Let’s Build A Rocket
Posted on
March 06, 2018 by
Rev. Stuart Campbell
And fire it into the heart of the Union.
(Fundraiser page here, or click here to donate directly.)
.
2 days remaining. Running total (all sources) at 9am, Thu 5 April: £127,400.
Wings Over Scotland is only possible because of you. Everything we do is fuelled by the generous once-a-year donations of our readers, and from the incredible support you’ve given us since 2013 we assume you think we’re pretty decent value for money.
Although of course, not everyone agrees.
So we’ll spare you the flannel. One way or another this is probably the last time we’re going to ask you to put your hands in your pockets, so let’s make this one count, folks.
I love these fundraisers, they always elicit the exact same shite from the exact same green-eyed arserags. Arserag Twitter will be bristling with decontexualised quotes, sundry pishflappery and all manner of defamation. Behold the seethe. 🙂
Dosh incoming.
Easily the best value for money every year.
This is it folks. Final big push. GIRUT.
Donation made, start building yon rocket.
Done.
“The last time”
What a mixed feeling of trepidation and sheer joy at the thought.
You’re not going anywhere. Worth your weigh in gold. Thanks a Billion for all you do. All good.
Lol, I only have one job a year and that’s it just done.
Power to your elbow Stu.
Wings is our hope let’s make it happen.
I maintain my rolling subscription Stu. Best money I have ever spent.
Last time ? I think not young fella. There will be a position for you here in Scotland courtesy of the people. We will insist on it.
Thank you Stu.
The last time? Oh how I wish!
Aim high, £100k and Indy or bust!
Will have a rummage down the sofa and see what I can find.
Just lifted large hammer, about to burst open bulging piggy bank.
Thanks for your very brilliant work
Just donated with pleasure, the equivalent of the annual BBC propaganda tax …
Ye see yon birkie ca’d a lord,
Wha struts, an’ stares, an’ a’ that;
Tho’ hundreds worship at his word,
He’s but a coof for a’ that.
For a’ that, an’ a’ that,
His ribband, star, an’ a’ that,
The man o’ independent mind
He looks an’ laughs at a’ that.
[…] Wings Over Scotland Let’s Build A Rocket And fire it into the heart of the Union. (Fundraiser page here, or click here to […]
@ G H Graham, don’t forget “The Laird o Cockpen!” starring……….Mundell.
Got to take my hat of to some of the people donating. Some very generous donations. Well done.
Donation made and good luck to all.
We are right behind you Rev.
Independence and beyond.
The Twitter share button on the donate page not working getting 404 error
Donation made – seems to be ticking up nicely.
Eyes on the prize people.
That time of year again & it’s a pleasure to donate young man. You are worth every penny & more besides. Thank you.
Donated. Best value of the year
Hey Stu , I will be donating my usual way via your bank – but I have a gripe !
I have never been sent a wee badge , hairgrip , bunnet or anything else!
Not that I really need those things , I just need you and WGD and a few others to keep me up to date with shenanigans and co.and to keep me sane ( ish)
I consider it my proud vile cybernat annual subscription. Donated!
Thanks for your hard work. Hope you’re right about the last time. Monthly donation heading your way
Donated by Paypal. Bought myself the pleasure of reading Wings for the next year and the pleasure of watching the fundraiser total mount (knowing that the Unionist media’s blood pressure climbs in line with that figure).
Rise up!
Today is the day when the anti-independence mob get repetitive strain injuries by pressing F5 constantly and getting more and more angry as more money is donated.
Small donation made, thank you Stu.
Twopenceworth added.
But I don’t believe this will be the last year. First there’s the vote. Then there’s the transition. Unless the Scottish media have a sudden Road to Damascus conversion, we are going to need a proper journalist for some time to come.
“probably the last time we’re going to ask”?
Get out of it, post independence we’ll still need you, just to make sure the transition is honestly reported and the charlatans and carpet baggers exposed.
You’re in with the bricks of life in Scotland now Stuart….(smiley faced thigbob) 🙂
Annual donation made. Keep up the good work and don’t let the b******s grind you down !
Donation made.
Donated. Hope it upsets a few British Nationalists.
Donation made..
Keep up the great work Rev..
Money in. Next time it’s YES !!
Sorry guys, i give all i can to overseas aide, every penny counts there, just £2 can save a life and those people need my money more, so i will do my bit there, and i will as allways put foreward the message for independence whenever i meet any of those labour supporting no voters
Alba Gu snooker loopy!
direct donation done. if seething has a sound, I’m sure i can hear it already, heh heh. this IS the final push folks. brexit will kill scotland to death
GODDAMNIT How could I miss the start of this?
This’ll get some folks backs up, so let’s annoy them even more!
Having problems trying to donate page will not accept my address!!!
Yes, politics about Scotland is fairly quiet but, because of Brexit, politics in Scotland in Scotland is not while we, collectively, hold our breath waiting for a much anticipated announcement and, simultaneously, get through a prenominal amount of popcorn and haggis nuggets watching the deck chairs being rearranged on what will become the Former United Kingdom – or FUK as it will be known.
Meanwhile, payment made, and freebies being looked forward to.
And thank you.
Five,six years ago i would never have considered donating money to a political blog.I had long given up on independence for our country and slid into a deep lethargic slumber.But thanks to yourself and others on this site you brought back to life my dream of an independent Scotland and for that my donation will be the best spent money i will spend this year.
She (the old pensioner) has just chipped in for the two of us.
Keep up the excellent work.
What price Wings for another year,
1 pint of lager a week for a year £180
1 Costa Latte with extra shot a week for a year £150
1 bottle of cheapish wine a week for a year £312
1 fish supper a week for a year £322
1 Cadbury Dairy Milk Chocolate Bar 360G a week for a year £182
1 packet Benson & Hedges Gold King Size x20 a week for a year £590
Stuart has been arrested and imprisoned by false accusation his character has been maligned by false accusation,
this is third world dictator assault on critical journalism,
lesser mortals would have run a mile or taken the establishment dollar,
people have paid a lot more than the price of a coffee on the road to their countries Independence,
What price Wings for another year.
Just a wee marker…
£13.3k raised = 30%
🙂
WTF?! The police confiscated all your equipment for three months?! You done well to keep the site going. I bet they have downloaded everything too and gave it to 77th brigadiers.
DD setup. Keep up the good work Stu!
Can I just add that thank god Stu that you ditched Indiegogo.
Oh, and GIRUY all those who think we’ve given up…
With pleasure
What would Scotland do without your great analysis.
I have been with you since 2012 and couldn’t do without your blog. Thanks for all your hard work!
Donated because you’re worth it! Looking forwards to my perks!
The best value for money you can get !!!
Thank you Stu
Monthly subscription continues indefineately. Keep up the very important and excellent work that you do Stuart. Both sad and elated that this ‘might’ be the last one.
I haven’t posted for a while but have dropped in to say good luck and I have made my donation.
In my wee part of the ‘real world’, I notice more people are speaking out in favour of Independence as the only option. It is imperative that we show we mean business.
Even if I weren’t passionate about independence for Scotland, I’d donate to Wings just to send a message to the British MSM, to all those useless unionist politicians who supposedly ‘represent’ us in WM and Holyrood and everyone else trying to scupper our country, letting them know exactly what I think of their ‘Great’ British way of doing things.
Thank you, Stuart, for keeping us informed and up to speed. Their treatment of you and your attempts to get the truth out there says so much more about them than it does about us, and it isn’t pretty. Thanks, too, to Chris for keeping us smiling.
Donation made, thanks Rev.
Fine but donations are not enough to bring Indy we need you to get off your back side and get outthere to help. I am nearly 70 now and only started canvassing at the last Ref and GE/LE when I retired but daunting as it maybe to some get the facts from WOS and other associated sites and lend your services to spread the word. There are still far too many outthere who for whatever reason do not want change so we have to convince them of the benefits of Independence.
PLEASE PLEASE I IMPLORE YOU I DEARLY WANT TO SEE SCOTLAND INDEPENDENT BEFORE I DIE
Stu, you’re now at 39% funded and you’ve raised 17.7K Wow, just Wow!
Well done everyone
Heedy, Peffers and their gang of Trolls have ruined a good forum.
So I will not be contributing to this site until those arseholes disappear.
Donation in, More to come on pay day.
O/T can folk take a wee look at Kirsty Hughes twitter feed – interesting article a bit down re our EU’s getting to vote in indyref2.
Basically they will not be allowed to after March ’19, once we’re formally out, even if we remain ‘transition’ members they will not get to vote as the means by which they originally got to vote was through EU legislation, which transition status will not extend to.
If Indy Ref 2 is beyond this time, we have got to get them to appreciate our track record of giving them the vote the first time, and asking them to help campaign for us – but I’d rather they got the vote.
Some interesting articles on EUReferendum.com also worth reading.
Thanks as ever.
Yes Now.
Donation made for the best Scottish political website. 🙂
Looking forward to my perks as well.
Off to dig myself out of my parking place, snaw again!
Just donated, Stu, bank-to-bank, via the internet, couldn’t be easier and no fundraiser commission. (09-01-26 A/c 26646153 Stuart Campbell)
As for ‘the last time’, that’ll be your decision, Stu, but because you are such a hugely important and much-loved icon of Independence, I suspect you might just change your mind after you visit Scotland post-Independence, to discover the crowds won’t let you leave.
I also think there will be a lot more work for you to do, possibly as the editor and CEO of Independent Scotland’s first proper national newspaper.
Indy2,
I believe if you can afford to make a donation for using a service that Stuart provides, you should do.
There’s no need to agree with everyone on this site, that’s just impossible.
Lol, you were never going to contribute anyway.
Daisy Walker @ 11:47am:
Yes, I agree that EU nationals (or rather, as they are, Scottish residents) must have the vote.
If it’s really the case that they cannot after March 2019, this only strengthens my view that we must have the referendum by then.
On the day after EURef, great show was made of how we valued EU nationals and would look after them. Treating EU nationals the same as everyone else here demands they be allowed to vote.
And, really, it’s not a good look if they’re told, ‘I know we said this but….’.
People might start to wonder who else can be thrown by the wayside and we really don’t want that :/
Have some basic sense indy2. 10% of the value of wings is the comments, 90% the articles.
The great Voltaire said ” It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere” How very true.
Many have given their life for freedom. Money is nothing in light of that, and we do have many fools yet to be freed from their chains. What price a Nation ?
Indy2 says 11:43 am
Heedy, Peffers and their gang of Trolls have ruined a good forum.
Eh?
Seems like YOU are the troll, pal.
‘this is probably the last time we’re going to ask you to put your hands in your pockets’
Why you say that?
Have the Daily Mail or the Guardian made you an offer you can’t refuse?
None of my business I know.
You will be badly missed Stuart.
Will donate anyway.Cheers.
@Craig P
I would say 99percent for articles. This is the information that gets forwarded…not posts ( not to detract from the good quality posts and links which often appear)
The articles are critical to countering unionist propaganda with data that always has linked sources etc
The posts are important. The articles are critical.
troll self-exposed…wot a dolt
Had a look to donate, but I already subscribe to iScot, so how would that work? Obviously I don’t want to accept something I already get, can I opt out and how?
O/T Nicola on 39.4k, next Brenda on 22.4k, which is actually up nearly 1k since earlier this am. Hmmm?
100 women. Programme on Sly news tomorrow at 4pm
O/T Heads up – YouGov are polling on Scottish Independence with EU membership for an independent Scotland thrown in for good measure. Just filled it in.
Will donate later. Hopefully glitches sorted by then.
45% funded and ah’ve no even sat down tae ma lunch yet (or dinner as we used to call the mid day meal in our house).
The English nationalists will be frothing at the mouth.
Winged Trolls soonds affy frichtsome!
Still, that’s what WoS is here for – to frighten the shite out of the BritNats.
Last fundraiser? There is nothing I would like more than to achieve a YES win in the next year-ish.
The Rev needs a good public appointment in iScotland. I propose he gets the job of setting up and leading Scotland’s independent media watchdog 🙂
A call to arms indeed!
“And the rockets’ red glare, the bombs bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there”
Not that one though!
Our flag first seen in the Year of Grace 734 high above Athelstaneford!
Donated a modicum!
Donated what I could and thankfully more than last year.
Many thanks for all that you do and to all the supporters, readers, contributors and activists!
Done by teatime!
Donation done and doubled my monthly standing order amount.
Not much, for all the hard work you do, but worth every penny from my pension.
Donated and enjoying the feeling of putting my money where my mouth is!
Thank you Rev Stu for everything you do. Worth every penny.
It will not let me donate a sum of my own choosing, only one of the 6 stated amounts. Is it just me not understanding?
Donation made by PayPal, looking forward to Indyref2!
Oops. Just noticed the fundraiser link above now.
Donated through the donate link at the top. Never mind it’s all ending up in the same place..
@Wee Sandy,
There is a box at the bottom in which you can fill in your amount.it is as a one off.
Isn’t it typical Tory Land England when we see their BBC Propaganda TV Station explaining how their caring government is trying to get UK portions reduced while we see ever increasing numbers having to use Food Banks to exist.
Also laughing out loud to see the DUP Leader, the one who states that she hate Catholics, doesn’t believe that Dinosaurs ever existed, and who’s supporters burn pellets for no reason other than it allows the UK Government to give them free money for their supporting, visit Brussels and Mr Barnier.
What on earth can the real Europeans make of these people hoping to sit around a table and discuss their future relationship when they embrace murder, corruption and hate?
Donation going in right now-just about at the 50% mark.
Many, Many Thanks to Rev for his herculean efforts against Westminster.
Transferred my association subscription to WOS, a few years back. Getting out of two unions for the price of one.
I love a bargain.
REV STU says…”..probably the last time..”
Even once we are independent, I very much thinketh not. An independent Scotland will need this site, just as much as the current colonial Scotland needs it now.
Money on way.
P.S if we don’t contribute, we might end up with no Chris Cairs cartoons on Saturday – and we all REMEMBER well what that means..
link to wingsoverscotland.com
🙂
If this blog closes down when we are independent, Wings Over Scotland should be the name for the new Scottish airforce! A fitting tribute, and it does what it says on the tin.
Pretty much half-way by lunchtime, as usual.
Donation in Stu out of my pension. More power to your elbow (and keyboard).
See the english governments tame house journal in Scotland (the herald – is that a paper?) quoting a uk government source on the repatriated powers “I don’t sense us moving from our position. We have already moved a hell of a long way and we can’t move any further in the way the Scottish Government want us to”.
What planet is this person on. These powers returning from Brussels do NOT fall under the remit of the english government. These are devolved issues which come under the umbrella of the Scottish government.
Through shear arrogance,bullying and contempt for the Scottish parliament this tory government has decided to intercept these powers on their return from Brussels. They are trying to steal what is not theirs.
They are doing us a favour by returning 80 odd powers. Big deal, how very bloody generous of them to “GIVE” us our own powers back. Christ even the bloody tories in Scotland oppose this.
NS give them hell
NEVER TRUST A TORY
50% funded, folks!
Donated. Not much I’m afraid – funds a bit tight, and I financially support our local independence hub, but you do such a good job I felt I had to contribute something. Keep up the good work. I totally agree with those who have said we will still need you in the early days of an independent Scotland, so don’t get used to the idea of stopping any time soon!
Indy2 says:
6 March, 2018 at 11:43 am
Heedy, Peffers and their gang of Trolls have ruined a good forum.
So I will not be contributing to this site until those arseholes disappear.
I popped in some cash on your behalf though.
Hope that’s ok indy2.
Anyway, its kind of an antidote btl WoS, after you’ve waded through the £300 million a year BBC Scotland region gimp zone for a while, for example.
Will Scotland ever have a decent progressive liberal media, that doesn’t spend every waking minute trying to destroy Scotland’s nascent democracy indy2?
Qui.
And that’s Scottish arsehole to you.
Wife insists on BBC tax so she can watch crap so no moaning from her if I fund something worthwhile for the same amount.
I think the only thing on the BBC I’ve seen in the last 3 years is the odd episode of Mastermind, but that supercilious prick John Humphrys does my head in.
@revstu :
There didn’t seem to be a box to say “I don’t want the stuff” this year, but just like the last times I don’t want it. Spend the money on other things, like more WBBs.
£55 of fuel added to the rocket.
@Bob Mack
Doh! It’s an age thing. Thanks. Now donated.
