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Wings Over Scotland


A matter of competence

Posted on October 25, 2016 by

Back in May we wrote this:

yoonpo

The prediction duly came true, as most of ours do. Sometimes we hate being right.

Because today in Parliament this happened:

The assertion of Lib Dem MSP Mike Rumbles that a second indyref bill legislated by Holyrood without first having been sanctioned by Westminster would be “universally recognised as being outwith the competence of this Scottish Parliament” is a flat-out lie. Legal opinions on the matter are widely differing, and the entire purpose of the 2012 Edinburgh Agreement was to avoid the prospect of the question being settled by the courts, because either way that would have opened a massive can of worms. The principle remains untested in law and both interpretations are legitimately arguable.

In May we also said that the then-policy of the Scottish Greens, namely not to vote for a second indyref unless it was backed by a million-signature petition, ensured that there wouldn’t be one anyway. But at their party conference last weekend the Greens abandoned that position and committed themselves to unconditional support in any such vote. The welcome U-turn, however, may be rendered entirely irrelevant.

Ken Macintosh’s reply to Rumbles was pretty non-committal, as might be expected. However, we can observe already that – exactly as we warned five months ago – one consequence of the SNP’s loss of their majority in May this year will be the Unionist parties exploring any avenues possible, however underhanded, to prevent the Scottish people from expressing their view on independence again in light of the dramatically changed circumstances that have arisen since the 23rd of June.

We can only hope that it won’t be a decisive one.

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    808 to “A matter of competence”

    1. Dan Huil says:

      Nissan the new British Leyland? Westminster backing DeLorean again?

    2. robertknight says:

      On the subject of posters….

      Spoof the Scotland In Union ‘broken record’ poster by simply replacing “scotland in union” with “scotland is useless”.

      No harm in clarifying what they actually mean, should their subtlety be missed on some of the electorate.

    3. Andrew McLean says:

      I see Glasgow labour have voted for privatisation of data and IT, I said during the week it was already a done deal, I said last month it was a done deal. The vote today was a formality. A rubber stamp on a back room deal that has been months in the making, Jesus they didn’t even hide the fact.
      If I was in unison I know where I would be inserting my membership card!

      Trebles all round as the eye won’t say!

    4. heedtracker says:

      What a difference a few UKOK months make.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36613296

      Leave supporters celebrate Sunderland win
      24 June 2016 Last updated at 04:00 BST
      The result in Sunderland was welcomed with loud cheers from the Leave camp, as the area voted decisively in their favour.”

      Now pay up for Nissan’s trade tariffs, Scottish region of greater England. We’re BetterTogether, Sturgeon’s evil, Scotland’s too small, stupid, poor etc.

    5. Stoker says:

      Proud Cybernat wrote:

      “There are still loads of dud stickies from the original batch the printers messed up if anyone would like some. They are difficult to peel but doable with good nails and a bit of patience. Just email: peepthebeeb [at] gmail [dot] com and we’ll get some out to you.”

      (Sigh) – I’m still waiting on mine bud, i sent you my details last week. I need that order to put one inside each copy of the Wee Black Book i’ve got earmarked for a targeted area.
      _____

      Dan Huil wrote:

      “Wonder where the bbc misreporting billboards are going to be situated?”

      Let’s hope the focus is within and around our 7 cities!

    6. heedtracker says:

      Libby Carrell news shock, Grauns says Scotland’s still a shit region, vote NO, vote SLab, forever.

      http://archive.is/bP7I8

      Scotland
      Scottish NHS failing to keep up with rising demand, says watchdog
      Nicola Sturgeon under fire after Audit Scotland says some health service boards may not be able to balance books next year

    7. Jack Murphy says:

      TODAY. First Minister’s Questions.
      Now Archived and available to view on
      Scottish Parliament TV.
      http://tinyurl.com/z439kja

    8. woosie says:

      Wondered when EBC would begin quoting the fishermen, the only industry in Scotland likely not to lose out in Engxit.

      What do these Scottish fishermen think will happen if EU nations can’t fish uk waters? They’ll all buy more boats and make a fortune? Of course not! Scottish waters will be teeming with shiny new engerlish boats, bought with the help of uk subsidies, the tax revenue from which will make Scotland’s “black hole” seem even worse.

      FFS, think 2 days ahead!

    9. Luigi says:

      Special, exclusive deals for Nissan and the finance sector in Europe, if truly on the table, could be highly problematic for May for a number of reasons:

      1. The EU may not agree (why should they?).
      2. If the EU does agree, the costs to the UK will be astronomical. The 250 billion that UKIP pretended we would save by leaving the EU will seem like a drop in the ocean by comparison with what is going to cost the UK.
      3. Once you start favouring one sector (or region) of the UK over others, that’s when the brown stuff really hits the fan. The screams for other deals will only get louder and louder.

      A real can of worms there. 🙂

    10. Dan Huil says:

      bbc misreporting Scotland billboards will be appreciated not just by most Yes supporters but by others who see the bbc as a wasteful organization spending millions on jolly jaunts for the likes of John Inverdale and Gary Lineker.

    11. Liz g says:

      Robert Peffers @ 3.20
      My bug bear with the whole narrative is twofold.

      ONE ,…..!!! What did Charlie do next.—-Well don’t take my word for it…go look it up!!!but not in British history.

      Two

      Personally….How can I believe any battlefield narrative that doesn’t include woman.
      Go to the Culloden Centre ….. learn about the battle….but try to find any reference to the Woman who were there???
      Then think about the fact that every battle had a support network of women.
      Why is this relevant here??? Well.
      How accurate is history???
      Would this resource be relevant to the outcome??

      But mainly……. LOOKOUT…if it doesn’t make sense to a 7yr old then it’s rubbish!

    12. Hamish100 says:

      Could an MP please ask the audit office to look into this smelly deal for the brexit voters. Surely if brexit is so good no help is needed?

      As for the audit office is there an EU equivalent? Couldn’t the EU just put a tariff on the apparent “bribe”. Taxpayers lose out again.

    13. mike cassidy says:

      OT

      Depressing – but directly related to the ‘alcohol price’ debate.

      http://archive.is/iMuNr

    14. orri says:

      That’s not a special deal for Nissan with the EU. That’s paying any additional tariffs imposed on them if we don’t pay in to the EU for access to the Single Market. The same way they’re going to pay for the City of London by the sounds of things.

      Mundell really needs to be asked if he knows fuck all about anything because he’s all over the shop their. He doesn’t rule out Scotland or anywhere else still being in the Single Market. What he says is that it won’t be the kind of deal that would require anything like Scotland becoming a semi-autonomous region thus allowing separate trade deals than the rUK. Obviously something that Westminster wants to avoid as it’d loosen our ties to them even further. So we might still remain in the Single Market if they can set it up as part and parcel of the UK’s deal rather than something we might be able to walk away with if we ever vote for independence.

    15. Les Wilson says:

      38 degrees ” Vote Scotland out of the Union” has been taken down.
      As i knew it would, the parliament one is still up,at 8000.

    16. CameronB Brodie says:

      Scottish NHS failing to keep up with rising demand, says watchdog
      Nicola Sturgeon under fire after Audit Scotland says some health service boards may not be able to balance books next year

      Does the Scottish Government determines it’s overall budget?

      “The right to development is an inalienable human right by virtue of which every human person and all peoples are entitled to participate in, contribute to, and enjoy economic, social, cultural and political development, in which all human rights and fundamental freedoms can be fully realized.” (Article 1.1, Declaration on the Right to Development)

      “The human right to development also implies the full realization of the right of peoples to self-determination, which includes, subject to the relevant provisions of both International Covenants on Human Rights, the exercise of their inalienable right to full sovereignty over all their natural wealth and resources.” (Article 1.2)

      http://www.un.org/en/events/righttodevelopment/pdf/rtd_at_a_glance.pdf

    17. Andrew McLean says:

      Funny on the twitter thing, you know funny to read, sad to post, apparently billboards are bad, who knew. Oh but only if they criticised the BBC, funny that?
      Oh and if you once worked for the BBC, then jumped to its defence, the fact this is pointed out as being somewhat a relevant fact, and perhaps you may be compromised in your objectivity is deemed to be vile?
      Oh and if you point the above and your sexual orientation is different then you are automatically a sexist pig?
      An so the argument descended, as Twitter is won’t to do, argumentum ad absurdum!

      In 2015 the Labour Party put up one poster, a week later it was gone. That was it,
      In 2016 the conservatives spent 16 Million,

      Remind me how that worked out?

    18. CameronB Brodie says:

      Sorry, I forgot I changed my mind half way through typing.

      Does the Scottish Government determine it’s overall budget?

    19. Andrew McLean says:

      Correction conservatives in 2015 he obviously

    20. Iain More says:

      woosie says:
      27 October, 2016 at 4:06 pm

      “Wondered when EBC would begin quoting the fishermen, the only industry in Scotland likely not to lose out in Engxit.”

      Well Engexit TV Aberdeen had the Yoon lickspittle Bertie on yesterday and allowed him to rabbit on about how wonderful Engexit will be and it is going to be the best thing since the discovery of fire. It isn’t just the EBC at it. So much for Fisheries supposedly being devolved. Well not in the Bertie parallel Yooniverse or that of the Yoon Press and Media.

    21. Dr Jim says:

      Ironic isn’t it that the folk who work for Nissan are mostly the folk who voted for Brexit which should have caused Nissan to leave so now Theresa May’s mob is going to use our money to bribe Nissan to stay thus keeping the Nissan workers in the jobs they almost voted themselves out of

      The Northern Irish will likely kick up such a huge fuss over Brexit that their threats will probably lead to NI getting a bespoke deal

      Wales will be massively poorer resulting from Brexit so they’ll need propping up to avert disaster

      London will definitely get everything going to keep the rich folk from risk of having to buy cheaper champagne and the financial district of course

      Which leads me on to Scotland, well we’re very good mannered so that goes against us for a start, we don’t threaten to blow things up so that’s all good for the UK
      We’re well used to being Fukced over so that’ll stand well for us, It’s likely we’ll just shrug our shoulders and say “Well what did we expect” so that’s OK
      Lastly Scotland’s got loadsa dosh to subsidise everybody else so the pooling and sharing’s not a new concept to us

      All in all, Yes, Scotland will suffer the most from Brexit
      so that’s a relief and a weight off my mind to know what’s coming as long as England and everybody else is A Fukcin OK

      Oh by the way Scottish fishing federation and the greedy Basirt lot of their fishermen Don’t count your Haddock before your Cod

      Scotlands long history of betrayal by itself continues it’s time honoured tradition, that and gutlessness in the face of the English coin
      I’m disgraced by my own countrymen (WOS folk excepted OC)

    22. orri says:

      The simple truth is that BPC was operating in his belief in the Divine Right of Kings which is why for him it was London or nothing. If he’d achieved that then the lot of in the UK including those in Scotland would have been far worse as he’d probably have reintroduced catholocism as the official religion. Any notion that the King of Scots rule by consent would have been out the window.

      His only merit is in reminding us that he did not have the full support of Scotland, never mind the UK. It was a civil war but it suits some elements of unionist thought to pretend it was a conquest of Scotland. As I’ve said before, it’s funny how we get fed tales of heroic failure. It seems that’s about all you’re allowed if you’re a scot.

    23. Tinto Chiel says:

      CameronB Brodie: most excellent. We could have a wee comp on here to substitute the terms.

      I’m the Petit Basque, but I’ve been called a lot worse.

      😛

    24. galamcennalath says:

      orri says:

      we might still remain in the Single Market if they can set it up as part and parcel of the UK’s deal …

      Little snippets are appearing which suggest we won’t be in the ESM. It is clear WM wants to opt out of the free movement of people aspect, but keep as much of the rest of the ESM as possible. I think this is the very thing the EU won’t entertain.

      If it were a genuine negotiation where each side wanted to give and take, then perhaps a bespoke arrangement would be possible. However, the EU seems clear that it want to ensure a UK outside the EU is worse off. I think the deal will be ESM in its entirety, take it or leave it. And that would include continued payments.

      So trade continues, movement continues, payments continue, and the UK get no say in the running of the EU. It becomes a second class player.

      I think WM will be forced to walk away from this to a hard/dirty Brexit to appease the far right.

      … rather than something we might be able to walk away with if we ever vote for independence.

      Which does leave us with something we too can walk away from, the UK!

      All will become clear in time. Waiting is painfully frustrating!

    25. orri says:

      IF the Spanish send fleets of fishing vessels to Scotland’s waters how much closer are ports in England or NI?
      Oil is ex-regio but is also in Scotland’s waters. Besides which what with increased Russian presence defence of the realm probably means we can safely be assigned our 12 mile limit as our own and Westminster takes control of the rest.

      Obviously if things do go seriously tits up security of energy, water and food will mean emergency measures take control of most of those out of the devolved administrations and back to Westminster as an interim measure.

    26. heedtracker says:

      Dr Jim says:
      27 October, 2016 at 4:30 pm
      Ironic isn’t it that the folk who work for Nissan are mostly the folk who voted for Brexit which should have caused Nissan to leave so now Theresa May’s mob is going to use our money to bribe Nissan to stay thus keeping the Nissan workers in the jobs they almost voted themselves out of

      Irony aint the half of the UKOK wonder of Leave England. BBC creeps wont be able to shut up every other Nissan sized big corp, all demanding the exact UK.gov pay their EU tarrifs too. Its going to cost UKOK tax payer as much as it does now in EU membership fees. But they got their country back and still own their Scotland region. Rejoice.

      Should be interesting watching all the liggers of the beeb trying to explain this away.

    27. CameronB Brodie says:

      🙂 🙂 🙂

    28. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      heedtracker says at 1:18 pm

      “differential” arrangements.

      You mean PREFERENTIAL ARRANGEMENTS.

      Scotland no doubt paying for this with our useless oil.

      Sunderland Nissan, London Bankers, NI Border….

      “Scotland will receive nothing, nada, zero, ziltch and the natives shall be thankful that the ‘Broad shoulders’ of this mighty Union are there to protect them in this their hour of need”

      So says His Eminence Fluffy Mundell Her Grand Britannic Majesties Governor General of North Britain.

      And some folk are moaning about whether billboards are a good idea !!!

      You couldn’t make it up.

      http://informscotland.com

      Get the message out.

    29. Proud Cybernat says:

      @ Stoker

      A batch of BBC MISREPORTING SCOTLAND stickies was sent out to you (and some others) yesterday by 2nd class post. If you don’t get them by next week, drop me an email.

    30. heedtracker says:

      Scott Arthur Retweeted
      Audit Scotland ?@AuditScotland 11h11 hours ago
      We’ve found that #Scotland’s #NHS is struggling to keep up with rising demand and cost pressures: http://buff.ly/2evBHsP #health #care

      Solution? Vote SLab. Oh christ.

    31. Stoker says:

      Proud Cybernat on 27 October, 2016 at 4:43 pm:

      AHhhh, music to my ears! Will do! I’m a happy chappy once again!
      🙂

    32. Andrew McLean says:

      Re Common Space opinion, re posters.

      Just for the record in my post, one of the few on here’ I criticised the opinion. But and I am not attacking the person who of her own volition claims her interests are “Politics. Feminism. Writes/rants,” However I do find it strange she then gets all funny if people disagree when she rants, May I suggest another occupation?

      Sycophancy and radical feminism and politics are strange bed fellows.

      But again she claims she only was on work experience with the BBC, still my assertion stands, at no time in her piece did she say, “you know I once was on a work placement” to validate her opinion. If she did It could have added weight to her argument, instead she chose to admit that, so it is indeed apposite that one questions her on her bias/prejudice whither overt or not.

      And another thing her not understanding that this omission calls into question her ideals of journalistic accuracy and objectivity, is fundamentally naive.

    33. frogesque says:

      I like the concept of the billboards but I do see a problem.

      The mockups and trials have a BBC logo on. This could open up organisers to legal action over copyright and trademark legislation. A way round it would be to substitute the raw logo with a picture of Pacific Quey and the monstrous glass box where the logo is prominently displayed. The billboard developers then own copyright etc. of the PHOTO.

      Might not stop a legal battle but should stop an injunction.

      Just a thought.

    34. Stoker says:

      Hi-de-Hi Campers!

      Now that we’ve helped to get the very important billboards project up and running to educate the masses can i ask all my fellow footsoldiers to get behind the ‘Going Postal’ campaign by ayeMail.

      The fund has reached roughly a 3rd of it’s intended target with just 7-days of the fundraiser remaining. Have a read at what ayeMail has achieved and what their ambitious intentions involve and chuck them a few quid if you can. Every penny appreciated!
      https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/going-postal–4#/

      Thanks to all who can help and to those not in a position to may your fortunes take a turn for the better quickly. Thank you!

    35. CameronB Brodie says:

      Perhaps this is what the Tories mean by a bespoke deal? Create “special economic zones”, which will further weaken national distinctiveness within Greater England. That’s a problem as everyone needs some differentiation in their lives, apparently.

      Another re-post from indy1, I’m afraid, highlighting one of the main contemporary challenges to national sovereignty.

      Offshoreness, globalization and sovereignty: A postmodern geo-political economy?

      http://alanhudson.info/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/offshoreness.pdf

    36. Orri says:

      The problem with the short pithy slogans you put on billboards is there’s little space to elaborate.

      Might I suggest a follow-up for the mis-reporting one along the lines of

      “Upholding the Union”

      The point is to cast reasonable doubt about it’s impartiality and of a constitutional bias which becomes official come the renewal of its charter.

    37. misteralz says:

      My Misreporting Scotland will be popping up around Deeside soon… 😀

      In other news, the BBC use Gill Sans as a typeface for pretty much everything. Eric Gill was, of course, a paedophile. I think Gill Sans is out of copyright now, and I’d like to see the BBC mount a case against somebody else using it.

    38. misteralz says:

      …and of course I mean my stickers will be popping up around Deeside soon. Sake.

    39. Robert Peffers says:

      @Socrates MacSporran says: 27 October, 2016 at 11:40 am:

      “I do not profess to be an expert on Scottish history, or on our relationship with England since 1707, but, I have my opinions. I have also been interested in the discussion on here between Robert Peffers and liz g; so, here is my twopenceworth.”

      As a towpenceworth, Socrates, it is rather good value for money, but here’s the rub. No matter how the parliamentary contingent want to play it – is neither here nor there.

      That is it is neither here nor there until the truth dawns upon the people of Scotland just how special they really legally are. The parliamentarians we elect are also, in their own right, just as special as the rest of the legally sovereign people of Scotland.

      They can only come into their fully empowered mode after a good majority of the rest of us realise the full extent of the legal powers we really do have. The whole thing depends upon the realisation of what being legally sovereign really means.

