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The past is another country

Posted on March 06, 2016 by

This week Scottish Labour have been attacking the SNP’s rather timid plans for the reform of Council Tax, which is an entirely fair and legitimate opposition pursuit.


But as is their wont, Kezia Dugdale’s branch office just can’t help overplaying their hand and doing it in a highly dishonest way.

All of the damning quotes Labour have assembled come from the 2003 and 2007 election campaigns. In 2003 the SNP lost the election – the resulting Labour-led government at Holyrood doing absolutely nothing about the tax – and in 2007 they won only a minority administration, which attempted to completely abolish Council Tax in favour of a local income tax but was defeated by the combined opposition of Labour and the Conservatives and eventually officially gave up on the plan in 2009.

(Though oddly, as recently as two years ago Scottish Labour’s then local-government spokeswoman Sarah Boyack was still talking about “The SNP’s plans to introduce their hated local income tax” as a current issue.)

In 2011 the SNP did NOT campaign on a policy of scrapping the tax in the coming parliament. Instead, they acknowledged the difficulty of coming up with a workable alternative and said that:

“We will consult with others to produce a fairer system based on ability to pay to replace the Council Tax and put this to the people at the next election.”

(Our emphasis.) The Nats, therefore, have NOT actually broken any promises. All manifestos implicitly assume a working majority, or all bets are off. After 2003 they weren’t in power, after 2007 they did their best but simply didn’t have enough MSPs to defeat combined Unionist opposition, and after 2011 – when they finally DID have a majority – they kept their commitment to consult on a fairer system.

The reason a brand-new one isn’t going to be offered this year is that Council Tax is a difficult and thorny problem to solve, and even the cross-party Commission On Local Tax Reform that was duly instigated by the Scottish Government wasn’t able to come up with a solution, throwing its hands in the air and saying that the Council Tax was bad but that they could “not advocate any single alternative to the present system”.

They passed the buck straight back to the political parties instead, saying:

“Our work is intended to inform new policies on local taxation which will be put to the electorate in the Scottish Parliamentary election in May 2016, recognising that political parties will attach different weights to the considerations for different options.”

So far the parties have bodyswerved the responsibility.

The SNP have fiddled round the edges, producing some slightly-progressive tweaks that nobody (except the Scottish Daily Mail) actually objects to in themselves but which by common consensus – including that of this site – are rather feeble and will produce a financial drop in a bucket.

Scottish Labour, which has been flapping around promising an alternative for nearly a decade, still has nothing to show for an endless parade of policy forums and debates on the subject. In October 2010 the party claimed to be “finalising” its proposals:


But just a few short months later it had given up on the idea completely:


Almost five years further on from that throwing-in of the towel, Scottish voters still wait in vain to hear of Labour’s plans for local government finance, although the last known position is that it still favours a property-based tax.

(The Scottish Conservatives and Liberal Democrats, to the best of our knowledge, also currently have no proposals for a Council Tax replacement, with both stalling frantically for time until they have to publish their manifestos in a few weeks. The Greens advocate a Land Value Tax, an attractive idea with some major unaddressed flaws, but have of course no chance of forming a government.)

But with Scottish Labour going back as far as 2003 for incriminating quotes on the subject, we unavoidably found ourselves delving through some of their own history, especially that of leader Kezia Dugdale. And some of it was rather interesting.


The News Of The World story above has been all but obliterated from history. You can Google all day long for any sort of reference to it, but the only place it seems to exist is in the archives of the National Library of Scotland. We’d be amazed if no other newspaper had picked it up at the time, but if they did they’ve all been wiped.

We can think of no justification for the censorship. No court case was involved and Dugdale defended her remarks rather than claiming to have been misquoted or taken out of context. The act of wiping them from the record is much more noteworthy than the comments themselves, which are offensive and stupid but not illegal.

But perhaps more fascinating is that while Dugdale deleted the post in question, all of the other articles from her old “Soapbox” blog (now vanished from public view) appear to have been imported across into her current website and can still be read there today, so we can only therefore logically assume that they still represent the opinions of the Scottish Labour leader.

That being the case, we thought we should have a look at some of them.




“I’m beginning to think, if I’m honest, maybe I look a bit funny at churchgoers and people of faith?”

That’s quite a lot of people to be looking “a bit funny” at.




“I believe women should have equal access to safe, legal, free abortion and that these rights should be defended and extended. All of that is in jeopardy if abortion is devolved.”

Another airing for a line Labour are fond of, namely “only civilised England can save us primitive, ignorant Scots from frothing anti-abortionists” – despite the fact that the Scottish Government is committed to no change in the law whereas some current UK government ministers favour cutting the time limit in half.




“Despite the circumstances in which John McTernan’s comments came into the public domain – clearly a breach of the Freedom of Information Act – I think what he said was absolutely right.”

(McTernan had described Scotland as “narrow, Presbyterian and racist”.)

“As a nation we do carry characteristics of deeply ingrained intolerance and prejudice and until we accept that, we have no chance of fighting it.”

Dugdale then complained that:

“I got a fair bit of stick from colleagues, fellow bloggers and some journalists in the Parliament for supporting the idea that Scottish people as a nation can be narrow minded and racist.”

…before citing as evidence a handful of user comments on the National Conversation website, none of which were in any way racist (although they were hostile to the Union Jack, Westminster and the Daily Record).

The only reasonable conclusion that can be drawn from the article is that Dugdale believes that Scotland is an inherently racist and bigoted country. In the light of that, the fact that she let Ian Smart back into her party suddenly makes a lot more sense.




“I don’t expect much from the SNP. Alex Salmond will try every trick in the book to get elected to the Scottish Parliament – and still keep his seat in Westminster! Standing for both a constituency and a list seat this May doesn’t even register in his party’s mindset as being inappropriate.”

I believe that on balance, proportional representation for local government is a good thing and I accept that the House of Lords is desperately in need of reform. But above all these opinions, I think that the electorate must be able to hold their elected representatives to account.

Mike Pringle has a majority of 158. He is I think, the third most marginal MSP in Scotland. Aware of his vulnerability, Mike has put his name forward for the Liberal Democrat Lothian’s List which means it’s nearly impossible to get rid of him at the next election.”

Should Donald Anderson win Edinburgh South, and I really hope he does, the Liberal Democrats will likely take the list seat which they only narrowly missed out on in 2003 and it will be Mike Pringles bum on it. How unfair is that?

No wonder voters are turning off politics when they see politicians carve up a job for life.”

Kezia Dugdale is standing for a constituency seat in May’s election, which she’s very unlikely to win. However, she’s also taking the top spot on the Labour list for Lothians, meaning she’s guaranteed a seat even if massively rejected by voters.

We must assume that for some unspecified reason she no longer considers the fact that Lothians voters have no way of getting rid of her or preventing her having a job for life to be “unfair” or an insult to democratic justice and accountability.




“The issue of flag waving has bothered me for sometime now. I’m worried that I became more conscious of all the saltires flying on the Royal Mile simply because the SNP won the election. Were they there before the election or did they all just sneak out and hang them up as part of a victory celebration?

I love the Saltire, and I’m deeply proud of my Scottish heritage but I’m also as British as the[y] come and I’m increasingly paranoid that the SNP are politicising my national flag as a symbol of their plight [sic] for independence.”

(Is it just us or is saying “I’m deeply proud of my Scottish heritage” rather than just saying “I’m Scottish” a bit weird there? And if you’re “as British as they come”, is the Saltire your “national flag” anyway?)




“My personal preference for a referendum question would be something like:

‘Should Scotland remain part of the United Kingdom with all the incredible benefits, security and economic prosperity that brings.’

Now that’s not a fair question because it’s so loaded. But what’s to stop the pro union parties all agreeing this frame of words and voting it through?”

Why do we suddenly find ourselves thinking of Alan Cochrane?




“Am I about to defend the indefensible and say Gordon’s done the right thing by abolishing the 10p tax rate? Yes.”

The unfailing popular touch.




“If Labour turns out to be the largest party but the combined seats of the SNP and the Liberal Democrats are enough to form a coalition…. would Labour have the moral authority to form a government?

For what it’s worth, my answer is no. If two parties form a coalition with more MSPs than the party with the single largest number of MSPs, then the views of a larger number of people will be represented in Government and I think that’s absolutely right.”

That’s quite an interesting contrast with the position Dugdale (as deputy leader) and all of her Scottish Labour colleages were stridently insisting on last year, of course.




“Capturing the votes of centre left, disgruntled and disappointed Labour voters gave the SNP a one seat mandate to produce this list of ‘achievements’:

1) Tax Cut
2) Tax Cut
3) Tax Cut
4) Populist move against medical opinion
5) Tax Cut
6) Tax Cut
7) Cuts, Cuts, Cuts.”

Readers might well be forgiven for forming the view that Dugdale was firmly against tax cuts, then. Except that on the blog she also stoutly praised Labour’s cutting of income tax from 23% to 20% and the reduction of VAT by 2.5%.

Then again, she savaged SNP plans to cut Corporation Tax from 28%, but while doing so neglected to point out that Gordon Brown had by that point already cut it THREE times – from 33% to 31%, then to 30% and finally from 30% to 28% – and wanted to cut it again as soon as possible.

By 2014, Dugdale was still furiously opposed to cuts to Corporation Tax, so long as they were made by the SNP rather than by Labour. So in summary, the current Scottish Labour leader’s position on tax is:

Reducing income tax (until about a month ago)
Reducing VAT

Ending prescription charges
Ending bridge tolls
Ending graduate endowment fees
Freezing council tax for a decade
Reducing corporation tax (unless Labour do it)
Reducing small business rates

We hope that’s all clear.




“The Scotsman is fast becoming the Daily Prophet, reporting stories from the Ministry of Magic headlines. It’s just as well that of all the Dark Arts masters, Alex Salmond is most like Guilderoy Lockhart – all talk and no potions. I just hope the spell wears off the Scottish Press soon.”


“A very senior SNP Cabinet Minister was kicked out of a Glasgow East shopping centre yesterday afternoon for causing a nuisance. Can you guess which one? What’s the more, BBC Scotland were there, filmed it – but wont use the footage! Who says there isn’t a bias?”

Those damn paranoid nats, eh?




“Yes, it’s expensive, and yes it has its critics, but it is absolutely critical to the future of Edinburgh in terms of linking up communities, getting people out of their cars and building the tens of thousands of homes that Edinburgh needs to keep its young and vibrant population in the city.”

We’re sure it’ll be lovely when it’s finished.




27 August 2008:

“It’s the man’s first day in the job – demonstrate a little courtesy and respect for goodness sake.”

17 September 2008:

“Watching Lib Dem conference hasn’t exactly been high on my priority list this week, but I did manage to catch Tavish the Tory unveil his plans for a 2p reduction in income tax.

I just wonder if the Lib Dem’s 33rd most influential figure has been buttoned holed by the 1st and told that with the Lib Dem votecrumbling, he’s just going to have to suck up a little right wing populist policy here and there?”

A whole three weeks from “demonstrate a little courtesy and respect” to “Tavish the Tory” and sneering about his poll ratings. (And oh look – cutting income tax, which was good when Gordon Brown did it, is back to being a “Tory” policy again.)

A year earlier, Dugdale had said “We might not like it, but ‘Negative campaigning’ enhances a healthy debate.” So that’s fair enough. But readers might reasonably feel that subsequently whining about the SNP being “Scotland’s Nasty Party” because they were mildly snarky to Tavish Scott was somewhat hypocritical.




“I don’t pretend to know enough about the issue to form a definitive opinion on the topic but in a straw poll tomorrow I’d vote against a replacement. That doesn’t for a second mean that I agree with the SNP.”

Um, it kinda does mean exactly that, Kez.

“When it comes to Trident, all those who are against replacing it should be uniting together to educate the rest of parliament and the people it serves, so that we can get a UK parliament committed to the demise of nuclear weapons not just in our own homeland, but in Europe and across the rest of the World.”

To the best of our knowledge Kezia Dugdale now backs Trident renewal, which is official Labour policy, in so far as anyone on the face of the Earth has any idea what official Labour policy on Trident is.




“The best way to tax aviation is through the powers available to our friends in the European Parliament. A Scottish tax on aviation now might, just might, set an example to the rest of Europe but it’s huge risk to both business and social mobility with little promise of return.”

Scottish Labour now opposes the abolition of APD (in the apparent belief that retaining it will magically generate extra money which can be spent four or five times over).




“Yes – the council tax system could be fairer. We need more bands at both the top and bottom ends of the scale, and we need to review council tax benefits to ensure that those that need the support receive it.

But let’s not forget that the Council Tax system offers potential levers of social and cultural change like Council Tax discounts for energy efficiency. Rewards for paying up and on time. A method of communicating and promoting council services. Enhanced local democracy and accountability for local authority spending.”


And hey presto, we’re right back where we came in. Nine years ago Kezia Dugdale was telling the SNP to “go back to the drawing board” over local government funding, yet in all that time her party has failed to come up with a single alternative proposal.

More kind-hearted readers might feel it’s a bit cruel dragging up these old comments from the Scottish branch manager, but nothing in this article is anywhere near as old as the 2003 and 2004 comments Dugdale is currently using to bash the SNP.

(The Nats at least acknowledge when events like the 2008 crash change the financial and political picture and require a shift in policy, but Labour keep banging away on the same old out-of-date drum long after it ceases to make any meaningful sound.)

Trawling through Dugdale’s blog – and remember, she’s chosen to have all these old posts transferred to her current website – uncovers not only a plethora of abrupt policy U-turns but quite a lot of rather unsightly material (as well as some comically wonky predictions, which we might cover in a separate post).

None of it, obviously, can be dismissed as having been misquoted or taken out of context by the press – it’s all in her own unedited (and un-spellchecked) words. But readers shouldn’t expect to see her taken to task for it in the way that Nationalists are for ancient injudicious remarks, because that’s not how journalism in Scotland works.

The almost Stalinist total disappearance from public record of the Catholic Church story is the real eye-opener, though. In 2008 Labour was able to say “Kezia does not speak on behalf of the party”. That escape clause no longer exists.

Dugdale is of course perfectly entitled to hold that opinion of the church leadership. So we wonder if we can expect anyone to ask her between now and the election whether her views on the matter have changed, as they apparently have on so many other subjects. We’re sure quite a lot of voters would be interested to know.

As ever, we don’t advise holding your breath for the answer.

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    2 Trackbacks/Pingbacks

    1. 06 03 16 22:30

      Why do that? – Mewsing Out Loud

    2. 20 02 17 07:29

      Labours Council Tax Doublethink | An Independent Scotsman

    373 to “The past is another country”

    1. heedtracker says:

      What a catastrophic load of unelectedable SLab rubbish. That “only civilised England can save us” is over the gates to Pacific Quay, in 24 carrot gold.

    2. Bruce L says:

      Good work Rev.

      Bit of a typo on the last line there. Solidarity with Kez? 😉

    3. Anonymous says:

      To be fair here and to play devils advocate, would the catholic church story’s dissappearance have anything to do with it being from the news of the world? A now defunct and last I heard crooked newspaper? Or were other news of the world articles easy to find? Genuine question here because that is the first thing that came to my mind and as such may be the first thing to come to our detractors’ minds too.

    4. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Bit of a typo on the last line there.”


    5. carjamtic says:

      A brilliant read,how many voters has the Red Tory leader insulted ?

      N.B. 5 out of 3 Red Tories have trouble with fractions. 🙂

      #Total Wipeout

    6. Brian Powell says:

      Wings has become the new Hansard. William Cobbett, tired of MPs saying they didn’t make a particular statement in Parliament, put together a register of who said what. MPs then couldn’t deny embarrassing comments and speeches they’d made.

      His records developed into the official Hansard records.

      MSPs, newspapers, and collusion between politicians and newspapers, created the same need for recording and reminding, and now analysis, of what they deny, hope we will forget and just plain lie about.

    7. Proud Cybernat says:

      While we’re on typos:

      “… Dugdale is currently using the bash the SNP.”

      “… Dugdale is currently using to bash the SNP.”

    8. heedtracker says:

      Wonder who’s next for SLab leader brilliance May 6? Loads of online hard core unionists and my tip is for this UKOK non red tory delight.

      Howsabout that then guys and girls.

    9. Proud Cybernat says:

      Meant to add – great article, Rev. And it doesn’t matter if these revelations by the SLAB branch manager go totally unreported in the Colonial Media. Through this site, half of Scotland knows all about it.

      Ta ta, Kez.

    10. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      ““… Dugdale is currently using the bash the SNP.””


    11. Andy Borland says:

      “I don’t pretend to know enough about the issue ….”

      From her own mouth, the best summation of Kezia’s ‘talents’.

      Intellectually weak and without a political compass.

    12. Simon Curran says:

      Superb stuff, everyone’s allowed to change their minds but it’s customary to admit it and explain why rather than just be in denial about it. If Kezia is the best SLAB have got then they really haven’t got much of a future. Only shame it’s Wing and not mainstream media highlighting Kezs `inconsistencies`

    13. Clootie says:

      ….I didn’t see anything wrong with the last line ?

    14. Iain More says:

      Ah the Cooncil Tax again, the barsteward child of the Poll Tax. I think we need the English to riot on the streets of London to get any kind of reform of local taxation. I being a cynic will suggest that any reforms we do get will be neither fair or progressive.

      I remember the squeals of the Brit Nat Press and Medja when the SNP proposed a Local Income Tax. Well they couldn’t get that one through because they didn’t have the Holyrood arithmetic to get it passed. I believe it was once even a Fib Doom Policy as well but that was before they became part of the SNP Bad Brit Nat cabal.

      I don’t even know if LIT would have even been workable but you just know that whatever the SNP comes up with even if it happened to be another Parties Policy that we will get the usual squealing from the Brit Nats whether they agree with the policy or not.

    15. Dr Jim says:

      Does this mean she can’t even trust her own “Mind” when her mouth opens to speak

      Is that not a medical thing then

      “Leadership Challenge” I nominate Neil Finlay
      At least we’ll get some firework laughs
      or Jackie Baillie or, Och any of them is worth a giggle

    16. ScottishPsyche says:

      Isn’t it illuminating that all this was done at the time she was working as a press agent or similar for Slab? This shows how unaware they were even then of the lasting impact social media can have.

      It is the crass naivety and gossipy nature which astonishes the reader. Did she really think it was appropriate to publish that stuff?

