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Minor roadworks alert

Posted on November 30, 2017 by

Scotland has 2,174 miles of trunk roads, of which 1.7 miles (that’s just under 0.08%) comprise the Queensferry Crossing. For the next few days those 1.7 miles are going to be subject to some partial lane closures on the southbound side for maintenance.

They’ll cause almost no disruption, because as it happens there’s another very similar bridge conveniently located just a couple of hundred yards away – linked directly to all the same roads – that traffic will use instead.

Not much of a story, is it? We don’t know how many miles of Scotland’s roads have roadworks on them on any given day of any given week, but we suspect it’s quite a lot. It tends not to make the news beyond a few seconds on the traffic bulletin at the end, but today was different.

The Scottish media went into full-blown SNP CRISIS! mode, and Good Morning Scotland took this minor piece of travel news – the delay to users as a result of the work is estimated at a maximum of three minutes – so seriously that it featured THREE separate lengthy interviews with politicians about it.

Willie Rennie of the Lib Dems completely lost his mind, madly suggesting that the work amounted to the bridge being “two years late”, while Jamie Greene of the Tories was uncharacteristically restrained – perhaps because he wasn’t sure if bridges were devolved or not – and finally transport minister Humza Yousaf was given a somewhat over-the-top grilling by Gary Robertson.

(We love Robertson’s tough interviewing style, but today he treated a minor temporary diversion as if the bridge had fallen into the sea. Greene, meanwhile, did manage to recover his hyperbole enough to describe being rerouted from one bridge to another one right next to it as road users having their “daily lives thrown into disarray”.)

The headlines above, as anyone reading the stories underneath them will quickly discover, are absolutely spectacular cobblers, fundamentally untrue and bearing no resemblance to what anyone seeing them would naturally interpret. Let’s look at a few extracts, adding some emphasis:

“further restrictions will be enforced at times up until September”

“The contract allows for those works to happen up until next September, at no additional cost”

“A Transport Scotland spokesman said although future lane restrictions were possible, timings of such measures had not been identified.”

The headline leads readers to think that the restrictions will be in place solidly for the next 10 months. In fact the “10 months” figure has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with the state of the bridge, but refers to the terms of the building contract. It simply indicates that IF any further works are needed – and nobody knows for sure if or when any will be needed or not – then they won’t cost the public purse anything so long as they happen in the next 10 months.

All bridges and all roads need maintenance for their entire operating lives. There’s nothing unusual or dramatic about it happening on this particular piece of roadway – all new projects have teething hiccups – and the consequences in this instance are laughably trivial. Most roads don’t have a handy alternative right next to them that people can use instead (and indeed have been using for the last 50 years). If you’re going to close a lane of a road anywhere in Scotland, closing one on the Queensferry Crossing is just about the least “chaos”-causing place you could possibly do it.

The ridiculous story is part of a concerted, years-long campaign by Scotland’s media and opposition to attack the bridge, because it’s an SNP success – an excellent piece of record-breaking world-class infrastructure delivered under budget and more or less on time, despite political obstruction from the other parties and the inherent difficulties such a project presents in terms of being hostage to environmental conditions.

As recently as last Saturday, for example, the Daily Record ran this scaremongering piece on page 4, which was comprehensively rejected by Transport Scotland:

And since the bridge opened the press have leapt on every opportunity to run negative stories about it for any reason they can find, including blaming punctures on it.

That can partly be attributed to the fact that bad news sells more papers than good news. But BBC Scotland doesn’t have any newspapers to sell, so readers can form their own conclusions as to why they’ve made such a mountain out of a molehill.

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    1. 30 11 17 11:57

      Minor roadworks alert | speymouth

    405 to “Minor roadworks alert”

    1. Welsh Sion says:

      Completely Off Topic … But …

      Happy St Andrew’s Day to all my Scottish friends in the indy movement.

    2. Walter Scott says:

      The Record can play all the greatest hit. Such as “Bridge of Lies” Come on DR. You know you want to

    3. starlaw says:

      Nothing I can really say about this, Ive crossed the old bridge lots of times when its been subject to lane closures etc. its normal. Whats even better now is that there is an easy alternative. Would make a better story if Willie Rennie was banned from using it.

    4. HandandShrimp says:

      The BBC are what they are…a complete shower of hacks and incompetents. Nothing changes. Willie Rennie on the other hand is just plain weird. First World Problems eh?

      I think Trump’s preference for Britain First Tweets, Brexit, £50bn settlement fees and ever receding trade deals are rather more pressing news but as the BBC no longer do credible journalism the chances of getting anything more challenging than a road report look bleak.

      Yesterday they did a negative piece on the Joseph Rowantree Foundation report on poverty. The report noted Scotland’s achievements over the last 25 years (better than the UK by a fair margin) and warned of troubling signs. The BBC laboured on the troubling signs but failed to provide any detail on why JRF thought there were likely to be problems. Looking at the UK JRF report it is quite clear. UC and benefit cuts. Deliberate by the BBC or incompetence? Or both?

    5. Macart says:

      Nope. No mystery whatsoever.

      I wonder if they’ve cottoned on to just why their stock as any kind of responsible media or political party has fallen off a cliff yet?

      Probably not. (shrugs)

    6. Auld Rock says:

      Starlaw that’s an idea but let’s not go for a total ban, let him walk over old bridge – in the middle of the carriageway, LOL.

    7. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Welsh Sion I’ll raise ah glass tae U tonight Cheers .

    8. jimnarlene says:

      The BBC in Scotland, needs a draw through with a backwards Xmas tree. They’ll not like it up em.

    9. Ken500 says:

      What if there was no Bridge?

      What a load of nonsense. MSM dunces.

    10. John Brown says:

      I believe my local MSP will be offering his usual canoe service for those “stranded” on the south side of the Forth.
      Anyone got a paddle for him? He stuck his oar in so often it’s gone all soft.A bit like him really.

    11. ronnie anderson says:

      @ jimnarlene Ah recommend a Douglas Fir , taller wie bigger branches ooofft .

    12. Helena Brown says:

      Strangele enough our road was closed the past two weekends. The signing could be better because the number of motorists who had not realised there was no way round the “bridge closure” and ended up running round the village.
      Where was the BBC with that report, oh I forgot, Five Council is Labour run, ah well.

    13. Iain says:

      Journalism, certainly as it is practised today, is a pretty sordid and disreputable trade.

      It’s driven by money, not the public interest. There’s got to be something to report, to sell the newspapers and the broadcast time (justifying the public expense, in the case of the BBC), and it has to be as sensational as possible, because if it’s presented as big news, the story can be made to last for days, thus easing the pressure on finding ‘news’.

    14. David Caledonia says:

      Donald Trump retweets something by Britain First and the British Buffoon Claptrap goes into overdrive, the reason they allways say Britain First is a far right group, which is a lie, Britain First is a political group that goes out and does non violent protests to make people aware of the likes of grooming gangs in the uk
      These are the grooming gangs that the BBC never reported on or even told the public that they even existed, Britain First walked down Luton high street and where threatend with violence and the police stood by and let it happen, that is what is happening in england today, if you stand up for your rights your called a racist, funny how only white people are called racist, but it does not seem to relate if your coloured

    15. Marcia says:

      Being a bit cynical you would think that the Media have a political agenda to paint the Scottish Government in a bad light. They know a 2nd Referendum is coming so they contrive to paint a gloomy picture and they ignore what is actually happening because of Brexit. Chaos with Brexit, Stability with Independence (in the single Market/Customs Union with EFTA or EU), the choice might be an easier choice for many. A slogan, ‘It cannot be any worse that what we have at present’.. could be useful in the next referendum.


      Today’s Alex Salmond Show

    16. David Caledonia says:

      Donald Trump retweets something by Britain First and the British Buffoon Claptrap goes into overdrive, the reason they allways say Britain First is a far right group, which is a lie, Britain First is a political group that goes out and does non violent protests to make people aware of the likes of grooming gangs in the uk
      These are the grooming gangs that the BBC never reported on or even told the public that they even existed, Britain First walked down Luton high street and where threatend with violence and the police stood by and let it happen, that is what is happening in england today

    17. Dr Jim says:

      I live in a cul de sac so in the event of road works I’m desperately trapped and the SNP have provided me with no escape or alternative but to suffer a waiting period of perhaps hours which makes me afraid for my health and could cause the economy to crash in my village due to there only being two pavements for a lengthy 500 yard walk to the shops to ensure my survival

      What shall I do, Disgrace I say

    18. Capella says:

      My local road was repaired a couple of weeks ago with delays of nearly a minute. No BBC Scotland reporters turned up to demonise the council.
      It’s a keep-the-SNP-out coalition council.

      Switch off the BBC. Listen instead to a St Andrews Day medley with Jimmy Shand and other artistes. It’s my birthday too.

    19. Neil Campbell says:

      Remember the queues on the old bridge when the Tories and Labour had tolls on them….

    20. Mike says:

      David Caledonia says: 30 November, 2017 at 11:13 am


      What an absolute zoomer. Britain first are scum. If you don’t agree just ask Jo Cox’s family.

      Therefor if you support Britain First you are scum.

      Made up name, David Caledonia supports Britain first, therefor he is scum.

    21. Robert Graham says:

      Oh christ thats it i give up –

      When are the Red Cross expected on the scene of this disaster.

      Have the UN been alerted

      Have food parcels and water been made available to stranded cold and hungry commuters

      When Is this useless transport minister going to be dragged in handcuffs before parliament.

      The same bbc strangely quiet on the one Billion and counting edinburgh tram inquiry , while i’m at it PPI whats the daily drain on the budget , thousands a day probably but the selective use of dramatic language that essentially is just an attack on the SNP government , in other words their day job takes top spot

    22. Any excuse to attack the Scottish Government, I believe it was that Libdem ignoramus Alex Cole Hamilton who started off all this nonsense about the Queensferry crossing snagging.

      Of course if it was Labour and the Libdems in power then all those projects would have been built perfectly and all would have come in under budget.

    23. starlaw says:

      Cousland road in Livingston is shut due to a gas leak. Come on BBC its just down from St Johns your reporters will easily find it

    24. jdman says:

      This is shocking, the disruption to peoples day is outrageous,
      could they not have predicted snagging would be required?

      So now when people reach the bridge from the North they are going to have to to all the trouble to turn their steering wheels to the left and go over the bridge immediately next to the new one!

    25. bobajock says:

      The Meejia Sah!

      Its the meejia thats holding the fort up north of north. The meejia thats making everyone see the truth.

      Hide yah money sah – panama or barbados?

      Of course sah!

    26. Breeks says:

      Stop Press 1890….

      “…Construction of the iconic Forth Railway bridge began in 1882 and it was opened on 4 March 1890 by the Duke of Rothesay, the future Edward VII. The bridge spans the Forth between the villages of South Queensferry and North Queensferry and has a total length of 8,094 feet (2,467 m). When it opened it had the longest single cantilever bridge span in the world…. but of course the bridge will be an abject humiliation for Scotland because it will require ongoing maintenance from day one, and they will never be finished painting it, because when they get to end they will have to start over again…”

      I find myself wondering how a modern Scottish “journalist” would fare if they were sent back to Scotland in 1890, but you know what, in 1890 as agents for Union and Empire, they’d probably have done very well or themselves running down Scotland’s ambition to be anything greater than UK cannon fodder.

    27. Clarinda says:

      Wouldn’t it be good if we could snag and repair the broken BBC so easily? They don’t see the irony of their contrived and bitter mumping of anything SNP – or Scottish interest for that matter – which blocks and diverts factual priorities (and their alleged code of practice) more than any minimal tension adjustment. It’s a wonder they haven’t warned us to stock our cars with Thermos flasks of Brown Windsor soup and packets of Tunnocks tea cakes for the journey.

    28. Proud Cybernat says:

      BREAKING from Pravda Quay
      with Jackie Kim Ono

    29. Jason Smoothpiece says:

      I thought many British Nationalists were against the SNP vanity project bridge in the first place presumably because they thought it was not needed.

      Therefore one lane closed won’t cause any issues.

      They have lost the plot fewer and fewer believe this nonsense now.

      It’s a lovely crisp day, they should go for a walk to clear their heads, an orange walk perhaps.

    30. The day Independence comes, and it will come soon, some riled to the brim by decades of BritNazi venom will take upon themselves to see the many wrongs put right.

      On that day, it will take all of our reasoned calm to stop a mob baying for the blood of the subservient lackeys of the BritNazi media.

      Don’t dwell on the rancid vomit those hell bent to belittle Scots and Scotland litter our country with.

      It will disappear down the gutter when the Big Storm that’s been brewing for decades unleashes the cleansing rain of Independence.

      Or – in less prosaic form – when we win, the opportunistic cowards will shit themselves and flee.

    31. Az says:

      An excellent skewering again Stu. You are something of a marvel.

      We must find a way to inform a greater number of people about reality. Just the other evening, a chap I speak to in my local boozer – and this guy is a supporter of independence – told me the QC was late AND over budget. He was extremely dubious about my insistence it was well under budget – that is until I googled some news articles showing it was £200+million under budget. He also had the impression that the bridge was closed on one side but also that the old road bridge was closed.

      Well, now I know – but I didn’t at that point. This is the drip drip effect of screaming nutjob media infiltrating even the mind of a guy who I know will vote Yes again when he gets the chance. I find this quite depressing.

    32. Arbroath1320 says:

      First up happy St.Andrews daypeeps.

      Second up happy birthday Capella.

      Third up what a bunch of ignorant incompetent useless earseholes these unionists are!

      Fifers are having to face up toa THREE MINUTE delay crossing over into Edinburgh on an OCCASSIONAL basis for POSSIBLY the next ten months. WTF!!!

      I used to live in Rosyth and commute into South Gyle in Edinburgh five days a week Jesus H. Christ it took me LONGER to get from the A90 onto Maybury road back in the day and I bet it has only got worse since then. Where is the BBC and Scottish media outrage about this?

      Just out of curiosity whilst the bus driver was going off on one about this NON event did anyone at the BBC consider asking him about WHEN his wee branch office are planning to pay their £800,000 outstanding police bill?

    33. heraldnomore says:

      FMQs, and here goes Ruthie on The Bridge…

    34. call me dave says:


      Aye your right there.

      BBC fort ‘Zindernuef’ like in ‘Beau Geste’ propping the dead bodies of the media round the paraphets in a last stand.

      Wee Wullie Rennie playing the part of Sgt Markoff… 🙂

      What was he like this morning eh? FGS!

      Lest I forget BBC Dab Radio 4 ‘extra’ in the early hours, a tribute to St Andrews day. Narrator signed off with.

      “The Saltire exists only to oppose England” and other patronising stuff which went before.

      If I remember the Saltire was well established as a national flag in 1480s and the St George flag early 1500s? but as usual Wiki doesn’t pin it down its all wrapped up in ancient crusader stuff and lots of maybe this and that. 🙂

      Good old auntie.

    35. JGBrogan says:

      Shame on the press and MSN! do they care how many people will change their travel because of the false news
      My first reaction when looking at the front pages of the Scottish press is thank god I don’t need to use these bridges.
      Where are the readers of this website and local people that must be inconvenienced by such lies, We need to let these meddlers of misinformation know that they are failing in their duty!Well I suppose they only do as they are told!!.Turkeys voting for Christmas??

    36. Training Day says:

      Wait.. Willie Rennie has a mind to lose?

      Donalda’s new broom has certainly done the trick at Pacific Quay. She and her staff are simply duty bound to report the fact that transport, health, education and police and fire services are all in irretrievable meltdown.

    37. Ken500 says:

      Why doesn’t Davidson just feck off.

      If it was left to the unionists there would be no Bridge.

      Bring back FPTP. Get rid these 3rd reject dunces. What a shower. What a bunch of uneless liars.

    38. jfngw says:

      The BBC are there to inform Scots they are inadequate and would struggle to govern themselves. If it is a UK government project it will be presented as a great benefit to Scotland, no matter what the lies are behind it. Whereas any SG project will be picked at like a scab for any minor fault, any negative story about the UK gov will result in a stream of FOI request around the same subject to prove we are worse.

      As long as you are aware of the agenda you are probable immune to the propaganda, but remember even watching will allow the negativity to seep in.

    39. PJM says:

      ***Breaking News***
      Ex-UN Secretary General Kofi Annan is to chair the Forth Bridge Scandal Enquiry…submissions to be sought from all badly affected parties, thought to include Mr Angry Ross Thomson, some Mormon fella, big swinging dick Alastair Majury, King of the Gypsies Douglas Ross, carpetbagger John Lamont, Fluffy the last King of Scotland, devolution expert and serial voter Kirstene Hair and assorted shiny, Tory sleek it-boys. The Enquiry is expected to run for at least fifty years, so when the great Kofi retires, the new head will be the even greater master of diplomacy Monica Lennon (21-gun salute discharges over the skies of Edinburgh as bonfires are simultaneously lit on hillsides all over her realm). It is thought that some guy from a castle in Fife will be firing off indiscriminately all manner of probing questions, gallantly overriding any convention for our benefit, and receiving such expenses to compensate all future castle purchases.
      Meanwhile on that Twitter…

    40. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      Britain First are an English Neo Nazi White Supremacist Group (Britain = England to these muppets).

      The BritNat Media will give them the oxygen of publicity (as they did and continue to do with UKIP).

      I assume it won’t be long before we identify Britain First members in Ruth Davidsons ‘No Surrender to Referendums Party’ I mean she appears to have collected almost the full set of Right Wing Racist, Sectarian, BritNat Nutters to her banner.

      Oh aye almost forgot, David Caledonia = David Britannia

    41. galamcennalath says:

      Here you go, YoonMeeja. Enough stories to keep you going till Hell freezes over ….

    42. Donald anderson says:

      Only the Onionist,sneering, same parties can turn roadworks snags into a victory for Imperialism.

    43. Ken500 says:

      FFS Labour dominated COSLA.

      Leonard should have a word with his 9 expelled members in Aberdeen.

      Wasted £1/2Billion on a grotesque projects of no value. £1.2Billion in debt. Sold the City in the stock exchange. That must be illegal. Cutting essential services. Now refusing to put up the Council tax for the wealthiest. £5 a month on average. After 9 years of restraint.

      8 Labour dominated Councils refused council tax increases.

      The unionists councils get enough money for education but use the statuary limits (30 pupils per class) as the norm and cut Education allocated funding. It is unionists councils who are wasting money on grotesque project of no value. (Private sector). Cutting essential service funding.

      The Scottish Gov is mitigating welfare cuts from Westminster. £100,000million. No bedroom tax, social care, lower student debt, no fees etc. Building affordable houses etc.

      FFS there would be no Bridge if it was left to the unionists. What a shower. Stop telling lies.

    44. HandandShrimp says:

      I have to say that I have no idea who Donalda is or what she claims to have done but I can say that I think the BBC journalistic integrity continues to spiral downwards. I no longer have any time or patience for any aspect of BBC output. I check the weather on the radio and that is about it. Generally if I have the radio on it is set to Absolute Rock.

      Shall watch with interest on RT to hear MacAskill on Megrahi tonight.

    45. Snode1965 says:

      Three times this morning GaryRobertson posted this on his own twitter feed, yet made no mention of the tragic suicide on the M80 that closed one carriageway completely all morning.

    46. Robert Graham says:

      o/t – so soon I know

      The English media trying to convince themselves they have a special relationship with the USA , as far as I know outside Mrs Mayhem no British politician has ever had direct contact with the Donald other than our own Alex Salmond, and he nailed the Donald very quickly, he said the Donald is your best friend up to the point he doesn’t get his own way, just like a petulant big child.

      We have all these commentators voicing their opinion on a person they have never directly dealt with, and it’s pretty obvious the last person on the planet, or indeed the universe they would ask is Alex , honesty talk about bloody vindictiveness, the same lot scream their indignation when he hosts a show that might embarrass their establishment, the same Alex they have tried to destroy, so the likelyhood of him being allowed to voice his opinion on any MSM here is Nill absolutely none

    47. Shazy Kinning says:

      Erm, only 2174 miles of “road”? – that’s not much!

      Followed your link: so 2174 miles of trunk road = 7% of Scotlands roads. So we have approx 31,000 miles of road. Which means the crossing makes up a grand total of 0.005% of our roads.

    48. Ken500 says:

      @ £100Million

      Unionists politicians give folk a headache. They are really annoying. They just make people angry.

      Westminster spending £Billions in grotesque projects of no value with cheaper, more feasible alternatives. HS2, Hinkley Point, Heathrow and Trident. Scotland has to pay repayment on the loans not borrowed or spent in Scotland. On average £4Billion a year. £1Trident, £1Billion no ‘minimum pricing’. £3Billion tax evasion, £4Billion high tax on Oil & Gas sector losing jobs. £5Billion Scotland can’t borrow to invest on growth. Less growth. Etc. £20Billion a year.

    49. heedtracker says:

      Ouch. That’s a painful read. Daily Record just detests everything now but Beeb gimps in particular certainly do think that this is a vile sep bridge too far. How very dare SNP Scots gov…

    50. mogabee says:

      Boy what scumbags.

      Did anyone else have a look at the tyre in question? If she paid £100 to get that repaired, she’s needing her heid looked at and the repairer asked some serious questions!

      In fact, see this whole shitey story? if only the journalist had looked at Transport Scotland’s website to check out why the part closures were required, the story wouldn’t be in the news at all…..Oh ..right..yeah 🙁

    51. Does Willie Rennie really have a mind to lose in the first place?

      I always thought he was a brainless idiot

    52. Ken500 says:

      FFS Peter Chapman. What a dunce. The millionaire worth £2Million. Income £1/2Million getting £100,000 in CAP subsidies. Pleading poverty. What a wally. Claims prescription for the sick are unaffordable. Supported cuts to education. Aberdeenshire Council. Claiming to support education in Holyrood. Blames the SNP for forty years of UK Gov fishing policy. The SNP did not support. Holyrood 2000.

      Westminster gave the £2Billion broadband contract exclusively to BT. They were fined for poor workmanship and complaints. BT were losing £2Billion on a subsidy in Italy. The Chairman lost the extravagant bonus but did not resign. More public money wasted.

      Baillie supports wasting £1Billion on Trident supporting jobs in Barrow on Furness.

      More nonsense about the Bridge, Council tax etc. MSM opposition. Get real.

      Brexit farce.

    53. mike cassidy says:

      If the SNP had been responsible for Voyager –

      they would be getting criticised this 40th anniversary for polluting space.

    54. dakk says:

      Great to see our trusty great british meeja have taken time out from reporting that the Duchess of Cambridge is excited on hearing that her ginger brother in law is getting engaged.

      Cutting edge quality journalism from the worthy custodians of our precious democracy.

      Pea brain pish peddlers.

    55. Giving Goose says:

      When a Unionist challenges you about how shit Scotland is, e.g. the snagging on the Queensferry Crossing, then ask them a question about the Great Imperialist UK.

      How big is the empire these days? Answer – it doesn’t exist.

      How are the Type 45 destroyers and how many of the 6 built are actually ruling the waves at this moment? Answer – 0 (zero).

      Why does the supposed great and powerful UK have foodbanks?

      There are numerous other negative (realistic) UK Memes that can be used.

      Use them and shoot these BrtiNat arseholes down in flames.

    56. ronnie anderson says:

      I cant get out of my rear driveway due to a set of traffic lights at a T junction average delay 10 mins , then when I get to the main Carlisle Rd another delay (WHY may you’s ask ) cause bloody Nth Lanarkshire Council have never built a roundabout that’s needed for 30 yrs .

