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The secretary of the playground

Posted on February 25, 2019 by

In today’s Times:

Yeah, you read it right. He really said it out loud.

The article also contains some chilling forecasts about the impact of a no-deal Brexit, including unemployment in Scotland more than DOUBLING (it’s currently 96,000):

But apparently the Secretary of State for Scotland is perfectly happy with refusing to try to avert such a scenario just in case it might let the SNP score a political point. It genuinely appears not to have even occurred to him that a good way to combat the SNP might be to be seen to be standing up for Scotland in the face of a Westminster-created catastrophe, rather than just whining petulantly about them.

But just look at us, expecting some semblance of intelligence or integrity from David Mundell, or any Scottish Tory.

When will we learn, eh readers?

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    1. 25 02 19 11:56

      The secretary of the playground | speymouth

    258 to “The secretary of the playground”

    1. defo says:

      Secretary of State against Scotland right enough!

    2. ScotsRenewables says:

      Possibly the most hated man in Scotland

    3. Arbroath1320 says:

      Ah … Scruffy Fluffy Mundell, Mrs. “Three coats” Feartie May’s wee tea boy (Junior Grade) confirms, yet again, should anyone have missed his previous attempts to ingratiate himself with his boss that he does indeed desperately want a cloak of ermine!

      This absolute plonker of a bad excuse of a politician will do ANYTHING, say ANYTHING just to keep his grubby little paws on the extra cash he gets as the Secretary of State for Westminster.

    4. There is a song with that comment in it “When will we ever learn….”

    5. I don’t hate many people, but him, I detest.

    6. Luigi says:

      The Scottish tories’ reluctance to speak up for Scotland, speaks volumes about their weakness of character and their utter dread of independence and hatred of the SNP, but hey we knew that already, right?

      Many Tory politicians are of weak character, so the bar is fairly low.

      However, has their ever been such a spineless, jelly-hearted wee spite of a Scottish secretary as David Mundell?

    7. Tammytroot says:

      Has he no resigned yet?
      Westminster’s Secretary of State agin Scotland.

    8. Robert Peffers says:

      Oh! We learned long ago. The real question is when are we going to do something about it?

      It needs great patience and an iron resolve to get the time right but we must get it right.

    9. Clootie says:

      Focus on the monkey grinder naw the monkey!

    10. galamcennalath says:

      We see Brexit’s potential to inflict economic damage on Scotland as an opportunity to further the cause of independence.

      A skeptic might consider the possibility that Tories want Brexit to inflict economic damage on Scotland to make it less viable and appear more dependent.

      Tories never have Scotland’s interests foremost. Draw your own conclusions about Mundell’s underlying motives.

    11. Clootie says:

      Obviously organ grinder but yae kent whit a meant

    12. mountain shadow says:

      Well, I would say the majority on here have learned, unfortunately, the one person who appears happy with this continued fiasco is the First Minister, who continues to sit on her hands.

    13. ronnie anderson says:

      Mundell’s no even the Tea boy ( junior grade ) he’s Tereza’s potty warmer .

    14. CameronB Brodie says:

      Scotland deserves a working democracy, not English despotism.

      What an odious pustule!

    15. Truth says:

      With a bit of luck it will be him unemployed in the not too distant future.

    16. manandboy says:

      On the day when The Institute of Directors declares it has lost faith in the Westminster political process, Mundell demonstrates yet again why he is despised in Scotland – but not yet by enough.

    17. From yesterday’s newspapers, David Mundell claims Scots won’t forgive SNP if they don’t back PM’s Brexit plan resulting in no-deal

      He went on to accuse the SNP of being “guilty of pathetic political cowardice” after the Scots Secretary said Nicola Sturgeon was exploiting the situation to help her indy bid

      Its patently obvious his tactic is to exploit of the Tory Brexit shambles by attempting to avoid any responsibility for Brexit, by blaming the SNP, if no deal Brexit occurs.

      The idea that this Tory creep would stand up for Scotland, when was the last time a Tory stood up to defend Scotland’s interests?

    18. Stephen says:

      Unfortunately his hate for the SNP outweighs his love for the people of Scotland. Here I thought MPs got into politics to best serve the people……silly me.

    19. ronnie anderson says:

      Mountain Shadow The majority on here urnae panic merchants but have faith in our FM , the can is in perpetual motion but that road will come to a end Then and only Then Nicola will implement the mandate for IndyRef 2 and then we WIN .

    20. GORDON FORREST says:

      Toom Tabard right enough!

    21. ClanDonald says:

      Remember he promised to get Scotland the same deal as the DUP got for N.Ireland, then suddenly went all quiet when his London masters told him to shut it.

      He only ever pretends to fight for Scotland.

    22. Breeks says:

      Just for perspective, that innocuous wee 7% predicted reduction in GDP?

      The 2008 Credit Crunch which comprehensively destroyed my businesses customer base and consequently damaged my business to the extent that even after a decade it has never recovered, well, that orchestrated criminal catastrophe only delivered a reduction in UK GDP of 2.5%. We went from employing 7 to employing none, and stayed that way.

      Frankly, with a 7% reduction in GDP, and worse for Scotland, in my opinion, losing 100,000 jobs seems, pardon me, a very “conservative” estimate.

      This will mark the end for a whole swathe of Scottish businesses who will have everything they know and thought they could rely upon turned on its head. The damage will be permanent and enduring. People will forfeit their reserves, their homes, their security and pensions trying to save businesses which have simply lost every vestige of buoyancy. The colour is about to drain out of their world.

      If you have a business, sell out now. Get out. Don’t be the niaive optimist I was in 2007. Save what you can. Get your capital out. Brace, brace, brace for impact.

      I know you won’t listen. You’ll think you’ll be lucky, and it will happen to somebody else. But you’ve been warned.

    23. Daisy Walker says:

      He’s loyal to a fault isn’t he. I wonder what his wages are as SSfS, much above his abilities.

      Re Brexit and Terrible May’s latest can kicking.

      The EU is making noises of extending A50 for 2 years, rather than facing a ‘rolling cliff edge’.

      I guess this would be do-able/acceptable to the WM Establishment under TM’s Terrible deal (whereby British courts will be used to adjudicate any trade disputes – not ECJ, with its associated new Tax Haven Laws).

      It seems unlikely it would be do-able under No Deal scenario, as that means the UK will continue trading with them and the UK can do whatever it likes in terms of trade and standards – so no deal means no trade with EU.

      Hmm, so it still comes down to a binary choice for the WM Elite. No Deal or TM shit deal.

      I don’t see, and maybe someone else here does, I don’t see any mechanism for any party at WM to reintroduce the Cancel Brexit option for a vote in WM. That seems to have been quietly dropped.

      The Brexit Coup continues as planned with No Deal the objective all along.

    24. yesindyref2 says:

      He’s our secret weapon.

    25. mogabee says:

      Well there you go. The secretary of solitary swings and roundabouts declines to stand up for Scotland.

      What is he good for folks?

      Yeah, that’s right, absolutely nothin’…

    26. CameronB Brodie says:

      mogabee
      What about a doormat?

    27. Daisy

      I believe the most recent idea gaining traction is for WM to ‘allow’ T May’s deal to pass on the understanding that she promises a second referendum where the choice for the people is ‘Her Deal or Remain’. So that’s a token cancellation strategy.

      However the Labour MP proposing it suggests that in order to facilitate this, the Labour party ABSTAINS on the vote to pass T May’s deal.

      Tempting though it is I cannot see T may agreeing to a 2nd ref. where the choice includes ‘remain’ as an option and I would think that the ERG would consider it too risky when they almost have ‘No Deal’ in the bag.

      By the way, I heard recently someone talking saying that in any referendum the choice should only ever be binary between the status quo and the proposed change so T May’s much vaunted choice between’ leave with her deal or No deal’ could never be put to the people.

      Also, a cancellation can be made with a unilateral decision from the UK whilst an extension requires ratification by each country in the EU

      Seems about the only recent people talking sense ( SNP not included) are Keir Starmer, Tobias Ellwood (although he is died in the wool Tory) and Ken Clarke.

    28. Breeks says:

      I would also add, the 2008 Credit Crunch was a global disaster, so to an extent, the rules changed for everybody. Brexit is a peculiarly “British” phenomenon, and while I have no yardstick to gauge how that will pan out, I don’t see many constructive positives to your business suffering disruption and impoverishment when your competitors don’t.

    29. CameronB Brodie says:

      Contemporary British nationalism is an expansionist form of English nationalism. Contemporary English nationalism is populist and xenophobic in nature. More on the “sterile nationalism” that threatens Scotland’s integrity as a nation.

      The toxicity of discourse: reflections on UK political culture following the EU Referendum

      The EU Referendum campaign has been widely criticised as one of the most divisive, ugly and corrosive campaigns in modern British history, the (unintended) consequences of which promise to shape political culture in the UK for some time to come.

      On the morning of 24 June, once victory had been achieved, Michael Gove characterised the Referendum as being about ‘one big question: should we leave the political structures of the European Union?’ His deliberately narrow formulation here presents a sterile reduction of the vote, one which denies the complex emotions, mythologies and contradictions at play during this decisive moment in political culture and history. Gove’s stripped-down ‘question’ prompted a personal reflection for me on how, in fact, the campaign had been steeped in political discourse designed to appeal to feelings of national identity and values, brimming with intangible promises of sovereignty, freedom and control. This was anything but a simple question concerning political structures….

      https://www.referendumanalysis.eu/eu-referendum-analysis-2016/section-5-campaign-and-political-communication/the-toxicity-of-discourse-reflections-on-uk-political-culture-following-the-eu-referendum/

    30. galamcennalath says:

      Breeks says:

      The 2008 Credit Crunch …. only delivered a reduction in UK GDP of 2.5%

      Another way to look at what we face is that a ‘good Brexit’ will have a similar impact as the 2008 event. That is the ‘best’ Brexit Scotland can expect.

      Lives will be ruined across Scotland in the name of far right ideology and English nationalism.

    31. Movy says:

      Maybe like Ross Thomson, Fluffy (that’s actually now too cuddly a name for such a dishonourable individual) is now an SNP Gain? His latest photo op in front of the saltire was dire, given his ongoing role in jacking Scotland the Brand, for example at the Royal Highland Show in Edinburgh and at that session held in Stirling Castle with Fox. So much for ‘promoting and protecting the devolution settlement’. I truly despise him.

    32. Daisy Walker says:

      @
      Meg merrilees says:

      Seems like the only people talking sense…

      I’d add the fella Lemmy to your list – first time in a long time I’ve heard a Labour MP speak out the truth and lay it out in a clear way, in direct defiance of the party orders.

      If WM allows TM’s deal with a promise attached for a PV, the English public are going to find out first hand what a VOW feels like.

      But for us, it would muddy the waters, wouldn’t it. Brexit (in one damaging form or another) will have been delivered and there would be the distraction of a some time in the near future PV (and the SNP’s position on it) to keep us all entertained.

      The arguments that the SNP should not be entertaining any thoughts of an IndyRef2, when a PV is on the table will come hard and fast from all Unionist Quarters. Kirsty Hughes will already have an article written on it. Hmmm.

    33. SilverDarling says:

      Politics is very easy if you are a unionist. Essentially all you do is oppose the SNP, no thinking required. The potential damage is irrelevant. Just oppose the SNP no matter what, even if it was your manifesto, even if it is your founding principle.

      If the SNP propose it, you must oppose it.

    34. HandandShrimp says:

      Don’t think Fluffy is ever going to be accused of being a political giant of our times. Ineffectual is perhaps too kind.

    35. Macart says:

      @yesindyref2

      He’s certainly weapons grade right enough. 😎

    36. Hamish100 says:

      mountain shadow says:
      25 February, 2019 at 10:39 am
      Well, I would say the majority on here have learned, unfortunately, the one person who appears happy with this continued fiasco is the First Minister, who continues to sit on her hands.

      Yeh yeh yeh — we believe you Jackson!!

    37. jfngw says:

      Soon to be Lord Fluffy of Dumfries, joining his other esteemed Scottish patriots, Lord Reid, Lord Darling & Lord Robertson.

