A matter of timing
Writing about the Hate Crime Bill in the Herald today, Kevin McKenna summarises in a sentence a point this website has been making for many months.
Because the real question about the SNP’s sudden demented obsession with focusing the public’s attention on its most unpopular policies right before supposedly the most important election in its history isn’t “Why?”
It’s “Why now?”
The party professes to be seeking a big majority at Holyrood so that its mandate for a second independence referendum will be clear and (it asserts) undeniable.
But if that was really the case, wouldn’t it be bending over backwards to create unity in the Yes movement, not division? Would it really be forcing through the widely-despised Hate Crime Bill in a mad pre-election rush? Would it really be going so far out of its way to push the enormously controversial and poisonously divisive transgender issue? Would it be so doggedly and spitefully alienating a huge swathe of its own members with its treatment of Joanna Cherry?
Leave aside your personal feelings on those things for a moment and just ask yourself why they’re being pushed right to the forefront now, of all times. Because if the SNP fostered unity and got its huge majority, it’d have five years with no effective opposition at all to do whatever it liked over those issues. There simply isn’t any rush. There’s no pressing epidemic of hate crime, and even if there had been there were already plenty of laws to deal with it for at least the next 12 or 18 months while the party prioritised its supposed entire reason for existing.
So even if you think that abolishing science, turning all speech into hate speech and marginalising your most competent MP are absolutely terrific ideas, it still makes no political sense to create a big song and dance over them NOW. That can only possibly damage the party’s chances of the majority it claims to want.
And it won’t even be able to claim to be surprised, because the SNP knows from as recently as 2017 that if you alienate or antagonise a large subsection of your own support (in that case Leave voters), hundreds of thousands of them may well simply stay at home or even vote for someone else. It’s less than four years since that very thing cost the party a whopping 40% of its Westminster seats.
You don’t win a war by triggering a civil war in your own side at the same time, as the Russians had learned 100 years earlier. You do whatever it takes to keep your team together, and then you settle your scores and conduct your purges quietly afterwards.
But since the SNP have instead chosen the exact opposite route – lashing out left, right and centre at Yes supporters – only one more question remains to be answered:
Is it an accident – in which case its leadership is the most incompetent and stupid in Scottish political history – or is it on purpose, in which case the only possible goal must be to deliberately AVOID getting a majority, so that it has a foolproof excuse for not delivering independence and can sit back and enjoy five more cosy and lucrative years in power, while still being able to implement all its unpopular social-engineering laws because the Greens, Lib Dems and Labour will back them?
Make up your own minds, folks.
So the follow on question to that is why don’t they want a majority.?
We’ve told you that a dozen times, but I’ve edited it in for the benefit of anyone who just arrived from Mars.
I am a slow learner.
I’ve asked the “why now” question to the diehard both votes SNP types on Twitter.
No coherent answer – just whataboutery, or the usual crap about being able to change it afterwards – completely sidestepping why NOW.
They’re being played by the SNP leadership. And yet they say we’re the ones being played.
Aye right.
I think she will jump ship after the HR GE, to somewhere further up the monkey tree protecting her derriere until she is bedded in to with international expenses jet set.
It’s reminds me of the siriza fiasco I’m Greece.
There really isn’t any other reasonable conclusion is there.
So do we spoil our constituency ballot or give them precisely what they DON’T want – a majority?
in Greece
“So do we spoil our constituency ballot or give them precisely what they DON’T want – a majority?”
I don’t think it matters, since their plan for getting an indyref WITH a majority is so terrible it has zero chance of working anyway. They’d have to own that, but then they could say “Hey look, we tried but the evil UK government foiled us, so vote for us AGAIN in 2026 and we’ll have another plan”. In practice the outcome is the same either way.
As with Gormley the truth will be exposed.
Fully agree, have argued same on Twitter (futile exercise). It explains a great deal, without the need for intellectual gymnastics.
However, the faithful cannot admit to themselves they’ve been duped – way too painful. They need a reason that justifies the faith they’ve put in.
So, bloggers it is, I’m afraid – you’re copping the flak (except court circular editor WGD, of course)
It appears to the most sane conclusion to reach. And it explains all the shit MSM bending over backwards to protect her.
I think it’s completely deliberate. If she called a referendum and lost then NS would have to stand down. Such a risk is counterintuitive to the logic of a megalomaniac.
@BuggerlePanda @16h42
Absolutely, that was always the plan.
Onto something where you don’t have to rely on voters, preferably
I have had this self same discussion with many others it just belies understanding. The Dog & Duck spent half the night on Wednesday trying to come to a logical explanation of their actions. We never got close to one that could show any perceived strategic advantage to the cause of Independence. The nearest we came to reaching a concensus is the very same conclusion as you seemed too to have reached. One day there will be a reckoning.I also dont need to tell if May is a repeat of 2017 and Indy voters stay at home you especially and other bloggers will be the scapegoats not Nicola of Assisi.
FFS Rev, give the panda a break eh?
Takes real grit and tenacity to keep typing comments with yon big hairy paws.
#MonThePanda
In a nutshell. And as a recently ex-member this is the sole reason I might be able to hold my nose and vote for them (on the constituency) anyway – to help deny them the minority and the instant get-out-of-jail card that they so plainly seek. Voting SNP to spite the SNP, basically. A majority won’t bring indy any closer but it will make them look even more pathetic when they fail to deliver – and hopefully accelerate the haemorraging of the membership and the growth of a party actually committed to independence.
I love a bit of Ed Norton on the weekends…
The SNP have become a delinquent organization, whereas once they were the opposite of that. They have turned Holyrood into a delinquent parliament, Victoria Quay into a delinquent civil service and our legal profession into a bunch of delinquent and untrustworthy middle-men. No-one really cares about Humza’s Hate Crime Bill. The situation is much more serious than that and needs a proper police investigation.
A well reasoned piece and if anyone asks, “why don’t they want a majority”, I suspect they are either newcomers, trolls or SNPG Right or Wrong supporters.
The terrible thing to ask about all of this, is every single SNP MSP too ignorant to see the writing on the wall? (See previous post by Chris.)
I believe the whole party – with one abstention? – voted for the Hate Crime Bill. Now, I cannot believe that the whole of the party SNPs are in on a “conspiracy”, but I strongly suspect that every single SNP MSP who voted in favour of that Bill is of the same mindset as their Leaders:
i.e. Hoping and praying to miss a majority in Holyrood, then whilst a few crocodile tears will be shed for “gallant losers” come May, the rest of the ragged bunch will be giving thanks to their Deity for granting them another 5 years on the gravy train.
“Trebles all round!”
If they’re trying to avoid getting a majority, shouldn’t we be trying to force a majority onto them? Why give them what they want?
GRA/HCB will pass whether they have a majority or not. If the SNP have a majority, we have four years to force them to move on independence.
Cozy feet Pete has infected them all.
Another possibility is that it’s a poison pill from a clique about to be defenestrated.
“so that it has a foolproof excuse for not delivering independence and can enjoy five more cosy and lucrative years in power while still being able to implement all its unpopular social-engineering laws because the Greens, Lib Dems and Labour will back them?”
They corrupt criminals want to retain their cosy and lucrative positions without having to deliver the one thing that used to be the reason for the SNP’s existence.
The parcel of rogues were petty thieves compared to these corrupt criminals.
Vote tactically to remove them from power.
“so that it has a foolproof excuse for not delivering independence and can enjoy five more cosy and lucrative years in power while still being able to implement all its unpopular social-engineering laws because the Greens, Lib Dems and Labour will back them?”
The corrupt criminals want to retain their cosy and lucrative positions without having to deliver the one thing that used to be the very reason for the SNP’s existence.
The parcel of rogues were petty thieves compared to these corrupt criminals.
Vote tactically to remove them from power.
Well put. I mean, it seems obvious to me and anyone not called Rip VanMcWinkle who has a functioning braincell – but it needs to be said.
The SNP are what the kids call “larpers”; e.g. a bunch of guys put on their camo gear and go airsofting, or outdoor survival courses – but they are not prepared to really jump out the back of a Chinook in the ‘stan, with a machine gun.
– fuck that.
It’s been clear for a while there is an agenda. The most likely reason is to hold onto power in a manner such that they don’t have to fight for independence. Without a majority they can sit back and say their hands are tied.
I’ve seen loads of the whataboutery, distraction techniques and petulant outbursts from the drones. Not one of them has any real answers.
I just wonder what they will do if they find themselves with a majority? They don’t have the funds to fight an indy campaign. We know that. They spaffed the indy fighting fund on big daddy smith’s defamation payout.
As for humzas cultist bill, I can’t wait for it to be misused on someone with the nous and resources to take him and it to task.
Rob M says,
“If she called a referendum and lost then NS would have to stand down.”
And they have already embezzled the £600,000 independence referendum fund to fill the pockets of the likes of Murrell and Rodick and to pay lawyers to defend their criminal conspiracy.
Don’t let them have the best of both worlds – vote them out.
Abstaining or spoiling the ballot will not be enough. Vote for the least worst alternate candidate, IMHO.
I think the answer to ‘why now?’ is simple – they – the Woke – have influence over the SNP NOW and the SNP have power NOW. They might not have it after the election. They’re making hay while the suns shines and taking no chances.
Why would they care how it affects the election result? It will either be an SNP Gov with a majority or SNP Gov with a minority dependent on the super-wokies of the Greens. They can’t lose.
Davidson writing in the Express says that ‘she has the momentum.’ At the stage we are at now, it is the party with the momentum that will do best and I think both Labour and the Conservatives have more momentum than the SNP. I can see this election turning into a collapse for them and I hope that is so.
Well, it looks like we’ll have to vote SNP for the constituency and anyone but the SNP for the region. If almost a million wasted SNP regional votes (from 2016) could be channelled towards Pro-Indy parties in the regions, things could become “interesting”.
The ISP, however, has to dismount its high horse and TALK to AFI. The pair of them, working together, could achieve SOMETHING.
Also, it would be rather spiffing if some BIG, well-known names were to stand under the AFI banner in certain constituencies. I’m thinking Glasgow Southside, Edinburgh Central, Dunfermline and so on.
The media coverage would, in fact, raise the profiles of both the ISP and AFI – IF THEY WORK TOGETHER!
If anyone is refusing to vote or even spoil their ballot for the snp in the first vote then don’t. Give to another Indy party instead,except for the greens.Not forgetting to vote for the isp on the list.
@ianbrotherhood
Sobriety is a curse as well.
Playing cat and mouse with my doc.
Only one answer fits the facts for me.
She has never wanted Independence but it was a very lucrative and profile developing role for a few years.
If the voters are stupid enough to put her back in power she keeps doing what she has been doing.
She knows she will have the fall back position of minority government and then can blame those nasty bloggers who ended Independence hopes.
The preparation work on priority woke list candidates is also part of the plan. A few constituency MSPs lost then the divisor for the list goes down and Wokerati MSPs chances go up.
Certainly she is cunning enough.
Stu I came to the same conclusion and mentioned it before.
I believe Sturgeon wants a minority government. Thus saying there is no Indy mandate.
So us not voting SNP , is doing exactly what they want. I believe giving them a massive majority is the way to go now. It will leave Sturgeon with no more get outs. In any case if we deny them a majority then Sturgeon will just keeping truckin, and independence may die. At least there is a mandate from yes ,if we give them a majority. Then it’s up to the movement he we force Sturgeon to act.
Who in their right mind would trust them to deliver a referendum even if they got a majority?
Have we all not seen the heights of criminality they have reached in first trying to jail Alex Salmond and then in preventing the truth from coming out?
“When it is safe bla bla bla”
“Covid bla bla bla”
“Section 30 bla bla bla”.
Vote them out on principle. Even the unionists had enough shame to resign over far lesser breaches of the Ministerial Code.
This witch is a totally shameless corrupt criminal. Get her out.
Perhaps someone is being blackmailed?
I had a friend at college who was manic depressive, and he described his own condition as a capacity to think himself into an unhealthy state of mind which he didn’t have the capacity to think himself out of.
With Independence, and the Alex Salmond conspiracy, the SNP under Sturgeon demonstrates a propensity to bumble their way into bizarre and asinine situations, which they then have no capacity to extricate themselves from, even when the situation spirals out of control.
It is my firm conviction that Nicola Sturgeon lacks the capacity to think strategically, and cannot meaningfully join the dots between cause and effect.
With Independence, she is like the worst kind of General from WW1, uninspired, uninspiring, and in no small part, responsible for year after year of stagnation, and static indecisive trench warfare, but simply lacking the requisite competence and strategic initiative to break the deadlock. Everything they do try is stale, pedestrian, and predictable, and turns into a bloody disaster because there is no strategic acumen in the planning.
Criticism won’t be tolerated, and those appalled by the madness and the futile waste must be condemned for lacking moral fibre, because a breakdown of discipline is very dangerous to their hegemony and control – ‘Examples’ will be made, and conscientious objectors must be publicly reviled.
No matter what the cost is, this “leadership” has too much hubris and narcissism ever to resign, or admit their own failure. Only their summary removal and replacement with better leadership can save us, and without that change, we are doomed.
I think a lot of Yes supporters and SNP loyalists need to come to terms with the fact the SNP are lost.. it will never come back, the NEC shenanigans have proved that to me
There is a huge gap in the market for a true left of centre Indy party (What SNP were until 2015) but big hitters need to have confidence in themselves and voters to make jump over.
Though it doesnt make the point less true duh why does the Herald, which along with Record, played its part in the scandalous framing of Salmond now encourages people to focus on what the SG wants people to focus on?
Apropos the missing £600k; presumably there hasn’t been any lawful or accounting explanation of its whereabouts. That being the case, is it not a matter that one or a group of donors could report the matter to the police as a matter of theft, requiring, at the very least, some kind of police investigation?
It is tempting to see the current SNP as tartan Bolsheviks, though not because they are far left of course. Lenin was prepared to sign a Carthaginian peace with the Germans (which cost them little because the Germans had already effectively won in the East), so they could concentrate on defeating Russian White reactionaries, the Provisional Government, and indeed anyone on the left who didn’t accept Bolshevik leadership.
Communist zealotry meant Lenin and his mates didn’t care if a separate peace with Russia meant victory for the Germans, because they confidently expected the workers of the world to rise up in a global revolution. They were prepared to ditch the allies (who were all bourgeois reactionaries in their eyes anyway) and use clueless Russian moderates as a springboard to revolution
The Bolsheviks won their Civil War, partly because the opposition was pants (…that rings a bell, huh?), partly because the Western powers had neither the will nor the power to intervene and help defeat the Bolsheviks, but mainly because the Bolsheviks were nasty pieces of work, they were utterly committed to their cause and had no hesitation in betraying erstwhile friends. That kinda rings a bell too.
Another reason or the MAIN reason she has failed in even talking about indy is she is shite scared of it , it is one thing heading a government of underlings that you have chosen personally because they are intellectually subservient to you ,it would be another thing entirely trying to organise and prepare for independence with a shower of intellectual pygmies which would become very apparent
Sturgeon is not up for the challenge as has been apparent in the policies she has chosen to go forward , it is all about the LOOK , Big fish little pond syndrome
There’s seems to be a presumption that the SNP knows what it is doing, rather then being utterly clueless about most things. I wouldn’t trust this Party to run me a bath, never mind run an independent nation.
@Cosy Feet Pete
I know you’ll be reading this, as you constantly egosurf and, besides, your obsession with the blogging “community” is off the scale.
If you are going to have a go at bloggers, don’t do if through a blog – even one as banal and lamentable as yours – as it makes you look a bit simple. Happy pensioning!
Sturgeon’s idea of a good political day out is not an AUOB mass rally in Edinburgh with herself addressing the crowd. Rather, it’s taking part in an LGBT march through central London and speaking at Trafalgar Square and being cheered. Then selfies with various English luminaries whilst eagerly awaiting her plaudits in the Guardian. Then going to sleep wondering who’ll play her in the biopic of her heroic career.
She actually hates Scotland and the awake half of the Yes movement hates her.
Big Jock says,
“Then it’s up to the movement he we force Sturgeon to act.”
She has shown that she is above every law of the land.
If we couldn’t get her out now, there is no way we can get her out after she is given a majority.
The Rev. Stuart Campbell was pretty sure that she would have no option but to resign, and Hamilton had no option but to rule that she breached the Ministerial Code multiple times.
She has even managed to delay Hamilton’s report, so she can fob off any breaches by seeking a mandate from the public.
Every vote for the SNP she will consider a vote for her, an endorsement of her policies.
Vote them in and there won’t even be Wings Over Scotland to fall back to – it will have been banned.
Vote the criminals out and put them in jail.
The personal finances of the Murrell family increases by approx £15k EVERY month through a combination of salaries not spent and increases in their pension pots. Why would they want this to stop?
@scottieDog
It’s is exactly like Syriza in Greece, Tsipras called a referendum on accepting the EU Bailout with it’s austerity demands, Greeks where threatened with expulsion from the EU or EZ if they voted “Oxi” to the deal, but they went right ahead and voted Oxi anyway. Varoufakis says he then found Tsipras despondent in his office, Tsipras had intended to lose the referendum so he had an excuse to cave in to Brussels, he then caved in anyway.
The SNP isn’t trying to lose the election. This is just the stuff of silly conspiracy theorists. It’s nothing to do with the British State either. I think the Great Leader has finally been found out. Basically she has always been a gob on a stick. She isn’t particularly intelligent. Cunning and manipulative yes, but leadership/ statesmanship ,no. She may win the election, but she is demonstrating to the people of the whole UK that Independence will never be achieved under her tutelage.
It all makes perfect sense if you imagine just for the sake of argument that Sturgeon is a placewoman for the UK Government or MI5 has something on her such that they’re able to detonate a nuclear bomb under the independence campaign by remote control.
I suspect that the answer to why now is that the entryists thought there was an opportunity. They know that if they press on, the majority might let it through just to avoid the noise. They know that if it was a less important time for the yes movement, they would have to rely on the actual support for their views. The real question is how the entryists managed to take over, and how quickly we can kick them out.
Columnists in mainstream media agreeing with Alt Right Platform[TM] Wings Over Scotland? Shurely not!!??!?
Anyway: isn’t it high time to move beyond bewailing the SNP and on to figuring out how to build a rival political party that scratches the itch the SNP won’t scratch? We’ve heard this song quite a few times before now.
I think there would some merit in trying to give them the biggest majority we possibly could, if and only if, there is a clear and achievable mechanism for clearing out & reforming the SNP.
I don’t think there is such a mechanism.
Although it would be nice to think that the SNP are taking a dive the reality I suspect is that they don’t think that they’re doing anything wrong. They’ll have convinced themselves that they are correct and the rest of us are too stupid, misogynistic, racist, ableist etc. to understand.
We’re in a time where 2+2=5, where getting something correct is a symbol of white supremacy, where men should be banned from wearing sunglasses as it’s sexist. The world has gone bloody daft and has bugger all to do with deep state or corruption. It’s because if a politician wears the right colour of rosette we vote for them thinking they share the same priorities that we do.
1971Thistle says:
13 March, 2021 at 3:59 pm
“Fully agree, have argued same on Twitter (futile exercise). It explains a great deal, without the need for intellectual gymnastics.
However, the faithful cannot admit to themselves they’ve been duped – way too painful. They need a reason that justifies the faith they’ve put in.
So, bloggers it is, I’m afraid – you’re copping the flak (except court circular editor WGD, of course)”
Aye, can confirm that. Personal conversation yesterday – Person wouldn’t accept SNP are not going to take us to independence and it will be all the fault of people like me who won’t vote for them.
I don’t think we can second guess the reasons.
If it is a plan to reduce their vote so they get enough but not too much, it’s a plan that can’t be comtrolled.
I never thought NS was incompetent but I do now.
If that is true about her time as a solicitor, it adds to my thoughts that she cannot make a decision.
She needs to be told what to do.
I will vote with my conscience.
No vote SNP constituency and either ISP or AFI for the list
Or maybe alternatively – try to give them a majority, but make sure we have a massively supported, civic independence convention (or something like it) *not* established, populated by, and controlled by the SNP.
Breeks says,
“the SNP under Sturgeon demonstrates a propensity to bumble their way into bizarre and asinine situations, which they then have no capacity to extricate themselves from, even when the situation spirals out of control.”
Breeks, they have very successfully extricated themselves from being held responsible, jailed, for the conspiracy against Alex Salmond.
They are in total corrupt and criminal control over every organ of the State.
Alex Salmond’s truthful testimony, with evidence, was swept aside by Sturgeon’s blatant lies under oath in from of the cameras.
This has been allowed to descend into groundhog day farce territory due to the failure to act on the initial mandate garnered through the material change in circumstance generated with the UK EU leave vote.
There needs to be clear separation of the democratic processes in which Scotland elects the Councillors to our Local Authorities, the MSPs to our Scottish Parliament to administrate the devolved powers, and the MPs we send to Westminster.
Continually contaminating our “normal” electoral processes with mandate generating over our constitutional status is wrecking our day to day politics, as we have to endure un-mandated policies we don’t want foisted on to us by politicians we elected for different reasons.
Counter to our Claim of Right, this is most definitely not the form of Governance that best suits Scotland’s needs.
Something has to change to break this cycle, and it doesn’t appear that our current choice of politicians are going to instigate what is required for that to occur, as they seem overly content to ride the gravy train, so it is left to the electorate to force change and clear the blockage so we can begin to move forward.
Good post.
Could a story have been sold to NS that is bigger than independence?
COVID doesn’t kill many people, but looks like it maybe going to restructure the World economy.
Obviously the Salmond fit up predates COVID and maybe not related.
Tony O’Neill says:
13 March, 2021 at 4:29 pm
If anyone is refusing to vote or even spoil their ballot for the snp in the first vote then don’t. Give to another Indy party instead,except for the greens.
Easier said than done. Pretty sure my options will be SNP, Lib dem,Tory or lab in constituency.
@Brian DoontheToon 4:27
I don’t accept your description of the ISP.
This was discussed at ISP branch meetings and the members wanted candidates they selected on a mandate the members had voted for.
I’ve been Looking at a number of comments on the idea from a number of non members that the ISP are the bad guys..
Tell me why I should accept a candidate as my list MSP who has not been questioned at a husting. Has no manifesto and to my knowledge has not been through any form of vetting.
I noticed someone on the previous blog claim the AFI were committed to a plebiscite election – show me the document they all signed and explain how they can be held to it even if they did since they have no collective authority.
You vote how you wish but don’t tell members of another Party what to do.
Why are the Greens exempt from your criticism ?
why are Independents exempt?
The AFI candidates who I know are good people and I wish them well but what you ask is no different from Pete Wishart asking me to step aside for the SNP for the sake of Indy.
Let the Voters decide based on what the hear over the next few weeks.
Liz says,
“I will vote with my conscience.
No vote SNP constituency and either ISP or AFI for the list”
If ever there was a time to put conscience before pragmatism, it is now.
Get the corrupt criminals out of a job. Wipe the smiles from their faces.
The independence movement will be able to regroup if and only if the SNP is out of the way.
It looks like the SNP are sort of short of funds.
https://twitter.com/andrewgmorton/status/1370727492697346050
twathater says:
Couldn’t agree with you more, like going into battle with untrained troops.
IMO We have three possible outcomes from this election regarding the NewSNP:
1) The country votes them back into power with a majority, they are forced to have an independence referendum by the electorate (which is a waste of time as WM already has & will veto it through continued denial of S30, the NewSNP leaders already know this and carry on bleating it out regardless).
If the NewSNP fail to comply to this umteenth mandate then voters might/should/will go elsewhere should such an alternative pro-indy party which stands in both the constituency and the list exist by then.
2) The country votes them in with a minority power-sharing vote along with the Greens again, we’ll be in the same situation as we are in now where the SNP can initiate anything-but-indy bills such as the HCB and GRA which nobody needs or wants and force them through parliament with the aid of the Wokey McWokey Greens.
3) The country votes them into a lesser position where they cannot form a government, opening the doors for a different coalition government or the yoons. The NewSNP are out of power and will spend the next Scottish election cycle purging the party of non-Sturgeonista’s and deselecting the few good MPs that we do have for the next WM election, going full blown woke modelled on their prototype party the Scottish Greens.
To be honest the WM scenario above is probably coming down the pipe regardless which of three scenarios above comes true.
Unless every election becomes a plebicite the UK Government can and will veto every single time they are approached about a S30, all they have to say is “no” because to them Scotland is a colony of which they hold all the levers of true power.
Devolution has been a welcome tool demonstrating to the subjugated Scottish people that we are fully capable of managing our own affairs, but it is now being wilfully and fully abused by the NewSNP and Greens to extend into pro-devo / devo-max rather than full blown Scottish Independence.
The NewSNP and McWokey-Greens may have independence in their manifestos, but it serves only as a token to keep pro independence minded Scots’ voting them into positions of power, over and over again.
So we’re left with the prospect of vast numbers of the Scottish electorate being disenfranchised with no large political party who represent them and their views, they might not even turn out to vote or spoil their ballots.
This is exactly what the NewSNP want, they are playing a psycological game with everyones’ hearts and conscience, making pro-independence citizens who fundamentally disagree with bills the NewSNP have enacted have to go against their conscience and morals for even a hope of Scottish independence to remain by voting the NewSNP back into power.
It’s a vicious dirty vindictive mind game that Nicola Sturgeon and the NewSNP are playing against the people of Scotland.
There is a huge vacuum in pro-indy Scottish politics at the moment, Scotland needs pro-indy parties such as the ISP and AFI to not only stand on the list but in the constituency as well or another new pro-indy party which can get big pro-indy names behind it to do so.
The NewSNP are finished as a vehicle towards Scottish independence that much is patently clear and the Greens have only ever been in politics to push Stonewalls’ manifesto onto the people of Scotland.