      Shyberry Stadium was build, again a roundabout was supposedly to be built to alleviate football traffic . Where’s the feking roundabout Nth Lanarkshire Council , that £20million lost would have come in handy .

    57. galamcennalath says:

      While not a fan of Gerry Hassan recently, I have to say this is excellent …

      Not part of his narrative here, but I see huge parallels in the attitudes of the Westminster Bubble, to Ireland and Scotland. They understand neither, and they wish both wouldn’t stop getting in the way of their plans. And in both locations there are Unionists who, for inexplicable reasons to me, stay loyal to London. That loyalty is not reciprocated.

    58. Will ofcom jurisdiction make any odds to BBC propaganda?

    59. TheWasp says:

      Arrived back from Aldi where I was surrounded by butchers aprons on most of the fresh vegetables, to hear the colonel being an arse, to sit incredulously as Dick Leonard blethers pish,and as Pigboy Wullie makes a total clown of himself. The Scottish parliament should be shown on primetime TV so the apolitical among us can see the absolute wallopers in opposition who are the darlings of the Scottish media. This morning they were a complete embarrassment

    60. THOMAS Brotherston says:

      This might be a useful juncture to discuss the whole topic of road maintenance. It seems to me that the use of a surfacing material that only seem to last just long enough for the company who laid it o clear the road of the paraphernalia used in the process,take a fortnights holiday and then return to begin the procedure all over again. This smacks of a “jobs for the boys or more appropriately millions of pounds for companies many of whom are generous contributors to a party which shall remain nameless(as well as leaderless)
      This is the 21st century we land men on the moon yet we build our roads from prehistoric bituminous marsh mallow gauranteeing a job creation project that fills the pockets of the already mind numbingly rich whilst driving the road traveling public(I use this term haltingly) insane.
      Let’s boil up the tsunami of plastic that threatens to overwhelm us, add some clever additives to make more tractable,durable and more easily laid. We could even add some magic ingredients to make it generate its own sub surface heating.imagine if John McAdam had patented his road surface material! A more modern material for a more modern nation.
      Let’s not not to the past. Oh and by the way, your not still taking notice of the Unionist hyenas and their jackals in the press. Who listens to them anyway?

    61. Proud Cybernat says:


      So Labour councils turn down £20 million pounds of funding from the Scottish Gov because “it’s no’ enough”. At the same time they are spending their contingency / rainy day fund which could leave that empty in a matter of years. And over and above all that, they refuse to use the powers granted them by the Scottish Government to raise funds from an increased council tax, something they’ve been complaining about for years.

      What is SLabour up to? It rather seems to me that they are deliberately trying to bankrupt the councils they control because when that happens, they can turn round and blame the SNP. And yes – the lying bastard media in this country will cover their arses and promote the lie all over the country. SNP very, very bad – bringing chaos all across Scotland. Job done.

      Does anyone else smell a rat with this or is my tinfoil hat just being interfered with by cosmic rays from some ex-planet’s sun?

    62. Clootie says:

      I struggle to understand why some people still think that the BBC can be trusted. This story is such an outstanding example of distorting reality that screams media bias against the SNP government.

      I crossed the new bridge a couple of times recently and could only think of the positive image created by those three bridges sitting together…but not being a unionist stooge I may not appreciate the media viewpoint.

      PFI contracts / Iraq War /Rise in Food banks / Trident replacement / TWO Aircraft carriers / Brexit etc etc do not compare to a few minutes delay on a new bridge partial closure for a few days for snagging…The latter of course is the fault of Holyrood unlike the others which are glorious Westminster dividends.

    63. Scotspine says:


      Has anyone else noticed the cheap john, cheesy new jingle that Radio Sweaty is playing?

      Its like something from a parody radio show. Not a single hint of Scots music in it..

    64. Petra says:

      The Rennie, Davidson and Leonard cabal seem to forget that most of us live in the real world beyond Holyrood (Unionist shenanigans) and the MSM / BBC biased outlets. They can’t see that they’re actually p*ssing people right off. People who work in the NHS, Emergency Services, schools, colleges and Universities. People who use the bridge know the score. Keep it up folks. You’re way beyond ridiculous now. Thanks for highlighting how contemptible they are Stu, once again.


      Happy St Andrews Day everyone and best wishes to you Capella on your birthday X

    65. Davosa says:

      Another voice to add to Grinning Fuckwit Davidson and Wee Willie Shitforbrains in the turn off the bastard radio – Richard ‘Tortured Vowels’ Leonard. Is he really as stupid as he sounds? Surely not !

      Afterwards on the arch unionist John Bettie programme on BBC Shortbread he had 2 republican journos talking about ridiculous media coverage of the Ginger Parasite’s subsequent nuptials.
      Unbelievable and quite entertaining too -despite the guffaws and explosions of outrage from Beattie.

    66. Jack Murphy says:

      Scottish Parliament TV. 12.00. 30/11/2017


      Now placed in Archive and available here:

      Alternatively,First Minister’s Questions is now uploaded on to the Scottish Parliament YouTube Channel here:

    67. heedtracker says:

      Actual news, anyone? No? its important too, not as important as beeb gimp network SNP bad smear campaigning but…

    68. Meg merrilees says:

      Happy Birthday Cappella.
      Happy St. Andrew’s Day to all on this thread
      and the moaning Proud Scots But bridge bashers can go and jump off it. I fhb wind deflectors are as bad as they are saying, then there will be plenty of gaps for them to jump through.

      Scottish Parliament is an embarrassment, I feel sorry for Nicola being subjected to such disrespect and verbal abuse every week.

      Watch Leonard with the sound turned down, he is like a stroppy child throwing a tantrum…

    69. Robert Graham says:

      o/t – as usual , well maybe not that much , I really appreciate Nicola Sturgeons patience in dealing with this Unionist block in Holyrood, f/k I probably would have to leave the chamber, time after time, a question is asked and the questioner can’t be arsed listening to the answer.

      I wonder if Nicola has thought of changing tactics rather than answer these banal questions that are more suited to a council meeting, rather than encouraging these tossers by giving coherent answers , adopt the Westminster way, short clinically motivated fact free answers.

      Finally who removed Wullies muzzle a more useless article has never raised its head in Holyrood, I wouldn’t trust this Clown to cut my grass.

      As an other poster has said this Circus should be on Council TV so people can see how bloody useless these muppets really are, how they are represented by the ones they voted for .

    70. Petra says:


      Special relationship on a shoogly peg?

      Aw naw wha ur wi gonnie trade wi noo? Naebiddy seems tae want us. Mind yi wiv still got oor freens in aw the despotic countries. Ooor war-minging pals.

    71. Street Andrew says:

      ronnie anderson says:
      30 November, 2017 at 11:06 am
      @ jimnarlene Ah recommend a Douglas Fir , taller wie bigger branches ooofft .

      Sitka Spruce would take some beating.

    72. Dan Huil says:

      Don’t pay the bbc tax. Let britnats pay for britnat propaganda.

      Britnats love to binge on the Cringe.

    73. Street Andrew says:

      Robert Graham says:
      30 November, 2017 at 2:24 pm
      “I really appreciate Nicola Sturgeons patience in dealing with this Unionist block in Holyrood”…..
      ….I wonder if Nicola has thought of changing tactics rather than answer these banal questions ….. adopt the Westminster way, short clinically motivated fact free answers.”

      Heaven help us if Holyrood behaves like Westminster. That is something we can all do without.

    74. Socrates MacSporran says:

      About 25-years ago, I worked with a gnarled old sub-editor, who had seen and done it all in newspapers. He always said, his favourite letter to the Editor said simply:

      “Sir, Is the University of Essex really necessary?”

      I would suggest, after today’s FMQs, the 2017 version of that letter might read: “Sir, Is Willie Rennie really necessary?”

    75. mike cassidy says:

      The SNP have gone too far this time.

    76. David Caledonia says:

      I am a proud scot, My name is David, the last name says it all but ofc its not my real name, for anyone here to call me scum and to say that Britain First had anything to do with the murder of anyone just shows the intellect of some people, think for yourself you idiot, seems you still believe in the main stream media, you are the kind of person that needs a good boot up the arse now and again, do not call me scum untill you get yourself educated, you stupid little man

    77. Dan Huil says:

      David Caledonia you are Andrew Neil and I claim my ten Euros.

    78. David Caledonia says:

      Jockanese Wind Talker,

      Your not able to think for yourself are you, you appear to not be a bit thick, but totally bloody thick
      I have voted SNP all my life, i even have a card to prove it, Britain First is not a right wing group, go and research them if you are able to read that is, do not just come on to a forum and spout your silly ramblings without putting your case foreward, or is that to much effort for you……… have a nice day lol

    79. galamcennalath says:

      Some good news on a cold day …

      “The DUP has warned Theresa May’s Government that a Brexit “convergence deal” with Ireland could “destabilise” the confidence and supply agreement.”

      … the collapse of the DUP Tory deal over Brexit would be an interesting twist in this whole fiasco.

    80. Capella says:

      @ Arbroath 1320 Petra Meg merrilees, thx – I did enjoy the special St Andrews Day editíon of FMQs. Nicola deserves a medal for putting up with such a humourless bunch of girners.

      From Stu’s twitter – a link to the minutes of the Holyrood committee where the Bridge snagging timetable is explained.
      Shows up Ruth Davidson for the hysteria she tries to foment.

      Their own MSPs Jamie Green and Peter Chapman were at the meeting when the following extract was reported.

    81. Weechid says:

      Thomas Brotherston at 30 November, 2017 at 1:34 pm It’s happening:-)

    82. crazycat says:

      @ Capella

      Since you’re here, I’d also like to wish you a happy birthday, and many years of sleuthing to come.

    83. Takeourblueback says:

      The problem we have is that the non-political-literate are believing this mince. All we can do is keep pointing out these faux outrage stories to everyone we know, Yessers & Non Yessers (Women and Men… too soon?)

    84. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Capella Happy Birthday & many more to U .

    85. Capella says:

      @ crazycat – thx – I haven’t been able to do much sleuthing recently being distracted by life as we know it.
      But I still have material to search through and will post if anything concrete turns up.
      Of course, every day in Britannia is a treasure trove of examples of Heydrich’s unhappy doctrine at work.

    86. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Just as it is part of the current SNP agenda to demonstrate by “doing the day job” well that an independent Scotland is eminently viable, it is part of the BritNat agenda to automatically vilify every possible aspect of that job, and magnify any inevitable small imperfection into a major crisis. The one strategy is a reactionary response to the other. (All too typically reactionary.)

      Two things follow from that. One is that by “crying wolf” so extensively, the tame media have been causing damage to the wider social fabric of Scotland just as much, if not more, than the SNP in particular. Including themselves. They are a joke. None are trusted now.

      But the collateral damage is pernicious. Young people, if they give up all hope of the future because of this, are not going to “vote for Corbyn” or any other convenient BritNat stooge, they are going to vote with their feet and seek a better life elsewhere. Just as some of out brightest and best have been doing these last 300 years, to the benefit of other places and to our general long-term impoverishment.

      The second is that the SNP have to find an additional way now to get ahead of the game. Demonstrating full competence in government is necessary, absolutely necessary, but it is not in itself sufficient. (Even if it is all-consuming and energy-draining.) The party has to find some way of waking people up to the reality that the current slow-mo carcrash of UK governance we are suffering cannot be allowed to continue much longer.

      So far the efforts of the SG have been directed, rightly enough, at trying to convince the Tory UKGov that remaining in the single market and customs union was necessary to help protect the wellbeing of all from at least some of the hurt. That attempt has clearly failed. Even the ongoing crisis over the Irish border, where that policy would resolve much of the difficulty, has not budged this pathetic divided UKGov one millimetre, and barring some unexpected event such as the demise of a few Tory MPs in marginal constituencies, nothing is likely to change.

      So time now I think for the SG and the SNP to go on the front foot. Time to stop vainly attempting to mitigate this Tory shambles, and go on the offensive against them. Give them for once a taste of their own medicine, and call them out in no uncertain terms. And do so based on the plain facts which are readily available and not on wild imaginings.

    87. Capella says:

      Hi ronnie – cheers to u too. The sun is way over the yardarm in these high pastures, almost time for a tincture.

      What about a St Andrews medal to be awarded to anyone who has contributed to a free and independent Scotland. I can think of a few potential recipients.

    88. North chiel says:

      O/T , however picked up a copy of “ Scottish” Sun in barber shop yesterday ( wed).
      “ British citizen test” on page 7 , first question : what was the last battle between England & France?
      Answer : Waterloo . What an insult to the memory of the Scots & Irish who took part in this 1815 battle.

    89. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Capella Not for Glory Not for Riches Not for Honours dae we Fight we wad but see the Light of FREEDOM dawn .

      Ah might be poorer at the end of this Independence campaign but my Family/Gchildren/GGchildren & all the Bairns still still to be born in Scotland will be all the Richer for all our efforts .

    90. geeo says:

      Actually, David the troll, The guy who murdered Jo Cox STATED he was a supporter of racist bigots, Britain First.

      That creates a solid link between the two.

      Also, the 2 bigoted racist zoomers who run that group are BOTH on bail for racially motivated hate speech and actions.

      If fact, they have even almost caused the collapse of a trial where young women were raped by a gang of men.

      Now, as a racist bigot, i am sure you will jump on the media description of the gang as “muslim men”, but let me save you the bother.

      These men were rapists, their race, colour, choice of fucking biscuits with a cup of tea, is IRRELEVENT, there is no such crime as “muslim rape”, it is rape, nothing more, nothing less.

      Bigoted racist scum like you and your BF mates need locked up. Oh wait….soon the BF duo WILL BE locked up.

      Good riddence to bad rubbish.

      Hopefully, you will be joining them if you continue to promote hate speech as you surely do.

    91. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Capella Btw if that tincture comes oot of ah ribbed bottle don’t drink it LoL .

    92. galamcennalath says:

      Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Young people, if they give up all hope of the future because of this, are not going to “vote for Corbyn” or any other convenient BritNat stooge

      Yes, I believe this is the greatest threat to independence. People, especially young people, want a radical change of direction and so far in Scotland this has been Indy via the SNP.

      In the last general election, versus the previous, the SNP lost a third of that vote which was enthused in the aftermath of IndyRef1. Most didn’t vote Unionist, they just didn’t vote at all.

      However, there is the possibility that Corbyn’s Labour will be seen as the radical force needed. It’s a con, of course, but one of the better Unionist cons!

      A mix of lost enthusiasm and an alternative radical solution conspire to derail the SNP/Indy wagon.

      IMO only a renewed focus on independence will renew the momentum.

      Getting on with the day job is commendable, but we need more.

      No Holyrood Indy majority, no Indy. That is what we face and the Unionists know it.

    93. Al Dossary says:

      Oh cool, another poster that I can ignore.

      Really I am finding FMQT rather tedious these days. Davidson is doing nothing but look for soundbites, from a prepared script. She is incapable of forming coherent response and plays to the table thumps of her lackeys.

      Leanord? – if that is the new labour guys name (which kinda shows the impact he has had on me) is looking to be more of a disaster than screaming Irn Bru Murphy was. Wee Willie always was and always will be the most clueless party leader there.

      I do however like the way Patrick Harvey conducts himself weekly.

      But the award for the most useless MSP of them all just has to go to the Presiding officer. He has never once that I can recall stamped his authority.

    94. ScotsRenewables says:

      Britain First is a far-right and nationalist British political organisation formed in 2011 by former members of the British National Party (BNP).It was founded by Jim Dowson, an anti-abortion campaigner linked to Ulster loyalist groups in Northern Ireland. The organisation’s leader is former BNP councillor Paul Golding, and its deputy leader is Jayda Fransen.

      Britain First campaigns primarily against multiculturalism and what it sees as the Islamisation of the United Kingdom, and advocates the preservation of traditional British culture. It attracted attention by taking direct action such as protests outside homes of Islamic extremists, its “Christian patrols” and “invasions” of British mosques.

      Britain First has unsuccessfully contested elections to the House of Commons, the European Parliament and the mayoralty of London. In November 2017, it was statutorily deregistered as a party by the Electoral Commission.

      Personally, I believe that anyone who openly supports Britain First cannot be a genuine member of the independence movement, whose values are inclusive not divisive. I don’t want to see posts by extremist trolls like ‘David Caledonia’ and would prefer it if Stu banned anyone professing an affiliation to or respect for any extreme right wing organisation.

      There are much more important things to talk about.Don’t feed the trolls.

    95. Robert Graham says:

      street andrew – missed the point , the point was as ever, stop treating these idiots with respect it only encourages them .

      the unionist bloc aint listening , so why keep indulging them , most of the tactics are just for cheap political points , it’s all a game to them , pure theatre and lame comedy .

      One thing would help , this current Labour presiding officer needs to get a grip on MSPs who think its time for a rant instead of a coherent question , he allows a rambling monologue that might just include question to go unchallenged , constantly.

      heaven forbid holyrood ever resembles westmonster

    96. Les Wilson says:

      Proud Cybernat says:

      You are spot on, it is, in my opinion that it is a Unionist ie all, to carry out the bankruptcies you speak of. With the aim of bringing down the elected Scottish Government.

      Ain’t no democracy in the Westminster world.

    97. Morgatron says:

      You know , they hate the SNP nearly as much as i hate them. We should never forgive them for their lies, smears and hostility to the SNP and indy. They are just a bunch of fuckers.

    98. Robert Graham says:

      ScotsRenewables – Yep with you on this one and thanks for the info , needs nipping in the bud .

    99. Mike Baldry says:

      Perhaps pedantic, but the cited reference say 2174 miles of trunk roads. Trunk roads are only 6% of the 56092 km total length of roads in Scotland, according to recent statistics from Transport Scotland.

    100. schrodingers cat says:

      In the last general election, versus the previous, the SNP lost a third of that vote which was enthused in the aftermath of IndyRef1. Most didn’t vote Unionist, they just didn’t vote at all.
      I agree with this, voter fatigue and perhaps other issued contibuted to a large no show of our supporters.

      nicola is right to keep indyref2 below the parapet for the mo, let the britnat brexiteers and remainers knock lumps out of each other.
      our time will come

    101. schrodingers cat says:

      The second is that the SNP have to find an additional way now to get ahead of the game.
      agreed, but in the face of massive msm bias… how, what can they do?

      commonwealth games are few on the ground, if nicola were to fund and discover a cure for cancer and the common cold, combined with evidence for alien life and gods phone number we would still face a wall of SNPBAD

    102. galamcennalath says:

      If it wasn’t deadly serious, it would be hilarious watching the Tories’ Keystone Cops antics!

      They have sat on the Ireland issue over Brexit for at least a year. There is a lot at stake and they have been navel gazing. This is a revelation for them – there is a world beyond England’s border!

      ” Arlene Foster: DUP will not accept Brexit border in Irish Sea

      Party warns any move to ‘placate Dublin and EU’ will wreck Tory/DUP deal “

      Appeasing both EU/Ireland and the DUP may be impossibly incompatible.

      Anyone for another general election?

    103. Meg merrilees says:


      What is Theresa May to do… if the DUP throw their rattle out of the pram she gains an extra billion pounds- assuming she was going to pay it in the first place.

      The way things stand in N. Ireland there is no executive just now and if the Tories take back control, Arlene would just have to go along with it and do what the tories tell her to do, especially if they go for the Irish proposals re the border..

      However, there is a slight matter of one’s majority at WM??? hmmm

      Rock and hard place ( no reference to ‘Oor Rock’, bit early for him right enough…)

      OH, and what about Gibraltar???

    104. Meg merrilees says:

      North Chiel

      Apparently the correct answer to that question is Agincourt because the Battle of Waterloo was between the UK or Britain and France…

      Here are a couple of cracking phrases from Wilipedia describing the brave English battle…

      Opposing them on the other side of the road was Pack’s 9th Brigade consisting of three Scottish regiments: the Royal Scots, the 42nd Black Watch, the 92nd Gordons and the 44th Foot totaling something over 2,000 men. A very even fight between British and French infantry was about to occur.[68]

      Some historians, such as Chandler and Weller, assert that the British heavy cavalry were destroyed as a viable force following their first, epic charge. Barbero states that the Scots Greys were practically wiped out and that the other two regiments of the Union Brigade suffered comparable losses…

      Maybe it should renamed the English Citizenship test?

    105. geeo says:

      Was about to post the DUP story but see it is already it when good news travels fast…haha!

      Presumably that makes the Irish Border question unsolvable then..oh dear..what a wee shame.

    106. Gary45% says:

      This comes as no surprise to anyone who follows WoS.
      Lets keep a wee eye on the new Mersey crossing, I am 100% sure this bridge will have the same situations regarding “snagging” where lane closures etc are inevitable, on the grand scheme of things, its better to get it sorted “a stich in time” comes to mind.
      Maybe the useless Yoon parties should get on with their “REAL JOBS”, and be constructive, rather than “petty ill informed embarrassing attempts at point scoring, cause at the end of the day it makes them look like SCONES.
      To be classed as a Scone is one up from being classed a FUD.

    107. Flower of Scotland says:

      Al Dossary@4.57

      “I do however like the way Patrick Harvey conducts himself weekly”


    108. galamcennalath says:

      @Meg merrilees
      @North Chiel

      I came across the same citizenship test online a couple of weeks ago.

      Question 6 was ..

      ”What charity works to preserve important buildings, coastline and countryside in the UK?

      Age UK
      The National Trust “

      No correct answer of course, because none do that in the UK. Should have been England and Wales.

      Actually rather sad! That’s two such questions in the same test. We can only assume other tests are equally flawed ,.. not flawed, biased.

    109. Flower of Scotland says:

      The Wasp@1.28pm

      You are exceedingly unlucky. My Aldi has hardly any Union flags on anything!

    110. galamcennalath says:

      The DUP shouldn’t claim to speak for Northern Ireland. Last Stormont election they got 28%, and in the FPTP general election got 36%. They represent one faction, a subset of Unionism.

      Though with the Assembly suspended, it’s hard to say who does speak for NI.

      A large minority consider themselves Irish, not British. In the EURef there was an overall majority to Remain.

      A compromise of sitting between the UK and EU must suit most folks there.

      The essence and success of the Good Friday Agreement was that it respected the aspirations of all parties. Maintaining that as much as possible would seem most important.

      The present Tories would seem unlikely to get it right!

    111. TheWasp says:

      Flower @ 6.28

      I have noticed a creeping increase in UJs for the last few weeks. East Lothian leeks and all the onions except the organics covered in the fleg, as well as a lot of bacon etc. Still a fair amount of saltires but less than previously

    112. Legerwood says:

      Can you imagine what the Tories in Holyrood would have been like if they had been around when it was discovered the Forth Rail Bridge had to be constantly painted?

    113. Dorothy Devine says:

      Capella , what a good day to have a birthday and as Ronnie says ‘ have a happy one and many more.

      I look forward to a future birthday of yours which could mark an Independence Day.

    114. jfngw says:

      BBC News is actually worse than fake news. Most fake news is fairly easy to spot and dismiss. What the BBC do is give selective news often missing context or impartiality. Two of this evening stories were basically generated by Tory propaganda, QC & broadband role out.

      Spotted the bar broadband story in the headlines and commented before it was even run what the punchline was going to be. They forgot to mention broadband is a reserved matter naturally.

    115. jfngw says:

      Although STV are little better, asking independent experts if they are SNP members. Surprised they didn’t follow up with ‘what school did you go to’.

