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Correcting the corrections

Posted on October 12, 2018 by

We’re blacklisted by the press regulator IPSO, but fortunately when we raise issues with especially blatant inaccuracies in UK newspapers alert readers sometimes take up the cudgel and file complaints with them because we can’t.

One such case was when the Daily Express published a story this summer with the eye-rubbing and creatively-capitalised headline “MAJORITY of Scots BACK BREXIT as SNP support PLUMMETS from voters backing Ruth Davidson”.

And, y’know, that’s not a very true thing to say.

So our alert reader waded into the red tape, and yesterday – four months after the original story appeared – secured a fairly prominent correction on the Express website. Which, they noticed, had only one thing wrong with it.

Can you spot it, folks?

For the less alert among you, here it is:

They politely suggested the Express might want to take another swing at it, and we’re pleased to say that the corrected correction pointing out that “correct” meant “incorrect” is now correctly in place. (Albeit with a headline which actually still rather implies that the false thing is true.)

The belated correction, of course, won’t appear in any of the syndicated news feeds which spread the original lie instantly across the world back in June:

But it’s still one more tiny partial victory for truth against lies. So that’s something.

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    1. 12 10 18 14:56

      Correcting the corrections | speymouth

    151 to “Correcting the corrections”

    1. Garrion says:

      You’re what now by IPSO? How do they justify that?

    2. James Westland says:

      That “newspaper” should be sold from under the counter wrapped in black polythene. It is worse than porn IMO. Buying filth like the Express should be a matter of deep burning shame.

    3. Effijy says:

      Institute of Propaganda Scotland Office, IPSO.

    4. gerry parker says:

      I can see that they don’t know where the % key is on the keyboard.

    5. Arbroath1320 says:

      Garrion says:
      12 October, 2018 at 1:18 pm
      You’re what now by IPSO? How do they justify that?

      I think Stu’s blacklisted by IPSO cause they are so tired of constantly being informed by the “wise man of the media watchers” of constant LIES and MISINFORMATION being spewed by the papers.

      Apparently IPSO don’t do investigations into lying newspapers too well, they much rather prefer to protect the papers. It is quite an event when an “apology” appears in a paper. Those responsible for making the request for an apology are immediately sent on a re-education course! 😀

    6. Helena Brown says:

      As an innocent, who funds IPSOS?

    7. Ian McCubbin says:

      This is laughable if it were n’t serious abuse of press priviledge.
      In an Independent Scotland this paper is toast.

    8. Proud Cybernat says:

      But when (if?) it appears in the printed edition it will be found on the bottom, left-side of an inside page (sports section mibbees) and 1 column inch if it’s lucky.

      Filthy lying toerags.

    9. jfngw says:

      Is this the IPSO policy, if you complain you will be blacklisted. In a few years, I then presume, they will declare the newspaper industry squeaky clean as they never receive any legitimate complaints.

    10. Craig says:

      Could we mount some sort of landmark legal case against IPSO and the newspapers over the constant barrage of lies? Surely nobody actually wants to be deliberately misled?

      Whilst the papers are sly and use weasel words like “could” and “might”, surely there must be a case for making sure their obviously deliberate wording of things to give the wrong impression is punishable?

    11. Big Gay Adam says:

      Apart from anything else, 19 plus 38 is 57, not 58. So it was never 58% backing Brexit to begin with. But hey, if you can twist the truth, why not skew maths too?

    12. HandandShrimp says:

      To force the Express to be even remotely accurate is an achievement.

      Should I ever feel the need to be lied to I think the Express would be my first port of call for an easy fix of dissembling.

    13. Bob Mack says:

      The important point is that it demonstrates who lies within the debate. If they have to lie repeatedly and obviously it raises the question why?. It is because their arguments are facetious and totally untrue that they have to revert to being deceitful.

      The boy who cried wolf found to his cost that trust is indeed earned and not given freely.

    14. Muscleguy says:

      In a better world with a proper press regulator instead of blacklisting you they would have used the number of well founded complaints from you as a reason to launch a widespread investigation into the lack of veracity in all the unionist newspapers in Scotland.

      What a useful thing that would be but of course that would undermine the union and since IPSO is a union defending and reliant organisation and Scottish independence would see them reduced and no public body likes the idea of their remit being reduced. This is part of the inertia of the British state and yet another reason to seek independence. We can mint a proper press regulator with teeth to replace IPSO and just ignore the lies about us in the rUK media and shrug them off only needing to correct them when with our EU colleagues we enter negotiations with them.

      I truly don’t know how the EU negotiating team manages to keep its sanity having to deal with the reality deniers on the British side. The Britain they once saw as the sensible bulwark against extremism no longer exists as we have become extreme and many will be glad to see the back of Westminster. Just like we will be.

      We can gang up with the Irish against them and they won’t like it up ’em.

    15. Petra says:

      When we get our Independence we’ll nominate you Stu to be on our very own IPSO Committee. Chairman in fact. The newspaper editors in Scotland won’t know what’s hit them and to stay in business (if there’s any left) will have to attend deprogramming therapy sessions. Confusion will reign, lol. Poor wee souls.

    16. Shamur says:

      Also 19% + 38% = 57% not the 58% ?

    17. galamcennalath says:

      People often say that corrections should be the same size, location, and style as the false report.

      That would be a start. However these are business making money from fake news. There should also be a financial penalty – eat into the takings (sales and advertising) for the day in question.

      We know a lot of it political propaganda but the business model is to make money from their niche readership by giving them the world view they want. That’s ok, a bit of a shity business, but ok. Free press and all. It all goes wrong when they use fake news, defamation, trial by media, false accusations, and undermining democracy by subterfuge and misinformation.

      There are lines a ‘free’ press shouldn’t cross. However we have a system where they can cross in order to make a net gain. Penalising to ensure a net loss would focus minds.

    18. defo says:

      Instead of PISO, maybe we could try the Saudi press control protocol.

    19. Jason Smoothpiece says:

      The failing newspapers who are of course in recipe of taxpayer’s money for the humorously titled democracy reporters, should print the truth and stop panphleteering on behalf of Westminster.

      We urgently need a new regulator as the present one doesn’t work.

      Lying inaccurate Newspapers are a danger to democracy, we need legislation. Tell lies and go to jail sort of laws.

      Was at a hospital appointment today bundles of Records Suns and Mails lying around free to read I saw one person in a very busy waiting area read one of the rags.

      Folk getting the message read these newspapers people will giggle at you. Read these papers and we will know you didn’t do well at School.

    20. Ian McGeechan says:

      You can see the tactic though. The Express pulls out in front to take the hit each time with it’s outrageous headlines. It gets away with it for however many years before it hits the buffers and the paper sinks and then another title moves into place to take over as the propagandists fall guy, and so it all begins again.

    21. Dr Jim says:

      The DUP are threatening the Tories again, the Tories are threatening the EU again, Labour are threatening to threaten the Tories again, the English people are threatening the Scottish people in fact everybody is threatening everybody with something and you know who’s coming out worst…Scotland because we never threaten anybody ….bit like our football team really so I’m off out to find someone to threaten

      I as a Scotsman will not be disenfranchised over the removal of my rights to threaten

    22. Macart says:

      Oh Jeez! And done with such grace. 😀

    23. Dan Huil says:

      Britnat media scum.

    24. Dave Albiston says:

      Er, shouldn’t there be another correction to the correction? They are just repeating the same incorrect headline. As Stu has taught us, most people only read the headline so it is just perpetuating the lie.

    25. CmonIndy says:

      The Express will burn if you take a blowtorch to it.

    26. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      The Daily Excess Express is an ecological phenomenon – it produces more effluent than even the precious natural resources it wastes.

    27. boris says:

      Another look at an old chestnut. For the younger readers

      https://caltonjock.com/2018/10/12/british-spymasters-revealed/

    28. Stoker says:

      Jason Smoothpiece wrote on 12 October, 2018 at 3:01 pm:

      “We urgently need a new regulator as the present one doesn’t work.”

      Sorry Jason, no we don’t, we need to put an end to the democratic deficit and reclaim our right of self-determination. Any media organisation controlled by London either directly or indirectly will always be corrupt and loaded against Scotland and the aspirations of her people. End London rule asap!

    29. Bob Mack says:

      Would just put the lid on EU discussions and English viewpoints if Andy Wightman and Jolyn Maughan win their case in the EU court of Justice in November really Article 50.

      Happy days ahead. English public would demand our Independence.

    30. Thepnr says:

      The attempt by the Express to say, sorry minor error we meant incorrect rather than correct is what they always say.

      I’ve heard it all before after a complaint to IPSO. This was their reply:

      Express Website

      “’Sturgeon was the problem’ SNP supporter turns on leader’s relentless rallying for indyref”

      28 June 2017

      I write in response to your complaint to IPSO that the above article was a breach of clause 1(Accuracy) of the Editors’ Code of Practice.

      You complain that the article provides ‘’totally false” information that Nicola Sturgeon has refused to hold another independence referendum within the next five years.

