Selective association
Alert social-media users couldn’t have failed to notice Unionist activists and hacks working themselves up into a very great lather last night over (currently former) SNP MP Michelle Thomson. The ex-director of Business For Scotland has resigned the party whip and is now sitting, at least temporarily, as an independent while police conduct an investigation into some property purchases in which she was involved.
As yet no criminal activity by anyone has been alleged, and Police Scotland has said that it has no plans at the moment to even interview Ms Thomson, let alone arrest or charge her. As yet it’s a political non-story.
But the mere proximity of the member for Edinburgh West – previously the victim of a smear related to the Ashley Madison website hacking – to even a sniff of impropriety has triggered a paroxysm amongst the media and the beleagured opposition.
Amusingly, some senior journalists have even tweeted an accusatory blog written by Labour activist and regular BBC pundit Ian Smart, whose own membership of the Labour Party remains a subject of uncertainty after a series of abusive incidents – Scottish Labour have persistently refused to confirm whether he’s been expelled, despite having been “investigating” him since April.
But that’s not the most interesting piece of hypocrisy on show.
The Herald’s coverage notes that one of the transactions under investigation is one where a pensioner, Sarah Capper, “sold her home in Stirling to former journalist and business partner of Ms Thomson, Frank Gilbride, for £64,000 in 2010. Ms Thomson bought the property for £95,000 the same day, and received a ‘cashback’ of £28,181.80 from Mr Gilbride.”
The Express also runs an innuendo-laden piece on the allegations, but neglects to mention Mrs Capper’s story, which is slightly curious as it’s been the most prominent in most of the reporting on the story because Mrs Capper is distinctly disgruntled by the circumstances around the sale of her house.
We can only speculate as to why the Express has left this juicy detail out. But we’re almost certain that it’s NOT because the Frank Gilbride mentioned by the Herald (who runs a media agency and whose CV notes that “My other professional interests lie in property. I once helped investors source good value property to add to their portfolio but now manage property portfolios”) by chance happens to be the brother of the Express’ long-serving Scottish political reporter Paul Gilbride.
We are, of course, not alleging any sort of improper conduct by either man. Unlike some people, we prefer to wait for the law to run its course before we judge anyone.
But when engaged in the generally unseemly and desperate practice of attempting to prove guilt by association, we’d perhaps point out that both political parties and the press might be advised to be mindful of how close they’re standing to the fan when they’re busy hurling a certain product at it.
Thomson was also the MP named in the Ashley Madison leak, in what looked to be a fairly obvious fit-up. I begin to wonder if someone in the business world has it in for Thomson, and is using their funny handshake contacts to bring her down.
Congratulations Stu.
I am constantly amazed at your brilliant discovery of concealed truth.
Where would we be without Wings?
It was the same ‘high standard’ of reporting on the EBC Scottish news this morning – “Police are investigating Michelle Thomson…blah blah”. This despite their own web news last night carrying a Police Scotland statement that she was not being investigated at this time.
What a complete waste of space and money the impartial broadcaster is.
If she has ripped of vulnerable folk when buying their homes at knock-down prices then questions need to be asked. TBH the legality of the issue isn’t that important to me. If she is guilty of ripping of vulnerable folk then its a moral question.
“If she has ripped of vulnerable folk when buying their homes at knock-down prices then questions need to be asked.”
I’m happy to accept that point from anyone who’s ever bid £30,000 more for something than they thought would be accepted, on the grounds that the seller would have liked or could have used a bit of extra cash. Anyone else can piss off.
Its no surprise that the right wing press have given front page prominence to the allegations about property deals involving SNP MP Michelle Thomson.
Though I wonder if MS Thomson is clear of all wrong doing, will these same newspapers give the story the same front page prominence along with a public apology.
I won’t hold my breath on that one happening.
[…] Alert social-media users couldn’t have failed to notice Unionist activists and hacks working themselves up into a very great lather last night over (currently former) SNP MP Michelle Thomson. The ex-director of Business For Scotland has resigned the party whip and is now sitting, at least temporarily, as an independent while police conduct an investigation into some property purchases in which she was involved. […]
There are very few saints around, and none of them in British politics. That said, I’ve been impressed with the conduct, past and present, of our SNP politicians. Anyone who’s eyeing a cushy retirement from politics doesn’t join the SNP, so the ethics of those who do are generally of a much higher standard than the rest.
That’s why this non-story is actually positive for Scots; if this is the worst they can dig up, we’re laughing! I feel for poor Michelle, some bottom-feeders are targeting her for the closest scrutiny, backed by a unionist press only too happy to pay for any shadow of a smear on our people.
I hope their divide and rule approach doesn’t make her feel isolated to the point where she chucks it. She’s very intelligent and dedicated, and we should be rallying to her support.
[…] Selective association […]
It’s the old tactic of throwing crap in the hope some of it sticks. I am confident the majority of people in Scotland, after years of crap being thrown at them by the unionist media, will see it exactly as the Rev describes.
There is a difference between doing something some of us might find distasteful or unethical and doing something illegal.
If we were to exclude every business or indeed every politician on the basis of the former we wouldn’t have any businesses left and our parliaments would be largely empty.
So stick to the facts and don’t be sucked in by the innuendo.
Police Scotland have not accused Ms Thomson of anything and are not investigating her. That’s the facts.
Can any of us who have ever used a lawyer swear blind that we know 100% they behave in an ethical and legal fashion? If not how can we expect Ms Thomson to have that knowledge.
The implication is that Ms Thomson knew the lawyer acting for her was a fraud. If she did then she should go. But that needs to be proved.
How did we become a society where guilt is assumed until innocence is proved?
Thank Heavens for Wings – there is a veritable ‘nest’ of interwoven ‘stirrers’ that Wings keeps opening up.
Well done that man!!
Express, P&J etc have giant ‘Business guru resigns to leave Nats in chaos’ alongside, ‘Hyslop grilled over cash for T in the Park’ headlines. Ultimately, their real problem is everyone gets it. BBC, ITV and all the British/English press really want SLab back in power in Scotland, they want the SNP out of Westminster and they want to damage Holyrood as much as they can. It’s a UKOK toryboy world, we just live in it.
I agree there is a witch hunt against this MP. Someone in Unionist HQ has decided she is the target. The Ashley Madison garbage and now this.
I am pretty confident she will be cleared.
As for Carmichael he is guilty. We are just waiting on the courts deciding if it helped his election result.
Nice one Stuart.
Selective reporting from the Express as per usual-hiding their own relative’s part in this.
As for Ian Smart-Labour branch in Scotland must have the longest investigation process in the history of mankind. Personally, I’d fact check every single word he writes.
Got involved in a convo on Twitter last night about MT & ended up accusing one guy of convicting her in the court of public opinion & BtP added that it was a kangaroo court.
If she’s done wrong fine-let the investigation be held but as far as I can see the police aren’t interested in her & she’s just done the honourable thing to decline the SNP whip till it’s all finished.
Trying to make out on twitter that she’s been chucked out of the party is just so much guff-decline the whip & party membership is suspended-that’s the rule.
It’s making me look even closer at what they are trying to hide by piling in on this non-story.
I’m with Alan Wylie on this. Looks dodgy as hell.
Is someone out to damage Michelle Thomson? There was the story about her being on the books of a dating agency. That disappeared fairly quickly. And now this which has rumbled around for a while. Has someone a grudge against her, determined to get his/her own back?
I do hope and expect that if and or when the Media’s wee Witchhunt of Ms Thomson is concluded to be baseless they will report those findings with at the very least the same enthusiasm they are showing now
(personal) How can a woman with such a nice smiley face be guilty of anything
That’s my razor sharp scalpel like analysis of her character
Yes, it is a dangerous and lonely life being a politician in the UK.
Your article clearly demonstrates how double standards,
nastiness, cruel opportunism and hypocrisy are the key drivers of “journalism” in the MSM.
I have every confidence in my local MP – she does not deserve this treatment
From what I underdstand the problem stems from the lawyer representing buyer and seller did not disclose some information to the lenders contravening the regulations and the terms of the loan. Here’s the link that willo explain that side of it link to ssdt.org.uk
@Alan Wyllie says: 30 September, 2015 at 11:26 am:
” … If she has ripped of vulnerable folk when buying their homes at knock-down prices then questions need to be asked.
“TBH the legality of the issue isn’t that important to me”.
Yes – we noticed that, Mr Wyllie
“If she is guilty of ripping of vulnerable folk then its a moral question”.
Aye! Thing is, Wyllie there is absolutely no evidence whatsoever that the lady has done anything of the sort.
She used a lawyer who is, as yet, not even charged with any wrong doing but is under police investigation. One assumes due to someone making a complaint.
Do you think we should accuse every elected and non-elected member of the Commons & Lords as these are all associates of the Kiddie Fiddlers and expenses fiddlers of those institutions?
Likewise the press who associated with the guilty phone hackers and the whole BBC who associated with Savile and other show biz and BBC stall sex offenders?
No one is listening to these, as yet unproven accusations, except desperate unionists frightened of losing their vile rip of millions of Scots., (and there is much evidence of that vile crime – I’m sure you won’t want to read that evidence.
Goodness me the Carmichael case has got the unionists spinning.
The fact that Mundell could be dragged in has them searching through the snp’s drawers even if there is nothing to find.
Check out Prof Tomkins on twitter and he’s meant to be some kind of law professor. Pity his students.
Thank goodness for wings.
Tom says:
30 September, 2015 at 11:57 am
I’m with Alan Wylie on this. Looks dodgy as hell.
I agree, Alan Wylie’s comments are rather dodgy.
Sorry I forgot:
Nobody forces anyone to sell a house, this isn’t the wild west if you accept a price for something you were not ripped off just because you might be unhappy later doesn’t make it a crime, anybody who’s sold their car to a dealer knows that
The other thing is buy a Mars bar from Tesco or Asda and you know it’s cheaper than the corner shop
Drive up the motorway and buy it from a services and it goes up again by quite a margin
So griping about someone making a profit is not only stupid it’s naive in the extreme
Think about it next time you want to sell something, anything
Yet LabServativeDem Paedos can walk around the lords and Westminster unhindered.
I’d not be so sure on this one. The lawyer was struck off not for committing fraud but for failing in a duty of care and contractual obligation to inform the lenders of a potential fraud. This didn’t happen once but 13 times. It doesn’t look good and is a serious matter.
“I’d not be so sure on this one. The lawyer was struck off not for committing fraud but for failing in a duty of care and contractual obligation to inform the lenders of a potential fraud. This didn’t happen once but 13 times. It doesn’t look good and is a serious matter.”
For him, yes. And he’s been duly punished for it. It remains to be seen whether Michelle Thomson has done anything wrong.
@Lollysmum
This is a 2 pronged attack:
1 to protect and deflect attention from Carmicheal. See all politicians are corrupt, so what if he lied that all do dodgy deeds.
2 this is part of project fear version 2. At all costs stop an SNP majority next May and they don’t need to worry about another referendum. Expect this to get worse over the next few months.
If I understand the transaction as described, what it looks like is Gilbride was purporting to artificially boost the perceived sale value of someone’s house by about 31K in exchange for approximately 10% commission.
It seems like a scheme that wouldn’t necessarily persuade a future buyer the house was worth any more than it had been beforehand. Probably not worth what it cost, but it doesn’t look like anyone was being “ripped off”, as long as the parameters of the deal (however unwise) were clear at the outset. Maybe anyone else thinking of doing this kind of thing should take independent financial advice about it.
It remains to be seen whether Ms Thomson was even directly involved.
As I understand it, Alistair ‘Flipper’ Darling was allegedly obliged to resign from the Law Society of Scotland as he woud have been investigated and possibly barred over his creative mortgage arrangements that were uncovered during the MP’s expenses scandal… it’s a funny old world.
What’s the issue here? Mrs Capper sold her home to Mr Gilbride for £64,000, and Mr Gilbride sold it to Ms Thomson for £66,818.20 (=£95,000 – £28,181.80) so Mr Gilbride made some transaction fee of £2,818.20 which may or may not be a reasonable figure, but it’s clearly not utterly outrageous in the context of a £64,000 transaction.
It sounds like the only possible issue is if Ms Thomson is claiming an investment of £95,000 (which can be offset against tax) while managing to obtain the cashback tax-free. But in this case it’s the tax authorities that should be miffed – not Mrs Capper. What are the grounds for Mrs Capper to be upset?
@Dr Jim says: 30 September, 2015 at 12:18 pm:
“Nobody forces anyone to sell a house”
It is even more simple than that, Dr Jim. Far as I can see the MSP used a lawyer to buy a property. The lawyer is being investigated – does that make all that lawyer’s clients guilty by association? Only the vile Unionists are accusing the MSP and we all know who they have been associating with and still are.
steveasaneilean asks;
How did we become a society where guilt is assumed until innocence is proved?
It became that society when the SNP started to become successful politically.
In addition, the MSM and the various Red/Blue Tory parties are accused of hypocrisy.
Hypocrisy has actually become the new weapon to be used against Scotland and it is therefor more accurate to describe the MSM and Red/Blue Tories, not as Hypocrites, but as Enemies of Scotland.
I like to picture a triangle, with Scotland at the apex, the other 2 points being External enemies and Internal enemies. External enemies are potential threats such as rogue states, terrorism etc. Internal enemies are the MSM, the Labour Party etc.
Breaking news: “Woman purchased house at a higher sale price than original seller had previously sold it for.”
What next?
“Man lost out when he sold shares at price slightly lower than the original bid price.”
Let me know when your moral outrage has sufficiently diminished so I can safely put the kettle on.
I love a good conspiracy!
Does anyone think the appearance of some new trolls on WoS is coincidence?
This is starting to look like a tit-for-tat scene where the unionists desperatly need to take the heat and coverage away from Carmichael by accusing MM of direct wrongdoing.
The beeb/msm will soon be frothing at the mouth, thinking they’ll get the folks of Scotland in uproar against the SNP (the real target).
Facts don’t count, just headlines and hours of onanist interviews on the “news” programmes.
Sorry MT not MM (moaning Minnie)
Good objective piece, Rev.
Of course it’s a newsworthy item, but as others have said, any of us might use a solicitor in innocence, that is then linked to some dodgy practice.
Too much to expect they would report the facts and move on.
I feel confident she will be cleared, but very sorry that she seems to be a target for smear. There’s a proper story.
To me it’s the same tactic as they used on Neil Hay.
Don’t let the facts get in the way of lurid front-page headlines, trumpeted long and hard enough that the ill-informed associate the targeted individual forevermore with wrong-doing.
They are hoping the less savvy absorb this guff. I fear that the clued-up and passionate among us are in the minority.
looks bad if you read guido fawkes
SNP MP Michelle “17 houses” Thomson has withdrawn from the party whip after police launched an investigation into her scandal-hit property deals.
The investigation comes after the Scottish Solicitors’ Discipline Tribunal struck off her solicitor for professional misconduct.
Thompson was involved in all 13 of the dodgy property transactions for which Christopher Hales was struck off, with the tribunal ruling that the MP had a “central” role in transactions that should have “set alarm bells ringing“.
Good bit of work Stu.
There is now a clear determination by the MSM to constantly barrage the SNP with lies and distortions in the run-up to the Holyrood elections in the hope that the Scottish government will be so tarnished that the electorate will embrace the “new clean“ Labour party under good ,sweet, kind, moral Jeremy.
The SH and National need to up their game to meet this threat from the British State.
“let alone arrest or charge “, “the possibility of impropriety has triggered a paroxysm”
You don’t need to look too far for this sort of behaviour. Have a trawl through your back pages for the innumerable references to the alleged sexual proclivities of Westminster politicians.
As the experience of Paul Gambaccini showed, these investigations are beginning to look more like homophobic McCarthyism than the pursuit of justice.
“how close they’re standing to the fan when they’re busy hurling a certain product at it.” Wise words.
Not defending Michelle Thomson’s business activities but everyone who sells a house is presented by a Solicitor and often also advised by Estate Agent regarding price.
Also worth pointing out that buyer would not necessarily know the medical condition of any seller, especially if transaction conducted by a third party.
But small details don’t matter during a witch hunt.
The SNP got 56 MP’s elected as we all know. 49 of them brand new MP’s.
Very few of us are squeaky clean.
The only thing that surprises me about this story is the fact that it’s taken 6 months for the powers that be to dig up a bit of dirt on one of them, because you can guarantee they’ve been digging around since day 1.
I think Michelle Thomson is being targeted not just because there is an excuse to use association with the lawyer, but because she is a business woman.
They may be trying to push buttons among the indy supporting left by highlighting that MT has been involved in commercial activities and making profits. If your views are hard left, then this in itself might be considered ‘anti social’.
I think the surprise for the unionists at IndyRef was the grassroots support from the left for independence. The GE reinforced the fact that many on the left have abandoned SLab.
An attack on an SNP MP with a business background may be part of a campaign to move the left back to the Unionists idea of ‘home’.
@ bookie from hell
looks bad but are her actions illegal? Or just ethically wrong?
We need to wait and see.
What the SNP need are saintly candidates with no history, no Facebook, no twitter.
Maybe I should put myself forward – or would the MSM find and link me to subversive Nattery via Wings comments?
Labour’s new policy introduced by Jerry: maybes aye maybes naw! To all questions/problems. However SNP still very very bad! Michelle Thompson very very bad! Nicola Sturgeon very very VERY BAD! Alex Salmon???
Serfs of jockland please come home to your stall at Animal farm, we love to use abuse and laugh at you.
Carmichael yer goose is cooked. Your finished! Very pleasantly surprised by the election courts decision.
For me personaly the hypocrisy of the MSM and the labour party is the fundemental issue in all of this.
I heard another terrible story last night about someone else who was sanctioned by the DWP for being 10 min late at the job centre,due to the fact that he was voluntering at the local charity shop.
Not wanting to tell folk he had no money and nothing to eat, he basically went downhill and although he had a social worker he died of malutrition because we as a society failed him he was 62.
This is the crux of the matter, why are the labour party not up in arms about this? instead of tweeting spurious accusations without any facts.
They should be working with the SNP against the tories, instead ordinary folk and especially anyone involved in the independence movement are treated like idiots for having a different opinion.
Jesus christ they give more credence to UKIP nutters and the orange order than our democratic decision to vote for change.
As has been said many times on this site and others, it is petty politics in the extreme, there are real issues in Scotland that we are dealing with every day and i think the SNP are doing a decent job under the circumstances.
Sorry rant over.
O/T
For some light relief. Here’s a political black comedy (novel) I wrote a number of years back. Some shades of what is going on in Scotland right now.
Here’s the blurb from the book:
Note: Industrial language throughout.
link to scottcreighton.co.uk
Enjoy.
I would leave Judges to do the ‘judging’ (if it gets that far)
Smearing without all the evidence ?
Wouldn’t it just be more honest to weigh Ms Thomson ?
Quicker anyway.
Of course we could be talking about Camerons ethnic cleansing programme, we’re on to Jamaicans now, he doesn’t like the darker folk does he
Bedroom tax to clean out the poor from London
Don’t want no Syrians here by george
Boatloads of Jamiacans shipped out
It’s not just the dark folk folk though is it, it’s us pasty faced Jockanese as well
What have all the above groups got in common
We’re Fcuking Common
I once used a lawyer in South Africa to claim business debts owed to me. I failed to do so and our association ended. I later found out that he was disbarred for purloining clients funds, some of which may have been mine. Does that make me guilty of getting my own funds which I did not get?
When did post stop being posted immediately?
I saw a Lumpen Part MSP give “evidence” to a committee. Just couldn’t believe his innuendoes of “cronyism”. This from the Royal North British Crony Party.
I’ll give Michelle the benefit of the doubt. Innocent until proven guilty but the whole property pricing system in Scotland is a scandal waiting to happen. The whole “offers over” system is just asking for abuse in fleecing the unwary.
Hey BBC report on Housing in London also contains “In Scotland, prices fell by 1.3% in the year to September”
That must be the wonderful Union dividend from the No vote. Good for 1st time buyers…
For all those worried about the medias notion of a Corbyn effect eating away at SNP.
Lets see the figures for actual Labour membership in Scotland ??
(Excluding the smoke & mirrors of Affiliated / Supporters).
Oh and if the shadow defence secretary Maria Eagle is confused by Corbyns comments on Trident – how will voters view such a shambles.
Labour policy is still pro Trident renewal – Maria Eagle.
“Jeremy’s comments aren’t helpful”
Ie he can be removed ?
Good old unionist media doing what it does best … throwing muck at the barn door … and MISSING!
I suppose we all had to expect some sort of muck digging and throwing from the unionist media. After all when they have NOTHING of substance to throw at the S.N.P. then they need something to do with themselves and what better than a wee bit of muck throwing.
Let’s not forget either that this *ahem* story broke more or less at the same time that the news about the St Margaret crossing broke.
What?
You didn’t hear about the new Forth Crossing?
You mean to say that you are unaware that the new Forth crossing is coming in ON time and UNDER budget! Well let’s just say the new Forth crossing is doing what the M74 extension and the Borders railway have done. They all are showing the people of Scotland that with the right people in charge of government we can have large engineering projects built that are finished on time and on, or more often than not under, budget.
I wonder how the Edinburgh trams engineering project got on! 😀
“What’s the issue here? Mrs Capper sold her home to Mr Gilbride for £64,000, and Mr Gilbride sold it to Ms Thomson for £66,818.20 (=£95,000 – £28,181.80) so Mr Gilbride made some transaction fee of £2,818.20 which may or may not be a reasonable figure, but it’s clearly not utterly outrageous in the context of a £64,000 transaction.”
I’m not sure but reading between the lines, the insinuation is that she has may have claimed a mortgage of up to £95,000 for a property worth £66,000. Through the cash back from her business partner, she has effectively ended up with a £28,000 low interest loan which presumably would be used as a downpayment for the next property. If that turns out to be the case, I’m not sure if fraud has been committed technically, but it certainly fails the “smell test”.
Some talking of it being a question of morals, hmm. I find it immoral that the tories are actually attacking their own people, by way of the bedroom tax, massive cuts to social security, killing people with disabilities by sanctioning them, zero hours ‘contracts’, making people work until they drop, cutting working tax credits, privatising everything they can, though it does not belong to them to do so! And of course much much more, ie, austerity for the poor, making the rich much richer, that sort of thing.
To be mentioning morals at this stage, regarding Michelle Thompson, when nothing has been proven is just backstabbing with no justification whatsoever.
As has been said, will the press, and anyone else shouting jacuse! (I know wrong spelling) be so quick to apologise to Michelle? No didn’t think so.
Why don’t you all avail yourself of the actual facts. Here’s a link to the disciplinary tribunal of the solicitor who arranged the property deals:
link to ssdt.org.uk
Take the time to read the PDF linked from the above which detais each of the questionable transactions:
link to ssdt.org.uk
Michelle Thomson is referred to as Mrs A in the report, this is not denied by anyone.
This isn’t about “SNP Bad” or “Ahhh, they should have vetted her”. This is simply the realities of real life and the type of thing that goes on in businesses. Quite how the SNP were supposed to know about this is beyond me (other than Michelle Thomson telling them “my solicitor from my property dealing days was struck off on 13th May 2014″, is it still okay if I stand for parliament as the SNP Candidate for Edinburgh West”).
Read the report and ask yourself if this is the type of person who should be representing a political party who campaigned on a “social justice” platform?
If you think that Michelle Thomson “didn’t really understand what was going on” then consider a paragraph from the ruling (emphasis mine):
In the whole circumstances, given the ongoing course of conduct, the large number of
transactions involved, the Respondent’s knowledge of the central role of Mrs A and
Company 3, which should have set alarm bells ringing and the fact that this type of
conduct is likely to bring the profession into disrepute, the Tribunal considered that it
had no option other than to strike the Respondent’s name from the Roll of Solicitors
in Scotland.
