Going walkabout
Posted on
April 11, 2020 by
Chris Cairns
The world's most-read Scottish politics website
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Wings Over ScotlandA tall tale
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Transphobia
Dave just isn’t prepared to accept there might be a world outwith his imagination. Or that he might not be superior. He has the ‘English disease’.
A unified biosocial theory of personality and its role in the development of anxiety states.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3809156
Aye right
I am genuinely unsure what point you want to make.
Nobody disagrees that cv19 is responsible for the deaths of many people. That might 10, 20 or 30 thousand, maybe even more over the next year. It’s a deadly virus that has spread around the world killing 100s of thousands.
The figures on hospital beds being used are falling, the curve has been flattened, for the time being. Are you arguing the lockdown should end or that it should be tighter?
Cammy
You are a fraud.
Stop blathering, produce evidence.
You can’t.
You are a dick.
@Sensibledave
I’ll tell what I’m arguing, the Westminster government are hiding the true death toll from the virus. Without this current lockdown numbers of deaths would still be increasing exponentially and not just 80% greater than the 5 year average.
Their plan is clear, “herd immunity” is so as to protect the economy rather than people. I hope you don’t believe for a moment that in 3 weeks’ time the lockdown will be lifted and it will be back to normal.
It won’t be, social distancing will still be the mantra and there will be no such thing as a “return to normal” at least before a vaccine is developed. That could take a year or more, that’s if they ever do develop one. That is needed in order to protect those most at risk and who are currently dying before their time.
You know who I mean, your mum and dad or granny and grandad.
@ Ian Brotherhood 10.06 pm – thx for the link. I read the article but haven’t seen the video yet. Two points I’d make are that the Trump family are said to have links to the drug manufacturer, which is why Trump keeps plugging it.
Two, the final point about how stupid the Chinese are reeks of Trumpism. I clicked on Liberymavenstock but that didn’t lead to any info on who this author is. Maybe Trump wrote it himself. He does know everything you know.
So hyper sceptical. But will look at the video and see what it says.
Dave must have a very strong urge to maintain the British state, despite Scotland’s lack of access to constitutional justice. He’s been pedaling his right-wing populism for years now, always seeking to appear moderate and logical. This is how the New Right operates to gull the gullible.
Full text.
The Narcissism Spectrum Model: A Synthetic View of Narcissistic Personality
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/1088868316685018
Dave’s a Tory so here’s some science. 😉
The Relationship between the Brexit Vote and Individual Predictors of Prejudice: Collective Narcissism, Right Wing Authoritarianism, Social Dominance Orientation
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2017.02023/full
Famous15 says: at 4:48 pm
“Dan and coriander you must know that a virus is not a bacterial infection and that is why doctors do not must not prescribe antibiotics for flu and other virals.”
Ya, and of course I’m not suggesting it will cure covid or pneumonia outright. But the virus seems to have a propensity to cause pneumonia which is a bacterial infection. And as earlier posts appeared to elude to the possibility that uptake of oxygen into the bloodstream is an issue, not having pneumonia is probably a good thing.
Eating a load of decent nutrients and vitamins is going to be a good idea at the best of times to keep immune system performing as good as it can.
My old man passed after a heavy flu that developed into pneumonia which led to organ shutdown.
He was initially turned away from doctors twice and sent home from hospital once about a week before things got drastic and he was finally taken to hospital ICU and quickly fitted with an oxygen mask, then shifted later that day with blues and twos to a different hospital with a renal ward. Once there they cycled between IV antibiotics and dialysis in an attempt to balance between treating the infection and dealing with organ shutdown.
I was told this was done as the dialysis basically filters out the IV antibiotics hence the cycle between the two processes whilst monitoring various parameters.
As an engineer I found the technique very interesting. In a different life I’d often thought of nursing but was too far down the spanner path.
My dad was a smart cookie and he knew that when he briefly removed the oxygen mask he was wearing and watched the blood oxygen saturation levels drop quickly that it wasn’t a good sign.
We got a couple of days with him but when he finally managed to get up to try to go to the toilet a blood clot that had developed during the time he was immobile with his organs shutting down must have moved and caused him to collapse and that was it, lights out in a fleeting moment.
Interesting how the Police and the Crown Prosecution Service have been issued direction where for example it is illegal to but paint and brushes for DIY at hone whilst buying food, or st least certain types of food is not.
Given the right to issue on the spot £960.00 fines one can see how the police and 5he public in England are going to come into conflict.
And that is exactly what the American constitution allows citizens to bear arms. It’s so that citizens can resist a government, a hostile force, that turns against them.
Policing is only by consent. If it is not consent then it is chaos.
Dan @6:54
Thanks for sharing that. My own Da was taken by flu a few years ago. I suppose there is small comfort to be taken in Natures way, surviving humanity/making it to the line, and all that.
Peeps
Scotgoespop blog is interesting. Not really for the blog post itself but rather for the BTL comments especially those by “Rolfe”.
Also some gen on “experts” who are really shills for the Union.
Take note Nicola!
Death trajectory from Johns Hopkins is interesting. Link..
https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/12D49/production/_111792177_scotland_deaths_2020-04-15_14_26_41.png
Interesting times!
@ Ian Brotherhood – I agree with what the medic is saying – that this virus is not flu. It’s a new combination of virus dna and we have no immunity. Survival seems to depend on how efficient your immune system is.
The Chinese medics Handbook I linked to earlier says IIRC that some patients didn’t improve on ventilators. The medics ran their blood through a machine which oxygenated it instead. Can’t remember what they called that.
https://www.alnap.org/help-library/handbook-of-covid-19-prevention-and-treatment
Dave would rather ignore expert advice and rely on his personal prejudice to guide his actions. Dave’s a typical Tory. The party he support is culpable of gross social abuse, criminal negligence, and an approach to social policy that is essentially 21st eugenics. English Torydum is getting closer to full-fat-fascism every day. Time to get moving peeps.
Full text.
The continuing tensions between individual rights and public health. Talking Point on public health versus civil liberties
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2267241/
Just watched The Corbet Report and found ther are protests against ‘lockdown ‘ which isn’t being reported in MSM If it is being reported protesters being described as dangerous nutters.As Corbet says public compliance let’s Governm away with it . I’ve noticed that the only people asking questions appear to be on the right of politics while the left leaning more likely to comply. Your compliance makes prisoners of us all. When was the last time this happened? Only now .You all have a cheek calling anyone a Tory while you slavishly believe Tory propaganda indeed you think they’re not telling us the true horror when really the only horror is how compliant,supine you are.As you can tell I’m not here to make friends I want people to stop buying this shit.No one denies there’s a nasty strain of flu doing the rounds but you’re complete surrendered astounds me .I used read this site every day because I thought you lot were sensible.What you are is old and frightened There is only one way to get Independence and that’s not going to happen in this country. Your talking shop is going nowhere.
Cammy
… you need to take a long hard look at yourself!
“Dave’s a typical Tory”. In one sentence you display all of the prejudice and bias in the world. You discriminate on the grounds of race, you discriminate on the grounds of political leaning, you stereotype, you generalise and you make s**t up.
You have made some pretty outrageous statements on a public forum Cammy. You could retract them … or you could produce a scrap of evidence. But there is no evidence, so you are just a pseudo intellectual, fake academic, liar!!!
Still waiting Cammy (cue more boring links from Cammy that try to deflect from his own enormous personal inadiquacies!
FFS
would sensibledave and Cammy PLEASE, just get a room, fellas.
Dog Biscuit,
I don’t agree with this type of lockdown, I am not right wing.
Let’s not forget that it is a right wing government implementation.
Also there is an interesting article in RT about the cost of lives because of this lockdown.
https://www.rt.com/op-ed/485876-covid-lockdown-kills-150000/
@ Ian Brotherhood – I’ve looked in the Handbook and I was probably remembering something called Extra Corporeal Membrane Oxygenation
On page 49 – Part Ill. Daily Management and Monitoring of ECMO (Extra Corporeal Membrane Oxygenation)
On p 24 of the Handbook the Chinese medics mention using chloroquine phosphate – an antiviral drug. I’m not a doctor so have no idea if this is in any way similar to the hydroxychloroquine drug which one of Trump’s companies has an interest in.
The Guardian has a podcast on this;
https://www.theguardian.com/news/audio/2020/apr/16/hydroxychloroquine-how-did-an-unproven-drug-become-trumps-miracle-cure
Watched Dominic Raab say they took into account and used the experience from elsewhere to guide their response. I can only ascertain from this then is the death toll was planned as they followed the countries with the worst outcomes.
Of course this was just bullshit to con the unaware that they had done a brilliant job by having the worst death rate in Europe, maybe the world at the end if we measure deaths per million.
8pm
Imbeciles clapping
Sad
Sad
Sad
Those calling for a swift let-up of the lock-down, probably are not qualified to make such a judgement, so have a right to express an opinion that endangers public health.
Full text.
Btw, this approach to public health is not possible without a legal respect for biology. 😉
The precautionary principle: in action for public health
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2092570/
Sensibledav
I just recognise an illiberal bigot when I see one. 😉
This new ‘R’ thing, at least I’ve never heard of it before. Erm…what is it again? I suspect it is to add even more confusion to the confusion.
The Government now asking/telling people with underlying illnesses to attend hospital? How odd. Must be running low on numbers enabling manipulation!
I’m with Ayeright on this in that the Government is hiding the true number of deaths. They are at least double if not more than what is being presented. Running scared maybe?
This thoroughly corrupt and useless lot know fine well that they have cocked this up big style! (although I am not discounting intentionally!} Way, way, way above any of their capabilities. Jesus, Dominic Rabb didn’t even know the function of the Dover Port when he became Brexit Minister!
Does anyone know if the front bench has all returned from their very obviously arranged staggered holidays yet?
CBB
I’m going to be honest – you’re starting to annoy me
Snopes thinks that, although Donald Trump’s family trusts do invest in companies manufacturing hydroxychloroquine, this wouldn’t provide enough financial return to be significant.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-profit-hydroxychloroquine/
ahundredthidiot
The idiot is simply giving me a platform to inform the debate with a scientific world view, which the British constitution can not resist. You either submit to British constitutionalism or you respect legal and social science. You can’t do both at the same time. 😉
Sorry….so have NO right to….
Cammy..still no eveidence, Fraud, Liar (and a V boring one at that!)
Capella @ 8:10
aye, and so does anyone in Scotland in receipt of a pension, phew, what a let off…..
That’s how ridiculous the anti-Trump nutters are.
Not enough clout to work out the consequences of their own bizarre shit throwing.
