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Wings Over Scotland


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Posted on March 29, 2022 by

…to all the pathetic, craven, cowardly excuses for politicians in both Scotland and the UK who think that they can blithely keep doing TV interviews and radio call-ins where they dodge the question of what a woman is all the way up to the next election, and thereby knowingly facilitate the criminal mutilation and sterilisation of children and the sexual abuse of vulnerable women in hospitals, prisons and rape refuges.

I am living for the day when someone in the Scottish media finds some courage from somewhere and asks Nicola Sturgeon, because she’s going to blink so fast her face might catch fire. But that phone will just keep on ringing until someone answers.

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    1. Mark Boyle says:

      John Main says:
      8 April, 2022 at 12:54 pm

      @Chas – 8 April, 2022 at 12:24 pm

      There are many reasons why nuking Russia in 1945 or afterwards was never feasible:

      1) Absence of bombs. The US did not even have a third bomb to drop on Japan. Construction of the initial test bomb and the two live bombs consumed all of the available nuclear resources. That situation persisted for several years.

      Nonsense.

      The Manhatten Project director Leslie Groves told President Truman that there would be another “Fat Man” type bomb ready for use by 19th August, with three more of the type ready in September and another three in October.

      (Source: National Security Archive Electronic Briefing Book No. 162. George Washington University. 13 August 1945.)

      https://nsarchive2.gwu.edu/NSAEBB/NSAEBB162/72.pdf

    2. Andy Ellis says:

      @ Ian Bunchedpanties @5.13 pm

      “But opening a comment with, e.g. ‘Putin’s Poodle @12.34’ is just gratuitous antagonism, designed to be offensive, and lowers the tone of discussion regardless of whatever follows in the actual comment.”

      I’m sure lots of the Putinistas, moon howling nativists, Covidiots….(so about a dozen of you) will be frothing themselves in to a lather at the very thought.

      Strange that your concern didn’t extend to charmers like Ruby calling me and a few others cunts ad nauseam before she (thankfully) disappeared up her own fundament, hopefully never to return.

      I’ve looked out my tiniest violin and I’m playing it for you all now.

      Can you hear it Ian? You seem the sensitive type….I’m sure you can…..after all you clearly have no problem with believing any old bullshit.

    3. Scott says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      8 April, 2022 at 7:10 pm

      What has the status of my own blog (which I haven’t looked at for months, and have neither the time or real technical knowledge of WordPress to bother keeping up) has anything to do with what I post here, or how often escapes me.

      https://ndls61.wordpress.com/

      How the fuck did you manage to post the shite you did on your blog without having the ability to do so?

      Do you really mean that nobody is interested in your musings?

      You lamented the fall from grace of the wee deid dug on GETTR to Rev. Stu the other day, opining that there are no blogs doing the heavy lifting any more…a clear gap in the market you choose not to fill.

      You also attacked Craig Murray as a liability to ALBA/The indy movement for his take on Ukraine (and the trans issue).

      We get it, only you and you alone can lead Scotland to independence.

      Wee man syndrome?

      Further to the franchise issue, only those whose birth is registered in Scotland should have a vote in any future referendum.
      Otherwise the whole world could ride into town for a few months, vote, then ride back out of town again.

    4. Andy Ellis says:

      @Scatt 7.38 pm

      How about taking a break from straw manning for a while? I just don’t have the time to do what lots of others who do it well have the time and knowledge to. Plenty of bloggers have pointed out that doing t well it is no small feat. I get that you have an axe to grind, but so what…it’s just your opinion. So what? If you’re do exercised about it, show us your stuff.. We’ll wait…..

      I can lament the lack of lots of things: why wold anyone with any perspective think that means I’m obliged, or even particularly interested, in filling the gap. Unlike the Dug I’m not a grifter looking for folk to buy me a bungalow. That being said, if I was to blog regularly, at least I wouldn’t post essentially the same blog post over and over again like Paul.

      Presumably I’m allowed an opinion about Craig Murray’s stances on Ukraine and trans rights? I agree with him about some things, not about others. Big whoop. Doubtless I even agree with some of the moon howlers about certain issues. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

      Straw manning doesn’t help what passes for your case. I’ve never said, nor do I believe, that I or I alone can “lead Scotland to independence”. Why would you say something so outlandish…? Ah, yes…because you’re intellectually dishonest and a bit stalkerish.

      No syndrome, just yer average guy, expressing my own views like anyone else. I get that it boils the piss of the fringe nutters in here that my views are generally those of the vast majority, but them’s the facts. Dinnae greet.

      Further to your blood and soil nationalism, I refer you (once again) to the Rev’s original twitter response of 13th July last year:

      [TRIGGER WARNING: MOON HOWLING NATIVISTS HATE BEING REMINDED THE REV THINKS THEY”RE BLLOD AND SOIL NATIONALISTS!!]

      “If you want to deny 20% of the people who live in Scotland the vote in a referendum because they were born somewhere else, we’re not on the same side. If you want their votes, fucking well persuade them. If you can’t, your case is shit.
      And stop whining that by saying this I’m trying to “shut down debate”. I have no power and no desire to stop you debating it. You can debate it all you want. I’m not reporting you to Twitter or the police. I’m just not interested.
      We debated this in 2011 and we came to the right decision. Nothing has happened that justifies abandoning that principle in my view. You can’t just disenfranchise people because you think they’ll vote the wrong way.
      ’As well as being morally wrong, it’s almost certainly self-defeating. The Scotland you’d be trying to sell people under that franchise is a very different place to the one we were advocating in 2014, and very much for the worse.
      That, of course, is true in many ways. If we got a referendum tomorrow I don’t in all honesty know if I could bring myself to campaign in it, because it’d be a *de facto* campaign for Nicola Sturgeon’s vision of a hellish, intolerant, incompetent and corrupt Scotland.
      But that’s not a decision I need to lose sleep over, because we’re not getting a referendum tomorrow, or next year, or the year after that, or the year after that.
      But I’ve officially lost any urge to even think about it, if even the people opposed to that awful vision just have a different kind of awful vision, of a country where only “ethnic Scots” have a say. Bollocks to that.”

    5. Andy Ellis says:

      @Scatt

      “Further to the franchise issue, only those whose birth is registered in Scotland should have a vote in any future referendum.
      Otherwise the whole world could ride into town for a few months, vote, then ride back out of town again.”

      Nobody has used such a franchise in any independence referendum since 1945 that I’m aware of. The majority have used inclusive franchises similar to that used for #indyref1.

      Why does Scotland – a country with advantages most countries who have fought for and gained their independence could only dream about – need to be the sole example of a country using ethnic, blood and soil criteria?

    6. Andy Ellis says:

      Something for the Putinistas:

      “Finland is hurtling towards NATO membership” Finnish MP Elina Valtonen says membership application could come as early as14th April.

      https://twitter.com/shashj/status/1512488459667382273?s=20&t=ZWVUP32nf6HgB7SZ2pYQ2w

      Sweden could be moving the same way: former Swedish PM Carl Bildt says Sweden could follow Finland:

      “For me, it is inconceivable that we would end up in a situation where the two countries come to different conclusions.”

    7. Scott says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      8 April, 2022 at 8:29 pm

      Why does Scotland – a country with advantages most countries who have fought for and gained their independence could only dream about – need to be the sole example of a country using ethnic, blood and soil criteria?

      I gave you the reason. And what are these “advantages” you speak to?

      Supremacy of Scots law is the ultimate aim of independence. Those whose birth is registered in another jurisdiction shouldn’t be given the vote in a referendum on Scotland’s independence. Nobody I know of is advocating for removal of all voting rights of those born elsewhere.

      Euref of 2016 excluded plenty of people not born in UK, so the precedent (a word you really like) exists, given it was framed as a ‘UK independence issue’.

    8. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Copying this across from earlier page, for those who may interested in seeing moving imagery of Ursula von Der Leyen.

      twitter.com/disclosetv/status/1512454953255809025

    9. Andy Ellis says:

      @Scutt 9.06 pm

      “I gave you the reason. And what are these “advantages” you speak to?”

      Yes, you did: it’s bullshit tho’ isn’t it? If “native born” Scots vote for independence in sufficient numbers, it won’t make a jot of difference if you and other regressive blood and soil nationalists disenfranchise thousands of “New Scots” , many of whom of course are pro independence. Go and do the research. Vanishingly few countries holding independence referendums have excluded the people you are proposing to disenfranchise. Independence referendums are not national elections: by definition, those voting in referendums are not “citizens” because the criteria for citzenship are decided after independence: that’s how all the recently independent states in Europe did it.

      If you can’t see how privileged Scotland is when compared to some of the countries who had to fight for their votes, you’re either disingenuous or just ill informed. All Scots had to do was put an “X” in a box. No wonder Catalans and others think we bottled it and look ascance at our political cowardice.

      Can you really see many Scottish political leaders going to jail in support of their beliefs and cause like their Catalan counterparts? THAT’S the advantage we have, and we can’t even summon the courage to rid ourselves of a failing britnat state that ripped us out of the EU?

    10. Ian Brotherhood says:

      If you can be bothered dipping briefly into the cesspool that is Twitter, this is a good one…

      twitter.com/Dan_0079/status/1512528007751213059/photo/1

    11. Robert Hughes says:

      Ian @ 9.21

      UVDL – the troll to end ’em all – looks like she just heard someone in Papua New Guinea is STILL unvaccinated .

      Her counterpart in obedient instruction – following , the vacuous Liz Truss, just announced ” the age of engagement with Russia is over ” : one could ask ” when did it begin ? ”

      Amidst the maelstrom of hysterical , bovine Russophobia there are – thank fck – some voices of sanity and , above all , honesty.

      Robin MaAlpine’s latest one of the finest examples

    12. Scott says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      8 April, 2022 at 9:37 pm

      Vanishingly few countries holding independence referendums have excluded the people you are proposing to disenfranchise. Independence referendums are not national elections: by definition, those voting in referendums are not “citizens” because the criteria for citzenship are decided after independence: that’s how all the recently independent states in Europe did it.

      Scots law.

      There is a clear border between Scotland and the rest of the world here.

      I’m already a citizen of Scotland because I was born here and my birth was registered here.

      You’re wife wasn’t so shouldn’t get a vote on this issue, no matter which way she’d vote. (I’m assuming that she lives with you in Edinburgh)

      You were the one that mentioned “advantages”, yet you won’t define them beyond ‘Catalans got jailed’. What a fanny you really are.

    13. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Robert Hughes –

      Would you happen to have a link handy?

      🙂

    14. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      I’ve been reading WOS since 2013.
      I’ve never seen so much ‘trolling’ as I have in the past few months. It all seems to come from one ‘contributor’.
      And that ‘contributor’s’ comments are becoming longer and longer. It’s now taking longer to scroll past his/her divisive ramblings.
      Please, Rev Stu, tak the buhll beh the hoarns and get rid.

    15. Ian Brotherhood says:

      I have a fairly serious (and extremely off-topic) question, and I’m asking it because one can always elicit the knowledge of others, especially when the I-Ching says it is ‘propitious’ to do so.

      Q: Why are occult forces obliged to ‘flag-up’ their atrocities?

      😉

    16. Andy Ellis says:

      @Scutt 10.08 pm

      “I’m already a citizen of Scotland because I was born here and my birth was registered here.”

      Citizens of Scotland won’t exist until we become independent. The criteria have already been set out. Nobody except a fringe of blood and soil nutters accepts your proposed criteria of only those who can prove Scots birth should get a vote. Even if people were minded to accept it, does that mean the estimated 800,000 Scots born in the diaspora get to vote? After all they’ll be eligible for citizenship, as will their children and probably their grandchildren.

      My pro independence English born wife is entitled to a vote, as is my brother in law who has lived in Scotland for 30 years and has Scottish born children. Nativists like you will lose us more support than we’d gain, just as Rev Stu said last July, quite apart from being morally wrong.

      Nobody abroad cares about Scots law, the Treaties of Union, the claim of right. They just think we should grow a pair and vote for independence. They’re less likely to recognise a bunch of blood and soil nationalists that just denied 20% of residents the right to a voice.

      Thankfully none of us will have to live in the kind of dystopian nightmare moon howlers like you would institute, because you have negligible levels of support except amongst a handful of the hard of thinking in here.

    17. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Robert Hughes (10.19) –

      Many thanks for the link.

      I”m only halfway through (and having to take frequent breaks!) but am enjoying it, cheers.

      😉

    18. Andy Ellis says:

      @Brian 10.20 pm

      Yup, “gregor” should deffo be terminated with extreme prejudice. The Cameron Brodie de nos jours. 🙂

      Still, it could be worse Hatuey and Ruby could still be posting…..

    19. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Regular readers may wish to note that Andy Ellis is now, after many months (nay years!) of going ‘over and above the proverbial’ for his country (?), showing signs that he’s been too long ‘on the same rig’, so to speak, as it were, to coin a phrase an aw that…

      As BDTT alluded to earlier, a wee fortnight onshore may well be in order.

    20. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Look in the mirror…

    21. Scott says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      8 April, 2022 at 10:51 pm

      Citizens of Scotland won’t exist until we become independent.

      Nobody abroad cares about Scots law, the Treaties of Union, the claim of right.

      All lies.

      The Claim of Right Act 1689 is still extant and gives legitimacy to the current monarchy in Scotland.

      Scots law is recognised by foreign states, otherwise the nobile officium of the Court of Session wouldn’t be asked to adjudicate on matters from time to time.

      Treaties are entered into and withdrawn from using the same mechanism the world over.

      Bonus fun fact about the withdrawl of UK from treaties entered into – all it takes to propose withdrawal from any treaty is for any MP to put forward a business motion in the House of Commons to do so.

    22. McDuff says:

      Scott 9.06
      Absolutely right. It was a fundamental mistake on AS part that he allowed people who had been in the country for twenty minutes to have a vote on our Scotland`s independence. The English vote plus EU citizens scared of their status after independence voted no which i believe robbed us of our freedom.

    23. Andy Ellis says:

      @McDuff 11.32 pm

      Nobody was robbed. The Yes movement failed to convince enough of the 80% of native born Scots, together with the pro-indy minority of “new Scots” to gain a majority. Don’t blame others for the failure of nerve of our own countrymen.

      Virtually no other country which has held an independence referendum has restricted the franchise to those who were born there, and excluded anyone else, least of all those who have lived here and contributed for years or decades. If you’re so keen on blood criteria, are you going to enfranchise all those mostly staunchly unionist Scots born in England and elsewhere?

      To quote a wise man (again, for the benefit of the hard of thinking until it sinks in)”

      “If you want to deny 20% of the people who live in Scotland the vote in a referendum because they were born somewhere else, we’re not on the same side. If you want their votes, fucking well persuade them. If you can’t, your case is shit.”

    24. Dan says:

      Seeing as Rev Stu is being quoted… A reminder that he did also mention a while back in a BTL comment over on ScotGoesPop, that tweaking the terms of residency criteria by potentially having a qualifying duration of residence prior to being enfranchised to vote wasn’t something he was adamantly against.

    25. Andy Ellis says:

      @Dan 12.06 am

      Scott:

      “I’m already a citizen of Scotland because I was born here and my birth was registered here.

      You’re wife wasn’t so shouldn’t get a vote on this issue, no matter which way she’d vote.”

    26. Scott says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      8 April, 2022 at 11:49 pm

      To quote a wise man (again, for the benefit of the hard of thinking until it sinks in)”

      I really think Andy fancies our host.

      Maybe that’s what Ian Brotherhood was alluding to earlier with his “he’s been too long ‘on the same rig’” comment?

    27. Dan says:

      @ Andy “I’m done with this place (but keep returning to it like a dog to its own vomit)” Ellis at 12.08am

      The franchise discussion was done to death last year. But so what if Scott disagrees with Rev Stu’s views on terms of residency.
      I posted what I did because you have been quoting what Stu has previously said to support your position, but have omitted to include the point that Stu was also receptive to tweaking franchise eligibility in terms of duration of residency.
      So for clarity, can you furnish us with what your views are in terms of a duration of residency criteria being implemented to restrict voting eligibility of temporary residents such as the likes of “foreign” students or short term contract workers, who just happen to be in Scotland at the time of any potential vote on determining our country’s future?

    28. Andy Ellis says:

      @Dan

      I agree with Stu that minor tweaking would be acceptable to exclude obvious temporary residents. I could even be convinced that 12 or 24 months residence is acceptable as some other referendums have used that as a criteria (though many more haven’t used ANY such criteria).

      If the Scottish government were serious about state building of course (as if!) it would do what the Catalans did and compile a specific voter register for the referendum l, separate from that for local or national elections. Catalans abroad can also register to vote, but I bet the nativists here would be pretty keen to exclude the 800,000 Scots now resident in England. Logic really isn’t the forte of the blood and soil types tho’!

    29. Andy Ellis says:

      @Scutt 12.40 am

      It won’t come as any huge surprise to those paying attention to your MO that your playground level of analysis leads with “you must fancy him”.

      Regressive homophobia and nativism all one deplorable Trumpian package.

      We see you and your other basket of deplorable mates.

    30. Breeks says:

      Robert Hughes says:
      8 April, 2022 at 10:19 pm

      Ian
      http://robinmcalpine.org/ignorance-will-not-bring-peace/

      Once again, another great article from Robin MacAlpine…

      “…But in Scotland I did expect something a bit more, a bit better, from the generally more thoughtful Scottish commentator class. I seem to have been wrong in that expectation.

      The only quibble I might have is the belief that Scotland isn’t already a victim of the same influences and influencers which readily destabilise other parts of the world for the “good” of the West.

      If an Independent Scotland threatens to become a noteable and outspoken critic of Western Foreign Policy, it will be Western Foreign Policy to “not” have an Independent Scotland.

      It might be tin-foil hat conspiracy theory, but on the other hand, perhaps it’s precisely this Western Foreign policy we have to thank for Alex Salmond’s stitch up, Sturgeon’s Wokist hijacking of Independence, the dark money influencing Scottish Elections, and a “Scottish” Media shielding Sturgeon’s betrayal of the Independence Movement from rigorous scrutiny.

      Is it reasonable to suggest the West’s penchant for a strategic regime change every now and again might have a reciprocal strategy for preventing regime change, such as preventing and oil rich Scotland from choosing an Independent Government.

      I’m not for one minute suggesting Scotland should revel in Western belligerence and advocate no-flys zones anywhere, but just that we be canny enough to realise that neither Westminster nor Washington, nor indeed NATO, are ever going to roll out the red carpet for Scottish Independence.

      It might be unpalatable for some, myself included, but within reason, there’s an expediency about Scotland being neutral and reserved in it’s outrage until it’s free of the Union and enjoying International Recognition.

      Come the day, Scotland will be seeking International Recognition from the US and Russia, not just Ukraine.

    31. John Main says:

      It’s snowing right now, so I think I will add my tuppence worth.

      All this wrangling about residence criteria misses the herd of elephants in the room.

      A competent ScotGov, excelling at everything within its remit, such as ferry provision, energy pricing fairness, law and order, Covid handling, drugs policy, openness, etc would already have raised such a head of steam for Indy that tweaking a few per centage points here and there would be irrelevant.

      All NS would have to do is say, “People of Scotland, look around you, see how much better things already are, now imagine how much better things could be”.

      We all know this.

      As things stand, NS would be drowned out by derisive laughter at the “see how much better things are” bit.

      There’s the problem right there.

    32. Republicofscotland says:

      Ian Brotherhood @9.21pm.

      Ursula von Der Leyen, President of the European Commission is a member of the Atlantic Council, the German intelligence unit the BND even has an HQ in Washington, and is frequently briefed on matters by the CIA.

      Von Der Leyen is the daughter of the notorious Ernest Albrecht of the Celle Hole false flag op.

    33. John Main says:

      @Mark Boyle 7:26 PM

      Thanks for your reply. I stand corrected on the number of fission bombs available in 1945.

      I think my other points remain completely valid though.

    34. John Main says:

      @Breeks 9:51 am

      Does it ever occur to you that an Independent Scotland might in the future be well served by the odd strategic regime change from time to time?

      Does it ever occur to you that your kind of “Scottish Exceptionalism”, which seems to manifest itself as some kind of fantasy where a rich, successful, resource-heavy, Independent Scotland will have no enemies, might be a nonsensical turn-off to pragmatic, real-world voters?

      The world’s a nasty place and getting nastier. It’s full of desperate, struggling people who are getting more desperate. The only countries that can afford to behave as if they have no strategic interests are those countries who have nothing that anybody else might want.

      Scotland will never be one of those countries.

    35. Breeks says:

      From Barrheadboy’s Twitter feed…

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFLhjEHvfmk

      French documentary from Donbas region 2016…

    36. Breeks says:

      John Main says:
      9 April, 2022 at 10:33 am

      @Breeks 9:51 am

      Does it ever occur to you that an Independent Scotland might in the future be well served by the odd strategic regime change from time to time?

      So you’re content for Scotland’s democracy and Independence to be subverted for the common good of the West and NATO?

      I’m afraid that simply makes you a useful idiot for the Unionists.

    37. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      8 April, 2022 at 11:00 pm

      @Brian 10.20 pm

      Yup, “gregor” should deffo be terminated with extreme prejudice. The Cameron Brodie de nos jours. ?

      Still, it could be worse Hatuey and Ruby could still be posting…..

      Why should Gregor be terminated and not Andy Ellis?

      Gregor is not insulting anyone not calling people names he’s not flamebaiting and he’s not a cunt.

      As far as I can see Gregor is posting new & fresh news he’s not regurgitating the same old thing over and over and over again.
      So Yup flamebaiting Andy Ellis should be the one to be terminated if only for the sake of Alba.

    38. Ruby says:

      John Main says:
      9 April, 2022 at 10:15 am

      It’s snowing right now, so I think I will add my tuppence worth.

      All this wrangling about residence criteria misses the herd of elephants in the room.

      A competent ScotGov, excelling at everything within its remit, such as ferry provision, energy pricing fairness, law and order, Covid handling, drugs policy, openness, etc would already have raised such a head of steam for Indy that tweaking a few per centage points here and there would be irrelevant.

      All NS would have to do is say, “People of Scotland, look around you, see how much better things already are, now imagine how much better things could be”.

      We all know this.

      As things stand, NS would be drowned out by derisive laughter at the “see how much better things are” bit.

      There’s the problem right there.

      Yawn! How many times has the above been posted in one form or another? Maybe you should go out and build a snowman lie in the snow make snow angels or snowballs to see if that could help you come up with something original to say. I’m wondering if you should be banned along with your mate Ellis. When it comes to originality & fresh news Gregor beats you hands down.

    39. Andy Ellis says:

      @ Rudey 10.56 am

      Gregor is just spamming the site with screeds of extraneous waffle, and using WoS as some kind of archive for reasons only he appears to know or care about. It’s the same MO as the late unlamented Spameron Brodie, who eventually tried the Rev’s patience too far. Lots of folk got fed up with Brodie too, though even then a minority of lackwits were happy to tolerate his inanities.

      The irony of you of all people objecting to being called names won’t be lost on the adults in the room, as you subject us all to yet another barely verbal tourettes addled diatribe. The difference between reasonable people positing here and engaging in actual discussion on issues, rather than posting pointless random links to extraneous conspiracy theorising about Covid, Hunter Biden and stuff nobody cares about is obvious to anyone with an IQ bigger than their shoe size, so obviously that counts you out.

      Come back when you have the intellectual height for the ride potty mouth.

    40. McDuff says:

      Andy Ellis
      So Mr Angry you prefer confronration rather than debate.
      Firstly don’t patronize me and don’t talk down to me, you might think you are on some higher intelectual plane but you are not.
      This is not the Andy Ellis site.
      Regarding eligibility for the ref vote I never stated a blanket ban on who could vote but I believe those entitled to vote should have been domiciled in Scotland for at least five years thus showing a committment to the country. I sense I hit a raw nerve with my comment, I wonder why.
      With regard to the Yes movement not convincing enough people to vote Indy I wonder where you were in the lead up to the referendum. The ENTIRE MSM relentlessly spewed out pro unionist propaganda and Indy scare stories 24/7 a daily diet of fear and lies. If that publicity had been on the side of independence the result would have been very different. To blame the the Yes movement is despicable.
      I think the Daily Record is your natural home.

    41. Andy Ellis says:

      @Breeks 10.54 am

      It appears not to have occurred to you that the majority of Scots are resolutely pro-NATO, Atlanticist and multilateralist in outlook. Much as you and a small minority of others might dislike the fact, it doesn’t make it any less true. You and others are of course free to make the argument that an independent Scotland should be neutral like Ireland or Switzerland, that it should spend little to nothing on defence.

      I doubt many people in Scotland or the movement think being part of NATO, the EU or identifying with “the west” is a bad thing. It would certainly be a brave prospectus to put before the people, particularly when it looks like Finland and Sweden are accelerating moves to join NATO. I doubt many of us will be convinced that by following our largely social democratic neighbours like Norway, Denmark and Iceland in to NATO we’re aligning ourselves with what Putin’s Poodle’s keep assuring us is “the Great Satan”.

      I suspect the line that there is some moral equivalence between the two opposing systems will be seen and remain as very much a fringe view in Scotland, but hey….fill yer boots: make the case and see how far it gets with the electorate.

      If Scots ever find the political balls to take their independence, NATO will be falling over itself to ensure we can join given our geographical and strategic situation, but if we decide not to they’ll shrug their shoulders and let us get on with it.

    42. Republicofscotland says:

      “but just that we be canny enough to realise that neither Westminster nor Washington, nor indeed NATO, are ever going to roll out the red carpet for Scottish Independence.”

      Breeks.

      Correct the trio of tragedy will never sanction Scottish independence, nor will the SNP under Sturgeon for that matter, Scotland is strategically placed in the Northern hemisphere it hosts US war heads and Westminster subs and is a first strike target in the war against Russia and China, and if by some miracle we did manage to ditch this ball and chain union and gain independence, Scotland will still be a first strike country in the eyes of China and Russia because why should they believe us that we no longer host nukes when we are as thick as thieves with the Great Satan.

      (ICAN) International Campaign to Abolish Nuclear Weapons, won the Nobel Peace Prize in 2017, NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg denounced the Nuclear Weapon Ban Treaty, the accord promoted by ICAN aimed at eliminating all nuclear weapons.

      Nato has used depleted uranium shells in Libya and Serbia, and lets not forget Nato’s part in Operation Gladio and the less well known Operation Gladio-B.

    43. Robert Hughes says:

      Breeks @ 9.51

      ” The only quibble I might have is the belief that Scotland isn’t already a victim of the same influences and influencers which readily destabilise other parts of the world for the “good” of the West.”

      It would betray a child-like naivety to believe there are not external * influencers * with an * interest * in Scotland’s affairs – specifically it’s aspiration to Independence .

      Sturgeon’s kow-towing to * Globalist * agendas eg TRANS-formations , selling off/out our enviable natural energy sources to foreign corporations and , currently , her ovine adherence to the NATO/US * Russia must die * narrative could all be seen as a reflection of this complicity .

      And we can never forget how the presence of nuclear weapons in our country plays in geo-political landscape

    44. John Main says:

      @Pubes 11:12

      “How many times has the above been posted …?”

      Plus once more, in bold, thanks to your cut-and-paste.

      Sometimes I really do wonder if you are smarter than you appear. For example, cutting and pasting my post whilst accusing me of having nothing to say could just be the most subtle of irony.

      As for your praise of Hattrick, sorry Gregs, now that one is more obviously stirring it.

      Anyways, Pubes, I’ve missed your unmissable contributions, welcome back.

      I’m off now to make a snow Sturgeon. I have a copy of her collected speeches book to place in her cold, snowy hands.

    45. Republicofscotland says:

      “Finland is hurtling towards NATO membership” Finnish MP Elina Valtonen says membership application could come as early as14th April.”

      Agent Ellis.

      Finland for your information has been contributing forces to the (NRF) Nato Response Force since a way back in 2008. It will come as a surprise to nobody if Finland joins Nato.

    46. John Jones says:

      I haven’t posted on this ( which was a wonderful site) for many months due to the shit being posted by morons, yes that’s you included Elis, fed up telling people to stop giving you air and encouraging your nonsense,
      You have called myself and others Putins Poodles, much rather be this than Boris’s bum boy like you. goodbye again!

    47. Andy Ellis says:

      @McDuff 11.23 am

      If you don’t want to be patronised, up your game and stop straw manning that I somehow think this is my site because I post responses to those who engage in topics I’m interested in, or because I’m directly answering them.

      Plenty of nativists are suggesting blanket bans and I didn’t accuse you personally of doing so. Try reserving your outrage for things people actually say not what you wrongly infer. Your lack of comprehension isn’t my fault or my problem, you nativism and regressive politics are however. Virtually no country holding a referendum on indy has imposed a 5 year residence qualification. A few have had periods of 24 months: all others used similar franchises to the #indyref1 pattern.