Och, to be honest, I never wanted independence anyway. I’m so glad they have told me what I never realised myself for the last 40 years. I’m obviously a complete dullard. 🙁
They fundamentally do not want independence. It was never about getting independence and then dealing with this ordure; it was always about dealing with this ordure, and, maybe, sometime in the far and distant future, there might come a time when independence could be a goodish idea. Maybe. In the meantime, keep the sheeple baaaahhh-ing and munching placidly with promises of deliverance any day now.
This pseudo ‘woke’ stuff is much, much bigger than Scotland, the SNP or independence, and even all three together. The foot-dragging was deliberate. The refusal to act on what the 2014 result told us and find a different route to independence, was deliberate. The attempt to undermine a Brexit exit, by incorporating the entire UK, and which was designed to fail, if only on a democratic level, and to eschew independence as the answer, was deliberate. The decision to ask over and over for a mandate and never use it to achieve independence was deliberate.
I don’t believe that Nicola Sturgeon herself was ever hot on independence, but, from 2015 onwards, the infiltration by the middle-class, bourgeoisie (oh, I am so full of ennui, so bored that I need to find a cause to make me feel better) pseudo ‘wokerati’ ensured its demise. The pseudo ‘wokerati’ are the vanguard and handmaidens of corporate America, and the chosen vehicle to prepare the ground for the next launch of predatory capitalism in the form of the tech industry/pharmaceuticals/prosthetics/health insurance, etc.
That requires that the health service – the entire one, not just the English one – be open to being swallowed by corporate interests in The States. And that’s just for starters. Independence cannot take place in those circumstances because the Tories are adamant that Scotland will be part of the deal when the advertisement, ‘The UK is now up for sale’ is ready to be displayed.
The pseudo ‘wokerati”s strings are being pulled by Stonewall and its affiliates, largely financed by rich men (and a trans woman here and there) of corporate America/Canada – it is also financed by the very governments and councils, public institutions and private firms and businesses it captures and/or intimidates into compliance – but it is, itself, just the vehicle for softening up the whole of the West (check out the number of countries it has infiltrated and the number of governments it has captured) for the next wave of Mammon-inspired enrichment of the few at the expense of the many. Its reward is its own perpetuation and the opening up of areas of unlicensed sexuality masquerading as equality and self-expression for all.
Why would the SNPG go along with it? Partly because it is corrupt, self-serving and is in thrall to Westminster, and partly because it lacks the imagination and nous to see the wood for the trees. It has been captured by a cult whose aims and underhand tactics match its own, but which pulls its strings, even as its own strings are being pulled. Millions of Germans fell under Hitler’s spell, millions of Russians under Stalin’s spell, Cambodians under Pol Pot’s spell (usually the young) and cultish religions have been created around the sexual appetites and Mammon-worshipping tendencies of particularly corrupt men, for centuries.
Nah. I really don’t think Mrs. Murrell, her cronies or in fact, any of the leadership have the nous, savvy, brains, call it what you will, to devise any kind of plan like this. This is just pure luck and coincidence.
These people are no better than your average middle manager.
There’s no way they could concoct any sort of plan like this.
I think you are being over conspiratorial.
An alternative interpretation is that the SNP are just expressing the ideological viewpoint of the professional and managerial class(PMC). This blinds them to an extent to the ideology of the broader population.
The SNP MSPs are overwhelmingly drawn from this class. There are very few semi-skilled or skilled manual workers among them. We also know from demographic data that LGBT are more common in the PMC than in the general population. Among politicians being LGB gives a distinct advantage, in that you are less likely to be pre-occupied with looking after children leaving more time for a political carreer. If you have no children, if all your friends are from the same social class, and many of them are LGB then you can easily fall prey to the illusion that the particular concerns of your social class and social circle are shared by the population at large.
The PMC dominance also goes along with the new neo-liberal economic strategy put forward for an independent nation. They take New Zealand as their model, a nation which out Thatchered Thatcher in economic policy.
If you are a Gay or Lesbian member of the professional or managerial class, it may be easy to imagine that being progressive means above all addressing the concerns of yourself and your friends.
Nunc autem quid? Cui bono?
The above thanks to the efforts of Mr. Fulton some time in 1982..
John Swinney has just said that the OECD report into Curriculum for Excellence cannot be shown to MSP’s and to do so would put him in breach of the Ministerial Code. Absolute pish.
I think NS is hanging on until the election so she can hand over to Angus Robertson. Angus is as likely to achieve independence as I am to become an astronaut.
Nicola can’t survive another whole Parliament as the Salmond stuff will not go away.
So the best hope/scenario is for Angus to fail to win his seat, Nicola to scarper for some exotic non job and someone actually in favour of independence and who has some gumption to take over.
Then we can quietly conduct our purge and put the cause back on track. It’s a big ask but I like happy endings.
Ingwe says,
“Apropos the missing £600k; presumably there hasn’t been any lawful or accounting explanation of its whereabouts. That being the case, is it not a matter that one or a group of donors could report the matter to the police as a matter of theft, requiring, at the very least, some kind of police investigation?”
It would be surprising if at least one complaint had not been made.
But remember these days the police and prosecutors only go for supporters of Alex Salmond.
They have no time or resources to look into any other crimes.
And of course they can’t do much other work during COVID.
Mist001
Tend to agree
Bunch of mediocres they could not plan a review of a complaint the chances of planning further is a nonsence.
I am astonished she has not condemned the attack on cherry so for me that says it all. She has been compromised and we need to think about how to deliver what her controllers least want…. A majority
My mind was made up on the 31st January 2020: this woman is in my view a political impostor, pretending to be who she is not. How long this has been going on, I have no clue.
She has deliberately disembowelled the SNP, deliberately trashed our popular sovereignty, deliberately used S30 as a weapon to wound us with and denying us self determination, deliberately used our votes against us to preserve the union, deliberately sought division within the yes movement by attacking Mr Salmond and as that failed, she is now deliberately alienating women.
This woman in my view has been working for the British state at least since November 2014. It is my view that she was tasked with rendering the SNP innocuous to the British state and with containing the yes tide from 2014 until the fury of forcing brexit on us was over and our powers stolen from us. That is why she needed Mr Salmond out of the SNP and front line politics.
This is why we had so many pro indy polls and why this fraud has seen a staggering number of 25 polls putting independence ahead and has done absolutely nothing to deliver indyref.
Independence support is going down (allegedly) because of lack of action. This was expected and in my opinion it is exactly what these people were deliberately planning for and why this woman has done everything to keep Scotland trapped in the UK stalling the pro indy movement.
They have been monitoring us continuously to check when they can inflict on us their next toxic “gift”, which undoubtedly will be so toxic that they will need first to be sure pro-indy support goes to “safe” levels, hence this heinous bill. Divide and conquer indeed.
If she wasn’t a stooge of the British state, there is no way that with the astonishing levels of corruption she presided over, with the breaches of the ministerial code and with those 500,000 pounds vanishing from the SNP accounts she would still be in post over 2 years after the unlawful actions of her government served taxpayers with a bill of over half a million pounds and goodness knows how many millions from the criminal case.
We have to face reality: the SNP as a pro indy vehicle is dead. This woman took away the engine and the wheels and handed them over to the British state.
So, are we going to waste the next precious 8 weeks bracing for whatever the British state has in store for us while we mourn the murder of the SNP and pray for its unlikely resurrection, or are we going to do something about it, like for example getting at least one pro indy party to put the end of the union in their manifesto?
If something has become clear in the last few days is that any chance of indyref with the SNP reborn as a British state tool under Sturgeon’s hands is a delusion. The only path for us to get independence is by pro indy parties including a mandate for independence in their manifesto.
kapelmeister says:
13 March, 2021 at 4:41 pm
“Sturgeon’s idea of a good political day out is not an AUOB mass rally in Edinburgh with herself addressing the crowd. Rather, it’s taking part in an LGBT march through central London and speaking at Trafalgar Square and being cheered.”
Her next bestest idea of a good political day was to swiftly summon the Zoom cameras and broadcast late at night a spontaneous, unscripted spiel (Yerrsss! Definitely unscripted!) – to a few dozen disenchanted wokeists who claimed to be leaving:
“Oh, please! Do not leave! Do come back! Mother Nicola will protect you few dozen wokeists from the majority of SNP members who think you are daft/malicious/crazy etc.
Old Ma Nicola believes in all youse transies etc., and there is a very special place for youse all in my heart.”
[Thinks to herself – “That’ll get rid of quite a few more members who I don’t want anyway!”]
Graeme Hampton says,
“So the best hope/scenario is for Angus to fail to win his seat”
Craig Murray should stand against him as an independent.
It could become a repeat of the Martin Bell movement against the, was it Hamiltons.
Craig Murray in a white suit against Robertson and his wife Jennifer Dempsey, who had a crush for Alex Salmond before settling for Robertson.
I can’t say I’ve thought through all the consequences but might be funny if a single list MSP from ISP/AFI was the balance of power between an SNP + Greens majority and a unionist majority.
Michael Russell was asked this question about rushing it by Christopher McEleny
https://twitter.com/Feorlean/status/1362505970816061442
His reply
‘Why ? Surely the desire to get it right (despite a tight end of session process) on which (commendably) the whole cross party effort is now focused ,might on this occasion be allowed to overcome any inconvenience? Better to light a candle than curse the darkness …..’
I must be thick because i don’t understand a word he is saying.
If i take all the clauses out it reads.
‘Why ? Surely the desire to get it right might be allowed to overcome any inconvenience?’
is it just me? Does that make sense. Surely the desire to get it right is the overriding principal? What inconvenience, getting women on board, that inconvenience. That seems to be supporting Chris’s point.
Happy to be put right.
I am realising that many people in Holyrood think it is one great theatrical production and have lost touch with the real world completely. Possibly because they have no real opposition.
I think they could be so dumb that they don’t even realise this is controversial. I wouldn’t be surprised if they thought this was going to be a breeze. Read TalkingUpScotland, the Prof JR doesn’t seem to think anything can rock the NS/SNP support. They have a collective delusion of grandeur. Several politicians are displaying symptoms common to many powerful people, sociopathy. NS has gone mad.
Yep, the very question I’ve been battling with for months & months. I’d already worked out they don’t want Independence. There was evidence everywhere that backed my theory up (a bit like the conspiracy to fit up Alex Salmond!) and you didn’t even have to look hard. So the question then became ‘what to do about it’.
Do I refuse to vote for them & support what they want? Or do I vote for them & refuse to let them off the Indy hook? Given the appalling policies they are introducing, most women’s instincts scream, ‘Don’t vote for that!’… But my head says, if they get a minority govt, they’ll do that ANYWAY. Women lose either way – so what do women do? I know what my thrawn Scots nature is encouraging me to do… Do I let myself & other women down if I do it? Hmmm… a real poser, for sure…
Stay at home, write nonsense on the ballot paper, vote for a none Independence Party
and you get a second Unionist government.
Most likely a Tory Lib Dem pact.
Boris can visit his other parliament and implicate all sorts
if cuts for us. Get his wishes to put us in a ghetto and eliminate us.
Baroness Ruthless can walk among us in her ermine robes.
Dross can read out his Westminster script like he has a brain.
You can tie me to a tree and shoot me first, and that might their plan too.
Independence by any means is an eternal flame for me and anything
in the way can be consumed by the fire.
I have been if the opinion since early 2015 that the actions of the sturgeon led SNP were contrary to what one would expect of a party honestly working towards independence. Almost everything they have done could be construed as bolstering the union.
Their popularity was not because of what they were doing but all to do with what the Tories were doing. They were not popular because of Sturgeon but despite her.
Far too much has been put in place to blame it on stupidity ( although there was plenty of that too).
There is no doubt that all of this and the safeguards, such as the Hate Crime bill and Gender recognition policies, placed specifically to ameliorate any large majority for independence, were put in place deliberately.
If it hadn’t been for the issues surrounding the Alex Salmond conspiracy which has really brought it all to a head they would have got away with it, and we would have once more taken the carrot, only again, once more, to discover that the section 30 route is not viable and another 5 years without any move to independence.
It has all went wrong for them and now they are embarked upon a scorched earth policy.
The only question in my mind is who is behind it all? I have a feeling the answer to that might surprise a hell of a lot of people.
I put a great deal of effort into selecting a new Party to get behind for both Independence and for the Holyrood Parliament post Independence.
I have made an effort to get involved, probably more so, than I did with the SNP over the last few years.
We all hope for an Independent Scotland and we will all do what we can to achieve it. However trying to portray a Party that was kicked off a few years ago as somehow in the wrong for staying true to their intent is unfair.
I hope the ISP remain loyal to the chosen candidates and the wishes of the Party members. I left the SNP because they ignored my voice.
Good luck to every Independence supporting candidate on the list. Getting behind who and what you believe in does not have to mean running down fellow Indy supporters.
@Kcor 5.15pm
I’d love to see Robertson loose. It’s my constituency and it’s a shame there probably isn’t anyone else I can bring myself to vote for. For most of my voting life – much of it in England granted – I’ve had to vote tactically to try and stop Tories. If I could bring myself to vote tactically for a Tory to keep Robertson out I would….but I just can’t do it.
So….spoiled ballot for constituency vote, and ISP for list.
We just have to hope the SNP can’t do too much damage in the next 5 years. No danger of a referendum or independence of course, it’s just wondering what other horrors they might come up with. 🙁
Mia says,
“The only path for us to get independence is by pro indy parties including a mandate for independence in their manifesto.”
What chance do you think there is of pro indy List only parties getting more than 50% of the vote in the coming Scottish election?
I’ll be voting SNP for my constituency for two main reasons. Firstly, it’s a personal vote for the SNP candidate, so to her I say, please don’t let me down, and stay true to yourself. Secondly, it’s to keep the Tories out. That’s it. But it’s despite the loathsome behaviour of NS and her pals, the arrogance of our government, and the deliberate sidelining of SNP democracy, all of which led to me leaving the party last month. And after this, my vote is up for grabs. The list vote? Oh, that’s going to any other independence party but the SNP, and if any party has the backing of Alex, that’s the party I’ll vote for.
Tony O’Neill says:
13 March, 2021 at 4:29 pm
“If anyone is refusing to vote or even spoil their ballot for the snp in the first vote then don’t. Give to another Indy party instead,except for the greens.Not forgetting to vote for the isp on the list.”
AM I missing something? There is another independence party standing in the constituency?
Dear Wings over Scotland, new to this site. Having read all the comments over the last few weeks I have come to the conclusion that the SNP don’t want a majority. It is my belief that they are terrified of having to govern an Independent Scotland. We would be bankrupt as an nation. When you look at the tax payer’s money that they have squandered over the last few years it beggars belief. They, meanwhile keep lining their pockets. Please people vote them out. For the 1st time ever I am ashamed to be Scottish with these people supposed to be representing us.
My SNP MP insisted that there is no division in the party. The listed what they had done.
Selective listening, as most folk know SNP is in a mess at Holyrood.
Are you guys serious about still voting SNP? After all this?
I am sorry but Stu is wrong about this one, despite his general genius.
The SNP is acting this way for 2 reasons:
1: they think they can get away with anything. They are invincible. The media supports them, they can spin the story any way they like, the Crown office and the opposition are sleeping. Idiots like us will probably even vote them again. Sturgeon is popular and she is relaxed.
2: this hcb transgender stuff is probably pushed by the greens. They need to do the green agenda because the greens keep them in power. The greens probably got this stuff in exchange for keeping them in power. They need them, they push their agendas.
That’s all. It’s not a mystery. For God’s sake, don’t vote SNP!
Peter Kinnaird says:
13 March, 2021 at 5:23 pm
“I’ll be voting SNP for my constituency for two main reasons. Firstly, it’s a personal vote for the SNP candidate, so to her I say, please don’t let me down, and stay true to yourself. ”
I felt like that until not one of them voted against the Hate Crime Bill. Now I don’t feel I can trust any of them.
Kcor says:
13 March, 2021 at 5:15 pm
Graeme Hampton says,
‘So the best hope/scenario is for Angus to fail to win his seat’
“Craig Murray should stand against him as an independent.
[…]
Craig Murray in a white suit against Robertson and his wife Jennifer Dempsey […]”
=======
Oh! Would that such could happen! I would spend as much of my pension and life savings** to leave me almost destitute in order to see the likes of Craig Murray – or *any* other Scotsman of integrity (and there’s one not too far away from her!) – stand in that election scenario.
**After all, I doubt if I would need any of my life savings should the current mess of rogues and vagabonds be returned in May. It would lead me to an early (earlier) grave.
Exactly right, cheers rev.
NS has made a complete fool of us with her “faux independence” crap.
And as for those spineless politicians keeping their traps shut – don’t get me bloody started – supposedly representing the views and needs of their constituents.
Seriously hoping for a new strong, intelligent, politically savvy party to emerge later this year.
Since we’ve labelled them the New SNP, because of the eerie parallels with Blair, and recalling that Sturgeon professed to finding the word National in her party’s name such an embarassment, I suggest they change officially to the Scottish New Party.
They won’t have that horrible word National anymore, and even better they’ll never need to cringe at being given the misnomer Scottish Nationalist Party – I can see why it upsets them so – by people down south.
A bonus would be that very little of the party livery, literature etc would need to be redone since you have SNP both before and after. And they really have to look after the pennies now. Rebranding is so costly. Queen Nic’s election bus wouldn’t need changing. Except, that is she’ll be wanting an even bigger picture of hersel oan the side. Egotism is an ever hungrier beast.
So there we are…the Scottish New Party. Promising to deliver more of that sexy devolution and more progressiveness.
Us nationalists can get on with pursuing our goals.
Andy Ellis says,
“I’d love to see Robertson loose.”
“If I could bring myself to vote tactically for a Tory to keep Robertson out I would….but I just can’t do it.”
I know it is an almost impossible choice.
But just think about it. One more Tory MSP will not make much of a difference, when Scotland is effectively ruled by a Tory government from Westminster.
But think of the satisfaction we will all get by actively getting out those who betrayed Alex Salmond and conspired to put him in jail to preserve their cosy and lucrative jobs in the Scottish and UK parliaments.
Put the bastards and bitches on the dole and deny them their pension rights as much as possible.
The inquiry will have failed to expose her, as it was designed to do. Mr Hamilton may do so; we’ll find out soon. She, astonishingly, appears to be protected by the legal system. I posted some time back that the only way left for us plebs is the ballot box.
I toyed briefly recently on the argument about giving the SNP a landslide victory at constituency level to in essence, call their bluff. It has some merit till you consider her most heinous plan.
The imprisonment of Alex Salmond with the full and certain knowledge of it’s fabrication.
She has to go, then Mr. Salmond can do his worst as best he can.
We have to deny her the minority government this article suggests she craves for all the reasons in it and some additional ones in comments btl.
That means only 3 options are left.
– Spoiled ballot 1. Pro-Indy party 2.
– Abstain 1. Pro-Indy party 2.
– “Most likely to beat SNP in your constituency” party 1 PIP 2.
A coalition of the useless doesn’t scare me at all. None of them have any policies to coalesce around. Even if they had any policies they couldn’t agree on what to coalesce around. It’ll collapse under the weight of it’s own incompetence. Scotland will be administered, not governed, for a period. Good. Belgium had no government at all for 3 years some years back and thrived by all accounts. So will we.
The priority for all believers in Independence who love freedom, with a respect for human rights and the rule of law is to get rid of this woman, her coterie and the craven fools who call themselves SNP MSP’s.
So a new argument for the great unwashed on here. Which of the 3 options best achieves her demise?
@Captain Yossarian
You mean THIS report which can be found on OECD website?
http://www.oecd.org/education/school/Improving-Schools-in-Scotland-An-OECD-Perspective.pdf
Captain Yossarian
Or is there a different one?
Why am I thinking of Vizzini’s Sicilian dilemma.
I dunno, just glad something made me laugh. Never go against a cybernat when independence is on the line!
Now, a clever man would not vote for the SNP, because he would know that only a great fool would vote for the terrible manifesto they have given. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not choose to vote for the SNP. But they must have known I was not a great fool; they would have counted on it, so I can clearly not choose not to not vote for the SNP…
Independence? Inconceivable!
@Carnyx
Yes indeed which led to varoufakis walking away. He had a plan, and a fairly decent one too but like the SNP Tsipras lacked the moral fibre to see it through.
Just like Greece and the EU, there is no velvet divorce on offer from the UK. It’s a bumpy ride for all concerned. Our current stock of politicians aren’t prepared to interrupt their salary or gold plated pensions to see Scotland flourish.
For decades in Scotland there was a pretty good living to be had in the Labour Party. It didn’t matter much who was in government at Westminster, for very little effort you could keep a bench warm down south or use your party connections to line your pockets or get yourself into any number of cushy public sector roles.
Yet when you spoke to Labour voters there were very few dancing down to the polling booth filled with excitement at the thought of a Labour government. I recall asking people why they were voting Labour and nine times out ten getting the answer “to stop a Tory getting in”. I’d go on to ask why they didn’t vote SNP and get either “waste of a vote” or “it might split the vote and let a Tory in”.
Most people aren’t all that politically engaged and are grudgingly content vote for something they know is a bit pish if they think it stops something worse getting in. Like Labour before them, it would suit the SNP nicely to have a reliable set of voters who demand nothing from them. Ditching people who read or write blogs, organise marches, meetings and street stalls is a small price to pay for an easy life.
All the perks of power and no one annoying you about when the indyref is is quite attractive to a certain type. The problem as the SNP will learn in time is that when your cushy lifestyle is threatened by an electoral rival you’ve alienated all the people who were willing to get off their arses and chap doors for you.
Anyone hoping for a great upset in May is in for a disappointment, the task ahead of us to to come up with viable alternative to the SNP before 2024.
Rev Stu
You can delete my two previous comments as I realize Captain Yossarian was referring to the ongoing study by the OECD which is at the draft report stage. It should be published in July this year
Maybe she’s just doing what she always did. Maybe losing campaigns – just, but losing them all the same – is what she’s good at. Everybody likes doing what they’re good at. And you get better and better at it the more often you do it.
Maybe she learned this trick in 2014. There she was, beside Alex Salmond all the way (or so we thought) but, of course, he was the high profile one, not her. He got the support up – great. But maybe our wee Nick waa happy at that, but even happier that Alex didn’t quite manage to get it over the line.
That was just the perfect result for her. Maybe the one she was really working for all along. Get the vote within a whisker, but don’t win. Perfect.
Because, in that circumstance, she knew fine well that Alex would do the decent thing, and resign. And she was already lined up to be the shoe-in that would be the next leaser. That was all foreseen, and fixed in advance. And, in fact, if he had not done the decent thing, she would have engineered all kinds of trouble for him behind the scenes until he was ousted, and she seized wgat she now saw as her ‘birthright’ – the leadership.
Alex didn’t have an inkling that such was the plan, and still trusted her. He thought he was putting the SNP and the whole independence movement into safe hands. He had not yet realised what he discovered later, namely that she was – in his words, if I remember rightly – a ‘person of ill will’. He had been played, and so had we all. He discovered that, to his cost, a good couple of years before we did. Salmond for the clanger was the high profile test case for her – now that she reckons it’s succeeded, she thinks she can go for all of us. Or at least for whoever she wants, whenever she wants. Meanwhile, in 2014 he had created the wave of support that gave her the greatest start imaginable – and, boy, did she capitalise on it.
Losing that referendum was the greatest thing that ever happened to our Nicola S. It catapulted her into power. Just imagine if we had won it – everything would have been in Alex Salmond’s control: she would have had to wait at least another ten years before she got anywhere near the crown she coveted. And in ten years anything could happen – she could easily put her foot in it, and be out before she got there. It seems it had already happened to her in her legal career (in 1998?), and it could just as easily happen in her political career too, since politics is such a precarious business.
That narrow loss in September 2014 was the best possible outcome for only one person – Nicola Sturgeon. She was the real winner of the referendum. In fact, if she had a religion a bit higher than the self-worship which seems to preoccupy her, she would have been praying for that precise result all along. It meant that she came into power with a far higher support and more goodwill from the general public than anything the SNP had ever experienced before. And it was permanent, because the Yes-supporting vote had gone up by something like a massive 16 points as a result of the indy campaign undertaken by AS, and it stayed there. Because it did not depend on him personally, but on genuine conviction. And she exploited it stupid, for her own ends.
She knows how handy it is to lose, and how great the dividend can be. Especially if what you lose by is not much – and not so much that it finishes you off, and you have to go. Even the loss in the Westminster GE when she lost so many seats and so many voters stayed at home, was no great loss to her. She was already soft-peddling on independence beforehand, keeping it out of the campaign, and she used that result to soft-peddle on it even further, acting as if the SNP had been a loser in that election when in fact – despite its losses – it still held a majority of the Scottish seats in Westminster.
Surely there is a pattern. She sure knows how to lose – and, in terms of her own personal aggrandisement, at how to profit all the way from losing. Narrow losses are her forte. She is very very good at them, and they suit her down to the ground. Actually, she has always been a lousy campaigner, or so I have always thought. What I never realised until now was that that was probably deliberate on her part. And here she goes again … Lose by just enough so you don’t have to act on what you pretend to promise, but not by so much that you end up out of office (or discredited in the eyes of those higher-up international level of politics – the moon and the stars – that you are now really aiming for).
She really is our modern day Lady MacBeth, with all that stop-at-nothing, dagger-wielding, all-encompassing and overweening ambition. And you might say ‘Naw, naw – she’s not intelligent enough to work all that out, plan it and go for it’. With regard to the ‘not being sufficiently intelligent’ factor I can agree with you. But it’s not intelligence you need at this point, or for these ends. it’s just cunning, and that she has in spades.
Where she gets it all from I will leave you to your imagination. But if lies that seem to succeed for a while (even when they shouldn’t, and ought to be seen through) are spawned by the Father of Lies, they usually only last so long – and then very suddenly they are gone. Like a puff of smoke. And so too is their perpetrator. Gone! Just as suddenly as she or he came.