    116. mike cassidy says:

      Ronnie Anderson 4.35

      Archived that NHS story.

      For the next Holyrood election the SNP should just put up a poster of Branson with a stethoscope round his neck and Ruth Davidson peeking out his pocket.

    117. Capella says:

      @ Dorothy Devine – oh that will be a wonderful day – whichever day it is!

      @ ronnie – ribbed bottle??? – whit’s that?

      I’m starting off with a wee bottle of Estrella in support of Barcelona. I may progress to something more toxic later. At which point I will be too incoherent to post anything! But I can still read!

      So keep the comments flowing.

    118. mr thms says:

      Just watched Reporting Scotland.

      Would Russia Today reporting on the Scottish Government’s plans to spend tens of millions of pounds to bring superfast fibre broadband to Scottish homes and businesses leave out the fact that broadband is a Westminster reserved power?

      Also watched a Scotland Today.

      Their story was on the Queensferry Crossing roadworks and I wonder if a Russia Today reporter would have asked a bridge expert if was he was a member of the SNP, for saying that for a structure as big as the bridge, the repairs to the ‘bumps’ at either end of the bridge was very minor.

    119. One_Scot says:

      ‘Although STV are little better, asking independent experts if they are SNP members. Surprised they didn’t follow up with ‘what school did you go to’’.

      I don’t watch the propaganda that comes from the BBC Scotland and STV, for obvious reasons, but asking if someone is an SNP member is a new low I thought was not possible.

    120. geeo says:

      Read this on RT just now, must be ‘fake news’ i couldn’t find it on the BBC…hmm..(Sarcasm detected).

      Financial crisis forgiven? Caps on bankers’ bonuses could be scrapped post-Brexit

    121. Dorothy Devine says:

      mr thms, saw that too and thought the same – it goes with the Ms Magnusson question to Mr Salmond ‘ What would you say to people who are scared tonight?’

      They are utterly risible and pick up big cheques for being intellectually bereft.

    122. North chiel says:

      Delighted that Ruth Davidson has not as yet become “ Scotland’s national chef”. Thankfully “ bully” beef Ruth & “ spotted dick” Leonard “ off the menu” at Holyrood.
      Ps How pathetic that “ Misreporting North Britain” main “ story” tonight is the “ snagging” being carried out on new bridge ( on time & under budget) a credit to our SNP Scottish government.
      It’s a pity that our FM today did not highlight the unionist construction debacles of the building she was standing in or the Edinburgh “ trams fiasco” or even the PFI fiasco ( adopted initially by the Tories) , and presently thanks to Labour in Scotland costing local authorities an “ arm and a leg” for years to come.
      “ Aunt Sally” and cohorts at “ Pathetic Quay” are the “ biggest snags” in Scotland.

    123. mike cassidy says:

      No longer watch these news programmes.

      So how did the bridge expert react?


      Volley the question back?

      Or just deliver the deserved Glasgow handshake?

    124. Fran says:

      Its standard building contract. The contractor is liable for snagging and maintenance for 12 months after PC (practical completion) unless a latent defect is discovered later. Every structure in the country is the same.
      Every single construction project requires snagging.

    125. call me dave says:

      Capella says:
      30 November, 2017 at 7:01 pm
      @ Dorothy Devine – oh that will be a wonderful day – whichever day it is!

      @ ronnie – ribbed bottle??? – whit’s that?

      You must be a younger woman Capella. 🙂 Happy Birthday.

      Poison bottles were moulded with a ribbed pattern so the user who might not be able to see it or if it was dark would know by sense of touch.

      Bit like the new Scottish bank notes with a Braille mark in the corner.

    126. velofello says:

      Try putting yourself in Davidson’s/Leonard’s/Rennie’s place.What subject would you raise to embarrass/ expose the SNP government? Think about it, complain about what? Reality is that the government has all points covered – health, infrastructure, social care, industrial development etc etc. Standing up and complaining about SNHS statistics when they outperform the rest of the UK, of a minor snag list activity inconvenience on a stunning, under-budget new bridge is the height of stupidity.

      Patrick Harvie leading the Greens is the only one to act in a considered manner. And reference the comment above by Al Dossary about the Presiding Officer, remember Tricia Marwick as Pres Off? She stood no nonsense. “Mr Kelly, sit down, Mr Kelly, sit down. Clerks, remove Mr Kelly”.

    127. Thepnr says:


      Asking such a question to an invited expert just shows them up for what they are. They are not reporting “news” that is of any relevance but instead making it obvious that they are attacking the SNP. If he was in then SNP then “can he believed” is what is implied.

      I’d describe it as unbelievable but it’s all too believable.

      The media in Scotland have totally lost the plot and deserve to be ridiculed. Just listen to them, such propaganda disguised as news is actually sickening.

      It can’t go on and must backfire at some point, hell mend them.

    128. Highland Wifie says:

      Happy Birthday Capella. What a great day to have a birthday.

      So glad to have ditched the licence. Life so much better. Don’t have to watch all that dross any more.
      Could still listen but find I don’t really want to any more. Makes me shudder now. Since discovering Wings and Nana’s lovely links I’m better informed than I’ve ever been. Thanks all.

    129. Thepnr says:

      @mike cassidy

      You can see the reply to the “question” here.

    130. One_Scot says:

      Have said this for a long time. STV News is just as every bit as bad as Reporting Scotland. They are both vehemently anti-SNP anti -Scotalnd.

      Hopefully one day every will be aware of this, and will no longer be taken in by their political agenda against Scotland.

    131. Sandy Thomson says:

      Up here on the Cromarty Firth we have been living with roadworks on the A9 Cromarty Bridge for around six weeks. Everyone just accepts that bridges need maintenance. No-one blames the SNP.

    132. John Thomson says:

      Every one should watch replay of channel 4 news absolutely riveting debate on brexit in Dublin

    133. mike cassidy says:

      Thepnr 7.41

      Thanks for that.

      Don’t know what’s weirder.

      That STV left the question in the edit – thereby revealing their reporter to be an arse

      Or that Alan Simpson didn’t go for the throat literally or otherwise.

      It really is so frustrating when Unionism like this isn’t tackled head on by the person on the receiving end.

    134. Capella says:

      @ call me dave – ah – I see. It’s all pretty toxic I fear. Still, enjoying the effects for now. 🙂

      @ Highland Wifie – well there is a very festive feel to today, maybe a touch of jingle bells with 4 inches of snow outside and plenty logs on the fire.
      But it’s also St Andrews Day with what Nicola refers to as “our winter festivals” to come. So I hope everyone is enjoying the warmth of the season – not forgetting that some people don’t have a secure home and plenty food.

    135. mike cassidy says:

      And the STV reporter, David Cowan, knew what was going on re the road surface

      as he tweeted on the 27th.


      Which makes his question even more sinister than it first appeared.

    136. Thepnr says:

      @mike cassidy

      I feel your frustration, but just imagine Alan Simpson answered with something like this:

      “So what are you implying? Are you suggesting that my considered opinion is impartial and that I’m here to support the SNP? Well I have never been a member of the SNP or any other party for that matter and I find your question insulting.”

      Right a good answer and we’ed all love to see that happen, however as you have said a response like this would most definitely be edited out of the report and no one would be any the wiser.

      That’s one of the reasons we’re always on the back foot. We can’t force the BBC or STV to report anything at all that would show them in a bad light.

      All we can do is that when they do slip up try and get the message to as many people as possible via social media.

      Baby steps I know but didn’t David beat Goliath?

    137. Jock McDonnell says:

      Watching Ch4 news.
      It really is scandalous.
      If you are in RoI or NI or London, you’ll get your voice heard, input to the deliberations, eventually a deal.
      If you are a Scot, you’ll get fuck all. We Voted Naw Fur Hee Haw, so Back in the box Jocks.

      The lesson is clear, you don’t need to stand tall, but you do need to stand up. Assert your nationhood or bend right over. Its gonna hurt.

    138. Highland Wifie says:

      The logs are burning and the toast to St Andrew is warming the insides nicely lol.

    139. Bob Mack says:

      I am beginning to wonder if there is something in the wind?
      I am lately sensing an increase in the attacks on the SNP from all sections of the media. The thing is, these attacks are about totally petty issues and easily demolished. Could we be heading for an election ?

      These issues seem coordinated by the media rather than random, with often no right of reply by the SNP.

    140. Skintybroko says:

      Scottish Parliament Building, Trams, PFI Schools – people in glass houses with stones comes to mind.

    141. Wee Alex says:

      Did anyone at Holyrood mention the Labour PFI schools that fell apart after 6 years.

      Thought not.

    142. It is standard contract procedure to undertake snagging at the completion of a contract and to have retention of payments of full contract sum until the snagging work is completed ,this is often 12 months after handing over the project to allow any snagging work to be completed. The Queensferry crossing is no different and a project of this magnitude is bound to have snagging issues.
      That the SNP haters in the MSM and the Unionist parties are trying to use this as a stick to beat the Scottish Government shows that they will stoop to anything for an SNP BAD story .

      By just getting on with the day job the SNP are playing to the Unionist tune.Nicola Sturgeon needs to make it clear that if the Scottish Government don’t accept the Brexit deal , that there will be INDY ref 2 before the UKleaves the EU and before the next Holyrood election.
      A Section 20 Agreement on a referendum with the Tory Govt. in London is desirable but if this is not possible , we should consider going ahead with a referendum anyway.This will creat a new dynamic .The INDY movement needs to set the agenda.

    143. Petra says:

      @ North Chiel at 4:41pm ….. “Last battle between England and France – Waterloo.”

      I read that article too NC and reckon that newcomers to the UK are being brainwashed before they even receive their Citizenship. I also noticed that one of the ‘British Citizen Test’ questions is as follows:

      “By Law, which TWO types of media have to give a balanced coverage of all political parties and equal time to rival viewpoints before an election?” Choose between television; newspapers, Internet and radio. Answer television and radio. The BBC must have broken the Law on numerous occasions with the BBC Trust doing nought about it. Are we going to see a difference, during future elections, with Ofcom regulating now?


      Today’s Sun highlighting that the investigations being carried out on CC Higgins, Supt Kinnell, CI Glass, a fourth so far unnamed officer (all suspended) plus two officers who are on restricted duties, is in fact a witch-hunt.

      ‘The crime … firing guns at Force training centres. Top brass have previously allowed civilians to use weapons at the Jackton shooting range near East Kilbride. Aamer Sarwar, an expert in Police discipline matters, said “It smacks of double standards, at best looks like sheer incompetence and at worst stinks of a witch hunt. Had the Crown, PIRC or the SPA checked the law they would have found a provision exempting officers using weapons on ranges. It could have been resolved by a basic inquiry.”

      In June we (the Sun) revealed that HR Chief Louise Haggerty and her number 2 Janice Howitt fired weapons at the range on a ‘familiarisation’ visit. Force boss DCC Livingstone (now in charge) said at the time such visits were not a problem.

      Police sources described the move as “bonkers” as officers and staff without full firearms training can lawfully use weapons at ranges if supervised.’

      Maybe wee Willie Rennie, notorious hounder of the Scottish Police Force, could clarify what’s going on? Who’s behind the witch hunt and why?

    144. Meg merrilees says:

      This is turning into a SNP witch hunt on tv these days… maybe every interview should be prefaced with someone’s political persuasion then we can judge for ourselves.

      e.g. on QT every member of the audience asking a question should state their political persuasion before they contribute and if they have any status e.g. Labour Councillor, OO member, DUP member etc then we might begin to see a pattern.

      Re the Queensferry Bridge closure, in the ‘old days’ if there was a problem with the Forth Bridge travellers had to be diverted to the Kincardine Bridge and Clackmannan crossing – a substantial diversion. Now they only have to travel a few miles and cross another bridge in the immediate vicinity. What’ stye problem?

      Some woman being interviews by Brian Taylor immediately after FMQ’s made a comparison to moving in to a new house , having your housewarming and 3 months later having to get the workmen in to repair something…. well I’ve got news for her, that is exactly what happens in a new house. Often after things have settled in there can be small adjustments needing to be made, plumbing adjustments, doors not closing properly. It’s called ‘SNAGGING ‘ and it happens. They should all grow up and get real.

      No wonder there is global warming with so much hot air being spouted here in Scotland.
      Read on twitter tonight that the current WM voting intentions have Tories on 41% and Labour on 41%.

      So even with the worst UK Government in all time, certainly in living memory, Labour can only draw equal – they should be miles ahead by now. How can the Tories be on 41%!!!!

    145. Iain says:

      How long did the last Lab/LinDem coalition in Holyrood sit unable to make a decision on a new crossing before they left office, decision still unmade?

    146. Thepnr says:

      How can the Tories be on 41%!!!!

      Brainwashing by the BBC, Daily Mail, Daily Telegraph etc. etc. etc.

    147. Andy Anderson says:

      Personally I can understand issues related the expansion joints but to me no excuse re the roads surface. Poor quality control?

      Politics is politics. If any other party had built the bridge the SNP would have had a go too. Yes there is a very annoying SNP bbaaaaddd agenda which we all get angry at. To me this is a genuine have a go topic.

    148. Legerwood says:

      mike cassidy says:

      For the next Holyrood election the SNP should just put up a poster of Branson with a stethoscope round his neck and Ruth Davidson peeking out his pocket.

      That is an absolutely brilliant idea. Especially after the news that he has settled out of court after suing the NHS in England about a lost contract.

      From the Telegraph:
      “”2 days ago – Virgin Care, part of Sir Richard Branson’s business empire, appears to have been paid a settlement by the NHS after the healthcare group lost its bid to provide children’s services … A finance paper published by NHS Surrey Downs, one of the six CCGs involved – state its liability for the case was £328,000.””

    149. Effijy says:

      I’m totally sickened by UK Media with emphasis on what masquerades as BBC Scotland.

      Can we get the BBC to take this absolute nothingness story and measure it against the negative impact Gordon Browns PFI £Billions lost has had on Scotland, or maybe Edinburgh’s Labour Councils £Billions wasted on part of a Tram Network, perhaps Labours £30 Million Holyrood Parliament that cost £400 Million and counting with repairs on-going today.

      I listened to LBC radio tonight were a Scot, Frank fought to defend the NHS from Ian Dale Broadcaster and Tory Candidate. Dale is trying to gear people up for privatisation by suggesting that we can pay it no more.

      Frank advised that Switzerland spends more than double per person when compared with the UK, so how come the Tories tell us the UK is Powerful and Rich and leading the world economies when we cannot compete with a land locked Mini Nation with no oil or gas?

      Dale suggested the figures were bogus and he couldn’t find them on Google?

      I found them in 30 Seconds?

      Frank also enquired about why NHS England don’t ask the UKs best performing NHS Scotland how they manage to do it despite having a history of poor diet and alcohol abuse, and more Rural Locations to support and harsher weather
      conditions, etc?

      Dale, for the first time on the show made no reply to a callers com
      ment. He rudely flipped over to another caller obviously sickened by a positive comment about Scotland.

      We are living in a society somewhere between 1930s Germany and George Orwell’s 1984.

      UK Fascist Media Rules!

      Fool Britannia
      Britannia keeps Scots slaves
      England ever, ever, ever corrupt in Spades.

    150. Black Joan says:

      Echoing a comment above, I regret to report a distressing outbreak of butcher’s aprons in Aldi.

      They seem happy to promote certain Scottish products — a good supply of organic Scottish cheese, for example, and organic Scottish eggs — but many of the vegetables, including the organic carrots from Moray, were badged as British and wrapped in the Union Jack. So I put them back.

      This was in the central Glasgow High Street branch and on St Andrew’s Day, too. Nae Nationals to counteract the Unionist rags on sale, either.

    151. Old Pete says:

      Lying BBC just said the Queensferry Crossing will be closed for next five days, what a bunch of unionist bastards the whole bloody mainstream media seems determined to destroy Scotland and the SNP.

    152. Margaret Brogan says:

      Maybe Jamie Greene is a very bad driver and can’t cope with slight traffic disruption, thus his life is made chaotic by the slightest wee hiccough?

    153. David Caledonia says:

      I am not a supporter of Britain First or any other english group, if you wish to see real violence against democracy and the right to peacefully protest go and watch a Britain First video on youtube
      See where the violence is really coming from, and see fascism with your own eyes , and the pure hatred against our values and laws from people who think they are allowed to do anything they please ,its an attack on all of us, and it could be coming to your town soon, calling Britain First a far right group is so ludicrous and if you cannot think for yourself, at least don’t keep shoving the main stream medias lies down our throats, at least do some research and learn what’s really happening on the streets of the towns and cities in huge parts of Britain

    154. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Black Joan –

      Re outbreak of ‘aprons’ in Aldi…

      Have noticed the same in Lidl. Just from time to time, UJ appears on products which previously had no flag at all. Then it’ll disappear again. Is it possible they’re deliberately testing whether or not the flags do actually influence the shoppers? I can’t think of any other reason…

      And another thing – Lidl usually has Tunnocks stuff, but sometimes it has stacks of it. Could Lidl/Aldi be shifting excess resulting from the UJ/apron boycott being effective across other supermarkets?

    155. cearc says:


      Hope you had a great day.

      Ronnie and Call me Dave,

      The poison bottle thing is bugging me, when and why did they stop using them? It was a good idea. The last one which I remember having was a prescription from a Belgian pharmicist around around ’69.

    156. TheWasp says:

      I was talking to my next door neighbours father in law in Aldi just beside the store manager, we both loudly said if the UJs keep infiltrating onto the packaging, we would be taking our custom elsewhere, so I hope he took careful note of this

    157. cearc says:

      The good news about the beeb/msm propaganda is that everytime they run a different ‘campaign’ they reach a new set of people who know that it is bullshite and will start to question their motive.

    158. Thepnr says:

      @David Caledonia

      I’m not interested in the slightest what the Trump thinks of Britain First or Scottish Independence for that matter. What I am interested in is your views on immigrants and Muslims in general for an Independent Scotland.

      You say you don’t support them but neither do you condemn their views, which in my opinion are clearly racist.

      Care to share your opinion?

    159. Petra says:

      I wonder if the STV is now leading the way? Will every broadcaster and newspaper in the country start informing their viewers / readers of individuals / agencies political affiliations? As far as I can see they’ve refrained from doing so up until now in an attempt to dupe us all, especially during Indyref1.

      STV is practically on a par now with the BBC when it comes to media bias. Constant SNP Baad reporting, day after day, on issues such as PFI, Edinburgh trams, broadband, Equal Pay cases in Glasgow and so on. The viewer is left thinking that all of these disasters have been created by the SNP through them using propaganda techniques, such as omission and cherry-picking.

      I’ve also yet to hear positive news in relation to our oil industry or any of the fabulous stories that are being reported in the National or on sites such as Talking up Scotland. It’s all SNP Baad, murder and fitbae.

      If you watch TV and are aware of what’s going on please phone or email the STV (and the BBC / Ofcom) and complain. If you copy and paste articles from this site, the National, TuS or whatever and state that you’re sick and tired of having to get your news / truth online, it simplifies the whole process. It only takes a few minutes and if enough of us do this it could make a positive difference. One thing for sure is that if we all sit back and do nothing at this will continue or in fact worsen.

    160. Capella says:

      @ cearc – had a great day and winding down listening to Robbie Shepherd doing his St Andrews Night special. Lovely Gaelic song on now.

    161. Thepnr says:

      @David Caledonia

      ‘Thomas Mair repeatedly shouted ‘Britain First’ before shooting and stabbing MP’

      In run up to killing, Mair searched web for Nazi material, Klu Klux Klan, Remain supporter William Hague MP and murdered Tory MP Ian Gow, court hears.

      These are witness statements not fabricated media ones.

      The “cowardly” killer of Jo Cox repeatedly shouted “Britain First” as he shot and stabbed the Labour MP a week before the European Union referendum, a court has heard. Gardener Thomas Mair, 53, allegedly shot and stabbed the married 41-year-old outside her Batley and Spen constituency surgery in Birstall, near Leeds, on 16 June.

      Opening his Old Bailey trial on Monday, prosecutor Richard Whittam QC told jurors how the mother-of-two supported the Remain campaign leading up to the referendum on 23 June.

      “As she arrived she was brutally murdered by one of her constituents, this defendant, Thomas Mair,” he told jurors.

      “It was a cowardly attack by a man armed with a firearm and a knife. Jo Cox was shot three times and suffered multiple stab wounds.

      “During the course of the murder Thomas Mair was heard by a number of witnesses to say repeatedly ‘Britain First’.”

      Nothing in it then? Could’ve fooled me.

    162. Michael McCabe says:

      @ Capella 11:20am Happy Birthday to You.

    163. Big Phil says:

      @ Capella ,
      Great Winger, you sound as though you had a ball today,glad you did, Happy bufty. 😉

    164. James Barr Gardner says:

      Whit the feck are red’blue tories going on aboot Scotland’s newest an best brig, are ony got a feckin’ clue aboot engineerin’ NAW.

      I was talkin’ tae a an ex-polis inspector (YOON) who made comment aboot the brig, am sorry but whit the feck dis a polisman know aboot engineerin’, feck feckin’ awe! But he assured me it must be richt as it wis in the papers. Strange he didnae tak ma view on it? I wis only an mechanical engineer fur 35 years, better taegither with logic like that ye kin dae wi’ oot!

      If you bought a new bike ye wad need to tak it back tae the shop efter 4 or 5 weeks tae git it checked ower an’ adjusted. Simple, cables stretch efter use to their final settin’. So the same fur a cable spanned brig, whit has got a fair wheen o’ cables on it, this big weighs thoosands o’ tons, things will move an’ settle, but good design allows fur this. Remember this brig will last a damn sight longer than the last yin.

      I wad pit oot a challenge tae awe so called feckin’ politicians an’ churnalists tae go an’ pit a fu’ day’s shift in wi’ the maintenance boys on the new bonnie brig, I have ma doubts if they’ll git past the first teabreak. Whit a shower o’ basturds, awe patter an’ nae feckin’ bus fare!

      Rant ower, pissed aff the day, the wee woman went oot to-day an’ came back wi’out a haggis, nithin’ tae be had in ony o’ the shops, on a St Andra’s Day at that,
      these basturd unionists huv reached a new low level, weel feck them awe!

    165. Petra says:

      Question time: If ever there was a competition being held to find the greatest ignoramus ever to appear on that programme the Deputy Editor of the Sunday Times, Sarah Baxter, would be in with a shout.

    166. Robert Peffers says:

      Here’s a song for the occasion:-

      Unsafe Bridge by Pepper

    167. Graeme Doig says:

      Just popped in to say that I can see traffic moving freely southbound over the forth road bridge. Don’t know how they’re managing but there you go.
      I hope to be able to report a successful navigation of the perilous crossing tomorrow when I try and get to Edinburgh.

      This whole thing is Jackie baillie on stilts. And that’s no mean feat.

    168. HandandShrimp says:

      The Yoon propaganda outlets seem to be desperately vexed over any and every issue they hope they can spin as a negative. However, the “are you or have you ever been a member of the SNP” is an interesting new twist. I don’t recall hearing an expert ever asked that regarding any other party.

      Will we now see the same question asked of any expert in the future regarding all the other parties? 🙂 Who am I kidding. This Union is corrupt and there is no such thing as news, just propaganda.

      I am quite sure that RT has its biases but the BBC and STV seem determined to make RT look professional in comparison to their own efforts.

    169. Chick McGregor says:

      Robert Graham
      “The English media trying to convince themselves they have a special relationship with the USA”

      TBF Robert the Americans have always regarded the UK ‘special’.