      Again, I didn’t blame the Yes movement. Interact with what people say, not what you’d LIKE them to have said. Doing so simply exhibits your intellectual dishonesty. Do better. The Yes campaign had lots of positive aspects as well as lots of negative ones. It never laid a glove on Project Fear, because those leading it were convinced that relentless positivity and nothing else would bring victory. Turns out they were wrong, even if it was a closer run thing than the yoons thought.

      I’m not interested in your whiny arsed fallacious judgements about the Daily Record being my natural home. An entirely hostile MSM didn’t stop support for indy increasing > 20% between 2012-14. #indyref1 failed because not enough Scots votes Yes. We weren’t robbed, we weren’t duped, we just bottled it and didn’t make a good enough case. Moving the goalposts and apeing the regressive blood and soil nationalism of Viktor Urban in Hungary and Law and Justice in Poland isn’t going to advance the cause.

    48. John Main says:

      @Republic 11:31

      “never sanction Scottish independence”

      Add logic to the list of Republic’s personal deficits then.

      Logically, if the world’s most powerful forces will never sanction Scottish independence, we are all wasting our time. “Never” is a very long time indeed.

      Ah but wait. So many of Republic’s posts actively harm Independence. Maybes this is just another spoiler from Republic. Just another nail in Scotland’s coffin as Republic pursues … whatever objective Republic is after.

      What to believe. Who to believe. It’s a scunner.

    49. Scott says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      9 April, 2022 at 11:29 am

      It appears not to have occurred to you that the majority of Scots are resolutely pro-NATO, Atlanticist and multilateralist in outlook.

      v

      I doubt many people in Scotland or the movement think being part of NATO, the EU or identifying with “the west” is a bad thing.

      —-

      Certainty followed by doubt. Well done Mr Waffle.

      As for this?

      “I doubt many of us will be convinced that by following our largely social democratic neighbours…in to NATO we’re aligning ourselves with what Putin’s Poodle’s keep assuring us is “the Great Satan”.”

      NATO is run by the Yanks for the benefit of the Yanks.

      USA is a shithole, fulla paranoid extremists fed ‘conspiracy theories about the socialists/reds/heathens/antisemites/non-whites’ 24/7 via hundreds of TV stations.

      The Yanks spend so much on their military because they fear being exposed as the regressive bunch of cunts that they are and the world should be modelled on their system.

      They mirror the English with their fragile sense of identity – ‘Why doesn’t everyone just like us?’

      War, what is it good for? Yank egos and bank balances.

      Fuck the Yanks, and fuck NATO.

    50. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      8 April, 2022 at 11:00 pm

      Still, it could be worse Hatuey and Ruby could still be posting…..

      For those who don’t know what a flamebait is this is a fine example.
      Ellis always needs someone to insult and argue with it’s all he does Ellis is a flamebaiter.
      He is unable to make a post without some smart ass name calling & abuse. If you don’t believe me you should check his previous posts.

    51. Andy Ellis says:

      @John Jones 11.42 am

      The absence of one more Putinista is surely cause for celebration rather than anything else. The BTL comments have been derailed by a small claque of fringe nutters over the past months. Unsurprisingly they are triggered by being called out for their unreason by the few remaining adults in the room.

      Don’t flatter yourself or them by believing or asserting here that you represent anything but a vanishingly small minority of cranks pushing regressive nativism, vaccine denial, and latterly shilling for Putin and shrieking inchoately about “the Great Satan”, the WEF and Hunter Biden as though it didn’t make you look like a deplorable basket of crazed QAnon refugees.

    52. Ruby says:

      John Main says:
      9 April, 2022 at 11:50 am

      Ah but wait. So many of Republic’s posts actively harm Independence. Maybes this is just another spoiler from Republic. Just another nail in Scotland’s coffin as Republic pursues … whatever objective Republic is after.

      What to believe. Who to believe. It’s a scunner.

      Yawn! You’ve said that 100s of times already!

    53. Dorothy Devine says:

      Robert , thanks for the Robin link – good stuff.

    54. Andy Ellis says:

      @scutt 11.52 am

      Feel free to come up with your counter evidence. I haven’t been able to turn up much recent polling about specifically Scottish attitudes to NATO membership, or to what an independent Scotland should choose to do, but if it were true that it was such a huge concern for Scots, or that they wanted no truck with NATO, doubtless we’d see it in the parties they vote for.

      By all means campaign with the tagline “Fuck the Yanks, and fuck NATO.” and see how much support you get. I’m thinking about the same as RISE and the SSP…if you’re lucky.

      Good luck with that.

    55. Ruby says:

      FAO Ellis & Main!

      Could you list the names of the posters you want posting here and why along with the list of those you consider to be part of the ‘claque of fringe nutters’

      Are you looking to have only posters who agree with you?

      I find this hard to believe due to your addiction to flamebaiting.

    56. Ruby says:

      Dorothy Devine says:
      9 April, 2022 at 12:07 pm

      Robert , thanks for the Robin link – good stuff.

      I have an idea! Why dont we discuss the content of Robin’s article here? Apart from the topic of this article there isn’t anything new to discuss hence the reason we are getting the same stuff repeated over and over again.

    57. Robert Graham says:

      Off whatever the topic is or was .

      A comment by sleepy JOE the US president ,he said Putin should be tried as a war criminal .

      Ok JOE and where would the trial take place and the evidence heard ?

      The only place war crimes can be tried is the International Criminal Court based in the Hague Netherlands

      Countries who do not recognise the ICC , the USA does not recognise The Rome Convention the founding principal of the ICC ,Israel & China are also missing from the signatories the latter both have questionable human rights records .

      I wonder why the USA self appointed protector of everything in the known universe not only is not a member but voted against its whole inception ,strange that eh ? .

      The USA along with the UK voted against a immediate UN inquiry into events in Ukraine again I wonder why maybe the resident cheerleaders of uncle sams antics could answer that .

    58. Andy Ellis says:

      @Robert Graham 12.40 pm

      Surely Biden is right….Putin is a war criminal and should be tried as such. Without reference to whataboutery on the crimes of others in other places, few people other than the over represented nutter fringe in here would take exception to that. It’s quite possible to support action against Putin and against those in the west people feel are guilty for war crimes.

      The ICC is the logical place, whether the US recognises it or not.

      Isn’t the problem with the international order and current UN led system that the vetos available to Security Council members is a recipe in many situations for stasis? It’s been that way since the USSR realised that the “empty chair” ploy in the 1950’s was a mistake and led to the UN voting to oppose the North Korean invasion of South Korea.

      If we’re going to advocate a neutral stance for Scotland post indy (as some in here appear to want) or support Robin McAlpine’s vision, how will that work in practical terms? Do we become a neutral like Ireland with little in the way of armed forces? Or a well armed neutral like Sweden? Or totally de-militarised like Costa Rica? Or be like Iceland: no armed forces at all, but part of NATO?

      When it comes to dealing with unpleasant regimes abroad, do we take the moral high ground and absolutely refuse to deal with at all: no trade with them, no foreign aid for their poor, or aid if they suffer humanitarian disasters? Do we sanction countries guilty of human rights abuses, oppression, or war crimes? Do we never intervene anywhere, for any reason, however flagrant the aggression or need?

      Or should we join NATO and/or the EU, imperfect as they may be? Is it better to be inside the tent pissing out, or outside the tent pissing in?

      With respect to the recent vote to exclude the Russians from the UN Human Rights Commission, which group would most Scots see an independent Scotland voting with? Look at the countries which abstained and those who supported Russia. Is that really who we are saying we want to line up with? Or do we live in splendid isolation, say “a plague on all your houses” and hope that everyone just leaves us alone?

      We could decide only to interact and trade solely with the purest of the pure politically and ideologically: only have diplomatic relations with regimes totally without blemish historically or in the present.

      That’s BOUND to work right? Scotland would be a paradise I’m sure.

    59. Andy Ellis says:

      @Rudey 12.09 pm

      “Are you looking to have only posters who agree with you?”

      Absolutely not. I think the quality would be improved if gregor’s input was excluded because it’s just wall to wall spam. The arguments for and against are the same as were had over a year ago with Spameron Brodie. The right decision was reached then: most reasonable people agreed. You aren’t a reasonable person though Ruby, you’re a tourettes addled embarrassment to the movement.

      I’m quite happy to debate with folk, even the whingers who get their panties bunched when being called out for their regressive opinions, and greet about being called nativists, moon howlers, or sentient spam as though it was the worst thing in the world. Away and grow up.

      I’d happily see a number of people stop posting, including you and skid marks on the indy movement like Putin’s Poodle, scott and a few others. I also think it’d increase the quality of discourse BTL. The idea that a collection of personality defects in a skin bag like you, the bulk of whose comments involve whingeing about me and John Main and calling us cunts, has anything of value to say will be seen by most folks for the bullshit it so obviously is.

      Your hot take on Robin’s latest piece will be fascinating, as long as readers can get past the continual references to those you dislike as cunts. Doubtless the quality of your analysis will match your limited vocabulary.

    60. Robert Hughes says:

      The divine Dorothy – yr welcome . Likewise Ian B earlier

      Good shout Ruby re yr suggestion to discuss the R MacA article , though I suspect there are * some * not amenable to any rational discussion the subject matter

    61. Robert Hughes says:

      ” of….”

    62. gregor says:

      @Andy Ellis

      Your attitude towards other members of the public /forum participants and contributors, speak volumes.

      Good luck if your stated aim is to terminate members of the public (e.g. me: a Scottish independence supporter/voter, and Wings forum member, of years).

      I value the public as an equal partner (the Scotland I know) and won’t be calling for your termination – I believe in public tolerance and open civilised discussion (thanks @Ruby, et al).

    63. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      9 April, 2022 at 1:34 pm

      @Rudey 12.09 pm

      “Are you looking to have only posters who agree with you?”

      Absolutely not.

      Evidence would suggest otherwise. You are 100% a flamebaiter.
      Any chance of you getting a new script. The one about tourettes is well past it’s sell by date. Yawn!

      Ha! Ha! Ha! Falmebaiters complaining abouts spammer! What you joke!

    64. Ruby says:

      A few corrections!

      Ha! Ha! Ha! Flamebaiters complaining about spammers! What a joke!

      I’m off to type
      ‘The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy cow’ with my eyes closed until I get it right!

    65. Scott says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      9 April, 2022 at 1:19 pm

      If we’re going to advocate a neutral stance for Scotland post indy (as some in here appear to want) or support Robin McAlpine’s vision, how will that work in practical terms? Do we become a neutral like Ireland with little in the way of armed forces? Or a well armed neutral like Sweden? Or totally de-militarised like Costa Rica? Or be like Iceland: no armed forces at all, but part of NATO?

      —-
      Make hay, not war.

      I know you think that the Claim of Right Act 1689 is worthless in the modern day, but it absolutely isn’t, as it gives legitimacy to the monarchy in Scotland.

      It contains the following clause.

      By levying or Keeping on foot a standing army in tyme of Peace without Consent of Parliament which army did exact localitie free and dry quarters

      The precedent exists for not having a full-time army in Scotland, much like the precedent of not having a full-time Parliament.

      Who should Scotland be afraid of on independence that requires large armed forces or NATO membership and the associated costs?

      Fuck the Yanks, fuck NATO, fuck their cheerleaders.

      Vote for peace, not constant fear.

    66. Dorothy Devine says:

      Good luck with that Ruby – I never mastered it and still regularly lose the “b”.

    67. Andy Ellis says:

      @Robert Hughes 1.35 pm

      The idea that folk like Putin’s Poodle, Tourette’s Ruby, gregor the spammer etc. are interested in, still less capable of, rational discussion on that or any other matter is for the birds. Folk are of course fully entitled to a worldview that rests on the USA and western democracies being the Great and Little Satans, to fluffing their conspiracy theories about MMS Russophobia, the need to de-nazify and neutralise the Ukraine, or the dangers of Covid vaccination, of why Hunter Biden’s emails are worth countless posts in here, but lets not try and fool ourselves they represent anything but a tiny minority of folk in Scotland or in the movement.

      Robin McAlpine’s pieces are always worth reading and engaging with. And what response have we had here? Scott droning on about how the Claim of Right is still relevant and advocating total demilitarisation and a part time parliament, finishing off with:

      “Fuck the Yanks, fuck NATO, fuck their cheerleaders.” as though that’s going to bring mainstream Scots voters flocking to the indy cause.

      An yet some of the moon howlers get their panties in a twist because I mock their inanities, their pep lips stuck out far enough to be used as an additional limb because a bad man called them a name and made fun of them.

      I’m sure we’ll be waiting for answers to some of the questions posed in response to McAlpine’s piece and Robert Graham’s call for a discussion of the issues from the usual suspects as we got to Rev Stu’s critique of the deeply flawed nativist prospectus. None of them actually HAVE any cogent arguments or analysis, just sophomoric references to *the Great Satan*, and false moral equivalences with no realistic alternatives.

      Obviously Scott’s vision of the good life where we’re self sufficient and live in some latter day camp of the saints is about as realistic as the Soviet’s promised utopia or the idea that unfettered capitalism will lead via trickle down economics to a New Jerusalem.

      There is definitely a case to be made for a post indy alternative to NATO, the EU etc. I wouldn’t trust some of the unreasoning Putinistas and nativists in here to articulate anything more cogent than repeatedly calling me and John Main cunts to be honest: it’s about their level.

    68. Republicofscotland says:

      Robert Graham @12.40.

      Good comment with interesting info, The Great Satan (US) imposed sanctions on the (ICC) and its members when the (ICC) investigated US warcrimes, the Great Satan reserves the right to invade the (ICC) and rescue any US citizen or ally that it deems appropriate to do so. Needless to say after the menacing of the (ICC) officials by the Great Satan all investigations into US warcrimes were were dropped.

      The Kuala Lumpur War Crimes Commission in 2011 found Tony Blair and George W. Bush guilty of warcrimes, and crimes against humanity unlike the Hague which is just a Western tool, both convicted men remain at large.

    69. Republicofscotland says:

      Christ to think I used to have respect for Horse Box Mike Russell, here he mumbles on about how the consequences of Brexit is all the fault of Westminster and dark Russian money, the latter is a new one to me.

      Russell talks about possible food shortages, and 25 mile queues of lorries at Kent as if it was inevitable that Scotland MUST somehow suffer because of the English government and its people wanted Brexit.

      The reality is that Russell and his boss Sturgeon strung Scots along for years that they’d hold an indyref if England dragged Scotland out of the EU we now know it was all lies and those lies have been coming thick and fast ever since.

      The indy carrot is being dangled just that little bit closer these days with the council elections on the horizon, once the election are over the carrot will be put back in its box, until Sturgeon needs those who still believe in her to vote for her party again.

      https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenational.scot%2Fpolitics%2F20057044.scotland-cannot-afford-part-tory-labour-uk%2F

    70. Scott says:

      @Andy Ellis

      Hunter Biden’s laptop was dismissed as ‘Russian disinformation’ by the New York times.

      I’m grateful to Gregor for posting about it, because our own MSM seem to have a problem with relating what was going on in Ukraine to what is going on in Ukraine. eg ‘biolabs’ funded by the Yanks.

      Your analysis of MSM is “for the birds” or pure contradiction for the alert readers among us.

      You consistently say that the Media didn’t influence the referendum in 2014 AND also that the MSM was totally hostile towards independence.

      Further,

      You claimed on GETTR to have left the SNP to join ALBA.

      You claimed on GETTR that you resigned from SNP because of policies you disagreed with.

      You claimed on here that you resigned from SNP because of their treatment of ‘Grousebeater’.

      You denied that the Nazi battalion in ‘the Ukraine’ (sic) existed and also that they do but aren’t representative of anything at all.

      You offer no counter position other than gainsaying.

      You come here looking for an argument, but just end up getting hit on the head lessons because you are a fool. You know it, I know it.

      [You are also on thin ice with your personal attacks. Tourette’s syndrome is disabling for many, so you are liable to sink into the realms of hate crime if you don’t desist. You also attacked me for having MS by implying that I must have neuro-psychiatric issues, a hate crime against a disabled person. I chose not to involve the police because I’m not a cunt, others might not be so lenient in their approach.]

    71. Republicofscotland says:

      “AN urgent four-nations summit should take place to consider how to respond to “hardship” in the food sector linked to the Ukraine crisis, Scotland’s Rural Affairs Secretary has said.

      Mairi Gougeon said Russia’s invasion of Ukraine has had a “significant impact” on the UK’s food supply chain.”

      Sometimes I wonder if these people are inept or just completely stupid to the facts, one of which is of course the Great Satan (US) rolling nukes up to Russia’s border after the 2014 coup of Ukraine was going to eventually lead to Russian retaliation, and all the consequences that have come with it, including food shortages, but then again the Great Satan doesn’t give a toss about Europe (Victoria Nuland is on record saying so) nevermind the UK when it comes to shortages.

      In saying that the UK government doesn’t give a toss about its population either or it wouldn’t have severely damaged its own economy by voting for Brexit, of which the effects are really beginning to bite now. As for Scotland, we are just a trailer being dragged along behind the UK lorry, wherever it goes no matter the terrain we follow and our own government at Holyrood appears fine with that, so excuse me for not getting all teary eyed when any SNP mouthpiece starts complaining about food shortages or fuel shortages etc, for they could’ve done something about years ago but chose not to.

      https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenational.scot%2Fnews%2F20057366.ukraine-crisis-urgent-four-nations-talks-food-security%2F

    72. Republicofscotland says:

      I see Susan Aitken the head of the SNP in my home town of Glasgow is pushing her council election agenda in the Sturgeon fanzine the National for re-election.

      There is of course no mention of the huge rise in child poverty, or the rise in homelessness in Scotland, or the massive drug related deaths for years now, or indeed that Scotland has the highest rate of incarcerations of prisoners in Western Europe.

      Nor is there any mention of the city council pleading with Westminster to charge Scots more for petrol or diesel to push their mythical zero-carbon emissions policies.

      However Aitken has nice wee carrot to dangle with 80,000 gift cards worth £110 to hard-pressed Glasgow families, to be given out over the next couple of weeks.

    73. Robert Hughes says:

      Andy Ellis

      It is , of course , in the realm of hypotheticals until such times as we are Independent , on that basis ….

      My preference would be akin to Ireland’s position , though possibly with a more emphatic rejection of NATO/US and the Military Industrial Complex bellicose hypocrisy that underpins it . In this I agree with Scott above

      How about being heroic in the pursuit of peace , strong in honest self-examination and honourable in foreign and domestic policy . The latter – ideally , including a radical decentralisation of power , with the concomitant increase in- real economic/political – power to the regions of Scotland ?

      In short ….daring to be different .

      Idealistic ? Of course it is . One thing is certain though , continuing to plough the same barren furrow of endless conflict , demonising others for the same affronts to civilised human relations we ourselves inflict on others , will lead to the destruction of the only home we all truly share .

      The astonishing blue pearl that is Earth

    74. Republicofscotland says:

      As in last May’s parliamentary elections where the SNP called for voters to give them both votes, that, we all knew would lead to multiple unionists being elected, so the SNP is calling on voters to do the same with the council elections.

      Sturgeon isn’t interested in independence nor other indy parties that are seeking Scottish independence.

      “Alba’s general secretary, Chris McEleny, said he was “bitterly disappointed to see the SNP are actively encouraging their supporters not to vote for other pro-indy parties”.

      “Considering this is STV, this will actively help get Unionists elected,” he added.”

      https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenational.scot%2Fnews%2F20057051.snp-criticised-scottish-council-election-advice-given-voters%2F

    75. Dorothy Devine says:

      Robert , round of applause from me!

    76. Breeks says:

      Apologies to be referring you to the great Propagandists, but this summary of Labour’s demise in Scotland by Labour’s own, makes for some poignant reading…

      ”…It was supposed to be about the great and the good selecting the brightest and the best but what it actually did was deny the chance for a whole lot of very talented and accomplished people, including a number of sitting MPs, from actually even putting themselves forward for selection.

      The irony is, prior to their defeat, I think it was the Labour Party who were deluded and the electorate was uncommonly rational for once. With Sturgeon’s SNP, I think the politicos are similarly deluded and out of touch, but unfortunately, I’m not sure I’m seeing signs of a refreshingly rational electorate. There are a lot of clapping seals out there…

      It’s a strange feeling I have that the end of Labour in Scotland was something organic, whereas the plight of the SNP feels contrived and orchestrated. There is something dreadfully “weird” and troubling about the SNP abandoning Independence to pursue GRA reform and self-ID. It feels artificial.

      I think the SNP will go the way of Labour, but I think it’s early days in the process and voter’s inertia is on their side…. For now.

      I wasn’t particularly political growing up, but time and time again, you wondered how Scotland could vote for these Labour charlatans time after time. What was wrong with these people???

      I hope I’m wrong, and ALBA does well at these Council Elections, but I’m not sure I have a good handle on the mood of the electorate.

      I know the likes of WeeGingerDug types are an easy target and not a reliable yardstick, but if you somehow rolled out that degree of deluded blinkered stupidity across the wider electorate, Sturgeon could dye her hair red, white and blue, channel Margaret Thatcher while dressed up like Britannia bursting YES balloons with her trident, and people are still gonna vote for her.

      I’m not saying this as a condemnation of ALBA, far from it, I actually think ALBA is getting a lot of things right, but it’s barely a year old, and there’s a lot of inertia still to be overcome amongst the “little” people who generally don’t give a shit about politics.

      To be honest, I’d rather the Council Elections were past, and ALBA were free and focussed upon pursuing the Constitutional route to a Plebiscite UK General Election. This local election stuff feels like a phoney war and anything could happen.

    77. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Breeks (5.58) –

      Thanks for that link. A gallery of throbbers to be sure.

      Won’t be that long before we see similar articles with quotes from current SNP heid yins. Sweeney is our very own Jack McConnell, looks as if he expects to be collared at any moment.

      Hard to imagine Sturgeon even giving such retrospectives the time of day, say, a decade hence – she’ll be too busy sorting out Africa or suchlike.

    78. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      9 April, 2022 at 2:54 pm

      @Robert Hughes 1.35 pm
      The idea that folk like Putin’s Poodle, Tourette’s Ruby, gregor the spammer etc. are interested in, still less capable of, rational discussion on that or any other matter is for the birds.

      plus a further 400 words all just sayng the same stuff that he regurgitates every time he posts here. You’ll note he made no comment about the Robin Mcalpine piece.

      He did however remind you for the thousand time that someone called him a cunt!

      It’s good of him to post this information so regularly just incase there is someone left here who still hasn’t recognised the fact that he is infact a cunt.

      He always needs to have a mate so he is claiming John Main was also called a cunt which is a utterly untrue.

    79. John Main says:

      @Republic 3:23 pm

      “ Satan rolling nukes up to Russia’s borders “

      As usual, Republic’s obsessive urge to post lies is exposed with a few seconds of research.

      European countries hosting US nuclear weapons are Turkey, Germany, Holland, Italy and Belgium.

      Somebody should tell Putin that far from NATO rolling nuclear weapons up to Russia’s borders, he is trying to roll Russia’s borders up to the nukes.

      I would nominate Republic to tell him, but as an accomplished bare-faced liar, Putin will immediately recognise a kindred spirit and discount everything Republic says.

    80. John Main says:

      @Andy Ellis

      The Republic of Ireland’s long-held and cherished neutrality is melting like snow of a dyke as the realpolitik of EU membership modifies the attitudes of its citizens.

      The times they are a-changing.

      Maybes it has something to do with increasing prosperity. The more you have, the more other people or other countries will strive to take it off you.

      Regarding somebody’s idea that an independent Scotland will have a part-time militia. I think that is a fair description of the Jacobite army in 1745-46. I know Scottish education has taken a few blows under the SNP, but even so, most readers here will already know how that worked out.

    81. John Main says:

      @Pubes 6:27

      I recall you calling me TAF a few times.

      I checked that out, it stands for Tactical Air Force, so I was pleased, honoured, and maybes just a wee bit humbled.

      I assume you were referring to my ability to deliver a devastating payload of destructive argument with pin-point accuracy when called on at short notice 🙂

    82. John Main says:

      @Breeks 5:56 pm

      A lot of ordinary voters are seeing blokes competing in women’s swimming and cycling and asking WTF?

      Doesn’t take much to start an avalanche when conditions are right.

    83. Ruby says:

      John Main says:
      9 April, 2022 at 7:11 pm

      @Pubes 6:27

      I recall you calling me TAF a few times.

      Did anyone call you a cunt or is Andy Ellis making shit up again.

      The only air force that I would associate with you is the air that comes out or you erse and smells fuckin’ awful!

      Did you actually go onto the internet to looking about the meaning of TAF?

    84. Ruby says:

      John Main says:
      9 April, 2022 at 7:16 pm

      @Breeks 5:56 pm

      A lot of ordinary voters are seeing blokes competing in women’s swimming and cycling and asking WTF?

      Doesn’t take much to start an avalanche when conditions are right.

      How does the above connect to what Breeks posted? Why do you think people are voting for the SNP? It could be argued that a lot of ordinary voters want to see blokes competing in women’s swimming and cycling and that is why the SNP are so popular.

    85. John Main says:

      @Pubes 8:08

      Check out the rumours about Gary Lineker’s farts.

      Maybes he’s not the only one.

    86. Ruby says:

      John Main says:
      9 April, 2022 at 8:30 pm

      @Pubes 8:08

      Check out the rumours about Gary Lineker’s farts.

      Maybes he’s not the only one.

      Why so reluctant to answer my question about folk voting for the SNP & GRA?
      Are folk who vote for the SNP 100% in favour of GRA? Should we take from recent polling that Scotland is a country of misogynists. I haven’t heard either you or your pal Ellis saying much about GRA.

    87. Republicofscotland says:

      Main @6.51pm.

      The US planned on taking over the Russian naval base at Sevastopol in Crimea, twice a Gallup poll was carried to find out how the people of Crimea felt about themselves if they felt Ukrainian or Russian, they answered Russian.

      The US and the Ukrainians resorted to violence against the people of Crimea in the hope that they would change their minds, this of course led to a referendum where Crimean’s voted to be ruled by Moscow.

      The US then commissioned another poll by Gallup, and this was the findings of that poll.

      “When Gallup did their “Public Opinion Survey Residents of the Autonomous Republic of Crimea May 16-30, 2013” (which was called that because even when Crimea was part of Ukraine, it had a special status, as being an “Autonomous Republic” — not a province), only 15% (slide 8) of Crimeans viewed themselves as “Ukrainian,” but 40% said “Russian,” and 24% said “Crimean.” 53% (slide 14) wanted Crimeans to be part of the “Customs Union with Russia, Belarus and Kazakhstan,” but only 17% wanted Crimeans to be part of “The European Union.” 68% (slide 15) said their feelings toward “Russia” were “warm,” but only 6% said their feelings toward “USA” were “warm.”

      If it had gone Ukraine’s way the as I said US nukes would now be in place at the Sevastopol naval base.

    88. Republicofscotland says:

      The Great Satan’s plot to oust Pakistan’s PM Imran Khan finally works, Khan would not allow US bases on Pakistan soil, nor would he toe the line on Russia.

      Khan named the US official who warned the Pakistani envoy to the US, Asad Majeed, that there would be “implications” if Khan survived the no-trust vote in the National Assembly, the lower house of the parliament.

      Khan named Donald Lu, the top American official dealing with South Asia in the US State Department, as the person involved in the ‘foreign conspiracy’ to topple his government.

    89. Scott says:

      So-called ‘New Scots’, the franchise and a heffalump.

      When Scotland gains its independence, those born anywhere but Scotland will be subject to the law of the country of their birth wrt nationality, citizenship and elephants.

      eg* WM will have to amend its legislation, thus affecting those born in Wales, Northern Ireland, England and any of those other Crown thingmies that Scotland has a part share in.

      *other countries won’t need to.

      And that’s why only Scots should get a vote in any future referendum.

      If residents want to apply for dual-nationality or dual-citizenship they’ll be able to.

      They’ll get to vote in the first Governments at national and local level, if they qualify to do so, as now.

      If that perfectly logical stance isn’t acceptable then you aren’t seeking the independence of Scots law, only a ‘dream form’ of independence from or dependence on Westminster.

    90. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Had a brief chat with a real independence activist this afternoon – someone all wingers know – who has been out and about now that ‘the bug’ appears to have subsided.

      If what he told me is accurate, the SNP will ‘win’ the May elections, but the word ‘Pyrrhic’ will be in headlines on May 8th.

      Veteran SNP activists will be voting with their feet.

      ‘I didn’t leave the SNP, the SNP left me.’ is what’s coming in the early-morning analysis which no-one will bother to wait up for.

    91. Confused says:

      Scott, kudos for “taking out the trash” of late; it’s a dirty job. The enemy are persistent and unembarrassed by their repetition.

      – but I notice in your posts a strong belief in “Scots Law”; not being a lawyer, being cynical of the law, I see indy as a chance to “rip it up and start again”.

      Clue me in on why Scots Law is so brilliant, how it can get us to independence and what needs to be improved. Do it quick, before the golf starts.

      – how do the Salmond, Murray, REV cases fit into this?

