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Wings Over Scotland

When they think we’re not listening

Posted on November 11, 2018 by

This piece ran in the Telegraph – a newspaper with no Scottish edition and almost no Scottish sales – on Friday. Click to enlarge.

Our favourite line is:

“Think of what the UK would be like without the vast wealth generated by the 44bn barrels of oil pumped from British territory over the last 40 years.”

(Curiously, this is a rather different line to the one Critchlow took during the indyref, when he was the Telegraph’s full-time business news editor penning a string of articles about how bankrupt an independent Scotland would be despite possessing an asset that’s now apparently big enough to prop up an economy 12 times Scotland’s size.)

It’s worth keeping in mind whenever Unionists tell us (a) how volatile and worthless and used-up oil is, (b) how much Scotland depends on the kind benevolence of the UK to survive, and (c) why we can’t have another referendum until years after Brexit.

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    1. 11 11 18 15:56

      When they think we’re not listening | speymouth

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    1. jimnarlene says:

      Its only ever worthless when it’s Scotland’s oil.

    2. Jason Smoothpiece says:

      Makes the blood boil but until the many unaware become aware we will continue to be robbed.

      This of course will not be covered by the Regime’s media.

      Scotland keeping the UK afloat.

      Wake up folks please wake up.

      Independence soon hopefully.

    3. Luigi says:

      Stealing it is one thing, but the mismanagement and complete squander of this resource over the past 40 years takes the crime to a new level. Scotland was not the first colony to be cleaned out by the BritNats, but hopefully it will be the last.

      One for the files. Sadly, our “Scottish” MSM won’t touch it (for some strange reason. :)). Copies of this article should be posted through every letterbox in Scotland.

    4. gordoz says:

      Is Scotland mentioned even once ?
      Very British colonial.

    5. Dr Jim says:

      Is this oil from the Scottish part of the English North sea or the English part of the Scottish north sea it’s all so confusing

      If I stand in St Andrews at the beach with my feet in the water I’m in England, if I step back onto the beach I’m in Scotland but I do know all the oil to my right is in England and all the oil ro my left is in the English part of what was Scotland

    6. TJenny says:

      Many countries mentioned in that article but Scotland – nah. Funny that , not. 🙁

    7. S.Perspective says:

      It’s quite simple really. It‘s because the natives fail to understand the value of their natural resources- until a benevolent colonial power arrives to exploit them on their behalf.

    8. Bob Mack says:

      I sometimes feel I am living in between two parallel universes. I keep getting told by media that everything we have in resources is useless, and yet they quote the same figures to Unionists as proof of worth.

      Which is it I wonder?

      I think I know actually.

    9. John Moss says:

      I really hate propping parasites up.

      Time to make the break.

    10. David Mooney says:

      And that is why the Westminster establishment will fight tooth an nail to prevent Scots Independence. They can’t afford not to.

      If Scotland gained full fiscal autonomy and full control over it’s territorial resources the rUK economy will tank, with or without Brexit.

      A hard Brexit is the excuse needed to declare a state of emergency and suspend the devolved parliaments. The ensuing civil unrest would just be a distraction used to hide the ultra right power grab, that’s been going on since before the Tory/LibDem coalition in 2010.

    11. Dan Huil says:

      British nationalist arrogance,ignorance and hypocrisy is sickening.

      For god’s sake, our sakes, this disgusting union with England must be ended.

    12. Iain says:

      What a shower of idiots we are subsidising the economy of a foreign country, whilst our own people are homeless and starving.
      When will we learn that charity begins at home.

    13. Breeks says:

      Oil is Britain’s thin red line against Brexit??? How apt.

      Britain’s “thin red line” was Scottish… The 93rd Sutherland Highlanders in Line formation who routed a Russian Cavalry attack in the Crimean War as it attempted to seize the British occupied port of Balaklava on the 25th October 1854 and threatened to cut off the whole British Forces from their operational base and supply routes.

      I am sick and tired of pompous British rhetoric and their skewed perceptions of history.

    14. dave Stewart says:

      Last night on the world service there was a piece on Norway.
      Crux of the article was that the Norwegians have just commissioned a new well that’s giving out 5 million barrels a day and is expected to run for 30 years at that level.
      The spin was that isn’t it ironic that Norway is exporting the polluting oil around the world whilst being almost totally powered by hydro electric power.
      The little lie inserted was the billions of Kroner in their OIL FUND, as far as i’m aware it’s over a TRILLION and the annual return from the investment is greater than some countries GDP.
      No mention of Scottish oil or the new West of SHetland oil and gas fields, still a well kept secret.
      Glad westmonster deals with all that polluting oil for us.

    15. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Which was why forty years ago some of us realised that the discovery of Scottish oil became the biggest impediment to us gaining our independence.

      Our value to the UK without it is minimal.
      “It’s Scotland’s Oil” had short term political attraction but much more serious long term consequence

    16. manandboy says:

      Scotland has had a funny feeling these past 45 years, but no one in the Westminster Government or in the BritNat media has been able to identify it.

      It’s the feeling of being robbed.

    17. frogesque says:

      Beware the narrative here.

      Independence is not predicated on oil riches. It is a bonus.

      By bringing the oil subject up now the Torygraph is setting an agenda. UK oil good, Scottish oil so volatile it could vapourise the very rocks you stand on. England can manage it sooo much better because . . . reasons.

      Bugger that horseshit! If oil is such a problem for Scotland then leave it where it is. It might be very nice to have but we don’t actually NEED it.

    18. tarisgal says:

      All that oil money – and yet we have hundreds of thousands of people homeless, children starving & welfare users being killed so as not to have to give them money, desperate people pushed to commit suicide on an unprecedented scale… All that oil money – and the country is soooo poor! It’s really hard to get yer head around that. And THAT is one of the reasons I will fight for independence.

    19. Artyhetty says:

      Britnat thieves, been theiving Scotland’s land, and resources and getting away with it by telling Scottish people and Scotland ‘you are too stupid, small and poor’ lolz! They have kept Scotland poor and begging at the same time it makes me sick.

      Now, they don’t even hide the fact they are stealing Scotland’s wealth, siphoning away our resources, removing our revenues and sending a few begrudged crumbs back. Are Britnat Scots really OK with that? They need their heads examined.

      It’s why they were so desperate in 2014 to keep Scotland shackled, they stopped short of violence to keep it that way, next time, who knows.

    20. winifred mccartney says:

      Oh but we are too wee,

      Oh but we are too poor,

      and too stupid,

      I am beginning to think we must be to continue to allow this theft especially when they lie continuously about WM subsidising Scotland. Typical tories, say it often enough and enough will believe it. I still know people who believe everything the BBC says.

      They’re a bit like Trump – they ARE the fake news.

    21. manandboy says:

      Tell me again that IndyRef14 was a perfectly valid referendum with no jiggery-pokery by Westminster.

    22. Robin Barclay says:


      Is there any chance you could link Critchlows articles in one place so that any undecideds can be directed to that point just to bin this f@cking myth once and for all.

      The lie from Westminster regards the size of Scotland’s reserves is what initially made me take a serious interest in the debate and this is still the one item on the agenda that Unionists and undecideds bang the drum with.

    23. Brian Powell says:

      But there is the very strange situation where people keep believing them.

      I get the Tories, the LibDems are irrelevant, but it is Labour in Scotland being total c.nts that seems so strange. They have left not a singe issue on which to have the slightest respect for them.

    24. fillofficer says:

      oil is the only thing UK have to trade
      we will never have it for ourselves
      no deal
      hard brexit
      holyrood closure
      rosey future, eh

    25. fillofficer says:


    26. galamcennalath says:

      It wouldn’t be quite so bad if they openly showed their deep gratitude to Scotland for our enormous generosity stretching back decades.

      Instead what do we get? They behave as if our land, resources, and young people are theirs to abuse as they wish.

      Anger, as an emotion, just doesn’t cover it.

      I had two great uncles die as young men in WW1. With the free access to records available online my wife has discovered she had a first cousin once removed who died at Arras.

      The carnage ‘for England’s glory” has been a bloody disgrace. Oil has been important, but not as valuable as our lost young men and women.

    27. Artyhetty says:

      re: Frogesque@3.30

      Absolutely, you are correct, but, people do not know that Scotland has seen virtually no benefit from her oil. I have spoken to family and friends in England, who say, ‘aye, but the oil’s all gone, so what you’s gonna do for money?’ :-/

      Where on earth do they think the £billions, probably trillions of £’s has gone, now that really is stupid. Scotland should have a massive oil fund, everyone should be incredibly wealthy in Scotland, didn’t Norway effectively give their people a £million each or something?

      No, Scotland has been stolen from, it’s absolutely criminal, kept poor, young people having to leave to get decent paid jobs, it’s bloody heart breaking.

      Yes it’s a bonus, IF we saw any significant benefit, it could have been invested in renewables, for a start.

      I see the SNP are ‘asking’ the Britnat English government to ‘devolve Scotland’s oil and gas’. Pigs will fly first, the Britnats will be roaring with laughter at that! ha ha ha!

      People need to know that Scotland’s oil has benefitted only the very wealthy in England. You want to watch the imagearchive at NLS, look up search and browse,’industry’, some films about oil, men working in Aberdeen when it first came on tap in a big way, they and their families were living in caravans and told to like it or lump it! The US cigar smoking oil men in charge were not bothered why would they be.

    28. Capella says:

      So what is the value of 44 billion barrels of oil at today’s prices? I make that 2.2 trillion or 55 billion a year for the last 40 years. At least.

      But maths isn’t my strong point.

    29. Geordie says:

      Precious, precious union eh? Sounds more like Gollum every time she says it.

    30. Joemcg says:

      Robin, if you click on the blue coloured text you can read all of Critchlow’s subterfuge in all its glory.

    31. Mark Russell says:

      Amazing. An article about North Sea oil that doesn’t mention Scotland once.

      Only in the Torygraph.

    32. Cloggins says:

      Just as no.10 is conferring with the army for assistance after a no deal brexit. Not for distribution of medicine or stockpiling or anything. No, for industrial action and suchlike events. They may be amassing at the border as we speak…

    33. Average price of Scottish Brent crude over last 40 years is $54 per barrel,

      average price of Scottish Brent crude over last 20 years is $65 per barrel,

      average price of Scottish Brent crude this year is $70.99 per barrel,

      even using the low $54 pb means over $1,000,000,000,000 still recoverable,

      the de facto English Gov have given the last $2,000,000,000,000 away to subsidise the London elite and the chavs of South East England,

      let us scrap the Treaty of Union and keep the $1 trillion for the help and benefit of the poor and vulnerable of Scotland.

    34. Cubby says:

      Lying Britnats looting other countries wealth for centuries. They used to use the bayonet now they use propaganda.

      Britnats have no shame. They do not deserve any respect.

    35. Rock says:

      Rock (2nd January 2015 – “The Ne’erday Game”):

      “Unfortunately, we have among us the most stupid people on the planet. Given the chance of 300 years, those who should have known better voted No.

      Now just 3 months later, or just a minute after voting No if a tale on another thread is to be believed, they claim they would now vote Yes.

      Throughout history and throughout the world, including here, people have died for independence. And we voted peacefully to reject it.”

    36. Cubby says:


      Indyref 14 – bloody hell that sounds like a Rockshit forecast for the future. Still at it after 14 referendums – surely not.

      I have always said that the biggest problem stopping Scottish independence is Scotlands wealth producing resources. Westminster has been looting other countries wealth for centuries. Old habits die hard. It is about time England stood on its own two feet.

    37. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      Amen to that, Scot.

    38. Davie Oga says:

      Current Scottish sector production is around 900 000 barrels per day and is expected to rise by 8% by 2020. At current prices (70USD) thats 44 billion this year.
      A tax regime like Norways would have injected 9 billion USD into a Scottish treasury this year alone.

    39. Neil Ralley says:

      And this is not including the new fields which are not being exploited because they are in the path of the Trident submarines. Oil is a very big deal and as one poster already pointed out it is reason enough for the RUK to fight tooth and nail to avoid Scottish independence, including every dirty trick imaginable.

    40. Scott says:

      North Sea oil can still be the bargaining chip we need

      This should be used against all the unionist hypocrites

      Oil is a curse on Scotland we were told.

      Lying Better Together barstewards

    41. Petra says:

      I can’t begin to tell you how sick and tired I am of hearing people on the streets / in their homes saying that we have no oil left now. All gone. Done! People like Critchlow should be facing being jailed, imo.

      We can’t let this go on any longer FGS. C’mon Stu let’s get another ‘coloured’ book out, ASAP, to EVERY home in the country (tell us how much it would cost). One page relating to our oil would suffice by highlighting the McCrone Report, Norway’s 1 trillion dollar oil fund and THAT particular article.

      This is our last chance to acquire our Independence, for one reason or another, imo. Let’s get a crowdfunder up and running. Let it run until we’ve collected the required amount even if we’re talking about £millions. We CAN do it.

    42. I Wright says:

      Maybe if all the brit poppywankers masturbating over the Brit dead this morning cared more about Scotland we could do something with our oil.

    43. Auld Rock says:

      Once again I’m going to be boring in pointing out that there is a new trend to ascribe every new oil/gas discovery, which incidentally are only the very small tip of a very large iceberg are NOT in the NORTH SEA but in the ATLANTIC in what is known in the oil business as the ‘ATLANTIC MARGIN’. Now unless geographical divisions have changed without us here in Shetland being told Shetland has ever since I studied Geography been the dividing line between the North Sea and the Atlantic.

      However it suits English, London Centric, Metro-land Brit Nationalists establishment journalists for it means that they can keep-up their lies and think we are all believing them. A quick glance at a map you will see that at least two thirds of Scotland’s Economic Zone (EZ) lies in the Atlantic, West of Shetland. When oil was first discovered it was McCrone’s report that was buried to keep Scotland in the dark, now they can’t deny its existence so they are desperately trying to muddy the waters with their lies and false information.

      I will also remind all Wingers that back in 2013/14 Bill ‘Big Mac’ McLaughlin provided a brilliant expose of what were the true potential oil/gas assets of Scotland in Scotland’s EZ.

      Don’t be taken in again and if in any doubt cast your eyes across the N.Sea to Norway and think, if Scotland had been Independent that could be us as well, think where our NHS would be, where our schools would be, think no austerity, think poverty eliminated, think no Universal Credit, think no food banks and I could go on.

      So let’s not let it happen again.

    44. defo says:

      Anger is an energy

    45. Petra says:

      How do we get our hands on a copy of Bill McLaughlin’s ‘expose’, Auld Rock?

    46. Clootie says:

      My only comfort is being on a site where everyone knows just how pissed off I am without the need to go into any detail Arrrggghhhhh!!!!

    47. Nana says:


      From Bella’s article in 2014

    48. Nana says:

      oops forgot to add part2

    49. Ottomanboi says:

      Hey ho, here we go, shafting Scotland’s wot we know…old English ditty.
      Fetch my ……….. write in favourite ‘weapon’ of choice.

    50. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Which is all the more reason to get out of this damned Union before our wealth of resources are bargained away by London in its increasingly confused and self-conflicted desperation, as this article unintentionally reveals.

      However long the onsuing negotiations might take, a winning vote for independence before 29.March immediately secures all our precious resources from future UK squander and mismanagement, and gives us the key to a successful and prosperous future relationship with the EU.

    51. frogesque says:

      @ defo: 4.55

      Unfocused, unchanelled anger is an enemy.

      Don’t get mad, get even!

    52. TJenny says:

      Don’t get mad, get everything! 🙂

    53. Ian says:

      When will enough people realise that the UK is and has been for a very long time an economic basket case and that that won’t change any time soon.

      ‘The 3.9 billion dollar loan

      As pressure on the pound continued, the government approached the IMF for a loan of $3.9 billion in September 1976. This was the largest amount ever requested of the Fund, which needed to seek additional funds from the US and Germany’.

      As for the 2016 delusion “take back control” –

      ‘The IMF negotiators demanded heavy cuts in public expenditure and the budget deficit as a precondition for the loan. Healey’s proposals for a cut of around 20 per cent in the budget deficit were hotly debated in Cabinet, particularly by Anthony Crosland and Michael Foot. Eventually they acceded, as it seemed likely that the refusal of the loan would be followed by a disastrous run on the pound. Healey announced the forthcoming reductions in public expenditure to the House of Commons on 15 December 1976’.

    54. ScottieDog says:

      I remember Jackie Ballie at a BBC debate in the run up to 2014 remarking how volatile an independent Scotland’s economy would be. I desperate to speak outing my hand up for ages but of course James Cook probably had his orders. The hand picked Britnat bankers were selected instead.

      Please tell me Jackie how volatile an economy which props up the city of London is..

    55. mumsyhugs says:

      Hope the Rev’s compiling a ‘Before’ and ‘After’ section in his next Wee Blue Book!!!

    56. ScottieDog says:

      Continuing on from my post, after that debate I got into conversation with one of the bankers (in a kilt) who handed me a 4 page doc from city bank about how iscotland would be a disaster.
      I tried to make him understand that each pound coming out of the city is a pound of debt where each coming from the proceeds of real resources such as oil, renewables etc is a pound of equity. Quite gobsmaked was I that a banker couldn’t understand this. Needless to say his doc was duly composted.

    57. Ruby says:

      Copy of article in text. Might be helpful if you want to quote sections.

      ‘North Sea oil can still be the bargaining chip we need
      Article rank 9 Nov 2018
      Andy Critchlow is head of energy news for EMEA at S&P Global Platts

      ‘There could be up to 20bn barrels of oil equivalent discoveries and undeveloped resources still out there’

      Oil is Britain’s thin red line against a hard Brexit. The North Sea provided an economic buffer during the “winter of discontent” of 1978 and the “Black Monday” stock market crash, which almost destroyed the City a decade later. It may have to serve the same defensive purpose again if Theresa May, the Prime Minister, bungles a deal to leave Europe, or even worse, fails to reach an agreement.
      Often derided as an insignificant and declining industry by some economists, oil remains one of the country’s most reliable money spinners and sources of hard foreign currency export revenues. Think of what the UK would be like without the vast wealth generated by the equivalent of 44bn barrels of oil pumped from British territory over the last 40 years. The North Sea also makes Britain entirely unique within the European Union, which is otherwise mostly barren of “black gold”.
      Without the near 1.7m barrels per day of oil equivalent – a measure including gas and other liquids – pumped from the UK continental shelf, the 27 nation bloc is entirely dependent on producers outside of its control such as Russia and Saudi Arabia. Of course, Norway, which sits outside the EU but still enjoys trade access, remains a trusted oil and gas ally for Brussels. Nevertheless, Britain’s exit will to a certain extent weaken the European project in terms of the world’s most valuable traded energy commodity.
      Central to the role oil can play in protecting the economy and the pound from the shock of a hard Brexit is the Forties crude blend and the closely linked Dated Brent price benchmark, perhaps Britain’s most instantly recognisable and globally significant brand quoted in financial centres around the world.
      Dated Brent is used to price around two thirds of the world’s supply of 100m barrels every day. Assuming a price of $70 per barrel, that’s over $4.5bn of transactions daily. The benchmark, assessed by S&P Global Platts in London, dates back to the heyday of North Sea production in the Eighties when the once prolific Brent oilfield was among the world’s most productive reservoirs outside of the Opec club of predominantly Middle Eastern petrodollar states.
      Although the last of the Brent platforms, floating 115 miles off the coast of Shetland, is being shut down, the so called “Brent complex” and price benchmark continue to thrive and evolve along with the demands of the global oil industry. As Brent itself has physically dwindled, new blends like Norway’s Troll have been added to the cocktail, giving traders in Europe and around the world the most reliable tool to gauge the value of different crudes.
      Outside of the North Sea basin, different crude blends that include streams from the US, West Africa and even Kazakhstan could be added to the mix in the future, but irrespective of their origin, Dated Brent continues to put Britain at the heart of a $1.7 trillion industry surrounding oil and gas. Importantly for Britain’s future outside the EU, it is a corner of commerce increasingly tilting towards meeting rapidly growing demand in Asia and especially China, the world’s biggest importer of crude.
      For example, the Hound Point terminal on the Firth of Forth exported almost 11m barrels of Forties crude in October, the vast majority of it heading to South Korea and China. If Britain is to succeed outside the EU and strike lucrative trade deals with Asia’s biggest economies, North Sea oil could be a useful bargaining chip our European neighbours don’t have at their disposal.
      Neither is the North Sea’s story as a major oil-producing region over. The latest figures released by the Oil and Gas Authority (OGA) yesterday identified almost 5.5bn barrels of oil equivalent still to be produced, enough to sustain output at current rates in UK waters for the next 20 years. However, the total scale of oil and gas around Britain’s shores could be far greater, with the OGA estimating there are up to 20bn barrels of oil equivalent discoveries and undeveloped resources still out there.
      Of course, tapping these resources in the North Sea is the challenge. Post Brexit it is essential for whoever sits in power in Downing Street to maintain the competitive tax environment vital to encouraging oil and gas operators to continue exploring for resources and more importantly putting new finds into production. The crash in oil prices, which began at the end of 2014, triggered a severe cutback in investment across the North Sea. Globally, spending in upstream oil and gas is expected to drop to around $500bn (£380bn) this year, from a peak around $950bn four years ago. This has made it harder for the UK to compete for investment from the international oil industry.