      After contacting the journalist, he has confirmed that that the statement was supposed to read ”Ms Sturgeon, however, did not refuse …”. As you can see, this was a minor editorial mistake changing the sentence to Nicola Sturgeon refusing to hold another independence referendum when in fact she did not.

      To resolve this issue, the website article will be amended so that the sentence will say, ”Ms Sturgeon has not however refused to hold another independence referendum in the next five years …” However, I do not believe that an apology to Ms Sturgeon is necessary in the circumstances.

      Yours sincerely

      They are relentless and will keep trying to grind you down. Glad to see that there are still some who will take them on and go the whole way.

    31. jfngw says:

      Who remembers this, one of the stars is someone called Yvonne, a local councillor.

      https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b045p8bw

    32. sandy says:

      Sorry referring back to QT last night.

      Hope you all noted Thompson’s remark. “I am not a member (pause) of the cabinet YET.

      Just about sums up this ass-wipe. Arrogance personified.

    33. Arbroath1320 says:

      Unbelievable!

      Feartie keeps telling us that there is no such thing as the magic money tree yet last year she found one! Well it must have been a magic money tree she found cause she miraculously handed £1.5 Billion over to her xenophobic sectarian best mates in the D.U.P.

      She is at it again folks!

      Yup … that non-existent magic money tree has magically reappeared! She is now, apparently, ready to hand over even MORE £MILLIONS to the D.U.P. to buy their support for any deal she brings back from Brussels.

      I don’t know about anyone else but to me the Tory government under Feartie is nothing more than a CORRUPT and FRAUDULENT operation from top to bottom! Still not to worry though eh we have the wonderful Metropolitan police force who are on the case as we speak investigating corruption and fraud in the British government. What’s that … they don’t do investigations that might have political conatations … well I’ll be blowed!

      I’d post the link to the article about this from the Sun but my archive thingy won’t archive!

      In other news I see there is a rumour over on Twitter that Penny Mordaunt, Esther McVey and Andrea Leadsom are threatening to all resign from Feartie’s cabinet over her Brexit “deal.”

      NEXT … 😀

    34. galamcennalath says:

      Dr Jim says

      The DUP are threatening the Tories again, the Tories are threatening the EU again

      They want a time limited backstop. That seems totally ridiculous when a backstop is the thing which kicks in permanently when all else has failed to deliver.

      The DUP appear to be signaling that they are still hard Brexiteers. Their main red line is that there should be no border in the Irish Sea. Given these, you have to assume they are quite happy to trash the GFA and have a hard border with the Rep..

      An interesting article in New Statesman America Edition ….

      https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2018/10/what-dup-playing-brexit

      [won’t archive]

    35. ALANM says:

      Two days after the 1970 General Election was held the Scottish Daily Express carried a front page story announcing the election of Donald Stewart as the new SNP MP for the Western Isles. There was no hint of bitterness in the way this news was reported in fact I’d go so far as to say that the editorial line from their Albion Street HQ was quite positive.

      Of course much has changed since then – Express newspapers shutdown their operations in Glasgow with the loss of hundreds of jobs and subsequently became rabidly anti-SNP. On the plus side, election results from the Highlands & Islands are now declared within hours rather than days of the ballot.

    36. jfngw says:

      @sandy

      You can understand Mr Thomson’s frustration, he looks at Mr Mundell and thinks ‘I’m better than that’. Sadly he is mistaken, he is not even as good as Mundell, and Mundell is completely useless.

    37. jfngw says:

      If you want to see the Yvonne BBC clip on YouTube I would do it prompto as I suspect the BBC will have this taken down asap once they see a link on Wings.

    38. Arbroath1320 says:

      Sorry to be the bearer of bad news peeps but that referendum thingy that we all took part in in 2014 remember? Well it NEVER happened! Seriously … it never happened. I have the proof!

      Far be it for me … a lowly Scot to disagree with the vice president of Spain over such an important issue as an independence referendum so I’m just gonna assume that what I THOUGHT happened for real was in fact only a dream that turned into a nightmare! 😀

      http://archive.is/15NAk

    39. Robert Peffers says:

      @Arbroath1320 says: 12 October, 2018 at 1:32 pm:

      ” … Apparently IPSO don’t do investigations into lying newspapers too well

      IPSO, mibbies jist – FACTO mibbies no jist say much.

    40. Arbroath1320 says:

      Just another wee O/T thingy here.

      I’ve just come across this on Twitter, it’s from the Guardian in 2014. I guess Dimblebum forgot to mention this when he sanctimoniously described Scottish education as being the worst in the UK last night then.

      http://archive.is/K4IRM

    41. Arbroath1320 says:

      Robert Peffers says:
      12 October, 2018 at 5:14 pm
      @Arbroath1320 says: 12 October, 2018 at 1:32 pm:

      ” … Apparently IPSO don’t do investigations into lying newspapers too well

      IPSO, mibbies jist – FACTO mibbies no jist say much.

      To be honest Robert I’m no so sure I trust their FACTO that much either to be honest. 😀

    42. Thepnr says:

      I suspect we’re getting near the end of the line as far as Brexit is concerned. Undoubtedly the most incompetent government and leadership that the UK has had to suffer under.

      Scotland, you want to break free. Believe me, you really do.

      A significant extension of the time limit of the transition period beyond 20 months is being secretly negotiated, to help keep the DUP on board despite cabinet pressure to limit it, according to the Guardian.

      How those ministers and backbench militant Brexiteers will react may be guessed at. How this solves the backstop problem is also unclear, rather than kicking the can down the road.

      https://sluggerotoole.com/2018/10/12/fresh-concessions-to-dup-reported-as-negotiations-near-climax/

    43. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Thepnr @ 17:43,

      Ach, my bet is that May is going to cave in to the EU, since the no-deal alternative is far worse, and with the help of some face-saving dressing-up she is going to (have to) face down her detractors and dare them to pull the plug. Corbyn Labour will passively stand by, as usual.

      Consequently, the UK will likely for an indefinite period be an EU vassal state, and (as I wrote yesterday) we are going to be the vassal state’s vassal statelet.

      Suck that up, yes-leavers, for you the worst of all possible worlds!

    44. Capella says:

      @ Arbroath 1320 – David Dimbleby’s crass sneer at Scottish education on QT needs to be called out. The Guardian article you link to certainly does that.
      I also noticed on twitter a thread addressing the shortcomings of PISA tests.

      Scotland has seen a rise in pupils securing places at university, record exam passes and leavers gaining more qualifications after school…

      PISA is calculated through a computer, running a statistical programme to predict the answers of pupils to questions they’ve not been asked.

      https://twitter.com/MammothWhale/status/858736473843134469

      These lazy unionist insults, based on nothing, are bad enough in the gutter press. But QT is produced by BBC Scotland so is paid for from the paltry fraction of the licence fee which is allocated to Scotland.
      People still paying the TV tax are paying to be lied to and insulted by ex Bullingdon Boys.

    45. Maria F says:

      Thepnr says:
      12 October, 2018 at 5:43 pm

      “A significant extension of the time limit of the transition period beyond 20 months is being secretly negotiated, to help keep the DUP on board despite cabinet pressure to limit it”

      And why I cannot stop thinking that the real reason for the “significant extension” of the transition period is not really keeping the DUP on board (you can keep them on board with the sweet carrot of another billion or even 2) but rather is desperately pushing indyref down the road until after Holyrood elections in 2021 so they can have a go, throwing the full force of the British establishment and all means necessary (including dark money, electoral commission turning a blind eye or two, full on BBC and MSM 24/7 propaganda, more propaganda from Scotland’s office in social media, more leaks from the Civil Service to pro-union newspapers and of course unconditional cooperation of the britnat troops in Lab, LibDems and Tories) to push the SNP out of its majority in Holyrood making them lose the mandate for indyref.

      I don’t bite any of it. DUP can very, very easily be kept at arm’s length (wasn’t Arlene’s DuP the gate through the the CRC Dark money got in and wasn’t she involved in the cash for ash fiasco?). Their problem is not the DUP (DUP has been kept in the loop of the EU negotiations all the time and Westminster is quite happy to leave it in the Customs union, differently to Scotland). Their problem is Scotland, Nicola Sturgeon, Alex Salmond in RT, the increasingly vocal and unruly SNP MPs, that mandate of the SNP for another referendum, a Scottish parliament fighting against their disgusting power grab and an unruly electorate in Scotland that is organising itself for independence and having the audacity to visibly walk the streets in increasing numbers demanding home rule. That is the problem of the British establishment right now because that problem is the only one that can realistically make their brexit implode. DUP and I dare say NI is not high in their list of problems. I actually wonder if it is in their list at all, as conveniently NI’s voice and ability to put pressure has been severely impaired by the lack of an active Parliament just now, leaving only the DUP, die hard unionists and easily bought, to speak for NI. Frankly, you have to wonder if the move to leave Sinn Fein totally out of the loop was engineered too.

