Replacement bollocks service
Alert readers may recall some articles last August in which we highlighted the total pig’s breakfast Scotland’s media had made of reporting ScotRail punctuality figures, centred around mistaking the “on time” figures (trains arriving within 59 seconds of their scheduled time, ie at the advertised minute) for the “PPM” figures (trains arriving within five minutes) which are the basis of official punctuality targets.
Several newspapers, including the Herald, Courier, Daily Record and Daily Mail, had to publish corrections after our articles, so we can be pretty sure they won’t have made that mistake again with the latest stats.
Can’t we?
A Daily Record piece today starts by reeling off a list of terrible PPM target failures for trains in the Stirling area “in recent months”.
But the problem – yet again – is that those AREN’T the PPM figures. The most recent ones published by ScotRail for the stations cited in the article, as always in the form of a 12-month rolling average, are:
Crianlarich: 78.4% (not 59.3%)
Dunblane: 91.2% (not 70.1%)
Stirling: 91.5% (not 64.4%)
So just some idiot hack who doesn’t know what they’re talking about? Nope. The very next paragraph shows that the Record IS aware of the difference between “on time” and PPM, but has mixed them up anyway.
Which means that while the Record’s headline covers itself by blaming it all on an idiot Tory MSP, the strapline – “Statistics show that only 64.4 per cent of train arrivals at Stirling were on time – with the target set at 91.7 per cent” – is a deliberate flat-out lie.
That’s because the 64.4% figure has absolutely no relationship to the 91.7% target. They are completely different measures. For the 91.7% target, the figure actually achieved was 91.5%.
Of course, falling short of your target by 0.2% doesn’t make much of a story. So even when you know you’re lying to your readers, you can spice the story up by giving them the wrong stats, knowing that you’ll get away with a tiny correction later in the week that nobody will notice, and readers will be successfully given a false impression of a rail service doing a lot worse than it really is, and which is in fact the best-performing anywhere in the UK.
But we should give the Scottish media credit for one thing, we suppose – it delivers misleading, inaccurate stories about rail punctuality (and apologies for them) with a flawless regularity and reliability that ScotRail could only dream of.
Scottish press “On the Last Train to Bollocksville”, again.
Dont worry if your trains late, you can allways throw yourself under a bus, they come every 15 minutes
Oddly, they don’t understand why their sales figures are …
Sighs, back to work.
Some habits can become addictive, and for D Clegg and the Daily Record w.anking seems to be the thing.
Is there any other country in the world where 95% of the press circulation is anti the government or has the “the strongest Parliament in the world” whose electorate gets the bulk of its news broadcast from a foreign capital?
However two good stories on front page of the Herald Jim McColl revealing that he has to go to London to see anyone in RBS and confirming that no Scottish banks exist anymore and as a result Scotland’s small businesses are getting a raw deal.
Also BP has made two significant oil finds, one west of Shetland and another in the central North Sea that could extend production by more than three decades with output doubling to 200,000 barrels a day within two years.
Meanwhile the Hootsman has yet another puff for Ruth Davidson including editorial basically claiming she is a world statesman.
Obviously they didn’t see her car crash interview on STV
You have to give the meeja credit for shear tenacity… or maybe not.
Because of the upgrades/electrification of the line, the service to Stirling and particularly Alloa can be affected, especially late at night at weekends. Everybody knows that as we were all lettered about the work. It is a major project involving a lot of bridge work, so obviously disruption and delays are inevitable, if for no other reason than railway workers safety.
On a slightly different by parallel one,
Eleanor Bradford was on BBC Radio (shock horror) complaining that she had to leave the BBC, despite being assessed as a model employee, because men doing the same job were being paid more.
I think her job at the BBC was outsourced to the Scottish Office, who seem to be writing all the Press articles via their private timed Press Releases.
Just checked the Record’s figures myself and – em – I have to agree with the Record this time. (That’s a first).
The punctuality figures they’ve published for Stirling are perfectly correct.
Stirling, Australia that is.
“I am not upset that you lied to me. I am upset that from now on I can’t believe you’ —Nietzche.
A season ticket in lying? That is what the media have.
This is an eye-opener..
https://energy.economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/oil-and-gas/bp-makes-two-discoveries-in-uk-north-sea/62718274
Macart
Shear tenacity is totally spot on – as in shear in the sense of sheep, because that is all the Daily Record is.
A big sheep with a herd mentality.
Of course the sheep dog is a certain border collie, name of Mundell and the shepherd is a collective based in Westminster, London.
Of course the Daily Record sheep has been de-balled – quite willingly.
Are Network Rail not responsible for delays caused by line improvements? Isn’t that a reserved matter? I don’t understand why Scotrail are held responsible for Network Rail problems.
Why don’t the rail unions sue these bastards.
The teachers union should sue the unionist council who are using the statute of limitation (class size 30) as the norm. To keep classes high and cut £Millions from education funds allocation. Cutting teachers and additional needs facilities. It is illegal. Not providing essential services and funding grotesque projects of no value. A total waste of public funds.
To be fair, very stupid people can copy a definition without understanding it. The Record is a notoriously stupid paper.
On the other hand, it could be fake news lies.
Either way, not worth the paper it is printed on.
It does seem that the SNP bad has morphed into Everything in Scotland is bad as the media increasingly look like they are trying to paint as negative a picture of what should be their own country as they can. The BBC ran the story on Scotrail having performed poorly but in the last sentance acknowleging that actually Scotrail had amongst the best perfomance figures of any of the rail franchises (excluding the largly irrelevant ones for East Coast and other express franchises which largely get priority treatment to make sure they are on time). It was like they’d got a memo saying keep making Scotland bad stories from somewhere. I’m aslo glad about Jim McColl’s comments on RBS. The bank is run by the UK government and increasingly looks to be pursuing a scorched earth policy with regards to it’s retail bank in Scotland. By the time it returns to some kind of private ownership it will have destroyed it’s customer base in Scotland which starts to look like the objective of the current board.
Must be transport week for the MSM, the BBC lead the pack yesterday with story regarding satisfaction figures. They forgot to mention this figure is always lower in the autumn, plus they compare another area figures from autumn to autumn to indicate a rise, forgetting to mention the autumn to autumn figure in Scotland also rose.
To hide this rise they state it is the second worst figure ever recorded, no mention it is a fairly small sample of travellers (1400) and the figures are probably within the margin of error to effectively be the same.
I think we can see the intention.
The Scottish media is doing a brilliant job at their self-appointed task of delivering 99% of fake, semi-deniable news stories on time (for the early edition), on budget (sometimes), and of course on the front page. 🙂
They may be idiots, but idiocy does not fully explain this behaviour.
They are downright evil, Scottish -hating, twisted liars with a dark agenda. A very dark agenda indeed.
There are lies, Lies. LIES and DAMNED LIES.
The media in Scotland including BBC/STV are all covered by the last version … DAMNED LIES!
The BBC/STV and their mates in the print media are incapable of:
a) investigating an article
b) questioning press releases from RED/BLUE Tories
c) covering a POSITIVE story about Scotland
d) recognising the difference between Railtrack effects on train times and Scotrail effects on train times
e) recognising their inbuilt hatred of the Scottish government/SNP
f) producing an article WITHOUT bias towards their beloved union
g) asking hard questions of the RED/BLUE Tories
h) recognising that people in Scotland are sick to the back teeth of their constant LIES
Hey apart from that they are all well on top of the story about train times and their punctuality after all they have all carried out a ruthless investigation and their own research into train punctuality … right? 😉
Hope folks will excuse me if I do not hold my breath waiting on this to happen. 😀
A lot of Scots are going to be very upset when this Parallel Universe created by the Media suddenly dissolves before their eyes
This was evident just before the 2014 vote in the last days we suddenly heard a lot of baffled english folk expressing real surprise about what could very well happen , the expression How did it get to this stage and what the hell is going on , this was because the media in general thought it was in the bag , the exact same thing is happening to a lot of scots right now .
The scottish media have painted an entirely false picture of what is going on , they cant keep up this pretence forever .
There will be tears before bedtime , a lot .
@Giving Goose
Whether simply lazy or dishonest, the message is ALWAYS the same – SNP bad.
There are two inevitable consequences of this approach. Firstly there’s the ‘cry wolf’ syndrome. If the SNP ever did truly go over to the dark side, who would now believe it other than those already tribally opposed to their existence? Constant misdirection and misrepresentation simply leaves the public less and less inclined to trust in the word of the media.
Secondly, the constant failure to represent at least fully half of the population and the fall in trust results in people walking away from your product. Where they are refused an ear or a platform, then people will make their feelings known by withholding their financial and moral support. Your business fails. Your profession is shunned. Your word and your opinion discounted.
Their choice right enough, but their narrative HAS created the current climate. They have no one to blame but themselves.
Just to add, the MSM are champing at the bit for the January figures as the flooding will make probably great headline numbers.
As for Virgin, I suspect the compensation they receive will be higher for a network rail delay than a local Scotrail service. So the priority to not delay them is probably higher.
MSM, a bag o weeds in a nation
Capella
Because laying blame at Westminster’s door on a reserved issue would not suit the anti-SNP agenda.
The m.s.m.,what a bunch of fannys!
We are ill served by them, and amazingly they are a dying industry.
They’re making it up as they go along!
Which democratic body is charged with holding the BBC to account? None in effect. They are treated with kid gloves, self-governing, much like the Royal family.
It’s getting weirdly obvious-
that constant BBC editorial bias promotes ONE SIDE across a range of fundamental constitutional political issues.
Cheap political point scoring has replaced investigation. Complicity with bullying bosses isn’t acceptable under modern management principles.
Has job security become more important, the main driver, above it’s published codes,public standards and social charter. Is HR actually running the show.
Who let the BBC become so politicised? The UK Labour Conservative Liberal Loyalist and Unionist Party and generations of their nominated members.
Nothing against the BBC as programme makers, but the Corporation actually belongs to us, not the Establishment.
We should wrestle it from their malignant grip.
I had a bit of a of a laugh when I saw this about a Tory.
Rich farmer Peter Chapman MSP will be holding a street surgery and his team will knock on doors of PRE-SELECTED streets does that mean that it will be only Tory streets.
However should you wish to speak to Peter and he is coming to your SETTLEMENT,I wont go on but SETTLEMENT.
PS You wont hear Davidson speak about this troubled boy sent to secure unit all the way from Kent to Scotland.
More lying by Britnat papers. Glad I don’t buy Britnat propaganda. Like the staff in Scotland’s NHS the staff of Scotrail will be fumin’ at such Britnat lies.
Another day, another UK 4th estate fraud on Scotland. Anyway, Scotland’s rail network light years behind England’s, let alone the rest of Europe. As soon as touch down in Holland say, oh god.
Its hard not to wonder what on earth’s been going on at the decider level of Scotland for a long time. In Aberdeen, right at the beginning of the not Scots oil boom, they built new Aberdeen airport the wrong way round, making it impossible to get the train to catch your flight. Taxi drivers got rich, it takes hours to get to the airport by car, Hadigan roundabout became the most stared at roundabout in the known universe.
All down to, its good enough for you, shut up.
Iain , dying indeed but it seems like a protracted death.
Was it not Edmund Keane who used to ‘die’ a couple of times on stage for the audiences enjoyment?
Hope the msm doesn’t indulge . I would prefer one fast one – that would give me great enjoyment.
Increasingly, an article on any subject which uses statistical evidence to ‘prove’ the point it is making is probably lying, or intending to mislead.
This is a dangerous trend because it means increasingly we can’t trust any source of information.
On a positive note it does mean that we have to think about what we’re being told rather than just accepting it as true.
There could be long term benefits in that.
I wonder if the strategy behind those lies and distortions from the Britnat media and politicians is not only to mislead the general public.
But also as a means to wear us their opponents down as well so that we become so exasperated that we give up
trying to expose them?
Sorry for going o/t so soon but
A warning to those tempted to browse the debate in the house of ill repute ( lords ) your countries freely elected government is presently being savaged by Labour benefit scrounging rejects , this looks like three days of misinformation Lies and general we hate the SNP ( Colin would be in his element ) I wonder if he has a season ticket ? .
All gleefully received by (when they are actually awake ) the elite of the country whose very existence is a total affront to acceptable democracy , Is it appropriate for a jewellery punter and female support seller to have more input than our first minister ,
There must be a system ,any system that puts this Pantomime in its rightful place a handy BIN .
The reason I help contribute to the Rev is that he gets down in the trenches daily to fight this sort of damaging propoganda.
Whilst I used to contribute to Bella and Common space I find that they have become more focused on “cerebral” reporting and giving the Brit Nat side an airing. I feel they have enough media time and space as it is.
I have sadly looked at figures like Loki being bought off. And I can see the beginnings of it in Angela Haggerty as she tries to increase her media footprint by expanding Common Space.
There are soldiers and there are conscripts. The Rev is the Special Forces section of the Indy movement. Nothing, and I mean nothing comes close to the work he does.
Hey, ‘Scottish’ so-called ‘journalists’, and all you
journalistspaid liars at the anti-Scotland BBC, take note;Scotland has the best performing railway service of any across the entire UK.
Scotland has the best performing health service of any across the UK.
These are hard FACTS, Please try to get accustomed with them.
It really isn’t difficult – unless of course you are deliberately lying to the people of Scotland.
Another day, another fake news story. Wonder what the next fake news nonsense will be. We won’t have to wait long to find out!
Transport, health, education, or policing – anything devolved is fair game for fake news. Funny how there is much less fake news about reserved matters!
Does North Korea actually have more fake news that we get in Scotland?
It might. However, is that the kind of comparison which should even enter anyone’s mind!?
@ Brian Powell – an information campaign on what is devolved and what is reserved wouldn’t go amiss. Train passengers and broadband users are particularly misled. A Wee Infrastructure Book would be handy.
As per usual with these everything in SNPland is bad pieces, context is important too.
Anyway, it’s easy to chuck out a load of figures, add a couple of dodgy percentages and expect most folk to grasp the fact that another non-story is doing the paper rounds.
With a bit of luck more will be turned off at the dire news and start to wonder why Scotland is so crap!
O/T, but important.
BP says oil output will double in the North sea.
Oh no, we all know how terribly terribly bad the oil is for Scotland, so we will as usual, have to hand all revenues over to our colonial masters in London, since it is too dangerous for Scotland to get the money.
I mean imagine if we were in the position Norway finds itself in, with untold wealth, due to it retaining and wisely investing its oil revenues. Just as well we give all our oil revenue for free to England.
https://www.fircroft.com/blogs/massive-find-for-bp-could-radically-extend-life-of-north-sea-oil-83131914017
Norway sovereign wealth fund (from oil). Read it and weep. Then demand independence from the thieving lying sc*m in London.
LINK : https://www.nbim.no/
Which idiot MSP was it this time? Let me guess… Annie Wells, Myles Briggs, Jamie-Lee Greene, James Kelly, Alex Cole-Hamilton, Willie Rennie, the Labour leader, Kezia Davidson, Jackie Baillie… and so it goes on.
So many idiot MSPs… so little time
Newspapers make up lies then Television reports those same lies as News then Television have special news programs to report on the lies the newspapers make up and even name these programs *Press previews*
Anyone who’s ever watched a *Press preview* will be aware they have “journalists” as guests to review the reviews of the newspapers they work at, so when repeating the lies they or their chums originally made up there are key words they begin each review with and they are these “This is a very interesting piece” that’s code for this is completely and totally a fabrication, another is, “In this piece he says” that means I’m distancing myself from what he says because it’s a lie and easy to see through if you have half a brain and I’m not stupid
In the homes of the people who think the news is the news and I should add not always because they are Nitwits, but because they might have busy lives and trust in the media that they’re not being lied to, this group of people are so confounded by the barrage of *Guff* coming at them can’t envisage a group of people “journalists” as doing anything as subversive as feeding them a load of makey uppy nonsense
Where do “journalists” find the time to make all this stuff up they might ask and why, well the why is an easy answer, they don’t work for us
The investigations they carry out are mostly done by investigating each others makey uppy stuff and regurgitating it but in a slightly different way so as not to appear as though they spent the day in the Pub talking to each other and not as most people think trudging the mean streets sporting a well placed fedora at a rakish angle and a press pass tucked into their hatband, and the men dress even worse Boom Boom!
When the Newspaper Boss says, his boss, y’know the secret Boss who owns the newspaper has been instructed by another Boss y’know a British Nationalist politician Boss to instruct his minions “journalists” to make up some SNP Baad stuff
That’s exactly what they do, and remember most of these “journalists” never left school so playground lies just come easily and naturally to a bunch of never experienced life Wee Nyaffs that most of the rest of us would have ignored at school or punched them in the face at 4 o’clock for being
Wee Nyaffs
Disclaimer: There are some decent Journalists out there but unfortunately there don’t seem to be any in Scotland they’re in other countries reporting actual news
@Scott says, Red Tory Better Together stalwart Dr or it Professor or is it Councillor Scott Arthur has yet another long rambling letter in Edinburgh Evening News which seems to be his personal manifesto without any explanation as to the cost of his wish list or how it is going to be paid for.
Capella
I asked the Head of a Modern Studies Dept why the issue of devolved and reserved powers wasn’t taught in school since 1997.
There was no real answer, just that pupils found info about the voting system boring, the voting system wasn’t my question. A simple list would have done.
I suspect that as the teaching profession was dominated by Labour it wasn’t in their interest to make it clear. LOLZ
During the Ind Ref I wrote a letter to the local paper, they were doing a series on the issues, laying out quite simply what was reserved and devolved. It wasn’t printed.
It would seem there was a concerted effort to keep the public ill informed.
Any truth in the rumour the North Korean news agency have their own office in Pacific Heights on the banks of the Clyde and are given daily instruction in the latest methods of disinformation presented by Mr Brian Taylor , these seminars are of course a requirement and are indeed a prerequisite of employment by every Scottish media outlet .
A load of tosh ? , Is it really , someone is pulling the strings and it ain’t Fluffy .
