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A bit of spot colour

Posted on May 19, 2020 by

We thought readers might be interested in a small update on yesterday’s post. As we told you, Graham Shields – the Head of Strategic Communications and Engagement at the Crown Office and Procurator Fiscal Service who fobbed off our complaint about newspapers enabling the identification of sexual assault accusers – was the editor of the Evening Times until he was let go in December 2017.

Which is just two months after this happened:

So you’d think that if anyone knew what jigsaw identification looked like, he would.

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    1. 19 05 20 16:56

      A bit of spot colour | speymouth

    140 to “A bit of spot colour”

    1. Craig Murray says:

      And yet Mr Shields was not charged at the time with Contempt of Court? How very fascinating.

    2. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Curiouser and curiouser…

    3. Julia Gibb says:

      Keep digging please. I am certain much more is to be uncovered.

    4. Bob Mack says:

      “Hypocrasy is the resin that holds the plywood of Society together” Maier.

    5. winifred mccartney says:

      You only get charged with contempt of court if you are a Salmond supporter – surely you know that.

    6. Mike K says:

      Best wee corrupt country in the world?

    7. Sharny Dubs says:

      The scales of justice are not well balanced me thinks.

      Keep on keeping on Stu

    8. tom kane says:

      Okay… that has actually crossed the rubicon… There’s so much Alice in Wonderland to be lived right now, but that has just gone right over the rainbow and it turns out we are still in Kansas.

      The toothless press complaints commission gives a paper a slap on the wrist, for identifying an accused in court. Its editor moves on to a new job at the COPFS and is now selectively watering down what it means to identify an accused in court.

      It’s a kind of hilarious. A particularly macabre kind.

    9. Vestas says:

      “The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.”

      SNP is corrupt to the core.

      Time for a plan B – before the next Holyrood elections.

    10. Socrates MacSporran says:

      The first rule of Unionism: Don’t do as we do – do as we tell you.

    11. Ron Maclean says:

      Say it ain’t so, Humza

    12. Vivian O'Blivion says:

      Kinky Friedman said; “elected officials should be limited to two terms. One in office and one in jail.” This administration is intent on proving him correct.

    13. Muscleguy says:

      Rules are for little people. Newspapar editors are gods don’t you know?

      /snark

    14. Golfnut says:

      Obviously employed by the COPFS for his wide ranging experience and due diligence, or maybe not.

    15. callmedave says:

      WARNINGS from the deputy chief medical officer of a possible second wave of coronavirus hitting the UK as deaths hit 34,970.

      The latest count comes after 174 more people died in England – however, new analysis suggests Britain’s overall death toll from the virus has already passed 44,000.

      Professor Jonathan Van-Tam warned on Monday evening that Covid-19 may return again in autumn and winter as we currently have over one million Brits left unemployed.

      Many Brits have started to return to work this week as lockdown measures ease, schools are looking to reopen and officials have said the crucial virus “R” infection rate may have risen over the last week.

      Today’s figures as known:

      Scotland………today……29……….Total….2134…BBC
      Wales…………today……17……….Total….1224…BBC
      N. Ireland…….today……07……….Total…..489…BBC
      England……….today….*174……….Total.no data..*SUN
      ==========================================================
      UK……………today….no data…….Total…*34970..*SUN

    16. jfngw says:

      O/T
      I’ll wait here for those that advocated we follow the Swedish model of virus containment, Sweden now has the highest daily deaths per capita.

      https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1262505577189687296

    17. Josef Ó Luain says:

      He’s obviously a paid-up member of that wee club for the chancers , barely legal spivs and fly men and women that you’ll find everywhere in Scotland where there’s a free meal or a buck to be made, including within the S.N.P. All of the club’s members are interconnected and dedicated to the furtherance of the club’s collective interests, along with the busted status quo and, above all, the continued growth of their bank accounts.

      That they are very small, unambitious fish in a very tiny pool is a thought unlikely ever to have occurred to the hubristic fuckers.

    18. Breastplate says:

      No Jfngw,
      Sweden does not have the highest daily deaths per capita.
      Sweden has the highest daily deaths per capita over a 7 day rolling average.
      It is completely different.
      Scotland has a higher death per capita than Sweden at the moment.
      That is not a statistic taken on a Wednesday afternoon between 1pm and 3pm.

    19. Julia Gibb says:

      Nothing sums up our media better than this excellent observation at the Alex Salmond trial by Mr. Murray.
      I, for one, will never forget it!

      ” when a defence witness for A. Salmond was called. The hacks put down their notebooks”

    20. Col.Blimp IV says:

      Did you make that story up Stu?

      No, you didn’t, did you?

      Nobody who was wanting to be believed could have.

    21. susan says:

      Can’t believe how bad this now looks. Keep going Stu you are lifting lots of stones.

    22. Famous15 says:

      When you condemn “Scottish” justice,please remember that all judges,all PF’s and prosecutors right up to Lord Advocate and all senior police officers and senior Civil Servants are all vetted by the MOD and require Security Service approval before appointment.

      Devolution did not change that!

    23. callmedave says:

      Today’s figures BBC official: + SUN for England

      Scotland………today……29……….Total….2134…BBC
      Wales…………today……17……….Total….1224…BBC
      N. Ireland…….today……07……….Total…..489…BBC
      England……….today….*174……….Total.no data..*SUN
      ==========================================================
      UK……………today…**545..…….Total….**35341…WM update

      It , as usual, doesn’t add up.

      No England only Total figures again today

    24. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      Sarah Smith’s Mother (Barroness Smith of Gilmorehill) was a Director of private spook outfit Hakluyt who use a mob called Control Risks.

      https://www.thebureauinvestigates.com/stories/2017-12-12/inside-the-corporate-investigations-business

      Sounds like the type of mob who could have video’d Salmonds QC on a train?

    25. ahundredthidiot says:

      jfngw

      Did you research your source?

      didn’t think so…..your source is a hysterical 13 year old (ok he’s 37, but acts like a 13 year old)….here’s a sample of his hysteria;

      “HOLY MOTHER OF GOD—the new coronavirus is a 3.8!!!” Feigl-Ding’s tweet read. “How bad is that reproductive R0 value? It is thermonuclear pandemic level bad—never seen an actual virality coefficient outside of Twitter in my entire career. I’m not exaggerating.” During the next five minutes, Feigl-Ding put together a thread on Twitter, mostly quoting the paper itself, that declared we were “faced with the most virulent virus epidemic the world has ever seen.”

      That last one is a belter!

    26. twathater says:

      OMG we need more masks , not just for covid19 but for the PUTRID STENCH coming from the COPFS , will the rot ever be cleansed

    27. ALANM says:

      Looks like someone forgot to tell Sarah Smith that she’s now in the same team as Nicola Sturgeon. Even Alan Cochrane over at the Daily Telegraph has cottoned on.

