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Wings Over Scotland


The Neverending Mandate

Posted on September 28, 2022 by

This probably merits more attention.

Because the SNP are now openly, publicly telling you that they’re never going to achieve independence for Scotland, nor even make any meaningful attempt at it.

Let’s look at that statement for a moment – bearing in mind it comes from someone very close indeed to Nicola Sturgeon.

The last sentence is what the SNP have been telling us for the last six or seven years: that the UK government will be unable to democratically resist a mandate from the Scottish people for another indyref.

They’ve kept telling us this as UK PM after UK PM has done precisely that – David Cameron then Theresa May then Boris Johnson then Liz Truss have resisted mandate after mandate after mandate with no difficulty whatsoever, and no sign that it’s caused them any sleepless nights.

The SNP have won eight elections in Scotland since the indyref: Westminster elections in 2015, 2017 and 2019, Holyrood elections in 2016 and 2021, council elections in 2017 and 2022 and European election in 2019. None of them were close-run victories – they won the Euro election by 23 points over their nearest rival, and only the 2017 council election saw a winning margin in single digits.

There has been a pro-independence majority in the Scottish Parliament for every single day since the 2014 referendum. Were Scotland a normal democratic country, we would be out of the UK by now. Parliament would have voted for it, just like the UK Parliament did for Brexit, and that would have been the end of the matter. The UK Parliament did not require or seek permission from the European Parliament to leave the EU. It simply exercised its democratic right as the body representing the people.

(Even though there has never been a UK Parliament where pro-Brexit MPs represented over 50% of voters in an election – in the wholly-Brexit-focused 2019 election, pro-Brexit parties got just 46% of the vote, compared to 49.6% for pro-indy parties at the 2021 Holyrood election.)

Pro-Brexit MPs could, of course, point to the Brexit referendum itself as their mandate. But now the SNP are telling us that even if an election they are treating as “a de facto referendum” delivers over 50% of the vote, they’ll still simply go back to Westminster with their caps in their hands and “demand” another referendum like they’ve been doing for over half a decade.

In other words, the election won’t be an indyref at all, but merely a referendum about a referendum, which the UK government will be under no obligation to attach any significance to, because the SNP itself has just given the UK government carte blanche to say no forever.

(“There is no route to independence that does not involve the agreement of the UK government.”)

So if you wait ANOTHER two years for the SNP to actually do anything, it still won’t count. They’ll just class it as yet another “irresistible mandate”, exactly the same as the previous eight that the UK Government resisted.

And when they resist this one too – which they will, because why on Earth wouldn’t they? What do they have to lose? Votes in Scotland? LOL – what will the SNP do? Make the NEXT election ANOTHER two years down the line ANOTHER “de facto referendum”, then repeat forever when Westminster knocks that one back too? This is already their last-ditch Hail Mary option and they’ve just told you they don’t really mean it. We’re still just begging on bended knee for something we’re never going to be given.

(The idea that it’s “politically” impossible, as opposed to legally impossible, is just absolute nonsense. We already know that whoever wins the next UK election, Labour or the Tories, will have stood on a manifesto of unequivocally refusing a second indyref and will therefore have its own mandate on behalf of the whole UK to keep Scotland firmly locked in the basement.)

The only way a de facto referendum can work is IF YOU ACTUALLY TREAT IT AS A REFERENDUM – that is to say, if you get over 50% of the vote you DO go ahead and declare independence, bypassing the UK government and appealing for international recognition under the UN Charter, noting that all other peaceful avenues have been comprehensively exhausted.

It’s actually the way most countries in the last 100 years have done it. It wouldn’t be plain sailing. But anything less than that is just throwing in the towel before the start of the fight. “Do what I want or I’ll jolly well ask you again in the future” is not a strategy, it’s a surrender.

Safely assume, readers, that Mhairi Hunter – the First Minister’s election agent, loyal servant and close personal pal – would not make public statements that did not reflect the First Minister’s position. This is SNP policy now. The “de facto referendum” has just been revealed as merely another empty, meaningless fart of rhetoric aimed at the infinitely gullible. More of the same, because if the mug punters are still swallowing it why would they stop shovelling it?

There are no secrets here. No journalism, no analysis was required to uncover the scam. They’re just telling you, right out in the open, if you can be bothered to hear. If you still believe in them – and there are still diehard SNP loyalists who read this site despite everything – ask yourself exactly what it would take to make you see. For as long as these crooked charlatans have control of the SNP, there will be no independence.

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    605 to “The Neverending Mandate”

    1. Dan says:

      @ Stoker

      Aye, totes need energy rationing when your country is generating all it requires, and is still exporting more than that amount down south.

      https://extranet.nationalgrid.com/RealTime

      If only we had another source of power like gas… Oh, what’s this

      https://mip-prd-web.azurewebsites.net/InstantaneousView

      SCOTLAND WITH ONLY 9% OF THE UK POPULATION HAS:

      65% of the natural gas production
      96.5% of the crude oil production.
      47% of the open cast coal production
      81% of the untapped coal reserves
      92% of the hydro electric production
      40% of the wind wave and solar energy production

      ENGLAND WITH 91% OF THE UK POPULATION ONLY HAS:

      35% of the natural gas production
      3.5% of the crude oil production.
      53% of the open cast coal production
      19% of the untapped coal reserves
      8% of the hydro electric production
      60% of the wind wave and solar energy production

    2. Stoker says:

      Quick, folks, there’s the 500-comment marker. LOL!

    3. Stoker says:

      @ Dan,

      Seen this, again, just the other day on here and a couple of energy-related comments near bottom, after article, made me wonder if you’d seen it. Here it is just in case you haven’t. https://caltonjock.com/2021/12/14/a-treasury-official-said-the-prospects-for-the-uk-without-scotland-look-bleak-the-scots-really-have-got-us-over-a-barrel-an-independent-scotland-can-go-it-alone-but-the-prospects-for-a-separate/

    4. Republicofscotland says:

      “I use it to describe the war criminals invading country 404. Fair comment as far as most people with a moral compass are concerned.”

      You mean the West, which isn’t most people with a moral compass, so to most people it would be seen as a xenophobic comment. Why am I not surprised.

    5. Dan says:

      @ Stoker

      Aye, the new Berwick Bank windfarm and others was mentioned btl here a while back.
      A pal is involved with the new HVDC cables which will transfer leccy from Scotland to elsewhere.

      Serious question. Has anybody seen an SNP or Green supposedly pro-indy politician ever promote or tweet the Scottish stats for our resources and industries. Some have gone to the bother of putting pronouns on their bios and pinned tweets relating some relatively unimportant stuff in the scheme of things, when those Scottish stats should always be front and centre to get exposure and inform Scots of the true situation.

    6. Scott says:

      Ellis.

      Scotland and its defined borders are older than the union it finds itself in.

      Scotland is perfectly entitled to seek the views of only those born here on its status, using a special register, just as it’s perfectly entitled to use the same franchise as 2014. It’s up to us to decide, not the international community, most of whom didn’t exist in current form even 100 years ago.

      NB Local election franchise in Scotland is less restrictive than in England.

    7. Hatuey says:

      Power cuts are inevitable in the UK. I assumed everyone knew that. It has been discussed in various places but it’s the usual don’t scare the horses approach by the msm.

      Another inevitability is a huge rise in unemployment. That’s why Truss can’t commit to increasing welfare payments in line with inflation; they know the welfare bill is going to go through the roof.

      While we are here, the plan to make the UK another low tax, low everything, sewage-station on the coast of Europe was unveiled today by Truss. In fairness, it’s the only post-Brexit economic model that actually holds any water. Dire as it is, there really is no post-Brexit alternative.

      The NHS and whole public sector is going to be dismantled and carved up. Those who hijacked the UK and forced Brexit on us, basically a bunch of offshore crooks, had this plan in their minds all along. They aren’t even hiding this aspect of the formula anymore.