      These pressures will only grow after Brexit, but North Sea oil should still give Britain the cash generating power to defend its economy and the leverage to build new trading relationships overseas.’

    58. ScottieDog says:

      “can’t begin to tell you how sick and tired I am of hearing people on the streets / in their homes saying that we have no oil left now. All gone. Done! People like Critchlow should be facing being jailed, imo”

      Petra, I think some reverse psychology is required here. Why don’t we call on the U.K. gov to leave the oil where it is? Let’s meet our climate objectives and at the same time let the U.K. gov make the argument about Scotland’s wealth for us?!

    59. Cubby says:

      Artyhetty @3.53pm

      “They need their heads examined” indeed and if that happened all they would find would be a Union flag stuffed where a brain should be.

    60. robertknight says:

      Sometimes, you really have to stop and wonder….

      Too Small? Nope – plenty smaller.

      Too Poor? Nope – plenty poorer.

      Too Stupid? . . . .

      Never mind, I’ll get my coat.

    61. galamcennalath says:

      No they sure if anyone has pointed out the obvious regarding using Scotland’s oil (and fishing) as Brexit bargaining chips.

      The EU will be well aware that Scotland may become independent in the near future and so WM can’t offer these with any long term confidence nor authority!

    62. Josef Ó Luain says:

      Many Scots have never learned how to complain never mind how to get fucking mad.

    63. Confused says:

      Was going to post this when I saw it – WOW – the first two paragraphs

      But the boss got on it first, then the hive mind took over – shit, its hard to keep up these days never mind get ahead of the curve.

      Auld Rock makes great point – which he has made before, I remember – about the “atlantic margin”. I even submitted an academic paper on the subject to the REV years and years ago.

      The terror of all this is that it DESTROYS any of the economic FUD the enemy put up – like asking a lottery winner “how will you pay the mortgage”.

      The terror of the inglish is even deeper tho – oil is “real wealth” which acts as the capstone to a whole edifice of “claims on wealth” which the city likes to trade in. The pound and all that sits on it is a house of cards. The pound is effectively an oil-backed currency, gaining similar strength to the dollar, despite being nothing like as large or strong.

      The tragedy of the oil was that its discovery allowed the tories to “financialise” the economy in the 80s – a total re-engineering of the economy to turn the screws down on the coffin of the working class – send all the good jobs east. No work, no working class. Class war and looting. They must have thought themselves clever at the time, but now – it could bite them in the arse. This is also the reason why the english are planning to FRACK THEMSELVES SENSELESS, with nothing being allowed to impede them.

      It’s nice to be discussing real issues again.

    64. Rock says:

      Cubby says:
      11 November, 2018 at 4:42 pm


      Indyref 14 – bloody hell that sounds like a Rockshit forecast for the future. Still at it after 14 referendums – surely not.”

      The usual CubbyCrap.

      Manandboy is referring to the 2014 independence referendum.

      Since you think you are so clever, why don’t you go on the record as to when the next independence referendum should be held in your esteemed view?

    65. sassenach says:

      It’s times like just now, having read the Telegraph piece, that I simply fail to understand why we are not miles ahead in the Indy argument.

      Are Scots never going to see what Westminster has been doing to them all these years? Or am I living in some parallel universe?

      Dissolve this bloody union – NOW!

    66. Ottomanboi says:

      The British Empire drained its ‘ethnic’ colonies of resources. India, when the Brits arrived, was one of the world’s richest, when they quit, ignominiously, it was among the relatively poorest.
      Scotland is being exploited in a classic colonial manner. As in the Brit Empire the majority of the exploited citizens took time to ‘capeesh’ the enormity of their own blinkered stupidity. The national mind is clearing, hopefully.

    67. sassenach says:

      Rock – crawl back under the rock, pretty please!!

    68. Macart says:

      And THAT is why this preciousss, preciousss union must never EVER be divided. It’s not about history. It’s not about shared experience. It’s not about a family of nations and loyalty to the mother of parliaments. It’s most certainly NOT about broad shoulders or pooling and sharing.

      It’s about resources. It’s about money. Filthy lucre.

      Your opinions. Your democracy. Your lives and life chances? Not so much. They really couldn’t care less about any of those. They’re not required so long as the political status quo remains in place. Seein’ as how they outvote you 10-1 in said mother of parliaments and all. That opinion of yours really isn’t necessary when it comes to appointing a UK government.

      Scotland for these people isn’t a partner. It’s an asset. It’s somewhere they can strip resources from and house their WMDs. Whenever some Tory, some Labourite or some Libdem opens their exhaust port to blather on about preserving the union? What they’re really talking about is preserving an asset base. That’s all you are to these folk. Hard assets and disposable assets. (SEE ATL)

      The ONLY way this treatment ends, and ends well, for Scotland’s population? Is if we decide to return our powers to their rightful place and owners. That’d be Holyrood and us basically.

      Personally, I’m fairly big on folk asking really nicely when they want to take or borrow something that belongs to me. Also applies if they’re asking for help. Just taking stuff because reasons? Seems a bit on the rude side.

    69. twathater says:

      OT/ But relevant, just watched (NATION ) with Lesley Riddoch and Phantom Films , this film accompanied with this article is dynamite ,
      The film explains that even without our vast oil resources the riches that can be accrued through proper investment and usage from renewable energy would outstrip oil revenues .

      But once again the UK establishment has scuppered the SG’s ability to utilise this vast resource by closing down investment , instead , it is stated in one of Nana’s articles that they are about to finance this same research and development of this industry in another country ( foreign ).

      There is only one way to get this information to the people to stand ANY chance of independence , and to expose to people the corruption and lies which we are inundated with daily and that is through the broadcast media . I know , how can it be done ?????

    70. McDuff says:

      I read this article too and was near hyperventilating at the sheer hypocrisy and arrogance of Critchlow. But this is good ammunition that must be used by the SNP come indy 2.

    71. Craig P says:

      Reading a history of British India right now (Inglorious Empire) and there are some intriguing parallels. The scale of exploitation was several orders of magnitude greater in India and Scots were in the thick of doing it, but the combination of looting plus a patronising ‘you couldn’t manage your resources on your own’ attitude seems awfully familiar.

      What I don’t get is the number of people in Scotland who actively *want* to hear how incapable Scotland is and who revel in our servitude. We can do so much better, why wouldn’t they want that?

    72. msean says:

      The author probably doesn’t even remember writing those older columns,even though they might contradict this piece.

    73. Cubby says:

      Rockshit @6.13pm

      Hey Rockshit I knew it was 2014 -diddy – it was a joke just like you and your joke forecasts – apprentice Nostradamus.

    74. Liz g says:

      But,But,But…. they’ve got London…
      London supports us all, having London means they will be fine when we leave..
      But we will be the sorry ones….. that right isn’t it???

      We would be nothing without London…. England doesn’t even need to make anything to sell anymore …. no need to.. the answer is London….

      Well I for one am fed up fundin London…. never mind the propaganda that the opposite is true .
      I’ll take them at their word and give no thought to how they will manage… because Scotland will leave them London all to themselves!!
      They can keep London we will keep our oil… and then everything for Westminster will be toot sweet and hunky dorry, they’ll have nae need to support us!!

    75. Hamish100 says:

      Sad to think of the lies the labour –Scottish branch will so willing to denigrate those of us who knew the oil’s worth.

      What group of people would say that having oil as a resource -with all our other resources is a bad thing.

      Only the tories. labour , lib dems and of course the Greens see this as a curse.

      Campaign for a oil fund to protect us – 100%

    76. Davie Oga says:


      Thursday the 6th of June 2019. No section 30 and it will be a referendum to affirm a declaration not to open a negotiation.

      It’s “What Matters To You Day”

    77. Hamish100 says:

      Rock I predict the next referendum for Scottish Independence will be 2019.

      I will say without fear or favour I will be 100% right or 100% wrong.

      I will get on with life either way.

    78. Ottomanboi says:

      @Craig P
      Shashi Tharoor’s book ought to be compulsory reading in schools. Scots, like the Kurds in the Ottoman empire, often did the imperialist’s dirty work with relish. It helped to take their minds off their own sad, exploited condition.
      Without Indian ‘cooperation’ the Brits would never have been able to hold the sub-continent for so long.

    79. Malky says:

      They despise and belittle us, they mock and patronise us and often in a Scottish accent. I am all for diversity of opinion, but I am growing tired of the sound of ‘Scots’ putting us down. I hope the Scottish cabinet have seen this as it makes for some very sobering and infuriating reading.

    80. Cubby says:

      Britnats control the media in Scotland= brainwashing lies and propaganda.

      Britnats are in political control.

      Britnats take all Scotlands revenues.

      Scotland is a colony. There to be used and abused by Westminster.

    81. Dr Jim says:

      Well they have as much oil as *we do* and only 4million people instead of 60 million so…. and then David Cameron was cut off as he was talking to Andrew Marr about Norway

    82. Muscleguy says:

      This is why Sturgeon and the SNP need to make much more of a noise about Independence and a referendum. So that when they propose this to the EU they EU come back with ‘ when the Scots vote for Independence we can just Admit them and have this in the EU with no deals’.

    83. Fred says:

      Thatcher used the North Sea oil revenues to de-industrialise Britain & was up to her neck in the illegal arms trade. The run-down “Astra Fireworks!” was snapped-up as it had an explosives license & was transformed into a major arms manufacturer. Gerald James opened up this this can of worms in the excellent, “In the Public Interest!”

      UK Government hit-man Stephan Kock also features, the assassination of Gerald Bull, builder of Sadam’s Super Gun. A large cast of rogues making fortunes supplying arms to both sides in the Iran/Iraq War, including Mark Thatcher. Parliament was by-passed & a cabal of City Spivs & MI5/MI6 ran Britain from Whitehall’s Cabinet Office.

      Where was Kock when Willie MacRae was murdered?

    84. Dr Jim says:

      Rock is just so ashamed of himself for voting NO he’s turned into a Gollum character and is lost to the world as a human and to be pitied or destroyed, take your pick

    85. Robert Louis says:

      Just like other colonies, Scotland serves only to provide wealth and riches FREE OF CHARGE for England. In return, just as used to be the case with other English colonies, we Scots have the joy of being able to say we are ‘British’.

      Ah, but the unionists and their Labour acolytes will say, you know when we were in India, we built many pieces of infrastructure, including the railways. But here’s the problem, the railways were NOT built as a generous ‘gift’ to the people of occupied India, their sole purpose was to help ship India’s riches (diamonds etc) out of the country to England (and I do mean ENGLAND).

      Honestly, with each passing day, and with each renewed arrogant insult from the English government, my desire for independence grows. As I said earlier, no other country would tolerate this for one second. In the same circumstances in other countries they would not be talking of ‘playing by the rules’ or waiting to see’ how things turn out. No, in ANY other country, they would have ditched this leech of a union the day after the vote to remove Scotland forcibly and against its wishes from the EU was taken. Now to add insult, they are using Scotland’s oil reserves as a bargaining chip – the oil reserves they told Scots just four years ago were worthless.

      Westminster is literally taking the p*ss. The time for playing by the rules or observing some vague notion of a ‘uk’ so-called unwritten (i.e ‘made up’) ‘constitution’ are long, long done. We need action by the Scottish Government and we need it soon. Too much procrastination, too much doffing our collective caps to what London says. These are NOT normal times, this is NOT democracy. England is hell bent on self destruction, and we need out. The time for talk is over.

      Independence. Get on with it, FFS. Please, get on with it. UDI/ referendum, whatever, the normal rules no longer apply, since London literally tore up the UK constitution, many years ago.

    86. yesindyref2 says:

      It’s Scotland’s oil, and that’s all I have to say about THAT.

    87. Confused says:

      funniest crap I read about brexit – some tory thunderer was giving it

      – treeza will get a GOOD DEAL from the Euros, for if they play hard-ball – she will CUT THEM OFF FROM THE CITY and its markets …
      – regulars will know the general love of Blazing Saddles references on WINGS

      – this one falls into the category when Cleavon Little points the gun at his own head and says

      “no one move or the n1gger gets it”

      … Paris and Frankfurt licking their lips about all the new business they will do …

      Some of them really think that – LONDON is an ENGINE of WEALTH CREATION – to which all I can say is – don’t get high on your own supply.

      But a lie told often enough becomes the truth – aah – remembrance sunday …

      -wasn’t it the empires policy to support the second strongest -against the strongest euro power to prevent european unification
      -didn’t german industry eclipse britain by about 1900
      -didn’t the empire set out to destroy germany
      -wasn’t germany set-up, in fact
      -and weren’t WW1 and WW2 just one thing really, with a long half-time
      -then you read about the lusitania, the balfour declaration and you are off down the rabbit hole
      – instead let’s just get all sentimental about this “incomprehensible thing which happened for no reason, archduke ferdinand” or the old textbook O grade history answer – ww1 arose due to the rise of nationalism …
      – and WE ARE THE GOOD GUYS

    88. Thepnr says:

      @Robert Louis

      Don’t beat about the bush Robert, tell us what you really mean when you say:

      “In the same circumstances in other countries they would not be talking of ‘playing by the rules’ or waiting to see’ how things turn out.”

      So what would they be doing in these other countries you speak of? Have you got a proposition of what not ‘playing by the rules’ looks like and that will win us our Independence?

      If so I’m all ears, so show us the way.

    89. yesindyref2 says:


      A division of S&P Global, S&P Global Platts is headquartered in London and employs over 1,200 people in more than 19 offices worldwide located in global business and energy centers on five continents.

      From an original focus on petroleum, we now cover oil, natural gas, LNG, electric power, coal, shipping, petrochemicals, metals, and agriculture.

      Seems like they might have to move their HQ to Glasgow after Indy. Or at least set up a new one.

      Shall we say 500 high-paying jobs, plus incidental benefits to the economy?

    90. Iain mhor says:

      Rock can predict heehaw – its 620 years one post (2038) and 622 (2040) yon the very next post even on the same page – Arsehole.

      As for the oil, I doubt even a declaration of Independence would secure it for Scotland. I won’t hold my breath that Scotland will see a single barrel in my lifetime. It’s not just an asset it is a material foundation of the state. It will not be relinquished under any circumstance.
      So, yes we may sometime see Independence for Scotland, but wresting her natural resources back from the red hands controlling it is another story entirely.
      Sounds depressingly cynical I know, but I just look around. Ever seen such a thing done anywhere in any country historically, without full state “intervention”? I haven’t but I can be educated otherwise.

    91. Iain mhor says:

      Shoukd read 2638 Ad & 2640 Ad – teach me to proof read!

    92. Iain mhor says:

      Should oh FFS! I’m shit at proof reading. I give in.

    93. Phil says:

      The Sunday National 11/11/2018 has one of today’s featured stories as a front page sub-head, as page 16 article, page 17 article, and page 7 supplement editorial.

      SNP move to stop oil cash being wasted again.

      First thought. How? Answer there is none. Over and over we read what a bad thing it is that Scotland is not benefitting suficiently, that the resource value may be wasted again.

      Time has come to start writing and discussing how. How is this to be done …

      Time to start creating structures and procedures to handle the oil/gas and other industries for the benefit of our population rather than for Westminster politicians.

    94. Jason Smoothpiece says:

      Robert Louis

      Feel your frustration mate, my blood pressure frequently rises to the danger zone when I see what is happening to Scotland.

      The blood pressure then goes through the roof when I hear otherwise sensible folk, some family, saying things are fine no issues. Happy to see the country under English rule.

      Independence is coming I believe, remember we only need to convert one person to yes and we are home.

      If every Scottish patriot converted one person to independence the stealing and lies ends.

    95. Alastair says:

      I was discussing with my daughter earlier things that trouble me about today’s parades and even festivals. After listening to my thought she said write them down.
      I have a couple of questions that trouble me.
      My great grandfather, grandfather and father fought in the first and second world wars.
      The family are from Lochgelly in Fife.
      Prior to the wars all efforts were being made for global naval superiority so is was “Jock produce coal, Jock produce steel, Jock produce warships.”
      When war broke out all of the above were in even more demand.
      The men folk were seduced by ” your county needs you ” posters to fight for King and Empire. Young men who were almost children, men with wife’s and children and of course the moral atrocity of conscription. Not forgetting the brave woman also served.
      So they fought and many died, many injured physically an mentally.
      The lucky returned hero’s and started to build a better life’s.
      Question 1 were was their war dividend.
      Within the span of the return of my father from WW2 and him reaching retirement age a different poster could have been posted ” your country doesn’t need you”. “Jock we don’t need your coal, we don’t need your steel, we don’t need your warships ” as every one of the dozens of coal mines in Fife employing thousands of men and women were forced to close. Men and woman thrown out of work and onto merger poverty benefits, families devastated, communities destroyed. Same with steel and ship building.
      The war didn’t break them but successive Westminster governments did. More probably died as the results of their impoverishment, their worthlessness, their casting aside than in war.

      In watch the armistice parades and balk at the ceremonial hierarchy .
      Queen and Royal family, Bishops, Prime Ministers, Cabinet Ministers and assorted beggers to the feast.
      Question 2 how many Kings, Queen, Bishops, Prime Ministers, Cabinet Ministers died in WW1 and WW2.
      I think to show real respect to those service men and woman who are still alive – let them lead the parade, they should lay the first reefs, it should be centred on them and their fallen comrades and let the others follow. Let the Queen, Bishops,Prime Ministers, Cabinet Ministers all march behind the hero’s. After all who is this all about. That would show thanks and real respect.

    96. Frank Gillougley says:

      Having fairly successfully managed to avoid the whole day’s proceedings, I was having my tea earlier and turned on CH4 innocently enough, only to be greeted by French President, schoolboy Emmanuel Macron urging world leaders marking the centenary of the World War One Armistice to reject nationalism. Addressing leaders in Paris he described it as a ‘betrayal of patriotism’.

      ‘By saying, our interests first and never mind the others’ you stamp out the most precious thing a nation has – its moral values,” he said.

      Yeah, just like those patriotic French ‘morals’ in Indo-China, The Algerian War of Independence, never mind Vichy France?

      I really do despair.

      Who needs history when you can just make this shit up and it gets full coverage beamed into everyone’s living rooms?

    97. Greannach says:

      I see the TV channel Talking Pictures has swapped its usual logo for a little TV set with a poppy slapped on it. FFS!

    98. yesindyref2 says:

      This is a good topic to stir up the nutcases amongst the unionists, as can be seen from comments below the line in this article:

    99. Thepnr says:

      Full coverage of all their shit can only be beamed into your living room if you choose to receive it by tuning in.

      That’s one of the reasons I choose not too and it saves me the cost of a license fee. Switch off and don’t pay for their propaganda, watch something else instead like Outlaw King and you won’t feel so bad.

    100. Cubby says:

      Hey Rockshit

      I already said earlier today indyref2 will be soon.

      Definition of soon: In or after a short time.

      As I am not trying to be an apprentice Nostradamus thats your lot from me. Like it or lump it.

      If I am wrong, so what, you are still no Nostradamus but you are a joke on Wings. Some other Britnats are trying hard to take your place but you are still the man.

    101. Sinky says:

      Can someone provide a link to George Kerevan article in The National just after the UK Budget where he wrote that if Oil was taxed at 2010 levels it would bring in £6BN a year rather than the pittance attributed by GERS?