    28. Republicofscotland says:

      The Glasgow Evening Times is a shitty wee union loving rag that backs Labour. It excels particularly in football and murder and bygone days of Glasgow in the empire.

      As for Shields and his kind, the rules don’t apply to them, they only apply to those who reveal what’s behind the curtain. Scotland’s judiciary, police force government and many other public bodies are just as corrupt as anywhere else in the world.

    29. velofello says:

      @ Jockanese Wind Talker; …and dubbed Salmond’s Q C’s voice using Voice Recognition techniques. Not persuaded on the technology? Ask your bank.

    30. callmedave says:

      The WM update still on has a lady medical official Dame Angela Ruth McLean DBE, FRS a professor of mathematical biology in the Department of Zoology at the University of Oxford, and Chief Scientific Adviser to the Ministry of Defence.

      Looks uncomfortable answering some questions and has refused twice to give a response

      “I’ll wait to see what I’m told on Thursday” was uttered by her. 🙂

      We have seen the last of her I think, maybe got an honest streak and balks at giving outright support for the UK Gov approach?

    31. Republicofscotland says:

      “ALANM says:
      19 May, 2020 at 5:31 pm
      Looks like someone forgot to tell Sarah Smith that she’s now in the same team as Nicola Sturgeon. Even Alan Cochrane over at the Daily Telegraph has cottoned on.”

      ALANM.

      You’ve got to hand it to Sturgeon she fooled us all big time, all the indy marches the mandates, the we in Scotland wont stand for anymore Westminster this and that, she really had us all going.

      Angus Robertson and then Ian Blackford both enforced our belief that it was only a matter of time before, their Scotland won’t take it anymore rhetoric at Westminster jolted Sturgeon in to naming a date for the indyref.

      Then the Salmond time bomb exploded and it knocked us right off our feet like a kick in the stomach we realised that Sturgeon has no intentions of holding a second indeed.

    32. robertknight says:

      Repost…

      A wee reminder of past performances on the part of one Ian Blackford, MP…

      “We cannot, and we will not, allow Scotland to follow Theresa May or Boris Johnson off the cliff-edge.”

      “Scotland’s voice must be heard and it must be respected. Scotland will not be dragged out of the EU against our will.”

      “Scotland did not vote to leave the EU, and we must not be dragged out against our will.”

      “We are simply not prepared to sit back and allow Boris Johnson and the Vote Leave campaign that have been running the government in London to take us out of the union against our will! We will not allow Boris Johnson to rip us away from Europe and deny the rights that EU citizens have here in Scotland.”

      “Scotland voted overwhelmingly to remain and we will not allow our country to be dragged out…”

      “‘We will not allow Scotland to be dragged out of the single market and…”

      I could go on. Hollow words from a hollow man!

      We, the electorate, should not allow ourselves to be hoodwinked again by his bombastic bluster and empty rhetoric, nor by similar performances on the part of the other 46 paper tigers who surround him; who under his stewardship have collectively demonstrated all the qualities of a busted flush.

      On a more general note, ever wondered why so many solicitors and bankers end up as politicians? A look at the banking and legal sectors should tell you all you need to know. And they supposedly work for us? Aye right!

    33. jfngw says:

      Who to believe ahundrethidiot or a public health scientist, is the daily rate per capita in Sweden now the highest or not. I don’t really expect a sensible reply just some insulting shite, which is your normal modus operandi.

      @Breastplate

      It now has the highest daily death rate per capita, or do you not understand the word daily. Scotland’s daily deaths are decreasing, Sweden’s look pretty flat to me.

      No need to apologise for suggesting we follow the worst performing nordic country, I take that as given.

    34. Capella says:

      Oops. How can person with a record such as that obtain a plum job in the COPFS? When you say “let him go” do you mean sacked him?

      Is it Masonics?

      OTOH the PM of the UK is also a failed journalist who is elevated to the top job and will probably waft ever higher by the time he’s done.

    35. Sinky says:

      BBC running as hard as they can on Nike. Anonymous tour guide who was booked by Nike contacts Ian Murray to complain he wasn’t contacted by health officials.

      Questions need to be asked of Nike surely they also had some responsibilty to inform tour guide and it seems an IT company that shared building with Nike were not informed either.

    36. Patrick Roden says:

      Capella says:

      Oops. How can person with a record such as that obtain a plum job in the COPFS? When you say “let him go” do you mean sacked him?

      Exactly what I was asking myself. I also wondered if he was asked to submit a ‘disclosure form’ and if so, did he mention previous ‘indiscretions’?

      If not, he should be sacked, if he did whoever hired him needs toanswer some serching questions.

    37. James Barr Gardner says:

      Famous15 says:
      19 May, 2020 at 5:07 pm
      When you condemn “Scottish” justice,please remember that all judges,all PF’s and prosecutors right up to Lord Advocate and all senior police officers and senior Civil Servants are all vetted by the MOD and require Security Service approval before appointment.

      All are Masonic, one hand covers another…..

    38. Breastplate says:

      Jfngw,
      Why do you use parameters that are very narrow?
      Yes, Sweden is the worst performing country in Scandinavia, I have no problem with the truth.
      I don’t have to cherry pick comparisons to bolster my argument.
      You on the other hand have to be very particular with which country you compare Sweden to.

      Sweden’s model at the moment proves to be better than the UK’s and Scotland’s without the loss of the civil liberties we’ve had here. Why is that?
      Of course there are countries doing better but equally there are countries doing worse.
      You seem adamant that Sweden must be specifically in line for criticism, why is that?
      I understand you don’t like Sweden’s model, why is that?
      I’m genuinely interested in your reasoning.

    39. Effijy says:

      If any school kids are following-
      This is what journalism looks like.

      You won’t find it in UK newspapers, TV or Radio.

      Wonderful work again Rev

      There will be a movie all about you one day!

    40. Effijy says:

      Remember this BBC Bias against Scottish Independence?

      https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/independent-enquiry-into-bbc-bias-regards-scottish-independence-referendum

      The BBC no longer bother about blatant bias as Sarah Smith can
      Slabbed our any slanderous comments she likes and it’s fine by them.

      The petition needed 100,000 signatures to register and sits at 93,100?

      Some Scots couldn’t recognise their own nose in front of them.

    41. jfngw says:

      @Breastplate

      Sweden does not have a better result than Scotland when comparing like with like, confirmed deaths by lab test. In fact Scotland’s figures by this standard are slightly better.

      I used Sweden because that is the comparison that was quoted on here by others (probably Joe) as a better model. At the time I commented that it was having a much worse outcome than its neighbours, it still is.

      The impression on here is that Sweden has effectively done nothing and had just the same outcome, this is untrue, they have different restrictions in place, I believe the bars are still open but you need to be served at a table, I can’t read Swedish so I have to rely on English sites reporting on them.

