The world's most-read Scottish politics website

Wings Over Scotland


The Cost Of Truth

Posted on December 17, 2024 by

The Scottish Government just issued another response in the long-running Freedom Of Information battle with alert Wings reader Benjamin Harrop over its conspiracy to frame and imprison the late Alex Salmond on false charges. Here’s a genuine extract.

Yeah, definitely nothing to hide here.

The release came a couple of days after the Scottish Information Commissioner, who has been trying to improve the Scottish Government’s woeful FOI performance for the last seven years, had once again expressed his dismay at their conduct over the entire three-and-a-half-year affair of Ben’s request.

Which makes this paragraph somewhat ironic:

Let’s just spell that out. Having spent years and hundreds of thousands of pounds of public money, against the advice of their own lawyers, on a futile legal attempt – contemptuously thrown out by the Court Of Session in just 20 seconds last December – to resist handing over ANY of the information sought by the request, the Scottish Government is now refusing on the basis that doing so would cost more than £600.

It’s hard to find words, readers.

(The Scottish Government refuses to reveal exactly how much money it has thrown at trying to keep this information secret since April 2021, but we know that the half-day Court Of Session hearing a year ago cost taxpayers over £73,000 by itself.)

Incidentally, at the time of writing this article we’ve still been unable to locate the release on the Scottish Government’s infamously unreliable FOI website, which is why we’ve uploaded it at the first link at the top of the post. But among the barrage of documents filed on the site in the last couple of days we did stumble across this:

It shows that in the last six months there have, once again, been zero complaints made under the procedures which were initiated almost seven years ago with the specific intention of being used solely and exclusively against Alex Salmond. He remains the only person ever targeted by the process, despite a supposed widespread culture of such harassment at Holyrood.

Readers could ostensibly verify that fact by clicking the link at the bottom of the page which claims to lead to previous updates on the figures, but in fact it leads to a generic UK web archive (not, as suggested, a Scottish Government one), which is broken.

Meanwhile, Nicola Sturgeon continues to breeze gaily around the country attending drag queen galas and book festivals, although the BBC did remarkably manage to encounter her on one of her extremely rare visits to her place of work yesterday, where she told them how much she was enjoying her life.

She also toured the media studios audaciously explaining how everyone except her was responsible for the “toxic” environment of the transgender debate (while taking credit for equal-marriage legislation passed by Alex Salmond and remorselessly shilling her upcoming book) and boo-hooing about how much abuse she’d had over it.

But the arc of justice bends onwards.

And to be honest, readers, living to see the truth finally come to light is the main driver that’s keeping this website going. There is no hope of Scottish independence under the current SNP, because the SNP now exists solely to try to protect the perpetrators of the conspiracy against Salmond. It’s the only thing they truly care about, and today’s publications are just the latest in a vast dossier of evidence of that fact.

Whatever that truth ultimately costs, it’s a bill that must be paid, because nothing else can happen until it is. Justice is the price of independence.

Subscribe
Notify of
guest

509 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Calum

“And to be honest, readers, living to see the truth finally come to light is the main thing that’s keeping this website in existence.”

This is a laudable goal and one I think all your readers can fully get behind.

Alex Stewart

It’s one of the reasons we fund him for sure. One of the reasons i do anyway. Indy cannot come without the truth beng known by all.

Ruby

Agreed! Sadly it would seem most readers are more interested in things going on outwith Scotland.

Mike Fenwick

2001 – correction – 2021!

Hatey McHateface

“it’s a bill that must be paid, because nothing else can happen until it is. Justice is the price of independence”

Amen to that.

Insider

Hmm !
Looks like all your posts are being automatically down-voted by bots, Hatey.

Hatey McHateface

Ah ken.

Like the doughty, formidable Scots heroes of yesteryear, the ones I well recall learning about as an impressionable schoolboy, I’m awa tae menstruate in hysterical quivering shame and horror at being downvoted 🙂

Jay

Is there a psychiatrist in the house?

Robert Matthews

I don’t think  Winfred Overholser is available.

Jim Tadgercock

I tried to vote + on it but it says I have already voted which I have not.

Mark Beggan

Your vote meter has Reversed Winding. People actually like what you say.

Sven

The truth of what was done to The Hero and by whom is a fine cause to devote WOS to.
For not until the full account of the extent of the plot, the involvement of allegedly impartial civil servants and the conniving of corrupt and venal MSPs comes to public knowledge can anyone hope to see any degree of honesty and integrity return to Scots politics.
More power to your elbow.

Young Lochinvar

Well said Sven!

Ian McCubbin

I agree with all said and understand it will be May 2025 before next legal steps will be enacted by Alex Salmond’s executors.

David Russell

Can the SIC lad not force the issue, seems he’s been laying the groundwork to me. Also, just saying, Current vacancies | Scottish Information Commissioner

Campbell Clansman

“18 UN member states”
UH, Mike, the UN has over 190 member states. Not 18.

Tony Little

Maybe just to the current UNSC?

Campbell Clansman

Not true, either. the UNSC has 15 members.
A gentle suggestion: Perhaps instead of asking a question about an easily-looked-up fact, you should look up the fact.

Tony Little

Yawn

Andy Anderson

Only 18 needed for recognition

Andy Anderson

Stu why did you remove Mike Fenwicks comment on Sovereign Scot at the UN?

Campbell Clansman

Only 18? More Nonsense, Andy.
To be recognized as a member of the United Nations (UN), a state must go through the following process:

  1. Application: The state submits an application to the Secretary-General 
  2. Security Council: The Security Council considers the application 
  3. Council vote: Nine of the 15 Council members must vote in favor of the application, and none of the five permanent members can vote against it 
  4. General Assembly: The General Assembly must vote in favor of the application with a two-thirds majority
Aidan

Can the application be made on behalf of the state by a campaign group with half a dozen members? For example, could a local scout group in Dundee decide to take on this brave task?

Campbell Clansman

There’s nothing to prevent a local Scout group, the Alba Party, the Monster Raving Loony Party, or any group with half-a-dozen members, from contacting the UN about Indy for Scotland, Indy for Lossiemouth, or whatever.
The UN would die laughing if any of the four actually applied.

Geri

Scotland is a country. Not a region.

& Any country can seek decolonisation & every country has the right to self determination & every country can even declare UDI. We’re only in a treaty – you don’t own Scotland.

It’s other countries who recognise Independence. Not a permission slip from England. In decolonisation they have hee-haw rights either including interference, the franchise, all broadcasting interference, counting votes or even setting fake targets..

Aidan

As I have explained to you before, international law deals in states and not in countries, and Scotland is not an independent state. There is no right provided in international law for groups of people to declare themselves as an independent state, outside of non-self governing territories, which is a defined term that on no reasonable construction could include Scotland.

This is explained in the Scottish S30 case and the Quebec reference case at the Supreme Court.

Geri

Away & get yerself tae fck.

Scotland is in a union. That’s it. A UNION. It’s not a region of England looking for separation.

There isn’t an international treaty alive anywhere in the world that requires the other sides permission to terminate it. David Davis, Brexshit negotiations.

& Palestine. The UN is never done voting, discussing & vetoing the plight of the Palestinian State that apparently doesn’t even exist.

So do jog on with yer made up pish!

The Supreme court was made up pish too to favour the colonisers. Complete bunkum as it’s even stated in the UN charter of a people’s right to self determination. England doesn’t OWN Scotland. Get over it already..

Aidan

England isn’t a state either so I don’t know in what form “Englands” permission might even be sought in your bizarre made up legal order. The United Kingdom is a state and one formed of four constituent countries. It does not exist on a treaty basis.

I know you think that the law is what you say it is, not what is universally recognised by judges, institutions and private individuals. What however baffles me, is having awarded yourself the supreme power to declare what the law is in your own rambling and incoherent way, why have you been so unambitious. After all, in your land of make believe you could be queen, in charge of an already independent Scotland with unimaginable wealth, at the helm of a world of subservient nations. Unbounded by the confines of reality, the possibilities are endless, and yet your invention barely changes the status quo.

For others reading, the right to self determination does not provide the right for people’s to form an independent country. This is a fundamental but common misunderstanding of the UN charter. The right exists of people’s to freely seek political, economic, social, and cultural advancement within a state or as a state. The right exists only to form an independent state where peoples are subject to a colonised arrangement or are non-self governed, so cannot self-determine within that structure. This is well defined in international law (and in the latter case a list is maintained) which does not apply to Scotland.

Zander Tait

The UK does not consist of 4 “constituent countries” Aidan.

Does it?

Aidan

It does, England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. There are also overseas territories if we want to start getting pedantic, but they aren’t countries.

Zander Tait

No it doesn’t Aidan.

The UK does not consist of 4 “constituent countries”.

Does it?

Aidan

Perhaps you consider asking the same question twice as some clever form of rhetorical device. Let me dispel that notion.

If you have a point to make then crack on and make it.

Zander Tait

Delighted to Aidan. My point is this:

The UK does not consist of 4 “constituent countries” as you falsely claim.

Does it?

Captain Caveman

In the highly unlikely event that you really are unsure as to the identities of the various constituent parts of the United Kingdom, might I suggest your using “Google” to go find out these elementary facts yourself, there’s a good lad.

Ruby

You should read the Crawford & Boyle legal advise commission by the UK Government.

Alternatively you could read the following which was written by Derek Bateman in March 2014.

March 26, 2014

An Auld Sang Gang Wrang

Guess what I’ve been up to as the sun shines? Reading the British government’s legal advice on independence, of course. You know, one of those efforts we’re not allowed to know the cost of.

Here are some headlines I’d forgotten since its publication last year.