      It is not, as some seem to think, a meaningless phrase and perhaps the historic story of what sovereignty is might just get through to the hard to convince. So here goes :_

      There seems to be something in the human psyche that needs instinctively to believe in a superior intelligent to lead or protect them. This in spite of there being no evidence to indicate there is, or should be. In fact the reverse is the truth.

      Yet humans have always believed there is something other than random events that rules our lives. We also talk of good and bad luck but there really is no such thing either. So the belief in God has ruled our World since ever humans walked upon it.

      After we passed the stage of worshiping such as the Sun we settled upon a heavenly power but, to date, no one has yet found where this heaven might actually exist and is.

      So this need to believe in God has always been used by the more power hungry to wield power over the believers who, to be fair, were only too ready to grasp any of God’s Earthly representatives to tell them how to obey their particular God figure. History is full of prophets, Popes and such like religious leaders.

      Yet there has been more torture, bloodshed and death caused by the belief in Gods than ever there was for money or other signs of wealth. Even to the extent of followers of the same God from different sects going to war for their God against each other, (and no, I’m not getting off the subject.

      So now we come to Kings, Emperors and so on. These invariably either claim to actually be a God or to be God’s real Earthly representative. They also invariably attempt to, “convert”, everyone to follow the one true God.

      Things evolve and the various Kingdoms go to war with each other with the victors taking over the losers kingdom in the name of the God they represent and that brings us to, “Christendom”, and to Christ’s Earthly representative – The Pope. By this time the teaching is that Kings are chosen by their birth to have the God given right to rule. However by this time the Kings had become so powerful that they needed a system of command to run the now larger Kingdoms and feudal style law became the norm.

      The King would grant land to his underlings who would do his bidding. These in turn then granted land to their underlings who also granted lands – et al. There was a point where there was no further need to grant land to anyone and so we had serfs or, “villains”.

      a member of a class of partially free persons under the feudal system, who were serfs with respect to their lord but had the rights and privileges of freemen with respect to others.

      We see this more clearly in Scotland as the Clan system in the Highland north and the similar, “Large extended Family system of the Southern Uplands.

      In Scotland, things took a drastic turn when Scotland was left without their King when Alexander fell to his death in Fife. The eventual upshot was that Robert Bruce killed the Red Comyn and the English King egged on the Pope to excommunicate Bruce. Under, “Divine Right of Kings”, this meant, as the Monarch owned everything and everyone, the whole of Scotland was excommunicated.

      To get out of this dire situation the Scots came up with a brilliant plan with the Declaration of Arbroath and thus they changed the history of the entire British Isles. The declaration not only made Scotland legally an independent Kingdom but it made the people of Scotland sovereign and the King only their defender of the people’s sovereignty.

      So just what did that mean? As sovereignty was, “The God given right to rule”, that made all Kings the God’s chosen people to rule then the People of Scotland became, by law, “God’s chosen people”, to rule.

      In the Kingdom of England things took a different course. When the English parliament decided to take over from their King, a king who also wore the crown of Scotland, they feared the wrath of God as to depose he who was chosen by God to rule was to defy God’s will. They got round that little detail by forcing the Royals they chose to replace James II of England to agree to delegate their God Given royal powers to the Parliament of the Kingdom of England and thus made only that kingdom a Constitutional monarchy and as this was in 1688 Scotland was not part of that setup.

      So unless anyone can show when Scotland became part of a Constitutional monarchy then Scotland is NOT part of a constitutional monarchy. What is more, as Scotland’s people are legally sovereign. then collectively we are the equal of Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth of England.

      Now Westminster can prevaricate till their eyes fall out but the legal facts remain that the Treaty of Union made a United Kingdom – not a united country and the sovereign of the English Kingdom is the reigning monarch while the sovereign of the kingdom of Scotland is the people of Scotland. It is also plain that the United Kingdom only has two signatory kingdoms and that running it as if England were the United Kingdom that devolves English country’s powers to the other three countries is NOT a legal fact.

    40. CameronB Brodie says:

      Stoker
      I wasn’t sure about using “differentiation” but “boundaries” just made me remember VNoB. 🙂

    41. heedtracker says:

      CameronB Brodie says:
      27 October, 2016 at 5:08 pm
      Perhaps this is what the Tories mean by a bespoke deal? Create “special economic zones”, which will further weaken national distinctiveness within Greater England.

      They’re so mental, they’ll sell the Nissan deal round the big corp globe. “Come to the UK, where we pay your taxes!” Then they just chuck it all on the great UKOK deficit/debt mountain, where Scotland’s share gets piled on.

      And all the yoons of the Scotland region of greater England shriek, “how can you be an independent country with all this giant debt what you ran up, moochin off the English?!”

      Yours faithfully,

      #KevRage.

      Not a tory or a yoon, ever.

    42. robertknight says:

      We need to run off a bunch of these…

      http://s15.postimg.org/whzoqbm5n/scotlandisuseless.jpg

    43. CameronB Brodie says:

      Of course, it goes without saying that “offshoreness” is completely incompatible with the “Right to Development”. Funny that.

    44. Robert Graham says:

      Andrew McLean re common space posts , after reading a few comments regarding the proposed billboards , one being dont pick a fight with the BBC or the media , i thought oh f/k have i missed this media support was i out that day , others were too Early , waste of time and money ,I thought unless you contribute to the fund butt out myself included re timing and content. The article itself confused and confusing ,all over the place with opinion , The author an Indy supporter ! well after skimming through it i wasnt sure , It is quite a long piece that could have been cut by 75% and still got the point across , point being she didnt like billboards , ok hen we get it .

    45. Valerie says:

      On the Nissan deal.

      Sky mentioned something interesting. Folk are asking about the terms or type of help, because it may run counter to WTO regs.

      You can assist companies to defray their environmental impact, and Nissan got this. You can’t directly subsidise them, because it gives an unfair trade advantage.

      This is what folk don’t get about the EU, it ensures we play by rules to.give a level playing field, which means, in theory, it should drive up quality, innovation etc., as folk compete for that business.

      Knowing this government, and the shockingly low IQ prevalent, Mays team might be getting their arse kicked soon.

    46. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      heedtracker says at 5:26 pm

      Surely #KevRadge 🙂

    47. Alastair says:

      BBC Mis Reporting Scotland.
      Lets make up a cisis – dam the Auditor General’s report.

      Reevel Alderson on BBC Newsdrive at 16.08 repotinng on the Auditor Generals Report on the NHS Scotland –
      “….there’s another crisis, if I may use that word – I have to say the Auditor General does’nt”

      You couldn’t make it up. But BBC Radio Scotland can.

    48. galamcennalath says:

      Notice how the UK is England’s?

      In the petitions about Scotland’s future, the language is about throwing Scotland out of the UK. Clearly, in their mind’s it is within their power to say who is and isn’t part of their UK.

      When we have a vote about independence, it is implied we leave … that is leave the UK behind in the hands of England.

      Then there is the talk of losing Scotland. It isn’t anyone else’s to lose. It’s ours!

      It all just reinforces the South British notion that the UK is just an alternative brand name for England!

      Come Indy, there is no UK. That will be hard for some to accept.

    49. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      Valerie says at 5:47 pm

      RE: “assist companies to defray their environmental impact”

      Tata Steel made a killing on this, then when the environmental levys dried up they liquidated the steel plants in Scotland, Wales and England that they had milked the tax payers money out of.

    50. louis.b.argyll says:

      Audit Scotland funding report first up on red button bbc news.

      GMC REPORT on unease across UK NHS.. Hidden under Health, not under headlines, UK or England.

    51. mike cassidy says:

      Jockanese Wind Talker 5.51

      whereas opencast mining companies simply walk away and leave the costs to the taxpayer.

      http://archive.is/Bf3df

    52. Meg merrilees says:

      Listened to FMQ’s this afternoon.

      What a farce – Davidson, Dugdale, Rennie, Baillie and Sarwar all try to stick the knife in Scottish Government and the latest report on SNHS.

      Nicola impressively wiped the floor with them ALL.
      The fact is that the SNHS is improving but when our budget is controlled from Westminster ( usually means cuts) and the number of people needing treatment is constantly rising – owing to ageing population – then it is amazing that we are not worse year on year,or plateau -ing, but, in truth, IMPROVING! Credit where credit is due and a huge thank you to all those who keep our health service running SO WELL.

      Amazing – May’s ‘Brexit Specials’ so far: –

      Considering paying billions to keep the City in the Single market; formal invitation to Wales to join the negotiations; special solution for the Irish border; special deal/ bribe
      for the Sunderland Nissan factory at what cost?; special hot-line for devolved administrations to contact David Davies – took 36 hours to answer; SWEET NOTHING for Scotland – other than a sharp rap on the knuckles for ‘undermining’ the UK’s situation and Mundell’s mundane comments today.

      Read that the Heathrow deal is backed by a Chinese consortium, what next?

      HAPPY BIRTHDAY Rev! More power to your elbow!

    53. robertknight says:

      We need to do a run of these…

      http://tinypic.com/r/2qujbis/9

    54. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      mike cassidy says at 6:03 pm

      Aye, we all pay for it either up front or retrospectively.

      That’s the UKOK way.

      No doubt ex MPs on the Board of directors of these firms did pretty well though.

    55. gordoz says:

      Its not just the BBC that are a disgrace.

      Good old STV getting the Hatchet job done on our NHS and the Scot Gov as usual.

      Audit Scotland a bit overzealous in their reporting as usual and very clever wording used relating to impact. When was the last ‘good report’ from Audit Scotland every reported anywhere on anything?

      All painted very cleverly to reflect the worse case possible on our excellent NHS / SNP ScotGov.

    56. Legerwood says:

      Valerie @ 5.47 pm

      Nissan deal.

      Any compensation that has been promised to Nissan is unlikely to be paid until after the UK leaves the EU therefore it won’t be breaking EU rules since the UK, if it goes for hard Brexit, won’t be subject to those rules re compensation/subsidy.

      As I understand it the UK is likely to pay any tariffs slapped on Nissan products after the UK leaves the EU. In this way Nissan cars etc will cost the same as now and will not have to up their prices because of the carriers that will be imposed post Brexit. A sweet deal that other companies will want.

      Whether it breaks WTO rules is another matter.

    57. galamcennalath says:

      Firstly, a) it’s the Record, b) it’s Mundell. So perhaps not what it seems, but ….

      “Scottish Secretary David Mundell reveals Scotland will leave single market when Brexit hits

      THE Tory MP admits ‘hard Brexit’ is inevitable and that Scotland will be outside the single market when Britain leaves the European Union.”

      “Mundell has now made it clear that Brexit means a ‘hard Brexit’ for the whole of Britain and that we will all soon be on the outside of the single market looking in.”

      http://archive.is/TjroD

    58. Famous15 says:

      Sarah Smith says on 6 0 Clock News that the SNP record on NHSis important as people will lose confidence if they see its performance fall below that of England. Wait! Wait!

      Smith fails to end her input by confirming that tha Scottish performance IS better.

      Grrrrrrrrrr. Biased ,bastard BBC.

    59. gus1940 says:

      BBC 6pm News – disgracefully biased sensationalised report on Today’s alleged Scottish NHS disaster – in particular the contribution from Sarah Smith.

      Of course none of the unionist shower at Holyrood at FMQs or the media care to mention just where the money comes from for our NHS and who determines how much pocket money we get from our colonial masters.

      And we’ve still got Misreporting Scotland to come – guess what their lead story will be and the content of whatever cr-p they excrete over the viewers.

      It would be interesting to see how how The NHS in England performs comparatively on the points shouted from the rooftops today by our pals at Holyrood and in the media.

    60. galamcennalath says:

      http://archive.is/TjroD

      …. Nicola should ask for this signed, Vow style perhaps:)

    61. gus1940 says:

      Whatever the deal offered by Brexit Central Control to Nissan there is absolutely nothing to stop them upping sticks and moving to Europe leaving large empty sheds- all robots and other machinery are moveable.

    62. 10/30 says:

      Re SNHS, watched FM questions and BBC six news today. Result, another donation to informscotland.

    63. marydoll says:

      The EBC ‘news is on where I am ( I’m abroad on extended holiday).
      A perfectly edited package. showing Buffalo/Tank girl at her shouty best abou the SNHS BUT not showing her put-down. Then Sarah Smith saying that people will start undermining the SNHS becasue of all the cuts…….not that the EBC or Mis-reporting scotland are doing the undermining.

      Wake up people! Brexit is shown as smiley happy – economica;;y sound ( except it hasn’t happened yet). If everything in Scotalnd is baddddd- why are we all still here and haven’t moved to UK ( sorry England) yet

    64. Bob Mack says:

      Does anyone remember a BBC chief being interviewed and admitting the job of the BBC was to preserve the UK. I remember the chief of the civil service said something similar, but there was someone from the beeb.

    65. CameronB Brodie says:

      Apparently Mr. Mundell doesn’t respect human rights. Fascist?

      “The right to development is an inalienable human right by virtue of which every human person and all peoples are entitled to participate in, contribute to, and enjoy economic, social, cultural and political development, in which all human rights and fundamental freedoms can be fully realized.” (Article 1.1, Declaration on the Right to Development)

      “The human right to development also implies the full realization of the right of peoples to self-determination, which includes, subject to the relevant provisions of both International Covenants on Human Rights, the exercise of their inalienable right to full sovereignty over all their natural wealth and resources.” (Article 1.2)

      http://www.un.org/en/events/righttodevelopment/pdf/rtd_at_a_glance.pdf

    66. Tam Jardine says:

      Andrew McLean

      My issue, now that I have mulled it over, with the article is that it is essentially calling a group of supporters of Scottish Independence, some who have given time and money, others just money to get a project off the ground “counter productive” and implying they are stupid zealots.

      To try and take on the behemoth that is the BBC- the single biggest obstacle to our Independence movement is no mean feat. The billboard campaign doesn’t go far enough but it is a start. Hacking and infiltration are probably the only serious means to defeat the BBC but we are not that kind of movement.

      I will re-read the article again but I can’t remember any alternative suggestions so I guess the idea is we just thole the BBC and their active campaign against our cause.

      Indy is a broad church and there will be elements we all disapprove of or think are not worthwhile but I think you have to be mindful- we are all on the same side and making hard working resourceful indy campaigners feel like shit is not on.

      And as we preach so we must practice: I don’t agree with a lot of the stuff on Common Space or their methods (or Robin Macalpine’s glacial timetable for that matter) but they are on our side so lets leave them to their own thing and rise above it. See what I did there.

    67. Dan Huil says:

      Well, I think today’s bbc mis-reporting on Scotland’s NHS shows us just how much we need this billboard campaign. And more.

    68. One_Scot says:

      David Mundane, ‘People are ‘scunnered’ of debating independence’.

      Lol, what he really means is that he is scunnered having to defend a corrupt and damaging union.

      Don’t worry Davie boy, the pain will go away soon.

    69. Andrew Gordon says:

      O/T
      Just made the mistake of watching the beginning of Not Reporting Scotland this evening featuring today’s report on the NHS in Scotland.
      I also listened with interest to FMQs today at lunchtime on the same subject.
      To say that the BBC edited it to warp factor 9 SNP bad is the understatement of the year and the disgraceful politicking and language used by the pathetic opposition leaders was dreadful.
      Contrasting the true story of the NHS, BBC Radio Scotland Call Kaye show tried their best on the same subject in the hope the would elicit as many bad comments about the NHS in their phone in.
      This spectacularly failed as with the very odd exception every call praised the NHS for the staff and the treatment they received. It truly sickens me that the BBC and opposition MSPs continually denegrate and try to undermine this amazing service ,and for the individuals in the public who like to bash the NHS may I remind them it is FREE and undoubtedly one of the best in the world

    70. Valerie says:

      Given that all we hear is leaving the single market access, Nissan was concerned at 10% tariffs, which is the default WTO regs.

      This from BBC

      “29 September 2016 Last updated at 17:13 BST
      Nissan Renault boss Carlos Ghosn has told the BBC that its Sunderland plant would lose competitiveness if Brexit eventually means that the UK ends up trading with Europe under WTO rules.
      This is because this would effectively add 10% to the price of a UK-produced car sold in the EU, because of EU import tariffs.
      He told the BBC’s Theo Leggett that it could harm the future of Sunderland “without any doubt”, unless the firm found ways to compensate for the 10% rise.”

      I think as others have opined, there is a risk of a dirty, fast Brexit, with fall back to 10% WTO tariffs.

      Once Brexit talks start, and the EU outline, you take the 4 freedoms or nothing, then the Tories will just walk, saying fine, just unravel the charges, grants systems.

      They have no interest in cultivating relationships, or that would have been happening big time. When you own the Leave campaign, there is no space for decency.

      800 UK troops in Estonia, on permanent deployment.

      Makes me sick, not to mention the Labour abstention debacle on the Yemen vote last night. I genuinely hate being part of the UK.

    71. Robert Peffers says:

      @Liz g says: 27 October, 2016 at 4:12 pm:

      “My bug bear with the whole narrative is twofold.
      ONE ,…..!!! What did Charlie do next.—-Well don’t take my word for it…go look it up!!!but not in British history.”

      Try this very brief biographic note for size, Liz :-

      However, after the disastrous forty minute defeat at Culloden Moor, Charles was forced to spend the next five months as a hunted man. It is not completely clear how Charles spent these months, although it appears he disguised himself as a ‘Mr Sinclair’, a ship-wrecked merchant, and later on as a lady, ‘Betty Burke’.

      Eventually, Charles was rescued from Scotland by his brother, and shipped back to France who, although they were still not prepared to support Charles’ bid for the throne, agreed to protect him – if only to continue their feud with England.

      In 1748, the war between France and England ended and the English insisted the French exile Charles. He was forced to spend the rest of his life moving around Europe in a range of guises. He had a daughter, by his Mistress, Clementina Willeinshaw, in October 1753, but the relationship ended in 1760 – amid tales of jealousy and violence.

      By the age of 45, Charles had few supporters and was excluded from his father’s will. (Luckily his younger brother Henry, the main beneficiary, was honourable enough to give Charles all he deserved.)

      He married a nineteen-year-old bride in 1772 but, after another break down, forced her into a Convent. From 1783, ‘Bonnie Prince Charlie’ was ill and was nursed by his daughter until 1788, when he suffered and stroke and died on 31 January, aged 68.

      His legend continues despite it being based on only one year’s adventure in Scotland.

      “Personally….How can I believe any battlefield narrative that doesn’t include woman.
      Go to the Culloden Centre ….. learn about the battle….but try to find any reference to the Woman who were there???
      Then think about the fact that every battle had a support network of women.”

      Ah! Liz, you underestimate my research. The previous encounter near Prestonpans was actually fought upon land once farmed by my family. It was actually fought at Gladsmuir and was originally known as the Battle of Gladsmuir. Gladsmuir lies in East Lothian, on the Prestonpan’s borders with Tranent, Cockenzie and Port Seton. My Dad’s two elder brothers were born on that farm near Gladsmuir.

