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Wings Over Scotland

They don’t care about you

Posted on February 14, 2014 by

Labour’s Michael Kelly on last night’s Newsnight Scotland, explaining that Scottish Labour MPs and MSPs would “to a person” back Ed Balls refusing a currency union, even if it damaged Scotland, because otherwise Labour might lose a UK election:

It’s nice to know clearly and unambiguously where Scotland stands as far as Scottish Labour’s concerned, isn’t it, readers? The only purpose of Scottish votes is to get Labour into power at Westminster, even if it means hurting Scotland to do it.

Coupled with Scottish Labour MP Jim Hood’s commendably frank assertion last week in the House Of Commons (col. 467) that If the Scottish people are going to be better off economically etc, I would still be against breaking away from the Union”, we at least can’t accuse them of lying for once.

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    277 to “They don’t care about you”

    1. This should be printed up and leafletted every labour ‘stronghold’ left – together with voter registration forms. The very people a yes vote would help are half the time so apathetic and beaten down, they don’t vote, they’ve lost hope.

    2. Calum Craig says:

      “Scottish” Labour, truly an oxymoron.

    3. Bill Fraser says:

      Watched that odious little man Kelly say that

    4. Seasick Dave says:

      If Iain McWhirter is reading this, I have an old cushion he can have for sitting on the fence.

      The other option is to get off the fence.

    5. Grant says:

      I am disgusted by these so called “Scots”.

    6. Tattie-bogle says:

      To Michael Walking Corpse Kelly, Labour wont win any election they are The Walking dead just like yourself AMC couldn’t make up half the shite you lot spew

    7. Tamson says:

      If memory serves correctly, every Labour First Minister, on taking office, swore loyalty to Queen, the Labour Party, and country – in that order.

      Why are people still surprised by this?

    8. muttley79 says:

      Michael Kelly, Jimmy Hood, Jackie Baillie, Johann Lamont, Margaret Curran, Paul Martin, Michael McMahon, Ian Smart, Ian Davidson, Duncan Hothersall et al. Jesus wept…

    9. Murray McCallum says:

      Who on earth votes for these people, is a member of their party and/or campaigns for them?

      Why do you vote for an organisation whose stated strategy is to damage your financial well being?

      What is going on?

    10. TheGreatBaldo says:


      I’m aware there is a lot of competition but is this the most ludicrous article in the Daily Mail yet ?

      “On the eve of my 34th wedding anniversary, which falls on Sunday, I find it more than a little unsettling to reflect that I may soon be married to a foreigner.”

    11. Embradon says:

      It will be interesting to read Labour in Scotland’s manifesto for the May 2015 General Election after a “Yes” vote.

      Something like “Vote Labour and we will work tirelessly to shaft Scotland in the negotiations” perhaps?

      That seemed to be what Michael (where did all the money go when you were running Celtic) Kelly and Jimmy Hood were saying.

    12. Desimond says:

      Imagine what Nicola Sturgeon is going to do with her 10 minutes to question Johann Lamont directly. She can go personal “Did they say this with you, their leaders consent” or she can go Party v Country “What is Scottish about Scottish Labour?”

      Either way, loudly stammering “We need to debate” wont save Johann, Scottish Labour or the Labour Party this time.

      To quote Bill Paxton in Aliens

      “Game Over Man, Game Over!”

    13. heedtracker says:

      Even the BBC bloke looks shell shocked. “Michael Kelly, if there’s a YES vote…” There is a YES vote ya choob, millions and millions of them!

    14. Alasdair Stirling says:

      I have just realised the problem. It is not that Scottish Labour oppose independence, it’s simply that they can’t understand the concept.

    15. heedtracker says:

      @ TheGreatBaldo, Thanks for link but this has got to be my “most grotesque English far right BetterTogether raging hypocrite of the day” mug award and its not even lunch time:D

      “But though the First Minister has cleverly succeeded in provoking some ill-feeling down south, where before there was only goodwill, this is nothing as strong as the Scots’ bitterness towards the English, as encountered by our son during his four years at Edinburgh”

    16. James123 says:

      Wow. It’s difficult for me to get my head round this. So he would vote against Scotland’s interests because it would hurt a party he would no longer be part of in a country he would no longer be part of.That’s definitely a head scratcher.

    17. Douglas Guy says:

      Surprisingly little use of qr codes on leaflets to take voters direct good sites, articles and to cached copies of clips like this.

    18. Desimond says:

      Labour – One Nation

      Fair play folks, its doing exactly what it says on the tin.

    19. Al Ghaf says:

      A very telling clip. His answer was instinctive and the justification was back peddling. The contempt Labour time servers have for Scotland runs deep.

      Just as the tartan tie is calculated. But they have no idea that we no longer live in the 20th Centuary.

    20. Seasick Dave says:


    21. Desimond says:

      O/T But did anyone see story in Metro today about the guy who hired a Billboard within Queen Street Station Glasgow to advertise his availability for work.

      Says it costs £300 which seemed quite reasonable to me given size of passing traffic.

      Could be a go-er for a giant Wings advert campaign across the nation?

    22. Angus says:

      The article is short and to the point about westminster labour having more ambition about saving themselves as a party rather than supporting Scotland’s interests in virtually any way and the truth of that remains, however there is a quite surprising (and negative) reaction through Facebook and other social media and blogs from the people whom westminster forgets about in all this politicking; the Scottish voter.

      Making those who can vote in the Scottish Referendum on Independence aware that we don’t actually ‘owe’ any money to the UK for UK debt is a real gift that many undecideds and soft no voters were unaware of, even after the announcement a few weeks ago that due to uncertainty of the market forces the Westminster government would as it should, reiterate its promise to pay the whole debt on what it has borrowed.

      The announcement is now seen as a precursor to this ‘new’ announcement by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, which is nothing ‘new’ just a stronger upgraded threat against us if we dare vote Yes.

    23. Jimbo says:

      I imagine we’ll be seeing these Unionist’s anti Scottish statements posted on billboards across the country in the very near future.

      I noted that, when Rona Dougal asked Danny Alexander, if there was a YES vote would he fight Scotland’s corner, he refused to answer. We can only assume therefore that out of spite, he would not.

    24. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      By being so joined-at-the-hip with the Tories and Libdems in this week’s Rough Wooing (not to mention the mindset that is highlighted on this page), I can see it soon being the case in Scotland that it would be better not to say you were a Labour voter, when in polite company.

    25. Morag says:

      Testing (sorry).

    26. JLT says:

      Tell you one thinsg, Scotland is going nuts ever since Osborne opened his trap.

      Phoned into Call Kaye this morning. Spoke to the controller there, who wanted to know what it was that I wanted to opinionate on. What he did tell me (as did Kaye Adams on her show) was that the phone lines were red hot and that it was highly unlikely I would get on. He did ask me for a comment, which they would try to get Kaye to read out.

      Just about every person phoning in this morning was now a hardcore ‘Yes’.

      I really believe the Tories want us to vote ‘Yes’. Convinced of it now.

    27. Triangular Ears says:

      Michael Kelly is the epitome of what has been wrong with west of Scotland Labour for decades. He is beneath contempt.

    28. G H Graham says:

      The British MP’s have but one purpose; protect their tax payer funded lifestyle for long enough to qualify for an ermine retirement robe.

    29. seoc says:

      The Scots, Welsh and Irish have always been seen by Westminster and Etonians as inferior servants who exist simply to pander to their self esteem – and finance them in all aspects of superior life.
      Huge shock on the way..

    30. HandandShrimp says:

      Labour in Scotland exist only to serve the Westminster machine, people living in Scotland are irrelevant. The reason they hate the SNP so much is that the shackles of servitude have been loosened and they have to work to get votes now. However, if we secure a Yes vote it is apparent it would be folly to include Labour as a party machine in any negotiations as they would poison the well with treachery. Individual Labour stalwarts that do care about Scotland would be a different matter, even No voters like Henry would bat for Scotland whereas Michael Kelly clearly would bat for Westminster.

    31. BigSteveChisholm says:

      Response to Douglas Guy.

      I’ve been thinking that myself. Maybe some WoS ‘address’ stickers are in order. Super simple – logo, web addie / QR code and an eye-catching strapline.

      I’m not encouraging vandalism. Just strategically placed stickers to drive traffic here. I’d buy a few (dozen) rolls to slap over gig posters in my local pubs & cafes. (sorry if they already exist and I missed them in the WoS Megastore)

    32. heedtracker says:

      Kelly and co are the living breathing embodiment of power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. I sat and watched this dude and Sir Gordon Brewer spend a whole BBC Scotland newsnight trying to destroy Labour for Independence. The pair of them, BBCLabour in Scotland, bettertogether but looking a bit less confident of their power now.

    33. Misteralz says:

      TheGreatBaldo – Went to open that in a new private window, just out of sheer curiosity. Turns out KittenBlock still works in private browsing.

      I’m married to an Englishwoman. We’ve been together for ten years and married for more than 70% of that time. I can’t understand the mindset that anything would change between us if one of our nation states changed overnight.

    34. liz says:

      It could be his age but it is almost like he is brainwashed,

      He didn’t seem to grasp that if Scotland was independent why would it matter who the hell got voted in at WM.