    102. geeo says:

      If you think Scotland can gain independence but not take control of the oil reserves, you need your head read.

      International maritime law, yet another thing which only does not apply to an indy Scotland…is tgat your position, Iain Mhor ?

      Surely not ?

    103. Thepnr says:


      I guess this is the article.

      If, say, an independent Holyrood government demanded £10 for every barrel – as was the case in 2010, when oil prices were comparable with today – then the Scottish exchequer would earn circa £6bn in tax revenue. That’s enough to halve the GERS notional deficit at a stroke.

    104. Myles O'Butter says:

      Fight fire with fire!

      This post/article is absolute dynamite.

      When people worry about or question how Scotland will cope after independence, this guy’s admission, published in the ‘esteemed’ Establishment Tory Telegraph of how much the UK depends on Scotland, is a killer.

      Rev Stu is giving us the fire power, let’s use it!

    105. Giving Goose says:

      If you’re struggling to convince “No’s” with economic reasoning then fall back on identity when debating.

      Keep it simple.
      Independence = Scottish
      No to Independence = British Nationalist
      British = English

    106. Cubby says:

      Confused@ 7.12pm

      Andrew Marr had some guy on from Reuters this morning reviewing the papers and he managed to say on two separate occasions WW1 was all down to the evils of …… wait for it……, nationalism. Nothing to with imperialism of course. Just people who would not stay in their box. Tut Tut.

      Who would have known it the SNP started the First World War.

      Had to switch off after he said it the second time.

      Andrew Marr – anglo scot Britnat – as Scottish as Morris dancing.

    107. Thepnr says:



    108. Sinky says:

      Thanks Nana but that is an old article. The one I am looking for was published a day or so after this year’s UK Budget.

      Also worth reading Andrew Wilson in today’s Sunday National on oil revenues pointing out that UK has got £500 billion in revenues from North Sea Oil.

    109. Nana says:

      @Pnr I think you have the right article there.

    110. Golfnut says:

      When Scotland dissolves the Union, and I don’t necessarily believe that will be due to a referendum, the International courts are going to be involved. As I said in the previous thread, I would really like to hear Westminster explain GERS.

    111. Sinky says:

      Thanks Thepnr

    112. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Frank G 7.46: well said. Big countries’ nationalism/imperialism good, others’ bad.

      Scotland’s “nationalism” is a simply defensive desire to exist at all and to be left alone to follow its own path.

      Boris/caltonjock made the good point recently in his blog that while we were enjoined to support “plucky little Belgium” in WW1, it was carrying out atrocities in its colony in the Congo, like all exploiting empires.

      As for Macron/Blair and his havers, my brother’s father-in-law was French. He joined the army to get a regular wage and was posted to Syria in the 30s. He loved its people, its complex culture and its landscapes but saw close up, like Orwell, the evils of colonialism, so much so he became a communist and later joined the maquis against Vichy France.

      Someone should remind Macron of the number of Algerian corpses which floated down the Seine at the height of the anti-Algerian crisis in the early 60s, the reality of brutal imperial nationalism.

    113. galamcennalath says:

      We often see that WW2 was considered different from WW1. A more moral crusade, more just. As time has gone on, I am far from convinced that was true.

      In Asia, the imperial powers – UK, Netherlands, France, and the US (who had taken Spain’s empire) – showed that the way to get ahead in Asia was to carve out an Empire. It was not a good example to set. So, the Japanese copied and invaded mainland Asia.

      Also, the established imperialists were strangling Japan’s economy holding back oil and other raw materials. The US was provocatively building a huge runway on Wake Island at a time when air passenger transport was by seaplane. This was clearly to put strategic bombers within range of Japan.

      IMO there really were no good guys, just innocents caught up in it all.

      As for Europe, the real intention was to destroy communism. There were strong elements within France and the UK which didn’t want war. In fact, I would venture that many sympathised with fascism or at least the idea of removing communism. I expect as time passes WW2 will also be seen in more imperial terms. It was certainly the first war where the strategic quest for oil played a huge part.

    114. Terence callachan says:

      Countries around the world go to war over oil.
      Englands Westminster will do anything to keep control of Scotland and I do mean anything.
      Many many of the English people living here in Scotland got their jobs through government departments and agencies or businesses that are against Scottish independence and don’t believe for a minute that there is no big plan to ensure that as many English people are assisted in job hunting in Scotlands to maintain a high proportion of support for colonialism at the ballot box because if you do your head is in the sand.Just take a look at how Englands Westminster treated all the other countries it previously held captive under the colonial umbrella they treated them like dirt under their shoes just as they are doing to Scotland right now, they know Scottish oil props up Englands economy but are prepared to take Scotland out of the EU against our will and continually tell lies about other aspects of life in Scotland doing us down at every opportunity.
      English people should not have a vote on Scottish independence why would you allow English people a vote when all you get are lies and betrayal.
      If English people had not been allowed to vote in the last Scottish independence referendum Scotland would now be independent.
      Can you imagine England allowing Scottish people a vote on English independence if there were twelve times as many Scottish people as English ? no didn’t think so.
      It’s time to take back control
      Now is not the time for English people to decide Scotlands future those times have passed.

    115. Clydebuilt says:

      BBC Parliament Channell. ” Fake News Committee” . . . There is one !

    116. wull2 says:

      I have said this before.

      If the EU waits until we have been pulled out, I for one will not vote to re-join, bang goes there fishing and oil that we don’t have.

    117. Petra says:

      Thanks a million Nana. I’ll check them out when I get more time later.

      Part 1:

      Part 2:


      @ ScottieDog says at 5:49 pm …. ”Petra, I think some reverse psychology is required here. Why don’t we call on the U.K. gov to leave the oil where it is? Let’s meet our climate objectives and at the same time let the U.K. gov make the argument about Scotland’s wealth for us?!

      Westminster leave the oil where it is, ScottieDog? That’ll never happen. Following Independence we’ll have choices. One being use our oil revenues ONLY up until we get our renewable energy sector where we want it to be, that is making a load of dosh for us.


      @ Dr Jim says at 6:47 pm …. ”Well they have as much oil as *we do* and only 4million people instead of 60 million so…. and then David Cameron was cut off as he was talking to Andrew Marr about Norway.”

      A wee reminder Dr Jim. Andrew Marr making a grand job of trying to shut Cameron up. Andy and Cammy Better Together, eh?

    118. Petra says:

      Please watch if you haven’t seen them before.

      ‘The Truth About Scottish Independence: The McCrone Report Scandal.’


      ‘The Stolen Seas.’


      ‘Jim Rogers on Brexit: If Scotland takes its oil with it…’

    119. Mogabee says:

      Andy Critchlow is a fully paid up sycophant of a bunch of morally corrupt media owners.

      Vilest and lowest of the low. Willing to say anything at his master’s behest.

      I see you. We see you. Scotland sees you.

      Your kind will be superfluous soon enough…tick-tock

    120. HYUFD says:

      Terence Callachan So what are your franchise criteria for any indyref 2 then? Only those born in Scotland and living in Scotland can vote ie no immigrants to Scotland whether English or otherwise and no Scots living in England?

    121. Mogabee says:

      Well Terence Callachan, here’s one English born person telling you to get aff yer arse and go and persuade folk that voting yes will give us choices we sure as hell don’t have now.

      Substitute English for Irish and see how far you’d get.

      I think folk like you are all talk…

    122. Cubby says:

      Terence Callahan@8.55pm

      My advice to you is not to get involved with the resident Britnat fanatical Tory. He doesnt know his arse from his elbow and is just a bloody irritant. If you have to reply just tell him to f….. off. He deserves no respect. He is not here to learn. He has a closed mind.

      He is a perfect example of why we want independence.

    123. Thepnr says:

      I’m pretty sure just about everybody in Scotland and the Uk is sick to the death of Brexshit now. Hurray up and get it finished seems to be what I’m hearing.

      Is that why though this has dragged on like it has with no end in sight, probably. Why did the UK vote to leave in the first place, for sure immigration concerns played a major part and were ramped up on TV and the right wing press for years even before the vote.

      Remember Calais and the asylum seekers on the news 10 times a day, stories of boats sinking in the Med full of people fleeing Libya and seeking a new life in Europe?

      How about crime and the criminal gangs running prostitution with “trafficked” women from Caesar!nia or Kosovo and any other place you care to mention in Eastern Europe like Romania. Yeah don’t forget the Romanians as that sounds like Romans or Gypsies as many would have them called.

      Well who paid for all this HATE to get into our papers, our telly and splashed in adverts on our Facebook pages?

      Somebody paid and they weren’t do this for the benefit of the general public of the UK, oh No they have their own plans and that means “taking back control”.

      Control of what? Us, that’s what. Control of the populace, not content with what they already have they want more and the UK public voted to give them exactly what they want when they voted to leave the EU.

      Voted to leave Human Rights and Worker legislation provided as a member of the EU. Voted to leave the largest trading block in the world with the best trade deals that anyone can get with all the other countries of the world. They voted to align themselves with Trump and his Xenophobic views.

      I can’t really believe it but people voted for slavery of themselves and it was all paid for by the billionaires who control all the wealth and all the press. They have been fooled.

      As for Scotland we did not all for for their crap and overwhelmingly rejected Brexit. We did though fall for their crap in 2014 and cannot afford to let that happen again.

      I’m pleading, get one thing straight and that is we can win this fight but it will take everyone of us to persuade another fellow Scot to come over to our side and support Independence in a democratic vote. There is no “other way”.

    124. Davie Oga says:

      Can Scotgov use the powers in the Town and Country planning act (1997) to frustrate the landing of oi?

      Can Glasgow council revoke and alter the planning permission for Pacific Quay in order to redesignate it for social or mixed use housing?

    125. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Cubby at 7:56 pm.

      You typed,

      “I already said earlier today indyref2 will be soon.

      Definition of soon: In or after a short time.”

      As part of my ‘O-Level’ and ‘Higher’ English, I was compelled to study Shakespeare. Apart from being able to quote parts of “Friends, Romans, countrymen” and “The quality of mercy is not strained”, I adopted one of Shakespeare’s well used words – “anon”.

      According to Oxford, it means “Soon; shortly.” I’ve been using it for over fifty years, as in “See you anon”. NOBODY has ever asked what I mean when I say it.

      Mmmm… I don’t know what the point of this comment is but maybe it will come to me anon; like the withdrawal from The Treaty of Union.

    126. Legerwood says:

      Thepnr @ 10.31 pm

      Control of people – you mean by microchipping employees perhaps? See this from Guardian online this evening

    127. He was plain ‘Mister’ back in the day when he lied about oil reserves and spread his Scotland is Shite, too poor message of fear.
      He got his reward for selling his country to the English of course.
      Lord Darling of Flipping.

      “The SNP are set to over-estimate value of North Sea oil, warns Darling

      THE SNP are planning to over-estimate the value of oil to an independent Scotland in a move that “strikes at the heart of their credibility”, according to Alistair Darling..

      Alistair Darling claims SNP say one thing in private and another in public”

      This was from The Telegraph
      10 Mar 2013

      “The former chancellor and leader of the Better Together campaign said the party’s plans to produce a new set of oil projection figures this week proved that they said one thing in private and another thing in public.
      Last week, a leaked paper by John Swinney, the finance minister, questioned the affordability of state pensions after independence and warned that the country’s finances would be at the mercy of volatile oil prices.
      It also accepted forecasts from the Office for Budget Responsibility predicting declining oil revenues in the near future.
      However, Mr Swinney claimed in a Sunday newspaper article that Scotland was, in fact, on the cusp of another oil boom due to rising oil prices and a wave of investments in Scottish fields.

      He predicted that production and revenues from the North Sea would surge from 2016 – the SNP’s planned date for separation.

      Mr Darling ridiculed the claims, saying: “This week, after having civil servants burning the midnight oils all weekend, the nationalists will rush out a paper that will contradict the oil revenue projections that only a few days ago they were supporting.

      “Their own fiscal commission told them not to over-estimate the value of oil in the long term, yet that is exactly what they are going to do. What happens if Alex Salmond is wrong? What happens if the price does fall?

      “Oil is great for Scotland. However, we know that oil prices go up and down and that one day it will surely run out.

      “The difference in tax revenues between the year when oil prices were at their highest and the year that they were at their lowest was almost pounds12 billion. This is more than the entire Scottish NHS budget.

      “Independence is forever, oil is not. Given the unpredictability of the price and the lack of certainty on how much is left, is it really worth staking our mortgages, pensions and our economic future on such a risky gamble?”

      Ken Macintosh,(remember him?)Scottish Labour’s finance spokesman, said the SNP was being “utterly reckless” with Scotland’s future by “asking us to gamble on oil and won’t even be honest with us about the choice we face”.

      He added: “We know that oil is a volatile commodity and the very fact we are arguing over the strength of the independent forecasts just proves how uncertain our future would be if we based our economy on oil.”

      This time we don’t let these bastards away with running down Scotland.
      We call them out: publicly harangue them when they appear on the Brit Nat media and Dead Tree Scrolls’ columns lying to the People of Scotland.
      We are much more vocal and media street wise now.
      Pillory these wasters at every opportunity. Shame them for lying to the Scots about Scotland.
      Where’s Darling these days?

    128. Thepnr says:


      Nothing surprises me anymore.

    129. remo says:

      How come I do not ever remember reading in Britnat media (or anywhere else for that matter) that oil is bad for other countries which produce it – just Scotland? How come it is only Scottish oil which has been running out for the last half a century? I asked a No-voting pal these questions before the 2014 referendum and am still waiting for a sensible answer. I also asked why Englandshire was so desperate to keep Scotland if we were a financial basket case. Still waiting for that answer too. I would love to know how to tackle those who really do not want to think or be properly informed about their own country. Any suggestions?

    130. yesindyref2 says:

      The barcode tattoo in my neck is very attractive. I asked for the saltire version.

    131. Golfnut says:

      @Jack Collatin,
      Let’s not forget 2014/2015 was the year they inadvertently lost £17 billion of revenue down the back of the sofa. Some might think that was deliberate. We need to remind people of that because they are doing it again.

    132. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Jack Collatin (10.53) –

      Excellent medley of reminders there.

      Cheers aplenty!


      P.S. I haven’t the faintest idea where he is now, but someone must know! He’s maybe got a new job making UJ bagpipe covers?

    133. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      ScottieDog at 5.49

    134. Al-Stuart says:

      Robin Barclay made a perfect point.

      Stuart Campbell, PLEASE keep up your forensic analysis.

      First thing every morning I check out Wings over Scotland and BBC Scotland for my news. I read wings for accurate reporting and BBC Scotland for a bit of fiction and to see what the bu66ers are up to.

      I am FURIOUS WITH THE SNP and a certain Holyrood minister who treated a charity I support with contempt. One of my friends founded that charity and IN SPITE OF THE SNP GOVERNMENT, BEHAVING DREADFULLY, THE CHARITY HAS SURVIVED.

      That disgraceful episode almost sent me from a YES voter to a NO voter.

      BUT this WoS website keeps me sane.

      I know beyond all reasonable doubt that Scotland would be far better governing itself. To be free of the shackles of Westminster. You’re on-topic example of how Westminster is squandering Scotland oil instead of us following the Nordic example of investing it for the future of our children is just one instance where Westminster has got it terribly wrong.

      So Stuart please keep this website as an exemplar of top class journalism and how duplicitous the Westminster politicians. It proves with facts how we have a better future with Holyrood politicians elected by ourselves, rather than a cripple-killing, rape clause promoting, expense fiddling, Brexit 5hitting Tories who we don’t elect governmening us like a Dickensian colony of the Rees-Mogg Raj Empire.

      Hopefully once Scotland gets its independence holy rude and particularly the SNP will sort themselves out with politicians of a decent calibre across the board and not the circuis of too many idiots we have in many political parties at Edinburgh just now.

      Robin Barclay’s point is, actually incredibly important and well worth acting upon.

      —— Original quote source —-

      Robin Barclay says:
      11 November, 2018 at 4:00 pm

    135. Thepnr says:

      Those in charge used to control everyone not in charge by fear. You know when you could be hung for stealing a sheep or deported to Australia for stealing a loaf of bread.

      Even look at an officer in the wrong way and you’d be guaranteed to spend a few months in the cells.

      We’re past all that now, we’re civilised so we are. Forget the mistakes and the injustices of the past, I promise we’re different now. Just give me your vote and I will take care of you and your family. I promise.

      Just watch though that you don’t lose your job because they’ll be nothing for you, everybody has to work to earn a living and you should be no different. “Ah but I’m ill and can’t work” Sorry I know that must be tough but there are food banks, some other mugs will take care of you as that is not governments job.

      “But couldn’t the government just tax the large corporations and the most wealthy just a little bit more to ensure children don’t go hungry”?


    136. Cubby says:


      Indyref2 anon. Works for me.

    137. wull says:

      London – that square mile ‘City’ thing – is built on paper. That is, money! Paper stuff, with nothing to back it. Not a firm foundation to build on. Mere paper.

      As the Palace of Westminster continues to sink into the mud, paper doesn’t even float.

      Oil, by contrast, is real. So is wind energy. And wave energy is real too. Scotland not only has a future; Scotland is the future. The only viable country in the so-called UK.

      Some people don’t know anything about politics because they genuinely don’t know. They are ignorant. An easy prey for the vultures who carry them off into their Fake News Kingdoms.

      Vulture-Politicians and Vulture-Journalists yoked together, united in heart and soul, in their common Vulture-Venture. That is, in their United-Vulture-Kingdom.

      Of England.
      And its Gobbled-Up Appendices.

      English-Nat Brit-Vultures know they are lying. And they know they are deceiving. It is deliberate. Conscious, fully intended, knowingly carried out, entirely culpable lies. And deceit.

      Deceiving the innocents who don’t know anything about politics. Those who are easy prey to all Vultures.

      As to the abusers of these ignorant innocents … whether they are P-Vultures or J-Vultures, gobbling journos or gobbling pols, they are all one, combined in their joint programme of picking up their prey. And gobbling them down lustily.

      Gobble, gobble, gobble …

      The gobblers, with their goblets, all wine and dine together, exercising theiur ever-churning greedy gobs … And then enjoy their expensive after-dinner cigars, puffing out smoke in the Smoke-and-Mirrors room of their highly esteemed ‘jolly good, old boy’ Establishment …

      What a good time is had by all the merry Gobblers … At the Vulture Club that runs their United-Vulture-Kingdom.

      Edward I knew that he was lying through his vizored teeth when he claimed to be overlord of Scotland. It wasn’t a mistake. It was a lie, through and through, a deliberate deception. Played out not just in Scotland, but on the international stage, deceiving everyone …

      The England-uber-alles Brit-Nat Vultures aren’t any different. They have known all along that they are lying through their Vulture-teeth … And they do it every time they open their mouths NOT to speak of Scotland, but to GOBBLE it up.

      In 700 years, nothing has changed. Nothing.


      (which could be a rousing chorus, if someone ever finds a tune).

      They come to bury Scotland, not to praise it.
      Gobble gobble, Toil and Trouble, they come to lay us waste’t.

      Thon Sleeping Beauty, Sco’lan’, maun noo wake frae slumber,
      An’ dae whit Wallace did, and then the Bruce, on thon Mid-Summer
      Day, the 24th o’ June, seeven hunner year gone by, an’
      Slay thon Vulture-Beast, its thrapple strangul’t in its lyin’
      Mooth, done doon tae deith, cleavit by the broadsword o’ its ain

      Yet … no’ sae gory as afore! In oor new story, deceit is slain
      By spreading oot the Wings o’ Truth, o’er hill an’ glen,
      In city lichts an’ every ben, an’ Oh! Whit glory to be alive
      When Sco’lan’ stauns up again, renewed, tae breathe an’ thrive
      In freedom’s sang, her very air cleaned free o’ Vulture throngs,
      Aince mair Untruth by Truth undone, Richtin’ a’ thon Lies an’

      An’ strikin’ dumb the lyin’ tongues, a’ ye wha’ Scotia nurtures,
      Spreid yer Wings, an’ sing yer sang an’ Truth’ll kill the

    138. HYUFD says:

      What does that say about the Edinburgh and Aberdeen financial services sector then? Plus London also has a thriving creative arts and IT and tech and media and legal sector too, it is not just finance.

