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Wings Over Scotland

Song for the Scottish Conservatives

Posted on May 04, 2017 by

On the occasion of the local elections.

Vote ’til you boak, readers. Seriously.

Because if the voting doesn’t make you sick, this will:


Davidson refuses to comment on abortion fears over ‘rape clause’ 

Tory MPs face being prosecuted for electoral fraud while they are fighting the upcoming general election campaign

Imminent tax and benefit cuts set to hit families hard and benefit the richest

Food bank use across UK at record high, reveals report

Laggan’s Zielsdorf family to be deported next month

Almost 600 Suicides Could Be Related To DWP Work Assessments

50,000 disabled people ‘have adapted vehicles removed’

In-work poverty hits record high as the housing crisis fuels insecurity

Grieving mum found hanged near Bedroom Tax eviction letter

UK public sector net debt hits highest on record at £1.65tn

The rogue bank, the failing company and the Tory Party donations

Government welfare cuts to drive another one million children into poverty

Landlord Tory MP says law requiring homes be fit for human habitation is an unnecessary burden

19 million Brits are on the edge of poverty even though nearly everyone has a job – and it’s going to get worse

Benefits Sanctions Cost More Than They Save, Damning Report Finds

UN: ‘Grave’ disability rights violations under UK reforms

The DWP is forcing a rape victim to pay the Bedroom Tax on her police-installed panic room

Britain just got perhaps the most intrusive spying powers ever seen

Malnutrition causing thousands of hospital admissions

Wealth of people in their 30s has ‘halved in a decade’

Woman deported from UK despite being married to Briton for 27 years

Today’s housing crisis means strangers are now sleeping two to a bed

Disabled people hit by housing crisis are told: ‘Your life is too expensive’

UK joins Greece at bottom of wage growth league

Lower benefit caps ‘will exclude poor families from large parts of England’

More than a million people in UK living in destitution, study shows

The government has announced the outlawing of intellectual opposition

Government To Deport Frail, 92-Year-Old Woman Next Week

Heart attack victim has benefits axed for missing Jobcentre appointment

Government planning to repeal animal welfare codes

Turn benefits into repayable loan, says Tory group

Grieving families to be £12,000 worse off under new bereavement benefits

Women are using newspapers because they cannot afford tampons, says Salvation Army food bank

Hate crime surges to record levels after Brexit vote

UK faces return to inequality of Thatcher years, says report



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  1. 04 05 17 12:56

    Song for the Scottish Conservatives | speymouth

389 to “Song for the Scottish Conservatives”

  1. Proud Cybernat says:

    You’ll be fine after one of these…

  2. AAD says:

    Greetings from sunny Glasgow.

    Standing outside the Polling Place there have been more takers for SNP than for Labour, the only other party rep here. Conservative candidate (as yet unseen by anybody in the area) comes from North Berwick. It’s a long way to travel to council meetings.

  3. Richard Duncan says:

    Thats me done till after work time .

    Both sons and their wives plus 2 friends who did not plan to bother voting but have now.

    I cant do much and struggle to walk very far but will crawl if i have to, to get folk out voting ….. it’s working .

    Now if every one can do similar then we can have the councils we want and throw a huge ” feck off ” to the yoons .

    Knackered now going for a rest .

    Good luck everyone .


  4. Bill Hume says:

    Eh…does a ‘dry boak’ count?

  5. mr thms says:

    It takes a little time to work out the order of preference for all 10 candidates and to number them. I got there in the end. I ranked the only Tory candidate last. If you make a mistake just ask for another ballot paper..

  6. bobajock says:

    Explaining vote/boak in office. STV – so many dont understand.

    Have the political classes pulled the wool for so long???

    Honestly Rev, it bears thinking about!

  7. Helena Brown says:

    Voted, 1-8,sour faced old Tories before us. Vote until you boak people.

  8. Dr Jim says:

    I really dislike Unionists particularly the, no, all of them

    Is dislike too strong a word, I don’t want to sound divisive

    In case Mrs May is offended by me and declares war on thinks as an act of (tractor) to r precious Union

  9. Thepnr says:

    Just reading the headlines of those Tory policy decisions and their effects on society does make me boak.

    I’ve puked up the Tory at the bottom of my ballot paper, I never voted for him I voted AGAINST him and let him know he’s last in my eyes because of all the shit they do.

  10. Macart says:

    Bet your arse that’s how I’m voting. 🙂

    Every box used and perference made.

  11. DerekM says:

    lol i reckon the majority of the indy vote knows what to do even if we sometimes try to confuse ourselves with electoral systems debates.

    Though to not have the debate would be the wrong thing to do since once we get indy we will have to decide a new structure for all our elections and at least we have had a chance to see plenty of different election systems lol

  12. mogabee says:

    Voted as you requested Oh Master! 😀 😀

    All kidding aside, voting Tory higher than last means you are quite happy for members of your family or community to suffer detriment in some form or other.

    Daughter voting at 16 for first time, wrote her a list of candidates in correct order, ‘coz that’s the kind of caring mother I am… 😉

  13. Dr Jim says:


    Ooooh! like it! That’s real motherly caring

  14. Bob Mack says:

    How or why anyone would vote for a party which has no conscience or soul is quite beyond me. Have people become so selfish and numbed to their fellow man that they could actually elect a party which openly persecutes the less unfortunate among us without regret or remorse?.

    I will go to the station later with my wife and proudly pick my preferences with the Tories at the bottom where they belong.

  15. heedtracker says:

    What a horrifying list of psycho tory rule.

    Outside view of psycho toryboy Brexit, British exceptionalism is psycho tory exceptionalism.

    “On the face of it, Brexit looks like a protest vote by the left behind. But the underlying reason is the hubris and ignorance of much of the British elite, not just the eurosceptics among it. They are less worldly than they imagine themselves to be.

    Their exaggeration of British political and economic power has fed the idea that Britain can afford to leave the EU, indeed flourish outside of it. And they have tacitly encouraged the poor and insecure to blame their problems on EU membership, in order to shift attention from domestic policy failures.

    This message has been reinforced by a stridently eurosceptic, and sometimes xenophobic, print media. The country’s responsible papers have been loath to call out the xenophobic ones, either out of exaggerated respect for Britain or growing indifference to the country. “

  16. John McLean says:

    Just returned from civic and moral duty at polling station..

    Feeling euphoric having voted ’til l boaked….Tory in at

    no 10…..hopefully next month that won’t be happening.

    Family fed up with me going on about this , but they’re all

    good little divisive nationalist…( so that’s 6 votes for the

    good guys ).

  17. Its a record Theresa May and Ruth Davidson must be so proud of.

    There are no suitable words to adequately describe that pair, little wonder May doesn’t want to do TV debates
    or to meet voters to defend her record.

    But we should miss out the other parties here in Scotland, They are the ones who told everyone, we were better together and that means they own what is happening under this Tory government.

    And that message should be hammered home to them every time they open their mouths about what the Tories are doing to the poor and vulnerable in our society.

  18. Sorry there was an an error in my post @4 May, 2017 at 12:30 pm
    It should have read as we shouldn’t miss out the other unionist parties

  19. Tom Kelly says:

    It is not necessary to let politicians decide Scotland’s destiny, We, the people, already have the means by which we can exercise our right of self-determination. At every general election the people decide on the future direction of our nation. If, and only if, over 50 percent of voters choose to support pro-independence parties at any general election, the people will already have made their choice, there is no need for further consultation, and no politician can legitimately deny the result.
    We already have the power to choose Independence, we don’t need permission from Theresa May or any other politician. All we have to do is vote for a pro-independence party which will accept the democratic decision of Scotland’s people.

  20. galamcennalath says:

    I suppose the nasty people in society need a nasty party to vote for.

    Fortunately there aren’t all that many genuinely nasty people around. It’s the idiots who aren’t actually nasty but for odd reasons vote Tory that annoy me!

  21. handclapping says:

    Now heres another soulless bonkers idea that can be sold as a money-saver by the Tories for their own benefit.
    When you get to 80 you can either take the extra 25p a week or loose the vote but if you opt for the vote you have to be assessed by Atos every 3 years for mental accuity.

    “Austerity” rules ok!
    (Voting Tory passes the mental accuity test)

  22. K1 says:

    I’ve written their names and ranking order doon on a bit of paper, for ease in the booth…if there are loads of them dae likewise.

  23. shiregirl says:

    The Tories are utterly abhorrent.

    God, I hope they vote wisely in Keith/Cullen area.

    Rooting for Iain Grieve and Theresa Coull.

  24. chocolass says:

    Wrote myself a crib sheet for order of voting
    -then left it in the booth by mistake!
    Hope the next voter followed it!

  25. nelliejean says:

    My husband asked me to write out our list of candidates in order so he would be sure to get it right in the polling booth!

  26. Thepnr says:

    @John McLean

    “but they’re all good little divisive nationalist…( so that’s 6 votes for the good guys ).”

    Haha John,that did make me have a laugh.

    To everybody else that supports Independence if you haven’t voted yet because your at work or whatever. Do not neglect your duty to support everyone in our society not just the privileged few. People power and you are the people.

    Mind get to your polling station and Vote Till Ye Boak.

  27. Blackhack says:

    That’s my duty done, The only observer/politician outside my voting station was a very nice English woman handing out SNP leaflets.
    Rather sad at the turnout for my ward when I was there…I’m hoping that most people will be at work and will vote on the way home.
    Anyway, Just need to wait now for the fat lady to sing 🙂

  28. ann says:

    ……… and after considering all that, people will still vote for the Conservatives today and on 8th June.
    Totally unbelievable.

  29. Davo says:

    Has anyone noticed how BBC Radio Scotland refer to Northern Irish Unionists as Unionists, but Scottish Unionists are called ‘Pro-Union’? There must have been a memo from central office because they all do it now.

  30. K1 says:

    Chocolass. Ah like yer thinkin’, might accidentally leave mine in there tae 😉

    *finds it really hard tae use the word ‘may’ in any sentences anymair*

  31. George says:

    Sadly as I live outside Scotland I can’t vote but having watched one of the videos do have a question.

    If a candidate reaches their quota, how is it decided which of their votes are then used for the second preference?
    I am probably being dense with this but if they have for argument sake 100 votes more than they need are 100 ballot papers chosen at random for the second choice?

    The reason I ask is because those 100 may not have used the “vote till you boak” method or perhaps listed a unionist candidate second (unlikely I know)where as a different 100 might be more advantageous to the indy parties.

    I have no doubt there is a simple answer so if someone could advise I would appreciate it.

  32. ScottishPsyche says:


    Rated them all. Hand actually shaking when putting Tory last – a physical aversion to voting for them in any shape or form but it had to be done. Lots of Tories around where I am, braying loudly and talking about Theresa May showing Johnny Foreigner a thing or two.

    Bet they were all shouting ‘Up yours Delors’ back in the 90’s too.

  33. Faltdubh says:

    Went with

    1 SNP 2 Indy 3 Indy 4 Lab 5 Lib 6 Tory 7 Indy

    The last Indy is a huge loud-mouth arsehole who’s Twitter is filled with ‘No Indyref 2’ shite yet wants to be elected on local issues.

    Imagine it’ll be SNP plus 2 Indys that go through.

  34. Arbroath1320 says:

    Blue sky here in Eastriggs.

    Sun is shinning here in Eastriggs.

    Hmm …I’m sure there was something else I wanted to say.;)

    Oh yes enjoying loverly egg rolls for lunch. No that wasn’t it.

    Got it heading across the road after lunch to put a few numbers down on a bit of paper.:D

    I have to admit the vote till you boak hits us all extremely early on here in sunny Eastriggs. Did I mention the sun was shinning here in Eastriggs? 😉

    After voting number one the other six candidates are all unionists. Still not a huge problem. I’ve worked out a numbering system for the other six candidates that when I look at it appears to have Labour numbers 5 and 6 and the Tory 7. 😀

  35. Capella says:

    That’s quite a charge sheet. Shameful that such a party is in power in a modern, wealthy European state. Let’s hope it won’t be for much longer. Could be rid of them completely in June.

  36. HandandShrimp says:

    That will be the day job that Struth whines about all the time and then shuts up like a clam when the Tory efforts are raised. No wonder – it is a record not of mistakes or incompetence but of wilful evil.

  37. One_Scot says:

    Done. It was not that hard when you realise that your are not specifically voting for anyone, but rather listing all the candidates in order, from the one you most like, to the one you most dislike.

    Just hope the SNP gets its vote out.

  38. george wood says:

    Having big doubts about voting for the Green.

    He lied on his leaflet about it being between him and the Tory for the last seat. The SNP have three candidates and are in the mix for the last spot. Labour are bound to get one as they got two last time as did the SNP.
    The greens also stood against the SNP in my constituency at Holyrood and we got Ruth as the winner.

  39. Proud Cybernat says:


    Not many posters in people’s windaes this election. The odd Green or SNP one I’ve seen but very, very low profile.

    Which got me thinking. That might not actually be a bad thing. With very low profile/poor visibility out there in yer actual streets but massive visibility online might work in our favour. Most a high percentage of the Tory vote comes from 65+ age group. They’re not seeing the overkill of SNP windae posters or the massive online activity so may be less concerned about getting themselves out to vote.

    On the other hand, those supporting Indy (and not particularly online) might be concerned of the seeming ‘apathy’ and be more motivated to get out and vote.

    Just a thought.

    Get Out An Vote EVERYONE.


  40. Big Jock says:

    So many people at work didn’t even know there was a council election or who was standing. Big Jock explained the voting procedure to them. To be honest most are SNP anyway but it baffles me how people just don’t take part in politics.

    It kind of explains why so many people voted no. They heard the BBC telling them and that was enough.

  41. Dr Jim says:

    So jaw dropped when I went to vote (East Dunbartonshire)
    No Lib Dems standing, none, totally shocked, happy but shocked

    I guess they’re saving their money to spend on Jo Swinson at the GE, I’ll be making every effort to thwart that though

  42. geeo says:

    My ward in Grangemouth was a dawdle.

    3 seats from this lot…



    INDEPENDENT (good guy)

    Labour (boak)

    TORY (boak)

    The labour candidate is actually a relative of my wife. She is a lovely person, however…this is an election, not a family reunion..and to be fair, i DID put her above the Tory chunt !!

  43. Big Jock says:

    Proud- I think you are right. People like us and there are many thousands will make sure we vote. The knuckle dragging Tory/Ukip neds won’t bother.

    The SNP does well on low turnouts as we are very motivated to a cause. Your average Brit is lazy and complacent.

  44. osakisushi says:

    I hate STV.

    Wife came to vote and asked the staff for guidance as clearly my explanation was not understood.
    When the staff attempted to explain the SNP had two candidates because they’d allowed it as they are in Govt, something inside snapped.

    When my lecture completed, we voted. With wife saying as we left, “still don’t understand it…”

    No GREEN candidate here in my bit of Argyll.

  45. Marcia says:

    I’m feeling rather left out by not receiving any Tory leaflets during this campaign to return to them with a note. I must be on a do not contact list. 🙂

  46. Sinky says:

    “When the staff attempted to explain the SNP had two candidates because they’d allowed it as they are in Govt, something inside snapped”.

    That should be reported to the Returning Officer at Council then at least they won’t get the well paid gig in June.

  47. Thepnr says:

    My polling station is tiny due to the rural location. The man and woman running it though were very nice and extremely polite.

    Reminding both me and my wife that you should fill in the boxes with numbers and not a X.

    Also that you could fill in all the boxes or just the one if you so choose. I found that fair. Very fair really and good advice.

    I was tempted to say “I’ll vote till I boak” fortunately resisted 🙂

  48. cearc says:


    I only had one leaflet. From the LibDems.

  49. Arbroath1320 says:

    Well that’s me back.

    I can still report the following:

    The sun is STILL shining in Eastriggs.

    The sky is STILL blue in Eastriggs.

    The egg rolls I had for lunch were indeed extremely loverly. No that’s not it.

    Oh aye voted at the polling “station.” Yep they really did call it the polling station!

    I actually found the numbers 1 to 7 actually came very useful after all. 😀

    Sadly there were no Green candidates in our ward.

  50. Robert Peffers says:

    @Marcia says: 4 May, 2017 at 2:02 pm:

    “I’m feeling rather left out by not receiving any Tory leaflets during this campaign to return to them with a note. I must be on a do not contact list.”

    Nah! Marcia, they don’t even read the emails they get.

    A good while ago I read a real Tory lie sheet and it was just ripe for a real blistering take-down as nothing that was claimed by them stood up to careful examination.

    So I did a real number on it that proved every single claim that was made was utter mince.

    Now I wasn’t abusive in any way. I just tore the claims they made to ribbons and asked why they were the telling obvious lies.

    I’ve been getting e-mails treating me like a nice wee Tory from Tory headquarters ever since.

    Even get emails from Theresa including one this very morning. Obviously they do not read the replies to stuff on their websites but harvest the email addresses and send out bulk emails to everyone on the list. Even when the original contact was a blistering attack on the Tories.

    Anyway I’ve had my lunch and my second dose of pain killers so I’ll get the boots on and head out to vote.
    I have my wee prepared list ready to accidentally leave in the booth when I leave.

    I know most of the candidates personally and hope I might see some of the opposition at the poll.

  51. Artyhetty says:

    That list is very scary indeed. UKGov are actually working to undermine Scotland’s economy, as well as to totally negate the positive welcoming to people from outwith Scotland, by deporting people who are perfectly eligible to stay and live here. To deport families, who are employing people, and running businesses in Scotland, is obviously a UKGOV message, saying you might as well not bother cos we will throw you out of Scotland, oh, and hopefully you will see that it’s the SNPGOV doing this, not us, nudge nudge!

    Imagine how this will be stepped up if still shackled to their disgusting UKok, with human rights removed and Scotland’s parliament vastly reduced if not eradicated altogether.

    Our council ward, argh, we have a bloody crap choice in my view. This ‘Libertarian’ stuff is dubious by the look of it as well.

    Still, will be voting soon, before the throngs of after work voters start queuing!