    35. Gillie says:

      Labour the One Nation party – ENGLAND

    36. R Whittington says:

      Anyone know what plan B is yet? I know a few undecideds who want to know what currency they might be using!

    37. muttley79 says:

      @G H Graham

      “The British MP’s have but one purpose; protect their tax payer funded lifestyle for long enough to qualify for an ermine retirement robe.”

      Correct, and it is beyond obvious now.

    38. HoraceSaysYes says:

      As blatant a demonstration as you will ever see that, for Labour, their loyalty and responsability is to the Party rather than their constiuents.

      It’s astounding, but unfortunately not at all surprising.

    39. Gillie says:

      R Whittington says: Anyone know what plan B is yet? I know a few undecideds who want to know what currency they might be using!

      Well we know that the UK Government’s Plan A and Plan B are.

      Plan A: Love-bomb Scotland

      if that fails (as it did);

      Plan B: Carpet-bomb Scotland

    40. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      @Misteralz says:
      I’m married to an Englishwoman. I can’t understand the mindset that anything would change between us if one of our nation states changed overnight.

      George told you yesterday what would change.
      He was very clear about it.
      One of you would become a FOREIGNER.

      Personally, I’ve no idea what a foreigner is.

    41. Les Wilson says:

      I think Scottish labour voters will be very upset that this Kelly supposedly speaks for them. Labour is in the gutter, and voters are stinging about these anti Scottish tactics.
      I hope the make their feelings known, sooner than later.

      In a NEW SCOTLAND I cannot see how a new refreshed Scottish Labour can every retain Kelly and his bunch of ("Tractor" - Ed)ous ” proud Scots “.

      One other thing, Tories just lost a by election to Labour in England. It makes me wonder if the Tories are, while assuming they will win the Uk election, are hedging their bets by actually wanting Scotland to go, and unwitting UK labour is actually helping to bring this about by also taking the kick Scotland line. What a hapless lot they are.

    42. taysideterrier says:

      All the people of scotland have to do is vote Yes and in effect we sack the so called (westminster) elite! All 600 or so!
      They dont work for the people they represent (possibly a few exceptions!) they work for there own gain, their gravy train and that of their vested interests.
      All in this together, I right…
      11% pay rise
      House flipping at tax payers expense for their benefit
      expenses scandal
      Allowing tax avoidance/evasion for their pals/”City”
      The list goes on and on.
      As soon as we have our independence and secure a written constitution that protects the people rather than the elite, the good people of Engalnd Wales and Northern Ireland will also wake up. Bring it on.

    43. Shiehallion! Shiehallion! says:

      Michael Kelly – the lining in George Osborne’s trousers.

    44. taysideterrier says:

      Would also like to insert the unelected house of lords into that list with their £300 a day, for in some cases sitting through a debate whilst fast asleep

    45. Desimond says:

      @G H Graham

      The last Irish Lord from The Free State \ Republic was still present in the House of Lords until 1961.

      All those Scottish MPs hoping for a long life reclining in Ermine and £300 quid a day expenses may be in for quite a shock when rUk see’s that bill aint being subsidized from Jock Public up North.

    46. James123 says:

      It was interesting that last night AS mentioned Henry McLeish on Newsnight and described as “for the moment a No supporter”. It is quite obvious that sooner rather than later he will come out in favour of independence.

      Wouldn’t it be great to see Labour for Independence create their own party with McLeish as their leader, how embarrassing would that be for SLAB. We could even see some defections from Labour MSPs to LFI. I can’t see SLAB surviving after a Yes vote, they will be severely tainted by their behaviour in the referendum campaign. LFI would be a clean start and they would provide the Scottish electorate with an alternative to the SNP.

    47. Morag says:

      Sorry, testing again.

    48. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      @taysideterrier says:
      the good people of Engalnd Wales and Northern Ireland will also wake up.

      … and, triggered by the need to remove all the Scottish Peers post-independence, they will actually finally carry out fundamental House of Lords reform.

      I know the Irish Peers got to keep their seats in the Lords, but it ain’t gonna happen this time.

      So … big market glut of 2nd-hand ermine-fringed Santa Claus outfits coming-up in 2016.

    49. tartanfever says:

      And on independence this is the bunch that will have to re-build Labour.

      These are the people that will remain in Labour looking for any job that they can find to keep their greedy snouts in the trough in an independent Scotland.

      These are the Westminster MP’s that may return to Scotland looking for a seat in Holyrood.

      Are we to believe that overnight they will become calm, reasonable, understanding individuals giving out a message of hope and prosperity to a fledging nation ?

      No, of course not, hence why my message to Labour for Indy is, and always has been, rip up your Labour memberships and start a new party. Why on earth you would want any of this mob tainting your cause ?

    50. Gillie says:

      Just been announced, “There will be no cross-party announcement on further devolution for Scotland before the referendum”

      The Westminster Axis of Evil can come together and say they will block a currency union, but they can’t come together to state what further devolution a Scottish parliament will have.

    51. Indy_Scot says:

      The man is clearly mad, infact he looks furious.

    52. Paul says:

      In Scotland because of the poll tax you couldn’t admit you were a Tory then with a certain betrayal of our students and for siding with the previous you couldn’t admit to being a liberal now for down right lying at the hustings and on television and for siding with the first you can’t look in the mirror and with out guilt say that I voted Labour. That means nearly half the electorate are ashamed of who they are voting for. For the other half they stand up and say with pride I voted SNP and I am voting to give my country a future and I am proud of it. What one feels all of you.

    53. Paul says:

      Last line meant to have “the best to”

    54. Morag says:

      James 123, I heard McLeish on the radio yesterday, and he was absolutely adamant that he was “unpersuadable” towards Yes. No ambiguity about it at all.

      Now where he puts his cross on his ballot paper on 18th September will be between him and his pencil, but I don’t think there’s much mileage in fantasising about him coming out as a figurehead for LFI in the mean time.

      Aftereards everything is up for grabs, but I think we will be able to do better than Henry.

    55. kendomacaroonbar says:

      @ R Whittington

      You have received an answer to your question several times now. Please take your trolling elsewhere.

    56. Robert Kerr says:

      O/T Sorry Rev.

      Received a mailshot from Ruth Davidson on behalf of “Conservative Friends of the Union”

      Reverse side is a questionnaire which starts with “How do you think you will vote in that referendum”

      There is an SAE for reply.

      Any advice?

    57. Morag says:

      O/T But did anyone see story in Metro today about the guy who hired a Billboard within Queen Street Station Glasgow to advertise his availability for work.

      Says it costs £300 which seemed quite reasonable to me given size of passing traffic.

      Could be a go-er for a giant Wings advert campaign across the nation?

      Desimond, I don’t think Wings will need to do this. I think it’s already sorted.

      Looking forward to this, I have to say.

    58. James123 says:

      My comment was rather in the realms of fantasy I agree. I do admire McLeish though for his common sense approach, a quality that seems to be severely lacking in the modern day SLAB.

      Here is a piece he wrote in the Daily Record today in case you haven’t read it.

    59. chicmac says:


      Desimond says:
      14 February, 2014 at 12:59 pm
      O/T But did anyone see story in Metro today about the guy who hired a Billboard within Queen Street Station Glasgow to advertise his availability for work.

      Says it costs £300 which seemed quite reasonable to me given size of passing traffic.

      Could be a go-er for a giant Wings advert campaign across the nation?”

      Sounds like a great idea, if those costs are true.

      But I expect political censorship will prevent.

    60. Desimond says:


      The issue I have is YES and Wings are 2 separate entities. I never go to YES website. It interests me not. Wings on the other hand is like a drug I feel we should all try and get others addicted to.

      Its the gift that keeps on giving and should be shared where possible.

    61. chicmac says:

      “Received a mailshot from Ruth Davidson on behalf of “Conservative Friends of the Union”

      Reverse side is a questionnaire which starts with “How do you think you will vote in that referendum”

      There is an SAE for reply.

      Any advice?”

      Anyone heading for New Zealand who wouldn’t mind doing a postal drop? 🙂

    62. Jeannie says:

      So if there is a Yes vote this year, who will you vote for in the 2015 UK General Election?

      The unionists will have to make clear in their election manifestos a year from now where they stand on negotiations. But their hands are being tied right now by Osborne, Balls and Alexander – no negotiating on the pound, whether it is in Scotland’s best interests or not.

      So when the Scottish Labour/Tory/Lib Dem candidates come to your door asking for your vote and tell you that if you vote for them, they will be taking a stand AGAINST your interests, how likely is it that they will actually get your vote? I’m beginning to think Labour has a death wish up here.

    63. heedtracker says:

      You know what’s weird and this is pulling from BetterTogether’s weird campaigning pile of garbage but how come here in Aberdeen there’s a complete silence from local Labour Westminster MP’s?

      In Aberdeen we have the raging vote NO, voteTory,Lab,Lib,UKIP or anyone but SNP Press and Journal daily but you never see or hear Labour MP’s like Anne Begg saying anything at all about the future of the Scottish nation.

      Very odd party, Labour in Scotland.