Hitler boasted that the lies on which his Reich were founded would last for a thousand years. It didn’t take long. Only a few short years later, and the ghost of his lies was lying in the rubble of that bunker underneath a destroyed Berlin. Gone like a puff of smoke, but not until after ll that terrible confusion and destruction.
Let’s hope the smoke overtakes our wee Nic sooner rather than later, before it goes that far. Maybe time to get beyond self-worship, and start sending up a wee prayer or two, or more. I don’t know when she’ll be yanked, but she will be. Let’s just hope we can hurry it along … Come the day …
Big Jock says:
3 March, 2021 at 4:31 pm
Spot on…All indy supporters must vote snp 1.
even if it makes u sick.
After that,if they dont act on it,all yessers (all yessers),
give them hell!
Last free vote snp.
Willie Jay says,
“Oh! Would that such could happen!”
It is not too late for it to happen.
Craig Murray would be the ideal candidate against Robertson.
Tommy Sheridan against Sturgeon.
A genuinely pro independence, credible, well known candidate standing against each SNP constituency MSP.
Wipe them out.
I get what you’re saying Stu, and you may be right. But for me it’s just huge hubris and a dogmatic ideology on display. The scary thing is that they’re going to take even a reduced “win” in May as an endorsement of cranking up the Woketron 2000. I’m aware of some extreme levels of anger and I think this shit could easily become violent. It’s unbelievable how they’ve managed to get huge sections of the Yes movement at each other’s throats. I imagine the Unionists are like the Roman soldiers in the tunnels in Monty Python & The Holy Grail.
Hi Geoff Anderson at 4:59 pm.
You typed,
“Tell me why I should accept a candidate as my list MSP who has not been questioned at a husting. Has no manifesto and to my knowledge has not been through any form of vetting.”
Have there been hustings? News to me.
You also typed,
“You vote how you wish but don’t tell members of another Party what to do.
Why are the Greens exempt from your criticism ?
why are Independents exempt?”
I think the Greens are gonna be sadly disappointed after the election. I don’t know enough about any independents to criticise them.
You finished with,
“Let the Voters decide based on what the hear over the next few weeks.”
I looked into the ISP web site this week and saw that they are putting up no more than two candidates on each regional list. Compare that to the number of SNP regional candidates.
IF AFI and ISP each put up two regional candidates, then it’s possible that either could get two elected. However, If the ISP candidates also presented under the AFI banner, albeit with their own, clearly explained policies, then all the AFI votes would be affected by the divisor mechanism, filtering down.
This could result in one or more AFI and one or more ISP being elected, depending on how many voters transfer their regional vote from the SNP.
What’s wrong with an agreement between AFI and ISP that would share the regional lists in the manner of ISP, AFI, ISP, AFI in half the regions and AFI, ISP, AFI, ISP in the other half?
What seems to be sidelined, by concentrating on ‘peripheral’ policies, is that the whole point of both AFI and ISP should be to work for our independence, as a priority.
O/T but worrying to see the recent spate of haberdashery-based vandalism is still ongoing.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-56386185
“If she called a referendum and lost then NS would have to stand down. Such a risk is counterintuitive to the logic of a megalomaniac”
She knows and everybody else knows she should have resigned already in January 2019. The fact that this breathtakingly corrupt and incompetent FM is still in power after that point tells us she is a stooge the British state still finds more useful in post that out of it.
It is my opinion the british state has kept her in power to stop a real pro indy leader taking control of the SNP and uncovering what was really behind the complains procedure, the hunting of Mr Salmond and the extent of the involvement of the British state on that.
The writing has always been in the wall since they announced those 3000 civil servants coming to Scotland: the British state would keep this political impostor in control of the SNP until either it was safe to pass the control of that party to their next conditioned puppet or they deemed the situation was safe enough for them taking over completely.
She will never call a referendum because she has been tasked with denying us one and with stalling and exhausting the independence movement until it gives up at least temporarily. The only reason why the British state has so far got away with denying us this referendum for 5 years is that they have done so through the SNP a party that since November 2014 has been fooling us pretending it was seeking independence.
You have to hand it to the British state though. They have played an absolute blinder and have run circles around us.
What I fear is what is coming after this. This bill is a clear, blunt instrument to impose division. Huge division – it is alienating half of the electorate. I think the going after Mr Salmond had the same objective but failed.
It is clear to me the British state needs division and a yes movement in complete disarray and unable to react back because they have something real nasty in storage awaiting the perfect timing to deploy it and that is why they have been monitoring us pretty much every week to see the evolution of the yes movement in the polls. The political impostor has been preparing the ground for the deployment of whatever nasty they have in mind.
They say what does not kill you make you stronger. What we learn from this betrayal, how we counteract it, how we stop them fooling us again in the future is what should keep us on focus.
Is it an accident – in which case its leadership is the most incompetent and stupid in Scottish political history – or is it on purpose, in which case the only possible goal must be to deliberately AVOID getting a majority, so that it has a foolproof excuse for not delivering independence
Perhaps there’s another possibility. I still think that Sturgeon started with an idea about Mr Salmond and like Topsy the thing grew and grew and grew because the stupid woman had no concept of the consequences of her actions. BUT other things have also been going on . Peter Murrell , I suspect, could be in serious trouble if anyone gets round to investigating his financial shenanigans. Sturgeon’s courting of the Wokes is out of hand. The money spent on court cases is out of hand. I can’t help but believe that many people have more than their jobs at stake. BUT the whole thing reminds me of a car chase in a movie where there is so much mayhem and all the vehicles are out of control.
I honestly don’t see anything deliberate in this except the Murrells and some others are trying desperately to save themselves. If the SNP as a whole can wake up to this scenario (I think the money is the way to get to them) then it’s a simple case of prosecuting and ridding the party (and the country) of the guilty
The fact that this is a heap of shit rather than a controlled build-up of policy is why it has become so difficult to separate everything out.
I wonder if we look at Sturgeon as an old fashioned metal dustbin full to the brim with all sorts of non-recyclable rubbish but still with a tightly fitted lid INSTEAD of the neat Russian Doll type of image which most people perceive we might begin to understand the problem.
That’s Sturgeon, her satellites represent the people she has used and the inevitable waste she has created, which cannot be stuffed inside the container and so they are a stinking mess of detritus trapped within the Murrell magnetic field.
BUT that’s Sturgeon’s constellation. It’s a small, stupid constellation. and if the rest of us let her destroy our chance at Independence, then we get everything we deserve.
We need the cleaners in
Aim everything at the SNP Financial situation.
ONE target
The rest will follow
James Hamilton QC really has a job on his hands to determine if Nicola Sturgeon broke the ministerial code.If he follows Scottish politics it will be difficult to not to take account of circumstantial events and actions.
So John Swindle won’t provide details of the OECD report Captn Yossarian.
Why is that. Another secret. Education performing too well.Another SNP super success story. Or just the big rat bag covering up again.
What the FK does this government deliver. Think about it now?
Just in case anybody can be bothered to read it, my apologies for all the typos in that last post. It might be comprehensible (but not necessarily sensible) all the same.
Willie Jay says:
13 March, 2021 at 5:28 pm
“Oh! Would that such could happen! I would spend as much of my pension and life savings** to leave me almost destitute in order to see the likes of Craig Murray – or *any* other Scotsman of integrity […] ”
And of course, *any Scots woman*, and I can think of one or two who would look splendid in white on the hustings.
Is there absolutely no-one thinking of a challenge such as the one Martin Bell presented, and won, at Westminster.
My money is certainly ready for immediate transfer to a suitable candidate’s challenge and programme.
The old analytic perspectives and logical reasoning that might once have served in the unpicking and understanding of the Scottish government’s actions since 2014, are no longer serviceable.
A healthy cynicism must, therefore, prevail. That senior, elected, government and party officials have been compromised and that Hollyrood’s future is far from certain, cannot be discounted.
katherine hamilton says,
“The priority for all believers in Independence who love freedom, with a respect for human rights and the rule of law is to get rid of this woman, her coterie and the craven fools who call themselves SNP MSP’s.
So a new argument for the great unwashed on here. Which of the 3 options best achieves her demise?”
If very bitter medicine is the only option to cure a nasty cancer, would anyone hesitate to take it?
Option 3, voting tactically to oust SNP MSPs is the bitter medicine we will have to take to defeat the Sturgeon cancer.
Independence demolishes the reason for the SNP to exist. Sure they could soldier on and attempt to win a majority in an independent Scotland but anyone with half a brain knows that people will revert to type and return to their natural political allegiances.
This means that many will resume voting for Labour (a new independent Labour of course) and the same for the Tories and the LibDems. Who knows, even the Greens might get a vote or two.
This would of course be a disaster for The Dear Leader Sturgeon, because the chances of her winning an election becomes much less likely. All her unpopular policies would be at serious risk of being repealed; two-for-one pizzas would be back on the menu, no free, inflatable birthing pools for rugby players turned mum & families can gather around the table once again & openly mock the Hate Cleric Of Pollock’s Gender Jihad without fear of him clyping to the Crown Office like a wee childish prick.
Imagine her girnin face when she is handed her arse on a plate while watching parliament declare her gravy train ticket, null & void
Willie Jay says,
“Is there absolutely no-one thinking of a challenge such as the one Martin Bell presented, and won, at Westminster.
My money is certainly ready for immediate transfer to a suitable candidate’s challenge and programme.”
Craig Murray, Tommy Sheridan and others, please rise to the challenge.
It is of course the case that an SNP Government will, by necessity, be come the opposition for an SNP party. The former wants power the latter wants independence.
“This would of course be a disaster for The Dear Leader Sturgeon”
Nonsense. The individual who leads Scotland to regaining its status as an independent state will be forever remembered in the history books of the entire world as a hero. Something like that would open her every political door in the world. The sky is the limit.
No. It is precisely the fact she could have had all that since 8th May 2015 and she chose not to that makes you think she has always had another agenda. Fame and power is not it. Running a colonial government for a minute longer than it is necessary is not it either. This woman is on a mission: that mission is to derail Scotland’s independence and hand Scotland’s territory and assets over to the British State.
And let’s face it, she is right on track.
Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
The Green Goblin told Nicola that he would vote for a VONC if she did not ensure the Hate Crime Bill was passed.
Proadage @4.02pm.
This thread is exactly why we must give the SNP a majority in May and thwart their plan. If we don’t then they can nestle in for the next five years without any recourse to promising an indyref.
wull says:
13 March, 2021 at 5:48 pm
Just in case anybody can be bothered to read it, my apologies for all the typos in that last post. It might be comprehensible (but not necessarily sensible) all the same.
I hear you wull. I have so many errors in my own posts that it’s embarrassing. Typos, spelling mistakes, missing words, sometimes two sentences joined into one when, I don’t know, maybe the phone rang or something else distracted the mind.
I blame Rev Stu. We need a proof reader or an edit facility. Lol.
Paying more attention just doesn’t do it. Sometimes I’d bet all my worldly goods there are no errors in a comment… then the instant you press ‘submit comment’ … boom. Ah ffs!!! On the upside, my shocking spelling and grammar has undoubtedly stopped me losing all my worldly goods in hasty bets I’m doomed to lose.
What is the benefit, or our prospects of chance , with no SNP majority? None
What prospect does Indy have with an SNP majority. None many will say. But that’s not true. The first option gives the movement no percetible mandate in the eyes of the UK and Europe. However the second option delivers a clear mandate. The SNP not delivering on the mandate is irrelevant.
This is about momentum and the people. Ultimately people power will make independence happen. We use the election to deliver our message to the world. The worst message we can deliver is that we have simply given up.
We can’t make independence happen if we let our heart rule our heads. This is about strategy.
It seems to me that the Brit State has something on Sturgeon, and that the SNP has been infiltrated by the Brit State.
Could this be something to do with Nicola Sturgeon’s inability to think on her feet, to improvise, to accept mistakes have been made? It took the courts to kill the Named Persons bill. She doesn’t like compromising which you often have to do. So they plough on with a ludicrous policy which will indeed lose votes.
@Willie – No Sir he won’t do it. He told them to write on the bottom of the report that it wasn’t to be reviewed by others – only by Swinney. Swinney is saying that to release it he would be breaking the Ministerial Code. Read the arsehole’s Twitter page.
.
Stuart this is one of your..
TOP TEN POSTS EVER.
You know anyone with the ability to think laterally knows we are soon to see the ANSWER for…
THE BEST OUTCOME FOR THE TRUE PRO-INDY MOVEMENT?
Stuart, please enjoy writing your next series of articles narrating the end-game of Sturgeon’s selfish money-grabbing, narcissistic tenure.
Her legacy will be the same as Margaret Thatcher…
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wq7-XeT9n_M
In fact Sturgeon will probably move abroad to Spain where the anti-Catalonian Spanish government will give her the sanctuary to spend her ill gotten gains without the entire Scottish nation reminding her every hour of every day that we ALL KNOW she SOLD Scotland’s rare chance of independence for her own bank balance and ego.
Her money grabbing and self-aggrandising nature is her downfall.
Whereas Stuart Campbell, Alex Salmond, Chris McEleny, Iain Lawson, Joanna Cherry will finally be respected for standing by their principles in the face of horrendous abuse.
Craig Murray worries me a little. He is obviously a highly principled and honourable man. Anyone who turns down so many honours from HM Queen Elizabeth is a bit special. But for the life of me I cannot agree with Craig’s advocacy of “both votes SNP”. I like Craig a LOT. But there is something hid from sight. I hope Craig is alright.
Meanwhile we all owe Pete Wishart a huge debt of gratitude, Stuart Campbell was all set to hang up his quill and parchment. Retire his word processor and close down his website.
Fortunately, Mr Speaker, the future Lord Pete Wishart of 30 pieces of Silver is such an utter Twitter idiot that he pissed off the Rev into continuing this website.
To think we all thought it was GAME OVER once the Hate Crime Bill came into law.
Far from it. ALL Stuart needs to do is stop swearing. Well he did most of that on Twitter. So no promblem with us all self-moderating the swear words.
As for the risk of FUTURE corrupt prosecution and fit-ups that some worry the Hate Crime Bill will bring about. That is a busted flush. The Sturgeon government and Police Scotland used up that trick trying to imprison Alex Salmon on fake, trumpeted up charges that perverted the course of justice that will come back and haunt MR Iain Livingstone for the rest of his days.
Any Clown Office official or bent management cop at Police Scotland who tries the perverted prosecution route again best get themselves a great solicitor and QC. As we will still be in the Union, that means we CAN call in the Met to investigate alleged criminality at Police Scotland and the Clown Office.
Be in no doubt that bent cops are brought to justice.
Life imitates art. Just ask a TRUE INDY supporter, Martin Compston as he goes into the 11th year of the acclaimed television series Line of Duty. Historically the rubber-boot squad don’t tend to publicise police corruption. It is usually dealt behind closed doors. Bi Glic, Bi Glic.
Methinks when the current tranche of senior bent cops eventually face their alleged misdeeds in all of this, the truth will be televised. The state broadcaster, BBC Scotchland are impotent in this. International tv channels and Yourube will carry a whole series of senior cops getting AC12ed.
Bob Costello @ 5.20 said, with regard to the SNP’s deliberate attempts (since as far back as 2015) to fail at getting independence, while kidding us all on that that was their objective:
“It has all went wrong for them and now they are embarked upon a scorched earth policy.
“The only question in my mind is who is behind it all? I have a feeling the answer to that might surprise a hell of a lot of people.”
Bob, if you know who it is, just let us know. Don’t leave us hanging in the suspense in the air. You suggest it is none of the usual suspects who are behind it, so … WHO?
1) I don’t believe NS is any sort of ‘agent’ or has been compromised by or is being blackmailed by MI5, etc.
2) It seems obvious she is a true believer in Woke politics – and she’s not alone. It’s big in many places. Look at Labour or the Greens. It’s also big with Biden in the US and it’s big in Ireland. That explains her policies – support for the HCB and the gender stuff. Her dedication to Me Too led her to pursue AS.
3)There’s a big age and class divide on Woke stuff – Woke is younger and better educated (university). NS probably sees us like Hilary Clinton saw Trump supporters – as deplorables.
4) NS believes history is on the side of the Woke (not least because it’s big with younger people) and opposition to it is old fashioned and will die out.
5)National independence and borders are not ‘woke’. NS’s opposition to Brexit is genuine and is based on a belief that national sovereignty and borders are old fashioned. I don’t believe that deep down NS believes in an Indy Scotland. But she would support an ‘indy’ Scotland that gave up as much of its sovereignty as possible to the EU. That would be woke, middle-class and trendy.
I think it’s that simple.
Kcor says:
13 March, 2021 at 5:15 pm
Graeme Hampton says,
“So the best hope/scenario is for Angus to fail to win his seat”
Craig Murray should stand against him as an independent.
It could become a repeat of the Martin Bell movement against the, was it Hamiltons.
Craig Murray in a white suit against Robertson and his wife Jennifer Dempsey, who had a crush for Alex Salmond before settling for Robertson.
Reply
Can Craig Murray stand with the result of his court case pending?
Will the result of his court case be delayed until the election or at least until after the cut off point for registering?
The SNP’s aims may be further reaching. We have allowed support for the SNP to become synonymous with support for independence – discredit one and you discredit the other- and we’re seeing that happening.
The SNP is aiming for that double-whammy. If Nicola is on the Vauxhall Bridge payroll, she’s playing a blinder.
The other scenario for an SNP minority is maybe Nikla’s ego canny take it. Will she still be First Minister, doubt it.
I’m hoping she would take the opportunity to step back with ‘honour intact’ (Ah done me best/worn out wi aw the covid etc) and take the fancy job wi’ UN/ Clinton Founation -onwards and upwards.
That’s why the rush to get the HCB through right now. That’s why she’s deliberately pissing everyone off (and women in particular).She needs a minority for the plan to work out. She’s not planning to be around so she’s left her fanboys a wee gift.
OK let me dream on.
or maybe this is reverse psychology by SNP to bring back Alex Salmond vindicated as the savior of Scotland and lead us to victory and independence! or she’s a MI5 plant?
oh shit the L S D is wearing off , go to go!
If only the Rev. Stuart Campbell had followed his instincts and set up the Wings over Scotland Party a couple of years ago, we would not have been in this dilemna.
My wish is for the SNP-Green Woke coalition to be voted out of power.
Followed straight away by the creation of the Scottish Independence Party, with the sole aim of fighting the next Westminster election on a plebiscite manifesto, which the Rev. Stuart Campbell has already written.
Scotland could yet be independent within five years.
But if and only if the New SNP has been voted out of power.
The New SNP is a bigger obstacle to independence than the unionists.
In fact with the unionists in power, there would be much more motivation for independence.
With the SNP in power, loads of gullible independence supporters are readily taking the carrot bait time and again. In the meantime, The National and Wee Ginger Dug are milking these gullible independence supporters, IMHO.
jockmcx says:
13 March, 2021 at 5:40 pm
Big Jock says:
3 March, 2021 at 4:31 pm
Spot on…All indy supporters must vote snp 1.
even if it makes u sick.
After that,if they dont act on it,all yessers (all yessers),
give them hell!
Last free vote snp.
======================
NO! NO! NO! and a thousand times NO!
When a political party which once fulfilled my political beliefs does a complete about turn *OVER MANY YEARS* and betrays *EVERYTHING* I have always believed in, I will *NOT* betray my conscience by giving them a single vote on the ballot paper in May.
Enough is enough! Anyone still yelling, “must vote SNP 1 even if it makes u sick” – to them I would simply say –
To squander a vote on a political party, even if it makes you sick, is the very same mindset of a country in Europe in 1933.
i.e. : “We can sort it after the election”
“The army will bring them to heel” [We have no army.]
“Big business will not tolerate their beliefs” [Big business will soon skedaddle from an SNP Scotland]
“The Scottish People will not accept outrageous rules, [The Scottish People will be bound by outrageous *LAWS* already passed, which will be enforced by the now apparently political “Police Service Scotland”]
The latter point of Police Service Scotland was a very clever move by those in command of Scotland. It should *never* have happened, It *must* be reversed. Can you tell me any other Western democratic country which has a *NATIONAL* Police Force? Not even the late President of the Good Ol’ USA dared to take that step.
#Scotland Awake!
I have been wondering for months now if the SNP don’t want an outright win at the next election. They have said almost nothing about independence for a long time now and the 11 point plan is back of a fag packet stuff. Twitter SNP advertising never mentions independence just now.
There is little doubt that the Murrels are content with devolution because it suits them. They have completely shut down SNP democracy to ensure they can do this.
I have no doubt that independence is very low on their list of priorities at least.
AFI press statement excerpt
“Key independence activists and former MSPs are now AFI members and are hoping to stand as AFI candidates, including former SNP MSPs Dave Thompson and John Wilson, prolific independence blogger and historian Craig Murray, Forward As One organiser Martin Keatings, independence activist and award winning journalist Mark Hirst, Glasgow East YES activists Lynne Millar and Angela Jones and former MEP and SNP member Hugh Kerr.”
So Craig Murray has joined AFI? Why would he be promoting SNP on the list?
Ruby says,
“Can Craig Murray stand with the result of his court case pending?
Will the result of his court case be delayed until the election or at least until after the cut off point for registering?”
I think they are trying to blackmail Craig Murray by delaying his verdict.
I do not wish for it to be the case, but Craig Murray can stand as a candidate from jail.
It is not beyond this corrupt criminal SNP government to rig the vote, but in a fair vote, Craig Murray could easily defeat Robertson.
Nally Anders says:
13 March, 2021 at 6:24 pm
“The other scenario for an SNP minority is maybe Nikla’s ego canny take it. Will she still be First Minister, doubt it.
I’m hoping she would take the opportunity to step back with ‘honour intact’”
=======
“I’m hoping she would take the opportunity to resign in total dishonour … ”
Fixed it for ye, free of charge.
“This thread is exactly why we must give the SNP a majority in May and thwart their plan”
You cannot possibly be serious.
These people held the largest share of the seats in Holyrood for the last 5 years and for a year before that the absolute majority of the seats. Since 8 May 2015 they have held the absolute majority of Scotland’s seats in Westminster. They have had countless mandates and the best opportunities to deliver. They have 25 polls in front of their noses with over 50% support for independence after clearly stating in their manifesto that they would call a referendum if there was a material change in circumstances (which there was) or there was a sign that a majority of people in Scotland wanted independence (25 polls proved that). Both conditions were met and yet these political frauds still did absolutely nothing to deliver.
They did the exact opposite to deliver: they made up a padlock for the referendum (the S30), they handed over our powers, they handed over our rights, they handed over our assets, they messed up with our female’s rights and freedom of speech, they took away our EU citizenship, they divided the yes movement, they destroyed our best pro indy political vehicle, they showed utter contempt for democracy, they undermined our popular sovereignty, they totally corrupted our government, they showed contempt for parliament by refusing to release the evidence and they took us for absolute fools.
The absolute worse thing you can ever do is to give these corrupt arses and political impostors a majority.
What we need to do is to take the majority away from them and hand as many seats as we possibly can to a real pro indy party.
How do we know if a party is really pro independence?
If they are including a mandate for independence in their manifesto. The last thing we need is to hand seats to a party whose only intention is to boost the SNP and to hand over to them seats by the back door.
Nobody is irreplaceable. Labour learned it the hard way in Scotland. Sturgeon’s SNP has been playing to be the new New Labour in Scotland. Well, we better teach them they are no irreplaceable either and that Scotland’s New Labour is no Lazarus. Nobody asked them to resurrect it.
You would have thought it would be obvious by now to even the most dumbest indy supporter that the new SNP don’t want a majority win in May, I have no doubt the plan is to get a minority to give them the excuse of not being able to deliver Independence because obviously not enough voted for them.
I hate this party with a vengeance now and although I intend to spoil my constituency vote and give my regional vote to AFI ( this could change if circumstances change) I can’t help but think if instead of us all fighting with each other as we’re doing now, we got our heads together and ensure the SNP win only by a minority on the constituency and we all vote for the same indy party (AFI ISP or whatever) on the list we could put the SNP in such a position that they could be forced to act.
We could easily ensure one of the new parties becomes the second biggest in Holyrood.
As well as removing more than a few unionists from Holyrood, the SNP would have to rely on them to get policies passed. of course the icing on the cake would be Alex Salmond as leader of the winning party, oh to see Sturgeon have to face Alex across the chamber on a daily basis, I believe this might be the only way we could get rid of her.
The great worry though is we’re too divided now and to be honest we Scots have never been too clever when it comes to taking command of a situation.
We’d rather spend our time fighting with each other.
Wha’s like us right enough.
Stephen P says,
“Key independence activists and former MSPs are now AFI members and are hoping to stand as AFI candidates”
Please, please stand against SNP candidates in constituencies and defeat them.
Ruby, yes Craig Murray can stand and can even do so if he is imprisoned.