As massed ranks of UKOK professional liars endlessly monster Scotland, what is really happening under UK rule Britannia stuff,
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-01-30/brexit-exposes-u-k-to-worldwide-raid-on-airbus-wing-production
@ Brian Powell – I would have thought the job of a Modern Studies teacher is to make subjects, which may sound boring but are essential, interesting.
They could use role play, mock elections, QT sessions etc to engage the pupils in the type of media output we are all subjected to. Young people like acting out TV personalities.
If schools only taught subjects teenagers are interested in the curriculum would be nothing but football, sex and celebrity gossip.
Britnat politicians just can’t help themselves:
http://www.thenational.scot/news/15909603.Neil_Findlay_just_made_himself_look_stupid_on_Twitter_____again/
Re: Robert Graham at 1154am.
See archived link below.
The Scottish Criminal Records office – which just so happens to be located – guess where? – Pathetic Quay, Glasgow, literally right next door to the BBC.
Reported here, in some trashy British Nationalist rag in 2005;
http://archive.is/OZwYP
This report is freely and openly available on the internet (just in case anybody panics). The location of the criminal records office, is also public information.
https://www.yell.com/biz/scottish-criminal-record-office-glasgow-6641971/
How long is this going to be allowed to go on for every day lies and fraud about Scotland ??? The SNP government have a legal and moral duty to defend Scotland and her people against this sort of thing we all know that broadcasting is a reserved matter but telling lies is not reserved its criminal and should be treated as such come on SNP do something about this it has gone on for to long I mean what have you got to lose you could not get any worse press reports than you already do
So once again we have a Labourite rag boosting a Tory politician of little merit. You really have to wonder how those Corbynite acolytes of “renovated” Labour manage to square that particular circle.
But then, when your benighted Northern Accounting Unit has to rely on the support of the toffs of SiU, I guess anything’s possible.
Brian Powell says:
It is all very odd, unawareness after all this time of who is responsible for what.
Clearly a lot of BritNat politicians seem challenged to understand reserved versus devolved! They almost always campaign in elections using the wrong issues.
I suspect part is the problem lies with what devolution actually is in the BritNat mind. It was intended to give the appearance of democracy but to keep Scotland in line with UK. There should be no deviations, the same BritNat parties should rule, there should be little need to know which parliament does what!
So educating everyone about who does what is counter to BritNat plans.
@ Brian Powell – it WAS taught in our Modern Studies dept from 1997 to at least 2006 when I retired. Three teachers – one right-wing Labour, one DK/never said and one SNP – as accurately and dispassionately as possible. We were aware of some anti-SNP colleagues in different subjects in other places who were well-connected to the EIS/Labour Party cohort who were a bit less balanced.
People forget the detail as most people are not that interested.
It’s the same with sex education, which I also delivered. I did say to my pupils that if any of them dared to go on telly and claim “but the school didnae teach us onything about …..” I would be straight on the ‘phone to the TV station to put them right.
The problem lies (see what I’m doing!) with the media who don’t bother with accuracy and publish bollocks from pro-union sources without any analysis or criticism. LYING by ommission, distortion or commission is lying – we also taught our pupils to look at WHY a story was being reported in a particular way. They may have forgotten, or deny it.
If I was still teaching I would be including web pages and blogs in Modern Studies lessons, including data from WOS.
See the SNP and the Greens have agreed the budget.
A lot less painful or protracted than the green ink brigade were hoping 🙂
on the subject of BBC Scotland – how much of Donalda’s meagre budget for BBC Scotland is spent on the English football which fills our screens with increasing regularity?
Robert Louis says:
31 January, 2018 at 11:48 am
O/T, but important.
BP says oil output will double in the North sea.
oh, NO!!!! Poor Scotland that we should have to suffer so!!!!
The Tories are taking £Billions out of Scotland. Ruining the Oil & Gas sector with high Tory taxes. 40% since Jan 2016. The Tory unionists ruling the Scottish economy. Taking £20Billion a year out of the Scottish economy in misappropriation andmismanagement. An absolute disgrace. £40Billion trade with the rest of the UK is another lie. Take off the cost of production and international trade to get the real figures. Scotland trades £11Billion with the EU and £10Billion+ in EU grants and ECB investments. More pro rata. An EU 400million market. Scotland will lose more than £8Billion a year without EU membership.
The Westminster criminals use Scotland as a dumping ground for nuclear waste and weapons. They are a disgrace
PMQs is just SNPbad. Set up by a question by one of tRuthlesses bawbags, who got a pat on the back(really), after he lied about the highest taxed region of greater England again. Then after a sensible question from Ian Blackford, another smear on the SG. Get us out of this shithole
”A deliberate flat-out lie.”
Just like the one that they told the Scots prior to voting in the 2014 Referendum, AFTER postal votes had been sent out / returned. Namely the pack of lies ‘VOW’ that never delivered at all.
A so-called VOW given by three key politicians, Cameron, Miliband and Clegg, who’ve all disappeared into oblivion along with Darling and Brown, following the duping of Scots. Just as the Corbyn’s of this World will eventually jigger off too.
Waken up folks and STOP BUYING THE DAILY RECORD.
Buy THE NATIONAL and start SUPPORTING the SNP.
……………………………………..
O/T
(Yesterday) – Legislation: European Union (Withdrawal) Bill – Second Reading (day 1).
This goes on for 11:30 hours with most speakers, including Tories, absolutely lambasting Treeza May and her party over the Brexit fiasco.
http://www.parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/a02ed460-1112-4806-aa75-ad88d9c86958
Or if you want to get the gist of what was going on re. Scotland check out this page. For example what Lord Hope has to say, such as ”Henry V111 didn’t go to Scotland. Cromwell did.”
http://www.parliamentlive.tv/Search?Keywords=&Member=Lord+Hope+of+Craighead&MemberId=2004&House=&Business=&Start=30%2F01%2F2018&End=30%2F01%2F2018
……………………..
Then use the same search page to check out:
Baroness Evans opening speech.
Lord Steele (one of the better speeches on our behalf).
Lord Wallace of Tankerness.
Lord Campbell of Pittenweem.
Forsythe (a couple of minutes only spent on raging at everyone downing the Tories, including Tories, lol).
Baroness Liddell (”look out, Brexit is a gift for the separists” – that’s us in case you didn’t know. Not them who are separating from Europe).
Lord Foulkes (looks and sounds as though he’s half-scooshed).
Lord Empey (Ulster Unionist – look out, Lord Foulke’s advice could lead to Sein Fein vetoing Brexit).
Lord Purvis of Tweed.
Baroness Finlay (Faced with a constitutional crisis).
Duke of Montrose (His focus is on Scotland, agriculture, fisheries and Rural Affairs – 45 of the 111 articles under threat relate to A, F & RA’s.
How’s the book running on what time Colin Alexander pops up with his sovereign railways for sovereign Scots, SNP out bleh bleh blah?
I’ve got 2.30 pm, although I am riggin the book too with this yoon troll baiting, right Co:D
So Blair ,just how do you suggest they go about it? Bearing in mind that every outlet is busily trying to intimidate and misreport , with the big unionist cheer leader of the BBBC and the laughably named Scottish TV hooray henrying on with utter disregard for truth , integrity or accuracy.
If they refuse to appear on TV it will be reported as a refusal with innuendo of ” something to hide’.
If they go on quietly and logically they will get the ‘hair dryer ‘ interview from the likes of Brewer.
If they go on aggressive they will be described as bullies .
One way or another the MSM will work against them in the usual treacherous ,duplicitous and malevolent manner.
It really is up to us to stop buying their drivel or viewing their ordure.
It is also up to us to point out their dishonesty to all .
Ahh Remember the good old days when we had great adverts from companies like Volkswagen ( pre emmisions fiddling days )with the strapline “if only everything was as reliable as a Volkswagen” well, we found something even more so The Scottish media! you can always rely on them….. to spout sheer unadulterated crap!
Oops meant to say that you only have to keep on using the search box if clicking on a particular speaker’s name doesn’t work (as happens with me on occasions).
Be fair.Colin Alexander is doing a great job for Mi5.The grub is not great at the GCHQ canteen and if he takes to 2.35 to reappear with his I am on your side but the SNP Baaaaad so be it.Self loathing Scots have to make a living.
The SNP mps should just quit the alien and alienating Wh+re of Parliaments before the place burns down or just falls down. The building is truly an icon of the corruption of the British state. Scots should not pay for its repair.
If schools only taught subjects teenagers are interested in the curriculum would be nothing but football, sex and celebrity gossip.”
Maybe so Capella, but a lot are also working really hard to get the Highers they need and go to uni and college.
Look at how many A’s you need today to get in to any professional course?
And kids in all Scottish state schools have to stand at the back of the UKOK q , as their contemporary’s at private school get that expensive head start.
Just ask Slabour’s next Scottish First Minister Anas why he shells out a lot for his kids at
http://www.hutchesons.org/Welcome-to-Hutchesons
in the SNP out/caused hellhole that is Govanhill too.
Find it interesting to read of this fuss by an MSP from a party whose stated policy in England/Wales is that the operation of privatised railways is nothing to do with government after the award of the franchises, as witnessed by the UK Dept of Transport’s disavowall of any role in the Southern Trains fiasco (which is far worse than anything emanating from Scotrail). Problems there are considered to be issues between the company and its customers.
It’s another matter with Virgin East Coast, but that of course is not Chris Grayling’s fault ! Humza however should consider himself lucky that the East Coast franchise was not a devolved matter!
Neil Findlay competing to win this week. What a fool -snp should sit in the Lords, funny how when in opposition (many times) labour called for the abolition of the Lords but when in power they stuff it full of their cronies.
He is such a democrat, unelected people should have a say, but then I remember how many labour msp’s in Scotland were not elected but ‘list’ and labour themselves were not happy with this when they were in power.
Problem is Neil there is a queue but you are in it
@TheWasp –
Hear hear.
Some days ye just feel ye canny take any more of their pish.
🙁
@gus1940
None of the BBC Scotlands allocated budget will be spent on Premier league football. The problem is programmes assigned to BBC Scotland that have little production based in Scotland (there are lots of these). If we give them easy statements that can be disproved then that’s what they will focus on.
It is the same for those that rage on about journalists salaries, most are not paid a fortune and deflects from what is important, the poor factual content.
We come to this site for factual data, filling it up with comments that are easily disproved is just giving the MSM an easy target.
Tend to agree this pantomime of the house of commons is long past its usefulness at best its a total farce , it’s just coincidence of course for the past few weeks we have loaded questions that border on total lies this being repeated time after time ,
that coupled with the aily lying of our media it makes you want to puke , a total bloody La La Land .
If you actually stop to smell the coffee, there has to be some reason behind this onslaught. It is way way above normal.
The only conceivable and believable answer I can come up with is that it is centrally coordinated. But why? Why now?
I have a very suspicious feeling that a referendum is in the offing or they suspect a referendum is in the offing, which is more likely.
It would make no sense otherwise.
I suggest they take them the media to court I mean the evidence is there for all to see the media in Scotland are lying to the people of Scotland and are by any other standards committing treason there is no other word for it surely that is an offence ??? Go get them now
What’s Torcuil Crichton saying about this Daily Record bollox!
In a short time, a wall of truth, like a tsunami wave, will hit these Brexit shores and sweep the BritNat media and much else besides, away with it.
According to Bloomberg, 4000 of the wealthiest people in London left for overseas destinations in 2017. I guess the Clever Money doesn’t pay attention to the Media.
Is there any kind of EU grant available to provide educational support to Scots that still buy or believe anything that the UK Media produces.
Can I just confirm to those behind this that you are a major contributing factor to millions of Children living below the poverty line, you have hard working adults queuing up at Food banks, you are killing severely disabled people who are forced through robust back to work exercises that kill 5 people per week,
you behind people committing suicide due to cuts on basic welfare, you are not fit to be called human.
Look in the mirror and not your bank account if want your life to be considered worthwhile.
Delighted to her the Tories seem to no longer believe that trade with China is a crime. I was sure they and their media pals viewed it as an act of betrayal when the SNP thought about it.
Funny old world innit.
Theresa May is to publish the already leaked Government brexit report.
Apparently to fend off a forced vote in the commons to have it made available.
This should be fun after trying to rubbish the SG studies…popcorn at the ready…!
Bob Mack says:
31 January, 2018 at 1:15 pm
If you actually stop to smell the coffee, there has to be some reason behind this onslaught. It is way way above normal.
It is an onslaught but it is being weighted across the UKOK media here in Scotland.
Daily Heil’s give away the Metro is very creepy UKOK attack propaganda to watch, if only because Metro’s free garbage is not totally relentless, everyday, hysterical SNP out, give away.
Metro’s gimps stagger their SNP out vote tory propaganda, across their Scottish propaganda week, in maybe 2 day intervals. Some days there is almost nothing politics in the Metro, the next, full on SNP out blasts of vote tory rage.
This week’s stand out vote Tory, hate SNP Metro rage? all about Angela Merkel doing or saying something outrageous to our lovely and wonderful Teresa’s tories and the OBFA getting scrapped, which is also really really wonderful, everyone wanted it gone, it was “illiberal,” for one thing, explained Zip Zap, from Kilmarnock.
Anyone can be UKOK hack/professional liar for this tory yoon zone.
And if you’re any good at all, the great beeb Scotland gimp network beckons, unless you’re a girl wannabe beeb gimp, you’ll be fully aware that the great BBC pays boys gimps far far more than girl ones, but you’ll still sell your soul to the greatest tory attack propaganda in Europe today.
@blair paterson.
The SG has no intention of playing unionist “SNP BAD” whack-a-mole.
By doing so, it allows the unionists to claim credibility for their utter pish.
The people of Scotland are not stupid you know, the last 7 elections in Scotland are testament to that.
Poverty:
The Britnats talk about poverty as if it’s just money when they bang on about folk having more than ever before, and to a certain extent that’s true we’re less poor, but there’s a lot more to poverty than just finance
Poverty of opportunity
Poverty of equality
Poverty of the right to expression
Poverty of the right to vote if you’re young
Poverty of a countries right to vote for whom it chooses to represent and govern them and the right to the recognision of such
Scotland suffers all of these types of poverty
BREAKING from Pravda Quay
with Union Jackie Kim Ono:
https://imgur.com/a/zT70k
…but it wouldn’t look as bad if you used the official definition.
They will not let facts get in the way of a SNPbad story.
“EU rejects Brexit plan for banks by Britain’s financial industry”
https://www.irishtimes.com/business/financial-services/eu-rejects-brexit-plan-for-banks-by-britain-s-financial-industry-1.3375183
The only real question is – how long will it take for the Tories to abandon their position of saying they will negotiate to achieve cherry picking, all-best-bits-deal, plus plus?
Their defence against the recently leaked paper was it didn’t include their preferred ‘fantasy deal’.
Very soon, they need to come out and say one of the available options … cancel, walk away, accept ‘Canada’, or accept ‘Norway’.
Yet the fantasy still perpetuates.
I agree with Blair Patterson.12.23pm. I think its about time the Scottish government put pressure on westmidden , and started demanding devolved broadcasting services. This is a perfectly reasonable request,so why is it continually being denied to us?.
Mike d at 3.18
No.It’s independence we want, not devolved anything. If we start arguing for devolved this and that we will be tied up forever in whatifs and whattevers and process which is exactly as our enemy wants.
We got devolution ceded to us only because of growing support for independence.
Further to the bollocks theme
Every week for the last few weeks we have a obviously planted Ruth the mooth question , it follows the line of the four to one internal market with let’s call it the rest of the UK , it’s about time this wee veiled threat was seriously challenged ,
Does the questioner believe if we vote for independence England will invoke a trade embargo , will our means of trading be hampered and curtailed by the English navy ? ,
Shades of Darian emerging here , you better stay or else , aye or else what , your navy and airforce will block our ports , oh how f/kn Quaint , so last Century in their threats , the mindset of Victorian England assisted by willing Scots who have been bought , Just like performing chimps . Apologies to Chimps for the insult by the way .
I hope someone from the SNP raises this threat in Holyrood , and give Nicola a chance of a clear shot at Ruth the Mooth , I wonder who the current labour tosspot will side with , no prizes for a correct answer , I won’t bother with the jester , oh f/k I can’t remember his name , something to do with aggravation of the stomach or wind irritation etc
Just remember chaps that’s a two way sword , we can in turn cut off your electricity , your Gas , your Oil , fishing , water ,
Your move says the American warship captain to the Arran Lighthouse when he was lost in the fog , let’s see who blinks first .
I wonder what title Ruth the Mooth will select for the HoL?
Baroness….?
Clootie Ha Ha now now that’s below the belt now , still bloody funny but Ha Ha .
Baroness? Pfft!
Well Geeo I think to do nothing about it is to condone it
OT – stolen 6,000 miles
This is the actual picture from The Scottish Adjacent Waters Boundaries Order 1999, and look at that median line that CROSSES the territorial water limits at the same angle, and even swings further north, before swinging east – all between the territorial water limit and the eastern boundary of the EEZ.
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1999/1126/note/made
But the line should swing east as SOON as it reaches the territorial limits. In fact not swing, just change angle.
The case for that 6,000 miles should be easy, the UK Gov’s own diagra points out the proper line as it gets to the eastern boundary of the EEZ.
It’s easier to see than the maps with suggested alternatives, so any case should have a picture with the current median line, and a sdeparate picture the proposed median line plus original.
Baroness Bull of Riding
yesindyref2 says:
31 January, 2018 at 4:13 pm
OT – stolen 6,000 miles
It is but beeb Scotland gimpery is also using that map of the North Sea boundary too, like the one I posted earlier today,
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-20042070
Wonder why a beeb gimp is leaving out the actual Scotland/England territorial line today, what Bomber Blair drew?
Dave mcewan hill 3.25 pm fair enough dave (If it was up to me, half republican irish) I’d seize my f****g indy tomorrow. BUT I’m trying to go down the democratic path. Not that the brit nats respect any other country’s democracy.
@Heed
Quite a fair article that one from 2013 Heed – but look what happened to the beeb gimps afterwards!