      How they would like an SNP Lord, it would be the propaganda coup the MSM journalists (we really need a new word for these as journalist is a bit flattering for the press release repeaters) are screaming for.

    38. Scott says:

      Just asking how did this go.

      Scottish Labour
      ?

      @scottishlabour
      Follow Follow @scottishlabour
      More
      On Saturday 23rd of February we’re taking to the streets to fight for our NHS and stand up for its future. Why don’t you join us

    39. Gordon bradley says:

      I strongly suspected that the entire purpose is to engineer a bitter irrevocable split from our home continent, the biggest trading bloc in the world, and force us defenceless into the jaws of the United Corporations of America. we’ll be torn to pieces. Fox’s ” Atlantic bridge” plot and Davis’s collusion with American agricultural groups have cemented this into a conviction !

    40. Bobp says:

      Re the Brexit fiasco, what I found out talking to people down here in the south west. Most people who had passports and had travelled abroad tended to have voted remain. Those who didn’t have passports but yearned for a shiny blue brit one had tended to vote for Brexit. They’ll probably take pride of place (never be used though) in their display cabinets.

    41. CameronB Brodie says:

      Brexit is an expression of English nationalist resentment. It is neither rational nor ethical. Contemporary English nationalism is xenophobic in nature, so does not consider the “Other” as being equal, nor their culture. The Secretary of State for Scotland is an English nationalist dolt.

      Getting our country back. The UK press on the eve of the EU referendum.
      The discourse of ellipsis over immigration and the challenging of the British collective memory over Europe.

      Dr Paul Rowinski. University of Bedfordshire.

      Abstract (edited).
      This paper investigates a critical discourse analysis the author has conducted of UK mainstream newspaper coverage on the eve of the EU referendum. Immigration became a key issue in the closing days. The paper will explore the possibility that the discourse moved from persuasion to prejudice and xenophobia.

      The paper will also argue that in the age of populist post-truth politics, some of the newspapers also employed such emotive rhetoric, designed to influence and compel the audience to draw certain conclusions – to get their country back. In so doing, it is argued some of the UK media also pose a serious threat to democracy and journalism – rather than holding those in power to account and maintaining high journalistic standards.

      The notion that that some of the UK media played on public perceptions and a collective memory that has created, propagated and embedded many myths about the EU for decades, is explored. The possibility this swayed many – despite limited or a lack of substantiation, is explored, a discourse of ellipsis, if you will.

      https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/89b0/abb12148d42fb82ec9f87a76daeb9fedf84d.pdf

    42. Gordon bradley says:

      I’ve long suspected the entire purpose is to engineer a bitter irrevocable split with our home continent, the most powerful trading bloc on the globe, and force us defenceless into the jaws of the United Corporations of America. We’ll be torn to pieces ! Fox’s ” Atlantic bridge ” scam and Davis’s collusion with American agribusiness have consolidated this into a conviction. Were in for a right kicking ! We can’t lie down and take this ?

    43. Fireproofjim says:

      The ermine coat, which Mundell covets above everything, is made from the coat of a type of weasel. How appropriate.

    44. Effijy says:

      Uno, dos, one, two, tres, quatro
      When May-Zee told Fluffy about a deal she saw
      Had grew two big horns and a wooly jaw
      Wooly bully, wooly bully’ Wooly bully.

      May-Zee told Fluffy, let’s don’t take no chance
      just do as I tell you, learn to jump and dance.
      Wooly bully, Wooly bully,Wooly bully

      May-zee told Fluffy, that’s the thing to do
      Get you someone like Ruthie to pull the wool with you.
      Wooly bully, Wooly bully,Wooly bully.

      May-zee told Scotland you’ll get free Irn Bru,
      Universal Credit, and a Vow Not True.

      He’s Fluffy Wooly Fluffy Wooly, Fluffy Wooly!

    45. galamcennalath says:

      The North British Tory motto …. Better a wasteland than free!

    46. Tomorrow’s headline in the National should read:-

      ‘Mundell admitted that he would let 100,000 Scots lose their jobs, so that he can keep his.’

      I wonder if Gary on GMS would read out that headline on Wednesday’s GMS Newspapers’ review?
      What an incredibly useless man he is.

    47. defo says:

      Scotlands Rimmer. Smeg head extraordinaire.

    48. Petra says:

      O/T

      As David Mundell, Ruth Davidson and their Tory cronies do zilch for Scotland, Nicola Sturgeon is working 24×7 on our behalf. Not been broadcast by the BBC / STV? I wonder why … not?

      ‘Nicola Sturgeon WASPI Women.’

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1lwiYFwsCE

    49. Petra says:

      O/T

      An article by Angus Robertson in the National. Nicola continuing to do the day job … PLUS. And great to see that we still have people like the Scot Dame Mariot Leslie, last UK Ambassador to Nato, onside.

      ”IN these times of global uncertainties it is quite right for Scotland to reach out internationally to make friends and influence people, organisations and other countries. Especially when the UK is inward-looking and sabotaging its international reputation – it’s essential for our partners to know that Scotland is open for business and remains a trusted partner on shared challenges like the environment.

      We can be proud that we have a First Minister and Scottish Government that takes its international obligations seriously, whether that is with fellow European Union nations, our northern European neighbours, countries with important trading ties and also nations like Malawi where we have a historic connection and development responsibilities.

      It is hugely impressive to watch the efforts that have been made to promote trade and commerce, from cutting-edge technology to our hugely successful food and drink sector, our academic institutions, our environmental policy successes, our fantastically rich cultural offering and also celebrating and protecting the contribution of people who have moved to Scotland and the contribution of Scots around the world.

      In the past year First Minister Nicola Sturgeon has been promoting Scotland in China, the United States, Canada, Germany, France and other key countries.

      Since becoming becoming First Minister, she has made sure that important global decision-makers are aware of Scotland’s priorities, including the Secretary General of the United Nations Antonio Guterres, head of the International Monetary Fund Christine Lagarde and leading business figures like Microsoft founder Bill Gates.

      In our near neighbourhood, the links between the home nations are a key priority both bilaterally and multilaterally through the likes of the British-Irish Council and directly with our northern Nordic neighbours.

      Since the 2016 Brexit referendum when Scotland voted to remain in the European Union and our southern neighbours voted to leave, there has been a huge focus on protecting links with our EU friends in the world’s biggest single market.

      Numerous meetings with EU Council president Jean-Claude Juncker, chief negotiator Michel Barnier and other key European decision makers have been held to explain Scotland’s preference to remain in the single market and customs union. They understand that so long as Westminster ignores Scottish wishes, we face the prospect of a damaging Brexit, but that this will have consequences for Scotland’s future.

      This week the respected international affairs journal Foreign Policy is reporting on “Scotland’s Marriage of Inconvenience – As Brexit looms, Edinburgh may forge its own path on the world stage”.

      Nicola Sturgeon told Foreign Policy: “We’re already taking steps to make sure that Brexit doesn’t isolate Scotland and see us turn inward rather than continue to look outward. The expansion of our presence, mainly across Europe but also in the United States and Canada, is all part of that.”

      Retired senior British diplomat Dame Mariot Leslie, who last served as UK ambassador to Nato, said: “I think Scotland’s political culture is very different to the political culture south of the Border. It is still a bastion, an increasingly rare bastion … of the old liberal international order, of multinationalism, interest in international co-operation, a view of solidarity across borders for the greater global good.”

      This is the message that is being reported in the European and foreign policy community. In addition to Foreign Policy this week, it was also one of the world’s most respected and widely reported newspapers Le Monde that featured Scotland’s international situation.

      Under the headline quote “L’Ecosse deviendra un pays indépendant” (Scotland will become an independent country) the paper reported on “La première ministre écossaise” Nicola Sturgeon and her rejection of the damaging Brexit policies of Theresa May.

      This happened in the week that we learned that the cost of a damaging no-deal Brexit to Scotland would potentially amount to a 7% drop in gross domestic product, a 10-20% drop in Scottish exports, net migration turning negative, unemployment rising by 100,000 and a recession starting this year.

      Given these potentially devastating circumstances it is absolutely critical that we have the best possible international relations. If we are to dig ourselves out of this Brexit hole which was not of our making, we need friends across Europe and the wider world.

      Scotland has a fantastic international record considering the constraints of devolution. Imagine how much better things can be with full and unfettered international relations. Scotland has a lot to offer Europe and the wider world.

      The time is coming when we must take up that challenge. Let’s help those who are not yet persuaded about the need for this change.

      The status quo is not acceptable and not sustainable. Let’s give people in Scotland the confidence to take the next step.”

      http://www.thenational.scot/news/17454105.scotland-has-a-lot-to-offer-the-world-the-fms-trips-are-winning-over-nations/

    50. Robert Peffers says:

      @mountain shadow says: 25 February, 2019 at 10:39 am:

      ” … Well, I would say the majority on here have learned, unfortunately, the one person who appears happy with this continued fiasco is the First Minister, who continues to sit on her hands.”

      And you, of course, are so much better informed and better able to judge the situation than the First Minister. and her many advisors.

      Should we all be listening to mountain shadow, Wingers?

      An anonymous commenter who doesn’t even have the honesty to comment under his/her/its own name.

      You are worse than Fluffy – at least he has enough courage to be open and honest about his identity.

    51. Republicofscotland says:

      I think we know deep down inside that Fluffy Mundell is working against Scottish interests. It looks as if Mundell would see Scotland a barren radioactive wasteland, long before he’d agreed with the SNP on anything good for Scots.

    52. Famous15 says:

      Golf course plans at Embo east Sutherland have been called in.

      Embo was a Labour stronghold but they did nothing for local employment so now it is the turn of the SNP to sustain employment for young people in this area. Building the golf course behind the village on Coul Farm would be a boon to east Sutherland tourism. It would offer a series of golf courses starting at the Royal Dornoch to suit all skill and fitness levels .

      It is annoying that locals back it 100% but protest comes from outsiders with bogus claims about “rare” flora a fauna. The golf course would be excellent for the environment. I have however heard bogus arguments that only make sense in arid countries.East Sutherland is not arid!
      .

    53. Robert Peffers says:

      @mogabee says: 25 February, 2019 at 11:26 am:

      … What is he good for folks?”

      Well I suppose he’s good for the occasional, rather hollow, laugh.

    54. Graeme J McAllan says:

      Defo, at least Rimmer was funny, while Sir Fluffy Flufferelington from Fluffington has none of Rimmer’s endearing qualities – leaves a nasty mess/smell like the Cat 🙁

    55. mr thms says:

      Trying to figure out if “No deal” is the bridge that connects these two..

      https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom_invocation_of_Article_50_of_the_Treaty_on_European_Union

      “The assumption is that new agreements will be negotiated during the mandatory two-year period, but there is no legal requirement that agreements have to be made.Some aspects, such as new trade agreements, may be difficult to negotiate until after the UK has formally left the EU.”

      and

      “Separate negotiations of the EU institutions with pro-EU regions [London, Scotland or Northern Ireland] would constitute a violation of the Lisbon Treaty, according to which the integrity of a member country is explicitly put under protection.”

    56. CameronB Brodie says:

      Here’s some neuropsychological analysis of Brexit, a corrupted advisory consultation that annihilates the principles of the Treaty of Union, and which social empowers far-right economics and xenophobia.

      Immigration, political trust, and Brexit – Testing an aversion amplification hypothesis

      Abstract

      A few weeks prior to the EU referendum (23rd June 2016) two broadly representative samples of the electorate were drawn in Kent (the south?east of England, N = 1,001) and Scotland (N = 1,088) for online surveys that measured their trust in politicians, concerns about acceptable levels of immigration, threat from immigration, European identification, and voting intention. We tested an aversion amplification hypothesis that the impact of immigration concerns on threat and identification would be amplified when political trust was low.

      We hypothesized that the effect of aversion amplification on voting intentions would be mediated first by perceived threat from immigration, and then by (dis) identification with Europe. Results in both samples were consistent with this hypothesis and suggest that voters were most likely to reject the political status quo (choose Brexit) when concerns that immigration levels were too high were combined with a low level of trust in politicians.