Sensibledave
I’ll be eternity grateful for your fortitude in bring us your wisdom. Keep up the good work. TA. 😉
CBB
You just seem to keep contradicting yourself though. One minute you bemoan the ‘fascist tories’ and then agree with their right wing lock down strategy to the point of warning against relaxation……because we’re not qualified…..ergo, suggesting that thee Tory Party are right…..maybe because they listen to ‘experts’….the type of which you condone because they got a degree at some diddy university in some diddy discipline…..and then criticise the outcome…….maybe.
It’s bloody annoying – you’re just trying too hard to be clever. I will happily listen to your opinion one way or another, but forgive me for scrolling on past when I see a link in bold or a cut and paste lecture to someone else opinion.
@Capella –
Just a quick one to acknowledge your comments and continuing efforts to shed some light on all this.
My medical pal has only commented that things seem to be shifting apace but how long it’ll take for a change in treatment/procedures to be reflected in governmental policy is another matter.
ahundredthidiot
You obviously know little about public health, and need to take a good look at yourself before pointing fingers. Some of the stuff you’ve been posting has gotten my finger twitching, believe me. Mind yourself, or I might not hold back next time.
Dan @ 6.54.
The loss of a parent especially when they understand the physical reason for their demise is something that lives with their children for a lifetime.
This is a thoroughly rotten disease, but all diseases are. That hurts, especially when the departed goes before their time. However, the callous COVID 19 decision to sacrifice older people the expense of saving the economy is something that will burn into the memory of those who have lost loved ones.
Think of the good times, of which there will be many Dan, and think what your Dad would have wanted, and maybe, just maybe, you will one day look back with a smile to what you were lucky enough to have.
CBB
How can I not respond to that?
Clearly you are not alone in being a coward of the highest order with no opinion of your own.
Please, by all means, let rip…….
Had a closer look at Flight Radar and I may have been mistaken earlier about cranking back to normality.
A comfortable majority of flights are still cargo and other non specific flights.
Flights disappearing very quickly from the FR app shortly after take off hiding destination.
I see captain tom moore has now raised 15 million for the NHS. Very commendable. But to all you Scots who donated, i’d be asking how much if any of that will be going to the SNHS.
dakk
I have been monitoring FR24 on and off for days – and there has been some bizarre activity on there the likes of which I have never seen. PWK to russia…NA destinations, Loganair flights to Latvia, private jets out of east mids flying in circles over the N sea for hours…….it’s mental.
Should have said NHS england and wales.
ahundredthidiot
I’m perhaps being a bit active right now as I’m trying to perform a number of tasks at the same time, as time is of the essence. By all means you are entitled to an opinion, but why not just mind yourself in future. I’ve been doing this for a while and I think I’ve managed to strike a balance that is acceptable to the Rev and the crew.
I’m not saying you talk shite all the time, you do make some good points. You appear happy to be prescriptive concerning matters that appear to be outwith you competence though. That needs some improvement work on your part, IMHO. 😉
Total deaths worldwide stands at just over 140,000. Only a dishonest Tory cunt would claim that hundreds of thousands have died. It must be a mental illness to have such a disconnect with reality. I wonder which came first for Tory Dave. His dishonesty or his fascist nature .
Looks like Andrew Neil has had a bit too much of the Blue Nun, he thinks it’s ironic using this brand but it is actually about his class of wine I would say, lashing out on twitter because he made a fool of himself yesterday. Not sure why yesterday is so important to him, as far as I can remember he did this regularly on air.
Anyway at his age he was probably a Cliff Richard fan, I suspect he has a quiet passion for The Young Ones.
CBB
that’s fine – let me know when you want a real time public health debate of apparently which I know jack shit and I will take you on, Acts, Sections, Sub sections and the consequences there of within the current context of COVID19 response for Category 1 and 2 responders.
Just let me know.
I know where my weaknesses lie – humility and kindness – I will work on mine and hopefully you will work on your arrogance.
ahundredthidiot
Rattling off legislation is no proof of understanding. Care to share what your frame of reference is?
@Willie
I notice I didn’t make it clear that this happened well over a decade ago so long through the grieving process now.
Email in from First Minster. Hmm, she doesn’t even highlight or make the distinction it’s the Scottish NHS…
“Together, we will get through this
Let me start with a heartfelt thank you.
Lockdown is tough. I know people are struggling. But let’s not forget, we’re doing it to save lives.
Later this evening I’ll be joining many of you again in the clap for our carers.
As we do so, take a moment to reflect on how together we’ve slowed the spread of the virus.
Fact is by staying home we’ve stopped the virus running rampant – we’ve protected the NHS and made sure lives have been saved.
Now, of course, we need to keep going. We can’t risk lifting the lockdown until we see all the numbers coming down.
So please stick with it – stay home, protect our NHS, save lives.
In the days ahead I hope to be able to set out some detail on the plan we are developing to plot next steps and the best way forward from this lockdown. I will be back in touch then.“
@ Ian Brotherhood – some interesting threads on twitter. This from an actuary. Actuaries make it their business to find out what might kill off their customers.
https://twitter.com/ActuaryByDay/status/1246866119597621248
and an update explaining why admissions to ICUs are younger and healthier than you might expect (consistent with what the consultant interviewed by Ch4? said):
https://twitter.com/ActuaryByDay/status/1249366217204338688?s=20
You still have nothing to say about the theft of your civil liberties.Projected deaths have proved fantastical.Our politicians including scunner Sturgeon will not let go of the powers they have granted themselves.Captain Moore being propagated to manipulate your heart strings. Do you all think the economy will bounce back if we are released from house arrest any time soon? Can I ask what planet some of you are on? Just in case you’re not sure this planet we’re on is called Earth. This whole crisis has been couched in emotional language.No one had anything to say about Sweden’s handling of this crisis. I know it’s difficult to admit when you have been conned. Is it a good idea to wreck the economy?How to run a health service with no economy .Im sure there is an expert here or a magician who can work that one out.I bet Captain Moore had no hesitation when the ramp went down on his landing craft at Normandy .None of us feartys are fit to lace his boots
It is only science deniers and the unaware who oppose the “precautionary principle”, which won’t last long in Brexitania.
Full text.
Precautionary Principles in Constitutional Law
https://academic.oup.com/jla/article/4/1/181/837098
I wonder what the odds are that Scottish care homes will still not be able to actually order PPE from these companies in another country. The policy change was probably just ‘take it off your website’ and tell them there is no stock if they try to order.
Ayeright 6.33
… they are not hiding anything mate. They don’t know, and neither does anyone else, how many people have died because of Covid 19. You need to get your head round that.
If someone dies in hospital, if they were perhaps on a ventilator and if they tested positive for Covid 19 – then it is relatively straight forward.
If someone dies in the community (about 40,000 a month do in normal times) then they either die as a result of an accident or some variation of the term “ill health”. I believe the “accident rate” in the UK is about 5000 per month. That means around 35,000 die because of ill health.
If someone is one day, or one week, or one month, or two or 3 months, fronm their “natural” death … then, in many cases they are very unwell. We have learned that those that are very unwell are the vast majority of the victims of Covid 19. Yes it can take the young and the previously well, but the vast majority are elderly and with underlying conditions.
If someone with heart failure is in their last days of their “natural” life, and then are tested positive for CV 19 and, sadly, die – someone has to decide if they died of CV19. What do you think? Do you think they should be reported as a Covid 19 death or not?
Hopefully, that helps answer your question about the death toll.
Moving on, you wrote “Without this current lockdown numbers of deaths would still be increasing exponentially and not just 80% greater than the 5 year average.”
Thats right Ayeright. Thats why we are in lockdown. Are you objecting to, or supporting, the lockdown Ayeright?
You wrote “Their plan is clear, “herd immunity” is so as to protect the economy rather than people.
The government have been very clear about their plan. The plan was/is to “delay” the spread of the virus (implicit in the word “delay” is an acceptance that stopping the spread is not possible without people dying for other reasons (eg, because they do not have food, medicine, or money).
Whether you believe that was/is the right plan or not, it is fair to say that the plan, as described, is working. Hospitalisations are starting to fall (3% down today), then the numbers in ICU will start to fall, then the number of deaths will start to fall. The NHS, under enormous difficulty, has performed brilliantly. They havent been overwhelmed. We have enough beds in hospitals and we have enough ICU beds.
You then wrote “I hope you don’t believe for a moment that in 3 weeks’ time the lockdown will be lifted and it will be back to normal.”
I don’t Ayeright. I dont think I am aware of single person that thinks that. Whether it is in 3 weeks or some longer period, I am pretty sure it will be a gradual process involving different work groups, schools, ages or whatever.
You then wrote “It won’t be, social distancing will still be the mantra and there will be no such thing as a “return to normal” at least before a vaccine is developed. That could take a year or more, that’s if they ever do develop one. That is needed in order to protect those most at risk and who are currently dying before their time.”
We agree.
You then wrote “You know who I mean, your mum and dad or granny and grandad”
Sadly Ayeright Grand parents are long gone (heart failure (x2) and cancer (x2)). Mum and Dad died within 3 weeks of each other 10 in 2001. I am the late middle aged bloke that has had pneumonia caused by some mysterious infection about 6 years ago. So I am probably in the firing line for CV19 myself.
My personal view on my own position is that I am following the government guidelines on social distancing. I think though, I am resigned to the fact that I will be exposed at some point (if I havent already) and that I will take my chances … about 1 in a hundered? The alternative is for my life to effectively stop. Not work. Not see my grown up kids or the grand kids. Not go out. Not go on holiday. Not go down the pub or out for a meal. What would be the point?
I am shopping for an elderly relative with a respatory disorder that I do not believe could survive CV 19. She is in her eighties, at home, alone. Thank god we have trained her up on facetime, facebook and the rest. I dont think she will ever come again to be frank.
I know Cummings is a keen eugenicist and he sees Brexit as a liberating emancipation of UK bio-science. But he does not respect science, he wants to misuse it for illiberal ends that simply scream social Darwinism.
CBB
I rattled off no such legislation, I put, in one sentence how I could debate current legislation, in all its detail, and how it manifests itself in the operational front line, in terms of response.
Despite my weaknesses, one of my strengths is getting to the fucking point.
No. I am not prepared to share a frame of reference.
John D
… I rather suspect that you, together with a number of others on here, don’t actually know what a fascist is. Anyway, join the queue of brainless numpties that hurl that word out as an insult to anyone that has a different view to them.
All it demonstrates is that you are a dick (you and canmmy could form a band)!!? The dickless dicks? Great name for you.
ahundredthidiot
I’d suggest you’re avoiding the point then.
