Deny the flesh
We’ve just received the most extraordinary Freedom Of Information response from the Scottish Government, readers. Trust us, you want to go and make yourselves a strong cup of tea before you read it. Or get this guy to bring you one.
It’s a reply to this request, from 21 September. Here’s a quick reminder:
You ready? Here it comes.
Wow.
For reference, here’s the 3 August 2020 response referred to above:
In normal circumstances we’d have been fully expecting some sort of weasel-worded attempt to pretend that “we hold no recorded information about this meeting” DIDN’T mean “this meeting didn’t happen”, just that it hadn’t been recorded.
But we’d naively thought that approach couldn’t hope to fly this time, as that fiction has been utterly destroyed by the Scottish Government itself. Because the remit provided by John Swinney to the panel investigating Nicola Sturgeon for a possible breach of the Ministerial Code expressly notes that such a meeting took place.
That remit was published as a Parliamentary answer on the EXACT SAME DATE that the Central Enquiry Unit (CEU) was flatly denying any knowledge of the meeting.
Which – unless Mr Swinney had written the inquiry’s remit on the bus on the way into Holyrood that morning, conveniently knowing that he was going to be asked about it – means that the remit was produced BEFORE the denial, and therefore the Scottish Government absolutely definitely DID “hold a record” of the 29 March meeting at that time, and therefore the 3 August FOI response was a blatant, flat-out, deliberate lie.
But even if a person was SO desperately gullible as to believe the “wrote the remit on the bus” scenario (and recent experiences on social media have suggested to us that such people do exist), or that perhaps the records were only updated that day with the information and the CEU just hadn’t caught up, it’s no good.
Because the remit proves beyond any possible dispute that the Scottish Government definitely held an official record of the meeting in early August, more than SIX WEEKS before we sent in our request on 21 September. And yet it has just told us categorically that it didn’t, and indeed that it still doesn’t in the middle of October.
(It would also be fairly astonishing if the remit had indeed only been written in August, given that Alex Salmond was acquitted in late March and the inquiry into the Ministerial Code breach – which was referred in January 2019 and was paused to avoid a risk of prejudicing his trial, giving them 14 months to prepare it – should have been ready to go immediately, not four months later.)
It’s a quite jaw-dropping insult to the intelligence of everyone involved, and also to the people of Scotland who are entitled to the truth from their government. We’ve sent a reply pointing out these facts and politely requesting that the CEU has a second stab at answering our questions, only this time not with a tissue of ridiculously obvious lies. We’ll let you know how it goes.
So they’ve been caught out in a big fat lie, and by doing so they’ve further damaged the reputation of the Scottish government, even more so if you take into account the readers who read this blog, and share it.
It would’ve caused less damage if they’d been honest with you and told the truth.
Of course you’ll get the Sturgeon routine of Oh…Um we forgot about that date on your FOI, because we had such a hectic schedule it slipped our minds.
Would’t there be a visitors book to sign even for evacuation purposes in case of etc?
Bus for Mr Swinney!
I think the only answer to all of the above is ,
Oh For F*ucks sake . Excuse the swearing
FFS, they’re not even trying any more.
Who’s going to do the needful and call for a No Confidence vote asap?
What’s the procedure, anyone know offhand?
The Sky news interview of Sturgeon is beginning to change folks minds on the fit up of Salmond.
“Seven separate individuals have so far, since yesterday’s Sturgeon Sky interview, contacted me to apologise for having doubted, criticised or argued with me for stating that Nicola Sturgeon was behind the attempt to fit up Alex Salmond.”
Now eleven folk.
link to twitter.com
I’m struggling a little, so take pity on the feeble minded. Does FoI relate to records held by the particular public body and this reply means that there are no records of that meeting, which is what I thought had already been stated i.e. Nicola forgot that an ‘informal chat’ took place but no record was kept? John Swinney’s ‘in question’ meaning that there is a question even if this meeting took place.
@cynicalHighlander says:
13 October, 2020 at 2:17 pm
“Would’t there be a visitors book to sign even for evacuation purposes in case of etc?”
Definitely should be for security purposes – it is a government building – there should have been a written record of all visitors, including their name (obviously), organisation, date and time of arrival, and date and time of departure. It would also record who was responsible for them, ie their escort and/or who they were meeting.
Folk have said it before but goodness knows how you have the patience to deal with these b*stards.
do you really think you will get a straight answer?
“Having conducted appropriate and proportionate searches….”
What the hell is a proportionate search?
I think it’s a euphemism for not really trying.
“Nicola forgot that an ‘informal chat’ took place but no record was kept?”
Nicola “forgot” the meeting until Jan/Feb 2019. No satisfactory explanation has ever been given for the failure to record it, because if it’s government business it HAS to be recorded and if it’s party business you’re not allowed to do it on Scottish Parliament premises.
But either way it was “remembered” over a year and a half ago and is clearly now recorded because it’s listed in the inquiry remit. So they shouldn’t be telling us it isn’t.
“the Scottish Government definitely held an official record of the meeting in early August”
Key word is ‘held’.
But FOI can’t find it so what’s happened to it? Destroyed? Forgotten about?
Has Scotland turned into Soviet Russia or something?
Or is it just shite at politics?
So let me get this straight. Is the record keeper now openly lying on behalf of the SG. Or are they actually this incompetent.
I choose the former.
Trying to get my head around the public reaction to the SNP dropping Sturgeon when her personal ratings are so high!
Who in the Scottish Parliament could lead in the mean time??
A vote of confidence would bring about an early election and a Wings party led by AS would be good to shred the Unionists of their remaining team.
A meeting for which – no Government record exists – perhaps leads one to this from the Ministerial Code:
7. MINISTERS’ CONSTITUENCY AND PARTY INTERESTS
General Principle
7.1 Facilities provided to Ministers at Government expense to enable them to carry out their official duties should not be used for party or constituency work.
I leave it for others to decide where it leads thereafter.
The people responding to your FOI request are not lying.
They have checked and found No Records of any Contact … between Aberdein, NS and her staff….
That’s because the Records have been removed.
So, ‘just to be clear’ as shifty/blink blink would say:
Her staff phoned GA in Mid March 2017 to arrange a meet with NS on 29th March 2017 and did not enter it anywhere on the official diary – yeah right, cause that’s a guaranteed way the meeting will be double booked.
That no records NOW exist, conceals the names of who was there, including perhaps one of the complainers, who for obvious reason can’t be on the investigation team and a complainer at the same time. And a record of that would provide evidence of collusion.
NS conveniently ‘forgets’ about this meeting, and only recalls being officially told about the complaints by AS at her home several days later.
NS admits to parliament she ‘forgot’ about the meeting, and there are no longer any official records of that meeting.
Ministerial Codes say it is a resigning matter for any minister to KNOWINGLY mislead parliament.
The word KNOWINGLY is incredibly important here from a legal perspective. We can all argue blue, that Aye Right She must’ve known – but you have to Prove it. How do you prove someone Knowingly did something, if they say they forgot. And how much easier it is to Forget if the official diary entry of something is no longer there.
As this shifty, improper behaviour continues, more and more people are being brought into the mix, to help cover it up. That is not sustainable.
1/ Mislead Parliament,
2/ Either fail to keep proper records of meetings, or the names of persons there (in itself a Breach of Ministerial Code), or have those records deliberately removed
3/ say you forgot about the first meeting you mislead parliament about. An easy thing to do when it has not been recorded.
So, if the records have been deliberately removed, in order to strength NS argument that she ‘forgot’ and make ‘knowingly’ much harder to prove, are we not beginning to get into criminal behaviour here. Doctor records, in order to convince an enquiry you forgot a thing, in order to remain in your job.
Everyone at the start of the week thought that the misdirect on the meeting on 29/3/17 was concealing more than one thing was barking up the right tree it would appear.
NS’s spade must be needing replaced by now I would suggest.
The past was alterable. The past never had been altered. Oceania was at war with Eastasia. Oceania had always been at war with Eastasia. — George Orwell
[…] Wings Over Scotland Deny the flesh We’ve just received the most extraordinary Freedom Of Information response from the […]
I’m sure the mainstream Scottish media will be delighted to share you r findings…
That’s it, I am convinced.
Scotland should not be Independent. We simply are not yet ready for that step.
Our Scottish Government and its Civil Service must remain under the control and benign influence of HM Government in London. We clearly need an other 300 years’ exposure to the English Civil Service’s way of doing things – before we can be trusted to totally fuck things up for the people of Scotland and for the good of the Scottish Establishment.
Thing is I can’t think of anyone in holytood who I’d want to be FM
“The only people who are angry at you for speaking the truth are those living in the lie “
Surely if the records have been removed. Then the previous email Stu has posted proves their original existence.
In fact this now leads the SG down an even bigger wormhole. Why would someone delete a government record, who authorised it and who deleted it?
Scottie- There is no-one on Holyrood good enough to take over. That’s why Sturgeon wanted all the talent to stay in WM. A threat to her leadership, same as Salmond.
J Cherry will have to be parachuted in. Normally that wouldn’t be a problem, as she could take a HR seat in 2021. However Sturgeon made sure she couldn’t.
To hang with that though. I would be happier for her to remain an MP and be FM until a vacancy….ahem …arose!
COYA on meth.
@Daisy Walker – surely the whole pack of cards fall if the committee calls GA and he confirms the attendees? At that point it surely provides more than enough motive for deliberately concealing the existance of the meeting?
If there is another attendee and I presume others know who that is (I don’t) then they surely can be called to the committee?
I don’t see why it would be particularly difficult to establish she’s not just lied but interfered with an investigation. Surely NS knows this and must have thought about how she will deal with GA’s evidence?
If so why wouldn’t she resign to save the truth coming out as per SG caving in on the investigation when the courts asked for the documentation?
NS is many things but I wouldn’t have put stupid down as one of them so I’m just trying to understand what her way out is? Is she really just hoping the committee don’t call GA?
A few things are going to happen now.
There will be MSM polling showing support for Indy through the roof (but not the 60% threshold – that red line ruins the argument ‘Scotland isn’t ready for another IR2). Shifty/blink blindk’s personal approval ratings will be through the roof.
Universal support for NS and Covid lockdown will happen.
Its likely this will impact/delay on the Committee hearing and its publications of evidence.
If they can keep Shifty Blink Blink in power until after 31/12/20 Brexit happens. Then unleash the hounds on her after that it will destroy SNP election chances at HR.
One potential course of action that Must happen. Any qualified, registered lawyer can appeal to the EU with regards unlawful conduct regards the Withdrawl Agreement. The UK Internal Market is not being supported by Terrible May for a reason. It breaks international law, and on that basis a lawyer in Scotland can register a complaint.
Any complaint registered will be dealt with underand by the ECJ – and they have 4 years time period to do so.
Of course, it would have so much more International coverage if instead of a single lawyer carrying it out, it was the SNP leader of the Scottish Government – not you Nicola.
Frank get the door.
I am getting so tired of all the obfuscations in this matter.
Either resign Nicola, for any reason you care to decide on,first being sure to take with you those others involved in this farrago of lies and disinformation. Go, in the name of God..GO!
We have A Nation to restore to it’s Independence. Thank you for your service.
@Daisy Walker – thanks, as with so many things I have no idea who you are but you clearly know your stuff.
Still struggling to see what NS’s exit strategy is. Even if its post 31/12/20 she must realise its not just end of her tenure as FM but end of her in the party, as a politician and possibly as a lawyer? Surely resigning now whilst her popularity is high is her better option?
Mist001.
Re the RAF’s A400M Atlas massive four-engine turboprop plane it operates as a tactical airlifter to deliver supplies or personnel.
No mention of refueling one has to wonder what it was delivering.
link to archive.is
Absolutely blatant lying.
Anyone excusing this, because reasons, is condoning it.
This is not how I want my political systems operating.
Westminster is a corrupt elitist broken structure. I want no part of it.
I do not want to have to say the same about Holyrood 🙁
Ok. I think I’m getting the picture now. So, as others have asked, why has Aberdein not been before the committee?
Another question: anyone know how long before the record of the Court of Session Commission and Diligence hearing is going before the Holyrood committee?