All the best WoS.
Donation made from last weekend’s wages.
Nana is back – see links on previous thread.
@ bob mack
Thanks Bob. I’m sure it’s an age thing! Now donated.
Jeez! Double posted! It IS an age thing!
Donated and Subscribed. Keep up the good work!!
Well Stu, I have supported you and your work from the beginning,
I ain’t gonna stop now. Money will be in today.
This is likely to be the biggest ever push for Indy coming very soon.
We need you as never before, let’s hope it is a huge fundraiser, and the biggest by a long way. Cheers.
couple of bob donated
Listening to the BBC r4 gimp network right the noo, a very jolly toryboy chat between two ferocious toryboys, professional liar Nic Robinson and Dan Hannan, south east of England Cons MEP.
Hannan last seen in Nairn, lying his toryboy arse off about everything really, especially the EU though.
So this chat’s a good example of how corrupt the BBC is today, a couple of tory creeps, chortling away together about lovely they both are, on their private toryboy beeb gimp network, at £3.5bn a year.
Invest for independence.
Saw Captain America last night on C4, which ends with Captain America wearing a WoS t shirt. No idea what SRS means though.
link to ebay.com
So get some WoS t shirts going too!
The Trolls owe as much dosh as everybody else
They’re here reading WOS just like we are
Pay yer dues Trolls
Let’s get this to six figures ASAP
Fabulous Wings deserves a pat on the back and a few quid from me. Thanks for all the hard work Stuart.
Just a funny aside, conversation, other night at our house; me’ well, you wouldn’t go to wings unless you don’t want to eat anything!’ Son#1, ‘Eh, what are you talking about?’ me, ‘wings, the restaurant your bro has been invited to, it’s all chicken wings!’ Son#1, ‘oh, I was wondering why the heck you were talking about Wings Over Scotland and not going there, everytime you talk about wings, you are usually on about Wings over Scotland!’
We had quite a laugh!
Anything ‘wings’ in our house is WOS. 🙂
Wallet dipped and donated.
Carry on your exceptional work Stuart.
Ps,I like birds and wings, and chicken’s, alive, we are vegy you might have guessed!
A pleasure to contribute. We cannot fly without our Wings.
When you say ” …this is is probably the last time we’re going to ask you to put your hand in your pockets” I trust you mean that you expect us to be independent before the next annual fundraiser and there is no suggestion that you will tire of the fight if we are still chained in a year’s time. Scotland needs you and like all your readers, excepting the trolls, we will keep putting our hands in our pockets to help you help us win our freedom no matter how long it takes. Your contribution to the drive for scottish independence is immense and appreciated more than you will ever know.
Stick with us to the end and when the end comes, and we are at last free of these vampires, your Wings followers will insist your contribution is recognised. Your talents will be invaluable in our new Scotland.
Best Independence site bar none!
Donated and chipped in a wee extra £25 on behalf of indy2, bill and Ben and good ol’ sensible…thanks to those guys for keeping my fire burning!
60% there already.
Blimey…
Making my donation on Saturday when in town with the wife.
I love this fundraiser! Always happy to donate, and have done every year since the first one. You are right though, they really fear Wings, so stay safe, Stu, and watch your back!
Donated.
Keep up the good work Rev. A must go to website for all us who support the Scottish Independence cause.
I agree with others on here that we will need you beyond this year for all true news reporting on Scotland and to get all the regular “Wingers” views which we need.
OT
Less than 2 hours to put your views on that UK Parl page:
link to parliament.uk
Some good ones, some lying ones, some totally ignorant views there. Give them both barrels!
Yeeeeehaaaah was just having a look at the fundraiser page before donating and it looks like ONE MILLION updated WBB’s are going to be printed and distributed “when the time comes”.
Britnat suckaz eat shit you morons you’re finished.
Soon.
O/T
Scotland’s First Minister still well ahead in Sky’s most influential woman poll:
1st – Scotland’s First Minister 35.9k votes
2nd – England’s First Minister 22.6k votes
3rd – Scotland’s future First Minister 17k votes
If you haven’t yet voted, here’s the link again:
link to news.sky.com
Rummaged down the sofa and found 2p and a fluffy sweetie of unknown vintage.
So you can have my TV tax as a special thanks for all you have done, are doing and I’m sure will continue to do.
Right I’ll try that again. Posted about 11.30ish and it hasn’t appeared.
Anyways…
I already subscribe to iScot so how does that work – can I opt out? If so, how?
I know I can donate directly but I really, really want a notebook!
Donated through paypal. Freedom won’t be long now. 😉
I got really annoyed by that site. It uses Google Address, which doesn’t include ours. It can’t cope with House Name, Town, Postcode. Every farmhouse in this area uses that format.
I got so angry I went to PayPal and gave you more than I’d planned to. That’ll show them!
@Prouf Cybernation 3.15
Done!
Proud Cybernat @ 3.15
England’s First Minister? I really hope you mean the old Queenie, cos she was No 2 when I checked around 11.30ish. I now cannot get onto the site constant ‘stopping script’ and ‘recovering page’. Hope somebody who knows how to has been taking screen grabs!
Like Elmac @2.23, I’m hoping your remark implies we’ll be independent before the next fund-raiser and you can lie down in a darkened room/recharge your batteries/come back home.
Off to Paypal to buy you some rocket fuel.
We won’t win without you and this site.
Money flowing in. Excellent.
Are we a bit slower than last year?
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Or, is Stu getting more on PayPay etc this year?
You’ll have to be patient Stu. Don’t get my pennies till Friday!!
A worthy cause and hopefully the last donation before we are independent with the next donation being to our new impartial and independent Wings Over Scotland multi-media platform – didn’t think we were going to let you off the hook after Indy did you – who do you think you are, a one trick pony Farage? ??
Just paid through Paypal this year, it looks as if quite a few of us are doing that.I tried to donate through the google thingy, but I got a bit annoyed with it, so Paypal it is.
Mair power tae yer elbow Rev. Pleasure to donate.
Donation done. Happy to do so. Many thanks for all your hard work.
O/T
Mark McDonald has tendered his resignation from the party – The National
He’ll continue as an independent MSP.
Can anybody help with my question @ 3.22pm?
Or, if I do donate through paypal can I claim a notebook?
Yours, Desperate to Donate.
Now at 16:45 and my rough maths calculates that there has been a donation every 45 seconds. Keep it up regardless of how much you can give.
AllyPally says:
6 March, 2018 at 3:46 pm
“I got really annoyed by that site. It uses Google Address … ”
Also stymied for a while by exact same problem. If a human glances at my address it will look foolish – purposely as I just filled in junk where some nonsense was required.
Nevertheless, WOS will do it again for us all this next year!
Almost 5pm so prepare yourselves for Report Scotland news item later condemning WOS for only achieving 76% of its target which goes to demonstrate clear evidence Scots do not want another Indy.
Noticed the charityscheckout retains your card details for future donations. If you don’t want this go to mydetails and delete it. I’m never too happy with too many online sites retaining my card details, that’s why I tend to use paypal.
Happy to donate. This site keeps me sane.
I wonder where we are now? I take it the New fundraiser platform
figures will not include Paypal sums.
£90 short of target says Stu on twitter. 🙂
Donated.A few pennies for Rev.Stu must have a new edition of Wee Blue book.
I’ll write that another way…£90 short of target.
Probably there by now but I’m sure it will be lots more than that by this time tomorrow.
One way or another this is probably the last time we’re going to ask you to put your hands in your pockets, so let’s make this one count, folks.
I disagree Stuart. If we are in the middle of another Referendum within the next year, and we’re sitting at 50-50 with the Unionists, I’ll bet every single person here will throw a ton of money at you and this website if you had to ask. I don’t think this will be the last fundraiser if necessity demands a further push.
All the best for the next year anyway!!
@jfngw
Thanks for drawing that to my attention. Hadn’t noticed
WoS Twitter. Stu says across all donation platforms, he’s almost at £45k.
Another few quid in the bag from me. Keep up the good work Stu. As already said above, the thought that this may be the last time fills me with mixed emotions. I have become accustomed to Nana’s daily links, Chris’ weekly (when not on holiday) excellent topical cartoons, Proud Cybernats wonderful Micky taking links, Macart’s, Mr Peffer’s and many many other regulars’ points of view and excellent background information.
Thanks to all you Wingers for digging deep to find the truth, and for sharing it with the rest of us.
When Indy comes…….I will miss you all. (No offence, but I really, really want to miss you guys so much!)
I will step back into the shadows now, but Thanks Guys, your information has been very, very much appreciated. ??
Good luck with the fundraising money well spent.
@JLT
By next March we should have either voted for Indy or not, or be pretty close to a vote. From the above message I get the impression that the Rev will wind down the site if we vote no again, his job is done if we vote yes.
If we vote no under the current conditions I fail to see any circumstances that a yes vote will prevail, you can only flog a dead horse for so long. But grasping defeat from the jaws of victory is a trait we are well aware of.
Liz rannoch
I checked the SKY page 15 minutes ago and it was only coming up with a page dated March 5th 03.40 am. Tried refreshing but it was still coming up with March 5th.
Hmmm
@jfngw
Hi mate. You misunderstand. If we are in the middle of another Referendum within this next year and Stuart asks for a quick £50K (for advertising, or to print more pamphlets or Wee Blue or Black books, etc), then I have no doubt we will all fire him that money. The point is …it may not be the last fundraiser if he asks one more time for one even greater gargantuan push.
@jfngw says: at 4.58pm
“Noticed the charityscheckout retains your card details for future donations”
Go back onto the donation page & click on the block og parallel lines in top right corner next to Donate Now button. This offers you an option to login if you had logged out of that page earlier after donating. Once in it takes you to your account so you can alter your preferences & details.
Although I’d said no emails when I checked my account it showed they could still email me so I unticked those sections. I get enough email rubbish without taking on any more because I didn’t bother checking & I certainly wouldn’t want any site retaining my card details.
Best of luck. Glad to contribute to the cause (directly this time). We have the mandate. We have a good base. Roll on indyref 2.
Meg Merrilee’s @ 5.45
I’m finding that the page is opening on page 8 or 9
The most recent comments are on page 1.
Try going too the bottom and clicking previous…. I know its a bit arse backwards.
Don’t take my advice to seriously though…. I still don’t see mine…and needed a copilot to donate (that’s why I had kid’s)
@Meg merrilees
@Liz rannoch
The Sky poll is still working. Over a 20min period, Nicola went from 36.8 to 36.9.
It takes ages to load the poll into the page. The page itself may be dated yesterday, but the poll info is dynamic.
Would be fun if it ended up 1. Nicola & 2. Mhairi 🙂
Your work is so important, please don’t ever stop.
By next year Rev Stu could be editor of the Scotsman. Or even the Record. Maybe not. A stretch too far. Certainly outlasting the lot of them.
Has Kezia made a ‘donation’ yet?
Haha, the usual moronic british Nationalists in Scotland are abusing REV STU online, with all kinds of smeary stuff (the usual nonsense).
He must be doing something right then.
Honestly, why do people who support Scotland being ruled by an English parliament in another country find it necessary to lie all the time?
A rhetorical question of course, but I remember, not so long ago, in 2011, 2012, 2013 and 2014, the ‘better together mob and their cabal of British Nationalists promised us they would make the ‘positive case for the union’. We have yet to hear it, and that is because their is no positive case for the union, and THAT is the reason the British Nationalists in Scotland have to lie.
So, as I and many others have done before, here is their chance, tell us all, the wonderful positive case for Scotland being the only country in the world still run by another. Tell us of the great advantages we get from NOT being in control of our own economy, or our food sector, or our science sector, or immigration and investment. Tell us why handing over ALL oil revenues to England for free is such a bonus for Scots. Tell us why having our culture, and languages denigrated on a regular basis, with every aspect of Scottish social life mocked, is such a great thing. Tell us why having a much despised flag, the butcher’s apron plastered all over our buildings and produce, instead of our national flag, the Saltire, is so good for us?
I’ll not hold my breath.
According to WoS twitter, target achieved.
Awesome. 🙂
Donated. What a terrific site this is Rev – despite some of the silly niggling that goes on.
Ha ha! Trust me to be late!
£57,75 from here in NL. Was great seeing the percentage go up between me first opening the site and donating!
Mildly OT, but I’ve lived here for 15 months now. I don’t know if it’s my increasing familiarity with the language, or May’s twattishness, but it seems that folk here are starting to really look forward to little England fucking right off. 😀
That’s another few quid in the kitty from me too – long time lurker tho and always happy to back the best chance (after the SNP) of us finally getting our independence
Never knew hitting f5 all day on a crowdfunder page could be so much fun, almost like poking the MSM in the eye each time the total went up!
OT
Just checking the times, and it seems live coverage of the Scottish Labour Conference is at the same time as the STV coverage of Ireland v Scotland.
mmmm, which to watch …
Fingers crossed Rev.
I feel alot more confident that independence can be achieved and that the indie media flourishes.
Well I guess if you’re not in it you can’t win it so even though I disagree with the occasionally
arseholereally nice guy who runs the site I’ll have to see if there’s a couple of Scots pounds spare on my card in a few days, even if just for the sakes of WBB2.98% at 7.07 on Donation page, 1k to go!
Pls the direct payment, direct debits and PayPal payments.
Soaring on Wings!
Am skint at the mo so apologies, have to keep the bawbees closely guarded for now… but if there’s an indyref2 and if there’s another Wee Blue Book to be funded, I would (perhaps literally) mortgage everything and put it into another big push.
I think there would be plenty who’d do the same.
@Jules 7.16: we all do what we can for the cause of converting Nos to Yes – any way counts!
I can’t say anything different to thank you, Rev – it’s all been said. Contribution to this fund coming direct under other half’s name [it is a joint account though!].
Small donation made, wish it could be more.
Congratulations Wings, ever impressive stuff 🙂
100%!!!!
Okay Hothersall, on behalf of Wingers everywhere, I challenge you to raise £45k in less than a day for whatever Britnat cause you choose!
Yey! Job done, would another £55k go amiss?
And – the target’s now over 100% on the crowdfunder page = £45.6k. Yippeee. 🙂
OOr wee Nicola’s still at #1 in the Sky poll with 37.3k with final results tomorrow.
happy wee bunny me, or should that be wee haggis.
Target reached!
What a perfect day to start the fundraiser!
link to taxresearch.org.uk
And befitting the Wings principle of sourcing the material
link to archive.is
Note that reading the first comment below the writing will probably have you reaching for your wallets again.
@mike cassidy
Interesting quote from that article:
“I have not been worried about the state deficit for sometime, ever since Mr Brown found out that the UK state can literally print money to pay its bills. Mr Osborne, originally a critic of this in opposition, then discovered its charms in office as well.”
That of course is a main argument for Scotland having our own currency, and some courage to use it.
Happy to have donated , keep up the pressure .
Ref the john redwood article
It’s good the reality of govt financing is becoming more mainstream.
The real debt is the private debt burden – our mortgages, credit card debt etc.
Govt debt is our savings.
Donation made. Keep it coming, Rev.
Over 47.2K+ on the crowdfund page with 911+ donors, and rising…
Enjoying reading all of the comments of encouragement on the ‘Recent donations’ tab
@Cactus: “911+ donors”
That’s the emergency number for “Help, we need more money for Independence” 🙂
A wee donation coming your way Stu, to say ta for the good work.
Noo, how aboot revising the article on Scotland unilaterally deciding to end the Union via a Scottish democratic mandate, whether via election or referendum.
Good luck with the rest of the fundraiser.
It’s been a good day…..NANA’S BACK. Oh, and I paid for some rocket fuel.
Just checked Paypal to make sure my monthly DD is continuing for this years fundraiser and it is…..stick it to them Stu
Hey yesindyref2, did you say EMERGENCY:
link to youtube.com
See it to the end, how they cut the cord on the Radio, Shortbreed.
Now approaching the £50K mark on the webby.
Party time!
POLL ALERT
it seems Sky news has changed the format of the most influential woman vote . Positions and number of votes no longer being shown. The queen is the first to appear and Nicola and Mhairi have been placed nearly at the end!!!
link to google.co.uk
Do I smell a rat or is it just a fluke on the net? Check it out folks!
Stu, thanks so much for the last 12 months and the last 5 years. Your one of the family now. Once back at the ponderosa my donation shall be winging its way to our wings.