So convince yourselves if you want that this is a witch-hunt by pesky unionists and MSM, but the Law Society of Scotland clearly don’t think that – but oh, that’t right they’re The Establishment aren’t they!
@Lesley-Anne 1:27pm
Excellent point made; but remember they are only following orders from the Establishment.
After reading the online John McKay STV bias rebuff / guff I wonder just how many of our so called journo’s remain untainted by the spell of Unionism. (Typo was smell – maybe should have left it in ?)
@Gordoz
Ach he’s over on itv saying he will live with decision to renew trident.
Well if he’s prepared to live with it surely that means sending it to London. What say you Mr Corbyn?
We’ll be there to wave it and your party goodbye.
Michelle Thomson’s definitely a primary britnat BBC target, as they cash in for SLab and Dugdale conference style, but Hyslop’s clearly their secondary target.
Was Thompson actually on that hacked Ashley Madison database? Doesnt matter, get it out there BBC Scotland and so on. Hyslop’s getting monstered for T in the Park £150k and isn’t that a terrible terrible thing but loads of public money gets given to hugely profitable businesses all the time.
eg
link to lifescan-scotland.co.uk
Billion dollar world wide turnover, £100+ million up in Inverness, with several million quid subsidy via SNP Scots.gov, great for the Highlands, Scottish science, Highland economy,jobs etc. They were going to leave Scotland a few years ago but thanks to the Scots.gov, they’re still here.
How toryboy Herald reports it all
link to heraldscotland.com
Never underestimate just how low spivs and conmen sitting in UKOK newsrooms are prepared to go.
Why would the seller sell to Gilbride, when a valuer was prepared (apparently) to value the property at £95,000, not £64,000? As a counterpoint to Stu’s point that nobody would pay £30,000 more for something, unnecessarily, why, in the name of God would someone accept £30,000 less than its value?
Is it just mine or is anyone else’s Troll klaxon screaming like a banshee.
Don’t worry folks, since she is a Westminster parliamentarian I’m sure that august establishment will rally round to quash these nasty rumours just as they rapidly covered up for Rifkind and Straw even though they were caught red handed!
@Colin Rippey.
OK : similarly, I’m sure you would agree that there was no breach of purdah via ‘The Vow’ as per the ‘Edinburgh Agreement’ since we’re talking about legalities like ? It was all above board on such an important issue.
Law Society have any kind of view on that ?? – nah that’s just politics in the UK. No laws broken, nothing untoward its just business.
@One_Scot
Oh yes indeed, and notice how they need their wee pals for backup.
‘Ahem’…LA…do they sing when they ‘dig’…Hi Ho…
link to youtube.com
Given the MP is not even under investigation the reaction does seem rather extreme. As I read it the lawyer was struck off for rooking the banks over mortgages not the sellers.
You sell your house you take the best offer. It is that simple. What a lawyer then did with subsequent property valuations and loans etc., is a separate issue.
Project Smear alive and well then.
Colin Rippey says:
Why don’t you all avail yourself of the actual facts
So what have we got.
Solicitor was, as I understand or misunderstand it, failing in his duties to the loan providers by obscuring that these were buy/resell transactions and that the loan was not matched to the purchase price, mixed with conflict of interest by acting for more than one party.
Solicitor now struck off. Which is quite serious given the lengths that the Law Society of Scotland usually go to in protecting their own.
But what is Michelle Thomson actually being accused of, buying up distressed property with lots of opportunity for quick and nasty capitalist profits ?
Lets see if the police find any evidence of a crime or if the story dies like the Ashley Madison stuff.
Troll y de doo da, Troll y dee day!
🙂
@gordoz
OK : similarly, I’m sure you would agree that there was no breach of purdah via ‘The Vow’ as per the ‘Edinburgh Agreement’ since we’re talking about legalities like ? It was all above board on such an important issue.
Law Society have any kind of view on that ?? – nah that’s just politics in the UK. No laws broken, nothing untoward its just business.
Quite what this has got to do with the Michelle Thomson case is beyond me.
Why is it so difficult to accept that there’s someone in the world who has been shown to be involved in practises so dodgy that the Law Society felt it necessary to strike off the solicitor, and that that person is a member of the SNP?
That’s true Gordoz. The *ahem* establishment is scared shiteless and they have nothing POSITIVE to say about anything … as per usual. Therefore instruct their underlings a.k.a. BBC and MSM to smear S.N.P. any way they can.
Glad you were able to find to new National Anthem for the unionists there K1. 😀
One_Scot says:
30 September, 2015 at 1:46 pm
Is it just mine or is anyone else’s Troll klaxon screaming like a banshee.
WHAT???
I can’t hear what you are saying One_Scot.
You’ll need to speak up!!!
There’s a bloody banshee screaming round these parts. It’s bloody DEAFENING!!!
@Anagach
But what is Michelle Thomson actually being accused of, buying up distressed property with lots of opportunity for quick and nasty capitalist profits ?
Right now Michelle Thomson is NOT being accused of anything. But that’s not quite the point of this is it. The point is that the transactions that Michelle Thomson “had a central role in” were deemed to be such that the Law Society stuck off the solicitor.
That’s the issue at hand here. The Law Society have their own codes of practise and have acted upon them.
Is it *really* so difficult to imagine that in the wake of the referendum and the vast increase in support for the SNP at the GE that there was going to be “some” candidates chosen who did not quite fit the bill of what the masses consider to be a “straight-forward, play by the rules, don’t take advantage of other people” types?
CRippey, She wasn’t ‘struck off’, he was. You’re the one jumping on the high moral ground here. Why?
I’ve never seen you quite as desperate as this over any other ‘news’ story. The way you feel about this is how I feel about the massive cover up of Sitting and past MP’s who have indulged in some of the most grotesque and depraved practices known to the human mind. That works me up.
Dodgy property shit is just that, what sits behind this from the media viewpoint is a witch hunt. Never seen you go on about the lying bastard Carmichael either.
But you are positively creaming yersel o’er this. Get a grip.
@ John D aka Ecosse-Nkosi
The posts stopped being posted immediately about weeks ago. Annoyingly. You also have to enter your user name and email every time. The delay used to be up to an hour but is much shorter now. Still annoying though.
Anagach says:
As I suggested at 1:03pm that is what I believe they are trying to highlight. In so doing, they perhaps hope to drive a wedge between the ‘broad church’ SNP and Indy left supporters.
Aye LA cause those who are calling for blood…are all snowfuckingwhite. 🙂
@Colin Rippey
Ahhh – So it is about “SNP Bad” !!!
Sorry- I assumed you had a genuine query and were not blighted by Unionism.
My apologies for the hard question – ( I’ll keep it simple in future).
Bye.
The thing is, this is actually an establishment thing. Most MPs are involved in something of the kind.
Just to prove it, I compiled (1) a dossier of corruption and (2) how a change in the law could prevent this from happening.
First in 2005 and then in 2015, I contacted the legal representatives of every Scottish party to ask if they were interested in the findings and moving to change the legislation.
I will not go into the results, but if we want to get the Scotland we all want, we need a completely new political system and completely new people involved in politics. That means people like YOU. Get involved in Common Weal and the rest, by all means support the SNP, but start writing a whole new constitution. The Declaration of Arbroath would be a fine starter, how about using it as the first articles?
We do not want Scotland to be a mini-UK, do we? Most of all, we need a new political class. And that has to be the people reading this blog… YOU!
[Personally, because I think “city-states” are the way forward in the 21st century, and the only way to stop the political class feeding off us… After all, Athens and Florence did not do too badly in terms of contributions to world democracy thousand(s) of years ago, did they? And surely in our globalised world the time for national states of millions of people is past it?]
Colin Ripley you’re smearing Thompson very heavily here, with your quote are you not?
“In the whole circumstances, given the ongoing course of conduct, the large number of
transactions involved, the Respondent’s knowledge of the central role of Mrs A and
Company 3, which should have set alarm bells ringing and the fact that this type of
conduct is likely to bring the profession into disrepute, the Tribunal considered that it
had no option other than to strike the Respondent’s name from the Roll of Solicitors
in Scotland.”
So Mrs A’s lawyer gets struck off roll of solicitors but is the tribunal saying that Mrs A is also culpable because his conduct “should have set alarms bells ringing” for Mrs A?
Such is the way of UKOK trolling Colin, unless you know differently and when hear your alarm bells you don’t do anything at all, or report it, or runaway or god knows what you cyber Britnats think you’re up to.
Very odd way to conduct a investigation Colin Ripley, unless you know differently.
@One_scot:
Sounds very co-ordinated and scripted. Think the attack dogs are being turned loose, sure there will be more packs along shortly.
Thank your employees HMQ for wee bit of a larf. “Rebellious Scots to crush” aye it’s a catchy wee number Betty, awrabest.
Meanwhile in the bowls of MI5 something is rumbling, what’s that f****** Smell!
It is beyond doubt that the Unionist Alliance of the Red and Blue Tories and the minimised Lib Dems, have settled on a single strategy to save the Union. They now have a single target – the SNP and their objective is to destroy the SNP’s credibility, one elected representative at a time.
The tactic is simple – deny the SNP power in Holyrood, then no threat of another referendum on Independence. If true, then next May’s Holyrood elections become another titanic election battle between the Independence Movement and the Unionists. It’s the referendum all over again, underlining once more that politics in the UK in this era, is first and foremost about the Union.
It’s a propaganda war in which the Michelle Thomson story is one bullet.
Another issues that the Labour party are sitting on their hands about.
link to snp.org
Was talking to someone last night who said that that this is only the tip of the iceberg the cuts next year will amount to 90million pounds.
At the base of this is a transaction where an ordinary member of the public sells their house to someone who then sells it for 48% more, on the same day, and then gives back 90% of the profit to the second purchaser. Seems legit.
@Alan Wyllie
I’m with you on that in general, but on the other hand if I wanted a quick sale and was prepared to accept £30,000 less than the “market” price, then that’s my right as well.
Protection for homeowners is inadequate though, even in this day and age of 2015. But the process is not illegal, even if at times immoral. It would need full details and both sides to determine if anything immoral had taken place.
Aye Manandboy, but we’re Neo in the Matrix (1st one), when he finally realises who he is. He catches the bullets, and drops them one by one.
We’re more powerful than we realise. There will be no ‘mortal’ wounding…no matter how many bullets they fire.
The point is that it is the mortgage applicant who is responsible for making an honest declaration on their application. The solicitor has a duty to report to the lender if they know, or have reason to believe, that the application was fraudulent.
In this case the solicitor has been struck off because of his failure to notify the lender. The lender is the victim as they don’t have the security they believed they had (and the applicant said they had) when they made the loan.
I don’t pretend to know the facts of this case and there may be an innocent explanation. As an aside, this doesn’t necessarily have to be a political smear. I can think of at least one disgruntled Ex lawyer who might have a grudge.
Either way. This all happened before the referendum, let alone the election. I trust that the SNP will deal with it.
@K1
CRippey, She wasn’t ‘struck off’, he was. You’re the one jumping on the high moral ground here. Why?
Sorry, (and I am being genuine here) where did I say she was struck off?
Be careful out there, folks!
Previously dead investigative journalism has suddenly come back to life. Never mind Lord Weir’s connection to PFI for which Baron Robertson is getting his reward, the BritNat Establishment is after an otherwise low profile MP.
Ask yourself why?
This smacks of something sinister. GCHQ is monitoring you all!
@heedtracker
Colin Ripley you’re smearing Thompson very heavily here, with your quote are you not?
(it’s Rippey not Ripley but…)
This is not my quote, it is a direct quote from the tribunal report.
O/T London Centric? Unease about the gross disparity of wealth, investment and resources has prompted the BBC to do a feature on it.
“London is a city of immense prosperity and power. But has it succeeded at the expense of the rest of the UK?”
Unfortunately, they fail to answer their own question. Swooning over London’s greatness appears to addle the brain and impair the critical faculties. Scotland completely under the radar. We have obviously already left “the rest of the UK”.
link to bbc.co.uk
Stopping bullets:
link to youtube.com
@gordoz
Ahhh – So it is about “SNP Bad” !!!
Sorry- I assumed you had a genuine query and were not blighted by Unionism.
My apologies for the hard question – ( I’ll keep it simple in future).
Bye.
Right. And here’s me thinking I wrote this:
This isn’t about “SNP Bad” or “Ahhh, they should have vetted her”. This is simply the realities of real life and the type of thing that goes on in businesses. Quite how the SNP were supposed to know about this is beyond me (other than Michelle Thomson telling them “my solicitor from my property dealing days was struck off on 13th May 2014?, is it still okay if I stand for parliament as the SNP Candidate for Edinburgh West”).
But I admit that the above snippet does contain “SNP Bad” so I guess you’ve got me there (good job you didn’t ask a hard question eh?).
Stories like this are an irrelevance because the average voter can’t get his head around stuff as complicated as this. I’m technically a genius and if I can’t even be bothered processing it then the average voter probably isn’t capable…
Let’s stick to the four legs good stuff. And we need to concentrate on Corby, I’d say about 90% of our efforts should be given to ridiculing Corbyn with the remaining 10% allocated to emphasising my greatness.
Colin Rippey says:
30 September, 2015 at 2:47 pm
@K1
CRippey, She wasn’t ‘struck off’, he was. You’re the one jumping on the high moral ground here. Why?
Sorry, (and I am being genuine here) where did I say she was struck off?
You posted a quote stating alarm bells should have been set off but left out with whom Colin? Mrs A? The fire brigade? International rescue?
You need to be a lot more acurate with your cunning stunts old fruity.
Incidentally, it is quite common for an MP to withdraw from the whip if there are allegations against them, so as not to bring disrepute on their party, even if they turn out to be innocent. Can’t think who but it has happened 2 or 3 times the last decade or so.
Once the inquiries are over and the “heat” is off, then they resume normal practice. I don’t think I’ve seen any media make this point. Basically at this point though, the SNP are not involved, it’s Thomson personally who is involved.
That’s the system, anyway, or was before it was an SNP MP, a member of a Jockland political party.
K1 says:
30 September, 2015 at 2:31 pm
Aye LA cause those who are calling for blood…are all snowfuckingwhite. 🙂
You can call them that if you want K1 … me, I’m up for calling them all something far worse and unprintable on here. 😀
That’s interesting your idea about utilising the Declaration of Arbroath Kenny. I have always held the notion that we should do exactly that. In my village idiot outlook on life I believe that if the DoA is good enough for the fledgling U.S.A. to use as a basis in writing their constitution in 1787 then it is certainly good enough for US.
In fact my thoughts run along similar lines to the U.S. constitution in so far as we utilise the DoA as the initial wording and then add a series of amendments, just like in the U.S.A., in such a way as to bring the DoA into the 21st Century.
We must never forget that the DoA is recognised as being the world’s oldest written constitution and as such WE must ensure that it continues to be recognised as such. By utilising it into an “updated” written constitution is, in my view, the ideal way of doing this.
Put yourself in Thompson’s position. You are interested in a property. Your lawyer tells you to offer £90,000 for it, but don’t worry, he’ll give you £30,000 of that back. You say OK and suspect nothing.
Aye, right.
Let’s stick to the four legs good stuff. And we need to concentrate on Corby, I’d say about 90% of our efforts should be given to ridiculing Corbyn with the remaining 10% allocated to emphasising my greatness.
JC’s doing it all own.
Vote JC! He’ll never nuke anyone but let’s spend hundreds of billions on teamGB nukes anyway, and dump them in the Scotland region, out the way, who’d want a bunch of radioactive WMD’s near anywhere nice, like London. UKOK.
@Colin Rippey
You are reading far to much into “Mrs A’s” central role in Hayes getting struck off.
Hayes was struck off because, amongst other things, he was not following the rules in informing the lenders of any ‘unusual’ or noteworthy details of the transactions, such as one or other party owning the property for less than 6 months and that ‘cash back deals’ between seller and buyer had been agreed.
In the property business where deals are lined up it is certainly not the case that buying and selling a property on the same day is ‘unusual’ per se, it’s just that the solicitor should have told the lenders.
Therefore the actual transactions are not the issue other than as evidence for the litany of Hales’ failures centred around “Mrs A’s” transactions; nowhere is it suggested in the LSoS verdict that anything illegal was being done by Mrs A and her associates. The issue is that the solicitor knowingly did not do what he was required to do.
A questsion in my mind though, is how did the press conclude that “Mrs A” was in fact Michelle Thomson MP? Presumably this is where the Daily Express contact comes in.
Vronsky says:
30 September, 2015 at 3:04 pm
Put yourself in Thompson’s position. You are interested in a property. Your lawyer tells you to offer £90,000 for it, but don’t worry, he’ll give you £30,000 of that back. You say OK and suspect nothing.
Aye, right.
So why did the lawyer just not buy the house himself? Altruistic conveyancing lawyers of Scotland are famous for their altruism right enough.
O/T Sorry but I just about fell off my chair laughing. Ooh the sincerity oozing from kez…
link to facebook.com
K1 on the theme Neo stopping the bullets.
You might just have something there, K1. The idea of a bullet-proof SNP/Independence Movement is one which might be worth developing both for the current batch of MP’s and MSP’s, but also for future candidates.
Personally speaking I think the Rev’s article is good, Rippey’s quote is fair, Vronsky’s point is good, and MajorBloodnok’s argument is fine.
So the conclusion is that we shouldn’t jump to conclusions, not be too quick to defend or attack, there are investigations going on (not into Thomson apparently), and we should wait and see what that concludes in a few months time before making our judgements – either way.
It seems a definite conclusion though that that’s not what the MSM are doing, they’ve pinned themselves to one side of that, for reasons better known to themselves and all of us who’ve seen it before.
Next.
Colin Rippey says:
30 September, 2015 at 2:49 pm
@heedtracker
Colin Ripley you’re smearing Thompson very heavily here, with your quote are you not?
(it’s Rippey not Ripley but…)
This is not my quote, it is a direct quote from the tribunal report.
I know it is Colin. Point is who are they referring to with their alarms bells going off stuff that you directly quoted?
If it’s Mrs A, why are they implicating her like this?
If it’s not Mrs A, who is it? Partners in the law firm? The seller maybe?
Conveyance’s a racket but if the tribunal is implicating both the crook lawyer and his clients too, well that’s a new one even for that cartel of legal lovelyness.
The unionist media has cried “wolf” too many times. It will once again backfire onto them. As newspaper sales drop they’ve nobody to blame but themselves.
Kezia on facebook @Nana Smith above – unbelievable.
Somebody is working very hard on the Labour in Scotland project – pity they have no wit.
“Why is it so difficult to accept that there’s someone in the world who has been shown to be involved in practises so dodgy that the Law Society felt it necessary to strike off the solicitor, ‘and that that person is a member of the SNP?’ ”
There is no ‘evidence’ that she ‘has been shown to be involved in practises so dodgy’. There is that he was. He was struck off.
The way it reads in the final part of your sentence is as if it is her that has been struck off. The ‘and that that person is a member of the SNP’ preceded by the ‘…Society felt it necessary to strike off the solicitor’ one is immediately of the view that the person being ‘struck off’ is the ‘member of the SNP.
Hope that clarifies, bad grammar perhaps?
Now can you attend to my query, why are you so worked up about this? There hasn’t been any investigation into Ms Thompson’s conduct as yet. You are impugning her reputation. It’s not the court of ‘CRippey’. Do you just hate the SNP and so this story gives you a bat to beat them with?
@ MajorBloodNok
how did the press conclude that “Mrs A” was in fact Michelle Thomson MP? Presumably this is where the Daily Express contact comes in.
I thought the same thing with Neil Hay. How was “anonymous” twitter user Paco Mcsheepie linked to the prospective SNP candidate?
Of course I may not have been paying attention but I never learned that bit of the non-story.
Good old unionist media…”never let a trial get in the way of a good hanging”.
This is about mortgage transactions, not folk using cash from under their bed. So far no mention of the valuer(s) involved, although the Law Society did allude to them in their tribunal findings. Get some popcorn in, this will take some time.
@heedtracker
Read the report, it is quite long and dreary, but you’ll be able to make your own conclusions from it.
There are several references to Mrs A instructing the solicitor, maybe Mrs A thought what she was doing was genuine legal instructions and perhaps it is the solicitor themselves that is at fault for every single transaction.
How can someone (or someone acting on their behalf) manage to sell their house, then make a complaint about the sale but not have a clue what the house was worth in the first place?
Something fishy going on here.
I fully expect this to be a non story. Of course that doesn’t stop the unionista media running with all kinds of rubbish.
Excellent piece of writing and fact checking by REV stu, yet again.
Colin Rippey says:
30 September, 2015 at 3:34 pm
@heedtracker
Read the report, it is quite long and dreary, but you’ll be able to make your own conclusions from it.
There are several references to Mrs A instructing the solicitor, maybe Mrs A thought what she was doing was genuine legal instructions and perhaps it is the solicitor themselves that is at fault for every single transaction.
Lousy dodge there Colin. You must be a new unionist troll. The reason you’re so weak on the ginormous BBC attack/monstering of just this one SNP MP alone is because, just like ye olde BBC creep show, you’ve decided the outcome of the investigation into Thompson’s conduct before it’s even begun and are too impatient to just wait and see, before passing your UKOK sentence.
But why let facts n shit get in the way relentless unionist attack propaganda.
Colin Rippey, must try harder.
From the Herald and it seems to be reflected mostly by the actual words she spoke according to the article:
” The First Minister, speaking at Holyrood, said that “serious issues” had been raised around the conduct of Michelle Thomson and said that a police investigation should be allowed to take its course.
She added that the SNP did not know about questionable property deals, signalling that Ms Thomson, who denies any wrongdoing, did not declare her activities prior to being selected as a candidate. “
I wonder what Labour think they’ll achieve by doing the faux outrage over this. Even if every last member of the SNP were guilty of dodgy dealings and so corrupt that I no longer felt I could vote for them, the LAST party on earth I’d go to looking for probity would be Scottish Labour.
So let me see if I have this right.
1) Someone, let’s call them Person A, owns a house.
2) Person A wants to sell their house
3) Person A contacts Estate Agent, let’s call them Agent B, to value the house.
4) Person A, happy with evalutation from Agent B, contacts Solicitor, let’s call them Lawyer C, with view to selling the house whilst also instructing Agent B to put the house on the market.
5) Someone decides to buy said house, let’s call them Person D
6) Person D puts in bid to buy the house whilst contacting their solicitor, let’s call them Lawyer E.
7) The rest of the selling and buying process is now taken out of the hands of both Person A and person D. The sale of the house is completed between Lawyer C and Lawyer E with Agent B on the periphery.
8) Once the sale has been completed Person D hands funds over to Lawyer E who passes the funds on to Lawyer C who eventually passes the money on to person A. End of sale. End of involvement of all concerned parties.
Now if at some late date AFTER the completion of the house sale Person A finds out that Person D has re-sold the house on to another person, let’s call them Person F, for a higher value than the original sale then who can they turn to?
In the first instance, and only instance in my view, they have no complaint against either Person D or Person F. The only avenue that Person A had was at the time of the original sale, to person D. Since this is no longer the case Person A has no valid complaint.
Had Person A wanted more for their house then they should have, in the first instance told the valuation agent at the time of the valuation … NOT month’s later. By this time it is too late!
My, my, the trolls are having a busy day. Wasted on me, I just scroll on by. Life’s too short to be bothered with them.