Fascist are strongly opposed to the legal self-determination of Others. Simples.
@ sarah 12.06 am – thx for replying – i agree that we are in a precarious position. But the Holyrood elections haven’t been cancelled yet.
The problem IMO is campaigning. The British parties have all the media at their disposal and will use them. The advantage of the YES groups, and I include the SNP, is boots on the ground. We have the people who will knock on doors, put up street stalls and YES hubs, hold AUOB marches and town hall meetings.
The disparity between the membership and enthusiasm of the British parties an the Indy supporters is stark. If it wasn’t for the lying press an TV we would already have independence.
It will probably become clear in the next few months how dangerous this virus is and what we are going to do about it. We could talk about that on this blog even. But we can’t knock on doors and have large gatherings until it is safe to do so. Leaflets and PPBs aren’t going to be enough.
And – I don’t trust electronic or postal voting either!
To all sniping snidely at people on here who have no other option but to act in accordance with gov recommendations , I watched a programme last night on doctors in hospital treating patients with covid19 and it was frightening and emotional in equal measure
No one , not even us retired , unemployed or unemployable want to be housebound or curtailed in our freedoms , if you REALLY think all these doctors , surgeons , nurses and carers are being hoodwinked and conned into a govt conspiracy to subvert our freedoms then you are seriously deluded
To all the capitalists worried about their investments and businesses blame your fellow capitalists the tories for extending the misery you perceive you are suffering from , but always remember there are no pockets in shrouds your health is your wealth and when it is gone NO AMOUNT of money can take it’s place
Dog biscuit
Calm down.
I agree entirely with what you say.
No need for me to expand further.
You’ve covered all the points.
How are boots on the ground an advantage when we are locked up?scoence denying? Precautionary principle?
Twathater
You say you have ‘no other option but to do as you’re told’.
Are you on a tag or have you been so brainwashed that you can’t think for yourself?
CBB
Given your question – I would suggest you are sounding more like 77 than some of the usual suspects.
Don’t get me wrong – I don’t think for a second you are 77, but why try to flush out my livelihood/role on social media?
I am going to let you have the last word….something tells me that is important to you.
twathater @9:45
‘I watched a programme…’
Jesus….what hope have we….
ALL the MSM is COMPLETELY CONTROLLED – wake the fuck up!
Stand by yore beds you orrible lot!
Anundredthidiot sir.
Ready for inspection.Sir. 77th by the left.
BTW Alex CoalHamilton would make a better eedjit than Willie Rennie who really is one.
ahundredthidiot
Why be a prick?
ahundredthidiot
That meant you, what’s your problem? Lacking tolerance perhaps?
Alan Mackintosh says:
“Cameron BB, from a discussion with a care home guy I know, all the covid deaths are from heart failure,(thats on the death certificate) which figures I guess, in that the body eventually gives up from lack of oxygen/fatigue.”
The thing is Alan, the way the body takes oxygen from the lungs and distributes it around our body is through the blood.
So, if you are short of oxygen your heart’s reaction is to beat faster, to get the oxygen to the necessary organs/muscles/brain, etc.
It could be that what is happening is that the OAP’s are short of oxygen because the respiratory function is impaired through this virus.
The heart is desperately trying to compensate and get the little oxygen that the person is able to breathe in, to the most vital organs (especially the brain).
Eventually, the person’s natural weakness through age, as well as the debilitating effects of having this virus leads to them having a heart attack.
This is important because it shows the effects of ‘comorbidity’
(a person having more than one condition) and we know how desperate the governments are to downplay just how many people are dying from this virus.
Ok, CBB, will try not to be;
‘apparently’, there was 5 days of zero death registrations in Scotland due to rule changes in how death registrations are now recorded to cope with COVID19, so late March figures down a bit, early April figure will be inflated.
Community Deaths are definitely up, but Hospital deaths are effectively at business as usual, prob because no one is going to Hospital unless COVID or absolutely necessary – so, the BAU return on mortuary figures is normal. Potentially this is a false outcome as it does not account for deaths in the community, which are through the roof (not my definition, but I have no reason to doubt the source) and will no doubt account for the circa 80% increase in figures compared to BAU.
I would guess that this figure will double BAU. So, as I said earlier, (and thanks to Col Blimp/Golf Nut) links to real figures matter, in order to build a proper picture of a developing situation.
Hi peeps.
The National Health Service in Scotland is called “NHS Scotland”.
Their logo has NHS with a downward pointing bracket below it.
Underneath that bracket is the qualifier – it could be “Scotland”, “Tayside”, Grampian”, “Education” and so on.
Thus the correct abbreviation would be “NHSS”.
The slanting NHS logo is England’s NHS but they don’t feel the need to proclaim that it is England’s NHS.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0e/NHS_Scotland_logo.svg/1200px-NHS_Scotland_logo.svg.png
https://www.nhsdenpro.org/NSS_2Col.jpg
https://www.nhstaysidecdn.scot.nhs.uk/NHSTaysideWeb/groups/mh_adult/documents/documents/prod_310078.jpg
Famous 15
did you ever work out ‘by the left – centre- right’ or do you simply repeat?
it’s the difference between those who question and those who follow……so, which one are you?
Capella, Ian B,
re the chloroquine phosphate, I came across the following article some time ago which I then suggested to everyone I knew to start on the (gin) and Tonic.
From this article and the comments btl, it seems the drugs actions are to modify the blood pH( affects the virus) and also more importantly allows zinc to enter the virus which disrupts it. The drug acting as a zinc ionophore…
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/03/17/an-effective-treatment-for-coronavirus-covid-19-has-been-found-in-a-common-anti-malarial-drug/?fbclid=IwAR0nQ7ArWtXwcfBEsOapzUiwzqgFMC7bkVEJ56gLwdA2M9Btq17Y2T7nf7c
https://asiatimes.com/2020/03/why-france-is-hiding-a-cheap-and-tested-virus-cure/?fbclid=IwAR1sEHnCk1cW3MCFXilBM1Qr8_QoGFTfQnfn0RtYOTZcgtUmY_RPRZ6-tFQ
Sorry, Famous 15
I just re-red your post – I m guessing you are assuming I am 77 or have a military background?
You would be half right.
they tried to get me back after I left – more than once btw – I am touched, of course……
Brian Doonthetoon
I’ll try to remember but please pick me up on it if I don’t. 😉
@CBB,
Racism is a crime.
To call someone a racist is to accuse them of committing a crime.
To accuse someone of committing a crime, without evidence, is in itself a crime.
Being a clever man you will know this, right?
If it was up to me people like Dave would be banned from this site, but it’s not my site so I don’t make the rules, however as long as Dave is allowed to post here, we at least need to show him some respect and not make serious claims about his character, without having the evidence to back it up.
If you see racism from anyone on here, contact rev and he will promptly deal with that person.
ahundredthidiot
“ALL the MSM is COMPLETELY CONTROLLED – wake the fuck up!”
Hardly a revelation, even less so to people who visit this site.
On C4 news tonight I watched a piece, which MAY not have contained many/any lies. But WAS 100% pure undiluted propaganda.
Condemning the Big Brother tactics of the Russian police, for checking the citizens who were out and about for their digital permits, issued only to those who were authorised to go to work.
Berating the Commie Bastard Government for; under-reporting of covid figures, not acting quickly enough, not doing enough testing, not supplying enough PPE and not having enough ventilators. They even displayed a still taken at a railway station concourse, which had red squares CGI’d around the faces of the commuters and alleged that the secret police were using facial-recognition software to weed out the heroic lockdown-busters.
Thank God we are living in the “Free” World.
Which does not alter the fact that without drastic measures the virus will lead to a breakdown of the health service, cause the unnecessary premature deaths of thousands, perhaps more than the undertaking industry can handle and subject many more to the agony and anguish of having to struggle for every breath for a week or two without proper medical attention.
It is not cowardice to wish to avoid that.
It is not stupidity to fear that it may happen.
Any more than it is bravery to tempt fate to strike you down.
Patrick Roden
I hear what you are saying but I’ve got some knowledge of this stuff. I was perhaps a bit blunt but I wanted to make a point. Being a cleaver man, hopefully you can appreciate when I’m being measured, and when I’ve simply lost the rag. 😉
Col Blimp
You are an idiot.
If you haven’t worked it out by now, you probably never will.
Col Blimp
Forgot to add
You are an out and out Coward.
You’re not alone
@CBB,
Mate I fully understand you ‘losing the rag’ but the best strategy, when faced with someone on here that gets you wound up, is to ignore them.
Otherwise, they have won.
Col.Blimp IV says: at 11:31 pm
“Thank God we are living in the “Free” World.”
Well up here we might be, but jeezo this isn’t far off Robocop.
https://twitter.com/Holbornlolz/status/1250739134261530624
Patrick Roden 😉
@ Alan Macintosh – thx for the info – I was looking for an excuse!
G & T it is.
@capella. Is this what you mean…
Extracorporeal Membrane Oxygenation (ECMO) life-support machine.
Can’t believe there hasn’t been 250,000 signatures on the Change.org site?
A rejection of the MP’s £10000 corona virus ‘working from home’ allowance.
Do people actually think Tory MPs should actually get a £10K
Bonus for the inconvenience of having to work from the home
The tax payers probably bought for them?
Get it signed!
CBB
Well, you’re certainly a more cleaverer man than me…patrick Roden agrees…….Jeez
Noting we didn’t already know regarding the antibody test but good journalism nevertheless, they (UK gov) paid 20 million quid upfront to not just one but 2 Chinese companies for the antibody tests that didn’t work. They left everything too late as we all know too well on here, we are literally run by a bunch of arseholes…sigh.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/16/world/middleeast/coronavirus-antibody-test-uk.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage
https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/ppe-diverted-from-scotland-nicola-sturgeon-coronavirus-care-homes-1-6608325
Not sure if it qualifies as ‘yesterday’s news’.
Anyone defending these current measures is either a fascist sympathiser/an out and out coward – or just a good old fashioned shite-bag
Patrick Roden
I seem to remember you trying to spread fear amongst our elderly
You are the lowest of the Low
do please, fuck the fuck off, Scotland does not need your nonsense
Dan
My Tongue was firmly in my cheek when I said that.
And we are not too far away from New Detroit up here either. Branson, Bezos, Gates, Musk and Trump are probably on the board of OCP.
‘PPE firm defends decision to ‘divert essential kit’ from Scotland to England during coronavirus epidemic’
The boss of a Personal Protective Equipment (PPE) distributor has said it was right to divert stocks from Scotland to English care homes amidst the Coronavirus epidemic.
