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The Cupid Stunt

Posted on March 08, 2018 by

An alert reader conveniently located in the Aberdeen area pointed us to an “SNP BAD” story in the ever-willing Press & Journal today.

And it raised an awful lot of questions the P&J didn’t seem to want to ask.

A pregnant Conservative councillor has said she will donate her baby box to charity – and called for the scheme to be means tested.

Ms Imrie said: ‘(The council administration) have budgeted to the best we can on a low budget, unlike the SNP with regards to unnecessary provisions that should be mean tested such as the baby box. I will be donating mine to (foodbank) CFINE.’

She was backed by independent administration councillor Jennifer Stewart who called the boxes a ‘vanity project.’ She added: ‘Most people I know wouldn’t want to put their baby in a box and neither would I.’

So let’s quickly go through them.

1. Nobody is FORCED to take a baby box, and you don’t get them by default. You have to fill out an application, and have it signed by a healthcare professional.

So if Cllr Imrie didn’t need one she could just have not bothered asking for it, rather than needlessly wasting a hard-pressed midwife or nurse’s time (and therefore public money) on form-filling as well as that of administrative staff.

2. The former Labour leader of Aberdeen council, Willie Young, immediately leapt to his Tory friend’s defence, claiming that Cllr Imrie hadn’t claimed the box at all, but that a midwife had done it without her permission.

As did another Tory councillor:

But as both the healthcare professional and the mother have to sign the form, either that’s a lie or the application will be rejected and there will be no baby box to donate, instantly solving the problem.

3. Since all new mothers are entitled to a box for free, we’re not sure what the point of giving it to a foodbank would be in the first place. Anybody who needs one already gets one and there’s not much point in having two boxes when you’ve only got one baby to sleep in them. You can’t eat the other one.

4. The box does of course contain other useful items. But if Cllr Imrie feels that foodbanks need extra assistance and that it should come from those like her who can afford it rather than from taxpayers, why is she taking and passing on a baby box that’s been paid for by the taxpayer, rather than just handing the foodbank some of her OWN money?

5. We’d also quite like to have a look at Cllr Imrie’s in-depth study (we’re sure she must have done one) on the costs and consequences of means-testing compared to universal provision. Because most research suggests that means-testing is a highly inefficient delivery method, and does more damage than any minor savings after the cost of administration are worth, because you end up with people not claiming things that they’re entitled to and need because of the hassle/stigma.

Those are just the obvious ones. We’ll bring you answers as we find them.

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    1. 08 03 18 13:56

      The Cupid Stunt | speymouth

    2. 24 04 18 11:24

      Cracks in the ice…? – scotlandisdifferent

    410 to “The Cupid Stunt”

    1. There’s no point in arguing with Tories, of any colour.
      They’ve abdicated reason, as their brain is poisoned by soulless hatred.
      The emptiness of their black heart sucks everything around them, like an evil black hole.
      Stay clear: they will eventually run out of things to destroy and turn on themselves. It’s already happening.

    2. dakk says:

      Yet another empty gesture from the thick as shit Yoon cult living in our midst.

      Truly pathetic excuses for human beings.

    3. bobajock says:

      There seems to be a lot of this going on, simply trying to find an axe to grind, but realising its your nose thats rubbing.

      Rather fun to watch Labour siding with the Tories on this one, good old Blighty sure makes em stupid eh?

    4. gordoz says:

      Political stunts being caught out like this is why Wings still has such vast support.

      Don’t know Aberdeen very well at all but the council does seem to be loaded with absolute numpties. Like most areas I suspect that the voting system means this is the case. (Many will ‘get in’ not based on talent or popularity) seems to be the case here. Imrie will go far in the Tory movement getting sucked into meaningless stunts attacking provisions for the common good of all.
      Tories an embarrassment to Scotland, (ALWAYS).

    5. wull2 says:

      What we require is Money saving expert Martin Lewis to advise Scotland, but will he.

    6. Dan Huil says:

      Britnat hatred for Scotland starts at a very early age.

    7. Conan the Librarian says:

      “Vile cybernat attacks pregnant woman giving to charity”

      You read it here first folks.

    8. Bob Mack says:

      I wonder if the SNP had offered £50 cash instead of a baby box if she would have refused ? Dilemmas eh ?

      Political point scoring in this instance seems very tacky indeed. When the Government actually care about your baby’s welfare and especially if you are too snooty or political to accept it as such.

      Yoons eh ?

    9. Brian Allan says:

      Corrado Mella says:
      8 March, 2018 at 12:34 pm

      ‘There’s no point in arguing with Tories’

      Oh yes there is (Panto style) because the tripe they come out with is headlined all over the MSM and should be countered to better inform those who voted them in

    10. fillofficer says:

      och, she’s no that bright is she ?
      ross thompsons partner i understand
      say no more, heh

    11. Macart says:

      The questions our meeja don’t ask.

      And that’s why people give generously to this site.

    12. Effijy says:

      Nice to see the Labour Waster still working with his Tory friends to stop anything positive happening to the working classes in Scotland.

      Could I suggest the the soon to be born baby has 3 numbers on its head. Just wondering if Mum could pass on her moral outlook to her off spring?

      If I was the Mid-Wife, I’d copy the Tory spiv’s signature on my phone and post it on social media.

      I know who lies for a living in politics up here and who is dedicated to the well being of our citizens.

      I read that report that showed the Tory Austerity measures on the disabled will have killed of 120,000 people in the UK with disabilities.

      Wasn’t there a German with a wee mustache who did this too?

    13. Donald anderson says:

      The Tory Parties answer to poverty is aye charity.

    14. One_Scot says:

      Words fail me, they really do. Thank God we will have the opportunity come #ScotRef to put these wastes of space behind us.

    15. cearc says:

      So if she didn’t sign the form, is she accusing her midwife of fraud?

    16. Black Joan says:

      Ross Thomson’s partner?

      Unlikely.

      From the loyal P&J: Aberdeen South Conservative MP Ross Thomson, himself a gay man, said: “I am 100% behind these plans for a gay pride event for Aberdeen next summer.

    17. One_Scot says:

      Yoons: ‘Let’s run with this SNPBad story’.

      The internet: ‘That story’s a lot of balls’

      Yoons: ‘It’s not a real story anyway.’

      FFS. How much more of this crap can any normal human take?

    18. Jim Bo says:

      Thanks for highlighting this Stu. This line of thinking infuriates me. I’ve heard so many ignorant callers in to the likes of Call Kaye discussing how baby boxes should be means tested or that it’s a waste of money.

      I filled in the form a few months ago so have first hand experience. Firstly the midwife asks if you aware of the baby box. She then discusses what’s included and then, assuming you express interest in receiving one, do the parents-to-be and nurse fill it out and sign it together. It is then up to the parents-to-be to send envelope through post themselves. So, either this woman has been caught in a lie or else the nurse has done something she shouldn’t have. As you rightly say, if the nurse was in error the delivery of baby box can be halted at any time as soon as this woman realised the error. Easy.

    19. Ian says:

      It leaves the possibility that the box was ‘fraudulently’ claimed for by the midwife/nurse forging the mother’s signature.

      That is obviously what they are insinuating if they claim she didn’t request a baby box. I imagine she’ll be happy to have the request published to show that it isn’t her signature on it.

    20. Lisa says:

      Maybe the councillor’s time would be better spent addressing the issue of why we have foodbanks in the first place than requesting resources she doesn’t need for a useless gesture.

    21. Dr Jim says:

      How can I get SNP Baad into the papers this week
      Let me think Hmm?

      Oh I know I’ll behave like an Arse that always works

    22. crazycat says:

      @ fillofficer at 12.51

      ross thompsons partner i understand
      say no more, heh

      That seems rather unlikely, unless something has changed dramatically in the last couple of years:

      http://rossthomson.net/content/?page_id=160
      “Ross lives within his ward in Aberdeen and is in a Civil Partnership with his Partner Douglas.”

    23. Scott says:

      Willie Young quote.

      It was the midwife who signed up for it not the Councillor but of course rather an apologising to the Councillor SNP attack the Councillor for being charitable. SNPBad right enough
      I thought that both parties had to sign so if true what Young says the midwife in question could be charged with forgery if she signed the name of the councillor,In that case someone should ask the councillor if she wants the midwife charged.Answer Please anyone.Just another dig at the SNP.

    24. wull2 says:

      The Beast from the East has gone, so they require to create a squirrel of their own, wonder what it is

    25. crazycat says:

      @ Black Joan at 1.06

      Apologies – you posted while I was checking that I had remembered correctly.

    26. dramfineday says:

      As an observation only, it appears that independent councillor Stewart shares the same ward as councillor Imrie.

      Strange to describe the boxes as a vanity project, given the good works councillor Stewart appears to be involved in regarding the relief of poverty. But….who knows how people think.

      Anyhow, the production of the application form, will test the issue of the lie. Perhaps a statement from the health board is in order for clarification.

    27. r.esquierdo says:

      Tory Cllr speak out of waste expulsion pipe. Pure guff

    28. shamur says:

      Tories of all colours will find fault or negativity with any positive SNP news story/product. I’m unsure if this is a requirement for being selected as a Tory or if a request was made to them to react this way in all circumstances. Either way, hopefully some people on the no side will surely be seeing through them by now.

      It’s clear their aim is to twist everything to get the headlines and hope no one dissects their actions.

    29. Shamur says:

      I should add, love your play on words for the title.

    30. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      The P&J, which has a much higher coverage in the NE than any newspaper anywhere else in Scotland, is probably our most effective enemy. It needs taken down somehow. It is followed in that league table by the really nasty Mail,the infantile Express and the two disgraces – the Herald and the Scotsman.

      The Sun sits on the political fence on the constitutional issue and is regularly generous to the SNP…

      but so (listen carefully) is the Record now… Editorial today very supportive of Mhairi Black and very supportive indeed of the SNP government’s initiative on rough sleepers. Not an anti SNP cheep in it for weeks.

      So instead of attacking the Record for past misdemeanours some congratulation would be in order for coming round to a better view and walking towards us. We maybe seeing a major change in our engagement with the media.

    31. Dr Jim says:

      I presume the Tories wont be using the Queensferry crossing then as it’s a vanity project too

    32. Andrew says:

      Cllr. Imrie is one of my ward councillors, as is the Jennifer lady quoted. More clowns representing me added to Ross Thomson!!!

    33. Dr Jim says:

      The picture says it all, she thinks she’s been clever
      maybe she has, she’s outsmarted herself

    34. cearc says:

      Shamur,

      It is definitely one of the best titles ever!

    35. Greannach says:

      Could that be the Willie Young of the property owning family in Aberdeen?
      Was one of his family’s properties enhanced at public expense?
      Is Willie Young representative of the Labour Party?

      Just asking.

    36. handclapping says:

      Dont look at the shambles the Tories are making of the fish. Nothing to see here, move along now.
      Oh look! a baby box!

      Well done the P&J for playing the part of the patsy

    37. Cubby says:

      Starting to wonder if eating too much fish can make you stupid.
      From the stupid fishermen who ignored the sell out by the Tories in the 70’s and who believe they will not be sold out again by the Tories to save the City of London to these stupid Tory councillors and MPs. Ross Thomson = Total Bampot.

      How long will it take for people to realise that these British Nationalists lie cheat misrepresent and don’t care a fig about SCOTLAND and ITS PEOPLE. They will betray Scotland and its people given half a chance of enriching themselves.

    38. artyhetty says:

      Just a disgrace to use a positive Scottish government initiative, to your own political ends, and likely actually putting women off from taking up the opportunity to have their motherhood recognised as something worth celebrating. All on International Womens day too, so not surprised.

      When I had my sons, had some conversations about whether being a mother, or a female artist had more status. I think we reckoned it was slightly better on that score, being an artist. Would have loved to have the baby boxes!

      Happy International Womens Day to all women here, and around the world!

    39. Ayrton Barmecide says:

      When I saw this title, I thought it would be on how the Scottish Sun reported Mhari Black’s speech yesterday as “SNP MP FIRST TO SAY CUNT IN PARLIAMENT”. You should cover that (and watch the speech)

    40. call me dave says:

      Jings! What a contrived grubby story trying to create a political local headline and now it’s going to end up with her and/or the midwife in trouble. 🙁

      PS:
      Like most folk I was trying to see how that poll ended and came across this. Anybody got the proper lowdown?

      https://twitter.com/rosscolquhoun/status/971701769553301505

    41. Don`t know much about the political personalities of local government in the North east,

      is Willie Young the partner/father of the pregnant Tory lassie ?

    42. schrodingers cat says:

      ot

      yon sky poll about women is still running, mhairi black has overtaken brenda
      snigger

    43. meant partner or father of bairn

    44. Cactus says:

      This posting is about the WOS Fundraiser 2018, in The National.

      Thanks Nana xx:
      http://www.thenational.scot/news/16070369.Wings_over_Scotland_smashes_fundraiser_target_in_less_than_24_hours/

      “Campbell said most of any extra funds raised would go toward the ambitious target of printing and distributing one million copies of an updated version of the Wee Blue Book, a campaigning tool which many independence supporters say played a vital role in converting Scots from No to Yes.

      “The one we produce for the second referendum will be pretty much all-new,” he told us. “An awful lot has changed since 2014, and we aim for it to be as up-to-date as possible at the time when people are really thinking about their vote.”

      Many no voters are now resigned to and are expecting iScotref.

      We’re going to have us a busy Scottish summer.

      Conservatives are cupid stunts.

      Ha ha ha.

      X.

    45. manandboy says:

      Excellent job, Stu, again and again.

      As an aside, but with the clock ticking down into the Brexit end-game, it is noticeable that this Tory Government and their Labour BritNat sidekicks are not showing any particular signs of the kind of stress one would expect IF the prospect of a hard Brexit and an imminently independent Scotland was very real in the not too distant future.

      If this is the case, then the likelihood may very well be that the English Establishment is not worried either by Brexit or IndyRef2, because they know it is Scotland’s fabulous wealth which is keeping the UK afloat, not the EU, and, because they know precisely how to rig a referendum on Scottish Independence.

      Alternatively, the UK is being governed by seriously incompetent people with an extremely high opinion of themselves.

    46. Jim Scott says:

      Someone queried if Willie Young represents the Labour Party. Well based on his track record, I think he only represents one thing. Willie Young. His arrogant self interest will go on as long as he cons Aberdonians into believing he represents their interests.

    47. heedtracker says:

      What a bloody nerve.

      Unionists like her have squandered over a billion quid debt in Aberdeen, with nothing to show for it all but hundred billion white elephants scarring Aberdeen.

      Looks like they’ve even succeeded in ruining Aberdeen’s once beautiful art gallery too, for what was a fantastically expensive and pointless “renovation” to begin with.

      Unionists like her rely on the relentless vote tory propaganda pumped out by neo fascist Voice Of the North P&J. That crew are well experienced in covering up, not reporting, flat out tory lying, you name it.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-42187516

      Delayed Aberdeen Art Gallery progress report due

      Staggering waste, appalling acts of council vandalism.

      Oil capital of Europe? citadel of toryboy goons, hell bent on ruining Aberdeen.

    48. Capella says:

      Hey- that’s the Deputy Lord Lieutenant of Aberdeen you’re talking about. He represents the Queen. So less disrespect to his most charitable highness, please.

      He blames the midwife. A fine Women’s Day sentiment.

      http://archive.is/cACip

    49. Chick McGregor says:

      Was the ‘mean tested’ a Freudian or typo on her part I wonder?

    50. Andy-B says:

      The meat and the bones of this manufactured story is Baby Boxes bad, SNP bad.

      Tories and the Red Tories good.

    51. Habib Steele says:

      I well understand the anger at Imrie. I do, however, object to calling her names, and to bringing Ross Thompson into it. The presentation of the facts about the incident, and any other nasty things she’s said and done, with comment on those is enough. Attacking what the lady has said and done is legitimate; attacking her person is not.

      This does our independence movement no good. Those on the fence may well be pushed in to the the camp of those who want us to continue to be colony of England.

    52. Cuilean says:

      Maul The Midwife.

    53. heedtracker says:

      Habib Steele

      Is it ok to call her a gender neutral, bare faced liar?

      Sorry, bare faced tory unionist liar?

    54. Darrin L Hall says:

      I’m from Aberdeen, but moved away in 2001 and the vast majority of people I know from there are pretty squared away and sensible, so what amazes me is where all these Red Labour & Tory wankstains come from.

      It just doesn’t make sense how these balloons get elected, FFS

    55. Bob Mack says:

      @Habib Steel,

      Interesting take. Exactly how do you remove the persons (deliberate )actions from the reet of her character. It was her choice to try and create bad publicity.

      Sure many Psychologists would appreciate your wisdom

    56. slackshoe says:

      Funny how you can always tell a Tory just from looking at them.

    57. Sarah says:

      O/T Mary Miller, Proud Lurker, who just donated. From my own experience I know you have to rake up a bit of courage to comment btl at first – but you’d enjoy it soon and it gives everyone else a boost to see another Wings supporter!

    58. heedtracker says:

      It just doesn’t make sense how these balloons get elected, FFS

      Maybe its apathy, Scottish local council elections are 20%. Some might argue that voter apathy anywhere is the dream of the hard core right, like in Aberdeen. Its maybe why they never spend money trying to encourage local democracy.

      SLab local castastrofuck of the millenium, Sir Wullie Young was finally voted out but he’s been given another big council job in Aberdeen.

      So they get what only 20% vote for.

      Sir Wullie’s greatest catastrofuck white elephant’s nearly finished, only tenants they can get? Neo fascist Voice of The North P&J.

      Even beeb Scotland UKOK gimpery struggles with lunatic yoons like Sir Wullie.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-34922087
      A date has been set for a hearing after an Labour councillor in Aberdeen referred himself to the Standards Commission over an “accidental” leak.

      Willie Young admitted he emailed confidential legal advice to one of the campaigners against the controversial £107m Marischal Square project

    59. heedtracker says:

      http://marischalsquare.co.uk/
      Aberdeen’s vibrant‚ new central district

      with no tenants, well apart from lots of P&J journos. That could be called “vibrant” I suppose.

      Ah well. It all be knocked down in 50 years, next gen Aberdonians wondering why they built so many white elephants like this in Aberdeen and why they’re still paying for them.

      Welcome to red tory Aberdeen.

    60. Eric The Cheeseman says:

      I spent over £4 last week for a pint in Edinburgh last week.

      I believe I also contributed LESS THAN £4 of my annual tax contributions in order to ensure that every baby born in Scotland this year can recieve a baby box.

      We get our baby box in a couple of months (the one that we and our midwife signed for, prior to us posting it off)… and I’m gonna thank the goddam hell out of the Scot Govt for providing it for us.

      And our son.

    61. cearc says:

      Whoops, it seems Stewart Bremner, having thrown his toys out of the pram is peeved that he may have lost them.

      https://twitter.com/WingsScotland/status/971752940292726784

      ‘…I might have to reply too them all to avoid tanking too much more of my business’

      So dedicated to the cause/bank acc., is he no?

    62. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Hmmm, she is handing “the box” in (she tells the P&J) for a cheap stunt, but just mibbee she did want, and intends to keep, the contents?

      There was a time in the NE, like a lot of rural Scotland, when the Libs were the main opponent of the Tories. Now ex-Lib now-dependent (well, she is hardly “independent”, is she?) cllr. Stewart is faithful sideline cheerleader to Tory cllr. Imrie. All chums together.

      But a token of the times: Libnon-Dems surely heading for extinction, having given up and sold out to curry favour with their old enemies.

      After all, who needs the dancing monkey when you can have the organ grinder?

    63. Highland Wifie says:

      Well that turned out well for her didn’t it? No doubt she thought it was a really clever way to have another go at resurrecting the ‘baby box bad’ story. Shame she didn’t have the brains to think it through properly.
      Maybe before these less than intellectual types act they should ask themselves ‘ now what would WoS do to this?’

    64. TYRAN says:

      Looks like she’s already wearing the baby blanket.

    65. Breeks says:

      Dave McEwan Hill says:
      8 March, 2018 at 1:27 pm

      …So instead of attacking the Record for past misdemeanours some congratulation would be in order for coming round to a better view and walking towards us. We maybe seeing a major change in our engagement with the media…

      Or maybe the Record is trying to reconstitute some degree of credibility with Scots after their betrayal via their 2014 Vow bullshit, just so they can stab Scotland in the back next time too.

      A rag is a rag. We saw its true colours when it mattered. It’s very charitable of you Dave to forgive and forget, and I do know where you’re coming from, a sinner who repents and all that, but Scotland’s mainstream media has only itself to blame for the contempt that it’s now held in. They chose a side, and it wasn’t ours.

    66. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Breeks @ 15:20,

      Sorry, but I can’t agree with you on this one. No time for wallowing in past bitterness, got to move on.

      Sure, we don’t forget, and we have to keep our eyes wide open. Maybe they’re just buying some insurance for the future, but so what? A possible straw in the wind. Every little helps, and we surely can use it.

      Unless you have a better idea for getting past the massed ranks of the paid misinformers…?

    67. Bobp says:

      Gordoz 12.39pm. I think the main embarrassment for Scotland gordoz are the “people” who vote for these Tory scum.

    68. We can but hope that the poor innocent gestating in this woman’s womb never gets to hear that her mother used her as a political prop to perpetuate a lie.
      This piece of disgusting toss illustrates perfectly how obnoxious the Tories really are.
      I wonder if the folk in the North East now realise what a big mistake they made voting for this band of self serving chancers.
      They are out to destroy civic society throughout Scotland.
      There is no question that this woman is having a baby box foisted upon her against her will, ergo, this is a badly crafted lie and attempted SNP BAD smear which has come back and bit her on the bum.
      As I say, let’s hope it doesn’t come back to haunt her in 16 years or so when her child is leafing through her mother’s scrap book.
      It ranks with John Gummer force feeding his young daughter a greasy burger during the BSE crisis.

      Tories, whit ur they like?

    69. Bobp says:

      Bob mack 12.47pm. Yeah she wouldn’t donate that to a food bank

    70. Robert Louis says:

      In all of this, what is so shocking not so shocking, is the way Labour spring to the defence of a Tory – especially considering the subject matter.

      Labour in Scotland eh? Red Tories to the core. Just wait until the referendum is called, then we’ll really see the red tories for all they are worth, just like in 2014.

    71. Bobp says:

      Darrin L hall.2.41 pm. Probably other ex-pats from other parts of the yookay. Which brings a question to mind, after watching tv programme ” A new life in the sun. Why are british people who set up a business in Spain or France called ex-pats?. When a polish shopkeeper or tradesman over here is called an immigrant?.

