Spoiler Alert
Still wondering what Humza Yousaf’s going to say to the SNP’s pretend “conference” on independence strategy this coming Saturday? Well, wonder no longer, because this morning he told Sky News.
In other words, he’s waving the white flag and praying for a miracle.
“To be frank, there is no rabbit to pull out of a hat, there’s no ruse I can cook up […] The only way to break that Westminster intransigence is through the power of the people, making sure we build up as much popular support to break that logjam.”
Readers struggling to identify how that differs from the policy that Nicola Sturgeon followed – to a striking and complete lack of success – for the last eight years, struggle no more: the answer is “Not at all”.
Humza’s got nothing. He literally just told you that himself, in his own words. He’s just going to sit around hoping that somehow there’s a sudden groundswell of public support, and that if there is it’ll somehow make Westminster cave in.
Unfortunately, the public just wants him to shut up about it.
What that tells us, remarkably, is that barely half OF SNP VOTERS put independence in their top three priorities for the next three years. (Which would admittedly explain why they elected Humza Yousaf.)
And even if it was their priority, they wouldn’t trust his government with it.
(And who could blame them, as it’s the safest bet in the world that he’s about to whip his MSPs to publicly declare their confidence in the stupefyingly incompetent Lorna Slater even as she costs the Scottish public hundreds of millions of pounds.)
We hope someone shows up with a much better plan – or any plan – sharpish.
In 1705 Scotland was a long established independent country – by 1707 it wasn’t!
There was one, and there IS only one reason Scotland lost its independence – the Treaty of Union.
What was done by others, long since dead, can be undone by us – in our time.
These are words from the “Declaration of a Sovereign Scot”.
“I do not consent to the terms of, nor the continuation of, the Treaty of Union established through the Acts of Union in 1707.”
Do you want to end the Treaty of Union?.
I will have blank forms of the “Declaration of a Sovereign Scot” at Bannockburn, if you want to sign and join those who already have.
The world will be told of your answer, and generations yet to come will see your signature.
*************
If you want to follow the progress of the Declaration initiative, it will be found via this link, not on here:
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100070340354557
If folk didn’t know before, they know now. The SNP is a dead, deceased, ex-movement for restoring Scotland as a sovereign state.
Disgusting.
Who are the 75,000+ members who STILL believe this shite?
I blame them as much as the SNP politicians.
THEY are the ones prolonging this nightmare.
On so many issues of late I have come to hate the SNP for making me side with Tories. Of course they are right to call for a vote of no confidence in Slater, she’s an absolute half wit who should be no where near the controls of a cooker, never mind in an office of government.
Only 22% of the Panelbase survey think Independence is a main priority. And 57% realise the SNP couldn’t achieve it anyway. And there are swings to Labour of 14%. I’m not sure that the “every election a de-facto referendum”, plebiscitary thingy,is such a good idea
Oh… it’s this coming Saturday is it? I’m so focused on not giving a toss I thought it was last week! 😉
…Of course; it’s all yesterday’s news spiced with some random pretentious shite from people who are (in business terms) out-striped by folk selling sports socks on street corners anyway.
I must remember to forget about it this Saturday too!
“I’m not sure that the “every election a de-facto referendum”, plebiscitary thingy,is such a good idea”
Why? The entire point of it is that if you lose once you just move on and try again.
Can see it now Scotland herded back into Labour fold and the Tories still in charge of running the estate.
Ach, ye cannae tak the breeks aff a hielan man, we’re aa Jock Tamsons bairns and there’s one born every minute and like adages….
PUKE!
“making sure we build up as much popular support to break that logjam.”
Our problem (well, ok, there are other problems…) by now is that he, and too many others, perceive “we” to mean “the SNP”.
It’s long past time for the “we” to mean something else.
The SNP are a liberal (whether neo or not) devolutionist party. In common with other liberal parties, at least these days, they are not interested in actually doing any governing or persuading anyone to anything. No, the people must persuade themselves on independence and then they *might* do something about it.
In the meantime they will, like the US Democrats, stick to doing no governing of much worth. People are cottoning onto that, hence Health etc rising to the fore because they perceive it to be a mess that’s being badly governed. However, the defence is in place….you are bullying them if you expect them to do anything to fix it, and you are bullying them if you’d like to see anyone sacked because they are not doing anything to fix it.
What a carry on.
There is someone who will deliver independence. His name is Alex Salmond!
Surely the “Scotland United” option proposed by Alex Salmond is the best way to show ‘popular support’ for independence?
Well…
I’ve coughed up my ten quid for Saturday, paid for my train tickets and I’ve seen the agenda too. So, I’ll be there on the day. Had I seen the third part of the equation before committing to the first two, that wouldn’t be the case.
This isn’t a conference and neither is it a convention (whatever the hell that’s even supposed to mean given all the participants will be from the one party at a party event organised by… that self-same party). It’s a seminar at best. A long-winded, short of substance, in desperation for attention, attempt to keep the show on the road. A carrot-stall and nothing more.
How can I say such things? Easily.
There’s been something of a distinguished history of late of the leadership attempting to muffle the membership, to control the ‘message’ and to silence questions or dissent from the floor. It’s not been healthy and it has brought us to where we are now: no further forward than we were in 2014 politically, and in a death-spin organisationally. This event, however, is one stage more regressive than even that.
I like Lesley Riddoch, I really do, but wheeling her and a few others out is no substitute for real debate. We’ve become a party afraid of itself, or, more precisely, a leadership cohort afraid of its own party. It’s not a debate (it’s not even a discussion) if you don’t open yourself up to alternative ideas. Where’s ABM or Ash? Why isn’t there ideas (be they good or bad) in the mix? It’s not that this isn’t healthy, it’s not even politics. Let the echo chamber commence.
G
Colonial-administrators don’t do original thinking.
As regards the comments made this morning about Ms Lorna Slater, I remind everyone that NONE of the so-called “Green” MSPs had the guts to put their names up for election on ballot-papers. They were ALL elected on the “List” basis.
This means that the electorate had NO say in the election to Government of the freaks that are propping up the SNP government – AT A PRICE.
Who made up the “List” of “Green” candidates? Why, it was the Green Party loonies themselves – and the Green Party put their people on the list in THEIR order of preference! The electorate (that’s us) had no say from start to finish.
One of the prices for the “Greens” supporting the SNP government was Ms Slater getting an appointment.
Not a good deal one fancies, not for the SNP, and certainly not for us, the people suffering the consequences.
“In a press conference to be held in Westminster at 5pm today (Tuesday 20th June), ALBA Party Group Leader Neale Hanvey MP will publish international legal opinion that states that the Supreme Court was wrong in the Scottish Government’s independence referendum case”
Stephen says: 20 June, 2023 at 12:13 pm
There is someone who will deliver independence. His name is Alex Salmond!
Aye? …Well I hope the wee gadgie van he tries deliver it in is LEZ compliant otherwise they’ll criminalise him before he reaches the city centre.
I understand that it was a Scot who first thought of the mechanization of decapitation not a certain Monsieur Guillotine.
I have no ax to grind on the matter but occasionally the rulers benefit from a reminder of their «impermanence».
Let’s face it Sturgeon had absolutely no idea what to do when she proposed a special conference to produce a strategy for independence. HY is, after all, the ‘continuity candidate’ so I am not surprised he has no idea as well.
I was reading the Scot gov paper on a constitution and it struck me that if I wanted to design a policy to divide the independence vote this would be it.
The crown is still important to a lot of older people as is seen as safe and stable.
Nuclear weapons, while a lot would be happy to see them go others recognise they have worked for the last 70 years and the Russian threat real or otherwise will always be used by the unionists. Their continued presence could be a good bargaining chip.
Having a right to this that and the next thing sounds like free bread and wine for the masses to the soft conservative vote. Tieing a future government to what is a policy rather than a principle is a nonsense.
Almost everything in the paper will divide the vote and provide ammunition to the unionists.
A more subtle approach would be to say there will be a written constution stating who gets a vote, how representatives stand and their terms of reference.
This paper could have been designed by a unionist as a car crash and certainly not by someone wanting indy. All these issues are for an indy government.
It is beyond belief that those in charge of the SNP are so devoid of political judgement.
Loony trooz and the climate scam reassuringly low on priorities, I’m pleased to see. Will any heed be paid though?
The referendum isn’t the problem. The SNP focus on it because they are frightened of creating a Scotland that could glide seamlessly into independence. They think the surgery needed on the economy (big but perfectly doable) would frighten the horses. So they don’t campaign for independence (although they pretend to) the actually only campaign for a referendum which they won’t get, and which they would lose because the horses would get frightened. And the sad part is you are all falling for it. You think it’s about the referendum too, but let me tell you it isn’t, it’s about independence and that means creating viability before any vote, afterwards would be too late and any vote would be reversed.
I have gone off the de facto referendum as right now it just amounts to yet again voting for a party I despise ‘for independence’.
If the SNP was the pre 2014 SNP it would be a great idea, but it is not, it is this current post 2014 abomination. Making it a de facto referendum only gives these wanks something to hide behind yet again.
Also the de facto is never going to work either IMHO due to the turnout problem. Turnout will never be high enough to get an absolute majority of voters.
Even in 2014 with 84.6% turnout the 55%.3 NO was still not enough to get a majority NO. The 55.3% NO only amounts to 46.8% of the electorate. On that 84.6% turnout the NO vote would have had to be just over 59% to just secure a 50%+ majority NO.
The turnout problem will mean you never get a majority NO or YES unless one of them takes very significant lead.
What this does mean though is if a minority YES is not enough to seal the deal then it must mean that a minority NO was not enough to seal the deal. That works both ways, right?
2014 was only a minority NO not a majority NO. If they won’t accept a minority YES (in a de facto or otherwise) why would we accept a minority NO in 2014.
I am sure that I am not alone with friends still in the SNP. Not one agrees with the current leadership but they are not dealing with reality. I hear versions of the same refrain over and over….
“I have been a member since I was 16”, “I have been a member for 40 years”
It reminds me of the old Labour remarks “My Father was Labour, my Grandfather was Labour…etc”
Party Politics/Loyalty has nothing to do with Independence. We should have one Primary objective.
The YES Movement stalls and marches of 2014 were disconnected from Party Politics. We need to get back to that.
The Rev @12.06 Why? The entire point of it is that if you lose once you just move on and try again. (In response to my suggestion that plebiscitary elections are not a good idea).
It turns out it wasn’t Einstein who said that repeatedly doing the same thing over and over again but expecting a different result, is a definition of insanity, but whoever said it surely had a point. But Shakespeare had Brutus say that there is a tide in the affairs of men, which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune. It seems that all the indications we have show that the tide, and certainly the flood, are not moving in the direction of Independence. It may have done once, but the repulsive SNP leadership destroyed that with policies loathed by Scots and
the British people generally. Calling every election a “referendum”, which is a contradiction in terms, will risk repeated failure especially when you consider that only 22% of this recent survey even regard Independence as a main priority.
Humza Useless, the epitome of the definition of Insanity…
Sturgeon’s real ‘crime’ was in spurning the opportunity to demonstrate that we can govern our own nation better than Westminster can.
Despite the shambles south of the border, she revealed to all that we are crap at governance.
The softer ‘Yes’ voters will never vote for indy because it would mean increasing powers for the buffoons that have held the (limited) range of powers that were afforded by devolution for the last decade and more.
At least Salmond knew how to run a government.
Sturgeon did to indy what Gerald Ratner did to his own company.
“We sell crap”.
And so does the present FM.
Shug;
Holyrood has voted by a large majority, more than once, for the removal of illegal nuclear bombs from Scottish soil (predictably, only the Tories voted against).
IMHO there’s more than ‘a few’ of us who want them gone.
He describe routes to Independence in such defeatist terms. He says we can’t have Independence. That’s what he’s saying.
“No ruse to cook up”
“No white rabbit to pull out of a hat.”
No country obtains her Independence by asking for permission. Humza. Why don’t ye go and bile yer heid.
He’s waving the white flag. The only thing white he likes I imagine.
I’d like to add, that Nicola Sturgeon will not be at the SNP conference in Dundee.
She’s tied down in the criminal investigation into the missing 600K where she’s been arrested as a suspect.
The fact that she’s not going to the conference to discuss her route forward just proves what a fraud she really was.
How can she not spend the weekend with her pals elsewhere? How can she just drop her defacto referendum idea and not be there to make her case?
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
That`s the strategy after nearly a decade of consultations,debates,meetings,diologues,conferences,round table discussions,blue sky thinking,
all those University educated brains and all they have come up with is
Can we have a referendum please,
No,
Be better of with Laurel and Hardy or the Three Stooges in charge.
Scotland is being run by the end product of `Positive Discrimination`
where skill and talent must give way to underrepresented groups no matter their lack of qualification for the job.
Q.Where does a Diddy hide ? A. In a field of diddys. When will he – they stop surprising me with their constant trash. I remember the summer of 2014 and the optimisim that was about. 9 years , yip 9 long wasted years and we are not even back at square one. The SNP are without, vision, balls and a leadership that are as piss poor as a community council on magic mushrooms.
Only one way now elect enough Alba and ISP candidates and then go for plebiscite elections.
With other recent polls showing between 51 and 57 % of people in Scotland wish the country to be independent then we still have hope.
I don’t see Labour having a comeback.
And turnout in Scottish general elections is of course much lower than (the suspiciously) high 2014 referendum. Looking at the history of Scottish GE’s the highest turnout was the last one in 2021 at 63.4%… once you get down to that level of turnout to get an absolute majority you would need to get nearly 80% YES (or NO).
So the defacto will always be ignored as inconclusive. Even with 55% YES at 63.4% turnout you are talking about only 34% of the electorate voting YES in a de facto. It is just not enough to demand independence on, not even a second referendum really.
I came to the conclusion it will be almost impossible to get a majority YES or NO when they are so close and when you factor in the turnout problem. There would have to be a very big shift in one or the other to change this.
If turnout was 80% you would still need nearly 62% YES or NO to get to the 50% of the electorate finishing line.
I am really not sure there is a solution to this until we get the needle moving on YES again and get people reanimated with the 2014 spirit…and even then it will be tough.
Scot Finlayson says: 20 June, 2023 at 1:32 pm
Scotland is being run by the end product of `Positive Discrimination where skill and talent must give way to underrepresented groups no matter their lack of qualification for the job.”
Exactly so… Racism (for example) is still racism whether it discriminates against the black or the white; it’s not a one-way street. The same sands for sexism, sectarian bias, classism… or any other bigotry. But it’s not just this deranged, counter-productive tokenism that is the problem; blatant cronyism (corruption) and rote management sit at the heart of many of our troubles.
This isn’t unique to Scotland, nor the SNP though.
“I remind everyone that NONE of the so-called “Green” MSPs had the guts to put their names up for election on ballot-papers.”
Actually they did. Twelve including Slater and Harvie stood in constituencies. All lost tbf but facts are sacred and all that.
They were ALL elected on the “List” basis.
Indeed but there is nothing inherently wrong in that. If/when the ISP and Alba make a breakthrough at Holyrood it will almost certainly be via the list.
The problem with the Green MSPs isn’t that they are elected via the list, it’s that they are incompetent fruit loops!
Brexit turnout 72%, Leave vote 52%. Total voting Leave 34.4% or about a third. That is all we have to achieve.
Yusaf is a cross between Micawber and Pangloss.
Something will turn up and all is for the best in this best of all possible worlds.
In the meantime he fiddles …..
If HY was a true leader, he would have a plan.
If SNP were an Indy party, Indy would be no.1 priority.
The SNP have shown themselves unfit to govern Scotland, with their GRR and BRS incompetence headlining the act, Ferries not withstanding, and court cases in the offing.
Where does that leave us?
HY if he had a shred of decency would resign forwith. We need a new start and we can’t have a FM of Scotland elected in a party that we all believed stood for Indy first and who does not have the slightest clue how to bring it about. Ash Denham had a plan, Alec Salmond has a plan, so step aside, let them get together and let’s get an election at the earliest opportunity to resolve this.
Resign, Go Away. Your continued (continuity) insanity should stop now.
SNP is actively killing independence.
The cost of living, alone, is responsible for the rise in support for YES. SNP has absolutely NO POLICY for delivering independence, that should chill you to the bone!
SNP imposters deserve to be removed, regardless of any separate investigation!
Mac @1.46pm
If a %age win for control is good enough for westminster uk elections, it’s good enough for a Scottish referendum or Independence win.
since 2015 UK General Election
SNP 56/59
two results
independence – ZILTCH closer
eddie izzard now suzy izzard
Sturgeon’s de facto U-turn on independence, while resigning from her premiership, under police investigation, is to be viewed as what, exactly?
All just coincidental?
Not compromised in any way. Nothing to see. Yet still, people are queuing to kiss her arse!
The Scottish National Party is beyond the pale! ‘Sell-out’, doesn’t come close to describing this tragic bunch.