      O/T slightly. McColm bemoaning the good old days when MSM journalists all went for pints with the MSPs of every colour and no doubt got all their stories. Now that Scottish politics is serious and for grown ups and not the cosy wee branch office chat that it used to be under Slab, he feels left out and even more irrelevant.

    17. Thepnr says:

      It must be embarrassing for Kezia Dugdale blogs from yonks ago being brought up by Wings.

      People can and do change their mind all the time, especially as they mature. I think Kezia leans which ever way the wind blows. As far I believe she did try the SNP and for whatever reason joined the Labour party and Foulkes became her mentor.

      I think anybody would struggle in that scenario.

      Now though she is a big grown up women and leader of the second largest party in Scotland she really needed to up her act, she has failed to do so and I see her going the same way as Murphy after May.

      We’ve had SNP BAD for the last 9 years, it has failed spectacularly, only serving to increase SNP support, so too have every Labour in Scotland leader since SNP first formed a minority government.

      No real surprise, but will they ever learn? Not for the foreseeable future I believe. I voted Labour my entire life until 2012 council elections. I didn’t vote as I had no one to vote for. Labour went awry and are continuing in that course.

      Hell mend them.

    18. jimnarlene says:

      I can hear a very loud face palm, coming from SLab HQ.

    19. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Or were other news of the world articles easy to find?”

      Yes, they still show up on sites like Highbeam even though the paper’s dead. This one, however, has vanished. And it’s all but inconceivable that nobody else picked it up anyway.

    20. Legerwood says:

      Re: Ms Dugdale deleting past blogs etc. If reports in the Daily Telegraph (on-line edition) are to be believed then Ms Dugdale is not the only labour leader culling her past output. Mr Corbyn also seems to be having a spring clean of anything he has written about the EU.

      As regards the Council Tax, was retaining the Council Tax freeze not Labour’s policy in its manifesto for the 2011 election as well as the SNP’s policy? I noticed Mr McWhirter today used a similar tactic when talking about the SNP not delivering on its manifesto promise to introduce local Income Tax by omitting to mention it was in their 2007 manifesto and, while they won the election, they did not form a majority Government.

      I think overall the changes to Council Tax announced last week were sensible. In this area incremental change is better than a wholesale re-valuation of property and bands that would cause uproar given that the last valuation was 20 years or so ago.

      It also gives time for the new tax arrangements and fiscal framework to bed in. This will involve the setting up of new bodies to help with the collection of the tax and once they are up and running then it would become easier to widen their scope and then introduce a local income tax in place of the Council Tax. Giving the local councils some of the income tax revenue, which was part of the SNP’s announcement last week, may be the first move in the direction of a local income tax.

      I personally prefer the Local Income Tax approach because any tax based on property values has a large subjective element in it and also, if no regular re-valuation takes place, a situation where it becomes divorced from reality as has happened in Scotland now and happened in England with the rates in the 1980s. As with Scotland today there had not been a re-valuation for almost 20 years in England whereas in Scotland the valuations took place every 5 years.

    21. Stoker says:

      THIS is what WOS is all about, smashing the lying Hunionist lies and hypocrisy right out of the park. And it’s the very reason i’ll never stop promoting WOS at every opportunity. Thanks,Rev!

      Wish there was a WOS equivalent focused solely on all things BBC.

    22. Bob Mack says:

      Clearly Kezia has has more faces than a Rubik cube. Mind you,so has Labour.

    23. G H Graham says:

      Now that is a superb demolition of a political amateur & an intellectual lightweight.

      Meanwhile, how stupid must one be to repost their own damning evidence unless one assumed, correctly of course, that the useless Scottish mainstream media wouldn’t care?

      I’d wager that she’s so inept, that she won’t even wince when she learns that once again, she & her Party have been rationally & perspicaciously pulverised.

      Nevertheless, while I’d never vote Labour even if my life depended on it, Scotland deserves much better than this puerile pretence of an opposition Party.

    24. muttley79 says:

      My impression of Kezia Dugdale is that she is essentially an opportunistic British nationalist, who has no deep or meaningful political convictions or principles at all. This is to the extent that had the SNP been as dominant 10 years ago as they are now, Dugdale would be supporting independence, and we would all be spared the Proud Scot but routine from her that we are being treated too. I genuinely think Kezia Dugdale is a pretty shameless individual, not at the level of Donald Trump yet though. The prototype head in whch ever way the wind is blowing politician.

      I see Iain Macwhirter said in today’s Sunday Herald that Dugdale is the best Scottish Labour leader since Donald Dewar. WTF is he talking about? Is he being serious or is he trying to be nice, because that is an enormous amount of bullshit?

    25. I understand that Dugdale applied for job with the SNP or an SNP elected member before she got a job with George Foulkes. Can anybody confirm this?

    26. @muttley79
      “I see Iain Macwhirter said in today’s Sunday Herald that Dugdale is the best Scottish Labour leader since Donald Dewar. WTF is he talking about? ”



      In my mind’s eye I see that progression more as a depiction of Primate evolution in reverse – Descent of Man.

    27. Iain More at 3.35

      The SNP gave up on LIT because the Council Tax was tied up with grant money from Westminster (which all of UK gets) and the UK government confirmed the SNP government wouldn’t get the top up if it cancelled the Council Tax in favour of something else

    28. Chic McGregor says:

      PS forgot wee Wendy. Bit of self censorship there, she had a bit of talent.

    29. Chic McGregor says:

      PPS Forgot Anas Sarwar (place holder), nah, that’s about right.

    30. Stoker says:

      muttley79 wrote:
      “I see Iain Macwhirter said in today’s Sunday Herald that Dugdale is the best Scottish Labour leader since Donald Dewar. WTF is he talking about? Is he being serious or is he trying to be nice,”

      Dippy Dug is a better cleaner, Dewar left the office in a mess.
      Mind you, she can’t control the staff, especially the men, i’m losing count of the recent embarrassing public displays of male Slaberite tantrums on display for all to see.

      Tip for Dippy Dug – If you can’t control the talentless losers within your own office don’t even think about taking on Nicola, it will only end in misery with a branch office fire sale.

      SNP x 2

    31. Capella says:

      Perhaps Kezia has exercised her “right to be forgotten” by Google as per EU legislation.
      I, for one, will happily oblige.

    32. Alan Mackintosh says:

      OT, sort of. I see more Slab money problems have turned up.
      “Scottish Labour general secretary Brian Roy and father, ex-MP Frank Roy, in party cash row”

    33. Bob Mack says:

      She better not take on Philip Tataglia Archbishop of Glasgow. I went to school with him. Mind like a razor coupled to a brilliant intellect .
      Really nice guy,and though we have differences on theology ,I would be hesitant to take him on in open debate.

    34. Chic McGregor says:

      Thing about LIT is that it may be executed in a progressive fashion in local terms but it is not progressive in terms of regional needs.

      i.e. ‘Rich’ council areas with lots of high earners, which should not need a lot of social provision, will get lots of LIT revenue but ‘Poor’ council areas with mainly low earners, where social provision need is intrinsically higher, would have less.

      Unless there was was some centralising redistribution system involved.

      Mind you, same applies to high end property tax hikes as well.

    35. ScottishPsyche says:

      @Dave McEwan Hill

      I can’t confirm but my understanding is she was at a loss career wise after her Masters at Edinburgh and as a stop gap went out campaigning (for Labour?) with a flat mate. She was told she had a knack for it and decided to pursue politics as a career.

      She was told there were jobs at Holyrood and possibly went after more than one there. She also said she had never voted until she was 23!

      I agree with others she seems completely and utterly motivated by her own career and is totally devoid of any integrity. I have never understood the love the Scottish Press have for her and Jenny Marra. They both seem vacuous and self serving. The idea that they are the great hope of Slab is risible.

      Didn’t she also say she wanted to go and write a book in 5 years time and give up politics altogether? If I were advising her, in all honesty, I would tell her to go full time into campaigning for single issues like MND where I think she could make a difference. Her politics is muddled to say the least.

    36. R-type Grunt says:

      Very possibly the best assasination I have ever read. And all from her own mouth. Vive la Internet!

    37. Jim Mitchell says:

      And yet knowing all this Labour still have her as their leader, that says even more about them as a party!

    38. liz says:

      As usual lots of folk are not that well informed.

      I met with my daughter today and she said everyone in her work was up in arms about the CT increase.

      They didn’t know it was for Band E and above.

      So we still have our work cut out to get the message over.

      This is, of course, because our news is not fit for purpose

    39. Vronsky says:

      A Catholic Church spokesman said: “To write that bishops of Scotland have a bigoted view of the world is deeply offensive.”

      Er – isn’t it absolutely necessary for bishops of whatever tribe to have a bigoted view of the world? Isn’t it that ‘bigoted view’ that defines the tribe? People with a rational view of the world would be bugger all use as bishops.

      I claim my £5 for finding something that Kezia Dugdale was right about.

    40. HandandShrimp says:

      Epic bit of work there Stu. Kezia relies rather a lot on hoping that the electorate have the memory span of a goldfish.

      So does Jackie Baillie come top think of it.

    41. Macart says:

      Outstanding digging Rev and if ever anyone deserved an extra bag of sweeties for having to dredge through that lot, you do.

      This current/same old tack of theirs is unbelievably insulting to the public. I mean, FFS! They can’t honestly believe that people have such short memories, or that a pledge made on a manifesto in a losing 2003 campaign, is an example of a pledge broken? The article covers all the whys and wherefores comprehensively, but dear God, why should there be a need for such an article? People shouldn’t have to constantly examine what their public bloody servants are holding up as unassailable ‘facts’.

      These are the same people who constantly bleat about the breakdown in communication, trust and respect between the public and politics. Well self evidently we have absolutely no reason to trust great swathes of our public servants on current evidence and even less reason apparently to trust their co conspirators in the media.

      As for Ms Dugdale, her politics are very simple to understand. Basically she’s for everything she is told to be for and against anything proposed by opposition parties. As for strategy? Anything goes that works, but then that’s the rough and tumble of politics eh? A defence the public are becoming all too familiar with and weary of.

      There is only one body capable of cleaning up our politics if our institutions and politicians are either unwilling or incapable of doing so… the electorate themselves.

      May = Spring cleaning.

    42. galamcennalath says:

      Excellent piece of journalism! Truth uncovered, not unsubstantiated opinion, but based on hard evidence. Watch and learn, all you Yoonist hacks out there!

      “The almost Stalinist total disappearance from public record of the Catholic Church story is the real eye-opener, though.”

      Certainly does raise questions!

      The WHY?, is obvious. But the answers to WHO? and HOW?, would be very revealing I reckon. However, like the story itself, those answers will be well hidden.

    43. Bob Mack says:


      I know what you mean,but in fact Bishops and above are not really bigots. They all have advanced Theology in their background. This allows them to reflect on events and meaning of events,and the possibilities inherent in the Scriptures. The Church itself hopes that it will channel them in a positive direction for their faith.

      However,faith can be and often is challenged by theology,and many “men of God” though openly professing firm belief in their Deity ,will acknowledge the fallibility of man in creating Canon law.

      The current Pope is an example of someone digressing ( albeit slightly) from established belief.

    44. Stoker says:

      Macart wrote:
      “There is only one body capable of cleaning up our politics if our institutions and politicians are either unwilling or incapable of doing so… the electorate themselves. May = Spring cleaning.”

      There is simply no better way of putting it, well said!
      liz wrote:
      “..we still have our work cut out to get the message over.”

      Ain’t that the truth. We can’t afford to be caught napping.
      Take nothing for granted and grab every vote possible!
      Spread the word (and articles such as this one) far and wide.

      SNP x 2

    45. Giving Goose says:

      I get the impression that Dugdale is very like a new convert to a religion, where the new convert is over zealous in adhering to the religion’s doctrines and beliefs.

      Some of the worst religious extremists are new converts to the particular belief system that they have newly embraced.

      But there is also another explanation for her erratic verbal excreta and that is the Classic Scottish Cringe.

      The worst of the KOK-Heads are delirious in their support for all things British, whether it’s the Royals, the Royal Navy, the Union Jack, London Rule, the Dam Busters theme, SNPBadness or Spitfires. It’s like an inferiority complex turned manic. Their addiction to KOK-Kac is like looking at a drugged up, dependent junkie, smacked out of their tree. All common sense has gone but the dependency remains.

      Kezia shows traits attributable to all of the above.

      Basically she is a Cringing Dependent Tame Junky Jock.

      A KOK-Head if there ever was one.

    46. Iain More says:

      Dave McEwan Hill says:
      6 March, 2016 at 4:39 pm

      Iain More at 3.35

      “The SNP gave up on LIT because the Council Tax was tied up with grant money from Westminster (which all of UK gets) and the UK government confirmed the SNP government wouldn’t get the top up if it cancelled the Council Tax in favour of something else.”

      That I didn’t know Dave. I just assumed that the SNP wouldn’t get the votes at Holyrood at that time to conduct such a reform anyway. I also guess the then Red Tory Govt in London would have baulked at the thought of having a progressive LIT for English Cooncils as well.

    47. Sinky says:

      Great analysis of BBC Scotland’s coverage of SNP Council Tax proposals by GA Ponsonby.

    48. liz says:

      @Ian More – Proud Scot Darling:

      ”Chancellor Alistair Darling has also said Scotland would lose out on £400m in council tax benefit if the charge was scrapped, but the Scottish Government has insisted the cash is “part and parcel” of the country’s funding package.”

    49. Dr Jim says:

      Without realising it Kezia’s right about the Religion thing being Bigoted though

      That’s what it’s based on (My God’s better than yours) otherwise it would never have worked for as long as it did,
      and still is among lots of people, I’m a sun worshiper myself, cannae get enough of it

      School history is going to be hilarious in a hundred years
      (If they tell the truth)

    50. Effijy says:

      Dipity Dug has just been Kezumped by the Rev for the 100th time.

      What a nightmare for Labour that Wings retains their comments,
      And uses them against them as they U Turned, Denied, and Lied about
      their past and present failures.

    51. Az says:

      Absolute belter of an article Stu!

      While trying to think of an articulate and erudite comment, I remembered the word ‘dipshit’ and I stick with that or it plural version to describe Dug and Labour. Kind of embarrassed for them actually.

    52. a says:

      Iain More, Dave, Liz has reminded me. It was nagging at me but I just couldnt retrieve it. I am pretty sure that council tax benefit comes straight from WM. If there was a change to CT such as changing to LVT or LIT the CT benefit sum would no longer come from WM, but would have to be an extra sum found by the ScotGov from the new tax system. Just another example of the strings attached to make any positive changes too costly to implement.

    53. fairliered says:

      I didn’t realise quite how two faced Kezia really was.
      That’s why the siye is invaluable.
      Any chance of a similar type of investigation of Jackie Baillie’s past utterances?

    54. Donnie McNeish says:

      kez’s had a makeover for the election, what she really needs however is a brain transplant.

      Let’s be blunt, kez has no credibility or deeply held political beliefs that appeal to anyone.

      That kez was elected almost unanimously says all you need to know about the labour party in Scotland, the labour party is finished and kez will be the one who throws the final handful of earth in to the hole.

      What amazes me is she will go down lying to the people, but hey ho that’s labour for you!

    55. muttley79 says:


      I am pretty sure I read something a while ago on Kezia Dugdale in the MSM, I think it was an interview. It strongly inferred that she went into politics because she could not get a job after graduating. It really did sound as if there no real interest in politics there, or at least any genuine passion to help others. I am afraid to say it sounds like Dugdale would say anything to get elected. I just do not get the impression she would fight for anyone but herself. I know that sounds harsh, but that is the way she comes across to me.

      @Giving Goose

      I think that many Brit nats who are Scottish suffer from the cringe imo. I suspect their allegiance to the British state is a way of making them feel more important, more confident than they believe they would feel if they were solely defined as Scottish. Having saw them in action as it were, I think they perceive Scotland to be small and insignificant. I would doubt they would be willing to admit it though. It may well be a ego thing as well.

    56. Hoss Mackintosh says:

      Brilliant piece of investigation – Rev Stu.

      You wouldn’t happened to have saved all these musings from Kez into the WOS archives by any chance?

      You never know when they might come in handy.

      Somehow I think they will not be on the Labour site for much longer. 🙂

    57. Tam Jardine says:

      Great article- you are spoiling us by releasing all that in one go! Imagine if Nicola Sturgeon had written blogs a few years ago completely at odds with her present day position: the press would be all over it. Can’t imagine them taking much interest in these revelations.

      OT- anyone know what the script is with the ‘SNP cutting funding for poor students’ story that has cropped up in the telegraph, times and scotsman in the last few days. I’m getting grilled on it and would be useful to get an insight from someone in the know
      PS- you know me well enough to know that isnae concern trolling!

    58. Jim McElhill says:

      Absolutely brilliant article Stu. This should be compulsory reading for SNP MP’s, MSP’s and SNP campaign teams throughout the country. I will certainly be sharing it.

      Some of Dugdale’s comments might have been made in the past, but our past has created our present therefore is relevant, just as our present will shape our future.

      Its also worth mentioning that Labour termed the SNP “Tartan Tories” for decades, until relatively recently, for not supporting their anti-Scottish legislation in 1979.

      Fair’s fair.

    59. JLT says:


      Fantastically well written, Stuart. Absolutely brilliant article, not only highlighting Kezia’s usual ‘mouth-before-brain’ comments, but rather more deeply, it showcases the political and social beliefs of the Scottish Labour Party to boot!

      Kezia follows the Party line rigidly (I will give her that much. She is loyal to her cause …though what that …well, that is anyone’s guess?!?), but it’s high time that Scottish Labour stopped hiding behind their screeches of fury that are directed at the SNP (and any Scottish supporter of independence), and instead …actually come up with their own manifesto!

      I mean …what is it that Scottish Labour are waiting for? Are they waiting on someone like Baillie to come up with an epiphany of where the Party is meant to be going. Is Gray going to shock the Party activists one morning by stating what SLAB’s position is on a ‘couple’ of policies? ( I say a couple because too many ‘ideas’ would leave them shell-shocked and burnt out).

      I have said it before, and I will say it again …the only future that Scottish Labour have as a credible political force, can only come through Scottish Independence. Freed from the shackles of Westminster, the Party may possibly rise from the ashes phoenix-like, and find itself anew within a brand new political world.

      Or… they can remain tied to the Westminster system, and die the most ignoble and slowest of deaths …a distant memory of what Keir Hardie and the Labour Party once set out to do, and that was deliver social justice to the greater general public; not snarl in fury at other Parties who have now taken up that most noble of causes.