The Treaty of Union is irrelevant

Scotland ceased to exist in law

It was merged into an enlarged England

It has no international personality in its own right

It cannot revert to pre- 1707 independence

There you have it. Oh, did I mention that the rUK is continuator state as well and will inherit all the rights of obligations of international treaties and memberships…and Scotland might somehow manage to get back in if London and Brussels are charitable.

The work, paid for by you, and produced by James Crawford, Whewell Professor of International Law at Cambridge and Alan Boyle, Professor of Public International Law at Edinburgh, is one of those meandering, precedent-littered documents which takes us from Moravia via Panama and Syria to Slovakia in a (to me) bewildering trek of legalistic irrelevance. I’m sure it’s all terribly vital if you make a handsome living from mystifying others, and I think it’s not insignificant that both the learned gentlemen are also practising barristers at the English bar where spectacular effusions of legalistic formulations are rewarded with millionaire fees.

This looks like a classic case of getting what you pay for. (Not that we’re allowed to know how much). If the brief was to make a case for the defence of the British status quo, they got good value for our money.

If they were looking at the modern-day reality of a democratic wish to form a new state, they failed. Although, interestingly, that reality of politics and the need to compromise and accommodate, can be found the further down the text. For example: ‘Whether the accession process could be varied in Scotland’s case, given that it is already subject to EU law as part of the UK, might be a subject for negotiations’

Or: ‘All this is not to suggest that it is inconceivable for Scotland automatically to be an EU member. The relevant EU organs or Member States might be willing to adjust the usual requirements for membership in the circumstances of Scotland’s case’

Our learned friends hedge their bets and trim whenever the cold reality of a Yes vote, legally acknowledged by the UK, is confronted.

Suddenly there are no certainties about international law at all. I remember making a programme about the subject and finding that there is such a thing as international law, it’s that it won’t apply uniformly to any situation you name. It is a chameleon which changes into different shades depending on what question you ask it. And when it comes to the EU, international law is merely a backdrop, not an iron code. The rules are made by the Members and are adjusted according to the wishes of the Members and to hell with international law.

There are clearly political rather than legal insights in the document. Thus the reunification of Germany can be neatly written off as an “internal reorganisation” although it brought 17 million people into EU membership. Why? Because the other Members wanted it to and Germany is too powerful to be stopped. And it helped smooth the way for the single currency. Pragmatism in action.

Try this: ‘This is also not to suggest that EU law would necessarily no longer operate in Scotland unless it acceded as a new state…’

So although we would be taking ourselves outside the EU, somehow or other its laws would still apply while we’re out?

Then: ‘There are no legal rules within the EU that specifically govern whether it can automatically succeed to membership’. Throughout the long document, if you skip through the jargon, there are similar nuggets that make it clear Scotland’s position will be a matter of politics and expediency and the law is like the Highway Code – you read it and forget. What matters is: Can you drive?

Even our Unionist lawyer friends quote enlightened sources on EU pragmatism…. ‘A Scotland bent upon independence grounded in the clear democratic support of the Scottish people would create a moral and, given the international law principle of self- determination, probably a legal obligation for all member states to negotiate in good faith in order to produce such a result, but this solution lies essentially in the domain of politics, not law.’

Ironic, isn’t it? They’re supposed to prove that Scotland is hopelessly alone and excluded, yet the more you read their own words, the more it becomes clear that logic defies them. I had an email exchange with Professor Boyle where he distils his own work into one simple idea…that Scotland will have no difficulty entering all international organisations and… ‘The only matter in the advice that is of any significance outside a foreign ministry is whether, when and how an independent Scotland would become a member of the EU. That is a very problematic question as there are few rules, a lot of political decisions, and Spain to worry about.’

But my real beef with this stuff is the idea that our country doesn’t exist. What kind of message is that to give in a political campaign? ‘You’re so small and insignificant that you’re not real and don’t exist and the country you’re so proud of was absorbed into greater England and everything you’ve got today is courtesy of Westminster which can turn off the tap when it feels like it.’

Ok, then. I’ll vote No. We already know from the polling evidence that this Neanderthal electioneering is turning people off and still they keep it coming. It doesn’t matter for these purposes what the law of the ancients says, it matters what you want people to believe. It’s called politics. If people have been brought up to believe their country entered a voluntary union from which they have the right to extricate themselves, why on earth would you go to the trouble of constructing a highly dubious case to contradict them? What is gained? I doubt if more than one in ten Scots accepts the lawyers’ assessment. For example here are quotes from of our leading historians. First Ted Cowan, Professor of History at Glasgow: ‘The Treaty states that the two kingdoms of England and Scotland shall on 1 May 1707 and forever after be united into one kingdom by the name of Great Britain. By my reading if Scotland goes so does Great Britain’.

Then Dauvit Broun, also of Glasgow University: ‘The UK = Scotland + England. Take away Scotland, and there can be no more UK. I have not heard anyone explain why this should not be the case… ‘Britishness’ is not the same north and south of the border. For us, including the main currents of Scottish unionist thought and sentiment in the past, Britain was a partnership between Scotland and England. For the mainstream in England, though, it was (and is) assumed to be England in another form. It is assumed that, indeed, the English parliament continued (and with it the peculiarly English doctrine of the sovereignty of parliament). And, of course, we need look no further than the monarch’s numeral to see how deeply embedded this idea is: she is the first Queen Elizabeth of the United Kingdom of Britain, but persists in being Elizabeth II.’ He ends: ‘I fear that this mode of thinking about Britain among the English mainstream is so deeply embedded that they take it completely for granted. (It is, presumably, why England is in the remarkable position of being the only democratic nation with a football team but no parliament of their own–a statement they would not recognise because they regard Westminster as ‘their’ parliament, despite the third article of the Treaty of Union.)

There is a lesson in here for the Better Together strategists and they just don’t get it. Yes has been telling them since the start and they just don’t get it. The voters are now telling them and they just don’t get it. They need to get their knuckles off the ground and instead of paying lip service to optimism, actually try to find some. Here’s a suggestion. Reject the legal advice. Say it was a mistake. Say the government is not convinced it’s correct and it was insulting to say Scotland ceased to exist. Why? Because to say so is to deny the very thing they’re fighting for – the Union. I talk about what I call principled Unionism which works only if you accept your country is in voluntary partnership with England. Remove that concept and we become, as the lawyers indicate, little more than an adjunct to England. Not even a Unionist who claims to love Scotland can vote for that. The British might lose this Union because they failed to stand up for it.

Last edited 1 month ago by Ruby
Aidan

But you don’t have any underlying reasons or rationale for your point, it is just a bare statement with no accompanying explanation to support it

Zander Tait

Off you jolly well go then Aidan.

You explain your reasons and rationale for your statement.

Aidan

I could provide a long and detailed explanation as to the historical context and background, the culture and identity etc. but that isn’t needed.

The four countries of the United Kingdom are widely recognised in official documents, narrative and media. It isn’t my idea, it’s an idea that is commonly and widely accepted. If you think it’s wrong, then feel free to set out why you think that.

Zander Tait

Except you won’t provide any such thing.

The UK is the:

United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

And that’s it. End of story, end of discussion

Aidan

Right, so Great Britain is a country and Northern Ireland is a country?

Zander Tait

No.

The UK is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

It does not consist of 4 “constituent countries”.

I am surprised that a Yoon does not know what the UK is.

The again, in your case Aidan, maybe not.

Aidan

Are you gunning for lowest IQ poster on the wings comments section?

Are you unable to tell us why you don’t think England, Scotland, Wales and NI are countries? Or are you just able to tell us that they aren’t.

Zander Tait

The UK is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

To claim otherwise reveals you to be a complete Yoon Idiot.

To claim that the UK consists of 4 “constituent countries” is a lie which reveals you to be a complete Yoon Idiot twice over.

What’s it like to be a complete Yoon Idiot Aidan?

Aidan

Yeah I mean I guess I got drawn into it by other “complete yoon idiots”, like;

Alex Salmond: link to independent.co.uk

Stuart Campbell:
link to wingsoverscotland.com

Fergus Ewing:
link to thetimes.com

Why don’t you post a brilliant rebuttal like “ The UK is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland”. That’ll put me in my place.

Hatey McHateface

Well, Aidan, Zander has certainly convinced me 🙂

Convinced me that should Scotland ever get Independence, he (and most of the Wings BTL posters) will have to be kept well away from any positions of influence and responsibility, and barred from anything requiring enough smarts to dress themselves unaided.

The interesting aspect of this realisation is that it exactly mirrors the history of what happened when the last vehicle for Indy, the SNP, morphed from a fringe grouping of nutters, to an aspirational national government.

As the usual suspects never tire of gurnin about, the SNP, on becoming serious, had to freeze them out.

I’m thinking the reasons why are bleedin obvious. And that it will have to bleedin obviously happen next time around too.

Aidan

It’s a sorry state of affairs to think these are the kind of people apparently at the forefront of a political movement which very nearly made world history just ten years ago.

Zander Tait

How patronising Aidan.

A sure sign you have lost the argument.

I have to ask Aidan, since you have no idea what the UK is, did you fall asleep at history class before you were expelled from Primary school?

Hatey McHateface

“apparently at the forefront of a political movement”

When a sniggering student, more years ago than I care to think about, we used to say “foreskin”.

Little did we think we were predicting the future. At the time, we were just having a laugh.

Zander Tait

Scotland, as Alex, Stuart and Fergus assert is a country.

That is a diversion by you to deflect away from your boundless idiocy.

The discussion is about the UK.

The UK does not consist of 4 “constituent countries”.

The UK is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

What’s it like to be a complete Yoon Idiot, Aidan?

I mean, come on, a Yoon that has no idea what the UK is.

Aidan

Have you ever thought about a career as an advocate? I’m sure you could string out a shoplifting trial for 7 years.

