The world's most-read Scottish politics website

Wings Over Scotland

Time catches up with us all

Posted on January 29, 2017 by

Here’s the Conservative MP for Stratford-on-Avon 10 months ago:


And this is him yesterday, reacting to the news that having been born in Iraq means he’s now banned from entering the USA:


Which you’d imagine isn’t quite the sort of “special relationship” he was talking about in glowing terms just two days earlier:


Because whether you’re Tory or Labour, the trouble with dog-whistling racists is that once you’ve started, you have very little control over where it’ll stop.








And it’s rarely anywhere you wanted to go.

Print Friendly, PDF & Email

1 Trackbacks/Pingbacks

  1. 29 01 17 13:56

    Time catches up with us all | speymouth

341 to “Time catches up with us all”

  1. One_Scot says:

    Nadhim Zahawi – ‘Yeah, I’m all up restrictions, as long as it doesn’t affect me obviously.’

    Seriously, why do we let these people control our lives?

  2. Bob MACK says:

    But but but. He loves Theresa. He meant other foreigners. Obviously a little administration error. Some poor immigration official will be blamed for lack of understanding the directive and all will be cushy again.

  3. Croompenstein says:

    Why are decent Americans putting up with this shit being done in their name?

  4. ScottieDog says:

    Mr Zahawi must feel like he fired a trident missile.

  5. HUGH KIRK says:

    Nadhim Zahawi seems pissed….What he wished for just bit him on the ass.

  6. HandandShrimp says:

    One of the things that disturbed me most about the Better Together campaign was their ready willingness to use foreigner as an indication of the other, something less than a whole. This was in my view a dangerous and slippery slope. A theme UKIP and Leave picked up on with gusto with their Leave campaign and one which Trump has embraced with a troubling enthusiasm.

  7. Miss Babington says:

    The perfectly executed takedown of blatant hypocrisy as always by the Rev.

  8. findlay farquaharson says:

    poetic justice

  9. Skip_NC says:

    Croompenstein, we’re not. It will take time, though, to win over the decent people who were fooled by Trump’s promises. Does that sound familiar?

  10. Ed t head says:

    Its going to be interesting during Indy 2 as all there past outbursts will come back to haunt them. There is a saying fools rush in May seems to have not heard it.

  11. Doug says:

    This is what I think of when I see a man like that.

  12. DerekM says:

    Wow he should resign on principle oh wait nearly forgot he is a tory they have no principles.

  13. yesindyref2 says:

    I looked at the Women for Independence gofundme for the Glasgow Vet to get back home (wasn’t allowed to transit via New York as born in Iran), and several of the donors were Anerican.

  14. Mike says:

    Its the same with Nigel Farage the latest migrant worker to work for Fox News in the US telling us all about how there are too many migrant workers in the UK.
    These people truly believe they are entitled and above common law and legislation.
    They are amongst a group of established elites who don’t actually believe that nobody is above the law.

  15. heedtracker says:

    And yet these profoundly stupid tories still reign over Scotland, with viceroy Fluffie.

  16. MajorBloodnok says:

    In my view, ‘conservatives’ are people who lack empathy and have difficulty understanding people different to themselves, and can only comprehend a thing when it actually happens to them personally.

    It is quite clear that Zahawi never thought it could happen to him, so maybe he now understands the downside of all this anti-immigration stuff he and his party spout. Though probably not.

  17. him being a UK citizen would probably allow him a visa to America?

    does the executive order say `born in restricted country` or `citizen of restricted country`?

  18. Terry says:

    Horrified by these events. And check Theresa the appeaser in turkey. Weak and foolish just like the uk we live in.

    Meantime in holyrood there’s the possibility of the govt being taken down. Thanks Green Party. I thought you had more brains than that – you’re walking into Tory mundell s tax trap. And if we lose a pro Indy majority in the ensuing election you will go the way of labour. I’d be so disappointed that you’d taken our chance of Indy away from us. You’re supposed to be better than that. And the result? Stuck in a Tory uk and out of Europe – dancing to the tune of trump. God save the queen. It’s a fascist regime. And there’s no future.

    And the irony is that in an Indy scotland I’d maybe have voted green

  19. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    The mask has slipped.

    It reveals the face of the Neo-Facist UK that a non Indy Scotland will be chained to out with the EU and the protection of Human Rights Legislation due to Brexit.

    Theresa the Appeaser won’t condemn because she knows the UK economy is going to tank.

    Someone should have told Nahdim Zahawi MP “If you tolerate this then your children will be next”

    Now he know what the “Proud Scot Buts” must feel like when the Establishment vilify all of Scotland not just us Vile Separatists.

  20. galamcennalath says:

    Typical Tory. “Rules apply to others, not me.” But then, “What, they are applying the rules to me.”

    Racist is something to avoid. Don’t open the can of worms, some of them bite. And, you can’t get them back in the can.

    The Indy side in Scotland has steered clear of racist, as have many on the Union side, let’s keep it that way.

  21. Seumas says:

    Scotland is most definetly a foreign country to the rest of the UK, when you compare our political and social outlook on life. The word “foreigner” was used in a nasty and negative way during 2014, as if there was something evil about being foreign.

  22. galamcennalath says:

    Ed t head says:

    Its going to be interesting during Indy 2 as all there past outbursts will come back to haunt them.

    Lots of shit for us to cast back up to them.

    They conducted IndyRef1 as if there would never be an IR2. They behaved after IR1 as if they would never have to fight another.

    And they are still at it. More fools them!

  23. mogabee says:

    Just NIMBYs…

    Or two-faced lying NIMBYs! 🙁

  24. Rob James says:

    That’ll be the same Nadhim Zawahi who was believed to be a negotiator for an energy company, purchasing oil from daesh and flooding the European market with cheap oil. The company board of directors included all the usual suspects (Bankers, ex BP executives etc.) When are the public going to say enough is enough.

    Unfortunately, most of them seem blissfully unaware of what these crooks are doing, whilst their living standards diminish year after year. They’ll blame it on the SNP because they said so on the BBC.
    Meanwhile the establishment (World Order) are flaunting their criminality and laughing at those who dissent.

  25. winifred McCartney says:

    The usual ‘I’m alright Jack’ approach from tories – touting for business good or bad from anywhere – even when any right thinking person would be avoiding like the plague. Turkey and human rights and democracy – secret police etc but lets make them more weapons.
    Trump every time he opens his mouth proves he is racist, homophobic and anti women. His is the worst rhetoric ever heard in America, caring for the poor by taking away their health care and dismantling everything that is good in America.

    I would never sanction abortion, but I would never undermine, blame or think any less of any woman who has had one. Trump is not a pro lifer he simply wants to control women and subjugate them to men.

    He is dangerous, controlling, and has made his fortunes on the back of the little man and woman whom he has used and abused for decades. Many, many people in America are ashamed of his antics and his position on many things. As for those who can only see through a selfish lense when it affects them (tory mp above) they are typical of the self-centred me me me culture of today.

    I still cannot believe that a man who has not paid taxes for something like 20 years, is a several times over declared bankrupt, who owes millions to China has been elected to be President of USA. I am still hoping I wake up and it has been a nightmare – though both republicans and democrats share the blame over there choice of candidates.

    Theresa May should not have been so quick to travel to America and certainly should not have invited him here to peddle his horrific nonsense.

  26. Jim the Westcoaster says:

    There’s some real irony in other players on the unionist side in our referendum. I loved the irony of the name Vote No Borders on the basis that if we had won they would have to erect a wall and checkpoints. The inference being that would be a bad thing. Less than two years later they presided over another referendum so they could put up borders with check points. Only that was to be a good thing. Now Trump’s trumped them and some of the Vote Leave acolytes are a wee bit disappointed. Karma.

  27. r.esquierdo says:

    What shoes will I wear today to suit the occasion

  28. chris kilby says:

    Be careful what you wish for, eh?

  29. One_Scot says:

    It is almost laughable seeing how desperate the Twatter Yoons are flapping about panicking screaming ‘there is no appetite for IndyRef2’.

  30. Arbroath1320 says:

    I don’t know what he is worried about. After all isn’t he a member of Tory “Mega Millions” club. This should make it extremely easy for him to “buy” his way into which ever country he wants to “visit” surely.

    Here’s just a “little” background to poor wee Nadhim.

  31. Stoker says:

    The criminal alcoholic, George Foulkes, says to Roseanna Cunningham:

    “So says the lady whose policy would make all English people foreigners!”

    And what’s wrong with “foreigners”? I’ve got countless relatives who are “foreigners” and i love them all, some more than others. It’s only nasty, sneaky, self-interested people like you George who use that word in a way that says far more about you than i ever could.

    BTW (1): If i leave Scotland i automatically become a “foreigner” no-matter what country i find myself in and i have absolutely no problem with being a Scottish “foreigner” in a foreign land.

    BTW (2): I’ve just noticed, George, your surname is an anagram of ‘foul kes’ – quite apt i suppose.

  32. Dorothy Devine says:

    r.esquierdo, clown ones spring lithely to mind.

  33. carjamtic says:

    Typical Tory ignores Rule no.1

    Rule No 1 : Never listen to your inner nazi,for short term,political gain.

    “Hey everbody,I’ve just shoved a scorpion up my arse and see there is nothing to fear,look I’m ok,I’m alright”

    As the scorpion slowly wakens and the deluded Tory’s tiny swastica tattoo (etched on their perineum)starts to vibrate,to tremble and as the cold beads of sweat begin to run down to the schucks of their arse,it begins to agitate,the now wide awake scorpion,the reality of the situation hits home,the deluded Tory knows he is not ok or even remotely alright,the terrors,peak at fear factor five.

    Multiply that on a Global Scale.


  34. Tam the Bam. says:

    Scottie Dog @ 11.52am

    Yep…and looks like its veered off course and heading back towards him!

  35. Legerwood says:

    Signed the petition to stop Trump visit.

    Votes rose from 185,000 to almost 189,000 in time it took me to complete process.

  36. galamcennalath says:

    Phenomenal. Clocking up 50+ signatures per second!


  37. SOG says:

    Trump petition – 190k @ 1340

  38. CameronB Brodie says:

    Apparently he felt it appropriate for taxpayers to pay to heat the stable at his second home. A quick check found that he also voted in support of air-strikes on his country of origin, in the interests of advancing humanitarian concerns, of course. It also seems that he likes to bank off-shore, so it appears the man has no scruples.

    My heart bleeds for the poor soul.

    Tory MP Nadhim Zahawi ‘closely linked to two tax-haven-based companies’

  39. yesindyref2 says:


    That petition has gone from less than 140,000 I think, to over 200,000 in less than an hour.

  40. Breeks says:

    First they came for the Communists,
    and I didn’t speak up,
    because I wasn’t a Communist.
    Then they came for the Jews,
    and I didn’t speak up,
    because I wasn’t a Jew.
    Then they came for the Catholics,
    and I didn’t speak up,
    because I was a Protestant.
    Then they came for me,
    and by that time there was no one
    left to speak up for me.

  41. Walter Scott says:

    Bad stuff is happening in brexitland and the US. Racists are now out in the open. We need to be free from fascism.

  42. Tam the Bam. says:

    Trump petition … signed.

  43. Ann says:

    Petition signed 211k

  44. HandandShrimp at 12.03 pm.

    Following on from that H.S, when Indyref2 comes along, will the No campaign propoganda revolve almost entirely around immigration, as they try to induce the fear factor, no matter how despicable that tactc is to all right-minded people.
    During the 2014 Independence Referendum it was a subject that rarely was asked about on the doorstep, it was mainly pensions, the pound, and sometimes defence that was mentioned, immigraton didn’t seem such a big deal to most people.
    As far as I can tell, most of the Better Together arguments from the last time have been debunked, mainly by the actions of the Westminster Government, so are they likely to use the “foreigners” argument in a bid to stop us becoming an independent country.
    Unfortunately, I think it’s very likely.

  45. Robert Graham says:

    It’s as predictable as night follows day, previous statements from Career politicians will in the end come back and bite them in the arse, When you don’t have any beliefs ,or principles but simply follow your chosen political party line as a means of advancement don’t be so surprised when as in this situation they are well and truly hung out to dry , Tough Shit Pal .

  46. Ronnie says:

    Funny, isn’t it?

    The English have turned the term ‘foreigner’ into a nasty word, only adding the ‘Johnny’ bit to make it a bit humorous.

    Is that the reason they cannot seem to comprehend that, to the rest of the world’s populations, some 7 billion people, they are the ‘foreigners’.

  47. yesindyref2 says:

    I only signed it after I posted, it took me an hour to decide. I don’t like the idea of being anti-President of the US and took no side in the election. But there’s a limit, and I hope his party kicks him out.

    Looked at the map, top constituency is Caroline Lucas, 2nd Corbyn, 3rd Bristol West, then 3 or 4 others in London. Edinburgh and Leith (Brock) about 10th, the rest of Scotland behind.

  48. Thepnr says:

    Nadhim Zahawi in the news 4th Jan 2017

    “An investigation by the Guardian has revealed close links between a Conservative MP and two companies based in a tax haven.

    Nadhim Zahawi has financial ties to Balshore Investments and Berkford Investments, which operate from a lawyers’ office in Gibraltar. He does not declare a connection to either company on the MPs’ register of interests.

    Balshore Investments holds shares worth over £20m in YouGov, the polling firm co-founded by Zahawi in 2000. YouGov company documents have referred to Balshore as “the family trust of Nadhim Zahawi’s family”.

    That’s who are doing your polling in this country.

    As for the petition on Trump.

    I doubt the Queen would be embarrassed by a State visit from Trump. Her husband certainly wouldn’t, him and Trump would probably get on great. Trump doesn’t have squinty eyes see.

  49. Thepnr says:

    @CameronB Brodie

    You beat me to it! 🙂

  50. One_Scot says:

    Trump – ‘It’s working out very nicely’. OMG.

  51. Arbroath1320 says:

    I was going to give a wee update to the signatures to the Ban Trump petition but in the time it took me to write this it has jumped 4,000 signatures. 😀

    Personally I don’t see what the problem is. After all it’s not as if he is racist or anything. 😉


    Sorry think I misunderstood the petition.

    Duly signed! 😀

  52. yesindyref2 says:

    I think perhaps the problem for Scotland is the wording of the petition “Her Majesty the Queen”, there’s a lot of anti-monarchists (not neccessarily republicans), but the wording means it will get more support over the rest of the UK. And it’s a kicking for Trump – and May who was so slow responding (see Sturgeon’s twitter feed). It’s also rational – keeping the head of the USA out of the UK altogether is perhaps a move too far.