    64. Desimond says:


      Yeah I though so too to be honest but then considered just a plain white poster with the blue crest and with site name…whats political about that?

      Plus any publicity generated by a BT complaint is always a welcome bonus. Much better when you make things harder to get hold off…just ask Frankie Goes to Hollywood.. 🙂

    65. Macart says:

      I wonder if the eejit boy Kelly is aware of the Claim of Right? Scots proclamation to support self determination signed by party members across the board. Or if he’s aware that one of the first ports of call in an independent Scotland will be a written constitution?

      If not, then he better get some homework done sharpish. If the Scottish electorate vote for independence, that WILL be the settled will and intention of the democratic majority. He can get with the programme and help build a healthy, wealthy Scotland. Or he can with all humility and due reverence, feck off out of it as unsuited for purpose.

    66. liz says:

      testing also

    67. Craig P says:

      Talking of stickers I noticed today someone on my street with a WoS car sticker. Think I might ring their bell and shake their hand 🙂

    68. heedtracker says:

      Just googled Anne Begg MP Scottish referendum and top of page is oor Anne putting the fear of no pensions up pensioners. So that shut me up.

    69. chicmac says:


      Your right. Don’t see how they can object to that. Worth a try.

    70. Jeannie says:

      Was out delivering Yes newspapers this morning and near the end of my run, somebody hammered on his living room window at me. I looked over, a bit startled, and was rewarded with a big smile, a wave and a thumbs up. Fairly made my day 🙂

    71. Desimond says:


      I think these words and the start of the video perfectly sum up ‘The Old Establishment’ folk like Mr Michael Kelly aka

      Yesterdays Men

    72. theycan'tbeserious says:

      A vote for labour in Scotland is a vote for Westminster imperial rule to the detriment of Scotland and the other Celtic nations of the uk.

      Wake up Scotland. The only way to improve your lot is to vote YES as the existing labour politicians would rather you starve and struggle within this unfair union than be independent and prosper!

    73. Macart says:


      What utter guff heed. There is only one pension plan with the UK state, pay for it with direct taxation and extend everyone’s working life as long as possible. At least in an independent Scotland the cunning plan of having that sovereign wealth fund WILL provide a pot for the rainy days.

      Where do these people dream up this crap?

    74. Macart says:


      First class. 🙂

    75. Bugger (the Panda) says:

      Morag says:
      14 February, 2014 at 1:37 pm

      Sorry, testing again.


    76. Roll_On_2014 says:

      @Les Wilson

      One other thing, Tories just lost a by election to Labour in England. It makes me wonder if the Tories are, while assuming they will win the Uk election, are hedging their bets by actually wanting Scotland to go, and unwitting UK labour is actually helping to bring this about by also taking the kick Scotland line. What a hapless lot they are.

      Les the Tories were never expected to win that one, it was not even on their own radar. But the result did highlight a change in the pecking order. UKIP came 2nd, pushing the Tories into third place whilst the good old LibDums came 4th and lost their deposit.

      Mebee a continuing signal that shows Nigel Garages party is on the up, and it could be reasonable argued that the next UK government may be a coalition of Tory + UKIP, God forbid. But that image may help Scots in their decision in September.

      But it does appear, in this article, that postal votes played a significant part in the result.

      Now where have I read that before… NuLabour and postal votes?

    77. cearc says:

      Robert Kerr,

      How will I vote?

      By putting a cross in a box.

      Are they really so thick that they don’t know that?

    78. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Don’t want to exaggerate this, but at SSP stall in Irvine today, real raw anger.

      I’ve been doing that stall regularly for the past eighteen months and haven’t encountered such rage before – at one point, two complete strangers (a man and woman, both pensioners) started swapping notes on what they would do to Osborne if he ever dares show face in Scotland again, and I had to leave them to it as no leafleting was getting done. Poor Ozzy – his lugs must’ve been white-hot.

      (Good to see Aidan of this parish, albeit briefly. Cheers mister. Did you say Beith or Dalry tomorrow? – please post details here as I’m sure you’l get extra help offered following these latest ‘developments’!)

    79. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      Just a wee post, to make the last hour’s posts magically appear …

      (George Foukes, I know it’s you that’s causing the delays. Please read faster)

    80. cearc says:


      love it!

    81. heedtracker says:

      Hello Macart. Its predictable fear mongering but oor Anne is very low key up here, in her own slice of lifetime tenure North Britain. She’s on twitter though raving about “vote YES for no money” speech by Edinburgh vote No labour Ian Murray MP who gets it all here.
      “By Blair McDougall, Better Together Campaign Director

      “He can’t even give us an answer on what money we would use.” Written in black biro on a survey form returned to our HQ by Gerry, a previously undecided voter, a few days after Mark Carney’s speech on the Pound, is what for many voters has become the key issue in the referendum.”

      Super rich Tory boys and job for life socialist workers, all desperate to shut down new democracy in Scotland. Whatever next.

    82. Inbhir Anainn says:

      Personally I wouldn’t trust McLeish as far as I could throw him, wasn’t he attributed as the man who “quietly moved” England’s North Sea fisheries boundary 60 miles north thereby effectively giving away Scotland’s legal rights to 6000 square miles of prime fishing waters to the English.

    83. taysideterrier says:

      I for one will never again be voting for a party with links to westminster, no mater what the outcome of the referendum.

    84. Bugger (the Panda) says:

      Anyone out there interested in Michael Kelly might like to look at this wee piece from a “fanzine” type wikipedia thingy about him.

      Ooor Micheal seems to have no Mystic Meg touch. In fact it might be safer to find out his position and just do the opposite.

      “A member of one of the families that had controlled Celtic since its foundation, he sat on the club’s board of directors until 1994, when the club reached the verge of administration and the much-criticised old regime was ousted by McCann’s takeover.”

      McCann had said he hoped to raise around £10m from a share issue. Dr Michael Kelly advised fans to invest in the National Lottery rather than buy Celtic shares on the basis that you stood a better chance of getting a return. And in that one statement he beautifully underlined the reason we had to remove him and his colleagues in the first place. He was so well proven wrong on that thankfully.

    85. cearc says:


      Yep, Gideon played a blinder there, followed by the unnamed source.

      re. the testing. It’s all an evil plot by the Great Cybernat Lord to increase the number of comments!

    86. Greannach says:

      This is how it must have felt to live in East Germany.

    87. Bugger (the Panda) says:

      Inbhir Anainn says

      I think he has said that he was deceived.

    88. David MacLeod says:

      I think the Scottish voter more or less now knows that the Labour party is there for the labour party.
      We know this because in order to cement their position in Scotland, they built the “Scottish Parliament” which was a parliament built by labour for labour. We know this because their faces when the SNP won their majority spoke volumes and they occassionally refer to Holyrood and the parliament they brought to the people of Scotland.
      I think we sent a rather strong message out to Holyrood labour in the last election. A message they have failed to take heed of.

    89. Macart says:


      Why am I not surprised?

      Really though, the lady wants to have a look at just how pensions are being paid for right now and then wonder how they’re going to be funded in a future debt ridden UK.

    90. nelliejean says:


      I’ve just asked my English husband how he feels about becoming a foreigner. He says it won’t stop him voting Yes 😉

    91. BuckieBraes says:

      I started today filled with gloom over this currency brouhaha, but for a number of reasons now feel much more positive.

      Firstly, this is due to what happened at work this morning. I had a good-going discussion with two colleagues who have hitherto shown little interest in the referendum. Now, much of it was banter (one guy fished a couple of notes out of his wallet and said, ‘Will I just run these through the paper-shredder now?’); but the important thing is they were receptive to my comments.

      I don’t normally ram my views down people’s throats; but when they become receptive, I try to make them think.

      Secondly, watching the Michael Kelly clip I realise that Better Together is now being manoeuvred on to territory it doesn’t want to occupy. Out of their comfort-zone of simply rubbishing the idea of independence, the three main Westminster parties are now beginning to be forced publicly to defend their own policies on what the hell they will actually do if/when Scotland votes Yes. It’s not a place they want to be. The next few months are going to be very interesting.

    92. Rod Mac says:

      I do not want to open the old football debate ,however I find it incredible that “Celtic People” like Kelly ,Dr John Reid ,Frank Roy,Jim Murphy, Brian Wilson, and all the other Labour people with season tickets at Parkhead can so support the Brits.
      On a Saturday toe tapping to anti British songs and every other day die hard British Unionists on the same side as Iain Paisley…go figure.

    93. Misteralz says:

      Nelliejean – I doubt my wife’s going to change her vote, either. 🙂

      And that Tory mailshot? Save your week’s junkmail and stick it in the envelope and send it back to Tory HQ. Make sure it ends up over an eighth of an inch because then they’ll have to pay more for the postage.

    94. Andy-B says:

      Michael Kelly who was behind the Glasgow miles better campaign, is no completely against, Scotland’s miles better, as an independent country. Oh how I loathe SLAB, for all the right reasons.

      Meanwhile David Clegg of the Daily (drivel) Record gloats, at the pound debacle, and the Record view has a pop at Alex Salmond.