You’re off your head.

Young Lochinvar

The UK was between GB as you say, but Ireland (intact).
I believe Westminster now refers to NI as a “Province” and Wales as a “Principality”- their words not mine.

Frankly the so called UK is a joke desperately hanging on in there post Empire.

Tick tock.

Geri

At what point are you gonnie tell him that NI isn’t a country?

I’m on the edge of my seat here..

Zander Tait

Yea I know Geri but that might have induced a complete mental breakdown for Aidan.

I like to keep things simple when dealing with Yoon idiots.

Aidan

Yes you’ve done a brilliant job of keeping it simple, and you were right to be concerned. The proposition “Northern Ireland isn’t a country” is enough to send anyone into a state of extreme stress and disfunction, I’m glad we avoided that so close to Christmas.

Now shock horror, your point is actually arguable! (Not by you obviously, but by someone with persuasion and reasoning skills beyond that of a boiled potato).

Captain Caveman

I’ve never read such an inflammatory post in all my life…

… from a potato perspective! No doubt King Edwards are his goto for the inevitable thrice-daily cone of chips. Heh!

Zander Tait

Thanks Aidan.

I am glad to hear that you now agree with me that the UK is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. It does not consist of 4 “constituent countries”

Have a wonderful Christmas.

Captain Caveman

Go look up “crass pedantry” and “Pyrrhic victory”, Chief.

In your head this is some massive big deal, no doubt, but the reality is you just look like a pointless prat.

Last edited 1 month ago by Captain Caveman
Zander Tait

And a very Merry Christmas to you too Grendel.

Have a wonderful time.

Aidan

Thank you for this informative and well structured engagement. I feel I’ve learnt something, quite frankly I’m amazed you haven’t been asked to give a TED talk, or maybe you have and a time hasn’t been found? Have you thought about a guest contribution to the Salvo website? I can’t obviously promise anything but I hear they’ll be an opportunity to address the UN general assembly in New York next year.

Zander Tait

Now now Aidan, now is the time for good cheer and good will to all men.

Like I said have a wonderful Christmas.

Hatey McHateface

“tell him that NI isn’t a country”

Why don’t you tell him, Geri.

In fact, live stream it from Donegall Square in Belfast, before a local audience.

I’ll willingly help crowd fund you a ticket to get there. A wee word of warning in your shell like though. A single is probably all that will be needed 🙂

Geri

A crowd of angry knuckle draggers still wont make them a country.

Hatey McHateface

Poor Zander. The qualifying stages of the World Cup, where the teams representing Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and England vie for a place in the final 32, must be a time of exceeding tribulation and mystification for him.

Captain Caveman

Only twice? Consider yourself lucky.

I’ve known less tediously repetitive parrots.

Zander Tait

Hello Grendel

Initiating unwarranted personal abuse yet again.

It must be a Yoon thing.

Captain Caveman

Oh, I’m just returning the favour, Chief. As for “unwarranted”, I think not.

(You’ll note that I only do this to very few people whom I consider to be trolls).

Last edited 1 month ago by Captain Caveman
Hatey McHateface

“The UK does not consist of 4 “constituent countries”.”

Of course it does … unless …

Maybe we also need to include the mysterious unknown that is “scotland”. There’s a boy forever posting on here that claims to be from there.

That would make it 5, I guess.

Ruby

Not according to the UK Governments legal advice it isn’t.

They told us that ‘Scotland was extinguished in 1707 and became lesser England.

See

Screen-Shot-2024-12-18-at-15.03.32
Captain Caveman

‘… The countries of the UK are:

  • England
  • Northern Ireland
  • Scotland
  • Wales …’

link to service-manual.ons.gov.uk

More:

‘… England, Northern Ireland, Scotland, and Wales are not themselves listed in the International Organization for Standardization (ISO) list of countries. However, the ISO list of the subdivisions of the United Kingdom, compiled by British Standards and the United Kingdom’s Office for National Statistics, uses “country” to describe England, Scotland, and Wales.[12] Northern Ireland, in contrast, is described as a “province” in the same lists.[12] Each has separate national governing bodies for sports and compete separately in many international sporting competitions, including the Commonwealth Games. Northern Ireland also forms joint All-Island sporting bodies with the Republic of Ireland for some sports, including rugby union.[13]

The Channel Islands and the Isle of Man are dependencies of the Crown and are not part of the UK. Similarly, the British Overseas Territories, remnants of the British Empire, are not part of the UK. …’

link to en.wikipedia.org

HTH. “Google” provides further info on the subject.

Hatey McHateface

Do I detect somebody wanging oan aboot G@za?

Haha – rhetorical question.

Is it one of the usual suspects?

See answer above.

James

Utter bollocks. Yet again.

But it’s all you know.

John Guest

England is a region.

Robert Matthews

Maybe James and his local dogging circle can step forward into the breach, the little rascal.

Geri

And?

Kosovo isn’t at the American puppet show, UN.

Are they any great loss to the UN, wh3re the Americans ignore votes anyway? Including security council ones.

They’ve consistently voted to give Palestinian a State. The Americans & the English consistently veto.

The UN is about to implode anyway. Everyone is getting sick of washed up has-beens sitting on the security council. UK & France have shit economies & they no longer have an empire & the USA is losing theirs.

We’re no longer living in the 1950s. It’s outdated & not fit for purpose. Old colonial bullshit has to go. There are far more worthy countries who should be on the security council.

Anthem

Can’t disagree with that!

Mike Fenwick

Hi … the 18 were chosen because of an important common characteristic – all 18 gained their own independence from the UK.

Campbell Clansman

But that’s not what you wrote, Mike.
And you should be copying it to all nations, not just 18.
If you make such basic mistakes on your declaration (and I’m not even mentioning the misspelled words) why should anyone take you (or your cause) seriously?

Mark Beggan

” I’m gonna take two weeks
Gonna have a fine vacation
I’m gonna take my problem to the United Nations”

Republicofscotland

Also there was the WhatsApp scandal – of which oor Mayor Swinney has added this.

“John Swinney has banned the use of WhatsApp on Scottish Government-issued phones following a furious backlash over the deletion of messages sent during the Covid pandemic.
SNP ministers will no longer be able to use mobile messaging apps on official devices from April 2025 following an external review.”

Tommy Box

In other news Humza is retiring from frontline politics – is this linked ?

Viscount Ennui

How can someone retire if they haven’t started to work?

znovak

A sign of gravy getting scarce at SNP Central, perhaps?

Fearghas MacFhionnlaigh

“The ancient Greeks were wrong:
Narcissus didn’t become a flower at all,
but a vampire.” (The Midge)

“Bha na seann Ghreugaich ceàrr:
cha d’ rinneadh Nairciseas na fhlùr idir 
ach na vàimpir.” (A’ Mheanbhchuileag)

“Bhí dul amú ar na Sean-Ghréagaigh:
Ní dheineadh bláth de Nairciseas 
ach vaimpír.” (An Corrmhíol)

Martin

There are lots of folk currently shitin# themselves right now which is the karma we will all enjoy so much when the day comes

gregor

Gracie Abrams: The Secret of Us: That’s So True:
“I could go and read your mind
Think about your dumb face all the time
Living in your glass house, I’m outside, uh
Looking into big blue eyes
Did it just to hurt me, make me cry
Smiling through it all, yeah, that’s my life…”:

link to tinyurl.com

Karma: Celebration: So True (Life Should Be:)
link to tinyurl.com

#Epic

Ruby

I don’t know what to say about all this stuff anymore being that I’m required to be polite.

She must be getting a fair amount of support from somewhere to be so audaciously going about doing what she’s doing.

She has no shame!

Being that I’m banned already I might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamp.

Sturgeon is a cunt.

Ian Smith

Is there any mechanism for SNP members to force compliance by the parliamentary party, or even to debate it, given that fact that it needs resolved before the movement can move on.

Robert Matthews

Bring back Rhodesia.

David M

I was talking about Sturgeon in work this afternoon. I cannot wait to see her have her comeuppance, and I think it’ll unite many people across the various political divides in Scotland. That day cannot come soon enough.

Michael Laing

I couldn’t agree more strongly, Stu, and with your last two paragraphs above all. The truth must be revealed and the lying tractors exposed.

Breeks

“…Whatever that truth ultimately costs, it’s a bill that must be paid, because nothing else can happen until it is.”

Sadly, I fear the enemies of Scotland know this only too well. Indeed, they positively thrive on it, as a long held philosophy.

In what walk of life would such an obnoxious and cynical reply to a legitimate FOI enquiry not be a sackable offence? Haa! Who am I kidding? Any politician, lawyer or Ombudsman in the country would be proud of it.

Contempt of Court will put you behind bars, while these wa*!ers are free to indulge their sheer and utter contempt for the public who pay their wages.

These arrogant c*!%ts need a brutal reminder that they serve the public. I’m sure it will come as quite a shock to most of them.

gregor

Quadeca: Time:

“A shattered clock upon the soft floor of the eternal home
As the hands of the clock fall and turn
We wave goodbye along with them
Now, when I ask, what is time
To some, it is the tape measure of life
To some, it is the disappearing monger of the universe
Hmm…
To some, it is an alarm, a brutal reminder
That it is always watching…
As it approaches constantly like a speeding train
And we, civilians, part with the middle of it’s tracks
And so I ask, what can fly without wings
What can fly without wings
Time flies
Time flies, that’s what I can tell you! Hahaha!
And although we are nearing the end of this art
We are only approaching a new beginning…”:

link to genius.com

From Zero: One Nation Under: Undeniable:

“Now that we’re a family
I can feel it from all sides
We live to do or die we’re all the same
There’s nothing you can’t tell us
And every single time
You step you’re gonna have a price to pay
Now that we’ve gone this far
I’m told I’ve gone too far
That’s not true
Before I go away
I guess I’ll throw away
The time I had spent with you…

You won’t forget about me
‘Cause I’m someone you can’t deny
Forget about, don’t think about
I’m just so sorry it’s true…”:

link to tinyurl.com

Fearghas MacFhionnlaigh

“Woe to you, hypocrites! For you have shut the door in people’s faces! You have taken away the key of knowledge. You yourselves do not enter, and you don’t let those get in who are trying to.”