Ian Brotherhood says:
31 January, 2018 at 1:10 pm
@TheWasp –
“Hear hear.
Some days ye just feel ye canny take any more of their pish”.
That friend is the general idea. That and also the fact that they know SNP/Yes is doing nothing to counter it.
Clootie @ 3.35pm.
You asked:
I wonder what title Ruth the Mooth will select for the HoL?
Not Baroness, as you suggested. Colonel Yadaftie has delusions of adequacy and grandeur, so, we might imagine, after she gets her safe English seat and becomes Tory leader then Prime Minister, she will be eligible for, and will accept an Earldom or its female counterpart.
Look out for the Countess of Selkirk, or maybe Countess of Buckhaven. But, Baroness, no, no, that’s for upstart commoners like bra entrepreneurs.
Proud Cybernat @ 14:49,
Damn right. The very same thought had occurred to me as I heard all that deferential guff on the lunchtime radio news.
But soon on MisRepScot we’ll get a chorus of criticisms about PM-TM’s visit from Wee Willie, Rude Gal and Red wotsisname, won’t we…?
…won’t we…?
Right now we are a “Vichy” style colony. Allowed for now to self regulate in different areas, until like the Germans, the UK government feels we have enough democracy.
It is killing them that we are not toeing the usual subservient line and they need to get us back on side.
News Flash. That isn’t going to happen voluntarily any more.
Davidson is their Petain in waiting.
From now on that is what I will call them. It suits.
Stopped buy the lying shit rag the Daily Record years ago. I’ve convinced several indy folk to stop buying it as well. In and around town, I cover the Record with the National on the newspaper stands when I’m in the shops.
Hit them where it hurts, sales figures.
yesindyref2 says:
31 January, 2018 at 4:40 pm
@Heed
Quite a fair article that one from 2013 Heed – but look what happened to the beeb gimps afterwards!
Maybe but point is, why are they leaving out the actual sea territorial map. Blair redrew the territory back in
https://wingsoverscotland.com/a-quirk-of-fate/
How you can say its a fair beeb thing, when they are fundamentally lying about the actual North Sea territory that belongs to Scotland, I do not know:-)
Maybes the liggers just forgot. Its pretty well hidden from public view, msm wise, as per.
Its not like you can stand on the beach at St Andrews and go, look everyone, there’s the new Scotland/England North sea boundary, what Tony Blair redrew back in 1999, secretly.
I think the saddest thing PSB’S have done for Scotland, whenever I go on holiday abroad and hear a Scots accent, I’d always make a beeline and have the craic. Now I think, is this a no voting yoon, and I hold back, because I don’t even want to socialise with these ‘people ‘.they are not Scottish. And don’t bother anyone trying to tell me,This is not the way to get certain people onside. These people would rather die than see an indy Scotland away from their beloved brutish empire.
FFS Tereza’s spending to much time on transatlantic phone calls wie Donald Duck , in aw ma years av never heard of aspiring to the british dream , ma dreams are anything but british .
Capita ‘s shares have nosedived they need to raise £17.5 million , no more door knockers & threatening letters from the Bbc Karma .
The Daily Rancid, Champion of Colonialist Collaborators.
Now I think, is this a no voting yoon, and I hold back,
Mike d, I’m the complete opposite. Every No vote Scot I know is a decent kind hard working tax paying human being. They voted No for as many reasons as YES voters vote YES.
Its life, in a democracy. Anyway the indy ref2 banter is great fun too, and you never know who’s listening in either, could be a undecided:D
We’re saved!
The UK says they’ll make up the EU trade losses by selling jam and scones to China and other countries all over the world, yes they really did say that
The world must be salivating in anticipation
@Heed
Well, tricky one about the BBC. Yes, they could have done the article with the alternative boundary I guess.
For your comment about NO voters I totally agree. I talked to loads of NO voters and since I didn;t push YES, found out theur viewd. Most were sympathetic to YES, but were concerned about various things depending on their circumstances. Heres’s some:
1. Just getting by, don’t want to risk NOT getting by
2. Mortgage – can afford it now but not if rates rise
3. Job, bad enough as it is, don’t want to be less secure
4. Like to go to London and not be a “foreigner”
5. We’re unable to govern ourselves
Loads of others, all reasonable to them. In my opinion there are very few “hardline” NO voters, just activists. I’d guess the heart of Indy is over 75% YES, it’s the mind that doubts, and over 90% could vote YES in the right circumstances.
Mike d says:
I empathise, but perhaps a bit less harshly.
The way I look at most things to do with people, is to consider that they don’t easily pigeonhole. They tend to lie of a spectrum between extremes. In the case of NO voters, it’s a case of forty shades of BritNattery.
I suppose I look at the whole EU membership issue in the same way.
I am tolerant of ignorance, disinterest, gullibility, even stupidity. People make their minds up about things based on their own experiences with influence from those around them. I firmly believe enough will change their minds through soft pressure from others plus positive experiences about things Scottish (and negative experiences associated with UKnotsoOK).
I believe we have a duty to engage and try to move these people our way.
However, I am totally 100% done with actual BritNats who fully understand the issues and wilfully damage Scotland for their own selfish reasons. I too just no longer want to engage with this type. I now firmly accept at least 20% of Scots are not people I want to spend or waste my time with.
yesindyref2 says:
31 January, 2018 at 5:44 pm
@Heed
Its just my experience. There is that rush of blood to the YES head when they say there vote NO issues but after that dissipates, they are still everything I mentioned and more.
Its 300 hundred years of UK, Rule Britannia stuff we have to live in and with here in their region of Scotland. 20 years of Holyrood, half of that under an appalling SLab unionist creep show…
And we came so close too in 2014. The only way is up!
O/T re Ruth Davidson. I was reading the Daily express (sorry, but I have an ad blocker) re a poll by WPI (no idea) that showed RD coming out tops to replace TM. Hilarious.
But funnier still was, I followed it up by going to an article in the Evening Express (not sure..an Aberdeen paper?) quoting RD just six hours ago as saying ‘ I am not going to replace TM’ …from an article on RD in Vogue Magazine. Yes RD has been Vogued! There is a photo in the vogue article. Hmm. Are coats two sizes too big in fashion this spring, who knew?
Anyway RD states there is no way will I leave the job I have to do in Scotland, no way whatsoever, I’m I’m Holyrood for the long haul. Yeh right! Bet she has a bag packed and ready to go when the call comes.
Rob Shorthouse is communications manager for ScotRail,
he was also one of the vermin that organised the Better Together Project Fear during Indy 1 which targeted the old and vulnerable,
he is a man with no humanity or honesty,
will say anything for a buck,a typical PR sh#tehawk,
for a communications person why do we never get good news direct from ScotRail,
is Rob Shorthouse actually incompetent or is he still playing the Project Fear lies and misinformation to attack Scot Gov.
Stu, excellent as per.
Loved the surge of comments.
A great read.
What is Clegg at the Record thinking of?
They are dying as they are lying,slowly but surely.
The Ranjurs will need to beat the Sellick soon to boost their sagging sales.
MOne will keep us abreast of the Brexit debate in the House of Lards, I’m certain.
Of course Sussex and Essex have devilish heavy snow every winter, just like Crianlarich, and they manage to run their trains on time. But wait.
They are a busted breed…
Oh, and a very important one:
6. The SNP / YES won’t admit there are risks and uncertainties
Doing an off the cuff analysis of current activists, the thrust of attack is against the SNP – and the 2013 White Paper Scotland’s Future. Little is actually against Independence itself.
There’s a tipping point, and we’re very close to that, and you could get activists just – switching – just like that.
@Heed
Indeed.
Hey, I’m a poet and don’t know it!
@blair paterson 3.54pm.
Well you are 100% talking utter shite (as usual).
If i call you a unionist tosser, and you ignore me, nobody cares, and will judge me for my insult but leave you alone, in general.
If i call you a unionist tosser, and you try desperately, and constantly, to convince me you are indeed not such a thing, then people look at the exchange and wonder if actually, i have a point and maybe you are one, as you are seen to be trying too hard to deny the accusation.
Now, i am not saying you are a unionist tosser here, but i bet you think i might be, huh ?
When you respond, as you surely will, others reading the exchange, because it is out there now, will, rightly or wrongly, formulate an opinion on something, purely because of your reaction.
Tomorrow i decide you are a twat..next day a moron etc…will you defend yourself on every occassion, risking judgement by the public reading those exchanges ?
And so on and so on ?
Insult whack-a-mole….just like you want the SNP SG to engage in with unionists.
Away ya slaver…(sic)
heedtracker says:
I know a lot that fit that description, thankfully.
However, I also come across quite a few real nasty types who represent everything I now despise. Vicious Tories who see nothing wrong with hammering ‘scrougers’. Openly fascist, covertly racist. Scots born, but that means nothing to them or their peer group. Deil tak the hindmaist on every issue. Hard as nails employers.
Not that I ever liked such people, but now I really want absolutely nothing to do with them.
From bollocks to brass necks R/us , Tory Ross Greer moaning about First Bus increasing fares, that’s a bleeding laugh , it was Tory Heroine Thatcher that privatised the buses , next we will have labour saying it was Nicola who privatised the Trains , oops no that was the Messiah Corbyn who stated shortly after being elected leader it was the SNP that done it blame them ,
Oh you couldn’t make it up , but in Scotland they can and they do it daily .
The British Dream ?
It’s always been a vision of yesteryear!
Did i just hear that 2 lib dem MSP’s voted WITH the SG and Greens budget ?
Felt they had to because of the financial input for ferry services.
Rennie trying to take credit for that already.
I didn’t just imagine that did i ???
“Davidson is their Petain in waiting.”
I humbly submit, Bob Mack, that Pith Helmet Mundell is a closer analogy, given his empire-building efforts in Embra recently and his invertebrate status.
Ruthie is still brazenly prostrating herself for a safe English seat before the Tory Establishment, who view her antics as those of a rather desperate wee gun dog enthusiastically doing demeaning tricks for a doggy treat.
She’s even a Massey Ferguson to herself: no dignity, no integrity, no backbone, no principles.
Oops the wrang Tory , not the green Tory it was rosy cheeks ginger nut who has difficulty with facts I was talking about earlier , so sorry to Patrick’s wee pal and the rest of the part time Tories
galamcennalath @ 17:49,
I tend to the same view. If we want to win next time, it follows as night follows day that we have to convert a slew of former “no”s. Otherwise we just lose again. And no amount of self-righteousness will assuage the deep feeling of loss.
Mostly the converts will be from the ranks of the “fearties” (to crudely pigeonhole them). Many of whom anyway felt a twinge of regret on the day after IR1. Their preference to play it safe has surely been shaken by UKExit in flagrant disregard for the “status quo” sales pitch they believed in IR1.
Keep in mind, peeps, that there has always been a majority of people who believe that Scotland will be independent one day. It’s simply time to convince enough of them that, with all the outrages of UKExit, the day has finally come.
@geeo
From the Herald: “Finance Secretary Derek Mackay slashed a promised 3 per cent rise in the threshold for the higher rate of income tax down to 1 per cent to find an extra £55m for councils and public sector pay rises.”
Which is what it should have been anyway of course, and probably anticipated and as per plan but I didn’t say that, my lips didn’t move.
Ain’t choreography a great art? Should be a degree in it!
Robert Graham 6.01pm. Problem is in Scotland Graham,the plebs/pensioners (bigots a lost cause) believe it. Doh.i seen it on the (ebc) news.
I might have been more fun watching Labour and the Tories contradicting each other and voting together against the budget but surely the idiocy of Willie Rennie is exposed for all to see.
“We just voted against a budget to get the Northern Isles new ferries but despite us voting against them it was the LibDems that got them.”
I feel incredibly optimistic today, gung-ho even, doesn’t make me a bad person.
Indy’s in the air everywhere I look around
Indy’s in the air every sight and every sound
And I don’t know if I’m being foolish
Don’t know if I’m being wise
But it’s something that I must believe in
And it’s there when I look in your eyes.
Heeddtracker 5.29pm. My english independence supporting wife always gives them the benefit of the doubt. BUT after about half an hour or so of conversation, i generally piss off to the bar. To be met later by my wife with the exclamation as, Why did you leave me with those a****holes. Ring a bell with anyone lol.
@yesindyref2
Absolutely the case that was planned as a future “concession” for the budget negotiations.
Top man oor Derek.
Careful there, Stu. You are criticising the Daily Record.
Don’t you know that’s the FM’s paper nowadays?
..Love is in the air..
…love is in the…..air.
There.
You can’t leave a lyric just hanging there.
Meindevon 5.51pm. If the mooth ever becomes first minister of engerlund, we’ll certainly have a field day extracting the urine out of the local carrot crunchers in Devon and Dorset lol.
Colin a.6.41pm.Im sure as McDonald’s would say. She’s loving it.
Hey what’s happened to Colin A?
Is that all you have to do to get him to stop droning on and on about freakin sovereignty and SNP out, ask him to do it:D
It’s the Reverend Stuart Campbell to you, sonny.
Galamcennalath 5.49pm. Believe you me, i don’t shove my politics down anyones throat. If the conversation drifts around to Scotland being independen,.i always insinuate the positives, to be shot down immediately by the negatives, no listening, blah blah blah. Which is when i say to my wife. Sorry love, need to pop to the loo. ( i canny say , I’m awa fur a pish).
Mike d and galamcennalath you both make sound points. But as we say in north east of Scotland, some c_nts just love a good fecht. we do too:D
Sews division where there is respect.
Today in the HoL Lord Hague was opposing a call by Lord Adonis for a second referendum on the terms of the final Brexit deal.
The obscenity of the HoL is …. well obscene. Democracy? Where?
Anyhows, I know an EURef2 might stop the whole thing so has that bonus.
However, the idea worries me. Unlike the need of IndyRef2 because everything has changed since the decision made in IndyRef1, what has actually changed since EURef1? Nothing I can see. The Brexiteers are saying the same improbable things, and the Remainers are highlighting the same consequences.
Since IndRef1 and the promises made, the vision promoted for their Union, and the status of the UK internationally are gone … vapourised.
England voted for its independence and I have always felt they should be allowed it. Nagging at the back of my mind is how would we feel if someone tried to overturn a Yes in IndyRef2 just because they didn’t like it?
As I say, the world has changed totally from IndyRef1, and IndyRef2 is essential. No one can say that about EURef.
The two are intertwined, of course. Scotland needs IndyRef2 because of England’s choice in EURef1.
We need a referendum, but not the one the HoL are bickering over.
Once bitten, twice shy.
No in the world of some Wingers. They still believe an indyref YES vote will deliver independence.
Even if Scotland had voted YES, you would still be waiting for independence. There was no legal agreement that a YES vote had to be fulfilled within any period of time.
Why was that? Do you think some of the sharpest legal brains in all of England didn’t think of that? That it was an oversight? Of course they thought of it.
Scotland would have gotten independence when aw the seas gang dry
( of oil), when they don’t need somewhere to dump the nuclear waste and they don’t need the fish and the water and they don’t need somewhere to kill animals and retire to.
You were promised Devo-Max, where is it? You already have it according to the FM’s Daily Record.
I read David Mundell, included “normally” in the Scotland Act. One word, but it legalised the Westminster power grab and made the Sewel Convention worthless.
It’s like watching the British Empire making treaties with the natives around the world. The pen is indeed mightier than the sword – for stabbing freedom movements in the back.
Yet, people on here want it all over again, thinking the UK Establishment would somehow find integrity and honour agreements that they have never done before.
The only way we will get independence is by our own hands. It will never be gifted by
British gentlemen’s agreements. The British Empire never worked like that.
A leopard does not change its spots. When will we ever learn?
Louis.b.argyll. I have absolutely no respect for any PSB’s who accepts their country as subservient to another state. Who make daily life changing decisions that affect them and their families, when they are not even the democratically elected party of that country.
VERY interesting map at the front of this one, look at the dotted line, got via a link from Cactus:
http://www.gov.scot/Resource/0045/00451087.pdf
“Produced for the Scottish Government by APS Group Scotland
DPPAS28225 (05/14)“
Tinto Chiel says:
One of many current politicians with only two policies … passionate British Nationalism and ardent self promotion.
That report commissioned by the Scottish Government shows that the SNP have been beavering away for a long time, even including the likes of those 6,000 miles. That’ll startle the resident dweeb and make it choke on its nanobits.
It’s like watching the British Empire making treaties with the natives around the world.
Good analogy Colin A. Look at how the British Empire collapsed, or how the Imperialists had to leg it with bullets whizzing past their ears:D
@Ronnie Anderson –
Great news re Capita.
(BTW, just got e-mail from another body confirmed for Friday. Fair wee squad now by the looks of it…)
The article linked by Cactus is excellent, well worth reading, by the “Professor of Political Geography in Durham University’s Department of Geography”.
https://philsteinberg.wordpress.com/2014/05/24/mapping-scotlands-waters/
@Bobp
You can start with my true blue neighbour who I overheard several years ago moaning about all the Scots in parliament. Oh and one several doors down who said very loudly last week in the company of myself and several others that it must be the Scottish in him that begrudges paying the hospital car parking charge. (I know, I was so close to telling him he should move to Scotland but thought that would have been cruel to Scotland) That was after he told us that his grandfather once said (of a posting to the Shetlands, I think) that it was so cold that he was sure God didn’t mean folk to live in Scotland. My other half dragged me out fairly shortly after that comment…can’t stand the sight of blood! 😉 The worst of it is his son is a Labour councillor. Weirdly the English sounding Scots born folk are sympathetic to Indy, but the more recent Scots down here aren’t.
Most folk are great but there is such an ignorance of Scotland and its politics. I just try to remember that all these poor souls get their info from unionist news and papers. So it’s to be expected.
Go easy on the other half though, Devonian and proud!
The UK Constitution:
Parliament is sovereign.
The United Kingdom Parliament is made up of three parts – the Crown, the House of Lords and the House of Commons.
Laugh at the Lords, but they are our unelected masters. That’s why the MSPs are there now, bending the knee.
Baroness Mone knows it too. That’s why she mocked an SNP politician.