BBC/MSM in foment, what is really going on? Are they trying to deflect from Labour voting in favour of Trident, Corbyn being a unionist prat with no understanding or interest in Scotland. Mind you I think Corbyn is pretty much what most of us suspected. Is it oor Alistair’s predicament, don’t gie us ideas about taking lying MP’s to court. Get back in your box, you swine.Or, is it mibies what’s happened in Catalunya that’s rattled their cage.
We have heard all of this before, many, many, many times, and it just doesn’t work anymore. Not even a background noise, just nothing.
Let me get this straight; the MP Michelle Thompson who may or may not be Mrs A is guilty of some unspecified crime because Mrs A’s solicitor is under investigation over possible mortgage fraud and is therefore all over the papers and the BBC. The MP Carmichael who personally lied on camera to his constituents among others is not yet guilty of criminally affecting his election chances and so is innocent and not all over the papers and the BBC.
Am I the only one confused?
The Trolls are doing what they do folks, pay no attention to their rambling hopes that somehow there might be something to stick on the SNP and so deflecting from their own pathetic shower of liars and serial deceivers
The height of their evidence is that there is no evidence,they only hope that there is, and with such desperation do they hope, they’re trolling every Pro Scotland site and Twitter feed shouting as loud as they can SNP Baaad
It’s not working and the Media’s attempts are not working and the Telly’s attempts are not working
So I say bash on Trolls, Scotland has seen these tactics out now and the more you do it the bigger the hole you’re digging, which is fine by me
Tick Tock, Holyroods a comin, Holyroods a comin
Can you hear the music
@ scunner says:
Labour HQ employs staff to go through twitter accounts of opponents with a very fine tooth comb just as they deleted all embarrassing references to elected Labour people on Wikipedia. Other parties are not so pro active.
On SNP candidates being bullet proof. That’s impossible as it would take several days to thoroughly investigate one potential candidate never mind the 300 plus that got nominated for Westminster selection.
With the SNPs open candidacy rule for new members at Westminster it was always possible that someone would slip through the net.
Even if a potential candidate revealed something in their past or has a spent criminal record when they are vetted then I would imagine it is a matter of judgement on whether they get approved and I am pretty certain that such information is never passed on to ordinary members before casting their votes.
Much relies on full disclosure by the potential candidate and if they have been less than truthful then they should be expelled.
The cause is bigger than any one individual.
Betsy says:
30 September, 2015 at 4:02 pm
I wonder what Labour think they’ll achieve by doing the faux outrage over this. Even if every last member of the SNP were guilty of dodgy dealings and so corrupt that I no longer felt I could vote for them, the LAST party on earth I’d go to looking for probity would be Scottish Labour.
Oh that is an easy question to answer Betsy.
Labour are so far down the deep subterranean pot hole they have dug for themselves over recent month’s that this is purely a weak and feeble attempt to try and deflect attention away from Corbyn, McDonnell and others and their anti S.N.P., S.N.P. BAAAD, rants.
SIMPLES! 😀
@Scunner
I read elsewhere that the LSoS tribunal verdict linked to is the redacted version. The full version went to the Crown Office, who called in the police a week later. I think that’s where it will have come from.
I note that Jackie Bailey is having a go at the Crown Office for not having acted sooner!
I would have to hear the words directly from the FM before I would believe anything the herald reports and suddenly that article is open to comments yet so many others are not.
Well as expected Ruth Davidson will not face any charges and no reasons given. Yet she admitted wrongdoing on tv. Took a full year for the ‘enquiry’ to decide that.
Someone’s tentacles are far reaching to hide the dirt.
The tin helmets on this comment thread are quite something.
I’m an SNP member and I’m seething at the idea that someone putting themselves forward to be an MP has done so in the full knowledge of their proximity to this grubby affair and didn’t stop to think about how it could all turn out. Remember, the vetting process will include a “anything that you need to tell us about stuff that might come out?” type question.That’s ignoring completely any presumption of involvement or prejudging guilt or innocence.
You might think, on planning to become a candidate of perhaps maybe not doing so if you were involved in 13 transactions where the solicitor acting eventually got struck off.
The Law Society can’t just strike folk off for minor indiscretions since it’s effectively ending someone’s career. Introduce an MP and the Crown Office and it becomes a big story that no newspaper will ignore – it’s not rocket science.
Now that it’s out in the open, my personal wish is to see it fully and rigorously investigated for the good of the party and those that will follow. Ignoring it or calling it a Unionist MSM conspiracy will not make it go away.
Just a wee heads-up Stu before you get too far into this.
If the allegations as reported are anything close to the truth, our girl could be headed for a little down time in the Crowbar Hotel.
We had a similar scheme around here. Read below.
link to edmontonsun.com
Mortgage companies generally don’t take too kindly to having property prices gamed.
Especially when there’s a kick back. As appears in the SNP girl’s case.
The real question is, why aren’t the Scottish cops NOT investigating Our Michelle.
Sorry to piss in the pickles.
Hopefully the SNP’s Sleepy Hollow press office has Nik-la up to speed before Kezza stands up tomorrow in FMQs.
But that could be a big ask.
First thing. The police are as yet not even investigating the obviously villainous Scot Nat MP according to the Media and Press that you drool over Mr Britley. Well not yet anyway but then the British State does have plenty of form for fabricating evidence or making it disappear totally, so I wouldn’t put it past them.
Secondly did the house sellers not accept bids and did they not indeed get their cash? They could easily have knocked back the offers. It is what people do if they don’t like the offers they get.
Brit Nat Govt sell assets built or purchased with our money all the time and on the cheap to their pals. We never see any Police investigation of that let alone any investigation in the Brit Nat Press and Media. It is after all not their money in the first place. Morally debased and corrupt Brit Nat Govts defraud us daily but get off with it with impunity.
It is obviously a week of orchestrated Brit Nat smear stories. I wonder if they heard that Carbuncle was going to get dragged over the coals, you know the sleazebag that wasted a seven figure sum of tax payers money allegedly. Awa an bile yer heid Britley! Troll elsewhere.
Oh and I am not a member of the SNP.
@K1
There is no ‘evidence’ that she ‘has been shown to be involved in practises so dodgy’. There is that he was. He was struck off.
Read the report, make up your own mind as to the involvement of Mrs A. If you don’t think Mrs A was involved in the transactions and how they were processed then that’s fine. All I have done today is say to people “read the report and come to your own conclusions”.
Now can you attend to my query, why are you so worked up about this? There hasn’t been any investigation into Ms Thompson’s conduct as yet. You are impugning her reputation. It’s not the court of ‘CRippey’. Do you just hate the SNP and so this story gives you a bat to beat them with?
What makes you think I am worked up about this? This comment stream is on an article which about the issue, it is this website itself that seems so worked up about it.
I have merely added some references to the underlying Law Society tribunal that has the actual facts (you know, the details of what took place).
If you want the real hyperbole go and review the Sunday Times articles that have run for the past two weeks which tried to bring in the people involved in the sales.
Kezia Dugdale on Facebook – the script. With thanks to Nana Smith for the link.
Watch out for the one to one chats, each is conducted separate from the group using two cameras – or, perhaps less likely, one camera with only one person in the room for each shot, reading their own lines.
link to facebook.com
Child 1. What do you do in your job all day?
Kez. I try to help people. But my favourite thing, my absolute favourite thing to do is to make sure that kids like you get the best possible chance in life. That’s my number one priority and that’s what my party stands for.
Child 2.Why is there a Labour Party?
Kez. To help people. To help working people. And we want everybody in the country to have a decent job.
But if you’re going to get a decent job, you have to get a decent education right? So we’ve got to make sure we spend lots of money on schools, so that when you leave school you can get the job you want to have.
Kez.What are you going to be when you grow up?
A. In charge of Dr Who.
K. In charge of Dr Who – that’s a great job!
Child 3. Will I get paid the same amount of money as Lucas when I grow up?
K. If you were grown up now, no. For every pound that you’d earn, you’d only get 89pence. So that’s unfair, that’s 11 pence difference, just because he’s a boy and you’re a girl. So I’m gonna work to change that. In the future, boys and girls will earn the same amount of money for the same job that they do.
Child 4. Is your job really hard?
Kez. Sometimes it’s hard, but all the time it’s really really exci’in’. It’s a great priviledge to do what I do, but it’s my job to make sure the Government do the right thing, and the Scottish Parliament has lots of powers and more powers are coming to the Scottish Parliament, so if we want to we can make Scotland a fairer and better place for everyone.
Child 5. What job do you think I might do when I’m older?
Kez. You could be absolutely anything you want to be, whether that’s an engineer or a computer coder, that’s somebody that makes computer games, a writer, an athlete or a doctor or a scientist – and if you can’t do any of those things you can be a politician.
The end bit – Kez to camera. Scottish Labour is changing and under my leadership there will be no doubt what Scottish Labour stands for and who we stand with. I believe in the potential of every single child in Scotland. And I want them to get on in life; I want them to achieve that potential. And I want it to be determined by their talent, their potential and how hard they work; not how much their parents earn or what school they went to.
I want every single child in Scotland to have the best possible start in life.
OT.The hereditary 7th Marquess of Salisbury:-“The UK is barely ‘hanging on’ to Scotland.” !!!
Speaking at a fringe event at the Labour conference in Brighton the Tory former Leader of the House of Lords said Unionists are spending all their energy “hanging on” and the point has been reached where “we have to go for a settlement”.
He has formed a constitution reform group with Peter Hain, the former Labour Work and Pensions Secretary, and John Denham, the former Communities and Local Government Secretary. !!!
THE TRIO ARE TOURING the party conferences discussing their ideas. Mr Hain said: “I think the bell is tolling for the UK. It’s a question of reform or die.”
From ‘Scotland-US’.
The NO’s are really scared witless.
The real question is, why aren’t the Scottish cops NOT investigating Our Michelle.
They are or at least they are investigating the purchases. Its the end of the SNP according to Professor Smirky, all the way over in Slovenia
Adam Tomkins ?@ProfTomkins 18 hrs18 hours ago
All bubbles burst. All tides recede. Eventually. Even the SNP’s. #Hyslop #TITP #MichelleThomson #CorruptionScandals
Well toryboys know everything there is to know about corruption. But if Prof T’s right, he’ll been running Holyrood end of May.
Rejoice:D
The question is, if this was a non-SNP MP would your post be the same?
Apparently, the establishment MSM have been sitting on this story for quite a while. Now, why would they decide to create a stushie about it this week? You would almost think they had some bad news of their own to hide!
It has taken the SNP over 70 years to gain it’s current position in Scottish politics. It was always obvious that the party’s enemies would use every weapon they could to try to harm the SNP’s progress. The secret of negating this is to avoid giving our enemies ammunition to fire at us. THe SNP must always act like Caesar’s wife and be above suspicion. I don’t blame the unionists for the line they have taken. If the shoe was on the other foot then we would be doing the same. I am very disappointed that an SNP MP finds themselves in their current position.
I wonder if Colin Rippey is the same Colin Rippey I previously came across on the SNP Hell No page on FB.
Jeez Manandboy that last part of wee Dugdale’s last answer is an absolute CLASSIC!!! 😀
and if you can’t do any of those things you can be a politician.
What does that say about wee Dugdale’s future *ahem* potential then? 😉
Answers on a postcard to:
K.Dugdale
Labour party Branch Office
Glasgow
North Britain
Roy Bohan says:
30 September, 2015 at 4:29 pm
The question is, if this was a non-SNP MP would your post be the same?
If its fraud, then they can go vote NO vote Britnat mental. Until then… is the point.
@Luigi
Yes, according to the STV article reporting Sturgeon’s comments:
“The SSDT published its findings relating to Christopher Hales on its website in June 2014. The SSDT only publishes the name of the solicitor.
“We publish SSDT findings in our Journal magazine and Journalonline.co.uk. We published an article on the findings of the Christopher Hales case in July 2014.
“If the Law Society has concerns about any potential criminal matter arising from a SSDT finding, it will refer the matter to the appropriate authorities. In the case of Christopher Hales, we first raised this informally with the Crown Office in December 2014. Our Guarantee Fund sub-committee referred it formally to the Crown Office in July 2015.”
THe SNP must always act like Caesar’s wife and be above suspicion. I don’t blame the unionists for the line they have taken. If the shoe was on the other foot then we would be doing the same. I am very disappointed that an SNP MP finds themselves in their current position
If they’ve got nothing, they invent it. Mind the madison online blind date thing? Total BBC monstering based entirely on nothing.
There’s probably never been a bigger, more aggressive propaganda attack campaign waged by the BBC and the British media anywhere in the world than what’s been dumped on Scotland for years now. And all of it to shut down democracy in Scotland or at the very least get Slab back in control. If that does actually happen eventually, say in another five years of relentless BBC style attack, A Slab and Dugdale Holyrood will do everything possible to bring Scotland to heel.
There’s a lot of enraged red and blue goons around and they wont forget this refusal of Scots to come home.
Kevin Hague ?@kevverage 2h2 hours ago
*points into the far distance*
look over there
*squints*
what is it?
*wry smile*
it’s a politician being cast adrift
Stu writes, “Unlike some people, we prefer to wait for the law to run its course before we judge anyone.” Good.
“Let the jury consider their verdict,” the King said, for about the twentieth time that day.
“No, no!” said the Queen. “Sentence first – verdict afterwards.”
“Stuff and nonsense!” said Alice loudly. “The idea of having the sentence first!”
“Hold your tongue!” said the Queen, turning purple.
“I won’t!” said Alice.
“Off with her head!” the Queen shouted at the top of her voice. Nobody moved.
“Who cares for you?” said Alice, (she had grown to her full size by this time.) “You’re nothing but a pack of cards!” – Lewis Carroll, Alice’s adventures in Wonderland.
@Iain More
I wonder if Colin Rippey is the same Colin Rippey I previously came across on the SNP Hell No page on FB.
Nope, not me I’m afraid. When was it you encountered this other Colin Rippey, care to share a rough date?
(there’s not that many of us Rippey folk so it would be a strange coincidence if there’s another Colin Rippey who would be on a facebook page called SNP Hell No).
@Colin Rippley – What we think or don’t think is irrelevant, that’s not how the Law works.
It is not a coincidence that this case occurred more than a year ago and is being dragged out now to divert attention away from the Carmichael case.
If he is called to give evidence under oath, a whole can of worms could be exposed as to other people’s involvement.
Don’t forget Carmichael and Mundell were in coalition.
If there is a case to be answered by Michelle Thomson, it will happen.
But at the moment a case of extreme hypocracy is playing out in the MSM.
From the Labour Party video on Facebook.
Kezia Dugdale to camera:-
“Scottish Labour is changing and under my leadership there will be no doubt what Scottish Labour stands for and who we stand with.”
No doubt what Scottish Labour stands for? – em, let’s see, lying, cronyism, brown envelopes, nepotism, hugging Tories and sleeping with the Tories, the gravy train, the House of Lords, corruption, expenses fraud, voting for austerity, in favour of nuclear weapons and illegal wars. There’s more but that’s more than enough.
Who we stand with? – that’ll be the Tories and the LibDems, the other Unionist parties and the Westminster Unionist Establishment.
OK Kezia, put that on your next scripted page to read out on TV.
@JimFindalyson
I agree. It appears the SNP vetting process needs a thorough overhaul. Perhaps they should co-opt some of the new members, who aren’t tied in to years long membership of the SNP, and some perhaps many of whom, left Labour because of its dubious practices.
The Press are protecting the brother of a journalist but are attacking an SNP member. Typical .They are such hypocrites. Millions of people buy a house make improvements and extend the mortgage. A property is only worth what anyone will pay for it. Many people have to drop their price for a quick sale. Try selling a property in Catalonia Spain where EU ‘foreigners’ not allowed to vote.
Millions have dealing with fraudulent lawyers, most of them are fraudsters. £300 to write a letter. £400 for a court appearance. Extending legal aid appearances to make money. Many of them are Tories.
All candidates should be vetted and members given the vote not annointed from on high.
@ Jack Murphy.
OT.The hereditary 7th Marquess of Salisbury:-“The UK is barely ‘hanging on’ to Scotland.” !!!
Lets all start stamping on their fingers.
🙂
Marie Clark and Dr Jim, 4.04: just so.
The Rev’s very popular today, with lots of new names popping up, and one old one we haven’t heard from for a while. I wonder why?
Let’s let the police investigate the solicitor. If the MP has done nothing wrong I’m sure the media will let us all know in due course, and on their front pages.
@liz
Timing’s wrong for a Carmichael diversion, that came out yesterday, but the Times on Thonson came out Sunday, and someone said, the week before as well.
Och Sinky right enough, you have to be an actual serving politician then do the crime to get aff wi it. All those untouchable Eton Tories and Eton Labourites, are utterly without blemish on their files before becoming politicians.
Right enough though, murdering and raping children, these are just allegations, with no one investigating them? And yet those who are being investigated sit in the Commons and the Lords and are given a ‘right of reply’ to their accusers, quietly holding up the investigations while those witnesses, the hundreds and thousands of people who have come to harm at the hands of these bastards, are monstered by their attack dogs in the media.
The very people who are ‘creating’ the law of the land are the biggest criminal cabal that exists at the heart of our established political culture. They have turned corruption into acceptable ‘norms’. That’s how corrupt they are.
Do you think they were all ‘squeaky clean’ before becoming politicians? Or do you think pre the advent of the internet, we just didn’t get to know how much was kept from public view, and only now are we seeing the historic establishment cover up for what it has been?
No matter how many simultaneous investigations on a scale never before seen in the UK, into child abuse, that reaches into the heart of the political establishment, are ongoing, do you see the whole of the London owned Scottish media screaming from their front pages, about how ‘outrageous’ this is?
The media are the establishment’s mouthpiece. When they say ‘attack’ that’s what happens, when they say ‘spike’ it, that’s what happens.
Michelle Thompson is a human being, she hasn’t done anything, the police are not investigating her.
It’s a stitch up just like with Neil Hay.
How far down the road are we gonnae get, when at the first sign of this sort of blatant smearing, we shrug and say ‘The cause is bigger than anyone one individual’? So when it’s the next SNP MP or potential candidate that has lived in the real world and hadn’t ‘polished’ themselves to fit the phoney paradigm of ‘respectability’ so they could ‘present’ themselves as ‘squeaky clean’ for their political career climbing, in advance. Shall we just keep dropping them?
The press and those that furnish them with this sort of ‘salacious’ pish is the problem. Not the people they are smearing.
I won’t be throwing this individual away on the grounds that our cause is bigger than this ‘individual’.
I’ll be waiting to see the outcome of this. And even if it works out that she was involved in some ‘dodgy’ money making activity. SO WHAT?
We can’t afford to get trapped in their narrative. The whole point is our representative come from a lot of ‘ordinary’ backgrounds.
I want anyone who hasn’t ever made errors in judgement, whether that is being involved with someone who turned out to be ‘dodgy’ or took advantage of some deal at some point in their lives…to cast the first stone and damn themselves as hypocrites by doing so.
The ‘bullet proofing’ is a metaphor for not ‘buying into’ the narrative in the msm. Understanding what is behind what is taking place. Not joining in with them and colluding with their corrupt value system.
Rant over.
@Ken500: “£300 to write a letter.”
Change the solicitor, that’s robbery, it cost me £75 and even £50 (plus VAT), not so long ago. The letters worked.
In these days of low (by historical standards) house building numbers, property speculation and investment is ethically questionable.
I applaud the Scottish Government’s attempts to regulate private rents, I’d also like to see them regulate buy to let and other methods of exploiting what is a basic human right. I don’t know if it’s within their remit, but it certainly should be.
I hope Ms Thomson is cleared of any wrongdoing but since the SNP like to vet candidates so thoroughly perhaps it would be wise to avoid such speculators in future.
Apologies if any of this offends.
OT>
That’s funny, a letter from the SNP
“As an SNP member, you’re now part of history.
…
Please take a few moments to renew your membership today”.
Expired a few days ago. I wonder if the double meaning and humour was intentional?
@K1 Excellent rant.
I’m wondering what might be going on in labour councils, could there be something they don’t want folk to know.
I’m keeping my eyes and ears open.
Apologies for my lack of knowledge of Edinburgh’s geography here.
I was wondering if Michelle Thonpson’s constituency overlaps in any way with the *ahem* intended constituency of wee Ruthie. As we all know wee Ruthie is moving from standing in Glasgow, cause even she has finally realised she’ll be handed her earse on a plate, to standing in Edinburgh.
Perhaps this is a wee advance attack from *cough* supporters of wee Ruthie and her tankette in an ultimately failed attempt to try and help her win a seat in Edinburgh. 😉
@Rippey
It could also have been United Against Separation since they have on occasion posted posts made by one Colin Rippey at WoS on their page as well. They seem to be drooling over the Thompson case or non case as well, strange that. But as you say it could all be coincidence.
For disclosure purposes I’m an SNP member (living in Wales!) and a Financial Adviser who does the odd mortgage.
The issue here I think isn’t the ‘innocent sellers’ of the properties being ‘fleeced’ as some have suggested. I suspect they will have had market value for their properties when they sold them.
The issue is the value of the properties ‘potentially’ being falsely overstated (with the co-operation of the dodgy solicitor and possibly a dodgy and co-operative valuer), leading to cash being extracted from and/or much greater risk being imposed on the building societies or mortgage lenders.
Obtaining a (say)£67,000 mortgage against a property inflated to £90,000 but which might really be worth £60,000 is mortgage fraud and a criminal offence. The mortgage company has been given poor security against the loan they’ve made on the property. The ultimate buyer manages to get a mortage at a low rate based on maybe 60 or 70% ‘loan to value’ whereas in reality they’re getting a mortgage of 100% – or indeed more – of the property’s actual value.
That said, the offence is usually on the person facilitating the mortgage (the solicitor and/or mortgage broker if involved) and the applicant if they are signing a mortgage deed knowing that it’s dodgy due to the inflated value, undisclosed cashbacks or whatever.
For what it’s worth if indeed Michelle Thomson is ‘Mrs A’,then she doesn’t appear to have applied for any mortgages herself, so it wouldn’t technically be she who would be in line for any prosecution brought forward – it could be the solicitor, the mortgage broker and the mortgage applicant(s).
So, she may well not be investigated as she may well legally NOT have done anything wrong.
My only regret is that the ‘SNP bad’ MSM will have a field day with this and it does seem naïve that she didn’t declare this as a potential press story before being selected.
It doesn’t make sense. Mr Frank Gilbride bought the house and sold it on . He must have made any profit from the sale. Did his brother shop him in 2010.
Let any Unionists make political capital out of this, the way they have carried on flipping, houses and claiming expenses. Jobs for the boys, missappropriating £Billions of public money and starving people to death.
Many self employed people put their money into saving/ISA’s for their pension.The ISA’s dropped every economic downturn and were worth less than the contributions. They put their money/saving into property as an alternative. Willy Young has property worth £Millions in Stonehaven.
@K1
“…even if it works out that she was involved in some ‘dodgy’ money making activity. SO WHAT?”
So what for social justice? You can just do what you like and rip folk off? Nah. Count me out of that independence model.
‘£300 to write a letter’ + a stamp, an envelope and 10 mins of chit chat. Don’t mention divorce rates. The sky’s the limit. Kerr Ching & Kerr Ching.
It is a case of caveat emptor and caveat venditor – let buyer & seller beware. In a buyers’ market (which since 2008 is most of Scotland apart from Edinburgh & oil rich Aberdeen) buyers’ offers are invariably couched as low as possible but no-one holds a gun to a seller’s head to sell.