      Unfortunately, ‘special’ has meant something rather different in the USA than in the UK.

      Of course in the neo-denial age that is Trump America we now have the situation where Tump says “you are special.” and May says “No, you are special.”

      Several million reiterations later the only conclusion the rWorld can come to is that both are ‘special’, which is of course absolutely correct and vindicates the concept of the superiority of gestalt intelligence.

    170. Ricey says:

      The hydraulic bridge over the Forth & Clyde canal at Bonnybridge frequently gets stuck in the raised position. Bit of a b’stard if yer an OAP walking down to the village shops. Ye cannae do it. And sometimes it’s combined with Scotrail shutting down the bridge under the main Edinburgh to Glasgow line. Bit of a b’stard when the canal bridge is up and the rail bridge is shut. Ye cannae go anywhere. Yet to see a Daily Ranger or BBC “reporter” commenting on that. Oh, aye, they cannae actually get to us to file the report. And we cannae actually get anywhere too. Just sayin’. Real problems not political shit.

    171. HandandShrimp says:


      I don’t know that much about Britain First so I took 5 minutes to look at their Twitter feed. It reads pretty much like a BNP/Stormfront type organisation.

      It is most certainly not my cup of tea.

    172. Valerie says:

      Oh good, we have acquired another scummy troll, extolling the virtues of Britain Furst.


      Unbelievable. Even the UKIP guy on QT tonight said they would not take anyone who had been a member. They’re that bad!

      Britain First are a disgusting, divisive, Muslim hating, click bait, Britnat, knuckle dragging bunch of tossers.

    173. Alastair Ewen says:

      Scotland actually has over 30,000 miles of road, of which 2174 miles are trunk roads.

    174. I commented on this absolute farce over on WGD.
      Sally Magnusson, Brian Taylor, are typical bought and paid for Union propagandists.
      The latest meeting to challenge the WM’Power Grab’of the 111 areas of EU legislation which must be returned to Scotland,’wee things’ such as agriculture and fisheries,between Swinney, Russell, with Mundell and Greening was relegated to second spot, while the Potholes and Pissoir amateur Toon Council dramatics of Davidson and Rennie headlined.
      We are a people held in check by the Scottish Branch of the Yoon Establishment.
      In my eyes they are Scots who are enemies of the citizens of Scotland, who place the wishes of a foreign country, England, over the democratic choices of the citizens of Scotland.
      You are spot on, Stu.
      I’ve had a wee wrangle with my local council over the clearance of autumn leaves from our avenue.
      I fully expect Professor Two Jobs WATP established bigot Adam Tomkins,whom we resoundingly rejected at the ballot in our constituency, to raise this vital issue next week at PMQ and demand that Nicola Sturgeon drop everything and make a beeline to our wee terrace with a yard brush and shovel, to get on with her ‘day job’.
      Our MSM are shameless, with no conscience.

    175. Liz g says:

      David Caledonia @ 10.39
      Well Am glad to hear that you don’t support Britain First.
      Neither do I.

      What exactly is it that you think is coming to a town or city near me?

      These people whom you say think that they can do what they like….. this is Wing’s… can say Torries!!
      We will understand.

      I am very sorry to have to inform you that – The Austerity- is already infecting our town’s and Cities.
      And you are absolutely right I am very concerned that huge parts of Britain keep voting fucking Tory.

      And that the media keep lying to us!!

      We should leave and right soon David don’t ye think??
      If ye do…then let me tell ya…ye came tae the right place!
      British First will get ye naewhere , they really are that dumb…(and before ye ask I did look) ….how daft do you have tae be …to let religion,any religion get in the bloody way……talk about yer Corersive Controll??

      Stick with us David….. because coming to the town’s and Cities near you….. Independence, Democracy and a Constitution.
      Once ye get that right….. naebiddy need fear anybody!
      If we get this right, religion will be a personal choice,and not a political device.

      You in??

    176. skintybroko says:

      Just came across the old bridge this morning – was an easier commute than normal – poor yoons will be raging!

    177. Dr Jim says:

      For three hundred and ten years a country that bought my country for money and then commenced to bully it and remove it’s wealth tells me on a daily basis what my values are

      I’m so grateful to the Bastirts

    178. Famous15 says:

      BBC Road Report GMS “Northbound traffic flowing fine,southbound that is fine as well”

      Cue regretful sigh!

    179. WeeBitContrary says:

      I am in agreement with Stu, I quite like Gary Robertson’s interview style normally, and I wonder if he’s gotten into trouble recently and is overreacting. I have heard him give a couple of fair interviews to SNP members recently, one I was quite shocked on how reasonable he was being (so shocked I’ve forgotten what it was about?!).

      Maybe he has been pulled up for being reasonable, because yesterday he took a fair amount of offence with someone advocating independent ATMs, going as far as shrilly suggesting people no longer need ATMs and certainly not one in each isolated rural town. Perhaps Gary has embraced online banking and contactless (which a later report said was causing debt problems particularly in the young) to such an extent he has no concept of cash?

      As for the roads, the constant reporting of the bridge is just bizarre – isn’t a snagging period always written into any building contract? (I just started laughing there, listening to GMS saying ‘let’s go to the queensferry crossing to see what traffic is like’ haha, the poor reporter is stammering over how light the traffic is, and making excuses about how people must have changed their behaviour – so SNP still bad. Do they have no concept of cause and effect? Wish they’d start hysterically reporting delays and road repairs on some of my routes – you have an awful lot to choose from in Glasgow. In fact, I wondered why not, when we have an SNP council now.)

      I still haven’t heard our BBC GMS team mention any council corruption re PFI deals. I have had to just complete mandatory learning of Competition Law and Anti-bribery etc for the corporate covering their behinds business world – and the full enormity of just how illegal the council was acting on the PFI deal reported here has hit me. There is no way that it should not have been investigated as soon as their was a sniff of a breach of competition law, that the authorities appear to have been complicit implies many heads would roll, the rules are extremely strict regarding public officials. How is this not news? And are our public bodies so corrupt that covering up is the automatic way they act? Is there no integrity? Why do we have these laws if no one ever acts on them?

    180. PictAtRandom says:

      Herald: “Repeats will make up half of new BBC Scotland channel content”

      Well, I just hope that includes “Greatest Hits of 2014”.


    181. Legerwood says:

      I think the Tories should be reminded that the last time they they were responsible for building a bridge over the Forth we ended up with one that needed constant painting – the Forth Bridge.

    182. John H. says:

      The Brits relationship with the USA hasn’t always been as cosy as they would like to think. The White House is only called that because it had to be painted after the British set fire to it in 1814.

    183. Capella says:

      @ Michael McCabe @ Big Phil – cheers and thx for good wishes. Loved that muppet video Michael.

    184. Greannach says:

      Many people, understandably, go on about Willie Rennie’s uselessness, but when you appreciate just how useless he is, it’s quite impressive that he got anyone to vote for him. That’s an achievement.

      Willie Rennie – “I’m a useless twat, Vote for me.”
      British Nationalist – “OK”

    185. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Ledgerwood All of 4 tons of Rid Lead paint year in year out , roll on lol

    186. PictAtRandom says:

      ” Legerwood says:
      1 December, 2017 at 9:10 am

      I think the Tories should be reminded that the last time they they were responsible for building a bridge over the Forth we ended up with one that needed constant painting – the Forth Bridge.”

      Interestingly enough, “Sir” William Arrol was a Liberal Unionist. No-one’s perfect.

    187. mike cassidy says:

      Well, as Nana seems to have overdone St Andrew’s Day –

      Here’s a little news to cheer up independentistas everywhere.

    188. jfngw says:

      Herald story quote:

      ‘Anyone in Scotland with savings or assets in excess of £26,500 is required to pay for their own care.’

      To my knowledge this is fake as anyone assessed as needing personal care over 65 receives this free. What they pay for is accommodation, food, etc.

      Is this just a repeat of the same story ran about this system in England but with an added ‘Scotland is worse’ spin.

    189. mike cassidy says:

      The effects of the medical condition known as Richard Branson Syndrome

    190. heedtracker says:

      Willie Rennie – “I’m a useless twat, Vote for me.”
      British Nationalist – “OK”

      You know you could just leave the name bit blank and sell it in most red, blue, yellow tory zones of Scotland.

      Where I’m from, Callum McCaig was a very good up and comer for the SNP. So they took him out in their Strong and Stable Teresa snap GE and we now have a, well just another tory stuffed shirt, like in the good old days of yoon.

      I’m a n other tory sock puppet, just like Colonel Ruth – “I’m a useless twat, Vote for me.”

      British Nationalist – “OK”

      “Lets agrees to disagree” was a huge buy what Murdoch says campaign lately for the Times too, here in Glasgow.

      If it doesn’t work, hope they start giving it away, like neo fascist and world class pervert Dacre’s all Heil the Metro shite.

      Its rather fun dumping huge fresh bundles of Dacre’s free, SNP bad grot in the recycle bin of a morn:D

    191. galamcennalath says:

      PictAtRandom says:

      “Sir” William Arrol was a Liberal Unionist.

      Unionism always was the strain of Nationalism which strives to ‘lord it’ over others. Classic imperialism.

      The Liberal Unionists were a break away faction of Liberals who opposed Irish Home Rule. They allied themselves with the Tories. This was at a time when most Irish supported Home Rule. The Irish Parliamentary Party was taking most seats outside Ulster.

      It is one thing for people within Scotland or Ireland (or Catalonia even) to be Unionists because they wish to be part of the larger Union. I believe it is something quite different for people else where to be Unionists on the basis that they wish to continue to rule over another someone else. That’s completely immoral.

    192. INDEPENDENTLY says:

      Absolutely SHOCKING
      Left 15 mins earlier for Edinburgh Airport and now I am 25mins early.
      How dare the SNP be so efficient and make things work so smoothly!!
      Pity the Tory Westminster govt can’t get on and do the day job.
      Universal Credit, Brexit, Yemen / Saudi all disasters.

    193. Les Wilson says:

      On BBCs morning Scottish tv news, the it was reported in first bulletin I saw that the work on the bridge would be over the next 10 months, the myth again. However in the later bulletin the 10 month lie,had been dropped.

      I have also noted that if I turn on the BBCs on radio early morning, there is a slight hint of truth, but by around 8am or a bit earlier, the headlines change to suit the BBC purpose.

      So whoever changes the first wave of ” news” must enter the building for work around 7am, and start altering to suit the usual agenda. (or it could be done over a terminal from London?)
      But it does definitely happen. Too often for coincidence.

    194. heedtracker says:

      So whoever changes the first wave of ” news” must enter the building for work around 7am, and start altering to suit the usual agenda. (or it could be done over a terminal from London?)
      But it does definitely happen. Too often for coincidence”

      Donaldo. Comes too, first coffee, wtf are the nightshift beeb gimps up to, change it back, its SNP bad, all the way, UKOK, or your’e fired.


      If you are an early riser, back shift beeb gimp etc, you’ve probably been bathed in the neo fascism that is BBC World Service.

      That charming beeb crew of neo fascists are only interesting right now because of Orange Hitler’s backing for British neo nazi’s on Twitter. But exact same World Service beeb gimps have been boosting, protecting, covering up Orange Hitler, since the day of his Pres inauguration.

      Although on balance, BBC World Service, well the whole £4+bn pile of tory britnat garbage would have been monstering Pres John F Kennedy to tory high hell and back.

      Maybe they did:D

    195. call me dave says:

      Big Auntie Radio 5 mentions a certain bridge closed for repairs but North bound traffic can still get across.

      It’s all true… But not the full story good old Auntie!

      Scottish engineering manufacturer fella tells us and shortbread radio Jamie that trading and business is good.
      Jamie adds the word exceptional but what about Brexit.

      Oh aye! Fella says outlook unclear but the trade with rUK worth four times that in EU … Thank you says Jamie

      Job done thanks Auntie… 🙂

    196. Almannysbunnet says:

      “Will the First Minister answer the question, was there or was there not a traffic cone spotted on the Queensferry Bridge, the public have a right to know.” over to Taylor of the BBC, “What Miss Ruth is trying to elicit from Sturgeon is whether or not the bridge can be classified as truly finished if a cone has been spotted on the so called bridge, I have here two journalists who were watching FM questions, what did you make of that?” Journalists in unison “well it’s fair to say that Miss Ruth has landed a knockout blow with this revelation that a cone and not any old cone but a traffic cone has indeed been spotted, allegedly, on the so called bridge, we can’t see STURGEON surviving this”. Well there you have it folks the Scottish government may not survive until the weekend in what is being called “Conegate.”

    197. heedtracker says:

      Well there you have it folks the Scottish government may not survive until the weekend in what is being called “Conegate.”

      Takes you back to, the Major tory glory days, when the English motorway building boom was getting out of control, none for Scotland as per, but they went motorway building apeshit down there, so

      It was an odd place to be though, watching England zoom ahead on giant road transport infrastructure spends, Scotland got none, but they were all moaning and grinching about traffic cones too.

      Poor old office shagger and tory lying hypocrite of the tory millennium, runner up to hundreds more of them, John Major, also hammer of the Scots, 2014.

    198. PictAtRandom says:

      So far we’ve just had short articles. I think a major crisis like this needs novel-length treatment:

      Looking at the summary, certain phrases like “simple-minded”, “obsessive hatred”, “demonstrating social equality” and “symbolising regeneration” leap out. I think it could be due an update.

    199. galamcennalath says:

      call me dave says:

      trade with rUK worth four times that in EU

      Indeed. They are super keen to push the UK internal market crap.

      The argument is being used in Northern Ireland saying trade with rUK is more that rIreland. And so we can expect it to be used from now until IndyRef2. They will relentlessly remind us of our important trade with England.

      For IndyRef2, the border and controls there, will be the central plank of Project Fear Mk2. If Scotland is closely coupled to the EU and England is out of the single market, Scotland and the EU will need to protect themselves against the potential of poor quality products from England.

      It’s all about regulations and convergence. When someone chooses to diverge, trade has to suffer because barriers become necessary.

    200. Les Wilson says:

      There is no doubt the BBC are our biggest enemy (among many) when it comes to Indy, or anything Scottish apart from wee documentaries striding over our hills and mountains and things like that. Or showing the english view of OUR history, we could not make it up, on the other hand, they certainly do.

      BBC guided by Westminster is a very anti democratic weapon, they must have very good propagandists in their employee while employing Nazi Grade dogma. a Curse on them, and I hope when Indy2 comes we hammer the Unuionists at the polls.

      I would love for them to get their just rewards by being kicked out of Scotland. What is it the yanks called the Russians when they made them register as a ??????. I forget the phrase but many will know it.

      But that is how we must regard the BBC. For that is what they are to Scotland.

    201. Les Wilson says:

      ” Unionists” ( typo last post

    202. Petra says:

      Sky News: Arlene Foster wants the EU to come up with an “innovative solution to resolve the Irish border situation.” She seems to forget that it was the UK that decided to pull out of the EU, not vice versa, people like her who voted for Brexit and her party that handed over hundreds of thousands of pounds in dark money which was then used effectively to ensure that the Brexiteers were successful. Scotland’s now being ruled by a Tory party that they didn’t vote for that’s being driven by a bunch of toxic sectarians in Northern Ireland. I wonder how many Scots are aware of this, in particular those who are Roman Catholic?

    203. Albert Herring says:

      The BBC a foreign agent?

      More like a foreign occupation force.

    204. Capella says:

      More nazi tactics being revealed, this time used by the stasi, but sounds all too familiar – from Stu’s twitter

    205. PictAtRandom says:

      I think that the DUP are in a much weaker position than they seem to realise. The most workable solution involves TM telling them to jigger off — and then fixing some kind of border in the Irish Sea.
      But if there is an early election then I would suggest that, in the more conservative parts of Scotland at least, it might be worth concentrating on Theresa’s bung to them rather than the more sectarian and illiberal aspects of their policies. Invite people in places like Wick, Buckie, Arbroath and Hawick to consider how a fraction of that money might be spent in the local area.

    206. heedtracker says:

      PictAtRandom says:
      1 December, 2017 at 11:16 am
      I think that the DUP are in a much weaker position than they seem to realise. The most workable solution involves TM telling them to jigger off — and then fixing some kind of border in the Irish Sea.

      DUP are merely posturing. BBC attack propaganda love posturing. Its right up their alley.

      But its going to be the EU that decides what the Irish border will be, because that’s what they are for. UK will either like what the EU decides, or lump it.

      Either way, UK in NI can pretend there is not a hard border on the way, but there really is.

      Or, how can you have all the great British Leave votes in the south east of England raging at us for a hard border at Dover, but no border in Ireland?

    207. Sinky says:

      Good to see socialism alive and well in the Labour Party.

      Former Labour MSP Lesley Brennan who walked away with a £30,000 pay-off after just 70 days of service has returned to Labour’s parliamentary pay-roll.

      Lesley Brennan became a Labour list MSP for the North East Scotland electoral region last year, following a colleague’s retirement.

      But she failed to win a seat in May’s elections, meaning she only served as an MSP for 10 weeks.
      Despite this, she was still entitled to a “resettlement grant” amounting to half her yearly salary. Now she has been announced as Scottish Labour’s new “chief of staff” – effectively leader Richard Leonard’s most senior staffer.
      Party sources suggested she could be earning up to £60,000 in the role, which is paid for by taxpayers.
      Ms Brennan is a leading figure in the pro-Corbyn Campaign For Socialism pressure group, and a member of Unite the union.

    208. Ken500 says:

      Every country trades the most with it’s nearest neighbour. Most countries do not have their economy controlled by it’s nearest neighbour to it’s detriment. It’s resources being mismaged and misappropriated. Against the majority wishes and the public interest. The Oil revenues being secretly and illegally taken by Thatcher. Cutting the Scottish budget to the core. ‘This must be kept secret’ written on Treasury documents. Appalling lies and deception. Spending the revenues building up London S/E. Canary Wharf and Tilbury Docks etc,

      Labour the McCrone Report. Kept hidden under the Official Secrets Act. Illegal wars, financial fraud and tax evasion. Costing £Trns Westminster mismanagement still costing Scotland £20Billion a year. The lie of a ‘single market’. The Scottish economy being ruined by Westminster intransigence

      £1Billion lost on Trident, £1Billion no ‘minimum pricing’, £3Billion lost tax evasion. On average £4Billion loan repayments on funds no borrowed or spent in Scotland. Scotland’s can’t borrow £5Billion to invest and grow the economy. £4Billion++ lost on Oil & Gas sector high Tory taxes, 40% since Jan 2016. Total £20Billion a year that could be saved or better spent.

      Westminster wastes £30Billion a year on Hinkley Point, HS2, Trident and Heathrow all disasters waiting to happen. With cheaper, safer more feasible alternatives at half the cost. Westminster has cut NHS £4Billion a year from 2015 to 2000. Cut Education £6Billion and Welfare £3Billion a year. £13Billion.

      Now Brexit ruining the UK economy. So the Tories and their associates can continue to tax evade. The EU is clamping down on it. The Tories will end up paying more to the EU for less rights and decision making. A complete and utter mess.

      Scotland needs to vote YES in the coming IndyRef.

      Mhairi Black and the rest are just great. The look on the Tories faces when she puts them straight. Priceless.

    209. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Independently I could hiv been worcer U could have arrived before Ud left SNP BAAADER .

    210. Another Union Dividend says:

      I waited ten minutes at temporary lights in Edinburgh this morning. This situation has been ongoing for weeks now.

      What is Yousaf doing about it?

      At least Stewart Stevenson resigned when M8 was blocked for hours due to snow. LoL

    211. Chris Baxter says:

      “Scotland has 2,174 miles of road, of which 1.7 miles (or just under 0.08%) comprise the Queensferry Crossing”

      Wiki says

      “Scotland has 2,174 miles (3,499 km)[6] (about 7% of the total roads in Scotland)”

    212. ronnie anderson says:

      @ heedtracker If T May sets a sea border in the Irish Sea , that would only be viable until Scottish Independence so she’s feked either way land or sea border .

    213. Les Wilson says:

      Albert Herring says:

      Then the BBC should be called the ” Enemy of the Country of Scotland”

    214. David Caledonia says:

      Well there you have it folks, Britain first walks down the streets of this country, and get attacked for doing so, police stand aside and do not arrest the attackers, there are certain types who do attach themselves to some marches, but they have been told they are not wanted as the people want a peaceful march in order to inform the general public what is really going on
      If you are of the opinion that the people in charge of the Britain First movement are part of any far right group, then show your proof, because i cannot find anything that points to that, there was a gathering of 3000 people not so long ago, they where there to applaud the killing of the people who drew cartoons of Muhammad, Britain First had 30 people there and they where attacked by a large part of those 3000 people for just standing there disagreeing with the killings and chanting Britain First, which is their democratic right to do so, if anyone thinks its a good thing to have people on our streets applauding the murder of journalists then i feel sorry for you
      This is my last post on this matter, i cannot be bothered with people who follow the lies of the MSM, its so tedious trying to educate some people about the truth

    215. David Caledonia says:

      And btw, i have a lot of respect for law abiding religious people, i would never put anyone down because of their religious beliefs, having an independent mind does not give anyone the right to abuse me on this forum, if that’s all you have to offer in the way of debate, then don’t bother , cause i can’t be bothered with it

    216. PJM says:

      Don’t do Twitter as my wife knows I will get sued at some point…
      however been reading WoS Twitter feed and saw thon Duke moaning about not being allowed to torture animals to death by means of other animals, so I thought ‘I know let’s start a meme’…from now on the Duke of Buccleuch is to be spelled Buckloo. No arguments…this is the future El Presidente of Scotland handing down a decree…
      From henceforth until the future abolition of all hereditary titles and the confiscation of all land stolen by the kakocracy from the hoi polloi, the new designation is DUKE OF BUCKLOO, nae ifs buts or mebbes. To seal this important event in our history a packet of Golden Wonder Salt n Vinegar crisps will be consumed with a soft drink of one’s choice.

    217. Ken MacColl says:

      Can Willie Rennie lose his mind? Subject for debate?

    218. ronnie anderson says:

      @ David Caledonia When U come on to a site such as WoS & well informed people re the political landscape of british politics & talk shite re britain first not being racist , do U expect us to thank U . U were corrected politely in the 1st instance but U continued to try to make a case for britain first .

      Your another Troll that can’t hack it when held to account .

    219. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Graeme Doig –

      ‘Jackie Baillie on stilts’ is like something out of a Salvador Dali painting, and possibly the most disturbing image ever to appear in this place.


    220. heedtracker says:

      ronnie anderson says:
      1 December, 2017 at 11:38 am
      @ heedtracker If T May sets a sea border in the Irish Sea , that would only be viable until Scottish Independence so she’s feked either way land or sea border .

      Fact is Ronnie, its just not up to tory UK gov. Its all on the say so of hated Brussels. All we’ve had so far is the usual absurdist BBC attack propaganda since the Brexit ref, pretending that somehow the great Brit ory UKOK zone can somehow dictate to the EU, 26 countries, half a billion people, near on.

      Its the insanity of beeb gimp tory Britnat propaganda that makes it all completely ridiculous.

      And ofcourse, what they will now start doing, is boosting up return of The Troubles threats, unless Brussels gives them a soft/no border Ireland deal, which may actually work too. The whole tory media are certainly hinting at it. But however much the tory BBC led media want us to hate the EU, the EU is not tory britnat.

    221. heedtracker says:

      Give us what we want, or you’ll have blood on your EU hands. Marvel in awe, at just another Lord Scumbag in action.