All the while, their non-stop rhetoric is how devious their comrade Tories are. Bring back Wooden Stocks, to town squares. These arsehole politicians should be publicly humiliated!
Humza says: “there’s no ruse I can cook up.”
He says: “there’s no rabbit I can pull put of a hat.”
He’s saying to all Independence voters. 53 per of Scotland polled and rising.
Humza is admitting he has no desire to smash the established order.
He admits he has no ideas for Independence.
This weekend will be the end of the SNP in the public eye. The end for Steven Flynn. For Mhairi Black. Keith Brown and the rest of the carpet baggers, loyal to the cult. Nicola and not the cause.
They can sign that bouquet of barbed wire.
Yousless isn’t interested in Scottish independence, an to be quite honest neither is the current crop of SNP MPs and MSPs, bar one or two. Yousless spilt the beans at a hustings for the leadership contest ( I called it a contest but it was fixed shoe-in by Murrell, GCHQ and some of the membership who don’t want independence) in which he said that no one can deliver Scottish independence.
Yousless only concern is keeping his party and himself in government and in a job, his track record as Health/Justice and as Transport secretaries were abysmal, and as the SNPs MSPs, and memberships choice for FM he’ll fail miserably as well.
Anyone one with half a spine and a desire for independence has dumped this party of charlatans ages ago, what’s left is the detritus, the dross the dregs, the gravy trainers and egotists, a vote for this current SNP, jammed packed with poor and mediocre liars and frauds, is a vote help keep pushing Scotland over the cliff.
There’s no excuses anyone whose still a member of the SNP ISNT interested in Scottish independence, and ergo is part of the problem and not the solution.
Get the SNP MPs/MSPs out at every election the longer it takes to do so the more damage they’ll do to Scotland especially with the degenerate Greens calling the shots in may departments.
It will take time to move forward sadly Sturgeon did huge damage to the movement and it will take time to undo what that dirty Judas and her MPs/MSPs did, sadly many older voters don’t have the time left to see an indy Scotland achieved.
Kate Forbes. She better better head for the life boat, because she’s going down with the ship on Saturday.
Karen & Anthem, that was pretty much the same conclusion I reached when I saw how difficult it would be to get an absolute majority. It has to work like that or it would not work at all.
It is a problem though as how do we effectively ‘demand’ independence or even indyref2 with only a 1/3 of the electorate voting for it.
So while yes this is no different to any other election I think they will just use this to ignore us.
Then what? What exactly can we do with a third of the electorate.
So 44% of the ‘Scottish’ people put education as their top priority. I would’nt worry about it, you can’t educate pork.
The Labour loving shit rag the Daily Rectum (Record) doing down Margaret Ferrier calling her “desperate” and promoting their preferred candidate who I won’t name in one of their notorious articles today. They even have a linked video with that die-hard Britnat Jackie Baillie mumbling on about Ferrier.
Slater needs to go. She’s clearly incompetent, has wasted time and money for businesses across Scotland and has taken a scheme which could have worked alongside what we have now, turning it into an either or situation. I also suspect the new DRS is going to be an excuse for councils to reduce staffing levels.
Yousaf won’t survive the next election, assuming he lasts that long. The backlash the SNP are facing is something they’re clearly aware of, hence this whole ‘we’re for independence, honest’ scheme.
I would be seriously worried if we achieved independence with this lot in charge. Can you imagine the deal they would negotiate for us, can you see them being anywhere competent in dealing with the logistics involved separating from England.They don’t give a dog’s bollock for this country.
Support the AUOB march this Saturday in Stirling.
The SNP conference will be in the hundreds.
The true supporters of indy will be in their thousands.
https://twitter.com/AUOBNOW/status/1666209360886784020
David Hannah
Forbes is no loss to the indy movement, she wants to go down the same road as Yousaf (S30) when it comes to indy she made this crystal clear at the leadership hustings, only Ash Regan had a plan, and that’s why Murrell GCHQ and unbelievably the membership DIDN’T vote for her.
The current SNP is a barrier to convincing folk and achieving independence.
Stephen says:
20 June, 2023 at 12:13 pm
There is someone who will deliver independence. His name is Alex Salmond!
—–
But he didn’t did he? He is the one that caused this mess in the first place by calling a referendum far too early and not working out the details. You know – the small stuff that Scottish people worry about, like pensions and what currency they will use.
Remember this? https://www.gov.scot/publications/scotlands-future/
Just when Neale Hanvey IS about to pull a rabbit from the hat. Well done Humza for yet again demonstrating you and your parties’ utter uselessness. https://www.albaparty.org/scottish_independence_supreme_court_was_wrong
this time, I’m convinced
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fDTUhlYMdc
phone baloney rhetoric by empty coats
strategies that can never ever work
a refusal to use the tools available
but the jobs and pensions are very real
if federalised-devo-max delivers more no-show divershitty jobs for scotland, this is the best we can do
it’s quite impressive for a firm to go bust before it has done any business – kudos Slater
Nikki back at the ‘rood, on the tag and under curfew I hope; her crime was fraud – selling people fraudulent investment schemes to do with scottish indy
When those who support independence really traumatize those who don’t the ground will move.
Sadly, Mr Yousaf is altogether too «nice» to be a ground shaking, political T.Rex.
Not sure why folks are throwing their toys out the pram here. If you do not have enough support to win the vote , why have one ? Just for the sake of it? Most folks know in their hearts that No would wipe the floor with Yes if another Indy ref was had at this point. I do not think he is saying much wrong here, unless you are advocating for civil unrest to make your point.
dasBlimp @3.14pm.
There was a plan for currency and pensions, but of course the Britnat media and their House Jock politicians at Holyrood scaremongered and put the fear into pensioners that they’d lose their pensions if they voted yes to indy.
On the currency thing Alistair Darling openly admitted after yes lost that Scotland could’ve used the pound on independence. The Britnats No plan was built on fear and lies hence their real moniker Project Fear. Project Fear if I recall correctly spewed some major bollocks like we’d not get the BBC on independence (a bonus if you ask me) that we (Scots) wouldn’t be protected from an attack from outerspace if we became independent, that the MoD might need to bomb Scottish runways, and that bastion of truth, honesty and parity, Lord George Robertson said that Scottish independence would lead to the Balkanisation of Western Europe.
Then we had the head of the Civil Service Sir Nicolas MacPherson come out and say after yes lost, that the Civil Service couldn’t standby and do nothing as the UK broke up and that his office worked tirelessly to keep the union together.
Of course a majority of Scots DID vote for independence in 2014.
Wee Britnat mouthpieces like yourself fear Salmond just as the current SNP fears him and Westminster also fears him because he led us to an indyref in which we lost because everyone was enfranchised, and 72.1% of folk from elsewhere in the UK (mainly England) who lived in Scotland at the time and probably still do, along with many more as Sturgeon the Judas census, a year late, and vasty more expensive is still hidden so we don’t know yet the figures for incomers from South of the border.
There is no plan, and there is no plan because the only plan that can work is simply anathema to the SNP Leadership (a party of which I’m still a member).
Alex Salmond is wrong. ALBA and others need to assert their independence by standing candidates at the next GE – maybe not in every seat, but certainly against the SNP in some. It and they need to assert and underline ‘their’ political’ Independence as anything other than this will just confirm it/them as the lap-dogs of the SNP. If Unionist wind, who cares? It only bloody Westminster!
The real battle ground is Holyrood.
Just as Nicola Sturgeon as SNP leader was comfortable publicly stating that she could understand why members might want to consider casting their list vote elsewhere (she urged such people to consider the Greens?), Humza Yousaf needs to do the same also.
Nobody bats an eyelid when Labour stand aside for Cooperative party candidates and we shouldn’t fear Alba. It should repeat its stance at the last HR election and not contest any constituency votes and stand everywhere on the list. Only that will give us an Indy majority and decimate the Unionist representation.
Only that will change the narrative internationally and give us then voice need to demand change. Everything else is mere begging and hiding.
Poor Yousaf.
I think he actually believed he had been gifted the role of First Minister of Scotland.
But it could be that the early faint light that is the dawn of understanding is creeping inexorably across the landscape of his dim awareness, and is revealing to him the truth.
The truth that he has been shuffled into the role of figurehead fool in the ‘Scottish Colonial Administration Service (SCAS)’ instead of what he believed was that of First Minister of Scotland.
The shame he must feel to know that he has become the enabler of Scotland’s coloniser. The shame he must feel in the realisation that he has become an accomplice to Scotland’s bane.
And the shame he must feel to know he has become the pathetic pet of the same imperial master that once held the people of his line in the tight grip of British colonial rule in the Punjab region of Pakistan.
Poor Yousaf.
He is unaware that a place awaits him in the frozen icy lake of Cocytus alongside his heroine, Sturgeon, in Dante’s Ninth Circle of Hell.
But perhaps Yousaf can yet avert his doom. Perhaps the light of understanding will free his conscience from the illusion of imperial glamour.
And perhaps, even now, he will resist his colonial master and stand up for the people of Scotland.
That happy outcome, of course, will never come to pass.
I wonder if there’s a spectator stand overlooking the lake of Cocytus. The view from there would provide some meagre consolation, I suppose.
Poor Scots – that we have to put up with such a farce in our name.
In the June 2016 Brexit Referendum 30% SNP of the 120k membership voted for Leave, 40 thousand folk I wonder how many are still SNP members ? The SNP the ship to take Scotland to Independence ?
@Den 3:31pm
I wouldn’t be so sure about that. Most polling companies are still weighting the independence question by voter recall from 2014. As time goes by, this increasingly distorts the ‘corrected’ result towards ‘no’ because of the strong demographic differences involved. Notably, those companies that do not do this have been producing ‘yes’ percentages >=50%.
It wouldn’t surprise me therefore that if there were a vote tomorrow, the result would be a narrow ‘yes’.
Yesterday I was speaking to a former No voter, Remain for Brexit and probably SNP/LibDem in ‘normal’ times.
He is a small business owner, both sons and his wife work in the company…. Motor Mechanic business.
He says, (and he always discusses and listens to what me and other customers are saying), he says, the folk in the industrial scheme he is in, and his customers, ALL of them, are saying, ‘the SNP are fucked’.
This is Perth folks.
Humza is so bad, he’s not even made a dent enough for folks to bitch about him, and Nikla just got arrested.
Everyone, including him, are aware of rumours, of misuse of ‘kitkats’ from the top down of ministers, of lavender marriages, of house sales and French Abassadors, missing money, missing accounts, unexpected camper vans (bought with cash).
What they are also aware of is standing charge for power up x4, power per unit up x 4. Materials and spare parts up 40%.
One large-ish medium company, panel beater, 95% of their business is via insurance… their fuel bill increase alone, for this year, up £80,000.
Meanwhile 4 mechanic apprentices laid off this week at one of the larger car dealers, and everyone else there told the company will close in Perth in the next 6 months.
Hyundi, Renault, Jaguar, Nissan, and 3 others I can’t remember at present, those dealers gone from Perth’s motor mile this year.
The Ford dealership rumoured to go later next year.
Perth College/HIU notification out that teaching jobs are being cut back.
In the schools, class room assistants being told there are to be redundancies.
In Perth City, the council (SNP) have just raised the rates, a ready reckoning with locals 7 shops have closed… this week.
Now here’s the bit that’s really, really interesting, this former No voter is looking to hear what Alex Salmond’s policy and plan is, and is prepared to host a business meeting with other Perth business reps to that affect.
That is a sea change.
Keep hanging in folks, as best you can.
ROS says something at 3:41
if any of that is true, which is speculation at best (and somebody else’s fault as usual), then Scots must be a gullible lot. Do you think they didn’t see through the lies of Project Fear? You can worship chubby Salmond all you like but, to me, he is nothing more than a tartan Boris Johnson.
bad dream murrell paid 250k to see the titanic but got arrested
no beacon
battery opperated
bolted in
logitec control
James
You can vote against nuclear weapons all you want at Holyrood nobody gives a dam
You need to get independence and then decide what is required and a degree of pragmatism will be required
DasBlimp @16.18
And yet, commencing with a minority executive, from 2007 – 2014 Mr Salmond demonstrated a canny, sound governance of Scotland which built up support for independence from a pitifully low percentage to the region of 50%. Whilst delivering services which achieved a high degree of public approval.
Has Mr Johnson left his Premiership with a similar degree of popularity for his cause, his Party or even his reputation. I wonder.
@Den (3.31) –
Who are you?
What does it have to do with you?
It’s now becoming clear that we’ve had a govt in power which was actively stalling on independence. So we’re entitled to wonder what could’ve been done by a party which *did* want it. Whether or not that party is Alba, time will tell.
But it’s up to us, the people who were betrayed by the Murrells and the people they’d press-ganged into their cabal, to decide what happens next.
Your ‘advice’ is unsolicited and unwelcome.
And that’s putting it very politely.
dasBlimp.
You haven’t a clue about my 3.41pm comment, because you’re a little Britnat numpty sitting at Denison or somewhere similar spewing your BS to put indy down, you haven’t clue and it shows. We in here have dealt with your kind for years, and we’ll continue to do so until Scots rid themselves of this rancid bucket of sewage union.
Now run along to Turner or Fleming for advice.
Wrong again ROS. I am a supporter of an independent Scotland just like you (but for a different reason.)
Denison/Turner/Fleming? I have no idea what you are wittering on about.
Yes, Sven. Salmond did all of that but the fact remains that at the final hurdle, he blew it. He didn’t convince the voters and that’s why he lost. Don’t get me started on that molten tub of lard, Johnson.
&Ian brotherhood What advice did I give ? I have gave an opinion based on the details of the article (namely chart 3) which as a subscriber to this blog I am entitled to give. Don’t like it scroll past it. (As I do with yours) you’re not the moderator so do one.
Ottomanboi , puke indeed.
G-man , since you will be there can you take some photos just to let us know how many attend – there will be photos aplenty of the indy march and it would be good to compare.
I’m sorry that I can’t make the march and maybe see some auld kent faces but I hope it’s a huge success with no monsoon to dampen spirits.
From a certain perspective the SNP under Sturgeon’s aegis is just another political entity two timing the Scottish people. It follows in the foot prints of Labour to which some in their «agony» are said to be returning.
Some electorates enable what the politically shrewd do not want.
Mac said;
“once you get down to that level of turnout to get an absolute majority you would need to get nearly 80% YES (or NO)”
Your big mistake is thinking we need an absolute majority. No, we absolutely do not. We only need a majority of those who vote. You can’t count votes that were never cast in the first place. A non-vote cannot be deemed to be either for or against the proposition voted on, and must be regarded as irrelevant.
The franchise should be as open as feasible, but in Scotland in particular, there is a specific issue that needs properly discussed, and that is to do with the fact that Scotland’s autochthonous electorate are also the owners of Scotland’s national sovereignty, and any important collective decision made by them engages that sovereignty, and so cannot be overruled by a non-sovereign majority even if it was larger. And for an important constitutional matter like independence, that sovereignty must be recognised and respected. And that suggests there may be little point in non-sovereigns voting in the first place.
Thus the real issue comes down to deciding who in Scotland really owns that sovereignty.
@Republicofscotland says:20 June, 2023 at 4:30 pm
spewing your BS to put indy down
Hoo boy, another cracker from RoS.
Soz, RoS. You got on the wrong side of history in February 2022. Alert Scots can’t have failed to notice that you and your fellow-travelers long since decided that when it comes to fighting for Independence, Nation & Culture, you’re rooting for the imperialist oppressor.
Maybes you want to re-write history now?
Naw.
dasBlimp said;
“Salmond did all of that but the fact remains that at the final hurdle, he blew it. He didn’t convince the voters and that’s why he lost. Don’t get me started on that molten tub of lard, Johnson.”
Salmond didn’t blow it at all, that was down to the entire might of the British state, the unremitting falsehoods from the mainstream media, and the abusively non-impartial output from BBC Scotland, all of which represented excessive and unwarranted outside interference with the referendum. The result should have been declared null and void, and rerun with much stricter controls, and especially with outside/international observers with real clout to ensure fairness at every level.
And he still got close; he raised the pro-indy vote from around 28% to 50%+ just a couple of weeks before the vote, and as he said, that was too early. He was hoping it wouldn’t get that high until the final week. As it was, it gave Westminster and the British establishment too much time to gear up after the panic of the 50%+ polls kicked in.
https://order-order.com/2023/06/20/nicola-ive-done-nothing-wrong-sturgeon-cant-also-attest-to-her-husbands-innocence/#comments
@James says:20 June, 2023 at 1:10 pm
illegal nuclear bombs from Scottish soil
Tut tut. Illegal nuclear bombs. Tchoh.
What is it makes them illegal, James? Out of date bomb tax?
Maybes the trolleys they wheel them about on have insufficient tread on their tyres?
Here’s a good one – inadequate Health & Safety notices?