    Donald Trump should be allowed to enter the UK in his capacity as head of the US Government, but he should not be invited to make an official State Visit because it would cause embarrassment to Her Majesty the Queen.
    More details

    Donald Trump’s well documented misogyny and vulgarity disqualifies him from being received by Her Majesty the Queen or the Prince of Wales. Therefore during the term of his presidency Donald Trump should not be invited to the United Kingdom for an official State Visit.

    The way this is going – could it make a million?

  53. yesindyref2 says:

    I had that petition on “back” in the browser by the way, and know I clicked heed’s link to get there, so it was on 138,000 just after Arbroath1320’s post at 1:14 pm.

  54. heedtracker says:

    234,194 signatures, on Ban Heil Trump petition! Its like watching an odometer at light speed.

  55. heedtracker says:

    236,901 signatures

  56. galamcennalath says:

    yesindyref2 says:

    The way this is going – could it make a million?

    Perhaps by midnight?

    If not, certainly some time tomorrow.


  57. heedtracker says:

    238,289 signatures

  58. heedtracker says:

    240,085 signatures

    Must be one of the fastest ever petitions signings.

  59. heedtracker says:

    yesindyref2 says:

    Looks like 2500 signatures a minute.

  60. Stoker says:

    1:20pm – I was 158,532
    1:57pm – Wife was 211,677


  61. galamcennalath says:

    Largest online petition to parliament ….

    EU Referendum Rules triggering a 2nd EU Referendum

    We the undersigned call upon HM Government to implement a rule that if the remain or leave vote is less than 60% based a turnout less than 75% there should be another referendum.

    4,150,260 signatures


  62. heedtracker says:

    Peirs Morganite Heil Trumpers, look away now

    250,138 250,357 signatures

  63. Robert Louis says:

    Madhim Zahawi the Tory MP who is now banned from entering the USA, or transit via the USA to another country, or even boarding a flight to the USA, should remember the old adage; ‘if you’re going to sup with the devil, best use a long spoon.’.

    Somebody really should check Trump’s head, and see if he has 666 under that hairdo.

    What is most depressing in all of this, however, is that no matter how corrupt and depraved the Government in Westminster becomes, no matter how much they cosy up and praise the racist, sexist, homophobic American idiot president, Labour in Scotland WILL NOT support Scotland being independent. And Labour then have the freaking audacity to wonder why they can’t get elected.

  64. Effijy says:

    Grandpa, will your vote to keep Scotland an English Colony, where my opinions and votes won’t count for anything, mean that must always be a 2nd class citizen?

    Does Grandma think having the 4th worst old age pension in Europe is a good thing? Is she happy her retirement age has changed from 60 to 67 years of age?

    Do you want to see the best performing NHS in the UK, sold off to an American Corporation?

    Do you think we should cause the NHS to crash by removing all the E.U and commonwealth Doctors and Nurses?

    Grandpa, why are socialists multi millionaires like Tony Blair, Gordon Brown, and Alistair Darling?
    Don’t they know the richer they become, the poorer the poor become?

    Grandma, do you think we should take advice from violent alcoholic criminals who get paid to sleep in the House of Commons?

  65. TheWasp says:

    I was going to sign the petition, but there isn’t a Scotland option in the drop down, so that’ll be that.

  66. JLT says:

    There is no doubt about it, the British State has been digging itself a deeper hole each day since Trump became President. It was bad enough for Theresa and Co in trying to promote Brexit as a good thing for the British State through the ill-conceived idea of the ‘Global Britain’ brand.

    But like the child who seeks and finds their hidden Christmas presents before Christmas Day (thus ruining it for themselves), Theresa has made a number of really bad mistakes in being too eager to strike trade deals with anybody, without…

    (1) Actually swallowing her pride and just negotiating a ‘Soft Brexit’ by accepting freedom of movement. It makes the most bloody sense! Forget what Brexiteers want. They got what they wanted – out of the EU. Negotiate the rest of the deal on the Remainer’s terms. Something is better that nothing for everyone …not her deluded notion of ‘no deal is better than a bad deal’.

    (2) Ignoring all the danger signs that emanate from Donald Trump, and instead, bolting for the States to then fawn and simper over the maddest, baddest, idiot in the World.

    3) Before then hurrying back to strike a military trade deal with another ‘democratic’ megalomaniac in Erdogan. Where did that come from?!?!

    Simply put, a good portion of those who voted Leave, let alone the Remainers, never wanted this type of Brexit. This was not what Brexit was about. What we currently have is Theresa holding the begging bowl, nervous smiles, and praising deluded nasty fools who should never be running a bath, let alone a nation. Instead, Theresa is performing for that tiny minority of what is literally, ‘a mob’. This mob hates everyone who is not a WASP (White Anglo-Saxon Protestant), but are demanding that everyone should not only trade with us on the UK terms, but should also fear us at the same time since we’re this (supposedly) great influential military power. It’s just utter nonsense.

    And how foolish has Theresa been in the last 24 hours. Stating only 4 days ago about how she would have influence over Trump and bring him to heel if he should step out of line. Fast Forward to last night, and the deluded fool of a PM, not once, but twice, gave a pathetic attempt in excusing Trump’s actions over banning Muslims at American airports. We have one fool causing chaos beyond his own territory by affecting air traffic in other countries because people can’t get connecting flights in the US, while another fool once again hides when the crap hits the fan. Trump and Theresa are perfect for each other for all the wrong reasons.

    But what it has shown is that Theresa is weak. She will crumble if things go seriously wrong. If I was the First Minister this week …I would never break eye contact with Theresa. Just give her a continued hard stare, and let her make more mistakes. One thing is for sure …Theresa is no Maggie.

  67. yesindyref2 says:

    Ah, I see Rev’s on the job (40 mins ago). That’ll help, as he’ll get retweeted if that’s what it’s called.

  68. Thepnr says:

    @Robert Louis

    Labour support anti immigrant policies, remember the Cup with the slogan “Controls On Immigration”. Remember Hilary Benn’s speech to bomb Syria being cheered most loudly by the Tories sitting opposite?

    They can’t get elected because they are Tory Lite, people with those views prefer the “real deal” so vote Tory. While in Scotland people against those views will now vote SNP.

    You are witnessing the death of Labour as a political force.

  69. Effijy says:

    If May has instructed the Queen to get down on her 90 year old knees to Kiss Trump’s ****, won’t all the former Commonwealth Muslim countries, that she is desperate to trade with, dump the UK like a hot potato, if their citizens are to be banned from the USA, by England’s new best friend?

  70. heedtracker says:

    Bloody students, coming over here, paying mega bucks for uni, wanting to stay and get a good job. Mayhem’s got your coupon punched. Heil Farage.

  71. galamcennalath says:

    Thepnr says:

    You are witnessing the death of Labour as a political force.

    When was the last time Labour openly opposed the Tories? Must confess, nothing comes to mind.

    Over 50% of South British voted far right (Con+UKIP). Their country seems on the verge of becoming a isolationist, xenophobic, right-wing fest. Labour are doing more to bring this about than challenge it.

    And, in North Britain? Labour’s sole aim appears to be ensuring we get dragged over the cliff edge too.

    Hell mend them!

  72. fionan says:

    petition signed and shared, almost 300,000 and I expect that number is out-of date by now

  73. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Whether intentional or not, the wording of that petition is brilliant – I have no probs signing, even as a republican – the very fact it’s aimed at saving her from embarrassment is, in itself, embarrassing for Liz and her ilk.

    If it hits a million signatures will she show appreciation to all the loyal ‘subjects’ who are so concerned for her?

    It’s just clicked over 285,000

  74. John says:

    Croompenstein says:
    29 January, 2017 at 11:52 am

    Why are decent Americans putting up with this shit being done in their name?

    Same reason we have to put up with the ‘foreign’ shit ruling us. We voted for it.

  75. Stoker says:

    Here’s a wee tune for that criminal alcoholic parasite Foulkes:

    Sting – Englishman in New York


    At 1:57pm the petition was at 211,677
    At 2:57pm the petition was at 282,603
    I’m away to enjoy the rest of today’s sunshine in the garden.

  76. Shug says:

    I bet this fact and comparison does not appear on the BBC any time soon

    Best laugh I have had all week we’re it not so sad

  77. Stoker says:

    Clickbait trap alert at 2:50pm Newbies! Don’t fall for it!

  78. Robert Graham says:

    Good to watch Lesley Riddoch standing up for Independence and giving the Audience a touch of realism by reminding them what was Scotlands place in this Union, short and sweet f/all we don’t count, This was on Nicky Campbell’s program The Big Question, Very surprised by Nicky Campbell’s defending Scotlands right as a nation to be heard and acknowledged as a partner , I expect he will be warned about future conduct for this slip.
    What wasn’t acceptable was letting that fool from UKIP , can’t remember his name or be arsed looking for it , anyway this Clown given free reign to continue to spout pish about us having to join the EURO when even Schoolchildren here know we can’t be forced to join even if we Qualified which be don’t , and this pish about having to go to the back of the Queue behind Turkey to join, There is nowhere in the European articles a provision for removing The Citizenship from European Citizens namely us , so how that’s going to work out when England leaves is anyone’s guess.

  79. Liz Rannoch says:

    Never seen numbers go up like this before!


  80. During the EU Referendum I noticed a lot of voters of Asian origin on tv moaning about there intention to vote Leave because they were concerned about the impact of migrants from Eastern Europe coming into their areas. The thought struck me that back in the 1964 General Election in the Smethwick constituency the then Tory candidate successfully played the anti-Asian immigrant card and that was no different to what was now being done against EU migrants. While I feel some sympathy with Mr Zahawi, he needs to recognise that it was people like him who gave Trump encouragement through the Brexit vote. Maybe if he and other people had engaged their brains a wee bit more prior to the referendum thinags might be a bit more positive across the planet.

  81. Donnie McHattie says:

    Nadhim Zahawi and Priti Patel stated that the uk would be free to allow immigrants from other countries post bexit.

    That they thought those who voted for brexit to prevent people from Poland or France entering England would be happy permit people from India or Pakistan into England. This belief highlights their lack of knowledge of their electorate and general intelligence.

    Now they are surprised that US is behaving the way their new president said it would behave, whilst the rest of us for a long time have been saying…………

    These idiots are now in control (of England), therefore the uk, time to get out quick!

  82. Hamish100 says:

    Can I just check that members of my family in the USA, Ireland, England , Australia etc are still my family. They are? I must be the foreigner then.

  83. John Edgar says:

    Well, well, some speshal relashonship! Put the lang spoons bit and supping with the devil to the side, what a stramash.
    All the schmalzy talk since last Friday has gone.
    May:s close hand-in-hand relationship with Trump will haunt her.
    And Trump has only been in the job a week or so!
    What next? Widening the ban? You could not make this up.

  84. yesindyref2 says:

    To make a rare opinion on such weighty international matters, a power bloc has hard power as in military, but it has soft power as in influence. The Chinese have been extending their soft power in Africa and other places by investment, trade and being quiet. The Russians are trying to do the same, but being rebuffed a bit. The EU has indigestion but could be good at the soft power angle.

    Trump on the other hand is throwing the USA soft power away. State department resignations, and the Pentagon must be tearing its collective hair out.

  85. yesindyref2 says:

    Aye, for China add Europe of course – and the USA. I think the USA is facing a future USSR crisis.

  86. Macart says:

    Neatly done Rev. 🙂

    Couldn’t agree more.

  87. handclapping says:

    Perhaps Stu should be asking historywoman how these days compare with Germany at the rise of Hitler. You know crazy ideas like the machinery of government will curb his excesses; how did that work out?

    If she is not batshit crazy she must be very worried poor thing.

  88. ronnie anderson says:

    Mr Zahawi Why do those word Karma & Bitch keep cropping up, hell rub it into you.. Two sons at Princeston Uni who cant leave the country Family life is disrupted aye Karma’s ah Bitch lol.

  89. jimnarlene says:

    @ over 300,000, I don’t care about embarrassing Betty, but Trump can fek off!

  90. Jimbo says:

    Zahawi is upset that he is now subject to the type of restrictions he wanted to impose on others.

    It’s always OK for these people when the laws they make for others don’t apply to them. Wee bit of a reality check for Zahawi on how it feels for others perhaps? Nah, he’ll still have that Tory sense of entitlement.

  91. galamcennalath says:

    Saw somewhere that the US is now more divided than it was at the time of its Civil War.

    Seems plausible!

    The right wing fundamentalist religious red neck lot, who of course the Republicans pander to, would seem to have far more in common with Jihadists in the Middle East than anyone in Europe.

    In that respect I feel sorry for the ‘normal’ folks in the US with whom we could relate.

  92. Pete says:

    Can’t really see what all the fuss is about.
    Trump is only carrying out his election pledges and the US citizens made him President.
    That’s democracy.
    Also, there’s been plenty folks on here wanting to disenfranchise foreigners voting in Indy ref2.
    Pot calling the kettle……

  93. Macart says:

    When you exclude on the basis of point of origination, race, culture, religion, sexual preference or gender?

    You become the problem. Difference instead of being a cause for celebration, becomes an excuse to exclude, alienate and other. It becomes a breeding ground for hatred, fear and exploitation by the ruthless. Y’know, politicians, media, corporate interests.

    Something the YES movement is only too familiar with. Inclusion, sharing, communication is the enemy of fear. It turns fear back upon itself I reckon.

    You want an independent Scotland to stand for something good in the world? Then hold out your hand to that world and be a friend.

  94. Bob MACK says:

    Petition signed and climbing fast.


    Not by the majority of Americans. Clinton won popular vote. It is relevant.

  95. Bill Hume says:

    I don’t care much whether President Trump has a state visit or not. If England wants him to have a state visit then that’s OK by me…….provided……Her Majesty makes it clear she is speaking as Elizabeth II of England, not Elizabeth I of Scotland.

  96. yesindyref2 says:

    Also, there’s been plenty folks on here wanting to disenfranchise foreigners voting in Indy ref2.


    Article on the petition now in the Herald.

  97. Robert Peffers says:

    @One_Scot says: 29 January, 2017 at 1:10 pm:

    “It is almost laughable seeing how desperate the Twatter Yoons are flapping about panicking screaming ‘there is no appetite for IndyRef2’.”

    “Ah Dinna ken aboot hungert bit Ah dae hiv ae muckle drouth.”

    Owersettin intil Inglis-“I don’t know about hungry but I do have one great thist”.

  98. sassenach says:

    Pete says:
    29 January, 2017 at 3:48 pm
    Can’t really see what all the fuss is about.

    Is that because the barracks windaes are dirty, perhaps??

  99. Thepnr says:

    There’s Pete trying to beat us over the head with what other posters on here say. So obvious is it not?