      Keywords: voting behaviour, immigration, political trust, threat, European identity

      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5900979/

      Why Britain Voted for Brexit:
      An Individual-Level Analysis of the 2016 Referendum Vote

      https://blogs.kent.ac.uk/epop/files/2016/07/Clarke-Goodwin-and-Whiteley.pdf

      The Brexit poll
      https://thepsychologist.bps.org.uk/brexit-poll

    57. starlaw says:

      Fireproof Jim 12;42
      Mundell is not ! a wheasels a wheasel but a Stoat is Stoatally different

    58. frogesque says:

      Cameron Brodie , mogabe

      How’s about “toom semit”, a string vest (© Rab C. Nesbit).

      We can see right through you!

    59. CameronB Brodie says:

      And here’s some social cognitive analysis of the Brexit vote.

      Brexit or Bremain? A person and social analysis of voting decisions in the EU referendum

      Abstract

      The period following the UK’s EU referendum in 2016 foreshadows significant social and political change in the UK. The current research draws on social psychological theories to empirically examine the drivers of voting decisions during the referendum. We report the results of a prospective study using structural equation modelling with data (N = 244) collected just before, and self-reported voting behavior immediately following (N = 197), the EU referendum.

      We employ a person and social approach to examine the additive roles of worldview, conservatism, social identity, and intergroup threat as predictors of voting intentions and behavior. Results showed that person factors (worldview and conservatism) predicted voting intentions through social factors (European identity and realistic threat), and that intentions predicted behavior. The results highlight the importance of addressing threat-based intergroup rhetoric, and the potential of common ingroup identity to mitigate psychological threat.

      https://www.researchgate.net/publication/322315497_Brexit_or_Bremain_A_person_and_social_analysis_of_voting_decisions_in_the_EU_referendum

      Brexit: how cognitive psychology helps us make sense of the vote
      http://theconversation.com/brexit-how-cognitive-psychology-helps-us-make-sense-of-the-vote-95031

      The Brexit poll, part two
      https://thepsychologist.bps.org.uk/brexit-poll-part-two

    60. Daisy Walker says:

      Weasels are wheasilly recognised.

    61. Iain.mhor says:

      Was just thinking that there was a pattern after devolution, of a succession of useless and thoroughly objectionable arseholes in the Office of Secretary of State for Scotland. Prior to that, love or hate them (mostly the latter) they could arguably be said to at least nominally hold Scotland’s corner – if for no other reason than (predominantly Tory) self-interest.

      It’s almost as if the brief of the Office was changed utterly. Other than Michael Moore, who at least exuded an air of honourability (and he was no saint to Scotland) I can think of none who were not invidious characters.
      Is it just me? Or can anyone hold up the character of any recent Scottish Secretaries?

      I do think the brief was specifically altered to undermine Scotland or risk losing her. The irony being it may have accelerated that very process.

    62. jfngw says:

      Ask not what I can do for Scotland, but what Scotland can do for me, I think that is the basis of most SoS’s that I can remember. It is merely seen as a stepping stone for a bigger job at WM, as long as they toe the line. They have all been political carpetbaggers.

    63. Chick McGregor says:

      He has gained more votes for independence by not resigning.

    64. admiral says:

      Look at how the SNP now defines the yoon parties:

      1) Labour – Bain “principle” (sic)
      2) Tories – resignation = Nat win (no resignation also = Nat win, BTW)
      3) Lib Dems – nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, we’re no’ playing unless you do what we want. Oh, that means other people’s budget ideas get accepted.

    65. galamcennalath says:

      Iain.mhor says:

      pattern after devolution …. in the Office of Secretary of State for Scotland.

      Prior to devolution the SoSS was more or less in charge of everything with was handed to Holyrood. For instance, the separate NHSScot was under the SoSS not the Health Minister at WM.

      So the roles before and after are inevitably quite difference.

      The way I look at it is the old role was clearly Scotland’s representative on the cabinet in London, however the post devolution role was London’s representative in Scotland. Folks joke about Mundell being a colonial governor but that’s too damned close to the truth of the matter to be funny anymore.

    66. Tom says:

      Daisy Walker says:
      25 February, 2019 at 2:26 pm
      Weasels are wheasilly recognised.

      But stoats are stoatally different.

    67. Socrates MacSporran says:

      starlaw @ 1.42pm

      Mundell might well be a stoat, but, never, by any stretch of even the most-evered imagination, could he be described as A Stoatir

      A Tube, A Bawbag, An Erse, A Nyaff. A Tollie, A Scunner….. There are many Scottish words which could be applied to him, but, he could never, ever, be A Stoatir.

    68. dakk says:

      Yeah,well I learned a long time ago that the british pigs who are politicians for the unionist parties make their living solely from inflicting harm on Scotland and it’s SNP government to the benefit of their London employers.

      It’s their chosen lucrative career and what they are paid handsomely to do.

      Just as their governor predecessors did similarly to all the other colonies.

      The only small difference is that they are allowed to take a few token seats at the imperial Parliament.

      Sadly it is not only the paid politicians who spend their time looking for an angle to do Scotland and an actual Scottish gov down.

      You can pretty much add all british minded people to that small select group.

      Paid or otherwise.

      That’s certainly one of the unpalatable truths which I have learned from my time on this planet to date.

    69. Alan Crerar says:

      …..soon to become the vermin with the ermine?

    70. Chris Kilby says:

      If and when Indyref2 happens, we need to take a leaf out of the crude-yet-effective Trump/Brexit playbook: a single simple message repeated endlessly. So instead of “Make America Great Again,” or “Take Back Control,” I give you:

      “No More Tory Governments in Scotland Again!”

    71. auld highlander says:

      C.K. @3.32

      NO LONDON GOVERNMENT

    72. Liz g says:

      Chris Kilby @ 3.32
      What about..
      A Scottish Government for a Scottish People!

    73. Ian McCubbin says:

      Totally incompetent shoe box secretary, I make more decisions of value for Scotland as one of 12 directors of Perth Yes Hub

    74. Craig P says:

      Willie Ross: Scottish Secretary. Hated the SNP. Used the threat of the rise of the nats to squeeze concessions out of Westminster, expected any Scots in government departments to stand up for Scotland first, secured Treasury funding for Scotland, then acted as the Chancellor’s attack dog against every other government department.

      Michael Forsyth: Scottish Secretary. Hated the SNP. Used the growing popularity of the Scottish Constitutional Convention to return the Stone of Destiny to Scotland for the first time since the 13th century (bar a short trip in 1950).

      David Mundell: Scottish Secretary. Hates the SNP.

      Beard holds snacks.

    75. Tom Kane says:

      I am really sorry about this… it’s all Alan Crerar’s fault… though there were some belters before that one… you know who you are… 🙂 some stoatirs in there right enough…

      Vermin in ma ermine
      by the bonny banks o clyde
      vermin in ma ermine
      wae sweet Glasgow by my side

      To see the sun go down
      on the independence town
      I’ll keep ma work wae vermins in ma ermine

    76. Muscleguy says:

      It’s too late for him after Nicola retorted to the Tories over their pointless criticism listing Fluffy’s own extensive travels with the zinger that naebody had noticed he was gone.

    77. Referendum1707 says:

      Sorry o/t but this is great. Link taken from last thread and it shows Susan Aitken gettin tore into the britnat scum at GCC. Takes no prisoners and is GREAT to watch and listen.

      https://twitter.com/lumi_1984/status/1099397918476378112

      You know what to do, spread and share far and wide.

    78. sandycraig says:

      Socrates 3.19

      Many years ago an older gentleman, trying to ridicule a younger lad not long started in the job, said to him ” ya wheasel bawed hoor ye “. Bit harsh but very funny at the time. Not kidding.

    79. sandy says:

      Carmichael/ Mundell liargate:-

      When Fluffy was asked time & time again if he knew “the liar” was lying, instead of answering “yes” or “no”, he repeated replied that he had been vindicated by —Who?
      Was this a case of not proven? Was this, in what is becoming all too common, a whitewash? Did they need an obedient teaboy who knew his place & knew who took milk & sugar?

      Somehow, I feel this is just part of the stink that is prevalent in Unionist politics.

    80. sandy says:

      “Repeatedly” Oops.

    81. Legerwood says:

      Liz g says:
      25 February, 2019 at 3:45 pm
      Chris Kilby @ 3.32
      What about..
      A Scottish Government for a Scottish People!””

      Or
      Scotland for Scotland

    82. Abulhaq says:

      Davidson, Mundell and other Unionist lackeys, pray do not tarry in your going, let your exit be swift for there is no place in Scotland for you and your perfidious ilk.

    83. ronnie anderson says:

      O/T.

      UN highest court has said Britain has to stop Administration of the Chagos Islands as rapidly as possible FREEDOM for CHAGOS GARCEA .

      Noo who says Scotland canny gain its FREEDOM from British domination . Britains star is waning on the World stage LoL .

    84. galamcennalath says:

      Craig P says:

      Willie Ross

      Kilmarnock. My first GE vote was 1974 and voted SNP against him. He won massively.

      While not my choice, you are right pointing out he fought Scotland’s corner when it came to finances. Although before my time, I get the impression Tom Johnston acted similarly. Also, much of the now long gone investments like Linwood, Corpach, Bathgate etc came during Tory years so perhaps SoSS under the 1950s Tories actually acted in Scotland’s interests!

      Changed days, for sure.

    85. manandboy says:

      The choice facing Scotland, is either continued exploitation and poverty under Westminster Colonial Rule, or, prosperity and Independence as part of the European Community.

      However that message has to cross a massive propaganda minefield.

      Hail Caesar!

    86. Liz g says:

      Ronnie Anderson @ 4.45
      Great news,I hope the islanders get control of their island soon and dump that US base,or at least charge a very high rent for it.
      Westminster might owe them some back rent too!!

      Ledgerwood @ 4.38
      Aye that’s a good one too.
      I also like… Bring Our Government Home…
      I think we all might be ready to start campaigning 🙂

    87. SilverDarling says:

      OT

      https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-47358602

      ‘The UK should end its control of the Chagos Islands in the Indian Ocean “as rapidly as possible”, the UN’s highest court has said. Mauritius claims it was forced to give up the islands – now a British overseas territory – in 1965 in exchange for independence, which it gained in 1968.’

      This is how dirty the UK plays when trying to hold onto territory.

    88. galamcennalath says:

      Challenge to all BritNats …

      Name one positive thing X has done for Scotland this century?

      Where X is …
      – Mundell
      – Davidson
      – May
      – Corbyn
      – Tory Party
      – Labour Party
      – Westminster
      – UK Government
      – UK
      – Union

      I can’t think of anything, can they?

    89. Petra says:

      O/T

      Four guys, a ladder, a brush and a bucket of wallpaper paste. P*ssed off with Brexit they took to going out in the night in their van and plastering their massive posters on top of the (legal) originals. They found someone who would print off five posters, with different messages, for £400 in total. Problem being however that, more often than not, they would be ripped down the next day.

      Then they set up a crowdfunder which has raised £thousands. Had problems finding companies to help out because they said that it was too “political”, however they persevered and a number of smaller companies have agreed to them using their billboards.

      Known as the “Led by Donkeys Campaign.”

      http://www.creativemoment.co/how-campaign-group-led-by-donkeys-displayed-politicians-crass-tweets-about-brexit

    90. galamcennalath says:

      @Petra

      Led by cuddies

      We need a Scottish equivalent taking the piss out Mundell and Davidson by highlighting their utter perfidy.

    91. SilverDarling says:

      @Petra

      Wasn’t there an Indy poster campaign a while back? I remember contributing to a crowdfunder. It raised some money but the billboard site then said they couldn’t put the posters up. A mobile poster van was hired but had to keep one step ahead as Unionists kept having it removed from wherever it was parked.

      It seemed controversial at the time to some in the Indy camp but I felt it was a good idea. Maybe this time it would garner more support?