Also not all the circumstances are known and every sale/ purchase is unique to that buyer & seller. e.g. many sellers simply do not have the money, the time or the ability to ‘improve’ a property before selling it, & thereby maximising their sale. All house purchases & sales are a bit of a speculative gamble and it often boils down to simply being in the right place at the right time.
Also with the advent of Home Reports, sellers at least have an independent surveyor’s valuation to use as a guide when accepting an offer so I find it difficult to understand how sellers (whether elderly or not) can be deceived into accepting a too low offer. After all the elderly lady in question would have had both an estate agent and a firm of lawyers acting for her. Neither a self-respecting estate agent or a lawyer would deliberating allow their client to accept an offer way below the Home Report valuation. Apart from anything else the estate agent and Lawyer would want to ring fence themselves from complaints being lodged against them by their client at the end of the day.
As far as I can see, the MSM are being entirely selective to the point of misleading the public. Which is exactly what we have come to expect from them in Scotland.
yesindyref2 says:
30 September, 2015 at 5:08 pm
@Ken500: “£300 to write a letter.”
Only outside the court rooms of Scotland. Once you’re in there, legal costs are unrestrained unregulated glory days for lawyers. Just ask four very brave Orcadians taking legal action against the last disgraced LibDem unionist MP in Scotland.
Didn’t take much Tom, did it? Cause of course that’s the ‘gist’ of what I wrote. Fucksake. Out ye go then 😉
@Tom
It’s nothing to do with an “independence model”. it’s about being over-protective of anything to do with the SNP because without them we get no Independence or even a Referendum.
The SNP aren’t perfect, hey, who is? What is wrong is that at times what happens is the indefensible gets defended, blindly. It appears even Sturgeon isn’t doing that.
Just heard Labour MSP Elaine Murray talking utter pish saying SNP should have asked Michelle what kind of profit did dhe make on her business transactions
Lesley-Anne 5.19pm
“Perhaps this is a wee advance attack from *cough* supporters of wee Ruthie and her tankette in an ultimately failed attempt to try and help her win a seat in Edinburgh.”
Is Sherlock Holmes your middle name LA? LOL.
You don’t think of things like that until their put in front of you on a plate, then in all falls into place.
You could be right.
Reading through the entire report from the Scottish Law Society’s tribunal in this case, it’s at least reasonable to expect Ms Thomson to be scrutinised for her part in these transactions.
First of all, there’s this “[…] with regard to the surveyor’s different valuations, Mr Ritchie advised the Tribunal that a lot of the sellers in these cases were distressed sellers.” (p.51 under CONCLUSION:FINDING)
Even though this all happened long before the election, for an MP from an anti-austerity party that simply doesn’t look great. I think it’s commendable that Ms Thomson is trying to protect the SNP – they had nothing to do with any of it, after all. Besides, a selection process that investigates each and every business dealing of potential candidates would be an impossible undertaking anyway.
But the decision also states:
“The Tribunal consider that the features of these transactions were such that the Respondent must have been aware that there was a possibility that he was facilitating mortgage fraud, whether or not this actually occurred.” (p.51 under DECISION)
which is a far more serious matter. (Just in case this is unclear, the Respondent is Ms Thomson’s solicitor who was struck off and the possible mortgage fraud refers to transactions Ms Thomson was directly involved in.)
While none of this proves that Ms Thomson is guilty of anything so serious as mortgage fraud, as an SNP supporter I am still worried about the possible fallout. MSM reporting is already so heavily skewed against the SNP, we really don’t need this.
@heedtracker
Ah, that’s a QC, they charge by the word and the minute.
@Ken500
Perhaps I’ve been lucky in my dealing with three different solicitors, who charged under scale when there was one, and did the job impeccably.
What people forget is that the fee is chargeable time, say £150 per hour, so a 30 minute session is £75 + VAT. Not all time a solicitor spends is chargeable though, at times there’s research, phoning colleagues who have specialised knowledge, Then there’s the assistant, receptionists, offices, insurances, fees, membership fees, and non-chargeable reading to keep up with changes in the law, new interpretations and judgements, journals, budget, tax changes and rulings. Plus rent, rates and energy.
On top of 7 years hard graft to get qualified in the first place, plus low-paid work before they get to charge £150 an hour for their time.
By the time they’re 35 they probably deserve their money, and anyway, if anyone else wants to do the same and is young enough, get those noses in those books and start studying!
Seems like a unionist witch-hunt no surprises that they are getting so desperate for people to believe the bullshit narrative they spout. Keep crying wolf unionist msm all you want but a lot of people see you for the tricksters you really are.
Interesting that this story broke the day after the Carbuncle affair was ratched up.
Just like how Frenchgate broke the day after Nicola won the ITV leaders’ debate (and, more importantly, beat Dave into second place).
It would be interesting to know if this happens a third time. I can understand the security services having files on this terrible, democratically elected party who wants to “break up the UK”. But using them to political ends…???
In addition to the practice which is currently being scrutinised in the case of the Right Honourable Michelle Thomson MP, I can add one of my own findings, which I have tried to raise with public officials, public servants and Scottish parliamentarians for years.
This is when a deceased person’s estate is being sold to raise funds for distribution to heirs: the house is undervalued by fifty to a hundred thousand pounds by the team of solicitor-and-executor and then sold at the undervalued price, in a PRIVATE SALE, to a friend/relative of either. This is a wonderful way to sidestep market prices (the price differential can be made even bigger if the heirs are not UK residents and so not aware of real house values).
For ten years, public officials have turned a blind eye to my complaints about this practice (amid a myriad of others). SNP, Labour, Lib Dems, Tory, Green (Patrick Harvie is the Greens’ legal spokesperson, but is not interested in this, apparently!).
Two divorce lawyers. One censured (alcohol), one struck off. HMRC mistakes ends up losing a £60,000 flat to legal fees. Years of worries. The Sherriff goes with the status quo – HMRC despite their admitted mistakes. The Crown Office is a Law to itself.
A Sherriff threw out HMRC case – an Advocate pursues (cost?) after an HMRC letter of non liability is produced. The Advocate continues to pursues the case, unbeknown to anyone. Letters are sent out in a different name to the wrong address with a different NI number. When the flat is sold. A lawyer informs the authorities (didn’t have to) and the legal battle endures. Most of the value is taken up in ill advised legal fees. The person emigrates. Happy Days.
Why don’t we get started on digging the shit on labour.
Starting with Glasgow Council, which has been subject of dodgy deals, and much more.
Let’s start digging on some labour MP’s and any other stuff we can find on them and highlight them across social media.
It would put the cat amongst the pigeons in many areas.
It would also be very good fun to see them squirm.
There’s something which gives trolls away every time. I’m not talking about your upfront in your face Unionists who appear, I mean the ones trolling in the correct sense of the term. The ones pretending to be on your side but then bringing up little criticisms to try to sow doubts.
Probably some tactician somewhere has deduced that this subtle approach is more likely to work than in-your-face.
The giveaway – they come on and focus on one narrow issue. They want to talk specifics and won’t engage in discussions about a wider picture. They will not compare and contrast.
That is in complete contrast to the rest of us who see each event, each biased reaction in the media, each Unionist polician’s lie … as part of a pattern of similar events, part of a wide web. Basically, we have been getting this shite thrown at us for at least three years now!
Another smear, another lie, another baseless accusation … the real story is in pattern, not the individual events.
There is one good lawyer. Excellent. The rest?
Is Sherlock Holmes your middle name LA? LOL.
Funny you should ask Caz. 😀 😉
Don’t let this news upset you too much.
link to m.stv.tv
They are trying to take our eyes off the big prize, which is of course Independence.
The one good thing about the Michelle Thomson case is that it knocked Corbyn off the front pages.
Our next prize is to wipe Unionist MSPs off the political map in Scotland.
This case shows up all of Scottish Labour’s problems. They have nothing to say to the people of Scotland.
They have just had a three day Conference and at the end of it, all they can talk about is an SNP MP.
Where is their vision for a better Scotland?
Vote SNP/SNP May 2016 and through these Unionist losers out.
Only a Slab fanatic could come up with this. Thompson the Predator now
link to you.38degrees.org.uk
@cuilean 5.28
You’re correct – it’s pretty difficult for a seller to be deceived into accepting a low offer for their property and it’s only likely to happen if the same solicitor is acting for both seller and purchaser, which was not the case in the original purchases in any of the transactions listed in the decision by the Scottish Solicitors’ Discipline Tribunal (yes, I’ve read all 52 pages of it).
All of the transactions in question involved a purchase by one person who immediately sold the property on to a business associate at an inflated price, and it’s the second sale which is dodgy in each case. The first sales were on the level, with different solicitors acting for purchaser and seller.
However, no seller is obliged to accept an offer to purchase, and sellers don’t even have to accept the highest of several offers (they might accept a lower offer to make a quicker sale, for example). No one has “ripped off” the original sellers of these properties. A seller’s solicitor might advise them to wait for a better offer if the offer is low, but the seller doesn’t have to take that advice.
A small point, by the way: not everyone selling a property in Scotland uses an estate agent. It’s not necessary since most conveyancing solicitors can market properties for themselves. Having worked in conveyancing for 25 years, i would never use an estate agent – they really do rip people off!
On the subject of property deals, having established that someone sold someone else a house and made a small profit; can anyone explain how Tony Blair, who spent many years on a politician’s good, but not huge, salary, ended up with millions of pounds’ worth of property in London?
Just asking.
caz-m says:
Completely agree. Realistically, their public rhetoric aside, they probably have one immediate objective. Deny the SNP a majority. This would stop independence in its tracks. It is a prize they know is worth having.
I suspect smear rather than fear will be their weapon of choice.
The story exploded on the same day Carmichael was told he has to go up before the beak to give evidence.
MI5’s slimy fingers are all over this.
Having worked in conveyancing for 25 years, i would never use an estate agent – they really do rip people off!
How are they different from conveyancing lawyers, charging percentage of sale proceeds in Scotland, and a cartel selling the same properties over and over, year in year out?
Snatcher Thatcher was an acclaimed challenger of cartels, closed shops etc, but she bottled it with the legal profession. Funny that. St Margaret also chickened out of taking on the dental profession and thats another UKOK racket.
And ofcourse the Bliar/Brown catastrophe was no different, red or blue, its a toryboy UK.
The Press are implicit in this. Another ‘SNP accused’ story that will be in the Headlines but an apology will not. The MSM are appalling.
They like bully an attractive women. They were even accusing the SNP business spokesperson of having no business acumen and no business. Heckling the fact.
@cuilean says
“It is a case of caveat emptor and caveat venditor – let buyer & seller beware.”
While I agree with this to an extent, I really believe that whether she may or may not have taken advantage of a valuable seller misses the point.
Its seems to me that she was gaming the mortgage lenders by borrowing more than she effectively bought the properties for and using the extra money to fund the next purchase in what is looking more and more like a property portfolio built on a pyramid of debt.
The lawyer continually failed to report that transactions were between connected parties on the same day or that substantial cash paybacks had occurred, which meant she had sought a higher mortgage value than the effective purchase price. It happened over 13 transactions and I fail to see how she could have been in the dark about all this.
Of course the MSM are having a field day with this. Could we have expected anything else? It looks dodgy as hell and it is absolutely maddening that this has happened to one of ours.
galamcennalath says
“There’s something which gives trolls away every time. I’m not talking about your upfront in your face Unionists who appear, I mean the ones trolling in the correct sense of the term. The ones pretending to be on your side but then bringing up little criticisms to try to sow doubts.”
your talking about crap like this?
link to tinyurl.com
Hmm I’ve had problems posting of late, lets see if this works all right. I did say the other night that what’s most interesting about this whole series of episodes is how it is in all the media simultaneously. Almost as if somebody somewhere was pulling the strings. You’d think that would eventually point directly to somewhere or someone doing the briefing.
I have no problem with the party investigating and having a procedure but it’s only a few weeks ago since the Ashley Madison worst attempted smear of all time, even when the Sun publihed that they had found out who had done it nobody cared as it was such a non story.
Thus I am much more suspicious of this kinda oddly non story hitched to the back of a mega rumpus about a hundred and fifty grand. Where were all those investigative journalists when Labour did all those incredibly expensive PPP deals on the never never never?
They are also very quiet on how those broad shoulders of the UK are protecting the oil industry workers post referendum. How much money is the UK government putting in to the pot?
If Andy Murray doesn’t appear in the ATP final. He is over. That’s the third year he failed to appear and disappointed folk. After the Jamboree racket at the Emirates stadium.
The full finding of the Scottish Solicitors’ Discipline Tribunal is here link to ssdt.org.uk if you’re interested, or need a cure for insomnia.
“we prefer to wait for the law to run its course before we judge anyone.”
The unionist media always finds the SNP guilty without any evidence so nothing new there.
But the law in Scotland has zero credibility.
It found Megrahi guilty when he was innocent.
It jailed Tommy Sheridan for perjury but let Coulson free despite perjury.
We all know that Carmichael is guilty as hell even if the law clears him, which it will almost certainly do.
Judges in this country are the lowest of the low.
@manandboy
another ordinary mum then…
Tommy Ball ?@tommy_ball · 3 hrs3 hours ago
The mother of one of the children used by “Kez” in her PPB is a Labour party campaigner. Hmmm.
Is English Law not different regarding Estate Agents was it not Thatcher or Blair that opened it up?.
Scottish Law stipulates Lawyers.
Dugsdale’s a lawyer but she really want’s to be a teacher. Head Lice um lies. She admits it, those who can do. Those who can’t become Unionist politicians.
Michelle Thompson deserved better than “I have no knowledge of Michelle Thompson’s business dealings” from Nicola Sturgeon.
not at all happy with her response.
If you want loyalty Nicola show some back!
dear sweet Jesus
whats the world coming to that STV trot out the “suspended” from the SNP REPEATEDLY meme
But the BBC at least acknowledge Michelle “stood aside”
GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT STV!
john king says:
“your talking about crap like this?
link to tinyurl.com ”
Exactly. Though it has to be said, I’ve seen more subtle attempts!
heedtracker – Ah, 38 degrees – this is the organisation which, if I recall correctly, set up a petition to ensure that the VOW was delivered, and after it had @ 200k+ signatures, allowed Gordon (Clunking Fist) Broon, to hijack and claim it as his own petition, and get lots of media attention.
When 38 degrees were asked whether the petition was originated by GB, they were evasive to say the least. I think most of us who had signed up to 38 degrees unsubscribed at that point, (believing it to be a BT/lab front) so I’m not surprised at the latest from them.
I wouldn’t worry about it as it’s clearly a deflection move – did Ms Thomson oust a Lib Dem perchance or, as LA queried, is she in the area that tank strider Ruthie has in her sights? Hmm?
Up until an hour ago the petition had – wait for it – 25 signatures. 🙂 🙂
Galamcennalath said, “Deny the SNP a majority. This would stop independence in its tracks. It is a prize they know is worth having.
I suspect smear rather than fear will be their weapon of choice.”
This all they have left but it means that next May’s elections will have to be fought by us with the same intensity as the Referendum and GE15. I personally have no doubt about the outcome, mainly because the internal contradictions of the Janus-face Labour Party are simply too great for even the BBC/MSM to successfully paper over for a sustained period. Mr Corbyn had better don the stab-vest ‘cos the Bombing Blairites are itching for regime change already. And Kezia is simply a joke, if a very bad one.
Industrial-size muck-spreader heading our way. I do hope the SNP leadership has a strategy in place, although this is difficult when they have no control over the media.
At least the Catalans have control of broadcasting.
John: your talking about crap like this?
I agree, John.
Quite remarkable that it took until after two-year’s debate and then the Referendum until they realised their judgement is crap.
Just seen SLab party political broadcast. Kezia talking to primary school kids about Labour policies. Sitting opened mouthed…by inference talking to the Scottish electorate like they are little kids not adults! This has the fingerprints of Blair ” eat yer cereal” McDougall all over it. Another epic fail.
Well Britannia TV Aberdeen opened up with the smear. I might as well read the SNP Hell No site of FB or the United Against Separation site on FB as watch Britannia TV Aberdeen.
‘We expect the highest standards from our political representatives’…quoted from grinning Jackie Baillie via latest BBC in Scotland’s hatchet job on the SNP.
Just as well Jabba that you will no longer be such a representative come next year’s Holyrood elections oh great one….as your own complete estrangement from standards and indeed the truth itself will be made manifest by your casting from a great height by the electorate out on your lying fat arse.
@Grouse Beater
No, the Times article was on Sunday 27th Sept:
“Michelle Thomson, the Edinburgh West MP and Scottish National party’s shadow minister for business, innovation and skills, was involved in the suspect deals in 2010 and 2011. Many of the vendors were “distressed” and anxious to sell. Thomson has strongly denied any wrongdoing.”
Lallands 29th Sep:
“It’s perhaps appropriate that I didn’t have time to blog about the election court’s Carmichael judgment this afternoon.”
The full media attention and social media blew up after Carmichael, but the seeds were sown by the Times before. It is possible they were aware it was due, but I’d say it was just aprt of their genral anti-SNP agenda.
@Colin Rippey says: 30 September, 2015 at 2:19 pm:
” … Why is it so difficult to accept that there’s someone in the world who has been shown to be involved in practises so dodgy that the Law Society felt it necessary to strike off the solicitor, and that that person is a member of the SNP?”
Perhaps, Mr. Colin Rippey, it just may be because, to date, the only official action taken against anyone involved has been by the lawyers trade association against their own, (now former), member.
Even more relevant is that, to date, the Scottish Police are doing no more than investigating the Law Societies former member. Ergo there has not as yet been and proven criminal actions by anyone.
That is why the Scottish Police are now conducting an enquiry – to establish if a criminal act has taken place. As yet neither the lawyer, nor his erstwhile client Ms Thompson, have been charged with anything and the lady is not even under investigation.
Now please do not continue attempting to goad commenters on this forum to overstep the propriety of polite English language comment, (Or to put that another way, “Why don’t you f … :Ach! Perhaps not.
Ken500
What has Andy Murray got to do with this?
Anyway your facts are all wrong. Two years ago he was recovering from back surgery, and last year he lost to Roger Federer.
If he should chose to miss the Emirates it would only be to try to win the Davis Cup at a financial loss to himself.
To tennis players the Davis Cup is like the World Cup and the Ryder Cup. To win it after 70 years would be a fantastic achievement.
@Ken500 “There is one good lawyer. Excellent. The rest?”
6 actually, 3 different practices. One was when we avoided a really dodgy solicitor who was “acting for both sides”. Or at least, the practice was. We declined their “kind” offer to represent us and got far far better results elsewhere. Yes, there are dodgy solicitors, and also ones charging far too much for very little. Some don’t even do their job right. like actually read deeds. Caveat emptor.
The plan is to keep any vision of a progressive Scotland as myopic as theirs with hyperbolic interludes of SNP calamities, disasters & catastrophes. Tragically for UKOK, YES has panoptic vision and is horizon scanning despite the manipulative state media circus kicking off.
Must be terribly frustrating for UKOK to have visual field defects and cognitive impairment- it has all the hall marks of a terminal decline. Independence for Scotland is the healthy option- let’s part like mature adults.
Labour/Unionist controlled CrownOffice – Meghrahi – Tommy Sheridan – Blair/Murdoch settling scores. Coulson lied at the £5Million Sheridan show trial. Otherwise the jury would not have convicted. Coulson lied and put someone inside. He was guilty as hell. Coulson eventually was put inside for breaking the Law. Blair should be in jail. Murdoch should be in prison for bribing public officials. A criminal offence any where in the world under US Law.
Sheridan was refused leave to appeal to Europe Human Rights Court by the Crown Office, upheld by (Blair’s) Illegal London Appeals Court. The London Appeals Court has to uphold any Scottish appeals decision because under Scottish Law Scotland is sovereign. People in Scotland are denied the ‘right of appeal’ against EU justice. i.e. ‘Equal rights to human rights Act/legislation.
Lochside
“Just as well Jabba that you will no longer be such a representative come next year’s Holyrood elections oh great one….as your own complete estrangement from standards and indeed the truth itself will be made manifest by your casting from a great height by the electorate out on your lying fat arse.”
Splutter cough
I didn’t think it was possible to eject Beaujolais from your ears! 🙂
I think Michelle did the right thing in withdrawing from the whip until the investigation is over. If she has done wrong then due process will take its course. If she has not done wrong the SNPbaders will be bitter and disappointed and of course will not apologise. In particular I suspect Jackie Baillie will not be forthcoming with an apology.
As Michelle is not actually under investigation I am not entirely sure what the the process is or how long it will take.
If Andy Murray doesn’t appear, it will be a financial loss unrecoverable to many would be fans. Cost of tickets , flights, hotel bills, train tickets + spending monies. Who won’t be squirming ‘Com’n Andy’ The Federer defeat – blink and it was over.
( : > } It was a bit random off topic. Henman pontificating.
@john king
During the vetting process, potential candidates are asked if there’s anything in their past that might be used against them, so presumably Thomson didn’t reveal her property dealings.
To be fair, a lot of people trust their solicitors and probably don’t really pay attention half the time “where do I sign”. And it’s not just Law that solicitors do, traditionaly they do a lot of finance handling and investment for their clients, the lucky ones who have something to invest.
Ken500 says
“( : > } It was a bit random off topic. Henman pontificating.”
Christ!
you are human
I thought your pseudonym was a serial number like r2d2 🙂
SLAB are that feckin thick and moronic they could not put 2+2 together to get 4. The Unionist media (all of it which precludes only The National and Sunday Herald) are more devious and distort everything to put gloss on Lab, Lib Con UKIP etc and dirt up SNP.
Keep trying unionist scum, you are not convincing anyone.
@Colin Rippey says: 30 September, 2015 at 2:47 pm:
” … Sorry, (and I am being genuine here).
Well that’ll be a first.
Tinderbox,
I presume when you state ‘valuable seller’ you meant ‘vulnerable’?
Anyway, you are making a lot of assumptions in ignorance of the facts. The lynch pin in all Scots sales is the Home Report valuation which is a legal requirement.
You have no idea what the Home Report valuation was in the case of the elderly lady.
Sellers can have a property on the market for years then end up being forced to accept an offer which is well below the Home Report valuation.
However it is always the Home Report valuation (not the sale price) which a lender relies upon, and that is why sellers have Home Reports ‘refreshed’ just before a sale.
Again, the police have not charged the MP with anything and indeed as she is not under investigation at all. We do live in a free market economy, after all.
I think we will find that this is all a storm in a very selective teacup.
No one should be surprised, Labour are desperate to find ammunition to attack the SNP. I too think she is being attacked because she is a business woman and Director of Business for Scotland.
Really disappointing that it is lead story on BBC Scotland but not surprised!
In propaganda terms, the SNP have a few pistols while the Unionists have an arsenal of machine guns.
Hard to bear, but bear we must for as long as it takes to gain Independence.
Asked this afternoon about Michelle Thomson by reporters, Nicola’s face was like fizz. Where was her personal advisor? Not good enough.
This is bound to affect how the SNP vets candidates.
Just for the record, and to demonstrate my fair mindedness, this sort of affair is something you will have to get used to, accept and just move on.
At any one time there may be an SNP MP or MSP that may have behaved in a manner which may be inappropriate, or dodgy or even illegally (I am not commenting on this specific case). Similarly there will be MPs of other parties, Policeman, Bishops, Lawyers, Judges, Doctors, Nurses, Civil Servants, etc that are in the same boat – at anyone time.
It is ridiculous to make any judgement, or to try and gain capital, on any one of those groups on the basis of the behaviour, that may come to light, of one or a few of them. No party, company, profession or institution can guarantee that all of its people are behaving to the highest standards at all times. All of these people are human – and some humans (in any group) may behave badly from time time – that’s life.
