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Wings Over Scotland


Posted on January 02, 1968 by

For off-topic chat. Duh.

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    1. Smallaxe says:

      Hi Tinto,
      One World One People One Love

      I’ve been in la-la land for a few days,

      “I’m the Urban Spaceman”

      Trust you to pick the Isosolese wan!

    2. CameronB Brodie says:

      @Paul Sinclair

      Re. consistency, with regard to politics and power.

      Studies in Public Opinion

      CHAPTER 12

      A Consistency Theory of Public Opinion and Political Choice: The Hypothesis of Menu Dependence

      ….The spine of this account is the concept of consistency. As with many social science terms, the concept of consistency is inconsistently used. In the context of research on public opinion and political choice, a trio of meanings can be distinguished. Consistency can be a synonym for constraint. Construed as constraint, consistency indexes the predictability of citizens’ position on one issue given their positions on another.1 Then again, consistency can be a synonym for stability. Construed as stability, consistency indexes the predictability of citizens’ positions on an issue at one point in time given their positions on the same issue at an earlier point in time. Finally, consistency can be a synonym for congruence. Construed as congruence, consistency indexes the predictability of positions citizens take on specific issues given their general political orientations.2

      Empirically, this trio-constraint, stability, congruence-is broadly related. The more tightly constrained citizens’ positions across issues, the more stable their positions are likely to be over time; and the more stable and tightly constrained their positions, the more likely they are to be congruent with underlying basic orientations. The premise of the theory we present is thus that the first two senses of consistency are causally parasitic on the third. Positions tend to be constrained across issues or stable over time to the extent they are congruent with basic political orientations. And just so far as citizens possess basic political orientations together with the competence to call them into play, a consistency theory of public opinion has a causal leg to stand on….

      Attitude Consistency

      Attitude–Behavior Consistency

    3. Smallaxe says:

      “War/No More Trouble” Playing for Change/Song Around The World;

      Selassie I…Rastafari…I’n’I

    4. Thepnr says:

      I’m getting ready to settle in for the World Cup final. I’m a big supporter of Croatia, I worked with a team of Croatians in Turkmenistan more than 20 years ago and have always admired them as a people.

      Visited Zagreb, Split and Zadar a couple of years ago, great places, very friendly people and great value as well as nice weather even in October. Highly recommended.

      I’d love to be there today. C’mon the Croats!

    5. Smallaxe says:

      “Where There Is Love” Playing For Change;

      Hi, Thepnr.

    6. Thepnr says:

      Meant to add Croatia is a beautiful country with a number of fantastic National Parks and probably the best preserved Roman architecture outside of Italy (take note Tinto) 🙂

      Some might say it’s like Scotland with lots of Sun 🙂

    7. Thepnr says:

      Hi Smallaxe

      Liked the Playing for Change version of Imagine this morning, kinda nice and peaceful tune for a Sunday morning. Cheers!

    8. Smallaxe says:

      You’re welcome, Pnr.

      Hi Cameron, this one is for you;

    9. Smallaxe says:


      Now you can learn all the words.
      Croatian national football (soccer) fans anthem;

    10. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. Archibald Maule Ramsay. With regard to consistency of political opinion, antisemitism is closely linked to racism and authoritarianism. Both common character traits of your common-all-garden Tory.

      Nazi indoctrination and anti-Semitic beliefs in Germany


      Attempts at modifying public opinions, attitudes, and beliefs range from advertising and schooling to “brainwashing.” Their effectiveness is highly controversial. We demonstrate that Nazi indoctrination––with its singular focus on fostering racial hatred––was highly effective. Germans who grew up under the Nazi regime are much more anti-Semitic today than those born before or after that period. These findings demonstrate that beliefs can be modified massively through policy intervention. We also show that it was probably Nazi schooling that was most effective, and not radio or cinema propaganda. Where schooling could tap into preexisting prejudices, indoctrination was particularly strong. This suggests that confirmation bias may play an important role in intensifying attitudes toward minorities.

      Keywords: cultural transmission, indoctrination, persistence, anti-Semitism


      Attempts at modifying public opinions, attitudes, and beliefs range from advertising and schooling to “brainwashing.” Their effectiveness is highly controversial. In this paper, we use survey data on anti-Semitic beliefs and attitudes in a representative sample of Germans surveyed in 1996 and 2006 to show that Nazi indoctrination––with its singular focus on fostering racial hatred––was highly effective. Between 1933 and 1945, young Germans were exposed to anti-Semitic ideology in schools, in the (extracurricular) Hitler Youth, and through radio, print, and film. As a result, Germans who grew up under the Nazi regime are much more anti-Semitic than those born before or after that period: the share of committed anti-Semites, who answer a host of questions about attitudes toward Jews in an extreme fashion, is 2–3 times higher than in the population as a whole. Results also hold for average beliefs, and not just the share of extremists; average views of Jews are much more negative among those born in the 1920s and 1930s. Nazi indoctrination was most effective where it could tap into preexisting prejudices; those born in districts that supported anti-Semitic parties before 1914 show the greatest increases in anti-Jewish attitudes. These findings demonstrate the extent to which beliefs can be modified through policy intervention. We also identify parameters amplifying the effectiveness of such measures, such as preexisting prejudices.

      The Evolutionary Psychology of Anti-Semitism
      Hate has deep roots

      The Radical Right and Antisemitism

    11. Thepnr says:


      They’re good at football, singing and dancing not so much 🙂

      Spotted a link when I watched your video, it’s a promotion for Croatia looks good though and importantly it looks real as that was at least my experience of the country. Worth a watch. Anyway kick off beckons živjeli.

    12. CameronB Brodie says:

      Perhaps one day. 😉

      Leroy Sibbles – Express Yourself

    13. Thepnr says:


    14. Cactus says:

      Good day. That’s the Trumps away and Croatia are taking on France at the footy, aye understand it’s currently 1-1.

      Mon the blacks.

    15. Cactus says:

      Thunder n lightening at the final!

    16. Cactus says:

      “Football is ‘better together’ at the co-op”

      Listen out in the second half.

      Ha ha ha ha ha!

      Ah’ve heard commentators/adverts say that statement throughout the World Cup… have you?

      We’re in unofficial indyref2 campaign mode, apparently.

    17. Smallaxe says:


      I’m a writer which is another way of saying I live in my own strange fantasy world.

      Social Distortion:”Story of My Life”

      Start today!

    18. Thepnr says:

      Amazing, that’s the end of that dream for Croatia who have played better than France. Still no bad for a wee country in getting there in the first place.

    19. CameronB Brodie says:

      @Tom Watson
      You appear to be a British nationalist, which I suspect is largely due to an internalisation of English culturalism. That is not an uncommon social pathology in Scotland, as contemporary Scottish media presents reality in terms that are consistent with British nationalist ideology. Contemporary British nationalism is an expansionist form of English nationalism.

      Toward a study of culture suitable for (Frontiers in) cultural psychology

      “The mutual constitution of culture and mind is a topic of central importance across all of areas of psychology.” With this mission statement, Frontiers in Cultural Psychology declares mutual constitution—the process by which mind and culture “live together, require each other, and dynamically, dialectically, and jointly make each other up” (Shweder, 1990; p.1)—as the unifying theme of its otherwise diverse contributions. Implicit in this theme is a non-essentialist understanding of both culture and mind. One direction of this dynamic process refers to the cultural constitution of mind. Mind is not simply an expression of genetic blueprint; instead, it emerges through active participation in and ongoing engagement with sociocultural affordances present in the structure of everyday worlds1. The other direction of this dynamic process refers to the psychological constitution of cultural worlds.

      Cultural worlds and their particular affordances do not exist apart from human activity; instead, they persist (or not) because people in the ongoing flow of everyday life actively select and (re)produce features—and de-select others—that resonate with their particular beliefs and desires. Among other examples, this dynamic conception of culture and mind is evident in work that considers the mutual constitution of moral understandings and sleeping practices (Shweder et al., 1995); motivational orientations and constructions of success and failure situations (Kitayama et al., 1997); affective orientations and children’s books (Tsai et al., 2007); personal identity and societal master narratives (Hammack, 2011); or national identity and constructions of history (Carretero, 2011).

      Despite this non-essentialist vision, much of the work that carries the label of cultural psychology continues to reflect and reproduce problematic reifications of culture and self (see Hermans and Kempen, 1998; Adams and Markus, 2004; Gjerde, 2004; Hammack, 2011). One could identify many examples to illustrate this point. The particular case that provoked the present commentary is an article by Mojaverian et al. (2013)….

      Indoctrination, Communicative Teaching and Recognition – Studies in Critical Theory and Democracy in Education

      The problem of indoctrination,with a focus on moral education

    20. Smallaxe says:

      I know nothing about football, I don’t even own a football bat but did I not hear a lot of people saying that It’s coming home?

      We are the Champions;

      It’s staying in the EU.

    21. Cactus says:

      Congratulations to the people of France, for your country winning the World Cup Football 2018!

      Les Ripoux Referee:

      Party on France. 🙂

    22. CameronB Brodie says:

      That’s what Scotland voted for and I hope Westminster doesn’t consider me a second class human. 😉

      Foo Fighters – All My Life

    23. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Thepnr 3.26: am fully aware, mom vieux. Croatia is a lovely country with a beautiful coastline and pristine waters. Was there last year. Its greatest resource is its people, with a fierce independence and self-belief we can only marvel at.

      Ironically, while visiting my Aged Neighbour, I heard our weaselly Vichy Vision asking how a nation of a mere 4.3 million could get to a cup final, and implicitly putting the boot into our country again.

      Oh, the irony: the answer is independence and an independent mind, quizmasters.

      Even an essentially partitioned country like Bosnia manages to exist with three currencies and three separate governments. And Montenegro is mainly mountainous with limited access to the sea.

      For a Scot (as I’m sure you will have felt), foreign travel is painful: all these countries with much, much less than Scotland yet we, arguably the earliest kingdom in Europe, are dragged down by the quicksand of a Union which was founded on bribes and menaces and a massive democratic deficit from the start.

      Ooh, I could crush a Blairgowrie raspberry, soon to be known as a British Blairgowrie raspberry.

      “Weasels, rip my flesh,” he Zappa’ed.

    24. Smallaxe says:


      A wee bit of the French National Anthem;

      And four other guys.

    25. Fred says:

      The best team lost!

    26. Smallaxe says:


      There is only one class of human, the others are dancer (puppets);

    27. Cactus says:

      Indeed Smallaxe, may aye contribute one further…

      Oh SO long, Harry Kane:

      And laugh about it all again.

      Ye can shove yer gboot.

      He he he. 😉

    28. Thepnr says:

      @Tinto Chiel

      I think that’s the main difference between Scottish and Croatian people, their 100% self belief in Croatia’s ability to be a nation is evident everywhere in that small country.

      We’re only half way there due to all the baggage too many have collected due to 300 years of English subjugation.

      The cringe doesn’t exist in Croatia, just enormous pride in their country. It even shows in their football as they never give in.

    29. Smallaxe says:


      How did you get up there?^


      I know which generation I’d like to be.

    30. CameronB Brodie says:

      I think the subjugation eased off at the start of the 20th century, before morphing into a more socially acceptable, outwardly benign, form of ethnic oppression. Where’s ma tomahawk? 🙂

    31. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Thepnr and Smallaxe: you have summed it all nicely, Sages of Wings/Urim and Thummin/Fran and Anna de nos jours und so weiter.

      Why the feck can’t Scots see they’ve been humped for three hundred and eleven years while their pockets get picked?

      I will post a Sorley MacLean poem some time to ease my angst.

      I’m too sensitive for this world…..

    32. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. ethnic oppression. Culture is an expression of ethnicity. Where is the political recognition of Scotland’s expressed cultural difference to England, especially re. Brexit? Nowhere that I see.

      Causal beliefs about depression in different cultural groups—what do cognitive psychological theories of causal learning and reasoning predict?


      Cognitive psychological research focuses on causal learning and reasoning while cognitive anthropological and social science research tend to focus on systems of beliefs. Our aim was to explore how these two types of research can inform each other. Cognitive psychological theories (causal model theory and causal Bayes nets) were used to derive predictions for systems of causal beliefs. These predictions were then applied to lay theories of depression as a specific test case. A systematic literature review on causal beliefs about depression was conducted, including original, quantitative research. Thirty-six studies investigating 13 non-Western and 32 Western cultural groups were analyzed by classifying assumed causes and preferred forms of treatment into common categories. Relations between beliefs and treatment preferences were assessed.

      Substantial agreement between cultural groups was found with respect to the impact of observable causes. Stress was generally rated as most important. Less agreement resulted for hidden, especially supernatural causes. Causal beliefs were clearly related to treatment preferences in Western groups, while evidence was mostly lacking for non-Western groups. Overall predictions were supported, but there were considerable methodological limitations. Pointers to future research, which may combine studies on causal beliefs with experimental paradigms on causal reasoning, are given.

      Keywords: causal learning and reasoning, causal beliefs, causal model theory, lay theories of depression, cross-cultural differences

      Cultural Psychology: Studying More Than the ‘Exotic Other’

      Representation and emotion causation: A cultural psychology approach

    33. Tinto Chiel says:

      Indeed, Smallaxe, indeed.

      I’m too pure for this world, but there’s always Gowkthrapple.

    34. Smallaxe says:

      Gowkthrapple, indeed Tinto;

      Did ye luv thon?

    35. Tinto Chiel says:

      It wasn’t Sorley, it was Derick:


      “Culloden, the Disruption,
      and the breaking up of the tack-farms –
      two thirds of our power is violence;
      it is cunning we need.
      When the tempered steel near the edge of the scythe-blade is worn
      throw away the whetstone;
      you have nothing left but soft iron
      unless your intellect has a steel edge that will cut clean.

      And throw away soft words,
      for soon you will have no words left;
      the Tuatha Dè Danann* are underground,
      the Land of the Ever-young is in France,
      and when you reach the Promised Land,
      unless you are on your toes,
      a bland Englishman will meet you,
      and say to you that God, his uncle, has given him a title to the land.”

      * Tuatha Dè Danann, a supernatural race in Ireland, sometimes said to
      be the progenitors of the fairies.

      translated by Derick Thomson

    36. Smallaxe says:


      You’ll like this, there are trees in it!
      “King of the fairies”

      Fairies have got Wings.

    37. Tinto Chiel says:

      “Did ye luv thon?”

      I pure done, Smallaxe, flaneur extraordinaire, but youse hiv omitted the trendy brasseries and boites de nuits wot are to be found all over this trendy nook a ce moment.

      I may expatiate later, should the Muse move me.

    38. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      That documentary about the 51st at St Valery – I found it fair.

      It is currently on CH4+1.

    39. Tinto Chiel says:

      Loved thon tree music, Smallaxe. Trees are to be hugged to embrace the life force/Great Spirit but “Elm hateth Man and waiteth.”

      Ya bass.

      I fear hammers, on account of the peom I hiv posted.

      Night, all! *retreats to bosky bower*

    40. Thepnr says:

      @Tinto Chiel

      Don’t fear the hammers, they are for shite poems. Yours was class.

    41. CameronB Brodie says:

      I think this post rounds up a lot of what I’ve been posting recently. Sorry for all the science.

      Critical Cultural Approaches to Gender and Sex

      Summary and Keywords

      Within the field of communication studies, critical cultural scholarship examines the interarticulation of power and culture. Drawing from critical theory and cultural studies, this research offers analysis of texts, artifacts, practices, and institutions in order to understand their potential to promote or preempt equality and social justice. Critical theory, which has Marxist origins, uses theory as a basis for critiquing and challenging systems of domination or oppression. The field of cultural studies focuses on social formations with a particular emphasis on media texts and the reception practices of audiences. Both critical theory and cultural studies emphasize the important interrelationship between ideology, or structures of belief, and the material conditions in which people live. Critical cultural research examines discourse and representation, including language and visual culture, as well as social relations, institutional structures, material practices, economic forces, and various forms of embodiment.

      Central to critical cultural scholarship is attention to the construction, regulation, and contestation of categories of identity, including race, ethnicity, gender, sexuality, ability, and class. A significant branch of critical cultural studies examines how ideas about gender and sex develop and circulate, asking how and why some constructions of gender and sex become normative and gain hegemony—or, cultural privilege—in a particular context. For example, such scholarship might critique the idealization of certain performances of masculinity and the attendant devaluation of femininity or other subordinated masculinities; or, this research might consider how particular iterations of masculinity or femininity may be counter-hegemonic, operating in opposition to prevailing ideologies of gender and sex. Critical cultural approaches also emphasize the intersectionality of gender and sex with other categories of identity. For instance, ideas about masculinity or femininity can rarely be separated from assumptions about race and/or sexuality; as such, prevailing ideologies of gender and sex often reflect the presumed normativity of whiteness and heterosexuality.

      Keywords: gender, sex, culture, power, subjectivity, hegemony, ideology, intersectionality, heteronormativity, feminism, feminist, critical theory

      Ideology, Identity, and Intercultural Communication: An Analysis of Differing Academic Conceptions of Cultural Identity

      A non-essentialist model of culture: Implications of identity, agency and structure within multinational/multicultural organizations

    42. Smallaxe says:

      “I may expatiate later, should the Muse move me.”

      Try syrup of figs, Tinto.
      Or this;

      Moving, intit!

    43. Smallaxe says:

      A tribute to all the men and officers of the 51st, my wife’s grandfather (KOSB) was taken prisoner with them after being wounded and spent the rest of the war as a POW.

    44. CameronB Brodie says:

      Here’s one from a man who turned marginalising social stereotypes aimed against his ethnic group, into his USP (universal selling point). I might be weird but I have at least one foot in reality. 😉

      Screamin’ Jay Hawkins – Constipation Blues

    45. CameronB Brodie says:

      universal unique

    46. CameronB Brodie says:

      Culture is in constant flux, reinterpreting and remaking itself. Westminster and British nationalism do not represent my values, nor the rest of Scotland, with specific regard to Brexit. Personally, I don’t fancy the culture that will result from Westminster policy and wish to access inalienable human rights I am currently prevented from accessing, such as the “Right to Development”.

      Grace Jones – Slave To The Rhythm (Remix By Medicine Head)

    47. CameronB Brodie says:

      Of course, one of the most vulnerable and significant targets that the New Right will have in their sights after Brexit, is education policy. They’ve been after it since the 1970’s, as it’s the cradle of national identity and culture. Trouble is, British Labour are also chasing Tory voters in the south of England.

      Ethnic diversity, Christian hegemony and the emergence of multi-faith religious education in the 1970s


      This article provides a detailed reconstruction of the processes leading to the formation of the widely influential Birmingham Agreed Syllabus of Religious Instruction (1975). This is contextualised within one of the most significant periods in the history of race relations in the United Kingdom. The authors discuss how this syllabus, and other landmark reforms in religious education (RE) in English schools from the late 1960s, responded to ethnic diversity by promoting supposedly culturally pluralist, multi-faith approaches to RE, which were subsequently perceived as eroding the Christian foundations of British/English national identity. They argue that the vilification of these curriculum reforms by culturally conservative critics was in fact based on an erroneous assessment of the extent to which these renounced the Christian hegemony of RE. They also critique the assumption that the religious clauses of the 1988 Education Reform Act represented a simple transition from culturally pluralist to assimilationist policies for the subject.

      Keywords: religious education, immigration, assimilation, cultural pluralism

      History teaching, nationhood and politics in England and Wales in the late twentieth century: a historical comparison

      ‘Poisoned history’: a comparative study of nationalism, propaganda and the treatment of war and peace in the late nineteenth and early twentieth century school curriculum

    48. CameronB Brodie says:

      Conservatives are not the same as Tories, who tend to struggle with non-British identities. I doubt folk will have failed to notice that some of them are, in fact, stupendously racist (see the Prime Minister, for example). This is a product of English culture and one that Scotland could do well to distance itself from. 😉

      Faith in history: memory, multiculturalism and the legacies of Empire in postwar England


      This article employs a broad concept of memory in order to examine the reconstruction of the past in various migrant religious and educational settings in the period after 1970. In educational projects designed to promote good community relations, and in attempts to develop non-dogmatic forms of religious belief, British history became the subject of extensive discussion and debate. A small space opened up in which the legacies of British imperial history, so often a matter of visceral feeling, could be publicised, explored and taken seriously. Using case studies from London and Birmingham the article argues that religious groups played a small but important role in enabling new, more inclusive and more critical historical narratives to enter metropolitan British society.

      Keywords: ethnicity, religion, history, identity

      1968—Too Little and Too Late? The Communist Party and Race Relations in the Late 1960s

      ‘The other day I met a constituent of mine’: a theory of anecdotal racism

    49. CameronB Brodie says:

      I wasn’t joking when I suggested Tory brains are wired differently to the majority, but from a right-wing perspective it’s my mind that wired up wrong. And it appears that ideologically minded individuals like to stay in their ideological bubbles. This will need some imaginative thinking to overcome.

      Fear and Anxiety Drive Conservatives’ Political Attitudes
      Can brain differences explain conservatives’ fear-driven political stances?

      Peer-reviewed research shows that conservatives are more sensitive to threat. While this threat-bias can distort reality, fuel irrational fears, and make one more vulnerable to fear-mongering politicians, it could also promote hypervigilance, perhaps making one better prepared to handle an immediate threat….