      England also has some of that North Sea Oil too, it is not all Scottish and there are plenty of wind farms in England too and wave energy in Cornwall

    139. mike cassidy says:

      Is the Crichley writing above about the political leverage oil would provide ‘us’

      the same Crichley who wrote this in August

    140. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Thepnr @ 22:31:

      I’m pretty sure just about everybody in Scotland and the UK is sick to the death of Brexshit now. Hurray up and get it finished seems to be what I’m hearing.

      Aye, and if we don’t do something about it beforehand, come 30.March this will rise to a loud chorus of “FGS, give us a break, no more, it’s a shame and all that but it’s done now, we’re done now, so pipe down about it”.

      All orchestrated by Corporal Davidson, echoed by Corbyn’s little meee-tooo BritNat followers, and blasted out by the media like there’s no tomorrow. (Which there might as well be.) Like 2017 but louder.

      And we who desperately want to get out of this prison will feel just the same as on 19.Sept.2014. Another beautiful opportunity lost.

      Unless we shake ourselves out of passive mode sometime soon and do something about it. Offer a clear way forward out of this utter failure of UK stewardship.

      Word-of-mouth is great, but without a full-on campaign, our story won’t get through the heavy media blockade and our truths won’t reach those who most need to hear it.

    141. mike cassidy says:


      I meant Critchlow!

    142. Famous15 says:

      In the face of powerful evidence that Scotland could not only survive but with the bonus of oil and gas it would match Norway in riches do we find a certain trolling fud sounding like the story child saying if you do not agree with me I’ll squeem and squeem.

    143. mike cassidy says:

      The Fud strikes again.

      Oh that wonderful wavepower in Cornwall!

    144. Thepnr says:

      @Robert J. Sutherland

      Shake yourself out of it then and get on with persuading people.

    145. Thepnr says:


      “UK Government hit-man Stephan Kock also features, the assassination of Gerald Bull, builder of Sadam’s Super Gun. A large cast of rogues making fortunes supplying arms to both sides in the Iran/Iraq War, including Mark Thatcher.”

      Back in 1992 I was working as an engineer in London on what was the biggest offshore oil job going on at that time. I was working for a Scottish company and flew down every Monday morning and back again Friday afternoon.

      So anyway, our company had a big slice of the pie in the construction of the structures for this project and of course there were others who hoped to get a slice of our pie.

      So one night my boss the Project Manager, myself and two others were invited for dinner at a posh London restaurant for dinner. The host was a paint salesman basically but the owner of the company. By the way the paint contract was a pretty big deal when you are talking of 20,000 Tonnes of steel to be painted to Offshore standards.

      I’ll get to the point, I was very bored with the conversation. Our host reminded me of that guy with the whiskers from Emmerdale Farm he had that big red Gammon face and the whiskers and chops to match.

      Then just when everyone was almost falling asleep he talked about the Super Gun and the trial of the Matrix Churchill directors for selling the gun to Saddam Hussain.

      He thought it a scandal that they should be in court, he explained how the arms business was the perfect place to make money and how sorry he felt for these guys on trial.

      This perked me up a bit and then he told us “If only I could live it all again I’d have come back as an arms dealer and I’d be retired by now”.

      So I just told him, “might as well come back as a drug dealer, you’ll make even more money and kill just as money people”.

      Silence around the table, my boss is not amused. Gammon face looks like he’s ready to explode and the other two are holding in their guffaws. I don’t really remember too much about the rest of that night but I do remember being happy 🙂

    146. Petra says:

      We’re getting there.

      Professor Mark McNaught’s draft Constitution for the Scottish State.

    147. Thepnr says:

      I meant as many people, not money people.

      I never proof read my posts, they’re directly from the heart and I know most get the meaning anyway LOL

    148. Liz g says:

      Mike Cassidy @ 12.53
      Aren’t ye feeling all warm and fuzzy about dissolving the Union ?
      Now that ye know all about the diversity of London’s economy… they even have “allegedly “ some North Sea Oil too… yay…
      I hope it’s enough to keep the lights on for 60 odd million especially in the Art Galleries of London!

      We need have nay concerns for Westminster’s ability tae mange after we leave…. and ,and,and they can even put all the money saved from supporting Scotland into health care ?
      They can put the promise to do so on the side of a bus, as that seems to be where their voters get their information…
      This is all going to work out so well…. I bet all of Westminster will give thanks every day that they have London…

    149. Davie Oga says:

      Hey Fud, No rational person would suggest that England doesn’t have resources. The challenge for England is that it doesn’t have enough. Not enough electricity to power what’s left of it’s industry, not enough gas to heat it’s homes , and not enough food to feed it’s population. Fortunately, after England saved the world during WW2, the Coal and Steel Community, then the Common Market were created so that European nations could achieve peace and prosperity through tariff free, unfettered access to each others resources, goods, and services. Unless England were to do something catastrophically foolish like leaving the common market, then it’s deficiencies are manageble. Mind you, I don’t know why I’ve
      even mentioned that last point. No sane government could countenance such a monumental act self-harm. Could they?

    150. sandr says:

      o/t interesting article lifted from Pete Wishart’s twitter feed,,

      Gove managing to enrage 50 plus Scottish farmers and businesspeople. “Sidekick” George Eustace appeared instead of Gove who was too busy to see them. He talked to them for 20 mins giving his views which “basically they wanted us to gang up on the SNP ans demand they fell in with the English cuts to subsidy and the Gove plan to pay something for ill defined “social goods”.

      It sounds as if it deteriorated from there, oh to be there to listen to that!

    151. Ghillie says:

      Scotland has been used and abused for centuries.

      This will end and soon.

      Andy Critchlow’s article is an example of the monumental arrogance that allows that ‘journalist’ to write such a piece without realising he has just laid down, in black and white, evidence that Scotland is exploited for his government’s gain.

    152. Petra says:

      @ Ghillie at 3:22am …. “Andy Chritchlow.”

      Arrogance Ghillie? Who knows maybe he’s a Yes supporter now, lol?

    153. Petra says:

      Oh well BBC news continued this morning with data about Armistice Day. Then on to BBC Scotland and not a dicky bird about the fantastic illumination in Edinburgh. So good in fact, that it must have been sticking in their craw. Does anyone have any idea who actually decides what the Scots should be told / shown on a daily basis?


      ‘Is fear of crime rocketing but only in non-Scottish parts of UK?’


      ‘Scottish student nurse and midwifery numbers reach record high as they plummet in Toryland.’


      ‘As NHS England cancer treatment wait statistics ‘set to be worst on record’, NHS Scotland’s success is ignored.’


      ‘BBC Scotland promotes Fraser of Allander nice neoliberal institutes latest daft idea.’

      ”Introduction of student nurse tuition fees.”…

    154. Petra says:

      ‘No-deal Brexit looms as Tory deadlock with Brussels continues.’


      Nurse vacancies in Scotland only a fifth per capita of those in ‘Dear Old Blighty’ blighted by Toryism


      ‘Glasgow Gallery and Museum beats Edinburgh and London.’


      ‘Scottish Independence Convention fund hits halfway mark.’

      …..“Preparing really good materials and arguments to help to reach that group of voters is among the first things we hope to do.” ..

    155. Capella says:

      In case you are wondering how Westminster manages to spend billions of oil money every year, you’ll be glad to know a few drops go to our dear former leaders.

      All past prime ministers since Major, who established the arrangement in 1991, have been entitled to claim the public duty cost allowance (PDCA) of up to £115,000 a year, to cover costs of ongoing public arrangements when they step down from office.

      Moneybags Blair claimed £1m in British taxpayers’ money over last decade https:

      What are “public arrangements”, I wonder. Security? Surely the state pays for that.

    156. Nana says:

      Change tack or face defeat, Brexit critics tell May

      Today, @carolecadwalla reports whistleblower @shahmiruk has been completely vindicated by the so-called ‘Taxpayers Alliance’ (founded by same guy who ran Vote Leave) admitting all liability after they sacked and smeared him for revealing illegal activity by Leave campaigns…

    157. Nana says:

      Mum of soldier who killed himself in front of his platoon pleads for more help for today’s troops

      Realities of leaving the EU are crushing the Brexiteer’s fantasies

      Brexit plan ‘complete shambles’, UK boss of ThyssenKrupp says

      May’s best pals

    158. manandboy says:

      From “For the Fallen”
      Poem by Robert Laurence Binyon (1869-1943)

      “They went with songs to the battle, they were young,
      Straight of limb, true of eye, steady and aglow.
      They were staunch to the end against odds uncounted,
      They fell with their faces to the foe.

      They shall grow not old, as we that are left grow old:
      Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
      At the going down of the sun and in the morning
      We will remember them.”

      The 100th anniversary of Armistice Day is now over.
      The fallen were remembered – but only by the many, not by the few. Not by Britain’s wealthy neo-liberal elite and its political arm, the Tory Party. They were, in contrast, forgetting.

      The fallen died for our freedom, but the British Establishment have abused that freedom by waging a new war, an economic war, which was declared by Thatcher, and is currently continued by May through Austerity, a war against the families of the fallen.

      Standing surrounded by the genuine, at Cenotaphs and at Remembrance Church services, and others, around the UK, the Elite’s are putting on a show, pretending to remember, even as they continue to take no prisoners in their rush to plunder, amid the onslaught of cuts against the descendants of the Fallen.
      Laying their wreaths down and bowing their heads, but impatient to get back to the military-like neo-liberal campaign to extract the taxpayer’s cash and place it securely off-shore in a tax-haven.

      No remembering by them, and no concern either for the 4.5 million children and their families living in poverty in the UK in 2018. They are the casualties of the war being waged by the Elite’s, and carried out by the Tory government.

      “We can completely fool enough of the electorate all of the time, and so we concentrate on them, feeding them constantly with our daily propaganda, brainwashing them, in effect, in preparation for the next election or referendum.”, said a source close to the government .

      Armistice day is over, but the war continues.

      Hail Caesar!.

    159. manandboy says:

      Ps. Salute to Nana.

    160. Ken500 says:

      Critchlow what a name. Is just another freaking liar. How low can they go? What a bunch of total liars Murdoch and the establishment liars. Killing and maiming millions of people. Murdoch walks away with £30Billion for ruining the world. Instead of being in Church he should be in prison. Along with all the sanctimonious liars.

      ‘Thou shalt not kill’. They have sanctioned, starved and killed millions of people, worldwide, They should hang theur heads in shame. Have the Royals apologised yet for the carnage that their family caused. All over Europe and worldwide.

      They are trying to bring down the world economy. Celebrating their privileged position based on lies. Instead of commemorating the millions that have mained and killed illegally. ”Austerity’ is a sham based on lies. Totally indefensible. Another quite unnecessary attack on society. Another excuse for the wealthier to line their pockets on others people’s misery. The largest unfair wealth gap in the world. Tax evasion reigns.

      The Russian revolution 1917 after Victoria’s grandson tried to sanction and starve the people. The ‘divine right to rule’ from God. He was giving nothing away. Choosing to starve the impoverished people.

      The Russian saved the West in the 11WW. 26milions died. Now they are sanctioning and trying to starve the Russians. Not much gratitude, from the Westminster total and utter liars and the sychophant lying Press. Tax evading Non Doms. A disgrace. Every word they utter is a lie. Lie after lie, after lie. They are not fit to govern. They betray the voters. Brexit is beyond belief. An absolute shambolic mess. The usual. That will affect Scotland the worst. The NE oil region the most.

      The Brexiteers are in full swing trying to ruin the Scottish economy. Scotland voted Remain. They do not give a damn. The EU costs Scotland nothing but brings benefit and investment much more than Westminster does. The EU invests in Scotland, The Westminster liars take from Scotland illegally and secretly. Since 1928 and before. Iraq, Dunblane and Lockerbie kept secret for 100 years. What have they got to hide?

    161. manandboy says:

      “Recent history provides two extreme examples of government incompetence. Decisions made by people who had no idea what they were doing. Elected politicians incapable of paying attention to details.

      The blanket guarantee provided by the (British and) Irish government to banks and the British guarantee of “no hard Border” have eerie similarities: poor decisions made by people who were operating way out of their league. Making stuff up as you go along. Taking decisions based on mental tosses of a coin, saying stuff before engaging the brain: all this is the currency of modern policy-making. The advent of artificial intelligence is welcome: any form of intelligence would be an improvement.

      Politics requires never admitting to anything. Never own up to mistakes, never ever say ‘I don’t know’ or ‘I’m not sure’. Say anything you like – anything at all, any old rubbish will do – but never show weakness. As John Wayne said, never explain, never apologise.

      Was anyone shocked this week when UK Brexit secretary Dominic Raab inadvertently acknowledged that he is an idiot? Talking about Brexit’s impact on the availability of stuff in shops, he was quoted as saying that he hadn’t realised that Dover was important to British trade.

      “I hadn’t quite understood the full extent of this….but if you look at the UK, at how we trade in goods, we are particularly reliant on the Dover-Calais crossing….”

    162. Robert Louis says:

      I see the BBC propaganda channel (‘news’ channel) is running a full blown propaganda exercise for nuclear power today. Un real. truly beggars belief Right up there with full on state propaganda.

      BBC =Pravda.

    163. Luigi says:

      Ah well, that’s it over. Respect of course to the lions led by donkeys (in all British wars). 100 years – surely that’s it now?

      I hope the BritNats aren’t planning to continue this annual poppyfest for another 100 years.

      100 years – it’s over.

    164. Cubby says:

      The Britnats who post on Wings never comment on the Wings post at the top of the page. They are like leeches they just jump on btl posts with their ignorant at best or irrelevant comments. They are here to annoy and disrupt.

    165. Cubby says:

      I heard during last weeks Finace debate in Holyrood a comment saying that some Scottish MPs were registering as English taxpayers. I guess none of them were SNP as the Britnat media in Scotland would have been all over it.

      If this is true then we have people supposed to be representing Scotland registering as English and depriving Scotland of money. Who would have thought it.

    166. Robert Louis says:

      Of course with the sickening poppy-fest (I remember those who were killed without all the nonsense) now drawing to a close, we need to remember that next year is the 80th anniversary of the START of the second world war. I do not doubt for one second that it too will be hijacked to present yet another full on ‘britishness’ propaganda exercise.

      Will Danny Boyle be doing the celebrations ‘commemorations’ again?

      Expect the announcements soon.

      The poppy used to be very simple, and respected. It has now been turned into a right wing britishness propaganda exercise. Union jack bagpipes and all (the piper should be ashamed at himself, throughly, thoroughly ashamed).

      Oh, and also coming up in 2019, a new baby from some work shy scrounger called harry and his wife.

      ‘Rule Britannia..toot, toot.’

    167. HYUFD says:

      Liz G London has the 4th highest GDP of any city in the world after Tokyo, New York and LA what an absurd comment and ultimately it is the creative industries London is full of that are the future of the global economy, oil will eventually run out.

    168. Robert Louis says:

      Cubby at 0824 am,

      Those Mp’s need named and shamed.

    169. HYUFD says:

      Ken500 Tell Scottish fishermen how much they should love the EU and hold back for the forceful response!

    170. Nana says:

      Morning manandboy

      I wasn’t paying enough attention this morning as you can see from the first set of links

      Bot! I promise I am not a Bot! 🙂

      Second mistake there are four links at 7.23, missed the spacing between the Bloomberg link and the FT article.

      Two more for the pot

      Labour’s Sir Keir Starmer insists ‘Brexit can be stopped’ to contradict Jeremy Corbyn

      This fellow always said it could be stopped

    171. HYUFD says:

      Robert Louis Those soldiers fought and died under the Union Jack

    172. Cactus says:

      Aye agree Luigi, 100 years gone, the end of an era, time to move on.

      A thankin’ yous for this mornings links, ladies.

      Nice timing and essential reading.

      Just over 17 days to go.


    173. Robert Louis says:

      Lizg at 0124am,

      Quite right. Scotland will do well without London leeching Scotland’s oil wealth and taxes. Any city does well, where several countries hand over their wealth to it. London is a parasite feeding off Scotland. Why else are the Tories and their labour britnationalist accomplices so keen to keep a hold of Scotland.

    174. potter says:

      @HYFUD HMRC trade stats show Londons second largest export last year was Mineral Fuel, wonder where that came from?

    175. Hamish100 says:

      Fud Union flag if you dont mind. Get your facts right. What did they fight for? On behalf of queen vics nephews. But you’re right too many Scots died in wars decided in London. The Boer war, Iraq, Afghanistan .So much sacrificed by so many for do few.

    176. Nana says:

      Morning Cactus 🙂

    177. Robert Peffers says:

      @Thepnr says: 11 November, 2018 at 7:55 pm:

      ” … Full coverage of all their shit can only be beamed into your living room if you choose to receive it by tuning in.”

      That part is true. You have the choice of not watching the live propaganda as you control the receiver be it on or off line.

      … That’s one of the reasons I choose not too and it saves me the cost of a license fee.

      That’s also true you can refuse to pay the license fee.

      … Switch off and don’t pay for their propaganda, watch something else instead like Outlaw King and you won’t feel so bad.”

      Unfortunately only the bit about watching something else instead is true for as a tax payer, and everyone pays indirect taxation, you are still funding the BBC as their annual grant from Westminster is paid from the consolidated tax fund, (i.e. from general taxation).

      Furthermore, in the case of the so called independent TV companies you still fund them as the cost to their advertisers is passed on to the consumers by the advertisers who fund the independent TV networks.

      The English Nationalists are a devious lot and the Scots, Welsh, Irish and, believe it or not, even the English themselves have always been brainwashed by the Establishment even when the likes of Daniel Defoe were being paid by The Establishment to pen political pamphlets for the government.

      The English establishment have always been the largest propagators of propaganda that the World has known. The BBC World Service, which is UK government funded, is the biggest such propaganda broadcaster in the entire World.

      Not even VOA and/or Radio Moscow has ever come close to taking that dis-honour away from the BBC and we United Kingdom taxpayers have always footed the bill.

      Whether we bought a licence to watch/listen or not we have always footed the BBC Bill. The Licence fee is just an extra payment for the gullible viewers as their general taxation is the main provider of funding for the BBC and the cost of advertising is always passed onto the customer.

    178. HYUFD says:

      Robert Louis London makes a net contribution to the UK Treasury, Scotland is a net recipient from the UK Treasury

    179. galamcennalath says:

      It is now within our grasp to ensure that no young Scot ever dies in another imperial war.

      Nae mair will the bonnie callants
      Mairch tae war when oor braggarts crousely craw

      – Hamish Henderson

      When he wrote this, it was probably a pipe dream. Now, we can make it happen.

      Perhaps the demise of the UK will permanently banish the blood soaked butchers apron.

    180. Breeks says:

      Nana says:
      12 November, 2018 at 7:21 am

      Union Jack bagpipes at the armistice centenary is the ultimate in UK racist insults.

      Thanks Nana, as always.

      Largely repeating what I said yesterday. I didn’t see the Union Jack bedecked bagpipes, because I don’t watch the BBC, but it’s the same calculated insult as the British Establishment and their Uncle Tams in Stirling orchestrating a clash between their Armed Forces Day and the 700th Anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn.

      Gordon Ross is quite correct, it is simply risible. It’s the equivalent of taking a Saltire to Dorset or Devon and demanding that Morris and May Pole Dancers salute it. That would make my skin crawl, nevermind theirs. What depraved mentality would think this bagpipe idea constructive??? An Englishman? Or a cringing toady from closer to home?

      I used to wear poppies. The modern ugliness of the poppy was the tasteless commercialisation of the concept, but the poppy itself was sacred to me, it was literally the physical resurrection of the fallen as life triumphed over the slaughter without prejudice or discrimination. Communion bread merely represents the body of Christ, but the petals of a 1918 Flanders poppy truly were the literal resurrection of life from death.

      Such ideas changed for me after Stirling’s Armed Forces day, when the “British Establishment” came to Stirling specifically to cock it’s leg over Scotland’s own commemoration of the Battle of Bannockburn. It didn’t work, of course it didn’t, but again, as I said yesterday, henceforth I will no longer wear a poppy, but commemorate instead ALL the flowers of the forest.

      I hope however this bleak tokenism of a decrepit Union in it’s death throws does however mark a turning point. From here on out, we no longer dwell on our Nation’s deconstruction through Brexit, but start to promote an articulate Scotland’s emancipation from the madness and focus all effort on our salvation and our imminent economic prosperity in Europe.