    92. Scott says:

      @Confused

      Golf is a waste of a good walk.

      Watching it on the telly is the waste of a good sit down.

      If you think that abolishing the nobile officium is a good idea with your ‘rip it up and start again’ then you’re either a fool or a fool.

    93. Confused says:

      – that’s a Churchill quote and has no credibility with me; the man had the “yips” and a weak grip. He could never experience the sublime pleasures of the greatest game in the world.

      Care to venture any more “skin on the bones”?

      Being ignorant of the law, I assumed it “mostly worked, fine”, then I took an interest in the Amanda Duffy murder and ever after watched Findlay closely; that was my first WTF-moment about the law, not the last. The more I learn about it, the lower my opinion becomes.

      Been a juror, twice; bit of a pantomime, bit of a spin of the tombola at the end.

      Represented myself in court once – got a “result” but my advice is – don’t do it.

      Had a couple of civil cases (successful) but the whole process leaves a bad taste.

      The idea of the use of Scots Law, however magnificent, as a constitutional weapon against the union seems fanciful. The establishment of a UK Supreme Court seems like a clear breach of the union treaty – but no one seemed to give a shit about this, not even the Scots Lawyers. “Constitutional Lawfare” might draw some blood, but that is all, especially if it can establish whether we are a “colony” or an “equal partner in the union” – it is the ambiguity which kills, allowing the UK to play it both ways as fits.

      Many years ago, as only a child I remember a man on the television, some historian/academic saying – “of course the terms of the treaty have been breached MANY MANY TIMES …” and I just assumed we would become independent within a couple of years, some 40 years ago.

      The problem, as I see it, is that “the law” gets selectively applied, depending on who you are; there is enough law to “hang us all” and gets used mainly to pick up people and “throw them agains the wall”, to teach them a lesson.

      “the law” is a tool of the establishment, which is unionist. Or can I get down to RS McColl and pickup a lawpack for “dissolution of treaty”?

    94. Ruby says:

      Ian Brotherhood says:

      ‘I didn’t leave the SNP, the SNP left me.’ is what’s coming in the early-morning analysis which no-one will bother to wait up for.

      Not only will I not be waiting up for the result I won’t even bother voting unless there is a gender criticial candidate.

      What are SNP voters hoping to achieve?

      I have zero respect for SNP voters and politicians.

      Just read the following posted by one of these misogynistic freaks who like to wear ladies knickers!

      ‘support your sister not just your cisters’

      Fuck you SNP voters!

    95. Scott says:

      @Confused

      “the law” is a tool of the establishment, which is unionist. Or can I get down to RS McColl and pickup a lawpack for “dissolution of treaty”?

      I refer you to the comment I posted some time ago.

      https://wingsoverscotland.com/this-is-a-message/comment-page-2/#comment-2689273

    96. Confused says:

      Scott – yes I read that comment, shut up the local loudmouth pretty good.

      The law society webpage describes nobile officium as a kind of multi use “sonic screwdriver” of the law. So who gets to use it? How and when. What button do we press? You make it sound so easy, I hope you are right.

      – I like your style but I think people would just start laughing if you really tried to do it.

      Wasn’t there an attempt to dissolve the union in the house of lords, sometime around when the dinosaurs roamed?

    97. Scott says:

      Anyone can raise an action for remedy in the Court of Session.

      The ‘noble officium’ is the ultimate arbiter in both the civil and criminal Supreme Court.

      ‘It’ has the power to issue any order deemed necessary.

      You’d abolish that and ‘not proven’ for reasons…?

      [Not proven means exactly the same as not guilty, but the directions given to the jury by the judge is never tacked on to the argument at any point for those in opposition to its existence.]

      No strawmen were harmed in the making of this comment.

    98. Robert Hughes says:

      Thanks Dorothy . Good night to you , and ALL WOS contributors , even those I don’t agree with .

      Few drams down the line …. but lets never forget , beyond all our disagreements about this n that ( n that n this n THAT n while we’re at it THIS , aye , n ….. Christ Almighty we’re geniuses at fawin oot ) we have one thing we all ( miraculously , lol ) agree on ….

      The restoration of our status as an independent nation . THAT we agree on

      Just noticed the time/date …10th April …..* several * years ago on this date I was being born , in my mother’s bed , being strangled by the umbilical cord , saved from the drunk midwife’s incapacity by the timely ( literally life-saving ) arrival/intervention of our local GP …..

      METAPHOR ALERT !!

      Scotland’s ( re ) birth is proving similarly * difficult * : also similarly , it will emerge – red in the face , gasping for air , besieged heart pounding …..victorious

    99. Scott says:

      @Robert Hughes

      Hoppy Birdy. You don’t look a day over.

      The Miracle of Birth can literally be just that, even when left entirely to the qualified. [Monty Python’s Meaning of Life was on its opening USA run on this day in 1983]

      The number one singles in the UK on this day since the year of the moonhowler landings of 69 (I was inspired to take a stab in the dark for a year range) are of varying quality imho.

      Save Your Kisses For Me gave me the boak every time I heard it in 1976, even though I was only 3 years older than a 3-year-old. I’m with Cllr Spear when it comes to UK & Eurovision. ‘Royaume-Uni, Nul points’ is my next tattoo.

      Bridge Over Troubled Water from 1970 is fantastic, but not the best song on the album (my 2nd favourite, since I was 3), that honour going to The Boxer AND El Condor Pasa (If I Could).

      Going Underground from 1980 is superb, yet one that seems spoken of only underground among ‘the Jams’, wherever that is, and whoever they are…

      1982 gave us Seven Tears by the Goombay Dance Band; a classic, but I think poor taste/bias brought its 3 weeks at the top to an end, days into the Falklands issue, as the following week Bucks Fizz/Fucks Bizz replaced them with My Camera Never Lies (obvious bollocks, because pin hole cameras think everything is upside down.)

      78’s Matchstalk Men & Matchstalk Cats & Dogs is fantastic in its simplicity, even though Lowry’s paintings are not very good, and I highly recommend not equating the song with St Winifred’s School choir, for obvious reasons, even though they sang on it. Singing along to drown them out is therapeutic. Ally Mcleod-o, Ally McLeod-o.

      I know that posting at this time of the morning is frowned upon by some with fair hair and unfeasibly large foreheads who like/demand to be called by their name, so I’ll pop off and ‘play you out’ with this drivel (there’s a wide choice) from 1991.

      The One and Only – Chesney Hawkes

      I was going to attach £5 to this comment as a present for you Robert, but I’d already pressed the Submit Comment button.

    100. Effigy says:

      Trans killer identifying as baby in Scots jail, demanding nappies & blended food https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/scottish-news/8687957/trans-killer-identifying-baby-scots-prison?utm_source=whatsapp&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sharebarweb

      What if a murderer identifies themselves as the prison governor?
      Can they order the release all the other inmates.

      These self identifiers demands get more absurd every day.
      Time for governments to identify as having a clue!

    101. Breeks says:

      I don’t know a lot about Scots Law, nor indeed how bastardised the concept of Scots Law has become, particularly these last few decades, but if you want one reason for Scots Law to matter, let it be that Scot’s Law is specifically recognised in the Treaty of Union, and thus, an important component of Scotland’s pre-Union Constitution is formally recognised in the Union Treaty.

      There are a whole series of arguments and precedents which disprove Unionist assertions that Scotland was extinguished in 1707, but the protected and independent Constitution of Scots Law recognised by Articles 18 and 19 of the Treaty of Union provides incontrovertible proof that Scotland was not extinguished.

      For the simplest of examples, for Scot’s Law to exist, it requires a Scottish jurisdiction, in other words, a Scottish Realm must exist for Scots Law to rule in.

      Thus the Treaty of Union, literally in it’s own text, affirms the survival at least of some Scottish Constitutional principles, and destroys the assertion that Scotland was extinguished.

      It’s not that Scotland needs proof it wasn’t extinguished, but the protected status of Scots Law is the Treaty of Union’s is tacit admission that Scotland the Realm, and Scotland’s Constitution still exist and survived the “unification” process.

      When you have a realm where Scots Law governs and English Law doesn’t, and a Realm where English Law governs and Scots Law doesn’t, you obviously have recognised territories, recognised jurisdiction and of course, a recognised border… all Constitutional “proofs”.

      You cannot have a Scots Law without a Scots land, so next time you hear a Unionist claiming Scotland was extinguished, ask him to explain the context of Articles 18 and 19 of the Union Treaty which recognise the Nation of Scotland remains extant.

      Articles 22 and 23 are similar… Scottish Peers will have the same privileges as English Peers. So what defines a Scottish Peer if not Scotland, and an English Peer if not England? To claim the Nations of the UK were extinguished in 1707 is patently ridiculous because the Treaty of Union acknowledges they were not in it’s own written text.

    102. gregor says:

      @Scott, et al

      You’ve got more integrity and ability than @Andy Ellis (x 1 billion).

    103. Alf Baird says:

      Breeks @ 7:35 am

      “When you have a realm where Scots Law governs and English Law doesn’t”

      Scots Law governs?

      In colonialism there exists two psychical cultural realms in which the native elites assimilate into the colonizer’s dominion and protect their interests, holding to their ‘values’ etc.

      “A national culture under colonial domination is a contested culture whose destruction is sought in systematic fashion. This cultural obliteration is made possible by the negation of national reality, by new legal relations introduced by the occupying power, by the banishment of the natives and their customs to outlying districts by colonial society, by expropriation, and by the systematic enslaving of men and women.” (Frantz Fanon).

    104. Ruby says:

      Effigy says:
      10 April, 2022 at 6:15 am

      These self identifiers demands get more absurd every day.
      Time for governments to identify as having a clue!

      Governments aren’t going to get a clue if people keep voting for them. I get the feeling it is not widely appreciated just how angry women are. I was going to say it would be interesting to have a poll for women only to gauge how they will vote in May.

      One of the many things that makes me very angry is we can’t have a poll for women only ‘cos that would be transphobic & nobody knows what a woman is.

      Women being eliminated is a huge deal and will have massive impact on the independence vote.

      Weirdly nobody here wants to talk about that!

      Stu keeps posting gender critical articles but posters are more interested in the Ukraine war than they are in the elimination of women.

      Anyone who says ‘trans women are women’ lose all credibility as far as I’m concerned with the result that anything the SNP/Greens say will just be ignored. It’s not a good position for them to be in when trying to sell independence.

      As it stands the Tories seem to have more of a clue than SNP/Greens re women’s rights!

    105. Robert Hughes says:

      Scott@ 3.54

      Hahahaha , cheers mate – I note you were up even later than me !

      Chronologically , my , somewhat dramatic , bday was closest to S n G’s classic album and I agree with yr assessment – The Boxer is a fantastic song , though the title track is * pretty * good too :likewise Going Underground , the Jammies best I’d say, though for sheer Euro naffness the Goombay’s * classic * is right up there .Not sure where ” there ” is though

      I’ll spend your virtual fiver on an equally virtual hair a the dug , * later * .Thanks again 🙂

    106. Ruby says:

      Effigy says:
      10 April, 2022 at 6:15 am

      Trans killer identifying as baby in Scots jail, demanding nappies & blended food

      These self identifiers demands get more absurd every day.
      Time for governments to identify as having a clue!

      What would be the argument against giving this person baby food & nappies if other prisoners are getting ladies panties, bras wigs & makeup?

      I reckon with regard to absurd demands you aint seen nothing yet.

    107. John Main says:

      @Gregs 8:40

      That’s what we call an “ad hominem” attack.

      It shows a lack of ability on the part of the attacker to constructively engage with or counter any of the target’s arguments.

      Perhaps you are simply channeling your inner Hattrick, Gregs. Nevertheless, you disappoint me. Maybes you need to serve out a bit more time on the “Silence” thread to prove your worth.

    108. Andy Ellis says:

      @Robert Hughes 3.48 pm

      I agree with one of the other posters that a round of applause is in order for your comment. It’s a fine vision. Sad to see that – despite those calling for analysis of McAlpine’s piece – BTL comments didn’t really reach escape velocity and amplify your stirring comment or present anything meaningful of their own apart from more boreathon’s about Scots law.

      The “super-Ireland” alternative you propose is a fine vision, and there’s definitely a place for idealism, I just wonder how it would work in practice I suppose, or how much support it would command post independence when it came to the first post independence government “setting out its stall” of what the early days of a better nation should look like?

      Any new government is going to have to convince a majority of the electorate of what the best “stance” is on foreign and defence/security policies. In earlier discussion here I’d voiced support for a defensive association with Nordic neighbours, but given that some of them are in NATO and some aren’t it might be a difficult sell.

      It would seem to me that a prospect of the realisation of the kind of radical approach you seek is much more likely in collaboration with more progressive small social democracies like Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Finland and Iceland (and Ireland too) than with the USA and “others”. Building a group with enough “clout” in international terms – both economically and politically – to really make a difference and force the pace of change in how things are done now won’t be easy of course.

      I’m not sure how ready people in Scotland are to reach for the radical vision you outline, but it is a fine aim. Whether post independence people “vote for safety” and opt for what they know and think will be safer based on their view of history, like joining NATO and the EU remains to be seen.

      It’s a shame there aren’t more people with vision in leadership positions in the movement: I honestly don’t see them in the current generation. Perhaps we’ll be luckier with the next generation?

    109. Breeks says:

      Alf Baird says:
      10 April, 2022 at 9:33 am

      Breeks @ 7:35 am

      “When you have a realm where Scots Law governs and English Law doesn’t”

      Scots Law governs?

      I get your point Alf, but all I meant was by referring to Scots and / or English Laws, Peers etc, the Treaty of Union is itself confirming there is Constitutional distinction.

      For example, I’ll repeat that Scottish Peers are to have the same rights as English Peers, and thus, a Constitutional distinction is codified in the Treaty… Scots Peers and English Peers are not the same thing.

      If they were, if the Treaty of Union had extinguished the Scottish and English Nations to the point they no longer existed, (and that’s what many BritNats contend), then the Treaty of Union would simply have said all “British” Peers have the same rights. But it didn’t. It referred to Scottish Peers and English Peers as dissimilar entities, and thus there simply has to a “Constitution” defining what a Scot is, and a dissimilar constitutional definition of what an English person is.

      Thus the text of the Union Treaty “inadvertently” recognises that Scotland and England are Constitutionally dissimilar, and consequently, Scotland’s pre-Union Constitution, complete with Sovereignty of the people, was NOT extinguished in 1707.

      Obviously, many of us Constitutionally alert Scots already knew that, but it’s nice to see it affirmed in the Treaty of Union’s actual text.

    110. Ruby says:

      John Main says:
      10 April, 2022 at 10:31 am

      @Gregs 8:40

      That’s what we call an “ad hominem” attack.

      Does the we stand for you and Ellis?
      What is Ellis’s argument? All he seems to be saying is all the posters on this forum are thickos with the exception of you and him. How do you engage with that shit?

      He always needs a mate to back him up and you are the idiot who is giving him that support.

      I would say that’s a pretty fair assessment from Gregor.
      But I suppose being that you are only here to flamebait you wouldn’t see that.

    111. Robert Hughes says:

      Ruby says:
      10 April, 2022 at 10:30 am
      Effigy says:
      10 April, 2022 at 6:15 am

      ” Trans killer identifying as baby in Scots jail, demanding nappies & blended food

      These self identifiers demands get more absurd every day.
      Time for governments to identify as having a clue! ”

      And people still use the term ” Conspiracy Theory ” unironically ! FFS , there is a conspiracy to rob us all of our rationality happening right in front of our eyes , aided and abetted by drongo politicians incapable of saying what a woman is . Sheer lunacy , exemplified by the now stock response to that question ….” I’m not biologist ” , WIT ???!!!

      I’m not a psychiatrist , but I can recognise insanity when I see it .

    112. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:

      BTL comments didn’t really reach escape velocity and amplify your stirring comment or present anything meaningful of their own apart from more boreathon’s about Scots law.

      Another boreathon about BTL posters. One thing I have to say about that cunt Ellis when it comes to flamebaiting he’s a superstar!

      The only poster TCE approves of is John Main and that is only because he can spot a useful idiot a mile off!

      At one time it was Hautey but Hautey wisened up towards the end. I doubt if John Main ever will. Thick as fuck! TAF

    113. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Just realised, yesterday, that it’s been eight years since we had the big FOW gathering in The Counting House, Glasgow.

      That was the first time a lot of us met in the flesh. That’s when someone set off the fire alarm and we had to stand in the street for ages. It was the night I was chatting to WGD and TJenny when a Brit spook accosted us of being ‘bigots’.

      A lot has happened since then. We’d all much rather the circumstances were different but we are where we are and the landscape will have changed again eight years from now. Feels pretty grim at the moment, but no-one could have predicted this state of affairs. Likewise, no-one can say for sure that we *won’t* be independent in 2030. Darkest before the dawn an aw that…

      😉

    114. Effigy says:

      By Jove I’ve got it.

      The baby killer has identified something for all of us!

      We all get the jail for something with a shirt sentence and identify as
      Scottish living in an independent sovereign nation.

      Can you support this Nicola?

      No frilly knickers or baby food required just a declaration would do fine!

    115. Robert Hughes says:

      Andy @ 10.45

      Cheers , and yes , it will take a bit of convincing for that to become Scottish post-Independence reality , worth aiming for though I reckon .

      Equally – pre-Independence – I know you’re sceptical , but the Constitutional Argument could fly with the requisite convincing : or , at least , as stated previously , form part of the overall case for Independence .First , more people have to be aware of it .Again , worth including/aiming for

    116. Andy Ellis says:

      @Scott 3.23 PM

      I’m not going to reply in detail to your piece and will endeavour to ignore you whenever possible in future, but I’m not letting that post pass. Others – even including Hatuey who was no friend of mine – have expressed in the past how your behaviour had crossed the line in to creepy as fuck stalkerish territory, but if you think you can come on here and issue threats of reporting me to the police from the cover of the anonymity so common to most snivelling cowards, on the entirely spurious grounds of committing hate crimes you’ve got another think coming.

      You weren’t attacked for having MS, it was pointed out that aspects of your claimed condition might explain your behaviour, or alternatively – and much more likely – you’re just a deeply unpleasant and creepy individual, without any extenuating circumstances.

      I’m definitely going with the “you’re just a deeply unpleasant individual” explanation. Perhaps some of those in here don’t see it but others will. Such is your inchoate rage that you’re willing to stoop to using exactly the same tactics used by trans rights extremists to silence the voices of gender critical people they disagree with, and of yoons who seek to silence independence campaigners.

    117. Breeks says:

      https://archive.ph/fA2cg

      “… Salmond and his gang are a turn-off.”

      Oh do fuck off National.

      Why not actually visit ALBA’s web pages and social media and see what they’re trying to do for Scotland?

      Meantime keep your poisonous filth and dribbling SNP bile to yourself. You and the arseholes at the Daily Express are cut from the same cloth, you just happen to piss in different directions.

    118. Ruby says:

      I’ve just scanned through Robin MacAlpines article.

      I’m too angry about ‘the elimination of women’ to really read anything more about the Ukraine war or any other war.

      He ends his article by saying:

      “But in Scotland I did expect something a bit more, a bit better, from the generally more thoughtful Scottish commentator class. I seem to have been wrong in that expectation.”

      Disappointed that folk in Scotland are calling others ‘Putin’s poodles’ and deciding everything is very black & white with regard to the war in Ukraine.

    119. Andy Ellis says:

      @Robert Hughes 11.19 am

      You’re right, I am sceptical about the various constitutional arguments being advanced as routes to independence. They’re not impossible of course: circumstances change in ways people seldom foresee, as the current situation in Ukraine demonstrates.

      Maybe coming economic problems, cost of living crisis, the realisation of the true impact of the UK leaving the EU etc will kick start something and encourage Scots to be more radical, but I won’t be holding my breath on past evidence. I’ll happily eat my words if there is a sudden overwhelming groundswell of rage leading to the establishment of an independence convention, withdrawal from Westminster and Holyrood and speedy independence.

      I just think dancing on the head of a constitutional pin is less likely to deliver results in a reasonable timescale than the alternatives, which are either a referendum or plebiscitary elections.

      The former now seems unlikely any time soon. I think most of us except NuSNP loyalists can see that. I hope the SNP get a bloody nose at the local elections, but in the end it’s the next GE that counts. Let’s face it, even if the SNP get an electoral kicking in May, the loyalists aren’t going to change. I reckon we need to see the scales falling from the eyes of SNP voters and rank and file members for real progress?

    120. Andy Ellis says:

      Ruby translator:

      “’I’ve just scanned through Robin MacAlpines article.”
      TRANSLATION: I thought I better at least pretend to engage in the topic the adults in the room are talking about, because I’m so desperate for people to notice me, but I have nothing meaningful to add.

      “I’m too angry about ‘the elimination of women’ to really read anything more about the Ukraine war or any other war.”:
      TRANSLATION: I’m a monomaniac who lacks the intellectual capacity to hold more than one idea in my head at one time.

      “Disappointed that folk in Scotland are calling others ‘Putin’s poodles’ and deciding everything is very black & white with regard to the war in Ukraine.”:
      TRANSLATION: I’m happy to defend the indefensible and express faux outrage about the opinions of others I don’t really understand, and to misrepresent them, as long as it means I can use the word “cunt” over and over again to show how edgy I am, even though everyone else just thinks I’m a foul mouthed harridan.

    121. Andy Ellis says:

      @John Main 10.31 am

      Hmmnnn….Spameron Brodie, Hattrick and greggs the baker: has anyone seen them in the same place at the same time?

      The people deserve to know…..!

    122. Ruby says:

      That National letter is pretty strange. I must admit I didn’t take a lot of time to read it. The last paragraph did however grab my attention

      “Yes, they still got a majority with the Greens, which is being used to push through the divisive GRA bill. How will this legislation encourage all the concerned women, who will lose their single-sex spaces, to vote for the SNP or even independence in the future? The SNP would do well to remember that women are 52% of the electorate.”

      That is a good question. However whoever wrote the about would need to specify what they mean by women as in ‘concerned women’ and women being ‘52% of the electorate’

      Is ‘Jo Bloomfield Edinburgh’ the letter writer a woman or a man?

    123. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      10 April, 2022 at 11:54 am

      Ruby translator:

      Do you always feel to need to translate for women?

      The question I am asking is why are the so called adults in the room not talking about ‘the elimination of women. Not interested?

      Was this lack of interest in the topic the reason why Stu decided to give up?

      Do you and Main ever worry about being seen as sexists/misogynists?

      Not a good look for members of Alba.

    124. Dan says:

      Does anyone know if there a livestream from the Indy X Moving Forward gathering in Dunfermline which started at midday?

      https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/indy-x-fife-moving-forward-tickets-308145660967

    125. Ruby says:

      Imagine the cheek of some women calling Andy Ellis a cunt!

      He’s been apoplectic about it for about six months now!

      Who needs to look up a thesaurus or invent a whole list a totally dopey names to call other posters. Hmmnnn….Spameron Brodie, Hattrick and greggs the baker…….

      Cunt does the job nicely!

    126. Andy Ellis says:

      Interesting piece from RTE News about Finland and potential early NATO membership, quoting Prime Minister Marin after her meeting with the Taoiseach Michael Martin on Friday morning:

      “I think we will end the discussion before midsummer. I think we will have very careful discussions, but we also are not taking any more time than we have to in this process, because the situation is of course very severe,”

      https://www.rte.ie/news/analysis-and-comment/2022/0409/1291369-finland-politics-latest/

      Just imagine if Scotland had a MSM capable of producing this kind of coverage of international events….!

      Also worth noting from the article the following figures from Finland:

      2017: 21% of Finns supported joining NATO.
      Feb. 2022: 53% of Finns support joining NATO.
      March 2022: 62% of Finns support joining NATO.

      The article points out that in the Winter War of 1939-40 Finland lost 25,000 lives to a Russian invasion, ceded 10% of its territory and had 400,000 people displaced in a population of 3.5 million.

      Cue much wailing and gnashing of teeth amongst the Putinistas! 🙂

    127. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      10 April, 2022 at 12:32 pm

      Interesting piece from RTE News about Finland

      You are way off topic you daft cunt! FFS this isnae Finaland

    128. Andy Ellis says:

      @Ruby 12.16 pm

      I can only refer you to the “some arsehole doctrine”

      https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-some-arsehole-doctrine/

      You may or may not be a woman. I don’t really care. The criticism of your whiny arsed input isn’t gendered, even assuming anyone knew what sex you were, it’s based on your inputs.

      As it is of course, you’re just “some arsehole” hiding behind their online anonymity so you can call folk cunts on line with impunity.

      I’m pretty sure Alba are entirely relaxed about me calling you out for your behaviour, but feel free to take it up with them if you disagree. Whether they’ll think complaints from someone with your online persona was worth listening to, or that my post amounts to misogyny, is another matter.

    129. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      10 April, 2022 at 12:41 pm

      @Ruby 12.16 pm

      I can only refer you to the “some arsehole doctrine”

      Fuck off! I’m not going to read any more of you ‘arsehole doctrine’
      Stop stalking me!

    130. Republicofscotland says:

      So a empty cargo ship called the Apache flying a Maltese flag, attempted to crash the Russian blockade of the port at Mariupol, after several warning its was fired on and the captain then complied with the Russian forces instructions.

      Umpteen Ukrainian helicopters have been shotdown by Russian forces, the helicopters were attempting to land at the Azovstal steel works in Mariupol to evacuate a plethora of foreign mercenaries and Swedish, US, French, UK, and a few other nationalities who are special forces and advisors to the Azov Nazi’s at the complex.

      The noose is closing in on these foreign nationals (advisors) and it would be a total embarrassment if they were caught and paraded by the Russian forces, this probably why Boris Johnson has met with the Ukrainian president to try and figure a way out of the predicament via an escape corridor for the foreign nationals.

    131. James Che. says:

      Breeks,
      Alf Baird,

      There were definately differences that distinguished the Realm and country of Scotland as remaining separate ( left in place ) from pre- union and afterwards

      1: This does allow for a definative border between Scotland and england. This is mentioned many times with regards to taxes.

      2: And as you say Breeks, Scots peers were not recognised as English peers and still cannot be to this day according to the treaty wording itself or the specific amount stipulated as allowed down south into westminister.

      3: The existence of a devolved Scottish government stopping at Scotland borders with England borders prevents Scotland passing any legislation or laws into the separate country of England.
      Along with this are the pieces of legislation that westminister passes for England and Wales only.

      4: That Scots and English law were to continue as a separate legal system from pre- union.

      5: That land Tax was specified as to retained in Scotland according to the treaty of the union, but not mentioned as to remain in England.

      The separating and distinguishing wording for the two countries Even after the treaty of the union was signed is acknowledged by both England and Scotland.
      It appears little more than a treaty of revenue collections from the agreements made between the two countries.
      And even then, it was by a small set of individuals and families whom self proclaimed they owned Scotland. Without producing the relevent paper work.
      Without evidence. I suppose the descendants of those families would be held liable for any recompsense or financial losses to be returned to England should we become independent today,

      perhaps where Alfs version of Colonism is correct as compared to the treaty on the union and our Long standing Scottish constitution .

      Is that the treaty lays down specific behaviour required by the Old english parliament from a detailed set of Scottish families due to their signitures that did not own Scotland.
      Indeed those that signed were considered a particular ( Section ) Scots

      These requirements were not put forward to the Scottish natives of their land and Country, nor was any recompense given to them.
      No agreement was entered into by all the natural inhabitants of Scotland,
      And no evidence was produced for the treaty sale.

      Thus the imposition implied is by brut force alone and a colonialism mindset and attitude that the rest of Scots had been included by default. And the taken over Scots laws, Scots land, Scots revenues and Scotland itself.
      Is Colonialism with a treaty.

    132. Robert Graham says:

      off topic

      The london borough of Tower Hamlets staged a 4 day event in order to persuade young people to get jabbed , over the 4 days 435 received the first and second dose of the Pfizer jab .this jab works out at £535.00 per person .

      Two weeks prior to this event the CEO of Pfizer Albert Bourla stated in a public news conference quote ” we now know the first and second dose is largely ineffective and does not offer any protection ”

      If this practice has and is being replicated throughout the country no wonder we are up shit creek , this added to the Billions wasted on track and trace adds to the biggest theft and transfer of public funds ever perpetrated ,

      Why is no one in Jail after the biggest theft in British History enabled by the biggest propaganda exercise ever staged in order to scare the shit out of a dumb public , we are all doomed dont go out you will die was the daily scare tactic’

      So please excuse my unwillingness to believe any of the total shite our media are peddling on a daily basis in order to extract a shocked reaction , the psychopaths that are pushing for a third world so they can test their new toys are using every trick to fool the public, they know the buttons to push.

      Every single platform and social media outlet has seen the emergence of Ellis and his type it’s their job so nothing personal Ellis or whatever your real name is but fuck off you were rumbled long ago but you are still hanging around like a bad smell.

      YOU HAVE A NICE DAY NOW , tosser .