@Terry
Hmm! Poll looks the same to me.
Nana Yeah! Missing Links are back. 🙂
Thingy’s comment has to be the best comment anywhere in the history of comments – “Sundry pishflappery” – notional Pints/Mojitos/Milkshakes have been ordered in your name 😉
Poll alert 2!
After much searching I found a link that does revert to the original.
link to news.sky.com
Wouldn’t it be great to wake up tomorrow to Nic winning, mhairi and now Caroline Lucas doing well and the papers fuming that Wings smashed its target on day 1?
Donation made. This site keeps me sane(ish).
@Terry
It looks OK to me.
Nicola has increased by ~1000 in the last three hours, and Mhairi ~500, which seems consistent.
Q by ~200 in same period 😉
Posted on the last thread, thought you might like to read just in case you miss it.
link to ukconstitutionallaw.org
link to scottishlegal.com
What a crew we have on Wings!
100% in the first day.
We can win Indyref2/Scotref whatever its called ; and we will, folks. Keep the faith and heid. We sit back a bit watching the clusterfunk that is Brexit and the Tories and we bounce.
Hello!
Somebuddies just gone for ‘The Wings Works’ perk.
Nice one, Anonymous donor 🙂
There’s a thing I like about the annual fundraiser – the number of “lurkers” who stick their monickers in. COME IN MORE OFTEN!
Me and Pete the Camera were hassled at George Square a few times, by three “mature” women who read WOS regularly but never post. They wanted “Proud Lurker” badges.
As it happened, we designed one and Pete produced a prototype. He then came under the control of Ninewells Hospital and was unable to produce any more.
Onnyhoo, at Glasgow Green, I was able to present the more vociferous of the three lurkers with the single “Proud Lurker” badge.
I told her to share it, week about. Why not do a post, typing “Ta”?
O/T
light relief – these crazy people will make you smile
link to bbc.co.uk
Small donation compared to what Iyou give. But it’s on its way to you Rev. thank you so much, grateful for the courage and integrity of Wings. Keep calm and carry on the good work.
I’ve given you some money in the hope that you go away. Ach, you know what I mean!
Best political site!
@Nana
The McCorkindale / McHarg link is doing my heid in. 🙂
Read it twice now but will have another go in the morning, it looks all good though.
Aye it’s been an interesting and uplifting day to see so many folk chipping in contributions.
Well done all!
Yesindyref2, 7.56pm
Aye, what we could do (with our money) is invest in serious infrastructure, proper future-proof systems, fairly funded like every other nation (that chooses) does.
The thought of foreign/Tory investors making money from the toil of generations-past and our renewables industry, through utility sell-off schemes like the National Grid and the GPO, is a sad one.
Embarrassing for two intelligent nations, to combine so disastrously, forming the UK establishment, which will rule the UK forever…if ONLY these pesky Scots…
It’s all going swimmingly 🙂
My tuppence worth fired across from Calgary in Canada. Fantastic progress on the appeal, but this time we must get it right – get the vote out. Anyway, I’m hoping to be back home, permanently, in a couple of years time and it would be so good to be re-entering my home country – on it’s way to becoming an optimistic, cringe-free, Independent nation
[…] social media users have voiced their support for the site and have urged fellow Yessers to continue to donate. In 2017 a similar fundraiser attracted over […]
Those boycotting the fake “independence supporting” The National on Saturday should give the money saved to the genuine independence supporting WOS.
8,000 boycotters would mean £4800 raised and also send a powerful message to the fake.
Dave McEwan Hill (3rd March – “The uninvited”):
“Ian Brotherhood at 11.13 am
With you completely. I will not be buying the Saturday National that includes the Bella magazine”
Hey, also keep an aye at the top RHS of the screen…
Less than 8,000 reader comments to go till it hits 750,000.
That’s three-quarters of one million comments, wow.
Should be able to fulfill that in a couple of weeks.
We’re heading to Venus…
Ah wonder if the successful Wings Over Scotland Fundraiser 2018 will get a menshie again in The National newspaper like last time.
Latest… now approaching £55K on page.
Well done on hitting the fundraising target Rev and it’s good to know you’ll be a thorn in the flesh of those Unionist politicians and pet media that choose to lie to us the general public.
I’m surprised you managed to last so long given the abuse you take daily, it’s because of what you write as you make many look like fools. Also a lot of jealousy there too, many hate you for your success as a blogger alone.
Well done to all that could spare a pound or two to keep Wings going, all the contributors btl and the lurkers as well. Great to read a lot of names from many I haven’t seen post before.
So many still care and it’s this belief that will win for us next time. Let’s carry on 🙂
Ken500,
“Has Kezia made a ‘donation’ yet?”
In a fair Scotland, she would be forced to pay damages to the Rev. Stuart Campbell for defaming him.
But my prediction is the rotten to the core Scottish justice system will clear her.
The vast majority of lawyers, especially judges, are the lowest of the low.
Thanks for all your tremendous work, and for not giving up despite certain dodgy people and their accusations.
It’s coming yet.
Jings! Clocking on time 22:00hrs
Now is not the time for tennis games.
PS:
Been watching a Doris Day film… partner too young to remember her much. ‘The Thrill of it all’ Comedy? She likes it.
What can you do..mellow with a merlot Aaahh! 🙂 No Footie 🙁
Weren’t clothes really nice in the 60s. Good days.
My donation, with a late payment penalty will come on the 20th when I get paid.
Well done to everyone and a big thanks to Rev.
Donated- a positive economic return on investment.
The British state is stricken, profoundly unwell- the only cure is an Indy Scotland using the transformative power of democracy.
‘The United Kingdom continues to find itself in the bizarre situation that it is pursuing as its most important national and political preoccupation a goal, namely Brexit, which most of those closely involved (including the Prime Minister) know to be profoundly against the national interest. This schizophrenia will over time express itself in various ways…Mrs May’s speech…the latest symptom of the dreaded disease which is Brexit. As a symptom, it can make little or no difference to the eventual prognosis for the stricken British patient’
link to fedtrust.co.uk
Was it 1 or 2 million Wee Blue Books?
And of course there will no doubt be the print off your own version available.
I hope there will be lots of pictures of buses in the WBB!
What a great team fighting for the very existence of Scotland. Let’s donthis!
@Robert Louis 6.42
Great post. Sums up why British Nationalists will always lie cheat and break promises. They have no positive case so they can only deceive threaten and scare.
NEVER TRUST BRUTISH NATIONALISTS
lol
the irish border problem
link to twitter.com
🙁
bbcalba has lost the pro14 rugby rights
Well, just squirted a wee bit of rocket fuel your way Stu – looking forward to making good use of the bottle opener!
Let’s get this into six figures, we need everything we can get.
The resilience of Wings is akin to the “Incy Wincy Spider”. No matter the many setbacks to the cause of independence it just keeps on climbing the spout knowing one day it will get to the top. Donation made through PAYPAL. Nice and simple.
Cactus says:
6 March, 2018 at 9:16 pm
Hello!
Somebuddies just gone for ‘The Wings Works’ perk.
Nice one, Anonymous donor ?
—-
and how did you know i was a buddy? after all they say about paisley folk..
A daily lurker and occasional jeff dugdale 121 🙂
Must share the comedy from the Herald
Experts hired by the Herald say North sea oil value about to drop sharply
Hahahahaheeheehohohoh!!!
Wings has a fundraiser and the Herald starts a *Fudraiser*
Didn’t the day go well.
Rev Stu for President!
Set up a monthly for the cause. Cheers Stu. We might not always see eye to eye but, thanks for everything you have done and continue to do. It will not be forgotten. Much respect.
William Wallace @ 1.09
Hi William, good to see ye post,not seen ye post for a wee while.
How’s all thing’s Wallace?
Donation made through Paypal.
@ Liz
Ach – no bad Liz. Just taking a wee rest for the battles ahead. I’ve been lurking and keeping a loose eye on wings but, I was needing a wee break to concentrate on health, family and ofc cutting doon on the late night drinking etc.
I’ve been sitting doon and writing daily tae but, struggling a wee bit wi the fatigue. Been trying to get some sort o sleeping pattern on the go but, it’s no as easy as it sounds as you well ken. Other than that I am fully charged up again for the road ahead.
Here’s hoping that Stu is right regarding the final fundraiser and that this is the year that brings aboot the change so many of us desire.
How are you keeping yirsel?? I hope 2018 has been good to you so far.
William Wallace @ 1.45
Aye I’m doing fine thanks, William, and glad tae hear that your picking up better habits…or tryin tae,LOL.
Keep it steady,cause I think it will be all hands on deck …and soon…
Take care of yerself and herself,won’t keep ye from yer sleep.
Night William X
Take care Liz and good night. X
@mike cassidy 7:49pm
Lots of ranting tories on that redwood site.
Maybe we all need to enter some xhoice replies.
Currently at £57.5k Scots and fully funded. 1m WBB coming soon.
What is this mornings total, it is a wee bit frustrating that we cannot see both totals, it would be good if Stu could keep us updated throughout the day.
@schrodingers cat 11:47pm
That’s a keeper. Hillarious.
link to mobile.twitter.com
We are going to need heroes, people who are willing to go the distance with resolve, Stu is definitely one of them.
There are many others who will help drive us to our goal so we really need to support them. They will help keep us on the right path.
Time for them to do as much as they can, all of us need to go the extra mile and follow their examples, this time we cannot fail.
OK I’m nothing if not tenacious!
Twice I’ve posted about donating without having to accept the iScot subscription, cos I already do that.
I don’t want to waste that perk. Would I get 2 iScots? I suppose I could leave it somewhere?
I want to donate so I can get the enamel badge and the Notebook, but I don’t need the iScot thingy.
Please can someone help? Is it just me who’s in this situation? I’m beginning to think my font is set to invisible!
@LizRannoch
Don’t worry about it – it’s a digital subscription – you won’t get an extra hard copy.
Links
link to blogs.gov.scot
link to infacts.org
link to indyref2.scot
Experts warn NHS Scotland must be exempt from future trade deals
link to archive.is
What does a beleaguered administration do? Rewrite the council rules to suit themselves. A disgusting power grab today. Only irony is that the suspended Labour Councillors now have a paid Tory whip…oops!!
link to twitter.com
link to indyref2.scot
Fair work charter for Scots workers hit by severe weather
link to archive.is
link to snp.org
link to nhsforyes.scot
link to autonomyscotland.org
link to newsnet.scot
link to cablemagazine.scot
US company buys Scottish offshore firm Ecosse Subsea
link to archive.is
link to irishtimes.com
link to nation.cymru
link to taxresearch.org.uk
Foreign Secretary asked to reject ‘language of war and conflict’ and ‘lead by example’
link to archive.is
link to politico.eu
link to eureporter.co
link to qz.com
Will contribute later today. We need sites like this to counter Tory mouthpiece that The Scotsman has become or the BBC pro brexit stance. Scotsman going big today on Tory attack on Continuity Bill. But good article from Iain Machinery in Herald on the Tory Power Grab.
Gizzit @ 7.28am
Thanks for that. If iScot get a sub and not have to send out a hard copy then I’m all for it!
Nana, a big welcome back and so many links! Away to donate, get ma porridge then tuck in to them, thanks.
Nana, I’m so pleased to see you posting again! Thank you for your brilliant links!
Good morning Liz. So many links, so little time but here’s a couple more for elevenses 🙂
Brussels and Paris to rebuff May’s Brexit hopes for City
link to ft.com
A ‘Major Second Wave’ of U.S. Fracking Is About to Be Unleashed Upon the World
link to archive.is
?“…build a rocket boys…”?
Good morning exile. Thank you and you are so welcome. It is good to know folks are reading some links and hopefully sharing relevant info.
Have a great day wherever you are. For some reason I have Van Morrison’s Too long in exile stuck in my head 🙂
Thanks Nana,
Scottish people require your service to find what is really being said, not what is being reported through the rose tinted glasses of our media,
Vote YES next time everyone.
Just before I tuck in to all those links, a wee reminder that at 4pm today on Sky news there is a programme called 100 Women. Guess who was still at numero uno when I checked earlier this am. By a long way!
Nicola 39.2k
Queenie 23k
Mhairi 19.5
Indy first, last and always.
wull2
I would say it’s through the bile tinted glasses of ‘our’ media.
FYI
Business begins at 1.30pm and includes:
a Stage 1 debate on the UK Withdrawal from the European Union (Legal Continuity) (Scotland) Bill
link to parliament.scot
Wow Nana. Back with a vengeance!
Reading Wings is becoming a full time job lol.
@Nana,
Thanks (always) for links,
John Redwood Tory MP admitting that Tory/Labour `Austerity` serves no financial purpose is an abomination beyond words,
through links and some of the great learned contributors on Wings I had a small grasp on Gov debt and tax and its ability to create money (fiat money)through Central bank,
but always wondered, if you can create money why the need to attack the vulnerable with `Austerity`,
is it just a reason to give their friends/contributors at Capita/Talis billions of £`s,
there must be a reason beyond just being evil,
Man’s/Woman`s inhumanity to man/woman
Makes countless thousands mourn!
Onwards to £100k and beyond.
I am surprised at the fact that about 50% of the donors prefer to remain anonymous.
I can understand some people being worried that their employers find out their support for Independence, in particular if they work for The BBC or any of the other colonialist media outlets, but 50% is very high – they should be proud to advertise their support.
Nana says
Thanks. Links are great, BTW 🙂
The above article has an interesting mistake. And it’s not from biased UKOK media.
” Northern Ireland should remain part of the EU customs union and maintain full regulatory alignment — effectively imposing a new trade boundary in the Irish Sea. The proposal was rejected by London and Belfast “
Rejected by Belfast? Says who? I very much doubt it would have been rejected by the NI Assembly, had it been active. Rejected by the DUP, yes, but they are now in a minority position.
So, it is interesting that even foreign media appear to accept the DUP speak for NI, when of course they don’t.
@Liz Rannoch 7.20: You can email the Rev – click on Contact tab at head of Wings page. He’ll sort it out for you!
That is an average donation of over £53 pp to reach the target,
superb support.
If you haven’t yet donated, keep on giving every £ is precious.
Nana’s back!
Another day for toryboys laying down the Brexit EU line.
Tories clearly think they can threaten and push around 27 member state EU like they do with their Scotland region.
If only everyone in the EU watched their beeb gimp network, Jacky Bird would really settle their EU hash.
link to bbc.co.uk
EU trade deal must include financial services, says Hammond
6 March 2018
Galamcennalath
link to bbc.co.uk
read this article tucked away on bBC N.Ireland politics website…
reports that Sinn Fein met in Brussels the day before the dUP and it’s described as a “meeting of minds”.
Think EU has more in common with Sinn Fein – who represent those in N.Ireland wanting to stay than those of the ‘No surrender’ DUP party small minded ………..submit your own noun!
Sarah @ 9.20am
Thanks very much for getting back to me.
Too late now I’m afraid, although it’s nice to know for any future donations.
At least I know now that I’m NOT typing in ‘invisible font’!
The threads have been relatively (usual idiot) troll-free for a couple of days now, mebbes more fund-raising is the answer?
People of the EU, tell everyone you know, what we are being told by the Scottish media.
@gus1940 9.14
Good point. Therefore please note contribution made by paypal today. Worth every penny to see the British Nationalist lies and deceit exposed.
It’s now 4pm and nearly 4 hours since the last comment. Furthermore donations to the fundraiser have slowed down.
Is there something sinister going on?
Happy to donate as usual,Stu. Much appreciated.
EU trade deal must include financial services, says Hammond
EU trade deal must not include financial services, says 27 other governments.
Making public demands does not really have anything to do with negotiating policy.
Preferred to donate through your ‘donation’ button and donation made.
Thanks for all that you have done and continue to do.
@Andy says:6 March, 2018 at 10:54 am:
“Having problems trying to donate page will not accept my address!!!”
You are not alone. However it apparently accepts all my data but nothing shows up in my on-line Bank Statements. These usually show up instantly and if the recipient hasn’t cashed it in there is a pending payment notice but that says nothing is pending.
So it looks like it hasn’t gone through. I’ll check it again this morning but it leaves the question – should I try again and risk donating more than I can afford?
Liz Rannoch @ 8.35pm 7th March.