“Is mairg dhuibhse, a chealgairean! Oir tha sibh a’ dùnadh an dorais ann an aghaidhean dhaoine! Thug sibh air falbh iuchair an eòlais. Cha deach sib’ fhèin a?steach agus bhac sibh an fheadhainn a bha a’ dol a?steach.”

“Is mairg daoibh, fhimínigh! Mar go ndúnann sibh an doras in éadan na ndaoine. Òir rug sibh libh eochair an eolais. Ní dheachaigh sibh féin isteach, agus iad seo a bhí ag dul isteach, chuir sibh cosc leo.” 

gregor

…behold, the kingdom of God is within you…”

(Luke 17:21)

gregor

The lost souls (demons ?) disagree.

Dan

Yawn… More futile piss-balling time wasting.

link to wingsoverscotland.com

Michael Laing

What’s your game? Why would you have an issue with justice being achieved for Alex Salmond, especially when others appear to be willing to take the initiative and foot the bill? You appear to be trying to stir up division between independence supporters here. That’s the very last thing we need; we have far more than enough of that already. But perhaps you’re not really an independence supporter at all.

Dan

My game? Can you not read properly.
I’m jist a realist and clearly state the reasons in my comments which somehow you’ve twisted to make it look like I have an issue with Alex’s name obtaining justice which I do not.
So piss off, I could equally question whether you or anybody else is actually for Scotland returning to self-governance when stalling and going about stuff arse for tit.

Chas

The brave and bold Michael is not in favour of realism. It is a trait shared by many who post on Wings

Insider

Away and play with the beavers !

twathater

I think it is rather telling the vastly increased infestation of yoononists and britnats posting BTL, I am beginning to believe I am on the effiedeans or historywomans blogs with the amount of naysayers and denigrators of Scotland and Scots

Ruby

Fight!

Screen-Shot-2024-12-17-at-19.31.48
Robert Hughes

Michael , yr way off with that accusation : Dan’s posts over the years speak for themselves ; and he has a point .

Much as I agree with Stu’s comment that there will be no Independence without justice for A.S , I’m doubtful the realization of such justice ( if it ever comes ? ) will – necessarily – take us any nearer to Independence .
Though that doesn’t diminish the absolute necessity of obtaining that justice .

There are a whole lot more truths that need to be exposed to the Scottish People before Independence will be achievable : not least of which is the true nature of Scotland’s relation with England , ie Union .

Justice for Alex will be a good start ; but not the end

G m

Independence supporters need to stop wasting their votes on imposters. Until the conspiracy to jail Salmond is exposed the imposters will continue to soak up votes that will be used against Scottish independence. It is an absolute necessity that the truth comes out and that can only happen in a court. You have a court case with evidence, which can be appealed and a verdict. That is as close to the truth as we get. Its all we have

Dan

One could jist as easily state “Independence is the price of justice”.
Because we won’t be in a position to deliver proper justice until we are liberated from the nefarious tangled web of the established UK and poundshop “Scottish” setups we are currently enduring and which are the cause of so many injustices.

Justice for the sadly departed Alex is but one thing in the scheme of things, what about the thousands of living Scottish citizens struggling to obtain a just and valued existence with adequate sustenance and warmth?
Aye, down tools, nothing is happening… and they can jist wait in line whilst we do fuck all to help them in practical terms or even offer hope for a better future whilst big money legal shizzle gets done.
There’s nothing helps a starving and freezing body more than said suffering body knowing a load of highfalutin wealthy people are busy with other business matters extraneous to some poor soul’s perilous existence.
Plus those Freeports and SEZs getting implemented on the qt will also be great for all those poor Scots too…

Way to lose the room comfortably off political folks, because it shows a shocking lack of self-awareness and disconnect from the lived reality of what so many Scottish folk and businesses have to endure on a day to day basis to get by, that some dolts think only one thing can be tackled and completed before any focus can be put on other matters.
Multi-tasking and reading the room are clearly skillsets Scotland’s supposedly brightest and best haven’t yet learnt…

It’s been clear for ages that this site’s comment section is circling the pan and no longer the discussion platform of worth that it once was what with it being filled with ever so obvious disruptors; Which it would appear I have been implicated as being for having the temerity to offer an opinion counter to what appears to be (scrolls up, checks ticks) 11 folk out of 5.5 million Scots.
And the recent implementation of said dumbed down like or dislike comment function further degrades btl to arsebook and twitter/ x adhd-like levels because folk are now too lazy and or stupid to even make the effort to type and post their thoughts.

Aye, FreeDumb for Scotland and oor silent liberation will be brave, stunning, and rather uniquely achieved solely through the power of saying and doing nothing and button pressing a like or dislike on t’internet.

Someone deemed a less disruptive ruffler of feathers than myself can step up and make the effort to post useful links and information, seeing as on previous thread the GERS figures are still being thrown about as a legit reason Scotland cannot move to self-governance.
Confused’s song enters mind: Oh flower of Ex Regio, when will see, oor revenues again…

FFS, some of the myriad bookmarked links I’ve got to rebut that pish are nearly a decade old. But who needs that useful armoury of data these days, jist lazily tick a dislike to rebut that stuff when you see it, that should work and convince undecided or questioning minds that the dross someone that doesn’t want Scotland to return to self-governance actually bothered to type and post isn’t all it appears to be.

I will spend more of my time elsewhere as I’ve recently joined the International Community… no not that one… I’ve bought an old and future proof 50 year old tractor to help further my own independence and liberation from the ills of dealing with what wider society and its stellar movers, shakers, and politicians are daftly allowing to have foisted onto us.

Last edited 1 month ago by Dan
Robert Hughes

Spot-on , D .

Of course , there needn’t be any ” either / or ” conflict between obtaining justice for Alex Salmond and likewise for , eg OAPs re WFA .

If our country hadn’t been so fucked-up by it’s 300+ years of being treated like a troublesome child by the ” superior power ” ; betrayed and sold-out by a succession of self-serving Scottish scumbags and latterly , subjected to the demented ideological ravages of Globalist head-nodders like Sturgeon/Yousaf/Swinney ( what a Trinity of Tosspots ) – we would not be in the position of having to fight for justice for Alex and/or OAPs

Michael Laing

So you think that because we might not achieve justice for Alex Salmond, there’s no point in fighting to clear his name, and because we might not achieve independence, there’s no point in fighting for it? Where is the logic in that? Are we just to give up and run away because we might not win? That’s pathetic.

Robert Hughes

Who said ” there’s no point fighting to clear his name ” ? You

Who said ” Though that doesn’t diminish the absolute necessity of obtaining that justice .” ?
Think that may have been me

You’ve managed to mangle the meaning of both Dan & my comments beyond recognition .

Must be that ” Climate * Crisis * you fervently believe in boiling your brain . Or something

Mia

Just out of curiosity, Rev, is it possible at all to know who authorised the release of the first document of your article in that disgraceful state, and who authorised the redaction of that document to that absurd and laughable extent?

Redacting and releasing from government a document like that is like displaying the uttermost contempt for the Scottish public and taking us for complete fools. It is completely unacceptable. That person should be sacked from public office immediately. If they do not have respect for the rights of the people of Scotland to full transparency of their government, if they do not serve the people of Scotland and instead serve the needs of some criminal, then they they do not belong in government or the civil service. They belong in jail.

It would be good to know who is the minister/high ranking civil servant that thinks our taxpayers money for their salary can be squandered in covering up the corrupt arse of some disgusting criminals.

Time to name and shame. If they show contempt for the people of Scotland in this fashion, then it is only proper that we respond them with contempt in equal measure. It is time we know who the criminals, the criminal apologists and the criminal gatekeepers hiding within our ministerial and civil service ranks are. That is the way we start pulling the curtain and let the light over this obscure and malodorous episode of Scotland’s history. By pushing away the useful idiots holding the lid down.

By the way, when on earth is Branchform going to actually make any progress and produce ANY results at all? Are we seriously expected to wait for decades until the criminals responsible die or move away to a tropical island somewhere? Is that what the police woman in charge is waiting for?

And then some here have the brass neck to claim Scotland is “a democracy”. One hell of a democracy. A kakistocracy more like.

Ruby

I don’t think they have any shame Mia.

Screen-Shot-2024-12-17-at-19.57.51
James Gardner

The Branchform Farce is proof positive that Democracy is a total Fraud in these Isles and always has been……

Alasdair

Seeing her gallivanting around so apparently carefree so soon after sending AS to an early grave makes my blood boil.

Ian

On what basis are redactions allowed and who is the final arbiter on what is or isn’t allowed to be redacted? As it stands, all too often it’s just a blatant FU. Some legal teeth badly needed to stop the piss taking –

The Scottish National Party (SNP) is a member of the Open Government Partnership (OGP) and has made a commitment to open government: 

Scotland’s membership of the Open Government Partnership (OGP) supports our commitment to openness, transparency, and citizen participation across everything we do as a government.