  52. geeo says:

    O/T and sorry if posted elsewhere…

    Dinner with Juncker went more badly than first thought, it seems..!

  53. Arbroath1320 says:

    Marcia says:
    4 May, 2017 at 2:02 pm

    I’m feeling rather left out by not receiving any Tory leaflets during this campaign to return to them with a note. I must be on a do not contact list. ?


    I knew I was right. It WAS your name I saw on the Tory “Do NOT contact!” list just below my name. 😀

    I don’t understand it myself. I even went as far as tweeting Dame Colonel Blimp Unsolicited Sex Spineless of Boak personally to enquire as to where my personal leaflet from her had got to. To date I’m still waiting … for the leaflet and her response to my ever so nice query. 😀

  54. galamcennalath says:

    Boaked in the booth!

    Up and down Scotland there must 100,000s of 3rd preference votes to the Green candidates! That assumes people do indeed use lots of preferences,

    I do hope Green voters put SNP 2 and 3 after their own candidate!

  55. Col says:

    Yes Davo, and they always call the SNP or pro independence groups nationalists. The use of certain words to describe folk which many would hold as a derogatory term is not by accident. Much time and effort has gone into smearing the pro indy half of the country and the BBC is more than happy to use such terms in describing us as such.

  56. Proud Cybernat says:

    The Alpha and Omega of it all…

  57. ScotsRenewables says:

    Mucho boako

    Had to go all the way to 10 for our solitary Tory . . . .

  58. Col says:

    What will happen to Scotland’s oil industry if as expected we are headed for a hard brexit on WTO rules on trade? I wonder if Sir Ian Wood will be funding Scotland’s next indy campaign as costs of production could more than double? Popcorn please.

  59. Marie Clark says:

    Aw, don’t feel bad Marcia, I only had two leaflets, both personally delivered, by independent candidates. Not one from any of the others. So you are not alone.

  60. Arbroath1320 says:

    Just come across this confirmation from Dumfries and Galloway Council.

    Just in case Unsolicited Sex supporting Ruth pops by I can confirm that there are NO big burly blokes threatening anyone in Annan today who is attending the polling stations.

  61. Eddie says:

    3.Pro-indy indpendent
    4.SNP, Tory & Lib-Dem hating independent!!!!

    It was a close run thing with Labour and Tory candidates, much deliberation was had but it was sorted when Mr Double-Barrel-Name decided to try to entice me to vote for him, I simply asked what his stance was on the rape clause and he backed off.

  62. Grey Dug says:

    The first few choices were easy, but then I was down to the last two, Tory or UKIP. Could I really rate any candidate as worse than UKIP? It seemed like a dilemma until I remembered that they’re one and the same anyway, so UKIP then Tory it was.

  63. Arbroath1320 says:

    I’m hearing, via Twitter, that Dame Colonel Blimp Unsolicited Sex Spineless of Boak has turned up to vote in the Council Elections.

    (Thanks to Mr. Malky for the photo 😉 )

  64. Big Jock says:

    C’mon Ruth how’s the postal ballots looking!

  65. Thomas Valentine says:

    You missed the adviser to David Cameron who proposed that boundaries to Westminster seats should be drawn according to the joint income of the residents. Such that say £2 billion income equaled one seat, it would then take fewer rich people to get an MP. So in extreme cases for ever one MP the normal population had the Rich would get eight or nine.

    He talked as if he was only trying to be fair in matching contribution to the country with political representation.
    You would never have to be told this guy was a Tory. No surprise Tory comes from Gaelic Toraidh (criminal).

  66. Arbroath1320 says:

    In future when Feartie McFeartie keeps repeating Strong and Stable this that or whatever remember she is only advertising this business.?

    (thanks to Harry Smith for the photo)

  67. Craig P says:

    My sole Tory is getting second last slot… just in front of the actual racist former Tory independent. Can’t wait to do my duty!

  68. Conan the Librarian says:

    It really was a toss up for me; UKIP 9 and Tory 10 or the other way round. Then outside the polling station I saw a guy in his early twenties clad in tweed jacket and cap with red trousers, cravat around his neck, blue rosette on chest…

    Ye see yon birkie, ca’d a lord,
    Wha struts, an’ stares, an’ a’ that;
    Tho’ hundreds worship at his word,
    He’s but a coof for a’ that:
    For a’ that, an’ a’ that,
    His ribband, star, an’ a’ that:
    The man o’ independent mind
    He looks an’ laughs at a’ that.

    UKIP 9

  69. Alex livingstone says:

    I have not voted yet,but when I do I will only be placing a number against the SNP candidates.I don’t understand why people are placing prefences against any other party as you do not have to.

  70. galamcennalath says:

    Col says:

    they always call the SNP or pro independence groups nationalists. The use of certain words to describe folk which many would hold as a derogatory term is not by accident.

    Same in Northern Ireland where the British Nationalists are never called nationalists only the Irish Nationalists get the label.

    Historically, nationalism comes with a lot of baggage. The nasty side of nationalism IS the British version where they believe in their own exceptionalism and entitlement to lord over others. The decent side of nationalism e.g. Ghandi, doesn’t seem to be the one most people first think of.

    Sad, but true.

  71. gerry parker says:

    What a TANK!


  72. Capella says:

    Something very odd going on with the BBC paper review. They are not publishing the “British” front pages because they say they can only publish factual news on polling day – at least that is what they said earlier this morning.

    However, they are publishing the Scottish front pages – except – the Herald and Scotsman. All the British papers and the Herald and Scotsman carried big scary Theresa May warmongering headlines. They are not published. The others are squashed in with titles missing in a very strange mash up.

    What is going on?

    For comparison you can view the front pages at kiosko

  73. Arbroath1320 says:

    Alex livingstone says:
    4 May, 2017 at 3:21 pm

    I have not voted yet,but when I do I will only be placing a number against the SNP candidates.I don’t understand why people are placing prefences against any other party as you do not have to.

    Can I suggest that you may want to watch this wee video first Alex. I think it explains why it is necessary to put a number against every candidate.

  74. Marie Clark says:

    Alex livingstone @3.21 if you don’t understand why you should vote till you boak, you haven’t being paying attention.

    Watch oot for the beardy man wi’ the hammers.

  75. gerry parker says:

    Met Liz g at Gartcosh this morning supporting the polling agents Billy and Cathy.

    Well done to all of you.

  76. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    Seriously @Alex livingstone??

    You are correct of course you don’t have to vote for every candidate but by ranking the Tories last you make it less likely for them to sneak in on transferable votes if it is tight.

    Anyway google ‘vote till you boak’ or read today’s National to get more information on why.

    End of the day it’s your vote so use it how you see fit.

  77. Big Jock says:

    Alex- You don’t have to but you are helping the Tories by not putting them last. They get eliminated immediately by putting them last.

  78. bittie45 says:

    Best of both worlds:

    The STV simulator at gives equal chance to candidates who are voted 8th preference or are left blank, so by leaving the worst candidate blank instead of ranking them 8th you are not giving them the satisfaction of saying “ah, but people did vote for us”.

  79. ayeanaw says:

    Below is my voting intention, I’m open to any last minute recommendations 🙂

    Rosyth Ward 5

    Wilson              – SNP             – 1
    Steele              – SNP             – 2
    McOwan          – Green           – 3
    Chamberlain    – Lib Dem       – 4
    MacIntyre        – Ind (ukip)      – 5
    Shirkie             – Ind (Labour) – 6
    Verrechia         – Labour         – 7
    Leckie              – Ind (Tory)     – 8
    Orton               – Tory              – 9

  80. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Thepnr @ 14:16,

    My experience was the same here in Glasgow. The person in the polling station who gave me my ballot briefly and clearly explained it as yours did. (Perhaps following general guidance that everyone had been given.)

    osakisushi @ 14:01:

    … the staff attempted to explain the SNP had two candidates because they’d allowed it as they are in Govt …

    Maybe they were just trying to be helpful, but that statement as you tell it was definitely out of order. You should make a formal complaint to the returning officer for your district, and also to the Electoral Commission. That is just not acceptable.

    (But incidentally has nothing to do with STV, and more to do with continuing unfamiliarity with a system that works perfectly well elsewhere in the world. It’s just that the good ole UK, as with most things these days, is very, very backward.)

  81. alex livingstone says:

    Thanks very much for your advice,I did not realise that by voting Tory last they were eliminated

  82. Thepnr says:

    @Alex livingstone

    Hi, it’s NOT just about who you want to win seats it’s also about those you don’t want to win seats.

    If you only vote for say the two SNP candidates in a three seat ward you are giving up the right as to who will be the third Councillor elected. Use ALL your votes to get YOUR most preferred candidates elected.

    You may or may not succeed but will have done your best.

    At the end of the day the choice is yours, use it wisely.

  83. Proud Cybernat says:

    “Thanks very much for your advice,I did not realise that by voting Tory last they were eliminated”

    If everyone votes the Tory last then the Tory is eliminated FIRST. Then whoever comes second last is eliminated, and so on…

  84. maureen says:

    Well, that’s me boaked, even helped someone else on their way to the polling station to boak! They had no idea what I was on about so I showed him my voting intention list, briefly explaining why I was voting in that order He waited until after I voted and took my list as a guide! I hope he passes round his family and friends.

  85. stonefree says:

    @Proud Cybernat at 1:44 pm


    Not many posters in people’s windaes this election. The odd Green or SNP one I’ve seen but very, very low profile.

    I like the idea of no posters, Brian and Alan Wilson were terrible for leaving them up for well over a month, That said a SNP councillor has just had a hissy fit over the council removing SNP posters where he had permission to put them.He blamed the Labour Party and the Independents , well sorry about that but Yesterday he was still a councillor and could have got to the bottom of it all.
    Maybe if he had informed the council it would not have happened?

  86. Thepnr says:

    @gerry parker

    Heard you are standing, good luck gerry.

  87. Arbroath1320 says:

    just a wee O/T here.

    Although the Conservative Broadcasting Corporation did not report it WE all know about the “white powder” attacks on a number of SNP offices the other week. Well folks looks like it is round two.

    The Dunfermline Press is reporting that the Douglas Chapman’s office has had to be evacuated due to a security threat.

  88. Flower of Scotland says:

    Voted. Used #votetillyouboak.

    I’m in the top LibDem village and a group of even older people than me came in to vote. The lady told them that it’s numbers this time. The answer was “Oh for goodness sake, how do we do that?”

    I said nothing!

    I knew that they were LibDemers.

  89. annie says:

    Job done, 1-7 Tory 7.

  90. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Jockanese Wind Talker @ 15:37

    Your (and others) basic message to Alex Livingstone is perfectly correct. It’s a pity there is still any doubt by any indy supporter about that.

    However, when you say:

    … by ranking the Tories last you make it less likely for them to sneak in on transferable votes if it is tight.

    it goes to show that people still don’t fully understand the principle behind “vote till you boak”. Ranking a single Tory last does nothing to stop them. It’s ranking every other opponent before them that does.

    You can safely leave your one last preference blank and it doesn’t matter a hoot.

    If there are two Tories standing, either rank the better of the two (if you know them) and leave the last one blank, or rank the one second in the order their leaflets tell you, and omit the other one.

    There are even more subtle variations on that besides, but I don’t want to risk confusing anyone by mentioning them, since bothering about them won’t matter in the end (though being able to happily avoid ranking any utterly reprehensible no-hopers can be a welcome relief).

  91. Dan Huil says:

    Think I’m right in saying local election results will be called mid-afternoon tomorrow?

  92. Socrates MacSporran says:

    After I voted this morning I was chatting to one of the local Labour high heid yins, a former councillor and, for all his politics, a decent wee guy.

    We got round to the General Election – he reckons the Tories might take a maximum of eight seats, but, is doubtful about Ian Murray holding on to his.

    He did say something which I must admit, I had never thought of before – if the Tories get even one more seat in Scotland, Fluffy is toast, even if he holds on to his seat. They will then have an alternative for SoS for Scotland and, the alternative will get the job, on the basis that anyone would be better than Fluffy.

  93. crazycat says:

    If there is only one Tory in your ward, it is not essential to rank them, because:

    If your ballot paper is still being scrutinized for your final preference, that means that

    a) all the other candidates have either been elected or eliminated
    b) there is still a seat to be filled, so the Tory is going to get it anyway, whether the quota is reached or not.

    If there is more than one Tory, or people even worse, then you need to decide who is the worst. Even if there is only one, it won’t hurt if you vote(d) for them. I couldn’t bring myself to (she was the 7th candidate and 7 is my favourite number, definitely not to be wasted on a Tory), but I can see there might be a grim satisfaction from putting them last.

  94. Ken500 says:

    The waiting is the worst.

    Just hope the Tory/unionist. Plus the other red Tories and those who back them up are out. The state of Aberdeen City because of these lying unionists and a green is a absolute disgrace. To get the City into £1.2Billion for that mess. The exact opposite of what folk wanted and expected. The Art Gallery is practically demolised. Vandalised. It probably will not be open for years with £Millions wasted

    The Tory Ron? Thomson had the cheek, damn cheek, absolute cheek to complain to some authority or other about the £80Million awarded to Glasgow for houses etc (in the Purdah period). Remembrr all the promises made to Scotland at the Purdah period in the IndyRef, when Cameron thought he had lost it. Powers turned to dust. The lies and conceit. Lord Smih Commission a farce. With non elected Tomkins interfering. Now a 3rd rate reject.

    Aberdeen City Council were offered £80Million, as a gift.To build a walkway and regenerate and pedestrianise the City Centre. Supported by the majority. They refused. Thomson was in favour. Thomson expects to be going to Westminster. Depends on the voters?

    People of all political hue are in complete agreement about Willy Young. Hopefully he will have his jotters and ends up under investigation. If there is any justice. If would be justified to give the LibDems a chance. They can be quite reasonable in local gov. They did not vote for illegal wars and support the EU but blocked the AWPR for years. At national level they lied about Tuition fees in England/Wales and propped up the Tories. The Tories back stabbed them and this led to the illegal EU Ref because of the perceived UKIP threat. Not Fibdems again. Farron attacks the Tories, Then refuses a candidate for telling the truth because of a Tory complaint. Erratic. Pickles who banned wind turbines in England but supports Hinkley by the sea. A complete waste of money a disaster waiting to happen.

    Two tidal barrages (Humber etc) could have cost half the price, produced more energy and been cleaner. There have been tidal barrages for years in France. One at Dinan? Hydro in Scotland is very important. From 1948 till 1964 Hydro projects were built in Scotland. Pitlochry etc. Still producing relatively free energy. Wind turbine projects now do the same.

    The Tories committed electoral fraud in 31 constituencies. UKIP can’t get a candidate elected to Westminster. They committed electoral fraud.. Farague has been funding a Political Party for years with public money and getting away with it. The grandee Tories have been protecting him for years. Farague has now destroyed his position. He won the battle and lost the war, He was getting over £Million a year out of the EU. Not for very much longer.

    The not nice but dim Tory Multimillionaire landowner takes out a £25Million loan to cover for the Oil & Gss down turn . Osbourne 5 jobs destroyed the Oil sector with illegal too high Tory taxes. The tax is 40% from Jan 2016. Osbourne now earns £Millions from other interests. After sanctioning and starving vulnerable people to death. Graft and corruption, The only reason they join the Tory/Unionist Party to ripe off public money and cut the essential services.

    It is being claimed that coming out of the EU will affect the Oil & Gas industry. How much worse could it get. 120,000 jobs lost already. The Tories/Unionist will not desist until Scotland is finished. Another relic Thatcher period, or worse. Another clearance. Imagine deporting people who have invested and lived in Scotland for many years. It is just despicable beyond reason. Creating jobs and regenerating the Highlands on particular visas, where they were guaranteed the right to stay. Changing the goalposts. Without migrant workers the Scottish economy would collapse.

    Scotland had better have another IndyRef soon. Independence in the EU. Or Scotland will be finished left to another catastrophe of Tory rule for years. That is just unthinkable.

    David Davis appealed to the EU HR Court about the illegal surveillance and protection of rights for people living in Britain. Yet will not support self determination for Scotland. International rights. Refused to consider Scotland remaining in the EU. Even though 62% voted for it. Davis is just another troughing Tory hypocrite. A lying ‘psycho bastard’. There own description of their Party. They certainly live up to it.

    Imagine if May loses the GE election. The Police move in and arrest the Tories crooks within weeks. England/Wales will be left with Corbyn or some coalition. Scotland has got the SNP and can have an IndyRef and win. Scotland will be Independent in EU. A bright, more prosperous equal, fair country. The majority wishes will come true.

  95. crazycat says:

    @ RJS

    Sorry! You said what I was trying to, while I was attempting to find wording that didn’t confuse things further!

  96. Bill McDermott says:

    I did my civic duty this morning. The guy at the polling station was explaining the voting procedure to me and I responded with, “Do you mean I should vote ’til I boke”. He gave me that knowing look, so I can safely say he is one of us.

  97. orri says:

    Whilst not big on the idea of numbering everyone other than to send a message there’s a very good reason for at least expressing a preference for as many candidates as there are seats in your ward.

    The point is that this is a multi-member election. You’re voting for 3 or 4 people so picking at least that many is a good idea.

    The problem a lot of parties might have is that in any PR system they aren’t guaranteed an outright majority and if the larges party will need to buddy up with others.

    That’s why it’s not really possible in council elections for them to do other than punt their own candidates.

    Put it this way if there were 3 good guys a numpty and a wank in a given ward then if more than 80% of the voters gave higher preference to their good guy of choice and then to the next and so on down to the numpty then the best the wank might get would still not be enough for him to get a seat.

    So even if you don’t want to sort the wanks into numerical order it’s a good idea that you express a preference for enough of the others that it reduces their chances of getting a seat if they don’t get enough votes to pass the quota.

  98. Thepnr says:

    @Flower of Scotland

    That brought a smile to my face, can’t wait to see the results tomorrow. Never been so excited since Scotland went to the World Cup in 1978. We’ve always been underdogs under English rule. No more, we’re more than capable of standing on our own two feet.

