Wings Over Scotland

“Thankfully, with one exception, indy sites have also now pretty much stopped openly attacking each other…” So which is the odd one out?

Spot on analysis and reasoning Stu. Have to say, if you don’t mind the plug, more people should read Robin Mcalpines blog as it’s very well written and incisive about the mechanics of politics.

“In cold hard practical terms, readers, would you genuinely want the UK government to turn round tomorrow and say “Okay, you can have an indyref in spring 2025”? With the hapless numpties currently running the SNP in charge of making our case?
Assuming that you’re sane and your answer is ‘No’…, “

Actually, folk on here have consistently said ‘Yes’ to that. They’d declare independence tomorrow without recognising the view of the 52% (regarding them as not Scottish enough) and they argue that with independence they’d be able to get better politicians, though where those knights in shining armour are now remains a mystery. Presumably they’d come from the ranks of the Wings BTL, Lord help us. In truth the SNP would be awarded greater powers as a reward for incompetence, corruption and deviancy.

“One of the worst medical mistreatment scandals in human history”

WPATH FILES – Trans Medical Scandal Exposed

Is this worth talking about?

I watched this:

link to youtube.com

What amazes me is that doctors went along with this.

Surely they must have thought castrating a young boy can’t be right equally cutting the breast off a young woman

I did watch the interview but I didn’t change me opinion.

I have recently learned about ‘castration fetish’. I found that very disturbing and wondered if boys/men are being castrated to satisfy some sickos very weird fetish.

I went to the Robin MacAlpine blog saw an article about diet. I screamed/swore and left immediately.

I’ve been on a diet all my life up until now. I’ve read everything there is to read about diet & nutrition. I’ve given up now and I just eat what I fancy. Miraculously what I fancy seems to be pretty close to what would currently be described as a healthy diet.

Rev. Stuart Campbell
Ignored says:
10 March, 2024 at 10:36 am
“more people should read Robin Mcalpines blog as it’s very well written and incisive about the mechanics of politics”

Couldn’t agree more, but the silly big twat limits his reach massively by refusing to be on social media, even just with an account that tweets new articles and nothing else.

I think Robin’s other issue is that there is no facility to comment or discuss on his articles.

Your 5th para from the end: “Funnily enough, a lot of the Unionists we’ve found common cause with on things like gender also have at least a grudging respect for Alex Salmond.” That’s certainly the case with me and other Conservative Unionists I know. Indeed I’m actually here because of the brilliant work you do on the gender etc issue. As for what you say on independence, well, it’s exactly what I say about the independence of the United Kingdom.

A timely and “on-point” contribution Stu. I’d like to think more people will take the central message on board, but ah hae ma doots, as a number of contributions BTL here already demonstrate.

With respect to this in particular:

I have bad news: we are. And there is no way out of that that isn’t founded on SOME sort of clear democratic mandate of over 50% of the vote. We could declare it until we were blue in the face, but the rest of the world won’t take a blind bit of notice until we’re demonstrably speaking for a majority of the people.

The extra parliamentary “cunning plans” for indy brigade are simply not open to reason. they are utterly convinced that magical thinking about the Claim of Right, the Treaties of Union, Salvo, Liberation Scotland and compulsory Irn Bru in schools (OK, I may have made 1 of those up…) will waft us to the sunny uplands more quickly and more easily than just persuading 50% + 1 of Scottish voters to grow a pair.

BTL comments in here are infested with these hard of thinking chumps. granted they are in no way representative of mainstream thought in the movement, or indeed of rational thought or research in to what might actually work in general.

It has to be wondered however what their dominance in this place, given its centrality in the pro-independence new media, looks to undecided or wavering voters who look in to test the waters?

It doesn’t amtter how many times you or anyone else ask them to “show us the money” and produce some (any?) evidence of significant academic, political or electoral support for their woo-woo views. Answer comes there nane, and that won’t change because they have nothing substantial to offer, as Roddy Hughes masterful fisking of Sara Salyers not that long ago showed: I doubt it took him more than an afternoon to hole what passed for her case below the waterline.

Sadly a small section of the population will always opt for the easy but wrong answer. Until that changes, the movement is going nowhere fast.

That Wings is pro-indy is a given! Another given is that in some regions of the movement people are also investigating alternative approaches to securing independence, wherein the idea of another referendum is an unwinnable and time-wasting distraction, particularly so under the rubric of a local-authority franchise.

That Iain Lawson’s Yours for Scotland, which discusses many other issues apart from flat-out independence, is ahead of older, more established blogs in terms of readership, whilst remaining avowedly anti-colonialist can, at least, tell us one thing: framing Scotland’s position as being that of a colony of England, with the quality of research and evidence now available to that effect, has a potentially much wider audience; for few Scots would ever knowingly wish to remain as a colonised people under the authority of a foreign oppressor with no more right to govern Scotland than any other sovereign nation. It is the Scottish people who are sovereign, despite three-hundred-years of lies to the contrary.

Livonian thinks Scotland is anti EU/EFTA and centre right, stupid cant. ‘Tory scum out’? Great slogan, that.

James Jones @10:32

Presumably the only reason we’d want a referendum in Spring 2025 is because we’d buggered the defacto one in 2024 in a not dissimilar way to the no if buts one in 2023 – or even the potential Brexit one at any time between, say, the significant material change and first hint of insanity* in response to seasonal flu 2020.

* Admittedly the loss of bottle since then (eg for the no if buts) is entirely excusable since, over and above any issues over the franchise and the projecton of fear for leaving so much as the house (let alone the UK), the social media narrative control arising has been off the charts (even POTUS was barred at one point) thus adding to the surprising reversal of (its) formerly positive influence (as touched upon in the interview, :))

“For as long as but a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be subjected to the lordship of the English.”

Not again!
Please, someone, tell me I’m wrong: I’ve always hated that quote because my reading of it is that they, the ‘one hundred of us’, is a reference to the controlling elite of the day, nobles and clergy. Nothing to do with ‘us’ working classes.

Back in the day, 13th/14th century, the ‘us’ (People of Scotland) – serfs/vassals – were looked upon by the ruling class as little more than slaves, useful but disposable, and (pre) cannon fodder.

The celebrated document from which the above passage comes contains signatories such as Ingram de Umfraville, John de Menteith, and others of similar ilk, who couldn’t give a shit about Scotland and were no different to todays political ‘class’ – Yousaf, Sturgeon, Swinney, Robertson and other odious specimens.

Ruby @11.33 “What are your views & those of other Conservative Unionists on the gender issue?” I think that might go too far O/T given that the Rev is posting about the way forward for the Independence movement. Broadly I was confirming his comment in that paragraph, that this Conservative Unionist has found common cause with Wings on this issue. As for the views of other Conservative Unionists the ones I know agree too but I might remark that there are many who are unfortunately also captured by woke and are no better than Labour on the subject. (As an aside I am not one of those Unionists who only has a “grudging” respect for Alex Salmond. There is nothing grudging about mine. The man deserves full respect and it’s possible to give that and disagree).

Ruby @11.33 Apols if this is double post but I got “504 Error message on first attempt. “What are your views & those of other Conservative Unionists on the gender issue?” I think that might go too far O/T given that the Rev is posting about the way forward for the Independence movement. Broadly I was confirming his comment in that paragraph, that this Conservative Unionist has found common cause with Wings on this issue. As for the views of other Conservative Unionists the ones I know agree too but I might remark that there are many who are unfortunately also captured by woke and are no better than Labour on the subject. (As an aside I am not one of those Unionists who only has a “grudging” respect for Alex Salmond. There is nothing grudging about mine. The man deserves full respect and it’s possible to give that and disagree).