      So I did have a bit of prior knowledge to begin with. However I found out a very telling story about the Prestonpans aftermath.

      After the Battle Prince Charles Edward Stewart ordered his troops to not butcher the wounded nor to hunt down and kill the fleeing enemy. He ordered, and paid for, medics from the Edinburgh Royal Infirmary to care for both his own and the enemy wounded. The Royal Infirmary still retains the paperwork ordering those medics to attend.

      What happened to the women and children at Culloden one year later is also on record, (not at the Edinburgh Royal), but is usually glossed over. It is also why The Duke of Cumberland became known throughout Scotland as, “Butcher Cumberland”.

      In contrast to The Bonnie Prince at Gladsmuir, Cumberland expressly ordered his troops to hunt down and kill all living things across the Highlands of Scotland. The slaughter went on for weeks.

      Here’s a few wee references :-

      http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Battle_of_Culloden

      http://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryMagazine/DestinationsUK/The-Battle-of-Culloden/

      Note look at the picture in the above cite as it shows some of the women.

      The last one is perhaps the closest to the truth I could find in a hurry as the computer with my notes and records is out of order just now but this is quite in line with what I have found before :-
      http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/4/16/967571/-

      By the way there are a few thatched cottages on the battlefield today and I have, somewhere, photos and records that women and children had taken shelter in them during and after the battle. Only to be dragged out and slaughtered by the Orders of the Butcher Cumberland.

    72. CameronB Brodie says:

      Tam Jardine
      Tam, can I be a crawly bum-lick for a minute as you just put your finger on what has impressed me about your input. You come across as being a mindful person. That’s all.

      No offense meant to those who like crawling and licking…apart from yoon ones perhaps. That might still be considered a hate crime though, so not even yoon ones. 😉

    73. yesindyref2 says:

      STV news was OK on the SNHS – pointed out that there were problems with budgets, but every country that has a publicly funded health service has the same problem. I didn’t see BBC mis-reporting Scotland this time as we weren’t on the channel. STV also reported Mundell very nicely: “no region will get special treatment” 🙂

      Mundell, SOS for the regions.

      “I’ll send an S.O.S. to the plebs, I’ll send an S.O.S. to the plebs, I hope you get my message in a bottle, it’ll take 30 hours but that’s your lottle, yeehah”.

    74. yesindyref2 says:

      @Tam Jardine
      The billboard campaign doesn’t go far enough but it is a start.

      I’m not convinced it should go any further than just getting people to look at the BBC carefully, look for themselves, see if they think it’s biased, rather than pointing out examples. The website can do that, but I think the billboards should just be something to get attention, and get people thinking – and looking more carefully next time the “News” is on.

    75. Connor McEwen says:

      Rab. C. Peffers 5.17 could yi fit that intae a TWITTER COMMENT or at least one page as ma scroll is a bit sticky. Seriously ta SOVEREIGNTY AND CONTROL mmm

    76. yesindyref2 says:

      Maybe one-liners changing every so often, but questions like:

      “Did the BBC give you both sides of the argument?”

      “Was there a balance of biased commentators?”

      “Were both sides of the debate given equal time?”

      “Did the presenter present just one side themselves?”

      “Was the coverage unfairly edited?”

      “Did you see the question on TV, but not the answer?”

      “Were you told that other countries have the same problem?”

    77. Thepnr says:

      @CameronB Brodie

      You can count me in as a crawler and licker if it means we can count on the support of other groups in addition to the SNP that support Independence.

      Don’t be fooled folks, Westminster will do it’s utmost to divide true supporters of Independence.

      Are you failing to pick up the vibes that I am? The panic in the establishment, the desperation of them to divide us?

      We have but one goal and that is Independence. SNP will be the vehicle that drives us there. All Aboard! should be screamed from the rooftops.

      Don’t be deflected, who cares what colour a logo is. Independence is what we seek and I could’t care less how we get there.

      I only have my eyes on the prize. Don’t be deflected cos we are winning.

    78. Iain says:

      As I said earlier disreporting Scotland is delighting in the bad news about the Scottish Nhs. I have very recent experience of the Nhs in Scotland and all I can say that the treatment in the most modern hospital in Europe was first class. The staff from cleaners to consultants were kind and helpful.
      People’s experience will expose the bbc as liars and even more people will disbelieve them.

    79. Orri says:

      Might be wrong but don’t think there’s been much commemoration or remembrance of WW1 other than possibly a reference to Baldric. A fair amount on the run up to the Brexit vote mind.

      Perhaps they don’t want the constant remindervof just how badly our glorious leaders can fuck up.

    80. Dr Jim says:

      All this palaver over the SNHS fair takes your thoughts away from Englands Brexit explanations though eh

      It’s only £30 for a doctors appointment in Jersey !!Bargin!!
      TTIP for Engerland coming to a hospital near you…SOON

      I wonder if Ruth Davidson or Kez Dugdale will stand in front of posters of queues of English folk making their way to Scotland with their belongings under their arms come Brexit day
      Will they be expats or immigrants

      It’s a funny old party is the TORKIP and LABKIP party

    81. ronnie anderson says:

      Am totaley mortificated at the speachyoligie oan here ( crawly bum lick ect ect ) behave yoursels an act like the Vile Cybernats yous ur. Educated Informed an all roon Good Peoples.

    82. ronnie anderson says:

      Given the news reports on Nissan making 2 new car models in Sunderland, does the GEO of Nissan have a direct line on the Brexit negotiations , an I dont mean the hotline number that the Scottish Gov has.

    83. CameronB Brodie says:

      Thepnr
      I took you as such. 😉

      Seriously though, you might want to clarify what you meant by “Independence is what we seek and I could’t care less how we get there.”. Loose lips sink liberation movements and is surely in the prayers of every true Scottish English nationalist.

    84. Thepnr says:

      @CameronB Brodie

      The Independence movement IMO is winning this argument despite the heroics of the BBC and the media Barons.

      Support for Independence is not solely reserved for the SNP party and I’ve read polls that suggest a sizable number of SNP supporters son’t support Independence at all.

      Same is true for all groups and parties, some communists and some conservatives will support Independence and I am grateful for that additional support.

      That’s what I meant when I said I didn’t care where it came from. Communists and Conservatives are both welcome in my vision of an Independent Scotland.

    85. Tinto Chiel says:

      Thanks, Robert Peffers, for the links.

      Stuart McHardy, in Chapter Eight of “Scotland’s Future History”, mentions the little-known (one copy in Embra Castle) Cantonment Records of The British Army 1746-53 which record the extensive and sustained efforts to extirpate Jacobitism and Highland culture beyond the brutal repression after the battle.

      Lots of fascinating detail here, but consider this quotation (page 107): “The Jacobite army that existed in 1746 in fact contained more men from what we nowadays think of as the Lowlands, than Highland clansmen, but it was in the Highlands that the post-Culloden resistance continued.”

      But the Jacobites were all Gaelic-speaking Catholic savages, right?

      Question: home come there were Jacobites in the Lowlands and England?

      We need a documentary with Pantene Pro-V Boy looking moody in Glencoe: NOT!

    86. Conan the Librarian™ says:

      Only eighty signatures to go. I’m really looking forward to the Tory excuses for not having this debate…

      https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/132687

    87. CameronB Brodie says:

      Thepnr
      That as well but you of course meant non-violent means. Paranoid, me?

      Sorry, I should have been clearer in my previous post.

    88. Effijy says:

      With regard to the Audit “Scotland” Report on the NHS,
      I’m very suspicious of how we were a mile ahead of NHS England and NHS Wales, and NHS N.Ireland in the last A & E
      figures that I’d recently seen, and of how every couple of days a see another catastrophe revealed in NHS England, that we are now on the bring and short of £500,000,000.

      Fear ye not for Boris Johnson and Michael Gove and Liam Fox have assured you on the side of a large Bus that now they have Brexit, and extra £356,000,00 per week can be spent on the NHS!

      Hoorah! Scotland only needs a week and a half and we back to providing the best NHS in there here parts.

      Lying B******s one and all.

      I contributed to the Billboards Campaign, as I had asked for this for the last few years, and I’ll contribute again as Westminster Control all of the propaganda channels that promote Scotland and SNP bad on a daily basis.

      I put forward another Billboard campaign for South Lanarkshire where Labour are in control of the Council.

      Their incompetence and corruption can be judged by the less politically active, with excerpts from the links below.

      This link would enrage 99% of South Lanarkshire’s Council Tax payers.

      “£500,00 Golden Hand Shake for Incompetent Finance Leader, with another £63,000 Garden Leave payment on top”!

      http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/south-lanarkshire-councils-golden-goodbye-1209081

      https://www.sundaypost.com/news/scottish-news/councils-cut-ties-with-scandal-hit-scotia-aid-charity/

      http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/news/14464339.South_Lanarkshire_Council_boss_disciplined_over_taxi_contracts_awarded_to_his_nephew/

      https://www.commonspace.scot/tags/south-lanarkshire-council

      http://news.bbc.co.uk/panorama/hi/front_page/newsid_7990000/7990682.stm

      Highlights from the above link-
      “Panorama went to South Lanarkshire in Scotland where an online auction decided the council’s new care provider. Domiciliary Care won the auction which saw bidders bidding down, not up. It’s one of Scotland’s largest care providers looking after more than 1,500 people. While it won with a bid to provide care for £9.95 an hour, South Lanarkshire says the decision to award the contract was based only 40% on price with 60% based on quality of care.
      Andrew Wilson, 78, was one of the clients whose care went to Domiciliary Care (Scotland). Mr Wilson is hard of hearing, blind in one eye and unable to walk more than a few steps. With no close family he lives alone and depends on carers. He allowed Panorama to fit secret cameras in his home for 19 days.
      The cameras showed him receiving a bed bath with his carer constantly on the phone and revealed that of his four half-hour visits a day, the lunch and teatime visits were often curtailed. While his care assessment says his lunchtime carer should prepare and cook a meal, he was routinely fed on sandwiches, packets of quavers and toast.
      Domiciliary Care denied neglect, saying their carers were under no obligation to go shopping for Mr Wilson but routinely did so as there was often no food in the house.
      ‘Tragic and scandalous’

      Do you want to vote these people back into power????

    89. silver19 says:

      There maybe trouble ahead, Snackbeard is saying “Britain will leave the single market – Secretary for Scotland” :-
      http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-scotland-idUKKCN12R1XT

    90. Capella says:

      O/T There’s a massive build up of NATO troops and armour around the Russian borders. Did we vote for this? The NATO insignia in this RT video looks unfortunately swastika-like.

      “On Wednesday, UK Defence Secretary Michael Fallon struck a belligerent tone in the Wall Street Journal when he warned that Europe “is our continent” and, as such, would be defended.”

      Isn’t Russia in Europe? Doesn’t UK want out of Europe?

      While he claimed the force would be “defensive in nature” he pledged it would be “fully combat-capable.”

      http://on.rt.com/7t2v

    91. Thepnr says:

      @Conan the Librarian

      Hahaha, already above 10,000. No they won’t debate it and Tories don’t make excuses for their incompetence. Nothing new then.

      Want to piss a “Proud Scot But” off in Indyref2. Just vote YES!

    92. heedtracker says:

      No 10 denies ‘sweetheart deal’ with Nissan

      Downing Street acknowledges that PM has given assurances to car industry as Jeremy Corbyn raises concerns about possible inducements”

      Rancid’s latest Nissan jibberish headline. Its certainly stretching UKOK hackdom, all this no deal for Nissan but yes there is a deal for Nissan.

      C4 teatime news were all over the Nissan triumph for teamGB shop, as was everyone in Nissan what C4 spoke to. C4 are just BBC gimps with a different badge and made PM May look like wonderful and Great British, as she explained that the UK is open for business, but no mention of Brexit means etc blah blah bleh.

      Talk about kicking their problems down the road. Deal with it all tomorrow, that’s later, who know what’s going to happen later, its planet toryboy, how bad can it get…

    93. Liz g says:

      Robert Peffers @ 6.59
      Thanks for that Robert
      Sorry my original comment was all over the place…was multi tasking!
      It’s just that I had been back at Culloden a few weeks ago,and saw the new visitors centre for the first time.
      While it was fantastic, I did get some blank looks when I asked about the woman who had to have been there.
      Also they were a bit vague about what happened next with Charlie.
      Again I am dubious of the narrative that he gave up,certianly the Scot’s were of no more use to him.
      But I do remember seeing a video of an Edinburgh Uni professor who mentioned that Charlie had not given up and had funded 6 ships involved in the next Spanish attack on England.
      But haven’t been able to find the lecture again.
      Please don’t misunderstand me in that I think he was some kind of hero….. I absolutely do not.
      My interest is only in the distortion of our history.

      While that kind of information does not seem very important on a blog like this I do think that it helps to show that the version of history we as Scot’s are led to believe is deeply suspect .
      Therefore this …..300 year old successful union guff we are constantly being drip fed really needs lookin at.
      Especially since the BBC and their minions (him wi the hair) are still at it.

    94. Thepnr says:

      @CameronB Brodie

      Apologies for not being clear. Of course I meant non-violent means.

      My bad for assuming that my message was clear without having to state it explicitly.

      Lat me be clear on this though. I do not support violence in any way, in particular state sponsored violence. i.e War against innocents the like I have witnessed in the last few decades.

      Please let me know if my response has been clear enough for you.

    95. CameronB Brodie says:

      Thepnr
      Mmmmmm, maybe. 😉

      I know your outlook but we have teams of yoon and British state goons looking for anything they can twist a miracle out of. No slur intended mate and thanks.

    96. frogesque says:

      @thepnr 8.18

      Ayes, we need be careful and absolutely explicit in our meanings.

      Remember the awful slur about ‘the Ulsterisation of Scottish politics’. We must give the Unionists absolutely no ammunition however innocently words are said.

      They are watching and waiting for the smallest slip.

    97. Conan the Librarian™ says:

      @ Thepnr

      I first got into this when I got an email from 38 Degrees yesterday. I duly signed, and when I went back it had been pulled.

      After it had got to 8,000…

      I think this one is worth a shot, if only to watch them tying themselves in knots about it.

    98. Effijy says:

      My last 3 posts seem to have all been lost?

      Do not worry about Audit Scotland’s questionable report.
      They claim we are £500 Million short but we all got a guarantee on the side of a Bus Fleet that Boris Johnson, Michael Gove, Liam Fox and all are going to give that extra £356 Million per week that we give to the EU, back to the NHS

      All Scotland needs is the money for the first 10 days of the year and we are back to being number one again.

    99. K1 says:

      Always appreciate your archiving and posting of FMQ’s Jack Murphy…thank you 🙂

    100. call me dave says:

      Kiss and tell!

      No 10 denies ‘sweetheart deal’ with Nissan

      https://archive.is/iZYV9

      Nissan decision to stay in Sunderland averts ‘catastrophic’ consequences

      https://archive.is/AdmsJ

    101. louis.b.argyll says:

      So..following independence..The ‘UK’ can call itself one of the following;
      England.
      Greater England.
      England and Northern Ireland.
      New Britain.
      South Britain and Northern Ireland. (My favourite.)
      Little Britain.
      Sorry Wales, you blew it, good luck.

    102. Thepnr says:

      @louis.b.argyll

      Following Independence I doubt many will care.

    103. Breastplate says:

      Aw, c’mon Thepnr, every No voter deserves a good boot up the arse.
      Or am I wrong? 🙂

    104. Thepnr says:

      @Breastplate

      I’m not sure what your referring to but a boot up the arse, a kick in the balls, a head on the nose isn’t what I was talking about.

      What were you talking about?

    105. louis.b.argyll says:

      Noticed on the Russian’s list of WHO THEY’D NUKE.. Did not include Denmark.

      Denmark is a non-nuclear but FULL NATO member..

    106. louis.b.argyll says:

      Thepnr, maybe it is a moot point, even flippant but the future will arrive and England will change its name

      We need to scare our abusive partner with threats of returning to SINGLE STATUS.

    107. Big Jock says:

      Bonnie Prince Charlie was a power hungry individual. He was only interested in the British crown not liberating Scotland. His end game was to be king of a united jacobite Britain.

      The brave misguided highlanders thought they were fighting to liberate Scotland. Many wanted to stop at the border as they believed their job was done. Had Charlie been honourable he would have declared Scotland as his Kingdom and reinstated the parliament. The English would have been unlikely to invade Scotland for a few years at least.

      By that time Scotland would have been re established. Charlie was one of Scotland’s greatest ("Tractor" - Ed)s. He conned the Scots into supporting him but he was a Brit like most of the Lords and Lairds of the time.

    108. Thepnr says:

      Yes got 45% last time. Not bad, but doesn’t win any prizes. Neither does booting No voters up the arse just because they voted No.

      Maybe, maybe one day ALL Independence supporters will support everyone that supports Independence. Maybe one day we will embrace our neighbour/colleague/brother/sister/father/mother/granny/granda that voted No and persuade them that Scotland should be Independent.

      That’s my wish anyway.

    109. sandycraig says:

      Robert Peffers I love a history lesson.

      When I went to school we never got any Scottish history. It was all corn laws and Lancashire mills. I was in my teens before I realized we had hundreds of mills in Scotland, and most of my education in our own history I found out for myself from various books. Thankfully I learnt my children to take an interest and am happy to say they will not let the wool be pulled over their eyes.

      The book “Culloden” by John Prebble gives a great account pre and during the battle as well as what happened in the aftermath. Make you weep at the barbarity of it all.

      I would also like to predict that Fluffer Macmuddle Bumbler will go down in history as the absolute biggest ersewipe in the history of politics. How that creepy shit sleeps at night buggered if I know.

    110. manandboy says:

      FWIW

      The UK, the EU, the US, the Middle East, Russia.

      The UK Government, the Tories, Labour.

      The markets, currency, Sterling.

      They all have one thing in common; one thing they all seek,
      but are not even close to it.

      Stability.

      We’d better get used to instability and uncertainty and to all the effects therefrom . For confusion and turmoil is the present and the foreseeable future, though we would prefer the past – because we think of the past as stable. But the past is now gone and the quicker we adapt to the new instability, the sooner stability again becomes possible.

      For Scotland the present uncertainty and instability creates the opportunity for choice. Either we create our own stability in Scotland under our own direction and control, or we continue with the uncertainty of colonial rule and the turmoil of an exploited life.

      Aye, Scotland – your choice. Rise up, and choose well.

    111. CameronB Brodie says:

      Hope it doesn’t appear self-engrossed if I correct myself from earlier. Thinking it over, there are of course women, even feminists, who won’t be open to the Methodology of the Oppressed.

      How to get them to even consider Scotland’s potential.