    60. Caroline Corfield says:


      Just saw this is trying to get off the ground –

      Apologies for any problems with the link, no idea why the ? is forcing a new line breaking up the address.

      Anyway, they cheppies wot did Newsline Scotland trying to get an Internet radio show going.

    61. CameronB Brodie says:

      If you’re “as British as they come”, one would assume you wholeheartedly accept the political and economic control of Scotland, from outwith it’s borders (i.e. from London). As the demographics of Britain ensures Scotland will never lead the Union, that would suggest a willingness to subjugate one’s culture to the colonial imperative of Unionism. To favour Britain, which is dominated by England, over Scotland.

      A Scottish patriot or willing neo-colonial slave?

    62. Ian Brotherhood says:

      The next Glasgow Friends of WOS gig will be in Waxy O’Connor’s on Saturday March 26th from 3-ish until closing time.

      Not just a bevvy session – Cadogan Enright will fill you in (in due course) about very special workshop he’s organising, and that’ll be the ‘business’ of the day before we have an open mike, readings, jam-session, I’m doing my Izal/comb routine, Thepnr’s bringing his spoons and Paula Rose has promised to bring her snake.

      Please come over to O/T and tell us, if you haven’t already, that you intend to come along, and even if you can’t attend, please pass word to anyone who may be interested – it’s likely to be the last WOS get-the-gither (in Glasgow at any rate) before May so let’s make it a good one.

    63. Paula Rose says:

      (@Ian Brotherhood and my fans)

    64. Connor McEwen says:

      caltonjock June 2015 did Jackie Baillie and Tank Commander Ruthie
      among others

    65. crisiscult says:

      re the news of the world story, I tweeted that to the Rev couple of days ago when I saw he was looking for confirmation it wasn’t fabricated. I found it on Nexis, the news database. It’s a subscription service. I personally couldn’t care less if she was daft enough to attach her name to something a 15 year old would write, though she was old enough to know better; however, I think it’s slightly surprising hat ‘journalists’ in Scotland aren’t that interested when they allegedly write to course mates of current SNP MPs looking for anything remotely scurrilous from their distant past.

    66. Legerwood says:

      Tam Jardine @7.31pm

      I think the cut you are referring to is supposedly a cut to the money given to Universities to fund places for students from poorer backgrounds who want to go to University either directly from school or from College after doing an HND or similar.

      Extra places have been funded by the SG each year from 2013/14 but there may be a cut to funding from 2016/17 academic year although places already created will continue to be funded.

      Universities Scotland and the Scottish Funding Council are putting out conflicting info on what exactly is happening.

    67. Provost Sludden says:

      The late Willie Ross, a “giant” in the Labour movement. Now there was a man who was narrow minded, Presbyterian and racist.

    68. Francis Mooney says:

      Truly, truly outstanding.

    69. Marcia says:

      What a good read young man.

    70. Thepnr says:

      Twenty years ago Blair changed Labour forever. No longer about ideals or principles, it was all about soundbites for the media.

      Over these twenty years every wannabe politician for the Labour party has fallen into line behind this ideal. People are sick of their crap.

      It’s the same all over, FFS they want Trump to run for Preident. Well not me, I want people with principles and ideals. I don’t ever care if I oppose those ideals I just want honesty.

      Is that too much to ask?

    71. Tam Jardine says:


      Thanks. The only info I have been able to find so far has been the unionist press. Will see how it plays out and try to get the SFC angle

    72. Bill McLean says:

      The reasons for the “cringe” are much more simple than we imagine, in my opinion. Simply, those who cannot and will not grasp a better future for our country believe that they are not good enough to do so,and they know that because their betters have been telling them so in overt and subliminal ways for hundreds of years. Like cowed dogs they accept any small expression of approval from their masters with childlike trust and joy! Poor, misguided, cowardly souls!

    73. Fred says:

      @ Provost Sludden, would that be the Willie Ross, old Basso Profundo, who built himself a bungalow on land “donated” by his local authority, which wasn’t theirs to “donate” being part of the Common Good Fund. Ayr toon cooncil mebbes?

    74. Wellreadned says:

      It isn’t really her fault; she fell in with a bad man and he ensorcelled her with tales of the Great Satan of Nationalism and it’s malign footsoldiers, the Cybernatz.

      She is merely a by-product of Foulkes being on the Toilet Duck one weekend in the heady days of Slab past.

    75. louis.b.argyll says:

      Great journalism Stuart.

      Kezia plumbs the depths of shallow.

    76. heedtracker says:

      Is that too much to ask?


      England’s a Conservative voting country, Scotland’s just an annoying region, kept in its proper place BBC led Scotch cringe and hard core bullying.

      Thatcher’s greatest achievement, New Labour know they can only get elected again by going right, pretending centrist but always right. Labour’s had it for another decade at least, probably 15 years more. That’s Gordon Brown’s greatest legacy to the tories, as well as saving this farce union.

    77. Ian Brotherhood says:

      I’m taking the liberty of pasting this from O/T, where Taranaich just posted it.

      He’s too modest to send it here himself but it’s a must-read before this day is out.

      Brilliant stuff!

    78. Big Jock says:

      So the Royal Mile in Scotland’s capital city should not have saltires? I don’t know any other country in the world where flying the home flag offends the nationals of that nation. Dugdale is terrified of the Saltire. This should be headline news. Dugdale wants to rid Scotland of Saltires. Should we take the saltires off Murrayfield, Linlithgow Palace, Glasgow City Chambers,Hampden? They were all there long before the SNP came to power.

      The truth is Kezia sees Scotland as a region of Britain or England. It’s a bit like Yorkshire or Cornwall. To her Scotland should not be viewed as a nation.

      But hasn’t this been Scot Labour’s strategy for 10 years. Scots won’t vote for them so they are chasing the Orange vote,ultra unionists and Tories. By rejecting the Saltire they appear more British and appealing to the ultra Brits.

      But why do they insist on calling themselves Scottish Labour, when being Scottish is wrong.

      Most Scots walk through Edinburgh despairing at the amount of Union flags and are relieved to see the Saltire. I can imagine her walking along the Royal Mile tutting and sneering at the site of white and blue. What a very odd individual she is.

    79. carjamtic says:


      The ‘Force’ is strong tonight,Aurora Borealis spectacular,if you can see it through the snow falling.

      Scotland really is Magnificant 😉

    80. heedtracker says: Northern lights of North Britain region.

      Also, just read Scotland has the highest PFI debt per capita not just in teamGB, but the world. Dugdale will say its worth it. for the union.

    81. heedtracker says:

      Under SLab control, North Lanarkshire council built three schools as a single PFI contract. Total costs are £729+ million. They will take until 2037 to pay back. Actual constructor costs at £150 million will be cleared 2017. Tasty.

    82. yesindyref2 says:

      Oh dear, I’m one of the few it seems who like Dugdale and think she can be good for Labour in time, if they let her survive. She’s growing into the job, but really needs to ditch her scriptwriter and do her own thing – even though this shows she does / did have some contradictory and changing views. Well, who hasn’t? Or who has?

      But the article is funny 🙂

    83. frogesque says:

      O/t yep, some nice views of the Aurora in Fife tonight. Just love Scotland!

      SNP/SNP May

    84. boris says:

      Has to be one of the best expose’ of any politician and warning to others of that ilk that the internet can be an unforgiving place for those who seek to gain popularity through the use of double speak. Well done Rev.

      Glasgow City Councillors Foolhardy Gamble with Public Finance To Be Reversed – Expect Chaos in Glasgow Throughout 2016-17

    85. Many of the buildings paid for by PFI will be needing increased sums in maintenance or even replacement before the PFI debt on them is paid off

    86. Robert Louis says:

      So, Kezia thinks there are two many Scotland flags in the most historic street in the capital city of Scotland. Typical unionist, ashamed of her own country.

      Has shw never been in other countries? Go to Sweden, and just about every house and boat has the Sweden flag proudly waving. Likewise in many other countries around the world.

      But here in Scotland, we have politicians like Kezia, who are ashamed of their own country’s flag. In any other part of the world, people like Kezia would be run out of town.

      Apparently, it is only the Scotland flag that bothers her, though. Seems that rampant union jackery is quite ok. Perhaps if Kezia loves the English union jack so much, she should b**er off to London, as the last time I was there, it seemed there were more union jacks than people. She’ll feel right at home, with all the other cringing unionist Scots.

    87. Brian McHugh says:

      What year… or decade? was it that Labour actually had a stated policy? 1970’s?

    88. scottieDog says:

      In a fresh blow to any 2nd indyref, experts say the northern lights would no longer be shown in an independent scotland

    89. Ken MacColl says:

      Well done Rev.

      We have here the additional bonus here that when you place these items on the record they can thereafter not be wiped. Your file is a masterly expose of the convoluted and confused thinking from the latest “leader of the opposition” in the Scottish Parliament. If only we could expect to find such work in the published media.

      Would it be fair to add… “and she is doing it deliberately!”

    90. DerekM says:

      And they wonder why i tore up my membership.

      A party devoid of any ideas that sold out its principles to become part of the English establishment,filled with dead heads and careerists all out to get a peerage.

      As for Kez i remember her she was hopeless then and is hopeless now and if you had asked me back then what her chances of being leader was i would have laughed in your face and told you not to be ridiculous.

      They still think they are fighting the SNP when in reality they are fighting their ex members and voters who they thought didnt matter and would always follow like sheep,so hows that working out for you Labour ?

      Your arrogance will be the end of you and the irony is it will be us ex Labour who will hammer the final nails in your political coffin.

      Great work Rev 🙂

    91. Ken500 says:

      Another 1Million voters insulted.

      A prolific poster

    92. Still Positive. says:

      Thanks Ian Brotherhood @ 10.32 for that link.

      Taranaich – wonderful tribute to your mother.

      I agree with Muttley79 further up the thread – Kezia is out for herself and is totally shallow. She has no commitment to the people of Scotland as she is beholden to the UK Labour Party.

      The electorate in Scotland have realised that the only party to have Scotland’s best interests at heart is the SNP and the colonial media have not only totally ignored it but are working against the SG. I despair at times.

      SNP x 2 and EU remain.

    93. Skip_NC says:

      That report from the News of the Screws may throw a spanner in the works.

      I’ll get back to figuring out whom to vote for next week.

    94. ArtyHetty says:


      Yes was reading about PFI last night and all the figures are available online via Scotgov. What was the cost, what is paid off and still owed, and broken down by town, city, area.

      I was checking it out because I know someone who now works at NHS Scotland in Dumfries and was insisting that the Scotgov are building the new hospital there with PFI. They are using no such thing, it is being built yes by private companies, but on a non profit basis. NPI I think it’s called.

      Anyway, I won’t go into it, this person also would not believe that the Scottish NHS is not and has never been part of the english one, insisting it will all be privatised because there’s ‘ no money to pay for it’. Yep from a no voter.

      That was all part of a discussion on a night out which ended badly unfortunately, with old friends getting very p*****d off at my ranting about independence and pulling them up for talking their own country down at every bloody opportunity. One saying they are ‘North British’, who is rabidly devoted to labour and could not bear to hear a word against, hating the SNP with a vengeance.

      With some you just have to let go and give up. It’s taken me all of a very upsetting weekend to come to that conclusion.

    95. bugsbunny says:

      As I go to my scratcher, this is what I predict for May 5th.

      Party Seats(Constituency/List/Total) Difference in brackets from 2011.

      SNP 73 6 79(+10)
      Tory 0 20 20(+ 5)
      Labour 0 18 18(-19)
      Liberal 0 3 3(- 2)
      Green 0 7 7(+ 5)
      UKIP 0 2 2( +2)
      Independent 0 0 0( -1)
      Others 0 0 0(N/C)

      Stephen Roney.

    96. Ghillie says:

      Arty Hetty @ 1.09am

      I think a fair few of us here have had similar upsetting times with folk who are now sadly former friends. It’s horrible and I’m sorry you had such an upsetting weekend.

      I was shocked by the vitriol voiced by people that I had trusted and liked so much. But I did see a side that I didn’t like at all and have either never seen them again or in some cases remained very wary.

      Interestingly, some friends who I am pretty certain are unionists have never commented on the badges I wear and don’t discuss politics in my presence, which I am actualy accepting as respect for our differences in opinion our differing allegiances. And as a desire to allow our friendship to survive.

      ‘With some you just have to let go and give up’. True. But it also sounds like you came to that conclusion with a heavy heart. Wait and see what happens. Some might come back to you and agree to disagree or even come over to believing in their own country. Any road, you are amongst friends and like-minded folk here =)

      As for Kezia, what a wee eejit!(sp?)

    97. mealer says:

      Arty Hetty 1.09,
      I have friends and acquaintances from across the political spectrum.An awful lot more of them support independence than ever before.Try not to lose friends over it.Let the unionists be the ones to do the ranting.We don’t need to rant about independence because we know it’s coming anyway.
      Be the one with enough confidence in your beliefs to offer the olive branch.

      Sometimes is best just to drop in a one liner such as “I don’t want to be ruled by a bunch of Old Etonians” then change the subject away from politics.Remember…’s them who have the problem of ageing,declining support.

    98. Ruby says:

      I found the News of the World article on Proquest

      Perhaps Proquest in linked to the National Library of Scotland

    99. HaggisHunter says:

      Kezia Cringe, that’s all that comes to mind when she’s on the Telly.
      She will do as her London masters tell her. Wasn’t she rejected by the SNP?

    100. galamcennalath says:

      Liam Fox tweets…

      “The United Kingdom, is one of the few countries in the European Union that does not need to hide its 20th century history.”

      …. this, is the kind of utter nonsense BritNats actually believe. The UK Is exceptional, special, blessed even, in their truly obscene and twisted version of history.

    101. galamcennalath says:

      @Me 8:42

      UK 20thC history – It probably began with the concentration camps of the South African War in 1900, and went downhill from there!

      Such lovely people, these Brits.

    102. Valerie says:


      Even by Liam Fox’s standards, that is a heinous, lying tweet. Or he truly has no conscience.

      Not often I’m left agape by Unionists, but this one is vile.

    103. peter newling says:

      Sorry for going off topic but are others finding Derek Bateman’s blog still blocked?
      Links say “forbidden” and Google entries say “this may harm your computer”.
      Who has done this? How? Is there a way to restore connections?
      Any advice welcome.

    104. Muscleguy says:


      That would be fine, IF theology was a valid basis on which to base your view of the world. If you want a rigorous framework to view the world from you can study Philosophy though relevance to reality can be dodgy there too. Science will give you the mental tools to view the world with, to view it as it actually is with no wishful thinking (a scientific sin). Wishful thinking, starting with the premise that humans are perfectible, rather characterises Theological thought, most of which was formulated before the Enlightenment and the scientific revolution which has transformed how we see and understand the world and the cosmos in which it sits. No Theology even approaches the size of the universe as it actually is. The Judeo-Christian tradition is in fact one of the more parochial ones in terms of cosmic setting. No theology predicted other galaxies, let alone the one we live in or galaxy structures. And before you ask nothing is special about the location of this solar system or this galaxy.

    105. heedtracker says:

      ArtyHetty says:
      7 March, 2016 at 1:09 am

      Sorry to hear about your weekend yoon debates. Personally I dont get into to it with hard core yoonery types but they are very angry winners. Yoons I know, seem to assume that as they won 2014, that’s it all over for good/generation. Go back to the good ole days, Holyrood’s most powerful ever so be grateful, you vote Lab, I vote Con, vote Lib, if you’re not so sure.

      I think a lot of it is that Scotland has such a vast socio economic gulf between wealth and not wealth. Middle class Scotland is just an another universe from the vast housing estates of Glasgow, Edinburgh, Dundee etc

      This is the self preservation society/Hope over fear?

    106. Craig Murray says:

      Arty Hetty 1.09

      I think a lot of people can relate to your experience. Look on the positive side – you have discovered some people who you thought were friends, are not. This knowledge is a step forward, even if painful to take.

    107. Macart says:


      I’m guessing Fox wasn’t big on history at school.

      FFS, that’s a particularly idiotic statement on his part.

    108. ScottieDog says:

      I’ve had similar experiences. Not so much shouting matches but friendships which have gone a bit Luke warm shall we say.
      It’s hard to untangle all the knots in people’s neo-liberal beliefs so I just focus on a single knot. You can’t argue on all the fronts so pick one untruth and focus on it. My favourite, as quoted by your friend is that the govt ‘can’t afford it’ or ‘there’s no money’. They have bought into the false economic monetarist religion adopted by James Callaghan and then Maggie thatcher.

      How can’t the govt afford it I ask? Then I get a mumbling reply.

      Then I site the example in 2012 of the govt QE programme (Quantitative Easing) where the govt instructed the Bank of England to purchase around 20% of the country’s debt. Where did the money come from? It was typed into a computer which is just about how all money is created today.

      Then I might quote that “a government cannot become insolvent with respect to obligations in its own currency”. That came from a chairman of the U.S. Federal reserve. That is applicable to the UK as issuer of its own currency.

      Now WE in the private sector can’t buy up our old debt. Imagine if you went to the bank and told them you had printed some IOUs to pay off your mortgage. They would probably pour you a cup of tea until the ambulance came.

      Then I might ask your friends how much govt debt there is compared to the amount of private debt. Of course they won’t know. They have just been told through partisan media that we have a government debt crisis.

      Then I explain that the NATIONAL debt as a percentage of our output is around 80% but the total private debt hovers at almost 400%.

      Whenever the government tries to save (surplus) we have to go into more debt. With an already huge private debt mountain I explain to them that the false beliefs about money were directly responsible and will be again for another financial crisis.

      The beauty of the above is that I never mentioned independence and I didn’t once talk about the SNP. I just unpicked a knot and it makes the other knots easier to untangle. Of course you might want to provide references to untangle these false beliefs…

    109. heedtracker says:

      And before you ask nothing is special about the location of this solar system or this galaxy.

      Other than the fact that the location allows life. Life that then produces Ian Murray MP and Oscar winning Interstellar.

      Its not fair that the last SLab MP in Scotland is over in Canada. What on earth Canada must make of Scotland that actually voted NO and then yes for this character, a socialist MP, elected by Morningside, one of the wealthiest constituencies in teamGB. The Inexplicable Ian.