Sam Gompels, managing director of Gompels HealthCare – a Wiltshire-based PPE distributor – said it was not Public Health England’s (PHE) fault that Scottish health authorities were too slow to establish distribution channels and that the health body had a right to demand the equipment remain within its borders.
He said: “We love Scottish care homes dearly and we always have done. We will do our best to supply them, but, there must be a Scottish scheme and the questions should really be asked of the Scottish authorities or public health Scotland, whatever the equivalent is.
“The fact is Public Health England got their finger out and organised these distribution channels and are getting pilloried for it because public health Scotland, or whatever the equivalent is, have not necessarily organised the same and that’s probably the nub of it.”
Scotland’s first minister Nicola Sturgeon addressed the claims, calling any disruption of supply to Scotland in favour of English care homes as “unconscionable and unacceptable.”
Scotland’s health secretary Jeane Freeman spoke with her Westminster counterpart Matt Hancock via conference call where the issue was ironed out.
She tweeted: “Pleased @MattHancock changed his plans to join a constructive discussion of 4 Health Ministers & grateful 4 assurance that neither NHS England nor PHE asked suppliers to divert PPE orders from Scotland. We go forward constructively as before & continue to check on these supplies.”
Hancock had planned to cancel his weekly meeting with the nations’ health ministers but reneged after the issue dominated the media cycle north of the border.
PHE referred the matter to the Department of Health which issued a statement stressing that it was implementing a “UK-wide” strategy for distributing PPE and denied companies had been instructed to prioritise any country.
A UK Department of Health spokesman said: “Our PPE strategy is UK-wide, making sure that frontline workers in England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland all have the PPE they need to stay protected while taking care of patients.
“Through this four-nation approach, we are working closely with the devolved administrations to co-ordinate the distribution of PPE evenly across the UK. To date, Scotland has received 11 million pieces of PPE from central UK stocks.
“We have not instructed any company to prioritise PPE for any one nation. Our UK-wide strategy will ensure equipment continues to be evenly distributed across the entire nation.”
This comes as the CEO of Scottish Care – one of Scotland’s largest independent social care providers – Donald Macaskill complained of a “massive dry-up” of PPE arriving in Scotland because companies were prioritising English facilities.
Public Health England sent Gompels Healthcare a shipment of stockpiled PPE which it specified were solely for English care homes. Gompels apologised to its customer base on its website saying restrictions on non-English companies were part of a criteria set out by PHE. A lot of the equipment were said to be out-of-date but recently retested and verified as safe.’
From above article posted by Robert Knight.
It’s not yesterday’s news, it shows the lie of some commenter’s on here insisting that this was not an issue, when it clearly was, the ‘publicity’ it received was the only reason that they (Public Health England’ changed it’s tune as it had clearly instructed the likes of Gompel to prioritise the PPE to England only care homes.
Hifud is a little snide prick who thinks the rest of us are ‘making shit up’ when it’s clear it was never ‘imaginary’ nor ‘devisive’ and if it was it was because English companies went along with PHE’s policy of only allowing English based companies to procure the fucking PPE.
K1
Thank You for the post. I was seeing this shit in real time and all I could see on this website was NS on the big UK boat and arseholes in agreement.
Madness!
BTW, it’s not just PPE…..
ahundredthidiot
You haven’t a clue and we are facing a public crises. Caw canny.
Sustainability and precaution: Part 2 How precautionary should we be?
http://www.vam.ac.uk/content/journals/conservation-journal/issue-44/sustainability-and-precaution-part-2-how-precautionary-should-we-be/
Herd immunity
What type of degenerates would actually refer to their fellow citizens in such terms. Even Trump refused to repeat what the UK called their strategy. Calderwood, Leitch and The Queen of Mandates all went along with it as well. Sick twisted people. Failures
CBB – so, let’s just nail this down, who is dealing with the crisis – you or me?
It astonishes me that you can provide evidence in the form of certified death certificates as submitted to the National registers of Scotland proving that the death rate for just a single week is 80% higher than the average for the previous 5 years and yet for some that evidence means nothing.
The week ending 12th April is likely to be exceeded when next weeks figures are released going by those revealed every day of deaths in hospitals.
It doesn’t matter at all whether or not a death certificate staes the cause of death is wholly ar partly a result of Covid-19. The simple fact that the average number of deaths is nearly double tells you all you need to know.
Someone talked about deaths from accidents, these are massively reduced by the lockdown simply due to fewer cars being on the road and no one at work in construction.
The idiots also fail to see that without the lockdown more people MUST get the virus and more people must die as a result. Vulnerable people, of course, are those most likely to die and that’s why 25% of the deaths are in care homes.
These poor souls don’t even make it to the hospital or as I saw on a news report the other day are being returned to the care home after turning up at A&E with symptoms but not even being tested.
That’s the real disgarce in all of this, the testing could be done and we have the kits and labs to do so, but…
@ ROB 11.51 – yes. I was quoting from the Chinese Handbook for Covid-19. Which I linked to above. They also mention using Chloroquine phosphate, an anti-malarial drug. See Alan Macintosh’s links to articles on this above. Or go off to the supermarket for some gin and tonic. For medicinal purposes.
ahundredthidiot says:@11:38 pm
“If you haven’t worked it out by now, you probably never will.”
If you mean – That the big fish have insulated themselves and intend gobble up all the little fish who fall victim to the economic Lockdown”?
I think they call that capitalism.
Do I win a cigar?
ahundredthidiot
You don’t appear to appreciate the nature, value, or necessity of a precautionary approach to policy and government, yet you claim those who support it are fascists. A skeptical approach to life is healthy, but it needs to be grounded in reality.
The precautionary principle: Public health, protection of children and sustainability
https://www.who.int/hia/examples/overview/whohia076/en/
Col Blimp
you may well have won a cigar, but will you have time to smoke it…..
I know this….my posts are being managed
Capella
There is no doubt a youtube video demonstrating how to make Chloroquine phosphate from tonic water and codliver oil.
ahundredthidiot
Who Knows, I used to be fairly impervious to disease but in recent years A heart attack and septicemia got the better of me maybe it will be third time lucky for The Grim Reaper.
@ Pete 9.52pm Pete you have made it clear by your postings on here that all you are interested in is money, money , money , no care or conscience for anyone or their suffering , just a typical self serving tory , never mind as things go you will not need to worry about tax evasion
———————————–
ahundredthidiot says:
17 April, 2020 at 12:07 am
Anyone defending these current measures is either a fascist sympathiser/an out and out coward – or just a good old fashioned shite-bag
So tell us cowards Mr ex service person just what you are doing to start the revolution , and shouldn’t you be back in uniform as your country needs you
The hundredthidiot is far from wrong. Time is very short.
off-guardian.org/2020/04/16/covid19-criminalising-pathologising-dissent/
I think this covers most commenters here, an excellent analysis of the hysteria and psychosis. The war against populism is over. It’s likely nationalists like us will be near the top of the list for special attention.
youtube.com/watch?v=Feh5TUENx4I
Those screaming that they want the lock down lifted better go and find a padded cell soon as they will need it. China has now jumped from no deaths yesterday to 1290 today.
Scotland In Union green ink brigade out in force in Scotsman letters page rewriting history on the fact that English firms were refusing to sell PPE equipment to Scottish care homes.
Also Ian Murray has column saying no time for politics then proceeds to attack SNP and extol Labour’s unbeatable team to win the next Holyrood elections
I would ask people who think lockdown should be lifted to explain what their understanding of why the lockdown is there in the first place.
The biggest indictment of the lockdown I have, is the lockdown being undermined by the low volume of testing. Lockdown is intended to slow down the spread of unseen contagion, and allow is to flush it from cover to know where it is and where it is not, but without testing, that opportunity is lost, and furthermore, you don’t know when you’re safe to lift the lockdown.
But that doesn’t make lockdown fail, because even without testing, some people with the virus will pass through it’s incubation, the illness itself, (or not if they have no effects), and be passed out the far end beyond the point of being contagious, and won’t have past their infection on to anybody because the were isolated. Lockdown itself can thus save lives directly.
But sloppy lockdown, where people are allowed to mingle, allows the virus to find a new host, and the life cycle of infection, contagion, incubation, illness, etc lives to fight another day, and you have created the fresh need for a three week extension to your lockdown.
Thus one person if they have the virus on them, and without testing, how can anybody know, but that one person can disrupt the lives of everybody. When the extent of contagion and risk is still undetermined, and there’s no testing going on, does it not seem selfish for one person’s impatience to disrupt everybody else around them?
I totally get the UK’s frustration with lockdown, but if we’d been quicker off the mark and much more rigorous enforcing it, shut our border, not allowing tourists up for Easter, stop royalty visiting and bring known infections to Scotland, and shut our airports to all but essential flights, then we’d have contained the spread and neutralised it.
Yes, the risk remains. A fire can rekindle from a Single spark. But if there is no infection apparent in an area, you can cautiously ease lockdown in that safe zone provided you have a cordon to keep new infection out of that safe zone. There is no point making a safe zone if you don’t install protection to keep it a safe zone.
These are the controls you saw in China and Korea; people tested everywhere, check points monitoring people for symptoms… Public washing and decontamination of streets… Have you seen ANY of that in the UK? No. Instead, someone with the disease can bring his entourage from one end of the UK to the other with total impunity… fucking up the lockdown for everybody.
Governor General Union Jack on BBC Radio Scotland GMS soon
@ K1
Well said, even now they can’t their story straight, contradictory stories all over the place.
What on earth happened in China overnight?
The global Corona Stats had been showing very
Few deaths per day but this morning it’s 1,290 deaths?
Is it a correction over a longer period or is it back to square one?
Blood tests to fly now, ready for the dystopian hell people?
WAKE THE F*CK UP!
Yes, lets believe China when we need our fear pr0n hit.
WAKE UP !!
Cognitive dissonance and complete lack of critical thinking is astonishing on this blog.
Im at the point of running now. Not sittingn here like a boiled frog watching you all ignore the obvious.
Golfnut says:
17 April, 2020 at 8:05 am
@ K1
Well said, even now they can’t their story straight, contradictory stories all over the place…
Aye, but really, there’s just one story.
The story of England keeping PPE for England alone is the same story of Scotland’s oil not benefitting Scotland. It’s the story of Rosyth’s successful tender for submarine refits being given to Devonport. It’s the same story of access to the ‘national’ grid.
It’s the same story that has blighted Scotland for as long as there’s been a Scotland. We have an insatiable parasite latched on to us, who puts a much lower value on a Scottish life as it does upon an English life, and gloats as it revels in a grotesque “Union” which is merely a fraud, bankrolled by purloined Scottish wealth. Scotland is expendable. It’s “no great mischief” if one of us falls.