Haha, bet you just stuck ‘illegal’ in there cos you thought it would make you look knowledgeable.
Soz, naw.
Link for live Alba statement on dodgy Supreme Court verdict, right now:
https://twitter.com/AlbaParty/status/1671186403353587712
Daisy Walker @ 4:16pm
Interesting anecdotal evidence of a sea change right enough, Daisy Walker.
I suspect that the same talk amongst folk that you tell of in your post is beginning to percolate through communities across Scotland.
Alf Baird said in one of his posts something like the “the rupture has occurred.”
I think he meant that the SNP has finally revealed its true allegiance and is now quite evidently not remotely interested in fighting for Scottish independence or standing up for us Scots, although it vainly, and rather pathetically, pretends otherwise.
But I’m sure if I’m wrong about what Alf meant he’ll soon correct me.
dasBlimp @ 16.43.
You have drawn the comparison between Mr Salmond and a man you do not even “wish to get started on”.
I simply suggest, based on the conduct and ability of both men in office, that this is an inaccurate, indeed facile, comparison.
Mr Salmond has amply demonstrated that he is a wily, experienced and astute political animal. Well able to keep politicians of various political views generally onside during his 7 years of leading Scotland successfully. Whilst adding to the support for independence dramatically. Certainly the referendum was lost … such is the nature of democracy.
He did however leave not only a united political Party, but a united political independence movement. Did Mr Johnson achieve this … I believe not.
Just in passing, being no oil painting or of Herculean build myself, please excuse my not joining in with your comments on the weight or build of others. I vote for politicians on their beliefs, policies and abilities. Not as a potential to advertise for weightwatchers.
@Northcode says:20 June, 2023 at 3:46 pm
[Yawn]
See thon Punjab. The language they speak is Punjabi.
Here’s some Punjabi, just for you, Northcode:
??????????
Can you see what it means yet? That’s right, it’s Punjabi for ‘coloniser’.
That’s the word they use in the Punjab to describe a white man of Scottish, Christian descent who goes to the Punjab and starts to tell them what to do.
I would suggest that you take some time out to try to understand what the fuck you are posting about, but ….
meh.
Circularity Scotland Kaput. Can’t we do anything right?. I am old school the people responsible should resign. We have had too many public service failures. When will anyone accept accountability. Can we get transparency and minutes, can we get Ministers standing up and being honest about the mistakes?. Blaming it on Westminster has ceased to be a reasonable explanation. Failure “Made in Scotland” from girders. And Labour will win the next GE and Scot Parliament elections. No change there then.
Today the SNP seek 60% and when the 60% is reached the SNP will only make it 80%.
Slater survives by 13 votes.
We shall agree to disagree then, Sven. As for other people’s looks and weight, I can point and laugh as much as I like because I’m a fat, ugly bastard myself.
Something has happened in Western politics where we have identikit individuals across the parties and countries who have pretty much zero in common with any of us despite us on here coming from quite a broad section of society, means, location etc. They blatantly neither listen to us nor represent our interests and we have people on different continents who also have nothing in common with us openly stating that they are mentoring and placing these people into positions of power and authority. They seem to have come from banking, law or directly from student politics.
I would be genuinely interested in peoples takes on this. Is it sustainable without draconian crackdowns on discussing it?
OK Xaracen, have it your way. Salmond didn’t blow it then. His campaign was successful and that is why we are all living in a utopian republic of an independent Scotland. Well, you might be, but I’m not.
Geoff Anderson says: 20 June, 2023 at 5:07 pm
https://order-order.com/2023/06/20/nicola-ive-done-nothing-wrong-sturgeon-cant-also-attest-to-her-husbands-innocence/#comments
Interesting… did I read that she’d moved out of the sweet smelling Lavender Lair for a few days? Where did Colonel Blimp go?
Please try to ignore the R Sole Main and his many “names”.
The guy is a 100% Ukipper, with far too much time on his manky yoon hauns.
I think Saturday is just a chest thumbing thing to get more money out of the followers
Xaracen, @4:52
I think there’s a perfectly arguable case for Scots abroad to be given a vote in any future referendum. You might disagree, but it’s debatable.
McDuff 3.06
You can’t say things like that on this site.
Don’t you know that if by some miracle Independence was achieved ‘it will all be fine’………….by magic?
Who needs a plan, incorporating projected financials. Things like, what currency will we use, Central Bank, the divvy up of UK assets and liabilities, pensions etc are a minor inconvenience and our brave, competent SNP Politicians will sort everything out in no time.
You really have to read more closely the words of wisdom that the intellectual colossuses such as Che, Baird, RoS amongst others that appear here, umpteen times, every single day.
The BPHB will be accusing you of being a troll or a Unionist very shortly.
There must be something in this legal opinion alba has found. The BBC has a total black out on it
@ Daisy Walker re your report of disgruntled folk and desperately sad news about jobs going/gone in Perth.
That is very interesting and “encouraging” as to the SNP’s prospects but there are still plenty of people commenting in The National who are convinced that M/s Sturgeon is perfect and Alex Salmond is an ego-driven unsavoury person, as are all the Alba members.
It is extraordinary how people can see the same facts and draw opposing conclusions. And very difficult to see how this state can be changed and how restoring independence can be progressed quickly.
Unless there is a successful revolution in the SNP on Saturday led by Izzy and G-Man. I wish them both the best and hope they will make a mark. Does anyone know if Ash Regan is going?
I like Kate Forbes. I had so much respect for her. She did the 13 hustings the length and breadth of Scotland. A new mother. She wanted to walk up the steps of Bute House with her bairn and vow to deliver Independence for Scotland.
She believes in the importance of traditions and her faith. She’d have been the most universally popular leader.
I liked Ash Regan. She was incredible. She had the Commonweal policies behind her. She reached out to Alex Salmond. She had the best ideas for the Independence Convention. She’s spoken out against sturgeon. Against ggr she spoke up for the Scottish people.
Both are incredible women both worthy of being first minister.
Fuck Humza. That’s all I can say. I don’t know why they are even standing with him.
Kate Forbes. She said she’d defend everyone’s views to the hilt. I respect that. I respect her views. I respect her political choices as well as much as I don’t agree with him but Scottish independence should be proud to have Kate Forbes as part of the team.
Humza couldn’t give a fuck about other people. He dodged the gay marriage vote and lied about it. End of story.
Anton D
” …..we have people on different continents who also have nothing in common with us openly stating that they are mentoring and placing these people into positions of power and authority ”
Indeed ; the question is to what end are ” these people ” being put into positions of power ?
I’ve always resisted the idea that there is one , definitive cabal of Superbaddies eg a New World Order with immense power/wealth controlling * everything * . Think maybe that idea is a modern expression of mankind’s archetypal fear of the Dark , Evil , malign unseen forces intent on fucking us up . Lucifer wae a laptop .
But….. when you look at the decisions made by just about every Head of State/Politician in the so-called Liberal Democracies ; what they espouse , support , promote eg …the refusal to apply even the slightest critical thinking to the clear insanity of the notion humans can change sex : how come they are ALL in lockstep with this idiocy ?
Ditto Geopolitics . When was the last time we heard any Politician talk about Peace ; let alone show some genuine effort in actually trying to bring some of that much needed balm to the world ?
I guess there’s just not enough money to be made by Peace .
Constant war is where it’s at , suckers .
Think it’s safe to say…..some cunts are pulling the strings : n it’s no us
Once again in total agreement David.
Today, I met some Glesca junkies in the car park.
They turned out to be bloody nice guys, and I have more faith in them than I do the entire SNP – and all of the other roasters from the other currently elected parties – put together.
I’m voting Sick Boy.
@Ron Clark says:20 June, 2023 at 6:06 pm
[YAWN]
Any time you find a fact in one of my posts that is wrong, “Ron”, fill yer boots.
Your legion of adoring fans will celebrate you finally managing to contribute.
Haha, I crack me up.
Interrupted for waterlogged pitch. FFS clowns, stop fecking watering pitches before games.
Humza Yousaf and Ed Miliband are both worth about £5 million each………
Sack The Man Who Failed To Plan Humza and Tom Petty have it right..
Free Fallin
And I’m free
I’m free fallin’
Yeah, I’m free
Free fallin’
Free fallin’, now I’m free fallin’, now I’m
Free fallin’, now I’m free fallin’, now I’m
I am constantly surprised by the number of Yessers, mostly male, it seems, who cannot see that Kate Forbes is just another snp devolutionist and a neoliberal to boot. She oversaw the fire sale of Scottish renewables without so much as a blink of an eye that we should be robbed so much, she oversaw and emphatically supported the Freeport tax havens which will help to destroy any hopes of a thriving Scottish economy, and she was damned quick to stab Ash Regan in the back at the election for leader of SNP and of course First Minister. She has brown-nosed Sturgeon all along and now brown-noses Useless even though he demoted her. She is a crawling bumwipe, and nothing more, just like all the other gravy trainers in the snp. Why men keep falling for these treacherous self-serving women I just cannot fathom!
@ David Hannah
Re. Kate Forbes
She was on maternity leave but still could have voted to ensure safeguarding checks were put in place re. GGR amendment vote.
The Conservative MSP Meghan Gallagher also on maternity leave managed to cast her vote.
As a new mother would she really have had the time and energy to properly commit to the task of being leader of the SNP and FM at this crucial time should she have won.
Maybe a few years down the line would have been a more realistic time for her, or did she just stand in the contest to split the votes for Ash…
Northcode @ 5:12 pm
“the rupture has occurred.”
Yes, the compromised party machine, by the poverty of its tactics, shows itself opposed to any innovation, leaving the movement to seek other solutions, such as this:
https://yoursforscotlandcom.wordpress.com/2023/06/20/salvo-liberation-snc-press-release/
Sturgeon’s latest protestation of innocence is even mmore contemptuous.
“I am an elected politician, I am a public servant, and that’s a legitimate expectation on me that I make statements”
So does that mean there is a legitimate expectation that Colin Beattie should come out with a statement similar to Sturgeon’s if he has done nothing wrong? Is he not an elected politician and a public servant?
What effect does she think this has on his position? I wonder if she has even considered it. Beattie, when stepping back from the treasurer’s position said ” I will continue to co-operate fully with Police Scotland’s inquiries and it would be inappropriate for me to comment further on a live case”.
If it is inappropriate for Beattie to comment, why is it appropriate for Sturgeon to make her statement(s) proclaiming that she has done nothing wrong?
Sturgeon is effectively saying “public figures who have been arrested should say if they have done nothing wrong”, thus inviting people to speculate about those public figures who do not come out with a similar statement.
Her statement suggesting that her husband is not a public figure is risible. He may not have been elected, but as chief executive of a political party he is hardly an ordinary private person, and her comments are not helpful to his position either.
“Me, me, me, look at me, listen to me, I don’t care what effect I have on other people as long as I can tell you what to believe about me”.
No respect for Colin Beattie’s position, or her husband’s.
Someone should tell her to keep her mouth shut and not try to influence people’s views, directly or indirectly, about her position or that of others who are involved in this live case.
Guilty or not, of any crime, Nicola Sturgeon should bugger off!
Perhaps the public should vote on it!
A Scot Abroad said;
“I think there’s a perfectly arguable case for Scots abroad to be given a vote in any future referendum. You might disagree, but it’s debatable.”
I’m not disagreeing, there may well be an arguable case, and it’s certainly debatable but I haven’t seen that case being properly made, and the debate doesn’t seem to have happened, and any I have seen made no mention of sovereignty as an important attribute of some Scots electors but not all, and I think it really should be debated. Because sovereignty really is important, and especially so for constitutional matters.
James Barr Gardner says:
20 June, 2023 at 8:17 pm
Humza Yousaf and Ed Miliband are both worth about £5 million each………
My final offer is 10p and a Taz bar.
She reminds me a lot of Natalie McGarry who doubtless believes and insists to this day she is innocent.
@Dan 8:47pm
Or real politick. The Church of Scotland membership is in decline. Thanks to Nicolas blanket ban on constitutional established services which proved to be illegal during Covid. However about 30 plus new Free Churches are being established. The law of unintended consequences the pentecostal are moving to the right and winning support. The Question is will civic and religious society recover from the SNP Governance. Mad, Bad and Dangerous.
FionaN @ 8,45pm
Why men keep falling for these treacherous self-serving women I just cannot fathom!
It’s the looks, Fiona. I agree with you entirely about Kate Forbes and her politics. Yet during the leadership election, there were men on this site almost swooning over Kate and her charming, girlish appearance. This is the woman who – apart from the awful policies she supported – said once that a woman should not be set in authority over a man. I think that’s how some men like their women, winsome and smiling and completely non-threatening.
Despite the engaging demeanour I would imagine that Kate is quite a sharp operator. (Being absent from the GRR debate and not voting for the Tory amendment which went through on the presiding officer’s casting vote is an indication. She could have voted remotely to support the amendment and her vote would have meant it would have gone through instead of being lost, no casting vote needed. Kate slipped out of that one.)
I didn’t see anything wrong with Ash Regan’s looks but frankly, it’s irrelevant when assessing a politician. I just preferred her ideas.
Personally, I think Humza’s quite handsome but I couldn’t care less, as he’s a completely clueless sumph.
Comments made by Fiona M & Dan re. Kate Forbes:
I totally agree with the comments you both made about Kate Forbes’ reasons for standing for First Minister. She made much of her Christian faith during her speeches. However, surely as a new mother, her duty was first to take care of her newborn baby!
When Humza demoted her, I expected her to to resign her seat to spend time with her new baby and care for her step children. However, it appears that Kate Forbes is another career politician who wants to be noticed! Now we hear she is speaking at the SNP “Meeting” on Saturday.
I wonder whether Ash Regan will attend the AUOB Rally – she’d certainly make more impact speaking there, rather than at the SNP “Meeting”!
Saturday should be a very interesting day!
Hypothetical question. Is it possible for a fake wife to throw a fake husband under a fake campaign bus?
@JGedd and Galloway Lass 9:57 and 9:58pm
I would rather talk Kate Forbes than Sharia Law in 30 UK Sharia Courts. Unaccountable to UK politicians and legal public representation. It makes no difference, I have a bet on the SNP losing 30 MPs to Labour. You had your time and were found wanting your time is over. Go gracefully.
George Ferguson – are you giving up on fighting for an Independent Scotland?
Forget about Sharia Law – Useless has a limited life in the Scottish Parliament!
Undoubtably, the SNP will lose seats but if they go to Labour then that victory will be shortlived. There are more Independence supporters than Labour lovers and most of the Independence supporters are outwith the SNP! There are other political parties in Scotland. If you feel you have an affinity with the old Labour Party then look into the Scottish Socialist Party, which believes in an Independent Scotland! Their views are probably more attuned to Keir Hardie’s priciples than the British Labour Party!
Good luck, whatever you decide to do. However, we are agreed on one point – the SNP has let the Scots down!
Xaracen, re 9:30,
Here’s somewhere to raise the case:
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/638166
@Galloway Lass 10:48pm
I retain my status as a principled Independence supporter. Ex SNP and now Alba . 650k for a report on the Ferries that was sorted on this blog months ago . The waste, the lies, the misformation, and the lack of transparency. The founding principles of the Scottish Parliament in reverse.
How do you think the Devil would go about getting you to sell your soul to him?
No idea? Are you sure? What, even after those posts I’ve made about ‘figures’?
The Devil would use rhetorical tricks to get his hands on your soul, of course.
Because the Devil is a champion of rhetoric. Satan, The original silver-tongued Devil.
And if you read on I’ll show you how he’ll try and get your soul, and by the end you and the Devil will be the best of pals and you’ll probably give him it for free.
Imagine the Prince of Darkness has already tried on several occasions to convince you to sell your soul to him.
He approaches you once again; this time in the guise of a traffic warden.
If at the heart of rhetoric is the ability to present yourself in relation to an audience, the following exchange demonstrates Satan’s mastery in doing just that.
Right from the start he leads you by the nose:
Here, the Devil sets the scene.
He establishes that ‘pride’ was at the root of his downfall, hints at the pathos of what he’s lost and appears unexpectedly generous to the God he might reasonably be expected to curse.
Note, too, his use of the plain style – establishing an ethos connection with you. He calls heaven, using Litosis, ‘very nice’ – just as you might describe a suburban front garden.
What a reasonable chap!
You give him a leg-up on to a red post box and the Devil sets about painting a mental picture – a rhetorical technique known as enargaia:
While all this goes on you are dancing around the post box like an eejit – even attempting a handstand as your praise for him reaches its climax. Righting yourself, you wipe the sweat from your brow and say:
There’s a slight pause before the Devil points straight at you and replies:
As you and the Devil stroll away side by side, that little bit of play-acting has done its work and the Devil continues, an arm around your shoulder and with winning self-pity: “I only wanted to be like Him, and have a few angels adoring me. But He didn’t see it like that. Pride, He called it. Sin of pride. Now, about your soul.”