      Let the despair of Dover’s bottlenecks be offset by the constructive reinvention of Leith, Dundee and Aberdeen,…. hell yes, Berwick upon Tweed too if they’ve the guts for it. Ferry ports, airports joint infrastructure projects… Scotland’s renaissance can be a wholesome tonic for us all, but steeped in objective 21st Century terrestrial opportunities which put food in our bellies and money in our pockets, not lukewarm reheating of 19th Century Colonial delusion which steals our oil, our bagpipes, and our fallen soldiers as their own.

      Haven’t we seen enough yet? We’ve “British” Whisky, “British” Tweed, “British” Haggis, they are even claiming Robert the Bruce as an Essex boy. Now we have “British” bagpipes? What is there left to insult? Union Jack Tartan? It’s your choice Scotchland… would you prefer Agent Orange on your thistles or DDT for your midges?

    181. Alba Laddie says:

      It’s Union flag, HYFUD.

    182. admiral says:

      HYUFD says:
      12 November, 2018 at 9:15 am
      Robert Louis London makes a net contribution to the UK Treasury, Scotland is a net recipient from the UK Treasury

      London is a transit point for vast amounts of money. The actual economic effort to create that wealth by and large takes place elsewhere.

      For example, most large plcs are London headquartered. They have their payroll offices there and deduct tax, national insurance and account for VAT and corporation tax from there, even though the work takes places elsewhere – think shops, restaurant and pub chains, energy companies, manufacturing companies, food companies, drinks companies, banks, brass plate operations. All that tax is accounted as “raised in London”. How many oil and gas rigs, power stations, factories, pubs, restaurants, distilleries, breweries, factories, farms, bank branches,are there in the UK and how many are actually in London.

      London gets the credit, but the work is done elsewhere.

    183. Nana says:

      Morning Breeks

      From what I’ve seen on twitter etc, I would say the bagpipe insult is the final straw.

      Last links for now

      Ooh, the tories love their letter writing, again and again and….

      Soon be worth 50p

    184. mike cassidy says:

      Nice one, Nana.

      “..they have been busy constructing a fanciful world of limitless possibility, based on a national mythology featuring Sir Francis Drake, Sir Walter Raleigh, the British Raj, and standing “alone” in 1940. Psychologically, some of them seem to be reliving an imaginary war with our closest neighbors and trading partners.”

    185. Boudicca says:

      On the radio this morning, last month 98% of Scotland’s electricity was generated by wind. And that won’t ever run out.

    186. ronnie anderson says:

      O/T .

      Sorry Folks for not giving a update on Lollysmum last nite .

      Lyn is in some pain given the type of break & fracture , she’s in Ward 108 ERI if anybody is close by , ( visiting times 2-8 pm other than dinner time 5-6pm ) its going to be a long recovery period , when she’s discharged her Daughter will take her to her home to take care of her .

      All the Best Lyn XX .

    187. robertknight says:

      ‘We’re bought and sold for viscous black gold-
      Such a parcel of rogues in a nation!’

    188. Ian Mccubbin says:

      Found out now then what a f#@ker. The bit that gets me is the assumption that there are none of us in Scotland. Never mind the fact we might have a totally different view to him.
      All I can add is the earthwhile Twitter chant.

    189. ALAN GERRISH says:

      So now we have proof from this Torygraph article that Scotland’s oil is key to a Brexit “victory”; the value of oil is real, permanent and valuable enough to be key to the survival of BritNatDom, coz now they have said so.

      Herein lies a golden opportunity for us to go on the offensive and put them on the back foot. No longer should we be responding to claims of “too wee” etc, forget all that, it’s now time for a confrontational approach.

      We should be saying at every opportunity: “of course (Westminster) needs our oil to survive, that’s why they cheat and try to hold on to Scotland illegally – it’s not us saying so, they have told us themselves”.

      The key issue around independence is of course not oil, but self-determination, whilst the main issue for most of us, is not a headline-grabber, nor, more importantly, a vote-converter for many. We need to work on normalising key facts about our strengths by using statements, as appropriate, to create a sub-liminal awareness in the doubter’s mind that we are being bound into a union not because we are better together, but only because the numerically larger partner needs our resources to survive (in the meantime of course, ensuring we suffer disproportionately from a lack of return on these resources).

      Add to that the other increasingly obvious facts that UK governance is incompetent, untruthful and untrustworthy, and we have plenty ammunition to be getting on with the job of creating an unstoppable demand for independence. There is a time for a softly-softly approach, but there is also a time to get tore in, and I feel that time is now.

    190. Dorothy Devine says:

      Lollysmum, what a purler! I hope you are like my Gran who was the worlds fastest healer!

    191. Ian Mccubbin says:

      Oops #dissolvetheunion

    192. Nana says:

      Morning Mike 🙂

      @Ronnie, please pass on my best wishes to Lyn.

    193. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      HYUFD at 12.32
      On independence the waters off Scotland to the east of Fife presently described (by The UK)as English will revert to Scottish. Scotland’s territorial waters are already marked out by international protocol (an accidental effect of Scotland having an independent legal entity).

      HYUFD at 8.25am
      As we all know. And where has all – yes all – the revenue from oil gone? Have a stab at this – London maybe?

      HYUFD at 8.27
      And who was it that sold the Scottish fishermen to the EU? Was it that chap who used to take wee boys onto his yacht? Actually the CFP probably saved the North Sea from the rapacious behaviour of the Scots fishermen and the vast majority of the Scottish people now recognise that. Or as Colin MacKay said to a Scottish Tory on telly. “Fish? Is that all you’ve got?” You’re well out of touch on this subject. It’s well gone.

      HYUFD at 8.27
      Don’t we just know that!

      HYUFD at 9.15
      Quoting the Daily Mail? You can’t be serious. As London collects all of the UK’s revenues and controls the propaganda it would be strange indeed if it decided to show a deficit (Oh. What about that £2 trillion national debt I heard you ask?)

      You were up early today,son. But not early enough. Everything you give is well gone. Obviously you don’t live up here.

    194. Ottomanboi says:

      HYUFD has the timbre of a species of ‘old colonial’. His/her/they/its bullish British patriotism is not quite pukkah even for a D.Mail reader. Bet there’s a union flag hoisted in the garden.

    195. Bill McLean says:

      “Those soldiers fought and died under the Union Jack”- that flag known to most of the world as the “butcher’s apron” is correctly the “union flag”. Now that we have established your omniscience tell us why Scotland should remain in this benighted and corrupt union?

    196. Cubby says:

      You know why I call our resident fanatical Britnat Tory a flat earther. Because if the Daily Mail had a story saying – sensation the earth is flat, not round, says a reliable source this diddy would be on here posting a link to it saying he knew the earth was flat all along.

      He doesn’t know his arse from his elbow. He is to be pitied not debated with. He has a closed mind unless it comes from The Daily Mail or Conservative Central office.

    197. Fred says:

      @ Thepnr, the author of “In the Public Interest!” Gerald James, was the Chairman of Astra, Stephan Kock threatened him at a meeting in a suite at the Berkeley Hotel & told him he would “Have him put down!” he would have him killed! James lifted a chair intending to break it over his head! This threat was from somebody to whom the door of Number 10 was always open. Kock was a favourite of Thatcher & attended her “Slipper Nights!” James was advised by another director to report this confrontation to the police in case anything happened. James was squeezed out of Astra by Kock & the whole enterprise went tits-up.

      Quite a pricey book online? but the library would be the place. Shocking stuff, criminals ran this country!. “Lest We Forget!”

    198. Cubby says:

      Robert Louis @8.26am

      If memory serves me right I think it was said the matter was being investigated. If this is happening whether or not it is legal it is a bloody disgrace. Particularly hypocritical if it is Labour MPs as during the debate Kelly kept banging on about how Derek McKay needs to raise more tax.

    199. Phronesis says:

      The most fitting tribute to all those who died in combat is to wean economies off the industrialised military complex and vote in leaders who understand the implications of climate change, promote sustainable farming and energy policies ,address global poverty and inequality.The really challenging issues of the day are not addressed by tax evasion,dropping bombs on poor communities , polluting the environment and placing whole ecosystems on the brink of destruction .
      Scotland’s oil wealth should have provided a sustainable fund for all the U.K. which could provide funding for all of the above in a transition to sustainable green energy. Its mismanagement is testimony to the incompetence and lack of forward vision from WM and very telling of WM priorities.That particular nexus of power will be re- constituted in Scotland for the common good.

      ‘CO2 has risen by 40% in just the past 200 years, contributing to human alteration of the planet’s energy budget that has so far warmed Earth by about 0.8 °C (1.4 °F). If the rise in CO2 continues unchecked, warming of the same magnitude as the increase out of the ice age can be expected by the end of this century or soon after. This speed of warming is more than ten times that at the end of an ice age, the fastest known natural sustained change on a global scale’

      ‘countries around the world spent $ 1.739 billion on arms in 2017. Although there was a marginal increase of 1.1 percent rise in real terms on 2016, the total global spending in 2017 is the highest since the end of the Cold War

      The five biggest spenders in 2017 were the United States, China, Saudi Arabia, Russia and India, which together accounted for 60 percent of global military spending. The United States alone accounted for more than a third of the world total in 2017 ($695 billion) and it spent more than the next seven highest spenders combined, confirming the fact that the country can retain itself as the most powerful nation – in terms of military – in the world’

      ‘By supplying Saudi Arabia the UK is endorsing its brutal regime and diminishing the importance of human rights and political freedom. There is also a great deal of evidence to suggest that Saudi Arabia is far from a reliable end-user of UK weapons. Saudi Arabia has secretly funded resistance movements around the world, often at the behest of certain elements in the US Administration in return for arms packages, and strong evidence suggests that Saudi Arabia diverted arms to Iraq via Jordan and funded the Iraqi nuclear programme in order to acquire its own nuclear capability, despite signing the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty in 1988’’

    200. Les Wilson says:

      Missed this yesterday as was out of house.
      The audacity of this Yoon creep really boils my blood, my words would never be enough.

      When you look at these figures and even the future figures he quotes, what would Scotland look like, how different would our society be?

      If we miss our chance again for reinstating our old country, we are going to again, be hog tied to the most corrupt Government in the world. Corrupt from every angle.

      We have to go, we will go, we are long past having any more of their crooked ways.

    201. Fred says:

      Scotland’s casualties in the Great War were 26% I believe. England’s were 11%. We don’t need any lessons in sacrifice!

      @ Nana, Dr Philippa Whitford would make a very fine President indeed! 🙂

    202. Corrado Mella says:

      A fluff piece from a fluffer repeating the BritNazi Establishment lie of “Britain”, a mythical creature that does not exist.
      It’s not a State, a Country or a Nation.
      It’s a fraud that’s been running for 300+ years.
      Time to call that out.

    203. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Breeks (9.25) –

      Great post, sums up how many of us are feeling right now.

      The Twitter went mental last night over this bagpipe shit.

      If that eejit was happy enough to do a performance on national television then he clearly isn’t the shy type. He should have the guts to explain to his fellow Scots (if, indeed, he is Scottish?) what the actual fuck he thought he was doing.

    204. ronnie anderson says:

      Nana/Dorothy I passed on everybody’s best wish to Lyn , she’s embarrassed noo she’s the talk of the washhouse , she hiz that many bruises oan her arms wie needle punctures U would think she had went 10 rounds wie Mike Tyson lol .

    205. ronnie anderson says:

      Ian Brotherhood I knocked back a couple of posters last nite on our Yes pages advertising union bagpipe bags , I still havn’t seen the video piece,any links.

    206. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @ronnie anderson –

      Sorry Ronnie, I only saw the stills, one of which was on the WOS Twitter. Another was a photo of the telly broadcast but I haven’t seen any footage yet.

      It’ll surely turn up in due course!


    207. Rob Royston says:

      I see Gordy on all channels just now doing the “English Vow”. Cometh the hour ……………

    208. HYUFD says:

      Dave McEwan Hill now talking about ‘rapacious Scottish fishermen’. What is the point of a Scottish nationalist party if it does not stand up for the Scottish fishing industry?
      London is of course the largest location for financial services workers, IT workers, legal services workers, creative arts workers, hotels and restaurants etc in the UK. Not just HQs for PLCs

    209. And we are going to change all this by posting letters on the Internet ???

    210. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Ronnie –

      Another still is here:

    211. frogesque says:

      Re UK bagpipe picture.

      Are we quite sure this isn’t a Photoshop or CGI jobby?

      Something about it doesn’t look right quite apart from the initial wtf!

    212. Dan Huil says:

      Arrogant and ignorant British nationalists are doing their best to destroy their so-called precious united kingdom , but they need our help. Scotland must do everything and anything to speed up the so-called united kingdom’s destruction; refusing to play by Westminster’s britnat rules will be most helpful.

    213. Sharny Dubs says:

      700 years and nothing has changed.


    214. Derek Aitken says:

      By my calculations 17m barrels a day @$70 per barrel = just over $1 billion A DAY. Now I know that’s not all profit but even half that split between the 5 million in Scotland = $100 pp per day would fend off hunger etc.

      Now if that doesn’t convince the most hardened NO voter then I believe Scotland has a bigger mental health problem than anyone could have imagined.

    215. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Ronnie.

      This looks like what I saw on BBC News channel yesterday. (Definitely wasn’t Photoshopped!)

    216. Daisy Walker says:

      o/t Brexit

      Let me see if I’ve got this right.

      Any deal which differentiates NI – breaks the Terms of the Treaty of Union. And then they are in danger of losing the cash coo that is Scotland by accident. Oops.

      Any form of membership of the CU and or SM require continued judicial rule by the ECJ – which in turn means the 1% (including her Maj and co) will not be able to keep their ill gotten gains from Asset Stripping entire continents over 100’s of years a secret anymore, from the Tax Haven laws being implemented.

      The game of brokemanship – ‘if you don’t let us keep our tax havens, we will trash our economy, and cost the EU mega bucks too’ – appears to have fazed the EU not a bit. Their bluff is called.

      And the closer it gets, the more the EU’s costs are offset by the gain of businesses fleeing the UK and resettling in other EU countries.

      The People’s Vote looks unlikely to happen (too little, too late) to arrange same, never mind win it. Certainly not without Labours whole hearted support (I think I’m old enough to remember when Labour had a heart, but it was possibly an illusion).

      The appeal to the EU supreme court about unilaterally withdrawing Article 50 is being appealed by Westminster – at the very least a delaying tactic. As this is the only realistic method of halting Brexit.

      Have I got this right.

      Nothing about Brexit makes any sense until you look at it from the point of view of the ruling elite, the 1%, who have been bred over generations to pull the strings of power from behind the scenes. They don’t see themselves as betraying their country, they see themselves, their families and their personal fortunes – as being the country.

      Disgusting Psycho’s one and all.

      I was at the ceremonies yesterday, could not help but think amongst all the pious heartfelt words, they’d do it all again in a heartbeat, but not fall for their own bullshit, and make sure their own kith and kin are nowhere near the front line.

      Where Indy Scot 2 stands in all this, I don’t know, but at the moment, I can’t see what else Nicola and co can do, their current conduct is exemplary, imho. Brexit changes everything.

      Kind regards to all.

    217. call me dave says:

      Jings! Déjà vu all over again.

      The return of the once big cheese Gordonzola on BBC Brexit. 🙂

      Also maybe David Elasticband will return and save us too.

      He was getting touted on radio shortbread this morning since his brother Ed failed the labour party last time.

    218. galamcennalath says:

      As seen on Twitter, quote from Gwynfor Evans (which I hadn’t seen before) …

      “Britishness is a political synonym for Englishness which extends English culture over the Scots, the Welsh, and the Irish.”

      Indeed. The project has always been a Greater England on these Isles.

      The sad thing is, so many Scots, Irish, and Welsh ‘aspire’ to be ‘British’. I see it as just wannabe English.

      Perhaps the project was at it’s most advanced, thanks to the big state built post WW2 by Labour. Institutions, employers, businesses, services, were all state controlled. The state played a big part in most people’s lives, and that state was culturally in the image of England but stretched its tentacles across these Isles.

      The state has rolled back. ‘Britishness’ and the Greater England project faltered. The BBC was one of the last bastions, However, now it seems private business has stepped in, putting butcher’s aprons on everything, or telling us ‘our regions’ likes whatever flavour it was crisps, or using private media to manipulate the political agenda.

      Too many of us have dumped our blinkers. The game’s a bogie.

    219. Fred says:

      Bags are from an Alastair McDonald in Whitehaven! Wonder if he does knickers?

    220. galamcennalath says:

      Saw an interesting report saying that for the first time ever, Irish exporters have shipped more cheese to non-UK destinations than to the UK.

      So, if the Tories get their way, quality Irish cheese goes elsewhere and the UK imports cheap US cheese which currently wouldn’t pass EU food standards.

      This does not bode well for Scotland’s own quality farming industry.

    221. Golfnut says:

      Is this the appeal the Scottish Court said they couldn’t make.

    222. frogesque says:

      @ Brian Doonthetoon: 1.29

      I did wonder if it had been pshopped, ‘fraid not.

      Looks like some has captured it from BBC and posted on Twitter.

    223. hackalumpoff says:

      @ Golfnut at 1:56 pm
      Is this the appeal the Scottish Court said they couldn’t make.

      Yes see yhis thread;

    224. Thepnr says:


      Flipping eck, that’s some video. How much lower can they stoop? This plays right into our hands, truly bizarre!

    225. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Nana @ 08:29,

      Lord Kerr was slightly more forthcoming on the R4 lunchtime news today. If I summarise correctly, he was certain the EU27 would agree a modest Art.50 extension to permit a UKGE or a somewhat longer extension to permit an EURef2 (aka. “Peoples’ Vote”) which proposed specific alternative outcomes, but not one which was imprecise. (An important differentiation with which we would all happily concur, I think.)

      Whether the English political ecosystem can arrive at anything similarly coherent at any time soon remains extremely uncertain, though.

      I used to say this UK humiliation was going to be as bad as Suez. I now think it will be worse.

      And the only creditable actor on the UK end in this whole farrago has been, and remains, the Scottish Government.

    226. Breeks says:

      That piper with the butchers apron on his pipes was in Lichfield Cathedral. Look at the backdrop.–music/remembrance-day-2018

    227. K1 says:

      Totally delighted for Shahmir Sanni, completely vindicated after a co ordinated smear campaign by the Taxpayers Alliance against him, they’ve admitted everything, unprecedented, which goes to them not wanting the case to go to court as they are part of a cabal at the centre of the Conservative establishment and would have had to reveal their ‘donors’ as part of said case.

      More saliently, the BBC gave a full platform to all those who vilified him after he whistle blew…they refer to these bastards as ‘think tanks’ when we all know, on here, that they are nothing less than private lobbying firms whose members are part of the Tory party and other major Tory party donors.

      ‘Adam Smith Institute, the Centre for Policy Studies, the Institute of Economic Affairs and Leave Means Leave’ are all part of the same network of what they say are 9 groups, so far, that are known to be lobbyists masquerading as ‘think tanks’, in essence a cabal of right wing greedy bastards who are shaping policy and polity in the UK. The BBC has a lot to answer for in legitimising these groups, often with the qualifiers of ‘respected’ before speaking to one of theirs spokespeople on air.

      I hope Shahmir takes some comfort from knowing that he has further exposed these groups for what they are and the BBC and other msm outlets have now nowhere to hide.

      He still has a case open against Downing Street who where an active part of the smear campaign, this goes to the very top of the Tory government. They knew exactly what they were doing in trying to take him down. TM knew about this and sanctioned it…no doubt about that.

    228. Thepnr says:

      They can stoop a lot lower and become even more bizarre, this 2 minute video (advert)from the Ministry of Truth shows the increasing levels of desperation from the government.

      The propaganda is failing, particularly in Scotland. Cheers Rev.

    229. Rock says:

      Cubby says:
      11 November, 2018 at 4:42 pm


      Indyref 14 – bloody hell that sounds like a Rockshit forecast for the future. Still at it after 14 referendums – surely not.”

      Cubby says:
      11 November, 2018 at 6:30 pm

      “Hey Rockshit I knew it was 2014 -diddy – it was a joke just like you and your joke forecasts – apprentice Nostradamus.”

      You certainly didn’t.

