The world's most-read Scottish politics website

Wings Over Scotland

Riding the rollercoaster

Posted on February 13, 2018 by

…with the Secretary of State for Scotland.

Boo! But wait!

Yay! But wait!

Boo! But wait!

Yay! But wait!

Boo! But wait!

Yay! But wait!

Boo! And so on. We’re not sure what the latest position is, to be honest, but it doesn’t really matter – whatever it is, we’re sure another one will be along in a day or two if you don’t like it.

(Our favourite, incidentally, was this one, which impressively managed to feature both of the opposing positions in consecutive paragraphs.)

And meanwhile, not far from here:

Scream if you want to go faster, readers.

Print Friendly

    1 Trackbacks/Pingbacks

    1. 13 02 18 17:56

      Riding the rollercoaster | speymouth

    366 to “Riding the rollercoaster”

    1. gordoz says:

      Any decent media outlet anywhere else in the world, would be calling for this charlatan to go and go now!

    2. HandandShrimp says:

      We’re not sure what the latest position is

      Worrying thing is neither does Fluffy Muddle.

    3. Geoff Huijer says:

      I’m screaming right enough; but I want to get off/out.

      A great example of politicians/media manipulating the ‘news’ and probably one of the many reasons neither are trusted these days.

    4. Dr Jim says:

      This is the UKs way of continuously kicking the can further down the road every time you’re about to pick it up until the time comes to tell you the original plan all along was to tell you to *get stuffed*

      But you had hope for a wee while and *isn’t that a good thing*

      But damn it just in time to be too late

    5. Robert Graham says:

      Anyone the least surprised .

      As usual just let us mugs know what you have in mind for the Jocks in the north , because by the looks of it a lot of folk here will accept anything for a pat on the head , f/n cowards .

    6. Macart says:

      Seriously. What on earth are the current crop of home grown Tories for?

      Lobby fodder? A Tory Whip’s chew toy? Laughing stocks? What?

    7. Luigi says:

      Jings, this is like 2014 all over again. All those vague promises (that were not really promises after all). That’s the method in Fluffy’s apparent madness – stall, play for time, confuse and utterly bamboozle the public. Try to deny what you said and maintain (im)plausible deniability. Every promise followed by a denial or weasel get-out words. Then the voters won’t know what to think (or vote). Precisely, old chep! Its the British Nationailst way. Job done.

      Mundell has neither the wit or the political nuance to do this on how own initiative, but he has WM handlers in the shadows, for sure, grinding the organ. The Tory house monkey simply does what he is told.

    8. mogabee says:

      “Right folks, we need to get another Scotch story out there.” “Erm, who is going out this time?”

      *Much shuffling of feet and lame excuses*

      “David, oh David. Could you run this by a few tame hacks”


    9. Bob Mack says:

      When you hold a position where you change your mind regularly, the outcome is generally negative and you are trying to hide it as long as possible.

      Useless, useless ,useless.

    10. frogesque says:

      Does anyone really care what that weasely gubshite says?

      Go and get the tea David, mines black with nae sugar.

    11. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      So, Sturgeon is fucking useless?

    12. Bob Mack says:

      @Reluctant Nationalist,

      That’s quite a jump you made there. Thought about the Olympics ?

    13. Robert Graham says:

      Sometimes you can be just too smart for your own good.

      This lot with their obvious shenanigans I believe have built up a head of steam and very very bitter resentment in a lot of people at being pissed on constantly, I fear a lot of people will lose it and lose it big time , the hug a nay sayer line while it might have been fine at one point , has went right oot the f/n windy , hug them I feel like nutting the first f/kr that defends their scabby Union .

    14. Auld Highlander says:

      That mundel muppet is living in the TWILIGHT ZONE. Spelling mistake is deliberate.

    15. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      As true as it is @Macart says at 4:49 pm

      “Seriously. What on earth are the current crop of home grown Tories for?
      Lobby fodder? A Tory Whip’s chew toy? Laughing stocks? What?“

      Most politically unaware folk will never realise this fact as long as the BritNat MSM and the BBC in particular protect them and their masters in London from any kind of scrutiny.

    16. Dr Jim says:

      @Robert Graham

      *Scabby Union*

      Now that’s the proper Scottish attitude to use accompanied by our well known bad tempered snarly face

    17. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      @ Bob Mack

      Yes, women’s beach volleyball in particular.

    18. Walter Scott says:

      It’s because Mundell is a gutless fucking eejit and everything is dependent on who he talks to.

    19. This little weasel should be put out of his misery, politics-wise.
      There will be Indyref 2 soon now. I’d be astonished if 75% of the English incomers vote No the next time ’round.
      It is clear that the English Establishment is hell bent on reducing England and Wales to Third World status in less than a generation.
      We must opt for Self Determination this time. It is our only option. Independence or die. it’s that serious.
      For those who don’t want to live in Free Scotland, head South to the 51st US State.
      Corbyn the Commie is a disgrace. It is becoming more and more obvious that he is a Born Again Militant doing his mistress Mother Russia’s bidding; destroy European Unity.
      The Brit Nat politicians have taken over the asylum.

    20. Bob Mack says:

      @Reluctant Nationalist,

      Don’t think you will be able to call it woman’s beach volleyball soon. Cannot think of a better name though.

    21. Easyblues says:

      I’ve worked for some people that could tell you to fuck off and have you looking forward to the journey…
      Mundell isn’t one of them

    22. yesindyref2 says:

      Now that’s really funny, Conservativehome contradicting the Express. which itself contradicts reality most of the time while supporting the Conservatives but supporting extreme Brexitisim even more. As for Mundell, he’s our greatest sleeping asset, well done SNP, how did you turn him to being pro-Indy and our actual S007? Or is that Magnus, I lose track of all these double-doubles …

      … but “S” did say she was going to do something about Scotland’s Intelligence and Security Service (SISS).

    23. yesindyref2 says:

      “I am S007”.

      Time for a cuppa.

    24. PictAtRandom says:

      Piling up more trouble for when the weakest part of the structure (whatever it is) gives way. But when?

      At the moment my thinking on IndyRef2 is along the lines of “The market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent.” If it is to be an early Spring 2019 referendum then Holyrood must control timing, franchise, postal votes etc and the vote will need to be large enough to avoid Catalan limbo. And in the course of the campaign there will be deliberate obfuscation from Unionists as well as sheer spin-the-roulette-wheel chaos and incompetence.

    25. Robert Louis says:

      Mundell is just a waste of space. At least a few decades ago, Scottish Tories were the kind of people who, even if they held differing views, you could at least hold a modicum of respect for, since they still stood up in some very limited ways for Scotland – even when Thatcher was in power (although it had no effect), but Mundell, and Davidson are just utterly utterly pathetic. The very worst of people. No morals, no principles. Just a silly wee bag carrier for his ‘betters’ from England. A Pathetic wee man.

      We should pity him.

    26. Highland Wifie says:

      This is precisely how they create a completely complacent electorate by sowing so much confusion that most good people give up and let the politicians get on with it.
      I mean how often do you hear people say they’re not really interested in politics? No wonder when this is the standard of discourse.

      Mundell is either a sleakit little toad who knows exactly what he’s doing or a useful idiot for the tories. Either way makes no difference as he’s no use to Scotland.

    27. Mike says:

      If they tore down the Scotland Office in Edinburgh and built a fairground the same people would visit the site for exactly the same reasons and get exactly the same service.

    28. Macbeda says:

      He’s confused because he’s spending too much time with all these burly men who are looking after him. He really needs to let his underlings get a say occasionally to possibly deflect us towards sweetrolls and all things baking. You know just for a change.

      That reminds me, where the hell is (T)Ruthless and what devious plan has she got up her sleeve for the next FMQ?

    29. Lanarkist says:

      In out, in out, shake it all about, This is what it’s all about,

      Oh, the Hokey-Cokey!

      Brexit night out with Mundell calling the Bingo at the end of the funfair pier!

    30. Dan Huil says:

      I know we still have to use “tractor” for you know what but can’t we make an exception for scum like Mundell?

    31. wee bud says:

      @ Highland Wifie

      It’s all very deliberate.. I think they blamed the Russians for inventing it.. Just keep pumping out mixed messages and people give up and don’t listen anymore..

      The British state is in full misinformation mode.. I suppose we should count ourselves lucky not to get the Irish treatment….. Yet.

    32. Doug McGregor says:

      If you say every possible combination of outcomes as you go along , at some point in the future you can select the one that best fits your needs at that juncture.

      We’re so lucky to have a political genius in charge.

    33. yesindyref2 says:

      Kind of OT, headline in Herald:
      “Willie Rennie: UK Government must be honest {about cutting immigration}” {my curly wurlies}

      Poor Willie, or could it be that Rip Van Willie Winkie and the Scottish LibDems are waking up at last?

    34. ephemeraldeception says:

      @Highland Wife.

      Mundell really aspires to being ‘a sleakit little toad’ but has failed to surpass useful idiot. While in London he just makes the tea for the person that makes the coffee.

      While in 21st century Scotland he is somehow Governor Sec of State 🙁

    35. PictAtRandom says:

      Dan Huil says:
      13 February, 2018 at 6:14 pm

      I know we still have to use “tractor” for you know what but can’t we make an exception for scum like Mundell?

      Best regarded as an inferior Riesling.

    36. Arbroath1320 says:

      Ladies and gentlemen I give you the latest “secret” footage of Scruffy Fluffy preparing for his next media “interview”

    37. Mik Johnstone says:

      David Munell (Local pronunciation) The Secretary of State Against Scotland
      the complete and utter Twunt shouldn’t be swanning off to Japan and Hong Kong, the snivelling wee parashite should be here answering the questions as to why he’s intent on selling Scotland out …. :@ :@

    38. velofello says:

      Do not underestimate Mundell, he has survived, and he has his son installed as an MSP at Holyrood that takes skill, and a constancy to purpose. Mundell never says anything to offend, always his words are reasonable, and his intent never declared.

      I cannot see a solution to the Irish Question over borders within the current Brexit “rules of the game”. Should there be no customs border between N and S Ireland how can Scotland possibly accept that solution unless similarly there is no border between Ireland and Scotland.And then a Customs border between Scotland and England?
      And if the N Irish retain EU citizenship would that be acceptable to Scotland.

      The logical solution is to cancel Article 50 and for the UK to stay in the EU, but that is not on the agenda of the Elite who visualise a financial klondyke, for them post Brexit. The EU intent to rein in offshore banking and tax avoidance in 2019 is the UK Elite’s alarm call, and to hell with the rest of us.ion

    39. Finnz says:

      I suspect Mundell is out in the Far east to find out what his next position will be.

      He thinks it might be found in a Fortune Cookie…

    40. Az says:

      “Scream if you want to go faster, readers.”

      That had me in stitches! Great article.

    41. Scott Shaw says:

      The Minister for Obfuscation strikes again!!!

    42. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Mik Johnstone at 6.42

      “parashite” I like it!

    43. starlaw says:

      A hard border between N and S Ireland will be imposed by Westminster as soon as U.K. leaves the E.U. That seems to be what Westminster is planning, just impose it and wait a few weeks for the dust to settle.

    44. yesindyref2 says:

      You gorra laff innit!

    45. Sinky says:

      I wonder who authorised or handed out all the Union Jacks to greet the minor Royals at Edinburgh Castle?

      Was it some ignorant entrepreneur or misguided Historic Scotland under Professor David Mitchell of Stirling University?

      As Yoons don’t seem to know t he Union Flag is a political symbol and the correct flag to greet a UK Royal in Scotland is the Royal Standard better known as the Lion Rampart.

      Is it not time the Scottish Government or the The Court of the Lord Lyon who is The Rev Canon Dr Joseph John Morrow a former Dundee Labour Councillor (so not much hope there) issued guidelines for those ignoramuses?

    46. Dan Huil says:

      From today’s Irish Times’ website:

      “Democratic Unionist Party leader Arlene Foster has rubbished speculation about the shape of Irish language laws that might emerge from Stormont’s powersharing negotiations.

      Mrs Foster said rumours about what legislation might look like were “not grounded in any sort of reality”.

      In an interview with the Press Association, the DUP leader again insisted her party would not sign off on a stand-alone Irish Language Act — a key Sinn Féin demand throughout the 13-month impasse.

      She also ruled out any laws that would require bilingual road signs in Northern Ireland; compulsory teaching of Irish in schools; or quotas of Irish language speakers within the civil service.

      Stormont’s former first minister also moved to temper expectations that a deal to restore devolution is likely this week.

      “I am hopeful that we will move toward devolution again,” she said.

      “Whether it is this week, whether it is in a couple of weeks or whether it’s in a couple of months what I must ensure is that we have an accommodation that everybody feels content with.”

      Mrs Foster also made clear that if devolution is restored she expects to be first minister of the new administration. Sinn Féin had previously ruled out her return to the post while an inquiry into a botched green energy scheme continued.

      “I am the leader of the Democratic Unionist Party so therefore I will be the person that’s put forward by the party to be first minister,” she said.”

    47. galamcennalath says:

      Proof, again, that we need to give these fools and liars their jotters.

      He is supposed to be Scotland’s man in the cabinet at WM. That’s a bad joke. He’s WM’s man in Scotland. No matter what his job is supposed to be, he is failing miserably.

      He and his BritNat chums have two policies – protect their Union and protect their own jobs. To be honest, I’m not even sure they are capable there either!

      Roll on IndyRef2!

    48. John Boyes says:

      “First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then they make you Secretary of State for Scotland” Mahatma Mundell.

    49. mike cassidy says:

      And this is what Mundell said yesterday.

      “Scotland’s skills, products and services are highly regarded globally, and we can build on that as we leave the EU and strike ambitious new trade deals around the world.”

    50. Indy2 says:

      Re; The Irish Border Problem.

      Treeza has to put into legal speak what her plans are for N Ireland border within the next couple of weeks. It has to be able to stand up in a European Court of law.

      So I for one can’t wait to see how she is going to word this. It is a conundrum, because no matter which way you look at it, it is full of contradictions.

      And to add to her problems, the IRA (or similar) have said they will start to kill anyone who is manning the actual border posts. The Head of the Police Service in N Ireland said he doesn’t think he could get staff to put their names forward for such jobs.

      So Treeza, it’s over to you hen.

    51. Tara6171 says:

      Mundell is just a political puppet. Doing what his Tory masters decide. I bet the cabinet laughs each time they give fluffy a scoop to tell the Scottish people.

      Fucking Joke of a man. Can’t even see his very own party is taking the piss out of him

    52. Petra says:

      Forget about Mundell. He’s a waste of space and not only we, but the Tories north and south of the border know it too.

      Bottom line is that two countries voted to remain in the EU, that is Scotland and NIreland, with Scotland voting with a higher percentage to remain than NIreland. That Scottish 62% has now risen to around 68%.

      NIreland is getting a special deal due to the ‘troubles’, whilst Scotland is getting penalised for attempting to acquire its freedom by refraining from taking up arms. Westminster doesn’t give two hoots about losing the troublesome Irish goat either, if it comes right down to it, but can’t afford to lose the Scottish cash cow.

      All they’ve done is cherry-picked Nicola Sturgeon’s document ‘Scotland’s Place in Europe’, with the ‘Differentiated Solutions for Scotland’ section changed by name to accommodate NIreland. If it wasn’t so serious it would be hilarious, as neither England nor NIreland bothered their ar*e to put pen to paper in relation to any ‘differentiated solution’.

      If they (Westminster) really think that we’re going to sit back and take it they’ve got another think coming. We’re all well aware of how catastrophic Brexit alone will be for Scotland, but the figures that we have don’t take into account how this will be exacerbated if we have to compete with a NIreland that’s in the SM and CU.

      Get out there folks, join your local Yes group, chip in and get Yes shops / hubs opened up right across Scotland. Start getting the ‘TRUTH’ out there, before it’s too late.

    53. Well said, Petra.
      WE cannot fail this time. Millions of us reject Brexit and will no longer tolerate domination by an English Parliament going forward. Harry and his girlfriend were in Edinburgh today and the Dead Tree Scrolls and Brit Broadcasters were going gaga; lots of Union Jacks waving, swooning wee lassies, and a ‘Royal’ regiment, and a gun going off, just to remind us that they have the guns, we don’t.
      There is only one solution. We are taking our country back.
      Intellectual midgets like Mundell Davidson Rennie and Leonard actually believe that they can still dictate to us and that they ‘rule’ over us because there are more English than Scots on this lump of rock on the Continental Shelf.
      There is a massive storm brewing.
      We shall prevail. We must, or die a slow death as a subjugated people.

    54. stewartb says:

      wee bud @t 6:17 pm and Highland Wifie

      Rather than dismiss Mundell and his associates as others have, I’m with you when you write: “It’s all very deliberate. I think they blamed the Russians for inventing it.. Just keep pumping out mixed messages and people give up and don’t listen anymore.. The British state is in full misinformation mode.. I suppose we should count ourselves lucky not to get the Irish treatment….. Yet.”

      Your comments give me the ‘excuse’ to go O/T and share the following – with apologies for the length of the extract. (The whole article is worth a read if this stuff on Surkov etc. is new to some.)

      Source: – posted there on July 10, 2016 by christopher harpertill

      ‘The documentary filmmaker Adam Curtis has described how Vladislov Surkov orchestrated Putin’s media and political strategy through applying the methods of conceptual art to deliberately confuse the population. He funded different activist groups who opposed one another, and even groups who oppose Putin. What’s more Surkov made people aware of his manipulation so that it was impossible to know what was real and fake.

      In this kind of scenario no-one knows quite who is their enemy or their friend or what to think about almost any situation. Some people have suggested that when Russia annexed Crimea in 2014 they were engaging in what Surkov called “non-linear war” in which a variety of seemingly disconnected factions are spurred into action (and perhaps supported) but it is always unclear as to who is fighting for whom and what are their intentions.

      This is part of a strategy Surkov referred to as “managed democracy” with the real intention being to destablise perception in order to exert control through force as “democracy is impossible in a country of angry, poor people”.