      I mean’t add this as well Johann Lamont, telling Scots to keep their hands off the pound, if we become independent, what flourishing country needs enemies when we have home grown ones like Johann Lamont and those above.

    95. heedtracker says:

      @ Macart. So that nice Ms Begg puts the BetterToegether fear and smear to work, meanwhile back at Rule Britannia central hardly 3 months ago-

      Britain’s pension shame: UK state pensions are the LOWEST in Europe – and even Slovenia and Slovakia give their old people more

    96. jon esquierdo says:

      Labour mafia

    97. Macart says:

      Nice to see this is pretty much going down with the Scottish voting public as expected. Which is to say all three Westminster unionist parties telling Scots exactly what their place in the scheme of things is, was never going to go down well. The smug smiles on Balls and Alexander’s faces being the capper.

      How the hell else did they think it was going to play? That we’d be cowed? Doff our collective caps and thank them for not whipping us? I hope they are reading these comments and getting some feedback from street level. They should certainly feel the wind up coming for the boot in the arse they’ve earned.

    98. Clootie says:

      Michael Kelly

      My jaw dropped when he said it out loud – I knew he was thinking it but to articulate it :-O

    99. The Man in the Jar says:

      Not particularly relevant to this article but due to events over the last day or two, the words of a Pink Floyd song “Time” keep coming to mind. Especially the last three lines of the song.

      “Hanging on in quiet desperation is the English way.
      The time is gone, the song is over.
      Thought I`d something more to say.”

    100. Flower of Scotland says:

      No currency union , no debt repayment , then rUK falls off a cliff ! That’s plan B ,

    101. Bobby McPherson says:

      @Rev Links are not working apparent ‘connection error’

    102. Macart says:


      Jeez, that’s brutal heed and in the mail of all places. But its just the red flag that should be waved in Ms Beggs face. Pensions aren’t safe under UK stewardship and haven’t been for quite some time. The cupboard is bare.

    103. Jamie Arriere says:

      Ex-lodgers and ex-landlords no longer have any economic trade relationship. Scotland and rUK will.

      Better find a better analogy!

    104. Seasick Dave says:


      Are you sure that nothing can be done from your end about the posting problems?

    105. Morag says:

      Here we go again….

    106. starlaw says:

      Tony Blair moved the fishing boundery , when SNP complained D Dewar stated it was meaningless

      been listening to BBC Scotland this morning think the exodus from labour has begun

    107. liz says:

      O/T just popped over to the guardian – big mistake – the complete crap being spouted is beyond belief.

      I posted a couple of comments and left – probably will not go back.

      It’s suddenly like the English are gobsmacked that we want to ‘share their’ £.

      They are falling over themselves to praise ‘statesman’ Gideon and talking about city types saying iScotland would be a pariah for ‘refusing’ to pay our debts.
      It’s collective madness.

    108. Jamie Arriere says:

      Wrong bloody thread! This posting delay is such fun

    109. Macart says:


      Oh its carnage alright, but useful carnage. I’d encourage everyone to take a look and post that link far and wide. Make sure people know just what they’re dealing with and just how effective Dave’s love bomb was.

      They’ve made a colossal mistake and so have the media. We get to see true colours all round. 😉

    110. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      dick at 1.19

      They will be using the pound

    111. Andy-B says:

      I think this George Osborne’s “treasury analysis paper” which has been cited as the reasons a currency union is a no go area.

    112. faolie says:

      @Gillie: “There will be no cross-party announcement on further devolution for Scotland before the referendum”

      Interesting. Got a link?

    113. Jimbo says:

      @ R Whittington

      Anyone know what plan B is yet? I know a few undecideds who want to know what currency they might be using!


      Plan B is to use Sterling.

      You can tell them they’ll definitely be using Sterling.

    114. Helena Brown says:

      I had a late friend who was an English Teacher and she taught in the same school as Henry McLeish, the pupils did not admire the man and neither did she, as she worked eventually in Castle Brae in Craigmillar in her day she was a tough lady who rarely took prisoners I believe what she told me. Henry is another one who is Party first, knows no other way. So I would say him voting YES is a bit like me voting NO.

    115. Davy says:

      Yep old Giddy Osborne has done us a really big favour with his smug announcment of no currency union to the natives up north.

      The Morning Call radio program this morning with Kaye was biteing, it was caller after caller stating they were now voting YES, and no matter how their comments were spun they never retreated from now voting YES.

      And the lady ex-labour counciller really put her point across very well and showed how disgusted she was with her party siding with the torys to put down Scotland, maybe the likes of Lamont, Ballie, Sarwar, Kelly, Grey and Davidson and the rest of the ("Quizmaster" - Ed)s would like to listen to a Scottish labour party member with intregrity.

      Well done Scotland and a 100 times over “you were great”.

    116. Andy-B says:

      This what awaits you if you vote no, George Osborne will make the biggest and deepest cuts to public spending in 50 years, says the IFS. The worst has still to come.

    117. ronnie anderson says:

      Ddos back error 503

    118. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      15:32-33 and I can’t get Wings on my iPad:

      Error 503, Guru Mediation XID: 434249777

      15:36 and I have got Wings now on the iPad, but it looks like post are 30 mins behind.

      Just sayin’ …

    119. Sue says:

      Oh no, if Scotland votes Yes in September, does this mean that my husband and I, both English born, both voting Yes, will BOTH be married to foreigners? Er, so what?

      By the way had a great time this morning folding the next batch of Yes papers ready for delivery Monday while listening to Call Kaye. Great to hear so many women passionate about Independence, and so many people sickened with Labour. Keep up the good work, Westminster.

    120. laukat says:

      Wee thought came into my head around Gideon’s no to currency union.

      Are they trying to force Scotland to have its own currency so that we have to buy the RUK government stake in RBS so that we can then nationalise it to have our own central bank?

      At the moment there doesn’t appear to be too many buyers. Is Gideon trying to create one?

    121. Ananurhing says:

      Just seen on RT this afternoon, Yanis Varoufakis Professor of Economics at Uni of Texas making very complimentary remarks about Scottish independence.

      “A very sensible kind of Scottish nationalism in the face of a very serious decoupling between England and Scotland.
      England is increasingly being absorbed by the logic of perpetual austerity for the masses, and socialism for the bankers.

      ….North of the border you have a majority of the Scots who are very seriously questioning the logic of perpetual austerity, who are completely and utterly committed to staying within the EU, and who are not taken over by the frenzy of xenophobia which is so evident south of the border, especially with the rise of UKIP and the general attitude towards the so called invasion of the British Isles by foreigners.”

    122. ronnie anderson says:

      And for their next TV apperance, Osbourne / Alexander / Ball,s, Saterday Night SPLASH ,with Tom Daily, take it east on them Tom, great height,s give them delusion,s of importance.
      And mind has the lifeguard,s Cameron / Milliband, and dont forget about the air flow, I recommend AQUA BAGPIPES, multable mooth pieces, mind dont let them droon,that,s oor privilage, on 18th Sept.

    123. Les Wilson says:

      Inbhir Anainn says:

      Your assessment of McCleish is also my estimation of him, he is way, sneaky and is currently hedging his bets just in case he can have influence again. He is also a close friend of Gordon ( the pickpocket ) Brown, they meet regularly. Says it all really.
      You are also right about Scottish waters, he was heavily involved with Blair in all that hidden deceit. Trust him not.

    124. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      @Macart says:
      Oh its carnage alright, but useful carnage. I’d encourage everyone to take a look and post that link far and wide.

      Like I just done on Al Jazeera:-

      (sort comments by newest)

    125. creigs1707repeal says:

      regarding currency union. In spite of Osborne’s bluster and BBC drooling, it has not been ruled out by Westminster. Here is what Sir Nicholas MacPherson, the Govt Treasury official, said:

      “…in light of the current stances I can’t recommend currency union …” (My emphasis).

      This is Osborne’s get-out clause. He hasn’t categorically ruled out a currency union based on the current situation. Situations change and that changed situation that will prompt a change of mind will be a YES result.

    126. Les Wilson says:

      laukat says:

      I would rather see RBS in London, most of them are already there anyway. They are toxic gamblers and are a risk to Scotland, I would encourage them to go.

    127. Andy-B says:

      Don’t know if this has already been posted, if so I apologise, but its still worth a second look.

    128. rab_the_doubter says:

      I can see this being the start of a ‘Celtic Spring’. The ConDemLab pact is one of the most disgracefully undemocratic things Ive seen in this country in my lifetime. If the worst happens – well, I’m too old to emigrate but my kids can rest assured that if they want to leave and live in a country which will treat them with respect then I will do my damndest to help them. Of course I’d miss them but better that than them being slaves to a South East dominated dictatorship.

    129. John H. says:

      Jeannie says:
      14 February, 2014 at 2:08 pm

      Was out delivering Yes newspapers this morning and near the end of my run, somebody hammered on his living room window at me. I looked over, a bit startled, and was rewarded with a big smile, a wave and a thumbs up. Fairly made my day 🙂

      You’re lucky Jeannie. An old guy in Bishopbriggs told me to stick my papers up my a**e last tuesday. (smiley).