    72. Wullie B says:

      When my first grand daughter was born, my daughter got the baby box, Ceitidh has never seen the inside of it, BUT she has had the use of various items that came with it, towels, ear thermometer and clothing.
      When her mother was born 20 years ago we recieved a bouty bag from the hospital as we did with her older sister and the baby box was a much better idea but we as a family are thankful for both, well done the SNP for this box than will provide new parents with such greta items

    73. manandboy says:

      https://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/live/2018/mar/08/

      This afternoon in Dublin, Donald Tusk says “Ireland must come first in Brexit talks”.

      I suspect that sometime soon the message will be ‘fasten your seatbelts’.

    74. Legerwood says:

      This woman does not have enough functioning neurones to create a decent synapse. Typical Tory councillor material.

    75. uno mas says:

      Dr Jim says:
      8 March, 2018 at 1:29 pm
      “I presume the Tories wont be using the Queensferry crossing then as it’s a vanity project too”

      Ditto the “Squinty Bridge” that takes them from their homes in Glasgow´s leafy West End to their desks in the big BBC Pravda office block.

    76. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Breeks at 3.20

      Stop talking puerile nonsense. You maybe stupid or maybe you think we are all stupid with you.

      If the Record or any other mass circulation newspaper starts to support us it has to be congratulated and encouraged.

    77. clan rossy says:

      I feel sorry for the baby,
      not the mother just another typical
      Tory twat opens her mouth and talks utter
      pish.

    78. Dr Jim says:

      O/T but maybe not

      Former spokesman and adviser to Vladimir Putin says in a SKY news interview that every time Britain or America is in trouble they invent an anti Russia propaganda story and Britains government controlled media put that propaganda out to the people to change what’s really happening in their own country to something else, and let’s face it Britain is in big trouble in the world right now

      He went on to desribe Russias involvement in Ukraine by saying British people don’t know the truth that it was Neo Nazis running Ukraine and of course Russia was going to intervene but Britains stae controlled media doesn’t tell the truth

      The Sky interviewer replied by saying Russia had state controlled media, the Russian spokesman just rolled his eyes, and maybe that’s because the Sky interviewer didn’t deny that British media were state controlled which I would have thought would have been the first reaction too

    79. Doug Mcgregor says:

      She probably got herself pregnant in order to pull this stunt.

    80. yesindyref2 says:

      Some would say “Don’t get mad, get even”. I would say “Don’t get mad, get what you want”. And that’s Independence, for me.

    81. galamcennalath says:

      These people, eh! We should sympathise though.

      I feel it is my good fortune through providence, genes, upbringing, and education to have never contracted BritNatosis. Many others here may share the same gratefulness.

      It’s a nasty debilitating disease. Mainly it’s the mind which suffers but there is a universal physical manifestation. The afflicted are only capbable of two facial expressions – the angry scowl, and the sarcastic sneer. In fact, these reflect the only two emotional states the sufferer experiences.

      Other symptoms can be identified by what the BitNatosis sufferer says. Their affliction makes them believe what they are told by authority figures and their agencies. This leaves them very vulnerable to manipulation and abuse. They will then frequently repeat these fantastical stories as if they had basis in reality. Having accepted this alternate worldview they live their lives and make choices as if it was all true.

      BritNatosis is curable! A daily dose of Wings over Scotland, The National, Wee Ginger Dug, and Scotland Goes Pop for 30 straight days causes the affliction to disappear and never return. 🙂

    82. Bob Mack says:

      In other news it appears EU has told the UK there will be no trade talks till the Irish problem has been sorted.

      Secondly, have you heard Angela Haggerty has been made the news editor of the Sunday Herald and is leaving Common Space.. Earned that eh?

    83. Dr Jim says:

      I used to call it Britnatillosis which is a similar condition except the sufferer has sudden outbreaks of Tourettes syndrome usually repeating phrases like *no surrender* or one worded screams of *NAW*

    84. galamcennalath says:

      manandboy says:

      I suspect that sometime soon the message will be ‘fasten your seatbelts’.

      Indeed. Things couldn’t keep drifting the way the Tories seemed to want them to.

      I am very pleased that the EU has taken a stance. TMay said Brexit must be hard based on her red line and simultaneously rejected an Irish border in the sea. The two are totally incompatible.

      So now the EU have told TMay to sort Ireland first. She can’t. Not if she wants to retain DUP backing and her red lines.

      So let us know now! Then we can make alternate plans.

    85. manandboy says:

      Is it not rather odd that in 20 months of wall to wall Brexit news, negotiations, analysis and in-depth reports, not one word has been spoken or printed about Scotland’s massive oil and gas deposits, the value of which makes Scotland as wealthy as Norway – and wealthier by far when all Scotland’s other energy assets and food and drink exports are added.

      Not a word.

    86. yesindyref2 says:

      Sky Poll. The link’s worked for me every time when o thers had problems, giving 100 waiting long enough, now it only gives 5. I’m guessing the poll is ended as it said top 5.

      https://news.sky.com/story/vote-who-is-britains-most-influential-woman-11274648

    87. Robert Peffers says:

      @TYRAN says: 8 March, 2018 at 3:10 pm:

      “Looks like she’s already wearing the baby blanket.”

      Dunno about that, TYRAN, but as she is pregnant she sure as hell is wearing the baby in the front part of her outfit.

    88. manandboy says:

      Nicola must be chuffed to be voted Britain’s most influential woman. It must make a difference to how she responds to the laughing stock of the Tory Party, Ruth Davidson, who didn’t even make it into the top 100.

      The Mooth should never be allowed to forget it. Ruth Nobody.

    89. galamcennalath says:

      Leo Varadkar, Taoiseach – “We must have certainty that if a better option proves unachievable the backstop of maintaining full alignment in Northern Ireland – with those rules of the single market and the customs union – will apply in order to protect North South cooperation and avoid a hard border” .

      Ok Tories, the ball’s in your court. You know, the round thing. Don’t just stand there, you are actually going to have to do something with it now!

      Perhaps if the Tories had thought about this in detail 18 months ago, they wouldn’t be in the shite now,

    90. yesindyref2 says:

      Imagine being the second Queen Elizabeth of England, and third to Sturgeon and Black of Scotland in influence.

      Send a gunboat!

    91. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Nana @ 16:16,

      Well, that’s the gauntlet thrown down by the EU and no mistake. May’s smokescreen supply has just dried up, and she has nowhere left to run now.

      To DUP or not to DUP…? =grin=

      Here in Scotland we could do with some of the kind of protection Ireland’s getting. Not too late to make it possible!

      (Nice to have you back, BTW, nana.)

    92. Nana says:

      O/T

      @Feorlean responds to JMC meeting in which UK Government neglected to bring forward new proposals. Instead, they’re pressing ahead with a bill that, even with their proposed amendment, would allow them to unilaterally take control of devolved powers without @ScotParl agreement.

      Statement here
      https://twitter.com/rosscolquhoun/status/971798872652689408

    93. Robert Peffers says:

      @Dave McEwan Hill says: 8 March, 2018 at 4:33 pm:

      “Breeks at 3.20
      Stop talking puerile nonsense. You maybe stupid or maybe you think we are all stupid with you.
      If the Record or any other mass circulation newspaper starts to support us it has to be congratulated and encouraged.”

      Perhaps so, Dave McEwan Hill, but there is an old saying, “That the Leopard does not change its spots”, and perhaps, “The Record won’t change its sports”. So we must ask ourselves, “What has brought about this change”?

      If the answer is that the Record is changing editorial/owner policy in order the save the rag from going further downhill then the strange claims canvassers get, when asking voters why they buy the rag, is often because of the sports. So a commercial decision, rather than a political one, is bound to fail as those buy for sport customers will vanish and the commercial venture will fail.

      I believe I’m not alone in doubting the Records change of political support is due to their political beliefs but just to a change their failing political sales pitch.

    94. geeo says:

      https://t.co/dOowsmHtB2

      Daily trouble on Brexit these days…oh dear..ho hum..!!

    95. geeo says:

      Re: the Daily Record.

      When the Daily Record produce a FRONT PAGE spread proclaiming its FULL SUPPORT for Independence and sends a clarion call for the Labour Party in Scotland, to ALSO back independence, THEN and ONLY then, will i give the Record credit.

      Hell..i migbt even BUY it…!!

    96. Nana says:

      Re the Sky poll

      Nicola Sturgeon and Mhairi Black ‘most influential women’
      http://archive.is/aw52i

    97. Macart says:

      @Nana

      RE: Pushing the bill through

      I know it’s worrying, but it was also predictable and as it happens, necessary. Pushing through such a bill without the agreement of the devolved legislatures WILL leave most reasoning and reachable voters with no doubt as to the nature of Westminster government and politics. That is, the nature of the beast before them.

      What many would not believe by word, they will be left with no choice but to believe the evidence presented in front of their eyes.

      That final domino is teetering.

    98. manandboy says:

      They know in NI. ” until May called her snap election, Scotland had 1 Tory MP for decades (Scottish Borders) – 1 too many! but Ruth Davidson went around Scotland, encouraged tactical voting & played the union card in a very underhand way (via the lodges), so we now have 13 useless tories who are also now in bed with the DUP. Time to end this corrupt Tory/DUP UK asap.”

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-43330027

    99. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Nana @ 17:51,

      Hah, did they keep the poll open longer than originally mentioned in the hope of a last-minute surge for others, one wonders?

      But all credit due, at least they didn’t tweak the result, or “disappear” the whole thing as others have done in the past.

    100. Nana says:

      @Macart

      Yes indeed worrying to say the least. Scots had better open their eyes and quick about it.

    101. Bobp says:

      All this talk about buying the record. Aye ok so we all rush out and put their circulation figures through the roof.And then they stab us in the back again with their indyref2 penultimate day publication.

    102. galamcennalath says:

      Here is a short letter from the Irish Times in its entirety…..

      “Brexit: The undefined negotiated by the unprepared to get the unspecified for the uninformed.”

    103. Nana says:

      @RJS

      I reckon there are a few sour looking faces at Sky after that vote, lol

    104. heedtracker says:

      Buying the Record would akin to voting SLabour again. The idea that Crichton Torcuil is now somehow a supporter of nascent Scottish democracy, let alone nation state Scotland no longer governed by England, is just never going to happen, is it:D

      eg.

      Sir Wullie Young, former red tory boss of ACC, is a very wealthy lawyer/landlord in Aberdeen, probably a multi millionaire.

      Aberdeen City Council have never built any social housing for the last 20 years, neatly covering all Vote NO or Else Sir Wullie’s reign, as ACC finance genius.

      If Sir Wullie was a blue tory, then fine, its what they do, make stacks of easy cash in a market like Aberdeen oil capital property rental market for example. Its made a lot of Aberdeen lawyers like Sir Wullie very rich also.

      But Sir Wullie’s a Labour dude, who was never going to do anything like build social housing in Aberdeen. Why would he, it might affect rental prices and his profits.

      Rule Britannia, all the way to the bank.

    105. Mikey2407 says:

      No means testing thank you very much. Everyone has a stake.

    106. fillofficer says:

      crazycat @ 1.11
      haha, i actually knew that but i had just
      read summit on twitter & knee-jerked
      u gorra laff, eh

    107. galamcennalath says:

      Tusk’s intervention declaring ‘Ireland first’ seems to have back footed the Tories!

      Hours have passed and the latest output (even from Brexit friendly sources) is still just to report it has happened.

      FT …. http://archive.is/jvgbN

      Fun to watch from the sidelines, which is fine when you believe Scotland will remove herself from this fiasco.

    108. Baronesssamedi says:

      This is early March. The baby’s due August. She can’t possibly have had her “20 to 24 week scan” yet. Nobody is telling the truth here.

    109. heedtracker says:

      galamcennalath says:
      8 March, 2018 at 6:50 pm
      Tusk’s intervention declaring ‘Ireland first’ seems to have back footed the Tories

      Our imperial masters are striding ahead though,

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-43334850

      Brexit: Don’t put bankers first in talks, says Labour
      By Rob Young
      Business reporter

      Indeedeedoodeee, right over the Brexit abyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyys!

    110. louis.b.argyll says:

      I only hate the Tories as much
      as they hate me.

    111. gerry parker says:

      Louis b.at 7:06
      You have balance in your life.
      🙂

    112. yesindyref2 says:

      Well done, vile cybernats, reach for the Sky!

    113. louis.b.argyll says:

      On BBC website..

      A spokesperson for the Chancellor said, “It’s plainly ridiculous to suggest the Chancellor has anything other than the best interests of the whole economy at heart’.

      Ha haaaa haa ha aargh..plainly ridiculous.

      Emperor’s New Clothes anyone?

    114. starlaw says:

      In the seventies with the SNP on a roll The Daily Record seemed to be turning to support the SNP, even its cartoon Angus Ogg … seemed that way inclined … Then on the day of the poll it fronted up with a huge Headline ….VOTE LABOUR… they wont sell me another pup.

    115. heedtracker says:

      I only hate the Tories as much
      as they hate me

      2014, Gordon Brown did promise faster, safer and better change, if we voted NO to keep this union.

      Its certainly faster change in the UK.

    116. David Williams says:

      Headline of the year, Stuart.
      Well done.

    117. Brian Powell says:

      With a Scot Independence Ref coming along I guess the Sunday Herald want to repeat, lets go for a split the SNP vote approach, with the shoeing in of Angela Haggerty.

      Look out for articles by Jim Sillar etc.

    118. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Robert Peffers at 5.41

      Indeed Robert. Exactly. And we shouldn’t be happy if the Record changes its position and supports independence?

      What silly nonsense I’m reading in responses to my post. The Record is perfectly entitled to try to represent the views of its readership base. That is exactly what newspapers do most of the time.

      It is perfectly entitled to support the Labour party. It is also perfectly entitled to realise that half its readers support independence and to reflect that.

      That is to be applauded and encouraged. That is very good news for us.

      Our biggest enemies now are the Mail and the Express (whose circulations are to a substantial extent held up by English immigrants),the P&J and the two disgraces -the Herald and the Scotsman.

      The Record knows we are winning

    119. mike cassidy says:

      ‘Provide a caption’ competition time

      http://archive.is/yxnFD

      Give me a minute, Claire, and I’ll fill another bag.

    120. heedtracker says:

      The Record knows we are winning

      The Record sales are going down faster than the Titanic.

      Rags do go bust you know. If this shitrag goes under, boohoo. Sorry Dave, you’re just going to have to accept that we live in a market based economy.

      Other news, teamGB meeja wise, from this crew of tories.

      https://archive.is/s1lxO

      “Channel 4 to move hundreds of staff but keep London HQ
      Move will be broadcaster’s biggest ever shakeup, but it will not be forced to sell £100m base”

      Woohoo!

      “The broadcaster has about 25 salespeople in Manchester and five staff in Glasgow.”

      Doh!

      Channel 4 is gloriously Englishishy. Scotland’s is just a giant blank space on the UKOK map for these liggers.

    121. Meg merrilees says:

      O/T

      At 9pm tonight, BBC R4 Melvyn Bragg talking about the Hoghland Clearances with Prof. Tom Devine, Murray Pittock and Marjorie Fraser. Didn’t hear it this morning but think it will be worth a listen tonight.

    122. Dr Jim says:

      If the Daily Record says some good things about the Independence side of the argument that at least makes some of their readers have another think about what’s right then good

      But that only makes it a good dog today, to be a really good dog it needs to do it more before anybody will want to put their hands near it again for fear of being *BIT*

      More training required before anybody thinks about taking it home, but if it bites again then it’s euthanasia…..or a nice farm in the country…..for any kids reading
      Don’t want to be insensitive

    123. Robert Peffers says:

      Robert J. Sutherland says: March, 2018 at 3:34 pm:

      “Sorry, but I can’t agree with you on this one. No time for wallowing in past bitterness, got to move on.”

      I’m a great one for looking at history. But not from a POV of wallowing in bitterness, or wallowing in anything else for that matter. The great thing about known historic facts without professional opinions is that you draw your own conclusions from the known facts and I’ve found, more often than not those conclusions are more realistic.

      This may be because many professional historians are academics who came right out of higher education and have never really lived in a non-academic World like everyone else. There are, though, some notable exceptions.

      So here’s a wee set of thoughts.

      Written down British history only began with the Romans and much of that is, very much like today, affected by political bias. It is thus suspect. There is very little, other than archaeology and science, that can tell us anything more than the written word.

      Archaeology has come a long way, though, since it was mainly self-taught amateurs who were more like treasure hunters than scientists. They are now well advanced scientists aided by technology. Much recent archaeological discoveries now contradict both written history and previous theories of former Archaeologists.

      So just what do we have on the historic differences that made Britain a diverse group of not just countries but often diverse regions of countries? There is one very, very, clear conclusion that cannot be disproved because it is so very obviously true.

      Since around 50 years before the claimed life and death of Jesus Christ the aboriginal peoples of the British Isles have been affected by immigration from outside the British Isles yet I read a claim, made within the past month, that the aboriginal Britons were wiped out and replace entirely by an immigrant people and I simply cannot believe it.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-43115485

      https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2010/dec/20/indigenous-britons-far-righthttps://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2010/dec/20/indigenous-britons-far-right

      Now read both of these links and you get two differing conclusions that suit the views of the authors and neither may be correct.

      There is one overruling truth, though, The extreme south of Britain has, since written history began, attempted to dominate all other settled areas of the British Isles and if I’m certain of anything it is that they are not about to stop doing so now.

      Unless, that is, the rest of the British peoples stop them from doing so and if Scotland, Wales and Ireland do, this time, regain their independence the South will always still attempt to dominate all of the British Isles. This problem will not go away upon Scotland gaining independence and another conclusion is that whatever it is, culture or genetics, this tendency of the South to attempt to dominate, at one point in history, the entire World, (The British Empire eras). It just is not going to go away by Scotland reclaiming her independence.

    124. Meg merrilees says:

      Mike Russell’s statement following the Brexit meeting today.

      news.gov.scot/news/brexit-talks-update-1

    125. heedtracker says:

      Look at it, Its a UKOK Conservative shitrag.

      “The Daily Record,[citation needed] along with Brian Souter, spearheaded the “Keep the Clause” campaign which aimed to prevent the Scottish Parliament from repealing Section 28.

      This law prevented local authorities from promoting “the acceptability of homosexuality as a pretended family relationship” in state schools. Section 28 was eventually repealed in Scotland in 2000 by 99 votes to 17 in the Scottish Parliament, and was repealed in England and Wales in 2003.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daily_Record_(Scotland)

      They’re Northern Irish ed was never off the vote NO or else BBC Scotland shows 2014, naked conservative cunning, right through the whole spectrum of terrorising Scots with Project Fear.

    126. Ken500 says:

      Jennifer Stewart who was elected as a LibDem who immediately became an Independent to join the a Unionist Alliance? No one voted for it. Not on the polling card. The Council being run by 9 Labour councillors who are supposed to be suspended by their Party for joining in a Tory Alliance. Jennifer Stewart who has reportedly described ‘baby boxes’ as a vanity project. The Council being propped up a two job Tory.

      The Council that spent £200Million on a grotesque project of no value. Ruining the City Centre. Causing traffic chaos. Getting into £1.2Bilion of debt. Illegally selling the City on the stick exchange. Spending £300Million on a Conference Centre with no business case or value. The present one had £26Milion of debt paid off. Used on average once a month. The Art Gallery now shut for years. Vandalised/renovations? £30Million cost. No money to finish it. No one wanted it. The artists exhibition for which the Art Gallery was built have no where to have their annual exhibition.

      The SNP have the biggest number of councillors. (19) The LibDem (4) could have held the balance of power and voted on relevant individual issues. The SNP/LibDem coalition run the Council in the past successfully. After Labour run up £1/2Bilion of debt. That had to be sorted out. Resignation and retirement. Instead the LibDem went in with the Tories as usual, in an unholy unionist Alliance. They certainly knew a thing about ‘vanity projects’ half finished all over the City. Grotesque projects of no value. No one wanted. A total waste of public money. Cutting essential services, social care and education etc. People were protesting on the streets. Just to be ignored.

      Willy Young at least was voted out but can’t keep his nose out. Still coming back to haunt. The 3rd rate rejects that can’t be get rid. The unionists even changed the electoral system with no authority to keep the rejects in. Can’t be get rid off until they keel over.

    127. Ken500 says:

      Daily Record sales have halved since 2010. Lost thousands of readers. Along with the demise of Labour. Flogging a dead horse. MSM totally out of touch. They must be determined to aid their own demise. At the moment despicable. SKy/BBC. Criminal Johnston is obviously pulling the strings. Trying to distract attention from the Tory mess. Impossible. They might as well give up. The poisoned chalice.

    128. Gfaetheblock says:

      Re Sky poll

      Celebrating a pile on to an open poll reeks of desperation somewhat. Do folk think anyone takes this seriously.

    129. Ian Law says:

      A progressive tax system does away with all means testing. Affluent people pay through taxation for all the “free” things givin to all citizens. All good.

    130. Dr Jim says:

      Michelle Mone must be spitting feathers and spewing all over her fake jewellery company right now as the First Ministers mentoring program takes off with top women leaders from all over Scotland signing up to Nicola Sturgeons plans while nobody wanted to know Mz Mone (Meeoww)Hee Hee Hee

      Now that the FM has been voted the most influential woman ever in the history of anywhere in the known universe Yoons are a tad angry because folk in England must have voted for her too

      And they didnae think that would happen did they

    131. Black Joan says:

      @ Meg Merrilees, and everyone. The Melvyn Bragg programme on the Clearances is repeated at 9.30pm on Radio 4 (not 9). Excellent discussion.

    132. Ken500 says:

      The latest nonsense from Aberdeen City Council is the plans to build thousands of Council houses. They couldn’t even build a by pass road for over thirty years. Or any council houses. They only thing they have done is ruin the City. The only City in Europe without a by pass road. The City/Shire was underfunded 30% of all other Council allocation by Labour/unionists for over thirty years. The only time any improvements were done was in the five years of the SNP term. They listen to what peopke want and act accordingly. Alex Salmond finally got the by pass road built, investment in the wind turbines, investment in the golf development and leisure centres and the university. The Labour cretins tried to take the credit.

    133. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      heedtracker at 8.05

      The Record is still by a large margin the second biggest seller in Scotland and all newspaper sales are collapsing so don’t know what you’re point is. The fact is the second biggest seller in Scotland is now being fair to the SNP

    134. heedtracker says:

      The fact is the second biggest seller in Scotland is now being fair to the SNP

      OK!!!

      But never smile at a crocodile, no you can’t get friendly with a crocodile…

    135. Brian Leask says:

      Does anyone know what Charity it is that she is planning on donating the baby box to? I am sure that they would much rather have the £160 that the baby box is worth.
      I intend to donate the £160 in cash to whatever Charity she is donating to.
      She should never have claimed the box that is paid for by us the Taxpayer. This is an awful PR stunt on behalf of the Tories.
      I am so enraged by this that if I could I would reimburse the government with the £160 cost of the baby box and put her to shame.