    92. Dr Jim says:

      The Chagos Islands:

      Boris Jonnson when Home Sec personally telephoned the president of Mauritius Chagos Isands and threatened him with trade starvation and any measures the British could take against him if he did not withdraw his complaint

      The president of Mauritius recorded the whole conversation

      Nice one Mr Pres

    93. Giving Goose says:

      Craig P

      They all hate Scotland.
      Imagine hating the very idea of your nation.
      If you are a unionist – you hate Scotland.
      Simples, IMHO.

    94. john boy says:

      “Scottish government for the Scottish people”

      What the fuck does that even mean..

      FFS.

      You get some crackers on here.

    95. Jason Smoothpiece says:

      Chagos Islanders grievance monkeys. Just because the British government kidnapped them, causing the death’s of some of their loved ones and killed all their pets and completely stole their country.

      They want separation and independence, don’t they know we are better together?

      I hope they know they wont get to see coronation street or any royal weddings.

      Put that in their pipe.

    96. Is it just me, or is there something of the pubic louse about Mr Mundell?

    97. john boy says:

      Labour moving to support a second referendum would only be possible if the won a GE.

      Never going to happen and just more chaos to add to the Car crash that is Brexit.

      May’s heart is for leaving on 29th March.

      Good for Scottish Independence.

    98. Tinto Chiel says:

      “Tomorrow’s headline in the National should read:-

      ‘Mundell admitted that he would let 100,000 Scots lose their jobs, so that he can keep his.’”

      That’s a great one, Jack collatin.

      Is that what they call reframing? 😛

      Just to clarify, I don’t hate David Mundell. I despise him.

    99. Liz g says:

      John boy @ 5.40
      Which bit is it your struggling wi?

    100. jfngw says:

      BBC News runs story on BBC Scotland channel, they send up a reporter from London to cover story and tell us what its purpose is. They don’t even bother talking to anyone from BBC Scotland, its the perfect example of the colonial nature of the BBC.

    101. ronnie anderson says:

      liz g its ah kick in the arse to those Unionist who say that England owns Scotland . Britain’s world standing is on the wane , they’ll come doon wie ah hard bump when Nicola rings the bell .

    102. Peter Marjoram says:

      What a disgrace! A total excuse for a dobber!!

    103. john boy says:

      Corbyn is a fuckin chancer.

      The Labour Party trying to please all sides at the same time, never a good policy when you are committed to nothing.

      “The Labour Party stands for…”

      You fill the last part in yourself.

    104. Republicofscotland says:

      STV news.

      Teaching, Scottish government bad.

      NHS, Scottish government bad.

    105. Liz g says:

      Ronnie Anderson @ 6.35
      Aye Ronnie,it’s been a long time coming,but they’re finally learning that the rest of the world doesn’t see thing’s their way.
      Yet even now I don’t think that most of them realise how hard that bump is going to be,when Scotland leaves them to it 🙂
      To coin a phrase..
      And use their usual projection..

      If they think the end of a 40 year Union is bad..
      The end of the 300 year one is going to be for them..

    106. john boy says:

      The stinkin Union we are stuck in with the English was formed in 1707,,, which makes it 312 years old.

      Not 300 years, like some simpletons like to think.

    107. ronnie anderson says:

      I had a letter today from British Seniors —

      Return to sender
      Im not feking british remove me from your mailing list .

    108. Essexexile says:

      A quick dip into WoS this evening shows the ‘frothometer’ is nearly off the scale.
      Getting very twitchy down here Nicola. She cannae take much more o’this Captain!

    109. TJenny says:

      On the bright side, it must be almost time for this year’s WOS crowdfunder, usually end off Feb, I think. I love watcing the total rise with the equal rise of yoon mumping, mooth frothing and general heid exploding. 😉

    110. yesindyref2 says:

      An article on the Chagos ruling

      https://www.ejiltalk.org/icj-delivers-chagos-advisory-opinion-uk-loses-badly/

      and note the argument over the avoidance of the word “sovereignty”. Not neccessarily good news for us, is my first take.

    111. john boy says:

      If I was an ordinary English punter who voted to Leave the EU then I would be absolutely beelin with the way MPs are trying to reverse the public vote which voted by a large margin to Leave the EU.

      This is English democracy in action,,,can you imagine if we we voted to Leave the UK and we were being threatened with the reversal of our vote.?

    112. mike cassidy says:

      manandboy

      Are you aware your wee boy is outside playing in the dark

      john-boy

      A description of someone you have met in the past who satisfies at least one (but mostly a lot more) of the following criteria: ……. an eejit, a twat, a fascist, a dildo, a member of UKIP, the BNP or the EDL, Gok Wan, a smackhead, a knobend …..

      http://archive.is/NdMCi

    113. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi mike cassidy at 7:36 pm.

      You typed,
      “john-boy

      http://archive.is/NdMCi

      Well found!

      8=)

    114. Hamish100 says:

      jfngw says:
      25 February, 2019 at 6:28 pm
      BBC News runs story on BBC Scotland channel, they send up a reporter from London to cover story and tell us what its purpose is. They don’t even bother talking to anyone from BBC Scotland, its the perfect example of the colonial nature of the BBC.

      Ha , noticed that myself- what cost? The announcer made the point how much the new channel cost despite the BBC having to make cuts. Forgot to mention that Scotland pays more to the BBC than gets back.

    115. mr thms says:

      The UN’s highest court has determined the UK violated the right of Chagos Islanders to self determination.

      https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-47358602

      “Chagos Islands dispute: UK obliged to end control – UN”

    116. Robert Louis says:

      The National newspaper will be a definite must buy item on Wednesday.

      They are publishing the McCrone report in full.

      https://twitter.com/ScotNational/status/1100102467457613824

      This is the westminster economic report which London deliberately hid, which showed that Scotland’s oil could make Scotland one of the very wealthiest nations in the world. Of course, as we all know England has from that day, been stealing Scotland’s oil, whilst calling Scots scroungers and subsidy junkies.

      And then they wonder why we hate Westminster English colonial rule. Once we are independent, we should pursue every route possible to seek the return of every single penny of Scotland’s oil wealth from the thieving barstewards in London.

    117. Iain.mhor says:

      @galamcennalath 3:17pm

      That’s certainly the role reversal ‘ london’s representative in Scotland’ but I’m not sure that the pre-devolution powers angle really holds. There were still plenty of post-devo powers held by WM & now they have clawed back even more, so the SoSS should still have plenty to lever and a full portfolio to defend for Scotland.
      It does seem the case the brief was definitely to agitate against Scotland after Devo, or was it possibly after 2014? It’s why I wondered if any post-devo SoSS’ could be defended as strong champions for Scotland.

      Michael Moore was at the helm when the Scotland Act of 2012 was pushed through, is that in his favour?
      We have the likes of Liddell – other than trying to get Buckie banned, Liddell was out of her depth and ineffective in any role.
      Browne was just a warmonger like Rockets Rifkind and a hypocrite of the first water – championing anti-nukes & war now, but did everything in his power to saddle Scotland with Nuclear weapons. Being the Clunking Fist’s grand vizier does him no favours either – A grade A shyster.
      Wee Dougie was an election fiddler, enough said.
      Mundell, Carmichael, Murphy, Darling & Reid can be dispensed with, we know their colour well enough!

    118. Hamish100 says:

      ohn boy says:
      25 February, 2019 at 7:33 pm
      If I was an ordinary English punter who voted to Leave the EU then I would be absolutely beelin with the way MPs are trying to reverse the public vote which voted by a large margin to Leave the EU.

      This is English democracy in action,,,can you imagine if we we voted to Leave the UK and we were being threatened with the reversal of our vote.?

      62% Said to remain. I will respect english votes if they respect ours.Why should Northern Ireland get better deals just because England wants to leave by 52%

    119. john boy says:

      Hamish

      I agree with you, but there is no getting away from the fact that is WAS a UK vote.

      The point I am making is that if these MPs can do it with Brexit, then they will think they can do it with Indyref2.

    120. TJenny says:

      john boy – but indyref2 wont be a UK vote.

    121. tam says:

      England loses another Colony. Lol

      The Empire is crumbling…

      Their grip on their Scottish Colony is slipping by the day.

    122. tam says:

      T Jenny

      The Brexit vote was meant to be a straight Yes/No vote.

      That was meant to be the end of the matter, whoever won would take the spoils.

      And just look at the state of the thing now.

      With the Labour Party even calling for another vote.

      Westminster do do democracy.

    123. john boy says:

      TJenny

      The Brexit vote was meant to be a straight Yes/No vote.

      That was meant to be the end of the matter, whoever won would take the spoils.

      And just look at the state of the thing now.

      With the Labour Party even calling for another vote.

      Westminster do do democracy.

    124. john boy says:

      The point I am making about Westminster democracy is that they don’t do it.

      When England is on the verge of losing her jewel in the crown(Scotland) just watch the bastards go into overdrive about trying to reverse the vote or offer another vote only with bells on it.

    125. geeo says:

      @Hamish 100

      We cannot “leave the Uk”.

      We can END/DISSOLVE the United Kingdom, but as we are one partner in a legally EQUAL partnership, we certainly will not be leaving it. Without Scotland, the United Kingdom does not exist.
      …….

      @john boy.

      Actually, there IS “getting away from it” (being a uk wide vote).

      Because it couldn’t be.

      The Treaty of Union is very clear, explicit in fact, that Scotland is an EQUAL partner in the Union, and that the People of Scotland are the Sovereign power.

      The Treaty of Union is also clear that neither Scots Law nor the Sovereign Scots People, can be SUBJUGATED, particularly on matters of Scots Law and Scots People’s Sovereignty.

      A ‘uk wide vote’ where weight of Non Sovereign Scots votes, is used to over rule (subjugate) Scots votes, is contrary to the express terms of the Treaty of Union.

      And THAT has obvious consequences for the Union, and none good (unless you are an independinista of course)!

      Do you still think that treeza’s can kicking is to do with ukexit ?

      It is because she is desperately trying to find a way to avoid Scotsgov dissolving the Treaty of Union for the specific reason that Scots Sovereignty of the People has been illegally subjugated by WM.

      The SECOND WM agree to exit Scots from the EU officially, and against our sovereign will (expressed by 62% to 38%) with no recoil of the decision, WM has ended the Treaty of Union, and THAT is why treeza is desperately putting off the day of reality.

      Uk wide vote is a British Nationalist fantasy.

    126. galamcennalath says:

      Iain.mhor says:

      There were still plenty of post-devo powers held by WM

      Indeed, too many.

      I have been trying to find out what reserved powers actually lie with the SoSS. Basically, I can’t find any! Each reserved power seems to lie with specific UK ministries.

      An example might be immigration, but that lies with the Home Office.

      Left wondering, apart from ceremonial BritNat-in-Chief-in-the-North, what does the SoSS do?

    127. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Republicofscotland at 6.50

      Exactly

      STV news is now generally worse than BBC but it is getting away with it

      Tonight’s was a disgraceful attack on our education system featuring an unnamed taecher who had chucked it over stress and work load. A primary school teacher no less.

      I was many years a teacher. Stress comes with the job and will always come with the job and no government can do anything about that.

      Some teachers can handle it. Some have difficulty.The wee buggers immediately spot the “stressed” ones and have great fun.
      It’s all Nicola Sturgeon’s fault of course.

      The STV news report emphasised teachers leaving because of stress and pay concerns.Then it contradicted its thrust by reporting the most teachers since 2010 and a record number of people in teacher training (and we have the highest number of teachers ever in primary schools and we have almost twice as many teachers per pupil than they have in England and they are better paid). Best ever higher results, highest ever number at university,highest ever number of folk in full time college courses and a recent ONS report describing Scotland as the best educated nation in Europe. And then we get this shit from STV.

      Let’s have a good look at STV. As many of our target voters watch STV as watch BBC

    128. @Robert Louis,

      Average price when McCrone report was written (1974) was $10.00 per barrel,

      2018 average price was $71.06 per barrel,

      the average in the 44 years from 1974 to 2018 is $50.00 per barrel,

      just under 1 billion barrels extracted from Scottish waters per year,

      40,000,000,000 barrels X $50 =

      $2,000,000,000,000 or two trillion dollars,

      biggest theft in the history of human civilisation.