At Westminster, as you all know, MPs of all parties are sometimes found committing indiscretions, behaving in a dodgy manner and sometimes illegally. The parties tend to remove the whip and leave them to their fate and, contrary to what might be thought, it is unusual for another party to try gain from the situation – they probably know they will be next.
So, “storm in a tea cup” comes to mind. If someone is a bad apple then they will be dealt with and we should move on.
Parliaments, wherever they are, are “glass houses” and stones tend not to be thrown. It doesn’t mean that the press wont have their day. Malcolm Rifkin and Jack Straw both, rightly in my view, got hammered by the press recently.
Just for once, how about about everyone writes a comment agreeing with me?!?!?
@ Yesindyref2
Whenever someone is “accused”
party leaders at least show a degree of solidarity with their MP’s
She could have been more supportive,
for Gods sake the woman hasn’t been accused of anything yet,
Or are we seeing the start of a split in the SNP
The young bloods who will not stand for the nonsense dished out by the MSM versus the old guard who want to stay on the right side of the establishment
wasn’t Fiona Hyslop not just the other day sucking up to the BBC?
I said in August last year “its time the gloves came off”
and what did we see?
the SNP went down in the last round to a soft uppercut,
I am fucking sick of the SNP pussyfooting around these people for fear of offending them!
There is something wrong with this whole affair.
This MP was, to my knowledge, the ONLY woman in the entire UK named as part of the AshMad thing.
When it transpired the female database was mostly robot created, that attack failed.
Now, a new method of staining her character has evolved. This really smells.
osakisushi says
“Now, a new method of staining her character has evolved. This really smells.”
I could not agree more
Her time in charge of business for independence has clearly gained her many enemies, we should circle the wagons round her
I wont stand back and watch those savages scalp her!
Lesley-Anne, I do agree that it would be nice to somehow incorporate the Declaration of Arbroath into a future written Scottish constitution. It was a revolutionary document for its time, stating that “there is neither bias nor difference between Jew or Greek, Scot or Angle”.
Only thirty years before this, Edward Longshanks issued his edict EXPELLING all Jews from England!
I would like to see more discussion online of a future Scottish constitution (if anyone likes, I can publish ideas online on a website I have free).
I also think a constitution is not enough. I think we need a country where, for example, economics and politics are taught in school. Or some form of direct democracy through a secure online system, where everyone somehow has a say. Why should Scots lead the world in so many ways, but not in politics?!?
Posts seem to disappear.
Have all the trolls gone back to bed now? It was like UKOK Central earlier on.
Phronesis @ 6.59: as usual, a wise comment but I think the “mature adults” bit is beyond our opponents. We could do with more of your musings on these pages.
If you think today was bad, it’s going to get a lot worse before May 2016, which is the do or die battle for the Union. They think that, if they can stall our advance, Indyref2 is off the table. This is why SNP/SNP is vital next year, if your primary goal is freedom from the UK cesspit.
I think the internal contradictions of the Janus-faced Labour Party are about to become too great even for the BBC/MSM to paper over. Corbyn will eventually be destroyed by the Bombing Blairites after being allowed to strut and fret his hour upon the stage. His position on Trident is laughable after the conference vote. Perhaps he can get some tips from Kezia. Or Angry Murray.
Jeez…
@ohn king
I think Sturgeon’s played it exactly right, especially if as manandboy says, her face was like fizz.
If I was Sturgeon back in May, or Angus Robertson for that matter, faced with 56 MPs going down into an environment where it’s known every move they make will be criticised and looked into for SNP Badness, I would say basically “If you get yourself into trouble, you’re on your own. Sort it. It will be nothing to do with the party, nor will it be allowed to reflect on the other 55 MPs.”.
@ osakisushi 7:33 pm.
Good point. The unionist media and Westminster establishment are desperate to find any way [fair of foul] to dent support for the SNP. The unionist media and westminster establishment are still in denial of the SNP’s success. They cannot understand the change in Scotland’s politics; as a result the unionist media in Scotland is dying a slow death. Likewise, as far as Scotland is concerned, the Westminster establishment.
@ sensibledave – where’s that noddy smiley emoty thingy when you need it! xx
sensibledave: you are a lovely, lovely person.
When I tried to type that it came out “sensible data”. Shurely shome mishtake, and don’t call me Shirley.
What are you after, anyhow?
Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes, as my granny used to say.
@john king
She’s actually not a director of BfS since 20 December 2014. I found this out because of a poster on Herald trying to make a big thing about annual return being cough, late, and accounts errr, due very shortly. It does happen with businesses they take the penalty sometimes – or appeal if appropriate. Non-business owning people wouldn’t understand. But she probably stood down around the time of her nomination for MP candidate, to clear the decks.
Somebody’s going after Michelle Thomson for some reason this is the second time in a few weeks invented trouble is being stirred up, there’s no way Michelle would have passed the candidate test unless the SNP was sure she was squeaky
We know the oppositions Modus but I have to say this smells personal to me, we have no friends or allies when it comes to this kind of thing and the SNP know this well, and for this reason I’ll quite happily stick my neck out and say this is all Pish of the highest order, I just cannot see this as a thing
Both BBC and STV are full guns blazing on this with every innuendo steered towards guilt, constant pictures of her with text like Struck off, Nicola Sturgeon Denies, Embarrassment for SNP The End Is Fcking Nigh
And the people who are actually guilty of stuff like Ruthless Davidson, John McTernon are found not guilty of opening up postal ballots which they admitted to and is a crime
And their defence, we were just bragging, they were only predictions, after TV evidence before our very eyes and ears they admit to breaking the law but that’s OK WTF is happening in our country when politicians like Carmichael can lie on TV, smear the First Minister, smear the French Ambassador, smear the French Consul and the electorate has to pay to get this guy into court
You’ll probably gather I’m getting a little irritated now, this is getting even worse than the Referendum it’s a real concerted effort from all sides now and must be stopped
So to that end I call on all members of the SDF (Scottish Defecation Force) to start hurling the shit back in huge quantities
If shit becomes in short supply I have connections in Norway who will ship over as much as is required, they eat a lot of fish
Isis, Isis is it, don’t get me started, SDF ya Bastirts
Went too far eh
Yesindyref2
“I think Sturgeon’s played it exactly right, especially if as manandboy says, her face was like fizz.”
Her face WAS like fizz
and what does that say to the public?
no smoke without fire that’s what!
her face condemned a person without a word being spoken,
even if she IS guilty Nicola should have asked people to allow her the benefit of the doubt while the facts are investigated ,or are we now in a world where presumption of guilt is the norm?
The troops have to rally round Ms Thomson, this is yet another smear/non story.
As we have come to realise if you are a unionist you could basically get away with murder, if you are an SNP member, Fart and you get done for genocide.
On that last point I heard some tit on Radio Scotch-shire this morning saying there was a wind of change coming from the Labour party, “well news for them,”
It still smells like SH*TE.
As for Henman pontificating.? I thought has was just a WAN*ER and Crap tennis player.
Jabba Baillie should be an advert for diet pills, that’s the beauty of the I-Player, you don’t have to watch the likes of her when eating your dinner.
Yay!
@john king “Or are we seeing the start of a split in the SNP”
I don’t think so the SNP has a history of managing to encompass a huge variety of views. But I think it may be evolving a little, with some resistance. My feeling is that new members coming in after the Ref for to support Indy have been holding back a bit, as the SNP got us a Ref and very close to a YES. But now perhaps they – we – are starting to make ourselves felt. Resistance is futile! The SNP will be assimilated 🙂
yesindyref2
“She’s actually not a director of BfS since 20 December 2014”
hence why I said “her time in charge of”
I’m well aware she no longer runs it!
but the charge stands,
so many people so many groups have supported independence but it would seem the SNP (of whom I am a member) would like to ignore the others actors in this play and imagine they and they alone are the the star performers
“Jaques to Duke Senior
All the world’s a stage,
And all the men and women merely players;
They have their exits and their entrances,
And one man in his time plays many parts,
His acts being seven ages. At first, the infant,
Mewling and puking in the nurse’s arms.
Then the whining schoolboy, with his satchel
And shining morning face, creeping like snail
Unwillingly to school. And then the lover,
Sighing like furnace, with a woeful ballad
Made to his mistress’ eyebrow. Then a soldier,
Full of strange oaths and bearded like the pard,
Jealous in honor, sudden and quick in quarrel,
Seeking the bubble reputation
Even in the cannon’s mouth. And then the justice,
In fair round belly with good capon lined,
With eyes severe and beard of formal cut,
Full of wise saws and modern instances;
And so he plays his part. The sixth age shifts
Into the lean and slippered pantaloon,
With spectacles on nose and pouch on side;
His youthful hose, well saved, a world too wide
For his shrunk shank, and his big manly voice,
Turning again toward childish treble, pipes
And whistles in his sound. Last scene of all,
That ends this strange eventful history,
Is second childishness and mere oblivion,
Sans teeth, sans eyes, sans taste, sans everything.”
@Kenny
I think a Constitution is a must, and might be the next Referendum campaign in itself. It should be done in such a way to encompass currently undecided, soft NOes and even the hard NOes, as well as YESsers.
Something like this (goes off to google Iceland):
link to en.wikipedia.org
“Between 2009 and 2013, in the wake of the Kitchenware Revolution Iceland’s constitution was profoundly revised through a ground breaking crowd-sourced process;[citation needed] in 2012 it secured the support of 67% of the population in a non-binding referendum[citation needed]. However, the new constitution has not been enacted by Parliament as yet, and since the Icelandic parliamentary election, 2013 looks unlikely to be”
But enacted. I think a lot was done online.
Sensible Dave has the great knack of increasing the SNP vote by 10,000 every post.
sensibledave
why dont you cram that yay where the sun dont shine YOU SON OF A *****!
Three of my sublime post gone missing in the last hour: good for WoS, bad for my self-esteem.
john king: like all of us you’re getting annoyed but we don’t know what to read into Nicola’s expression. She could equally be fizzing about our perfidious media. She can’t really defend an MP who hasn’t even been investigated yet.
SNP vetting is extremely thorough, simply because we all know what we are up against and any chink will be exploited by MSM/BBC.
We simply have to let the police investigate and see what transpires.
Compared to the Westminster Cesspit, it doesn’t amount to a rabbit’s fart (as my French sister-in -law would say).
There’ll be a lot worse to come before the Unionist’s last stand in May.
@john king
I think Sturgeon is quite natural which is good, and it means her face show it too. I doubt she’s condemned Thomson without a trial, but it’s clear Thomson failed to reveal all during the vetting process, otherwise she’d probably have failed, this time at least.
@sensibledave: 🙂
@Dr Jim, oh I don’t know, I enjoyed it. The more the MSM and all those behind it go after the SNP, the more they reveal how much they hate loathe and detest the SNP not only for daring to think of Independence, but for having the sheer effrontery of thinking they can voice opinions in the hallowed House of Commons that aren’t, errr, quite criket and roly-poly with custard.
manandboy says:
“lying, cronyism, brown envelopes, nepotism, hugging Tories and sleeping with the Tories, the gravy train, the House of Lords, corruption, expenses fraud, voting for austerity, in favour of nuclear weapons and illegal wars.”
I can’t read that without my brain going into Bob Dylans “Subterranean Homesick Blues”
To Paula Rose & Tinto Chief
THANK YOU!
To Iain & John King
.. it may take you longer, but you are going to grow to love me.
Tinto Chiel
“She could equally be fizzing about our perfidious media. She can’t really defend an MP who hasn’t even been investigated yet.”
Oh dear God
so how is the unconnected cynical viewer supposed to differentiate between her being annoyed at Michelle Thompson and the media unless she BLEEDIN WELL TELLS THEM?
Yep! Had an argument with someone (a MrJayMobbs)on Twitter last night who gleefully jumped on Michelle’s case and said that she hadn’t done enough.
It started off with his tweet of ‘It’s all quite ironic considering the bluster the SNP have created over Alistair Carmichael’s seat.’
To which I replied, ‘Aye, but at least she has rightly resigned. Rather than fall on his sword, Carmichael drags his guilt through the courts
Then I received this – ‘She’s resigned from her Party, but not resigned her seat, job and therefore salary! Big difference.
To which I replied, ‘Question. Is she guilty? Has she been found guilty? Nope. It’s an investigation at the mo, Innocent until proven guilty
After that …not a peep!!
The difference between Carmichael and Michelle Thomson is, that Michelle at this point has not been accused of anything. but to protect her party, she has resigned and distanced herself from them for the moment, and will probably return to them if all is proven that she is innocent in the entire affair. A rather noble gesture one could say.
However, our Carmichael who proclaims that he innocent, accused our First Minister of being in cahoots with David Cameron, and while at it, drags in the French Ambassador. There in lies the difference. Accusationary fingers were pointed at Nicola Sturgeon which all seemed to emanate from the Scottish Office.
As more and more evidence came to light, and as an article in Commonspace stated, ‘The results of the Cabinet Office inquiry find that the memo was passed on to the Telegraph by Euan Roddin, special advisor to Alistair Carmichael.
Carmichael admits to agreeing that the memo should be passed to the press, acknowledges that its details were false and apologies for his role in the leak.’ (link to commonspace.scot).
Yesindieref2
“it’s clear Thomson failed to reveal all during the vetting process, otherwise she’d probably have failed, this time at least.”
Ok well that’s it then,
you get the tar I’ll get the feathers,
SOMEBODY BRING A RAIL!
what part of innocent until proven guilty is hard for people to get here?
This first appeared in the DR and is now on :-
link to scottishlabour.org.uk
“Young women are told ‘if you are good enough and work hard enough, you can achieve anything.’
It just isn’t true.” (But Kez didn’t tell the girls that last bit.)
It ignores the barriers that a young woman faces when she tries to succeed in our society.
It ignores the fact that there are young women who, no matter how hard they work, will never achieve what they want because of the institutional discrimination they will come up against.”
This isn’t what Kezia told the kids in the Party Political Broadcast on Facebook, and tonight on TV.
OT Just watched Kezia’s ‘Question Time’ in which she very sincerely says – if you can’t do anything else, be like me, become a politician.
“The SNP will be assimilated :-)”
Into what, yesindyref2?
I only joined in September last year but feel that discipline is very important given the forces ranged against us.
It’s the long game were playing here.
When we achieve independence we will have to reward the likes of sensible Dave with an award for increasing the demand for independence.
sensibledave
Have you had a bang on the head or something? Try picking up a guitar or engaging someone in a language you don’t know. The human mind is a wonderful thing indeed- and is an area we are all clearly just beginning to understand. In the space of a week Will made statements I agreed with, and now this intervention.
Could it be the common sense and objectivity of the posters on this site is having a gradual effect?
“To Iain & John King
.. it may take you longer, but you are going to grow to love me.”
I wouldn’t hold you breath!
TInto Chiel says:
“There’ll be a lot worse to come before ….”
Yes. They will target specific areas, and therefore particular SNP politicians, where they feel they are in with a chance.
“… the Unionist’s last stand in May”
I do believe this may indeed be their last stand. The object will be to deny the SNP a majority. If they can achieve this, independence is off the cards for the medium term. If they fail, and the SNP gets a good solid majority then IndyRef2 will follow as the inevitable ‘perfect storm’ develops courtesy of WM.
This election may turn out to be the showdown.
Tinto Chiel
“It’s the long game were playing here.”
Ive been playing the long game
since 1974
I’m getting tired of waiting! 🙁
there reaches a point when (and I think we have reached it) you just have to go for broke.
In common with many on here, I see collusion by media and Slab with British Intelligence pulling the strings.
Timing is everything and the coincidences are beyond even David Icke’s fevered imagination.
We are under sustained Campaign Fear mark 2….the aim?: to derail or disable the impendind wipeout of Unionism next year.. and they mean to stop it at all costs.
One point..I watched both STV and BBC’s version of NS’s statement. The former showed her emerging and responding to the questions re. Michelle Thomson’s conduct…the latter edited that out and made it appear that she was barging out to the media and simultaneously blurting out a denial of knowledge…a subtle but telling omission that changed the entire implication of a single scene.
Ukok trolls and self loathing doubters on here…if you dare question it…consider the burying of Carmichael’s ongoing shameful trial…a lying charlatan hanging on like a human nematode for grim death…consider Catalonia’s incredible poll result and the implications thereof for democracy…also disgracefully suffocated from msm coverage.
And most telling; the Jeremy Corbyn show….Red under the bed in England and caring sharing socialist in Scotland…at this rate the man will require three cheeks on his arse to sit on all the different principles he’s supposed to espouse.
Hopefully messers Prof Robertson and GA Ponsonby are on the case monitoring both the subtle and the totally blatant lying being perpetrated…yet again…on the Scottish population by British forces of darkness.
I agree with John King…it’s time the gloves finally came off and the SNP as the elected government of Scotland came out and challenged the deceit and collusive nature of our corrupt Imperial glove puppet media.
O/T
Any VW owners with YES and SNP stickers on their vehicles should hide them, as ECB Scotch-shire will soon be looking for another “Headline non story”
You can see the Harlot, spaniels ears burd with her big botoxed cheesy coupon, reading the headline, SNP cause global warming, and K wi an E fae the valleys would continue the pi*h on her mind numbingly dire radio show, where some unionist pri*k would then tell us about the SNP being members of ISIL.
The gloves are coming off.
Sorry I am starting to rant,
The media bias has been turned up to 11.
John King, we don’t know what Nicola’s annoyed at. She may have been caught off-guard by this and needs to check that everything is water-tight before she comments definitively. We need to let things settle and the investigation take its course.
The establishment likes to set hares running and I think this is just a deflection strategy. The MSM frames the debate and sticks cameras and microphones in her face. She may not be in possession of all the facts. Should she go out on a limb in such a circumstance?
Let’s keep a calm sough.
Gary45%@8pm
Thanks that is a brilliant sentence about unionists getting away wi murder and if SNP members fart they get done for genocide! I needed a laugh today, and with the troughing, trolling unionists on the warpath so as to preserve the status quo, we probably all do!
As I have, I think, said before, this referendum, this site with all the great people, adorned with such great wit and intelligent hilarious comments at times has kept me going.
Hey you boring unionists, never underestimate the creative, innovative, and progressive faculties, that the good people of Scotland are well capable of in all areas of life. And they put them to good use you know, and that is how we are such a strong resilient lot. :))
I would like to see more discussion online of a future Scottish constitution (if anyone likes, I can publish ideas online on a website I have free).
I like the idea of being able to go somewhere Kenny where respectful discussions can be had about the future of our written constitution. No doubt many on here and elsewhere have their own views about such a topic.
More over I’m sure Stu would appreciate the constitutional discussion being carried out somewhere other than on Wings. 😀
I also think a constitution is not enough. I think we need a country where, for example, economics and politics are taught in school. Or some form of direct democracy through a secure online system, where everyone somehow has a say. Why should Scots lead the world in so many ways, but not in politics?!?
I totally agree with you Kenny in that just having a written constitution is not enough.
I think you may be right in your proposals about politics and economics being taught in schools. (I’m well past the official school age so I have no idea what is taught in schools these days. 🙂 ) I do think though that this discussion is best left until after independence. I’m afraid discussing what should and what should not be included in the school curriculum may muddy the waters of the indy debate. (there again I may be wrong, as I usually am. 😉 )
With regards to your idea about on line democracy then yes I think that is definitely achievable. As always though there is one ghost in the room that as always needs to be cleansed before this is achieved and that is the question of the on line security.
“The media bias has been turned up to 11.”
Im right with you on that Gary!
@ sensibledave.
I don’t think you really got the gist of my reply. I’d give it a millennium, frankly.
Thanks for the promotion to chief, but I am not worthy.
I have some knowledge of SNP vetting procedures. Regardless of how any police investigation may eventually turn out, the hard fact is that had relevant information been disclosed by the person seeking the candidacy it is very probable that they would not have been allowed to proceed. The process was designed to avoid potential situations such as this.
@Tinto Chiel
It was said with a smiley.
I had thought I was going to go in, guns blazing, looking for reform and support for that, try to get a couple of resolutions through the branch, even one in the constitution itself, go to conference and go for it. And then I realised I didn’t have a clue what I was talking about, that from what I could see there was plenty of dissenting voices, but that it was all managed quite easily, and democratically. Some of what passes I don’t like, for instance the all-female shortlists, but that’s one of their quirks, live with it.
So instead of spending my birthday money on going through to Aberdeen, I spent it on Chris Cairn’s signed hardback. Humour won the day!
John King: I’ve voted SNP since 1974 so I’m not going to fall out with you. The next few months are our make or break before May and there will be a lot more of this kind of stuff. Let’s let the chips fall where they may for just now. Nicola must be sure of her next step. Sometimes you have to soak up the punishment before you use the sledgehammer.
Fight the good fight, mon brave.
Tinto Chiel
“Should she go out on a limb in such a circumstance? ”
No she shouldn’t go out on a limb, she was thrown a curve ball,
quelle surprise,
Shes a professional Politician for Gods sake,
I am furious with her that she could not summon up enough courage to support a new MP who she may admittedly not know as well as the long term party members, but she SHOULD have had the nous not to appear unable to automatically support her without giving Thompson the support she should have reasonably expected,
I am so dissapointed in Nicola.
“Fight the good fight, mon brave.”
Merci mon ami. 🙂
Aa need ma bed
up early in the mornin.
@ Mister J King
¥ that’s a like for you vids. A chuckle in the morning.
Could not get Ken, ya ken (taken) (possible Kenneth or King Kenneth? ) or Ken5 or Ken50 so Ken500 in panic, by default. ta ken. Good ta ken. Not complicated or anything.
($ : > }
Sorry, yesindyref2. The internet is not the place for irony. These damn smiley faces.
Fairy Nuff.
Carry on.
Yes, the Nippy Sweety did seem even nippier than usual when confronted by a hostile press regarding Michelle Thomson.
I would expect, however, if/when Action Krankie, Dippity Dug, Holy Wullie and the rest try to make capital out of this tomorrow at FMQ, wee Nippy will tear them new ones.
Confronted as she was by the media, the FM, who is probably still getting to the bottom of things as regards a retort to the inuendo surrounding Ms Thomson’s position, was definitely on th defensive.
At FMQ, she will be on the attack, so, I feel it will be woe-betide any of the pygmies who try to make political capital from this.
Anyone know which WM committes Michelle Thomson is a member of? The first thing that occurred to me was if you want to nobble or even silence a committee member you bring their honesty/probity into question. Stop laughing all of you-I know there aren’t many honest souls in WM but the law of averages says there must be a few 🙂
Right now we have dodgy deals with China, HS2 for which there’s no business case, fracking & UCG going ahead, TTIP, selling off the NHS, Trident renewal & a host of other things we don’t know about being discussed by committees in WM hallowed halls (joke).
The problem WM has is that on some issues the SNP MP’s don’t have a vested interest in the issue but as happens at times, those with no interest can afford to be the most vociferous opponent of a deal which has the agreement of the majority before the official meeting/discussion has even taken place.
Who knows? Maybe she is percieved to be a spoiler. It would not surprise me particularly as it was SNP MP’s who blew the whistle of MP’s expenses & a 2nd scandal which escapes me right now.WM cannot handle honesty in it’s politicians-all they can do is discredit them 😉
@Tinto Chiel
No worries. It is interesting to wonder how much difference the new members who outnumber old ones nearly 4 to 1 (I think the latest membership is around 118,000) have made to the party, and I don’t think it’s a lot, apart from size. Which is probably just as well.
Nicola wisnae fizzing. She was exasperated. She wis annoyed at the Press. Could you imagine the rammy. Sticking micros everywhere. Tommy had the right idea. Curtail them, and they still give abuse.