So glad the wee ginger stroke survivor (gimme a hoose)! has nose dived! Horrible misogynist.

Ian @ 12:13 pm

“the reason for wanting independence”

…has always been the same – liberation from oppression, hence decolonization.

The most pampered native groups/bourgeoisie are usually the last to figure this out, because they are ‘part of the racket’, which also explains the lack of urgency by elites including the national party:

link to salvo-cor.s3.eu-west-1.amazonaws.com

Good article and one I agree with in principle. One area where the SNP (deliberately?) missed a trick was to ignore the fact around 40% of their voters backed Leave in 2016, despite a huge push from Sturgeon and Murrell for the party faithful to get behind Remain. Two of their former Depute Leaders (Jim’s Fairlie and Sillars) also backed Leave, as did high-profile YES campaigners like Commie Sheridan, people on both the left and the right, most motivated by a preference for EFTA/EEA over EU, rather than being bampots like Farage, Gove and Johnson.

With the above in mind, it was always going to be a poor strategic move by the SNP, to tie independence directly to EU membership, but it’s a perfect example of how they have narrowed the broad church over the last decade. When broken down to its most fundamental argument, independence is not about what policies Scotland would take, rather about who decides those policies. Do we stick with a broken Westminster system of a two-party FPTP circus, with less difference between the big two than most people would like – and where the Tories are in power around 70% of the time, against our express wishes since the late 1950’s – or take the leap to deciding our own affairs? On that ground alone, our case is strong.

I agree Stu.
Keep laying down the facts and keep it interesting.

A proper foundation for the next campaign, which maybe closer than we think.

Politics, economics and science have lost all credibility and a paradigm shift must be due.

If I had the wings of a sparrow and I had the arse of a crow. I’d fly over Holyrood tomorrow and shite on the bastards below.

Not again!
Please, someone, tell me I’m wrong: I’ve always hated that quote because my reading of it is that they, the ‘one hundred of us’, is a reference to the controlling elite of the day, nobles and clergy. Nothing to do with ‘us’ working classes.

Ok then, if you’re right and clever, be good enough to clarify who ” … and the other barons and freeholders and the whole community of the realm of Scotland send all manner of filial reverence, with devout kisses of his blessed feet…” might be referring to.

Not the barons and freeholders, but the other bit, that awkward little reference to whole community of the realm bit. Who exactly are those folks making up the community in the realm of Scotland?

And while you’ve got your thinking cap on, let’s assume you’re content to agree the Monarch of Scotland ISN’T sovereign, perhaps you’ll be able to clarify who is.

Rev: yes, I can see where you are coming from, and I agree, broadly. However, I also agree with Breeks that in dependence cannot be lost sight of and we all have to keep it in our minds at all times, even when we are engrossed in other topics. We really so need to be ready to go when the opportunity arises so that will take, at the very least, a constitutional convention where all kinds of ideas can be played off each other.

Personally, I think that the biggest threat to independence is not Westminster but the ‘trans’ issue. It overarches every policy, every law, every institution, every aspect of government of this country of ours – and even the UK – and it has to be stopped because it is a massive threat to women and children, but also to our ‘democracy, such as it is. It is yet another hard left, misogynistic movement that is trying to divide us in its complete insanity. Why is the hard left so insane always? Why does it play into the hands of the right every time? Its stupidity is beyond human comprehension.

Ruby: you are quite right – it is, as is the rest of the ‘trans’ movement, a fetishists’ and paraphiliacs’ paradise. We are living in an age of sadism, narcissism and psychopathy. These things are indicative of a breakdown in civic/economic/political society. By the way, it is not a crime to state that biology is real, and, if they bring in the aggravated part of a ‘hate crime’, they will have to prove the crime part of it. Telling a man he’s a man is not a crime – yet, anyway. Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull’s Party of Women is off the ground. People can join and can stand as Councillors and/or MPs and MSPs/Independents (in full time). The main aim is repeal of the GRA 2004.

It’s natural that Wings has the overwhelming lion’s share of the audience – you have Hamish the overwhelming lion.

When independence isn’t a meaningfully live political issue – which it currently isn’t, with no referendum or plebiscitary election on the horizon, however much WE might wish otherwise – banging on about it simply irritates the general public, who have other priorities and just think you’re a fundamentalist obsessive, like a Jehovah’s Witness who knocks their door every week and never takes the hint.

People have other priorities right now like eating, heating their homes, paying rent/mortgage and generally just surviving. The Scottish Government have mainly given up trying to mitigate seemingly endless Tory cruelty in order to pander to the SNP’s core base. Frankly, right now, independence feels like a middle class luxury policy, especially now the SNP have no interest in any other demographic.

It still hurts that Sturgeon had the best chance we’re likely to have for a second referendum possibly in many people’s lifetimes with Brexit and utterly squandered chance after chance to boost her party, her mates and of course, herself. I think now independence is dead for a generation at least. It may still simmer in the background but until people’s standard of living improves they’re not going to be willing to dive into something that will hurt for a period of time. Then again, I assume at some point we’ll get competent politicians governing but there’s no sign of that at a UK or Scottish level.

And the sole upside of being in the UK over that period – the fact that the Tories are broadly sane on the gender issue and, to put it baldly, saved Scotland from the SNP – will dissolve the moment Labour take power later this year.

The Tories need to go. They’ve caused so much damage in the last 14 years that I can’t see us recovering from it in decades. Austerity has been a terrifyingly bad policy made worse by Brexit which has returned the UK into the broken country it was before it joined Europe politically.

But, and this is a massive but, their policies on gender and Queer Theory have generally been very good. Of course there’s exceptions within the Tory ranks who have been pushing Queer Theory quite strongly. If Penny Mordaunt had become PM things would be very, very different right now and I’m not sure the victories we’ve had in restoring some sanity in the last few years would have happened. The Tories also brought in equal marriage when Labour were doing everything they could to avoid it, though LGB people’s two or three years of people treated as normal, equal human beings were wrecked in 2016.

I now approach a general election wanting the Tories gone and destroyed but also fearing what Labour will bring with their soft neoliberalism and pandering to gender which will give us Trans MPs who won’t do anything but push the gender issue. I fear people are so wanting the Tories to go that they’re prepared to see what happens or, as I think is the case, most people are still unaware of what the facts are.

Then you’ve got the SNP who gave up on independence for a form of corrupt, incompetent governing that’s seeing the poor and working class suffer. People are starving but there’s always money for gender ideology. The feelings and desires of pornsick, mentally ill men and a few women, not to mention children who’ve been groomed by adults, comes before feeding kids.

Your weans might be starving but here’s some puberty blockers for them.

The joyful innocence and camaraderie of the 2011-14 campaign isn’t coming back. Those days, to coin a phrase, are past now, and in the past they must remain. To be prepared for what may come in the future you need to have the broadest possible view of the terrain, and the best way to do that is to have Wings.

The Indyref campaign isn’t ever going to be replicated. The political engagement that happened a decade ago is over. There’s no referendum going to happen in a generation at least & many of us will be dead by the time that happens, if it ever does.