  100. Capella says:

    Petition duly signed. 333,218 at the moment.

    An interesting document is the American Declaration of Independence. It has a detailed charge sheet against King George that would be apt today, both in Scotland and in the USA. With a little editing it could be a template for the coming campaign.

    He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

    He has endeavoured to prevent the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither…


  101. Conan the Librarian says:

    Left a link to the petition on the Washington Times to see how the Trumpanzees would bite…

  102. K1 says:

    Trump claims these executive orders are to ensure no ‘terrorists’ enter the US, he’s attempting to mask the true aim which is to ban Muslims, he can’t state that because that’s unAmerican, on the grounds of religious freedom and that citizens there have that protected according to their written constitution.

    Here’s the problem though Pete…the 9 countries that are specifically banned have never attacked of killed any American citizens in the past 30 years from ’75 to ’15, but a handful of countries that have attacked America and its citizens, over that same period and absolutely meet the criteria of ‘terrorists’ have not been banned?

    So he’s not acting on what he stated, he’s lying through his teeth and no one but numpties like you are falling his pish.

    Oh, there’s also the unedifying problem regarding Trump’s business empire. The fact that those countries that do ‘fit’ the terrorist profile have no Trump businesses within their borders, but everyone one of those countries that do not ‘fit’ that terrorist profile has, poses a real conflict of interest question that I’m pretty sure lawyers are going to have a field day with too:

    But don’t you let those little facts get in the way of your sucking up (condoning) to one of the most racists POTUS’s that has ever been ‘democratically’ elected in the good ole US of A.

  103. uno mas says:

    Donald Trump to visit Glasgow?


    Memo to “Empire Biscuits”

    YOUR GOING TO NEED A BIGGER RICKSHAW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  104. yesindyref2 says:

    Apparently they’ve been having problems:

    We want you as a new recruit

  105. heedtracker says:

    Netherlands welcome Heil Trump. Great country, not run by planet toryboy.

  106. velofello says:

    Well I won’t sign the petition.”Embarrass the Queen?”. To me the entire Royal establishment is an embarrassment. Remember Cameron saying – the Queen purred on learning of the Indy vote?

    Seems Mo Farah, a Knight of the Realm, has a problem too.Somali born, who lives with his family in Oregon, USA. Does he receive Lottery funding I wonder?

    Trump? I’m not a fan but better him than Clinton. The body count to date is 61 people close to the Clintons who have died. Assassinations, heart attacks, drowning. Check it out. Clinton on Assange, “Can’t we take him out?”.

    There is much happening and troubling,in the world on a global scale, and in our UK politics. Suggest we focus on supporting the Indy campaign where we do have influence.

  107. yesindyref2 says:

    Remembered that wrong, it is of course:

    They want you, they want you
    They want you as a new recruit

  108. Pete says:

    Whichever way you look at it Trump won the election under the US rules fair and square.
    It’s no use bleating on about the popular vote. It means nothing.
    Many say FPTP is unfair in the UK elections but that’s the rules.
    uKIP have just 1 MP but stacks of votes.
    He is doing what he said he would in double quick time unlike most politicians who promise lots but deliver little.
    In any case, it’s only a temporary ban and the countries are those identified as being problematic under the Obama administration.
    Just wish we could do the same.
    You either believe in world citizenship or national borders.
    You can’t have both.
    I believe in nation states being in control of their borders with a strict definition of refugee status
    It would seem that just about anyone can be a refugee .
    Germany opened its borders and we can all see the result.
    Reality check, please.

  109. velofello says:

    Derek Bateman – We are disengaging from the world’s most influential grouping of civilised nations…

    As I posted above, focus on what we can influence.

  110. Robert Peffers says:

    @Ronnie says: 29 January, 2017 at 2:01 pm:

    ” … Is that the reason they cannot seem to comprehend that, to the rest of the world’s populations, some 7 billion people, they are the ‘foreigners’.”

    The fact is that to the Englanders, and the USAsian Americans who see themselves as the only Americans and think the Far North Inuit, Canadians, Mexicans and Central and South Americans as foreigners in America. Not to mention the native Americans from USAsian parts as foreign to the USA have more derogatory terms for others than any other nations on Earth.

    Jocks, Swearties, Paddies, Micks, Taffs, Ragheads, Wogs, Toerags not to mention the USAsians call the English Limeies and the English call the USAsians Yanks.

    So you are indeed right, Ronnie and they don’t see themselves as the foreigners when they are not in their own country.

    You will note I coin the term, “USAsian”, for the citizens of the USA.

    Try it sometime. Their immediate reaction is, “I’m not an Asian”. Then you say, “I didn’t say you were – I said you were a, “USA – sian, i.e. a person from the USA”.

    They may then say, “I don’t like that it sounds too much like Asian”. To which you then reply, “So just what’s wrong with Asians”?

    Now’s your chance, if they called you, “Jock”, to say, “Would you prefer if I called you Yank”?, (Unless of course they are a, “Yankee”).

    Mind you, you really have to try and keep a straight face too.

  111. yesindyref2 says:

    It’s cross-party, and that helps bring people together in a common cause.

    Who cares about the monarchy, either way?

  112. JLT says:

    Whichever way you look at it Trump won the election under the US rules fair and square

    Which is true enough, Pete, while at the same time, it also reflects badly on American politics in general. For someone to be voted in by stating extreme viewpoints of building walls, demanding other nations pay for it, starting trade wars, denouncing an entire religious group, wanting to create an arms race …isn’t the type of political leader to be standing on the world stage, let alone the most powerful nation on the Earth.

    But as you say, Americans voted for him

    …but at the same time, the rest of the world doesn’t need to bow down, grovel or even adhere to him. We can talk to him, but if his rhetoric becomes vitriol, then we should step away. If Trump wants to begin trade wars, then I’m sure the rest of the world could band together and refuse to trade with America. It would only take hours, if not minutes, before American companies would be banging on the White house door demanding Trump’s head. As we were told 2 and half years ago during our Referendum, it’s the economy, stupid.

    If the American people themselves don’t bring Trump to heel, then certainly American Companies will. This is an American problem, and it will be solved by the American in general.

  113. Dan Huil says:

    England can brown-nose Trump if it wants. I can’t see most European nations doing the same as England. Best for Scotland to continue building bridges, as opposed to walls, with Europe.

  114. Conan the Librarian says:


    I couldn’t give a toss about embarrassing Queenie, I want to see this getting debated. Then we’ll see just who “gets embarrassed” 🙂

  115. Robert Kerr says:


    “fair and square” . A masonic code surely.


    Cambridge analytica helped.

  116. JLT says:

    I couldn’t give a toss about embarrassing Queenie, I want to see this getting debated. Then we’ll see just who “gets embarrassed”

    I agree. I’m just Royalist and no more (because I can’t abide the idea of a President Blair or Brown), but yep, I want to see this ‘Global Britain’ nonsense completely trashed, tarnished and mocked. If this is another weapon in the arsenal to convince soft No voters that Westminster and its Establishment have lost the plot, then yep …so be it! Let’s get this debated so we can show the other half of Scotland what type of politician leads them, and just what a post-EU UK is going to look like.

  117. Reluctant Nationalist says:

    First time posting here! Love lurking and reading your routine deft demolition of the MSM merde, Rev. But unforunately I’m tempted into posting today because this whole schtick manufactured by the SNP about Scotland being a tolerant haven of doughy-eyed social justice progressives is becoming a tad unbearable, and obv not borne out by the polling statistics from recent past years that showed that the same percentage of Scots wanted a reduction in immigration as the fascist Little Englanders (49%).

    Now, I appreciate that on one hand there’s the same ageing population/pensions/university fees problem that immigration helps solve, and on the other a very rewarding experience of scoring political points against the Tories and their dog-whistle tactics, from a comfortable situation of by virtue not having responsibility for decisions on immigration.._yet, so it’s not as if you can be honest about the issue at this point; but it’s probably best to leave it alone, as this BS will put off a huge number of those edging to ‘Yes’. Now the dividing bell has long since rung, and this shitshow could finally end with independence, don’t jinx it it with unnecessary posturing, please!

  118. Phronesis says:

    Wise words from @Idrees Ahmad

    ‘To set up a competition between Muslims as to which one of their countries is more terroristic is a moral and political cul-de-sac’

    The tragedy of Aleppo on Obama’s watch

    A round up of the implications of Trumps policies- most opinion is not favourable
    ‘The results portend a dark era of regional hegemonies over collective problem-solving as impulses for national solutions to global threats take precedence. How ironic that, as the world gets smaller and the demand for cross-border solutions grows, the most powerful country in the world has decided to build walls and run for the hills’

    From Jeff Halper- someone who understands how peace can be achieved in the Middle East because, believe it or not, there are Israelis and Palestinians that can comprehend a peaceful future that is not delivered at the end of a gun or bomb blast- but the media very rarely publish that. They are more comfortable broadcasting the empty rhetoric of those who do not live within the kill zone

    One thing that we can conclude from recent events is that we need not refer to the USA for guidance on democratic processes (nor its new soul mate UKOK) and Scotland should continue forging ahead with its progressive democratic ideals, link in with other like- minded countries and show the world what joined up politics and democracy looks and sounds like.

  119. Undeadshaun says:

    Fair and square sounds like something a squaddie would says, is pete a member of the 77th brigade?

  120. Tam the Bam. says:

    Trump petition now approaching half-a million signatures.

  121. Valerie says:

    I feel nothing but contempt for Zahawi. He and his party are all about destroying any aspect of empathy within society, and its working.

    Da’esh will be having one huge celebration right now, as well as busy picking off new followers, for fresh recruits. All aided and abetted by the UK.

    Let’s not forget, that exactly a year ago Tasmina managed to get a debate in the House, asking to ban Trump from visiting, based at that time on his hate speech about Muslims.

    SNP were laughed at, and much of the Tory rhetoric was about free speech and inviting Trump to be persuaded by British values of tolerance.

    Then May commenced her desperate world tour of tyrants, as fast as her skinny legs could carry her.

    May had to be pressured to denounce the Muslim ban, of course she did, she invented the go home vans.

    Anyone in Scotland still supporting this Union? If you are, for shame. Utterly vile and disgusting, and Scotland will be properly fcked over, just as soon as we forget this bump in the road to Brexegeddon, and get back to laughing at the Labour party.

  122. Vestas says:

    The Telegraph is reporting @ 16:39 TankGirl saying :

    “State visits are designed for both the host, and the head of state who is being hosted, to celebrate and entrench the friendships and shared values between their respective countries.

    A state visit from the current president of the United States could not possibly occur in the best traditions of the enterprise while a cruel and divisive policy which discriminates against citizens of the host nation is in place.

    I hope President Trump immediately reconsiders his Muslim ban.”

    If that’s true then unionist or not – well said.

  123. Bill McLean says:

    Signed petition re Trump – now over 435,000. Sorry if this has been passed by the time I posted!

  124. John Edgar says:

    Now Ruth Davidson has joined the anti Trump fray calling for a ban on his state visit.
    Should she not stick to her “day job”? Or is she beginning to worry about the Tory image of being in a speshal relashunship with Trump? Of course, she never puts Tory it Conservative on any literature!
    Of course, if May personally was to contact Trump after their much “trumpeted ” meeting and put pressure on him over UK citizens with dual citizenship with the “banned” countries, it might jeopardise the great trade. deal promised by Trump who puts America first!!
    Amazing how in such a few hours the “success” of the visit goes wrong!!
    Nice to see the brittishers being wrong footed again. Trump might even extend ban and stringent criteria for entry to the brits and others next. Those who criticise him are deemed to be enemies and doomed. A new North Atlantic Wall on the USA’s eastern seaboard?

  125. misteralz says:

    Heedy @ 4:29

    The Netherlands is my home now and I can’t think of any good reason to move away. That’s such a good video as well. The alsfluitdijk isn’t far from me and it’s very impressive. One thing I’ve noticed is that talking about politics isn’t even remotely taboo, Geerts Wilders is hated roughly as much as Trump is and nobody believes that Scotland will be dragged out of the EU. Nobody.

  126. Brian Powell says:


    The Unionists and Trump do have shared values. Haven’t you read the article above?

  127. Luigi says:

    With a debate in WM now likely, the SNP should table a motion, condemning Trump’s (selective) muslim ban on US travel.

    Let’s see where all the yoon parties stand on this.

    For, Against or abstain?

    Watch em squirm. 🙂

  128. dakk says:

    Nice bit of Karma to see this BritNat Uncle Mohammed get hoisted by his own petard.


  129. yesindyref2 says:

    Ah well, Tweet from Ruth Davidson:

    State visits are designed for both the host, and the head of state who is being hosted to celebrate and entrench the friendships and shared values between their respective countries.
    “A state visit from the current President of the United States could not possibly occur in the best traditions of the enterprise while a cruel and divisive policy which discriminates against citizens of the host nation is in place.
    “I hope President Trump immediately reconsiders his Muslim ban.

  130. Luigi says:

    Oh Dear, TM’s wonderful PR trip to Trumpland seems to have backfired rather badly. If WM refuse a vote on condemning Trump’s muslim ban, then let’s have one at Holyrood.

    The yoons need to be pinned down on this.

    Table a motion and watch em squirm. 🙂

  131. Bill Hume says:

    Who’s this Pete fella? Have the unionists had to delegate troll work on this forum because they can’t keep up?

  132. Luigi says:

    Careful Ruthie,

    You could scupper the Brexit-Trump trade deal.

    If you believe sincerely what you tweeted, then you will have no qualms about embarassing your boss and voting for a Holyrood condemnation of the muslim ban? Right?


  133. robertknight says:

    Trump’s Bitch all over the place on this one, initially saying a matter for USDHS and Trump alone.

    Now on the wrong side of public opinion, yet again, scrambling around for a position she hopes the Tory dead tree scrolls can spin to her advantage.

    Ever get the feeling she’s not long for the job?

  134. Pete says:

    I think you might find that his popularity amongst the general public might rise.
    Just remember that posters on here have nowhere like the views of the mass of voters.
    A point we should remember for Indy ref 2.
    Most people, even those with left wing economic tendencies are socially right wing.
    Trump goes down well with a lot more than may be imagined.

  135. Valerie says:


    Don’t be naive about what Ruth is doing for ‘Big T’, she is out on recon for her masters voice. Testing the water, supplying a convenient hook.

    You know how they operate by now. No way would Ruth do that without London’s blessing, because if it was genuine, it would have been out there first crack of dawn.

  136. Dan Huil says:

    I don’t trust anything Davidson says and does. She’s a britnat; she’ll always put Westminster before Scotland.