    133. James Che. says:

      As to real events,
      Not one of us is included in the Scottish side of the treaty of the union by signed agreement.
      Except the families detailed.

      They did not own Scotland.
      They were not elected to act on Scots behalf.

      As to the wording of the treaty of the union,
      I think the
      THE STATUE LAW REVISION ( SCOTLAND ) ACT 1906.
      THE STATUE LAW REVISION ( SCOTLAND ) ACT 1927.
      THE STATUE LAW REVISION ( SCOTLAND ) ACT 1964.

      By The Great Britain Parliament , which Broke the Treaty of the Union 1706/ 1707 . due to it’s Revised Pre- Union Acts of Parliament of the laws of Scottish Parliament which were in place anc to remain so even after the union.

    134. Andy Ellis says:

      @Robert Graham 1.16 pm

      “Two weeks prior to this event the CEO of Pfizer Albert Bourla stated in a public news conference quote ” we now know the first and second dose is largely ineffective and does not offer any protection ”
      An Instagram post takes remarks by Pfizer’s CEO out of context to suggest that he described his company’s COVID-19 vaccine as largely ineffective.”

      For the benefit of Robert and others in the basket of deplorables:

      FACT CHECK:
      Our ruling
      An Instagram post claims that Pfizer’s CEO said two doses of the COVID-19 vaccine offer “very little protection, if any.”

      The quote in the post was part of remarks Bourla made in an interview. But he was referring specifically to the vaccine’s protection against infection by the omicron variant, not about their effectiveness against COVID-19 in general. He also said that three doses protect against severe disease.

      This claim contains an element of truth but ignores critical facts that would give a different impression. WE RATE IT AS MOSTLY FALSE.

      https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2022/jan/14/blog-posting/claim-about-pfizer-ceos-description-vaccine-leaves/

      “Two doses of the vaccine offers very limited protection, if any,” the Jan. 13 post says, attributing the quote to “Pfizer CEO, Albert Bourla, Jan. 10, 2022.”

      The post was flagged as part of Facebook’s efforts to combat false news and misinformation on its News Feed. (Read more about our partnership with Facebook.)

      The remarks were taken from an interview Bourla gave to Yahoo Finance on Jan. 10. He was asked about the wave of COVID-19 cases caused by the omicron variant of the virus.

      Bourla talked about how omicron is more mild, but very infectious, posing a challenge for the vaccine. But the quote in the post leaves out important context about what he was discussing. He was referring to how well two doses of the vaccine protected specifically against infection by the omicron variant.

      “We know that the two doses of the vaccine offer very limited protection, if any,” he said. “The three doses, with the booster, they offer reasonable protection against hospitalization and deaths. Against deaths, I think very good, and less protection against infection.”

      In another interview the same day on CNBC, Bourla talked about the omicron wave and the need for better vaccine protection. He said Pfizer was working on a version of the vaccine that would offer “way, way better” protection against omicron, particularly against infections. He said the new vaccine would be available in March.
      “The protection against the hospitalizations and the severe diseases, it is reasonable right now, with the current vaccines, as long as you are having, let’s say, the third dose,” he said.

      We reached out to Pfizer but did not hear back immediately.

      PolitiFact has reported on how omicron spreads quickly and is more resistant to vaccine protection, though the vaccines do protect against serious illness from the virus.

      Fact-checkers at Reuters found that this claim was missing context, and Snopes said it was Mostly False.

      https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2022/jan/14/blog-posting/claim-about-pfizer-ceos-description-vaccine-leaves/

    135. Ian Brotherhood says:

      ‘NATO-aligned Italian TV channel La7 scored a fantastic own goal. It showed the serial number of the Tochka-U missile that hit Kramatorsk station.Thanks to the serial number SH91579 the missile was traced back to the Ukrainian army.’

      twitter.com/LauraRu852/status/1512883967942619136

    136. Andy Ellis says:

      @ Ian Brotherhood

      Odd then that the Russians first loudly claimed responsibility for the attack before hurriedly deleting the posts (not before they’d been archived) when they realised they’s killed 50 civilians:

      “In a post on the incident, the Atlantic Council’s Digital Forensic Research Lab, a U.S. watchdog site, reported that:

      Russian Telegram channel Siloviki prematurely published information that Russians are ‘working on a cluster of armed forces of Ukraine at Kramatorsk railway station’ and celebrated casualties among Ukrainian combatants.
      “A few minutes after the initial post, they edited it, presumably after reports of civilian casualties proliferated. In the edited post, they said that when the Kramatorsk railway station was hit, ‘It was possibly a Tochka-U [missile] that the Armed Forces of Ukraine use.’
      “Both posts were subsequently deleted, but the original post and the edited message were archived as a forwarded message on another pro-Kremlin channel.”
      Other teams of investigative journalists also reported that the Russian denials are likely false. The Conflict Intelligence Team (CIT), a group of Russian journalists, said missiles that hit the Kramatorsk station likely came from the southeast, where the Russian Tochka-U systems are positioned.”

      https://www.polygraph.info/a/fact-check-russia-kramatorsk-missile/31793971.html

    137. Mark Boyle says:

      Ian Brotherhood says:
      10 April, 2022 at 1:34 pm

      ‘NATO-aligned Italian TV channel La7 scored a fantastic own goal. It showed the serial number of the Tochka-U missile that hit Kramatorsk station.Thanks to the serial number SH91579 the missile was traced back to the Ukrainian army.’

      twitter.com/LauraRu852/status/1512883967942619136

      … because everyone knows that the Russians, with their plentiful supplies of fuel and ammunition that’s allowed their invasion to steamroll non-stop into Kiev and all points of the compass, would never ever dream of chucking captured Ukrainian ordinance it had sold to them in the first place right back at them.

      Jesus tapdancing Christ, this place sometimes …

    138. Andy Ellis says:

      @Mark Boyle 1.49 pm

      Interesting also that the Putinistas are so desperate to believe (or at least have everyone else believe) that Vlad and his mates are just a great bunch of lads, selflessly performing a special military operation to rid Ukraine of neo nazis and demilitarise it (whether Ukrainians like it or not!), that they’re quite happy to uncritically accept the word of state controlled Russian media, while pouring scorn on any western MSM because they’re ALL tainted of course.

      This place – or more precisely *some* of the people in this place sometimes indeed….

    139. Andy Ellis says:

      More for the hapless Putinistas and their shills: (note, before they whinge on about the report being aligned with the Great Satan, it specifically mentions reports from Russian Telegram channels).

      https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/new-atlanticist/russian-war-report-russia-makes-false-claims-while-blaming-ukraine-for-kramatorsk-railway-station-attack/#kramatorsk

      Russia makes false claims while blaming Ukraine for Kramatorsk railway station attack
      On April 8, missiles landed near Kramatorsk railway station, killing dozens of people and injuring more than 100. The exact scale of casualties is still being investigated. According to local authorities, at least four children died. One of the missiles found on the scene had the phrase “?? ?????” (“for the children”) scrawled on it. While the phrase is open to interpretation, some have speculated that it was intended to mean “for the children of Russia,” and thus part of Russia’s attempt to paint Ukraine as the aggressor.

      Ukrainian authorities had urged residents of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts, including the city of Kramatorsk, to evacuate while it was still possible. Ukraine brought in multiple trains to bring residents away from the conflict, but the evacuation faced problems. On April 7, for example, three evacuation trains got stuck after Russia bombed railways near Barvinkove, the primary route westward from Sloviansk and Kramatorsk. The trains eventually departed after a delay of several hours. Meanwhile, buses from Vuhledar came under fire during an evacuation.

      At least six trains were scheduled to depart Kramatorsk on April 8, each leaving the station as soon as they reached capacity.

      Russia tried to blame Ukraine for attacking its own citizens. Russian Telegram channel Siloviki prematurely published information that Russians are “working on a cluster of armed forces of Ukraine at Kramatorsk railway station” and celebrated casualties among Ukrainian combatants. A few minutes after the initial post, they edited it, presumably after reports of civilian casualties proliferated. In the edited post, they said that when the Kramatorsk railway station was hit, “It was possibly a Tochka-U [missile] that the Armed Forces of Ukraine use.” Both posts were subsequently deleted, but the original post and the edited message were archived as a forwarded message on another pro-Kremlin channel. Another pro-Kremlin Telegram channel, Veteran Notes, published an ominous message on the evening of April 7, suggesting people who evacuate from Kramatorsk and Sloviansk not use railway transport.

      Kremlin-owned mainstream media picked up the narrative and continued claiming Ukraine had attacked its own civilians, insisting that Russia does not use the Tochka-U missile system. While it might not be on official lists of Russian equipment, researchers previously spotted footage of Tochka-U systems being deployed in Belarus over the course of March, disproving Russia’s claims of not using them.

      —Roman Osadchuk, Research Associate

    140. John Main says:

      @Republic 12:50

      “this probably”

      But maybes naw, eh Republic?

      You been promoted from making up lies about stuff that never happened to making up lies about the future?

      How did you do yesterday on the National? 50 to 1 on the winner. You must have minted it, with your predictive abilities.

    141. Andy Ellis says:

      @John Main 2.13 pm

      I I think we can assume with a fair degree of accuracy that reality and the posts of Putin’s Poodle are two circles that intersect at no point in the Venn diagram of life.

      I wonder, did he ever provide any evidence for his claims that the Russians had captured a US general in Mariupol during the week…?

      No…? There’s a shocker.

      “Cloutier has denied these rumors. He has recently been seen in Turkey at a NATO Allied Land Command event.

      What’s going on: Several websites and social media users have circulated reports that U.S. Major General Roger L. Cloutier Jr was captured by the Russian army in Mariupol, Ukraine. However, Cloutier has responded to the rumors, calling them completely false.

      In fact: Cloutier’s professional title is Lieutenant General, not Major General, as his LinkedIn profile shows. He is currently in Izmir, Turkey, where he has been working since August 2019.

      Cloutier posted images from an event in Turkey on LinkedIn on April 5, 2022. One user, Surinder Puri, responded to the post by questioning claims that the Russian military had captured Cloutier. Cloutier responded by saying that the rumors are completely false.

      Cloutier has also been seen in pictures posted by Allied Land Command’s official Twitter and Facebook accounts from the April 5 event held in Turkey. Therefore we confirm that the claim is false.”

      https://www.logically.ai/factchecks/library/4f1e495d

    142. Republicofscotland says:

      Agent Ellis @2.03pm

      The Atlantic Council really, of which is staffed by the military and the CIA, and has extremely close relations with Nato.

      The serial numbers on the Tochka-U missile booster section used at the Kramatorsk railway bombing match those of the Ukrainian inventory of the weapons they hold.

      It was cowardly and disgusting attack by the Nazi’s on their own people for propaganda purposes but with the Ukrainian forces on the back foot this kind of action was always going to happen the Nazi’s even used fragmentation warheads which explode just above the ground to do maximum damage to humans.

    143. Dan says:

      Ach, seeing as there is mention of part numbers on military ordinance.

      https://theferret.scot/raytheon-paveway-missiles-war-crimes-yemen/

    144. Andy Ellis says:

      @ Putin’s Poodle 2.27 pm

      As opposed to your unimpeachably neutral sources you mean? Like Tass, Venezuelan channels…or is it just what your handler passes you from Vlad’s playbook of the “special military operation”?

      How’s that proof coming along of your earlier big expose of Cloutier being in the hands of the Russians?

    145. Republicofscotland says:

      Agent Ellis @2.57pm

      Having a small piccy of Cloutier on Linkedin means nothing, he can be seen all over social media as in this, and we know he was in Ukraine training their forces.

      https://twitter.com/old_move/status/1511357699493183499/photo/1

      As for your fact checking website which is partly funded by Jeff Bezos, and which is one of a number of so called fact checking firms such as Correctiv and Politifact which are funded by dodgy characters such as yourself.

      Logically. has just come into a hefty chunk of cash.

      https://www.privateequitywire.co.uk/2022/03/16/312928/logically-closes-usd24m-funding-round-led-vitruvian-partners

    146. Andy Ellis says:

      @Dan 2.36 pm

      I don’t think anyone is denying the Saudis fired missiles from the UK in Yemen though Dan, so not sure why it’s relevant? There’s definitely a discussion to be had about the sale of weapons to unsavoury regimes around the world right enough.

      However in relation to the other things Putin’s Poodle tries to pin on the Ukrainians rather than the real culprits, there’s only going to be one actual answer isn’t there? So either the Russians are responsible for the Kramatorsk missile attack, or the Ukrainians did it. Same goes for Cloutier: either he’s in Russian custody, or it was fake news. Similarly with things like the downing of the Malaysian airliner in the past: either the Russians or their proxies did it, or the Ukrainians did it.

      Now of course, folk are perfectly entitled to believe the Kremlin’s take on any of these and other given issues rather than the alternative explanations. It’s not impossible that the Ukrainians would bomb their own side I suppose, but is it really likely? It could have been a missile fired by them that went off course. Or it could just be the much more likely explanation: the Russians are responsible, just as they are for the carpet bombing of Mariupol, the war crimes elsewhere, however hard the apologists for Putin’s regime try to insist otherwise.

      You’ll always get a minority of cranks who would sooner believe outlandish conspiracy theories – however bonkers – that fit their pre-existing ideological position, than the more likely truth. It’s been….enlightening ……let’s say to see how many in this place are quick to dance to the Putinista tune, generally on the basis of nothing more concrete than *Oh, look! Great Satan / false equivalence / whataboutery*.

    147. Scott says:

      Andy Ellis now for something completely different

      Droning on about Scots law and the constitution won’t assist in the debate over (those born in) Scotland’s right to self-determination.

      Advocating to join NATO, thus giving up independence on defence matters from day one and in the event of a member state ‘going rogue/SNAFU’, while being forced to spend n% for the privilege is the real vote winner. [It’s doubtless that ‘The majority’ probably don’t support the economic development of the Firth of Clyde anyway]

      *https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Colonel

    148. Andy Ellis says:

      @Putin’s Poodle 3.12 pm

      Ah right…so we’ll look forward to your retraction when Cloutier turns up somewhere verifiable then? Ofr will we then be treated to more conspiracy theorising that it’s a doppleganger, or photoshopped?

      Not sure what your handlers are paying you mate, but it’s not enough to look this desperate…!

    149. gregor says:

      @Andy Ellis

      I’ve been busy hosting a Russian from Saint Petersburg (shove that in your conspiracy theory pipe).

    150. Andy Ellis says:

      @gregor

      Good for you. Are they fleeing Putin’s regime or holding you hostage?

    151. John Main says:

      @Andy Ellis

      Sure, the Ukrainians launched their own missile at the railway station. Just as the Russians have been shelling ethnic Russians in the Donbas region for years.

      It’s all false flag ops if you warp yourself sufficiently, so to argue about it is fundamentally sterile.

      Maintain focus on the basics:

      1) who launched an invasion into a sovereign nation after amassing forces for months whilst simultaneously denying to the entire world an invasion would happen?

      2) why is around 10% of the Ukrainian population, mostly women, kids and the elderly, now in foreign countries?

      3) why are most Ukrainians begging the various “Satans” for military and financial help when they could just lay down their arms and embrace their Russian “liberators”, before going on to enjoy all of the “freedoms” and “advantages” on offer in the world’s biggest prison, the RF?

      4) who has engaged a semi-senile religious nut job to provide scurrilous “God is on our side” justification for unification of the Russian Orthodox Church under rule from Moscow (an interesting yet disturbing fact unmentioned on here)?

      Republic and the other malodorous skid marks here would like nothing more than to permanently shunt the site into endless arguments about serial numbers and the like. That’s what Rev Stu used to refer to as a squirrel.

    152. John Main says:

      @Gregs4:22

      Hope you won’t be tempted to pass off any of Mr Kipling’s finest as your very own.

      Or is she now baking for you?

      Oo err missus!

    153. gregor says:

      @Andy Ellis

      Neither: making cultural/historical connections with my local village: twinning re. WW2.

      I won’t show her your disgusting comments (Scotland isn’t like you).

    154. gregor says:

      Character Attacks: Why people resort to personal attacks and character assassination:

      “Although it doesn’t feel like it, the reason is simple, character attacks are all about feeling intimidated by another. People who feel good about themselves NEVER have to discredit others to feel more powerful. By creating lies or padding stories to sway others to make you look good, will cause you to lose in the end. Mother’s truth: believe half of what you see and none of what you hear.
      Think of the people in your life that act as mentors. They served in this role because they truly want to be helpful. They have nothing to prove, ask for nothing in return, and never need to force their opinions on you. Most of all hopefully they are honest and forthcoming.

      Next, think about the people who feel the need to attack. What one usually finds is someone who has little self-esteem, maybe is carrying a lot of anger or jealousy, and has the need to force their opinions on you or others for approval or validation.

      The way to handle these people is to tell them, their opinions (half-truths/lies/attacks) really don’t have any impact on you. Understand that they are really not in control of their own emotions, are lashing out like a child having a tantrum, or are trying to saving face….”

      https://www.brysontaylor.com/post/character-attacks-why-people-resort-to-personal-attacks-and-character-assassination

    155. Scott says:

      John Main says

      3) why are most Ukrainians begging the various “Satans” for military and financial help when they could just lay down their arms and embrace their Russian “liberators”, before going on to enjoy all of the “freedoms” and “advantages” on offer in the world’s biggest prison, the RF?

      4) who has engaged a semi-senile religious nut job to provide scurrilous “God is on our side” justification for unification of the Russian Orthodox Church under rule from Moscow (an interesting yet disturbing fact unmentioned on here)?


      ‘Spooky’ #1 on-this-day coincidences.

      3) Hear’say – Pure & Simple

      4) (I want you) Back for Good – Take That

      Mots sans nombres) Crazy – Gnarls Barkley

      [You n Ellis should release a charidee single for the poor, so they can afford the debt repayments to the rich in the West via ‘Ukranian clearances/Refugees wanted LLC’, but doubtless Mr Ellis would still want to be the Main man of the double-act]

    156. Scott says:

      gregor says:
      10 April, 2022 at 4:52 pm

      1) Character Attacks: Why people resort to personal attacks and character assassination:

      “Although it doesn’t feel like it, the reason is simple, character attacks are all about feeling intimidated by another. People who feel good about themselves NEVER have to discredit others to feel more powerful. By creating lies or padding stories to sway others to make you look good, will cause you to lose in the end. 2)Mother’s truth: believe half of what you see and none of what you hear.

      On this day in @ #1

      1) Gloria Gaynor – I will Survive (1979)

      2) I Heard It Through The Grapevine – Marvin Gaye (1969)

      [jfc, this isn’t reference to the accusation homophobia against me earlier in the comments]

    157. Andy Ellis says:

      @gregor 4.37 pm

      Very laudable. Perhaps she’s less po-faced than you gregor?

      What does your guest think about the current “special military operation” or are they scared to say in case they end up in the gulag for 10 years?

      I’m pretty convinced Scotland is more like me than it is you, Putin’s Poodle and the others in the basket of deplorables.

    158. Republicofscotland says:

      The Feb 24th operation by Russian forces pre-empted a massive assault by the Nazi’s in Donbas, the Nazi’s have been murdering civilians in Donbas for eight years prior, if Putin hadn’t given the order to go in the Nazi’s would’ve committed even more warcrimes than they have now.

      This I posted yesterday, the folk of Crimea prefer Russia over Ukraine, they too were attack.

      The US planned on taking over the Russian naval base at Sevastopol in Crimea, twice a Gallup poll was carried to find out how the people of Crimea felt about themselves if they felt Ukrainian or Russian, they answered Russian.

      The US and the Ukrainians resorted to violence against the people of Crimea in the hope that they would change their minds, this of course led to a referendum where Crimean’s voted to be ruled by Moscow.

      The US then commissioned another poll by Gallup, and this was the findings of that poll.

      “When Gallup did their “Public Opinion Survey Residents of the Autonomous Republic of Crimea May 16-30, 2013” (which was called that because even when Crimea was part of Ukraine, it had a special status, as being an “Autonomous Republic” — not a province), only 15% (slide 8) of Crimeans viewed themselves as “Ukrainian,” but 40% said “Russian,” and 24% said “Crimean.” 53% (slide 14) wanted Crimeans to be part of the “Customs Union with Russia, Belarus and Kazakhstan,” but only 17% wanted Crimeans to be part of “The European Union.” 68% (slide 15) said their feelings toward “Russia” were “warm,” but only 6% said their feelings toward “USA” were “warm.”

    159. Republicofscotland says:

      So the Israeli Foreign Minister Yair Lapid has jumped on the Empire of Lies bandwagon with regards to Russia, Israel which has been butchering women and children in Palestine for over 70 years and the UN nevermind Nato has stood by and watched with indifference.

      Everyone knows that Israel is an oppressive apartheid military occupying regime, yet the Israeli’s are welcomed into all manner of European and world events, the hypocrisy of this is on a monumental scale.

      Ukrainians committing genocide and the Israeli’s systematically eliminating an entire nation for over 70 years is acceptable to the UN, Nato and Europe.

    160. Republicofscotland says:

      A bit of common sense here.

      “FORMER First Minister Alex Salmond has called for Scotland’s campaign for independence to be detached from the Scottish Government.

      The Alba Party leader was speaking at a cross-party Indy X event in Dunfermline that also featured speakers including SNP MP Douglas Chapman and Common Weal founder Robin McAlpine.

      Chapman used the event to say that Scotland could declare independence with a majority of Yes MPs being elected to Westminster.”

      https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenational.scot%2Fnews%2F20058611.indyx-alex-salmond-douglas-chapman-address-scottish-independence-event%2F

    161. wullie says:

      OT
      BIGPOWEROFF at 10pm tonight on April 10th for 10 mins.

      . Apparently the Spanish did this in protest to the electricity price rises caused a lot of problems for their national grid govt took prices back to 2019 levels

    162. Dan says:

      Andy Ellis says: at 3:58 pm

      I don’t think anyone is denying the Saudis fired missiles from the UK in Yemen though Dan, so not sure why it’s relevant? There’s definitely a discussion to be had about the sale of weapons to unsavoury regimes around the world right enough.

      I didn’t post the link to suggest who did or did not fire weapons in Ukraine. How would we actually know with 100% certainty anyway when those with intent to manipulate a perception and an outcome that serves their objectives will go to great lengths to achieve their aims through all sorts of nefarious means.
      Such as.
      https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2013/10/fake-bbc-video/

      I did however post the link for the latter reason you suggest in that there is definitely a discussion to be had on the ongoing creation and selling of such destructive devices because of the resultant impacts they create when they are used.
      I question why such weapons are allowed to exit at all, because if just a small percentage of the time, money and intelligence poured into the technical development and manufacture of such weapons had instead been focused on creating solutions that better served humanity and the planet as a whole we’d be in a much better place.
      But instead here we are enduring the bullshit caused by the profiteering commercial interests of the global “elite” psychopaths playing monopoly for their own ends with the resources of the planet.

    163. Dorothy Devine says:

      IanB , I remember it well – you had the best hand shake and John King the best T shirt. I met Paul K , at the time he was a carer for his partner and life was hard. Ronnie was going through health problems then too and I met Kinnive – who seems to have vanished .

      I remain convinced that the ‘security boys’ set off the alarm.

    164. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Anyone who is now aged 40 or over was an ‘adult’ when 9/11 happened. Then we had the ‘war’ in Iraq and many started paying close attention.

      But prior to that, when a lot of those same adults were teenagers, we had the NATO bombing of Yugoslavia. (I take it we can agree that it was NATO who did the bombing, not Yeltsin’s Russia?)That’s when some of us older ones started paying attention, and we can remember the propaganda even now. (Jamie Shea and his white jacket, anyone?)

      What was it Alex Salmond said about the action at the time? (If you can remember, that is a measure of how vicious was the MSM reaction to any dissent.)

      In any case, an organisation which ends up with a character like George Robertson as its Secretary-General is worth watching closely.

      ‘According to the Serbian Ministry of Defense, 2,500 civilians were killed during the NATO airstrike, including 89 children and 1,031 members of the army and police. 6,000 civilians were injured, including 2,700 children and 5,173 soldiers and police, and 25 are still missing.’

      http://www.novinite.com/articles/214422/Today+marks+23+years+since+the+NATO+Bombing+of+Yugoslavia

      https://www.irishtimes.com/news/bombing-unpardonable-folly-says-salmond-1.168443

    165. Scott says:

      wullie says:
      10 April, 2022 at 7:03 pm

      OT
      BIGPOWEROFF at 10pm tonight on April 10th for 10 mins.


      “All art is quite useless, according to Oscar Wilde – Endless Art by A House”

      At #1 in the USA on this day in 1973

      The Night the Lights Went Out In Georgia – Vicki Lawrence.

      Give leccy the vicky

      Coming Out of the Dark – Gloria Estefa, from 1991, will be the meme attached to all the twitterati who posted photies of themselves sitting in the dark for 10 minutes.

      All in all, we’re just Another Brick in the Wall (Part 2, 1980)

      People contunually back the wrong horse in the fight for change…contrived (Is or isn’t that Ironic? #1 in Canada otd in 1996) segue, but still aposite to

      A Horse With No Name – America (#1 in USA, 1972)

      99 Luftballons – Nena (#1 in Australia, otd 1984, 10 other ’84 charts’), both {original} and {English reached #1 in UK, Ireland, Canada} versions outsold AHWNN.

      We asked for signs and The Sign(s) were sent.

      It’s a Crazy idea, but Hello, Everything Changes when you’re Young At Heart.

      People of Scotland have the Power and Nothing’s Gonna Stop Us Now

      I Love Rock n Roll – (a homage to the future of crack, careless sex and gambling?)

      Bye Bye Baby, Don’t Forget Me (When I’m Gone)

    166. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Dorothy –

      Agreed.

      😉

    167. Andy Ellis says:

      Lots of people will also remember that the NATO bombing of Serbia in March to June 1999 was in response to the Serbian actions in Kosovo where 8,676 Kosovar Albanians were killed or went missing and 848,000 were ethnically cleansed from Kosovo. Around 500 Serbian civilians died in the NATO bombing campaign and 1000 Serbian military personnel.

      Doubtless many of those presenting one side of the issue would have been entirely happy to see the Serbs have done the same to Kosovo and Putin is now doing to Ukraine. A strange one that…bit like Putin’s Poodle demanding obeisance for the suffering and deaths of Russians killed in the Donbas, while remaining silent about the deaths of Ukrainians in the “special military operation”?

    168. John Main says:

      @Scott 5:12

      “Mother’s truth: believe half of what you see and none of what you hear”

      How did your mum communicate her truth to you then?

      Obviously she can’t have just told you if you don’t believe anything you hear?

      If you only believe half of what you see, did she hold up cards with the same message on twice? If you disbelieved the second card, the truth on the first card would still suffice.

      Still, it seems like a complicated rigmarole to me.

    169. Andy Ellis says:

      @Dan 7.32 pm

      “I question why such weapons are allowed to exit at all, because if just a small percentage of the time, money and intelligence poured into the technical development and manufacture of such weapons had instead been focused on creating solutions that better served humanity and the planet as a whole we’d be in a much better place.”

      While what you say is true, I doubt it’s any more possible to put the genie of the whole international arms trade back in the bottle than it is to “uninvent” nuclear weapons. Most if not all countries who make weapons – particularly those that make complex weapons systems – seek to sell them abroad, and have for throughout history. Countries could undertake not to sell or export weapons they produced at all, or only to sell to other “acceptable” regimes, but controlling end-use is pretty hard.

      I’m not sure how we go about “creating solutions that better served humanity and the planet as a whole”. As long as countries feel there are threats to their security there will be an armaments industry. Until and unless there is a new world oder ensuring universal peace and strict adherence to non-violent means of conflict resolution, countries will maintain armed forces and the means to produce armaments systems they deem sufficient to protect themselves.

      Even in the past the UK was quite happy to make and sell battleships for anyone who had the money

      I’m all for an ethical foreign policy and not selling armaments systems to repressive regimes: the idea has been around for a long time, but sadly it doesn’t seem to be making much progress.

    170. John Main says:

      @Republicofscotland 10 April, 2022 at 6:02 pm

      “Ukrainians committing genocide”

      Can’t help feeling you are losing it, Republic.

      “Ukrainians committing Satanic genocide” is far more your style.

      You get an early night and return here refreshed with more hysterical insanity bright and early tomorrow.

      Get back on top of your game ASAP. Not much more than 3 weeks left to reel in those pro-Indy votes and convert those No’s to Yes’s!

    171. John Main says:

      @gregs – 10 April, 2022 at 4:52 pm

      Character Attacks: Why people resort to personal attacks and character assassination:

      Hey Gregs, I can’t off the top of my head recall anybody posting here who hasn’t at some time or another got stuck into somebody else.

      Including you. Ironic or what?

      Does that mean we all are suffering from low self-esteem? Maybes it’s a manifestation of the Scottish Cringe. What do you think?