    136. Robert Peffers says:

      @Dave McEwan Hill says: 8 March, 2018 at 4:33 pm:

      In reply to:-Breeks at 3.20:-

      “Stop talking puerile nonsense. You maybe stupid or maybe you think we are all stupid with you.”

      It may be strange to some Wingers that telling someone they may be talking puerile nonsense is somewhat wrong – or maybe not.

    137. Ken500 says:

      Scotland exports £44Billion. £4Billion [food (& drink?)] increased £4Billion from last figures. Without Oil exports. Keith Brown is reported to have stated £30Billion is exported worldwide, £11Billion goes to the EU. Gives a lie to the statement that £40Billion in trade goes to the rest of the UK.

      The Tories ruined the Scottish Oil & Gas sector. Since 2010. Too high taxes when the price had fallen. Taxing it at 62% when the price had fallen 75%. It is taxed at 40% since Jan 2016. Losing Scotland £Billions and thousands of jobs. £28Billion+ 120,000 jobs because of Westminster policies and mismanagement,

      Scotland raises £10Billion more in taxes (pro rata). Than the rest of the UK. Exports over £10Billion more (pro rata). Without Oil revenues. Borrows £10Billion (pro rata) less debt. £30Billion+ Has no balance and payments deficit Yet ends up poorer (pro rata) because of Westminster policies. It is an absolute scandal.

    138. Brian McHugh says:

      Robert Peffers at 8:20pm,
      It is the same now. We are in an unprecedented period of population growth (doubled in my lifetime to date from 3.6 billion to 7.2 billion) and instant travel by aircraft from one side of the world to another. In a thousand years time, archaeologists will say that, our time, was when all the races of the world were wiped out and humananity became one human race.

    139. Meg merrilees says:

      Thanks Black Joan and apologies for bum steer earlier. ( it’s been a long day)

      9.30pm R4 programme with Tom Devine and Murray Pittock on Highland Clearances.

      Incidentally, my nephew arrived home from Canada today, for a short stay. Amongst other things, I was shocked when he told me that English money gets a better rate of exchange than Scottish notes. Apparently ours cost more to handle??? Work that one out!

      Re Nicola the most Influential and Mhairi, her Deputy most influential, – the STV article said that obviously their ‘ fans had voted in their thousands to vote’ .

      I’ve logged back on and NS is now on 49.1k and MB 28k, Queen on 23.9k

    140. gregor says:

      Tory/Labour alliance say midwives & SNP BAD!

      The contempt for everything Scottish knows no bounds…

    141. Ken500 says:

      Maybe if they lose a few more readers/sales. They will support the SNP even more? It works. Money talks, money talks. Hmm hmm. Money talks when people walk. Boycott SKy/BBC. Some people will never forgive the Record after the VOW. A step too far. They did not buy it in any case. Along with the Sun. Murder and football. The gutter Press. Not to many people’s taste. People can buy what they like. Murdoch. NI. They do not like supporting the criminal Press.

      More Nationals in M & S after complaints to the manager. On the lower shelves. Not easily to spot. Unless they are replaced in front of the Sun at the top. Even buying a National can be an effort. Some of the articles inside it too radical. At least it claims to support Independence.

    142. Ken500 says:

      Mary is really stuck between the devil and the dep blue sea. To solve the Irish border question she has to offend the DUP who could bring her and her Gov down. The only way to get out of the mess is to bring them down. Aye everybody will not get what they want. Especially her. They do not ever know what they want in any case. Except to continue tax evading and misappropriating public money. The Tory – unionist way.

    143. Robert Peffers says:

      @call me dave says: 8 March, 2018 at 4:53 pm:

      “Not so shabby. A graph!”

      https://twitter.com/BBCDouglasF/status/971787846033035265

      Perhaps so, call me dave, but the most significant thing about the graph is the obligatory put down of Wales, Northern Ireland and Scotland.

      Most Scots are so inured to Westminster Establishment propaganda they fail to even notice the put downs.

      The chart is labelled, on the horizontal axis, as regions of England but with the countries of Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales added as if they too are regional areas of England so the chart is not comparing like with like.

      Furthermore the two most leftward columns are also misleading but they demonstrate, to alert readers, something very, very interesting. They highlighted Westminster dishonesty.

      These last two columns, labelled as, “unallocated/unknown”, can only be exports/imports creamed off by Westminster due to their strange accounting of anything leaving the United Kingdom being classed as exports from the country, or region, from where the goods leave and not as exports from where they are grown, manufactured or extracted.

      In other words the chart is evidence against Westminster’s thieving.

    144. Glamaig says:

      I listened to R4 and Shortbread Radio all the way home from work hoping to hear something about this which you would think would be of interest – no trade talks until Irish Border resolved.

      Total silence.

      https://twitter.com/eucopresident/status/971771754325700608

      http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2018/03/08/remarks-by-president-donald-tusk-after-his-meeting-with-an-taoiseach-leo-varadkar/

    145. galamcennalath says:

      Boris Johnson saying he’s quite happy with a no deal Brexit. No surprise there, really.

      This shows the problem the EU have with Brextremists ….

      The Foreign Secretary also suggested there could be “very minimal controls” at the Irish border after Brexit but insisted there was “no need” to return to a hard border.

      ‘No need’ for the UK to have customs checks etc.. Of course not, the UK wouldn’t care if it’s US sourced crap found it’s way into the EU! The Brextremists just don’t care that by having a hard Brexit they force the EU to protect themselves from the diverging deregulating UK.

      The same would apply to iScotland. We would be forced to have a hard border to protect ourselves and our producers from ‘unfit for consumption’ items coming from iEngland.

      http://archive.is/BiK9j

    146. heedtracker says:

      Total silence.

      They’re always like this. Total non tory bad network, the complete beeb gimp opposite of SNP Out BBC Scotland.

      Although, it means the BBC r4 news hours are now filled with excellent world wide reports. Pretty cute dodge really, you have a shite tory gov, so don’t talk about it, beeb gimp wise, just head off round the world.

      Or, why do our imperial masters think the EU is just going to leave a wide open border?

      Although, again, Nic Robinson routinely explains to beeb r4 tory listeners that the Swiss borders are practically non existent, why not the UK’s, simpers Nic.

      This week on BBC r4, Nic and beeb r4 gimps also want us to forget that the Saudi monarchy is a horrifying mass murderous regime.

      Spooky.

    147. galamcennalath says:

      Glamaig says:

      Total silence

      Yes, pretty close to it. The fiasco, the sham, the media subterfuge couldn’t hold on indefinitely.

      Now a more realistic picture of the unfolding disaster is going to have to be presented to the UK populace. And after all the spin so far, the media are going to find it difficult to backtrack and show a bit more honesty and realism!

      The Irish border is not a sideshow.

      The Tories red lines limit their options.

      The more they weaken links with the EU the greater the impact.

      The world will not come crawling on blended knee!

      At the same time, the attacks of the devolution settlement can no longer be swept away either.

    148. William Wallace says:

      Through gritted teeth 🙂
      http://archive.is/xVzY4

      Gracious in defeat are they no?

      🙂 🙂 🙂

    149. Rock says:

      Journalism at its very best.

      Why will this brilliant article not be re-published in the “independence supporting” The National?

      Because The National is a fake whose only purpose is to milk the most gullible independence supporters.

      Even its chief lobbyist here is getting annoyed with it:

      Dave McEwan Hill (3rd March – “The uninvited”):

      “Ian Brotherhood at 11.13 am

      With you completely. I will not be buying the Saturday National that includes the Bella magazine”

    150. Rock says:

      Pravda GB, enemy number one of Scotland, is going on about the poisoned “Russian spy” to defame Russia as usual.

      The ("Tractor" - Ed) was spying for the British. He was a BRITISH spy.

    151. Robert Peffers says:

      @Gfaetheblock says: 8 March, 2018 at 8:45 pm:

      “Re Sky poll
      Celebrating a pile on to an open poll reeks of desperation somewhat. Do folk think anyone takes this seriously.”

      Yeah! The Yoons took it very seriously – that is until the results came in then, like you, it is just a bit of banter fun.

    152. Ken500 says:

      Young accuses the midwife of fraud???. If folk justifiably criticise Young he threatens to put the Police on them. Barney has just made him Lord Lieutenant. Pay back time. Knows where the bodies are buried. Young ousted Barney when he was on one of his many overseas trips? Many in a year. Studying bucket collection in Mauritius or some such activity. Without official permission. More unregulated activity. Some would call it corruption or fraud. Investigated many times. Just like teflon Tony always gets away with it. The Bridge of Don crossing another waste of £18Million of public money trying to get re elected in the constituency. It did not work. A worker died. The by pass road being built would have relieved the traffic in any case. Another white elephant,

    153. Gfaetheblock says:

      Robert Peffers

      Firstly, this point is just wrong, there is no basis for it. It is a logical way the break the uk up into geographic areas.

      ‘but with the countries of Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales added as if they too are regional areas of England so the chart is not comparing like with like.’

      However, that is trivial. Your assertion below is demonstrably wrong. You state:

      ‘In other words the chart is evidence against Westminster’s thieving‘

      Well if you look at the notes, are you claiming this is Westminster stealing our small parcel trade, channel island business and overseas trade registered in the UK?. Can I suggest you read through the attached before spreading disinformation?

      https://www.uktradeinfo.com/Statistics/OverseasTradeStatistics/AboutOverseastradeStatistics/Documents/RTS_Methodology_Revision_2016.pdf#page8

    154. Glamaig says:

      interesting difference in Michel Barniers tweets here

      https://twitter.com/MichelBarnier/status/970651453646934017

      ‘Good meeting this morning with Mary Lou McDonald and Michelle O’Neill Sinn Fein…’ (all smiling in picture)

      https://twitter.com/MichelBarnier/status/970961060382601216

      ‘met DUPLeader this morning…’ (no smiles in picture)

    155. galamcennalath says:

      William Wallace says:

      Through gritted teeth

      They imply it somehow wasn’t fair because ‘their’ women lost.

      “it seems the fans of two of the SNP’s most prominent figures have responded in their thousands”

      … isn’t that the object of such a poll, to see which has most ‘fans’? If wee Scotland can muster more fans for ‘our’ two than great big England can for Queenie and Thatcher, doesn’t that say something obvious?

    156. Glamaig says:

      ‘Both party leader Nicola Sturgeon and MP Mhairi Black are among the top five, along with the UK’s longest serving monarch Her Majesty The Queen’

      LOL they cant bring themselves to say Nicola and Mhairi both were in front of queenie! maybe just protecting their readership from strokes and heart attacks, so saving lives, a humane measure.

    157. Ken500 says:

      ‘Ross Thompson MSP has to repaid public money. After sharing a hotel room with his partner funded with public money.’ Some people really know how to waste public money. Taking out of the mouth’s of babes.

    158. yesindyref2 says:

      Why will this brilliant article not be re-published in the “independence supporting” The National?

      http://www.thenational.scot/news/16074248.Tory_councillor_applies_for_baby_box_just_to_give_it_away_in_cheap_stunt/?action=success#comments-feedback-anchor

      “Tory councillor applies for baby box just to give it away in cheap stunt”

    159. Robert Peffers says:

      @Ian Law says: 8 March, 2018 at 8:46 pm:

      “A progressive tax system does away with all means testing. Affluent people pay through taxation for all the “free” things givin to all citizens. All good.”

      You just don’t have a clue, Ian.

      I’ll give you the truth of United Kingdom taxation since the Labour Government changed the tax system from being direct taxation, (on income(PAYE), and wealth)) to become indirect taxation, (on goods and services), that is VAT, Road Fuel Duty, Tobacco Duty, Alcohol Duty, Betting Tax and so on.

      It was known way back when the great Scottish Economists like Adam Smith, wrote their books that in direct taxation those most able to pay paid the highest burden of taxation and under indirect taxation those least able to pay paid the highest burden of taxation. Now when the Tories took over from Labour their very first move was to give tax allowances to the rich and to not only increase the basic rate of VAT but to also bring more items, (invariably item like hot pies that workers used for their meal breaks), to come under VAT.

      So the process to take from the poorest to give to the rich was begun by Labour but welcomed with open arms by the Tories when they regained power. It is no coincidence that since that introduction of Indirect taxation the gap between the rich and the poor has gone on getting wider. In the present Tory Austerity, that they claim we are all in together, the richest people have more than doubled their personal wealth and you cannot be under austerity while more than doubling your wealth.

      Yet here you are under the impression that the rich are paying for the things the poor get. The truth is that the poor, by bearing the main burden of taxation, are percentagewise paying for any perks they get. Everyone must pay for tax on goods and services for VAT is the main tax now and almost everything is thus taxed. Even the fuel in the car has not only Road Fuel Duty added but you pay VAT on it too.

      Great scheme for the government as the tax collectors for the government are those who sell goods and services and collect VAT for the Treasury.

      I don’t know what it is about the United Kingdom working class but they seem to think that income tax is all there is. Yet everything they buy, including services, is taking much more of their earnings than income tax does.

    160. William Wallace says:

      @ galamcennalath

      Indeed it does.

    161. Thepnr says:

      Baronesssamedi says:
      8 March, 2018 at 6:51 pm
      This is early March. The baby’s due August. She can’t possibly have had her “20 to 24 week scan” yet. Nobody is telling the truth here.

      A lot of you seem to have missed this tweet, if correct that the baby is due in August then there is no baby box to donate to a foodbank or elsewhere for that matter.

      Basically another Tory nobody getting MSM time to air a grievence against the SNP and by association Independence.

      Liars both. The councillor and the P&J. May they be dammed.

    162. Thepnr says:

      Post on Wings not tweet. Blush.

    163. Rock says:

      yesindyref2,

      “http://www.thenational.scot/news/16074248.Tory_councillor_applies_for_baby_box_just_to_give_it_away_in_cheap_stunt/?action=success#comments-feedback-anchor

      “Tory councillor applies for baby box just to give it away in cheap stunt””

      Publishing someone’s comment is not the same thing as publishing an article.

    164. Richard Hunter says:

      Tories seem to enjoy being unpleasant. If there’s no obvious reason for it, they’ll invent one!

    165. Ken500 says:

      They have started naming names and reporting the misogynistic bullying in Westminster on the telly. Once again they are above the Law, The Laws that they make. Criminal behaviour. They would not get away with it in most work places. It would be illegal. Bercow is one of them. The one supposed to be monitoring the abuse. Total lack of any PR department for complaints.

    166. heedtracker says:

      Tories seem to enjoy being unpleasant. If there’s no obvious reason for it, they’ll invent one!

      They look out for each other though. This popped up on WoS twitter stream

      http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/lawmaker-wes-goodman-anti-lgbt-resigns

      Its only relevant tory gimp wise because the BBC have more or less made toryboy Mike Portillo a multi millionaire, never off BBC r4 gimp network for example.

      And yet Thatcher favorite Portillo is one staggering liar, even by planet toryboy standards,

      https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/michael-portillos-sexual-past-is-colourful-but-its-his-own-affair-1117478.html

      Peter Tatchell, as ever, is absolutely clear on the answer. “Michael Portillo,” he argues, “is widely despised within the lesbian and gay community because he has repeatedly voted against gay equality”.

      I don’t think it matters who our elected reps are shagging, just like everyone else but there really is nothing in the world like how the lying, troughing hypocrite toryboys own the BBC and all the rest of UKOK hackdom.

    167. Kangaroo says:

      Here EU go, here EU go.

      I can feel a ‘border poll’ coming on.

      A way to ‘solve’ the impasse, leave it to the people who live there.

      If they vote to join the Republic – border in Irish Sea.
      If the vote to stay with UK – border on land.

      Or maybe they ask the NI people ‘Where would you like the border to be?

      Or a ‘No Deal’ – Mad Max scenario.

      I have run out of chocolate!

    168. jfngw says:

      Remember three parties in Scotland are organised like BBC Scotland and should be addressed by their correct names:

      UK Labour in Scotland
      UK Conservatives in Scotland
      UK LibDem in Scotland

      They have as much autonomy as BBC Scotland, they are allowed to fiddle around with some parochial issues but they should keep out of anything that steps on the toes of their superiors. Hence no single market debate at UK Labour in Scotland Conference.

    169. Dr Jim says:

      I’m gonnae be controversial

      I’m 69 years old I don’t care what peoples new and improved genders or non genders are, I don’t care what religion people are whether it’s new or old or invented, I don’t need to hear all the reasons why people are different from everybody else, I don’t care about new special rights that people demand everybody else pays attention to

      And you know why? I think everybody should be treated the same as everybody else with a bit of reasonably good manners and we’ll all be fine
      It’s taken millions of years of evolution to get us this far so whatever the personal gripe with humanity is it’s not the fault of the people who don’t understand or can even be bothered understanding

      I don’t care doesn’t mean that I’m anti anybody it just means do what you want as long as it doesn’t impinge on anybody else

      That’s equality

      btw: I prefer black dogs to other colours and I don’t care for blue cars, those are preferences, not set in stone coz I might change my mind (you never know)

    170. call me dave says:

      Did they not do that with Trident as well? …

      UK Scottish Labour no vote on Brexit Bill.

      I’ll get the conference ‘on-line’ tomorrow, got my cellotape ready to stick my eyelids up and two bags of Sweet/Salt popcorn from the pound shop. lol… don’t know how long I’ll last.

      It’ll be hotching wae radical solutions to Scotland’s problems nae doubt! Like the SNP must mitigate this and that and cough up more money for other things. Funny old world init! 🙂

    171. Dr Jim says:

      Labour party conference to demand SNP spend more money on things that the Labour party voted against them having the power to do

      Conference ends, let the pigeons fly a.n.d one two three Sing!

      Well keep the red f…..uuurghh

    172. Bill Hume says:

      Well said Dr Jim……I have a black dog and a white car….subject to change if I feel like it.

    173. jfngw says:

      Found this tweet online, is a sort of antidote to the Rowling tweet regarding about how if we gave the union another chance, we would be in a powerful position (I can’t find the exact words and it’s getting too late to keep on searching).

      ‘being in the U.K. is a bit like being a battered wife. Downtrodden & scared to leave the marriage. We need to summon up all our self-respect & courage to leave. If we don’t we’re in for a hell of a beating’

    174. Dr Jim says:

      @Bill Hume

      Thanks Bill, sometimes it’s all too much at the one time eh
      Who’d be a politician, glad I’ve retired and only got my own insanity to put up with

      And Independence of course

    175. Thepnr says:

      @jfngw

      Sounds about right to me.

    176. gregor says:

      Off topic but possibily significant: http://ytcropper.com/cropped/We5aa1b3278dd0a

    177. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Regarding the topic a the top of this. We should have a rapid response unit that can produce a hard hitting little leaflet that can be distributed immediately in any specific area and they would soon think twice about using newspapers to tell lies.

    178. gregor says:

      Before I get lynched, I merely ask people to be open minded and wait and see: https://qanonmap.github.io/?

      (I will refrain from speaking off topic in future)

      I support independence for Scotland.

    179. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      In fact on reflection I would gofurther than that. I would book a local hall and organise a public meeting to which the offending person was publicly invited.

    180. Ken500 says:

      Aberdeen City unionist male councillors have been deliberately harassing another female councillor. Breaking Council rules of conduct. To which they are supposed to abide. By sighed decoaration. They should be reported once again to the regulation authorities and the Council PR dept. Donnelly and another one.

      Speaker Bercow has illegally bullying women in Westminster. Breaking the Law. The Chairperson of the regulationary body. MPs above the Law again. Breaking the Laws that they make. The bullies in Westminster have been making the staff ill. Making them sick and having to be off ill. Then transferred to other posts.

    181. silverbuick says:

      First I missed the play on words in the title and then ‘mean tested’ as well? I’m a bit off today.

    182. Still Positive says:

      Jings, you’ve all gone to bed early.

    183. Cactus says:

      Hey there!

      Mary Miller.
      Pete Barton.
      Rory Proctor.
      Chris Matson.
      Stephen McGinty.
      Alex Hughes.
      Joe Curran.
      Audrey Garvie.
      David Nicholson.
      Lyn Farmer.

      Ah thought I’d give yee’s a menshie here as well, Wingers.

      Pop into any of the main articles anytime.

      Try posting on the next Cairnstoon.

      You may already do hehe.

      Draw back yer bow:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45DUM5uxZbk

    184. Graeme McAllan says:

      Mair like stupid bint 🙁

    185. Socrates MacSporran says:

      As of today, this stupid councillor is only 19-weeks pregnant (if we take 1 August as her due date – the article says she is “due to give birth in August”).

      Therefore, she has not yet had the 20-24 week scan at which her midwife would be expected to put into process the system whereby she receives the baby box.

      Therefore, all she has to do is, when the day arrives and she and the midwife have the baby box conversation, tell the midwife: “Thanks but no thanks, I will not be needing a baby box.”

      What a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deveive and all that.

      And, as a still partially-active journalist, albeit in my eighth decade, might I add – what a bunch of fannies the News Desk staff at the P&J must be, not to question such a stunt.

    186. Breeks says:


      gregor says:
      9 March, 2018 at 12:17 am
      Off topic but possibily significant: http://ytcropper.com/cropped/We5aa1b3278dd0a

      I wonder if Trump has read about the Smoot-Hawley Tariffs of 1930, where protectionist tariffs imposed by the US was met with retaliatory tariffs on American goods, and significantly impacted upon the Great Depression of the 1930’s.

      The opening salvos and Trump’s rhetoric about a premeditated trade war must be music to the ears of Brexiteers (that’s sarcastic btw), who are about to add prohibitive tariffs and destroy the economic competitiveness and access to market of their own economy!!!

      Brexit would be stupid enough idea at the best of times, but against the backdrop of a global trade war instigated by the Americans, and with the UK economy already teetering on recession with an unhealthy balance of trade, crippling debt and creeping inflation, the UK is heading up Shit Creek at full speed.

      Still, the 1930’s can teach us what can stem from a country flirting with fascist ideology, when it finds its economy floundering and poverty rampant, already has its society thoroughly brainwashed by exceptionalist delusions and monopolised propaganda, believes itself belittled Internationally, and has an ingrained philosophy that military spending and prowess can stimulate economic activity. And with disputed territorial flash points, such as Gibraltar or the Falkland Islands for example, what can possibly go wrong???

      Still, at least where Gibraltar is concerned, at least Spain can be relied upon to act rationally, not act like a fascist dictatorship bullyboy suddenly finding itself emboldened by opportunistic events, International law, and powerful European allies.

      Take it all together, you might describe such circumstances as “Greatly Depressing” .

      Let me insert a timely reminder that the EU was conceived and devised in the immediate aftermath of WW2 to promote reconciliation and common purpose amongst quarrelsome belligerent European States to prevent arguments spiralling out of control into future wars, and instead refocus upon promoting robust, strong and interdependent economies.