  137. Gary45% says:

    A guy on ya tube saying Trumps reneged on the $221 million Obama was giving Palestine for humanitarian aid. The USA have given Israel an extra $43billion(mostly for defence),against what?? stones!
    so it looks like the Zionists are controlling the “Puppet”, then again his older kids are married to Zionists.
    Nothing like “Keeping it in the family” as they say in Red Neck county.
    Leader of the free world?
    Petition signed, pity it’s not banning him from entering UK/European airspace..

  138. Ian Brotherhood says:

    That petition is about to hit the half-million…

  139. ChewinTheFat says:

    So, immigration was only okay when Zahawi came over from Iraq to have the opportunity at a better life but it’s not okay now for some reason? This guy is an idiot and a complete hypocrite.

    Lol @ the no campaign and no voters, “concerned” that Scotland/SNP would make England “foreigners.” They use the word in such a harsh context and have turned the word into such a negative thing…

    BUT, the UK’s closest allies and closest “friends”, the great United States of America ban people from the UK who are Muslim, making Muslim British citizens “foreigners.” Why isn’t this being condemned as much as when they were condemning Yes voters/Scotland/SNP?

    The entire no campaign are complete hypocrites but of course, the hardcore no voters will still be in denial, making them even bigger hypocrites than the no campaign itself.

  140. yesindyref2 says:

    Yay! 500,000.

  141. Ian Brotherhood says:

    That’s the 500,000 mark passed – it took 11,861 signatures in the last 11 minutes.

  142. Dan Huil says:

    It’s okay folks, Boris Johnson is on the phone to Trump’s son-in-law as we type.

    Bwaa bwaa, now look here, bwaa bwaa, Churchill, bwaa bwaa, old chap, bwaa bwaa bwaa, Eton, bwaa bwaa bwaa, special re… Hello? Hello there? Bwaa!

  143. Undeadshaun says:

    Yup pete ignoring my accusation that he is a member of 77th, ergo he is a paid squaddie troll.

  144. Alibi says:

    Zahawi merits further investigation for other activities to enhance his wealth. Google his name and Gulf Keystone Petroleum. Serious suspicions that he has been complicit in activities that have cost a lot of small private investors a lot of money while earning him tens of thousands a month for doing nothing to benefit the company. Whiff of corruption around the whole thing.

  145. Undeadshaun says:

    Yup pete ignoring my accusation that he is member of 77th, ergo he is a paid squaddie troll.

  146. Reluctant Nationalist says:

    @ Gary45%

    Like all presidents he’s certainly a puppet (and the least convincing one yet), but I doubt Zionists are the master. Just business as usual. Quid pro quo.

    Are you sure it’s an extra $43 billion, and not just that as the total annual ‘gift’?

  147. Lenny Hartley says:

    merkel has to explain Geneva Convention on phone to Trump. I’m speechless

    See BBC reporting shortbread headlined the Fundraiser to get the Glasgow Yooni Vet back from Costa Rica no mention of who organised and photo of fundraising page cropped so you could not see the words Women for Independence.

  148. Robert Kerr says:

    Will the petition hit 1000000 before midnight?

    What shall Wee Nicola say to Teresa tomorrow at Cardiff meet-up?

  149. geeo says:

    SIR Mo Farah is on a training camp in Ethiopia, has lived in ‘murica for 6 years.

    Born in Somalia.

    Currently trying to find out if he can get home to see his children.

    Theresa May….”American immigration policy is America’s business..”

    Must be a comfort to Mo Farah’s wife and kids.

  150. galamcennalath says:

    Conservatives tweek “Support for another referendum on independence prior to Brexit has fallen to just 27%“. From a Sunday Times poll.

    These polls are just conducted to get propaganda fodder.

    If someone polled me and asked, “Should IndyRef2 occur before Brexit?”, right now, I wouldn’t have a clue what to say. It depends on so many things which have still to happen.

    If the question was, “If you knew that the Scottish offers of compromise had been rejected and Brexit was going to be hard, should IndyRef2 occur before Brexit?”, then my answer would be, “definitely”.

    If the question was, “If you knew that the Scottish offers of compromise had been rejected, Brexit was going to be hard, and the EU had given no promises of membership, should IndyRef2 occur before Brexit?”, then my answer would be, “probably”.

    If Brexit is an unlikely soft, then the case for IndRef2 may disappear for the immediate future.

    If the EU were to make offers of continued membership, and perhaps financial assistance for the new state, and Brexit was squaring up to be awful, I would say, “ASAP”.

    Now, that was all about timing. I am a YES under all circumstances. However, many folks will be YeS or NO, as these different possibilities unfold.

    Questions, with background scenarios, are just mischief making!

  151. yesindyref2 says:

    Woudln’t surprise me if the epetitions website is working at full cpacity, as it’s still at the rate of 1,300 per minute and 78,000 an hour. If it was enhanced since 7 months ago, I’d guess it’s on 2 different servers, one to service the front-end webpage, and another to chuck out confirmation emails and process the returns.

    The epetitions website crashed 7 months ago.

  152. geeo says:

    534,586 @ 6.46pm

  153. Nana says:

    Governor of Washington @GovInslee delivers speech at Seattle Airport gate on Trump refugee ban

  154. yesindyref2 says:

    @Robert Kerr
    If it is working at full capacity it would be short of the million, maybe 950,000, if people kept trying. On the other hand it could be the count catching up.

  155. Ruby says:

    I’ve just been reading a review of the film ‘Loving’ The way things are going I wouldn’t be surprised if Trump re-introduced the the ‘anti-miscegenation law’.

  156. gus1940 says:

    WE are continually bombarded with the ‘fact’ that TRump is a Billionaire.

    While the total assets of the spider web of multiple assorted enterprises to which his n ame is attached may exceed $1Billion nobody ever asks what the liabilities.

    I suspect that he is sitting on a pretty large debt mountain.

    Just what are the borrowings of his empire?

    I don’t know how much he has ‘Invested’ in his Menie Golf Project but he boasted of a $200 Million investment at Turnberry.

    Are we supposed to think that he just put his hand in his back pocket for that lot or is the whole thing being financed by borrowing.

    Is it not time that somebody did a bit of investigation and established his net worth.

  157. HandandShrimp says:


    That poll concludes concludes that there has small increase in support for independence to 46%. They are looking specifically at a snap poll the preempts what Brexit means. No one is suggesting that and Nicola has all but ruled it out but the Conservatives spin that small part of the data-set to make it look like no one is interested. The actual independence question makes it quite clear that the gains of the 2012-2014 campaign far from dissipating are still edging upwards. That is what frightens them. They know it is still in the balance and they could lose. Hence the desperate demands to rule out another vote.

  158. Ruby says:

    Very bad timing on the part of Theresa May to plan her trip to HeilTrumpland on the day he introduced the ban on Muslims entering the USA.

  159. Stu Mac says:


    We don’t: a corrupt and failing electoral system and a corrupt political class are what allow those people to control our lives.

  160. Dan Huil says:

    Most of you have probably seen this recent poll but for those who haven’t:

  161. Stu Mac says:

    @Stu Mac

    Oh and a corrupt and biased MSM as well.

  162. Cactus says:

    A can of worms..?

    Aye, mibbies more like a can of elephants.

    Guid luck wae putting them back in their can, ssson.

    Mon the petition!

  163. Liz Rannoch says:

    @ galamcennalath 6.47

    WoS said that in the 10th paragraph it states that Yes is at 46% although panelbase haven’t published yet.

    I think all this Trump/Mayhem stuff is distracting and Brexit is fine as far as it goes but, I feel we should never let it be forgotten what the Tories are actually doing to us. People can get forgetful/accepting of a ‘little bit here and a little bit there’ stealth stuff.

    However, a bit of good news? Hopefully. Maybe somebody could archive I don’t know how to sorry.

  164. gus1940 says:

    If the Trump visit does go ahead I presume that as usual with such visits there will be a spectacular State Banquet at Buck House with all the usual suspects in attendance.

    I look forward to seeing Trump sitting beside Betty while Phil sits beside and ogles Melania. The expression on Betty’s face will be interesting to see.

    Such an occasion will be a wonderful opportunity for a massive protest demonstration in front of Buck House and stretching back along The Mall.

  165. Undeadshaun says:

    Russian spy who leaked details on trump video found dead in car

    Donald trumps advisors don’t believe him on russia and sitting in on phone calls

    Rogue potus staff twitter leaking staff before its announced

  166. heedtracker says:

    Heil Farage. Well its Eddie Hitler now. They don’t seem like that monicar UKIPers, so how about Eggie Jitler.

  167. JLT says:

    Very bad timing on the part of Theresa May to plan her trip to…

    Actually it’s not if you believe in the old saying, that ‘those the Gods wish to destroy, they first make mad’

    For Theresa, her career, her ‘Global Britain’ brand, her US Trade Deal are all going up in flames.

    And waiting in the wings waiting for a quiet word – The Queen, the EU, half the UK electorate, Nicola Sturgeon… LOL. It’s f***** priceless!

    And what is she suggesting to do to solve this mess? She’s sending Boris and Amber Rudd to speak to US delegates to ask for British citizens to be made exempt from the exclusion! Seriously WTF …LOL!!

    Talk about digging a hole. Theresa’s not using a spade; she’s using a JCB. What she is proposing means that she STILL ACCEPTS Trumps controversial decision. It means that she is bricking it big time in so many ways as it must mean that everything hinges on this US trade deal. If the UK electorate win, and Trump gets barred from meeting the Queen (or even coming to the UK – he may just take the huff), then that’s the end of the UK-US trade deal. That leaves Theresa with nothing …nada …hee-haw. She’ll be at the absolute mercy of the EU, who will no doubt, be very, very angry with the UK’s actions since her ‘Hard Brexit’ announcement just under 2 weeks ago. Hard Brexit …get ready for ‘Iron Brexit’. They will throw the kitchen sink at the UK if it has nothing as a backup plan. If ever the EU wanted to show its citizens the consequences of leaving the EU …then it will make a severe example of the UK. What perfect timing!

    This is her 3rd mistake on the trot on this matter! She is going to get flayed for this by the International Community. I can’t recall of ever seeing a politician creating as many mistakes in just one day!

  168. galamcennalath says:

    Liz Rannoch says:

    Maybe somebody could archive I don’t know how to sorry.

    Theresa May’s planned laws for countering extremism and terrorism are close to being shelved because the proposed legislation has failed to provide a clear definition of the problem it is intended to address.

  169. Stoker says:

    WOS archive links for the remainder of April 2013 now over on O/T.

  170. K1 says:

    Undeadshaun, this is getting really interesting now…roguepotustaff seems to be being treated as a legitimate ‘source’…they’ve ‘scolded Louise Mensch’ claiming she just wants their ‘ID’s’ confirmed. If there is half a truth about Trump being blackmailed, ye gotta figure that dossier is legitimate. Very strange going’s on behind the scenes in the Whitehouse.

    At least we can take some comfort that there seem to be many more than may appear on the face of it, within the WH who are seriously concerned about what he’s doing?

    I’ll be keeping an eye on that rpotusstaff account, cheers for the link.

  171. ian m says:

    Trump has implemented a policy that he promised during the campaign.He has kept his promise.
    Calling him names and signing a petition may make some people feel better but over 62 million Americans supported him.
    Lots of weeping and wailing but in due time things will ease off

  172. Liz Rannoch says:

    Thanks a lot galamcennalath.

    Petition now 601908.

  173. galamcennalath says:

    geeo says:

    534,586 @ 6.46pm

    601,550 @7:46pm

  174. crazycat says:

    @ Liz Rannoch

    To archive (on a PC – don’t know if this works with phones):

    Go to
    Instead of copying the URL of your article here, copy it into the box on
    Click “save the page”
    The article will load, and a new URL will be generated within
    For your link, this is

    Your link is to a page of articles about terrorism, though; archiving the specific one about Theresa’s bill generates

    (This happens automatically after clicking on the article within the archived version of the whole page, no need return to the Guardian. In fact, I never went directly to the G at all, just copied from your post.)

    I believe that if someone else later tries to archive a more recent version of the same article, a new archive number will overwrite the first one (after a warning). There is an alternative version of the archive site that preserves older archiving, but I cannot remember what it is; no doubt someone else will enlighten us!

  175. K1 says:

    Watch and learn ian m. Watch and learn.

  176. crazycat says:

    @ Liz Rannoch

    As I expected while writing such a screed, galamcennelath got there first (in terms of generating the link).

    Maybe that’s why it appeared when I clicked the article! I assumed it was automatic, but perhaps it only happened because of his earlier action. That would make more sense; usually if you click on an archived article you are taken back to the source website.

  177. Liz Rannoch says:

    Post hasn’t appeared so I’ll try again.

    Thanks a lot galamcennalath.

    Petition now 608937

  178. Gary45% says:

    Ian m@7.40
    I think even the most ardent red neck banjo players will be pretty disgusted with Trump, (well some) he may be implementing policies, but it’s the way he is “doing business” that’s the problem.
    Treating the world like a TV game show is not the way to go about it.
    What threat will he impose regarding the off shore wind farm off the Menie coast line.

  179. Liz Rannoch says:

    me @ 7.52 Patience woman, patience.

    @ galamcennalath & crazycat my hand swooshes over my head. I’ll read another 1/2 dozen times and then try it! Thanks.

  180. Sandy says:

    Notice Aberdeen football club are anxious not to lose their excellent right winger, Johnny Hayes. Should they do so, then they have a plethora of candidates locally from which to choose, going by the correspondents on the letters page of Saturday’s P&J. Only problem is that they must have excellent skills, be part of a team that benefits from sharing, being unselfish, & most of all, fitting in with aims of the vast majority who are somewhat forward thinking & striving for success. (Ref: SG & WM elections).
    On second thoughts, forget it. Hold on to Hayes.

  181. Ruby says:

    JLT says:
    29 January, 2017 at 7:33 pm
    Very bad timing on the part of Theresa May to plan her trip to…

    Actually it’s not if you believe in the old saying, that ‘those the Gods wish to destroy, they first make mad’

    Ruby replies

    I should perhaps have put a 🙂 after my remark about bad timing.

  182. heedtracker says:

    misteralz says:
    29 January, 2017 at 5:27 pm
    Heedy @ 4:29

    Totally love Holland. Completely glorious country. Huge Dutch influx to Aberdeen with Shell, really special people. If Scotland can become anything like the Netherlands, in the next 25 years…

    Another tory BBC grotesque, watching them trying to Farage a beo fascist scumbag like Geerts Wilders. Really twisted tories running the BBC now. Even C4 news gits do it. BetterTogether fascism basically.

  183. Ruby says:

    The question I have re all these world trade deals is what is it the RUK sell to the rest of the world?