      At Least Bias Is Bipartisan: A Meta-Analytic Comparison of Partisan Bias in Liberals and Conservatives

      Liberals and conservatives are similarly motivated to avoid exposure to one another’s opinions

    50. Cactus says:

      A good mornin’ to you Cameron…

      “This will need some imaginative thinking to overcome.”

      The good news is… we shall overcome.

      Good mornin’ good mornin’ to you too Smallaxe:–WBPBHo

      🙂 😉

    51. Cactus says:

      Upon Yes, Wales and England will be iScotland’s continuing neighbours…

      Politically: Scotland will be independent.
      Geographically: Unchanged, remains the same.

      Independent Scotland is a European and international country.

      And now we’re about to launch into Space too! 🙂

    52. Tinto Chiel says:

      Hi, Smallaxe. I went to bed early for my beauty sleep (so important at my age) and so missed your Weird Al. What a seer the man is! If he were World President there would be a New Dawn.

      I obvs didn’t see the programme about the Highland Division BDTT typed about but my handler and I visited St Valery en Caux a few years ago. The harbour is a bit like one of those small East Neuk ones and it’s surrounded by high cliffs where the Germans could have mounted their 88mm guns so I don’t think there was any real possibility of any evacuation.

      The monuments to the HD on the cliff are very impressive and I took quite a few photos but they were taken with a film camera.

      At least de Gaulle didn’t forget the sacrifice of the division, however cynical Churchill may have been:

      “I can tell you that the comradeship in arms experienced on the battlefield of Abbeville in May and June 1940 between the French armoured division which I had the honour to command and the valiant 51st Highland Division under General Fortune played its part in the decision which I took to continue fighting on the side of the Allies unto the end, no matter what the course of events.”

      I used to be able to Google a much longer speech by him where he praised the Scottish soldiers and made reference to the historic links and alliances between Scotland and France but I’ve been unable to find it again *adjusts tin foil hat to rakish angle*.

      It’s a funny old game, Saint.

    53. Thepnr says:


      If you got a weird “robotic voice” phone call last night then it was my fault, I sent a text message to your home phone by mistake. Eeeek!

    54. Smallaxe says:


      So it was you, I can come out from behind the couch now.

    55. Smallaxe says:


      I meant to leave you this;

    56. Thepnr says:


      Yes sorry 🙂

      Thought I’d better fess up as I knew you’d still be hiding behind the couch this morning.

      A present for you, just this once.

    57. Smallaxe says:


      You find out who your friends are;

    58. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Smallaxe 1018: thanks, I haven’t seen that site before. Had internet probs this morning so late in replying.

      Soffisticates on here might also be interested in “Churchill’s Sacrifice of the Highland Division” by Saul David and “St Valery: The Impossible Odds” by Bil Innes, which recounts the exloits of two Gaelic-speaking sodgers who escaped and made their way back to Scotland via Spain and North Africa.

      Meanwhile, in other news, I’m feeding grated cheese to a baby robin which has appeared in the garden and the sun is shining, so things are fine, apart from the fact that Scotland is still fastened to the dying animal of the UK.

      Yeats, ya bass.

    59. CameronB Brodie says:

      Racists are encouraged to express themselves by the political and media environment they live in. Racists also tend to be authoritarians and are likely to be anti-Semits. As such, it’s important to look back in order to understand the new age of Powellism we appear to be entering.

      Enoch Powell and the Making of Postcolonial Britain

      A belief in hierarchy, Schofield emphasizes, was at the core of Powell’s Toryism. Born into a lower-middle-class family, Powell was particularly attuned to the way in which specific historical institutions, such as university and then the army, created hierarchy, and thereby order, in British society at home and abroad. Race was every bit as central as class to Powell’s conception of hierarchy, evidenced by his enthusiasm for imperial power in India, where he served from 1943 to 1946. Countering characterizations of Powell as a liberal committed to the eventual independence of Indians, Schofield notes his refusal to acknowledge either the ability of Indians to articulate a national community of their own or the reality of anti-colonial sentiment. Becoming a researcher for the Conservative Party after the war, Powell remained so committed to ‘the unique and necessary role of the Englishman in India’ that, when predicting widespread violence in the wake of independence, he recommended martial law as the means by which Britain could reassert authority over the subcontinent (p. 70)….

      To What Extent is Britain Post-Colonial?

      Immigration Manhunts and British Post-Colonial Identity

    60. Thepnr says:

      Have I got a treat for all you lovely friends of Off Topic or what?

      So being at a lose end I’ve spent most of the day extracting every youtube link ever posted on Off Topic from day one, a grand total of 9458. Though many have been played more than once so it is not 9458 individual clips.

      I did this because I was very interested in finding out what were the 10 most played songs and how often they had been played.

      Turns out that it’s actually going to be the top 11 because two songs were tied at number 10. See if any of your own favourites are here 🙂

      So here is the top eleven countdown, 10th equal played 9 times. I remember it well on the run up to the referendum, so will Ian B as he played it first 🙂

    61. Tinto Chiel says:

      @CameronBB: Hakim Adi’s essay is interesting but I can’t think of a time when Britnats felt guilty about their empire. I think it’s at the heart of their world view or weltanschauung as we often say in Cadzow but not after six pints of Guinness and a kebab.

      @Thepnr: I salute your indefatigability. Looking furrit to the rest.

    62. CameronB Brodie says:

      Tinto Chiel
      I’m afraid he might have been talking about academia and public life. Agreed, British nationalists are often ‘culturally chauvanistic’, subjectively defining themselves against the different “other”, who they wish to obscure and exclude. It’s just a pity that racism gets such a culturally approved platform in Britain.

      Comparing British and American conservatisms through the prism of African development


      Conservatism and conservative party politics in Britain and America is associated with neo-colonial attitudes, including pursuit of national interests ahead of post-colonial development. Based on interviews conducted in Washington and London with actors involved with African development, this article examines comparative shifts in conservatives’ engagements from the late Cold War era to the G. W. Bush and Cameron governments. Greater ideological heterogeneity and distinctiveness among American conservative interests groups, combined with a bureaucratic environment in the US allowing more direct channels for ideological input into policy, results in a more clearly conservative stamp on Africa policy in the US than in Britain where ideological lines on development have become more blurred since the 1997 New Labour election victory and the creation of the Department for International Development.

      KEYWORDS: Conservatism, ideology, political parties, Britain, US, development, Africa

      That’s a big effort there Alex, I hope you don’t think it inapropriate of me to follow up with one for the “Hairy Plumber” a.k.a. POTUS. 😉

      Alex Puddu – Bad Love

    63. Thepnr says:

      Right I’m starting again, I’ve changed the rules else Paula Rose has nine of the top ten spots LOL.

      So the new rules are at least TWO people must have played the same song, don’t worry Paula your still in 7 of them 🙂

      In at Number 10 first played coincidently enough by CameronB Brodie and also Paula Rose, john king and Tinto Chiel.

    64. Thepnr says:

      At number 9 in the most played tunes on Off Topic we have a Country & Western number from Paula Rose back in May 2014 and followed up by Smallaxe in March last year.

    65. Thepnr says:

      At number 8 it’s a distinctly Scottish tune again played by both Paula Rose and Smallaxe.

    66. Thepnr says:

      At number 7 it’s pure pop. Played by Paula Rose, Ian Brotherhood, myself and Lucia Daines (who she?)

    67. Thepnr says:

      I’ve already played number 6 as it used to be number 10 before I changed the rules, but for completeness here it is again.

      Two people have played this Ian Brotherhood and me.

      Moving swiftly to number 5 then it’s one I hadn’t seen and BDTT first played it followed by Dave McEwan Hill and Tinto Chiel. Played 10 times overall.

    68. Thepnr says:

      This next song at number 4 has been played a total of 10 times but it has been played by the most number of different posters.

      They were Paula Rose, Oneironaut, BDTT, YesIndyref2, Macart, Tinto and Lucia Daines. I’m sure I’ve played this too but must have been a different link.

      Anyhow number 4 is a catchy tune from 1966, sexy video too 🙂

    69. Thepnr says:

      Down to the top 3 and at number 3 is once again a big favourite of Paula Rose as well as Yesindyref2 and Smallaxe.

      Released in late 1968 it found new acclaim when made part of the soundtrack in the cult film Pulp Fiction.

    70. Thepnr says:

      Number 2 was one I liked, played a total of 15 times the first was in March 2014 by Paula Rose and again by Ian Brotherhood after the referendum in September 2014.

      A classic song from the 70’s showcased by a couple of clowns 🙂

    71. Thepnr says:

      Anybody fancy a guess at what has been the most posted song on Off Topic, a total of 16 times? It’s a tough one mind.

    72. Thepnr says:

      OK here it is the most linked to song ever on Off Topic first played by guess who? Yes Paula Rose and also Ian Brotherhood.

      The song is good but I love the video, bit of nostalgia when hankering after my youth 🙂

    73. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      That’s a fair amount of work you put in there, Thepnr.


      How about the “one hit wonders”, ie only posted once by anybody? (You must have time on your hands…)


    74. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Thepnr (again!).

      I have a hunch this could be right up your farmtrack…

    75. Tinto Chiel says:

      Would never have guessed that one, Thepnr. Can’t remember even hearing it here.

      Thanks for all your Alan Freemaning.

    76. Lucia Daines says:

      OMG Paula and I are pogoing round the room – so very happy.

    77. Thepnr says:

      @Brian Doonthetoon

      There are 7,294 links that have only been played once which is pretty good going I think. Just shows the diversity of choices made be Wingers 🙂

    78. Thepnr says:

      @Lucia Daines

      I love to make people happy enjoy Lucia, I see you got a couple in the top ten as well 🙂

    79. Thepnr says:

      @Tinto Chiel

      The number one song was last posted on Off Topic in January this year. Nobody ever opens every link LOL.

    80. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      I promised Smallaxe months, nay M-O-N-T-H-S, ago, that once I had uploaded a particular track to YouTube, I would stick a link in ‘off-topic’, in advance of 25th January.

      I knew I had the single in my hovelhold but couldn’t find it.

      Onnyhoo, around a month ago, I found the bag it was in but, unfortunately, it was in a bag that I had fallen against, when I tripped on a cable trailing over my drawing room floor and was in many pieces.

      Therefore, I consulted t’interweb. I think I was able to buy the only 7″ version on the web but, as a bonus, was able to purchase what appeared to be the only 12″ version (on blue vinyl) available on the web.

      I’ve just checked; it’s still not on YouTube. It’s by a Scottish artiste and I will try to put a video together before 25th January next year.

      What a tease eh um, umma?

      “On 25th of Jan each year, Scotsmen remember full of cheer…”

    81. CameronB Brodie says:

      Can I just squeeze this in, ta. Re. the availability of affordable housing.

      Delivering affordable housing in troubled times
      Scotland national report

      February 2011

      An assessment of alternative ways to fund new affordable housing in Scotland at a time when public resources for housing are being significantly reduced.

      2 The credit crunch and Scottish affordable housing

      The traumatic unwinding of the credit crunch and its aftermath has been fully told in several places (e.g. Adair et al., 2009; Cassidy, 2009; Gamble, 2009; O’Sullivan and Gibb, 2008; Shiller, 2008). Here we focus on the UK and Scottish Government responses. The chapter also looks at the medium-term public finance impacts in a devolved context and what this means for affordable housing….

      Affordable Housing Need in Scotland
      Summary Report – September 2015

      Housing Policy in Scotland since Devolution: Divergence, Crisis, Integration and Opportunity

    82. Thepnr says:

      @Brian Doonthetoon

      Northern Soul wasn’t really my thing, I was just crap at the dancing though I did try to look the part at the few occasions I went to an all nighter at the Marryat Hall even bought a pair of “spoons” hoping to fit in LOL.

      Teezers was more my thing and it’s where I met my wife 🙂

    83. Smallaxe says:


      Thanks for all that, for a’ that an’ a’ that;

      We shall prevail!

    84. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Thepnr.

      I DJ’d in Teasers from January 1980 to September 1980, on Sunday evenings. I was interviewed by Tayside Police about the Templeton Woods murder, which happened the week before my first gig.

      “Spirit Of Radio” by Rush always reminds me of those nights – that and “Let’s Make Love” by The Nolans.

      Willie Rasche was a cheapskate and because I could earn more doing The Bowlin’ Alley, I gave it up for Weds, Fris and Sats in the BA.

      (I did play a rather catholic choice of music on those Sunday nights…)

    85. Thepnr says:

      @Brian Doonthetoon

      I was definitely going to Teezers at that time though I met my wife there in 1979 so before your time. The DJ’s were very important especially in the last 15 minutes when it came to the slow ones 🙂

      The other options at the time were Tiffany’s or the Palais until that burnt down. How did that happen?

    86. CameronB Brodie says:

      Can I just squeeze this one in as well, ta.

      Re. Anna Soubry, “private conversations” and Tory MPs “have said that the loss of hundreds of thousands of jobs will be worth it to regain our country’s sovereignty”.

      That’s what you get if you allow a bunch of social Darwinists anywhere near political power. Especially in an age of global, neo-liberal, consumerism.

      Social Darwinism


      Social Darwinism is a complex and controversial topic, a package of ideologies supposedly inspired by biological evolutionism that is of interest to scholars of both the life and the social sciences. In principle it includes any political system inspired by the view that human nature and social activity are driven by our biological nature, especially as defined by the process of evolution. The complexity of the topic derives from the fact that the term social Darwinism has been applied to a number of different (and to some extent incompatible) ideologies. The key feature is supposed to be the influence of Charles Darwin’s theory of evolution by natural selection, in which the “struggle for existence” determines the “survival of the fittest,” thereby ensuring that the species adapts to new conditions—although it is widely assumed that the process also guarantees progress toward higher levels of complexity.

      The classic image is of the proponents of unrestrained free-enterprise capitalism justifying their policy by appealing to the “survival of the fittest.” But the term has also been applied to justifications of militarism and imperialism (national or racial struggle) and to the eugenics movement’s efforts to replace natural selection with a process of artificial selection by restricting the reproduction of the “unfit.” The term has also been applied to more or less any claim that human nature is fixed by hereditary factors, especially those linked to social class or race….

      The intensification of neoliberalism and the commodification of human need – a social work perspective

      Culture of Cruelty: the Age of Neoliberal Authoritarianism

    87. Cactus says:

      Cheers for the Top-10 choons Thepnr 🙂

      Here’s one aye thought might have made the final cut:

      Another Ian B favourite 🙂

      Groovy Tuesday.

      It’s the 17th.

    88. Cactus says:

      Hearing on the lbc wireless that Vote Leave have been fined.

      Sounds fine tae me, congratulations.

      Whip crack away CJ.

    89. Fred says:

      @ Thepnr, well done kid!

    90. Thepnr says:


      Cheers Brian, I really enjoyed reading that and all the other posts.

    91. yesindyref2 says:

      The UK is finished for Scotland, it’s not if it’s when, hope I’m still alive to be here for it. Here’s the quickening of the version on MT.

    92. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. the inner Trump we all apparently have inside us.

      Authoritarianism, Dominance, and Social Behavior: A Perspective from Evolutionary Personality Psychology


      The concept of authoritarianism has been widely misunderstood because of both confusion about values and science and disagreement about a definition of the concept within different areas of psychology. Research in cognitive and social psychology has focused on linking scores on authoritarianism scales with social behavior or information processing, but these efforts have not been very successful at either defining the concept or predicting behavior. In developmental research, authoritarian parenting refers to an emphasis on parental control and decision making. Organizational authoritarianism has been linked to higher productivity and, in some cases, with lower job satisfaction. One way of making sense of the variety of definitions of authoritarianism is in terms of evolutionary personality theory and the concepts of dominance and submission. These biological concepts are relevant to both human and animal behavior, and they can be used to explain authoritarianism in scientific, rather than pejorative, terms.

      Keywords authoritarianism, evolutionary personality psychology, dominance, group behavior

      Can evolutionary psychology and personality theory explain Trump’s popular appeal?

      In Pursuit of Three Theories: Authoritarianism, Relative Deprivation, and Intergroup Contact

    93. CameronB Brodie says:

      Trump is a narcissistic, authoritarian, mysogynist, it is more than a little unfortunate for the world that the “Hairy Plumber” has managed to game his way to so much agency.

      Discursive psychology, rhetoric and the issue of agency


      Recent years have seen the growth of a movement which has aimed to reorientate the discipline of psychology around the study of discourse. Generally known as discursive psychology, this movement has had a large effect on social psychology, particularly in the United Kingdom, Australia, Canada, Scandinavia and South America. Its effect in the United States has been less marked. Discursive psychology is part of the general movement of critical psychology, which has been reacting against mainstream social psychology, especially the sort of experimental psychology that remains dominant in the United States (see, for instance, Gough and McFadden, 2001; Gergen, 2001; Hepburn, 2003; Sloan, 2000).

      Discursive psychologists have not been content merely to criticise mainstream psychology. They have proposed alternative ways of conducting psychological research, shifting the balance from the quantitative methodologies to qualitative ones, together with a commitment to studying human psychology through the use of language. Discursive psychology, however, represents more than a methodological alternative to conventional psychology. It rests upon an attempt to establish new, theoretical principles. At its heart lies a very different conception of language than that which is accepted by most mainstream psychologists, especially cognitive psychologists.

      In this paper, I will outline some of the principles of discursive psychology, especially in relation to its reaction against cognitive psychology. I will seek to show why philosophically the position of discursive psychology entails a critique of cognitivism, and I will describe attempts to use discursive principles to reformulate psychoanalytic theory. In addition, I will discuss the problem of agency, especially how it applies to discursive psychology. I will suggest that the problem of agency is essentially a rhetorical issue rather than a theoretical or methodological one. Calling it a rhetorical problem does not imply that it is a lesser problem – as if it were ‘mere rhetoric’, and, thereby, of lesser significance than theory or methodology. To suggest this would contradict the very basis of discursive psychology, which recognizes the importance of rhetoric in social life. By calling the issue a rhetorical one, I hope to draw attention to the importance of the way that psychologists, including discursive psychologists, use language to write about the phenomena that they are studying.

      Agency-Structure Dualism – Critical Social Psychology

      The Discursive Psychological Perspective – Critical Social Psychology

    94. CameronB Brodie says:

      I’ve just skimmed the surface of this issue, as I’m very out of practice, but Scotland needs to wake up to the true nature of British nationalism. A post-Brexit Britain is not somewhere I imagine most [c]conservatively minded Scots would want to go, frankly. Cultural sustainability is bound to social justice and environmental sustainability, so it is intrinsically linked to human rights. Scotland is currently denied access to inalienable human rights, as consequence of the “One Nation” ideology of British nationalism. A Tory invention, btw., which offers very little prospect of hope for Scotland, IMHO.

      Post-Cognitive Psychology

      This paper speculates about what will, and should, follow cognitivism in psychology in the new century. It highlights the importance of the work of Wittgenstein, Sacks and Edwards for the development of post-cognitive psychology. Cognitivism is criticized for failing to conceptualize practices in a way that recognizes their action orientation and co-construction, and to appreciate how they are given sense through people’s categories, formulations and orientations. Discursive psychology focuses on the production of versions of reality and cognition as parts of practices in natural settings. It is offered as one potential successor to cognitivism.

      Keywords action, cognitivism, discursive psychology, practices

      Embodying discourse analysis: Lessons learned about epistemic and ontological psychologies

      Responding to critiques of ‘Including social discourses and experience in research on refugees, race, and ethnicity’, and providing suggestions for future work in discursive psychology, this article expands upon the complex and dynamic character of research in socioculturally informed social science. Through a better understanding of experience and an awareness of broader social discourse, one is able to consider verisimilar ontologies, which are fundamentally socio-linguistic phenomena. It is important to understand the value in using discursive psychology’s analytical practices; however, an awareness of the need to expand upon such practices is necessary in order to better understand how experience is cultivated in dynamic and rhythmic co-regulated social constitution. Future research should endeavor to develop techniques that are not necessarily formulaic, but are still examinable for the purposes of determining good versus bad work.

      Keywords Discursive psychology, embodiment, experience, ontology

      Beyond the Ontological Turn: Affirming the Relative Autonomy of Politics


      In this article, I critically evaluate a characteristic tendency that is found across the various traditions of poststructuralism, both narrowly and more broadly defined. This is an increasing propensity to be preoccupied with ontological questions and seemingly at the expense of either a refinement of political concepts or a concrete analysis of forms of power and domination. I consider the reasons for this development and stress how this characteristic feature of poststructuralism appears to follow from the very fact of ontological pluralism. What we see in contemporary continental thought is a proliferation of different traditions, and each side seeks to defend their position in ontological terms. Following this, I advance the idea of a relative autonomy between ontology and politics, where the former does not determine the latter in any direct or straightforward fashion. I argue that we need to stress this relative autonomy to open a little space between ontology and politics, space where we can return poststructuralism to a more concrete engagement with ‘the political’.

      Keywords ontology, politics, political, relative autonomy, domination

    95. CameronB Brodie says:

      Authoritarianism, Dominance, and Social Behavior: A Perspective from Evolutionary Personality Psychology link

    96. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      I’ve just watched the first episode of “Rip It Up”, looking at the history of Scottish “pop” over the past 60 years (on BBC2 Scotland).