Fkg SNP. What the fk are we waiting on the SNP for? What are they gonna do? Deafen us with silence and let the Weirdy Beardies set the agenda, as Nicola and her pals surreptitiously dismantle all that the SNP once stood for.
Enough. Get this new Indy Party rolling, and let us taking a battering ram Constitutional mandate all the way to the UN and Council of Europe. Yes, hold it in check while COV19 rages, but ONLY while COV19 rages.
Breaks
Well said.
@twathater at 2:12 am
Meet Pete.
https://twitter.com/Argyll_Angus/status/1250879750253535260
Breeks
The kill rate of the virus does not justify the response – Sweden and Belarus are taking a radically different approach and it is making little difference to spread – cat is out of the bag. I have no idea where this virus came from – nor care for that matter.
(I am assured that) every single newspaper today has the same front page ‘STAY AT HOME’
Maybe remove the virus as a reason for house arrest – just for a second if you have the capacity to do that – and look at it with fresh eyes.
Why would all the Governments of the World (well…..most) order their people to stay at home to spend time with their families AND pay them to do so?
Just think about that for a second.
(and end_imminent is barking up the wrong tree)
@Effijy,
`The central Chinese city of Wuhan has raised its number of COVID-19 fatalities by 1,290.
State media says the undercount had been due to the insufficient admission capabilities at overwhelmed medical facilities at the peak of the outbreak.`
I’ve seen it all now ! Carlaw has made an official complaint to the BBBC for being biased in favour of the SNP .
In the name of the wee man ! Is Carlaw completely off his tory trolley?
@The complete idiot said:
I seem to remember you trying to spread fear amongst our elderly
And the claims that I made re that a lot of elderly were catching the virus because untested people were being sent to convalesce, has since been proven to be correct.
BTW, if you care to look at my replies to CBB I wasn’t backing him up against you, I was commenting to him about sensibledave.
I won’t ask you to apologize as you don’t come across as someone who is man enough!
One presentation of the impact of CV19, as of yesterday, is as follows:
CV19 Deaths per Million Population:
Spain 402
Belgium 383
Italy 358
France 263
Uk 190
Sweden 119
USA 86
Iran 57
Denmark 53
Germany 45
Different countries are at different points since their first death due to CV19 and we know that deaths excelerate up to a peak – so these numbers are not directly comparable – perhaps until we see the results in 12 to 18 months time.
Nevertheless, I observe a difference between perceotion and reality – particularly in the case of the USA.
The Britnats are truly delusional, despite the fact the death rate from the virus in Scotland, using any figure available, is half England’s, they deny it. They claim it’s population size, easily disproved, then population density another delusion as Scotland’s central belt has a high density and many places with higher density than any city in England have lover death rates, finally they just lie and say it is the same percentage.
They want it to remain silent, it just doesn’t fit the Scotland is shit narrative. When these facts are represented you get Scottish journalists tweeting telling elected representatives to ‘zip it’, that’s our unbiased press in Scotland for you.
Not that I believe Scotland has done well in this, it has been a disaster also, tracking WM policy has put Scotland in the top ten of deaths/million, but still comparatively better than England.
Here’s some happyclappy people not caring about social distancing.
And lots of police not caring either
https://twitter.com/d_rafi1/status/1250864574984867856
jfngw 9:55 am
You wrote “The Britnats are truly delusional, despite the fact the death rate from the virus in Scotland, using any figure available, is half England’s, they deny it.”
You are just making stuff up again! Where has anyone denied it? Just for once, rather than shouting unsubstantiated piffle (lies!), how about you produce, you know, some actual evidence? You are like some vindictive little schoolgirl making up lies about their “friend”.
@sensibledave
There is no point comparing these numbers unless we can be certain they are all using the same measurement and we know they aren’t. Some use hospital only, some hide the numbers to stay low in the charts. The deaths per million in the UK is around 300 in reality.
Good morning ghetto dwelllers. Who is for the left and who is for the right?There is a morbid fascination over death on here perhaps because so many are in the winter of their lives Fear not death can only take us once .Let is pray Our Father. etc
@sensibledave
What can I say but fuck off wanker.
https://twitter.com/DougChapmanSNP/status/1250349046373298179
jfngw
I think I made it clear that the numbers are not directly comparable. I note, using all the insight and intelligence you can bring to bear, the only comment you have to make on all those numbers involving millions upon millions of people in Europe and the USA is, effectively … “the British are liars”. Doh!
What we might learn from this situation is that we require more than simple democracy we need a well informed democracy. Ignorance is no longer a citizens’ excuse. Keep informed, check and compare all data, do not assume the proclaimed experts are indeed expert.
Btw. That also applies to the purveyors of Scottish independence rhetoric.
jfngw 10:09 am
So again, you wrote “You wrote “The Britnats are truly delusional, despite the fact the death rate from the virus in Scotland, using any figure available, is half England’s, THEY deny it.”
You then post, as evidence of “THEY” some private citizen nut jobs somewhere.
I apologise jfngw, when you said “they”, I assumed you meant the government, or the press, or a professor, or something .. when by “they” – you actually meant some bloke down the pub.
Once again, Apologies.
jfngw
Better give up.
Sensible Dave has got you on toast, mate.
When your only riposte is a profanity, then you’ve lost.
Well, already the neoliberals at Westminster are looking for ways to recoup monies spent on battling Covid-19. The Social Market Foundation, (no doubt from Tufton street) is run by a Tory/Labour(Red Tory) and Lib/Dem think tank.
The first order of business for them is to recover money from the poor, and for them to draw up a proposal on how to remove the triple lock on state pensions. You can virtually hear the wheels of capitalism grind back into motion on ways to make the poorest in our society carry the heaviest burdens for the cost of this virus.
As Exercise Cygnus(2016), of which the stark warning were completely ignored by the English Tory government comes home to roost big time, and the incompetent xenophobic fool of a man Johnson recouperates after virtually self infecting himself.
We have one of the other stooges Matt Hancock attempt to shift the blame for the lack of PPE, which has caused the sad deaths of frontline staff, give a speech on how precious PPE actually is, and that it should not be wasted, thus attempting to shift the blame for the shortage of PPE onto the frontline NHS heroes, who’ve battled on bravely everyday whilst putting their lives and the lives of their families at risk.
So it any wonder then that England is probably looking at the highest death toll rate from the virus in Europe. Years of underfunding and backdoor privatisation of their NHS, has cost lives.
When this crisis, which has become a tragedy due to the British governments shoddy and inept handling of it finally abates, heads must roll.
The English government are desperately playing for time with their covid death reporting.
So obvious they are trying to get past peak death rates before they give the true figures including non hospital death rates.
They shall not be pitied as the tragic Red Zone that they are.
Even the Jeremy Hunt and the Health Select Committee are embarrassed.
Did anyone hear the First Minister being interviewed by Sarah Smith this morning on BBC R4?
The only good thing I can say about Sarah Smith is that she at Least let Nicola speak without too much interruption. Nicola was good, fluent, genuine answers.
Well worth a listen – Sarah introduces Nicola’s policies completely wrongly at the beginning which Nicola has to explain and correct and then in the final question she asks a completely political question of Nicola Sturgeon leader of the SNP.
Stunned moment’s silence before Nicola answers by nailing it on the head … That is an overtly political comment Sarah and I, as the First Minister of Scotland won’t rise to the bait. ( Words to that effect) so there’s no point in trying….
It was probably just after 8.10 this morning – not sure when exactly but it finished at 8.17 ( 8.19). Sarah Smith is a very poor radio presenter – so wooden.
She was teamed up with Nick ‘he-didn’t-answer-my-question’ Robinson for the programme. And I read upstream that Jackson Carlaw has complained that biased BBC is pro-SNP.
You couldnae make it up!
Mike Cassidy and Breeks,
I think it is hypocritical of you both to ridicule people who don’t believe that this lockdown is the best option we have.
Remember that you are both advocates of this lockdown so you should be willing and able to accept some of the responsibility for the ensuing deaths whether they are Covid 19 related or not, the same way we are all responsible for our decisions not to have a lockdown every winter flu season.
So really, I would like to know why you think we should disregard flu victims but not Covid 19 victims?
Is it just a question of numbers?
If so, at what number of deaths do we change from no lockdown to dispensing with civil liberties?
Is it a question of the amount of resources to cope with the virus?
If so, if given those extra resources, would more deaths be acceptable?
Why do you and others get to pour water on the idea that there are other options that may be better.
Mike Cassidy, I’ve read the links you posted as I am more than willing to take on as much information as possible, did you read the last link that I posted?
If so, what are your thoughts on it?
Here it is again
https://www.rt.com/op-ed/485876-covid-lockdown-kills-150000/
Now you don’t have to believe the numbers but I think it shows that you need to accept decisions don’t exist in isolation. There are consequences for those decisions.
When you fuck about with one side of an equation you would have to be wilfully brain dead to think it doesn’t affect the other side.
I think it is extremely unhelpful that you both feel it necessary to pontificate from your high horse and piss on others when you have shown you are not eager to countenance the concerns of others who don’t agree with you.
I’m not advocating that more people should die, I’m advocating that less people should die in the long run. This is a marathon not a sprint.
So just to be clear, I don’t know what the best option is but neither do you. We will all be gifted with 2020 hindsight when this virus is no longer a threat but using this model, we will have one almighty fucking mess to clean up that will be of our own making.
“Much fanfare has been made of the need to scale up Covid-19 testing. But the truth is: the country’s capacity to test for coronavirus is being wasted. Meanwhile, NHS workers are under-protected and under-tested.”
http://archive.is/TtP1A
So the truth is like social distancing (see Westminster Bridge last night versus overzealous policing of parks, beaches etc.) death statistics, ‘Nightingale Hospitals’ and now testing) we see stage managed Propaganda disseminated by the BBC and MSM.
This along with my post yesterday gives more damning evidence of UK Government failure.
Scottish Government can’t even make use of the shortfall as testing is being managed (like PPE distribution) by UK Government!!
Meanwhile we have the very mediocre tv presenter, though I can’t think of anything notable that he’s done, Ben Fogle, attempt to capitalise on the very goodwill of the public towards the NHS and the fabulous job its staff are doing by risking their lives to save others on a daily basis.
Fogle wants you and I to go outside on the Queens birthday, April 21st and sing from the bottom of our hearts happy birthday to her, bringing her great cheer.
Needless to say the insignificant and forgettable tv presenter, has been so far, rightly, and widely mocked and derided on social media.