      “Once it begins to dawn on the unionist electorate that the Irish government is trying to break up the UK then we are into very dangerous territory indeed.

    222. starlaw says:

      PMJ 11.57

      Golden Wonder Crisps…stolen from Broxburn and transported to England … no thanks

    223. David Caledonia says:

      ronnie anderson, i can’t be bothered, go an annoy someone else

    224. Steev says:

      Just to clear up any worries, I commute over the bridge every day (have done for a decade or more) and this morning there was no traffic southbound – I thought I’d slept through Friday and it was Saturday.

      I got from Dunfermline to Barnton without needing to queue.

      Can we keep it like this?

    225. David Caledonia says:


      Is there anyway we can block people here, i can’t be annoyed with people calling me scum and a troll, they don’t even know anything about me, all these type of people want to do is abuse people for having an opinion that does not agree with theirs

    226. jfngw says:

      The BBC almost achieved its role during the election, it was to reduce the number of SNP MP’s with the objective of them not having an majority in Scotland. They actually failed but an apology several months down the line after misrepresenting the facts during an election, they probably see as a price worth paying. An ermine robe will still be prepared for some of them.

      Having watched the said reporter for years, his use of facts, particularly regarding Scotland, is just his modus operandi. After all he was once a Murdoch tool, only left I suspect once he realised he would never be the top dog.

    227. Old Pete says:

      United Ireland would that be a plus for our Independence chances ? Where will all the rabid unionists be repatriated in mainland UK, probably Scotland and if that happens before we gain our Independence then we never will.

    228. Robert Graham says:

      o/t – What they leave out.

      Last nights BBC Scotlands late news featured the plight of a poor soul who runs a hotel in a highland glen, it showed the poor internet connection the hotel can access.

      During the ( hatchet job) eh report , it briefly mentioned BT Openreach as being in overall charge, but the whole substance of this report centred round the Scottish government, and opposition parties complaining about the Scottish governments woefully inadequate handling of the ongoing role out of broadband.

      At no point was the Westminster government mentioned, or this is a reserved power, it was never mentioned that the Westminster government appointed BT Openreach as the contractor , and the money the Scottish government has had to provide to fix the arse BT are making of the implementation of the role out .

      Nicola Sturgeon welcomed the threat from the Westminster government to by pass Holyrood and directly fund this problematic strewn project, she said we know the problems ,Westminster haven’t a clue as usual .

      Viewers were left with the impression it’s all the Scottish governments fault ,no other possible interpretation could be made, it wasn’t what they included, it’s what they left out , that is the whole crux of the intended hatchet job , another job done by BBC in Scotland, well done chaps .

      And my heartfelt commiserations to the owner of this hotel deep in a glen , tough shit dear you are surrounded by mountains miles from anywhere and you expect the rest of us to enable your little enterprise to flourish by providing services to the same extent & degree as the centre of a town .

    229. Chris Baxter says:


      “If you are of the opinion that the people in charge of the Britain First movement are part of any far right group, then show your proof”

      You mean like posting misleading and incendiary videos implying that Muslims are scum and intent on destroying UK society? And then directly stating how pleased they are that Trump retweets their “hate” videos (Britain First’s word).

      Like that, you mean?


    230. Old Pete says:

      BBC continue with their anti-Scottish propaganda no surprise there.
      When we gain our Independence then Jackie Bird and co must know their bums will be out the window. They are fighting hard to keep their jobs but we must prevail and defeat them and it needs to happy before the next Scottish government elections or it might never happen.

    231. GORDON FORREST says:

      This BBC branch office really makes me sick. I would have nothing to do with it but it is better to know one’s enemy. How about we all boycott it on Hogmany and then for the full month of February and I mean dont watch /listen to even a second of it and try convince all our friends and relatives to do the same.
      To them viewing figures mean money. They lose figures they lose money that might just send the message.

    232. David does not own a telly says:

      Robert Graham

      I can see that the BBC upsets you, i never watch it, mainly cause i don’t own a television in the first place, and have not done so for years
      Even if i do happen to see the BBC news, i don’t care about it as i learned many years ago that most of it was one sided anyway, i can’t get annoyed with it, cause its just so silly, and i cannot understand why people pay to watch it, and anyway, i have better things to do with my time than sit watching a little box in the corner of my living room, no thank you!, life is to short to waste it like that

    233. heedtracker says:

      BBC r4 gimps lunchtime news today, RBS shutting hundreds of branches, same RBS destroyed by City spivs, owned by tory UK gov, but right on Q, r4 beeb gimps head to their Scotland region for SNP bad vox pop Scotland and angry Scots RBS customers, who all say SNP bad, same beeb gimps evening getting SNP Scots gov rep on their vote tory news show.

      It wont be bbc r4, it will be BBC Scotland liggers, creeping about Glasgow today, as usual, beeb smear campaigning all things Scottish.

      Because lets face it folks, Alex Salmond and the SNP caused the biggest City crash, since the last one.

    234. Robert Peffers says:

      @call me dave says: 30 November, 2017 at 12:04 pm:

      “If I remember the Saltire was well established as a national flag in 1480s and the St George flag early 1500s?”

      Ye dinna remember richt, call me Dave.

      Here is what is known historically of the connection between Scotland, St Andrew and the Saltire.

      Records show that Scotland had adopted St Andrew as her patron saint by the year AD 1000.

      The Seal of the Guardians of Scotland (which was used to authenticate legal documents and communications) had a representation of St Andrew on his X-shaped cross in 1286.

      St Andrew first appeared as a national symbol on a coin of the realm, a five-shilling piece minted during the reign of Robert III. in In 1390.

      However, the connections go back very much earlier than that.
      Scottish tradition claims that the Saltire, a white saltire on a sky blue background, (which is the oldest flag in Europe and the in the Commonwealth),, can be traced back to a battle fought in East Lothian in the Dark Ages.

      Tradition has it that the battle took place in the year 832AD. when an army of Picts, under Angus mac Fergus, High King of Alba, and aided by a contingent of Scots led by Eochaidh (Kenneth mac Alpin’s grandfather) were on a punitive raid into Lothian (then and for some long time afterwards Northumbrian territory), were being pursued by a larger force of Angles and Saxons under one Athelstan.

      The Albannach Scots were caught and stood to face the enemy near Markle, by East Linton. This just north of today’s modern village of Athelstaneford. Athelstaneford, was resited onto higher ground in the 18th century, where the Peffer, flows into the Firth of Forth at Aberlady, forms a wide vale.

      At the time of the battle the Peffer Burn was wholly in-drained, and it formed a major obstacle to being crossed. The armies met near the present day farm of Prora, that still has a field named as, “The Bloody Lands”.

      Before the battle, King Angus led his troops in prayers for deliverance. These prayers resulted in the army observing a cloud formation that formed a white saltire against a blue sky.

      The Angus vowed that if, with the saint’s help, he gained the victory, then Andrew would thereafter be the patron saint of Scotland and after the Scots did win the Saltire became the flag of Scotland.

      Later, Kenneth mac Alpin, (who may have been present with his grandfather at the battle), united Picts and Scots and named the kingdom Scotland, Andrew did become the patron saint of the united realms.

      Kenneth mac Alpin, King of Scots and Picts, Ard-righ Albainn, was laid to rest on Iona in 860AD.

      This information comes from:-

      Flag Heritage Centre at Athelstaneford (pronounced ‘Elstenfor’ locally).

    235. galamcennalath says:

      It’s common for someone on WoS to be considered “a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting quarrels or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community”. Traditionally, the object of such behaviour was amusement, however in politics it is likely to be about disruption, deflection, and making discussions look uninviting to casual visitors.

      Sometimes a search on Google like “their posting name”

      reveals their past behaviour.

      There often seems to be a life cycle. They begin with short posts reinforcing the runnng theme and professing support for the SNP and Indy. Then a drip drip of doubt, often saying their support is conditional, then mild attacks on specific policies, and finally open inflammatory stuff. Job done, persona burnt out, disappearance, appearance of another character.

      It’s difficult not to be drawn in!

    236. wull2 says:

      I still think next to the name it should say something like the example to help people recognise who is for and who is not.
      WULL2 who supports independence says :

    237. call me dave says:

      @Robert Peffers

      Thanks for flagging that up Mr Peffers. IMust do better 🙂

      It was the St George flag being the national flag of England (date?) that was annoying me. Hard to pin down,

      PS: That radio programme commentator was Ian Hyslop now I remember. Here’s a link to listen for folk interested. 🙁

      Saint Andrew
      The Real Patron Saints

      How did a Palestinian fisherman who had never even heard of Scotland become the patron saint? Have the Scots got the wrong man?

      Ian Hislop pieces together a rather unsaintly tale of Andrew the apostle posthumously elbowing out his local rivals to the title, only to be challenged in later years by a romantic drunk, a poet – and Mel Gibson.
      You get the drift 🙂
      St George was a much nicer chap.

    238. admiral says:

      heedtracker says:
      1 December, 2017 at 1:12 pm
      BBC r4 gimps lunchtime news today, RBS shutting hundreds of branches, same RBS destroyed by City spivs, owned by tory UK gov, but right on Q, r4 beeb gimps head to their Scotland region for SNP bad vox pop Scotland and angry Scots RBS customers, who all say SNP bad, same beeb gimps evening getting SNP Scots gov rep on their vote tory news show.
      It wont be bbc r4, it will be BBC Scotland liggers, creeping about Glasgow today, as usual, beeb smear campaigning all things Scottish.
      Because lets face it folks, Alex Salmond and the SNP caused the biggest City crash, since the last one.

      Hey, heedtracker

      Did anyone remember that Bitter Togetherites told us ” vote Yes and nae banks in Scotland”?

      PS Just kidding! Of course they didn’t. 🙂

    239. frogesque says:

      @Robert Graham 12.53.

      The very same woman was bleating about her internet connection earlier in the day on Kay (wi’ an e)

      Smelling a very big rat at Propaganda Headquarters.

    240. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Robert Graham 12.53 Thanks for that post Robert I just caught the intro to that piece & her bleating about £ 80 grand costs to put a fibre optic line in , buying businesses on the cheap does come with some drawbacks , she’ll be expecting sunshine next lol .

      John Swinney warned Openreach/BT they had better pull there fingers out last year & fulfill their contract with the Scottish Gov .

    241. heedtracker says:

      Hey, heedtracker

      Did anyone remember that Bitter Togetherites told us ” vote Yes and nae banks in Scotland”?

      I do. They kept telling us that Scotland never have been able to afford to bail out “our” RBS. That fraud was pumped into the mainstream very hard and then RBS came out for NO and how they will Leave Scotland, if we voted YES because they are a Scottish bank and therefore, er.

      Beeb Scotland vote NO gimp hysteria wasn’t alone ofcourse.

      But the bank crash was caused by Alex Salmond.

      For the balance, it is worth having a wee lookee at City spivs literally dripping money, as they leave for their London mansions at the end of the City day. Its not just that there’s so many of them, but that they are literary shiny with so much cash.

    242. Proud Cybernat says:

      Bought The National this morning. Read it on the train into Glasgow Central. Didn’t leave it on the train for somneone else ’cause they have cleaners who come straight on and clear the carriages of newspapers etc.

      What to do? What to do?

      “Ahah!” Problem solved.

      Was passing by a big pile of Metros still piled high in their metal holder at the entrance to the station. Slipped my National on top of the pile of Metros and stood back for a minute. A wee old guy passed by and, without looking, took the top paper and went away reading the National.

      Hope he enjoyed it.

    243. One_Scot says:

      Seriously Dave, ‘Caledonia’, is that really the best you can come up with. How about Dave McHaggis, or what about Dave McKilty. To be honest I think Dave McJocky has a nice ring to it.

    244. Giving Goose says:

      Slighty O/T

      NHS Highland publish communications on their intranet (available to all staff), including questions that are submitted by journalists.

      The entries give an interesting insight into the agenda of said journalists, especially the P&J; as of 30 November, here is a typical P&J belter –

      P&J – I’m working on a story re: the number of adverse events in hospitals. Could you please provide comment as to the extent of these numbers, and what NHS Highland is doing to reduce them?

      Response – NHS Highland aims to ensure that all adverse events are reported, acted upon and analysed as appropriate and the knowledge thus gained to improve quality, patient safety and performance of the organisation. This will encourage and strengthen a learning culture in which the quality of care for patients and working lives for staff will continuously be improved.

      Goose – Do you think the P7J has an agenda? Does a bear etc….

    245. Giving Goose says:

      Slighty O/T

      NHS Highland publish communications on their intranet (available to all staff), including questions that are submitted by journalists.

      The entries give an interesting insight into the agenda of said journalists, especially the P&J; as of 30 November, here is a typical P&J belter –

      P&J – I’m working on a story re: the number of adverse events in hospitals. Could you please provide comment as to the extent of these numbers, and what NHS Highland is doing to reduce them?

      Response – NHS Highland aims to ensure that all adverse events are reported, acted upon and analysed as appropriate and the knowledge thus gained to improve quality, patient safety and performance of the organisation. This will encourage and strengthen a learning culture in which the quality of care for patients and working lives for staff will continuously be improved.

      Goose – Do you think the P&J has an agenda? Does a bear etc….

    246. heedtracker says:

      Lovely redition of Scotland’s history Rob!

      But its the, “Scottish tradition claims” thingee, that we must always be wary of because this is just one rout britnat yoon culture takes, to erase Scotland from contemporary UK history.

      How many times have we been told that it was the Scots tribe of Ireland what actually invaded Pictland, from Ireland, and successfully took over? Its all complete lies and the Scots of Ireland just never existed.

      Welcome to the Neil Oliver yoon roaster UKOK history channel, sorry that should read, future Sir Neil Oliver, yoon roaster, for the UK.

    247. Socrates MacSporran says:

      Anent the current interest in RBS, and their branch closure programme.

      I have a friend who started with what ultimately became RBS, aged 16 and straight out of school. He rose through the ranks to a very senior position, but got out before it all went tits-up.

      He is adamant, the problem with RBs and the other banks is, as they expanded, they gave too-many key positions to people who were not bankers, who had not come-up through the banking culture, and, the career bankers who were there were not listened to when they warned of impending disaster.

      He said: “I warned the board of directors, they were going down the wrong path; at least half a dozen guys at my level, all of us career bankers, who had started in our local branches also warned them – we saw where it would end, and we were right. They listened to the spivs in the City of London and not the real bankers, the result was disaster.”

    248. SeanW92 says:

      @GORDON FORREST RE BBC boycott

      Whilst I like your thinking perhaps just pushing for non-compliance with the TV licensing might be a better shout?

      Already a well established campaign in place for that and it’d be easier to convince people to save themselves a bit of money than miss their daily brainwashing (albeit desirable that they give it a miss).

    249. Legerwood says:

      ronnie anderson says:
      1 December, 2017 at 1:38 pm
      @ Robert Graham 12.53 Thanks for that post Robert I just caught the intro to that piece & her bleating about £ 80 grand costs to put a fibre optic line in , buying businesses on the cheap does come with some drawbacks , she’ll be expecting sunshine next lol .

      John Swinney warned Openreach/BT they had better pull there fingers out last year & fulfill their contract with the Scottish Gov .

      If this is the story about the Glen Clova hotel and it’s Wi-Fi that was on Reporting Scotland last night and is prominently displayed on the BBC news website then her comment that you just need to look at the TripAdvisor site to see all the adverse comments guests had made about it is a bit of a stretch.

      Last night I looked at the TripAdvisor site for the hotel and looked at the reviews under ‘facilities’ . Nary a mention of wi-fi.

      Today I looked at the reviews in general. There are 85 pages, 430 reviews or so.

      I got as far as page 8, and noted 3 comments about wi-fi being poor BUT all 3 said it did not matter because the walking, scenery etc were great and 1 said it was OK in reception. Gave up at that point.

    250. geeo says:

      No need to boycott the BBC.

      They already almost never have SNP politicians on anyway.

      Yesterday they were discussing the brexit talks with devolved governments and ONLY spoke to Carwyn Jones, and never even mentioned Scotsgov far less talked to someone.

    251. X_Sticks says:

      @Ronnie Anderson

      “she’ll be expecting sunshine next”

      I think you’ve misjudged her character. She’ll be demanding sunshine. After all it’s almost always sunny on the bbc.

    252. heedtracker says:

      He said: “I warned the board of directors, they were going down the wrong path; at least half a dozen guys at my level, all of us career bankers, who had started in our local branches also warned them – we saw where it would end, and we were right. They listened to the spivs in the City of London and not the real bankers, the result was disaster.”

      The other side of all that, no one actually knew what the City were actually doing, not us the public and their customers nor even say, Crash Gordo,

      Crash Gordon says he save the World, by not having the faintest idea how the UK’s biggest commercial or industrial sector was being destroyed, by City spivs, too big to fail, socialism for the rich, capitalism for the poor, style of Crash Gordo/Labour catastrofucks.

      And today, we have sneaky creepy beeb Scotland gimps desperately eating into the heart, soul, self confidence, of Scots, gradually but surely, not voting for the SLabour party.

      IS there some connection maybe?

    253. Thepnr says:

      Britain First’s “official policies” on a certain religion practised here in the UK and across the world by 100’s of millions.

      – Introduce a comprehensive ban on the religion of “Islam” within the United Kingdom. This ban will include the prohibition of halal slaughter, sharia courts, religious publications (such as the Koran, Hadiths), the operation of mosques, madrasas and “cultural centres” and the public preaching and / or teaching of Islamic scriptures and doctrines.

      – Introduce a prohibition on the use of Islamic face coverings in public, such as the Burka.

      – Anyone found to be promoting the ideology of Islam will be subject to deportation or imprisonment.

      The groups other official policies make for interesting reading too.

    254. Vestas says:

      Re the “£80 grand for broadband hotel” nonsense :

      The tl;dr is there’s at least 14 MILES of cabling to be put in place so £80k seems entirely reasonable (to me anyway) for one business customer.

      Oh and of course its a reserved matter (and subject to EU subsidy regs) anyway so ScotGov can’t do anything much.

      “SNP BAD!”

    255. Robert Peffers says:

      @David Caledonia says: 30 November, 2017 at 3:20 pm:

      “I am a proud scot,

      We only have your word for that, David and the rest of your post is sheer anti-Scottish/SNP abuse.

      Allow me to question you on some points.

      Britain First are openly anti-Islam are they not?
      Britain First are openly anti-immigration are they not?

      They have an estimated membership of 1,000 supporters. Is that correct?

      Britain First jointly led by Paul Golding, 35, a former official of the far-right British National party. Is that correct?

      The other leader is Jyda Fransen, 31, who was last month charged by police in Northern Ireland with hate speech at a rally outside Belfast City Hall in August. Is that correct?

      Britain First claims, (in their own words):-

      “Britain First stands opposed to all alien and destructive political or religious doctrines, including Marxism, liberalism, fascism, national socialism, political correctness, Euro federalism and Islam.” Is that correct?

      There’s other wee inconsistencies in your claims, David.

      Britain First claims to be a Patriotic British Party and was formed in 2011 by former members of the British National Party like Jim Dowson, an anti-abortion campaigner linked to Ulster loyalist groups in Northern Ireland.

      Thing is they claim that, “Britain”, is a country but Britain factually is composed of eight(8), distinct countries with four of those countries comprising the United Kingdom which itself is, first of all, a Kingdom composed of two former independent Kingdoms of which one is comprised of three countries.

      In short the United Kingdom is not a country – it is a Kingdom as its title correctly designates it.

      The other four, non-United Kingdom countries of Britain are The non-UK Republic of Ireland, the non-UK Government Bailiwick of Jersey, the non-UK Government Bailiwick of Guernsey and the non-UK Government Isle of Man. The latter three are Crown Protectorates but not under Westminster rule – that is their common head of state Is Elizabeth Rex II.

      These Britain First people come well wrapped up in Union Flags. Quite simply you really cannot be a genuine SNP member and support a very much unionist political party.

      You seem to claim to support Scottish Independence while espousing the mantras of not just a UK unionist bunch of extreme right wing unionists but who also stand for the still independent countries of Britain to be united as Britain – hence their title, “Britain First”.

    256. galamcennalath says:

      I know of some pretty remote dwellings in Scotland. Frankly I just can’t believe they will ever be serviced by laying fibre cable.

      IMO it will become a utility like mains water – expected in most places, but for some they need other solutions. Some locations will need to use 4G, satellite, etc..

      If it is national policy to supply everyone then subsidies of the most appropriate technology are going to be needed.

    257. Thepnr says:

      @Robert Peffers

      “Facts are chiels that winna ding” as written by Rabbie Burns.


      2. Britain First is a movement of British Unionism.
      We support the continued unity of the United Kingdom whilst recognising the individual identity and culture of the peoples of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.
      We abhor and oppose all trends that threaten the integrity of the Union.

    258. Robert Graham says:

      Still o/t – The honourable member who started this misinformation was daddy’s little Tory ,mis HAIR who perpetuated this lie in Westminster, she wrongly said and was not corrected ,she said the SNP government were the problem in the broadband rollout, knowing fine well that this was a Lie , or maybe I am being a little harsh on mis HAIR like all Unionist mouth pieces she is a little confused about what the Scottish government are actually able to do , what powers they actually have ,

      I think Nicola Sturgeon called their bluff by saying the Westminster government want to by-pass Holyrood, fine carry on chaps , we know the problems and as per usual Westminster haven’t a clue,
      Labour jumped on the bandwagon and were duly reminded if it wasn’t for the SNP governments intervention the hard to reach places would be missed out as not being commercially viable .

      Over to you Westminster let’s see how good you are,just like the farm payments mess that was foisted on Holyrood ,Westminster were never able to get it to work , and never managed to make all payments on time, so give it to the jocks let them take the blame .

      As ever the compliant media never reported that, we can’t have Westminster held up to ridicule can we , just blame the SNP with a little help from our friends in the BBC .Works every time .

    259. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      schrodingers cat @ 17:47 (30.Nov),

      Yes, we are all acutely aware of media bias. When they have descended to interviewers demanding the political allegiance of an interviewed expert on a purely technical matter, you just know that everything mediawise in Scotland is political now. And virtually all of it is directed against the SNP.

      Ruth Davidson is admired by the public at large not for her political acumen (she hasn’t any) but for her forthrightness. People like that because she seems to be “telling it like it is” and doesn’t pull any punches. OK, it’s mostly empty guff, and as G A Ponsonby rightly says, she never has to face any critical questioning anyway, so it’s an easy berth, but it has an effect.

      On the other hand, Nicola (for example) can handle any level of critical questioning, as she has to do on an almost daily basis, and is always quietly reasonable, even in the face of obviously skewed lines of questioning, and tries to answer them fairly, regardless. Likewise with the Brexit business, always quietly trying to get the UKGov to see plain sense, and continually being knocked back.

      But this continual attempt by all of the SG to merely mitigate the worst effects of Brexit (as with everything else) is beginning to look far too lame now. That’s the reason, I believe, that so many former voters didn’t turn out for the SNP at the last UKGE.

      The whole Brexitastrophe is at a tipping point now. People are beginning to sense the enormity of this historic BritNat error, and they’re just aching for someone to stop mitigating this disaster – while getting absolutely no thanks for it – and instead start telling some hard-hitting home truths. Standing up and pulling no punches in a way that can’t be ignored or half-truthed by the usual BritNat media lackeys.

      There are tides in the affairs of mankind, but oft times they do need a good push too.