    110. Hobbit says:

      @Heedtracker, 0915

      I think a lot of it is that Scotland has such a vast socio economic gulf between wealth and not wealth. Middle class Scotland is just an another universe from the vast housing estates of Glasgow, Edinburgh, Dundee etc

      Yes, the differences within Scotland are, IMHO, as important as the differences between Scotland as a whole and the remainder of the UK (esp the South-east). I think this is something we need to talk about more.

    111. Almannysbunnet says:

      Trust, once lost, is difficult to regain. Labour aren’t even trying.
      Their lack of respect for the people’s intelligence will be rewarded by a mass two fingered salute from the peoples of Scotland.
      In the 18th Century we had the Scottish enlightenment. In 2014 we had the Scottish awakening and we are wide awake to their old tricks. Labour yer doomed!

      SNP x 2

    112. Fred says:

      @ Macart, a buddy of mine was at school with Liam Fox he tells lies about his age. Does his boyfriend know?

    113. tamson says:

      You could have abbreviated one section of Dugdale’s opinions:

      Cuts Labour implement
      those done by anyone else

    114. heedtracker says:

      More SLab gibberish, also future Lord Ian of Morningside says the line dropped, when future Sir Gordon Brewer asks him a good question- ” The party Québécois came closer to winning their indy ref than the SNP did in Scotland, but today are no longer in power and not that influential. Do you see any lessons for Labour (and everyone here in Pacific Quay) from what’s happened to Québécois in Canada, because everyone here in BBC vote SLab Scotland is working like the fantastically well paid con artists we are, trying to find some way of getting #SNPout?”

      Sorry Gordy, you’re breaking up, I’m going through a tunnel.

    115. If I remember correctly Labour had planned to introduce two new council tax bands a lower tax band for those in the cheapest properties and a top rate band for those in expensive properties.

      It was never explained how this could be done without carrying out a revaluation of properties as had been done in Wales.

      And with the value of houses rising in the property market, how long would this quick fix last be before those in the lowest band ended up paying the same level of council tax as they are now?

    116. ScottieDog says:

      But you also need to differentiate the ‘brainwashed’ middle class from the middle class who are very aware of what’s going on.
      I think it was Elizabeth warren in America who did a brilliant talk about the ignorance by the middle class about how their wealth was being destroyed by the neo-liberal elites running the country and not by welfare.

      In this country we are taught by the mainstream propaganda to believe that a few people on benefits are stripping away the wealth of the Middle class when it is actually the city of London syphoning the wealth.

    117. Ken500 says:

      A Unionist poster with extremely racist bigoted views had the first post on the Scotsman website. That change when a Unionist politican took up a post. Taxpayers money for old rope.

      People in the UK are using imported fracked Gas. Many people in Britain do not want to frack.

      Osbourne is taxing Scottish Oil sector 60% destroying it. Losing thousands of jobs and £Bilions. Importing Gas from Norway – Statoil.

    118. Daisy WAlker says:

      Hello wings and wingers,

      I’m such a simpleton… I had this £145 kicking about, now what was it for? Oh yes I used to use it to pay for blatant lies and badly presented maps….

      Am guessing the Rev will make much better use of it.

      Thanks to all.

      Cheerie the noo.

    119. Karmanaut says:

      If Scottish Labour weren’t lying to us, they wouldn’t be Scottish Labour.

      As for Kezia…


    120. heedtracker says:

      ScottieDog says:
      7 March, 2016 at 10:12 am
      But you also need to differentiate the ‘brainwashed’ middle class from the middle class who are very aware of what’s going on.

      In the 60’s Labour opened up uni’s and college’s to working class people in the UK. They will never make that mistake again UKOK style in Scotland, but the fact is that they did.

      They real horror that underlies this pretty stark socio economic progresive liberal opening up of uni’s in particualar is that the class that it produced almost instantly pulled up the ladder behind them, as soon as they possibly could.

      Everyone knows now how hard red and blue tories, SLab dingongs in particular, rage at free Scottish uni but look at how likes Cherry Blair QC, working class Liverpool, married to Bomber Bliar, recipient of free uni, student grants, law degree, wealth, fame, loadsafackin money etc, BUT almost instantly Labour get in, they scrap every student grant, pile in with loans, or just continue the blue tory policies of making students pay and blocking same working class access that clearer works. Just ask Cherry Blair.

      Its not rocket science.

    121. heedtracker says:

      Sorry about all typos up there. Another horrific example of how opening up education. Free private school, free OxBridge, bit dim though, creeps into BBC, flowers into far right blue tory, grovels to his betters, savages the life out of any and everything progressive, ultimate UKOK toryboy counter jumper from hell, and there’s a whole army of them, tory red and blue.

    122. dakk says:

      Excellent exposure of duplicitous and cynical Dugdale/Scottish Labour Stuart.

      Highlights Slab’s bitter twisted view of Scotland.

      So Dugdale and other Slab leaders view Scotland as a bigotted country.

      So entirely logical for them to clean up with the ‘Presbyterian narrow bigotted’ populace/voters,whilst assuming the Catholic vote were already owned,despite bad mouthing their hierarchy.

      I don’t think even the other 2 unionist parties in Scotland are as cynical and dishonest as Slab,at least not the Torys.

      Thanks Stuart.

    123. ArtyHetty says:

      Thanks for the friendly responses, heedtracker, C.Murray and Scottiedog.

      I suspect those friends have been chomping at the bit to have a go at me, I fell for it, as much as I tried to talk about anything but politics, they were determined. You feel like the dogs have been set on you, nasty. 3 against 1.

      The liebour friend, did his utmost to call me a ‘nationalist’ in the most negative sense. You see, only he can be a ‘socialist’, you can’t support the SNP and be a socialist, or even social democrat.

      The other one adamant that if you have an ‘english accent’ you can’t say you are Scottish if you go abroad for instance, even if having lived in said country for more than half your life. That from a Scottish no voter. All not so proud Scotbuts.

      Time to pick myself up and go deliver some leaflets.

      Have a good Monday everyone.

    124. Capella says:

      Another fine bunch of links from Nana!
      This film about the “Secret City” i.e city of London and its predatory denizens is going to take up an hour of my time today. From the freethinking link above.

      Ian Murray in Quebec – not looking at how Canada managed to neutralise the PQ vote. Good grief no.

    125. Greannach says:

      I often wonder if Branch office tweets are written under the influence of something in a bottle.

    126. Capella says:

      O/T For those who haven’t seen the HoC Research paper on the Quebec referendums, here’s the link to the pdf:

      There is also an interesting Wiki article on the history of the Quebec independence struggle. Many parallels with our current situation. Ian Murray could have stayed at home and googled it.

    127. Bob Mack says:


      The theological approach is viable because we know of nothing else apart from our own human experience. We are aware of other worlds ,but of no life force which occupies them. Therefore we are restricted to humanity, and the human condition.

      Theology is not just the study and approval of your own chosen belief,but also includes the appreciation of why others worship or hold their faith according to their own experience. At least it opens the door to acknowledging the views of others.

      That in my view is no bad thing .

    128. Nana says:


      I thought you would want to see that. I think I might have posted the link before indyref. Anyhoo when I spotted it again last night I decided it might be worth reposting.

      Have another couple of links

    129. bjsalba says:

      I see in the National that Caroline Leckie is touting the notion that we need a rainbow coalition at Holyrood to reform the tax system.

      Rev Stu’s piece here demolishes that nonsense. It ain’t gonna make a difference. It is UK Westminster Treasury that holds the power.

      I know Caroline served as an MSP from 2003 to 2007, so was not in Holyrood when the UK Treasury has said no under Labour and then under the Tories, but you would have thought she would have kept abreast of things or at least got up to speed when she started as a journaist.

      She does herself and her former party no good by writing nonsense that has been debunked before the paper even comes out.

    130. John H. says:

      Liam Fox and others like him should read-

      Cruel Britannia: A Secret History of Torture by Ian Cobain.

      One man who was arrested by the British at the end of the war on suspicion of being a communist spy had been a prisoner of the gestapo for two years. He reckoned that the British were far worse in their treatment of him.

    131. ScottieDog says:

      If you want to rage against a specific class so be it – that is exactly what the establishment wants.
      Or you can Educate them. No I’m not talking about university etc – that is conditioning.

      The discussions I have with Middle class colleagues are like the one I wrote a few posts back about economic lies and misunderstanding about our money system. It’s about making them understand how the system is working to dismantle their wealth as well as everyone else’s.

    132. yerkitbreeks says:

      Don’t normally take issue with you, but in your quote “REPLACE” seems clear enough.

    133. Almannysbunnet says:

      “BBC assistant political editor Norman Smith said the prospect of the SNP co-operating with the government would inevitably be seized on by Labour ahead of the upcoming Scottish elections in May.”
      Do labour really want to go there? Abstaining in a vote is seen as “co-operating” with the tories. Bring it on.

    134. heedtracker says:

      It’s about making them understand how the system is working to dismantle their wealth as well as everyone else’s.

      How’s that been happening then?

      Its not rage specific class. Its entrenched class socio economics, UKOK style for the last since ever.

      Good example is English medic’s refusing to work weekends. Fair enough but thanks specifically to socialist worker Gordon Brown, GP’s retire with £2 million pension pots.

      Do you?

      £2 million pension returns £60-£80k a year, at today’s mess of UKOK bankster rates.

    135. Capella says:

      @ Nana
      Yes I’m reading “The New Few: A Very British Oligarchy” by Ferdinand Mount. Surprising how a Baronet, Sir Ferdinand, as an insider, exposes the evil machinations of our oligarchs. The film on The City will complement nicely!

    136. heedtracker says:

      Another day, another round of UKOK bbc comedy, top BBC ligger sacked for bias:D

    137. Sarah says:

      To be fair, though I dislike her, she did say that it was the upper echelons of the Catholic Church that were bigoted, not the laity in general or every member thereof. Given the Pope the CoC had last voted in at the time of the remarks, there were a lot of Catholics making similar or worse, as I recall.

      Holy hell, I’m now so sick of the eternally offended whingers and the professional spinners and twisters that I’ll even defend people I can’t otherwise stand.

    138. scottieDog says:

      It’s called a debt based money system. Banks creating money and pumping up the price of housing and other assets. So what warren was doing in the US was comparing what the middle class salary would afford you in the 70s and what it would afford now. It’s less now. It’s less because of neo-liberal beliefs and a privatised monetary system – not because of folk on benefits.
      Do you think I’m sympathetic towards these people? I can assure you I’m not. I’m angry at their attitude and I find myself categorizing people when I’m out and about and I feel bitter.

      But I’ve had the stand up arguments with these people. They walk off muttering and it just strengthens their resolve. That’s why I do things differently now.

    139. Almannysbunnet says:

      @heedtracker says:
      7 March, 2016 at 12:43 pm
      top BBC ligger sacked for bias:D

      I misread that the first time too. It’s BCC not BBC in this case.

    140. heedtracker says:

      I can hear hammer of the Scots Tom Harris boasting about being the new Torygraph UKOK columnist on BBC Daily Politics and that’s even more laughable than the BBC ligger sacked for bias.

      UKOK SLabour dude hired by Torygraph far right nutters, shock.

    141. Provost Sludden says:

      Aye, thats the fella.

      O/T Clean for the Queen has only attracted one volunteer group (3 people) in Dumfries and faces the axe. How are things elsewhere?

    142. Almannysbunnet says:

      Provost Sludden says:
      O/T Clean for the Queen has only attracted one volunteer group (3 people)

      Maybe it’s because they cannae spell 🙂

    143. michael diamond says:

      Aye provost sludden, clean for their queen, while kate and wills enjoy their skiing holiday at the taxpayers expense. Sad sad unionist plebs.

    144. heedtracker says:

      scottieDog says:
      7 March, 2016 at 12:57 pm

      US middle class economics do indicate what you say about the US. But this is pop economics in a $19 trillion dollar economy in a 50 state continental federation and over there, middle class America means working class, when they debate.

      Here in teamGB, its a very different economic middle class, wealthy, high paid, high job security, auto entrance to uni, professional nepotism, via private ed mostly, clear establish dividers between working and middle class, housing areas, school demographics.

      Much of UKOK toryboy world’s problem in their fractious Scotland region maybe that they’ve not created nearly enough middle class Scots to vote NO and vote Tory or maybe just enough for the former. Logic dictates that they should but that’s not how it works in the grand old yew kay. All focus has to be on the super heated south east and London economy. Middle classes in the north are sustained by it all.

      Just ask socialist worker Gordon Brown. He knows and he’ll tell you, to bugger off.

    145. heedtracker says:

      Yoon parties going nowhere, another day of Scotland region news from rancid The Graun, its not meteor showers this week its, northen lights hitting Scotland region headlines and “Three London museums totalled more visitors than Venice in 2015
      Weakness of the pound and capital’s popularity helped attract record 124.4 million visitors to UK’s top attractions”

      At least they’re not monstering Scottish democracy. As Carell and co click through all Scottish stories they wont report, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, ooh wait obituary in Scotland there, not English, no, no, no, no, no, no, ah fcuk it, go with weather.

    146. bill says:

      Bateman links to porn sites, it’s possibly hacked or users have posted links.

    147. Les Wilson says:

      I was reading an article about Vietnam this morning. Here is a short extract.

      ” Vietnam has gone from being ‘the Cuba of Southeast Asia’ to a country with more opportunity, fewer restrictions, and one of the fastest growing middle classes in the world.
      It just goes to show how powerful freedom can be: prosperity rises when a nation progresses from ‘unfree’ to more free.”

      Our own naysayers should read and take notice.

    148. carjamtic says:

      After getting a free ride for over 300 years,(a backie)the Yoon is not happy to be told to ‘get aff’,rather than stepping off quietly and with some dignity.

      Yoon punctures both tyres,with his stinging telson,everybody ends up broken and in a ditch asked ‘Why’?
      Yoon says ‘no reason,it’s just in my nature,I resent those who have what I lack …I’m a

      There are only 10 types of people in the world :Those that understand binary and those who don’t.

      Red Tories are Yoons

      SNP x 2

    149. Chic McGregor says:

      It seems these tourist visit figures rely on attendances at museums, art galleries and other covered venues.

      Wonder if they factor in the fact the Summer of 2015 was one of the wettest on record? I think July was wettest on record IIRC.

    150. heedtracker says:

      Chic McGregor says:
      7 March, 2016 at 3:11 pm
      It seems these tourist visit figures rely on attendances at museums, art galleries and other covered venues.

      Come for that great yew kay history, with a region called Scotland tacked on the top. They’re dicks about stuff like this too

      These cant be seen in Lewes or Edinburgh, despite having massive visitor draw potential. Why, because although they were found in their Scotland region, they appear to be Scandinavian. Ergo, theyre not Scots and don’t not belong there. They belong in London, which is also why the British Museum is called the London Museum, where they have a real shortage of interesting stuff, what is very vital to the UK tourism industry, y’see.

    151. dakk says:


      ‘All focus has to be on the super heated south east and London economy. Middle classes in the north are sustained by it all.’

      And the middle classes in turn sustain the Westminster hegemony.

      We the plebs just pay for it all through taxation and are brainwashed into knowing our place and revering our betters,or they won’t take care of us detritus.

      And how dare you question the right of our doctors to have their mouths stuffed with gold and not have to work every 4th Saturday ?

    152. Tom Platt says:

      For information only. I have recently started posting on a FB page entitled “Scottish Politics Group”. There is a thread there from 19 hours ago, headed “Rag, tag and bob-tail. Why do you think Rev Campbell lives in Bath?” It now contains a number of rubbishy posts about Rev Stu from 2 or 3 nonsense web sources. They are not just smutty but hard core smut Rightly or wrongly, for better or for worse, I have become involved and the latest of my posts is as follows:- “..It is strange how these posts of carefully written smut and rubbish about Stu Campbell grow in number as though they are reproducing themselves. It is surely a sign of the danger that his blog is seen to be posing to the might and power of the great UKish state by those with vested interests in the Westminster Establishment. Perhaps he will soon be challenging Nicola for the title of the most dangerous person in the UK? Why don’t the people in positions of power put as much thought into improving the Westminster systems rather than trying to fend off the attempts of people involved in WoS to improve the quality of life for all of us/? The people here who claim not to want to read his carefully thought out and well referenced work seem only too happy to read and post the obviously contrived scandal stories surrounding him The offending words and evidence of actions are dredged up from the bottom of the sewer, stripped of context and found to have Rev Stu’s fingerprints on them, despite the fact that he usually wears protective gear when processing filth. Thankfully for the mental health of the Scots, the tens and hundreds of thousands of readers of the WoS blog have the intelligence to recognise the quality of the process that he is encouraging people to take themselves through. I cannot be the only poster here to recognise so many of the posts on this thread as internet rubbish not worth serious consideration or counter. They are obviously being posted merely to try to discredit him. What has he got to do with anything anyway? It is the critical process that he is encouraging that is key, rather than his own personality. That critical process will survive even if attempts to discredit him succeed.” The attempts will not succeed if I have anything to do with it. I am just so grateful that this valuable blog exists and I will certainly be contributing to the crowdfunder.

    153. Chic McGregor says:

      I believe Stornoway has been ‘loaned’ about a half dozen of the pieces on an on going basis from the British Museum.

      Maks ye sick eh?

      Also latest thinkin is it wis a wee Icelandic wummin thit made thum an Ah’m mindin as weel thit they hae fun oot fae thir DNA thit Icelandic wimmin were maistly Scoats in origin, they Vikings maun hae stoapit in Scotland oan the wie ower. 😉

    154. jcd says:

      Tom Platt,

      Paragraph breaks my boy, paragraph breaks, that’s what will end the union.

      Otherwise we’ll all BE KILLED WITH HAMMERS.

      SNP X 2 in May

    155. john king says:

      Rev Stu Campbell

      Think you’ve been in the west country a little too long there Catwheazle

    156. Tom Platt says:

      Sorry jcd.

      It is a while since I posted here.

      I had forgotten that they are possible.

    157. louis.b.argyll says:

      A good point Tom…

      ..all the ‘departmental’ underhand political posturing and all the ‘departmental’ denial based lies about our economies..

      What a great waste of an entire educated class of baby boomers.

      Thanks folks.

    158. alexicon says:

      Don’t think that has taken.

      Try again.

    159. Lollysmum says:

      @ Tom Platt
      Good post Tom even if you did forget the golden rule re paragraph breaks. Yes you’re right-Rev Stu does have them worried 🙂

      Good job we have his back!

    160. Grouse Beater says:

      Man, sunshine or no sunshine, this has been a crap day. It’s becoming impossible to throw off a profound sadness. I’m beginning to hate sunset.