      Please Scotland, please Scottish Eurosceptics and EFTA backers, please be aware the real villain is not the EU, and why Scotland should remain fully committed to the EU. Why we are dithering with indecisiveness at such a time seems dangerous, stupid and utterly reckless to me.

    187. Nana says:

      Westminster deputy leader stands down amid investigation over gifts
      http://archive.is/bUdQC

      Councils on the brink of going bust as report reveals Tories have slashed funding by 50% http://archive.is/4Sym1

      Judy Asks: Is Brexit Destroying the Irish Peace Process?
      http://carnegieeurope.eu/strategiceurope/75724?lang=en

      https://www.politico.eu/article/uk-faces-e2-billion-eu-payment-for-china-fraud-trade/

    188. Nana says:

      Brexit risks delaying cancer treatment and putting ‘patients at risk’
      http://archive.is/HBUBO

      Calais problems will be 10 times worse than at Irish border, warns port boss
      http://archive.is/6Fa3S

      Macron seeks to replace Britain as India’s gateway to Europe
      http://archive.is/0rHil

      https://www.euractiv.com/section/uk-europe/interview/trade-expert-jersey-holds-the-key-to-unlock-brexit-dilemma/

    189. juster dave says:

      Here’s me thinking the baby box was for the baby..silly me !

    190. Robert Peffers says:

      @Breeks says: 9 March, 2018 at 7:16 am:

      ” … Why we are dithering with indecisiveness at such a time seems dangerous, stupid and utterly reckless to me.”

      Who are these, “We”, who are dithering that you speak about?

      And who is it you accuse of, “indecisiveness”?

      Has it entered your mind that you may by attempting to convince Wingers that you, personally, are a better judge of the situation than the leadership of the only real hope of Scotland avoiding the Armageddon the combined United Kingdom and USAian, “Special Relationship”, seems set upon inflicting upon the World … again?

      In the first place the SG/SNP are not, in any way, being either indecisive nor are they, (or indeed the EU), doing nothing.

      In the second place why are you so keen to run full pelt towards the very same precipice as the Westminster Establishment. Just which side are you really on?

      It seems to me, and I’m not alone, that your accusations of the SG/SNP being, “dangerous, stupid and utterly reckless”, is far, far more, “dangerous, stupid and utterly reckless”, than biding the time and taking the appropriate action at the correct time.

      Historically far more conflicts, both military and politically, have ended in total disaster and defeat than have ever been lost by taking the correct action at the correct time.

      “Into the valley of death, rode the six hundred.”

      The English army at Bannockburn.

      Johnny Cope at Prestonpans.

      Get the picture now?

    191. One_Scot says:

      I have been saying that for some time. There has to be a border poll in Ireland, it is the only way May can solve the problem and move on – to making the UK even smaller. Lol.

    192. Macart says:

      @Socratese MacSporran

      “what a bunch of fannies the News Desk staff at the P&J must be, not to question such a stunt.”

      Call me cynical, but I somehow doubt questioning the integrity of the story or its principle ever crossed their minds. 😉

      @Nana

      Yeah,the freeze on Brexit talks, much like Westminster’s current actions of the bill, were entirely predictable and inevitable. Really must stock up on snackage at this point. I’ve got two bingo cards running at the same time Better Together failures and Brexitmaggedon.

      And I’m just about set to call HOUSE on both. 😉

    193. Clootie says:

      …only in a Scotland served by a unionist media would such a story gain any traction.
      A universal government entitlement to young families is somehow bad and to be attacked.

      The NE of Scotland has embraced the Tories.
      Red, Yellow and blue voters all switch to Ruth’s ream to ensure Westminster remains in charge…go figure?

    194. Ian Foulds says:

      Dr. Jim at 11.35pm

      You’ve ‘nailed’ it.

    195. Breeks says:

      Read it again Robert.

      I didn’t mention the SNP.

      The collective “we” I referred to was the Eurosceptic contingent of Scotland who favour a relationship with Europe that in any capacity is the poor cousin of full membership.

    196. Andrew says:

      Just been listening to GMS with Richard Leonard, I would genuinely be embarrassed to say I was a labour supporter having listened to the utter drivel coming from RL.
      Is this really the best labour can find to lead their party? it’s just plain embarassing to listen too.
      Anyway, keep up the good work !

    197. dakk says:

      Gary Glitter.

      Got it now.That’s who Ms Imrie is the absolute double of.

      Master Garfield Glitter.Ah yes!

      Can rest easy now.

      God help the wean when it is born.What with it’s looks I mean.

    198. Capella says:

      @ Socrates MacSporran – so if she is only 19 weeks pregnant and has not yet had the conversation with the midwife to order the baby box, then Willie Young must be lying. He blamed the midwife for ordering the baby box.
      Absolutely typical.

    199. AndyMcKangry says:

      Accompanied my brother last night to the recording of radio shortbreads satirical panel show hosted byDes Clarke.
      My brother is newly retired and really needs something to do!!
      We were treated however to the musings of Alex Bell( Gaurdian and Courier).
      Although the show and the panel was for the most part enjoyable, the presence of Bell was a puzzle to me, he was as funny as Piles, until I reminded myself it was radio shortbread.
      According to Bell there is no constitutional crises looming, there is no appetite for protest against brexit mostly because “people” don’t understand it and have no interest in it and the likelihood of Independence is greatly reduced for the same reasons!!
      So there you have it, we are all worrying for nothing and we should settle down and be good compliant, apathetic unionists!,
      Somebody please tell me that it was just my bunker mentality kicking in and that he was really being funny. I won’t hold my breath though!

    200. Robert Peffers says:

      @Breeks says: 9 March, 2018 at 8:20 am:

      “Read it again Robert.”

      Why? I understood it in my first reading.

      “I didn’t mention the SNP.”
      Yes, I know, which was exactly my point and is clearly made as you needed to explain who you meant, (below).

      “The collective “we” I referred to was the Eurosceptic contingent of Scotland who favour a relationship with Europe that in any capacity is the poor cousin of full membership.”

      Indeed so but you have been, for some time now, urging anyone who reads your comments, they should be taking action now, or even should have been doing so yesterday.

      It boils down to this – should we put our faith in Nicola Sturgeon, the SG and the SNP, along with their many expert advisors and legal teams to know what is going on in Scotland, Westminster and the EU parliament or in you and those complaining that the FM, SG/SNP are indecisive and have become, “comfortable”, at Westminster and have joined the Establishment.

      Nicola, the SG/SNP are playing a blinder – as to Becoming comfortable and part of the Establishment just listen to this Mhairi Black speech:-

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cG9tpVr2KeI

      Which I believe, (perhaps wrongly), boosted her popularity in the SKY poll on UK influential women to place her above the Queen of England. It is nonsense to claim, as the SMSM has, that this was due to only indy supporters pushing her in the poll. She clearly obtained support from right across the United Kingdom’s women.

      The SNP members at Westminster cannot ever be comfortable in an Establishment that resents and detests their very presence within that edifice.

      Like it or not, deliberate or not, it is wrong to seem to attempt to second guess and undermine the actions of the SG/SNP for there will never be any other organisation that will ever stand such a chance of gaining our independence.

      Let’s be clear, we indy supporters are all impatient, and some of us have waited all our fairly long lives for the day and may be dead before the day arrives but there will be no other vehicle to get us there than the SNP. They are not perfect but they are all we have. (and I’m not saying the Grassroots YES movement aren’t a very powerful and necessary component in the Indy movement.

      The SNP need the YES movement and the Yes Movement need the SNP. They are two different components and things only began to go our way when they both existed together.

    201. Legerwood says:

      Robert Peffers

      “”I’ll give you the truth of United Kingdom taxation since the Labour Government changed the tax system from being direct taxation, (on income(PAYE), and wealth)) to become indirect taxation, (on goods and services), that is VAT, Road Fuel Duty, Tobacco Duty, Alcohol Duty, Betting Tax and so on.””
      ……………

      It would be more correct to say that the Labour Government of Blair and Brown, as Chancellor, changed the emphasis of taxation from direct taxation, e.g. income tax, to indirect taxation such as VAT etc.

      All of the indirect taxes that you mention were already in existence when the Blair/Brown Government came to power.

      VAT dates back to 1973 when we joined the EU. It replaced the Purchase tax (33%) which was introduced on ‘luxury’ goods in 1940. Fuel duty was introduced in 1908 while Tobacco and Alcohol, or excise duty, in one form or another date back to the 17th century.

      Gordon Brown certainly favoured indirect taxation over income tax which he reduced quite significantly at the higher rates during his time as Chancellor.

    202. Ken500 says:

      Typical out of touch Tory – unionist. The privileged not supporting other women. The sisterhood? Unfinished ‘vanity projects’ all around the City. Wasting £100 of Millions. £1.2Billion in debt. Cutting essential services, social care and education allocation, which ultimately costs more. The P&J/EEsupports this administration. Owned by a Dundee unionist who spent the profits on a redundant football club. Possible tax evasion. Both now in trouble going to the dogs. Being sold off or into administration. While Dundee is run by an SNP administration with massive improvements.

      Aberdeen City unionists are a laughing stock. Justbthe mention of them in the City. Across all walks of life and political persuasion. The reply is usually an expletive+. Universal. Maybe the reason so few people vote. (30%/40%)They think it isn’t worth. No matter how they vote they are just ignored, The only time the City was run properly, to the majority satisfaction, was when the SNP term when the City was on the up and the books were balanced etc. Many people were more content. Not now,

      The unionists support £Billions spent on Trident. Wasted on grotesque projects of little value. Hinkley Point, HS2.etc. Illegal wars causing the worst migration crisis in Europe. Killing other people’s babies. A humanitarian disaster worldwide. Yet would take money out of the mouth’s babes. Will not even let 30,000 unaccompanied children at risk into the UK.

      Yet grudge a baby box for children. Now Brexit.

      The biased, non impartial Sir BT getting £Millions from taxpayers for iinadequate Polls. On another anti SNP rant. Academics are supposed to be unbiased and impartial according to their Code of Conduct and their professional standard. Now trolling Scotland and Scottish taxpayers picking up the substantial bill for departmental expense and remuneration. Always getting it wrong and being censored and fined by the political governance association.

      Head of.non compliance association. Another conflict of interest. A game of chance. It would be more successsful putting on a blindfold and putting a pin on a donkey tail. The acclaimed expert who always gets it wrong. Poor analysis, methodology and data gathering, censured and fined many times. Making a fortune from public and private funds. A total waste of money breaking Purdah. Polls being used to influence the result. Gerrymandering is a criminal offence.The Bookies get it right.

      Sir awarded for bias and serves to corrupt unionism. It can be rest assured Brexit is more a problem for the Tory – unionists than the SNP. The Tory unionist vote share diminishing by the minute, May is between the devil and the deep Irish Sea. To find an Irish border solution she will have to dump the DUP. Then they will dump her. The electorate will dump the lot of them. This farce will continue until they both are voted out. The Tories could find themselves in the wilderness for thirty years. The Party actually finished with the average member aged seventy. They have to drag candidates off the street. They are dire. The Brexit disaster

    203. galamcennalath says:

      Nana says

      https://randompublicjournal.com/2018/03/08/not-buying-british-shortbread/

      Have strings been pulled behind the scenes to encourage business folk with BritNat sympathies to undermine Scotland the Brand? To replace Scottish with British, words and symbolism?

      Or put another way. Is that just a conspiracy theory or is the evidence we see everywhere proof that it’s actually happening?

      Personally, I usually go with seeing is believing!

      Additionally, why is it specifically Tories who rush to defend the proliferation of butcher’s branding?

      It would be comforting to have some evidence of intent and collusion. Perhaps association with SiU. Perhaps Tory donations.

      We may just have to wait for the post Indy Truth and Reconciliation Commission for answers!

    204. mike cassidy says:

      Nana

      Noticed the Rev was thinking of giving a donation to the indyscotnews site following their revelation about who is behind the Red Robin site.

      And why not.

      Still not clear why Michael Joslin wanted to stay anonymous.

      Maybe he didn’t want Scots to track down the sort of thing he was writing in 2009.

      “The art of political messaging is having something that we can put on a bumper sticker to identify who we are. If people see it, they recognise it, they know it, they believe in it and more importantly they will vote for it. We simply don’t have anything to put on that bumper sticker. We don’t present a coherent image that people can empathise with let alone believe in. We don’t give people a clear positive reason to vote Labour that they can tell their friends about and be proud to be a part of. Gordon Brown needs to come across as though he is one of the people, he is fighting their fights and delivering for the people that need to be delivered for. Gordon is doing this; but people think he isn’t. If people think he isn’t then we have a problem.”

      http://archive.is/m20qN

    205. Ken500 says:

      Labour were raising more money in taxation. £600Billion. Borrowing and spending £120Billion. Total £720Billion. In 2009.

      Seven years later the Tories are raising £533Billion. Borrowing and spending £100Billion more. £633Billion. Some acclaimed as private Chinese investment. A con. For grotesque projects of no value. The Tory slush fund. Just racking up the debt.

      They have tax cuts for the wealthiest and cut funding for essential services etc. Increasing inequality. Starving people to death unnecessarily. So they and their associates can illegally tax evade and emmbezzle public money. Breaking every Law and rule in the book. There were not even Laws toput the Bankers funding the Tory Party in jail.

    206. Ken500 says:

      Jennifer Stewart actually broke electoral Law. Got elected as a LibDem then immediately became Independent to support another political Party. Electoral fraud. Broke the Councillor Code of conduct. A signed declaration in Law. Electoral fraud for personal benefit. . Some integrity. She should immediately stand down and there should be a by election. Complains should be made to the electoral authorities. Even with investigation. No doubt will get away with it.

    207. Highland Wifie says:

      Re. Shortbread wars
      I occasionally visit the house of a friend, English, proud to be British and certainly not going to vote for Indy, who insists on playing games with flag stamped shortbread. (For the uninitiated, the shortbread inside the union flag tin is a most untraditional rectangular shape with an embossed Union flag stamped into it. I of course always decline and choose something else off the plate or plead not hungry. Not a word is exchanged about this. We both know we do not agree on Independence and never will. But I know her well and she does like her little acts of provocation. One day the choice was Tunnocks teacake or flag shortbread. I went hungry that day.
      What are they like these Britnats eh?

    208. galamcennalath says:

      “A transition deal which gives the UK continued influence over European Union rules is essential, industry chiefs representing millions of British workers will tell the Brexit Secretary next week.”

      http://archive.is/tNtIz

      I always assumed, believed even, that the CBI had a great deal of influence on the Tories. The CBI would like the UK to have continued influence on EU rule making after Brexit. That is a long way soft of the Tories position!

      As things look this week, a transition deal looks a long way of! We are currently stuck while the EU awaits a UK position to prevent a hard border across Ireland, and that seems impossible given other Tory commitments.

      Also, Tory red lines mean the ongoing relationship with the EU will be a basic trade deal. Estimates are made that this will half total trade in good and services with the EU. It doesn’t seem much better than WTO after a no-deal Brexit!

      It does seem like changed days when the Tories appear to be placing political ideology before the needs of business. Strange times.

    209. Macart says:

      When even SKY lay it out. You know it’s bad.

      https://archive.is/wAYdc

    210. heedtracker says:

      Great links Nana!

      Also, its easy to forget but red tory Gordon finally got the PM job off of Blair, he had a clear 6-12 month very winnable general election window but he bottled it. And then his ally Rupert Murdoch decided he was toast.

      Murdoch and the BBC are utterly ruthless, as we all know in Scotland.

      “Gordon Brown needs to come across as though he is one of the people, he is fighting their fights and delivering for the people that need to be delivered for. Gordon is doing this; but people think he isn’t. If people think he isn’t then we have a problem.”

    211. Macart says:

      The disputed powers.

      https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/972048813895581697

      Power grab it is then.

      And if that list isn’t a heads up moment which should have people really looking at our ‘partners’, then I don’t know what will.

    212. galamcennalath says:

      Highland Wifie says:

      What are they like these Britnats eh?

      Aye, indeed. Nationalism is an unfathomable concept to those of us who are driven to achieve democracy and social justice. An enigma wrapped up in a puzzle draped in soiled butcher’s attire. 🙂

    213. Proud Cybernat says:

      BREAKING from Pravda Quay
      with Union Jackie Kim Ono:

      https://i.imgur.com/PlaqCxR.jpg

    214. Robert says:

      “Is it ok to call her a gender neutral, bare faced liar?”

      No. But it is OK to say that what she has said is untrue.

    215. HandandShrimp says:

      Flipping heck!

      Go away from the interwebs for a few days and you come back to find Stu has had another massively successful fund raiser and yet another Tory wing nut seems to be determined to base their political career on left over Daily Mash stories.

      You can’t take your eye off the ball for five minutes.

    216. HandandShrimp says:

      PS I also listened to radio shortbread this morning for the first time in an age and heard Richard Leonard talking about Brexit conference motions. I wasn’t really any the wiser after what was a fairly lengthy interview and I don’t think the interviewer was either. Richard sounds like a nice enough bloke but he redefines the concept of vague.

    217. call me dave says:

      Three pages for Henry McLiesh in The National today urging the Scottish branch office accounting unit to embrace the
      ‘single market’

      Hooray Henry the great fence funambulist!

      Just noticed there’s a lie in McLiesh. 🙁

    218. heedtracker says:

      Complains should be made to the electoral authorities. Even with investigation. No doubt will get away with it.

      A lot of it is voter apathy. Unionists in ACC understand this totally.

      They have no reason to even consider what Aberdonians think about how SLabour red tory dudes like Sir Wullie Young have pissed away hundreds of millions on his white elephants. Neo fascist Voice of the North P&J, massed ranks of beeb Scotland gimps, all have yoon ACC backs.

      Yes they make a lot of money themselves but just look at the debacle over billionaire Ian Wood offering a fortune to demolish Union Terrace Gardens.

      For some reason or other, Wood decided he wanted these fine but run down city centre gardens demolished, ACC held a city wide ref, Aberdeen said yes do it, ACC said no that’s the wrong answer, Wood went back to his cash mountain, quite a large chunk of what might have been a Scottish oil pension fund, like Norway’s.

      You get what you do not vote for.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_Terrace_Gardens

      Its a lot like having Princess Street Gardens sold off and built over with just another giant concrete shopping centre. Although to be fair, red tories catastrofucks like Sir Wullie have also ruined Aberdeen’s main street too, for some reason.

      Welcome to teamGB, in Aberbloodydeen, current owners, all kinds of tory yoon zoomers and roasters.

    219. Glamaig says:

      David Clegg of the Daily Record on Radio Shortbread this morning peddling the same old pish that if Labour take seats from the SNP it somehow makes a Labour government more likely.

      IT DOESNT BECAUSE THERE WOULD STILL BE THE SAME NUMBER OF TORIES YOU TOTAL IDIOT. ONE OPPOSITION PARTY TAKING SEATS FROM ANOTHER DOESNT DAMAGE THE GOVERNMENT. ALL THIS DOES IS WEAKEN SCOTLAND.

      To be honest it is scary the number of intelligent people around who seem to believe the pish Clegg is talking there. I even had to explain it to Mrs G and my son. Its one of these things that are called ‘truthy’ which sound true at a surface level until you actually think about it. Sadly a lot of people dont think about it and fall for it.

    220. heraldnomore says:

      “But Mr Leonard – who was having a good day at the despatch box – was not finished.”

      That’ll be Brian Taylor on FMQs. I think I’ve just turned the clock back about seven years, but at least back then we could Blether With Brian on such matters and put him right; and we had Rab in the Cal Merc with the real commentary…

      Toodle ooh the noo. He still sees a different version to the one I watch.

    221. HandandShrimp says:

      Call me Dave

      🙂 I think it is spelt McLeish 😉

      Henry is clearly torn and is probably one of the more articulate genuine Devo Max supporters out there. Unlike the SiU loons he has no desire to scrap Holyrood.

      SiU seems to have morphed from “No to Independence” to “No to Scotland…make it a county of England”. When did that happen?

    222. Ken500 says:

      @ Steve Clarke

      A brilliant thread on Rev Stu twitter.

      Agreement with every word. Says it all.

      Thanks a Billion Rev Stu for all you do and everyone else who gives support.

    223. galamcennalath says:

      Glamaig says:

      peddling the same old pish that if Labour take seats from the SNP it somehow makes a Labour government more likely

      Politicians will ‘try it on’, it’s in the nature of the game.

      The way it’s supposed to work is that an informed electorate make reasoned judgements not only about policies but also about which politicians they believe and trust. And to keep voters informed we have a free and balanced media. Except we haven’t. We haven’t a media which contributes to the democratic process, we have one which undermines it!

      When a politician makes a ‘truthy’ claim like that, an interviewer doing their job would shoot them down in flames on the spot. But alas there is an agenda to keep the electorate uninformed. Ignorance is strength.

    224. Ken500 says:

      There will not be much change until the 3rd of May. The council elections in the rest of the UK. The council elections when the Tories lose ground as expected The threat that the Tories could lose seats. May will be gone before the year is out.

    225. Nana says:

      Don’t know if anyone has posted this

      Power grab frameworks!

      https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/frameworks-analysis

    226. galamcennalath says:

      HandandShrimp says:

      “No to Scotland…make it a county of England”. When did that happen?

      I think it’s always been there. Literally since the Treaty of Union. On both sides of the Border. Some deluded fools believed a new merged country of ‘Britain’ could be forged. However most only every saw a Greater England in these Isles.

      Devolution has always been a threat to Greater Englanders and they opposed it in two referendums. They were probably correct. We now have a rabid Greater English Nationalist government in WM. I would think behind closed doors they see the ideal solution to constitutional friction would be to neuter or kill off Holyrood.

    227. Glamaig says:

      galamcennalath says:
      9 March, 2018 at 10:47 am

      ‘When a politician makes a ‘truthy’ claim like that, an interviewer doing their job would shoot them down in flames on the spot. But alas there is an agenda to keep the electorate uninformed.’

      Indeed and its even more blatant because Clegg isnt even a politician, he is the Political Editor of a major newspaper, and knows fine what he doing, as does the interviewer.

    228. Ken500 says:

      Clearly the Daily Record has not lost enough revenues and readership. The lying continues. Labour will not gain seats in Westminster because enough voters in England will not support him (unless there is no alternative). The rest of the UK decides the make up of Westminster. Scottish votes do not count. Some reporters should learn to count and read a balance sheet. A bit of general knowledge, economics and history might help. How out of touch in Scotland Labour really are. There is a credible alternative in Scotland (Thank goodness). The Daily Record Labour supporting unionists intend on going bust. Just like Labour – unionists bankrupted Britain.

      Apart from the fact Corbyn the enablers. The duplicitous liars supporting the Tories. Corbyn Oabour could have brought down the May/Tories on 12th Sept 2016 EVEL but chose not to. Let the farce just continue. If Corbyn cared he would step aside as he has done so many times. Can’t step up to responsibility. Labour – unionist weak on so many levels.