Rhetoric is a vast subject and part of it is the art of persuading an audience to support your argument or viewpoint .
And rhetoric uses all sorts of tricks and devices to empower someone to do just that.
That dialogue by the way is from the 1967 film Bedazzled, written by and starring Peter Cook and Dudley Moore . You played the part Moore played in the movie.
Cook was educated at Cambridge University and Moore, Magdalen College, Oxford. So it’s no wonder they knew a thing or two about the old rhetoric.
George Ferguson – Well said, I am also an ex SNP member who joined Alba!
A Scot Abroad says:
20 June, 2023 at 11:00 pm
Xaracen, re 9:30,
Here’s somewhere to raise the case:
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/638166
NAW
I was an innocent child.
I thought the Wee Frees were tiny Protestants.
I imagined a terrifying bogey man with a grinning skull for a face, at the name “Ian Skelly”.
I thought shell suits were the apex of clothing technology and fashion.
I assumed Glen Michael had trapped some kind of talking spirit in his lamp, and was demonstrating his twinkling eyed avuncular terrifying mastery over unclean voices from the supernatural realm in between Batfink and He-Man And The Masters Of The Universe.
To this day, I, too, dream of a land called Yoker.
It is rumoured that Peter Murrell has hidden the household Iron from his wife.
He thinks it’s a lot safer to have an outside company do their Ironing.
Who can blame him?
The wee monster from Dreghorn has form.
And if it came to a square go, Sturgeon could probably batter the shit out of sticky fingered Pete.
A Scot Abroad thinks he should have a vote in Scotland? If he wants a vote in Scotland, then he should get back here, set up residency, pay taxes, etc! He seems to think that, bacause he fought in the “British Army” that should give him more rights!
Both my Scots father and my Welsh mother served during World War II. My father was with the KOSBs on the Khyber Pass (out of Fort Peshawar) and my Welsh mother was with the WAAFs on the RAF bases in Eygpt.
They never talked much about the war but when I was about 10 years old, I was doing a school project about the War and asked them both – “Why did you join up and go to War?” They both told me that no-one knew what Hitler was up to and feared that he might attack Scotland and Wales! Neither of them gave any thought of what Hitler might do to England!
A Scot Abroad has got 12 names on his Petition – what a pathetic example of the present British Army!
robbo,
Why not? Why shouldn’t the 750,000 Scots abroad from Scotland have a vote on their nation’s choice?
Some Indy supporters want to restrict the vote to Scots, in Scotland, and if you aren’t a Scot but are living in Scotland, you shouldn’t have a vote either.
Well, I disagree.
I am an Alba member and I just joined Salvo/Liberation who are taking the case to the UN and ICJ. I think we need a multi pronged approach if we are going to beat Westminster. I would encourage all to sign up to Salvo and start the ball rolling. We need 100000 members so that Salvo can proceed and state the case for Independence internationally. The SNP are going nowhere/ backwards, it’s time to ditch them and support the people that will free us from London.
A Scot Abroad says:
21 June, 2023 at 12:13 am
robbo,
Why not? Why shouldn’t the 750,000 Scots abroad from Scotland have a vote on their nation’s choice?
Some Indy supporters want to restrict the vote to Scots, in Scotland, and if you aren’t a Scot but are living in Scotland, you shouldn’t have a vote either.
Well, I disagree.
Tough.
Well, can you tell us another country in the world that has done it when seeking self determination/independence from a whore of a colonial state?
Give us some precedents for this. Maybe you want scots born people who live in USA , CANADA , EUROPE too – hell why not the whole fecking world?
When we get our full sovereignty back then, maybe then you can maybe seek a Scottish passport/citizenship under those terms you describe like a lot of other nations do, USA, CANADA, IRELAND to name a few.
Dan, you’re right.
I’ll tell you this. When Ash Regan started running with the guy Torrance behind the scenes. He said he joined the SNP I listened to him on the 9.
I listened to the SNP again. I listened to Ash Regan. I searched youtube for her launch at Queensferry.
50 plus 1. The general election.
A vote for Independence.
Ash Regan. She marched for Independence.
She’s done everything possible.
I thought she was amazing during the campaign. It got me listening to the fake hustings. Because during that campaign the hope for Independence lay with ash Regan.
As for Kate Forbes. Of course she wants Independence. She wants to help her island communities. Fuck knows who advised her on the free ports. She’s a finance minister with no control over the economy. A young woman in her 20s.
Forbes wants Independence. Be in no doubt.
This. Pretend convention. Is a sham. I hope she tells Humza to fuck off. I really do. Screw him. And mhairi black and Steven Flynn. Losers.
I hope that winds you and yer 11 buddies up! Then maybe you’ll get the point.
Don’t get me wrong. When we get our independence you’ll automatically get Sottish passport when you produce yer birth certificate saying you were born in Irvine central or Thornyflat maternity seeing as you said you come form AYR ?
LMAO
Sturgeon. She lacks class.
I read a story about her legal career. About Sherrif Passportnikov. And how she failed her client. How Nicola was about to be struck off.
I tell you what. It’s a shame we can’t give Nicola her passport and tell her to fuck off and leave us alone.
Passport the fuck off Nicola. I can’t stand her.
Hail Alba.
https://www.ukip.org/do-the-snp-really-want-independence
https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/scottish-news/more-half-council-areas-saw-30282048
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/nicola-sturgeon-says-can-only-30278504
The best argument for not having Scotland as an independent country is imagining the pollsters here being in charge of the economy, health etc, GCHQ, Klingons running things – numpties.
https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/politics/nicola-sturgeon-refuses-say-whether-30280101
https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/politics/snps-devastating-health-stats-reveal-30277675
https://www.gbnews.com/politics/nicola-sturgeon-statement-arrested-snp-latest-news
I think Scotland is a colony. I think the SNP are the Irish Independence Party 2.0.
Steven Flynn and Mhairi Black.
The guy has a lisp doesn’t he?
He can’t get his tongue around Independence. It’s unpalatable for him and the SNP.
Unfortunately the next general election is 2 years away.
Baldy Steven Flynn. With short man syndrome. He thinks no one will notice him. With that fucking fat cow on the front bench. The one that wants to decapitate terfs. God knows what her name is. And her in the yellow dress. Unbelievable the lot of them. Can not stand them.
I cannot believe that twice now Sturgeon has gone to ground for a week, including not showing up for work, and in the interviews on her return nobody has put her on the spot for highly suspicious behaviour in total contrast to her pleas of innocence.
There would be nothing stopping her answering basic questions of where was she and what was she doing. This is not the period that is under question, unless she was using it to cover he= tracks.
Humza has no plan. And sadly neither do we.
__________
Votes of no confidence should be taken out of political hands and given to the general public to make. Some might say we already have that power, it’s called an election, but i mean if a politician wants to call a ‘vote of no confidence’ in another political individual then that vote should be entrusted to those who matter, the general public.
And just to make sure that system isn’t abused by politicians calling votes of no confidence for any reason and none it should be stipulated in the rules that if a politician calls for a vote of no confidence in another politician and the public return a result favouring “the accused” then the politician who called for the vote of no confidence loses his/her seat automatically.
Votes of no confidence are currently meaningless, they can be manipulated to counter public opinion. And there is no real worthwhile outcome to them other than to suggest maybe the culprit should resign. And with politicians being ever more brazen these days to stick it out regardless of what they’ve done wrong etc there needs to be a system other than one that just wastes valuable political time and money.
That would soon dump Slater out on her arse, where she belongs. But as Stuarts article reveals, a bunch of half-witted self-serving parasites are going to save their colleagues skin, as scaly and reptilian as it is. Instead, we get 68 v 55 saving their parasitical partner in crime.
We’ve all got a plan. March in bannockburn on Saturday. There’s the plan. Hail Alba.
Humza:
Bity.
Justn back from the Scotland Georgia game. It should have been called off. I had to leave game at half time to catch my train. It was a shambolic delay matche donly by the shambles that is SPT Rail. I made it to Glasgow Queen Street with 5 minutes to spareor I would have been stranded in Glasgow. Wokist heads need to roll.
Perth and Kinross also needs to provide affordable parking. £7 for 12 hours is a scam. Wokist heads need to roll again.
https://grousebeater.wordpress.com/
I still can’t get fully behind the Scotland team and their so called “Tartan Army”.
Their stance, or lack of it, regarding Scottish independence is there for all to see.
This will remain how I feel until the SFA and the Tartan Army fully endorse Scottish independence.
I put them along side the Scottish rugby team and their supporters.
You surely must want your National team to be at the very least an independent nation., and not some subservient outfit with the same powers as any English region.
And Hampden Park is the worst National Stadium in Europe.
Surely if any Stadium needed a roof, it had to be Hampden Park.
But their loyal gullible supporters seem to accept sitting in that dump.
Similar to what the SNP members seem to find acceptable withintheir Party, while others looking in from the outside find unbelievable.
IAIN MORE.
Georgia….a country with a better case to be independent than Scotland.
Corruption, civil and ethnic friction, tanking economy, US strategic interest, pending EU application and member of Zelensky fan club.
Scotland should get a case of that..
A Scot Abroad said;
“Xaracen, re 9:30,
Here’s somewhere to raise the case:
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/638166“
That’s the last place I’d go to raise the case; that place doesn’t respect sovereignty at all, except that of the English establishment. It is demonstrably highly abusive of Scotland’s sovereignty, and has been for literally centuries.
Ron Clark 8.53am. Yeah FIFA should amalgamate Scotland and wales into an english/british team. Because the world does’nt recognise them as nations anyhow. If nothing else,
That might shake lazy apathetic Scots out of their political apathy for independence.
This reminds me of Sturgeon’s speech on tour in 2015 “There is no back door to independence. If there was I’d have walked through it years ago. What we need to do is convince the international community to recognise us as an independent country.”
”
Essentially, the United Kingdom, exists on the basis of an international agreement, the Treaty of Union. That agreement is the constitutional settlement without which there can be no Union. If the limits and conditions of that agreement can be torn up and thrown away, as they have been by the stronger ‘partner’, then what you have is not a ‘united’ kingdom but the annexation of one nation by another.
We are working towards restoring those limits and conditions, (and we’re not talking about the price of salt here!), as the prerequisite for the lawful continuation of the United Kingdom. Without which Scotland can only be reclassified as a an annexed country – a colony.”
Sarah Salyers.
https://yoursforscotlandcom.wordpress.com/2023/06/20/salvo-liberation-snc-press-release/
aLurker says:
21 June, 2023 at 10:09 am
More or less what we see occurring, this from ‘Doun-Hauden’ on ‘Strategies for Independence’ and the withdrawal of Scotland from the UK Union alliance:
“Withdrawal Strategy
A majority of Scotland’s national representatives may exercise and assert Scottish sovereignty by revoking the Treaty of Union, as it began. A democratically elected majority of Scotland’s national representatives should initiate Scotland’s withdrawal from the UK union as soon as possible.
The British State may or may not wish to contest Scotland’s national representatives’ right, as representing a signatory party to the Treaty of Union, to withdraw the sovereign nation and people of Scotland from the UK union. Should this be contested, the courts may be asked to opine on the matter.
If there remains a dispute, then the matter may be taken to the International Court of Justice. The ICJ would then seek to settle the matter in accordance with international law by giving advisory opinion.”
https://yoursforscotlandcom.wordpress.com/2021/08/29/determinants-of-independence-synopsis-and-strategies/
National Stadium.
In Milan the 2 Main Football teams share one stadium.
In Amsterdam the National Stadium has a retractable roof as they get wet weather.
What could Glasgow have if the money spent on Hampden, Celtic Park and Ibrox put into the one kitty.
The answer would be the best stadium in Europe.
Would Old Firm fans wreck the seats and vandalise if it’s main opponents beat them in a shared stadium?
alurker linked https://www.gov.scot/publications/scotlands-future/
If that is true then it should be headlining every UK news media outlet! This could really turn out to be something. Let’s hope it doesn’t just fizzle out.
Lorna Slater and Emma Roddick are living proof that selecting people on the basis of ‘diversity’ rather than ability is a fkn stupid idea
Ron Clark says:
21 June, 2023 at 8:53 am
I still can’t get fully behind the Scotland team and their so called “Tartan Army”.
Their stance, or lack of it, regarding Scottish independence is there for all to see.
This will remain how I feel until the SFA and the Tartan Army fully endorse Scottish independence.
Trying to make everything political is one of the things that puts off normies.
Most people really don’t want a party political broadcast when they’re watching some laddies kick a ball about a park.
Btw Alex Salmond knew better. He turned up at France 98 as a fan, not to deliver a speech. Labour were absolutely raging.
Link posted by aLurker @10:09am:
Salvo, Liberation, SNC Press release
Link posted by Alf Baird @10:25am:
DETERMINANTS OF INDEPENDENCE SYNOPSIS AND STRATEGIES
Sturgeon is the redundant Mayor of Toy Town, whom has nothing to contribute, bar self-promotion!
Devolution provides politicians the means to get paid for gaslighting the Scottish electorate.
Open your eyes for fucksake! Holyrood and The Scotland Act, is stunting any legitimate progress toward independence.
Extract from Salvo, Liberation, SNC Press release:
Salvo, Liberation, SNC Press release
Extract from Alf Baird’s paper Determinants of Independence Synopsis and Strategies:
DETERMINANTS OF INDEPENDENCE SYNOPSIS AND STRATEGIES
Ron Clark
A competent national squad (and sports in general) is part of the bedrock that an independent country is built on – look at Slovenia. Scoring goals is way, way, way more important than having them try and score political points.
Red 11.07am
Not a peep was heard from the so called “Tartan Army” during the 2014 independence campaign.
And it continues to this day.
Alf Baird.
Recognition of a colonial parliament, the “Devolved government” sent to Scotland to manage Scotland is a must,
Recognition that the early concept of the “treaty of the of Union” was a political union between two parliaments.
Recognition that, that particular political concept never advance further than the ratification due to one parliament ( Englands) Westminster parliament eliminating by dissolving the other parliament ( Scottish) parliament in England from the agreed concept in 1707.
Recognition that the treaty of union whilst being a political union, was not a territorial union with Scotland,
Recognition that one parliament ( Westminsters) old English Parliament had a continuation into the new named Great British parliament until 1708 when they held their first Westminster elections under the old English parliaments Triennial act that was passed in 1694. With the same transferred parliament members Completing the three year requirement of that parliament.
Recognition that the 1707 Scottish parliament, Cancelled in England and extinguished did not and could not provide representatives of a Scottish parliament to Westminster after they extinguished in England.
The selection process took place after the Scottish parliament was extinguished.
Etymology counts.
Recognition of the extent which Scotland and its people were and still are held as a’ “Colony” of Westminster parliament without a binding treaty to A Extinguished Scottish parliament since 1707.
I have messaged Sara Salyers this information yesterday,
Together, along with a Colonial devolved government sent to Scotland for the management purpose of Scotland under the continuation of Englands old Westminster parliament legislation does much to enhance and advance Scotlands claim of being Colonised to the World, rather than one single identifier.
The only subject I neglected to mention to Sara Salyers was the “Colonial Stock ( Scotland ) acts,” in the 1800s that could be forwarded if needed myself or indeed you’re self.
@Alf Baird
Sorry, Alf. I pasted the wrong text for your extract by mistake.
Here’s what I meant to paste.
Extract from Alf Baird’s paper Determinants of Independence Synopsis and Strategies:
DETERMINANTS OF INDEPENDENCE SYNOPSIS AND STRATEGIES
Get rid of the Scotland Act, at a stroke, by sacking Holyrood. Refuse to take their seats. Then we can legitimately set about ending the Union, at the very next election!
That next election would of course be to reinstate a Scottish government…. in Holyrood, as stipulated by current legislation. Simply, contest that election to end the Union! Same manifesto for Westminster Scottish by-elections, whichever event is given priority.
A mass walk out of both parliaments, is the first step to independence!
Unilateral action, is Westminster’s biggest fear. The very word ‘unilateral’ sets off, every unionist troll! I wonder why that is?
Independence must be seized, that much is certain. It’s tragic that our politicians cower behind Devolution and The Scotland Act, that much is also obvious.
@Effijy
The National Stadium is a disgrace due to one reason..The SFA.
For many many decades they looked after only themselves and neglected the needs of fans and the National game.
Their decision in how to rebuild Hampden was short-sighted, wrong and duly over ran into millions in extra cost to produce an immediately out of date and truly awful stadium which is pathetic when compared to its contemporaries like the ultra modern Millennium Stadium.
Rangers and Celtic have nothing to do with this absolute shambles. Worst of all, its still the same old same old Blazers and Junkets set up. The SFA are a decent example of Establishment Scotland.
I thought Scots was just English spelt wrong.
If you were to throw 6 darts randomly at a map of Scotland, you could never define a Scots language that would be understandable to all of them. Move 50 miles in any direction and the language changes significantly.
I was researching reparations.