I’m a Scot and my wife is from Yorkshire, we moved back to Scotland in 2017 to lend our votes to the Yes movement and fight for the cause of Independence. We both agreed when we moved back to Scotland and attending the SNP conference that there was a shift and that the SNP longer was dedicated to Independence or a referendum and that the shift in the SNP was to be more like a political party (New Labour)and to govern and where happy for Westminster to hold all the powers and they where happy with the powers they had. When the continuity bill was paused in Holyrood because of the terrorist attack I said to my wife why would you suspended the parliament and I thought a the time why didn’t they just have a 10minute silence, well we know the rest the SNP continued to the courts and lost and we all know why? This is when my doubts crept in about the SNP leader and its only got worse and with the hate crime bill my wife been saying we should move back to England and that she doesn’t want to live in a country that anything you say can be regarding as a crime. Sturgeon doesn’t have imposter syndrome but she is the Imposter, she passed the sovereign right of the Scottish people to Westminster and then tried to pass it of as the Gold Standard she wouldn’t march for AUOB but would run to London for a people vote and then gave up on the Idea when Boris Johnston wanted a election which she knew he would win the Tories where correct the SNP was wanting a Tory government and the SNP are just happy with the way things are and I reckon its already to late for us to see Independence. The SNP since Sturgeon took over as leader has made mistake after mistake and I’m totally surprised that its taken this long for it to dawn on the general public and I’m totally surprised for 30yrs she fooled Alex Salmond. Even on the 05.05.21 every single poll says the SNP has lost there majority there is nothing on this gods earth that will make me vote SNP 1&2 the only thing that will make me give the SNP 1 vote is the resignation of Nicola Sturgeon but by then it’ll be to late because as soon as I get my postal vote it I’l be ticked and signed and sent straight off.
Mia says,
“How do we know if a party is really pro independence?
If they are including a mandate for independence in their manifesto.”
Since you didn’t answer the last time, I’ll ask again:
What chance do you think there is of pro indy List only parties getting more than 50% of the vote in the coming Scottish election?
Roger @ 6.20
I tend to agree with you. I think Sturgeon was/is worried about the NEC fightback and negative consequences of the harassment inquiry/Hamilton report and decided to act immediately for the woke principles that are most important to her just in case she wasn’t around or the woke lost influence after the next election. To hell with the consequences.
What I don’t understand is why no one in the SNP hierarchy tried to stop her.
Thanks, Breeks @ 6.11, for the encouragement / consolation.
No need to be embarrassed about old-fashioned spelling mistakes, however. As the French used to say – and I think they probably had something a mite more interesting than mere spelling mistakes in mind – “a moment of shame is quickly over”. So, presumably, worth it all the same.
Travelling by train down to London one day about 30 years ago, I got talking to the guy in the seat next to me and he turned out to be a Prof of English literature at Liverpool University, who was a real expert in William Shakespeare (I checked this out afterwards, and he really was, with notable publications of or about Shakespeare to his name). He was a very unassuming and pleasant man, and it was a great conversation. The one thing that has stuck in my mind from it after all these years was when he said ‘Shakespeare couldn’t spell, and couldn’t have cared less about it’.
He assured me that in Shakespeare’s folios – and he had edited these – you can find the same word spelled (should that be ‘spelt’?!!!) in three or four different ways. Maybe even in the same scene, sometimes.
That was encouraging!
Isn’t it funny the things you remember? Probably they are the things that suit you … while others, that don’t, just slip from your mind.
Oh, dear! … I should probably delete that last remark. Otherwise there’ll be a barrage of those terrible ‘cybernats’ banging away on their keyboards to fire off btl comments here, accusing me of being Nicola Sturgeon …
Action For Independence (AFI) held a very good conference today which confirmed the Max The Yes Strategy designed to elect a super-YES majority in May with a solid group of AFI MSPs mandated to hold the SNP feet to the fire on the question of independence and prioritising another referendum regardless of Westminster squeals or Johnson’s jibes. AFI would have preferred the election in 7 weeks time was promoted loud and clear as an independence plebiscite election with a subsequent majority empowering a Holyrood independence majority to begin separation negotiations and seek international recognition for the once again independent nation of Scotland. However SNP leaders lack of courage, vision and intent means that hope will be dashed. An urgent referendum after May becomes the priority in the absence of the plebiscite election situation.
It was confirmed that over 40 nominations for candidates all across Scotland have been received with more meetings to be held on Monday before Tuesday’s deadline to receive nominations from all 8 of AFI’s regional branches. The nominations to date include former SNP MSPs Dave Thompson (2007-2016) and John Wilson (2007-2016), prolific Indy blogger and historian Craig Murray, Peoples Section 30 Challenge and Forward As One organiser Martin Keatings, award winning journalist Mark Hirst and former MEP and SNP approved candidate Hugh Kerr.
AFI is clearly assembling a quality and credible team of independence advocates seeking 2nd votes across Scotland to form a clear and unequivocal independence bloc in Holyrood after May. Despite many serious misgivings about the current leadership of Scotland’s principle independence party right now AFI believes it is right to promote SNP 1 / AFI 2 as we refuse to countenance the idea that any unionist advances are good for Scotland.
In place of the selfish and reckless Both Votes SNP mantra AFI will fight under the banners of Both Votes Independence and Scotland Before Party. I would appeal to independence supporters to both support AFI in May and join AFI now to help it build into the alternative independence party of the future. In the absence of any viable and credible alternative we believe AFI deserves to be supported amongst those who believe independence should be an urgent and non-negotiable priority. For more information read the AFI Press Release here https://afi.scot/action-for-independence-first-national-conference/
Lenny Hartley says:
13 March, 2021 at 6:35 pm
Ruby, yes Craig Murray can stand and can even do so if he is imprisoned.
Reply
Perfect! Lets encourage him to do it.
CRAIG! CRAIG! CRAIG! CRAIG! CRAIG! CRAIG! CRAIG! CRAIG! CRAIG! CRAIG! CRAIG! CRAIG!
The penny is now hanging over the edge and about to drop, stuart. A few more nudges should do it.
You have more support than you think. Time to grasp the thistle.
I reckon Govanhill and the West End will declare UDI from the rest of Scotland, denounce everyone else as gammons and receive backing from the EU. Either that or it’s zombies on the horizon, one of the two.
Brian Doonthetoon at 16:27
Seconded!
“we all vote for the same indy party (AFI ISP or whatever) on the list we could put the SNP in such a position that they could be forced to act”
Come on Helen, look a the last 5 years. They have had all what they needed to deliver and they have not delivered, on purpose.
Look at the astonishing levels of corruption engulfing Sturgeon, her government, her party and the COPFS. Yet, do you see any real, meaningful move from the opposition to chuck her government out?
The worse thing you can do is to give these corrupt liars a majority.
If the SNP does not want to deliver indyref or independence, they will not. They have the British state on their side. If you give them enough seats, it will be sufficient for a few tory/labour/libdems MSPs to casually vote with them to stop indyref.
If you want independence you are going to have to hit these liars where it hurts: the seats. Take away from them not just the majority, but a good chunk of their current seats too and threaten with taking away from them the Westminster seats too in the next GE unless they toe the line. They have to be left unable to govern unless they align with that other pro indy party so it is that party who calls the shots. Even then, I would not put pass the cynic Sturgeon to collapse the government and call a new election.
The next question is what pro indy party we vote for?
The last thing we want is a pretend pro indy party whose only intention is to fool us too by boosting the SNP seats and handing them seats by the back door.
Oh! Hang on!
Can Craig stand as an independent constituency candidate & on the list for the AFI.
I’m looking for an alternative to Angus Robertson.
@Mia
“What chance do you think there is of pro indy List only parties getting more than 50% of the vote in the coming Scottish election?”
Zero. Because it’s a confusing mess for those who have even heard of them – they appear to be going to compete against each other on the list. And a lot of people have not heard of them – not least because they have no big names. I fear they will get nobody elected and will amount to no more than a new RISE. Not what I want to happen, but they’re not doing a good job of it with they’re lack of cooperation.
@Stephen P
“What I don’t understand is why no one in the SNP hierarchy tried to stop her.”
1 – some did – Cherry for example
2 – a lot of them probably share her views about wokeism being the future and want to be ‘on the right side of history’, etc.
3 – she’s the Boss – Scotland’s Angela Merkle
I really think the SNP are just power mad, but not willing to serve on any constructive way for Scottish folk. They’ll pass silly laws which won’t make any difference to anyone. Kind of like the Swiss, where it’s illegal to flush the loo after 10pm.
Laws do not work, only actual education works. So we’d have to end the pushing of agendas and allow understanding to surface. This is a worldwide problem, not restricted to the SNP. We’ve got to ask why.
I have no doubt that the Rev knows a hell of a lot more about it than me but is it not possible that holymacmoses has a point?
I believe the Gender carry-on and Hate Crime Bill/Act came to the fore after the inquiry/case against Mr Salmond went-how can I put this politely?-belly up
They may have generated genuine enthusiasm in the sounding chamber of the ‘Government’ and seemed like a way of attracting a few more votes, but then became a useful way of distracting attention from any Salmond backwash and any number of other ‘Issues’
Once the Trans Clans and the Woke Folk had gathered it became difficult to back-peddle and thus-well you are where you are
Myself and Big Jock postulated this very theory on a previous thread. Problem is she could stay in place covering for missing funds and still leader of a large party, with a husband still employed by the party to boot.
Referendum nicely kicked into the long grass till the next set of elections. The Old “not my fault people voted as they did” will appear and we get the blame for failing to choose the party of Independence.
Result? No further forward either way.
Sorry, but the suggestion that NS is involved in a “ conspiracy “ to somehow avoid Independence is just ludicrous.
This whole line should be shut down for the arrant nonsense it is.
Sure there’s too much power in a small clique etc etc but that’s been the case ever since the SNP came into power.
The only policy for Sturgeon has been Independence & that’s not an economic or social policy – its a campaign.
There’s been a policy void in the SNP for a long time.
The principal aim of her Govt has been to avoid taking any decisions which may put off the undecided & to actively seek to appeal to the “ activists” who apparently promise to deliver their constituencies – that policy void has to be filled & hence she has found herself pulled into the twilight world of “ wokeism”
It’s called politics baby.
The idea the SNP politicians are not part of the political class has always amazed me.
But let’s put our hands up- we let it happen- it’s been in plain view for a long time.
Suggestions by Mr Campbell that this is some kind of conspiracy is deflection of the worst sort.
Let’s stay real-we made the mess we can sort it, but only if we accept that Independence is a much more complex & long term mission than simply securing another referendum.
NS knows that- a lot of people on this site don’t.
Real world policies are required – apart from rejoining what appears to be an increasingly dysfunctional EU.
@Kcor
That’s not what I was getting at.
The point was that she won’t call a referendum. But I 100% agree with the point you made.
Perhaps the Nouveau SNP don’t fancy handling the post Brexit/post Covid economy.
There is lots of crowing BTL of the National article saying there is no evidence that AS was the victim of malign intent and that in the absence of evidence the committee will make a definitive statement saying so.
Of course, we all know why.
Those that are happy with that will in future accept the findings of all such committees and investigations. They will have been happy about McCrone and Willie McRae. They will have been happy about Priti Patel’s non-bullying bullying payout whitewash. They will accept the findings of the Grenfell inquiry and the Covid-19 response by both governments, the contracts for cronies and shortages of PPE despite the shortfalls being pointed out 2 years before. The care home sacrifice will be ‘explained’ with much hand-wringing and proclamations of haunted thoughts and sleepless nights.
These are of course Westminster problems and our parliament is better than that. They will tell themselves that because, for now, it looks like their side has won but we know it has not. Away from election fever and spin, they will understand that eventually but, by then, it will be too late.
@TOMMY SHERIDAN says:
13 March, 2021 at 6:50 pm
AFI 2 fair enough. SNP 1? How will you counter criticism that all you are doing is voicing support for a bill that removes women’s rights?
Please do not use the stock “we’ll sort it out after the election” answer.
Big Jock…give the SNP the majority that they don’t want then destroy them politically and electorally when they fail yet again to deliver Indy.
Starting all over again by voting against them or abstaining in May is playing into the hands of the Unionist hegemony running the anti-Scottish establishment of COPFS/PoliceScot/ and the SNP/Murrell leadership. Hold their feet/head/ you name it to the fire and prove them to be the bogus liars that they truly are.
The Unionist trolls that have been poisoning this site with their adulation of Andrew Neil and voting Tory are becoming shriller than ever as the Rev returns to basics, i.e.Independence above all as the raison d’etre.
The SNP are a flawed vehicle which needs trundled over the line in May, then cast off like the failed, flawed and compromised con that it has become. The Movement is all. This trojan horse of our nation’s ambitions needs owned and destroyed within the protected circle of non Unionist control of Holyrood..the sham shibboleth of devolution.
Otherwise ,we surrender..yet again to Westminster and the onslaught of ‘Britification ‘, the absorption of Scotland as ‘North Britain’ once and for all. A colonial administration of 3500 transplanted ‘officials; from RUK ..back to redcoat rule.
Meanwhile West of Shetland the oil revenue pours into Boris and Co’s corrupt coffers unremarked by the BBC and the MSM; ‘fusion reactors are planned to be planted like poisoned nuclear plants in Chapelcross or Dounreay by the Brit Gov joining the biggest target in the world at Coulport on Scotland’s back for a holocaust in making.
I want Sturgeon out and all the rotten pseudo Britnat civil service colonial admin dumped into the bin of history, But by voting Unionist or abstaining like the trolls want we will end up a collection of disunited factions at the mercy of the British Fascist State and its merciless revenge.
We have the brains, we have the resources, we have the clear sighted and honest leaders. Let us go the last painful mile and vote SNP for constituencies and then wipe them out in the next chapter of our struggle. Learn from the wokes..collaborate, then terminate.
“AFI would have preferred the election in 7 weeks time was promoted loud and clear as an independence plebiscite election with a subsequent majority empowering a Holyrood independence majority to begin separation negotiations and seek international recognition for the once again independent nation of Scotland. However SNP leaders lack of courage, vision and intent means that hope will be dashed”
There is nothing stopping AFI to include in their manifesto a mandate to begin separation negotiations and seek international recognition if they achieve a majority, is there?
To give the people of Scotland the opportunity to vote for independence AFI does not need the SNP to hold its hand. It only needs the will to do so.
AFI does not need permission from the SNP to make the next election a plebiscite. The only thing it needs is to include a mandate for independence in their manifesto.
To be quite honest, attempting to ping on the SNP the blame for AFI not having sufficient commitment to independence or interest in giving the people of Scotland a chance to vote for independence does not look well at all. It looks cowardly.
If you permit me, the strategy of “maxing the yes” and supporting SNP 1 when the SNP under Sturgeon has revealed itself as the most corrupt and deceiving political party in Scotland’s history, may be flawed.
We all know the SNP has no intention whatsoever to deliver so this strategy puts AFI under a very strange light – it makes it look like AFI is only winning seats to boost the corrupt SNP mandate.
I think AFI should revisit its strategy. A lot of people can no longer stomach giving their constituency vote to a corrupt SNP that is willing to throw our democracy, our females’ rights and freedom of speech in a bonfire for the sake of a minority of powerful males and a hidden agenda.
And still, 7 weeks to the election and the people of Scotland are being denied, even by their own parties, their fundamental right to self determination and the fundamental democratic choice that should be at the top in every single democratic election in Scotland:
that of voting for independence.
Let’s hope some indy party gives us that choice. Otherwise spoiling both ballots seems like a solid alternative.
If someone can explain the advantage of not giving the SNP a majority ,then i’m all ears.
I speak as someone who left the party after 32 years. I might be raging at Sturgeon, but I don’t think giving the yoons any ammunition helps Scotland’s cause.
Do we want to wake up to Boris and Davidson telling us Scotland said no. Or at the very least giving the SNP a chance of letting us down. They will let us down of course, but the people have spoken and that is where we have some power.
No SNP majority might make us satisfied at their bloody nose. But bearing in mind the premise of this article. It might be the bloody nose they planned.
Thank you, Tommy Sheridan, for the link to the AFI press release, and the information. It sounds as if AFI is shaping nicely. I will not be able to bring myself to vote SNP 1, but AFI on the list sounds to me, as of now, by far the best option.
Nevertheless, even those who do vote SNP 1 and AFI 2 will be sending out a clear message that they are NOT SATISFIED with the SNP, and do NOT trust their approach to independence. Every list vote for AFI, even by those taking AFI’s advice, should therefore register with the SNP as an indication that people are fed up with their prevarications on independence, and will not vote for them again if they do not make it the priority it should be. That is all to the good.
I suppose the same can be said for votes for the ISP. At the same time, although it looks unlikely, I do hope that the ISP will come to an arrangement with the AFI, so that all the non-SNP pro-Indy candidates can unite under the same banner – so to speak – for May 6th. ISP candidates who are then voted into Holyrood in this way will still be able to form a disciplined caucus within the AFI in Holyrood, voting strictly according to their ISP policies and principles. I can’t see anything in the AFI’s constitution and intentions that would prevent that.
All is not lost; there is still everything to play for.
@Veritas
“The idea the SNP politicians are not part of the political class has always amazed me.”
Yes, of course they are.
But on Wokeism, where is the (non-Conservative) political party today whose ideology is NOT Woke? Only Boris, Trump and Macron (that I can think of) opposed it. And the SNP is a liberal party (thpugh they’d say ‘left of centre’, but they’re not socialists, so they can only be liberals).
Wokeism is a much bigger blight than just the SNP and Scotland. And it is a fashionable blight with political and chattering classes…and with the young.
Ever since she took over, Sturgeon has been leading independence voters up the garden path. Whenever she fails, she rolls out the indyref2 narrative, and everyone falls for it hook, line and sinker. She’s promised another indyref every year since 2015, and still hasn’t delivered. It’s time independence voters woke up. There will never be another indyref whilst Sturgeon and her cabal are running the show, and the dyed in the wool simply cannot see the woods for the trees. As long as the hard of thought and the gullible remain onside, independence is as dead as a Dodo.
Sturgeon’s main goal is retention of power, not independence.
Hey Veritas, what you smokin… Can I have some?
Think independence supporters have two serious alternatives (how either could be arranged fk knows) 1 Give the SNP such a massive majority that that have no option but to go for Independence straight away (having been franchised to do just that, and nothing but that) In which a section 30 request will, predictably. get the shortest shrift from Boris. Which then leaves them with nowhere else to go except put up or shut up-a declaration of UDI or Sturgeon resigns to join the rubber chicken circuit. 2 Vote a lib dem/Lab/Con/ Judean peoples front coalition whilst a new party is formed to fight for real independence.
“Despite many serious misgivings about the current leadership of Scotland’s principle independence party right now AFI believes it is right to promote SNP 1 / AFI 2 as we refuse to countenance the idea that any unionist advances are good for Scotland.”
Tommy.
I after much deliberation the other night I have come to realise that SNP 1 and AFI or ISP 2 is the only way forward, no matter how vile and nasty the SNP have been (and they’ve certainly been both) in recent years, having a unionist party in government in Scotland can only be bad for Scots all around.
In my opinion the SNP would be content with a minority government in May, with the Greens backing them, they could blame the likes of us for not getting a majority, we can’t allow that plan to succeed we must give them a constituency vote majority.
One it sends a message to Johnson (who must already know by now that the SNP is flagging with regards to voters in Scotland but he’s playing it down) and two, an SNP majority gives us a very slim chance of holding an indyref within the next parliamentary term.
Some won’t like this idea, others well, who knows.
@ Big Jock at 7:17 pm
The very fact that we find ourselves in this predicament at all should be a wake up call that all is not as it seems within the SNP.
Re. Not giving votes to the SNP. I suggested before that this discussion needs to be considered not on a national level but on a local level. The electoral targeting of certain constituencies held by individuals that are a major factor in creating this predicament and placing us where we are is valid.
Malignant cancer which is detrimental to a body’s overall health and well-being is specifically targeted with the most suitable localised treatment which damages the overall body the least.
Unfortunately the potential creation of a good person / wank list to identify culpable individuals took a major hit when the MSPs showed their credentials with the recent Hate Crime Bill passing.
Empowering these folk for another 5 years when they will be able to silence those voices that oppose them is fundamentally going to restrict or inhibit the possibilities of dealing with them later.
They will go after this site. A couple of weeks back they showed their hand on that score. That comes after previously silencing Stu’s accounts on twitter.
Regarding your voting intentions folks.
What is the highest moral principle?
Ans
Honour, honesty, integrity, sincerity all refer to highest moral principles with also the absence of deceit or fraud.
Now if you think the SNP fill those criteria and deserve your vote,then fill your boots.
I do not, so they don’t get my vote- simple for me.
Why now?
Spite. She has her future planned, and a move, forced or voluntary, may be sooner than later. Same reason for extending contracts of people who should have been be sacked.
Having a bit of fun at expense of ordinary people before moving on.
Very well said, LOCHSIDE @ 7:13pm.
Serious question for those arguing for giving the SNP a BIG majority because that will give them ‘no choice; but to go for Indy – how so?
Why haven’t they done it with the majority they have already?
And how does a a BIG majority stop NS asking Boris for a S 30 and Boris saying no and NS saying ‘Bad Boris won’t give me a referendum!'” and the same blah, blah again for another five years?
I don’t get this ‘big SNP majority means NS must go for a referendum’ argument. More likely she’ll see it as an endorsement to carry on exactly as she has been doing, wokery and all.
I think this article and REVStu are spot on.
Think about it, six years of sturgeon, with mandate after mandate and chance after chance to really hammer home the indy message and she has done NOTHING. Not one serious move has she made for independence, I mean she won’t even turn up at indy marches, but goes to Pride and brexit demos in London.
Independence is NOT her priority, and she surrounds herself with those who think the same way. This is why they feel safe to indulge these nonsense agendas. Even outwith independence, the GRA is hardly the most urgent Scottish problem, nor for that matter is the stupid ‘hate (thought) crome bill. But she has made these a priority, in the full knowledge they are utterly, utterly divisive.
I have said it before and I’ll say it again, she is a fraud, and utter charlatan – and it is for THAT reason her cabal seemingly wanted to destroy the reputation of an innocent Alex Salmond. She knew he WOULD call her out, she knew, that he would identify just WHY her focus is on NOT gaining independence, but stringing Scots along with vague promises that are never kept. She knew, that within the SNP he would put a stop to her lies and nonsense.
Nicola Sturgeon is either the most incompetent leader in political history, or she is a London stooge, wholly in the pocket of London. It would not be the first time, England has done this with her colonies before. England, you might say, has form.
If we want independence, it really will not matter how we vote in May. She and her cabal are already happily allowing Westminster to dismantle Holyrood and Scotland’s rights. It is a right canny game she and her British state cabal play, whining about big bad London, whilst acting on their commands. Always playing for time, always moaning ,but in reality doing nothing, just saying enough to string us all along. And it would have continued, had the Jury in Scotland’s highest court not seen through the tissue of lies they were fed.
Maybe I’ll be surprised come May. Maybe the SNP will launch a proper manifesto for change, that makes independence a matter of not just necessity, but considerable urgency. It is urgent, anybody can see that.
I’ll not hold my breath.
dropthevipers@7.37pm.
I see no benefit to Scots never mind the indy cause by giving your second (List) vote to a BritNat party at Holyrood. Only the other day SLAB’s new leader Anas Sarwar dropped a Glasgow/Kelvin (Hollie Cameron) candidate because she spoke positively on Scottish independence. The Tories at Holyrood take their cue from Westminster, and Lib/Dem leader Willie Rennie, would rather see a scorched earth policy in Scotland before he’d agree to independence.
List vote either AFI or ISP.
Do people recall that near the end of Blair’s ‘useful political life’, when he was almost fully exhausted, fully squeezed-out, like Nicola is now, that he singlehandedly tried to open up the UK to dozens and dozens of ‘supercasinos’ in every city up and down the land.
Strange move for a socialist Labour Prime Minister eh…
That was a very revealing moment. Blair was done and so they people behind him decided to see if they could cash in financially in a real piss taking manner, just as they had already done politically for 12 years.
It was a greedy grubby little moment that gave us a glimpse of the true forces behind Tony Blair.
So I would guess Team Nicola are desperate to get these final political poison pills ingested into the Scottish body politic now before all else because they think Nicola is done anyway and therefore getting this done is more important to them than the SNP’s success at the forthcoming election. That should be a worry to everyone…
Again I think it underlines just how pernicious and insidious these bills are that they are so important as to override all other considerations like winning the election.
They really want them. So they should be resisted at all costs.
Hi, Nicola, thanks for agreeing to meet us, have a seat please.
Can I ask you to pay attention to this – it’s not long.
………….
You work for us now.
We’ll be in touch.
“If someone can explain the advantage of not giving the SNP a majority”
Because that is the only way you would have a chance for SNP to deliver an indyref or independence that they clearly have no intention to deliver. If you give them a majority, they will make up any excuse to not deliver, just like they did for the last 6 years.
I say a chance, because I would not put it pass Sturgeon or the next puppet to align with the tories, labour or libdems to stop Scotland’s independence if that is their only way out. At the end of the day, her government has form or siding against Scotland, doesn’t it? They aligned with the British state government against Scotland when they attempted to delay and derail Mr Keatings’ S30 case.
There may be another reason.
NS fancies herself a spot in the UN as a spokesman/woman/other for minorities, like the trans fetishists.
Her push to do all this horrible stuff before the election is part of that intent. She has no interest in independence, or anything approaching it.
She wants all this crap on her CV, so she increases her chance of getting a much better gig, for much longer than the gap between elections.
She is acting on her own behalf, no one else’s, and certainly not the Scottish people. She’d be happy to watch Scotland drown under Tory fascism if she gets the gig of her dreams.
She’ll be off and we’ll be fucked.
I don’t think this is rocket science, imho.
#ReclaimTheseStreets is trending on twitter,
because the streets are seen as not safe for woman after Sarah Everard was abducted and murdered by a man,
at the same time as she was reported missing,Humza Yousaf was taking away the sanctuaries of safety for all Scotland`s woman,
which allows for uncertified self id, allowing any man to legally claim he is a woman and enforce access to female sanctuaries,
every MSP who voted Humza Yousaf`s abomination through is complicit in making all woman of Scotland less safe than they were,
and any that use the #ReclaimTheseStreets hashtag is a dirty hypocrite.
You don’t have to defeat Scottish Independence – you don’t even have to fight it.
You just have to sabotage the vehicle that drives it. Steer it where you want it to go. It’s less bloody.
Western Government are expert at this, the UK and the US being top of the league.