      As Curtis puts it:
      “… nothing really makes any coherent sense. We live with a constant vaudeville of contradictory stories which makes it impossible for any real opposition to emerge because they can’t counter it with a coherent narrative of their own. And it means that we as individuals become ever more powerless, unable to challenge anything because we live in a state of confusion and uncertainty”

      Something similar has happened in Britain but this is not through conspiratorial attempts to control the population. Rather politicians and parties, as well as other interest groups, have sought to privilege their position in a political battlefield. In order to do so they accuse their enemies and media outlets of lying and misrepresentation.

      It is these kinds of accusations which have pushed the BBC into ridiculous contorted positions trying to present a semblance of balance. This can be observed in the consistent pairing of climate change scientists with climate change deniers and the privileging of neither position (despite one being almost devoid of scientific backing).

      In combination with the almost total reduction of mainstream political communication to spin and soundbites this makes it difficult for many people to conclusively decide or choose between competing positions.’

    55. Ian Brotherhood says:

      If May said ‘David, we’re going to have you blood-eagled live on national television as a distraction while we publish our feeble Brexit road-map’ Mundell would reply, ‘Okay, fine, eh, what time do you want me there?’

    56. jfngw says:

      It’s time to choose Scotland, citizens of the world with the future in our own hands. Or citizens of the isolationist UK, your future decided by the whims of another nation. The Scotland I want can’t be achieved by the present status quo.

      Now is the Time!

    57. heedtracker says:

      Its not just Fluffie, there’s 12 more after their Strong and Stable snap GE. What a crew, led by Fluffie.

      Its interesting how UKOK tory plans to scrap Scottish Westminster seats has slowed down a bit about, since they won 13 tory seats instead of the 1, Fluffie.

      Have to hand it to the tory scumbags, if they can’t win at the ballot box , they’ve absolutely no moral code to prevent them trying anything on to keep control of Scotland.

      Pretty neat spin on it all from their gimps in Pacific Quay too, at least it could be spin. How to make just another tory shyst on Scottish democracy look all normal and fine.

    58. Dr Jim says:

      It starts with a whisper of discontent, then there’s a clamour
      is there soon to be a rising

      The noise is definately increasing

    59. TD says:

      It is incredible, but what is happening here is that Mundell is putting ideas out there to see what reaction he gets. If he is not shot down in flames by his fellow tories, then he can claim to have influenced, if not determined, policy. If he does get shot down, then he just says something else. It’s a hell of a way to run a country.

      I don’t know whether it is a good thing that they are so chaotic, which would suggest it is only a matter of time before they get booted out of office, or a bad thing because the government of the country that we still have the misfortune to be part of doesn’t have a scooby about what they are doing. Do we want them to do Brexit in a competent manner or do we want them to fail miserably? So far they are failing – I’m simultaneously celebrating that they are making such a dog’s breakfast of it and fearful for the consequences.

      Maybe we need to descend into the chaos of a neo-liberal post brexit world for those who currently reject Scottish independence to wake up to the reality of what is happening. Is that what we have to go through before we emerge on the other side?

    60. Brian says:

      I wonder if Fluffy has just been mixing up Scotland and Northern Ireland?

    61. Wullie says:

      We only have a treaty with these people, what is taking place is nothing more than foreign interference.

    62. jfngw says:

      What will Mundell’s magic 8 ball say tomorrow?

      I would be more inclined to believe the magic 8 ball has more influence in the cabinet than Mundell.

    63. Arabs for Independence says:

      Sinky @ 7.34

      The Rev Canon Joseph Morrow of St. Ninian’s church Dundee, was the Grand Master of the Grand Lodge of Scottish Freemasons.

    64. Petra says:

      @ Jack collatin says at 8:08 pm ….. ”Harry and his girlfriend were in Edinburgh today and the Dead Tree Scrolls and Brit Broadcasters were going gaga; lots of Union Jacks waving, swooning wee lassies, and a ‘Royal’ regiment, and a gun going off, just to remind us that they have the guns, we don’t…….

      Nana fairly cheered me up JC, so I’m passing it along.

      @ Nana: I read on twitter that two bus loads from Liverpool were at the meet & greet. I don’t remember who tweeted it. Nice to see actual photos of the visit and not what the MSM try to make out.


      WOW 112 comments on there. This subject must be upsetting some people, lol.

      ‘Could this be the solution to the annual GERS controversy?.’

      THE establishment of an independent Scottish Statistics Agency is the main recommendation of the latest policy document produced by think tank Common Weal.

      The latest in the White Paper series, which deals with the policies and infrastructure an independent Scotland will require, shows how the creation of independent Scottish Statistics Agency could end Scotland’s data desert and put the annual GERS controversy to bed.

      An independent Scottish Statistics Agency (SSA) could also provide a significant boost to the economic management of the country.

      While Scotland has better data provision than the UK as a whole, it lags far behind comparable European countries. The gap is one of the leading causes of the annual controversy surrounding the GERS statistics, which serve as an estimation of Scotland’s finances within the United Kingdom.

      The report by Common Weal head of research Craig Dalzell argues: “Regardless of Scotland’s constitutional arrangements … it should be universally recognised that better data can be used to produce better government policy and to better monitor policy as it is implemented”.

      The enhanced data could allow the government to better target income tax and other ways to raise money, while the SSA could create hundreds of high-paid jobs, giving a boost to Scotland’s economy.

      Jim Cuthbert, former Scottish Office chief statistician, said: “There is a real need to review the arrangements for providing official statistics in Scotland, particularly given the data requirements for the operation of the new fiscal settlement, and the absolute priority under that settlement for the Scottish Government to manage the economy so as to achieve optimal economic performance.

      “There is a need to overcome the fragmentation of statistics as government relies increasingly on agencies and other bodies to deliver public services, not to mention the potential for further constitutional change, and the statistical requirements that would pose.

      “It is therefore absolutely right that Dr Dalzell’s welcome paper makes the case for a Scottish Statistics Agency. It is also right that the paper does not draw firm conclusions about how such an SSA should be structured, but sets out options. What is needed now is an active debate on how statistics in Scotland should be organised in a changing, and challenging, world.”

      Robin McAlpine, Director of Common Weal said: “A serious country measures itself to help it make better decisions about its future. I really want Scotland to be a serious country. A Scottish Statistics Agency would be a big step forward.”

      Key Points from the Common Weal Report:

      Scotland’s level of statistical data provision marks it as the best-served nation within the UK, but overall provision falls short of what would be expected to serve an independent country.

      Regardless of Scotland’s constitutional arrangements, better data provision is vital for the creation of better government policy and better management.

      Specific gaps have been identified in areas such as the regionalisation of data, the tax gap, GERS, Whole of (Scottish) Government Accounts, the National Register of Assets and Scottish import and export data.

      A Scottish Statistics Agency (SSA) would be charged with identifying and filling gaps in statistical provision.
      The SSA may take the form of a single, centralised agency charged with collecting or commissioning the vast majority of statistical data. Alternatively, it may be more of an overseer of a decentralised network of specialised data providers, a regulator to ensure the data meets a sufficiently stringent Code of Practice as well as maintaining a data portal to ensure access to the gathered data.

      Ideal budgeting is difficult to assess, as budgets depend on the model employed. An SSA proportional in size to the UK’s would have a budget of £15 million per year and would employ 265 people. An SSA the size of Sweden’s would have a budget of £83.3 million and employ 700 people.

    65. heedtracker says:

      What are smallish countries that are not run by scumbag tories like viceroy Fluffie and his beeb gimps like?
      Here’s why Danish people are richer than ever before
      With more cash than they know what to do with, households are stuffing their banks full of deposits”

      Danes probably dont have to be brainwashed into arselicking royals either.

    66. Graham says:

      One wonders where Fluffy gets his business and trade advice from…?
      Oh wait, I know this one…

      Keith Cochrane.

      Yes, that Keith Cochrane.

    67. Petra says:


      This is really bad news for us: Our renewable energy sector overall. Westminster of course will be loving it.

      ‘Crunch talks to be held on future of BiFab as hundreds face redundancy.’

    68. Calum McKay says:

      tories are in hock to dup and mundell is a simpleton at the beckon call of his london masters – what more is there to say?

    69. heedtracker says:

      It does cost toryscumbags a lot to get viceroy Fluffie in too,

      Tory MP David Mundell spent more on election campaign than total of all his rival candidates
      In total Mr Mundell spent £46,843 which was funded from party donations.”

      The Strong and Stable vote Viceroy Fluffie snap GE costs included the 2 years of “we said no, we meant NO” attack propaganda pouring out of Pacific Quay, in a parallel nation state Scotland universe.

    70. wull2 says:

      Most company’s plan things 5 Years in advance.
      Brexit threw a spanner in their plan, if the EU says the time to adjust at the end will be very short, that will make their new plans even more urgent.
      It wont be long before they say vote YES this time.

    71. Big del says:

      Wankers, everyone of them….

      And what is it with this team( ?)GB and the MASSIVE F——G cross on that F—–G apron???????

      Get it right up they jocks is it? Won’t be watching this shit …..
      ….wankers, everyone of them, again…

    72. The Scottish Play says:

      No special deal – only because we have a Secretary of State who is determined, by his deliberate opposition and inactivity in representing Scotland, that there will not be one.

      The fact that the entire Country of Scotland, every constituency, (including Conservatives in his constituency) voted to Remain in the EU – matters not one jot, to him. The fact that every MP in Scotland (except him) voted against the retention of Trident, matters not one jot to him or, it seems, to his Party.

      But as the Supreme Court recently ruled,,, yes, it’s official,… bring on that Plague of Boils (Lord Smith, you assured us all was so improbable) … yes you, you ‘Prorouguers’… ignore Conventions and the Devolved Administrations at your leisure (particularly Scotland), but to do so … and not taking heed of the political situation… there may indeed be a political price to pay.

      Why would you want to be in any Union that cannot accommodate, in any way, the wishes of an entire Country?

      So continue to steadfastly ignore the democratic wishes of an entire Country….with the usual opposition to the democratic will of the Country, as for certain, that Country will, inevitably, have Its say.

    73. Rock says:

      Has Nicola managed to flog her dead horse yet – a separate deal for Scotland in the EU?

    74. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Rock at 10.46

      Either you don’t get it or you think we are all stupid The “dead horse” here is called Rock

    75. Petra says:

      I see that the site ‘wreckers’ are out already. Next up the ‘bait-takers’, so it’s over and out from me.

    76. Auld Highlander says:

      It’s just crawled out from under it’s stone.

    77. ronnie anderson says:

      Time to dust this of and give it ahwee airing .

    78. Big Jock says:

      Fuckkkkk!!!I can’t take anymore…where is my fuckin Country!!

    79. wee bud says:


      Thanks for the info… I thought it started in Russia and has been exported far and wide.. We’re just lucky we’ve got the best journalists in the world to look after good old blightys interests ..

    80. Robert Graham says:

      Well wee ginger dug is up for it , I hope everyone here has the same passion , a common expression in Glasgow when the rag has been well and truly lost , when you hear ah f/k it , that’s the time to duck because that’s the signal of someone who has the RED mist descending before their eyes and anything can happen and it’s never a pretty outcome for the recipients .

    81. stewartb says:

      Petra @ 10:56 pm

      I’m intrigued by your classification of btl contributors into ‘wreckers’ and ‘bait-takers’.

      In the same way as we’ve had academic and other research into the content of certain BBC Scotland programmes, perhaps what we need is similar research into the nature of btl posts, with Wings as a case study? (insert an emoji of your choice here!)

      So let’s think about research questions. What triggers the first appearance in a thread of your ‘wrecker’ – perhaps (i) their ‘judgement’ on the potential impact of Stu’s initial blog – i.e. anticipating its impact potential; or (ii) actual evidence of the way that one of his blogs gains traction – i.e. a response to actual evidence of impact gauged through volume of responses here and/or on Twitter?

      And what governs the frequency of their contributions to a particular thread -perhaps (i) the need to work harder to divert from a particularly impactful blog and/or subsequent thread; or (ii) (just) the opportunities presented to them by your ‘bait-takers’?

      And do responses made to ‘bait-takers’ focus down and deepen the discussion on the topic of the initial blog, widen it, or divert away from it?

      Of course all this implication of strategies and tactics may well be complete nonsense. But no harm in ‘alert readers’ staying ‘alert’!

    82. heedtracker says:

      Fuckkkkk!!!I can’t take anymore…where is my fuckin Country!!

      Worst things about the current tory teamGB rule of Scotland include, no political satire whatsoever of any tory creeps Christ only knows, viceroy Fluffie and his merry band of Scotch tory sock puppets are very worthy tory creeps.

      Massed ranks of beeb gimp led tory msm, turned teamGB into a one party tory satire banned state but its certainly not like this anywhere else, just torboy teamGB,

      One of dozens across the pond. Who knows what they’d do with sockpuppets viceroy Fluffie and Colonel Ruth.

    83. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @RonnieA (11.07) –

      🙂 🙂 🙂

      Now I comprehend the sources of your ‘patter’.

    84. Petra says:

      Oops I just noticed Boris’s post on David Duguid / Colin Clark and the fishing industry.

      Boris I can’t thank you enough for the time and effort that you put into constructing your fabulous articles. Always chocolate-a-bloc with extremely interesting data that can be used to great advantage elsewhere.

      Some of the data could / should be advertised in Yes shop windows (or as car stickers especially on the east coast), such as David Linden SNP MP submitting more written questions (233) at Westminster than all other Scottish Unionist MP’s put together.

      Meanwhile David Duguid, so-called representative of Scottish fishermen, has submitted ZERO and Colin Clark who ousted Alex has actually managed to outdo his crony and submit ONE. Just two of a number of lazy, lying confabulators who have duped the electorate and additionally have the brass neck to pick up their massive pay cheque.

      Northern Ireland has managed to get themselves a great deal as Brexicide goes and Grimsby representatives are right in there fighting the bit out for the fishermen in their region. Grimsby if I remember rightly that actually voted for Brexicide. Farcical or what?

      Whilst Scotland is lumbered with a bunch of Unionist MSPs and MPs that don’t give one whit for the Scots … Scotland as a whole … and that includes the fishing industry. What on earth have we done to deserve this?

    85. Greannach says:

      Nice to see TV celebs Harry Hewitt and Mandy Sparkle visiting Edinburgh surrounded by government-issue union jacks wiggling in the wind. Do we know if any members of the royal family will be visiting the capital this year?

    86. Petra says:

      @ stewartb at 11:35pm …. Wrecker and bait-taker research.”

      I doubt that we’d get anywhere with our research Stewart. I reckon that they, wreckers, come on whenever they find the time to do so. No rhyme nor reason. No pattern emerging that you could analyse other than that one individual seems to have a job as he / she, in the main, only comes on at night. Either that or he / she lies in their kip all day and emerges from their pit when it gets dark.

      The bait-takers? Some of them may actually be wreckers in disguise, such as the individuals who respond with a load of old drivel and in some cases, additionally, vile language. Like a type of tag team.

      Other bait-takers react by imparting half-decent data which may serve a purpose or not. That depends on the content of the wreckers post (is it worth correcting or not) and on how one views the ‘interaction’ overall.

      I’ve not found that bait-takers replies actually deepen or widen the debate as the responses are usually repetitive which then ‘entices’ others on to complain in all manner of ways. The ‘all manner of ways’ are not usually conducive to attracting individuals to follow the blog either … which leads to diversion not of the topic, but of people jiggering off of the site altogether.

      If it wasn’t so off-putting, their key objective, and our main aim so profoundly serious for this Nation it would make for an interesting subject to research. Maybe someone living in an independent Scotland will take the time to make sense of it all one day?

      Meanwhile that’s my basic (very basic) psychological theory of the wrecker / bait-taker scenario, lol.

    87. Petra says:

      Mmhh bad idea to reread posts. Please ignore my IPads spelling mistakes, lol.

    88. geeo says:

      I see the village idiot (rock) has still not worked out why Nicola keeps promoting the eu compromise deal for Scotland.

      When it is rejected for the nth time, come the indyref, Nicola will stand up and point to the persistant offers of reasonable compromise over the EU, all of which WM rejected out of hand.

      Trouble is, if NI are offered such a compromise deal, that will not play well with a lot of Scots, told to fuck off by an English Tory PM/Government, while watching NI getting a political “happy ending” from self same Tories !

      If rock cannot see such a blindingly obvious, and effective, strategy such as this, he might just be that very thing he describes..a stupid person in Scotland (assuming for a second he IS in Scotland.

    89. Dr Jim says:


      The poster you’re talking about doesn’t post for the same reason you do, his sole motivation is to wreck disrupt and destroy, along with the other two or three
      If you mention them it gives them the chance to fill up the thread with themselves thus making readers of Wings read what they say

    90. MJT says:

      Stewartb is refrencing HyperNormalisation, Adam Curtis’ excellent 2016 Documentary. It can be found in various places online and is well worth a watch. Century Of The Self is excellent too.

      RE: Wee Ginge Dug. His latest blog is as good as ever. I really want Paul Kavanagh up front and centre when the campaign kicks off. He’s one of us, a people person, he gets people, and he’s very good with words. I get the impression he’s no slouch when it comes to strategy an aw.

      I’ve said it before, and i hope to be able to say it again and again…if we can give everyone the chance to make an informed decision, we have it in the bag.

      If we’re smart, we can set the agenda, we can attack their weaknesses and as they take time defending, we attack again, we look for and keep exploit weaknesses (as part of a strategy).

      As angry as I am, I still accept that someone who does not know the true nature of this nation, good and bad, the wealth of this nation, the true nature of how things really are right now regarding our assets and resources, i cannot expect them to or assume they will see what i see and make the conclusions I make.

      I hadn’t read the comments on Wings for a while. There are a few posts and posters i class as ‘dogshit’. When i see dogshit, i walk past and keep going, i tend not to call out to all and sundry, ‘see this, it’s dogshit, see it, it’s dog shit, dog shit i tell thee…’ cos i assume most folks can see it’s dogshit and are capable of walking by just like me.

      Ignorance we can work on, stupidity is beyond my scope.

    91. Kangaroo says:

      Petra @ 9:24pm

      I had a look at the twitter feed that you referenced and whilst I was having a good laugh at the derisory crowd that turned out my wife was questioning the timing of said photo and whether or not it was taken at or near the time when the ‘distinguished guests (cough) were due to appear.
      Could you or anyone else shed some light on this.

      PS She said the same thing about the Jeremy Corbyn crowd.