    130. Jim T says:

      OK – help needed here wrt Michael Kelly and a sword that was gifted to him when he was Lord Provost of Glasgow.

      I have a recollection of him refusing to hand it back to the city because it was “a personal gift” from some Saudi prince.

      No mention of it anywhere via a wide range of Google searches. Anyone recall the details and, did he ever hand it back?

    131. Bugger (the Panda) says:

      update for me

    132. stonefree says:

      Shiehallion! Shiehallion! says:
      “Michael Kelly – the lining in George Osborne’s trousers”

      Agreed Both full of shit.

    133. Jim T says:

      @Calgacus – just given you the first “uptick” on that posting on al Jazeera.

    134. Robert Kerr says:

      Test to unblock.

    135. Jeannie says:

      @John H

      Aw naw…a stand-off! You should’ve compromised – and stuck them up HIS arse 🙂

    136. Alt Clut says:

      If ever THE moment for an organisation came then for ‘Labour For Independence’ this is it !!

      Go for it comrades and friends – the rest of us will help you – win the referendum now by showing Labour voters in Scotland how to take back their party through a YES vote that enables us to run this country in the interests of its own people rather than the toadies of the London elite who run Labour in Scotland now.

    137. Robert Kerr says:

      @Jim T.

      Provost with Saudi sword wasn’t Kelly but Peter McCann.

      Obituary here with details about the swords (plural)

    138. liz says:

      Calgacus MacAndrews – also upticked you.

    139. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      @Jim T says:
      OK – help needed here with Michael Kelly and a sword that was gifted to him when he was Lord Provost of Glasgow.

      I’m guessing it wasn’t the “simple sword of truth”.


    140. Westie7 says:

      Just Found this From the BBC Scotland News article
      Will Osbornes bullying backfire

      Alastair, a Scottish businessman, said clarity was more important. He added: “Finally we’ve got clarity in what the currency will be which is good, we know that we will not have the pound. but what we now need to know is what the alternative would be in an independent Scotland.

      My emphasis

      This is the message that needs putting to bed.

    141. Jamie Arriere says:


      Don’t forget this, for the private pensions too.

    142. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Desimond 1.58, As a YES campainer, I support all Indy sites, the internet is the only medium, we can get our message out, so I would encourage you to use all available resouces, Yes Wings is more informative, & we are greatful to the Rev, but not everybody know,s about W.O.S., its up to US to PROMOTE & SPREAD the YES CAMPAIN ALL INDY SITES.

    143. Desimond says:

      @Rod Mac

      “I do not want to open the old football debate”

      Lets not because your ideas of “Celts toe-tapping to Irish songs” are as out dated as the idea of Labour championing the cause of the working man.

      One to discuss at the 19th Sept Victory celebrations my friend in Wings

    144. Desimond says:

      @Rod Mac
      Apols sir,on reread I see my error there.

      Sadly they’re great love is not Labour or Celtic, its purely money and power.

    145. Rough Bounds says:

      Surprising just how many people in Scotland still regard Labour as the good guys and the Tories as the bad guys. Take a look at this clip. You’ll get the message.

    146. Capn Andy. says:

      Jim T.
      If my memory serves me, it wasn’t Kelly that got the sword it was Peter McCann.

    147. crantara says:

      Scottish Labour.The new Blue Shirts.No Pasaran.

    148. Desimond says:

      @Ronnie Anderson

      Indeed, hence my view that this expected massive YES advertising campaign while welcome, may not include the vital Wings, which does such a wonderful job in getting the message through to all visitors regardless of age, background or knowledge.

    149. Helena Brown says:

      May I remove Henry’s name from my remarks earlier it was Malcolm Chisholm so I think he will be unlikely to leave the Party either.

    150. Alba4Eva says:

      My experiences today… 3 individual instances of unrelated people talking to me today about the events of the last 48 hours, all expressed their move to a YES vote. I know that one of the was a previous ‘No’ voter and the other 2 were possibly undecideds or No’s.

      If my experiences over the last day or so is reflective of the general mood, then the Polls (provided they are not manipulated) are going to be quite extraordinary.

    151. Alba4Eva says:

      After the Michael Kelly video, a George Carlin video comes up… Much of what Carlin says is so true aboit the Westminster Unionists… worth a watch…

    152. Desimond says:

      I think we have a new addition to the “IndyRefSpeak” Doubletalk Dictionary. (You know when they say cant and wont and it doesnt actually mean that etc).

      Can we add:

      ‘Mixed Opinion’ actually means “Heavily Favouring YES”

      Judging by the Wings readers reports of todays Call Kaye shows overwhelmingly YES based audience response and the BBC’s reporting on a balance of callers into the show.

    153. X_Sticks says:

      “Scottish independence: Will George Osborne’s ‘bullying tactics’ backfire?”

      “We either have a triumphalist vote for independence or else a sullen and resentful vote against. Neither bodes well for harmony in the UK.”

      And BBC Scotland will have a lot to answer for whichever way it goes.

    154. AYEMAN says:

      Read Daily Record today where Osborne, in denying Scots the use of the £, said in his speech “Asking taxpayers in England,Wales and Northern Ireland to stand behind Scottish banks is a non-starter” and Alistair Darling “Why would taxpayers in England want to bail out banks of a foreign country?” Got a bit miffed and recalled something I read about Irish banks so did some on-line search and found this. In 2010 UK bailed out Irish banks with £7bn, Chancellor Osborne justified it to Westminster parliament “..because it is overwhelmingly in Britain’s national interest” as “Ireland was a friend in need which accounted for 5% of total exports” and that “Irish banks issue sterling”. So Westminster has one friendly rule applying to some independent countries but a totally hostile rule for a Scotland which constitutes the rUKs 2nd largest export market! Now I aint no web expert and it begs the question – “Why the hell don’t any of our so-called journalists in the MSM do some investigating and challenge the lies being fed to the Scottish people by unscrupulous politicians?” We all know the simple answer is that it does not fit with the fear-mongering agenda adopted by the MSM. Also, thanks to the link from Andy-B, I can now add Johann Lamont to this parcel o’ rogues for same reason.

    155. Wayne says:

      Labour have effectively self-destructed in Scotland, they will be severely punished by the electorate for this gangster squad love-in with their bitterati chums in the Tory/LibDem coalition. Labour are so ideologically committed to Unionism that nothing can possibly come between that. If every single leading economist in the world came out and unanimously agreed that an independent Scotland would be substantially improved economically by voting YES, they would still be against it. I find that staggering. Union before all else, self-interest before all else. Labour in Scotland are little more than puppets. And that doesn’t even take account of Lamont, possibly the most incompetent and intellectually challenged person ever to be promoted so high in the Labour ranks.

      Thankfully there is hope. The hope comes on the radical left, in the broad sweep of socialist groups that support independence, and of course with Labout for Independence. A revolution within the Labour party in Scotland can’t be far away, but it needs to happen now. Scottish Labour needs to break away from the UK party, either that or post-independence they will be overtaken.

      Scots will not forgive Ed Balls and co for this treachery. Henry McLeish is certain to flip to yes, and he won’t be the last high profile member to do so. The revolution is coming.

    156. Macart says:


      Ooo Nice. The more people see, the better.

      Need to sign off for a couple of days, but looking forward to seeing the results of this after its really settled in. On current evidence, I’d be fairly nervous were I the vising cabinet members on the 24th. There may be one or two folks present with something to say to them. 😀

    157. annie says:

      Someone on twitter just coined the new name Osballs – love it, wonder which one of them will feel the most insulted.

    158. kininvie says:

      Just an updating post. Nothing to say. It’s snowing.

    159. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      Update for me

    160. Papadocx says:

      A fresh wind is blowing through Scottish politics and my goodness the stench is overpowering, and the rodents are being forced out into the open, in their droves. The only people who haven’t noticed are the rats of the press and television who claim to hold the political rats to account, and are in fact their partners in deception and fraud of the electorate.


    161. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      @Macart says:
      Ooo Nice. The more people see, the better.

      I am trying to post on CNN at the moment. They are doing moderating.

      BTW : If many of us are having to post to see refreshes, there will presumably be a number of lurking non-posters who are not seeing an up-to-date view of Wings.

      Go on, go on, go on, go on … yes, you there … do a wee first post.

      Or maybes you would have to do a wee post before you could even see this message.


    162. Misteralz says:

      Posting to see what I’ve missed!

    163. Jamie Arriere says:

      I reckon these Ddossers care more about us than LabLibCon ever will!

    164. Findlay Farquaharson says:

      todays daily record poll with yes on 48% shows only a 2 point swing required.

    165. Lochside says:

      Several points: (1)noted that Andrew Neil and Kirsty Wark both adopted the haranguing approach yesterday to NS an AS respectively in their interviews yesterday. Obviously, concerted directorial policy perhaps? This has been the approach on BBC ‘Scot’ for a while, now appears Institutional procedure for dealing with ‘Nats’.

      (2) Hood and Kelly: what a pair of disgusting frauds. One obese and inarticulate, the other senile and bitter. A wonderful example of a rapidly decaying ‘Scottish’ Labour institutional corpse.