  184. Pete says:

    Ian m
    At last, somebody with some sense.
    I suppose we are so used to politicians prevaricating that we can’t get used to someone doing what they said.
    The reason folks in Scotland are not keen on another referendum is that NS keeps threatening but does nothing about it.
    Eventually, she will lose all credibility.
    She should take a leaf out of Trump’s book and put up or shut up!!

  185. frogesque says:

    628,245 signed!

  186. Lenny Hartley says:

    Ruby, Whisky,Gin Oil and Gas, Shellfish

  187. heedtracker says:

    Pete says:
    29 January, 2017 at 4:39 pm
    Whichever way you look at it Trump won the election under the US rules fair and square.

    Without causing you to have more kittens with your trollshmanship, the west is still democratic and everyone has the absolute to criticise Heil Trump, right from the get go.

    Cant be any more straight forward Pete.

  188. heedtracker says:

    The reason folks in Scotland are not keen on another referendum is that NS keeps threatening but does nothing about it.
    Eventually, she will lose all credibility.
    She should take a leaf out of Trump’s book and put up or shut up!!

    Very poor trollsmanship Pete. Folks in Scotland are very keen on another referendum, which is why yoon culture is screaming, not another referendum.

  189. Legerwood says:

    Lenny Hartley says:
    29 January, 2017 at 6:28 pm

    “”merkel has to explain Geneva Convention on phone to Trump. I’m speechless””

    I hope it was a video link because she probably had to draw pictures to get him to understand it.

  190. Ruby says:

    Lenny Hartley says:
    29 January, 2017 at 8:13 pm
    Ruby, Whisky,Gin Oil and Gas, Shellfish

    Ruby replies

    Are you winding me up Lenny?

  191. Glesca Keelie says:

    Don’t you worry, Pete.
    It’s coming yet, for a’ that

  192. Ruby says:

    If 46% of voters want Independence how can Unionists claim nobody wants a 2nd IndyRef.

    I think it’s time to let all Unionist uttering go in one ear and out the other.

  193. bobajock says:


    Pulled that into focus. Clarity.

    Rev – Thanks.

  194. heedtracker says:

    Ruby says:
    29 January, 2017 at 8:26 pm
    If 46% of voters want Independence how can Unionists claim nobody wants a 2nd IndyRef.

    Good question, where’s Pete right the now?

  195. heedtracker says:

    ian m says:
    29 January, 2017 at 7:40 pm
    Trump has implemented a policy that he promised during the campaign.He has kept his promise.
    Calling him names and signing a petition may make some people feel better but over 62 million Americans supported him.
    Lots of weeping and wailing but in due time things will ease off

    Problem with that load of shite, he’s selective on which Muslims he lets in, which is just the start of how much of a bawbag Heil Trump is.

    But wait, its OK, Heil Trump’s decided British Muslims are nice, again.

    Boris Johnson ?@BorisJohnson 8m8 minutes ago
    Statement on what the Presidential exec order on inbound migration to US means to Brit nationals/dual nationals.

    BoJO to the rescue.

  196. DerekM says:

    Support for another referendum on independence prior to Brexit has fallen to just 27%

    That is a bit of a skewed poll is it not asking about prior to Brexit,i bet the tories had hoped it would come in higher than that,its a trick question in that you do not get a definition of what they mean by prior to brexit,before A50 is signed or after,since most Scots understand that A50 must take place first before brexit can happen.

    I have noticed they do not want to split the two and only use brexit.

    I wonder what response you would get for after A50 is signed.

    Never forget that right now at this very moment is the best time for the yoons to have indyref2,the best time for us to have it is after A50 is signed.

    Its a double faced strategy if they can get us to have indyref2 before A50 they can use indyref2 to kick A50 into the long grass by claiming an internal constitutional referendum keeping the EU out of it,this we can not let happen or we will be robbed they have no other option but to try they are in too deep.

    So no matter how much they poke you or scream have indyref2 now in your face just laugh at them and say after your boss signs A50 eejit.

  197. yesindyref2 says:

    Patience Pete, patience. I know from your previous postings you’re desperate to escape the 77th and move to Scotland to get a real job and escape the ravages of May, but you’ll just have to wait a bit longer.

  198. Ruby says:

    The claim being made by Nadin Zahani isn’t that he has dual nationality but that he is being banned because he was born in Iraq.

  199. Valerie says:

    Petition at 666k, the number of the beast!!!!

    Amazing watching it spin up like a one armed bandit.

  200. Alan Mackintosh says:

    Hey Wingers, looking for a post on here, a few months back, maybe Sept or Oct. Was about the jews being rounded up on the channel islands and handed over to the nazis, with “bobbies” doing the work.

    Have tried searching using terms “channel islands”, “jews”, “police”, etc but cant seem to find the post. Any one remember it?

  201. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    Hi yesindyref2 at 4:39 pm.

    “Remembered that wrong, it is of course:

    “They want you, they want you
    They want you as a new recruit“”

    I guess you’re alluding to this ‘classic of its genre’, or umma wrang?

  202. Robert Kerr says:

    Pete will be at the NAAFI canteen for his tea break.

    He’ll be back.

    Patience for us and him

  203. Clapper57 says:

    Oh my giddy feckin aunt…..pity that ‘special’ relationship forgot to add The Donald into the equation.

    It is not so much that they are all QUEUING UP … do deals ……more like they are all feckin DOUBLING UP…..with laughter…… Lol

    Jeezo how daft would the people of Europe be NOT to be inspired to follow the same path as Brexit & Trumperica…..cause what the feck do they have to lose ? Why I cannot even contemplate them NOT considering this is the best option for them…..I mean look how well it is going for Brexit & Trumperica.

    Please pretty please people in Europe (France,Germany & Netherlands) restore my faith and please choose wisely………….GIRFU …………when you vote this year.

  204. heedtracker says:

    Ruby, Heil Trump’s no like Iraq Islam. Saudi Islam nice, some are nice, some are not, it depends really, on where the Pres business interests lie.

    But business is business.

  205. Robeet J. Sutherland says:

    ian m @ 19:40

    Lots of weeping and wailing but in due time things will ease off

    …but in due time things will just get worse and worse, more like.

    Maybe you’re referring to Trump’s worst-ever approval ratings after just one week on the job. (Heading south towards half of Obama’s after 8 full years?) Hard to get worse, true, but I’m sure he’s tryin’.

    What’s the current betting odds of Trump’s impeachment or other “early retiral”, eh?

    As for the leader article, a fine illustration of another wise old saying: “what goes around comes around”.

    We just have to get out of “51st-statist” England before that comes around. (Secretly lusted after by all those who claimed to be against a federal union, duh!) Or out before we get sucked into TTIP-on-steroids via one of Trump’s bilateral “special relationships”!

  206. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    ian m @ 19:40

    Lots of weeping and wailing but in due time things will ease off

    …but in due time things will just get worse, more like.

    Maybe you’re referring to Trump’s worst-ever approval ratings after just one week on the job. (Heading south towards half of Obama’s after 8 full years?) Hard to get worse, true, but I’m sure he’s tryin’.

    What’s the current betting odds of Trump’s impeachment or other “early retiral”, eh?

    As for the leader article, a fine illustration of another wise old saying: “what goes around comes around”.

    We just have to get out of “51st-statist” England before that comes around. (Secretly lusted after by all those who claimed to be against a federal union, duh!) Or out before we get sucked into TTIP-on-steroids via one of Trump’s bilateral “special relationships”!

  207. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    Hi Alan Mackintosh at 8:50 pm.

    You typed,
    “Hey Wingers, looking for a post on here, a few months back, maybe Sept or Oct. Was about the jews being rounded up on the channel islands and handed over to the nazis, with “bobbies” doing the work.”

    Is this what you seek?

  208. Anne Bruce says:

    Alan Mackintosh

    Try November 13, 2016. An article called “In Remembrance” might be the one you’re looking for.

  209. yesindyref2 says:

    LOL. I guess it depends whether he’s in the Brownies, or the Navy or just one of the village people.

    Can we adopt him, please? As our mascot? Poor lad will get cold when they kick him out the barracks.

  210. Lenny Hartley says:

    The White House Staff rogue Twitter account has these on the Mayhem’s visit saying Trump said
    “I hope she likes us, but she doesn’t have much to offer”
    “she does what we want, or we go somewhere else”

    Some special relationship eh?

  211. ian m says:

    The US has been badly run for decades.It is filled with corruption and influence pedaling.It needs a non politician to clean it up.
    Trump is not a politician and sees this in a very black and white situation again he is not politically sensitive

    Pete, the reason Nicola has not called a 2nd Indy ref is because she wants to establish that Scotland has exhausted every avenue until there are no more options left.
    She will make the call when she has to and TM will have forced Indyref2 on Scotland so no moral high ground for Westminster.
    She knows better than us how to set the table for success

  212. Ruby says:

    Alan Mackintosh says:
    29 January, 2017 at 8:50 pm
    Hey Wingers, looking for a post on here, a few months back, maybe Sept or Oct. Was about the jews being rounded up on the channel islands and handed over to the nazis, with “bobbies” doing the work.

    Ruby replies

    Is this what you are looking for?

  213. Lenny Hartley says:

    Ruby it was a serious answer to a serious question 🙂 can’t think of anything else the USA would want from the UK , they ain’t bought anything military since we flogged the Harrier jump jets to them on the cheap, which we might have to buy back as it looks like Trump might cancel the F35 , as he said according to the leaked tweets “she doesn’t have much to offer”

  214. Ruby says:

    Alan Mackintosh says:
    29 January, 2017 at 8:50 pm

    Have tried searching using terms “channel islands”, “jews”, “police”, etc but cant seem to find the post. Any one remember

    Ruby replies

    Lots of replies to your post with me coming last. Just incase you are interested this is the search term I used in Google:

    site: channel island police arrest jews

  215. ian m says:

    Trump’s executive order halts visas for 90 days for “immigrants and non-immigrants” from Syria, Somalia, Sudan, Libya, Yemen, Iran, and Iraq. The executive order further suspended the entry of all refugees for 120 days, indefinitely blocks Syrian refugees from entering and lowers the ceiling to 50,000 for refugees allowed to enter the U.S. during Fiscal Year 2017.

    In 2011 Barrack Obamma suspended immigration from Iraq for 6 MONTHS

    Funny I do not remember reading about that ???? or a petition ?

  216. Ian Brotherhood says:

    If Trump gets his State Visit, it could be a quick and unusual one.

    They’ll Air-Force-One him into Balmoral (by parachute if necessary), give him a round of golf, a venison dinner, then haul his big orange ass back out asap.

    No fucking way will they risk a gig at Buck House.

    The crowd that gathered there after Diana’s death spooked them more than enough – they can’t, and won’t be able to, police the hundreds of thousands who’ll turn up to ‘welcome’ Trump.

  217. heedtracker says:

    Nigel Farage Retweeted
    Alex Jones ?@RealAlexJones 3h3 hours ago
    Farage: Trump Elected to Protect America From ISIS … @DRUDGE #tcot #Trump Not a #MuslimBan

    Why would the UKOK freak show leave out the fact that it was Bush and his UK grovellers, that created ISIS?

    Now watch this drive.

  218. Ruby says:

    Lenny Hartley says:
    29 January, 2017 at 9:13 pm
    Ruby it was a serious answer to a serious question ? can’t think of anything else the USA would want from the UK

    Ruby replies

    My question was re exports from RUK! Do they make whisky in the RUK? 🙂

    I know about the jam & biscuits!

  219. heedtracker says:


    They like British cars, Range Rovers, Jags. All owned by foreigners, Tata of India. Hope they’re not Muslims.

  220. Alan Mackintosh says:

    Something occurred to me regarding the list of countries. From memory they are the ones listed in the Project for the New American Century, PNAC, which was the blueprint for the destabilisation of the middle east and its reconstruction-by- design of the US neo-cons.

  221. DerekM says:

    For some reason i suddenly remembered this youtube video,now its a bit conspiracy theory you can make of it what you will,its the information about the past and the players that will shock you.

    Lets just say you will not get this in any school history class.

    lol yes its 3 hours long

  222. Ian Brotherhood says:

    The rate of signatories for this petition doesn’t seem to be slowing.

    Astonishing stuff.

    Aye, okay, we’ve all heard it, and loads of us have said it, that polls and petitions make no difference in the end-up, but this?

    It must ‘mean’ something, surely?

  223. davidb says:

    @ Ruby.


    A number of prominent Indian business people are I believe, descendants of Persian Zoroastrians who settled in India several hundred years ago.

  224. Thepnr says:

    Check out this Zahawi quote from the Andrew Marr show today talking of the Trump ban.

    “For the first time in my life, last night, I felt discriminated against,” Zahawi said. “It’s demeaning. It’s sad.”

    This creature is a despicable hypocrite.

  225. Lenny Hartley says:

    Ruby, sorry never seen the R, thought you were meaning the UK as it is currently unwritten constituted,

  226. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @DerekM –


    Seriously man, I guessed what video it was before I clicked the link – you mentioning the length of it was the clue.

    Yeah, it’s soo-perb, esp the JFK stuff, had never seen that before.

    I’m well past the point of caring whether or not anyone decries me as a ‘conspiracy theorist’, and anyone who really believes they know it all about recent history ought to at least watch that before flinging such insults around.

    Great link, and I hope some will watch it.

  227. Legerwood says:

    Ruby @ 9.26 pm

    Seems they do, or will soon, make whisky in rUK

  228. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Alan Mackintosh –

    Great to see you commenting again.

    For all I know you may have been doing so every day, but I haven’t been around much so I would’ve missed it.

    Anyway, I do believe you’re right about the PNAC stuff. That was their master plan. Mibbes it’s taking them a bit longer than they thought, but they’re still well on the way to destroying the ‘Middle East’ as we currently know it.

    ‘From the Nile to the Euphrates’, eh?

    Well, even if they do get that, you really have to wonder if they’ll ever be content to let anyone live in peace.

  229. Alan Mackintosh says:

    BrianDTT, Anne, Ruby, many thanks! Ask and ye shall receive…

  230. yesindyref2 says:

    @Ian B
    Could still make 900,000 by midnight.

  231. Stoker says:

    Two hours to midnight, will it reach the magnificent seven? (1m).

    Folks, if you click on the link then scroll down a wee bit and click on the ‘view map’ you can move your curser thingy around over the map and reveal some interesting statistics. I think a certain part of Edinburgh is leading the race in Scotland? 🙂

  232. Capella says:

    @ Ruby – The UK is the 2nd biggest exporter of weapons AFAIK. BAe Systems and subsiduaries of Raytheon etc export to tinpot despots all over the world (Saudi, Israel etc) It’s the perfect commodity after all. It is routinely blown up and has to be replaced or “updated” like Microsoft products.