    I know we got humped in 1978 but we did beat the finalists Holland 3-2 with this Archie Gemmill goal wining the goal of the competition. So close and then so far 🙂

  99. Liz Rannoch says:

    Beautiful day! Me and him just back fae boaking!

    Coming out of polling station heard this – “me neither, ahm no votin’ fir nae f*&king unionist party” – 3 guys sitting on bench just blethering.

    Rev, here’s another one you might consider:

    Aye just lump them a’ in thegither, nasty, despicable horrendous minds at work.

  100. crazycat says:

    @ Socrates at 4.15

    The demotion of Fluffy had occurred to me, but I’m not sure he’ll mind too much (not that I care) – he doesn’t look comfortable. But what if the only other one is a wee twerp like the part-time referee? I’m not expecting him to get in, but the others might be just as useless.

  101. Albert Herring says:

    Best to fill in all the boxes.

    Otherwise overnight, someone might sneak a “1” into the blank toryscum box and add a “0” to my “1” in the nice SNP box.

  102. Robert Graham says:

    I just wonder what the percentage of wasted votes will be with this super duper voting ,oops its not a vote but a preference system , perm any 8 from 10 and take yer pick hope for the best .

    First order of business should be attempt to replace both systems , confusing not a bit , look at how many posts there have been about both systems , whats the betting the ability to alter the voting system for the Scottish Parliament and councils are reserved , there yah go gotcha once again .

  103. Ken500 says:

    The SNP will have to get back into majority in Holyrood and change to FPTP. In local elections and Holyrood. So 1st preference votes do not go in the bin. It is just a sin. Many people who are politically aware do not know to preference vote the candidates/party. They are still just voting SNP 1 & 2. They could be letting Tories through. Or Labour in certain cases. Aberdeen, Glasgow, Even Edinburgh. The problem is the unionist gang up together, even though the SNP have equal or majority no of seats. Then they do everything they can to blame the SNP Gov for the unionist failures, especially from Westminster.

  104. Flower of Scotland says:

    I’m away back to help get the vote out in Muchty.

    Good luck to all the SNP candidates and Greens too!

  105. Glamaig says:

    I believe there was a motion at SNP conference to make the Holyrood election system STV like the council elections. I was against this at the time thinking that SNP would never get a majority again. However I am told that this is not the case, in 2016 we would actually have got a bigger majority with STV (not sure how anybody can work that out).

    I assume the motion was rejected? I now think it might be a good idea to use STV for everything to reduce the present confusion of a different voting system for every election, and it seems like a fair proportional system (hopefully June 8 will be the last FPTP election in Scotland anyway 🙂

  106. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    crazycat @ 16:20,

    No worries, we’re on the same wavelength. It’s not easy to be subtle when many people are still grappling with the basics.

    That seems to be the difficulty with STV. It’s hard to motivate people to rank, however lowly, anyone whom they essentially oppose. I feel it myself, actually.

    (Though I suppose it forces us all to recognise there are many shades of grey, so to speak!)

  107. Ken500 says:

    The Scottish Gov could change tgecekectoral system in Scotland. Remember Alex Salmond was speaking about it. Change the list system. So losers could not regurgitate. Extend the elected one. If Scotland is Independent it needs more elected members for the committees? There are not enough MSP to cover all the additional committee work which is necessary for government. Holyrood is much cheaper to run than Westminster. Less admin and pomp carry on.

    Scotland would have to pay a few more civil servants but all the good administration jobs that Scotland pays for would transfer from the Mall to Edinburgh. The wasteful Scottish Office would disappear. A win, win for Scotland. Defence personnel would be based here. A navy based here. Vessels to patrol the shore. Scotland already pays a Defence bill to the Treasury.(Including pensions). The personnel would be based in Scotland boasting the economy. Squint Trident could go. It could go in any case if England/Wales leave the EU.

    Hammond laughed and sneered at the prospect of Scotland having a Navy. Or building vessels. Claimed Trident would take 3 years and £27Billion to move. More than it costs now. Claimed Scotland would have to pay for it. Then changed the story. Lies. The Tories ‘Bombs and Debt’ disaterous campaign. Hammond and Davis. They are a laughing stock. Along with Teresa May. Blaming the EU for the Tory failures. Liars.

  108. john 58 says:

    Lovely Sunny day to vote, all candidates numbered snp 1+2, greens 3, labour 4+5 ,Tories 6. job done and feeling contented.

    Met two woman on way out of polling place , as they passed one said ” hope yiv voted til yi boaked ”

    I answered ” im boaked out” , brought a smile to all our faces .

  109. Ken500 says:

    @ The Scottish Gov could change the electoral system in Scotland. It has the power.

  110. Dr Jim says:

    My neighbour told me she voted Labour both crosses

    I didn’t say a word!

  111. Proud Cybernat says:

    “Though I suppose it forces us all to recognise there are many shades of grey, so to speak!”

    There are many shades of Tory.

    There, sorted.

  112. call me dave says:


    My favourite goal! Magic.

    PS: Voted along with my partner nearly the same order for us:

    The first three were easy 1 & 2 SNP in the order as per local branch instruction and then 3 green.
    Then 6 Lib Dem. 7 Ind Labour (deselected for being a numptie) 8, 9 Official Labour and 10 Tory No UKIP.

    4 and 5 Independent local nutters.

    Also earlier this week sent e-mails to my family with the video and who are all SNP / Green. They have also voted till the boaked.

    Have a good day all. Fingers X’d for Friday count.

    Archie Gemmel 🙂

  113. jfngw says:

    Only problem was what order to put the Labour & LibDems, but the thought of Willie Rennie gloating just made me boak, so placed them after Labour.

  114. Thepnr says:

    @Dr Jim

    Hope your not just winding us up LOL

  115. Dr Jim says:


    Nope, no windup true

    Got to be a spoiled ballot eh, sad!

    Hee Hee!

  116. heedtracker says:

    Vive la France. Cant wait for council election results and that’s the first I have ever had that emotion about council elections.

    Will ACC Olympic level UKOK catastrofuck Sir Wullie Young cling on, for another 4 years at ruining Aberdeen for example?

    Ligger Neil’s lunchtime Daily Politics show today was an hour long celebration of BBC fascism, from one ex Murdoch bootboy, Ligger, sidekicked by another ex Murdoch bootboy, some schlub, they rambled on about the glories of neo fascism in the UK and France, 15 minutes of Ligger’s vote tory show handed over to an ex BNP thug who wanted to tell us all he’s not a far right racist thug.

    Then BBC r4 tory gimps spent a 45 lunchtime news show licking Prince Phillip’s jacksy, because he’s 90 something.

    Beeb gimps even give the BNP thug his own slot

    Have nightmares.

  117. Skip_NC says:

    Greetings from Raleigh, North Carolina. I find it interesting that several posters have mentioned making lists of candidates. Are sample ballots not available online? Here in NC, I can go to my county website, put in my name and address and get a personalized sample ballot. On average there are about thirty races on each ballot, so you need something to mark off. (It’s not as simple as voting all Democrat or all Republican, as a moderate Republican might be preferable to a Democrat climbing the greasy pole.)

  118. geeo says:

    Kezia Dugdale’s F/B page is a desperate place…
    My response to Jim Harper…”SNP BAD” supporter
    @jim harper.

    You said this…
    “English voters won’t accept a minority labour government propped up by the (SNP)”.

    If that is true, then you have just made a compelling case for independence.

    If English voters refuse to accept the resultant government from the UK WIDE ELECTORATE then Scotland’s voice, if it differs from what ENGLISH VOTERS feel is not acceptable, will NEVER be heard in a Parliament which claims to represent ALL parts of the UK.

    In that case, the Union is OVER, and YOU agree that is the case by the statement YOU make.
    Then i threw in THIS for Kezia’s supporters to ponder..
    If labour and the SNP formed coalitions in councils with No Overall Control (NOC) then the TORIES would be 100% ELIMINATED from ALL decision making in Scottish local authorities.

    This can be done TOMORROW.

    Kezia Dugdale will tomorrow, CHOOSE, if Scottish tories REMAIN involved in local council decision making, or are REMOVED from said local decision making.

    Kezia would do well to remember there is another election in 5 weeks time when HER DECISION to kill or keep the tories will be judged by the electorate of Scotland.

  119. heedtracker says:

    Hammer of the Scots Severin Carrell has one last blast at SNP voting

    28m ago
    Severin Carrell Severin Carrell
    The Scottish Tories have reinforced their complaints that the Scottish government has broken election rules by promoting new spending to win votes, provoking counter-accusations of hypocrisy from the Scottish National party.

    Ross Thomson, the Tories’ general election candidate for Aberdeen South, said Nicola Sturgeon should explain why these “cash for votes” announcements were made so close to the council elections. He said:

    There are clear rules on how government should behave in the run-up to an election. It looks to many voters that the only rule the SNP has followed is how best to use taxpayers’ cash to win votes. It stinks to high heaven – and we need to see some clarity from the first minister now.”

    Always a good sign when Graun piles in hard to Scottish democracy like this, total Graun black out reportage and then last stick that world famous progressive liberal Graun boot right in, hoping to catch evening Scottish voters no doubt.

  120. Thepnr says:


    Well done. GET IN THERE. We won’t back down, simply love it.

  121. galamcennalath says:

    Skip_NC says:

    a moderate Republican might be preferable to a Democrat climbing the greasy pole

    Relieved to hear you clarify that. I don’t follow US politics at all really, but through the years I’ve heard politicians talk sense and think, ‘they’re ok’, only to find they are Rep. and at other times find I completely disagree with what a Dem is saying. Yet I know the Dems should be for me at the overall level.

  122. Dr Jim says:

    Just saw something on Twitter that made me think
    Theresa Mays constituency Maidenhead voted heavily remain
    So what would happen if she got voted out in her own election

  123. Robert Peffers says:

    @Alex livingstone says: 4 May, 2017 at 3:21 pm:

    “I have not voted yet,but when I do I will only be placing a number against the SNP candidates.I don’t understand why people are placing prefences against any other party as you do not have to.

    Will Matron let you go to the poll unaccompanied, Alex?

  124. galamcennalath says:

    Dr Jim says:

    what would happen …

    … we’d all bust ribs laughing our sides off.

    Like in a Napoleonic era battle, someone from the rank behind would just step forward and take up the gap of the fallen. Then things would carry on! Westminster works like that.

    Would it effect Brexit? Depends if the Tories are looking for an excuse to do a u-turn to a soft single market outcome.

  125. MARYDOLL says:


    I have just voted at a polling place in Edinburgh South. In the time it took me to go in and vote, a table with red balloons and labour literature appeared on the next corner – on way to polling place. Surely this is not allowed? Should I report it ? To who?

  126. Arbroath1320 says:

    Dr Jim says:
    4 May, 2017 at 5:24 pm

    Just saw something on Twitter that made me think
    Theresa Mays constituency Maidenhead voted heavily remain
    So what would happen if she got voted out in her own election

    For starters Dr. Jim WE would all be celebrating and ROFLOAO for days as would the E.U.! 😀

    Panic would ensue amongst the Tories to find yet another *YAWN* leader who would fight for a Strong and Stable something or other.

  127. Skip_NC says:

    Galamcennalath, The interesting thing about US politics is that it is dominated by two monolithic parties that cover a large range of opinions. For instance, a Republican in the north-east states can be more moderate (eg, John Major Tory) than a Democrat here in NC. At the presidential primary, I almost took the Republican ballot to vote for John Kasich. In the end I took the Democratic ballot to vote for Bernie.

    Anyway, folks, get out and educate those with less political minds on how to vote. It can make a difference. Only a few hours to go.

  128. Socrates MacSporran says:

    crazy cat @ 4’23pm

    Actually, the wee linesman – he’s not good enough to be a referee – might be a good choice for SoS for Scotland.

    He’s used to standing on the side lines, occasionally waving his flag, quite often getting decisions wrong, and being ignored by the bigger pratt in the middle.

    Sounds to me like ideal Tory SoSfS material.

  129. Sinky says:


    Which Polling Station was it?

    Contact local SNP on 07973 834 892 or 07789 646 606

  130. Lekraw says:

    For the song, I’d have gone with “If You Tolerate This, Your Children Will Be Next” – Manic Street Preachers.

    I only hope people are out voting in numbers. These Tory excuses for humans need a message sent.

  131. george wood says:

    Any advice on where to rank Libertarians.
    Apparently they will campaign against Indyref2 if it involves being in the EU.

  132. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Arbroath1320 @ 17:43,

    Oh that pic link is pure dead brilliant. An undertaker too – says it all about May and Brexit really.

    Except it will be our own funeral if we don’t get out of this slow-motion car crash in time…

  133. Robert Peffers says:

    Went into the poll and the two people on the desk were explaining the numbering system to everyone as they issued the ballot papers.

    The lady on the desk looked at the large SNP badge on the woolly hat and said, “You’ll know how to vote”, and handed me the paper.

    I took it to mean there had been a load of SNP voters already and they all knew the ropes. I hope I was right.

  134. crazycat says:

    @ Socrates


  135. Breeks says:

    That’s me done my bit.

    Have to say, if I hadn’t been paying attention, I’d have done my SNP 1, Green 2, and left it there. But I kept going, Independent 3rd, Liberals 4th, Red Tories 5, Blue Tories 6.

    Job done.

  136. Stoker says:

    WOS archive links for November 2013 now showing over on O/T.

    Just back from doing my bit for Ward 8 of Scottish Borders Council.
    Both the Boss and i voted as follows:

    1: SNP.
    2: Greens.
    3: Independent (McGrath).
    4: Independent (Aitchison).
    5: Labour.
    6: Lib Dem.
    7: C & U (Weatherston).
    8: C & U (Mountford).

    Not expecting much in my area but can’t wait to see the results.

  137. Sandy says:

    Just got an e-mail from Ruth the untruth asking for money. Cheeky bitch. Replied that I was a wee bit short at the moment & could she perhaps help me out through her multi-millionaire controllers.
    No reply yet. Early days, tho’.

  138. Sandy says:

    Joined her mail list for amusement only.

  139. Richardinho says:

    Am I the only person who thinks this voting system is crazy?

  140. jfngw says:

    Watched the BBC claiming murders had risen by 31%, but on reading the article it transpires that for the year they have actually fallen by 8%. The increase of 31% is only comparing the last nine months, or since May became PM if you want emulate the BBC and put a twist on it.

  141. frogesque says:

    @Sandy 6.27pm.

    I gave the dog a proxy vote to bite her earse.

  142. CameronB Brodie says:

    Nothing wrong with a bit of libertarian freedom, IMHO, so long as excess is curbed by appropriate ethical frameworks.

    Anglo-American neo-liberalism demands wholesale deregulation, deifying market forces at the experience of human liberty and self-realisation. This doesn’t bother HMG, which has historically struggled to grasp the basic concept of respecting inalienable human rights.

    Wonder if there’s a Libertarians for Indy group? 🙂

    Transforming our world: the 2030 Agenda for Sustainable Development

    Our shared principles and commitments

    10. The new Agenda is guided by the purposes and principles of the Charter of the United Nations, including full respect for international law. It is grounded in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, international human rights treaties, the Millennium Declaration and the 2005 World Summit Outcome Document. It is informed by other instruments such as the Declaration on the Right to Development.

    “The right to development is an inalienable human right by virtue of which every human person and all peoples are entitled to participate in, contribute to, and enjoy economic, social, cultural and political development, in which all human rights and fundamental freedoms can be fully realized.” (Article 1.1, Declaration on the Right to Development)

    “The human right to development also implies the full realization of the right of peoples to self-determination, which includes, subject to the relevant provisions of both International Covenants on Human Rights, the exercise of their inalienable right to full sovereignty over all their natural wealth and resources.” (Article 1.2)

  143. ayeanaw says:

    Hello Lurkers

    I urge all lurkers to make just one post today, tomorrow or this week regarding how you voted in these local elections.

    As all lurkers know I was your leader, but have renounced my title now that I have started posting 🙂

    In the box at the bottom of this page simply pick your username, enter your email address and put your comments in the big box. Go on you’ve been wanting to for ages.

  144. gerry parker says:

    Thanks Alex, going up to Stonehaven tomorrow right after ward 6 NLC count is complete.

    Then it will be straight on to getting Phil Boswell re-elected.

  145. Macart says:

    All four members of the Macart clan voted now and all four 1-9 in the right order.

    Well done the weans. 🙂 (see under teenagers)

  146. chris kilby says:

    Makes you proud to be British.

  147. manandboy says:

    Theresa May, the UK’s first PM with Artificial Intelligence, and robotic language.

  148. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    In all the typing about which order to put candidates in on the ballot paper, I’m kinda surprised that there has been next to no mention of TUSC as an option. As far as I’m aware, they are pro-indy.

    My own ward previously had 2 SNP and 1 Labour. I think there were 2 Lib-dems in the council, out of 29 councillors. Today I voted –

    1. SNP
    2. SNP
    3. TUSC (a well-known local pro-independence activist)
    4. Lib-dem
    5. Lib-dem
    6. Tory
    7. Labour

  149. Az says:

    I quite enjoyed voting today because I knew what I was doing. As someone else said, no LibDums in my ward either. Easy choice, using party advised order also:

    SNP#1 – 1
    SNP#2 – 2
    Green – 3
    STUC – 4
    Lab#2 – 5
    Lab#1 – 6
    T*ry – 7

    Dawdle, but nice to see the indy favouring candidates outnumbering the parties controlled from London.

  150. george wood says:

    @Cameron Brodie

    Their are Libertarians standing for Edinburgh seats.

    I think they supported Indy1 but they are against Indy2 if it involves staying in the EU.
    It muddies the water a bit on where to rank them.

  151. Millig says:

    Voted in this order

    Lib Dem

    Voting for Renfrew North and Braehead in Renfrew. Chap at table giving out voting papers was telling everybody that voting was preferences not a X in a box and explained it in detail to the person ahead of me. Heard the same advise being given at the other tables in the room.