According to Britain under “tort law” old reparations going back generational are and can be excluded if the victim is no longer alive,
This is their defence going through a court case involving the Colonialism Slavery and being captive against ones will,
We Can presume then that as Scots in this present generation we are still being held under Colonialism and refusal of our right to self determination from the enslaver of of our and Scotland Colonialism.
Under Britains understandings stance on reparations related to ” tort law” we can safely say and claim that more than five million modern Scots of Colonialism that have been refused the right to self determination and freedom of their Country anc people are entitled to a considerable amount reparations.
Wether the parliament and English tort law win or loose the Case for older generational reparations that still leaves over five million Scots entitled to these reparations.
Language,
Indeed the same changes of language is seen in England,
Cornwall differing from london,
And Yorkshire differing liverpudlians,
However it is still recognised as one language of England by governance,
The same variety of languages within Scotland would still be considers Scottish with Gaelic spoken and recognised as the older language of modern Scotland much in the same way as the old language of Cornwall is but still within England,
The reason that most Scots do not speak their natural old is Due to Colonialism, that evidence of enforcing a foreign language on Scots, I can verify personally, as I was strapped and caned in school many times over many years for not speaking the Imposed Queens English language in Scotland,
Many others have mentioned here the attempts of British education system to Squash the native language of Scots, This has happened to many other Colonised Countries around the world
James Che
James, I’m trying to work out my share of the payout. What’s a Trillion quid divided by 5 million? 🙂
James Che @1:31pm
” I can verify personally, as I was strapped and caned in school many times over many years for not speaking the Imposed Queens English language in Scotland”
Me too, James. Me, too.
Ian Smith says:
21 June, 2023 at 12:56 pm
If you were to throw 6 darts randomly at a map of Scotland, you could never define a Scots language that would be understandable to all of them. Move 50 miles in any direction and the language changes significantly.
——————-
You’ve obviously not been to many regions of Engeeeerland then ya clown.
Geordie sound like West Country does it?
Brummie sound like Scouser does it?
Yorkshire sound like Cockney does it?
eegit does sound like eegit though!
That goes fur you tae dasBlimpy!
Mainbot;
The UN declared nuclear weapons to be illegal in 2021.
Fcuckwit that you are.
dasBlimp @ 12:52 pm
“I thought Scots was just English spelt wrong.”
Ye ken whit thocht duin!
I find it helps if you disable predictive text, Alf.
Unless I’ve missed something, “a groundswell of public support” for a referendum is not the same as a “groundswell of public support” for independence. I think that the SNP was left completely spooked by the 2014 result, and simply hasn’t known how to move on. And even if London gave us a referendum now, would anyone here trust the SLP to lead the independence campaign?
Ian Smith at 12.56pm: “If you were to throw 6 darts randomly at a map of Scotland, you could never define a Scots language that would be understandable to all of them. Move 50 miles in any direction and the language changes significantly.”
That’s abject drivel. Until the 1700s, Scots was the written and spoken language of royalty, government and the nobility as well as ordinary Scots. You only have to look at any Scottish letter or document from the 1600s to see this. Of course Scots has regional variations, but that doesn’t alter the fact that it was and remains a distinct language in its own right.
Incidentally, as a native Fifer, I can understand Aberdonians and Glaswegians pretty well. Southern English accents and dialects, less so.
Wikipedia says:
Scots is sometimes regarded as a variety of English, though it has its own distinct dialects; : 894 other scholars treat Scots as a distinct Germanic language,
Scots is actually closer to Old English as the Anglo-Saxons settled in the lowlands of Scotland ( you may find you all have Anglo-Saxon blood in your veins if you’re lucky). Come the Norman invasion, they seeded the English language with their filthy French but the Northern Anglos were left unmolested because the Scots did some deal with the Normans – and look how that turned out.
@Robert Hughes
A few times I have posted suggesting that people look up the names in the Pentagon who led the US and in turn other Western nations including us into the wars of the last thirty years. These names show which country these wars were fought for.
I have a late friend from this demographic who I really miss for his insight. He no longer used the internet and when I asked why he replied “because I found out stuff which I wish I didn’t know” and I can relate to that.
Re us being dragged into conflicts which do not concern us, I was reading up on someone, a Harvard lecturer on Government, who said with regard to Europe “we are here daring to attempt a unique historical experiment: transforming a mono-ethnic, mono-cultural society into a multi-ethnic one.” He is also an Executive Director at the Tony Blair Institute For Global Change. Which war did Tony Blair drag us into despite one million people marching against it and which region was he rewarded with an envoy role in?
We’re not in the 1700s and royalty, nobility and government fitted all centred on Edinburgh.
Most Scots never travelled more than 20 miles from their place of birth and never had a conversation with any of them.
Correct Anton Decadent
… and Tony Blair is Scottish. Born in Edinburgh and educated at Fettes.
DASBLIMP. 2:49
Your knowledge of «stuff» is truly astounding.
A point though, Scottis, perversely named after the Irish Scotti, is a version of Anglian ie Northumbrian «Inglis» with an lexical admixture of Norman French, French, Dutch, Norse Latin, middle and modern English. It is, however, about as «native» as Gaelic which those Scotti brought with them.
Scotlands «native» speech was akin to modern Welsh. It is believed that died out sometime in the 12th century subsequent to the end of the oldest «British» kingdom Strathclyde/Ystrad Clud https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Strathclyde
All good fun and revelatory of the complexity of the entity variously styled Caledonia/Scotia/Alba/Scotland.
So pleased you are taking an interest in Scots history and culture, however subject to muddle and racist gloss.
@Northcode & Alf Baird says:21 June, 2023 at 12:12 pm
The Scots language should be made the national language of Scots and given authority as such
So do we Scots get a democratic input, like a referendum perhaps? Maybes a majority of us Scots might think that the undoubtedly large sums of taxpayers dosh required might be better directed? What will be the penalties for flouting the ‘authority’ of the Scots language? Second-class citizenship?
A key requirement is to teach the Scots language in schools at all levels, and at universities, in addition to English
Surely anybody still being taught to read and write at university is wasting their time?
All peoples from other nations seeking to work in Scotland (or apply for citizenship post-independence) should be required to have an acceptable level of knowledge of the Scots language
Good one. That will stop EU or EFTA freedom of movement in its tracks! Hows about Scots already in employment in Scotland? Will they be sacked if they lack that acceptable level of knowledge? Retrained? Who pays, the employee or the employer or ScotGov?
Tell you what, though. I’m estimating 20 years for the necessary knowledge of the Scots language to come up through the schools, through further education and apprenticeships, and into the working world.
20 years is more than long enough for ordinary Scots to get scunnered of the entire daft idea, and throw out those who tried to force it on them.
As the 21st century continues to descend into the dystopian hellhole I think most of us can clearly see ahead, it’s not as if us Scots won’t have more important things to worry about.
Anyways, this is supposed to be a pro-Indy site. Best not terrify normal Scots by telling them that Indy could see them compelled to learn, write and speak what is a new language for them, and possibly lose their best employment opportunities if they can’t, or won’t, play ball.
The way I see it, compulsion to use Scots will be about as popular as compulsion to use Gaelic.
North Code,
I not sure what the payout for modern Scots would be, or the Share between Scots in Scotland,
But there is one thing for sure, Scotland and Scots would be held under modern day victims of Colonialism when they are being refused the right to self determination, and their Claim of right is as a nation is being acknowledged.
The very fact that Westminster has actually Colonised the hoax treaty of union to itself as lord overseer rather than a mutual treaty whereby as the only other party mentioned could legally with draw.
But Westminster is conflating and confusing many issues here,
1: That Scotland was extinguished from the treaty of union in 1707.
2: The Westminster parliament of England is the sole arbiter participant of the treaty of union and therefore is the solely in the treaty on its own.
3: That Scotland under both of those scenario circumstances is a Colony of Englands parliament, but not recognised as a extinguished Scottish parliament since 1707 in England,
It Can be proven that the old English parliament did continue into the new GB parliament without elections until 1708 thus continues to present day.
Excellent grounds for reparations to all modern day Scots living in Scotland.
Now if I receive reparations before you I will give you reparation dosh to tide you over til you receive your own full reparations,
Then you return mine back without interest incurred upon yourself as fellow Scots looking out for each other,
He hee, a bit of fun to be had no doubt,
I wonder how many Scots realise that being Colonised all these unfortunate years might actually pay dividends in this modern woke Culture.
I also wonder if many Scots born citizens living outside Scotland might suddenly want to return, and maybe stymie themselves from shouting “Scotland is not Colonised”.
@James says:21 June, 2023 at 2:19 pm
Mainbot;
The UN declared nuclear weapons to be illegal in 2021.
Fcuckwit that you are.
Did they now, James. Well, well, well, everyday a school day.
Sounds like you have all you need to go make a Citizen’s Arrest. Lead from the front. Claim UN authority. Seize a bomb or two and immobilise them pending UN action.
I most sincerely want you to know that I (and maybes one or two others) will be behind you every step of the way. Oh, yes indeed.
Tch, tch, illegal nuclear bombs. What ever next.
Oh and one other thing. Shop much in French Connection do you?
[maybes get a grown up to help explain that one to you]
John main,
You do not need to worry your head about what Scotland does or which direction Scotland goes when it is independent, after all you have choosen which side you prefer already, so has DasBlimp.
You should however maybe turn your attentions to the rest of the union that remains south of the border as I hear rumbling that the Irish and Welsh want to leave England soon as possible,
Infact I hear parts of England want to leave the other half of England,
Perhaps we can keep you occupied and busy so the others can leave first,
you know take you by surprise.
Look squirrel. Look prickly hedgehog.
@Ottomanboi says:21 June, 2023 at 3:37 pm
Careful with that historical stuff! You might notice that the Declaration Of Arbroath boasts how the Scots had “thrown out the Britons and completely destroyed the Picts”.
So our birthright as Sovereign Scots is actually a piece of boastful, genocidal, colonialist propaganda.
subject to muddle and racist gloss
Everything is. It’s a shame, but it can’t be helped.
JOHNMAIN
Scots/Lallans and Gaelic are as efficient forms of communication as any human language.
However, without high end, sophisticated, intellectual resources i.e language planning skills, dictionaries, grammars etc financed by the state education apparatus both will continue to decline.
Both have suffered from political marginalization to the rural fringes.
To survive they have to be brought back into the mainstream. The SNP has signally failed in that.
Speakers of English have a blind spot to the existential importance of language. Until, of course, something threatens «anglo» dominance.
Ron Clark says:
21 June, 2023 at 12:03 pm
Red 11.07am
Not a peep was heard from the so called “Tartan Army” during the 2014 independence campaign.
And it continues to this day.
Well, it’s not really an army, it’s mostly a men’s drinking club. Maybe lower your expectations, because it’s a minor miracle that amount of Scottish alcoholics doesn’t get into regular trouble with the cops.
James says:
21 June, 2023 at 2:19 pm
Mainbot;
The UN declared nuclear weapons to be illegal in 2021
When can we expect Interpol to arrest the leaders of Britain, the USA, Russia, China, Pakistan, India, France and Israel?
I’m sure the United Nations isn’t just a collection of superannuated shitetalkers.
Re: the Scots language.
How many votes do we think are in that? Do Scottish people seem enthusiastic about this? Or is it like the colonial theory debates – a niche interest?
I dinnae ken myself, but I suspect people are mair worried about mortgage payments and electricity bills. Bad times ahead, gang.
@James Che says:21 June, 2023 at 3:44 pm
I not sure what the payout for modern Scots would be, or the Share between Scots in Scotland
So give us a ballpark figure, with some idea of the possible uncertainty error.
Take an “orders of magnitude” approach, i.e. are we talking £10, £100, £1,000, £10,000, £100,000, £1,000,000, what?
I believe the similar-thinking politicos in California have settled on $1.2 mill per grifter, sorry descendant of slaves, so we Scots should be in the same area, don’t you think? Maybes more?
Show us the money! James, please.
Ottomanboi says:
21 June, 2023 at 3:37 pm
DASBLIMP. 2:49
Your knowledge of «stuff» is truly astounding.
—
Thanks, Ottomanboi. Are you chatting me up? I’ve heard of this online dating malarkey. It’s quite good fun, isn’t it.
John Main..
They did actually.
Do you not get the news where you are under her rock?
Maybe wander out for a bit in the fresh air eh?
Northcode says:
21 June, 2023 at 1:48 pm
James Che @1:31pm
” I can verify personally, as I was strapped and caned in school many times over many years for not speaking the Imposed Queens English language in Scotland”
Me too, James. Me, too.
———-
Probably explains why you two are a bit strange. can’t you sue them or summat? It’s obviously damaged you both.
James Che @3:44pm
“Now if I receive reparations before you I will give you reparation dosh to tide you over til you receive your own full reparations,
Then you return mine back without interest incurred upon yourself as fellow Scots looking out for each other”
That’s a deal, James. I’ll do the same for if I get my reparation dosh first.
@James Che says:21 June, 2023 at 4:01 pm
John main,
You do not need to worry your head about what Scotland does or which direction Scotland goes when it is independent
Naw, you’ve got that one dead wrong.
As a resident, tax-paying, Sovereign Scot, my view is as important as that of everybody else. Soz, and all that, but it can’t be helped.
Nukes are now illegal under international law.
They’ve not to make any new ones & it’s a step to get rid of them. Tho I bet the yanks, Israel & the UK will break that international law too as they hold the record for ignoring treaties..
” I think that the SNP was left completely spooked by the 2014 result, ”
Hobbit.
I’m not defending the current SNP but the above is rubbish, in 2014 Project Fear which ran a lie filled negative campaign backed by the full weight of the Britnat media was totally spooked when a poll just a week or so before the September 18 indyref showed Yes in the lead.
The Britnat lies then went into overdrive, and the Britnat media pumped out Project Fear lies ten to the dozen. Corbyn suffered the same fate with a filthy Britnat smear and character assassination campaign a few years back.
Salmond being an honourable man resigned as FM after the Project Fear lie filled victory in 2014, and the rest as they say is history.
Incidentally Scots DID vote Yes in 2014.
John main.
🙂
North Code.
Did you hear Were the only two strange people left?
, how delightful that feels when in amongst the cancel culture, the “othering” crowd, the unionist, and the wokeraty numbskulls,
No wonder we seem strange to them.
dasBlimp @ 3:28 pm
“… and Tony Blair is Scottish. Born in Edinburgh and educated at Fettes.”
What matters is where your culture and values come from, not necessarily where you are born. Your culture/values have a lot to do with who your parents/family are, the culture they come from, their social class in that culture, and the wider social group you are brought up in.
As James Kelman said, if you want to know your identity, look at who your relatives are.
@Alf Baird
Having now read several of your papers and your book, Doun-Hauden, my view is that compelling an indigenous people to use a language not their own is undemocratic and smacks of colonialism.
From what I’ve read it appears to be one of the devices used by colonisers to effect control over the colonised – especially in administrative and educational environments.
It would also appear that one of the first stages of decolonising the minds of the colonised is for them to reclaim their own cultural identity, particularly their own language.
Anecdotally, and from my own experience, the Scots language, what I remember of it, often feels more comfortable to use in both writing and speech. Almost if it’s lying dormant just under the surface of the language that has been imposed over it.
I find that phenomenon quite interesting considering I more or less stopped speaking in Scots from around the age of seven or eight.
When I think about it, though, I was still using a lot of Scots words in every day conversation into my late teens and beyond – although never when writing. More so than I do now, although I’m beginning to pick it up again.
To RepublicofScotland
To clarify – however the result in 2014 was achieved – and I’m not doubting that the Britnat media ran a project Fear in the last fortnight or so before the vote – I think that my comment still stands: that is, that the SNP was spooked by the final result. They have not had the confidence to engage since, settling rather for running a devolved Scotland. And not doing that all that well!
@Geri says:21 June, 2023 at 4:24 pm
Nukes are now illegal under international law
It’s like I replied to James. Every day a school day. So why don’t you and James gang up and make dual citizen’s arrests of some nuclear bombs. After all, the law is on your side, you’re acting against illegality, so what can go wrong?
And we will all be behind you both. Oh yes.
James Che @5:47pm
Dammit, Jim. They’re on to us.
Better contact the mother ship and let them know that our mission to move the humans up an evolutionary notch has failed.
We’ll come back in a thousand years and give it another try then.
“… and Tony Blair is Scottish. Born in Edinburgh and educated at Fettes.”
dasBlimp.
So what, Gordon Brown is Scottish as well, there’s a whole plethora of Scottish House Jocks desperate to do England’s bidding to the detriment of Scotland.
Treacherous b*stards.
“and I’m not doubting that the Britnat media ran a project Fear in the last fortnight or so before the vote ”
Eh?
Hobbit.
You obviously weren’t paying attention or more likely you don’t know, (same as dasBlimp) but Project Fear ran a lie filled fear filled campaign from day one.