    129. Dr Jim says:

      Neil Findlay on the new 9pm BBC news is asked the question
      *If Labour supports a second referendum on Brexit then it surely must support one on Independence*

      Neil Findlay’s answer *Well no coz that’s different*

    130. ronnie anderson says:

      Is the manny from C&A back under ah different moniker lol

    131. galamcennalath says:

      A reasonable appraisal of where we stand with Brexit now Corbyn has come off the fence to some degree in the Guardian.

      http://archive.is/entcX

      HOWEVER, this section needed correcting ….

      “…. a price worth paying for British ENGLISH nationalist fantasies. How else will Britain ENGLAND finally learn the value of European comradeship? “

      … responsibility for this Brexit fiasco lies firmly in England. Scotland chose a different road and will surely continue down it.

    132. jfngw says:

      Maybe we should stop referring to it as indyref2 and just call it a Peoples Vote (or a We Are The Peoples Vote if you want the loon yoons on board). We would be voting for acceptance of The Vow (exposed as The Lie on 15th Sept 14) and the other option available. A confirmation or a rejection of the union as offered by WM, it is a union offered by WM because if it was a union of equals we could leave at any time we wanted without having to ask.

    133. Liz g says:

      Ronnie Anderson @ 9.13
      They ALL come back to us Ronnie, they cannie help themselves.
      Some even come back so soon,it’s like they never really left 🙂
      It’s our charm and charisma so it is 🙂

    134. CameronB Brodie says:

      I see David Mundell wants a no deal Brexit taken of the table. Not to protect Scotland but due to his British nationalist ideology. What a odious wee turd.

    135. galamcennalath says:

      The Telegraph announces, behind their paywall, “Government planning to pay billions to Brussels – even in event of no-deal Brexit”.

      Doh! There seems some tone of surprise here. Perhaps even disapproval?

      Money is owed and if you don’t pay off your creditors they aren’t going to be very keen to do business in the future. And the UK does, I assume, intend to do business with the EU even in the event of a ‘no deal’ cliff fall.

      The Telegraph was always right wing. However, I do feel there was a time before it became just another daft rightwing comic where magical cherry cakes and unicorns were made to sound real.

    136. Heart of Galloway says:

      James Cook as The Nine roving correspondent in an Icelandic hot spring vox pops fellow bathers on Brexit.

      Two American lassies having second thoughts about moving to ‘England’, a wee Leave means Leave Englander and a Scot who voted no to Indy in 2014 saying Scotland’s 62 per cent Euro vote was being being ignored by ‘the English government’.

      Cook: Does that swing you from no to yes in a future Scottish independence referendum?
      Scot: “Yes”.

      Then Cook interviews an Icelandic Government minister who says her country’s 360,000 population means size is not important when it comes to governing yourself.

      Cook: So Scotland could be a successful independent country?
      Minister: “Absolutely.”

      Hope springs eternal…

    137. defo says:

      Good night Mary Ellen

    138. john boy says:

      Sky News

      “Labour announces backing for a second Brexit referendum”

      https://news.sky.com/story/labour-announces-backing-for-a-second-brexit-referendum-11648217

    139. Jock McDonnell says:

      The BBC does love the prefix ‘Anglo’ and yes, its true, its very useful.
      We have Anglo-American, Anglo-French etc, even Anglo-Scottish.
      There’s Anglophone, Anglophile & Anglosphere and the less commonly used Anglocentric.
      2 which I think are overdue for an outing though are Anglosceptic & Anglofascist.
      Did I miss any ?

    140. Tom Busza says:

      @Heart of Galloway 10.04 pm

      “Then Cook interviews an Icelandic Government minister who says her country’s 360,000 population means size is not important when it comes to governing yourself.”

      That Icelandic Government minister is, in fact, the Prime Minister of Iceland (since 2017) Ms Katrín Jakobsdóttir.

    141. Robert Peffers says:

      @john boy says: 25 February, 2019 at 5:40 pm:

      ” … “Scottish government for the Scottish people”
      What the fuck does that even mean.”

      Is English not your first language, John Boy?

      ” … FFS.
      You get some crackers on here.”

      You certainly do, John Boy, will you be commenting again?

      I’d explain to you what, “Scottish government for the Scottish people”, means but as it cannot really be broken down any further than it already has been I think I’d just be wasting my time.

    142. CameronB Brodie says:

      Johnboy’s on the wind-up.

    143. Confused says:

      chagos islanders back in the news – its one of those dirty deals in history that often happen

      pilgers done a lot of work on this, his films are good, but he always comes from the human angle (which is not bad TBH, its just not the real picture) – there are deeper themes

      – that britain wasnt in vietnam was a very good thing – ever after we’ve followed the yanks around like poodles – wilson kept britain out, he also had to deal with an extreme right which intended to coup-de-tat his arse (- but was kept at bay till 1979) – and he had a bank of england governor who kept saying “there will be a run on the pound” every week

      but wilson beat his enemies thusly (possibly the most powerful pure intellect ever in the big chair)

      – he did a deal with the americans – they would support the pound on the forex markets in secret
      – if he would keep the bases open east of suez so they could run their war in vietnam
      – no run on pound – financial collapse was to precurse the coup – a “govt of national unity”
      – britain also kept its troops out, unlike australia
      – one of the titbits handed over to the yanks was the chagos, which became diego garcia, a superbase for B52s (- supposedly it is the favourite posting in the US air force)

      the chagossians lost their home, a paradise – it was a great injustice – but they were not all simply rounded up, shot and buried in mass graves, which is par for the course for the americans (usually get their proxies for this kind of thing) – consider east timor, another pilger investigation – that was mass murder. The yanks were roundabout this time running their Phoenix program – assassination as terror weapon. The chagos, arguably, got off easy – also remember the kind of hieronymous boschian heart of darkness savagery that was going on in the congo around this period. There’s what they got and what they could have gotten even worse.

      this is all “realpolitik” – did wilson do good, or bad – I think the former, very much so; the powerful are always making their omelettes by breaking others eggs (or heads)
      – the extreme right got kept out of power till 1979
      – no vietnam war for british lads
      – no financial collapse
      for those who like eastern martial arts doctrines – think of judo – leverage and pivot

      the themes are – realpolitik – triangulation – and having the americans at your back, for hauners – THEN YOU CAN ABSOLUTELY FUCK THE UK DEEP STATE

      that funny little man had a mind like a laser and balls like melons

      nikkis last trip to yankee-land – I hope she was “triangulating” her arse off

    144. SilverDarling says:

      ‘The Nine’ wasn’t beyond hope.

      Everyone appeared a bit giddy but maybe that was first night nerves. James Cook’s report was good.

      Neil Findlay was as much of a fud as usual and was able to control the interview more than he should have been allowed to. Will they allow an SNP MSP or MP to speak though, that is the question?

    145. manandboy says:

      mike cassidy says:
      manandboy
      “Are you aware your wee boy is outside playing in the dark”.

      Bit heavy on cryptic there, mike.

      He’s not so wee anymore actually, and he’s more likely to be in town having a pint with his mates.

    146. CameronB Brodie says:

      Can anyone suggest a reason the BBC in Scotland is completely uncritical about Brexit? Could it be their Royal Charter prevents them from being impartial? Can it be that the BBC in Scotland is dedicated to supporting British nationalism, no matter how sterile, xenophobic and authoritarian it has become.

    147. Robert Louis says:

      Just to follow up on the McRone report being published on wednesday in The National, their was a very interesting interview with Dennis Healey (Labour chancellor) in Holyrood magazine, way back in 2013.

      In the interview, he admitted that Westminster deceived Scots about the oil and still are.

      Here is a small but important section;

      QUOTE (referring to the oil)

      “I think there are a lot of problems connected with it that haven’t been faced up to, either by Salmond or by the British and they are mainly to do with oil and the income it provides and yes, I think they [Westminster politicians] are concerned about Scotland taking the oil, I think they are worried stiff about it.

      “I think we would suffer enormously if the income from Scottish oil stopped but if the Scots want it [independence] they should have it and we would just need to adjust but I would think Scotland could survive perfectly well, economically, if it was independent. Yes, I would think so… with the oil.” I ask Healey what he thinks about claims that Scotland is subsidised by the rest of the UK given that Joel Barnett, he of the Barnett formula, was his deputy at the Treasury and worked out what share of the national income pot Scotland should receive. He says Scotland “pays its fair share” and that “these myths” are simply perpetuated by those that oppose independence…”

      Full Interview here;

      https://www.holyrood.com/articles/editors-note/still-raising-eyebrows

    148. SilverDarling says:

      @Cameron B Brodie

      Is it because they are actually civil servants in all but name?

      They approach Brexit with a resigned what is done is done and get on with the process of making it happen no matter what. Theirs is not to question but to facilitate.

    149. jfngw says:

      I see that in Wales Labour’s main target are Plaid Cymru seats similarly to how they target SNP ones in Scotland. The objective of the three BritNat parties is to eliminate the indigenous parties of Scotland and Wales and the winner in England will take the spoils of victory. It’s the retention of the cartel that matters, not who ends up running the thing.

    150. CameronB Brodie says:

      SilverDarling
      Just following orders. That’s no excuse.

      —-

      I just herd some smarmy Brexiter on Sky stating his side had honoured the democratic requirements of leaving the EU. The scale of his mendacity is simply amazing, given the ruling earlier today that the Brexit vote should be discarded due to criminality, but can’t be as the vote was constitutional only.

      The far-right have taken over and vulnerable lives will be lost as a consequence of England’s Euroscaptic pseudo-religion.

    151. john boy says:

      Camaroon Bar

      As someone said yesterday

      Got a little chuckle at that one Mr Bar.

      Lol

      You are at the wind up Camaroon Bar.

    152. CameronB Brodie says:

      ….consultational only

    153. CameronB Brodie says:

      I’ve not been called that since I was in primary school. What age are you?

    154. john boy says:

      Camaroon Bar

      And the only difference is that the Camaroon Bar has more brain cells.

      The IQ levels on Wings is staggeringly low, thought I’d come along and bump up the ratings for you.

    155. Phronesis says:

      There is no settled definition of imperialism ‘a relationship … in which one state controls the effective political sovereignty of another political society ‘ (Michael Doyle, 1986 ’ Empires’) a strategy to create and widen political inequality, using all manner of covert and overt methods to suppress and control. No need to have an ideological dispute about what imperialism is – there are plenty of examples from social, political, cultural texts and visual material spanning the history of the Empire.
      Empires fade- in a modern context this happens in real- time and we shouldn’t mourn the demise of Empire. A modern functioning democracy doesn’t use the base ideologies of imperialism as its starting point – it puts human rights at the centre of a democracy of mutual respect of autonomous agents.
      Brexit is looming, today’s ruling at the UN will lead to Chexit and soon Scotland will have its Scexit.

    156. Robert Peffers says:

      @CameronB Brodie says: 25 February, 2019 at 10:28 pm:

      ” … Can it be that the BBC in Scotland is dedicated to supporting British nationalism, no matter how sterile, xenophobic and authoritarian it has become.”

      Has the BBC ever been anything other than dedicated to supporting British/English nationalism, CameronB?

      Never forget that the BBC Overseas Service has always dwarfed both Voice of America and Radio Moscow when these two propaganda broadcasters were at their most prolific. The BBC still is by far the most prolific propaganda broadcaster the World has ever known.

      The rise of the internet and social media has certainly set them back a bit but they are still there on every waveband and on every means of broadcasting from long wave to short wave and guess who pays for it all?

    157. CameronB Brodie says:

      Johmboy
      Do you own an orange jacket perhaps?

    158. jfngw says:

      @Cameron Brodie

      It’s the way the BBC is organised and the limitations that are made clear by London. Brexit is a UK matter not a regional one (BBC Scotland is a region to the BBC, they call it Nations and Regions but it is one management arm), they cannot make programmes that London consider a UK matter unless they are commissioned to by London.