    230. galamcennalath says:

      Failed Prime Minister, failed Chancellor, failed MP, failed Scot, failed to deliver promises … gets wall to wall coverage. Why would anyone care what Federal Broon has to say on any matter?

      He must be disliked and mistrusted by a wide spectrum of voters.

      He clearly hasn’t the self awareness to shut up and hide his face.

      And there he is, sermonising, again. Yawn!

    231. Rock says:

      Davie Oga says:
      11 November, 2018 at 6:38 pm


      Thursday the 6th of June 2019. No section 30 and it will be a referendum to affirm a declaration not to open a negotiation.”

      First of all no Scottish politician has the guts to hold a referendum without a section 30, certainly not Establishment lawyer Nicola, let alone declare independence first.

      Second, with the UK out of the EU, Westminster would crack down in such a way that the events in Catalonia would look like an enjoyable picnic in comparison.

    232. We’re no sooner done with the butcher’s apron poppyfest than we are plunged into Children in Need, that insult to Social Democracy, where well of Celebrities and TV Pains in The Arse will Gush and Ooh all week urging us to give up our hard earned to fill begging bowls for ‘Children in Need’.
      The sixth largest economy in the world?

      Mummie Dearest Davidson’s Party has driven 500,000 Scots citizens, including 260,000 Scots children into state engineered poverty, the Lumpen Proletariat who rely on food banks and second hand clothes shops just to survive.

      Will Lenny Henry make a special appeal for The Third Child which the Blue Tories have chucked off the Welfare safety net? Will he champion the Children of Rape who can’t prove the violation to Esther McVey’s satisfaction?
      England stinks to high heaven.
      The Blue Red and Yellow Tory way is to drive the population into serfdom, low wages, reduce the Have Nots to a nation of beggars relying on the Graham Nortons of this world to beg for alms on their behalf.
      Charity England.
      If you are not in the top 10%, the English Establishment expect you to beg, borrow from legalised Loan Sharks, or starve, freeze, and huddle until premature death relieves your state engineered misery.
      The Merrie England of Oliver Twist.
      Ah, the good old days, when the scruff knew their place.
      Scotland must get out of this corrupt little UK state. Now.

    233. Rock says:

      Dr Jim says:
      11 November, 2018 at 6:51 pm

      “Rock is just so ashamed of himself for voting NO he’s turned into a Gollum character and is lost to the world as a human and to be pitied or destroyed, take your pick”

      Rock (17th June 2014 – “More help for Scottish journalists”):

      “Heavens forbid, but if the vote is No, Westminster will enforce a scorched earth policy on Scotland. The food banks now will look like relatively good times in a few years’ time.”

      I believe that democratically there will be a Yes vote but the British Establisment will rig the result.”

      What do you think Jimmy, was the result rigged?

    234. Terence callachan says:

      To HYUFD
      To Mogadee

      Who should be allowed to vote on scottish independence ?
      It’s an easy
      question to answer.
      Use the same rules that Westminster applies when people want a passport.
      It’s that simple
      So if you are English you have to show that you have been living in Scotland for at least five years
      Or have a parent who is scottish
      Or you have to have been born in Scotland yourself
      Once you pass those you will be required to sit the “life in Scotland test”
      you know , just like the life in the U.K. test that overseas people have t take when applying for British citizenship
      We will apply the life in Scotland test to English people meeting the above conditions
      So really it will be a Scottish citizenship application
      We don’t need to apply it to any other nationalities apart from English people because those people from countries other than England have already done a life in the U.K. test
      English people have not so they will be required to meet the conditions that would apply to them if they were applying for a scottish passport
      We will no doubt set
      our own new passport and scottish citizenship rules once independent but in the meantime will apply those British rules set by England Westminster to English people living in Scotland

    235. Breeks says:

      Thepnr says:
      12 November, 2018 at 2:46 pm
      They can stoop a lot lower and become even more bizarre, this 2 minute video (advert)from the Ministry of Truth shows the increasing levels of desperation from the government.

      Ha ha ha!

      “Sometimes fake news is easy to spot….”

      Aye, just look for the BBC logo in the corner.

    236. Rock says:

      Ghillie says:
      12 November, 2018 at 3:22 am

      “Scotland has been used and abused for centuries.

      This will end and soon.”

      Well 2640 AD is not that far away really.

      Or perhaps you can suggest a slightly earlier date?

    237. Boudicca says:

      Remember that Trolls turn into Rocks when the sunlight hits them

    238. Robert Peffers says:

      @HYUFD says: 11 November, 2018 at 10:05 pm:

      ” … So what are your franchise criteria for any indyref 2 then?

      Awa and stop attempting to stir up trouble. You are the typical British/English Nationalist.

      There is only one franchise under Scots law, HYUFD.

      Under independent Scottish Law there is only one legal franchise. It stems from 1320 and the Declaration of Arbroath.

      The people of Scotland will be those enfranchised to vote under Scots law and that has been well documented by the SNP for many years.

      Anyone 0f any colour, creed of country of origin who is mainly resident in Scotland and who pays their tax in Scotland.

      I doesn’t matter where you come from it is where we are all going together.

      Now awa ye gan an stop attempting to stir up English/British style racism in Scotland or are you like so many other unionists who fondly imagine they are not nasty nationalist but are instead proud patriots.

      I’ve got news for you. Look in your Oxford Dictionary. There to find the two terms are synoomous.

    239. Malcolm says:

      North sea oil can be a bargaining chip. Did you notice that the name Scotland is not used in the article. Looks like the Britnats have already took our oil.

    240. Jock McDonnell says:

      I don’t support the people’s vote & the English should get what they voted for ie Brexit (just as Scotland got what it voted for in 2014) & perhaps change their minds in future, I think it is true to say PV folk want a vote on the specific deal, nothing else. There is no proposal on what the alternatives might be.
      That is probably why NS can offer to support it. The CU and SM remain her redlines.

    241. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      K1 @ 14:46,

      Amen to that.

      They honed their tradecraft in IR1. Along with the dark money merchants.

      (Oh, and I see they let the Monolithic One out early today. Must have earned some good behaviour merits, then.)

    242. Les Wilson says:

      Missed this yesterday as was out of house.
      The audacity of this Yoon creep really boils my blood, my words would never be enough.

      When you look at these figures and even the future figures he quotes, what would Scotland look like, how different would our society be?

      If we miss our chance again for reinstating our old country, we are going to again, be hog tied to the most corrupt Government in the world.

      We have to go, we will go, we are long past having any more of their crooked ways.

    243. Referendum1707 says:

      Petra 11th Nov 4.49pm

      “We can’t let this go on any longer FGS. C’mon Stu let’s get another ‘coloured’ book out, ASAP, to EVERY home in the country (tell us how much it would cost). One page relating to our oil would suffice by highlighting the McCrone Report, Norway’s 1 trillion dollar oil fund and THAT particular article.”

      At the last WoS fundraiser he said that if the fundraiser reached it’s target, which it did and then some, something like 1 million would be printed and distributed. Not wanting to give the enemy too much of a heads up I for one have refrained from mentioning that recently but am now actively looking for, waiting for, some kind of hint that publication is indeed on the cards.

    244. Les Wilson says:

      What that guy wrote would suggest to me that he firmly thinks Scotland will be kept in it’s box, so pressure on him when writing it.

      Another one who does not know Scotland and what is simmering just below the surface. Again, English exeptionalism where they feel they will contain us, yet again.

      That may disproved before long.

    245. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Referendum1707 @ 16:01,

      I think realistically Stu is having to keep his powder dry until a campaign starts in earnest. Which I also am wanting to see happen ASAP.

      But like the SG, we are forced to wait a wee while longer until some kind of shape emerges out of the ongoing English political guddle.

      To quantity-produce a new booklet that is immediately overtaken by a UKGE or “Peoples’ Vote” would be a waste of precious resources.

      The main thing for now is to be fully prepared to act while it still matters to everyone, but such that it won’t be scuppered by diversionary circumstances as in 2017.

    246. Cubby says:

      Dave McEwan Hill@11.51am

      The real question is CAN ENGLAND STAND ON ITS OWN TWO FEET?

      I’ve asked a lot of Britnats over the years why can England not just stand on its own two feet rather than looting other countries resources. This seems to offend the English Britnats. Scot Britnats just stare ahead as if their brain hàs been unplugged such is the shock.

    247. Thepnr says:

      Here’s a turn up for the books.

      The EU’s chief negotiator Michel Barnier has said the key elements of the Brexit withdrawal treaty are ready to present to Theresa May’s Cabinet tomorrow, reports say.

      The Financial Times reports that Mr Barnier told ministers from the EU’s remaining 27 member states that “the parameters of a possible agreement are very largely defined” but still need political endorsement.

      Good! Then tomorrow afternoon when it all crumbles to dust and more Minsters walk out we can start getting ready for Indyref2. Truth though is, I don’t see it happening. Just more bullshit from the MSM.

    248. Cubby says:

      Rockshit is back to the apprentice Nostradamus stuff. You are a joke Rockshit and I forecast you will still be a joke on 20/10/2020 at approx 2.17 pm.

    249. galamcennalath says:

      Never seen this scenario of how things might develop ….

      “Parliament votes down the deal, and markets react dramatically. There’s an outside chance traders will end up forcing a deal. Rupert Harrison, macro strategist at BlackRock and one-time adviser to former Chancellor of the Exchequer George Osborne, predicts Parliament will have another go, and fall in line the second time under the weight of a crashing pound.”

      WTF. MPs bow to market pressure!? “Traders will force a deal”?

      That would be a dreadful undermining of democracy!

    250. Another Union Dividend says:

      Union Jackery will only increase with Brexit.

      So can anyone from the Scottish Government tell me why the Scottish Agricultural Science Agency at Roddinglaw Road Gogarburn Edinburgh has recently installed a very large Union Flag at the main entrance.

      The last I kooked SASA was run by the Scottish Government.

    251. Referendum1707 says:

      Robert J. Sutherland 4.24

      I get what you’re saying about timing etc and yes of course it’s absolutely critical but to me there’s too much of this “and we haven’t even started campaigning yet…”

      That kind of potentially fatal complacency could lead to the downfall of Scotland once and for all. What if the WM regime intentionally or even unintentionally creates some kind of situation whereby SG is forced to call a referendum, election or whatever at 2 weeks notice? Where’s the “campaign” going to be then? Huge gamble for WM of course but if they won we’re finished for good. Easy to say oh it won’t happen like that because well reasons etc but who’s actually willing to predict how things could pan out? In this environment anything could happen.

      For anyone interested in actually doing something about it have a look at these cards.

      Any problems with procedure contact Colin Dunn via contact button.

    252. Robert Peffers says:

      @Thepnr says: 12 November, 2018 at 12:11 am:

      ” … Those in charge used to control everyone not in charge by fear. You know when you could be hung for stealing a sheep or deported to Australia for stealing a loaf of bread.”

      Oh! They didn’t even need to catch you, or accuse you, of stealing anything, Thepnr.

      They used the Vagrancy Acts to clear the lowlands and southern uplands of Scotland. The charge was, “Not having any visible means of support”.

      The point was that the mine, mill, foundry and agricultural employers, (including the landed gentries estates), had their company towns and the estates and farms their tied cottages.

      Each year they had a feeing on market, (feein oan merkat). The estate managers, and farm grieves loaded the farm worker onto carts along with their goods and chattels in their Plowman’s Chests, (Pluckie’s Kists), and took then to be fee;d oan. The armed forces had a similar thing with, “The King’s Shilling”, and the Press Gangs.

      So when the landowners discovered that sheep were the most profitable, “crop”, the workers were simply not fee’d oan and were destitute and homeless.

      The mines, mills and manufactures who owned the company towns didn’t pay redundancy they just didn’t employ workers who lived in tied houses and old and wounded service people got no war pensions and were simple left without a barracks.

      Then along came the village plod and arrested the, “Offenders”, as, “having no visible means of support”, and they were hauled before the Bench.

      If they were lucky they got the Poor House or a little worse, The Work House but the worst was transportation to the Colonies to be, “apprenticed”, to a landowner or business. Many were worked to death and females an boys sold into the sex trade.

      Many never survived their, “Apprenticeship”, but those that did established the British Empire colonies.

    253. yesindyref2 says:

      @Robert Peffers @3.44
      Well said.

      There’s the usual stirrers try to take advantage and pretend “we” will ban English voters living in Scotland, well, “WE” will do nothing of the kind.

    254. Thepnr says:


      I posted much the same thing the other day in that if they get a deal to put before parliament before Xmas then they will vote it down.

      Two weeks holiday and a time for reflection so if the first vote fails there will be a second vote if the government hasn’t crashed and burned in the meantime.

      Unlike those at hedge fund Blackrock I believe the second vote will fail too and we all get back on the merry-go-round and start over again in a never ending Brexit groundhog day.

      Maybe then Nicola Sutgeon will be tempted to make a move, guess we’ll all just have to wait and see as anything could happen, so probably will.

    255. Petra says:

      @ Robert J. Sutherland says at 2:14 pm …..”to permit a UKGE or a somewhat longer extension to permit an EURef2 (aka. “Peoples’ Vote”) which proposed specific alternative outcomes, but not one which was imprecise.”

      As far as I can make out RJS the Peoples Vote relates to voting on the final Brexit deal. It’s not another EU referendum. Check out the link. Indyref2 points out that the BBC has been confusing people, surprise, surprise.


      @ Referendum1707 at 4:01 pm … Petra 11th Nov 4.49pm …. ”At the last WoS fundraiser he said that if the fundraiser reached it’s target, which it did and then some, something like 1 million would be printed and distributed. Not wanting to give the enemy too much of a heads up I for one have refrained from mentioning that recently but am now actively looking for, waiting for, some kind of hint that publication is indeed on the cards.”

      I reckon that the enemy knows exactly what’s going on Referendum1707. There’s probably some of them posting on here on a daily basis. And then there’s GCHQ. There’s just over 2 million households in Scotland. I reckon we should be fundraising even more money to get a book into EVERY home, even if it means posting some of them to houses in remoter areas. Stu, like Nicola, is probably waiting until the situation becomes clearer (hopefully) and as we know things change on a daily basis, such as oil prices previously. Like you I’m actively looking for, can’t wait, to get the TRUTH out there and I hope that it includes this article.

    256. yesindyref2 says:

      Jings, this is a quiet time, as we all wait to see what variety of madness will be perpetrated on Scotland and the rest of the UK. Will it just be severely damaging madness, or total catastrophe? One thing’s for sure, Brexit is in the endgame.

    257. Thepnr says:


      Bankers J P Morgan and Goldman Sachs also believe in the suggestion made by Blackrock that there will be a second vote and that May will win.

      Goldman Sachs even go so far as to say that they believe the chances of a deal being approved are 70%.

      Look at the mess these guys made in 2008 so who would believe them now? Phuctavano mibbee?

    258. Robert Peffers says:

      HYUFD says: 12 November, 2018 at 12:32 am:

      ” … What does that say about the Edinburgh and Aberdeen financial services sector then?

      What it says to me is there is good reasons why the Edinburgh financial sector is mainly based upon pensions, insurance and manufacturing and Aberdeen’s is based upon the Oil, Gas & Fishing industries together with renewables and the service industries that serve them.

      All real industries with real cash being earned for real goods going out. Plus, of course, with Scotland’s smaller population, the per capita earnings are far greater.

    259. Thepnr says:

      Link to the J P Morgan and Goldman Sachs bollocks.

    260. Socrates MacSporran says:

      Terence callachan @ 3.32pm

      I like your idea, a Scottishness test for English immigrants should not be too-difficult to arrange.

      Oral exam, question 1: How do you pronounce the name of the town spelled M-i-l-n-g-a-v-i-e?
      Q2 – pronounce the name of the town spelled K-i-l-m-a-l-c-o-l-m?
      Q3 – pronounce the name of the village spelled E-c-c-l-e-f-e-c-h-a-n?
      Q4 – How do you pronounce the name of this iconic Scottish stretch of water: Loch Lomond?

      Those four questions should separate the wheat from the chaff, throw in a few questions about Scottish monarchs, then hold a quick Scottish Country Dancing session. Those would-be Scots who survive a Strip the Willow, followed by a Dashing White Sergeant – are in.

      Tie-break question – what is the difference in significance between the question: “What school did you go to?” if asked in Glasgow or Edinburgh.

    261. Bob Mack says:

      Important news.

      I’ve just heard the Government are going above the Scottish Upper Court and are appealing to the Supreme Court in London to overuse the decision of the Scottish judges. This shows how important this case is.

      Secondly this group led by Jolyn Maugham QC and Joanna Cherry MP Qc needs funds to continue.

      Joleyn thinks the Supreme Court may not hear the application by the government, but you never know. It will have to decide if Scots law is secondary to the Supreme Court.

      The government are trying to stall perhaps?

    262. Dr Jim says:

      Gutless Troll cowards, oh and btw HYFUD your British Nationalist friends round the corner are now aware of you and they like you less than we do, it’s what you get for being a gutless coward online with varying dating profiles
      I believe one of them’s called Tyrone and he’s very keen on your picture

    263. frogesque says:

      Anyone wanting to start YES campaigning can do it now and virtually for free.

      Pick your local motorway bridge/busy roundabout/bigboy supermarket/ wherever and get get out there with your flags.

      No one, absolutely no one can stop you peacefully holding a flag as long as you are not on private property. Be firm, be courteous and smile. You will get the usual detractors but a tremendous amount of support also.

      Normalise YES so that when the real campaign starts in earnest we are street smart and can hit the ground running. You don’t get to finish a marathon without a bit of graft and training.

      So it’s winter and the weather’s gets inclement? Folk see that and know you mean business. Christmas shopping can wait for a day. We have a bigger celebration coming!

    264. yesindyref2 says:

      @Socrates Q2 – It’s Kilmacolm – a dry town!

    265. yesindyref2 says:

      or used to be right enough

    266. galamcennalath says:

      Socrates MacSporran says:

      Q4 – How do you pronounce the name of this iconic Scottish stretch of water: Loch Lomond?

      More and more, I’m hearing Scots saying thinks like LocK Lomond. Surprisingly, the perpetrators can often have ‘broad’ accents. They tend to be young(ish).

      I don’t actually think it’s Anglicisation because otherwise they often, as I say, have broad accents. Don’t know where the bad habit is coming from, but I do hear it.

      Paradoxically, an Anglicised proud-but is very likely to say LoCH.

    267. Hamish100 says:

      Are hufud and rock really the rev and he’s winding us up? Does make the site boring though.

    268. galamcennalath says:

      Another Union Dividend says:

      Union Jackery will only increase with Brexit.

      WGD is spot on. Bloody (pun fully intended) butcher’s aprons everywhere.

      I take great exception to it. Makes shopping ever more difficult. Trying to find non BritNat tatties is becoming a challenge! Our nearest supermarket is a Coop, and really bad for this.

      Scottie Brand tatties are apron free.

      Still, if folks weren’t buying the stuff they would soon get the apron off it. People must just ignore it. They shouldn’t. It matters.

      Funny thing though, the Scottie Brand tatties seem to always sell out first 🙂

    269. manandboy says:

      What is at stake in Brexit is the survival not only of the Tory Party but of the Ruling Class, the British Establishment.

      The head of one of Germany’s largest industrial firms in the UK, ThyssenKrupp, has called the Brexit plan a “complete shambles”.
      Terry Sargeant says the government has failed business. “The Tory party aren’t making decisions for business, they are making decisions to prevent an implosion in their own party.”

      Sargeant said he was speaking out because the next generation of “working men and women” were going to be hit hardest by Brexit, which he said was an act of complete folly.
      “In Germany, people look at this and are aghast at what is happening,” he said.(From the Guardian morning briefing email today.)

    270. Dr Jim says:

      Aldis still has plenty of Saltire branded products or products with no brand

      Morrisons and Tesco the biggest disrespecters of Scotland
      Morrisons don’t even sell fish from Scotland

    271. Cubby says:


      Nope it’s not the Rev. No one could act as boring as Rockshit. Also no one could act as dense as the Britnat Tory fanatic from England.

    272. Petra says:

      @ Nana says at 5:25 pm …. ”Our Nicola, a caring human being.”


      Aw Nana thanks for that. I’d just checked this out as my husband came in and asked him to have a look and then burst out crying (what a welcome home, lol).

      If only, only, only all politicians were like her. More than anything how lucky are we to have her as our leader.