Following a YES vote as long as we remain subjects of the UK constitution, we can only be free if our unelected Lords masters voted to set us free.
Mike d, agree fully.
Think ‘he’ was implying FM hypocracy, having a column etc in same papers that we also see lying.
Appearing less, in the media that attempts to whitewash you, isn’t really a logical engagement.
That paper and others that are being found do make it clear the Scottish Government was well ready for the negotiations over Independence, and for any aftermath in courts, e.g. chasing those 6,000 stolen square miles – and perhaps more. It gives a good counter to the 1998 line, to go back to the 1987 line, and settle perhaps for a sensible UNCLOS one.
But it also puts meat to a conclusion I came to even before 2013. That the Scottish Government had to be very careful what arguments it used in support of Independence, precisely because it could undermine negotiations AND the “legal” position. So at times it appeared to be ineffective, whereas it was just safeguarding Independent Scotland’s poistion – unlike the UK Government with its incredibly stupid first white parper, and its endorsement of te unfamous Annex A.
A case in point is currency. I maintained contrarty to NIESR that the currency – GBP – is actually an asset, and that Scotland would be entitled to a share. For the sake of a figure, I put a value on it, I think, of £400 billion, of which Scotland’s share would be £33 billion. That’s WITHOUT taking into account assets of the BoE – the GBP is an intangible asset, recognised by accountancy and HMRC / Companyu’s House, and indeed a place on the Balance Sheet (I submitted my accounts 17 hours early today – an absolute record).
But if Salmond had gone for our own currency, perhaps that negates the negotiating position and Scotland could be deemed to have foregone the asset value and therefore be elegible for no share. Who knows!
Mmm, mistype “parper” for paper. I kind of like that 🙂
Meindevon 7.49pm. Lol. My english wife of 35.yrs(Hertfordshire) university educated,cannot believe why Scots didn’t vote for indy. What’s the answer? I just keep hoping enough clever Scots will see the truth,and do the right thing as citizens of a proud independent nation.
yesindyref2
Who could the Scot Govt take a legal case to, Supreme Court?
UK constitution:
Parliament the supreme legal authority in the UK, which can create or end any law.
Generally, the courts cannot overrule its legislation and no Parliament can pass laws that future Parliaments cannot change.
Much of UK politics is not law. It’s not democracy. It’s political power based on centuries of tyranny.
Anybody else on here have a suspicion that a couple of anti-SNP posters aren’t Scottish and / or not living in Scotland at all? Just asking due to some ‘slips’ of the tongue / language being used now and again.
Meanwhile I have to report that my husband was absolutely gob-smacked today. He was sitting in the communal break area when one of the workers approached him and asked if he could read one of his newspapers (Friday, Saturday and Monday’s Nationals). My husband said no problem and if you want, take it / them home with you. The guy walked into a wee side room and started reading. All of the SNP / independence supporters rolled their eyes at each other, as this guy has been one of the most outspoken No supporters of a workforce of over 200. Not only that he’s heavily involved with the OO.
My husband had one independence discussion with him years ago, but it was a waste of time with the guy shouting over him. From then on he would just make a point of coming out with the latest piece of either positive news or outing a Media lie in front of the guy. Latest relating to the oil situation. Anyway when the guy left my husband noticed he’d walked off with the 3 newspapers. A step in the right direction I’d say!
Where d’ya think?
(UNCLOS) “ Disputes can be submitted to the International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea established under the Convention, to the International Court of Justice, or to arbitration. Conciliation is also available and, in certain circumstances, submission to it would be compulsory. The Tribunal has exclusive jurisdiction over deep seabed mining disputes. ”
http://www.un.org/depts/los/convention_agreements/convention_overview_convention.htm
@Petra
Robert Peffers pointed out Scots are sponges for language, and so we are. But exposure to TV and any social media like UseNet of old, just makes that
worseeven better.Apparently Willie Rennie said that the budget did not provide the “ transformational change that Scotland needs” . Perhaps then Willie should consider voting for independence at the earliest opportunity?? Or is that “ too simple” Willie??
Whit ur they like they Tories .
https://9gag.com/gag/aVO2E9v?ref=fbp
I hear you, Petra.
One recent anti-SNP contribution on this site contained a phrase that I have never heard a Scot use, but is normal in parts of England.
I share your suspicions.
yesindyref2
Scotland and England are parts of the UK. That’s national, not international. ( Unless Scotland became independent first).
Would that not just be the UK arguing amongst itself, so a domestic issue?
Could a devolved legislative within a state refer a case of dispute against the state?
(Genuine questions).
Petra 8.24
The writer, Christopher Priest moved to Bute recently.
Here’s a post he made in November about his experiencing the difference between the English and Scottish NHS.
http://archive.is/z84uA
No idea what his views are –
So I emailed him expressing the hope his experience might be leaning him towards independence.
Sowing seeds.
Mark Fletcher
I’m curious. Which phrase?
O/T Re- the House of Lords debate on the EU Withdrawal Bill, this from Lord Steel of Aikwood (aka David Steel, of the Lib Dems) on 30 January (@ 3.12pm):
“What this Bill does is to dispense with the Scottish Parliament. That is why it is unacceptable, and that is why we must have an amendment during Committee that puts right a totally unsatisfactory Bill as it stands.”
https://hansard.parliament.uk/lords/2018-01-30/debates/DEF7D976-EE5D-4150-BC6D-2F2C928719C5/EuropeanUnion(Withdrawal)Bill
The fact that a Westminster Government could even draft legislation that elicited this response from someone with David Steel’s status, and from someone who gives no (apparent) support to Scottish self-determination, speaks volumes for the disrespect in which even Scotland’s present constitutional status is held by the Tories in Westminster.
And so it is more that Yes supporters that consider that Scotland’s Parliament is under threat.
In this context, does anyone know any more about who’s behind and what is planned for this – the proposed Hands Around Holyrood/ Hands off our Parliament demo at Holyrood on Friday, 23 March.
This is of course a critically important, very current subject but, candidly, I’m finding it hard to find out any more about this. It is not trivial to make a useful, significant mark via a demo on such an important issue at any time but on a Friday and with (so far) limited publicity, its likely to be an uphill task.
https://www.facebook.com/RTUKnews/videos/1892438921045982/?hc_ref=ARRiaJCoWibMavhFZIDLZfNZL101lWBD2fHPVNnvAJXm9TwCs0jqkVnjsMUdSrISK2M&fref=gs&dti=115401562440571&hc_location=group
Here’s a true story for you.
Once upon a time, in a classroom somewhere in the East End of Glasgow, there was a boy who came from a decent family, but was extraordinarily disruptive.
To protect his identity, I shall give him a false name – let us call him ‘Colin Alexander’. Colin’s teacher decided to ignore Colin’s frequent unhelpful, unwelcome outbursts and instead concentrated on those who reacted to him. They were systematically harassed and punished.
Result? Colin Alexander was now a voice in the wilderness barking only to himself.
Eventually, Colin’s head exploded.
Even Tereza’s lords have no faith in her
My husband had one independence discussion with him years ago, but it was a waste of time with the guy shouting over him. From then on he would just make a point of coming out with the latest piece of either positive news or outing a Media lie in front of the guy. Latest relating to the oil situation. Anyway when the guy left my husband noticed he’d walked off with the 3 newspapers. A step in the right direction I’d say!”
Yes but, they are often really funny so if you’ve got the urge to lol at them, try it. Some are just mad funny too.
Some are often just plain old misogynists, when it comes to the FM. for all kinds of reasons.
colin alexander says:
31 January, 2018 at 8:42 pm
Mark Fletcher
I’m curious. Which phrase?
Everyone call tell where your’e from by your accent Colin A. Its not that much different when you btl SNP out too.
We usually tell what class we are, where we’re from, even from what part of which city.
Sometimes we tone our language to make ourselves understood, fit in, make our points etc This is known in linguistics as, “accommodation.”
As you have shown Colin A, btl SNP out stuff is quite difficult to accomplish, cunning linguistic accommodation wise.
Its maybe something for the 77th ding dongs to think about, which they probably have by now, right Co, if the 77th does exist?
@ colin alexander
UNCLOS generally applies to signatory States but there are provisions in Annex I – Resolution III covering the interests of those in non-independent territories.
A few snowflakes about tonight.
Heedtracker
So, where d’ye hink am fae?
Ah’ll gie ye wan guess. I bet ye don’t hiv a Scoobie.
colin alexander says:
31 January, 2018 at 9:33 pm
Heedtracker
So, where d’ye hink am fae?
You think I care?
heedtracker at 9.18
Colin A said he had been in the SNP. I asked him when and what branch.
I asked who he was, what area he was from who and what he was. No response. It OK for folk to use non de plumes on here if they are making non contentious comment but once they start stirring it they should be prepared to identify. Otherwise their contribution is meaningless because we do not know whether it is honest or otherwise.
I have already heard all his stuff that is eerily a reflection of divisive stuff one might see planned by the Telegraph or the Times or the usual political magazines.
His name is not Colin Alexander
@Ron Maclean
Didn’t know that, thanks.
Don’t think I knew about the “International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea” until I looked that bit up, though I might have years ago and not thought it important. But it is important though really, as quoting UNCLOS to the Unionists is one thing, helps if we know how it can be resolved if neccessary.
Today on BBC Uk wide broadcast:
Between progs. On BBC 1 at 9pm “Openess” Wild camping in Glencoe.
Steve Wrights afternoon slot Radio2 . . . . and a hi from Mr. and Mrs Smith “on their way to the island of Mull we’re passing Loch Lomond, the scenery is beautiful”
Eagles Hotel California ” Call a place Heaven wave it Goodbye”
In Scotland’s case it’s all about stacking the odds against Independence
Ron Maclean
Cheers.
I did check the link provided and saw the UK is a signatory.
But could the Scottish Govt refer the case for dispute resolution, if the UK Govt refused?
(before independence was declared).
It’s UN convention, and I’m dubious as to whether the UN would interfere in UK internal politics.
(After reading some of the posts tonight about the Lords: “will there be a devolved Scottish Govt?” is maybe a more pertinent question.)
Sorry if it has already been mentioned on here.
Who said our oil is running out?
https://www.fircroft.com/blogs/massive-find-for-bp-could-radically-extend-life-of-north-sea-oil-83131914017
Bp for one, they said that back in 2014.
Dave McEwan Hill
I’m no stirring anything. I despise the Daily Record, I think you’ll find many independence supporters feel the same way. I also believe in freedom of expression, so if the FM wants to write for it, she has that right. And I’m sure she’d defend my right to girn about that.
I’ve been breenged at and had abuse shouted at me in the street for campaigning and canvassing for the SNP, unlike some of the armchair patriots on WoS who call me troll etc but never get off their airses to help free Scotland.
If I’m in Dunoon again, I’ll maybe pop in and buy a Saltire off ye.
But you need to tell me if there’s a decent chippy. My girlfriend took the huff cos last time in Dunoon the chippy roon the corner from your shop was shut and the kebab shop fried up frozen chips fae Farmfoods.
Frozen chips! she said. You should have seen her petted lip.
O/T
Is this oor wee Rock?
https://mobile.twitter.com/RockArden
Or maybe it’s a Rock thing?
Last hour…
BBC – Theresa May to fight EU transition residency plan
Telegraph – Theresa May promises free movement of EU citizens will end on Brexit day
Sun – Theresa May declares she’s a Brexit ‘believer’ and that our economy WILL boom outside the EU
Huffpost – May Warns EU Migrants Coming To UK After Brexit: Don’t Expect Full Citizens’ Rights
…. a bit out of touch with how things are going, how long has she been in China?
Palms slapping foreheads all over the EU!
It’ll be a golden-age for business lawyers/accountants post independence, all that licensing regulation, import tarifs, contract tendering..what are the professionals waiting for?
You can’t pass an OBE on to your children but you can build a better nation.
Socrates and Clootie
Don’t you think (t)Ruthless would opt to be Dame?
Re trains to Stirling in recent months – they are in the middle of electrifying the line( from Larbert?) through Stirling to Dunblane and there are months of disruption ahead, plus for some weeks past, , Mon – thurs post 9pm trains have been stopping at Croy and only an onward bus service is available, doubling the journey time from Glasgow to Stirling.
i’m sure that would drag the arrival times down but of course they won’t explain that in the newspaper article.
OK so what is going be the hot topic for FMQ’s tomorrow?
@ colin alexander/yesindyref2
UNCLOS Part XV covers procedures for settlement of disputes. I suspect we would have to go through Scottish/UK/EU legal systems first – all dedicated as usual to giving us a fair hearing. Maybe Gina Miller would take the case on.
https://www.facebook.com/TommySheppardSNP/videos/2005126916402031/?hc_ref=ARQWXmEPlxq0K4CYBWKr8nWtZW8AAwIIvUd7Ij5pC3B4VAgPVl2dNQR95m1ZdpAxV8I&fref=gs&dti=520164458118370&hc_location=group
Those 13 Tories can never say they didn’t know what they were doing when they walked through that lobby and passed the EU withdrawal Bill up to the HoL. Here’s Lord Hope emphasising the devolution aspect of the Bill passing without legislative consent being given by the Scottish Parliament.
Anyone who believes that Scotland has no say in what is about to take place, hasn’t being paying attention. Scotland is not a region, we are signatories to the United Kingdom, our Nation is constitutionally what makes the ‘united’ Kingdom what it is. They ignore us at their peril:
‘My Lords, I think that we need this Bill. It is in everyone’s interest that the gap in our law book when we leave the EU should be filled. As the noble Baroness the Leader of the House says, we need a seamless transfer from one system to another when that event occurs, so I think that the Bill deserves to have a Second Reading and must be allowed to pass. Nothing that I am about to say should be taken as being in conflict with those basic points.
However, the Bill comes to this House in a sorry state. It was drafted many months ago when we knew much less about how the exit was likely to be managed than we do now. It all seemed so simple then; you only have to look at Clause 9 to appreciate that point. It is designed to give power to Ministers to implement the withdrawal agreement. It also provides that no regulations may be made under that section after exit day. The idea that everything that needs to be done could be achieved on or before exit day informs the entire Bill, but we now know that there will have to be an implementation or transitional period—call it what you will—after that date. So that is an absurd provision in the light of what we now know. Moreover, the Government have failed to bring forward the amendments that are so obviously needed to meet this changed situation and deal with other criticisms that received cross-party support in the other place.
*
Time is short so I will concentrate on just one of the important issues: devolution. This is of concern to all the devolved Administrations, but I hope that the others will forgive me if I speak only about the devolution settlement that is set out in the Scotland Act 1998. I ?spent many hours late into the night debating that Bill here—we often sat well after midnight in those happy days. I worked with the Act as a judge on many occasions from its enactment until my retirement and learned to respect the way in which it had been drafted. That is why I am astonished by this Bill’s failure to respect that settlement in its formulation of the regulation-making powers given to Ministers.
There is of course a political angle to this issue, too. The Scottish Ministers have declared that they will not put a legislative consent Motion before the Scottish Parliament unless their objections to this are met. The bonds that hold the UK together would be stretched almost to breaking point if the Bill were to proceed to enactment without their consent. As a mere lawyer, I am in full sympathy with their objection.
Ministers may think that this is merely an enabling Bill, but it is not. It is about our constitution, too. The situation that it provides for as we leave the EU is entirely new. It is one that we have not had to face since the Scotland Act was enacted. The constitutional arrangements that were settled by the Scotland Act 1998 have to be changed but, as the Bill stands, they are being rewritten in a way that is naive and very damaging. Others will criticise some of the clauses containing regulation-making powers as amounting to Henry VIII clauses. As far as I know, Henry VIII never got to Scotland, but Oliver Cromwell did and he and the forces under his command did quite a lot of damage while he was there. I think that these clauses have a touch of Oliver Cromwell about them.
This issue goes far beyond the much-criticised Clause 11, which is about retaining EU restrictions in devolved legislation when we leave the EU. You can find these regulation-making powers in Clauses 7, 8 and 9 and throughout the entirety of Schedule 2. They are far-reaching and we must assume that they are there because it is intended that they should be used. As the wording stands, they could all be exercised to their fullest extent in all areas that are devolved to Scotland without any consultation whatsoever with the Scottish Ministers.
The legislative competence of the Scottish Parliament after exit day has been called into question, too. That would not be so bad if we could be certain that these provisions would have a very short life because everything that needed to be done could be achieved on or before exit day. As matters stand, though, we can expect these powers to be exercised for many months after that date. Those in Clause 9 are time-limited, absurd though that limit may now seem to be, but the remainder are not.
Ministers may say that that is not their intention; I listened with great care to the words from the noble Baroness about devolution. If so, I urge them to make their position clear in the Bill. Only if they are willing to do that are they likely to win the confidence of the Scottish Ministers in the area where a real opportunity lies for a mature and intense discussion, as we seek to define how the system of devolution can best operate in a new and vigorous UK single market after exit day. That is what the discussions about a redesigned Clause 11 should really be about. It is an area where there ought to be a real opportunity for an agreed way forward.?
However, there is much more to the issue than Clause 11, as I have tried to emphasise. It is hard to see those discussions getting anywhere so long as the basic architecture of the Bill is so misguided and ill-informed. I will be bringing forward amendments that seek to resolve that problem and I hope that they will be supported across the House. If others seek to do the same thing, I will support them, too.’
*my bold/italics
You suspect wrong as usual. Surprise surprise!
Alexicon
see the headline article in today’s P n J – things are so bad in the North East that ‘families go hungry because of oil price crash’ Wonder if they even bother to report the two new BP finds that will be producing through till 2050?
I love dunoon, there are a few good pubs there, and a great chippie down one of the side streets, nothing better than going for a fish supper, get stuck in, then head to Sinbads for a good swally,……………….. Magic !
Forgot the direct link to Hope’s comments in Hansard:
https://tinyurl.com/y9k9t42e
Sorry, thought that was about a dispute when Independent. As far as any dispute while devolved, then why would anyone bother, apart from making GERS look a little better? It wouldn’t create any extra revenue for the ScotGov.