Seems with more you uncover and what Craig Murray has shared the time line on Ms Sturgeon going could be in line with departure of Boris the incompetent albeit for different lying ????.
Please take care, Rev. They have plans to deal with anyone seen as a threat to the UK.
link to twitter.com
@ Laukat says:
13 October, 2020 at 3:05 pm
@Daisy Walker – surely the whole pack of cards fall if the committee calls GA and he confirms the attendees? At that point it surely provides more than enough motive for deliberately concealing the existance of the meeting?
If there is another attendee and I presume others know who that is (I don’t) then they surely can be called to the committee?
If so why wouldn’t she resign to save the truth coming out as per SG caving in on the investigation when the courts asked for the documentation?
NS is many things but I wouldn’t have put stupid down as one of them so I’m just trying to understand what her way out is? Is she really just hoping the committee don’t call GA?
Hello Laukat
Re – surely the whole pack of cards fall if the committee calls GA and he confirms the attendees? At that point it surely provides more than enough motive for deliberately concealing the existance of the meeting?’
The grudging disclosure of the ‘forgotten’ meeting by NS last week, was that GA was in Holyrood ‘to meet a former colleague’ and while there ‘popped his head round the door/fleeting visit’ to see Nicola. And remember, up until last week the official notification of when NS know was by AS at her home on 2/4/17. So ‘officially’ the committee could not have ‘known’ about this meeting and GA meeting with her on 29/3/17.
This was extremely clever wording by NS – she refers to ‘former colleague’ without naming them or specifying if they were actually a participant/present at the meeting. She has provide herself with ‘plausible deniability’.
Obviously ‘the whole pack of cards falls’ if the committee calls the right witnesses and asks the right questions. But that is a lot more difficult if they don’t know what was done, by whom and for what reason.
You ask, ‘if there is another attendee and I presume others know who that is (I don’t) then they surely can be called to the committee?’
I refer you to NS’s official answer above. Was there another attendee, and if so who was it? Well if we get an answer to that, NS will say, ‘I told you GA was at HR to see a former colleague, sorry didn’t I mention it was so and so, and they were present, sorry my mistake’ Plausible deniability. But what she has not done is provide the committee with the name, and the fact that they were there. And if the committee don’t know – they can’t ask.
You state, ‘If so why wouldn’t she resign to save the truth coming out as per SG caving in on the investigation when the courts asked for the documentation?’
I’d suggest she has been seriously compromised by the Brit Nat state. All her eggs are now in that basket and in order to get any kind of reward at the end of this, her job now, is to cling to power until after 31/12/20 and Brexit no deal goes through. Thereafter the longer she can remain in power until HE ensures they can release the hounds in time for May and destroy SNP chances then.
Re – NS is many things but I wouldn’t have put stupid down as one of them so I’m just trying to understand what her way out is? Is she really just hoping the committee don’t call GA?’
The plan to neutralise AS was supposed to work at the first hurdle. They did not know their man, and they’ve been furiously trying to cover their tracks – and making a hash of it – ever since. NS’s only way out now is to keep loyal to the Brit Nat establishment and hope for a reward later.
@ Big Jock at 3.04: “No-one at Holyrood good enough to take over” as FM.
Mike Russell? Strong enough character but is he a “loyal to NS”
person and therefore won’t improve the situation?
Alex Neil? Joan McAlpine? Jeane Freeman? All seem strong enough pending some of the MPs getting back to Holyrood.
Which reminds me, are any current MPs standing for Holyrood, does anyone know?
The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out for himself.
[H. L. Mencken]
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
[Benjamin Franklin]
To be governed is to be watched, inspected, spied upon, directed, law-driven, numbered, regulated, enrolled, indoctrinated, preached at, controlled, checked, estimated, valued, censured (and) commanded, by creatures who have neither the right nor the wisdom nor the virtue to do so.
[Pierre Joseph Prouhon]
Alan Crocket,
Aberdein’s sworn testimony at the Salmond trial was that Nicola,’s Chief of Staff Liz Lloyd had phoned him to arrange this very meeting two weeks previously. Yes, the one nobody remembers.
Who is !ying?
Black Joan @3.33pm.
You mean like the state actors who set up Salmond to spend the rest of his life in prison.
ScottieDog says:
Thing is I can’t think of anyone in holytood who I’d want to be FM
………………………………….
There’ll be someone until Ms Cherry or Ms Whitford can get up here.
Sarah two of them are past retirement , and Joan isn’t FM material. I do like Joan , but she is very much a niche politician. We have one of those already and look how that turned out.
Alex Neil is also not a particularly good speaker.
Thanks, Bob Mack, but I think you may be reading too much into the trial report. As far as I can see, there’s no evidence of how the meeting was arranged or what was actually discussed. Here’s Craig Murray actual report of the evidence in question:
“On 8 to 9 March 2018 Ms A had contacted him to say she was involved in a process of looking at complaints about Alex Salmond. He had spoken to Kevin Pringle and Duncan Hamilton by conference call to discuss this. On 29 March 2018 he had held a meeting with Nicola Sturgeon in the Scottish Parliament to discuss this.”
Interim FM HR leader- Wild card Ivan Mckee.
@ Big Jock: the post holder only being interim until May 2021 election anyway was part of the reason for thinking these people would be acceptable. I hoped that a better person might be elected as FM then – but if none of the MPs are standing then I don’t think anyone better will be on the SNP benches.
But if there is a new party, with great champions in the ranks, doing well in 2021 [ever the optimist] then Holyrood might elect one of them as FM. The FM does not have to be party leader and does not have to be from the largest party either [I believe].
Thing is too, maybe to layman who doesn’t routinely keep a diary, all this ‘confusion’ and forgetfulness about dates might seem plausible, but in the bureacratic world of politicians, especially at this level, it seems inconceivable and highly irregular that there’s no record kept of any meeting.
I’d be asking to see the actual diary or ledger, or as somebody suggested, the relevant page of the visitors book for corroboration.
Similarly, you could check the diary and phone records too for any other meetings which might have fixed people’s movements via other meetings, rather than a blank page in a diary.
Alan Crocket @ 3.33
So this Aberdine guy phoned his lawyers about a meeting that’s a figment of his imagination?
Or phoned them just in case he passed the First Ministers open door while at the Parliament?
Then perjured himself?
To what end Alan?
I can see why Nicola Sturgeon would lie , but he ,as far as I can tell , gains or loses nothing and the only risk to himself was to lie in Court!
On the other hand those who claim no knowledge or memory of that meeting do have things to gain and things to explain. The least of which being where’s the record of it gone ?
alternatively- Could Jo Cherry be party leader of the SNP. AN other from Holyrood be interim FM until May. Then a referendum led by JC shortly after.
Thanks, Daisy Walker, but I’m not addressing the question of whether Sturgeon’s conduct was perfect in every respect, merely the significance or otherwise of the Aberdein meeting, and whether the evidence really supports a sinister interpretation of the responses to Rev. Stu’s FOI request.
Thanks, Lizg, but my point is that Aberdein’s evidence does not necessarily contradict what Sturgeon has said about the meeting. From what we know so far, we can accept that both are telling the truth, and neither puts that meeting very high in the scale of things.
Interim HR leader. Maybe Ben MacPherson? Has ministerial experience. Did various things before politics. Doesn’t appear to be in with the wokes. I stand to be corrected.
Ach, this and everything else. Just seen that indy poster boy is taking a break away from it, expressing his frustration at inaction towards indy by the Scottish government. That in itself is quite sad, as he produces great independence materials. He is one of the jewels in the independence crown.
But honestly, who can blame him. The Liars and murderous cabal of Tories in London, England, are not just planning to dismantle devolution, they have already done it. It has been done. They now have zero respect for Scotland, its parliament, and its people. How does NS respond? Has she called an indyref? Has she asserted Scotland’s consitutional rights?? No, of course not, because for the last four years at least, she has been sitting doing nothing, using the EXCUSE of ‘waiting for permission’ to hold an independence referendum.
We have an SNP government with mandate after mandate, after freaking mandate to pursue independence. Even without such a mandate, their duty is to protect Scotland’s interests, and they are simply doing nothing. NOTHING.
No doubt Iain Blackford will ‘give the PM a hard time on Wednesday at PMQ’s’. Again. No wonder the lying murderous Tories do not take them seriously, since Nicola Sturgeon has made it very, very clear, that no matter what they do to Scotland she will absolutely NOT do anything about it – unless London gives her permission. All talk, no action.
It is pathetic. Really, really pathetic.
May 2021 is far, far, far too late. ANY clown can see that, but no, NS plods on telling Scots AND (quite foolishly) our enemies in London that she will do nothing until after May 2021.
So, let’s all sit back and watch as England strips Scots of their EU citizenship, imposes tuition fes upon Scottish students directly from England, imposes atrocious food standards that will be the end of quality Scottish produce, imposes damaging trade deals without our consent, imposes new laws without our consent, while our parliament is overruled and usurped, while Scotland’s constitutional rights and laws are ignored and the treaty of union is repeatedly boken and broken again by England and its murderous lying Tory leaders.
As regards the treaty of union, there is now no need for an independence referendum, since the treaty is no longer functional. The Scotgov should be calling a news conference to announce that since ENGLAND has unilaterally decided to leave the treaty of union, Scotland has no choice but to become independent. That is what any self resepcting country in the world would do in these circumstances, but not Scotland. No, we will sit and let it happen, like good colonial subjects.
All of that, let’s just sit back and watch it all get done to Scotland, while we wait for the dithering Scottish Government to finally wake up to reality. Their are no ‘rules’ anymore. England has broken them all, and Scotland is being treated as a colony, and our pathetic First Minister sits back, doing nothing, wittering on about a section 30 or something.
Now is the time our Scottish Government should be on the attack, with every single breath and interview, but no, they carry on as though nothing has changed. It is delusional.
Scotland utterly humiliated and subjugated by England. And YES, I do mean ENGLAND, and its lying murderous psycopathic leaders.
Seriously, what is the f***ing point anymore. If we are not allowed our rights and freedoms via the ballot box and the clearly expressed will of Scotland, then what other choice is left for us???
Will nobody stand up for Scotland?
If we don’t sort our government officers and our judicial system out, British nationalism will eradicate Scottish culture as a component of global constitutional consciousness. This is exactly the same sort of legal practice favoured by the Nazis, or any or authoritarian and totalitarian regime that considers itself above international law. ;(
#ragging
link to qualitative-research.net
Surely the more obvious answer to an interim leader is Keith Brown? He’s always struck me as a decent man who speaks well. He has ministerial experience and is the official deputy therefore easy to slot in. He’s also been sidelined by NS which means he’s probably not tainted by the Salmond plot and if he has been sidelined its probably because NS views him as in the Salmond camp?
clear out at many levels required.
Meanwhile, I hope Paul Kavanagh aka wee ginger dug (who is another jewel in the independence crown) gets well soon. Such sad news about him.
An absolute champion of independence.
@Sarah says:
13 October, 2020 at 4:03 pm
“The FM does not have to be party leader and does not have to be from the largest party either [I believe].”
I posted something similar a couple of days ago (I think!).
While it is correct anyone can be FM, the First Minister has always been associated with the party leader in Scotland. For other parties that is not an issue, but the SNP only has seats in Scotland.
Although it makes a lot of sense from a tactical point of view. politically I think it would be a non starter.
How is the leader of the SNP selected? Is it the NEC or by party members? I honestly don’t know. But I’ll bet this time around there will be a proper contest.
Robert Louis says:
‘But honestly, who can blame him. The Liars and murderous cabal of Tories in London, England, are not just planning to dismantle devolution, they have already done it. It has been done. They now have zero respect for Scotland, its parliament, and its people. How does NS respond? Has she called an indyref? Has she asserted Scotland’s consitutional rights?? No, of course not, because for the last four years at least, she has been sitting doing nothing, using the EXCUSE of ‘waiting for permission’ to hold an independence referendum.’
………………
The only people who need to respect Scotland are the people of Scotland . AND I’m sure that very few Scots-minded people would set our politicians and electorate below the WM lot.: NOT LEAST because in Scotland we recognise dirty tricks and seek redress for such behaviour.