      I need facts to convince her.

    92. Andy Anderson says:

      Did you see the BBC news last night showing Harry and Megan at the castle in Edinburgh. All the large flags were the Union flag. There were two wee Saltires. This is a State sponsered subliminal message. It never stops.

      At least Megan is a good Gaelic name from Ireland.

    93. Ghillie says:


      Typical sociopathic behaviour, carried out as ordered by HQ: manipulative, continually changes course, tosses crumbs, sweeps crumbs away, keeps situation uncertain, fires ahead with own original plans.

      Represents sociopathic party.

      Sole solution is to walk away and keep going, never look back.

    94. Jeremy Corbyn makes a rare hour long visit to Scotland, and insults and lies to the people of Scotland, and attempts to air brush out the evil history of half a century of Red Tory Brit Nat Unionism in Scotland’
      Why doesn’t he just stay out of Scotland all together?
      He is an old Islington Commie, without a clue about matters Scottish.
      He is a sad boring old man who has never had, nor will he ever have his day in the sun.

      That other Dick, ‘The Scarf’ Leonard is the product of the Northern Branch’s generations of in-breeding.

      He speaks like a faltering ’70’s Yorkshire Mining Shop Steward from an episode of ‘Life On Mars’, and has as much commitment to Scotland as Essex Double glazing salesmen.
      He can fuck off back to the Mother Country too.
      Speaking of in-breeding.
      Harry and the ‘throngs’ who stayed away when he and his squeeze visited Auld Reekie.
      Well done BBC and STV. Idiotic Saddam like coverage of a minor Royal whom nobody gives a tinker’s toss about.
      Roll on Independence Day.
      Don’t bother coming back, Prince Harry.

    95. Arthur Martin says:

      Well said MJT! I subscribe to your dogshit philosophy as well.

    96. starlaw says:


      Camera angles tell the story, from waist level means there is no crowd. No photo shots from above prove it.

    97. Macart says:

      @ Nana

      Right! Coffee in hand I’m braced for the worst Nana. What we got today? 😀

      @ Jack Collatin

      On Corbyn…


    98. Robert Louis says:

      Just a reminder for that bullingdon boy lying tory, Boris Johnson, when he makes his speech today about Brexit.

      Scotland voted to remain within the EU. In Edinburgh, the city where lying tory Ruth Davidson currently has a constituency, the vote was 75% remain.

      Scotland still has no intention of leaving the EU, and will not be leaving the EU. England can go and do whatsoever it pleases, just don’t drag Scotland out of the EU with you.

      The sooner England and Boris goes, the better.

    99. Nana says:

      Good morning Macart

      Well Sam it’s basically more of the same old. I decided not to link to Boris’s latest tripe as I felt we can do without that.

      Stormont talks look like there’s a breakthrough and maybe the Scotland office are none too happy

      Oh and Alex Salmond will not run for deputy


    100. Macart says:


      I suspected both might come about this close to the deadline and for obvious reasons. Mr Salmond especially will want the FM to have a clear run at what’s coming without the opposition and meeja using him as a leaver. He’s also ideally placed these days to use his own platform to great effect, not to mention his availability for the board of any official pro yes campaign.

    101. McDuff says:

      We have become strangers in our own country.
      We own nothing, we control nothing.

    102. Nana says:

      A couple more

      Dublin port prepares customs checks for hard Brexit

      May’s new immigration proposal sums up everything wrong with her approach to Brexit

    103. cazm says:

      England is becoming a more distant land to me as each day passes.

      From their english media, to their english politics, I find it less and less relevant in my daily life.

      This of course is a good thing.

    104. TYRAN says:

      STV’s Aidan Kerr strange tweet about FMQ TV viewing figures. PMQ is a similar viewing figure and inline across UK audiences. ie: the figure isn’t unusual. Only a few diehard anoraks would watch that sort of stuff. Perhaps ask Kerr how much STV2 matters since it routinely attracts zero viewers outside of High Road and Taggart repeats.

    105. Chick McGregor says:


      I have posted links to the international pension status before.

      But like other international comparison bar graphs I have posted like for instance on manufacturing, on equipment investment and on Balance of Trade, all showing the utterly dire position of the UK, they never illicit comment.

      Makes me wonder if folk do not understand or try to understand what they are saying?

      Is it just an issue with that format?

      Could the point be made in a more immediately understandable yet still clear format?

      I can’t think of one.

    106. call me dave says:

      Mundell and / or Ruthless won’t come near a microphone as Scotland is teetering on the Brexit brink and shortbread radio are getting stuck into Yousef on fishbowl reflections on train windows and some pylon foundation that might or might not be dodgy.

      “Your picking a fight” says Yousaf to Gary.

      Aye of course he is it’s another ‘whack-a-mole’ day in Scotland and somebody cried at the Olympics where 4 countries are pretending to be one.

    107. Robert Graham says:

      o/t -I wonder who told borris these two vast aircraft carriers he is boasting about are as intimidating to the Chinese as the Dunoon ferry would be , or for older viewers The Vital Spark with Doogie at the helm .
      It’s worse than we thought the years of private schooling and in breeding has really diminished the tory gene pool .

    108. galamcennalath says:

      The Express is a filthy rag with a great deal to answer for.

      Two headlines stood out this morning …

      ” Brexit news: ‘Forecasts were wrong’ Brexiteer trashes project fear predictions

      BREXITEER John Redwood revealed Remainers’ gloomy forecasts on the post-Brexit UK economy were wrong and most people who voted Remain will admit it is not as bad as they thought. “

      IS NOT … present tense. It hasn’t happened yet FFS! Do they really believe that if the forecasts were know before EUref, where the economies of Leave areas were likely to be retarded by 15%, so many ordinary workers would have voted to leave?

      It isn’t the first time we’ve heard that “Brexit isn’t so bad after all” line, as if it has already happened. That approach must be aimed at some incredibly gullible people.

      It was mince from the likes of the Express which tricked voters.

      ” Will you be talking German after Brexit? Swedish ambassador skewered by Humphrys question

      BBC HOST John Humphrys asked Swedish ambassador Torbjörn Sohlström if there is a “danger” Sweden’s second language will be German after Brexit during a grilling on the BBC.”

      What sort of language is that? The ambassador was skewered and giving a grilling according to the Express. Utterly vulgar and disgusting behaviour.

      For that matter, it was a bloody stupid question from Humphrys!

    109. galamcennalath says:

      Robert Graham says:

      who told borris these two vast aircraft carriers he is boasting about are as intimidating to the Chinese as the Dunoon ferry would be

      Indeed. People like Boris haven’t come to terms with the UK’s place in the world. The UK is one of several middling countries in Europe. Also, is it not ironic that Boris seems Hell bent on further diminishing the UK!

      The Chinese have one operational carrier and more being built.

      The Liaoning appears to be of similar size to HMS QE. Each can operate about 40 aircraft.

      Well, the Liaoning currently operates aircraft, the QE will at some point in the future eventually operate aircraft.

      I predict it won’t be long until the UK two fancy carriers are sold off to pay the bills. Perhaps to a ‘rising star’ like Brazil.

    110. Dr Jim says:

      Trade committee House of Commons says Brexit and devolution are incompatible

      So they want to undevolve us

    111. @Andy Anderson

      Megan is more a Welsh than Irish name,

      Mairead would be the equivalent Irish name,

      both come from Margaret which derives from the Sanskrit for `Pearl`.

    112. heedtracker says:

      Give it up for future PM BJ, or just another lovely boost from tory beeb gimps, SNP free zone as usual ofcourse.

      Boris Johnson: Brexit is a reason for hope not fear

      The future’s bright, the future’s Brengland, ruled by tory twits and beeb gimps.

    113. Ottomanboi says:

      The Mundell brief from the SO site:
      The Office of the Secretary of State for Scotland supports the Secretary of State in promoting the best interests of Scotland within a stronger United Kingdom. It ensures Scottish interests are fully and effectively represented at the heart of the UK Government, and the UK Government’s responsibilities are fully and effectively represented in Scotland.
      All hangs on the interpretation of the word ‘responsibilities’ and what ‘fully and effectively’ signifies. ‘A stronger United Kingdom’ is highly suggestive of what is expected of Mundell in his capacity as a latter-day imperial satrap. Dont call us, we’ll call you is the very heart of the matter.

    114. Robert Graham says:

      o/t – again Eh Borris the spider has been speaking for some time live on Air at The Policy Exchange whatever in London , doesn’t this qualify as a Tory party broadcast as its only that party who are involved in the negotiations , even with the sound down he seems very animated so many hand movements are gestures , I wonder if he’s on something and it’s not coffee .

    115. galamcennalath says:

      Boris Johnson: Brexit is a reason for hope not fear

      Yup, he got that one right for we Indy minded Scots, though definitely not in the way he meant! 😉

      Said it before. England voted for its independence, it should allowed to get on with it. Voters have a responsibility to inquire and assess. What Brexit meant was clear at the EURef for anyone who had engaged their brain. There is no change in circumstances so I don’t believe there is a need for EURef2.

      HOWEVER, it should also have been clear to everyone that England leaving the EU also meant the likely breakup of the UK. England also voted for independence from the rest of the UK, although as the biggest component, they don’t see it that way.

      Boris’s hard Brexit is incompatible with the reality of post Good Friday Ireland and with the wishes of Scots. So yes, Boris, your Brexit gives me hope!

    116. heedtracker says:

      Vast crowds greet the royals on tour. BBC Scotland love this very very much. Wish I was royals worshipping train loving toryboy sometimes, toryboy life must be so pleasant. And this royal’s daddy even has his own private train too.

      Oh to be a beeb gimp, on Valentines day, so much brown nose love for their royal masters in Pacific Quay,

    117. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Ian Brotherhood I’ll let you know Mr ther’s nae end tae ma talents ah kin also dey Flannigan & Allan ( smileys )

    118. Scott says:

      Listening to Boris just now and knowing who he is I would think he was speaking about our independence if the words Britain was excluded everything he says all the words spoken he reminds of what we said about leaving the UK,I am sure people a bit more savvy than me could put it better.
      Peoples fears to get over we can do it ourselves he says

      Come on Scotland vote YES Boris is making the case for us.

    119. call me dave says:


      Jings there’s a funny thing!

      I caught some of Boris on the car radio as we were driving home and said to my partner exactly the same thing as you mentioned.

      “Aye Dave”… says she “put on Kingdom FM”.. FGS! 🙁

    120. Legerwood says:

      Economic growth figures.

      BBC reporting on EU economic growth rate which is at a 10 year high but strangely omits UK when mentioning growth in individual EU countries

      So for comparison here are the UK figures

    121. heedtracker says:

      Is this lotto for winning a royal yacht or buying royals a new one? stupidest question today. The one in Leith is stunning right enough. Royals and their beeb gimps could sail round the colonies for the rest of their creepy lives too.

    122. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Ronnie A –

      Canny wait tae see yer Hinge & Brackett.

    123. Dan Huil says:

      @heedtracker 11:47am

      “Vast crowds…”? Photos I saw show close-up jobs of people-meeting. Train-boy from Northampton. News pictures didn’t show wide angle shots of the “vast crowds”. Wonder why. But all Scotland really really loves Harry’s bint for wearing tartan a la May. Good to see Harry not wearing his Nazi armband, though.

    124. call me dave says:

      Nursing staff from the EU must stay or the NHS faces a ‘Brexit disaster’

    125. galamcennalath says:

      Scott says:

      Boris … would think he was speaking about our independence if the words Britain was excluded

      I know exactly what you mean.

      I remember listening Farage well before either IndyRef and EURef and thinking …. I actually agreed with everything he said in that instance if UK were substituted for EU, and Scotland for UK.

      It’s actually an uneasy feeling, because although the rhetoric fits we know the motivation, underlying believes, and objectives are quite different.

      The two constitutional scenarios are totally different, but oddly, Brexitossers can make them sound parallel.

    126. PictAtRandom says:

      Petra says:
      13 February, 2018 at 11:49 pm

      Oops I just noticed Boris’s post on David Duguid / Colin Clark and the fishing industry.

      Boris I can’t thank you enough for the time and effort that you put into constructing your fabulous articles. Always chocolate-a-bloc with extremely interesting data that can be used to great advantage elsewhere.

      Some of the data could / should be advertised in Yes shop windows (or as car stickers especially on the east coast), such as David Linden SNP MP submitting more written questions (233) at Westminster than all other Scottish Unionist MP’s put together.

      Meanwhile David Duguid, so-called representative of Scottish fishermen, has submitted ZERO and Colin Clark who ousted Alex has actually managed to outdo his crony and submit ONE. Just two of a number of lazy, lying confabulators who have duped the electorate and additionally have the brass neck to pick up their massive pay cheque.

      I was going to say that’s lamentable — but maybe we’ve managed to finger the two people who know what’s actually going on. Pity they won’t share their vast knowledge with us.

    127. galamcennalath says:

      “Why we need indyref2 sooner rather than later

      Wee Ginger Dug”

      “Many who lent their votes to the SNP in 2016 because the party stated in its manifesto that they would hold another independence referendum if Scotland was taken out of the EU against its will. “

      Agree with WGD completely.

      I trust and believe the SNP/SG are on top of this and have a firm plan which will be enacted soon.

      However, I also believe it’s all over for a very long time if they don’t move soon.

    128. wull2 says:

      galamcennalath, I have had the same thoughts, even from some speeches over the pond.
      I hope and keep my fingers crossed it convinces some people to vote YES next time.

    129. Mike d says:

      Heedtracker 11.47am. As.Mrs Brown would say ‘That’s nice.

    130. Bill not Ben says:

      We need a new scottish newspaper, a paper that speaks for scotland and not one that just goes along with the unionist agenda.
      Until that happens the people of scotland will just be fed the usual mince with lashings of tripe to cover it.
      Are there any true scots out there that will put their money into building and creating this, all scotland needs is a paper with a neautral editorial and unbiased view of what is really going on inside this so called union that we are part of, but not an equal of, if that where to happen, i would start buying a paper again, cause lets be honest, what’s the difference between a toilet roll and the papers sold in scotland , a toilet roll is a useful thing and never tells lies

    131. ronnie anderson says:

      Ian Brotherhood That’s no gonnae happen am no ah Fluffy impersonator an anither hing ah don’t tickle the ivories ( nae talent there )

    132. mr thms says:

      #Legerwood @ 12:09 pm

      So for comparison here are the UK figures


      Oil and gas production has a big part in the UK figures.

      For example, a recent halt in production in the Forties Field due to a repair of cracked pipe for a few days could have accounted for a drop of 0.1% or 0.2% in the UK figure

      So it strange figures showing the increases in oil and gas production since 2014 rarely show up in articles like the one in your link.

    133. orri says:

      The problem with a Royal Yacht is that it isn’t just the yacht you need. There’s a small flotilla of navy vessels that have to accompany it and Britain no longer rules the waves so that’s a bit more problematic.

      Now a Royal Submarine might be slightly more survivable if it weren’t that legally they have to surface within the coastal waters of other nations.

    134. heedtracker says:

      The problem with a Royal Yacht is that it isn’t just the yacht you need.

      It is odd that a rich dynasty with such flamboyant tastes, private jets, private trains etc, refuses to buy their own private yacht. Every other billionaire has one, like a badge of obscene wealth.

      And yet, here we are in teamGB, compelled to worship billionaires and told to buy luxury yacht lotto tickets. Not to win a luxury yacht but to pay for one, for obscenely rich royals.

      Its an odd land of teamGB this, no matter how hard their beeb gimp groveler network tries to brainwash everyone into believing the filthy rich must be worshipped.

      From the archives,

      to the present, socialist worker Crash Gordo minces round Fife, rich as a Lord.

    135. auld highlander says:

      The old royal tub/yacht had a crew of 250, 21 officers, all r.n. volunteers / hand picked arse lickers plus a troop of marines when they were on board. Nine admirals and a commodore skippered the thing during it’s life. Between them all that would have been quite a wage bill and grocery bill. Then you have the food and liquor bill for all the tossers that were invited to functions during it’s lifetime.

      All paid for by the good old tax payer.
      If they want a new boat then these parasites should buy and pay for the running out of their own mega wealthy pockets.

      Do you believe these figures below?

      Royal Yacht
      Mr. Salmond: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence what were the total running costs for the royal yacht Britannia for each year since 1990. [13218]

      Mr. Soames: The total operating costs of HMY Britannia are:
      Year £ thousand(43)
      1990-91 9,272
      1991-92 12,458
      1992-93 8,361
      1993-94 8,397
      1994-95 11,424
      1995-96 8,423
      1996-97(44) 7,575

    136. Ottomanboi says:

      I’m convinced that the Scots are treated with contempt because the British Unionists believe they can get away with it and that they can sleep easily in their beds without fear of serious retaliation.
      Given the political climate change under Brexit I do not envisage toleration of such abusive behaviour lasting for much longer. I trust I am not wrong.

    137. Bill not Ben says:

      Boris has just been awarded an OBE, its not the one we all know and hate, its the other one, The Oh Bloody Ell award, its im again lol

    138. Petra says:

      @ heedtracker says at 11:47 am …. ”Vast crowds greet the royals on tour. BBC Scotland love this very very much. Wish I was royals worshipping train loving toryboy sometimes, toryboy life must be so pleasant. And this royal’s daddy even has his own private train too. Oh to be a beeb gimp, on Valentines day, so much brown nose love for their royal masters in Pacific Quay.”

      This just sums it up for me, HT. High time the Scots got out of this class-ridden UK midden.

      ”Nine year-old Oliver Clews, from Northampton, chatted with Harry about trains, with the Prince recommending he take the sleeper train. Oliver told BBC Scotland: “He shook my hand and it was amazing and exciting and it made my holiday. “Nobody in my class will have met royalty before.”‘


      Corbyn is back in Scotland saying that ”we shouldn’t have hungry children in Scotland in 2018” and blaming the Tories and the SNP for the state of affairs.

      Where do they get the brass neck from? This is the man that has supported the Tories austerity cuts and is allowing us to be taken out of the EU. Then there’s McCrone, Stolen Seas, PFI, Trident, Equal Pay cases etc, etc, etc. The Labour ‘boot the Scots up the backside’ list is absolutely endless and has covered nigh on 70 years.