Sarwar has slung mud at a stalwart of the Slab prominente who denies everything, where does that leave us & is this just a deputy leadership scam?
Captain Colin @ 9.33
Wan puts you in the west, don’t instead of dinnae is Ayrshire, so mind gads, puggy and snysters the next time, Scooby not Scoobie, so little knowledge of council telly from the 70’s. I think the Sandhurst lexicon needs updated
K1
Thanks for the report on Brexit Debate in the Lord.
Lord Hope is too sensible to be in the Lords.
Colin Alexander: your Dunoon comments strike a chord with me as I too have experienced the chippie closed fate.
However, more than made up for by happy memories of weekend visitations over the years to the Cowal Games (Gathering) with a group of friends and caravan. I do recall many moons ago 5 of us arriving late on a Friday night having set up the van and awning, piling into a packed bar and ordering up 5 rounds before closing time when someone said to the barman “when do you close”, October was the reply. Great weekend that was.
Dave McEwan Hill says:
31 January, 2018 at 9:36 pm
heedtracker at 9.18
I don’t mind the old phoney. SNP out is Colin A’s game and he’s clearly not a quitter. I guess its the usual yoon chancer stuff that bugs most, the pretence at being an ardent, the most ardent YES, but in actualité…
A fair few NO’s do that in real time though, I voted YES but never again, and if you argue with them, they rage back that you’re terrible at converting them back to YES.
But life is full of sneaky shits, sadly, right Colin A?
Having a wee wander round the net thingy before heading fir bed and came across this:
https://evolvepolitics.com/tory-mps-claimed-315000-of-taxpayers-money-to-fund-secretive-hard-brexit-pressure-group/
Sleep tight folks!
An observation.
With each and every passing day it becomes increasingly obvious that this site is not what it once used to be and not in a good way.
I think the Rev is more than aware of the culprits and EARNESTLY urge him to purge this platform of the virus currently infecting and…not too strong a word I suggest..’destroying’ this..the most popular forum for I ndy minded people.Please Rev…sort it out.
Did anyone else hear the Burd on Reproaching Scotland at 6.30
calling one of BP’s new fields, the Ashmelvish field.
Really? I know she’s been rounding her vowels and removing the last traces of her Scottish accent for a few years now, but does the Scottish ch as in loch actually stick in her craw so much?
Well done the SNP Scot Govt in passing a budget that helps protect public services and jobs.
Well done the Greens in supporting it and for encouraging the SNP Scot Govt to invest in jobs and services.
Excellent piece of cooperation by Scotland’s pro-independence parties.
O/T
Latest @Survation Holyrood poll:
https://twitter.com/rosscolquhoun/status/958831606181122048
I was watching the HoC debate earlier on re the refurbishment of the Palace of Westminster. I knew it was bad but it seems the place is an accident waiting to happen. The stories were quite shocking about burst pipes and water running down walls onto electrics. It sounded like the place should be condemned. Why are our MPs still working there? Any other building would have been shut years ago. Lives seem to be at very high risk.
If the worst were to happen, God forbid, just how culpable would the government be?
Ananurhing..23.00hrs.
Actually…the one I picked up on was The Jakey and Catriona Renton BOTH mispronouncing the suspended leader of Slab S.Lanarkshire Council…….David McLachlan…….”LACH”…sorry girls its “LOCH”…got it?…good.
Latest @Survation Holyrood poll:
Ouchee! Thank you Nana. Tantrums in Pacific Quay tonight, that great glass citadel of yoon, tory yoon too:D
They must be pulling their hair trying to work out they can force SNP out now. More union fleg stories no doubt.
Latest @Survation Westminster poll:
SNP 39% (+1)
Labour 27% (-2)
Tories 24% (-)
Liberal Democrats 7% (-)
Other – 3%
The Wasp
Scooby Dooby Doo. Well done. I say wan and wean. No yin or bairn. Though I dae say: whit wan, that yin?
Don’t know how though. Ah jist dae.
——————
Bill not Ben / Footsoldier
I would recommend Dunoon to anybody that’s no been there; but it’s the good chippy down the side street that was shut last time I was there.
I think there was another wan up the brae, but couldnae find it. (Is there?)
But the view from up the wee hillock at the sea front remains absolutely stunning on a good day.
And say hello to Dave McEwan Hill and the YES shop staff. Give them your support.
>alexicon says:
31 January, 2018 at 9:55 pm
Sorry if it has already been mentioned on here.
Who said our oil is running out?
https://www.fircroft.com/blogs/massive-find-for-bp-could-radically-extend-life-of-north-sea-oil-83131914017
Bp for one, they said that back in 2014.
============
Pity it’s BP discoveries.
If they are really massive finds, then like the Clair Ridge recent extensions, the estimated volumes of recoverable oil will be kept well hidden, or portrayed extremely conservatively, so as not to encourage the nasty separatists. They will be under constant “evaluation”. Can’t find any pre-drill estimates for these new discoveries, and BP hasn’t released the thickness of the oil columns for some reason..
Interesting how the BBC downplays the size of the discoveries.
“In the grand scheme of things, this isn’t a big find. BP has given no indication how much oil and gas it expects from these two wells, but the mood music suggests it will be small to moderate”
Don’t know what “mood music” they are referring to, as the BP spokesman in the same report talks of “exciting times” and suggests current production will double.
The Herald and the site linked above suggest a “potentially massive” find.
Who knows… but the Achmelvich discovery is next door to the giant Clair field. And the Capercaillie find in the North Sea was previously described as a “large undrilled high impact exploration play by Chevron, which indicates a major target..
It’s that time again:
https://www.timeanddate.com/moon/phases/uk/edinburgh
Special moon tonight.
All aboard The Lunar Express 🙂
The last oor of January ’18, how’s urs been… fast, slow, right on time?
Lookin’ good Nicola xx.
meindevon @ 11.09
I watched the debate too and totally agree.
Cactus @ 11-30pm
It sure is a special moon buddy aint it!…ultra…ultra bright “can ye see it fae Bath Mission Controller…’peep’…..Glasgow out.
SNP on 39% (Westminster voting intention).
What’s that rustling noise I hear there, Donalda?
Oh, that’ll be yer jotters, doll.
Howsabout a song…
For me Scotland’s trains are:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0quXl_od3g
Yes!
I used to think Colin & Co should maybe be removed , but this would be a very dull place if everyone agreed with each other , sometimes Colin raises some pretty uncomfortable Questions amongst his hate the SNP rants , that’s why recently I asked Colin what he would do if directing operations at the SNP , I was surprised to receive a civil reply without the usual guff , you can bypass comments if they annoy you , I think that’s why no action has been taken by the Rev .
Just for you Cactus…I’m playing ‘JANUARY’
Aweright Tam the Bam ~
Aye, in some places, in this world, people will also see an eclipse.
Look up everybuddy 😉
Just for you Cactus…I’m playing ‘JANUARY’…by Pilot.
Cactus @ 11-256pm
Hey…ITS FEBRUARY!
Hey to ye February, how many days you got, twenty eight or nine?
Excellent Tam the Bam 🙂
Yee har!
@ Cactus ….
Great. One of my favourites. All singing and dancing around the living room now, lol. Reduces Brexit stress levels and lowers Withdrawal Bill blood pressure.
Petra @ 12-06am
‘One of my favourites’…you talking about Pilot Petra?
At the start of each month (in 21st century iScotland).
We should welcome each one in.
Should auld acqu…
Musically.
chewchew.
Aye cheers to ye too Petra xx.
My moon, 10 miles west of Glasgow, is still white. The BBC spinning this blue/red moon is utter bollocks.
Cactus @ 12-10pm
‘Ya think?’
Aye aye Tam the Bam.
Why the ffsake sake sake not… afterall, we ride on time and..
We own midnight.
The Black Box band are excellent 🙂
Dance.
meindevon @ 11:09
Seems like the best thing would be to use a bulldozer.
Oops! the Red and Blue tories aren’t at the Emergency Assembly Point.
Hello, hello does anybody know where they are?
Cactus @ 12-22am
Emm…..I’m an AWB chap masel.
@ Tam the Bam ….”January / Pilot.”
Nice song Tam, but no referring to Ride on Time. You know all of that howling your head off to the super, duper, blue, blood moon (wolf moon) whilst dancing around like maniacs. All gearing up for Independence Day ….. AH….WOOOOOOO!!
Better go and calm things down, especially as I’ve got a brother-in-law that gets carried away with himself, lol. Time they were all heading home in fact.
Ah dinnae ken the awb aff-haund dude.
What’s yer tune?
Cloudy and rainy here in Oz so didn’t get to see the Super blue, blood moon. Saw some pics in the scottish papers online. Impressive!
Meindevon @ 11-09pm
I’m Barnstaple bound in June….fancy a summer break?….I’m going to a family wedding…makes a change from funerals.
Remain is at 66%
Westminster voting intentions SNP 39%
Holyrood voting intentions SNP Constituency 42%, List 33%
As the Rev says, 11 years, 17 point lead (Holyrood), that’s some going eh?
But as we all know they are a busted flush…death throes…honeymoon is over…etc etc
SNPbad no so bad after all (must be killing them seeing those figures. 😉
I prefer Dylan Thomas to Colin Alexander. Thomas is much more authentic.
Time for your break in the GCHQ canteen. Try the toad in the hole?
K1 12-42 am
Absolutely.Dare I hope for good things?
Blue moon is second full moon in a calendar month…it doesn’t change co!our. Eclipse turns it blood red but we haven’t got line of sight of the eclipse. They saw it in Merkinland. Cracking full moon though, at its closest to Earth at the moment.
Good opinion poll for the SNP. That will burst a few faces 🙂
Petra @ 12-37am
Ride on Time
def remember that one Petra…..I don’t know why (maybe cos it was the same era) as…….
Apols Tam the Bam ~
Ra dawnin’ came to me.
MDB.
AWB:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8rEkUhevfg
Cheers all.
Full (or almost or I need specsavers) moon, white and scudding through some white fluffy stuff at times, you can still see it though.
Yes, Ride on Time, got a gig in Sweden and the only way to take all the stuff over for a 6 week old was to get a caravan, and she cried so I’d put on Black Box and it was always Ride on Time was the best – quite loud. It made her forget to cry. Learned later it was because my wife loved Coke – still does – it’s the gas makes baby colic! That was also when I found that gripe water was 3% alcohol. Preferred a beer myself, you could get low strength from petrol stations. Daughter liked it too on the dummy. Mmmm, tasty.
#chewchew, “said Thomas”:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjfwNwyhzXQ
Funny GC.
Cactus @ 1-04
…Like the boy said…that aint the AWB….that’s Wild Cherry.
Now funk up …ok?
O/T this is an email I recd from my friend tonight , I have been trying to convert him
Well that’s me getting pumped again by the SNP and Nicola’s pet poodle Mr Harvie, that’s my rates up and income tax up Angry face with horns
not a happy chappie, I might as well go out and fix the roads for them as well before my car gets destroyed oh that’s right not to mention the fact that I had to go and collect grit so that I could do their job and grit my road now I know what independence means, it means I do it myself and be independent
My response to him
Hello Mr Angry man I think maybe your confused , shouldn’t you be complaining about the 50 years of mismanagement we had from Labour in Scotland where they Jack Mc Connel gave back £1 billion to wastemonster because they couldn’t think of anything to spend it on in Scotland , maybe they could have repaired a few roads , or the £300 billion , various wastemonster governments have STOLEN from our oil revenues whilst giving us pocket money .
Or there again maybe we could get some money from our current oilfields , but oh no I forgot Norway has recd billions from shell and bp in tax this year but our wastemonster govt is LITERALLY PAYING shell and bp millions to help themselves to our oil so I know who is getting pumped . I know you are a wind up merchant , but when you don’t vote for independence and wastemonster parties liebour , tolies , or lib dumbs get rid of Hollyrood then you will be happy knowing that its wastemonster the OO and the DUP who will be doing the pumping
Ye gorrit, man, aye.
It’s February ’18.
Trains r cool.
Cheers Tam the Bam, here’s one for the jukebox, 17 GIAR:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brfFFfjzQmA
Three years (MAX) frae now… we will be a free Scotland.
That’s a good feeling.
🙂 🙂 😉
Number 29 Royal Exchange Square is a Friday.
Polls for elections which will not take place under current constitutional criteria are well and good, but since none of the current uk wide unionist parties will contest them…..well, frankly, they mean nothing, other than act as a barometer measuring how little the unionist and media lies are being believed by Scots voters.
Agree they are a kick in the nads to unionists in that respect.
Interesting poll shows misconceptions on issues which appear in the media.
Results are quite staggering.
http://archive.is/a0vDe
Interesting you posted that wee snippet regarding misconceptions ‘which appear in the media’.
Was reading though some of the withdrawal Bill on Hansard and going back and forth between different questions taking place on 30th Jan 18 in the HoL. I came across a wee question that Lord Pearson(UKIP) was asking the minister in charge of media blah blah. He’s essentially complaining about the BBC bias ‘for’ the EU as he perceives it…it’s a short discussion…worth a read for the last paragraph from the minister, wherein he agrees and elaborates on the previous speaker’s comment wherein she states: ‘…that people have more faith in the BBC and national newspapers than in social media…’
HIs response:
‘The noble Baroness is right: trust in media sources is measured each year by a survey, which clearly shows that the public believes radio and television more than it believes social media. Radio and television get a 74% to 77% approval rating, whereas social media gets a mere 15%. Members of the public are not fools.’
https://tinyurl.com/ycmsze6j
———————
I was struck by those figures showing the public ‘believes’ radio and television more than it ‘believes’ social media’. Which goes to the heart of the article you just posted. The public are getting it wrong by very wide margins in terms of even basic assessments on immigration, obesity et al.
If as it seems they are not capable of figuring out the truth of the matter for themselves on these basic numbers and are heavily reliant upon the msm for their knowledge, isn’t it rather obvious that their heavy reliance would suggest it is ‘because’ of their belief and/or ‘faith’ in Radio and television and ‘national newspapers’ that they would be bound to be taken in by say something more complex like ‘Brexit’?
Isn’t it also be fairly obvious that these Lords and Baronesses are a bit thick too if they can’t see that Brexit happened precisely because people have placed ‘too much trust’ in the msm?
It seems obvious that it is a misleading way to ‘frame’ the question on the survey itself, it’s ‘too narrow’ a definition, social media is associated with FB and other ‘sharing’ platforms. No reference to checking the internet for sources etc, that would explain such high ‘approval ratings’ for R&T.
I would strongly dispute the minister’s conclusion from this survey and his parting shot at the end, indeed I would go as far as to say:
‘Members of the House are fools’ and would add ‘Members of the public are gullible, naive and foolish to believe anything that the msm has to say on even the most basic of subjects’.
—————————————
It’s also easily seen that swathes of ‘England/Wales’ are reliant on the traditional MSM and do indeed ‘have more faith in the BBC and national newspapers’ but what say they about Scotland’s 62% Remain and support for the SNP?
We were just as bombarded wi the crap as they were. Members of the public…in Scotland…are not fools. 😉
Has James Kelly got himself a job at the Herald, or has someone hacked it? Headline:
“Blow for Scottish Conservatives in new political poll”
Links
https://news.gov.scot/news/tenants-and-landlords-benefit-from-new-regulations
http://www.scottishhousingnews.com/19574/scotland-streets-ahead-england-affordable-housing-delivery/
https://www.autonomyscotland.org/the-understatement-of-the-century/
https://beta.gov.scot/news/record-nursing-and-midwifery-students/
http://scotgoespop.blogspot.co.uk/2018/01/mainstream-media-narrative-lies-in.html
https://spice-spotlight.scot/2018/01/30/private-financing-of-scotlands-infrastructure/
https://randompublicjournal.com/2018/01/26/britains-dirty-establishment/
http://www.holyrood.com/articles/inside-politics/maree-todd-her-journey-politics
UK minister in Edinburgh for Brexit talks
http://archive.is/Pycyk
http://rbs.postach.io/post/questionable-data
https://www.farminguk.com/news/Brexit-public-policy-and-trade-change-creating-perfect-storm-for-vet-shortage_48496.html
http://edition.cnn.com/2018/01/29/opinions/brexit-crisis-critial-for-may-walshe-opinion/index.html
Shares in UK government contractor Capita plunge 40% after profit warning
http://archive.is/y7qnD
The Leaked Brexit Analysis Shows How Cutting EU Immigration Will Hit The UK Economy
http://archive.is/Qg2ns
https://www.politico.eu/article/catalonias-carles-puigdemont-its-over/
http://jackofkent.com/2018/01/where-are-we-now-on-brexit/
@K1
Caught some of that survation poll late last night and couldn’t agree more. That is some impressive achievement by the current Scotgov right there. 🙂
Indyref still around the mid to high 40s% and EU remain up by 4% to 66%. All this in the teeth of a seemingly concerted and never ending torrent of misinformation from both establishment political practice and the media.
No too shabby. 🙂
Now that’s got to leave a mark.
Latest re Brexit -Site has been updated
https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/uk_withdrawal_en
May visit comes amid disagreements over Beijing’s overseas investment drive
https://www.ft.com/content/cb552198-02c0-11e8-9650-9c0ad2d7c5b5
Elm Guest House look like at being at the heart of a possible cover up in the long awaited investigation into how institutions handled allegations of child sexual abuse against prominent people in Westminster.
https://www.byline.com/column/22/article/2029
https://www.thecanary.co/uk/2018/01/31/an-arms-dealer-chose-the-worst-time-to-brag-about-what-its-getting-up-to-in-our-primary-schools-tweets/
This post if off-topic
I read a piece by the Sainted Eleanor Bradford, in The Guardian online this morning, which really sums-up what a bunch of absolute shites the London Establishment and the BBC management in Scotland are.
The poor lassie has become a central player in the BBC gender imbalance pay row; that’s shocking.
You would think, after all the sterling work the poor wee soul did on promoting “SNP Bad” and how often she told Scotland, the SNP was killing the Scottish Health Service, Eleanor might have got a massive bonus, or even a wee OBE for services to the Union, but, no, all the time she was being under-paid.