You don’t forget stuff like this because you lived through it, you either recall it or you don’t, the latter applies, usually because you know nothing about it in the first place (dasBlimp).
@dasBlimp
I know but no true Scotsman etc. As the world around us changes beyond recognition Scotland will be exempt and allowed to retain our homes, jobs, areas, cities, country and culture. Anything bad we were involved in before any of us or our grandparents were born was done by big boys who ran away.
I have posted a number of times with regard to the stuff promoting ethnic cleansing/genocide I am seeing in the Arts, too many white people in Inverness etc. Too see what we are really dealing with people should look up the Weather Underground. This time fifty years ago this Marxist group was planning to take over the US and the population were to be be herded into re education camps where an estimated twenty five million, their estimation, who would not bend the knee to them were to be liquidated. Their descendants and sympathisers are active in politics, academia, even at nursery level, and the media in the West as I type but we are not supposed to talk about it because calling out people who wish to see you ended is bigotry.
Language is a important connection to ones immediate surrounds and to the wider community a person lives within,
Deliberate and enforced language change is required by the Coloniser to break down groups and communities that are linked,
The divide and rule principles are actively present in the Social experiment of mass migration and immigration around the world today,
The same divide and rule principles can be seen in white priviledge and Blm nowadays. It was also used to make people feel alienated with vaxxers and anti vaxxers,
It has been converted for use over into gender issues,
And has long been used to inspire hatred of one nation against the other.
The principle never changes, only the title of the topic.
Dividing and banning and actually “Colonising” the wide variety of languages used into one single language, The Colonising language, and then introducing many many new foreign languages and belief systems into the mix furthers the feeling that you live in a foreign Country while standing in your own Country,
The success of the Colonisers ideology depends on wether indigenous people are outnumbered while losing the sense of their background, their old community, of their of belonging to collective race of people in common, and to the very to their roots and their Country.
This is the ideal goal and aim of the Coloniser.
You guys are aware that if Scotland was a person, she’d be on life support right now and the doctors would be muttering about “care pathways”, and the relatives would be wondering who’s inheriting the house? You know that, right?
Scotland does not have a lot of time left before the situation is irretrievable.
It’s later than you thocht.
Just thought I’d mention that cheery factoid, because collectively we seem to be whistling into the night here, guys and she-guys. There are fewer Scots alive today than there were yesterday. Tomorrow will be worse. The prognosed mathematical progression of the native Scottish population at this point looks like one of DMA Design’s Lemmings right shortly the SPLAT!
Seems to me the best way to save Scotland from demographic implosion is to make more Scottish children. Teach them weel, and let them lead the way.
Show them all the beauty they possess inside.
Give them a sense… of pride.
This is an easy and fun thing you can do at home with the missus.
Or we can just get old and see our country repopulated and remade by other, more vigourous nations before we die. Up to you.
Scotland Free Or A Dessert! (Jobby flavoured Angel Delight)
Can I get an Amen (from the Kate Forbes fans at least, even? Idk if Wee Frees do that Hallelujah stuff.)
@Republicofscotland says:21 June, 2023 at 6:35 pm
Project Fear ran a lie filled fear filled campaign from day one
That would be the 2014 Scottish Independence Referendum.
“Should Scotland be an independent country?”
The effects of that fear campaign are considered on here to have swung enough voters from Yes to No.
Later on in 2016, we had the Brexit Independence Referendum.
“Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?”
Once again, Project Fear was in full flow, and just about every organisation we can think of was deployed in favour of Remain. Plus even Obama, FFS.
Yet that fear campaign is considered on here to have had no effect whatsoever on swinging enough Scottish voters from Leave to Remain.
And thus you have it. The effects of undue pressure, bias, fear, are only BAAAADDD when they cause a result the poster objects to (Indy rejected). Otherwise they are just GRRRAAAAANNNDDD (Brexit rejected (in Scotland)).
You don’t forget stuff like this because you lived through it
A rare chance for me to agree with RoS. I won’t be forgetting any day soon.
Meantime IMO, one national characteristic we might want to consider and learn from is that the English are more immune to Project Fear effects than we Scots.
It’s a small sample size, admittedly, but the one example of Project Fear the English were exposed to (Brexit), they stuck up 2 fingers to the “elites” (and why not, that’s an indigenous English response).
The two examples of Project Fear we Scots were exposed to (Indy & Brexit), we caved both times, and meekly did what our “elites” told us to do.
Maybes “cringed” is a better word than “caved”.
Good point Red.
An indy Scotland could introduce economic incentives for young women to have their 2/3/4 kids in their 20s, when young and healthy – a high level of welfare benefits, then generous educational and business grants for these women to get back into work/uni when in their 30s. This is common sense, but any politician who suggests it will be branded a “nazi”, with a lot of jibes about “lebensborn”. In fact, it sounds to me more like “having it all”, but for real and not the cheap con trick of feminism, a movement which seems to live entirely in the headspace of rich socialites and jewish lesbians.
– the backdrop to this “demographic crisis” was the story of a record number of abortions done in Scotland last year, some 16000, almost all of it viable, healthy life, but expunged mostly for reasons of inconvenience and not at all the hysterical edge-cases beloved of abortionists. Getting scraped is a sacrament for the feminists by now and any critical look at what is happening subject to a crazed response. Then, in a celebration of insanity, we have the flipside to it all – desperate attempts to get barren old crones up the duff via IVF using the miracles of medical science.
Another side to it all is the impoverishment of young couples, particularly with respect to the housing market, a nasty and very rigged scam, something which should be broken up as a “racket”; NB Scotland has loads of land, so why is housing so expensive?
Yet another aspect of our slow genocide is the creeping increase of “White – Other British” to Scotland, mostly the nicer bits, something which will only increase and is currently being hidden from the public.
Devolution gives you no control over any of this, obviously. It’s “indy or bust”. But it may already be too late.
It was an extremely difficult choice.
Trying to decide who has written the most shite today between Che, Baird, RoS and Northcode. Regrettably I have to exclude Che as I never read any of his/hers/its posts. However, as I am sure most will agree, they are all repetitive shite.
Bairds efforts are skimmed through although I again note the clever use of some guid Scots words and the usual reference to some obscure individual no one pays any attention to.
RoS tries but always fails miserably. Not too bright I suspect.
This leaves Northcode, whom to me, is a recent arrival on the scene. He/she/it is trying to catch up on ‘lost’ time and now posts copiously everyday. Unfortunately The posts have now to be afforded the same treatment as those of Che. Simply scroll past as swiftly as possible! I could be wrong but it could be that Northcode is Baird’s boyfriend/girlfriend. Such is the adulation on show.
Maybe it will be better tomorrow but…………….I doubt it!
@Red says:21 June, 2023 at 7:30 pm
Scotland does not have a lot of time left before the situation is irretrievable.
It’s later than you thocht
Exactly.
IMO, it’s already too late for the Sovereign Scot idea. There are already too many New Scots, and the imbalance grows daily in the wrong direction.
So we are back to the simplest and best idea for Indy, cos it engages all Scots, Sovereign and New, political and apathetic, brown and white, young and old, male, female, pretendy and cat.
Show us the money! Backed up by competence, rationality and realpolitik of course, cos there is no money without these foundations beneath it.
Maybes one happy day, people will just stop banging on about 1707, Bannockburn, Darien, colonies, “against oor will”, etc. etc. and focus on the one thing that can unite the majority of us for Indy:
Show us the fucking money.
John Main,
England and the Establishment was split down the middle regarding Brexit. On one side of the divide was the ecstasy of getting rid of Johnny Foreigners and on the other side was the despair of getting rid of cheap labour.
Regarding Scottish independence, the Establishment was acting as one for the Union and fully against having their cash cow running off to pastures new.
Chas,
The laws of thermodynamics indicate that you are a bit of a roaster.
John Main,
John Jappy, Gavin McCrone and William Waldergrave have already shown you the fucking money and what’s happened to it.
@Ottomanboi 4.09:
“Scots/Lallans and Gaelic are as efficient forms of communication as any human language.
However, without high end, sophisticated, intellectual resources i.e language planning skills, dictionaries, grammars etc financed by the state education apparatus both will continue to decline.”
For someone who seems to be a recent immigrant here you have a pretty sure-footed feel for the realities of language in Scotland.
We must not impose a binary choice on either of the native languages in any future Scotland, should it ever emerge. In general, Gaelic is fine for the Highlands and Scots for the Lowlands. Obviously, Standard English will continue to be taught in schools.
I will only make the general comment that I am amazed by the general ignorance of SNP MPs/MSPs regarding Scottish history, languages and culture, perhaps summed up by The Great Vacuum, Education Minister Jenny Gilruth, following the wonderful example of brain-lite Shirley-Anne Somerville.
This has led to obviously self-defeating general howlers/deliberately legal suicide like referring a matter from the highest court in Scotland (the Court of Session) to be qualified/ set aside/adjudicated in England, one of the clearest breaches of the Treaty of Union imaginable.
As Red has said, we have only very little time before demographics finally defeat native Scots and I have very little belief that professional politicians will/can do anything about it, since they are so self-serving, compromised and thick as Gove.
I find the name Breastplate too long to type. I think that it is maybe appropriate to abbreviate it in some way. Of course, any new name should somehow reflect the original ‘flavour’ that the user intended. It would help if the new avatar was something short and snappy
Giving due cognisance to the word breast, the word TIT seems appropriate? On reflection, this is maybe too short. A Right Tit seems to fit the bill. Perhaps you could unite with either Che, Baird, RoS or Northcode. This would then produce a Pair of Tits. If you all combined you could be ‘Tits R Us’.
Give it some thought, if this is not too taxing for you?
Am always happy to be of assistance.
I forgot to mention Niall Aslen who did a fantastic job of detailing the extent to which we are being robbed.
@Breastplate says:21 June, 2023 at 8:27 pm
Recollections may differ, eh BP?
Re Brexit. The CBI was against it, so was the TUC, the BBC, the opposition, half the government, big companies, organised labour, the churches, the scientific and educational establishments, most of the press (DM excepted). Don’t forget the saintly Obama. Hell, even the RSPB came out in favour of Remain.
Many people are of the view that an excess of Johnny Foreigners leads to a smaller wage packet for the indigenous, not to mention more expensive accomodation, poorer education for their kids, and more chance of dying from lack of timely medical treatment for life threatening illness.
Or dying from stab wounds/gunshot wounds sustained in the street.
I can’t really fault anybody who voted for Brexit on these grounds.
Just as I can’t fault anybody who votes for Indy for essentially the same reason – keep the Johnny Foreigners out.
@Tinto Chiel says:21 June, 2023 at 8:48 pm
Obviously, Standard English will continue to be taught in schools
How’s that then?
American English is spoken by the young, and not so young.
American spelling is used by most.
I find that incontrovertible fact of unconscious cultural colonisation exceedingly funny, TBQH.
So what are you saying, Tinto? Talk of going to see a movie, or spell “colonise” as “colonize” and a pupil will get the tawse?
Sounds remarkably regressive to me!
John Main,
Yes, as I pointed out in my comment, Brexit was seen as a problem for business (rightly or wrongly) v those who seen Brexit as an elixir to remedy broken Britain (rightly or wrongly).
Johnny Foreigner was on both sides of the equation in large dollops.
As you say yourself, the government were split, indicating the schism. My point wasn’t about whether Brexit was right or wrong but that Scotland faced the full might of the Establishment, that wasn’t the case for Brexit.
For the record, I AM a Scot abroad. I do NOT want people in my position to have a vote on the future of a country we neither reside in nor contribute to. I will be back though. And I will be both campaigning and voting for independence. If I can find someone to vote for.
Chas @ 8:12 pm
“the usual reference to some obscure individual no one pays any attention to.”
You mean those ‘postcolonial theory’ writers whose works helped influence and bring about the present UN policy on decolonization allowing more than 80 former colonies to become independent states?
You may be aware that Alba and Salvo are now rapidly taking Scotland in that same direction:
https://yoursforscotlandcom.wordpress.com/2023/06/20/salvo-liberation-snc-press-release/
Some people are clearly paying attention.
Oh Jesus, this gets worse.
We now have Northcode dribbling on about the Scots language, and James Che dribbling on about colonialism. That’s going to be truly horrific when he works out how to insert that into endless diatribes about misunderstood interpretations of Arbroath and the treaties. A total scrollpast fest.
I think John Main and I are probably on opposite sides of pro, and anti, Indy, but we seem to be quite lined up on (to use his phrase), “show us the fucking money”.
Except I’ll go further. There’s not enough money in Scotland, the oil, the gas, the wind, the whisky, or even the Japanese tourists being led down the Royal Mile by a lady with a yellow brolly, to pay for Indy. Not at the rate that Scotland’s people consume it.
Another excellent podcast out today from, “A Scottish Prism”
Regarding brexit; I’m set for a trip to Finland/Denmark, dropping off pals and pals-of-pals’ stuff and picking up another pal and her stuff.
The paperwork! Fucksake.
Scots should be following the Nordic model, or most of Europe for that matter – breeding the next generation.
The parents are looked after by the state, are given free nannies, childcare, minted garden, money incentives, family time off etc.
Everyone is happier & healthier for it. No wonder. It’s not a bleak outlook for them like the UK shite hole is.
Britain has adopted the culture of branding everyone scroungers or the greedy who think their taxes shouldn’t pay for other ppls kids. Instead of seeing the bonus of parents returning to work & being productive to the economy. Not Nazi at all but I know, some ppls attitudes are rank.
Women shouldn’t have gone out to work in the UK. They thought they had a new job lol. They didn’t. That was a myth. They just lumped on a 2nd & 3rd to thier stressful day of a new full time job PLUS the ones they already had waiting at home of housekeeper & childminder. Same with father’s stressed out to be provider on more & more consumerism the high cost of living & work until yer grave with no job security & no house to call home. It’s biting countries on the are now as thier populations dwindle to the point of extinction.
Get breeding LOL! Before Trans put the final nail in all our coffins..
John Main re nukes.
It’s not up to us to make citizens arrests. I suspect under international law that’s the job of the UN signatories to force compliance to the new treaty or face sanctions.
A strongly worded letter is the norm I think..
America, Israel & the UK will do the usual exceptionalist thing & ignore it if a fly farts in thier direction…
Re the Yoon trolls who crawled out from under a rock. My point about the Scotland footie was that I was close to getting stranded in Glasgow on Tuesday night because the Wokist Yoons in the SNP now running Transport in Scotland are doing their best to trash our Transport networks etc.
But thank you for giving away yer Yoonery quizzers. With Quizzers like you we will never be Independent. You also obviously hate Scotland winning at anything. Does your hatred for Scotland winning at anything also extend to the obvious hotbed of Yoonery that is so called Scottish Rugby.
“ Not enough money in Scotland” ? That’s because it’s been syphoned off by the London treasury and spent primarily South of Watford . Time our resources and taxes were repatriated to a Scottish treasury .
Geri says:
21 June, 2023 at 11:40 pm
Get breeding LOL! Before Trans put the final nail in all our coffins..
Scotland should stop pandering to the NeoLiberal Ponzi scheme of grossly inflated house prices which can only ratchet up the prices to stratospheric levels if there is both a chronic and acute shortage of housing to go around.
People rightly curse Thatcher and her self servicing Tories, but NONE of the shite she tipped over Scotland has been reversed or overturned, in the four decades since. We still bitch and whine about how terrible it is, but yet we’re too feart to get up and walk out the open door.
Revitalise Scotland’s housing, undercut the price of property and recognise that having a place to live is as fundamental as having access to drinking water, health care, and food. It’s not a fkg luxury item that’s left in the hands of evil, greedy bastards who want extort cash and prosperity from a fundamental requirement of ordinary existence.
And no, I do NOT mean sponsoring a corporate house builder to build thousands and thousands of trash properties on virgin greenfield sites. That’s the very opposite of what I mean. These are the slums of tomorrow. They have a date with a bulldozer already.
Scotland was founded on common good, and our recognised interdependency upon each other. Whether we struggle or thrive, we do it as a Scottish society which doesn’t leave the less fortunate ones behind.
It certainly doesn’t rob our young folks blind for 25 years paying ludicrous excesses on a stick built piece of crap that resembles a house but likely won’t survive the lifespan of two mortgages.
You want Scotland’s kids to be setting up families, getting kids into our schools and expanding our workforce? Get a housing strategy to get these people secure homes so they can actually find a place to fkg stay and get to work without being ripped off by the racket that passes for a construction / housing industry.
Give them land to grow their own veg, and aye provide training, advice and support for doing it. Start encouraging them to be independent in mind and body, NOT dependent upon the state to provide them with a living. Doing this for yourself is incredibly rewarding.
Instead of filling their heads with pish about gender, and all the other crap that gets pumped into their heads, and get our schools and colleges focused upon teaching our kids how to look after themselves and provide for a family for the pride and security of having a family, not winning the lottery on a lucky day in the housing market.