O/T. re Sky News poll . . . Who is the most influential female in the UK . . . . First time I looked at it managed to see that (7th 8.30pm)
1. Nicola Sturgeon. 43,000
2. Queen. 23,000
3. Mhari Black. 22,000
I couldn’t get to vote so tried reloading the web page ( several times, cleared out cookies) didn’t get to see the above results again. A friend tried it on their computer same result.
Sky Poll, Mhairi now only 900 votes behind Brenda – Nicola far out on front, 23,ooo ahead of Brenda. GSTQ!
Sky poll – I can get to the site (and able to vote) if I open in an ‘incognito’ window.
Its a funny old world…. ( russian spies )
An ex/russian spy master gets poisoned and suddenly the russians are seen as the bad guys.
The ex/spy master took money from the west to betray his own people who where spying in the west, how many of those russian spies died because of this mans greed for money.
There is no way we should think it is ever eight to kill him or his daughter, but was it right to betray his own spies for money, and how many of them died horrible deaths, mmmmm
Its a funny old world…. ( russian spies )
An ex/russian spy master gets poisoned and suddenly the russians are seen as the bad guys.
The ex/spy master took money from the west to betray his own people who where spying in the west, how many of those russian spies died because of this mans greed for money.
There is no way we should think it is ever right to kill him or his daughter, but was it right to betray his own spies for money, and how many of them died horrible deaths, mmmmm
@ Bill not Ben,
You do of course realise he was a Colonel in the KGB, and probably,almost certainly has been responsible for the killing of Western spies himself before he turned informer?.
Putin was also KGB. Not nice people at all.
Re Russian spy, you gotta ask why? Why would Russia after all these years decide to get rid of him, or perhaps he was still betraying his Country or perhaps somewhere where he now regarded as home needed a ginormous red squirrel !
Re the spy, maybe he was rubbed out by our own covert operations mob and then the media jumps to conclusions and blames the other tribe, it takes a lot of attention away from the underhand dirty dealings of brexit.
What I don’t get, is why his Daughter as well. She was on a visit from Moscow…Could there be a personal vendetta at work here. Perhaps she was followed across by someone with a grudge.
Anent the case of the Russian Spy, meanwhile Theresa May is murdering thousands of men, women in children in the Yemen by proxy, courtesy of the Saudi fascists!
Red spy at night is sabre-rattling Boris’s delight, empty aircraft carriers on stand-by!
Well O/T
An article about disabled access on the London underground on Victoria Derbyshire now is stating that £600 million has been spend on Tottenham court road tube station alone,and there are 270 stations on the network. Do you think we paid for that out of the union dividend?
@ starlaw 10:32 am :
“What I don’t get, is why his Daughter as well.”
Because its personal is my guess, someone wants his entire family dead. IIRC his son/son-in-law died of somewhat abrupt “liver failure” at the age of 39 in St Petersburg a couple of years back.
I reckon its simply payback for the agents he betrayed and were killed (one apparently tortured to death by the CIA). What goes around comes around.
Sure is a convenient “squirrel” for the Tories/Tory press given the current state of play with Brexit….
The Beast from the East has gone, so they require to create a squirrel of their own, wonder what it is .
@Scot Finlayson
“John Redwood Tory MP admitting that Tory/Labour `Austerity` serves no financial purpose is an abomination beyond words,
through links and some of the great learned contributors on Wings I had a small grasp on Gov debt and tax and its ability to create money (fiat money)through Central bank,
but always wondered, if you can create money why the need to attack the vulnerable with `Austerity`“
It was economic brainwashing Scot. Through the mid-70s with all the discord, the ‘monetarists’ championed by Milton Friedman drummed into politicians (starting with the Heath govt) that govt finances were like our own. Spending would lead to higher borrowing costs and inflation etc etc.
Here we are £1 trillion later of govt spending and interest rates are near zero. All the neoliberal economic models are bollocks.
At the aggregate economic level one persons spending is another’s income. Austerity (taking more money out of the economy actually reduces people’s income. Less spending leads to more unemployment. More unemployment leads to more payout in benefit and therefore LARGER govt deficits – not how most have been taught to understand it.
It’s funny we understand what to do in a skid (although counterintuitive) but folk can’t seem to (and many economists) apply the simple explanation of the economy.
This is the quickest piece of economic framing I have seen courtesy of yanis varoufakis..
link to youtube.com
Thatchers economic policy of the 80s triggered the biggest private debt bubble in history. What economists won’t tell you or don’t know is that most money created nowadays is by commercial banks in the form of loans and mortgages.
I wrote a piece back in 2014 about this partly to make soft NOs realise what a basket case the U.K. was but also to steer folk away from the £..
link to bellacaledonia.org.uk
P,s sorry if folk offended at the Bella link.
Quentin Letts, buddy of Lord Dacre, who has a problem understanding Mhairi Black, is the author of “Fifty People Who Buggered up Britain!” Quentin went to boarding school so he should know? A suitable candidate for “Fanny of the Week?”
See the SNP, or some msp or other, jumping on the UK’s current Russia bashing platform over RT’s supposed misinformation. The UK that says ahlan wa sahlan your royal highness Prince Salman (O Butcher of Yemen) care for some new lethal military hardware?
Doesn’t RT treat Scotland with more respect than the British broadcasters? The reason Alex Salmond chose RT in the first place?
auld highlander @ 10:29 am
Re- the spy, you write: “…. and then the media jumps to conclusions .. ”
May I suggest an alternative construction – “and then the media are fed and accept the ‘conclusions’ they are given”?
It is on occasions like this that I become aware all over again of how little trust I have now in the UK state, its agencies, our corporate media and BBC – the damage done by the Blair government with its falsification of Iraqi ‘weapons of mass destruction’ has left a profound legacy of mistrust around security and defence issues that may stay with me for the rest of my days.
@ScottieDog
‘Twas the good old days when mostly speaking blogs got on with each other. Who knows, those days may return once Indy Ref 2 is announced!
Here’s a thing for you. Could Scotland launch am official local currency (strangely enough called the Scots pound) soon after a YES but before Independence itself, while keeping the pound sterling as our foreign currency until Independence Day?
Just thinking out the baby box!
I’m fairly sure there have been countries that had both a local and a foreign currency though, when I checked this stuff out back in 2014.
@indyref2
Here’s one that was prepared earlier…
link to neweconomics.org
It could be done tomorrow…
Yeah these were the good old days. Probably because we had a defined date. I’m expecting the clans to come together for the big push..
@ScottieDog
Yes, I remember reading that. Like many I’d be wary of a digital currency, even though paper currency is – digital. I’m thinking more of notes (and gradually coins). As long as it’s local, it can just get exhanged for the “foreign” currency pound sterling presumably on a one to one basis.
We already have it really as a local currency as Scottish banknotes, though matched one for one at the BoE in giants and titans, but I’m thinking of making it an “official” local currency. Kind of doubt if UK banking laws allow that, the 1858 or whatever year, bank act.
So get it devolved immediately!
Re the Sky pol……..
Nicola S. 47.1K votes
Mhairi B. 26.2K ”
queenie W. 23.8K ”
diana 9.7K ”
thatcher 8.6K “
Oh dear…more bad news for treeza…!!
More dead ends than being lost in a maze.
link to t.co
@yeaindyref2
I’m all for local and regional complimentary currencies. Notes make it a bit more complicated but if you look around Europe There are some pretty big examples. Chiemgauer in Germany is one. ‘WIR’ in Switzerland has been going since the end of the Great Depression.
The idea behind scotpoud was that it was non-exchangeable for sterling so in that sense was sovereign. It was also a demonstration on how easily money can be created, blowing away the neoliberal economic myths.
As for Scottish sterling, yes each banknote is backed by the BOE and new notes themselves can only be created via seniorage courtesy of the central bank.
Anyways regarding the macroeconomy, anyone thinking ahead about the pointlessness of austerity and how scotland should run its economy, Bill Mitchell’s latest lecture in Helsinki is well worth a watch.. it covers all of the points made to @scot finlayson above..
link to bilbo.economicoutlook.net
Re Brexit Power Grab
Energy security will be a big issue on Brexit and you can rest assured it will remain under the tender mercies of Westminster – Scotland will be fracked to blazes
@ScottieDog
@yesindyref2
And @anyone else who suggests Scotbitcoin currency.
Yes; “Money is one of humanity’s greatest inventions and a powerful social technology. … ” As they say over on http://neweconomics.org.
But digital currencies are novel tech constructs which serve some purposes, but not all the necessary purposes an independent country with a functioning currency needs.
The currency must be under the control of the government of that country – for many reasons. First to be believable to potential voters. Then to allow government to control money creation and extinguishment of money. Those are necessary to keep tabs on inflation, to influence rises or falls in value, to pursue infrastructure spending, to keep banks in line, … to do all the ‘good’ things we would want a government to do.
Digital currencies tend to brag about how decentralised and below the horizon they can be. Our UK government for a few decades pursued a hands-off policy allowing banks to operate further and further below the visible horizon, even unto downright illegalities. We are now paying the price for A. government not accepting that it must control money supply and B. banks feeling beyond accountability until it all fell apart in 2007 / 2008.
Not being an economist I would recommend following someone who is. Follow Richard Murphy at taxresearch.org.uk.
The current SNP initiatives at bank creation will, I sincerely hope, lead to a central bank which will act as our Scottish Central Bank & Financial Industry Regulator.
The new YES campaign is moving into that phase where we will be asked to present to voters what The Scots Government will look like. Institutions must be brought into existence which look like what grown up countries need.
I suppose that will start with the functions we see around us day by day, eg., banks and a currency. There must be regulators which come with believable teeth, not the London sort who mainly scratch the corporations backs.
As Nicola proceeds toward more and more devolution I hope that will look more and more like a functioning proto-government which can be presented as a working and desireable model for the future Scotland.
I’m not suggesting a bitcoin currency. The idea behind scotpound was that it was a govt issued currency, albeit digital.
It was really just a system of mutual credit (which has been in existence for 5 millennia, and no there was never a barter economy)
I would warn you that this is probably the central bankers next move – to make money ALL digital, thereby privatising it. (Read the article I wrote in Bella)
I would certainly suggest a modicum off digital currency IN ADDITION to seniorage created cash that way, unlike just now we are not restricted to mostly commercial bank created digital money.
The key distinction – central bank created money is 100% guaranteed. Go to NS&I website if you want clarification.
Phil I have been following MMT for the past few years and am familiar with Richard Murphy’s blog
ScottieDog says:
8 March, 2018 at 9:54 pm
Excellent, more people should make the effort. It takes time to unlearn neo-lib economics. To enthuse the Scots voters it would be useful to do that. The coming indyref needs tangible arguments to place before people.
I feel the problem with cryptocurrency is the ‘crypto’ part.
I’m afraid I’m a habitual lurker, have been here for years.
Only reason I don’t post is that there are many well informed posters (yes you, Nana! among others..) and I’m too busy reading almost all of the comments etc.
I would rather not dilute or divert the stream, so I just go on quietly being here.
Contribution made gladly.
Just a wee note though – please keep this in mind as per Stu’s guidance on comment rules..
The future of Scotland is playing out before our very eyes.
The stakes couldn’t be higher; none of us really know how this will pan out.
So, whatever allegiance or beliefs you hold, do it with dignity.
With level headed reasoning.
With humility.
And please, Rock.. there may be some stupid people here in Scotland, but don’t tar us all with your brush!
@ Ottomanboi, 1.54pm
I don’t think RT was so much Salmond’s nod, more the only sizeable port that would unload the good ship ‘Slainte Media’. I was way more suspicious of the (Les Dawson in drag whisper) “senthual harrassment” stuff that magically appeared in Holyrood just as the Harvey Fronkensteen scandal broke. I rolled my eyes big time at that one.
Can anyone tell me who ebay jimmy is?
I’ve just donated here and I get thanks for donating to ebay jimmy when I completed the donation.
It’s not very reassuring.
Relax…e-bay Jimmy is non other than your host…The Rev Stu.
p.s. I believe he mentioned there’s a long story concerning this…..Tell us a bedtime story Rev?…..aww gonnae?
Once upon a time, there was a guy called Jimmy…
…
And we all lived happily ever after, independence.
Awe ra best Tam the Bam.
Labour Ulster Unionist David clegg. Take seats from snp means labour wins Westminster. Can he not count. For Labour to win Westminster they need to take seats from the Tories. Leonard on radio just now. Oh dear Kezia come back
Thanks Tam.
I’m using a iPhone 5 and I sometimes don’t get all of the details.
If you know what I mean.
Hamish100
Do you mean David Clegg of the Daily Record?
Just watched the Alex Salmond Show on RT.
Did I enjoy it, YES
Kerching!!!!!!!!!!!
Another donation plus a wee bonus as thanks to Robert Peffers for his help.
Paid in yesterday and loving the comments. Just want to support those of ROBBO. This website is truly effective in so many ways, but as ROBBO says, we need people to chap doors. The first time I did it (40+ years ago) I was almost hoping that nobody was going to answer. But once I started talking to folk it got a lot easier and I soon enjoyed it.
Back then we had to explain what we stood for and why, now we just ask if they are voting for us. Quick and easy by comparison.
We need people to get active; one day you are going to have to answer “What did you do to help win Independence Dad/Mum?” Donate but also get out and work, don’t leave it to others.
Donation given via PayPal.
When the starting pistol gets fired, lets hit the ground running. Two cliches in one sentence, yes I know 🙂
I can feel a bit sorry for people like Mrs Lamont, all those years ago she backed the wrong horse when she took up with scottish labour.
Now she is stuck with that decision, but i think if she jumped ship to the SNP, all her ravings would be forgiven, as we all know, when you join that lot of chancers and timewasters you have to toe the line, the reason they have a yorkshire man leading scottish labour is simple, he has only ever voted for the unionist labour party in england, and he will do as he is told, not that it makes any difference anyway, the guys just a mouth with no will of his own, how sad is that
Thinking about Brexit and the hard right elite nutters.
They hope to win big bucks for themselves, and the can do that in at least two ways. One way is to do a trade with America, with prior knowledge they can invest heavily in the US companies that will be looking to ransack the UK.
The other way, is to carry out ” Crisis Investing”, this is where UK assets will fall so far that they will be able to pick them up for very little. It happens in every crisis. They really, really want a hard brexit to put these things within their greasy hands.
While there will be other ways they know to reap personal rewards, these pointed out are the main ways they will benefit.
Many many big investors and alert smaller ones use these practices during times of crisis across the world.
Devious shit bags, the lot of them. They prey on peoples suffering.
Constitutional crisis over ‘devolved’ powers brewing, trust those concerned will have the bottle to see it through to the delicious discomfort of the arrogant British state and its colonial regional apparatchiks.
Rev, you require to tell everyone that this post is to keep us informed how the fundraiser is going.
O/T
After N.& S. Korea gave Trump 2 fingers and started to talk sense between themselves it appears that The Orange Hitler is trying to jump on the bandwagon by claiming that the moves towards detente are all down to his valiant efforts.
It really makes one sick as it appears that the media or some sections thereof are swallowing that nonsense.
Is there a problem with posting on Wings?
One comment since this afternoon?
Something suspicious?
Or am I getting paranoid.
@Iain,
Previous thread I a in. This is just an update thread.
Are the usual wingers all dead.
Do not encourage the yoons by not posting.
We are the majority.
They are the decling minority.
We are the new majority, they will need to adjust to their new minority status.
@Iain
This thread is kept up the top for a week or so, to show the updates to the fundraising.
The “live” thread is the one underneath it, currently
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Once upon a time there was a so s’appelled United Kingdom…
… and then there wasn’t!
And we all lived happily ever after…
Independence.
Chris….!
SC day.
bit late, but donation made and read the charity pitch…..
….gotta love the smell of Unionist fear in the morning
Roll on Indy2
Just done my donation direct to account at Santander. I love the rage from the brit nats.
‘One way or another this is probably the last time we’re going to ask you to put your hands in your pockets, so let’s make this one count, folks.’ Eeek – please explain
Sleepwalker.Under a tory government in a Westminster dominated Scotland. Scottish people will always be putting their hands in their pockets. Does that explain it enough for you?
Its a funny old world…… ( The Min Spies )
Yes i am quite fond of the odd mince pie, with a few french fries of course and a big dollop of beans.