There are sadly, bigger fights to be had. The fight for a better standard of living for everyone struggling right now and of course, the gender debate, not to mention the ‘Queering’ of everything from politics to art and beyond is a threat to democracy and reality itself. There’s glimmers of hope. The referendum result in Ireland yesterday should send a serious warning to politicians that once people are fully informed of what Queering means, and how that affects women, children and the disabled then it’ll be firmly rejected. There’s also people trying their best from all political points of view, and of course, there’s increasing numbers of ordinary people becoming tired of being poor, while at the same time fighting against what all of this is doing to them, their peers and the most vulnerable.

But I also think we’re on a verge of a collapse like no other in living memory, so I agree. We’ve got to break out of echo chambers, avoid falling into conspiracy theory and try to prepare ourselves for what is going to be a hard fight on a number of fronts over the coming years.

@ Rev Stuart Campbell … I respectfully ask you to consider – where we differ. It is not in any way in the substance, but in the order in which events take place.

Quotes from the clip … “We declare independence … AND THEN you seek the recognition of the international community”.

The Declaration of a Sovereign Scot initiative deliberately set out just short of 3 years ago to reverse that order of events.

The importance of obtaining the recognition of the international community, for me, is the starting point not a follow-on/end point, particularly, as the evidence of the past 10 years proves, we have to endlessly wait on political parties. The Declaration initiative is non-party political, it seeks its mandate from the people of Scotland. Some background:

The Declaration of a Sovereign Scot initiative is an initiative to regain the independence of Scotland, through the democratic consent of its people who choose to exercise their right to self-determination. Over those 3 years, Scots from all over Scotland have signed their inividual Declaration. As recently as the last two weeks, at Holyrood, and in Glasgow more ACTS of self-determination were established as Sovereign Scots signed their personal Declaration. Each will be scanned and copied before the originals are sent to the United Nations in New York for safe-keeping. They will also form part of further contact with 18 UN Member States as this initiative develops further.

During the UK Supreme Court hearing this was evidence, and is recorded on behalf of the UK by the UK Advocate General: ‘The Advocate General does NOT dispute that the United Kingdom recognises and respects the right of sef-determination in intrnational law.’

Very recently, ‘The European Left, a transnational party that brings together more than 40 progressive organisations across Europe, unanimously backed a resolution recognising that “Scotland has the right to self-determination”.

In reference to the contact now established with the 18 UN Members, each of whom share the key characteristic in that they each gained their independence from the UK, they have now been asked as part of this initiative – ‘Do you have any reasons which you believe deny that right of self-determination to the people of Scotland?’

Order, order!

If, and I stress only if, you wish more, please use this link:

https://ww .facebook.com/profile.php?id=100070340354557 …. (Insert the missing ‘w’)

As a philosopher once said “If we could see politics what would it look like? a cube but with all it’s corners on the inside.”

“The idea that “the people of Scotland” might rise up, either by popular vote or by attempting to reconvene the Convention, is the stuff of fantasy.”

The real stuff of fantasy is the illusion that we are in a fair and just union with England when that couldn’t be further from the truth.

Such as the stealing of our assets the denying Scots the democratic right to choose when to vote on to leave this union or not (NI can vote every seven years) the lies and deceit from Westminster, the installing of their place men and women in our politics, the interfering of the English security services in our politics (Mi5 created a fake Salvo homepage to con folk into signing up on it), the moving of marine borders to steal Scottish assets. The gradual erasing of our languages and culture, the placing of nuclear weapons on our soil.

There are far too many discrepancies to list in here of abuse of trust from Westminster against Scotland that isn’t fantasy

The fantasy is that the union is beneficial to Scotland IT ISN’T the union is holding us back.

When its shown that Westminster HAS broken the rules of the Treaty of Union and it has on many occasions, I’d imagine if enough folk are informed of this, that dissolving the treaty will be easier to achieve.

My,My Stu you have certainly stirred the pot with this post and your comments, IMO your response to Breeks correct me if I am wrong was not adversarial or calling out his beliefs as blood and soil, nativist , moonhowling, xenophobic , misogynist,fantasist or sectarian, my interpretation of your comment is that irrespective of whichever belief is held on the SOVEREIGNTY of Scots and independence, inevitably it will have to suffer the inclusion of politicians at some stage

It then appears that your number 1 arselicker Andy Pandy the font of all knowledge who had his own blog but gied it up because he’s a boring arsewipe and nae body visted it
has taken great delight in using your comment to mean that you agree with his interpretation of the SOVEREIGNTY issue but you refrain from calling your readers moonhowlers,nativists,blood and soil,xenophobic

And then we have Hatuey who thinks anyone relating to independence from the past is a revisionist and independence should be all about the FUTURE, BUT Hatuey is insistent that reparations should be given to ALL the countries that have suffered the abuse and denigration from the empire in the PAST, I think Hatuey should decide whether he’s past it or future proof

And then we have John C who likes to call anyone who has an opposite opinion from him regarding homosexuality or lesbianism homophobic or xenophobic and now the ever present RACIST, John C is outraged that there may be such a thing as a TRANS MP but if anyone were to point out the glaring over representation of LGB mp’s and msp’s in parliament he feels it his duty to call them his favourite epithets

I enjoyed the video but can’t help wondering what the two people in the top tier of the library were looking at.

Hmm, “Ever get the feeling you’ve being cheated…”

link to youtube.com

Aye, lets jist forget about returning Scotland to self-governance and stick in this great Union. I mean it’s totes braw continuing to endure unwanted governments that we didn’t elect foisting evermore policies we don’t want onto us that are the cause of this hellhole of crap we’re enduring.
About 70 years having the wrong folk in control of oor destiny is jist grand…
FFS, if folk don’t have the ability or motivation to articulate the reasons why we are where we are and that being in a radically bad and worsen situation will require an equally radical shift to get out of the mire then we may as well give up eh.
Best tae take wer foot aff the gas and jist let us, and oor land & seas be exploited even more, and have what remains of oor spirit crushed, oor businesses & industries trashed, and oor assets and resources pillaged.
Maybe tak tae drink or drugs tae ease yer struggles until our comfortably off “brightest and best leaders” tell us otherwise…
Ach, I’m sure some folk will be VERY happy with us taking that stance and they will be happy to take a break from securing Scotland ever tighter in the Union…

link to bills.parliament.uk

Rev, alleluia to your interview. On this 4th week of Lent. Hope you have still given up on the sweeties. A refreshing Saturday morning magazine broadcast ‘afore the fitba’ by Alex Salmond and Taz. An article that might have been missed by some readers is in the Sunday Times. (I only have a paper copy). The input of professionals to the party machinery or the professionalisation of Alba. I hope that includes input of career professionals on policy. New members, new approach and a credible sensible policy base.

Just read about Royal Mail hiking the cost of stamps yet again.
I recall the Rev having a post on Labour scaremonger Brian Wilson saying that if Scotland became independent the costs of stamps would go through the roof like it has in the independent, free Republic of Ireland.
The idiot himself and the Unionist press didn’t trouble themselves to check valuable propaganda pieces like this but as shown here it was absolute nonsense as the Postal Service in Ireland was cheaper and more efficient.
So be careful Scotland if you don’t want thing like that happening to you.

In 2010 when the Tories where put in power against Scotland will the cost of a First Class Stamp was 41p.
As of 2nd April the cost increases by 8% to £1.35.
That’s around a 330% increase for a lesser delivery and pick up time as well as a loss of thousands of fair paid steady jobs that made money for the treasury.