    46. Scotspine says:

      “Its called snake oil y’awl and it’s been around for a long long time (credits Steve Earl)

    47. Thepnr says:

      @Robert J. Sutherland

      may has alraedy caved into the EU on many of her “red lines” and will do so this time as well. She was never in any position to do otherwise. Her problem now is her own cabinet and backbenchers. It will take a miracle for her to get any of this through a vote in parliament.

      You’re right though that it will all come down to Labour so let’s see.

      Meanwhile all the bullshit from the previous lot is now coming out into the open due to the Brexit fiasco. George Osborne using weasel words to justify decisions he took in Cameron’s government when he was right hand man.

      He also accuses May of “kicking the can down the road”. Politicians of his like along with many more I could name are nothing but scum thinking only ever “what’s in it for me”?.

      And, speaking about immigration, he said: “We certainly made mistakes. I’m not for a second pretending we didn’t. The immigration rhetoric was too harsh. We should have stressed the benefits of immigration I think, when it came to Europe.

      “Every politician, left and right, used Brussels as the kind of kicking post when of course most of these issues is how we want to run our own society.”

      http://archive.fo/UAOdN

    48. mike cassidy says:

      jfngw 5.03

      “I feel a fake. Do you understand?”

      No doubt a rhetorical question!

    49. jfngw says:

      I seem to remember The Robots of Death, what model was May?

      LEELA: So, explain to me how this UK market is larger on the outside than the inside.
      DOCTOR: Hmm? All right, I’ll show you. It’s because markets insides and outsides are not in the same dimension.
      (The Doctor gets two boxes from a cupboard.)
      DOCTOR: Which box is larger?
      LEELA: That one.
      (The Doctor places it on the time console then goes over to Leela with the other.)
      DOCTOR: Now which one is larger?
      LEELA: That one.
      DOCTOR: But it looks smaller.
      LEELA: Well, that’s because it’s further away.
      DOCTOR: Exactly. If you could keep that exactly that distance away and have it here, the large one would fit inside the small one.
      LEELA: That’s silly.
      DOCTOR: That’s transdimensional market engineering, a key Brexit discovery.

    50. mike cassidy says:

      If you watch one thing this weekend

      this is it.

      https://twitter.com/JamesMelville/status/1050337166709190658

      Yes, I’m imagining a Scottish equivalent!

    51. galamcennalath says:

      With Brexit there is always the elephant in the room, which must never be mentioned …. Scotland and IndyRef2. May knows Scotland will make its move and probably in response to the way Brexit pans out. No PM wants to be the last PM of the UK, so we might be ignored but I very much doubt we are forgotten.

      I guess NI being seen to have a special deal is something May is trying to avoid. Because that is cue for Scotland to say, “me too”.

      So that (I suspect) is what all this talk about all of the UK being in customs union with the EU for an extended period is all about. It solve the NI being different problem.

    52. Rock says:

      Rock (17th April 2016 “Reforming your principles”):

      “Electoral Reform Society,

      Electoral Commission,

      Information Commissioner,

      All “regulators”,

      the Scottish Justice system.

      They are all rotten to the core.”

    53. Robert Peffers says:

      Gordon Ross IndyCar posted 3 hours ago.

      Must watch for Wingers:-

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRebErRxOng&t=5s

    54. Ottomanboi says:

      When those 56 Westminster mps were elected they ought to have quit ‘the Mother of Parliaments’ immediately. Then they had clout. Now, the SNP is buffeted by forces beyond its control. The UK brexiters will probably get their desired ‘no deal’ deal and walk away happy, hand in glove with the DUP.
      Scotland will be up the classic creek its dithering leaders still hoping for someone to turn up with a paddle. Scotland is plainly a marginal affair, unless the strategy sharpens up, we’d better get used to the status for yet another generation.
      The rose-tinted specs, worn by many on here, need to be discarded. Rags like the Express are the authentic voice of ‘Britain’ and their noise will certainly increase unless we are prepared to chuck all it represents on the independence bonfire.

    55. Footsoldier says:

      Fortunately those who read the Express in Scotland are a very small minority and those who buy it even smaller.

    56. Ken500 says:

      Just as well no one reads it. It is all of nonsense. What a total waste of time and money.

      They know is an Independent Scotland they would not have a job. It is the appalling UK Gov of whom no one in Scotland votes who supports these cretins. Tax evading non Dom millionaire. In an Independent Scotland they would not have the unionist Parties patronage to keep them insulting . Pure nepotism.

      The P&J parochial broad sheet. Reporting every nonsense these unionist incompetents Tell them Lie after lie, after lie.

      Unionists Trying to get credit associated with the AWPR. These Parties blocked it for forty years, £Billion of Oil went down and nothing came back. The unionists just pocketed the lot. Of course carousing that Scotland was subsidised. A complete total and utter lie.

      No investment. The roads absolutely appalling. Congestion so bad at times people could not get to work. They sat in traffic jams for hours and then just went home if they worked p/t. Useless Labour voted against it every single time. Until the electorate got fed up with the incompetence and voted. them out.

      The Libdem solution in the rural ares of commuter areas said just take the bus. In rural areas where there wa no buses, The buses had been privatised and cut the service.The 30 years LibDem MP now a millionaire Lord. Voted in to keep the Tories out. No Labour or often SNP candidates . Quite a rural landowning areas. The only thing they managed to do was revamp the overnight train so they could use it and build a wind turbine near someone home. So they would get the remuneration. Rumbles et al ruing the local economy. Could not believe it when he gut voted in and reappeared. That swarmy git. Along with rest of them. No one can stand the sight of them. On the list. The 3rd rate losers. Many now in the House of Lords troughing it there. It is infuriating.

    57. jfngw says:

      I see Toby Young is tweeting shite about Scottish education. Makes two points, both of them incorrect. He was considered an educational expert in England, need I say more.

    58. Iain says:

      The story sums up the daily express, a lying bunch of fannys.
      To coin a phrase.

    59. Hen Broon says:

      Why have you blocked me on Twitter please?

    60. Robert Peffers says:

      @Ottomanboi says: 12 October, 2018 at 7:26 pm:

      ” … When those 56 Westminster mps were elected they ought to have quit ‘the Mother of Parliaments’ immediately. Then they had clout. Now, the SNP is buffeted by forces beyond its control.”

      And will you be the first person standing with the semi-automatic rifle in the path of the British armoured vehicle as it trundles towards you with the obvious intention of ignoring your presence? Ignoring you exist as the British Government has always treated Scots before?

      The SNP are attempting to do what no Scottish people have managed to do in the entire history of Scotland. To gain Scots their freedom without spilling a single drop of blood whether Scottish or otherwise.

      I posted Gordon Ross’s video – I did not post that I agree with him and I do NOT agree with him.

      We must not, and I use the term advisedly, jump the gun and make no mistake the Brexiteers will have no compunction putting down what they see as insurrection.

      They did it before in Scotland and for many years in Ireland. Now get this They took Wales by armed might, they took Ireland by armed might but no other country or kingdom, including the Romans has ever taken Scotland by force … and been able to hold on to Scotland.

      Scotland was the last frontier of the Roman Empire yet here we are in thrall to the Westminster Establishment. Armed conflict did not win Scotland for Westminster and it will not win back Scotland’s freedom now.

      Brains will always baffle bullshit and the SNP have brains aplenty. There are proportionately more legally trained elected MEP’s, MPs and MSPs and party officials in the SNP than any other political party in the British Isles. I believe they have matters well in hand – let them get on with their jobs.

      Bull at a gate tactics will only get many of us killed, maimed of imprisoned. As it is Westminster is quietly killing off the weakest and most vulnerable among us just now. That is a well proven fact they simply do not care who dies to get what they want.

    61. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Ottomaboi (7.26) –

      ‘…we’d better get used to the status for yet another generation.’

      What’s all this ‘we’ business?

      Plenty of us see things quite diferently and some are even content with how things are progressing.

      So why don’t you and Rock The Fingerer fuck off to a cave, pick one another’s scabs in silence and gie the rest ay us some peace?

    62. Scott says:

      O/T Sorry if this has be here before but I think this is worth keeping for when Indy2 comes along.

      Heseltine: Thatcher blew UK’s North Sea oil windfall

      In some ways my preference would have been less popular, because I wanted the money to go into investment, to create a sovereign wealth fund for example, and too much of it went into personal consumption.

      We all knew this but these barstewards said oil would run out in 10 years.

    63. Ken500 says:

      The People finally stop believing the Press incompetents and voted the SNzp in. Most of them had more sense.

      The LibDems blocked the AWPR for over ten years. They had a green as the chairman of the infrastructure committee. They blocked the expansion of the airport, the Golf development, the road provision. Blocked House building. They were building houses alongside plannned historical villages. Ruining the layout. Young fsmilies could not get a house. They had to move hours out of town and commute for hours. Putting more traffic on the roads and oesbihg young families without support of family help and baby sitters etc. Only occasionally being able to come into town for a meal, cinema or a night out.

      The biters finally got fed up and voted them out. The SNP/LibDem administrstion got into power and began to transform the City. They began improved everything. Build the Union Square project. Although some people were sceptical, at first. It was really successful. They,expanded the airport so there were direct international flights. Now people have less expensive, time consuming, tiring secondary travel. For connection. Especially for people with children or the elderly.