One does tend to get rather bored with caviar and champagne after a while, and those strawberries with cream don’t have give you the galloping globtrots it you over indulge, but, all in all its not a bad old life, as long as my Rolls Royce is looked after by the hired help, everything is cushty.
Back to spies, all this hulabaloo about us maybe not going to the world cup, i don’t really give a monkies if i never see a world cup, as long as i get my cup of tea and a bowl of porridge every morning i am as happy as a scottish terrier with a shiny nose on the streets of Edinburgh, i never touched his nose, honest gov, i was in the pub getting blootered at the time of the offence. ( well that’s my excuse for what its worth ).
Anyway, Boris the spider has come out with his latest wheeze, we might not go to the world cup he exclaimed to the media if russia has been found to be involved in the salisbury samba affair, i think he meant england will not go, but one can’t be really sure that’s what he meant.
There has been a suggestion that scotland should have a referendum, the poles seem to indicate that the whole of scotland would vote to keep england out of the world cup, and the people don’t seem to care , even if its proved that it was not the russians involved in the salisbury samba, but a wee guy from drumchapel passing through the town and determined to scupper england’s world cup plans lol
@Indy2 says:6 March, 2018 at 11:43 am:
“Heedy, Peffers and their gang of Trolls have ruined a good forum.
So I will not be contributing to this site until those arseholes disappear.”
Aye!
Richt!
Wull ye be takkin aa yer ither noms de gurre wi ye tae?
Hey there Robert Peffers, how you getting on?
Mist blowing away and sunny day on the way =)
Happy Mother’s Day to one and all = )
Thing is, we come in all shapes and sizes =)
Love to us all = ) xxx
Before i go through the email and address form can you pay with paypal at the end
nevermind just used the paypal link on main page
Stuart your a legend and I use the word sparingly. Were would Scotland be if it weren’t for people like you ? Your worth every penny, if I had more I would give more. We would be picked clean by the Westminster vultures and arse kissers from our own country. We need more people like you if were to save this little country of ours from Torys tunrcoats and thoroughly horrid people who want to destroy our wee country.
Once upon a time, there always is a european country called Scotland.
Yes, we all lived happily ever after.
Independence.
Upon.
TFC.
Bill not Ben 6.00
You wrote “There has been a suggestion that scotland should have a referendum, the poles seem to indicate that the whole of scotland would vote to keep england out of the world cup”
Haha! Well the good news is that it doesn’t appear that Holyrood will be faced with the possibility of considering withdrawing Scotland from any World Cup finals any time soon!
More seriously, my own view is that the “Russia” situation is getting more and more serious and there seems to be little that we (the UK) are able to do, on our own, that would affect the Russian strategy on anything.
I would favour a response that involves many countries acting together. With respect to the footy as an example, the UK could Host a World Cup given 3 months notice. We have the grounds and facilities. It wouldn’t be ideal, but it would be possible … if other countries (or, at least, most of them) were willing to get involved with such a “protest”.
The world cup will be held in russia, that’s a fact, any country that withdraws its team will not be allowed to go to the world cup after russia as the football authorities have suggested.
Politics and sport should never be mixed, i remember 1980 the americans and a few others refused to send their athletes because the russians where in Aphghanistan, who is in Apghanistan now, yes the americans.
Did it make any difference in 1980, no it did not, our own Alan Wells went there and won the gold medal and he was brilliant.
Every country does bad things to each others spies, they allways have done and allways will, trotsky was murdered in mexico for going against the russian state, even the little guy in North Korea had his own brother done in just lately, our own country does the same all the time, ofc we don’t get to hear about these things done in our name, we just have to look at the Northern Irish situation to see what happened there, innocent people’s names and addresses where given to the killer gangs there, and these names and addresses could not be given out without british intelligence being part of it all, so who are the bad guys and who are the good guys, well that all depends on who controls the media, and why is that guy to scared to come out of that embassy in london, cause he knows he will be shipped out to america and his life will be over, cause american justice will never allow him to walk away a free man
You two are sitting next each other in GCHQ, so why are you debating on here? Maybe just go along to the canteen/ restaurant and chat about English football over a latte.
The Wasp 1.19
… You should demand a full refund Waspy!
Your triple skin tin foil hat isn’t working.
I am betting that you don’t believe that the USA sent men to the moon either? Am I right?
Sensibledave = arrogant ignorant offensive paid to TROLL British Nationalist
Cubby = Idiot
I often wonder why, when England is one of the world’s leading football nations, they have never hosted the world cup since 1966?????
Who would miss poor wee england if it doesn’t get to go to the world cup, 53.01 million greetin faced spoilt brats sitting at home with their bairns dummies stuck in their gobs.
Bill McLean 6.23pm. Maybe because of the fact that they are not universally loved As much as they thought Bill.
Sensible Dave @ 2.09
I apologise, I had to buy the tinfoil hat online as all the shops in the high street have closed because of brexit.
Sensibledave = idiotic arrogant ignorant offensive paid to troll British Nationalist waste of space.
Its good to chat about other things than just the usual stuff, all the other guys cover most stuff, so its good to have a little sideways walk now and again.
We have people here that can keep us informed about stuff we may not really have an interest in all the time.
I am a big boxing fan, so i tend to spend most of my internet time watching all the old and new fighters, each to their own, politics gets to be a little boring when you just read the same stuff all the time, anyway, i’m off to watch the tribute to the great Ken Dodd on the telly, should be a good laugh, and i am sure we can all do with that
Alba Gu snooker loopy!
Its funny how people think you should just chat about the same old stuff, and then they call you silly names when you don’t comment about all the topics they cover all the time, yes, its a funny old world right enough.
Bill McLean 6:23 pm
You Wrote “I often wonder why, when England is one of the world’s leading football nations, they have never hosted the world cup since 1966?????”
I can help you there Bill … its because of FIFA (or more accurately, the corruption that exists/ed within FIFA).
The two most recent World cups were hosted in South Africa and Rio, the next is in Russia and the following one is in a furnace, sorry I meant Qatar in the summer.
With the exception of Brazil perhaps, one might note that “winning” the right to host a World Cup has little to do with heritage and relevance, much more to do politics and corruption.
But I wouldn’t expect you to understand that Bill … being from a country that doesn’t really get involved in World Cup finals.
… nice to see, for once, Westminster SNP MPs and Tory party MPs on the same side for once. Seems that Mr Corbyn mis-judged the mood though.
Oleg 7:20 pm
You wrote “Who would miss poor wee england if it doesn’t get to go to the world cup, 53.01 million greetin faced spoilt brats sitting at home with their bairns dummies stuck in their gobs.”
… heaven forbid that I should read any sweeping racial stereotyping or an insult of my whole country in that comment eh!
…. Can’t wait for the first “its not the people of England that we have an issue with ….” comment to follow.
On holiday Rev? I dont blame you. Youve earned it. Well, youve raised it.
Much respect.
Can’t see anywhere else to contact you Stuart. I received a letter from RBS today saying that there had been suspicious activity on my Mastercard. After a lot of buggering about I finally contacted someone who could enlighten me. Apparently my donation to you via Charity Checkout had been blocked as being ‘suspicious’. I assured him that everything was in order and that he should pay the specified sum to Charity Checkout. I thought I would give you a heads up about this as RBS and other Banks may be doing this to donations from fellow supporters. I’m not saying there is anything untoward about this, but it might be worthwhile checking this incident with Charity checkout. All the best
I wish to send you a donation but only £1 comes up.
I do not wish to use Pay Pal.
How do I get out of this roundabout please?
Oh I do have an issue with many English people. Specifically the ones that voted Tory and put an x beside Brexit. That ok Dave ?
@Bill not Ben,
You sound like a diddy man . Fan of that is.
@ David S BRIGGS,
Use contact icon at top of page David.
Completely off topic but please check out The National today-
double page spread on Broken Records,a brilliant Scottish band
Xxx
I still love Ken Dodd even though the guy has just died, i like the line on one of his shows, he comes out and says, i don’t know why your all laughing i’m the only one that knows when this finishes, yes very often people had to leave his shows to be able to get home, and they where walking and looking back and laughing, and wishing they could stay to the end, wnenever that would be……………… Brilliant stuff
I am a scottish nationalist, and i do not have an issue with english people voting for brexit or voting for anything else for that matter.
But i do have an issue with anyone that thinks they have the right to say that they are wrong to vote for brexit.
Its called democracy, and anyone who is against the democratic process just because it does not go their way has my deepest sympathy, because if they don’t realise by now its the only way in any political system to come to a fair result, then they do have their heads in the clouds. Alba Gu Bra.
P.S. and before anyone has a go about scotland voting to stay
in the european union, please don’t bother, because we
are part of the UK, and that unfortunately is the place
we are at in the political process as it stands at the
moment
Bob 8.19
… thanks for pointing that out Bob, but what has their Englishness got to do with anything? If you are echoing Oleg’s comments, then the sentiments I passed to him …. I also pass on to you.
If you have an issue with people of a different political persuasion to you voting for a different party to you, then I think you should perhaps look a little closer to home first. The majority of voters in Scotland didn’t vote they way you voted in the GE and they didn’t vote for independence either.
As usual Bob, there is always a “smack” of blame the English about comments here. The only people that have ever been asked if the want to leave the UK were the Scots. They said No. You may choose to try and make that an English issue … but it isn’t.
As I may have mentioned before, because Scots voters insisted on being part of the UK, they were given a vote in the EU referendum. Because of the voters in SCotland that voted Leave rather than Remain, I was outvoted. Myself, and 70% of the good folk in Oxford voted Remain. But the 1m Scottish Leave voters one the day for Leave.
Are you following this Bob? Or does democracy only work one way in your mind. Are you one of those that think that a Scottish Remain vote should carry additional powers of veto over the rest of the UK?
You need to reassess things Bob.
Hi sensibledave.
I read your comments, knowing you are domiciled ‘dan sarf’, unlike some other commenters who are domiciled in North Britain but have a tendency to gibber Braille, whom I tend to ignore.
Onnyhoo, I find myself wondering…
What is YOUR interest, as an Englishman, in posting on WOS, a web site that is dedicated to the concept of independence for Scotland?
Do you comment on other political web sites?
Care to share so we can see your wider comments?
Onyways that’s it from me on the Russian thing before I get a chap at the door, so to speak. My point is to keep an open mind, unless perhaps Sturgeon and / or Blackford (appointed 18th July 2017) as suggested as members of the Privy Council, have been shown indisuptable and authentic evidence, which is a possibility. Perhaps backed up by Police Scotland.
Sorry, wrong tab! I forgot this was the thread with sensibledave wittering to himself.
Hi yesindyref2.
I’m wittering to him also, coz I’m intrigued.
8=)
@BDTT
I was thinking more of the flowerpot men – they’re propagating!
Sensibledave, makes a lot of good solid points, but it appears that if you don’t go along with the narrow minded narrative of some people you should not be allowed an opinion.
There are a lot of things posted on wings that i most certainly disagree with but i just ignore most of it.
I would try never to make anyone look foolish for having an honest opinion, but then i believe in democracy and that includes the freedom to air your opinions as long as they are not insulting to others or racist in tone, anyone might not agree with me, but at least allow me to have an opinion without insulting me or calling me stupid, cause if anyone does that to me they will be ignored by me for ever more on wings, lets face it, life is to short to be bothered with that kind of debating skills from certain kinds of people
@sensibledave
“Because of the voters in SCotland that voted Leave rather than Remain, I was outvoted.”
You’ve been told before that that’s shite. In Scotland 1,018,322 voters voted Leave. The UK total vote was Leave 17,410,742, Remain 16,141,241 a majority for Leave of 1,269,501.
1,269,501 for the whiole UK is GREATER than 1,018,322 for just Scotland’s Leave voters.
But I forgot you’re innumerate and think 7% is equal to 16%.
yesindyref2 2:37 am
You wrote, with no sense of awareness or embarrassment …
“You’ve been told before that that’s shite. In Scotland 1,018,322 voters voted Leave. The UK total vote was Leave 17,410,742, Remain 16,141,241 a majority for Leave of 1,269,501.
1,269,501 for the whiole UK is GREATER than 1,018,322 for just Scotland’s Leave voters.
Haha yesindyref2, bit of a faux pas there matey!
I wrote (and you quoted me)
In other words yesindyref2, had the £1m Leave voters voted remain …. then that would have been “swing” of £2m … which would have produced the opposite result.
So I will say again ” “Because of the voters in SCotland that voted Leave rather than Remain, I was outvoted.”
Apologies if this is too hard for you.
Bob 7.35
What is YOUR interest, as an Englishman, in posting on WOS, a web site that is dedicated to the concept of independence for Scotland?
Dangerously, I will assume yours is a serious question. I have answered similar a number of times before. I will respond briefly.
There are a number of political parties in the UK that send MPs to Westminster. Those elected MPs, from all over the UK, make the laws that affect me. Westminster is my only Parliament.
Some political parties represented at Westminster are not interested in helping the UK to become a better place. They don’t want to be in it. As a result, they don’t act in my best interest. Mostly they act, plot, plan and scheme to make life as difficult as possible for the UK’s elected government. In my view, this is not because of real political differences, but mostly because a desire to “wreck”.
This may be good fun for SNP party members, but it has serious affects on me as a UK citizen living South Oxfordshire.
One topical example is, of course, Brexit.
In much simplified terms, Ms Sturgeon will attempt to use any real or imagined threat of disruption to the UK’s exit from the EU.
The citizens of the the whole of the UK had an equal right to vote in the EU referendum. They vote was had, and the result of the free and fair referendum was that 1, together with 70% of voters in my constituency, and a slightly smaller percentage of voters in the whole of Scotland…. were outvoted. We lost.
You only have to read most of the previous threads here on Wings to understand that “SNP type” voters are not prepared to accept that result. They want to use whatever threats, again real or imagined, to upset, or wreck or make more difficult than it already is, the Brexit process.
Any success the SNP or the the minority of SCots have in doing that, will damage the UK’s prospect of achieving a good deal with EU or, it may even postpone or even stop the democratic process. The SNP would consider that a good outcome.
As discussed above, England will not be leaving the UK. Whatever deal the UK gets with the EU will be the deal that I have for the rest of my days and my grown up children will also be affected for the rest of their lives.
The SNP is not interested in what is best for the UK. Arguably, they are far more interested in making the UK as bad a place to be …. because they believe that will increase the chances of an independent Scotland.
So, in commenting here on Wings, I try to show a different point of view to the “echo chamber” discussions that often take place. In more recent times, I have also taken the trouble, more often, to point out when commenters have moved from political debate to insulting stereotyping of millions of people. Rarely do Wings “home” supporters “correct” commenters when they do it … so I do.
Does that help?
I am a scottish nationalist, or as i would prefer to be known, a scottish patriot, as being a scottish nationalist seems to be equated in some quarters with being connected to Mr Hitler and his pals which is obviousley ludicrous to anyone with one functioning brain cell.
I want out of the european union, as it stands now its run by some kind of committee or old boys club as i like to think of it now, only an old boys club is less of a danger to us than this union is as it stands now.
All our lovely oil and fisheries will be up for grabs if we stay in this dangerous cartel of interests, let there be no doubt about that, they have tried to stop freedom of speech all over europe , and its still going on to this day, but they are being challenged through the courts now, you see the people of europe have learned, if they can use the courts to lock us up and curtail our freedoms, then we can use the same laws to show that what they are doing is unlawful, and is in effect a fragrant abuse of the laws that govern us all, and they are finding out, that our courts will not let them away with their corrupt practices.
Hi sensibledave.
The Scottish government is elected by voters in Scotland. The Scottish National Party form that government and have done so since 2007. From the SNP’s constitution:-
Aims
2. The aims of the Party shall be:
(a) Independence for Scotland; that is the restoration of Scottish national sovereignty by restoration of full powers to the Scottish Parliament, so that its authority is limited only by the sovereign power of the Scottish People to bind it with a written constitution and by such agreements as it may freely enter into with other nations or states or international organisations for the purpose of furthering international cooperation, world peace and the protection of the environment.
(b) the furtherance of all Scottish interests.
How is the Scottish government furthering Scottish interests, in respect of BREXIT, which you mentioned above?
Let’s take the alleged power grab by Westminster as an example. Somebody posted a rather fine analogy a few days ago.
Scotland put 111 devolved powers into an envelope and sent them to Brussels for the EU to look after. As the UK voted to leave the EU, Brussels will be posting those 111 powers back to Scotland.