A previous poster says it was edited – ie cut to look like that. There will be a vid released shortly, no doubt, giving the real scene.
Socrates MacSporran: my feelings exactly.
Good luck, Kezia.
This particular story will disappear quite quickly IMO. I suspect the tactic is to target one, or a few, individual(s) with a steady drip-drip of rumour and non-stories. Nothing substantial which could be unequivocally disproved but just lots of side swipes and innuendo.
It’s the establishment’s revenge for going after Carmichael so if, and hopefully when, he goes down all this smearing will escalate, especially if Mundell gets drawn in too, don’t expect Carmichael to be the sole scapegoat without taking someone else with him.
It’s going to be a bumpy ride until May …
“It’s going to be a bumpy ride until May.”
Quite right, GrahamB. There’s a long, long trail a-winding for us all.
My lost posts thanked Marie Clark, Dr Jim, Phronesis and galamcennalath for their sage contributions today.
Keeps us all sane, I think.
When I read the CV’s of our politicians I wish I could see more folk who had done real jobs. I want people to represent us from all walks of life. I especially do not want people who went to University Politics Class then did a party job and suddenly they are telling the rest of us how to live. Yet there are plenty of those kind.
If, and it is very desirable in my mind, we want people with commercial experience to stand for election, then we will have to accept what goes with that territory. Just as Doctors kill the odd patient, and lawyers bungle the odd house conveyance. Just about everyone leads a far from blameless life. And commerce is a dog eat dog world.
Now we have no idea what, if anything, Ms Thompson is accused of. On the scant evidence of some disreputable media sources it sort of looks like some sort of mortgage issue may be what’s gone on. Mortgages were thin on the ground before CMDave’s lot started their support schemes. It would have been hard to sell houses in 2009/10.
It is no more wrong to buy a house at a knockdown price, than it is to sell it at a profit. There are many many people who have done well out of the boom in recent years. Is their profit somehow more moral than anyone else’s? Indeed since the real losers in this monopoly game that perhaps half the community have indulged are in fact future generations who cannot afford the prices, is there really anyone who is truly holy?
If you don’t pay the mortgage the bank gets your house. If you are a forced seller and there are no buyers you can give the bank your keys or take whatever is offered. If you think its worth twice that then hold out. I saw an ex council house in London went for a million recently. I didn’t read about the sellers giving all the profit to the homeless.
If charges are brought against anyone then we can all pass opinions. But until then, there’s nothing to see.
ALERT
I’m becoming increasing irritated by lots of stuff. The case the SNP is founded to progress is independence for Scotland.
This has nothing to do with whether Michelle Thompson had a dodgy lawyer or not.
We have been fannying about too long on the Vow,the Smith Commission and all the other diversions and distractions our opponents throw in front of us.
We won’t win a second referendum because we are nicer than the Labour party and pinning hopes on Nicola’s current popularity is foolish and short sighted.
We won’t win a second referendum as an alternative to the Labour Party or on a Green ticket or by engaging our opponents on the battle grounds they choose to attack us on.
We win by painting the better country we can achieve if we are in control of our own decisions and our own economy.
We win by establishing that we are economically self sufficient. We win by establishing that we are no less able than any other country. We win by establishing we are being lied to – and, crucially, that only the really stupid believe the lies.
We win by campaigning for independence (and have no dalliance with devo this or that or silly federalism).
All these things are above the low level of political scrimmaging we are being presently engaged in.
It’s our own fault if we allow ourselves and our cause to be minimalised by peripheral concerns
TJenny, it is interesting watching the whole UKOK media and online unionist fanatics going berserk at these two women, like a killer whale going nuts on its trainer at seaworld.
But its conference time, last Scot Libdem ever is heading for the witness stand, imagine all of them trying to get him to not answer under oath questions like, “who else knew about this memo? Were you told to give the memo to the torygraph creeps? In your letter of confession to Sturgeon you said you knew the accusation against Sturgeon was false, how do you know that? Did Fluffie Mundell know you were going to leak the memo and if so, what did he say?
A lot of BBC and co sneaky shits are going to be doing a lot more than editing vids to make Sturgeon look bad.
I’ve just had a word with someone and she told me to say
“Calm down I’ve got this”
This is just makey uppy pretendy but I think this is what this person would say
Folks, remember this is exactly what we have come to expect from the collusion between the media and the British state. This kind of rubbish has been happening for years. Remember how they used to smear Alex Salmond. Now they try to damage Nicola by attacking those around her. Same old sh*te.
Please don’t get suckered in, and fall for such tosh. I do not doubt Michelle will be found to have done no wrong. She did the right thing as soon as the matter was raised.
Meanwhile, does the Labour party actually have any policies (aside from renewing trident)? Serious question.
Dave McEwan Hill at 938pm,
Well said. Very, very well said. Needs shouting loud and long.
I completely agree, we need to be painting the picture of an independent Scotland not fannying about with Smith, and other trivialities for which Westminster holds power.
The poll ratings for independence support will not go up by themselves, it will take the SNP and others to shout about it long and hard. Barely a statement was made by Salmond that did not refer to independence. Now, it seems like a secret.
@Lollysmum 21:19
Michelle Thompson sits on the Business, Innovation and Skills Committee. This committee is one of four committees that comes together to form the Committees on Arms Export Control. See link below for more details.
link to parliament.uk
Just a brief aside:-
Q. What have Haiti, Senegal, Zimbabwe and Liberia got in common with the UK?
A. Not a lot. These countries have better long-term prospects.
Cameron & Osborne are not doing a proper repair job on the UK but merely covering the holes with masking tape. The UK economy continues to be set up by the Tories for a quick kill for themselves and all their friends in the neo-Liberal Club, leaving a massive, crippling, long-term debt and all the assets owned by foreign investors. It’s like a giant PFI.
Or, to put it another way, imagine in your will you leave what little you have left to your children and grandchildren, but then at the end you mention the spent nuclear reactor in the basement which has to be decommissioned.
Who says so? – the World Economic Forum, via the following link:- uk.businessinsider.com
There is only one escape route – Independence. And we don’t have a lot of time left before the good ship rUK goes under.
It is mind blowingly incredible how the UK electorate and the No voters, put their faith in the Tory Spivs, the biggest con-men ever to be put in charge of governing the UK.
I’m struggling to see moral or criminal behaviour here on the part of MT.
A person wants to sell their house – an offer is made (without pressure) and they accept.
Buyer 1 sees that with a lick of paint, a few new slates and some fresh coffee – the house would be worth almost double the £65,000 he paid for it. He contacts his friendly Property Developer (clues in the name).
Property Developer also see’s the potential, a price is agreed, £30, 000 over the initial price paid.
Buyer 1 says if I help you find more properties like this and if I invest in this project to the tune of almost £30,000, you could cut me in on profit of selling this house on once its done up.
This is a private contract. Nothing illegal there that I can see.
Ah but! Property Developer may be using borrowed money, and if the value of the house is collateral for the loan, Property Developer ‘may’ be actively misleading the lender.
Well yes, and this would be a problem if the PD had no intention of ever repaying the loan in the first place and intended to bail out at the first hint of trouble. Its just that with a portfolio of 13 similar business/property developments, its likely Property Developer has by now, quite a good business relationship with their lender, and is paying back the mortgage as per the contract. If they weren’t, they wouldn’t have got 13 mortgages in the first place – credit checks and all that.
In order for the PD to stay in business and make a profit – they now have a property that has cost £95,000, which if as a Mortgage will have to be paid back. It will now have to be sold for a considerable amount over that – probably by spending the £30,000 on renovations.
And what about the Solicitor – well, if you used a Solicitor and found them reliable, wouldn’t you recommend them to a someone, particularly if that person was a friend/partner/business associate. Since when was it the job of members of the public – including business people to become experts in the professional rules and regulations of Solicitors? That’s sort of why Solicitors regulate themselves as a body wouldn’t you say.
Fraud’s are notoriously difficult to define legally – there are so many permutations – but you still need a clear intent to ‘defraud’/ get some kind of gain out of a person or body of ‘something’. If the Mortgage repayments are being honoured I can’t see that a fraud has been committed or attempted.
Now if you look at the inflated housing market in London, and the housing benefits paid out to friends of Conservatives who happen to be Landlords there, or if you look at the sell off of the Military Housing to OinkyLovers pal, which was then immediately contracted back out to the house the Military (see Chunky Mark), well then the words Fraud, Sharp Practice, Unethical Moral Behaviour all spring to mind.
T in the Park brings millions in revenue to the Tayside area. It is definitely an investment. Kind of thing a Government should be supporting.
Cheerie the noo. Dinnae let the bampots get ye doon.
One thing that confuses me slightly is that there was a press release from the LSoS claiming that the investigation into his behaviour which led to his being struck of was a “prosecution”. Is that actually the correct word to use or a misrepresentation implying he was guilty of a criminal act. If the later was it deliberate.
Not saying that he isn’t actually guilty of breaking the law which is why the police have been called in and would be for the courts to decide if they find evidence to convict. As to the buying low and selling high in 2010 it’s worth mentioning that the reporting is that if the property portfolio is as high as is being mentioned then Thomson and her partner have yet to realise any profit from those properties. I’d assume they must be being rented out.
It’s also worth mentioning that 2010 was after the crash and the incoming coalition fucking the market even more than before. The harsh reality was that vulnerable people were being forced to sell by the actions of the previous Labour government and the LibCon. The option was sell and downsize or rent. The market was slow or non existent.
IMHO after trying to understand today’s coordinated attack by apparently organised unionist, EBC, STV, MSM AND ALL THE ENGLISH STATE SERVICES.
For consideration: Carmichale is giving the Establishment a very difficult problem, how do they let him off with all the exposure he and the case is subjected to, And allow it to quietly dissipate?
Is Mundell involved in the Carmichale debacle, as I believe they shared an office during the run up to the referendum, not very private!
Ruthie baby was admonished today of any wrong doing regards postal votes at the referendum?
The Labour Party would rather have a low profile at the moment until Corbyn stops saying he wouldn’t press the button under any circumstances. Thank the Lord. So why have a button you will never use. Cost £100Billion.
The state services are as usual creating non existent trouble for the EBC MSM etc to foam at the
mouth, about try and put Independence supporters and SG on the back foot while they practice their dark arts, or shoot someone if that’s what’s needed by the spooks.
@ken500
If Andy Murray doesn’t appear in the ATP final. He is over. That’s the third year he failed to appear and disappointed folk. After the Jamboree racket at the Emirates stadium.
Are you talking about the folk who booed him in 2012?
link to theguardian.com
MT’s coat’s looks to be on a shoogly peg here.
She has been involved in 13 deals where her solicitor has been thrown out of his profession for allowing activity that could allow fraud to happen. We will find out if there has been fraud in due course, but she could lose her business and end up with criminal charges of this is the case. Dispite what is stated above, decisions to lend and LTV are calculated on sale price, not valuation.
Personally as a former financial services professional, she should also be aware of the appropriate manner to treat customers in vulnerable situations. This is more of a moral than a legal issue, but for an MP probably more damaging than the white collar crime element of this accusation.
The SNP and NS are right to distance themselves from her until this is sorted, as it feels pretty grubby.
@manandboy
Yes but independence has to mean monetary independence and not a currency union with the uk treasury. Under the latter scotland wouldn’t fare much better unfortunately.
sensibledave says:
30 September, 2015 at 8:21 pm
To Paula Rose & Tinto Chief
THANK YOU!
To Iain & John King
.. it may take you longer, but you are going to grow to love me.
I’d love it if you could tell everyone why this farce union needs to be defenderised by the biggest pack of bullshitters in the English speaking world sensible?
Love you.
@Dave McEwan Hill @Robert Louis
Smith undelivered can be the reason for Indy Ref 2, and the cause for support for YES increasing meantime, that’s its main importance for Indy supporters.
Indy support + More Powers support = 66%. If More powers are not delivered, than that’s a load of the more powers / devo-max supporters potentially moving over to Indy.
The 2015 Scotland Bill is expected to become law (at least in the UK parliament) before the Holyrood elections.
As Papadox hints (I think) , was all this nonsense today really about deflecting Ruthie Tank Commander’s absolution from self-confessed incrimination?
It’s a mad, mad, mad, UKOK world.
Unfortunately, we’re still attached to it.
O/T
Have any of you received yet another register to vote thing? This must be my third in the last three or four months (OK the first had the wrong name but still)
Don’t forget folks that the BBC has a long history of editing videos and audio recordings so large pinches of salt required when indulging in their shenanigans.
It’s not as if she’s a serial firestarter or anything is she?Imagine that eh?
Top trolling by the usual suspects …quality.
Corbyn talking pish around the “nuclear deterrent”.The liebour party are seriously deluded.
I think she said she hadn’t done anything illegal, whereas you might have expected her to say she hadn’t done anything wrong. This worries me because it could mean that she has done something morally wrong and the press will have a field day on that.
The Labour Party would rather have a low profile at the moment until Corbyn stops saying he wouldn’t press the button under any circumstances.
JC is telling England they will have Trident 2, so why the confusion over JC pushing the button?
“Jeremy Corbyn has told ITV News he will have to “live with, somehow” a decision to renew Britain’s nuclear Trident if it is what his party chooses.
“The new Labour leader – who has consistently voiced his opposition to Trident – said he would do his best to persuade his party that the £100 billion-weapons system should be scrapped.
“My views on nuclear weapons are very well known – I have a strong moral objection to nuclear weapons,” he told Tom Bradby.
“If I can persuade the whole of the Labour Party to come round to my point of view, I would be very, very happy indeed. I will do my best.”
But pressed on whether he would concede defeat on the issue, Mr Corbyn said: “If I can’t, we’ll live with it somehow.”
link to itv.com
All here. “Strong moral objection but…”
Daisy Walker@10pm.
Like yourself, I cannot see what the problem is.
We sold a house in Edinburgh 20 odd years ago, the market was quiet at the time, the couple who bought the house made about £30,000 profit six months later, when the market picked up.
Yes I was a bit miffed at the time, but hey ho you just get on with it.
I am sure the EBC Scotch-shire branch will keep this non story going for a few more days.
Then we will get
“Nicola Sturgeon ate my pet hamster” says reliable, honest source Ian Murray.
Or something just as pathetic.
yesindyref2 says:
30 September, 2015 at 10:15 pm
@Dave McEwan Hill @Robert Louis
Smith undelivered can be the reason for Indy Ref 2, and the cause for support for YES increasing meantime, that’s its main importance for Indy supporters.
To be honest YES there are quite a few options that could trigger another referendum thingy in my view.
1) non delivery of Smith Commission
2) Trident
3) removal of powers from Holyrood
4) feet on the ground in Syria
5) WM deciding that oil companies can frack below 300 metres without notification or applying for permission.
link to archive.is
Just to name a few. 😉 😀
O/T on the subject of a future Scottish constitution.
Lesley-Anne and yesindyref2, I have incorporated your posts into an initial page to which I hope people will contribute and together we will all write a Scottish constitution.
I have created a page on a website I have, actually related to an issue as far removed from Scottish constitutional matters as you can think (a reference guide to Russian art), but it is all I have at the moment!
You can follow the link, which tells people how they can contribute. It will probably take time to get going and I will troll sites such as this whenever the “constitution” theme arises:
link to rusartnet.com
The question at the heart of this affair seems to be how you can spot a dodgy lawyer without knowing the law backwards yourself?
You employ a lawyer who offers you a way to save money – whether on tax, property deals, inheritance or what have you.
Do you check every last legal detail – or do you take the lawyer on trust, because…well, lawyers are expected to be trustworthy?
Maybe Michelle Thomson should have smelled a rat. With every apparently good deal it’s always worth asking where the catch is. But I think most of us would have just gone along with the proposal – because lawyers are not generally expected to be acting illegally.
@ John D aka Ecosse-Nkosi
Oops, meant to say (at 2.30), posts started to not appear right away about TWO weeks ago.
Sorry YES I left one other example of what may very well cause the indy ref 2 … a NO vote in Hambone’s E.U. in/out referendum whenever in the next millennium the Baconiser decides to hold it. 😀
I’ll jump over and give your site a quick once over Kenny. 😉
KOF
Thank you for that info-very interesting. I can’t really see her supporting arms exports yet we all know it’s big business for WM & Porkie in particular with Saudis as the main customer. Very interesting indeed 😉
Another couple of bullshitters put that Sturgeon accused/denies boot in again, with usual sneaky/creepy The Graun word choose too-
link to theguardian.com
This lot really going big on their “you hate corrupt Sturgeon don’t you Scotland region” but I keep getting message below with adblock on rancid’s daily monstering of everything Scotland, except the lovely scenery.
Hope they all go bust like the Hootsman:D
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@Kenny
I think the Constitution should be about us, the People, our rights to be Sovereign, our Claim of Right, our right to control our politicians, not the other way around. Our right to Law.
Apart from things like that, I don’t think there should be any politics in it at all. One political party might want nukes, 20% of GDP spent on defence, conscription, tanks at every street corner, armadas threatening the trade routes of the universe while extorting a 10% tariff for safe passage, while another might want neutrality and a defence budget of £10,000 a year, if that, mainly to keep off deranged pirates. The Constitution should be equally applicable to both. For me the right place for politics is Parliament, not Constitution.
As such it would probably be quite small in length, but powerful in impact.
@kininvie
“I think most of us would have just gone along with the proposal – because lawyers are not generally expected to be acting illegally.”
Spot on. You take their advice.
I fairly recently bought a property where I was told if I did it a certain way it would save me a few hundred pounds. I couldn’t see how it would and rejected it but the solicitor was insistent so I relented simply because I did not understand the machinations.
Still think I will actually be worse off in the long run but these things are complex and your rely on your solicitor.
Far do I want to be the guy who brought Diet Coke to the party and sat in the corner all night being a pain in the ass.
But if the allegations are correct, this girl’s done like last night’s dinner.
It’s not the price of the properties that’s the issue.
But what drove them up. Apparently not market forces.
And the self dealing that reportedly drove it. That’s surely the crime.
What’s most bewildering is why the unnamed mortgage companies have stayed so quiet and undetected.
Surely there are civil court actions around trying to recover the loot lend on allegedly faked property evaluations.
Of course this thing was likely planted. Scottish MSM jurnos are intensely lazy.
But better it come out now than in the middle of the campaign so it can get done and dusted by the SNP War Room. If someone can wake them up.
When this becomes obvious the SNP brainstrust will dump Michelle like a sack of Stu’s well-seasoned kitty litter.
All that’s left is for WM to set the by-election date.
You heard it here first.
@kininvie
That might be at the heart of it indeed, blind trust in a professional she was paying for advice.
@Lesley-Anne
Yes, I think we’re spoiled for choice. And even if Smith is delivered absolutely in full, there have been several evaluations which show it damages Scotland, so the Scottish Government might have to “reluctantly” reject it.
@AlbertaScot
It wouldn’t surprise me.
As Lochside said at 8.42 and others have said this is quite obviously an orchestrated propaganda exercise.
The Alan Wylie and Tom posts early on in the thread mention morals and that is whole line of attack as the Britnats know that immorality is their achilles heel,what with war crimes,paeodo rings and Trident etc.
Given that they have been sitting on the story for a year,they just waited till they could get maximum impact from the’Storm in a teacup’story ( cheers SDave).
Coming on the back of Corbyns Labour resurection speech with his ‘flags dont build houses’ nonsense,I can see why they chose this particular attack at this time.Whoever fed him with the old 80s speech probably fed him the flags tag line as well to fit in with the housing purchase theme of the MT attack.
Im sure M15 think Corbyns da man as far as Scotland is concerned.
@Cuilean
“Anyway, you are making a lot of assumptions in ignorance of the facts.”
I think we’re talking cross-purposes. I agree, £64,000 may have been a fair price in difficult market conditions. I don’t believe her motive was to take advantage of a vulnerable seller.
But I do have trouble understanding why MT would pay her business partner an extra £30k in a back-to-back transaction, and then why he would in turn reimburse her almost the same amount. And why is this pattern repeated many times.
Hales was found guilty of, among other things, failing to advise the lender that as a result of cash back arrangements, the loan sought by the purchaser was substantially greater than the total purchase price paid to the seller.
MH may well have been in the dark over his actions, and she may have been too busy to notice large sums of money appearing in her bank account after each transaction.
One things for sure, this is not going to blow over anytime soon, MSM are going to milk it, and in the meantime I think the SNP and NS are right to distances themselves.
Re a Scottish constitution
The Tories are ready to go with a British constitution.
A UK Bill of Rights.
Before it can be applied to Scotland it requires the consent of the Scottish parliament to repeal the Human Rights Act in Scotland.
After the next Holyrood election the SNP might be the largest party without an overall majority and run the country as a minority government, but when it comes to what will be a legally binding vote I expect a grand alliance of Unionist parties to prevail and give permission.
The Scottish public need to know before the next election what a UK Bill of Rights will mean for Scotland.
AlbertaScot at 11.12
You know nothing about the matter.
“If someone can wake them up.”
If someone can wake them up maybe they’ll get up to 60% in the polls and get an overall majority in the Scottish Parliament. Oh. They’ve got that already. And asleep too.
So many smartarses pop up here from time to time
From todays troll fest I conclude that whole Establishment is now very very scared of us. The question is why? It must be more than Carmichael alone. I think it is also very much tied to Catalonia, IndyRef2 and ultimately Independence.
They have now gone back to pre-IndyRef full smear and fear. It seems Labour must win the Scottish Elections. Is this why Corbyn has not been deposed already? The emphasis seems to be on smear this time as they used up all the fear tactics. Lots more concern trolls in evidence too. Do not be drawn in.
Divide and conquer seems to be alive and well. Questions of morality, rich (MT) against poor. Labour just spent days saying they are the champions of the poor. The right (SNP?) against the left (RISE?) and split the vote while Labour steps in?
This is getting very intense again. Do not let them manipulate you into splitting YES. Stand back, take a deep breath and look objectively at what is going on and try to see the bigger picture.
Whether MT did or did not do wrong will be sorted out in due course and is irrelevant. What they are trying to deflect us from is Independence. Labour have a new leader and have had their conference and are organising for the fight. Are we ready?
@dakk “Im sure M15 think Corbyns da man as far as Scotland is concerned.”
Bearing in mind he’s said he wouldn’t push the nuclear button if PM, I would say he’s their public enemy number 1, shades of the Cold War days of the 60s and 70s.
They’re probably going through the micfrofiche and piles of papers from their Labour party investigations at that time, trying to find the missing link between him and the communist party, and putting the newgen bugs in place … oh, they did that already.
Anyway, having renewed for a year, turning down the offer of a guaranteed 62.5 year lifespan from now for life membership, it occurs to me that with the huge rash of new members for the SNP, SSP, Greens, now is the time for all to encourage anyone they know to renew as well, if they took the annual one-off payment rather than direct debit.
‘twould be good if the SNP could get above that 120,000 …
@sensibledave says: 30 September, 2015 at 7:25 pm:
“Just for the record, and to demonstrate my fair mindedness, this sort of affair is something you will have to get used to, accept and just move on.”
Pish!
The day I accept the, “fair mindedness”, of such as you I will top myself. I consider no one guilty until they are at least found so in a court and even then it is subject to appeal. I’ve seen too many cases of miscarriage of justice in my time.
In this instance the lady being persecuted, and that is exactly what it is, is not even under investigation. This is plainly a United Kingdom Establishment Dirty Tricks project probably as part of instructions from the very top of that vile establishment. It is, in point of fact, exactly the sheer idiocy of such dirty tricks that will split asunder the United Kingdom.