    42. Care homes in Sweden have come under the spotlight for their high number of COVID-19 deaths.

      Figures from the Public Health Agency show almost half of all fatalities linked to coronavirus have happened in residential homes.

    43. Colin Alexander says:

      http://www.copfs.gov.uk/foi/26-about-us/foi/1412-register-of-interests

      “The Civil Service Code, which applies to all civil servants, requires that they should not put themselves in a position where duty and private interests conflict, nor make use of their official position to further those interests.

      As a public servant, an employee has a particular duty to ensure that their public position is not, and raises no reasonable suspicion of being, abused in their own personal interest.

      The Crown Office and Procurator Fiscal Service holds a formal Register of Interests which extends to all members of staff…

      The Register is not published”.

    44. Breastplate says:

      Jfngw,
      Again, it depends what stats you choose to compare. Deaths per capita, Scotland is worse as I’ve said before.
      You are correct, Sweden still has regulations and guidelines in place but they seem to value civil liberties more than us here, it often makes me wonder if this is one of the reasons we have yet to gain independence.

    45. Colin Alexander says:

      http://www.copfs.gov.uk/foi/10-about-us

      COPFS

      “Anyone can make a complaint or comment on our service or work. While we will answer all aspects of dissatisfaction, only complaints which affect you directly will be considered under our Complaints Handling Procedure…”

      “You can complain about things like:

      Delays in responding to your enquiries and requests
      Failure to provide a service
      Our standard of service
      Our policy
      Treatment by or attitude of member of staff
      Our failure to follow proper procedure”

    46. Craig Murray says:

      Would you like to hear of another amazing coincidence? The last few days Stu has been revealing the connections between Graham Shields of the Crown Office and Procurator Fiscal Service, the Glasgow Evening Times and Dani Garavelli.

      Then today the Glasgow Evening Times runs an article attacking me over the cancellation of the Doune the Rabbit Hole Festival and specifically making a meal of the contempt of court charge, which some might feel is dubiously relevant to a music festival.

      I am sorry I don’t know how you do that archived link stuff. Incidentally the article is wrong on pretty well anything. Ticket sales have been suspended for weeks, including stopping instalment plans. All ticket buyers have been kept fully up to date by a series of posts and emails. The formal cancellation and refund scheme will be up and running this week. It is quite a big thing to organise when you have two staff.

    47. Colin Alexander says:

      Craig Murray

      I think you and your family should take legal action for breach of privacy Article 8 of the Human Rights Act 1998 for the DR publishing a photo of your and your family’s family home.

      In my opinion it was unnecessary and went beyond what was required and breached privacy and clearly caused you distress.

      That’s opinion, not legal advice.

      google: MGN Ltd v United Kingdom for further info

    48. Breastplate says:

      Scot Finlayson,
      That is also correct but these deaths occurred because health and safety guidelines were not followed, not because of the model they used. There was no sinister intention to infect the elderly with Covid19.

    49. Colin Alexander says:

      Craig Murray

      You go to archive.is and paste the webpage you want to archive in the box. It does the rest and provides you with the archived page address.

      Here it is here: http://archive.is/x7n1K

      Doune the Rabbit Hole organisers delay cancellation of event

    50. dakk says:

      https://inews.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-india-why-number-cases-deaths-relatively-low-country-billion-people-2562373

      India seems to have got something right in it’s approach to Covid19,at least so far.

      Either that or they have just funeral pyred anyone with a cough on the Ganges.

    51. robertknight says:

      Craig Murray…

      What do you expect from a pig if not a grunt?

      The gutter-press in action once again.

      Good luck with the festival… and everything else!

    52. Robert Louis says:

      Effijy at 716pm

      Sorry, as has been repeatedly pointed out here, 38 degrees is a proverbial waste of space so far as Scotland and the lying BBC is concerned. This was tried with 38 degrees years ago, and when the required sigs were achieved they refused to act, because…’scotland, something, mumble, mumble’.

    53. jfngw says:

      @Breastplate

      In fact using confirmed lab test deaths they are nearly identical, although I used the wrong number for Scotland in my first calculation, 374/m for Scotland (I had 360 the first time, don’t know why), 370/m for Sweden. It is the only measurement you can compare as both countries have total deaths rates that are a good bit higher than normal but it’s not reliable to use these unless we do it everywhere. An example of this is the low care home death rates being claimed in England that are not reflected in comparable countries.

      Although this differs from ourworldindata site that gives 366 for Sweden (no idea why this numbers differs unless they do more than divide deaths by population). They don’t do Scotland separately, that’s why I used my own figures.

      As Sweden’s numbers are not currently reducing the likelihood is they will overtake Scotland on this measure.

      I could just use the excess deaths per country but I don’t know what the exact number for Sweden is. I can sometimes plough my way through some European sites but I find the Nordic languages pretty impenetrable.

    54. mogabee says:

      When you stir the pot it’s amazing how much murk from the bottom soon clouds the whole.

      This is nothing short of great delving that I’d expect from a really great journalist. Putting most of the creeps who work on the news to absolute shame.

      O/T
      Wish the arseholes on here intent on disrupting every fucking thread would quit it. Take your weird ‘conspiracy’ laugh ins and sort yerselves out..

    55. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      “Wish the arseholes on here intent on disrupting every fucking thread would quit it. Take your weird ‘conspiracy’ laugh ins and sort yerselves out..”

      WTAF? @mogabee says at 8:41 pm

      Are you saying that there is no conspiracy involving the Scottish Government/Civil Service; Members of the SNP and their staff; The COPFS; Police Scotland and the ‘Scottish Media’?

      No retrospective change in Policy to allow an investigation (which was found to be tainted with bias)?

      No politically motivated fishing operation for any little thing that could be twisted in the hope of obtaining a prosecution?

      No manufactured charges?

      No one perjured themselves in court giving evidence against the Former First Minister of Scotland?

      No partisan reporting only focused on the prosecution not the defence?

      And now that it didn’t work no-one is conducting a politicised contempt of court rear guard action against Craig Murray and Mark Hirst who reported on the defence case during the trial in an attempt to save their arses?

      Aye tinfoil hatted nutters the lot of us eh?

      Fanny!

    56. jfngw says:

      Sorry O/T again but this one is just too funny to ignore (from STV).

      Just got a press release from UKIP. They says they will stand on the Holyrood list next year on “scrap the Scottish Parliament” platform!

      That’s the Tories lost the Historywoman’s vote then.

    57. Graeme says:

      Just got a press release from UKIP. They says they will stand on the Holyrood list next year on “scrap the Scottish Parliament” platform!

      —————————————————————–
      That’s a lot of lost deposits

    58. Millennium says:

      Republic of Scotland 6pm

      Just about sums everything up.