      (3) BBC were quick to dig out Bob Doolaly of BP for his personal take on Currency matters, where were ‘our’ Scottish Unionist Leaders yesterday?

      (4) McLeish: a slimy self-seeking prevaricator. I didn’t realise that he was the one behind the move to remove our 6000 sq mile of sea to England’s stewardship. But it figures. He’s simply speaking out as a fair play proponent in order to protect his prospective chances in Indy Scotland..Leader of the New ‘Scottish’ Labour Party anyone?

    166. well, thanks to Dr. Kelly that’s us more determined than ever to get the remaining 5,000 Labour for Indy leaflets we printed distributed in the areas that matter. (we’ve just delivered 40,000 papers to the good folk around here in Edinburgh West). Time to capitalise on the gift that keeps on giving !

    167. Findlay Farquaharson says:

      havin to wait ages to see posts.

    168. Robbie says:


      Watch now.

    169. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      @Jamie Arriere says:
      I reckon these Ddossers care more about us than LabLibCon ever will!

      If you let one into the house in Glasgow, would he be a “Lobby Ddosser”?

    170. jinglyjangly says:

      Allan Grogan on Aljazeera NOW

    171. Patrick Roden says:

      I am just testing

    172. Linda's Back says:

      Derek Bateman has some trenchant comments about James Naughtie’s interviews this morning.

      You could almost feel the venom coming from Kirsty Wark last night when she harangued Salmond

    173. twenty14 says:

      Rev – please can we no crowdfund a courtcase against the bbc (after we crowdfund a big march )

    174. Patrick Roden says:

      How did the meeting go today Rev? I hope they are able to put preventive measures against these attacks.

      I have saw it on several comments that their is a general Ddos attack against all wordpress blogs,

      might it be a way of hiding themselves or perhaps just some malicious nerds?

    175. Patrick Roden says:

      We need an immediate crowd funding effort so we can have a quick panelbase poll.

    176. Flower of Scotland says:

      Update !

    177. mato21 says:


    178. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      Well done Allan Grogan on Al Jazeera!

      He had a lot to put up with.

      It wasn’t hard to tell the difference between Professor Gallagher from Nuffield College and a ray of sunshine.

    179. ronnie anderson says:

      @Desimond,ah agree with you on that they want to be top dog,I,ve fell out with them a number of times,I,ve said it in my Yes group to,there should be no division by any Indy promoter,s.I post on Yes Scotland site promoting Wings / Bateman ect ect, & I will keep on doing that.

    180. kininvie says:


      All that ‘lender of last resort’ bollox…

      Here’s Sir Philip Hampton, Chairman, RBS, sticking it to the HoL cttee on economic affairs in 2012:

      Lord Hollick:It would seem that, absent a lender of last resort, RBS, based inScotland, would be at a severe competitive disadvantage in the marketplace.

      Sir Philip Hampton: It would depend on the arrangements. We should not think thatlender of last resort facilities relate only to the top company in any bank. For instance, at the time of the financial crisis in late 2008, because
      we have substantial operations in the United States, we used the US Federal Reserve as a lender of last resort, providing short-term liquidity when the market completely dried up. The Fed gave us lender of last resort facilities
      amounting to many tens of billions of dollars. That was because we had a US banking licence and we were operating in the United States. A central bank does not want its banking system to collapse, so it acts for all the banks that are operating in that country. We have used many central banks as a lender of last resort for the many operations that we have in the many jurisdictions in which we operate. That is a key part of what central banks
      do in the jurisdictions that they control. Just because there might be an independent Scottish Government does not mean that all our lender of last resort facilities would disappear; they would be continued

      All Sir Philip’s evidence is worth reading. Under constant pressure to admit RBS would be doomed after indy, he just gives the noble lords the finger, while remaining totally polite.

    181. northbrit says:

      A fine example here of how English people aren’t interested or in any way bothered by independence as Alec is so keen to point out to us:

    182. Alba4Eva says:

      Stu… what is being done to sort the site out. This is critical and at a critical time?

    183. X_Sticks says:


    184. HandandShrimp says:

      I have seen a couple of mentions of a Daily Record poll, anybody know what it was. I can’t see it on their website?

    185. Andy-B says:

      Alistair Darling deriding Alex Salmond in the Spectator, calling him, “A man without a plan”, amongst other things.

    186. ronnie anderson says:

      Calacu Mac have you any links, would every body provide links to world wide media comment pages, that way those of us non PC literate can navigate more easely, thanks.

    187. jinglyjangly says:

      Danny Alexander concedes defeat in Referendum, speaking on Scotland tonight he says that following the vote there will be negotiations. He did not say following a Yes Vote he said following the vote!!!

    188. Ian Brotherhood says:


      I know you’re busy, as ever, but any chance, please, please, (with a bottle of your favourite fruity-flavoured cider on top) could we have a Quarantine 2?

    189. Andy-B says:

      This in my opinion is the most telling, snippet from yesterdays sermon on the mound II. Why? well George Osborne wouldn’t answer any media questions, and did his best to dodge reporters. If indeed Scotland is not to be allowed to use the pound, wouldn’t the Chancellor have followed up his speech with a robust interview with the press.

      No the fact George Osborne wouldn’t even answer one of Bernard Ponsonby’s questions, including the very important one, “How much is this going to cost English businesses”, leads me to believe, the denial of the pound for Scotland is a empty threat.

    190. Wayne says:

      I went over to the Better Together facebook page just for a laugh, and I can’t believe what lies they spout. Apparently Salmond has now admitted that he can’t use the pound! Can you believe it, eh? Hold the front page!

      Still waiting for the BBC to pick up on the story from The Herald and The Independent. Or does a behind-the-scenes brieging only only count as newsworthy when it is damaging to the YES campaign. Nah, I am sure that never happens. The BBC are renowned the world over for their impartiality and fairness, they would never let themselves become the propaganda arm of the state and Better Together?

      There is a poll on the guardian asking whether Osborne had done the right thing in ruling out a currency union. Last time I checked less than 12% of people thought it was a good idea.

      Nice one George!

    191. Juteman says:

      Post for update.

    192. Roll_On_2014 says:


    193. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @jinglyjangly –

      No-one could claim that Danny ‘Foodbank’ Alexander has a good ‘poker face’. But he does resemble a busted flush.

      Watch how John Sergeant deals with his waffle in this old QT clip:

      If the comments I heard from the good folk of Irvine are anything to go by, he’d be as well keeping his big sonsie face south of the border for the next couple of decades – right now, there is a real desire to insert Alexander/Balls/Osborne/Cameron/Clegg into one another, thus forming a five-Tory roast.

      (Please see the following diagram – Alexander, for example, thinks he’s No 3, when, in fact, he’s No 7, and would easily fit inside just about anyone else. Please note how completely plucked they all are.)

    194. James123 says:

      I have seen a couple of mentions of a Daily Record poll, anybody know what it was. I can’t see it on their website?

      I saw it on there earlier, seems to have disappeared, probably wasn’t going the way they wanted it to. DR seem to do a lot of these polls but we never see the results.

    195. Findlay Farquaharson says:

      bloody nora, getting slower.

    196. HandandShrimp says:


    197. liz says:

      Andy-B. I took a look at the comments – god these folk are despicable.
      As soon as someone put up a perfectly sensible post about pegging the £ 1:1, he got voted down.

      I’m sure there are many decent folk out there but it seems to me a lot of them posting both there and on the guardian have this gleeful attitude that they are getting one over on us.

      By far the worst are the uncle Tams desperately trying to curry favour with negative personal comments on AS.

      BTW I think the rev is off line at the mo as he said he was going to try to sort out the problems with DDOS.

    198. Findlay Farquaharson says:

      the daily record poll is mentioned on yes scotland facebook page.

    199. Arbroath 1320 says:

      Just heard on (dis)reporting Scotland that Danny Alexander has written to Alex Salmond wanting to know what currency we will use in the event of a YES win. SERIOUSLY?

      What part of “we’ll be using the pound” do you NOT understand?

      I don’t think it could be any clearer. We either use the pound within a currency union, now denied to us by you and your best buddies.


      We use the pound in its own right without a currency union.

      The choice is not OURS to make Bubba but YOURS! Do you want an independent Scotland to help rUK with its incredible £1.3 Trillion debt or are you more than happy to keep all that debt for yourself, the choice is yours!

      Thanks to the statements from you and your best buddies yesterday I think we here in Scotland know your answer. Enjoy working to clear your £1.3 Trillion debt on your little own some Bubba. 🙂

    200. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      OK … enough is enough.

      Ye cannae just keep sayin’ “update” or “post for update” any more.

      Henceforth choose one from:-




    201. jingly jangly says:


      The DR had an online poll yesterday, probably that, I tried to vote but my computer started reporting a virus when I when on there site, it was one of the bogus virus reports tempting you to download a Microsoft security upgrade which gave you a virus… Anyway I didn’t go any futher so did not vote.

      If it was an online poll the results means nothing as all these nasty Cybernats take over these polls. Just wondering was that Virus expisode an attempt by dark forces to infect Cybernats p.c.’s?