  152. clan rossy says:

    snp 1-2, greens 3,indi 4,lab scum 5-6,pure scum 7.

    honestly i was raging having to give 5,6,7, a preference
    i genuinely felt dirty when i was numbering them .
    had to go hame and hae a wee lie doon.

  153. AyeAyePatty says:

    Hello wingers. First post from an old Highland lurker.
    Today I voted
    SNP 1
    Green 2
    Independents 3, 4. 5
    Lib Dem 6
    Labour 7
    Tory 8
    My daughter voted with the same preferences.

  154. Lowflyer says:

    Voted today in NE Banff and Buchan

    1. SNP
    2. SNP
    3. Lib Dum
    4. Indy (Useless Trougher that is clearly pro Union)
    5. Indy (Sleeper Tory)
    6. Conservative & Unionist Parasites

    Have spoken to a lot of elderly people today and a large amount of them said they only voted 1,2,3. Left me with the impression that the way the info is presented on the ballot paper, has potentially misled quite a few folks into not using up all their preferences.

    PS – Thanks to all the regular contributers and to the Rev for making this site such a great resource for the only cause that matters.

    Hail Alba

  155. ronnie anderson says:

    Ah wiz gonna watch ah film tonight The Long Goodbye , but it lasts way past August

  156. crazycat says:

    @ clan rossy

    I know what you mean; I hadn’t voted for (or “against”) a SLab candidate since the council elections in 1995, which were FPTP and a choice between the half-witted but relatively well-meaning Labour incumbent and a real Blue Tory.

    This time I did number the two SLabbers, but it hurt, since they are both utterly vile; the only purpose was to exclude the even viler Tory. Only 2 SNP candidates, so at least 2 unionists will get in, with little to choose between them.

  157. solarflare says:

    SNP 1-2, Independent (who campaigns purely on local issues) 3, Independent (whom I could find absolutely no information on) 4, Slab 5-6 and Tory 7.

    And it felt good saving that Tory 7 for last.

  158. Phil says:

    George says:
    4 May, 2017 at 1:11 pm

    “Sadly as I live outside Scotland I can’t vote but having watched one of the videos do have a question.

    If a candidate reaches their quota, how is it decided which of their votes are then used for the second preference?”

    They use supercomputers to work out the answer to who gets what extra votes so don’t feel embarrassed by not easily grasping this nicety.

    Our council, Highland, has the whole vote analysis used last time laid out ward by ward so transfers of extra votes are visible. Other councils may do the same so one might gain insight by finding that.

  159. CameronB Brodie says:

    george wood
    Oops, I wasn’t aware they were an option, I wasn’t endorsing them. I was fortunate as I only had to rank SNP, Green and the three shades of Tory.

  160. Iain More says:

    Voted till I boaked in Heldon and Laich (Moray) and I was boaking quickly. I had only one SNP candidate to vote for and then the Green. After that it was a stomach churning cowk. It was a nice day here and then I popped on the train to go through to Aberdeen and it is a nice day here. No excuses for a low turn out here.

  161. Giving Goose says:

    At Aird and Loch Ness ward, Teanassie primary school polling station this evening, it was going like a Hornby train.

    There was actually a genuine Tory on the ballot, 7 candidates in total. The Tory got 7th!

    LidDem Tory

    I’d have wanted to see the Independents binned at the bottom because they are closet Tories and together with their chums have screwed up Highland Council.
    But you make the best of a bad deal.

    Anyway got a funny for you;

    For those immigrants worried about their future in the UK post Brexit, I have a solution –

    Change your surname to Windsor (worked a treat for a German family).

    I can see a future for Pavel Windsor, Enrique Windsor, Slobodan Windsor and Ahmed Windsor.

  162. Yesitis says:

    What I did on my holidays…

    SNP 1 & 2
    Independent 3
    STUC Against Cuts 4
    LibDem 5
    Labour 6
    Tory 7

    The polling place looked reasonably busy for just after teatime.

  163. Phil says:

    #1 – SNP – new, to replace retiree SNP.
    #2 – L’Dem – has a very good local track record!
    #3 – Ind
    #4 – Ind
    #5 – Ind
    #6 – Ind
    #7 – Ind
    #8 – T**y

    For three councillors.

  164. tobias says:

    I’m not in Scotland so had to vote for least worst where I am.

    Wasn’t STV, just fptp for council and X 3 of 5 for own council.

    used as anti-tory votes…….i don’t think the irt will come off after leaving an x next a lib-dem…

  165. Dr Jim says:

    I’m still mulling over this Theresa May losing her seat in Maidenhead because after some delving it appears Mrs Mays popularity has slipped in that area somewhat and the good and God fearing ladies of Maidenhead are shall we say no aw that chuffed wae their dear strong and stable leader
    Indeed there have been unflattering comments from her own constituents about her brittleness and pointy fingeredness

    Is it Boris for the crown? Hee Hee Ha Ha Mbwaaahaha

    Somebody stop me!

  166. galamcennalath says:

    Tory manifesto comes out on Monday. The Evening standard says …“it is rumoured Mrs May is set to include three cast-iron election pledges that will lock party members and peers into backing her stance as the UK withdraws from the European Union “

    Which stance might that be? Will it be defined, or will it be whatever stance TMay deems to be the one the whole party has to get behind?

    In the 2015 Conservative Election Manifesto, page 74 ….

    “We are clear about what we want from Europe. We say: yes to the Single Market.“

    … quite explicit. Doubt if it will be quite the same nor as clear this time!

    We should watch out for the wording, though. Vague weasel wording might imply they want some wiggle room to go soft.

    Wouldn’t a U-turn to a softer Brexit be met with howling opposition? Perhaps, but remember how they reneged on IndyRef1 promises. We were told the statements made didn’t commit the Westminster government to delivery. They were never made on half of government, just campaigning organisations, individuals, and media … not by anyone important, we were told. They could try the same trick again.

    Will they? I suspect not, but we should be on the lookout for signs!

  167. Keith fae Leith says:

    Leith Ward 13 for Edinburgh cooncil:

    1: SNP
    2: Green
    3: Court proven Liar party
    4: Former socialist Tory
    5: Died in blue wool Sadistic Tory

    Only 3 seats up for grabs, I was hoping for more “good guys” to rank.

  168. Katie says:

    1. SNP
    2. SNP
    3. Green
    4. Independependent nobody
    5. Independependent nobody
    6. Lib dem
    7. Red Tory
    8. Red Tory
    9. Blue Tory Scum

  169. Flower of Scotland says:

    I’m back home.

    So in the Howe of Fife:-
    SNP 1&2
    Independent (cause she was anti Independence)

  170. ChewinTheFat says:

    Voted til I boaked.

    1 – SNP
    2 – SNP
    3 – Green
    4 – Libertarian
    5 – Indy
    6 – Lib Dem
    7 – Labour
    8 – Tory

  171. Clapper57 says:

    My partner went to vote this morning at an Edinburgh polling station and was asked by male volunteer if he knew what to do re voting.

    My partner said yes he did i.e. put numbers in order of preference for each person from 1 to 8 ( There was 8 candidates in my area) ……man said no you only need to do 1 to 3….I know these people are volunteering but it is not their place to advise people how many they should be ranking in order of preference….even ballot paper does not state only need to do 1,2 & 3.

    Ballot paper indicates can do more. My thoughts are if someone tells a volunteer at polling station “yes I know to use numbers and not put an ‘X'” then it should be left there….unless voter has other query re voting.

    It is nice to be helpful but there is a difference between being helpful and…..too much information…..information which is frankly I think a tad misleading and dare I say outwith their volunteer job description.

    God willing the Tories will get stuffed today and also on June 8th…..let’s hope that the Devil will decide today and on June 8th NOT to look after his own….irrespective of polling station volunteers bearing false messages .

    ps. My partner , son and I ranked Tories last at number 8…ignoring unwanted voting consultant volunteer Private Pike’s intervention !!!!!

  172. Garles says:

    Ma Day!
    Get off work early : check
    drive 360 miles from South West swerve by accident at Birmingham. nae bodies stop me the day: check
    Vote Annandale North: check
    SNP 1
    Libdem 2 (haud my nose)
    Labour. 3
    Con. 4
    Con. 5
    staff telling staff to vote all preferences or only one said to the several old dears in front of me in queue.Funny they did not explain to me think it may have been the “I’m with Nicola ” SNP badge on ma lapel.

    Time for bed am knackered

  173. Bob Mack says:

    Voting done. Queasy about even marking the Tory but all done.
    3 Green etc etc.

  174. bleakfuture says:

    Just back from voting till I boaked. SNP 1 and 2, Green 3, down to Tory 10th and last in my list. Had to hold my nose as I went through some of the others too.
    A tory friend from out of town told me that he had voted for the Union this afternoon. Didn’t see that choice on my voting form so put the yoons as far down as possible.

  175. Skintybroko says:

    Duty done

  176. Michael McCabe says:

    Just back from the Voting. 1 SNP person outside and when I came out She had been joined by a green activist. 1 2 3 SNP 4 Green 5 libdem 6 7 labour 8 the nasty party. Managed to hang around a while and passed on 20 wee black books. Hope they made a Difference. No union representitives present. pity as I like a good Debate.

  177. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    Hi Yesitis.

    Good to see someone else giving a vote to TUSC (I think!)

  178. White Van Wummin says:

    1 SNP
    2 SNP
    3 Green
    4 Useful looking Community Council Bloke
    5 Arthur Scargill Party
    6 Lib (why?) Dem
    7 Slabby Morningside wifey type with nice coat I liked
    8 Ranty yoon type Slabby
    9 Unstable close to the edge looking ex-kipper fascist type
    10 Tory cannon fodder candidate in picture with Ruthie

    The last 5 were difficult for me I really wanted an option like – Send them on a one way space mission to the far side of fuck, but that sadly wasn’t on the ballot. If the tory hadn’t been in a picture wi’ Davidson then she might have made it to 9.

  179. Thepnr says:

    Don’t know about the rest of you but I’m in a fairly good mood tonight reading all the Vote Till Ye Boak posts.

    Now we don’t know yet how that will work out of course but I believe the outcome can only be good. I’m not so daft as too think WOS, Wee Ginger Dug and Scot Goes Pop can have as much influence as the BBC.

    But WE do everyone of us, if we spread the message it really does get out there and there is NO way to stop that message because we are the messengers.

    For once it seems, we are all working together for a common goal despite party politics and their petty differences. That is how we will win. I believe the only way we can win.

    I’m looking forward to the results tomorrow afternoon, I would expect both the SNP and the Greens to return a record number of Councillors. The most ever and that is a big boot in the arse for Ruth Harrison and I would like nothing better.

    Then next we get on to the General Election and knock her and her disgraceful party out. Well done all, at last we are working together.

  180. Tam the Bam. says:

    Evening guys from a still sunny Hillhead/GLASGOW (Ward 11)

    Did my civic duty about an hour ago…only SNP/LAB activists outside….SNP chap told me voting had been ‘brisk’…which surprised me as its been a fabby doo sunny day here (I spent the day on Inchcailioch…the ‘burial’ isle ..on Loch Lomond with my Sis and Harry the dog)…beautiful beyond description.

  181. galamcennalath says:

    Brexit looks worse with each passing day.

    “European Union officials fired an opening salvo on Thursday in a “Brexit”-related dispute that could threaten London’s status as the undisputed financial capital of Europe and affect hundreds of trillions of dollars’ worth of financial products.”

  182. Tam the Bam. says:

    White Van Wummin…8-37pm

    “Send them on a one way space mission to the far side of Fuck!”……lol…brilliant WVW….I think this should figure on a pamphlet for the next fight GE “Theresa’s Wibbly Wobbly Way Election”….go girl.

  183. Robert Louis says:

    I’m just on my way out, to vote for the ‘I don’t give a sh*t about anybody else, I’m a self centered selfish rich git, and the poor and disabled can just f off and die’ Tory party, for the first time in my life.

    Of course they will be ranked in LAST place, behind ANY other party.

  184. cctxt says:

    Mid Berwickshire Seat SBC
    1. SNP
    2. Greens
    3. Libdem
    4. Lab
    5 Tory
    6. Tory

  185. Graeme McAllan says:

    Our beautiful country of Scotland sadly brings a wee tear of desperation, sadness and confusion to a simple process, and is precisely why we can never become the shining beacon of democracy and purpose for the whole World – it’s all just a wee bit too confusing 🙁

  186. Balaaargh says:

    Japanese government and business give their views on Brexit. Link to the original statement at the bottom of the article.

    Done my bit and voted. Everyone but the Tory.

  187. galamcennalath says:

    Someone making a point in WoS Twitter … this is the first time in their life they have voted Tory and Labour.

    Just think about it for a minute. Today 100,000s of voters dedicated to independence actually gave Labour and Tories a vote!

    Yes, today was the first time in my life I have put an mark on a ballot next to Labour and Tory.
    Quite a thought, even if it was in the last slots.

  188. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Phil @ 19:39:

    Our council, Highland, has the whole vote analysis used last time laid out ward by ward so transfers of extra votes are visible. Other councils may do the same so one might gain insight by finding that.

    Yes, I hope so too, because it could be very useful for “post-game analysis”.

    (Maybe someone knows for sure, but I assume that they are all required to do so.)

    A supercomputer isn’t needed to calculate the transfers, BTW. The calculations are computationally trivial, so it can can all be done by spreadsheet on an ordinary PC; the necessary manual data entry and programming are both a right fiddle though. (It can even be done manually with the help of a calculator, it just takes a whole lot longer.) Whereas scanning+OCR of ballots and custom counting software make it a relative dawdle. It’s the unavoidable manual validations and vote determinations which still slow everything down.

  189. Big Phil says:

    Just done my duty and I did vote till I boaked, explained the who,what and why for to my wife and older kids so us four are on the team.
    Driving up from Ayr tonight I was pleased to see SNP candidates at polling stations ,so if you saw a Red Transit wi a big happy guy blasting out ‘Hope Over Fear’ ,it was yours truly.

  190. Thepnr says:

    @Graeme McAllan

    There’s no desperation being felt here my friend. In fact just the opposite, enthusiasm because each day we learn and we educate others. I don’t feel confused either.

    There are few defeatists here so wipe your tears.

  191. Tam the Bam. says:

    Sorry..omitted the ‘WAY TO GO’in Ward 11?Glasgow

    4)Scottish Libertarian Party (honestly!)
    6)Glasgow Lab
    7)Lib Dem

  192. Tam the Bam. says:


    What on earth are you garbling about man?

  193. Mark Fletcher says:

    Three very chipper SNP activists outside the Polling Station this very sunny afternoon. No representation from any other party.

    Went in and did my duty:

    Lying Bastard Party (Carmichaelists)
    Red Tory Tweedle-Dum
    Red Tory Tweedle-Dee
    Spawn of Satan

    Passed a cheery moment with SNP activists as I left and felt happy.

    Went shopping for birthday presents and engaged in long political conversations with two nice women who were very receptive. Recommended Wings as suitable reading material.

    Left with some great presents and couldn’t be happier.

  194. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Clapper57 @ 21:06:

    man said no you only need to do 1 to 3

    This kind of misdirection is absolutely intolerable, whether from plumb ignorance or wilful mendacity.

    The advice I personally received here in Glasgow was impeccable, but there have been a few anecdotal accounts on this thread already about such things elsewhere (even in Edinburgh FGS!), which is very troubling.

    If such wrong advice happened over a significant period at any polling station, it could even render the result for that ward invalid.

  195. Still Positive says:

    Voted this morning in my 4-seat ward, Clydebank Waterfront

    SNP 1,2 and 3
    Independent (good guy) 4
    Independent (seems decent- does a lot of charity stuff) 5
    Independent (seems he stands every election) 6
    Labour 7
    Labour 8 (pleased at putting this numpty 2nd last)
    Nasty 9 (covered up the name and filled in the blank box)

    Don’t even know the last guys name!

    Later did 2-hour stint at bigger polling station (about 5 or 6 as many voters use this one.

    Son has been at the bigger polling station since 7 so will find out turnout when he gets back.

    Does anyone know where we can follow results tomorrow?

  196. One_Scot says:

    To be honest you are not really voting for them, you are putting them in an order of who you like the most, to who you like the least.

    You should not think of it as voting for Labour or Tories. All you are saying is that you like theses candidates less than the ones you have higher up.

    By not listing them in your order only gives them more chance of being selected by someone else.

  197. Tam the Bam. says:

    Graeme McAllan….8-59pm

    “Its all a bit confusing”…really…REALLY?

  198. George says:

    Thanks Phil!
    I appreciate your advice and will check that out.
    Good to know it’s a supercomputer and not Jackie Baillie with her abacus! ;o)

  199. Justin f.n. minty says:


    Ex snp x
    Fib dem
    Tory farmer

  200. Robert Kerr says:

    Been and Boaked. Just missed three persons wearing blue rosettes who were on the way to the car park. Pity. At least the labour man inside held the door open for my daughter in her wheelchair.

    Now we wait.

  201. bugsbunny says:

    Doon Valley Ward. East Ayrshire.
    1. SNP
    2. SNP
    3. SGP
    4. Local Independent
    5. Independent (6 miles away).
    6. Libertarian.
    7. Conservative.
    8 Labour (6 miles away).
    9. Labour (next street) (ex councillor finger in every pie).

  202. Proud Cybernat says:

    Just boaked all over my polling station. What a mess. SNP 1 & 2. Green 3. Yoons the rest – Blue Tory LAST (still difficult). Ward up to about 46% turnout which, I think, isn’t bad for Local Election.

    So many people simply not understanding STV system. Putting crosses instead of numbers. Voting for just ONE of their preferred party when two candidates are standing. Leaving all other places unranked. Heard a Labour voter asking the Labour candidate outside the polling station, “Why were there two Labour candidates on the paper? I didn’t know which one to vote for so I just plomped for you because I saw you outside on my way in.”

    I kid you not.

    A really crazy voting system to have when it confuses so many.