    59. Millennium says:

      Rev

      You need to get shot of the Flat Earthers who pollute this website and are in utter denial.

      According to them the Earth IS flat, and Nicola Sturgeon WILL lead us to Scottish Independence.

      They are of course wrong on both counts.

      Getting pissed off hitting my head off of brick walls after reading the nonsense they post.

    60. jfngw says:

      I think now we can conclude that these alphabet women are in a position of power and effectively deciding who the COPFS will or will not prosecute. They are not obviously too concerned about their identity being concealed as they don’t want the Scotsman journalist prosecuted.

      Who else but those wielding power could convince the COPFS to prosecute on such flimsy evidence so many independence supporters.

    61. Kenny J says:

      ” dakk says:
      19 May, 2020 at 8:04 pm

      https://inews.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-india-why-number-cases-deaths-relatively-low-country-billion-people-2562373

      India seems to have got something right in it’s approach to Covid19,at least so far. ”

      CNN last night. Vietnam, 95 mill population, no deaths, nil, zero.

    62. Effijy says:

      My wish for the petition that was raised by George and Independence supporter,
      Was to give me and any other supporter the ability to confront Unbiased claims
      By the BBC with why do you think 100,000 Scots signed up to say you are.

      Ask them to raise the same number in a petition to counter the claim or
      Give us the number of Scottish Households that no longer pay the TV
      license tax.

      No way they want you to know how many have ditched their propaganda fee.
      This looming Tory recession will see many thousands ditch their tax as they try
      To survive.

    63. Davie Oga says:

      Two uncomfortable truths we learned from the case.

      1) The FM lied to parliament about when she first found out about the investigation.

      2) The FM’s chief of staff perjured herself in an attempt to falsely convict a perceived political rival to the FM.

      The former can possibly be forgiven as misremembering or an error in judgement. Taken together they are a damning indictment of the First Minister and her “team”. That she continues on makes a mockery of Scottish democracy, the party membership, and the entire justice system. One could think that the only reason she is still in her position is her usefulness to those powers who wish to stop independence. As soon as she is a threat towards those powers by moving for independence, she will be destroyed by those who are protecting her.

      She is a fatally flawed leader, holed beneath the waterline. Her leadership has turned the political vanguard of the independence movement from something that reflected Scottish asperations, into a self preserving, corrupt, virtue signalling basket case.

      People are fickle. Popularity comes and goes, but when the majority of the Scottish population figure out that she’s done to the institutions of state, the party that enabled her will be destroyed.

    64. Kenny says:

      My God.
      This whole farce has served only to reduce the high office of COPFS to that of sleazy den of masked rogues.
      “We’re the f*cking law!”

      Bad cop, bad cop – the biggest gang in the world

    65. jfngw says:

      I see the UK EU negotiating document tries to impose that the UK would have effectively the power to veto any new EU member, probably thinking of Scotland.

      This is from a phrase in the withdrawal agreement ‘take into account the view of the U.K.’. But I think that is just the Withdrawal Convention and not legally binding, surely WM understands that type of scenario.

    66. Col.Blimp IV says:

      Millennium says:@9:43 pm

      Who gives a shit what shape the earth is?

      The Flatso’s assure us that ye cannae fa’ aff the edge – there’s a big wall of ice that keeps the water in.

      https://www.amazon.co.uk/Flat-Earth-Map-Gleasons-Standard/dp/B01GQUW6PO

    67. Col.Blimp IV says:

      Davie Oga

      Eh-hem … You have been keeping up to speed on the aftermath of the Salmond Trial front?

    68. Millennium says:

      Col blimp 10.28pm

      So the Earth really is flat?

      Well I never, lol.

      I just need convinced now that Sturgeon is not a Unionist plant.

    69. Millennium says:

      In IRA terms, Sturgeon would have been known as a “sleeper”

      Where they lie low for years without revealing their actual purpose and those around them are completely oblivious to what they are up to.

    70. Col.Blimp IV says:

      Millennium

      Many people believe in the existence of God, without ever having seen much in the way of proof, they call it faith.

      I suspect it is something similar with St Nicola’s Independence supporting followers.

    71. Colin Alexander says:

      Hmm and I wonder who has been giving Sturgeon legal advice on indy and other matters, such as a s30?

      Could it be the Scot Govt’s top law officer, the Lord Advocate, head of the COPFS by any chance?

    72. Col.Blimp IV says:

      Millenium

      How long will we have to wait for the SNP to lead us to freedom?

      How long have the Christians been waiting for the promised return of the Messiah?

      The Jews have been waiting 4000 years longer – They had Jesus bumped off by the Romans because they thought he was an impostor.

      People with faith will wait for ever … longer than that if needs be.

    73. ScotsRenewables says:

      Millennium says:
      19 May, 2020 at 10:50 pm
      In IRA terms, Sturgeon would have been known as a “sleeper”

      Where they lie low for years without revealing their actual purpose and those around them are completely oblivious to what they are up to.

      Of course, some might say the same of you 🙂

    74. Habib Steele says:

      Are the Masons involved in all this

    75. terence callachan says:

      No doubt in my mind that this is all the work of Westminster
      I don’t think NS is in on it
      But clearly many influential people are

      I would think that as there are quite a lot of people voting Tory in Scotland there’s a good chance a fair number of them work for the COPFS and elsewhere in the Scottish government including SNP

      And it’s a safe bet that many Tory voters work for the newspapers TV Radio BBC STV etc
      So they’re doing the dirty possibly corrupt illegal work not just for their employer but for themselves

      I don’t think NS is in on it
      But does she know who she can trust !

    76. Joe says:

      50 scientific references supporting hydroxychloroquine use. To help the efforts of the awake and aware for the 2nd ‘pandemic’

      http://covexit.com/50-science-references-supporting-hydroxychloroquine/

    77. CameronB Brodie says:

      Historywoman? Now there is a damaged psyche that appears totally detached from social morality and empathic cognition. 😉

      Ecological Psychology: Six Principles for an
      Embodied-Embedded Approach to Behavior

      https://www.researchgate.net/publication/287723137_Ecological_Psychology_Six_Principles_for_an_Embodied-Embedded_Approach_to_Behavior

    78. shug says:

      I see Boris wants the schools back, MSM now running a story saying the unions are plotting against it, Manchester and Liverpool and numerous conservative areas are saying no way.

      Nobody seems to be mentioning the private schools are waiting till September Good to see who’s children are expendable.

      What ever is said on this page I trust Nicola to make the correct decision for mine.

      Meanwhile Westminster is trying to blame the scientists for the virus.

      What a shower

    79. Famous15 says:

      Nike Conference and Nike hakka 26 to 27 Feb.

      Cheltenham Race Meeting with 250,000 cheek by jowl 13 March.

      Oh dear,oh deary me the SNP lost the gold cup?