Anyone thinking Scotland just gets to walk away into the sunset with all Her oil, fishing and fresh water, has to have their head screwed on backwards.
There is another possibility of course – that she and her inner circle (the only ones who matter, since she has maneouvred everyone else out of the picture) are just lacking in intelligence, empathy and understanding. She has been in power long enough but what do people know about her character? She has played a blinder in deliberately keeping it away from the public, content to play this middle management office supervisor par excellence. Her highest ambition.
I now think she is the classic small town prim, censorious self-righteous type, unworldly, determined to run the church committee and the jumble sale better than anybody else. With a very dim view of those who thwart her busybody agenda. After all she knows best for everybody. She has no idea of life outside of her comfortable bubble, and feels convinced that she and her friends should be running things. She thinks she is in the vanguard, abreast of the latest in vogue ideas, despising those who cast doubt on her virtuous patronising, and quite happy to see others fail who threaten her cosy rectitude. The vicar’s daughter, prim, bossy and clueless about life on a housing scheme or women’s refuge.
That is the calibre of the people running the show – mediocre, unimaginative and self-righteous small-minded dullards. What have they done to inspire a vision of an indy Scotland? Diddly squat – they don’t have the ambition or vision. Can anybody remember a thing Sturgeon has said which has inspired you, moved you or made you identify with her? She is a vacuum, devoid of human life, as bland as her wardrobe. She and her pitifully small circle just feel like they ought to be in charge, telling people how to behave. And heaven help you if you don’t agree.
Worst results for this election – SNP majority or SNP+Green majority,
Best result – the ISP eclipse the Greens on the list vote and an SNP/ISP gov becomes a possibility.
But the ISP and the rest of them need to get themselves sorted out v quickly. And I don’t just mean online or on Twitter, they better be showing up in the news, on TV, etc – and very quickly as there’s v little time left, You got to reach the non-Twitter general public.
I say give the SNP the mandate. Give them a few months to let us down. Then the movement takes over the independence cause.
Yes I know the SNP will not deliver independence. I am not giving them my faith. What I am using the election for is to demonstrate Scotland’s wishes. If people think a minority SNP government in 2021 will be taken down , then I am afraid it won’t happen
Either way we are stuck with the SNP. But I would rather have a mandate than not have one. That gives Scotland a fighting chance.
I am voting for my country, not for the SNP.
The only positive outcome (which is very unlikely to happen) would be a minority SNP government held together by an alliance with AFI/ISP.
Every week at PMQ’s the FM could be asked ” What have you done about independence this week?”
Independence motions could be tabled by AFI/ISP that would embarrass the SNP if they did not support them.
@TommySheridan
“…to receive nominations from all 8 of AFI’s regional branches…”
So you’ll be taking votes away from Joan McAlpine on the list for the South Scotland region?
How disappointing. If there’s one MSP that we can’t afford to lose from the Scottish Parliament it’s Joan McAlpine. Every single one of us should be doing what we can to ger her re-elected, not taking votes away from her.
I’m afraid can no longer support your alliance.
@Ian Mac 8:03pm
Its patently obvious she is not devoid of human life? If she wins a majority then she deserves to stay. It’s how we deal with the situation that matters. And there are many differing views. Each to his own. The only legitimate way to depose of Sturgeon is by democratic means. She will have to hand over power if she loses the election. Her psychological construct, I no longer care about.
Chat on this post seems to have taken off. People have taken off on my comment and suggested that Craig Murray run against Angus Robertson. FWIW I’m pretty sure he can’t do that unless he resigns from the SNP and goes as an independent and I have no reason to think he would.
My thoughts were just that 1 seat be sacrificed for the greater good. In a further twist I don’t see any harm in Angus being elected in future. He is a capable media friendly performer. I just don’t want him leading the party or having too great an influence on strategy.
‘She is a vacuum, devoid of human life, as bland as her wardrobe. She and her pitifully small circle just feel like they ought to be in charge, telling people how to behave. And heaven help you if you don’t agree.’ I’ve dealt with her and she’s fuckin useless….even worse than Swinney. They use middle-men, young dopes from Victoria Quay in the main. We’re all sick of it now and there’s no way back for the two of them.
Roger @7.48pm.
Giving the SNP a majority in May by no means, means that Sturgeon will hold an indyref, in my opinion it only leaves that door ajar for one within the five year term.
As for your second point we know a majority in May won’t change Johnson’s mind on the S30, however a SNP majority doesn’t allow Johnson to proclaim that Scots don’t want independence, and reinforce his position that Scots favour the union.
From the close of a comment further up this Thread:
“Anyone thinking Scotland just gets to walk away into the sunset with all Her oil, fishing and fresh water, has to have their head screwed on backwards.”
I can add to that, Scotland’s Maritime Waters!
There’s a map somewhere on the Web—-it’s massive and approximately 6-7 times England’s waters, well to Scotland’s North and North-West.
Big Jock says:
13 March, 2021 at 8:08 pm
I say give the SNP the mandate. Give them a few months to let us down. Then the movement takes over the independence cause.
I understand the rationale but in doing this you will endorse and thus perpetuate the corruption that pervades not just Holyrood, but the whole national apparatus.
Believe me I know. https://www.tns2019.org/new-blog-1/2021/3/13/jumping-into-the-kangeroo-court
The hydra needs to be decapitated. Many times over.
Republic- I agree. We cant get independence without the demonstration of a mandate, even if we know the SNP won’t deliver.
The people can make it happen.
Jack that artificial sea border doesn’t have any legality under international maritime laws. It’s irrelevant.
@Veritas
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EwW2ROXXEAAyH6y?format=jpg&name=small
@ Jack Murphy
Colin Dunn aka Indy PosterBoy has produced a massive amount of info-graphics over the years.
https://twitter.com/zarkwan/status/1000089713208971265
His site with pages to scroll through.
https://indyposterboy.scot/
“I understand the rationale but in doing this you will endorse and thus perpetuate the corruption that pervades not just Holyrood, but the whole national apparatus.”
TNS2019.
Two points worth noting are, no one knows what the next five years holds under a SNP government we can speculate, we don’t even know if Sturgeon will still be the leader until 2026.
Second point, by giving them a majority we are also endorsing the very slim possibility that there might be an indyref before 2026, and as I’ve said before the majority stops Johnson from proclaiming that Scots want to remain in this unfit for purpose union.
@TNS2019 – Thought you might like this sir; I know I did: ‘The defeat of the no-confidence motion in John Swinney told us nothing about Mr Swinney but quite a lot about the Scottish Greens, who saved his bacon (if they will pardon the expression).’
And don’t forget leccy.
Scotland currently exporting more than we are using.
https://extranet.nationalgrid.com/RealTime
TOMMY SHERIDAN @ 6:50 pm
“Action For Independence (AFI)”
Thanks Tommy. Great news that Craig M is standing. And you too I hope. Well done Dave Thomson.
4 votes heading AFI on the list frae this hoose.
And will also join AFI.
SNP1 (grudgingly for now) / AFI2 in May’s election
Max the Yes folks.
01/12/2020
Craig Murray:
“I am standing for president because I want the SNP to be a party whose overriding priority is to obtain full, completed and internationally recognised Independence for Scotland within a maximum of two years from this date.”
Craig got a remarkable 25% support.
Now it would appear, according to Tommy Sheridan, that Craig Murray is a possible candidate for the AFI.
So in 3 months CM has gone from being a (creditable, reputable and worthy) possible President of the SNP to AFI candidate.
Does CM know this?
Sturgeon is a fraud and has done everything she can to delay and derail independence whilst pretending to support it.
Her strategy is to sabotage the independence movement.
She is a glove puppet of the british secret service who drank from The poisoned chalice years ago.
The triple lock mandates slogan so often used in 2017 has been silent for years.
Make no mistake, the SNP are opponents of Scottish independence!
The next leader of the SNP assuming it is not Nicola or her hand chosen successor is going to be severely hamstrung.
They will face Corbyn’s choice, SNP style…
Try to live will all the Sturgeonite backstabbers (who will get you in the end if you do).
Or go to war and try to deselect them and replace them with candidates loyal to Independence and not Nicola.
It’s the proverbial horns of the dilemma.
Like Corbyn the next SNP leader, even a very good one can’t win if they are dealt that hand.
This is where we come in, the voter.
We have to do what Old Labour fatally never did with New Labour. They never addressed the legacy Blairite MPs.
The biggest favour we can do for the next, hopefully good guy, SNP leader (be it Cherry or whoever) is utterly fucking massacre politically as many of the Sturgeonite drones as possible.
Give them a fighting chance to rebuild. Otherwise we are just handing the new leader a poison chalice.
Zander Tait @8.39pm.
I’ve followed Craig Murrays blog for over a decade now, and his credibility in my opinion isn’t in question, here’s a man with a heart condition with the Sword of Damocles hanging over his head, yet he’s still prepared to try and do something positive to help Scots gain their independence, what are you doing for the cause?
You couldn’t lace Craig Murray’s boots.
I will be giving the SNP my constituency vote in May, as a personal vote for my MSP, who I know is 100% for independence. The AFI are most likely to get my list vote. I have been an SNP member since 1974, and am only remaining a member so that I can vote Sturgeon and her wokes out and help reclaim the SNP from the quizmasters currently in charge.
Craig Murray is not standing for AFI or anyone else. He is a leading light in Now Scotland, but that is a cross-party/no party movement, presenting no candidates. He is still a member of the SNP but failed their candidate vetting and hopefully always will. He supports independence, or ‘is not a team player’ in SNP parlance, and thus terminally unacceptable.
So Craig is not standing for anyone anywhere.
But watch this space.
Why?
1. Sturgeon and her ruling cabal are so arrogant and deranged that they actually believe that the natural state of Scotland is to be ruled by them. Years of fawning cult like adulation and appearances at a packed hydro has led Nicola Sturgeon, the narcissistic psychopath, to believe that like Christ himself she can walk on water. She believes she is a world leader of genuine standing on a par with presidents like Angela Merkel and that she is destined to lead for as long as she wants. She believes she is never wrong, given the way fully signed up sturgeon cult members like scotsrenewables behave who can blame her.
2. Sturgeon always wants to be seen to be ahead of the social game, so embracing wokeism and trans rights allows her to preach to others and fulfil her dream as being embraced as a genuine intellectual with her finger in the social pulse like her lesbian girl crush Elif Shafak…. and similarly some of her allies like “daddy bear” also want to get on the woke bandwagon so they can shag their way through the SNP gay youth wing who go weak at the knees for this biology defying insanity.
3. The trans rights lobby are very active online and on social media and Sturgeon is savvy enough to know that if she gives them what they want that instantly she has a massive online army who would go through the fires of hell for her while completely ignoring how utterly corrupt and dishonest she is. The truth is that she has calculated the likes of wings and other pro Indy sites either don’t pack the online punch on Twitter etc that the trans lobby do, that the Indy movement is no longer “sexy” enough for Sturgeon as they lack the bright young things of the trans lobby and also they (wings) sometimes ask difficult questions.
Ultimately Sturgeon and her cabal at the top of the SNP are not interested in independence, all they care about power and money and it just so happened that independence would allow them to achieve that aim without Westminster or the EU ever jeopardising that when the inevitable destruction of human rights takes place as the sturgeon cabal tightens its grip on power. I know some people think sturgeon is some kind of agent for the British state who is trying to destroy Scottish nationalism but that could not be further from the truth and completely ignores that sturgeon is just being sturgeon, a power crazed, evil, twisted narcissistic lying psychopath who has never had a genuine friend in her whole life and would shit on whoever it takes to get what she wants.
Big Jock @8.29pm.
Yeah Jock, its not an ideal situation but I can’t see another way.
@Republicofscotland
With all due respect ROS, you have misunderstood my post completely. Try reading it again. I described Craig Murray, quite clearly as “creditable, reputable and worthy”. He still is. My simple query is that Tommy Sheridan is claiming that CM is now in line to being a possible candidate for the AFI.
Until I hear it from Craig Murray then I am suggesting that Tommy may have got his facts askew.
I hold Craig Murray in the highest regard, and you are right ROS, I would not be able to lace his boots, but I would be delighted to buy him some of his favourite indulgence once such places of ill repute re-open and enjoy and hour or two of his inherent wisdom.
Lochside @ 7:13 pm
“Otherwise ,we surrender..yet again to Westminster and the onslaught of ‘Britification ‘, the absorption of Scotland as ‘North Britain’ once and for all. A colonial administration of 3500 transplanted ‘officials; from RUK ..back to redcoat rule.”
You are right Lochside, the very survival of the Scottish people/nation is what is at stake. The colonizers are digging in. We can’t afford to mess around.
So Max the Yes – SNP1/AFI2 – even if the taste of SNP1 is a wee bittie soor.
Maybe if Sarwar wins in NS’s constituency, and as SNP will get hee haw from the list, this could mean a new leader for SNP anyway, courtesy of the voters?
I’d still like to see a plebiscite election on indy based on the list vote – AFI? Perhaps at least seek that additional mandate – a democratic Scottish national majority vote in favour of independence would be important leverage.
Okay Zander I take your point, but whether or not he is or isn’t going to stand for AFI, how does that affect his credibility or AFI’s for that matter, as you’ve stated below.
“So in 3 months CM has gone from being a (creditable, reputable and worthy) possible President of the SNP to AFI candidate.”
Captain Yossarian says:
13 March, 2021 at 8:38 pm
@TNS2019 – Thought you might like this sir; I know I did: ‘The defeat of the no-confidence motion in John Swinney told us nothing about Mr Swinney but quite a lot about the Scottish Greens, who saved his bacon (if they will pardon the expression).’
Indeed I do. I was contemplating Green at one point. Never again.
Also, re the NEC elections which seem a lieftime ago. Those votes seem to be making a lot of sense now.
Craign did remarkably well and that tells us a lot about the SNP membership.
There is no logic to ‘give the SNP a majority and they will have to deliver indy’,
No they won’t no matter how large their majority is they will only have to deliver what is in their manifesto and we know that what will be in the manifesto is the risable 11 point plan that has absolutely no chance of delivering independence.
So no matter how we vote independence will not happen next Holyrood term, it would be best Not to give NS a majority as a majority will only cement her power.
I go for the stupid and incompetent option with extra arrogance and entitlement- they don’t care about independence and they caNnot be forced to deliver it, no matter how large a majority they get. A large majority will only mean a decade at leasT before we get another chance at independence whereas a poor showing might bring some changes.
Thanks Dan at 8:34pm for the Links.
Proadge says:
13 March, 2021 at 4:02 pm
In a nutshell. And as a recently ex-member this is the sole reason I might be able to hold my nose and vote for them (on the constituency) anyway – to help deny them the minority
Have you thought this through? Voting for them ensures that we all stay on this road to madness, at least a minority might curb their excesses. They have proven they are completely unaccountable.
Could be that they simply have no idea what they are doing. Kiddies playing with matches.
If indeed they have no idea, giving them a majority will certainly give the woke element the keys to the booze cabinet as well. It might not end well.
TNS2019,
Is Murrell in a relationship with Harvie? I’m only asking.
Interesting and plausible. Dreadful scenario, though.
I recall, as a schoolboy averse to contact sports and with no interest whatever in football or rugby, that when during PE I had to be on the playing field so engagedI would endeavour to always stay well away from the ball while appearing always to be heading towards it.. Quite a knack! It appears the SNP under NS and PM pursue the same evasive strategy.
Zander Tait. You come across I am afraid as an attack dog for the Sturgeon loyalist front.
Craig Murray is a utterly respected individual both nationally and internationally. He is pro Scottish Independence so why would you attack him for trying to maximise seats in the forthcoming election.
In 2016 953,000 votes secured 4 SNP list seats whilst 956,000 votes secured 45 unionist seats. Standing for an AFI seeking to maximise independence seats is a sensible thing to do. So why are you attacking Mr Murray – and what gives a pygmy like you the right to say that he has gone from being creditable, reputable and worthy.
Quite honestly Zander you are an attack troll For whom do you work, from who do you take the shilling?
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GUESS WHERE THIS CAME FROM ? ( and no it’s not Nicola Sturgeon’s Face Book that’s being taken down )
@ Lochside 7.13pm
Brilliant post. You don’t comment often, but when you do, you always hit the target.
On another point. If the SNP end up relying on a contingent of ISP/AFI Msps to govern, could the smaller parties refuse to support Sturgeon as leader in the same way as coalition partners refused to back Richard Mulcahy in Ireland in 1948?
@ Jack Murphy
Happy to help. Whilst on the subject of seas, there is also the matter of Westminster moving the maritime border to take 6000 square miles of Scottish waters.
Craig Murray covers that in the following article.
https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2017/01/scotlands-stolen-seas-technical-explanation/
Having bobbed about on boats West of Shetland piloting an ROV assisting placing the first of the subsea infrastructure on the sea bed of the Foinavon oilfield, I can tell you it is difficult to comprehend the staggeringly vast ares our maritime waters extend to.
Kcor says in relation to making a complaint to the police in respect of the missing £600k:
“It would be surprising if at least one complaint had not been made.
But remember these days the police and prosecutors only go for supporters of Alex Salmond.
They have no time or resources to look into any other crimes.”
That may well be right. But even leaving aside potential criminal claims, in English law, where money has been lent for a particular purpose, it can be impressed with a trust whereby if it used for a different purpose, that could amount to a breach of trust by the persons using the money unlawfully, who are fiduciaries. I’d imagine that there are equivalent provisions in Scots law.
Donors in these circumstances in England could seek declarations from the High Court that the persons who have spent the money for the improper purpose have acted in breach and be required to repay the sum. A Scottish solicitor may be able to advise on whether such restitutionary claims are possible.
@Republicofscotland
No ROS, you have not taken my point, but in the interest of clarity I will re-phrase that which I wrote thusly:
According to Tommy Sheridan, Craig Murray is now a potential candidate for the AFI having, only 3 months ago, received 25% of the votes in running for SNP President as a member of the SNP.
I believe that Craig Murray is an honourable, intelligent man. A man of boundless integrity and the antithesis of all those who now control the SNP, the Scottish Civil Service and the Lord Advocates office of truth suppression.
Now if that is not clear enough ROS, how about this:
I do not trust Tommy Sheridan.
I trust Craig Murray implicitly.
I detest the Sturgeon and her vermin acolytes.
I wish for nothing more than for Scottish Independence.
Just like you ROS.
A lot folks taking about Craig Murray, while I agree that Craig did the right thing as regards the salmond situation and does not deserve to be jailed there is a problem with Craig’s position in that he would still vote for Nicola Sturgeon.
I believe Craig still backs Nicola Sturgeon for the same reasons that he supports Scottish nationalism, not because he loves Scotland, but because he hates the UK for destroying his career. Some may say “does that really matter?” Well it does because it means he is willing to back Sturgeon in the vain hope that she may break up the UK so he can get his revenge, rather than wanting independence because he actually believes it will make people’s lives better. Maybe I’m being harsh but he was a member of the Lib Dem’s for years and only appeared to be interested in Scottish nationalism when Alex Salmond brought our movement to the fore.
I might be wrong, but I simply cannot understand how anyone staring a jail sentence in the face could possibly even consider voting for the person who trying to have them jailed. Craig has claimed multiple times that he believes Sturgeon is a criminal (I do too) and that he has evidenced to prove it and yet he is going to vote for her so she can finish the job of destroying the country. It defies all logic. Just can’t get my head around it at all.
Peter is 56 Nicola is 50 they will retire in 5 years that is the plan, no doubt.
Big Jock says:
‘If someone can explain the advantage of not giving the SNP a majority ,then i’m all ears.’
Err – I think their conduct over the last couple of years may have something to do with people not wanting to vote for them ?
Then again, I understand that consistent life principles are difficult for some.
I have taken on board your point Zander, now that you’ve rephrased it, and I retract my 8.43pm comment.
As for Tommy Sheridan, I agree with his strategy this time.
Fairliered says
‘I will be giving the SNP my constituency vote in May, as a personal vote for my MSP, who I know is 100% for independence. The AFI are most likely to get my list vote. I have been an SNP member since 1974, and am only remaining a member so that I can vote Sturgeon and her wokes out and help reclaim the SNP from the quizmasters currently in charge.’
How does that work ?
‘You’re getting my vote of support so that I can get rid of you’
Hiya Stuart and Wings readers,
Long time reader (right back to your Amiga Power days), first time commenter.
First of all, thank you for fearlessly telling the truth. If only we had a hundred like you.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the security services had their hooks in the SNP (I’d be surprised if they didn’t), but I think Paul Cockshott and Roger are on the right track.
Wokeness is the religion of the ruling class, and people who aspire to the patronage of the ruling class. I’m fairly sure Nicola, Humza, and the rest of them know fine well how unpopular it is – they just don’t care, because they despise you. There’s no compromise possible with Woke, no possible disagreement in good faith, no constructive debate to be had. If you’re not 100% on board with the Woke agenda, whatever it is this month, you’re a racist / sexist / homophobe / transphobe / whatever.
That’s how Humza could make his extraordinary speech snarling about white people, and nobody in the Scottish Parliament batted an eye (obviously if you similarly complained about brown people you’d be in jail). It’s also how Alyn Smith could recently denounce anyone who opposes a ban on “conversion therapy” for people with gender confusion as “bigots” (obviously the trans cult defines anything short of immediately sterilising impressionable children with artificial hormones as “conversion therapy”).
Malice plays an enormous role in woke politics – the desire to humiliate people designated as “gammon” or whatever. I’m not sure we’ve ever seen anything quite like it in Western history, it’s as if an entire class of people has gone feral and openly seeks the destruction of their own nations. What the SNP and Scottish Government have tried to do to Alex Salmond is not an aberration, it’s more or less how they plan on treating anyone they hate.
There’s no quick or easy solution to any of this unfortunately, but I can’t follow Big Jock’s logic that the best way to deal with a corrupt and criminal regime is to reward it with votes. None of the major parties are good options, but a price needs to be paid for stripping the Scottish people of what little freedom of speech we had.
If we tolerate this, our children will be next.
@Republicofscotland
Fair Doos ROS.
Bill Clinton spent more time on Jeff Epstein Airplane than the pilot. Deplorable?
Was anyone ever arrested for the Seth Rich assassination?
Craig Murray can’t be trusted because he wants independence for the wrong reasons
(@Shocked)
FFS, what a raging loonpit of fantasy this place is becoming.
Should the First Minister be such a puppy dog to the Rapey swivel eyed Clinton’s?
Why not call their bluff? Make every effort to produce a big SNP majority and “dare” them to renage on their expressed intention to call a referendum.
I’m in love with Karen Dunbar.
I just watched her on the telly, she’s brilliant.
She represents everything I love about Scotland.
KD for FM in May.
If Mzzzz Sturgeon is pursuing Independence then I suppose Tony Blair is a ” pretty straight kind of guy”.
Craig Murray burned his high flying career, that most of us would salivate over, to blow the whistle at great personal cost.
He has, by any measure, earned the right to ‘call it as he sees it’.
I disagree with CM at times but that is what it means to stand next to someone you respect to achieve a common goal.
Enough people will simply not turnout rather than vote snp. They will still be the largest party and the indy groups will be further fragmented/.
Not looking good for indy.
.
Humza Yousef and Nicola Sturgeon believe women are inferior in Scotland.
They just created the transgender driven HCA where men in dresses can access women’s safe places.
If a woman objects, she is at risk of being arrested.
In Scotland a cock-in-a-frock man has all the rights whilst last year 118 women were killed by men who have perverted desires or rages against women so powerful they kill women…
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-56365827
Stuart asked about “timing” in this article.
The answer requires a forensic investigation, but in a short sentence…
The British Establishment have found the very worst in humanity and joined it with a hugely controversial subject then deploy this to kill off any risk of losing their Scottish Colony.
Simple and tragic.
If you want to study the personification of this, just examine Alyn Smyth, read the words of his former toy boy Jordon. Read the Woke words of the Twittler Youth. The saddest example of this toxic mix of dissonant pro-men anti-women laws can be found in one slithering excuse of a human being…
Pete Wishart.
This ex-RunRig warbler disgusts me.
Pete Wishart, you have blood on your hands. Women’s blood. As does every single SNP MP and MSP who have kept Nicola Sturgeon and her acolytes in office.
Wishart, I hope the blood money you call your pension is worth the sacrifice? Always remember Pete…
“Evil triumphs when good men and women fail to act.”
Just before the 6th May election, the British Press will weaponise all of this to bring about a Lab/Lib or ConDem “Scottish Executive”.
The careerist politicians will all be alright as they have gold plated pensions to rely upon.
@Denise 9:05 pm
Well said Denise.
Why now indeed, well (westminster)may bought the Dup, so i believe that the snp leadership have been bought to stifle scottish independence, there is no other explanation as to the snp’s pushing of the self destruct button.
Will craig murray be representing his constituents from prison?
Who in their right mind is going to vote for Tommy Sheridan?
How did Alexander untie the Gordian knot?
@ Geoff Anderson , TheSNPleftMe unfortunately I agree with Briandoonthetoon this is not about personal feelings this is about SAVING Scotland’s independence from a shower of wasters, we keep hearing that we need to support alternative indy parties to hold the SNP’s feet to the fire , the more indy parties there are only lends confusion to voters and makes an effective opposition less likely
I am not saying one or the other is right but it REALLY needs true patriots to swallow their pride and negotiate a way FORWARD
Another wee suggestion whichever party might consider putting in their manifesto is alongside a publicly issued statement of a plebiscite election for indy in EVERY election , the party will confirm that if elected to HR they will immediately make a move to FORCE a repeal or removal of the new HCB
Why don’t we have an advisory referendum on the Humza Bill? They could have it on the day of the election. Simple bit of paper in with the other bits of paper?
Do you want Hate Crime Bill to become law? Yes/No.