    We’ll just have to wait and see how it all pans out.

    Away to clean my shirt now and take the sickness pills.

  203. Kingseat says:

    Right job done.

    SCUM(Scottish Conservative & Unionist Moron)-6.
    Would have liked to mark the SCUM candidate lower but only 6 candidates and didn’t want to risk spoiling my ballot paper as a result.
    Looking forward to a great result for the SNP.

  204. galamcennalath says:

    Tam the Bam. says:

    What on earth are you garbling about man?

    When was the last time you put a mark on a ballot paper beside the Tories?

    Today was certainly my first. And I suspect the first for a great many other voters.

    With any luck, and a good result in ScotRef, we will never have to boak vote again.

  205. Tam the Bam. says:


    So you think Tory representation on your council is preferable to Labour?….I have big problems with Scottish Labour but I would never…NEVER arrange my votes in that order….nevertheless…its your prerogative.

  206. ScottieDog says:


    Genuine question, would a corbyn victory in June make Indy less/more likely?

  207. dramfineday says:

    A song for the Scottish Conservatives? How about “Living in the past” from our own Ian Anderson?

    Voted “’till we boaked” at lunch time in SW Edinburgh….turn out then, very quiet according to the peeps on the scoreboard.

  208. galamcennalath says:

    “Conservative candidates told to refer to themselves as ‘Theresa May’s local candidate’

    Hopeful Tory MPs distance themselves from party name after instruction from HQ “ – from The Independent.

    Is this them doing a rerun of Davidson’s tactic in the Holyrood election i.e. Pretend not to be Tories?

  209. crazycat says:

    @ George at 9.23

    The short answer to your question is that all the second preferences of a candidate elected on first preferences are looked at. The surplus is then divided in proportion.

    eg: if CandidateA is elected with 50 surplus votes, and half of all CandidateA’s second preferences go to CandidateB,a quarter go to Candidate C and a quarter to CandidateD, then B gets 25 extra votes, and C and D get 12.5 each (decimal fractions are used; no rounding up).

    In later rounds it is a little more complicated.

    If B gets in this time, his/her surplus will be a mixture of first preferences and second preferences inherited from A. But the principle is the same – the next preference is the beneficiary.

    Nobody decides that particular votes are surplus; all the papers are re-examined (unless they have no further preferences on them or all lower-ranked preferences have already been elected or eliminated).

    That turned out not to be a short answer, of course!

  210. Robert Peffers says:

    @Proud Cybernat says: 4 May, 2017 at 9:29 pm:

    “Why were there two Labour candidates on the paper? I didn’t know which one to vote for so I just plomped for you because I saw you outside on my way in.”
    I kid you not. A really crazy voting system to have when it confuses so many.”

    Yeah! But! Proud Cybernat, Those, “confused”, gadgies are the same ones who answer your greeting of, “nice sunny morning”, by stretching out their hands with the palm up to check if it is raining.

    It is simple enough to understand that you make your choice by numbering them in the order you like them. Furthermore many, if not all, councils stuck a fairly clear guide through every letter box.

    I’m afraid it is a case of :-

    “Hear now this, O foolish people, and without understanding; which have eyes, and see not; which have ears, and hear not.”

    From Bible: Jer. 5:21 (King James version)

  211. Tam the Bam. says:


    Ahem…despite the fact Iain Anderson (Jethro Tull) spent a period of his younger life in Dunfermline…..he’s a Blackpool boy…..oh…and he’s a dick.

  212. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    I too am looking forward to the results tomorrow afternoon @Thepnr says at 8:39 pm am

    I’m feeling quietly confident that the tRuthless Mayhem Party will get some of the wind knocked out their sails.

    You are 100% correct when you say “For once it seems, we are all working together for a common goal despite party politics and their petty differences. That is how we will win. I believe the only way we can win.”

    Wise words for the forth coming GE, lessons learned from Holyrood 2015 (vote split, damage done) but not this time.

    However the down side will be:

    That the BBC/MSM will be ignore the collapse of BLiS and the hardcore Yoon vote going over to the tRuthless Mayhem Party and produce the usual ‘Tory Surge’ propaganda.

    And we will have to put up with Wee Wullie crowing about ‘winning’ not because they have but because they are the least bad of a bad bunch of c**ts.

  213. bugsbunny says:

    Tam the Bam,

    Her ex mother in law lived through the wall from me and was a demented old bugger who made my life a fucking misery for 8 years. I had to move because of her. I lost count the number of times I had the police at their door. She can rot in hell along with her mum in law. I have nothing but bitterness and hatred towards her.

  214. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    I too am the same @galamcennalath says at 9:37 pm

    This is the first time I have ever put a mark on a ballot paper beside Labour or the Tories.

    But as others have said, I din’t see it as voting for them.

    I saw it as ranking them in order of preference.

    Preference based on their policies, abilities and whether I thought they would best represent myself, my family and my community.

  215. cearc says:


    So basically the japanese have taken 15 pgs. to say that they want everything to stay exactly the same for their businesses.

    Tad optimistic there.

    They even want the EMA to stay put despite there being no possibility of that and the new location is already being decided.

    Guess there’ll be some unhappy bunnies there, looking to relocate.

  216. Chick McGregor says:

    Seems to have been a high turn out in Kirrie. A lot of Tories.

  217. Tam the Bam. says:


    ‘Her ex-mother-in law lived’through the wall’ from me…..Whit is this…its 12 mins after the closure of polls and we (don’t know about you right enough) are keyed-up for the results… that doesn’t float yer boat?…ah well…have a slice of shortbread.

  218. Thepnr says:

    @Chick McGregor

    Fingers crossed that there was a high turnout but less Tories than you have heard of 🙁

  219. dramfineday says:

    TtB @ 10.01. Thank you for that.

  220. Tam the Bam. says:

    Chick McGregor…….10-09

    ‘High turn out of tories in Kirrie!’

    ….I suppose they all turned up for The Ball
    of Kirriemuir Chick…

  221. The Dog Philosopher says:

    @ Proud Cybernat

    Can’t help feel this STV multi-vote complexity will damage the Slab vote more. Most Yessers are on the ball because we rely on Indy sites like Wings etc. Old School Labour types, like you mention, probably rely more on their daily red and the black top horoscope pages. Blue-rinse Tories tend to be a wee bit more astute at this voting business.

    I bet the Greens will be taking great heart from the trust being shown by the hardcore SNP vote. Post-Indy they will no doubt reap the benefit but they must be careful not to align themselves with the Yoons or obstruct the path to independence. Be careful with any axe you grind, Patrick!

  222. Valerie says:

    Good to see all the boaking activity.

    Annoyed to see polling clerks giving shit advice, and it needs reported. They are paid workers, not volunteers.

    The objective advice is you can number as many or as little as you want.

    Did my stint for a few hours this evening at a Polling Station, it’s a thankless task on your own, but just a SNP presence is at least noticed.

    Not too much snark from yoons that I proffered a leaflet, and nice to see some local dogs (and attached owners) I knew, so had a mini rant about folk not knowing how protected they were under SNP.

    Fingers crossed folks, I’m North Lanarkshire, and Slab have as much corrupt shit floating around as Glasgow.

  223. Meindevon says:

    Well here in deepest, darkest Devon I have voted. It wasn’t complicated. No boaking. No mathematical equations necessary. Four names, one big cross.

    However I did deliberate all day…Labour or Greens.

    I’ve said for ages I was not going to vote for any of the main lying, poor hating, always abstaining parties again. And I didn’t. Made my mind up in the booth, mind you.

    Green Party X

    Please don’t let me find that tomorrow Exeter has a Tory run council and it’s ALL my fault!

  224. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    But how did the five and twenty virgins from Inverness vote?

    I doubt that BBC Scotland will get that info from a FOI request…

  225. Robert Peffers says:

    @Tam the Bam. says: 4 May, 2017 at 9:39 pm:

    “So you think Tory representation on your council is preferable to Labour?….I have big problems with Scottish Labour but I would never…NEVER arrange my votes in that order….nevertheless…its your prerogative.”

    It is actually fairly simple, Tam.

    If you have a single ward in a Labour Controlled council that has the SNP close on its tail in the council, and your ward is in an area where the Tory doesn’t stand a chance, you might decide to put the nae chance Tory before the least likely, (second choice), Labour guy.

    The reasoning being that the Tory won’t get in but you might prevent an extra Labour guy in a council that is only just labour controlled.

    The obvious problem being you have to hope that not too many other independence favouring voters have the same idea in other wards and the Tory sneak in.

    However, if it was just one Tory in an SNP gain from a former Labour council it could make a big difference.

    The trouble is, as always in tactical voting, such machinations can backfire.

  226. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    Unfortunately @Chick McGregor says at 10:09 pm the Unionists are always pretty good at getting their voters out.

    Hopefully more Indy Supporters turned out than normal for the Local Elections if turnouts are higher than average

    Yoon turnout may be static/comparable to last Local Election in % terms.

  227. mumsyhugs says:

    Forres voting:



    Indy (sitting no voter – but keeps opinion to herself and genuine local hard worker!)

    Indy (new candidate – eejit but used him as a blocking vote to knock the others further down the list!)

    Indy (ie sitting tory)

    Indy (ie sitting opinionated loudmouth tory)

    Tory (spit)

  228. schrodingers cat says:


    fell and cracked a rib putting up signs in a field
    then fell into the compost heap full of nettles putting up sign at bottom of garden

    up at 6.00 to hang polling places signs and witness ballot boxes being sealed at,

    spent all day outside polling places and collecting turnout figures for 2 polling stations.
    at 5pm started the knockup, 1100 houses in town, 300 knock ups,

    only 2 of us activist for knock ups, 4 in total

    10 pm, witnessed boxes being sealed

    i only have results for 2 polling stations (14 in this ward) so will wait till results are correlated.

  229. bugsbunny says:


    That is exactly what East Ayrshire is. 1 SNP councillor more than Labour with a solitary Tory councillor. Her dead mother in law lived through the wall from me between 2004 and 2012 at that point I moved back in with my older brother. The year before I campaigned against her, as a volunteer trying to get our man in.

  230. bugsbunny says:


    BTW she won and she’s was is a drunken foul mouth. So when my old dear neighbour died and she moved in it started. SNP bastard quickly followed by threats to my person. She at the time was untouchable
    I had shite posted through my door and a brick through my window which stopped when I installed cctv. She’ll get in again.

  231. Arbroath1320 says:

    Apologies for O/T here.

    I’ve just come across this on Twitter.

    Apparently Feartie McFeartie could very well be in for one hell of a … erm … surprise come June 9th folks if this article pans out in the way it implies. 😉

  232. Elizabeth Stanley says:

    I’m in Banff & Buchan. I’ve been inundated with conservative leaflets & a “personal” letter from Ruth.

    I voted SNP X2 rest don’t care.Con at bottom.

    There are a lot of idiot fishermen in this area who think the EU is bad,SNP even badder & Cons will look after their interests.

    Part of me hope they get what they wish.Washed up & floundering on a bleak polluted beach.

    This area was strongly con until SNP made inroads with Eck being a wonderful MSP/ MP.

    I fear this may revert to the cons.Hope not.They seem very in your face.Spits.

  233. Robert Peffers says:

    @ScottieDog says: 4 May, 2017 at 9:48 pm:

    “Genuine question, would a corbyn victory in June make Indy less/more likely?”

    Of course not, ScottieDog. Corbyn is every bit as much Westminster Establishment as every other troughing unionist – including Mayhem herself.

    As I’ve pointed out so many times they will fight like ferrets in a bag among themselves but will close ranks and stand shoulder to shoulder against any outsiders that threaten the Westminster Establishment. They will sacrifice their own to defeat the outsider and the present outsider is the Scottish Indy movement.

    In wartime these coalitions are called, “National Governments”. Now remember the Tory+LibDem coalition formed with the explicit aim to stop Scottish independence and the Labour+LibDem Holyrood coalition to keep out the SNP.

    Do you imagine that the first did not negatively affect the LibDems and the Second negatively affect both the LibDems and Labour in Scotland?

    Let us hope that the present, 3way, unofficial unionist alliance at Holyrood will have further negatively affected all three unionist parties in Scotland tomorrow.

    It is abundantly clear that the last examples of coalition governments, whether at Westminster, Holyrood or the Scottish Local Councils, were expressly designed to defeat Scottish independence.

    A decent Scottish MSM would have highlighted such Establishment machinations for the people of Scotland but the Scottish MSM are an integral part of the Establishment. It really should be self evident to all clear thinking Scots but, for some unknown reason, it seems it is not.

    This from Wiki:-

    “In the United Kingdom, coalition governments (sometimes known as “national governments”) usually have only been formed at times of national crisis. All six coalition governments in the last 120 years have involved the Liberal and Conservative parties.”

    That blockquote says it all, really.

  234. defo says:

    schrodingers cat

    More dead than alive then today. Yer a hero.

  235. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    schrodingers cat @22:42:


    All too literally, it seems. Sorry about that. Mend soon!

    Hopefully the results tomorrow will cheer you up (not to forget the rest of us).

    Then it’s once more to the breach, dear friends, for next month’s showdown…

  236. Cadogan Enright says:

    Le cuidiú Dei, if the posts here are even half representative, e Greens will win a lot of local seats with SNP transfers

    Let’s hope they have the wisdom and long-term thinking reciprocate and to stand down any candidate likely to let a Tory win a seat on the 8th June

  237. schrodingers cat says:

    lol at defo

    im trying to encourage folk into stepping up to the mark

    we need more activists, even if it only to stand for an hour out side a polling place.

    btw, many talked about ballot box rigging. especially during indyref1

    polling agents can witness the empty boxes being closed and sealed at 6.59 am, and the lid closed at 10pm and sealed.
    polling agents can even note the numbers on the seals.

    worth considering folks?

  238. Ghillie says:

    Oh Schrodinger’s cat! Are you ok?!

    My son suggested you might like the Corries’ ‘ The Bricklayer’s Song’.

    Hope it helps you smile through the stings and the aches = )

    Well done for your huge efforts today.

    Thank you everybody for all the effort to get this vote out 🙂

  239. Ghillie says:


  240. Thepnr says:

    @Cadogan Enright

    Too right, if we are ever going to defeat the UK and gain Independence then we need to work together. Petty party politics must not be allowed to get in the way. As one we’re stronger.

    That’s us not them.

  241. George says:

    Thanks Crazycat!

    That helps enormously, no wonder the results take a while.
    I appreciate you taking the time to explain that.
    Hopefully we’ll see some good results tomorrow.

    I’ll say goodnight now :o)

  242. Robert Peffers says:

    @Ghillie says: 4 May, 2017 at 11:18 pm:

    “My son suggested you might like the Corries’ ‘ The Bricklayer’s Song’.”

    For Ghillie and the cat:-

    YouTube cite to the Bricklayer’s Song

  243. Ghillie says:

    Good luck to our Sandy Howat = )

    And good luck too to ALL our pro-Independence candidates = )

  244. schrodingers cat says:


    snp supportersvoting green 3 wont make much difference, greens will win few councillors
    however, if greens vote snp 2&3 will make a difference to how many snp councillors get elected.

    we will know tomorrow know exactly how many greens vote snp 2&3

    i hope the consensus of opinion on social media shows up in the results, bear in mind, that the results will not be absolute, ie, in 2012, 45% of greens 1 voted snp 2, i think if we get 70% this time, it will be a big success.

  245. Clootie says:

    I do have concerns as I wait tomorrow’s result. I fear that my fellow Scots may give any ammunition to the Tory party. I find it difficult to belief that anyone could vote for a party with such a record as that outlined in the article above.

    …it is going to be a long day.

  246. heedtracker says:

    schrodingers cat says:
    4 May, 2017 at 10:42 pm

    fell and cracked a rib putting up signs in a field
    then fell into the compost heap full of nettles putting up sign at bottom of garden

    Christ hope you’re OK SC. You’re an inspiration!

  247. Robert Peffers says:

    @Clootie says: 4 May, 2017 at 11:38 pm:

    ” … I find it difficult to belief that anyone could vote for a party with such a record as that outlined in the article above.”

    I’m sorry to tell you this yet again, Clootie, but it is, unfortunately all too true.

    All Unionists are followers of the Westminster Establishment and that Establishment is like an iceberg.

    Most of it is under the water and out of sight but the out of sight bit is the driving force that the Westminster Parliament is just the public face of.

    Thus there are unionists of every hue and shade from the Loyal Orange Lodge to the Civil Service and Churches who will always by there to blindly do the Establishment’s bidding and the Establishment has no problems in sacrificing them on the alter of English Nationalism.

    Never take them for granted.

  248. Thepnr says:


    Christ hope you’re OK SC. You’re an inspiration!

    No he’s not! He’s just “some arsehole” like you and I too Heedy.

    We all do our own little bit. Get it? 🙂

  249. Ghillie says:

    Robert Peffers @ 11.27 pm

    Thank you for the link to The Bricklayer’s Song = )

    Must learn how to link myself!

    Hope that didn’t count as one of the cat’s nine lives!

  250. Flower of Scotland says:

    @schrodingers cat.

    It must be something in Fife. I fell down steps leafleting in Gateside, skinned my knees and ripped the nail on my thumb.

    It all starts again this weekend!

  251. Meg merrilees says:

    Schrodingers Cat

    Snap ‘sort-of’- I fell down some stairs when out leafletting on Sunday and have sprained my ankle and pulled some ligaments. Tripped outside a mannie’s hoose.
    He came out to find me lying on the ground.
    Good news tho – he guaranteed the two votes from the house, so it was worth it.

    I hope you’re recovering well – shame about the nettles – they’re right wee stingy things at this time of year.

  252. Capella says:

    @ shrodingers cat – what a hero! Hope you are enjoying a wee dram after your hectic day.
    About the count- the computers run software provided by Peter Lilley’s company. So it’s not who votes that counts but who counts the votes.
    It better be 100% above board.
    Long wait till Friday afternoon’s results. At least poor old Prince Phillip can drop off the radar again now that the enforced “sticking to factual information ” purdah period is over.