      It didn’t cost much to convince a few million useful idiots that Brexit was all about sovereignty, although for the crooks with their dark money it sort of is.

    8. gregor says:

      WEF Klaus Schwab:

      “So we penetrate the cabinets…”:

      Penetrate:

      “To move into or through something.”

      “To succeed in becoming part of an organization, etc. and working within it.”

      “To reach or affect something.”

      https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/penetrate

    9. gregor says:

      World Economic Forum (29/09/2022): Agenda:

      What you need to know about the global economy…

      “Global recession increasingly likely…

      …expect reduced growth, persistently high inflation and a continued decline in real wages…

      Growing inequality between and within countries is the ongoing legacy…”:

      https://archive.ph/ncKSp

    10. Dan says:

      Power cuts you say. But how will folk charge all those expensive leccy cars…

    11. gregor says:

      Pervade:

      “When qualities, characteristics, or smells pervade a place or thing, they spread through it and are present in every part of it.”

      https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/pervade

    12. gregor says:

      BBC (05/10/2022): Scotland’s economy likely to be in recession – report:

      “…The data points to weakening demand in the economy as inflationary pressures pervade every aspect of our lives…”:

      https://archive.ph/O9bv4

    13. gregor says:

      World Economic Forum: People:

      Nicola Sturgeon:

      https://www.weforum.org/people/nicola-sturgeon

    14. Republicofscotland says:

      Hatuey.

      Truss wants to turn the UK into a global corporation’s dream, with no workers rights, low tax rates for the highest earners, low corporation tax, low benefits, low wages for middle and bottom earners, limited environmental overseeing, freeports. Rampant capitalism with a light government touch is the goal.

      We’re heading in the direction the USA has already taken.

      “Rights of Corporations Business constitutional rights are the rights of any companies formed in the United States, which are afforded by the United States Constitution. Some business entity types have almost as many rights as individual citizens of the country.”

      As for power cuts Scotland produces more energy than it needs, yet the lights will probably go out in Scotland first.

    15. gregor says:

      World Economic Forum: People:

      Danny Cohen: Head of Television, BBC News:

      Tim Davie: Director-General, British Broadcasting Corporation (BBC):

      Melanie Dawes: Chief Executive, Office of Communications (Ofcom):

      Kwasi Kwarteng: Chancellor of the Exchequer, HM Treasury of the United Kingdom:

      Devi Shrider: Scottish Government COVID-19 Advisory Group:

      Liz Truss…

    16. John Main says:

      @ Hatuey says:5 October, 2022 at 10:38 am

      “I don’t really know how you could convince a non-Scottish voter from elsewhere in the UK to vote to destroy the Union when so much for them hinges on the continuation of the Union, including their ability to come here to live, buy property, work, and vote, in the first place”

      Always in a Hatuey post, some parked breakfast.

      So in Hatuey’s iScotland, everybody from the EU will be free to come here (Hatuey just loves the EU), and probably everybody from the rest of the world will be welcome to come here (cos we are the nicest, friendliest wee country in the world and besides, it’s payback time for our historic colonialism).

      But people from England will be turned back at the border. And quite possibly (Hatuey’s post is ambiguous), English people already in Scotland will be cleared out.

      I’m assuming that emigrated Scots living in England won’t be allowed to vote in any referendum, and they will thus fall clearly into Hatuey’s “non-Scottish voter from elsewhere in the UK” category. Maybes Hatuey will tell us why Scots exiles should be barred from returning to iScotland.

      Maybes naw.

    17. John Main says:

      https://unherd.com/thepost/the-russian-refugee-crisis-nobody-wants-to-talk-about/

      200,000 is the number claimed by this article.

      Might be interesting to hear from the “usual suspects” what their views are on how many of these refugees Scotland should take.

      After all, the “usual suspects” are staunch supporters of the refugees’ mother country.

      Then again, maybes the “usual suspects” will want the refugees lined up against a wall and shot like the tractors they might consider them to be.

    18. Andy Ellis says:

      @twatbynametwatbynature

      As usual Ellis gives it the majority this or the majority that when he is pushing his pish and when asked to produce EVIDENCE to support his pish no evidence can be found, but when anyone counters his arguments they are immediately asked to produce evidence

      What’s sauce for the goose though twatbyname, eh? I’m pretty sure my views represent those of mainstream, progressive, civic nationalists and that we represent the majority of the movement. If you think your brand of fringe, regressive, nativist nationalism represents the majority, then prove it. We’ll wait….

      The evidence was produced in an investigation by Edinburgh university, but for some reason (maybe because it went against the establishment and HIGHLIGHTED the stupidity of the franchise) it was ignored by the establishment

      One study, for which the evidence and back up is no longer available. Even if that one study is accurate, you’ve no way of knowing how those figures might have changed if blood and soil nationalists like you had gotten their way BEFORE 2014 and succeeded in depriving new Scots of the vote. Plenty of people would have been horrified at the betrayal of civic nationalism that represents.

      The franchise wasn’t and isn’t stupid. It’s standard, widely accepted and progressive. As Rev Stu pointed at the outset, we made the right decision in 2012-14, and nothing has changed since to justify a different franchise.

      YET Ellis and his supporters continue with the FALSE CLAIM that the Scots didn’t do enough to convince the very people who shouldn’t have had a vote on OUR CONSTITUTION

      It’s not a false claim. If Scots – old and new – had tried harder, we’d be independent by now. You don’t get to randomly decide that a whole class of Scots aren’t worthy of participation because you don’t like furriners.

      His usual denigration of people who oppose his outpourings only highlights the fact that he is a self opinionated , self absorbed pub bore that despises any opposition to his declarations

      More deflection on your part. I expect opposition and welcome it. I think people with unsavoury views need to be tackled head on, and have the light of reason shone directly in to their beady little eyes, whether they’re regressive nativists, covidiots, shills for Vlad and his fellow war criminals, or folk banging on about 300 year old treaties and Scotland’s colonial status.

      Nobody is trying to silence or stop any of it: much easier for it to be exposed for the bullshit it is.

      Any claimed indy supporter that openly and publicly states he would ACTIVELY WORK AGAINST Scottish independence if the franchise were altered and his wife and daughter couldn’t vote is not an indy supporter I would trust

      Just as well some of us have principles then eh twatbyname? I’d definitely campaign against franchise change. I’d definitely refuse to vote for a party advocating for it or supporting it. I’d have a hard time supporting a Yes vote in a referendum that used a restricted franchise, but it would depend on the detail of what they were proposing.

      For what it’s worth, I wouldn’t trust any purported independence supporter that campaigned to ditch civic nationalism, particularly the coterie of nativists polluting BTL conversation in here, almost invariably from behind anonymous profiles so they can spread their bile and unreason without actually having the courage to own their fringe nutterdom. You’re on the wrong side of history, the wrong side of the argument and on the opposite side from the person whose site you use to spread your bullshit.

      Whether Ellis likes it or not 53% of SCOTS voted FOR independence and we WERE robbed by OTHERS

      According to one analysis, the details of which are no longer available. 53% of native born Scots, not ALL Scots. You and yer xenophobic mates don’t get to exclude random percentages of all Scots just because you think the only way we can win is to queer the pitch.

      The “puir wee us, we wuz robbed by the furriners” schtick is a crock of shit to excuse the fact that Scots bottled it in 2014 and have contrived to instal a bunch of devolutionists in power ever since. New Scots aren’t responsible for native Scots being slaves who revere their chains.

    19. Republicofscotland says:

      Main &.46pm

      Usual suspects, such as Unherd funded by George Soros.

    20. John Main says:

      @Ruby says:5 October, 2022 at 9:20 am

      “I voted remain not because I knew all the details of how the EU worked who does. I voted remain principally because I felt the EU gave us protection from crooked/fascist politicians”

      That is very interesting!

      So you admit to ignorance of the subject, and thus adopting a faith-based position.