Teach our people trades again. And I mean proper trades that turn kids into learned professional experts who are good at their jobs, and know how to build proper fkg houses of substance and longevity.
You do NOT require to own property if you have a stable and affordable rental sector. Scotland should be as proud of it’s housing as we are of our NHS, and these Tory style parasites who want it all privatised so it’s open season on societies most vulnerable people can be expelled from Scotland as a body expels puss from a wound.
You want a vibrant Scottish society? Give our kids a future here so they don’t have to fk off to Australia to get a start in life.
Start backing Independence so we have a government looking out for Scotland’s best interests and future, no grooming Scotland for the next humiliating exploitation where we’re all fleeced yet again.
I don’t want to say it, because it’ll be misinterpreted by the usual arseholes, but I’d ask you to look beyond the Hitler Youth / Nazi elements of it, and no, I’m not advocating a Scottish Luftwaffe, but back in the 1930’s, the Germans set up glider schools to get their young people enthused in their nations recovery. In Nazi Germany this was an abuse, the motives were corrupt but mechanism was very empowering. It could have been a wholly positive phenomenon if it’s motives had been constructive and positive.
It needn’t be aviation, (though why not? – it could be), but “something” to get Scotland’s young people engaging with their nation; something that makes all those young Scottish lads and lasses in NZ or Oz start thinking they’ve maybe made the wrong decision abandoning Scotland.
We do not have to live the miserable lives dictated to us by a broken and vindictive UK society. We can build something much more progressive, life-fulfilling, and rewarding for our people.
Independence is only the start. Become the Scotland we were born to be. Invest in our own people, not some corporate bank or Hedge fund who’s name we’ll never know.
London’s plans for Scotland are to turn our Nation into a Retirement Home for Southerners, wholly dependent upon UK subsidy so Independence is forever impossible. Our infrastructure is underdeveloped, or mothballed completely, our homes are beyond our reach, and our populations are being displaced. Nevermind the Clearances, isn’t that uncomfortably close to a Nazi ideology of Lebensraum?
Some numbers:
Miners put out of work due to Thatcher’s policies: 20,000.
Oil & Gas workers likely to be put out of work due to Net Zero policies: 140,000.
UK Net Migration last year: 606,000.
UK Illegal Migration (rubber boats) this year so far: 10,000.
Still hating Thatcher? – then get ready to hate with stilts on when the current crop of politicos shut down our oil industry.
Still wondering why property purchase and rental prices are so high? – just look at these immigration numbers FFS. Do you really think they are all living in cardboard boxes?
Here’s my conclusion. Let’s assume the UK and Scotland are indeed shitholes. But, compared with the places all these people are coming from, they are still better shitholes.
Ergo, the current situation will persist until such time as our “pull factor” disappears, meaning until we are every bit as bad a shithole as the worst shithole anywhere in the world
Two conclusions can be drawn:
1) The decline still has some way to go.
2) Today is the best day of the rest of your life, because every day things will get worse.
I’ll close with one final thought:
Are you happy with the conclusion that our only future is continual decline until we are as equally bad a shithole as the worst shitholes in the world?
No? Then examine your attitudes and assumptions that need to change. Pay attention to the policies and views of politicians and parties. Reject tribalism and habit. Seize realism and pragmatism. Vote accordingly. Organise accordingly.
Right, I’m off to enjoy the best day of the rest of my life. For most people reading this far, today will also be the best day of the rest of your lives, as geopolitical forces combine with home-grown political ineptitude to make everything worse day after day. Enjoy!
7 years tomorrow since the Brexit vote.
Innarestin article on Unherd “Brexit Has Stumped Our Zombie Elites”, with some good takes on the state of Scotland. Here’s a wee quote:
“With the UK out of the EU, Scottish independence is just too demanding a prospect for the culture warriors in Holyrood who have survived its corruption chaos”
The author’s conclusions seem sound to me. We are essentially back to square 1, in both the UK and Scotland. Plenty of scope there to grow new people, new parties, new policies, and a new solid support base for Indy in Scotland.
True Indy this time, not the sham Indy of control outsourced to the grown-ups in Brussels.
North Chiel @ 3:06am
Scotland’s vast natural resources; resources that rightfully belong to, and which should be entirely for the benefit of, indigenous Scots, IS the money.
And there’s still plenty of it. If there wasn’t Westminster would ditch Scotland in a heartbeat.
A Scot Abroad said;
“There’s not enough money in Scotland, the oil, the gas, the wind, the whisky, or even the Japanese tourists being led down the Royal Mile by a lady with a yellow brolly, to pay for Indy. Not at the rate that Scotland’s people consume it.”
Yes, there is.
North Chie
Indeed.
Given Scotland`s small pop and its 50 years of oil and gas revenue, it should be stinking rich, but its not. So where has all the money gone. Its a question i pose to unionists and one which they can`t answer.
C’mon everyone – ignore the obvious anti Scots on here , god knows why they bother coming other than to insult and windup .
Try even harder to ignore them and remember what our host has said in the past.
What gets me about SNP followers is their child like innocence in thinking they are dealing with a modern democracy at Westminster, that will see reason.
These people don’t give a hoot for democracy.
Already in Scotland we have a legal hierarchy defending sturgeon and her Vietnam team, we have the civil service in cahoots, we have the police investigating to order and a fully compliant press reinforced with a duplicitous BBC and who knows what the security services are up to.
These are the people who stand up in November talking about the people that died fighting for democracy.Oh the irony.
The long and short is expecting Westminster to see reason being kind a very long shot indeed.
TINTO CHIEL 8:48pm
My ancestral «ethnicity» is in a far more precarious state than that of Scotland. The Bush/Blair Iraq war has decimated the ancieng Syriac speaking minority. The Arab/Kurd political hegemony pays only lip service to the interests of ourselves, the Yazidis, Turcomans, Mandaeans, Marsh Arabs etc. The Jews went long ago we may be next.
We are a little known culture, particularly in the West, which provided the Arab conquerors with links to the classical knowledge of Greek, Roman, Persian, Egyptian and Indic cultures through our language skills. Not a little of this knowledge was considered dangerous to the novel Arab religion and did not survive the excesses of rulers. Some, however, did and provided a basis for so called Islamic science, mathematics and philosophy to develop despite strict religious sanctions on «thought».
Languages matter in so far as they are an expression of human thought, an expression as diverse as the human imagination is capable of and circumstances allow.
Dorothy Devine,
Debate is necessary, arguments need to be countered and ridiculous statements demand ridicule.
I’m not talking about flooding the thread with endless contradiction, that would be tedious and pointless.
We do need to champion independence for people who are unaware of the facts or are simply looking for information regarding Scottish self determination.
There are a few on here who do not merit an answer to their nonsense because they will not change their mind regardless of how much evidence is placed before them, don’t talk to them, speak to the people who are reading Wings.
Breeks I agree.
The UK has zero prospects for young ppl. Zero hours contracts & high rents – who’d even consider kids?
The UK is absolutely shite at looking after its citizens of all ages, from tuition fees for young ppl to the worst pension after working all thier life & the Tories would have them picking fruit until the dropped if they could get away with it & they just might – they’re getting more & more authoritarian with every passing day.
The Union is dead if ever there was another referendum. They have absolutely feck all to offer us to stay & why they won’t even bother now.
I could weep at the fuckwits who voted No believing the Better Together bullshit.
SNP is dead but Independence is not. If there is the madness of another referendum we seriously must change the voting franchise or we really with be Northern England & it’ll be a permanent ‘No’
We really needed Ash to win & have every election as a ref. That’d sort the wheat from the chaff. If ppl want Better Together Tory pish, fine – then live with it! Starting by stopping mitigating against thier policies & have a Tory FM. Let them live thier Tory dream.
Wee Alba Book Event
Tonight 7pm Kinross High School/Campus
Free
All Welcome
BREASTPLATE
Individuals, when they give it thought, value their independence, resent being bossed by others. What is the psychology of those who would deny it to a nation of such individuals.
It cannot rest on pure reason. Resentment, jealousy, prejudice, fear, misanthropy?
Breeks @ 6.02
Excellent post , B . Think you got one thing wrong though . The obscenity that is the ” housing market ” is not the product of unrestrained greed enabled/encouraged by successive UK Govs .
No sir , according to John Rees-Main , the culprits are those dastardly immigrants , who , upon washing-up on * our * shores head straight for the nearest Estate Agents , pushing native Caucasians aside , gazumping poor Nigel, Jeremy , Bethany and all the other put-upon Tory Voters . I’m sure we’ve all seen , walking down our High Streets – stepping over dog shit , litter, commercial and human trash en route – groups of such invaders gathered round the front windows of Madoff n Co Realtors waving * loadsa money * n boasting about they just outbid some jerk-off loser/local for a nice little ” des res ” mews gaff – and did so using UK Taxpayers money – YO !
Remember wee Mainy , who is forever demanding to be shown the ” fucking money ” ( why he needs money for fucking is anyone’s guess ) was , just the other day , whining about wages rising ; how does he imagine Scots are going be the millionaires of his imagination , the GUARANTEE of which is the prerequisite for him and his droning ilk – aye , that includes you Chass ( sic ) , to ever vote YES for Independence , if wages are still to be constrained by the golden calf of * Market Forces * ?
There are definitely questions to be asked around the subject of Immigration .How the basic human need for a safe , secure home came to be just another commodity to be sold to the highest bidder or lucky recipient of State/Housing Trust largesse is not one of them . We know what caused this deplorable situation – red in tooth n claw feral Capitalism ; the worship and prioritisation of money over any/every human need/value .
DD
Amen to that.
Iain More 12.17am
Of course anybody who criticises the Scotland team or their “Tartan Army” just has to be a “Yoon”.
I bet you are a fully paid up member of the SNP, a subscriber to the National, Wee Ginger Dugs number one fan,,,and think Nicola Sturgeon should still be leader of the SNP.
And you probably wear a kilt, with one of those “see you Jimmy” bunnets on.
Scotland the Brave, my fuckin arse.
You can be a member of the mighty ” Tartan Army “,,,just as long as you don’t mention Scottish independence,,,pathetic!!!
McDuff @ 8:27am
So where has all the money gone?
Scotland’s money went to london; where it was partly spent on expanding westminster’s criminal global financial operations centre within the 1.1 square miles that is the city of london.
Did you know the city of london, the world’s money laundering service provider for the rich and vicious, has it’s own police force – a separate organisation from the met police?
The rest of Scotland’s money was spent on: bolstering london’s and the south east of england’s infrastructures, illegal wars, epically stupid and poorly planned military weapons systems development, enriching the greedy and undeserving, a plethora of expensive vanity projects, enriching the greedy and undeserving, epically stupid and poorly planned civil engineering projects, attempting to keep up with the Jones’s'(America), reparations to former british colonies, enriching the greedy and undeserving, the english monarchy, and, finally, enriching the greedy and undeserving.
Oh, and a tiny ‘handout’ for Scotland.
Also, I can’t be bothered capitalising westminster or london or britain or the uk or england any more – they don’t deserve it.
Leslie Riddoch writes an extraordinarily critical article just two days before she is due to speak at the SNP Convention this Saturday
https://archive.is/vcXg8
@Robert Hughes says:22 June, 2023 at 9:37 am
Hey Bob,
You’re right. I’m wrong.
All these millions of people DO live in cardboard boxes. They don’t use public services.
That being the case, there is no pressure (white flight) for older, richer English people to move north and settle in Scotland.
Thus, there are no areas of Scotland where locals have been squeezed out by wealthy southerners.
Thanks for clearing that up, Bob.
You’ve enabled us to identify some of the most frequently lying posters on here.
@Dorothy Devine says:22 June, 2023 at 8:34 am
Try even harder to ignore them
You are so right DD.
Indy will be ours if we just blank everybody who ever questions anything about it.
Anyways, soz if I have ever posted anything to upset you in the past. So here’s a wee post that will land smack bang in the middle of your comfort zone, just for you:
See thon Sturgeon, fit a tractor, eh?
You’re welcome.
@Northcode says:22 June, 2023 at 9:53 am
So where has all the money gone?
Scotland’s money went to london
@Robert Hughes says:22 June, 2023 at 9:37 am
We know what caused this deplorable situation – red in tooth n claw feral Capitalism ; the worship and prioritisation of money over any/every human need/value
Hmmm. Either the fucking money is important or it’s naw.
If it’s naw (a new development to me, at least) all these year’s banging oan aboot “Scotland’s Oil” would seem to have been a complete waste of time.
Anyways, sort it oot among yersels. I’ve been telt. To want Indy just because it will make Scotland (and myself) better off in a material sense is seemingly just a sign that I have adopted the colonialist’s corrupted mindset and values.
Looking at you Northcode.
Meh
Confused says:
21 June, 2023 at 8:10 pm
Good point Red.
An indy Scotland could introduce economic incentives for young women to have their 2/3/4 kids in their 20s, when young and healthy – a high level of welfare benefits, then generous educational and business grants for these women to get back into work/uni when in their 30s
Thank you. This is where other countries are already heading.
The fertility crisis isn’t a uniquely Western or white people thing, it’s everywhere in the world that has heavily urbanised and modernised. Even China. We should be open to ideas from other countries, because we’re all facing similar problems.
John Main – So we are back to the simplest and best idea for Indy, cos it engages all Scots, Sovereign and New, political and apathetic, brown and white, young and old, male, female, pretendy and cat.
Definitely can’t see any future for the likes of Alba unless they can successfully connect with things the Scottish public – which isn’t particularly politically aware – cares about.
Those are mostly the bread and butter issues. Tangibles.
The good news for political outsiders is that the status quo can no longer guarantee even a 1990’s style standard of living for its subjects (we will most probably end up with South Africa style brownouts on the regular, with savage restrictions on your movement and consumption) – that creates possibilities for change.
Ottomanboi says:
22 June, 2023 at 9:06 am
TINTO CHIEL 8:48pm
My ancestral «ethnicity» is in a far more precarious state than that of Scotland. The Bush/Blair Iraq war has decimated the ancieng Syriac speaking minority. The Arab/Kurd political hegemony pays only lip service to the interests of ourselves, the Yazidis, Turcomans, Mandaeans, Marsh Arabs etc. The Jews went long ago we may be next.
The crimes of the collective West (i.e. the United States government plus its obedient little sidekick regimes such as Britain) against the peoples of the Middle East mirror their attitude to their own populations, whom they thoroughly despise and always have done.
Divide and rule is, of course, the original colonial/imperial template. King Richard II ‘of England’ (he wasn’t, of course, English) spoke for our parasitic foreign ruling class then and now when he promised his peasant subjects (90% of the population) only slavery and death.
Forever War abroad and Infinite Migration at home are two sides of the same debased coin. The biggest threat to global security and peace right now are the people who claim to represent “freedom and democracy” and a “rules based order”, while filling their pockets and destroying entire societies.
Geri – Get breeding LOL!
Exactamundo.
Mibbe I’m being naive here, but it seems to me if we want more babbies (and we do, the alternative is monstrous), the first thing we should do is ask for them.
If ye dinnae ask, ye dinnae get. And asking is free. We used to not need to ask, because we had social conditions that led naturally to most people starting families. What was unspoken and implied needs to be spoken out loud now. Not just by middle aged Mums wondering about grandchildren.
25 years ago or so, Alex Salmond launched a canny campaign called “A Penny for Scotland”.
Why don’t we ask couples if they can make a Baby for Scotland? The advertising campaign would be adorable.
Northcode
Of course I know where the money went and still is. The point of my post was that unionists won’t answer that question because it would be an admission that these revenues were plundered.
I know you know, McDuff. I was just emphasising your point.
Scotsrenewables says:
22 June, 2023 at 9:56 am
Leslie Riddoch writes an extraordinarily critical article just two days before she is due to speak at the SNP Convention this Saturday
https://archive.is/vcXg8
The most interesting thing about that article is the candid photie of the SNP membership.
There’s a LOT of Werther’s Originals and Tena for Men in that crowd. I’m not making fun – we’re all getting older.
But that’s the problem, right? Can’t expect people in advanced middle age to keep on trucking forever. They cannae. What will the SNP do when they run out of confused elderly people to pay for their motorhomes? I don’t think there’s enough purple haired gendernauts to replace them.
Since we are not getting Independence any time soon, I’d suggest some effort shaping our next decade of *ahem Democracy under Devolution.
My starter for ten, will be the implementation of an ‘Open List’ in our electoral ballots, and preferably a ‘Free List’, because it’s high time the electorate decided which wasters were parachuted into power.
Currently our ‘Closed List’ is effectively just Party Pal Voting, it is the Party which decides which useless chancers get to sit at the trough representing us.
An Open List allows the electorate to cast votes favouring List Candidates of their choice, and I’d suggest a ‘Free List’ is better yet.