However, Westminster wants some of those devolved powers to facilitate rather grubby sounding trade deals with the USA (as one example), powers relating to food standards, the environment, and so on.
When that envelope containing the 111 powers lands on the UK mainland, on its way to Scotland, the Westminster postman will open it, take out the powers it wants to steal, reseal the envelope and send it on its way.
That is the background to what you see as SNP attempts to wreck the BREXIT process.
“They want to use whatever threats, again real or imagined, to upset, or wreck or make more difficult than it already is, the Brexit process.”
We elected the SNP to stand up for Scotland. That’s what it is doing.
Remember, the UK is, supposedly, a union of two equal kingdoms. One of the kingdoms voted to remain in the EU. The other kingdom, on the whole, voted to leave, although its province voted to remain.
The UK government still hasn’t explained how the Good Friday Agreement will be upheld.
Here’s a wee scenario for you. Westminster will assume superiority and tell Scotland they are stealing the powers. Scotland will say, “Oh, yi bliddy think so?” and announce indyref2, with or without “permission” from Westminster. At the same time, there’ll be a referendum on the reunification of Ireland. If all goes according to plan, Northern Ireland will get what it wants, Scotland will get what it wants and England & Wales will get what they want.
Problem solved and everyone lives happily ever after.
Here is to ye’s excellent Wingers.
Ronnie Aitken.
Michael Forman.
Hugh Stewart.
Anna Knowles.
Paul Garbett.
Chris Milligan.
David Smith.
David Andrew.
Paul Davis.
Andy Thompson.
and recent Anonymous.
Almost six figures.
XXX,XXX
SO here’s another one from Europe:
We’re all just Prisoners in Paradise:
link to youtube.com
Welcome to Scotland above.
iScotland coming soon.
Yes.
It is possible I didn’t properly read what I quoted for a change, as I ignore most of the gobbledygook in those grievance laden victim complex postings. Ho hum.
Brian Doonthetoon 3:45 pm
… I didn’t need the lesson about what the Scottish government is for. The MPs representing constituencies all over the UK voted for the creation of Holyrood (nasty selfish scots hating bastards eh?).
You asked me why a comment here on Wings. I answered you. You probably agree with most of the points I have raised and I am sure you can see things from my point of view – and can therefore understand why I might comment.
yesindyref2 4:53 pm
… very classy sir/madam. We are “cool”!
Hi sensibledave.
So we agree the raison d’être for the existence of the Scottish parliament/government.
We Scots expect our governmemt to fight our corner. Whose corner are the UK Tories fighting?
I’d like to ask you a question. As a remainer, how do think the UK government is doing in organising BREXIT, eg negotiating a deal with the EU, negotiating any border between Ireland and Northern Ireland, agreeing principles with the Scottish parliament and Welsh assembly, and so on?
This may provide pause for thought…
link to weegingerdug.wordpress.com
Brian Doonthetoon @ 7.25
Em Brian….Ye didn’t actually get an answer tae the first question.
Here, does anybody feel like concentrating on attacking the Tories, their way of government, their policies, on these threads?
I know it’s a novel idea, but it might just work.
Brian Powell s8:09 am
You wrote “Here, does anybody feel like concentrating on attacking the Tories, their way of government, their policies, on these threads?
…. I think you are out of step with Ms Sturgeon. She is standing shoulder to shoulder with the government at the moment!
Just reading Fridtjof Nansen’s book, Norway and the Union with Sweden, 1905. Nansen was the Norwegian explorer and supporter of Norwegian independence.
“In Sweden it was regarded as probable that the Norwegians were really divided into parties incapable of acting together; “they are patient folk, and have been sat upon by Sweden before; they will put up with this new insult, even if they make a great fuss about it.”
Sweden was wrong about the Norwegians, but if you substitute England and Scotland there, it was spot on about Scotland’s ‘response’ to what happens to it.
The only change in attitude has come since the SNP became the government.
Great to see the fund raiser now exceeds £100,000! Really looking forward to Nicola firing the starting gun for Indyref2. Meanwhile enjoying Mrs May making an absolute fool of herself threatening Mr Putin with ordering the House of Windsor not to turn up to the the footie to watch England’s elimination in the first round. How he must be trembling with mirth.
Clive Scott 11.06
Yesterday: “Mrs May later met Ms Sturgeon for face-to-face talks at a Joint Ministerial Committee meeting in Downing Street on Wednesday afternoon.
As she left the meeting, Ms Sturgeon said those attending had been “united in our condemnation of Russia’s actions”.
She added: “I expressed my support for the initial steps that the prime minster has outlined in the House of Commons this afternoon.
… She Also tweeted on the subject … look it up.
Please write a piece for me on Ms Sturgeon’s making a foll of herself with her pathetic attempts at standing up to Russia. May be you think it is time for her to go?
Its a funny old world ( attacking russia )
There now, its all out in the open, russia is being blamed for a chemical attack on a father and daughter.
Any sensible killer or assassin does not try to leave any evidence that it was them that did the dastardly deed, or am i being to simplistic here, or am i pointing the finger somewhere else maybe.
But where else could that finger be pointed, russian gangsters, british intelligence, etc etc etc, well at this point in time nobody knows who did it, but there is one solid fact, there is not one bit of evidence to point to russia as the culprit.
Making a nerve agent can be done by any clever group of scientists/chemists, does not have to be a military group at all, but Mrs May and her bunch of liars, and we know they are liars, they lie to the scots all the time as if we are stupid, they say the chemical is russian and of military grade, whatever that means, its lies about russia, plain and simple, cause they don’t know for a fact the russians are involved with this particular incident.
Why are all these people wanting to make russia out as the bad guys when anything happens, what is their real agenda, here is a little suggestion, before the 2nd world war, the national socialists said the jews are our enemies and the people attacked the jews, because they believed what their rulers and media said to them, this russia accusation i believe is in the same vain, if we have anyone to blame, it gives us, the british government the right to safeguard our people, so lets make more bombs, business will boom in that area, and when and if things go wrong in all the areas we get involved in, heyyyyyyyyy, we can allways blame the russians, cause they are a bad lot don’t you know
Bill Not Ben 11.28
You wrote “Why are all these people (my insert: including Ms Sturgeon) wanting to make russia out as the bad guys when anything happens,”
Hmmm…
Annextion of Crimea
Ukraine
Supporting Syria
Supporting Iran
State sponsored doping of their athletes
Meddling in democratic elections
Cyber Crimes
The shooting down of a Malaysian passenger airline
Why would a country annex another country in contravention of the UN? Why would a country Invade Ukraine. Why would a country’s armed forces shoot down a passenger aircraft. etc, etc ..
… and then, deny to the world, that they have done any of those thing?
Why would anyone think that Russia was capable of doing bad things, has become a rogue state, and that they don’t care what anyone thinks?
Do tell Bill not Ben … and don’t forget to include Ms Sturgeon and her cabinet in your explanation.
Our very own nerve gas returns. Sensibledave. Want to compare against British war crimes Dave ? Think my list is longer.
Bob Mack 12.09
… very droll Bob! I am the only one keeping this thread alive.
Since Ms Sturgeon has expressed her support for the UK’s stance on these matters, the swivel-eyed Winger brigade have gone strangely quiet!
I am waiting for a Heedy, or a Peffers, or you (?) to tell Ms Sturgeon she is a warmongering imperialist with a deluded view of her, or her country’s importance or relevance in the world.
@Sensible,
This is only a thread about the total sums raised. All the real action is on previous thread. Oh well. I’m sure you were missed in any event.
Ms Sturgeon is playing a blinder. English tally Ho brigade see us as friends. When it all goes tits up she only has to say that she was acting on official information. Win/win.
Bob Mack 12.55
Alternatively, … she might just be reacting in the way that she believes that the majority of Scots would want her to react?
Indeed, playing a blinder! Just not what the swivel eyed ones wanted methinks!
@Sensible.
Certainly the Unionist element in Scotland. The rest of us want to stay alive as long as possible. That involves not sabre rattling at a country who could annihilate us completely should they wish. Common sense. Mind you,we could all die heroically as an alternative strategy and all that bluster would seem worthwhile No?
The Russian thing is odd, there seems little for the Russians to gain from doing this but they haven’t got a track record that exactly shines with glory either. Far too many in the public sphere in Russia have met untimely ends.
So while I can’t see why the Russians would want to do this, it certainly doesn’t preclude that they did. Presumably, Nicola has seen more than we have so I can’t say her brief comment on the matter perturbs me greatly. One must hope that the three victims all survive and that Sergei can shed some light on who they bumped into or saw on that day.
Part of me hopes that it was loose cannons or third parties because if it was an action that was sanctioned by the Russian Government there is a danger of this spiralling into another cold war and arms race.
Bob Mack 1.13
Notwithstanding your completely different position to the official SNP stance on this matter, could you explain why expelling diplomats is “sabre rattling” whilst assassinating people on the UK mainland with a WMD isn’t?
Appeasement and pacifism doesn’t stop well armed, aggressive, rogue nations Bob. Unless you can give me an example from history where it did? No? I thought not?
@Sensible,
Certainly didn’t stop Britain from slaughtering millions in S Africa,Malaysia and India. I give you that.
What do you actually think the UK is capable of doing to Russia Dave. Send in a frigate? Build up tanks on their borders?
Come on Dave,tell us all. Why is Russia going to be afraid of the UK? They are laughing at us whether they did it or not
Answers on a last will and testament form please.
Bob Mack 1.49
It is interesting to try and decipher and understand your “reading” of this matter.
Please tell me if I am wrong, but the only two options that you appear to believe exist are either …
1) allow Russia to do whatever it wants wherever it wants to do it.
Or,
2) be obliterated by a nuclear attack.
Is that about the size of it Bob?
No Dave. Option 3. Hide behind the skirts of those nations we voted to leave in the EU. Option 4. Hind behind daddy America. All options involve seeking protection whilst mouthing off at Russia. British way you see.
Handandshrimp
I pretty much agree with your summation.
The scary bit to me (that people like Bob seem to miss) is trying to understand the end game.
The Russians know, as we all do, that if they were to attempt to “obliterate” us then they may well succeed … whilst achieving exactly the same ends for themselves (i.e. mutually assured destruction) via a volley of ICBMs arriving on their heads.
So, are we heading towards another “Cuban Missle” type game of brinkmanship to test the resolve of NATO? Are these events (as I listed above) a series of deliberate provocations to get a feel so to speak? Is the next move to annex a minor NATO country and see what happens (assuming that such annexation would result in a timed ultimatums along the lines of “withdraw by X time or we attack those forces”)?
Maybe its just about Russian domestic politics and these events are about Putin playing to his population in advance of the next election and, in reality, he has no plans to “Push” further.
The problem is always about trying to apply logic and reason to the behavior of a man that may have lost his ability to be logical and reasonable in our sense of those words. Is he possibly a Sadam Hussain, a Kim Yung Un, a Hitler … where we just cannot think like they do? We don’t understand the mind set that wants to oppress and suppress ordinary folk with the threat of or application of death.
@Dave,
Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Just as well we have the (sensible) and reasonable Donald Trump at our back then ha ha ha ha ha.
Somebody tries to kill and ex/russian spy and all of a sudden we could have a nuclear war as a possibility.
This is from my spies in the Kremlin, they tell me that Mr Putin is sitting there every day and talking to himself about committing suicide, yes it seems the man is a fecking raving lunatic right enough, off to find my gas mask and a packet of tunes, well they do say tunes help you breathe more easily.. lol
Bob Mack
You wrote “Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Just as well we have the (sensible) and reasonable Donald Trump at our back then ha ha ha ha ha.”
I have no idea what you are going on about.
I am waiting for another option from you Bob. I suggested ypou think only 1 & 2 exist. What else have you got? Is that its? ReallY?
Your anxiety is showing Dave. Not like you to make typing errors. You write absolute drivel. Utterances from the local Tory Party manifesto..
Britain is a has been, occasionally washing it’s dirty shirt collars to appear as it always saw itself in the world scheme.
Take on Russia? In a pigs eye ( tribute to Mr Cameron).
Trident? Not without Donalds say so. We are like the wee guy you always find behind the big guy, and who always urges the big guy on to do something because he can’t himself.
Tatty,threadbare, and as frightening as a Cindy doll. That’s UK for you.
What can the UK do? Nothing Dave, but beat a hasty retreat whilst trying to maintain its dignity.
I saw recently a short Youtube video by I assume an elderly Scots woman who was suggesting those that voted ‘NO’ were affluent and did not want to upset the applecart and those in the ‘YES’ camp were the poorest and who merely wanted more Government handouts. That maybe the perception which must be dispelled by all of us who are in the ‘former’ category who simply want self determination and Independence for all its ills /benefits. Get out there and start spelling out the facts.
It’s the way I tell ’em.
Bob Mack 4.28
“What can the UK do? Nothing Dave, but beat a hasty retreat whilst trying to maintain its dignity.”
… You have made it clear that would be your plan. Is it only faceless bloggers that you have the nerve to make a stand against Bob?
Fortunately, Ms Sturgeon, her Cabinet, the British Government, the USA, Germany and France are made of sterner stuff Bob.
@Brian Powell
Pretty cool class of frigate in the Norwegian navy, built in Spain by Navantia, for around £360 million each (probably £600 million at today’s prices). They have 5 of them. Shows what can be done all the same. NH90 helicopter will compare reasonably with the Merlin when converted fully to ASW for them, but cheaper. Also carries the Naval Strike Missile which is very cool.
link to en.wikipedia.org
@Sensibledave,
No Dave. Not sterner stuff, just bluff and bluster.they will all fold like a pack of cards in a gale. You as well Dave. Keyboard warrior. Brave as a lion —-until you meet another lion. Sign of being scared Dave.
Hi sensibledave.
You have neglected to answer the questions I asked you last night at 7.25pm.
I’ll repaste them to save you scrolling back.
We Scots expect our governmemt to fight our corner. Whose corner are the UK Tories fighting?
I’d like to ask you a question. As a remainer, how do think the UK government is doing in organising BREXIT, eg negotiating a deal with the EU, negotiating any border between Ireland and Northern Ireland, agreeing principles with the Scottish parliament and Welsh assembly, and so on?
Donald Trump
( washington ) Its a funny old world !
My spies in the white house have informed me that the president has at last learned all the political games being played and how to play them.
He was heard to say, i just condemned russia to keep them brits and all the rest of those russian haters happy, i know they have no evidence about who actually committed the chemical attack on that sleezy russian ("Tractor" - Ed), who gave up his own people for dirty money, but heyyyyyy, just tell the brits and the leaders of the european cartel what they want to hear, that keeps them happy, and gives their fake media something to write about.
Have ye a good 17th of March mornin’ to ye…
David Fildes.
Wendy Henderson.
Margaret Clarke.
Donald Stevenson.
Philip Hogg.
Martin Macdonald.
Aaron Adams.
Stephen Barty.
Alan Black.
Stuart Simpson.
And many more excellent Wingers.
Returning you to Cairnstoon:
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Or shop:
link to wingsoverscotland.charitycheckout.co.uk
Its a funny old world ( war names )
Its british wars that killed millions over the centuries, i will just call Ireland one nation for the sake of this question.
If Scotland, Ireland and Wales had all voted against all the wars when it came to a vote in the english parliament would all those wars not have taken place because 3 parts of the union said no.
So if 3 parts of the union say no to the wars, that means its basically england that’s going to war and not britain as a whole, so its english wars, not british.
British nationalists really believe their Russian sideshow will make their brexit disaster disappear. You’ve got to laugh.
I don’t know who’s “running” sensibledave…….but they are getting their money’s worth.
Independence, nothing less will do.
Its a funny old world ( being sensible )
Being sensible is not accusing people or countries of chemical attacks just because you think it could be them, i could make a list of all the countries and people or agencies it could have been, but then that basically includes everybody in the world, so i won’t bother cause i am sensible
Bob Mack 7.28
Hey bob … I’m a nobody. You should be shouting your insults at Ms Sturgeon! She is the one that is speaking for your party and your country on this matter. Go on, tell her how useless and inept she is and how futile and irrelevant her statements regarding this situation are.
No? Why’s that Bob?
Bob Mack
…. I have been thinking about your stance on this. Being the open minded sort of chap that I am, I have listened to what Ms Sturgeon has had to say, together with Mrs May, Trump, Mr Macron, Ms Merkel … so that is one view. On the other side there is you, Corbyn and Putin.