      That certainly explains your usual OTT reaction to anybody who questions your “faith”.

      Incidentally, is this the problem with the SNP and ScotGov? Shorn of the guiding hand of the benevolent EU, have they been given free reign to practise their crooked/fascist tendencies?

      If you believe that, no wonder you are so keen to get us into a neo-colonised relationship with Brussels.

    21. Republicofscotland says:

      So according to a prolific poster, we who seek Scottish independence, are now classed as blood and soil xenophobic nationalists, because we want Scots to decide their own future status of Scotland.

    22. Geri says:

      Hey Einstein, what would you suggest when a country is suddenly flooded with ‘orcs’?

    23. John Main says:

      https://bnn-news.com/international-media-report-more-than-260-000-men-have-fled-mobilisation-in-russia-238846

      Oops.

      Repo will be along in a mo to explain how this site is compromised by satanic influences.

    24. John Main says:

      @ Geri says:5 October, 2022 at 8:16 pm

      “Hey Einstein, what would you suggest when a country is suddenly flooded with ‘orcs’?”

      Where you bin, Geri, the usual suspects have already covered this.

      You call on the government of Chad to say that the orcs just held a free and fair referendum and 99.2% of them voted in favour of the floods.

    25. Geri says:

      & for the record, I’m not anonymous. Wings would find me in two seconds flat in the notion took him! My email address is the same one as my DD was linked to.

      & I dunno how to add a profile pic or care, tbh. I don’t need my fkn DNA to have an opinion do I?

    26. Geri says:

      Regards power cuts.

      Grim FFS but anyway, stock up on candles, batteries for a radio & a gas camp fire. (Aerosol ones) & lock up yer valuables.

      There used to be a survival program every week on ch4 yrs ago lol a *What to do in the event of…*

      We’ve already had the pandemic. Another was a blackout. Candles on the black market would be the price of gold & thieves will be on the prowl with no street lights. High crime a certainty.

      FFS what a time to be alive!

    27. Geri says:

      John Main.

      They’re the only ones who cause all the wars while no fecker is even near them.

    28. Republicofscotland says:

      Main @8.17pm.

      Baltic News Network is counter propaganda news network set up in 2010 to counter Russian propaganda in Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia.

    29. Hatuey says:

      It’s always fascinating to hear what ordinary people think about politics, isn’t it…

      I always try to make time for the caretaker in our office block when I’m passing his little desk; he’s one of those very straightforward old soldier types that has a view on everything.

      After explaining where the politicians got something wrong, which he does every time we chat, he always finishes with “you couldn’t make it up, could you…”

      It’s a shame though. The building owners informed us just two weeks ago that they’re going to be bringing contractors in to do his job starting in November. No doubt it’ll save them a few quid.

      Just got to get on with it, I suppose. Tough times indeed.

      The prick was starting to bore me anyway. As long as the fucking toilets are clean, right?

    30. John Main says:

      @ Hatuey says:5 October, 2022 at 8:58 pm

      “It’s always fascinating to hear what ordinary people think about politics, isn’t it…”

      Jeezo, Hatuey, I know you fancy yourself as this site’s resident over-achiever, but try to tone down the smug, pretentious superiority when you post.

      There might be some of your under-achieving “ordinary people” reading. They don’t need your lofty condescension.

    31. John Main says:

      @Republicofscotland says:5 October, 2022 at 8:46 pm

      “yada yada counter Russian propaganda yada yada”

      Hey, I am starting to see how this works.

      Russian propaganda is gospel truth, so anything that counters it must be lies.

      Simples.

      Simplistic.

      For simpletons.

      I have a link to the story on Al Jazeera, but I am guessing they are a Mossad front or some other such lunar howlery.

    32. Andy Ellis says:

      @John Main 9.08 pm

      Interesting isn’t it? The P utinista massive in here, the Orc lovers and war criminal apologists are convinced “ordinary folk” share their world view, when in fact the vast majority would happily see Vlad and his nice bunch of lads hunted down with dogs by the families of Uk rainians they’ve murdered, then publicly hanged from the nearest lamp post.

      Dunno about you but there’s something “off” about Hatuey’s Damascene conversion from someone border line sensible (at least by the standards of many of the denizens in here) to the full fat moonhowler camp. Question is, does someone have incriminating pictures or is it just some kind of breakdown? 🙂

    33. Geri says:

      All countries have propaganda.

      Look at our own! It’s 24/7 made up bullshit.

    34. Breastplate says:

      John Main,
      Do you not countenance the idea that all of these governments are lying to us?

    35. Hatuey says:

      I’m kinda cumbersome for you, andy… got it.

      I noticed that you didn’t chip in on the discussion about the pipeline and the question of who blew it up…

      I don’t blame you.

      Feel free to go through your routine now. Or shrug it off, we’ll never know eh?

      And that’s the sort of compromised position you’re in on just about every subject. We don’t need to see any incriminating pictures…

    36. moixx says:

      Email from For Women Scotland:

      “Rally for Women’s Rights!
      Reminder that the rally is this coming Thursday, the 6th October. Please do come along to the Scottish Parliament at 11:15am if you possibly can – we’re really hoping for a large and loud crowd. Male supporters are welcome too and we will have some placards available.

      We’re not planning on live streaming the event, although some recordings will be available afterwards. If you want to hear us – be there!!

      Don’t forget to contact all your MSPs and ask if they could take the time to come out and speak to those gathering – put your postcode in here to find your constituency MSP and 7 regional MSPs and send them a quick email.”

    37. Hatuey says:

      For the record, I’m no great fan of Vlad. He seems a lot smarter than the idiots running our show though. There are things growing in my fridge that demonstrate consciousness more convincingly than Biden.

      The West and the UN had years to accommodate Vlad’s “security” concerns. Nobody anywhere can explain why he can’t break international law but the west and US can, especially when many agree his concerns were legitimate.

      The world is sick of the double standards.

    38. Andy Ellis says:

      @Hatuey 9.31 pm

      You considerably overestimate your importance…..but then you’re the one narcissistic enough to go on about your supposed over-achiever status as John Main often has fun pointing out.

      Of course Vlad had the pipelines blown up: a desperate hail Mary pass to try and deflect from losing the war and an attempt to scare the appeasers in the West to go with the nuclear sabre rattling, which even his few remaining BRIC friends realise is full-on bonkers.

    39. Breastplate says:

      Ellis,
      The 404s have been bombing the shit out of their own people for 8 years.
      They may have had Russian roots and spoke Russian everyday but they seen themselves as 404s, although that has now changed.

      As I said before, we would have been none the worse off if the people of the Donbas were allowed a peaceful and agreed autonomy.

      That’s what should have happened after the violent overthrow of their democratically elected government.
      It was distasteful to them but you seem to think that it was important to bring them back in to line by killing their family, friends and neighbours.
      Now you seem to be angry that it hasn’t worked.

    40. Geri says:

      They’ve said the same about every country they’ve invaded. Every leader they’ve deposed.

      Over 50+ years of warring, famine, chaos, refugees, giving away land that isn’t thiers, causing mayhem, dropping nukes, destabilise the world, using Africa as a human laboratory, selling weapons, & shielding tyrants – you’d think someone would let the penny drop by now of who the real aggressor is & take a look at thier track record. All while no one is even near them.

      Yet you continue to champion their cause while others aren’t so blinded & aren’t a sycophant.

    41. Breastplate says:

      Ellis,
      Anybody with any sense knows that the prime suspect for blowing up Nordstream 2 is the USA.
      They already said they would do it but if you don’t want to believe that then the fact of the matter is that it was specifically identified by the Americans as a way to hurt the Russians.

      Now if you want to believe that the Russians wanted to hurt themselves financially by destroying the conduit that made them oodles of money in the past and would have made them oodles of dosh in the future, that is your prerogative.
      It’s more than a bit silly, really.

      The USA is conveniently on hand to save the day and sell gas to the Europeans, at a more expensive rate, obviously.