It’s losing money and it’s heading for bankruptcy so next we will only have private sector options that will cost the earth where workers will be on minimum wages or zero hours contracts.

Dan @ 6.40

Bullseye !

Restless horses . all in a row . all tethered-up . nowhere to go

@Hatuey 7:42pm
I attended a meeting on reparations out of subject interest. The UN call was nearly twice of the net wealth of the UK at 11 Trillion pounds (2021 figures). Reparations as an argument does not stand up to close scrutiny. How about reparations for the Vikings. Rape. pillage and murder. Many place names are still Viking in origin in Scotland or the Romans and let’s not talk about the Colonisation argument. The first duty of a State is to protect it’s citizens. Doubling reparations equating to the entire wealth of a Nation is nonsense. We would be enslaved.

It is not that I have lost faith in Scottish Independence, I have lost faith in Western Independence.

By Independence I mean the idea that we as the population of anywhere in the West will be allowed a true and fair government to represent ‘us’ and what ‘we’ actually want in the land we originate from.

There is no country in the West that is currently independent by that definition.

Biden is not America.
Trudeau is not Canada
Sunak is not the UK
Yousless is not Scotland.
repeat for every western country…

A cascade of cunts, swindled into position by enormous amounts of money. The donor class. All actually trying to ‘finish us off’ like they tried to do Russia (circa 1990). History does not repeat… but it rhymes.

But without a ‘spark’ nothing will happen. The SNP simply cannot be bothered. The only way independence will become a live issue is if we make it one. Is that not the point??

It is easy to say it isn’t happening anytime soon…but far harder to be the spark that makes it happen.

Mibbes forget about the SNP being sh*te, and just start talking about independence once again.

The £85K porn film explores “Dyke Sexuality.”

This country is corrupt to the core. Let’s hope Humza is in his last week.

Alister Jack must release the FOI about the Salmond case. Or will the First Minister of Gaza survive diverting money to Hamas?

There’s no hope in Scotland if he does!

George Ferguson: “The UN call was nearly twice of the net wealth of the UK at 11 Trillion pounds (2021 figures). Reparations as an argument does not stand up to close scrutiny. ”

Are you saying it’s a non-issue because you think the UK can’t afford it? Or are you saying it’s a non-issue because… well, because you said so?

I can assure you that court cases involving historical liabilities take place every day all over the world. If compensation for crimes and errors of the past is a non-issue, someone might have told the lawyers who make a fortune out of such cases.

Now you seem to be saying that there are limits as to how far back you can go in such cases. If that is true, I am not aware of it. The limits that exist seem to depend on lawyers being able to make a plausible legal argument, presumably with evidence, etc.

The authorities or courts can put a time bar in place, as I understand it, but usually that would be negotiated with concerned parties. No such time bar is in place now with regards to reparations for colonialism. Indeed, as I said on a previous thread, Italy has recently agreed to pay Libya reparations for its invasion of 1911 (5 billion Euros).

The British Empire didn’t substantially unravel until the post-1945 era. That isn’t so long ago that it couldn’t be argued (if Libyans and Italians can do it, I am sure others could).

Anyway, I have never argued for reparations. All I have said is that it isn’t up to people like you (a beneficiary of the crime) to decide if they have a case or not; it is up to the victims and victim countries.

George Ferguson @ 8:33 pm

“The first duty of a State is to protect it’s citizens. We would be enslaved.”

Scots were sold by State elites over three hundred years ago and been enslaved ever since. And the cost of this? Well, the loss of 3-4 million people for a start, plus resources and social and economic under-development ever since.

Perhaps we should consider also the opportunity cost of 300+ years of colonial under-development? By all accounts our population today should be similar to that of Sweden and our economy stronger than Norway. Instead, today at best we are on a par with weaker eastern European states.

That gap between developed and underdeveloped state is the cost of colonialism, which in GDP terms will be in the region of £200+bn per annum today.

@Hatuey 10:03pm
Please don’t attribute to me words I didn’t say. Or second guess my motivations. Which Hatuey I am dealing with? I have pointed out that before. If you can’t see that reparations twice the amount of the UK National wealth is grotesque then there is no hope and I doubt you are an Independence supporter. A true Independence supporter will first and foremost give fealty to the citizens of the indigenous population including nu Scots that pay taxes here.Your reparations arguments are from the demented left.The same left that destroys the decency of social boundaries and will ultimately be defeated again!

“Assuming that you’re sane and your answer is “No”, then clearly the Yes movement needs to spend some time getting itself shipshape, and unity of purpose isn’t actually a useful way to achieve that.”

Strongly disagree, Stu. For what it’s worth.

Scotland should be an independent nation. The rest comes later.

Even if we had the most perfect government in office there is absolutely no guarantee they’d remain there after a YES vote.

If we’re waiting on everything being absolutely perfect first – it will never happen.

In the event of a YES vote the parliament would change immediately as parties realigned & jostled for position. The SNP would be nowhere near the negotiating table.

2014 was so successful, imo, because it wasn’t about party. It was a single question.

You seem to be making the mistake of assuming the SNP would be in charge of the YES movement – something Sturgeon was fond of doing too.

JMO

Muscleguy @ 8.47pm

I hear you loud and clear.

George Ferguson @ 10:39 pm

“Trillions not billions”

You are right, England’s colonialism which is now costing Scotland over £200 billion+ every year means Scotland is certainly owed £trillions over the past 300+ years. Few if any other peoples have been colonised for longer than the Scots.

I’m sick and tired of hearing things
From uptight, short-sighted, narrow-minded hypocritics
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth
Ive had enough of reading things
By neurotic, psychotic, pig-headed politicians
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth

Breeks:

“I agree 100% the SNP has betrayed us, whether hapless, corrupt, or infiltrated from the beginning, it makes no difference at the end of the day. The net result is the same.”

The inside story of the betrayal by the SNP and who were responsible, as with the inside story of the betrayal of Alex Salmond and who were responsible will hopefully be bestsellers in Scotland in the very near future.

A chunk of stale cheese exclaimed: “I want reparations from Norway double their current Sovereign wealth.”

And I have said nothing to discourage you from hiring a lawyer and making the case.

The same aforementioned cheese: “Hatuey used to be a thoughtful centre right commentator. Now he is a demented left winger devoid of rationale debate…”

I have never regarded myself as any of those things and actually consider such classifications as childish and stupid, entirely at odds with the freedom bestowed upon me as an existentialist (I’m not bound by anybody’s definition or expectation of anything, including my own). You should try being rational and free, starting with freedom from yourself.

Johnlm: “Seems that we compensated the slave owners”

Lol. They kinda keep that part quiet, don’t they…

As far as compensation and reparations go, I think there are some obvious examples where certain countries should cough up, the US for Vietnam and Cambodia, Britain for Kenya and Diego Garcia, several countries for the destruction of Iraq and Libya… I’m sure Republic of Scotland could add a few more, it’s his area of expertise.

I don’t think Scotland’s case for reparations would be as straightforward.

Anything that happened after 1945 should in theory be a no-brainer, though, from a legal standpoint. The reason it won’t happen, the reason justice and human rights are disregarded in the world today, is down to the veto power that members of the Security Council wield (in the hands of the biggest criminals as far as acts of aggression and violations go).

Every single person that reads this knows the score, understands, and probably agrees — basically, anyone that is intelligent enough to type their name should agree. It’s not exactly complicated.

Not to add fuel to any fire, but there is another matter to consider.