    202. Aidan says:

      @Ian Brotherhood
      Great to see you guys out there today. Very much enjoyed meeting and talking to Richie Venton at the table. He mentioned a big SSP event in Ayr on March 3rd?

      The leafletting tomorrow is in Beith. This is the information I have on it:

      “Garnock Valley & West Kilbride YesArea will be doing streetwork at The Cross, Beith, beside the B7049 between Eglinton Street & Reform Street, Saturday 15th February from 10.30am until 12 noon, weather permitting.

      The streetwork involves handing out leaflets to passers-by and inviting supporters to sign the Yes Declaration for an Independent Scotland.

      We’ll meet about 10.20am to set up for streetwork beginning at 10.30am, in front of The Auld Kirk.

      If you haven’t helped out at our streetwork before and you can manage along we’ll be really pleased to see you.”

      It says weather permitting but the forecast for tomorrow looks pretty good. It’ll be cold, though, with a strong wind, so if anyone is joining us, wrap up warmly.

    203. James123 says:

      I’m having to use Opera to view this website, Opera, I know, WTF.

    204. Jeannie says:


    205. Ian Brotherhood says:

      While the gremlins torment us, why not use the messages of ‘refreshment’ to state what you see as your own, personal, benefit post-Yes?

      We all do different jobs, have different family circumstances etc. We all have reasons which are fundamentally ‘selfish’ – that’s not necessarily a bad thing, but it’s true nonetheless.

      So, here’s a starter:

      ‘As a writer of prose fiction, I want independence for Scotland because it will break the stranglehold that the Londoncentric publishing industry has on Scottish, and other so-called ‘regional/minority’ literary activity.

      I believe that independence will unleash the most intense outpouring of creativity Scotland has seen since The Enlightenment – I’ll be able to do my own stuff, in my own chosen form of language, without worrying whether this or that metropolitan ‘reader’ will take one look at my address before chucking the ms I spent five years writing on the slush-pile.’

      There ye go.

      What’s your reason?

    206. Roll_On_2014 says:

      With regards to The Daily Retard I notice that they have not said a word on ‘Red Ed’s ruling like Thatcher’ episode.

      May I suggest to Joan McAlpine, if she is reading this, that she raises it in her Tuesday column piece. We must keep those Labour die hards up to speed on their leaders aspirations.

    207. msean says:

      Can someone tell me the process re postal votes and how they help a party at election time. I thought you request the postal vote and send it in to the returning officer?

    208. Jim T says:

      @Robert Kerr – thanks for that.

      I suppose I now have to grudgingly apologise (unreservedly-ish) for besmirching such a fine upstanding member of the Glasgow community.


    209. Morag says:

      Post to refresh comments.

    210. Dcanmore says:

      Horrible piece by Nick Curtis in tonight’s London Evening Standard… “I love the Scottish but… ” Apparently us Jockos should just shut up as Scottish Independence is nothing more than whine and an irritation according to this nobody ‘commentator’. Here’s all 500 words of it…

      A couple of extracts if you don’t want read the full shite…

      “I wish the Scots would just bloody SHUT UP about independence. I mean, when did the Battle of Bannockburn happen? 1314, that’s when (or as we say in England “about quarter past one”). Let it go, already. Every time Alex Salmond or some other McTalking Head comes on the news to whine about it a red mist of irritation clouds my eyes and the arguments are drowned out in my head by the words of Ewan McGregor’s smack-addicted Renton in Trainspotting: “Some hate the English. I don’t. They’re just wankers. We, on the other hand, are COLONISED by wankers.” (his emphasis).

      and … “That’s as sound an argument against Scotland’s ability to survive alone as any counter-case I’ve heard from the independence lobby. Does Scotland leach from the financial teat of powerhouse England or are the figures fixed? Would (disputed) ownership of (dwindling) North Sea oil and gas reserves see Scotland prosper? Who knows? Who cares? The economic argument is a nonsense zone of massaged figures.”

      As an attempt to lovebomb us he does mention that he enjoys a smoked sausage supper when in Edinburgh (and that’s it folks).

    211. Arbroath 1320 says:

      I can’t help anyone looking for the poll in the Daily Record but Munguin has a copy of the poll in the Courier. I suspect the figures are similar to those in the daily Record.

    212. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Aidan –


      Big SSP event in Ayr March 3rd?

      News to me mister.

      It’ll be because we operate a ‘cell’ structure, not unlike that favoured by the Illuminati. I, as a mere foot soldier, occupy a tiny cell far-flung from weighty orbs of knowledge and power.

      (I am, if you like, a pea lying on the fringes of the bowling green.)

      No doubt they’ll let me in on it nearer the time!

      Good luck tomorrow. I won’t make it, but will be with youse in spirit. You can look forward to hearing some highly imaginative suggestions as to what Osborne, Balls and Alexander can do with their clumsy ultimata. The ones I heard this morning are, for the most part, unpublishable, but kept me smiling and warmed my innards.

    213. Marcia says:


      Anyone can request a postal vote. Unlike years ago you needed to go through hoops to qualify for one. Parties can now target voters and may through canvassing or via surveys send out postal vote application forms. The voters may send a completed form on to the party sending it out or direct to the Electoral Registration office in their area. Parties are not allowed to sit on these forms and they must be sent to the ERO with a specific time. Rules were tightened because of the activities of Labour during the Glasgow North East by-election.

      When an election is called postal votes are sent out to the voters. All candidates get a list of all postal voters that have been sent out. You will find that these people will be targeted by the candidates in the election first as these people in the main vote but not always as the list will contain a lot of elderly and not all send the forms in.

    214. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Don’t let these delays put you off commenting – don’t wait until it all appears to be back to ‘normal’. There is no such thing as ‘normal’.

      Just keep posting as usual, and let’s make this the busiest thread yet – send the message out to these cowardly anonymous fuckers that we will not be disrupted, distracted or suppressed.

      Post now and post often!

    215. cearc says:

      hello wingers

    216. jingly jangly says:

      Ch4 News, 80% of private jobs created in UK post recession are in London!!!!

    217. Misteralz says:


    218. Jim T says:

      Here’s a forum in the Swiss edition of “The Local”:

      I think they need some guidance …

    219. gerry parker says:

      That was a busy day delivering another batch of Yes papers working toward an iScotland and listening to some Jazz on my iPod while I do it. Looking to extend my territory next week.

    220. twenty14 says:

      I believe Independence will be the biggest lift this Country could ever possibly get. People will walk about with a smile, help others even more than they do now. All those burden that we carry will be that little bit lighter and others will help carry their load. We will be the talk of the World and the World will watch as a small nation of 5 million plus people gain their Independence ” without so much as a bloody nose “.

      On Independence day I would like to see bonfires lit at dawn on top of every Munro in our land ( see Lord of the Rings 🙂 )and the World to watch the biggest Party on this Planet.

      My happiness is that we’re just 7 months away from this happening

    221. ericmac says:

      “total s h * t. wings over scotland is a propaganda site run by a homophobic bigoted nationalist scumbag fantasist who claims to be a reverend.. a man of god.

      most of the posters are the same people posting the same nonsense over and over again with multiple accounts… to call any of then intelligent is laughable.. if they were intelligent they would be taken in by sliarmond.. in fact many of them are probably the ridiculous rev himself keeping himself amused in his brighton bedsit..

      also your quote about 1 million users is total nonsense. less than 30% of the population support indy and wants over scotlands own panel base poll showed that less than 9% of the population paid any attention to sites that stemming pile of crap. perhaps you could tell me what 9% of 30% of the electorate is? even assuming all of these people visited wants over scotland it certainly isn’t 1 million!!!”

    222. gerry parker says:

      Good post by Derek Bateman over on NNS.

    223. gerry parker says:

      @ 2014


    224. cearc says:

      I like the idea of beacons as well but not just munros. We’ve got lots of hills.

    225. twenty14 says:

      @ericmac – Get John McMad over here for a chat so we can ease the burden on his poor wee soul

    226. Richard Bruce says:

      I hate to bring 1314 into the up to date views on Wings, but, is this not like de Bohun’s charge at Bannockburn, (a chance to kill the Scottish problem stone dead)?

      Stand your ground, wait till you see your face on his armour and …

      Well I think we all know what happened there!

    227. Croompenstein says:

      @mutley79@12:21- the list reminds me of the time that Norwegian commentator listed all the Brit’s when Norway beat Eng-er-land at football..your boy’s took one hell of a beating..LOL I will recite the list merrily on 19th sept with that appendage..ha ha your boy’s took one hell of a beating..

    228. liz says:

      checking in

    229. Morag says:


    230. msean says:


      Thanks,it seems I didn’t realise that these can be sent to the party,whatever party it may be.Must admit,doesn’t sound right sending your vote through a party office,even if they sent you the application/ballot originally.

    231. cearc says:

      I liked Danny boys response to being pushed on other economists disagree. ‘one or two might’.

      Does he know who wrote the fiscal report? Does he know who they are? Has he read it?

      What with that and giddy’s authoritative, won’t allow them to use sterling. Poor Carney must be squirming and thinking he has entered a madhouse.

    232. Croompenstein says:



    233. Richard Bruce says:


      Nothing wrong with Opera, fast, efficient, works where others fall, bit like Scotland in a way. Does what it says on the tin!