      Don’t be afraid to use the principle of cui bono or Occam’s razor.
      Of course, if it doesn’t suit your argument, you can always dispense with them.

    42. Ruby says:

      Power cuts in 2022 will be a lot more serious than the power cuts of 1978 during the winter of discontent.

      There will be no internet, no email, no telephone.
      Businesses wont be able to operate.

      The BT telephone I have is reliant on the internet. No electricity no phone.

      For those who don’t have the BT internet phone you’ll need a plug-in phone the cordless phone wont work.

      Getting a few extra batteries for my phone might be a good idea also some of these power packs.
      Just spotted a mobile phone on Amazon for £17. That might be worth buying.
      A pack of two power packs for £14. That could be better than candles. I do have a couple of these us powered lamps which are very good & bright.

      Anyone know how long phone batteries and power packs hold their charge if not used.

      I do have a couple of these dynamo wind up torches. They are very cute one’s a Peppa Pig and the other is a very sad dog. They do the job no batteries need just a lot of wrist action.

      Anyone know how long phone batteries and power packs hold their charge if not used.

      Will the melted food in the freezer be covered by insurance? Maybe time to start eating all the frozen food and stock up on tins.

      My survival list so far:

      1 mobile phone £17
      4 power packs £28
      10 cans corned beef
      10 fleece tops ranging from size 12 to size 24.

    43. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      WHY is it, that so many contributing BTL here are concerned with R-ussia and UK-raine?

      This is a Scottish pro-independence web site. Is that subject a more appropriate subject for comments, rather than events elsewhere?

      We’re screwed if Nicola is allowed to rule the roost. So, what’s the answer? Many contributors here feel that their input about the war to the east of the EU is more important that the situation regarding OUR independence.

      Screw the nut!

      Concentrate on what we can influence!

    44. Effijy says:

      This Tory Crap about increasing the pension age yet again.
      It is an outright lie that the U.K. population is continuing to live longer.

      Latest reports show longevity is stalled in most wealthy areas and in poorer communities people are dying younger.

      These trends are not influenced by Covid but the Tories have saved a couple of hundred thousand pensions by mismanagement of Covid herd immunity and failure to react quickly.

      The average Glasgow male will not see his 55th Birthday but the Tories want him to work until he is 68. Can they arrange a PAYE system on the other side of the Pearly Gates.

      The first sign of these figures were composed in 2011 which probably means 2010 was the first year in U.K. history where life expectancy began to reduce.

      Wasn’t there a great new English government that came into power in 2010 who still rule over us today.

      Vote Tory! Die younger, work longer, have fewer rights, go cold and hungry and have your mortgage rate run you into homelessness.

      Remember it’s all about the rich getting richer!

    45. Breastplate says:

      Bdtt,
      Join Alba, Vote Alba is the best solution for Scotland I can come up with.

      Unfortunately, the “war” or rather our reaction to it, is having and will be having a bigger impact on our lives than Nicola Sturgeon and the New SNP at the moment and in the immediate future.

      I think we’ll find it a bit difficult to ignore, even if we wanted to.

    46. Shug says:

      I noticed the nine had an article tonight about a girl who suffered from sleep walking that had been raped. Long story short case closed due to concern about consent. Now I have not seen the evidence but the concern was directed and the case being closed. Now why is the BBC telling us about this case in England. Is the BBC preparing us for the need for no juries in sex cases in Scotland, no need for evidence and only one verdict.
      If a woman’s say she was raped it can only be true
      Just wondering why we need to know about this case

    47. Shug says:

      I do hope Nicola pulls a sickie, resigns and heads of the the UN and we can get in with indy

    48. Hatuey says:

      For Ruby; https://bluettipower.co.uk/products/bluetti-eb70-solar-generator-sp200-solar-panel

      Nice thing to have, irrespective of the current bullshit.

      I’ve turned into a prepper…

    49. Hatuey says:

      Forgot to say, I wouldn’t worry about batteries for your mobile phones; the mobile networks will be one of the first things to collapse and there’s a good chance your phone will be useless, with or without a charged battery.

      The Germans and others are already planning for this. Look into it. I have some links somewhere if you need them.

      My advice is to worry about heating, food, light, and hair gel…

    50. Ruby says:

      Hatuey says:
      5 October, 2022 at 11:43 pm

      Forgot to say, I wouldn’t worry about batteries for your mobile phones;

      I wouldn’t be worried about a mobile phone if I had an old fashioned landline.

      https://archive.ph/14Wsz

      ‘Storm Arwen: Why power cuts left people unable to phone for help’

      Might be time to chuck out the coffee vendors and re-install phones in the phone boxes.

      When asked about those who were unable to make even 999 calls, a BT spokesperson said the damage caused by Storm Arwen had been “unprecedented and no phone or broadband provider could come up with a solution that would allow backup services to work for more than several days”.
      However, Ofcom says it recognises there may be exceptional circumstances where a normal level of service is not possible but “even in those circumstances, our rules are clear that there should be protections in place for people to call the emergency services”.
      Customers should be provided with “solutions that are appropriate for their needs”, including greater protection for those living in an area “subject to regular power outages longer than an hour”.
      A spokesperson said the regulator was “in touch with BT to understand how they are meeting these obligations to these customers”.

      There is an irony, spotted by Mr Bridgett, that the green agenda is not taking into account the realities of weather associated with climate change.
      Electric cars, air source heat pumps and the new digital landlines are all “useless in circumstances like this”, he says. “The whole thing’s an absolute joke in the aftermath of a storm like that.”
      He wants resilience built into utility infrastructure by the organisations responsible for it

    51. DJ says:

      Brian Doonthetoon @ 10:17 pm says, “Concentrate on what we can influence!”

      Brian, couldn’t agree with you more!
      Rev, please get a grip btl. It’s dragging this once great site down into the gutter.

    52. Hatuey says:

      I wish they’d bring back coal power stations and open a few mines up again.

      I’d be good with nuclear too. We could put them out of the way somewhere, in East Kilbride or something.

      The wind turbines just annoy me now. We don’t benefit from them in any way. And they’re everywhere, monumental reminders of our colonial existence…

      At least with coal more than 14 people would get jobs.

    53. Geri says:

      Start a government petition?

      Sturgeon to recall WM duds & call the convention.

      Even if she’s knocked back from SC she’s still supposed to be going ahead with a Plebiscite & kick starting a campaign – what’s keeping you, Nicola?

      If she doesn’t deliver then a vote of no confidence. Claim of right. If Scots have people power then use it *the right of the Scottish people to determine the form of government best suited thier needs*

      Reason of no confidence? She’s not used a single mandate we voted for & she’s not prepared the groundwork she promised.

      What does the group think of Joanna as FM or Angus? Philippa would be good too.

    54. Geri says:

      Hatuey..

      Get yerself some logs. They’re environmentally friendly & can make a cracking bit of toast.

    55. John Main says:

      @Breastplate says:5 October, 2022 at 9:30 pm

      I admit there is a possibility that the Yanks blew the pipeline.

      Just as there is a possibility it was the UK rainians, or the Poles. Did I mention the Russtis?

      Here’s the thing, BP. I intend to wait for the evidence. That’s a deeply unfashionable stance on here, where immediate, borderline-hysterical, OTT reaction to everything is the standard MO.

      The truth will out eventually, like it always does.

      Given that just about everybody on here agrees that AS was fitted up without evidence, I really thought that Wings BTL posters would have absorbed the lessons from that episode and become more determined than ever that claims and accusations must be fact-based.

      Very odd that so many seem to have headed off in the opposite direction.

    56. John Main says:

      @ Hatuey says:6 October, 2022 at 1:11 am

      “I wish they’d bring back coal power stations and open a few mines up again”

      BBC reporting coal generation being maintained so there will be no power cuts this winter. Linked stories easy enough to find online with a typical 30-seconds worth of effort.