      I found episode 1 fairly good. I must admit that I found my eyes becoming watery during the Lulu and Middle of The Road segments. (Must be an age/nostalgia thing.)

      I’ll wait for the segment on Skeets Boliver/Michael Marra and Jim Kelly and the Sleaz Band…

    97. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. Kezia. With an MA in Social Policy(?), there really is no excuses for her political stance, IMHO.

      Critical Consciousness: An Alternative Pathway for Positive Personal and Social Development


      This paper presents a conceptual model of the integrative psychological construct of critical consciousness (CC), defined as a moral awareness which propels individuals to disembed from their cultural, social, and political environment, and engage in a responsible critical moral dialogue with it, making active efforts to construct their own place in social reality and to develop internal consistency in their ways of being. The ontogeny of CC is analyzed in terms of the synergistic interaction between its two main components, structural developmental and moral motivation. The paper describes the cross-cultural interview research which allowed the elaboration of the CC developmental pathway. It posits the dimension of moral motivation as distinguishing the CC pathway, and illustrates the continuum between predominantly moral and expediency motivation through brief case vignettes. The paper differentiates three developmental macrolevels of CC, and illustrates through case vignettes two alternatives of social consciousness at the level of conventional morality—CC and non-CC. Some possible sources of moral motivation in personal history and biography are discussed.

      Moral development, social consciousness, social responsibility, critical thought, Freire

      Understanding Internalized Oppression: A Theoretical Conceptualization of Internalized Subordination

      Frantz Fanon, Steve Biko,‘psychopolitics’ and critical psychology

    98. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Just dropping this in before I try to catch-up with all the comments I’ve missed this last week or so, hope abody’s well there.

      My boy has been playing this for days and it eventually grabbed me so mibbe others will like it. Apologies if it’s already been posted…

      Dermot Kennedy, ‘Young & Free’ –

    99. Cactus says:

      Oh what a Scottish Summer 1976 / 2018!

      This is like the Westminster Tory politicians current political reality like:

      iScotland announcement very soon now.

      Yes 2 for one and all of us.

      Here’s Doogie and the guys (a double-play):

      I got it on the original on tape cassette. 🙂

      Theresa May, politician… ahhhhh hahahahaha!

      Whose next…?

      42 years.

      To learn.

    100. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Thepnr –

      Just caught up with all your Top Ten. Great stuff!

      I only ever posted ‘Hurts So Good’ because Paula had gone AWOL and I was trying to draw her back in. I’d never heard that song before she posted it. Seems such a long time ago now. Then again, so does the night of the referendum itself.


    101. CameronB Brodie says:

      @Kezia Dugdale
      Have a gander at these, then come and join those who seek effective political representation. Or are you a British nationalist?

      A Pedagogy of Social Justice Education:
      Social Identity Theory, Intersectionality, and Empowerment

      This article explores a theoretical and practical understanding of social justice education through an examination of a US-based intergroup educational organization running conflict transformation programs since 2005. Based on in-depth interviews conducted with and surveys completed by administrators, educators, and student participants of the organization’s programs, this article analyzes a case example of social justice education that integrates Freirean thought, social identity theory, intersectionality, and experiential education, including empowerment and responsibility education. Offering different programs aimed at distinct constituencies yet all based in the same pedagogy, the organization’s primary goal is to empower participants to engage in social justice activism.

      From Charity Towards a Social Justice Paradigm: Critical Consciousness Through Service-Learning

      A Social Justice Lens
      A Teaching Resource Guide

    102. Thepnr says:

      @Ian Brotherhood

      It does seem like such a long time ago, I reckon I’ve aged twenty years since deciding to support Independence lol

      Still if something is worth fighting for then it’s worth it.

      Here’s one that didn’t quite make the top ten, played first by me in 2014 🙂 and also by Smallaxe.

    103. CameronB Brodie says:

      Anyone feel as if an indyref might be in the air? On the inherent sense of self-entitlement that’s intrinsic to British nationalism, Tories and stuff.

      Collective Narcissism and its Social Consequences


      This paper introduces the concept of collective narcissism – an emotional investment in an unrealistic belief about the in-group’s greatness – aiming to explain how feelings about an in-group shape a tendency to aggress against out-groups. The results of 5 studies indicate that collective, but not individual, narcissism predicts inter-group aggressiveness. Collective narcissism is related to high private and low public collective self esteem and low implicit group esteem. It predicts perceived threat from out-groups, unwillingness to forgive out-groups and preference for military aggression over and above social dominance orientation, right wing authoritarianism, and blind patriotism. The relationship between collective narcissism and aggressiveness is mediated by perceived threat from out-groups and perceived insult to the in-group. In sum, the results indicate that collective narcissism is a form of high but ambivalent group esteem related to sensitivity to threats to the in-group’s image and retaliatory aggression.…narcissism.pdf

      Narcissists aren’t very conservative but believe in inequality

      The Psychology of Legitimacy
      Emerging Perspectives on Ideology, Justice, and Intergroup Relations

    104. Thepnr says:


      Another new one for me, just had my daughter watch the two of them and isn’t it funny how there faces can change. Jeezo I wish I had the power to give everybody more information.

      Anyway have a good kip, tomorrow is another day where we will have to fight the good fight. Armageddon isn’t going away unless we force it to by the power in all of us.

      That is the power of persuasion and we really need to use it.

    105. Cactus says:

      SO to learn.

      1976 to 2018 to 2060.

      The message in the spirit of the meaning of…

      Every 42 years we will have a most excellent summer.

      Aye wonder if England & Wales will be back in the EU by then?


    106. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. the fundamentalist faith promoted by the New Right and which causes Septicemic Brexititis. It sold well with Anglicans, especially the non-practicing variety. Brexit is an expression of English culturalism that has gotten out of hand, it does not respect the Scottish vote.

      Sacred Politics—Trump, Brexit and Civil Religion

      British Civil Religion?

      November’s Armistice Day commemorates the sacrifice of troops in Britain. Faith and political leaders arrive at the Cenotaph, laying wreaths. In November 2015, tabloid headlines accused leader of the opposition Jeremy Corbyn of failing to show due reverence due to not bowing deeply enough. Later, he faced the scorn of the then Prime Minister David Cameron for not singing the national anthem. This year, the story was that Corbyn “danced a jig” prior to the memorial service, once again, failing to reflect the sombre mood of the event.

      It is clear that Britain has a civil religion too – different though from the United States. The accusations and criticisms of Corbyn are that of impiety. He is not reverent enough, he does not commit to the rituals, he is an infidel, a hypocrite who doesn’t believe in the national religion at all.

      The argument of impiety in civil religion will largely fall flat for those on the left, but for the British right, who value traditional institutions, it is a significant charge.

      Britain’s civil religion is currently up for debate. While Britain was once an undeniably Christian country, the public role of religion has increasingly diminished, prompting the former Archbishop Rowan Williams to observe Britain is a “post-Christian” country….

      How religious groups voted in the 2016 referendum on Britain’s EU membership

      Recent research has shed light on the voting preferences of the British electorate at last year’s Brexit referendum, looking at how support for remain or leave was distributed across a range of socio-demographic groups, as well as showing how it varied based on party support, policy preferences and ideological beliefs. How did religious groups in wider society vote? Were some more likely than others to have voted to leave the EU or vice versa? Data from wave 9 of the British Election Study Internet Panel Study, undertaken after the referendum (with fieldwork conducted by YouGov between 24 June-6 July 2016), allow a comparison of voting behaviour based on religious affiliation. The core sample for wave 9 is used, which enables cross-sectional analysis of the data.

      The figure below shows the proportions voting remain and leave within different religious groups. Some groups showed an even split between the two options on the ballot (Methodists and Baptists) and some showed a slight preference for one side or the other (Catholics and Church of Scotland / Presbyterian for remain; Jews and other Christian for leave); but more distinct voting patterns are also evident. Those who identify themselves as Anglican or Church of England were clearly in the leave camp – 60% backed Britain leaving the EU and 40% supported staying. Muslims were clearly in the remain camp, with 69% choosing this option and 31% in favour of leaving the EU. Those with no religion (a group with a younger age profile) were in the ‘remain camp’, by 57% to 43%, as were those belonging to other non-Christian faiths (55% to 45%) and those who preferred not to disclose their religious affiliation (55% to 45%)….

      The Social Consequences of Brexit for the UK and Europe: Euroscepticism, Populism, Nationalism, and Societal Division


      This article examines the 2016 Referendum on the United Kingdom’s membership of the European Union and draws on initial research into the reasons that the UK voted to leave and demographics of the leave vote. This initial analysis suggests that the Brexit (British Exit) vote reveals wider and deeper societal tensions along the lines of age, class, income, and education (Goodwin and Heath 2016). By providing an account of the background and events of the referendum, this article asserts that the vote was a case study in populist right-wing Eurosceptic discourse (Leconte 2010; Taggart 2004), but it also reveals strong elements of English nationalism (including British exceptionalism and social conservatism) in parts of British society (Henderson et al. 2016; Wellings 2010). Given this, the article begins to make sense of Brexit from a social quality perspective and outlines a possible social quality approach to the UK and Europe post-Brexit.

    107. CameronB Brodie says:

      Sacred Politics—Trump, Brexit and Civil Religion link, doh.

      @Kezia Dugdale
      Have you considered your position from the perspective of Democtatic Theory?

      Political Self-Determination and the Normative Significance of Territorial Boundaries

      I. Introduction

      Proponents of global egalitarian justice often argue that their positions are compatible with the principle of self-determination.2 This argument is not merely a strategy of reassuring and appeasing nationalist and statist opponents; rather it conveys the intuition that self-determination is pertinent for just institutions, protecting liberties and rights. Especially in the context of international justice, the principle of self-determination assumes a strong normative power due to its primacy in theoretical and political opposition to colonial rule.3

      At the same time, the arguments in favour of global egalitarian justice reject one customary component of what it has meant for a polity to be self-determining: namely, that the boundaries of states (or other self-determining political units) are normatively significant for the allocation of rights and duties. They reject, in other words, the proposition that duties of social justice and rights of political participation stop or significantly change at borders.4

      In this paper, I propose a new argument in defense of the normative significance of territorial boundaries, which draws on a political interpretation of the principle of self-determination. This specific interpretation of the principle of self-determination emerges from the detailed analyses of the relationship between self-determination and boundaries-making, developed in theories of secession.5

      Theories of secession have focused on disputed territories, assessing the validity of various claims to territory in light of the principle of self-determination. These discussions are of direct relevance for global egalitarian arguments and their critiques in regard to territories that are not currently disputed, because much of the debate concerns the validity of claims by polities to their territories and the scope of their self-determination. The political interpretation explored here defines the claim for self-determination asa claim by a group with a shared political identity to establish (or maintain) separate political institutions with jurisdiction over identifiable territory.

      The political interpretation is distinct, in the normative principle that it invokes, from two other conceptions of self-determination: the national and the democratic. In the national version, self-determination derives its normative claim from the value of nationality; in the democratic interpretation, self-determination is a claim to an equal participation in decision-making, deriving its normative claim from the value of democracy.6


      CHAPTER 2:

      2.2 Legal framework governing self-determination

      Invariably the starting point is Article 1 of the UN Charter which states in the material part that one of the purposes of the United Nations is:

      2. To develop friendly relations among nations based on respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples, and to take other appropriate measures to strengthen universal peace.69

      Article 55 of the same Charter tracks the language of article 1 in requiring states parties to promote higher standards of living, international and cultural co-operation and universal respect for human rights and freedoms.70 Reference to the principle of equal rights and self-determination can also be found in articles 73 and 76(b) of the UN Charter. As a principle of the United Nations, self-determination has also been carried to the fore and addressed in a number of conventions, cases and resolutions.71

      Two “Decolonisation Resolutions” were passed in 1960 by the UN General Assembly – Res. 1514(XV) and 1541(XV), which provided for the right to self-determination in terms precisely identical to the contemporary framing of the right in the covenants. Suffice it to say that the two Resolutions were purely of colonial context and purpose though still regarded to be the cornerstone of the UN law of self-determination.72 The principle has also been applied in a series of judgments by the I.C.J such as the South West Africa Case,73 the Western Sahara Case74 and the East Timor Case.75 In the East Timor case, the I.C.J stated that the right of peoples to self-determination was one of the “essential principles of contemporary international law”.

    108. Smallaxe says:

      Rasta Children feat. Nattali Rize: Playing For Change/Song Around The World;

    109. CameronB Brodie says:

      Scotland, stand up against ‘British’ exceptionalism, a.k.a. English cultural chauvinism. It won’t end well for Scotland if England gets it’s way on Brexit. Say no to racism.!

      Sista Mary – Blindeye

    110. CameronB Brodie says:

      The far-right have stroked post-colonial England’s need for for a tangible sense of direction after empire, with the eager support of the corporate media and the BBC. The politic class is now powerless to avert Brexit, which represents the adoption of an authoritarian totalitarianism as the articulation of British nationalism and culture. The far-right will destroy any potential for hope in Scotland, if we let them.

      Leroy Sibbles – Garden Of Life

    111. CameronB Brodie says:

      The prospect of living the rest of my life under a paradigm of racist austerity on stilts, really doesn’t appeal to me. Self-determination for Scotland is where it’s at, as a written constitution would help prevent sociopaths in public office from cause harm to the public. Given the direction of travel that England has chosen, Scotland needs independence in order to survive culturally, intellectually and spiritually, so let’s get moving.

      Bassomatic – Rat Cut-a-Bottle

    112. Tinto Chiel says:

      Is it just me or is there a strong resemblance between Man A in this:

      And Man B in this?

      Spooky is wot I say.

    113. Cactus says:

      Gd evenin’ wise ones, enjoying the Garden of Life and Bassomatic, thx Cameron bro 😉

    114. Cactus says:

      This post is about a da pizza pie.

      Cookery serving suggestion #458…

      Overoil and try sprinkling some granulated brown demerara sugar over your a da pizza pie with extra lots of sugar in the centre, think of the flan ‘gumars‘.

      Sweet bites.

    115. Fred says:

      Dead-ringer Tinto. The red-troosered sage of Cadzow does it again!

    116. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Fred: unfortunately for Mr Eardley, Stanley still makes more sense. What a maroon, as old Bugs used to say.


      Btw, the breeks are more terra cotta…

    117. Thepnr says:

      @Tinto Chiel

      The posh English speaking Stanley Baxter looks more like Ross Thomson!

      As for the first BBC clip, that looks like a spoof.

    118. Tinto Chiel says:

      Everything on BBC is a spoof, Thepnr.

      I tried to verify your claim that Baxter is more like Ross Thomson but the latter’s head is so far up Bojo’s arse, it is impossible to tell at the mo. He’s the kind of wee sook at school who got taken round the back of the bicycle sheds to show him the error of his ways in a firm yet supportive, caring and inclusive environment.


      A beautiful day here in South Central North Britain. The BRITISH Greek basil our daughter brought us from S________’s is still doing fine. My baby robin likes grated cheddar cheese and I have seeded the back grass with AP mines to deter that bloody ginger cat that sneaks about the garden.

      Problem solved!

    119. Smallaxe says:


      Is that cat giving you Gyp;

      Btw, what does a cheese fed robin taste like?

    120. Tinto Chiel says:

      Morning, Smallaxe: you have been a busy boy since Nana went on undercover border patrol.

      Your robin-based question was deep, mon vieux haricot (as deep as the well of my Brexit apprehension).

      I’m going to plump for a theoretical “cheesy” at the mo.

      In other news: I may be just imagining this but I think my BRITISH Greek basil is tasting a bit gammon now.

    121. Tinto Chiel says:

      “Gammony” obvs.

      Y did my Y not Y?

      Take that, fillosiphers.

    122. Tinto Chiel says:

      That’s even deeper, old mole, and requires much musing.

      Deeply depressed by GMK’s timetable.

      Off to erect a Keep Off The Grass sign.

    123. Tinto Chiel says:

      Not that kind of grass, you silly sossage.

      Have just been informed by my carer I am going shopping for a new item for her Inverness wardrobe (and I don’t mean a handle).

      This could take some time……

    124. Smallaxe says:

      I feel your pain, old chap. My carer bought a new vacuum cleaner yesterday and it came without utensils so I have to take her into darkest Carlisle today to allow her to punch someone!

      I’ll just have to suck it up;

    125. Fred says:

      Anent Carlisle & Wardrobes, came across Archbishop Gavin Dunbar of Glasgow’s magnificent curse on Borderers & thought of Mundell,

      An ex of Fatty Soames once described sex with Churchill’s grandson as lying under a double wardrobe in which somebody had left a small key!

    126. Tinto Chiel says:

      “… lying under a double wardrobe in which somebody had left a small key!”

      Definitely not a skeleton key in his case, Fred, eh? I believe he said something about two days ago about Brexit but I couldn’t really give a flying fruit bat about the sexist old grunter.

      I wish I could remember the name of the wit who said he was initially excited about his new Dyson but now it languishes in the cupboard under the stairs just gathering dust…..

    127. Ian Brotherhood says:

      ‘Fatty’ Soames pops up frequently in Alan Clark’s diaries, seems they were very close.

      Just thought I’d throw that in there to help momentarily dispel the image of him, naked, lying on top of someone else. You wouldn’t wish that on anyone, unless, of course, it’s another Tory (which it probably was).

      Ach, I would say ‘Fuck Them All’ but they’re doing it for themselves these days…

    128. Fred says:

      Is this the same Soames who phoned Lady Di on behalf of Prince Charles & predicted that she would be finished off in a car accident? guess wot!

    129. Tinto Chiel says:

      Evening, gentlemen.

      Good to know these Establishment scum-balls think they are superior to us all. The more genteel of my grannies used to say Tories had the morals of alley-cats. As for the Irish side, you don’t want to know.

      When it comes to imagining their absurd horizontal joggings and sexual couplings in various deviant combinations (including “Poppers” Blunt), I always adhere to the Singing Detective’s dictum: ” Quick, think of Malcolm Muggeridge, think of Malcolm Muggeridge!”

      Saves a lot on mental health counselling and analysts’ bills in the long run.

    130. Cactus says:

      Mornin’ wise Wingers, 8 days remaining to go 🙂

      Things are hotting up in uk politics.

      Getting warmer.

    131. yesindyref2 says:

      Well, this is all deeply unsettling, with no deal becoming more likely I think it’s hit home in a personal way for the first time. Too busy before considering the ins and outs for Indy, deciding what to post carefully elsewhere, but now the reality of crashing out of the EU hits home. In spite of the armour Indy supporters have because of our hope for a different path for Scotland. I guess as TC says above, GMK’s “timetable” doesn’t help in the slightest. It just doesn’t have any urgency about it. Seems more like “hey, that’s an iceberg ahead, hold my pink gin while I go below and get the camera”.

      I got nearly nothing done today, and I have masses to do. But on the other hand, if I with all my armour am feeling this, and it seems others are too, then what about the punters in the street? Is it starting to get through to them? Perhaps it is. I doubt it.

    132. Tinto Chiel says:

      yesindyref2:”Perhaps it is. I doubt it.”

      Me too. Too many people think politics is for politicians and somehow “they will do a deal”. I don’t know how often I’ve heard this recently, particularly from The Greys. I sometimes call my town Zombieville because of all the unaware Mail/Express readers wandering around repeating “I hate yon Sturgeon for all the free things she’s given us” but food and medical supplies will be at a premium if the Tories crash out and the old are arguably the most vulnerable.

      *Sets tin-foil fedora at a John T Angle*

      What cabal/Deep State Types really control the UK and the media? Do they really thing the devastation and poverty of Crash-out is acceptable? Obviously the tax-dodging billionaires who own the press want it but there must be sane people who see the tsunami coming and know it’s madness to the max.

      The only thing that cheered me up yesterday was Peter A Bell’s riposte to GMK. SNP leaders should note the bounce the party got following their walkout. It added thousands to the marches and we need more bolshie behaviour like that to grab people’s attention about the giant iceberg ahead.

    133. Smallaxe says:

      Tinto Chiel says:
      “medical supplies will be at a premium if the Tories crash out and the old are arguably the most vulnerable.”

    134. Tinto Chiel says:

      Don’t worry, Smallaxe. I’ve still got some Sloan’s liniment and some pre-war Croat gin so we’ll be ok after Armabritnatgeddon.

      Dull and wet here: John Major weather but without the peas.

    135. Smallaxe says:

      Thanks, Tinto,

      That’s cheered me up, no end. Raining here also;

    136. Tinto Chiel says:

      Nae probs, Smallaxe. I’ve got the crew for such an eventuality:

      I see you have been a busy boy on the M/T. Your links were most instructive. I’ve never known such madness, chaos, incompetence, stupidity, corruption and duplicity since our local WRVS changed the rules for the Jams and Jellies contest.

      I’ve never used Marigold rubber gloves since.

    137. Smallaxe says:

      I’m glad you’ve got that all sorted, Tinto.

      But it’s still raining!

      Not to worry though, I’ve got a get rich quick team;


    138. Tinto Chiel says:

      I dig it, mon vieux haricot. I really liked that bit of SW when I was a nipper.

      Don’t worry, my handler informs me the weather will clear up later and she is never wrong.