      I’d check first to see if they were willing to embrace difference, then make sure they are not using their master’s tools to interpret the world (i.e. Whitehall’s perspective). If all good, look how to activate their equality gene. Next step, FREEDOM! 😉

    112. Bill McLean says:

      Big Jock – Charles Edward Stewart was a 25 year old lad who believed he could recover the throne for his father and believed correctly that his family were the legitimate monarchs of the UK. I’m no royalist and never have been but like Robert fascinated by history. I’ve read many books about the Jacobites and some of the versions vary so much that someone has to be misinterpreting history deliberately. Remember CES was Catholic so immediately suspect! The book Sandycraig mentions John Prebble’s “Culloden” is a real eye opener for the uninitiated and those who have been fed British propaganda and bigotry for three hundred years!

    113. Proud Cybernat says:

      @ Thepnr

      “That’s what I meant when I said I didn’t care where it came from. Communists and Conservatives are both welcome in my vision of an Independent Scotland.”

      Well said that man!

    114. Fred says:

      “The Private Passions of Bonnie Prince Charlie” by Hugh Douglas, portrays him as a psycho & a serial batterer of women. The French had the right of it in dealing with Royalty, sadly it never crossed the Channel.

    115. Big Jock says:

      Yeh Bill I get that. Yes history can be interpreted in different ways.

      However what we do know as historical fact. Is that Charlie wanted the British crown. Anyone who wants that crown is unlikely to want an independent Scotland. Essentially we would have been replacing a protestant Brit for a Catholic Brit.

      The Royals in Scotland softened the ground for a political Union by moving south when they unified the crowns. Those Royals were his Stuarts. So he was likely a unionist like his ancestors.

    116. Meindevon says:

      If Ruth and Kezia think NHSScotland is bad they want to come down here. There was man in the papers this week in Devon cut his own gangrenous toes off with pliers after his operation to cut his leg off was cancelled..even worse, months later his leg and foot are fine! (in the scheme of things!)

      On another horrible note, a personal Greek friend who is moving away to the South East ( why?) thought she had found rented accommodation for her and her lovely family when suddenly the owner said no sorry, it’s nothing personal. She pressed for a reason but she wouldn’t say. When she asked if it was because she was Greek/foreign she did not deny it but said it wasn’t personal! I was so ashamed of these people I live amongst and found myself apologising for their disgusting attitudes.

      On the bright side, her husband is a surgeon and I said they should go to Scotland, they will be made most welcome!

    117. The most obvious example of BBC bias passes almost unremarked.

      When an SNP spokesperson (representing about half the voters in Scotland)contributes to the news a Tory, a Labour and a Lib Dem spokesperson are then allowed to respond to the SNP point.
      This is unacceptably unbalanced. Either you should get one response to the SNP point or the SNP spokesperson should be allowed to respond to all three unionist points.

      In particular the Libdems with a lower vote than the Greens are given equal status which is nonsense. When the SNP was at 6% in the polls it was’t on the news at all.

    118. Robert Peffers says:

      @Liz g says: 27 October, 2016 at 8:12 pm:

      “Sorry my original comment was all over the place…was multi tasking!”

      Oh! I know that feeling very well.
      ;-))

      “It’s just that I had been back at Culloden a few weeks ago,and saw the new visitors centre for the first time.
      While it was fantastic, I did get some blank looks when I asked about the woman who had to have been there.”

      Aye! And I know that feeling very well too!

      Also they were a bit vague about what happened next with Charlie.
      Again I am dubious of the narrative that he gave up,certianly the Scot’s were of no more use to him.

      But I do remember seeing a video of an Edinburgh Uni professor who mentioned that Charlie had not given up and had funded 6 ships involved in the next Spanish attack on England.

      “My interest is only in the distortion of our history.
      While that kind of information does not seem very important on a blog like this I do think that it helps to show that the version of history we as Scot’s are led to believe is deeply suspect.”

      Obviously I believe that the history of how the whole thing unfolded and is still unfolding is the key to a return to Scottish independence. To put that into perspective I had a particularly good schooling in Scottish history. I was very lucky that two of my teachers, a brother and sister, were the most outstanding teachers I ever met. One at primary and one at secondary.

      However, my real interest in the subject came from my interest in Scottish independence way back in the mid 1940s. I was a great bookworm and would trawl round the many second-hand book shops in Edinburgh old town at that time. On a good day I would go to Greyfrier’s Churchyard, a haven of peace in the city, and read my purchases. Over a time I had shared a bench with an old gentleman who also always had his nose in a book. He eventually opened up a conversation by remarking about my love of books and we became great friends.

      It turned out he was a well known KC, (The queen was still a princess back then), and like myself a staunch Nationalist. He it was who first set me off on the history of the relationships between the two Kingdoms and how it was actually a bit illegal even back then just after WWII.

      There is absolutely no doubt that the Union was forced upon Scotland by the English Kingdom and the greed and weakness of the then wealthy Scottish Land owners who were also the parliamentarians of those days.

      Both William Patterson and Daniel Defoe were English undercover agents. Patterson being a London Scot and Defoe was released from serving a prison term by the English Spymaster, Sir Robert Harley.

      Defoe had the ear of the Scottish Parliamentarians and he was sending letters back to Harley in London. Those letters are still in the English archives and some have been published.

      The whole thing was a setup and to add to the mix the English Troops were massed at the Scottish Border and an English fleet lying off the Firth of Forth.

      So let me put it this way – if Scotland was the basket case economy the English claimed it to be – Why did they want it in the first place? Here’s a clue for you. Patterson, who is credited with starting the Bank of England to bail out the English Crown is the same person who set up the Darien Expedition and at the start of the Union the English national debt was massive while that of Scotland was NIL.

      The real financial troubled people in Scotland was not the nation but the wealthy landowners and remember that in 1706/7 Scotland was a mainly agricultural economy and there had been five years of poor harvests, including what was termed, “The Year o the Short Corn”.

      BTW: If you want to read the story, “The year o the Short Corn”, (and other stories), for free then go to this site and you can register for free.

      http://booksread.virtual-ip.org/books/l52408550/the-year-of-the-short-corn-and/

    119. heedtracker says:

      The most obvious example of BBC bias passes almost unremarked.

      When an SNP spokesperson (representing about half the voters in Scotland)contributes to the news a Tory, a Labour and a Lib Dem spokesperson are then allowed to respond to the SNP point.”

      BBC style usual have the whole torylibSlab shebang pile on, then BBC Scotland gimp answers for whoever SNP it is. That’s what they do in BBC r4 but that crew are really horrendous tories.

      Another day at the UKOK tory lie machine, Nissan’s not getting their new car sales tariff paid for, its all government “support and assurances”.

      The Scots get a Brexit phone number to a toryboy. The Japanese get UKOK cash showered on them. Welcome to teamGB Japan.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37787890

    120. Big Jock says:

      Yes the Union was a political confidence trick. But in those days the parliament was run by unelected gentry. Scotland never signed itself awaway. Some greedy men with land and titles did it.

      We have had to live with the consequences for 300 years. The Scotland we have today is a miracle of survival. Despite 300 years of propaganda and assimilation. The Scottish identity and culture persists.

      It persists because of people like us and I say that as a 3Rd generation Irish immigrant. We will not let Scotland die. We have our homeland in our souls whatever the Brits chuck at us. What we feel is what we are and it can’t be smothered by colonial imperialism and suppression.

    121. Liz g says:

      Robert Peffers @ 10.10
      Thanks for the link Robert… your a star.
      Any tips on how to work out when it’s not obvious if your reading Scottish or British history?

    122. Robert Peffers says:

      @louis.b.argyll says: 27 October, 2016 at 8:39 pm:

      So..following independence..The ‘UK’ can call itself one of the following;

      Nope! They need not change anything, Louis.b

      The other partner Kingdom that signed the bipartite Treaty of Union that formed the United Kingdom was called the Kingdom of England and it had contained the Country of Wales since 1284 and, “The Statute Of Rhuddlan. It also contained the Kingdom of All Ireland, since 1542 but it then lost the Republic of Ireland when Ireland partitioned.

      Mind you they changed the full Title of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland to The United Kingdom of Great Britain & Northern Ireland in 1800/1.

      Now, when any bipartite union splits up, both partners legally revert to the Status Quo Ante and that will be for them, “The Kingdom of England”.

      What it will NOT be is, “The United Kingdom for there will then only be one Kingdom in it – England.

    123. Breastplate says:

      Thepnr, don’t overdose on the serious pills ffs.
      It’s a punchline from a Billy Connolly joke that you are well old enough to remember.

    124. Proud Cybernat says:

      “When an SNP spokesperson (representing about half the voters in Scotland)contributes to the news a Tory, a Labour and a Lib Dem spokesperson are then allowed to respond to the SNP point.”

      You mean like this:

      http://imgur.com/EXl04Mv

      Aye–we notice and this is just another example of the imbalance of ‘reporting’ we see every day being pumped across the scairwaves every day by the BBC in Scotgland.

      A BBC constitutional discussion where ONE SNP MSP representing 50% of the country is met by THREE unionists representing the other 50% of the country.

      Aye–balance and fairness BBC in Scotland style. Why not a Green + SNP v a Tory + Labour? Eh BBC? Can you effing answer that question you balloons?

      Aye–we notice aright and that is precisely why we, the people, are no longer accepting this utter pish from you.

    125. CameronB Brodie says:

      Robert Peffers
      You missed a sitter there Robert.

      “What it will NOT be is, “The United Kingdom for there will then only be one Kingdom in it – England, innit.”

      Perhaps I’ll get my coat.

    126. Rock says:

      “” … If parliament is unable to deliver, there is absolutely nothing that the people will be able to do “within the law” as it currently stands.”

      That is utter rubbish, Rock. First of all the people are already doing more than just, “something”. Have they not elected a series of independence supporting MPs to Westminster? There could not be a more legal way of expressing the people of Scotland’s sovereign wishes to Westminster than that.”

      You are indirectly admitting that the people of Scotland have near zero “sovereignty”.

      They can do nothing more than elect MPs in an undemocratic system.

      Those MPs are outnumbered 10 to 1 in Westminster and cannot get a single thing approved in favour of Scotland.

      Are you suggesting that the 56 SNP MPs have the legal right to come back and declare UDI on behalf of the “sovereign” people of Scotland who elected them?

    127. Ann says:

      My niece has been in hospital for the last five weeks. She has been treated with some top class medical implements and first class care with dedicated doctors and nurses 24 hours a day.

      Therefore I am sick to the back teeth listening to all the constant negativity.

      Yes the Scottish NHS may be struggling, but we cannot fault the dedication of these people.

      So rather than stand up at First Ministers Questions, how about for a change the opposition sit around the table with the elected government and do a brainstorming session and try to solve these problems and stop insulting and demeaning the NHS service.

      Nah! That would be asking too much.

      All I can say is God help us if any of the opposition parties ever get elected, because I have a feeling that the SNHS will end up like the NHS in England and Wales. Services sold off bit by bit to the highest bidders with our Hospital Trusts being unable to counter bid them as they don’t have big cash reserves like multi nationals like BUPA.

    128. David says:

      Proud Cybernat says:
      27 October, 2016 at 4:43 pm

      A batch of BBC MISREPORTING SCOTLAND stickies was sent out to you (and some others) yesterday by 2nd class post. If you don’t get them by next week, drop me an email.

      I got mine thanks and well I was in the royal mail sorting office and this young lady came in and got the invisible treatment so I said to her you don’t look invisible to me and got a lovely smile.

      So I said are you a YES voter and she said yes of course I am so the hand went into my pocket and out came about 20 or more Misreporting Scotland stickers WOW she said thanks and I got an even bigger smile, gosh it is nice to be nice.

      many thanks

      David

    129. Tam Jardine says:

      CameronB Brodie 6.59pm

      Thanks Cameron. I was absolutely raging yesterday after reading that Common Space article so I brung some of that thunder last night. Good to reflect and assess again.

      By the way- I am enjoying your persistence with the UN right to development. It is essential to get that hard wired into our shared philosophy.

      Robert Peffers 3.20pm

      Thanks for your response on Bonnie Prince Charlie and Culloden Robert- I found your post (now on the “older” thread) absolutely fascinating, in particular your dismantling of the “Union of Crowns”.

      I also enjoyed your links above- the heat mat of Scotland form space is quite an eye opener and I would be interested in locating a map comparison between the early 17th C Scotland and the empty land is it is now.

      Too much to go through now- salut Robert (and apologies for exposing you to the piece in the Express)

    130. K1 says:

      Having just watched FMQ’s ah huv tae say whit a fuckin’ disgrace that Sarwar is…’an emergency question’ no less…grandstanding bullshit as per from him. It wasn’t even a point of order! As Ann says above I hope we never have to endure these idiots ever getting close to power in Scotland.

      Slab’s never getting resuscitated in Scotland and the life support is gonnae get switched aff on the Tories soon enough when people wake up to the reality of their hard boiled English brexit!

    131. Liz g says:

      Rock @ 10.40
      I can’t say what Robert is suggesting.

      But I am stating that The Scottish MP’s have the legal rights to leave Westminster taking our Soverenty with them.

      Only point is..that’s NOT… UDI .

      It’s dissolving the Treaty of the Union.

      We would only ever need a UDI if our MP’s were not willing to follow our instructions

      Don’t believe me then go find out what Mrs Thatcher had to say about it.

    132. louis.b.argyll says:

      Dave M.H…Meindevon says. at 9:59 pm
      If Ruth and Kezia think NHSScotland is bad they want to come down here. There was man in the papers this week in Devon cut his own gangrenous toes off with pliers after his operation to cut his leg off was cancelled.
      AND THERE WAS NO MEDIA BLAMING ‘THE CONSERVATIVES’ PER SE.. UNLIKE HERE..WHERE..

    133. Thepnr says:

      @Breastplate

      Sorry, the state we’re in has wound me up a bit. No offence meant.

    134. CameronB Brodie says:

      Tam Jardine
      Cheers. I would write something for the Rev. but I think folk can follow the UN links themselves.

      http://www.un.org/en/events/righttodevelopment/pdf/rtd_at_a_glance.pdf

      http://www.ohchr.org/EN/Issues/Development/Pages/Backgroundrtd.aspx

      http://www.ohchr.org/EN/Issues/Development/Pages/DevelopmentIndex.aspx

      http://www.un.org/documents/ga/res/41/a41r128.htm

      http://www.ohchr.org/Documents/Publications/RightDevelopmentInteractive_EN.pdf

      That sort of thing might then lead folk to look for R2D links themselves. There’s bings of them from different perspective no less.

      Britain is a criminal enterprise, I’d prefer to live under the rule-of-law.

    135. heedtracker says:

      Late night fun with the yoons.

      Kevin Hague Retweeted
      Tom Gordon ?@HTScotPol 47m47 minutes ago
      Winner of Best Scot at Westminster award: David Mundell MP for steering Scotland Bill through Commons #politicianawards2016

      BBC Newsnight one long party political broadcast on behalf of the Conservative party, Nissan deal a show of British brilliance and genius and shows teamGB to be “more a global trader and less an EU one.” All delivered by ex Graun Ligger, who cant seem to stop smirking, unless Kirsty Wark was tickling him. That Graun ligger is an appalling tory hack though. So much for centre left and progressive liberal Graun. What a bunch of con arteests! but

      Vote Tory, their great.

    136. heedtracker says:

      Good old not a tory or a yoon Kevrage. No one’s giving his economics of doom and disaster a go, so here he comes, claws out.

      Everyone who cares know that toryboy yoons like our Kevrage just want to close down Holyrood and throw Alex Salmond in to Leith docks. Democracy’s a bitch for hard core toryboys. Anyhoo,

      http://archive.is/zf6OC

    137. CameronB Brodie says:

      Tam Jardine
      I posted to say cheers back but it had a good few links and might not appear, so cheers.

    138. Phronesis says:

      How vexing at FMQ –the ‘scandal’ of SNHS. What will this current SG pass onto the next generation in terms of its health legacy ‘genomic health’ as the SNHS buildings crumble, agency staff are used because health boards can’t commit funds for staff long term because of cuts.

      What can we do about the aging demographic, increasing demand, health inequalities, the complexity of multimorbidity-all global health challenges. Should we try to work constructively with SG, strive to continuously engage with the public, keep the SNHS nationalised, critically appraise the situation with NHS England and compare this with the stance of SG?

      NHS England’s privatisation programme has been evolving for 3 decades under the stewardship of incumbent WM governments and supported by legislation that has hastened the piecemeal selling off of a national asset. Did the electorate in England know this- could that be a scandal?

      ‘A major Pulse investigation has revealed that private companies are boosting their profits by up to 100% as the health service struggles to cope…

      They say they are gaining from the plight of the NHS, with patients more likely to pay for their care to avoid lengthening NHS waiting lists, which have led to 3.7 million NHS patients wait for treatment – the most since December 2007.

      The investigation – the most comprehensive since the introduction of the Health and Social Care in 2012 – also shows that local commissioners are paying hundreds of millions to private hospitals and that hospitals have also boosted their income from private work.

      BMA council member and former RCGP chair Professor Clare Gerada, who led much of the GP opposition to the 2012 reforms, says: ‘I am afraid that we are sleepwalking into US health system.’

      http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/news/commissioning-news/private-companies-see-profits-double-while-nhs-waiting-lists-increase/20033105.article

      ‘No extra cash,’ was reportedly the message from Prime Minister Theresa May to the NHS at a recent private meeting.

      It seems the Conservative austerity programme will continue, despite lengthening waiting lists, greater rationing and mounting concern over how the NHS will get through the winter.

      In contrast, a special investigation by Pulse shows private healthcare in the UK is buoyant’

      http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/home/private-sector-profits-as-nhs-crumbles/20033114.article

    139. Capella says:

      BTW – I skim read the Audit Scotland SNHS Report and couldn’t see anything in it to justify the media frenzy today. Comments stated that demand is rising, savings have to be made, transition to community based health care was slow etc etc. Maybe I’m missing something. Or could it be that the Unionists leaders and media are raising another false alarm?

      No mention of free prescriptions and record responses in A&E, of course.

      I can remember when much of health care WAS community based with local maternity hospitals and free dentistry. First the Blue Tories, then the Red Tories, destroyed that system with their “internal markets”, privatised services, top heavy management structures and new GP contracts guaranteeing 6 figure salaries. Now they have the nerve to complain about the system they themselves created.

      Fortunately, most of us are still compos mentis and know the real value of our SNHS.

      http://www.audit-scotland.gov.uk/report/nhs-in-scotland-2016

    140. manandboy says:

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/war-by-media-and-the-triumph-of-propaganda

      “The times we live in are so dangerous and so distorted in public perception that propaganda is no longer, as Edward Bernays called it, an “invisible government”. It is the government. It rules directly without fear of contradiction and its principal aim is the conquest of us: our sense of the world, our ability to separate truth from lies.”