      “At least with coal more than 14 people would get jobs”

      Hmmm. Anybody believing that a new deep mine would employ hundreds of blokes (and a few gals, this is 2022) wielding picks has been living in their bedroom for the past 30 years.

      The advantages to automation and ROVs are so bleeding obvious I won’t bother.

    57. John Main says:

      Reports of the Russtis killing their own people, i.e. those people who little more than a week ago were seemingly voting 99.2% in favour of becoming forever Russti.

      Does anybody know how the government of Chad feels about this? The must be fizzing that they were tricked into lending their seal of approval to the referenda.

      But I see Brian DTT appealing for a stop to discussion of this topic on here.

      Happy to comply, Brian, but I reserve the right to re-start if others won’t leave it alone. Which is usually the case.

    58. John Main says:

      “The whole thing’s an absolute joke in the aftermath of a storm like that.”

      Tell you what the biggest joke is. Those people who like to boast to anyone who will listen that they no longer carry, use or need cash.

      The day we all supinely agreed to give up our right to pay all bills in cash, and our right to be paid all money owed to us in cash, was the day we abandoned a significant chunk of our freedom.

      And as with so much of what happens, the adverse effects are worse for the poorest people in our society.

    59. Ruby says:

      Power Cut Survival Kit continued.

      Old fashioned flask.

      One with a glass interior not those stainless steel ones which are hopeless.

      I probably should be using my old fashioned flask currently to save electricity. ie boil kettle once and fill up flask.
      That would be fine if I just drank cups of tea but I’m a big fan of Nespresso.

      I might check the carboot sales & charity shops for a 2nd old fashioned flask. That could be used to fill up my hot water bottle & to make instant porridge/soup/noodles.

      Oh shit! I don’t have an old fashioned hot water bottle.

      That’s another thing to add to the list.

      2 x Old fashioned flasks
      1 Hot water bottle.
      1 very small jar of instant coffee – Yuck!

      Check out camping stove & battery operated radio.
      Butane gas stove Amazon £18

      Wind up Emergency Radio, Solar Hand Crank Portable AM/FM Weather Radio with Cell Phone Charger, 1W Flashlight, Motion Sensor Reading Lamp and SOS Alarm for Home and Outdoor Emergency £31

      I might have to revise my list. How long have I got before the power cuts start?

      These power cuts are going to cost us a fortune.

      Still thinking going to Spain for the winter might have been a good idea.
      That would have been a lot easier if the ‘thick as fuckers’ hadn’t voted for Brexit.
      It’s not as easy to be an illegal immigrant in Spain as it is in the good old UK.

      The ‘thick as fuck Brexiteers’ probably wouldn’t like to be reminded of this but back before Spain joined the EU Spain was over-run with British illegal immigrants stealing Spanish jobs. Probably the same today.

    60. Ruby says:

      Brian Doonthetoon says:
      5 October, 2022 at 10:17 pm

      WHY is it, that so many contributing BTL here are concerned with R-ussia and UK-raine?

      It’s their way of protecting Sturgeon, the Union & Brexit.

      The more we focus on UK-raine, Covid & the fuckin’ franchise the less we focus on the SNP, the Union & Brexit.

      I blame the ‘2 Cunts’ they are the worst culprits.

    61. Dorothy Devine says:

      Ruby , only two????

    62. Rab Davis says:

      I see that Wanker Main is still here.

      But more importantly,,,saw a comment about the two latest opinion polls that came out the other day.

      “…Though both polls did also record increases in support for independence. YouGov had support for a Yes vote up five points to 43%, while backing for the Union dropped by one point to 45%, with 7% undecided.

      Savanta ComRes had Yes up one point on 45% and No remaining at 46%, with 8% undecided…”

      WTF is happening here. Two polls STILL showing NO ahead of the YES vote.

      The blame lies squarely at Sturgeon’s door.

      In these circumstances the Yes vote should be well above 65%.

      The shear lacklustre approach by Sturgeon and her MPs and MSPs is the sole reason we are in this position.

      And her fellow SNP members don’t help the Indy cause either.

      Watch them next week swinging from the rafters as Sturgeon enters the arena.

      SNP members remind me of NO voters just before the vote in 2014,,,I couldn’t understand why they were so slow on the uptake,,, SNP members are now in that category,,, what the fuck don’t they see that the rest of us all plainly see?

    63. Republicofscotland says:

      What chance do we have of ditching this odious union when our gutless and spineless MSPs, can’t or more like won’t, even answer this simple question.

      “MSPs Bottle It

      They rejected calls- by 93 votes to 22 -to confirm if King Charles asked for changes to the Scottish rent freeze bill that could affect tenancies on his Highland estate. Calls to disclose whether the King used his opaque powers, ‘crown consent,’ are now muted.”

      https://twitter.com/Grouse_Beater/status/1577803737124446212?cxt=HHwWiICxyfWIvuUrAAAA

    64. Republicofscotland says:

      Re my 10.39am comment.

      Here’s how the voting went.

      https://twitter.com/Mislein/status/1577901739898015744/photo/2

    65. Breeks says:

      Brian Doonthetoon says:
      5 October, 2022 at 10:17 pm
      WHY is it, that so many contributing BTL here are concerned with R-ussia and UK-raine?

      I’ll plead guilty to that BDTT, but I’ll stop. It seems counterproductive.

      The reason I felt it was relevant is that listening to (banned) Ruski rhetoric helps me to see how impressionable people (both them and us), are influenced, false narratives are seeded and a grossly distorted story becomes celebrated and accepted as “truth”. This matters, because there are a lot of echoes with what’s going on in Scotland.

      Not to dwell on it, nor promote the theory, but the Ruskis reckon the US is increasingly under the influence of Israel, and that is the source of the warmongering in the Middle East, and why the UN is impotent in International affairs. It isn’t Ruskiland orchestrating tensions, it’s NATO expansion breaking promises made when the Soviet Union collapsed. So far, so boring, everybody knows this.

      However, the reason why Western values are toxic to Ruski, China, etc, is increasingly portrayed through crude exposés of Trangender / pedophilia / and disrespect for the sovereignty of weaker nations. Sound familiar? Again, who is orchestrating this? Where is money for it coming from? You might be forgiven for thinking it was designed to get right under the skins of religious societies such as I dunno, Islam? But wait, doesn’t it also make it easy for these nations to contemplate war on us, the gays, the pedos, the weirdos and morally bankrupt?

      Let me stress, these aren’t my views, I’m describing my interpretation of the views I see on “their” forums and social media, but to be honest, some of it resonates. In Scotland our sovereignty isn’t respected in the slightest, our media is full of lies and indoctrination, our political ideals, particularly Scottish Nationalism have been infiltrated and sabotaged by Transgender creeps and compromised “leadership”. Not in theory mind, actual fact.

      Scotland’s traditional neutrality and anti-war credentials are now boasting “No fly zone” Sturgeon, with MacDonald and Smith trying to flap their wings as warhawks, Angus Robertson in his pocket after having cosy chats with Israeli secret service manipulators, (Smith just recently “backing” Iranian women protests. Not because they’re women, but because of course, any instability in Iran must be welcomed).

      We now have joke UK prime ministers, who seem frankly quite bizarre as choices for the sober office of UK Prime Minister, but Truss, the latest imbecile, (who has just crashed the economy and handed billions to the wealthy), candidly promotes herself as a fanatical Zionist. Hear any alarm bells yet?

      I am not approving of the Ruskis, nor Mr Put, I am not allying myself to their cause, BUT, it is my unsettling suspicion that what is currently happening in Scotland with regard to the sabotage of Scottish Independence begins to bear an uncanny similarity to a clandestine regime change of the very type which the West and NATO are serial offenders.

      To think the unthinkable.. are the clandestine forces which plotted the 2014 coup in Ukr to install an vociferously anti-Rus government on Ruskiland’s border the same forces which have been grinding down Scottish Independence since 2014, and steering Scotland away from golden opportunities like Brexit, when Scottish Independence was there in the palm of our hands?