      The SNP. Alex Salmond got all these projects built. He got the funding. He got it all done. Then he got voted out because it was raining. People sat on their hands and would not even go out to vote.Libdems voted Tory because of Ruth Davidson and her lies. The useless Tories got in. They haven’t go a clue. Not fit to lick Alex Salmond boots. They are just trying to expand their own interests. They are trying to claim credit for nothing that has got anything to do with them. Trying to take the credit for everything that Alex Salmond has done.

      The useless cretins were selling mugs with ‘Salmond slayer’ on it. These low lives who have never had a job in their lives and could not organise a piss up in a brewery. They are are only in politics for what they can get. They are taking the electorate for mugs, but it will rebound on them.

    64. Robert Peffers says:

      @Capella says: 12 October, 2018 at 6:21 pm:

      ” … People still paying the TV tax are paying to be lied to and insulted by ex Bullingdon Boys.”

      Ah! Capella, you are of course correct. Now you may think me a cynical old guy, and you could also be correct in that too, but I believe that at least a quite large proportion of those still happy to pay for the pleasure of having propaganda piped into their homes are well aware of what they get for their money and know full well that it is lies, omissions and deliberate distortions but that is exactly what they want to hear.

      Most will know the truth but are very happy eager that it be broadcast to others.

      I simply do not believe the more prominent people who use that propaganda against Scotland and Scots, and I include in that political figures, newspaper people, broadcasters and certain Britnat organisations, do not know it is false news.

      They want to indoctrinate the more stupid people of Scotland who do believe the false narratives fed into Scottish homes 24/7/365. For those people’s wellbeing depends upon keeping, at least a majority of voters ignorant of the truth.

      That’s just another way of saying the claimed majorities we see quoted by the media have two distinct components – a smaller one that knows the truth and a larger one that believes the smaller faction’s propaganda and without that smaller factions votes there would be no majority against Scottish Independence.

      For example you will never convince me that people like David Mundell, Ruth Davidson and even Murdo Fraser are so stupid they believe the pish they spout at every opportunity. They simply use the ignorance, bigotry and sectarianism of the terminally thick to advantage.

    65. Bob Mack says:

      My grandaughter does just fine in a Scottish education. At 12 years of age she speaks passable French, Spanish and English.

      People have nostalgia for the “great” days of Scottish education, but my memories were of sitting reciting ? tables parrot fashion for what seemed hours on end, and writing the same alphabetical letters endlessly, whilst all the time avoiding the thrown board dusters and the 12 inch rule across the knuckles for any mistakes. Remember the belt?

      Kids today would not enjoy what we had. Many of my generation learned through fear of making a mistake rather than enthusiasm.

      I suppose I did well enough in spite of that, but I would not like my gran daughter to learn under such duress.

    66. Robert Peffers says:

      @Ian Brotherhood says: 12 October, 2018 at 8:13 pm:

      ” … So why don’t you and Rock The Fingerer fuck off to a cave, pick one another’s scabs in silence and gie the rest ay us some peace?”

      Chuckle! Chuckle! Best laugh I’ve had today.

    67. Haggishunter says:

      UK media (TV and newspapers) is the main weapon against Scotland, just like the Soviets, tried to indoctrinate the people’s of Eastern Europe.
      In normal countries, Germany, Ireland and Sweden, any media outlet found telling lies or manipulating the truth is shutdown.
      Non political geeks know they’re lied to, while Brit nats may think it’s normal and a correct method of maintaining their union.

    68. Ken500 says:

      Now the unionist are trying to take credit for all the successful projects in the NE that they blocked for years. Alex Salmond and the SNP got all the projects built. The AWPR the new Academy, the Sports village, with communal changing room. Not a problem and helps families, the elderly, friends, groups, additional needs groups and schools who need support to have a swim or engage in physical activities.

      The turbines in the Bay (an eyesore right enough). The airport expansion for Internstional flights cutting journeys and emissions.

      Now the useless unionists try to take credit for the AWPR, The P&J is full of them critising any delay and of course blaming the SNP. Anything that goes wrong it’s the SNP in any twisted way they can produce. The unionist incompetents who have ruined the City. Wasting public money. On grotesque monstrosity projects no one wanted. Prople were protesting in the street but they would not listen.

      If it was up to them the Road and the successful projects would never have been built. The AWPR would never have been built. So why don’t they just,completely be quiet. Alex Salmond should have been at the Opening. He should be honoured for what he has done for Scotland. Standing up for Scotland, the whole of his life,

      People just appreciate and support him. Now some pathetic civil servant is trying to bring him down, The civil servant who thinks they are FM and gets paid more. There is already one elected FM. There is no need for another. Stop trying to take credit for some thing someone else has done.

      They can shove Brexit were the sun does not shine, The lights will all go out. They wil be out on their ears soon. There should be a massive spread in the P&J documenting all the good things Alex Salmond has done for the NE and the world. A world Statesman. Haste you back Alex and good luck.

    69. Rock says:

      Ottomanboi says:
      12 October, 2018 at 7:26 pm

      “unless the strategy sharpens up, we’d better get used to the status for yet another generation.”

      I admire your optimism.

      Rock (27th August 2017 – “Underneath the Goodyear blimp”):

      “Scotland was on the verge of independence immediately after the Brexit vote.

      The unionist parties were without leaders and completely lost, the SNP had 56 out of 59 MPs and 50% of the vote, the EU’s eyes were (favourably) on Scotland.

      But Nicola squandered a once in a 1000 years golden opportunity by wasting more than a year flogging a dead horse – a separate deal for Scotland which was never going to happen.

      The result: Nicola outsmarted by the collusion between Saints Theresa and Ruth on one hand, and Corbyn on the other, fall in SNP support from 50% to 37%.

      It is my prediction that there will be a “snap” Brexit and the SNP will be caught napping and unable to hold a second independence referendum.

      Or another “snap” Westminster election with the SNP again losing support.

      Despite the pretendy “sovereignty” and boasting of the clueless pompous armchair pundits posting here, Scotland is again as far away from independence as ever.

      If they succeed in neutralising the Rev. Stuart Campbell and WOS, independence will be “stone dead” for at least 620 years.”

      Challenge to the usual suspects:

      Do you have the guts to go on the record and state that there will definitely be an independence referendum before Brexit has been completed?

      Robert Peffers and Ian Brotherhood?

      Cowards.

    70. Rock says:

      Ken500 says:
      12 October, 2018 at 8:34 pm

      “The People finally stop believing the Press incompetents and voted the SNzp in. Most of them had more sense.”

      More fake news.

      SNP support went down from 50% to 37% at the last election, with loss of half a million voters and more than 20 of the 56 MPs.

      That was all because of the Unionists United promoted by the press and very much believed by the people.

      And the SNP lost its majority in the Scottish parliament because of the fake “independence supporting” The National heavily promoting the Greens and RISE at the expense of the SNP.

      As Ottomanboi rightly says: “The rose-tinted specs, worn by many on here, need to be discarded.”

      No swearing in your reply, it is against the rules.

    71. Iain says:

      The Scots a a free and independent people who are kind and generous to all deserving nations.
      It probably isn’t a good idea for post Brexit england to piss off the main supplier of food parcels to their imploding economy.
      Then again what would the tory party be doing caring about ordinary people trying to survive.
      The elite after all have to have their tax havens free from E.U. harassment.

    72. Petra says:

      Take a look at Professor John Robertson’s credentials. Can anyone tell me why the BBC haven’t considered offering him a job or even a slot on Question Time, lol.

      https://thoughtcontrolscotland.com/2018/10/12/question-times-hatchet-job-on-scottish-education/

    73. Dr Jim says:

      Yoonsville democracy means we’re not going to tell you what you’re voting about so we can change whatever you thought it might have been and say that was what we said it was

      Yoonsville attitude to Scotland is you voted once and you don’t ever get to vote again because we’ve decided that you’ve decided on the lie we told you and it can’t be changed until we change it to another lie

      It’s kinda no wonder there’s not a country on the planet who’s sticking up for good old England at the moment

      Pretty poor reputation aboot the place

    74. Liz g says:

      Ian Brotherhood @ 8.13
      Nice One…. LMFAO

    75. Robert Peffers says:

      @Dr Jim says: 12 October, 2018 at 10:04 pm:

      ” … It’s kinda no wonder there’s not a country on the planet who’s sticking up for good old England at the moment
      Pretty poor reputation aboot the place”

      The expression, “Perfidious Albion”, goes back a very long way, Dr Jim.

      “Perfidious Albion – England considered as treacherous in international affairs, in a rendering of the French phrase la perfide Albion, said to have been first used by the Marquis de Ximenès (1726–1817). Both terms are recorded in English from the mid 19th century.”

      You could say they are infamous for it.

    76. Capella says:

      @ Robert Peffers – I wouldn’t dream of calling you a cynical old anything Robert. I agree that the politicians you mention are cynical. They pump out propaganda day and night in the hope of fooling some of the people all of the time.