    260. pitchfork says:

      OT: Brussels v London in the World Cup

    261. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      galamcennalath @ 15:38,

      They used to say that about electricity as well, until Tom Johnstone (one of Labour’s few genuine heroes) banged a few heads together and made it happen right across the highlands.

      Problem is, the SG doesn’t have the power (forgive the pun!) to do any such thing properly, hamstrung as it always is by London, yet when there’s any problem it’s always the SG’s fault, according to the BritNat media.

      I do believe that cabling the whole of Scotland is feasible given sufficent will, but it can only happen after Scotland gets independence and can run things fully without interference. Only then can a Scottish government (of whatever political colour) be fairly criticised if things aren’t right.

    262. Dorothy Devine says:

      OT but hope you are rushing to secure your free , only one per household , commemorative coin of Betty and Phil’s platinum wedding ?

    263. Gary45% says:

      The broadband shite the Yoons come up with.
      Ex Fib Dum Danny Alexander, ran his campaign on bringing Scotland super fast broadband, it comes as no surprise he did basically FU*K ALL about it.
      SNP= Real politicians doing real work, standing up for the interests of the nation they govern. I think many people are realising this, after all, the Yoon oppositions embarrassing attempts at the new bridge closure made them look even more foolish.
      Rubberheid and his fellow nobody’s on GM Shortbread this morning, obviously pissed off, because you could easily cross the River Forth by car with relative ease,
      so all the Yoon hysterics yesterday came to self embarrassment.
      SNP “Doing Real Government” 10 – Yoon pretendy’s 0

    264. CameronB Brodie says:

      See these hard-hitting home truths, best ignore the Scottish themed corporate media, they’re a toxic collection of prejudiced reactionaries.

      For a social science slant, the Yoonstream appears to be using a “determinant framework” approach to policy implementation analysis, rather than a “process model”. No wonder their judgement lacks a sense of “how-to” and fails to “recognize a temporal sequence of implementation endeavours”. Still, SNP Baaaad!

      Making sense of implementation theories, models and frameworks (full article, with added flow-charts 🙂 )

    265. galamcennalath says:

      Robert J. Sutherland says:

      I do believe that cabling the whole of Scotland is feasible given sufficent will

      You could be right, but my point was other solutions might be more appropriate,

      Not everywhere gets everything. Most of Scotland (by area) gets a much cut down version of Freeview (no Alex Salmond 🙁 ). Most doesn’t get DAB radio, or outside the populated areas gets only ‘English DAB’. Most hasn’t got 4G. 3G is little better and much still has no coverage.

      Water is a good case. Many homes don’t have mains water. Other solutions are used. A business with private source needs a filtration system and annual certification.

      Your example of electricity, and also landline phones, are indeed almost universal. Eigg, though, is one community where electricity has been off grid. There will be others.

      So ‘essential’ services are never quite universal, or in some cases very far from it.

      We should aim high, but in some locations IMO, it needs to be by alternative means.

    266. schrodingers cat says:

      re st andrews flag

      the story about the cloud cross in the sky is also recounted about constantine the roman emperor

      Kenneth mac Alpin, was only ever know as King of the Picts, rex pictorum (or Rex fortrui)

      King Donald II died 900 ad, was the first man to have been called rí Alban

      alba probably only covered the area of the dalriada (not controlled by vikings) mannan, perthshire (caledonia) atholl,(fotla) stirlingshire,(miathi) fife, and perhaps even angus.

      north of the mount, ie, marr buchan, banffshire, moray etc was still a separate entity as were the lowlands.

      alba was and still is just the gaelic name for the island of britain, (see perfidious albion)

      the irish writers frequently refer to tha dalriadan kings and princes as Cruithne, creenies (ptolemy calls them creones) they were part of a more ancient and bigger kingdom which included the ulster cruithne. The ulster cruithne we subsumed by the rise of the irish O’neils as were the dalriadan cruithne about 500ad by fergus macErc.

      the term cruithne wass still used until the mid 700’s for both ulter and dalriadan kings but slowly gives way to the term Scot. (cruith is just the gaelic form of the romanised word brit)

      In the 730-40s the king Óengus 1 (angus of Circinn) led campaigns against Dál Riata and brought it under his overlordship by 741.

      the term cruithne was also used when refering to other pictish kingdoms, eg fife, fortrui, ce, circinn etc.

      it probably refers to a cultural and linguistic identity rather than a geo political entity. perhaps only as a means of differenciating them from people in the lowlands the romano welsh speaking britons ( pre roman brithonic speaking prydains)

    267. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      I refer you @David Britannia to the comment made by @Thepnr (must have missed the change back Alex) says at 3:39 pm

      “Britain First is a movement of British Unionism…….’We abhor and oppose all trends that threaten the integrity of the Union’.”

      So what if you are a Proud North Briton David, that’s nothing to be ashamed of (if that is your persuasion) it’s just that most of us on here are Proud Scots who feel your ‘Precious Union’ is well past it’s sell by date.

      However, the fact you are agreeing with and the views of a Political Group with a hatred for ‘brown people’ and foreigners are openly religiously intolerant and Unionist. Who’s supporter murdered a democratically elected representative of the people (even though I have no time for the Political Party she represented) says you are no Independence Supporter IMHO.

      Feel free to explain to me how Britain First’s principles would have any place in a modern Independent Scotland.

    268. Robert Peffers says:

      @Dorothy Devine says: 30 November, 2017 at 6:51 pm:

      “I look forward to a future birthday of yours which could mark an Independence Day.”

      I also add belated best wishes but imagine Dorothy already celebrates it as her own independence day. I believe her comments to come from a very independent minded individual who makes her own mind up on most issues.

    269. Andy-B says:

      Oops, looks like the price barrel of oil is on the rise.

      Cue the British establishments switch from, oils worth nothing so you can’t afford independence to, ah but the oil supply in the North sea is fast running out, so you still can’t afford independence.

    270. Is it just me, but I get the sense that BBC Scotland presenters are looking a bit sheepish these days churning out Brit Nat propaganda.
      They surely realise that many of us are tuning in and laughing in their faces when they report on the disaster that is the Queensferry Crossing.
      What possible job satisfaction can there be in being Wullie rennies pet news hound, sorry poodle.

    271. Greannach says:

      The bridge would work better if Prince Henry and Margo Sparkle drove over it en route to their honeymoon. But they’ll probably be mooning somewhere sophisticated like Las Vegas. Not Scotland.

      As an elderly Conservative woman with Union Jack incontinuence pads (think Jacky Baillie), I am more interested in royal weddings than bridges.

      I think you should place more emphasis on Prince Henry and Prince Arthur and all their children in your internet-site. That’s what excites people like me.

      No, nurse, I do NOT need an injection. Take away those rusks, you fickle jade!

    272. Is it just me, but I get the sense that BBC Scotland presenters are looking a bit sheepish these days churning out Brit Nat propaganda.
      They surely realise that many of us are tuning in and laughing in their faces when they report on the disaster that is the Queensferry Crossing.
      What possible job satisfaction can there be in being Wullie rennies pet news hound, sorry poodle.
      Iv’e just read Neil Findlay’s latest SNP Bad lies on twitter.
      Can this man ever appear more foolish and ill informed as he does today.
      Lazy old Labour lies.
      Fuck off back to La La Land, man.

    273. CameronB Brodie says:

      The Yoonsteam is the ragged arse of yesterday, scrambling hard to maintain Scotland’s lack of democratic agency. Their judgement is compromised by the partisan nature of their “community of practice”. Grubby tubes, frankly.


    274. Vestas says:

      There’s only ONE way to cable up rural Scotland and thats by using optical fibre (FTTP).

      For most of NW Scotland you could run the cables in the roadside ditches – armoured cable of course so only the most drunken JCB driver cleaning ditches could rip it up. No problem with water ingress either.

      This would cut the costs of maintenance hugely – there’s overhead lines on Lewis (for example) which are repaired up to eight times a year as gales bring ancient copper down.

      Its not rocket science but if BT are ANYWHERE in the process then they’ll try to sweat their copper network assets to the max. Their (frankly stupid) plans for show how far they’ll go to keep their monopoly.

      After indyref2 is successful BT have to be eliminated from any Scottish state funding – apart from anything else they’ve been in bed with GCHQ forever. In fact the GPO engineers set up what became GCHQ so perhaps “in bed” should be viewed as “in their genes”. Like BBC Shortbread it has to go completely.

    275. Robert Peffers says:

      @Andy Anderson says: 30 November, 2017 at 9:28 pm:

      “Personally I can understand issues related the expansion joints but to me no excuse re the roads surface.”

      Oh! Wad yo credit that?

      Here was me not realising materials used in road surfaces did not expand and contract like everything else in the World.

      Especially when you consider that on bridges the road surface has expansion joints between the several sections.

      Gee! Isn’t physics a wonderful thing.


    276. schrodingers cat says:

      shouldnt we all be wearing a yellow ribbon or summat to commemorate the great queensferry bridge disaster?

    277. Robert Graham says:

      o/t And probably off the wall anyone think of a way sleekit or just barely legal way to hit these constituencies that elected a Tory mp , maybe an emergency land tax review, a rateable value review . a removal of any kind of rate relief, something, anything to hit these b/ rds in the pocket, they want a Tory government and all the associated little goodies, well why waste time, give them what they wish for make them happy.
      Firstly any and all assistance the Scottish government plan to improve local services, stops with imdiate effect tonight , broadband back of the Queue, road improvements mm thinking about it send them back for review . Maybe make their MPs work for a change by fielding the many complaints of the SNP government being nasty to their constituents . Let’s see how far their FOI requests get them, I volunteer to man the switchboard and answer the postal requests .
      This could be fun as I am a bit deaf and a slow reader, but I am willing to give it a go , do my bit for the community if you like .

    278. Meg merrilees says:

      Robert Graham/ Frogesque

      The BBC has now posted the report a an article about the lamentable Internet connection at the Glen Clova Hotel


      I checked her website last night and read several of the trip advisor reports – i didn’t find any that commented on the internet connection…

      I wonder if a whole tranche of reviews will appear overnight damning the internet connection..Either that or it’s a cunning plans on her behalf to get lots of people to visit the website.

      Think it has backfired massively though, her twitter feed last night was positively collapsing with the number of folk decrying her and pledging never to return to the hotel, and it seems she thinks Kirsten Hair is really nice!Obviously a Tory stitch up….

      Did the BBC interviewer ask her if she was an SNP supporter at the end of the interview???

      Thought not!

    279. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      schrodingers cat @ 17:23,

      Good idea. I can just feel a McGonagall poem coming on to befit the occasion… =grin=

    280. meg merrilees says:


      there was report about a month ago saying that someone had worked out how to get a wi-fi connection through solar panels and satellites which would revolutionise internet connection around the world, particularly deepest Africa as well as rural Scotland.

      Just had a thought whilst listening to the news about the RBS closures, including my local in Bannockburn – maybe the SNP can forge ahead with the Scottish investment bank and get some branches established PDQ in these redundant RBS buildings!

    281. Thepnr says:

      Just had a thought whilst listening to the news about the RBS closures, including my local in Bannockburn – maybe the SNP can forge ahead with the Scottish investment bank and get some branches established PDQ in these redundant RBS buildings!

      Excellent idea, I know where my current account and all other business would be going.

    282. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Dorothy Devine Ah kin get two coins the front of ma hoose is in wan street & the back gairden ( caravans) is in anither street but ah wont be rushing tae pay over the odds fur ah nickel coin .

    283. Robert Peffers says:

      David Caledonia says: 30 November, 2017 at 10:39 pm:

      “I am not a supporter of Britain First or any other english group,”


      In the first place they claim to be a, “BRITISH, not an English, Group as you claim.

      In the second place to write the term, “English”, without the use of an upper case capital letter is insulting to the very largest percentage of perfectly decent people of England.

      In any event the whole organisation was begun by a very extreme right wing Scottish person, Jim Dowson, and I quote from:-

      “A far-right millionaire with Ulster loyalist connections plans to use his international social media network, which backed Donald Trump, to support Scottish independence. Jim Dowson, a former financial backer of the British National party and former member of Britain First, confirmed on Monday that he will be deploying his “Patriotic News Agency” and other networks with their bases in Hungary and Serbia to promote Scottish separatism.”

      Go read the full article.

      In any event Britain First was formed in 2011 by former members of the British National Party and actively campaigns against multiculturalism and the “Islamisation” of the UK. It is widely condemned as racist.

      It is presently led by former BNP councillor Paul Golding and former English Defence League member Jayda Fransen.

      Both Golding and Ms Fransen were charged with causing religiously aggravated harassment in September 2017 in relation to leaflets distributed in Thanet and Canterbury.

      Golding was also jailed for eight weeks in December 2016 for breaking a court order banning him from entering mosques.

      These people are extreme right wing activists with convictions for among other things racism yet you are here on Wings telling Wingers to get themselves educated as you imply you know better.


      Just a shot in the dark here David, do you perhaps support a team that plays football at Ibrox?

    284. TheWasp says:

      Alloa RBS shutting as well. Scottish Investment Bank would be my first choice when I close the account I’ve had since I started work.

    285. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      Of course muslims can have a place in an independent Scotland. Somewhere between the coast and the 12 nautical mile limit.


    286. Robert Graham says:

      Meg – thanks for the info , its amazing the more you scratch the clearer it becomes , what started as an insignificant wee gripe from a neutral hotel owner with no obvious axe to grind , bit by bit the dots begin to join .

      Surprise surprise at the bottom of the heep a wee unionist bit of mischief , involving our very own complicit bbc in scotland .

      This is when the Scottish media fail us all , a good reporter would have nailed this little bit of fakery without breaking sweat

    287. galamcennalath says:

      Tusk … “Let me say very clearly: If the UK offer is unacceptable for Ireland, it will also be unacceptable for the EU. I realize that for some British politicians this may be hard to understand”

      … understatement at the end!

    288. Gary45% says:

      Aye looks like the banks are getting ready for a mass cull.
      The cynic in me thinks its not just simply closing banks, the old chestnut about security for the amount you have in each bank comes to mind ie £85,000 per bank, when (not if) the banks all merge. If you are in the fortunate position to have vast savings in many banks, if they start to merge with one another you will be basically FKD.
      Shortbread this morning talking about how this will effect the North Coast 500 etc. Just when the North starts to see the benefits from its natural beauty and the massive boost to the struggling local economies it looks like the old ” We canny have Scotland getting any type of success” line is being trotted out. (Paranoid! Me?)
      Bitter together.

    289. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      Here, was the change to ‘Private Residential Tenancy’ that came into force today discussed much btl? Shifts more power to tenants, away from landlords, and seems quite a decent thing to do. Of course, landlords will have to be VERY careful about who they choose to rent to, and it could completely fuck up the lucrative Edinburgh festival rent scene, but hey.

    290. Thepnr says:

      Here is the full list of RBS branch closures across the UK. Scroll to the bottom for a list of those in Scotland and to see if yours is one of them.

      Don’t forget either than the reason for these closures now is to allow Hammond to sell off the UK government’s 71% stake in RBS as announced in last weeks budget, even though it will mean a loss of £26 billion (at the current share price) to the taxpayer that bailed them out.

      Call me a cynic but this move was pre-planned as a means of increasing the share price between now and when the sell off begins. So much for an Independent Scotland losing control of it’s banks. They never were Scotland’s in the first place.

      You’ve been had once again, will you ever get wise NO voters?

    291. Thepnr says:

      Link to the FT story of Hammonds sell off of RBS from the budget.

    292. Gfaetheblock says:

      Threpnr, wasp, et al

      Scottish investment bank is not a retail bank, they are aimed at SME financing.

      For Holyrood to set up a bank, it would need a UK banking licence and large capital reserves, there are significant barriers to entry to banking. I do not see this ever happening.

      If you are against closures and shareholders, go Natioonwide.

      Gary, love to hear why you think bank mergers are inevitable, leaving one super bank (?), suspect the MMC would prevent any further consolidation in the market.

    293. Socrates MacSporran says:

      I had a laugh at an item on tonight’s BBC Shortbread news, about some crashes on the Forth Road Bridge today.

      The guy they were talking to said something about how they had to lift some vehicles off the bridge, causing delays. He then added, that this showed the resiliance of the new Queensferry Crossing, where they have a hard shoulder on which to park such vehicles.

      The report was then suddenly terminated. Funny that.

    294. Petra says:

      I see you’ve reported on the RBS situation, Thepnr. I’ve just been in the process of digging out something I came across recently.

      George Kerevan states (The National: Budget Gimmicks hide Hammond’s refusal to hit the Growth Button), “Finally I see in the budget small print that Phil hopes to balance the books by flogging off £3 billion worth of RBS shares every year for the next five years.”

      Could this have anything to do with the bank closures?


      David Linden (SNP East Glasgow) has been pulled up by Bercow for refering to the House of Lords as “ermine vermin.” Good for you David.

    295. Gary45% says:

      The banking crash happened and anyone with savings saw their pennies disappear up the Clyde, since then the bankers who still control the finances are still having lavish bonus/ parties and you can rest assured the “money men” will take your last penny when they get the chance.
      The MMC are puppets in the grand scheme of things, if they have any power, ask yourself why the likes of Arnold Clarke have taken over car dealerships in many towns and cities across Scotland, up here in Inverness its turned into Arnold Land.
      MMC only when it suits them.
      They tax you till you die and get away with what is basically theft, “suits” rewriting the rules to suit themselves.

    296. geeo says:

      If it is not bad enough that RBS are shutting 25% off all Scottish Branches, the unions are demanding that the Scottish Government “protect communities which will be hardest hit”.

      No bad eh..anti indy unions see members shafted by unionist government, demand the SG, who they hate, sort their pals mess out.

      Tell your union members to vote Yes then, there’s a good start.

    297. Thepnr says:


      That’s a shame that we would need a UK Banking License whatever that is. Though I’d imagine that once established the Scottish National Investment Bank will grow to include retail banking as well.

      Guess we might just have to wait until we are Independent before we make our own rules and laws and don’t need any UK license.

    298. brewsed says:

      Broadband over copper wires has limited bandwidth and the greater the distance from the exchange or fibre cabinet, the less bandwidth you get. The Glen Clova hotel is many miles from anywhere so, using copper, will get low bandwidth but installing fibre with the civil engineering involved from BT would be expensive. However, with imagination and ingenuity it is possible to mitigate the costs: is the end point within line of site of somewhere with an existing connection? If so, bribe them to share it and put a line of site wi-fi link in. Even if it is not exactly line of site, a mast on top of the house or up the hill behind could do the job. Or, can you make an informal agreement with whoever owns the intervening land to install your own cable to the fibre cabinet. If there is a community without sufficient bandwidth, organise your own broadband.

      The Glen Clova hotel did not ask for a broadband connection, it wants a commercial 100Mbs Ethernet connection. OK, the installation costs would be the same, it is the same fibre optic cable, but the service level agreement is different and supporting that requires very different terminating equipment – not cheap Netgear routers but expensive remotely managed Cisco ones for example.

      But you wouldn’t want the facts to get in the way of a good story.

    299. Jason Smoothpiece says:

      Nationwide and your local credit Union for Banking, where you can, keep your money away from the evil ones.

    300. Gfaetheblock says:


      I am aware on no private savers who lost money in the global crash a decade ago. Shareholders, governments, councils etc all did, but no savers, unless you have links to those who did, i can’t remember this happening at all.

      The bail out protected the indivuals that cou”d have been impacted.

    301. Rock says:

      “The headlines above, as anyone reading the stories underneath them will quickly discover, are absolutely spectacular cobblers, fundamentally untrue and bearing no resemblance to what anyone seeing them would naturally interpret.”

      For counter balance, the one and only “independence supporting” The National should have equally screaming front page headline news stories every day.

      But it doesn’t because it is an utter fake.

      It wouldn’t even have to resort to “absolutely spectacular cobblers”.

      All it has to do is to pay a reasonable fee to the Rev. Stuart Campbell to reproduce WOS articles as front page headline news every day.

    302. Gfaetheblock says:


      That story annoyed me last night as well, like saying ‘ I want a Ferrari, cars are too expensive!’

    303. ahundredthidiot says:

      I say we, ‘the movement’, where it can be bothered, should vote in numbers, to keep Kez in the jungle.
      How good would it be if her success was down to us.
      From potential FM a few years ago (I know, I know) to the jungle show…

      Least we could I say, no hard feelings and all that.

    304. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      David Britannia clock off early did he Rock?

      I suppose you’re at the 77th All Ranks Christmas do this weekend (na doot the days count towards your bounty, the officers serve your meal and the drink is cheap).

      Tell Wee Davey the race hate shit stirring works better on the other side of the border (it’s probably fuc*ed his chances at the New Year promotion board) 😉

    305. Rock says:

      Meg merrilees,

      “However, there is a slight matter of one’s majority at WM??? hmmm

      Rock and hard place ( no reference to ‘Oor Rock’, bit early for him right enough…)

      OH, and what about Gibraltar???”

      Can’t you even ask your “rhetorical” questions without bringing my name into it?

      Meg merrilees (19th May – “Becoming the squirrel”):

      “Excuse me asking – just a bit confused.
      Why is there a separate Scottish Tory Manifesto when we are approaching a WM election?”

      “It’s all rubbish, deliberately meant to mislead.”

      Rock (19th May – “Becoming the squirrel”):

      “Why do you ask when you know the answer?”

      Pretending to be “confused” when you obviously weren’t at all.

      For your information, that is exactly how typical unionists pose “rhetorical” questions.

    306. ronnie anderson says:

      7.26pm It may have escaped your attention but the Rev does’nt write a article every day of the week .

    307. schrodingers cat says:

      rjs canny resist 🙂

      Beautiful Queensferry Bridge of the Silv’ry Forth!
      Alas! I am very sorry to wit
      That ninety tories have taken a fit
      On the last day sin’auld lang sine,
      Which will be remember’d for a very long time.

      ’Twas about seven o’clock at night,
      And BBC Scotchland blew with all its might,
      And the pish came pouring down,
      And the uber yoons seem’d to frown,
      And the Demon of the airwaves seem’d to say-
      “Brillo will blow down the Bridge of Queensferry.”

      When the cars left Edinbourgh
      The passengers’ hearts were light and felt no sorrow,
      But Kay wi’ an E gave a terrific wail,
      Which made oor hearts for to quail,
      And many of the passengers with fear did say-
      “I hope God will send us safe across the Bridge of Queensferry.”

      But when the cars came near to Queensferry,
      BBC did loud and angry bray,
      And shook wi’ anger for the absence of delay
      On the last day sin’ auld lang sine,
      Which will be remember’d for a very long time.

      So the cars sped o’er wi’ a’ their might,
      And the Kingdom o’ Fife hove in sight,
      And the passengers’ hearts felt light,
      Thinking they would enjoy themselves on the weekend,
      With their friends at home they lov’d to send,
      oot fur pint an’ roond the bend.

      So the cars mov’d quickly along the Bridge of Queensferry,
      Until it was about midway,
      Then BBC Scotchland gave the game away,
      There was no delay on the Queensferry!
      Gary Robertson did loudly bray,
      Because ninety Tories had been screechin’ a’ day,
      On the last day sin’ auld lang sine,
      Which will be remember’d for a very long time.

      As soon as the catastrophe came to be known
      The alarm from BBC Scotchland was blown,
      And the cry rang out all o’er the town,
      Good Heavens! the Queensferry Bridge is closed southboun’,
      And a passenger car from Edinbourgh,
      Which fill’d all the peoples hearts with sorrow,
      And made them for to turn pale,
      Because a’ o’ the passengers got hame to tell the tale
      How the disaster happen’d auld lang syne,
      Which will be remember’d for a very long time.