In England : the dirtier the trickster ; the more applause.
There are people in Scotland prepared to hold a referendum and once Nicola Sturgeon and her pals are out, that’s exactly what shall be done. We can make Mr Salmond’s ordeal the making of an independent Scotland . In fact, the people of Scotland owe that to him and themselves to set the record straight.
Below is one of the conditions of the Remit as laid out by Deputy First Minister.
4.22 Ministers meet many people and organisations and consider a wide range of views as part of the formulation of Government policy. Meetings on official business should normally be arranged through Private Offices. A private secretary or official should be present for all discussions relating to Government business. Private Offices should arrange for the basic facts of formal meetings between Ministers and outside interest groups to be recorded, setting out the reasons for the meeting, the names of those attending and the interests represented. A monthly list of engagements carried out by all Ministers is published three months in arrears.
‘A monthly list of engagements carried out by all Ministers is published 3 months in arrears.’
Since it appeared on JS’s Remit that provides a timescale of when it was removed.
@ Alan Crocket ‘I’m not addressing the question of whether Sturgeon’s conduct was perfect in every respect,’
Good, we’ll just focus in on whether she broke ministerial law in numerous ways Including misleading/lying to parliament, ‘oversaw’ in her capacity as First Minister, to it that massive amounts of tax payers money were wasted pursuing what she was amply qualified to know was ‘unlawful, unfair and tainted by apparent bias’ legal procedures against a man later completely exhonerated at court of all charges. And that man is one of our leading lights for pursuing Independence.
But yes, lets just refer to it as conduct ‘not perfect in every respect’. Will you extend that attitude to AS perchance.
Re: A WM leadership candidate.
If things move swiftly enough, a disinfected NEC would have no trouble returning WM applicant’s procedure to that which had served for so many years, and so little controversy.
I think I could live with Ian Blackford remaining there for the forseeable.
Is it not the case that Johnson misleads the WM Parliament every time he stands at the Dispatch Box and opens his lying mouth?
In Alan Crocket Lalaland…
GA:
O hey Nicks. Just popped the head round the door to let you know that several women are accusing Alex of r@pe…
NS:
Wha… you don’t say! Shockerooney!
GA:
Yeah. Just thought I’d let you know. Cheers Nicks…
NS:
Muchos appreciatos. Cheers Geoff… Ok Liz. What’s next on the agenda? Lunch?
gus1940 says:
13 October, 2020 at 4:46 pm
Is it not the case that Johnson misleads the WM Parliament every time he stands at the Dispatch Box and opens his lying mouth?
……….
That’s true.
And isn’t it also true that the reason the people of Scotland want to be an independent country is so that we can do more and be a better place than WM.
The bar isn’t very high, after all:-)
Sorry Stu. 🙁 Don’t kill me with hammers.
NOTE: I have deleted a number of comments which risk potentially committing contempt of court through jigsaw identification of complainers in the Alex Salmond trial, and banned the person responsible.
I apologise if I am saying what is already known, but the CEU is not really responsible for the response (are they not based on an Island somewhere off the west coast now I come to think about it). The response comes from the work area (s) that hold the information. The CEU simply pulls it together if several areas are involved in the answer, sense checks it (hahahaha) and makes sure its legal etc. It is then generally signed by someone who does not have clue as to whether the answer is correct or not…I know this for sure as I did it myself quite lot…the signing bit that is.
It looks like the entire system is completely corrupt.
God knows just how bad it must be in the house of
Corruption at Westminster perfecting their art over
Hundreds of years.
Reply to crisiscult at 3.22pm.
Apologies if someone has already posted this and/or it’s not relevant. On Geoff Aberdein the letter from the committee to him. Their deadline was the 4th of August but as far as I can see it has not yet been posted on the site, presumably connected to the Salmond evidence?
The Committee requests details of, or copies of, all communications between yourself and one or more of the following:
• the former First Minister, Alex Salmond;
• the First Minister’s Chief of Staff, Liz Lloyd;
• the First Minister, Nicola Sturgeon MSP;
• any other relevant individuals (for example other special advisers or the First Minister’s private office).
link to parliament.scot
Did lesley evans write this tosh ?
Astonished @5:25
No, because it’s at least grammatical tosh.
This is becoming quite absurd.
We are now within touching distance of Independence and some elements of the YES movement are focusing on some ‘he said/she said’ useless nonsense.
Anyone who thinks Salmond is a + on the road to independence needs to take a long hard look at themselves and re-evaluate what they actually stand for.
It was never going to be easy.
Sturgeon is dragging the Yes Movement into the gutter with her.
That bitch knows it and it suits her agenda.
It just shows you what she thinks of the people within the Movement and the members within her Party.
She thinks of herself, her man and her lifestyle/bank book.
A horrible individual.
gullaneno4
We are never within touching distance of indy so long as Sturgeon is at the helm. She has no desire to free Scotland, and even if she did she is so compromised that any Yes campaign would be ruined by her presence.
gullaneno4
It’s worthwhile to remember that this whole train wreck started as a result of government “knowing best” and trying to push through legislation which likely would have alienated 20+% of potential yes votes. So independence is within touching distance in the same way lemmings are within touching distance of dry land as they hurl themselves into the sea.
Does Scotland need Sturgeon?
If the answer is NO, then why is she still leader of the SNP/Yes Movement?
When are SNP going to start calling out BBC interviewers misreporting?
I am just watching Whiteford being told Scotland needs to tighten up as much as England and she is saying Scotland is tighter than England but not challenging the BBC on where they their rubbish information.
The BBC is presenting misinformation and they are doing it deliberately. They are making the crisis worse.
Lesley Riddoch – excellent journalist and a good weather vane of the independence movement has included the Holyrood enquiry and Nicola’s appearance on Sky News in her latest podcast. She’s a good ‘un and they can’t tar her with the “vile cybernat” brush.
link to twitter.com
@Astonished at 5:25 pm
You can be sure that nothing on this subject matter leaves SAH without Leslie Evans having seens it first.
For years on Wings I have tried to point out the SNP is not the indy movement and how good or bad the SNP are says nothing about the merits of independence.
Also, support for the SNP and support for indy is not the same thing. Ask Pete Wishart if you don’t believe me.
A country being ruled by another country is NOT normal. Countries that have their own governments can have good, bad or indifferent govts.
The SNP run the British Empire’s Scotland colony.
That the people of Scotland are holding the SNP to account now is a HUGE step forward in Scottish democracy.
That’s what independence could give completely: the ability of the people of Scotland to hold ALL their government to account, not just the Holyrood WM branch office bit of the UK state.
Republicofscotland, the a400 is not huge, its not much bigger than a boeing 737/400,
Have seen quite a few flying over Arran when they were working up out of Prestwick.
Basically a larger (in length) c130j hercules. Like all RAF aircraft they practise taking off and landing at civilian airfields In case they need to divert there in case of emergency.
Remember watching the Vulcans doing touch and goes at Aberdeen forty odd years ago, what a sound!
Sometimes we forget that that meeting took place and at other times we remember that we had forgotten that that meeting took place. This isn’t your lucky day.
cynicalHighlander has a good idea. FOI the visitor’s book for Geoff Aberdein on 29th March 2018. Time he signed in, who he was there to see, time he signed out.
“gullaneno4 says:
13 October, 2020 at 5:31 pm
This is becoming quite absurd.
We are now within touching distance of Independence and some elements of the YES movement are focusing on some ‘he said/she said’ useless nonsense.”
…………………………………………….
When did Mrs Murrell ask for a referendum?
You’re one of many fans supporting the SNP who have lousy seats, a long way from the game. You’re all relying on a set of screens and recorded screams and shouts to know when to applaud because you believe that someone has scored a goal for your side.
You’re unaware of how long the game has been in play because you don’t know what the time is and you’re certainly totally ignorant of when/if the players have changed ends and substituted people.
As for the ‘ball’; it’s nowhere to be seen and so you don’t have a hope of keeping your eye on it.
Elevate the matter to the Freedom of Information Commissioner, Stuart.
This is simply symptomatic of the dysfunctional nature of Scotland’s government and judicial system, which have been stunted and deformed through standing under the English cultural tradition of Parliamentary sovereignty. Which no longer respects the legal obligations of Britain’s public administration, as set out in Treaty law and the Acts of Union. So Westminster is no longer able to support cultural pluralism within the newly created legal entity of Brexitania.
Scots need to urgently wake up to the fact that our government and legal Establishment’s practice is simply incompatible with international human rights law. In other words, our legal Establishment’s intensely parochial and right-wing legal stance and approach to legal practice, ensures Scots will never enjoy the benefits of democracy.
Scotland has no sustainable future if our law officers continue to place (white) English/British nationalism, or personal gain, before the universal principle of equality in law. So you shouldn’t allow any low-flying legal scholar to attempt to convince you Scotland remains legally bound by Westminster. 🙁
#ragging
Intergovernmental
Panel on Climate Change
Social, Economic, and Ethical
Concepts and Methods
link to ipcc.ch
“So independence is within touching distance in the same way lemmings are within touching distance of dry land as they hurl themselves into the sea.”
Stuart Mackay.
As far as I know Lemmings don’t actually do that and the myth arose after a 1958 Disney wildlife documentary called White Wilderness, where the film crew forcibly drove a large group of Lemmings off a cliff in a poor attempt to spice up the programme.
Tories now trying to drag Kirsten Oswald in now.
She closed down the NEC before Peter Murrell’s expected
update.
‘However, Kirsten Oswald, the party’s business convener and deputy leader of the SNP’s Westminster group, suspended the meeting before the chief executive’s update because it had reached its two-hour time limit, despite there being an incomplete agenda. Sources said that Ms Oswald refused to take questions and would not allow the meeting to be adjourned until later this week’
link to thetimes.co.uk
link to archive.is
@Daisy Walker – thanks for patience and replies. You had the following in one reply
“One potential course of action that Must happen. Any qualified, registered lawyer can appeal to the EU with regards unlawful conduct regards the Withdrawl Agreement. The UK Internal Market is not being supported by Terrible May for a reason. It breaks international law, and on that basis a lawyer in Scotland can register a complaint.
Any complaint registered will be dealt with underand by the ECJ – and they have 4 years time period to do so.
Of course, it would have so much more International coverage if instead of a single lawyer carrying it out, it was the SNP leader of the Scottish Government – not you Nicola.”
What would be the possible outcomes of that action? If NS is not the leader to take this forward are you hinting that a person may be waiting in the wings wanting to do this?
Lenny Hartley.
The Boeing 737/400, has some pretty impressive stats.
Wing Span 28,88 m 94 ft 9 in
Wing Area 105,4 m² 1135 ft²
Length 36,40 m 119 ft 5 in
Height 11,07 m 36 ft 4 in
I don’t know who could step forward to replace Nicola Sturgeon as leader of the SNP, but I would like to see Alex Salmond as the first president of an independent republic. It may go some way to make up for his treatment at the hands of the current SNP leadership. He will always be remembered fondly for what he has achieved for Scotland, whereas Nicola Sturgeon will forever be a stain upon our nation.
@ Laurkat
‘One potential course of action that Must happen. Any qualified, registered lawyer can appeal to the EU with regards unlawful conduct regards the Withdrawl Agreement. The UK Internal Market is not being supported by Terrible May for a reason. It breaks international law, and on that basis a lawyer in Scotland can register a complaint.
Any complaint registered will be dealt with underand by the ECJ – and they have 4 years time period to do so.
Of course, it would have so much more International coverage if instead of a single lawyer carrying it out, it was the SNP leader of the Scottish Government – not you Nicola.”
What would be the possible outcomes of that action? If NS is not the leader to take this forward are you hinting that a person may be waiting in the wings wanting to do this?’
In answer to the above
Firstly I’m not aware of anyone waiting in the wings, but if more people know about it as a course of action, the more likely it will be. hence the reason for posting it.
What would be the possible outcomes of that action?
Currently – as of 31/12/20 – we are out of the EU and no longer have the ECJ to refer things to. And for anyone who wants reminded of how kindly the British run things, when they’ve no-one to answer to – I refer them to the Film – Hunger, over on Netflix.