      But they can’t fool all the people all the time. That is why they invented broadcasting and newspapers. They made a bit of a mistake over the internet but they are trying to remedy that as we speak.

      Let’s spoil their fun. Once people see through the big lie they never go back to being believers. 🙂

    77. Colin Alexander says:

      So, the sovereign people vote Yes to indy in an advisory referendum.

      In the EU-REf, UK Parliament turned an advisory referendum into a parliamentary vote to trigger A.50.

      So, how does the Scot Govt turn an advisory YES ( no S30) to indy? UK Parliament isnae gonnae vote for it.

      Take it to the UN? We see how that has worked in settling the Israel / Palestine situation.

      It’s a genuine question. What’s the plan? The people should know.

    78. Robert Peffers says:

      Just been watching a youtube video about the risk of a no-deal Brexit upon the Irish N. Ireland electricity links. They operate a shared system. This will stop with a Brexit.

      What they are not telling you is that the Irish arrangement depends upon the Ireland/United Kingdom interconnector and thereby hangs the tale of why it isn’t being mentioned further than that.

      “The HVDC Moyle Interconnector is a 500MW high-voltage direct current (HVDC) link between the Northern Irish and British transmission systems Auchencrosh, South Ayrshire in Scotland and Ballycronan More, County Antrim in Northern Ireland, which went into service in 2001. It is owned and operated by Mutual Energy.”

      So what happens to all Ireland electric power supplies when the Kingdom of Scotland ends the bipartite United Kingdom?

    79. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Yay!

      I can now legitimately claim a ‘Rock Fingered Me!’ badge.

      Oh, happy happy day!

      🙂 🙂 🙂

    80. jfngw says:

      Noticed some who I believe is a SNP councillor having an attack at Wings readers/twitter followers today. Basically she seems to think we are all scum that are a negative to the independence movement.

      Hate to say this but this is the type of arrogance that lead to the demise of Labour. The SNP really need to understand that insulting the people that probably are your voters is not the way to stay in power. If I lived in her area, and despite having voted SNP for 26 years now, I would find it difficult to give her my vote.

      Also another SNP councillor referred to those that have legitimate concerns about issues being described as wingnuts, they seem to be moving into that Labour area were they just assume support.

      If the SNP want to retain power they need to wind down the insults from their elected representatives.

    81. Robert Peffers says:

      @Colin Alexander says: 12 October, 2018 at 10:41 pm:

      ” … So, the sovereign people vote Yes to indy in an advisory referendum.”

      Awa an bile yer heid, Colin. While doing so learn some Scottish and English history.

      There is no such thing under the legally independent law of Scotland as an advisory referendum.

      The people of Scotland voting in that referendum are legally sovereign and a sovereign’s word is law and the Scots have never relinquished or delegated their legal sovereignty to anyone on a permeant basis.

      Under the Kingdom of England law the Queen of England is legally sovereign but in 1688 by the Glorious Revolution when the English Parliament rebelled and deposed their rightful monarch they skipped all the Catholics in the direct line and invited Mary of Orange to assume the throne.

      Mary refused because she did not want her husband, William, as a consort. The English parliament then offered the crown to the couple as joint monarchs – on condition they legally delegated the English Parliament their Divine Right of Kings – a.k.a. sovereignty.

      Thus the people of England are legally Her Majesty’s subjects but they get to elect those who are Her Majesty’s delegates.

      When a voter in Scotland elects anyone to any tier of government they delegate their sovereignty to the elected person. Thus if those elected delegates hold a referendum they are using the sovereignty of the people and it cannot be other than the sovereign choice of the sovereign people of Scotland.

    82. Meg merrilees says:

      O/T

      I notice that the Daily Torygraph front page is stating that the EU is proposing a transition deal to last until the end of 2021…… to allow the N Ireland issue time to settle.

      Thinly disguised excuse to allow another G. Election by then – T May if still PM would hope to no longer need the DUP so could agree anything but surely the main reason is to hopefully get rid of SNP majority and confound the mandate for Indy ref 2 referendum.

      Rees-Mogg etc. won’t allow that deal even if it eases tensions over UK splits.

    83. Robert Peffers says:

      @jfngw says: 12 October, 2018 at 10:58 pm:

      ” … If the SNP want to retain power they need to wind down the insults from their elected representatives.”

      I think we can fairly call that diatribe by jfngw an anti-SNP sweeping generalisation.

      Don’t blame the whole party for a couple of numpties who are certainly not representative of the party in general and such as the leadership in particular.

      I’d be willing to bet that they have already been quietly taken aside and had the error of their ways gently pointed out to them.

    84. Hamish100 says:

      Rock ottomanboy . One in the same

    85. Thepnr says:

      @Ian Brotherhood

      Shouldn’t have waited and only needed to ask about the “I’ve been fingered by Rock” badges, I’ve a few old ones going spare that you could have had for nothing.

      They’re pretty worthless anyway, due to an over abundance in the market. No one really wants to own one, a bit like Rock.

    86. Robert Peffers says:

      Breaking news 45 Minutes ago:-

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crBsdatZzas

    87. yesindyref2 says:

      If the Brits can try to kidnap everything about Scotalnd including our whisky, I guess we can do the same. Just a verse, can’t be bothered about the rest.

      Colin to right of them,
      Colin to left of them,
      Colin in front of them
      Dribbled and floundered;
      Spouted at with sh*t and shill,
      Boldly they rode and well,
      Into the jaws of Freedom,
      Into the Glen of Tranquility
      Rode the one hundred.

      Pass the bottle.

    88. Dr Jim says:

      Email just in from the party I have been successful in passing the 7th level of SNP acceptance which gives me access to the golden door of knowledge and if I answer the hopping bonus question the secrets of the monkey kingdom shall be mine which means I will be told when the referendum is

      It’s true It’s all true

    89. Dan Huil says:

      Hey, guys! Efter splashing oot on a “vile cybernat” sweatshirt Ah’m nae aboot to buy anither ane saying “wingnut”. Although…

    90. Colin Alexander says:

      Robert Peffers

      Ta for your interpretation of history / sovereignty. Now to current affairs.

      When we are told Westminster’s Holyrood subservient branch office held an advisory opinion poll but only UK Parliament MPs can decide the UK constitutional matters of the UK and the MPs are not going to vote for the end of the Union, what then?

    91. Colin Alexander says:

      Scotland votes: Aye

      UK Govt / UK Parliament says: No

      Simple question: What then?

      Jokes, insults, ignoring me etc, doesn’t make that big question go away.

    92. Robert Peffers says:

      Breaking news 80 minutes ago:-

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yDjz4TP2k0

    93. Dr Jim says:

      Lib Dem Baroness Jolly in the HOL says Scotland has a *fantstic health system* and went on to praise the Scottish government for its policy on nursing bursaries

      Willie Rennie must be in his shed when these things are happening

    94. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Colin Alexander at 11.44

      Why would we even factor in at this point a possibility that the UK will ignore the United Nations Charter to which it is an original signatory and the Scottish Claim of Right which was just reconfirmed in the UK parliament a few weeks ago?

      I have to say I have a better opinion of our neighbours than you appear to have.

      If however they do decide to try to block us we then have to adopt to suit that circumstance but we have to go through all the proper procedures before we consider any other circumstance.

    95. Cubby says:

      BRITNAT WARS

      Britnats are fighting each other all over the UK.

      On the other hand Britnats on Wings are just complementing each other. Are the Britnats sitting in the same office together or it is just the same person. Either way Britnats on Wings get with the programme and start fighting with each other.

      Especially boring boring boring Rock just cut and pasting the same crap for about a year now.

    96. yesindyref2 says:

      OT
      I see there’s a bit of a stramash because Lynn Henderson, president of the Scottish Trades Union Congress and a Labour Yes supporter say the SGC didn’t consult them, whereas the SGC say they did. The SGC aren’t actually good at public relations, they seem to have adopted a defensive attitude.

      The thing is this, the SGC Report can be seen as a safe neoliberal backstop plan for iScotland which went down well with the financial community. And that’s something we can quote if asked about the economy – there is what I’d call a Plan B which can be followed and Scotland goes safely into Independence.

      All the SGC had to say was: “If we had consulted the STUC you would have wanted major changes, this is “A” plan for Independent Scotland, it isn’t “THE” plan. It’s a safe backstop for debate, and even fallback.”.

      I’ve never even bothered reading it, just what I read about it. I want our own currency, and have been converted to the MMT way, so the neoliberal SGC report in substance is anathema to me, except as a very short transition – if that. Personally I’d like to see both sterlingisation AND our own currency from Day 1. It’s what we have now after all, in effect, our own £4 billion worth of Scottish currency in our pockets.

      But that’s what all the different groups and parties can come up with – different plans for Independent Scotland, as indeed Common Green (?) did. The SGC isn’t a political party, it’s not therefore going to implement its Report if elected. But their report is a safe, if undesirable, haven.

    97. Ghillie says:

      Meg Merrilees @ 11.08 pm and Robert Peffers @ 11.21 pm

      The plot thickens.