Just heard Lord Falconer say he would certainly ‘press the button’ given the right circumstance. So then, a Brit WMD hurtling towards a country that is probably more than capable of a nuclear response. And here we all are getting hot and bothered about what exactly? Independence? If Lord Falconer has his way there won’t be anyone left to vote for. Does Her Madge have a fall-out bunker at Balmoral by any chance? Bet she has.
On the Michelle Thomson case. What concerns me is this: how is someone who owns multiple properties, worth a cool million or so, supposed to argue the case against austerity? Frankly, I’d rather have more Mhairi Black-types leading the charge.
link to caltonjock.com
Were they not working on a Scottish Constitution during the IndyRef campaign? Whatever happened to it?
Dave McEwan Hill
I was just thinking how people making a fast buck on the property market has been the dinner party conversation of choice for years in Edinburgh, discussions taking place between seasoned ‘pros’ while mere mortals listened in, enviously.
An entire television genre formed around the game. And the death star is the world capital of course.
Now all of a sudden we seem to be a nation of experts in property litigation or whatever. What a load of shite. I’ll leave the police to do their job.
It is impossible for me to make an informed judgement anyway as all the outlets running the story are completely discredited propagandists for whom honesty, integrity and impartiality are foreign, and very distant lands.
@Ealasaid and @Kenny
The SNP published a draft Constitution in June 2014 at:
link to gov.scot
A lot of good stuff, but also party political stuff.
@ Alberta Scot
“It’s not the price of the properties that’s the issue. But what drove them up. Apparently not market forces.”
I’d say that nothing drove the prices up, the price paid by the second buyer were about right. In Scotland we have to have a compulsory House Valuation Report, which must have valued the houses the same as or higher than that paid for them, or they would not have got a mortgage for that amount.
It’s not illegal to buy a house for the valuation amount. It’s also not illegal to offer a cash back once the sale is complete, lots of house builders/developers do it. I seem to remember some flats being sold in Canary Wharf in London had cash back of over 100K. What it was, was a cheap way of borrowing money to build a property portfolio.
FYI any house that’s sold in Scotland goes up on the Land Registry website 30 days after the sale. One of the original sellers probably saw their house had been sold again within a few weeks for 30K more and was a tad upset.
@heedtracker says: 30 September, 2015 at 3:50 pm:
“Lousy dodge there Colin. You must be a new unionist troll. “
New he is not, heedtracker, this guy is a well known quite inconsequential unionist idiot that’s been at this vile game for a considerable time. Always with some trumped up smear story and never to debate real political matters. Just like Wee Willie Rennie, Jackie Baillie and other unionist trash.
@Tinderbox
“But I do have trouble understanding why MT would pay her business partner an extra £30k in a back-to-back transaction, and then why he would in turn reimburse her almost the same amount.”
She wouldn’t have paid her business partner, the mortgage company would have.
Dog Philosopher: What concerns me is this: how is someone who owns multiple properties, worth a cool million or so, supposed to argue the case against austerity?
Read that three times and it makes less sense each time.
yesindyref2 11.53
‘i would say hes their public enemy number 1’
That’s why I specified as far a Scotland is concerned.Remember English votes decides who becomes PM.Corbyn could win 100% of the vote in Scotland and still get nowhere near power.I thought we all knew that.
Just as it was Parliaments decision to invade Iraq and not bomb Syria,would it not be be Parliament’s decision to press the button,not Jeremy Corbyn’s ?
Moreover, it will be the US Commander In Chief who will decide if the Red Button even works when pressed 🙂
A great day for paradox.
We got Captain Corbyn telling his jolly Union Jack tars they can have a free vote on Trident, adding, “Oh, and by the way, I will never push the button”.
Shock and consternation from assembled vitamin C starved crew. What? You’ll never wipe out entire civilisations?! But that’s the whole purpose of having a nuclear bomb.
And you’ve just undermined our vote! Boo hoo!
Loving it.
yesindyref2
Corbyn may have said he wont push the button.Tony Blair said he would have an ethical foreign policy.
What Labour tell the gullible lefties in UK, and what they do if elected are not the same.
i dont believe a word he says.
Albertascot: You heard it here first.
Not really. The kind of, let’s hang ’em now, garbage you posted is par for the course in these events.
Strange thing is, the police investigating the affair say (so far) they are not planning to question Ms. Thomson. That renders your little theory somewhat holed amidships.
@Jim McIntosh
“She wouldn’t have paid her business partner, the mortgage company would have.”
No, she paid her business partner. The mortgage company lent her the money in order to do so. If this all falls down around her, it will be because the mortgage lenders are feeling screwed over and decide to pull their loans.
Tinderbox,
yes, it does not seem very bright to buy a property which is only worth £64K for £95K.
But this was a private deal, between two business partners. As connected business persons there could be any number of business reasons for partners so acting, which are perfectly legitimate business transactions: tax reasons, business accounts adjustments, share distribution adjustments, quid pro quo partnership agreements, partnership liquidity regulations. The possible legitimate (i.e. non-criminal) business reasons are endless.
Until all the facts are known you are simply jumping to conclusions, which, I must gently convey to you, may be very wrong conclusions.
If any ‘fraud’ has been committed, then the Crown Office will prosecute. As far as the press states that is not the case.
Tinderbox: No, she paid her business partner.
In my vocation I get documents and agreements stuck under my nose on a regular basis – if my lawyer says all is okay, my rights protected, I sign. If he’s not there to give that trusted advice I never sign.
@galamcennalath says: 30 September, 2015 at 5:59 pm:
” … Basically, we have been getting this shite thrown at us for at least three years now!”
Eh! You must be one of the newer guys, galamcennalath.
One of the founding fathers of the SNP, Arthur Donaldson, was monstered from the very start of the Scottish National Party.
link to edinphoto.org.uk
Go google them by name and get yer hair curled for free.
It’s good to see some of the guys are finally getting the big picture here.
It’s all about keeping your eye on the prize. That would be the Big I.
Michelle is totally expendable and is about to become a huge distraction.
Hey, and I see some fellows are still getting on my case about Sleepy Hollow – the semi-comatose SNP “media centre.”
Wednesday with all the Jezza/Michelle/Kezza/MSM media bullfeathers coming down the pipe, the lads managed to put up exactly zero (0), nil, nada press releases.
Nothing on Twitter either except something totally irrelevant about student visas.
I rest my case, yer lordship.
AlbertaScot: Michelle is totally expendable and is about to become a huge distraction.
Don’tcha just admire Alberta’s loyalty.
As for the rest of the post, it’s too late to call an interpreter.
@dakk “Just as it was Parliaments decision to invade Iraq and not bomb Syria,would it not be be Parliament’s decision to press the button,not Jeremy Corbyn’s ?”
No, it’s the royal prerogative passed to the Prime Minister (and Cabinet) to do a lot of things without having to consult Parliament first, like war and deployment of troops.
In the case of Syria, Cameron chose to put it to Parliament, but he didn’t have to.
I’ve enjoyed all the posts and often laughed hilariously, nice to see a few new trolls. I thought though I might point out out a few observations in my reading.
1. Michelle Thomson is not being investigated by anyone.
2. Innocent until proven guilty.
3. There have been other notable “headlines” this week that barely made page 5, column 3 bottom right in our MSM:
“Lib Dem MP Alistair Carmichael to face questions in election court”
“Ruth Davidson electoral law probe finds no criminality”
“Labour will not debate Trident”
“I won’t sue Ashcroft over ‘Pig-gate’ because I’m too busy running the country, says David Cameron”
I’m sure that there are many many more.
Deflection, pure and simple. Our rulers want us to be discussing Michelle Thomson rather than the real scandals.
Where the fuck is the Chilcot report? Where are the prosecutions in the historical sex abuse scandals involving all those MP’s and Lords.
Let’s not take our eye off the ball, the Michelle Thomson crap is a storm in a teacup compared to that lot.
These bastards literally get away with murder.
The motivation of the coordinated unionist attack on Michelle is very obvious. We must not let them divide us. There is no suggestion from the police that she broke the law, and everybody should support Michelle. You can be sure they will have their plans for further SNP targets.
Good luck to the pro-independence parties and to all the independent candidates in today’s local By-elections.
link to scottishelections.org.uk
They cannot divide that which in a sense is non-political.
Independence for Scotland is not about politics or nationalism. It is a belief that we can do better and will do so by governing ourselves.
For me, it is all about freedom of choice. The Tories offer No choice and are loathed by the vast majority in Scotland.
We have little choice. Yet, they inevitably govern us,
@Thepnr
Couldn’t agree more.
We want to change politics as it is practiced today? Politics by soundbite? The politics of party and state compromised media manipulation?
Then we need to change our system of government. The people need to set the rules of conduct and the best way to do that is a written constitution setting the framework for our politics.
“We must not let them divide us.”
At the moment, “us” is 50%, we need another 5-10% to get Indy Ref 2, and then Indy.
Meanwhile I think we should be looking for what we have in common with as many as possible of the NO voters, particularly the relatively undecided ones, and communicating openly and in a non-hostile way in that common ground.
Never heard of Chilcot?
Read it and weep because these are our Imperial Masters personified.
Not surprised that they don’t want to release the report which is obviously full of witness statements.
The MSM will be all over this any day soon I’m sure. Doh!
Committee members
The committee of inquiry, the members of which were chosen by Gordon Brown, comprises}
Sir John Chilcot (chairman), a career diplomat and senior civil servant who was previously a member of the Butler Review
Sir Lawrence Freedman, a military historian, and Professor of War Studies at King’s College London. His memo outlining five tests for military intervention was used by Tony Blair in drafting his Chicago foreign policy speech.
Sir Martin Gilbert, (died 3 February 2015) a historian who supported the invasion of Iraq and claimed in 2004 that George W. Bush and Blair may one day “join the ranks of Roosevelt and Churchill”
Sir Roderic Lyne, former Ambassador to Russia and to the United Nations in Geneva, previously served as private secretary to Prime Minister John Major
Baroness Prashar, a crossbencher, member of the Joint Committee on Human Rights, and the current chairwoman of the Judicial Appointments Commission
The committee also takes secretarial support during proceedings from Margaret Aldred.
Which Sir represents the Establishment then LOL
Handandshrimp says
“Have any of you received yet another register to vote thing”
Yep
I got one a few days ago, calling itself a “reminder” going on to suggest I had not responded to a previous correspondence (WHICH I DID NOT GET) asking me to yet again register to vote,
just what the hell are they up to?
__________________________________________________________
AlbertaScot says
“Michelle is totally expendable and is about to become a huge distraction.”
Yea because we can get more friends eh?
We stick by her end of,
she is not accused of anything,
“Hey, and I see some fellows are still getting on my case about Sleepy Hollow – the semi-comatose SNP “media centre.”
Says the man from Foggy Bottom!
The folk who booed Andy Murray were the Continentals, French/Spanish supporters. They tend to be loud and more excitable in general – culture. The ‘British’ reserve. They still don’t make as much racket as the orchestrated Emirate jamboree. They would be chucked out.
The orchestrated din at the Emirates was detracting, unsportsmanlike for the visiting players and for those wanting to concentrate on the Game. No sense of gamesmanship. It’s only a Game. Not X factor – some wannabees trying to get on TV.
Andy can be frustrating at time, even for major supporters who pay to watch the sport. It should be proportionate. It was great the Davis Cup was held in Glasgow, twice. It made it much easier for supporters. The UK are mad for Tennis.
@Yesindyref2
“Meanwhile I think we should be looking for what we have in common with as many as possible of the NO voters, particularly the relatively undecided ones, and communicating openly and in a non-hostile way in that common ground.”
Absolutely. This is why I tend to engage on issues in a non-political way. For example, asking people why they think there is so much private debt. How they think money works in the economy; Explaining the link between private debt and the government’s spending (in simple terms); laying bare how much of a mess the economy is and why it’s entirely avoidable.
Dropping little nuggets into conversation about the BBC board of trustees; who owns the mainstream press etc.
zero ref to Indy or SNP.
All this while you have commonweal rolling out its book of ideas and people are innovating up here on currency etc.
You have to be showing people what’s wrong with the way things are in a non-confrontational way. Then you have to demonstrate what’s actually being done – here, now.
The infrastructure and means have to be in place so that the decision on independence becomes common sense.
I’ve had a long hard think(maybe drink)my fav option now, is a Federal Union
hated by nationalists & unionists
Nicola Sturgeon by far is the best for Scotland
If anyone can deliver a Federal Union,it’s the FM
a lot of good people on here and brilliant contributions thx
I now see both camps, each have strong/weak positions
all the best
A federal union, like devo max is never going to happen.
Bookie from Hell
“I’ve had a long hard think(maybe drink)my fav option now, is a Federal Union”
Not a chance
we cant allow another country to dictate foreign and defence policies to us,
independence makes sure no more Scottish boys and girls will die in wars not of OUR choosing,
nor should we allow a foreign policy which is against our interests to be dictated by a country who’s outlook is SO different from ours, eg immigration.
O/T links
link to news.scotland.gov.uk
link to pensionsworld.co.uk
link to lallandspeatworrier.blogspot.co.uk
link to ponsonbypost.com
link to oilandgaspeople.com
O/T links
link to iainmacwhirter.wordpress.com
link to scriptonitedaily.com
Ex-Tory Lord Hanningfield charged with expenses fraud
link to archive.is
link to politico.eu
What has party political point scoring got to do with Holyrood’s FMQs?
I don’t remember Scottish Parliament discussing the Eric Joyce, Jim Devine or Nigel Griffiths scandals.
Double standards of the imperialists in press and TV who failed to ask any searching questions as to who knew what when in the Labour Party regarding former Lord Provost Steven Purcell who was in charge of a multi million budget and the cops and drugs. Even when things came to a head and widely discussed in social media there was a BBC / MSM news blackout for over a week.
Where was the Scottish Parliament debate or press coverage of the activities of leading NO Scotland campaign major donor Vitel plc whose activities were far more heinous than any MPs failings?
Last week the Sunday Times revealed that Pat McFadden MP, shadow cabinet Minister for Europe, has claimed almost £22,000 from taxpayer for renting a second home in his Wolverhampton constituency despite owning a next door property and renting it out. He also owns a home in London valued at £1.2 million.
Where were the BBC TV reports or other newspapers front page headlines on that?
Double standards all round.
Federalism is the kind of home rule the Liberals supported because they know it will never happen.
It’s like saying you want to get rid of nuclear weapons but are a multilateralist.
Bookie from Hell, nope. It’s well past the stage of devo max, federal union or whatever you want to call it. It has to be independence, only way to go. Then all the decisions are ours. End of.
By the way, I see that we lucky souls in jockistan, are being graced with the presence of Mr Corbyn today. Apparantly he is coming to win voters back to Labour.
Good luck with that son.
@Tinderbox
Perhaps another reason she paid her business partner the whole amount, is because paying the buyer 30K less would have been fraud against the mortgage company, paying the full amount and getting 30K cash back wouldn’t.
Ends up as cheap money from the bank to either renovate the property or more likely to be used as a deposit for the next purchase.
@ John King Im on my second register to vote John ,Im checking the reg num Nth Lanarkshire council.
@Robert Peffers
New he is not, heedtracker, this guy is a well known quite inconsequential unionist idiot that’s been at this vile game for a considerable time. Always with some trumped up smear story and never to debate real political matters.
Ahhh, you’ve got me there eh. It’s true, I don’t debate the “real political matters” that you raise such as “It all started with the Romans”.
@ bookie from hell I weil get the Fedrel onion it run past the Smith Commission er Naw, dont dilute Full Independence your doing the Onionists job.
Let’s talk about an actual disgraced politician.
PravdaSound4 continuing the rehabilitation of Malcolm Rifkind by asking him to comment on the Russian position in Syria, which he says is “dishonest”. Every time I hear his smarmy, strangulated vowels I have to throw something at the radio.
I have a stack of polystyrene bricks for this purpose.
It’s mad, mad, mad, mad, mad, UKOKian world.
I’m a Scot, get me out of here.
@Bookie from Hell
A Federal Union? What you mean like FFA? Which is after all the very definition of Home Rule.
Scotland Bill amendments vote on FFA was I recall, 508 votes against and 56 for. Or do you mean Federal Broon’s near Federalism which he personally guaranteed delivery of? That being the one the Daily Record and pretty much most of the media called the ‘Vow’ and sold as Devo Max. The one which has now disappeared off the radar entirely.
weegingerdug.wordpress.com/2015/09/28/altered-state/
There is only one union possible bookie and that is a confederation, which will require an independent Scotland. Westminster will not ever release power willingly or through reasoned settlement and a sense of ‘fair play’. If they have made anything crystal clear in the past two years, its that the ‘Federal solution’ is not on their to do list.
Too good a link to get wrong.
link to weegingerdug.wordpress.com
o/t links
link to pensionsworld.co.uk
link to lallandspeatworrier.blogspot.co.uk
link to ponsonbypost.com
link to oilandgaspeople.com
Corbyn wont press the Nuclear button if he,s PM. MSM all over a non story Cadbury,s wouldnt invite him to press the start button on the Choclate Button machine & their Onionists, Oh how the MSM deceive the People.
One minute I believe there is a grand conspiracy. The multi front assault of the last few days has to have been coordinated, surely.
Then I read this, posted by Nana Smith
link to iainmacwhirter.wordpress.com
A good appraisal of Labour’s motorway pile up regarding Scotland.
The next best chance to thwart Indy is to deny the SNP a majority next May. Labour will have to play a central role. They should be getting their act together on Scotland.
So, if there is a coordinated Unionist front, then no one told Labour! Their state of chaos and disorganisation at such a critical moment doesn’t exactly fit with grand conspiracies!
Beware of Red/Blue Tories Bearing Gifts
I watch open mouthed at the latest attempt of the Red Tories to launch an attack on Scotland….The Wooden Horse of Corbyn.
The people of Scotland are now the masters of joined up thinking (much to the dismay of the BBC and MSM) and are not fooled.
The SNP in Holyrood is the best thing that could have happened to Scotland,they have earned our trust by hard work and honest politics.
We have zero tolerance for liars,lurid headlines or unbalanced reporting,we know that small doses of poison delivered on am almost daily basis has worked for the UKOK in the past,we also know the SNP is the antidote,they are on borrowed time….and they know it.
O/T – postie just delivered my first copy of iScot magazine.
I thought I would share some feedback from the Labour conference.
I have a friend who is an activist in an English constituency and actually made a speech.
I’ll keep the identity of the activist secret for obvious reasons.
The feedback is interesting;
There was open dissent against Corbyn with calls from the floor voicing disapproval.
Many various groups were gathering together to discuss opposition to Corbyn.
There were also groups within groups. How coordinated these opposition groups are was not obvious, nor was their ability to pull together and organise anything more than just vocal opposition to Corbyn.
But opposition was clearly in evidence.
The Burnham camp were one of those groups joining together to discuss opposition to Corbyn, which is potentially damaging when you consider that Burnham has agreed to join the Shadow Cabinet.
Burham supporters, my friend being one of them, have absolutely no confidence in Corbyn. They don’t rate him as a politician, as a leader, they think his ideas are sheer lunacy and won’t work.
The general feeling was one of chaos fuelled in part by the encouragement from Corbyn to allow differences to be aired. This just led to a complete free for all and the conference sounds more like a Scout jamboree than a serous coming together of a major political party.
There was an example of a social gathering later in the evening where Tory supporters turned up and toasted the Labour people present with champagne with “Thanks for the next 10 years in government that you’ve given us!”
Labour activists, at least in England, are not brimming with confidence.
Macart says
” If they have made anything crystal clear in the past two years, its that the ‘Federal solution’ is not on their to do list.”
That is a huge step forward in my opinion.
Not that I’m actually aversed to FFA/Home Rule, it would have been a good intermediate step. The problem is that is has been very popular BUT as you say, will never be delivered.
The Achilles Heel of Indy has been FFA/Home Rule. Cameron knew, used it, and abused it.
If it becomes crystal clear, once and for always, that FFA/Home Rule is not on offer then Indyref2 will be a straight choice between DevoNotMuch and Indy. That puts us in a MUCH stronger position.
The icing on the cake will be is the next Scotland Act is an obvious poisoned chalice and is rejected by Holyrood. Then it’s DevoAsIs versus Indy.
I’m not so supportive of Michelle. This was a well known tactic in the mid-00’s to drive up the value of property assets on the balance sheet of small property investors and was one of the core reasons for the crash in the Mortgage Backed Securities market in mid-08 that eventually led to the banking collapse.
This was used by buy-to-let investors (mostly in the USA to be honest, but also the UK) to borrow more and more and so were basically defrauding the mortgage lenders so that the asset value to loan value was much steeper than the banks risk teams realised.
There was a case in Nottingham where a new development of flats was sold more than 4 times (I think some were up to 6 times) on one day before the first “owners” moved in. The new “owners” moving in had much more highly leveraged mortgages than they should have.
This is why there is now a “6 month rule” where a property being purchased (with a mortgage) has to have been owned for 6 months or more before it can be bought.
Nana Smith: the Caledonian All-seeing Eye that Never Sleeps.
Thanks for the great links, and thanks to LPW and Messrs Ponsonby and MacWhirter (yes, well said, Iain) for some excellent analysis.
Just imagine if the MSM did this kind of stuff.
Come on, Harvey, bring your carrot. Time to go fishing.
I read a lot about changing politics, changing the minds of NO voters and sad to say I don’t see much mind changing from the negative side of the argument, if anything I’m seeing more entrenchment in the NO camp
For some reason much of the NO side seems to be fighting this battle from a sectarian or perceived class distinction view
And it’s a strange thing to behold when for example you have two diametrically opposed sides seemingly wanting the same outcome but for entirely different reasons
On the one hand you have the football argument which for Rangers Football Club would appear to be (wrongly)that the Independence lot are all Catholics so we hate them that’s it vote NO
You have however Celtic Football Club who’s desire to be in a British League would leave them stranded in rotten old Scotland and they wouldn’t get to play with the big boys so vote NO
Rangers also would like to be pals with England for the same reason, except, much though Dermot Desmond of Celtic would like this to happen, it won’t, both Football Clubs have been told countless times by the Big Real English Football League, Naw, sod off we don’t want you under any circumstances,
But still they hold out hope and certainty they will somehow change the minds of that country’s Footballing authorities,
Which brings me to the class war aspect of the vote
Some folk consider themselves of better social standing than others or financially more secure which leads them to the mistaken conclusion that only (mostly) poor people want Independence (fur the benefits)because the wealth of the country is created by them and them alone and poor people take and don’t contribute
And I suppose when you look at it through their point of distorted mirror view it must seem right
So how do you convince Two Million People that another Two Million People who hold the opposite view are right and they are wrong when you can’t elevate the question beyond
Proddy’s and Kafflicks or I live in Bishopbriggs and I live in Possilpark
I’ve used Glasgow areas to show the difference but the same applies in every town
@galamcennalath
Yeah, they didn’t just rule it out, they used it, abused it as a campaign strategy and then overwhelmingly crushed it in commons vote.
Anyone out there who still thinks we’re on Johann’s ‘devolution journey’ really has to have a serious re think.
O/T
Lord charged with fraud says he was ‘surprised’ by decision to prosecute The CPS claims Lord Hanningfield pocketed allowances for attending the House of Lords for 11 days when he wasn’t entitled to the money.
No mention of this on BBC I wonder why.
Michelle Thomson.Not charged but all over the BBC what a shower of barstewards they are.