If however, a legal complaint is registered to them with regards the legality of the UK Internal Market Bill, (which breaks international law, and the EU is taking legal action against) under the terms of the Withdrawl Agreement – (which Boris signed) that legal dispute would be adjudicated under European Court Justice rules and regs, at the ECJ and within a time frame of 4 years from date of registering the complaint.
In other words it stops WM being able to bargain away Scotland’s Assets, with the EU, until the legal complaint is dealt with at the ECJ – within a 4 year time frame.
For your info.
It’s really is quite simple peeps, we simply need to stop allowing our right-wing legal Establishment from separating Scots from our human rights. Our government was designed to serve Westminster, not Scotland. And this is perfectly acceptable to the regressive bigots who are charged with caring for Scots law, as well as the SNP, apparently. Sack the lot of them and replace them with those who are either willing or competent to support international human rights law. ;(
#ragging
European Journal of Bioethics, Vol. 1 No. 2 (2010)
Brigitte E. S. Jansen: Law, Public Health Care System and Society
link to jahr-bioethics-journal.com
Quite a tangled web this, but I still can’t help thinking that there is enough slack for the FM to justify what she said about April 2nd. The desire to protect anonymity of certain individuals is a possible justification, if there is no material difference in being told of the allegations on March 29th or April 2nd, or any day in between for that matter. If she knew GA was being invited to Holyrood to discuss the matter then that’s a little more difficult. Definitely Eck was the victim of a conspiracy. I’ll wait til I hear from the Gaffer on who knew what before I make any judgement. Independence is too important.
TBH I wouldn’t be surprised if any future responses Stu gets for Freedom of Mis, Dis, & Piss Information requests are signed off by Swervin McMervin.
Joe Morrison.
You seem a grounded individual.Where did you get your education btw?
This what is meant by bringing the house down. No prospect of NS leaving honourably. Of course our highly paid MSPs are sleeping on the job. They should bring her down not Stu.
Civid stats for today shows the results for Spain, Italy, Germany and Sweden.
Their combined population is over 200,000,000.
They have suffered 143 fatalities.
Bojo’s UK with a third of that population 143 fatalities.
And the Tories tell us they are working hard, managing this so well
and introducing world leading technologies?
Oh no they’re Not!
Not sure why some keep bringing up an RAF plane flying about Scotland? It’s kinda normal.
Now if they were unauthorised Russian military aircraft we’d have a problem don’t you think, no?
Is Kate Forbes a crazy suggestion as a replacement to Nicola Sturgeon ?, she seems capable to me but maybe too close to Nicola I don’t know and I’m not sure of her woke credentials, but she comes across as no nonsense and the way she handles the budget after the Derek McKay fiasco was quite impressive
I predict that ns will be gone by December.
Daisy Walker @ 2.39pm.
So, ‘just to be clear’ as shifty/blink blink would say:
Her staff phoned GA in Mid March 2017 to arrange a meet with NS on 29th March 2017 and did not enter it anywhere on the official diary..
Just to be clear, as shifty etc, etc (and a tad punctilious)
The contacts you refer to would be Mid Mar 2018, not 2017 – however, a slip of the quill, I knew what you meant!
(Just in case someone’s just flown-in from the moon, or is ready to pounce to the Scot Gov’s defence at the slightest sign of)
Great work.
AYRSHIRE NOB
You must have got yours in Orange County I see.
Are you a convert to Scottish Independence, or are you still sitting at your keyboard with your Union Jack PJs on.
Watch and learn NOB, we will show you how that other native of Orange County, Sturgeon, is destroying Scotland as every day passes.
You sound like a really nice Yoon, so there is hope for you yet.
#weenicknew
Also, Daisy Walker @ 2.39pm:
That no records NOW exist, conceals the names of who was there, including perhaps one of the complainers, who for obvious reason can’t be on the investigation team and a complainer at the same time. And a record of that would provide evidence of collusion..
Has Geoff Aberdein been asked re this key piece of info?
I’m pretty sure Mr Aberdein* would clear up this detail.
*Making the case for Aberdein’s veracity; “Geoff is not known, I think it is fair to say, for his subtlety” Alex Massie.
link to twitter.com
We must be getting close to some truth, as folk are coming under attack though misleading misrepresentation by those who appear to be attempting to gas-light Wings. This is not new and there are ways of countering it. 😉
Forum: Qualitative Social Research, Vol 18, No 3 (2017)
Play the Game. The Construction of Gender and Professional Behavior in Organizations: A Frame Analysis
link to qualitative-research.net
Hi Stanley
How’s Ollie?
Thanks Kenny – 2017 it was, the years are fair dragging on as they say.
Sorry Kenny 2018. I’ll stop now.
In reply to Graeme at 7pm.
Kate Forbes is a fundamentalistish Christian.
Abalha says:
13 October, 2020 at 7:28 pm
In reply to Graeme at 7pm.
Kate Forbes is a fundamentalistish Christian.
——————————————————————
Is that a problem ?
Much ado about nothing.
There can be a difference between meeting people and having a meeting.
Oh well never mind Joe Mo
Yes it’s fair to say there’s a strong Orange flavour here in Ayrshire.Probably being close to NI but there’s quite a few normal people that don’t let their creed cloud there judgement when it comes to independence. Not all Catholics support indy and not all proddies support the union.
Maybe you should read the book “A Memoir of the Forty-Five” .it’s not really all about religion you know.
Nite nite
In reply to Graeme at 729pm
For me not a fan of her views on abortion
For the ‘Woke’ – you queried – they won’t be a fan for wider reasons.
Of course I accept she can hold her personal views, based on
her beliefs, but just not sure she’d be a popular choice.
And politically I don’t think she’s that strong, but maybe that’s just me, seems a wee bit of a career politician, not sure how heartfelt her commitment to the cause of independence she is, could be wrong of course.
An article which may give a sense.
link to archive.is
@Mr Thms,
Ah! The old I phoned him up to arrange a chance meeting on a specific time at a specific date routine.
Any sort of religious or political fundamentalism is a problem, but all legal systems need to relate to a foundational moral theory in order to be potentially universal in outlook and prescription.
This is what Scots law is being forced to abandon in order to accommodate anti-foundational ideology that lacks coherence and compatibility with contemporary political theory (Brexit and GRA). This is why I’ve suggested we are being fitted up to slip seamlessly into a state of authoritarian totalitarianism.
All of this is being conducted under a legal order that is hostile towards international human rights law. So it is hostile towards public health, democracy, and the rule-of-law. That’s what happens when you place nationalism and tradition above the Moral law. And when your legal Establishment is openly hostile towards Natural law and natural justice, so can be considered an enemy of authentic culture. ;(
#ragging
link to jahr-bioethics-journal.com
I am looking to WM to provide the next leader. There is plenty of people there to step into the role of a strong leader. I don’t see anybody in Holyrood including Kate Forbes. That’s my view. I could be wrong of course, happy to change my mind later. Fundamental Christianity is not a problem for me. Makes a change from the pervy lot stalking Holyrood. It’s a question of experience.
“Now if they were unauthorised Russian military aircraft we’d have a problem don’t you think, no?”
AyrshireRob.
Not really we had several Russian ships take shelter near Moray a few years back due to terrible weather, it took more than 24 hours for a Royal navy warship to arrive, prior to that folk from the area claimed that the Russian sailors were very plausable chaps. Its only Westminster that has a problem with Russia Scotland does not.
As for dodgy planes the MoD has been training Saudi pilots at English RAF bases for several years now, on how to bomb and kill more efficiently in Yemen.
Tannadice boy
What I would say is regards Kate Forbes.
I find her a good orator from what I’ve seen.She’s good with numbers and is what we need going forward to indy.She is young but we all were once yeah!
The alternatives to number crunchers in labour and tory were Frightning were they not? James somebody and Murdo somebody. Probably had to resist Arithmetic back in the day.
Re-sit even
the 28th march v the 2nd April thing is a distraction. the suggestion appears to be that it was known about before the rules where changed – in fact it was the reason the rules where changed. and that is a entirely different game.
link to gordondangerfield.com
of course i could be mistaken or have forgot already
ho hum
@Ayrshire Rob
I am not discounting her. I married a Highland lassie not too far from her. I think she is a future leader but not for now. It’s my opinion she could prove me wrong. More power to her elbow.
In reply to Tannadice Boy at 804pm.
Fair enough if fundamental christianity isn’t a problem for
you.
Oddly while I’d rather have the French model where religion plays no part in society,I do hope John Mason holds onto his seat,very much disagree with his social views BUT he’s not a career politician and works bloody hard for his constituents, doesn’t seek the trappings of power. He lives his beliefs.
Kate Forbes on the other hand, for me, is a classic careerist, it’s more about her than anything else.
I love how you have the establishment in Scotland on the ropes Stu. Its heart breaking that the SNP has morphed into the nature denying devolutionists, however, the truth is is hammering their lies and they are bricking it.
Sturgeon is toast.
Cant wait for breakfast!!
@Terry 5.47pm
Thanks for Lesley link.
link to lesleyriddoch.com
I’m not punting religion folks, but were are not going to get anywhere nearer accessing our human rights, if we can’t overcome our legal Establishments ingrained ideological bigotry against the Natural law. This narrowness disables Scots law by rejecting and excluding the existential kernel of scientific and legal universality, though it does enable our legal Establishment to stand under Parliament, rather than the Moral law.
link to philpapers.org
Click the blue title for the pdf.
Serious Q –
When was Peter Murrell’s last (or I should say, ‘most recent’) public appearance?
Hello Stuart. About this article. I believe that you have worked in an office so you might know what it is like when some idiot keeps on hammering away at something and doesn’t accept the responses given. The result tends not to be not cooperation and information but intransigence and obstruction. Duff responses can also be due to human behaviour rather than conspiracy. No offense, but I thought this site was meant to be a “Scottish political media digest and monitor…” You are now so far down the rabbit hole that you have forgotten why you are here. Apart from a few of your followers on here no-one who really wants independence gives a stuff about whether Nicola is the goody or Alec is the goody. If Nicola went tomorrow fair enough. If she hangs about but gets us independence then fair enough. If she doesn’t produce the goods (independence) then get soemone else who will. If that person happens to be transgender I don’t care. I just want independence. I had a quick trawl of your recent articles and it is a long, long time since you wrote a series of articles that were not about the internal politics of the SNP. Could you maybe think about having another look at the independence question once again? Maybe a positive article on occasion rather than just the shock jock stuff? gullaneno4 seems to be one of the few on here who has their eye on the ball. I know this comment comes across a bit aggressive but that is unintentional. I just want independence, but all I see on here is negativity and a commentary on the internal wrangling in the SNP and the GRA stuff. There’s more to independence than this.
In reply to Ian Brotherhood at 909pm
When have you EVER seen Peter Murrell in public?
And then there’s the third wheel SNP lawyer
Scott Martin, who has ever heard of him, let alone
seen him.
Yet he is still the main person on the active Yes Scotland
as a company person.
You know all of this was known about in 2014, few people spoke up and that’s the problem, it’s why we are where we are now.
STV teatime news.
First item,
Scottish fishermen had the cheek to complain about Brexit, even although the guy they Interviewed was STILL in favour of leaving the EU
Second Item,
Scottish Farmers complaining that leaving the EU will create an unfair market for them, even though they were in favour of Brexit and staying within the UK.
Third item,
About years of austerity causing families to go hungry and live under the poverty line.
Every one of these situations where caused by us voting to stay within the UK under English Tory rule.
So those who voted no in 2014, and those who voted for Brexit deserve all the bad luck that is coming down the line.
And STV forgot to mention that austerity was caused by 10 years of english Tory rule.
Republicofscotland 737/400 is a medium size plane, i was just taking exceptionnat normal tabloid exaggeration, not a giant byvany means
Here, perhaps, is NS’s out
link to under2coalition.org.
Piece about it in Sunday’s National.
The Under2 Coalition is led by a group of Co-chairs and supported by a Steering Group to ensure the coalition is diverse and globally representative.
Our 4 Co-Chairs, one of whom is now NS. Responsible for Europe. How does she find time. Covid covid covid.