      I’m not backing Ruskiland, but it seems to me acutely apt to be asking ourselves whether Scotland has been the “victim” of the very same covert Western interference which the Ruskis, Chineze and Asian’s feel so intimidated and threatened by.

      So while this “theory” is just the tip of the iceberg, I do find it acutely fascinating to take an interest in what’s happening in Eastern Europe. I know, I know, it seems tangential and totally unrelated, but what if it’s not? What if it’s the same warmongering lobby groups and influencers who are determining that Ukr must have an anti-Rus government and be riven by war, are the same covert lobby groups determining that Scotland remains docile and Scottish Independence is put firmly on the back burner?

      So I repeat once again, I am not an apologist for the Ruskis, nor do I condone the invasion, but nor do I feel relaxed about people who swallow the British media’s version of events hook, line and sinker. People need to understand the extent, the extreme extent, to which they are being lied to.

      Sadly for Scotland, I believe our Scottish government is non responsive at the helm. It’s a pro-Independence government in name only, but not being steered by the pro Independence movement. We have suffered a regime change before we even had a regime to change.

      If those parallels exist in reality, that means the orchestration exists in reality. The interference in our affairs is a reality. And the best bit yet… right now, this minute, we’re blithely allowing these rotten compromised bodies, these false charlatans, the infiltrators, to waste month after month, year after year, organising a referendum for us. That’s kinda dumb of us don’t you think?

      Wake the fk up Scotland. The enemy isn’t at the gate, it is already so much worse than that.

      Look at it all. Take in the whole thing and look for the patterns.

    66. Breeks says:

      Oh yeah, and if somebody pipes up to call you an antisemite, don’t stop looking into things, look that much harder into them.

      That’s how antisemitism works as a defence mechanism. It’s a general purpose / coverall accusation designed to stop people asking questions. A lot like homophobia come to think of it…

    67. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Breeks (11.46) –

      Bravo.

      😉

    68. Dan says:

      Aye Breeks, it’s not beyond the bounds of possibility that Scotland’s future and oor quest to return to self-governing nation status is being strongly manipulated by external interests when you see things playing out as they are.
      Gregor’s many btl links on various threads certainly highlight undemocratic influence and collusion.

    69. Ian Brotherhood says:

      ‘The dangers of escalation towards the nuclear are becoming very real. I fully acknowledge and condemn the toxic nature of much Ukrainian nationalism, the glorification of Nazis, the banning of opposition parties and of Russian language teaching and media. I utterly oppose NATO expansion. Of course it was not Russia who blew up the Nordstream pipeline or shelled the nuclear power station they were themselves occupying.

      I absolutely get all of that.

      But unless Armageddon appeals to you, and if you have the slightest respect for truth over ideology, the cheering on of Putin has to stop.’

      Craig Murray.

      Can’t remember seeing any blog by Craig receiving so many replies. Really interesting stuff.

      https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2022/10/striding-towards-armageddon-why-putins-annexations-are-wrong/

    70. Geri says:

      That’s how I see it too Breeks.

      I’m no fan of his but his reasons are valid & he’s given yrs of warnings. Spoken from his own mouth. Treaties broken, fkwits on his borders & NATO pointing their weapons. Then, when asked why, they humiliate & taunt the fall of his Union & to STFU & had the EU start playing the same game.

      The west started this shit & the west thinks it’ll play the poor refugee card to shut down ppl questions. Same as they did with Iraq. There’d be no casualties if the West hadn’t instigated it all. There was an excellent Irish speaker in the EU parliament who lost her shit on the supply of weapons that’s keeping this going. Bullets don’t solve problems. Talking does. The wee puke got up in a tantrum & stormed out the parliament.

      Sturgeon & Co pissing about all Zionist lately & celebrating casualties of war & no fly zones – while she has fk all say & Scots don’t have a foreign policy. All while that rusted heap of junk sits on the Clyde. How fast the bairns not bombs mantra lasted. Not wise ramblings to make from her & her cabal when a peacekeeping country is seeking acceptance on the world stage & it’s cause for independence.

      Truss & Starmer have fallen into Zionist line. The labour files chart Corbyns demise. It stinks to high heaven & the gender shit has run rampant.

    71. Dan says:

      I didn’t see mention of this in here yesterday.

      Murrell perjury probe is dropped after two years

      https://twitter.com/GrahamGGrant/status/1577553011727126529

    72. Geri says:

      He should never have been allowed to continue in the party once wifey became FM.
      He should never have been allowed to continue in the party when this shit hit the fan.
      They should’ve all gone over the mishandling alone.

    73. Ruby says:

      Dorothy Devine says:
      6 October, 2022 at 10:00 am

      Ruby , only two????

      There were more but there are only two now</b.

    74. Ruby says:

      Dan says:
      6 October, 2022 at 1:35 pm

      I didn’t see mention of this in here yesterday.

      “Murrell perjury probe is dropped after two years”

      https://twitter.com/GrahamGGrant/status/1577553011727126529

      There are lots of things that don’t get discussed here. It seems to be all about UK-raine, Covid & the fuckin’ franchinse.

      https://archive.ph/I3zFV

      I saw that article yesterday. I didn’t know he was being investigated over the past 5 months. That didn’t get much press coverage.

      They seem to be saying he didn’t tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth but his ‘contradictory statements’ didn’t reach the level of criminality necessary to press charges but if any further evidence is found they may change their mind.

      Aren’t there other police investigations going on. They take so long you tend to forget about them (that probably the idea)

    75. Geri says:

      What would you like to talk about? The scandals of the SNP? That’s almost as riviting as hearing the Tories are shite on loop. Lol.
      1 & 3 are about independence.

      If ppl don’t know that then they’ve not been paying attention.

      The west won’t tolerate disobedience. Far to many have a vested interest in having it’s lap dog remaining in the UN under the UK banner- fully intact as the UK. It’s the only thing they have left

      Independence isn’t compatible with thier world view. The franchise, if it remains as it is, will guarantee that picture doest change.

      We won’t get ‘Ach well, we’ll try indyref3 – no harm done eh?

    76. John Main says:

      @Ruby says:6 October, 2022 at 2:36 pm

      “There are lots of things that don’t get discussed here. It seems to be all about UK-raine, Covid & the fuckin’ franchinse”

      So discuss them then. Naebody’s stopping you.

      If it is yer feart of being laughed at for your stupidity that’s holding you back, then up yer game.

      Don’t take that one personally, it applies to a few of the roasters on here.

    77. John Main says:

      @Dorothy Devine says:6 October, 2022 at 10:00 am

      “only two????”

      Good question. Is naebody counting Breeks and new disciple Geri?

      Zionism to blame for Scotland’s woes? You couldna make it up.

      On the latest thread, somebody was talking about scraping up the shit under the barrel. The analogy applies here too.

    78. Breastplate says:

      You are correct Geri,
      Many of the subjects SOME people don’t want to discuss is intertwined with our own politics, every day life and Scottish Independence.

      It was a former Secretary General of NATO that said in 2014 that Scottish independence would be “cataclysmic for the West”.

      But instead of discussing pertinent subjects related to why this site exists, why not try tumbleweed spotting.

      There’s absolutely nothing wrong with people have a difference of opinion, it’s good for us.
      I agree with many things Andy Ellis or John Main say (not so much Chas) but I also disagree with some things they say, it’s perfectly normal.

      Stuart Campbell will let us know if he’s had enough of us but as far as I can tell, it’s not alternative views he doesn’t like but childlike behaviour with other people btl.
      I understand that some people don’t like hearing other viewpoints but I do.
      It would be completely boring if there was no debate on here.

      An echo chamber is on the WGD channel if you wish it.

    79. John Main says:

      @ Breastplate says:6 October, 2022 at 7:10 pm

      I may not agree with what you write, but I will fight to the death to defend your right to write it.