      It would suit him better to go home and do something for the millions of hungry children in England. That advice applies to Mr Leonard too. They should stick to cleaning up their own backyard, as it’s in dire need of it.

    139. Petra says:

      The stupid Scots, from poor wee Scotland, are at it again.

    140. Robert Graham says:

      Petra – re The Messiah Corbyn where do you start , as usual Labour in Scotland wishing we are all brain dead and suffering from long term memory loss . As you say Brass neck doesn’t even come close ,
      Just farting about on u/tube looking at old movies , just now its the master of ballantrae surprise surprise a movie in Scotland and not a convincing Scottish accent to be found , no wonder a lot of Scots are confused about their country , ever since Radio – TV – Movies have been around a whole country has been brainwashed into believing their country is part of greater England , A wee pat on the head and a patronising word is what keeps them happy , Makes you bloody sick ,

    141. gus1940 says:

      Re the lack of a Royal Yacht – I understand that Baroness Mone’s current boyfriend/benefactor is the owner of a floating gin palace which could be lent to our poverty stricken royals.

    142. geeo says:

      From reuters. Wee corner of Scotland and the picture from the wider world for deep water exploration/extraction. (Think west coast of ascotland after Trident gets the boot post Yes vote).

      “Hail shale, but deepwater oil fights back” –
      Companies including Exxon, Shell and BP have set a rigid cost ceiling for new projects, requiring them to be profitable with oil at $40 a barrel in order to withstand an uncertain outlook clouded by the rise of electric vehicles”
      …… ….

      Thats gonna leave a mark in the ukok yoons underwear…!!

    143. Petra says:

      Thanks for the links Nana even although they are full of hellish examples of Westminster corruption, perversion and lies.

      We need to know what’s going on of course as the Establishment’s propaganda machine is doing its utmost to suppress information, such as UK links with the Philipines.

      The article about Duterte is absolutley horrendous and this is the type of regime that Westminster wants the Scots to sign up to, over and above Saudi, the US etc, as they pull us out of the EU.


      As far as I can make out Filipino citizens will be made welcome in the UK now (what happened to controlling immigration?), through the new visa-free policy, as long as they can speak English with a British accent. No questions will be asked about shooting women in the vagina, as long as you’ve managed to master speaking English with a stiff upper lip. In line of course with their prior British Empire criteria / policies / activities.

    144. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      galamcennalath @ 13:00:

      However, I also believe it’s all over for a very long time if they don’t move soon.

      True that. Once Brexit has been allowed to happen, many people will shrug and say “shame, but what’s done is done, now leave me in peace” and the BBC will be chock-full of WW2-era “we stand together alone” propaganda.

      The only other way indy could stall I suppose is if public opinion in England were to follow us and shift decisively against Brexit!

    145. PictAtRandom says:

      Variation on the European theme:
      There are jokes about Kent being turned into a lorry park in the event of a Hard Brexit. But what about possible (if smaller) blockages in the Scottish transport network if this happens? Could some of the Scottish (and N. English ports) be used as a sort of “rat run”? And are there any Holyrood contingency plans?

    146. frogesque says:


      DUP: Arlene Foster, ‘ no prospect of a return to devolved government at Stormont.’

    147. North chiel says:

      “Frogescue @0418 pm”, perhaps Arlene just prefers calling the shots from no.10 then??

    148. yesindyref2 says:

      Royal yachts? Compare the Danish royal yatch still in service, which can be used as a hospital ship and, I believe, as a supply ship

      with the Britannia which, errr, couldn’t

      It’s all a question of priorities, pink gin or lives.

    149. frogesque says:

      @North Chiel 4.22

      Sack the lot, no £1B bung and hold new elections in NI

      Time to get tough with the duplicitous bastards.

    150. Petra says:

      @ Kangaroo says at 3:52 am – ”I had a look at the twitter feed that you referenced and whilst I was having a good laugh at the derisory crowd that turned out my wife was questioning the timing of said photo and whether or not it was taken at or near the time when the ‘distinguished guests (cough) were due to appear. Could you or anyone else shed some light on this. PS She said the same thing about the Jeremy Corbyn crowd. I need facts to convince her.”

      Well I didn’t come across that on Twitter Kangaroo, it was passed on to me, but what I can tell you is that Edinburgh is always milling with tourists and if you put up barriers, clear people off of the street, the number of people that you saw would account for a regular scene. Plus have some Unionist official just walk along and hand out Union flags to everyone.

      Bussing up folks from England is common practise for the Unionist politicians, especially prior to Indyref1 and then of course their Scottish party MP’s / Councillors are obligated to attend meetings to fill up the venue, lol. Venues chosen are usually extremely small too.

      Theresa May wouldn’t even contemplate walking the streets of Scotland, like Nicola Sturgeon. She comes up and hides away in huts, such as on private estates owned by her Tory supporters / donors. And in this instance estate workers were forced to attend, even if they couldn’t stand the Tories.

      Prior to Indyref1, and following postal votes being sent out / returned, a couple of hundred Labour politicians were ‘trained up’ to Scotland to support Unionist lies.

      I don’t know if you have seen this video but I’ll post it anyway and see if I can find more ‘evidence’ to satisfy your wife, lol.

      I love this video with an ordinary Scot using his initiative .. and Alex Salmond was said to have fallen about laughing when he saw it. Seemingly English cooncilors didnae want to go to Scotland, in particular Glasgow. The No Mean City and all that. HA, HA, HA.

    151. yesindyref2 says:

      OT – HMY Britannia
      Found this on a forum, no idea if it’s valid or not, she seems to have stopped being a potential hospital ship in the 80s. Sorry, it’s long.

      The Royal Yacht Britannia was designed as a dual function vessel – a Royal Yacht in peacetime and a hospital ship in times of hostility.

      There was extensive consultation with the Medical Director General of the Royal Navy during the design phase both to determine the requirements for the ship in the hospital ship role; and to ensure that the conversion could be performed in the most economic manner with minimal alteration to the existing structure and equipment.

      As a hospital ship Britannia had accommodation for 200 patients with the wards in the after part of the ship where the Royal Apartments are usually located. While most patients were anticipated to be medical and surgical cases provision was made to cater for patients with tuberculosis and infectious diseases.

      Provision was made for operating theatres, ophthalmic facilities, physiotherapy facilities, X-ray facilities, and pathology laboratories all on the lower deck. Provision was also made for a full dental clinic, including laboratory, on the main deck. In addition the sun deck located aft was specially strengthened to permit the landing of helicopters for casualty evacuations.

      Although normally manned by a Royal Navy crew, when operating as a hospital ship, Britannia would have been manned by a merchant navy crew in accordance with international law.

      Certain features have been embodied in the design which add to the value of the ship as a Royal Yacht, but which are not altogether essential for that purpose. They would however be necessary if and when the ship is used as a hospital ship. Such features include ship’s stabilizers, certain air-conditioning, large laundry facilities and comparatively high speed, none of which could be added on conversion as a hospital ship except at considerable additional expense and long delay in completion.

      This is a very good techincal paper that discusses Britannia’s role as a hospital ship.

      To be used as a hospital ship, she would have needed great big red crosses painted on her in advance. If Independent Scotland ever decided to get our our own royal family for some odd reason – or a president – it might make sense to go the Danish way, but also double up as a fleet auxiliary for solid supplies replenishment.

    152. Liz g says:

      North chiel @ 4.22
      Beginning to think yer right.
      While I don’t know a great deal about the details of N. Ireland’s political issues, it does seem a bit manufactured to be stopping the Parliament from sitting “mainly” because of Gaelic!!!

      Mibbi Westminster’s real deal wi the DUP is to keep that administration stymied till after Brexit…wouldn’t surprise me in the slightest.
      Bet they wish they could deal with Holyrood so easily!

    153. Liz g says:

      Aw…RIP John Jappy

    154. North chiel says:

      “ Liz says @ 0422” yep bought& sold for Westminster gold ( if only the unionists controlled Holyrood ), no problem then for Mayhem

    155. Robert Louis says:

      North Chiel at 422,

      I said that right after the DUP were bribed by 1.5 billion in pounds sterling of tax payers money to vote with the Tories at Westminster. It was most likely one of the things discussed and offered as part of the bribe. N. Ireland opposes brexit, so Much easier for the DUP (who campaigned to leave the EU) to sit in London dictating what they want to happen directly to Theresa May, than have to face criticism, debate or media scrutiny in Stormont.

      The Tories prefer it too – despite their protestations to the contrary. All the supposed ‘negotiations’ to return power to Stormont, are just a very expensive, anti-democratic charade. Having direct control of N.Ireland makes Brexit easier for the lying Tories in London.

      A win-win for the British Nationalist Tories AND the bigotted, homophobic DUP. Meanwhile, like Scotland, N.Ireland will soon be dragged out of the EU against its clear, democratically expressed wishes.

      Do they really think that will help keep the peace over there?

    156. yesindyref2 says:

      When you think about it, rather than an incoming UK Government being able to appoint peers from their own party, perhaps they should have the right to sack peers from other parties. That’d be much more fun.

    157. Dr Jim says:

      The DUP want more respect and more respect for British culture and nane o yees kin speak Gaelic write it doon or even mention it and defo no road signs

      Pretty much the same as the country formerly known as Scotland then, pure dead loyal tae the Maj!


    158. Cubby says:


    159. galamcennalath says:

      So Boris said nothing of consequence. He admitted himself he only wanted to discuss ‘feelings’.

      The clock is ticking ultra fast and the UK electorate and EU negotiators need some clarity and substance within weeks.

      I am certain May’s up and coming speech will say nothing either. Just sound bites intending to be motivational to a disillusioned and impatient population.

      Yet, phase one should be being put on a sound legal footing within weeks and the EU are looking for a proposed plan. Meanwhile TMay et al appear to be back peddling on Phase One and playing silly buggers with a reasonable offer of a transitional period.

      So I just can’t see what they are playing at. There’s only one explanation comes into my mind, again. That they want to crash out and blame Johnny Foreigner.

      They are willing to take a short term hit … no, they are happy to sign us all up to a short term big hit so they can achieve their hard right rich person’s ‘Utopia’.

      OK, fine. Scotland has an alternative plan.

      That brings me to my second lack of understanding. The Tories do know that a crash out means the end of the UK!? Why are they so willing to do that? What is their plan on this? They think they can win IndyRef2?

    160. galamcennalath says:

      Gina Miller on Boris’s pathetic speech ….

      Spot on!

    161. Brian Powell says:


      Labour have given the Tories a blank cheque by saying they will never support Independence.

      The Tories know they have nothing to fear from Labour in Scotland.

    162. call me dave says:

      Very sad to hear that Mr John Jappy has died.

      His insider stuff was a revelation to me when I came across it about 6 years ago.

      I’m afraid we have lost a few good people on the road so close to Independence. RIP.

    163. jfngw says:


      Possibly an ITV programme there, Peers With No Talent. The public get to vote out a Peer every week

    164. Mike d says:

      Dr jim 5.08pm. I agree wi you doactor jim. See me ,I cannae be Daein wae yon Gaelic sh**e. Mind I cannae speak fcukin English eether. But I so luv my Maj and my fleg. And they eeeesssnpee ur so bad.

    165. yesindyref2 says:

      Peers on ice
      Britain’s got too many peers
      Pointless peers
      The Great British Peer Off with Ruth Davidson

    166. Footsoldier says:

      Off topic, here is the current BBC website showing bombing statistics on major towns and cities in WW2. Looks like Scotland escaped completely.

      Of course as usual, we are off the radar.

    167. stewartb says:

      Today’s speech by the UK Foreign Secretary makes for a hard read if you support Scottish independence and recall the ‘Better Together’ rhetoric hurled at us in the lead up to IndyRef1 and since.

      Read from an Indy perspective, the irony throughout the speech reaches preposterously huge proportions. And if I considered that the man has any awareness, any appreciation of how this speech might go down in Scotland, then his hypocrisy also knows no bounds. But how many in Scotland will be exposed to the irony, to the hypocrisy, either now or in an IndyRef2 campaign?

      This quote is just one of a host that justifies Brexit in ways the British Nationalists deny to Indy supporters:

      “It (Brexit) is the expression of a legitimate and natural desire for self-government of the people, by the people, for the people.”

      And later in the speech:

      “That is why people voted Leave – not because they were hostile to European culture and civilisation, but because they wanted to take back control.”


    168. galamcennalath says:

      Loose Peers
      Mock the Peers
      The Peers Show
      Trust Me, I’m a Peer
      Peers who kill
      A Question of Peers

      … so many possibilities, so much material. 🙂

    169. Dr Jim says:


      That’s because Scotland isn’t actually in the UK so we don’t count

      Who can forget the immortal words of Mundell when he said

      “All the devolved regions have to get behind and support the UK at this crucial time”

      See, England is the UK and we’ve to get behind
      Isn’t that just where we’ve always been


    170. galamcennalath says:

      stewartb says:

      … this speech might go down in Scotland, then his hypocrisy also knows no bounds

      It’s a Tory trait. Hypocrisy by the cart load yet absolutely no sense of irony.

      Remember both Cameron and Osborne saying how fortunate Norway was its it’s low population and all that oil. The parallels with Scotland just never enter their wee minds.

      “Scotland. I say, that’s where we go to catch the grouse, deer, salmon and estate workers’ daughters, what oh!”

      Yet, when it comes to oil, exports, and defence showhow Scotland’s comes back into their thoughts.

      That much used phrase … hate Tories for what they are, and hate Labour for what aren’t … never was more relevant to Scotland than now.

    171. Thepnr says:

      Well here’s one woman writing to the Guardian who has a solution to one of the problems of Brexit, crops rotting in the fields.

      The recent difficulties of British farmers – migrant workers no longer wish to work in low-paid temporary jobs far from home, because a drop in the value of pound removes the only advantage – are not going to disappear (Food left to rot as 4,300 farm jobs went unfilled, 10 February).

      But there is an answer to this supply problem: national service.

      All students in tertiary education could be required to register for work in seasonal agriculture. Universities should organise their term times and vacations in accordance with the needs of the nearest agricultural areas. This was the origin of the “long vacation”, when students went home to help with the harvest.

      Wonder if she is a Tory and voted leave? Difficult question.

    172. Meg merrilees says:


      Aye they probably never heard about the Clydebank Blitz and they clearly don’t know – or choose to ignore all the unexposed ordnance lying in the deep trench between Scotland and N.Ireland. which is so bad it means we can’t possibly build a bridge there.

      Talking of N.Ireland – I see Arlene has re-iterated ‘No Surrender’.
      The DUP clearly feel that they are home and dry since their unholy pact with T May, and it’s obviously not in their interest to allow the devolved assembly to regroup. They have a much stronger hand as the Tories’ kingmakers.

      How can they resist an Irish language act – they live on the island of Ireland.

      Petulant children.

    173. Gary45% says:

      Boris Johnson, just another typical inbred nobody, who carries on the “inbred mantra” of shouting big Latin mumblings, and his inbred ilk “cream themselves” every time he “goes off oan wan”.
      This folks is the best?? the Establishment have to offer the rest of the civilized world, Rule Britannia is well and truly FKD.
      I reckon Humza should have “stuck the nugget” into Gary Rubberheid on Shortbread this morning.
      Rubbers questioning was more than embarrassing, Yoon gimpery at its finest.
      Big storms on the mountains today, “nae skiing” what’s Humza going to do about it? I’ll phone Shortbread in the morning.

    174. yesindyref2 says:

      Remember recently the Brent Crude went over $70 a barrel? Well, the Unionist media has bided its time and, probably via that BBC generously giving releases to the paper media, here’s the result:

      “Expert warning on oil price outlook as US output surges”

      Doom and Gloom, please take our oil away, it’s a burden. But I looked at the report and my comment is below to keep this short.

    175. Liz g says:

      Meg Merrilees @ 6.19
      Well Meg if the DUP get their wish and Westminster impose direct rule.

      I think we should be demanding equality of treatment.
      Equal Marriage rights to start…

      Not forgetting Westminster wanted to keep abortion law in their hands,with a view to keepin it the same for everyone in their (the DUP) beloved UK…let’s agitate to make it so.

      Gaelic…. as a given of course…..We have it and the Welsh have their language so it’s only fair,our Scottish MP’s ask for a level playing fields…. as the EU Treaties demanded.
      We are still member’s are we no?

      Mibbi by the time we push Westminster into that,as best we can, they will start to work out they would be better to keep their government at home instead of playing game’s wi people’s life’s!

      If not,then…..mibbi we could try to table legislation to make sure they are no drawing wages for job’s they’re no doing.
      Apparently there’s fruit needing picked!

    176. yesindyref2 says:

      “Even at the moment Brent Crude went over 70 USD, it was predicted it would drop 8 USD with profit-taking and US Shale, so the current 64 USD having dropped to near 62 USD is as predicted. The report itself concludes with:

      “The components of the oil market balance are dynamic and a lot can change in the next few months: the deteriorating situation in Venezuela is one obvious candidate, and the apparent buoyancy of the global economy could deliver higher demand growth than we currently anticipate. As a result, prices could be maintained at recent levels even as US production rises. If so, most producers will be happy, but if not, history might be repeating itself.”

      Considering the cost of production in the UKCS has dropped from over 30 USD to around 12 USD from memory, the outlook for the North Sea still looks pretty good.”

      We need to pay attention folks, the MSM will take every opportunity to take news out of context, to put Indy down, and us with it.

    177. heedtracker says:

      This just sums it up for me, HT. High time the Scots got out of this class-ridden UK midden.

      Petra there was a huge pro NHS demo through central London a week or so ago. Beeb gimp network simply refused to report it at all, in anyway whatsoever.

      Fast forward to Edinburgh Castle royals visit and exact same beeb gimps are flat out lying about the non existent royals worshipping crowds.

      Can’t be any clearer examples of how corrupt the BBC is today.

      They’re trying to destroy Scottish democracy.

      Can they succeed?

    178. Petra says:

      It’s clear that the status quo in Northern Ireland suits the DUP and the Tories down to a T; and that nothing that Sein Fein could / would say or do will alter that.

      Meanwhile the whole kit and caboodle, who’ve done nought for a year now, should forfeit their wages and the 7 elected Sein Fein MPs should reconsider their Westminster stance. March in folks and upset the Unionist apple cart.