      Basic domestic chores are continually pervaded with loss of the nation’s right to self-determination. What a shit deal that was. We hand over our sovereignty so we can be at the mercy of a government antithetical to our own aspirations, Orwell’s Big Brother nation that wants us to remain forever its territory.

      No wonder so many Scots take to booze to numb reality.

    161. Chic McGregor says:



      There’s an even ruder one of Wendy in the SP.

    162. louis.b.argyll says:

      Ooh, Brent oil breaks $40.

    163. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi carjamtic.

      You stated,
      “There are only 10 types of people in the world :Those that understand binary and those who don’t.”

      I’d suggest that this statement holds true as well.
      There are only 11 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, those who don’t and those who misread your statement.


    164. Capella says:

      Cheer up Grousebeater. It’s only life. If winter comes can spring be far behind?

    165. Marie Clark says:

      louis b argyll 5.35 “ooh Brent breaks $40”. Aw naw, whit ur we goan tae dae noo. $40 . Oh a ken SNP BAD.

    166. carjamtic says:

      Aye Brian

      I often re-read the posts,by the second/third time reading I get what the poster saying 😉

      Danger Alert : Old Joke

      ‘Good morning Yoons,welcome to our Plastic Surgery Addicts Anonymous group……I am disappointed to see so many new faces….but remember SNP still Bad’

      Coat oan

    167. louis.b.argyll says:

      Yes Brian,

      Every $5 rise creating a further £7 Billion black hole, somehow.

      The UK turn black gold into black holes.

    168. john king says:

      “No wonder so many Scots take to booze to numb reality.”

      Jesus I suddenly realised, IM AN APACHE

    169. john king says:

      $40 a barrel, thats it then the days o cheap petrol are over, it’ll be 1.40 by the morra!

    170. Nana says:

      O/T click the link to open document

      Letter re fiscal framework

    171. louis.b.argyll says:

      Sorry, should be Marie..

    172. Dr Jim says:

      Oil went down and that was bad
      Oh no it’s going up again that’s bound to be even worse

      Why us, what did we do to deserve oil

      The whole thing’s a tragedy I just can’t take any more of this

    173. heedtracker says:

      Grouse Beater says:

      Chin up soldier. Often the battle’s a lot more interesting than victory. Actually in Scotland’s case that’s probably not true, as our independence day approaches.

      We surrounded by ferocious liars and conmen but maybe take a break, like ultra unionist Doc Bonkers here.

      He’s off to oil poor Dubai, to explain to them why they would be far bettertogether off UKOK style, if only their neighbours ran their country for them, extracted all their natural resources to enrich themselves, dragged them in to endless horrifying war, dumped their nuke weapons next to their biggest city, sneered at them for being to poor, small, stupid moochers… you can probably see where I’m going with yoon of the year 2016 Dr Scott Thinks and what he wont be saying to any Emirati’s, probably.

      Its all just for us.

      Scott Arthur ?@DrScottThinks 23h23 hours ago Edinburgh, Scotland
      I’m heading to Dubai on Tuesday with work…

    174. heedtracker says:

      Chic McGregor says:
      7 March, 2016 at 4:00 pm
      I believe Stornoway has been ‘loaned’ about a half dozen of the pieces on an on going basis from the British Museum.

      Maks ye sick eh?

      Imagine what the Greeks have to listen to.

    175. ArtyHetty says:

      Aw, Grousebeater, don’t let the bstrds get you down.

      A chores day today for me too, interspersed with WoS, then a fab walk along the Water of Leith, I felt so lucky, to see such wonderful sights close to home.

      Let the yoons wallow in darkness, we really have seen the light, which is great isn’t it. I am an atheist btw, lol.

      We are the new, new enlightenment, some will only come to acknowledge it when they are about 90, such fools!

      Hm, I see the oil price is creeping up, that oh so volatile commodity, and just when I actually saw some goods are a few pennies cheaper on my shopping list, damn!

    176. ArtyHetty says:


      think yourself lucky we don’t have any gold, or anything really valuable, just a bit of oil and gas and a wee bit of land etc. (joking).

      Here is a very good site which reports on all things environmental regards countries with resources that a few people would quite like to have, at any price,

      They openly murder activists.

    177. Provost Sludden says:

      Perhaps the Unionists are rigbt. Can you imagine a small country of less than five million people that shares so much history with a larger neighbour on the edge of Europe, burdened with unpredictable oil revenue, going it alone?

      I mean think about it, do we seriously want to end up like Norway?

    178. Ian Mackay says:

      The Dugdale News of the World article – and many more newspaper articles – can be found on the ProQuest website.

      Even better, if you’ve got a Glasgow library card you can enter your card number and search the site for free.

    179. Lenny Hartley says:

      Bugger just when I thought better get the central heating oil tank topped up!

      We’re all doomed i tell yae

    180. louis.b.argyll says:

      Shh..don’t mention the gold.

    181. heedtracker says:

      UKOK hackdum pretty sniffy about New Day, the all new UKOK newspaper, which doesn’t mean it’s going to be any good.

      Will they have a groovy rancid The Graun style creepy scotland region section, where they tell Scotland how shite it really will be, if we dont keep letting England run us and we have weather n shit?

      Far right toryboy’s not impressed, shock.

    182. Provost Sludden says:

      New Day promises to be neutral, so there will be SNPbad articles from both Labour and Conservative figures.

    183. Dr Jim says:


      Damn!! Forgot about the Gold
      Could things get any worse, Ochone Ochone

    184. liz says:

      BBC Scotlandshire prime time tonight – The Lady Lairds.FFS

    185. G4jeepers says:

      Liz, sickening isn’t it…

    186. ArtyHetty says:


      No gold, no no no, shhh.

      If you look on youtube, you can watch great vids on gold bullion stores, and all about the billions it’s supposedly worth. Every day I pinch myself, I mean they go to any lengths, completely wrecking the landscape forever, while poisoning and even murdering the indigenous people, in order to dig out gold, melt it down and store it underground!

      Water? I buy that bottled water, though rarely, but always think, wait who’s water is this? Oh yeh, it comes from Scotland’s aquifers, but makes a tidy sum for someone.

      All every day stuff as well, bizarre.

    187. heedtracker says:

      Its a toryboy world but this is funny, NS on New Day

      “On Monday I went to the newsagent to buy the newspapers and picked up the first issue of a new one calling itself the New Day. This is the creation of the company that publishes the Daily Mirror, and it is, the publishers say, intended to appeal to people who have given up reading newspapers, people now so numerous that they are rapidly bringing the industry to its knees.”

      People don’t buy their awful grot so its their fault. How will we ever know how the royals are getting on at their Alpine ski resort toryboys?

      There is real UKOK stupidity out here. Try being in the same area as proud Scot but rugger buggers singing Flower of Scotland Region. Its like the Biggus Dickus Life of Brian scene, for YESers.

      and stood against them, la la la blah blahbedee dah.

    188. daisy Walker says:

      Dear Grousebeater,

      I just wanted to say how much I enjoy and appreciated your articles. They mean a great deal.

      I hear you when you say your feeling downhearted just now. Please take good care of yourself, and if you can, rest up a little, cause this is the long haul now, a different kind of battle than the referendum, and you and the Rev and WGD, and the others, have been going full tilt now for years.

      I suspect there’s been a change in policy by the other side, the SLAB wanna be big boys have been quietly shuffled aside by suits with posh accents, and the first thing they’ve done is close the tap on information. That’s why there’s been less for the Rev to get his teeth into, they’re just not giving interviews anymore.

      But that’s ok, cause we’re not going away, not giving up and aye yes for aw that. Nae biddy does thrawn better than us. And here’s a thing, it’s not about them, it’s about us, every little bit of decency builds something, and they can’t stop it, or steal it or spoilt it – bet it scares them silly.

      You take it easy now, we’ve got your back, and we’ll carry the weight the now bud.

      Anyway, that’s enough for now, apparently Derek Batemans got porn! I’ve always found his blog SO informative, can’t wait;)

      Best wishes.

    189. Valerie says:

      Very interesting, and won’t be reported. UK is being cited in this action by the Marshall islands.

    190. Ruby says:

      Ian Mackay says:
      7 March, 2016 at 8:16 pm

      The Dugdale News of the World article – and many more newspaper articles – can be found on the ProQuest website.

      Even better, if you’ve got a Glasgow library card you can enter your card number and search the site for free.

      Ruby replies

      I would imagine most libraries have signed up to ProQuest & possibly Press Reader. That is an amazing archive of newspaper articles. The link I posted earlier was where you enter your Edinburgh Library card number for access to Proquest.

      The other site that you can gain access to with a Edinburgh library card is Press reader.

      That is a really good site where you can read digital versions of millions of newspapers & mags from all over the world.

      Just out of interest is the Sunday Post & PJ behind a paywall?

      You can read these on Press Reader you can also read the Herald.

      Well worth having a look or asking about it in your library.

    191. Still Positive. says:

      Aye Grousebeater you’ve struck a chord there. Many times over the last 18 months I have thought how much better a YES vote would have been.

      We could have been discussing the settlement, writing a Scottish Constitution and planning what our country would be like in the future. I remember our YES shop brimming with ideas from us ordinary folk.

      The nearer we get to our should-have-been Independence Day, the more despondent I get at times.

      I console myself with the feeling that independence will come and it won’t be too long until we can take part in planning our country’s future.

      Chin up and stay positive! 🙂

    192. Big Jock says:

      Another Natalie Mcgarry witch hunt in press. Apparently accused ultra Brit Alastair Cameron of being a Holocaust denier. I know nothing of the man. Does anyone know if there is any substance to this?

    193. call me dave says:

      @Grouse Beater

      “Ring the bells that still can ring.
      Forget your perfect offering.
      There is a crack, a crack in everything.
      That’s how the light gets in.”

      — Leonard Cohen

      Scotland and it’s people are treading treacle at the moment but better times are coming.

      I appreciate all your posts and your linked articles. Keep on keeping on. 🙂

    194. Nana says:

      @Grouse Beater

      Hope this cheers you a little bit…

    195. Robert Peffers says:

      @Dr Jim says: 7 March, 2016 at 9:05 pm:

      “Damn!! Forgot about the Gold
      Could things get any worse, Ochone Ochone”

      Yes, Dr Jim, of course they could get worse.

      Some numptie could mention the vast Methane Hydrates, (Fire Ice), that are believed to lie West of Shetlads.

    196. Still Positive. says:

      Nana @ 10.33

      Thoroughly enjoyed that. Although I think Alex needs to back on his 5:2 diet.

    197. Graeme Doig says:

      Big Jock

      There’s a link to Herald article in a retweet on Rev’s feed. Seems Natalie has not learned or been told in strong enough terms to stay away from Twitter.

      Crass stupidity to give them so much ammo in my opinion.

    198. liz says:

      Natalie McG is not my favourite person, as she blocked me over a disagreement re Tommy Sheridan.

      However looks like she is going down fighting, so more power to her elbow.

    199. Excellent issue of the National today with a fine contribution from Richard Walker, George Keravan and Kevin McKenna in good form and one of the best Greg Moodies yet.

      Eagerly looking forward to Tuesday’s edition. This will be guest edited by Stuart Cosgrove with the remit of producing a “Scottish Six” edition. Interesting

    200. mr thms says:

      Government Expenditure and Revenue Scotland (2014/15) is published later today..

    201. mr thms says:


      Of course the link should be

      I blame an unresponsive/slow browser

    202. K1 says:

      Apropo nothing in particular…we should all now refer to any Unionist zoomers including all papers in Scotland as:

      ‘The Yoonatic Fringe’.

      That’s all.

    203. K1 says:

      Yes, I forgot the ‘s’. It’s 3 in the morning…that’s the least of ma worries 😉

    204. yesindyref2 says:

      A Quote from Richard Walker’s article yesterday in the National:

      “The reality is that the Scottish Six proposal is the essential first step in destroying the Reporting Scotland model. The main reason Reporting Scotland is parochially obsessed with courts, crime, and small-scale non-stories is that so many of the major stories are the prerogative of the London staff.”

      So many Indy supporters seem not to care, because they’ve packed in their licence and don’t watch it anyway. But it’s not them this is aimed at, they’re not going to be indoctrinated anyway.

      It’s those we want to change to a YES it’s aimed at, those who watch and believe the crap they’re spoonfed from London. So that in time we’ll get Scottish news, and UK and International news, with a Scottish perspective, not a London one.

    205. Ken500 says:

      Visitors Nos.

      UK 126million visitors UK population 62’million. = two or three trips to Art Galleries , museums – tearooms, (mainly free – can give a donation), a year = 126Million+

      London S/E pop 20million

      Venice pop 200,000

      London will have more visitors (pro rata – larger) but not as a percentage. Not comparing like with like. Statistics and damn lies.

    206. Ken500 says:

      A majority do not give a damn about the BBC News Channel in Scotland because of the bias. The majority do not watch it. BBC Scotland’s ignorance and lies has led to it’s own demise. Westminster controlled. It is just a disgrace. Betrays it’s Charter with impunity.

      There are moves afoot to establish external monitor for complaints. Westminster uses public money to call the tune. The Director goes to Downing Street every week to get guidance and instruction, so as not to cross the line. BBC is stuffed with Westminster supporters. Like the HoL. The Saville abuse kept secret for years by Westminster, child abusers, molestors, killers and chancers, Infest the Establishment. The Iraq War cover up. Dykes told the truth and had to resign. Gilligan told the truth and was hounded. People died.

      The Official Secrets Act covers up the Westminster liars and controls the MSM. The Editors are threatened. The Press is illegally owned by tax evading Non Doms, with Westminster associates complicit. ‘ All in it together’ Boris a touch of reality – out of the loop. Side lined.

    207. Macart says:

      @mr thms

      Is it that time of year already? A snapshot of an incomplete set of books which yoon central has used to beat Scotland about the head with since their tory creation.

      The yoon press will be queuing up to have a wee read and tell us all how boned we are from from this year’s offering.

      Just once I’d like to see a full and complete set of Scotland’s accounts hit the streets. Every single penny generated, from every revenue stream and accounted for.

    208. heedtracker says:

      Just once I’d like to see a full and complete set of Scotland’s accounts hit the streets

      You could start with, there’s more Panda’s in Scotland than there are Labour MP’s.

      Edinburgh zoo’s renamed their’s Tian Tian Murray, in his honour because he’s so honourable and rare.

    209. Macart says:



      Just wishing out loud heed. Yoon central would never dare allow the Scottish government to produce a full set of accounts or indeed access to all relevant data. A degree of autonomy too far in their eyes.

    210. orri says:

      There must be one hell of a temptation to use a Scottish Six as an opportunity to censor the unmitigated policies of Westminster. The persistent and deliberate attempts at undermining Holyrood’s ability to manage our NHS is going to be a lot easier if we don’t have the failings in the rUK to compare. Nor can it help when we can see how Hunt treats junior doctors.

      That’s only one example of how even an allegedly biased reporting of rUK news might actually benefit the SNP.

    211. Capella says:

      Another excellent link Nana. If there’s one thing makes me angrier than the Beeching cuts to the rail infrastructure, it’s the dearth of Scottish based film, TV and radio. Oh to be as free as Iceland!

      “I received no support from BBC Scotland whatsoever. In trying to understand why not, my assessment is that the only way people keep their jobs at BBC Scotland is by NOT challenging London. The organisation is largely impotent with respect to network (across the UK) commissioning, and does not have the autonomy to challenge decisions made in London. Specifically, Scottish commissioners are not allowed to meet with Channel Controllers to pitch projects – rather, they have to pitch to London heads – who are themselves developing their own projects, and trust that the London commissioners will represent their projects well to Channel Controllers. When TUTTI FRUTTI was commissioned, this was not the case. Commissioning became very centralised in the 2000s. This has been disastrous for regional commissioning, and now is the worst time ever for Scottish scripted work getting network commissions.”

      P.S.Where is Derek Bateman? Can’t he post here to let us know what has happened to his blog?

    212. Croompenstein says:

      Did anybody hear the farmer palmers on GMS this morning with their pitchforks raised and flaming torches over the CAP payments

      If they hadn’t spent so much putting big vote naw signs in their fields they would maybe have a spare pound

    213. heedtracker says:

      Macart says:
      8 March, 2016 at 9:17 am

      As long as they can keep saying “the money comes up from London” and Scotland votes NO for this, is all that matters. That “the money comes up from London” was Ruth Davidson in No Thanks action but she suddenly stopped using it in last week or so of the ref campaign.

      The less we know, the UKOK better.

    214. Petition against Hinkley Point Nuclear station project which is already turning into a disaster

    215. I really do wish Natalie McGarry would stay off twitter-
      as she is giving the media all the ammunition they need to attack her- and concentrate on doing her job as an MP looking after her constituents.

      The way she is going she could very well find herself either de-selected or if she isn’t lose her seat at the next general election as she is becoming a liability.

    216. aranciaca says:

      OT – but just seen “The National” this morning. Thought that it was superb, and just waiting for Rock to crawl out from under himself to tell us how Stuart Cosgrove’s imaginative depiction of Scotland as an outward-looking nation is actually a unionist plant to make us all think that BBC Londonshire is wonderful while propping up the writing of Magnus Gardham.

    217. Greannach says:

      Was anyone else surprised to see the Branch’s ex-Rutherglen MP Tom Greatrex on TV in his new role as spokesperson for the Nuclear Industry Association?

    218. frogesque says:

      National: Scottish Six Pilot: Guest editor Stuart Cosgrove.

      BBC Online Scotland: What the Papers Say: No comment!

      Sums up the BBC attitude ‘not where you are’ precisely.

    219. Chic McGregor says:

      Scottish Six.

      Don’t know how much real editing Stuart Cosgrove was able to do in practice, i.e. how comfortable he would be challenging staff input given the one off nature of the task.

      Usual paranoid nat quibbles from me here and there where I wonder if his editing pencil quivered.


      “and even 21 year old MP Mhairi Black”. Why even?
      Wouldn’t simply “and 21 year old MP Mhairi Black” have been more neutral? Or if you were wishing to put a more partisan slant on it “and of course, 21 year old MP Mhairi Black”

      And the throw away line in given fact mode:
      “and a simple yet devastating change by the Scottish Government on how books are supplied to schools”
      With no elucidation on or justification of the remark.

      Why the close up on Margaret MacDonald Mackintosh’s signature rather than a view of the whole picture? I suppose on V/T footage both would have been shown but, strange choice for a one off pic.