@Abalha (9.09) –
Only time I ever noticed Murrell in public was at the opening of the big new bridge (the name of which escapes me), and in the throng after NS’s conference speeches, directing folk as she moved through the crowd.
Oh, and there’s that snap of them together, watching a tennis match or suchlike, and…
That’s it.
And he’s been in the job for 21 years?!
#WeseekhimhereWeseekhimthereWeseekhimeveryfuckinwhere
😉
Check his tweets via SNP.
link to twitter.com
Rev how are these replies signed because the people in the SG dishing out this barrel of lies should be held to account for their conduct.
They also exude an arrogant confidence suggesting they feel they are untouchable.
@Albaha
Fair enough each chiel to his own. A highland expression according to my wife. Of course you can always stand for public office. Thats a challenge for you. Stand if you think you are better.
.
Stuart,
My boss has conducted, indeed fought the more devious amongst FOI units of ScotGov and its quangos. I just telephoned him about this and he said a few brief sentences which I actually wrote down. It infers the above reply is technically truthful and indicates a remedy…
“Shredders, dear boy, shredders. The Scottish Government have bought a job-lot of shredders and have been burning the midnight oil, shredding for all they are worth. The information is physically no longer there. Those papers are no physically gone. Fact.
The forensic department in the police or at the Auditor General for Scotland may be able to recover Ghosts in the machine. FOI-able copies of the shredded documents.
But frankly, this looks like a matter best referred to Police Scotland, as someone in ScotGov or with ScotGov access credentials has been (allegedly) perverting the course justice.”.
Stuart. There was a lot more to the conversation between us and the whole thing seems a minefield.
You may need a whistleblower to testify that they have witnessed “evidence tampering”. Or some other way, but my boss gave this final rejoinder was to…
“Recommend your friend keeps digging because this thing has the aroma of rodent all over it.”
For my tuppence worth…
When the dam bursts and all this Sturgeonite McWoke stitch up of the former First Minister for alleged rape and the most reputational damage she could inflict for putrid political advantage spills over that dam, then the river of excrement will be many times worse than Westminster Expenses Scandal.
When Sturgeon, Murrell, Leslie Evans, Rhiannon Spears, the McWoke fifth column and the MI5 high ranking plants infesting the SNP High command and NEC are revealed, there will be a seismic shift in Scottish politics…
The Sturgeonite destruction of the SNP for McWoke selfish advantage.
Hopefully, the growing realisation amongs decent SNP members will wake up to what Stuart Campbell, Kenny MacAskill, MP., Alex Neil, MSP., have been exposing…
That Sturgeon and her acolytes have committed such egregious damage to the SNP and YES IndyRef movement.
The result should be national outrage and Sturgeon plus Murrell will either fuck off to Dreghorn with their jotters and NO golden goodbye. Or they will be dragged out of Bute House in handcuffs by burly polis. They deserve that after the two years of Hell on earth they (allegedly) put Alex Salmond through.
It’s about time we reminded our law officers they are our servants and they do not own the law.
Scottish culture has not yet been fully eradicated from global constitutional consciousness, but it won’t last long so long as we fail to respond effectively to our legal Establishment’s legal position, which places them alongside the most blue-nose hum bigot your are ever likely to meet. 🙁
Philosophy, Rights and Natural Law
Essays in Honour of Knud Haakonssen
link to edinburghuniversitypress.com
Dogs in Lebennon getting trained to detect Covid 19. Apparently could be as much as 98-100% accuracy. Bloody amazing our canine friends eh?
They do it for a rubber toy bless,not money.
Keep chipping away Stuart. The whole edifice is about to come crashing down, and it will all be due to the smallest detail.
HUN bigot, obvs.
Obudsmn for Banking and Investments
Natural justice and procedural fairness at OBSI
What are natural justice, procedural fairness and administrative fairness?
link to obsi.ca
cynicalHighlander says:
13 October, 2020 at 9:39 pm
Check his tweets via SNP.
Thanks for the link to Murrell’s tweet. I am not on Twitter so don’t know how it all works. However, the link takes you to a tweet he sent on the 19th of June! is that really the latest tweet he has sent? or are there later ones? even then, the tweet in that link is about Covid and sod all to do with independence or anything else independence related.
Cheers
Re WT @ 9.11
You are missing the point. There will be NO independence with the Murrell clique in charge, that much has become very clear. In any event there is no more time to give to them to see what happens. We are hard up against the end of the transition period on 31 December when the plans already made by Bojo to bypass Holyrood will kick in. Together with the effect of an ever more corrupt and compliant press any prospect of a referendum will be long gone.
It is down to Sturgeon and her delaying tactics that we are facing Armaggedon. There is no point in producing happy clappy articles when we have to lance a suppurating boil before we can look to achieving anything. The Rev is correct to put all his energies into that.
@ WT at 9.11pm: Are you a troll, or just wilfully blind? Nicola Sturgeon has brought Scotland not one scintilla closer to independence in the six years of her leadership, and she has no plan and clearly no intention doing anything to bring independence about. Not only that, but she has conspired to jail an innocent man on false charges, and she and her government are now lying, obstructing and doing all they can to cover up their corrupt and criminal actions. I have believed in independence and voted for the SNP for the whole of my adult life (I am 57), but this is intolerable. Sturgeon’s time is up. She must go immediately.
WT says:
13 October, 2020 at 9:11 pm
Hello Stuart. About this article. I believe that you have worked in an office so you might know what it is like when some idiot keeps on hammering away at something and doesn’t accept the responses given. The result tends not to be not cooperation and information but intransigence and obstruction. Duff responses can also be due to human behaviour rather than conspiracy. No offense, but I thought this site was meant to be a “Scottish political media digest and monitor…” You are now so far down the rabbit hole that you have forgotten why you are here. Apart from a few of your followers on here no-one who really wants independence gives a stuff about whether Nicola is the goody or Alec is the goody. If Nicola went tomorrow fair enough. If she hangs about but gets us independence then fair enough. If she doesn’t produce the goods (independence) then get soemone else who will. If that person happens to be transgender I don’t care. I just want independence. I had a quick trawl of your recent articles and it is a long, long time since you wrote a series of articles that were not about the internal politics of the SNP. Could you maybe think about having another look at the independence question once again? Maybe a positive article on occasion rather than just the shock jock stuff? gullaneno4 seems to be one of the few on here who has their eye on the ball. I know this comment comes across a bit aggressive but that is unintentional. I just want independence, but all I see on here is negativity and a commentary on the internal wrangling in the SNP and the GRA stuff. There’s more to independence than this
What’s the matter WT suddenly finding that Wings is one of the real driving forces for Independence but not in your small-minded way? . If you’re too thick to realise what’s going on here you don’t deserve independence you amoral self-centred moron.
We all need help wake Scotland up to our legal Establishment’s ideological hostility to international human rights law. So it gives me no pleasure in seeking to end the party of hope’s current leadership, but the NEC is hostile and obstructive to our cause, and we need to defend our democracy and cultural fabric from expansionist and xenophobic English Torydum.
Medicine, Health Care and Philosophy volume 23, pages 335–342 (2020)
To die well: the phenomenology of suffering and end of life ethics
link to link.springer.com
Nicola Sturgeon, Boris Johnson, Matt Hancock and the so called experts on SAGE that are driving us towards another hard lockdown on the flimsiest of evidence and pure fear mongering. According to them and the other panic mongers that since only approximately 7% of people serologically tested have anti bodies then that means that the remaining 93% are 100% vulnerable. This is total nonsense and it is disgraceful SAGE would push that idea, it doesn’t even stand up to the slightest bit of scrutiny.
Here is an excellent discussing this issue and the immune system: link to sebastianrushworth.com
If this pile of lies and subterfuge has distracted Sturgeon for even 5 minutes, it’s five minutes that should have been spent dealing with other much more important issues.
It’s time to stop. The country is in a terrible position right now.
How we address coronavirus and the Tory power-grab has far-reaching implications for the people of this country. Those things can’t wait. We shouldn’t be distracted by this mangled, twisted mess that she herself single-handedly created.
She’s caught. It’s over for her. Anybody that suggests otherwise is encouraging her to stay and that means more valuable time wasted.
There’s power behind all thrones and it’s time the power behind the SNP put an end to this, for the good of her health, her marriage, the party, and the country.
All the alternatives to her resigning are much more damaging. This isn’t going away. It’s just going to get bigger and worse as long as she stays.
Enough is enough.
The thing is, all this economic carnage and a good chunk of excess deaths, are the responsibility of English Toydum’s ideological prejudices, which value property rights and cultural tradition over human rights and scientific reason. That’s very bad. Mkay!
Journal of Medical Ethics, 2006 Apr; 32(4): 209–214.
Bodily rights and property rights
Abstract
Whereas previous discussions on ownership of biological material have been much informed by the natural rights tradition, insufficient attention has been paid to the strand in liberal political theory represented by Felix Cohen, Tony Honoré, and others, which treats property relations as socially constructed bundles of rights.
In accordance with that tradition, we propose that the primary normative issue is what combination of rights a person should have to a particular item of biological material. Whether that bundle qualifies to be called “property” or “ownership” is a secondary, terminological issue. We suggest five principles of bodily rights and show how they can be applied to the construction of ethically appropriate bundles of rights to biological material.
Keywords:
property rights, ownership, biological material, transplantation organs, donation
link to ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
It’s very bad because if you are unable to defend your legal identity, you are unable to defend the integrity of your biological material, a.k.a. your mind and body. Which appears to be acceptable to the Lord Advocate. ;(
#ragging
Case Western Reserve Journal of International Law, Volume 38, Issue 3 2006-2007
Biosecurity under the Rule of Law
link to scholarlycommons.law.case.edu
bipod @ 11.05 pm.
I disagree with the general tone of what you’re saying. Full lock-down is the only thing that has actually worked so far.
It’s easy to say that the costs of lock-down are too high right now but, assuming there is a threshold, and there must be one even for you (I would think), could you give us an indication of where it might be?
For example, would you be willing to watch say 5 thousand people per day dying of coronavirus? 10 thousand? You tell me, at what number would the price be too high for you? I’m genuinely interested.
I enjoyed the article you linked to, btw. It’s a fascinating subject. I would liked the author to have touched on the effectiveness of vitamin D and explained where that fitted in towards bolstering immunity, etc.
Fact list for Covid. Im sure it has been posted before byt just in case:
swprs.org/facts-about-covid-19/
Boris Johnson has been talking about how this plague has changed everything and we won’t be going back to normal even after Coronavirus. I was talking about the sheer number of international corporations that had the same vocabulary regarding this back in Spring – the 4th industrial revolution, while politicians the world over seem to be repeating the same rhetoric ‘build back better’, ‘the new normal’. Its very handy that this came along and allowed such a Great Reset isn’t it?
Its obviously pure conspiracy garbage to think that maybe this will be used by the financial and political elites at the expense of you or I. Clearly. Nobody would ever be so inhumane and power hungry.
Thanks to whoever posted the Lesley Riddoch podcast Sorry can’t remember who , but thanks to them ,
The only time I am going to reference CBB but as he appears to have a Legal background , Cameron do you trust the Legal establishment in Scotland ? ,my dealings with them leave me with the impression a bigger bunch of crooks and Liars would be hard to find , and drowning every one of them would be a good start and would probably improve most people’s life’s .
The way Craig Murray is being relentlessly pursued is disgusting and the recent utterances from the Top one ,the lord advocate and his opinion that as far I can see is a world first and would effectively close down Twitter , best of luck on that one yer lordship, it would be intriguing to see the outcome of that little line of legal gibberish .Meant to further pressurise Craig into silence , rather than a free society we are headed to a very strange Scotland that most people won’t believe or recognise.
Robert Graham
Our legal Establishment are institutionally British nationalist in outlook, so are ambivalent to anything deemed tainted by Catholic theology, and only grudgingly support democracy. So no, I don’t trust them. They favour a legally dogmatic “positivist” approach to law, and so are ideologically “ambivalent” to natural justice.