      It must have been an awful sight,
      To witness in the dusky moonlight,
      While BBC Scotchland did laugh, and angry did curse,
      Along the Queensferry Bridge of the Silv’ry Forth,
      Oh! ill-fated Bridge of the Silv’ry Forth,

      I must now conclude my lay
      By telling the world fearlessly without the least dismay,
      That your wind wall protectors would not have given way,
      At least many sensible men do say,
      Had they been supported on each side to the ground,
      At least many sensible men propound,
      For the stronger we our houses do mak’,
      The less chance o’ the SNP has of getting the sack.

    308. Rock says:

      ronnie anderson,

      “7.26pm It may have escaped your attention but the Rev does’nt write a article every day of the week .”

      He usually writes at least 6 articles per week.

      Another apologist for the fake “The National”.

    309. Meg merrilees says:

      Not trying to be a surrogate Nana but here’s a quick roundup of the UK regions tonight according to the BBC website:
      WTO warns the UK that Brexit will be very difficult and costly. Tariffs on agricultural products could be as high as 20-40%, and cars could be 10%.
      Sinn Fein think the DUP is bluffing re their threat to remove support from the Conservatives
      23,000 homes sitting empty in Wales

      and here’s the official BBC report:

      There were no major problems during the morning peak after the Queensferry Crossing has closed to southbound traffic for resurfacing work.

    310. Rock says:

      For the record, the “independence supporting” The National HAS NOT run a McCrone Report article in its 3 years’ existence.

    311. Shinty says:

      re banking – correct me if I’m wrong, but do EU rules not oblige the UK government to protect bank savings up to a certain amount?
      – can’t remember the figure but it’s way more than most will have in their account.

      Also, if I remember correctly it wasn’t retail banking banking
      which caused the crash in the first place.

      Someone with more knowledge will be able to fill in the pieces.

    312. Gary45% says:

      How much interest on your personal saving have you had since the crash, this is what I was referring to, hence everyone has lost.(pay rises etc)
      Meanwhile bankers get richer at our expense. rewriting the rules to suit themselves.

    313. The biggest bill the uk will pay for leaving the eu is the loss of Scotland’s wealth in their coffers for on Indy 2 the yes vote will win by a mile and they know it that’s why they are not printing any of their oppinion polls of late they know all the lies they told the last time will not wash also their broken promises and their insults so they are going into overdrive to try to discredit the SNP they say the first sign of madness is to keep doing the same thing all the time and to expect a different results well boy are they mad in more ways than one

    314. Legerwood says:

      Rock @ 7.46

      In October this year the National ran a series of articles over 6 days on North Sea Oil. The Mcrone report, while not the primary subject, was mentioned and quoted.

    315. Legerwood says:

      Shiny @ 7.52pm

      It was the EU that brought in the scheme in the 1990s

      In UK the limit is £85,000. It was raised in 2017 to take account of the drop in value of the pound post Brexit.

    316. heraldnomore says:

      Oh, so it’s another night of Rock Follies is it. Time to bail out and go and count the penny jar to see how many copies of The National I can spread around tomorrow. Probably with a wee bit tinsel and gift tag – love fae Rock

    317. Lenny Hartley says:

      Blair Patterson, there is a full scale Scottish poll by Survation due out in the next week.

    318. mr thms says:

      Can anyone tell me what the BBC did to celebrate St Andrew’s Day?

    319. K1 says:

      Further proof if any more were needed of the mentality of Britain First, you know that nice little group of nice people who only want to protest on the streets and get caught up in ‘nameless’ other groups racist demos?

      Y’know, the one’s that David Caledonia is defending?

      Here’s Jayda Fransen’s reply to being doorstepped by NYTimes reporter’s today:

      ‘My message to the FAILING@NYtimes – if you EVER send another slimy reporter to my home address after I refused you an interview, I can promise you that those vultures you hire as your reporters will be getting home visits of their own (hashtag)BritainFIrst

      12.05am – 1 Dec 2017’

      What a fucking charmer she is. But hey we aren’t looking in the ‘right’ places for our information about who these people we are. Pffffft!

      And yes I checked her actual twitter feed and the time stamp is different, nonetheless it is a direct tweet from her account. I need to go disinfect my mind now after trolling through the trash that is her timeline.

      Now get tae fuck Caledonia and don’t use our country’s name as your handle, call yourself David BritianFirst, that would be more apt and honest.

    320. Dorothy Devine says:

      Ronnie , they’re FREE – you only have to pay P&P but don’t rush!

    321. Gfaetheblock says:


      So no one lost money, unearned potential income is not lost. Aye, interest rates have been sub 1%, but inflation has been not much higher. Saving rates over inflation and mortgage rates below base were part of the bubble that caused the crash (ref sub prime lending).

      Shinty –

      yep, everyone is covered fro £85k per institution, so if you have more than this you would spread across banks, but also, if you had more than that you would have a range of investments, rather than just cash savings. But yep, basically all cash saving are totally secure and no one loses cash savings, previously or in the future, as this wil be carried froward post Brexit I would expect.

    322. John from Fife says:

      Regarding Banks. Why is the UK government still providing them with Quantitative Easing.

    323. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Some of the bots (male, female, transgender or shapeshifting) posting on here seem to be stuck in an infinite loop.

      Let’s have a wee Google. The National and McCrone…

      Here’s a quote:
      “In 1974, to the chagrin of the Tory Government, the size and Scotland’s likely ownership of that wealth was brought to their attention in the oft quoted McCrone report. Its contents were so explosive, in so far as they flattened out of sight any counter arguments Westminster might make against the economic case for an independent Scotland, that they labelled it top secret for more than 30 years.”

      That’s from,

      “These facts were not made public since the Cabinet ruled that the McCrone Report be kept top secret for 30 years. In 2005 it was once headlined in the Glasgow Herald, but few journalists and broadcasters have discussed it except in occasional SNP publications. Most folk in Britain think it unimportant. Meanwhile, the tax of one penny a barrel for Shetland’s local government has made the general standard of living there not only better than most of Scotland, but better than most of London. “

      That’s from,

      “As Gavin McCrone reported to the UK government any hesitation about Scotland’s ability to go it alone was abolished by Scotland’s oil. And the SNP, having nearly won the Pollok by election, had won Hamilton the following year in 1967 (before Oil) and was taking deep and permanent roots.

      London’s attitude to Scotland changed. From smothering Scots in praise about their abilities and their contribution to the Union the bonanza of Scotland’s oil, as well as underlining Scotland’s viability, provided on the other hand the biggest reason to a less wealthy post-empire UK to fight strongly to hold onto it and hold onto Scotland.( Some of us said so at the time and were wary of the “It’s Scotland’s Oil” campaign which implied oil as the major basis of our case for Independence.) So the McCrone report was hidden. And a campaign (which continues to this day) to persuade the Scots that they were too poor to stand alone was commenced.

      And let me be perfectly plain. I am annoyed but hardly surprised that the London establishment buried the McCrone Report. But that’s politics. I despise however all the hoardes of Scottish Ministers and MPS of all parties (except the SNP) who colluded in that deceit and who betrayed the people they were elected to represent and who still are among us. And here we are in 2017. “

      That’s from,

      So, there you go. The National has never featured The McCrone Report. Methinks that certain bots need to be taken back in house for software upgrading.

    324. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      Fuck England.

    325. Capella says:

      @ Brian Doonthetoon – You are disinfecting the spreading miasm with a good dose of truth. Well said. But I fear the bots are seriously malfunctioning. Too much joy and happiness being generated making them unstable.

    326. K1 says:

      For anyone who missed it, Alex’s 3rd show, Kenny McAskill talks about Lockerbie and Megrahi’s release, also go into a bit of depth about the hypocrisy at play with the British state and Blair and Brown’s involvement with Lybia at that time. Also, has a wee wurd wi Tome Devine. Very good, this is a great platform for Alex to get untold information out there more widely.

    327. K1 says:

      Check this email out from Rev’s timeline, someone has sent him this.

      Looks like DWP don’t want ‘hub of expertise’ in Scotland, set to close down here and move to Newcastle ‘in case of independence’, reckons within ‘2 years’. Redundancies will happen if this is the case.

      As he says, will be interesting to see if there is any veracity in this:

    328. galamcennalath says:

      brewsed says:

      If there is a community without sufficient bandwidth, organise your own broadband.

      Been researching. Yes, a number of communities in Scotland have set up their own broadband, often with roof top aerials linking one property to the next and routing the connection through.

      The more we hear about this Clova situation, the more it sounds like political mischief. I wonder if there was any community discussion at all.

    329. Lenny Hartley says:

      galamcennalath Here on Arran in the more rural parts of the Island they have Arran Broadband
      People speak highly of it, if it was available in my area I would consider it as no need for telephone line and up to 35 Mbps download .

    330. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. Britain First. They would be better selling their racial prejudices to English nationalists, who appear to be more receptive than Scottish nationalists, to that sort of rubbish.

      This briefing provides an overview of attitudes toward immigration in Britain. The discussion focuses on two basic questions: whether or not people favour or oppose immigration to the UK, and how many see it as one of the most important issues facing the country.

      ….Gaps also remain in the evidence base simply at the level of describing as opposed to explaining public attitudes toward migration. As noted above, most of the evidence base comes from questions about ‘immigrants’ or ‘immigration’, terms which are defined vaguely or not at all. So, the evidence base records responses to immigration as each survey respondent understands and envisions it (Blinder 2013).

      While official government statistics on net migration define a long-term international migrant as anyone who comes to the UK to stay for at least one year, it is not clear whether or how the public distinguishes migrants from others such as short-term visitors, naturalised British citizens, ‘second generation migrants’ (children of migrants who themselves are actually native-born British), and ethnic or religious minorities generally. Furthermore, in a media environment that often conflates categories such as refugees, asylum seekers, and migrants (Baker et al. 2008), there is a danger that survey respondents’ expressed opinions are based on an image of immigration that highlights only a subset of the full array of migrants to the UK.

      Also, there is little polling evidence that assesses what information members of the public already possess. A 2009 BSA item found that the typical survey respondent overestimated ‘non-western’ migrants as 25% of the UK population, when the full (western and non-western) foreign-born population is actually only about 11%. But even this basic level of information is rarely assessed in polls. In addition, knowledge of policies and trends is not always widespread.

      The 2013 BSA module asked several factual questions about immigration policies and trends, and found that less than half of respondents were aware of the much-publicised numerical ‘cap’ on skilled non-EU labour migration (45% said it was true that there is a limit on work permits to migrants from outside the EU, and that these permits are reserved for those with qualifications and English language skills). A large majority (84%) also thought that more people applied for asylum in Britain in 2013 than ten years ago, which is not true. On the other hand, 81% answered correctly that migrants from Eastern European countries in the EU may legally come to Britain to work.

      Post-immigration ‘difference’ and integration
      The case of muslims in western europe

      Experiences of Muslims living in Scotland

      2 Chapter 2: Literature review

      Scottish Muslims and Scotland

      2.32 As discussed previously, it has been suggested that important differences exist between the experiences of people from ethnic minority communities in Scotland compared to England. It has been argued by McCrone that there is a powerful and enduring ‘Scottish myth’ which portrays Scotland as a ‘more egalitarian society than England’. This would suggest that experiences of discrimination in Scotland are less likely. However, Hopkins and Smith have argued that the difference between the Scottish and English situation has not been the absence of racism within Scotland compared to England. Rather, they argue there has been a distinctive racialisation of politics in Scotland. Hopkins and Smith suggest there has been a specific preoccupation with the religious divide between Catholic and Protestant Christians in Scotland and that this has led to ” unwarranted complacency among Scottish decision takers” about other forms of racial and religious discrimination (Hopkins and Smith 2008).

      2.33 A further difference noted by some academics is that whilst there is evidence to suggest English nationalism has an impact on whether a person expresses ‘Islamophobic’ attitudes, Scottish nationalism does not appear to (Hussain and Miller 2006). Similarly, Maan argues that the Asian community and ethnic minority communities generally have fared comparatively better in Scotland than in England (Maan 1992).

      As far as I’m concerned, England is struggling to find an identity that isn’t bound up in it’s history of colonial exploitation. Scotland is the same but our experience has also largely been one of the colonised. I mean, imagine not having national autonomy in the 21st century?

    331. Gary45% says:

      GBlock & Shinty.
      So when the interest rates go up and the people are paying more for their mortgage, we will see a rise in interest in savings?
      AYE RIGHT.
      As said before , where were the protesters when the banks shafted us, the suits got away with no public unrest, hence they will do what they like.
      If I am wrong I will be the first to hold my hands up and apologise.
      I just feel we are at the opening credits to the big movie, and the SH*T has yet to hit the fan.

    332. Lenny Hartley says:

      John from Fife, re QE the banks did not get Quantative Easing, it was (it stopped a couple of years ago) where the magic money tree creates money to buy Government Bonds. (Basically nobody else was wanting to buy them due to low interest yield and risk.
      It’s all smoke and mirrors

    333. David Caledonia says:

      Thank you K1,

      Your language is like yourself, vulgar and pointless

    334. David Caledonia says:


      Water off a ducks back, bad language impresses nobody, and people like you don’t impress me, go and annoy someone who gives a damn

    335. cearc says:

      In 2014 I met a person who was intent on voting no because RBS would ‘move to England’ and there would be no bank in the village.

      Nothing would convince him that moving HQ to London did not mean closing it’s entire operation in Scotland. He was adamant and quite heated about it.

      6 mths. after the no vote, guess what closed in the village? Being a kind sort of person (occasionally) I have refrained from mentioning it to him since!

    336. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      David Caledonia = David Britannia

      “GSTQ & Her Fascist Regime” eh Davey Boy?

      You get dicked for being a sh*t troll and have to stag on while the rest of the 77th have their Xmas Booze up this weekend?

    337. ronnie anderson says:

      @ K 1 Big HUGS K bad man no likee thruthee lol.

    338. David Caledonia says:

      Jockanese Wind Talker

      Have you a problem with grammar, cause i cannot understand anything you write here, surely your not completely illiterate

    339. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      All I want for christmas is a nice pair of socks.

    340. crazycat says:

      @ Gary45% at 10.47

      The interest rates on NSandI accounts, including Cash ISAs and Premium Bonds, have just been increased, a little.

      Commercial banks may or may not follow suit.

    341. jfngw says:

      @mr thms

      Yes, the did a Reporting Scotland Special highlighting all the failures and how incapable Scotland is of self government. To prove this point they highlighted how the reserved function of broadband roll out to a hotel in Scotland was the fault of the SNP. Described how the new crossing across the Forth was a total disaster and how no other project in history has had a handover period (if there was they seemed to not know).

      STV celebrated by querying the political affiliations of an independent expert, then did a world tour of Scots celebrating their nationality surrounded by Union flags.

      Meanwhile on the Russian RT channel there was a St. Andrews day Alex Salmond Show, giving a positive spin on Scotland.

    342. David Caledonia says:

      Jockanese wind bag

      Go and troll someone who gives a damn, your plainly and idiot

    343. crazycat says:

      @ David Caledonia

      Have you a problem with grammar, cause i cannot understand anything you write here, surely your not completely illiterate

      A “problem with grammar” appears to have occurred in your own post – Sod’s Law and all that.

      Surely you’re not…

    344. Thepnr says:


      Hahahaha 🙂 David here’s a wee song for you YEW CHOOB.

    345. CameronB Brodie says:

      In light of Brexit, how well would you say UKOK society is integrated, given the constituent nations do not appear to have an equal voice? Does Whitehall really view the Celts as ethic minority, colonial possessions?

      New paradigms iN public policy
      Post-immigration ‘difference’ and integration

      The case of muslims in western europe

      3 identifying and resPonding to ‘difference’

      The need for integration arises when an established society
      is faced with people whom it perceives, and therefore treats, unfavourably by comparison with other members. Typically these outsiders also perceive themselves as ‘different’ though not necessarily in a negative way. This challenge may relate to different areas or sectors of society and policy, such as employment, education and housing. For example, someone is integrated into the labour market when s/he is able to enjoy equality of opportunity in accessing jobs and careers, as well as the education and training necessary to compete for such jobs; and when the labour market is not segmented into different parts with radically different monetary rewards and working
      conditions for those with broadly similar qualifications and

      This is particularly relevant where the segmentation is not, formally or informally, based on the categories of ‘difference’ such as race, ethnicity, religion and so on. What is true of labour markets can be applied more generally. The purpose of integration is equality of opportunity in a society, where membership of any sector of society – employment, education, and so on – is not based on criteria such as race and ethnicity. Integration has a number of components based on opportunities to participate which are context-specific and need to be secured by law and policy initiatives. It also has a subjective and symbolic dimension, which has some context-specific features, but which also has a more general or ‘macro’ character: how a minority is perceived by the rest of the country and how members of a minority perceive their relationship to society as a whole.

      Even if members of ethnic minorities are fully integrated in terms of legal rights, access to employment or education that does not mean they have achieved full social integration. This also requires some degree of subjective identification with the society or country as a whole – what the Commission on Multi-Ethnic Britain called ‘a sense of belonging’ (CMEB 2000: Introduction) – and acceptance from the majority population that the minority persons are full members of society and have the right to feel that they belong….

    346. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      Jesus. Whoever has his hand up ‘David’s’ bum – never go full ret*rd.

    347. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      Oh. My. God.

    348. Thepnr says:

      @David Caledonia

      “Go and troll someone who gives a damn, your plainly and idiot”

      A problem with grammar appears to have occurred in your very next post too – Sod’s Law and all that.

      you’re plainly an idiot

    349. Still Positive says:

      Oh weel I dinnae ken whlit to say, so goodnight all and look forward to Chris Cairns cartoon tomorrow.

    350. cearc says:


      There are already miles a phone cable trailed along the sides of the road in NW. Not armoured though and usually not actually in the ditches (which are reamed most years). Just trailing through bog, over rock, hanging over the cliff edge by the sea etc. The overhead lines were a pain and frequently faulted particularly on one post which was actually in the sea.

      Of course the UKgov could have encouraged BT to improve rural services many years ago by only allowing them to charge for the actual bandwidth received.

      Anyone, anywhere can get a decent connection by satellite. (Even in the Angus glens!)

    351. CameronB Brodie says:

      Reluctant Nationalist
      You don’t appear to be particularly sensitive to issues of difference. We are all the same under the skin, brother, only Scots don’t get to express their political identity in the same way that the English do.

      Get the picture?

    352. Reluctant Nationalist says:


    353. Dr Jim says:

      Some bear the scars of domination physically or mentally under the skin for hundreds of years

      Some rejoice in celebration of the lash that put those scars there

    354. K1 says:

      Ma vulgarity has reach David, as we can see, notice you didn’t admonish yer pal from Britain First on her ‘gangsta’ talk regarding New York Times journalists?

      Ya total prat. Fuck off. 🙂

      (Imagine a guy pulling the ‘bad language’ card whilst simultaneously defending ‘Britain First’ muppets…you cannot make this stuff up)

    355. CameronB Brodie says:

      It’s all boils down to what an individual values most. Conservative value authoritarian social order, protection of tradition and are often hostile to out-groups and minorities. Liberals, less so, though it depends on which end of the liberal rainbow they sit.

      Most of us sit on more than one interwoven-spectrum of some kind. 🙂

    356. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      Your presence here sir, is an egregious affront to are nation, and if I were to be so bold, I would vociferously declare that your a terrist.

    357. Liz g says:

      BDTT @ 9.19 & Ledgerwood @ 8.07
      Thank you very much you two….

      I had posted a few day’s ago that I minded reading about the McCrone report in the National.

      I did frame it with “I read so much I couldn’t be absolutely sure”….. mainly because I didn’t want to get into all the…Prove it Liz & I am not your fucking secretary Crock..
      kind of conversion but also because he seems quite desperate to talk to me,and I am no having that.

      I am so glad you two managed to clear it up definitively.
      And hopefully we never again get the claim that The National won’t mention the McCrone report.
      But as I have said in the past I believe that Craig suffers from Narcissistic Personality Disorder,and (wild claims are a big part of this condition,claims only backed up by the Narcs constant repetition that they are true despite evidence that they are not) therefore it’s no impossible that he will make this claim again.
      So please keep hold of the rebuttal, cause it’s no something we should let stand,and its no Crock we need to convince.
      But it disnay do any harm to bring up the McCrone report correctly in any event!

    358. K1 says:

      I just saw this post from earlier where the prat says ‘HELP ME RHONA’

      David Caledonia says:
      1 December, 2017 at 12:42 pm

      Is there anyway we can block people here, i can’t be annoyed with people calling me scum and a troll, they don’t even know anything about me, all these type of people want to do is abuse people for having an opinion that does not agree with theirs

      Do you seriously think you have some fucking pull on this blog, get tae fuck David, cause I can’t be bothered coming on to the number one political blog in Scotland to see bile and excrement from the likes of you being spluttered all over these pages.

      And I will not stand back and listen to a lying little deluded fucker like yourself taking the moral high ground whilst promoting the agenda of an outfit like Britain First under the guise of some contorted ‘fake news’ that we are all falling for and that you have privileged information that puts into question the veracity of the credentials of the group you are defending?

      You seriously need to take a long hard look at yourself if you believe anything that you have written about this group. You have been told countless times on here that you are in essence spreading lies and contorting the truth regarding who the founders and players are in this group. This is verifiable public knowledge that anyone can find about easily. That you have even hinted never mind openly asserted that this group is not what it itself purports to be is beyond parody.

      Robert Peffers has provided the actual facts of the matter and still you will not acknowledge what he or anyone else has actually stated, instead…my ‘vulgar’ reach made you jump up and pay attention.

      Now, it’s quite simple David, Stu isn’t gonna save your pathetic little neck by banning people who have been on this blog for literally years just cause we disagree ‘vehemently’ in my case, with your whole toxic outlook on this subject. The contradiction of someone being able to state that they support independence for Scotland whilst simultaneously supporting and defending a toxic right wing outfit like Britain First is utterly beyond any reasonable and sane ‘political’ position to hold within those frameworks of reference?

      Scotland’s overarching political outlook is one of inclusivity and multiculturalism, Britain First is the antithesis of this position and they are not lovers of the whole ‘Scottish independence’ movement either. Your position therefore is ‘untenable’ and does not lend itself to easy discourse on a blog such as this. It is not a matter of a difference of opinion on this mater David, it is a matter of completely divergent ethoses (ethe, ethoi), that is not about your opinion or mine, that is about the founding principles upon which we see ourselves in terms of our humanity, cultural and historical outlook et al.

      You have to choose eventually David. You either become a fully fledged human being who sees through hate filled rhetoric and false information or you don’t. What doesn’t happen on here is that you get ‘enabled’ to spout pish unchallenged and you don’t get to treat Stu like he’s your Da while you are out playing wi the other kids, by asking him to step in cause ‘you’ don’t like being challenged. Geddit?

      Grow up or fuck off, your choice.

    359. Liz g says:

      Speed reading to try and catch up… But…
      am I reading this right…..
      Britain First are no actual Nazi’s….They are really only Grammar Nazi’s?
      And protesters of “bad”language?