    273. frogesque says:

      I only want to know how folk pronounce YES

      Aye, oui, tak, ja, tha or even too bloody right mate!

      Long as that X goes in the right place of that bit of paper it’s fine by me!

    274. Cubby says:


      Everyone knows the Tories are the “nasty” Party – a bunch of heartless killers with no morals. Some people justified voting for them by saying but they are “competent managers”. That myth has well and truly gone and gone forever.

      Blair will be remembered forever for illegal war in Iraq.

      Cameron and May will be remembered forever for the Brexit disaster.

      Britnats bloody disasters the lot of them.

    275. Ken500 says:

      The millionaire Scottish fisherman criminals (£16Million+) who overfished the seas and threw dead fish back for years (40) ruining their own stock. Then pleading poverty. Ruining their own industry with bad terms and conditions. They employ foreign slave labour to make more money for themselves. Making money out of other people’s misery. Depleting their own stock and blaming everyone else. Supporting the Tories and Tory policies because they could get away it for years.

      The SNP never supported these policies. In fact SNP policies once they got slight access to representation was solving the problems. There were agreements to use bigger nets for higher quotas. Richard Lochhead. Some of the ignorant bastards went and voted Tory. Voted for the very Party that had betrayed them for years. Thick or what. Incomprehensible. EU grants and investment has financed better premises and construction. The nearest biggest market for premium prices and skilled labour.

      Brexit will hit the NE of Scotland the most. Some of these ignorant incompetents are voting for it. Voting to be worse off. Just unbelievable. An act of self harming. Their markets and business will collapse. The Oil & Gas sector will be severely affected. The international agreements are based on EU policies and cooperation.

      The Tories have already badly affected the Oil & Gas sector with high illegal taxes. Affecting production. Now these Tory fishermen want their industry badly affected by high Tory taxes.

      The NE needs Alex Salmond to stand up for the NE. Now non represented by two Tory cretins. Two useless gross, ignorant incompetents. Along with the rest of them.

      The AWPR Alex Salmond championed will help their businesses no end. While some people vote to destroy their own industry.

    276. yesindyref2 says:

      YES, Si, yay, aye, oui, Ja, it’s all sausage to me.

    277. Breeks says:

      Bob Mack says:
      12 November, 2018 at 5:08 pm
      Important news.

      I’ve just heard the Government are going above the Scottish Upper Court and are appealing to the Supreme Court in London to overuse the decision of the Scottish judges. This shows how important this case is…

      The UK Government would like you to think they are going above the Scottish Court, but in truth, it is more accurate to say they are trying to get around the Scottish Court, because they know damn well they haven’t got the pips to overrule it.

      The UK Supreme Court really aught to know where it’s jurisdiction ends, and indeed refuse to hear the case, but then again, the UK Supreme Court itself a political construct introduced by Tony Blair and theoretically incompatible with the Treaty of Union. It is an instrument of Westminster and might simply do as it’s told.

      In vital essence, what is forming before our eyes is the definitive Constitutional Test Case where the European Court of Justice will be obliged recognise the binary and absolute nature of EITHER Scotland’s Constitutional Sovereignty and Scots Law, OR the Dogs breakfast of Westminster’s professed Parliamentary Sovereignty together with it’s Supreme Court arbitrary construct.

      I like those odds for Scotland, especially given Westminster’s formal ratification of Scotland’s Claim of Right, and the precedent which exists where the UK Supreme Court has already bowed its head to the supremacy of Scots Law in the past.

      It all boils down to the indivisible and absolute nature of Sovereignty. We have that Sovereignty, and it would appear it’s International Recognition is a work already in progress.

    278. Thepnr says:

      Wrong link posted earlier to the Brexit J P Morgan Goldman Sachs story. This is the correct one.

    279. Meg merrilees says:

      Unbelievable! Last week the Court of Session in Scotland refused to allow the Supreme Court to prevent the Article 50 case proceeding to the ECJ.

      Just reading on the Rev’s twitter feed that the WM gov is now putting pressure on the UK Supreme Court to give the Gov. permission to disregard that refusal from the Scottish Courts and launch another appeal to delay the court case from going to the ECJ on Nov 27th.

      And this democracy refers to itself as the Mother of all Parliaments – they must be absolutely desperate….

    280. Meg merrilees says:

      Nana @5.25

      Aye and Windsor wanted them all rounded up/moved on twice this year because of two vastly expensive Royal Weddings – half of the money from which could have housed and sorted out every homeless person in this country and get rid of it for ever.

      Nicola – the most dangerous woman in Britain today or Nicola the human being.

      Think I know which one is the correct description.

    281. Terence callachan says:

      To Socrates macsporran…
      Actually you would not believe how many people were failed on the life in the U.K. Test for not being able to answer historical questions usually relating to Englands favourite subject one of their kings , check it our online and what makes it worse is that having failed that test they were then refused British citizenship which meant they could not apply for a British passport the cost of sitting the test is £50 a time and the total cost of British citizenship can be £1000 a person.
      Examples of questions …
      Name two forts that were part of Hadrian wall !!
      Who was uk prime minister in 1945 Rutherford beveridge attlee or Churchill !!
      Who became the first Archbishop of Canterbury st Augustine st Patrick st Andrew st Columba
      Who led the invasion of England in 1066 Harold , Alfred the great, duke of Normandy ,king Kenneth MacAlpin

      I think we could have some historical questions for English people to show their Scottishness that would all be about Scottish history we could require English people living in Scotland to pass the life in Scotlands test before being allowed to vote in the Scottish independence referendum.
      Those that pass could take a taxi to the voting station to save costs.
      Having lived in England for many years and having been educated in English schools I can confirm that they were never ever taught any Scottish history whatsoever .
      But there again I would reckon the people applying for British citizenship having to sit the life in the uk test were never taught English history.
      Another requirement of British citizenship is that you have to be able to speak English so you don’t get a passport through that route if you cannot speak English.
      For the Scottish independence referendum test of Scottishness for English people living in Scotland we should require them to be able to speak some scots too.

    282. Capella says:

      @ Socrates MacSporran – trick question.
      Q How do you pronounce the name of the town spelt A-b-e-r-c-h-i-r-d-e-r?

    283. Petra says:

      @ Cubby says at 5:55 pm … ”Blair will be remembered forever for illegal war in Iraq. Cameron and May will be remembered forever for the Brexit disaster. Britnats bloody disasters the lot of them.”

      And don’t forget the major part that Cameron played in the downfall of Libya, Cubby, with all of the misery and mayhem that has entailed. Probably another reason for him skittering off following the EURef result. Good excuse and all of that …. ”The scathing verdict comes just one day after Mr Cameron’s sudden announcement that he will leave Westminster immediately.”

      ‘David Cameron ‘ultimately responsible’ for Libya collapse and the rise of Isis, Commons report concludes.’

    284. Terence callachan says:

      To dr Jim…
      I like Aldi and shop there a lot, I’m running out of supermarkets because so many sell stuff that used to have a saltire and now has the Union Jack and stuff that says made in Scotland but had a Union Jack, I don’t buy anything with a Union Jack .
      I’m sad to say I just received ALDI,s Christmas pamphlet through the post and shockingly it is full to the brim of union jacks.

    285. yesindyref2 says:

      Well, looking ahead, if May stays at no 10, we get Indy Ref 2 and it’s a YES, it’s May at the head of the negotiations and while Cameron was fairly easy to figure, I have no idea about May. She always looks so tired, why is she clinging on at the top? It can’t be money, I don’t think she’s personally power mad though she is from the point of view of wanting to bypass parliament, so what drives her? The sympathy vote perhaps, which she does actually get from the EU-27?

      I presume the SG / SNP are already gaming this, to be ready, but I think they’ve got a difficult job on their hands, unlike Cameron who followed the “rules” of the game.

    286. galamcennalath says:

      @ Capella
      @ Socrates MacSporran

      Scottish silent Zs are the bestest.


      We joke about the English with their silent Rs, but we have our own peculiarities.

    287. Cubby says:


      I have always thought May just doesn’t want to be one of the shortest serving PM’s in English history. A legacy thing. Didn’t want Brown being a longer serving PM than her.

      Sorry but have to disagree about Cameron. He did break the rules with the infamous vow. So my take has always been why be desperate for another S30 Edinburgh agreement when they did not respect the last one. Apart from that history marks them out as treacherous perfidious Albion. Trust them and you will be sorry.

    288. Cubby says:

      Terence Callachan@6.14pm

      Although I do actually know the answer to some of the British test questions. I would be more than happy to answer wrongly to all of them. No desire to be British.

    289. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Bob Mack @ 17:08,
      Meg merrilees @ 18:02,

      Has the BBC bothered to notice yet? =grin=

    290. Edward I took from Scotland not only our sacred Coronation Stone he also took cart/ship loads of ancient artifacts,treaties,documents,books,scrolls and the historical writings that recounted our long history,

      what was left was in later years taken by Oliver Cromwell when he sacked Edinburgh,

      what they were trying to do was erase the nation of Scotland,

      this is what the UK establishment are insideously doing now with their British this and British That on tv and their covering everything in the butchers apron,

      plus any Scottish history they now try to debunk/discredit or rename it British history

      the UK establishment are in no rush they will just slowly remove Scotland from existence,

      we need to just end the Treaty of Union,we have the mandate,just end it,

      if the English wanted it to end they would basically just rip it up and nobody in England would really give a f@ck.

    291. Terence callachan says:

      I have a little smile when I see people talking about what Theresa May is up to and why she has continued to be leader, it’s all very simple, nothing complicated at all , there is a plan and has been a plan from day one, there never was a remain campaign all efforts by the conservatives labour ukip and Lib Dems went in to Brexit and there is one simple reason for that, they will all be personally rewarded for Brexit.Rhe House of Lords and Westminster is a den of thieves they have been busy passing around the recommendations to those in the House of Lords and Westminster showing where and how and with whom to move and hide their money and with what businesses they should invest, it will be of course businesses outside U.K. Because businesses in U.K. Will suffer because of Brexit but when you set foot in either of those two corrupt places you either have to be part of it or leave, yes you can stand up and argue your case and even be critical of the government but back in the bars and restaurants you will be in it together with the rest of them making sure your own personal wealth is safe and secure and highly profitable, nobody there wastes the golden opportunity of such readily available insider information and as even the ordinary people on the streets know information is money especially government information that is going to affect stocks and share prices, get in quick take the reward nobody can prove the fraud and corruption in this closed shop, it’s above the law because it makes the law.
      There will be some in both hoses who say they are remainers but they are toadies they are in on the trick just playing the remainer card because so many of the populus did actually vote remain and their votes will be required in future so play them as fools shout a bit about remaining to keep them sweet but knowingly do so with a conscience that cares not a jot about that betrayal.
      Theresa May said she was a remainer ,well, as I said someone had to , so many people voted remain you couldn’t have the whole house being brexiteers when nearly half the populus were remainers ,she is a brexiteer an out and out brexiteer it’s been easy with the help of Englands newspapers and the BBC for her to keep up this charade of being a remainer doing a stoic job of getting the best deal ,were you taken in by it ? surely not ? i know it’s sad, it’s sick , but that’s politics in England for you.
      Theresa May is and always was a brexiteer she still is but will say she is a remainer right up until she resigns then in five or ten years she will write a book about how she had no choice but to pretend to be a remainer to save the country.
      I hope England sinks in its Westminster cesspit.

    292. Capella says:

      @ Galamcennalath – Yes! you can add Finzean to that and its neighbour Strachan (pron. Straaawn)

    293. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Petra @ 17:04,

      Yes, I’m aware of that. But Kerr was keeping all options open, hence my bracketing of the rather unfortunate term. (Too abbreviated a summary, I fear.) It being hard to predict what would actually ensue if there is deadlock in WM.

      Given the clear shift even down south to Remain as the true economic realities have steadily emerged, obvs the EU27 would readily agree a re-vote if “cancel exit” were an option.

    294. Dan Huil says:

      Findochty is a guid ane.

    295. galamcennalath says:

      Guardian editorial …

      ” It is not as if Brussels won’t do a deal. It’s just that for Mrs May it must be so vacuous that it will be meaningless. There is no clarity over what the UK’s connection with the single market will be …. Yet this suits Mrs May, who prefers to stay in office with a fix than go down fighting for a principle. “

      Their pitch is that May/Tory indecisive behaviour is all about staying in office.

      That’s distinctly London Bubble-esque.

      There is another angle and that is preserving their Union at all costs. There are two interconnected issues plaguing May, NI and Scotland.

      Clarity that it is to be ‘Canada’ (which is probably what they want) means a border in the Irish Sea. This fragments the UK. In response Scotland will say, “what about us, we want to stay close to the EU”. May is determined not to set a precedent with NI.

      Also, the Scottish Government has made clear anything less than single market membership is unacceptable. So again, it is in the interests of their Union to give no excuses for IndyRef2.

      Kicking can down the road is as likely to be about preserving the Union as anything, IMO.

      I believe the priorities are in order a) reach the Brexit date, b) preserve the Union, c) Tory party, and d) sorting out an orderly Brexit.

    296. Stephen McKenzie says:

      yesindyref2 at 5:15 pm

      Yes Kilmacolm used to be dry and so was Cathcart where I worked. The Home Brew Beer Keg in my flat was always in use and I had wine fermenting on an industrial scale..

    297. Thepnr says:


      “I have no idea about May. She always looks so tired”

      I have thought that myself in recent days, in pictures I’ve seen of her in the papers she suddenly looks haggard and worn out.

      Maybe she has just forgotten to remove the mask after Halloween.

    298. Fireproofjim says:

      Capella @6.20
      Aberchirder is known locally by the loons and quines as Fogieloan,
      From auld Scots “mossy lane”

    299. Capella says:

      @ Fireproofjim – you win the neeps n tatties! Foggieloan it is:

    300. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Nana says:
      12 November, 2018 at 5:25 pm

      Our Nicola, a caring human being

      It reminded me of a sunny day in September 2014, when Chris Law (now MP for Dundee West) had his restored fire engine, “The Spirit of Independence”, at City Square in Dundee, along with the YES Bus and the Business for Scotland battle bus.

      Probably Dundee’s most famous actor, Brian Cox, came along for a blether with the peeps.

      A well known homeless guy, John, sat down in front of the Business for Scotland bus. At one point, as seen in the linked pic, Brian Cox, along with Deb Brown and Sandy Clark, from Team YES Bus, had a 20 minute blether with him. John eventually had a lower leg amputated and sadly died a couple of years ago.

      I did capture a three minute video of their chat but I’ve never uploaded it to YouTube as, with hindsight, I regarded it as rather private.

    301. sandy says:


      And the classic, AVOCH.

    302. Chick McGregor says:


      Yogh bro.

    303. HYUFD says:

      Dr Jim Threaten and intimidate as much as you want, it does not work with me

    304. HYUFD says:

      Robert Peffers So English residents of Scotland who pay tax in Scotland will be able to vote in indyref2. Thanks for the confirmation

    305. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      RE: Outlander downloads.

      This is a lot easier. Just close any pop-up windows if they appear. And DON’T download anything, like a Flash update!

      Use “Server VidCloud” at the page. It seems to be reliable.

    306. Tinto Chiel says:

      Capella, let’s not forget the Garioch/Geerie and Kilncadzow/Kilkagie in the pronunciation stakes!

      @Scott Finlayson, 7.05: quite right about the confiscation of our historical records and the motives behind it. When what was left was returned after the Cromwellian interlude, as I think you know, one of the two ships returning the documents to Scotland sank, with incalculable consequences for our historiography.

      I noticed an advert recently for a new “historical” TV series about England’s Hundred Years’ War with France described as a “British” event.

      Arrogance? Ignorance? Cynicism? Take your pick.

      Beam us up, Nicola…

    307. brewsed says:

      Aberchirder (aberherder) pronounced locally as ‘foggie’ or ‘foggieloan’ as that is what it was before a planned village was built. Being up a hill it is neither at the mouth of a non-existent river chirder or near the sea despite having a harbour street.

    308. brewsed says:

      King Edward, between Banff and Turriff (of the Turra coo) pronounced Kineddar as that is what is was before the map makers came along and stamped English pronounciations all over the place.

    309. HYUFD says:

      Robert Peffers Cubby

      Economy of Scotland Services 75%, Production 18%, Construction 6%, Agriculture 1%

      Economy of UK Services 80%, Industry 19%, Agriculture 0.6%

      So really little different. Scotland is not some vastly different industrial powerhouse compared to the rest of the UK, both the Scottish and UK economies are based in the majority on the services sector

    310. Thepnr says:

      @Brian Doonthetoon

      The YES movement has a soul that is what the picture of Nicola Sturgeon talking to a poor homeless person and that of homeless John back in 2014 tell us.

      Eventually enough people will get that message, we can be better.

    311. Thepnr says:

      @schrodingers cat

      That had me laughing. Nice one LOL.

    312. HYUFD says:

      Meg Merrilees The wedding of Prince Harry and Meghan Markle brought an extra £500 million into the UK economy, with £200 million from tourism and £200 million on merchandise and celebration products sold and £100 million for the media industry.

      It cost £32 million so made a big profit overall. Prince Harry also works with a lot of homeless charities too and he and Prince William regularly visit homeless shelters as they did with their mother

    313. galamcennalath says:

      Tinto Chiel says:

      England’s Hundred Years’ War with France described as a “British” event.

      I suppose it was. England and Wales fought on the English side, Scotland fought on the French side.

      Everyone got involved. 🙂

    314. Pete Barton says:

      Hi HYUFD.

      Please tell..what does your acronym stand for?

    315. Golfnut says:

      @ galmcennalath

      Britain is a Roman construct, this Island was called Albion, (white land ) in the old language. Of of 51 battles fought between the British and the Scots, Scots won 29. The Treaty of Edinburgh signalled the abject failure of British arms to defend its borders. See, we can change the narrative just like the eh, British.

    316. Tinto Chiel says:

      Galam: “Everyone got involved. ?”

      Hee hee! But will they mention the Battle of Baugé?

      Ah hae ma doots…

    317. Dan Huil says:

      Remember the Battle of Bauge!

    318. Dan Huil says:

      I see New Zealand has opened its first embassy in Dublin. Edinburgh next.

    319. Cubby says:

      I watched Alex Thomsons report on C4 on fracking and the horrors it has brought to Holland. Very good report. Pity he never mentions that fracking ain’t happening in Scotland. He knows it is England as his report focuses on Lancashire. Not a word of recognition for the Scotgov never mind appreciation for the correct decision to stop fracking.

      Why then does he tweet Holland is stopping fracking just as the UK is starting. It’s England not the UK.

    320. Brutish Values,

      during WWI nearly 2,000,000 horses were shipped over by the Brutish Empire into the war zone of France,

      where they stoically served their human masters,

      after the war ended the Great Brutish Empire decide to leave them all in France to be slaughtered and used to feed the German prisoners of war,

      Brutish Values.

    321. Macart says:

      Stan Lee passes aged 95. R.I.P

      So many stories and what a legacy.

    322. Davie Oga says:


      All advanced capitalist economies are dominated by the service sector. Not much of an excuse to allow another country to govern you.

    323. Clootie says:


      The gullibility of some can be breathtaking!

    324. frogesque says:

      @HYUFD: 8.36

      Not quite correct. As I understand it non taxpayers of which myself am one being almost solely reliant on the paltry UK state pension but having a Scottish NI number with an S suffix will, if fully domiciled in Scotland, get to vote in IRef2. As will 16-18 year olds and anyone else getting by under the income tax limit.

      We play by Scotland’s rules, not Westminster’s.

    325. Thepnr says:


      Thank muchly for the link.

    326. Fred says:

      Hundred Years War, a defeat for England big time but you’d never know that from endless BBC progs!

      Kilconquhar, a good shibboleth but all that would be necessary is to get prospective voters to say the word “Deteriorated!” They also tend to call the ground the floor!!!

      Theresa May wearing a poppy while party to wiping the people of Yemen off the face of the earth!

      Kirkintilloch also a dry toon!

      Edward I was palmed off with a lump of local stone the real thing was carved & came from the Middle east via Ireland.

    327. Nana says:


      It’s excellent but scary.

    328. Gfaetheblock says:

      Re outlander

      It is available on Amazon, without the need to share pirated links.

      If you want to buy something, it’s better to pay for it than steal it.