      Was out in the car earlier and heard this on my mobile crystal set. Got so carried away movin’ and a groovin’ that I ended up in Bonkle:

      A lesson for us all there, I think.

    139. Smallaxe says:

      I used to get the #67 bus going to Bonkle when I worked at Colville’s steelworks in Cambuslang, never did get to see Bonkle but I’ll tell you sometime about how I managed to set myself on fire while waiting for that bus.

    140. Tinto Chiel says:

      Had you slathered yourself in whale oil and lit up a stoagie?

      I’m all ears.

    141. Fred says:

      Very drunk one night I nearly got on a ghost-bus going to West Crindledykes!

    142. Tinto Chiel says:

      I know people (mostly Glaswegians) call it Darkest Lanarkshire but maybe it should be called The Twilight Zone in the light of your post, Fred.

      Q: if you get on a ghost-bus, are you a ghostbuster?

      Ok, ok, I’ll get my Klingon cloaking device.

    143. yesindyref2 says:

      whale oil beef hooked.

      Oh well.

    144. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      One of my ‘now and again’ music links.

      When I first started to search YouTube for stuff, this was (I think) the only hit that came up for the John Dummer Band. I thought that it was rather clever, as it was the first example of a mashup I had seen.

      The bonus is that Linda Carter is in it.

    145. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      See all this on the news today about the shortage of soft fruit (ie berry) pickers? Eh ken a sang aboot thah’…
      Eh blame it on the nabblers… Nabblers drove the honest pickers awa…

    146. Cactus says:

      Way out East again Wingers… Anstruthers where it’s at.

      Ahm back on the beach, flying solo dis time.

      Hey Chris Cairns…

      Has it been one week already like..?

      Saturday’s comin…

    147. Cactus says:

      Just learned that ah’ve got access to free wifi here yee har…

      Most excellent.

      I can surf.



    148. Cactus says:

      Postcaird frae Anstruther comin’ soon…

      Scotland is ours xx.

    149. Fred says:

      Probably ended up walking Tinto. Also many, many years ago there was free buses which took Glesga folk in search of a “walk on the wild-side” out to the Griffin in Bothwell on a Sunday where there was a variety of debauchery available as long as U bought sausage-rolls, there was even singing on the Sabbath, fair scandalous!

    150. Cactus says:

      iScotland soon.

      Watch the tides.


    151. Smallaxe says:


      Close but no cigar.
      Fred, you, drunk! Never. We always had to wear a tie in the Griffin, remember?


      It took me a minute to work that one out.

      Brian DTT,

      Thanks for that, here’s another from JD;


      You’ve been a naughty boy again.

    152. Tinto Chiel says:

      Still musing about yesindyref’s 5.42.

      Stuff the sossage rolls, I believe loose women used to frequent The Griffin.

      “The horror! The horror!”

      Bona fide travellers MRIA.

    153. Fred says:

      Guys, ties were of course de rigueur back in the day. There was also a compulsory raffle as I remember, the prize was Bellshill or someplace!

    154. Smallaxe says:


      If you’re still musing over Yesindyref2’s comment, try saying it quickly in an Irish accent.

    155. Tinto Chiel says:

      Ah, Smallaxe, my signature tune! Fanx for that. You have moved me.

      How can you say “it” in an Irish accent?

      Moanly kiddin’. I see, I see.

      But WHY did yesindyref2 say that? Ever thunk o yon, Poindexters?

      “World is crazier and more of it than we think”, as the Peot said.

    156. cearc says:

      Hmmm, ‘compulsory raffle’, eh?

      Sounds like a Wing-Night-Oot.

    157. Fred says:

      “The next dance is a raffle!”

    158. yesindyref2 says:

      @Tinto Chiel
      Just because you mentioned whale oil and it brought back memories 🙂

    159. Tinto Chiel says:

      Memories? Memories, you say?


      *Strokes chin*

    160. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Any mention of “whales” (yesindyref2 at 4.53) reminds me of an excruciating joke.
      Two old boys sitting on a park bench.
      Tam says to Willie “Hive ye seen that fillum Moby Dick?”
      “Naw” replies Willie.”Wife’ll no let me go tae thay durty fillums.”
      “It’s no a durrty film. It’s aboot whales.”
      “Och. I dinnae much like they Welsh eether.”

      Boom boom (or not).

    161. yesindyref2 says:


      Wouldn’t you like to know.

      So would I come to think of it.

    162. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Dave and yesindyref2:

      And I thought “Free Willy” was Warren Beatty’s biopic.


    163. Thepnr says:

      This is a grainy and bad picture of Tiger Woods leaving the green at the ninth hole on Carnoustie today.

      This is a better picture of the house behind him on the same picture 🙂

    164. cearc says:


      Good on they people! Prime spot as well.

    165. Cactus says:

      Ahhh that’s better.

      Fucking wifi rules okay.

      On the beach:

      Could be anywhere, in Scotland.

      Sunday club.

    166. Cactus says:

      Oor Scottish Withdrawal Bill is gettin’ sorted oot v soon…

      Be it Supreme or ECJ.

      Scotland will WIN.

      We’re SOV.

    167. Tinto Chiel says:

      Sweet sixteen, Smallaxe?

      I was eight…..

      Still John Major weather here but shirts are out of underpants.

    168. Smallaxe says:


      We all know that you can be economical with the truth when it comes to your age.

    169. Tinto Chiel says:

      Not a lot of people know that this:

      Was just a cover version of this little toe-tapper:

      Gone nadgerin’…

    170. Smallaxe says:

      Fixed that for you!

      Happy nadgering.

    171. Tinto Chiel says:

      Was just putting on my nadgering mail tabard when I saw your last.

      Fanx for httping for me.

      Are my crow’s feet so obvious?

      Laters, haters.

    172. Fred says:

      Anent Tinto’s Stanley Baxter lookalikes, Gordon Brewer gets mair Baxterdised every time ah see the hauf-biled tosser!

    173. Tinto Chiel says:

      I have heard tell he is a particularly useless Baxterd, Fred.

      Just in: an alarmed Jeremy Corbyn summons Stella Creasey to account for her off-message comments on a second referendum.

    174. Tinto Chiel says:

      Don’t know how the extra ‘e’ in Creasy got in there.

      In my defence:

    175. Tinto Chiel says:


    176. Cactus says:


      Yes Scotland’s withdrawal from the UK union will be most pleasing. Let’s keep our European continuity in continuance citizens.

      Did you ever play this arcade game at the MegaBowl in Clydebank…

      Mad Dog McCree:

      They also had a Laser Quest there.

      That’s nice shootin’ stranger!

      Game Over Westminster.

    177. Smallaxe says:

      Manic Monday;

      The maniacs will be here soon!

    178. cearc says:

      My ears are burning.

    179. Tinto Chiel says:

      Step back from the range, cearc.

      This may help 😛

    180. Smallaxe says:

      Morning cearc & Tinto,

      I did say that the maniacs would be here soon.
      Serves You Right;

    181. Tinto Chiel says:

      Bonjour, Monsieur Hachette.

      Still John Major weather here, but thankfully no sign of Edwina Currie.

      Have started to plan my No Deal Brexit shelter and stock pile at Tinto Towers.

      Are tinned prunes a good idea? Asking for a friend.

    182. Smallaxe says:

      Hi Tinto;

      Tinned prunes, there’s only one thing wrong with that idea, you (or your friend) will,

    183. Tinto Chiel says:

      Wise (and very moving) words, mon vieux haricot.

      I’ve seen a domestic nuclear shelter in Switzerland, where they are compulsory, and I have to say it makes getting stuck in a lift with Jacob Rees-Mogg for fifty years (until prosperity returns to Britannia Island) a breeze by comparison.

    184. Smallaxe says:

      I’ve got a domestic nuclear shelter at home but we just call it ‘the wheelie bin’.

    185. cearc says:

      Hoorah, at last we had a decent amount of rain to wet the soil, yesterday. Brightening up nicely now.

      Dried prunes take up less space. Bunkers are for coal!

    186. Smallaxe says:

      Ladysmith Black Mambazo:”Rain, Rain, Beautiful Rain”

      Some people dance in the rain, others only get wet!

    187. Cactus says:

      Mon the rain, thx Smallaxe, she’s beautiful.

      Hey Arb-LA, ahm back… ah think.

      Tiny bubbles honda East coast.

      Party on Scotland x.

    188. Cactus says:

      How fast can the quickening get like?

      Gonnae save some for laters…

      Cheers neighbours x.

    189. Thepnr says:

      Back in the old days there used to be quite a few youtube links played on the main thread. I was reminiscing last night looking through a few old articles and clicked on a couple of links.

      Here are the songs being played on Wings over Scotland on the article from 30th August 2014 just a couple of weeks before the referendum.

      They’re pretty good 🙂

    190. Thepnr says:

      The point of them was meant to be uplifting I think. I know I was uplifted LOL.

      Two of the links no longer work and one of them was played twice. That leaves 5 to go of which this is the fifth.

      This is a wee beauty from the ordinary people of Dundee.

    191. Thepnr says:

      Glasgow band now and one of their songs I hadn’t heard before.

    192. Thepnr says:

      Three to go and this was one of mine 🙂

      You probably won’t know it but the lyrics were what I was trying to get across back in August 2014.

    193. Thepnr says:

      You will love this!

      “Sit down and eat your fucking Wheeto’s!”

      The penultimate youtube link from btl that night and it’s brill.

    194. Thepnr says:

      We’re at the last one from the thread on the night of 30th August 2014 and I think the best of the lot. Starring our good friend Ian Brotherhood. The man is a natural in front of the camera.

      He could’a been a contender and I wish he had been 🙂

    195. Thepnr says:

      There’s still time yet Ian, get yourself into Holyrood. I know you could do it, no problem.

      Forget about the skeletons in the wardrobe, we’ll have your back 🙂

    196. Tinto Chiel says:

      I heard that little creep Hunt shamefully trying the EU blame game with the German foreign minister today. These are the final stages before Crash Out, I think.

      I could be convinced these gruesome Tories are actually aliens. None of them even move normally. They could be lizard folk or extras from Gormenghast or summat but they just ain’t right.

    197. Cactus says:

      Ireland knows what to do… hay hay!

      Such a lovely site.


    198. Cactus says:

      Did ye ken this:

      Love the 80’s intro music. 🙂

    199. Cactus says:

      Check the pure nick of this:

      Scotland needs to get away from these crazies.

      Roll on iScotgov.

    200. Tinto Chiel says:

      Morning, Smallaxe, Dullish and cool here, but in a supportive and inclusive way.

      That track reminded me of the big question: why did the lava lamp not linger longer in the ladies’ lavvy in the PRMG?

      It’s a mystery right enuff.

    201. Tinto Chiel says:

      Morning, Smallaxe. Dullish and cool here, but in a supportive and inclusive way.

      That track reminded me of the big question: why did the lava lamp not linger longer in the ladies’ lavvy in the PRMG?

      It’s a mystery right enuff.

    202. Smallaxe says:

      Let’s not lament about the light and lovely lava lamp that languished in the ladies lavvy, lad, I think a light-fingered lag lifted it long ago leaving the ladies in the lavvy lightless and left to light large and little candles.

      Don’t worry, Karma will get them;


    203. Tinto Chiel says:

      Wot the ‘ell, Smallaxe?

      Sorry ’bout the doubler but when I pressed “send” it said I had no internet connection so I pure done it again.

      Awaiting hammers.

      I’ve heard Karma can be a beeatch.

      Eny thotts?

    204. Smallaxe says:


      Check your mail and you’ll understand my thoughts.

    205. Tinto Chiel says:

      I have just opened my e-gander bag and have been humbled by the depth of your thoughts. Have had to employ a mephatorical bathyscaphe to comprehend their profound madgesty.

      Scotland awaits your autobiography with bated breath, particularly the dirty bits.

      P.S. can you sub me a tenner till the end of the month?

      And oblige, etc.

    206. Smallaxe says:

      I’ve very generously sent you 173 dollars (Jamaican) to help you out (about £1) but you really must stop wasting all your money at the bingo.

      As for my autobiography, it will be available in all good charity shops in the fullness of time unless the movie comes out first (working title) “Wtf was I thinking”.

      Please accept my abject apologies for the late reply but I couldn’t be arsed replying earlier.

    207. Archie (not Erchie) says:

      I’m debating whether to write this up…but I wish the gentleman who approached me on the Bannockburn March would identify himself…I mean why would you ask me if I was Rev Campbell yet admitting following Wings since it’s beginning. I’m still puzzling over this.

    208. Thepnr says:

      I met you again on the Bannockburn march though definitely never asked if you were the Rev. So you can rule me out 🙂

    209. Archie (not Erchie) says:

      @ thepnr..yes and ‘hackalumpoff’ but we got separated. It was during that time I was walking alone I was approached by this person. Unfortunately no name, or pics.

    210. Smallaxe says:

      Archie (not Erchie),

      It wisnae me!
      It is a mystery;

    211. Archie (not Erchie) says:

      Yes happy music guys it is a mystery. See you all soon

    212. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Smallaxe: deeply touched by your words. The “couldn’t be arsed” bit really brought a tear to my eye.

      Thanks, bruv.

      Brer Rabbit.

    213. Smallaxe says:

      A’m a silver-tongued devil soaum.

    214. Fred says:

      Ye’re worse than yer sister Archie!

    215. Tinto Chiel says:

      CIJS your posts are becoming increasingly unhinged, Smallaxe. The song is called “Wednesday Morning, 3 a.m.” and yet your date-stamp is 7.29 a.m.


    216. William Wallace says:

      Utter pish. 😉

    217. Smallaxe says:

      I’m well aware that it’s stamped 7:29 am, I’ve been busy since 3 am. Did you want a running commentary?

      You’re warped;

      Quo Vadis

    218. William Wallace says:

      Hey Sma 🙂

      It is pish 😉

      Everybody ready to rumble? Keen my fkin arse. Get these charlatans tae f*** 😉

    219. William Wallace says:

      One to another?

      Whaz up fir direct action? Fkin seek o being nice iy.

      Stir it up.

    220. Smallaxe says:

      The Specials:”A Message To You Rudy”

      Got to think of your future!

    221. William Wallace says:

      Rise up – Rebel 😉

    222. William Wallace says:

      Jimmy Cliff (Full Concert Woodstock 94)

      We can get it if we really want 😉

    223. Tinto Chiel says:

      Just in: Treeza May sings the sensational new Brexit Crash-out Mash-up with Jacob R-M on the glockenspiel:

      Get down, homies.

    224. Smallaxe says:

      ‘May’, I present the new National Anthem;

      A’m Hank Marvin!

    225. Chick McGregor says:

      Some may recall the following personal strategy I suggested here a couple of times.

      Anyway, here it is.

      Today, began the systematic delivery, to my usual leafleting patch for Yes and Indy stuff, of complimentary copies of The National.

      I have ordered 10 copies per day for the next few weeks and today was the first batch delivered.

      There are around 300 addresses in my patch so it will cost me around £240 and some considerable, but IMO well spent, time and effort.

      I fully realise that not all leaflet patch ‘owning’ activists will have the ability to do so and others might consider it a futile exercise.

      In order to make sure the recipients do not, quite logically, assume there has been a paper boy delivery mistake, the following message on a paper ring surrounds each copy:

      “This is a complimentary copy of The National.
      If you decide you like it, it can be bought from your local newsagent or an identical, but much cheaper, digital version can be downloaded on line at https//www.thenational/subscribe/”

      Why 10 copies a day? Well initially I had thought of 4 per day over a longer period but then it occurred to me that the figure per day should be a best guess of the number who might reasonably be expected to become dead tree or digital subscribers. That way there would be minimal disruption to the demand supply cycle.

      It occured to me that only 4 folk out of 300 was perhaps a tad pessimistic.

      Now, of course, the disruption to demand for The National of one solitary effort like my own is not anything they would be concerned about but if the idea is taken up to a significant level of activists then it could be.

      Now I have no way of knowing how many (if any) of ‘my’ 300 might become future subscribers, the 10 figure is just my best guesstimate, might be wildly optimistic or wildly pessimistic, but I felt strongly enough it was worth a try.

      Just putting it out there for others to consider for themselves whether it is a worthwhile strategy.

      In an ideal scenario all indy/yes leafleting area owning activists could ensure every household in Scotland got a free National to read.

      No doubt, I will be able to glean some feedback from my local newsagent in regard to dead tree editions for my solo effort but digital subscription effects would only be known to staff of The National.

      But is there time to await such feedback? would it be statistically valid? or is it time to just go for it?
      Your choice.

      Anyway, here is a pic of the first batch:

    226. William Wallace says:

      Excuse my previous drunken interlude 🙂 Was some party 😉

    227. Smallaxe says:

      Chick McGregor,

      This one’s for you, Chick. Well done, sir. 🙂

    228. Smallaxe says:

      William Wallace,

      I would have come to that party but,

    229. Chick McGregor says:

      Hero or fool and his money? Who knows?

      Anyway, 30 delivered and counting.

    230. Smallaxe says:

      Parov Stelar:”Nobody’s Fool”

    231. Chick McGregor says:


    232. Smallaxe says:

      Hot Chocolate:”Every 1’s a winner”

    233. cearc says:

      Well done, Chick!

      Just seeing mentions of matters that most of the media are ignoring could lead to great things.

      Don’t know if it will boost their sales but it if just sows the seed of questioning in a few minds it will be worth it.

    234. Smallaxe says:

      Tears For Fears:”Sowing The Seeds Of Love”

    235. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi peeps.
      I am currently finishing off a pint of Tennents in the Caledonian Bar in Dingwall, on the way from Plockton to Invergordon,where we are meeting some WOS rogues, before heading to Inverness tomorrow.

      Seeyiz there!

    236. Smallaxe says:

      Bob Marley vs. Funkstar De Luxe:”Sun Is Shining”

    237. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      As we left the car an hour ago, external temp was 31 degrees.

    238. Sarah says:

      @Chick McGregor 12.15 a.m. – an excellent and generous initiative. I’m definitely thinking about trying in a patch I did recently where there is a concentration of pension age folk – not that I’m saying they were No voters [our polling district was 59% Yes] but they will have a bit more time to look at the paper and then talk about it to other people.

    239. Smallaxe says:

      Brian Doonthetoon,

      You’re in for a treat when you get there, Brian.

    240. Tinto Chiel says:

      In Nairn planning my Inverness approach from the east. Hotter than the Earl of Hell’s Brinylon underpants.

      Been doing some strategic thinking for the next referendum. Think we should rework the old women’s temperance motto and get some of our young Beautiful People on a poster saying: “Lips that say No will never touch mine.”

      I have these Grate Thotts sometimes.

      Bit of a curse, sometimes, my genius.

    241. Sarah says:

      Re Smallaxe to BDTT – forecast for Inverness tomorrow is 21 degrees and 40% chance of light rain. We do need the rain but it could have waited a day!!

      The route for the march is lovely – along the riverside to start then over the main road bridge into the main street, so lots of visibility to the public, turn up past the Castle and out to the park.

    242. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      We had Laura, a nice lady from Carnoustie, in the Forward Shop in Dunoon today. She showed us the little cards (#The tartan Pimpernel)she is slipping into copies of the Daily Mail in newsagents. Good idea!
      I’m finding people increasingly confused about Brexit. Probably mirrors the confusion in Westminster. Brendan O’Hara MP dropped in to see us last week. He confirmed this to be the case. Both the Tory and Labour Parties are completely split on the issue. Are we looking a the collapse of the UK?
      In the Scottish contest and the legal case going on in London at the moment I’ve dug up some UN laws which support our case and I’ll mention them in my Roundabout Show on tune in at Argyll Independent Radio from 7pm.

    243. Smallaxe says:

      The man on the moon will be drawing the curtains soon.
      R.E.M.”Man On The Moon”

    244. Cactus says:

      Oot n aboot wae ones Wings brolly, prepared for the expected, lashings earlier, the skies are getting dirtily darker and the lightening and thunder has just begun…

    245. Cactus says:

      Tis a pure deluge ra now, just as well aye got my Wings brolly… and aye feel jolly with ma Wings brolly.

      Blue jeans, blue shirt with a walking shelter.

      Heading for the Wings b…

      Nae fear bikers.

    246. Thepnr says:


      Loving the old tunes. One to add.


      Seek shelter, you will need it!

    247. Thepnr says:

      I’d almost completely forgotten this existed. Definitely never played here before. Good footwork in there 🙂

    248. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Dropping this in before I hit the sack.

      Good luck to all on AUOB Inverness tomorrow.


      Moffat/Hubbert, ‘She Runs’ –

    249. Thepnr says:

      @Ian Brotherhood

      Another definitely never played here before, think you’ve got your authors hat on tonight. T’was good though.

    250. Smallaxe says:

      Eff yuh nyam too much of dis yuh wi get an ache inna yuh belly;

    251. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Thepnr at 12.26

      Echo Beach – One of my all time favs

      Apogolies to slight cock up on my Roundabout show last night. Rabitted on for several minutes about sovereignty with the main mike disconnected.

    252. Cactus says:

      Aye indeed Thepnr, twas a torrent last night, still feeling really muggy awe around. Enjoying watching the march on indylive (stayed local today cause I’m heading to a birthday party soon.)

      Any word up on the turnout for Inverness?