Of course there will be the monarchists and acolytes of the greatest state sponger in UK history, who’ll doff their caps, kowtow, and applaud with much gusto, the Queen now hidden away in her ivory tower, without need or want of anything.
Yesterday’s 5 o’clock update had the cso, Sir Peter Bedsheet showing a death rate graph with 4 or 5 red zones including UK, plus South Korea.
The UK line was the only one which had(hospital deaths only).2 months in, and they don’t know how to count properly yet.
Even their most blinkered apologists will feel some discomfiture.
Not a chance.
Aye be fine if the english royal family dip into their vast wealth that they’ve accumulated over the centuries from the peasants, dip in maybe 3 Trillion and bale out england, maybe the other countries in the so called union might get some scraps, we’re all in it together as they said.
I would like to know why it’s safe for police and public to clap on a bridge together but not safe to sit in a park on your own .Any takers ? Come on you clever old folks . Instead of obsessing over numbers look at the inconsistencies in governments dealing with this crisis Are any of you interested at all , about untested workforce from Europe? Now no swearing and no avoiding anomalies in governments handling of this . And no more living,If you can call it that, in denial.Believe it or not I voted for independence and for Europe mainly because I try not to buy government line and of course believe countries should be Independent . What is pissing me off is how malleable some posters are here.I believe this site has done a lot of good for Independence.Dont be possesses of at trolling Why ? Because all ideas deserve to be challenged That’s called debate.Im not being ignored because I’m a troll.I am ignored because no one seems to have an answer to awkward questions. What price Independence for a people who hide from bogey men?
Thanks for the China stats update Scot.
Encouraging to see China admitting to errors and amending them.
Stupid Dave used outdated figures while defending his
Indefensible Empire.
Even with the major adjustment to China’s Death Stats
Their figures plus Iran plus Great Germany’s, all with greater
Populations and with more densely packed cities than the UK
Have a combined death total lower than Bungling Bojoland.
I think the first German death was a day after the UK’s but as they
Haven’t been chopping away health facilities, ignoring the trends from
Countries like Italy and not investing in testing equipment England is killing
4 people for every death in Great Germany.
The above is shocking on its own but add in the Tory cover up of all related
Deaths outside of hospitals and there should be an international trial here
For crimes against humanity.
Dippy Dave and Private Pete can bake them a cake with a file in the NAFFI.
Effigy Naffis no longer exist as far as I’m aware.
@Pete
The evidence is in the post but you being one of the Britnats I will just put you in the ‘they just lie’ camp.
Hi Dog biscuit.
From:-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navy,_Army_and_Air_Force_Institutes
“Today
NAAFI now operates out of bases in British Forces Germany, Brunei, Gibraltar, the South Atlantic Islands, and onboard HM Ships through the Naval Canteen Service (NCS).
In Germany it provides the supply of all catering, retail and leisure. This includes running the Officers and NCO’s Messes, providing the catering service as well as a number of retail outlets, coffee forums, bars and the sale of tax-free cars. “
Republicofscotland
We should think very carefully about that.
Maybe we could Empress Elizabeth aka “Purrin’ Betty” a
purr-fect birthday.
It is rather dangerous to attempt to make your way through life disconnected from reality (see Brexitania).
Full text.
Rationality versus reality: the challenges of evidence-based decision making for health policy makers
https://implementationscience.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1748-5908-5-39
Could someone please get this in front of the SNP leadership, as they have a legal duty to protect my human rights but don’t appeart to have a fucking clue about the law.
Reality and Public Policy
https://www.nationalaffairs.com/publications/detail/reality-and-public-policy
Hate to be a pain,
What is the name of Hancock’s company?
Or even the time of the posting, where someone wrote at length about it?
Thanks
@sensibledave
Well all governments do lie if they can get away with it, journalists don’t technically lie but present the evidence in a fashion that often they may as well lie. Here is the ‘zip it’ from a journo, dressed up as a opinion, although I suspect this post may disappear soon.
https://twitter.com/paulhutcheon/status/1250894024124313600
,
And as for academics, I think we have found many in the past that will adhere to a principle for selfish motives. I worked in a university for six years some time ago, it was disappointing to find that some people with PHD’s were just as childish and spiteful as everyone else.
I try not to refer to people as ‘nutters’, delusional is good enough for me, we all see things through our own prism.
Effigy
You wrote “stupid Dave used outdated figures”
I am starting to get the hang of you Effigy. When “they”!are lying to you, you mean one bloke in a pub. Now, when you say “outdated” you mean they are yesterday’s figures!!
For the figures for 17th April see: https://e-markets.nordea.com/#!/article/56973/corona-daily-update-donald-and-the-pacemakers
@Breastplate, 11.03
Good post.
As more research studies come out about the low mortality coronavirus (https://www.rt.com/news/486017-denmark-covid19-mortality-study/ ), about transmission (https://today.rtl.lu/news/science-and-environment/a/1498185.html), the question arises why house arrest for the whole of society and the removal of civil rights? Why have standard public health procedures (test, track, isolate) not been implemented? Why ask Imperial College to model the epidemic on incomplete data?
The imperial college Bill Gates collection. http://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=39&v=C3ldtVWKlQI&feature=emb_logo
What’s all the moaning about PPE first for England?
Scotland got the Poll Tax first and Scotland’s soldiers were usually the first to die in the Empire’s Wars.
So, the Union’s fair isn’t it?
Just heard Hancock say 11m PPE has been sent to Scotland is there any way we can confirm this.??
Naafi’s died a death decades ago when they let in the crooks and private enterprise thanks to MAGGIE. Crooks and thieves ran it into the ground and stripped it bare until around 2015 when there was nowt left.
@ Colonel Blimp IV – I was thinking of simmering some Peruvian bark in salt water but G & T would be good too. Probably there isn’t a drop of tonic left in the supermarkets by now and every tree in Peru has been stripped of its bark.
There’ll always be an England…
Scotland’s people can die.
They may take our lives by withholding our PPE but, they will never take our freedom. Well, until 1707.
I appreciate we need to understand covid better, but the first priority is its’ containment. An early let-up will just mean this problem is with us for much longer than it need be. That will cause more harm than continuing the lock-down until safe to lift it. Public health comes first, then human rights, then the economy.
Safeguarding human rights
in times of economic crisis
https://rm.coe.int/safeguarding-human-rights-in-times-of-economic-crisis-issue-paper-publ/1680908dfa
Brian Doonthetoon I’m sure glad you cleared that vital matter up.
CBB,
We left the containment stage a month ago, we are in the delay phase.
Do not listen to any figures coming out with a connection to Westminster.
What if the 11 Million bits of PPE kit where not sent
To Scotland?
Do you imagine someone will actually count them?
What if Scotland needs 20 million but of PPE Kit
Should the story be lives put at risk again as 8 million short?
What if they sent 5,5 million pairs of gloves and no aprons or masks?
Over how long a period were these items sent and what was the number requested?
What does Scotland require each week and what do we have in stock?
The Tories have very expensive educations and are very well versed in lying.
Breastplate
It would appear the Tories have gone “full retard” then.
Listening to Matt Hancock and he has to be the biggest lying bulkshitter in UK Politics.
Just perfect for the Boris Johnson Administration
EVERY word he utters is a lie.
If you keep hot housing the population the problem will be extended and more may be dying as a result. A wee message to SNP politicians you lot adopted draconian powers at too enthusiastically for my liking.I will be wiping my arse with my polling card should we ever be allowed to vote again you have destroyed what little democracy we had. Tartan Tories right enough it seems The worst of the seat warmers? Take your pick. Alec Salmond King of Scotland
Dorothy Devine says:
17 April, 2020 at 9:23 am
I’ve seen it all now ! Carlaw has made an official complaint to the BBBC for being biased in favour of the SNP .
In the name of the wee man ! Is Carlaw completely off his tory trolley?
There’s precedent for doing that. What’s his face, “bayonet the wounded” Ian Davidson did the same thing back in 2014 or thereabouts, claiming Isabel Fraser was biased when interviewing him. Isabel Fraser was actually reasonably competent and impartial, but we saw her removed from duty, and the BBC was free to bleat about ‘everybody’ accusing it of bias must mean it’s broadly getting the balance right.
Just another load of horseshit dumped on Scotland’s drive as part of the great indoctrination strategy at the BBC. People fell for it in 2014, but hopefully a smaller percentage will fall for it now.
You didn’t think the Tory and Labour MSP’s were there to actually do anything at Holyrood did you? They’re just diddies who are only there to channel BBC propaganda and manipulation; useful idiots to articulate the BBC’s shite and create the illusion their propaganda is deeply embedded in Scotland.
The purpose of the Union is to benefit England.
It always has been, it always will be.
Breastplate
I’ve not been paying much attention to timelines, tbh, as I’ve lost the habit of self-indoctrination through the media. 😉
Breastplate 12:31 pm
You write “CBB, … We left the containment stage a month ago, we are in the delay phase.”
Sometimes me ol’ boobysalver, I like to sit an admire a beautifully crafted, yet so simple, put down, slam dunk, of complete knob. Congratulations!
CBB is very learned and clever man don’t you know! Doh!
Project ‘lets scare the shit out of the punters’ gets existential.
https://www.itv.com/news/2020-04-17/newspaper-industry-helps-deliver-governments-stay-at-home-message/
“In politics, what begins in fear usually ends in folly.”
? Samuel Taylor Coleridge
Dave supports a party that brought us austerity and Brexit. Dave support a party that does not respect the first principle in law, DO NO HARM. Dave supports a party that is culpable of murder through policy.
How Civil Society Actors Responded to the Economic Crisis:
The Interaction of Material Deprivation and Perceptions of Political Opportunity Structures.
eprints.whiterose.ac.uk/97109/5/WRRO_97109.pdf
N. Ireland start to issue more data regarding deaths out with hospitals where corona virus has been the cause.
https://archive.is/G19EZ
CBB
… you need to give up Cammykins. You just keep making yourself look a complete tool. Even the home crowd are gently trying to tell you to stop making a fool of yourself (cue – Cammy cuts and pastes another irrelevant citation that nobody reads). Haha!
P.S. Brexit material deprives Scotland of access to the Natural Law. That’s despotic totalitarianism, that is.
Dave appears keen to deprive Scots of the Natural Rights, or else he would not have spent all these years telling us he knows better. Just because.
“Global Governance and the Public Domain: Collective
Goods in a ‘Post-Washington Consensus’ Era”
wrap.warwick.ac.uk/2078/1/WRAP_Higgott_wp4799.pdf
Sensibledave,
My reply to CBB was not an attempt at a put down merely a gentle reminder of where I believe we are, and as somebody I have shared a beer with I believe he will accept it as such.