In simplification; in a ‘Free List’one has as many votes as their are candidates, and can distribute them as one wishes (all votes to one candidate, and no votes to others, as an extreme example) This adds an upvoting/downvoting effect into the mix – a swifter way to abolish wastrels to oblivion, and promote the deserving.
That is an achievable goal in the short term, and possibly an easy sell to an electorate who should be familiar with the concept of Upvoting/Downvoting (or Like/Dislike) and shifts the balance of power back to our alleged ‘Personal Scottish Sovereignty’.
Our political parties appear uncapable of vetting candidates, let us relieve them of that obviously, onerous burden.
Like it or not, barring some paradigm shift in the short term, we will be living under the yoke for many years yet – if it is to be Devo, then let it be Devo with bells on.
If all Parties think it is to be business as usual, then we should teach them the real meaning of ‘Peeble wi Stanes’
@John Main, 21st June, 3:41pm:
“What will be the penalties for flouting the ‘authority’ of the Scots language?”
Local languages abound in small European nations that are proud and fiercely protective of them: Catalan, Friulian, Frisian, Galician, Greenlandic, Ladin, Luxembourgish, Romansh, Saami, Sardinian, Vossemaal. Nation-states destroy such languages so that they can claim that nobody uses them – this is a proven tactic for squashing the desire for independence. An estimated 1.5 million people speak only Scots. Not teaching it gives a lever to those who want to destroy it.
They’re having this debate in Greenland, and the Greenlanders are winning.
@John Main, 21st June 3:41pm:
“What will be the penalties for flouting the ‘authority’ of the Scots language?”
Local languages abound in small European nations that are proud and fiercely protective of them: Catalan, Friulian, Frisian, Galician, Greenlandic, Ladin, Luxembourgish, Romansh, Saami, Sardinian, Vossemaal. Nation-states destroy such languages so that they can claim that nobody uses them – this is a proven tactic for squashing the desire for independence. An estimated 1.5 million people speak only Scots, so it hasn’t been rubbed out yet. Not teaching it gives a lever to those who want to destroy it.
They’re having this debate in Greenland, and the Greenlanders are winning.
(posted this at around 8.10 but it never turned up and wasn’t flagged a in moderation so must have fumbled it. Trying again.)
John Main stream
“ Oil & Gas workers likely to be put out of work due to Net Zero policies: 140,000.”
The people advocating shutting down new drilling endeavours to achieve net zero (ironic, that term) are politicians in a representative democracy. They have counted the likely votes and trimmed accordingly.
Personally I think we have to go a lot further than that – the ecological problems we are facing are more serious than just the global warming due to fossil fuel burning (John – not plastic manufacturing, unless it gets burnt once used). They are a consequence of what we do with cheap energy, not just it’s destructive combustion products.
You assert that 140,000 workers will be “put out of work”. That’s not comparable to the 20,000 miners left unemployed (if that really is the figure – not done the checking) but here is a clue why:
https://archive.vn/2kydu
Most of those 140,000 oil industry dependants will find other work. It looks like effort will be spent to feather-bed that process to deal with their bealing, now chickens are finally coming home to roost.
So John, do you say we must maintain the oil industry AND deal with the problems fossil fuel use causes? Show us the logic.
Or is it really that you will use any argument, however crooked or disingenuous, to keep the gravy-train on track, delivering massive wealth to a few billionaires, a good living (for now) to less than 10%, and buggering-up everything else? How much do you get paid?
Ruby was right about you.
Great post from Breeks – and I know we don’t agree on energy stuff
Northcode says
Also, I can’t be bothered capitalising westminster or london or britain or the uk or england any more – they don’t deserve it.
—–
You seem a bit grumpy today, Northcode. What’s up? Couldn’t you manage a proper poo this morning?
Yasss! Bannockburn’s a definite now.
Looked 50/50 for a bit there, but I can make it. Phew!
@scotsrenewables/Red –
Paul Kavanagh has properly shat the bed with his ‘consequences’ comment re Fergus Ewing.
If Riddoch and GMK have any sense between them they’ll refuse to share stage with him on Saturday.
DasBlimp @ 11:09am
Thanks for your concern over my bowel movements, dasBlimp – very touching.
Though now that you ask, I am grumpy this morning. And I’ll tell you why.
My doctor has diagnosed me as suffering from a case of colonial constipation.
It’s a terrible affliction where, due to being colonised, I no longer have the motivation to give a shit.
There’s only one cure apparently, independence.
But on top of that you and your ‘pals’ are antagonising my colonially constipated condition by insisting on hogging all the poo for yourselves.
Worse, you gather all your poo into one great pyramid of poo and plop it all over WoS threads.
It’s as if you’re taunting me with your abundance of poo – although I know you would never stoop that low.
Not that it matters that much to me anyway. I don’t give a poo – even if I could.
So, nobody has got an answer to how an iScotland will pay for itself. It’s a plain and undeniable fact that Scotland has more spent on it per capita than it raises, also per capita, in revenues. In simple terms, it’s like a family getting an income of £3,000 a month, and spending £3,500 a month. At some point, the bills won’t get paid.
So what is the answer? Oil and gas have got about 30 years left as reliable revenue. The renewable energy potential in Scotland is vast, but it’s just as good anywhere within 1,000 miles, and countries now want their own energy security, not to be reliant on other countries. Becoming a tax haven is probably out, as Ireland and Luxembourg have got that covered. There’s only so much that tourism can raise, and revenues are still down from the pre-pandemic levels. Scotland’s industrial base is low, and currently the population of Scotland have the highest levels employed in public service of any country in Europe. They may make an income, but they are a net drain on public finances. About 55,000 of those jobs are U.K. public sector, so they would disappear following Indy.
I’m just not seeing where the money is coming from to pay for iScotland.
Not without some very savage paring back of what is spent in Scotland.
If the cure is independence then you are going to have to hold it in for a lot longer yet, Northcode. It’s just shit innit.
Maybe you should try colonic immigration.
Credit where credit’s due. Nice come back, dasBlimp 🙂
North Code.
I read you’re last post, and smiled,
I repeated this to my spouse, explaining they do not have Colon Cancer, the diagnoses was wrong,
That they had something similar, a illness called Colonial constipation,
Well they thought it was a funny corrective diagnoses, you brightened up their day, you made them laugh,
Even asked me who had said it, I put your name forward,
They responded by saying, He ( you) are a good addition to wings, I have read a few of his posts,
Colonial diarrhea and Constipation 🙂 :-),
Scot Abroad,
Colonial constipation followed diarrhea diatribe,
Your illness will never get better while you stick to the same old Colonial diet of fearing mongering. And trying to inflict Scots with the same illness.
ASAB; “About 55,000 of those jobs are U.K. public sector, so they would disappear following Indy”
Public sector jobs would continue to be part of Scottish needs eg HMRC, DWP, etc. Chances are we would need to recruit more people to the public sector. So they would not disappear because of indy. Maybe help others see what you mean if you share your source for the info you present.
You know, it is peculiar that I no longer Worry how Scotland might fail should we gain independence,
I no longer worry that there is no oil, no infrastructure, no thriving Nhs, no money, No specific plan for the future, no Ferries, no employment, no valid currency, a falling population, food banks instead of a economy, that future problems will befall Scotland and Scots galore.
Because that is realistic portrait painted of the Scotland I live in now under our Colonial devolved Westminster legislated Wee pretendy parliament,
If we were to immediately transition to independence, and start at the beginning we would not notice that we were any lower unless than we are now
Unless we took up a globalist Climate change agenda policy into a new Independent Scotland.
Derek Rogers @ 11:02 am
“Local languages abound in small European nations that are proud and fiercely protective of them: Catalan, Friulian, Frisian, Galician, Greenlandic, Ladin, Luxembourgish, Romansh, Saami, Sardinian, Vossemaal. Nation-states destroy such languages so that they can claim that nobody uses them – this is a proven tactic for squashing the desire for independence. An estimated 1.5 million people speak only Scots, so it hasn’t been rubbed out yet. Not teaching it gives a lever to those who want to destroy it.”
Well said Derek.
We know that languages develop and transfer through peoples and their movement and interactions. The Scots language is oor ain distinct, unique langage, constructed and developed solely by the Scots through, and despite, all the varied invasions and cultural interactions over more than one thousand years. The archaeological record also tells us that there was, during all of this period, an indigenous people here already in the form of the Picts and their descendants.
The Scots language is therefore unique to us Scots because it has been built and formed by us, also aided through external interaction with other peoples, cultures and languages, as with most if not all language formation.
The Scots language isnae English, neither is it Latin, or Gaelic, or Norse, or French or German, tho it has some elements of all of these and others in it. Scots is oor ain Scots language, a distinct language made by Scots for Scots. It is oor ain indigenous mither tongue.
And Scots are defined by that Scots language, which is the basis of our national identity today and the fabric of our national culture, which is what gives us our national consciousness, without which there would be no independence movement.
@ A Scot Abroad (aka A Nu English 😉 ) at 12:38 pm
I’ll post this again seeing as you’re newish here, and also to remind Mr Main who continues to say no explanation has been made here as to how he might be better off if Scotland returned to self-governance.
The Kingdom of Scotland has a much better resources to population figure than the Kingdom of England.
(Old stats so may not be 100% accurate but it gives the gist.)
KINGDOM OF SCOTLAND WITH ONLY 9% OF THE UK POPULATION HAS:
32% of the land area.
61% of the sea area.
90% of the fresh water.
65% of the natural gas production
96.5% of the crude oil production.
47% of the open cast coal production
81% of the untapped coal reserves
62% of the timber production
46% of the total forest area
92% of the hydro electric production
40% of the wind wave and solar energy production
60% of the fish landings
30% of the beef herd
20% of the sheep herd
9% of the dairy herd
10% of the pig herd
15% if the cereal holdings
20% of the potato holdings
90% of the whisky industry
70% of gin production
KINGDOM OF ENGLAND WITH 91% OF THE UK POPULATION ONLY HAS:
68% of the land area.
39% of the sea area.
10% of the fresh water.
35% of the natural gas production
3.5% of the crude oil production.
53% of the open cast coal production
19% of the untapped coal reserves
38% of the timber production
54% of the total forest area
8% of the hydro electric production
60% of the wind wave and solar energy production
40% of the fish landings
70% of the beef herd
80% of the sheep herd
91% of the dairy herd
90% of the pig herd
85% if the cereal holdings
80% of the potato holdings
10% of the whisky industry
30% of gin production
The revenue streams generated by the current UK government policies means the two Kingdoms’ combined resources help to serve the UK population of 67 million.
So if Scotland returned to self-governance we could emulate current UK policies, which as a Conservative are presumably policies you are supportive of. So therefore with The Kingdom of Scotland’s much improved resources to population figures it would mean the larger proportional revenue stream generated by those Scottish resources would only have to serve 5.4 million.
Please feel free to reciprocate your suggestions on how an independent Kingdom of England will pay for itself.
James Che @1:01pm
Thanks, James. Glad I brightened the day a bit for them, and you, too, I hope.
Colonial diarrhoea? 🙂
I fear I might have taken this thread up a ‘back alley’ to a whole new world of metaphor.
James Che @1:35pm
Exactly, James. The priority is independence. We can sort the rest out after we achieve that first.
Because, as you suggest, things could hardly get much worse than they are now, and at least we’d have the power to forge our own destiny – whatever that might turn out to be.
Corporal Jones has farted again;
“……Oil and gas have got about 30 years left …”
Scotland played Norway recently at football I hear, spot the difference; both countries struck oil in the 70s, one got richer and richer…and richer – now has one of the best living standards on earth, best infrastructure etc etc.
The other got poorer, and poorer…and poorer, in fact lots of it’s people can’t afford to pay their heating bills in winter and many even have to go to food banks.
Can you guess which one is which??
[Main;THERE’S “the fucking money”]
@ £6,000,000,000 per DAY (current westminster oil revenue take from us) that’ll do for starters then, cheers. Don’t forget all of our other taxes and revenues that flow directly south…Oh and let’s not be paying for stuff like HS2, new london underground trains and lines, housing the illegal trident submarines/bombs 30 miles from Glasgow (cheerio to those completely eventually), ‘northern powerhouses’ (6 billion), 650-odd scrounging westminster MP’s and ‘lords’. Oh and then there’s the debts that westminster takes out in our name and that we end up paying for (using Scottish oil reserves as security)….I could go on but you know all of this already; we see you for what you are, a typical lickspittle house jock Unionist.
I have lost my fear that things could get any worse in Scotland.
With the energy Crises and high prices already upon us, housing shortages,15 minute cities, gender dysphoria, and Global agendas implemented by the Greens and Snp on climate change and lockdowns. Food prices up and cars being withdrawn,
all without any viable working replacement plans in place ready to takeover.
Scotland is at Rock bottom,
The only way is up.
It is now the time to walk away, and have our own Scottish government, our own public structures instead of Corporations running Scotland,
Perhaps we could make it a jailable offence in Scotland to lobby or fund politics and politicians and give them a set minimum wage, so they always relate to ordinary citizens.
James, @ 1:58pm
You are out by four orders of magnitude. Westminster doesn’t get £6 billion a day in oil revenues. It’s £0.676 million per day in 2021/2. Which is about the daily cost of the unemployed layabouts of Lanarkshire. Probably less.
Everything after that error is utterly laughable. FOUR orders of magnitude out. You are about as credible on national finance as the Greens. And they are atrociously incredible on finance.
Northcode,
are you really so stupid as to thinking that gaining independence is more of a priority than having a credible fiscal plan for an iScotland before making the leap?
Do you identify as a lemming?
Ian Brotherhood says:
22 June, 2023 at 11:52 am
@scotsrenewables/Red –
Paul Kavanagh has properly shat the bed with his ‘consequences’ comment re Fergus Ewing.
Curious and hypocritical line for WGD to take just weeks after the 14 rats in Westminster decided to stab their “colleague” Margaret Ferrier in the back, but hey-ho.
Perhaps loyalty is also non-binary to the SNP.
Perhaps that’s it. Maybe honesty is non binary in the SNP too.
Maybe supporting Independence is non binary.
Maybe Sturgeon isn’t a fking liar at all, but just non-binary when it comes to telling the truth.
Just remember folks, if you support Scottish Independence, there’s an AUOB March in Stirling on Saturday, 709th commemoration of the Battle of Bannockburn.
I haven’t checked, but I’m guessing it will be starting from the old Stirling Bridge “as usual” lol.
This one is quite a trek as I remember. Four and a half miles I think, and uphill a good bit at the end. Might look at the train, because parking a car means double the walk.
@Breeks @2:41pm
There’s a park and ride car park in Stirling just as you come off the motorway at junction 10, I think. The bus is free from the car park to the centre of town.
Ottomanboi @ 9:33am,
Agreed, it seems to be emotions that override any logical thinking, the need to cling tighter and tighter to the red, white and blue comfort blanket that’s reeking and in need of a good wash or more likely incinerated.
These people make little sense, they are adamant that they don’t want to make any decisions for themselves and it is alien to them that others wish the responsibility, accountability and the positive psychological effects that come from captaining our own ship.
These naysayers know their place and are happy swabbing someone else’s decks.
Dan,
Your list tells us where Scotland could make improvements.
One thing for sure the global extremist climate change nonsense the Greens and SNP are pushing on Scotland and Scots will not be advantagous to Scotland because of it ” extreme ideals” rather than scientific solutions,
The other half of the worlds Scientists whom have no voice as they are not employed by government and MSM but still amply qualified suggest the opposite, and that global cooling is actually taken place in our hemisphere.
@fruitella the hun says:22 June, 2023 at 11:03 am
Ruby was right about you
Jeezo, Fruit, grow a pair of seeds or pips or whatever is most fitting.
If you have something to say, don’t skulk behind Ruby.
Ok. You constantly deride anyone who posts their idea of the way forward yet your own analysis is often drivel. For instance, implying that far fewer miners suffered at Thatcher’s hand than the likely casualty list in the oil industry if the net zero project is seriously pursued.
A wee check of the backstory would have told you that but of course you can’t snipe every other post and check facts.
You haven’t said if you have a plan to keep the oil industry at the current level and simultaneously reduce carbon emissions, well do you?
Breastplate,
on current performance, Scotland can’t even swab its own decks. It’s a bit stupid to be pro-Indy when that’s the case. Scotland is a moneypit, where it comes up from the south to be shovelled into the endless bennies claimants.
And you want to be independent? Well prepare for the bennies idiots to be storming Holyrood when you tell them they’re getting £500 a month less, because Scotland can’t afford them at the rate the poor English taxpayer has been giving them. And that goes back to 1707.
Buy a supply of popcorn, this teaser is going to develop into a killer story https://twitter.com/ScotExpress/status/1672155064826306561
North code,
22nd June 1: 45 pm.
Ha haa, gotcha 😉
“Why? The entire point of it is that if you lose once you just move on and try again.”
Can’t you see, this is exactly why people don’t take you lot seriously.
It’s what every party does at every election.