    172. Dan says:

      @ Andy Ellis at 9.25pm

      For sure it is a complex situation but you did say it warranted discussion on how to potentially alleviate some of the utter bullshit and hypocrisy we as the underclass plebs of our respective countries and States have to endure by the ruling global “elite”.
      Just a few months ago we had the COP26 masif flying in to Scotland to tell us all how we minions must do our bit to reduce the negative environmental impact of our existences.
      I’m pretty certain raging fookin wars and causing extensive destruction of societal infrastructures and the following resultant rebuilding has a bigger carbon footprint than anything most if not all us punters get up to.
      These twats telling us how to live can get in the sea for all I care with their pontifications that appears to have fuck all impact on the trajectory we are on. It’s the highly influential corporates and the massively wealthy that effectively dictate the direction our society takes that they need to challenge, but they just don’t have the bawz for that sort of thing, so the wee folk get it every time.

    173. Andy Ellis says:

      @John Main 9.28 pm

      I was looking for evidence online of the genocide Putin’s Poodle keeps assuring us happened in Donbas between 2014-22. I cam across the following from the charity Action on Armed Violence (AOAV) whose website is here:

      https://aoav.org.uk/

      Their report from 24/02/2022 stated the following:

      “In recent weeks, Action on Armed Violence (AOAV) has monitored an escalation in violence in the Donbas region, which borders Russia, and where violence between Ukrainian forces and pro-Russian separatists has occurred since 2014.

      Between 2014 and 2021, AOAV recorded 5,242 deaths and injuries in Ukraine, including 2,704 civilians and 2,538 armed actors and security personnel. Of the civilian casualties recorded, 2,381 (88%) were caused by explosive weapon use in populated areas.

      Ground-launched weapons, such as shelling, mortars, rockets, or grenades, for example, have accounted for 2,459 civilian casualties since 2014 – 91% of total civilian casualties.

      Of the civilian casualties, the vast majority occurred in 2014 and 2015, with 1,428 and 862 civilian deaths and injuries in these years respectively. Despite continued sporadic shelling across the line of control, which divides the region of Donbas, civilian casualties have fallen quite consistently since 2014, with 28 recorded last year. Fewer civilian casualties are also likely to have occurred as numerous civilians have fled the worst impacted areas in Donbas since 2014, leaving an aging population, many of whom cannot leave.

      In many instances of shelling since 2014, the perpetrator has not been identified, but where they have, Ukrainian separatist forces have been responsible for at least 667 civilian casualties and Ukraine for 783.

      In the last few days, there has been an increase in shelling across the line of control, which has resulted in seven civilian casualties. At least three civilians were injured on February 17th when separatist shelling hit a school in Luhansk. On the same day, separatist shelling left another woman injured in Marinka as she waited for a bus. Shelling by Ukrainian forces was also reported to have left one woman injured on February 17th. On February 20th, 2 civilian deaths were reported due to Ukrainian shelling in occupied areas of Luhansk. And, on February 21st, a civilian was killed and homes damaged by separatist shelling on Donetsk.”

      Horrendous as all deaths are of course, it prompts a number of questions for Putin’s Poodle and his willing accomplices:

      1) Do 2,700 civilian deaths qualify as genocide?

      2) Are the Ukrainians killed by separatists the victims of genocide too?

      3) How many minutes from this post will it take for Putin’s Poodle to rubbish the charity AOAV and claim they are a CIA/Great Satan front organisation?

      For a little context, AOAV’s site has the following figures for Putin’s special military operation:

      a) 96% of civilians killed in Ukraine’s 2022 war the death occurred in populated areas.

      b) 2,151 casualties from explosive weapon use since the Russian invasion began (24 Feb – 08 Apr), across 158 incidents;

      c) 1,790 civilian casualties were recorded (1,005 killed, 785 injured);

    174. Scott says:

      Ellis ignores?

      Fewer civilian casualties are also likely to have occurred as numerous civilians have fled the worst impacted areas in Donbas since 2014, leaving an aging population, many of whom cannot leave.

      Ethnic cleansing?

    175. Ian Brotherhood says:

      It’s becoming well-nigh impossible to post links to anything which contradicts the UK/NATO narrative, regardless of how solid the evidence.

      Those responsible for the constant distraction are the same characters who – throughout the last two bug-riddled years – insisted that ‘there’s nothing to see here’.

      Anyone with more than a passing interest in covid-related stuff has long known that the story is bogus. The data is there.

      But we’re now expected to believe that the same string-pullers haven’t total control over Zelensky et al?

      Give us a break, FFS.

      The same techniques used in the run-up to indyref1 are being used to punt the ‘Ukraine’ story. It washes for some. But for those who’ve learned from the indyref experience, it’s all horribly familiar.

      Nothing to see here?

      Nah – there’s plenty.

      So, fill your boots with Ellis/Main shitery, if you wish. One thing’s for sure – neither of them will be sharing their home with a Ukrainian pensioner anytime soon.

    176. Ian Brotherhood says:

      This, from Ellis at 10.05, is noteworthy:

      ‘1) Do 2,700 civilian deaths qualify as genocide?’

    177. Clavie Cheil says:

      Are Putin’s Poodles taking their medications yet? There was no missile or bombing attack when our glorious leader was in Kiev? He was to busy in stitching up our Glorious tax dodging Chancellor and his wife.

      To Putin’s Poodles I say. ‘The Brit Tories are too busy to worry about the Ukraine.’ How dare the Ukrainians think they can be Independent. Those Indy loving Kulaks should know their place in the grand scheme of things.

    178. Effigy says:

      PoorUkrainians bolstered by promises made by Boris.

      It shows just how desperate they are that they grasp the words of a pathological liar who is throwing hurdles everywhere in front of their refugees who want to come here in spite of Patels pledges.

    179. Andy Ellis says:

      @ Ian Brotherhood 11.17 pm

      If the question is noteworthy Ian, want to take a swing at answering it?

      Either you agree with Putin’s Poodle that the killings in Donbas qualify as genocide or you don’t. Over use or incorrect application of the term genocide isn’t something that most reasonable people would be comfortable with, particularly those who have been the targets of genocide, as it serves to belittle and down grade their suffering and what they went through.

      Of course it won’t come as any surprise to most of us that those who misuse the term colonisation also misuse the term genocide.

    180. Andy Ellis says:

      @Ian Brotherhood 10.41 pm

      That’s simply not true though is it Ian? What you seem to be upset about is that the lunatics no longer have control of the asylum. Why should the conspiracy theorising, Putinista narrative be the only one represented here? It certainly doesn’t represent the views of the majority, either in the general population or the independence movement which so many of the folk here are shaming with their input.

      There’s a reason so many of the small claque of fringe nutters in here get so triggered by people shedding light on their unreason. Covidiots, regressive blood and soil nativism and those who buy the Putinista agitprop tend to flock together. they’ve convinced themselves they’re in the right about their hobby horse issues, and react badly when the general public scorn their idiocy and point and laugh at their Emperor having no clothes.

      You’re not on the right side here Ian, you’re aligning yourself with the basket of deplorables who pushed Project Fear in the indyref, who pushed for brexit, who strutted around the White House in a buffalo headdress. If you were in France you’d be advising folk to vote for Le Pen because Macron was part of the WEF/Great Satan conspiracy.

    181. Ruby says:

      Is it not a huge waste of time spending weeks on end arguing about Ukraine?

      What purpose does it serve?

      Can I suggest you have a wee break and talk about things that are happening in Scotland.

    182. Robert Hughes says:

      Remember the guy – Jonathan Cook – whose excellent article on the Craig Murray trial Stu reprinted here a while back and many WOS readers praised ? This from his Facebook page yesterday

      Jonathan Cook, journalist

      ” Are we all now interested in defining ‘genocide’?
      Let’s be clear: if what’s happening in Ukraine counts as genocide, then what Saudi Arabia is doing in Yemen (with US and UK backing), what Israel does in Gaza, and what the US and UK did in Iraq was also genocide. No ifs, no buts.”

      Any fair-minded person would agree . Please spare us the usual gash knee-jerk response * Whataboutery * ; a term that has joined the lexicon of stupidity along with * Conspiracy Theorists * * Anti-Vaxxers * * Anti-Science * ( lol ) as a means to ( attempt to ) close down any critical observations of * Official * narratives

    183. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      11 April, 2022 at 9:16 am

      That’s simply not true though is it Ian? What you seem to be upset about is that the lunatics no longer have control of the asylum

      The question is who are the lunatics. Are you a lunatic Mr Ellis.

    184. The public record of civilian violent deaths following the UK/US illegal 2003 invasion of Iraq,

      Documented civilian deaths from violence
      186,176 – 209,391.

      `The invasion of Iraq was neither in self-defense against armed attack nor sanctioned by UN Security Council resolution authorizing the use of force by member states and thus constituted the crime of war of aggression, according to the International Commission of Jurists (ICJ) in Geneva.`

    185. Andy Ellis says:

      @Dan 9.42 pm

      “…..but you did say it warranted discussion on how to potentially alleviate some of the utter bullshit and hypocrisy we as the underclass plebs of our respective countries and States have to endure by the ruling global “elite”.”

      Historically, I suppose the only ways of re-distributing wealth and power to bring about real change have been either taking it by force from those that have it, or electing governments to enact policies which achieve the same results. The former may be faster but tend to be accompanied by undesirable consequences, the latter takes longer and can still be co-opted by those with most to lose who will always try to protect their interests, property and wealth.

      In “the west” I suppose many people expected things to follow the same trajectory we saw in the 60’s and 70’s: things would get better, equality would increase, opportunities would increase. There’s a reason many people looked towards the Scandinavian social democratic model as an ideal: they may not have been perfect but they struck what seemed to most an enviable balance.

      Instead we see the rich getting richer and things going in reverse. The top 1% and the top 10% increase their accumulated wealth, big issues like the environment are not tackled, health care, education and basic amenities are still lacking for too many, democratic freedoms are still not available across huge swathes of the globe. Tackling those problems seems to have defeated our current leaders: the issue is how to replace them, and whether we can do so in a reasonable timescale.

      Meanwhile in Scotland, we can’t even get rid of a deeply dysfunctional party like the SNP or persuade more than 50% to get up off their knees and vote for independence.

      There’s definitely a place for a more radical prospectus, but people need to see it as realistic. Coverage of the French election recently suggests that Marine Le Pen is having more success than people thought she would by appealing to disillusioned voters by promising them “stuff” and doubtless many will fall for it and not see the populism and regressive right wing nationalism behind the curtain. The nativists in here have more in common with Le Pen than they’d like to admit.

    186. Andy Ellis says:

      @Robert Hughes 9.28 am

      I agree with you. Genocide isn’t an appropriate term for any of them. Few except real fringe extremists groups would argue that the Shoah was genocide or the Turkish action against Armenians in WW1 was genocide, but over use of the term just makes those using it look barking.

      Putin’s Poodle has routinely misused the term genocide to describe the deaths of a few thousand people in the Donbas conflict – who came from both sides, not one side – as genocide. Few of the Putinista shills in here have objected, either because they are morally vacuous enough to agree with him and his world view, or because they don’t really care / don’t dare to disagree with the fringe nutter narrative touted by the moon howlers in here.

      No fair minded person agrees that the examples quoted are genocide, but then no fair minded person accepts that Ukraine needed to be de-nazified demilitarised, or that Scotland was/is a colony, or that Covid vaccination is a vast WEF/space lizard plot.

    187. Andy Ellis says:

      @Ruby 9.25 am

      Did Rev Stu appoint you as Thread Prefect then…? I must have missed that.

      Presumably there’s some list of acceptable “local topics for local people”?

      That should be interesting*.

      *hilarious

    188. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Klaus Schwab – who looks and sounds more like a third-rate Bond villain than you would think possible for someone who isn’t doing it intentionally – and his minions are openly discussing impending transhumanism and what to do with billions of ‘useless’ people. They’re doing it in plain view.

      Whether or not you believe that the ‘pandemic’ plays a part in this, the fact remains that these unelected psychopaths have the characters who *ARE* elected by us in their back pockets.

      (By the way, the ‘useless’ includes all of us, whether we’re vaxxed/boosted or not – even Andy.)

    189. John Main says:

      @Ian Brotherhood 10:41 pm

      “Impossible to post links”

      Nah, Ian, the link posting mechanism has not changed.

      “shitery”

      Let’s see. Once upon a time there was a smaller country that was invaded by its much larger neighbour. Thousands of people were killed/maimed, millions of refugees were displaced, and billions of euros worth of damage was done. The leader of the larger country claimed the smaller country had no right to exist, and its people had no right to live as the majority of them wished.

      Brace yourself for so much “shitery” you eventually drown in it. Cos this “shitery” is not going to go away.

    190. John Main says:

      Andy Ellis

      To be fair, I am in agreement with Ruby (there’s a first).

      I am more than happy to not post about the war for the next 3+ weeks if the nutters would do the same. My view is that this bin fight is not advancing the causes of Indy/Alba.

      But if the likes of Republic feel driven to come on here, day after day, foaming about Nazis, Satans, genocide, Biden’s laptops, etc, my view is that on balance, Indy is helped by a constructive/factual/rational/humorous counter-narrative.

    191. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      11 April, 2022 at 10:30 am

      @Ruby 9.25 am

      Did Rev Stu appoint you as Thread Prefect then…? I must have missed that.

      Presumably there’s some list of acceptable “local topics for local people”?

      That should be interesting*.

      *hilarious

      as mad as a box of frogs

    192. Ruby says:

      John Main says:
      11 April, 20We22 at 11:44 am

      Andy Ellis

      To be fair, I am in agreement with Ruby (there’s a first).

      Not true. You’ve agreed with me in the past … when you seemed like a reasonable person ….before you ganged up with that cunt Ellis and turned into an blithering idiot posting about Putin’s poodles & sausage rolls.

      It’s interesting that you are now playing the role that your pal Hautey played before he saw the light. I think I’ll call you Hautey’s Replacement

    193. Ruby says:

      <Edinburgh to bring in tourist tax if SNP win council election on May 5

      As your newly appointed thread monitor I have decided discussing this local issue would make a nice break from the pointless never ending argument about Ukraine.

      https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.heraldscotland.com%2Fpolitics%2F20059820.edinburgh-bring-tourist-tax-snp-win-council-election-may-5%2F

      Does enforced highter room charges help the tourist industry?

    194. Ruby says:

      Another approved topic for you to discuss. I have to go now but I’m going to pass the baton over to Gregor who will be thread monitor in my absence.
      OK Gregor.

      https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.heraldscotland.com%2Fpolitics%2F20059603.lorna-slater-criticised-comparing-gra-critics-racists%2F

      Lorna Slater criticised for comparing GRA critics to ‘racists’

      ‘LORNA Slater has been accused of breaching the ministerial code after she compared critics of government plans to reform gender recognition laws to racists and antisemites.’

      Racists? The woman is no right in the heed!

      “This beats the angry Glaswegian who accused an Edinburgh chip shop of racism after they charged him 25p for tomato sauce.”

      https://archive.ph/FpyCs

    195. Andy Ellis says:

      On the principle that even a broken clock is right twice a day, it will actually be interesting to see whether the SNP manage to win enough seats in Edinburgh, either alone or with their Green mini-me sidekicks, to form an administration.

      I think most residents are more concerned with the high proportion of Air BnB properties and controlling those than with a tourist tax for every visitor. But hey, if it encourages them to spend more money on our our roads and the mocket state of what is supposed to be a World Heritage site I’d vote for the principle, even though I wouldn’t vote SNP or Green if they were the only parties standing and voting was compulsory.

    196. Scott says:

      A clock with no hands is never right.

      A tourist tax creates another level of bureaucracy* that will dilute the amount intended to fund improvements.

      It also reduces the amount of money folk can spend elsewhere.

      ‘You’ll have had your tea and paid your tax?’

      *Will Nictating Sturgeon (or any other politician) be able to claim back the tax on expenses if she stays overnight at the former North British Hotel?

    197. James Che. says:

      10 April 2022 at 6:18pm.

      In response to you’re comment yesterday.
      Some of us have long been stating that the way the Scottish government are playing a pretence at independence since 2014 is little more than deliberate delay tatics.

      From the snp many unused mandates to their approach to Brexit of wait n see what happens,
      Then Wait n see what happens after Brexit trade deals,
      Wait n see mantra during two years of covid

      The snp have played everyone along with carrots.
      The snp also think they are the leaders of the ‘ Yes ‘ movement, But they have proved themselves to be deliberately in avoidance of that very aim.
      The delays and excuses, the lack of alternative plans, and nearly eight years to create one plan of a section 30 order.

      Therefore it is time for the Independence movement to withdraw the reins from the snp/ green coalition hands. They have created little more than misery for the Scottish population with insane policies and gender issues.

      Thus we must remember that a Scottish devolved government from westminster is still a branch of westminster.
      And westminster is not about to cajole itself out of Scotland.
      As long as the devolved Scottish government is still a branch of a westminster run government within Scotland.
      it is a wolf in sheep’s clothing.

      The westminster derived Scottish government will not turn on itself.
      And therefore cannot act as a sovereign government,
      If it did…..
      It would pretty much be equivalent of UDI.

      The people in Scotland are sovereign however.
      And not in the awkward position of government UDI
      if the people inact their right to self determination.
      Without any political parties involved or Registered on the electorial roll.

      However until the people themselves are ready to march and declare themselves independent ( NOT WANTING OR SEEKING INDEPENDENCE ) from houses, banners, boards, flags, cars, work places and independence sites.
      Nothing will happen.

      Because every politician knows legally it is the people alone that are sovereign.

    198. Andy Ellis says:

      Eeeeeuch……! Thirteen candidates in Edinburgh Central for 5th May Elections. Kevan Shaw for Alba #1 obviously….but I’m beginning to wonder about “vote ’til you boak”?

      Not sure I can bring myself to vote for any of the others, tho’ fuck knows who most of the “Independent” candidates are?

      I might just have to bit the bullet and do it just to have the pleasure of putting Marianne Mwiki 11th, Claire Millar 12th and Finlay McFarlane 13th.

      https://whocanivotefor.co.uk/elections/local.edinburgh.city-centre.2022-05-05/city-centre/

    199. James Che. says:

      Ian Brotherhood.

      Indeed i to have noticed that they are proudly stating their plans out loud an no longer shy for the warped way they wish the world be for their benefit.

      While they are on air and recorded, we may presume they must think that they are more than half way there to reset the world.

      One thing for sure, it no longer is a conspiracy theory now the are out bragging about it for all to see.

    200. Scott says:

      What does devolution mean to you? (as Ian Astbury might have sung)

      For me it created the Parliament of Great Britain.

      Scotland devolved its abilitity to legislate when the Union with England Act 1707 was passed, thus ratifying and approving the Treaty of Union of the Two kingdoms of Scotland and England.

      https://www.legislation.gov.uk/aosp/1707/7?view=extent

      But it has been amended by WM to repeal some of the articles of union – only some of the legislation doing so is visible on leg dot gov.

      Criminal Justice Act 1948 is one, that repeals part of an Act of ‘the Old Scottish Parliament'(sic) but CJA1948 only applies to England & Wales and was itself repealed by Statue Law (Repeals) Act 1977.

      Statute Law Revision (Scotland) Act 1964 repealed laws of Scotland that had been extant since as far back 1424 – all deemed obsolete 257 years into this precious union, most likely due to English law (which is what WM legislation is) changes for E+W.

      SLR(S)1964 isn’t visible on leg dot gov, but there is a wiki

      https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Statute_Law_Revision_(Scotland)_Act_1964

      Anyhoo

      Power devolved is power retained, as the Secretary of State for Scotland says.

      We already have the power to act, but our fiction-obsessed, current First leader is blind to the tools already at OOR disposal.

      Her Majesties Great Seal of Scotland still exists (The First Minister is the current keeper)

      The Claim of Right Act 1689 remains extant.

      The nobile officium of the Court of Session is the ultimate arbiter of Scots law

      Dear Scotland and the cult in Government,

      Joy or sorrow, what does revolution mean to you?

    201. James Che. says:

      SCOTT.
      Glad to see some one else taken up the baton, well done.

      Here is another belter when it comes. “We do not get whom we vote for.”

      PLURAL VOTING
      Did you know that in London a person can vote more than once in an election.

      In 1892 George Shaw-Lefevere legally was able to vote 5 times in a election.
      And at one time Sir Robert Fowler a late member of the House, used to brag that he 13 votes .

      It states that a well known Oxford tutor was able to vote 18 times in an election due to varios qualifications,
      A clergyman of the Church of England who has a hobby for acquiring different qualifications for other Constituencies, has been able to obtain up to 50 chances to vote.

      Under the Representation of the peoples Act 1969 this practice is now abolished in Britain.

      ( Except ) It still exists in the City of London today.

    202. James Che. says:

      Scott.

      One has to enquire how on earth fair voting can take place in Britain when the City of london has Plural voting.
      The Scots have the Hond’t system,
      And the rest of Britain a different system.

      What happened to we are all governed the same by the British/ uk Parliament?

    203. Ruby says:

      https://twitter.com/petecarson

      PETE CARSON FOR EDINBURGH CITY COUNCIL

      He reckons he’s the only candidate who isn’t a fuckin loser.

    204. Ruby says:

      https://archive.ph/mvcma

      This is Kevin Illingworth

      He stood in
      ‘2019 Leith Walk: Edinburgh local election Independent 110 votes (not elected)’

      In 2019 he was passionate about Leith now he’s standing in Edinburgh Central.

    205. Ruby says:

      If you want to watch the Kevin Illingworth video go here:

      https://tinyurl.com/56scw7m5

      or directly to the Edinburgh Report page.
      Video don’t woork on archive.

      I did post a direct link but it didn’t upload.
      Anyone else getting posts that don’t upload?

    206. Robert Hughes says:

      Ruby

      YIKES ! Is the aforementioned Pete Carson representing the Acid House Party ? Aceeeeed !

      Other than a wig , it’s hard to tell who/what he stands for .

      Not that this is any surprise given Scottish Politics now is all about * performance * ; not in the sense of performing a service to the community that elected you of course , but the sense of ticking all the right Identitarian boxes , having the right flags on your FaceTwitter profile and generally not giving a fck about much else . Your man should go far

    207. Andy Ellis says:

      Pete Carson and Bonnie Price Bob are more likely to get my vote than Finlay McFarlane.

      The only councillors that ever answered emails or did anything constructive over the past few years were Jo Mowatt and Margaret Graham.

    208. Scott says:

      @James Cheyne

      City of London Corporation covers an area of 1.1 sq and has 8000 residents, but when it comes to voting, normal rules don’t apply in ‘ward elections’.

      “City residents aged 18 and over are automatically entitled to vote in City of London ward elections. Businesses and other organisations are also entitled to vote. All voters must be registered on the Ward Lists before they can vote in City elections.

      Sole traders and partnerships are entitled to register all equity partners. All other organisations are entitled to nominate a certain number of electors based on the size of their workforce.”

      -source: https://web.archive.org/web/20110927125622/http://www.cityoflondon.gov.uk/Corporation/LGNL_Services/Council_and_democracy/Councillors_democracy_and_elections/Voting_and_Registration/Voting+FAQ.htm

      City of London wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_of_London_Corporation#Elections

      The square mile – run by and for the benefit of those ‘standing on the square’ who in turn support those in the pyramid above.

    209. James Che. says:

      Scott.

      And the way City of London Plural voting works is as follows

      If you have a business you get a vote in that area,
      If you have businesses in two or five different areas as an address you get to vote in those areas,

      If you are in a university or or perhaps two then you also have a vote in those areas.

      If you live in a different place from above, you also have a vote in that area,

      If you live half your time in a second house due to your work, or constituents then you also would have a vote in that area.

      If you are in the house of lords/ westminster you also have a vote for that premises.

      That is the meaning of Plural Voting in the City of London, only.

      Even if each one only uses two to three of their available votes in elections, it sways the voting system skewed.
      And as far as i can ascertain and read from the wording it does not discriminate between which specific elections it applies to.

      As all elections are British elections these are supposed to be under the same election laws.
      However This unique and quint English law does not apply to Cities of Edinburgh, or Glasgow,

      Nor does it apply to Cities in Wales and Ireland.

    210. Ruby says:

      Paul Penman
      I am Paul R Penman and I am standing for the City Centre ward as an Independent.

      I have been a Community Councillor on the Old Town Community Council since 2018 and have served as its Secretary. I am currently its Treasurer. In the 2017 local election, I stood unsuccessfully for the Scottish Tory Party in Leith.

      Once a tory……?

    211. Republicofscotland says:

      “I was looking for evidence online of the genocide”

      Agent Ellis 10.05pm.

      You won’t find much on Western so called human rights sites, for they don’t want the truth of the matter to get out.

      https://www.stalkerzone.org/the-genocide-in-donbass-continues/

      https://quemadoinstitute.org/2015/07/10/donbass-appeal-for-un-war-crimes-tribunal-jeopardizes-universal-amnesty/

      I suppose its akin to the forgotten war, where the Saudi led coalition armed with British bombs partially made in Glenrothes in Scotland and at Warton in England, and Saudi troops trained at English airbases on how best to kill Yemeni folk, at weddings in hospitals and schools and bombing residential areas as well since 2015.

      Yet the UK media ignores this mass slaughter, no giant fund appeal, or a cry for the folk of Yemen to come to the UK to live with UK citizens, no tearful news clips of mums with crying children, no £350 quid for those willing to take in a Yemen family, no mass supplying of weapons from the entire West to Yemen, no hate crimes against people from Saudi Arabia in the West either as their is with Russians.

      The West has completely blanked the Donbas genocide it doesn’t fit the Wests agenda.

    212. Ruby says:

      I cant get links to upload
      If you are interested in Paul Penman Google

      Council elections 2022 – Paul Penman – City Centre Ward

      The article is in the Edinburgh Reporter.

      No info so far on
      Maria Pakpahan-Campbell unless she is a Life Coach.
      Norrie Rowan? Rugby player?

    213. Republicofscotland says:

      British SAS forces and American Delta special forces have been involved in the fighting in Ukraine against Russian forces since day one say French international correspondent Georges Malbrunot, who got the info from French intelligence.

      SAS troops protected Boris Johnson on his recent visit to Ukraine to meet Zelensky where they had a roastbeef dinner.

      Of course these forces were involved in Syria as well, under denial from the nations that they had troops in Syria General Cloutier was also in Syria, now he’s pinned down in the Azovstal complex along with other foreign fighting nationalities, I suppose Cloutier could be sold back to the Great Satan as happened in the case of the Israeli general captured in Syria awhile back.

    214. Ruby says:

      Finlay McFarlane He / Him

      Pronouns thats all you need to know about Finlay!

    215. Andy Ellis says:

      Tisk, tisk @ Putin’s Poodle…you will have the wrath of Ruby the Thread monitor fall upon you for daring to discuss matters other than those exclusively relating to local things for local people. In future, please restrict yourself to the discussion of potholes in your local roads, planned tourism taxes, and the impact of regular bin emptying on the achievement of independence.

      Perhaps they aren’t of much concern in Omsk or wherever the bot farm you oversee operates?

      WRT genocide, I can’t find anyone, anywhere – other than you and Vlad and his mates of course – who thinks the definition of genocide relates to the situation in Donbas. Any civilian deaths are tragic, whether in Yemen, Donbas, Palestine, Israel, Syria, Myanmar…the list is a long one. A few thousand casualties, which come from both sides, do not constitute genocide however many ideological somersaults you perform.

      It’s a strange comparison that western sale of arms to Saudi Arabia & GCC and training of their military, is the same as Vlad’s “special military operation” in the Ukraine though. I don’t recall the Saudis questioning the right of Yemen to exist or attempting to detach bits of it and annex them? Still in your through the looking glass world it’s hard to see up from down I suppose…?

    216. Scott says:

      ‘Perhaps they aren’t of much concern in Omsk or wherever the bot farm you oversee operates?’

      Ellis, the paranoid andyroid/haemorrhoid.

      Won’t talk about Scots law or Scotland’s constitution (because the ‘international community’ don’t care until we gain indy or some other deluded bollocks), but is the self-declared expert in the machinations of every other jurisdiction.

      We have at least 3 tools in place already to allow us to reclaim the independence of Scots law, and btl has one tool who won’t engage in good faith.

      1. The Great Seal of Scotland
      2. The Claim of Right Act 1689
      3. The nobile officium of the Court of Session

    217. James Che. says:

      Scott.

      PLURAL VOTING SYSTEM is not to be confused with a PLURALITY VOTING SYSTEM.

      One is whom has the most votes.
      And the other is the candidate whom polls highest,

    218. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      11 April, 2022 at 5:00 pm

      Tisk, tisk @ Putin’s Poodle…you will have the wrath of Ruby the Thread monitor fall upon you for daring to discuss matters other than those exclusively relating to local things for local people. In future, please restrict yourself to the discussion of potholes in your local roads, planned tourism taxes, and the impact of regular bin emptying on the achievement of independence.

      The flamebaiting fuckwit making shit up again!
      This is what I said

      “Is it not a huge waste of time spending weeks on end arguing about Ukraine?

      What purpose does it serve?

      Can I suggest you have a wee break and talk about things that are happening in Scotland.”