  253. heedtracker says:

    Thepnr says:
    4 May, 2017 at 11:54 pm

    We do and I am:D

    What I did this time is get a fair few people to vote today who normally dont bother, maybe a dozen. How they vote I dont ask but if every WoS reader has done just this, its all to the good. All it takes is phoning them, over and over:D

  254. crazycat says:

    @ George and anyone else

    My example at 9.56 contained an error (I suspected it did, but was too idle to check; mea culpa), but the principle was correct.

    The distribution of the surplus also takes into account the total number of votes the candidate receives, so it would not be half the surplus that was transferred to B in my scenario.

    The correct calculation is described here: (p3 onwards)

    The calculations are performed to 5 decimal places, which seems a bit excessive, but maybe it has been shown to be necessary.

  255. Inkall says:

    “Aberdeen City Council were offered £80Million, as a gift.To build a walkway and regenerate and pedestrianise the City Centre. Supported by the majority. They refused.”

    Was that for the current white elephant going up, or the previous Wood Group effort to destroy Union Terrace Gardens and the farce of a local referendum on it?

    I must admit the whole Union Terrace fiasco soured me a great deal on the SNP in Aberdeen but I would still vote them over the Unionists.

  256. meg merrilees says:


    Interesting article about a 16 year old Czech girl standing up to a fascist (skinhead) in a demo.

    Her quote: “The main thing that’s struck me is that some people are now calling me an ‘extremist’, that being anti-fascist is somehow ‘extremist’,” she told the BBC.

    They then include a collection of photos of ‘stand off’ photos that have gone viral in recent years… no our photo from George Square on Sept 19th 2014 isn’t included.

  257. cynicalHighlander says:

    Meg merrilees says:

    I hope you’re recovering well – shame about the nettles – they’re right wee stingy things at this time of year.

    Eh! Who told you that?

    This is when you can make nettle soup, the young leaves of most plants are edible as it is only after their first flush/aging that their toxins/irritants become prevelant ranging from painfully irritant to dangerous.

  258. Thepnr says:

    @meg merrilees

    An amazing quote from that 16 year old in your link.

    Lucie, meanwhile, said she was not concerned about her physical safety.
    “Even if something had happened to me, physical wounds always heal in the end,” she told the BBC.
    “But if I’d kept silent or if I’d decided not to get involved, it would have left a wound inside me that would never have healed.”

  259. stuckdoonhame says:

    Dum & Gal Abbey ward:

    1. SNP (as per leaflet)
    2. SNP (ditto)
    3. Green
    4. Independent (has no chance) “deviant” (see 5)
    5. Independent currently suspended from Red Tories (see 4)
    6. Official Red Tory
    7. Keech

    Mr Stuck transposed 4 & 5 but otherwise the same.

  260. asklair says:

    Was going to write a long post, fuck it, got the dry boak when I voted, the bottle of red wine was the remedy.

  261. Thepnr says:

    I’ve loved this thread. Everything.

    It’s true Scotland is divided so we need to unite it as one.

    Let’s get on with it, it’s that simple. Convert a No to a Yes.

  262. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @Thepnr –

    To my shame I have often steered clear of confrontation, even when I knew that someone had to do it.

    That’s why we have to listen carefully to what Smallaxe and others are telling us. Yes, it’s natural to avoid conflict and unpleasantness generally – the fight/flight scenario is just too much for most.

    That’s why, when a ‘George Square’ scenario happens again (as it surely will) we need to be composed, and *remember* what we’ve learned. As and when the circumstances arise, we must be able to see the provocateurs for what they are and respond accordingly.

    At some point, aye, maybe, they will have to be fought physically, but my gut-feeling is that they haven’t the will or conviction. We should forget about the journeymen casuals/neds looking for some brief excitement. In truth, no BTUKOKERs, apart from active/retired servicemen, would even turn up for a real square-go, even if cordially invited.

  263. call me dave says:

    Darn Sarf Prof Curtis notes that with very few results in that

    UKIP shedding lots of votes

    Tories up substantially

    Labour down

    Lib/Dems up slightly

    Radio 4 / 5 combined now starting special election night>

    J. Naughty (thought he retired 🙁 ) presenter

    FGS! Breakthrough in Scotland for more popular Tories… maybe!


  264. Liz g says:

    Sometimes I give up I really do.

    After getting home from my own ward quite up beat (finger’s crossed for Gerry Parker) good turn out and lookin like mostly friendly faces.

    Tell? youngest…. who couldn’t find her leaflet for the voting order of the 3 SNP she wanted to vote for…to try to find someone around the polling station to ask.

    She found one of the actual candidates The Actual Candidate FFS.
    Gives her the order as requested…and then? volunteers …..
    “She doesn’t need to add anymore but could stick the Green next if she wants to”.
    I mean Seriously…..She!!! knew better at least but this was about half nine,too late to try and have a word.
    How many others got this sage advice.
    Nae wunner ah drink!

  265. William Wallace says:

    Me tae Liz.

    Trying to take a righteous stance against dirty fighters fighting a dirty war is hard work.

    Yir entitled tae a wee nip 🙂 Deserving even. 🙂

  266. Ghillie says:

    Thepnr, your happiness and positivity is infectious = )

    Today’s style of voting is a major step forward in folk cooperating again to win back Scotland’s Independence.


  267. Dr Jim says:

    What’s up with Robin McAlpine over on Common space then
    Local democracy’s good but it’s bad but it’s good again but it’s broken and it’s hardly worth bothering voting in it

    Another one that doesn’t get it, you can’t change anything just by moaning about it boxers don’t win fights outside the ring

    Today I met a Labour guy who now votes SNP but he says as soon as we’re Independent he’ll go straight back to voting Labour, I asked him why, his answer was, that’s my party
    I said what if it’s still the same lot you’ve got right now like Sarwar and the Blairites and Dugdale and Baillie
    he said aye but they’ll change once we get Independence
    I suggested to him that maybe the SNP will be to Scotland what the Labour party should have been
    He countered by saying aye but Iv’e always been Labour so I can’t change now, I said but you did, he said aye but that’s just temporary

    Another wee story I don’t understand

  268. ian murray says:

    Nicola getting booed on Question time pretty loudly
    The Welsh woman mentioned her friend Nicola Sturgeon was all it took
    Ironical the point she was making was about the other countries not being respected
    Wigan doesn’t do Irony
    It is around the 30min mark

  269. William Wallace says:

    @ Ian Brotherhood

    I said sometime ago on here that we have got to mobilise the schemes. Casuals (and I speak as one that did his thing in the eighties) [there wiz nothin else tae dae] are not a lost cause in that regard.

    Every crew is made up from the schemes and anyone that grew up in the 70’s and 80’s in a tenement block will ken what I am talking aboot here.

    We were able to drap the scheme to scheme fights (this is the tail end o the Skins and the Mods and that) and pit aside wir differences to represent wir toons and cities. We did this by organising in the schemes week in and week oot. We were able to co-operate in amidst ah that chaos for the common good (as we saw it at the time and however misguided) and pit aside localised tribal loyalties. I genuinely think that we can dae that on a wider scale.

    Mebbe cry it “Schemes fir Scotland” or something.

    I’m an auld utility boy that once saw fighting as a stable currency (Afore the E’s came alang and chilled abody oot) and maist o the auld team that I ran aboot wi are pro indy and that is reflected in my own family and my old circle of pals.

    I ken a lot o guid cnuts fae different schemes in Scotland, either through the futba or the late eighties crossover period into “having a good night oot” where the futba became an irrelevance. Some still drift doon to the Old Bank Bar for the nostalgia and even my ain family amongst it ah. They are no shy to fight but, they are family men by and large these days.

    My point is that the schemes and ex casuals are generally pro indy and that we can probably work together to mobilise the troops from scheme to scheme and town to city but, to what end?

    They would like us to fight. They are inciting us to fight. A lot of us even want to fight. The moment we raise our hands and partake in violence is the moment we lose the case for independence.

    Eh dinnae hae the answers man. Eh’ll leave that to better fowk than me.

    Ah eh ken is that violence is not it.

    So maybe you are a wiser man than me

  270. Inkall says:

    @meg merrilees

    The saddest/craziest part, her being called an extremist, is because of the current madness in America which is all over the media, and no doubt partly the media’s fault.

    American groups claiming to be “anti-fascist” are attacking anyone who is a Republican or a supporter of the President. They are either just troublemakers wearing the name or people who have genuinely bought into the rubbish about Trump being “literally worse than Hitler” that has been spewed all over the internet.

    The issue is that over here in Europe when people stand up to actual fascist and Neo-Nazi groups, actual anti-fascism, they are now getting tarred with the same brush as the current mob in America.

    Even that BBC article almost fell into the same trap. While they didn’t use the current black-block/Anti-fa Americans fighting people in the streets they did use the palatable Black Lives Matter picture of Ieshia Evans. BLM being much the same media and troublemaker driven circus as the anti-fascists all over the American news justnow.

    Now this isn’t the first time anti-fascists have gone too far (radical elements of Anti-Fa groups in Europe have done some terrible things) but the media coverage as this is happening in America combined with internet culture has lead to a very strong polarisation and backlash against anyone claiming to be anti-fascist, often by people who simply see the label and don’t know the difference between the current American situation and the not to uncommon Anti-Fascist counter protesting that goes on here in Europe when neo-Nazis and racists raise their heads.

  271. One_Scot says:

    I take it everyone is still in bed.

  272. mr thms says:

    I just woke up and now listening to Good Drivel Scotland.
    Looking forward to Glasgow becoming an independent city.

  273. Big Jock says:

    First Scottish results between 10-11. Not much to stay up for!

  274. Undeadshaun says:

    I believe machines are being used for counting this year and is why counting doesnt start until this morning.

  275. mr thms says:

    Good Morning Scotland discussing cluster headaches.

    I imagine there will be clusters of Labour, Conservative and Lib-Dem candidates around lunchtime having a collective headache.

    Phil Goodlad next.. now I’ve got a headache..

  276. Ken500 says:

    Another Unionist troll appears. Not for long.

    If the National doesn’t get rid of the unionists trolls on the website. Transferring for the Herald. It will go the same way. The unionists trolls destroyed just about every other website.

    Wings being unionist troll free and Independence supporting has led to it’s spectacular success.

    Thanks Rev Stu for all you do. Amazing. Thanks a billion.

    Just can’t believe Murdo Fraser, ‘No one will come to Scotland’.

    Scotland is the 2nd place destination in the world for tourists.

    Scotland was depopulated by Westminster centrist policies. The clearances are historically documentaries. Since 1928 Westminster has done it’s worst to illegally and secretly take money and resources out of Scotland. In the 1930’s people emigrated to America. People had to leave and migrate to get a job. The £10 passage to Australia in the 1960’s.

    Thatcher in particular illegally and secretly took all the Oil revenues. Offshore them and spent the fund in London. Building up Canary Wharf. Funding ‘loads of money bankers’. Deregulating banking etc which lead to the banking crash. The world banking Laws were rescinded. Collateral reduced from 25% capital reserves world wide. To 13% in US/UK by successive US/UK governments. The US and UK are world bankers. They should be supporting and securing the world banking system. The Bank of England was manipulating the libor rate which sets interest rates worldwide. Alistair Darling was in on it. He should be charged with fraud and put in prison. The UK is the only place in the world where the criminal politicians and fraudster bankers have not gone to jail. They are protected by the State and the unionist crooks at Westminster. The UK Union costs Scotland £20Billion+ a year.

    All the profits earned from exports just go back to the Westminster Treasury. The Oil sector unfair and illegal Tory taxes. Loss of jobs etc. Cost £4Billion. No tax on ‘loss leading’ drink. Trident £1Billion. Tax evasion £3Billion. Paying loan repayments not borrowed or spent in Scotland £4Billion. Scotland not able to borrow. £6Billion. EU Grants not available because of Westminster indecision, extra CAP payments not received. CCS projected not funded £Billions. Total £20Billion+

    Thatcher centralised the transport system through London. Now dangerously congested and polluted. Building 26 miles of Tilbury Docks. Thatcher cut the Scottish budget and closed down every manufacturing facility. Making sure unemployment was lower in London S/E and always higher the further North. Especially in Scotland. Thatcher wrote in official documents, ‘This must be kept secret’. Released under the 30 year Official Secrets Act, Iraq and Dunblane have been kept secret for 100 years. What revelations must they contain?

    The depopulation of Scotland continued until Devolution 2000. It is only since then that the population has stabilised and slightly increased. Now people are being thrown out of Scotland tragically. The Tories have changed the rules. Visas which guaranteed people rights to stay have been revoked. It is just disgusting beyond belief. That people are being. Forced to leave Scotland in such a barbaric way, Murdo Fraser is a liar. The Tories should hang their heads in shame. The pain and anxiety they are causing people. Just disgraceful. Especially the sick and vulnerable.

    The worst migration crisis since 11WW has been caused by the US/UK illegally bombing the Middle East to bits for years. Supporting absolute despot monarchies and apartheid States. There would be a two State solution, immediately, if the US stopped funding and supporting Israel. Putting the burden and cost of the migration crisis on other European countries.

    The US spends a fortune on redundant weapons for Defence. When gun crime is out of control. 26,000 people are killed in the US every year. The Health care system is out of control. Insurance led. The costs are out of control. Private health care often means people are over diagnosed and treated. Often with procedures which are not beneficial. Others do not get the essential treatment that they need because of cost. A two tier system that is not beneficial to all. A public funded health care system. On a progressive tax system. It is much fairer and less costly. Treatment according to need. Not bank balance. The US would be better cutting Defence spending and improve the economy. Cut the debt, The highest in the world. Before the US economy gives over a cliff. Destroying the world economy.

  277. mr thms says:

    Good Morning Scotland discussing edible insects..

    Next up, after the traffic… scraping the barrel.

  278. Effijy says:

    England becomes a one party fascist state!

    Wales becomes a one hopeless party state!

    I can wait to see these headlines spread right across the UK Media, just as they suggested when SNP had a landslide victory?
    No chance! Attacks are just for none Westminster Parties!

    The English have just confirmed that they want no trade agreements within the next 2 years, no matter what, they support attacks on the Disabled, they want to add another million Children to the 3 million already living in poverty, they want to put weapons of mass destruction before people, breaking the triple lock for UK pensions
    and continued privatisation of the NHS.

    Just how Dumb can one nation be?
    How corrupt can the UK media be to brain wash so many?
    How can Scotland’s people continue to endure the controls of a neighbouring nation without morals or the will to seek truth and justice for all?

  279. Robert Peffers says:

    @Ghillie says: 4 May, 2017 at 11:55 pm:

    “Thank you for the link to The Bricklayer’s Song = )
    Must learn how to link myself!”

    No problems, Ghillie. Links are easy. The only problem is with only YouTube. It is also only with YouTube on Wings.

    Here’s the gen:

    Go to the site and the item you want to link to.

    If it is YouTube when you click on the item the link will appear in the address bar at the very top on the YouTube page

    Then you highlight the name of the link in the address bar.

    Then right click on the highlighted link:

    This brings up a wee pop-up menu:

    You then select ‘copy’ on the wee pop-up menu.

    Now go back to your Wings comment, (or any where else you want to copy the link).

    Now right click where you want the link:

    Select ‘paste’ on the pop-up menu and the link is now in your comment or where else you want it.

    Now, for YouTube only, you highlight the ‘http://’ bit in the link and delete it but leave everything from the ‘www’ bit onwards, (in only YouTube links), and the job is done.

    For other links you leave the ‘http://’ bit in the link.

    Another method is to use the keyboard to cut & paste.

    When you have highlighted any item you use a combination of keyboard keys to ‘cut’ and to ‘paste’.

    The keyboard key combination to ‘cut’ is ctrl + C

    The key combination to ‘paste’ is ctrl + V

    Hope that helps

  280. Robert Peffers says:

    @Capella says: 5 May, 2017 at 12:02 am:

    “@ shrodingers cat – what a hero! Hope you are enjoying a wee dram after your hectic day.”

    That was a saying for my old Grandfather.

    No matter what the malady, or injury, his recommended prescription was to have a wee dram.

    When asked, “And will that cure it Grandfather”, his reply was, “No – but you will enjoy having the (insert malady), a wee bit better”.

  281. DerekM says:

    @ Dr Jim

    It is an old battle Jim one that we yessers who were inside the Labour party have been fighting and losing for decades.

    But remove the PLP control from westminster through indy and you can bet we will take back the Labour party from the tory thieves who stole her.

    This can only happen once we get indy too many vermin in ermine to do it before,though i was thinking that after the GE would be a great time to start a fight inside the party hmm sounds like a plan lol

  282. Capella says:

    @ Robert Peffers – good morning Robert. Aye a wee drop of poison takes the edge off any problem – at the right time.

    Sober for the daytime poll count. How different to the all nighter that was the Indyref14. Computers obviously don’t do night shift.

    Looks like the English voters are veering ever further rightwards with the assistance of the BBC and press. What a tragic state of affairs. I just hope that the Scottish results will be an antidote. If so, it will be largely thanks to sites such as WoS.

  283. galamcennalath says:

    Capella says:

    Computers obviously don’t do night shift.

    That’s ominous! You make them sound like paid Yoon trolls.

  284. Robert Peffers says:

    @Dr Jim says: 5 May, 2017 at 2:07 am:

    ” … Iv’e always been Labour so I can’t change now, I said but you did, he said aye but that’s just temporary
    Another wee story I don’t understand.”

    It’s like football team supporters, Dr Jim.

    They support a particular team as a youngster and it becomes, “Their team”. 30 Years later and the team they supported that was then top of the league is struggling at the bottom of the second division – but it is still, “Their team”.

    The reason being that they are NOT football supporters that are, “The ******”, supporters(insert useless team of your choice).

    It is team loyalty and not a choice made with logic and cognoscente of the subject – be it football, rugby or politics makes no difference – they are not fans of the main subject but have a primitive tribal loyalty to the tribe of their youth.