      On the Gaelic article, I was expecting ‘V/T with English subtitles’ as the accompanying side annotation.

      And as usual, I think our Stuart’s hammer would have twitched violently over the length of some of the paragraphs throughout. 🙂

    220. Robert Kerr says:

      @Peter McCulloch

      Natalie needs also to stay off television too.

      I thought I had outgrown my cringe problem long ago but she was interviewed last week by RT after her fun in Turkey and the cringe came back. I’m OK now but your post re-triggered it.

      SNP SNP EU

    221. frogesque says:

      Chic McGregor 10.02

      My overall impression reading today’s National was that London was still very much looking over Stuart’s shoulder.

      Nothing too controversial although the sideswipe at JK and her Spanner pal (for the next issue that will never happen) was one lighter moment.

    222. Chic McGregor says:

      “Did anybody hear the farmer palmers on GMS this morning with their pitchforks raised and flaming torches over the CAP payments

      If they hadn’t spent so much putting big vote naw signs in their fields they would maybe have a spare pound”

      Yes, I find their seeming blind spot regarding how they have been thoroughly stitched up on CAP payments by the UK Government bewildering.

    223. Chic McGregor says:

      Not sure if we need look any further than the Herald staffers, they seem to have been sufficiently trained to auto-spin for the Union.

      I am assuming that the National sometimes uses input from staff who normally work on the Herald but that might be completely wrong.

      If they do then it must be difficult to switch modes, even for those who are not evangelical unionists.

    224. @Robert Kerr
      8 March, 2016 at 10:23 am

      Sorry Robert about my post retriggering your cringe.

      This why I don’t tend to watch these political
      programmes, they really are so cringe worthy at

    225. Dr Jim says:

      Scotlands block Grant:

      Why do they call our money a Grant?
      Easy answer,

      “Percentage of Scotlands Tax”

      Or PST for short, coz that’s what I get every time I hear the phrase Block Fukcing Grant

      Whaurs ma sword…The Bastirts

    226. Ken500 says:

      The majority support Natalie McGarry calling the hypocrites out. Absolutely brilliant. She’s nae feart. Never mind the WFI crap.

      No wonder the sleekit hypocrites are always threatening to sue her for telling the truth. They are absolutely feart of being called out for their arrogant, conceited posturing.

      Go girl. She really brings important issues to the fore.

      The farmers do well out of CAP. The payments should be due in June. They are getting bailed out early. Westminster took the money due to Scottish farmers to distribute to wealthy farmers in the rest of the UK. There is an emergency fund. It was the landowners who put the signs in the fields. Many farmers support the SNP. Raise funds etc.


    227. cirsium says:

      Just once I’d like to see a full and complete set of Scotland’s accounts hit the streets. Every single penny generated, from every revenue stream and accounted for.

      Macart – that will only happen when we are independent.

    228. Marga says:

      OT, rating of the 10 most influential female politicians in the world – Sturgeon at no. 9 (in Catalan).

      Nicola Sturgeon, at only forty-five, is the first woman to hold the posts of first minister and leader of the SNP. Her force and charisma have made her an important figure throughout the UK and her role in the coming European Union referendum is sure to be crucial.

    229. Chic McGregor says:

      Last time I checked (during indyref1) the CAP grant allocated to Scottish farmers was only about 2/3 of the MINIMUM designated by the EU on a state basis.

      i.e. If Scotland were independent as an EU STATE there would be an immediate increase in CAP grants for Scottish farmers of about 50% just to comply with the agreed minimum.

      It is only because it is the UK which gets the CAP grant that Westminster can decide to allocate it to its regions as it wishes. And Scotland is just a region to them.

    230. galamcennalath says:

      heedtracker says:

      ” Often the battle’s a lot more interesting than victory. Actually in Scotland’s case that’s probably not true, as our independence day approaches.”

      People often say that when you go on a trip you should make the most of the journey. I could never do that, I just want to arrive at my destination asap!

      Scotland’s road to Indy feels like that! I find myself getting increasingly fed up and frustrated at the pace of the journey. I listen to those who say, “small increments”, “steady progress”, “gradualism”, “more powers” … their arguments have merit.

      However, how far have we got? In a practical government sense, a third of the way? This however lags at least a decade behind popular aspirations. Five years ago a third wanted Indy and two thirds wanted, or would settle for, DevoMax. Now just over half want Indy.

      Perhaps it is this never ending gap between what Scots want and what we are given which frustrates. We move forward, but the gap remains.

      We almost had a step change in Sept 2014, but my unchanging opinion is we were cheated by false promises.

      I want faster progress, right now, I don’t see it coming anytime soon.

      EngExit? Perhaps, but even if they vote to leave, it could take years to develop into a constitutional crisis.

    231. orri says:

      Think McGarry got her Alistairs confusticated. She probably thought he was this guy

      She’d probably be advised to do some basic fact checking before she opens her mouth again.

    232. Ken500 says:

      Try Derek Bateman twitter or Prof Robertson twitter for information. The site was infested by porn. So was the Catholic Church website. No connection? Targeting has been used before.

      Bateman deletes and bans supporters, it leads to a weaker website. The Internet providers give higher support to busier websites because it increases there business. Higher volume of traffic, with more people gaining access, leads to higher donations to support the site.

      Hinkley nuclear Plant £25Billion+ and HS2 £70Billion are a disgrace. A total waste of public money. Appalling and dangerous. Nuclear is a total threat. There is no cure for radiation poisoning. Where is the waste going?

      A total threat to the environment and the public purse. A means for the Tories to misappropriate £Billions public funds for their associates, friends and family, in consultancies and fees. Other renewable schemes are more cost effective and safer. A Humber tidal barrage (£9Billion), solar and turbines would be far more cost effective and safer

    233. heedtracker says:

      No wonder the sleekit hypocrites are always threatening to sue her for telling the truth. They are absolutely feart of being called out for their arrogant, conceited posturing.

      Nice example and every time you look, they get worse. What “post truth” means from historic liars like this and his BBC creep show, is anyone’s guess.

      Blair McDougall ?@blairmcdougall 1h1 hour ago
      Big day for post-truth politics in Scotland as annual GERS public spending & tax figures published. Expect to hear from the SNP…

    234. Ken500 says:

      Scotland got an extra, additional CAP payment from the EU, because as part of the UK, Scotland gets the lower payment of any member. Westminister took that extra payment, and gave it to wealthier farmers in the rest of the UK. The Tory Minster actually said ‘Better together’ when there were protests. The SNP MEP’s are raising it in the EU.

    235. heedtracker says:

      There’s very rich landowners and then there’s farmers. Run up to the ref and there was a giant NO ploughed into high up fields along the A90 north of Dundee. The landowner is a multi millionaire Scottish tory.

    236. Ken500 says:

      The GERS are a disgrace. A show of how Westminster policies bantantly rip off Scotland. Scotland has lost £Billions to Tory policies. Oil revenues are down £Billions because of the Tory tax policies Taxed at 60/80% when prices have fallen 75%. Scotland has lost £Billions since 2011Budget in Oil revenues. Scotland pays £4Billion a year repayments for money it doesn’t borrow or spend.

      Scotland can’t tax ‘loss leading’ drink losing revenues. Whisky Companies pay no tax because of Westminster. Scotland loses £Billions of tax revenues because Westminster does not enforce UK tax Laws. HMRC is not fit for purpose. Trident/illegal wars, tax evasion and banking fraud. Westminster rule is a disaster for Scotland. No CCS for coal. Coal/steel production has been stopped in the UK. Wind turbines have been banned in England.

    237. Chic McGregor says:


      The UK gets the lowest CAP payment per hectare in the EU, but even before the extra payment, largely intended for Scottish farmers but snaffled by Westminster, Scotland got a lower per hectare allocation of the UK grant taking them below the agreed per hectare minimum for a member state.

    238. Ken500 says:

      Some people have no patience. They want everything now. Addictive personalities.

      Scotland was cheated out of it’s Independence by manipulating lies. The Electoral rules and Purdah rules were broken. A hollow victory for lies, manipulation and deceit, for which they will pay.

    239. Ken500 says:

      @ Chic – agree

    240. mike cassidy says:

      Ori 11.44

      I hope you are wrong with that suggestion.

      For, if she doesn’t know the difference between ‘Cameron’ and ‘Mcconnachie’, then the least of her problems is spanners peeking behind her curtains.

    241. Well according to the story in the Scotsman Ms McGarry quickly apologised and deleted the comments from social media.

      But Alistair Cameron of Scotland in the Union has now engaged lawyers and is not satisfied with the politician’s efforts to make amends.

    242. yesindyref2 says:

      An interesting consulation took place on GERS, results were out recently, so 2014-15 should be a bit more accurate, though some proposals were put off (more talks with Treasury):

    243. yesindyref2 says:

      @Peter McCulloch
      I wouldn’t be too chuffed about being accused on the wrong, presuming that’s the case. McGarry should restrict usage of twitter to totally avoid personal attacks. Looks like someone else has taken over her twitter acccount all the same!

      GERS by the way is due out tomorrow, according to that consulation doc.

    244. galamcennalath says:

      IF McGarry latest problems have arisen because she mixed up Alistair Camerons then she has been very stupid.

      When this was first mentioned last night the name Alistair Cameron meant nothing to me. A quick google made it obvious there were a great many ACs out there, but even in the context of Scottish politics there were several. It seemed unlikely the pro-Union one was also the holocast denier. I saw no evidence supporting that, other than same name.

      It did occur to me within minutes that she might have got her ACs mixed up. If she really is THAT careless, then she is a fool. More importantly, she is letting a lot of Scots down by her impulsive behaviour and careless actions.

      Her significant mistake in the Spanner fiasco seems to be using cut and pasted tweet ‘evidence’ which proved to be misleading. Again, she should have double, triple, checked before jumping in.

      Time she focused on her duties to her constituents.

    245. orri says:

      As far as CAP goes Scotland’s farmers are a bit like the disabled child of a disreputable family who use benefits meant for him to live the high life whilst giving him the crumbs of the table.

      Even worse given that one of the aims of those payments is to raise standards in Scotland so that less will be needed in subsequent years.

      Other than easy access to an expanded market one of the main benefits to Scotland is that we have a PR elected parliament having influence in redistributing wealth back to the UK that wouldn’t reach some regions if it was up to Westminster.

    246. @yesindyref2 8 March, 2016 at 12:50 pm

      As others have rightly said Natalie McGarry should have checked, double checked and triple checked to make sure she had all the facts and the right person, before making such an accusation.

      Its no good after the event to then apologise and delete the comments because the damage has been done!

    247. call me dave says:

      Shona Robison announces 1% pay rise for NHS workers in Scotland


      The rest of the ‘news’ is presented as SNAFU and SNP bad.

    248. heedtracker says:

      Its no good after the event to then apologise and delete the comments because the damage has been done!

      Nice display of concern trolling. All great fun.

      Sincere concerns for poor Major Bojo today, who made a silly mistake by telling all his staff to not say anything public Brexit, or rather not Brexiting, staying neutral etc

      UKOK Civil Service lunatics handed out gongs to all their staff that campaigned to save this farce union,

      Special Service awards, for politicly neutral and unbiased British civil service, for historically Project Fearing Scotland into NO.

    249. Chic McGregor says:


      TBF I think Scottish farmers already have the highest standards of animal husbandry and cultivation. However development grants are rather, and I think sensibly, targeted by the EU at areas with less favoured land which could be improved and that is certainly the case for Scotland,

    250. When elected to public office, one’s Twitter use aught to be limited to making announcements about activities, plans, events, achievements etc. associated directly with one’s office.

      And of course, correcting the record where errors or false statements have been made.

      Instead, Ms. McGarry chooses to use it for puerile bun fights with people that are not for turning. The result is to make herself sound like an impatient harridan.

      Next time Ms. McGarry has an opinion; let it go.

    251. @heedtracker 8 March, 2016 at 1:16 pm

      Far from trolling, there needs to be concerns raised about
      Natalie McGarry’s behaviour, particularly if the accusation she made turns out not to be true.

      I do not know who this Alistair Cameron is, and quite frankly I don’t particularly care.

      What I do expect from SNP politicians is that they make sure they have all the facts available to them and they have identified right person when they make accusations.

    252. Jack Murphy says:

      TODAY. The Independent:–
      “These are all the MPs who voted to force through the ESA disability benefit cut”

      NOTE—our very own Tory Secretary of State for Scotland,David Mundell MP [Ruth Davidson’s pal 🙁 ] is on the list!!

      Sharp cuts to disability benefits!

      OUT with the Tories!

    253. heedtracker says:

      Peter McCulloch says:
      8 March, 2016 at 1:33 pm
      @heedtracker 8 March, 2016 at 1:16 pm

      Far from trolling, there needs to be concerns raised about
      Natalie McGarry’s behaviour, particularly if the accusation she made turns out not to be true.

      That’s nice. Are there not much more important issues facing Scots today, other than this one MP tweeting something?


    254. @heedtracker
      8 March, 2016 at 1:37 pm

      Yes there are more important issues facing th

    255. @heedtracker
      8 March, 2016 at 1:37 pm

      Yes there are many very important issues facing Scots
      unfortunately Natalie McGarry tweets takes attention
      away from these issues and allows the unionist media to focus its attention on her.

    256. heraldnomore says:

      Aye, Cosgrove’s Six in The National is excellent. My only problem with the TV version is with the production company. Now if we had SBC, and Cosgrove had a role…

      As Named Person gets in the news again, given pelters, I haven’t heard any suggestions yet that Bailey Gwynne just might be alive today if we had had NP legislation a decade ago.

    257. Andrew Mclean says:

      Funny that when one of ours says something stupid (see above) they are castigated and its milked for every ounce of political capital, but all fair on the other foot!

      Suppose it puts the lie that the SNP control every word! If only, what the SNP need is a chief of staff that can control properly, you know put the fear of death into anyone who would dare post off message stupid comments.

      Biggest mistake was spanner, we let him walk, and that we will regret. But if Natalie is reading chin up, back to school.

    258. Chic McGregor says:

      I am afraid those who choose to become elected representatives do take on extra responsibilities in regard to honesty and accuracy.

      They also, as indicated in ECHR rulings are expected to have a thicker skin and to recognise that comments aimed at them by unelected members of the public should be seen as expressions of a political nature and not be taken personally (specific wrong and damaging accusations apart).

      That may seem unfair, but that is the nature of the job.

      So if you are clumsy with words or can jump to wrong conclusions, both of which I am guilty myself or are unable to shrug off political banter, then you should not seek elected office.

      Which is why I have never sought to be a candidate although I was coerced to be one once, back in the days when we did not have enough local SNP activists to stand as candidates in the council elections.
      I only did so under extreme protest and with the proviso that if by some miracle I was elected then I would resign with immediate effect.

    259. heedtracker says:

      Peter McCulloch says:
      8 March, 2016 at 1:44 pm
      8 March, 2016 at 1:37 pm

      Yes there are many very important issues facing Scots
      unfortunately Natalie McGarry tweets takes attention
      away from these issues and allows the unionist media to focus its attention on her.

      So why are you piling on too? Every little helps.

    260. Capella says:

      George Monbiot is a reliable source of comment on farm and moorland subsidies:

      “The minister responsible for cutting income support for the poor, Iain Duncan Smith, lives on an estate owned by his wife’s family. During the last 10 years it has received €1.5m in income support from taxpayers. How much more obvious do these double standards have to be before we begin to notice?

      Thanks in large part to subsidies, the value of farmland in the UK has tripled in 10 years: it has risen faster than almost any other speculative asset. Farmers are exempted from inheritance tax and capital gains tax. They can build, without planning permission, structures which lesser mortals would be forbidden to erect, boosting both their capital and income. And they have a guaranteed income from the state. Yet all we hear from their leaders is one long whinge.”

      He is talking about the Big Farmers and landowners, by far the greatest beneficiaries of the subsidy culture in the UK. he has an interesting explanation for why the general public tolerate this robbery. First, because as children we are read stories about cuddly farm animal families. But also:

      “…after being brutally evicted from the land through centuries of enclosure, we have learned not to go there – even in our minds. To engage in this question feels like trespass, though we have handed over so much of our money that we could have bought all the land in Britain several times over.”

    261. dakk says:

      The more tittle tattle smears the unionist media spread against SNP,the less the effect.

      The law of diminishing returns.

      Had to listen to an old unionist whore bad mouthing SNP yesterday, but the attacks were all garbled with no conviction.

      Even they don’t believe their own shite.

    262. David Wardrope says:

      Would love SNP to include something in their manifesto along the lines of, “Under SNP government, grass will continue to be green” then ask Scottish Labour if they agree with the SNP position…

    263. Chic McGregor says:

      I omitted to say in my post on it that it was over-all an excellent example of what the Scottish Six could be by Stuart Cosgrove.

    264. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Thanks,Chic. I was about to compose a snarky comment

    265. Capella says:

      As this is International Women’s Day I would support Natalie McGarry’s right not to keep her mouth shut, her right to call out vile misogynists and to visit Turkey on an official delegation.

      I have no idea what the latest scandal is about and I don’t really care. Innocent till proved guilty used to be the norm.

    266. Grouse Beater says:

      On hating politicians:

    267. Chic McGregor says:

      Here is a chart(on an inyref1 window leaflet) showing per hectare CAP development grant for each EU member state with data for 2013.

      Note the UK was the lowest in 2014-20 and in 2007-13 (indicated by a line rather than a second bar chart for some reason?)

    268. orri says:

      Think it’s the development funding supposed to be targeted at scottish farmers that I was talking about. Given to Westminster to distribute and then pooled and shared over the UK as a whole. Resulting in less development in Scotland than expected so the UK can milk the system in subsequent years.

      Obviously not all EU funding is vulnerable to that kind of redistribution.

    269. Tony Little says:


      She tweeted a comment about the leader of Scotland in the Union which claimed he was a holocaust denier, realised her mistake and apologised. They (SiU) are suggesting in the media they may sue – but as she apologised pretty much immediately and in the same forum as the original mistake, I doubt anything will happen.

      Of course this doesn’t stop the Corporate Media from making a storm in a teacup.

      However, I would suggest that Natalie counts to ten before committing things to social media at the moment. The Tweet was apparently at 03.00 am, so maybe she needs to get some rest!

    270. call me dave says:

      The Times in Scotland now 689 sales behind the Scotsman:
      and other figures.

    271. heedtracker says:

      Grouse Beater says:
      8 March, 2016 at 2:21 pm
      On hating politicians:

      Another great read GB. Malice dripping great British meeja next?