Hmmm. If you don’t mind Bob, for now, I will go with the view of the leaders of countries of open, western democracies, rather than the twisted, capitalism and democracy-hating approach if you, Corbyn and Putin.
Bob Mack
… just listening to the SNP chap on Peston … are you going to tell him he is a sabre rattling, useless, blow hard Bob?
Haha! You need to find a new party to support Bob!
Oi! Rock. (Dick)
Less of the accusations of ineptitude.
Compared to the UK Tory Government,
our SNP Government has shown respect for the under- privilidged, respect for the environment, respect the elderly.
The Tories set policy based on risk to their electability.
The SNP strives for a fairer nation (to be created before we are extinguished or dragged to hell to maintain our elitist masters)
Sorry confused Rock with Sensibledave there. Or did I.
Bob Mack
Cat got your keyboard Bob?
Sensibledave = arrogant ignorant offensive British Nationalist.
Bill Hume 5:44 pm
You wrote “I don’t know who’s “running” sensibledave…….but they are getting their money’s worth.”
No one runs me. I answer to no one. I am no one’s lackie. I have independent thought. ….. you should try it some time – or doesn’t your programming allow it?
Hi sensibledave.
RE: “Cat got your keyboard Bob?”
I’ll refer you to two comments that you have declined to address.
link to wingsoverscotland.com
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Brian 12.54
… you are going to have to be more specific Brian. Write your two questions down and post them. I will gladly respond.
sensibledave – click on the 2nd link above.
Brian
Found them! When you read my responses, please understand some factual background.
Please understand, I am a citizen of the UK governed by one Parliament based in Westminster. When I vote, I expect every other citizen of the UK’s vote to carry the same weight as mine, no more, no less – be that in a UK General Election, or a UK referendum.
I assume therefore, in the context of us having a sensible conversation, that you would respect and agree with those expectations as being fair and reasonable as far as I am concerned.
You wrote 1.”We Scots expect our government to fight our corner. Whose corner are the UK Tories fighting?
As I have stated in previous comments, in matters pertaining to issues of devolved power, Holyrood is your Parliament. For non-devolved matters that are dealt with at Westminster. Then Scots, just like like the good folk of South Oxfordshire, are democratically bound by the results and outcomes of the UK voting outcome.
As you well know, there was a movement to have a referendum in Scotland on the subject of Scottish Independence. The MPs, representing constituencies across the whole of the UK, voted at Westminster for Scotland to have a referendum. The referendum was had and the result is known. The people of Scotland voted to remain part of the UK and to carry on having exactly the same rights as me, living in South Oxfordshire, when it came to matters governed by Westminster.
Scottish MPs have exactly the same rights as my MP, and an MP in Liverpool, Newcastle, Wales or Northern Ireland or wherever. The outcome of the UK’s EU referendum meant that the majority of folk in Scotland, and the majority of folk in South Oxfordshire, were outvoted, freely and fairly by a majority that lived elsewhere in the UK.
Therefore the UK is leaving the EU.
Therefore it is very important to ALL UK citizens that the UK gets the best possible exit deal.
The Scottish government has the democratic right to have a view on these events and say whatever it wants to say. It can even take the stupid position that it agrees that the people of the UK voted to leave the EU – but didn’t vote to leave the Single Market.
What is cannot be allowed to do is take away my rights. SCottish voters cannot have the right of veto over voters elsewhere. When they voted to remain in the UK – they voted to be remain a UK citizen – just like me. Their votes cannot have some special, power of veto status on UK decision making.
So, in answer to your Q1, The Tories, who happen to be in government, are “fighting” to implement the democratic decision of the citizens of the UK. As it happens, in the most recent General ELection, knocking on for 90% of UK citizens voted for UK political parties whose manifesto commitment was to leave the EU and to leave the Single Market. So the UK government is simply seeking to to implement the decision of the people of the UK.
Finally, the irony that I recently explained to yesindyref2 is that had Scottiish Leave voters voted Remain, that the UK would be Remaining. MY Remain vote would have won the day … if it hadn’t been for 1m Leave voting Scots, that are still in the UK, because SCotland voted to remain in the UK.
If you have read and understood the facts laid out to you above then you will see that I, a Remain voter living in South Oxfordshire, have absolutely no truck with SNP based victimhood and grievance on this matter.
YOur Q2
“I’d like to ask you a question. As a remainer, how do think the UK government is doing in organising BREXIT, eg negotiating a deal with the EU, negotiating any border between Ireland and Northern Ireland, agreeing principles with the Scottish parliament and Welsh assembly, and so on.
Given that the UK voted to leave the UK (which meant leaving the Single Market and the Customs Union – because everyone told us that would be the outcome) … the Government are doing OK so far. They have an enormously difficult task anyway, but the assistance being given to the EU in the negotiations by parties like the SNP mean that the job is tougher than it should be. Ideally, the government should have everyone behind them – but they dont. Remainers carry on remoaning and repeatedly highlight the EU’s position saying what we can’t have and can’t achieve in the negotiations. We can’t cherry pick and we can’t have our cake, etc. They take this stance not because they think it is best for the UK’s negotiating position in the negotiations – but because they hope to make life as difficult and uncomfortable as possible for the government at every stage. That is their right. It wont succeed and we will end up with a worse deal as result maybe.
As a citizen of the UK that has left the EU, the rest of my life and that of my children risks being damaged by those that continue to make life as difficult as possible. You know this, which is why you do it. You hope that a less successful UK will lead to a greater chance of an independent Scotland.
It is your right to pursue that course. It is my right, and the right of the rest of the citizens of the UK and our Government, to try to ensure that you achieve as little damage as possible. As an example, Ms Sturgeon isn’t involved in the negotiations to Leave the the EU – because she is not interested in trying to do the best deal possible for me.
She, along with the SNP, you and a few others just want to wreck. She, along with the SNP, you and a few others have therefore been sidelined from the negotiations as you have absolutely nothing to offer. You refuse to accept the view of the majority you cannot be trusted to represent the majority.
The situation with respect to NI will, in my view be resolved. Either the EU will erect a border (we wont) and create a situation where 44% of Ireland’s exports have to go through a hard border check – or they will agree a much softer version of a border of the type we have all heard described. Do the voters in Ireland and Northern Ireland have votes that have the power veto what the majority of the citizens of the UK want to do? No they don’t.
With respect to Wales, Scotland and devolved powers and agreeing principles,… again they are relatively minor and simple issues that can be addressed as part of the overall deall we do with the EU. I do not have any truck with these “power grab” accusations. Again a solution will be found.
… hope that answers your questions.
Delighted to support WoS. Indyref2 getting closer every day and we need this sites analysis and observations on the pap served as ‘news’ in Scotland. As others have also said, i would also like to see a Wee Gold/White Book being authored and distributed well before the next Indyref. Or perhaps even a special Brexit edition detailing the political, economic and social consequences of Brexit on Scotland.
Sensibledave = arrogant offensive ignorant British Nationalist propagandist.
This is a very serious matter, go to youtube and google in this title.
The Child Abuse Cover Up A Police Whistleblower Speaks.
sensibledave
Lets get serious here, there are about 600 english MPS in the house of commons, how many MPs does Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland have in the house of commons.
So when you start to talk about a United Kingdom vote, you are correct, but its not a fair system when the vast majority of those votes elect english MPs to the house of commons.
If you think that is what democracy is all about, then i do feel that you need to waken up to the reality of this union and its flawed system of so called democracy
Chucked in fifty bucks this morning from Canada. Hope to fly home on a Scottish passport in the not too distant future.
Donation made, get building that rocket!
@Sensibledave,
I think your problem lies in an illusion of an all inclusive Democracy. It is one thing for two countries to unite. It is quite another when one country gives itself ten times the voting influence than the other. There are two countries who should have equal representation in the grander scheme of things. After all, you now have English votes for English laws as well as 10x the representation in Parliament.
Why not equal representation on status as an equal partner in the Union ?
Hi sensibledave.
From the SNP’s 2016 manifesto:-
“We believe that the Scottish Parliament should have the right to hold another referendum if there is clear and sustained evidence that independence has become the preferred option of a majority of the Scottish people – or if there is a significant and material change in the circumstances that prevailed in 2014, such as Scotland being taken out of the EU against our will.”
THE SNP have put forward numerous proposals since the EU referendum, all rebuffed by the Tories. Did you like none of them?
The Scottish parliament has the preliminary legislation in place for indyref2; all that is left is the date to be decided.
Brian Doonthetoon 4:40 pm
You wrote “THE SNP have put forward numerous proposals since the EU referendum, all rebuffed by the Tories. Did you like none of them?
Again, I will respond on the basis that your is a serious question.
I believe that it is disingenuous of you to pretend that the SNP proposals were meant to do anything other delay/wreck the Brexit process.
It is simply not possible to reconcile a binary referendum choice with half arsed, half way, some in, some out, type outcome. You know that.
SCotland is part of the UK. It voted positively to be part of the UK. It must abide (as I have to) with that which is decided by the majority in the UK. Whatever that is.
With respect to indyref2, doubtless Ms Sturgeon will try to cause as much trouble and confusion as she can. Everyone knows that. She has raised the issue of indyref2 and she has raised the spectre of using the courts. We all know she is plotting and scheming to try and do as much damage to the UK’s negotiating position as possible. Which is why no one listens to anything she has to say with respect to Brexit.
She will do what she will do anyway. She made the “I’m not bluffing” comment which suggests she is going to try something soon. We will have to wait and see.
In the long comment I made above, I asked you to consider my position. I am a citizen of the UK represented by the Westminster Government and I asked you to accept that I can only accept equal voting rights for all UK citizens. The notion that a Scots voter should have more rights than me in a UK referendum or General election is just silly … and you know it.
Lots of popcorn will be consumed whilst we watch the antics of the various players. Those that want the UK to prosper – and those that don’t.
The very interesting side show is indeed the issue of Scottish Independence. In my humble opinion, either Ms Sturgeon wins indyref2 before the UK Brexits – or the concept will be lost, literally, for another generation. I cannot conceive of a situation, for 25 years at least, where Scots will vote to leave the UK once we have left the EU. Once we are out of the EU, Scots will want to “wait and see” what happens economically. If all goes well then they will not vote to leave the UK. If it goes badly …. then heaven knows what will happen..
Hi sensibledave.
Can I remind you that the question asked in the EU referendum in 2016 was,
“Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?”
That’s the organisation known as the “European Union”. There was no mention on the ballot paper of leaving the EEA or the single market.
The proposals put forward by the SNP would have let the UK remain in both, whilst leaving the EU. Unfortunately, the UK government is blinkered by the xenophobic “controls over immigration” sentiments displayed by some, particularly in England.
The SNP has been exploring all avenues but, as I typed, has been rebuffed by the Tories. It wasn’t an overwhelming “Leave” vote (51.89%) but I’ll be happy with that come indyref2.
link to en.wikipedia.org
Would i remind a certain person here that the SNP is a party that is based on getting scottish independence, that has allways been the case, we make no apologies for that stance to anyone.
So to try and muddy the waters by saying the SNP are trying to do this and do that when it comes to the brexit situation is not true, they are looking out for the interests of the scottish people, now we have the tories letting down scottish fishermen and even their own MSP are angry with their own government at westminster who have once again betrayed scotland when there was no need to, it seems as usual that scottish interests are expendable to the tory party to enable them to get deals in other areas
Some folk are deluding themselves that the UK will still exit the CFP after the transitional period.
Trouble is the city of London will be reaping the benefits of this fix with ongoing access to EU markets and Scotland’s fishermen are well and truly stitched up.
Anyone not admitting this must have a religeus faith in London rule.
Sensibledave = arrogant offensive paid to talk rubbish British Nationalist.
Bill not Ben 9.54
You wrote “Would i remind a certain person here that the SNP is a party that is based on getting scottish independence, that has allways been the case, we make no apologies for that stance to anyone.”
I am assuming that comment was to me.
No one has any doubt that the SNP’s main goal is to achieve Scottish Independence. I have no problem with that. We live in a free and fair democracy thankfully.
All I have pointed out is that it is totally disingenuous to suggest that the SNP is somehow desperately seeking to “help” the UK (and its non-Scottish citizens) in achieving a good outcome from the negotiations … it isn’t.
You only have to read many of the previous threads to see that that it is true – where the discussion is about making life difficult for the government on Brexit. Again, the SNP has every right to do that. The rest of us have the right to recognise that is what is happening and act accordingly.
I noticed that you did not mention the sell out by the brexit negotiators on the scottish fishing industry, it seems that now the uk is still allowed to be part of the fishing industry, but has no say about who actually is allowed to fish there.
And you talk about the SNP, scotland has no say in any of this farce, if you notice, its only english MPs that are there negotiating, no representatives from the other 3 parts of the union you love so much to blether about, seems that people like yourself like democracy as long as you allways hold the winning hand in the whole sorry rigged process.
Alba Gu snooker loopy!
The scottish government not agreeing with the UK/european union alliance to still stop our fishermen from fishing our waters anytime they like, yes that’s very disingenuous of them to disagree with something that is a betrayal by the UK government of scotland’s fishing industry.
Or do you not think scotland has a right to say to these people, piss off, go away and think again, cause we are not having it.
If i was in power in scotland, nobody would tell scottish fishermen when to fish, they would be told, go out their and fish, this is our territory not english, and certainly not belonging to spain or any other plunderer that’s killing our fishing grounds without impunity
@Sensibledave @Bill not Ben,
Have you two lovebirds been living in a cave somewhere?
Fergus Ewing has made the fishing situation very clear indeed. It is the UK government selling them down the river. Nobody else.
Its truly amazing, the scottish whiskey and food industries are worth about 4 billion a year, lets take the whiskey, the english treasury takes most of the profits made from whiskey, and what does scotland get in return, well we have lots of foodbanks for a start, and people dying with cancer losing their benefits, after all you may have a year to live, but your still able to work until they put you into a coma when the pain is to much to bare, and allow you to die with your family watching you fade away with some kind of dignity, and wishing it was all over with
@Bill not Ben,
£6 billion on most recent figures. That was 2 weeks ago.
Bob Mac
What are you on about the UK government, so your actually telling us that scotland has a part to play in a UK government, scotland has no part to play in deciding our fishing industry, so stop accusing us Nats of not putting the blame where it belongs, its the english conservative party, masquerading as a United Kingdom party, a United Kingdom which has never existed btw, and is a little term though up by people many centuries ago to keep scotland wales and northern ireland under the yoke.
Nuda Veritas
@Bill not Ben,
You appear to have a problem intrpreting what people actually write. I suggest you have a cup of tea and read what I have written again.
“It is the UK government who have sold them down the river”
Understand now?
Very happy to make a donation. Wings does very valuable work and is a key part of the Independence movement. Keep up the good work.
“Last 24 hours: £9,708”
That’s funny 🙂
I suggest another article about it in maybe a week’s time …
I tried to send you a donation but stalled at the PayPal hurdle.
Did you receive it please?
I tried to send you a donation but stalled at the PayPal hurdle.
Did you receive it please?
No response to previous comment
@Jim Lynch,
Better to use “contact” icon at top of wings front page.
The EU has preserved the North Sea fishery using quotas, it had gone to the dogs by overfishing & Scottish boats, no angels! landing black-fish & being heavily fined. We have a bad record anent overfishing, the east coast herring fishery collapsed years ago. Time these trawler skippers realised that the fish belong to the Scottish people, they are just permitted to fish it.
Fred
You are perfectly correct there was over fishing in the past, the navigational stuff enabled the fishermen to find the fish a lot easier, unfortunately they did not realise that they where catching everything and not leaving the younger fish to grow, that’s why they now have bigger holes in their nets to prevent that happening, but to the main point of this whole thing, scottish fishermen are being told they can only fish 2 days a week, but then the european union allows other countries to come to scottish waters to fish when our fishermen are forced to stay in harbour, so the scottish fishermen are not fishing but the spaniards and everyone else are out there fishing and our skippers are struggling to make the payments on their ships, some of those guys are millions in debt to the banks for the loans they got to buy their fishing boats, is that fair on guys just trying to make a living in a very dangerous industry at the best of times
Bob Mac
You said me and that other lovebird are living in a cave, mmmm
Well i said its the english government that sold the fishermen down the river, you can call it the UK government if you like, but when did the SNP get involved with your UK government as you call it, i seem to remember the tories did not want to even speak to the SNP, i presume you know that scotland is supposed to be a partner in this so called union , now if you cannot interpret that, then don’t bother replying to any of my posts in the future, i don’t like what i say being misrepresented and misquoted by you or anyone else
@Bill not Ben,
I’m not sure you know what your saying most of the time.