      Fire in the belly… aye, ah’ve got it in spades like hehe. 😉

      PASSION X.

    253. Tinto Chiel says:

      Thankful the rain held off today for The Righteous.

      At least we got to march through the centre of Inverness, past the wee Britnat with the manky Union Jackstika jaiket and his sombre pal who assaulted the pregnant Yes lady in 2014. Lots of tourists seemed to find us beautiful and photo-worthy.

      The march went on forever after the climb behind the castle through the empty bourgeois parts of Inversneckie and my handler and I had to bail out before the park, unfortunately.

      Do we have a figure for today? I thought about 5000, based on my diddy team expertise 😛

      Heard this old thing as we assembled pre-march and still like it:

    254. Sarah says:

      Cactus, Tinto: the organisers told us 14,000. It certainly made a fine show crossing the bridge and bystanders seemed to enjoy seeing us.

      It was a good day with a great atmosphere – everyone pleasant and good-humoured. Lovely company to spend the day with.

    255. cearc says:

      Hey, TC,

      Where were you? Didn’t see you around the wings stall. Mr. Nana went off looking for you. Don’t know if he found you as I didn’t see him again.

    256. hackalumpoff says:

      Hi cearc, yesbot, highland wifie, x-sticks, crazycat, ruglonian, richard Ronnie & team, great to see you all today.

      I went looking in the undergrowth for TC but seems he is MIA
      or is he MI5?

      Smallaxe – sitrep please.

    257. Cactus says:

      14,000 plus, that’s excellent, good show Scotland, thanks Sarah x.

      Ah reckon the Edinburgh auob march will be massive like.

      Mibbies even more marchers than Glasgow eh…?

      100,000 plus is a realistic target.

    258. Sarah says:

      I think you could be right about the numbers that could be on the Edinburgh march, Cactus. I think a lot of people are now seeing what a liability Westminster system is and want out.

    259. Tinto Chiel says:

      Dear Soffisticates: kept on walking up ayont the castle but gave up at 1450 ‘cos had to get back home for fambly ceilidh @ 1900.

      @Hackalumpoff: will keep goods till next time 😛 “And venus guards the horned moon.”

      Ken whit ah’m sayin’?

      Sorry to disappoint all The Laydees: well, they’re only human…

    260. hackalumpoff says:

      @ Tinto
      The Brochan is coming to the boil, put more peat on the fire man!

      Enjoy the Ceilidh

      Check your eamil re the moon.

    261. X_Sticks says:


      Great day in Inverness yesterday. As hackalumpoff says there were quite a few wingers there and always good to catch up though you never seem to have enough time at the rallies – by the time you get round everyone and say hello it’s time to go round them all again to say cherio!

      Aye, numbers bandied were 14k which is amazing for Inverness. Not the easiest or cheapest places to get to.

      Some of the wingers seemed to be suffering from an excess of heiland hospitality courtesy of Nana and Norman on Friday night ;). You know who you are.

      Next up is Dundee on the 18th Aug. Let’s try to get it punted on the soshul meeja and get numbers out for that.

      As Cactus says Edinburgh will be the biggie I think, but try to get to Dundee if you can folks.

    262. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Smallaxe –

      Thanks for that GSH link, haven’t heard that album before so I’m going to listen to it for the rest of the day to escape the utter madness going on over on MT and Twitter.

      Looks like the BBC Scotland high heid yins have finally shown their hand. Fight or flight time…

    263. Cactus says:

      Aye, dates for yer diary…

      – Pacific Quay Plantation BBC/STV rally (11/08/18)
      – AUOB Dundee (18/08/18)
      – AUOB Edinburgh (06/10/18)

      Digital countdown clocks to follow…


    264. Cactus says:

      Woooft, turning out to be a wacky week! Go WingsScotland!

      Allow me to reiterate and instate where it at like, ye ken alert readers like, courtesy of the groovy teachings (plural) of Jacky Blacky:

      With warmest regards,

      Aussi, Hey iScot’s Maurice… ah like the new cover, Slavey-Davey Mundell and his wee flag hehe. 🙂

      Ahm drinkin’ a Pina-Colada in Portugal ra now like, hey perception!

      Good energies on the main threads, tis working.

      Be shocked, it’s normal.

    265. Cactus says:

      NB did anybuddy else notice the sudden once-again surge of followers on the WingsScotland twitter channel today… and nae wonder like.

      Glasgow is games city from the 02/08/18 for a weeknabit.

      Mon over.

    266. Cactus says:

      Haha, ah never have been that good at fishing.

      This should make more sense eh?

      Kind regards,

      It’s been a long year… on the PRock radio ra now.

    267. Cactus says:

      It’s that time again Scotland,

      Twinkle twinkle on yer Harp:

      It’s a sing-a-long Scotland.

      NB see that cold shiver runnin’ down yer neck.. it’s called, endorphins like.

      Good to see ye posting too HT.

    268. Cactus says:

      Scorpions – We Built This House

      Yer house is yer HOME.

    269. Cactus says:

      Just a little bit beyond the Midnight Special +1:

      Sittin’ in at… 13,246,351 views like.

      Go the Scotland Express!

      Woo! Woo!

    270. Cactus says:

      Rev says:

      “Amazingly, I still haven’t even had an email telling me the account’s terminated.”

      SO much for their Standard Operating Procedures eh…

      Aye and surely aye with all this high profile attention over Wings Over Scotland, this should encourage an official public statement from all thy accusee’s, in light of the facts.

      Bad to the bone radio.

      Shine a light!

    271. Cactus says:

      Gaun furrit…

      Chuck us an egg like?

      (headphones recommened.)

    272. Cactus says:

      And furthermore Scotland…

      12 fucking days remaining to go j’aime.

      To all Wingers Xx.

    273. Cactus says:

      Make that eleven.

      That was a funny good suggestion somebuddy made to get loads of Rev masks printed off for the next BBC/STV protest.

      Last day of July ’18:

      Rarin’ tae go now. 🙂

    274. Cactus says:

      Did you ever see this…

      Titled ~ Animals Can Be Jerks Compilation:

    275. Fred says:

      Folks, James & Texas playing at the Party at the Palace, Linlithgow Aug’ 11th.

    276. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      The Proclaimers doing the official opening of the refurbished Queens Hall in Dunoon on Friday.

    277. Tinto Chiel says:

      Soffyquiet in here, so I’m going to leave this little earworm for you all:

      Hope you’re on the mend, Smallaxe.

    278. CameronB Brodie says:

      It would appear that the BBC fears this site. Good. Democracy can not survive media censorship and manipulation.

      The Role of the Media in the Construction of Public Belief and Social Change


      The media play a central role in informing the public about what happens in the world, particularly in those areas in which audiences do not possess direct knowledge or experience. This article examines the impact the media has in the construction of public belief and attitudes and its relationship to social change. Drawing on findings from a range of empirical studies, we look at the impact of media coverage in areas such as disability, climate change and economic development. Findings across these areas show the way in which the media shape public debate in terms of setting agendas and focusing public interest on particular subjects. For example, in our work on disability we showed the relationship between negative media coverage of people on disability benefit and a hardening of attitudes towards them. Further, we found that the media also severely limit the information with which audiences understand these issues and that alternative solutions to political problems are effectively removed from public debate. We found other evidence of the way in which media coverage can operate to limit understanding of possibilities of social change. In our study of news reporting of climate change, we traced the way that the media have constructed uncertainty around the issue and how this has led to disengagement in relation to possible changes in personal behaviours. Finally, we discuss the implications for communications and policy and how both the traditional and new media might help in the development of better informed public debate.

      Keywords: media, social change, policy, climate change, disability, economy

      Understanding Media and Culture: An Introduction to Mass Communication

      The mass media, democracy and the public sphere

      Chapter 2 The mass media, democracy and the public sphere

      In this chapter we explore the role played by the mass media in political participation, in particular in the relationship between the laity and established power. There is a long-running debate in media theory over the ways in which the media not only disseminate elite, critical opinion but also influence the formation, expression and consumption of public opinion (Halloran, 1970; Lang and Lang, 1968). How far do the mass media provide a public sphere in which citizens may debate issues in a democratic forum and in which those in power may be held accountable to the public? In this chapter we examine the way television is responding to economic and regulatory pressures to move from a public service model towards a market model (Blumler, 1992; Collins et al. 1986; Garnham, 1990; Qualter, 1991); the media are changing their relation to political processes.

      These changes affect the relationship between ordinary people and elite representatives of established power. There is a concern in liberal democracies about having an involved public. Here we are interested not so much in the degree of involvement but in different types of involvement. There is a difference between an elite democracy where communication between established power and the laity takes the form of dissemination from the powerful and the representation of ordinary beliefs as mass opinion, and a participatory democracy where established power is engaged in some kind of dialogue with the public. Recently this debate has centred on how to conceive of the role of the citizen in modern western democracies….

    279. CameronB Brodie says:

      For the attention of Baron Hall of Birkenhead.

      Critical Media Literacy, Democracy, and the Reconstruction
      of Education

      Cultural and Media Studies

      While media education has evolved from many disciplines, an important arena of theoretical work for critical media literacy comes from the multidisciplinary field of cultural studies. This is a field of critical inquiry that began decades ago in Europe and continues to grow with new critiques of media and society. From the 1930s through the 1960s, researchers at the Frankfurt Institute for Social Research used critical social theory to analyze how media culture and the new tools of communication technology induce ideology and social control. In the 1960s, researchers at the Centre for Contemporary Cultural Studies at the University of Birmingham added to the earlier concerns of ideology with a more sophisticated understanding of the audience as active constructors of reality, not simply mirrors of an external reality.

      Applying concepts of semiotics, feminism, multiculturalism, and postmodernism, a dialectical understanding of political economy, textual analysis, and audience theory has evolved in which media culture can be analyzed as dynamic discourses that reproduce dominant ideologies as well as entertain, educate, and offer the possibilities for counterhegemonic alternatives (see Kellner, 1995)….

      Media & Open Societies
      Media and Democracy

      What is Really Required?

      Media, pluralism and democracy: what’s in a name?

    280. Ghillie says:

      Didn’t want to disrupt the main thread:

      The Royal College of Midwives have now issued a new statement that Baby Boxes should be universally available throughout the UK!!!

      Again, as ever, our Scottish Government leads the way 🙂

    281. hackalumpoff says:



      Beat that Tinto.

      Never tried an instagram linky, hope it works.

    282. Tinto Chiel says:

      “Beat that Tinto.”

      Impossible, hackalumpoff, not even with a big stick.

      I was going to go to bed but I feel so queasy now at the sight of that wee object I’ll have to stay up until my inner Vlad The Impaler subsides.


    283. Cactus says:

      Where do we begin..

      Welcome to ye Wings Over Scotland new readers.

      Are you alert yet..?

      Be shocked like, it’s really SO FUCKING normal.

      Love the fuck.

      Fuck the side threads, ahm in Peru on the Irn Bru stu, hey perception like… do U really believe aye am where?

      Karma is cool.

    284. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Anyone remember oneironaut, lately of this parish?

      Bumped into him t’other day and he was asking if we were still going. Ah says ‘aye’, he says ‘good’.

      Just thought I’d convey his good wishes…

      Slainte to all absent friends.


    285. Tinto Chiel says:

      I remember the name, Ian, and a groovy gravatar, perhaps? Tell him to get back on here, please. Need all the help we can get.

      For some reason, this sprang to mind:

    286. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @TC –


      That’s proper memory-lane material for me, shudder to think last time I heard it but it’s definitely familiar…

      Ye’d never imagine they were around same time as Bowie was doing his Space Oddity stuff…or maybe they were doing it before him?

      Oneironaut was at the first ‘big’ WOS social, in Glasgow, Counting House, April 4th 2014. Oor ain Crazycat will remember him. He was also a stalwart in Ayrshire SSP, one of the crowd who got the branch up and going again after years in the doldrums. Come rain or shine, yea, even in the bleak fekkin Irvine midwinter he was there and I’ll always remember and admire him hugely for that.

      Can only echo what you said about him coming back – if I do happen to see him again anytime soon I’ll convey that message.


    287. Smallaxe says:

      Ian Brotherhood,

      Ian, scroll up to the first comment on this page and then hand in your Alert reader badge. 🙂

      Pay Attention!

    288. CameronB Brodie says:

      It appears the BBC is considering it’s next move. This should be interesting. Which does the BBC view as the most important of it’s Charter duties, supporting the yoonion or it’s role as public educator? 😉



      This dissertation consist of five articles: 2. Habermas and the Problem of Indoctrination, 3. Reviving the Gadamer-Habermas Debate in the Context of Theory of Indoctrination, 4. Between Facts and Norms – Action Research in the Light of Jürgen Habermas’s Theory of Communicative Action and Discourse Theory of Justice, 5. Teaching and the Dialectic of Recognition, and 6. Critical Adult Education and the Political-Philosophical Debate between Nancy Fraser and Axel Honneth. Articles 4 and 5 are written together with docent Hannu L.T. Heikkinen. Articles 2, and 3 deal the question of socialization and indoctrination. Indoctrination can be defined as infiltrating (drilling, inculcating etc.) concepts, attitudes, beliefs, and theories into a pupil’s or student’s mind by passing her free and critical deliberation.

      Form the perspective of the modern Western worldview, the education in accordance with mechanical solidarity can be described with the term indoctrination. Mechanical solidarity prevails in traditional society and socialization in traditional society tends to produce a static form of personality, which I call a traditional personality. Mechanical solidarity means solidarity between those individuals who think alike, act alike, have the same value system, speak the same language, etc. It is intolerant, doctrinaire and prejudiced. In a traditional society, highly individual personalities are perceived as a threat, not as a resource or potential.

      Education and socialization in this traditional – i.e. indoctrinative –
      sense does not aim at an individual and autonomous personality. It aims at traditional persons who think, speak, act, believe, etc. alike, and fear and dream the same things. In a traditional society, there is only one model of good life, and education is based on that model. According to Durkheim, in a society of mechanic solidarity there is very little room for individual thinking – that is, individual consciousness. In modern societies, identities are open to a certain extent. In a modern society, educational institutions leave or at least should leave the identity of an individual open. Modern personality is a kind of person who is capable of forming a critically reflective relation to tradition and can to a certain extent critically evaluate interpretations that the tradition consists of. The basic claim in the critical theory of sociology of education is that indoctrinative education prevents the formation of the modern personality and thus also prevents social criticism and critique of ideology.

      The problem when educating modern personality is following: Where does autonomy come from if young pupils are not communicatively competent to critically evaluate the content of tradition? If critical learning requires critical evaluation and reflection of the tradition, a communicatively incompetent learner is unable to learn critically. Through what kind of learning process is a critical and communicatively competent subject formed? Asking this question is the same as asking how Bildung is possible. For this purpose, I have constructed a model of communicative teaching which tries to preserve the idea of critical learning while recognizing the authority of the teacher and tradition.

      I define communicative teaching as including the value orientations by which the teacher commits herself to the “universal” presuppositions of argumentation and acts in accordance with these maxims as to the best of her ability. The phrase “as to the best of her ability” is needed because the pedagogical relationship can never be “symmetrical”. The best a teacher can do is to act as if the pupils were communicatively competent speakers. Of course, the pupils aren’t fully communicatively competent speakers, and that is why communicative teaching can never be the same as communicative action in the Habermasian sense. Nevertheless, a teacher must make an effort to orientate her actions towards communicative action and not towards strategic action. I claim that pedagogical communication is a kind of simulated communicative action and it is more simulated in the early stage of education.

      Keywords: Critical theory, indoctrination, communicative teaching, recognition in education, democracy in education, action research, critical adult education.

    289. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Smallaxe –


      Must apologise, I’m just not keeping up these days.

      Hope you’ve been enjoying all the shenanigans over on the MT these past few days. Quite extraordinary stuff.

      Strange days indeed!


    290. cearc says:

      I hope you told oneironaut to start posting again. It is a shame that so many ‘old names’ have stopped posting.

    291. Cactus says:

      Ahm in, an this seems apt WOS WINS again:

      And that’s a capital fucking O, writers!

      We understood like?

      Get groovy. 😉


    292. Cactus says:

      Magnificent like:

      Sing-a-long if ye ken ra words like x.

      WOS, sponsored by ra BBC.

      Ahhhhh hahahahaha.

      That’s funny. 😉


    293. Smallaxe says:

      Ian Brotherhood,

      Some more Bonzo Dog Doo Da?
      “The Strain”

    294. Cactus says:

      Haha bloomin moomin heck… one wiznae even in J.R.Hartley mode last night, yet some body appears to have gone and launched and landed themselves oot of the watter, all by themselves again, tackle not required. This is SO much fun. 😉

      Ahm thinking mibbies a double-bluffer for effect.

      This is comedy gold, thx.

      Silver hook like?

    295. Cactus says:

      As soon as Nicola announces the date for our independence referendum day, lots of familiar posters names will re-appear overnight.

      Some people only post when the main event is ON.

      Enjoy yer Sunday y’all.

    296. Cactus says:

      Hey Smallaxe, liked the pedestrian crossing with 4 walkers.

      Or mibbies go for a hammer hook:

      Lookin’ out for the good Dr…

      Main event comin’ soon.

    297. Smallaxe says:


      Keep on keeping on, my friend.

      This is where they got their name;
      Muddy Waters:”Rollin’ Stone”

    298. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @cearc –

      Sorry for slowness of response…

      I’ve often tried to persuade G (oneironaut) to return and he did, once, briefly. But his heart really isn’t in it any more. He took the indyref result very badly and never quite got over it.

      But he’s a smart cookie and knows what’s best for his own health and sanity, so that’s why he left us. And I must say, he looked well t’other day.

      Who knows? Perhaps he still comes here just to read what’s happening, and if so? he’ll see these comments and know that he’s missed.


    299. cearc says:

      No doubt inspired by the MT, this has been my ear-worm all day.

    300. Fred says:

      Smallaxe, greetings kid! How is the Duke doin?

    301. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. gender “blank slatism” (the belief that human psychological traits, cognitive abilities, and behavior are all learned). I don’t see how that is possible, though I do acknowledge society does influence the gender roles we adopt.

      Biological Theories of Gender

      People often get confused between the terms sex and gender. Sex refers to biological differences between males and females. For example, chromosomes (female XX, male XY), reproductive organs (ovaries, testes), hormones (oestrogen, testosterone).

      Gender refers to the cultural differences expected (by society / culture) of men and women according to their sex. A person’s sex does not change from birth, but their gender can.

      In the past people tend to have very clear ideas about what was appropriate to each sex and anyone behaving differently was regarded as deviant.

      Today we accept a lot more diversity and see gender as a continuum (i.e. scale) rather than two categories. So men are free to show their “feminine side” and women are free to show their “masculine traits”.

      The biological approach suggests there is no distinction between sex & gender, thus biological sex creates gendered behavior. Gender is determined by two biological factors: hormones and chromosomes….

      Gender differences in the classroom

      Gender Sensitive Adult Education: Critical Perspective


      This article aims to foster a reflection on the meaning of gender in adults’ learning, considering gender as a social order that is entrenched in daily relations, no matter the domain of life under analyses. As the research shows, it cannot be any longer ignored that being a man or a woman creates a different approach of the learner towards the situation of learning, mainly because formal, informal and non-formal contexts of learning tend to be congruent with a set of messages based on gender stereotypes that can be prejudicial to the individual’s development. The experiences related to gender influence the way knowledge is acquired, the expectations people make about themselves, the choices of learning subjects and their self-confidence in learning. The use of gender lenses to deconstruct such learned norms should be included in the field of adult education as a way of promoting (social) subjectivity of contemporary adult learners.

      Keywords: gender; adult learning; adult education; gender stereotypes; gender lenses; subjectivity of a learner

    302. Cactus says:

      Cheers for my August ’18 issue of iScot magazine Ken.

      Noticed that cover page Ruth, looks a bit like Rocky now:

      Ruth Davidson, politician, is a fool.

      Defi’not’ely not a Xena WP.

      Slightly Sambora’ish. 🙂

    303. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. British antisemitism in an age of Anglo-American neo-liberalism, as reported by the predominantly right-wing media. This issue will always be weaponised to hurt those who support social inclusiveness. Degeneration theory and subsequent ‘eugenics’ thinking of the Victorian era, has many contemporary legacies, most notably British exceptionalism/racism, (see Tories in general, for a boak).

      N.B. Neo-liberalism is bad, mk.

      Whitehall and the Jews, 1933-1948: British Immigration Policy, Jewish Refugees and the Holocaust

      ….London’s work follows in the line of those more critical of Britain’s role in the Holocaust, most notably Martin Gilbert, Tony Kushner and David Cesarani.(21) In fact, Cesarani and Kushner are able to lay claim to a new school of thought on Anglo-Jewish relations.(22) In his work Kushner has advanced the argument that Britain’s claim to be a liberal, tolerant country is not true. A form of antisemitism lies at the heart of Britain’s liberality in that there is a desire in British society for the Jews to assimilate and, when they choose not to, they are viewed as problematic, which is an argument with which London would certainly concur. She begins her work by stating that between 1933 and 1948 Britain held a consistent line on limiting Jewish immigration (p2). Refugees would be assisted only if it was in the interests of Britain, a concept that holds true today if the attitude taken by many towards the current issue of asylum is considered. Thus, while Britain would ‘tolerate’ a certain amount of immigration for humanitarian reason, this ‘toleration’ was limited by several interlinked factors….