    229. Capella says:

      Labour will try to take seats from everyone That means the SNP in Scotland because until last year there was only 1 Tory MP in Scotland.

      But in England they will try to take seats from the Tories. That is their problem. Labour is just as split over EU membership as the Tories.

      In Scotland they have to pretend to be centre-left. In England they have to be centre-right.

      In Scotland the centre-left ground is occupied by the SNP. In England the centre-right ground is occupied by themselves and the Lib Dems. Not many seats left to fight for.

      They’re trying to face both ways and failing, much as the Liberals have done. Their “Scottish” Conference will be a complete waste of time IMO.

    230. Breeks says:

      It’s frustrating that we are talking about these repatriated powers coming to either Holyrood or London. There is a third option don’t forget.

      If we want Scotland to resist the pressures of chlorinated chicken, GM foodstuffs and steroids in beef, then the best place for these powers is Brussels as a component part of the EU collective which has shown itself smart enough, and economically strong enough to withstand pressures from the US and China, and which can and already has negotiated dozens of International Trade Deals from the strong collective bargaining position.

      All of these powers currently delegated or “devolved” to the EU, with a sovereign veto, is entirely appropriate and exactly where these powers ought to stay.

      Plan A should be unapologetic and uncompromising about staying in the EU collective as a member state. That’s where OUR interests are bolstered, because our interests are then the same shared interests as Germany, France, Italy etc, and whether you like it or not, it is the community factor which takes the power of individual states and amagates them into the greater collective power of the EU.

      Anything less than maintaining our EU membership and citizenship is a grossly inferior Plan B.

      Brexit, even Brexit with repatriated powers, is definitely NOT our optimum objective. It would just be nice to hear somebody saying it every now and again.

    231. Capella says:

      Of course, if Labour had spent their 13 years in power in Westminster making the case for and implementing centre-left policies, they would be in power now.

      But they didn’t and nobody believes them any more. They are mostly self-serving career politicians who practice economy with the truth and nothing else. This baby-box episode illustrates that with both Labour and Tory lying to the public, aided and abetted by the P&J.

      If it wasn’t for Stu they would succeed.

    232. heedtracker says:

      House of Commons Speaker John Bercow named in bullying claims, Pritchard by the way is a Tory

      Wow! He’s interesting to watch as Commons Speaker too, very adept at stepping in to help and protect assorted toryboys, especially if they’re floundering or dont know their brief. Also interesting is how Commons beeb gimp producers cover all that up with nifty camera shots, that nip away from the floundering tory gits.

      That’s also a very famous English pub name, The Floundering Tory Git, just behind Red Lion, in popularity.

    233. Capella says:

      @ Breeks – Westminster can’t allow those powers to return to Holyrood. Their whole BREXIT project depends on London being turned into Singapore. For that, they need Scottish resources to trade.

      Otherwise, they will have to abandon BREXIT and look so incredibly stupid we will all die laughing.

    234. heedtracker says:

      As SLab/Con catastrofucks like Sir Wullie, play their toryboy games, in conjunction with the ever more tory ferocious Press and Journal, what was SLabour really like, towards women, when they assumed they owned their Scotland region, for ever and ever, UKOK?

      Herald vote NO, vote Tory stuff disappears behind paywall with archive is, so.

      Also, note ending, that Leonard nobody, “did not respond to a request for comment.” Shock!

      http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15568711.Revealed__Labour_led_Glasgow_council_spent_millions_fighting_women_workers__39__equal_pay_claims/

      SCOTLAND’S largest local authority spent more than £2.5 million fighting equal pay claims by female council workers over the last 10 years.

      Figures released following a Freedom of Information request show that between 2007 and 2017 – when the Labour Party controlled Glasgow City Council – £1.8m was spent on legal fees and a further £700,000 on “internal staff costs” to contest claims by women who were victims of wage discrimination.

      The SNP claimed the figures “demonstrate just how far Labour was prepared to go to fight equal pay” and a campaign group which represents the majority of claimants said the outlay was an “incredible waste of public money”.

      The Court of Session decided in August that a re-grading scheme introduced by Glasgow City Council in 2007 may have provided less favourable treatment for women workers. In September the SNP leader of the local authority Susan Aitken pledged to “end Glasgow’s years of pay injustice”.

      She has held meetings with Scottish Government Finance Secretary Derek Mackay to discuss “financial assistance” which could help pay the anticipated £500m compensation bill to at least 6,000 women.

      However, the SNP has criticised Labour for dragging its heels on equal pay when it led the council, potentially increasing the cost to the public purse.

      The Freedom of Information request asked Glasgow City Council to set out internal and external costs for equal pay litigation and administration and the local authority provided figures from 2007 until 2017, a period covered by the re-grading scheme which was at the centre of the Court of Session ruling.

      The council spent a total of £2,551,256 fighting the claims, including £712,832 on internal staff costs. The fees for “counsels, solicitors, opposition legal expenses, shorthand writers, postage” and “other professional fees and expenses” totalled £1,838,425.

      A council source said one long-serving senior director “went white” when they realised how much had been paid out.

      Last month Aitken, who became council leader after the May local authority election, accused Labour politicians of “sticking their heads in the sand” over equal pay, “denying justice” to women workers.

      She said years of inaction “inflated the potential cost with each passing year – not to mention the cost of legal fees”.

      An SNP source said: “These figures are horrendous and show just how far Labour was prepared to go in Glasgow to fight equal pay. If they had just sorted this out when it first became an issue 10 years ago it would have cost a fraction of what it will cost now.

      “Labour’s leadership candidates need to justify why they stayed silent on this issue for all those years and didn’t raise it with Labour whilst they ran the council. Why didn’t they ask them to direct officers to resolve this issue years ago?”

      Former Head of Local Government for Unison Scotland, Mark Irvine, who is now an equalities campaigner and the spokesman for Action 4 Equality Scotland (A4ES), which represents more than 80 per cent of claimants, said: “£2.5 m is an incredible waste of public money, especially after three senior judges in Scotland’s highest civil court, the Court of Session, unanimously concluded that Glasgow City Council’s pay arrangements are unfit for purpose.

      “I suspect the figure is likely to be a huge underestimate of the true cost to the council and local council taxpayers…Glasgow’s figures underestimate the real costs involved because they don’t reflect the cost of large numbers of highly paid senior officials spending much time of their time pulling the wool over the eyes of a largely female workforce, instead of looking after their interests by upholding the principle of equal pay for work of equal value.”

      A council spokeswoman said: “These are costs incurred by previous administrations that chose to challenge pay claims through the courts.”

      A Labour source accused SNP critics of “staggering hypocrisy” adding “It is currently an SNP-run council which is appealing a Court of Session decision on equal pay.”

      Aitken responded: “Any remaining legal proceedings will only be for the purposes of providing clarity, they will not be used to delay or put barriers in the way of reaching a settlement. I have instructed council officers to begin talks to agree terms of reference for negotiations with all parties.”

      A spokesman for Anas Sarwar’s leadership campaign said: “Anas has put tackling gender inequality at the heart of his campaign, and has already unveiled plans to create a Labour commission to finally end the gender pay gap once and for all.”

      Richard Leonard’s campaign did not respond to a request for comment.

    235. heedtracker says:

      Nice. EU’s got their own hard core toryboy right wing Strong and Stable Teresa style probs too though. If only the beeb gimp network could get in to Europe!

      Matthew Holehouse
      ?

      @mattholehouse
      Follow Follow @mattholehouse

      Lux PM Bettel: “They were in with a load of opt-outs. Now they are out, and want a load of opt-ins.”

      4:29 AM – 7 Mar 2018

    236. yesindyref2 says:

      Great article by LPW, and to add to that from some observations, seems to me those espousing the Tory point of view in forums turn out to be abolitionists, who would see Holyrood go and direct rule again from Westminster.

      Well, this is a fair democratic view to take, and is honest. But after 25% voted NO in the Dev Ref of 1997, successive survyes showed support for abolishing Holyrood decreasing down to around 7%, with ups and downs, and perhaps a more recent increase to maybe 10%.

      It will be interesting to see this year’s SSAS, because the Tories in Scotland themselves are increasingly supporting policies that can only lead eventually to Holyrood being abolished, and if the Scottish Tories are indeed representing an anti-devolution raft of policies, then their native support goes down to less than 10%. For comparison, in 1997 they polled 17.5% of the Scottish electorate for zero MPs out of 72, though they managed to get 18 seats in Holyrood in 1999.

    237. Ken500 says:

      Corbyn now in Scotland telling even more lies. More fool them. It would be better if they tried to keep him quiet. Speak about dinosaurs in politics. Control by unelected Trade union leaders. The old days Leading to oblivion. Jackie Baillie speaking nonsense as usual. Carillon had very little presence Scotland. The warning signs were already there. Got rid of even by the councils for breaking contracts. A disaster area. How are the jobs going in Barrow on Furness and Davenport. Funded by £1Billion of useless Trident money by Scottish taxpayers. McCluskey.

      The SNP Gov better, different more economical way of funding. Got rid of PPI for a better way of funding. Keeping to budget.

    238. Ken500 says:

      Classic. ‘They were in with a lot of opt outs. Now they are (want) out, with a lot of opt ins.’

    239. Robert Peffers says:

      @Legerwood says: 9 March, 2018 at 9:16 am

      ”I’ll give you the truth of United Kingdom taxation since the Labour Government changed the tax system from being direct taxation, (on income(PAYE), and wealth)) to become indirect taxation, (on goods and services), that is VAT, Road Fuel Duty, Tobacco Duty, Alcohol Duty, Betting Tax and so on.

      I’ll grant you that I was perhaps rather clumsy in how I expressed myself as I meant to state it as I expressed it later in the comment as being the balance of direct tax and indirect tax. Yes indeed most taxes mentioned did existed before Labour shifted the main burdens from direct to indirect by cutting back on direct while increasing the indirect.

      Even the former, “Purchase Tax”, had been used to balance the main burdens by only being applied to such things as the more expensive fur coats like Mink and Ermine and upon the more expensive of imported perfumes and fine imported wines.

      It thus remains true that Labour were the first modern UK government to deliberately shift the main burden of taxation from direct to indirect taxation and so knowingly burden the poorer members of what passes as United Kingdom society with being the main contributors to the Treasury tax take.

      From that day the balance has swung ever more towards opening the gap between the haves and the have nots in the United Kingdom.

      Every unionist government since then has gone on biasing indirect taxation to punish the poor while rewarding those in the top wealth brackets who continue to become ever more wealthy as their friends in governments removes money from the pockets and purses of the most poor and disperse it among their friends the rich.

      Note also that the individuals elected to local councils in the United Kingdom and parliamentarians in the United Kingdom including devolved administrations and the European Union parliament are recipients of that United Kingdom biased taxation system. There is little chance these will legislate to remove their cash cow providers that are the poor.

      In living memory our local councillors were all unpaid. Not really a good thing as they tended to be drawn from those in society who benefitted most by being able to affect local government decisions. For example many a small jobbing builder who got himself elected to the council soon became a big housebuilding company with council-house building contracts.

    240. jfngw says:

      Don’t worry I watched Neil, Portillo & Flint last night telling us that the EU are on the verge of a deal, they are bluffing and will compromise in the negotiations. We pretty much got the EU on the ropes seemed to be the underlying message, it’s just the EU are better at PR it seems. Believe it if you want!

    241. galamcennalath says:

      Lidington, “What will not help either customers or producers is to have different sets of food labelling or food hygiene or safety regulations in different parts of the UK. All that does is add to costs, loss of jobs amongst producers and it leads to less choice, probably a higher price for consumers.”

      So, why does Livingston think some parts of the UK will end up with poorer standards than others?

      So, London will set our standards. What if they decide to lower them? We are to sit still and shut up?

      It isn’t a problem if standards vary. Producers simply produce to the highest common denominator. Surely no member of the public will complain about high standards! If producers plan to export to the EU they will have to comply with their standards anyway.

      And if 28 members of the EU can currently agree (significant word, agree) common standards then why can’t everyone across these Isles?

      The Tories don’t want to agree anything with Scotland, they want to dictate everything.

      But let’s face it. It’s all about the Tory race to the gutter. Cheap and nasty is good enough for the plebs.

    242. galamcennalath says:

      Lidington becomes Livingston. My iPad can be a real joker sometimes. An OS with a sense of humour. Who would ever have predicted that?

    243. yesindyref2 says:

      Don’t know if anyone has linked this, but

      http://www.thenational.scot/resources/files/73339

      “UK Government document that reveals details of its Brexit power grab on Scotland” from the National.

    244. galamcennalath says:

      yesindyref2 says:

      Brexit power grab

      Interesting how many areas are ‘Devolution Intersects’ for NI but not S nor W!

      I suspect as part of the Good Friday Agreement more was devolved to NI to allow easier agreement N & S.

      We haven’t heard much about it because there is no NI parliament currently, but this power grab may impact on the GFA.

    245. Robert Peffers says:

      @HandandShrimp says: 9 March, 2018 at 10:43 am:

      “SiU seems to have morphed from “No to Independence” to “No to Scotland…make it a county of England”. When did that happen?”

      Oh! Generally speaking it happened roughly between 1700 to 1706 at Westminster but SiU only found out about it last month, (from a guy on Twitter I think).

      I’ll get my coat & woolly Wings hat.

    246. yesindyref2 says:

      OT
      Been casting my e’e over the Record and it seems pretty balanced and resaonable to me, maybe even the SNP do a little better than others on the Politics page. Good to see too they carry the “most influential woman” story:

      https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/nicola-sturgeon-mhairi-black-voted-12153605

    247. yesindyref2 says:

      @galamcennalath
      One of the 24 kind of at random: “EU legislation providing a common framework of rules on breeding and trade in pedigree animals and germinal products in the EU and the treatment of imports from 3rd countries. Each of the UK regions has competent authorities in their areas for recognition of breed societies under this legislation.

      UK regions

      and one of the 12 they think reserved apart from NI almost at random:

      Food Geographical Indications (protected food names)

      yes, one would suspect the UK Gov’s motivations.

    248. K1 says:

      I’m laying it out, so we can all see exactly what powers they are going for, read them…and weep:

      24 policy areas that are subject to more detailed discussion to explore whether legislative common framework arrangements might be needed, in whole or in part
      Responsible UK Government Department
      Area of EU Law (Policy Area)
      Devolution Intersect
      Additional Information – what the EU law does
      NI
      S
      W
      DEFRA
      Agricultural support

      Policies and Regulations under the EU Common Agricultural Policy covering Pillar 1 (income and market support); Pillar 2 (rural growth, agri-environment, agricultural productivity grants or services and organic conversion and maintenance grants); and cross-cutting issues, including cross compliance, finance & controls.

      DEFRA
      Agriculture – fertiliser regulations

      Regulations providing common standards for compositional ingredients, labelling, packaging, sampling and analysis of fertilisers. The UK is also signed up to a number of international agreements (e.g. the Gothenburg Protocol) and EU agreements (the National Ceilings Directive) related to fertiliser regulation.

      DEFRA
      Agriculture – GMO marketing and cultivation

      Standards for marketing and cultivation of genetically modified organisms.

      DEFRA
      Agriculture – organic farming

      Regulations setting out standards for organic production certification.

      DEFRA
      Agriculture – zootech

      EU legislation providing a common framework of rules on breeding and trade in pedigree animals and germinal products in the EU and the treatment of imports from 3rd countries. Each of the UK regions has competent authorities in their areas for recognition of breed societies under this legislation.

      DEFRA
      Animal health and traceability

      EU rules and standards that aim to maintain animal health and allow their movement, including policies covering: prevention of disease (entering UK), control of disease (endemic and exotic), surveillance (for exotic disease) movement of livestock, pet passports and veterinary medicines.

      DEFRA
      Animal welfare

      EU rules relating to aspects of animal welfare including on-farm issues, movement of livestock and slaughter.

      HSE and DEFRA
      Chemicals regulation (including pesticides)

      EU regulations on the classification, labelling and packaging of substances and mixtures (CLP); the placing on the market and use of biocidal products (e.g. rodenticides); the export and import of hazardous chemicals; the registration, evaluation, authorisation and restriction of chemicals (REACH); and plant protection products (e.g. pesticides).

      DHSC
      Elements of reciprocal healthcare

      Regulations 1408/71 and 883/2004 are the main pieces of EU legislation providing for reciprocal healthcare.

      DEFRA
      Environmental quality – chemicals

      Regulation of the manufacture, authorisation and sale and use of chemical products primarily through the REACH regulation but also including: Persistent Organic Pollutants (POPs),
      Polychlorinated Biphenyls (PCBs) and Minamata.

      DEFRA
      Environmental quality – ozone depleting substances and F-gases

      The UK has international obligations under the Montreal Protocol to phase out the use of ODS, phase down hydrofluorocarbons by 85% by 2036, licence imports and exports and report on usage to the UN. EU Regulations and institutions currently deliver these obligations through quota restrictions, licencing and reporting requirements. The EU Regulations also go further with product bans, leakage controls measures and certification requirements for technicians.

      DEFRA
      Environmental quality – pesticides

      Regulations governing the authorisation and use of pesticide products and the maximum residue levels in food, and a framework for action on sustainable use of pesticides.

      DEFRA
      Environmental quality – waste packaging and product regulations

      Policies and Regulations that aim to meet certain essential product requirements and set product standards including for packaging (e.g. ROHS in Electrical and Electronic Equipment, Batteries and Vehicles) in order to manage waste.

      DEFRA
      Fisheries management & support

      Policies and Regulations relating to rules relating to the sustainability of fisheries (quotas), access to waters, conservation measures, enforcement and financial support.

      Food Standards Agency

      Food and feed safety and hygiene law (food and feed safety and hygiene law, and the controls that verify compliance with food and feed law (official controls)

      EU regulations laying down the general principles and requirements of food and feed safety and hygiene; food and feed law enforcement (official controls); food safety labelling; risk analysis; and incident handling. The regulations set out an overarching and coherent framework for the development of food and feed legislation and lay down general principles, requirements and procedures that underpin decision making in matters of food and feed safety, covering all stages of food and feed production and distribution.

      DEFRA
      Food compositional standards

      Minimum standards for a range of specific food commodities such as sugars, coffee, honey, caseins, condensed milk, chocolate, jams, fruit juices and bottled water.

      DEFRA
      Food labelling

      Regulations setting out requirements on provision of information to consumers on food labels.

      MHCLG
      Hazardous substances planning

      Elements of the Seveso III Directive relate to land-use planning, including: planning controls relating to the storage of hazardous substances and handling development proposals for hazardous establishments.

      BEIS
      Implementation of EU Emissions Trading System

      Directives 2003/87/EC establishes the European Union Emissions Trading Scheme for greenhouse gas. The Scheme sets a maximum amount of greenhouse gas that can be emitted by all participating installations and aircrafts; these operators then monitor, verify and report their emissions, and must surrender allowances equivalent to their emissions annually. Allowances are issued either by being sold at auction or allocated for free to some operators, and can be traded, with the price determined by the market.

      BEIS (DHSC, MHCLG, DEFRA, DfE and MoJ also have interest)
      Mutual recognition of professional qualifications (MRPQ)

      Directives that create systems for the recognition for professional qualifications and professional experience throughout the EU. Allowing EU professionals to work in regulated professions in other EU states on either a permanent or temporary basis.

      DHSC
      Nutrition health claims, composition and labelling

      Including Regulations and Directives on the nutrition and health claims made on food; food for special medical purposes and weight control;food intended for infants; the addition of vitamins and other substances to food; and food supplements.

      DEFRA
      Plant health, seeds and propagating material

      Requirements in relation to the import and internal EU movement of plants and plant products, risk assessment of new plant pests and outbreak management. Assurance and auditing of policies across the UK to protect plant biosecurity. Requirements for plant variety rights, registration of plant varieties and quality assurance of marketed seed and propagating material.

      Cabinet Office
      Public procurement

      The regime provided by the EU procurement Directives, covering public procurement contracts for supplies, services, works and concessions above certain financial thresholds awarded by the public sector and by utilities operating in the energy, water, transport and postal services sectors (Directives 2014/24/EU, 2014/25/EU and 2014/23/EU).

      BEIS
      Services Directive

      Directive that seeks to realise the full potential of services markets in Europe by removing legal and administrative barriers to trade by increasing transparency and making it easier for businesses and consumers to provide or use services in the EU Single Market.

      https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/972048813895581697

      https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/686991/20180307_FINAL__Frameworks_analysis_for_publication_on_9_March_2018.pdf

    249. Macart says:

      @K1

      Not hard to see why those competences have been singled out and it has fuck all to do with exploring any damn thing. With oversight on those powers they could sell your products, overwrite your brand, your standards and your resources right out from under your nose.

      Do people, after all evidence of their actions to date over austerity ideology, post indyref legislation and the biblical omnishambles that Brexit has become, seriously believe they wouldn’t?

      Equal partners was the sales pitch in 2014 folks. What do you call partners who take things which don’t belong to them without asking and give you crumbs in return?

    250. Macart says:

      @Proud Cybernat

      Good grief! 🙄

      I can Hardy believe it.

      Ah’ll get ma poncho.

    251. galamcennalath says:

      BBC – “Westminster will give “extensive new powers” to Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.”

      The spinning has begun.

      How kind hearted of WM to give some of our powers back to us!

      Obviously the media will play down our other powers which they are refusing to transfer!

    252. Legerwood says:

      Robert Peffers @ 11.49 am

      Gordon Brown really did go all out for indirect taxation and, if memory serves me correctly, he even added a few new ones but in his last budget he made one change to income tax that hit the poorest tax payers hard.

      That was when he scrapped the 10p tax band. At a stroke he doubled the income tax of those who just made it into the 10p band yet he went on TV the night of the budget and said no one would be worse off! The ones particularly hard hit were women in their 60s whose pension, if they had paid Seeps meant they were just into the 10p band…like me. My tax bill doubled.

      What was even clearer was that he had not told Tony Blair that he was going to do it. I saw the TV footage of the budget. His announcement of the scrapping of the 10p band came right at the end and Tony Blair’s reaction to it was a picture. He clearly realised immediately what it meant for those in that band.

      Mr Brown was not a very good Chancellor, to put it mildly.

    253. yesindyref2 says:

      @Proud Cybernat
      Jeez.

      Just looking on his timeline, and the Record earlier. They’re going really big on Mhairi’s speech, looks like being a bit of a shaker. But then some buffoon says something misogynisitic and homophobic about Ruth Davidson. Sigh.

    254. Robert Peffers says:

      Anyone feeling down and like they need a really good laugh could do worse than read this little gem from an information link on many BBC News website articles:-

      https://archive.is/cvsKJ

      I may have a rather peculiar dry sense of humour but I found it really hilariously funny. Even so it really is a mind blowing, in your face, pile of BBC downright lies.