When governments join the partnership they must endorse the Open Government Declaration and commit to the following principles:

  • increase the availability of information about governmental activities
  • support civic participation
  • implement the highest standards of professional integrity through administrations
  • increase access to new technologies for openness and accountability

link to gov.scot

twathater

Ian this has been going on for a considerable amount of time , these people spout these mantras and gleefully sign up to these grandiose sounding organisations BUT where is the facility to FORCE them to comply with the tenets they signed up to

We have a shower of clowns (and they are on the increase) who post on here decrying and denigrating independence supporting people who want the best for our country and people and want all politicians and political parties to be honest with integrity or face the wrath of the electorate

I don’t care what these people say about Scotland’s ability to be self sufficient or prosperous because they are obviously too stupid or oppose independence which is their right but I get outraged that the ONLY thing that they have to offer is to remain part of the fetid decomposing corpse of the uk and to be governed by the same two VILE parties whose incompetence and corruption is destroying everyone’s standards of living

These fuckwits only proposals are “vote for this shite corrupt political party BECAUSE it is LESS shite than other political parties” THAT is their reason to stay in this despicable union , they cannot produce anything POSITIVE about the union or the uk

Young Lochinvar

Correct. 100% correct.

I quote;

“Ah, freedom is a noble thing”

To achieve that we need patriotic politicians that are “noble” in mind and actions to secure independence, not the barrel of troughers and deviant enablers that have made us endure years of pitiless cumber “catched” in this toxic Union.

James Gardner

Honest John the Redactor holds the pen……..

sarah

@ Mia at 18.42 I was just about to say something along those lines. Oh what a laugh the civil servants and their “masters” must have had redacting absolutely everything apart from one name.

What had Ashleigh Gray done to deserve to be the only fact exposed to the public gaze? Did she perhaps murmur something about the duty of public servants to, shock horror, serve the public honestly?

That would be enough to render her liable to every punishment the rest of her colleagues could inflict on her. No doubt she has been ousted from the tea club as well.

Louise Hogg

Can we recruit Ashleigh Gray as mole in the Civil Service? Or as an Independence Sleeper Agent?

Robert Hughes

Bravura writing/thinking , S.C .

There is no hope of Scottish independence under the current SNP, because the SNP now exists solely to try to protect the perpetrators of the conspiracy against Salmond. It’s the only thing they truly care about, and today’s publications are just the latest in a vast dossier of evidence of that fact.”

Its astonishing that there are still so many pro-Independence supporters unable/willing to acknowledge the inescapable truth of that statement .

And this one ……” Whatever that truth ultimately costs, it’s a bill that must be paid, because nothing else can happen until it is. Justice is the price of independence.”

Absolutely

sarah

Googling Ashleigh Gray I find that she is “Deputy Director [Interim], Propriety and Ethics, Scottish Government”.

So the question remains. Why is her name the only unredacted piece of information?

A second question is “what does a director and their deputy do about propriety and ethics in the Scottish government?” On the face of it they haven’t been doing enough since November 2014.

Mia

Why is her name the only unredacted piece of information?”

To send us all on a wild goose chase?

Or … so they can claim they did not redact ALL of it?

sarah

Cynical, Mia, but probably true! And what do you make of the gall of Swinney saying today that Whatsapp is not to be used on official phones? He, the master of redaction and obfuscation!

Mia

As I am indeed an unashamed and unrepented cynic, what Swinney said makes me think in the following:

  1. whatsapp cannot be used on official phones, meaning, burner phones will be provided in addition to a clean, official one to particular members of staff
  2. he expects people to continue to use whatsapp but on their own personal devices, so they can not be recalled for official matters
  3. they have already moved on to another encrypted, unofficial, system.

It is remarkable that he says that whatsapp is not to be used. But what he does not say is that messages sent from and received on official phones should never be deleted. In other words, he EXPECTS compromising and sensitive messages to be deleted.

I wouldn’t expect any less of Mr Redacted

sarah

I’m afraid that I am growing cynical because I thought the same. It is just a pantomime performance he is giving of stopping wicked people using official means of communication to do wicked things. I’m sick of it.

Skip_NC

I believe there is a rationale for the e-mail recipient and sender redactions. When the Holyrood Whitewash was at its slaisterous peak, I seem to recall someone making the point that staff below a certain grade had to have their names redacted. So presumably Ashleigh Gray is the only one senior enough to have her name published, which begs the question – where are the rest of the e-mails?

John C

Several MSPs have spoken or hinted of a culture of abuse at Holyrood spread across all parties so nobody gets a pass. That may not be sexual abuse, but bullying. Certainly anyone who has watched FMQs will see examples of that. Patrick Harvie especially is clearly a toxic little man who especially has issues with women.

So for nobody to use a complaints system is telling. Of course it was designed purely for Salmond as Sturgeon wanted him destroyed. He knew where the bodies were buried after all.

The fact the Scottish Government, the SNP, and large parts of the Scottish establishment have all conspired to keep the facts secret from the public who pay their wages. My hope is that everything eventually becomes public. I suspect David Davies may well invoke parliamentary privilege next year and that Sturgeon faces a lot of questions.

As for Sturgeon, her attempts to rewrite history is astonishing but not altogether surprising. She was never a champion for LGB rights, her lavender marriage suggests much and her championing of trans issues is full of contradictions. History isn’t looking at her kindly now hence the attempt to change it. She’s killed independence as a political option for a generation. Women and girls rights, along with LGB rights are under threat from TRAs. The SNP aren’t interested in making lives better anymore and our cities are being reshaped in ways to exclude the disabled, working people and the poor.

She’ll carve herself a media career. I expect a podcast, maybe a column in The National. Owen Jones will prostrate himself at her feet. She thinks she’s got away with it. I hope she’s going to face what she did at some point.

Mia

She’ll carve herself a media career”

I think it is more likely that she migrates to USA and joins the democrats there. Judging by her absurd policies and the way she idolised Clinton then Obama and then Biden, it seems to me this 2-faced woman and her sidekick Teflon Lloyd may have been working in collusion with them and USA’s deep state all along.

Skip_NC

She is of no use to the Democratic party over here. People like her are ten a penny. She is a failed leader of a government less powerful than that of a US state.

Geri

That’s a certainty.

The more I follow others world news & elections the more American interference there is.

Georgia, Romania, Hungary, France, Japan.. they’re everywhere & pouring in $$s & civic unrest.

I see they’re plotting to get Trudeau out now. Not difficult I know, but his own government are throwing him under a bus & it just so happens they’ve links to Yahoo & Z. Trump wants the conservatives in. They don’t mind a bit of gen-ocide & warmongering.

Skip_NC

Nobody has to plot to get rid of Justin Trudeau. He’s doing a bang-up job all by himself, and has been for quite some time. Losing his finance minister was rather careless. I don’t think the Liberals will suffer quite the same fate as the Tories did about thirty years ago. However, unless the other parties really bugger things up between now and the election, the Chocolate Fireguard will not be PM after next October.

Ian Smith

She has nothing to offer the Democrats. Her rise was purely opportunistic based on the characteristics of when devolution occurred and how SNP rose in numbers first through list MPs in Hollywood and then through the constituencies in both in Edinburgh and London.

She was the right place and time to be a plausible young woman for promotion, while others were too old and thrawn to take the junior roles, had principals that kept them hostile to the leadership or were in Westminster rather than Holyrood. Then for similar reasons headed on upwards. The only genius was marrying the CEO.

A bit like Humzas rise as an ethnic. No great talent or ideas, but able to learn the presentational mechanics of politics.

She was handed a competent position but didn’t have the insight or talent to keep things on an even keel.

Mia

How many FOI requests for the same thing would have to be sent at once to completely overload and bring the Scot Gov to a halt until they release the darn information?

Lorna Campbell

Unless the truth is revealed, you are in stasis and cannot move on, and, if it is revealed eventually, we are going to have to learn to forgive, no matter how hard that is. Of course the procedure was established precisely to bring down Alec Salmond, and nobody else. However, I think at least one or two of the women were also shafted. I am hoping that they might, in time, spill the beans.

You are right, Rev, the SNP is not interested in independence. Independence itself became the distraction, not the woke gibberish. The woke gibberish needed independence to be kicked into the long grass. It will be brought down eventually, but it might be far too late to gain our independence by the ballot box. This is what the fools have never understood.

G m

Absolutely correct, unless the truth is revealed the roadblock inside the SNP will not be removed and Independence support will continue to be used against them.

As for the 2 women having been shafted, they weren’t shafted .They knew exactly what they were doing and they have long enough to make amends. They should face charges with the rest of them.

Geri

I don’t know why the 1st judge never charged them all with perjury despite knowing they were all lying under oath.

I don’t think there’ll ever be closure. It’s not in Perfidious Albion’s remit & it’s as plain as day this was their doing.

Forget the SNP. Let them sink to oblivion where they belong. None of them are worth saving & they’d be as welcome fronting any indy campaign as a severe dose of the trots.

Indy need to organise individual independent MSPs & MPs & forget voting for a single political party.

Louise Hogg

2 women? I thought Ms F was the only one who could semi-legitimately claim that she was gaslit into believing Alex had had sexual intentions, and then guilt-tripped and harassed into testifying against him?

Young Lochinvar

On reflection I reckon I wasted a couple of hours of my life last night (that I’ll never get back) watching “Operation Mincemeat” on the box.

The relevance?

It was about the fantasy lives of the spin doctor spooks played out in life as they dreamt up black op back stories during the Second World War.

So like SHE who must not be named as described by Blackburn..

Ruby

link to archive.ph

Dated 30 October 2017

Aamer Anwar said he had been told of a “catalogue of abuse” ranging from cyberstalking to physical assault.

These were pretty serious claims being made by Aamer Anwar.
I wondered at the time why nothing was being done about this or if Aamer Anwar was just making it up. Now when I think about it maybe it was the ‘interns and researchers to MSPs’ who spoke to Aamer Anwar who were making it up.