If, supposing, the SNP emerges from this past decade disgraced, shamed and discredited, with it’s senior echelons facing jail time and civil actions, and the whole of Scotland’s political landscape tainted by crank and oppressive legislation which may take decades to purge, then you have to ask yourself one question.

What has the Independence Movement actually done to divorce the disingenuous SNP from the rightful cause of Scottish Independence? Where is the dissent? Where is the rebellion?

No matter what the outrage, the flagrant dishonesty, the squandering of mandate after mandate, the hijacking of the Independence cause to further Transgender destabilisation of society; bar a few grumbles along the way the Independence Movement might have talked the talk, but on the whole, have acted with supine complicity. (Rare exceptions duly noted, and saluted).

It churns my stomach to think of the damage these twisted bastards have done to Scotland’s cause, and our Nation’s sense of self interest. They have suffocated Scotland, and not a single one of them has faced as much as deselection for their outright t(reachery).

Worse than that, even what passes itself as opposition to the SNP is still waiting for leadership and initiative to come from the corrupt and dysfunctional SNP, presumably once it finds the time in between wrecking Scotland’s societal infrastructure.

Hope you’re proud of yourself Scotland. Maybe we should invite our Scottish diaspora home to vote for us the way we get foreigners to play our sports for us. Maybe we might “win” then.

Craig Murray should be on the list but I understand it would be impossible to separate out his Scottish politics content versus everything else he writes about.

Stuart Campbell and Craig Murray are the only two Scottish bloggers I read. I will read Robin McAlpine if people post links on here but I am not seeking him out.

I also like Gordon Dangerfield but he writes fairly infrequently.

It all seems (outside of Wings and CM) just incredibly ineffectual. Lots of empty rhetoric. WGD is by far the worst. I was really glad when his gaggle of supporters stopped posting comments on here…

This site and CM) breaks real news. I also know that if they state a fact I can pretty much rely it is true (no one is infallible but they are close).

The reporting around the Salmond stitch-up was vitally important and continues to be so. Both of you deserve medals for that alone (amongst a few others).

George Galloway is also the same. You may not agree with his views but he does not lie. Pretty meticulous in his fact checking as well. I guess with all these guys and gals (who talk about things the MSM want to hide) you have to be like that or you won’t survive.

Or you can sell your soul for thirty pieces of silver, dress up like a ponce, scrounge a house, and produce arse gravy for the National.

It was interesting but I would have preferred to see that interview the other way around with SC interviewing Alex Salmond about the future of the Independence movement and why it is (seemingly) that ALBA is not capitalizing on the growing unpopularity of the SNP.

If there is any money left in the polling pot it would be interesting to explore this question next time.

I also would not have described SC as bitter. I watched the 2019 interview and this one and I see no difference. He strikes me as a very calm, logical person who does not speak or write out of emotion.

Speaking of empty rhetoric though, I see Tommy Sheridan was on after Wings…

Ahh!! I see I missed the point of the article… after the interview there is quite a bit of bumpf but then AS starts talking about Wings again at the 31.45 mark.

Ok so watched it now…

Hmmmm again funny choice of language from AS this time ‘screeds’…

Sadly AS seems to be asleep at the wheel over all this woke stuff and what is really going on.

Lastly Stu’s line about still worshipping the same deity he has always worshipped piqued my curiosity… what deity is that?

So let’s have a chat about Alex’s closing comments.

Mac says

Hmmmm again funny choice of language from AS this time ‘screeds’…

Sadly AS seems to be asleep at the wheel over all this woke stuff and what is really going on.

What Alex Salmond said in his closing comments was

he(Stuart) bewilders people because he often goes off on tangents. People have looked to the site to have analysis of Scottish independence suddenly find the are reading endless screeds about self-identification incredibly well written, incredibly powerfully written never the less not what they expected

I was reluctant to mention that because I feel I’m always posting ‘endless screeds about self-identification’ when posters here aren’t interested.

It seems a lot of people are asleep at the wheel over woke stuff but that’s their choice.

Colonisation is not past history for Scotland, in fact it is ever present and up to date situation and the world is witnessing it,

When a Countries peoples have tried through the normal political channels, by referendums, and Court cases, and on each occasion the Colonial master keeps telling them ” now is not the time” .

Not as long as the Colonial Country over Scotland has Control of the politics, the defence systems, the purse string Status, holds the overriding supreme court system for judgement and justice over Scotland, and decides how your Country will be managed by a secondary governing devolved body put in place over your Country full of their employed civil servants,

Not when Scotland voting system is fixed at FPTP and also a owned by private Franchise, that is capable.
The SNP was established over 70 years ago as a political protest to give Scotland a voice following the legal dictates required by the Colonial governing body.
This has been infiltrated and altered beyond recognition in last 10 years to a drivelling rainbow game chasing party that actual stymies Scotlands voice whilst introducing a variety of restrictions on free Speech, impaling almost every voiced subject in Scotland as a hate crime,

The fear that our true representation and our very voices are coming under threat of being incarerated.
Is Colonialism.

When freedom to choose your own future for your people and Country and all avenues to follow and have the right to self-determination is in the hands and laws of a Colonial arbiter saying No to that freedom.
Scotland is a Colonised Country in the present day modern times , and has been for over three hundred years,

When a treaty of union in-of – itself has been Colonised and turned into a chain and collar from England’s Westminster parliament around the neck of Scotlands the people, , by stating that Scotland has no free will or “Right-to- Self-Dertermination” until England says so.

This is now over 300 years of Scotlands enslavement , and regardless of Nation or Colour of a nation,
Every Country that has ever been Colonised and sold by the empire and enslaved must understand
The present circumstances of Scotland in relation to the said parliament of Westminsters Colonising position in England over Scotland.

The Scots protested loud and were out on the streets against the treaty of union and were beaten back by the invading forces of military might of a larger domineering Country right on its borders.

It was never a voluntary treaty of union between Scotland and England,
And Englands parliament of Westminster to this day boasts that “THEY” did not give the Scots a vote to join the treaty, because the Scots would have in all probably have voted No.

Scots was captured, Colonised and enslaved. There Countries resources stolen, and their land and sea traded to the highest bidders by the colonising Country.

Hatuey,

Scotlands case for reparations and redress, compensation would indeed be different,
As Scotland is at present still Colonised.
And still being refused the Right to self- determination under its own laws and voting systems.

It still has to use the Colonisers system and the Colonisers media,

Both of which stymie free will, free choice and restrict the right to self determination.
Thats how Colonisation works.

As long as Westminster parliament refuse Scotland the right to Self- Determination and the free will and mastery of their own voting system,
The parliament in England is loudly advertising its own Colonial stance over Scotland.

I think Mr McAlpine is often an interesting read. I don’t think he’s interested in off-the-cuff discussion. I think he likes to offer opinions for people to ponder. He also invites people to write in with ideas and would publish those he thought worthwhile.
I suspect he doesn’t have the patience or intuitive understanding displayed by Wings over many, many years BUT he does have some interesting ideas. He explains what he’s about and how he wishes people to contribute to his work very clearly. Its a semi-intellectual site. I suspect some may view it as a dryasdust writing but it’s not always the case:-)

I was reading article 11 of the union with Scotland act,

It is interesting to note that Queen Anne was not Queen of all of Britain until the treaty of union was ratified,
And up until that point was Queen of England France and Ireland,

Question,

What authority did Queen Anne of England, France and Ireland have to appropriate Commissioners to Scotland to negotiate the treaty of union,
She was crowned in Westminster Abbey as the monarch of England, France and Ireland, without taken the “Scottish coronation oath” during those proceedings.