    255. Dr Jim says:

      Again been banging on about this for years
      Lower food standards in the UK means lower wages and more production in order to sell to other countries they don’t even have deals with, and more production of fish means less fish without the EU to stop it happening
      So the fishermenn who were complaining are sold out for deals with anybody who’s got money to pay the UK (England)
      GM crops means cross contamination worries and there goes the Whisky industry, sold to Kentucky and Peru
      Food Labelling Yeah! well we’ve been seeing that for the last three years

      The BBC will continue to report this as softly as they can so’s not to raise the alarm but maintain they did report it when the shit hits the fan, and it will
      Meanwhile David Mundells Scotland office increases in size staffing and budget to almost as big as Holyrood (WHY?)

      If Scottish people don’t wake up from their apathy pretty soon Holyrood will be downgraded to the Scottish County Council just like Yorkshire

      And all because England knows they’re not going to get a Unionist government voted into Holyrood who’ll do as they’re told, so they’re just going to eliminate Scotland as a country, Simples!

      BTW It’s not only Scotland, a deal in Norn Ireland was just about ready to be announced by the two parties there, Theresa May arrived and it was all mysteriously called off with all the usual regret noises
      Wales has no chance I’m afraid they’re hammered the end

      So the UK Guv see all this as making a threat the the EU that if the UK don’t get what they want this is what they’ll do, will the EU back down and deal? I kinda don’t think so, I think the EU will get even tougher with the UK
      because if they don’t 27 other countries will kick up a helluva stink and it’ll cause unrest in the EU which is exactly what the UK wants, the break up of the EU and it’s control and democracy

      Remember folks the first country the Nazis invaded was their own

    256. yesindyref2 says:

      Mmm, I’m a bit concerned about this one, Nick Eardley is one of the better from the Beeb:

      https://twitter.com/nickeardleybbc/status/970221763614429184

    257. starlaw says:

      Come on then MSM lets see if you can redeem your reputations. Where will the ordinary man in the street get an honest report on whats happening with the return of these powers, will it be through your pages…. or will it be on the New Media… the balls in your court.

    258. Famous15 says:

      Powers are only being retained by Westminster so that we do not get price rises.If Scotland is stubborn and does not accept GM,nice poisons,fracking,privatisation,halogen washed chicken etc then we will have to take an ENORMOUS PRICE RISE.

      Alternatively we vote for independence just live quiet wealthy lives.

    259. Proud Cybernat says:

      “Powers are only being retained by Westminster so that we do not get price rises”

      Since none of these powers are ‘reserved’ they are devolved by default. They are Scottish Parliament powers. WM isn’t retaining anything since they don’t presently have them in order to retain them. WM is TAKING from Scotland (agreed in the Devolution Settlement) what is not theirs.

    260. Jack Murphy says:

      Many thanks Poster Nana for your links at 7:25am approximately.

      This one certainly stands out as worth a second airing,with video clips and text:

      http://indyref2.scot/bbc-admits-it-misquoted-fms-hgv-comments-but-says-coverage-balanced

      Trust Once Lost is Never Regained

    261. heedtracker says:

      Meanwhile David Mundells Scotland office increases in size staffing and budget to almost as big as Holyrood (WHY?)

      Because we’re a colony. Scotland’s getting too big for her UKOK boots, so all kinds of tory wingnuts are coming up to sort us out.

      Its what the proud Scot buts voted for.

      How many will do that again?

    262. t42 says:

      Ian says:
      “It leaves the possibility that the box was ‘fraudulently’ claimed for.”

      Have to wait on them publishing that form. We’ll need a spare box for all this popcorn 😀

    263. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Nana @ 07:25,

      Link: “Scottish Labour bosses block vote on single market”

      What they do within their own party is just a forewarning, if any were needed, that if BritLab ever get power in London again, Scottish interests will (as always) be suppressed for the sake of the Greater (English) Good.

    264. yesindyref2 says:

      @Rev
      I suggest an open article for a change, “What made you support Independence?”

      Here’s mine:

      Someone pointing out in 1972 that the BBC was biased against Scotland and realising it was true. Imagine my anger that I had just subconciously accepted it.

    265. Cubby says:

      Stopped buying any newspapers years ago. Couldn’t find any that I was happy buying. No papers in my house. Don’t miss them. Never bought the record and never will . Don’t trust them at all. They may appear to be supporting independence – but the key word is appear.

      I remember the Scottish( sick of all these English companies sticking Scottish on the front of their name) Sun saying they would support the SNP. Never bought the Sun either and never will. If they all went bust wouldn’t loose any sleep.

      Need to convince my wife that we should stop paying the BBC license fee. This fee is like some sort of tax from the dark ages – it is in effect just another POLL TAX.

    266. Famous15 says:

      Laurel and Hardy will be turning over in their graves finding they are the headliners at the Labour Party conference. Poor Kier Hardie will be feeling ignored.

    267. Proud Cybernat says:

      Luxembourg PM Bettel says: “They were in with a load of opt-outs. Now they are out, and want a load of opt-ins.”

      The Alpha and Omega of Brexit.

    268. Robert Peffers says:

      @galamcennalath says: 9 March, 2018 at 12:18 pm:

      “Lidington, “What will not help either customers or producers is to have different sets of food labelling or food hygiene or safety regulations in different parts of the UK. All that does is add to costs, loss of jobs amongst producers and it leads to less choice, probably a higher price for consumers.””

      Yeah! But as far as Westminster goes it is all right to have different, “Electricity Power Grid connection charges that increase depending upon the further the producers of power are AWAY from the biggest consumers of the commodity in London. This flies in the face of all the rules of the Tory, (red and blue), beliefs in the free market economy. The main rule of which is that the holder of a scarce commodity can demand the highest price they can get for a scarce commodity.

      Which rule, if applied, would make the consumers where power is scarce pay more but Westminster not only has the differential connection charge scheme but also actually subsidises those power producers closer to London and the south of England.

      So what was that you were saying Mr. Lidington, about, “adding to costs, loss of jobs amongst producers, less choice and probably a higher price for consumers?”

    269. Famous15 says:

      Keir Hardie has been edged out by Laurl and Hardy at the Labour Party conference.

      BTW my price rise comment was satire.I know,I know the Tories are beyond satire.

    270. Proud Cybernat says:

      I know it’s on the oS Home Page but –

      Just a wee reminder to peeps that the WoS 2018 Crowd-Fundraiser is still on-going. Please give whatever you can. ONE MILLION Wee Blue Books is how we will win IndyRef2 and they dinnae come cheap…

      https://wingsoverscotland.charitycheckout.co.uk/cf/The-Final-Countdown

    271. Breeks says:

      Before letting ourselves be dragged out of Europe, and incidentally, being sidetracked with a mini battle over selected powers coming home, just take a moment. Step back, and ask yourself why the UK delegated these powers to Europe in the first place.

      Granted I accept, the repatriation of powers could, and maybe will be the blue touch paper and escalate into a full blown battle of constitutional sovereignty, but surely there is another way to invoke the same or similar constitutional showdown, but with the arguments centered upon keeping Scotland in the EU, as mandated by Scotland’s Remain vote. -Not just making do with frustrating a Westminster power grab.

      Maintain Scotland’s EU membership, and the issue of repatriated powers evaporates altogether.

    272. yesindyref2 says:

      @Breeks: “Before letting ourselves be dragged out of Europe, and incidentally, being sidetracked with a mini battle over selected powers coming home, just take a moment.

      Either the UK Gov concede on those 24 powers, when Sturgeon meets May this week, or the Continuity Bill gets passed and sent for Royal Consent on 22nd March. In 2 weeks it might all be over for the UK. Compared to that it’s the EU is the distraction.

    273. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      jfngw @ 12:09,

      Haven’t watched that self-referential little bubble for some time now, but they are not alone in that absurd belief. Heard somebody the other day on the R4 lunchtime news plying the same idiotic line, that “the EU will cave in to our demands” or somesuch. Just because.

      The exceptionalism in them is strong, very strong.

      Which will make their inevitable eventual humbling all the sweeter.

      The EU are now simply trying to disentangle the UK as cleanly and effectively as possible with minimal mutual damage, not that they are getting any help whatever from UKGov. But we can be very sure the EU is not going to just bend over and take it from England. They have their vital interests to protect, and they have the real power to do so. Someone’s bluffing, but it ain’t the EU.

      (While we here in Scotland still have people serving the UK’s interests by having nothing better to do than endlessly quibble about the EU. =sigh=)

    274. One_Scot says:

      ‘Nick Eardley is one of the better from the Beeb’.Lol, you’re having a laugh, right?

    275. Sinky says:

      One-SCOT SAYS:
      If it is this Nick Eardley then he’s def one of the better BBC Scotland’s correspondents.

      Edinburgh City Council elections May 2007

      CRAIGENTINNY/ DUDDINGSTON (3 seats available) Elected: Ewan Aitken (Lab)3487 Stefan Tymkewcz (SNP)3484 Gary Peacock (Lib Dem)1190* Not elected: Victoria Roberts (Con)1720 Stan Blackley (Greens)701 Shami Khan (Lab)600 Kevin Connor (Solidarity)187 Peter Mcdougall (Liberal Party)152 Jet Cameron (Independent)100 Nick Eardley (SSP)82 John Wallace (Independent)69

    276. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Breeks @ 14:46:

      Granted I accept, the repatriation of powers could, and maybe will be the blue touch paper and escalate into a full blown battle of constitutional sovereignty

      Well, there you have it. It’s not something theoretical, and granted in return it’s not the issue of principle that you or I tend to get exercised about, but which sadly not too many other ordinary folk seem to care about at the moment, preferring to keep their heads buried in the sand of the BBC’s bland assurances. But it could nevertheless be the key that unlocks everything. Here’s why:

      + Legal action puts the UKGov under pressure at a time when they could well do without it. Look at all the credibility and organisational damage that Gina Miller inflicted in her action. And they are already cracking up. What would be the effect on them if we could even endanger the whole Brexit process?

      + This could be the catalyst for opening up the whole constitutional debate at home, and make the inevitability of a political solution via IR2 a necessity recognised by virtually everyone (excepting an extreme minority of Unionist zoomers, of course).

      + If it forces UKGov to override us completely, it demonstrates very clearly to all those self-denying PSB’s the total fiction that we’re all equals in this wonderful Greater England.

      It’s still a debate about our constitutional standing within the UK, so I can understand your concern, but it’s the one whose outcome, one way or another, has the power to demonstrate that there is no comfortable place for us within the UK. Which is what we have already long realised, but others now will.

      After that, all bets are off.

    277. galamcennalath says:

      Brexit, Continuity Bill, powers, devolution.

      I’ve always felt that Scottish Indy will happen quickly having been moved up several gears by unforeseen events. Maybe not quite unforeseen but unexpected in terms of impact.

      History shows that’s how things go. Something simmers away and then suddenly an event comes along and brings it all to the fore.

      I feel we are approaching such a moment in Scotland’s long history. Too many springs are wound up too tight and something’s gonna to go ping. In real world terms that means folks who haven’t been paying much attention suddenly do, and they feel both motivated and aggrieved enough to take a big leap.

      Hard to predict what will light the touch paper.

      Holyrood, a Scottish government, our Indy-lite has been popular. In polling terms, approval ratings are high. Scots have shown clear and continual demand for powers to increase, not be removed, Perhaps a clear and present danger to devolution and Holyrood might be the match.

    278. One_Scot says:

      He was the presenter in Reporting Scotlands belated, farcical and disjointed report on the bill that passed at Westminster to effectively strip Holyrood of her powers.

      A report that was days late and only produced due to the fact that BBC Scotland was taking so much flack online about not reporting the events. And even then he made no mention of the fact that it only passed because of the thirteen Scottish Tory’s votes.

      Yeah, he’s one of the good uns, lol.

    279. Robert Peffers says:

      @One_Scot says: 9 March, 2018 at 2:58 pm:

      “‘Nick Eardley is one of the better from the Beeb’.Lol, you’re having a laugh, right?”

      I’m with you on that, One Scot.

      There isn’t any better ones at the BBC.

      They start off as all bad and we then only have worse ones.

      It’s a bit like that old question, “Is your glass half emty or is your glass half full”.

    280. manandboy says:

      If you understand this by Ian Dunt, then you’ll realise what the UK Govt strategy on Brexit is, and on much else besides.

      The lack of ideas about how to respond to Russia is demonstrative of how unlike the Cold War this is, despite appearances to the contrary. The new conflict is not really conducted by big power blocks carrying out assassinations.

      It is conducted by information warfare, which intends not to convince an audience of something, but to make it impossible for the public, in any country, to really know what is true and what isn’t – or even if truth exists.

    281. yesindyref2 says:

      @galamcennalath
      In 1979 and 1997 only the Tories opposed devolution. In Holyrood now they’re the only party not supporting devolution, and in fact their vote against the Continutity Bill is FOR a diminishing of powers amounting to an attack on Devolution which could go further and end up in the abolishing of Holyrood.

      It could be in Indy Ref 2, that it would be a choice between Independence and NO devolution, with again, only the Tories oppposed. The old team which got 74.3% YES in 1997 could be back together again …

    282. Sinky says:

      Working from home this afternoon gutted to be inside on such a great day. Watched full 30 minutes of BBC TV “National” News Channel. Not a word on the details of Westminster’s Power Grab.

      The “provinces” don’t register in London centric BBC news coverage – far less the three other nations.

      Talking of cupid stunts.. Did you see the Labour conference background for the Keir HARDY Awards?

      They have already airbrushed early Scottish self government supporters Jimmy Maxton and Don Roberto Grahame Cunningham from the Scottish branch office lexicon.

    283. galamcennalath says:

      @me at 3:20

      There are still a lot of DevoMax and Federal fantasists out there. If the Tories continue, as we fear they might, then any reversal of devolution will be a huge kick in the teeth for those who seek more short of Indy.

      It might force them off the fence. McLeish is one who comes to mind.

      We know the clear choice is DevoNotEnough versus Indy. A binary choice. Things will change if/when everyone in Scotland sees that.

    284. Sinky says:

      Corbyn really has trouble with the truth. Labour made Trump Scottish trade ambassador. The SNP stripped him of the role. Let’s not forget that it was Labour’s Jack McConnell who first feted Donald Trump by flying to New York.

      McConnell and Trump enjoyed a lunch of shrimps and steak. Along with a photo opportunity, at which Trump made favourable noises about investing in Scotland, it completed a satisfactory few hours for the First Minister.

      The billionaire’s golf company was lavished with attention. Two memos released by SE show that – at a cost of £4,800 to the public purse – the agency paid for two helicopter tours of Scotland, taking in the golf course site, as they showed off the country to their deep-pocketed American friends.

      A further e-mail shows they offered to meet the £40,000-£50,000 cost of a feasibility study into the Menie Links site. Trump’s people were impressed, “raving” in August last year about the way enterprise agency officials were courting them

      From 23 April 2006 https://archive.is/ihayG

    285. Ken500 says:

      @ Keir Hardy – Hardly

      You just could not make this stuff and nonsense up.

      Revision Labour UK. Can’t spell, count or read a balance sheet.

      They are not taking back powers from the EU. They already had the powers of which certain were devolved to Scotland under the Devolution agreement. They are trying to deregulating powers from EU agreement and good governance. They are using the situation of powers being deregulated from EU good, agreement and good governance to make a power grab in the areas under the Devolution Agreement and resolution.

      Breaking the Sewell agreement. Acting illegally under International Law. Basically either the powers come back or the UK Gov is finished. The Tories behaviour is not only dishonourable and dishonest. It is illegal. Basically they do not have a clue what they are doing. What they are trying to do is impossible. Contradictory.

      @ ‘They were in with opt outs. They want to be out with opt ins.

      Cherry picking. Have their cake and eat it. They actually do not know what they want. Except to keep on tax evading, embezzling and misappropriating public money. Just as long as they can get away with it.

    286. Ken500 says:

      Corbyn lies will not do them any good. Just cause embarrassment. No one will even notice he is here. Just an irrelevance.

    287. Ken500 says:

      Mad cow came from Alabama. That cost £Billions and lost trade worldwide for ten years. Foodstuffs prohibited for export. Including Haggis, even though it affected Scotland less,

    288. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      “If it is this Nick Eardley then he’s def one of the better BBC Scotland’s correspondents.”

      Edinburgh City Council elections May 2007

      Nick Eardley (SSP)82

      Really @Sinky says at 3:11 pm???

      Good Guy, Maybe?

      or

      Another Marxist making a 180 Degree about turn like Slovenia’s Best Kisser (according tae Heed), Prof Tompkins MSP who “In 2004 made a speech on the same stage as SSP leader Colin Fox at an event to rival the Queen’s official opening of the new Holyrood building.”??

      http://archive.is/Tc3EP

      or

      MI5 Infiltrator as per 70s Trades Unions, Miners Strikes etc. etc. returning home to the establishment???

      http://archive.is/vuNZ8#selection-2595.79-2595.226

      http://archive.is/fx9Ln

      Good Guy or Wank, who knows?

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_UGD7AazMI

    289. K.A.Mylchreest says:

      Just in case you missed this on another thread …

      Here is, I think, the full breakdown of the powers WM wish to retain post-Brexit. On the whole they seem mostly related to food, agriculture and the environment :

      ————

      1. Agricultural support – Policies and regulations relating to income, market support, agriculture, productivity and maintenance grants.

      2. Agriculture, fertiliser regulations – Common standards for compositional ingredients, labelling, packaging, sampling and analysis of fertilisers.

      3. Agriculture, GMO marketing and cultivation – Standards for marketing and cultivation of genetically modified organisms.

      4. Agriculture, organic farming – Regulations setting out standards for organic production certification.

      5. Agriculture, zootech – Rules on breeding and trade in pedigree animals and germinal products in the EU and the treatment of imports from third countries.

      6. Animal health and traceability – EU rules and standards that aim to maintain animal health and allow their movement, including policies covering prevention of disease, control of disease surveillance movement of livestock, pet passports and veterinary medicines.

      7. Animal welfare – On-farm issues, movement of livestock and slaughter.

      8. Chemicals regulation (including pesticides) – Classification, labelling and packaging of substances and mixtures; the placing on the market and use of biocidal products; the export and import of hazardous chemicals; the registration, evaluation, authorisation and restriction of chemicals and plant protection products.

      9. Elements of reciprocal healthcare

      10. Environmental quality, chemicals – Regulation of the manufacture, authorisation and sale and use of chemical products.

      11. Environmental quality, ozone depleting, substances and F-gases – The UK has international obligations under the Montreal Protocol to phase out the use of ODS, phase down hydrofluorocarbons by 85% by 2036, licence imports and exports and report on usage to the UN.

      12. Environmental quality, pesticides – Regulations governing the authorisation and use of pesticide products and the maximum residue levels in food, and a framework for action on sustainable use of pesticides.

      13. Environmental quality, waste packaging and product regulations – Product standards including for packaging (e.g. ROHS in Electrical and Electronic Equipment, Batteries and Vehicles) in order to manage waste.

      14. Fisheries management and support – Rules relating to the sustainability of fisheries (quotas), access to waters, conservation measures, enforcement and financial support.

      15. Food and feed safety and hygiene law – Food and feed safety and hygiene; food and feed law enforcement (official controls); food safety labelling; risk analysis; and incident handling.

      16. Food compositional standards – Minimum standards for a range of specific food commodities such as sugars, coffee, honey, caseins, condensed milk, chocolate, jams, fruit juices and bottled water.

      17. Food labelling – Requirements on provision of information to consumers on food labels.

      18. Hazardous substances planning – Land-use planning, including: planning controls relating to the storage of hazardous substances and handling development proposals for hazardous establishments.

      19. Implementation of EU Emissions Trading System – This directive area establishes the European Union Emissions Trading Scheme for greenhouse gas. The Scheme sets a maximum amount of greenhouse gas that can be emitted by all participating installations and aircrafts; these operators then monitor, verify and report their emissions, and must surrender allowances equivalent to their emissions annually.

      20. Mutual recognition of professional qualifications – Directives that create systems for the recognition for professional qualifications and professional experience throughout the EU. Allowing EU professionals to work in regulated professions in other EU states on either a permanent or temporary basis.

      21. Nutrition health claims, composition and labelling – Nutrition and health claims made on food; food for special medical purposes and weight control; food intended for infants; the addition of vitamins and other substances to food; and food supplements.

      22. Plant health, seeds and propagating material – Import and internal EU movement of plants and plant products, risk assessment of new plant pests and outbreak management. Assurance and auditing of policies across the UK to protect plant biosecurity. Requirements for plant variety rights, registration of plant varieties and quality assurance of marketed seed and propagating material.

      23. Public procurement – The regime provided by the EU procurement Directives, covering public procurement contracts for supplies, services, works and concessions above certain financial thresholds awarded by the public sector and by utilities operating in the energy, water, transport and postal services sectors.

      24. Services Directive – Directive that seeks to realise the full potential of services markets in Europe by removing legal and administrative barriers to trade by increasing transparency and making it easier for businesses and consumers to provide or use services in the EU Single Market.
      ——

    290. Ken500 says:

      Tompkins married an America woman. Came under the influence. A migrant family. Hope the Tories don’t try to chuck her out.

      Another trougher on Scottish taxpayers money. Trying to ruin the Scottish economy. Public money that could be better spent. A 3rd rate reject. They have to drag them in off the street. That’s why they are so dire.

      An embarrassment.

      Never even trust a Tory politican.

    291. Ken500 says:

      The Tories ruined the Oil sector with too high taxes. Now they obviously want to try and ruin the farming, food and drink sector. Scotland’s successful major exports markets.

    292. Proud Cybernat says:

      LIVE from Pravda Quay
      with Union Jackie Kim Ono:

      https://i.imgur.com/kEzyj1W.jpg

    293. yesindyref2 says:

      @galamcennalath
      Not just the devo-maxers of course, also the status quoers. Where is the status quo of a devolved parliament now?

      Potentially over 90% could vote YES, plus those abolitionists who might just want to see a layer of government abolished with its politicians, and if not Holyrood, then Westminster?

    294. Bob Mack says:

      Looks like we would be eating dodgy American chicken and beef whilst sitting in front of our shale gas fracked fuel fire.

      They also want to control the emissions of the only part of the UK that has met and exceeded it’s targets.

      They can go #$×& themselves.

    295. Sinky says:

      STOP the Tory Power Grab

      It’s confirmed, Theresa May’s government will try to grab powers away from Holyrood.

      Earlier today, Tory ministers set out how they will take control of devolved issues like agriculture, fisheries and the environment after Brexit.

      Let’s work together to put a stop to this Tory plan. I need your help to protect Scotland’s powers.

      Here’s three quick things you can do right now:

      1.If you haven’t done so already, sign our petition.

      2.Share the petition with friends and family on Facebook,
      messaging apps or on Twitter.