      Murdo and McWhirter opposed to Universal basic income,must be a good thing.

    80. Guybrush Threepwood says:

      Indeed, Sweden does have the highest death rate in Scandinavia, however it is far too early to compare countries. Professor Johan Gisecke reckons that it would be logical to wait 1 year before comparisons.

      According to the good professor, lockdowns don’t save lives, they merely delay the inevitable. The problem with lockdowns and closing borders, is that you eventually have to unlock them. The virus is still with us, probably forever.

      As soon as countries come out of lockdown, deaths with increase. In the end, most countries around the world will have roughly the same stats.

      Lockdowns have never been part of pandemic or epidemic counter-measures, even for more deadly viruses.

      While it is a great personal tragedy for those who have lost loved ones, Covid19 is actually a relatively mild virus in historical terms.

      Hong Kong Flu killed up to 4 million people between 1968 and 1969 – no lockdown.

    81. Willie says:

      Certainly seems that Mr Shields may not be a fit and proper person to hold the job that he now does.

      As editor of a paper publishing information that could identify a child who was sexually abused there has to be a question as to why he or the journalist who wrote the piece were not victim he charged and prosecuted for a criminal offence.

      Harrowing enough to be sexually abused for thereafter your identity to be exposed in the newspaper. It seems quite extraordinary that the police and fiscal failed to take action.

      All very reminiscent of Jimmy Saville disgrace, and clearly it is not unreasonable to suspect there the presence of child abusers at the heart of our crown prosecution service here in Scotland.

      Very well done to Rev Stu for exposing this situation. There is indeed a smell coming from our justice system.

      Failure to take action against those who would expose a sexually abused child and then to employ the editor of a newspaper that exposed the child is an outrage in a decent society and maybe the particular circumstances COPFS would like to advice. People need to know the facts. The authorities need to explain what happened here

    82. Willie says:

      In the light of information now coming to light in this article a question to the Justice Minister.

      Do you as Minister condone the abuse of a child or do you think action should be taken against those who abuse a child.

      If it is the former, and by your inaction it certainly seems that you do condone child abuse, then in you stand accused as assuredly as those who protected odious Sir Jimmy Saville.

      If it is the latter, will you issue a statement about what you intend to do about this abuse, why there was no prosecution, and why the editor of the paper involved in the abuse of exposing the child’s identity was subsequently awarded a senior position with the Crown Office.

    83. Breeks says:

      Oh my… Prince Charles want’s pickers who are stickers. Statement produced by the 1984 Ministry of Truth. There was no Brexit. Brexit is a lie. Brexit didn’t happen. There is no word Brexit, it has been removed from dictionaries. Britain could never be so stupid as to kick out a reliable labour force it desperately needed to harvest food then leave itself at a serious disadvantage with nobody to harvest food.

      Apparently “reaping what you sow” has some small print which nobody read. “Somebody” actually has to physically do the reaping. That’s a bit inconvenient isn’t it? Who knew???

      His Royal Contagiousness goes on to mention a great initiative from WW2 to help food production, and I thought, Ah, that’ll be the emergence of the EU then, but no. He meant the land army. The land army of volunteers and conscripts he wants back. Not those conscripted shirkers mind, just the pickers who are stickers. Those dumb enough to do it for nothing and keep grinning.

      I say get the Brexiteers to pick the fruit. They created the whole catastrophuck. To keep up their morale, they can even be given an official mini Union Jack to hold in their bum cheeks while they’re bent double in the fields. That should please Royalty, seeing so many arseholes waving Union Jacks at them. A win-win situation for Blighty!

    84. Robert Louis says:

      Today, in The National, james Dornan has a piece (you need to subscribe to read it), in which he basically argues that indy is the last thing that we should be aiming for right now.

      So there you have it, the ‘coronavirus excuse’, we all fully expected. Brexit will happen and the SNP WILL do nothing to prevent it reaching its catastrophic conclusion. The endless dithering and waste of six years of rock-solid support for the SNP, is come into full view.

      However, what attracted my attention was this;

      QUOTE “Well I’ve been biting my tongue for some time now while watching people, who in my opinion should know better, talking up “splits in the party”; disillusionment with the most popular leader in the UK – if not in the whole of Europe – Nicola Sturgeon; and pretending that being found not guilty in a court of law is the same as your behaviour being acceptable. [my bolding]

      I wonder what he is referring to????? Is this a veiled smear against an innocent man? If only everybody’s behaviour was as perfect as Mr. Dornan eh? Mind, James Dornan has never been First Minister of Scotland, or lead our country to as close to independence as we ever have been, and given our country a sense of hope, instead of the despair we currently have. Mr. Dornan didn’t take a political party from the backseat of Scottish politics and lead it into forming a Scottish government, with an absolute majority.

      Anyway, those in the indy movement who still think the SNP will get us independence, need to take a reality check. It isn’t going to happen. Too many in the SNP are quite happy with the way things are, and they are not going to let something as silly as independence ruin it for them. The SNP are quite happy to just talk about independence. No action, none.

    85. Robert Louis says:

      Breeks at 0720 am,

      This is just pure class,

      “I say get the Brexiteers to pick the fruit. They created the whole catastrophuck. To keep up their morale, they can even be given an official mini Union Jack to hold in their bum cheeks while they’re bent double in the fields. That should please Royalty, seeing so many arseholes waving Union Jacks at them. A win-win situation for Blighty!”

      The outright stupidity of the landed gentry who voted for brexit, now moaning about a lack of fruit pickers beggars belief.

      It is the brexiteers and stupid callour murderous Tories who should be made by force to go out on the fields. Nothing could be more ‘british’.

    86. Scottish Questions before PMQs,

      basically a chance for the Brutish establishment house jocks Jack and Murray to try and outdo each other in their contempt and mockery of their country.

    87. defo says:

      Add J Dornan to the empty oot list.

      With so so many arse’s to cover, I think that when the Eck bomb drops it’ll be like toppling dominoes.
      Is this to the benefit of our collective cause?
      No, but the alternative is worse.

    88. Ottomanboi says:

      Robert Louis @07:27
      The National is a sheep in wolf’s clothing, as is the ‘National Movement’.
      Some ‘nationalists’ are simply not true believers.
      They may be the fruit of Unionist entryism. .

    89. susan says:

      Can’t believe what Dornan said. I guess there will always be an excuse to put Independence on the backburner.

    90. Julia Gibb says:

      Couldn’t finish reading the Dornan article! It started with a promise stating that since he was retiring he would speak freely and in the next paragraph spewed HQ crap on the reader.

    91. Polly says:

      Thanks for writing this. Wish I could say I was surprised by the revelation.

      “They had Jesus bumped off by the Romans because they thought he was an impostor.” They had Jesus bumped off because he was a threat to their power and they used the ‘he’s an imposter’ as a good excuse. A bit like Dornan, and other folks who use ‘his behaviour may not be criminal but it was unacceptable’. Any excuse will do that will allow them to take the position they want to take.