      And, it’s as if the Good Friday Agreement is going through a shredder slowly.

      What a Pandora’s Box these idiots have opened.

      As for the Express, what a shower of lying chancers.

      Hope everyone is keeping safe during this rain and wind! Thinking of you Cearc =)

    98. Robert Peffers says:

      @Colin Alexander says:12 October, 2018 at 11:44 pm:

      ” … Jokes, insults, ignoring me etc, doesn’t make that big question go away.”

      Have you considered Colin, that the reason for the jokes, insults and ignoring’s is that you have had the answers to the questions you pose answered many times already and what is more explained in great detail that has involved people in much valuable time.

      That particular question has been answered in detail on several sites including Wee Ginger Dug and Wings within the past few days.

      The SG already challenged Westminster upon the legality of the People of Scotland’s legal sovereignty in the Westminster Supreme Court. It was made by way of a statement of its existence.

      The UK Government did not challenge that statement. i.e. they legally acknowledged it. The legal standing is that royal sovereignty has no place under Scots law. This drew the international court into the matter. So there is already a challenge before the international court and they have announced it will be fast tracked.

      If Holyrood is legally sovereign and the Treaty of Union is what it says it is, A union of two Kingdoms, then Holyrood can legally end the Union if it has the sovereign people’s mandate.

      Bear in mind the whole Holyrood Parliament already has voted a mandate for another referendum pending unspecified major constitutional change – and no matter how Brexit pans out – that is a major constitutional change by even being on the table.

      So there you go – Nicola asks for a section 30 even although she doesn’t need one and Westminster has no options that makes any difference. If they refuse it is a major constitutional change. If they don’t we get our referendum anytime that Holyrood wants it anyway.

    99. Jason Smoothpiece says:

      Stoker

      No argument mate you are of course right, however in the short term new regulator please.

      In the longer-term a promise of consequences for those who acted against the interest of Scotland following independence

    100. pete says:

      Dr Jim
      I thought it was level 8 as in the gov in wm is 8 s**t.

    101. Jim McIntosh says:

      Totally agree with Gordon Ross suggestion need to get off our knees and start to actually do something to show that we are not going to be so passive from now onwards. Think it will also give boost to indie camp while waiting for the whistle to go over the top and heading for the DATE.

    102. Dr Jim says:

      @Pete

      It’s all top secret, high level, need to know, condition red stuff us SNPers of the high grade get to know, it’s like the magic circle but only magicar, we have to wear special things that only we know about and we do rituals down in the bowels of Holyrood that I can’t talk about on pain of expulsion and that is painful I’ve seen folk expulsed Oohft not a pretty sight, but it’s glorious to be in and better than oot

    103. pete says:

      @ Dr Jim
      its all going to blow up in there faces if it wasn’t going to cause trouble to the people it would be fun to watch but its the damage that will happen, as it has only started I think the SNP will call indi ref 2 at the right time information is power and a early jump is not needed, I am a see the whites of there eyes type, they think its easy but have overdone it, also what is happening about the Gib border nothing in the gov controlled press.

    104. Cactus says:

      Aye, they tipp-ex’d out their corrections then wrote it back in, in invisible ink.

      4 hours remaining to go till toontime, like hopefully (like approx.)

      Number ‘2’ is under the tree. 😉

      Opening soon.

    105. Cactus says:

      And now…

      A piss-take dedication to the Express:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bc6qFpbAgwM

      Go fack yourself you facking fack.

      Now England’s getting fracked.

      Somebuddy call a Dr hehe.

    106. Hamish100 says:

      Can we impose tariffs on both bits of ireland so we’re not undercut?

    107. Breeks says:

      I disagree with the written Constitution as proposed.

      I don’t disagree with the sentiments of a Republic which protects the welfare of its citizens, but I believe that should be a Covenant between the State and the People, because over time, these needs ands capacities might change and become obsolete. Look at the US Constitution and the right to bear arms. These issues are important, and yes constitutional (small C), but they are also ephemeral to a degree.

      Keep Scotland’s written Constitution as short and succinct as possible, and unalterable for all time. The People of Scotland are Sovereign.

      BUT, our Constitution comes with an instruction book. A “Covenant” which can address the ever evolving issues such as social provision and human rights, and also formalise the prevailing interpretation of the written Constitution.

      For example, the written Constitution correctly affirms that the people of Scotland are Sovereign. Hence we thus need a Covenant to define what constitutes being a person of Scotland, and address anomalies unique to Scotland whereby a Scottish citizen, is sovereign from birth, but cannot vote until 18. That is a Constitutional anomaly which needs clarity. But say too, for example we wanted the voting age reduced to 16, we can or could a adapt the Covenant to suit the new criteria, and leave the essential written Constitution unaltered and sacrosanct in perpetuity.

      The written Constitution should be the nucleas of Sovereignty and nothing more. For everything else we need a Covenant. It is an important distinction which we should get right from the off.

    108. Dorothy Devine says:

      Just been shauchlin’ round my wee heid – could the BBBC buy the Dire Scotsman under an assumed entity for continuity of ‘Scotland is ordure and deserves nothing but contempt’ > After all the BBBC is so good at the contempt.

    109. Stoker says:

      Thought some readers would be interested in seeing this if you haven’t already done so. They appear to be organised? lol

      http://www.electionpolling.co.uk/tactical-voting/snp

    110. wull2 says:

      My opinion Keep Scotland’s written Constitution as short as possible The People of Scotland are Sovereign.
      The more you have in it, the more people can argue over it.

    111. Nana says:

      I’ve not read this right through, lots of links and references to Scotland. ‘Brookings’ for some reason made me stand up and take notice so perhaps a Winger with some spare time could take a look
      Divided kingdom: How Brexit is remaking the UK’s constitutional order
      https://www.brookings.edu/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/FP_20181005_divided_kingdom.pdf

      https://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/anger-and-dismay-after-labour-back-tracks-on-pledge-to-scrap-universal-credit/

      https://www.thecanary.co/uk/2018/10/11/how-many-privileged-columnists-does-it-take-to-silence-one-black-woman/

      http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2018/10/12/how-far-might-the-market-fall/

    112. cearc says:

      Wot no ‘toon? Greets, quietly.

      Ghillie, thanks for the concern but we haven’t had that storm. No rain yesterday but one almighty, sudden, blustery,blast of wind yesterday afternoon which sent the chooks rushing under the trees. Lots of rain mon and tues but I was asleep on and off all of both days, recovering from the weekend’s jaunt.

    113. Nana says:

      Brexit: culpable naïveté
      http://eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=87022

      Right then, let’s talk about the no-deal notice for Free Trade Agreements. Totally inadequate. Read on if you want to know the details (and to get better advice – for free!)
      https://twitter.com/DavidHenigUK/status/1050737021885579264

      http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2018/10/12/the-lights-are-flashing-red-in-northern-ireland/

      Schengen in ‘danger’ after Nordic countries bring in border controls
      http://archive.is/XxtBL

    114. Famous15 says:

      I am on a different planet today listening to BBC,to hear about horrendous road and rail turmoil,major problems in education and NHS cancer treatment BUT YET HOWEVER the tone was sympathetic to Government and not one minister was even mentioned never mind asking for a resignation.

      Here in this wonderful place south of north I had the streets to myself because a princess married a sales rep. The rain is much wetter here.

      I now undersand why our cult leader,some would and do sustitute that”L”,why he gets so grumpy.As my grandad used to say you can only % with the % you were given.

    115. Tackety Beets says:

      Mmmmm. Nae Rubens e day ??

    116. Nana says:

      Theresa May faces cabinet revolt over customs union plan
      http://archive.is/lr81M

      https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/brexit-the-truck-driver-and-20-tonnes-of-frozen-chicken-1.3660279

      ‘The EU Referendum – Something Doesn’t Smell Right’ it’s all about money, people and data – thankfully at Brexitshambles, as in Canada, we’re not too concerned with ‘Political Sensitivities
      https://twitter.com/brexit_sham/status/1050807964863488000

    117. Ken500 says:

      The Royal wedding. What a display. ‘Let them eat cake’. Marie Antoinette. The Tory Royals and their cronies.who tax evade and cause mental health problems. Charles receives £20Million a year and pays £2Million in tax. A 10% tax rate. The Royals and their cronies have evaded tax for years. The majority of guests will be tax evaders. illegally paying tax. The UK Gov does not enforce the tax Laws so unionist politicans and their associates can evade tax and steal more public money. Embezzle public funds.

      The people cause mental health problem They are sanction and starving people, with mental health problems to death, They are raising awareness of something that they cause. £thousand dresses and shoes when people are starving. Privilege and abuse. There actions abuse people. They are total hypocrites.,

      The Royals and their cronies are breaking International Law and taking part in illegal wars. Taking part in illegal wars killing and maining millions of people and causing mental health issues They are not supposed to take part in political matters, but they do. They are supposed to be non political and.act legally.