      3.Share the facts on social media or in conversation with friends. Get a summary here.

      https://www.snp.org/powergrab?mc_cid=934fe98a4e&mc_eid=06fc309f0a

    296. Ken500 says:

      The Tories sure can drag them off the street to stand as as candidate for the unionist Alliance Party. That does not in fact exist. Can’t be registered on the electoral register. More electoral fraud. Not on the voting card or giving details of financial support. Breaking electoral fraud. Again. More electoral corruption at Aberdeen City Council.

      Councillor Imrie, the ‘baby box’ denier took out £100,000 insurance in case she lost her looks.looks like a right poseur. Yet grudges women a baby box. Taking out of the mouths of babe’s. An absolute disgrace. Another Tory embarrassment.

    297. Bobp says:

      Scotland eh! Wha’s like us? Naebody. Because no other country in the world “name me one has half their population as parasitic hosts.

    298. frogesque says:

      I wonder if babybox woman has taken out insurance for being a wrinkled prune in her old age?

      What a poser! Sort of woman who would insure against not getting whistles from brickies and would sue for harassment if she did.

    299. Slightly O/T,

      The Russian that has allegedly been poisoned `Sergei Skripal` is being called a Russian Spy, but if he worked for MI6 would that not make him a British Spy,

      anyone know the protocol,was Kim Philby a British or Russian Spy ?

    300. yesindyref2 says:

      @ Bobp: “Scotland eh! Wha’s like us? Naebody. Because no other country in the world “name me one has half their population as parasitic hosts.

      You do realise that many of us will have some partners, parents, sons and daughters, other relations and friends – that voted NO?

      Insult a NO voter and you insult all of us. And it’s hardly likely to convert them to YES – is that what you want?

    301. Capella says:

      @ Sinky – petition signed. But I think it will take much more than a petition, which Westminster will ignore. Willing to turn up ata demo with placard if necessary.

      @ Scot Finlayson – good point. Skripal was spying for the UK. So he must be a Ukadian spy.

      Craig Murray points out that, though the media are speculating wildly about where someone could have obtained nerve agents, none point out that Porton Down is only 8 miles from Skripal’s houe in Salisbury.

    302. Wullie says:

      I have signed the [stop the power grab petition ] although I cannot see it doing any good whatsoever. I can only hope that the SNP are doing something behind the scenes that will have a damn site more powerful outcome. I cannot take the way we are treated anymore, something has to give.

    303. yesindyref2 says:

      @Colin Dunn on Rev’s Twitter (I don’t do twitter):

      13 MEPs not 12 I think.

      Population at Jan 17 / number of MEPs

      Slovenia 2,065,900 8

      Lithuania 2,847,900 11
      Croatia 4,154,200 11
      Ireland 4,774,800 11

      Scotland 5,404,700 13

      Slovakia 5,435,300 13
      Finland 5,503,300 13
      Denmark 5,707,300 13

      Bulgaria 7,101,900 17

      Scotland very close to Slovakia for population, unless there’s a more definitive formula I missed.

      https://yesindyref2.wordpress.com/2016/10/06/eu-information-how-it-works/

    304. Tinto Chiel says:

      “I’ve always felt that Scottish Indy will happen quickly having been moved up several gears by unforeseen events. Maybe not quite unforeseen but unexpected in terms of impact.

      History shows that’s how things go. Something simmers away and then suddenly an event comes along and brings it all to the fore.”

      Messrs. Marx and Lenin would have agreed, galamcennalath, and I am inclined to concur. The galactic-scale catastrofeck which is being unleashed on us by Brexit will awaken the non-political Scots who just try to get on with their lives and normally “leave politics to politicians”.

      They will soon realise that the island of Ireland, where many of them have family/forebears, risks returning to the horrors of the 70s because of the recklessness of WM.

      They will soon realise that their parliament, which is generally popular, will have many of its powers simply removed from its control by a Westminster intent on neutering it since it’s the wrong kind of democracy.

      They will slowly realise the risk to jobs and prices of the crash-out and sulk the Tories have in store for us.

      The more venal will begin to wonder, “But whit aboot my foreign holiday/new Beamer/Spanish timeshare/medical provision abroad/ und so weiter?”

      All the apparently “boring” historical/academic/legal points on sovereignty and The Union, which posters like Robert Peffers have been banging on about for years on here (for the benefit of Wings’ passing trade/lurkers) are finally about to bite Maybot and her Eton orcs on their collective arse.

      The trip-wire’s force lies in its unforeseen/unexpected effect, after all.

      Scottish passport within 18 months will do me.

    305. manandboy says:

      If the Russians had a mole in Porton Down, and a guy they wanted eliminated using nerve gas lived just eight miles up the road, well, who would travel the 1868 miles from Moscow to Salisbury carrying a deadly poison in those circumstances.

    306. Sinky says:

      Final point on Labour’s gaff ridden conference apart from Corbyn’s UKIP dog whistle on immigrants cutting wages for Brits. Leslie Laird called on UK Government to publish list of the 24 power grab issues….. Which they did three hours before she spoke.

    307. Dr Jim says:

      You only want power over a thing because you want to exercise that power
      Now given that all four constituent parts of the UK conform to EU laws standards and conditions that can only mean the UKGuv wishes to change these laws standards and conditions and that makes David Lidington a bare faced liar and when you take a close look at his face while he’s mouthing this jobs and different prices and labels crap he knows we know he’s a liar

      Why do they want control of *chemicals* why GM crops when we don’t have them in Scotland, as far as fishermen are concerned if they get shafted I couln’t give a flying bleep
      they deserve everything they get because of their own greed
      but it’ll be the rest of us who suffer

    308. louis.b.argyll says:

      Good evening, fair-minded independence seekers.

      Another day- another nail in the UK coffin.

    309. Legerwood says:

      Sinky says:
      9 March, 2018 at 6:48 pm
      “”Final point on Labour’s gaff ridden conference apart from Corbyn’s UKIP dog whistle on immigrants cutting wages for Brits. Leslie Laird called on UK Government to publish list of the 24 power grab issues….. Which they did three hours before she spoke.””

      …………

      Even toodle-oo the noo picked up on that in his report for Reporting Scotland. That was about the only bit of the report I saw but it looked as if the Keir Hardy (sic) banner down. Could be wrong. Only got a glimpse.

      O/T The Russian, who was a spy for the UK, was jailed by the Russians. Therefore they had plenty of opportunity to kill him in jail so why do it in such a public place?

    310. Capella says:

      My gravatar has disappeared. No idea why. Maybe it will reappear soon.

    311. Capella says:

      Voila!

    312. starlaw says:

      Dr Jim 7pm

      watched the behaviour of David Lidington and it was that of a bare faced liar.
      What will London do to Scottish Salmon Labelling that Edinburgh wont apart from stick a uj on it . If London want to stick labels on Salmon … let London grow its own. They claim its labelling but its our food industry they are stealing, Beef, Whisky Biscuits the lot.

    313. starlaw says:

      Man and boy 6.27

      the handling of this incident is abysmal. It is now nearly a week since and decontamination has just begun . Also Police officer was hospitalised but 21 others were unaffected, and only hauled in when they went to the news. Something Iffy going on.

    314. Dan Huil says:

      @Capella 7:14pm

      For a second there I thought you were a member of the Capella String Quartet.

      Then I realized you had written “Voila!” not “Viola!”

    315. Bob Mack says:

      Re the Russian spy. It is fairly obvious he knew the killer. If he had been sprayed by something why did he not seek immediate help. He was a Colonel in the KGB,thus no novice to ways of eliminating people. It kind if indicates that he was at least unsuspecting of whoever did this, Someone he knew and trusted. Also sounds as if the policeman probably gave CPR and ingested agent.

      Suicide is also a possibility ?

    316. manandboy says:

      During the post Brexit era, the English Establishment do not want their living standards to drop and because Scotland has some of the finest food money can buy, and plenty of it, they want guaranteed access to it.
      Among other reasons, what better way than to rob Scotland of its devolved powers over agriculture and fishing.
      This could become the 2018 version of The Clearances.

    317. Robert Peffers says:

      @Bob Mack says: 9 March, 2018 at 7:36 pm:

      “Re the Russian spy. It is fairly obvious he knew the killer. If he had been sprayed by something why did he not seek immediate help.”

      Ah! Bob Mack, I’m not going to say more than this. As part of my job in Rosyth Dockyards RADIAC we had to learn not just about Nuclear Physics and Quantum Physics to work with atomic radiation, x-rays and other radiations but they foisted calibrating, testing and repairing instruments that detected biological warfare and chemical warfare agents.

      I’ll say no more than that when you get contaminated with a nerve agent you have no time to seek any kind of help.

      Matter of fact the troops uniforms are fitted with a wee pocket by their legs that will contain a syringe that can be used from right were it is. It is supposed to contain an antidote but perhaps contains something to put the victim out of their misery.

      http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/nerve-agents-how-do-they-work-science-symptoms-causes-explained-salisbury-a8245726.html

      I watched classified films, (made in WWII), of people affected by these nerve gasses and I honestly have never been so horrified in my life.

    318. Ken500 says:

      According to reports the Policeman visited the house the next day, The substance contact was made in the house.

      Whotoo believe? There is so much out of sync with the ‘official story’. More whitewash? Mi5 or 6 are more likely to be involved. Dirty tricks. Boris Johnston the criminal is leading the charge. Into oblivion, Behind the propaganda.

    319. geeo says:

      STV report “WM Power grab confirmed”

      So..when will the story emerge, about how Scots clearly are being taken for mugs as a result and should consider voting for Independence to stop being shafted by a WM system, which thinks it can shit on Scots and expect us to pay them for the honour ?

      On the Continuity Bill, THE biggest stick to beat WM yet. Brilliant bit of work imo.

      If WM continue with the power grab, we shouldn’t even need an indyref !!

      I mean, if the principle terms of the Act And Treaties of Union are in clear breach…the Union it toast, legally.

    320. Ken500 says:

      @ Craig Murray has some interesting info.

    321. Capella says:

      @ Dan Huil – sadly no violas – tant pis! 🙂

    322. Ken500 says:

      Re fishing.

      How would foreign vessels be stopped fishing the seas? Without agreement. Vast area. Often bad weather etc. At present Scotland does not even have boats/vessels to patrol the shores. Despite funding £3.5Billion for Defence, (Including!£1Billion Trident). Reportedly getting £1.5Billion back (£1Billion included funding Trident). Another Westminster money/power grab. Hammond (DS) giving ‘evidence’ to a Westminster committee (re Scottish Independence). Smirked and laughed at the suggestion of Scotland having a navy presence and boats to patrol the shore.

      Drugs and anything could be landed in Scotland without knowledge. Fishermen were landing black fish all over the place, until they got caught. Under UK Law, Not by stopping fishing.. By other on shore detection, Wee Frees. In fact the EU offers fishing protection. Conservation. Preserving the stocks.

    323. Jim Williamson says:

      “I will be donating mine to (foodbank) CFI

      Reminds me of that oft quoted saying – do you like babies Answer Yes but I wouldn’t eat one!

    324. yesindyref2 says:

      @Ken500 “At present Scotland does not even have boats/vessels to patrol the shores.

      The 12nm territorial waters are largely devolved to Scotland, and the Scottish Government has 3 FPVs (Fishery Protection Vessels) called MPV Minna, MPV Jura and MPV Hirta. You also get at times one of the older UK OPVs patrolling around – I’ve seen that on marinetraffic.

    325. Bob Mack says:

      @Robert Peffers,

      Yes Robert, I believe the troops can carry Atropine which interrupts part of the mechanism of nerve gases,but not all.

      The point is, if it had been one of the lethal nerve agents as you describe such as VX or its derivatives, it would kill almost immediately or at lest within minutes. Why then search his home or the graveyard.
      The agent used must have been of the Sarin family which takes much longer to act, allowing him time to walk about.

    326. galamcennalath says:

      Tinto Chiel says:

      The more venal will begin to wonder, “But whit aboot my foreign holiday/new Beamer …

      In 2014 it was certain that many NOs weren’t motivated by love of the Union or a precious British identity, it was their wealth, position, status, and prospects which drove them. Voting NO and continuing with little change seemed their safest option.

      And how did that turn out? Fine so far, but their choice made then is now hanging by an ever more shuggly peg! What Brexit could mean is becoming more obvious by the day.

      Some people say NO voters will have to feel the pain first. I’m not so sure. Folks with wealth and status are a pretty far sighted bunch when it comes to preserving what they have!

      An iScotland closely associated with, or a member of, the EU should already be looking a safer bet than sitting in the back of the Blighty-bus as it disappeared over the Brexit precepice!

    327. yesindyref2 says:

      Page for that about the FPV is

      http://www.gov.scot/Topics/marine/Compliance/resources/Vessels

      interestng to note Minna is inshore, see her often in the Clyde, but the other two are offshore.

    328. Dr Jim says:

      The Russian not Russian British double Russian agent spy
      That was a short description of most of the people who do this stuff for a living and who knows who did him in but in a practical sense why would the Russians bother killing a man they could have killed anytime they wanted, which leaves me with one thought and it’s the same one I’ve had from the start, the Brits is wot dunnit so they can blame the Russians and it gives them a neat and tidy way of keepin their failure of a government out of the glare for a minute

      Former adviser to Vladimir Putin said the same thing on live Sky TV when he called the British media state controlled and propagandists and did this because Britain, in his words *are in big trouble in the world right now*

      As for lethal gas I can make the stuff with four household ingredients bought from Asda and I’m not telling you what they are or some daft kid’ll do it and spray his family, but it’s not difficult and loads of ex soldiers and military folk will tell you the same

      Brit big flannel and bluster to confuse the population that there are bad guys out there (Russians) who want us all dead, and it’s just made up garbage

      Every Brit Prime Minister worth their salt cooks up or starts a war with somebody, it helps to cement their credibilty and the Inglis’ll rush out in their droves and vote for this shit

    329. galamcennalath says:

      Not sure if this has been posted. SNP position on power grab.

      https://www.snp.org/pb_what_is_the_scottish_eu_continuity_bill

    330. JLT says:

      Dearie dear …please pass the Tories another spade. Seems they want to keep digging while they in that ever deepening hole.

      Never trust a Tory.

    331. Rock says:

      call me dave,

      “Three pages for Henry McLiesh in The National today urging the Scottish branch office accounting unit to embrace the ‘single market’”

      The fake “independence supporting” The National gives three pages to a unionist chameleon?

      When it could have re-published this WOS article as front page headline news.

    332. Robert Peffers says:

      @Bob Mack says: 9 March, 2018 at 8:55 pm:

      “The agent used must have been of the Sarin family which takes much longer to act, allowing him time to walk about

      That wasn’t really my point Bob Mack. What I meant was that when affected the person usually convulses and that is what prevents them doing anything about it. In fact those old wartime films quite coldly stated that the affected person would probably not survive but the injection in the leg would allow them to fight on for a short time.

      They were really saying the affected guy would die but the so called antidote would allowed them to fight on for a brief spell.

      Some other films showed volunteers, (cough!), who were uniformed troops in convulsions. I know from the similar films of volunteers taken at some of the Atomic Bomb trials subsequently had high death and cancer rates.

      They took troops and placed them at different distances and with none to fairly inadequate shelter then exploded the test weapons. Then studied the results. You will understand they had little knowledge in those days of Health Physics Measures. Which were, of course, the object behind having the troops there in the first place.

      Don’t know if you have ever seen the island of Bikini before and after such a test. Operation Crossroads 1946:-

      https://www.radiochemistry.org/history/nuke_tests/crossroads/index.html

    333. Ken500 says:

      The National did publish this subject.

    334. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      O/T Don’t know why some of us are getting all diverted over the nerve agent thing, but in my book anyone who deploys (or orders the deployment of) this vile stuff against anyone for any “reason” is a morally bankrupt scumbag who deserves to burn in the innermost circle of hell for eternity.

      Furthermore any attempt at any kind of equivalencing, deflecting or “explainerising” is simply demeaning. There is no justification for it, period, and especially not from those who rightly criticise our own deadly dalliance with the likes of Trident. It only destroys any credibility we have to protest at that continuing nightmarish presence among us.

      If this business has even any vague relevance to independence, this latest Russian outrage – and let’s not mince words, for that is what it recognisably is, possibly even perpetrated with the deliberate intention of provoking a western backlash to help promote a certain little czar’s upcoming re-election campaign – serves only to show up how threadbare, stuffing-lost and toothless the pathetic UK Lion has become.

      And indeed how very willing the Tory UKGov has been to downplay several previous “incidents” for fear of the loss of Russian oligarch funds from the City of London money men, for whom the hiding-away of ill-gotten gains is a speciality. (Another lot who deserve their own special circle of hell.)

      And that’s all I intend to say about that particular diversionary subject.

    335. Liz g says:

      Dr Jim @ 9.07
      Bet those four Asda item’s would have Union Flag’s on them.
      So naw ye couldn’t make the stuff,as ye wouldn’t buy them,in the first place Dr Jim…LOL…

    336. ScottieDog says:

      Anyone know what’s happening with Labour For Indy.
      They might have a target rich environment at the mo.

    337. yesindyref2 says:

      When it could have re-published this WOS article as front page headline news.

      The National published an article yesterday – don’t you read postings on this forum? You’ve already been told that.

      http://www.thenational.scot/news/16074248.tory-councillor-applies-for-baby-box-just-to-give-it-away-in-cheap-stunt/?ref=mrb&lp=15

      As for McLeish saying Labour should support the single market – good – we need Labour and the LibDems onside for the Continuity Bill, as that isolates the Tories as being anti-devolutionists who want to see Holyrood fatally weakened.

      More KP (nuts) from you.

    338. Iain mhor says:

      Adam Tomkins getting a bit animated recently over Scotland’s Continuity Bill and I’ve never seen him so uncharacteristically rattled.
      In January (Sunday Politics Scotland) he acknowledged that Clause 11 was a problem and should be in alignment with devolution as per Scotland Act/Sewell and that agreement was vital. That this would happen and both sides would reach an agreement – it was inconceivable to him that an agreement would not be reached – Despite the Tories now having railroaded it to the House of Lords.
      He also was of the opinion that not to reach an agreement would be brown trousers (which is why it was inconceivable to him it wouldn’t occur) However, in all the talk of agreements and suchlike; at no point has it been spelled out why Clause 11 is so vital to Article 50.

      We of course know why – it’s because the UK government need these powers to negotiate with the EU. Without them they are in a much weaker position. It also needs them to bargain trade deals after Brexit. It has heehaw to do with cross governmental homogenisation of intra-uk regulations or such shite. If it was, it would be very easy. “Ok we agree not to amend any of these powers ’til you’re finished with Brexit” or “We agree to keep these regulations in line with greater UK government regulations until you’ve finished” These regulations are kitty-litter internal to the UK and should have no bearing on Article 50, unless of course these powers were key to Westminster’s negotiating tactics. As well as the means to weaken Holyrood.

      Tomkins is seriously agitated now because he knows the UK absolutely must have them as bargaining chips. It can be done without them, but Brexit will turn into a bigger shitshow for the governnent. Also, as #1 constitutional expert on all things Scotland and UK, he is seriously bricking himself at what he knows is coming down the pipe if Westminster goes ahead without amending Clause 11 regardless.

      He is admittedly a very erudite fellow and stated he is no great fan of the UK constitution as it stands, far less a fan of Royal Prerogative! However, his expertise has allowed him to dance on the head of the great UK constitutional pin and steer the legal arguments and interpretations to Westminster’s whims. He has been most able to assist in blurring, obfuscating and avoiding the most pertinent discussions of its weaknesses to suit the UK Government and Tory party.
      He fine well knows the implications of forcing through Clause 11 without Scotland’s consent and can feel the foundations shifting beneath his feet. He is frustrated and scared. He may once had the courage of his prior academic convictions, but is now realising what being a fully.paid up Tory entails.

      Now if a fellow with such an intimate knowledge and relationship with UK constitutional law (and erstwhile Tory) is so rattled, then we should take note.
      I’d almost go as far as to suggest he’s almost at the stage of pleading through his anger to allow these devolved powers to be taken by Westminster; because he’s now caught between the Tory Government having no Article 50 bargaining chips and the constitutional crisis he sees coming. He can’t threaten the Government will drive it through anyway, because that would actually make him the architect of the very crisis he’s hoping to avert.
      It’ll be tears before bedtime I’m thinking.
      C’est la guerre Monsieur Tomkins, c’est la guerre.

    339. louis.b.argyll says:

      Question 1.
      WHICH of the following has an
      international reputation as
      the WORLDS BEST salmon?

      -Norwegian salmon?

      -Scottish salmon?

      -British salmon?

      A. Scottish.

      (just ahead of our North Sea neighbours)
      .
      .
      The SCOTTISH Government has placed our PREMIUM food and PREMIUM drink exports, front and centre, to restore and explore our good SCOTTISH BRAND, helping with business and marketing.

      With full access to our natural resources and fair funding, hopes for other/new industries AFTER INDEPENDENCE are looking good.

      Unless UK rule clings on here indefinitely, completely wiping out a thousand years of good taste.

    340. Dr Jim says:

      @Liz g

      Union Flegs on the poison that should tell us something eh
      I’ll think about that when I’m working on my new sprayable irritable bowel gas

    341. Ken500 says:

      Illegal wars, financial fraud and tax evasion. Starving and killing millions. Worldwide. Banking crash. People in glass houses. He who throws the first stone. Bliar, Thatcher, Brown, Cameron, Osbourne, Gove, Farague, Murdoch. Johnston, Johnston, Johnston. All the associate M15/6. Police corruption. ‘D’ notices and corruption. Johnston the imbecile criminal liar. A British double agent spy. Lurking in the shade in the suburbs. It all stinks to high heaven. No one can believe a word they say. Play with fire they will get burned.

    342. galamcennalath says:

      Priceless irony.

      I paraphrase … the UK leaves the EU intent on rekindling passions with its long lost empire. However that empire is now eyeing the EU with it wealth and size as the desirable partner. The UK risks being left in the corner with no one wanting to dance with her. Sad and deluded.

      http://archive.is/JT49Q

    343. Rock says:

      yesindyref2,

      “The National published an article yesterday – don’t you read postings on this forum? You’ve already been told that.”

      You have already been told that publishing someone’s comment is not the same thing as publishing an article.

    344. schrodingers cat says:

      neurotoxic A and B agents are usually liquids, they are also percutant and persistant, ie they go through the skin and can lie around in puddles even outside emmiting gas by evapouration. each nato troup carries an auto injecting atropine syringe, usually in their gas mask bag on their webbing. the atropine will retard the effects of the neurotoxic agent if administered quickly enough, exiting the zone immediately. even after decontamination (showers etc) affected individals are monitored, eg smoking a cigarette can cause the symptoms to kick back in again.

      you can recover from neurotoxic gas attack because of they way it works on your nervous system. old ww1 gases, mustard, phosogene etc, burn your inside and the effects are irreversable. after saying that neurotoxic agents like sarin or soman are very fast acting. they also require a great deal of knowledge and equipment to make

    345. Rock says:

      yesindyref2,

      “As for McLeish saying Labour should support the single market – good”

      McLeish is an opportunist unionist chameleon whom The National would not be giving three pages if it supported independence.