    141. carjamtic says:

      Thepnr

      Your wish is also my wish….in 2014 No won the vote….on reflection,that victory….that ‘at any price’ approach,has not been without cost to them,it came at a very high price,way,too high a price.

      All the broken promises,the immediate effect of the cold heart of Westminster,with regards to any Scottish matters and even now,we are beginning to feel the beginnings of the icey,wintry winds of Brexit on our faces.

      Unless No voters spirits,have been completely broken (which I don’t believe to be true) they must know that this is not what they wanted,not what they voted for,I urge them rediscover their souls,their common humanity,which somehow,has been ‘spirited away’ from them,by Westminster.

      Putting all political disagreements aside,in an iScotland,I want them here,(I need somebody to rip the pish out of and vice versa).

      The world is in a sorry state right now,let’s make a start,by cleaning up our own midden first,who knows what it might lead to….say yes next time,we will never have a better opportunity to make a difference.

    142. Meindevon says:

      louis.b…..yes you’re right. I never noticed and I should have! (Smacked wrist for not being alert!) Even the Daily Wail article only had a two line comment from the hospital at the end of the article re the poor mans cancelled operation. Not a peep from local MPs.

      If that had been in Scotland Kezia, Ruth, Willie and willies dug would’ve got a say on how bad the government was.

    143. Sinky says:

      Audit Scotland report pointed out that NHS England deficit currently £2.45 billion whereas Scottish NHS has £0.5 million surplus.

      Scotland has best A & E figures in whole of UK.
      NHS patient satisfaction 2016 90% under SNP compared with 40% under Labour in 2005.
      Under SNP – NHS budget is £3bn higher, more staff employed and inpatient and outpatient waiting times shorter.

      Brazen hypocrisy from Ruth Davidson on agency staffing. Tory-run NHS England spends £3.7bn on agency staff (up £400m on prev year).

      Read what has been done in the NHS since May.

      http://www.snp.org/delivering_a_healthier_scotland

    144. Legerwood says:

      Hasn’t this been a lucky day for Labour?

      Headlines full of GDP ‘growth’, when it has actually fallen from 0.7% last quarter to 0.5% this quarter, Nissan building new cars, the bung is in the post – allegedly, and crisis in SNHS.

      All of that and nary a word about the mess Labour got itself into on Wednesday night when around 100 of its MPs did not back the party on its own motion about Yemen.

      Aren’t they the lucky ones. Or maybe just plain irrelevant.

      Yet the tragedy that is the situation in the Yemen is not irrelevant and deserves better than this Labour debacle.

    145. heedtracker says:

      Don’t have nightmares. Today was a spectacular display of BBC Scotland attack SNP propaganda though. That zero bad news tory reports from the creeps is especially worrying/or very lovely, pending how tory and yoon you are.

      https://thoughtcontrolscotland.com/2016/10/27/starting-early-bbc-scotlands-ecology-of-fear-monthly-interim-report/

      Running total 21/9/16 to 27/10/16* Number of reports

      Bad news for SG/SNP 22

      Good news for SG/SNP 9

      Bad news for Labour 1

      Good news for Labour 5

      Bad news for Conservative Party (CP) 0

      Missed bad news opportunities for CP endless

    146. Dr Jim says:

      If I had a million pounds to bet, which I don’t, I would bet it on Theresa May’s deal with Nissan that it will be to pay for all research and development grants for “new apprenticeships” for “To make Sunderland a more betterer place” thus saving Nissan a couple of billion on training offsetting any increase in costs for that company

      Somebody will leak it soon enough

      I’ll bet a….

    147. Thepnr says:

      @carjamtic

      Despite what others may think I believe Independence will be won in the schemes of Easterhouse, Kirkton, Torry and Niddrie.

      The vote in 2014 was what 85% and the slimy No shower won by 5%. That extra 15% mostly lives in the schemes where you and I grew up. Get their vote then we win.

    148. Stoker says:

      David on 27 October, 2016 at 10:50 pm

      Well done, David, you’re now a fully bonafide Yes farmer.
      Keep planting all those little seeds of hope folks.
      _____

      Breastplate wrote:
      “Thepnr…It’s a punchline from a Billy Connolly joke that you are well old enough to remember.”

      (((Oi!))) We’ll have no swearing, we’ll have no bevvying and we’ll have no ageism on here thank you very much. Ach, feck it, am away tae git pished, its foo oh geriatrics oan here.
      🙂
      _____

      https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/going-postal–4#/
      _____

      Goodnight troops, am away tae throw anither log oan the fire.
      😉

    149. carjamtic says:

      Thepnr

      My old da (yesser) still lives in Rogerfield,will be going down to see him soon,I need some stickers ?.

      Getting paid on Monday,will be supporting Mis-Reporting Scotland,Phantom…and others.

      😉

    150. Sandy says:

      OT.
      Just how difficult are we Scots to appreciate things handed to us on a plate by Westminster.
      Here we can have the best nuclear weapons money can buy & we want to reject it.
      Are we tha difficult to understand?

    151. Artyhetty says:

      Regards the Nissan deal, remember that Sunderland is a huge huge urban sprawl, in the 80s when I studied there it had high unemployment, and sorry to say not much going for it at all. Considering it was a huge industrial area, culturally it always seemed empty, to say the least. Schooling in these industrial areas was purely an exercise in preparing people to go down the mines, and to build huge ships, as cannon fodder, or for the fishing industry, or to work in the electrical or biscuit factories etc.

      My point being that a huge population, with nothing to do, is a problem, so you have to make the people think they are being favoured, not being left to rot.

      If Nissan had been allowed to jump ship, the tories could have ended up with a volatile situation indeed, given the mindset.

      What an absolute disgrace that this extreme right wing UK government are dirty dealing, wasting vast sums of money they make out is not in the coffers for health care, social care, and in partilcular, for social welfare.

      No such amends will come to Scotland, May will punish Scotland as soon as art50 is signed, no doubts there.

      Places like Sunderland are boiling pots, bubbling away, with more than enough folks with no prospects, only too ready to join the extreme ranks to get what they want, but who blame anyone but the tory government.

      Sweeteners, this is no doubt the first of many, except where we are. Of course, it is also the UKok way of saying f**k you Scotland!

    152. CameronB Brodie says:

      heedtracker
      Did I mention it all boiled down to umwelt? Here’s a pretty narrow perspective on the subject of causation, which only attributes the influence of environmental factors to lower species.

      https://www.britannica.com/topic/animal-behavior/Causation#ref497879

      Obviously printed before environmental psychology was invented.

      http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/journal/02724944

    153. yesindyref2 says:

      @Heed
      Nice article by average, can’t wait to see him on the BBC as their resident expert. Tells it as it is, shoots from the hip, ouch, his foot. Never mind, the SNHS will soon have it fixed, there there, poor lad, shouldn’t be allowed out on his own. Nurse!

    154. Thepnr says:

      @Artyhetty

      Every single thing you say rings true with me. I have worked a lot in NE England and it is a eye opener. Sunderland, Hartlepool are symptoms of the UK’s failure. I mean big style.

      I’ve witnessed poverty here in Scotland witnessed it every day but never as bad as there. Nobody gives a shit though, certainly not this current Tory government. As if any Tory government would.

      We need billboards in Sunderland and Hartlepool too, giant ones that say:

      SCOTLAND LOVES YOU TOO COME JOIN US!

    155. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Well, we all seem to have strayed somewhat from the original topic, but this little insight may be of some interest to folk here re the BBC, ironically via the BBC itself.

      I happened to catch en passant a Radio4 programme the other day, “Thinking allowed”, which on the few occasions that I have happened upon it always seemed to be populated by caricature lefty sociologists. (You would probably like it, CameronB! =grin=) But the presenter Laurie Taylor (who is a genuine lefty sociologist, BTW) was relating the interesting story of how a friend of his, an experienced TV director, found that jobs at the BBC mysteriously began to dry up. This happened over some years, much to his frustration, until one day he received a grubby piece of paper from some anonymous source that claimed he was a drug addict. And his name was mis-spelt. So he was on some BBC blacklist, one just like the (illegal) ones that applied eg. in the construction industry. Once that mis-identification was clarified, the friend started to get jobs again.

      Apparently vetting and blacklisting was something that happened at the BBC over very many years. People would be appointed then almost immediately afterwards get a letter withdrawing the contract.

      I have no idea how this might in any way relate to BBC Scotland these days, but it does make you wonder about the possible long-term exclusion of known independence supporters. No need for explicit directives from on high about content and approach, just make sure near every employee is “one of us, what?”. Could explain quite a lot.

      Anyway, the programme is on catch-up, R4 last Wed. @ 16:00, if you care to listen to it for yourself.

    156. CameronB Brodie says:

      Robert J. Sutherland
      I can go on a bit Robert. 🙂

    157. Still Positive. says:

      The pnr @ 12.03

      I think the next indy ref will be won by those areas who voted ‘No’ who also voted ‘Remain’ this year.

      I don’t think it is a coincidence that the highest ‘No’ votes were also the highest ‘Remain’ votes.

      For example: Edinburgh; Stirling; East Renfrewshire and East Dunbartonshire.

      We should be campaigning in those areas. They also have SNP MPs so it can be done.

    158. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      CameronB Brodie,

      (No offence meant, Cameron, and I truly hope none taken either!)

    159. call me dave says:

      Ruth Davidson wins Herald Politician of the Year prize after she revived Scots Tory Party

      http://archive.is/hTQsU

      I have not read it… 🙂

    160. CameronB Brodie says:

      None at all mate.

    161. Artyhetty says:

      Re;Threpnr@12.46am

      I guess poverty is poverty no matter where. Scotland has suffered hugely at the hands of WM, and still does. To have a few hundred overbloated millionaire toffs, making major decisions about what they see purely as their cash cow, ie, Scotland, is just an abomination in my view.

      Sunderland can look after itself, and actually not so sure many there, as in Newcastle, are that keen on holding hands with Scotland regards rejecting the britnat overloads bullying tactics. They read too many pretendy lefty rags and believe the bbc still tells the truth, though that started to change after J.Corbyn saga.

      No, they will be happy as larry, more like, sod off Scotland. Sorry, that is what my feeling is about reaching out to our poor neighbours. I could be wrong though. What was that, oil, in the North Sea, Wei- aye man! Note the word, North.

      Ok, I will sign off now before I get on my high horse! Too late!

    162. Cherry says:

      I/we would like to say a huge thank you to you all! As a result of your efforts, we’ve reached our target within a week!

      That means we can move on to the next stage of the campaign; getting the posters up!

      We are going to aim for a good spread across the country, with posters in all Scotland’s cities and some major towns.

      We will use standard billboard companies for most of these, but if you know of more unorthodox sites that might take a poster, now is the time to look into it and get in touch with some details. If you’ve already contacted us about this, please do so again as we may have missed your email in the rush.
      http://www [dot] informscotland [at] gmail [dot] com

      It’s going to take us a couple of weeks to get this next stage organised but we’ll keep you posted!!

      We’ve already created a bit of a stir with the campaign. The Herald ran the story today and tomorrow, Friday, Professor John Robertson is being interviewed about what we’re doing, on RT – the TV news station. Not sure when that’ll go out. We will let you know if we hear.

      Finally, thank you once again. You are part of direct action to bring balance to the BBC in Scotland – stand tall for that!

      The Inform Scotland Team

    163. yesindyref2 says:

      OT
      Holy sugar! Got this via Lamont’s twitter since she got an award for reinventing herself on it, and never knew about this:

      http://mashable.com/2016/10/25/iceland-strike-pay-gap/?utm_cid=mash-com-Tw-main-link#1p4cMMbFQqqY

      You don’t mess with Icelandic women! 1975.

    164. CameronB Brodie says:

      For those not convinced its totally mental. Environmental even. This isn’t exactly cutting-edge awareness. Then Thatcher came along.

      Remember, the environment includes all the information pollution the BBC and yoon press creates.

      https://www.researchgate.net/publication/232600712_The_Psychology_of_Place

    165. CameronB Brodie says:

      Sorry, the linkage I’m trying to highlight isn’t very clear in that one. Here’s a bing of evidence.

      “Environmental psychology is an interdisciplinary and international field that views persons and their physical surroundings as interdependent. It uses social science methods to study those person–environment relations, and recognizes the value of a multi-level, multi-disciplinary, social-ecological approach to such questions. This Special Issue explores the connections between the environment (at different scales, ranging from a room to a city) and the range of human responses addressed in the field. These connections and related responses include, but are not limited to, environmental perception and cognition; environmental attitudes and appraisals; environmental stress, noise, and crowding; responses to disasters, settings, personal space, territoriality, and privacy; crime and fear of crime; behavioral change; home, neighborhood, work, and educational environments; and facility planning and evaluation. Articles appropriate for the Special Issue include historical perspectives, theoretical articles, and reviews of research in a topic area, or discussions of a program of empirical research in an area. Papers that examine the relations between humans and their surroundings with planning, design or policy implications would represent excellent fits. This Special Issue aims to explore the state of knowledge in the field and the application of that knowledge to creating better places for people.”

      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4600143/

    166. CameronB Brodie says:

      Sorry, I don’t think that one got it either. Third time lucky.

      2011 : WHAT SCIENTIFIC CONCEPT WOULD IMPROVE EVERYBODY’S COGNITIVE TOOLKIT?

      https://www.edge.org/response-detail/11498

    167. Breeks says:

      Isn’t there something deeply troubling about and area teetering on the brink of economic collapse and deprivation, which relies on foreign investment to manufacture cars for export to Europe, but which votes by handsome majority to leave Europe and fundamentally compromise the business interests of the vital foreign investors?

      There is something malevolent about the social engineering currently underway in the U.K., something which is powerful enough to overwhelm a persons logical thinking, and leave him or her content to bite the hand that feeds them. What moves people to opt for the clearly illogical choice?

      We really need to get to grips with this. It is the same dark malevolence which can manipulate the Geordies of Sunderland to shoot themselves in the foot with such a complete lack of self awareness that also has a grip on so many Scottish Unionists.

      These are people who cannot think for themselves. I don’t mean that in a derogatory way, but in their heads whatever pish the British media pumps into circulation is a much more dominant in their thought process than their own capacity to think analytically and independently about the reality of the world around them.

      Again, I don’t mean it in a derogatory sense, but these people act like sheep, or schooling fish. Any pressure or influence to distance these people from the flock is alarming to them, and the automatic response is to return to the comfort zone of the flock.

      It takes something both powerful and sophisticated to make a Geordie with a job at Nissan making cars for export to Europe to vote in support of Brexit. We have a similar phenomenon at work on our Unionists keeping them blind and deaf to merits of Independence, and closing down their mental faculties and capacity to think for themselves. They have no confidence in their own suppressed powers of deduction, and rely on the media to do their thinking for them. This is a dangerous state of affairs when we have such a dangerous, manipulative and thoroughly malignant media with its own agenda which is routinely left unchallenged.

      Could it persuade Scots that Brexit is actually good for them? Well yes, I rather think it could. Ask the fecking Geordies why they voted for Brexit like the proverbial turkeys voting for Christmas.

      There is a social engineering process at work here, a great parasite sucking the life force out of our democracy. Until it is defeated or removed, our faith in democracy should be suspended. Yes, I believe it IS that serious. The logical case for Independence for Scotland in Europe might be clear as day to us, but logical deduction has a blind spot wherever propaganda has a strong foothold. Not only does our BBC propaganda have a strong foothold, it is ubiquitous and unchallenged.

    168. CameronB Brodie says:

      One of those nights. Another correction.

      I thanked Tam earlier without pointing out that the “Right to Development” is not the UN’s, it’s everyone’s. It is an inalienable human right.

      “The right to development is an inalienable human right by virtue of which every human person and all peoples are entitled to participate in, contribute to, and enjoy economic, social, cultural and political development, in which all human rights and fundamental freedoms can be fully realized.” (Article 1.1, Declaration on the Right to Development)

      “The human right to development also implies the full realization of the right of peoples to self-determination, which includes, subject to the relevant provisions of both International Covenants on Human Rights, the exercise of their inalienable right to full sovereignty over all their natural wealth and resources.” (Article 1.2)

      http://www.un.org/en/events/righttodevelopment/pdf/rtd_at_a_glance.pdf

    169. Arabs for Independence says:

      Breaks @ 03:45

      People from Sunderland are Mackems- they have a dislike of Geordies.

    170. Big Jock says:

      Breeks. Yes there are many yes voters who voted leave. Why? Because they bought into the idea the the EU was the bad guy!

      Any bad things that happen to Scotland are actually as a result of Westminster policy nit EU policy. Also try and get your head round an indi supporting Scot thinking giving colonial Westminster more power over them is better than Eu membership. Then there is the fact that it was a UK vote on the EU not an independent Scotland vote.

      Why would indi supporting Scots vote with the little Englanders? I have met many indi supporters who have an illogical anti foreigner insular anti EU agenda. That worries me greatly. I have pointed out that England’s overpopulation is presented as Scotland’s in the media.

      But we are the opposite we need migrants. We rely on Poles to run the Highlands. They are great people and the Eu is good for Scotland. I share a desire for independence but am at odds with little misguided Scotlanders. The twisted logic of threatening to vote no in the next indi ref to stay out of the EU and leave power with Wm. What the fuck.

      But again I repeat the EU ref was about giving Wm more power. Any indi supporter voting leave needs to take a good look at themselves. The Eu is not sovereign and they are not your enemy. Wake up people!

    171. Dan Huil says:

      First things first: an end to the union with England. We can deal with EU, NATO membership later.

    172. Socrates MacSporran says:

      Last night, the lady in my life and I went to the pictures, to the live streaming from London’s Garrick Theatre of the Kenneth Brannagh production of John Osborne’s The Entertainer.

      We thoroughly enjoyed it, and thought what superb timing from Brannagh, to revive just now, a tale of A Great Britain, mixed-up in a misadventure in the Middle East, suddenly discovering what an insignificant little country, run by people who still had delusions of being a great empire, their “Great” Britain actually was.

    173. Grouse Beater says:

      Socrates: “a [highly relevant] production of John Osborne’s The Entertainer.”

      Good point.

    174. Grouse Beater says:

      Big Jock: “I share a desire for independence but am at odds with little misguided Scotlanders. The twisted logic of threatening to vote no in the next indi ref to stay out of the EU and leave power with Westminster. What the fuck?”

      Seconded.

    175. Ken500 says:

      Minimum pricing will hold SNHS and stop people poising themselves.more Gov intervention I health matters would help. The Scandinavian countries introduced social measures to improve health care. The Scottish Gov is doing that with limited powers. Nursery care, social care, increased SNHS funding, prescriptions etc. No ‘bedroom tax’. In April the Scottish Gov can stop sanctioning vulnerable people. Might be able to put up Gov pensions. It would cut welfare benefits.