      This is FT, fair enough all aimed at the City spivs that will get a funny tingle, in their collective special place, reading FT’s running dog lackey garbage.

      “What you need to know

      The Bank of England is preparing to protect British banks from running out of funds in the event of a Brexit vote by flooding them with a wall of money in the latest sign of the authorities’ nervousness surrounding the EU referendum.”

      Who else but super City toryboys get flooded with a wall of money? The UKOK war machine, Trident 2 makers, the Lords, royals…

    272. Capella says:

      @ Tony Little
      Thanks for the info. Let’s see if the offended party sues. It is interesting that the “donation to a charity” demand is included again.
      I’ve read some of the drivel comments under the vacuous newspaper “accounts” of this spat. She does seem to bring out the vileness of the Yoons.

    273. Capella says:

      Meanwhile, back at the trough:

      “The minister who agreed that EDF, the French nuclear company, could charge twice the wholesale cost for electricity generated by the new Hinkley Point plant now works for the lobbyists who advise the company.
      Sir Edward Davey, who announced the deal with EDF in October 2013, has taken a part-time job with MHP Communications, who name EDF Energy among their clients…

      Analysts at the stockbroker Liberum Capital described the price as “economically insane”, adding: “As far as we can see this makes Hinkley Point the most expensive power station in the world”.”

    274. Legerwood says:

      Capella @ 2.02 pm

      I am not sure that Mr Monbiot is that reliable a source particularly on the matter of farmers and their requirement for planning permission.

      This from the Scottish Government’s web site about Farm diversification and the need for planning permission:

      “”If you propose to alter the appearance of an existing building substantially, convert a building to a different use, develop a new building for a use not classed as agriculture or forestry or construct a new access or car park then you will generally need planning permission. Planning permission is also necessary for any larger agricultural buildings either over 465 square metres or 12 metres in height and any building for the keeping of livestock for non-agricultural purposes, such as horses. Planning permission is normally not required if you are planting woodland or changing crops or livestock.””

      There is more on the site about what requires planning permission and what, if anything, does not.

    275. Giving Goose says:

      An open letter to Natalie McGarry to give up Twitter and apply some common sense to her role as MP.

    276. Capella says:

      @ Legerwood
      I agree that the planning info most likely refers to England. However, despite that, he is very reliable and usually supplies references so that we can check out sources ourselves.

    277. Dr Jim says:

      The leaders debates:

      On the run up to our election the BBC will televise the debates live chaired by…wait for it…

      Kaye Adams and Gary Robertson

      Oh Joy!

    278. Almannysbunnet says:

      According to Yougov on EU referendum Scotland and Wales are for In and Engerland is for out.
      Interesting map.

    279. K1 says:

      From that link about the corbyn4primeminister ticket sales:

      “People should take it easy a bit and be sociable and get on with each other and see that we’re in a community.”

      I won’t be told by a guy called Crispin Flintoff how to be fucking sociable in my own community…

      Idiot. They never learn.

    280. Dorothy Devine says:

      Thanks for that Nana , I needed a laugh and the comments below the line on the Corbyn concert gave me that!

    281. Ken500 says:

      The majority want Natalie McGarry to keep calling the lying hypocrites out on Twitter. They are so feart they kept on threatening to sue her. Go girl. It’s absolutely great. She’s nae feart of the lying, conceited, arrogant poseurs. Never mind the WFI crap. Most folk are loving it.

    282. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Nana Oh Nana you,ve made me gon an done it ( chinged the big boy Pampers) Jim Logue getting rid of Dinosaurs Pmsllll, the bloody biggest of the bigger Dinosaurs in NLC.

      I introduced a Chairman of our local Community Council to Logue many years ago , & his words to Logue at the time. You,llbe anither lying basterd then tae, ah should hiv taken a picture of his face.

      At that time all Councillors get a raise to work in every Community doing Surgeries Logue has never held a Surgery in our community, money for old rope again,but Im glad he,s holding the batton when Labour go down,an will ah no rub it in every time ah see him lol.

    283. Legerwood says:

      Capella @ 4.11 pm

      Actually I checked and the planning regulations in England are broadly similar.

    284. Nana says:

      @Dorothy & Ronnie my sides are aching. Poor wee dug didn’t know what was happening. He’s not used to so much hilarity in the afternoon.

      “ah should hiv taken a picture of his face”

      Aye Ronnie, oh to have a camera handy for just such times.

    285. Legerwood says:

      Corbyn Concert: ” not going well because of SNP dominance”

      So the SNP to blame for this too. SNP bad – to the nth degree.

      Glad the Buzzfeed report told us who the comedians are though, cleared up any confusion on that point.

    286. Tam Jardine says:

      Scotland in Traction, sorry, Union is such a bag of undemocratic pish that it is hard to imagine someone taking aim and missing.

      Their Holyrood Charter (signed by Ruth Davidson and Willie Rennie) is neatly summarised on thier website thus:

      “1. We urge all candidates and parties to rule out campaigning for a new referendum in the forthcoming Parliament.”

      translation- the electorate who want a new referendum should be denied a voice.

      “2 We urge all candidates and parties to respect this promise and to pledge to work in good faith with the UK Government in the interests of both Scotland and the rest of the UK.”

      translation- our elected representatives should not simply represent us but also work on behalf of people in England, Wales and Northern Ireland. Holyrood should take on a whole new fucking remit whereby our interests are only partially represented in tandem with the interests of those in the rest of the UK.

      “3. We urge all candidates and parties to focus the debate on how we best use the powers Holyrood has, rather than forever debating how to acquire new powers.”

      translation- the process of devolution should be considered over regardless of the opinions of the people of Scotland even if only a tiny fraction agree with this.

      “4. We urge all candidates and parties to respect the integrity and independence of our great Scottish institutions.”

      translation- presumably that is a dig at the SNP. No mention of the outside interference from the might of some great and not so great institutions from rUK and beyond during this febrile political period but I guess its ok for the Foreign Office, the UK civil service, the english press, the BBC, UK banking sector, the monarchy etc etc to ride roughshod over Scottish democracy before during and after 2014.

      “5. We urge all candidates and parties to renew their commitment to unity, tolerance and decency in political discourse. We urge them to respect each other’s views, including on how Scottish nationhood and patriotism is expressed, and to condemn the politics of division, insult and intimidation.”

      translation- respect the fact that Better Together and the UK government have cheated, intimidated, insulted and left Scotland festering in a morass of unfulfilled promises, lies and dreams trodden beneath the regime of a country who has subjugated us for so long without a mandate from the people. Up until now that is.

      Respect those who lied to pensioners telling them their pension would be taken from them. Respect those who lied to people about organ donations being cancelled. Respect those who lied to EU migrants- who told them the only way they could remain in the EU was if they voted No when perversely the opposite was perhaps true.

      Respect those who’ve dumped the UK’s nuclear arsenal within close proximity to our largest city and comfortably within fallout range of the entire central belt, and who will vote to keep it there, renew it and use it on our behalf if necessary against civilians just like us elsewhere.

      Respect those who’ve sold our future out from under us… or rather simply given it away.

      Point 5 addresses the yes camp alone but could have come from a microdot of awareness that in voting No guys like Cameron have kinda betrayed Scotland- they just don’t want to be reminded of it because telling someone they have betrayed their country is divisive even if it is true.

      Scotland in Traction is all about closing down debate, closing down democracy, getting us all back in our box and defacing our glorious national emblem, the thistle in UKOK red white and blue.

      Well- they can fuck right off. Ms McGarry should have nailed them for what they are rather than what they are not.

    287. Footsoldier says:

      Natalie McGarry is not helping at all. Why on earth is an MP tweeting at 3.00am. If she has time to spare, she should be helping her constituents, not acting like a third rate MP.

    288. Almannysbunnet says:

      I see Douglas Alexander has just taken up a post advising an international law firm. Along with his role as Senior Fellow at Harvard, visiting professor at Kings College London and advisor to U2 frontman Bono that makes 4 jobs. He must be good at multi tasking or is that multi trousering. He’ll hardly be able to walk for his bulging pooches.

    289. The Isolator says:

      Methinks Ms McGarry may just be being put up as a conduit to the flack coming our way in the pit that is Westminster.

      Unfortunately for her I also happen to think she is being flung under the proverbial bus by the party.Signal jammer as they say in the good ole US of A.

    290. Ken500 says:

      Douglas Alexander supported an illegal war, banking fraud, and tax evasion. He left the UK in 1.5Trillion in debt, with the most vulnerable suffering. Bono is a tax evading Non Dom. Douglas Alexander was party to causing the worse migrant crisis since 11WW. The Chilcot Report is being covered up.

    291. Capella says:

      @ Legerwood
      I think he must be referring to this:

      “4. Permitted development
      Permitted development means that if your farm is 5 hectares or more, you have the right to:

      erect, extend or alter a building
      carry out excavations and engineering operations needed for agricultural purposes – though you may still require approval for certain details of the development.
      The types of permitted development include:

      temporary uses of land
      agricultural buildings below a certain size
      forestry buildings
      caravan sites and related buildings in some circumstances
      Check with your local planning authority (or local area planning office in Northern Ireland) before making use of permitted development rights to make sure your development won’t need planning permission.

      The Agricultural Document Library (ADLib) has policy planning guidance on permitted development and farms.”

    292. ScottishPsyche says:

      I think Natalie responds emotionally without thinking. She has had a lot of flack but needs to take more than a moment now to think before she tweets.

      A period of quiet reflection would be advised. The new MP excuse cannot be used and she knows how both social media and MSM work. Slab will never forgive her for Curran’s defeat and so are looking for any excuse which she is giving them in buckets. There is a lot of nasty Loyalist stirring going on.

      What with the ‘Old/New Firm’ derby to look forward to, it is like we are moving backwards in time and it is not good. Looks like Slab are going to be playing the Sectarian card and the OBFA will be high on the agenda for May.

      “A plague o’ both your houses…”

    293. Lenny Hartley says:

      O/T just read this on Hamish Henderson, makes sense to me, mind you I have been trying to read “The Prison Notebooks” on Gramsci for a couple of years and it’s above my level of understanding 🙂

      Visited Gramsci’s grave in Rome a couple of years ago, gave him a blast of The Laggan playing Bandeira Rossa, I’m sure he enjoyed it. the American curator could not believe that two Scots had travelled to Rome to pay homage, he thought we were there to see Shelley and Keats.

      I got free flights buying a printer so Rome was chosen to go bad Gramsci’s grave.

    294. Lenny Hartley says:

      How can predictive text change visit to bad? As above I typed visit Gramsci’s grave and it changed to bad Gramsci !

    295. galamcennalath says:

      Tam Jardine says:

      An excellent ripping to shred of Scotland in Union. If that is mainstream Yoony thinking, then they are out of touch with even a big chunk of NO voters!

      “… focus the debate on how we best use the powers Holyrood has, rather than forever debating how to acquire new powers. … translation- the process of devolution should be considered over regardless of the opinions of the people of Scotland even if only a tiny fraction agree with this.”

      Two thirds of Scots have wanted, as a minimum, DevoMax levels of powers for at least 5 years. Soon, apparently, we are to be given the powers from Calman (almost a decade ago). Then in a year or two we will get SmithLite as the latest Scotland Bill. Still we will be nowhere near DevoMax.

      The truth is, of course, Scots want to move forward while WM and their representative in Holyrood want to freeze or reverse. They seem to be trying to redefine DevoMax as the Maximum Devolution WM will allow!

      As you say, “only a tiny fraction agree”, so the Yoons are just wishful thinking.

      The key is to get a solid majority realising its Indy, or DevoNotMuch.

    296. liz says:

      O/T Blair McD is on twitter wetting himself with excitement as it looks as though this years Scottish GERS will be bad news.

      Of course those of us better informed were expecting this due to the negative impact from austerity cuts, jobs being moved south, failure to invest in renewables, lack of control over economic levers etc etc

    297. Ghillie says:

      Tam Jardine @5.27 WELL SAID!!

      They are actually fully bonkers!

    298. ScottishPsyche says:


      They will be delirious with schadenfreude. They cannot contain themselves awaiting the graphs that will show us what would have happened. We would be plummeting into the fiery depths of hell, black hole of debt, lining up with our begging bowl to the IMF, and so on…

      And of course George Osborne is doing such a good job, broad shoulders, pooling and sharing, long-term economic plan…

    299. K1 says:

      Ghillie that’s why I’m calling them the ‘Yoonatic Fringe’ Because they are not speaking for mainstream politics in Scotland, they do not represent public opinion in Scotland, they do not represent Scotland at all.

    300. Capella says:

      @ Legerwood
      Scottish planning consent for farm building is the same as in England. For farming and forestry most developments have “deemed consent”. There are a few exemptions such as the size of building, distance from a trunk road or industrial farming likely to produce masses of slurry.

      “9. The use of land for agriculture or forestry does not constitute development, as defined by the Town and Country Planning (Scotland) Act 1972. However building, excavation and engineering works, in connection with such uses is
      classified as development, although in most cases planning permission is deemed to be granted under the provisions of the 1992 Permitted Development Order.”

    301. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Lenny Hartley.

      I’ve been playing that track, from the album, for years, at appropriate gigs.

    302. Gary45% says:

      Dr Jim@4.35
      K wi an e fae the valleys and G. Rubberheid.
      EBC quality!?!?
      Just listened to Boris on the I player (lunch time news).
      Does anyone else think,if he was anywhere else in the UK, the media would have chased him from politics years ago.
      The man is a moron and complete embarrassment.
      If this is quality London politics the UK is Fuc*ed, (we already know it is)


    303. Molly says:

      If you look at Natalie Mcgarrys Twitter page, under her picture it clearly states – personal account.

      The fact someone was on Twitter yesterday retweeting and trying to make yet another mountain out of a mole hill seems to have worked (and NG should know that.)

      I should be surprised that a professional like John Mackay actually read this story out on STV , giving some easy free publicity to some group , but somehow I’m not.

      Yes maybe Natalie Mcgarry should think twice before pressing the tweet button and check her facts but is it really news?

      What or who Scotland in Union anyway?

      Judging by the blurb it’s a non party movement which unites people around a positive view of Scotland in the UK , and assists them in taking action.

      Well two things
      1. I was always taught never to put a comma before and
      2. They have a funny definition of ‘ unite’.

      A book event they held in Glasgow has Archie McPherson , Prof Tom Gallacher and Professor Jill Stevenson in support. Not really going for the young opinions then or the left or the Yes support or the 45% or the don’t knows or the …

    304. Dr Jim says:

      Funny how this Scotland in Yoonion guy used the exact same words as Jakey Rollout when referring to Natalie McGarry

      I don’t know what went on but as soon as this guy opened his mouth a whole lot became crystal clear in half a dozen words

      Looks like another job for Harvey Keitel nudge nudge

    305. Phronesis says:

      The dynamics of UKOK politics are being brought into the spotlight via the majority of SNP MPs- isn’t it illuminating to see how asymmetric this union is – Scotland wasn’t supposed to find out how subversive UKOK is in its approach to Scottish and has stymied anything that would benefit Scotland (indeed anything north of the Watford Gap).

      Scotland has had decades of its own subservient politicians happy to agree to any UKOK agenda e.g.the buried McCrone report, illegal wars, tax avoidance, the mismanagement of our oil wealth (for the whole of the UK), dismantling the state, zombie economic policies with Scotland a mere footnote on the page of UKOK history-the list goes on and on- quite a repertoire for the arguments for Indy 2.

      It is very simple and very logical- vote for our party of independence and we will no longer be tied to an unhealthy, unequal, bloated political system that will inevitably involute on itself.

    306. Tackety Beets says:

      Sorry not read the thread , just jumped on to vent a bit .

      So according to BBC Oor Wullie wears Tackety Boots ? Eh Faa says aat?

      So remind what day is it today , a yes we have the “Scotswoman” rag printed …. It’s International Woman’s Day and our “misreporting Scotland” fails to mention that Kim Little, considered to be one of the worlds top Ladies Footballer is back in the YooK .

      She is in Falkirk tonight playing for Scotland’s Ladies Football team playing Spain LFC , an International football match.

      Do we need a Scottish 6 ?
      FFS just remembered forgot to buy the National to read Cosgroves spiel, dammmmit .

    307. Craig P says:

      Molly says:

      “A book event they held in Glasgow has Archie McPherson , Prof Tom Gallacher and Professor Jill Stevenson in support.”

      Woof, miaow, and barking at the moon!

    308. Giving Goose says:

      I have no idea what discipline is applied to being a member of the SNP, an SNP MP or an SNP MP (whip removed), but someone has to get a grip on Natalie McGarry.

      I am sure that Natalie does masses of good work on behalf of the Yes movement and we can shake our heads at the trivia of the Twitterings that she has entered into, but if the headlines that she has inadvertently supplied to our enemies in the MSM cost the Yes movement just one vote, then that is one vote to many IMHO.

      Natalie McGarry, for f***s sake; stop using social media for ill considered posts and start getting real. It might not matter much to you, but we have a country to win back, so for the love of (insert appropriate swear word of your choice) quit Twitter now!

      Natalie, it would appear, has neither the insight, nor the common sense to participate on social media and she should be put on some sort of probation and double quick.

      It may be trivial, as I suggested, but it all matter in the long term.

      If there is someone from the SNP/Yes movement reading this who has influence, will you please do something about Natalie McGarry. Get her back under control.

      Now I may have pissed some people off, but I fell that someone has to say something! I just did.

    309. ArtyHetty says:


      Yes, in answer to your question. My dad always said that the yookay would end being a ‘little America’, bless his lovely true and decent socialist soul. (he swore never to vote labour again after he saw what Blair was like).

      Looks like he was right.

    310. heedtracker says:

      Now I may have pissed some people off, but I fell that someone has to say something! I just did.

      Its a tweet, one tweet. And she’s still up at 3.00am, the strumpet. If you’re enraged by this tweet, from this MP, your heads up your arse, or you’re a yoon.

    311. ScottishPsyche says:


      This has become so clear recently. Did Slab ever vote against the LibCon coalition? Did they ever single out any policies which did not benefit Scotland if it went against the UKLab Party? Was it always for the good of the UK (whatever their idea of the UK is – it is not an equal union) no matter what?

      What were they doing all those years? Certainly not representing us. Party first, electorate second and always will be.

      That SNP have shown up the myth that Westminster is a UK parliament. That seems to be the strongest argument yet for Indyref2 – that we can never be allowed a voice in this mismatched drain on our past, present and future.