      The Royals and their cronies are causing hardship for vulnerable people. They are Party to sanctioning and starving people, causing miser, pain and causing mental health problems. £400,000 a year for ten years is being spent renovating Buck palace. The Royals are financed with public money, They are worth £Billions because they have evaded tax for years. There extravagance is legendary of excess and over consuming. Creating a load of extra rubbish and destroying the Planet. Then blaming other people for it.

      They are total hypocrites.. Head of the dark orange lodge. A misogynist, racist, bigoted secret organisation. An illegal association. The Royals are supposed to be apolitical. They are not at all. They are supposed to be a non political Head of State. They are not. They betray their status every day. Someone should remind them of their duties and they should act accordingly. Some people are obsessed with this dysfunctional family of ignorance. They might give people an item of amusement but they are causing many of so much pain and misery backing up this uncouth, dangerous Westminster unionist Gov.

      Brexit is causing people mental health problems. People are now so worried, anxious, stressed and not sleeping properly. They are developing health problems and not eating properly. Worrying about others not getting enough food. Worrying about Brexit is making people ill, tired causing mental health problems.

      People join the SNP for what they can give. People join the unionist Parties for what they can get. May and the unionist politicans.sre a disgrace. They follow the line ‘Let people eat cake’. Soon they will be gone leaving their mess behind them.

      Vote SNP/SNP. Vote for Independence. Flying like Wings. Over the top of the opposite they have not got a clue. Thanks Rev Stu for all you do. You are a hero.

      Any SNP representative critising Wings will soon be deselected. Do not go there. Take a bit of advice. An action of complete self harm, Or apply for some support.Take a leaf from Dugdale and reconsider the situation. La la belle land. Faulks enabler did not get far for telling lies. Got demoted. Serves them fight. Putting up with all their nonsense. Proole are sick of it.

    118. TJenny says:

      Tackety Beets – According to WOS twitter, there be gremlins in the ‘tronics which are preventing the Cairns’ toon appearing. Stu’s trying to fix it, so fingers crossed.

    119. Simple outlook I know, but constitutions usually cause conflict, as they are used for reference when someone strays from the literal definition. Just ask the churches. Most of the splits and havoc have been and still are stimulated by the too literal use of their constitutions.

    120. stu mac says:

      @Robert Peffers says:
      12 October, 2018 at 11:05 pm
      @Colin Alexander says: 12 October, 2018 at 10:41 pm:

      ” … So, the sovereign people vote Yes to indy in an advisory referendum.”

      I think the notion of an advisory referendum has been blootered out the park by the reaction of Westminster politicians to their own advisory EU referendum. Apparently that “advisory” referendum is set in stone and is the “will of the people”.

      Of course, aside from your own arguments re sovereignty of our people, there is the fact that any clear win in an independence referendum would be recognised by the UN as “the will of the people” and the UK would be under great pressure to recognise it (especially nowadays when they seem to have ticked off everybody bar the DUP).

    121. robertknight says:

      As sure as eggs is eggs, if this’d been a former SNP councillor (as opposed to Labour) then the Britnat Brainwashing Channel would’ve mentioned it multiple times throughout the article. As it is…

      https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-45836795

    122. Robert Peffers says:

      @Jim McIntosh says: 13 October, 2018 at 1:15 am:

      ” … Totally agree with Gordon Ross suggestion need to get off our knees and start to actually do something to show that we are not going to be so passive from now onwards.”

      Ane or twa AUOB mairchers did you in oor capital city twa/three days whiles., Jim.

      ” … Think it will also give boost to indie camp while waiting for the whistle to go over the top and heading for the DATE.”

      Oh! Aye! That comment, “Over the Top”, has a ring to it, Jim. Has connotations of WWI and trench warfare in which the Scottish regiments played such a prominent part. Which is why there are a far greater number of Scottish names on war memorials than any other country in the British Isles.

      Add that to the Westminster claims that Westminster hold full legal sovereignty over the devolved parliament at Holyrood and heir reaction will be to use your proposed actions as insurrection, (as did the Spanish Government when Catalonia held a referendum and used violence to curtail what they claimed was illegal Catalonian insurrection.

      Meanwhile, your claims that Holyrood and the SG/SNP are inactive is sheer and utter lies.

      The SG have claimed, (in the Westminster Supreme Court), that the legal position as stated in, “The Treaty of Union”, that is the legal agreement of only the two signatory KINGDOMS with signatures, (and independent), royal seals on the Treaty document states that the two kingdoms legal systems are sacrosanct for ever and, by not contesting that claim, have legally acknowledged it but then gone on to ignore it.

      The SG responded by referring the matter to the international court which has already accepted the case and in view of current events have publicly stated they will fast track the matter as being urgent.

      The International court has little option than uphold the SG claim as under English Kingdom law, (three countries), the Queen of England is legally sovereign but must legally delegate her Divine Right of Monarchs, (sovereignty), to the parliament of the Kingdom of England but no such parliament has existed since 30 April 1707. The Westminster Parliament that sat on 1 May 1707 and has sat there until the present day is, and calls itself, Her Majesty’s Parliament of Her United Kingdom.

      The problem with that is that Their Majesty’s United Kingdom that Westminster claims was, “A Union of the Crowns”, was only a personal union of the monarch itself and also included Their Majesty’s Crown Protectorates of Jersey, Guernsey and Man which even today are not part of the United Kingdom government but are, and will remain, parts of Her Majesty’s personal United Kingdom no matter what happens over Brexit.

      This because Westminster is claiming to take Britain out of the EU but Britain is not an EU member state. The United Kingdom Government, (not Her Majesty’s personal United Kingdom), is the member state and thus cannot take Britain out of an EU all Britain is not a member of.

      So there you go- your claims that the SNP/SG are doing nothing is sheer, and not very thick, mince.

      Let the Scottish Government, which incidentally, has held a cross-party vote in Holyrood and won it, get on with legally fighting Westminster through the international court system where, if they succeed, the Scottish government can legally, if it has a mandate, declare the United Kingdom over forever – and hopefully without a drop of anyone’s blood staining the kingdom of Scotland.

      After which victory I would expect an open debate upon Scotland claiming that as Her Majesty did nothing whatsoever to uphold her duty as Protector of the people’s legal sovereignty to drive her out, as stated in the Declaration of Arbroath, or better still declare Scotland a republic and ditch the monarchy forever.

    123. Cubby says:

      I took in Galloway’s programme this morning on RT. He seemed pretty sober but it didn’t stop him talking a lot of pish. Galloway had an English Britnat on to give us the benefit of his wisdom and knowledge about Scotland. The SNP/ desire for independence is fading away he says. Everything in Scotland is rubbish because Sturgeon goes on about independence all the time and needs to get on with the day job. This guy must have been reading the Daily Express.

      Galloway actually makes a comment to the effect that in his role in the programme he has to put the other side of the argument then fails to do so. He prepeats the once in a lifetime referendum lie. He repeats the new Catalonia style misrepresentation of a referendum ex sect 30.

      In summary lying Britnats are everywhere in the media even on RT.

    124. Meindevon says:

      Did anyone see a Dr Richard Foster on GGs RT Sputnik show just now?

      Well, NS never talks about anything except independence, not getting on with Scotland’s dire nhs, education, etc. May will not allow anothe Indy ref and NS will accept that because support for independence is failing as the last elections show, remain in U.K. numbers are increasing and on and on.

      Every single Unionist put down he covered. This guy must be a member of SIU surely.

    125. defo says:

      TJenny says:
      13 October, 2018
      “Tackety Beets – According to WOS twitter, there be gremlins in the ‘tronics which are preventing the Cairns’ toon appearing. Stu’s trying to fix it, so fingers crossed.”

      That’s Man code for ‘we found which pub he’s in, expresso has been applied, and sketching currently underway’ Jenny. 🙂

    126. Meindevon says:

      @Cubby

      Haha, I wasn’t the only one who saw it then.

    127. Cubby says:

      Meindevon@10.23

      Bloody appalling wasn’t it. The guy must be from SIU or Galloway gave him a script to follow. I used to think Galloway talked pish because he was pissed but when you seem him sober he still talks piss. Galloway just another self promoter.

      Talking about self promoters is R Spear just another CBoyd/A. haggerty. With friends like these who needs enemies.

    128. TJenny says:

      Aaand the Cairns’ toon is up 🙂

    129. Tackety Beets says:

      T Jenny @ 9.40 am

      Thanks , I noticed the tweet after my post.

      Wings Twiiter Feed Is our next go too in the morning.

      Despite a joornalist telling us not to follow Wings yesterday ……..eh ……what.

    130. TJenny says:

      And it’s in colour, worth waiting for.

    131. jfngw says:

      @Robert Peffers

      I have spotted you modus operandi, anyone who has less than glowing comments on the SNP is labelled as anti-SNP and then often subjected to your insults. Expecting some discipline from elected members is not anti-SNP, in fact I would consider it the exact opposite.

    132. mike cassidy says:

      Dr Russell Foster.

      https://www.kcl.ac.uk/sspp/departments/european-studies/people/staff/academic/fosterr.aspx

      Galloway’s man for all things European.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uuHV84bJqc

      Clearly an individual immersed in a deep understanding of Scotland and its politics.