      No Council should get capital expenditure until it have fulfilled it’s duty to provide homeless facilities, social care, nursery places, proper rehab facilities, kept class sizes down and sorted potholes. Too many Councils do not fund essential services but spend public funds on non mandated grotesque projects. Wasting £Millions/Billions of public money.

      Politicians who try to make political capital from criticising the SNHS are insulting millions of voters. The employees, their families and friends and the public users. Many of the Health Boards members are Unionist placement. Local politicians and their cronies who got their patronage from Unionist parties. Quangos.

      Mundell is an utter disgrace. The Holyrood system should be changed. Unelected 3rd rate rejects have too much say in it. The Tories are ruining the world economy. The English working class vote Tory. It would help the NE of England if Scotland was Independent. Scotland would be wealthier and so would the NE of England for jobs etc. In the Oil/Gas and fishing sector etc.

      Vote SNP/SNP in May 2017. Vote for Independence.

    176. Macbeda says:

      O/T

      http://t.co/GOGEIgwAbM

      This is brilliant.

    177. Breeks says:

      That’s my point Big Jock.

      There is something screwing with people’s heads which trumps their logic and reason.

      It is the propaganda which has anti European bias, and pro U.K. Bias. Why are we then surprised to find Unionists who dislike Europe, or even Yes voters who dislike Europe?

      How can you be a Unionist but fail dismally to forward any positive case for the Union? How many anti Europeans can give you an argument they didn’t hear first on the BBC?

      Without the propaganda, this bastion of opposition would crumble to dust. It endures because the media sustains it constantly.

    178. Tam Jardine says:

      Big Jock

      Well said. One thing I would add is that there are other reasons for some up here voting leave.

      Yes voters voting leave- I would expect that many (knowing the polls which were predicting a strong remain vote in Scotland and narrow remain vote elsewhere) voted leave to get us into the exact scenario we find ourselves.

      Some yes supporters may have voted leave as a means of destabilising the UK. Others I presume couldn’t bring themselves to vote on the same side as Cameron or Darling.

      A remain vote would be taken as a vote of confidence in the status quo which we all oppose- I am not surprised so many voted against this status quo.

      And many folk just want independence- total independence for Scotland.

      It’s not how I voted. We only have an exit poll to go on- we’d have to poll further to get a better understanding of such things.

    179. Big Jock says:

      I know Tom I know a few tactical leave voters.

      However there are other narrow minded little Scotlanders who want to cut us off like England. Like I said I have nowt in common with them other than a desire for independence, but not isolation.

      Finally we can have a vote on the EU when it’s appropriate i.e independent Scotland.

    180. starlaw says:

      Heard on the radio yesterday. A company building fifty houses in the London area decided to abandon the scheme as they believed they could not get them sold in the present financial climate.
      The said company have been contacted by the Government and told to build five hundred and the government would buy what they could not sell.
      Expect a pre brexit building boom to be announced sometime soon

    181. Nana says:

      Westminster a cesspit

      CSA Inquiry: Shocking allegations of sexual assault by leading QC
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJZ0E5bT4jk&feature=youtu.be&a

      https://esther9982.wordpress.com/2016/01/07/hasc-feb-2014/

      mp-keith-vaz-to-join-new-uk-parliaments-justice-committee-1479027?
      http://archive.is/3fe9U

      https://cathyfox.wordpress.com/2016/10/25/keith-vaz-and-mp-standards-of-behaviour/

    182. North chiel says:

      I note that the Home Office has rejected the reintroduction of the post study work visa for international students in Scotland.
      The Home Office said ” applying different immigration rules to different parts of the UK would
      complicate the immigration system , harming its integrity, and cause difficulties for employers
      with a presence in more than one part of the UK “.
      Not much chance for ” immigration powers” for Scotland as part of ” Brexit negotiations” then ?

    183. Breeks says:

      Something very bleak about those tweets to Mr Ponsonby…

      “…Don’t go BBC bashing for the sake of it. Be smart”.

      “… I don’t think the BBC should be mentioned. Sell it as “get the news you’re not getting”.

      These people do realise it’s a campaign against the BBC right?

      He isn’t bashing the BBC for the sake of it, he’s trying to raise exposure of how foul, corrupt, biased, manipulative and subversive to Scottish democracy the damned BBC actually is. The whole point of the ad campaign is that it DOES name and shame the BBC.

      I despair sometimes. There are none so blind as those who will not see.

    184. CameronB Brodie says:

      Re. opponents of the billboards. Do they not want to highlight the imbalance of semiotic power/influence evident in Scotland’s environment?

    185. JaceF says:

      Heard a certain Adolf H received the posthumous award of most change effecting politician for his reforms of Europe.

    186. fionan says:

      Conan the Librarian™ says:

      Only eighty signatures to go. I’m really looking forward to the Tory excuses for not having this debate…

      https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/132687

      It has reached 11,894. They promise a debate after 10,000 signatures. This should be good. Now did someone mention popcorn?

    187. Stoker says:

      Cherry on 28 October, 2016 at 1:53 am

      Thanks a million for the very appreciated update on the billboard project. A big thank you to all involved for knocking down the hurdles and getting this project up and running.

      Those who attempt to knock our determination to expose the BBC for what it truly is would do well to remember that we are a movement, full of folk from all walks of life, and we don’t need to wait on permission from any political party.

      Our one important bonding priority is to see Scotland become a free and independent country once again and that includes exposing the No1 obstacle to that freedom, The BBC, that’s exactly what activists do.

      Please, come and join us and stop knocking us or at the very least come out with a more productive alternative. Our days of sitting and waiting on something to happen have long since gone.

    188. Kelpie says:

      Fionan and Conan the Librarian™,

      I’m afraid there’s a really obvious reason the Parliament will just laugh at this one.

      The petiton says Therefore I believe England, Wales and Northern Ireland should get the chance to have their Referendum to vote Scotland out of the U.K.

      With at least 90% of the signatures coming from Scotland it looks like the petitioner has misjudged and there is no real appetite in England, Wales and Northern Ireland to “vote Scotland out of the U.K”.

      Unless the petition gets significantly more support from it’s target audience then this will get filed straight into the bin.

      Anyone gots lots of English-dwelling friends or relatives up for a laugh?

    189. One_Scot says:

      DAVID Mundell has insisted there will be no “special deals” for Scotland in the Brexit negotiations when he was questioned by MSPs yesterday.

      But,

      “There will be a United Kingdom agreement, but that agreement can include differential arrangements in different parts of the United Kingdom if, as part of the negotiation process, that is seen to be the best way forward.”

      And lets face it, you know that will definitely happen, because the Yoon always deliver on their Jam tomorrow promises, like the Lord Darling/Jackie Bird Devo Max, Home rule promise, the Daily Record and the three stooges Vow promise, and the David Cameron £200 Billion Oil bonanza for Scotland if we vote No promise.

      Yep, I don’t know about anyone else, but I for one believe everything the Yoons tell me, they never make false promises to con the people of Scotland.

      On a serious note though, If Scotland stupid enough to be taken in by the David Mundell and the Tories lies again, then we deserve to have the shit kicked out of us for the rest of time.

    190. CameronB Brodie says:

      Here’s a challenge to our Scottish government. Next time you get the right setting, e.g. BBC QT, see how many times you can slip the “Right to Development” in to the conversation. Perhaps even following-up with a public service announcement on the BBC or leaflet distribution might not be out of the question?

      That would probably help open a few eyes and possibly provide material for all sorts of dissertations and doctorologies. 🙂

    191. Smallaxe says:

      Nana:

      Thanks for the links,I’m a bit late this morning,kettle on

      Peace Always

    192. Ken500 says:

      There are different rules for different parts of the UK. Re after study schemes for students at Imperial, Oxbridge and Bath.

    193. galamcennalath says:

      One_Scot says:

      …false promises…

      What should be happening is that every time a Yoon makes a promise it should be greeted with, “everything your side has promised has been reneged on, so how do you expect voters to believe that?”

      The real problem is, compliant media lets them away without being challenged.

      All the lies of IndyRef1 are now being written off as YES myths, while winning NOs rewrite history to suit their ongoing agenda.

      We need to get the message out by any and every means we can.

    194. CameronB Brodie says:

      Macbeda
      My ribs are sore and the neighbours will be giving me funny looks. Both image and comments, priceless. The tears are still streaming. Thank you. 🙂

    195. Greannach says:

      On BBC Parliament about 10 minutes ago I watched John Reid, Peter Hain, David Trimble, Norman Tebbit and other rejects making decisions about my future. And I’m paying them?! Wouldn’t it be novel to give democracy a go?

    196. Free Scotland says:

      I hear Captain Snackbeard McFluffbrain of Mundellia is telling Scottish farmers what a wonderful future they will have after Brexit. This could turn out to be the only time he’s ever told the truth, because by then Scotland may well have made the only decision that really makes any sense: to rise and be a Nation again.

    197. Stoker says:

      CNN host getting a taste of what we’re subjected to 24/7. LLF!

      Oh the irony in it all!
      http://archive.is/Vl50t

    198. galamcennalath says:

      Greannach says:

      Wouldn’t it be novel to give democracy a go?

      It would indeed. But it will never happen at Westminster! Democracy is contrary to everything they stand for.

    199. Brian Powell says:

      Stoker

      was there any indication why CNN was interviewing Hopkins?

    200. Nana says:

      Britain’s mixed messages deepen Brexit rifts with EU
      http://archive.is/5tY23

      Anyone got a subscription for the times. Archived what I could http://archive.is/Su4zE

      http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/scotland/true-independence-means-leaving-the-eu-5n06dqcbn

    201. Stoker says:

      Brian (9:59am)

      I had similar thoughts, why her? The only indication of a reason i picked up on for the interview was that she (Hopkins) is a Daily Mail columnist. I also noted that the writer of the article i linked to has the same surname as Hopkins. Are they related?

      You might find extended coverage of the interview on Youtube?

    202. Valerie says:

      So Fluffy is the latest to receive a smackdown from No 10.

      They have denied his chuntering that we would be out of the single market.

      The Nissan thing rumbles on, now that some have cottoned on, that Clark must have promised to offset the 10% tariffs if they arise.

      Both of these examples fascinate me from the point of view that the UK govt seems help bent on the idea you can have a pick and mix.

      Tusk is on record as saying its hard Brexit, or no Brexit. They have said they will stand by the 4 pillars, and logically they must, or the market falls.

    203. CameronB Brodie says:

      Hopkins might in a privileged position to shape opinion but what knowledge base is she drawing from? What’s her background?

    204. CameronB Brodie says:

      Hopkins might be in a privileged position to shape opinion but what knowledge base is she drawing from? What’s her background?

    205. louis.b.argyll says:

      IMHO..Get those billboards up.

      Aw..poor BBCScot staff? Maybe they’ll have a union meeting, ask if they should be following orders without standards.

    206. Meg merrilees says:

      O/T
      Sorry!

      Ha ha ha ha ha, Ruth Davidson is Scotland’s Politician of the year?…
      “In addition to reviving Conservative numbers in the Scottish Parliament, ( isn’t that as a direct result of D’Hondt?)
      Ruth Davidson also won plaudits for her performance against leading Conservative Brexiteer Boris Johnson in a debate days before the vote on European Union membership.(when she was defending Remain – a position she has flipped on!)
      She also scooped “another honour, the prize for Donald Dewar Debater of the Year.”
      It’ll be winner of the Great British Bake Off next for her Upside-down Pudding!

      Ha ha ha ha ha, but EVEN funnier – Mundell is named Best Scot at Westminster and Jacquie Baillie is named Community MSP of the year for retaining her seat. ( aye, 109 votes is close right enough!)

      Ach, maybe I’m being cynical – we can’t always win and it is The Herald making the calls!

    207. Stoker says:

      Valerie wrote:

      “..the UK govt seems hell bent on the idea you can have a pick and mix.”

      Trouble is, Valerie, do they not realise that Woolworths went bust trying to sell pic n mix’?
      🙂

    208. CameronB Brodie says:

      Silly sabotage or an alarm calling attention to a major problem for the status quo, wherever that went? Probably some tax haven.

      http://petitionmap.unboxedconsulting.com/?petition=132687

    209. Flower of Scotland says:

      Cherry @1.53am

      I did GA Ponsonby,s wee poll on Twitter and was delighted to see the result.

      Well done all of you. Looking forward to seeing these BILLBOARDS up.

    210. Dr Jim says:

      Folk are saying the EU’s a shambles what do we want to be part of that for when we come out of the UK

      That’s easy, the EU has the good will to be better
      When did anybody ever hear of the UK having good will

    211. louis.b.argyll says:

      Help! They’re giving awards to fascists and elitist sympathisers.

    212. louis.b.argyll says:

      If, one was to purchase, say, all the Heralds/Mails/Expresses/ etc from a shop..
      Are we then entitled to throw them into the gutter, where they, their staff, their editors and especially their owners belong.

      Maybe we should replace Guy Fawkes with the gutter press.
      Certainly flammable.

    213. Chic McGregor says:

      Meg
      “It’ll be winner of the Great British Bake Off next for her Upside-down Pudding!”

      Ha, ha, ha. Nice one.

      ….P.)
      …/..(___
      .(….).:::::}
      ./….:__:/
      \___/

    214. Ken500 says:

      The Herald ‘awards’ are like Holyrood. The loser wins.

    215. HandandShrimp says:

      Not really surprised at Davidson getting the Herald politician of the year award. By Conservative standards she has had a good year and the press do seem to have thrown Labour and Kezia under a bus.

      The SNP can’t win this every year 🙂

      Mundell is quite possibly the worst Scottish MP so I can only imagine the Herald are having a laugh or whatever drugs they were on were stronger than they expected when they selected him.

      Ditto for Baillie the Dissembler.

    216. louis.b.argyll says:

      The Herald awards are for softening up similar ‘panels’ who’ll be giving out OBE/MBES next year.

      Davidson wouldn’t get one based on the
      CURRENTLY STAGNATING TORY VOTE.

    217. louis.b.argyll says:

      Now it’ll be.. Award winning conservative leader Truth Davidson…

      Hang on..think I’m going to be si

    218. Liz g says:

      Well there ye go the Good Friday agreement is worthless.
      It’s only holds good till Westminster changed the goal posts.
      Who would have thunk it?

    219. galamcennalath says:

      louis.b.argyll says:

      Award winning conservative leader Truth Davidson…

      … who won, in part, because she pretended not to be the conservative leader!

      The Ruth Davidson for the Union Party made gains.

      Now she will need to stand and defend her true identity – the xenophobic isolationist hard right blood and soil English nationalist Conservative Party! Good luck on that one!

    220. heedtracker says:

      How can anyone award a tory for the best anything? Best trougher maybe, most inexplicable harm caused. 80% of Scots never vote tory. Architects do “Carbuncle of the year awards,” often won by Aberdeen City Council, for the horrors they inflict on our eye balls and psyche.

      Herald makes a fool of itself again, shock.

    221. Les Wilson says:

      I would like to see the BBC billboards at the border roads particularly Berwick on tweed (A1), and M74/M6.

      Fora start,that would be excellent exposure!
      Well done in reach the target to all concerned.

    222. HandandShrimp says:

      galamcennalath

      Aye, I thought the gloss on Davisdson’s persona looked pretty tarnished on her return from the “Hate a Foreigner” jamboree down south. She didn’t look comfortable and I don’t think the UK party is heading in a direction of her choosing. It will be a lot harder for her square the Tory circle in the months ahead.

    223. galamcennalath says:

      Liz g says:

      Well there ye go the Good Friday agreement is worthless.
      It’s only holds good till Westminster changed the goal posts.

      Now, as in Scotland, the people of Northern Ireland find themselves set aside as a South Britain centric government focuses on its home territory.

      May would probably like to be PM of the UK, but it will never happen. She will remain champion of the South British.

      Like Scotland, NI will need to reassess its constitutional status if the Brexit they opposed does develop into a damaging fiasco.

    224. Les Wilson says:

      When you think the Tories can’t get any lower, they always
      prove us wrong.

      http://evolvepolitics.com/tory-councillor-says-that-the-homeless-should-be-grabbed-by-the-scruff-of-the-neck/

    225. heedtracker says:

      Nana says:
      28 October, 2016 at 11:12 am
      COURT DISMISSES BREXIT CHALLENGE

      Thanks Nana. You have to wonder if some people have too much money and too much time on their hands, or is it just politics. It doesn’t get any more emphatic and there’s nothing constitutional to prevent NI going Brexit with the rest of us UKOK suckas.

      ISSUE 5: Mr McCord contends that Article 50 TEU cannot be triggered without the consent of the people of NI and it is asserted that the Good Friday Agreement has created a substantive legitimate expectation that there would be no change in the constitutional status of NI without the consent of the people of NI.

      The Court’s Assessment of Issue 5

      Mr Justice Maguire said he was not aware of any specific provision in the Good Friday Agreement or in the 1998 Act which confirms the existence of the limitation which the applicant contends and which establishes a norm that any change to the constitutional arrangements for the government of NI and, in particular, withdrawal by the UK from the EU, can only be effected with the consent of the people of NI. Further, the Court could not identify material which would cause it to imply such a limitation. The judge said this was not surprising as if such a limitation exists it would be reasonable to have expected it to have been highlighted in the run up to the Referendum. Further, it would have the most unusual result of requiring a second Referendum to be held in NI within a short time of the people of NI having gone to the polls in respect of the same issue in a national referendum where the national outcome was in favour of withdrawal.

    226. Brian Powell says:

      It’s an extraordinary display of some form of psychological disfunction that the Herald is handing out awards to members of the party that caused Brexit, and to those parties which are behaving like zombies in the face of the chaos of Brexit.

      It doesn’t matter if this is considered trolling by the Herald, the fact that they are doing it shows their dysfunctional minds.

      There is the historical case of the British in Kabul before they withdrew at the time of Raj. They had two years to draw up plans how they would take all the troops and civilians from Kabul to what is now Pakistan.

      During the summer leading up to the deadline it was as if nothing was happening and there was no threat. There were parties and the officers played polo.

      And it turned out there really was very little happening. The Senior Officer in charge of the evacuation said he wasn’t really fit to plan it, he was too old. Meanwhile the civilian population believed it would be OK, there were so many of them, they had the British army to protect them.

      The they eventually set off and were slaughtered on the way by tribesmen and died in freezing weather. Of the 10,000 who set out just some hundreds made it out.

      There seems to be the same Raj types in charge of Brexit and the same, everything as usual nothing will happen, complacency among Tory/Labour politicians.

    227. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Hmmm, NI is one thing, but I wonder if the 1707 Act of Union makes a difference from a strictly legalistic point of view.

      I know there are also proceedings underfoot in England (thus the legal challenges to unilateral Government invocation of Art.50 are by no means over), but is anyone in Scotland making a legal challenge to Brexit based on Scots Law…?