I might be wrong about Craig Murray, but at the moment his goal seems to be rightly expose Nicola Sturgeon as a criminal…. and then re-elect Nicola Sturgeon so that she can corrupt the legal system even more and absolve herself of her crimes while destroying Scotland a little more every day…
If he wasn’t backing Sturgeon I wouldn’t be so confused about what the hell he is doing. Seems like utter madness. An analogy would be someone is threatening to push you off a cliff and instead of holding on you jump off yourself to save them the bother so they can then go on to push someone else of that cliff.
Roger says,
@Mia
“What chance do you think there is of pro indy List only parties getting more than 50% of the vote in the coming Scottish election?”
“Zero.”
Exactly.
Mia has relentlessly been pushing her plebiscite manifesto by the List parties but has twice failed to answer my simple question today.
What is her agenda? Who is she going to vote for?
Promising something which you know for sure you will be in no position to deliver is obtaining votes by false pretences. It just destroys their credibility.
@Mac (7.52) –
‘Do people recall that near the end of Blair’s ‘useful political life’, when he was almost fully exhausted, fully squeezed-out, like Nicola is now, that he singlehandedly tried to open up the UK to dozens and dozens of ‘supercasinos’ in every city up and down the land.’
Can’t say I remember much about that, but I do remember, when the National Lottery was in the offing here, an expert came across from the US to advise on how lotteries should be done. I don’t know if ‘Camelot’ was in charge then, or now, or whose idea this was, but the whole thing was remarkable – this dude looked as if he’d walked straight off the set of something like ‘Boardwalk Empire’. He may even have been from Chicago. (Well, if you’re going to start a ‘numbers’ racket, you go to the pros I suppose.)
That one can’t be pinned on Blair ‘cos it was way back, maybe mid-90s, but it would’ve been the dying days of Major, ‘national bollards helpline’, all that stuff.
So, aye, maybe you’re right, that there’s a pattern of sorts – when the Exit sign starts becoming discernible, they just grab whatever they can get.
willie says:
13 March, 2021 at 9:15 pm
Zander Tait. You come across I am afraid as an attack dog for the Sturgeon loyalist front.
Zander Says:
“I detest the Sturgeon and her vermin acolytes.”
Got that willie?
I have been all ar sea for weeks now. Lochside at 7.13 is where I want to be. Then something else screams af me. Surely if you want Independence voting for a Unionist party is just not an option. At all.
I want to send a clear message to SNP and I think we are all struggling to find the most effective way to do that without shooting ourselves in the foot. I don’t pretend to have the answer but I think it first and foremost depends who is your Constituency candidate. I have a newbie and can try to question her. I absolutely couldn’t vote for some others if I lived somewhere else.
Holding the SNP to the fire sound feasible but how do we do that once they are elected. We all know they don’t even listen to elected officials never mind ordinary members never mind mere voter fodder.
PLEASE DO NOT VOTE FOR A UNIONIST PARTY. No matter the question that is never the answer. Maybe if you cannot stomach your SNP candidate spoil the ballot and hold your head high.
I will never forgive that we are put in this position and my heart breaks for all of our brothers and sisters who know they are probably too old now to see the dream come true. It certainly won’t come true in the next parliament and may hell keep the coals warm for those that have brought us to here.
On a more positive note, let us remember how much this has brought many of us together and we will develop a true Independence party out of this. The growth shoots are there.
Do what you can live with. No one can criticise you for keeping your own integrity.
Another very good article, Stuart. The question as to why now is a difficult one to answer.
My take on it is as follows: Every journey requires a destination and the SNP were elected to move us towards independence. However, for a myriad of reasons already well explained, the SNP have abandoned their destination. They have become directionless, and because the momentum has to travel somewhere, they are self-imploding.
By doing everything they can to avoid delivering independence they are, in effect, sabotaging independence.
Ingwe says,
“Donors in these circumstances in England could seek declarations from the High Court that the persons who have spent the money for the improper purpose have acted in breach and be required to repay the sum. A Scottish solicitor may be able to advise on whether such restitutionary claims are possible.”
I am sure that should be the case in any democratic country.
But as I said earlier, there must have been at least one complaint – ignored by the Police and prosecutors, who are in the pocket of the corrupt criminal SNP.
£600,000 embezzled and not a single complaint or court case? Only in a corrupt criminal country like Scotland.
@Shocked 10:00pm
I didn’t get Craig Murray’s vote SNP 1 and SNP 2 either. In his defence he qualified that by saying it’s very difficult for us to decide what is for the best. I paraphrase. But it’s true we all have to pick our way through this debacle. Winning the World Cup one nil, Maradona decides to score 2 own goals and nobody knows why?
Rob M says,
“@Kcor
That’s not what I was getting at.
The point was that she won’t call a referendum. But I 100% agree with the point you made.”
My point was just complementing yours. Yes, she won’t and she has already embezzled the money donated to fund it.
Disturbing footage emerging of police breaking up the vigil in London.
Calls for Patel and Cressida Dick to resign.
Can we expect Police Scotland to be similarly ‘robust’ with the many women here in Scotland who will surely organise a lot more than vigils as and when the monstrous HCB becomes a reality?
@ JimuckMac at 9:12 pm
“TNS2019,
Is Murrell in a relationship with Harvie? I’m only asking.”
and there was me thinking Patrick Grady MSP was Murrel’s son.
he seems to have the required credentials
Ian Brotherhood says:
It used to be the case that if you couldn’t get into the Police in Scotland you tried MOD Police and if that failed the Met would have you. Don’t think they have progressed much beyond thuggery since the Miner strikes.
Zander Tait says,
“I trust Craig Murray implicitly.”
Last week Craig Murray was advocating constituency and list vote SNP.
List vote SNP, when there are genuine pro indy list parties? Craig Murray is not stupid, so why did he advocate that?
Today it has been reported that Craig Murray is on the AFI list. How did he get onto the AFI list in a matter of days after advocating a list vote for the SNP?
Now he is out of the SNP, I wish Craig Murray would do us all a great favour and stand against Robertson in the Edinburgh constituency.
He would get massive support for his campaign, both financially and in campaigning.
Knowing NS from 30 years ago, I can assure readers that MI5 need not be involved in the scenario playing out before us. What we are dealing with is an incredibly driven politician, for whom power is the main goal, indeed the only goal. Independence is something which may or may not happen as a result of her remaining in power, – it is but a side issue in the game. Any perceived threat to her power base will be dealt with efficiently.
Put simply, in a game of Monopoly, NS could be sitting with Old Kent Road, whilst all around her players had the better properties. I would wager that 3 hours later she would have the entire board under her control and the other players scattered round her feet.
And keeping with the pastimes analogy, I would suggest that anyone interested in bettering Scotland give themselves a break of about ten years. Go find another pastime; one which will benefit you. For this game is pretty much over, and a new one will only begin when Nicola moves off the board circa 2030-2035.
Not voting SNP may be a moral decision, and the right one.
However read Stu’s assessment. We end up with either an SNP minority or majority. Given the numbers and alternatives. The moral decision still results in the same leader and party.
A minority SNP government with 5 more years of nothing but devolution, is the worst of all outcomes.
My point is that giving the SNP a majority is not endorsing the party. It’s simply voting for the best outcome in the two scenarios.
John Martini says,
“Will craig murray be representing his constituents from prison?”
Do you have insider knowledge from the corrupt criminal Lord Advocate that Craig Murray has been sentenced to prison?
Meanwhile…
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-56389824
Women being opressed by the met police
John Martini says,
“Who in their right mind is going to vote for Tommy Sheridan?”
Who in their right mind is going to vote for Nicola Sturgeon?
maxxmacc says:
NS was displaying the same traits she displays now when she was health minister, my wife has a few horror stories from Health Protection Scotland where she victimised and broke good people for her own ends.
Kcor says:
13 March, 2021 at 10:25 pm
Zander Tait says,
“I trust Craig Murray implicitly.”
Yes, Craig is trustworthy. Tommy Sheridan is maybe less so.
When CM announces that he is now a member and candidate of the AFI then that will be the end of the matter.
On the other hand, if Tommy is telling porkies then that should clearly demonstrate that the AFI are not to be trusted having started down the same toxic path of lies and fabrications that the SNP now deploy with utter impunity on a daily basis.
Come May 6th. vote and vote for what you believe in. Make your own mind up and do not listen to anyone else.
“The SNP isn’t trying to lose the election. “
I didn’t say they were trying to lose it. Quite the opposite.
“What is her agenda?
I want to exercise my democratic right to vote simultaneously for the three things I consider fundamental in a modern Scottish democracy:
independence of Scotland + protection of females’ rights + protection of freedom of speech.
None of them is expendable nor more important or less than the other two. I will vote for the three.
“Who is she going to vote for?”
Unless a new pro-indy party willing to include in their manifesto a mandate for independence, I will spoil my constituency vote
Unless at least one of the new pro indy parties in the list is willing to include in their manifesto a mandate for independence, I will spoil my list ballot too.
I refuse to vote again to give yet another mandate for a vote on independence. We already did that repeatedly since 2016 and got nothing in return. I refuse to vote simply for the sake of boost SNP seats and power. Their power has only led to reduce ours. This time, either I vote for independence, or I spoil my ballots.
Females’ rights and freedom of speech are for me fundamental. I refuse to endorse with my vote the actions of unscrupulous individuals who will abuse my vote to force on me things that I know will harm me.
I refuse to vote to curtail my own rights and I refuse to allow to be cajoled into voting for what I do not want just because undemocratic politicians think they can get away with their toxic agendas by deliberately limit our democratic options while still maintaining the illusion of democracy.
Does that answer your question?
@maxxmacc (10.26) –
That’s intriguing!
Can you give us any juicy titbits?!
😉
Plan B should no longer include the SNP.
I had a look at AFI’s ‘aims and objectives’.
Nowhere within did I see the words Plebiscite Indy Election.
Nowhere.
Lots about building another Indy party, maximising Indy, holding the SNP to account, etc. And ensuring another Indy Ref.
But the words ‘plebiscite election’. I saw not at all.
So folks. Lets build another gravy train. And they can sell us new carrots. Just like the old ones.
Shocked says,
“I might be wrong, but I simply cannot understand how anyone staring a jail sentence in the face could possibly even consider voting for the person who trying to have them jailed.”
Totally agree.
The only reason I could think of was he had been blackmailed into supporting her in return for not being sent to jail.
For the record, Craig Murray should not have been prosecuted.
He was prosecuted because the Lord Advocate is a corrupt criminal in the pocket of the Criminal in Chief Sturgeon.
In my opinion, there is a reason why Craig Murrays verdict has not been arrived at yet. I may have been fooled by Sturgeon for a considerable amount of time but I have learned from that painful lesson. Robertson is damaged because of his association with Sturgeon, the Brit state know this and are moving another of their Pawn’s into place.
“giving the SNP a majority is not endorsing the party”
Yes, it is.
Giving them a majority is endorsing the party, endorsing the disgustingly corrupt leader, endorsing the vanishing of the ring-fenced money, endorsing their suppression of evidence and contempt for parliament, endorsing their appalling treatment of Mr Salmond and Grouse Beater, endorsing their dodgy practices surrounding the judicial review, endorsing their attack on democracy, justice, females’ rights and freedom of speech, endorsing their denying us our right to self determination and endorsing their taking us for fools.
“A minority SNP government with 5 more years of nothing but devolution, is the worst of all outcomes”
No. The worse possible outcome is an unleashed majority SNP government leaded by the nose by wokes with no restrains, no opposition, no intention whatsoever to deliver indyref or independence and nothing else but a rapidly shrinking devolution.
Actually, I can not think in anything worse.
I have in fact decided I cannot in conscience continue in the SNP. I had always imagined that the majority of decent members would act against Nicola once they worked out what she had tried to do to Alex, and that she has no intention of really trying for Independence.
Unfortunately I was wrong. Most ordinary members appear to have either no perception or no morality, while almost all the elected MPs and MSPs turn out to be entirely egoistic careerists. The “New SNP” is far more interested in identity politics than Independence.
For this election it seems practical to contest only the list. I have therefore today told Action for Independence, which is an umbrella alliance, that I am available for the Lothians list. I do not think at this stage I have been adopted, which is why I have not announced.
I expect the Independence political scene to be hectic and fluid the next few weeks. I understand that ISP have not been cooperative in discussing entering the AFI umbrella and agreeing list allocations, but I have only heard one side of that story. I have not joined any actual party at present. I do still hope there will eventually emerge a united Indy list (SNP aside).
Well, I’m afraid I don’t agree with this analysis of the situation. It’s possible it exists some background idea that they have in mind, but I think the explanation for all of this relates to the Salmond scandal.
What you’ve all got to bear in mind is that the Salmond stitch-up is one of the most bizarre, perverse, unhinged, freaky, twisted, fucked-up, disgraceful things ever to have occurred in Scottish politics.
You, us, we here, we are all immune to the insanity of it, we’ve processed it and come to terms with it. For me that’s actually only true to some extent — I’m still traumatised by it and in a state of shock.
But it is, I believe, the truth. I believe it’s the truth as confidently as I believe 2 + 2 = 4.
Now, if that was on you going into an election, with a growing number of people finding out and realising what happened, wouldn’t you want to change the narrative?
Would you want to go down in history as the person that had a terrible election because of something so outrageous and bizarre?
SO, how do you deal with it? Well, easy really, you change the narrative by doing highly controversial stuff. Now you have a new story — I lost votes and seats because I was so progressive and ahead of my time…
You get the idea. It’s not great but it’s better than going down in history as a totally unhinged freak.
@ Ian Brotherhood at 10.15 and Al at 10.24
In the late 1980s I went to see a film called The Love Child, starring Sheila Hancock and Peter Capaldi. It was set in London, and featured a group of police officers who beat up youths they didn’t like the look of and then adorned their unconscious (or possibly dead, it wasn’t clear) bodies with stickers declaring “Congratulations! You’ve met the Met”.
There is I suspect a difference between not wanting to lose and not wanting to win comfortably.
I have contented myself that I cannot vote for them, as bad my family. I could kid myself on I was voting for a concept. In this case independence, but the reality is I know that is not on offer with this version of the party.
Rock of Gibralter was a great racehorse but would I have backed him after he lost two of his legs? No.
The SNP is a strange entity these days and not one I can feel comfortable with. I appreciate anybody’s decision to maintain them in power. That’s your choice. I cannot live with it Im afraid.
Regardless of who wins or loses this election we are looking at several more years of wishing and hoping. That’s just the reality. I think we have to not rebuild the movement ,but move it to a new home ASAP .It is not currently in safe hands.
Daisy Walker @ 10:44
I looked back. It was you that claimed the AFI had a plebiscite promise!
@JimuckMac says:
13 March, 2021 at 9:12 pm
TNS2019,
Is Murrell in a relationship with Harvie? I’m only asking.
I read your name as JimuckRake. lol
Ian Mac says,
“There is another possibility of course – that she and her inner circle (the only ones who matter, since she has maneouvred everyone else out of the picture) are just lacking in intelligence, empathy and understanding.”
Not to forget that she and her inner circle are the very persons behind the criminal conspiracy to jail Alex Salmond on fake charges. Craig Murray has stated that explicitly and on that I trust him 100%.
““What chance do you think there is of pro indy List only parties getting more than 50% of the vote in the coming Scottish election?”
“Zero.”
So?
That is no excuse to downgrade their commitment to Scotland’s independence. Because if it is, then they are not worth even their logo.
We have been proved time and time again for the last 6 years that indyref is not the route to get independence. That route has been barricaded by Sturgeon with her bogus S30.
We have been proved too that the SNP has no intention whatsoever to deliver independence. So why insisting in using them as the vehicle to deliver it?
The way to get independence is by plebiscite. We have an election in 7 weeks. So, are those parties really pro Scotland’s independence or their only intention is to boost SNP seats?
Craig Murray,
Finally the right choice.
Now you are out of the New SNP, why don’t you do us all a great favour and stand as an independent against Robertson in the Edinburgh constituency?
Mia says,
“The way to get independence is by plebiscite. We have an election in 7 weeks. So, are those parties really pro Scotland’s independence or their only intention is to boost SNP seats?”
If the pro indy parties in your region don’t stand on a plebiscite manifesto, will you refuse to give them your list vote?
Who will you then give your list vote to?
Kcor
Have been very tempted!
But I don’t think he’ll win anyway, much of the constituency has been hollowed out by airbnb, and the good people of Dumbiedykes know very well what the Macbeth family did. Folk are not as stupid as they think. They can’t rig the election like they can the candidate selections.
Craig Murray @ 10:49 pm
“For this election it seems practical to contest only the list. I have therefore today told Action for Independence, which is an umbrella alliance, that I am available for the Lothians list. ”
Good on you Craig. We badly need your intellect and integrity and your specific and unique expertise in Holyrood, and that of Tommy Sheridan, Mark Hirst, Dave Thomson and the many others who are or wish to stand for AFI. If you can add Alex Salmond to that ‘list’ all the better.
Well, that is the end of the matter. Tommy Sheridan speaks the truth and Craig Murray confirms that he is now an AFI potential candidate on the regional list.
Too bad that CM was not allowed the largesse and the respect to release the news for himself.
Just Tommy being Tommy, I guess.
It’s always about Tommy.
You are on the cusp of the biggest collapses in the standard of living in the history of western civilisation.
You are still cling to false idols. What do you think the authoritarian control and massive surveillance state is all about?
Talk about fiddling while rome burns!
@crazycat (10.49) –
🙂 🙂
Haven’t seen it, but sounds interesting.
I’ll raise ye…
‘Jubilee’ (Jarman, 1978)
Toyah Wilcox is a mental punk who, in one scene, castrates a police officer.
Fair enough.
Thirty-five years or so later, she’s presenting Songs of Praise.
So it goes, eh?
😉
Big Jock @ 10.28 pm
There are 3 possible outcomes. SNP majority, SNP minority, or unionist coalition. Do not rule out the latter, the polls are lagging behind the decline in the SNP vote and there are a lot of disillusioned nationalists out there who are beginning to accept that the SNP under its current leadership will never deliver independence for Scotland.
So what do we do? Vote SNP, cross our fingers and hope they will clean out their filthy stable and lead us to independence or vote to be rid of their corruption and see the rise of a new independence party who will do what it says on the tin? The latter probably means 5 years of unionist control at Holyrood but at the end of that 5 years there will be a new kid ion the block instead of being back where we are now (probably worse) if Sturgeon prevails.
We need to vote these corrupt sods out of office. Ingrained prejudices and voting the way our parents did is stupid. We should vote to achieve the key objective, in this case to rid ourselves of the main impediment to Independence – Sturgeon’s SNP. Vote for whoever has the best chance of beating them in the constituency and ISP or equivalent on the list. By doing so you are voting against the corruption which is shaming our nation and improving our chances of eventually achieving independence.
TOMMY SHERIDAN,
“a solid group of AFI MSPs mandated to hold the SNP feet to the fire on the question of independence”
Did you fail to notice how the SNP leader lied countless times under oath while facing the camera, and swept aside all the honest testimony with evidence provided by Alex Salmond?
How they have used every illegal move possible to avoid being exposed as the ones responsible for the criminal conspiracy to jail Alex Salmond?
Do you seriously believe that AFI MSPs will be in any position to hold this corrupt criminal cable to the fire?
AFI MSPs would be in a much stronger position if there is no overall unionist majority or even a unionist coalition, but the corrupt SNP is out of power.
The SNP MSPs would then find themselves in the awkward position of siding with you or siding with the unionists.
@crazycat 9
PS
I should, of course, have written ‘Toyah Wilcox plays a mental punk…’
Just wanted to correct that at the earliest opportunity.
@crazycat says: 13 March, 2021 at 10:49 pm @ Ian Brotherhood at 10.15 and Al at 10.24
“In the late 1980s I went to see a film called The Love Child, starring Sheila Hancock and Peter Capaldi. It was set in London, and featured a group of police officers who beat up youths they didn’t like the look of and then adorned their unconscious (or possibly dead, it wasn’t clear) bodies with stickers declaring “Congratulations! You’ve met the Met”.”
“The Love Child” was a black comedy – the bit with the stickers is taken from the claims that people beaten up by the Inter City Firm of soccer thugs had such stickers put on them.
A similar story is also told about the National Front, Militant, Class War, the BNP and any other favourite tabloid pantomime contemporary baddie of any given period you can think of – doubtless if the story did the rounds today, the perpetrators would be TERFs, transphobes, BLM and XR activists, Corbynistas and anyone who disagrees with Meghan Markle.
“If the pro indy parties in your region don’t stand on a plebiscite manifesto, will you refuse to give them your list vote?”
Yes.
“Who will you then give your list vote to?”
I will write “NONE” across all the names and will trace a fat line across all the sections were you can tick your choice.
Graeme Hampton – ‘In a further twist I don’t see any harm in Angus being elected in future. He is a capable media friendly performer. I just don’t want him leading the party or having too great an influence on strategy’
You are clearly in the dark re the AS stitch up.
Some research will help you.
Angus + wife would be 10 x worse than the current alleged ‘lavender couple’.
Ian Brotherhood says:
Toyah Wilcox- met her around 1979, she was a really nice, down to earth person but then again I was a hormonal teenager.
Craig Murray says,
“Kcor
Have been very tempted!
But I don’t think he’ll win anyway, much of the constituency has been hollowed out by airbnb, and the good people of Dumbiedykes know very well what the Macbeth family did. Folk are not as stupid as they think. They can’t rig the election like they can the candidate selections.”
Thank you for responding.
But please, please rethink.
The SNP leadership has got away with the crime to jail Alex Salmond on fake charges. They have become completely above the law in Scotland. They tried to jail you and Mark Hirst.
If a high profile candidate like you were to stand directly against them, just think of the exposure it would get.
You of course know better of the situation in the constituency, but if you think you have a chance of winning, please please stand.
These corrupt criminals must not be allowed to get away with it.
They, should be in jail, not you.
Ian Brotherhood at 10.49
Toyah also played Lala in the Teletubbies
Having met – and blethered with – both Tommy Sheridan and Craig Murray, using the “Good Guy”/ “Wank” categorisation, even although I do not concur with their overall political ideologies, I believe that both of them have Scottish Independence front and foremost.
Therefore, until they demonstrate otherwise, I see them as “Good Guys”.
I’ve commented infrequently here before. I’m using my name here now because I’ve used it on WGD to like his blog posts. If I could like posts here I’d have done so hundreds of times over the last 7 years. It is possible to be in both camps.
I found indy by finding my namesake as Logic’s Rock in the run up to the 2014 referendum. On his site he showed the posters from the 79 referendum, and the broken promises I vaguely remembered as a boy growing up. I was instantly converted.
I wish the WBB had got out into Scotland sooner and in larger numbers, and that is acknowledging the herculean effort put in to get it out when it did. It made a huge difference, and should be required reading for every resident of Scotland, as far as I am concerned. I wish every billboard in Scotland showed broken unionist promises from 79 and now 14 all across Scotland.
But today that is sadly irrelevant, because the SNP as the political representation of the independence movement in Scotland as represented by the voting public, which I have watched from afar in the USA, a country that has its own existential crises to face, appears to have not only shot itself in the foot, it has then decided the foot wasn’t worth that much and instead of trying to save it, has amputated the foot instead, because that will help it sprint better.
What the verifiable fuck?
I have no dog in this fight, living abroad as I do, and with no vote available to me in Scotland, (my last legal vote before being timed out due to residency rules was in the Brexit referendum. I was not permitted to vote in the indyref as an expat) I can only watch in horror as a movement I believed in dies on its remaining foot.
Independence has lost its way, and lost its voice. The clarity I felt when I saw those posters promising jobs at Linwood, at Ravenscraig, in the collieries, promises I bitterly knew were betrayed within the next deacade if not the next five years, has been lost, muddlied and trampled upon by one footed idiots.
I don’t pretend to know what will happen next or how to go forward, but independence must keep going, with or without the SNP. The shitty fact is that if the SNP are beaten, or worse still, crushed at the next election, then the political drive for independence will be stymied for years, how many I can’t guess. If they do somehow get a majority then any inaction on their part will lead Independence back to being stymied as if they’d lost. And I don’t have much faith that the SNP will do much with another mandate anymore. I want to be surprised, but I suspect we are years behind where we should be now, come what may.
Long post to say I’m depressed by this turn of events. Depressed to see divide and rule, the oldest trick in the book, apparently working. Depressed to see independence supporters sniping at each other, depresssed to see the SNP lose sight of its core mission, depressed to see unionists happy and encouraging the independence movement to splinter, independence voters to not vote, or even vote for parties who have never had independence as their guiding light. That has to be insanity, and spoiling your ballot is an abdication of responsibility – it is letting others dictate your fate. I understand the impulse, and I’m not saying wheesht for indy, Christ I really don’t know what to do – which I think has been the point of recent events – to confuse independence supporters into inaction, unable to trust anything anymore.
So I implore all of you here to think carefully about what you want to happen in Scotland over the next five years, and vote accordingly. Yes this is like QE2 reminding folk to think before the brexit vote, but I really mean it – you who have a vote in Scotland need to weigh it carefully, and vote the best way you think for independence. Think, and vote. The choices are sadly limited, but don’t waste what rights you still have while you have them.
@ Mark Boyle at 11.19
Thank you; I was going to say more about the film, including that it was dark humour, but decided my post was long enough without that. I didn’t know about the inspiration for the stickers, though.
@ Ian B at 11.08
I never saw Jubilee, but I did watch another Willcox/Jarman collaboration – The Tempest – which was, not surprisingly, also pretty weird.
@ TheSNPLeftMe at 10:50 pm
I’d say that is a little harsh, if technically true, as I understand it Solidarity are proposing the plebiscite election, who are under the umbrella with others within AFI.
The question is why can’t / won’t ISP work with AFI quickly to resolve their differences and allow this whole 2nd vote strategy to have far more chance of success?