Bob Mack
You don’t have to agree with anything i say, in fact i wish you would not comment on anything i say, and this is because, calling 2 people lovebirds and say they are living in a cave, makes any comments you make to me an others worthless, because if you cannot respect the people here, then don’t expect to be given any respect back.
I don’t actually care what you think of any of my comments, to me you have lost the right with your whole attitude and disrespect here to be of any relevence to me, so just go elsewhere and peddle your nonesense and give the rest of us the right to comment without having to put up with you.
That is my last word on this, as far as i am concerned i will not deal with your attitude any more
@Bill not Ben,
Like you (hopefully) I pay my dues to comment on this site. If that doesn’t suit you,tough.
O/T
Seems increasingly obvious that ‘agents provocateur’ have become a real and present problem within the Wings comment threads.
Giving respect to others………… not a problem
Disrespecting others ………… you have a problem
…. I think I have been insulted!
I’ve never thought of myself as a “Lovebird”. I think sometimes I am beautiful as a swan whilst sometimes swooping like a Golden Eagle and taking out prey with a brilliantly incisive piece of prose.
Anyway, today I am sensibledave and tomorrow I will be Peffers. On Fiday, I am planning to be Nana. Over the weekend I will be signing in alternately as Heedy, yindy2, Bob Mack, Bill not Ben. On Mondays, I like to put on a fat suit, practice my harshest Glaswegian accent, chew a few nails and then launch myself on the ‘net as the pooperhero “Proud Cybernat”.
… see you there! haha!
Our First Minister has come out in favour of blaming the russians for the chemical attack in Salisbury.
It appears whatever this chemical is, it can be produced anywhere, and there is actually a book online that provides the formula to make it.
The americans are one country that has made it, and there are many others, my point is, the UK government have said, that it is a chemical that could have come from russia, not did, but could have, and that is the evidence for the prosecution M’lud, or as i would call it, no evidence at all.
A notable scientist has said that any student in chemistry could knock this stuff up without a problem, and he works in the business just 7 miles from Salisbury, and he has stated that the UK government was on to his working place, and put pressure on them to blame the russian, but they said no, but they where allowed to state, that it could have come from russia, and btw , the guy works in the same place as Mr Kelly had worked, you know the guy that committed suicide in a field near his home
I used to be a werwolf, but i’m allright nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooow…. lol
@sensibledave
I wouldn’t worry about it, I think you’re sensibledave and are what you are, not pretending to be something other than what you are, though not too sure about the sensible all the same.
Hmm.
600 english MPs in the house of commons, 59 scottish MPs in the house of commons, and they call that democracy.
Imperialism is alive and well, scotland even gets to build their warships for them, how lucky we are to be ruled by a london government lol
Notice that Bill not Ben has gone from barely literate unpunctuated posts to fluent prose. How odd eh?
Seems some people need to get a life, attacking people for their gramma and punktuation as if they have studied the english language in more deetail than the rest of us, when it’s obvious they have not done so, as their punktuation and gramma is not as pearfect as they seem to thinc, and they are not as pairfect as they seem to thinc they are either……… lol
yesindyref2 4:20 pm
You wrote “I wouldn’t worry about it, I think you’re sensibledave and are what you are, not pretending to be something other than what you are, though not too sure about the sensible all the same.”
>… thanks yindy. The thing that gets me about this sort of thing is that we josh around about conspiracy theorists and tin foil hats – but some contributers clearly do actually believe the allegations above. Hey Ho.
Anyway, what’s next to discuss? How about I propose a motion?
“this house (site) believes that Ms Sturgeon and the leaders of the EU are right to support the UK government in their belief that the Russians are (most likely) responsible for the outrage in Salisbury and that diplomatic relationships and other initiatives should be adjusted to reflect these beliefs.”
… discuss!
If just 20% (60000) put in an average of £15, we would have a fighting fund of nearly £1million. Yet we have just over £100,000 in funds for a now or never chance for independence.
@sensibledave
I think they’re right to support the UK Government, but full stop before the rest of it.
Hi sensibledave at 12.32pm.
You typed,
Anyway, what’s next to discuss? How about I propose a motion?
“this house (site) believes that Ms Sturgeon and the leaders of the EU are right to support the UK government in their belief that the Russians are (most likely) responsible for the outrage in Salisbury and that diplomatic relationships and other initiatives should be adjusted to reflect these beliefs.”
Maybe you should read the stuff that we are not getting from the BBC, ITV and Channel 4?
link to off-guardian.org
link to moonofalabama.org
Plus the info the Craig Murray, former UK ambassador – whose blog is under DOS attack (Why?) – has posted in the last couple of days:-
link to craigmurray.org.uk
I propose a motion, its a fact that the UK government are selling weapons to an arab country that’s killing tens of thousands of people in Yemen, and just lately we had the leader of that same country meet the prime minister of england and the Queen of england. do we as a site think this visit should have been allowed to take place
Bill Not Ben
I agree with you that our arms industry poses many ethical and moral issues. Whether it is Saudi Arabia, China, Turkey, the USA , or one of many others then, clearly, there are difficulties in weighing the pros and cons.
So, in agreeing with you, what do you think the Scottish government’s policy should be? I read this:
“According to Scottish Enterprise, the defence industry in Scotland employs over 12,600 people with annual sales of over £1.8billion. Many of the biggest firms are marine companies which are involved primarily in naval defence.
BAE Systems in Glasgow builds warships including the Type 45 destroyers. Rosyth-based Babcock Marine is helping to build the UK’s new Queen Elizabeth Class aircraft carriers.
Some of the companies in Scotland are domestic while others are outposts of international firms such as QinetiQ, Raytheon, Thales and Finmeccanica. Finmeccanica is the world’s eighth largest defence contractor and is part-owned by the Italian government.
Its subsidiary, Selex Galileo in Edinburgh, is heavily involved in high-tech aviation research for the Eurofighter, SAAB Vixen and the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter.
CAAT say that Finmeccanica has supplied drones to Pakistan, howitzers to Nigeria and helicopters to Algeria, Libya and Turkey.” END.
Bae systems used to be part of a scottish shipbuilding industry that could build any ships they liked, and most of the ships where for the commercial industry, or ferries, cargo ships, etc etc etc.
Now BAE systems can not build these kind of vessels because the UK government has made that part of the clyde military vessels only.
Scotland does not need to rely on just building for the UK war machine, we where doing very well thank you without it, in fact we where doing a hell of a lot better, the clyde used to employ tens of thousands of men, we have an independent shipyard at Port Glasgow, which has a full order book and will have for years to come, and they have taken on apprentices to keep the skills on the clyde, what happened with BAE systems, they where promised all sorts of contracts if the people of scotland remained in the union, but after the referendum, all of a suddenly those promises disappeared, you see, what the workers did not realise was that westminster only said if we leave the union we could not have any work from the war machine, no promises about the years to come as far as work was concerned.
Pensioners where even told they might not get their pensions, the biggest lie of all, if you pay into a pension fund that fund must by law pay you that pension, but according to the UK government it might not, and not one of the MSM in scotland reported on this crude lie to blackmail those that did not know any better
I have lived in scotland all my life, i remember the QE2 coming down the clyde in 1967, they had to cut a lump out of the Inchgreen Drydock to accomodate it as it was so big.
My father worked on that ship, he was a joiner who mostly worked the building sites, but it was good money and he liked the idea of being part of the building of the liner.
My father allways worked, but there was not enough work on the clyde for every joiner as its obvious, joiners are not needed until the ship is nearing the finishing stages, my father had to go to england to the shopfitting to make a living, i have a friend a few doors away who has to go to Newcastle to get decent money at the shopfitting.
I personally did not fancy the shipyards or the building sites, to bloody cold as i had experienced it for a few months in the winter, my father told me not to get into his trade as it was hard in the winter, no heaters on a building site, even when the house was weatherproof, it was still cold and miserable conditions to work in, so i plodded along in lots of jobs, i even sold insurance at one point, then i decided i would work for myself, no more bosses, i eventually retired at 40 years old and have never had to work since that day to this, i could never understand why my father never started his own joinery business,he seemed to be quite happy just to take a wage without the responsibility of owning his own firm, and he could do it all from form work to the finishing and allways did a first class job, he took a job as a gaffer once, and never did it again, he said to me, i had to bag guys i new as they where not upto the job in hand, and i had to do it, but he decided he would not be the guy to do it, when he got his pension he retired and never worked again, but one thing he did do, he taught me all the tricks of the joiner trade, which i am called upon now and again if any of my family needs a little work done, they all seemed to want their toilets boxed in lol.
Anyway, just a little piece of my experiences of working life, i never did really like working, you see life is to short to waste, and when you get the chance to retire, go for it, and do as i do, travel the world, go and experience different countries at least once a year, lovely Jubbly !
Bill not Ben
… you may or may not be correct in your assertions and opinions … but what you didn’t do was tell me what the Scottish Government’s policy should be going forward?
If someone becomes a leader and decision maker at a given point in time – then they have to make the decisions from that moment on. They do not have the luxury of saying “I wouldn’t start from here”!
… back to you Bill not Ben.
@sensibledave
That’s quite an old SG document, it’s now of course the T26 not the T45, the QEC, one is already commissioned and completed rotary wing aircraft trials, the other launched though work still being done. And Selex Galileo is part of Leonardo who employ 1,800 in Edinburgh, making amongst other things the Raven ES AESA radar for the Gripen, Eurofighter and F35-B (used for Beyond Visual Range detection and missile guidance).
As for the morality of drones and even war itself, we may indeed be back to bows and arrows and swords in a few years, as lasers can disable and even destroy missiles and the drones themselves:
link to ukdefencejournal.org.uk
There’s a shipborne version, land ones – and they’re working on airborne ones as well, though weight and size is a bit of a problem so far. Won’t be long before we all have our own laser jacket missile and bullet defence all the same, reacting at the speed of light. I’m only half joking, as there’s also been a little work on star trek like force shields. Back to the stone age through technological advancements, where’s my club?
Airborne – the problem is getting enugh power I think.
Special thanks to donor Anonymous, yer some giver btw 😉
– Anonymous(s)
– Kenneth McDougall
– Janet Connor
– Lee Taylor
– Neil Campbell
– Terence Davies
– Ian Primrose(s)
– Paul Gillespie(s)
– Cameron Adam(s)
– Mark Rowantree
Just over 1,000 comments to go until Wings hits…
Comment number 750,000.
Three-quarter mill.
Wowski.
Cactus
…… leave it with me!
Edward Heath’s government wanted to close the upper clyde shipyards cause heath would not give them a measly 6 million quid, so we had the work in with the great Jimmy Reid and a few others, Heath’s government give in eventually, but then we had Thatcher forced upon us, and she took revenge on the clyde for heath, i have no doubt about that.
The clyde is now picking up again with the likes of Ferguson Marine having built the new infrastructure to handle bigger ships in their yard, and when we become independent BAE systems will be utalised to built merchant ships again, instead of war machines that scotland does not need and never wanted, all we need is a small navy in case we need it, which is very unlikely as scotland will not attack anyone as an independent nation.
And btw, Sweden has a large merchant shipbuilding industry which does not rely on building warships, i live beside the clyde, i have seen with my own eyes what has been done to it over the years, i cannot remember the last time i saw an upper clyde built merchant ship or any other ship apart from a warship coming down the river, and that is not enough to give tens of thousand of people work, as it used to be, we are an island that needs ships, so why are we not building them like other countries are doing, years ago we even had Lithgows on the lower clyde close down, now we have lovely new houses there, but unfortunately, no shipyard, and that yard gave a lot of families in the district work for over one hundred years, and now that’s gone for ever, Why!, who benefitted from that closure, and most importantly, who let it happen, lots of men never worked again,so the state paid dole money for people who could have been working and paying into the system instead of taking out
Hehe, ah reckon the WOS-F18 TFC total will rocket up…
link to youtube.com
This comin’ Friday the 30th March 2018.
It will be payday for many.
This is the BIG one.
THIS IS IT!
i.
Did donate early, but then again, to recycle a well-worn joke, give early and give often. 🙂 Well, not that, exactly, but I realised that I’d probably find it workable to give a wee bit every month. So that can happen too.
Mony a mickle and all that.
Things are getting really quite alarming and scary now.I really do value this analysis of our dear old British press.
O/T
WINGERS NIGHT OUT 7TH APRIL
OTTERS HEAD, WOODSIDE, GLENROTHES.
KICK OFF 7:00pm
Full details just been posted on “off topic” page. Hope to see lots of you there.
Pension pay day allowed me to contribute but did also give less than first intended due to Clara needing some too. Keep up the great work Stu et al. May we collectively continue to incumbuggerance the Westmonster trolls.
Just pitched in for all the excellent work. I wouldn’t be informed at all if I hadn’t discovered Wings all those years ago
All we have to do is flag up “wingsoverscotland.com” to our wavering friends, suggest that they have a read of the main articles, then THINK…
Sensibledave = arrogant offensive British Nationalist paid to troll.
Any pensioners looking for extra money on here..to donate of course!
I thought I was pretty switched on but I recently discovered the married pensioners allowance.
If your spouse does not claim the full tax allowance you can pass part of your allowance on to them, with a bonus of it being back dated. Extra £230 a year for me [+£430 back dated]
Introduced 3 years ago and seems to be off the radar as all my friends and family have not heard of it.
Simple to follow guide on the tax website.
O/T
WINGERS NIGHT OUT THIS COMING SATURDAY – UPDATE AND REMINDER.
Wingers night out, 7th April, start approx 7:oo pm (ish), Otters Head, Woodside, Glenrothes.
Another night of sparkling wit, repartee, free food, Scottish themed quiz, new faces(hopefully), raffle, and we have the revamped bar all to ourselves!!!!
See over on the Off Topic” page for full details of location, transport links, affordable overnight accommodation.
Hope to see lots of you there.
Chas.
Just donated to one of the most important causes of my life 😉 Let’s get our great (soon to be greater), nation onto the world’s stage as an equal.
Cheers Stuart for all your great work.
Almost forgot to donate this year, but finally done now. Keep on fighting the good fight, Stu.
Let’s do this!
A quick check to see if the following have contributed this year:
– Dame Ruth Davidson.
– Dame Kezia Dugdale.
– Sir Willie Rennie.
– Sir Richard Leonard.
– Vince.
Ah reckon Dame Dugdale will be due to make a private donation anyways.
I’ve just got to contribute again!
Best value investment that there is for Scotland’s future.
Thank God there is still a haven for truth, transparency and justice in the festering den of corruption that is Westminster’s
Union.
Hi Guys let’s push this fundraiser over the edge. If we don’t beat the top fund raiser amount some will claim we are no loner interested in being independent. Failed fund raiser etc
Please help push this over the line. Support for Wings is falling and other such mince
Good to see all the (previous?) lurkers posting their input here.
We will prevail. Right is on our side.
“And we’ll fight for what is right,
And the dawning of the day…
link to youtube.com
Remember. sensibledave = arrogant offensive British Nationalist paid to TROLL
Can we have a social night in Dumfries, please? We’re not all tory *ankers down here, you know!….The Tam’oShanter has sometimes got some Yessers in…
After reading a Red Tory Labour article in the Greenock Telegraph I have just made a further small donation. Seriously doubt that the Greenock Telegraph is impartial. Another unionist rag sadly
Hi Sandy.
Why not organise a ge-together for after the march/rally on 2nd June?
link to facebook.com
“MARCH FOR INDEPENDENCE- DUMFRIES
SATURDAY- 2ND JUNE 2018
BROOMS ROAD CARPARK TO WHITE SANDS DOCK PARK
GATHERING AT 1.00 PM, LEAVING AT 1.30PM SHARP
PROCESSION ROUTE: Brooms road carpark, Shakespeare street, Whitesands, Buccleuch street, Loreburn street, English street, High street, Nith Place, Whitesands Dock park.
MAKE SURE YOU JOIN THE EVENT ONLINE..”