    179. Legerwood says:

      Thepnr says:
      14 February, 2018 at 6:16 pm

      I am surprised she did not go the whole hog and suggest schoolchildren should be used to pick fruit etc during the summer holidays.

      The long summer holiday was introduced around the 17thC in recognition of the fact that truancy went through the roof in the summer because children were needed to work in the fields. Nothing to do with teachers needing a rest everything to do with children as part of the Labour force.

      At the time of the Reformation when the Kirk was setting up the parish school system it was envisaged that the school year would be exactly that – a year – but economic reality in the shape of children being needed in the fields during the summer led to the long summer holiday being introduced. Tattie Howking – a week off secondary school – was the residual consequence of that.

      I knew the Brexiters wanted to take us back to the ’50s but I thought it was the 1950s not the 1650s!

    180. jfngw says:


      Much as I would like to see Sein Fein upset the WM applecart there is 0% possibility that they will take the oath required to take their seats. The oath is a declaration of allegiance to the monarch, they would be toast with most of their supporters.

    181. yesindyref2 says:

      Theresa may but it’s unlikely she’ll be able to.

    182. Liz Rannoch says:

      Aye Mundell. No matter what way the cookie crumbles he’ll be able to say ‘I told you so’.

      What bothers me is with all the empire building he’s doing in Edinburgh when will the EU withdrawal bill happen? Is it March 19. The end of Dec 20 after transition? Or, more worryingly, the day May decides to crash out?

      I think the tories have been quietly making up a new constitution. They will cause Ireland to be dumped (have they actually paid the DUP yet?) Wales won’t matter to them, but they must bind Scotland to the UK and a new written constitution announced quietly within days of any of the above dates would probably go ‘unnoticed’ in the general furore with the help of MSM. Henry VIII says it’s OK and Fluffy moves in, unless the HoL do something we’re screwed.

      Please tell me I’ve got it wrong!

      I wouldn’t put it past the sleakit b’trds.

    183. Mike d says:

      Just watched a “place in the sun ” why do ENGLISH people abroad call themselves ‘expats”. When EU nationals coming to the uk are called immigrants? What the fcuk is it with these people’s mentality.

    184. stewartb says:

      BBC Reporting Scotland tonight had a piece on the DWP’s Personal Independence Payment (PIP) and reported negative stories about the role of private sector involvement in making assessments.

      The BBC reporter ends (almost) by telling us that PIP is to be devolved to the Scottish Government and that the latter has determined that there will be no private sector involvement.

      But then finally, the closing sentence from the BBC reporter ensures that this commendable action – based on a clear principle set out for some time by the SG – gets the famed BBC ‘balance’. I paraphrase: ‘Scottish Labour claim this decision (on no private sector involvement) is as a result of its pressure on the Scottish Government’.

      Is this claim justifiable? We are left uninformed by the BBC (of course), but this ‘good’ action is left with the viewer as possibly/probably attributable to Scottish Labour. Why was this even included, as there was no ‘political’ input from the SNP or SG to the piece? Rhetorical question!

    185. Liz g says:

      Petra @ 7.08
      Totally agree about Sein Fein…..the fact that the job they have been voted in to do at home has been out sourced to Westminster, is… would ye put it???
      ” A Material Change in Circumstances “….so they should consider sending in their MP’s to perform the role..

      As for the oath….well as an atheist an oath to a god is for me nae oath at all,as I would assume that a promise that is not involving a god is for believers!
      So they have the ability to choose the less binding option.

      Mibbi they should consult their constituencies and see if they want them to do that…
      It would certainty stop Westminster from ignoring N.Ireland during Brexit at the very least….a d mibbi get them their Parliament back up and running!

    186. Robert Graham says:

      As widely predicted the DUP have got what they wanted , no involvement in any type of government by anyone not supporting their line on things , their view of the world is pretty twisted by most people’s standards , A little example , the physical removal of Irish Language or symbols from Irish waters man hole covers shows how really petty this lot are, they will resist any type of Irish language being taught , as was pointed out by someone else , No Irish language on the island of Ireland , tell that to anyone else in the developed world and they would think you were bonkers .

      I wonder if Fluffy and his parallel Scottish government under the guise of the Scotland Office have been looking over how the direct rule from Westminster is to be operated and how a Scottish version could be slipped under the radar , introduced and up and running while our backs are turned , the recent confused messages emanating from the Scotland Office are a side show to divert attention from what is really going on , and it probably won’t be to our benefit .

    187. galamcennalath says:

      Mike d says:

      why do ENGLISH people abroad call themselves ‘expats”.

      My own theory is that they expect to take their ‘superior’ culture with them. They have no intention of ‘going native’ and integrating. They therefore continue to see themselves as English/British and adopt the term ExPat.

    188. jfngw says:

      Truly dire Reporting Scotland, managed to shoehorn in negative SNP story as second item even though there was in fact no now news content, just the opportunity regurgitate this story with comment from Tory MP. I wonder who raised this with the editorial team?

      Apparently Labour claimed they forced SG to exclude private contractors in assessments. As this person claims to be a journalist he should investigate the truth, not just regurgitate a Labour handout.

      Some Canadian is unhappy with how Scottish rural GP’s are to be funded, Eh! They will scour the world for an negative SNP story.

      That’s my penance taken care of for this week.

    189. ronnie anderson says:

      RIP John Jappy if it wasn’t for people like you we would be none the wiser for Westminsters Treasury duplicitous accounting of Scotland.s revenues .

    190. Petra says:

      @ Heedtracker at 7:03pm …”BBC bias.”

      It must be hellish for them now HT. Do you not have any sympathy for them, lol?

      They had decades, pre social media popularity, of untrammelled access to lying not just to the UK population, but to people Worldwide. They know that millions of people can see right through their lies now, but the old leopard is finding it difficult to change its spots and well we know that it can’t. It’s impossible, so it will have to die a death to be reborn just like the Westminster so-called democratic system. How long that’ll take is another question.

      Meanwhile STV is catching up with the BBC. I wonder who’s calling the shots there now, as it’s becoming more and more biased on a daily basis. As one example, no mention of A&E stats tonight no doubt because the figures have been rising with more than 90% of patients being seen within 4 hours. The MSM in the UK, a sad bunch of misfits, at an all time journalistic low.

    191. ronnie anderson says:

      Robert Graham I wonder how long it will take James Brokenshire Nth Irish secretary to get electrons organized in Nth Ireland

    192. call me dave says:


      This was a story from about 2 weeks ago I think.
      From WOS twitter Labour claiming it was them what done it… but we all know the real story.

      Hope I’ve done the link right?

    193. Thepnr says:

      Nice work if you can get it. What fat cats?

      “Persimmon boss to give away part of £110m bonus”

    194. jfngw says:

      @iz g

      It’s not the god part that is the problem with the oath, it’s not compulsory as there is two versions. It is declaring of allegiance to the monarch that they will never take.

    195. ben madigan says:

      @ Robert Graham who wrote “the DUP have got what they wanted , no involvement in any type of government by anyone not supporting their line on things ,”

      I understand the DUP are now calling for Direct Rule from Westminster (well they have been for a bit). Yet Direct Rule requires an Act of parliament, which will go down well with Westminster as they flounder about trying to cope with the implications of Brexit.

      The DUP and their friends/puppet-masters in the Loyal Orders have managed to humiliate and embarrass the PMs of 2 different countries.

      Here are the take home messages from their latest debacle.

      Take Home Message for Scotland as she moves towards Independence: beware of giving the loyal orders any political power whatsoever!

    196. Macart says:

      @ronnie anderson

      Mr Jappy has passed? Sad news.

      Thoughts go out to his family.

    197. heedtracker says:

      The MSM in the UK, a sad bunch of misfits, at an all time journalistic low.

      Fact is though, BBC Scotland is the major anti democracy force at work in Scotland today. If they succeed, they’ll get their red or blue tory

      And that will be that for Scotland, for a generation.

      This is all that everyone in Pacific Quay does now, working very hard to close down Scottish democracy.

      Its the BBC or democracy. They take no prisoners, show no mercy, until they do finally get the SNP out.

    198. Kangaroo says:

      Thanks for looking.

    199. Petra says:

      @ jfngw at 7:26 pm … “Sein Fein.”

      I appreciate the monarchical stance that they take but it’s a wee fantasy that I have jfngw seeing the look on DUP (and Tory) faces when the Sein Fein MPs march into the Westminster midden and take their seats. I can actually feel their sense of dread in my bones.

      As Liz g says at 7:46pm ……”Mibbe they should consult their constituencies.”

      We’re all faced with what looks like being a massive Brexicide catastrophe. I would imagine that many that support Sein Fein voted to remain in the EU so might be open to their 7 politicians taking some kind of muttered oath and their seats in London. Who knows? It would be worth a try, asking them, and if successful would reduce May’s majority to six. If I was Irish and my folks had been subjected to the misery doled out by Westminster I’d be seriously considering doing so, especially if it would bring reunification closer.

      I’m not Irish of course so may not be aware of the ramifications. Maybe some of our pals in NI, like Ben or Joannie (correct spelling?), could keep us right on this one?

    200. Thepnr says:


      Get a “Page doesn’t exist” message.

    201. Thepnr says:

      That link works fine and is better than the link on their twitter page 🙂 Ta.

    202. call me dave says:


      Excellent link Nana thanks.

      Jings A whole treasury to explore.

    203. jfngw says:


      I suspect that Davidson & the Orange Order coming out in favour of Scottish independence is more likely than Sein Fein taking the oath.

      Also I can’t see what is in it for them, the more catastrophic the Brexit the more likely, in my opinion, is a united Ireland.

    204. Liz g says:

      jfngw @ 8.25
      Yes jfngw I do understand that and I also understand why they consider it beyond the pale.
      But since they have no real intention of upholding an oath to the Windsor’s why not take a fake one.
      Use their own rules against them if ye like!

      And yes I am sayin lie….as we and they have been lied to.
      And lied to by people who have taken that oath apparently genuinely!
      Which is why I said they should choose the form of oath that means the least to them….and not the one that they would pledge to their ain country.

      If is was my countries freedom on the line I would in a heart beat wouldn’t you?

      It could be argued anyway that an oath that’s not taken willingly is not valid,and is in fact forced!
      Which this one is if you can’t represent yer people without it.
      A backdoor way of keepin,in this instance the wrong sort of Irish out the Parliament.

      Therefore IMHO is OK to fake it……Ah mean its no like its an oath tae Scotland noo is it lol….but seriously an oath must be freely given to be valid don’t ye think!

    205. ben madigan says:

      @ petra who wrote “it’s a wee fantasy that I have seeing the look on DUP (and Tory) faces when the Sein Fein MPs march into the Westminster midden and take their seats . . . . etc”

      Petra pet – it is your fantasy on your part as you said. No SF voter shares it. Do try and get over it.

      SF do not take their seats in Westminster
      a) because they are a republican party and will not swear an oath to HM Elizabeth II and her heirs
      b) They want no British interference in ireland and consequently do not want to interfere in British affairs. They are an Irish party- an irish Republican party
      c) their electorate fully support their abstentionist policy. This has been discussed over several Ard Fheis and SF voters fully support their policy. No SF voter wants his representative to take his seat in Westminster.
      d) The numbers (as you yourself said) are not enough to make any difference anyway

    206. Mike d says:

      Jfngw without a doubt Ireland Will be United within the next 5/6 year’s. But will Scotland still be a vassal state? Probably!

    207. jfngw says:

      @Liz g

      If you were requested to take an oath, that Brexit would be cancelled if Scots were to declare they would not hold another referendum in their lifetime, would you take it. If not, why would you expect others to leave their principles at the door.

    208. Mike d says:

      Liz g 9.18pm. Irish republicans wont sell themselves for England’s pound. The PSB’s Will,No pride, no passion, no sense of belonging,No identity. You’ve
      Got to feel sorry for the poor ignorant soul’s.

    209. Robert Graham says:

      The gobby shop steward from Yorkshire who is now claiming his party removed any involvement by private companies in social security assessments ,oh what are they like eh , would this be the same Labour Party who first introduced the private sector namely ATOS , oh well I guess they are close to this type of organisation so they would be listened to , maybe even have some labour peers on their board of directors .

      Now that the shop steward is on a roll he could maybe get his arse up to Bi- Fab you know the company he recently saved , I have seen the Photos of him actually doing it although to be fair he was outside the place at the time must have just been captured just steeping in eh , Anyway it looks like they need his assistance once again I guess he will be featured on BBC Scotland tomorrow morning heading off on his mission .

      Aye labour in Scotland where would we be without them , Probably independent and a good few hundred billion better off , maybe sensible Dave is right about stupid Scots they are all around us and allowed out on their own . I think a test should be introduced in order to be allowed a vote .

    210. Potter says:

      There will be no special deal for Scotland.There will be a hard Brexit.Indyref2 is coming.Project fear2 will focus on the “UK single market”. Unionists will point out that Scotland exports far more to RUK than EU.They will point out Scotland only exports 18% to EU. What are the differences in economics of Wales,NI and England given Wales exports 59.8% to EU, NI 55% ,UK 43%,England ??.The recent leaked impact report stated Scotland’s GDP would fall by 9% with hard Brexit,Wales 9.5% and NI 12%.You would have thought given how little we apparently export to EU Scotland’s economy would far less affected,or am I missing something?

    211. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Nan, Thepnr et al –

      Beat me to it, I’ve been watching it too. Brilliant. And TSTV is reporting impressive viewing figures on Twitter – for all we know this could be something of a breakthrough for the station so let’s spread that link as far as we can, the more watching it this evening the better.

      Yes shops could do worse than have that on a permanent loop. I’d defy any unionist, no matter how ‘staunch’, to watch that footage and tell themselves or anyone else that this nation doesn’t have what it takes to do pretty much anything it likes – then they have to wonder how much we’re being held back by the WM Tories and their unionist buddies.—welcome-to-scotland.html

    212. Fred says:

      @ Nana, many thanks for John Jappy, his letters used to appear in the Ross-shire Journal. One of the good guys!

    213. Bobp says:

      Hard border.i don’t think mortars on the back of a flatbed lorry will respect that. Over to you treeza.

    214. Liz g says:

      jfnwg @ 9.39
      Sorry ….I’m no makin myself very clear…
      They would be taking a fake oath….they won’t actually mean it…
      Everyone will know this…but as long as they don’t declare it there’s nothing Westminster can do…..or for that matter auld Betty Windsor either.

      And even if they tried …..they just look like they won’t let the wrong sort of MPs into their Parliament.
      Most people aren’t big on details!
      Oath’s were big …back in the day….but now perception is more or less everything.

      And to answer your actual question…… When it comes to my family and their surviving this rotten system.
      Who don’t forget we know kills people…. I have nae principles…. But rest assured it I take a ” genuine ” oath you can depend on it..

    215. Dr Jim says:

      Since 2007 SNP Scottish Guv have built 71.000 houses 70% of which are for social rent

      Labour in power promised many many houses and built 6

      Labours Richard Leonard says the SNP colluded with the Tories to close mining pits, EH? EH? EH? EH? EH? EH? REALLY? REALLY?
      Let us remind ourselves of who was in power when pit closures were taking place in the whole of the UK

      Richard Leonard says Labour will pay everybody oodles more money when they beat the SNP
      When Richard Leonards Labour actually were in power in Scotland for the whole of my life why didn’t they do it then

      Richard Leonard claims his Labour party introduced free personal care for the elderly and takes credit for it’s success, except it was rejected by the Labour government at Westminster and it was a total and absolute failure and costs spiralled out of control until the SNP fixed it and now it’s working

      If you were to get credit for thinking things I’d be King of the world, the SNP however, DO STUFF!

      Day Job n that!

    216. Mike d says:

      Liz g . It’s not a fake oath liz. It would be symbolic. And the brits would love that. To reduce sinn fein’s vote. It ain’t gonna happen.

    217. Petra says:

      @ Kangaroo at 8:46pm ….”Thanks for looking.”

      Pleased to do so Kangaroo.


      @ Ben at 9:25pm …”Sein Fein Fantasy.”

      Oh well Ben I looked for your advice and got it, however another of my fantasies has just bitten the dust, lol. Best stick to reality. The reality of an independent Scotland.

    218. Rock says:


      “If rock cannot see such a blindingly obvious, and effective, strategy such as this, he might just be that very thing he describes..a stupid person in Scotland (assuming for a second he IS in Scotland.”

      Only “sovereign” clueless pompous armchair pundits can’t see the blindingly obvious.

      That Nicola spectacularly squandered a once in a 1000 years golden opportunity by wasting more than a year flogging a dead horse – a separate deal for Scotland which was never going to happen.

      The SNP having 56 out of 59 MPs, 50% of the vote, a remain vote in Scotland, the EU’s eyes favourably) on Scotland, the unionist parties without leaders and completely lost.

      Instead of striking when the iron was hot, she tried to be ultra cautious.

      She was then outsmarted by the collusion between Saints Theresa and Ruth on one hand, and Corbyn on the other.

      Result: fall in SNP support from 50% to 37%, loss of half a million voters and 23 MPs.

      The moment has been lost. In my view there is a 1% chance of an independence referendum happening before Brexit has been completed. I will be happy to be proved wrong.

      After Brexit has been completed, Scotland will be at the mercy of the Westminster government, with no official status in the EU other than a region of the UK.

      There is 0% chance of winning a referendum held after Brexit has been completed for the next 620 years.

    219. jfngw says:

      @Luz g

      You made yourself perfectly clear, I know you want them to lie. But you did not answer would you take the oath I described.

      Do I want to achieve independence with a lie, no I want to be better than WM not just the same but based at Holyrood.

    220. Rock says:

      Bill not Ben,

      “We need a new scottish newspaper, a paper that speaks for scotland and not one that just goes along with the unionist agenda.”

      You mean something other than the fake “independence supporting” The National, sister of The Herald?

    221. Mike d says:

      Bobp 9.55pm..are you talking about the ‘barrack busters “?

    222. Nana says:

      Well that was brilliant viewing from TSTV. Loved the music.