Maybe this was all a way of controlling the folk being accused.

Of all the “catalogue of abuse” the only
people being investigated were Mark MacDonald & Alex Salmond.
Goodness knows what Mark MacDonald did to deserve it.

Dated 1 Mar 2018
link to archive.ph

Sturgeon shocked by Holyrood survey on sexism and abuse

At that time I was wondering what they meant by sexual abuse/sexual assault. Did they make a typo in a text or accidentally touch someone’s knee.

 Kezia Dugdale said the results were unsurprising but Nicola Sturgeon was shocked.

That is interesting one woman found the results unsurprising and the other was shocked.

I pretty much believe most women have the same experience regarding sexism/misogyny.
I find Kezia more credible than Sturgeon.

Weird that Sturgeon spent all that time with Salmond & didn’t suspect anything!
Not even a single sexist comment!

Dated 15 Aug 2017
link to archive.ph

Ms Sturgeon insisted that “Alex Salmond is not sexist”, saying “I think I would know if he was sexist, and emphatically he is not”.

It was at the time Mark MacDonald was fired that I became very suspicious of Sturgeon.

Something very rotten going on in Scotland.

Screen-Shot-2024-12-17-at-20.40.43
Last edited 1 month ago by Ruby
agent X

Flynn made a big drunken mistake in trying to kick out a sitting MSP member.

I hope he sinks without trace the jumped up little shit.

robertkknight

So they’re banning WhatsApp from ScotGov devices.

Is that because they’re afraid they’ll be caught out?

What’s the alternative means by which our duplicitous SNP overlords will be able to scheme and plot? Telegram?

agent X

Personal phones not government issue phones.

Shug

The moment they publish the facts is the moment Salmond wins as it proves his case which is why they delay.
At the same time the unionists know they are guilty and if they pursue indy it will be leaked to the press and they lose.
The SNP must publish to resolve the Salmond case and to clear the air before 2026.
Swinney can’t release the info as it will show his involvement
Sturgeon thinks she might make a come back but the unionists have the messages she can achieve nothing but maintaining the union.

agent X

“Sturgeon thinks she might make a come back”

She will realise when her book fails that she is not the World Leader that she thought she was.

James Gardner

Her book will be in the charity shops within a fortnight…….proof positive that she is and was a nonentity…….fairly similar to to Harry the Spare’s book….not exactly Pulitzer Prize material…in the fictions awards……..!

Shug

It is interesting watching the BBC. Recently i have seen Brindly, Sturgeon, Lloyd, Riduck. They are all being given a gentle airing

Why does the BBC support these people. Why woude the protector if the UK support them???

I know the answer BTW

James Gardner

They are all connected to MI5 !

Shug

Some are some are just thick

agent X

MSPs back plans to end ‘double-jobbing’
=====
Government to ban WhatsApp for official business
=====
Humza Yousaf to step down as MSP at next election
=====
Rules tightened on chauffeur cars for ministers after ‘limogate’ scandal
=====
Sturgeon accused of rewriting history by denying ‘mass opposition’ to gender self-ID law
=====
Day 1,250: When will we get answers to the SNP finances scandal?
=====
Driverless bus service in Scotland to be withdrawn due to lack of interest
=====
Nicola Sturgeon rues descent into ‘toxic’ debate on topics such as equal marriage
=====

Recent headlines from various sources.

Not been a good week for the SNP has it?

James Gardner

Or the LieBore Party……..!

Ruby

We’ve come a long way from the MeToo movement in 2017 when there were great concerns about unacceptable behaviour towards women to the possibility of Harvey Weinstein being able to put on a dress and be housed in a woman’s prison.

link to archive.ph

In an explosive testimony she claimed that Weinstein does not have testicles and his penis is “like a vagina”, adding that she thought he was “deformed or intersex“.

“The first time I saw him naked I thought he was deformed or intersex. I didn’t know if he was a burn victim but it would make sense,” she said. “He does not have testicles and it appears like he has a vagina.

OMG It’s no wonder I’m banned and you all want to wank on about foreign wars.

Screen-Shot-2024-12-17-at-21.48.52
Last edited 1 month ago by Ruby
Fearghas MacFhionnlaigh

Sturgeon’s demeanour all through this suggests she has been assured of protection at the highest levels. Her astounding notion of a 2026 return as First Minister signals her settled confidence that the comprehensive redactions are securely permanent. She feels invulnerable. Maybe she is.

G m

The leadership at the Crown Office, Polis, Civil Service, commentariat all took part in the stitchup. Maybe she is immune from prosecution. There will certainly be resistance to it. Too much of the truth is out now for her to become chief admin. again? . Even the unionists, quiet at the time, are making noises that sound like demands for the truth, now that Alec Salmond is deid.

Young Lochinvar

SHE whose name shall not be uttered is swanning about with a brass neck unable to resist attention.

I have one thing to say to her/ SHE/ they/ it:
Numbers 32:23.

James Gardner

Her absolute arrogance is proof positive of her sleekitness, not a guid look to most Scots….

Young Lochinvar

I believe it’s termed hubris James.
Like “pride” (another word hijacked by the woke) it’ll come before a fall..

Mark Beggan

The cost of truth may be more than any one anticipates. The price may be the Unthinkable. A large swing to the right, extreme right. We’ve had the most extreme Left wing nut cases this country has ever seen.

James

Extreme Left wing?

When was that? Did I miss it?

Michael Laing

There’s nothing remotely ‘left wing’ about woke ideology. It’s all about fomenting social division in order to further the interests to the ruling class. Divide and rule, in other words.

Campbell Clansman

Who promotes woke ideology?
Left wing parties.
Like the Greens, Labour, LibDems and the SNP.
Just take a look at which parties in Holyrood voted for the Gender Recognition Bill (the above parties) and which didn’t (the Conservatives).
What you write is the exactly opposite of reality, because you can’t admit the reality.

Zander Tait

I don’t know about left or right wing, but, with some notable individual dissenters, the GRR was and is promoted by the parties identified by Grendel.

The Tories were and are against. The Reform Party and the Alba Party and The ISP are also against this deviant nonsense.

I too am against it and I suspect, so too is Grendel.

twathater

I think you will find Mr tory boy that some of your fellow arsewipes in the tory party did indeed vote for the GRB, there were also abstentions from parties across the parliament

Fearghas MacFhionnlaigh

A word from one brave person could yet pierce the ballistic glass. Such was the nub of Solzhenitsyn’s counsel in his 1970 Nobel speech:

« It (violence) does not always, not necessarily, openly throttle the throat, more often it demands from its subjects only an oath of allegiance to falsehood, only complicity in falsehood. And the simple step of a simple courageous person is not to partake in falsehood, not to support false actions! That is why, my friends, I believe that we are able to help the world in its white-hot hour. Not by making the excuse of possessing no weapons, and not by giving ourselves over to a frivolous life – but by going to war! Proverbs about truth are well-loved in Russian. They give steady and sometimes striking expression to the not inconsiderable harsh national experience: “ONE WORD OF TRUTH SHALL OUTWEIGH THE WHOLE WORLD”. And it is here, on an imaginary fantasy, a breach of the principle of the conservation of mass and energy, that I base both my own activity and my appeal to the writers of the whole world. » (Alexandr Solzhenitsyn: Nobel Lecture in Literature 1970)

Mark Beggan

I would like to thank the good Rev for being a beacon of Truth in these dark times.

Mark Beggan

I see Useless is giving up politics to return to University. Where he will learn which bit is the arse and which bit is the elbow.

diabloandco

He’s not joining the political department run by some daft professor is he? Canny mind the name but I’m sure she said she was involved in Labour party politics Kezia somebody???

Peter McAvoy

If the copy of the document displayed at the top of the article is real those responsible for it have done something unusual and saved taxpayers money on ink or toner.

Alf Baird

I’m not so sure that “Justice is the price of independence”, colonialism covers far more.

But what we do know is that there is no justice in the colonial framework. We also know that independence means decolonization.

link to yoursforscotlandcom.wordpress.com

Ruby

I have many questions. 

Going back to the Libby Brooks article which states

Of those who reported experience of sexual harassment at Holyrood, 45% identified the perpetrator as an MSP.

I would like to have been told who the 55% were.  Are we talking about civil servants, cleaners, carpark attendants or visitors. What % are male?

It’s all too vague as is the definition of sexual harassment.
One woman’s definition of sexual harassment might be another woman’s definition of flirting. 

The number of revelations of sexual harassment is going to rocket if you change the definition of sexual harassment and make every exchange between a man and a woman into a potential case of sexual harassment.

Anyway all that stuff and the concern for women’s comfort/safety is way in the past and now ‘invasion of personal space’ is absolutely fine. If you don’t like it you can consider yourself a bigot.  

Screen-Shot-2024-12-18-at-09.33.35
Last edited 1 month ago by Ruby
gregor

Dr. Simon Goddek
@goddeketal:

“HARD TRUTH: The endgame of “woke” ideology is the complete eradication of Western civilization.”

link to tinyurl.com

gregor

Alice Smith
@TheAliceSmith:

“Marxists believe in the concept of Year Zero – the complete destruction of a society’s culture, traditions, and history in order to start anew.”

link to tinyurl.com

World Economic Forum: Does capitalism need some Marxism to survive the Fourth Industrial Revolution?
link to weforum.org

link to archive.ph

gregor

Nine Inch Nails: Year Zero: God Given:

“You don’t want to get left behind, because it’s all coming down right now
Now, how hard is it to see?
Put your faith in me…
You should
Get where you belong
Everything you know is wrong
Come on, sing along everybody now

And he gives us sight
And we see the light
And it burns so bright
Now we know we’re right
When his kingdom come
And thy will be done
We have just begun
We’re the chosen ones…”:

link to tinyurl.com

#RealityRevolution

Republicofscotland

On Operation Branchform – which will probably run until the next Holyrood elections – or, until Bain throws the lot out, and says there’s no case to answer.