    133. gus1940 says:

      RK at 9.55

      Reading the article on BBC news it immediately became clear that as no party was mentioned she couldn’t possibly have been an SNP councillor.

    134. ahundredthidiot says:

      Now you see how the German people were tricked in the 30’s

    135. Welsh Sion says:

      IPSO = I Piss Scotland Off

    136. Robert Peffers says:

      @ jfngw says: 13 October, 2018 at 10:47 am:

      ” … I have spotted you modus operandi,

      I had no idea it was in any way hidden. That being so it must have strained your intellect a bit to spot it.

      ” … anyone who has less than glowing comments on the SNP is labelled as anti-SNP and then often subjected to your insults.”

      What insults might that be, jfngw? Oh! Wait up – that’ll be the ones YOU perceive to be insulting then, jfngw?

      ” … Expecting some discipline from elected members is not anti-SNP … “

      Oh! Get a grip upon reality. There is no other political party in Scotland that has a hope in hell of gaining Scottish independence than the SNP. Then we have those, some right here on Wings, who are accusing the SNP of becoming part of, “The Establishment”, and getting far too cosy with the so called easy life of being Westminster privalidge MPs.

      Trouble with that idiocy is there is absolutely not a shred of truth in it. For starters the SNP are the hardest working group in the Westminster Parliament and the figures to prove that are those recorded in Hansard. The SNP are proportionately the best attending party in debates in the chamber.

      Not only that but they have the highest proportion of MPs who have given up far more financially rewarding careers in order to be MPs. Many were practicing Lawyers and there is one who is a leading surgeon and consultant. They are also, as a group, the most distant from their constituencies and thus have to work and travel more to do their jobs.

      But here’s the crunch, those doing the rubbishing of the SNP while claiming to be Indy supporters claim, “The SNP is doing nothing”, and that is a bare face lie and I have already pointed out on this very thread that is a bare face lie.

      The SG legal lot made the claim of the Scottish people’s sovereignty in the Westminster Supreme Court and the UK Government made no attempt to even question that statement of fact. That, in law is taken as an acceptance the claim stands unless it is challenged.

      Even if it is then challenged it is then not up to the United Kingdom parliament to decide the matter it is up to the judges of the Supreme Court and they must be seen to be unbiased and explain their legal judgements and back them with correct legal arguments. The point being that as Scottish Law has indeed remained independent since the Treaty of Union any claim, based upon the Treaty of Union being wrong after 311 years is laughable.

      That brings up rather a lot of constitutional arguments that Westminster really, really does not want to surface for any one of them also has the capacity to end the union.

      It really is simple, though, if the people of Scotland are legally sovereign then Westminster cannot be sovereign if the sovereign people of Scotland say Westminster does not represent them.

      Yet numpties are accusing the SNP of doing nothing and others claiming the best performing parliament in the United Kingdom are not doing their day job. If they are not – tell us, jfngw, who has been doing it for them?

      We have had over three centuries of Westminster strong arm tactics, not forgetting 40 years of armed occupation and forced suppression up to the Scots by English Unionist troops until the Battle of Culloden in 1745, but the suppression of Scots did not end there.

      There are Scottish towns with place names like Fort William and Fort Augustus that testify to them being English garrisons in Scotland.

      Westminster forcibly suppressed our languages, our music and our unique mode of dress. The very treaty of union itself is testament to sectarianism and deliberate English efforts to suppress even the Scottish Protestant faiths but mainly Roman Catholicism. Yet the Treaty itself has articles of union that prevent the Royal person from being head of the Scottish Protestant Faiths.

      Westminster has, from day one of the Union treated Scotland with utter contempt and has broken many, many terms of the treaty. Any one of which is grounds for the treaty to end.

      Yet here you are claiming the SNP/SG for doing nothing yet the SNP/SG is contesting our people’s sovereignty in the World Court. You simply will not gain independence by standing in the path of Westminster armoured divisions and throwing Saltires, bagpipes and kilts at them.

      Think about it – the unionists of Stirling had British Armed Forces Day to prevent Scottish commemorations and the Edinburgh lot tried to prevent AUOB the use of the Queen of Scots Park. They were, in both cases, prepared to use Scots Law against legally sovereign Scots for the benefit of British unionists. Yet here we have the SG/SNP taking Westminster to the Westminster Supreme Court and then onto the international courts and you claim they are doing nothing.

      311 years of strong arm suppression has not been deflected by Scots by railing against Westminster while Westminster did just as Westminster pleased.

      Yet now AUOB and the SG/SNP have stopped Westminster in their tracks by use of insistence of the people of Scotland’s sovereignty.

      Brains baffles bullshit every time.

    137. Gary says:

      There should be some kind of ‘three strikes and you’re out’ rule.

      So, if you’re caught lying three times you shouldn’t be able to call yourselves a ‘newspaper’ any more and have to have a warning on the front page along the lines of ‘none of this is true’ perhaps above the title of the rag.

      Maybe instead of ‘newspaper’ they could be called ‘LIARpapers’?

      It’d be good if there was some kind of in-house fact-checker on newspapers and maybe even a regulatory body that actually DID something, like force the papers to retract lies and check they’ve actually done it.

      But then, that would stop them propagandising, wouldn’t it?

    138. Chick McGregor says:

      To paraphrase the late, grate, Frankie Howard, ‘Never has my IPSO been so factoed.’

      IPSO has gloriously, along with the Electoral Commission, the BBC, the Supreme Court and many other great politically independent (cough!) institutions, played its full part, in resurrecting the Bringlish Empire part II.

      OK it may be hovering, temporarily, in the air above an enormous chasm, Wile E. Coyote-like, but that last middle-fingered show of bravado is glorious,…. err isn’t it?

    139. Sinky says:

      Cubby says at 10.36 am unfotuneatly some do not progress from student gender politics which has got more strident since my day and can’t focus on the bigger picture of self determination for our nation.

    140. JLT says:

      I’m just quietly shaking my head. Talk about downright vindictive petulance.

      They might be pretending to apologise. But to whom?

      Certainly not to the 52% of folk who believe that independence is a real and viable option. Certainly not to themselves. Nor the English electorate if they saw the same headline. And most certainly not the fanatical BritNat voter who believes that 80% of Scotland voted ‘Leave’.

      And we used to laugh at Russian Pravda. Welcome to the British media of the 21st Century.

      The only good thing is though, that most of Scotland detests the Express, so hopefully, they’ll eventually go the same way as The Scotsman.

      And when that moment comes …good riddance to them.

    141. Meg merrilees says:

      Robert Peffers @ 3.23

      You mentioned that WM has forcibly suppressed our language – well they’re still at it.

      If this proposed New Act of Union is accepted then in trying to implement it there will be a UK wide referendum. The questions posed will be written in English and Welsh only and NO other language – so yet again WM rubs the noses of our gaelic speaking family in the dirt.

      Barstewards the lot of them

    142. Willie says:

      @jlt

      Your comment about the Scotsman being down and just about out is very much the way that the Express will go.

      It is a real pity that Alex Salmond did not get control of the debris that is now the remnants of the Scotsman. The title is worth something because of its history but the current content is worth nothing.

      The success of Wings, Bella Caledonia, Common Space are examples of the very real demand out there for good reading. indeed, as the on-line media matures, and folk move away from the traditional and now dying paper based outputs, it is difficult not to see a resurgence of demand for good on-line titles with good on line content.

      So yes, people I do believe will pay for good journalism once the old and dying models of old are gone. Nature abhors a vacuum, and there is a future to come.

      We wouldn’t all be reading Wings if we didn’t think that, and there’s many a dying dinosaur like the Express that would love to have a readership like Wings.

      And so to the visionaries, a term I use appropriately, I very much applaud those who contribute and maintain titles like a Wings et al. There is a future. Good journalism and reporting will always be read no matter what the medium.

      And as the Scotsman, or what is left of it, it is up for sale again, as it’s daily sales plummet below 5,000 and it’s online readership stalls at a fraction of what Wings readership is.

      But an online journal, utilising the long established name of let us say the Scotsman, but with community based ownership and control, displaying good journalism and content, isn’t that something that could be a benefit to an independently minded Scotland.

      So let us all give our support to the current crop of newbies who are not now so new and who are doing a fantastic job supporting independence. There is a void to be filled as the dinosaurs die their slow death.

    143. David Briggs says:

      It isn’t a ‘Newspaper’. It’s a comic, with a similar fan base to ‘The Beano’, or ‘The Dandy’. The readership tends to be elderly in Scotland.

    144. t nicholson says:

      It is possible we could have a GE soon,but who do we vote for?.Corbin I do not trust.So how about this…people in NI vote for Remain parties..WELSH,for Plaid Cymru..Scotland for SNP ..that leaves England! The only party they can vote for is Lib Dems The only party to say they would stop it
      So they form a coalition and Stop Brexit Best of all we would have the Tories and the Labour party on the opposition benches!! And best of all we will have broken the whole rotten cycle of UK politics at long last,



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