BBC management, cads and bounders the lot of them.
Nana,
Thank you for your links, the sun is shining here.
Kettle’s on!
🙂
https://www.politico.eu/article/catalonias-carles-puigdemont-its-over/
Not sure this is correct as Mr Puigdemont has denied it
Catalonia’s Puigdemont denies giving up after ‘defeat’ texts
http://archive.is/A3EI9
@Nana
Right on time Nana.
Good news on the poll front. 🙂
twathater at 2.03
Good post. That’s the right response.
That’s what to say to them…….
YOU voted for it!
YOU voted for austerity
YOU voted for slashed budgets
YOU voted to stay in a UK with £2 trillion national debt
YOU voted to go down with the sinking ship
Good morning, Nana.
Hope you’re keeping well.
Thanks again for all the LINKS you provide for breakfast. They go well with my coffee.
Take care. 🙂
Morning Smallaxe, tea for me please.
Morning Macart it sure is 🙂 The beeb will be fair scunnered, lol
Morning Baldeagle, you are welcome.
Some breakfast negativity from the Glasgow Heraldo about the use of the new Edinburgh Gateway station. Have mixed feelings about airport-related stations myself but they’ve lost no time in cutting in with figures after the thing’s only been open a couple of months. Hope it doesn’t go towards ‘derailing’ reopenings like Levenmouth as all the new lines so far have surpassed expectations. (Noticed that NESTRANS produced a negative report on an Aberdeen – Ellon line at the end of last year. Wouldn’t it have been better to have considered it as part of a Banchory – Ellon – (Peterhead) line? The Deeside element in particular must be viable.)
Macart says:
Offers considerable hope about what will happen when YES campaigning actually begins!
I do wonder, and others have said the same, is the “concerted and never ending torrent” actually counter productive for the BritNat cause?
I can’t see it converting people back – once they see the reality, you can’t un-see it. I can imagine it is retaining the gullible and disinterested, so perhaps that is the objective.
As Lincoln put it “You can fool all the people some of the time and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time.”
I think the point is that when you choose to fool people it also has an impact on those you fail to fool. And when to keep doing it, fewer get fooled.
The BBC’s commissioned report says there was no gender pay discrepancy in the BBC. Price Waterhouse is the same ilk as the reporter last week who said give me your story and I’ll spin it what ever way you want.
If you get the chance listen to Carrie Gracie yesterday talking to HOC committee you will see a highly competent honest reporter bringing the BBC to its knees. Part of problem too is outsourcing and making individuals self employed/free lance but not free to do other work – taking away many rights – private production companies also dilute the responsibility of the BBC.
Even kaye with an e must surely be thinking ‘something is not right here’.
Little Known Facts:-
Watching last night a documentary on the London Underground I was shocked but not surprised to be informed that The London Underground receives 50% of its income in the form of subsidy.
More taxpayers’ money bled from Scotland and the regions and poured in to SE England infrastructure.
It would be interesting to know just how much that comes to – does anybody know?
PictAtRandom @ 8.03am
I read the story in the Herald today about the new station.
It is a hub station next to the tram depot – change here for the airport – which has not received much if anything by way of publicity since it opened therefore perhaps not too surprising that the number of passengers using it in its first 11 months have not reached the projected target.
However, if you read far enough into the article you find that 1500 new houses are to be built near the station and a new International Business gateway, billed as a new city quarter for Edinburgh. Therefore it is likely to prove its worth in the not too distant future.
A little more on bbc brexit bias.
https://www.rt.com/uk/417514-bbc-bias-brexit-tibbit/
@galamcennalath
That’s my theory. I posted this upthread yesterday:
Whether simply lazy or dishonest, the message is ALWAYS the same – SNP bad.
There are two inevitable consequences of this approach. Firstly there’s the ‘cry wolf’ syndrome. If the SNP ever did truly go over to the dark side, who would now believe it other than those already tribally opposed to their existence? Constant misdirection and misrepresentation simply leaves the public less and less inclined to trust in the word of the media.
Secondly, the constant failure to represent at least fully half of the population and the fall in trust results in people walking away from your product. Where they are refused an ear or a platform, then people will make their feelings known by withholding their financial and moral support. Your business fails. Your profession is shunned. Your word and your opinion discounted.
Their choice right enough, but their narrative HAS created the current climate. They have no one to blame but themselves.
gus1940 says:
A quick Google says …
“23 Nov 2009 · A Conservative Government should scrap the £3 billion annual subsidy to Transport for London.”
… which gives a ball park figure, buses included.
People say England needs a parliament. I think it much more important that England is seen to have budget so its spending can be accounted separately from genuine UK wide expenditure .
Some English spending has Barnett consequencials ie health, education. All sorts of things they dip into the UK budget for aren’t covered. Infrastructure spending ie M25, Channel Tunnel, umpteen Thames crossings, all paid with UK money. I guess London transport subsidies are the same.
And UK money includes some Scottish money!
Great linksmanship for coffee time Nana! used to be a fag too.
All the BBC led vote tory msm propaganda, local, national, online, on the radio, all the tory professional liars, liggers and brown nosers possible, from beeb Scotland gimps, to Andrew Neil and dont call me a fascist, well maybe a little bit, Nic Robinson AND look at the strong and stable tory show today,
http://archive.is/cxWbV
Imagine a Scotland without BBC Scotland’s spectacular SNP out, vote tory fury raging away at us all, let alone every single vote tory shitrag out here.
And that doesn’t include the Billions of taxpayers’ money being spent on upgrading and expanding the Tube Network.
All that hard work talking down our SNHS, our railways, our education system, anything to do with Scotland. All that time spent monstering Nicola and SNP baaad. They’ve tried lying about what’s going on, they’ve tried ignoring all the good news and still they can’t shift the polls.
They must be wringing their wee hands with frustration.
What can we do to convince them that Scotland’s sh***e? And we’re, ahem, better together.
No, we’re not stupid but they are if they think we are.
The SNP are doing rather well considering how long they have governed. Obviously people approve in general.
Amazing to think that after everything over the last year especially in terms of negative reporting ,they still hold a majority.
People say England needs a parliament. I think it much more important that England is seen to have budget so its spending can be accounted separately from genuine UK wide expenditure”
Quite easy to do galamcennalath.
From the FT, Shawn Donnan, World Trade Editor JANUARY 29, 2014
Scots exports would be worth almost £100bn after independence
Fuelled by banking, whisky and oil, an independent Scotland would export goods and services worth almost £100bn, putting it among the top 35 exporters in the world, according to new data that could bolster the economic case for independence.
The trade data were released by the Scottish government on Wednesday, just as Mark Carney, Bank of England governor, was highlighting the strong economic links between Scotland and the rest of the UK and the potential fiscal and monetary complexities that independence would bring.
The estimate of Scotland’s 2012 exports lays out in stark terms the strength of Scotland’s economic ties with the UK. It shows that £47.6bn of a total £73.6bn in non-oil exports of goods and services, and almost half of its oil and gas exports were to the rest of the UK.
Mr Carney warned in his speech that the “high degree of integration between Scotland and the rest of the UK may in part depend on their being part of the same sovereign nation” and that the emergence of borders after independence could affect that.
But the numbers could also bolster the economic case for Scottish independence by offering a picture of a mature and independent trading nation that, while heavily reliant on oil and gas, would also be a vibrant exporter of other goods and services to the world.
“Scotland could be perfectly viable,” said Gavin McCrone, a former chief economic adviser to the Scottish government and author of the book Scottish Independence: Weighing Up the Economics.
The data, in the Scottish government’s annual Global Connections Survey, were scheduled for release long before Mr Carney’s speech was announced.
They estimate the value of Scotland’s 2012 non-oil exports of goods and services to the rest of the UK and the world at £73.6bn. A Scottish government spokesman said on Wednesday that it estimated oil and gas exports that year at £24.4bn.
Taken together those numbers put Scotland’s total 2012 exports at £98bn, making it the 34th biggest exporter in the world, just behind Denmark and ahead of the Czech Republic, oil-rich Qatar and emerging market darlings such as Nigeria and Vietnam.
There are still questions over what an independent Scotland’s total trade position would be. The Scottish government does not publish a comparable estimate for imports. How to split oil and gas revenues is also likely to be one of the most contentious elements of any post-referendum negotiations. It therefore remains difficult to assess just what Scotland’s oil and gas exports would be.
But based on survey responses from more than 2,000 companies in Scotland, the picture offered of the rest of the economy is far more concrete. It shows financial services accounted for £11.2bn of Scottish exports in 2012, making it by far the biggest single industry. Close behind with £8.7bn in exports in 2012 were food, beverages, and tobacco, of which the whisky industry accounted for £4.6bn.
The logistics of how an independent Scotland would trade with the rest of the UK – and the world – and whether independence would affect trade would depend on many different factors, said Mr McCrone.
Monetary union would ease trade and so too would both countries remaining members of the EU. According to the data, £11.7bn, or 45 per cent, of Scotland’s £26bn in exports beyond the UK went to EU member states in 2012.
But the future of a post-independence monetary union and both the UK and an independent Scotland’s EU membership remain open questions that will have to be dealt with in the future.
In his speech Mr Carney cited past economic research that had showed a “border effect” on trade between the US and Canada and in other parts of the world. Yet just what would happen to trade at the Scottish-English border post-independence is unclear, Mr McCrone said.
More certain is the likelihood that independence would come with some immediate “disruption” to trade should it happen. But with time – and negotiations – it would inevitably settle down, he said.
“It would be a bumpy ride to begin with and in the long term it would depend on how sensible government policies would be,” Mr McCrone said.
Glasgow was once a giant global finance centre but we all know the UKOK story by now.
London First, England extra First, Scots are scroungers off English taxpayer, vote NO Thanks, forever.
O/T
Wouldn’t it be great if we could disappear the useless Donalda Wotsername from PQ and replace her with Carrie Gracie with a view to her becoming the firat DG of SBC after Indpoendence.
I don’t know what Carrie’s views are re Indpendence but whatever they are she has surely demonstrated her integrity and belief in the truth when it comes to reporting news so that even if she supports The Union – with her in charge at PQ BCc Scotland would cease to be a Union Propaganda broadcaster.
@PictAtRandom
The Edinburgh Gateway Station is one for the future,there are plans for tens of thousands of new homes and businesses in the area (Cammo, Barnton,Maybury out to Newbridge,Ratho),
both sides of Glasgow Road out to Kirkliston,
i think there is going to be a new council estate in the Cammo fields near Barnton,
I remember Hermiston Gate was built and was empty for a long time now it`s jammed most days,
it`s called `Infrastructure for The 21st Century`.
auld highlander says:
I would like to see the same impartial analysis of those BBC programmes for pro/anti Indy support!
That level of bias would blow any Brexit bias out of the water, I’m sure.
Still, it is interesting that the BBC do also appear to be opinion forming rather than reporting on other issues.
Another example (perhaps the opposite of this Brexit finding) has been the ridiculously high coverage the BBC gave Farage and UKIP a few years ago. A fringe organisation with barely any voter backing. The BBC hyped them into prominence. If the BBC had never done this, Brexit would never have happened!
They could done the same with the English Greens. They didn’t though. Hyping right wing British Nationalist organisations is more the BBC’s style.
The Deeside element in particular must be viable.)
One of the most beautiful railway lines in the world too. When they shut it down, they tried to wreck some of the most beautiful stations anywhere too, mainly built for the pleasure of Empress of half the world Queen Victoria, who also blocked her Deeside railway crossing over the Cairngorms to Perth and Glasgow, it would have spoiled her Balmoral palace.
The economic loss of the Deeside Railway must be staggering.
When they shut it all down, Aberdeen was and still is left with a very thin Victorian road network, all of which has barely managed to cope with traffic for the oil capital of Europe.
Why did the great yoons of UKOK in Scotland not invest in transport in the north east of Scotland, let alone the 5 decades of Europe’s oil capital status for Aberdeen, as every single English town and city enjoyed and enjoys massive road and rail infrastructure investments?
Shut it. Its good enough. England First. Rule Britannia, you lot don’t need etc etc.
Wonder if Eleanor Bradford is bitter enough at the abuse she suffered to spill the beans on her Pacific Quay handlers.
Quite a bit is being said about planes post-brexit but what about lorries?
This thread from Sam Coates@ The Times
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesTimes/status/959006960556396549
‘First civil service analysis for the bill makes “no deal” look unattractive.
Britain’s 75,000 hauliers can use EU roads because of EU membership. If we crash out they rely on a permit system for “3rd countries”
Officials think we will get 1,200 permits, devastating the industry
and in the same thread re lorry stacking for Dover, another example of ‘competent government’,
‘Around 15m was spent drawing up plans for the park to hold 3,600 HGVs … DfT dropped the proposals … after it emerged that officials failed to carry out an environmental impact assessment’
Strong and stable, sunlit uplands etc.
Fred
It crossed my mind that some beans might get spilled in the battle for equal pay. I certainly hope so. It always seemed that Bradford was working to a very specific brief. A brief I am not convinced she was entirely personally invested in.
Another example (perhaps the opposite of this Brexit finding) has been the ridiculously high coverage the BBC gave Farage and UKIP a few years ago. A fringe organisation with barely any voter backing. The BBC hyped them into prominence. If the BBC had never done this, Brexit would never have happened!”
Indeed. But we have to wonder, who specifically makes the decision at or for the BBC, to make a dude like Farage a household name?
We can only really guess as to who it is that sits around the BBC conference desk and plans things like, Nigel Farage will be on the lips of every Brit, with in say the next 6 months and for decades to come.
This is the ultimate corruption of any media outfit really, no one really knows how it works, much like mafias around the world really. At least we all know that its Rupert Murdoch’s opinion we see on SKY or the SUN.
We can speculate though. BBC Scotland is clearly run by extremely reactionary tory britnats, but how are they able to operate with so little public scrutiny and accountability? We cant even know their view figures.
They dont look like much in real life. Over a year ago, I found myself alone in a Glasgow auction house sales room with the last great king of BBC Scotland Ken MacQuarry.
It was interesting watching this little toady wee guy, grumpy, unattractive but very expensive suit, scuttling about examining auction furniture, totally oblivious to the world around him, he could have been a successful lawyer, business or property dude. When he finished, he nipped outside and jumped in to the usual £100+k German saloon, zoomed off back to town.
That little guy ultimately changed the course of Scottish history the year before, he certainly shapes how Scots like us view our region of the UK, but above all else, he definitely does not want any public credit for it all, just his juicy promotion up to the fabulously well paid beeb gimp ranks, maybe an OBE when its all over.
BBC are not the mafia, they’re much more powerful.
It’s not about immigration and trade deals. These are just the consequentials. Important as they are, the heart of the matter is POWER.
Brexit is about power. The EU diluted some of the UK Establishment’s power.
The UK Establishment want ALL the power. That’s also why, at the same time there is the devolution power grab, sent to the unelected, unaccountable Lords.
That’s how, even when all scenarios predict negative economic consequences for the UK, Brexit must go ahead at ANY cost ( for others) in the minds of these people.
As you can guarantee, for those who have all that power, they won’t be the ones suffering economically. They’ll be the ones with ALL the power to run the UK the way that suits them. To channel all the money towards themselves, even more than now.
They call it UK sovereignty. I talk about the sovereignty of the Scottish people.
When you hear or read sovereignty: think “power”:
People have to think and decide:
Do you want the ordinary people of Scotland to have the power to decide how our country should be run? A country run for the good of all, including the ordinary people.
or
The unlimited, undiluted sovereignty ( power) of (WM) Parliament to do whatever it wants to? A country run by the rich with unlimited power, for the rich, to make the rich even richer at the detriment of the rest ( think Scotland in Union and Lords types).
That’s why these same people want the Human Rights Act abolished (which came from the European Convention on Human Rights): It gave people extra protection from abuse by the state. It put a check on the unlimited power of the UK Establishment.
That’s why they feed the population constant propaganda ( about the SNP, Greens etc) to undermine the opponents of unlimited power for WM Parliament, unlimited power the UK ruling Establishment.
We can have a prosperous country run for the good of all.
The best way to do that is by supporting independence for Scotland.
heedtracker says:
Ref Scotland’s trade with England, why oh why, no one says this very often and rarely often enough.
England makes much more by supplying us with, well, everything you can imagine.
They knowingly sell much more to us than we do to them.
The figures, which will certainly be deliberately on the low side that is what they do. So Carney spouting on about some type of border, well Yes, there could be a border of sorts but the wave through kind, they would be digging a much bigger hole for themselves if they did want a hard border.
So no serious type of border would be implemented, of course there may be a general traffic border check for immigrants ( as we will likely be in the EU) but very little for the goods industry.
It would be another shot in England’s foot to impede cross border trade. Add to that, it would cause a huge loss of jobs and income, for English companies who thrive from Scottish trade. Something England could not afford to happen.
They know Scotland means huge trade for them, and would have to make a border as soft as possible for goods transfer.
But my point remains, even Carney left that fact out. England makes FAR more from us than we do from them. We should shout it at all times, and our politicians should be doing the same in any media interviews, parliaments, ie ours and Westminster.
It is another Westminster con, that many of our own forget to debunk just too often.
Now I’m beginning to form the idea of discontented “Bradford Woman” as one of the key swing voters in IndyRef2. So if you were to go full Blairite who else would you include in the focus group? And where is Middle Scotland anyway?
Can I just throw this into the mix.
‘If they don’t report the truth how can we?
Former BBC China editor Carrie Gracie who resigned from her post in protest at pay inequality, is giving evidence to a committee of MPs.
Maybe Donalda of BBC Scotland should tell her staff that is what they should she did say she wants to get our trust back.
That clip from Carrie Gracie is worth a listen.
Westminster is up to its ears in debt, it’s having issues with its European neighbours, it needs Scotland’s resources, it threatening to stop trade with Scotland if we are independent. Remind you of any other period from the past?
O/T
Long post – apologies.