      ‘The man who hated Britain’ – the discursive construction of ‘national unity’ in the Daily Mail


      In 2013, the British right-wing tabloid Daily Mail triggered a fierce controversy, focused on antisemitism and patriotism/nationalism. It was sparked by the publication of an article on the British economist Ralph Miliband with the provocative headline ‘The man who hated Britain’. The lead refers to Ed Miliband, then leader of the British Labour Party: ‘Ed Miliband’s pledge to bring back socialism is homage to his Marxist father. So what did Miliband Snr really believe in? The answer should disturb everyone who loves this country’. In this paper, we analyse how Ralph Miliband is discursively constructed as a dangerous ‘Other’ and subsequently politically instrumentalised in a campaign against his son, Ed Miliband. We focus on how a particular concept of national unity is constructed with reference to the stereotype of the ‘disloyal, intellectual, international Jew’. This figure emerges as the ‘Iudeus ex machina’ in the scenario of impending doom in order, we assume, to distract attention from structural issues facing British society and economy. In our analysis we tackle the complex interdependencies of – mostly coded – antisemitic and nationalist rhetoric with the help of an interdisciplinary framework that integrates approaches to antisemitism, nationalism, media studies, and critical discourse studies, and related methodologies.

      KEYWORDS: Antisemitism, nationalism, national identity, Labour Party, UK, Daily Mail, critical discourse-analysis, discourse-historical approach, calculated ambivalence, coded antisemitism

      Report reveals the complex nature of antisemitism in the UK

      A study by the Institute for Jewish Policy Research finds that while only 2.4 per cent of the British public are hard-core Jew-haters, 30 per cent have antisemitic attitudes of ‘different intensities’

      An unprecedented study of antisemitism has found that views which could be described as hard-core Jew-hate are held by no more than 2.4 per cent of the British public.

      This country remains one of the best places in the world for Jews to live, with hatred aimed at the community among the lowest recorded internationally….

    304. Thepnr says:

      Found a tune for Dominic Raab our new Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union.

      Don’t think he’ll have heard this one on Off Topic 🙂

    305. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. greedy fuckers such as Jim Ratcliffe. What can you say, other than scum does tend to float to the top of the barrel. Bet he’s a Tory, who tend to oppose any form of social equity, as a matter of principle. Forty years living under a paradigm of neo-liberal indoctrination, certainly has had a long-term impact on British culture, IMHO. Not a positive one, frankly. 😉

      Critical perspectives on taxation

      Tax matters. Globally, it touches the lives of every citizen and economic entity, sometimes in ways we do not fully appreciate. Despite this, tax has not received the intellectual attention it deserves from accounting scholars and indeed is often marginalized by other apposite ?elds of enquiry such as political science, law and social policy. The reasons for this marginalization are somewhat obscure, and this generalized ‘othering’ of tax varies in extent from country to country. It may in part be a consequence of the extent to which tax in its practical application is controlled by professional bodies, be they accounting or law. It may suit the professions to keep tax safely within its technical box; a convenient lie to keep prying eyes from closely examining the hidden power plays at work. The fragmentation of tax as a ?eld of enquiry across a variety of academic disciplines arguably makes this marginalization more likely. Nor can there be any doubt that tax is widely underrepresented in university teaching programs, particularly in countries such as the UK where tax may not even form part of the curriculum at undergraduate level….


      Tax avoidance and benefit manipulation

      Views on its morality and prevalence

      There has been a sharp shift in the perceived prevalence of benefit manipulation but people are more likely to think this is wrong than tax avoidance….

    306. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Thepnr –

      What a blast from the past that was – honestly can’t remember last time I heard that, and what a great wee song.

      There’s brilliant footage of EC onstage with Ian Dury on the Stiff Tour, way back, they’re all together to do Sex & Drugs & Rock & Roll as the finale and he looks absolutely terrified. I’ll see if I can find it.

      Have a great weekend mister, and abody else too.


    307. Cactus says:

      Hehe tune for tomorrow:

      BBC is community property: 😉

      Ring-ding: (12,645 views)

      Less than 1 day remaining to go.

      🙂 like y’all.

    308. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Thepnr –

      Nah, couldn’t find it. Paula Rose probably has it, or saw it first-hand!

      You got a link Paula?

      In the meantime, here’s ID & The Blockheads doing their Peel seesion, maybe recorded around the same time as the Stiff tour, certainly same year. What a great tight band it was. Soo-perb!

    309. Cactus says:

      Evening Bro Brotherhood 🙂

      Here’s one for Paula Rose…


      Jukebox on FP.

    310. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Cactus –

      See you tomorrow then mister?

      So sorry I missed you at Stirling – for a fair bit of the march (the hilly bit in the scheme) your hat was visible but I never quite caught up with you, then never saw you again that day, had to bolt fairly early.

      Catch-up tomorrow big man.



    311. Cactus says:

      You betcha bro bud, ah’ve headed out to the southside for one or twa furrabit, was getting too excited indoors re ra morra, pure agro like.

      See ye at Glasgow’s Millennium Bridge high noon.

      Clutha sounds groovy fur afters. 😉

      BBC Hahahahaha!

    312. William Wallace says:

      I can’t make tomorrow but, I hope you all have a good day/night and hopefully I’ll catch some of you in Dundee next week.

      Stuff yir licence BBC

    313. cearc says:

      Have a great time at PQ today, folks.

    314. Thepnr says:

      Sorry that I can’t be with you at PQ today but will be watching on Independence Live.

      Hope to see many of you in Dundee next week which should be a great day and I think a really big turnout should be expected.

    315. Tinto Chiel says:

      I was talking today to fellow intellectuals/Wings Brains’ Trust members at the Pathetic Quay event today, to wit crazycat, Cactus, Ian B and X_Sticks.

      We were discussing sleekit BBC propaganda and its all-pervasive nature. I remembered a TV programme I had watched at my daughter’s while awaiting a delivery which summed it all up for me.

      It was about Shackleton’s expedition to Antarctica, which was being described in hushed Empire-orgasmatronic terms by some officer-class Tim-Nice-But-Dim-chiel who really began to get on my nazzums as he told his story.

      My attention was drawn to the “villain” of the piece, one Harry McNish/McNeish, the expedition Scottish master joiner from Port Glasgow, who refused to trek over the ice after Endurance became lodged in the pack-ice, arguing the party should set up camp and wait until the ice-floe floated them to open water.

      Shackleton apparently responded to this challenge to his authority by threatening to shoot Harry, so the men tried for a day to drag all their equipment over the ice. This resulted in only one mile being travelled, so Shackleton had to abandon his plan and make camp, as McNish had originally suggested.

      Harry must have really annoyed them: he was an avowed socialist and a member of the United Free Church who abhorred the appalling swearing and casual blasphemy of Shackleton’s crew. Worst of all, he insisted in speaking in his “rasping” Scottish accent.

      For all this, he was an amazing joiner, who could produce splendid work sometimes by eye rather than measurement. He got the men playing football to maintain morale and fashioned goalposts for them.

      One they reached open water (as he had predicted), he suggested cannibalising two of the three lifeboats to strengthen the remaining James B. Caird for the dangerous voyage to South Georgia. He built up the sides of the latter boat, strengthened the bow and caulked sails to stretch over the open boat to protect the men below chosen for the voyage.

      Shackleton selected Harry as one of these, supposedly because he thought he might foment rebellion if he had left him behind on the ice-sheet with the remaining men. A cynic might suggest it was because he knew McNish’s skills would essential for survival.

      The expedition, against the odds, eventually reached the whaling station on South Georgia, surviving the appalling seas, and all because of McNish’s efforts.

      To top it all, Shackleton refused to decorate Harry with the Polar Medal, something which has been challenged in recent years when a posthumous award for him received a lot of support.

      My further research showed that Shackleton, when Endurance had to be abandoned, had insisted that McNish’s cat be shot to “save weight”, something for which Harry never forgave him.

      In short, imo McNish saved the expedition, but being a proletarian Scottish type, this could never be admitted and the myth of Shackleton had to be constructed. The latter’s expedition was ultimately as useless as Scott’s, only it didn’t produce as many casualties. “Only” three men from the Ross Island party died (something not mentioned in most accounts).

      Poor Harry filled a pauper’s grave in NZ until quite recently, when a fine headstone and memorial cat was placed over his resting place.

    316. Thepnr says:

      @Tinto Chiel

      Thanks for the story, I’d never heard of Harry. I think I need to read more history, something sadly lacking in my education.

    317. Tinto Chiel says:

      My pleasure, Alex. Harry was quite a man but it’s the Establishment wot writes history most of the time and that’s the problem.

      Mind you, yon quantum physics is a bit of a head-scratcher, eh?

      Unfortunately, won’t get to Dundee to make it five in a row owing to a prior social engagement. Hope to meet you in Embra.

    318. Thepnr says:

      @Tinto Chiel

      Will definately see you in Embra, I’ve already booked somewhere for Saturday and am going with the wife. This has the potential to be the biggest EVER march in Scotland.

      I hope Alex Salmond will come along and speak at the finish in Holyrood. I think he will, let’s see.

      @Ian Brotherhood

      i tried to find that Stiff tour but no joy, instead I stumbled upon this German version of TOTP from 1978.

      Loved it, if your my age then probably the best year for music.

    319. Tinto Chiel says:

      My witterings on Harry reminded me of this Great Scot, another one whose Polar Medal was held by a petty and vindictive establishment. It’s the Union Dividend, don’t ya know?

      Hope hackalumpoff likes it.

    320. yesbot says:

      Happy glorious 12th to all! Game over for Scotland’s inglorious ‘greedy’ estates?

      Good day yesterday @ #BBCSwithOff which turned into a fab, informal Wings ‘night-oot’. Thanks for your company brilliant Wingers! Really loved it, see you all in Dundee 18th.

    321. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Tinto Chiel.

      Re your interest in WS Bruce and matters polar maritimus.

      You may find this thread an interesting read:-

      (I think I’ve linked to it here in the past.)

    322. Tinto Chiel says:

      Re WSB, I meant to say “was withheld”.

      Haven’t seen that material before, Brian, so thanks. Life on a whaler seems like Hell on Earth to me, so I don’t know how those men did it.

      I have a vague memory of coming across some footage of one of the last Scottish whalers (late ’60s?) on YT. Think it had a red hull.

      Won’t make it to Yes City owing to a family thing but it will be Embra a gogo in October.

    323. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Thepnr –

      Just watched that episode of Arte.


      The Three Degrees were hot stuff sho nuff…


    324. William Wallace says:

      Was looking through my twitter feed when this photo popped up with a rather suspicious looking character in the background 😉

    325. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Dundee march for independence, Saturday 18th August, route map and bus info (scroll down from map for info).

    326. Fred says:

      @ Tinto, interesting stuff, Shackleton somewhat less than a hero? Expedition geologist James Wordie from a Glasgow haulage family. Wordie’s had possibly the biggest stables in Scotland. A gt uncle of mine was a cairter with Wordie’s.

      Biog, “Polar Crusader!” Sir James Wordie.

    327. Tinto Chiel says:

      Never heard of the Wordie family, Fred, but that’s most interesting. The geologist one was certainly never mentioned in Sandhurst Boy’s encomium of ES (subtext: never trust them pesky krassivy Jocks) in the prog wot I saw.

      I have got to the stage now where I never believe anything from the Establishment media unless I can verify it for myself. I was saying to an esteemed Winger only recently that I removed various titles by Max Hastings and Andrew Roberts from my shelves because of their lies and distortions during the referendum campaign (and “novelist” C J Samson and his nasty, dismissive hatred of us).

      My reasoning was how could I trust their judgment on military history when I knew how they had spread lies and distortions a gogo on Scottish independence?

      Question everything, ya bass.

      Stop press: heard No-voting Alex Mcleish say on Radio Shortbread how gut-wrenching it was for Scotland to fail to qualify for the last world cup.

      Oh, the irony! Make mine a White Tornado.

      *Bites carpet and makes gurgling noises*

    328. Fred says:

      @ Tinto,

    329. Tinto Chiel says:

      Fred: do I need a https:// in front of that?

    330. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi T. Chiel.

      Links given like that will work if you highlight it – in this case from “m” to the last “p” – then drag it up to an empty space on your tab bar and release.

      Here it is onnyhoo.

      RE: Shackleton. You may find this of interest.

      Here’s an example from that site:-

      You can get some info on Caird and his philanthropy and research funding here:-,_1st_Baronet,_of_Belmont_Castle

    331. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi T. Chiel.

      Further info…

    332. Tinto Chiel says:

      Hi, BDTT.

      Thanks for all those. I shall muse thereon.

      “World is crazier and more of it than we think.”

    333. William Wallace says:

      That’s me getting ready to head “up the road” ( ) for the Dundee gathering. Wouldnae mind meeting some of you that I’ve not yet met and those I already have.

      What’s the parking situation on the green? My mum and a couple of other elderly family members are joining the march for a wee while but, they are not in the best of health so it would be handy if I could drop the car on the green in advance and then drop them all off afterwards.

    334. Thepnr says:

      @William Wallace

      There’s a free council car park at the bottom of Roseangle, maybe only about 40 spaces or so. On street parking around there will be pretty difficult too I would think.

      You could use the Tesco car park on Riverside and then over the railway footbridge back to the Green.

    335. Clapper57 says:

      If anybody in Edinburgh during festival…go and see Kevin Gore & Bobby Nicolson gig ‘Gone Native’ at 6.30pm at Royal Oak…Kevin is a great independence supporter and performs at most AUOB events.

      Normally Kevin performs at Captains Bar Edinburgh where every Wednesday/Thursday he hosts ‘one singer one song’ where he sings/plays and invites other singers/musicians to also play.( during festival not doing Thursday due to Royal Oak show).

      Kevin is a great songwriter and singer and has written brilliant songs about Scottish Independence….I know him and he is a genuinely nice guy….so if you get the chance go see him at festival or if you are in Edinburgh anytime pop into Captain’s Bar to see him.

      Captains Bar Wed – 8.30pm until late…Thursday 6pm to 9pm.

      Note: Captains Bar also has other musicians and one in particular is excellent Gerry Mulvenna…check his Facebook to see when he is on…lovely voice and good songwriter and a nice guy.( his Facebook page shows dates/times when he has shows on at festival ).

      Support Indy singers.

    336. Thepnr says:

      I’m bored, very very bored so I’m going to do a top ten of my personal favourite songs played on Off Topic.

      These will be good even if I do say so myself 🙂

      Straight in at number 10 is one that always makes me smile as the lead singer sorta reminds me of the Rev 🙂

    337. Thepnr says:

      I’ll bet you didnae expect this to be number 9!

      So why did I chose it? It’s a great scene, a 100 year hoodoo was banished and a great number of Scots celebrated and it was nice to watch so much happiness.

    338. Thepnr says:

      So we reach my own personal favourite at number 8, nobody will ever guess the songs I’m going to play next, too diverse to be labelled LOL.

    339. Thepnr says:

      At number 7 the first song from my youth, memories of dark tunnels and lonely platforms working in Londonium.

    340. Thepnr says:

      I did say that these were my personal favourites on Off Topic and not necessarily my favourite songs LOL. Just thoght I’d clear that up. I loved this at number 6 in the run up to the referendum because of the video and mainly the flags 🙂

      Plus she’s a pretty good singer anyway.

    341. Thepnr says:

      Now we’re close to the end you might guess some of these if you have clinked my links in the past as they are all old favourites. So for number 4 we have an old classic also one of Smallaxes favourite groups.

    342. Thepnr says:

      This is us that are still on Wings 4 years after the referendum at number 3.

    343. Thepnr says:

      I have had a bit of a dilemma here in choosing between number 2 and number 1 for my personal top ten from Off Topic. Decisions have to be made though no matter how difficult so this is my number 2.

      It’s a tale of a split up and strikes a chord for me at least about how hard it is to win Independence.

    344. Thepnr says:

      So here I am with my number 1 all time favourite from Off Topic and some of you might have guessed that it’s a Johnny Cash number. Maybe not the one you were thinking of though.

      This one is a warning and even more relevant now than it has ever been. I could have chosen lots more Johnny Cash in my top ten but thought this one would be enough. The message is clear.

    345. Tinto Chiel says:

      Thanks for all that effort, Thepnr: a great selection.

      You’ll turn into Alan Freeman at this rate.

      Surprised you didn’t include this, a favourite of all vile seps:


    346. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Thepnr –

      Haven’t had time to sit and enjoy your selection yet.

      I’m pretty sure I can guess two or three at least but I’ll have a think about it today and then enjoy seeing them tonight with a can in hand.

      Hoots all!


    347. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. antisemetism in the ‘old left’. I don’t deny there are Jew haters and more general racists in the Labour party, but these outlooks are most commonly held by right-wingers. The human mind likes to hold opinions that appear consistent to the individual who holds them.

      Anti-Semitism in Europe before the Holocaust


      It is commonly accepted that the years 1899–1939 represent a highpoint in anti-Semitism in western societies. What factors account for the wave of extraordinary anti-Semitism after 1899? Was the rise of anti-Semitism between 1899 and the Holocaust uneven? Did anti-Semitism vary in content and intensity across societies? Did Germans embrace anti-Semitism differently from French, Italian, Romanian, and British citizens? Data drawn from the annual volumes of the American Jewish Year Book are used to examine these questions systematically. Pooled time-series analyses suggest that variation in anti-Semitism over time and across countries was largely a function of economic conditions and Jewish immigration, and to a limited extent of the rise of leftist parties.

      Keywords Anti-Semitism, Europe, Holocaust, Prejudice

      Palgrave Critical Studies of Antisemitism and Racism

      Observing the ‘Other’: Mass-Observation and ‘Race’

    348. CameronB Brodie says:

      This is one of the dog-whistle issues the far-right, religious fundamentalists and narcissistic Britnats would love to confuse folk over.

      Global Anti-Semitism in World-Historical Perspective: An Introduction

      Abstract: This introduction to the Spring 2009 issue of Human Architecture: Journal of the Sociology of Self-Knowledge begins with a discussion of “The Articulation and Re-Articulation of Anti-Semitism” in a worldhistorical
      perspective, focusing on such topics as “Anti-Semitism in the Longue-Durée,” “Christian Europe’s Final Solutions,” and “Israel and Global Anti-Semitism.” It then follows with a survey of the volume’s articles which were part of an international conference entitled, “The Post-September 11 New Ethnic/Racial Configurations in Europe and the United States: The Case of Anti-Semitism,” organized by Lewis Gordon and Ramón Grosfoguel at the Maison des Sciences de l’Homme (MSH) in Paris on June 29–30, 2007. The two scholars along with Eric Mielants also served as co-editors of this issue. Part of a series inaugurated by a discussion on Islamophobia, the conference brought a majority Jewish group of scholars together in the hope of bringing to the forum a critical exchange and conversation among the participants. The discussion presented in the introduction is not necessarily representative of the views of the scholars included in the collection.

      Antisemitism in contemporary Great Britain
      A study of attitudes towards Jews and Israel

      1. Jewish anxieties and the observed
      levels of antisemitism: at cross-purposes?

      Surveys of attitudes towards Jews have repeatedly shown that antisemitism in the UK remains relatively low when compared to other European countries. For example, in its global survey in 2014, the Anti-Defamation League found only two out of thirty-four European countries to have lower levels of antisemitism than the UK. These findings are corroborated by the 2012 European Union Agency for Fundamental Rights survey of Jewish experiences and perceptions of antisemitism: contrasted with other European Jewish populations, UK Jews are the least worried about antisemitism in their country. Thus, in relative terms, Jewish and non-Jewish perspectives are well aligned. However, in absolute terms, within the British context, they are considerably less so. According to previous Pew surveys, about 7% to 8% of the general population of the UK hold unfavourable opinions about Jews, and the situation has remained at this level since the early 1990s. However, nearly 50% of UK Jews perceive antisemitism to be a problem in the UK, two-thirds believe it to be on the increase, and about 20% report being subjected to antisemitic harassment on an annual basis.4

      Further, the sheer scope of research into antisemitism over the past twenty years or so is indicative of the extent to which it is a matter of considerable communal concern. Marginal topics simply do not generate research activity on this scale. So how does one explain the dissonance between the apparently low levels of antisemitism and the apparently high levels of anxiety about it? Are Jews and non-Jews fundamentally at crosspurposes in relation to antisemitism? Is the Jewish view disproportionate in relation to the real extent of the problem of antisemitism? Could it be that it is coloured by past events, particularly memories of the Holocaust, or by current events, particularly terrorist attacks against Jewish targets in other parts of Europe? Alternatively, could it be that the Jewish perspective is affected by the development of modern communications, including social media, that tend to heighten knowledge and awareness of issues that would have been less noticeable in the past? Or is there something fundamentally flawed in these social
      scientific measurements of antisemitism that fails to adequately capture what is really going on?