    329. TheItalianJob says:

      @Nana at 9.31pm

      Thanks for this link and all credit to Clive Ponting.

      Some amazing and frightening revelations about Westminster and the Establishment.

      Scary pronouncement he makes on the possibility of a No Deal Brexit and a state of emergency being declared and the Scottish Parliament being stripped of its powers with Westminster taking over.

    330. Thepnr says:


      Yes a wee bit scary, but know what? I think we have the courage to deal with that and we will do. We’re winning this and we need fear nothing, their ammunition is depleted and now we face empty rhetoric. Brexit has been a step too far for the Imperialists and it will be their downfall.

      Then we grab Independence with both hands, we need have no fear.

    331. Frank Gillougley says:

      Clive Ponting – a blast from the past!

      From one who was on the inside of British Government, his synopsis of where we are now (from 7 minutes on) is chillingly understated.

    332. Famous15 says:

      All this petty Unionjackery to try to end Scotland as a nation is an outrage. Please do not respond by being as petty.I saw a teenager in Morrisons put a Union Jacketed lettuce in the freezer cabinet. That is not an answer.Talk to the management about the damage to Scotland the Brand causing Scottish jobs.

      Unionism is now fragile and out of that fragility flows the poison of British Nationalism. That nationalism is unlike the civic nationalism of the SNP. British Nationalism is like that nationalism favoured by Trump and it is a pity the French President did not make that distinction.

    333. Nana says:

      @TheItalianJob Aye it is frightening but I guess we always knew the establishment will fight dirty.

      @Thepnr, I’ve always been a worrier [hubby will tell you so]

      I’ve often felt Brexit is just the excuse for the establishment to’get total control of Scotland’
      We can not allow it.

    334. Capella says:

      @ Tinto Chiel – aye there’s mony a bonny lassie in the Garioch O!

    335. Terence callachan says:

      To HYFUD…
      The royals cost England a lot ,they don’t bring any tourists ,the tourists are here for other things and just visit the palace etc whilst they are here, the royals are a curiosity, nothing more.
      A bit like yourself really.
      Being a taxpayer will not be a qualifying condition for voting in the Scottish independence referendum.
      There is no Scottish HMRC only an English HMRC yes the English HMRC do say that they ringfence PAYE collected in Scotland but the figures they produce are as believable as the English cry that “the oil is worthless and in any case it’s running out”
      I nderstand your pain , your anger , your world is changing before your eyes and there’s absolutely nothing you can do other than spout forth your spiteful bletherings .
      Scotland was never yours, you got a shot of it for a wee while but couldn’t look after it properly so we are taking it back.
      Taking back control
      Scottish votes for Scottish questions
      By the way is it HY FUD or HUFY D

    336. Thepnr says:


      I think Nicola is well on top of this. We can trust her to do the right thing. I’m absolutely certain of that, rest easy if at all that is possible in these fraught times 🙂

    337. Dr Jim says:


      I’m a gentle old Scotsman who doesn’t engage in that sort of thing, I leave that sort of behaviour to the more rabid and weak minded of your own kind, they’re easy to manipulate like you

    338. yesindyref2 says:

      Acharacle, there’s another. Anyone mention Strathaven?

    339. TheItalianJob says:

      @Thepnr at 10.32pm

      Enjoy reading your posts. I also like you positivity and I look forward to meeting you and shaking your hand in an Independent Scotland. 🙂

    340. Thepnr says:


      Cheers manny 🙂

      I’m sure you’ve not forgotten that we met in 2014 but I get your point and next time we meet I’m certain it will be in an Independent Scotland because it wont be that far away now.

    341. Nana says:


      I do absolutely trust Nicola, I also trust my fellow indy peeps to help get the information out there, so lets all share this latest from Phantom power.

    342. TheItalianJob says:


      I do indeed remember meeting you at the Wings stall at the Arbroath Seafest just before Indy2014.

      Let’s hope the next one is going to take us over the line.

      Some of my family seem to think so as well and they were and are still No voters. Duh!!!!

    343. Thepnr says:


      Your wish is my command and I will do. I just want to say once more Nana how important you are to the Independence cause.

      You may not appreciate it but the information you provide through the links I can read every morning is invaluable. It’s not all one sided so gives a much more balanced view of what is going on in the whole wide world than that we get from our mainstream media alone.

      Sure there may not be that many reading the links like I do everyday but enough are and that readership will only grow.

      I look forward to meeting you at some point and I’m sure we will, maybe you could join me and TheItalianJob when the job is done for a wee toast to our Independence. Hubby is welcome too of course, wouldn’t want him feeling left out 🙂

    344. Macart says:


      If they watch nothing else this year? Get them to watch Journey to YES 22. Might be enlightening for them and help them look at their world and their vote a wee bit differently. 😉

    345. mike cassidy says:

      Not interested myself

      But depending on where you live

      You might be able to borrow Outlander from your local library.

      For example.

      Seasons 1 and 2 are available from the Fife Library system

    346. Nana says:

      Aw Alex, that’s nice of you to say and I’ll be only too happy to meet up especially if TheItalianjob lets me drive the mini 🙂

      I doubt anyone reads ‘all’ the links I post but if some get shared then I’m happy.

    347. TheItalianJob says:


      Yes If anything would make people switch to yes it would indeed be Journey to Yes 22.

    348. HYUFD says:

      Terence Callachan It was the royal wedding the extra tourists came over for, France may still have visitors to Versailles but it gets no extra tourism revenue from royal weddings

    349. TheItalianJob says:


      You will indeed be given the chance to drive the mini. Problem being to fit all us Wingers in.

      Haha 😉

    350. Nana says:


      I just checked and seems the record stands at 27, we will have to beat that 🙂

    351. mike cassidy says:

      Probably a bit late now

      But if you want a ‘laugh’

      The Telegraph page which hides the full article does allow you to read the comments under it.

    352. TheItalianJob says:


      That’s incredible but we can beat it for sure. Just like we will beat the Westminster Establishment this time.

    353. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      RE: Outlander downloads.

      Gfaetheblock at 10:03 pm typed,

      “Re outlander

      It is available on Amazon, without the need to share pirated links.

      If you want to buy something, it’s better to pay for it than steal it.”

      I’m of an age whereby I remember that you bought a TV and paid for a TV licence, then you could watch anything that was capable of appearing onscreen.

      The commercialisation (profitisation?) of our TV viewing dates back to the advent of satellite and so on. IMHO, the production and broadcast should be paid for from advertising revenue.

      How often can you watch a Scottish fitba gemme on free to air channels?

      Why pay to provide profit for companies who can’t generate enough income from advertising? If they had enough viewers, the advertisers would be queuing at their doors.

    354. Macart says:


      Mibbies not all the links, but most. 😀

      One day we’ll have to meet up with some of the gang and have that bit of home baking you mentioned. There may also be a tipple involved. 😉

    355. Nana says:

      @TheItalianJob Sounds good to me 🙂

      @Macart Tipple you say, och well that just makes a meet up all the more urgent.

      But please No popcorn 🙂 unless of course it’s tipple flavoured!

    356. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      HYUFD at 12.54 pm

      Got fed up replying to you but I couldn’t let that one go. “Rapacious Scots Fishermen” is indeed a accurate description of them.

      I suggest you stop talking about matters of which you have no knowledge.

      I live adjacent to what was for centuries a cod spawning loch. Not a cod has been seen in it for a couple of decades. When I was young just a few miles from here we would go out -as did many others – in small boats and catch half a dozen haddock or whiting. They got fished out too by the trawlers. Even the seals left.

      They were doing the same to the North Sea. Then along came Ted the sailor and negotiated away the North Sea on a deal with Spaniards on some EU issue. The EU got control of Scotland’s water. I have little doubt they would NOT have got such control of Scotland’s water had Scotland been independent. But Scotland’s fishermen found their days at sea restricted as sensible plans (in CFP) were set in motion to save the stocks. Some of them then just sold their licenses to Spanish fishing boats. Many others however got caught cheating by over catching and using a hidden shute in their boats to land too much fish. I could go on – but I have no sympathy whatsoever with greedy Scots fishermen – and they are just wakening up now to the fact that their future relies heavily on immediate access to continental markets – which Brexit will deny them.

      If I have complaint it is with the successive Scottish Governments which have been to lenient with them

    357. HYUFD says:

      Dave McEwan Hill So Scottish nationalism it seems stops when it comes to standing up for Scottish fishing communities then

    358. Meg merrilees says:


      Aye, if the weddings are going to make that much money for ‘the economy’ then I can understand why the Council wanted to get rid of any street beggars and homeless people.

      How about thinking in a completely different way about ‘the problem’ – setting up a marquee specifically for the homeless people to have a slap-up meal and somewhere to sleep while the streets were so busy.

      I don’t doubt that the recent Royal Weddings brought a lot of money into the UK economy but my point is that for a small adjustment to some of their extravagant plans, the House of Windsor might have shown some Christian compassion and given the money saved to help the homeless. Again, e.g. a % of every Souvenir of the Royal Wedding sold could have gone to help the homeless.

      It doesn’t take much of a mental shift to consider others less fortunate and plan to include them.

    359. HYUFD says:

      Crisis the homeless charity was one of the official charities chosen by the royal couple for donations to support
      The Windsor Homeless Project also raised funds from selling royal wedding souvenirs

    360. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      I think I’m the only one left now who’s not responding to BritNat propagandist FUD.

      Royal weddings – sheesh!

      He’s not worth the bother.

      If s/he’s the best the BritNats can come up with now, they’re really in deep doo-doo.

    361. Cubby says:

      Robert J Sutherland @1.24

      Nope I am no longer engaging with the fanatical Britnat Tory diddy. I may comment on him but not with him. He really is not worth the bother. Nowhere near smart as he thinks he is. He really does not know his elbow from his arse. A closed mind who thinks a link to the Daily Mail proves his point.

      He is just a disrupter who probably never got enough attention from his parents as a child and likes to see his name in lights on Wings. Pathetic creature.

    362. Meg merrilees says:

      that’s all lovely then isn’t it…. but that’s the Windsor’s getting everyone else to give money to the homeless. Not dipping into their own pockets!

      You can’t defend the indefensible!

    363. mr thms says:

      HYFUD @ 12:01 am

      Funny how Scottish exports always exclude oil and gas.

      “Make Room OPEC: U.K. Is Set to Become Net Crude Oil Exporter”

    364. mr thms says:

      mike cassidy @ 11:31 pm

      Someone made the comment that even at its peak oil has never generated more than 3% of the UK’s GDP.

      If it was not for that 3% the UK would have been in recession for years.

    365. yesindyref2 says:

      The wedding of Prince Harry and Meghan Markle brought an extra £500 million into the UK economy, with £200 million from tourism and £200 million on merchandise and celebration products sold and £100 million for the media industry.

      It cost £32 million so made a big profit overall.

      This is the technique of the FUD, some impressive figures out of the thin air, to show a profit for the UK. The UK, the UK. Which implies ALL of the UK. But is it?

      Firsly guesses, for that’s all they are, range from £80 million to a £ billion in total for the economic benefit. But taking the tourism, and hospitality, that’s local to the wedding, hotels, air bnb, pubs, restaurants, retail in and around London. It’s unlikely tourists for the wedding would be visiting even Edinburgh, let alone Falkirk, Newcastle, Bangor or Bath. So the benefit to anywhere outside London, the South-East and those parts of the East of England close to London benefit, the rest of us very little.

      Merchandise. Well, how many places in Scotland make Toby Jugs of HRH and brood? Damn few I would think, there’s no market for it here, so even for those tat sellers who stock it, it’s an import from England and the potteries or importers. Similarly for plastic or cuddly Beefeaters, it’s a London market, and suppliers will be econmically around there – including importers from China. Similar for fashion, and even the tourism brand is centred around London and the Royals.

      So even taking that £500 million, it’s dubious as much as £5 million comes to Scotland, and considering only 1/2 VAT and income tax comes here in revenue, that’s at most an economic muliplier of 0.2, for just £1 million of economic benefit, even based on those high estimates of £500 nillion.

      So, for Scotland a cost of 1/12th of £32 million, plus the extra cost of sending and accomodating police officers to fill the gaps of protection (you get a lot in the crowds), gives Scotland a cost of £3 million, minus the £1 million benefit for a nett LOSS of £2 million.

      This is how the Unionist FUDs work – they talk UK but in reality the cost is borne by the UK as a whole pro rata for Scotland at 1/12th, the benefit rarely trickles down to Scotland.

    366. HYUFD says:

      Most of the Windsors own funds are not theirs as such but come with the role of Head of State and would apply equally to a President and their family

    367. HYUFD says:

      So even on your extremely conservative estimate of £80 million brought in by the royal wedding given it cost £32 million that still makes a very healthy profit of £42 million. You also ignore Balmoral and Holyroodhouse which have royal connections and royal visitors may have visited over a long weekend after the wedding and the tax revenue too. So comfortably over £5 million would have come to the Scottish economy. Most of the policing costs were taken by the Met and local Home Counties police too, there were few if any Scottish police so yet another whinging Nat falsehood

    368. HYUFD says:

      A very healthy profit of £48 million made in all even on your very conservative estimate

    369. Golfnut says:

      Balmoral is the Queens private estate, Holyrood is the Queens official residence in Scotland, her Royal residence you ignorant numpty

    370. Terence callachan says:

      To HY FUD…
      All that nonsense you come away with about the royal family really is a waste of time ,grow up, nobody believes that rubbish anymore people have awakened from the slumber that once allowed the royal fairy tales to be believed everyone now knows that they don’t bring any money to the country they are spongers living the high life on the backs of the poor taxpayers and to make it worse the taxpayer now has the burden of carrying an extra load that is made of even more spongers working in jobs that support the propaganda trail that tries to keep the fairy tale nonsense alive.
      It’s gone ,just like the British army and its empire, gone, all that’s left is a flag plastered all over tv and supermarket products, a desperate attempt by the despicable bunch of opportunists England now votes into government on a regular basis.
      Sorry HY FUD but you are toast, a dusty old relic from the past that is trying to make a come back with a cover up after the the truth has been posted.

    371. Dorothy Devine says:

      OT I look with disgust and rage at the papers headlining police investigating airport incident regarding Mr Salmond.

      Sky news obviously delighted and several papers.

      I wonder if these so called journalists are working on finding the ‘lost ‘ list of paedophile MPs? And those determinedly covering up on their behalf ? No?

    372. Cubby says:

      On numerous occasions it has been shown that the Britnat media can find Britnats in all areas of Scottish life that hate the SNP and the Scotgov and are willing to lie their heads off on any subject the media want.

      Therefore it is not unreasonable to be very wary of believing any of the crap that they publish. Britnats are liars. A proven fact.

      In conclusion why should we believe any of the Salmond smears from proven liars with an anti SNP Agenda whose hatred knows no limits.

      These journalists are nothing but paid propaganda writers. Anti Scottish propaganda writers taking money from a foreign country. It should be illegal.

    373. HYUFD says:

      Golfnut Tourists visit both

    374. HYUFD says:

      Terence Callachan Wrong 67% back the monarchy including 61% of 18 to 21 year old Brits.

      Countries like Spain, Sweden, Norway, Japan, the Netherlands also have constitutional monarchies

    375. yesindyref2 says:

      You also ignore Balmoral and Holyroodhouse … So comfortably over £5 million would have come to the Scottish economy.

      Jings, you’re even trying to FUD yourself out of that one. Was there something in “It’s unlikely tourists for the wedding would be visiting even Edinburgh,” you didn’t understand?

      As for the two attractions you mentioned, neither of them is in the top 6 attractions in Scotland which receive over 1 million visitors a year, and Balmoral is only open to the public from Monday 1st April until Wednesday 31st July, all tourists get to do the rest of the year is walk over the bridge and stare at an electrically operated double gate, and even when open it’s just the grounds and outside, and the ballroom as the only room to visit.

      If you have to post about Scotland, at least have some knowledge about it rather than a stream of ignorance. I, for instance, being somewhat more clueful than you in all respects (same as other posters here), wouldn’t post about Epping Forest and its contributions to nature conservation, if any, without having a clue. Even having been there long ago, several times.

    376. Footsoldier says:

      Far too much outrage on here about the BBC and the press. They are for the status quo, expect nothing else at any time and move on to more productive chat.

    377. HYUFD says:

      Balmoral gets 70,000 visitors a year. Not bad for somewhere miles away from anywhere in the middle of the Highlands

    378. Cubby says:

      Our resident Britnat does not know his arse from his elbow. Not uncommon amongst English Britnat fanatical Tories. He posts ignorant, arrogant and colonial crap.

      He promised to stop posting and go away back under the Rock he came from ( he calls it a flat) but just like all Britnats he is a liar.

      You are not wanted – do pissof Old Tory boy. Your Brexshit chickens are coming home to roost soon. We will soon see how engurland performs on its own rather than looting other countries resources.

    379. yesindyref2 says:

      Balmoral gets 70,000 visitors a year.

      Which has nothing to do with a Royal Wedding in London, or the tourists it didn’t bring to Balmoral – or Edinburgh.

      and “miles away from anywhere” shows just what a provincial prat you are.

    380. Fred says:

      Yesindy U might think that the problems that beset Epping Forest, fly-tipping & dogging in particular, your friend’s talents might be better employed locally!

    381. yesindyref2 says:

      This, from the article, is why we need to be careful condemning all Tories.

      We are traditional Tories

      What’s needed is they become more vocal, and take back their party which, though not to my political ideals, isn’t to its own traditional ideals either. Thatcher was a better Tory than any of the current high heidyins, and that’s saying something!

    382. yesindyref2 says:

      He’s a useful tool for seeing in more depth into the “mindset” of the extreme activists of the SiU ilk. Though in fairness even they’d know Balmoral is on a bus route from Aberdeen, and not far from Braemar or Ballater in Royal Deeside!

    383. Fred says:

      Balmoral is a massive tax-dodge, made into a trust to avoid paying death duties & inheritance taxes, as a trust never dies, & registered in some treasure island. Formerly made the property of the penniless Prince Albert as any land owned by the monarch would become part of the Crown Estate, it therefore is not owned by the Queen & real land-reform cannot take place without first tackling this Bal-morality problem.

    384. yesindyref2 says:

      Yes indeed, but it does all need to be done very carefully so as not to throw the wheat out with the chaff.

      In the case of Balmoral it does indeed bring in 70,000 visitors a year, who maybe visit the tourist info office on the road first, go over the brig, pay for admission and get taken up through the gates in a little motor train, walk around gift shops, donder round the grounds and then sit in the cafe and maybe buy some souvenirs. A fair amount of local produce giving economic benefit, jobs, even direct income tax revenues. Only open 3 months of the year, but probably gets passers-by all year round. Don;t stop on the road as the sign says where you can see the palace coming up from Braemar.

      And then the tourists go back to their cars or coaches, some off to other parts, but some to Braemar, Ballater, Strahdon or other parts, and spend more money. It is a tourist attraction, and land reform needs to take that into account.

      It’s why, I guess, it hasn’t been done already – it needs a lot of research and careful legislation formulation and perhaps that’s why even Wightman has been slow to produce. There are beneficial estates, arguably Balmoral is one of them.

    385. yesindyref2 says:

      I forgot the ballroom, the biggest room, which is open for visists 🙂

    386. Fred says:

      The castles is a pastiche kid, it might be better let as a hotel or Wotherspoons. By Balmoral I mean the estates, greatly enlarged since Victoria’s time & should be broken up for the benefit of the people!

    387. yesindyref2 says:

      Ah well, there is that 🙂

    388. Fred says:

      Mad King Ludwig made a better job of it when it came to phoney castellation!

    389. Harry Christian says:

      Just a minor correction – The Telegraph does have a Scottish edition. It can be identified by the abbreviation ‘Sc’ at the top of Page 1. The individual pages that differ from the main edition can also be identified by the abbreviation ‘Sc’ at the top of the page. In yesterday’s paper these are pages 7,8,13 and 14, and also page 5 of the sport section.

    390. Cubby says:


      The clue is in the name Conservative and UNIONIST party. If they are for independence then why be in this party. Even their current leader said they are the nasty party.

      I’ll chalk this up as one of your dodgy posts. Next you’ll be saying not to condem all people in the Orange Order as they are not all catholic hating bigots they just like going along for a sing song and banging drums. The Orange Order the military wing of the Tories.

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