    228. Breeks says:

      Ordinarily, I’d say good luck to her. It’s a shallow award and it costs me nothing to be courteous. But the simple truth is Ruth Davidson being Scotland’s politician of the year leaves the same sour and unfulfilling taste in your mouth as UKIP’s David Coburn elected to represent Scotland in Europe.

      There is something very wrong an unpleasant about it, and a sense of artificial fraud.

      Besides, what business is it of the media to be giving awards or endorsements to any MP? Stick to doing the news… or rather why not start doing the news properly instead?

    229. galamcennalath says:

      That great champion of blood and soil nationalism, the Telegraph, says ..

      FTSE 100 falters and pound skids to eight-day low against euro after Northern Ireland rejects Brexit challenge

      … now imagine the effects when Brexit begins to become reality!

    230. Bob Mack says:

      Two Scottish Tories, belonging to the Party that has wreaked devastation on the less well off, has come close (as yet) to crippling the UK economy, and created nothing but racial hatred,xenophobia and intolerance win awards for being politician of the year and great debator, and best Scot in Westminster.

      pish.

    231. heedtracker says:

      Besides, what business is it of the media to be giving awards or endorsements to any MP? Stick to doing the news… or rather why not start doing the news properly instead?

      Because the tories own the UK and their massed ranks of pet hacks, from the BBC to the Herals, are paid to keep it that way.

      Another day on planet UKOK toryboy. Filthy rich tories fill their pockets with EU dosh, cause appalling animal suffering, wreak environmental havoc, the RSPB says shooting birds is just fine though. We’re not governed by lunatics though, just tories, like award winning Ruthie Babes.

      http://archive.is/szJVt

      “The Royal Society for the Protection of Birds (RSPB) does not support the petition to ban driven grouse shooting, but argues that new laws are needed. “As currently practised, intensive driven grouse shooting is a negative environmental impact,” said the RSPB’s Jeff Knott. “Grouse shooting can deliver benefits [for some birds], but not enough grouse moors are delivering to the highest standards.”

    232. Socrates MacSporran says:

      Fluffy Muddle – Scottish Westminster Politician of the Year. All I can say is: “Jings, crivvens, help ma Boab”.

      I would say it was between him and the Red Tory from Morningside for the Biggest Scottish Waste of Space at Westminster.

      But, at the moment, The Herald is rudderless.

    233. I’m actually surprised at the idiocy of our media to think that the awards to these two Tories in any way enhances the position of them or the union.
      It opens them all to ridicule and derision. Sheesh. Don’t tell them.Never interupt an enemy when he is makinga mistake.

      Its a bit like asking Celtic supporters to vote on what is their favourite team in Scotland

    234. Dr Jim says:

      Tories voting for each other to get an award is only done in the hope of winding us up

      I for one am not wound, either up or any direction, the only thing I wonder at is the Tories persistent use of the tactic of annoyance as a strategy for winning the hearts and minds of Scotland, but go for your lives Tories, I certainly wont try and stop you

      You’re doing great…Honest!

    235. Liz g says:

      Robert J Sutherland @ 11.46
      Last I heard about the leagal challenge in England was the Noicola and her team were keeping a close eye on it.

      It seemed to be also indirectly inferred that the Scottish Government was looking at the possibility of their own legal challenge,but was keeping its powder dry.
      Hard to tell if they were serious or not.

      Having said that,while the Good Friday agreement is really about running an electoral system fairly and the law aligning with European law.
      The Treaty of the Union is at it’s heart a Trade agreement,so there might indeed be something in it preventing Scotland’s trade arrangements being damaged.
      And I do know that there’s the ” for all time ” bit in it somewhere.

      So unlike the Irish Court finding there was an expectation that the UK would stay in the EU,so that eventually hadn’t been included in the agreement and that this was reasonable.

      If the Trade agreements within the Treaty of the Union were expected to be for all time so therefore it could be said would cover all eventualities.

      The absolute disgrace though is that had there been any clause at the time saying that European law only stays while you are in,but the English gets to decide,and then you will have to trust the British government all over again.
      The Good Friday agreement would, I think never have been signed.

      So how that Judge can’t see that the continued protection of Europe was to be the safe guard against a Westminster acting in a unrestrained way in it’s dealing with N Ireland was implicit in the whole agreement is beyond me.

    236. galamcennalath says:

      Derek Bateman on the BBC and billboards.

      http://derekbateman.scot/2016/10/28/up-in-lights/

      I like what Derek writes and consider it to be full of sensible and moderate wisdom.

      However, I find it difficult to believe the BBC’s failings are all simply institutional.

      He is correct that there are huge institutional problems where the BBC always supports the status quo. He is probably also correct in saying there is no grand conspiracy to target the SNP specifically.

      There has to be more wrong than just an overall pro UK and establishment stance.

      What I do think is there is an institutional environment with allows individual supporters of the Union within the BBC to push their personal bias. Conversely, if there are individual supporters of Indy within the BBC they don’t have influence because that would be stepping out of institutional line.

    237. Fred says:

      Anent the Yoonstorm on NHS Scotland by Davidson, Dugdale & Rennie. This trio couldn’t run a wulk-stall & as for Sarah Smith, it’s worth noting that in a country with a population of 60 million, a quite unremarkable lassie with no obvious talent has managed to secure such an important position in the BBC entirely on her own merit. Not since Bridgid McConnell have we seen the like.

    238. mike cassidy says:

      Close ties between the media and the tories?

      Surely some mistake?

      No.

      http://archive.is/r9WYJ

    239. Scots Renewables says:

      I too find it hard to fall in with Derek Bateman;s idea that BBC bias is unintentional>

      I was listening to the lunchtime news on BBC Radio yesterday. Top headline was the news that the NHS in Scotland is failing to make seven out of eight targets on some organisation’s target list.

      This was then followed by what can only be described as an uninterrupted tirade lasting over a minute from Conservative leader Ruth Davidson saying this was all the SNP’s fault, a disgrace etc. ad nauseam.

      Then an immediate cut to the next item. No balancing viewpoint, no Scottish Government statement, nothing.

      That was not a professionally crafted news article in line with the BBC’s alleged code of ethics, that was a crude stitch-up.

      Sorry Derek, but I too think you are way off the mark here.

    240. yesindyref2 says:

      Sturgeon won the Herald award the last two years so you could say it’s time for a change, but it’s also been a tight year for her, walking the path twixt and between Indy and Brexit and NO voters and YES voters, and she’s had to walk on egg-shells.

      I think her performance all year has been absolutely outstanding, I can’t pick a fault, which makes it 100% – even including the couple of “faults” I would pick on, but that’s from a very focussed point of view of end objective. For anyone impartial, Davidson has been more interesting, more in the face, and over the nominees she was to me the winner. But Patrick Harvie should also have been nominated, and that would have been a closer race with, for me, Harvie nosing it because his performance is consistent, it’s one step forward for the Greens, none back, whereas Davidson’s a bit erratic.

    241. heedtracker says:

      Scots Renewables says:
      28 October, 2016 at 12:45 pm
      I too find it hard to fall in with Derek Bateman;s idea that BBC bias is unintentional>

      Thanks to this dysfunctional mess of a tory owned UKOK democracy we have to cope with, everyone in Pacific Quay is now fighting with everything they’ve got to keep their jobs. They know full well that if democracy does actually take hold in their Scotland region, it’s all over. And its a very high paid, cushy number at BBC Scotland as we all know.

      So that’s all they’ll be doing until Scottish independence, monstering Scottish democracy. Its also why planet toryboy hated the EU so hard. Brussels is a democracy that they couldn’t control, so now we’re out.

    242. Dorothy Devine says:

      Speaking of BBBC Scotland , does anyone remember the young male newsreader David somebody who suddenly vanished from our screens , although he did manage to say farewell?

      I remember Sally looking quite upset over it and wondered what he had done to have the rug pulled out from under him.
      Was he a closet or not so close YESSER?

    243. galamcennalath says:

      heedtracker says:

      Brussels is a democracy that they couldn’t control

      All things have to be relative. There are few absolutes.

      So yes, the EU is a beacon of democratic enlightenment and vision COMPARED to Westminster.

      For Scotland the EU has delivered, on balance, good things. When did anything positive or worthwhile last come out of WM!?

      It is perhaps understandable that the Tory boys and girls never really took to the EU because, fortunately, it was literally foreign to their way of looking at the world!

    244. Iain says:

      I have to agree with Scots Renewables, that the bbc shows blatant and unacceptable bias in its news coverage. It is not acceptable that an organization that is publicly funded shows such unacceptable bias. The bbc charter prohibits them showing such bias, yet they blatantly do so.
      Having such a minor thing as a poster campaign is not an overreaction to such a violation of the bbc charter.
      I think Derek is wrong on this position, and it is the duty of every Scot to oppose this injustice.
      We will win inevitably, and the bbc credibility with be permanently damaged like the”Sun” in Liverpool.

    245. mike cassidy says:

      Remember its a big world out there.

      I mean, there are people so far to the right, they object to Rupert Murdoch’s media manipulation in the USA.

      http://archive.is/pfoBI

    246. yesindyref2 says:

      While I’m in my “cold” “impartial” “objective” mode, in terms of political party push for YES it’s the Greens who can have the public eye, and Indy push. They’re unfettered, they’re not the government, they’re fully entitled to say as strongly as they like that Scotland is not going to get any special deal in the UK, Scotland exits the EU with the UK. They can even be critical of the SNP for wasting time, this differentiates them from the SNP even more, and gives a lot more strength to a wide YES, rather than a rather narrow one.

      The SNP themselves are totally stuck as they should be, behind continuing to exhaust all options short of Indy, to the bitter end. They are winning recognition for this from the most hardened sceptics, bar the odd few mouth-frothers we know so well. This is absolutely essential, the YES vote was 45%, Remain 62%, but around 1/3rd of SNP supporters voted Leave so this makes around half of the Remain vote open to persuasion to back YES instead of NO. Meanwhile the SNP / ScotGov is doing the preparation, currency, ecoomy and hopefully presenting that case with publications.

      As far as the wider YES campaign is concerned for the next 5 months, that’s us, I see the billboards BBC is mis-Reporting Scotland as THE biggie. The more billboards the better, it needs to reach outside big towns, along the A9, A82, A77, A1, you name it. Once the Ref is underway billboards should probaby be changed from that to a subtle YES campaign something like “Change is coming anyway, there is no status quo, which do you want, an Independent Scotland or one in the UK but out of the EU? Vote YES and control your own destiny.”.

    247. Les Wilson says:

      I totally agree with the BBC billboards, however, they could be used in many ways to get the truth out there to the masses.
      We could be showing up this fictitious ” Union”, in so many ways that would be hard hitting.

    248. heedtracker says:

      galamcennalath says:
      28 October, 2016 at 1:12 pm
      heedtracker says:

      But the UK and the EU are two entirely different unions, as we all know. Tory UK has almost instinctively hated the EU from the start, because its democracy they cant control. Much the same hate was directed at Obama. His presidency has also been misrepresented and unreported, BBC EU style, by our BBC Scotland tory chums in particular.

      We’re out of the EU because of English xenophobia. Its that simple. Farage and UKIP feed off of English xenophobia, tory BBC led UKOK press feed and build English xenophobia.

      Only reason planet toryboy held their Brexit ref was to try and hold back UKIP voting xenophobia and all the FPTP Westminster power waiting for UKIP.

      You can do this all day.

      Why else has the BBC given so much backing to UKIP? From Dimbelby’s Question Time to Jim Naughty going UKIP mental in his Scotland region last EU elections, trying to get a nutcase like Coburn elected. Naughty and his Pacific Quay freakshow are continually and desperately trying to break up SNP vote. It worked with Coburn’s UKIP but its got nothing to do with Scottish democracy, only protecting toryboy right to reign over us.

    249. yesindyref2 says:

      If Derek Bateman says he thinks the bias at the BBC is institutional, Salmond said the same, and so have I. Most of it is institutional, just unconcious attitudes and bias, British empire perspective, and perhaps some of the editorial decisions as well go that way. They think only in terms of the UK parties for instance, the SNP and Greens are local, provincial, no account in the big scheme of things. Even UKIP is more important to them, poor blinkered dears.

      The advantage of that is it means he’s pushing that view, and perhaps the BBC will take notice of it, whereas when accused of bias they just say no, not us. We know that bias does exist and that a couple of the news and politics people would be better out of the business. But talking about bias appeals to people rather than the BBC so we do that, whereas the Batemans of this world try to get the BBC to change.

      Sounds like a plan to me.

    250. Roboscot says:

      Re Derek Bateman, the BBC and billboards. Derek Bateman used the money he got from the BBC to buy Newsnet. Newsnet was for many people the ‘go to’ site during the referendum campaign and was a strong critic of the BBC. After Bateman bought it, it’s a shadow of its former self, as if it’s been neutralised. Does anyone else not find that a bit suspicious?

    251. Breeks says:

      I’m with you Heedtracker and ScotsRenewables.

      To quote Mr Bateman-

      “The trouble with this analysis is simple. It’s not true. It’s not true and it’s not possible. Anyone with common sense or any experience inside an organisation understands there is a collective ethos or corporate mindset and subconsciously follows it – which does happen at the BBC whose origins, management configuration and internal protocols tend towards reflecting a status quo. In this case that means Britain. This idea of conveying the coherence of the UK is now written into the new charter settlement. It means that when there is a threat to the status quo, as there was in the 90’s over a Scottish Six, the Director General went to the Prime Minister to move jointly against it in case it threatened the Union. Which makes you think about the indyref…”

      What is it you are describing if not bias? And institutional bias at that.

      I don’t actually care why the BBC is biased, I don’t lay the blame on Jackie Bird’s shoulders, although Douglas Fraser regularly gives me indigestion. I don’t even regularly cite the prevalence of Labour sympathisers who pepper the BBC Scotland newsroom as evidence of bias, although I very much do find it incompatible with an agency which moves to refute its bias yet does not recognise the absurdity of its position. All I judge the BBC upon is its output; and that is an output which rigs its programs agenda, heckles and aggressively interrogates proponents of Independence while Unionists spokesmen routinely get a much easier ride.

      What you are excusing Mr Bateman is the BBC for being the BBC, and the faithful servant of the British state. I get that. However, the BBC has never once delivered the positive, constructive, and progressive arguments for the British state, those illusive and mythical arguments which define why the Union is good for Scotland. It’s only defence of Britain has been to discredit and belittle the voices calling for Independence, whilst refusing to turn its allseeing eye upon the gross injustices suffered upon Scotland by a heartless UK government.

      Don’t say this is all an illusion Mr Bateman. It does you no credit. It exists, whether it is the subjective perception of the YES man in the street, or the cold number crunching analysis of Professor Robertson.

      I do not want, nor do I expect to see BBC staff strung up from lampposts. What I want in a country divided by differing constitutional philosophies is provision of an informative and progressive IMPARTIAL dialogue which respects both sides of our divided community. Our media should be our servant, articulating the relevant issues and hosting enlightening debates and enlightening back stories to support and assist objective analysis of the subject. How bloody dare they declare themselves institutionally on the side of unionism whilst pretending the pish they screen on our TV’s is impartial? It should be hosting the debate, and not be the active participant which it is.

      I don’t understand how Mr Bateman can join the dots yet fail to see the picture.

      The BBC in Scotland has roll to perform but it is institutionally unfit to perform it. It is that simple.

    252. louis.b.argyll says:

      Nothing on BBC Scot news about removing visas for EU graduates at SCOTTISH UNIVERSITIES..

      Extensive piece about refurbishing a helicopter though. Ending with a line that it MIGHT benefit local tourism.

      LOOK! A helicopter.

    253. louis.b.argyll says:

      There’s probably a gong somewhere down the line with Andy’s name on it.

      Oooooo…

    254. Nation Libre says:

      What happened to BBC’s Isabel Fraser?

    255. sinky says:

      Derek Bateman’s article is spot on.

      http://derekbateman.scot/2016/10/28/up-in-lights/

      The BBC is the glue that holds Britain together but slagging it off on Billboards won’t change minds, better to drop in instances of bias to your friends or in letters to local newspapers to undermine its credibility and word will get around.

      Politics is about the art of the possible, empathising with your opponents then finding out what really concerns them about Indy or what do they need reassurance on.

      In any Billboard campaign Better to use catchy slogans pointing out the truth on a topical subject.

      Did you know that…….. ? And think positively.

    256. Chic McGregor says:

      Socrates
      “But, at the moment, The Herald is rudderless.”

      But surely they still have some left?

      Oh wait, you said rUDderless. 🙂

    257. Proud Cybernat says:

      Billboards funded by hundreds of ordinary people in Scotland challenging the BBC’s ‘news’ reporting. I’m sure we’ll find the campaign being the top story on BBC’s Misreporting Scotland tonight.

      Won’t we?

    258. galamcennalath says:

      Breeks says:

      BBC has never once delivered the positive, constructive, and progressive arguments for the British state, those illusive and mythical arguments which define why the Union is good for Scotland.

      Has anyone? Is there one?

      “illusive and mythical” is right.

      Personally, I like there is literally no case any more. We hear nostalgia, pure conservatism with a small ‘c’, hoping against hope the world will stand still.

      Truth is, there IS a vision of a future UK in Union and it is so obscene and unpalatable they dare not expose it! “Positive, progressive, and constructive” it is not!

    259. stupidactingsmart says:

      @Dan Huil
      “bbc misreporting Scotland billboards will be appreciated not just by most Yes supporters but by others who see the bbc as a wasteful organization spending millions on jolly jaunts for the likes of John Inverdale and Gary Lineker.”

      I despise Inverdale but I have a new respect for Lineker given his recent comments on refugees. That’s raising your head above the parapet. Plus, the Sun hate him now. Any enemy of theirs…

    260. TheBuchanLoony says:

      Re Derek Bateman…
      “That needs a structure in which word comes down through layers of staff to the journalists. It means telling a journalist what to say or what to write even against his better judgment. It means over 200 staff keeping quiet and never spilling the beans. It suggests all staff are party to an undeclared plan and word doesn’t leak out. Nobody complains. Everybody is malleable or has no political views of their own.”
      Just like Jimmy Savile then?

    261. Bob Mack says:

      THE CLUE about the BBC is in the name. It is not the Scottish broadcasting corporation. It is British. That effectively means that all the major players from Board level down will protect that interest. The ordinary Joe who front programmes may be neutral,but the message they give out is most certainly not.
      I am not looking for special favours or SNP bias. I simply look for an even playing field,which we all know is lacking.

      Guys like Bateman frustrate me. Does he mouth words but not understand the implications of them. History is littered with examples of where the people had to announce their views and their voice in spite of authority figures advising otherwise.

      The current theme seems to be let us not upset anybody. That route leads to indifference and exclusion. Damn right we have to upset people to make them listen.