      The implications of historical and contemporary anti-Semitism in Glasgow and Scotland for Global Citizenship

      Global Citizenship in Scotland

      Global Citizenship is associated with school education in Scotland (by contrast, Intercultural Education is associated with different forms of post-school education). Citizenship and Global Citizenship were introduced as part of the Scottish Curriculum for Excellence in 2004 (Scottish Executive, 2004). The Curriculum for Excellence is “encapsulated” in four capacities that enable a young person to be : a successful learner ; a confident individual ; a responsible citizen and an effective contributor (Education Scotland, 2016a). A responsible citizen is one who has “respect for others” and has a “commitment to participate responsibly in political, economic, social and cultural life”. Two of the capabilities of a responsible citizen are to “develop knowledge and understanding of the world and Scotland’s place in it” and “understand different beliefs and cultures”. Biesta (2013) points out that, surprisingly, religion is noticeably absent from the core Curriculum for Excellence documents that reference Citizenship or are focused on Citizenship (Learning and Teaching Scotland, 2002 ; Scottish Executive, 2004).

      Citizenship, like the other three capacities, is supposed to be developed through the eight curricular areas in schools (Expressive Arts, Languages, Religious Education, Social Studies, Health and Wellbeing, Mathematics, Sciences and Technologies). Global Citizenship, which is closely connected to Citizenship, is described as being a key context for learning across the Scottish school curriculum (Education Scotland, 2016b). Citizenship and Global Citizenship, then, are not designated as distinct curricular subjects in school education in Scotland. This can be contrasted with the separately funded, governed and structured English school education system (Holt et al., 1999). In England, Citizenship Education was introduced into the National Curriculum in September 2002 (Keating et al., 2010). It became a statutory, discreet and compulsory subject at that time and aims to provide a “high-quality citizenship education (that) helps to provide pupils with knowledge, skills and understanding to prepare them to play a full and active part in society” (Department for Education, 2013).

    349. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @TC –

      Alan Freeman?


      Before my time but only slightly.

      Serious question – would a Scots version of the Hairy Cornflake be a Herty Oatcake?

    350. Tinto Chiel says:

      Actually, that Radio 1 bunch were pretty creepy, Ian. Apart from the obvious monsters like Savile and Jonathan King, a good few others have been accused of very dodgy behaviour, including the sainted John Peel while he was in the USA.

      Fair takes the edge of your nostalgia, innit?

    351. Marie Clark says:

      Hi guys,

      time to myself at last. Big family do this weekend, and busy getting ready for the invasion. I was just playing about on youtube, an I met this. Aw, made me shed a wee tear, but all that hope and energy is still there. We’re in a hold position at the moment, but we’ll a’ be there when the call comes.

      Tinto, how’s Harvey, he seems to be very quiet at the moment, is he okay.

    352. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Marie.

      You may enjoy this version of the same song. It dates back to August 2014, when Chris Law revealed “Spirit of Independence” – in Baxter Park! It features Sheena Wellington and Citizen Smart.

    353. Thepnr says:

      Very rare footage of an episode of Question Time that the BBC pulled for some reason. Can’t think why, the guests were as follows:

      Alan Greenspin – Economist and former Chairman of the Federal Reserve

      Dr David Starkers – Historian and Penderast

      Hugh Jarsenhead – CEO of the bailed out Bank of Legoland

      Gordon Blair – Prime Minister

    354. Marie Clark says:

      Brian DTT, never heard that version before. Sheena Wellington nver lets you down does she. Thanks for that.

    355. Fred says:

      Ah Thepnr, Hugh Jarce rings a bell somewhere? “Round the Horn mebbes?”

    356. Tinto Chiel says:

      I’m afraid Harvey is not in a good mood at the mo, Marie. That picture of Mone the Moan in The National set him off and he’s throwing his carrots about today.

      It’s going to be a long night…

    357. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @TC –

      It certainly does.

      Probably told you this one before but I remember a dude in my secondary school who had made his mind up (we were approx 15 at the time) that he wanted to become a police officer so that he could eventually work his way into the Vice Squad. Then he’d be able to see the real hardcore stuff which, in the late 70s, was not so easily available and, to lads of a certain age, more valuable than diamonds, gold or heroin.

      Don’t know if he ever made it, but the idea that someone like him would be entrusted with the control of such material is more than mildly concerning. Ditto with priests – I know of one guy, first-hand, who spent all those years studying Latin and Greek and heaven only knows what else specifically *because* he’d worked out (from personal experience at the hands of one) that priests get whatever they want, when they want, and no-one will ever dare tell. Again, that was 70s.

    358. Marie Clark says:

      Tinto, poor Harvey, mind you moanin minnie is enough to put anyone in a bad mood. Sympathies, maybe he’ll feel better tomorrow.

    359. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Thepnr –

      Right, that’s me settled, can of Scrumpy cracked.

      Haven’t clicked any of your Top Ten links so far and only scanned the accompanying comments so I honestly don’t know what you’ve selected but I’m bearing in mind that your selection will be different from the O/T Top Ten you collated using your magic gizmo…

      I know that your selection includes Johnny Cash (I did catch that in the comments) but I’m guessing you’ve picked the very poignant one he did near the end (I Hurt Myself…?); Andre Rieu might get a look-in with the big pipe/whistle extravaganza…and that one Paula Rose first submitted called ‘Hurts So Good’ (forget the artist). There’s another one on the tip of me ears I can’t quite catch, something funky but I can’t nail it. As an outside shot I’ll pick the Shakin Stevens/Bonnie Tyler one I posted and you ended-up dancing-to.

      So, now, ahm away scrolling back to find out!

      Cheers and hoots aplenty!


    360. Thepnr says:


      Aye, Hugh Jarce drop us a line just to say hello.

    361. Thepnr says:

      @Ian Brotherhood

      Nowhere close LOL, well mibbee a wee bit close. Tried not to be too obvious and if I choose again next week no doubt some would be dropped and new ones added.

      That then was my top ten last night and tomorrows might be different 🙂

      I’m going to watch them again too just to remind me what they were.

      Hope you enjoy all the same 🙂

    362. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Thepnr –


      That was brilliant mister. Pure brilliant.

      From No 1 down…

      Got the ‘Cash’ wrong, but perhaps a similarly fatalistic one…

      Jim Diamond’s was the one I had ‘on the tip of me ears’.

      Labi Siffre – first time I’ve seen that footage. Brilliant.

      ‘Sittin on The Dock Of The Bay’ – normally I recoil from these multi-artist charity efforts but that was a good one and I remember you and/or Smallaxe posting it.

      Spoon-man doing Faithless was/is a cracker.

      Hadn’t ever seen the Florence & The Machine one, that was weird but brilliant.

      The Jam Down In The Tube? I’ve hardly ever been in London but the first time would’ve been approx 86 and that video looks ‘exactly’ the way I remember it – same colours, mood, everything.

      Ezra – Da dooby dooo…

      Sunshine on Leith – soo-perb. Watched it live that day, tears were aflow.

      Future Islands – what a pick there man. Great.

      So that’s that then, and highly enjoyable it was too, thanks aplenty. I’m terrible at picking things, making lists etc, it would take me a long time to do something similar. Maybe you find it easy? Different strokes for different folks (now there’s cue for a song!)

      Hoots brother, see ye soon.

      X 🙂

    363. Thepnr says:

      @Ian Brotherhood

      No real rhyme or reason but a recurring theme maybe 🙂

      No 10 Futures Island “Seasons change” “People change”

      No 8 George Ezra “Give me one more reason why I should never make a change”

      No 6 Florence “The dog days are over, happiness here it comes”

      No 4 Playing for Change “looks like nothing’s gonna change”

      Top 3 speak for themselves.

      My last one for tonight.

    364. Macart says:

      One of the greats.



    365. Thepnr says:


      Yes she was a great singer. One of her’s played here before is a favourite of mine (another one).

    366. Marie Clark says:

      Mornin one and all, how are we all this fine day.

      You’ll notice I’m feeling quite chirpy today that’s cause it’s my birthday. Made it to the three score years and ten and still standing YAY.I hope to do a bit of damage yet, especially when we win the indyref2.

      Big party tomorrow for the beloved and myself, both big birthdays and the ruby wedding. Might have a sair heid oan Sunay, but that can take care of itself.

      I’ve left you a wee tune. It’s a great favourite of mine and since it’s the birthday, I hope you don’t mind my wee indulgance.

    367. Fred says:

      Happy Birthday Marie

    368. Tinto Chiel says:

      Happy birthday and ruby wedding, Marie. I told Harvey and he has decided to make you a giant carrot cake but he can’t find the SRF. A bit of a mess in the kitchen at the moment.

      I haven’t heard that track since its release and it just reminded me what a great voice Gerry had.

      Btw, don’t read the btl comment from the guy with the initials JJ unless you want to gnash your teeth/ bite the carpet.

      I certainly had to…

    369. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Happy birthday Marie!



    370. Marie Clark says:

      AW shucks guys, thank you for the birthday wishes.

      Tinto, please thank Harvey for his efforts, how did he know that I’m partial to carrot cake. As for JJ, the man’s got no soul, just should enjoy the music, what’s was the point of dragging that shit into it. I’ll let you into a wee secret, I was born and brought up in Paisley and my wee sister went out with Gerry a couple of times, we’d be about seventeen or eighteen , so many years ago. He used to be the singer in a band called The Mavericks and they played the youth clubs and a lot of dances, Good times.

    371. Hackalumpoff says:

      Many happy returns Marie

    372. Tinto Chiel says:

      Top pick, hackalumpoff. Really enjoyed that one.

      How’s the barnacles?

    373. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      I’ll slip “Baker Street” into my online “Roundabout” show at 7pm on Argyll Independent Radio tonight plus,of course Runrig’s Hampden Park “Loch Lomond”.
      Thinking of starting a campaign to get “Scots Wha Hae” reinstated as the round up of the SNP conference.

    374. cearc says:

      Happy celebrations!

    375. CameronB Brodie says:

      @Douglas Alexander
      ?From the perspective of critical public health, I suggest you away an play with yourself, you opportunist fud. The role of the Scottish government is not to mitigate for Westminster’s neoliberal extremes. What is your stance on Scotland being forced to Brexit? Were Scots not promised a new constitutional settlement only a few years ago? Is it only the voting public who have social responsibilities?

      P.S. What sort of impact do you think Brexit will have on the social capital of Scots?

      Understanding marginalization as a social determinant of health


      Population-based studies have drawn attention to the associations between social and material disadvantage and poor mental and physical health over the life course, thereby contributing to inequalities in health. More recently, research in Britain has demonstrated that the effects of such disadvantage are cumulative through childhood and has shown that ‘ethnic minorities’ are at particular risk. This study gathered data from persons at risk, specifically first-generation migrant teenaged girls and their mothers, in Britain and Canada, and identified marginalization as a central feature of their relationships with others. Bourdieu’s theoretical perspective is drawn on to examine the processes that contribute to marginalization and the conditions of broader society that sustain and reproduce them.

      It was the participants’ experience that their potential goes unrecognized, their opportunities to develop new relationships curtailed and possibilities to acquire new competences were eclipsed by others’ assumptions about them. The authors illustrate the social processes that contribute to the creation of tensions between seeking to belong and being assigned to the margins and consider their attendant influences on health. Taking direction from Bourdieu they illustrate ways in which discourses of marginalization and marginalizing practices associated with them can be interrupted, and in so doing work towards redressing processes that create a context for health inequalities.

      Keywords: Marginalization, exclusion, health inequalities, culture and health, Bourdieu, social determinants of health

      Community Psychology: In pursuit of wellness and liberation
      Chapter 13

      Politics, Trust and Networks:
      Social Capital in Critical Perspective

      New Labour: From Communitarianism to Social Capital

      In developing the New Labour repertoire in opposition, and indeed during its first term of office, the Labour party explicitly drew from the communitarian movement in the USA. Deliberately mirroring the language of the Founders of the American Constitution, Amitai Etzioni, the foremost communitarian writer, claims a series of self evident truths which define the need for ‘a new moral, social and public order based on restored communities, without allowing Puritanism or oppression’ (Etzioni 1993:2). The core of this new order was defined in his opening words of the Preface to the 1995 British edition of The Spirit of Community: Communitarians call to restore civic values, for people to live up to their responsibilities and not merely focus on their entitlements, and to shore up the moral foundations of society. (Etzioni 1995:ix)

      This appeal to duty and moral order provided the basis for his definition of community (‘communities are social webs of people who know one another and have a moral voice’ (Etzioni 1995:ix)). As ever (Williams 1983) ‘community’ was largely defined by Etzioni by its negation: ‘increasing rates of violent crime, illegitimacy, drug abuse, children who kill and show no remorse and, yes, and political corruption’, with America being seen as subject to ‘moral anarchy and the crumbling of social institutions (Etzioni 1995:x). The communitarian agenda was rapidly adopted and adapted in Britain by the Labour Party after its traumatic 1992 General Election defeat. In 1994 a collection of essays Reinventing the Left was published (edited by David Miliband, now Minister for Schools’ Standards) seeking to re-launch the Left which ‘needs a radical and new identity if it is to do more than rail against the (many injustices) of the present’ (Miliband 1994:2).

      One of the key essays was by Gordon Brown (now Chancellor of the Exchequer) who proposed A New Agenda for Labour (Brown 1994). The new popular socialism proposed by Brown was to rest on four foundations: a redistribution of power away from ‘entrenched interests and unjust accumulations of power and privilege’; an enabling state ‘showing that the true role of government is to foster personal responsibility and not to substitute for it’; a new economic egalitarianism based on ‘enhancing the skills of everyone’; a new constitutional settlement between individuals, their communities and the state – ‘I believe to re-invent government we must first reconstruct the very idea of community’ (Brown 1994:114).

      Traditional definitions of community were seen as having broken down (and having thus enabled the individualistic attack of the Right): the stable territorial base of communities had disappeared, as had stable individual identities and life-styles, through the impacts of globalisation. For Brown such definitions of community were in any case superficial, concealing the true, and continuing, base of community – interdependence. From the four foundations Brown drew two major political imperatives in communitarian fashion: individuals must take more responsibility for their own welfare (broadly conceived) as monolithic state bureaucracies are disaggregated (and become providers of last resort); the re-structuring of responsibilities must be balanced by a major new cluster of rights (the right to develop individual potential).

      At root our objective is that individuals should have the opportunity to realize their potential to the full – that individuals should have the opportunity to bridge the gap between what they are and what they have it in themselves to become. (Brown 1994:113) It is this latter imperative which drove Brown beyond the Etzionian framework and towards the idea of social capital. Brown re-interpreted the history of socialism’s struggle to control the means of
      production, distribution and exchange (‘the old agenda’ 1994:114) as a struggle for the realization of human potential underpinned by three ethical principles: First, a belief that individual potential is far greater than can be realized in a wholly capitalist society; second, a belief that individuals are not just self-centred but also co-operative; and third, a belief not only that individuals thrive best in a community and that the potential of the individual is enhanced by membership of a community but also that a strong community is essential for the advancement of potential. (Brown 1994:115, emphasis added)
      Brown’s qualifications highlighted in the quotation above signalled the shift (in the new agenda) to engagement with the market economy not as temporary pragmatic necessity but as an ethical and economic good: The key question is not whether we abolish markets but how we set standards, or regulate, in a way that ensures that markets work in the public interest. (Brown 1994:116)8

      The changed nature of markets, through globalisation and the alleged skills revolution, meant, for Brown, that ‘individual liberation arises from the enhancement of the value of labour rather than the abolition of private capital’ (Brown 1994:116). The realization of individual potential (now largely interpreted as ‘skills’ saleable in the market, with the ability to choose from a multiplicity of public services a distant second) could only take place in a new form of ‘co-operative community’. In developing this reasoning Brown clearly moved beyond communitarianism: the reliance on the idea of one moral community remained (together with the key assumption that New Labour is the expression of it) but the lack of economic reasoning in communitarianism demanded a further intellectual framework to theorize the link between individual, community and the global market economy. Social capital helped provide this. The work of Coleman both produced a model of increasing the realization of potential in disadvantaged groups and provided a link into rational choice economics. In order for both of these to be operationalized into policy making there was a need for what Schuller has called a ‘technomethodology’ (Schuller, 2000). It was a model of this which the voluminous work of Putnam in Bowling Alone offered: twenty pages of Appendices (Putnam, 2000: 415-435) are devoted to specifying the data sources for the ninety-six Figures and 9 Tables of the main text (a rate of one every four pages). This work was ground breaking not only for its provocative political thesis but also for its operationalization of social solidarity as social capital in a way which had largely eluded theorists of ‘community’ (its predecessor).

    376. Tinto Chiel says:

      Right, Marie: Harvey even candied some wee French carrots and set them in a sea of butter icing so droning the whole shebang down to you now.

      Look in the NE in twenty mins and flash three times.

      (signed) Broadsword.

    377. Thepnr says:

      Happy birthday Marie!

      Here’s a tune I played for Ian Brotherhood’s 50th on here, that would be a good while back now LOL.

    378. Lucia Daines says:

      Happy Birthday Marie and yes Thepnr that was a few years back.

    379. Thepnr says:

      @Lucia Daines

      He’s getting on right enough 🙂

    380. Marie Clark says:

      Danny Boy to Broadsword, sounds as though Harvey has been baking his wee furry paws off, Sounds good though, I’m looking forward to it. Hope the mess in the kitchen hasn’t upset Mrs TC too much.

      Thanks Alex and Lucia for your kind wishes. I wish I could still skip about like Claire Grogan, but I think by the time we dae a strip the willow the morn’s nicht I could be wiped out.

      I’m off to have a wee dram and pace myself for tomorrow. Hope it doesn’t end like this.

    381. Michael McCabe says:

      Amos Lee-Windows are Rolled Down

    382. Marie Clark says:

      Oh Hell bells, last post disappeared off into the ether. Duh.

      Danny boy to Broadsword, looks as though Harvey has been baking his wee furry paws off. Looking oot fur the drone, cake sounds good. I hope Mrs TC wasn’t too upset with the mess in her kitchen.

      Alex and Lucia, and everyone else, thank you for your kind wishes. I wish I still had the energy to skip about like Claire Grogan in that clip. I think that strip the willow tomorrow night micht wipe me oot. I’m away tae have a wee dram and pace myself for tomorrows party. Hope it doesn’t end up like this.

    383. hackalumpoff says:

      @ Tinto Chiel: 17 August, 2018 at 12:16 pm.
      “How’s the barnacles?”

      Crusty but tasty! Brushed my teeth with Marie Rose Sauce, à la Sunny Jim. You’ll need to up your gemme before you sign on.

      Just took 5 hours from home to Glesca. A9 jammed with Touries heading south and Runrig fans heading for Stirling.

    384. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Marie: no probs on the kitchen front, though Harvey may have overdone the baking powder, on reflection.

      hackalumpoff: did you mean Touries or Tories?

      Will settle for bilge-rat (metaphorical), second class just to serve on your decks.

      PS: have numerous Lady Cynthia Sins titles for your perusal.

    385. hackalumpoff says:

      Tinto Chiel says:
      A tinto chiel 17 August, 2018 at 8:55 pm

      hackalumpoff: did you mean Touries or Tories?

      Will settle for bilge-rat (metaphorical), second class just to serve on your decks.

      PS: have numerous Lady Cynthia Sins titles for your perusal.


    386. Tinto Chiel says:

      hackalumpoff, you seem uncharacteristically tetchy ce soir: Dr Tinto prescribes two fingers of single malt *folds middle two fingers under thumb*.

      You say toe-rag, I say touareg *adjusts Bedouin robes* .

      Can’t make the stall/Dundee ramorra owing to ongoing social interface situation. Do you have “Lady Cynthia Goes to Inverie” (1957, paper covers)?

      Please advise: +£2.50 pp, any reasonable offered considered.

      Them Aussie Sheilas can sure swear. I’m impressed, and I’ve been to Airdrie.

    387. hackalumpoff says:

      @ tinto

      tetchy, moi ? naw.

      “Dr Tinto prescribes two fingers of single malt *folds middle two fingers under thumb*.”

      A Crofters dram is between thumb and pinkie.

      Expect a Brown paper envelope in the post from Lady Cyn.

      Re Towrag: The officers’ quarters are traditionally in the stern of a sailing ship, and the ratings’ in the bows, including their toilet arrangements. In sailing days the wind usually blew from behind the ship, taking away noisome smells from the body of the ship. Similarly the heads (toilet arrangements, specifically a place to sit with part of the body hanging over the water) were at the front so that the oncoming water could wash the ship clean. In those heady days (sorry) the service of toilet paper was performed by a rag, tied to a rope, which after use could be let down into the bow waves to be washed by the passage of water. The ‘tow-rag’.

    388. Thepnr says:


      Sorry my friend but I just cannot find it in me to agree with that definition of tow-rag.

      Let’s face it, even hundreds of years ago would sailors really hang their arse over the bulwark rather then shit in a bucket and then throw it over the side?

      I do not think so as I would chose the bucket every time 🙂

    389. Tinto Chiel says:

      It’s the intellectual speculation here which keeps drawing me back.

      “Between thumb and pinkie” sounds like one of Fred’s “Hoose Haufs”.

      I’m more of an organic whey with fermented quinoa man masel.

      Have a great march, vile seps.

    390. William Wallace says:

      Thanks PNR for the info. I’ll be marching from the start of the march but my mum and other family members that are less able will park up nearer the event and walk the last bit.