    346. yesindyref2 says:

      You have already been told that being told that you being told is being told that not being told is being told that you’ve already been told that you’ve been told that cutting and pasting your own comment repeatedly is incredibly borng and is not the same thing as being told that you being told is being told that not being told is being told that you’ve already been told that you’ve been told – and that’s telling you.

    347. yesindyref2 says:

      That should fry the processor, and the motherboard.

    348. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Iain mhor @ 21:48,

      Your posting contains a whole lot of sense, Iain.

      “Needing to retain our resources to negotiate with the EU.” That’s the nub of it right there.

      A very good article also by Andrew Tickell in today’s National, I thought. (And sucks to you, stone-age man.) Covers essentially the same issues as on this thread today.

      I’m persuaded that London is so detached from reality, both Continental and Scottish/Welsh/Irish, that it is institutionally blind and simply unable to prevent itself blundering on regardless.

      There is no cunning plan, just empty exceptionalist bluster.

      And sooner rather than later it’s going to flounder and be found out.

      Just like Rude Gal’s already being found out now, despite all her past heavy promoting by the BBC. I imagine her sitting all alone now, the little corporal with a quarter of her little band AWOL, staring into the abyss, asking herself where it all went wrong. As is her erstwhile intellectual buddy Tomkins.

    349. Liz g says:

      Iain mohor @ 9.48
      Well… I don’t think it’s just the “powers” that are vexing Adam Thompson!

      In the committee on the 6th the one with Aileen Mc Harge/Hage (sorry can’t do links) two very interesting thing’s happened!

      Firstly around 10 min in,he started to form his “the SNP, by their own actions have made it so the Sewel Convention doesn’t apply”, argument.
      To which the other professor replied… “That’s NOT what I said Adam,but nice try”, she then went on to say that in her view Sewel hadn’t been ruled out.

      The second thing was in relation to a question from Neil Findlay…. He asked was there a ” legal” reason that the bill had to be in place – Before – the Westminster one to which one of the Holyrood lawyers replied….

      Yes, Section 3,para 4 or section 4,para 3 (canny mind) of the Westminster bill,if it gets into law before the Holyrood bill,will alter in law the 1998 Devolution settlement…

      Neil Findlay was visibly shocked and blurted out that “this is the first he/we are hearing about this.
      He seemed to be stunned,and Professor Tompkins had not a word to say about it.
      Either he missed it,or he was counting on no one else picking up on it…
      Either way that sort of blunder means he is no much good to Holyrood as any kind of Constitutional expert?

      Although he had gathered himself enough to try the ” Sewel is out of play and it was the SNP what done it” line in the Chamber.

    350. Ken500 says:

      Alternatively the Tories could just get voted down. They have no great majority anywhere. The lecterns will start moving. May 3. Rest of UK Council elections. Tories losing as projected. All hell will result. The only thing that bothers the bastards is if they lose their troughing seats. Tomkins can huff and puff as much as he likes but they do not have a strong majority anywhere. Especially in Scotland. Now out in the wilderness. No friends again.

      This carry on could very conceivably destroy the Tory Party. The infighting etc. The tardiness and intransigence did before. They have form. Then Scotland did not have their own (limited) Parliament, or organised regime to stand up against them. It does now. A totally different proposition. Tomkin got a few hundred votes. He has no authority to stand up for anything. Just a white noise of irrelevance. Detested in many quarters. Incompetent and ignorant. On borrowed time. Speaking tosh dies not win any kudos. Just an embarrassing turn off.

      The sight of most of them is enough for most people. The Westminster carry on is unbelievable. The planted questions and braying. Heckling. Like another twisted world. What planet are they on. Who do they think they are? Selfish, arrogant gits. Displaying their arrogant rudeness and bullying. The smell of the conceit and miss placed privilege. Aroma whiffs out. Even out of view.

      People in Scotland are not fools. They rise up when necessary and will do again. Especially when their prosperity and livelihood is threatened. They have before. Ditto the rest of the UK. Very few will be pushed around by lying Tories. Liars alway get found out. Give May until the end of the year. Or go before. The alternative will not be much better. IndyRef 2 is the other option, How long can they keep hanging in being seriously weakened all the time.

    351. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      As for our indefatigable fence-sitting friend McLeish, now that devolution is under such dire existential threat from the increasingly-desperate Tories, even he must surely realise that any hope of “federalism” is a complete non-flyer. A dead duck. A quit quacker. A perished paddler.

      (Not until a week before the IR2 vote, maybe, when someone will attempt to resurrect its fully-decomposed corpse. If we let them. Some chance!)

      So come on Henry, it’s been a braw fecht trying to turn the good ship NorthBritLab away from the rocks, but really. Your North Accounting Unit’s new Great Little Steersman is plainly intent on the opposite. It’s just a question of time.

    352. Clootie says:

      …somebody reads Andrew Tickel!l!

      I have. Him in the same box as Fry…flick to next page.

    353. Slarti says:

      @ Yesindyref2

      That is hilarious, got me spluttering with delight!

    354. Clootie says:

      Henry McLeish ….what better example could you have of the Scottish cringe …” I wis gonnae, mibbae vow aye…BUT!

    355. Ken500 says:

      FFS Clair Imirie wins ‘free’ Council Tax for a year. 2011 in Edinburgh. For signing up for direct debit. Uses the money to go on holiday to Switzerland. It is absolutely incredible. £thousands.

      One of five winners. Was it rigged?

      So it’s ok for other taxpayers to pay for this greedy, hypocrite to go on holiday ski ing to Switzerland. A complete waste of public money. On the Council for what she can get?, but grudges a baby box from others.

      Poseur planted all over the Internet as a ‘model’. Certainly not a model for most people in more difficult circumstances or the welfare of babies.

    356. Effijy says:

      RE English Spy in Russian Uniform.

      Westminster is behind it all!

      He obviously doesn’t get his Russian Army pension, so how did he get a house of Circa £350,000.

      How does he live well wining and dining?

      We pay for once Westminster has robbed us.

      It probably cost us £1,000,000 to get this guy to confirm the Russian have nuclear weapons and Army posts across their nation.

      I fear this Tinker has just been added to the Tory Austerity list.

      According to the Indian columnist Bhaskar Menon, the British Empire ‘killed with famine, sword and fire more people than Genghis Khan, Attila the Hun, Hitler or Stalin. In the defense of its imperial interests it has precipitated two World Wars and is now presiding over an empire of crime that drains the poorest countries of their hard-earned wealth. During the days of Empire and now, treachery has been a staple in Britain’s international relations.

    357. Effijy says:

      The needless deaths and negligent care across NHS England only
      get a cursory glance in some corners of the UK Media.
      A baby box given away by a rich tory carries much more CONcern?

      The email from the Northampton NHS trust’s medical director, Matthew Metcalfe, said: “Last night a patient died due entirely to the dangerous overcrowding of the department.

      3 learning disabled, a day, died of inadequate NHS England care, last year- that’s a staggering 1200, and, it was probably more this year.

      Death rates at 19 NHS hospital trusts in England were alarmingly high last year, according to an influential report.
      The Dr Foster hospital guide also revealed that tens of thousands of patients were harmed in hospital when they developed avoidable blood clots, suffered obstetric tears during childbirth, accidental lacerations or puncture wounds, or post-surgery intestinal bleeding and blood poisoning, the Observer newspaper reported.

      And they want to force Scotland’s superior NHS into the deadly, incompetent, underfunded, heartless Tory NHS England???

    358. K1 says:

      Liz @10.27pm

      I can’t find the committee meeting you are referring to on the parliament tv. Anyway can you narrow it down, I’ve looked at all meetings that took place on the 6th and can find none with Aileen McHarg listed as giving evidence?

      Just sheer curiosity about those comments from Tompkins and ah want tae see Findlay’s ‘Ah’ve jist realised whit’s goan oan’ expression.

      Cheers

    359. ben madigan says:

      @ Robert J. Sutherland who said “any hope of “federalism” is a complete non-flyer”.

      So glad to hear you agree with me Robert.
      Immediately after the referendum I wrote this post. I have seen nothing since to convince me otherwise!

      https://eurofree3.wordpress.com/2014/09/25/squaring-the-circle-what-no-means/

    360. Robert Peffers says:

      I’ve just spent ages again tonight trying to donate to Wings.

      No idea how many attempts I made. The damned page keeps asking for my, “Town”, but will not accept it, no matter how many times I typed it in. Perhaps it is like Brigadoon and Stu will have to wait 100 years for the donations. By which time the Scottish currency in an independent Scotland will be either the Euro or our very own, very strong, very Worldwide accepted currency.

      When I attempted to donate last night it accepted all my data, including my town, (village actually), but wouldn’t let me send the donation. I’ve had enough frustration for one night.

      Ah’m fair forfochen, (owersettin intil the Inglis):-

      forfochen/forefoughten – adj. exhausted; tired; enervated; worn out.

      Ah’m awa tae ma scratcher. (Isn’t our Lowland Scots language so very descriptive?

    361. louis.b.argyll says:

      Night night Robert.. Watch those bytes.

      I’ll get ma ‘jamys.

    362. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      Robert Peffers @ 23:49,

      I don’t mean to inquire, Robert, but personally I find these days it’s often far less frustrating to avoid the foibles of individual websites and pay direct via online banking (if you happen have that set up already, of course). Details are available if that’s an option.

      That way every single penny also goes to where it’s intended – no middle men taking a skim!

    363. Liz g says:

      Clootie @10.47
      I read Andrew Tickel, and I think he does a good job of explaining the Legal side of things.

    364. louis.b.argyll says:

      Effigy,
      thanks for this- needs repeating.
      Three hundred years in one paragraph..

      According to the Indian columnist Bhaskar Menon, the British Empire ‘killed with famine, sword and fire more people than Genghis Khan, Attila the Hun, Hitler or Stalin. In the defense of its imperial interests it has precipitated two World Wars and is now presiding over an empire of crime that drains the poorest countries of their hard-earned wealth. During the days of Empire and now, treachery has been a staple in Britain’s international relations.

    365. Breeks says:

      Robert J. Sutherland says:
      9 March, 2018 at 9:41 pm

      O/T Don’t know why some of us are getting all diverted over the nerve agent thing, but in my book anyone who deploys (or orders the deployment of) this vile stuff against anyone for any “reason” is a morally bankrupt scumbag who deserves to burn in the innermost circle of hell for eternity…

      I watched BBC news today about this, and it all looked very, very odd. Lots of figures running around in Hazmat suits, soldiers arriving, CIS tents being set up for forensic inspections… all very serious. Except…

      The folks in Hazmat suits were mingling with civvies in normal clothing. I saw no decontamination facilites, no spraying facilities or footbaths, nor indeed movement restrictions and safe area cordon at all. The forensic inspection tent was blowing about in the breeze – hardly likely to protect forensic evidence, nor contain toxic threats. This remember was meant to be the scene of some poisonous nerve gas discharge, which has apparently injured an indeterminate number of people.

      When I recall the rigours and length went to, to contain the spread of foot and mouth disease, this “apparent” site investigation of a chemical nerve agent attack seemed amateurish and undisciplined to the point of farce. Not least were the news cameras on site right beside military personnel walking around in Hazmat suits and a policeman looking on…

      Look at this picture…

      https://news.sky.com/story/spy-poisoning-military-deployed-in-salisbury-as-police-investigate-cemetery-11282930

      Ask yourself if that’s a picture of a crime scene consistent with the presence of deadly toxins?

      One explanation might be the area had already been declared safe, and restrictions relaxed, however, were that the case, why were the people still wearing Hazmat suits?

      I wouldn’t go so far as to say the whole thing looked staged, but I did get the impression the images were deliberately contrived for the media.

      The UK Establishment clearly intends on milking this incident and getting its money’s worth and full dramatic license for popular consumption.

    366. Liz g says:

      Breeks @ 12.42
      I wouldn’t have said that they were “milking it”
      Mare like Marketing it.

    367. schrodingers cat says:

      testing
      soz folks, new os

    368. schrodingers cat says:

      O/T Don’t know why some of us are getting all diverted over the nerve agent thing
      —————–
      there are wingers who have first hand technical knowledge of such chemicals, when they share it, it becomes general knowledge. it makes westminsters job of lying to the public more difficult.

      thats one of the reasons people come to wings. it is what it is for

    369. Tam the Bam. says:

      I’d take it back if I were you.

      Your profile pic is now a dog on my screen!

    370. Cactus says:

      Mon Team Scotland at the rugby!

      John Clark.
      Olie Young.
      David Anderson.
      James Blair.
      Douglas Wilson.
      Kris Macallister.
      Fiona Kelso.
      John Bruce.
      Victor Moncrieff.
      Mick Fulton.

      Will be lookin’ out for ye Wingers…

      Think of all the other normal independent European countries around this world, looking at Scotland’s plight to FREE itself from UKGov and wishing us to join them and enjoy the same benefits, like they do.

      This is the ULTIMATE Play The Game. 🙂

      Brexit is a choice of ‘sliding doors’.

      “Hey hey, set me free…”
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kJA8v577W8 (1,444,857 eyes)

      iScotGov coming soon…

    371. Cactus says:

      There’s yer names up in lights.

      Sandra Robertson.
      Alistair Walker.
      Sheena Godley.
      Jonathan Davidson.
      Richard Everitt.

      Just to make up the numbers for the 1st XV.

      Keep it tight and play to the wing.

      XV = Scotland Victory, aye.

      Play well.

    372. Cactus says:

      That’s the fun thing about rugby…

      The goalpost (try line) is the breadth of the pitch.

      And it’s all about the ‘conversion’.

      Try Scotland! Aye.

      See, hear.

      Here.

    373. Ghillie says:

      First of all, congratulations Ms Imrie on expecting your baby. Wishing you good health and the safe delivery of your new child =)

      Though from experience, I can say that when your bonnie new baby has managed to squitt on every single item of clothing and bedding (including your own) and you are too exhausted to go near the washing machine, you may wish then that you had been gracious about the loving gift of the Baby Box from our forward thinking Scottish Government =)

      Ach, we all say things we wish we could take back. Never too late to change direction. You have your wee one’s future to think about now.

      Nevertheless, blessings on you and your baby Ms Imrie x

    374. Cactus says:

      Hey Ghillie, aye second yours xx.

    375. Cactus says:

      Refresh in about circa 4 hours for Saturday Cairnstoon.

      What you got for us CC…

      Mornin’.

    376. Robert J. Sutherland says:

      schrodingers cat @ 01:36,

      Most all of what I’ve seen on here is baseless idle speculation, which can certainly be accessed but does the site’s reputation for truth-telling no good at all.

      (Like two human beings in mortal danger, yet it’s supposed to be a fiction, or something. According to our “friends” in St. Petersburg.)

      All getting us nowhere. Jeez. I despair sometimes.

    377. cearc says:

      G’day, Cactus. Let’s keep converting them. It’s getting easier all the time.

    378. Cactus says:

      Hey cearc xx ~

      Aye.. convert, enlighten, educate, awaken…

      They need to learn.

      For themselves.

      That’s key.

    379. Cactus says:

      Still up.. just like the TV, aye sometimes read le bbc Scottish blogs on guest access computers on and off.

      If you do the same, ye’ll probably begin tae see the screw turnin’… don’t you think Peter Piper.

      Share a little… to learn lots.

      Scottish politics.

      S’all urs CC.

      +Nana xx.

    380. Cactus says:

      Gonna make a prediction…

      Oor Hamish wont be in todays toon.

      It may be a Tory or Twa.

      Laters…

    381. Ken500 says:

      One of the factors among many that led to Thatcher demise was her opposition to the EU. The splits within the Tory Party. There was only so much they could take. It was the EU problems within the Tory Party that finally took her down. Deja Vu. May.

      When the Tories were finally voted out. Interest rates were 15%. Unemployment was over 3Million. The UK economy was decimated. Violent protest was everywhere. Riots in the streets especially in London were common. The Scottish economy had been decimated. Poll tax etc. There was anarchy. People can actually forget the violence that took place. In the nostalgia. The good, old bad old days. People will rise up again and give when they can’t take any more. Soon.

      Just keep on voting SNP/SNP. Vote for Independence. Get someone else to as well. They stand up for Scotland and generally care about people.

    382. Ken500 says:

      The Tory – unionists are definitely selling the farmers and fisherman in Scotland down the river again. Taking away their rights and their rights over their own industry. They are having their rights to improve their own industry taken away. The grab back of powers could devastate the farming and fishing industry. Make them less productive and more difficult to sell their products. They could be put into increased financial difficulties and lose their income and livlihood. Some of them are being conned.

      Scotland needs more rights over it’s economy. Not have more rights taken away. They could lose their rights to protect their industry. Have them taken away. The Tories are after the fishing and farming industry to do it further harm. Than austerity and the fall in the pound is doing already. Doing harm to many industries, including the Oil sector.

    383. Well worth a read to anyone interested in geopolitics and the wider world,

      Interview to American TV channel NBC
      Vladimir Putin answered questions from NBC anchor Megyn Kelly. The interview was recorded in the Kremlin on March 1, 2018, and in Kaliningrad on March 2, 2018,

      http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/57027

    384. Nana says:

      Corbyn’s speech to Scottish Labour conference, Dundee – confusion and contradictions on Brexit or why is Labour not opposing Brexit? a thread
      https://twitter.com/KirstyS_Hughes/status/972205190593089538

      https://infacts.org/no-theresa-us-canada-border-not-good-model-ireland/

      Flyer beware: Ryanair to sell tickets with Brexit caveat
      http://archive.is/fN2Zf

      But but, what about that oh so special relationship
      http://archive.is/xey6G

    385. Robert Louis says:

      Nan your link at 0807am,

      http://www.alynsmith.eu/scotland_in_europe_update_9th_march_2018

      Is extremely informative. Thanks.

    386. louis.b.argyll says:

      Cactus 3:44 am
      Hey cearc xx ~

      Aye.. convert, enlighten, educate, awaken…

      And probe, with a view to destroying, a certain generation’s inferiority complex.

    387. Ken500 says:

      The way Mark McDonald has been treated in the Press etc is appalling. The idea he is any kind of ‘sexual predator’ without totally any proof is just disgrace. A defamatory accusation. It is just appalling. A total witchhunt. Anyone who knows or have met him. He is nothing but a gentle man who would not give offence, intentionally.in any way. Totally bewildering. It is just outrageous, Totally out of proportion of any ‘offence’ given.

      The Press/MSM are a joke and misleading. Jumping on the bandwagon. No research or investigation. What’s new. Unwantedky trying to destroy people’s reputation. The NE could lose another competent, hard working politician. Through misunderstood circumstances. A travesty of justice. To lose a career and job. Having a wife and family to keep in difficult curcumstances. For some mild misdemeanour. Enough is enough. Just hope he is getting enough support from colleagues, friends and those who know or have met him. Like and admire him. Affirmative.

      People send misintepretated texts and e-mails every day. Millions.Letting drunks sleep it off. Many would be of the opinion that was doing them a favour. Even some who protest to much when they get some back some correspondence with expletives. Kettle black. Those in glass houses. The first to throw stones. Some Politicians should realise how angry difficult circumstances make some people. Especially those caused by their misconstrued actions .The actions of this UK Gov are totally uncaring and unfeeling. Totally unnecessary.. They are damaging the society and the economy.

      Why is any Report or evidence of malicious allegations being kept secret. Having apologised for any offence caused. Where is the evidence. Innocent till proved guilty. Natural justice,

      Mark McDonald did so much good work for additional needs children and their families. Raised awareness of autism etc. Those on the spectrum.A devoted family man having some extra struggles every day. Some banshees have gone too far this time, This miscarriage should be corrected. A total injustice.

      More politicians need diversity training. Some e-mails received for help (even offensive) are from those with mental issues. They need help with mental health issues and given some consideration. Given appropriate treatment and support. They do not appreciate they are giving offence in many cases. They just want appropriate help because they are struggling. Not be ‘charged’ by the police, dragged to court and put in prison or fined for mild misdemeanour. That will not solve any problems just make things worse. Far worse for society. A total waste of police time and resources. They need appropriate diversity training, as well. Many were ex military with their own problems or agenda.

      Additional needs and those on the spectrum activities should be resolved with more understand. 20% of the population. Especially from politicans who need more diversity training, They volunteered but are not up for it. Text and e-mails can be blocked. Or banned. Many have the staff to help solve these problems. Shield or rectify them.

      Too many people are in prison already unecessarily. . They should be given understanding and appropriate help. In some cases proper total abstinence ‘one change’ drink/drug counselling. To counter abuse. It is more cost effective etc and much more appropriate in the circumstances. For goodness sake a bit of human kindness.

    388. Ken500 says:

      @ Nana Thanks for the links. As usual excellent.

    389. Tam the Bam. says:

      GMS just broadcast a report from their man in Catalonia purporting to tell how support for Catalan Indy has ‘plunged’ from 48% to 40%.Of course no rebuttal was proffered.The entire object of the piece was a thinly disguised lecture/warning to independence minded Scots.
      Incidentally…don’t think they once mentioned the Westminster ‘Power Grab.’….(though I did admittedly drop off into the land of nod between 8-9am).

    390. Fred says:

      “The Collected Wisdom of Henry McLeish!” coming to a bookshop near you!

    391. Brian Powell says:

      Tam the Bam

      That would be after twice majority voting for pro-Independence politicians in GEs.

    392. Gary45% says:

      Sorry Kids just read the last “so many comments”, noticed Mark McDonald getting a wee mention, he was an SNP politician hence the over the top, inbred, pathetic castigation from the YOON MEDIA.
      As far as Mr Putin goes, MOSSAD are 100% guilty in the recent “Empire violation”, we will never be told the truth regarding what happened, but lets kick Putin, Assad, Wee Kim. etc. “open your eyes” Do not forget the situation in the Middle East thanks to the intervention of the so called “Free Peace Police” from the West. Look at Palestine, if you dare to stick your head above the parapet you will see what is really happening.
      I really hope Wee Kim tells the West to go and do one, unless Israel gets rid of its Nuclear weapons or is this statement regarded as Anti Semitic? you can FUCK OFF if you think it is.
      WAR makes money. end of.

    393. Valerie says:

      She would not be able to register for it yet..she is not 20 weeks as far as read! She is going to have to apologise to midwife for the implied statetement by Willie Young.(The Wall) midwife applied fraudulenty on her behalf!

    394. Foonurt says:

      Wull, yuv goat thoan aff yurr mine, Gary45% (8-07pm).

      He brew, ah karma cuppa.



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