    312. Ruby says:

      Did anyone listen to the Jeremy Vine show today? I just heard a few snippets he discussed nuclear power.

      Here’s a link for anyone who has the time to listen

      starts around 1:10:45

    313. galamcennalath says:

      @ crazycat
      @ Molly

      The Oxford comma does no harm, and can often make text easier to understand, clarify meaning, and separate phrases in a list 😉

    314. Tam Jardine says:

      Giving Goose

      I’m not sure the SNP hierarchy can take further action against someone who has resigned the whip and been suspended from the party? What do you propose- a half nelson?

      Do you really think a stupid mistake on twitter should lead to her expulsion from the party? And do you really think no-one is having a quiet word?

      She apologised for her mistake. Lets not wallow in this- the yoons will dine out on this for weeks. I put together a thoughtful long post above going the full cybernat to remind folk what the organisation in question is all about. Not sure if I didn’t waste my time.

      Natalie fought hard in the indyref, she fought hard to win in May last year and I have no doubt she is a good constituency MP. She made a mistake. The dude she made a false claim about is fighting against democracy and throwing his weight and money behind us all giving up, going home and behaving like good little colonials. Only 2 sides in this- I’m on hers.

    315. Giving Goose says:


      Hardley a Yoon. And my heads not up my arse either.

      But McGarry is almost effortlessly getting herself on the MSM pages for all the wrong reasons. Nothing wrong with being pissed off with that.

      Its bad enough that the MSM will make up anti SNP/Yes stories to publish, but they shouldn’t have it made any easier for them.

      Get off Twitter Natalie, morning, noon and night, for f***s sake!

      We have a country to win back.

    316. Molly says:

      Thanks crazycat, Galamcennalath,

    317. crazycat says:

      @ Molly and Galamcennalath

      I was brought up to use the Oxford comma, long before I knew that was its name, and now a list without one looks wrong. But of course people taught that it is wrong won’t feel like that.

      As a fan of punctuation (I particularly like the interrobang, I think it eases understanding, but there does seem to be a trend towards leaving it out, which brings out the old fogey in me.

    318. Dr Jim says:

      Have you taken a look at these SIU people including Kim Jong Davidson, Willie Stan Laural Rennie, James Kelly and a host of other Better Togetherers and various hanger on Zoomers

      This is a collection of Yoondoms cream of NutJobs
      All they’re missing are uniforms

      Maybe Miss McGarry’s sacrificing herself to draw attention to something the Media won’t report which is the rise of something really unpleasant, this lot looks worse than the BNP

    319. Giving Goose says:

      Tam Jardine

      I’m not advocating expulsion.

      And you’re correct – the Yoons will be dining out. And drinking her health.

      But think about this. Would you allow someone who can’t drive a car to give you a taxi ride along a busy motorway?

      Of course you wouldn’t. But Natalie’s behind her Twitter wheel and an Independent Scotland is several stops along the road.

      Allow her to continue driving and she’ll be running off the road.

      It’s horses for courses and when it comes to Twitter then my money is not on Natalie.

      Every SNP bad headline is (at least) one current No voter not crossing to Yes. The MSM is still influential and every vote counts. Scotland is to important.

      #natalieofftwitter (or whatever it is you’re supposed to hashtag)

    320. Capella says:

      I’ve just had a look at Natalie McGarry’s twitterings. All looks very laudable to me. Why should she shut her mouth, get off twitter, get to bed early etc etc?

      Being detained by Turkish check point guards for recording shelling on her phone seems rather heroic to me. At least it would have been had she been a male MP.

      Turkey is in NATO and has just closed down a national newspaper and arrested journalists for criticising Erdogan’s attacks on the Kurds.

    321. heedtracker says:

      Giving Goose says:
      8 March, 2016 at 9:11 pm

      Hardley a Yoon. And my heads not up my arse either.

      It is but so what. She’s a great MP, she’s the generation that will win Scotland’s independence. A couple of slip up tweets is neither here nor there. The dude all over yoon media land threatening her is only to the good for Scottish democracy, just like that anti Scotland grotesque Rowling.

      So stop telling people to shut up.

    322. Thepnr says:

      Compare the damage done to Kezia Dugdales credibility by this article with Natilie McGarys inopertune tweet.

      Guess though what you will most hear and read about? That’s what bugs me most, the general public are not given the whole picture and the opportunity to make comparisons.

      Knowing you will not be treated fairly by the media should give any Scottish MP or MSP pause for thought before giving their own opinion on social media where every slip will be multiplied a thousandfold.

      When are going to see Foulkes, Smarts or Spammers tweets reported on. Never, it’s all a pile of dung anyway.

      Tweets are NOT news goes a break.

    323. Bob Mack says:

      Scotland in Union is an umbrella organisation including such notables as Mr Skinner.

      He is the guy who toured round Perth soliciting voters of his own Party ( Labour) to vote Tory to keep the SNP out. He is not at all amiable. I believe Effie Dean’s is also involved.

      As for Natalie? Foolish ,but I do not care much for this organisation at all,and care little if she offends them. Perhaps if you see some of the contributions to the worthies of this site from their supporters on twitter I am sure you would see typical Yoonery in any event.

    324. The proven liar and disgraced human being Alistair Carmichael gets on his hind legs in the whorehouse of all parliaments and calls for an alternative way to `handle` the refugee crisis,

      how about stop bombing the f#ck out of families homes in Syria,

      what parent would not protect their young and flee to a safer place,

      Alistair voted for Bombing Syria,

      how about looking in the mirror Alistair when you ask for ways to stop the refugee crisis.

    325. Capella says:

      RT reports on Turkish crack down on the press.

      Natalie is opposed to Turkey’s attacks on the Kurds. This tweet is about speaking at a rally in protest of the war on the Kurds but also about Breaking the Silence. Is the BBC reporting this?

    326. Graeme Doig says:

      Giving Goose @ 7.45

      Agree with much of what you say. Seems to me Natalie needs to be keeping a cooler head or be staying away from her iPad.

      We should be making sure yoondom has to work for its muck.


    327. yesindyref2 says:

      @Giving Goose
      I’m with you on this, she should keep the presonal atttacks off twitter. Here’s what she tweeted in the first place:

      Leading unionist figures do know that ‘Scotland in Union’ is headed by an internet troll and an outed holocaust denier, right?

      She got the wrong guy it seems, she wronged him, if you like, she defamed him. When told this she deleted the tweet and apolgised without apologising at all:

      I’d add however, that you should be careful who is distributing your materials, but apologies etc.

      That’s when the solicitor pushed it further. I would do the same.

    328. Jim says:

      “Named person has also been strongly criticised by the Conservatives, with Prime Minister David Cameron describing it as “absurd”
      You wanted English votes for English laws so kindly fuck off and mind your own business.

    329. galamcennalath says:

      Jim says:

      “David Cameron ….. kindly fuck off and mind your own business.”

      …. if only we could say that on every issue, and for ever more!

      We will be able to way that to WM at some point, but he won’t be PM when the time comes.

    330. Jim says:

      @galamcennalath says:

      …. if only we could say that on every issue, and for ever more!

      We will be able to way that to WM at some point, but he won’t be PM when the time comes.
      God no, Boris or Gideon?

      The paedophiles are getting restless, named person may interfere with their operations.

    331. heedtracker says:

      We should be making sure yoondom has to work for its muck.

      Its makes no odds to yoon hackdom. Civil war rages across Libya and into Tunisia, we have BBC 24 news, r4 radio on at work, never heard it reported once, wonder why?

      Unicef use “refugees” but BBC creeps use “migrants”

      All we hear in depth, UKOK royals on their ski hols.

    332. galamcennalath says:


      Boris I reckon. Which should be worth a few Yes percentage points!

    333. Jim says:


      Killing is not newsworthy unless it is your own getting killed.

    334. Iain More says:

      I was indifferent to the named person policy but now that the BBC and Brit Nat Establishment is squealing SNP BAD over it; Well I have now taken an interest in it. Methinks the kiddy fiddlers doth protest too much!

      If it puts a break on the depraved criminal elements in the Brit Establishment getting their clammy mitts on the kids then I am all for the named person policy.

    335. Jim says:


      Boris I reckon. Which should be worth a few Yes percentage points!
      What a fucking choice eh? The Angel of death or the percieved clown that could really be the most dangerous man in British history

    336. heedtracker says:

      Jim says:
      8 March, 2016 at 11:39 pm

      Killing is not newsworthy unless it is your own getting killed.

      BBC coverage of the middle east and Libya in particular drips with toryboy agenda, propaganda, bias. Its civil war with direct involved throughout but silence from BBC gits, mass future PM Bojo coverage, royals go skiing, clean for queen, doping in the tennis.

    337. Jim says:

      @Iain More

      I was indifferent to the named person policy but now that the BBC and Brit Nat Establishment is squealing SNP BAD over it; Well I have now taken an interest in it. Methinks the kiddy fiddlers doth protest too much!

      If it puts a break on the depraved criminal elements in the Brit Establishment getting their clammy mitts on the kids then I am all for the named person policy.
      If you put obstacles in the way of paedophiles then expect them to protest loudly. FFS, they could have this law repealed in the UK Supreme Court because it has the power to overrule the Scottish government apparently.

      The paedos are getting restless.

    338. Ken500 says:

      @ Telegraph

      Ken Clarke failed to act on child abuse by Cyril Smith and Janner

      That’s why you need a name person to co-ordinate and prevent child abuse, cruelty or death. A cover up or inaction by authorities/agencies who should be protecting children but fail.

    339. Jim says:

      BBC coverage of the middle east and Libya in particular drips with toryboy agenda, propaganda, bias. Its civil war with direct involved throughout but silence from BBC gits, mass future PM Bojo coverage, royals go skiing, clean for queen, doping in the tennis.
      I can only quote Frankie Boyle, “Look at the shiny shiny”.

    340. frogesque says:

      @Iain More 11.41.

      My only concern about the Named Person is what could happen in the future if there were a change in government. I trust the SNP to do right by our children and if it prevents any abuse I’m all for it.

      Just suppose though, for one horrific second, that an extremist party were to use the legislation for political ends against parents or teachers. “Has your parents or teacher ever said anything against your leaders or in support of a proscribed organisation such as the SNP?”

      Thin end, thick wedge. There needs to be cast iron safeguards built in otherwise there could be unintended consequences.

    341. Ken500 says:

      @ Trlegraph

      Child abuse is covered up by politicians

      That’s why a named person is required

    342. heedtracker says:

      I can only quote Frankie Boyle, “Look at the shiny shiny”.

      They are over seriously over doing it with future PM Bojo. They did it with Farage and look where its ended up, Brexit, chances of.

      Jim Naughty pumped that UKIP MEP directly in to Scotland with the BBC in Scotland, cant mind his name Coburn but that was to break up referendum voting, which it may have done a bit.

      Its all probably upper class twits in the Beeb, sabre rattling at the upper class twits in Whitehall, mess with us, we mess with you.

      Meanwhile, same upper class creeps have their nukes dumped next to Glasgow and then poison everyone working on them. Rule Bojo’s Britannia.

    343. call me dave says:

      Some news from labour land I missed earlier.

    344. Fred says:

      Giving Goose is correct, Natalie McGarry is my MP, maybe it suits her to be a loose canon & outwith the control of the whip but that’s not what I voted for & no longer have an SNP MP. She would be better advised in getting her name cleared & back into the party this farce has dragged on for too long.

    345. Still Positive. says:

      Named Person: to all of you who are concerned.

      I am a retired English teacher and what is incumbent in teachers in Scotland is to report any worries you have about a particular child to whoever is charged with Child Protection in your particular school. Every year I was teaching we had part of one of the INSET days in August reminding us of our responsibilities to the pupils.

      The last case I had was a boy in my S6 class whose mum had died of breast cancer 2 years earlier. He was the eldest of 4 siblings and had been responsible for getting the others out to school while his dad was at work and coping with his grief.

      He had not been turning up for classes and was behind with essays and I was giving him a hard time when he did turn up.

      One day he asked if he could talk to me and it turned out his mother’s death had just hit him as his father was feeling and coping much better.

      As a widow I knew that his feelings were normal and I asked, and was given, his permission to pass the info onto Pastoral Care/Guidance so they could refer him to Bereavement Counselling.

      That is what the named person act is about – co-ordinating all agencies for young people.

      Sorry for such a long post.

      SNP X 2 and EU Remain.

    346. Molly says:


      A private company ? Nooo , next you’ll be telling me the SOS and Ruth Davidson signed up to their Charter.

      Oh what a tangled web we weave…

    347. yesindyref2 says:

      OT (but bear with me)

      Dug out a PC game over the weekend that I bought 3 years ago (£4.54 from Sold Out Software) – Railroad Tycoon 3, playing the map of Britain. You transport resources to places that want to buy them, by building the rail and the stations, and buying the (cheap) trains. And passengers and mail. Starting in 1829.

      First time I played it 3 years ago the best to start for resources was Manchester to Birimingham, Gloucester, Bath etc, then get to London. You just get a handful of houses, a couple of industries or a coal or iron mine, that sort of thing, seeded to start with. You can buy 3 sizes of stations with different catchment areas, pay for track, bridges, tunnels if you can afford them. Trains are dirt cheap, engines get better and faster in later years.

      This time I did Scotland only, less resources in the game so harder to get going, and not easy to find flat routes. Did Glasgow to Edinburgh, then Dundee, expensive to get to but it got and gave a lot of traffic. Added Aberdeen and Ayr and a couple of other places for grain and coal, got it stable (all big stations) and let it run for 50 years. All the towns grew a lot, loads more houses, new industries. By 1879 Scotland was thriving, trains running around all over the place. I was worth $80 milion.

      But then I looked at England where I hadn’t built rail (I took pity on Newcastle and Middlesborough), and London, Manchester, Leeds and the others are still just the 3 or 4 houses as they were to start with. Villages!

      Just goes to show how communications like trains grow towns – and populations and prosperity. It would be the same for roads, air routes, and ‘tinternet. I guess we’re lucky the Victorians liked to visit Scotland or we’d still be on Shanks Pony. Apart from the roads General Wade brought to keep us suppressed of course.

    348. Ken500 says:

      People in Scotland can’t stop the use of fracked Gas. Westminster is importing it, from the US. It is coming through the pipes. Westminster policies taxing the Scottish Oil sector 60/80% when the price of Oil has fallen 75%. Osbourne has destroyed the Scottish Oil sector, since 2011, (deliberately?) Losing thousands of jobs and revenues. Scottish consumers could be using fracked Gas from elsewhere, while being denied the right to produce it’s own resources by Westminster policies. Losing the Scottish economy £Billions of revenues.

      Westminster has stopped coal/steel production in the UK. Banned onshore wind turbines in England. Cut investment in solar.

      Scotland is half empty. There will be places where it is safe to frack.

      The HS2 is a total waste of money and will have a detrimental effect on the UK economy. Hinkley Nuclear Power station is an unaffordable disaster waiting to happen.

      Djokovic is taking drugs.

      Natalie McGarry is a hero, calling out the lying hypocrites.

    349. Capella says:

      @ orri 11.39 Good link. I see that Mr Cameron is also a director of iconically named Britscot Ltd which is registered in Surrey. Gets about.

    350. Orri says:

      If the named person legislation is struck down can we expect the next time there’s a press uproar about some kids being abused despite so many public employees being involved for them to hold their hands up and admit to at least some of the blame?

      This was never about apointing a “State Guardian”. It was always about what it says on the tin, nominating one of the many people already in contact as official can carrier. Perhaps Cameron would be advised to butt out given his party’s connections to a certain JC.

    351. heedtracker says:

      Scotland is half empty.

      But we did just get a mention there on Nick Robinson BBC r4 news, one line, “Aberdeen beat Partick 2-1 but still 1 point behind Celtic who have a game in hand”

      Airbrushing of Scotland out of the UK by UKOK media farts along. Oh wait, announces the SNP are “disappointing hypocrites,” says nice BBC man.

      Nick Robinson sounds like he’s about to pass out.

    352. Orri says:

      Was more intereted in who McGarry meant by calling a troll. The name Andrew Skinner might be familiar as someone who’s idea of tactical voting in the GE consisted of, mostly, voting Tory.

    353. heedtracker says:

      “If UK votes Brexit, its the end of the UK with Scotland voting independence, the queen knows that”

      We got another BBC mention on r4, Sir Edward Somebody, Project Fearing the Queen, who had “bust up” at a Palace do with Nick Clegg 2012, and Scotland will leave says Sir Ed. Comedy on BBC r4.

      Nick Robinson gasps for water, water, handed oxygen mask, British oxygen!

    354. @heedtracker
      8 March, 2016 at 2:01 pm

      I am not piling in on Natalie McGarry, I just wish she would sense and bloody well get off twitter and concentrate on helping her constituents.

      Because all she’s doing with these damn tweets is helping the unionists and their media deflect attention from the Westminster Tory cuts that are badly affecting many scots and have seen people driven to commit suicide.

    355. Fred says:

      The McGarry business does no favours to campaigners here hoping to unseat Paul Martin the baron Springburn’s son. This fiasco could save his seat & the SNP candidate has his work cut out

    356. Andrew Mclean says:


      You know you have a fight anyway, given the absolute tirade of pish from the unionist press.

      I am sure someone from the party has reiterated the fact to our MP;s that every post every statement every action is being analysed by people who see them as enemy’s of the state and as such are to be destroyed politically and personally.

      A good tip, when a elected to the legislature you are no longer a fringe activist so stop acting like one. and if you have no political acumen ask every time you want to tweet, and as a lawyer you know better than to accuse someone, whither at 3 am you were sober or not.

      Regardless of any of the above YOU HAVE NO PRIVATE TWEETS!

    357. Petra says:

      Natalie McGarry is still under investigation re. the Women for Independence saga. You would think if for no other reason she would keep her head down until she clears her name.

      Nicola Sturgeon is working her butt off to win hands down in May and no doubt has 1001 issues to deal with. The last thing she needs is N McGarry on the news and on the front page of newspapers every day: Losing us vote after vote.

      It’s high time she made her mind up. Is she going to be a ‘paid’ politician and represent her constituents or be an ‘unpaid’ one (wo) man botch-up, online crusader? Or is the term ‘crusader’ being too kind? Is she just one of the millions of commonplace Twatters on Twitter?

      I also wonder what her No voting fiance, David Meikle GCC Tory counciller, makes of it all?

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