      They will deny this of course, but anyone who has worked there knows the pecking order. That’s why they spend so much time on fishing, it is of no real interest to London and has not much real UK wide interest either.

    159. john boy says:

      Macaroon Bar

      Why would I own an orange jacket.

      Do you own a straight jacket,,,for those crazy moments you go through

    160. CameronB Brodie says:

      Robert Peffers
      I’d love to see a Scottish human right lawyer take them to task over the content of their Royal Charter. They can always squirm an excuse out to explain their bias, but a legal challenge of their charter is what we need IMHO, as it discriminates against non-British nationalist identities.

      Compulsory loyalty? Accountability, citizenship and the
      BBC

      oro.open.ac.uk/11249/1/11249.pdf

    161. john boy says:

      Labour happy with 2nd Brexit vote, so surely just as comfortable about a 2nd Indy vote.

      Surely!!!

    162. William Wallace says:

      Gi yirsel peace John Boy iy. If you are going to troll, then could you at least make it interesting or funny for those of us that might be struggling to get to sleep the night?

      This level o banter is playschool material.

    163. CameronB Brodie says:

      jfngw
      Thanks.

      Johnboy
      Do you seriously think you’re going to upset me?

    164. john boy says:

      What will Dick be saying about Brexit2

      Dick is the current Labour branch office trustee.

      What about IndyRef2 Dick?

    165. john boy says:

      Macaroon Bar

      You were the idiot who asked me if I owned an orange jacket…

      Did you forget,,,are your tabs starting to kick in???

    166. CameronB Brodie says:

      Johnboy
      Away and play with yourself.

    167. Robert Peffers says:

      @john boy says: 25 February, 2019 at 10:56 pm:

      ” … The IQ levels on Wings is staggeringly low, thought I’d come along and bump up the ratings for you.”

      That seems an astonishingly strange comment from someone with a rather poor grasp of both grammar and punctuation, John boy.

      By the way, have you worked out yet what the phrase, “Scottish Government for Scottish People”, means? After all, with your massive IQ level it is incumbent upon such as you to educate we poor uneducated commenters on Wings.

      As we are sometimes likely to say here in Scotland:-

      Aye! Richt!

    168. Kangaroo says:

      geeo @8:39pm

      Agree 100%
      I hope Breeks reads it and understands it too.

      Only a little over a month now, and Kaboom.

    169. Hamish100 says:

      I’m suspicious of anyone stealing a name from the Waltons.
      What name did you use before ?

    170. Thepnr says:

      The latest Peston article is interesting.

      “PM set to offer MPs guarantee of binding vote on whether to take no-deal Brexit off table for 29 March”

      https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1100165171002200064

    171. geeo says:

      Oh dear, wee john boy ain’t going to last long around here.

      I have an uncanny sense of these things you know…

    172. Robert Peffers says:

      @john boy says: 25 February, 2019 at 11:02 pm:

      ” … Why would I own an orange jacket.”

      Absolutely hilarious. You are so dim you do not know the significance of the orange jacket yet you have the temerity to attempt to take down intelligent adults. You are well out of your depth here.

    173. William Wallace says:

      Did I just hear someone say Goodnight John Boy!

    174. ronnie anderson says:

      Hamish 100 Ah boay of many names is he & superior inteligencia in comparison to us inferior an unedumacated Scots .

      Btw he’ll go the same way as they all went before BLOCKED .

    175. msdidi says:

      Hamish100 @ 11.23pm
      What name did you use before ?
      John boy….son of Jezza…..who hasn’t appeared today….after last nights “nonsense.” Funny that – lose one to scroll past – gain another!

    176. Thepnr says:

      @john boy

      It’s straitjacket not straight jacket. Just thought you should know.

    177. Dr Jim says:

      Scotland Tonight: Tom Harris says Scotland has no say in this Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP have no locus in this

      Michelle Thompson starts to speak Tom Harris overpowers her with a louder voice and ineffectual John McKay smiles ineffectually with as much authority as Help me Rona

      That’s always been a problem for STV they’ve only got Bernard Ponsonby who’s the atual journalist while the rest are just script readers

    178. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      “I can suggest a reason the BBC in Scotland is completely uncritical about Brexit and I believe that the BBC in Scotland is dedicated to supporting British Nationalism, no matter how Right Wing and Neo Fascist the Westminster British Nationalist Government becomes @CameronB Brodie says at 10:28 pm

      The BritNat Broadcasting Corporation will continue to do it’s patriotic duty, defending “The Precioussss Union” as per the British Nationalist Broadcasters Royal Charter (aka ‘only obeying orders’).

      Propaganda straight oot the Joseph Goebbels play book.

      6. The Public Purposes

      The Public Purposes of the BBC are as follows.

      (4) ………and help contribute to the social cohesion and wellbeing of the United Kingdom.

      https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/577829/57964_CM_9365_Charter_Accessible.pdf

      It is no coincidence that Radio Scotland was launched in advance of the 1979 referendum and that this new BBC Scotland TV channel is being launched in advance of IndyRef2.

      Control of the narrative via framing, propaganda, disinformation and omission is the BBC way.

    179. CameronB Brodie says:

      Thing is, I have actually just run out of my meds as my spud duty over-ran. My PTSD wasn’t diagnosed for over twenty years, so I can cope, I’m not about to loose my composure quite yet. Certainly not in the face of infantile jibes. 😉

    180. Thepnr

      seems to be the front page article on the Daily Mail tomorrow as well.

      18/23 ( seems to be confusion how many) ministers set to resign if she refuses to take No Deal out of the equation.

      Of course ERG will go ape on Tuesday but seems she might be weakening and heading towards an extension.

      We’ll see…

    181. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      SilverDarling @ 22:24,

      Yes, Findlay got off very lightly, the weaselly operator. Claimed that Corbyn’s late conversion (heavily qualified) to a PV was all part of the Great Master Plan (aye, richt) for “the country” (!), then when challenged about what question Corbyn – or himself, even – wanted in their referendum, ducked & dived and was allowed to faff on regardless that Parliament would decide. The very same Parliament that moments before he was describing as “gridlocked”. Utterly unconvincing.

      Yes, I likewise would like to see how they interview some SNP minister.

    182. geeo says:

      @msdidi

      Someone tipped off the blog owner last night about dear old jezza being up to his old tricks, like him, john boy here will not be able to resist being what he is.

    183. Thepnr says:

      @Meg merrilees

      An extension to Article 50 looks unavoidable now, she knows this.

    184. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      CameronB Brodie @ 00:03,

      Heh, heh, he chose the wrong target there. His pathetic little schoolboy jibes must seem like drops in the ocean, grains of sand on the beach. Take care, though.

      Somehow I can’t see him being for too long among us anyway.

    185. CameronB Brodie says:

      Robert J. Sutherland
      Thanks, will do.

    186. yesindyref2 says:

      @CBB
      I think johnboy is just jezzaing in his pants.

    187. CameronB Brodie says:

      yesindyref2
      I got that feeling as well.

    188. Liz g says:

      geeo @ 12.07
      Aye someone must have reported him,because one of his inane posts was taken down and he doesn’t seem to be posting under that name anyone.
      And like this “john boy” the slide from when they appear till reverting to type seems to be getting faster and faster.

      Because I can’t see the one’s at this level being the ones paid to be here….
      I just keep looking forward to what idiocy will manifest itself the night the Yes vote comes in.
      Every Cloud and aw that!!!

    189. Wee Alex says:

      Thepnr says:
      26 February, 2019 at 12:16 am

      @Meg merrilees

      An extension to Article 50 looks unavoidable now, she knows this.

      ————

      There are 27 EU countries who will need to be convinced that extending Article 50 is worthy of extension.

      I’m fed up listening to Boris et al telling the EU they have to give up the backstop, but what is May giving up in these negotiations.

      The only answer is a withdrawal of Artice 50.

      Oops forgot, Independence vote!

    190. Graeme J McAllan says:

      This chief potty-warmer’s job is to keep Scotland down, while draining our resources and collecting his wages 🙁

    191. Dr Jim says:

      I read something good on Twitter

      *There are no Unionists left, there are only British Nationalists now*

      I think that might be close to being right

    192. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Wee Alex @ 00:53,

      The EU27 have already made it clear that, given where things are, they are prepared to grant an extension, irritating as it may well be for them. The only question really is: how long?

      Oh, and also, if her can-kicking ploy runs out of road, is May determined to drag us all out on 29.March regardless?

    193. Cubby says:

      STV’s Scotland Tonight.

      STV’s idea of balance – a panel of four to discuss Brexit – three Britnats and Michelle Thomson.

      One of the Britnats is even the ex UKipper Suzanne Evans. The other two labour’s Murray and Harris.

      Thomson has to actually say ” given that this is Scotland Tonight I think we should be drawing our attention back to what is actually happening in Scotland…..”

      Harris says “Scotland had no vote in the EU referendum” – Harris on TV denying the existence of Scotland.

      In summary, one true Scot and three Britnats that care not a jot for Scotland.

      STV what a sad joke of an organisation.

    194. Wee Alex,

      aye, all this drama about something which has been obvious to Nicola for weeks.

      Labour now realising too little, too late, that maybe a People’s vote would have actually been a good opposition line to follow. Would actually achieve more good if Corbyn put all his energy behind an extension which they could have achieved a few weekss ago if they had supported the SNP amendment instead of abstaining.

      What a mess!!!

      How long before she throws in the towel?

    195. Liz g the night the YES vote comes in we’ll be out in the streets till dawn so not many posts expected then from us…. time for them to feel how we did on Sept 19th 2014.

    196. Cubby says:

      Just been reading recent posts. Has Jezza been reincarnated as John boy?

    197. Petra says:

      @ galamcennalath (5:10pm) and silver darling (5:26pm) ….. “Led by Cuddies / wasn’t there an Indy poster campaign?”

      Led by Westminster Cuddies right enough galamcennalath. Better still robbed blind by them.

      You might be talking about the Inform Scotland billboard campaign SD, which seemed to be faced with a number of challenges at that time. What interests me about the English “Led by Donkeys” campaign was that the posters seemed to be pretty cheap …. £200 for five massive posters. And then they, of course, went on to do a DIY job costing nought by plastering their posters onto billboards without receiving permission. They’ve got that permission now from a number of billboard companies and the money through crowdfunding to pay for the use of billboards / someone to carry out the work. Seemingly their posters are spreading all over England now. They’ve also been smart enough to avoid legal action by using factual political quotes. IMO, we’ve also got loads of “facts” that we could draw from.

      ……………………….

      If I had to say what I’d like to do with Mundell I’d be getting lifted by the Police. He’s in a “class” of his own as being the most despicable, inept, lying Tory in the country right now and that’s saying something. Add to that it looks as though 300 plus Tories at Westminster can’t stick the wee toady either. Another issue that’s always annoyed me, over and above the Smith Commission and Frenchgate, is that Scotland wasn’t mentioned ONCE in the 585 page draft Withdrawal Agreement. What did that wee runt have to say about that? We should all be bombarding him with mail asking him what he’s actually doing for Scotland, as it looks as though he’s getting paid handsomely for doing no more than spouting a load of lies …. AGAIN.

      https://mobile.twitter.com/TommySheppard/status/1098206380115349504?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

    198. yesindyref2 says:

      Astonishing. Recorded the 9 on the new BBC so I could watch it at leisure, and I have, rewind “Did I hear that right”?

      Yes it covers the fake prescription drug thing, very well I thought, but its general tone is kind of positive towards Scotland and that’s a refreshing change. But it’s also very fair to Independence, even making a point of it in the Iceland section.

      Haven’t finished yet, but the only ones who can complain about it so far are the Unionists.

    199. Liz g says:

      Meg merrliees @ 1.40
      I think this also might be the point where the Scots who didn’t really listen to Nicola back in 2016,get another more focused chance to see that we cannot be protected from the democratic deficit.
      That anger, that bounce for Indy after the first Brexit vote is about to happen all over again,if this vote goes ahead!
      I wonder if Westminster will risk it,then again what choice do they have?
      It’s now looking like Westminster are going to have to choose which Union they really want and I’m not even sure most of them realise it yet!