INTERNATIONAL THEOLOGICAL COMMISSION
In Search of a Universal Ethic:
A New Look at the Natural Law
link to vatican.va
sorry….so are HOSTILE to anything deemed tainted by Catholic theology
Northwestern Journal of International Human Rights, Volume 2 | Issue 1 Article 4, Spring 2004
Natural Rights and Modern Constitutionalism
link to scholarlycommons.law.northwestern.edu
@Hatuey
There is an existing formula used on the number of deaths per Kilometre of road. Been used for years. In fact decades. The same principle applies with Covid. But the number of deaths due to Government action are not being recorded. Level playing I say. I should have died 3 times in my life shit happens man. Take your own precautions is what I say. I wear a mask and socially distance etc. I protect my family. Believe NS if you want to. We are still alive. (And kicking).
@Hatuey, 11.39
Full lock-down is the only thing that has actually worked so far.
It certainly saved the NHS but at the cost of increased mortality (“over the lockdown period as a whole Government policy has increased mortality rather than reduced it.” link to lboro.ac.uk) and serious damage to the economy. Is this why the WHO is advising countries not to use lock-down as the main way of dealing with the coronavirus? See the statement of the WHO’s Special Envoy, David Nabarro, on this clip link to youtube.com
Thanks Cameron for a polite response and actually backing up your reply with the reasoning behind forming your opinion ,
Doesn’t mean we are best pals but credit where is due again thanks for taking the time posting a link for explanation .
Our legal Establishment’s hostility towards the Natural law and natural justice, poses a very serious threat to Scotland’s public health. Brexit removes Scots from the protection of EU Health and Environmental law, and seperates Scots further from the protection of international human rights law. Which is just as well, as the GRA amendments are incompatible with medical philosophy, bioethics, and the contemporary political theory of democratic liberalism.
So we really need to get on top of our law officers, if we want to get on top of Covid-19. Joined-up thinking and a respect for public health ethics is simply beyond the bio-neurological architecture of the right-wing brain. Which appears to characterise our legal Establishment’s intellectual and cultural narrowness. ;(
American Journal of Public Health, 2001 November; 91(11): 1776–1782.
An Ethics Framework for Public Health
link to ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Robert Graham
I can’t think what I’ve done to put you off me. If you let me know I might be able to make amends.
Cameron I can only give a personal opinion and it’s this take it on board or dismiss it it’s your choice , a deluge of links that are either irrelevant to the current thread or without a obvious point or a specific reference to any question asked might help , That’s my opinion I had the same discussion with Colin who used to get some pretty interesting abuse , it certainly helps if people myself included take the time and acutely read what is being posted rather than jump to conclusions. Then again it’s your opinion and you are as entitled to express it a much as anyone here. We are all guests in this particular platform and are allowed a voice without abuse my advice would be try and curb the links a bit.
If the SNP does not seek alternative (ethical) legal advice to sort the NEC out, the party is finished as a vehicle for national liberation. And Scotland has no future as a nation capable of supporting democracy, as our legal Establishment stand under the Crown in Parliament and not the Moral law. ;(
Medicine, Health Care and Philosophy volume 21, pages 387–402 (2018)
The evolution of public health ethics frameworks: systematic review of moral values and norms in public health policy
link to link.springer.com
Robert Graham
I have tried to be very selective in who I abuse and how I abuse them, as I’m trained to defend open democracy from the radical right. Perhaps the relevance isn’t immediately apparent to you, but I’m not simply posting random links, I’m pointing folk to grounded theory that supports public health and democracy. I’m very rusty though and it’s taken me a bit of time to get up to speed.
BMC Medical Ethics volume 15, Article number: 73 (2014)
Teaching seven principles for public health ethics: towards a curriculum for a short course on ethics in public health programmes
link to bmcmedethics.biomedcentral.com
Tannadice Boy, that’s all very interesting but doesn’t address or answer my question; what number of deaths per day would you be willing to accept – as the price that’s worth paying – to avoid lock-down?
You know what I mean by that, my wording is crap today as I’m tired… if we opened up the economy fully and left distancing measures to the individual rather than government, at what point would you jump in and say that’s enough, time to lock-down, time for the government to step in?
cirsium, I understand all that. In an ideal world, we wouldn’t need to lock-down because we’d stamp it out and firefight cases properly using track, trace, testing, etc., when new cases appeared. Got it.
Nobody here and certainly not me is arguing that the government (UK and Scottish [which are the same thing as far as coronavirus is concerned]) have done anything but royally fucked this right up.
We went into lock-down too late which meant the disease spread like wildfire earlier in the year. That meant when we eventually did go into lock-down, we had to go full-on and for longer. These are all uncontroversial, accepted, and understood things.
Just in case anyone was left with any lingering doubts about how useless the government was, they let us all come back out of lock-down without proper systems in place and to fuck it all up again.
But full lock-down did work and it will work again.
I’m asking at what point the government, you, everybody, thinks we should reach for that option since everything else they have done clearly doesn’t work. It is a question of when, not if, and that’s testable as you’ll see.
So, again, how many deaths per day will convince people who are skeptical about restrictions it’s time to go back into full lock-down? It’s a simple question.
My personal view is that as long as schools are open then the virus will spread. Schools are like perfectly designed distribution systems for viruses.
If you were to sit and build a virus distribution system – involving lots of careless people coming and going and unwittingly carrying the virus into the wider community – it would look just like a school.
Re: Rev’s FOI request, is it because they’re selectively running SG business on Party IT infrastructure, so there’s no records to find? Maybe a sysadmin footsoldier in the SNP’s IT Crowd could unpick it from an O365 Exchange backup.
p.s. Godspeed WGD.
There is no legal defense against the truth, and I know a bit about how to support that through epistemology and stuff. So I hope our legal Establishment is aware I’ve only started ripping them a new one. ;(
Putting public health ethics into practice: a systematic framework
link to frontiersin.org
More goings on in Cunninghame North.
Osama Saeed Bhutta has ‘suspended his campaign’ because a branch sent out an email to its members telling them to vote for Kenny Gibson. He says;
‘This contravenes rules 8.5, 9.2 and 9.3 about using member data, using party meetings, and the role of office bearers’
‘As a result, I am suspending my campaign until the party decides whether or not it will implement its rules. If it acts in good time, I will resume the campaign. If it does not, it will have to accept a tainted result’
link to osamabhutta.scot
The email, at the centre of it. sent out by the Garnock
Valley branch.
link to twitter.com
Holymacmoses says:
13 October, 2020 at 10:24 pm
WT says:
13 October, 2020 at 9:11 pm
Hello Stuart. About this article. I believe that you have worked in an office so you might know what it is like when some idiot keeps on hammering away at something and doesn’t accept the responses given. The result tends not to be not cooperation and information but intransigence and obstruction….
Quid pro quo Holymacmoses, about your comment. I believe you sound just like some crooked Local Authority Complaint handler who’s indifference to Local Authority corruption and impropriety is a vital ingredient in the widespread proliferation of said corruption and impropriety.
And the ‘idiot’ you dismiss as a nuisance for hammering away at the problem is actually some poor bastard who’s business might be failing because the corruption injures it’s productivity, and ‘the idiot’ is actually just desperate for somebody to listen to him, help him pay his bills, feed and clothe his kids, and maybe remind himself what righteous Justice smells like.
For some people, the only acceptable level of corruption is zero corruption. There is no ‘safe’ level. There is no tolerable limit considered harmless. If you don’t agree, then you’re part of the problem. You’re maybe just a small part of the problem, and you can easily convince yourself your part in it is insignificant, but for any victim of corruption the effect is cumulative and focused in one place.
To quote Edmund Burke: “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men should do nothing.”
I am convinced Rev Stu is indeed one such “good man“, but one of the very few who is brave enough to make a stand and do “something“. The SNP would do well to listen, purge the evil within, and put their house in order.
I’ll give you second quote too, or rather the lyrics to a song… Make that an anthem, for people downtrodden by corruption and indifference everywhere… or as you put it, suffering “intransigence and obstruction”.
(Something Inside) So Strong – Labi Siffre
The higher you build your barriers
The taller I become
The further you take my rights away
The faster I will run
You can deny me, you can decide
To turn your face away
No matter ’cause there’s
Something inside so strong
I know that I can make it
Though you’re doing me wrong, so wrong….
If an understanding is needed to establish why Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama were so determined to impede or topple President Trump, investigators must go back into history comparing sums that donors claim they sent towards the Clinton Foundation, with the Foundation’s public filings, submitted many places, under penalties of perjury.
The Clinton Foundation public record, evident in plain sight includes multiple confessions of making false statements under oath.
May the long overdue indictments, prosecutions, convictions, fines and incarcerations soon begin”.
link to caltonjock.com
So.
We have Nicola Sturgeon lying to parliament. She still claims it wasn’t a lie, and is desperately trying to obfuscate to cover the lie. Geoff Aberdein swears under oath in court that the meeting was pre-arranged and took place on the 29th of March 2018, and the subject was about complaints of sexual misconduct against AS. The official records of that meeting have disappeared, but existed at some point. Nicola Sturgeon’s efforts to say she ‘forgot’ might have been more plausible if she was more consistent about when she stopped forgetting and if the subject matter – that she thinks so important, and indeed thought so important at the time evidenced by commissioning an updated harassment policy the year before to capture just that situation. Quite the coincidence. – was something so easily forgotten.
The meeting on the 29th March took place, that is now agreed by all parties – what is now disputed is the form of that meeting and what was discussed. The lack of existing records, coupled with the original claim it never happened, puts doubt in everyone’s mind, but the testimony of Aberdein, and the contacts with various parties he had at the time, prove that it took place on the subject claimed. Nicola Sturgeon now should be providing evidence, proof, that Aberdein is lying, or admit she is lying. (If she had a conscience or cared, or had any honour left, that is). Saying she forgot is not proof. She was asked a direct question in parliament, and did not correct her ‘mistake’ of misleading parliament as quickly as possible – she has staff that is there to check records and there was a record of the meeting at the time, so she could have corrected her mistake in parliament immediately.
The earlier gossip about the sky news report in Edinburgh airport in 2017 is a different event, and covers rumours (possibly started by the SNP themselves?) that she would have been aware of. This just makes the initial commissioning of the new harassment policy, with the sudden change in the final draft to exclude involvement of the First Minister, possible proof of the conspiracy. If the scottish Government drafted a general harassment policy only to suit one situation, then they have acted badly. There is a lot of evidence already published that suggests this, but is a more difficult thing to prove, and we may only ever have circumstantial evidence on this.
I want to make a note about the accusers. As soon as anyone makes a complaint on anything to someone officially obliged to deal with it – the burden of behaving responsibility is then taken on by that official. The complainer no longer has to be reasonable or fair or anything. That’s what grievance procedures are about – you have someone there that can examine the situation dispassionately and ensure your grievance isn’t unreasonable or malicious and decide what to do for you. In the AS case, those accusers put the burden of acting responsibility and fairly on to all the officials that dealt with it. That means, all these public servants that dealt with the situation – public servants that have a duty of care to us, the public, to ensure we are protected and treated fairly – are the ones to blame for any malicious intent that there may have been within any complaint.
So, civil servants, police, procurator fiscal – all those people involved at every stage, and not one reasonable voice among them questioned the sense of the complaints themselves, or the level of seriousness that should be applied – not one questioned or stopped driving the process forward, even after the judicial review found the initial process unlawful. Extraordinary.
Everyone involved should be questioned and their positions as public servants tested
So I do not, personally, attach any blame to the complainers – it is the public servants that took on the burden of responsibility for those complaints that must take full blame. But, say, hypothetically speaking, you had the bizarre situation where a complainer was in fact one of the public servants that was taking responsibility for the complaints, as well as influencing how policy was applied, as well involved in arranging meetings and recording those meetings – there is a serious conflict of interest. As a complainer that person is allowed to be as malicious and unreasonable as they want, but as an official they would be responsible for ensuring those complaints were dealt with reasonably and fairly. If, say, this happened, and it was not discovered until later that a complainer was deeply involved in creating policy and influencing events – then, every single part of the process potentially tainted by this possible malicious actor would have to be reexamined and reapplied in a separate – possibly totally independent – process. It would have been unlawful to continue.