    360. David Caledonia says:

      No wonder the english say we scots hate them when you read some of the numpties on here, just mentioning a serious subject concerning england and they all break out in boils and start foaming at the mouth
      He mentioned something to do with england, we can’t let that go, lets get together and abuse this english loving, god save the queen kind of person, even though he has lived in scotland all his life, and has never voted for a government that sits in westminster
      Yes folks these are the kind of people that give us lifelong nationalists a bad name, telling someone what and who they are without knowing one little thing about them, i did not comment a lot on wings as i agreed with what most of my fellow nationalists where writing, but for people that are supposedly on the side of independence to abuse a person like me, who has only ever voted SNP, and who will never change his vote is an utter disgrace to our cause and our country, i am sorry i got into a bit of name calling, but that’s what happens when you respond to them, you start to become just like them, and that’s not the person i am or would ever want to be
      So, from know on i will ignore them, i just wish i had a blocking button so that i would never have to read their abuse again, they are very tedious people, most people are kind and considerate and i thank them for that, we don’t have to agree with each other all the time, but we should respect each other, no matter what

    361. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      K1: “REEEEEEEEEE!”

      What was that you were saying about authoritarianism, Cameron? I think your infantile dichotomy just got blasted out the water bruv.

    362. Thepnr says:

      @David Caledonia

      Straightforward question looking for a straightforward answer.

      Do you David respect the right of Muslims to live in Scotland and practise their religion?

    363. TheWasp says:

      How many times? Stop feeding the Trolls please. Thank you.

    364. Petra says:

      I see that we have had the usual anti-Independence supporters on the site tonight (yesterday now).

      Britain First are okay folks, AYE RIGHT – GET LOST, and the ”don’t buy the National’ promoter doesn’t realise that he or she (or it) is actually doing a great job in promoting it. Thanks a million Chucky.

      And by the way check out Matt Qvortrup’s books / opinion. We can get our independence by bi-passing the (corrupt, imo) Electoral Commission, for one. Well worth taking a look at his work.

      Now for one of my favourite songs (again – hope you’re not bored). Keep on, keep on trucking folks because we are getting there. They know it and more than anything we know it.

      Don’t EVER forget our poverty-stricken, downtrodden ancestors who gave their all, to no avail, fighting for Independence. Nor the millions who were ‘cleared’ out of Scotland. More than anything get on board now and put up the most vehement fight of your life for your children and grandchildren … and their grandchildren.

      Enlighten yourselves. Grow a spine and support us FGS.

    365. David Caledonia says:

      I thought wings was different, if the abuse is allowed to continue, people like me will leave, i do not have the time or the inclination to bother with abusive people, its so boring and spoils it for us all
      I use my name of David Caledonia on forums all over the world and i have never had any hostility like i get on here, i don’t need the hassle

    366. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. Conservatives. Remember how the “organic view society” doesn’t cope well with the march-of-time and real-life circumstances? Though it is not a reductionist world view, it does view social inequality as natural and resists change. Hence Conservatives and Pluralists don’t tend to agree.

      GCE Government & Politics (6GP03)
      Paper 3B Introducing Political Ideologies

      No. 4 To what extent do the traditional conservative and the
      New Right views of society differ?

      Indicative content (this is not an exhaustive account of relevant points)

      • Traditional conservatives adopt an organic view of society. This implies that society works like a living thing, an organism, which is sustained by a fragile set of relationships between and amongst its parts. The whole is therefore more than just its individual parts. This implies that the individual cannot be separated from society, but is part of the social groups that nurture him or her, reflecting the dependent and security-seeking tendencies
      within human nature. Organic societies are fashioned ultimately by natural necessity, and therefore cannot be ‘improved’ by reform or revolution. Indeed, reform or revolution is likely to destroy the delicate fabric of society, creating the possibility of radical social breakdown. That is unfortunate, as society is part organic.

      • The liberal New Right, by contrast, adopts an atomistic view of society that is based on the assumption that human beings are self-seeking and largely self-reliant creatures. This view differs substantially from the organicist view, as society consists only of a collection of independent individuals and their families, implying that ‘there is no such thing as society’. Such ‘rugged’ individualism implies that society should afford individuals the greatest possible scope to make their own moral decisions and accept their consequences. This is also why the New Right is so strong in the Mother of Parliments, IMHO.

      •However, the conservative New Right remains essentially faithful to the organic model. Its emphasis on the importance of authority, established values and national identity is based on organic assumptions.

      Conservatism Short Answer Questions

      To what extent do the traditional conservative and the New Right views of society differ?

      Traditional conservatives adopt an organic view of society. This implies that society works like a living thing, an organism, which is sustained by a fragile set of relationships between and amongst its parts. The whole is therefore more than just its individual parts. This implies that the individual cannot be separated from society, but is part of the social groups that nurture him or her, reflecting the dependent and security-seeking tendencies within human nature. Organic societies are fashioned ultimately by natural necessity, and therefore cannot be ‘improved’ by reform or revolution. Indeed, reform or revolution is likely to destroy the delicate fabric of society, creating the possibility of radical social breakdown….

      Theories of Sovereignty


      Sovereignty has affected us a lot its existence is felt everywhere from our government to everyday for example, when we demand some favour from the authorities and the authorities refuse to grant us the same, we protest. The concept of sovereignty has been controversial in academic discourse. Men obey because they agree that it is pleasing to do so. In tyrannical states, men obey through apprehension, while in democratic states the common men obey through blessing. Force is only required for the few who refuse to obey. It is this possession of force to support its commands and to compel obedience that distinguishes the state from all other associations and that makes it sovereign.

      The meaning of sovereignty has undergone change across history. We all know what power is, in a broader sense. Although we see it everywhere in our lives, it is hard to define. While doing social and political theory, we try, however, to make the concepts of Sovereignty more precise and clear. Despite the many meanings of the concept, sovereignty has a core meaning. Concept of understanding Theories of Sovereignty is very much relevant in 21st century. In this article we will discuss about the nature of Sovereignty, understand the meaning as well as new challenges of Sovereignty in the contemporary situation.;PID=2012-3-1-9

    367. CameronB Brodie says:

      Sorry, that was meant to be posted in OT.

    368. CameronB Brodie says:

      Reluctant Nationalist
      “infantile dichotomy”

      What, Critical Theory and Social Science? Do you reckon intolerance of racism is intrinsically authoritarian by nature? WHAT HAVE YOU GOT TO SAY?

    369. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      The irony being, that’s one of your better posts. I didn’t say ‘bollocks’ once.

    370. Swiss Perspective says:

      @David Caledonia.
      I don‘t often post here. In fact, you‘ve probably posted more words on this thread than I ever have on Wings. Part of your problem is an apparent unwillingness to distance yourself from the hate speach of Britain First. And as long as you don‘t, fellow posters here will not make you very welcome. Like any group of people, the Wings Community may be far from perfect, but racism is one thing it certainly does not tolerate. And on that note, the overwhelming majority differentiate between the English state and the English people.

    371. CameronB Brodie says:

      Reluctant Nationalist
      Thank you. I told you I welcome constructive criticism, so please feel free to set out your position.

    372. Liz g says:

      David Caledonia @ 2.19
      Ye do know there’s a “Contact” button at the top of the page?
      If yer no happy that’s what yer supposed to use David!
      It’s in the rules.

      Nobody here can allow or disallow anything.
      Only the Rev gets to decide.

      Go and tell him things have to change or you will leave,if you really feel so strongly about it.
      If he think you and Britain First are being unfairly treated on his blog I’m sure he will let everyone know!

    373. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      “What, Critical Theory and Social Science?”

      No, just your overreaching attempt to simplify something to make it look like you know what you’re talking about.

      “Do you reckon intolerance of racism is intrinsically authoritarian in nature?”

      Probably. The clue is in the word ‘intolerance’. But the manifestation of the punitive desires of the intolerant – or rather the coincidence of a manifestation existing which performs the intolerant’s desire – is the more appropriate phenomenon to examine, though; one should separate the individual’s natural intoleance, from the measures which can punish or oppress intolerance as a real system (state-enforced, legal etc) in order to, I suppose, look at it in finer detail. But you’ve, again, attempted to dazzle and wave the attention away from one particular subject (who most definitely didn’t fit into your theory), and on to a related, but much more complex question.

      Anyway, the fact that it may qualify as authoritarian is not of any great importance, though. Authoritarianism is unavoidable.

      Now, since I know that you’re taking the piss, I shall revert to my Bernard Manning form and away from this earnestness, for I know that I am a fool.

    374. CameronB Brodie says:

      Reluctant Nationalist
      Nice of you to finally show more your true self. I’ve never claimed to ‘know it all’ but I am interested in where you specifically feel my outline is in error.

      I also think intolerance of racism is probably authoritarian in nature, which I also feel is probably unavoidable, so please do not try to specify my motivations or intentions.

    375. K1 says:

      Bernhard Manning? Fuck and I though it wis ‘Some Mother’s do ‘ave ’em’

      Also…you do know the importance of being earnest, don’t you? 😉

    376. CameronB Brodie says:

      If a certain degree of authoritarianism is inevitable/essential, would the purpose of the authoritarianism not be a reasonable measure of it’s moral value?

      Is protecting inequality based on prejudice and tradition the same as protecting individual rights and inclusion?

    377. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      Aye OK Cameron. A sincere apology for that. I can’t do any more serious stuff – look at the time. Alright alright, I’m rifing with pedestrian thoughts here, that’ll blow nobody’s mind…
      Something something it’s not equality if one part of socity recieves special treatment (and those in power know fine well that it breeds contempt, the sadistic bastards)…something … not if the tradition is what the majority have adapted to and are most happy with (also, you know your Machiavelli – he warned that the people do not forget their culture or traditions when a new rule attempts to dilute or destroy it) somint somint one must examine the reality of nations which have seen a radical change in what authoritarianism protects (or, rather, enforces) compared to those which haven’t, and also question the reasons for the change. Why? WHY?
      Something something the ham-fisted state (as long as the right words are used, systemised atrocity ignored, as long as bi-lingual signs on view) eventually brings about a horrific absurdity that CREATES new intolerance for what was previously subsumed into the society. Something something fear, anxiety, the politics of emotion, lack of trust. A commendable idea that is ruined because so many of us don’t trust the state. The age of hypocrisy take 2…nothing as striking as what Zola experienced, but the feeling’s there something something.


      K1: “Some mothers do ‘ave ’em”

      Was there paki jokes in that? All I can remember is he done a woopsie.

    378. Capella says:

      @ CameronB Brodie – one of your quotes says that power is not easy to define. But Pamela Butler, in her excellent “Assertiveness for Women”, defines it as having five qualities.
      1 Power of position – e.g. elected or appointed or inherited status as president, prime/first minister or monarch.
      2 Power of reward – e.g. to give something valuable such as a job, money or land.
      3 Power of punishment – e.g. to deprive others of something such as freedom of movement or speech or action.
      4 Power of expertise – e.g. technical skills which society needs and values.
      5 I forget the fifth one, will have to look it up. Think it might be power of personality e.g. some film or tv stars are very influential. Also Rev Stu!

    379. meg merrilees says:

      David Caledonia @ 2.00am

      You said:

      …most people are kind and considerate and i thank them for that, we don’t have to agree with each other all the time, but we should respect each other, no matter what.

      Does that apply to Muslims?
      Does that apply to people with a different colour of skin from you who have been born in Scotland and don’t vote for the WM government we are forced to endure?
      How do you feel inside when ‘Britain First’ barges into mosques?

      You’re experiencing a little bit of how it feels to be the ‘odd one out’ on this forum and you don’t like it… well think about one thing:

      Actions have consequences

    380. CameronB Brodie says:

      Nothing complex is easy to define. 😉

      Realism, Deconstruction and the Feminist


      ….Stanley and Wise accept that groups who are similarly socially positioned, such as black lesbians, may in some respects see the world in similar ways. This is particularly likely when these groups are actual communities. However, there is no way of judging whether this knowledge is better. To assume that the view of the subjugated is more accurate would oblige us to decide between the views of different subjugated groups according to how oppressed they are.

      Our view is that there are no foundational grounds for judging the a priori superiority of the epistemologies of the oppressed, nor of any one group of the oppressed, in relation to the production of ‘knowledge
      ’…other than by comparing and judging the ontological bases of these epistemologies (1993:228).

      It would be ethically wrong, Stanley and Wise assert, to set up a hierarchy of the oppressed and assume that the heavier the oppression, the better the knowledge it yields. And if we cannot do that, nor can we claim epistemological
      privilege for the feminist standpoint over the standpoints of the oppressor. However, it is acceptable to prefer (on what they call ‘ontological’ grounds) the standpoint that ‘better fits with a proponent’s experience of living, or being or understanding’ (ibid). The feminist standpoint becomes the appropriate point of view for your way of life, and the very possibility of knowledge is thrown out along with the epistemological privilege of the oppressed….

      Critical Realism, Gender and Feminism: Exchanges, Challenges, Synergies

      An increasing number of scholars have become familiar with critical realism, finding it a robust alternative to the poststructuralist perspectives that currently dominate gender studies and feminism. This trend has coincided with an increased interest among feminist theorists in the issues of ontology, materiality and nature, which have always been at the heart of critical realist interventions. However, despite these thematic alignments, and the fact that both critical realism and feminist theory are inherently critical-emancipatory, the critical realist approach continues to occupy a marginal role within both feminist and gender studies debates.

      Concurrently, the field of critical realism has remained decidedly ‘masculine’ in nature, both in the sense that men dominate it, and in terms of the issues with which critical realists have most commonly concerned themselves. Recent critical realist feminist work, the International Association of Critical Realism’s adoption of a proactive policy to enhance the representation of women in its organs and activities, and the growing critical realist preoccupation (particularly in Bhaskar’s philosophy of metaReality) with historically ‘feminine’ topics such as love, mark a potential shift away from these trends….

      The Gender Selectivities of the State
      A Critical Realist Analysis


      This article develops a critical realist, strategic-trlatioal analysis of the gendering of the state. It draws freely on femenist theorists, recent work on masculinity, and some insights from ‘queer theory’.1 Ny aim is to show the contingently necessary nature of the gender biases in the state’s institutional architecture and operation and show how these can be illuminated through a critical realist, strategic-relational perspective. The article has four main parts. These deal with (a) critical realism and the strategic-relational approach (herafter SRA), (b) its implications for analyzing gender selectivities;
      [c] the gender selectivities of advanced capitalist democratic states; and
      (d) some implications for strategic selectivity for feminist action.

    381. geeo says:

      A tale of 2 bridges.

      Contrast the utrer hysteria of a lane closure on the queensferry crossing to this incident darn sarf, which involved a truck hanging from a bridge!!

      “Two lanes were shut while the incident was dealt with, which caused some traffic delays”.

      All you need to know huh ?

    382. Rock says:

      Brian Doonthetoon,

      “So, there you go. The National has never featured The McCrone Report.”

      I repeat what I had posted:

      “For the record, the “independence supporting” The National HAS NOT run a McCrone Report article in its 3 years’ existence.”

      And it remains 100% true.

      Quoting it inside other articles is not the same thing, as you should know.

      Readers of The National have often complained about it here, that is why I know.

      What prevents the likes of you from putting pressure on the “independence supporting” The National to run a front page headline news article headed:


      All 8,000 readers of The National already know about the McCrone Report but the blaring headlines might catch attention of No voting folks picking up The Record or The Herald.

    383. David Caledonia says:



    384. David Caledonia says:

      Liz G

      I am a nationalist, never vote anything else, just want the right to block people i have not interest in debating with, cause they just want to be abusive, its that simple !

    385. David Caledonia says:

      Meg merilees

      I respect youe opinion, but i will not be abusive to you because you have that opinion, its your right, but i am a diehard nationalist allways have been, some people just hate the english, and that’s what’s behind this abuse

    386. David Caledonia says:

      Its a funny thing, i have been a nationalist for well over 40 years, yes i am that old lol
      My family and friends have had a good laugh when i tell them about the abuse i get on here, they know me, the sick abusers don’t
      To reply to them all would take up to much of my time, and dare i say it, my intelligence, but Heyyyyy if they get off on it, then why should i care

    387. CameronB Brodie says:

      David Caledonia
      So do you really support this?

      Britain First: The “most dangerous far-right party”?

    388. geeo says:

      Desperate dave the troll, tagging his drivel on the end of old topics.

      The only “diehard nationalist” you are, is a “British Nationalist”.

      You have never voted SNP nor backed independence in your life.

      You are a zoomer.

    389. K1 says:


      Debate the issues, you don’t even see your own hypocrisy as you ‘attack’ others for challenging your support of Britain First. While you hide behind your faux offence/outrage at some our more adult language, not once have you replied to any of our posts asking the most simplest of questions regarding your ‘support’ of Britain First?

      Not once have you acknowledged the salient points outlining the contradictory stance you have taken in defending a group who are actually the epitome of bile laden racists, with anti muslim rhetoric at the heart of their ethos and are violent to boot, whilst simultaneously claiming to be a Scottish ‘nationalist’, which by definition is a left leaning inclusive polity whose main political party, the SNP, is politically diametrically opposed to Britain First in every meaningful sense?

      All you have done is ‘collect’ what you perceive as ‘insults’, but there was and is a lot more to the comments than those ‘perceived’ insults David. And now you again attempt to take the moral high ground unable it seems to square your own hypocrisy in bemoaning adult language on this forum whilst also supporting violent extreme right wing nut jobs in Britain First?

      Seriously man you are either a very uneducated dude and perhaps are just unable to grasp the salient points and therefore resort to hurtful wee boy posturing over a bunch of sweary words or the use of the word ‘troll’. Or you have another agenda on here with your ‘Britain First’ are not the ‘bad guys’ rhetoric?

      I think it’s fairly understandable when you punt that line that you will not receive succour for those views on the number one Scottish Independence blog in the UK?

      The very fact that you seem unable to even grasp why many of us on here recoil at your position on this matter, because if as you state you are a ‘Scottish nationalist’, ‘we’ on here are’ apparently’ ‘your’ fellow travellers David?

      And yet here you are dumbfounded and ignorantly believing this is some sort of ‘personal’ attack on ‘you’ and creating a whole other narrative about people on this blog ‘hating’ the English as somehow the reason ‘you’ are being challenged on this matter? And that is a very ‘unionist’ narrative your are touting there too David, it is also a complete lie.

      It simply beggars belief that you expect to be taken seriously when your input is so woefully lacking in any nuance or depth of understanding about what this Britain First party is about David.

      Take some responsibility for what ‘you’ brought to this forum David. Stop blaming others for being intolerant of your lies about Britain First, we can all read and research information David, stop pretending they are a poor wee group of souls misunderstood by the rest of us and that you somehow have ‘insight’ or ‘knowledge’ to the contrary about this group.

      (Oh David? I don’t give a toss whether you read this or not. It’s not all about you, any one with an ounce of savvy can see exactly what has taken place in this entire episode with you on this thread)

    390. MikeyW says:

      On one of the Saturday morning shows on Radio 2 I noticed that Sally “Traffic” was directing drivers to the Kincardine Bridge for their southbound journeys!

    391. Capella says:

      @ CameronB Brodie – just returned to this thread so didn’t see your comment above till now. Thx

      I checked the definition of power and the 5th one is called “referent” power. It just means that people we like and respect are more influential.
      I know it is difficult to define something complex. But full marks to Dr Pamela Butler for identifying the elements. Amazingly, her book is still available. You don’t have to be female to read it!

    392. David Caledonia says:

      I have never supported Britain First, if i say something good about china, does that make me a commy…. c’mon get real

    393. David Caledonia says:

      I have a coloured friend, a scouser friend, an Irish friend but i have never met a boy named sue heh heh heh

    394. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      “Britain First Official Policies”

      Not the sort of party to which I would accept an invitation.

    395. K1 says:

      Just a sample of the absolute lies you were punting on here about Britain First. You literally state that they are not a ‘far right’ party. You then make out when many others point out rather straightforwardly that you are mistaken in your assertion. That people the ‘attack’ you on here. Another outright lie. The first commenter said ‘anyone who supports’ BF is scum. Didn’t say you were at all? That is the only occasion where the word ‘scum’ was used in response to your comments.

      But you have repeatedly denigrated every single poster who responded to your crass and lying nonsense by repeatedly insulting them with terms such as ‘stupid’ ‘idiot’ and even ‘troll’?

      You’re a complete hypocrite David and a total liar. You stated you ‘did not’ support them, but you have repeatedly stated also that they are not what we have all been pointedly telling you that they are in fact a far right party?

      It is you who has done all the insulting on the back of most of the posts directed back to you questioning and challenging ‘your’ outlook on this matter? Not once did you have the courtesy or decency to reply in any mature or reasoned manner to any of those posters. But instead cried out for the Rev to rescue you?

      Seriously man. You are the one is uneducated and totally out of order on this thread, If you continue to respond I will continue to ensure the truth of what has taken place here is the last comment about this matter on this thread.



      @ 12.11a.m 30th November 2017

      ‘…the reason they allways say Britain First is a far right group, which is a lie, Britain First is a political group that goes out and does non violent protests to make people aware of the likes of grooming gangs in the uk’

      @3.20p.m. 30th November 2017

      ‘…for anyone here to call me scum and to say that Britain First had anything to do with the murder of anyone just shows the intellect of some people, think for yourself you idiot, seems you still believe in the main stream media, you are the kind of person that needs a good boot up the arse now and again, do not call me scum untill you get yourself educated, you stupid little man…’

      @3.32pm 30th November 2017

      Jockanese Wind Talker,

      ‘Your not able to think for yourself are you, you appear to not be a bit thick, but totally bloody thick
      I have voted SNP all my life, i even have a card to prove it, Britain First is not a right wing group, go and research them if you are able to read that is, do not just come on to a forum and spout your silly ramblings without putting your case foreward, or is that to much effort for you……… have a nice day lol’

      @10.39p.m. 30th November 2017

      ‘…calling Britain First a far right group is so ludicrous and if you cannot think for yourself, at least don’t keep shoving the main stream medias lies down our throats, at least do some research and learn what’s really happening on the streets of the towns and cities in huge parts of Britain’

      @11.48a.m. 1st December 2017

      ‘..If you are of the opinion that the people in charge of the Britain First movement are part of any far right group, then show your proof, because i cannot find anything that points to that,…’

    396. K1 says:


      If I see you on other threads on Wings I will copy and past your comments verbatim regarding your utterly preposterous assertions. For one thing is clear David, if as you are in fact, completely wrong and able to spout such blatant lies about a subject that is easily verifiably debunked, then anything else you have to say on any subject is at the very east ‘not’ reliable and at worst you are in fact a propagandist.

      We have enough of that pish to contend with without having to scroll through your nonsense on here.

    397. David Caledonia says:

      being abused for stating the truth about anything is not what democracy is about, as has often been said, i might not like your opinions but i will stand up for your right to have them
      There are people who just don’t get this democratic principle as i am very well aware of , asking people not to be abusive brings out the usual stuff, its all your own fault, well sorry, having an opinion about something is a democratic right

    398. David Caledonia says:

      I guy who was born in Luton walks through his own town centre every day, and every day he gets threatened and insulted
      He has friends of all different colours, guys he went to school with, very good friends, but because he speaks out about what has happened to his town he is called a racist, but the funny thing is the people he exposes are not a race, and he has made it very clear about the minority of people he is talking about not the majority of decent citizens who just go about their normal family lives, i have family in Luton, i know the town very well, been going there since the early 60s, and i can tell anyone, its not the same town of 50 years ago, i never go near the place now , to much hatred towards good people, who’s only fault is to be born in that town, and lived in it while it changed to a hatred filled cesspit

    399. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      I repeat,

      “Britain First Official Policies”

      Not the sort of party to which I would accept an invitation.

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