    219. James Che. says:

      Scott.

      The British parliament use both,
      But it defines it as a separate system from say, the D Hond’t system in Scotland under the devolved government.
      As a D hond’t system favours larger political parties or coalition parties, rather than smaller parties or individuals.
      Staving of any chance of changes to the leading parties.

      We are voting under different rules than the City of London.

    220. Dan says:

      If we are one “country” as unionists like to say, it ain’t half weird certain areas of said “country” use different voting systems…

      https://www.parliament.uk/about/how/elections-and-voting/voting-systems/

    221. Andy Ellis says:

      @ Ruby 5.44pm

      Don’t shoot the messenger Rubes….Putin’s Poodle started it. Bit like his boss started it in the Ukraine.*

      *other topics are available. Terms and conditions apply. Ruby will still call you a cunt, because, you know…you can’t educate pork.

    222. Ruby says:

      https://archive.ph/tW14b

      Hysteria does nothing to help trans people

      According to Slater it is “disgusting” that the government’s critics are permitted the opportunity to raise their concerns on the BBC and other media platforms. Such privileges would not be extended to overt racists, climate-change deniers or antisemites, and “gender critical” feminists should be considered beyond the pale too. Alex Massie

      Spot the fascist!

      Anyone here thinking of voting Green?

      Contrary to what Slater implies, people concerned about the implications of the Scottish government’s gender reforms are not anti-trans. Rather, they are concerned about the implications of legislation that allows a man to declare himself a woman (or vice versa) simply on the basis of their own feelings.
      Alex Massie

      This is a good article.

      The Flamebaiting fuckwit should note this is happenind and Scotland and it’s not just about potholes.
      I can’t say that I’ve found previous discussions about potholes & sinking schools to be all that interesting. It does however piss me off having to pay to have my car repaired due to pothole damage but I can never envisage my self spending months on end droning on about potholes in the same way as that cunt Ellis does about Putin’s poodles and his Stooge does about fuckin’ sausage rolls.

      FYI If you have an 02 mobile you get a free sausage roll for Greggs on Friday & Saturday.

    223. Dan says:

      @ Ruby at 6.37pm

      Jist get your car to Self ID as a big tough offroader with a foot of suspension travel and it will may be able to cope better on the mean streets of Auld Reekie, with its entropic speed reduction systems that seems to be developing on oor roads.
      Plus you’ll fit in better with aw the other 4×4 and SUV drivers that seem so abundant in urban environs these days.
      On that note I’ve to traverse your toon the morra and am torn between taking the bypass lottery or the “coast road” through Leith. The latter is tempting because a quick google shows a fuel station that is selling diesel well below what I can get it local to me.

    224. Clavie Cheil says:

      Are Putin’s Yoon Poodles taking their medicine yet?

      Lets see Pro Putin Fascists rule in Serbia. Putin’s poodle the neo Fascist Orban rules in Hungary. It could be that Putin’s poodle the neo Nazi Le Pen could win in France. Is he funding her again by any chance?

      Oh and what about all those donations to the anti Scottish Brit Tory Party that Putin’s pals gave them?

      Maybe if Putin’s Yoon Poodles took their medications they would start to notice a pattern here.

      Remind me again of who the Nazi’s and Fascists are please. It is clearly not the Ukrainians. Evidence suggests it is Putin who is the extreme right wing Megalomaniac. Well Europe’s Nazis and Fascists just seem to love him.

    225. Republicofscotland says:

      “Remind me again of who the Nazi’s and Fascists are please. ”

      You know fine well Cheil, as do we all.

      https://askeptic.substack.com/p/an-anti-ukraine-meme-gets-a-fact?s=r

    226. Effigy says:

      If the U.K. media was worth having we would be discussing how Westminster telling us of the
      world leading campaign they have to bring in Ukrainian refugees has seen fewer arrive than the rest of the refugees they were supposed to have stopped crossing the Channel.

      Rishi wants an enquiry like Boris so that you cannot comment on family tax avoidance or green card status for the US until a friendly Tory Lord drags it out and then announces nothing to see here plebs.

    227. Ruby says:

      Dan

      Be warned!
      Loads of roadworks in Edinburgh and none of them have anything to do with repairing the potholes.

      In Leith it’s all about the trams
      North Bridge – new bridge being built
      Royal Mile getting new cobbles
      Cowgate – new hotel being built.

      New roadworks everyday.

      You might want to self-id your car as a helicopter.

    228. Dan says:

      @ Ruby

      Ooh, good call on my car Self IDing as a helicopter, then I won’t have to buy highly priced diesel and can instead fill it with some of the many gallons of kerosene I aquired from a recent fuel heist I was involved in.
      Obviously there are the small matters of the fuel not having the correct duty paid on it for road use should I get pulled and tank dipped by VOSA. And whether Self IDing alone is enough to actually physically change a 2.0 litre 4 cylinder turbocharged compression ignition common rail engine designed to run on diesel into a jet turbine engine designed to run on kerosene…

    229. John Main says:

      @Pubes 6:37

      The spammer is called Gregs.

      Greggs is a well-known and reputable high-street seller of bakery products.

      Gregs is an eejit with a fixation on the porn to be found on Biden’s laptop or laptops (they seem to be breeding).

      I don’t doubt you can read, Pubes, but your ability to comprehend or process what you read is seriously in question. The poster who is most on here, endlessly spewing lying shite about Satans, Nazis, genocide, etc. is Republic.

      For the third time, I am posting that if everybody else shuts TF up about Ukraine, so will I. But, if people want to post shite about it, I will probably respond.

      For the avoidance of doubt, I am filled with admiration for a nation and people who will sacrifice everything in defence of their country, their freedom, and their right to choose their own destiny.

      If anybody had told me even as recently as January that I would soon have to be writing stuff like this on Wings, I would have been incredulous.

      Now I am just sad that some Scots have sunk so low.

      Wha’s like us, eh Pubes?

    230. John Main says:

      @Republic 7:36 pm

      Quote from an assessment of the war so far on Unherd today:

      “And this is just one more challenge in a war that will continue until Putin is willing to cut his losses and accept the one thing that Zelenskyy can give him: a promise that he will not apply for Nato membership. As to why the stalwart Zelenskyy has indicated he will do this, declaring that Ukraine’s model will instead be self-sufficient Israel, the answer is obvious: instead of strengthening its members, in recent times Nato has provided an alibi for their unilateral disarmament, which persisted even after Russia’s annexation of Abkhazia, South Ossetia, and Crimea. Not only have armies shrunk, but their training is more ceremonial than functional, as became painfully evident when supposedly well-trained units were sent to Iraq and Afghanistan.”

      Ukrainian Nazis modelling themselves on Israeli Jews, eh Republic? I am so looking forwards to your convoluted logic and language as you link these Satanic extremes together.

      Scotland should be looking to harness your foam-flecked torrents of outrage for energy generation. Certainly more reliable than wind power.

    231. Dan says:

      Wind power looks pretty fuckin reliable to me as Scotland is currently using approx 3.2GW and yet we’re still exporting 4GWs to England.

      https://extranet.nationalgrid.com/RealTime

    232. Ruby says:

      John Main says:
      11 April, 2022 at 8:03 pm

      @Pubes 6:37

      The spammer is called Gregs.

      Greggs is a well-known and reputable high-street seller of bakery products.

      You are spot on with regard to my ability to comprehend what you write!
      Are you a surrealist?

      ‘This is not a spammer this is a sausage roll’
      Inspired by the work of René Magritte.

    233. Scott says:

      We have at least 3 tools in place already to allow us to reclaim the independence of Scots law.

      1. The Great Seal of Scotland
      2. The Claim of Right Act 1689
      3. The nobile officium of the Court of Session

    234. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @John Main (8.15) –

      ‘Ukraine’s model will instead be self-sufficient Israel…’

      🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

      Self-sufficient?!?

      Cheers John, we could all do with a laugh right now!

    235. Ruby says:

      Dan says:
      11 April, 2022 at 8:22 pm

      Wind power looks pretty fuckin reliable to me as Scotland is currently using approx 3.2GW and yet we’re still exporting 4GWs to England.


      https://archive.ph/nbJQ0

      Do you remember this story during the IndyRef?

      I remember The Herald/Scotsman’s version of the story

      ‘Breeze Freeze in Scotand’ ‘Drop in Wind speeds blow to independence’ or something like that. The gist of it was there would be no oil and no wind either.’

    236. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Robert Hughes (9.07) –

      Thanks aplenty for that link. The phone call, in particular, is just jaw-dropping: ‘Fuck the EU’?!?

    237. James Che. says:

      Dan.

      Indeed, hows is the treaty of the union working for them compared to us here in Scotland behind the closed doors with smoke and mirrors.

      Anyone can find that link and look it up. Type in the two types of voting systems in the City of London i mentioned in the threads above to wikipedia.

    238. James Che. says:

      Just finished watching ” The Jones plantation ” on youtube.

      Mmm remind anyone of any other situation.

    239. James Che. says:

      Scott,

      Or you could just act on your sovereign right to self determination.
      A forth option 🙂

    240. Scott says:

      James Che. says:
      11 April, 2022 at 9:55 pm

      Scott,

      Or you could just act on your sovereign right to self determination.

      I’m working on it.

    241. James Che. says:

      Ruby.

      Whats not to like regards talking about Scotland on a site that was set up for information and facts for Scottish independence.

      Well said.

    242. Robert Hughes says:

      Ian B @ 9.17

      Truly . The arrogance of these people . The EU better be VERY careful or it’ll be the next expendable pawn

    243. Clavie Cheil says:

      Republicofscotland says:
      11 April, 2022 at 7:36 pm

      “Remind me again of who the Nazi’s and Fascists are please. ”

      You know fine well Cheil, as do we all.

      https://askeptic.substack.com/p/an-anti-ukraine-meme-gets-a-fact?s=r

      =================================================================

      Take your medications Yoon.

    244. Breeks says:

      Ian Brotherhood says:
      11 April, 2022 at 9:17 pm
      @Robert Hughes (9.07) –

      Thanks aplenty for that link. The phone call, in particular, is just jaw-dropping: ‘Fuck the EU’?!?

      The whole article is excellent, in a chilling kind of way.

      Perhaps the most chilling aspect of this is the interference with domestic politics. You have to wonder whether these American “interests” have tendrils in Scotland trying to make sure the US’s bully boy partner in crime, the warmongering UK, doesn’t disintegrate into a prickly and pro-European Scotland, and an increasingly frantic and isolated England, gorging itself on its own exceptionalism.

      It seems fairly obvious something is protecting / fuelling Sturgeon and her sabotage of Scottish Independence.

      It’s not very difficult to imagine a similar telephone conversation taking place, not about Ukraine but Scotland, with a Salmond bad / Sturgeon good mentality and narrative. She is definitely someone’s pawn, because she sure as hell isn’t doing it for Scotland.

    245. Breeks says:

      Robert Hughes says:
      11 April, 2022 at 11:41 pm
      Ian B @ 9.17

      Truly . The arrogance of these people . The EU better be VERY careful or it’ll be the next expendable pawn

      Europe already has come under attack… Brexit.

      But there’s a question beginning to materialise about whether the Americans have got sloppy, and Russia has outmanoeuvred them from the beginning. Russia hasn’t buckled under US sanctions, but thrived on them, and it has created a Russian economy that remains buoyant and robust without Western dependency. The Chinese are apparently doing the same thing.

      The tectonic plates in geopolitics might be shifting, and the US economy looks grossly off balance economically, and mightily dependent on military spending. But if it’s money is no good in Russia, China, and much of the Middle East, while an emerging Africa is “owned” by the Chinese, and the US has been caught stabbing Europe in the back, then suddenly, the dominance of the United States, arguably, begins to look a little fragile.

      The US too has some serious domestic imbalance in it’s wealth distribution, a healthy paranoia about Islam and racism generally, an unhealthy version of US exceptionalism, and again, arguably, came close to civil war breaking out after Trump supporters stormed the Whitehouse. The US hasn’t exactly been making friends these past few decades. The US economy is dependent upon war.

      I think it’s true, the Russians have I think been bruised and bloodied by the power of Javelin and NLAW missiles. Those missiles have had a good war so far, but you can bet your bottom rubble both the Russians and the Chinese will be studying the vulnerability of their armour and tactics. If there’s one nation on the planet which can take a doing, but survive and retire to lick it’s wounds and come back stronger, it’s the Russkis.

      The war in Ukraine has given a lot of people food for thought. The Russians need to improve their tanks, but the Americans need a new foreign policy , strategy and philosophy since traditional economic sanctions are increasingly impotent.

    246. Stuart MacKay says:

      Breeks,

      Of course there are tendrils. Everything from the Atlantic Council to the World Economic Forum is intended to ensure the faithful stay on message and stick to the big picture.

      Why else do you think Sturgeon is dragging her feet on independence. The oligarchs and regime changers of the west simply don’t want it and she’ll lose her position at the global trough if she doesn’t comply.

      A few conversations by American State Department junior interns on the strategic importance of Scotland is enough to cool the aspirations most ardent supporters of independence that get picked to go on these free trips to be feted in Washington.

    247. Dan says:

      LukewarmDave now on GETTR, so no twitter pop up blocking shit to deal with.
      Only 2 posts so far but both wee clips are worth a looksy.

      https://gettr.com/user/lwdave

    248. John Main says:

      @Breeks 12 April, 2022 at 7:41 am

      “Russia hasn’t buckled under US sanctions, but thrived on them, and it has created a Russian economy that remains buoyant and robust without Western dependency”

      FFS Breeks, I am going to have to pay a lot of attention when anybody posts in future that an Independent Scotland will have a buoyant and robust economy. I had absolutely no idea how low the bar had been set.

      “The US … arguably, came close to civil war breaking out after Trump supporters stormed the Whitehouse”

      Sure, Breeks, but it’s a bloody thin argument, despite what the Democrats like to assert. A few nutjob trespassers don’t make a civil war.

      “If there’s one nation on the planet which can take a doing, but survive and retire to lick it’s wounds and come back stronger, it’s the Russkis”

      Agreed, but if you accept that, and you also accept the arguments that “Ukraine is part of Russia”, “Ukrainians and Russians are one people”, etc. then the logic irrevocably follows that the Ukrainians can take just as much of a doing as the Russkis. And come back stronger. Sounds like a recipe for unending war to me. How does that help the “buoyant and robust” Russian economy?

    249. Ruby says:

      Europe already has come under attack… Brexit.

      France next?

      Is flooding Europe with refugees all part of the plan.

      Who’s funding France’s far right?

      Is it them
      https://archive.ph/MRnaS

      or him

      https://archive.ph/s1ApE

      or both?

      What are the implications for Scotland should Macron or Le Penn becoming president.

      Fishing?

      Le Touquet Treaty? I think Macron wants rid. Don’t know what Le Penn wants.

      Auld Alliance? Will it be cancelled if the far right win?

      Refugees from France flooding the UK?

    250. Ruby says:

      https://tinyurl.com/24cbz5kw

      It was a nice thought Mr Macron!

    251. John Main says:

      @Stuart MacKay 12 April, 2022 at 7:52 am

      “Why else do you think Sturgeon is dragging her feet on independence. The oligarchs and regime changers of the west simply don’t want it and she’ll lose her position at the global trough if she doesn’t comply”

      That’s a comforting fable for the kind of Scot who can be found drinking alone, crying into his dram, and mumbling “they’re all agin us”.

      My preferred answers are:

      1) NS doesn’t have the ability to run a successful, aspiring first-world country. Her personality defects mean that her cabinet consists of similar second-rate apparatchiks. The capable are eased out because they pose a threat to The Leader.

      2) NS, the SNP, and the Indy movement don’t have the vision or the concrete policies to convert enough Scots to Yes to ensure the next Indy Ref is a shoe-in. Therefore, for fear of losing again, they are doomed to continually shuffle along, quoting DelBoy, “this time next year Rodders, we’ll be independent”.

      Look on the bright side Stuart. If I am right, the Scots Indy movement can work to sort these problems out, with new people, new parties (Alba), and new policies.

      But if you are right, Scots Indy will never be able to raise itself from its self-pitying maundering. ‘They’, the shadowy manipulators behind the scenes, will always win.

      Let’s hope I’m right, eh?

    252. Stuart MacKay says:

      John Main

      The Ruble is currently trading at 82 to the USD. Pretty much the same exchange rate before the invasion. Do you still think those sanctions are working?

      You really need to stop watching the Neocon News channel on the Zelensky Broadcasting Corporation.

    253. Andy Ellis says:

      @Breeks 7.41 am

      I think you present a rose tinted view not only of Russia’s performance generally but also of its future prospects. “Future history” is something we get warned against of course, but many people, including quite a few experts on Russian politics and security, are actually predicting tough times ahead for the Russian Federation and possibly even its dissolution.

      Putin’s illegal annexation of the Crimea and his willingness to encourage breakaway statelets which nobody else recognises in the Caucasus and Transnistria on the grounds that they used to be Russian may have opened a Pandora’s Box. If the borders of Georgia, Moldova and Ukraine can be regarded as changeable at the whim of Russia, why can’t the borders of the Russian Federation? A Russia militarily weakened by the war in Ukraine and economically crippled by sanctions is at more risk of breaking up than it is of re-assembling a new Greater Russia.

      The war in the Ukraine may in fact be seen historically as Russia’s Suez moment. It’s a lot more than just “improving their tanks”. Russia is a middling power with an economy the size of Spain’s or the state of Texas, ruled by a kleptocratic bunch of gangsters.

      There are lots of reasons for some of the many ethnic minorities inside the Russian Federation to secede: there are 85 “federal subjects” or constituent parts inside the Federation, 22 of them named after the ethnic minorities which inhabit them. A militarily and economically weakened Russia – particularly one increasingly isolated from the global economy – may see lots of trouble ahead. The same thing has happened in the past when Russian central power has been weakened. Many of the constituent republics in the far east have more to gain and closer contacts with China, S. Korea and Japan than with distant Moscow.

      I know the Putinistas in here have their own narrative, but if you read analysis from subject matter experts about Russian military performance in the Ukraine is paints a pretty bleak picture for the future of Putin’s regime and for Russia as a whole.

    254. Dan says:

      Righto, I’m off to fire up the transhelichopper…
      Wish me luck on my drive flight.
      Hopefully with a successful arrival at my intended destination it will have spruced up my navigation skillz so I can find Wings Over Scotland, as it seems in the fog of “war” I’ve inadvertently found myself on Wings Over Ukraine…

    255. Stuart MacKay says:

      Andy Ellis

      Do you think there is a trend to fragmentation in various states or is this a time of consolidation?

      You can certainly argue we’re on the path to creating superstates as these would be more “stable” in a multi-polar world where the various factions jostle for dominance.

      However I wonder if we’re actually seeing the end of the major power blocks as more countries are considering going their own way and entering into more bilateral agreements – India being an obvious example.

    256. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      A good read from Barrheadboy.

      https://www.barrheadboy.com/follow-the-money/

    257. Republicofscotland says:

      It didn’t take long for the trapped Nazi’s and its international forces to claim that Russian forces are now using chemical weapons, even though its been shown that the Great Satan has biolabs in Ukraine that were doing experiments with dangerous pathogens.

      The same claim of chemical weapons use was rolled out in Syria when the Western forces were pushed back. The Nazi’s and the Western mad dog mercenaries and their advisors such as General Cloutier, are hiding deep under the Azovstal complex in a underground secret base that Nato has access to called the PIT-404 which has at least eight levels, built and operated by Metabiota, and owned by oligarch Rinat Akhmetov,
      the alleged illegitimate son of former Ukrainian President Kuchma, there are 24 km of tunnels up to 30 m deep.

      One must ask why are the Nazi’s and their Western accomplices willing to risk their lives (eight helicopters and one large ship destroyed by Russian forces) on multiple occasions to smuggle what or who out of the underground complex, which has failed on each attempt.

    258. John Main says:

      @Stuart MacKay 12 April, 2022 at 9:10 am

      “The Ruble is currently trading at 82 to the USD. Pretty much the same exchange rate before the invasion. Do you still think those sanctions are working?”

      Depends Stuart.

      If the sanctions were intended to permanently crash the ruble, then no, obviously.

      If the sanctions are intended to ensure that Russia has great difficulty buying stuff from the west with its rubles, then maybes yes.

      But I have never written on here about sanctions one way or another. If you are interested, I think the best possible outcome for this mess (as in least worst outcome) is that Ukraine and Russia fight each other to a stalemate.

      And BTW, I don’t agree that that will be the various assorted Satans using the Ukrainians as pawns or proxies to do in Russia. I don’t accept the commonly-held belief on here that nations or peoples have no independent agency, but only ever act when ‘others’ pull the strings.

      My view is that the Ukrainians decided they want to fight. They will decide when they want to stop. That’s kinda what free, independent, sovereign nations do.

      Well, maybes Scotland is the exception that proves the rule.

    259. John Main says:

      @Republicofscotland 12 April, 2022 at 10:11 am

      “the alleged illegitimate son of former Ukrainian President Kuchma”

      Shit Republic, on top of everything else, these Nazis offend against morality with their extra-marital sexual liaisons.

      The stink of their hypocrisy fills the nostrils of decent people.

      Death to them all!!!

    260. Breeks says:


      Stuart MacKay says:
      12 April, 2022 at 9:47 am

      …However I wonder if we’re actually seeing the end of the major power blocks as more countries are considering going their own way and entering into more bilateral agreements – India being an obvious example.

      The end of them, no, but a global re-balancing might be in progress.

      If, and it’s still a big if for now, but if we’re coming to the end of the petro chemical era, and Carbon based fuels are on the way out, then oil will not be the same commodity it traditionally has been.

      The multi billion dollar question is what form of energy will replace it, and who has the resources which that revolution will depend upon.

      What constitutes the resource in a wind generator? The wind or the generator?

      The beauty of renewable energy is that it isn’t a finite resource the way coal, oil, or minerals are, and a resource which replenishes itself is a completely different economic proposition to a resource which expends itself.

      With a following breeze, maybe the planet can break free from the chains and dependency which conventional energy creates.

    261. Republicofscotland says:

      Main @10.29am. re my 10.22am comment.

      DPR forces have confirmed that they captured US General Cloutier.

      And, here’s how they knew he was in Mariupol.

      “Officers from the U.S., Canada, Germany, France, Italy, Turkey, Sweden, Poland, and Greece are now trapped in the dungeons of Azovstal. U.S. Lieutenant General Roger Cloutier, recently captured by DNR People’s Militia from a downed helicopter, has been tracked down by the Russian GRU and SVR in Mariupol from external surveillance of his mistress in Turkey in Izmir.

      The Ukrainian national, known to the intelligence service as Klute, had always accompanied the general as a traveling wife, confidante and interpreter. As soon as information was received that this woman had arrived in Mariupol, Russia

      launched a military operation and blockaded the city.”

      As far as I’m aware the Russian forces do not want to bunker bust the underground complex, they want to capture all the Western troops alive, its just a matter of time.

    262. James Che. says:

      Barrheadboy.

      An excellent analyses.
      And at present the propaganda wars continue for money and world power due to greed rather than democracy,

      No one has any more blood on their hands than the powers instigating another war, that have been embroiled in just about every war directly or indirectly through arms sales to bring down countries through regime change for the benefit of obtaining their resources.

      War propaganda has become the most important weapon to gain support for doing the wrong thing to innocent civilians in other countries.

      Knowing that the propaganda for war has been exploited this time around and has been growing for some time, ( anyone remember the disappearing Skirpels ) and all the other nonsense that never tallied.
      While Russian money flowed into the political party down south,

      I realise the tangled weave of deceit runs both ways in propaganda wars,
      So i for one would rather free Scotland from becoming entangled or involved in future wars.
      Where our land, soil and people are not only sitting duck targets, or a training ground for killing other humans.

    263. James Che. says:

      Two distinctive opposing views from the same groups that do not tally.
      Climate Change and blowing the planet apart with war.

      And

      Ensuring the whole world is triple vaccinated to save lives.
      Then killing them with war.

    264. Scott says:

      Dan says:
      12 April, 2022 at 9:46 am

      Hopefully with a successful arrival at my intended destination it will have spruced up my navigation skillz so I can find Wings Over Scotland, as it seems in the fog of “war” I’ve inadvertently found myself on Wings Over Ukraine…

      Dan, you have a particular set of skills.

      You will look, you will find.

      Good luck!

      War, what is it good for?

      Getting people to talk about war while fervently ignoring their own issues domestically.

      Scotland’s independence can be reclaimed via

      1. The Great Seal of Scotland
      2. The Claim of Right Act 1689
      3. The nobile officium of the Court of Session
      4. The Scots

    265. John Main says:

      @Republic 11:28

      Online response to typing “where is Roger Cloutier” into search engine. This is an excerpt from the Reuters news agency:

      STARTS
      A public affairs officer for the Supreme Headquarters Allied Powers Europe (SHAPE) (the headquarters of NATO’s Allied Command Operations) told Reuters in a statement: “These claims are completely false. Lieutenant General Cloutier’s last visit to Ukraine was in July 2021 to conduct Land Staff Talks in Kyiv in order to strengthen NATO’s partnership with Ukraine’s brave and capable forces.”

      The officer added: “NATO is a defensive Alliance and NATO stands ready to deter Russian aggression as well as assure its Allies that sovereign NATO territory will be protected. There is no NATO Allied Land Command presence in Ukraine.”

      VERDICT

      False. The head of the NATO Allied Land Command, Lieutenant General Roger Cloutier, was not captured by Russian forces in Mariupol, Ukraine, despite claims made online. There are no Allied Land Command personnel on the ground in Ukraine.

      This article was produced by the Reuters Fact Check team. Read more about our fact-checking work? here.
      ENDS

      Quite a number of other sites also backing up Reuters, Republic.

    266. John Main says:

      Interesting article on the Guardian Online today:

      “Absentee owners buying up Scottish estates in secret sales”

      Here’s a quote:

      “Nearly two-thirds of last year’s sales were carried out privately, without the land going on the open market, with a third of the total going to overseas buyers. Those “off market” sales meant land was changing hands secretly without allowing local people to put in bids”

      The rest of the article is just as bad, so don’t read it if you are at risk of seizures or red mists.

      Why not contact your local councilor, and in view of the pending elections, ask her/him/it/they/cat what they intend to do about Scotland being sold out from under our feet?

    267. Scott says:

      @John Main

      What do Reuters et al. say about the following?

      Scotland’s independence can be reclaimed via

      1. The Great Seal of Scotland
      2. The Claim of Right Act 1689
      3. The nobile officium of the Court of Session
      4. The Scots

    268. Republicofscotland says:

      Main @12.44pm.

      Reuters which is a member of the Atlantic Council (corporate members) as is its CEO James C. Smith, as well as the Council for Foreign Relations and the World Economic Forum, is about as truthful as you, Chas, Chiel and Ellis when it comes to events in Ukraine.

    269. Andy Ellis says:

      @Stuart MacKay 9.47 am (& @ John Main 10.22 am)

      “Andy Ellis

      Do you think there is a trend to fragmentation in various states or is this a time of consolidation?”

      Either or both could be true. On balance it seems to me that the Russian Federation is in more danger of disintegration over the next 5-10 years than there is a prospect of it re-forging a neo-USSR.

      There are quite a few pieces out there discussing the prospect:

      https://nationalinterest.org/feature/breakup-will-russia-splinter-over-war-ukraine-201728

      https://unherd.com/thepost/how-the-war-could-lead-to-the-break-up-of-russia/

      The Sergej Sumlenny piece on UnHerd is interesting as he points out that failed Russian Operation in Afghanistan is now widely seen as the straw that broke the back of the USSR. Worth noting that around 15,000 Russians died in 10 years in their Afghan involvement, and it appears they may have lost the same number in a few months in Ukraine.

      Many of the constituent parts of the Russian Federation might get more restive when more and more of their sons start turning up in body bags, particularly if the economy is tanking at the same time. Sumlenny points out in his piece that it is often non-Russians who make up the bulk of the conscripts in the Russian army. He cites the Astrakhan bordering Kazakhstan area where 80% of the population are ethnic Russian and 20% ethnic Kazakhs, but more than 80% of those conscripted from the republic in to the army are ethnic Kazakhs.

      Russian imperialism may be the greatest victim of the war in the Ukraine. It may be seen historically as Moscow’s “Suez moment”, with Russia being reduced to a rump area of the western Russian Federation and many of the Caucasian, Ural/Siberian and Far Eastern republics and autonomous areas deciding they’d be better off independent.

    270. Republicofscotland says:

      Agent Ellis 1.36pm.

      We know Unherd is a dodgy news outlet, (Soros Funded) as for the Nationalinterest.org its part of The Center for the National Interest, of which its one time CEO Paul J. Saunders worked for the US State Department, the entire website was founded by the Neocon Irving Kristol who was a avid member of the Council for Foreign Relations.