  285. Col says:

    England, you’ve changed. Not for the better. I want a divorce.

  286. Macart says:

    I see some results have rolled in overnight from England and Wales.

    None of them especially surprising given the current climate.

    UKIP, its task seemingly complete, facing large losses and its voter base returning to their natural home. Labour taking hits all over the place and the Libdems a mixed bag.

    Oh, and Tory rentaquotes slagging off the EU left, right and centre.

    Who knew?

  287. Meindevon says:

    Sky news panel a moment ago. The Sun’s David Willetts saying ‘there is a dangerous dialogue’ coming out from politicians saying ‘the media has failed’. He then said ‘there is a very wide ranging, very balanced, UK media’. Every person on the panel agreed.


  288. schrodingers cat says:

    prediction for today….

    it only hurts when I laugh, however

    i think we will see a mixed bag, but it will highlight the areas where we are strongest and the areas we are weakest and should target in the ge

    i wouldnt get too hung up on seat numbers as they dont necessarily reflect support for snp, better to look at the number of votes total in first count for snp, labour etc

  289. Socrates MacSporran says:

    Reading through the overnight posts, I noticed an interesting one from Dr Jim @ 2.07am about dyed-in-the-wool Labour Party members lending their support to the SNP until independence.

    I believe there is a lot of this about. Yesterday, at the polling station, I was speaking to the tiny hard-core of Labour supporters, guys I have known and argued with for over 20-years.

    One of them, a teacher, said: “If the Tories win a few seats up here in the GE, they will take that as their cue to kick Indyref2 into the long grass – now is not the time will become, there will never be a time”.

    He didn’t argue when I suggested maybe Scottish Labour should then declare independence from London and become truly Scottish. But, he did accept, too-many in the Labour Party in Scotland will, through self-interest, stick with London and will have to be got rid of.

    There is Labour’s big problem – stick with London and be wiped-out, or break free and have an independent future. At least, finally, some within Labour are thinking this.

  290. Macart says:


    Many thanks as usual and just in time for tea break.

    Good hols? 🙂

  291. galamcennalath says:

    Socrates MacSporran says:

    Labour’s big problem – stick with London and be wiped-out

    I think there are still too many in Labour in Scotland who believe demand for Indy will subside and their fortunes at Westminster will return. And as you say slowly but surely this view is losing its credibility.

    There will be a tipping point. I reckon when Brexit’s true nasty face is exposed and ScotRef is scheduled, many in Lab and the LibDems, and even perhaps a few Tories, will begin to doubt that there is any point in continuing to support a Union with a dark and nasty future.

    The sooner the better. Labour actually wield enormous power if only they would understand that. If a significant number switched to Indy support than that would be a big boost to Indy, probably almost guaranteeing it. Also they would have a future as a iScottish party.

  292. Flower of Scotland says:

    Schrödinger’s cat

    Hope you feel better today. You’ll be needed again soon!

  293. DerekM says:

    lol good analysis Robert but mainly it is because we are stubborn gits and somebody else has to do it the SNP can not.

    But like any football club you can get the managers sacked and bring in a new manager with a fresh new outlook might even save you from the dreaded relegation.

    Though this slabber team could not beat an egg,an insult to pub teams so they are.

  294. galamcennalath says:

    Nana says:

    Looks like the South British are also beginning to see the BBC (and much of the rest of the mms) for what it is!

    “there has been virtually no other coverage from the mainstream media of this deeply undemocratic scandal”

    The media in the UK see their role as controlling and manipulating news rather than simply reporting it.

  295. Brian Powell says:

    One wonders as we see the chaos of Brexit and the collapse of Labour, the huge growth of Toryism and rightwing ideology will Scottish Labour still look on this yet still stand scratching its arse and examining what it finds under its fingernails?

  296. John H says:

    Col says: 8:33 am

    “England, you’ve changed. Not for the better. I want a divorce.”

    The English used to pride themselves on being a tolerant people, but that was when things were going their way.

  297. Meg merrilees says:

    Don’t read this if you don’t want to be depressed.
    I’m just reporting it in case we ever need evidence of how biased the BBC still is.

    Well, I listened to an hour of the BBCR4 reporting of the election last night (01.00-05.30.) Wished I hadn’t! It was so bad but I was mesmerised.

    WARNING: ‘GE17 night’ is going to be a very unpleasant Tory love-in – hopefully NOT in Scotland!!

    Well done the Tories, into landslide territory here, UKIP vote has collapsed,
    Labour expected to lose Wales, looking at swings – could be double figures to the Tories… no reports from Scotland till tomorrow but Conservatives are expected to gain many seats …
    James Naughtie introduces Ivan McKee, MSP for Govan..
    Ivan McKee MSP for PROVAN corrects Naughtie who bumbles about how could he get that wrong after all these years of course, it’s the other side of the river …
    SNP think they will win control of Glasgow, quickly return to London – no mention of different voting system.
    Caroline Quinn was obnoxious – interviewed one chap who had just lost his seat (Council leader) in Warwickshire. Asked him excruciating questions, really turned the knife in the wound and then thanked him for giving what must have been a ‘very difficult interview’
    Tories could win Wales;
    Pigs could fly, I could turn into a cat… this is the world’s respected broadcaster ?- THE BBC – spouting gibberish.
    No talk of % turnout. Gave up at this point!

    Still going strong this morning, in fact worse – Robinson absolutely loving it. Tories have won Cumbria – Copeland and Barrow -in-Furness. Visitor quips that it must be the first time submarines have influenced the outcome of a Council election.

    Turns out –
    Tory swing is only 8%
    Cardiff is held for labour.
    Labour still the biggest party in Wales.
    These elections were in parts of England which are more naturally tory – the shires as opposed to the cities.
    UKIP collapse – (yet they still have 20 MEP’s doing a lot of damage in Brussels.)
    Jeremy Corbyn’s visit credited with winning Cardiff for Labour.

    It’s all biased opinion – BBC manipulating the results and influencing people.
    England definitely on a different course from us.
    Wonder if they’ve put something in the drinking water?

  298. meg merrilees says:

    Flower of Scotland

    Hope your getting better too!

  299. Socrates MacSporran says:

    galamcennalath @ 9.27am

    Good point, I sense you are correct in your view. It will, take something really special for the scales to fall from some Labour eyes, but, fall they will.

    I recall, my old mate, the late Brian Meek, wonderful rugby writer and one-time Conservative convener of Lothian Region, virtually being drummed out of the Tory Party for suggesting the Scottish Tories should become more independent (small i of course) from London.

    The young Murdo Fraser briefly flew this kite, before deciding to become the Tommy Docherty of Scottish politics. I feel, once Independence is achieved, Scottish Conservatives will be forced down this route, and could genuinely prosper, attracting support from more than the LOL, WATP factions.

    In an Independent Scotland, there will be a need for a right-of-centre party, but, more One-Nation Tories than the near-Fascists who are controlling that party today.

  300. schrodingers cat says:

    labour are very good at clearing dissidents from their ranks, sometimes ruthlessly. remember militant, the clause 4 and the purge of non blairites, in 2012, before the council elections, at least 10 of their glasgow councillors were purged, in somecases with threats from above. (remember mcternan on bbcscotland radio, giving andy kerr and others a sever kicking in public). At the CLP level, many of their activists have drifted away and joined the snp etc, this allows the few remaining activists, who agree with the new direction, to take control.

    I doubt there are many labour activists left in scotland who are not unionist types like hotherstall. there isnt a wing in slab who could mount a challenge to the present leadership and drag them towards an independent scottish labour party.

    No, slab will go down with this ship.

  301. Marie Clark says:

    Ah Nana, nice to see you’ve returned to the fold. I hope that you are well and enjoyed you’re wee break.

    Looking at the English and Welsh results coming in, it would appear that the ukipers have now gone to the Tory scum. Dear God what is going on in England. Can no one see, or do they just not care that they are becoming so right wing, xenophobic, racist, inward looking. It is becoming quite frightening.

    I reckon if the Maybot gets a big majority we’ll find ourselves outside the EU PDG. She’ll walk away, and blame all these furriners for being BAD and nasty to us poor wee Brits, as she would have it.

    I think that’s been the plan all along, no deal, just hard brexit and tough on the rest of us that want to stay in the EU.

    They Maybot is proving herself to be worse than Thatcher. At least Maggie had some intelligence, Maybot is an android I reckon, no feelings or compassions. Just spit out the preset programme and soundbites.

    Time to get out of here folks.

  302. old highlander says:

    Was the story about the duke released yesterday to take the heat off the election fraud story?

    the bbc cannot b trusted.

  303. Nana says:


    I had a lovely time thank you. Good to go away but great to be home. Was back in time to vote, looked very quiet at my polling place. Didn’t see any reps around so I was not able to chat with anyone to get the inside view.

    Anyhow folks I’m not sure what has already been posted so apologies if links are repeated. Have not had time to read the thread.

  304. orri says:

    The problem with UK wide parties is that they’re in a no win situation when it comes to celtic representation. Witness the derision at Kinnock as a Welsh Windbag followed in later years by descriptions of Brown as a One-Eyed Scottish Git.

    Either Scots and Welsh have an influence in the policies of their parties or their only there to act as lobby fodder according to the right wing parties who have little to no foothold. It’s going to be really funny if by some bizzare electoral mischance this election results in a slender Conservative victory dependent on seats won in Scotland and Wales.

    That however is tangential as to why it doesn’t actually matter whether Ruth Davidson was the originator of the infamous “R@pe Clause” or not. The point is that she feels compelled to support it and justify it rather than represent her electorate. Mundel is even more of a pointless windbag.

  305. Meg merrilees says:

    Marie Clark

    I worry you might be right.

    ‘No deal is better than a bad deal’ — We’ll just leave , then!

    GE17 ‘Give me a strong hand, give me a mandate’ — I’ll just take us out now then!

    £60 million bill — I’m not paying that, we’ll just leave then!

    The bullies are accusing Europe of being bullies.

    Waken up England before it’s too late.

  306. flux_capacitor says:

    ayeanaw says: 4 May, 2017 at 6:36 pm
    I urge all lurkers to make just one post today, tomorrow or this week regarding how you voted in these local elections.

    I’m a long time daily reader and lurker of Wings.

    I’ve tried my best to get Willie Young and his cronies out of Aberdeen.
    1,2 SNP
    3 Solidarity
    4,5,6 “Indepedent”
    7 Lib dem
    8 Labour
    9 Tory

    I really wanted to put Labour in last place, but I couldn’t bring myself to place the Tories higher than dead last.

    Big shout out to all Aberdeen wingers 🙂

  307. Capella says:

    @ galamcennalath – yes I’m deeply suspicious of using computers in elections. Had a background in IT and so aware of how easy it is to manipulate the software to produce the desired result. When the software is written by a company owned by arch Tory “I’ve got a little list” Peter Lilley, then klaxons sirens etc.

    Combined with a grossly biased media, lack of exit polls and independent observers then it boils down to “Do you trust the UK authorities to be honest?”.

    The stakes are very high now. For the London Establishment the chaos of BREXIT and the danger of NI reuniting with Eire, and Scotland becoming independent must tempt the cheating impulse. I wonder what checks are built into the process.

    I read on twitter yesterday that the CPS had caved in to pressure to delay investigation of the Tory Election Fraud until after the June election.

    Hope all goes well. But eternal vigilance is the price of freedom, to coin a phrase!

  308. Nana says:


    Indeed England have gone completely mad Marie. I feel it may be worse than we think.

    They are ramping up the hate rhetoric against Scotland, first it was immigrants, then the EU and now we are next in line. My fear is that May will do exactly as you suggest, drag us out and then close Holyrood snappish. They can not afford to let Scotland go.

    During a conversation I had on Monday, a lady asked
    “Would she dare put the army on our streets?”

    I believe she would not hesitate.

  309. Meg merrilees says:

    See previous post above…
    It’s like the script of a Jeeves/Bertie Wooster sit-com

    Boris, you heard what that beastly Mr. Juncker said to me just now?
    Fetch me my fur coat. We’re leaving.

    Hope I’m wrong…

  310. marydoll says:

    edinburgh south
    1 – SNP
    2 – GREEN
    3 – IND
    4- LIBDEM
    5 red tory ( who were electioneering outside polling place)
    6 blue tory

  311. David says:

    Find out later today how inverclyde voted, we need to get the labour party out of control in our council, years of mismanagement here, they had to give control of the housing stock to River Clyde homes, in the last few years new housing is springing up everywhere, there are 41 houses nearing completion as i write this, and hundreds more going to be built soon, come on inverclyde vote SNP, you know it makes sense

  312. Breeks says:

    I predict Tory euphoria for the UK, and whatever happens in Scotland will be spun as a Tory revival.

    It seems in the UK context, it is only Scotland where the Tories have credible opposition.

    That is going to fuel a highly acrimonious General Election, where the Tories can cite the blue wave of UK unity being threatened by the divisive Nationalism of the Scots.

    We are about to suffer a Tsunami of pro Union BritNat Propaganda. Theresa May has to crush Scottish opposition or fight Brexit with her shoelaces tied together. The SNP has to stand firm, draw upon solidarity with Europe, and withstand everything, but importantly COUNTER the UKOK propaganda.

    It isn’t going to matter whether Brexit is a success or a catastrophic failure for the UK, the media will sustain the myth that it is a success. Europe will be the enemy, and Scots siding with Europe will be held as treacherous.

    How will it all turn out? I don’t know. But where are the EU summits and EU Press corp facilities I have been talking about for years now? Where is the battle for control over Scotland’s media airwaves? There isn’t any.

    We have a strong command of our own camp via the internet, but how much influence and reach that has into the Unionist camp is difficult to quantify. I fear it’s not as much as we hope. I say that because support for Indy is growing, but the momentum seems terribly weak. Another YES grassroots reinvention will help us too, but that takes time for momentum to build.

    That all sounds terribly pessimistic, and sadly it is. However it is a phase that will pass. The darkness before the dawn. Scotland has a stout and steadfast headland of SNP governance which will survive this UK Tsunami of Tory “resurgence”. And while the UK landscape will become a very blue and hostile place for SNP and pro Indy beliefs, the waters will recede, leaving a Tory government to face an obdurate EU wholly uncompromising over Brexit, and an equally obdurate Nicola Sturgeon proceeding relentlessly with the ScotRef campaign.

    As I read the tea leaves, it is now too late to address the media defect. Could’a, would’a, should’a,… we didnae. So we are running with the media we have got. So we will be fighting ScotRef against a steep incline, and should not expect to be given fair representation of our viewpoint. Instead we should be prepared for shrill distortion of the truth and vilification. Perhaps that was always inevitable.

    However, I think there is an even larger “unknown” which might, and in my opinion will, come in to play. Frankly, I simply cannot see Brexit negotiations running their course. Brexit negotiations are going to collapse long before the 18 months allotted to them, and the UK could be barrelling out of Europe much sooner than any rational mind would think comfortable.

    The quick exit is not going to trouble Europe, or at least it’s safe to say Europe will adjust to the altered landscape very quickly, and EU to Westminster communications will largely cease.

    The billion dollar question is what does Scotland do in those circumstances. What if we are denied that 15 to 18 month opportunity to build momentum for ScotRef? If Theresa May, on the back of a sweeping electoral UK majority sticks two Churchillian fingers up to Europe and walks away from the table, where does that leave Scotland?

    Who knows? Because we do not have any modern Court of Session ratification of the legitimacy of Scotland’s popular sovereignty. We have no legally binding diktat to throw down like a gauntlet of last resort. That is to say, we MIGHT have an escape route through legal sovereignty, but it’s one for the Courts to decide, which might take months and years to untangle. (So why didn’t we start untangling it years ago?)

    The only ejection seat we have in an emergency is a UDI, and as we all know, that option is fraught with difficulties and acrimonious disputes.

    I agree entirely, no dissent whatsoever, that the perfectly correct thing to do is to put 90% of our eggs into the democratic ScotRef basket, however correct, it’s not the only thing to be doing. I just hope somebody has been canny enough to tuck maybe 7 or 8% of our eggs in the Court of Session basket, and whatever is left 2 or 3 eggs in the Long Shot UDI basket of last resort.

    Theresa May doesn’t do negotiating. If we want Independence, sooner or later we will have to take it.

  313. Robert Peffers says:

    DerekM says: 5 May, 2017 at 9:31 am:

    ” .. and bring in a new manager with a fresh new outlook might even save you from the dreaded relegation.”

    Strange idea that. When I was first lifted over the turnstiles at football games in Edinburgh to watch the Hib’s Famous Five & the Heart’s Terrible Trio you never heard anything about sacking managers.

    Yet there were so many really great Scottish teams and even Raith Rovers, East Fife were competing with the likes of Rangers and Celtic. Scotland’s teams were spreading the game throughout the World in the Scottish close season.

    It was on the park that good football was played and it was on the park that the team captain would change the teams tactics depending upon the way the game was flowing.

    If the team wasn’t playing well they brought in players from the reserves or by transfer for managers only kick a ball during a match to return a ball to play if it is off the pitch.

    To me, if your best striker is off form you do not make him play better by sacking the manager. In fact if you see a team that is changing their manager too regularly then that team is usually a team in trouble.

  314. Macart says:


    Yup, pretty quiet down my way too. When I called in with the clan, it was considered a rush. 🙂

  315. heedtracker says:

    Graun simpers, “Tories make gains,” which is making the wait for Scots results even more nerve wracking. If tory BBC led attack propaganda in Scotland really has worked, Australia could be an option:D

    Australia may be one of the socio economic set ups hard core tories really want to emulate too.

  316. mike cassidy says:

    While we await the counts –

    surely someone could come up with an anti-tory equivalent of this for the GE

  317. Capella says:

    O/T Mr Junker delivers a speech in French because “English is losing importance in Europe”.

    Better book in to your Conversational French classes. Madame May est cuit.

  318. Bob Mack says:

    Looks early doors as if Tories taking Labour seats. The polarisation ?