      Haha, as it happens, I do agree with what you write, so I am safe enough for now.

      IMO it’s all interconnected. Our world changed forever on the 24th February 2022, and we have yet to fully comprehend how things are going to work out.

      To claim that this historical event will leave the Scottish Indy conversation unaffected is to deny reality.

      So it can’t be off limits for discussion.

      As for the “playground shit”, it is the fall back position of a few on here, and we all understand that its use signals that its users have reached the limits of their abilities.

    80. Dan says:

      John Main says: at 7:56 pm

      As for the “playground shit”, it is the fall back position of a few on here, and we all understand that its use signals that its users have reached the limits of their abilities.

      Of course, calling Ruby “Pubes” isn’t “playground shit”, no siree… 😉

      https://wingsoverscotland.com/fire-water-burn/comment-page-2/#comment-2704314

    81. Geri says:

      John Main.
      We’ve just witnessed it in action.
      Corbyn wasn’t compatible with the west. He spoke out on Israeli atrocities & the plight of Palestinians. That couldn’t be tolerated – A blaze of false allegations will stop his lofty ideas. Could you picture him on the UN security council & asking why the feck Israel was the only one who could commit human rights abuses on such a grand scale & break over 200 resolutions with absolutely zero consequences from *the beloved international community*
      Sturgeon was heading for the same exit door but she’s a sudden champion of all things war now, a fully signed up member of IHRA & she’s shut up about indyref. All saving her from the same treatment.

      Included in the IHRA that Corbyn was forced to sign up to – it is absolutely forbidden to ever question the Israeli state. Ever. On anything. It’s anti semitism.

      & It’s not *over there* The Scottish Jewish community don’t want Scottish independence. For the exact same reasons.

      The break up of the UK? Leaves little England. No seat at security council. No money. No funds for warring. No credibility. Pish poor & no gob to run with amongst the big hitters.

      Why do you think the BritNats have such an obsession with who’d press the button at every single GE & leadership challenge? I don’t ever remember this being front & center of politics until Cameron & the absolute rash of lobby groups influencing government.

      Breastplate, yes. We received plenty of veiled threats during indyref. Even after it. We were a clear & present danger to UK security. They’d have to take our airports out LOL Or BoJo whipping up the military types that it’d be a travesty if we broke up the UKs military might. He wasn’t speaking to us – that’s a clear dog whistle.

    82. Ruby says:

      Breastplate says:
      6 October, 2022 at 7:10 pm

      Stuart Campbell will let us know if he’s had enough of us but as far as I can tell, it’s not alternative views he doesn’t like but childlike behaviour with other people btl.
      I understand that some people don’t like hearing other viewpoints but I do.
      It would be completely boring if there was no debate on here.

      The problem with the debates on here which I would probably call ‘pissing contests’ is they are like Sturgeon’s mandate neverending. The fuckin’ franchise has been ‘debated’ here for at least the last six months it never ends and it’s just the same people saying the same thing over and over and over again.

      Why do you think Stuart Campbell banned the words UK-rain & Pu*in? I think that may have been him telling us that he’d had enough of that particular topic.

    83. Ruby says:

      “As for the “playground shit”, it is the fall back position of a few on here, and we all understand that its use signals that its users have reached the limits of their abilities.”

      The winner of the ‘playground shit’ prize definitely goes to Andy Ellis. He seems to reach the limit of his abilities in every post he makes.

      He’s even been warned by Stuart Campbell about his ‘fuckin’ playground shit’

    84. Breeks says:

      Breastplate says:
      6 October, 2022 at 7:10 pm

      There’s absolutely nothing wrong with people have a difference of opinion, it’s good for us.

      In theory, that’s perfectly true. But the theory begins to break down the moment one of those opinions is disingenuous, delusional, or flagrantly dishonest.

      When the whole narrative is shifted from the reality, the whole story is a construct detached from objective truth, which isn’t actually all that far away from what we’re seeing (or rather not seeing) about Ukr, then arguably, a need arises to downgrade some opinions as less legitimate than others. It becomes essential to recognise the disingenuous feeds.

      I’m not talking about errors, or even reportage which hasn’t got the full story. I’m talking about the wilful disinformation. It is extraordinarily dangerous.

      Why are Western reporters saying Put is losing this war and getting desperate when it simply isn’t true? What’s the plan here? What happens when the truth gets out? Is there a plan or “backup” story to cover up the lie? Or is there something more sinister going on, such as setting the scene for a false flag atrocity such as a dirty bomb or low yield nuclear blast? “Aye that fella Put was backed into corner! He’s used a nuke because he was getting his arse kicked!” Spoiler alert…He really wasn’t.

      If you take the time to listen, (and of course do the legwork to find it), a lot of what Put says is ominous, yes, actually scary, but it’s also measured and rational. Frankly I find it much less scary than some of the rabid Russo-phobic nonsense coming from the likes of Truss.

      I don’t believe Mr P has designs on Ukr, nor is he likely to press the red button. He hasn’t any need to. Then you look at NATO, Dizzy Lizzy Truss, and Biden who’d probably press any button someone put in front of him, and suddenly the jeopardy we’re all in is off the scale.

      We are staring down the barrel of nuclear Armageddon, but not because Mr Put is a megalomaniac… A big contributing factor is that over the last couple of decades, the West and NATO seem to have abandoned restraint and rational foreign policy and Western nations, the US and UK in particular, now elect leadership regimes who are as mad as a bunch of frogs.

      Correction, mad as a bunch of frogs armed to the teeth and utterly determined to spend eye watering billions on weaponry and point it all at Ruskiland and Cnina.

    85. Geri says:

      Breeks,
      Aye, they’ll be looking around for where to have an accident.

      Just so happens the UK could do without a particular thorn in its side at the moment – a headache that isn’t going away anytime soon. Was the warning of more waste a precursor for an Oops! Moment? In our future soon?

      If you reverse his situation he’s not acted any different than any other country would. If the Mexicans had a foreign power meddling with treaties, especially an enemy, while playing with nukes – they’d be fkn car park over night.

      They started the dismantle of the USSR & they’ll finish it – while telling the world the usual pish propaganda it wisnae me!

      It’s US foreign policy to be world dominant. No superpower but them. NATO is the enforcer. Ireland & France stayed well out of signing up. It’s a hegemony.

      Anyway. Maybe Ruby wants Wings to have a ‘Whits fir tea?’ thread in the basket weaving section? ?

    86. John Main says:

      “I don’t believe Mr P has designs on Ukr”

      Seriously, for new readers here, that little gem was posted by Breeks at 6 October, 2022 at 9:07 pm

      Here’s another:

      “We are staring down the barrel of nuclear Armageddon”

      Sure, Breeks.

      The Zionist conspiracy reaches into the Kremlin, where it could, if it so chooses, make Mr Put press the big, red button.

      I note you are not saying one of the satans will start it.

      You are saying Mr Put will start it because his attempted annexation of a sovereign, independent country went tits up.

      And rather than accept that reality, he will take himself, his country and as much of the world as he can get, down with him.

      But he’s not the baddy, here in your view. Oh no.

    87. Hatuey says:

      Craig Murray’s latest is simply weird.

      Amidst all the propaganda and lies they’re force-feeding us, he decided to write an article urging people to stop supporting Vlad?

      And he somehow thinks that the support Vlad receives, support you’d need a blooming PCR machine to find, is going to inexplicably cause the war to escalate?

      Just to underline the clarity of his thought, he makes clear that he believes the US were responsible for blowing up the pipeline, an act of industrial warfare that has the potential to take this conflict in all sorts of grim directions…

      When this gets hairy — and it definitely will — it’ll have absolutely nothing to do with any support for Vlad found in western quarters.

    88. John Main says:

      @Dan says:6 October, 2022 at 8:09 pm

      “Of course, calling Ruby “Pubes” isn’t “playground shit”, no siree…”

      Don’t be daft, Dan, of course it is, which is why I stopped.