And without being Coronated in Scotland,

If she only became Queen of GB after the treaty of union……..WTF,

Some unionists will say this old guff does not matter any more.

Except that in Scotland the crown prosecutions relating to Scotland, the old Scottish legal requirement to have a fair trial with a jury, that is mentioned when claiming injustices against king James,
The system, the Court System under the Crown, and the crown justice system in Scotland and even the royal assents are all related to wether the monarchy has authority over Scotlands legal system.

However if the monarch and crown of England held no legal hereditary position in Scotland prior to the treaty of union, to give the Scottish Commissioners valid authority in making the terms to the treaty of union on Scotland behalf, due to Queen Anne not being authenticated as Queen of Scots,
It throws a entirely different slant on the originating creation of the treaty of union,

And wether Charles is a hereditary king of England, but not Scotland,
Wether the Sovereignty sitting in Westminster parliament derives only from the English parliament Acts “of Settlement” to inherit on the throne of England.
And the English parliament Act, The Bill of Rights, setting the Sovereignty of the Crown of England within Westminster parliament,

This matters in the present day when you consider the “Alex Salmond case” and the “Craig Murray Case” due to the crown position in and over the devolved government in Scotland,

Jury-less closed trials are not part of Scots Law,

Supposing the Crown of England never had Crown Courts in Scotland, due to Queen Anne not officially in any capacity being queen of Scots or Scotland.

The Crown of England, France and Ireland gains access to the (Crown) “courts of Scotland” only via the back door through the devolved government royal assent under the The Crown sitting in Westminster parliament.

Whereas in Scotland the Monarch is not Sovereign, the people are,
The Scots Law states that trials must be a trial by Jury.

I am surprised that Alex Salmond and Craig Murray did not insist on Scots law. Of a open Trial by a
Public Jury,
This would have prevented the secretacy of the Alphabet women slapped on by the judge, in both cases.

Perhaps some clever lawyer in Scotland could explain the difference between Scots Law of a trial by Jury compared to English law, of Jury-less trials.

Breastplate.

Those awkward negotiations surely become easier if started from a point of view that Scotland is a Colony of a Westminster parliament in England refusing Scotland the Right to self Determination since the first military forces of England in the 1700s were sent to Scotland to squash the Scottish rebellion to the Treaty of Union,
And Westminster parliament has enforced that position of Colonisation over Scotland further over many hundreds of years to this present day by refusing Scots in Scotland the right to Self determination under their own terms,

75/80% of Scots have no real interest in politics. This percentage is increasing by the day.

You can understand why when you read the repetitive drivel that 0.1% of the electorate post on here, irrespective of the subject matter in any article. Anyone with even a mild interest will be put off by the constant stream of dross as posters pursue their pet projects.

I exclude Stu from the above.

You’re right Chas. I’ll make this my last post on the site. I’m a kind, caring and compassionate person outside of my darkest thoughts on Wings.

We should be talking about Scotland as an Independent country. But the years have made me bitter. Small hits of dopamine in order to destroy the SNP are definitely not it. It doesn’t make me happy. It’s an addiction.

I’ll keep funding Wings Over Scotland, and hoping for the truth around the Salmond conspiracy to come about. And Sturgeon the Judas to be arrested and a real Independence campaign to commence again.

God would hate this part of me. And there’s definitely more positive ways I can spent my time than growing increasingly bitter.

I hope Scotland wakes up. Goodbye and goodluck!

Listen to Lloyd Quinan on Through A Scottish Prism: A Scottish Dawn: approx 25.30 mins in. He’s explaining about how Steve Chisholm, new ALBA member is linked to Cromarty Green Freeport; how Kate Forbes negotiated them with Michael Gove; and the wider implications of Green Freeports for both Scotland and the UK right’s globalist ambitions.

Hatuey.

In case you have not noticed it is not a one man band situation, you are talking thousands of Scots and more,

MaryB @12.50pm.

Professor Alf Baird exposes freeports for what they really are.

link to yoursforscotlandcom.wordpress.com

Kate Forbes is not to be trusted on independence no matter what she says to the contrary.

Same school tattle tail whinging complainer, please sir, Sir , can I complain that historical records are not important in Scottish history
As it is to the history of England, same old drivel.

And yet no one is more tuned in to repeating old history mantra more than Westminster parliament itself stating it is one of the oldest parliaments in the world. Every day, Tut tut.
And repeats the treaty of union gospel every day on its parliament site. Tut tut.

Scotland should not have its history records background repeated to its people is that what your saying

Very Cromwellian, lets take all Scotlands related historical records and leave it with blank canvas.

Did you know that when England was a Commonwealth and republic,
It did not include Scotland?
as Scotland crowned king Charles as monarch of Scotland long before England.decide to return the Stuarts to the throne down south,

A bit of missing history in Scotland for Scots.
Scotland was not part of England republic or Commonwealth.
Someone forgot to tell Queen Liz,

They also forgot to tell her she was not queen Elizabeth 11 of Scotland, as Scotland never had a queen Elizabeth 1.

That was England.

James Che @ 12:53pm,

I’m sorry, I fail to see any merit in thinking negotiations between the rUK and Scotland would be made easier by bringing accusations of past colonial behaviour to the fore.

I do see bad faith and disingenuous argument being involved leading to the necessity of international arbitration.

I would imagine a messy divorce is on the cards, parasitic passengers love a free ride and won’t take kindly to extrusion.

I believe you are quite correct when it relates to king Charles 111 coronation in England and his lack of Coronation with regards Scotland recently,

And having watched the televised Coronation of him in the kingdom of England, You are Correct, during the complete ceremony he did not include the Scottish Oath.

In the kingdom of Scotland the ceremoney did not witness his Coronation, nor the Coronation Oath during that Ceremony, nor him wearing the coronation Crown of Scotland on his head,

To touch the Scottish regalia cushion is not a classed as a Coronation in Scotland,
But then neither did queen Elizabeth 11 of England, likewise her father before her,

It was media hype and properganda that disguised untruths,

One of the missing comments by the media, was,
if Great- Britain is under ONE United kingdom,
Why the need to have two separate ceremony days/ dates for one monarch.
Opps.

James Che, I’m sure the broad appeal of the proposal will make the challenges easier… a problem shared, etc.

Alf, I’ve never had an issue with the claim that Scotland’s relationship with England is essentially colonial, although I would say neo-colonial is a more fitting term.

I think there are degrees of colonialism though, and not all colonies or neo-colonies are managed along the same harsh lines. I am sure we can all agree, for example, that Scotland is not managed along the same lines as the Belgian Congo.

Quite a lot follows from that simple and obvious discernment.

Memmi, for his part, was describing the sort of brutal colonial condition of places like the Congo, and that took him to extremes so that he even justified terrorism against civilians, from what I can gather.

In the context of Scotland today, those extremes are completely inappropriate, as is much of what Memmi and others say about colonialism when applied to our predicament.

Breeks
Community of the realm of Scotland; CORRECT!

All countries back then had limited suffrage but the Scots had better than most, ie England, with a parliament based on the 3 Estates, not unlike the French model.
Nobility, Clergy, Burghs.

Whatever hoops the likes of Umfraville and Menteith went through, they still came out on the right side eventually securing Scotlands usurped independence, rights laws and liberties the hard way, something the likes of Sturgeon, Yousaf et al are in no way fit to be even compared with.