    223. TheWasp says:

      I made a comment a few days ago, which i hadnt done before, on my blue Tory MPs Facebook page concerning a marvelous constructive meeting he had with the fluffster. The yoon hordes descended immediately, and although I just called into question the honesty of the governor general, but this was ignored for an SNP bad fest. I pointed out I hadn’t mentioned the SNP but still they piled on.

      A couple of other non yoons tried to make rational points, and it transpires these people are being subjected to bile, hatred and mocking disrespect from a gang of yoons regularly on the Facebook page, and were glad I started to ” help them out” against an absolute tirade of fuckwitted bile.

    224. ben madigan says:

      @ petra who said “The reality of an independent Scotland”.

      Indeed Petra – and at the moment we all trust in the SNP and their decision on the right time to call IndyRef2.

      Personally speaking I hope it is soon (Autumn 2018 – Spring 2019, depending on what is agreed for the Transition/Implementation period). Otherwise I foresee “a bad moon arising on the right and troubles on the way” for Scotland

    225. Bob Mack says:

      Does someone help Rock put on his clothes in the morning?

      Never met anyone so irrational about The National

    226. galamcennalath says:

      ben madigan at 10:31pm

      Yes. exactly.

      I keep watching and waiting for Brexit to implode, or explode, whatever. I just can’t see it going well for Scotland. Especially when two thirds of Scots just don’t want it.

      However, the Tories continually drag their heels. Getting nowhere, talking in riddles, and mostly hiding their squabbling. But this can’t go on.

      I cannot accept a genuine possibility of a soft Brexit outcome which will ‘appease’ Scotland.

      Hard, and no transition on the cards, and IndyRef2 would have to be very soon!

    227. Liz g says:

      Jfngw @ 10.17
      The oath you described Aye I would take it …..
      Why on earth not…… no ma middle name my friend!

      And what lie would Scottish independence be based on?

      Also we will always have a different government to Westminster…. Because they will be within slapping distance
      thats the whole point.

      And just as an aside….I don’t mind them lying to or about the auld queen…’s the killing I have a problem with!
      So they should say whatever they need to to prevent that.
      Like the song says “its only word’s”

    228. Cubby says:

      Ross Thomson – total Tory bampot.

    229. Mike d says:

      Liz g..ah the killing, something we all have a problem with. Except the brits. Ah well each to their ain.

    230. heedtracker says:

      Happy UKOK Valentimes everyone, from everyone at the dole office.

      DWP Press Office?Verified account
      Follow Follow @dwppressoffice

      Claiming to be living alone is one of the most common types of benefit fraud – don’t ruin #ValentinesDay by failing to declare your true circumstances

      THE most common type of tax evader is another species of teamGBist really. Bet HMRC liggers dont tweet this kind of thing at say, mega rich tax dodgers, like Brenda for example, who only uses tax havens to rest some of her dosh, not all of it just some, for that royals resting of mullah.

    231. Thepnr says:


      I think you’ll like this latest poll from BMG. Guess what? It seems the UK public are “unclear” on the Governments plans for Brexit.

      The thing that they most seem to be clear about is that just 25% say that they are clear about “Plans relating to the rights of EU nationals living in the UK”.

      As for everything else Meh!

    232. geeo says:

      Oh dear…i upset the resident yoon goon it seems.

      2017 Snap election result (Scotland).

      SNP….35 seats.

      Tories…13 seats

      Labour….7 seats

      Lib dems..4 seats.

      That means the SNP WON 11 MORE seats than ALL rock’s yoon chums COMBINED.

      That means the SNP won 22 more seats than the 2nd party (tories)

      That means the SNP WON 28 seats MORE than the 3rd party (labour)

      That means the SNP WON 31 MORE seats than the 4th party (libdems).

      If that is SNP failure…then what happened to unionism in that 2017 GE ?

      Indy is coming, even a cock-end like rock knows it.

    233. Dr Jim says:


      The presenter says to the DUP representative if it’s now going to be direct rule from Westminster then you’ll be happy to have same sex marriage and an Irish language act the same way everywhere else is governed like in Wales

      DUP guy says Oh no we cannae have that BBC guy says but you’ve given up running the government you can’t argue
      DUP guy says oh no no no no blurb blurb blurb

    234. Robert Peffers says:

      The Westminster Establishment is keeping this news item very, very quiet. The item appeared on the BBC text service early yesterday but was soon removed. I did find this link though after searching Google just now:-

      I’m surprised no alert readers seemed to have mentioned it. Mind you I’ve been somewhat busy and only looked briefly in on Wings today.

    235. Big Phil says:

      @ Nana 10.22
      Just watched TSTV as well Nana,what a productive wee country we were(are), the music was great.

    236. heedtracker says:

      I’m surprised no alert readers seemed to have mentioned it. Mind you I’ve been somewhat busy and only looked briefly in on Wings today.

      Its still going to be Charles III. Brenda’s only 92. Her mum lived to what, 106?

      If royals are good at anything, its massive longevity.

      If Brenda keels over in 15 years time, their Commonwealth heads will probably not be picking another chinless wonder, other than Charlie, in 2032?

    237. Petra says:

      I’ve just been watching the hour long programme ‘The Scots who fought Franco’ on PBS America Channel 94.

      One Scot after another is interviewed which makes a pleasant change. Strange that the BBC never seems to get round to producing programmes like this. Too busy using the miserly 55% of our license fee ‘spend’ on programmes that run the Scots down, like Question Time?

      This is well worth a watch (proud to be Scottish) and I see that you can access it on YouTube.

    238. Liz g says:

      Robert Peffers @ 11.11
      I think Nana put up a link to that story this morning Robert.
      And they don’t come more alert than her!!

      Anyhoo how’s things your end… router packed up last Thursday night so I have been a bit out of the loop.
      Been fun watching the kids wi no internet thou…lol

    239. Bobp says:

      Thepnr11.02pm. ‘re the rights of eu nationals living in the uk. I suppose the other 75% wouldnt know if the eu nationals were being lined up to be gassed.

    240. Lenny Hartley says:

      Petra re the Scots who fought franco , its was an STV production in 2009

    241. Bobp says:

      If your watching ebc. Its about time you got to fcuk out of Scotland. Your not welcome anymore. We see through your lies.

    242. Robert Graham says:

      Heedtracker interesting little message from the DWP the subliminal threatening undertones are pretty obvious , maybe The Yorkshire shop steward would have a word with his PCS members how exactly these good Union members are involved in facilitating this Tory government in their quest to make every day a little darker a little grimmer for everyone who contacts the DWP .

      Come on Mr shop steward what’s your remedy for resisting the Tory government you seem very keen in condemning everything the SNP government are doing , or is it a case of the usual labour way ,say one thing in public then do exactly the opposite when out of sight , as for your PCS members , only doing their job is no defence , only following orders also referred to as the Nuremberg defence didn’t wash in 1945 and it certainly doesn’t f/kn wash now ,

      Get back to f/n Yorkshire where you belong because your impending a good government we don’t require you or the Messiah to muddy the waters and cause division we know the target even if you don’t pal .

    243. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Robert Peffers I contacted some betting companies a couple of years ago to place a bet on Charlie not succeeding to the throne , guess what no takers .

    244. Petra says:

      @ Lenny …….”STV production.”

      That’s the first I’ve heard of it Lenny. Missed it in 2009!

      Anybody come across anything half-decent Scottish, truthful documentary / historical / biographical etc, produced by the BBC over the last 80/90 years or so?

      Watch you don’t get trampled in the Wings rush folks.

    245. Bobp says:

      Robert peffers the demise of lizzie, As Mrs Brown would say,That’s nice’

    246. Liz g says:

      Mike d @ 9.40
      Do the Sein Fein MPs not draw their Westminster salary then?
      I have never seen that confirmed or denied.
      And if they don’t take their seat’s… Exactly what is it that they do?

    247. Hamish100 says:

      Poor rock and a hard place. No chance of independence, no chance of x, y and z! Go to bed if that is your belief and give as adults peace. You have nothing to worry about have you.
      The National is bad , very bad it doesn’t really believe in independence – unlike the hootsmon, P&J, daily record, Torygraph, times ( guardian) favourite of rock!
      Sad wee person. Is your name Tom Gordon? David Begg? He he.

      Are you back on evening shift?

    248. Robert Graham says:

      A very sad loss with the announcement of John Jappy passing , a wealth on knowledge in one man , the difference with him was he was actually involved and witnessed at first hand how this Union operate , and guess what it ain’t for our benefit never has been ,

      my previous wee rant had a mistake I had typed Impeding but the I pad changed it to impending , clever wee f/IRS these iPads sometimes . Handy when watching a slow movie or watching the BBC news trying to figure out what s—-te they are pushing tonight .

    249. Robert Peffers says:

      @Liz g says:14 February, 2018 at 11:22 pm:

      “Anyhoo how’s things your end… router packed up last Thursday night so I have been a bit out of the loop.”

      I’m still really not getting to grips with my son’s death but I suppose that is normal in the circumstance and I suppose the family will be all a bit like me.

      We won’t really begin to get closure until we get informed of the cause of death and they told us it could take months as the labs checking out the samples have enormous backlogs due to the recent ‘Flu epidemic. All we got told was that there were no apparent suspicious circumstances and the cause of death was, “Unapparent”.

    250. Petra says:

      RIP John Jappy

      Condolences to your loved ones X

      You won’t be forgotten by many Scots and when we get our independence you’ll be on our Roll of Honour List. Just too bad you didn’t get to see Scotland become independent.

    251. Still Positive says:

      Agree with all on here who appreciate what John Jappy did for us.

      RIP and condolences to your family.

    252. Still Positive says:

      Agree with all on here who appreciate what John Jappy did for us.

      RIP and condolences to his family.

    253. Still Positive says:

      Me @ 12.54. Should be HIS family.

    254. Liz g says:

      Robert Peffers @ 12.14
      Aye Robert it must be very frustrating for all of you.
      I hope that there’s a crumb of comfort in the knowledge that I have been thinking of you.
      And I am sure that you don’t need telling that ye don’t ever get over it… just learn tae live with it…anyhoo my friend take care of you ( and the wee..Butterfly Spaniel…. who won’t know exactly what’s wrong, but will surely know sumthin is) and yours…X

    255. North chiel says:

      Sick to the back teeth of Lewis Macdonald on Northsound radio all day hourly news bleating on about the possible delay to the completion of the Aberdeen bypass because of the collapse of Carillion and “ demanding answers “ from our Scottish government. No mention of the 30 year delay to the construction of this bypass when Labour ruled Scotland from the discovery of Scotland’s oil through to 2007 then ??

    256. geeo says:

      Nearly choked on my coffee earlier, reading this headline in the Daily Record online…

      “Slavery gang led by THE TANK COMMANDER kidnapped and beat victims in piggery torture chamber”

      My caps…!!

    257. silverbuick says:

      Robert Peffers, it’s been 11 years since my 20 year old son died, so I understand the pain. His was also a sudden death. There really is no closure. You just muddle thru the best you can. Kind regards.

    258. yesindyref2 says:

      “Pete Wishart: Why we need to be like Wallace in Braveheart”

      but but but

      “Pete Wishart urges caution on indyref2 timing”

      Whatever happened to Pete who I used to respect highly, did he become institutionalised at Westminster, read too many London based rags and watch too much BBC, fell for the drip drip drip propaganda, and now fancies a role in a panto as Wishy Washy Wishart?

    259. Nana says:

      RTÉ Northern Editor Tommie Gorman on what went wrong and what happens next for Northern Ireland

      Sinn Féin accuses DUP of collapsing deal to restore Assembly

      Kincora cover up has a lot of leverage for a certain party

    260. Petra says:

      @ yesindyref2 at 6:05 am …. “Pete Wishart.”

      I don’t reckon that any of our MPs at Westminster have become institutionalised at all. In fact, I’m sure that they absolutely detest that institution and can’t wait for Scotland to become independent. Pete Wishart is probably concerned that Brexit, so far, hasn’t moved support significantly towards or over the 50% mark, that there are EU divisions in Scotland and that if we go for independence too soon we’ll fail again. There’s also the issue of May’s “now is not the time” and how the outcome of a referendum would be dealt with.

      People like Pete Wishart have spent decades, day in and day out, fighting for our independence and having to put up with conditions that most of us couldn’t begin to deal with, that is without doing something that would see us behind bars. I know that the latter comment applies to me for one. As we sit at our keyboards pontificating about what we should do, he’s actually out there in the thick of it all, trailing up and down to London, battling away on our behalf. We may not agree with him, the timescale, but he still deserves our respect and support, imo.


      Don’t forget that Alex is on RT at 7:30am folks. If you can, watch the programme to get his ratings up. Also on again at 6:30pm and midnight tonight.

    261. Robert Louis says:

      Yesindyref2 at0605am,

      I have to agree, Their are a few of them who seem to have fallen into the trap of thinking what they say in Westminster matters. Bragging about being on the Scottish affairs committee, when in reality unionists are the majority, and the SNP are there as a token gesture to make them feel they are ‘involved’. Pete Wishart will not be getting my vote for deputy, that is for sure (and I do like the bloke). If you cannot summon the courage to stand up for what you believe in, at times like these, then maybe you’ve forgotten what it is all about.

      It is very easy in difficult times, to keep saying ‘oh maybe if we wait, it’ll be better’, or just one more month to ‘see what happens’ etc. Just keep putting off the difficult choices – it’s called procrastination.

      Have to say, Westminster has this effect on many people from Scotland. They go down there, and slowly they are ‘worked on’ by gentle cajoling and slow gentle persuasion, that ‘actually you know down here, we like you SNP bunch, we like how you do things etc etc.. etc..’ Absolute patronising nonsense. I think some fall for it.

      I remember not very long after the SNP hoard were first elected to Westminster, I saw a session live in the commons where, Rees Moog, was talking to them offering up platitudes and pleasant comments etc..It was all jolly nice. I remember thinking, I do hope these SNP MP’s don’t get sucked into this nonsense.

      My honest opinion is that SNP MP’s in Westminster were only good for one thing, and that was when in the majority it would mean independence (as had always been recognised across the UK), since that didn’t happen when they were elected, they are now pretty much a waste of time. Talking on committees etc.. but changing nothing. Effectively paid lip service by London. Sinn Fein has the right idea – they work very hard in their constituencies, but never go to Westminster. They treat Westminster with the utter contempt and disdain it deserves.

      As I said the other day, the time for talking and thinking is over. Westminster has stated very, very clearly, that it intends paying no heed to what Scotland needs or wants. It has made it clear it will continue to treat the FM and the people of Scotland with utter contempt and will continue quite literally taking the p**s. The people of Scotland voted to remain in the EU, the Scottish Government has a triple democratic mandate. Time to use it, and stop talking.

      We need indyref called soon. Time for action. People are angry, and they are getting restless – maybe Pete Wishart hasn’t noticed. Time to use that anger and channel it for indyref2. I and many others, have zero intention of hanging around until 2021 to ‘see what happens’.

    262. Petra says:

      Looks as though this will be well worth watching. Alex has been in Ireland and will be interviewing Irish politicians over the next 3 weeks, such as Bertie Ahern.

      Interviewing Mary Lou McDonald right now.

    263. starlaw says:

      Let SNP decide when the time is right. Westminster is goading trying to push SNP on to Westminsters timetable, this must be resisted, more developments have yet to come. EG DUPs efforts to turn the clock back, Scotlands time is very close, let the leaders decide.

    264. Nana says:

      James Kelly [scot goes pop] has a post on his blog re Pete Wishart’s article, tried posting it earlier.

      It may appear but if not, go to his site to read it.

    265. Liz Rannoch says:

      Does anybody have any ideas about my question on the repeal bill @ 7.41pm?

      Working on a letter to local rag and would appreciate some help. Thanks.

    266. Mike d says:

      ‘re.brexit and the irish situation,So sad.that the efforts for peace achieved by a decent politician like mo mowlam are being undermined by right wing tory zealots, same as the Scottish tory mp’s who got elected on a ticket of sectarian poison.

    267. Robert Peffers says:

      @heedtracker says: 14 February, 2018 at 11:16 pm:

      “If Brenda keels over in 15 years time, their Commonwealth heads will probably not be picking another chinless wonder, other than Charlie, in 2032?”

      Thing is, heedtracker, it seems that as it is not a hereditary post that at least some of the Commonwealth countries may put forward a non-Royal for head of the Commonwealth.

      For example the Australians have a written constitution that bars their elected members from office if they have more than Australian nationality and have already thrown out elected members who didn’t even know they didn’t meet the criterion of duel nationality.

      It has been touch and go for Australia ditching the Queen of England and becoming a republic for years.

    268. Mick Clark says:

      O/T not registered on Twitter but love reading Wings Twitter latest. Not allowed now unless I register. Any way around this? Don’t want to register on Twitter as there are some tweets I’d find it difficult not to reply to and might regret it.

    269. Macart says:


      I like Pete Wishart, but I believe he’s wrong on this. To do nothing will cause immeasurable harm to the SNP politically, but that will be as nothing compared to the long lasting economic harm which will be visited on Scotland’s population.

    270. Petra says:

      Thanks for the links Nana.

      If this is what Arlene Foster wants, for Treeza to be running the show, she and her DUP cabal should abide by UK rules, regulations and Laws, more than ever now, in relation to for example abortion, same sex marriage and fulfilling the obligations of the St Andrews Agreement in implementing the Irish Language Act: All of which impact on many people living in Northern Ireland.

      …’Ms Foster said it was now incumbent on the British government to set a budget and start making policy decisions about schools, hospitals and infrastructure. “Important decisions impacting on everyone in Northern Ireland have been sitting in limbo for too long.”..’


      Watch the Jim Allister DUP ‘weaponised’ video.

    271. Robert Peffers says:

      @Liz g says: 15 February, 2018 at 1:01 am:

      ” … ye just learn tae live with it…anyhoo my friend take care of you ( and the wee..Butterfly Spaniel…. who won’t know exactly what’s wrong, but will surely know sumthin is) and yours…X”

      Strange you should say that, Liz g. The wee dog is very much an alpha female and tends to be very independent. She will jump onto the bed on a cold night and even get under the covers. But only for a wee while to warm up and then go to her own wee bed.

      Since my son died the wee dog has been ultra affectionate and is spending much more time on my knee and seems to want far more bodily contact than previously. She has now been spending the entire night on the bed, above the duvet, lying against me and with her head in my hand.