    234. twenty14 says:

      If Rev’s no here can I be Rev for the night

    235. a Supporter says:

      I don’t normally use very intemperate language but after what Labour’s Michael Kelly has just said above I consider him to be the lowest form of ("Tractor" - Ed)ous life on this planet. I would have no compunction in putting him in front of a firing squad.
      And please quote me if you will DMail.

    236. Richard Bruce says:

      Does anyone have a link to the Alex Salmond/Wark interview on YouTube?

      I hate going near BBC websites now.

    237. fairliered says:

      Thought anent the last week. A guid Scots comprehensive education makes you cleverer than an English public school education.

    238. fairliered says:

      Next time the SNP get to submit a motion at Westminster, what about: “When Scotland gains its independence, all Scottish Lords will be expelled from the House of Lords.” It won’t be passed, but it would be worth seeing the reaction from Davidson, Lang, Foulkes, Darling, Goldie, Forsyth, Wallace, etc.

    239. Les Wilson says:

      msean says:

      Ref Postal votes, as far as I can gather, they visit houses in labour districts and get people to sign a proxy for that allows them to submit the form on behalf of the person.

      For those who are too infirm, the ill, cant be bothered voting,the elderly etc ” don’t worry, we will do it for you”
      Maybe a few bottles of buckfast given away, etc.

      Then they pile up and count their “postal vote”and present them when required. I saw a labour guy in the Livingston election doing just that. Smiling all over his face. They marginally won, I guess, because of these votes.
      It is certainly along these lines. It’s a fiddle, labour are famous for it.

    240. MajorBloodnok says:


      (That was my Dad’s move in rock, paper, scissors. I think he cheated.)

    241. Morag says:


    242. Jeannie says:


    243. Les Wilson says:

      I guess we have all noticed the fever Unionists have over a Plan B, they ask everywhere, in every time this subject is raised, they are desperate to find out so they can then try and rubbish it en masse.

      SG playing the right cards, and ignoring it, they can’t take it and are foaming at the mouth. Alex is playing it spot on, keep them wondering, they are getting ever more desperate, great! However, it shows disarray in the Unionist camp.

      Expect more irrational stuff. Does anyone know who it was that said ” A YES is not a YES?” I want to shake his hand, well maybe not, but you know what I mean.

    244. Clootie says:

      Ian Brotherhood (good idea)

      Good idea – what is your reason for voting YES?

      I will gain very little directly. I will probably pay more tax as an offshore worker. I may pay more indirectly to Holyrood.

      My reason for voting YES is that I’m happy to contribute more to support the following issues in order to have a fairer country. Free education / a first class NHS / Better pensions for the elderly /an end to unfair taxes on the poorest and weakest / an end to foodbanks –
      for this and more count me in.

      Paying my tax at present to support the following Trident / Aircraft carriers / High speed rail to turn Birmingham into a London suburb.
      This they can shove.

    245. MajorBloodnok says:


      …and that about wraps it up for this evening folks.

    246. Misteralz says:

      We’ve got a new troll! 😀

    247. Paula Rose says:

      So – left of centre folk in Scotland talk about a brilliant new democracy, whereas right of centre folk bemoan the fact that we are too wee, too poor and too stupid to do anything,
      is that right?

    248. Arbroath 1320 says:

      Re postal votes.

      I remember this coming up at the last Holyrood elections in 2011. I have never been happy with the idea that postal vote “applications” can be sent via political party’s. I live down in Dumfries and Galloway and if I remember correctly the postal vote applications return address was for Labour H.Q. in Glasgow. Glasgow! I mean WTF?

      In my view this form of applying for postal voting is so open to voting fraud. Why on earth should ANY postal vote application have to go through a party’s H.Q., it shouldn’t! I’m prepared to accept political parties helping those who can not make it to the polling station, but do it there and then on the door step, or inside in inclement weather 🙂 but above everything else the return address on the postal vote application MUST be the local Electoral Returning Officer NEVER a political party H.Q.!

    249. Gerrintaethem says:

      I am voting yes because not to do so would be to accept that this Orwellian nightmare we are enduring is as good as it gets.

    250. X_Sticks says:

      How I wish for a successful Scotland where our kids can make a good life for themselves.

    251. Boorach says:


    252. CameronB says:

      I don’t know why Anton Karas sprang to mind. 🙂

    253. Vronsky says:

      My ex-wife was a definite No. Following this week’s events she is now a probable Yes, and will not be voting Labour again. I didn’t ever expect to see either of those outcomes – if she has changed, others must have too.

    254. James123 says:

      @Richard Bruce
      Nothing wrong with Opera, fast, efficient, works where others fall, bit like Scotland in a way. Does what it says on the tin!

      Guess I shouldn’t knock the wee guy, although it’s starting to play up as well now, no fault of its own of course.

    255. cynicalHighlander says:

      James123 says:
      14 February, 2014 at 6:56 pm

      I’m having to use Opera to view this website, Opera, I know, WTF.

      I have used Opera, not so slow as Firefox was becoming, for a year or so and this problem has more to do with various OS 32bit 64bit platforms in different ways i.e. its weird. Like now I have had to type all of my details in yet earlier one letter brought up the option to click.

    256. msean says:

      Thanks to all re postal votes,thinking that this system will need to be sorted in an independent Scotland.

    257. cynicalHighlander says:

      It seems the posts are never the same like a kaleidoscope a different image every time one views the site!

    258. Fergus Green says:


    259. cynicalHighlander says:


      Labour’s candidate, Michael Kane, retained the seat with 13,261 votes, a majority of over 8,000 on a low turnout of 28.24%. A total of 10,141 postal votes were cast and only 13,883 on the day.

      Draw ones own conclusions.

    260. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

      stone (of destiny)

    261. Les Wilson says:

      In elections of any kind postal should only be gathered at one point which is monitored and all participating parties and their members should be banned for harvesting them at risk of large fines. Fill in any gaps I have missed!

    262. Desimond says:

      @Ian Brotherhood

      RE – What is your reason for voting YES?

      I believe my reasons are perfectly captured within this image from Mackenzie Thorpe, it shows my idea of the philosophy we shall all follow in a free Scotland

    263. Fergie35 says:

      Makes my blood boil watching these self important labour bashed tarts talking Scotland down, however, the feed back I am getting locally after Dod Osborne’s speech is not too complimentary towards the chickens ( ie no voters) so keep it up Dod, we thank you for the 5th columnist support, you erse hole!

    264. Misteralz says:

      We’re going to win this. 🙂

    265. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      A possible swing back in England to Labour, irrationally based on the fact that David Cameron can’t control the weather,presents us with a problem. Our continuous cry of “no more Tory Governments for Scotland” implies that a Labour government in London is a better idea.
      If even unintentionally we make such prospect seem somehow attractive we damage our own prospects.
      Concentration should be on the useless contribution of Labour in Scotland and in London. The biggest impediment to Scottish independence has always been the Scottish Labour Party which has always sucked up and neutered lots of the potentially progressive political forces in Scotland

    266. Muscleguy says:

      @Flower of Scotland

      The problem is if we mint a Scottish pound and peg it to Sterling. The hit to their balance of payments, debt load etc will inevitably drag Sterling down the pan.

      Would this be good for Scotland? It would be good for exporters but bad for our pockets, more expensive energy and food. Meaning the Scottish Govt will have to compensate us in some way.

      So remember all that when your wish for schadenfreude over Westminster gets the better of you.

      Of course Sterling is not the only currency we could peg the S-pound to. There’s the Euro, the US Dollar or Norwegian Krona. Think on that last one. Small European country, oil economy. How’s that for a good fit?

    267. john king says:

      “I would rather see RBS in London, most of them are already there anyway. They are toxic gamblers and are a risk to Scotland, I would encourage them to go.”

      Absolutly agree, I would not wait for them to make it appear as if we’re begging them to stay, I would invite them to go as soon as we get a yes vote.

    268. john king says:

      “Calgacus MacAndrews – also upticked you.”


    269. john king says:

      “McLeish: a slimy self-seeking prevaricator. I didn’t realise that he was the one behind the move to remove our 6000 sq mile of sea to England’s stewardship. But it figures. He’s simply speaking out as a fair play proponent in order to protect his prospective chances in Indy Scotland..Leader of the New ‘Scottish’ Labour Party anyone?”

      Welcome to the club, now you know why most people despise him and to claim he was misled is quite untrue, he knew EXACTLY what he was doing.

    270. Bill McLean says:

      O/T – MSP and councillor Cara Hylton – the latest example of how low Labour have sunk! Labour in Scotland is a curse on the people – unfortunately many haven’t yet seen it.
      We have to win this referendum to achieve the decent, socially conscious, peaceful Scotland most want. I’m still having to sign in?

    271. Thanks for the link to Alex V Wark. I do not rate Wark as a good journo’.

      I always remember her spectacular, but, but, but, but, but… interruptions from the 90’s/00’s.

    272. Howie says:

      Wark is an excellent example of a parody on Parkinson’s dictum. Fame is achieved when mediocrity expands to fill the opportunities that good connections provide

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