Hancock was on PR before politics @ jackie says at 12:36 pm
Wish the both of you would just deprive this blog of this stupid circular dissembling pish and before either of you start in on me…just fuck off.
Long-serving Conservative MSPs will be forced to stand down from the Scottish Parliament at the next election if they fail to win a constituency seat, under radicals change introduced by Party Leader Jackson Carlaw to introduce fresh blood into the party
https://caltonjock.com/2019/12/16/jackson-carlaw-promised-to-end-the-unelected-20-year-holyrood-career-of-murdo-fraser-confirmation-the-gravy-train-has-been-derailed-expected-very-soon-jackson/
Breastplate
Totally. 😉
Beginning to warm to pierce morgan jist a wee wee,really wee bit!
lol
https://twitter.com/LesBlair53/status/1250705503023480832
Now we have the BBC lunchtime news programme, giving over airtime to Prince William and his wife, we had to listen to him waffle on about his father and how he was concerned about him with regards to the virus.
Of course this drain on the taxpayer didn’t mention his fathers reckless disregard for other peoples lives when he fled to Scotland bringing the virus with him to a small knit community. No his self centred father (a royal trait) ignored the guidelines that cost Catherine Calderwood her job inspite of knowning them.
There should be no place for these despicable sef serving parasites in an independent Scotland.
Despite what Matt Hancock says on the reporting of extra deaths due to Covid-19, there might be a fudge to hide the true extent of the deaths from the in England.
https://goodlawproject.org/covid-19-deaths/
So Alister Jack, on Good Morning Scotland, hinting that business will need to kickstart soon, because in the possible coming recession, if it doesn’t, those at the poorer end of society will end up in deep poverty.
Do I even need to point out the sheer hypocrisy of this Tory bastard. No? I didn’t think so.
I’ve got one Alister Jack. Is he happy Scotland has been stripped of legal identity for this pile of shite?
Austerity swung voters to Brexit – and now they are changing their minds
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2018/11/19/austerity-swung-voters-to-brexit-and-now-they-are-changing-their-minds/
Latest all BBC values for reported deaths today.
Scotland…….32………Total…..837
Wales……….32………Total…..495
N. Ireland…..18………Total…..176
England (no figure)…….Total..(no figure)
——————————————–
UK………….847……..Total….14576
FGS! Scotland fig was incorrect.
Latest all BBC values for reported deaths today.
Scotland…….58………Total…..837
Wales……….32………Total…..495
N. Ireland…..18………Total…..176
England (no figure)…….Total..(no figure)
——————————————–
UK………….847……..Total….14576
Colin Alexander
12.23
Why can’t the SNHS make its own contracts and buy it’s own PPE?
I thought it was independent?
I think you’ve got an inferiority complex, always wanting to be beholden to the big NHS.
Says the Trump fan. 🙂
There’s not a lot wrong with the Donald.
Another day of English/British nationalist incompetence. Another day closer to the end of the so-called united kingdom.
Trump and good judgement simply don’t belong in the same sentence, unless it points out Trump lacks of it.
Full text.
Individual differences in moral judgment competence influence
neural correlates of socio-normative judgments
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2569820/
Scotland could do with a big injection of this, IMHO.
Reasoning, cognitive control, and moral intuition
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fnint.2012.00114/full
Please read page 18 and stop debating about using your former rights to combat this assault. You are chattel. Wake up..
http://www.nommeraadio.ee/meedia/pdf/RRS/Rockefeller%20Foundation.pdf
As of today, India 1.3Bn people, 500 confirmed cases of CV 19.
Hurry up people, time is running out.
When do you become “non essential” ?
The fight against tyranny needs solid foundations. Our media would deprive us of the mental capacity to defend our biological integrity, and freedom to determine our own futures. That’s not right.
https://thepsychologist.bps.org.uk/volume-26/edition-3/how-power-affects-brain
Our new dystopian hellscape in video. Police building databases of the “quarantined” and the screws tightening ever more.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZphK_CMUbKg
Disappointed you people are buying the MSM garbage wholesale.
Sturgeon is a fully paid up member of the CFR. You know, Henry Kissinger and the like….
@ Dan 9.01am it certainly looks as though it has the same thought capacity as Pete but I don’t know if he walks upright
Pete says:
“Why can’t the SNHS make its own contracts and buy it’s own PPE”
The England/UK paradigm.
English based suppliers supplying to UK customers were told by English authorities who were concerned about potential shortages, to supply only English Healthcare organisations (i.e. Not the Wogs).
For all we know, they may not have been deliberately far less maliciously trying to disadvantage the Second Class Britishers.
We just failed to show up on their radar and became collateral damage … No doubt yet another casual infringement of the Treaty of Union, to add to a very long list.
Col Blimp
Maybe we didn’t have the same firm contracts in place as the English NHS?
I just don’t know. Neither do you.
Why didn’t the Scottish authorities demand the same?
My point is that – you want independence, here is an area where you have independence, yet you moan when it doesn’t work out for you.
Pathetic!
Cammy 1.34
… Haha! knew that you couldn’t stop yourself!
Pete says:
17 April, 2020 at 4:06 pm
Col Blimp
Maybe we didn’t have the same firm contracts in place as the English NHS?
I just don’t know. Neither do you.
Why didn’t the Scottish authorities demand the same?
Err – because Yoons constantly bleat about pooling and sharing and being Better Together?
Because May centralised UK NHS procurement under PHE?
Pete. You are right. The Scottish Government should have known what they were dealing with and all this Privy Councillor cosiness made them forget exactly what they were dealing with. They are dealing with a self centred shower of bastards who have asset stripped Scotland for years.
Now Pete you Scots hating fellow all I can say to you is ”Off you pop! Me old matey”
This might be what peak-flow looks like. It might not be though. Scotland has reached peak-flow, as Brexitania is highly unlikely to support our potential as a nation. 😉
Full text.
What does principled versus conventional moral reasoning convey to others about the politics and psychology of the reasoner?
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1002/%28SICI%291099-0992%28199906%2929%3A4%3C455%3A%3AAID-EJSP937%3E3.0.CO%3B2-1
Dave really is a knuckle-dragger.
If callmedaves figures are correct @2.40pm, then subtracting their total from the overall, total should gives us Englands total.
Which I think is 13,518.
Pete says:
“Maybe WE didn’t have the same firm contracts in place as the English NHS?”
and
“…here is an area where YOU have independence, yet you moan when it doesn’t work out for you.
Pathetic!”
I was aware that “House Jocks” are of the opinion that it is possible to be Scottish and YooKayish simultaneously, but had no idea that they could switch between one and the other so quickly, whenever they think the grass is greener on the other side of the border.
What a despicable bunch of slimy chancers they are.
Massive thanks to all the members of the English Royal Family,who in this time of crisis, have decided to follow the Swedish Princess and actually do an “honest shift” for the free house, jewels etc.
Feel the love man.
Oh Aye, LBC promoting some new TV appliance, its called BritBox, I had a wee look on the internet, they should have called it Shitbox, the gullible paying yet again for repeats they have already paid for with the licence.
Proud to be a wukfit ?
For the hard of reading like Pete.
The not-England parts of the UK had appropriate supply chains.
Until Public Health England changed the chains from UKwide to England only.
Imagine if the Scottish or Welsh Health Services had told those suppliers to prioritise Scotland or Wales.
But at least they know now they can’t depend on a ‘better together policy dictated by England.
PPE supplier confirms England only policy for care homes
The statement claims that only three out of 2000 products are restricted for use in England. Those three products are, however, coronavirus protective masks, gloves and aprons.
http://archive.is/sDKHU
The UK government on Friday (today) announced a £10m fund to shield England’s fishing and aquaculture sectors from the impacts of coronavirus.
More than 1,000 fishing and aquaculture businesses in England will receive £9m in direct cash grants through a new fisheries support scheme, the government said, noting that the supports were designed to assist the sector with its “immediate needs” during the crisis.
The government also said that a further £1m would be made available to support projects to assist fishermen to sell their catch in their local communities during the pandemic.
The move, it said, would enable them to find new markets and support communities that depend on the fisheries industry.
—————————————————————–
News where we are:
The first minister outlines extra measures to help the fishing industry, noting that “clearly the market for seafood and shellfish has effectively collapsed” which is having a “very serious and immediate impact on coastal and island communities”.
The government is allocating a further £3.5m of support for fishing vessels of over 12 metres, Ms Sturgeon says.
Have been impressed by the candidness and honesty of the New York State governor Andrew Cuomo over the past weeks . He strikes me as being genuinely trying desperately to do the best he can , and he doesn’t shy away from criticism of DT and the Federal Government .
Republic of Scotland…..22,500 deaths from covid19 in England
Yes the figure for England ids about 13500
But that is only covid19 deaths in hospital
It does not include people who have died outside of hospital
Scotland’s national records office states that in Scotland 62% of covid19 deaths have been n hospitals
25% In care homes
13
13% at home etc
If you apply that to England
13500 died from covid19 in hospital only
If 13500 is 62%
And you add the other 38% who have died in care homes and elsewhere
Then 100% is about 22500
So the real figure of covid19 deaths in England is about 22500
Lets be honest ever since the union Scotland’s been treated like mugs and the result of the 2014 ref proved that they are mugs I’m sorry to say that but facts are facts even the ones we don’t like people in the past died for freedom we were given the chance to have it in a vote and rejected it we can post and blog all we like about old treaties history etc., but that will not gain us our freedom it just proves our frustrations no England will never let you go you are their cash cow but we only have ourselves to blame no one else and that’s another unpleasant fact but if we can form a new party we may be able to rise and be a nation again ???
Blair Paterson
It’s not in the slightest kind or rational to blame a largely politically uneducated population to make good political judgements, especially when HMG civil service and the yoonstream combine forces to distort the TRUTH and TERRORISE the elderly.
Sky news reporting this afternoon Critical shortage of PPE in areas of England and Staff being asked to reuse items . Now we know why an attempt was made to divert supplies destined for Scotland .
Sorry….for not being able to make….
@ Capella at 9.42 pm 16th: you are right about the MSM not being on our side in a campaign, and that our strength is with stalls, events etc etc which can’t be done in lockdown. And also that postal votes are dodgy.
However, I think that it is vital we try to regain Scotland’s independence now, not wait for the 2021 Holyrood election. So I am trying to think of how a vote could be managed under the current conditions. I am desperate to escape the appalling dictatorship of the UK system so am willing to have a less than ideal campaign.
The end of the beginning?
Early peek at data on Gilead coronavirus drug suggests patients are responding to treatment
http://archive.is/BMg5q
“Aye gowns are tight in England”. says Tory earlier today..
forget who.