      That car park you mentioned and surrounding area is too much of a long shot and I think Tesco riverside might be on the ball in terms of time limits on parking so they are going to try further up the Perth road or the other side of South Tay St.

      I’ll pop over to the wings stall and say hello to you all so nae hiding awa when you see me coming. 😉 I’ll probably hae the HoF flag, Wings Flag and Catalan flag on a fishing rod with the Anonymous Saltire mask and Saltire laces on like last time.

      Hope to see some of you there.

    391. cearc says:

      Have a great flag party in Dundee today everyone.

    392. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      We have lots of 5ft x 3ft Saltire flags at the Forward shop for £3.50 and particularly nice fine Saltire scarves (120cm appx 4ft) very suitable for wear at marches and demos for £4.50. All can be posted free to any UK address. Orders and cheques to “YES Cowal” at the Forward Shop 186, Argyll Street, Dunoon PA23 7HA.
      Lots of other stuff. Visit us when in Dunoon.

    393. Cactus says:

      Burpity burp like…

      Boozin’ inda Boozy Cow, ra Wingers are comin’.

      Here cum’s ra Wingers! xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.

    394. Fred says:

      Good to see the good folk Doon the Watter have rejected an E II R pillar-box & await an honest wan. The Royal Mail induction used to include a wee pep-talk about the Scottish livery on vans, uniforms etc! so some clown has slipped-up. The boxes used to be made in a Scottish foundry, mebbes even Kirkie? hmmm long gone!

      The Elizabeth we never had, apparently when out on the royal barge, wiped her arse with a swans neck!

    395. Tam the Bam says:

      STV Evening News reported a crowd of 6,000.
      Underestimating again?… I await Misreporting Scotlands estimate.

      Anyone care to hazard a guess?

    396. hackalumpoff says:

      @ thepnr 18 August, 2018 at 2:41

      “Sorry my friend but I just cannot find it in me to agree with that definition of tow-rag.”

      See you engineers, you are newcomers to the trade, us deckies have a much longer history.


      Mind you that’s a yoon navy, maybe the Scottish Navy was more soffisticated.

      I believe James Clark Maxwell invented bogroll after a feed of the Guga and then he went on setup the rest of the modern world.

      Missed you at the march today, maybe Edinburgh ?
      I can bring my sextant, compass and chronometer to to show you the way LOL

    397. hackalumpoff says:

      @ Fred at 4:07 pm

      “The Elizabeth we never had, apparently when out on the royal barge, wiped her arse with a swans neck!”

      That would be the Royal Towrag then.

      I believe Charlie has been interviewing for his own Towragger. Soon to be known as Baron Mundell Broontongue of TowragToon.

    398. Fred says:

      “Pass us a bundle o Mundell!”

    399. Fred says:

      “It’s Fluffy!”

    400. Cactus says:

      Mwah to our lovely ladies of Wings xxx.

      Excellent times beautiful Yes City Dundee, thanks for having us, one and all.

      It’s time for a sing-a-long Sunday hehe…




      2 months (less thirteen days) remaining to go Wingers…

      Edinburgh like.

    401. cearc says:

      Glad you all had a great day.

      I didn’t bother responding to the ****hole on MT, just sent a complaint via the contact button. The 10.38 comment, stated as fact rather than opinion, is clearly defamatory.

    402. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. Virulent misogyny hiding in plain sight. Misogyny is one of the key cultural vectors the New Right has exploited to mobilise a new politics of supremacy.

      What we get wrong about misogyny
      Sexism and misogyny are not the same — and the difference matters.

      What is misogyny? How is it different from sexism? And why does the male-dominated status quo seem to persist?

      A new book by Cornell philosophy professor Kate Manne has answers. She argues that misogyny is not about male hostility or hatred toward women — instead, it’s about controlling and punishing women who challenge male dominance. Misogyny rewards women who reinforce the status quo and punishes those who don’t.

      In this interview, we explore how sexism and misogyny are different, how misogyny is embedded in our customs and institutions, and what Trump’s election and our current moment reveal about our future.

      Our conversation, lightly edited for clarity, follows….

    403. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @cearc –

      I saw that comment (and the others by the same character) – didn’t report it meself but I did report someone else very recently using the contact form as you suggested and Rev put the culprit into pre-moderation. That’s the way he’s asked us to deal with folk who are upsetting others and it works. I assume the same has happened with this latest numpty, or it will in due course.

      Disgusting way to speak to anyone and we’re very fortunate that there isn’t more of it on WOS. Dunno if Rev blocks many before we even get to see them or they just avoid this place because they know they’ll get bagged sonner or later but we certainly seem to have nowhere near the amount of bile and rage that infests other sites.

    404. Sarah says:

      @cearc – he was extremely offensive about Cactus too [10.56pm 18th August] so I’ll be reporting to the Rev too.

    405. Cactus says:

      Evening Ian B, yeah ah’ve been keeping a running eye on the users posts, I thought the users personal attack on the ladies and other Wingers a bit strange and well off. Nae attempt at competitive banter and all on the return offensive.

      The difference is the ladies are firm but fair.

      Sure, aye can push things, be ‘creative’ and carry the odd sweary word in context, but fur me said sweary words would only be directed directly at Britnat politicians or said in stand-alone. One does have his own ways and means, it’s important.

      Upon reflection, maybe in doing so it helps to rouse certain peoples, identify and ‘bring em out in the open’.

      Hey Sarah, mwah, have an excellent evening xx.

    406. Archie (not Erchie) says:

      Chust a wee observation. Having sifted through videos and photos of Dundee march I was much heartened to see many Wings flags. They seem to be breeding! It’s a real boost to those of us who couldn’t be there in person.

    407. cearc says:


      I reported them all as offensive etc. but the last one where he omits an ‘I think’ or whatever was legally defamatory.

      Cactus is a perfect gentleman, as Ruglonian would also testify (even if he didn’t come to Inverness!)

    408. Chick McGregor says:

      An emotional weekend for us at the Runrig farewell concert, so here is an older vid of a Barrowland Ballroom concert we were at, one of many Runrig concerts, long long ago.

    409. Chick McGregor says:


      Burpity burp like…

      Boozin’ inda Boozy Cow, ra Wingers are comin’.

      Here cum’s ra Wingers! xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.

      How did you get in? The word on the street was they were not letting any indy supporters in. Its on the blacklist now.

    410. Benhope says:

      Good turnout in Lairg today at meeting to discuss The Growth Commission even though it was the sabbath!

      Keith Brown and Maree Todd spoke well and emphasised their commitment to Independence. Plenty questions and good engagement from the members.

      Quite a few references to Wings from those emphasising detailed points.The source to go to to obtain the true facts on all things Indy.

    411. Cactus says:

      Mornin’ cearc xx, aye wish aye could have made it to Inverness, was at a birthday do, definitely next time. 😉

      Mornin’ Chick, aye the bar seemed cool with us, ah spoke with the bouncer outside and used the power of the indy force… invincible it is! 🙂 Even managed to take a ride on their Saltire adorned metal coo at the top steps hehe.

      Getting in is the easy bit.

    412. Liz g says:

      Morning Cactus @ 1.46am
      I’m playing catch up and it seems I’ve missed something ( don’t need tae know) but if it is what I think it is..
      Pay it nae mind..
      Ofcourse yer are,it seems, in a wee bit o’ trouble fur missing Inverness,,, not tae worry Edinburgh is the BIG one!
      And I say that as a wedgie..
      Wull we see ye there?

      Ian Brotherhood.
      So nice tae finally meet ye… Sorry I had to run,but I needed tae get my bus…. Which I never did…but that’s a whole other story.. LOL!!

    413. jdman says:

      What happened at the BoozyCow?
      did you get thrown out?

    414. Tinto Chiel says:

      Morning, sophisticates.

      Wake up with this:

    415. Tinto Chiel says:

      A little literal, this vid but the same sentiment is charmingly expressed by these Luvvly Laydees:

    416. Sarah says:

      @cearc 11.00 pm: good work. Hope that is the last we see of him.

      I didn’t see you at Inverness – but then perhaps it was because I lay down as soon as we got to the Heather Park, having done the walk both ways so my hips were complaining! I couldn’t crawl across to the rest of the Ullapool & Lochbroom crowd! I had been with them on the march tho’- close to our two pipers.

      It was great to see all those smiling faces, the banners, the music etc etc and the support from the houses we passed. Really encouraging.

    417. Cactus says:

      Afternoon all, aye it was nae bother at the coo, we had a good time there then folks began heading off to get home.

      Ahm wondering now if there were other indy supporters not allowed in, hmmm.

      (…getting out is the hard bit when yer havin’ a good time) 😉

    418. Chick McGregor says:

      It was the missus telt me they were turning away fowk wi saltires an the like, I think she saw it on facebook.

    419. Cactus says:

      Chick, turning folk away were they, that sucks. We arrived there about an hour after the march arrived (in covert mode.) Once we were in the flags came out, nae hassles.

      It’s not like they didn’t have enough space to accomodate everyone… they’ve got a massive beer garden (and lovely ivy) out back… ach well, their loss.

      If we’d known about the turnaways, we’d have tried a new venue.

      Ah’ve got an idea where to go for afters in Edinburgh… 🙂

    420. Liz g says:

      Cactus @ 1.11
      They definitely turned 5 folk away just before I met you..and
      The reason was ” nae colours ”
      My friend and I actually discussed testing if they would turn a disabled person away,if ye remember she was on a mobility scooter..
      But we decided going to the park was much more fun!!

    421. Cactus says:

      Yeah the park was excellent fun Liz, what a view it was from the edge of the park to the bandstand and the sunshine held fine too.

      Mibbies we should reserve a place/venue for ‘all colours of independence’ for after the Edinburgh walky…

      Howsabout Arthur’s Seat.

      Some view fae there.

    422. Tinto Chiel says:

      Capella: here’s the Jackie Bird song:

    423. cearc says:

      Aye, I’ll be in Edinburgh, I hope. Well I’ve already booked and paid for an outrageously priced (they all are) hotel for the fri/sat. So that’s half a room available for someone else.

    424. jdman says:

      Cactus, I hope you enjoyed your 20 yard lift? 🙂

    425. yesindyref2 says:

      Mmm, £26.96 for hostel just off the Royal Mile with a free drink voucher.

    426. yesindyref2 says:

      So try to book megabus online and it won’t take a card, or any card, from my computer or daughter’s iphone. So you can book at 65p a minute premium bloody ripoff. So I phone the enquiries instead and there’s an IT problem they’ve been working on all day. So basically all you have to do to make £39 an hour is kick your company server over and get people to book on a premium rate number at £39 an hour paying minimum wage. Hey, did Michelle Mone take over Megabus?

    427. Cactus says:

      Hey jdman, aye twas a pleasure to ride with yee’s and arrive in comfort and style, nice interior. 🙂

      Hope to see yee’s in Edinburgh, come October.

      Party at the parliament!

    428. yesindyref2 says:

      Ah! A blinding light – the bus is CITYLINK so booked through them online no problem, £1, cheap at half the price.

    429. yesbot says:

      for Betty Boop and Jim Thomson

      Don’t know if you read here much but just wanted to be sure to thank you both for your kindness on Saturday; it was very much appreciated. Hope it didn’t add too much hassle to your journey and of-course also thanks for your excellent company. Just rounded off a great day!

    430. Capella says:

      Hi Tinto Chiel. Took me a while to get here. My this is a long thread. Love the Jackie Bird song. Bit more dangerous than JCC’s It Man.

      Been watching Hitler’s Circle of Evil on Netflix. So in the right frame of mind to appreciate BBC purveyors of propaganda.

    431. David says:

      Q: What do you call a car crash that lasts 6 minutes?
      A: Gillian Marles!

      Blimey what a terrible terrible interview she conducted for BBC Good Morning.
      More please, cos every unionist display/tantrum like that brings independence closer.

    432. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Capella: glad you liked it. Elvis C wrote some great lyrics when he was a young ‘un.

      To mix my metaphors, any society’s journey along the road to fascism is a bit like what happens to the lobster put into tepid water. The heat is gradually increased until, by the time the animal is even vaguely aware what is happening, it’s already too late.

      The BBC, with its disproportionate exposure of Farage and the new rabid right wing agenda of QT (pro-Brexit, anti-immigrant) is facilitating it all wonderfully.

      Hitler didn’t start with Auschwitz, he started by picking on minorities and seeing what he could get away with.

      Oops, too serious for O/T.

      Toodle pip!

    433. Capella says:

      @ Tinto Chiel – the rise of the Nazis is very relevant today, unfortunately. Which is what I like about the Netflix docudrama. Hitler’s Circle of Evil. The infighting, jockeying for power and dark scheming of psychopathic misfits are illuminating.

      Re music. I think the independence movement could do with a few upful songs for the march. The Proclaimers have some good lyrics.

      Slogans too – “What do we want?” Better slogans.

    434. Tinto Chiel says:

      “The infighting, jockeying for power and dark scheming of psychopathic misfits are illuminating.”

      The Tory party conference isn’t for a while, Capella.


      Mrs Tinto is wanting me to dig up something in the garden but before I go, and on the subject of inspiring songs for us, I leave you this antipodean one with Significant Words and complete with unexpected piper. Think it’s one of Ian B/Thepnr’s favourites (intellectuals of this parish).

    435. yesindyref2 says:

      As long as it’s not someONE in the garden. that’s OK.

    436. hackalumpoff says:

      @ Tinto
      Did you feel the wind of change while digging?

      Take me to the magic of the moment
      On a glory night
      Where the children of tomorrow dream away
      In the wind of change

    437. cearc says:

      It’s ok, yesindyref2, he’s not allowed to dig in that bit of the garden. Your secret is safe.

    438. Tinto Chiel says:

      Good track, hackalumpoff.

      You’re all mad as hatters, btw. Going to make some carrot fritters with Harvey.

      Sweet dreams, sofisticates.

    439. Capella says:

      Good lyrics. Trying to get the marching millions to sing it might be quite hard though.
      Heard some people sing “No Union No Cry” on one march. Maybe with a bit of tweaking the rest of the lyrics would fit?

    440. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Capella at 10.30
      “No Union,No Cry”. I like it

      How about “Walk and Don’t Look Back” for our marchers. Peter (Macin)Tosh and Mick Jagger


    441. Capella says:

      @ DMH – great song. Mick Jagger looks about 12. Something upful would be good on the marches and maybe even the bagpipes could play some reggae (I’m trying to imagine it!).

      Maybe we need a songsheet. AUOB singing from the same songsheet!

    442. Nana says:

      Meant to post this a few days ago, was worried it might embed if posted on the MT.

    443. Tinto Chiel says:

      Oh, Nana!


    444. Nana says:


      I kinda knew that might happen, that’s why I thought it best to put it here rather than on the MT.

      I’m away to hide under the stairs now and please send sustenance as I may be in hiding for some time!

      Let me know when it’s safe to come out 🙂

    445. Betty Boop says:

      @yesbot, 20th August 2018, 11.06pm

      No problem, it was an absolute pleasure. Also, it was nice to have someone else the car instead of just our stall gubbins rattling about!

      We don’t post much these days, but, but keep up as much as possible with Stu’s articles.

      Really enjoyed having the time to relax for a wee while at the end of the day in the B/Coo with some of our Wings friends and the saltire lampshade in the corner 😉

      Catch you all again sometime x

    446. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Capella.

      You typed,
      Something upful would be good on the marches and maybe even the bagpipes could play some reggae (I’m trying to imagine it!).

      Imagine no longer. Here are a couple of singles from my vinyl collection:-
      “Reggae Bagpipes” by The Magnificent 7 and “Let’s Foot It Out Together” by Alastair MacDonald.
      You’ll get the option to play in your media player if they don’t play in the web browser.

      Listen for the kazoo solo…

    447. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Anyone else noticed that the “the-cereal-offenders” page is still active, thanks to “HYUFD” and those of us who are keeping him going?

    448. yesindyref2 says:

      Keeps sensibledave off the main page, same as before, though cubby = danny = reluctant nationalist = I forget who before are doing their / its bit to disrupt.

    449. Fred says:

      Just finished this excellent book. “The Tartan Air Force!” by a lassie called Deborah Lake.

    450. Dave McEwan Hill says:


      The collaboration between the Glimmer Twins (aka Jagger and Richards) and Peter Tosh was bountiful indeed. It produced one of my favourite records of all time – Peter Tosh’s “Johnny Be Goode” which I play regularly on my Not Fade Away r&r online radio show


    451. William Wallace says:

      Finally back from Dundee gathering. Was nice to see you again Hackalumpoff and also the couple of lurkers from the MT’s I met too. I did pop over to the wings stall to say hi a couple of times but the rest of you were slinging iz the dinghy (again). That’s the third time now I think so hint taken and duly noted you bunch of beep beeps. 🙂 😉

      That said, see you all in Edinburgh. 😉 🙂

    452. Liz g says:

      William Wallace @ 3.03
      Aw sorry I missed you at Dundee…
      Had been wondering how you’ve been keeping?
      But I’m taking it that since you made the trip your.. gettin oan wi it…
      Hope to see you at Edinburgh
      Stay well my friend

    453. Thepnr says:

      @William Wallace

      I saw a big guy with an Anonymous mask on near the Wings stall. Myself and Ian B were around there for a couple of hours.

      Next time Wullie if you ask big Ronnie or any other Winger you meet at the stall they should be able to point us out. I would have liked to have met you. So see you in Edinburgh 🙂

    454. William Wallace says:

      @ Liz

      Been keeping a lot better Liz and thank you for asking. Would have been nice to say hello to you in Dundee but, hopefully, I will finally get a chance to say hi in Edinburgh. Hope you had a great day out.

      @ PNR

      I think that might have been my son ( he pinched my mask for the march and I had already gifted the other one to smallaxes grandson at Dumfries 🙂 ) I was stood next to him (my son) most of the time with the three flags on a fishing pole (HoF [top], Wings[middle] and Estelada [bottom]).

      Hopefully, I’ll see you and the rest of you I have not yet met in Edinburgh. Looking forward to that one, it should be massive.

    455. Tam the Bam. says:

      What..oh what has happened to the Wings Twitter feed?
      Is this a supposed upgrade? I hate it and get banner straplines at the bottom of my screen asking if I want to continue receiving feed from this app WHICH I DONT HAVE!!!!…..(mercury blows the tap aff the …..)….HELP!!!

    456. Chick McGregor says:

      Nicola released the following 20 mins ago

      A statement from Nicola Sturgeon

      Nicola Sturgeon said:

      “Complaints were made in January relating to Alex Salmond by two individuals.

      “These complaints have been considered since then under a procedure covering ministers and former ministers that was agreed by me in December 2017 in the wake of public concern about harassment.

      “Although I have been aware for some time of the fact of the investigation – initially from Alex Salmond – I have had no role in the process, and to have referred to it before now would have compromised the integrity of the internal investigation, which I was not prepared to do. However, I was informed by the Permanent Secretary earlier this week that she had completed her investigation and that she intended to make the fact of the complaints public.

      “Alex Salmond is now challenging the Scottish Government’s procedure in court. The Scottish Government refutes his criticisms of its process and will defend its position vigorously.

      “However, this focus on process cannot deflect from the fact that complaints were made that could not be ignored or swept under the carpet.

      “I have been clear on many occasions that all organisations and workplaces must make it possible for people to come forward to report concerns and have confidence that they will be treated seriously. For that principle to mean anything it cannot be applied selectively. It must be applied without fear or favour, regardless of the identity, seniority or political allegiance of the person involved.

      “My relationship with Alex Salmond obviously makes this an extremely difficult situation for me to come to terms with. I am also acutely aware how upsetting this will be for my party. However the over-riding priority must be to ensure fair and due process. I would also ask that the privacy of those who have complained be respected.”

    457. hackalumpoff says:


      Permanent European Union Citizenship

      Sign up folks, could be useful.

    458. Tinto Chiel says:

      Chick, I’m presuming when the FM says,”The Scottish Government refutes his criticisms of its process and will defend its position vigorously” she means the “Scottish” civil service at Holyrood, who are employed by the UK government under a Permanent Secretary it appoints.

      The wording of the press release makes it seem as if Alex Salmond is at odds with the SG and thus his own party, which I find strange.

    459. Dave Mc Ewan Hill says:

      Wonder what I’ll say about the AS stuff on Argyll Independent radio tonight. Unprepared as its Cowal Games tomorrow and the day has been spent making up rolls and soup for the Forward Shop in Dunoon tomorrow

    460. Tinto Chiel says:

      @DMH: do you have to initiate any discussion? I notice The Rev. is giving it a wide berth, for obvious legal reasons.

      I expect it to be dragged out for a while by MSM.

      Use your teacher training and keep a firm hand 😛

    461. Capella says:

      @ BDTT – wow – reggae bagpipes and crooning! Didn’t think that would be possible. But now I remember that Ian Brotherhood posted a link to 50 Cent singing It’s Your Birthday to the bluebell polka. Jimmy Shand vs 50 Cent.

      @ DMH – I have a Peter Tosh vinyl album. Just away to check and see if it has that Johnny B Goode version. I didn’t know that Mick and Keith had been into reggae though his “Indian Girl” was certainly influenced by S America – I thought maybe by Bianca.

      Now imagine the Edinburgh marchers skanking their way down the High Street!

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