    262. Jack Murphy says:

      STV on-line. BBC is keeping the good old Guardian afloat says MP yesterday.

      “Philip Davies said the broadcaster is “single-handedly keeping the Guardian afloat” after purchasing 75,114 copies of the newspaper last year.[WHAT!!!]
      Now we know where our money is going. 🙁

      Statistics show the broadcaster buys more copies of the Guardian than any other newspaper.

      Last year the BBC purchased 73,596 copies of the Times and just under 70,000 copies of both the Daily Mail and the Daily Telegraph.———–”

      With that cash the BBC could have set up several Foodbanks AND stocked them!
      A DISGRACE.
      Have they never heard of pooling and sharing?

      Squandering peoples’ money, many of whom are struggling to make ends meet on a weekly basis.
      SHAME on the Peoples’ Broadcaster–up here and down there.

      http://archive.is/92kLr

    263. louis.b.argyll says:

      Write to local papers?!
      Is that some kind of joke?
      Do you really think letters in local advertisers are effective ? Or even get printed?
      Do me a favour and get a grip.
      Anyone with connections to the British propaganda machine..ESPECIALLY THOSE WHO HAVE A PENSION CARRIED OVER, should butt out.

      Leave public campaigning to those who are in control of their own actions and imaginations.

      We must now take risks, to create a strong sense of REBUTTAL to the drip drip of Capitalist malevolence.

    264. louis.b.argyll says:

      It’s the BEEB, see.

    265. Chic McGregor says:

      Any idea how many copies of the Herald the BBC buys?

    266. heedtracker says:

      louis.b.argyll says:
      28 October, 2016 at 2:29 pm
      It’s the BEEB, see.

      Big broad brush stokes but even this fledgling Scottish democracy is a very real threat to the world of the £20 million a year banskters, the £50 million oil co CEO’s, troughing lords and ladies, royal billionaires we’re told to worship, as they whizz overhead in $100 million dollar biz jets to their tax havens, UKOK tax havens.

      And all protected and boosted by guys like socialist worker Gordon Brown, Lord Flipper, breying shire toryboy’s, greedy lords, Osborne, Ruthie Babes, you name it, all of whom say to Scots who have nothing, vote SLab, we’re the ones who can change your lives for the bettertogether, together united in teamGB. And its rammed down our throats by the BBC Scotland creep show, every minute of everyday.

      Or as SLab activists like dr NO! keep saying

      Scott Arthur ?@DrScottThinks 28 Jul 2015 Islington, London
      Labour’s recovery shouldn’t be about right v left, or rich v poor. It is about convincing everyone that social justice is in their interest.

      Is it?

    267. galamcennalath says:

      Jack Murphy says:

      Last year the BBC purchased 73,596 copies of …

      There’s a fundamental question here. Why and what for?

      Surely it can’t be to read news? Are the BBC admitting their own massive news gathering service needs to buy newspapers to find out what’s going on?

      I would have thought broadcast news was many hours ahead of dead tree scrolls.

      It also feeds into the whole plagiarism accusation against the media in general where almost all of any single organisation’s news output has been copied from elsewhere. Thus they all run with the same line, never double checked for authenticity.

      Real journalism is now very rare.

    268. Grouse Beater says:

      The BBC is irrelevant to Scotland’s culture, and to Scotland’s aspirations.

      It has been that way for over thirty years.

      Anybody who wants to work for it harbouring ambitions to report Scotland as the nation it ought to be by now is delusional. They will never get past the first interview.

    269. Grouse Beater says:

      “Last year the BBC purchased 73,596 copies of … There’s a fundamental question here. Why and what for?”

      The BBC doesn’t create hard news. It chooses the day’s main topics from the day’s newspapers. You sit around a table and pick ‘n mix.

      Since the BBC demoted all departments output to channel the greatest funds to news departments, news departments must be given full resources. And every HQ, department, station, outpost, and key staff must have copies of the day’s UK newspapers.

    270. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      Brian Powell says at 11:40 am

      “It’s an extraordinary display of some form of psychological disfunction that the Herald is handing out awards to members of the party that caused Brexit, and to those parties which are behaving like zombies in the face of the chaos of Brexit.”

      For some reason this image popped into my head when I read your first paragraph.

      http://ww2gravestone.gqt0ethe.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/adolf_hitler_end_1945__1461061557_50734-475×300.jpg

    271. sandycraig says:

      I think Derek Bateman is deluding himself. My wife is fed up of me commenting on Reporting Scotland when I hear or see an article that isn’t 100% correct. Too many times it is the information that is not included that pisses me off.

      So whose fault is it. It can’t just be ignorance of the facts all the time. The news report has to be made up and checked before it is broadcast surely.

      The most famous example, not Pacific Quay especially, is Nick Robinson. “Salmond never answered my question”, when we all knew AS answered him for about 8 minutes, and still they tried to deny it. Who was responsible for cutting that bit out and completely changing the story.

      Billboards, bring them on. I’m sure people will read them.
      Think how many times we read ” caution deer on road, heavy rain expected etc” when driving on the roads. It might just sink in to some folk.

    272. Meg merrilees says:

      Cameron Brodie @ 10.33 I checked on the petition map just around 10am and it was over 12,000 votes!! Mostly different shades of bruised red/purple and reddish brown towards the north of the map!

      Socrates Mac Sporran @12.05 Sorry to correct you but we must give Mr. Fundilly Mundelly his proper title as per the award for “Best Scot at Westminster” ???? Sorry, Mhairi, Angus, Tasmina, Alex….

      Yesindyref2 @12.57- I think it was a choice between Truth Davidson and John Swinney – a no-brainer really!

      Andy Murray through to quarter finals in Vienna. Jamie through to semis but you’ll probably not be told this by the EBC because ‘we’ are playing cricket against Bangladesh just now!

      Been reading the judgement from the NI court re Article 50/Royal Prerog/Brexit. The Court seems to be specifically concerned with the situation as it affects NI Constitution and Good Friday agreement; aware that other challenges are happening in England and Wales and ay need to revisit in the light of their findings.

      Loved this phrase form the judge;-

      “While the wind of change may be about to blow the precise direction in which it will blow cannot yet be determined so there is a level of uncertainty, as is evident from discussions about, for example, how NI’s land boundary with Ireland will be affected by actual withdrawal by the UK from the EU. ”

      However, as regards the specific conditions established by the Good Friday Agreement and whether any Constitutional change would require the consent of the people of NI, the judge said that, ” the UK Parliament has retained to itself the ability to legislate for NI without the need to resort to any special procedure”.

      Whilst that statement initially set me worrying, the judge did state earlier that the situation may be different in Scotland and he would leave it to the Scottish Courts to decide.

    273. yesindyref2 says:

      Something often not considered about the BBC is that most of their bias is by omission, not commission. For example news item “The Government is pants”, failing to put in “UK” as in “The UK Government is pants”. Similarly for the NHS “The NHS is in a dreadful state”, rather than “The English NHS is in a dreadful state”.

      Also of course where their “panels” consist only of Unionists.

      It’s constant, and permeates every news program and every political progran we have on BBC, even those in Reporting Scotland.

    274. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      Also I suspect we’ll hear from the uninitiated and those blind to the Unionist MSMs machinations.

      “Well thon Davidson MUST be doing a good job, you wouldnae win an award if ye weren’t now, would you??”

      That’s why the Inform Scotland project is so important.

    275. yesindyref2 says:

      Thinking about Derek Bateman (I commented on his article), if he comes out like “The BBC is biased” he’s not going to be invited on. Whereas if he pursues a very moderate line, perhaps he can become a regular panellist alongside the dreadful Alex Massie, and the two of them can give their views on whatever the discussion was about.

      Anyways OT, I’ve realised I shouldn’t change much the structure of the wordpress blog I’ve got, the EU will be a big battleground in IndyRef2, 30% of SNP supporters voted Leave, there’s a lot of other pro-Indy supporters voted Leave, so I think I’ll leave the main page pretty well as is, and if I want to go off on a tangent anywhere as is my wont, stick it through the navigation tags at the top.

      I reckon the EU issue is worth perhaps as much as 30% in IndyRef2 – maybe even more. Getting knowledge and understanding out of how the EU works is going to be vital in getting those votes.

    276. gus1940 says:

      At yesterday’s FMQs Patrick Harvie reminded me that the airline industry does not pay duty on Avtur and Avgas.

      Historically when the airline industry started up there was no way that it could get off the ground (pun apology)without such a subsidy.

      However, we are now in the ludicrous situation whereby a train ticket from Edinburgh to London costs several times that of an airline ticket for the same journey a fact which to my mind makes a case for the establishment of a level playing field when it comes to public transport both air and ground.

      While it would cause an uproar both at home and internationally to start charging duty on aircraft fuel is there not a case for its removal from surface transport i.e. rail and sea.

      After all, in this age of concern over pollution it is a fact that air transport is far and away the most polluting transport medium.

      The resulting reduction in costs would result in the following:-

      1) The viable re-introduction of a daily vehicle and passenger service on the Rosyth to Zeebrugge route up to the standard of the late lamented Superfast service.

      2) Greatly increased use of bus travel with a resultant reduction in both pollution and congestion.

      Given that modern high speed trains are very competitive up to certain distances in particular when one considers the time it takes for check-in and security at airports it could be argued that if internal UK Flights (with sufficient rail investment)and medium distance European flights could be eliminated there might not be a need for a Heathrow 3rd. runway. Instead – spend the billions on the railways.

      I don’t know what the tax take is on road and rail diesel fuel (it could be argued to leave the tax on fuel for road freight to make rail freight more competitive.)

      For electrified rail lines some sort of subsidy towards the cost of the electricity would be required.

    277. Tom B says:

      The BBC is the tenacious glue that mires the Scottish people in stasis, paralysed, blindfold in a thick fog of misinformation, they’re a vast smoke and mirrors machine, strategically placed in every home. Bateman’s intense love affair with the BBC is incurable. BBC is a code-phrase that puts him into an altered-state and all rationality goes out either the round, triangular or square window. Bateman heavily censors commenters, as did Newsnet, as does Craig Murray, probably not all for the same reasons, but a pattern all the same, dissent but protect certain institutions, entities and persons whoever/whatever they might be, in the case of Bateman it’s the BBC, with Murray it’s the ailing rotten EU. It is therefore important we join the EU asap, as an independent country now, and retain that independent status after the EU folds. Time is not on our side.

    278. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      Tom B says 28 October at 6:46 pm

      “Bateman’s intense love affair with the BBC is incurable.”

      “BBC is a code-phrase”

      Aye Tom B.

      BBC = Big Bloody Cheque.

      Bateman et al don’t want that income stream to dry up.

      Maybe he’ll be invited on to the BBC to discuss the Separatists Billboards (for a ‘wee’ fee obviously).

      ‘Cometh the hour, cometh the man’

      Bateman’s only trying to cement his comfortable position via the work thrown to him by the BBC.

      The man cometh for the ‘fee’.

      Another Uncle Tam, bought and sold for English Gold.

    279. ian murray says:

      As was pointed out on WoS there will be a whole loss of jobs when we get independence so the BBC here and down South are enthusiastically working against Scotland’s interests

    280. CameronB Brodie says:

      Jockanese Wind Talker
      I’ve never been able to post on any site he is involved with. Perhaps he does not appreciate my stile, or lack of. Perhaps it is what I say he is unsure of. Don’t know, don’t care.

    281. CameronB Brodie says:

      Correction: I’ve not been able to post on any site he is involved with since initially being banned from News Net, then a very brief episode on his current site.

    282. CameronB Brodie says:

      Look I know he plays a roll in informing the debate but I think he’s in denial over institutional bias at the BBC.

      The clue is in the name Mr. Bateman.

    283. Tom B says:

      Jockanese Wind Talker: 28 October, 2016 at 7:18 pm

      Well probably he was a big noise of some sort there at one time, as what I’m unsure, amongst that set, but probably in the same way Fred MacAulay was regarded by some pitiable and pitiful few as a comedian, the comedy is that HE thinks he’s a comedian. I’d never heard of Derek Bateman before the year or so preceding the 2014 Independence Referendum, when he struck his indy rebel pose. When he and a gaggle of others, like BellaCaledonia were thought to be on the independence side of a very lop-sided new and old media tussle for our fact-starved minds. They gave us candy-floss to fill the void. Now it seems uncertain what side they’re on, what they’re for or against, only that they’re not really sure themselves half the time, and their propensity for dithering ineffectually while Scotland suffers defamation and peril is catching, with even the SNP first amongst the afflicted.

    284. CameronB Brodie says:

      At the end of the day, equality demands inclusion and a respect of difference. As such, I don’t think the BBC even makes it out of the starting blocks.

      The Master’s Tools Will Never Dismantle the Master’s House
      http://www.historyisaweapon.com/defcon1/lordedismantle.html

    285. yesindyref2 says:

      @CameronB Brodie
      I posted on newsnet earlier today – twice, straight up. I’ve only rarely posted, maybe 4 or 5 times this year, all of them to disagree. Politely though, maybe that’s the key?

    286. manandboy says:

      British military to re-establish on St Kilda. What Scotland thinks doesn’t count. Westminster pours contempt on Scottish sovereignty.

    287. Rock says:

      Liz g,

      “We would only ever need a UDI if our MP’s were not willing to follow our instructions”

      When did Labour, Tory and Lib Dem MPs ever follow our instructions?

      Pray tell us how we, the “sovereign” people of Scotland, can declare UDI if our MPs don’t follow our instructions.

    288. Big Jock says:

      I commented on Batemans blog. He is a great guy, witty, intelligent sharp. But he has a real blind spot for the BBC. Anyone who listens to Gms would not have to wait long to hear an anti Snp story. Then there is Call Kaye. They vet the callers to get the same 90% angry Yoons on everyday. Then there is the Rangers cover up denying that Rangers are 90% responsible for bigotry and hooliganism in Scotland.

      Then there was George Square riots by Yoons reported as 2 sides clashing. It was assault plain and simple. A 2 year old could have inteterpreted that. Then there is the sacking of Jim Spence! Did Murray make that call.

      Then there is Scotland 2014 with ex Labour leaders daughter anchoring. Then there was shipping up Southern Scots to cover the referendum. Then there was the commonwealth games. London moves to Glasgow and not one Scottish presenter on the TV shows. That was like watching my own country from abroad.Constant reference to British athletes. Yet we competed as Scotland.

      What more evidence do you need Derek.

    289. CameronB Brodie says:

      yesindyref2
      That gives me the chance to admit I made a complete bollocks on his current site. No malice was implied, it just went wrong.

    290. CameronB Brodie says:

      Intended rather than implied. I think there were probably assertions there was an agenda. Parandiod, me?

    291. yesindyref2 says:

      @CameronB Brodie
      It happens. I got banned from Bella because I disagreed with the “editor”. I’d also disagreed with Pat Kane before, guess they don’t like that there. Their loss, not mine 🙂

    292. punklin says:

      Divisive comments not helping Indy cause.

      Either you’re for Indy or against and if you’re against but might change your mind then that’s all to the good.

      Derek Bateman is smart and persuasive. Maybe sees BBC in a different light but dissing him as if he was an apologist for unionism would be self defeating.

    293. Rock says:

      punklin,

      “Derek Bateman is smart and persuasive. Maybe sees BBC in a different light but dissing him as if he was an apologist for unionism would be self defeating.”

      He is an apologist for the BBC. He has a vested interest in the BBC.

      The BBC is Scotland’s enemy number one, has always been.

      Zero doubt about that.

    294. CameronB Brodie says:

      I’ll qualify my lack of care. It is not because I think Mr. Bateman is wrong, or bad, or some sort of enemy within. I simply accept I don’t perceive the complexity of my umwelt. I try not to beat myself up about it though.

    295. CameronB Brodie says:

      I do try to make sure my umwelt is not harmful to my well being though, as I perceive it. I don’t see how that is possible if my umgebung (the British state), denies me my inalienable human rights. Bit of a problem there eh?

      “The right to development is an inalienable human right by virtue of which every human person and all peoples are entitled to participate in, contribute to, and enjoy economic, social, cultural and political development, in which all human rights and fundamental freedoms can be fully realized.” (Article 1.1, Declaration on the Right to Development)

      “The human right to development also implies the full realization of the right of peoples to self-determination, which includes, subject to the relevant provisions of both International Covenants on Human Rights, the exercise of their inalienable right to full sovereignty over all their natural wealth and resources.” (Article 1.2)

      http://www.un.org/en/events/righttodevelopment/pdf/rtd_at_a_glance.pdf

    296. CameronB Brodie says:

      I think that’s how I broke the NLP guy. 🙂

    297. Liz g says:

      Rock @ 10.54 pm
      When did we ever give them any.
      Other than on 18th Separate 2014 ??
      They followed that one!!!!

    298. Liz g says:

      Also Rock
      You little old pedantic thing you
      I am talking about instructions to do with ending the Union
      You know a Sovereignty specific one.

    299. Rock says:

      Liz g,

      “Rock @ 10.40

      But I am stating that The Scottish MP’s have the legal rights to leave Westminster taking our Soverenty with them.

      Only point is..that’s NOT… UDI .

      It’s dissolving the Treaty of the Union.

      We would only ever need a UDI if our MP’s were not willing to follow our instructions”

      And how would we declare that UDI?

      Who would do the declaring?

    300. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Rock at 6:50 pm.

      You typed,
      “And how would we declare that UDI?
      Who would do the declaring?”

      In terms of ‘business speak’, you bring to the table two problems, when what is required by the boss (us) is solutions.

      So, what solutions are you putting forward for consideration?

    301. Liz g says:

      Rock @ 6.50
      We don’t
      We don’t have to
      That’s the Whole Point.

      Why would we?
      What on earth makes you think it is an option?

    302. Jimmy D says:

      You know Rev, that it is ultimately you who holds a great deal of responsibility for the failure of the SNP to achieve a majority for the term of this parliament.

      You and of course the SNP members who appear to be both unable and unwilling to listen to reason.

      Let it be said that you were all warned and SNP-SNP vote was an utterly stupid move.

      So thanks for your contributions to this issue and of course, for the rise of the Tory opposition in Holyrood.

    303. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “You know Rev, that it is ultimately you who holds a great deal of responsibility for the failure of the SNP to achieve a majority for the term of this parliament.

      You and of course the SNP members who appear to be both unable and unwilling to listen to reason.

      Let it be said that you were all warned and SNP-SNP vote was an utterly stupid move.”

      So… what you’re saying is that if FEWER people had voted SNP they’d have got a majority? Riiiiiggghhhtt.

    304. Christian Schmidt says:

      Relax. The pro-independence majority could overrule the presiding officer or even install a new one.

      I could actually understand why the SNP wouldn’t want to take on the job again, but I’m somewhat disappointed the Greens didn’t.



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