      I concur, Breeks 7.20 post was hilarious. Sickening of Charlie III, disgusted at brexiters, repulsed even more by folk like Yvette Cooper, and despairing of Sturgeon’s useless promises to EU nationals – sometimes only laughing at them makes it bearable.

    92. Sensibledave says:

      Millennium 9:43 pm

      You wrote “You need to get shot of the Flat Earthers who pollute this website and are in utter denial.”

      it used to be that I usually managed to create unity amongst wingers (usually in opposition to whatever truth I had laid before you). In seemingly no time at all though, supporters of the SNP, and ex supporters, are now split and turning on each other.

      And, again in no time at all, the lefty tactic of the “cancel culture” is now being used within the cause. “I disagree with what you say …. therefore I want to remove your right to say it.

    93. Famous15 says:

      Sensibledave I bet you are like me and would support independence even if Genghis Khan led the SNP.

      We are the true believers and see many other small countries of our size with a fraction of our resources having very successful governments and have happy peoples!

      Independence is both natural and normal. Scotland the brave? Not much bravery required.

    94. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      Excellent start to the day with a good laugh provided by @ Breeks says at 07:20 am.

      Royal Contagiousness and Union Flag waving arseholes!

      On fire as usual Breeks.

      🙂

    95. Jason Smoothpiece says:

      Dorian saying things he is not authorised to say?

      If this is the opinion of the SNP and I think the membership should be told if it is, I may become one of the enraged anti SNP types.

      If the main aim of the party, raison d’être for the Tories on here, is not independence then they are finished in my opinion.

      I still believe that the SNP is the only real game in town regarding independence but if that is no longer their main aim I’m off.

    96. Bob Mack says:

      @Sensibledave,

      There may well be splits in the followers of Wings of the SNP, , but I bet you every single one of them has no doubt about Independence, and that’s the main thing,isn’t it.

    97. Liz g says:

      Sensible Dave @ 9.14
      Is the lock down getting to you or something Dave…. it’s to early in the morning fur strong drink?

      I don’t know what website you think yer on!
      But Wings was never ever a place for group think.
      We debate from all perspectives and we do it with passion.
      It’s always been robust.
      This is exactly why it’s so successful,and long may it continue.
      We don’t come to talk to people who always agree with us and… I suspect you stick around here because you don’t want too either.
      I hope you appreciate that because of this format you have a rare opportunity to express yourself,whichever side of the debate you are on. An opportunity not tolerated by the British Media….

    98. Effijy says:

      This brings the number of Northants care home Covid-19 deaths to 102, and compares to 17 Covid deaths the week before, and 18 the week before that.

      In total, 46 Northamptonshire care home residents died last week of all causes including Covid-19.

      Now let’s forget all about that and get back to focus on one English Owned Care Home in Skye
      and SNP Bad Scots too wee too stupid.

    99. Famous15 says:

      Was the Cheltenham Gold Cup with 250,000 fans coughing And spitting and sneezing BUT no hakka really well over two weeks AFTER the the Nike conference in Edinburgh?

      Parallel universes Scotland and England or is It their propaganda MSM?

    100. McDuff says:

      Robert Louis 7.27
      Spot on.

    101. Sensibledave says:

      Famous 15

      I think you may have missed the mark somewhat. I am neither for, nor against, Scottish Independence. It is up to the people of Scotland.

      Bob Mack

      I would observe Bob, that the accusations I read regularly on these threads now is that many, including NS, have no interest in Independence and are either troughers or spies!

      Liz G

      My comment was aimed specifically at Millenium who called for the “banning” of anyone they disagreed with. As for the lockdown, I am coping well thanks. Although the family finances are being decimated and I fear for those suffering Ill health and those friends of mine (and everyone else) that are shielding, I am lucky enough to have a garden so the sunshine is a small pleasure in these times.

      I am not sure what you meant by your comments about the British media. From where I sit, it looks like journalists in general are getting stick, rightly or wrongly, for not reflecting “the mood” of the country.

    102. Vivian O'Blivion says:

      Question (OK, rhetorical question) what IF Sturgeon took Scotland into an independent future (live with me here for the sake of argument)? What of her much stated position that Scotland should be an independent nation within the EU? How would the EU regard a government that seeks to lock up critics and political enemies while disregarding blatant criminality from its supporters? This stuff would make Viktor Orban blush.

    103. Bob Mack says:

      @Sensibledave,

      Nicola Sturgeon, SNP, whatever.

      They may well be tardy in looking for Independence, but that does not mean people like myself and others are going to accept that. We may well have to bide our time, but rest assured we will find the means to be able to make that choice.

      It is my right as a Scot. My sovereignty to make that decision was given to me many years ago and as far as I know nothing in legal terms has denied me of that right.

    104. callmedave says:

      Catching up:

      Big raspberry from Breeks to Charlie there. Excellent! 🙂

      I’m sure we all ’embrace’ that apology from Sarah and ‘enjoyed’ hearing it said.

    105. robbo says:

      Any chance brexit Boris will do same for UK?

      Naw don’t think he will,do you?

      https://twitter.com/Camz99/status/1263032976956362753

    106. Phydaux says:

      Heartfelt thanks to you Stuart for your efforts, on our behalf, in searching for the “ inconvenient” truth about our criminal justice system. Like an expert archer, time and time again your arrows hit the target. I can almost hear the collective groan of “ not again” whenever your e-mails ping into their inboxes. The SNP claim to be the party of social, economic and criminal justice. I am watching and waiting Mr Yousaf. If these principles are no longer vital to your party, then you should be rightly concerned at your re-election prospects. You should know by now that Indy supporters can smell bullshit at 40 paces in a gale.

      Breaks: 7:20
      Laugh out loud…thank you for putting that image in my head…fucking hilarious. Charles Windsor is just like the rest of his benefit scrounging family…indifferent to how things really are, the essence of bullshit. What comes out of their mouths is emptied of all informative content. Just like excrement is matter from which everything nutritive has been removed.

    107. Breeks says:

      ”James Dornan: Why independence cannot be the SNP’s priority for now…”

      Here’s a wee thing.

      Write a letter to Westminster and the UN declaring that Brexit is an act of colonial subjugation that is incompatible with Scotland’s Constitutional Sovereignty, and an emphatic Democratic majority which rejected Brexit.

      In paragraph 2, declare that the delivery of Brexit, the realisation of Scotland’s unconstitutional and unlawful subjugation, will be deemed to terminated the 1707 Treaty of Union between Equals, and that consequently, the United Kingdom has ceased to exist.

      There you. No politicking, no campaigning, no distraction from COV19 lockdown, no obligation on anybody to do anything. But if the Tory’s under Johnson accelerate Brexit, then they progress Scotland’s Independence with equal urgency and gusto.