It occurred to me last night that a way to demonstrate civil disobedience was this.
When the the EU powers are stolen and transferred to GB HQ Holyrood. We could form a massive human chain around the new UK Scotland office. Thus preventing anyone entering or leaving.
It would need to be on a massive scale, at least 10,000. This form of disobedience is how they do it in Belarus or Barcelona. Lets see the Tories send in the troops or try and use tear gas on us!
NewsUKUK Politics
The most puzzling moments from the Dominic Cummings press conference
Dominic Cummings and family ‘avoid huge council tax bill on Durham properties’
Report says charges for two buildings on Durham farm won’t apply retrospectively
Tom Batchelor
@_tombatchelor
1 hour ago
Dominic Cummings and his family are liable for council tax on two properties built at his family’s farm in the northeast of England, but backdated charges that reportedly could have amounted to tens of thousands of pounds will not apply.
Officials have concluded that charges for the buildings, on the outskirts of Durham, should start from this month rather than from when both properties were built, without planning permission.
Contrary – I agree in principle with you but one of the problems is that some of the complainers under the new process were also involved in drawing up the process and its implementation.
Appears that Scottish Government is only ‘Goody two shoes’ when dealing with WM Tories and Machiavellian when dealing with Scots.
Oh were it only the reverse.
From the judicial review of the harassment policy as applied to alleged complaints against Alex Salmond, the judge used strong language: Unlawful. Tainted. I always thought this rather extreme for what we are told was the issue – the minor indescretion by Judith MacKinnon having had contact with a complainer prior to investigating the complaint. We have been fed horse manure, haven’t we?
If it turns out that all our public officials, all our courts, know exactly how badly the complaints process was carried out, and did nothing to stop it, and are refusing to allow us to know how unlawful the process was, then they have persecuted a private citizen (AS), they have behaved unlawfully, and should be held to account. If that necessitates revealing the identity of any possible complainer/official – then it should be done. If they all – the public officials – want to admit their wrongdoing and pay AS compensation for persecution, it could be done without revelations; but with continuing cover-ups and obfuscation, ALL public officials that know of the actual wrongdoing that occurred need to be held to account, and it seems that it is everyone but us that know what the fuck has been going on, then we need any malicious actor to be brought to account, and all those responsible for supporting those malicious actions brought to account.
It is in the interests of the Scottish public for this to be taken to court, and for punishment to be handed out accordingly. This is a worthwhile use of public money. These public officials have a duty of care towards us, and they have breached that contract. A committee in parliament with a narrow remit and no teeth is not good enough. We are talking about institutional corruption, potentially.
What i said a few days ago, those old shredders were busy.
@Cameron B Brodie
‘I have tried to be very selective in who I abuse and how I abuse them, as I’m trained to defend open democracy from the radical right.’
The trouble is that anyone who doesn’t agree with you on anything is radical right.
@Hatuey
Anybody who proposes a full lockdown and not selective protection of the vulnerable any time a disease with a very low mortality rate hits is pretty much asking for an economy equivalent to the stone age with all the deaths and misery that would accompany it.
We have seen a padding of the statistics and a dramatization from the media. It is beginning to dawn on the more alert people that there is more to the measures taken to ‘beat covid’ than simply best public health policy.
Big jock 8.11am. Ah wishful thinking there big jock. Scots dont do civil disobedience. In fact sadly scots dont do much of anything.
Sorry, 2 things came to mind. hand wringing and whingeing.
Achnabanan,
That is exactly the possible problem I was referring to – you have no proof that’s the case though. What I am saying is, is that the misdirection of ‘who knew what when’ is irrelevant if the actual unlawfulness of the process was in fact a serious breach that was known about by everyone involved. It doesn’t matter when anyone knew what, the whole process should have shut down immediately and re-examined without the ‘apparent bias’ being present – and going by Lord Pentlands ruling, it sounds like it was known about then, but they all carried on regardless.
The calls for ‘independence’ in the procedure, the unlawfulness – dismissed by Leslie Evans as a problem with the wording of the policy – makes sense. Call me slow. But I go by evidence, not just hearsay. It’s a serious breach by many people, potentially.
Irony being that nowadays dishonesty from supranational organisations, and virtually every world leader but one, means you need to sign a visitors book to have a cup of tea with your neighbour when even as recently as a couple of years ago apparently anyone could waltz into parliament, buttonhole the FM and, notwithstanding the catty interview on Sunday, subsequently provide silent witness to said meeting being used in somewhat spurious impeachment calls founded on the original sin of another.
Aside to Breeks – suspect you might be owing Holymacmoses an apology.
There’s no hiding that mercenary mentality, the one that projected Scotland into England’s orbit.
https://www.thenational.scot/news/18792140.75-per-cent-scots-will-back-independence—economic-case-right/
Always suspected Scots were closet Tories and so seemingly did a certain Mrs Thatcher who was confused by the Jekyll and Hyde mind set.
The resemblance to respectable small shopkeepers counting the day’s takings after midnight and then going out whoring is ‘striking’.
Is Scotland a real nation or just distant mirage?
Joe, you could attempt to answer my question. Why won’t the Corona-Skeptics answer?
People don’t assess death in percentage terms. Telling us it’s a very low mortality rate when say 1000 per day are dying of coronavirus, doesn’t (or won’t) help your argument.
Funny, though, that you are quite happy to include statistics in your arguments when it suits you – no “padding” and “dramatisation” there, right? Your statistics dropped from the heavens and are as pure as snow.
Contrary
You attach no blame to the complainers??
AS was found not guilty, which means the jury did not believe the evidence presented by the complainers, which suggests they were untruthful.
So why did they all suddenly come forward at that particular time especially when Murrell`s apps message has revealed an apparent determination to prosecute AS.
Contrary, is 100% correct.
One step at a time though.
Big Jock, I like your plan btw. Got to be better than sitting here moaning at each other.
In today’s Times.
‘Jackie Baillie, Scottish Labour’s deputy leader, questioned the first minister’s statement in light of her instigating the final meeting with Mr Salmond. “Her story simply doesn’t add up,” Ms Baillie said’
link to archive.is
Gerard: “Scottish Government is only ‘Goody two shoes’ when dealing with WM Tories and Machiavellian when dealing with Scots.”
Bang on. Best assessment yet.
I KNOW NOTHING, I KNOW NOTHING , ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ……………I am from SNP. member. Not me for to know anything.
OT Someone was asking about the benefits of Vitamin D – web site called Why Scots Need Vitamin D has a great deal of info about it, and its written by Doctors.
For folks info, if you are in the chronically low levels of Vitamin D and taking supplements to rectify same – you will see absolutely no improvement until at least 3 months in. I think that’s worth knowing, as most people would expect to see a gradual improvement in the first 3 months and could lose hope/think its not working without that info.
Anyone who suffers depression and or chronic fatigue should have their Vitamin D levels checked as a matter of course. It can be a Life changer and a life saver. The medical profession are becoming much more aware of this in recent years, in fairness to them.
@Hatuey
Your question isn’t easy.
However a start would be compare the deaths from missed medical treatments, depression and other deaths as a result of the last lockdown and compare them to the numbers dying now.
You could also look at the deaths caused in other countries who didn’t lock down.
Before anybody says ‘ah yes, but my auntie Ethel died of Covid, how can you be so heartless’.
I knew a really nice young guy who died of Covid. Only 25. He died because his genius government had a binary lockdown/no lockdown policy. So when they lifted lockdown and he had to pay his bills by working in a bar he caught it and died.
If they allowed people like me to keep the economy ticking over while sheltering the vulnerable (and pay for their expenses, which can be done if the economy is kept running) it would probably be the best solution.
One trouble we have is clear evidence of stat padding and misinformation being broadcast to us. Unfortunately looking at that opens a rabbit hole most are uncomfortable about going into.
For heavens sake. Even if your willing to give Nicola the benefit of the doubt( which is a long stretch), she and the top civil servants and lawyers signed off a totally illegal process which His Lordship hammered ruthlessly.
This is utterly inept, never mind illegal. They took part in a process which was given to the accusers to prove if it was satisfactory to them. What can you say?
Did Alex receive any support. As far as I know you are innocent till proven guilty.
It was one way traffic. Designed to convict Alex. When that didn’t work they handed their tainted evidence over to the police to finish the job. Thankfully that failed too but only because a jury looked at the evidence as being wrong.
@Hatuey
Additionally:
All the information is available for people to go and have an honest look. If you don’t want to that then that’s not my problem and im not here to hold hands and pry open the eyelids of people who refuse to open them.
stuart mctavish says:
14 October, 2020 at 9:27 am
Aside to Breeks – suspect you might be owing Holymacmoses an apology.
Maybe I do Stuart. If I come over too strong, it’s because my life has been badly plagued with corrupt rogues and feckless intermediaries, (more than a few of them SNP imbeciles) who turn indolent complacency into an art form.
Such rot has gone unchallenged so long it is now endemic in Scottish Society, and the consequence are there for all to see in Holyrood’s attitude towards corruption, entryism and lobbyists.
Holyrood is ably supported by a legal process happy to flagrantly descriminate against one sector of Scottish society, (those who back Alex Salmond), and incredibly, is even ‘indifferent’ about it’s own vexatious and malicious prosecutions.
I percieved Holymacmoses to be attacking Rev Stu for rocking the boat and threatening Sturgeon’s master plan for
independenceSNP victory.I apologise if I went off the deep end, but I get very defensive when people attack others for doing the right thing. It’s a mindset which gets right under my skin and rubs me up the wrong way.
If Scotland and the damned SNP hadn’t been so deaf, dumb and blind in their adulation for Sturgeon these past 5 years, Scotland might have actually fought Brexit, defended it’s sovereign Constitution and European Citizenship successfully, and thereby have secured a Scottish Constitutional backstop all the way back in 2016, which would have plunged Brexit and the UK Union into terminal decline from which it could not recover.
People did try, but dragging the SNP and Party faithful out of their blinkered complacency and blind faith in Sturgeon’s secret masterplan is quite a challenge.
If that hadn’t been the case, instead of dreading December’s end for losing the protection of our European Umbrella, Scotland might instead have been celebrating the termination of the Treaty of Union as an Independent Sovereign Nation.
Instead we’re to be treated to another gutless capitulation in December, and then another bucket of lukewarm sick next May, with Wokerati croutons for added spice.
Forgive me if I’m not cheering, but I’m too in touch with my inner crabbitness to even smile.
Robert Bruce stabbed to death his political opponent,
was it a case of `get him before he gets me`.
So, we are told, the Covid infected Grim Reaper cuts a swathe through the population.
On a purely non scientific observation, given the high profile celeb culture we live in where are the celeb corpses? We’ve had coughs and sniffles from Trump and Johnson, neither top of the scale fit specimens and Bolsanaro of Brazil all seemingly recovered but who else?
I personally know no one with even symptoms of this condition, of any age.
When daily briefings start outside Bute House concerning the state of health of the FM I possibly might begin to believe there is something in this affair. Then again, could it just be simply an Eva Perón ‘I suffer with my people’ pose?
¿Quien sabe?
@Big Jock
That’s exactly what we should do. Close the place down before it gets open.
It might be all we can do given the pathetic ineptitude of our representatives.
Happy to discuss.
No Worries Breeks – or anyone else writing here. I don’t take offence when discussing stuff and here I’ll state a permanent apology if I ever upset anyone. All opinions are valid – it’s just that I think I’m right:-)
It’s good to be angry about injustice and I write badly sometimes and people read badly often.
@Breeks
No worries on my part but the part of the post you took exception to appeared to be a quote from someone else
An excellent post from Iain Lawson on how the Snp are running the candidate selections for the constituency candidate to stand in 2021 for the Snp and how the members and the branches are being stitched up by the party .
In Iain’s own words , Who ever heard of elections where the electorate is kept top secret? Whose running this Party? Joseph Stalin? .
“ Wait till I tell you about this. I could not believe it when I was first told about it. So I checked and as unbelievable as it is, it is happening and this is how the SNP are planning to run the selection of candidates across the country. “
“ THE FIX IS IN “
link to yoursforscotlandcom.wordpress.com
On topic and having read earlier posts:
There is no dispute that a meeting took place on the 29th of March in Holyrood, and that it involved at least Nicola Sturgeon and Geoff Aberdein.