Simple uniform campaign messaging, pooled votes so less wastage.
I’ve got dozens of non political anorak contacts waiting for info on how best to cast their votes. Many using postal ballots which will be arriving in a few weeks.
Mia says:
13 March, 2021 at 11:21 pm
“If the pro indy parties in your region don’t stand on a plebiscite manifesto, will you refuse to give them your list vote?”
Yes.
“Who will you then give your list vote to?”
I will write “NONE” across all the names and will trace a fat line across all the sections were you can tick your choice.
Then either you have completely lost it.
Or you a Sturgeonist trying your best to minimise the pro indy list vote.
If there is one thing most genuine independence supporters agree on, it is to give the list vote to genuine pro indy parties.
You are deliberately trying to sabotage that.
You know perfectly well that the pro indy list parties will not get anywhere near 50% of the vote. Including or excluding plebiscite in their manifestos is completely irrelevant.
@ Zander Tait 11.06
That AFI press release has been out since early afternoon. I picked it up from Mark Hirst’s twitter long before Tommy Sheridan’s post.
i.e. the news was first released by AFI not Tommy and had been in the public domain for hours. You seem to have some vendetta against him based on that comment.
Stuart, If we don’t get the SNP a super majority, England won’t be a place to escape to.
https://s3-eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/lawcom-prod-storage-11jsxou24uy7q/uploads/2020/10/Hate-crime-final-report.pdf
Zander Tait tommy was quoting from a pn AFI press release so if you have a problem take it up with AFI.
Zander Tait says,
“Too bad that CM was not allowed the largesse and the respect to release the news for himself.
Just Tommy being Tommy, I guess.”
To be fair, Tommy stated that nominations had been “received”:
“It was confirmed that over 40 nominations for candidates all across Scotland have been received with more meetings to be held on Monday before Tuesday’s deadline to receive nominations from all 8 of AFI’s regional branches. The nominations to date include former SNP MSPs Dave Thompson (2007-2016) and John Wilson (2007-2016), prolific Indy blogger and historian Craig Murray, Peoples Section 30 Challenge and Forward As One organiser Martin Keatings, award winning journalist Mark Hirst and former MEP and SNP approved candidate Hugh Kerr.”
People have differing opinions of Tommy, but IMHO, he is a proven genuine independence supporter and a great campaigner and orator as was seen during the 2014 campaign.
I dearly wish he would take up the challenge to stand against Sturgeon in her constituency.
ScottieDog says,
“Plan B should no longer include the SNP.”
Exactly.
Paul C/Mist001/Roger/Red: the pseudo ‘wokerati’ are following a script: that of gender identity and queer theory. These are not half-baked ideas spewed out by students. On the contrary, they set out, step-by-step, how the ideology, fronted by the trans issue, will play out in every country in Europe and the West. That is the template. Denton’s, international lawyers, wrote the screenplay whereby you do not engage, you accuse everyone who questions you of being a bigot, you refuse to acknowledge documentation, you denounce fact as fantasy… and so on. The three elements make up the bigger picture which is to be absolute freedom from prohibitive laws and absolute free expression of self – a new morality unconstrained by societal norms.
This is not supposition. This was born in the American universities, and you don’t have to be Brain of Britain to follow the template. You just have to join the dots, and that is what the SNPG has done. Gender politics and queer theory came first, not the politicians. The politicians were captured by it. They are politicians and they see that the young, middle-class, educated elites – the future – follow this stuff. It is not just in Scotland.
It is in every country in the West, more so in some than others, but infiltrating everywhere. Every country’s young people are being seduced into accepting this stuff. It has an agenda if you follow the thread back, and the agenda is necessarily multi-layered. I do not claim that it is a conspiracy. It’s not; it’s a coming together of several parallel ideologies at the same time.
I do claim that its agenda is to soften up Western society for the new wave of capitalism that is going to come, that those who enable it, such as Stonewall, are interested in self-perpetuation and funding as much as pushing the trans agenda, just as the politicians are wedded to their own preservation and comfy salaries and pensions, but following the money takes you, ultimately, to corporate America, and it is no coincidence that every country’s experience of pseudo ‘woke’ is, basically, the same. This is not just a Scottish problem. Ireland, for example, is already much further down this road than we are.
@Dave Llewellyn (11.26) –
‘Lala’ was Toyah Wilcox?
I’m assuming that was just voice-work, right? She wasn’t actually cutting about inside a gigantic blobby suit?
maxxmacc @ 10:26
I’m afraid well written pish is still pish.
If Sturgeon was the grand strategist you suggest, how do you explain the nervous twitching and blinking?
More importantly, how do you explain the utter mess she made of the Salmond stitch-up?
It’s not like she got away with it or talked her way out of it; she basically had to corrupt the whole establishment to cover it up. It’s far from over and I’d guess about 40% of the population have their suspicions.
As for your imagined game of Monopoly, if I came back after a couple of hours and found her winning as you describe, I’d simply assume she’d been cheating.
Even if you take the Salmond stuff out of the equation, she’s been a complete failure as leader. On Brexit, Indyref2, Coronavirus, OBFA, Education, land reform, poverty, child poverty, drug addiction, etc., etc., etc. Flop after flop.
She had an extended honeymoon period starting with the post 2014 surge through Brexit and into the pandemic – no acumen involved, just being in the right place at the right time – and now she is unravelling as anyone might have predicted.
Anonymoose says:
13 March, 2021 at 5:02 pm
IMO We have three possible outcomes from this election regarding the NewSNP:
One other possible outcome is that the SNP win a majority, confounding the entryists who will have failed in their mission to make the party unelectable and allow the unionists back into power. Then, with a nominally pro-indy majority, the new indy parties can develop properly while the SNP conducts a brief but bloody civil war which will see the ordinary members oust the cabal, Sturgeon steps down and the party is reclaimed by the pro-indy massive, just in time for an early referendum.
In any scenario, I don’t see Sturgeon remaining as SNP leader for long after 6th May. It’s because of her inaction on this that new pro-indy parties are rising, the Yes Movement is distancing itself from the politicians, groups like the National Yes Network and Now Scotland are forming themselves into a pro-indy force that is lacking in the SNP, and she knows we are running out of patience.
I see an SNP majority simply as a means to keep the unionist parties from seizing control, buying us time to deal with the SNP then press on with the cause with AFI and ISP keeping them on track.
I can’t and won’t vote SNP in this election. To see what happened to Alex Salmond, what they tried to do to him, breaks my heart. And as for all those other SNP politicians who have not spoken out, hell mend the lot of you. You all know full well that Alex Salmond was set up. You know that, yet you stay silent. You’ve tried to wipe him from history, and for that, I’ll never forgive you. Nicola knows full well that Alex wasn’t what they made him out to be. You all know.
– well written, eloquent and tightly argued post from Lorna Campbell (as is commmon); I will add some more things, but much more bluntly –
The nonsense ideas of today got laid down more than 40 years ago, it all has deep roots, which makes it hard to fight.
The “POPE OF WOKE”, Mickey Fuckall (did I spell it rite?) has been revealed as a nonce (on french twitter); he went over to Tunisia to bum little kids. Looked like a nonce and was a nonce. Imagine. His big idea was
“the revolution has failed so let’s try screwing”.
“sexual liberation” was a juggernaut that a lot of people jumped on because they got something out of it, but is now out of control; the current agenda item is trannies, but the next thing will be bestiality or paedophiles. Kid fucking is a definite place they want to go; they have tried all this before, in the 70s, but it never took.
– this all gets such support, and free reign on social media as elites are naturally sexually jaded and “libertines” – it’s more about imagination and opportunity for them – they want to just do what they want, in public, and not have to mess about on Epstein Island, Elm Street Guest House, Haute de la Garenne, or have anything to do with “Taken”-style criminality. If you want to go back even further you end up with the Marquis de Sade.
SEXUAL POLITICS/GENDER THEORY/QUEER THEORY, all gets wrapped up with many other fashionable topics as “identity politics” and which does not (beyond lip service) include any class analysis, therefore it does not touch on economics; the flow of money is to be left alone. This makes it extremely popular among elites as a manipulator of the general public – it portrays itself as “the left” but it is a fake, an utter FALSE-LEFT. They continue to rob us, and if we complain – point us to the nearest gay disco.
ID politics = “the leftwing of neoliberalism” – note also : identity politics hates nationalism (“fascism”) and democracy(“populism”)
As a mere aggregate of bad ideas, this would be bad enough; but it has the further quality of a new and fanatically intolerant religion : let’s call it WOKE-IANITY. There are many toxic strands in play – new puritanism, witch-hunts, self denunciation, soviet union, the cultural revolution, huxley, orwell – all being used to absolutely bash the ordinary citizen who does not know what is going on, and cannot understand why he cannot state simple biological facts.
– our FM looks like a “true believer” in all of this, which makes the indy movement a bit … “fucked”, as it were. Or maybe she is just doing it for the money – a nice fat job with a “foundation” when she leaves office.
Just finished The Terror… best thing I’ve watched in ages.
impostors.
Ian Brotherhood. Toyah has her own YouTube channel along with hubby Robert Fripp. Enjoy.
Nicola Sturgeon is a functionary for the Green New Deal agenda. These covid lockdowns are going to be morphed into climate lockdowns to ” save the environment”. There’s an economic reset happening. A shakedown of small business owners by bigger businesses.
An economy cannot survive this treatment. More and more people goods and resources are falling into the hands of fewer.
Sustainable development does not specify precisely which jobs will replace those jobs that will be terminated because they have too high a carbon footprint. Also its about the billionaire class, Gates et Al, owning and controlling everything and everyone. Gates seems to have bribed a lot of people and organisations in order to achieve so much power and influence.
Does anyone realise the track record of Gates Polio ” vaccine ” in India? He’s a dirty corrupt bastard.
You should read the Sustainable Development document online. Frightening unless you fancy a Soviet lifestyle.
@ Tommy Sheridan 6.50pm you said
———————————-
AFI would have preferred the election in 7 weeks time was promoted loud and clear as an independence plebiscite election with a subsequent majority empowering a Holyrood independence majority to begin separation negotiations and seek international recognition for the once again independent nation of Scotland. However SNP leaders lack of courage, vision and intent means that hope will be dashed.
————————————–
That’s fair enough Tommy but how does SNP cowardice mean that AFI cannot include a plebiscite election as an ongoing condition for their involvement in ANY forthcoming elections , if AFI and ISP win a number of seats at HR and they have a plebiscite in their manifesto they can then embarrass the SNP’s failure to do so ,IMO I agree with Mia and Daisy Walker ALL elections now and in the future should be plebiscite elections
@Lorna Campbell and @Confused
I agree – and we must all know that none of it is in anyway compatible with democracy or true Indy. They see the bulk of the people as dangerous racist/sexist/homophobe/transphobe haters/reactionaries. They don’t trust the people and are essentially anti-democratic. Oh they don’t mind letting people vote – so long as they get to choose who the candidates are.
One of the first things they’ll want to after the election is change the rules so independents can’t stand for the List vote. Mark my words. It would take a 2/3 majority in Holyrood, but Starmer’s ‘Labour’ will support them (I suspect). Something strange is going on in the world today.
Pixywine says:
13 March, 2021 at 9:57 pm
How did Alexander untie the Gordian knot?
There are different accounts, but one story says he simply slashed through it with his sword.
Lochside says:
13 March, 2021 at 7:13 pm
…Learn from the wokes..collaborate, then terminate.
As the seconds tick away in the last stroke before midnight, I will agree with your strategy Lochside. But while there remains even the slightest chance of Sturgeon being ousted in disgrace before the Election, then that remains the best possible option.
Test the gutless wretches in the SNP whether they adore Sturgeon more than having their snout the expenses trough, and the only way of doing that is convincing them they are courting electoral disaster playing ‘Chicken’ with an angry core vote.
Sturgeon yet needs to survive both the Fabiani and Hamilton Inquiries, and the possibility, (though he’s too magnanimous to do it), of Alex Salmond forcing Criminal Proceedings against her rotten cleek. Here’s hoping she doesn’t and he does.
However I disagree that this Election is Scotland’s Armageddon or the end of Independence. Whatever the result, WHATEVER the result, Scotland will endure.
Holyrood has made it’s choice and sold it’s soul to Westminster, and sold out Scotland’s sovereign constitution. Holyrood thus represents a beachhead of Westminster’s Colonial encroachment into Scotland, and thus, ridding Scotland of Westminster rule means ridding Scotland of Holyrood’s rule.
I see Scottish Independence as a test of faith in Scotland’s Sovereign Constitution, the unalterable Constitution which defined our Nation. Sovereignty is ours. Nobody can take it away. That is the eternal bedrock of Scotland, and everything else is transient.
When the Pope recognised the Nation of Scotland and popular sovereignty of the people in 1328, a thing was done that cannot be undone. That is the key to Scotland’s emancipation and freedom from the tyranny of this Union and / or some shitty rotten Government selling Scotland down the river.
The Declaration of Arbroath was literally written to protect Scotland from both Colonial Invasion AND the t(reacherous) betrayal of our own Leadership. Our ticket to exit the UK, unseat the rogues in power, and reclaim our place in the world as a sovereign Nation is right there in front of us, and it always has been.
Scotland doesn’t know itself. Our power lies within. Scotland is merely a prisoner of it’s own delusion. It is our awakening which will deliver us. Our faith in Holyrood is actual proof that we are still asleep.
Holyrood broke it’s faith with the sovereignty of the people, thus Holyrood confirmed itself as a puppet government masquerading as our own, and truly unworthy of being Scotland’s seat of government. Take a step back to take in the bigger picture, and it actually makes no difference whether Westminster’s colonial outpost in Holyrood is run by the Red administration, the blue one, or the yellow. The puppets inside answer to Westminster and dance to their tune, not the Sovereign Scottish People. “Our” First Minister is no more than “their” head Gauleiter.
In the aftermath of Bannockburn, King Robert laid waste to Stirling Castle so the Colonial Invaders were denied a strongpoint from which to exercise their control over Scotland. I look forward to Holyrood, guilty of the same deceit, meeting the same fate. I literally mean it. Personally, I would merrily bulldoze the ugly catastrophe into the ground and replace it with a building of presence and appropriate stature, or better yet, no building at all, to teach our Lords and Ministers humility.
See that lump in the ground? That’s all that remains of the 2nd Century AD Romans attempt to impose their might on Scotland. See that other lump in the ground with all that concrete? That was Westminster’s 20th Century effort.
It’s a small distraction but I can hardly watch the Fabiani Inquiry without wondering wtf is going on with the walls and ceilings behind. Call that an interior??? It looks as though it was built from IKEA spare parts and No More Nails. Just because you can do something, doesn’t mean you should.
As a second tangent, I raise a glass to Chris Cairns for his expertise in representing a Holyrood Parliament Building that is recognisable in caricature. Well done sir. You are a master in your trade.
so that brings the next question.
Is the hate crime bill specifically engineered to be divisory rather than being something they believe in?
ie …if it were to wait till after the election, it wouldn’t be fulfilling its actual purpose.
Why push this Hate Crime Bill through 8 weeks before the election? I suspect it was so they could dragoon their own MSPs to vote for it with the threat of expulsion hanging over their heads. If they had delayed the Bill until after the election some of the MSPs might have felt secure enough with 5 years tenure ahead to defy Sturgeon. As it is there simply isn’t enough time to put together a campaign as an Independent. (Alex Salmond is probably the one exception)
With both the Hamilton and Fabiani’s Inquiries not likely to report before Holyrood is prorogued, I believe it is imperative that the election be deferred until later this year to allow them to report and Parliament to act on them. Unfortunately this is the very reason that Sturgeon is desperate for that election to happen in May in the expectation that re-elected with a majority and the support of the Wokerati candidates she’s foisted on the voters she can ignore the report findings.
Yip. The simple truth appears to be that the SNP are pretty damn comfortable with the status quo. They get to maraud around Scotland doing whatever they want, all our institutions having been captured. And they get to blame Westminster for everything they fuck up.
All that’s left is to convince the Davos crowd that Sturgeon should be awarded a top job at the UN when she gets board of playing with Scotland; that’s why were seeing people like Devi Sridhar arriving on the scene and making up rules unchecked.
But they’ve underestimated the Scottish electorate.
We’ve reached and been through peak-SNP now, thank goodness. They will get a shock in May.
Anyone who recognises what the SNP has become yet still pushes simple logic and reason aside to endorse them at the ballot box has probably been brainwashed.
Sometimes you need to take a step back in order to take two steps forward.
The most important thing for the cause of Scottish independence is now to force deep change within the SNP, or replace it with another vehicle for Yes.p
wull says:
13 March, 2021 at 5:48 pm
Just in case anybody can be bothered to read it, my apologies for all the typos in that last post. It might be comprehensible (but not necessarily sensible) all the same.
Excellent post Wull.
Events involving London’s finest fascist bully boys last night, made it all click into place.
The reason the Scotgov is pushing these draconian and UNWANTED measures through in such a rush, is EXACTLY because they know right now their can be no demonstrations, their can be no marches, due to covid.
That is the sleekit nature of the current Scottish government. It tells us all we need to know about Nicola Sturgeon and her coven. Their are soo many pressing problems for them to attend to in Scotland, but they choose the anti-science, anti-Women, Anti-gay, GRA instead. Dogma, rather than reason, ideology before common sense.
An epic fail by the SNP.
I have had a lot of time to reflect on Sturgeon’s show at the enquiry.
I was spitting blood watching her lie her way through it. I texted my brother, who knows very little about what is going on in the SNP. He had said she was blowing them away! But he wasn’t watching it, he was getting sound bites from the Sturgeon nodding dogs.
Even in the heat of my white rage. I told him I was done with the SNP , but would still have to vote SNP 1 and then for someone else on the list.
I am as mad as anyone else. But Scotland comes first. Letting any British parties get seats, is not going to help Scotland. It’s simply wrong to help any unionist.
That’s why I will never vote to allow those bastards any leverage in my country. I want them out of my country. They have no interest in Scotland , and no place in our parliament.
twathater
There must be something about the P-word that makes political parties nervous. Is it too radical a step which might alienate potential voters or does it somehow paint the party into a corner and would be used as a weapon against them – charges of sedition, for example?
If Craig had actually participated in any form of crime,
why would our fake justice system not have declared
it weeks ago?
This delay is yet again obviously political and bares no
Relationship with something other countries define as justice.
London women on Clapham Common-
When confronted by the fascist force, Why didn’t they just say
they were Rangers fans?
They could demand the same rights to break all Covid restrictions,
drink in public, smash benches, set off incendiary devices, etc.
Just wears the club colours and the world is their Oyster Card.
Can a ‘biggish Indy name’ not be found to stand against Sturgeon in the May 6th elections?
If she loses her seat and is not number one on the list, that could be a neat way to clear the roadblock.
Big Jock says : I want them out so I am going to vote for them…….
Pipi….Brits out. I want Sturgeon out , but after independence.
This site is operating as a life-support system for near despairing Independence supporters at the moment , struggling for breath in the suffocating fog of lies , boundless deception and bad faith ,
a shaft of light in gathering darkness .
Excellent post and commentary as per .
From this thread Lochside’s post above is where I’m at voting intention- wise .
We just can’t allow the Unionists to emerge victorious from all this havoc , rage and bitter division Sturgeon el al have wreaked upon our Movement .
If necessary wear a gas-mask , frogman suit , full-body armour , whatever, shower in disinfectant before ( and crucially after ) voting for the bastards , but vote we must , if we think our task – Independence , is daunting now , it will be doubly so if Unionists take Holyrood , be in no doubt about that compadres .
Paradoxically , our election slogan should be ” Vote Them In To Boot ” Them ” Out “
Sturgeon and her cowards will never lead Scotland to indipendence, people no longer trust her to run a government never mind negotiations with the remaining nations were a yes vote ever achieved. I am deeply suspicious about the “I am still voting SNP No1” brigade.
I see one of the people accused against Joanna Cherry pleaded guilty in court. Apparently HE is/was? a member of the SNP at the time.
Which SNP branch? couldn’t be in the stirling area could it??
Joanna has handled this well and has highlighted the utterly intolerable verbal abuse (perpetrated by certain ‘men’) that is directed at some women within the SNP. What has the SNP leader said about it??
https://twitter.com/joannaccherry/status/1370436720739647488
The theory that the SNP leadership – which is increasingly distinct from the SNP as a party – is deliberately sabotaging its ability to deliver a free and fair referendum and/or independence assumes a level of strategic thinking that is entirely absent. The reason it looks like connections are not being made between cause and effect is that connections between cause and effect are not being made.
It is not the behaviour itself that must be explained, but the explanation for the behaviour. When we see the SNP leadership behaving in ways that cannot do other than adversely affect its electoral fortunes and doing so immediately prior to an election of historic significance, this can only be explained by a near-total absence of strategic thinking. No dots were joined in the making of this plan.
It is this dearth of strategic thinking that must be explained. Especially given that we are talking about a political party which has enjoyed near-miraculous electoral success over a quite miraculously long period. How the fuck did they do that without some weapons-grade strategic thinking in their armory? And given that they must have had this weapons-grade strategic thinking, where the fuck has it gone?
One possibility is that they never actually had it. That they just got lucky. Very lucky. Improbably lucky. But not impossibly lucky. It is conceivable that fortune might have contrived to favour the SNP. It’s possible they just hit a winning streak. It could happen. Lots of seemingly disparate things could have come together to bring electoral success that was quite unplanned. Think of that 2011 election landslide that led to the 2014 referendum. An astounding victory. But not part of any plan. The SNP was not ready for a referendum. The party was bounced into it by events outwith its control. It was fortunate to have a leader at the time who was clever enough and politically agile enough to take advantage of the situation. Might that be considered an element of the party’s good fortune?
It seems likely to be a bit of both. There was a lot of luck involved. But ten years ago the SNP was a very healthy party. Very democratic. Good (not great) internal communication. Effective structures. Clever people united for a common purpose. People who talked to each other. Little in the way of factionalism. and a huge army of campaign foot-soldiers ready to do the slog work. In other words, the party was in an excellent position to take advantage of any good fortune that came its way.
In particular, the SNP was uniquely advantaged by devolution and proportional representation. Because it was not bound to an ideology it could respond quickly and cleverly to the signals sent out by the electorate. It could adapt to the will of the people. Or, at least, the SNP could do so better than other parties. And that was enough.
From all of this we get outcomes which look like the result of superb strategic planning even if in reality there was very little. Very little was good enough because luck was making up for any lack. Moderate competence was complemented by happy coincidence.
No longer! Both competence and good fortune have left the building. The mistakes that are being made are worse than the mistakes that used to be made and the luck that cushioned the party from the electoral consequences of bad decisions has departed. When I say luck I mean the factors that happened to be advantageous even though there was no intent. The SNP was not purposefully designed to take advantage of devolution. Things just came together. The factors that allowed the 2015 landslide were not contrived by the party. Member activists – supplemented by the Yes movement – worked for that victory, to be sure. But that effort was rewarded much more handsomely than even the huge amount of work warranted.
It all comes down to Nicola Sturgeon. Where Alex Salmond was flexible and agile enough to stay on his feet no matter how wild the ride, Sturgeon wants to maintain her chosen course no matter what. If the ride is wild and knocks her off her feet from time to time this doesn’t matter so long as she’s still standing when the music stops. And she is convinced she will be standing no matter what.
Strategic thinking doesn’t thrive in the conditions created by Sturgeon’s approach to leadership. Where Salmond’s style of leadership was often to say you go ahead and I’ll take my cue from that; Sturgeon says I’m going this way and you damned well better be right behind me. Salmond’s way can look like strategic planning if luck lends a hand. There are no circumstances in which Sturgeon’s brand of leadership can have any of the characteristics of strategic thinking.
There are still people at all levels in the SNP who are very capable of strategic thinking. But they cannot have effect. Either they are ‘dissuaded’ from contributing their ideas or their ideas are ignored. What was once connected is now compartmentalised. What was once flexible is now rigid. Where once there was circulation now there is stagnation.
What once looked like strategic planning for success now looks like the strategic planning of a kamikaze pilot.
By their silence all but a few MP/MSPs have endorsed the SG policy of destroying independence and the aspirations of its people. So why did they stand for the SNP in elections?
It is now evident it was not to pursue independece but rather it was the pursuit of money and a fat pension. They disgust me.
Pipi – What’s your alternative. Rage never won a war. It usually leads to bad decisions and slaughter.
The alternative is electing Tories and Labour Brits. I tell you this. If the SNP end up with a minority. They will get propped up by the Greens. It will be business as usual. So what is your endgame.
Meantime Ross and Sarwar will be gloating that Scotland said no again. Your joy at upsetting the SNP will last a few days, then be followed by 5 years of regret.
StuartM @ 4:53am
Excellent point, which raises the question as to whether Westminster can (or indeed should) impose a deferral until such time as any or all criminality has been exposed and, if not, what that implies for the S30 gold standard.
@ Pipinghot.
Geez peace you will ye?
You must think folk on here are buttoned up the back.
Im voting first and foremost to further the cause of independence , and secondly to keep those labour party barstewards out.
Every election , and there will be twists and turns along the way , highs and lows , the british will be fighting against scottish independence till one day….it happens.
pipinghot says:
14 March, 2021 at 8:13 am
” I am deeply suspicious about the “I am still voting SNP No1” brigade. ”
Be as suspicious as you like but I only ask …..is Independence more imaginable under the current ( transient ) admittedly fckn awful SNPG or a Unionist controlled Holyrood . A plausible answer would be perhaps ” not imaginable under either scenario ” , fair enough , for me though , the latter scenario is the worse-case possible , as it takes the issue completely out our hands and into those of our declared enemies .