      Who needs 54/56 MP’s if they’re all James Doran’s or Pete Wishart ilk? Maybe no it’s beginning to become clear why they achieved nothing.

      Write the bloody letter, then the whole of Scotland in a single instant is held safe behind a binary Constitutional Backstop, which either halts Brexit in it’s tracks, or it delivers the final coup de grace to the Union and the UK is no more.

      One damned letter, and the Declaration of Arbroath suddenly has a rival for it’s historic significance.

      How about a petition Scotland? We, the sovereign people of Scotland demand a Constitutional Backstop to prevent Brexit and Scotland’s unconstitutional subjugation. Go to town with it, full-on cyberNat mode, every blog, every article, every BTL comment demanding a Constitutional Backstop.

      Let’s give ourselves such momentum and impetus that even the SNP cannot hold us in check.

      Time is short. We need it done and with the UN and Council of Europe before the last act of Brexit is done, and those talks are already close to collapse.

      What say you Rev Stu? Instead of a live Indy Campaign running now, why don’t we mobilise for a Brexit Backstop, which has the power to scrap the Union by proxy?

      Call the bluff of all the doubters and procrastinators. It’s not an Indy Campaign, it’s a Constitutional backstop demand, and a meaningful change in the Brexit Narrative which can be delivered with the writing of a single letter…

      Make can make it impossible for Sturgeon “not” to write that letter…

    108. Oneliner says:

      Re Graham Shields

      Surely this is a resignation issue?

    109. Breeks says:

      WTF? That has missing words all over the place… was that me? Or is the text handler being selective with changes to the text?

    110. Republicofscotland says:

      “Was the Cheltenham Gold Cup with 250,000 fans coughing And spitting and sneezing BUT no hakka really well over two weeks AFTER the the Nike conference in Edinburgh?”

      Famou15.

      Although I have issues with Sturgeon over independence and the Salmond fit up, I’m under the impression the Nike conference was held before the implementation of lockdown.

      As you rightly point out the Cheltenham race meeting was packed out to the rafters, of course you also rightly add that the media is a unionist propaganda tool used against us at every turn.

    111. Liz g says:

      Sensible Dave @ 10.05
      I’m with ye on that, staying well and staying sane,is about the best we can all do at the moment. As for the finances ..I have nae money worries…because I’ve nae bloody money 🙂 seriously though,I don’t complain because I’m to thankful I don’t have a young family that I’d have to steer through this.
      I can’t imagine having to deal with it all if mine were still young….

      Anyhoo…..
      I ment, the British Media in general,and the BBC in particular, create no space for Scotland to explore it’s politics.
      The BBC are paid by us (under pain of criminal prosecution) to serve our media needs and they fail to…but more to the point here is… the space for comments you enjoy on Wings is not available to you on the public broadcaster.
      They shut it down in 2013 and as far as I know they’ve kept it closed…

      BBC Scotland was years ahead of Holyrood in diverting from from a 4 nation approach!!!!

      The double irony is, that as far as I understand it….it was the people who were prevented from commenting below the line on the BBC who migrated here and have enjoyed the ability to fight, flounce or figure it out ever since!!!
      That’s….how do the British say it now???
      Unprecedented. Aye!
      So I don’t tend to complain about a site while enjoying the service that it provides to me..I just say thank you…

    112. Sensibledave says:

      Bob Mack

      As a democrat, I totally support your right to promote, support, argue for, vote for, etc, an independent Scotland. I was merely observing that many here on Wings argue that some, like NS, are troughers or spies.

      It isn’t my view. As I have written before, it is my view that NS does not believe that a referendum could be won at this time because of all of the “events” queering the pitch. So she finds herself in the position where she appears to some of her supporters that she isn’t trying … whilst, in actuality she is preventing what she believes would be the catastrophe of a second No vote.

    113. Sensibledave says:

      Liz G

      It is interesting that you and many here on Wings perceive the BBC as some part of the government Propaganda machine. Down here, the perception is completely different. They are perceived as the personification of liberal, lefty, right-on politics. Remember, the government stopped making Ministers available for the Today programme and Newsnight because of it.

    114. Bob Mack says:

      @Sensibledave,

      You may well be right about Nicola Sturgeons thought process, but prior to the last referendum it was clear that support for Indy was only around 28%. That is I suppose why Cameron took the chance of agreeing to a Section30.

      Now support for Indy is beginning in the high forties or thereabouts depending on which poll you read.

      My thoughts are that Nicola is very very competent, but is not a leader for a “war footing” if you like, which the battle for Independence has become.

      We need someone prepared to take actions outwith the expected. Someone to pressurise and harrass.Combative.

      That clearly isn’t Nicola Sturgeon .

      Like her?? Yes I do. She just happens to be the wrong leader at the right time.

    115. Col.Blimp IV says:

      Sensibledave

      “…the accusations I read regularly on these threads now is that many, including NS, have no interest in Independence and are either troughers or spies!”

      If there is an other plausible explanation for the lack of revolutionary zeal exhibited by people who are in the positions they are in today – Because THEY managed to convince US that THEY were best equipped to lead us on the long march to freedom.

      I would like to hear it!

      All I can add is my belief that the ringers and the carpetbaggers are more driven, and the rank and file MP’s and MSP’s, due to varying degrees of miss-placed loyalty and cowardice – ain’t ever going to mutiny or stick their heads above the parapet without being specifically ordered to do so.

    116. Benhope says:

      Breeks 10.37.

      Totally agree. That sounds like a positive plan and time is definitely running out.

      WM government seems determined to leave EU with a disastrous no deal. The double whammy of the Pandemic and Brexit will surely mean the UK economy will take longer to recover than almost any other in the world.

      We must declare our intention to rejoin the EU before the end of the year.

      Thank you Breeks for you campaign in reminding us all that our Sovereignty is the vital key to our future freedom.

    117. Col.Blimp IV says:

      Cowardice,ringers,carpetbaggers

      Just checking for possible “red flag” words that may have got my last post sent to the moderators pound.

    118. Col.Blimp IV says:

      troughers,spies,rank,file,revolutionary

    119. Col.Blimp IV says:

      I,or,if,but

    120. Col.Blimp IV says:

      No I am not trying to formulate a “Jigsaw Post”.

    121. Sensibledave says:

      Bob Mack 11.15

      I accept the points you make. The bit that I fear, is that the likelyhood of a successful Indy campaign inside the next 12 months are, at best, dodgy. Project Fear 2 will kick in big time, with more ammunition than ever. That campaign will be aimed at the “floaters” in the middle and will aim to argue “now is not the time”. CV19, SNP infighting, Oil Prices, Brexit, a Depression, government borrowing, currency, are just a few of the “events” that will probably be focused upon to scare the floaters out of a Yes vote.