” figures previously published revealed the estimated staff costs for Operation Branchform stand at more than £1.7 million while police overtime is £95,425.
A spokesperson for Police Scotland told the Record: “On August 9 2024, we presented the findings of the investigation so far to the Crown Office and Procurator Fiscal Service and we await their direction on what further action should be taken.””

Republicofscotland

On my above comment – there are currently eleven Police Scotland officers working full-time on Operation Branchform, according to a FOI.

sarah

Wouldn’t it be useful, as well as fun, if the police acted as complainer against COPFS/Scot Gov for… to start with, waste of police time.

100%Yes

MSM has no interest in mentioning the Alex Salmond case, Sturgeon very early on paid tax payers money to the support the MSM during the pandemic which was in her favour. I’ve stated since the day Sturgeon stood down that as soon as 2026 comes and goes she will be elected as leader of the SNP again. She been in control from day she put her self forward in 2014 to be SNP leader and she is still pulling all the strings so move along there is nothing to see here.

I left the SNP in 2015 because it was abivous that Sturgeon had no interest in restoring Scotland nationhood again. I have stated since then she’s the false prophet and action should be taken towards the SNP under these AUOB marches if we had where would be be today.

Even today people in Indy movement believe the SNP is the vehicle towards Indyref2 keep dreaming your a idoit completely.

Westminster is in full control there building underwater pipline’s to England not for the short hall but for the future and that doesn’t mean Scotland is leaving. Everything thats happening is to secure England prosperity and Scotland’s demise and yet one simple solution lies in Scotland favour and its scorned with contempt. We need to form a new party thats Unites support for independence for all nations in the UK (cos if Scotland no longer exists as a nation due to it being now part of the UK then England no longer exists too, and that would be devistating to the English) and if that means feilding Scottish candigates in England so be it.

Sturgeon and the SNP leadership is laughing right in your face they know 100% that no action will ever come to light. The demise of the SNP has to be top priority and the formation of a new party feilding candigates throught the whole UK to end the Union is the only way Scotland will become Independent and trust me it isn’t going to happen by any other means.

Until we waken up and start thinking out the box who’s going to suffer, Scotland and its people and the damge done may not be reversible.

Westminster and the Unionist know that Scotland’s place is secure in the Union under the leadership of the SNP, but what these southerners aren’t sure of, is how long Scots will put up with all the bull before the Scottish people demand action on the constitutional question this is why these Westminster MPs are asset striping Scotland for its resources before we take matters into our own hands. Your being laughed at, we going to have to take Independence it isn’t going to be given not today and certainly not in the future. If we want Scotland to be Independent the choices, we make are going to need to be made long before 2026 and if we continue down the same road, I believe we’ll be at war its already being planned.

The war of Independence can be won if we fight it in England and use the English nationalist against the Unionist, I hate to say this but its true, English nationlist is dominant than Unionism so lets USE IT.

sarah

See Barrhead Boy’s article today, 100% Yes. Independents for Independence would answer your “new party” call, I think. And there’s Peter A Bell’s New Scotland Party with the #ManifestoforIndependence.

100%Yes

Peter Bell party isn’t going to field any candidates in the up and coming Holyrood election in 2026, so I have to ask whats the point in this party? When Alba party started and was fronted by some top Indy supporters and whats happened in the last 3yrs and 10yrs nothing and this is precisely whats going to happen with this vanity project by Roddy. Westminster and the MSM isn’t listening and there not going to listen because they don’t need too, hence we need an entirely different direction and approach and if we don’t take it Scotland and the UK will remain the same entity this is just obvious.

sarah

I don’t see it as a vanity project by Roddy. He chaired the Summit the other week and got 20 different activists [including the Rev] and group reps to come to brainstorm/plan a way of combining the grassroots independentistas in a campaign. He is not aiming to be the figurehead/leader. Nor is he forming a party.

It is meant to be grassroots people getting out on the streets as we did in 2014 but this time with a canvassing data tool AND to get behind real independence candidates i.e. I4I, ISP and any other real honest non-party political people. If we had several [preferably a lot] of such people elected to Holyrood it would force SNP to co-operate in real moves for independence.

100%Yes

Sara, The goal to Independence can still work but until the SNP/Government starts the ball rolling, WHICH IT WONT so nothing will change. Westminster isn’t listening it doesn’t need to they hold all the cards.

The UKG isn’t ever going to relinquish control over Scotland this is a fact.

At the moment the SNP is allowing Scotland to be asset striped in order for the UK government not to shut Holyrood or put and external force on bringing certain people to justice.

The SNP has two goals 1 protect Sturgeon and 2 destroy the Independence movement, their actions over the last 10 years, shows there is enough evidence to prove this.

I hope Roddy idea works but it won’t. I’ve even joined and donated, for me the worrying thing is time I don’t believe Scotland has a whole lot of time and I strongly believe we are heading towards a war which I don’t want Scotland to be involved in and trust me if we are Holyrood will be shut down quicker than the eye can blink.

sarah

I entirely agree about the urgent need for Scotland to be out of the Union. I too donate to every worthwhile attempt by people who I believe to be honest and have fire in their bellies for the cause.

I’m not optimistic, either, but the attempts have to be made in the hope that there will be some impact. When I think of the 100,000 plus folk in Edinburgh for AUOB marches who are no longer visible, they still exist but need a goal – Roddy aims for May 7th 2026 as that goal. Are enough Yes folk desperate enough to put in a shift in order to get true independence fighters elected? I pray that there will be.

At the same time there is Salvo/Liberation’s route. Not quick but the cumulative effect should help. It’s got to be tried.

sarah

http://www.indy4indy.scot. Roddy McLeod, Barrhead Boy, is trying to get the Yes movement going again – all those separate local groups who did stalls, leafleting etc etc independent of SNP control – for Independence Nothing Less.

He and others have a Campaigner tool to help the Yes groups efforts in collecting necessary voting data.

See his article on Barrhead Boy blog today.

Campbell Clansman

We get a “new” Indy political movement announcement every week. A “Peter Bell” Party one week; a “Barrhead Boy” Party the next. It seems that every obscure blogger with half-a-dozen followers is issuing his own “Manifesto” about his new “Movement.”
It’s really good for a laugh how even the 1% can’t unite behind anything.

Aidan

The Indy4Indy website is still under construction, but they have managed to get the Donate section working so at least we know they’re focusing on the parts that are important to them.

Campbell Clansman

Money appeals first, policy afterwards.
Sounds like the SNP grift, just on a tiny level.

Young Lochinvar

Gloriana
Maybe they learnt it/ it’s rubbed off on them from the “jolly boy” masters of the art: the Tories.

Expensive hoors to buy the lot of them..

Geri

Aye & those parasites Patriots let anyone buy them. Foreign donations welcome – holiday homes & wallpaper a bonus. The creators of the “hostile environment to immigration” don’t mind foreigners & immigrants if they have the foldy stuff to deposit. Fae choosing the UK prime minister & setting policy & laws – tae a gong & a pass straight to the Lords if the price is right. Just sign up to the Tory party from anywhere in the world & cast yer vote.

Tories – keeping Britain…ummmm…

Young Lochinvar

Amen to that Geri!
The two facedness of some here beggars belief..

Hatey McHateface

I’ve read the article – very interesting. Just one wee dig at the Dews, so a huge improvement over the article Dan linked to the other day.

Please keep us posted on the progress of the I4I movement, sarah. I can’t wait for the chance to vote for the candidate in my constituency, hopefully in 2026.

100%Yes

 
Today every single Scot pay their taxes and send it to England who in return use it as legal tender and then send back pocket money that we turn into a currency with no monitory value. Yet with one simple application to the court to make the Scottish currency legal could solve one of the biggest stumbling blocks to some people regarding independence which is, what currency would we us? But no one has ever given this a single thought or proposed taking this action.
 
I’ve often stated long before we had even decided on having a referendum that, removing the monarchy from Scotland should have been top priority. Even now it would be the stepping stone to nationhood and sending the strongest message to England that Scotland is heading towards Independence.
 
The Independence movement has no leader and it never has, its lead by a lot of voices heading all in different and wrong directions and it isn’t helping. No one eats the chicken with the head still attached.
 
Alf, there is a lot we can do to upset the southerners but our politicians are too afraid to do it and we the people aren’t at the point of demanding it, if we were Westminster would be worried.

Aidan

The currency issue is not about whether an independent country could issue its own currency, obviously it could. It’s what the impact could be on the Scottish economy from a new currency whose value is uncertain and which might fluctuate considerably over short periods of time.

“Removing the monarchy from Scotland” is impossible whilst Scotland remains part of the U.K., unless the U.K. also got rid of the monarchy.

100%Yes

That why its important to have the Scottish pound make legal tender NOW not tomorrow or the day after we become Independent.

Aidan

“Legal tender” is constantly misunderstood. All it describes is the means by which creditors must accept payment for a debt. It is not a mark of validation. Changing the Mediums of Exchange laws to include the Scottish pound would have nil impact on the potential value or future volatility of the Scottish pound. That would require rUK and Scotland to adopt separate currencies.

Hatey McHateface

The “Scottish Pound” will just be yet another waste of time and more importantly money, as long as the current ruling government in HR has, as its stated policy, the intention of taking Scotland into the EU immediately upon Independence.

We’ll be using the Euro as our currency.

Just for once, let’s try to deal with the real world. The SNP government has stated that a vote for Indy will be seen by them as a de facto vote for EU membership.

Just because the posters BTL here don’t like to talk about them, doesn’t mean these policies have gone away.