      Mind you she has been a trained Therapet since aged 5 weeks old and can pick out an the very young, more elderly adults and the ill and or disabled.

      She can be walking on a high street, she will stop and greet people as she goes along and you can bet those she seeks out among the crowd are the most vulnerable on the street.

    272. Tinto Chiel says:

      I was visiting the Aged Neighbour last night and was unlucky enough to catch a clip of Arlene Foster (surely The Mrs Doubtfire From Hell or one of Ronnie Barker’s more extreme drag characters) and her revolting crew, including one prickly wee gremlin called Hamilton (?), who accused SF of not respecting British traditions and values, or some such Carmichael.

      And imagine those bloody Irish wanting to speak their own language…..

      The reason NI is so far behind even the Republic on women’s issues and LGBTI rights is down to the DUP, who only want to be British when it suits them but cling to repressive and antiquated “values” which the rest of the UK legislated against years ago.

      Pravdasound4 gives them a free ride of course, so much so you could be forgiven for forgetting that a substantial majority in NI voted to remain, something which never seems to get a mention nowadays.

      It’s a funny old game, Saint.

    273. Petra says:

      Vote for Labour to get a Lordie.



      @ Macart says at 9:01 am …. ”I like Pete Wishart, but I believe he’s wrong on this. To do nothing will cause immeasurable harm to the SNP politically, but that will be as nothing compared to the long lasting economic harm which will be visited on Scotland’s population.”

      Most of us on here, I’m sure, won’t agree with his timeline either Macart and it’s doubtful that he’ll become Depute. At the moment I reckon that Pete Wishart and many other MP’s aren’t privy to what’s going on behind the scenes at Holyrood and at the end of the day it’s Nicola who will be making the decisions about the timing of the next referendum, not Pete.



      Fantastic – Red Gerard’s full gold medal run 87.16

    274. Macart says:


      “At the moment I reckon that Pete Wishart and many other MP’s aren’t privy to what’s going on behind the scenes at Holyrood and at the end of the day it’s Nicola who will be making the decisions about the timing of the next referendum, not Pete.”

      Pretty much.

      The SNP Scottish government have used gradualism over the years to slowly build people’s confidence in our institutions. They’ve also used it to build people’s confidence in themselves and their capabilities. It’s brought us to the brink or tipping point, whichever way you prefer to call it, but to a point where we can choose. It’s been a truly exceptional and successful strategy. Events though, can sometimes make a nonsense of any strategy however exceptional.

      Constitutional crisis throughout the UK. Economic and political mismanagement on a truly eye watering scale. Utterly needless and reckless societal fracturing. All those, have brought us to a point where a leap onto that lifeboat, rather than a step, is required to avert hardship and suffering from being visited upon the population at large.

      The way I see it at the moment? The timing and final shape of the deal will determine the when for our government. They are bound and compelled by commitment to various processes, legality and the devolution settlement. The when for the independence movement to start campaigning is as soon as we feel like and probably the sooner, the better.

    275. Ottomanboi says:

      In the introduction to a book, Oxford University Press, published in 2009 I have just read that post war Berlin was divided between American, French, [English] and Russian government zones.
      It’s the purblind conceit and cultural hubris of such usage that irritates.
      Brexit will not improve matters. Brexit is essentially concerned with post imperial English consciousness. It carries a weight of ethnic mythology which crushes all who might differ.
      We should not underestimate its power.
      I trust the national movement has a well conceived, reasoned plan and strategy for dealing with the tsunami of patriotic, romantic rhetoric when the day of reckoning dawns in 2019. The SNP needs a depute leader with a marked sense of the urgency of our situation. This is no time for ‘wait and see’.

    276. Petra says:

      Wee Ginger’s take on Indyref2.

      ‘Why we need indyref2 sooner rather than later.’

      …”The next independence referendum should be framed as Scotland giving itself the opportunity to have its own say on Brexit, and that means it must be held near the date when the UK leaves the EU. My own preference would be for Scotland to hold a referendum shortly before the official Brexit date as by that time we ought to have some idea of what is in store. That means a referendum in Spring 2019. A Yes vote in that referendum means that Scotland can then negotiate its own relationship with the EU, and protect Scotland’s interests in a way that the British Government has no intention of doing. It also means that Scotland will be able to look to the EU to put pressure on the UK to respect Scotland’s interests in the way that the EU is protecting Irish interests. The British parliament and British nationalists aren’t going to do this for Scotland. We need tae dae it wursels.”

    277. Petra says:

      ‘Alex Salmond: ‘Nothing is more motivating than an indyref2 debate’


      ‘The experts explain where we’re at with Brexit – as EU patience wears thin.’

    278. TheWasp says:

      Mick Clark @ 9.00

      I have the same problem on my phone and tablet, but can access the Twitter feed on my laptop.

    279. jfngw says:

      I see Nick Robinson has consulted with his staff and they have all agreed the BBC is the most impartial organisation they can think of.

      The fact that UKIP with no MP’s, only received 1.8% of the votes in 2017 (less than the SNP that stood only in Scotland), is never off their channels may be an indicator of this impartiality in action. Previously they said their appearances reflected the support, still never off with next to no support.

      I don’t know their appearances on the main BBC compared to the SNP but it seems higher. Rarely have I seen an SNP member on Newsnight unless there is a negative story to run and they want to big up Davidson. And Neil sometimes will invite a SNP person onto This Week but no matter the subject it will turn into an attack on the SNP Government, ably assisted by his Cheshire cat.

    280. Alan Mackintosh says:

      Mick Clark, on laptop its fine, but on ipad it keeps asking for log in. I get round it by doing a google search for wings twitter and entering the site from there. Whenever i have gone straight to the site i get trapped in the log in. HTH

    281. starlaw says:

      Petra 9-52

      My thoughts exactly, will also be the time Westminster neither needs or wants it, Westminster is trying to goad us into around September. Don’t move!

    282. Petra says:

      Watch the video and have a good laugh!!

      ‘Former UKIP candidate publishes ‘No Divorce Bill’ Brexit song.’


      MORE LIKE:

    283. Bill McLean says:

      Pete Wishart is a smashing bloke but on the timing of the next Indy referendum I totally disagree with him. The Britnats are nothing if not cunning. Regardless of what we think or say about them they hung on to huge areas of the world for hundreds of years while they stripped them clean – they are not daft. They will be planning well in advance to stop our Independence. It now looks like we are heading for “direct rule” of NI, due to the talks breakdown, for the flimsiest of reasons. I hope not but the disaster that may ensue will have little effect on the Britnats on the mainland and I strongly feel that that is what Mrs May has in mind for Scotland and Wales – why is Mundell building up his empire in Edinburgh? I she gets direct rule over us we can say goodbye to Independence – forever! We must toughen up a bit and instead of reacting to them take a lead. Tell them there will be an indyref if it looks like Scotland is going to be disadvantaged – every country in the world would! Just my feelings.

    284. orri says:

      Given all the talk about possibly reversing Brexit it seems to me that it’s critical that indyref2 must be held with enough time before the next Holyrood elections to make it irrevocable.

      Cut it too fine and sure as eggs the unionist parties will all get a bandwagon of No to independence. Regardless of the fact that what they’ll be saying is if by the peculiarities of the electoral system they gain a majority of seats without a majority of votes they will cancel a referedum result without even refering it back to the electorate.

      There must be at least enough time for the parliament to negotiate in good faith with Westminster. Unlike the current shambles where it seems the aim is to talk out the 2 Year countdown and hard Brexit by default. At a minimum Holyrood must impose a limit that sees Scotland independent before May ’21

      My prediction would be either the end of this year or early next. There’s a chance that somehow Brexit might be used to quash the right to self determination from Scotland and the closer we get to the 2 year mark from when Article 50 was acknowledged by the EU the more danger there’s of the UK simply accepting the suspension of it’s EU membership. The apparent silence over Catalonia might embolden Westminster even more.

    285. Scott says:

      Here is a good one guess who has been out in Afghanistan blowing up bombs no other than the Colonel Ruth Davidson no wonder the BBC or Gary cant find her.

    286. Bob Mack says:

      I agree that we should wait for indy ref2 whilst everything plays out around it.

      N Ireland is a mess. The Unionist grass roots. Or more aptly Loyalist ,believe the British and Irish States are out to subdue them. They could turn on Mrs May and the British State anytime soon. Meanwhile there is a binding agreement to ensure Stormont stays open as the seat of N IRELAND government. It would take an Act of Parliament to change that, but would create an international furore for the UK.

      This union is breaking up before our eyes, and we have not yet begun to fight. Brexit will further focus minds as to the potential for Scotland to take a massive financial hit from leaving.

      The Tories are fools, manning the SS BRITAIN as she sinks, handing out assurances instead of lifebelts.

      Bide our time and hit them at their lowest ebb. That time is not yet upon us.

    287. jfngw says:

      Maybe we should have a more apt question on the referendum paper.

      Where do you want the full governance of Scotland and its future decided?



      Not very well worded but you get the drift I hope

    288. Mick Clark says:

      Thanks guys. Hate not being up to date with who Stu is ripping apart each day.

    289. Petra says:

      This is what we’re up against. The sinister Establishment network.

      ‘Assange Judge’s Husband Runs Security Firm With Ex Head of MI6.’

      And while you’re there check out the embedded Mirror article.

      ‘Mr Arbuthnot’s wife joined him on two of the trips, including to Istanbul where the couple gorged on an astonishing £1,200 of food during the long weekend.’


      Check out Professor Robertson’s latest articles too:

    290. Fred says:

      @ Petra, the Bella, Lords, link is chust sublime!

      Gary Robertson tried to do a number on a Scottish minister this morning, aided & abetted by some Tory, anent “Costing & Funding!” for child welfare. You might think that mentioning “Costing & Funding!” would be something the Tories would avoid at all costs, even Mundell is at the other side of the world to avoid questions on that very subject & that “Costing & Funding!” is something the SNP are particularly good at! (Check that bridge for example).

      Theresa is still living rent-free at Number 10, held hostage by the rednecks of the DUP whose leader should be in the jile for financial irregularities on “Costing & Funding!” a heating scheme.

    291. Meg merrilees says:


      Aye, she’s getting first hand experience of how to negotiate a minefield!
      The mines are cleared by a Dumfriesshire based company – obviously Fluffy couldn’t go because he was in Hong Kong and they could never have extended the invitation the the First Minister because that would have shown her in a positive light.

      To quote the ‘British’ Host in Afghanistan,

      ‘James Cowan of the Halo Trust said:

      “Not many politicians get to visit Afghanistan and it takes a certain sort to face its dangers only a few days after some major attacks.” ‘

      Right up (t)Ruthless’ street then!

    292. galamcennalath says:

      Could the U.K. really hold another Brexit vote?

      Reading through this accurate (and probably impartial) analysis, I was left thinking what and utterly astonishing constitutional mess!

      Not only was Brexit a really stupid idea, and not only is there a UK gov which can’t even decide what it wants to do about it, but any further democratic mechanisms for undoing the mess seem to be impractical!

      I cannot see TMay getting her act together even by the summer. The details must be settled by Autumn. An IndyRef2 then now seems highly likely to me.

      If, and only if, the arrangements are not as bad as seem likely, that may slip. Perhaps to Spring 2019.

      Looking at it differently. What are the chances of getting an agreement which does not meet the “substantial changes in circumstance” of the SG’s mandate? I have to say, I think that highly unlikely.

    293. Dr Jim says:

      Yasmin Alibhi Brown said on SKY news that Britain only got what it has by going around the world bullying other countries and taking what it wanted and it thinks it can keep doing that

      And she’s absultely right, the British state weilds their version of democracy like a gang leader with the biggest chib
      They believe democracy stops when they’ve won the fight, until they decide when the next fight will be

      The EU say will you talk to us about what you want, the UK British state says, we want everything and we want it now, the EU says that’s undemocratic, the UK says Democracy is what we say it is

      So how do you do democracy with people who don’t understand the meaning of the word
      How do you talk to people who say I don’t want to hear you anymore we won
      What kind of people threaten you with unpleasantness if you don’t comply with their demands to stop talking about democracy

      The undemocratic British state do, or they’ll chib you

    294. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Bill McLean at 10.24

      Peter Wishart is completely and dangerously wrong and factions who want us to wait for the “right time” should understand there is no such thing.

      You make the “right time” by campaigning for it and we wont get YES back into the lead until we do so. It wont just go into the lead if we just wait.

      Our independence is not determined by Brexit and even if the worst comes to the worst, we leave the EU, it is a disaster people just adapt to changed circumstance. Brexit is helping us at the moment to an extent but that will fade.

      The Scottish Government is correct in representing the overwhelming view of Scotland on the issue and our nuanced position is putting our opposition on the back foot.

      Did anybody see the incoherent ramblings of the Tory and Labour guy with Colin McKay last night. Neither of them made any sense whatsoever and the Tory chap looked marginally insane.

      We have to get a date for a referendum and get going

    295. Brian Powell says:

      British army lost in Afghanistan, including the last foray there. They were virtually confined to one base. The Americans bailed them out.

    296. Meg merrilees says:

      Robert Peffers

      This item about the Commonwealth was on the bBC website on the 13th.

      I’m so sorry you will have to wait to find out about your son’s last hours. It must seem interminable. Glad you are back online. Take care, M

    297. Jack Murphy says:

      STV News:”Scottish exports to the Netherlands worth more than £2bn are at risk because of Brexit, the external affairs secretary has said…………”

      Meanwhile in the Alice in Wonderland Tory Party,Mundell and Davidson continue with their Brexit madness.

    298. Bill not Ben says:

      Lets be honest, do we really want scotland to be part of a european super state that can do as it likes, they have threatened Poland and Hungary because they refuse to take in complete strangers into their countries, when did somalia become part of the european union, and yet their nationals can illegally enter any european country and then claim they are something they are not.
      I blame merkel for all of it, the woman has no idea about anything, but she and her cohorts will not listen to sense from anyone, they say if you don’t agree with them they will punish you.
      Is that what deomcracy is, your country says no, and then you get sanctioned, its madness from people who are to dogmatic to see how stupid they are.
      We have evolved into a dictatorship in the european union, a common market was what we signed up for ( UK ) not a political union by the back door run by unelected individuals who are doing very well thank you very much on the gravy train that is disguised as democracy

    299. Robert Graham says:

      Dr Jim – very funny I haven’t heard that particular term of endearment for some time ‘ Chib you ‘ Ha Ha brought back memories of when I lived in Glasgow .

      This push to hold hold is getting right up people’s noses , ok let’s say that’s the best way, if so some serious mischief should be going on right now by every department of the Scottish government tangle up every Westminster department with spurious bloody arguments , make them wonder what Holyrood are up to . And above all make Fluffy appear and explain what he is up to with the suspected alternative Scottish government he is constructing in Edinburgh .

      And directly confront the BBC in Scotland as to what the f/k they think they are up to with the daily sometimes hourly attacks on the freely elected government , in other words pick a fight .

    300. Bob Mack says:

      Poor old Mrs Merkel. She has not got a clue eh ? Mind you, it would help if you could explain why Germany economy has started to boom over the past year. I don’t think it is Mrs Merkel who hasn’t got a clue.

    301. John H. says:

      Those who want to wait until 2021 for a referendum are wrong I believe. People get fed up with having the same party in power after a certain number of years, and they forget how bad the others were when they had control. If we don’t go in this parliament then we can forget it. I believe that we have a small window left now to go for it, and we must get it right, postal votes and all. Otherwise we will be a small area of Brexit Britain.

    302. geeo says:

      Bill not Ben, i see you are still dribbling your utter pish about the EU.

      Simple Question for you.

      If Indy Scotland is to stay in the EU, will you vote Yes or No in indyref2 ?

      If you will vote Yes, then why the fuck are you banging on about the EU ? After indy, you can vote for a Party who wants to leave the EU, and if a majority of Scots agree with you, we will leave the EU.

      If you would vote No under the circumstances i put to you, then frankly, you were ALWAYS going to vote No and were never in favour of independence.

      We only have the chance for a new indyref because we are currently being taken out the EU against our expressed Sovereign will.

      That was the mandate, so indy within the EU absolutely MUST BE the way forward.

      So again, if Scotland is staying in the EU post indy, will you vote Yes or No, when the referendum comes ?

    303. Footsoldier says:

      A Jill Stephenson is starting to appear in the letters pages of The Herald. According to a Herald article dated 5 July 2015, Jill Stephenson a prominent unionist and professor of history at Edinburgh University called Mhairi Black a “foul mouthed little slut”.

      This may not be the same person but if it is, I wonder why is it necessary to give space to people who have previously used inflammatory language when such behaviour is being discouraged.

    304. Jack Murphy says:

      Petra mentioned at 7:20am:
      “Don’t forget that Alex is on RT at 7:30am folks……”

      Here is this week’s broadcast:

      RT TV:”….. This is the first in a series of interviews by Alex Salmond which look at Irish politics post Brexit…….”

    305. Bob Mack says:

      I despair:

      NATO –did the military just get together and decide to protect Europe, or were politicians involved?

      Commonwealth— we just love Britain so let’s just keep a loose connection said all the people we used to govern. Or were politicians involved in that?

      UN— just a group of people who sponge off every State perhaps, or were politicians involved in that?

      I could go on and on naming hundreds of organisations with which we have POLITICAL unions either via treaties or agreements, and yet there is always someone who picks out the EU as being somehow unique. It is bizarre how you can ignore every other political connection to countries all around the world, with whom we trade,give aid,military assistance etc

    306. Highland Wifie says:

      @Mick Clark
      Yes I’m finding same on iPad. Up until a couple of days ago I could get straight on to a thread on Stu’s Twitter with one click. Now I can’t get past the login and it’s infuriating as I have to go to Google to find individual Twitter accounts and you can’t access the full thread. May have to give in and register but really reluctant to.

    307. Robert Graham says:

      Dave McEwan Hill- yep agreed , as if Fluffy & Co are going to wait until we are ready just as we are being advised to wait until the right time , right now the Unionist parties all of them in collusion are actively working on blocking any referendum it doesn’t matter if the Scottish parliament have voted for one, they don’t really take any notice of anything that comes out of Holyrood anyway .