As for those despising *For as long as but a hundred of us* ie the declaration of Arbroath; pathetic malcontent whingers!
It was far ahead of anything seen by then (Magna Carta included) and was an inspiration behind the even more famous later *we the people*.

Another step closer to an authoritarian society in Scotland, free speech is increasingly under pressure from all quarters.

“The Scottish Government’s new controversial hate crime law will finally come into force next month.

The Hate Crime and Public Order (Scotland) Act was passed by MSPs in March 2021 but it has been one of the most controversial pieces of legislation debated by MSPs in the last few years”

So why do we need the HCB when hate crime is on the wane, its all about shutting up dissenters by making dissent a hate crime.

“Figures released by the Crown Office and Procurator Fiscal Service (COPFS) last year showed a two per cent drop in hate crimes in Scotland in 2022-23.”

Breastplate,

Colonialism as related to the past for Scotland it is alive and well presently still active, when one side of the treaty of the union itself has been Colonised,

For the parliament of UK is telling Scotland it has no right to self determination.

Scotland has never been in a treaty of union with the UK parliament.
Scotland has never been in a treaty of union with the Great- Britain parliament either.
The parliament of Scotland 1707 and the parliament of England 1706 held and agreed upon the political parliamentary union, namely the treaty of union.

However the Scottish side of their parliament came under Dissolution by proclamation of Queen Anne and separated from the parliamentary treaty of union within less than a year in 1707.

Thus leaving the Upper house of lords from the old English parliament as sole members of the new Great- Britain parliament.

This is recorded history of events that directly relate to the political parliamentary union.

Why would you promote yourself to Scotlands independence future troubled and difficult negotiations if you offer to go into political battle without ammunition.
Your already a dead soldier holding a white flag of surrender.

Mac @ 9.34 am

“Ahh!! I see I missed the point of the article… after the interview there is quite a bit of bumpf but then AS starts talking about Wings again at the 31.45 mark.”

————————————-

Thanks for highlighting that – I’d missed that bit at the end of the show. And very much agree with your next post at 10.01 am.

Is this perhaps AS’s response to what happened last week with Eva Comrie and Yvonne Ridley? If so, I’d agree that AS “seems to be asleep at the wheel over all this woke stuff and what is really going on”.

As are others (apparently), including for example Craig Murray and Robin McAlpine. It seems like they don’t want to engage with the issue in any real way, or address the wider effect it’s having (ie beyond the damage to women’s rights and child safeguarding). I don’t understand their thinking on this at all, but maybe that’s because they’re not really thinking about it.

I’m now even more worried about AS and Alba’s position on this issue. It may have seemed that having a (slightly vague) policy and then to largely ignore the issue and try to play things down would be enough, but already that hasn’t worked and they’ve lost good people over it (although I’m still not quite sure exactly what happened there, and have been left with more questions than answers). Not sure what to make of it all really.

Alf: “You ignore the fact that colonialism is ‘a disease of the mind’ “

I didn’t ignore it any more than I ignored 12 thousand other related factors. You perhaps expect too much of me.

The problem with diseases of the mind is that people don’t know they have them; it’s a bit like colour-blindness. Maybe we could develop a test for the Scottish Cultural Cringe.

Outside of the near totalitarian control of the MSM in Scotland on the issue of Independence, we have enough freedom to put up a fight in the information war. I believe demographics and technological trends are in our favour there too, so that we should be able to cure the diseased minds you refer to more easily in future.

Wings has probably done more than any other outlet when it comes to curing diseased minds. Maybe we should be calling Stu Doctor instead of Reverend. His powers in that regard can be expected to increase as time passes, along with those of others in the field, and that bodes well for us.

link to archive.is

I don’t remember the full details of Craig Murray’s criticism of ‘gender critical women and why he was asked not to speak at a AUOB march.

It might have been something to do with the above.

So she gathered the sisterhood, fed them posh pasta and fizz, then posed in their drunken embrace. Not as JK but Jo. The photos went viral and so inevitably did criticism: that the butch lesbians looked manly; that they were dining “in chic spaces quaffing expensive wines”, as ex-ambassador Craig Murray complained; that their bodies were old.

I didn’t know he said the above but he certainly made himself unpopular among women voters back then.

I had my say about Craig Murray BTL here on Wings back then.

I’ve forgiven but I haven’t forgotten.

I wouldn’t have mentioned it again but ‘moixx’ brought him up.

Ruby, like you I have been concerned and outraged in equal measure at the deliberate ignoring of many posters here and elsewhere on what is a despicable threatening abusive policy proposed not only by the Scum Nonce Party but the WHOLE of the rancid reviled clowns that INFEST the laughingly titled Scottish parliament
Every party including the tories have embraced this open deviance and perversion and every one of them are GUILTY of conspiring to render our children to the mercy of deviants, perverts and paedophiles, there is NOT one PARTY or POLITICIAN fit to vote for apart from the ISP and unfortunately they do not have the widespread recognition to EXPOSE the sexual depravity being FORCED on our children
I have commented here and elsewhere that I felt ALBA’S stance on the GRA and self identification was lukewarm and wishy washy, their was NO open bold statement that ALBA was VEHEMENTLY OPPOSED to the GRA and real women and girls would be supported UNCONDITIONALLY and TOTALLY with their safe spaces being protected without question
IF you are a formative member of any political party and are involved in the formation of policies and proposals and the decision of what those policies will be, why would you accept a policy that you were vehemently opposed to or has someone rewritten the original policy or watered it down to accommodate possible votes and membership
If the policy has been amended subsequently which necessitated resignations from Eva Comrie and Denise, who was responsible for the change of policy and why was it changed,were the 2 named ladies unwilling to give up their beliefs, honesty or integrity by capitulation,surely the membership have a right to know why their brightest and best officials have felt the need to resign
ALBA turning into snp2

It’s competition time again.

9 posts from Che this afternoon. Which one do you rate as being the most pish?

One condition-You are not allowed to select all of them.

I suspect that as very few will be read, the longest one will be the favourite.

Ruby @ 4.49

Robin McAlpine had this article on his site last year:

link to robinmcalpine.org

which I had read hoping for some good ideas, but it all sounded a bit like Alba’s ‘Citizens’ Assembly’, which is basically trying to ignore the issue, with the idea that a ‘compromise’ could be reached at some future point (no idea what that might look like, and he didn’t give any suggestions either).

I assume Craig Murray’s comments were on Twitter, and although I used to look at it (when you still could without having an account) I missed those ones so I wasn’t sure just how strongly he supported self-id.

I did see a comment a while ago from him in which (from memory) I think he said his feeling about juryless trials was probably the way women feel about self-id (or words to that effect) which I had hoped might help him see the gender stuff in a different light. Perhaps not, but I don’t understand why he wouldn’t at least consider it, and that’s part of the problem.

I’ve seen some good posts on Wings btl from (I assume) men as well as women – people who see how lots of the very concerning things we’re hearing about are all interlinked, and that it’s not just about women’s rights. But it still seems to be the case that many people, including possibly the likes of Craig Murray and Robin McAlpine, don’t want to acknowledge that, or just don’t believe that it’s true. But then, some people still think the SNP are the best route to independence, so clearly it can take years for things to become clear.

James Che said;

“Question,

What authority did Queen Anne of England, France and Ireland have to appropriate Commissioners to Scotland to negotiate the treaty of union,
She was crowned in Westminster Abbey as the monarch of England, France and Ireland, without taken the “Scottish coronation oath” during those proceedings.”