    200. Liz g says:

      Meg merrliees @ 1.42
      True of course….. but I’m sure some of us will check in..
      Wouldn’t want the rev to feel abandoned 🙂

    201. Liz g says:

      Yesindyref2 @ 1.53
      I still think it’s too little,too late for the BBC in Scotland.
      The clamour for this channel was in 2014 and all they’ve done from then till now is make things worse.
      We needed broadcasting devolved.
      We don’t even get a real channel.
      And how they justify broadcasting this only in Scotland is beyond me its ment to be about the other half of the island ffs.

    202. Petra says:

      @ Meg / Liz.

      Let’s face it if Big T’s no single market deal, NIreland in a preferable situation to Scotland gets through, we’re out. If it’s a No deal Brexit we’re out. If the people’s vote is solely between May’s deal and No deal we’re out. If it includes “remain” and the English vote to leave again we’re out. If the English vote to remain in the EU we’ll at least have seen off the greatest threat since Suez and then what? The Tories that we didn’t vote for will continue to rule the roost under a new and more “woeful” leader, UKIP will be on the rise again, there will be riots in England and between one thing and another the Scots will want out. The Union is well and truly over now, IMO. More than anything Nicola Sturgeon has to be commended for her ability to see the big, and far reaching, picture. Thank God she refrained from jumping the gun as advocated by so many.

    203. Liz g says:

      Petra @ 2.20
      Well Petra…
      All the time’s we’ve finished up agreeing to disagree!
      I have to tell ya..
      I agree with every single word of that 🙂

    204. yesindyref2 says:

      @Liz g
      It’s never too late – for Independence and the BBC to improve, or at least a new part of it.

      The 9 had quite a positive outlook for Scotland, and the presenters seem to genuinely like Scotland. Compared to the BBC 1 Scotland news where they have their noses in the air as though Scotland is a bad smell and they wish they weren’t here, as they really really think it’s crap.

    205. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Kangaroo @ 02:43:

      Looks like the DUP will be vindicated before long

      Where on earth do you dredge this diversionary drivel from, you arrant fool? You are either having a laugh at our expense or you seriously need help, pal…

    206. yesindyref2 says:

      @Kangaroo
      Seriously, that site is beyond abominable shit.

      Please take it to alt.conspiracy.totalwhacko.nutcase.weirdo where it belongs.

    207. Liz g says:

      Yesindyref2 @ 2.47
      I can’t see it!
      To what end can this channel to forward?
      The charter says the BBC must help support the Union.
      So other than a sop to either fool some into believing they are represented or draw heat so as to leave the main channel’s free reign to punt Britain.
      What exactly is this channel for?

      It looks like more crumbs from the Union table…
      This organisation can have no future in an Indy Scotland and Indy is inevitable.
      But the big but is… The Indy movement cannot really get behind this channel and still generally support not paying the TV tax to receive it…

    208. Ghillie says:

      Petra @ 2.20 am. Hi Liz g and Meg merrilees too =)

      Aye, I’m with you on that too.

      Well said and explained simply and clearly =)

      I have always believed in Nicola Sturgeon’s integrity and incredible political acumen.

      And I do think we are living through the days of the cleverest and most careful maneuvering, by Scotland’s First Minister and team, through an extremely complicated and dangerous political scene.

      Jumping the gun has no part in that.

    209. Liz g says:

      Robert J Sutherland & Yesindyref2
      You should consider sending those links from Kangaroo to the Rev in the morning. (I can’t do links)
      As you’ve both said this is batshit crazy stuff…And the Rev has put a lot of time and treasure into making a quality political blogg, so he should get to see if he wants this stuff on it!
      You can add my name if you want to

    210. Liz g says:

      Ghillie @ 3.31
      Hi… Yes we are very fortunate to have Nicola and her team at this point in time 🙂
      They must have nerves of steel!
      I don’t know about you Ghillie but I feel it’s like the stars have aligned or something and Indy is so close… Yay.. 🙂

    211. john boy says:

      Here comes Johnny.

      The level of debate is that of primary school kids posting whatever shit that comes into their heads.

      Need to up the IQ levels on here.

    212. yesindyref2 says:

      @Liz g
      We should keep a critical eye on the 9, but having met and talked to Geissler years ago I think he’s a genuine guy. And perhaps MacKinnon is and will have problems changing the culture at BBC Scotland in general, as it’s ingrained. She also needs to fight off the “parachuting” tactics of BBC down in London where the weather for grossly overpaid and under-performing Good Morning programs and suchlike rubbish only occurs on the roof of the studio, and whose knowledge of Scotland is restricted to kilts and deep fried mars bars.

      The boycott of the BBC licence is not overall, no idea how many, but many do watch BBC – and are critical. If some at least didn’t watch it then no Indy supporter could actually comment and complain about it when needed. The SNP is also getting more noisy about it – as in the recent QT incident, and The National is keeping on top of it, hopefully on a regular basis. More importantly those we want to convert do watch the BBC and there’s little point in just saying to them “Don’t pay the BBC tax”, if they were asking about some garbage Indy report on BBC.

      Personally I’d like the BBC to reform and improve, as the chances of it disappearing with the non-payment of a few thousand licence fees is nil, 0%.

    213. Ghillie says:

      Yes Liz g,

      Indy feels very very close 🙂 🙂 🙂

    214. john boy says:

      Yesindy2

      Are you for real???

      Are you a Unionist who gas wandered onto the wrong forum.

    215. Iain.mhor says:

      @galamcennalath 8:44pm

      What the Office of the SoSS does is really what you have already intimated – two of its mere three core principles are
      “Strengthen and sustain the Union”
      “Champion the UK Government in Scotland”

      If anyone else needs reminding of “David “Deliverer & Guardian of Devolution” Mundell’s take on the role, then his party political broadcast (sorry, his elevating speech) last week, marking 20 years of devo, can make you choke here;

      https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/speech-devolution-after-brexit

    216. john boy says:

      BBC Scotland means nothing but harm to the Independence cause.

      It’s built into their DNA

    217. john boy says:

      Anybody who can find anything good to say about BBC Scotland needs wstchin’

    218. john boy says:

      BBC Scotland,,,,enemy of the people.

    219. yesindyref2 says:

      @Liz g
      I didn’t make that point very well. It needs both, those who watch, those who boycott. It’s quite possible if it wasn’t for the noisy “Boycott” Indy supporters, some in the BBC wouldn’t feel the need to reform. See the contrast between MacKinnon and Valentine for instance who thinks the Indyref coverage was perfect, whereas MacKinnon says she wants to regain trust – and I think genuinely does.

      @Ghillie
      Could be closer than we think 🙂

    220. john boy says:

      BBC Scotland is the mouthpiece for the English establishment in Scotland.

      Anybody who doesn’t already know that needs watchin.

    221. john boy says:

      After Indy we will probably have our own state funded broadcasting corporation.

      So the majority of technical staff could be transferred over to the new company.

      But the front room tractors like Burd and Co would need to go.

    222. McBoxheid says:

      GORDON FORREST says:
      25 February, 2019 at 11:11 am

      Toom Tabard right enough!
      ——————————-

      John Baliol was king for 4 years, this rag of a man is so filled with hatred of the SNP and so irreleveant in the greater scheme of things, he will fail in his attempt to be fitted for the ermine straight jaiket. Independence will come and he will be left with nothing and out of work.

      He will be begging for a place amongst the red seats, but there won’t be one available. Indeed, all the “Scottish” lairds will loose their titles in that place. The Tories will drop him like a hot tattie. The only lordship he’ll get is “lordy, who is that pest and what is he still doing in the palce of Westminster?” He will be blamed for indy by a tory party that is ripped apart, because the tories will need a scapegoat. They themselves are never to blame in their own minds.

    223. Nana says:

      Brexit- on, off, in, out or shaking it all about. It’s anybody’s guess what will happen next. Any Brexit links/news below could all be old news by the time you’ve read them.

      Welcome to a special Full Scottish, filmed at the Aberdeen Independence Movement conference in Aberdeen.
      This week, a Broadcasting Scotland crew headed to the north East for theAberdeen Independence Movement’s Conference. We spoke with SNP Depute Leader, Keith Brown MSP, Gillian Martin MSP, and Maggie Chapman, Scottish Green Party Co-convener and filmed Keith Brown’s keynote speech.
      https://www.broadcastingscotland.scot/full-scottish-24-02-2019/

      https://www.snp.org/westminster-is-broken-beyond-repair/
      Call for answers after up to 20k die being owed ESA payments
      http://archive.is/6cKca

      https://thoughtcontrolscotland.com/2019/02/25/only-three-parents-write-to-swinney-or-sturgeon-about-p1-testing-and-none-report-a-child-stressed/

    224. Nana says:

      Great interview by @mrjamesob @LBC w @JMPSimor explaining that because of advisory nature of the Brexit referendum, the Courts cannot void the result. Legal claim should also have come before Dec 2016 but corruption was not known yet
      https://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/james-obrien/brexit-referendum-corruptly-won-but-result-stands/

      Also, remember that Alex Salmond tabled an amendment for a quadruple lock to the EU Referendum Bill, meaning a leave win would have been dependent on all four nations voting for it. The amendment was rejected because “the referendum is advisory.”
      https://twitter.com/alanferrier/status/1100095197696929792

      https://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2019/02/25/may-is-trashing-the-country-i-live-in-i-have-a-right-to-be-angry-about-that/

      The UKgov are criminally negligent
      https://twitter.com/CarolineLucas/status/1100106265622134784

    225. Nana says:

      Brexit: Theresa May facing revolt ahead of cabinet meeting
      http://archive.is/cKtUA
      The Lancet: Brexit will cause significant harm to the NHS, but No-Deal Brexit presents by far the worst option
      http://archive.is/tdDqC

      https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2019-02-26/britain-s-other-irish-border-is-also-a-big-brexit-problem

      This Brexit trade bill threatens parliamentary sovereignty
      http://archive.is/bqm3F

    226. Nana says:

      https://universalcreditsuffer.com/2019/02/25/universal-credit-call-centre-staff-vote-for-2-day-strike/

      A Spin Doctor Helping the IndependentGroup Worked for a Hawkish Right-Wing Think-Tank
      http://archive.is/FCscU

      Brexit: this historically dysfunctional process
      http://eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=87159

      The Brexit death spiral
      https://www.byline.com/column/67/article/2428

    227. Breeks says:


      john boy says:
      26 February, 2019 at 4:31 am
      After Indy we will probably have our own state funded broadcasting corporation.

      So the majority of technical staff could be transferred over to the new company.

      But the front room tractors like Burd and Co would need to go.

      Yeah, we can mark all the other ex BBC curriculum vitae’s with a little Christmas tree.

    228. yesindyref2 says:

      Trolls just lurv suckers.

    229. Robert Louis says:

      Yesindyref2,

      You optimism for the BBC liars in Scotland is admirable, but I’m not convinced. Many, many times when they have been subjected to criticism in the past, we have seen a few weeks of less bias, but once things calm down again, they get back to it with gusto.

      You see, many folks will have seen the rightful criticism of the BBC lately, so what they do, is ease off a wee bit with it at the BBC, just when folks are watching out for it. A few semi balanced news pieces her and there, just enough to make them look ok to most folk. Enough to make it look as though the folk claiming bias are just ‘fringe butters’. Then they get right back to it, once the heat is off, they will be back to propaganda mode as usual. This is what is going on now.

      Mark my words, in a few weeks, it will be back to business as usual for the paid liars, propagandists and London stooges at the BBC in Scotland. Once indyref is called, the BBC liars in Scotland will be right at the front pumping out anti SNP, Scotland and independence rubbish. It is what Westminster pays their wages for. Why else would the Tories not sell them off to their chums in the Murdoch empire.

      He who pays the piper calls the tune. Especially at the blatantly biased, anti Scotland BBC.