Holyrood may ( I believe will ) become redundant to our goal irrespective of who wins it , extra-parliamentary action will be required , but losing it to Unionists at this time will not help in any way
Thomas. Exactly. Country first, always!
We choose the least worst scenario. SNP majority.
@BigJock
Or in your case it isn’t country first or even party first but Nicola Sturgeon, Peter Murrell and their band of criminals first and to hell with the consequences.
If you think you will get rid of Sturgeon if you re-elect her… well actually you know you won’t because you’re team Sturgeon.
From twitter,
`Dr Jordan B Peterson
@jordanbpeterson
3h
God help us all. Not Scotland….`
when hearing about Humza Yousaf`s HCB,
Jordan is a Canadian clinical psychologist who has been battling against trans activist and woke ideology for a long time.He is not a transphobe, he is a great believer in science and fact.
he has 1.7 million followers on twitter,
much vilified by corrupted MSM.
Five years of Unionist in power at Holyrood could be just what is needed to get the YES vote up to 80%
Unionists in power at Holyrood = No IndyRef2
SNP in power at Holyrood = No IndyRef2
Whoever is in power at Holyrood will have to deal with the post Brexit/post Covid economy and all the problems that will bring.
Big Jock
“We choose the least worst scenario”
Hanging or firing squad.
Not much of a choice.
Ask yourself which outcome makes IndyRef2 in 2026/27 more likely?
SNP in power at Holyrood = huge decrease in the YES vote
Unionists in power at Holyrood = huge increase in the YES. vote.
Five year plan
Get rid of the SNP
Increase YES vote
Be patient
FFS Sturgeon is going to get re-elected anyway. The SNP will still be the biggest party.
The idea that the Yoons could form a government is just nonsense right now. But why would we do that.
It’s like cutting off both legs to even things up.
Ruby – You don’t know that. It’s a hell of a gamble.
Giving the SNP a majority will secure the SNP’s future and nobody elses.
Voting for them with the HOPE that they’ll be nice..? What kind of strategy is that?
With a majority they’ll continue to stop members from commenting on their deeds. They’ll continue to rig NEC elections to suit themselves. They’ll continue to hamstring members questions at conferences (that’s if we GET a conference) and they’ll continue to cover up all the corruption with more corruption. Worse than that, WM will assist them in crushing any protests/demonstrations against the Scots government – because they know that it’s safer for the Union to keep the SNP in power.
I can’t see any positives in voting them in for a majority. Look at the Tories with their majority. Our protests ping off them like popcorn bullets as they gaily skip along causing crisis after crisis.
Ditch the SNP. Strip them back to the wood. If the Unionist parties form a coalition then at least we can unite in fighting against them for independence again.
Big Jock says:
14 March, 2021 at 8:56 am
Ruby – You don’t know that. It’s a hell of a gamble.
Reply
Does anyone know anything for sure?
Well if we give the SNP a bloody nose and a minority. Just be aware that independence will be off the table for 10 years, that is a definite.
Alternatively the majority provides the mandate to the people. It’s up to us to make sure it happens this time. The SNP can’t hide behind Covid, even if they try that.
I fail to see that an SNP majority in Holyrood is the least worst scenario especially if you are a woman.
Good piece by Peter bell. I hope he’s right in a sense and this is purely down to lack of thinking and obsessive autocratic leadership.
It’s funny, a few years ago I’d have had it the other way round – where salmond was much more autocratic and Sturgeon less so, but I didn’t know either person.
https://peterabell.scot/2021/03/14/kamikaze-strategy/
The best leaders I have worked under make you feel like you’re making the decisions – even though you’re not. They delegate, they include you in their thinking and they don’t ask leading or YES/NO questions. There’s a time to be autocratic and they know when that time is.
I’ve seen it go both ways for people new to leadership. I’ve been there myself. In the initial stages EVERYONE has a degree of imposter syndrome – I’d be very worried about those who don’t! As a result there are those who attempt to control everything (NS) and those who try to empower those around them. Although the latter can be taken advantage of, the former is the road to ruin.
@Peter A Bell says:
Don’t you think that cutting and pasting your own article from your own website onto this one’s comments was a wee bit rude?
It’s nice getting links to what other people have to say, so long as they give a brief overview first, but hijacking someone else’s comments page for guerilla marketing isn’t edifying. There’s too many using the WoS comments for that as it is already.
Big Jock @ 9.06am:
Well if we give the SNP a bloody nose and a minority. Just be aware that independence will be off the table for 10 years, that is a definite.
Independence will be off the table for 10 years WITH the SNP in power! We have absolutely NO guarantee that the SNP will progress to independence and loads of evidence that they won’t.
The Scottish Greens have now officially been renamed the “Scottish Queens”.
@Peter A Bell,
I agree Peter. They clearly don’t know how to force the issue on Independence or develop an alternative winning strategy.
Everything relies on a Tory Prime Minister conceding a referendum for no clear reason other than “Democracy”.
This position is untenable. Add to the mix the calibre of politician being promoted internally to senior positions because they are compliant and obedient team players it is a recipe for stagnation and inaction
Big Jock says:
14 March, 2021 at 9:06 am
Alternatively the majority provides the mandate to the people. It’s up to us to make sure it happens this time
Reply
What plans do you have to make sure it happens this time?
What plans do you have to make sure we win this time?
Graeme Hampton says:
13 March, 2021 at 8:20 pm
I don’t see any harm in Angus being elected in future. He is a capable media friendly performer. I just don’t want him leading the party or having too great an influence on strategy.
————
You can’t be serious! Angus Robertson & his wife are two of a Kind.
Are you aware that Angus Robertson helped to stitch Alex Salmond up? The last person who should get voted into Holyrood is Angus Robertson. He is bad news.
Mighty S . I think indi is off the table for that time too, what concerns me most is the further damage to Scotland by a re elected Sturgeon. Think back peeps to what they have done before placing your X
@MightyS:
Agreed. The increasingly Bialystock and Bloom behaviour of Sturgeon and co does indicate doing their best to ensure they don’t get a majority so they have to be reliant on a third SIZEABLE coalition partner such as Wee Willie’s Flip Flops, meaning they get to stay in power but down have to deliver on pushing the IndyRev2 promise.
They’re long overdue a “be careful what you wish for, you might just get it” moment.
Brian Doonthetoon 4:27 pm
“Well, it looks like we’ll have to vote SNP for the constituency and anyone but the SNP for the region”.
What the fuck is this “we’ll”.
Have you been on that Dundee hooch again Mr Toon???
DON’T VOTE SNP 1
DON’T VOTE SNP 2
DON’T VOTE SNP EVER!!!
Glasgow racer says:
14 March, 2021 at 9:28 am
DON’T VOTE SNP 1
DON’T VOTE SNP 2
DON’T VOTE SNP EVER!!!
Reply
Who should we vote for IYHO?
Lots of theories Flying around. Even more accusations about the motives of every poster.
One thing I am certain about. I will never vote for a Unionist Party.
When Sturgeon falls, and she will fall, the Party will turn on her clique. It will be of little benefit to purge the leadership and still have 5 years of a Unionist run Holyrood.
We have posters saying burn it down and start again.
The next claim is that the new parties have no traction.
Any organisation can be turned around by changing the Managing Director. It doesn’t need the sacking of all staff. The Leader creates the culture and direction.
The SNP wider membership are just as motivated towards Independence as anyone on Wings. I couldn’t stay in the Party but that doesn’t mean that those who do stay are any less committed to Independence or that they are gullible fools.
Those who vote SNP, AFI, ISP, Green are not the problem. They are supporters of Scotland.
The leadership of the SNP. The leadership of the Greens ARE the problem.
Vote as your own logic dictates but stop blaming fellow Scots for making a different choice on the best route to follow.
The Scottish political class are rotten to the core and have been for hundreds of years, full of insane visions of grandeur.
I fully understand the points being made by the owners of this site, but no one seems to be providing any sorts of ideas on how we progress as a nation. If it is to be as a socialist republic, then the vision of socialism has changed mightily from my idealistic youth when we viewed equality in very different terms from today’s media orientated and seemingly brainless population.
Sturgeons raison d’etre seems to be personal advancement through the offices of the now completely discredited EU perhaps to inherit the place of the suitably incompetent Von der Leyon. Whatever, most people in Scotland have no idea and perhaps no interest in what a really independent Scotland will look like or operate, but personally as an ex SNP and now floating voter I am very interested indeed.
Stephen P says:
13 March, 2021 at 11:39 pm
@ Zander Tait 11.06
No Stephen, I have no vendetta against TS. I have never even met him. In fact Tommy does have qualities that are now completely missing from the Bute House Bunker such as an unwavering belief that an Independent Scotland would flourish and the sooner said Independence comes about, the better.
My main point is that I believe that it would have been better for Craig Murray to announce his future plans either ahead of or simultaneously with the AFI announcement.
“If necessary wear a gas-mask , frogman suit , full-body armour , whatever, shower in disinfectant before ( and crucially after ) voting for the bastards”
No.
I will not vote for no bastard to curtail my rights, my freedom of speech and my democratic choices. I will not vote for no bastard to abuse my yes vote to preserve the union, to force me to believe in an unscientific reality that does not exist and to force on me what harms me. I will not vote for no bastard so I can be repeatedly lied to. I will no vote for no bastard to systematically denying Scotland its right to self determination under their pathetic excuse of the day.
Sorry but this time they have gone too far and there is no longer a way back because they deliberately burnt all the bridges.
From where I am standing you can no longer pass a sheet of rolling paper between the SNP and the British state parties so close they have become.
They will not get my vote.
Independence is never off the table until it’s delivered.
You fight for it every day not every 10 years.
Does anyone really think letting the Unionist Tories take control of Holyrood as a better option?
It’s a Scottish crooked government or it’s the Master Race’s English Parliament in Edinburgh.
No escape. A punch in the guts or have your intestines ripped out.
Ruby says:
14 March, 2021 at 8:52 am
SNP in power at Holyrood = huge decrease in the YES vote
Unionists in power at Holyrood = huge increase in the YES. vote.
Five year plan
Get rid of the SNP
Increase YES vote
Be patient
.
I think you’ve nailed it, Ruby.
Let’s be honest. The UK, which Scotland is a part of, is in a mess. Covid, Brexit, useless self-serving politicians and Governments are all to blame.
Hopefully, Covid is now on the way out. Brexit has been done and we now have to make the best of a bad situation-we can’t turn the clock back! This leaves us with the Politicians and Governments.
Bozo and his clowns are with us for another 4 years or so. We have the opportunity to change things in Scotland very soon. The SNP Government have not served Scotland well for the last 13 years. The list of failures far exceeds any perceived successes. Do we continue to vote for the SNP for more of the same? Unfortunately, the opposition parties do not instil any confidence either.
Independence is hailed as the panacea for all our woes but no party is willing to explain to the public how this will work or more importantly, how it will be financed. Emotive words and phrases look and sound fantastic but words are all they are. Will some Independence Party please explain how an Independent Scotland would prosper and provide some ‘financials’ to back this up. Until this is produced and is realistic and honest I simply cannot support Independence in any form. I suspect that millions of genuine, free-thinking Scots are exactly the same. The rabid SNP supporters appear to accept everything the party hierarchy tells them although the winds of change are blowing.
My wife and I will be voting in May, for the first time in 20 years. Don’t know who for as yet but it will not be for the SNP, Tory’s or Greens. Spoiling ballot papers is not an option and is frankly just stupid.
Craig Murray
I suggest someone like Craig needs to get the ISP and AFI in the same meeting and use his diplomatic skills to encourage them to work out a joint strategy to maximise the (non-SNP) pro-indy vote.
——————————————————————
NO VOTES SNP:
Sturgeon said she would be judged at the ballot box.
A vote for the SNP is a vote for Sturgeon.
@TheSNPLeftMe Very much chimes with my own views. Something of particular importance for me is the accessibility of politicians. If we are betrayed by Sturgeon and her clique, we have access to them; they live among us; they walk down our streets; we know where to reach them. That’s not the case for the shadowy powers at Westminster. I plan to vote SNP1, AFI or ISP two. I’m not voting to put even more power into the hands of folk in another country, especially when I don’t even know who they are.
By the way, I’m obviously not suggesting, in terms of accessibility, that I’d commit any crimes against them – just in case anyone wants to read into my message something that isn’t there.
Shocked says:
13 March, 2021 at 10:00 pm
I might be wrong about Craig Murray,
Yes you are wrong about Craig Murray. In a big way.
He is a staunch independence supporter for Scotland. If he gives his first vote to the SNP, by doing this he is enabling the INDY list candidates a better chance of success of entering Holyrood.
The D’Hondt system doesn’t go away because you are angry with the SNP leadership.
A very large proportion of the public will still vote SNP1/2 that is a reality ( The majority do not follow the intricacies of voting). If the SNP suffer losses in constituencies then the list divisor goes down. That means a big increase in woke SNP list MSPs.
The D’Hondt system is Sturgeon’s back up plan. The loss of 4 constituency MSPs in a region could result in 3 list MSPs depending on how well the 1/2 holds up. She may end up with a minority Government but it will be a Woke stronghold.
it is not a simple issue. The list selections are designed for the SNP getting a kicking.
D’Hondt can benefit the new list parties. However it can also benefit the SNP list MSP if constituencies are lost.
I am not arguing to vote SNP in the constituency. I am highlighting the impact on list votes following any loss of constituencies.
Look at how many MSP seats the Unionist vote delivers for very little success in the constituencies!
Sturgeon has most of the women’s vote and practically all of the Woke Yung Peeepole.
Looking and the media over the last few days , they appear to have moved on from “White supremacy” issues to “Male supremacy” look forward to the red witch pressing that particular button very soon!
Women have certainly been politicised pretty comprehensively and are in my opinion the biggest danger to our hopes of removing Comrade Sturgeon.
An ISP or AFI Pro-indy alliance with the SNP in Holyrood? But, holding the SNP’s feet to the fire on indy? This is complete and utter claptrap.
There will be NO cross-party pro-indy alliance at Holyrood.
If the SNP wanted a pro-indy majority working together for indy, they would organise for that.
The SNP actively attack and undermine the pro-indy movement. Any pro-indy parties are a threat to the power of the SNP. They won’t be given ANY support, or encouragement.
The SNP have ALWAYS wanted maximum power for the SNP by running an SNP 1 SNP 2 campaign, knowing this will result in maximum SNP and maximum Unionist List MSPs / minimum other pro-indy MSPs.
This has ALWAYS been so.
@Mark Boyle
It’s typical Peter Bell I’m afraid, rambling, repetitive, irrelevant and as usual missing the point…. and doesn’t realise he has been used as blunt instrument to keep some unruly SNP people onside by the cynical SNP leadership with their endless and false promises of indy ref 2 just over the hill.
He completely misunderstands Sturgeon and what her goal is. Nicola Sturgeon hasn’t been bothered about independence since she was a surly teenager. Nicola Sturgeon is in this game for power and independence is the vehicle to achieve that so be it, if not she will choose another horse to take her over the line.
Years of fawning adulation has led the power crazed psychopathic narcissist Nicola Sturgeon to believe she has conquered the Scot indy market and while she now thinks we would all vote for her to help her achieve her, aims even if she literally spat in our faces, she has calculated that the support we offer isn’t quite enough to get over the magic 50% and into the territory of an absolute majority and the power to corrupt the country beyond the point of redemption that comes with it.
So the decision has been made to bank Scottish nationalist support and move into another part of the electorate, trampling over us as she goes because she believes we will simply take it and keep voting SNP. That new target group is the wokeists and trans lobby, sturgeon believes that getting them on board will take her over the magic 50% and not only that they offer an instantly available standing online army that she believes will be far more effective than us boring and unsexy Scottish nationalists. Her new army will not only secure her absolute power in Scotland but it will propel her to the heights of global wokeism leadership where she can share platforms with AOC, Hilary Clinton, Kamala Harris and Jacinda Ardern. This is the big game, Scotland simply isn’t big enough for the power crazed psychopath Nicola Sturgeon.
We’ve all been played, thankfully many of us have woken up to the truth and now we need to mobilise grass roots to kick her out of politics for good by decapitating the “New” SNP snake. Hopefully she will also end up in prison one day.
I’m with Sillars and Salmond, the SNP is finished until the corrupt ones are cleared out.
BuggerlePanda 13 March,
“I think she will jump ship after the HR GE, to somewhere further up the monkey tree protecting her derriere until she is bedded in to with international expenses jet set.”
Well if she does , just remember we all helped to put Her there, We all helped Her to do what is going on right now.
Big Jock 08:24
“Rage never won a war.”
Hot rage has indeed never won a war. Cold rage, however, is the vital element that is needed to win this war.
Our enemies, both in London and Edinburgh, are willing to do whatever is required to crush us. Rage keeps us alive. Temper that rage till it is a cold unforgiving blade and we may well yet win out freedom in our lifetime.
Focus that rage on the those who have corrupted Scotland, not on those who want independence but not at “any cost”.
‘Be careful what you wish for’.
If we put more power into the hands of people who we all know are corrupt then that speaks volumes of the electorate.
I will vote SNP if I think the candidate is a decent human. Even if they are not so hot on independence (who know’s what they have been instructed to say).
But I live in John Swinney’s constituency.
So I cannot vote SNP.
https://www.tns2019.org/new-blog-1/2021/3/13/jumping-into-the-kangeroo-court
Not saying much this another attack but not on Westminster.WHY??
Just a few weeks ago the debate was about who second votes should go to. Now I see a lot of people are talking about where first votes will go. This is real progress. We are heading in the right direction.
Between now and the election, I’ll be explaining to people why voting for those who abuse and exploit them is a bad idea. If that’s an argument, it should be the easiest one to win I’ve ever engaged in.
I also think there’s an argument for voting for other parties in certain seats (even conservatives) where key players and architects of the SNP’s corrupt ways can be punished and ousted.
The election in May has nothing to do with principle or independence, and that’s not our fault. We all wish things were different.
The election in May is about punishing those who wronged the independence movement. It’s about teaching the SNP a lesson.
In case any of you haven’t read the writing on the wall, indyref2 is 5 to 10 years away, no matter who you vote for. Don’t go after the messenger, go after those who created this situation and scuppered our chances.
We need to destroy the SNP before we can build something new out of the ashes to replace it, just as we built the SNP out of the ashes of Scottish Labour’s destruction.
We are actually fighting the 2026 election right now.
I agree Hatuey, but how do we educate Nicola’s “monstrous regiment”?
Mark Boyle says:
14 March, 2021 at 9:14 am
Don’t you think that cutting and pasting your own article from your own website onto this one’s comments was a wee bit rude?
You got it arse for elbow, sonny. I posted a comment here which I then decided to put on my own blogsite. And why the hell not? They’re my words. I’ll put them wherever the fuck I like. The only one who has a say in the matter is Stu Campbell. If he thinks it’s rude, he can delete the comment and block me.
Try not to be such a tedious arse-ache, eh!
Reading much of this the usual with made up names,using negative when we are near indy victory>It will interesting to see who is really wants to independence,every week under the cover of secrecy the Tory Parasites,making up rules as they go along,to destroy Scotland,building a squatters hub in Edinburgh/Glasgow,no permission from Scotland.The internal Market Bill to steal resources and taxes,to defend themselves The COVERT Intelligence Bill allowing rape,torture and protection even for wrong doing.Welcome to the Westminster DICTATORSHIP.For children and grandchildren. More lies and promises coming!!
I read this blog and others, I think, if it’s as bad as everyone says it is then why are we not willing to do anything about it? Never mind not voting or spoiling ballot papers. Why sit behind a keyboard venting your annoyance, your disappointment and your frustration? Stand up, organise a protest! Demo at Holyrood! If the SNP think it’s ok to allow the kids to go back to school during this pandemic then why can’t we go tell Nicola Sturgeon how unhappy we are to her face? Can’t all the indy groups get together to try and make a difference before May? We all know most of the current snp msp’s will stay in a job, they’ll still be in charge but allowing them free reign isn’t an option when they’re making such a mess! Something needs to be done before the election. It’s not civil disobedience I’m calling for it’s a march and rally to Holyrood and maybe even a sit in to get answers, to demand the mandates are used, to get what we’ve voted for all these years
@Sandra
A march/protest or whatever is a waste of time, the only thing that will grab their attention is to vote them out.
The reason we are where we are is people’s willingness to vote SNP no matter what, until that changes nothing will change.
@Shocked
No way I’m even open to thinking about voting the snp out, they might be blagging they’re way through governing Scotland but at least they’re trying to put Scotland first. I’m voting SNP 1 for sure and I’ll see what my option 2 is, if there’s no alternative Indy party then it’ll be snp 2. I might be very pissed off with GRA & the HCB but we can deal with that after the election. I’ll always try to encourage my fellow Scots to go to Holyrood to make our demands clear especially on #indyref2 I see no reason not to and we might actually be giving Nicola the backing she needs to actually do it!
@samdra
The SNP? Putting Scotland first? Aye sure,
The “SNP” has become sturgeon’s personal party, the old SNP is dead, it no longer exists. Sturgeon was willing to jail her supposed friend for political reasons, just imagine what she’d do to you if you got in her way.
I’m with true patriots like Sillars and Salmond.
You’re with Sturgeon, criminality, corruption, Your clearly don’t give a damn about women getting their rights taken away in the name of wokeism, happy to give up your own rights to keep the party leader safe. We see you sturgeonite.
@Shocked
You clearly have an issue with independent thought lol Of course the SNP are trying to put Scotland first, they’ve certainly used any devolved power to try to ensure we are better off in real terms than those in other U.K. countries. I’m not very happy at the moment and I agree with Peter Bell’s assessment of the SNP. There’s a danger we will lose everything and Scotland will be absorbed in to the U.K. again if we can’t hang on to what we have got. The snp get 1 more chance but really the people of Scotland need to get off social media, stop arguing and demand what we want in person and I don’t mean ridiculous indy rallies in different cities! I mean going to Holyrood, I mean going to the heart of scot gov and telling them either get a grip, find the yoons you’ve allowed in the party and get us Indy using every method possible including courts and get international support.
@ Sandra
Can you give us an inkling of how we are meant to deal with the HCA after electorally cementing for another parliamentary term the very same folk that imposed without mandate said HCA on us?
If you have been following what’s been going on closely you will be aware the structures within the SNP have been altered and thus disenfranchising the members so they have much reduced influence to instigate change within the Organisation.
The following linked article covers that subject.
https://wingsoverscotland.com/how-to-make-a-coup/
On balance I agree with Peter Bell too, but not because I think the SNP are trying to put Scotland first. I think they are simply pursuing the goals they really want to achieve – woke cookies and legislation to allow everyone who disagrees with them to be criminalised – without the slightest thought of how it will play in electoral terms. They’re confident of winning no matter what they do, and they also perhaps genuinely believe that majority opinion agrees with them (rather than the truth being that most of the electorate have no idea of the wider implications of their woke policies). Their heads are so far up their own backsides they don’t have a clue what’s in front of them.
They want personal advancement (and woke cookies) and Scotland’s interests can go hang frankly. The election is irrelevant because they expect to win on the back of the wheesht for indy and hold your nose vote, at worst.
@sandra
You’re deluded. This isn’t down to “yoons” or whatever, as as for P Bell, well I’ve already said what I have to say about him, he couldn’t have read sturgeon more wrong if he tried.
This is down to corruption and criminal behaviour in the leadership of the SNP, but in their defence I don’t honestly blame them for taking the piss out the country when people like you keep making excuses for them.
Quite enjoyed manhating lesbian Hannah Bardell’s ravings today (on the bandwagon-jumping back of that psycho Greens woman’s supposedly satiric bleatings) in The National, today, about curfews for men. Win votes? This pack of vengeful sexual minority psychos wouldn’t even know how to SPELL it. Complete and utter insanity.
They WILL pay for this manhating shit, on top of all their other deranged madness, in May. Nothing more sure. A textbook example of how to totally destroy a party with divisive extremist fascist policies.
Sturgeon must be proud. Her Scotland-wrecking project is nearing completion. Sorry for anything we did to you growing up, nutcase. Certainly had your revenge now, eh? The ruination and damage is clear for the naked eye to see the length and breadth of the country.
Tragic and disgusting. Same as it ever was.
@Peter A Bell says:
14 March, 2021 at 1:29 pm
“You got it arse for elbow, sonny. I posted a comment here which I then decided to put on my own blogsite. And why the hell not? They’re my words. I’ll put them wherever the fuck I like. The only one who has a say in the matter is Stu Campbell. If he thinks it’s rude, he can delete the comment and block me.
Try not to be such a tedious arse-ache, eh!”
Bullshit – the times between posting it on your blogshite and here were a matter of minutes. Seems pretty obvious you were wanting to use WoS as an unwitting showcase and all the bullshit about “deciding” to make it a post on your own are worthy of Sturgeon and Blackford’s Jackanory stories.
As one poster above has already stated, you’ve got form for this.
As for Stu, think he’s got enough on his plate to bother policing all the various wannabes coming here trying to publicise their own fetid efforts, both blogs and parties.
Yes, they’re your words and you can put them wherever the f**k you like – and when you put them in someone else’s blog the rest of us can tell you to tell you to go do one, Mr “Thinker, Listener, Talker, Reader, Writer” – or should we just say “Pretentious wanker” and be done with it?
Big Jock says:
“At least there is a mandate from yes ,if we give them a majority. Then it’s up to the movement he we force Sturgeon to act”
Are you just back from having the Lobotomy done ? We have a majority now, they have ignored us for years already so what is it you have suddenly come up with to get them to do your will all of a sudden ? Some sort of Balric like cunning plan ? Jeez.
Do not be surprised if your post is currently being examined and the sim card never arrives.
A lot of big egos on here, that’s why I won’t reply to anyone, I just put my comment and go.
Anyone wants to pull me up on something, my advice is dont bother, just go and annoy someone that gives a F__K