    Also, chemicals are very lucrative, ICI, Pfizer and others. And don’t forget Pilkington glass (Liverpool). Does Sheffield still make steel goods? Do we still make leg irons for the Middle East market?

  233. Stoker says:

    Sorry, folks, you need to click on the link then click on the ‘Show on a map’ facility, not as previously stated ‘view map’.

  234. Alan Mackintosh says:

    Ian B, aye I’m here, lurking mostly. Occasionaly add my tuppence worth. Saw you at Glasgow green but was wings stall was too busy to say hello.

    Re PNAC, Syria certainly didnt go to plan, thanks to Vlad…

  235. Graeme McCormick says:

    I think signing the petition is counterproductive. Instead if he comes let’s have the biggest demonstration against Trump here in Scotland.

    As for Theresa May , it’s only a matter of time before she flies to Harare for a trade deal with Mugabe. She could include the stopover on her way to North Korea

  236. Roughian says:

    10 o’clock news petition has reached 1/2 million. At 10.07 it’s over 750,000. Accurate reporting again.

  237. Ealasaid says:

    I have been trying to sign that petition for hours but keep getting ‘error 422 Sorry we could not do what you wanted. Please try again.’ Just too busy at the moment.

    Apart from the car manufacturing that will probably leave with Brexit, I think that England’s real main export is the arms trade including bombs, fighter planes etc. They did make passenger planes with France for a while but I think that has ended now.

  238. Stu Mac says:

    @JLT says:
    29 January, 2017 at 5:09 pm
    I’m just Royalist and no more (because I can’t abide the idea of a President Blair or Brown),

    I’ve seen that argument before and I can’t believe how folk that make it can’t see how stupid it is.

    If you don’t want a presidency because people might vote a politician you dislike into it then logically you should be against any democratically elected political position because there’s always a chance some numpty will get elected (though that reduces if you have a more sensible voting system and not FPTP or one of the more dodgy PR options).

    To say you’d rather keep unelected, for-life, royalty who help by just being there keep an antiquated, corrupt and undemocratic system alive (House of Lords, honours system, etc.) is doubly daft.

  239. Capella says:

    @ Ruby – how could I forget “Services”! We help people to hide their money in tax havens all over the world, Turks and Caicos, British Virgin Islands – basically, anywhere offshore. I think the plan is to turn London into a City State like Singapore with a vast hinterland draining revenues into it. The “Great Wen” as it was so appropriately called.

  240. Robert Peffers says:

    @Robert Kerr says: 29 January, 2017 at 8:51 pm:

    “Pete will be at the NAAFI canteen for his tea break.
    He’ll be back.
    Patience for us and him.”

    I’m pretty sure Pete is just a thick as a stack of four short planks numptie. Either that or he is under the impression that Wingers are. Even the 77th would not be so stupid as let a squaddie that thick onto Wings to get torn up for toilet paper.

    Only a total numptie would think that Nicola was just being inactive. Anyone with enough brain cells to cause synapsis knows that she would be nearly as stupid as Theresa May if she tried to hold a referendum before the English Government made the formal request for the, now so called, United Kingdom to exit.

    Let’s face it the daft English PM is that thick she thinks that Britain will be exiting the EU when she takes England out of Europe.

    I’m almost certain that, at very least, the only bit of Britain that will exit is, at worse, the UK bit. I cannot see Jersey, Guernsey or Man going with them and I’m certain the Republic will still remain in Europe.

    Anyone, except idiots, thus knows, “Brexit”, CANNOT mean, “British Exit”, as Ms May so stridently claims.

    Anyhow, the English Government is even not really the government of the United Kingdom even it the English Supreme Court has ruled it is. That, of course, gives Scotland, and the EU, the out they need.

    There is absolutely no way that the English can claim the United Kingdom is a country. It is titled United Kingdom and that is exactly what it is. Not only that but it is four countries – not one.

    The EU only needs to rule that the EU, “Member State”, is a bipartite union of kingdoms and one partner kingdom has voted not to leave but will remain as the legacy member state with only an appropriate change in the terms of member state to accommodate the difference in economic size.

    That requires the formal Article requesting the United Kingdom to leave before the EU will even consider discussing the matter. If May believes that they will just drop all EU business to accommodate a country or kingdom that wants to leave she is in for a shock.

    That will just be the start of her worries for the process will be dragged out as much as the EU can drag it out. Then the negotiations themselves will go on for years and no one else in the World will be daft enough to attempt to begin negotiating trade terms with a state that is in an uncertain situation. After which trade negotiations can take decades.

    Yet Pete thinks Nicola is daft enough to actually hold a referendum right now. Why would an astute lady like Nicola be stupid enough to play her Joker before the hands were dealt?

  241. JLT says:

    @Stu Mac
    I’ve seen that argument before and I can’t believe how folk that make it can’t see how stupid it is

    Your kind of missing the point. I’m happy enough to put up with the Royals until an independent Scotland finally has enough MP’s who are astute, have integrity and are extremely knowledgeable. Once we have a fair solid base, then I’m happy to switch to a Republic.

    What I would hate to see, is President Sturgeon get defeated in the second election of an Indy-Scotland, and be replaced by President Davidson …or worse President Dugdale.

    Hope that explains my position.

  242. ronnie anderson says:

    @ Ruglonian Im watching the Petition on & its gone past 772 thousand

  243. heedtracker says:

    Nice bity of the hourly BBC Scotland fraud on Scots,

    Fraud’s cooking this up begin SLab Ms Dugdale’s statement,

    Cuts to services

    She wrote: “Labour will table amendments to the SNP’s budget to stop, in full, the £327m cuts to local services like schools and care of the elderly, and to invest in our economy

    The fraud’s cooking this up begin SNP Mr Mackay’s statement,

    ‘Record investment’

    The budget bill was published on Friday as the formal legislative process got under way, and Mr Mackay described it as “a budget for growth and public services”

    Wonder why BBC Scotland gimps place inverted commas around their SNP intro and none round their SLab one? Is it to create some doubt’s perhaps, in the readers, that there is something wrong with the Mckay statement and that Dugdale’s is factual? Yes.

    It’s a subtle art destroying Scottish democracy, at the BBC. Well it gives me the creeps. The sleaze bags are such a drag sometimes.

  244. I am raging!!!!
    The BBC Scotland news covered the rescue of the Iranian Glasgow vet Hamesah Tayan from Trump’s airport lunacy by a crowdfunder started last night which collected quickly twice as much money as was needed. It managed to avoid mentioning that the crowdfunder was put up by Women For Independence and in fact in its coverage it even managed to make sure the Women for Independence logo was largely obscured.

  245. yesindyref2 says:

    As far as the monarchy thing is concerned, the Lords don’t have to go with it, you could just have a ceremonial monarchy which is basically what the UK has now anyway. And the thing is that brats though some of them might be, the family as whole is brought up on the idea of statesmanship and dignity – something to impress the tourists, and those who like a bit of pageantry colour occasionally (not so many in Scotland though).

    Whereas can you imagine Davidson indeed as President, doing Bake Off, President Frankie Boyle doing a stand-up, President Jackie Bird sulking at the SNP, President Ian Wood or even Pres K***n H***e? A Pres Trump lookalike, or even our own Pres Rev Stu?

    I don’t think so! I personally can’t think of one single person I’d want as President, even Sturgeon. So for me, I’ll stick with a Queen or King, though of course, there may be a hidden line of monarchs ready to spring up, secretly preparing in the Dordogne or Tuscany. Mmmm, perhaps I’m related …

  246. Luigi says:

    So Begging Boris manages to get a concession for UK muslims.

    Great news. Ah, so that makes it alright then! Face is saved. Rule Britania!

    “You see jocks, how much better together we are?”.

    Only the broad shoulders of the UK managed to get the trumpet to favour our muslims.

  247. heedtracker says:

    Tory The Guardian piles in behind Heil Teresa. Only our chums in the south can print “PM makes instruction” with a straight face, very stateman/woman like of them. What next, Teresa makes peepee?

    Donald Trump

    May tells ministers to raise travel ban with their US counterparts

    PM makes instruction to Boris Johnson and Amber Rudd as she faces pressure to cancel Donald Trump’s state visit

  248. DerekM says:

    @ Ian Brotherhood

    Yea i think he nails it at least 90% all the WW2 stuff makes you think especially when you see the families involved.

  249. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Dave McEwan Hill –

    It’s understandable that you’re angry, but hey, if you hadn’t picked-up on that broadcast then many of us would never know anything about it.

    That’s why we’ll win in the end – the accumulation of small important details will do for the Yoons as they can only deal in crude broad-stroke fearmongering. Death by a thousand wee toty cuts type of thing…

    More power to ye brother, as aye.

  250. yesindyref2 says:

    Mmm, I name this Ship King YesIndyRef2 and God help all who sail in her.

    I can do this thing!

  251. Hamish100 says:

    Dave McEwan Hill

    What the BBC is impartial!

    Actually since the new person has taken charge of BBC Scotland the anti indy and snp stance has increased.
    There is clearly a concerted attempt to manage the news from a pro union brexit perspective. But your right Dave to be angered by such bias.

  252. heedtracker says:

    Fourth party LibDems get a Graun mention on Heil Trump, usual complete black out on anything third party SNP. Clearly rancid ‘s last Scots readers dont want to know what their elected reps are doping.

    “With Tim Farron, the Liberal Democrat leader, also calling for the state visit to be cancelled,”

  253. yesindyref2 says:

    Hell with smashing the bottle though, what a waste 🙁

  254. Meindevon says:

    Legerwood @9.50

    Aye you’re not wrong. I drive past that building often. It’s pretty small. Doubt it’ll be much of a threat to the Scotch trade. Still, wondering if sabotage is called for? 😉

  255. galamcennalath says:

    Luigi says:

    Only the broad shoulders of the UK managed to get the trumpet to favour our muslims.

    And how does the rest of the world, who are busy criticising Trump, see the UK’s antics?

    “broad shoulders’? More like ‘brown nose’!

    Our European friends always saw the UKOK as a bit of an American Trojan Horse in the EU. They will be glad to wheel it back outside the gates.

  256. ronnie anderson says:

    Petition now past 806 thousand

  257. Andrew McLean says:

    It’s funny , I was a Burns supper a few days ago, and a funny thought struck me, my heritage, my sense of place, my family history, is Scotland, but that’s nothing!

    What makes me part of this country is a tradition of understanding what it is to be a Scotsman, that though century’s divide us, and our common language has evolved, we have the understanding that, a King is only a King if we say he is, and although that power once kept in the clan system has by blood and sacrifice transferred to us, jock tamsons bairns, and we not wishing to keep a good idea to ourselves say, from hundred a year, it’s coming yet for all that, that all men are brothers.

    And if all men are brothers what need of kings?

    I have more in common with a man from Iraq or Iran who wants to make a better world than any man who only is interested in petty vested interest, or like the new labour or new conservative no surrender, what’s in it for me, me,me, me me me!

    Immigrant? That’s your fear, oh poor fool, fear not the immigrant, rather fear the ignorant, the racist, the fascist, the nazi’ give them no power, because, when they have disposed of your enemy, then you are next, you see you are a reminder of their inadequacy, they needed arses like you to get power!

  258. Legerwood says:

    Meindevon says:
    29 January, 2017 at 10:51 pm
    Legerwood @9.50

    “”Aye you’re not wrong. I drive past that building often. It’s pretty small. Doubt it’ll be much of a threat to the Scotch trade. Still, wondering if sabotage is called for? ?””

    I don’t think you need to consider sabotage. The locals are objecting to it because they think it looks ‘too Scottish’!

  259. Legerwood says:

    Meindevon says:
    29 January, 2017 at 10:51 pm
    Legerwood @9.50

    “”Aye you’re not wrong. I drive past that building often. It’s pretty small. Doubt it’ll be much of a threat to the Scotch trade. Still, wondering if sabotage is called for? ?””

    I don’t think you need to consider sabotage. The locals are objecting to it because they think it looks ‘too Scottish’!

  260. heedtracker says:

    Ruth Davidson, Facbook.

    9 hrs ·
    Support for another referendum on independence prior to Brexit has fallen to just 27%.

    Nicola Sturgeon should now act on behalf of all of Scotland, not just the SNP, by ditching her unwanted and unnecessary plans.

    SHARE to let friends know.

    Working class tories are even weirder than the posh ones.

  261. Ken500 says:

    Zahawi is a tax evading criminal. He did not declare £25Million in offshore interests, in the Westminster register of interest. Does he want to go to the States to mansge or recover the funds? They are all in it. Farague. Trying to illegal embezzle public funds and launder them through illegal secret offshore accounts.

    He is a total liar. He should be put in jail.

    Wait until Brexit when they are all banned from travelling freely to and through Europe. They will be jumping up and down indignant.

    Scotland had better be out of the corrupt and unequal UK Union before they start the negotiation rammy. These Tories will sell Scotland down the swanney. These Tories think folk in Scotland came up the Clyde in a banana boat. Boot on the other foot. Boot them out. Trump will swallow them up and spit them out.

    Scotland gains much more from EU trade, EU Grants, investment from the ECB, shared Defence costs and foreign trade, than any trade in the UK. Westminster Treasury false accounting.

    If people have to change travel arrangements for three month. The illegal wars killing and maiming of millions of innocent people will be stopped.

  262. Alan Mackintosh says:

    Seems my memory still functions. Knew that list of countries was familiar.

    “We’re going to take out seven countries in 5 years, starting with Iraq, and then Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and, finishing off, Iran” –

    General Wesley Clark. Retired 4-star U.S. Army general, (Supreme Allied Commander of NATO during the 1999 War on Yugoslavia) .

  263. Lenny Hartley says:

    Ian Brotherhood @ 1046, think I’ll stop posting obviously nobody is reading my shite!

    Lenny Hartley says:
    29 January, 2017 at 6:28 pm
    merkel has to explain Geneva Convention on phone to Trump. I’m speechless

    See BBC reporting shortbread headlined the Fundraiser to get the Glasgow Yooni Vet back from Costa Rica no mention of who organised and photo of fundraising page cropped so you could not see the words Women for Independence.

  264. Rock says:

    Dan Huil,

    “England can brown-nose Trump if it wants. I can’t see most European nations doing the same as England.”

    They all will.

    With the exception of Iceland.

  265. David Patrick says:

    Theresa May’s USA foreign policy:

    First to pay homage, last to condemn.

  266. heedtracker says:

    The ACLU is getting “multiple reports” that federal customs agents are siding with President Trump — and willfully ignoring a Brooklyn federal judge’s demand that travelers from seven Muslim countries not be deported from the nation’s airports.