    230. Nana says:

      The FT’s seen May’s proposals for UK no-deal tariffs. Looks like Hammond/Fox fought Gove to a injury-wracked score draw. Zero for all, exceptions for some sensitive manufacturing (steel, ceramics), cars at 10% & ag (beef, sheepmeat, milk, cheese, pigmeat).
      https://twitter.com/alanbeattie/status/1100282965110779905

      It’s all about immigration
      https://twitter.com/SurreyAmps/status/1100154193539682304

      https://inews.co.uk/news/scotland/snp-mp-calls-for-citizens-assemblies-to-set-indyref2-strategy/

      That’s all

    231. john boy says:

      Anyone who had a good word to say about BBC Scotland wants a watchin’.

    232. john boy says:

      Only a smarmy Yoon bastard would have ANYTHING good to say about BBC Scotland.

    233. Bob Martin says:

      Tory cabinet meeting today, could be interesting.

    234. Macart says:

      @Nana

      Lot o’ hot takes out there doin’ the rounds Nana. 🙂

      The interesting thing I’ve noted from this whole Brexit fiasco, is the amount of skittery things and that have been brought into the light. The ‘who paid what to who and when’ kinda story.

      The other thing strikes you, is the nature of the beastie and their support. What they feel they can get away with because…. reasons. There’s a poll over on the Sky news site (won’t archive for me) which throws up a few interesting figures. 😉

      Seems folk don’t trust government or mainstream meeja very much. They also feel that racism is on the rise and that the future of the UK both as an economy and as an entity looks bleak. There’s a whole lot of who knew(?) and Q.E.D. moments in that lot.

    235. Bob Martin says:

      From Aug 2018:-

      Barry Gardiner says politicians must honour the promise they made to voters in 2016

      Andrew Sparrow Political correspondent

      @AndrewSparrow

      Tue 21 Aug 2018 11.09 BST Last modified on Tue 21 Aug 2018 20.55 BST

      Barry Gardiner
      A second referendum on Brexit could lead to social unrest and embolden the extreme right, a member of Labour’s shadow cabinet has said

      The shadow international trade secretary, Barry Gardiner, said that even though he thought Brexit would make the UK poorer in the short and medium term, it would be wrong to try to stop it by holding another referendum because that would appear undemocratic.

      https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/21/labour-mp-says-second-brexit-vote-could-lead-to-social-unrest

    236. Breeks says:

      Happy Independence Day Chagos! At least near enough as makes no difference anyway… Sovereignty rules supreme.

      All it needed was a Constitutional Test Case and international recognition. Well, well, well, ….. Who knew eh?

    237. Footsoldier says:

      Debate Night on BBC Scotland this Wednesday channel 9 already looks like a yawn – John Swinney and Murdo Fraser, both boring speakers and this is what the BBC think people want?

      Last night on STV Michelle Thomson came over well and plugged the Scottish dimension, something the SNP no longer do on air, and she did not get ruffled at all and she is a good coherent speaker and doesn’t get lost in reams of figures like many do.

      The reason the SNP are missing from the current Brexit debate on UK national TV is because they having nothing to say of interest and are being ignored.

    238. Big Del says:

      Fanny Farage on sky news now:
      What price freedom?
      We voted to be an independent country.
      In charge of our own laws.
      We have been in a 2 year establishment bombardment.

      Sounds familiar don’t it?

      Also, bumped into a guy last night who started his shit again.
      “ They gave the vote to 16 yr old to try and push independence on us but they can’t buy a beer”
      I said “but they can pay Tax and join the army so why should they not have?”
      Him “ but they can’t buy a pint” and “ what does it say on yer passport”
      Me “ Born in Falkirk”

    239. Kangaroo says:

      To Whom it may concern

      If The Rev says he doesn’t want it then I will no longer post it.

      Simple.

    240. Nana says:

      Morning Macart
      You are right, lots of stuff slithering out and it ain’t pretty.

      I saw the Sky poll and had a go at archiving with no luck.

      It’s worth posting and anyone who doesn’t want to click the link can pass on by

      https://news.sky.com/state-of-the-nation

    241. Daisy Walker says:

      O/T from EUreferendum.com todays essay…

      ‘a vote is due which would supposedly empower parliament to force a Brexit delay on the government if Mrs May has failed to get her deal passed by 13 March. This is the famous Cooper-Letwin amendment.

      Sadly, no one has broken it to these hopefuls that parliament has no power to force Mrs May to do any such thing and, even if she decided to approach the European Council for a delay, they could still say “no”. The very worst (or best) that can happen is that the leader of the opposition tables another motion of no confidence which, if successful, could lead to a general election. And by the time that was over, we’d be out of the European Union by default – without a deal.

      In terms of running down the clock, therefore, it would appear that Mrs May has already achieved her aim. She needs to do absolutely nothing between now and 29 March and we will be out.

      The only sure way to avoid a no-deal (***NB the Author Richard North does not acknowledge the existence of the legal right / ability to Cancel Brexit***) is to vote for the Withdrawal Agreement on 12 March. Assuming that the European Parliament also ratifies the deal – we will be into the transitional period and ready for another 21 months of bickering and uncertainty.’

    242. Cubby says:

      Robert Louis @8.21pm

      Spot on. It always amazes me the optimism that some independence supporters continue to show that the Britnat media will suddenly become more sympathetic to independence. It won’t happen.

      I won’t be watching the new so called BBC Scotland channel. Why give them the opportunity to have another propaganda channel broadcasting in Scotland. Happy to see it end up like STV2 – terminated.

    243. North chiel says:

      “ Iain Mohr@0411 “ , would The Office of Secretary of State be more appropriate TOSS and as a Minister of the crown ER ( Elizabeth Regina) be added??

    244. Breeks says:


      Cubby says:
      26 February, 2019 at 10:33 am
      Robert Louis @8.21pm

      Spot on. It always amazes me the optimism that some independence supporters continue to show that the Britnat media will suddenly become more sympathetic to independence. It won’t happen.

      Correct.

      I believe public service broadcasting is a good thing, and essential thing in many respects, but by its nature, it falls an easy hostage to those who would abuse it.

      I believe people should have unfettered access to dispassionate, apolitical, objective news and current affairs discourse, but unfortunately Scotland currently has no such facility. But worse, much worse, than simply not having the media we need, we have the media of the colonial Occupier.

      Scotland has a cuckoo in its nest. A fat bloated imposter which pretends to be one of us, but exists solely for its own self interest as it greedily purloins resources which don’t properly belong to it, leaving our own Scottish media weak and emaciated.

      The Cuckoo will always be a cuckoo. You can reform it all you like, but it will still be a cuckoo. The longer we feed it, the fatter it gets. As a Nation, Scotland needs to start recognising the BBC cuckoo, and be able to distinguish it from our own Scottish offspring, a vital, homegrown and kindred Scottish media, and make a conscious effort to protect what is ours, and make sure our resources get invested in our own media.

      I’d like to see the fat f———er’s carcass rolled out the nest altogether, but it’s currently dug in like a tick and won’t be easily expelled, but at the very least, we can stop feeding it and start making sure the media we support is the media we want to see thrive.

      The cuckoo’s whole philosophy is that the host never suspects it’s being duped. I believe that philosophy’s days are numbered.

    245. Daisy Walker says:

      O/T The Civil Contingencies Act 2004 edited highlights…

      Local Arrangements for Civil Protection

      Meaning of Emergency

      An event or situation which threatens serious damage to human welfare, in a place in the Uk, or threatens serious damage to the environment of a place in the UK, or war or terrorism, which threatens serious damage to the Security of the UK

      An event or situation threatens damage to human welfare, only if it involves, causes or MAY cause,

      loss of human life, human illness or injury, homelessness, damage to property, disruption of a supply of money, food, water, energy or fuel, disruption of a system of communication, disruption of facilities for transport, or disruption of services relating to health

      (quite a lot of this looks like the tory manifesto to be fair)

      A Minister of the Crown or in relation to Scotland, the Scottish Ministers (plural) (but really just Fluffy), may by order,
      provide a specified event or situation, as falling or not falling within the above meaning

      And there’s more, but I’ll let you look it up yourselves.

      Interestingly…Under S 2 contingency Planning – they have a duty to ‘maintain arrangements to warn the public, and provide info and advice to the public, if an emergency is likely to occur or has occurred.

      Part 4 (1) is also interesting (isn’t it)

      Advice and assistannce to the public

      … shall provide advice and assistance to the public in connection with the making of arrangements for the continuance of Commercial activities by the public…, in the event of an emergency

      (So, all those businesses currently feeling like mushrooms…. may well have a legal case for compensation – now there’s a thought.)

      S 14 Scotland – Consultation

      (1) A Minister of theCrown SHALL CONSULT the Scottish Ministers before making regulations or an order under this part (General Measures – power to make up emergency regulations and order people to do stuff) in relation to a person or body if or ins so far as … exercises functions in relation to Scotland.

      (2) The Scottish Ministers shall consult with the Minister of the Crown before making regulations or an order under this act.

      Worth a look at this folks.

      The use of the plural ‘Scottish Ministers’ may be very important – and it goes all the way through the legislation, at the moment there is only one Westminster Scottish Minister and that’s Fluffy.

      Food for thought anyway.

    246. Daisy Walker says:

      And theres more..

      S 24 Regional and Emergency Coordinators

      Emergency regulations must require a Senior Minister of the Crown to appoint

      (a) for each part of the UK, other than England, in relation to which the regulations have effect, a person to be known as the Emergency Coordinator for that Part

      (4) In exercising his functions a coordinator shall – comp with a direction of a senior Minister of the Crown and have regard to the guidance issued by a senior Minister of the Crown.

      Emergency Regulations may not amend The Human Rights Act 1998.

      In the event of Terrorism or possible Terrorism – the movement of people or vehicles on or near to roads can be stopped, not be orders from Scottish Ministers – but by order from Secretary of State for Scotland.

    247. Cubby says:

      Breeks@11.21am

      ” The cuckoo will always be a cuckoo.” spot on.

    248. Liz g says:

      Kangaroo @ 9.57
      Can’t you work out for yourself what is and isn’t appropriate for this blogg?
      Or do you take the view “just do what you want until someone stops you”?
      Either way not a good look Kangaroo!

    249. Liz g says:

      Breeks @ 8.56
      I think yer a wee bit premature there Breeks!
      The judgement is NOT legally binding and the U.S. rent that island from the UK.
      There is no way that the UK is giving up that island any time soon.
      It’s a step to it aye I’ll grant ye that,but what else could they do….They canny exactly have a vote on it….
      But going to a Court with the backing of a vote may very well be a different story…and before you say both..one has to come first and that’s a judgement call!

    250. Nana @7.23

      If we are definitely heading for a United Ireland – and it sure as hell looks likely, then we have to make sure that we have taken the fork in the road for Indy ref 2 by then or we might find an awful lot of ‘ex-Pats’ heading for Ayrshire and other West coast towns with their orange Jackets on their shoulders.

      Yikes!!!

    251. orri says:

      https://www.parliament.scot/help/769_799.aspx
      Scottish Government
      As defined in section 12 of the Scotland Act 2012, the Scottish Government is the group of senior Ministers in the Scottish Government. It comprises the First Minister, other Ministers appointed by the First Minister under section 47 of the Scotland Act 1998, and the two Scottish Law Officers (that is, all Ministers in the devolved government other than junior Scottish Ministers). These members of the Scottish Government are known collectively in the Act as ‘the Scottish Ministers’. Informally, the term is frequently used to mean the Scottish Ministers, the Scottish Law Officers and the junior Scottish Ministers

      Fluffy is not a Scottish Minister.
      They have specifically put him in charge and excluded them

    252. Chris Kilby says:

      Heil Fluffy!

    253. Daisy Walker says:

      Thanks orri.

      Think the below, enables them to by-pass all.

      S 24 Regional and Emergency Coordinators

      Emergency regulations must require a Senior Minister of the Crown to appoint

      (a) for each part of the UK, other than England, in relation to which the regulations have effect, a person to be known as the Emergency Coordinator for that Part

      S 29 requires them to consult Scottish Ministers, and then provides statutory powers that they don’t need to if its urgent, and even if they should have, the didn’t have to.

      I’ve typed it out more over on the latest thread.



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