    271. Andy Ellis says:

      @Putin’s Poodle 1.49 pm

      Every outlet that isn’t slavishly loyal to Putin’s regime is suspect to you though. You rely on QAnon crank sites, tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorists and organs of the Russian state. Most ordinary folk are capable of looking at the evidence from multiple news organisations, think tanks, NGO’s, independent journalists, historians, academics and universities and make their own judgement about which side is more likely to be true.

      Of course there are situations when convinced conspiracy theorists will die in a ditch to argue black is white. Cloutier for instance could turn up alive and well in Izmir, holding today’s Hurriyet, and you and others would still insist it’s a fake or photoshopped. You’re the modern equivalent of those insisting the moon landings never happened, or that Kennedy was shot by 2 gunmen.

      It’s a racing certainty that when deeply unpleasant Donbas Russian nationalists turn out to be lying about this nest of NATO personnel trapped &/or captured in the Azovstahl complex, you and others will either refuse to comment and quickly move on to the next piece of agitprop, or come up with some even more outlandish woo-woo to explain you were right all along.

    272. Republicofscotland says:

      “Cloutier for instance could turn up alive and well in Izmir, holding today’s Hurriyet”

      Agent Ellis, I’m sure could create that fake photo at your workstation right now if you wanted to, but why hasn’t your superiors allowed it, strange that one, if only Orde Wingate was still alive he’d have sorted this Ukraine thingy out in a week or so.

    273. Scott says:

      “Most ordinary folk are capable of looking at the evidence…

      Cloutier for instance could turn up alive and well in Izmir, holding today’s Hurriyet

      It’s a racing certainty that when deeply unpleasant Donbas Russian nationalists turn out to be lying… ” – Andyroid Ellis, the cornered rat.

      Why hasn’t he turned up anywhere then to provide the proof that the Russians are lying?

      How do these “deeply unpleasant Donbas Russian nationalists” compare to the deeply unpleasant (and pleasant) North Britain Britnats?

    274. Mark Boyle says:

      Brian Doonthetoon says:
      12 April, 2022 at 10:01 am

      A good read from Barrheadboy.

      https://www.barrheadboy.com/follow-the-money/

      I always thought he was a bit confused as a Rangers supporting Scottish nationalist (up there with Confederacy supporting African Americans in the “are you fking high, bro?” stakes), but he fk right off with this pish:

      “Contrary to the accepted western narrative, I say there are no good nations in this particular killing field. As I have said many times, the only innocents and good guys are the civilians caught in an American/ Russian proxy war. Do not let anyone kid you on. This war was made and gamed in both Washington and Moscow.”

      Yeah, because when one country invades another in order to conquor it and “recycle” any natives getting in their way (as either Siberians or worm food) it is somehow not a straight case of right vs wrong but global conspiracy bollocks … go and fk off Barrhead Boy and stay fked off until you acquire a few working braincells you fking fud!

    275. James Che. says:

      Ahh for peace and stability.
      To be in our own country and keep our selves to our selves.

      We would and could live in peace if it were not for the antagonists trying to prevent the SCOTTISH from leaving.
      A sore fight against colonialism.
      We want to go.
      An all they want is to keep our land an resources.
      Not the people.

    276. Andy Ellis says:

      @James Che 3.20 pm

      I bet folks in the Netherlands, Denmark and Norway were saying the same right before the Germans invaded them. Ir the Finns before the Russians invaded them. Or the Ukrainians before the Russians invaded them.

      Remind us how that worked out for them?

      You see where this is going right? Sticking your head in the sand and assuming that being a “local country for local people” doesn’t always work out.

      Some of us have more ambition for the early days of abetter nation than to be a Brigadoon parody of Royston Vesey. OK?

    277. Scott says:

      Mark Boyle says:
      12 April, 2022 at 2:49 pm

      Brian Doonthetoon says:
      12 April, 2022 at 10:01 am

      A good read from Barrheadboy.

      https://www.barrheadboy.com/follow-the-money/

      I always thought he was a bit confused as a Rangers supporting Scottish nationalist

      Did ye, aye?

      It shows how good your ability to objectively analyse anything is then.

      JFC,

      My Granda ran a Rangers supporters bus in Bridgeton and my Da had a tattoo of ‘King William on his horse’. I’m a Celtic supporter, but not a Catholic, Irish or supporter of the IRA, and I wasn’t ‘disowned’ by either of them for not wearing ‘the sash/scarf’ my forefathers wore.

    278. Republicofscotland says:

      I’m surprised the Russian forces didn’t shoot this guy, as they were warned that foreign mercenaries do not have the same rights as official fighting forces. He’ll be the first of many foreign fighters to be captured and paraded.

      “A British man fighting for Ukraine in the besieged city of Mariupol was forced to surrender Tuesday after his unit ran out of ammunition — making him the first known UK prisoner of Russia’s war, according to reports.

      Aiden Aslin, 27, a member of Ukraine’s marines, surrendered along with his unit during an intensified assault from Russia”

      https://nypost.com/2022/04/12/uk-man-fighting-for-ukraine-surrenders-in-mariupol/

    279. James Che. says:

      The comment was especially for you. It is called baiting.

      We would just adore you so much if you moved to the ukraine to go fight you’re battles along with the rest of your warmongering etel.

      Instead of being on a Scottish independence site trying to surround the independent Scots down narrow tunnel into a corral on all topics,

      We see you, we know.

    280. Andy Ellis says:

      @James Che 3.42 pm

      I doubt you could bait your breath from your MO James.

      I doubt the Ukrainians would have much use for someone of my age and skill set. I’ll happily stand shoulder to shoulder with them and support them in what ways I can, as any right thinking person should.

      The skid stains on the independence movement who are attempting to wash their hands of any involvement don’t represent the mainstream thankfully. Most right thinking people treat you all with the contempt you so richly deserve. You’re not on our side, you’re on the side of the orcs.

    281. Effigy says:

      Boris and Rishi fined by Met Police for Partygate crimes.

      The finest corrupt minds from the OxBridge brigade now working on the latest excuse why
      both should not be forced to resign.

      I propose they put in yet another Tory Lord to hold an enquiry over the next 2-3 years
      before finding the both innocent of all accusations from the Plebs.

      Strangely I want Bojo to stay as a wonderful reason for Scotland to sever all ties with Westminster’s nest of corruption.

    282. Mark Boyle says:

      Scott says: 12 April, 2022 at 3:30 pm

      Did ye, aye?

      It shows how good your ability to objectively analyse anything is then.

      JFC,

      My Granda ran a Rangers supporters bus in Bridgeton and my Da had a tattoo of ‘King William on his horse’. I’m a Celtic supporter, but not a Catholic, Irish or supporter of the IRA, and I wasn’t ‘disowned’ by either of them for not wearing ‘the sash/scarf’ my forefathers wore.

      Oh FFS stop kidding yersel’ son that Rangers and the “culture” surrounding it is the epitome of the Scottish cringe and aspiring to be anything but a cap doffing to the man in the Big Hoose and know-your-place Britnat. They appeal to the petty bigotry of the petty minded proles for one clear purpose – divide and conquor – and it is no coincidence so many of its board happened to be amongst Scotland’s colonial masters.

      I can guarantee you if they ceased hoovering up trophies along with their bigot mates from the east end, a lot of so-called “Scottish nationalists” would be not merely quick to disown them for “ethical reasons”, but would deny having ever supported them in the first place!

    283. James Che. says:

      Key board warrior only then , aww didums.

      And if the Scots dont play with you, you’ re gonna do what?
      YOUR GOING TO TREAT US WITH CONTEMPT.

      Wow we did’ realise.

    284. Dorothy Devine says:

      Effigy, are we being told how much?
      I seem to remember some students having to deal with eye watering fines.
      I sincerely hope that it isn’t just 50 quid.

    285. Scott says:

      “I doubt the Ukrainians would have much use for someone of my age and skill set.” – Andyroid Ellis, aged 60. (Have they got enough misogynistic, 60 year old drunkards that move from employer to employer to employer already?)

      “The skid stains on the independence movement who are attempting to wash their hands of any involvement” – Skidmark Ellis

      I feel sorry for the remaining ‘infinite monkeys’, who just type aimlessly without feeling the need to publicise themselves for doing so.

      Care to discuss how to regain the indepndence of our country of birth using only 4 ingredients, Mr E?

      1. The Great Seal of Scotland
      2. The Claim of Right Act 1689
      3. The nobile officium of the Court of Session
      4. The Scots

    286. Andy Ellis says:

      @Mark Boyle 2.49 pm

      There is (regrettably) a small coterie of – I suspect…? – far left folk within the movement who have uncritically accepted the Putinista playbook. It’s simply a continuation of the extremist fringe who uncritically support and fluff for any far left cause, however odious and suspect its behaviour on the basis that they are simply responding to the aggression of the Great Satan etc.

      They neither know nor care how outlandish they look and sound to “ordinary” Scottish voters and independence supporters. Only their ideological purity matters, irrespective of any damage caused to the movement by their fringe extremism.

      When they are confronted with the reality of what ordinary voters actually feel and think about e.g. Putin’s aggression in the Ukraine, they fall back on the Putin’s Poodle angle that they are somehow privy to knowledge and intelligence that “ordinary” folk aren’t, because they’re brainwashed by the MSM.

      In the end it’s a Trumpian narrative. We are expected to disbelieve the evidence of out own eyes and ears, and accept their world view uncritically. Delusional crack pots to a man.

    287. Republicofscotland says:

      The Syrian White Helmets are now training their Ukrainian counterparts in the art of deception and propaganda, like they did in Syria, until they were outed.

      There founder James Le Mesurier who was offed (2019) after it was revealed that he was MI6 were nominated for a Nobel Prize in 2016, which is almost as insane as giving a Nobel Prize to the mass murderers Barack Obama and Henry Kissinger.

      Watch out for the Ukrainian White Helmets running around Ukraine like the Keystone Cops pretending to help casualties that have occurred due to Russian attacks or chemical attacks.

    288. James Che. says:

      Effigy.
      Just read the same.
      Great time to jump into some else’s war. Camouflage jackets.

    289. Andy Ellis says:

      Unsurprisingly I see Roddy over at BarrheadBoy is having a melt down when people disagree with him in BTL comments.

      Another Putinista shill and skid mark on the movement. Strange isn’t it that none of these people are prepared to debate or defend their extremist fringe positions? They respond to a few comments, then block or disallow comments because it doesn’t suit their narrative.

      Fragile little flowers aren’t they? One might almost think they weren’t capable of justifying their woo-woo beliefs.

    290. Republicofscotland says:

      Its no a mibbies aye or mibbies naw, its a definite in Kenny’s eyes.

      “Former Liverpool and Scotland star Kenny Dalglish says that Ukraine should be handed automatic entry to the 2026 World Cup which is set to take place in the US, Canada and Mexico, if they are unable to fulfil their current fixture schedule.

      Ukraine had been due to play Scotland on March 24 in a World Cup qualification playoff semifinal for this year’s tournament in Qatar, with the victor taking on Wales in a winner-takes-all match, but the ongoing conflict within their borders has forced the postponement of Ukraine’s football.”

    291. Scott says:

      Mark Boyle says:
      12 April, 2022 at 3:59 pm

      Oh FFS stop kidding yersel’ son that Rangers and the “culture” surrounding it is the epitome of the Scottish cringe and aspiring to be anything but a cap doffing to the man in the Big Hoose and know-your-place Britnat. They appeal to the petty bigotry of the petty minded proles for one clear purpose – divide and conquor

      That’s your take on what I actually wrote? Kinda proves my point about objective analysis.

      [Did you actually mean conquer? – https://www.definitions.net/definition/conquor%5D

    292. James Che. says:

      I did not realise it was outlandish, far left or extremist to always seek peace in your own land.

      Someone doing some rebranding while the Scots are’nt looking.

      Sigh, we should be used to the butchers flag by now.

    293. Scott says:

      “What utter nonsense you are spewing the western lies they very thing we advise people not to fall for. The Nazis are imbedded in the Ukraine Military and Government it has been proved beyond any reasonable doubt. You sir,speak with forked tongue. I suspect you are a paid troll.” – Barrhead Boy

      This is Roddy’s reply to Andyroid Ellis on his ‘Follow the money!’ article

      This and 1 other comment is a meltdown according to the narcissist among us.

    294. Republicofscotland says:

      Scott @4’40pm.

      It would appear like many other folk Barrhead Boy has the measure of Agent Ellis.

    295. Effigy says:

      I’m lead to believe the fines are £60 but there may be multiple fines for being present at multiple parties.

      As Boris can have £30k free holidays, £100K speeches at JCB’s HQ, £150K Tennis matches
      against the fat blob and £200K fund raisers for Carrie’s new wallpaper I am confident he will not need to part with one penny.

      Having a Tory MP condemning a Jury for convicting another Tory MP for sexually molesting a young boy, they should have no problem appointing a new Met Police Commissioner who can agree Tories in power are above the law and any accusers can be convicted.

      Committing murder may well be their next step above the law but do the latest round of benefit cuts and inflationary rises count as that already?

    296. Scott says:

      Republicofscotland says:
      12 April, 2022 at 4:45 pm

      It would appear like many other folk Barrhead Boy has the measure of Agent Ellis.

      Roddy doing what comes naturally, Putin the boot in to Ellis and his delusions.

    297. Andy Ellis says:

      I’d say the fact that Roddy is modding comments out is sure fire evidence that he’s either too scared to debate those disagreeing with his views, or simply lacks the capacity like many in here.

      I see he also uncritically regurgitates the “14,000 people have died in the Donbas, why don’t you care about them!” line, while failing to point out that 9,000 of those were military personnel – including 500 Russians aiding the far right nationalist Donbas separatists – and around 3,300 of whom were civilians.

      Many of those civilians were of course Ukrainians and ethnic Russians who supported the Ukraine killed by the Donbas separatists, and > 300 were the international citizens murdered by them when the shot down the Malaysian airlines flight. Facts, eh? Seems Roddy doesn’t like them appearing BTL in his blog.

      Why might that be I wonder?

    298. Republicofscotland says:

      “Many of those civilians were of course Ukrainians and ethnic Russians ”

      For once Agent Ellis speaks the truth, the Ukrainian Nazi’s were ethnically cleansing the Donbas of Russian speaking Ukrainians, Kiev banned the speaking of Russian in the country, and of course many Russian speaking Ukrainians were beaten and killed as in Odessa.

      Russia stood back and watched as the world ignored the slaughter in Ukraine for eight years, the Nazi’s were mounting a huge offensive against the Donbas when Putin’s forces preempted a strike before they could.

      It will never be forgotten that the West has stood shoulder to shoulder with the Nazi’s in Ukraine to try and destroy Russia, a country that saved Europe from the WWII Nazi’s.

      You’re on the wrong side of history Agent Ellis and you know it.

    299. Andy Ellis says:

      @Putin’s Poodle 5.16 pm

      Nobody sane buys the Putinista narrative that Ukraine needed to be de-nazified tho’. It’s obviously too late to expect you to give up on your Quixotic crusade on the issue, but nobody with any sense of perspective accepts it. There was no ethnic cleansing in the Donbas, nor any genocide. There were human rights abuses by both sides, but the farrago of the capture of the Ukrainian state by neo-nazis and the Azov battalion being in control is strictly for the birds.

      The far right in the Ukraine enjoyed negligible support at the last election, and it’s levels of support have decreased in each succeeding election since independence. Constructing this outlandish fairly tale that there was an imminent threat that needed to be dealt with by Russian invasion is something that only convinced assets of the Putin regime could possibly accept with a straight face.

      Thousands have died in a war zone, including 500 Russian troops helping the far right Donbas Russian nationalists. No western troops have been involved. Civilians have died on both sides, but both Donetsk and Luhansk are legally parts of the Ukraine, as is Crimea. the international community doesn’t accept their annexation from the Ukraine, or their UDI “helped” by the Russian Federation.

      There is a right side of history in this affair, but you and those who think like you definitely aren’t on it. However desperately you try to promote the Kremlin’s playbook, the vast majority of ordinary people in Scotland, both pro and anti independence, see it for what it is.

      Th big losers in this war will be Russia and those cheerleading for it. With luck the imperialist Russian Federation will be destroyed, just like the equally loathsome USSR was. No right thinking person should shed any tears over it.

    300. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      12 April, 2022 at 5:01 pm

      I’d say the fact that Roddy is modding comments out is sure fire evidence that he’s either too scared to debate those disagreeing with his views, or simply lacks the capacity like many in here.


      Maybe he thinks you are a flamebaiting troll and does’t want you and your utter nonsense leaving skidmarks on his blog.

    301. Mark Boyle says:

      Scott says:
      12 April, 2022 at 4:30 pm

      Mark Boyle says:
      12 April, 2022 at 3:59 pm

      Oh FFS stop kidding yersel’ son that Rangers and the “culture” surrounding it is the epitome of the Scottish cringe and aspiring to be anything but a cap doffing to the man in the Big Hoose and know-your-place Britnat. They appeal to the petty bigotry of the petty minded proles for one clear purpose – divide and conquor

      That’s your take on what I actually wrote? Kinda proves my point about objective analysis.

      [Did you actually mean conquer? – https://www.definitions.net/definition/conquor%5D

      https://knowyourmeme.com/photos/1135725-counter-signal-memes

    302. Andy Ellis says:

      @Ruby 5.34

      More likely he just isn’t capable of responding. A lot of the Putinistas speak approvingly about Rev Stu’s open moderation policy in here when it suits them…strange it doesn’t extend to Roddy…?

    303. John Main says:

      @Republicofscotland 12 April, 2022 at 5:16 pm

      “the Nazi’s were mounting a huge offensive against the Donbas when Putin’s forces preempted a strike before they could.

      It will never be forgotten that the West has stood shoulder to shoulder with the Nazi’s in Ukraine to try and destroy Russia”

      Nah Republic.

      Both of your claims are deluded falsehoods.

      Ukraine made enormous efforts in the weeks running up to the Russian invasion to avoid doing anything that Putin could seize on as a provocation or pretext.

      All those weeks when Putin was telling the whole world that no invasion was planned or intended.

      It will never be forgotten how ordinary, patriotic men and women can fight for their nation and their land. OK, correction, it will be forgotten here BTL, but nowhere else.

      Will Russia be destroyed? Certainly quite a few fault lines visible, as Andy Ellis describes. If the whole tottering edifice collapses, Putin will be remembered in history as the architect of its downfall.

      Zelensky will be remembered as a Wallace, or a Bruce. But not here BTL. Something about heroic freedom fighters sticks in the craw of some of the most prolifically posting Wingers.

    304. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      12 April, 2022 at 5:38 pm

      @Ruby 5.34

      More likely he just isn’t capable of responding. A lot of the Putinistas speak approvingly about Rev Stu’s open moderation policy in here when it suits them…strange it doesn’t extend to Roddy…?

      You’ve got to draw the line when someone is an utter cunt!
      Nobody wants a flamebaiting fuckwit on their blog calling others names.

    305. John Main says:

      @Mark Boyle 12 April, 2022 at 2:49 pm

      “I always thought he was a bit confused as a Rangers supporting Scottish nationalist”

      Hey Mark,

      Can you publish a table of all the teams it is acceptable for a Scots Indy supporter to support.

      Make sure you cover all the divisions and maybes the amateur leagues too. Let’s get this one sorted.

      Many thanks in advance.

    306. John Main says:

      @Pubes 5:58 pm

      “You’ve got to draw the line when someone is an utter cunt!
      Nobody wants a flamebaiting fuckwit on their blog calling others names”

      Hats off to Pubes.

      Genuinely impossible to tell if she is for real.

      Respect 🙂

    307. Ruby says:

      Anything interesting happening in Scotland today?

    308. Andy Ellis says:

      @John Main 6.02 pm

      Definitely a wee want about yon Pubes. She’s blind to the irony of that post huh? Doubtless some lackwit will be along directly to tell me its a hate crime to call someone blind….or a lackwit…or to look at them funny.

      She strikes me as the type of wee ned that panhandles at taxi rank queues for coppers toward her next buckie carry oot, or the wee nyaff getting plastered sat in the corner of the bar swearing under their breath that everybody tries desperately to avoid.

    309. Mark Boyle says:

      It just about sums up “Scottish nationalists” like Barrhead Boy and Scott how humpty they get the moment anyone criticises the Old Firm or – even worse – dares suggest that their roles as the “circuses” of the “bread and circuses” approach to keeping Scotland disunited and distracted is more than mere coincidence, despite the bizarre manner so many sections of Scottish society’s ruling class (economic and political) fell over themselves to reinstitute one half of it upon bankruptcy and enforced demotion for irregularities, only years after merrily allowing three separate clubs to go to the wall under highly dubious circumstances with barely a peep.

      Time for a history lesson. In 1912, thanks to bad business practices, and despite having some of the biggest gates in the country, Celtic flirted with bankruptcy. They were bailed out by Sir John Ure Primrose.

      What made this benefactor so surprising – indeed beyond belief – was that Primrose was a failed Liberal politician whose anti-Irish and anti-Catholic pronouncements had torpedoed rather than enhanced his career as he’d hoped. Not only was he a patron of Rangers and eventual chairman, he was at that time in charge of the Orange Order in Scotland, and was largely responsible for the introduction of what is still refered to as “the policy” at Ibrox.

      However an explanation for his motives can be read in old minutes of the Glasgow Chamber of Commerce after the Russian Revolutions in 1917 where he expressed a concern that the situation of the poor in Glasgow may inspire similar rumblings of discontent, particularly upon the conclusion of the war when so many men would return to find themselves without work, and that the Old Firm’s role in distracting “the labouring class” with tribal rivalries was “useful” in making it more difficult for such sentiments to spread.

      It would also explain why Rangers became so much more vehement with “the policy” after Friday 31 January 1919.

      What was true then is true now – and finds parallels in Spain, where the monarchy and in turn Franco encouraged the tribalist sentiments of Athletic Bilbao and Barcelona as they acted as lightning rods to Basque and Catalan sentiments and diffused any real risk of them becoming anything more than 90 minute nationalism. Sounds familiar?

    310. Scott says:

      “I don’t know if he’s paid or not but he’s certainly a troll, this is the same man who trolls Wings advocating every Englishman/woman for whatever reason and however long living in Scotland should get a vote on Scottish sovereignty, I suspect he’d import them to give them a vote if he thinks he’d get away with it” – Graeme George

      https://www.barrheadboy.com/follow-the-money/#comment-18702

      Seems to be catching, funny that…anyhoo…

      This is happening in Scotland, Ruby.

      Scotland can regain its independence using 4 ingredients.

      1. The Great seal of Scotland
      2. The Claim of Right Act 1689
      3. The nobile officium of the Court of Session
      4. The Scots

      [Ellis-the-cornered-rat won’t engage on this at all]

    311. Ruby says:

      https://archive.ph/IxrK5

      Biology as basis for sex is common sense, says Starmer

      Duffield told Woman’s Hour, on BBC Radio 4, this morning she was “really hesitant” to share pictures on social media of a lunch this week with JK Rowling, the Harry Potter author who has become an outspoken advocate for single sex spaces, but thought “sod it”.

      Something going on with Craig Murray.

      “Craig Murray –
      @CraigMurrayOrg
      ·
      8h
      Hundreds of anti-trans activists, purporting concern for the safety of women, have now tweeted or retweeted a photo of my home, with hate comments.

      Four women and three children live in my home. Their safety?”

      I don’t know exactly what his views are on self-id, GRA and whether transwomen are women.

      I’m not liking the use of the term anti-trans activists.
      I’m getting quite a high reading on my mysogenist
      detector.

    312. Ruby says:

      https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001686y

      What questions will you ask local gov candidates

      Will it be about potholes, dog poo or what is a woman.

      ‘If you don’t respect my sex you don’t get my X’

    313. Ruby says:

      https://tinyurl.com/5hft8n5s

      What questions will you ask local gov candidates

      Will it be about potholes, dog poo or what is a woman.

      ‘If you don’t respect my sex you don’t get my X’

    314. John Main says:

      @Andy Ellis 12 April, 2022 at 6:14 pm

      There’s certainly enough material there to complete a PhD thesis.

      Incidentally, I had a look at Barrheid Boy’s article, and your comments and the comments of others. I was struck by how Barrheid lays out all the reasons why we should not support Ukraine, but can think of no reasons why we should. That screams bias straight away. His response to your comments was more hysterical than logical.

      What I am still waiting for, is for somebody to explain, what will be the outcome of walking away from Ukraine, giving up pushing back against Russia, and accepting the enlargement of the Russian Empire as a fait accompli. It seems to me crystal clear, that those who are advocating this course should be able to tell me what this course will mean today, next year, ten years down the line.

      It is only then that the pros and cons of fighting or capitulating can be assessed and a self-interested decision made.

      Sure, supporting Ukraine against Russia is going to cost us all. But what is not supporting Ukraine going to cost us? Saving some money today, only to lose much more next year or the year after, is no bargain.

    315. Stoker says:

      Several months ago Douglas Ross says: The Prime Ministers position is untenable and he should resign.

      One of DRoss’ London masters, and big Tory player, Jacob Rees-Mogg immediately responds: Douglas who? He’s an irrelevance.

      Fast forward to today’s news and Douglas Ross says: Blah! Blah! Blah! Ukraine! Blah! Blah! Blah! Ukraine! No the Prime Minister shouldn’t resign.

      What’s wrong, DRoss? Scared in case you get your arse felt again? Scared in case yet again your London masters tell it like it really is? And btw, you’re delusional if you truly believe London has *any* influence, one way or the other, on the situation in Ukraine. Obnoxious arrogance personified! You utter little irrelevance you! LOL!

      Wouldn’t it have been the laugh of the century folks if some reporter had the spine to ask DRoss if there was any truth in the rumour he was first to offer to pay his masters fine for him?
      _____________

      In other news: Some Tory gets into a scuffle in Aberdeenshire. Probably due to a member of the public telling the rat just what he thought of him. Tory rat charged by police and the Conservative Scottish Branch Office can only say: ‘We do not comment on live legal cases’ or some other similar bullshit. But notice how they’re always first with a comment on any ‘legal case’ involving independence supporters. Strange that, eh?

    316. John Main says:

      @Pubes 12 April, 2022 at 6:57 pm

      “I’m getting quite a high reading on my mysogenist detector”

      Red Alert Pubes!

      The mysogenist detectors are from a batch of North Korean knock-offs and should all have been recalled for safety reasons.

      Did you not read the instruction manual? Surely all the spelling mistakes in that would have made you suspicious you had been ripped off?

      Unplug your mysogenist detector at the wall, pick it up with tongs, and put it in your garden. Call the council tomorrow to dispose of it safely.

    317. Republicofscotland says:

      “Nobody sane buys the Putinista narrative that Ukraine needed to be de-nazified tho’”

      Agent Ellis.

      Its not up for question its fact that Ukraine has a multitude of street and monuments saluting Nazi sympathisers, they hold an annual parade in memory of those beasts, such as Bandera who is a national hero.

      Nazi supporting politicians walk along the corridors of the Ukrainian parliament in Kiev, the Ukrainian national guard has incorporated in its Nazi battalions who wear Nazi signa on their uniforms, it not up for discussion Agent Ellis, its fact.

      Its fact that the same Nazi’s have been systematically murdering Russian speaking Ukrainians in the Donbas and in Odessa, and that the Russian language is banned in Ukraine.

      You and the West support these Nazi’s that is also a undeniable fact, its disgusting and I cannot find words enough to describe what a vile creature you and Main and the others in here who are Nazi supporters.

    318. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      There’s so much “non-Scottish independence” stuff being posted btl here that it could lead you to believe that certain commenters are engaged in a process of “divide and conquer” to kill the idea of an independent Scottish nation.

      What is the purpose of WOS? To cure the ills of the planet, or to promote Scottish independence?

      Some peeps either have an ulterior motive or should hover over the “submit” button and have a rethink before they post.

    319. Andy Ellis says:

      @John Main 7.19 pm

      Indeed. Ian Lawson is another who is similarly prickly to anyone who dares contradict him and unable to engage in or tolerate debate. Barrhead as you note – in common with some of the basket of deplorables in here – has been captured by certain idees fixes in relation to the Ukrainian situation, particularly those well rehearsed by Putin’s Poodle.

      I took issue with his bald assertion that “14,000 Russian speaking Ukrainians” have been killed in a civil war. Whether he is being disingenuous or just isn’t aware of the misrepresentation of his statement is open to question. Of the total he quotes, 11,000 are military casualties from both sides: slightly more Donbas separatist than Ukrainians, with 500 Russians who were helping the Donbas separatists. We don’t know the details of language or ethnicity of the dead military personnel of course, whether they were Ukrainian or Russian.

      The same goes for most of the 3,300 civilian casualties (which includes the 300 international citizens murdered by the Donbas separatists when the shot down the Malaysian airlines flight). That total comprises people on both sides of the front line in the Donbas, i.e. it includes many killed by the Donbas separatists, including ethnic Russians who oppose the separatists.

      Of course it suits many punting the Russian narrative to give the impression, either directly or indirectly, that 14,000 ethnic Russians in the Donbas were killed by Ukrainians. It speaks to their attempt to demonise the Ukrainian regime and to fluff the discredited narrative of ethnic cleansing and neo-nazis being in control of the Ukrainian regime.