    Heil Trump.

  267. crazycat says:

    @ Lenny Hartley

    I noticed that you’d already mentioned it 🙂

  268. Cactus says:

    Good tae see ye posting of recent Tjenny..

    ‘You touch my fingertips.. and my heart is a glow..’ 😉

    Everybuddies coming back, Yes!

    As the story goes, time catches up..

    Excellent, it’s time and it has begun again.


  269. Cactus says:

    What shores..?

    I’ll go for a Bheghuinaghain please..

    Whisky.. nae bother doll.

    I’m frae Glasgow.

  270. heedtracker says:

    Dave McEwan Hill says:
    29 January, 2017 at 10:38 pm
    I am raging!!!!

    Don’t get mad Dave…

  271. Gary45% says:

    Israel has been doing this to Palestine, so it’s great to see a Tory getting some persecution.
    The Tories went to Israel last summer and simply ignored the plight of the Palestinians (you tube Palestine occupation) you might get some insight to what Trump is planning for the world.
    Thanks for the info regarding the “all new EBC in Scotchland” sounds like it is still the same shite.

  272. Andrew McLean says:

    Funny first time I actual understand your post!

    Yes it’s starting!

  273. Ken500 says:

    Labour up to more nonsense. Give it a rest. 3rd rate losers.They are just not up to it. Pathetic time wasting. Not fit for public office.

    ACC Unionists has squandered £Millions alone. £100Million on the grotesque carbuncle ruining the City centre. Causing traffic chaos and congestion. More debt.Refused a Gift to pedestrianise the City Centre and make a walkway. Supported by the majority. £Millions cancelled on the planned Community Football stadium.. Spend 3 years and £30Million vandalising the Art Gallery. Spent £20Million on a bridge to nowhere. Over £340Million wasted, Against the majority wishes and the public interest.

    No money spent on essential services. No proper Social care or education funding. No drug ‘total abstinence’ rehab counselling, No overnight provision for the homeless. No essential, bus service or pothole repairs.

    Trying to illegally sell the City off on the Stock Exchsnge. Getting into morevdrbt. Enough is never enough for Labour/Unionists. Everyone has had enough. May 2017 will make a change.

  274. TJenny says:

    Cactus – Aw shucks, I’m touched you remember. 😉

  275. frogesque says:

    @Lenny Hartley 11.02

    Caught that item about the Glasgow Vet too, deliberate lies by omission from our State Propaganda.

    It’s up to us all to get the truth out.

  276. Dr Jim says:

    Foreigners generally have rights

    Scottish people, not so much!

  277. Chick McGregor says:

    Why do we only have No 1’s in tennis for male singles, male doubles and male wheelchair?
    What about female singles, female doubles and female wheelchair?

    That is half of possible No 1 positions Scotland does not have.

    And isn’t it a bit sexist?

    SNP BAD.

    Why are Scottish health service statistics much better than those in England? Clearly the SG are doing that deliberately (coyright Zebidee) for purely political purposes.


    Why do Scots want to remain in the EU? Doesn’t make sense for the insular little nationalists they are, does it? No, again it must be propaganda by the SG.


    Why are the SNP BAD? Because they are the SNP and they are therefore, BAD, simples.

  278. Chick McGregor says:

    PS Did I forget to mention? the SNP also happen to be very BAD as well as just BAD. Many of our independent experts can verify that fact.

  279. Effijy says:

    840,000 signatures at 23.40 for Trump to be Trumped

  280. Ken500 says:

    @ Cactus is Fuenteventura

    Doesn’t have a vote? Ventura ace detective

    A hoax

    Where is Meths? Used to post on the Scotsman. About the Trump carry on. Fee fi Bon. Joyce should know.

  281. Chick McGregor says:

    Re the UK’s ‘special’ relationship with the USA. Theresa May might want to research what American’s usually mean when they use the word ‘special’. Then she might reflect on just how accurate it actually is.

    Meanwhile in Turkey she should ask Erdevan how he got the Syrians to pay for their wall and relay that info back to her new best pal.

  282. frogesque says:

    @Chick McGregor 11.34

    You forgot to mention the Forth Bridge and the Forth Road Bridge didn’t close today but the new Queen’s ferry Crossing is expected to be completed on time and under budget.

    It’s all the SNPs fault so SNP bad.

    Everyone knows it should have been a fiasco like the Edinburgh Trams which was not down to the SNP so its their fault they can’t be blamed.

    Is that clear?

  283. Cactus says:

    I never forgets babes.


    Keepin’ the dream alive.


  284. Valerie says:

    Putin refuses to answer calls to end visa free travel to Russia, thereby showing his nouce. He must be laughing hard at these deadbeats that don’t know how to behave, like May and Trump.

    I think the alleged exemption for UK that BoJo is alleged to have brokered is just spinny bullshit. They say it won’t affect most UK travellers, but may have extra checks if anyone connected to the banned countries.

    Watch out for lots of Russia bad stories, as they keep saying Putin will deal with Trump.

    Ask yourself – when was Putin anybody’s bitch? I just think he is sitting back laughing big time.

  285. David says:

    Hi Stu, just hoping you might be validity checking the latest Sunday Times OP that Ruth Davidson has been gushing over for most of today. I know the Sunday Times is no friend of indy but it would be good to know how kosher this OP was.

  286. Thepnr says:


    “@ Cactus is Fuenteventura. Doesn’t have a vote?”

    Cactus is just on holiday in Fuenteventura LOL He does have a vote, he’s a weegie through and through.

  287. Waverley warrior says:

    Why sign a petition asking for trump to be allowed into country ?

  288. Chick McGregor says:

    ‘Putin refuses to answer calls to end visa free travel to Russia, thereby showing his nouce’

    Visa free? Wish it was.

    We went to Russia a couple of years back and getting a visa was, well complicated.

    On the forms, you had to name every country you had ever visited, with dates. You had to name every company you had worked for, your boss’s name in each and a contact telephone number in each case. And loads of other stuff like what organisations and political parties you had been a member of.

    Finally you had to physically go down to the Russian consulate in Edinburgh for an interview and for your biometrics to be taken.

    During the interview, I asked, What’s with all the palaver and fingerprints and stuff? The guy said, Britain started it first for Russian tourists coming here.

    There was, maybe still is, a special group visa for cruise ship passengers for up to 72 hours dealt with mostly by the cruise admin., but we did not consider that long enough to see everything we wanted to see.

    We flew to St Petersberg and stayed for 10 nights at the official state Hermitage hotel and due to a visa oversight could not even take the ferry to visit our son in Finland as intended.

  289. Capella says:

    Petition now at 862,609. Keep going to 1 million.

  290. Ken500 says:

    The Tory/Unionists/Westminster Unionists can’t complain because they intend to do this to EU citizens.

    The Tory/Unionists will be scared they get banned or restricted access to the US (and the EU).

    They are totally trying to avoid that suggestion.Trump is doing, what they say they intend to do.

    Total hypocrites.

    Sudenly they are up in arms about a restrictive similar plan in the US.

    The Tories Brexit advocates are being show up to be total hypocrites.

    They are criticising Trump for doing actions, the Westminster/Unionists intend to carry out.

    Boo hoo – Bojo and Mo. It’s beyond parody. Getting some of their own medicine.

    SKy takes the biscuit, jam and wooden spoon. Totally changed their tune. Murdoch not jumping back and forwards unrestricted. Trump and Brexit. The America Alliance in stitches. Sone State visit in tatters.

    Now on to Democrscy, siting the poor old Queen, Democracy and an unelected monarch sticking their nose in and interfering at every opportunity. When they are supposed to be impartial. Taking part in illegal wars. Diana tip toeing through the mines and cavorting with the Muslin son of the biggest illegal weapons dealer in the world. The ‘killer Wales’.

    Their father drove their mother off her head, finally resulting in her death. Then married the ‘other women’. The tax evaded legacy. Head of the church. The biggest consumer on earth lecturing others on the changing climate. Why don’t they change their habits. Leopards never change their spots. Enough is never enough. Murdoch SKy should be in prison. Along with most of the corrupt Unionist politicians.

    The US/UK illegal wars caused the biggest migration crisis in Europe since WW11. They couldn’t make a bigger mess. Selling arms to terrorist Governments, who repress their population.

  291. ben madigan says:

    @ the various people who discussed a Scottish President

    if Scotland ever decides to become a republic (and to be quite honest I can’t see the Royals lasting through Independence) then presidential candidates will be voted for a short term, usually 5-7 years by the people.

    Since we’ve had Elizabeth II as head of state for nigh on 65 years change may be hard to conceive. But think about it.

    Can anyone remember who was president of the USA,France or Italy 65 years ago?
    Answers: Truman, Auriol and Einaudi – names that belong to history books!

    Furthermore, Presidential Candidates need not be politicians. They can be Scottish Nobel prize-winners, eminent doctors and scientists, musicians, film-makers, artists, poets, writers – whoever Scotland thinks will best represent her short-term on the International Stage

  292. CameronB Brodie says:

    OT but not OT and from the Rev.’s twitter.

    ….the Vampires’ Castle seeks to corral people back into identi-camps, where they are forever defined in the terms set by dominant power, crippled by self-consciousness and isolated by a logic of solipsism which insists that we cannot understand one another unless we belong to the same identity group.

    I suggested a while back that Owen Jones couldn’t empathise with the Scottish experience because he is English. My bad. I’d have been more accurate in suggesting Owen is possibly unable to support Scotland’s self-determination, a natural condition for nations, as his views have almost certainly been distorted by the BritNat media’s relentless misrepresentation of Scotland’s circumstances.

    Mind you, the focus of academia’s contemporary social investigation is very much concerned with the significance of identity and how it is formed. The author probably knows far more about this stuff than I do but what the heck. Here goes getting up myself again.


    If there is a single Marxist whom Pierre Bourdieu had to take seriously it has to be Antonio Gramsci. The theorist of symbolic domination must surely seriously engage the theorist of hegemony. Yet I can only find passing references to Gramsci in the writings of Bourdieu. In the first reference above, Bourdieu appropriates Gramsci to his own thinking about cultural domination, in the second Bourdieu deploys Gramsci to support his own theory of politics, and in the third Bourdieu ridicules Gramsci’s ideas about organic intellectuals.1

    Given the popularity of Gramsci in Europe during the 1960s and 1970s, when Bourdieu was developing his ideas of cultural domination, one can only surmise that the omission was deliberate. Bourdieu’s allergy to Marxism here expresses itself in the refusal to entertain the ideas of the Marxist closest to his own perspective. He openly declares that he had never read Gramsci, and that, if he had, he would have made his criticisms abundantly clear. Of all the Marxists, Gramsci was simply too close for comfort.

    Indeed, the parallels are remarkable….

  293. Malky says:

    Petard hoisting of an almost laughable nature.

  294. Undeadshuan says:

    This is scary @roguepotusstaff asked what bannon wants Reply was a picture of nuked usa buildings.

  295. Undeadshaun says:


    Actually looking on a bigger screen than phone and probably not nuked, but a bombed out building.

    Still scary.

  296. bjsalba says:

    Watched the petition roll to over 900,000 minutes after hearing from the BBC that it was over 800,000.

  297. Hamish100 says:

    Notice BBC scotch land showed the Indy fund raiser post on tele. Proves that the original decision to air brush out was wrong. Embarrassed into changes.

  298. Ed the head says:

    Looks like WM is ignoring the petition as uk passport holders are not affected, so it’s out of the EU and now we are the 51 state.

  299. K1 says:

    If you click on petition from phone as I’m doing now, there’s a wee link in blue right at bottom of page that says ‘get petition data (json format).

    When clicked you can see every constituency with named MP and number of signatures. But look at all the other countries mentioned, with some just a handful of sigs., some into thousands. This could account for the UK numbers being reported and deducting all other countries, the estimates may well be ‘accurate’. Check it out, haven’t done the sums, it’s alphabetical, UK as a whole is individually counted as a ‘single polity’too.

    Just a thought.

  300. Pete says:

    This petition is rubbish!!
    Obama did exactly the same thing in 2011 but there was no outrage.
    But, of course, he was a cuddly liberal!!!!

  301. heedtracker says:

    BetterTogether Slovenia branch manager sure does get around.

    Heil Tompkins.

  302. Ken500 says:

    There are arguments for a constitutional Monarchy. A totally impartial Head of State who doesn’t interfere and keeps within monetary restraints. The Royals are supposed to be impartial but are not. Taking part in illegal wars, tax evading and banking fraud. They are breaking the Law. Some, especially, older people identify with a Royal Head of State is part of their history. Life long/time experience. Polls suggest a slight majority (in Scotland) do agree with it. The Royals are supposed to be impartial They interfere and are biased on too many matters. They are rolled out and used by politicians. Trying to guide politician matters. That is not the deal. They are breaking the Law.

    A presidency can be embroiled in political matters or corruption, scandal and controversy. It could need a considerable amount of funding. The PM travelling the world causing havoc on private jets. Staying away To avoid trouble at home. Often before they are deposed. An eventual vote on it might suffice. Too much rocking the boat might lead to instability, which many folk do not want but favour a gradual change. It will be in any case.

    The Westminster Unionists can’t condemn Trump making folk change their travel plans for three mionths. Go a different route. They want to ban people permanently from certain countries. They already do it. People are banned/barred already from coming to the UK from the rest of the world. A strict immigration policy which splits families. There are ways round it. Brexit means they will also be banned from EU. Vis a visa. People from the UK will be banned/barred from the EU. No freedom of movement. Damaging trade, business and splitting families.

    Trying to chuck people out for no reason, when they have a justifiable right to stay. Malice and cruelty. Westminster depopulated Scotland. Many people from Scotland had to migrate to survive. A 40Million disaporia. Many resident in the US. 20%? of descendency. They should have a bit of decency. About visits. Trump has brought many visitors to Scotland/UK Brexit will damage his multimillion businesses It will damage Scottish tourist industry because Scotland does not have control of its immigration policy or visa. It is being taken out of the EU against the majority wishes, with no concessions.

    The Westminster Unionists are complicit in denying people rights. Shambles and chaos. Costing £Billions/Trns. Westminster miscalculated the immigration figures. Misinformed the EU benefits. Including foreign students passing through. Not including Brits taking up permanent or dual residency abroad for economic reasons or to save tax. Tax incentives in other EU countries. The migration figures are fiddled and do not include only temporary visa residence. May miscalculated the books on purpose to favour Brexit. Not including the increased migration because of the UK/US illegal wars. That was not taken into account. Or accountable responsibility.