Given there is no dispute that is why, for me, it appears in the list for the inquiry remit – it simply had to be included for consideration now that the meeting has been “remembered”.
However the FoI responses says that there is no Governmment record of such a meeting. Why not simply believe that?
Willing to be wrong on this, but rather than suspect a record of a meeting has been removed, my gut judgement because of the nature of the meeting and its subject matter/content – is that there never was a record made of the meeting. Makes it much easier to forget?
That is what both FoI responses appear to very firmly confirm, and it is what led to my earlier post:
7. MINISTERS’ CONSTITUENCY AND PARTY INTERESTS
General Principle
7.1 Facilities provided to Ministers at Government expense to enable them to carry out their official duties should not be used for party or constituency work.
Ironic it may be, it may prove important that the FoI responses eventually act as important evidence in relation to that very provision. What is or isn’t allowed and can constitute a breach of the Ministerial Code.
Time will tell.
Every day she remains at the helm she steers Scotland that bit further from where we should be. The day that the impenitent Sturgeon and her band of chancers are shorn of power and influence is the day we start to zone in on independence.
@Breeks or anybody
How do I put quotations into italics on here?
@Joe 10:13am
‘… keep the economy ticking over while sheltering the vulnerable (and pay for their expenses, …
Will I be allowed out to help Big Jock when he surrounds the British Embassy?
@ LeggyPeggy thanks for the link from Iain Lawson re the Fix is in.
Extremely organised, both in terms of policy, staffing and actions.
This is not a group of like minded people, coming together and bundling something together, refining it as they go along.
This is trained people, who know exactly what they are doing right from the start, why they are doing it, and have ensured they recruited others on the way.
Where is auld Peffers to show us the errors of our concerns, and tell us how democratic the SNP is now? I’m hoping he’s OK by the way.
@Ron Maclean
Only if you ensure a 2 meter social distance, wear a face mask, probably also a face visor, have a bottle of sanitizer and make sure you have the NHS tracking app.
If you do all that then im sure you can be permitted to be a rebel…
Sturgeon is a crook.
Sturgeon is a con merchant.
Sturgeon has no plans in the immediate future to push for Independence.
Sturgeon is comfortable with living under London Rule.
Her goody two shoes mask is slipping.
Underneath we see an English Patsy.
And this evil little bitch, with the help of her equally evil husband, were going to send an innocent man to prison for the rest of his life.
The only reason he dodged that particular bullet was because that particular jury found him not guilty.
And what about the GRA Hate Crime Bills?
Her silence on the UK Internal Market and indyRef2 is deafening.
Are you SNP members proud to point at that evil little bitch and say,,, that’s my leader, that’s who I will follow,,,I am going to stand by her, no matter what she does.
Or are you going to cancel your membership and say, I’ll return when the evil little fraudster resigns.
Tartan – The only complication with direct action is the Covid situation. Large crowds can be dispersed by the police.
However if the numbers were sufficient then the police would find it impossible to break up the protest.
This protest would need co-ordination. Thinking about transport and social distancing. One thing we don’t want to be accused of is putting peoples lives at risk.
But on the other hand , something must be done.
@Joe
As long as the expenses cover the sanitiser and the face masks.
OT I sometimes receive news about the price of Gold and Silver.
The following is from their news letter – and is obviously slated to encourage sales of Gold and silver….
‘Unemployment in the UK is at its highest since spring 2017 and is growing at the quickest rate since mid-2009 according to new data from the Office for National Statistics (ONS). Between June and August, unemployment jumped from 4.1% to 4.5%, and ING are now warning that unemployment could hit 10% by Christmas – the worst rate in 27 years.’
‘Deviation from the scientific expert advice given by SAGE – the Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies – has investors worried that the UK will be one of the last nations to end lockdown in the coming months, severely delaying economic recovery.
While the US election is only three weeks away, Brexit is the next issue likely to drive the gold price up. Prime Minister Boris Johnson has set a deadline of Thursday October 15th for the EU to get a satisfactory post-Brexit deal in place, else the UK will “walk away”.
Based on previous negotiations, confidence is in short supply and many believe that the UK will have the hardest Brexit come the new year. Fears of no-deal and the subsequent impact to trade have repeatedly led to a devaluation of the Pound over the past four years.
Global economic confidence is low, and the best recovery forecasts suggest three years of low GDP growth. A weak Pound alongside rising inflation and very low interest rates will rapidly devalue cash savings’
Please read this by Ian Lawson.
It’s quite shocking.
link to yoursforscotlandcom.wordpress.com
What I don’t like about this site is this, the subject matter is important yes, but everyone going over and over what has been going over and over for some time now is bloody ridiculous
If you do not have anything new to say that people do not already know, then what is the point of saying it
Good grief, I don’t even have a tv and I have known and been informed of all that’s been going on for a long time now
repeating info that we all know is not only boring its just like that bloody tv show that I only see when visiting someone with a television……….POINTLESS
holymacmoses says:
14 October, 2020 at 10:46 am
@Breeks or anybody
How do I put quotations into italics on here?
link to w3schools.com
Use HTML formatting in your text.
It’s difficult to explain, because the brackets and cues you need to explain things are picked up as formatting cues…
You open the fomatting with a set of open and close brackets containing the formatting, em for emphasis, then write the text you wish formatted, and at the end you need to close the formatting with a second set of open and close brackets but which includes a forward slash /
Hopefully the link explains better…
and its goodnight from him
Don’t forget to flush
and no reply will be given, so do not waste your time and mine
Regards Iain Lawson’s blog, I posted the lastest on Cunninghame North early morning.
Anyway seems Osama Saeed Bhutta isn’t happy about a branch emailing its members and telling them to vote for Kenny Gibson, he’s ‘suspended his campaign’.
(Just spotted his twitter name ‘OsamaSBhutta)
link to osamabhutta.scot
Abalha – The level of corruption in the SNP is being exposed everyday.
We were warned when the SNP membership exploded, that eventually corruption would set in. The SNP were supposed to be better than this!
This is all on Nicola and Murrell’s watch.
@Hatuey 11:39pm
I don’t have a specific number in mind but it would need to be truly exceptional. The trouble with these lockdowns is 1) there still is not any real evidence to say that it actually suppress the virus to the degree that its advocates say it does 2) There is no evidence to say that it actually saves lives, if a recent study by Edinburgh university is to be believed it may actually cost more lives in the long run from the virus (this is not considering collateral from lockdown this is just from deaths from the virus its self) 3) But If it does suppress the virus what is the point of a 2-3 week lockdown, surely it would just shoot back up as soon as it is lifted.
Of course this won’t just be a 2-3 week “circuit breaker”. Remember back in march when we were told that the lockdown would last a month tops to flatten the curve? No this will turn into 6 more months of harsh restrictions while we wait on the vaccine silver bullet. This is all being done for a virus that it is not particularly exceptional.
In reply to Big Jock at 1137
You are so right, It really is like ‘Carry On Political Party’.
Of course since 2014 when Nicola Sturgeon took over and she and Peter Murrell consolidated their power base they have run a coach and horses through due process, favouring those close to them and throwing others overboard.
I’ve never been a member but am an independence supporter and ended up working on the Yes Scotland media desk from March 2014. What I witnessed of both Peter Murrell and Nicola Sturgeon then, it was clear there was trouble ahead.
Others in the party saw it too but seem not to have bothered to challenge it at the time and now here we are.
Big Jock Says:
Nice idea, but they’re all working from home.
New poll for Ipsos Mori has Yes on 58% with don’t knows excluded
Also new voting intentions link to twitter.com
SNP on 58% on consituency, 47% on list
Breeks says:
14 October, 2020 at 11:25 am
holymacmoses says:
14 October, 2020 at 10:46 am
@Breeks or anybody
How do I put quotations into italics on here?
link to w3schools.com
Cheers Breeks.
I’ll give it a go
here goes
Hi Mike Fenwick at 10:45 am.
You typed,
“There is no dispute that a meeting took place on the 29th of March in Holyrood, and that it involved at least Nicola Sturgeon and Geoff Aberdein.”
Liz Lloyd, the First Minister’s chief of staff, was at the 29th March meeting, as reported at the link below in January 2019.
link to archive.is
I posted this yesterday, or the day before, as to what the MSM / British Establishment would be likely to do next.
There will be a flurry of polls showing support for Indy (and NS approval ratings) increasing (but never getting to or over the 60% mark – as this is an SNP line in the sand, and dismantles their argument ‘Scotland isn’t ready for another IR yet)..
Whats the chances eh?
next step is likely to be full covid lockdown – in order to ensure the committee cannot meet to view the disclosed documents AS will produce. Internet viewing is so much easier to interrupt.
The publishing of the documents will take another fortnight – and not be read by many, and the chances of NS staying in place until the 31/12/20 deadline are improved dramatically..
I see Joe is a bit upset I’ve no remorse and little compassion when it comes to taking on the radical right, and their want to support science denying and racist authoritarianism (see Brexit).
Theoretical Medicine and Bioethics, Vol. 39, Iss. 2, (Apr 2018): 165-169
Fredrik Svenaeus: Phenomenological bioethics: medical technologies, human suffering, and the meaning of being alive
link to search.proquest.com
You’ll have heard how a person in fear of drowning may push down upon the head of a nearby swimmer in their desperation to survive?
I believe I saw that kind of response from Nicola Sturgeon in her Sky interview, when she speculated that Alex Salmond was angry with her because she did not willingly collude with him to make those allegations by others of sexual misconduct go away.
It may be that a lie feels easier to tell if it bears some relation to the truth. In this case, was it that he is angry with her (and she perhaps even more angry with him?) because she DID willingly collude AGAINST him, with others, to PROMOTE those allegations?
Emotionally if not logically, those inverse facts may feel in her own mind like a valid equation.. somehow.. a ‘truth’.
Re the FoI request and its statement contra that of the remit statement by John Swinney, does anyone know what penalty may be incurred by a FoI respondent knowingly giving false (or incomplete and thereby misleading) information?
If this false statement was made at the direct behest of, or under pressure from, even someone high-up in Government or in some Party, nevertheless surely ‘I was just following orders’ cannot absolve them of personal responsibility and blame,
since FoI implies impartiality and a loyalty to truth before any misplaced personal loyalty.. i.e. any supposed obligation to ‘lie for the cause’.. ideally!
Wouldn’t it be convenient if Mr Aberdein had surreptitiously recorded the meeting on the 29th etc, the verbatim record to be released later?
It’s illegal, I gather, to audio-record or video people without their knowledge and consent.
But I believe a legitimate defence (accepted in law) of an otherwise-illegal act is that it was done only to prevent a greater crime from occurring.
Mr Aberdein’s serious consternation, evident in that he sought legal advice beforehand, suggests to me that he may have suspected dangerous, even dubious and dark, matters were afoot.. or about to be enacted.
Such devices are readily available and compact. Of course a mobile phone will serve. Just set it recording before entering the meeting, maybe giving your own preface stating reason and date/time/place.
Then ensure introductions/greetings by name/position (‘Hello, First Minister’ and bring date/time/place into the conversation naturally, for a definite record (‘Nicola, thanks for arranging this meeting, your offices at Holyrood are so handy’ etc.
groundhog day lol
Not been clever here but if Salmond and Sturgeon are both schooled in Law, then it could be argued, that the so called meetings never took place what took place was merely a curtesy arrangement, with no formal greetings established, making it a meeting, and further merely with advisors present, simply a legal set of minds grouped together to establish what was to be discussed and if it was acceptable to both parties and if so then a meeting and recordings to be established for clarity.
The meetings may simply be a gathering of mediators for two parties even if both parties are in attendance to give their consent to recording and making official a registered meeting, this may be why the FOI is quite rightly stating there is no recorded evidence of such meetings.
“The meetings may simply be a gathering of mediators for two parties even if both parties are in attendance to give their consent to recording and making official a registered meeting, this may be why the FOI is quite rightly stating there is no recorded evidence of such meetings.”
No. That’s not how the rules work.