James, we’ve already done this to death! Once again, and for the last time;

It is documented in the Records of the Parliaments of Scotland website that she did indeed take the Scottish coronation oath; it was administered to her in London by her Privy Council, which attested, that is made a formal legal declaration, that this had happened in conformance with Scots law and with Scotland’s 1689 Claim of Right. This attestation was formally accepted by Scotland’s parliament on 12th June 1702, when it passed an ‘Act Recognising Her Majesty’s Royal Authority’.

“And without being Coronated Crowned in Scotland”

Of no consequence, James, a coronation has no constitutional or legal significance; it is the formal taking of the relevant Oath that actually matters, and not where and when it took place.

“If she only became Queen of GB after the treaty of union……..WTF”

Well, she could hardly become Queen of the Kingdom of Great Britain before it even existed. It was the Union that brought that kingdom into formal existence. And anyway, the ‘Kingdom of Great Britain’ was and still is only a name of convenience, because the two prior kingdoms didn’t merge to any significant extent anyway, because there were just too many irreconcilable differences between them.

Even now, after 316 years, those differences still exist and are still problematic; that England’s establishment has done its level best to bludgeon those differences away and pretend they don’t exist is just typical English establishment perfidy.

“However if the monarch and crown of England held no legal hereditary position in Scotland prior to the treaty of union, to give the Scottish Commissioners valid authority in making the terms to the treaty of union on Scotland behalf, due to Queen Anne not being authenticated as Queen of Scots, it throws a entirely different slant on the originating creation of the treaty of union”

It would if it was true that Queen Anne was not authenticated as Queen of Scots, but it isn’t, so it doesn’t.

As for the rest of your comment, both Salmond and Craig Murray were tried in Scotland under Scots law; Salmond with a jury present because of the seriousness of his alleged crimes, Murray’s case getting a summary judgement because it was of lesser seriousness. Summary cases do not have juries. There is a proper legal term for that difference, but I’m afraid I can’t recall it.

Within the past fortnight, Hats has called for chunks of Scotland to be gifted to Muslim immigrants for them to create their own new countries, and for Indy to be put on hold whilst Scots all adopt the cause of a free Palestine.

Now he’s calling for the descendants of those Scots who may have been alive at the time of the slave trade, to gift everything they have to people who may be the descendants of the slaves.

All these ideas do indeed have a single common feature to them – nobody rational would ever have proposed them for serious consideration.

Meantime, in the real world, Portugal becomes the latest EU country to be on the cusp of putting into power a political party that did not exist 5 years ago. That party has political aims that hardly anybody would vote for 5 years ago, but now they are becoming mainstream.

That’s not an endorsement of Hats lunacy BTW – what’s happening in Portugal and elsewhere across the EU is at least rooted in sanity.

It does show that voters can be persuaded out of their comfort zones though, and I’m confident it could even happen here in Scotland.

moixx
Ignored
says:
11 March, 2024 at 6:45 pm

I assume Craig Murray’s comments were on Twitter, and although I used to look at it (when you still could without having an account) I missed those ones so I wasn’t sure just how strongly he supported self-id

I think they were but they were also in the MSM. There was a bit of a stooshie at the time. I was ragin’ and ranting about it here BTL on Wings.

link to archive.is
JK Rowling and the lunch of secrets

Then the boys joined in. Craig Murray, who describes himself as a historian and human rights activist, seemed to think that our event was disrespectful to a man accused of the rape and sexual assault of two women. “While [Suzanne] Moore was knocking back expensive wine in a shit venue with fellow “victim” J. K. Rowling, Assange was entering his fourth year locked in a tiny cell amongst convicted terrorists.” One wonders whether it is only feminists who should refrain from eating until Assange is free?

I don’t think men fully understand how angry women are about this issue. I can understand that men do a lot of things I don’t understand and I’m just talking about the normal ones not the ones who climb up the toilet wall to see women peeing.

I’m letting them off I just wont be voting for their political parties.

Sometimes it’s quite hard to get through to men.

Xaracen
7:39pm.
It is a interesting conundrum.
That they said it is all correct, and above board,

Are you stating her “privy Council of the parliament of England” in London was the people which attested that it be made a formal legal declaration,

As it would have been extremely difficult for her to have had a “privy Council of Scotland” prior to her taken the that Scottish Oath, that the privy Council in London attested to.

So are you suggesting that it was the privy Council of Westminster parliament in England that attested and swore blind that she had taken the Scottish Oath, was now Queen Anne of England & Scotland, confirmed by the privy Counil of England. to make her Queen of Scotland,

So Scotland has to believe faithfully that the privy Council of the parliament of England had made a new Queen over Scotland,

Details do matter Scotland, that is a great leap of naive faith.

I have found no related articles to confirm that the queen of England, France and Ireland took the Scottish Coronation Oath except for what you suggest, that the privy Council of “England” within Westminster parliament of England swore and attested that their queen of England they had made into the queen of Scots, by England.

And then sent aa letter to Scotland and the Scottish parliament, saying the privy Council in Westminster had created the Queen of Scots for them,
And to a Scottish parliament that had sold Scotland for Ermine and gold, under deceit.documented it as true, they didn’t have a vested interest to tell a lie then?

Whom do you believe, seeing as Queen Anne of England France and Ireland did not have a Scottish privy Council prior to supposedly taken the Scottish Oath,
Maybe this has not been done to death,
To many if and buts and maybe’s.

Which one came first, the Scottish privy Council of Queen Anne or Queen Annes privy Council of England, making her Queen of Scotland, to obtain a Scottish privy Council,
it is a conundrum.

Xaracen,
7:39pm.
It is a interesting conundrum.
That they said it is all correct, and above board,

Are you stating her “privy Council of the parliament of England” in London was the people which attested that it be made a formal legal declaration,

As it would have been extremely difficult for her to have had a “privy Council of Scotland” prior to her taken the that Scottish Oath, that the privy Council in London attested to.

So are you suggesting that it was the privy Council of Westminster parliament in England that attested and swore blind that she had taken the Scottish Oath, was now Queen Anne of England & Scotland, confirmed by the privy Counil of England. to make her Queen of Scotland,

So Scotland has to believe faithfully that the privy Council of the parliament of England had made a new Queen over Scotland,

Details do matter Scotland, that is a great leap of naive faith.

I have found no related articles to confirm that the queen of England, France and Ireland took the Scottish Coronation Oath except for what you suggest, that the privy Council of “England” within Westminster parliament of England swore and attested that their queen of England they had made into the queen of Scots, by England.

And then sent aa letter to Scotland and the Scottish parliament, saying the privy Council in Westminster had created the Queen of Scots for them,
And to a Scottish parliament that had sold Scotland for Ermine and gold, under deceit.documented it as true, they didn’t have a vested interest to tell a lie then?

Whom do you believe, seeing as Queen Anne of England France and Ireland did not have a Scottish privy Council prior to supposedly taken the Scottish Oath,
Maybe this has not been done to death,
To many if and buts and maybe’s.

Which one came first, the Scottish privy Council of Queen Anne or Queen Annes privy Council of England, making her Queen of Scotland, to obtain a Scottish privy Council,
it is a conundrum.

Sturgeon – who is the MSP for Glasgow Southside – urged anyone with information about the incident to come forward.

what a pity she didn’t urge anyone with information about the money do the same.