  319. schrodingers cat says:

    madame May, votre céréale est pret,

    ton dîner est sur la table

  320. Flower of Scotland says:

    Shock there in ward 3 Dunfermline Central as Neale Hanvey, SNP group leader, misses out on re-election. Provost Jim Leishman back in.


  321. schrodingers cat says:

    is there a scottish tv program with the scottish results?

  322. schrodingers cat says:

    snp fife leader loses to tories

  323. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

    Agreed @Bob Mack says at @10:53hrs.

    Unionist Voters going for the Full Fat Union option rather than Union Lite.

    Polarisation as anticipated.

    Interesting to see %s and what the total Yoon vote really is.

  324. call me dave says:

    Lib Dems take two Edinburgh seats 1 SNP + 1 TORY


  325. schrodingers cat says:

    kussenberg ecstatic about tory gains in scotland

  326. schrodingers cat says:

    so far

    SNP: 21 (-5)
    CON: 18 (+11)
    LAB: 13 (-3)
    IND: 8 (-3)
    LDEM: 1 (-1)
    GRN: 1 (+1)

  327. Conan the Librarian says:

    Looks like the nae sayers are voting for the Tories, especially the OO in Cowdenbeath. The grandchildren of Communists voting for right wing unionists.


  328. Gerry says:

    Shrodingers – didn’t the Fife guy lose but to a different SNP candidate ?
    Don’t trust Kunnsberg

  329. john says:

    Hayley Millar on GSM this morning, in a piece about the Lincoln result. Referring to “Theresa”, not “Theresa May”, not “the leader of the conservatives”, not “the prime minister” but “Theresa”!

    Unconscious bias no doubt but telling.

  330. skintybroko says:

    @ Flower of Scotland – FFS that’s not good news, Jim may be known as Mr Dunfermline but he is still a raving unionist

  331. Flower of Scotland says:

    On BBC @bbclaurak suggests Neale Hanvey lost his seat to a Conservative. Not strictly true. He lost it to a fellow SNP member

  332. heedtracker says:

    Laura whispers, you can sense the sheer exhilaration of just being a tory in Scotland today.

    Laura Kuenssberg ? @bbclaurak
    Labour source say Tories on course for huge increase in vote share in Scotland – whispers of lots of anti-SNP tactical voting
    10:58 AM – 5 May 2017

  333. schrodingers cat says:


    i dont have proper data, and as i said, seat count isnt the best guide

  334. schrodingers cat says:

    willie young in bridge of don loses

  335. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @William Wallace (2.45) –

    Just a quick one to acknowledge your post last night. Very interesting.

    I’m no wiser than you friend, and I shouldn’t have used the term ‘casuals’ because I really don’t know anything about that whole scene.

    But I do know this – there’s no way we can just stand there and take it if they try to stage a repeat of George Square 2014.

  336. Proud Cybernat says:

    Just hope the Tories make big enough (but contained) gains in Scotland to put the frighteners on people to get out and vote SNP in GE17.

    Aberdeenshire Council so far:

    After 5 out of 19 wards declared:
    SNP 6
    Con 5
    lnd 5
    LD 1

  337. starlaw says:

    BBC shortbread 11am news “some results are coming in from the council election .. more about this later”

    breaking into programme later to gleefully announce SNP Losses

  338. Bob Mack says:

    If Glasgow settleston can go Tory, which it apparently has done ,then what can I say. I worked there for many years. It is among the most socially and economically deprived areas in the whole of the UK.

    There is only one explanation. Sectarian divisions. It has a very strong Orange Order presence in the immediate area, .

    Seems we are Ulsterising right enough, just as the Tories wished.

  339. Robbo says:

    Early days i know. Clackmannshire- no change

    Annoying thing is the seats are going to tories from labour. I’m beginning to boak again!

  340. Training Day says:

    This is already looking like the arrangement of forces before the final battle many on here have long predicted – self-determination vs a Unionism coalesced around the Tories.

  341. Dr Jim says:

    We should expect some Tory gains and SNP losses we’re getting down to the two party allegiances now where Scotland will be Nationalist or Unionist and policies won’t matter, it’ll all come down to which side you’re on and now that Labour’s gone or going I think we all know who’ll win

    And it will never be the Tories ever
    But really, they know that

  342. Gerry says:

    shrodinger, totally understand.
    Difficult to get data, and Larua bbc is very “telling”.
    Just falling over herself to rub salt in anything indy isn’t she.
    Her background is very interesting also, very close to the establishment.
    I am following
    For the Glasgow count.

  343. Flower of Scotland says:

    Ward 3 results – Dunfermline Central Alan Craig, Cons, Garry Haldane, Labour, Jean Hall Muir, SNP, Jim Leishman, Labour #LG17Fife

    Results Ward 2 Dunfermline North /Gavin Ellis, Conservative and Unionist, Ian Ferguson, Scottish National Party, Helen Law, Labour Party

    Results Ward 1 – Bobby Clelland, Labour Party
    Mino Manekshaw., Conservative and Unionist
    Kate Stewart, Scottish National Party

  344. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    The key is lots of anti SNP tactical voting readily achieved in the lowish turnouts at council elections.

    Council elections are not a good vehicle for us and the SNP/Independence vote only really enthuses on the constitutional issue so any increase for us today is a good result. That of course will not be the narrative in the media.

    The more significant element is the polarisation and the sinking of the Labour Party in Scotland.

    All that said,and being also aware of strains in some areas, this is a campaign we should have been running since early last year and there are a lot of questions to be answered about contentious vetting procedures and why many areas were only able to introduce candidates in February and March this year.

  345. Ken500 says:

    English Councils election – FPTP

    UK GE – FPTP

    Scottish Council elections -STV

    Holyrood election – D’Hondt

    Not comparing like with like.

    The Unionists muck up the Scottish electoral system to try to stop the SNP getting a majority. To make sure useless 3rd unionists and others could regurgitate in over, and over, again. Votes can’t get rid of them even though they can’t stand the sight of them. Useless lying troughers, who cause trouble and just do the opposite of what the majority want.

    The majority support FPTP for obvious reasons. It is simple easy to understand. One person one vote and the majority choice wins. Voters,even politically engaged, still do not understand the other electoral systems. Why should voters have to put a preference anywhere for candidates they cannot stand. When 1st preference votes go in the bin. That is not democracy. It is an abuse of the political system. To put people off from voting because they feel their vote does not count.

    To tie Scotland to an decaying, defunct, Westminster Union of lying, criminal sychophants ‘psycho bastards’. It is just another smear target of the MSM who are so ignorant and manipulating they do not even point out the different electoral systems.

    The first thing the SNP should do. Is get another majority in Holyrood and change (back?) to FPTP. They would sweep the board. The useless unionist and others would be out, No more nonsense briefing etc. Scotland would be Independent in the EU.

  346. geeo says:

    Labour CANNOT win OC in Glasgow just announced.

  347. heedtracker says:

    Shettleston vote tory, BBC Scotland dude in ecstasy, is something to witness though.

    Tory stronghold Shettleston!

  348. Ken500 says:

    YESSSS Willy Young’s OUT. OUT.

    Thanks folk in the Bridge of Don.


    That has cheered folk up no end. It was worth that result.

  349. Flower of Scotland says:

    Ward 15 results – Glenrothes Central and Thornton
    Derek Noble, Labour
    Ross Vettraino, SNP
    Vikki Wilton, SNP

  350. Meg merrilees says:

    My cousin just got elected for Lib Dems in Aberdeenshire – on the 5th level.

    Little bit of me just beginning to wonder if we should have left the Tories off the final number in our lists? i.e. not voted for them at all…

    Ach well we’ll probably never know – better to try than not try.

    Seems quite a low turnout albeit higher than England, and early results calming nerves a bit.

    Nicola spot on again. The GE will be between the SNP and the Tories.

  351. Ken500 says:

    Willie Young result. Hope that is repeat all over Aberdeen. The SNP get a majority. Even though they have to sort out the Unionist mess of debt etc. Again.

  352. One_Scot says:

    Laura Kuenssberg there, clearly absolutely desperate for the SNP not to gain control of Glasgow.

    Enough to make you boak.

  353. heedtracker says:

    There are no words.

    Laura Kuenssberg?Verified account @bbclaurak 3m3 minutes ago
    Sounds like Tories also taken a ward in Ferguslie Park which is one of most deprived places in the whole country

  354. Ken500 says:

    Labour lose outright control of Glasgow after 40 years. Looks like the SNP have done it. So, so chuffed. Happier again.

    YES and YES again. A GE. Then another IndyRef on the way.

    Scotland has awakened up. At last.

  355. geeo says:

    Wetting her wee knickers over Shettleston and Paisley going Tory….Laura Kkkberg not making the obvious connection to Hard unionism O/O style.

    Perhaps she doesn’t know…

    Ukip down south….bye bye.

  356. Proud Cybernat says:

    It’s polarising just nicely in time for GE17. SNP v Gory Tory. The Labour self-harmers have gone Tory because the enemeny of my enemy is my friend. How wrong can they be? Do they not see what’s in store for them and their families?

    Decision Time Scotland:

    GE17 – Bring it on! Cannae wait.

  357. call me dave says:

    @Flower of Scotland

    Ward 15 Fife is my patch.
    Saw Vicky and Ross yesterday to say all the best.

    Happy with that 3 member ward.

    Yup! We all know it’s them or us

    W.Young out excellent too.

  358. I see its reported on BBC election results that the SNP leader on Fife council Neale Hanvey has lost his seat to a tory.

  359. heedtracker says:

    Live coverage and beeb gimps ticker tape result thingee bottom of screen has Cons, Lab, LibDem, PC, UKIP and no, nothing SNP.

    Hard core BBC propagandists at work today, unless there is no SNP now.

  360. Inkall says:


    Great news for Aberdeen on Wully being given the boot.

    Hopefully if the SNP do get overall control of the city the Unionists won’t have left so much of a mess that there is no choice but to bow down to big investors (Ian Wood, et al) and put through any projects that give those investors a bunch of carparks and flats to sell anyway.

  361. John H says:

    Shettleston and Paisley go Tory.

    Would rather the tories ruled for 100 years than see Scotland become independent.

    My God, they really meant it.

  362. K1 says:

    Any other Indy links tae other than BBC? Not prepared tae listen tae Wells gloating over shettleston when we aw know the ukippers hard line oo unionists have contributed to that gain. Shettleston Scotland’s shame, turkeys and xmas come tae mind.

  363. Robbo says:

    That Annie Wells nearly said it there the cow “We are the…ppp”
    when discussing Shettleston-

    Ulsterisation is exactly what she meant

  364. call me dave says:


    Darn Sarf Aunties North British bar chart on BBC1 live coverage has no Lib/Dem on it but it has UKIP. Shurley schome mishtake!

  365. heedtracker says:

    Ulsterisation is exactly what she meant

    And the beeb git kindly helped her along too, wrapping up with “and the Scottish tory campaigned on local issues and Scottish independence, didn’t you Annie? Yes.

    It really wasn’t. But that beeb ligger is one of their more aggressive tory unionistas.

    Another day, another round of tory BBC fraud on Scotland’s fledgling democracy farts along.

  366. Ken500 says:

    The BBC employs some ignorant, arrogant incompetents. No wonder people turn it off. Over remunerated prima donnas who brief against the people. £3.7Billion for that nonsense. Most of them should get their jotters.

    Looks like Tories have increased but as long as the SNP gets a majority. There is not much they can do to muck up the economy. It will be better to get the rest out of the way. A straight fight between the SNP and the Tories. The SNP will win hands down. Scotland will be Independent in the EU.

    How can anyone vote Tory in Scotland after Thatcher is a complete mystery.

  367. Ken500 says:

    The wee troll reappears. Won’t last long on Wings.

  368. Robbo says:

    Seems the knuckle draggers got out in South/North Ayrshire, both hung councils- no surprises there in my wards- rife doon here wae unionist scum.

  369. gus1940 says:

    What do fellow Wingers think are the odds that The BBC will mention The Flute Factor regarding Tory victories in what appear to the uninformed to be unlikely areas?

  370. gus1940 says:

    Well that’s us well into the second day of the blanket media tsunami of vomit inducing sycophancy over the Duke’s retiral from public life.

    I hope you realise that we shall have to undergo a re-run of all that with bells on when he eventually pops his clogs.

  371. skintybroko says:

    There is no chance the BBC will mention the flute factor in those previously no go areas for Cons, talk about turkeys voting for christmas, if those results dont get labour to think again and support indy they are doomed I tell ye, dooomed.

  372. Big Jock says:

    All of this no matter how insignificant. Plays into the hands of the Tories. They see a weakness and will try and manipulate us. I can’t believe how many young yes voters at work I met today didn’t vote. They see it as not that important. I explained that we have strength only when we act. When we stand by the enemy is waiting to pounce.

    What today shows is that the rump of Labour supporters left don’t necessarily back the union. However 8-10% of what was left of labour see the union at all costs, and will vote Tory even if it harms them.

    It’s a messy picture and the SNP need to sort this out. Today has been a warning on a low turnout. Perth and Kinross has reverted to the days of Fairbairn I worry for these areas come GE.

  373. crazycat says:

    @ Meg merrilees @ 11.57

    If there was only one Tory, it makes absolutely no difference whether you ranked them or not.

    Your final preference would only be looked at if all your higher-ranked candidates had already been elected or eliminated and there was still a seat to be filled.

    If those criteria were fulfilled, the Tory would get the seat, regardless of whether he/she reached the quota, because there would be no-one else left to give it to.

    They would only look at the papers to arrive at a final tally for the candidate, not to decide whether he/she had got in.

  374. crazycat says:

    Further to my post above, I chose not to rank the Tory, and thought she might be eliminated early – there hasn’t been a Tory elected in this ward in the 27 years I’ve lived here, though both the voting system and the ward boundaries have changed.

    Then I discover she got in on first preferences! That really is shocking. I thought we were outwith the orangey bit, too.

  375. Graeme says:

    Sturgeon slammed
    Nats bashed
    Sturgeon must take indyref off the table
    tories triumphant

    I can just see it now
    wtf is wrong with the people of this country


  376. Ian Brotherhood says:

    @crazycat –



    Not enjoying the way things are unfolding today.

    Not one wee bit…

  377. Big Jock says:

    Yep this is like 2014 all over again. I had one guy at work say it was better Tories than SNP but he was patriotic?

    Another lets say politically challenged lady asking me if I agreed that Theresa May was the best person to negotiate with the EU. Needless to say she got an earful.

    We are now living with the consequences of and ignorant element of society trying to get involved in politics. Some people think Little England sticking it’s fingers up to the EU is a brilliant tactic. I am really worried for the future of Scotland today!

  378. Big Jock says:

    I never thought I would say this but….I am actually looking forward to June 9th. The STV system has worked in the Tories favour today. Come election night they might not be so lucky.

    I maintain that the SNP should have used the election as a referendum. A straight majority is easily achievable. Another legal referendum with the kind of idiots going around Scotland is not looking so inevitable.

    If the Tories get 15 seats in the GE which now looks possible. Yes we have a majority but it’s shoogly and has a use by date.

  379. HandandShrimp says:

    The results are poor, and I am not surprised. I did a two hour stint at the door last night and it was a slow but steady procession of what looked like a church congregation. Elderly and middle class. The Tories got their vote out. The SNP vote simply didn’t turn to in the numbers we needed.

    I hope this is rectified in June or things are going to be seriously screwed for the ordinary working people of this country and the UK generally.

  380. crazycat says:

    @ Ian B

    Yes, it’s grim, overall. My ward did return both SNP candidates, but the details surprised me.

    They had split the ward to give the new candidate a chance (one of the incumbents stood down), and I was expecting the other incumbent, who had been in for 2 terms already, to top the poll, with the new candidate maybe struggling.

    In fact, she got in on first preferences, along with the gormless Tory who doesn’t look old enough to vote and can’t even spell her own e-mail address correctly on her (no to a referendum) leaflet.

    The SNP man, who has the best record for participation in the entire council (not sure how that is calculated), was only elected on round 7. Since there were 7 candidates, that’s down to the wire. Very surprising. At least he did get in.

    Maybe it’s the alphabetical thing, up to a point. The SNP woman was first on the paper; the Tory last, and the SNP man buried in the middle.

  381. crazycat says:

    @ HandandShrimp

    I share your concern, though our turnout was in the low 40%s in all wards, which is slightly better than 2012 (still poor for the election that has most effect on daily life, though).

    In June it could be voter fatigue/despair that determines the outcome.

  382. Famous15 says:

    You fuck faced froggie hun bastards better start listening because we want a free trade agreement with you shitey cunts!

    Theresa May.

  383. Foonurt says:

    Newspapers fur tampons. Fur fuck’s sake. Noo, oantae 8th Jin. Redd, yoan basturts.

  384. William Wallace says:

    @Ian Brotherhood 11:34

    You are certainly wiser than me in choosing a non violent approach. It wasn’t always easy to avoid violence growing up in a Dundee scheme. The Eighties were rife wi “whaur ir ya fae?” whenever you went visiting somebody ootside the tribe 🙂 (Usually some lassie yiv met at the Grove or Fat Sams the previous weekend).

    You are right in saying that we should not stand there and take it but, you can imagine how it will be selectively edited by the Yoon media to suit their narrative and demonise the movement for independence. Would not matter about the who, what, why or where because we would be absolutely crucified for it.

    Even if a lot of the old lads encourage the young team to mobilise the people in their schemes, the moment it is given a name or has any sort of hierarchy, it will become a massive target. Even if it’s sole remit is to promote independence and protect the indy movement from being physically attacked by rabid OO Yoons.

    As eh say, I dinnae hae ah the answers but, eh am prepared to try and work toward creating solutions.

    If the Tories want to get into bed wi the sort o fowk they are and instigate a dirty war in Scotland, we have got to be measured and controlled in the way that we respond to that. Not to say that we should bow down to it in any way either just that we need to be creative and think carefully about our response.

    We cannae play the game the way they want us to. We are playing fir keeps here. 🙂

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