      A lot of the myths punted by the Putinistas are countered here, including the old chestnut about Crimea “always” being part of Russia, or having voted to rejoin Russia (a few of which Putin’s Poodle reproduced in Barrhead’s piece BTL):

      https://www.chathamhouse.org/2021/05/myths-and-misconceptions-debate-russia/myth-12-crimea-was-always-russian

      https://www.chathamhouse.org/2021/05/myths-and-misconceptions-debate-russia/myth-03-russia-was-promised-nato-would-not-enlarge

      https://www.chathamhouse.org/2021/05/myths-and-misconceptions-debate-russia/myth-01-russia-and-west-are-bad-each-other

    320. Republicofscotland says:

      Agent Ellis @8.21pm.

      Chatham House FFS, you might as well have posted a link to the Whitehouse or 10 Downing street.

      The current chairman of the council of Chatham House is the former CIA operative Dr DeAnne Julius.

      Your links tell more lies than you do and that’s saying something.

    321. Andy Ellis says:

      @Brian 8.18 pm

      Doubtless if Rev Stu agrees he will take action. Experience suggests otherwise however: he was after all very loathe to take action agains Spameron Brodie, despite many begging him to do so.

      Why you feel it is your place to decide what can or can’t be discussed. and whether it helps or hinders the cause, is difficult to judge. BTL comments on here have often veered wildly away from the posted topic after a while. Who are you or anyone else to dictate what is permissible and what isn’t? Ruby has already tried to appoint herself Thread Monitor, without (thankfully!) notable success.

      As to whether issues you don’t like promote independence or not, I can only re-iterate what I and others have said in the past: roasters coming on here spouting off their admiration for Putin, or advocating the disenfranchisement of 20% of Scots ARE having an impact on the movement in our opinion.

      Despite infrequent posts, this place is still – as Stu posted on GETTR not long ago – considerably more popular than other pro independence sites like WGD. The legacy of this place if it does finally close shouldn’t be Putin loving skid marks on the movement like Republic of Scotland, foul mouthed harridans like Ruby, or spammers like gregor. Those, and the tone police whingeing that this should be a local site for local people, are the ones who present a clear and present danger to the movement.

    322. Andy Ellis says:

      @Putin’s Poodle 8.29 pm

      Yeah, yeah….we get it, everyone from any institution, international organisation, NGO, university, media outlet, government that doesn’t uncritically accept the Putinista narrative is not to be trusted. It’s the same one sided view of the world that renders you incapable of discussing why you insist we must focus only on the deaths or crimes you want to prioritise, while ignoring any others.

      Thus you demand everyone condemn the deaths in Donbas, many of which were and are the responsibility of far right Russian supported nationalists trying to illegally detach parts of the Ukraine and join them to Russia, while ignoring the deaths of thousands of Ukrainians – including many ethnic Russians who want no part of Putin’s attempts to establish pretendy republics he can then annex to the Russian Federation – killed by Russia’s proxies.

      Similarly, we hear nary a peep from you about the thousands killed in Mariupol, or those butchered in the towns west of Kyiv. Your concern and outrage seems curiously selective. Perhaps it’s because you lack a moral compass, or perhaps it’s because you’re an ideological extremist. I’d lay money on it being both, but then I’m not at all convinced you’re a”real” independence supporter or even Scottish or in Scotland at all. We’ll never know of course because you’re just “some arsehole” on the internet, punting fringe nutterdom as though it were fact.

      Nobody buys the gaslighting crap about Ukraine being captured by neo-nazis, or that by supporting Ukraine we’re sympathising with the far right. It’s such a puerile argument that nobody with an ounce of common sense buys it.

    323. Scott says:

      “Why you feel it is your place to decide what can or can’t be discussed. and whether it helps or hinders the cause, is difficult to judge.” -Ellis

      “As to whether issues you don’t like promote independence or not, I can only re-iterate what I and others have said in the past: roasters coming on here spouting off their admiration for Putin, or advocating the disenfranchisement of 20% of Scots ARE having an impact on the movement in our opinion.” -Ellis

      Andy Ellis is clearly a fascist. And a cunt.


      Back on topic,

      Scotland can regain its independence using 4 ingredients.

      1. The Great Seal of Scotland
      2. The Claim of Right Act 1689
      3. The nobile officium of the Court of Session
      4. The Scots

    324. James Che. says:

      Brian doonthetoon. 8: 18.

      Yep More or less the same thought.

    325. Ruby says:

      Craig Murray has angered a lot of women.
      The following was posted on Twitter.

      Scottish Witch Woman = Adult Human Female.
      @DarcyWAHF
      ·
      11h
      Replying to
      @CraigMurrayOrg
      Anti trans ? Where has anyone mentioned trans ? Just highlighting you’re misogynist fossil views. Once again I will reiterate that as a founding member of the @AlbaParty
      this man’s high standing within in the party that says they support women’s rights is an insult.

      Very valid point!

    326. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Andy Ellis.

      Your response to my comment says lots about you input here.

      No offence…

    327. Scott says:

      “Perhaps it’s because you lack a moral compass, or perhaps it’s because you’re an ideological extremist. I’d lay money on it being both, but then I’m not at all convinced you’re a”real” independence supporter or even Scottish or in Scotland at all.” -Ellis

      An ideologue doesn’t lack a moral compass, they’re convinced they are doing the right thing for the right reason.

      Also, backing both runners in a two-horse race is a sure fire way to get rich quick, said only the bookies.

      *Reminder, if Ellis’ spouse doesn’t get a vote in the mythical indyref2, he’ll vote no- JFC, Rev Stu won’t necessarily join the campaign if this is happens, but that isn’t the same as what the drunk misogynist proposes to do*

    328. James Che. says:

      Scottish people are not putinites because they are not siding with you.

      Most of us are not indoctrinated towards war. And most do not want WW3

      It that simple,
      we are, just not all acting without thought, when shouting war cries from afar like NS,

      Sometimes more is achieved by not acting like a bull in a china shop.
      But simple observing.

      For non of us wish to learn later on we are on the wrong side another Iraq war, where truths were were twisted

      I personally am more a peace keeper than a war mongral.

    329. James Che. says:

      Scottish people are not putinites because they are not siding with you.

      Most of us are not indoctrinated towards war. And most do not want WW3

      It that simple,
      we are, just not all acting without thought, when shouting war cries from afar like NS,

      Sometimes more is achieved by not acting like a bull in a china shop.
      But simple observing.

      For non of us wish to learn later on we are on the wrong side another Iraq war, where truths were were twisted

      I personally am more a peace keeper than a war mongral myself.

    330. James Che. says:

      Ruby.

      Wigs n whiskers.

    331. Andy Ellis says:

      @Ruby 9.26 pm

      I think this might be the first time I’ve agreed with Ruby.

      I’m expecting news that Putin’s Poodle accepts Russia is wrong for something next. 🙂

    332. gregor says:

      Bigots hate an informed public…

      Ukraine’s political opposition arrested (12/04/2022):

      https://archive.ph/qF53l

    333. Mark Boyle says:

      Scott says:
      12 April, 2022 at 9:19 pm

      Back on topic,

      Scotland can regain its independence using 4 ingredients.

      1. The Great Seal of Scotland
      2. The Claim of Right Act 1689
      3. The nobile officium of the Court of Session
      4. The Scots

      Aye right. It’s that easy.

      You forgot to also include:

      5. The Fairy Flag
      6. The Sword of Gryffindor
      7. The Arkenstone
      8. The return of Take The High Road
      9. The return of Third Lanark to the Scottish fooball league
      10. The Death Bogle of Pitlochry to be named Scottish Health Minister
      11. An independent Scottish currency index linked to the EEA retail price index for cheese scones, stovies and tablet.

    334. Scott says:

      Mark Boyle says:
      12 April, 2022 at 10:22 pm

      Scott says:
      12 April, 2022 at 9:19 pm

      Back on topic,

      Scotland can regain its independence using 4 ingredients.

      1. The Great Seal of Scotland
      2. The Claim of Right Act 1689
      3. The nobile officium of the Court of Session
      4. The Scots

      Aye right. It’s that easy.

      You forgot to also include:

      *desperado stuff*

      It is that easy, what makes you say it isn’t?

    335. Breastplate says:

      Ffs Ellis, give it a rest.
      You’re on here boiling your piss at everybody that has the temerity not to believe the utter garbage spouted by the BBC et al.
      Top tip for you, if you can manage to keep your shit together long enough to let it sink in, the UK is lying to you about Ukraine, the USA is lying to you about Ukraine and the Russians are lying to you about Ukraine.

      None of them give a shit about the Ukrainian people.
      As I have pointed out before, this is an East v West power struggle, absolutely nothing new about that.
      It’s just yet another country’s inhabitants getting bombed.
      Try and understand that you are only succeeding in making yourself look like an imbecile when you accuse the Russians of being the only bad guys here.
      Of all the players in this clusterfuck, there are no good guys.

      Ukraine has been top billing in our media because we have an excellent bogeyman in Putin but probably the biggest humanitarian crisis on the planet for the last 7 years has been little more than an occasional footnote in our media because the obvious bad guys there are our best buddies.

      So remember this, we are the bad guys. Yes, other people are the bad guys but that does not make us the good guys, we’re still the bad guys.

    336. Effigy says:

      Look there is Russia, a Nazi, Rampant Inflation.

      Is that you Prime Minister and Chancellor of the Exchequer who have lied repeatedly for months on TV, Radio, The Press and in the House of Commons and we don’t like to mention it

      Lying to the House is a resignation matter as is making economic decisions that help your wife avoid U.K. taxes.

      Millions in this country are going hungry and cold while the rich get filthy in it.

      Attacking those attacking us is our first priority.

    337. Effigy says:

      Lichfield MP Michael Fabricant had earlier told BBC News:
      I don’t think at any time he thought he was breaking the law… he thought just like many teachers and nurses who after a very long shift would go back to the staff room and have a quiet drink.
      Writing to him, Pat Cullen, general secretary of the RCN, said:
      We remain at the forefront of pandemic response. Despite political narrative, as health and care professionals we know the Covid-19 context is nowhere near over. While you position yourself with some authority as to the behaviour and actions of nurses during the pandemic, I’d like to inform you of the following facts.
      Throughout the pandemic – and still certainly, now – most days, nurses and nursing support workers, when finally finishing a number of unpaid hours well past shift end, will get home, clean their uniforms, shower and collapse into bed.
      Throughout the early pandemic, this was often alone, for the protection of others – kept away from family, friends and support networks. These shifts – in communities, in hospitals, anywhere people are – are long, unrelenting, understaffed and intense.
      At the end of one of the many hours, days and years we have worked, since recognition of the pandemic, I can assure you that none of us have sought to hang out and ‘have a quiet one in the staff room.’ There isn’t a site in England that would allow alcohol on the premises for any professional to consume during working hours.
      As frontline professionals, still dealing with the implications of the pandemic – understaffed, underpaid, overworked, exhausted, burnt out and still holding it together while doing the best we can for our patients. It is utterly demoralising – and factually incorrect – to hear you suggest that our diligent, safety critical profession can reasonably be compared to any elected official breaking the law, at any time.
      Fabricant was talking about the incident in which the prime minister took part in a gathering of two or more people indoors, which was banned at the time.
      Updated at 22.34 BST

    338. Confused says:

      Lying, weaponised, gets called “psychological operations” and is a valid tool in war. And the “west” US/UK/EU/Israel/NATO considers itself to be at war with Russia, from the exact moment Putin booted the “oligarchs”.

      The British were very good at it – “babies on bayonets”, “soldiers crucified” – in WW1; enraged young Adolph, who decided he would not be “out-lied”.

      Interestingly, during WW2 all sorts of strange characters were used in propaganda/deception operations – stage magicians, illusionists; Dennis Wheatley and Muriel Spark wrote propaganda, and one guy in a special unit thinking up “mad plans” (never realised) ends up as the most famous spy novelist of all, Ian Fleming. Even the magnificent Christopher Lee (Dracula) was doing spooky work.

      If some war story sounds like a “screenplay”, it may be for good reasons, like say “the ghost of kiev” – that ukrainian TOP GUN who shot down a dozen migs … or you see, now in the public mind – “Putin is Voldemort, and Ukraine is Gryffindor and Zelensky is Harry Potter … ”

      I remember as a kid the Falklands but also the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, replete with copious diagrams in the Daily Record about “15 minutes to Armageddon” and most of us bought the line about the heroic “afghan people” (mojahedin) and evil russians; you had to wait some 30 years before guys like Brezinski admit in interviews they “armed up the nutters” as a provocation, just to destroy the soviet union, and it was a “price worth paying” (since he wasn’t paying it). Adam Curtis covered Afghanistan in one of his fascinating movies.

      About 20 years after the Falklands, an ex-marine published a memoir in which he claimed “our brave lads” committed (actual) war atrocities (not phoney baloney ones). Polaroids of posing with severed heads, that kind of thing. I think the book got excerpted in the Guadian Weekend (when it was still almost a newspaper) – it got denounced in parliament, then memory holed, and I cannot remember the author. I could try to use the Guardians online search engine?! (chuckle)

      Another source of “what actually happened” is the release of cabinet papers under the 30 year rule, that always has many surprises, but in short – the government lies to the people, constantly.

      Point is, it’s “nice” to get the real story 20/30/40 years down the line, but it doesn’t do much practical good – at the time they conned you. So, given these bastards track record you have to apply the precautionary principle – I’m not swallowing it – any of it

      youtu.be/69uM5q1ULvQ?t=54

      in practical terms, I would – assume the opposite of what the BBC say, in the first instance; it will save time. This guy gets it –

      https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2022/03/30/british-bullshit-corporation-whitewashes-ukrainian-nazis/

      “false flag” is a concept which has only recently got into the public mind (the other side, not us!) but it’s as old as the hills; Churchill uses the phrase “pseudo gangs”; the zionists “dress up as arabs and blow things up”; committing violent acts to discredit a peaceful opposition is a good tactic (kitson); there was even a roman politician who hired thugs to beat up citizens randomly, then got in on a “law and order” ticket. You need a compliant, controlled media to get away with this as functioning, independent journalists might ask you, at a press conference – where is the evidence/proof, for corroboration, “who benefits” and whether or not the “narrative” passes the basic test of making sense – if Putin wants to kill civilians (which has no military objective for him) he could kill a lot more, and leave little evidence behind.

      In the digital age, fakery is unfortunately a lot easier than it ever was; I am sure most of have photoshopped a hated politicians face onto a pornographic image for fun – now imagine professional people, with 1000 times the resources you have and are doing it for real, getting the lighting and shading authentic, which was always the giveaway when done by hand, and it’s not just still images, video can also be done.

      Arguing the toss, to and fro, over “some thing I just saw on twitter” proves nothing; we can all be conned in little things, in the small, at any time, but when you stand back, look at historical patterns and motivations, the picture is much clearer.

      Did the russians – blow up the theatre/blast the train station/r4pe kids/kill bambis mum/ and is the azov steelworks full of western mercenaries and who is torturing prisoners ? – I dunno, nor is there any way I can know, for sure – but I know how I would bet.

    339. twathater says:

      I inadvertently watched part of have I got news for you with victoria coren mitchell as the host , she made a couple of comments re Scotland which was quite an insight to how some of our neighbours view our supposed equal partnership with england in the uk , BUT don’t worry it was only a bit of banter not racist or demeaning whatsoever
      It had to do with qwasi kwartengs proposal to site nuclear power plants in Scotland, link

      https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m00164tk/have-i-got-news-for-you-series-63-episode-2

      From 10.46 and 14.25

    340. Scott says:

      twathater says:
      13 April, 2022 at 2:12 am

      I inadvertently watched part of have I got news for you with victoria coren mitchell as the host , she made a couple of comments re Scotland which was quite an insight to how some of our neighbours view our supposed equal partnership with england in the uk , BUT don’t worry it was only a bit of banter not racist or demeaning whatsoever

      Em, I think you should sit down for this, but…HIGNFY…this isn’t inadvertant or news or worth watching in the first place or whatever place the link is for those with a telly licence, which rules me out.

      Decent cliffhanger – ‘what she said about what that lunatic said’, have you tried CH4?

    341. Breeks says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      12 April, 2022 at 8:21 pm

      @John Main 7.19 pm

      Indeed. Ian Lawson is another who is similarly prickly to anyone who dares contradict him and unable to engage in or tolerate debate.

      Debate? You flatter yourself.

      You think it’s clever giving people derogatory names like some precocious adolescent attention seeker, and your “analysis” of information, while interminable, is both glib and naive.

      If you actually want to debate with these people, (and most of us know that’s a mighty big “if”), then raise your game, develop some maturity, and for once say something that’s actually worthwhile for people to engage with.

    342. Mark Boyle says:

      Scott says:
      12 April, 2022 at 10:30 pm

      It is that easy, what makes you say it isn’t?

      Reality.

    343. Andy Ellis says:

      @Breeks 7.55 am

      You’re the one flattering yourself and the other low lives in here I’m afraid. Have you seen the what passes for debate for them? They wouldn’t know how to engage in a reasoned argument if it jumped up and bit them. You’ve seen Putin’s Poodle paste wall to wall Kremlin agitprop, and yet we’re simply meant to accept that his argument is valid because “the West” is just as bad, or because the MSM has an agenda?

      When did Republic of Scotland ever respond to questions about his constant assertions about the scale of the problem with nazism in the Ukraine Breeks? That’s easy: not once. Similarly, when did he or any of the other Putinistas express the same sympathy or outrage about the victims of Russian aggression in the past few months, sympathy that they demanded we all expressed about the Russians killed in the Donbas since 2014? Has he, or any of those in here enabling him ever slapped him down for his “the Ukrainians had it coming” remark? No, of course they haven’t, because they are either extreme enough, or ill informed enough, to largely agree with him.

      As for calling people names, have you just been blanking out the constant abuse doled out by that harridan Ruby, or the creepy stalking of obviously disturbed individuals like Scott? And we’re just meant to not respond?

      Folk like Barrheadboy and Ian Lawson are of course entitled to do what they like with their own blogs, as it Rev Stu, but it’s telling indeed that neither of them are prepared to tolerate debate BTL, as was obvious yesterday in Roddy’s piece. It’s obvious that those who share that world view aren’t prepared to defend their positions, because they know they don’t stand up to any scrutiny.

      The light to some is an unwelcome friend: it’s sad they are so well represented in here these days, but at least we know this place isn’t an echo chamber for the worst of the movement which is what stains on the movement like Republic of Scotland and others who share his views really want.

    344. Andy Ellis says:

      @Mark Boyle 9.21 am

      “Reality”

      It’ll never catch on BTL these days Mark. Sadly most of the adults have left the building leaving the place to be over run by a basket of deplorables who have doubtless always been there, but in the past were diluted with those who have functioning moral compasses and a sense of perspective.

      Covid-19 and now the war in Ukraine, twinned with the lack of progress on independence has emboldened the fringe nutters to crawl out from under their rocks, much as the MAGA lot came to prominence in the USA.

      People prepared to believe that “the Ukrainians had it coming”, or that Covid is a hoax or a plot by the illuminati, or that we wuz robed in 2014 and must disenfranchise 20% of Scots, aren’t well prepared for reality.

      Thankfully most ordinary Scots treat such extremist fringe nutters with the contempt they deserve, and will vote for them in the same quantities they did for (checks notes) RISE and the SSP. 🙂

    345. Mark Boyle says:

      Confused says:
      13 April, 2022 at 12:39 am

      About 20 years after the Falklands, an ex-marine published a memoir in which he claimed “our brave lads” committed (actual) war atrocities (not phoney baloney ones). Polaroids of posing with severed heads, that kind of thing.

      The claims which you have put sauce and sprinkles on centred around one or two cases of British troops shooting dead prisoners because the orders they had meant they couldn’t afford to lug any around. This was back in 1992 in the Independent, prompted by the book “Excursion Into Hell – The Battle For Mount Longdon” by Vince Bramley. An investigation was held, and it collapsed in two years, not least of all because so much of said squaddie’s book, like so many of its ilk, was torn to pieces by others’ testimony.

      What are referred to as “battlefield executions” have always been pretty common in warfare, and is why surrendering rather than attempting to retreat or breakout from encirclement is always seen as a very last resort, because there’s no guarantee of the reception you’ll get, especially from people whose mates you’ve just killed.

      The nearest to an atrocity was tales of the tops of ears being cut off three executed soldiers who had claimed to be American mercenaries. It has been standard practice in most regular armies to execute all captured “soldiers of fortune” – in WW1 and 2 members of the French Foreign Legion never surrendered because they were regarded as “mercenaries” and could expect no quarter.

    346. Ruby says:

      Craig Murray –
      @CraigMurrayOrg
      Hundreds of anti-trans activists, purporting concern for the safety of women, have now tweeted or retweeted a photo of my home, with hate comments.

      Four women and three children live in my home. Their safety?

      Any concerns about the safety of the four women & three children when not in the safety of his home?

      What are his concerns re their safety while in their own home? Worried that someone might pin a ribbon or a sticker on his garden gate?

      He didn’t seem too concerned about their safety when he allowed them to be filmed on national TV & You Tube.

      I’m amazed that Craig Murray is not willing to listen to women’s concerns re self-id.

      It will be interesting to see what steps the Alba Party take re Craig Murray. Some guy that nobody had even heard of got suspended for saying something about Putin. I don’t believe anyone except those trying to score political points were that interested in Alba’s stance on Putin. I don’t think it will be an issue in the council elections.

      On the other hand the issue of women’s rights is a very big deal in the upcoming local elections especially for Alba. Lets see what they do about high profile Murray who joined Lorna Slater in calling women with concerns derogatory names.

    347. Ruby says:

      Andy Ellis says:
      13 April, 2022 at 9:43 am

      @Mark Boyle 9.21 am

      “Reality”

      It’ll never catch on BTL these days Mark. Sadly most of the adults have left the building leaving the place to be over run by a basket of deplorables

      Yeah! Yeah! Yeah! Blah! Blah! Blah!

      SSDD!

      Yawn! Yawn! Yawn!

    348. Republicofscotland says:

      SITREP Mariupol.

      “The Nazi drowning operation is said to begin today in Mariupol..

      At least ten fire engines to be either on the road or already at the factory to start pumping water from the river or sea and pumping water to above-ground ventilation shafts that carry fresh air to the cavernous network of tunnels below the Azovstal metallurgical complex..

      If Azov close the ventilation shafts, they will drown within a few days. If they do not close the ventilation shafts, they will drown in a few days. In any case, the siege of the factory will be terminated in such a way that the factory itself can remain intact..”

      The factory complex will remain mostly intact which will allow it to function again for the people of Ukraine.

    349. Republicofscotland says:

      A bit of head turning here from Sturgeon, trying to focus on Westminster when her government has put Scotland in a shambolic state, from ferry building to NHS dentists going private because Humza Yousaf has changed the way the NHS pays them, it now costs an NHS dentist more to complete a tooth filling than they get paid for by the NHS, so many are going private.

      Then there’s the worst waiting times on record at A&E’s in Scotland ambulances queuing up outside hospitals with patients in the back, record drug deaths and homelessness across Scotland, heating bills and food prices through the roof, prisons bursting at the seams, and what is Sturgeon calling for ah yes.

      “FIRST Minister Nicola Sturgeon has led calls for Boris Johnson and Rishi Sunak to resign after it emerged they will both be issued fines for breaches of Covid-19 regulations in Downing Street and Whitehall.”

      Like I said head turning by the betrayer the of Scots.

    350. Scott says:

      When liars lie verbally, they can briefly lose control of their arms.

      The syntax of the now-desperate ramblings of Ellis sponsored that comment.

      Disenfranchising 20% of those old enough to vote because they weren’t born in Scotland, but only for one day, is hardly ‘the crime of the century’, if indeed contrair to law.

      However, because Andy managed to find a woman who’d fuck him more than once and marry him that was English, he’d vote against Scotland’s right to self determination if the 20% were excluded.

      If Scots get a vote and nobody else, we can be assured that Scots law has deemed it lawful and proper for it to be so.

    351. Republicofscotland says:

      SNP Whitehall puppet Alyn Smith calling for Johnson to do more and give more to Ukraine, no doubt his SNP MP and brother in arms and fellow Whitehall puppet Stewart McDonald will be up next with a similar story.

      https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenational.scot%2Fpolitics%2F20064121.politicians-must-held-account-vladimir-putin-boris-johnson%2F

    352. Ruby says:

      I’ve been a woman all my life so I know what a woman is.
      What I don’t know is what a trans-woman is.

      Is it as simple as just being a man in a dress?

      I don’t have a problem with men wearing dresses etc but I do have a problem with the idea that a man in a dress is a woman.

      You can call me a racist, anti-trans, a transphobe and dictate that transwomen are women until the cows come home but I just don’t get it.

      Any reason why men in dresses can’t just be trans-women.

      Is there something wrong with transwomen being transwomen or transchildren being transchildren?

      Surely medical science could come up with a better solution for ‘gender dysphoria’ than heavy duty drugs/life altering surgery and trying to convince the general public that men are women.

      What difference does it make re their safety if transwomen are women? Women are not safe. Why would anyone think becoming a woman will make you safe? That’s nuts!

      How much does it cost to make a man look like a woman?

      Should this cosmetic surgery be available on the NHS?

    353. Scott says:

      Ruby asks:

      How much does it cost to make a man look like a woman?

      Ask India Willoughby how much was paid (£n) to look like a man that’s had a sex-change operation and then multiply it by itself to the nth degree and keep doing that until infinty o’clock.

      Roughly £Itcostsalotmorethanthat plus change.

    354. Ruby says:

      Republicofscotland says:
      13 April, 2022 at 10:34 am

      from ferry building to NHS dentists going private because Humza Yousaf has changed the way the NHS pays them, it now costs an NHS dentist more to complete a tooth filling than they get paid for by the NHS, so many are going private.

      Then there’s the worst waiting times on record at A&E’s in Scotland ambulances queuing up outside hospitals with patients in the back, record drug deaths and homelessness across Scotland, heating bills and food prices through the roof, prisons bursting at the seams, and what is Sturgeon calling for ah yes.
      et t

      These are all huge issues why aren’t we talking about them more?
      We can have a pissing contest about Ukraine for months on end but it won’t change anything in Ukraine & definitely not anything here in Scotland. Would it not be better highlighting for example that decent denistry is only available to those with money here in Scotland. If you don’t have decent teeth to chew your food that can lead all sorts of complications and ultimately longer waiting times and queuing outside A&E.

      How many SNP politicians and their families pay for private dental treatment? I bet they all do. With their salaries they could easily afford £2K + for a transplant.

      Obviously we can’t pay to accommodate unlimited numbers of Ukrainian refugees, cosmetic surgery & life long drugs for trans people and also offer decent dental treatment on the NHS. Decent dental treatment on the NHS has to go.
      It used to be we had 6 monthly check-ups but that has now been reduced to yearly check-ups.

      It’s fine ‘cos nobody likes going to the dentist anyway!

    355. Ruby says:

      Scott says:
      13 April, 2022 at 11:35 am

      Ask India Willoughby how much was paid (£n) to look like a man that’s had a sex-change operation

      Pity Willoughby didn’t pay to get rid of the male agression.

    356. Scott says:

      Ruby says:
      13 April, 2022 at 11:47 am

      Pity Willoughby didn’t pay to get rid of the male agression.

      He’s irrational, and will always be.

      Narcissists are by definition.

      Ellis fits the profile for ‘an intact predatory online transwoman’ in many ways.

    357. twathater says:

      @ ROS it is unbelievable the brass neck sturgeon has re calling out ANYONE for lying , you only have to watch her performance at the HR enquiry and her don’t knows and can’t recalls to realise sturgeon only has to open her mouth to speak and she is lying
      WHY are all the political parties and politicians who publicly proclaim their outrage NOT taking bozo and richy rich to court for the constant lies and denials issued by them during covid about partygate to parliament , and WHY are they NOT exposing and vilifying the CONSERVATIVE PARTY for their gross ineptitude and contempt of parliament and the electorate by NOT publicly SACKING these corrupt clowns

      And WHY are the broadcasters and msm FAILING to highlight the outrage that should be felt against these corrupt liars for CONSTANTLY ,REPEATEDLY and DELIBERATELY LYING about partygate

      WILL HOYLE the speaker who insists the word LIAR cannot be used against a member be sufficiently outraged at the clowns to ban them from the HOP or will they still be able to be addressed as the right honourable member , when CLEARLY they are anything but

      Will sturgeon the betrayer still keep us, Scotland handcuffed to this bed of rancid lying corruption elected by a shower of selfish greedy morons who cannot see the stupidity of their actions

    358. Stoker says:

      In todays buried news under the carpet:

      “Replacing Human Rights Act will weaken protections, say peers and MPs”

      Well no shit, Sherlock! Most Scottish independence supporters already know this. But of course we have to pay a fortune for Westminsters House of Parasites to tell us.



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