      If indyref2 was lost again in the next year, then it is my view that 10 or 15 years would pass before indyref3 could be forthcoming. If indyref2 were to take place in 2 years time, and some of the poo being experienced by everyone now is behind us, then maybe then.

      So I think NS is taking the flak for the “greater good”. But that doesn’t seem to be a view that has much support here.

    122. Breastplate says:

      Sensibledave,
      If as you have stated, you are a democrat. Then it should follow that as a democrat, there is no such thing as winning or losing a referendum, it is merely listening to the Voice of the People, which is surely the premise of democracy.
      There is no reason to believe it would be a catastrophe, whatever the result was.
      It would only be a catastrophe if people then believed we should stifle the Voice of the People thereon.
      If somebody believes they will only listen to the Voice of the People when it agrees with them, they are not democratic.
      Of course, we are still allowed to have different opinions but we are also allowed to have as many referendums as we want.

    123. CameronB Brodie says:

      Not so sensible dave, claims impartiality but refuses to acknowledge Brexit is incompatible with the terms under which Scotland joined England in political union. As such, our determined contributor of English Torydum, continues to undermine support for constitutional democracy. This is clearly his intention, as he’s spent years spewing cultural bigotry while claiming to be impartial. His method is rather disciplined and regimented, and his determination to piss against the wind, unrelenting. 😉

      ADMINISTRATIVE JUSTICE IN EUROPE
      http://www.legislationline.org/documents/id/18979

    124. Col.Blimp IV says:

      Sensibledave

      We were promised that – The war would be over by Brexit.

      And had fixed bayonets ready to go over the top for the final push – but the order never came.

      Some of us have been in the trenches for 40 and more years.

      But we cannot go home until the war is won – we don’t need reinforcements, we don’t need more shells for the artillery, or tanks, air support or favorable weather conditions.

      WE NEED NEW GENERALS.

    125. Craig Murray says:

      sensibledave

      The problem is that Nicola was doing everything possible to avoid action on Indy before that list of problems – Covid19, depression etc. occurred. Which was obvious to anyone except some incredibly blinkered loyalists who argued black is white.

      She now has some more plausible sounding excuses for the devolutionism she supported all along. But actually Independence is the best way to tackle all those problems.

    126. Bob Mack says:

      @Sensibledave,

      The goal of Independence will in truth will take as long as it takes.Perhaps the youngsters of today may achieve it on our behalf. If so then good.

      I want the choice now, but I am prepared to watch now things develop. You cannot kill an idea whose time has come.

    127. CameronB Brodie says:

      @Sensibledave
      I don’t think you’re thick, so you’re opposition to constitutional justice must be ideological.

      CONSTITUTIONAL JUSTICE
      https://www.osce.org/odihr/33161?download=true

    128. Sensibledave says:

      Breastplate

      I am not sure about your “No winning Or Losing” comment. Isn’t it quite natural that those who’s views were not carried would feel like they personally “lost” whilst still accepting democracy won?

      I note that you believe it is ok to rerun referenda every year ( month, week?) purely because you can. What is your explanation to those In the majority who voted against independence?

      The catastrophe that I related to was the catastrophe that I perceive it would be to Yessers and the cause, if indyref2 was also lost.

      To Col Blimp, Bob and Craig, whilst it is noble to fight when defeat may be inevitable … I suspect that NS wants the fight to happen when she believes she can win it. Her problem is that many of her supporters (ex supporters) would appear to prefer a Fight with glorious defeat to A postponed fight and a potential win.

      I was wrong once as I recall. I thought I was wrong on something but It turned out I was right all along. I’ve learned my lesson now though!

    129. CameronB Brodie says:

      Not so sensible dave appears to be under the delusion that parliamentary sovereignty is compatible with international human rights law. I suspect this is largely due to the English home-counties nature of dave’s bio-social identity. Subsequently, not so sensible dave’s identity is incapable of accommodating a legal order that gives Scotland equal legal status to England. Clearly, not so sensible dave’s identity politics are unable to support liberal constitutionalism.

      Protecting the Rule of Law in the EU Legal Order: A Constitutional Role for the Court of Justice
      https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/european-constitutional-law-review/article/protecting-the-rule-of-law-in-the-eu-legal-order-a-constitutional-role-for-the-court-of-justice/346FB7EDF6C6B4AF3FB24117A6DD49E9

    130. Bob Mack says:

      @Dave,

      Glorious defeats are the stuff of English legends are made of are they not?

      Arthur, Light Brigade,Gallipoli, Almost WW2, Crimea.Singapore
      American colonies.
      Too many to list.

      All deep in the psyche of UK. Glorious defeats are actually no defeat at all, provided you use them well.

    131. Breastplate says:

      Sensibledave,
      It is ok to have a referendum at the drop of a hat and on a whim when we (the People of Scotland) want but of course, when practical would be better and I’m sure the people here in Scotland could cope with the trauma of giving our opinion at some point to every new government. If it doesn’t suit you then maybe democracy doesn’t suit you either.
      As has been stated many times on here and elsewhere, democracy is not an event, it is a process.

    132. Col.Blimp IV says:

      “… whilst it is noble to fight when defeat may be inevitable … I suspect that NS wants the fight to happen when she believes she can win it.”

      Therein lies the absurdity of the SNP’s position.

      A referendum is not required far less an S30 agreement from London.

      Referendums only come along once in a while, when a reasonable case for having one can be made and (subject to the agreement of our English Overlords) – but elections happen every four years

      The SNP’s MSP’s need only put their cushy jobs at marginally more risk than is required when there is an election.

      But thus far they have clung to the “we will run the devolved parliament better than the Unionists” plea to the public, as their election battle cry.

      As opposed to “Give us your vote – And your country will be free” – which would seem a more appropriate position from people who’s objective is supposedly Independence for Scotland.

      No SNP candidate who is not prepared to make a public declaration to that effect will get my vote.

    133. Sensibledave says:

      All

      I will refrain from further comment at this time. I think some of you are reasonable enough to at least understand my point even if you do not agree with it.

      Breastplate

      Who are the people of Scotland that you keep claiming to represent? Are they only Yessers? What representation do the No’s get?

    134. CameronB Brodie says:

      Dave is desperate to appear reasonable but he’s simply a bit of a bigot.

      ‘A Union Founded on the Rule of Law’: Meaning and Reality of the Rule of Law as a Constitutional Principle of EU Law
      https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/european-constitutional-law-review/article/union-founded-on-the-rule-of-law-meaning-and-reality-of-the-rule-of-law-as-a-constitutional-principle-of-eu-law/4A2EF3970647B7380182CA5808A81063

    135. robertknight says:

      The goal of the Yes movement is Indy, not Governance.

      The goal of the SNP is Governance, not Indy.

      Therein lies the problem.



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