I just noticed this morning when checking my email that the email from the Herald has the subject as
SNP MP Michelle Thomson suspended from party as police launch inquiry into property deals and more news
Whereas the National has:
Here are The National’s latest headlines for Tuesday, 29th September 2015
I don’t know what The Scotsman do re spreading their message but I might subscribe just to see what headlines pop into my email.
I’m wondering if more people read these newspaper headlines in their email box than any other means.
I expect this has already been covered by Wings and I’m way behind but you know what they say ‘better late than never’
Oh and on the Macwhirter Link?
Chaos doesn’t begin to describe the problem they have in electability. To all intents and purposes Mr Corbyn’s party has voted to retain Trident, their leader has told the world he couldn’t press the button.
As laudable a personal position as that is, it not only makes expenditure on Trident instantly redundant and repugnant, but the UK a world laughing stock politically.
Its one or the other, black or white. Vote to ditch the damn things and make sure you have a conventional military fit for purpose, or keep them and have the world willing to believe you’d use them if you have to.
Not a great start for new/old Labour, has to be said.
@Tinto Chiel
“All-seeing Eye that Never Sleeps”
not terribly well right now as I’ve done my back in. It must have been the ‘all night dancing’ that did it.
I wish, oh to be young again! I swear the last few years have aged not just my body but my tired mind.
Yesindyref2 1.46
‘Its the royal prerogative passed to the Prime Minister’
Fair enough on that point,but as regards Jeremy being a weapon to be used against Scotland,I already see it.
As far as Trident goes,the US will decide if it ever can even be discharged,not Jeremy.
@Nana
Steady Nana, you were warned about break dancin’ and all night raves.
You want a good stretching regime and plenty of fluids. We need you fit. 😉
Nana, you’re but a caileag yet. You were looking great when I met you in FS.
Now get back on that interwebthingy and bring home the bacon for us.
Oh, that’s so last week.
Dr Jim I wonder if people from Bishopbriggs also think being Scottish is a bit ‘common’NQOC. If Scotland became Independent they might be rejected by the upper echelons of British society even if they did go to private school.
It’s important what people in England think!
@Macart & Tinto Chiel
Now boys as I said to Ronnie “DO NOT MAKE ME LAUGH”
He was kind enough to offer me a loan of a corset and if this pain in the butt doesn’t get better I might have to take him up on that.
@ Macart 08:34 and everyone else.
Regards you link to the Altered State film on the decisive dominance of Main Stream media in the Referendum campaign.
Its clear that the BBC wont be devolved and the main stream newspapers remain solidly Unionist.
Paul Kavanagh sums up at the end of the film that if Ref 2 comes to pass, we will have the same result because of the decisiveness of the Main Stream Media.
We need a radio channel to get the message out over the airwaves. I don’t mean something that will churn out political dogma and wall to wall SNP cheerleading. What I mean is something that has a mix for everyone, music, chat, news.
I don’t know what the technical difficulties of this are, but on the money front, surely if Pirate Radio managed on a shoestring in the 1960s, we could all contribute something to get it going?
We all sit here typing away, whinging about Kay (with a bloody E), Union Jackie Bird, The Record, Scotsman et al. That isn’t going to change anything.
Before I go and take Macart’s advice re ‘plenty of fluids’ Hic’ here’s another wee link.
I hope slab are ready to open their cupboards up to the enquiry. I hear lots of skeletons rattling in there.
link to news.scotland.gov.uk
Corbyn in Scotland today, probably going to pop into Holyrood and support Kezia with the dodgy estate agent non-story which is ongoing.
A big build up to the event by the papers setting out their stall yesterday and BBC Scotland trailing the story this morning although big Brian trying his best to be ‘even handed’ but failing.
Sturgeon will do what she does so well when confronted by the ‘have you stopped beating your husband’ accusations, keep the heid and bat them into touch.
The main attack will be how the SNP vetting process is bad and how could they have missed this … because labour and the tories have never never been involved in selecting ‘unsuitable’ people.
Only the police enquiry into the struck off lawyer and the available evidence may lead to genuine consequences in the future until then it’s all speculation.
I notice that the SG enquiry into care abuse too slow says MSM and our tapestry is in the wrong place… good old Auntie.
No case to answer here.
link to archive.is
BBC cuts, leads to open wound: (wont archive)
Royal and Ancient ‘sad’ to see BBC go, Sky steps into breach a year early to cover the open at Troon.
PS:
By-election today Glenrothes West and Kinglassie fingers crossed.
I have met Michelle, she seems a pleasant woman and she worked hard for YES.
That said, if she is guilty of any misdemeanor she becomes a liability.
But it is not what happened in the past that really matters, it is how we deal with it in the present.
The french used to behead failed generals to “encourage the others”, and we should look at this as an opportunity to show the SNP’s zero tolerance to failure.
Note: it is only if she is guilty of some crime, but if she is, it is a chance to show our difference our honesty and our ability to clear corruption from our own.
In short we can profit from this debacle if handled well.
@ call me dave 9.51
. . . PS:
By-election today Glenrothes West and Kinglassie fingers crossed.
You bet! I’m just off to vote in GW&K!
Also, several By Elections today, if you have a vote, please, please, please, USE IT!
Tell the Hootsman, Retard, EBC, Corbyn and the rest what you really think of them
@dakk says: 1 October, 2015 at 12:29 am:
” … Just as it was Parliaments decision to invade Iraq and not bomb Syria,would it not be be Parliament’s decision to press the button,not Jeremy Corbyn’s ?”
And that is where you are wrong, dakk.
UK PM’s can indeed take the UK into a war on his/her say so without even asking parliament. In fact it is extremely hard for the Labour party to even change their leader after he is chosen.
Note how the majority of the labour party office holders are anti-Corbyn at this time but cannot get him out. This is one of the evil things about this de facto Parliament of England.
This is due to the three non-Scottish countries in the bipartite UK being subject to English law and English law is based upon them being a Constitutional Monarchy in which the Monarchy is legally still Sovereign but the Royal sovereignty powers pass to the Commons to exercise.
As the PM is able to act as a dictator and their party finds it is almost impossible to remove them from office they are effectively legally able to do as they like in the short term.
Scots law is far superior and is based upon the Declaration of Arbroath that states the people are sovereign and can remove the monarch if they deem the monarch unworthy, or in the case of the parliament throw them out. Scots MPs legally wield the people’s sovereignty but English, Welsh and Irish MPs wield the Monarch’s sovereignty. Westminster has always just ignored that little fact.
However, the de facto parliament of England has assumed, since at least the misnamed Union of the Crowns, that the English sovereign, (and thus Westminster), has full sovereignty over the Scots and thus Scotland’s parliament.
You can see this just now by David Mundell’s statement that HE won’t allow another referendum. However, Scottish Law is based upon the people being sovereign and no one can tell a sovereign people they cannot throw out a government they do not approve off.
Basically, if it ever comes down to this matter going to the International Courts, the International courts will have to rule that as the Scottish people are legally sovereign then it is their choice and no one else’s.
Remember that, no matter what the USA or UK said as to who should rule in the case of the Lockerbie Bomber trial, the international court said it was Scottish Law’s case as the crime fell under their independent jurisdiction.
The holding of the case in a foreign neutral country was a fudge agreed between the parties. If the Scots had dug their toes in there would haver been a fudge and we just may have had a more reasonable result. The only USA function at the trial should have been as called witnesses.
Michelle Thomson has committed no crime. Having a fraudulent lawyer is not s crime. Otherwise most of the population would be criminals. Many lawyers are fraudulent. Go to courts and tell lies to protect the criminals. Unionist politicians are criminals who use fraudulent lawyers to protect their crimes. Use the legal system ‘D’ notices to conceal their crimes. Where’s the Chilcot Verdict. 5 years late.
The Commons timetable is constructed so MP’s who are lawyers and businessmen can conduct business in the morning. The Commons main business has breaks in the day but can finish at 1 am. Not conducive to family life. Diana Abbot spent most of her time going shopping and having her hair done. Just being available for the vote. She wrote a diary. There is pairing cutting down on the time needed to be spent there.
All candidates should be vetted and voted for by members, not annointed from on high.
JC hits town,
Robertson: “But that was about – again – that was about the franchise, wasn’t it? Their argument is that in 1993, that was when ScotRail was privatised.”
Corbyn:
“The franchise, yes. But I do think they had a choice, and they could have exercised it to ensure that ScotRail remained – or, er turned, rather – into full public ownership. Surely that would be a much better way of doing things. And indeed the Labour policy, overall, is to return the franchises and the rail operating companies into public ownership, so that we all get the benefits of the rail service and the profits that go with it.”
So why didnt Crash Brown etc do that then JC?
Another UKOK bullshitter in action. 30 years of UKOK politicking and all they can come up with is just one another sneaky shit.
@ nana
If we were Irish we would have our own film board and make films about auld wifies renewing their youth!
link to thisisirishfilm.ie
The lenders make their own valuations. Banks/Building societies make independent assessment of valuation. They use their own surveyors or Charter Surveying Companies usually end less than 100% of valuation ( government guides) to control mortgage markets. Buy to Let rates % or doubtful collateral rates are higher. 80/90% of valuation.
@Scotspine
He also goes on to say that out of necessity we created our own media online and that we’re in a far better place than we were two years ago. He’s right on both counts.
Unfortunately this isn’t the sixties anymore and when you’re talking about funding any kind of broadcast media, be it TV or radio, you’re talking in terms of numbers that you find in telephone books. That’s beyond even a good crowd funding campaign of your wildest dreams. Ideally that takes people with real resources and infrastructure to make it work. The sort of people with serious cash and the will to invest. And that would only be for a modest venture.
The MSM isn’t about to collapse in our lifetime and Westminster will not devolve responsibility for broadcasting. We simply need to get creative with what we’ve helped create already and pump what funds we can into it, help it grow.
@Ruby
Definitely, I was trying to point out in as short a way as possible that folks perceptions of what is, is only through their own eyes and experience and not necessarily the truth
Although in terms of the Independence debate it’s completely irrelevant what people in Englands opinion is as that would be the business of Scotland should it hopefully become Independent
I have opinions about England but I’m quite positive my English relatives don’t lose any sleep over what they are, nor should they
Half my family are from the Midlands and they’re more concerned about my falling under the spell of the evil cult that is that terrible Sturgeon woman who rules Scotland with her hordes of flag waving thugs marauding the streets and terrorising the innocent
So what people think is a truth can be shaped by the powerful as well as the educated
We should know in Scotland, things are not always what they seem
It just seems everybody hasn’t got that yet
I have given this thought, and read the full ruling re the solicitor,and yes he should have been struck off, not least as he allowed “doing the best for his client” to manifest itself in failing to adequately disclose material facts to the lenders.
But re the MP? that’s a whole different kettle of fish! as what has been published cannot help anyone to make a call, for instance let’s take it as a given that all business people, myself included maximise profit, yes I have bought for £1 and sold for £2, I have even bought for £3 and sold for £8. and as commercial director in a previous job I aimed for 40 % GP, didn’t always get it, but to average I made hay when I could and buttoned up tight when I couldn’t.
Given that all property is theft, we start low on this as a moral argument, ALL people when buying a house want to buy cheap and sell high, (I have a property developer friend who when seeing a nice deal will offer 20% less than the asking price, cash that day, he rarely gets a deal, but using this has built up a good stock!) so let’s drop what was paid to who when, its silly, just as its silly to complain to the shops after you bought your christmas presents (12 weeks to go!!!) that run 50% off sales in January.
Oh and before I forget since when was a cashback deal so immoral? go on google cash back on your mortgage! the only concern from the mortgage company is the property valuation, or LTV, and guess what it’s not the solicitor who makes this assumption! And the bigger the mortgage the more you have to pay back!
So what about other MP,s from all parties who have property, or stocks or shares, are they obliged to buy only at a fair price, ie not to much profit? nonsense!
The SNP Gov asked permission to renationalise the ferry and rail contracts, take them back into Scottish public ownership. Westminster refused. That is why Scotland needs Home Rule/Independence.
The Scottish Gov already subsidises the ferry service £1Billion, an essential service. Already subsidise the rail contracts with £Millions (£Billions?) of public money.Under UK Gov givernance rules/laws. Edinburgh has subsidised cheap public transport. The transport services are still control in house but are funded by all taxpayers whose transport systems are privatised. The wealthiest City in Scotland.
A retired Edinburgh lawyer, minted, uses bus pass to get the bus from the airport (quicker) rather
than using the Trams. Edinburgh bus pass holders can use the trams for free. All other bus pass holders have to pay the concessionary fare. The Tram fares are 30% cheaper than the bus. Bus fare to Airport return £12 – Tram fare – £8. Yet they are supposed to be getting the monies back for the Tram.
Colbyn is lying. Colbyn lied to win an election and isniw reneging on all the promises. Same old, same old. Made the same mistake as before.
Property rights are enshrined in Human Rights Law @ Lallander Peat Worrier. One of the enshrined structure.
O/T
Tinto Chiel says:
1 October, 2015 at 9:38 am
Nana, you’re but a caileag yet. You were looking great when I met you in FS.
Now get back on that interwebthingy and bring home the bacon for us.
Oh, that’s so last week.
Reference last week.
Surely David Cam.
Would have been better getting photographed / caught with his appendage in a DUCK!
Then he could have legitimately passed the whole thing off as:-
“I was only inserting my PRIVATE MEMBERS BILL!”
I suppose then that, Duck a L’Orange, would have had to be O/Ordered off the Menu at Stormont though ?????
As they say, “Ah’ll get ma coat”.
Scotspine at 9.46:
We need a radio channel to get the message out over the airwaves. I don’t mean something that will churn out political dogma and wall to wall SNP cheerleading. What I mean is something that has a mix for everyone, music, chat, news.
Absolutely spot on, Scotspine. Given all the creative and technical talent out there on the pro-indy side, a decent radio station programme would be perfectly feasible and very effective. The programmes could also draw on the best of all the various blogs and podcasts already in existence and spread the word to a much wider audience, provided the material is relevant, upbeat and allows space for alternative and opposing viewpoints.
Not sure about the legal aspects or the funding but as you say, if Pirate radio could manage it what’s to stop the setting up of a real “Radio Scotland”?
What would be helpful would be the political will to make/encourage it to happen….Nicola….
@Capella
Thank you I loved that. Just need to find out where the reguvenating water is so I can go immerse myself in it.
Oh and as I mentioned skeletons this morn that cailleach sure had a lot of dem bones in her attic.
The bbc has it’s own skeletons…
link to exaronews.com
View figures for BBC garbage drop every day. Its only a small minority that sit and give full attention to ridiculous BBC chancers in action. A pc or tablet taxed v ye olde crystal bucket in the corner of the room.
C4 is an awful outfit. Its view figures are sliding away all the time. So toryboy world wants rid of it. As their view figures drop, advertisers are charged a lot more for far less.
Last GE showed BBC etc just how little power they actually have to monster SNP and make Scotland vote SLab. US tv deals with the age of the internet by making great television. BBC farts out stuff with cringers like Neil Oliver mincing around English graveyards trying to make 14th Hampshire exciting.
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Nana , sorry to hear about your back – the thing to do is keep moving but have a high stool ready to park the bahoochie upon when exhaustion sets in.
Many years ago I read a piece by a Professor Something the gist of which was if we knew just how vulnerable and delicate our spines were we would all be scooting around on wee trucks , kinda luge-like.
I think Macart’s advice of liquid breakfast, lunch and dinner would work pretty well! At least you would be oblivious to place ,pain and people.
Corbyn:
“The franchise, yes. But I do think they had a choice, and they could have exercised it to ensure that ScotRail remained – or, er turned, rather – into full public ownership. Surely that would be a much better way of doing things. And indeed the Labour policy, overall, is to return the franchises and the rail operating companies into public ownership, so that we all get the benefits of the rail service and the profits that go with it.”
As Stu explained in a previous post – it would be illegal for the Scottish Government to set u a public body to run rail services. That’s in the Railways act 1993. Does Corbyn not know this?
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Macart at 8.28
Well said. A “federal” solution is not remotely practical and it is not desirable. Like the illusory FFA it leaves us with Trident, foreign wars and in reality dependent and at the mercy of English imperatives. It can’t be any other way and we must ensure that it is knocked out of the debate as quickly as possible.
A confederal solution ( ie independent entities agreeing freely to share responsibilities in various appropriate areas) should be designed and presented to invalidate arguments about “isolation” on independence.
How does a Lawyer get struck off
Incompetence? Criminal Activity? Strict Adherence to the Law?
I suppose there must be a bunch of reasons but something struck me about this particular case in that there seems to be journalistic connections involved in this, and where there are journalists there is doubt about what’s actually going on
I seem to remember Jo Beltrami a Lawyer of great notoriety who successfully defended the most abhorrent of criminals in Scotland and indeed the criminal classes boasted of having a “brilliant bent lawyer” whether true or not but nonetheless nobody struck him off
So does that mean Ms Thomson’s Lawyer was not powerful or rubbish at his job or once again in Ms Thomson’s case more to this than meets the eye given that this is the second time in a matter of weeks someone is trying to take down this particular lady
I smell Shite
@Tinderbox
“But I do have trouble understanding why MT would pay her business partner an extra £30k in a back-to-back transaction, and then why he would in turn reimburse her almost the same amount.”
The sale of the property could involve capital gains tax. One way to reduce that is to inflate the recorded buying price of the property. It’s a tax dodge. Probably out of the Busines for Scotland handbook!
@Dorothy Devine
Thanks Dorothy, any advice gratefully received. I spent the last couple of days prone, couldn’t really do much else. Decided this morning to grit my teeth and push on.
Sadly painkillers don’t mix well with some liquids or I’d be flying.
I’m still standing…for now! Computer propped up on the kitchen unit and actually managing some housework.
O/T a little something to brighten your day.
UK Elections ?@Election_UK · 14 hrs14 hours ago
Here’s the latest 2016 Scottish Elections forecast. SNP Majority.
SNP: 71 (+2)
LAB: 26 (-11)
CON: 24 (+9)
GRN: 5 (+3)
LD: 3 (-2)
Alan Gerrish at 10.56
For less than £2000 an online radio station can be set up and anybody on broadband anywhere in the world can listen to it.
I could be sitting at my computer here agonising on the days issues on Wings and typing my responses while listening to an interview on online radio.
Wings Radio would be the very thing
Capella says @11:03
I agree, it can be read that what Corbyn suggested was tantamount to misconduct in public office, i.e the rigging of the criteria weighting of a tendering competition under the The Public Contracts (Scotland) Regulations 2006.
@ Dave McEwan HIll
“Wings Radio would be the very thing”
The very thing indeed and more along the lines I would envision. An expansion of something which is already an established and popular footprint, rather than a stand alone start up.
Or we could crowd fund a takeover of the Scotsman and work from there in terms of radio. I mean, if you can get 6 articles for £300 then you should be able to buy the whole paper for £1500.
Just to add a little more to my Scotsman takeover bid we could also change the title to “The Flying Scotsman” brought to you by Wings Over Scotland. It even has a built in advertising slogan.
Nana Smith says:
“Here’s the latest 2016 Scottish Elections forecast.
LAB: 26 (-11)
CON: 24 (+9)”
As we approach the ‘perfect storm’ for IndyRef2 it would be to our advantage if the official opposition in Scotland became the Tories. It would achieve a number of things.
It would turn the spotlight even more on the Tories.
It would complete screw up the DR and BBC Jockshire when they would find their talking-up-SLab strategy somewhat irrelevant. Talking up the Tories wouldn’t help the Union!
It would focus the battle – Scotland versus the Tories. Now that does improve our Indy odds!
So … “Come on the Tories” … Sheesh, did I really say that 🙁
O/T
when looking for the phrase “Remember that you are an Englishman, and have consequently won first prize in the lottery of life”, I couldn’t remember who said it? so googled it, I was surprised to find it had been changed to “Born British” quite a lot of the time, is this britwash?
@ Andrew McLean
I’ve noticed a few strange changes in online reference sites such as Wikipedia. On looking up “national liberation movements” recently, I found the phrase had been changed to “separatist”, because “liberation” was deemed to be political! But now I can’t find that reference so perhaps it has been deleted post GE.
BTW a distant radio is beaming out the high pitched whines of Kezia Dugdale in what must be FMQs. Sounds like a barny is in full swing. No doubt our online allies will be posting the score.
Oh dear, now Ruthie is outraged.
New balls please.
FMQs
As expected Kezia trying to make two and two add up to a labour five about the struck off lawyer. This is what labour in Scotland is reduced to, hitting out in hope of landing a blow.
Three strikes and your out Kezia. Damp squib like Corbyn.
Kezia kept digging a hole for herself and eventually Sturgeon, after three goes, bats her to the boundary with hints that labour have not acted rigorously enough in similar situations.
Ruthie continues on the same theme… Sturgeon makes a good job of dealing with this and makes a promise to act, if required.
I’m happy with that.
FMQs just finished well played Sturgeon.
PS:
‘Coffee with Claire Baker MSP’
Had an invite to this tomorrow at 2pm and a free post survey asking 6 loaded questions and to tick only 3 if I can’t attend.
They are all along the line of
Are you interested in….blah blah! Of course I am! 🙂
It’s at one of the local community centres in Glenrothes.
Looks like an attempt to form a labour database for the Scottish elections and pretend that Claire has something to offer us Fifers. I’ll fill in the survey and free post it. 🙂
@Nana
Thanks for that. Sorry to hear about your back.
Lots of statistics on that linked site:
Important to vote SNP 1 and 2 as others there have indicated.
link to twitter.com
Robert Peffers. 10.28
‘The holding of the case(Megrahi)in a neutral country was a fudge agreed by the parties’
I remember thinking at the time the Libyans had pushed for this thinking with the ICC being in Holland they might get some spin off of superior justice for their man.
In retrospect they may have got a better trial in Scotland with a jury etc.
I’m sure Rock may not share this view however with his experience of our legal system.
@call me dave
Thanks for putting the link on for electionUK.
Totally forgot…blame the meds, well that’s my excuse!
link to twitter.com
“Last GE showed BBC etc just how little power they actually have to monster SNP and make Scotland vote SLab. US tv deals with the age of the internet by making great television. BBC farts out stuff with cringers like Neil Oliver mincing around English graveyards trying to make 14th Hampshire exciting.”
I laughed at the last sentence, heedtracker, but you’re right. Despite our getting despondent about the power of the BBC, last May did show that many in Scotland don’t seem to be listening any more. And BBC Scotland is getting more and more obvious in its bias.
Once that trust goes, it’s gone for ever.
dakk,
“I remember thinking at the time the Libyans had pushed for this thinking with the ICC being in Holland they might get some spin off of superior justice for their man.
In retrospect they may have got a better trial in Scotland with a jury etc.
I’m sure Rock may not share this view however with his experience of our legal system.”
As if Libya would have been given any choice in the matter.
The rotten to the core Scottish system recently refused another appeal in Scotland. Megrahi was innocent but everyone in the Scottish justice system who jailed him are guilty as hell.
Better trial in Scotland? The judges who are all freemasons are the lowest of the low in Scotland. There would have been a zero chance of a fair trial in Scotland.
Why was Sheridan jailed for perjury but Coulson allowed to walk free despite perjury?
Robert Peffers,
“Scots law is far superior and is based upon the Declaration of Arbroath that states the people are sovereign and can remove the monarch if they deem the monarch unworthy, or in the case of the parliament throw them out. Scots MPs legally wield the people’s sovereignty but English, Welsh and Irish MPs wield the Monarch’s sovereignty. Westminster has always just ignored that little fact.”
Not that crap again.
How does a “sovereign” Scott start the process of removing a purring queen who interefered in our referendum?
Why are we still under English rule after 300 years if we are “sovereign”?
“Sovereign” my foot.