      We always are dancing to the tune the Unionists are playing what’s needed is a change of plan they should be wondering what the hell holyrood are going to do next not as been the case we wait until they’re allowed without impediment to strangle us with their actions , then try to undo what they have done when it’s to late .

      Scottish ministers should right now be insisting Fluffy explain his suspected empire building in Edinburgh in full view of everyone , this has to come from the top it cannot be left to a few intelligent bloggers to weed out the truth , bugger this non answered questions guff they have to stand their ground until this matter is out in the open , keep insisting this is answered .

    308. Bill not Ben says:

      I refuse to lower myself to the trolls level after i last commented about the state of the european union.
      All i can say is this, somalia and other countries like it are not part of the european union, is this true or false.
      And how can an economy boom if it tales in over a million people and cannot find work for them as they have no education or skills,who pays for them to sit on their backsides all day and provide them with very generous welfare payments, here is a little clue, one of my favourite teams play there, Bayern Munich

    309. Bill not Ben says:

      It seems that if you don’t like the european union in its present form it means you are somehow not in favour of a european union
      Sometimes you feel as if you have stumbled into some kind of twilight world where people do not comprehend the english language.
      And me an SNP supporter who only ever votes SNP no matter what, as a guy once said about football, its a funny old game, well posting can be a funny old game to. lol

    310. Thepnr says:

      Turkey is not in the EU yet has managed to take in more than 3 million Syrian refugees fleeing war.

      Lebanon is not in the EU but has over 2 million Syrian refuges.

      Egypt is not in the EU and has over 1 million Syrian refugees.

      Germany took in over 600,000 Syrians, the UK well not so much. In fact less than 10,000.

      The plight of these fleeing war and bombed out houses is a world wide problem and we should all share the burden that IS of our making.

    311. frogesque says:

      Thinks we have a new pet bridge-dweller.

    312. Bob Mack says:

      @Bill and Ben,

      Read the financial papers or Google current German economy.

      Actually I find your post quite disturbing. It is very veiled racism. What do you hold against Somalia exactly.? They are certainly contributing to Germany right now, but I expect you do not believe that either. SNP or BNP ?

    313. Bob Mack says:

      Try looking up the history of Somalia. Another colony bombed into being a British protectorate. Yes. Britain was running Somalia right up until 1960. We owe them for having created the mess by giving away their lands to Ethiopia.

      You know nothing. We did the same in Palestine and India.

    314. Legerwood says:

      European superstate

      Mr Junker could not have been clearer when he spoke yesterday: talk of an EU superstars are nonsense

    315. Legerwood says:

      Superstate, superstate, superstate, supers…

    316. Robert Peffers says:

      There are more SNP and SG BAAAD sheeple posting here on Wings than there are on the Scotsman and Daily Record put together.

      Only fools or undercover unionists would advocate changing the successful SNP/SG tactics that is presently continuing to see a movement of voters from the unionist parties and a subsequent rise in those who would vote for independence.

      So – has Wings been taken over by fools or false flag unionist agents?

      Every great tactician, whether political or military, (or both at once), has stated the obvious – never interrupt your opponent when they are making mistakes.

      They also always stress that lost battles, military or political, most often result from wrongly timed actions. In every conflict there are three basic actions attack, retreat or hold fast.

      The successful tactician knows precisely when to adopt which tactic. In some, more complex, conflicts it can be possible to adopt any combination of those three basic tactics on different fronts at the same time. For example you engage with the enemy, on your terms and on your chosen field. i.e. you allow the enemy to attack you on your terms, on one front.

      Then when the enemy throws their reserves into that front, you mount a surprise attack on the enemy from the enemy’s rear and that could mean perhaps withdrawing some troops, (retreat), from the main front to mount a pincher attack that has the enemy outflanked and thus with nowhere to retreat to that doesn’t involve losing the battle.

      Conflicts, outside of a sporting ring, are never a stand up contest between equals. Now tell me how many boxing matches end in a draw?

      The facts are that the SNP are winning the battles as the polls show a steady, if slow, movement towards independence.

    317. Nana says:


      How many people listen to BBC Radio Scotland? This page has the latest official audience figures. All figures quoted include listening across all platforms, including online.

    318. geeo says:

      Notably, Bill not Ben has failed to answer my question.

      I shall try again.

      Q. If Indy Scotland is to stay in the EU, will you vote Yes or No in indyref2 ?

    319. Dan Huil says:

      @Nana 1:29pm

      Thanks for the link.

      Oh dear. Poor old Radio Scotland. Ha ha ha

    320. K1 says:

      You lower yourself all by yourself BnB. Noted.

    321. Another Union Dividend says:

      Footsoldier says: @12.15

      The Scotsman scrapped mad Jill Stephenson’s column after being alerted to her offensive tweets and she has not had any letters printed since then so she has reverted to the Edinburgh Evening News and The Herald.
      See more on the Scotland In Union letter writers here

    322. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Bill not Ben @ 11:56,

      “European superstate”, eh? =sigh= Now where did you get that tired old slur from?

      Could it be that Farage chap and his pals, you know, the ones who spout “England über alles”?

      Could it possibly be those wonderful newspapers (alleged) who tell all those lovely stories about how great Scottish independence would be?

      If you really are a supporter of independence, just how much credence can you seriously place on the hate-mongers who are not only traducing Scotland 24/7 but almost anywhere else except their precious Little England and their Empire 2.0 pipe dream?

      Wake up, my friend, before it’s too late – you’re being manipulated in a very old-fashioned but time-tested way. (Or just possibly you’re trying it on with us.)

      As others have said in other ways, there’s no “indy à la carte” (pardon my French). You either have to accept the whole democratic kahuna or you get nothing at all.

    323. HandandShrimp says:


      I agree that we could wait a long time if we were to look for the perfect time but there has to be a degree of planning to the timing.

      I favour May or Sept 19. It is reasonable gap from 2014 and we will have a good idea of what Brexit entails by then. This is important because the raison d’etre for a second referendum is that circumstances have changed. We need to map those changes and lay the options out to the Scottish people. An independent Scotland with access to the single market via a Norway or EFTA type deal would be a clear position to present to the people. We cannot afford to go off at half cock, this will likely be the last chance most of us will see.

    324. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      HandandShrimp @ 15:16,

      That’s right, while more and more people are currently waking up to what a total catastrofolly Brexit really is, stall until Brexit is a done deal for most folk then offer “Brexit-Lite” after it’s all too late. That will really do the deal. Duh.

    325. Thepnr says:

      @Robert J. Sutherland

      You won’t be surprised to find that I agree with HandandShrimp that the terms of Brexit agreed between the EU and UK need to be known before any further referendum.

      That timetable is what the FM and SG are working to, October this year is that date given by the EU for the final deal to be put before the remaining EU27 members.

      Are you seriously suggesting that a second referendum must happen in the next 9 months before these proposals are known?

      I think there is a greater chance of another general election or even a second EU referendum happening in that timescale than there is of Indyref2.

    326. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      yesindyref2 @ 06:05,

      Actually, once you look beyond the headline bravado of the first article, you see that Pete Wishart hasn’t actually changed his stance at all.

      We all have to face up to the inconvenient truth he mentions which is that the people of Scotland haven’t even yet risen up in fury at being trampled all over by our imperial masters, as they damn well should have been right from the get-go.

      The question is how to deal with that and move on?

      Wishart and his fellow-thinkers have an essentially passive attitute, and are waiting for circumstances to change in some beneficial way before finally making their move. Leaving everything to “events”.

      To which in their timidity they typically – and extremely unhelpfully – add confusion by peddling Blairite-style triangulation, “vassal state” EFTA status to dampen the very real affront of Brexit they bemoan isn’t causing enough reaction!

      What we need instead is real leadership. Looking back in history, you see that successes are often won by people who don’t have an obvious fair wind behind them at the start, but have a sound intuition that there’s a situation pregnant of development, and also the energy and gumption to exploit it to the max. They energise people. They make things happen.

      We are in that situation right now, I believe. Despite the obvious odds against us.

      This isn’t a time for fainthearts and wishful-thinking compromisers.

      “Who dares, wins”.

      That’s the real lesson of “Braveheart” that Wishart & Co clearly just don’t understand.

    327. Bill McLean says:

      Dave McEwan Hill at 1145am – Hey Dave i’m on your side!!

    328. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “So – has Wings been taken over by fools or false flag unionist agents?”

      My patience with comments like this is on its very last atom. Wings hasn’t been taken over by anyone. Some people in the comments disagree with each other. That’s a thing that happens. Deal with it.

    329. HandandShrimp says:


      The chances of holding a referendum, negotiating an exit from the UK and retaining EU membership before the 31st March 2019 is not realistic. We have to keep this as real as possible otherwise any campaign is going to get shot down in flames before we even start. Politics is the art of the doable we have to present the doable.

      It may be that closer to the time, for reasons that suit them, the EU make the transition surprisingly easy. At this stage though we should start from the basis that we will have to do it all for ourselves. We cannot formulate a unilateral offer that could be killed with a single soundbite from Rajoy or similar. It has to be clear, straightforward and watertight.

    330. yesindyref2 says:

      There are more SNP and SG BAAAD sheeple posting here on Wings than there are on the Scotsman and Daily Record put together

      This isn’t an SNP forum, it’s for Indy supporters of any party or none, and for others to comment too. And critical comments about Pete Wishart’s “wait till after 2021” are all over the place “out there”, if you look. If Pete Wishart’s intention is actually to throw a few firecrackers into a room full of dozing people to wake us up, he’s succeeded.

    331. Bill not Ben says:

      Never voted for any other party than the SNP, never attacked a somalian pirate in my life, never been allowed into another country without having a visa or a passport.
      Does that seem unusual to anyone, or am i the only person that needs documents to get into another country, i would love to just waltz into Russia, China, America, Australia, New Zealand etc etc etc, oh i forgot, they are not in the european union, so i need to prove who i am so that i would not be a danger or a drain on the state, i wonder what would happen in all those countries if i said i was a syrian refugee, do you think they would believe me and take my word for it, i am scottish but i think i could pull it off if it was’nt for my accent, and the fact that i am quite old and not 14 with a beard and pretending to just out of primary school, it seems to be quite easy for lots of people to do this, i have an idea,i could walk into austria and say,you owe me, one of your guys started the second world war and bombed my grannys house in Dumbarton, yes that would do it, play the old victim card, that never fails to impress people, yes a new life with all the free benefits in austria, and nobody will even ask me to get a job, now how do i get there, i know i will jump on a lorry at the channel tunnel, sneak through france, make my way to the german/austria border, cross over and say here i am feed and clothe me and give me a house and a big stash of money every week, you owe me for bombing my wee grannies hoose in the war

    332. Bill not Ben says:

      That was a nice little story, i am a scottish nationalist, i have never voted for any other political party, i believe a european union could work with a few changes, but i could never accept any unelected cretins telling me or my country what to do, i have never voted for the cretins that are in power in the house of commons now, but they tell me and my country what to do.
      Its all to familiar, now a european army and a central power base in brussels and every country flies the same flag, was that not what that little austrian fellow wanted, or did i just imagine that, mmmmmmmm

    333. K1 says:

      ‘never been allowed into another country without having a visa or a passport.’


      Have you heard of the British Empire?

      Did they all have passports and visas when they ‘visited’ all those countries…did those countries ‘allow’ them in too?

      Did they ‘pretend’ they were ‘refugees’, all of them? Did they ‘integrate’ with those who lived there?

      Are people checking out their Irish heritage so they can escape when the full impact of Brexit comes so they can play victim to get an Irish passport? I mean we are talking grandparents and great grand parents, probably pre war connections in this regard? Are people ‘wrong’ to do this?

      What are the ‘numbers’ of those getting ‘free benefits’ having ‘sneaked’ into Scotland? Or England?

      Too much Mail, too much trash telly. If you are going to ‘rant’ incoherent nonsense and expect to be taken seriously on this site of all sites, do provide links to sources to back up your ‘assertions’ instead of ‘attempting’ rather immaturely imv to present some dystopian nightmare gleaned from the pages of the Express or some such other ridiculous ‘media’ source as your ‘obvious’ references.

      Oh and just one tiny wee thing, if you as you claim are an SNP voter and supporter, in what universe does your outlook remotely mirror anything related to this left of centre socially democratic progressive party?

      Correct, it doesn’t.

    334. K1 says:

      62% of Scotland’s electorate voted to stay in the EU. It’s like you’re not even from here.

    335. yesindyref2 says:

      now a european army
      No there isn’t, that’s the Express or Daily Mail talking, or rather making it up as they go along. It’s a defence co-operation for equipment and command co-ordination, but all members who voluntarily commit resouorces to it, retain control over any forces supplied.

      So no, not a “central power base in brussels

      Military capacities developed within PESCO remain in the hands of Member States that can also make them available in other contexts such as NATO or the UN.

    336. Bill not Ben says:

      Now…… they want a european army, that’s a fact, nothing to do with any newspaper, its a fact, every countries army would be in the control of brussels if that bit of legislation gets past.
      The British empire did not need a visa or a passport, good heavens we are going back a bit there old chap, i think the world has moved on since those days, some people are still in a little world of their own i think, we must get them into reality if we are ever to get our independence

    337. Bill not Ben says:

      I state that i am an SNP supporter and all of a sudden i am a liar, now why am i called some kind of liar, its because i state the bleeding obvious, but people who don’t seem to know any better ask me to state my sources, are my sources not bloody obvious to them, its called the european union.
      They are like the tories at the top of that union, they make things a little bit obscure to try to fool us that is for our own good, if they control a countries army, they can then control that countries people, its bleeding obvious to anyone with just a little bit of savvy

    338. Bob Mack says:

      @Bill not Ben,

      You mean like America controlled us into all the wars in the Middle East ? We want to avoid that the in future,don’t we?

      Funny thing that the Americans control our nuclear arsenal, because without their satellite guidance we might as well fire donuts. Wonder if that’s why we went eh?

      WE ARE ALREADY CONTROLLED.and not necessarily for the good.

    339. yesindyref2 says:

      Now…… they want a european army, that’s a fact,

      No, it isn’t a fact, my link disproves it. What it is is rabid Brexiteer nonsense.

    340. yesindyref2 says:

      every countries army would be in the control of brussels if that bit of legislation gets past

      WHAT bit of legislation? The EU-27 have already SIGNED the notification on PESCO – Permanent Structured Cooperation.

      Read the factsheet and leave the crap to the MSM.

      This is Wings, no crap is allowed.

    341. yesindyref2 says:

      @Bob Mack
      Sorry, that’s incorrect. Trident is guided by gyroscopoic navigation which is preset before launch. Satellites, if avaliable, are for making minute course corrections to make accuracy within a metre, otherwise it’s a few metres which makes very little difference really.

      And it’s launched using two keys under the control of the Sub commander and officers, not launch codes. The Yanks have no operational control, though if they withdrew support for the missiles themselves (not warheads), there’s be no maintenance and about 3-6 months later the UK deterrent would be useless.

    342. yesindyref2 says:

      if they control a countries army, they can then control that countries people, its bleeding obvious to anyone with just a little bit of savvy

      Total shit. Control remains with the member state of all assets, was there something about this you didn’t understand?

      Military capacities developed within PESCO remain in the hands of Member States that can also make them available in other contexts such as NATO or the UN.

      remain in the hands of Member States

    343. Bill not Ben says:

      Scotland has control over our soldiers, i suppose there where no scottish soldiers on the streets of Northern Ireland, next we will be told that the ASH was not in Aden all those years ago.
      Its a funny old world when your told you have charge of your own army, yes i suppose you do until a higher unelected authority tells your soldiers to take care of that terrible situation in the likes of poland and hungary, and what will that terrible situation be, well it could be people on the streets of poland and hungary refusing to take in illegal immigrants as demanded by the Zsars in brussels, and if anybody thinks anyone is going to tell Poland and Hungary what to do, then all i can say is, wait and see the fallout and the breakup of the EU, its not a common market anymore, its not a democracy to any sensible and intelligent persons way of thinking.
      It has to change or it will break up, i have been a businessman most of my life, but i have never had anyone tell me that they would not trade with me if i did not give them control of my business, i will predict that Poland and Hungary will leave the so called european union in time as it does not seem able to accommodate democratic freedoms, i would love every country to trade with each other and that includes scotland, but there is not going to be any deals with us from europe, imagine scotland in a political union with europe, they tell us how to fish and how often, wonder what they would do when they seen all those lovely oil wells in the north sea, will we be able to keep and use all that oil for ourselves and for the good of others as we see fit, westminster did’nt, they took the lot for the good of the union, and a fat lot of good it done poor wee scotland

    344. yesindyref2 says:

      @Bill not Ben
      Are you on weed?

    345. Bill not Ben says:

      The scottish parliament voted with a big no to the gulf wars, i remember the votes well, but scotland was still dragged into it.
      It seems that scottish born soldiers did not have a choice to go to war or not, and scottish mothers and fathers waited for their dead sons and daughters to be brought home from a war that their parliament voted against, if that does not make you bloody angry then nothing will, what’s down om paper has nothing to do with reality in the european union or the westminster form of union, devolved powers is a classic case of a power grab by westminster when we leave europe, don’t take my word for it, ask Nicola

    346. Bill not Ben says:

      Are you the only opinion allowed here, if so we can all leave you to it, then you can bore the arse off yourself with your ill mannered comments

    347. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      I find it interesting, that people come on to this pro-indy web site, and after intially spouting out some pro-indy stuff, then start to offer guff, with no backup.

      No, our heads do not have zips up the back.

    348. Bill not Ben says:

      I allways find that doing your own research and cross/checking is very rewarding, anyone that is to lazy to do their own is not worth the bother i allways find

    349. K1 says:

      Crack cocaine mair like

    350. Bill not Ben says:

      Mr junker said there will not be a european army, and Mrs May said London is not the capital of england, and Mickey Mouse said, its a lie, i do all my own stunts lol

    351. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Dearie me…

      Restating dross does not make it true.

    Comment - please read this page for comment rules. HTML tags like <i> and <b> are permitted. Use paragraph breaks in long comments. DO NOT SIGN YOUR COMMENTS, either with a name or a slogan. If your comment does not appear immediately, DO NOT REPOST IT. Ignore these rules and I WILL KILL YOU WITH HAMMERS.

    ↑ Top