I had a discussion in the pub last night with an SNP member and activist. (I’m not an SNP member btw). My view in this discussion was that the FM will review the BREXIT deal which will likely become known in the autumn of this year and if that looks bad for Scotland (we voted to REMAIN in the EU remember) she will take a decision then to hold a 2nd IndyRef. If that happens in the Autumn then I would suspect IndyRef2 within a few months at most – certainly before BREXIT date.
I was surprised that this SNP activist did not share this view and believes (quite strongly) that the FM should only call a 2nd IndyRef when she believes it can be won and she will only know that if the opinion polls regularly have indy polling at around 60%.
This activist believes we should wait till at least 2021, after the NEXT Scottish Elections. States it would be better for SNP to stand at next SEs on a clear mandate of a 2nd IndyRef.
I was utterly horrified by this activist’s views. Perfectly entitled to have them, of course, but so much at odds with my own thinking and that of many here on WoS.
I made the point that if the SNP do not use the IndyRef2 mandate it ALREADY HAS then it will be fatally wounded in subsequent Scottish Elections. Look at what happened in GE last year. Tories arguing “NO to a 2nd IndyRef” and SNP responding with “What 2nd IndyRef?” No wonder so many SNP voters stayed at home! Many would have been thinking what is the point in voting for the SNP if they are not going to push for indy at every opportunity they get, i.e. if a majority is won at Scottish Elections, UK GEs or IndyRefs?
This activist felt that we only have one more crack at this for at least a “generation” because people are too fed up with politics and referendums. Again a view I simply do not share. In my view Scotland has woken up from a 310 year political slumber and is energised again; has realised what a complete disaster the Union has been for our country. Sure there are those who would rather we went back to sleep again but that simply isn’t going to happen. The political landscape has changed as has the appetite of Scots for that change.
The SNP are the main vehicle to bring about Indy and that is the ticket they should be standing on at EVERY election, imv. If people don’t want indy in a SE or GE, or another indy referendum then they don’t have to vote for the SNP. If they DO want immediate indy then give the SNP a majority in SEs or GEs or if an Indy referendum every 4 or 5 years then vote SNP.
FGS – look at the Swiss – they are constantly having referendums. The idea that Scots don’t want to have Indy Refs any chance they can is just WM perfidious conditioning. It’s bollocks. We have woken up and are hungry for change. You don’t have the Tories or Labour or UKIP or Greens abandoning their key policies/ideology or placing them on ice – so why should the SNP?
We have a very short window here and it is becoming narrower by the day. In my view, we should have the vote BEFORE we BREXIT. If we vote YES then the EU can keep us in a ‘holding position’ until the divorce settlement is completed. And those negotiations will be so much more in our favour if we are still technically in the EU – we will have the EU backing our position. If we wait until after BREXIT then I think the opportunity of many lifetimes will be lost.
We are very close to the tipping point. When the full effects of BREXIT become clearer (and this is slowly starting to happen and to dawn on people) there will be a sudden and significant swing to YES. We’re almost at that point and when it happens (and it WILL happen), the FM shouldn’t dither.
I wis not a little scunnered by this activist’s ‘caution’.
History shows us that when one country threatens another eventually the population of the country being threatened stands even firmer together, so all these threats from The British Nationalist parties about Scotland somehow being locked out of trade with England will only succeed in demonstrating to Scots that England governments are what we said they are, bullies
Keep up the threatning Yoons you’re proving our point just like you did with Ireland, so find an Irish person who has anything good to say about England government
I’ll give you a head start
Rent a mouth Bradford could sing like a canary about the lies and misinformation and UK propaganda that she spouted on behalf of her State controlled BBC employers,
but she will have no platform to sing from,
the establishment MSM as one will slam close the doors on her if she speaks out,
think the state BBC will throw her a bone to shut her up,maybe a stint in US with that other rent a mouth James Cook.
@Proud Cybernat
That must be the activists own views. I’m an SNP activist and all the members I know want another referendum in the Autumn.
That is Peter Bell,s view too.
Despite oil price now at $70 and rising there is no point of holding another referendum until such time as we can be reasonably confident of winning it with say regular opinion polls showing 60% support.
Losing a second referendum will set back the prospect of independence for at least another 20 years.
heedtracker says:
1 February, 2018 at 10:31 am
Why did the great yoons of UKOK in Scotland not invest in transport in the north east of Scotland, let alone the 5 decades of Europe’s oil capital status for Aberdeen, as every single English town and city enjoyed and enjoys massive road and rail infrastructure investments?
Heedtracker, I have just returned fro a trip to Ireland, and seeing all the massive transport infrastructure and investment over there was enough to make me weep – for Scotland. Shiny new trams, trains, motorways, airports, subways – all constructed during the past 30 years – with no oil money!
Yes we now have a shiny new bridge, but no thanks to WM and it could have been a lot more (been to Norway recently?). What could Scotland have been like it if the British Nationalists had invested wisely, instead of channelling all the oil money into overdeveloped London, nuclear phallus symbols and of course those deep tory pockets that are never satisfied (private contractors).
Scotland did benefit from the old empire, but we have now paid back many times over IMO. Time to end this corrupt union.
@Proud Cybernat
I agree with your view that IndyRef2 must be soonish. The BritNats are trying to hold out for Holyrood2021 and expect to win a non Indy majority.
Today’s Survation poll is promising for us, but it falls short of a Holyrood Indy majority. The SNP would be the biggest party but we know if there was a BritNat majority there would be no IndyRef2. Waiting seems stupid.
As for the activist you spoke to ….
I am a member of the SNP and others I speak to are ‘champing at the bit’ too.
However, I get another feeling from long term members. Some having been members for many decades. They have seen the ups and downs. Yes, they are in it for Indy, but they are also in it for party politics. They think long term and they put a lot of focus on winning elections to gain power and implement policy, not just Indy.
I’m in for Indy. I am one of the ones who joined late 2014. I see the SNP as a means to that end. Better governance between now and Indy is part of the means by which Indy can be won.
But I certainly don’t support the SNP in a blind tribal way. “My party right or wrong” is certainly not my philosophy. It is for some members though.
If the SNP wait until after Holyrood2021, lose a pro Indy majority, and with that any chance of independence, I will resign membership and give up being an activist.
Why do BBC Scotland more or less ignore reporting Brexit. I suspect it is an edict from central control that Brexit is a UK matter and reporting of it is reserved for the network (London).
“Losing a second referendum will set back the prospect of independence for at least another 20 years.”
Disagree. The SNP can stand on an Indy ticket at every UK GE – they just have to decide to do it. If they win a majority of seats and a majority of popular vote then they can declare indy. Just stick it in their manifesto at UK GEs and Scottish Elections. If people don’t fancy it they don’t have to vote for it. Democracy in action. That way Scots get to vote on indy every 5 years or so.
Do you have any faith in UK controlled opinion polls … I don’t. But will trust SNP with the timing which I think is getting close.
Proud Cybemat – Agreed People won’t hang around for ever ,
This media deluge , since 2014 has and must have taken its toll , this Chip – Chip – Chip bit by bit eroding any gains made , Being picked off on a daily basis ain’t the way to inspire confidence
I for one expected fireworks after we elected every MP bar three, that I believe was Scottish people’s answer to Cameron’s EVIL it was a collective up yours Davey boy go f/k yourself Pal .
Even Maggie gave up trying to get Scots on her side , If a majority of MPs are voted into place by the SNP that’s it game over the people have spoken . Start preparing the evictions of folks who would disrupt a nation in the process of re gaining its pride and place in the world .
Every election is another referendum , who says all the bloody Unionist parties .
Sinky says:
Probably.
However, losing a pro Indy majority at Holyrood2021 would end up doing the same.
In a multi party system achieving that situation in Holyrood will always be a tall order. It’s been done twice, but only just.
The BritNats will make sure Holyrood is never able to call another IndyRef after this current constitutional upheaval is over, by one means or another.
We have only two options IMO …
Use the mandate we have and call IR2 soonish
or
Try to win Holyrood2021 and call it shortly after
I think we have a good chance of winning IR2 soon, I have low confidence that we can win a pro Indy majority in Holyrood2021.
Not sure why all the doubt about when the next Independence referendum will be. We have already been told that it will be in this parliament.
Proud Cybernat @ 11:26,
I agree with you there. That may be one individual’s personal view, but I don’t believe it’s just down to one person either. We get a hint of it from time to time from a couple of the usual suspects on here too.
There seems to be a “caution-ist” faction within the SNP who are not prepared to make a move until there is a significant swing in public opinion first. Which rather begs the question as to how the swing will ever actually come about.
You might think that the emerging true facts about Brexit would provide a more-than-sufficient wake-up call, but among the public-at-large there still seems to be a large element of “wait and see” mixed with a certain weariness about politics in general that is acting as a brake. So maybe right now this very minute is not the right time. (To coin a phrase.)
But there must be a clear purpose in mind also. A certain lack of that is arguably what set the SNP back at the last UKGE, which ironically – for a time anyway – seems to have encouraged (if that is the right word!) this cautionist element. But thankfully that seems to be changing now.
It may be that Brexit is like the Antartic ice shelf, slowly melting away underneath without any obvious change, then suddenly a whole slew breaks off. But simply waiting for some kind of big public shift to work its magic seems like a fundamentally flawed and defeatist strategy to me. There has to be way more “push” than that, especially given all the forces around that are actively trying to suppress it.
The stable base for “yes” since 2014 makes for a great starting point for IR2, but “events” alone are never going to be enough. It is going to require leadership from the front at the right time to get that win.
In the meantime, it seems that there some among the SNP membership who could do with a good dose of positive thinking.
O/T
re;Heedtracker@10.31am
Aye, Queen Vicky wouldn’t have wanted the plebs taking the train to near that beautiful (stolen) land and castles up in Deeside, now would she.
I was watching some wee films online, National Library of Scotland, image archive a while ago, some about infrastructure. One which said that the roads up to the highlands, were built when things like hydro and other money making industries for England were started, and quarrying, they needed all that stone to build English roads and buildings in London. I think the crags in Edinburgh were quarried to build bridges and some major buildings in London, far as I have read.
The only reason Scotland has any roads or rail is so that the land takers could get around, and get to Scotland’s resources, they obviously didn’t think ahead when it came to the Aberdeen area and all that oil. I still have the article from Feb 2014, from a Newcastle rag, a full page, advertising for people to turn up who had skills in oil industry, for jobs coming up in Scotland, cos lots of them needed. Oh aye.
Proud Cybernat@11.26
On the subject of a second independence referendum, I think Nicola will have the measure of things, totally. Anyone saying to leave it until after Brexit is done and dusted and after the next Scottish election in 2021, is being daft. In that scenario they may not be a Scottish parliament!
Also, the Britnats are watching, and waiting, like cats at a mouse hole, and so to keep it in the bag for as long as poss, is a very good idea imo.
Proud Cybernat says:
True. It would need to be a policy of UDI. That would be a major change of direction for the SNP. It would also not go down so well internationally as winning a straight forward referendum.
It would also need a lot of voter reorientation. Clearly at the moment many don’t see a direct correlation between party support and independence. They should, but they don’t.
Brexit minister suggests civil servants may be conspiring against the government
https://f7td5.app.goo.gl/HltV3zy9h2ho2vAW2
Its a conspiracy ah tell ye..!!
K1 @4.15am.
Cracking post there, just shows how public opinion can change if they feel under attack.
Watching FMQs – can Small Dick get any more pathetic?
BLiS is now out through the bottom of the barrel, but, seems incapable of stopping digging.
I get the impression the First Minister is rapidly running out of patience with the sheer stupidity fo Small Dick’s weekly performance at FMQs.
And as for Colonel Yadaftie. She (again) got her erse handed to her on a plate, but, she will keep coming back for more, she’s the political equivalent of Monty Python’s Black Knight.
Again Richard Leonard is a total embarrassment at FMQs. He hasn’t moved on from student politics as your rhetoric must have some kind of credibility if you want people to believe you.
He wants a wealth tax but Scottish government doesn’t have this power thanks to Labour and Tories opposing devolving this.
No wonder latest survation opinion polls shows SNP in the lead.
http://thenational.scot/news/15912860.Latest_poll_reveals_Scottish_Conservatives_set_to_LOSE_five_seats_to_the_SNP/
Holyrood Constituency Voting Intention:
SNP 42% (+2); LAB 25% (-2); CON 25% (+1); LD 6% (-1); Other 2% (NC)
Westminster Voting Intention:
SNP 39% (+2); LAB – 27% (-2); CON 24% (NC); LD 7% (NC); Other 3% (NC)
Artyhetty says:
1 February, 2018 at 12:10 pm
O/T
re;Heedtracker@10.31am
Aye, Queen Vicky wouldn’t have wanted the plebs taking the train to near that beautiful (stolen) land and castles up in Deeside, now would she.
It was her Imperial railway though. London, Edinburgh, Aberdeen, Ballater.
They’ve just managed to let the the Ballater station burn too.
Its amazing to think that some of the world’s greatest ever imperial powers floated up that Deeside line, Tsar Nicholas II and family for one, all kinds of German imperial rellies, incredibly powerful British imperial Prime Ministers, victorian celebs, you name it, all to entertain the most powerful empress the world has ever seen, before or since.
In fact the Tsar of Russia’s last hols abroad were probably up the Deeside line to visit Victoria at Balmoral, who then refused the Tsar sanctuary as the Russian revolution looked like succeeding. No point in winding up her Brit huddled masses, subjects, living like slaves.
Its interesting to speculate just how rich and powerful Victoria’s descendants are today and how Tsar Nicholas lost absolutely everything.
Future King Charles has his own private train, so you never really know whether the old Imperial Deeside line will actually be reopened.
The more things change in teamGB…
Aye, the cowal games in Dunoon, that’s when the pubs doubled the prices,apart from one that is, and that’s the pub i went to,i even bypassed my local up in the scheme as even it doubled its prices
Apart from that aspect, a great place to visit,especially in the summer months
O/T
Mike Russell: Time for talking about Brexit legislation amendments well over
http://archive.is/PcFnj
“Brexit minister suggests civil servants may be conspiring against the government
Just like they conspired against YES campaign in IndyRef1 “in the national interest”. Karma can be a right bugger at times.
The unionists are using the statute of limitation (30 pupils per class) as the norm for years to cut £Millions from education allocation. Cutting essential services. Instead spending money on grotesque projects of no value. The Greens are so out of touch. Aberdeen City £1.2Billion in debt. Selling off the City on the stock exchange. £200Million spent in the biggest mess in the City Centre. Shutting off roads causing traffic chaos. Spending £300Million on a Conference Centre with no business case. They are a total disgrace. Not fit for public office. A two jobs Tory keeping these unionists in power. What about local democracy. The unionists even changed the electoral system so these 3rd rate rejects could get in.
Police Scotland is getting the police sorted out from unionist corruption.The LibDems are out of touch. The Police are being held to account. Too many people are being put in cells on charges that can never come to court. That needs sorted out.
heedtracker
With respect, maybe if you had had an old-fashioned Scottish education, you would have known, old Vicky died in 1901, Tasr Nicholas was not looking for a bolt hole from the Russian Revolution until 1917, by which time it was Vicky’s Grandson George V who was on the imperial throne.
Picked up from WoS twitter
Should Scotland be an independent country? (women/men)
Yes: 49/43%
No: 51/57%
(Survation 24 – 28 January 2018)
From survation itself …
Yes M 42.7% F 49.1%
No M 57.3% F 50.9%
Come on lads! What the Hell’s going on here?
Total guess, but I reckon it might have something to do with the differential change YES/NO because of Remain/Leave.
In NET terms perhaps, YES has lost more Leave/YES males, but gained more Remain/NO females.
Q.By what right can the Scot Govt demand an indyref?
A. Electoral mandate ( though it’s not a “right”, it’s a convention like Sewel and like all elections.). The people voted for it, well 46.5% voted for their manifesto, that included a suggestion of an indyref.
Note: not a majority, but they got the parliamentary mandate with support from the Greens.
But, the UK Govt ignored that convention, when the FM sought indyref talks. That was a major flouting of constitutional convention. ( We have another one with the devolution power grab).
MPs or MSPs, the fundamental basis is the same: electoral mandate.
That’s why – before devolution – the SNP for decades had a legitimate policy that, if a majority of SNP Scottish MPs are elected, it’s a mandate to negotiate independence. Even the likes of Mrs Thatcher recognised that.
The main reason the SNP adopted the indyref policy was, it could increase the chance of getting power at Holyrood, as people could then vote SNP without supporting independence. The SNP hoped to prove they are capable of running devolved( and indy) Scotland – hence anti-SNP propaganda all the time in the Unionist media. It was an opportunity to prove competence in government; a chance to prove Scots aren’t too stupid to run their own affairs.
It had NOTHING to do with it being more democratic, as it isn’t. It was two or three bites at the cherry; avoiding putting all the eggs in one basket. A foot in the door.
Voters could elect devolution SNP. Voters could elect SNP MPs.
Voters could reject what used to be the core policy of the SNP: independence, and not risk a single SNP MSP or MP seat.
It works. It worked. The SNP became the Scottish Govt.
They had an indyref and the electorate rejected independence, their former core policy, but the SNP GAINED a huge increase in MPs, they are still the biggest party at Holyrood too.
Sinky @ 11:50,
Actually I don’t buy that. Despite Alex Salmond’s turn of phrase last time round, widely misused since by the BritNats, we haven’t gone away at all since. The facts of the situation haven’t changed, and consequently our opinion hasn’t changed either. In fact, it has hardened.
There comes a time when you have to do like Caesar, cast the dice and take the consequences, otherwise you spend the rest of your life regretting a failure to act. (“I coulda been a contender…”) One path, taken with sound judgement and purpose, might lead to success, the other way leads inevitably to failure.
Ask yourself one thing: why are the BritNats so desperate to avoid having IR2? Might they just be afraid that this time they are at very serious risk of losing?