Young Lochinvar

Independence needs to be absolute and free of precondition affiliation with other Unions.

A constitution written first in law.

Then people can vote on whether to join trading “groups” or not.

Independence needs to be inviolate, the country whole and indivisible.

factfinder

There is no “Scottish Pound”. Scottish banknotes are issued under the authority of the Bank of England, and are denominated in pounds Sterling, as it says on Scottish banknotes. The pound Scots ceased to exist in 1707; the exchange rate at that time was £1 Sterling = 12 pounds Scots.

Young Lochinvar

So we own it too in this (ahem) Union of Equals then.
Sorted.

Republicofscotland

Scotland has no monarch – ask yourself why their at two-crown offices – a Scottish and an English one.

There’s no such thing as a “British Monarch” non have sworn to uphold the Claim of Right.

Fictional Kingdom, Fraudulent State – YOURS FOR SCOTLAND

Hatey McHateface

What’s the situation in “scotland”?

Don’t tell me you’ve never been tempted to declare yourself king.

gregor

Kings Of Convenience: Declaration of Dependence: Me in You:

“But ooh
There’s a little bit of me inside you
Gathering what you’ve lost
Ooh
There’s a little bit of you in everyone
Can never keep a secret…

And I’m watching you now
I see you building the castle with one hand
While tearing down another with the other…”:

link to tinyurl.com

“…seven year-old Alexander III became the first Scottish king to be crowned, rather than merely enthroned…”:

link to tinyurl.com

link to wingsoverscotland.com

Aidan

Can you provide any examples of someone in an official capacity recognising or acknowledging that?

“Secret” legal doctrines which are only known by random individuals writing on their own blogs and are arrived at by a reinterpretation of history are not by their own definition law.

Mark Beggan

For the last decade Scottish politicians have done nothing but upset the ‘ southerners’ and at the same time doing absolutely nothing for Scottish people. Sturgeons biggest trick was to keep that hatred simmering just enough. And it’s through that blind stupidity that has allowed the Bisto Kids to keep their elite lifestyle.They have been playing politics with our lives whilst improving their own.

Campbell Clansman

Scotland (8.2% of the UK population) pays just 8.1% of all UK PUBLIC REVENUES yet it receives 9.1% of all UK PUBLIC SPENDING!
Sounds like a pretty good deal for Scotland….

bobo bunny

Where are you getting these figures from – your English masters? Away and hing aboot somewhere else. You are nothing more than a ("Tractor" - Ed) to Scotland – as are the clan you purport to represent.

Campbell Clansman

So as an Indy supporter you reject official statistics!
About as I expected.

Geri

They aren’t ‘official’ if they were there’d be no need for guess estimates. They’d be able to produce a full ledger with proof of receipts. They’d be able to produce oil & gas receipts too.
It’s not difficult FFS. There’s only 5 million of us.

Where is England’s official statistics report?

The Tories did give us a clue tho – nearly £100 billion will come from the North Sea, Scotlands territorial waters, funny, I don’t see that listed in the Scottish “official statistics” That’d clear our pretendy deficit in one go..

What does a country, with not much in the way of natural resources, live off? We’d all love to know. Get to it…

Campbell Clansman

“Geri,” your admission of ignorance of official statistics is noticed, and believed.

Geri

Yoon troll. Round & round they go pushing the GERS pish. Debunked by everyone since circa 2013.

Here’s a novel idea. Have the Union on a rotating executive administration/management/treasury bookkeeper – ever few yrs it passes back & forth between Scotland & England. The only two in the union. Everything would be recorded properly then. The English would have nothing to hide & no need for estimates. Not even an energy supplier gets away with estimates these days. It’s so 1980s!

bobo bunny

You’re a clown mate. Put your big shoes, revolving bow tie, squirty flower and red nose on, and fuck right off

James

Well said.

Confused

GERS is when the people who robbed you, tell you how poor you are.

The true pillage of Scotland is revealed by comparative GDP studies; our peer nations – Norway, Ireland, Switzerland have GDP in the 600-800B a year range (interesting – Ireland’s is higher than Norway, but has no oil). Scotland’s GDP is supposedly 200B. How Scotland’s accounts are made up, is “problematic” to say the least, but let’s look at it both ways :

– if this number is right, then it shows a catastrophic mismanagement of Scotland’s economy by London.

– if this number is wrong and it is actually much higher, then it proves the colossal robbery which is being enacted on Scotland.

Either way, there is no argument for union. We are poor because of London.

Let’s argue from absurdity – suppose the UK made an offer to the norwegians to join “the most successful political union in history” – would they do it? No, but they might die laughing at the idea : “better together” – aye, so the London skyscrapers get twice as tall, Norway is reduced to the level of Wales, and the new british supernuke gets berthed in OSLO?

what is GTF in norwegian?

bobo bunny

Reveal your sources or shut up. If its YouGov and the Tory tax crook Nadhim Zahawi, then you are spinning a load of shite.

Gordon

Ah yes, GERS estimates (figures arrived at by sticking a pin on a donkey), guaranteed to be under-estimates..

The Scottish Government also publishes estimates for Scottish GDP, including some with estimates for offshore economic activity. The latest estimate for GDP in Scotland was £218 billion in 2023 when including its own calculation allocating offshore activity to Scotland on the basis of geographic share. (that old chestnut, after the Brits stole 6000 square miles of the North Sea)

Have a look at this chart, bearing in mind the obfuscation of Scotland’s figures:

link to statista.com

Marie

6000 square miles. Scotland what have you lost? So so sad.

Republicofscotland

Now when you look out over the sea at Carnoustie which is well inside Scotland’s border – you are looking out over English waters that were stolen from Scotland.

A MUST read website for those that don’t what’s going on – it has more info on the stolen seas.

Scottish Conspiracies Political Injustices Scotlands History Mc Crone GERS Report Indpendence Devolution Referendum 1979 2005 Trident

Geri

It will be returned. It was theft. Only fcked up corrupt counties demand payment in exchange for democracy. Scotland voted fair & square for our own parliament. That should not have came with a price tag.

Campbell Clansman

Marie, don’t take Geri’s illiterate ravings seriously.

Since Scotland never had any ownership over the North Sea (beyond the traditional “cannon-shot” 12-mile limit) there was never anything “owned” for anyone to “steal.” The North Sea Exclusive Economic Zone (EEZ) where the oil is, is granted to a nation–in this case, the UK–by international law. By international agreement the EEZ was not granted to Fifeshire, Lossiemouth, or Scotland.

Take a look at any map of Scotland prior to 1707 (i.e., independent Scotland). No map shows Scotland with any claim to the EEZ area, beyond the cannon-shot (12 mile) limit.

Geri

Oh do piss off.

Scotland has a clear maritime map of its waters.

They’re vast.

Unlike Engurland that only has a teeny, tiny channel.

Campbell Clansman

I give geography lessons to the fact-allergic.
Geri’s response is “piss off.”
You can’t cite a pre-1707 map of Scotland, the Independent Scotland you bang on so much about, that shows the middle of the North Sea as part of Scotland. Because there never was none.
it’s just amusing to destroy your fact-free rants, because they’re so easy to refute.

Young Lochinvar

Gloriana

If uncomfortable facts are merely figments of imagination then why did Westminster (auld Bleary Broon if memory serves) OFFICIALLY redraw a line (WELL outwith cannon shot distance) in the “north” sea in the first place?

Why the Icelandic “cod war”?

Why the “Norwegian” sector of the North Sea for drilling?

Why the constant bickering with Spain about waters off Gibraltar?

Facts are awkward chiels..

I suspect everything and every right you consistently disavow to Scotland here, you would defend to the hilt if it was your precious Union and England as the case in hand.

Debate is all well and good, trolling and doing propaganda with fictional p1sh read in right wing Fleet Street rags is not.

You serve no real purpose here, just agitate.

Gordon

As usual from you – utter bullshit! The North Sea revenues accrue to a geographical construct created specifically to deprive Scotland of any benefit – extra-regio. ALL revenues from that construct accrue directly to The Treasury – now there’s a surprise

Xaracen

You are being disingenuous, CC!

If there was no formal border between the Scottish and English EEZ areas, then there was nothing to move in the first place, so why did Blair and Dewar need to bother?

And if Scotland’s area was limited to 12 miles, why wasn’t England’s?

Aidan

Ahh yes this old grievance monger chesnut again.

Prior to 1998, the sea border between England and Scotland was only required to demarcate the jurisdiction of the two respective criminal legal systems (so if someone was say murdered, on a boat in the North Sea, would the murdered be tried in an English or a Scottish court). There wasn’t really any significant issues about where that sea boundary was drawn given that very few criminal cases were likely to be brought concerning that area of sea, so a straight line was drawn to make everyone’s lives easier.

In 1998, because of devolution a boundary which would be used for a much wider range of purposes including taxation was required. This boundary was therefore drawn in accordance with the accepted principles of international law with respect to the demarcation of EEZ’s. This follows a kinked route which is equidistant from the England and Scottish coastlines. That is the proper and appropriate economic boundary.

Dan

@ Xarcen

I tried to respond to the comment you just made a few minutes ago but when I submitted my post it said I couldn’t comment on unapproved posts…

T’was these couple of links.
(I would have thought all those red tick givers to my last post would have got their shit together and stepped up… instead of just throwing shit-talk at trolls…)

link to craigmurray.org.uk

link to craigmurray.org.uk

Xaracen

Thanks for these, Dan. I would have posted a link to CM’s posted comment rather than the whole text, but I couldn’t see how to generate a link to it in Wing’s new setup. I have no idea why Rev Stu binned it. It certainly wasn’t particularly long and it wasn’t abusive in any way.

James