      What? You think I’m going to deny it? Fuck, no. I’m not one of the roasters on here who’s reaction to ever being called out or corrected is to simply double down.

      Seeing as how it’s such an ongoing issue for you, why not count all the incidents? Then cunt all the count-calling incidents. Give us the comparative scores. List all of those who have merrily joined in the cunt-calling for what must be getting on for years now.

      Make yourself useful. At least we will have a fact-based post for once.

    89. Scott says:

      John Main says:
      6 October, 2022 at 10:13 pm

      List all of those who have merrily joined in the cunt-calling for what must be getting on for years now.

      —-

      John Main is a cunt.

    90. John Main says:

      @Hatuey says:6 October, 2022 at 10:11 pm

      “Amidst all the propaganda and lies they’re force-feeding us”

      You have to admit, Hatuey, that the propaganda and lies are all quite ineffectual. This site is hoaching with over-achievers, like yourself, who have insight into the “higher understanding”.

      I wonder at the force feeding too. It doesn’t seem to work. In fact, some might question if it even exists, given that every TV, radio, laptop, moby and app still comes with an Off button.

      Are the Zionists practising subliminal messaging on us as we sleep yet? Asking for a long-term psychiatric ward inmate.

    91. John Main says:

      Hey Scott

      Welcome back.

      Not one of your best, but that’s the problem with dashing off posts like that.

      What you doing on this thread anyways? Did you find it as boring as I did, what with everybody terrified at being the first one to break the “Ukr taboo”?

      This thread allows us to engage in “playground shit” as much as we wish.

      Your turn.

    92. John Main says:

      Sorry, Scott, meant to write:

      Did you find the new thread as boring as I did, what with everybody terrified at being the first one to break the “Ukr taboo”?

    93. Ruby says:

      Geri says:

      Anyway. Maybe Ruby wants Wings to have a ‘Whits fir tea?’ thread in the basket weaving section? ?

      Why would you think that Geri?

    94. Scott says:

      John Main says:
      6 October, 2022 at 10:42 pm

      Sorry, Scott, meant to write: …

      that’s the problem with dashing off posts like that.

    95. Geri says:

      UKr has been independent for over 20 years.

      They had one rule to follow. Remain neutral.

      If you end up in trouble you can have assistance.

      Feck! Is that it? I’m free to go?

      Just keep yer heid doon & don’t fraternise with known undesirables?

      That sounds simple enough.

      That shouldn’t be mistaken for support.

      I just don’t swallow the propaganda ‘poor UKr all they want is self determination’

      Or the same feckers wouldn’t be denying ours.

    96. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Onnyhoo, does anyone btl have a favourite fork?

      I have bought and inherited a number of different styles but my favourites are the wide ones with four tines.

      In other news, film at a later time.

    97. Geri says:

      Whose arse would you test that on first? 😛

    98. Geri says:

      Ruby.

      I was being sarcastic. Yer no intae the franchise the? LOLz! 😛

      Btw. You’d be fuming if you knew who the respondents were to SNPs gender self id consultation. Have you ever looked?

      Being serious – it’s a serious business who votes for shit we don’t like. Sturgeon was in the process of full steam ahead when she was abruptly forced to make a statement to parly she was putting the breaks on for now. Thank fuck! It nearly became law!

      Jordon had an episode. Full on meltdown! Pesky fecking Nats!

      So moral of the tale – see who votes on shit that concerns you.

    99. Scott says:

      Brian Doonthetoon says:
      7 October, 2022 at 12:04 am

      Onnyhoo, does anyone btl have a favourite fork?

      I have a least favourite fork – it was one with three prongs that just felt horrible in my mouth. My brurr used to put it out specially for me if he had to set the table, because he was and is a cunt.

    100. Geri says:

      Profile of Respondents re self-ID

      ** 3. In total, 15,697 responses were available for analysis, of which 15,532 were from individual members of the public and 165 were from groups or organisations. Overall, 49% of respondents to the consultation are resident in Scotland, with 38% resident in the rest of the UK and the remaining
      13% resident elsewhere in the world.**

      Nearly outvoted. Again.

      https://www.gov.scot/publications/review-gender-recognition-act-2004-analysis-responses-public-consultation-exercise-report/

    101. wee monkey says:

      The SNP have killed indy.

      If there was ever a chance that an independent Scotland could not just survive, but thrive, they’ve categorically killed it stone dead for the immediate future.

      The corruption & fraud that emanates thanks to them is criminal, & their day will come soon enough.

    102. Geri says:

      The SNP aren’t the Independence movement & they’re no longer the vehicle to get us there.

      They’re a bunch of London’s administrator’s.

      The only language they’d understand is to be voted out.

      Even if indyref goes ahead, it’ll lose.

      We need a giant to shape a new Scotland & a dragon at the exits.

      Cocks in frocks won’t cut it.

      SNP had loads of cash to throw at Stonewall. Zero to spend on three main ingredients for indy.

      Information – mailings, podcasts, social media.
      Representatives – ppl that knew thier shit in both parliament’s.
      Scrutiny – a daily debunker/fact checker.

      They’ve done feck all. Even employing the author of the Vow. What the feck has he done?

      Independence needs to take back control. Wipe out this shower of shite & start again.

    103. Ruby says:

      Brian Doonthetoon says:
      7 October, 2022 at 12:04 am

      Onnyhoo, does anyone btl have a favourite fork?

      I can’t help you with ‘basket weaving’ or even about ‘making yer tea’
      I can help with the forks as I did work as a silver service waitress when I was a student but that’s pretty boring but what might be useful is the use of a fork to mend a broken zip. Three pronged forks are best.

      https://tinyurl.com/m9jkfcu2

      Happy to help with any further tips & wrinkles you may require just ‘zip it’ with sexist jibes about ‘basket weaving’ & ‘making yer tea’. 🙂

    104. Geri says:

      Ruby
      FFS get down from yer cross. I’ve already explained I was being sarcastic – said in jest cause the topic wasn’t about what you wanted to talk about. Didn’t Wings used to have an off topic discussion area? I think it’d be a handy tool to archive discontent between indy & non indy support. Our own convention & assemblies discussing contentious topics LOL

      Or maybe he’d, rightly, tell us all to fuck off & create our own site. He’s not playing mink monitor.

      BTL will go of topic because that’s what happens when maybe other factors have a direct relation to the article or breaking news interrupts normal service because no one can start a new post.

      I’m female, btw. I was being sarcastic of other forums who have that sort of ‘whits for tea’ layout lol.

    105. willie says:

      Just watching the reports of the commencement of the COP27 conference.

      And with its commencement there has been extensive coverage of ex-Prime Minister Boris Johnson giving an address to what was actually a fringe meeting.

      With Rishi Sunak speaking this afternoon as the ” official ” prime minister it is not difficult to realize the division in the Tory Party and how Boris Johnson and his clique are trying to undermine the ” actual ” Prime Minister.

      The UK could be headed for absolute economic collapse never seen before and these Tory clowns carry on like this. Pensions, savings, incomes, benefits all headed down the toilet – it’s the Brexit Bonanza, Brexit Bounce, Better Together jamboree.

      Suck it up folks, suck all this shit up and enjoy.

      It wouldn’t be too difficult to imagine how a clique in the Tory Party could be ready to reinstall Johnson. Give it to Christmas and the place will be a mad house of gnashing teeth.

      No wonder Police forces up and down the country together with the military are emergency planning on population lock down. It’s not just the Yanks who are heading for insurrection. Only difference is that they are tooled up with guns – protestors and police.

      But at least today the loon ball government that wanted to cut taxes for the rich, but now want increase taxes, impose swingeing spending cuts, took the step to announce that they were dropping the plan to spend £250m on a replacement Royal Yacht Britannia.

      Tells you all – hard hats on folks!



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