    The UK/US caused the migration crisis in Europe. Displacing maiming and killing millions of innocent people with their illegal eternal wars, bankers fraud and tax evasion. Trump was against and said at the time. 2003-2008. It is on the internet. Worldwide web. Look out for it.

  303. heedtracker says:

    What’s loadsamoney in Slovene?

    To be fair, he has been shrewd enough to convert his huge out put of Slovenia says vote NO you deluded fascists Scots btl commentary, in to hard cash, very hard cash.

    “Tomkins’s work for a right wing American think tank with links to Trump supporters is at odds with Scottish Tory leader Ruth Davidson’s opposition to the election of the US President-elect.

    His links to the American right will also raise questions about the company kept by Tomkins, who is the Tory welfare spokesman at Holyrood.

    The Liberty Fund also holds co-sponsored conferences with right wing US groups such as the Charles Koch foundation and the Cato Institute.”

  304. K1 says:

    Testing: petition

    Awaits robotic knee-jerk reaction. Operative word being ‘jerk’ obvs.

  305. Sinky says:

    On the day UK Parliament is discussing fake news, The Scotsman front page headline states “IndyRefe2 poll shows drop in support” whereas YES support has increased by 1% in the poll referred to.

  306. heedtracker says:

    One of my Slovene girlfriend’s er, funderising billionaires, makes you proud to be a Glesga uni grad it does.

    “The Charles G. Koch foundation has also given gobs of money in education — with attached strings.

    For example, when the foundation was engaged in talks with Florida State University back in 2007 to make a donation worth millions of dollars, the organization had an agenda: The school’s Economics Department would get the cash if it taught economics to reflect the pro-business, anti-regulatory philosophy of Koch — and wouldn’t if it didn’t.”

  307. Nana says:

    Theresa May to warn devolved nations: you have no veto on Brexit

    London Swedes told to prepare for brexit

    Merkel: Terror Fight Does Not Justify Trump Immigration Ban

  308. Nana says:


    Johns Hopkins’ Top Psychologist Releases Terrifying Diagnosis of President Trump

    Iraqis say US President Donald Trump ‘has gone to war with Islam’

  309. heedtracker says:

    Koch brothers dosh also funding Prof T twice, through the Cato institute and the Charles G. Koch foundation. When one creepy as fcuk far right pressure group just isn’t enough. Do they approach UK tory gimps like my Slovene girlfriend or do you have to apply for their bucks?

    “The Cato Institute is an American libertarian think tank headquartered in Washington, D.C. It was founded as the Charles Koch Foundation in 1974”

  310. Ken500 says:

    Obama/Clinton did the same. They were even worse. Illegal wars killing and maiming millions of innocent people. In the US and abroad. Parasites. They would not listen. Clinton was up all night on an illegal computer site. Getting donations from Saudi’s to kill Muslims. They were using the US army as mercenaries to kill innocent Muslin people for the Saudi regime. An absolute despot Monarchy which restricts citizen rights. Greedy, torturing criminals. The citizens can’t travel freely. When Trump got elected, The bombing stopped. Now trying to arrange with Putin to stop the illegal carnage. On Russia!s borders.

  311. galamcennalath says:

    From yesterday’s poll….

    Should Scotland be an independent country?

    Yes 46%
    No 54%

    That is a strong position to begin a campaign for Indy from.

    In contrast, there has already been a relentless campaign against the SNP/SG/Indy for the last year, plus.

    Coming up, soon ….

    – More sidelining of Scottish views
    – The true nature of Brexit both in plan and in effect.
    – The close relationship of the Tories with Trump.
    – I hope, a positive view of Indy by the EU.

    … and that is still before we begin actively campaigning for Indy!

  312. Ken500 says:

    Tomkins is married to an American. A migrate family with permission to stay but campaigns against migration and immigrants. Who might be next to get chucked out? Or lose their 2nd ‘job’. Or remuneration of public money. 3rd rate rejects. A burden on the hard pressed tax payers. Multimillionaires looking for subsidies of public money. 3rd rate rejects. Start packing? There might be a post in the US. Or maybe not. A different education system. Private.

  313. scotspine says:

    OT. Radio jockland run a feature on Scottish Wassailing!

    They interview someone from south of the border who is introducing Wassailing to Scotland “we must ensure this tradition is kept alive”

    Aye, subdue our own traditions in order to assimilate!

  314. Ken500 says:

    Boris Johnston just gave up his dual/US citizenship to pay less tax.

    Boo hoo Bojo. No freedom of movement. Own medicine. Restrictive travel. Chaos and confusion. The dope on a rope. Osbourne and his dopey past. Restrictive movements.

  315. orri says:

    I’m of the opinion that given a choice between an unelected but, hopefully well trained, Royal or an elected President as HoS this thread kind of demonstrates why I’d go for the Royal. However the real question is why the assumption that there’s got to be a choice? Certainly at the moment we have Teresa May going down the same route as Thatcher and presuming presidential powers without even an official endorsement from the members of her party. You’ve also got Corbyn and the dubiety of his claim to leadership.

    I was going to claim that Germany doesn’t have a president until I did a fact check. The main point though is that I didn’t have a clue an doubt most other people outwith germany would have. So the real question is do we need a head of state?

  316. Bob MACK says:

    An eminent Psychologist in America has just broken the rules and guidelines by diagnosing Trump without seeing him. Dr Gartner believes Trump is an incurable Narcissist, which I think we all knew anyway.
    However he believes him to be at the extreme end of that scale which is concerning.

    It means he functions at a higher level, but with equally high disregard for the outcomes of his actions. That is very serious indeed and does have real implications for the world.

    As long as he survives in a conflict he would completely lack concern or empathy for any other living thing affected by that conflict.

    Petition soaring past 975,000 as I write.

  317. Robert Peffers says:

    @Pete says: 29 January, 2017 at 8:11 pm:

    “At last, somebody with some sense.

    Good God! Has someone agreed with the numptie?

    Oh! Wait up. That’ll be Pete agreeing with himself. It’s unlikely we would have two total idiots posting the same idiocy in the same topic at almost the same time.

    Only an idiot could postulate holding a referendum before an Article 50 has been submitted to the EU, much less debated by the EU, and the English Government then attempting to drag their equally sovereign United Kingdom partner out of the EU.

    What does this numptie imagine the point of holding another indyref to be?

    Pete has as much political understanding as a half-dead clipshear with a broken back.

  318. Lenny Hartley says:

    Manx businesses getting say in Brexit negotiations !

    So looks like Governments such as ours are to be excluded but private companies invited to talks.

    petition just about to hit the million!

  319. Valerie says:

    @Chick McGregor

    Sorry, can’t find the Twitter source. I may have worded it badly, but I think the comparison was you can still get a visa for Russia and travel. The point being no travel for those 7 countries on the list.

    America still on fire I see from Sky. It’s true he said he would do it, and its just a pity it didn’t motivate the numbers we now see out on the streets, to vote.

    A very stretchy exchange with an English FB friend who objected to me calling Corbyn ‘supine’ for his 3 line whip, working for the Tories. She gave me gibberish about it being ‘strategy’.

    She said we are sitting quite comfortably here because we can have another referendum. I said, yes, but that has taken years of hard work out on the streets. She discovered voting last year.

    We stand on the shoulders of giants in Scotland, and I sincerely hope we don’t let them down.

  320. Breeks says:

    Pete says:
    30 January, 2017 at 8:27 am
    This petition is rubbish!!
    Obama did exactly the same thing in 2011 but there was no outrage.
    But, of course, he was a cuddly liberal!!!!

    Come on Pete, raise your game. Obama stopped processing the applications of refugees from a war zone without paperwork in many cases, which I do not defend, but that is altogether different from an arbitrary ban on ALL Muslims, including those with green cards and “legitimate” documentation. Obama was also working with his State Department, whereas Trump’s ban is pure xenophobia and he seems to decide his daily agenda according to whatever toy falls out his cereal box in the morning or appears on Fox News.

    Supposing Trump withdrew this ban tomorrow and apologised, (which he won’t), the damage he has done to US interests in the Middle East will last for decades. He has told all moderates and non-combatants fleeing from ISIS that the USA tars them all with the same brush. Don’t come running to the USA because you’ll be turned away. Time will tell what jeopardy his arbitrary and summary ban has placed Americans in, those already working and living abroad. There are now Americans all over the world anxious about their own travelling arrangements.

    You also have to remember that the Islamic extremists aren’t fighting a war to win. Their war is Jihad, the war is their objective where they can die as martyrs. Trumps knee jerk stupidity will be seen as a massive incentive for ISIS to continue, because their obscene provocations are beginning to show results. Fighting fire with fire was Trumps mantra, music to the ears of Jihadis, and drawing the US away from tolerance, justice and decency, and embracing torture, prejudice, paranoia and “might is right” invective. Granted, that shining white reputation has looked pretty grubby for some time now, but even the semblance of justice is preferable to unrestricted warfare devoid of justice and self restraint.

    When you think about it, the obvious Jihadi objective is, we all assume, to release some token outrage to provoke their religious war. And yet the USA currently stands poised with black citizens at war with the trigger happy police, hispanics treated like animals, whites paranoid they might become a minority, and Muslims treated like terrorists, and the Nation is divided and agitated with deep running entrenched opinions. At the centre of it all, you have Trump, a President at war with the press, a friend to Russia, a friend to Israel, surrounded by buddies and family and beyond the reach of the “men in grey” and the conventional US “behind the schemes” power brokers who might steady the hand of a new President in office. The biggest loose cannon in history is out of control and on a roll.

    America has never looked more unstable, and the Jihadis must surely be loving it.

    Scary and nasty thought for the day? Those Jihadis must be seeing the opportunity for tipping the US over the edge.

    As for Theresa May, poor Theresa. She reminds me of that VW Golf Ad, about the playboy who put it all on black and it came up red, married the sex kitten just as she turned into a cat… Theresa May gets PM job when UK committed to Brexit, ditches the EU for US just as the US begins to eat itself, and sets her face against Scotland… and that chapter has yet to unfold.

    Theresa is not lucky.

  321. Nana says:

    UK govt rejects 1mn-strong petition to bar Trump state visit – report

  322. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “him being a UK citizen would probably allow him a visa to America?

    does the executive order say `born in restricted country` or `citizen of restricted country`?”

    It says, and means, “born”. DOESN’T ANYONE CLICK THE LINKS?

  323. Dorothy Devine says:

    I think we all have to remember that the MSM is far from truthful and that applies to the USA as well.

    RT has just backed Pete’s statement about Obama and it has interviewed many folk in Ohio who back the change that they hope Trump will bring to their devastated area.

    We really have to get more excited about our own situation and take a back seat as far as the POTUS is concerned.

    Before anyone thinks I am delighted about his election may I say with the choice of two folk who could never sway me to enthusiastically support them, then the lesser of two evils won.

    Now , ‘mon Scotland ,arm yourself figuratively speaking for our fight .

  324. Liz g says:

    Orri @ 9.19
    Can’t say that I agree with you Orri I have never been able to see any benefit to having Royal anything, other than as a how we used to live history lesson.

    Don’t you think it is horrible to take certain babies and map out their whole life.
    To literally brainwash then into believing that they have to forfeit a life they would choose,in exchange for privilege that they must sometimes question..Even a wee bit,when they see human suffering.
    To have their elders and intulectual superiors Actually Phiscially bow down and call a teenager Highness and Magisty,to me that is a form of insanity.

    As a citizen I find putting a family in fancy dress into a golden boat,then sailing it down a river in the pissing rain,while bands play at them, and Actually broadcasting it.
    Deeply embarrassing.
    Most of what they do is cringe worthy crown’s,coaches ect.
    As a modern democracy why on earth would we courtenance being represented by That?

    But my main objection is that we IMHO while designing our new Constution need to be looking at the Judiciary,a second chamber and most importantly the checks and balances we put on Holyrood,and I can’t see a role for a Crown as it is currently defined in whatever it is we come up with!

    We don’t have to have a President in the traditional sense of the concept,we can define the role as unique to Scotland, something along the lines of “Lord High Protector of Scotland” as a nod to our History,but clearly not so gender specific!

  325. FatCandy says:

    uno mas @ 4.19
    Funniest comment I’ve read on WoS to date.

    Dan Huil @ 6.21
    2nd funniest comment I’ve ever read on here.

  326. Dorothy Devine says:

    Liz , can we forget the ‘Lord High’ and just have Protector of Scotland and her People ?

  327. Stu Mac says:


    No still don’t get it. Much as I’d hate to see the same thing, if we had an election and somebody awful got elected then them’s the breaks. Unless you want to do away with democracy which would suits our present UK rulers. Of course we ought to have a better and fairer electoral system and there can be arguments about what powers a “president” or similar official would have as an elected official would be very different from a regent.

    One could even argue for having a regent but a short term one chosen at random and being no more than a front to maintain traditions: they’d get to open parliament each year and launch ships and train engines and so on but have no real powers. Maybe a lottery you buy into with profits going to charity. Free ermine, army uniforms and jewellery returnable once your 1-2 year term is up.

  328. Breastplate says:

    @Dorothy Devine,
    I have to agree with you that our own situation should take precedence and have been fed up to the back teeth of US politics rammed down our throats for the last couple of decades getting worse year on year.

    @Breeks, you started off well enough in your post but when you say things like

    “and drawing the US away from tolerance, justice and decency, and embracing torture, prejudice, paranoia and “might is right” invective”

    If you really believe what you’re writing,you need a break.

  329. orri says:

    My argument is simply that given a choice between a President and a Monarch I’d chose the later to bypass the pretence of democracy associated with a presidency with actual powers. A purely symbolic president is kind of pointless.

    However the more pertinent question, given this thread is about a president with less votes cast than his rival and that some of his predecessors were replaced in office by someone who may not have been elected on their own popularity, is whether we need an official Head of State or not.

    If there was ever a move to do away with the role of monarch and move towards something else those in favour of a republic need to decide beforehand what the alternative should be and pick one. Some kind of “ruling” council or committee drawn from parliament with a cross party representation and subject to recall might be a better bet.

  330. geeo says:

    BBC News channel headline at 2pm.

    “Petition hits a Million…”

    (Shows graphic at 1,026,048)

    However, at 2pm the petition was already OVER 1.2 Million…..

    To think the BBC had the cheek earlier to run a story on “fake news” from “non tradidional media” sources ….

Comment - please read this page for comment rules. HTML tags like <i> and <b> are permitted. Use paragraph breaks in long comments. DO NOT SIGN YOUR COMMENTS, either with a name or a slogan. If your comment does not appear immediately, DO NOT REPOST IT. Ignore these rules and I WILL KILL YOU WITH HAMMERS.

↑ Top