Arch Unionist David Bell quoted by opposition at FMQs is a leading member of the London based anti independence grouping These Islands whose Advisory Council is listed here
http://www.these-islands.co.uk/advisory_council/d3/
The Chair and founder member is pet food salesman Kevin Hague
Socrates MacSporran says:
1 February, 2018 at 12:44 pm
heedtracker
No need for respect Socrates:D
So, in correction, Tsar Nicholas 11 of Russia was refused sanctuary not by Victoria but her grandson, George V.
Happy?
More women than men now YES.
The Tories are taxing the Oil & Gas sector 40% since Jan 2016. Ruining the industry and losing £Billions and 120,000 jobs. Scotland has to pay £Billions a year on loan repayments not borrowed or spent in Scotland. £1Billion on Trident. Minimum pricing in May will save £Billions. Tax evasion costs £3Billion. HMRC not fit for purpose. Illegal wars cost £Billions. Financial Fraud etc.
Scotland loses £20Billion to Westminster misappropriation, mismanagement and ignorant incompetence. Brexit will cost Scotland even more.
robert js
They are against holding indyref2 for the most basic of reasons in politics.
Self Preservation.
If Scotland votes Yes, then EVERY unionist politician in Scotland is OUT of office as a result.
All unionist parties are UK parties, and as such could no more operate in an Independent Scotland’s politics than the 35 SNP MP’s could remain working at WM post Yes.
That is the actual reason they are against even holding indyref2.
Self Preservation, no more, no less.
But 45% voted for independence. That desire for independence remains high according to polls.
The FM and current leadership of the SNP are products of the “play it safe” policy. She was a List MSP twice before eventually winning a seat.
The SNP now face a dilemma:
They have the mandate in the eyes of SNP voters. Support for the SNP is still high.
But, independence is not the majority view in opinion polls.
If they did have an indyref, the UK Govt can simply breach convention again and ignore it if YES won, but herald it as democracy, the sovereign people have spoken, if NO won.
The SNP wouldn’t barely mention the “I” word for years after one lost indyref. What then if two are lost? Would people stop supporting the SNP? Or what?
Even if YES won, the Scot Govt cannot legislate for independence. The FM is a Privy Counsellor of HM Queen now, part of the British political Establishment. Mainstream. Can you see her revolting against the shackles of devolution and against the British Establishment for breach of political convention? No chance.
A govt mandate ends with the end of that parliamentary term. Till date, 2011 was a one-off; the only time ANY party has gained a majority at Holyrood and that’s when indyref was endorsed by the UK Govt. Indyref2 got voted through the SP by just 10 votes. That means only five or six seats less after the SP election in 2021 and there is no chance of another indyref for at least another five years.
It’s a dilemma, but till date the SNP have always played it safe for the SNP.
My prediction – and it’s only a prediction – is that the SNP will say because of all the Brexit legislation time required at HRD and WM, there is not enough time to vote for and implement independence, so no point in holding an indyref this term.
That will also serve as another carrot to keep independists voting SNP along with devolution supporters. “Vote SNP for indyref in 2021. The SNP will settle for another minority devolution govt, that can’t deliver independence or even an indyref . In the meantime the SNP political class stay in regular employment, jobs for life in many cases, and stay in limited power.
Do you think they will risk their safe livelihoods for an against the odds shot at indy that the UK Govt would ignore anyway? Gesture politics. That they cannot implement. I don’t.
‘Ian Murray: Labour’s ‘jobs first’ Brexit shown up as impossible.
‘LABOUR MP Ian Murray has launched a scathing attack on Jeremy Corbyn and Richard Leonard saying the leaked UK Government economic assessments about the effects of leaving the EU prove Labour’s “jobs first Brexit” is impossible.
The former shadow Scottish secretary hit out after a secret report concluded that the UK would be worse off regardless of whether it departed the bloc via a soft Brexit or a hard one….
http://www.thenational.scot/news/15911073.Murray__Report_blows_Labour_s____jobs_first____Brexit_out_of_the_water/
……………………….
‘Scottish Affairs Committee looks at immigration needs.’
….’ The meeting comes as Scottish academics prepare to examine how politicians and the media shape perceptions of refugees in a £3 million study on the impact of the migrant crisis on Europe.
Researchers from Glasgow Caledonian University (GCU) will study how political speeches on immigration, and the resulting coverage, shape public perception. They will also travel to Turkey and Iraq to set up “advice clinics” to ensure migrants and refugees have access to accurate information, as part of the three-year Respond project – an EU-funded review of mass migration to Europe.
Dr Umut Korkut of GCU said: “Our researchers will concentrate on three types of newspapers in each country; conservative, liberal and middle ground and see how the politicians’ speeches are put into context.
“The plan is to establish legal aid, educational aid, employment aid and public health clinics, in Istanbul and Baghdad, and we will also look to host a series of lectures to dispel the false news about immigration into the European Union.”
http://www.thenational.scot/news/15905377.MPs_look_at_Scotland___s_immigration_needs/
So, it would be an interesting poll: SNP voters in 2016:
Would you again vote SNP in 2021 if the SNP did hold indyref2?
O/T
Protecting Scotland’s interests
https://news.gov.scot/news/protecting-scotlands-interests-1
Sorry, I meant to write:
SNP voters:
Would you vote SNP in 2021 if the SNP did hold NOT indyref2?
Would you vote SNP in 2021 if the SNP held indyref2 and No won again?
Should the Scot Govt hold an indyref2, even if opinion polls suggest independence is not the favoured option before an indyref is held?
Should the Scot Govt hold an indyref2, even if the UK Govt say they will not legally or politically recognise the result?
England blocking trade with iScot, eh?
So where will they get their leccy from? The lines from Fr and NL already run to capacity importing or are they expecting such a huge economic downturn that their requirement will drop by the 14% (or whatever it is) that they currently import from here.
Bit of a water problem too, I believe.
Had the misfortune to read the Bill Leckie column in an abandoned copy of the Sun in a cafe this morning. He is ranting on about the proposed 20% pay rise for fire service personnel over 4 years in exchange for undertaking additional dangerous duties re weather disasters, terrorism or air sea rescue incidents.
Okay Bill tell us, in your opinion who should be tackling these incidents?. better still tell your loyal follower (s) who is actually doing them at the moment?
Leckie (Brit Nat follower and SNP full time basher) thinks that fire service personnel should be paid £50,000 per year. I could perhaps agree with him along with our health and police personnel. However like all Brit Nats he proposes pay increases for everybody but fails to come up with ANY answers as to how these would be funded.
He either doesn’t know (probably) or ignores (definately) that 82% of powers that would allow these increases to happen are retained by westminster. The easiest job in the world is to make whatever proposals you want because you don’t have to come up with ANY answers.
Leckie along with his look alike pal Neil Finlay are old school Labour. Bitter and twisted individuals who have never accepted that labour in Scotland no longer exist. They refuse to get into the 20th century never mind the 21st.
geeo @ 13:06,
Yeah, we only have to win once and they lose forever!
FMQs should carry a PG rating these days. The FM was in combative form, which apparently you’re not meant to be in when being chinned by assorted buffalo wranglers, Steptoe stand-ins and thingy.
Mr Leonard especially should have stayed in bed today. No REALLY! The fella should have just pulled the Kashmir covered Eider down duvet over his coif and begged off work. That was an appalling ear cuffing he took and no wonder. Halting, ill prepared question. The charisma of a frozen haddock. The mental agility under response of equally cold porridge. Oh, for the love of God! THE HUMANITY! 😉
I think I get it now though. Most of the week the FM and SG take awful abuse from these … politicians… and their meeja chums without right of equal response or redress. Strikes me that FMQs is the only place they can publicly dish out a proper dose of well deserved Karma.
Move over DONALDA MACKINNON.
The Scots are looking for an honest, fair-minded Director at BBC Scotland.
Make way for CARRIE GRACIE.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrie_Gracie
………………….
‘Carrie Gracie’s values put the BBC to shame.’
‘WHO would have guessed a Commons select committee could make edge-of-the seat, compulsive viewing? But then how many times is a witness as smart and searingly honest as the BBC’s former China editor, in the Westminster hot seat?…..
‘Carrie is actually a Scots lass – her father was a Scottish oil executive and though she was born in Bahrain while he was on assignment there, she was educated in Aberdeenshire and Glasgow before studying at Edinburgh University. In 1985, long before it was fashionable, she went to teach in China, learned to speak fluent Mandarin, took a Chinese degree, worked in the BBC World Service soon becoming a correspondent and presenter…’
http://www.thenational.scot/news/15911049.Carrie_Gracie___s_values_put_the_BBC_to_shame/?ref=mr&lp=7
…………………………………….
Looks as though they think they’ll still be ruling the roost in Scotland come 2022!
‘Defence chiefs spend more than £100m on Trident decision.’
….’ Under MoD plans, new submarine schools being established at Faslane – the UK’s submarine hub – will offer academic and technical training for all RN personnel entering the service from 2022.
The MoD said it means that all submariners’ careers, whether afloat or ashore, will be principally conducted from Faslane as part of a £1.3 billion investment in creating the Clyde hub….’
http://www.thenational.scot/news/15905062.Defence_chiefs_spend_more_than___100m_on_Trident_decision/
Scottish Parliament TV.
FIRST MINISTER’S QUESTIONS.
1st. February 2018.
Proceedings now Archived and available here:
https://tinyurl.com/yc2fr7z6
@Nana
“Take steps”. 🙂
Dammit! Hit the post button before I was ready.
The SG will be inclined to take steps in the very near future I’d say. This quote from Mr Russell is the kicker.
“Because of their failure so far to listen, there is currently no prospect of the Scottish Parliament giving its consent. That is why we need to press ahead with our own preparations to ensure Scotland’s laws are protected in the event the UK leaves the EU.”
Long letter in the National. Someone who’s not too happy with the Scottish Government, on Land Reform, which I agree with.
‘Letters: How can we lead on health as tenant farmers are evicted?’
‘How deeply ironic that on his visit to Scotland Bill Gates emphasised the importance of agriculture for health, and Scotland’s leading role in helping prevent malnutrition around the world, yet at this very time hundreds of food-producing tenant farmers across Scotland are being evicted or otherwise losing their tenancies so that landowners can reap the financial benefits of forestry grants (Gates praises Scottish impact on modern life, The National, January 27).
Rob Gibson (Letters, January 24) rightly points out that evicting a limited partnership farm tenant is legal, as were the infamous Clearances of the Highlands, Lowlands and Borders of past centuries. Legal yes, moral no.
Many of the limited partnership tenancies at risk today were secure leases carried over decades, even centuries, but it appears estate factors over time made changes to the fine wording. Assurances might have been given that the estate would never put them out, no need to worry, but these loose words allowed the estates to achieve the desired aim of having only insecure tenancies – the zero-hour contracts of property.
Rob will know better than me that our landed elite were greatly shocked when the 2003 Land Reform Act was passed by the newly reinstated Scottish Parliament, as this significantly eroded their power, and they lost no time in spending vast amounts of money hiring expensive lawyers to protect their interests, and full-time lobbyists to do the same in Holyrood itself. Votes on puppy tail docking, snares etc show their effectiveness. Lobbying also led to vast grants being made available for tree planting, irrespective of the consequences, which are the root of these present tenant farmer evictions in the Borders and all over Scotland.
Further largesse was also handed to landlords by the Scottish Government in the shape of very loose rules on farm subsidies, which allow tenants to be evicted and the landlord to claim the cash. This policy has seen, startlingly, many hundreds of farming families and their employees evicted all over Scotland – the very people that would have been, should be, producing “Scotland The Brand” fresh local food products. The remedial order of 2014 had the effect of assisting with evictions – is this really the same “progressive government” lauded for helping improve nutrition in impoverished countries?
Heartbreakingly, the situation has also arisen that limited partnership tenants who had less than a five-year lease have effectively been excluded from the Scottish Rural Development Programme for 12 long and hungry years – most of the money, I have been told, being scooped up by large landowners.
Scottish land reform is indeed a highly complex issue, but some simple measures could surely easily be put in place to protect not only these farm tenants but also the health of our own people, who are amongst the unhealthiest in Europe? Can Scottish ministers not easily address these issues by banning tree-planting grants on land that was previously let to tenant farmers, and not paying farm subsidies on farms where tenants were evicted? Could this be so difficult for a progressive government that so heartily condemns the human rights abuses of the Clearances of old?
What is the point of Scotland The Brand without Scottish food producers? What is the point of government obesity consultations in one of the fattest countries in the world if we are to stand by as producers of local fresh food – Scottish tenant farmers – lose their ability to produce that food, and vast areas of our land are made impossible to walk, cycle or exercise on due to intense oppressive conifer forestry. Is it to be “Let them eat cake”?
EU farm subsidies are supposed to maintain rural populations, not to be used as a weapon for clearing the land. The Scottish Government can act and it must act, by stopping giving landlords incentives to evict. Simple.
Carol Charters
Balerno
http://www.thenational.scot/news/15905319.Letters__How_can_we_lead_on_health_as_tenant_farmers_are_evicted_/
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Hamish MacPherson publishes excellent history articles in the National every week. Brilliant for those who want to refresh / educate themselves with regard to Scottish history.
‘Adam Smith: The Scot that set the moral compass.’
http://www.thenational.scot/news/15889667.Adam_Smith__The_Scot_that_set_the_moral_compass/
@Macart
I was wondering if you meant for me to take steps, wasn’t too sure where 🙂
I think the SG are indeed taking the necessary steps to protect Scotland and our parliament. However that should not stop us from having wee conversations with folk who are not as clued up as we are here on Wings.
Jack Murphy @ 1.44, thanks for the clip of FMQ. I skipped past Davidson, she’s just a waste of time and space, then arrived at Richard Leonard. OMG, whit a total embarassment, Jings. When he was elected as branch manager, I didn’t quite no what o expect, but my, my, my, he’s even worse than all of them that have gone before him.He remind me of one of those shop stewards, that when you met with management, tried to use big words to make himself look clever. Instead they always made an erse o’ themselves and had the management laughing at them, and they thought that they were wonderful and doing well.
That performance at FMQ’s was diabolical. Poor Nicola, having to sit there and listen to that nonsense, and then be required to answer him. Then back he comes again, with the same old crap. Does he not listen to the answers and explanaitions that she has given him. I watched that, and kept thinking, for god’s sake, someone put him oot his misery.
Has no one offered him the advise aboot when yer in a hole, stoap digging. Unbelievable. I’m gobsmacked at the incompetence on display.
Anybodies in Glasgow on Sat https://www.facebook.com/will.glen.338/posts/524418934607758
@colin alexander says: 31 January, 2018 at 8:39 pm:
“Scotland and England are parts of the UK.”
Yes they are, Colin, but those two initial lerers, “U and K”, are the initials of the term, “United Kingdom”, which is, per se, by definition a kingdom. A Kingdom formed by a political, “Treaty of Union”.
It is thus, by definition, a kingdom. As those two Kingdoms, between them, contain four distinct individual countries and The Treaty of Union makes not one reference to country or countries the fact is that the United Kingdom is exactly what the Treaty of Union says it is – a united monarchy.
It is neither a single united nation nor a single united country. At best it could loosely be described as a united political state excepting for the fact that Westminster decided to change the set-up of the United Kingdom when it devolved some minor powers unequally to only three of the four united Kingdom countries but retained for itself the governance of the country of England and used EVEL to enforce that upon the three countries they devolved, what were now essentially country of England sovereignty upon.
The rest of what you claim in your comment is utter bollocks. The “UNITED KINGDOM”, is exactly what it claims to be but it does not operate as what it actually is. It operates as the de facto, (unelected as such), parliament of the country of England that has illegally taken over the entire United Kingdom, and is acting as if that country of England alone is the governing body and has devolved unimportant minor powers to the other three subservient countries and worse still, (from a Scottish perspective), it has illegally relegated its only legal partner kingdom, to being just another annexed by the kingdom of England country. Scotland, though, is both a kingdom and country.
So why are you, Colin Alexander, who claims to be a supporter of Scottish Independence, doing your level best to promulgate the ideas that Westminster is attempting to enforce upon the legally sovereign people of Scotland?
It is unfortunate that many genuine Wingers regard you as no more than being a simple Troll for if they not only read your absolute unionist pish but paid attention to the political points you regularly lose the argument/debate about they might just get a far better perspective of the real and the false facts of what Westminster is all about.
Factually there are 533 constituencies in England, 59 in Scotland, 40 in Wales and 18 in Northern Ireland – yet not one of them is elected as a member of the Parliament of the country of England. Who then governs the Country of England that no one has been elected to govern?
I’ll put that another way for you – These so called, “English MPS”, are elected as United Kingdom Members and no one at Westminster is elected as a Member of the non-existent Parliament of England because no such parliament exists. Westminster is the De facto Parliament of the country of England masquerading as the Parliament of the United Kingdom and factually cannot be both simultaneously.
It is long past the time for such as you, Colin, to use the full title of that Westminster parliament and not the two initial letters, “UK”.
It is all too easy to forget that UK means, “United Kingdom”, (a two equal kingdom partnership).
It does not mean the Parliament of a country called, “The UK”.
It does not mean the parliament of, “The Country of England”.
Nor does it mean, “The Parliament of a country of Britain”. (as in, “BREXIT”).
Arse skelping as an art form…take a bow Mr Peffers. 😉
K1 nice one but why oh why does Mr Peffers bother playing tig wie muppets .
He makes the point Ronnie that he’s really giving them a showing up and by deconstructing their pish, others get to see what pish it is that he is spouting. If no one challenges it or debates it with him and his ilk, then he gets a free pass and anyone (lurkers) could be led to believe that what he says has merit?
I leave it Robert, geeo and Heed…they are naturals at taking apart his nonsense, everyone else just then gets on with posting ‘around’ the colincrash…don’t even have to read what he says…the 3 amigos are dealing with it.
Most of us are ignoring him Ronnie, more and more. He came on just after GE 17. He’ll be gone soon enough. Just like SD, remember? Once they are completely nailed they get bored…the Rev won’t ban him so we have to deal wi him ‘as is’.
Just ma tuppenny worth 😉
Can you get replacement bollocks? Is this an operation available on the national health?
Peter, No doubt the timescale will not meet with your approval, what timescale would you suggest?