N. Ireland sent some to England, reported 2 days ago.
Maybe that’s the 55,000 they are expecting today.
That’s not a lot spread over say, the London area.
Squeaky bum time darn Sarf!
Also heard (radio) ‘out of hospital’ deaths in England from the virus is getting to near 50% of the ‘in hospital’ deaths.
Terence Callahan@5.18pm.
Thanks for that I suspected the deaths were higher than that figure of 13,508. My 2.10pm links indicates that doctors are being given leeway to pronounce death causes on death certificates in England as other than Covid-19, possibly to keep the figures from skyrocketing even higher South of the border.
I’m certainly no pharmacologist, I’m just a bit of a critical thinker and know a bit about public health. I’m still not claiming I’m an expert. This might prove instructive though.
Adverse Event Detection in Drug Development: Recommendations and Obligations Beyond Phase 3
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2446471/
Does Chris Grayling have a second job working for Trump?
The Trump administration paid a bankrupt company with zero employees $55 million for N95 masks, which it’s never manufactured
http://archive.is/KqMui
This is what you get when you apply “critical realism” to a limited knowledge of public health.
Full text.
The Healthy Homes and Neighbourhoods integrated health and social care initiative
A Critical Realist Translational Social Epidemiology Protocol for Concretising and Contextualising a “Theory of Neighbourhood Context, Stress, Depression, and the Developmental Origins of Health and Disease
https://www.ijic.org/articles/10.5334/ijic.3962/
doh!
….(DOHaD)”
Was listening to the 5 o’clock address for the dumb plebs.
That ever so posh English person Alok Sharma spent 10 minutes talking about getting a vaccine as if England was going to have the solution to all this lol.
He forgot to say they don’t even have enough paper gowns for doctors, so they’re telling doctors/nurses to reuse old dirty contaminated ones.
But they’re going to get a vaccine.
Are ye, aye?
What a posh low life bag of wind.
Further to discussion on Covid-19: Are chloroquine and Hydroxychloroquine really game-changers? from York Cardiology.
I often listen to his talks and he’s a consultant cardiologist so should know what he’s talking about (unlike Donald Trump).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pfd8OUPGVC0
Chris’ cartoon is genius.
The disparity in Policing is ridiculous.
Tactical Support Group dude tells a journalist in a sparsely populated area to “Go home, you’re killing people”.
Yet the Met Police Chief was clapping along with the crowds of police and public on the bridge.
https://twitter.com/Jeggit/status/1251147578734899200
If only. 🙁
The New Legal Realist Approach to International Law
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/leiden-journal-of-international-law/article/new-legal-realist-approach-to-international-law/74E6552AF5B049B5EE40FFB8192DD4E4
Capella,
Yeah watched the video. Ta. Covered the studies which I think were in the WUWT link I posted. He seemed to miss out the link between the chloroquine opening the path for zinc to attack/ disable the virus. And yes although there can be long term side effects in some people, the use for covid would be short term, so I feel like it is a bit of trying to dampen down any idea that it might be useful- perhaps to avoid people taking it in a non clinical setting. However it being a prescription drug, we’re not going to get our hands on it anyway…
An anecdote- a friends mother in London. Her doctor tried to prescribe her some weeks ago, long before Trump mentioned it. Couldn’t get it anywhere. I wonder if it has been stockpiled? From the article I posted it mentioned the UK govt had banned any export of it on 20th Feb.
Alan Mackintosh,
Yes, Hydroxychloroquine is scarce at the moment, especially in France where I read an article somewhere that the entire stockpile had vanished.
I don’t know how true that is though.
After 3 months of cover up Sky News has tonight started drip feed the likely source of the virus.
An accidental escape from the Wuhan Level 4 security biolab.
Something I suggested was a possibility months ago.
We will never know for sure, but the possible link should have been explored/aired by msm ‘journalists’ months ago.
Just catching up with the Rev’s twitter – John Nicolson has done himself no favours at all.
For those who don’t know he was promoting a film about young trans person made as it turns out by the awful Sleeze. He was criticized for not addressing the role of that person in contributing to the toxicity of the GRA debate and asked some pertinent questions. He chose instead to quote tweet the Rev’s answer and use this invite him on to his radio show to confront a grand dame of the trans movement, Jan Morris, who is 91.
It looked like he had hoped to achieve a gotcha moment by not asking Stu directly and then saying he had given him an opportunity to give his view but didn’t get an answer. He also appeared to try to engineer a confrontation whereby a sweet old national treasure is ‘denied their existence’ by a nasty person.
What was most illuminating was the victimhood he then retreated into and his utter refusal to answer the many legitimate points put to him by women. Instead he cherry picked the men to engage with and also diverted and obfuscated, picking on someone who used a pseudonym – a technique often used by Pete Wishart. He then had a conversation in morally superior tones with the requisite Trans Ally about how terrible the answers were.
https://twitter.com/JUProctor/status/1250898272778149888
There was no abuse whatsoever, only frustrated questions from women with whom he refused to engage with or answer. Another one who it seems is nothing but a self serving disappointment.
@ Alan Macintosh – the link you posted yesterday reported the strange disappearance of these drugs in France. Pepe Escobar suggests that the elite are stockpiling for their own use. Wouldn’t surprise me, although Chloroquine is supposed to be cheap and easily produced.
https://asiatimes.com/2020/03/why-france-is-hiding-a-cheap-and-tested-virus-cure/?fbclid=IwAR1sEHnCk1cW3MCFXilBM1Qr8_QoGFTfQnfn0RtYOTZcgtUmY_RPRZ6-tFQ
But you’re right, he didn’t mention the zinc. Checks vitamin supplement – ooh yes, there’s zinc in it. One a day to be taken with G & T.
It would be strange if the only thing the Westminster government are competent at is hoarding everything for themselves that’s necessary to survive a pandemic.
SilverDarling
John Nicolson appears to be ignorant of the natural order of things. That is more than a bit alarming and points to why the SNP are unable to defend our human rights from Brexit.
You can’t take rights away from women to give men more rights. That’s pure misogyny. From a critical realist perspective, sex-based rights are only ethical if the claimant is of the appropriate biological sex. Men and women have different sexual epistemology (life stories).
Why we need critical realism in the sex and gender debate
https://fairplayforwomen.com/critical_realism/
P.S. Scotland and England have different social epistemology.
To Meg Merrilees. I did hear the Sarah Smith interview and I thought her closing remark to the FM crass and totally inappropriate at this time. Fair to say Nicola put her firmly back in her box.
If the SNP does not clear the dross from the party, Scotland is going nowhere.
Integrating critical realist and feminist methodologies:
ethical and analytical dilemmas
https://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/42539759.pdf
@CBB
That is what is so disappointing – the refusal to try to understand why some women and men have a problem with self identity.
The constant reducing of the arguments to discrimination against Trans people and equating s28 legislation with this proposed GRA legislation are disingenuous and false.
The points put forward were so eloquent and they were trying to engage but he just could not or more likely, would not.
CBB
I do agree with you about Nicholson.
The SNP seem to have a propensity for promoting dodgy old queers.
Clear them out.
And Pete’s not a bigot?
Is there any escape from the Chris Grayling Factor.
U.K. Paid $20 Million for New Coronavirus Tests. They Didn’t Work.
“You can’t lift the lockdown as long as you are not testing massively,” said Nicolas Locker, a professor of virology at the University of Surrey. “As long as the government is not testing in the community, we are going to be on lockdown.”
http://archive.is/ss0we
Re: the independence of the Scottish NHS (SNHS).
Babies are tested at birth or soon after for certain genetic and other conditions. There is improved post-birth genetic testing, so a certain genetic condition can be identified immediately and health support can be given to the babies involved, rather than support weeks, months or years later because the physical symptoms of the genetic condition are numerous and varied and not always immediately evident.
The supposedly independent SNHS wouldn’t introduce the test unless the English NHS advisory panel recommended it.
One for Pete to critique.
https://marksimonfrankland.blogspot.com/2020/04/my-open-letter-to-nicola-sturgeon-maybe.html
Just to make it absolutely clear, I don’t judge folk by their sexuality. Trans is a sexuality. Biological sex is not the same as gender (sexuality). It is vital they are not misrepresented, as in the proposed reforms, which made no logical linguistic sense.
Justice is not possible if the law is detached from empirical reality.
SEX AND GENDER: A CRITICAL REALIST APPROACH
citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.511.8478&rep=rep1&type=pdf
@ Cameron B Brodie
Trans is not a sexuality.
Is that what you meant to write?
(Knowing my luck, you’ll have corrected it before this post appears!)
I see the wannabe chuckle brothers are still in tandem with bell end in a supporting role are going strong as people keep feeding them. Starvation works better.
Thanks Capella,
that was indeed the article I read, I couldn’t remember where I read it but it was very interesting.
crazycat
I didn’t make a mistake this time, that’s what I meant to write. You suggest trans is not a sexuality. If at all possible do so so briefly, care to outline your reasoning? I would hate to confuse the debate. 😉
Dan
I enjoyed reading Mark’s blog.
Really interesting chap whose heart is in the right place.
As you would imagine his ideas are all a bit impracticable but I loved him reminding us of the ‘Scottish Enlightenment ‘ when Scottish education was the envy of the world.
That’s where we should be investing and as a grandparent it is so sad to see how far our education system has slipped. So many subjects are not available and the general standard is just so mediocre.
I have youngsters at state schools and also at private schools and the difference is immense and it should not be.
This is not political as the decline has been going on for years but it needs addressing quickly.
Just a couple of the multitude of matters requiring consideration depending on how and when things play out.
https://twitter.com/joannaccherry/status/1250707172553523202
https://twitter.com/GrayInGlasgow/status/1250793459029618689
Dan @ 8.52
That is the most inspired piece of outside of the box thinking than has been thunk in a long time.
The world deserves to hear more of the Frankland Solution.
“…I believe there must now be historic windfall tax.
A 90% windfall tax on all offshore wealth.
A windfall tax to bring in $27 trillion dollars: more than enough to cover all the bills of the nightmare we are living through. And before we shed tears for those who will be picking up the Covid tab, then we should remember they will still have $3 trillion dollars to keep them in the style they have become so very accustomed to.
And believe me, no matter how many super yachts and Gulfstreams they buy, it will still be utterly impossible for them to spend $3 trillion even if they all live to be 500 years old…”
//www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pl6QzovB-38
Re the hydroxychloroquine question
Its widely prescribed for people who have lupus as the anti malarial benefits of it suppress lupus flares. Now there’s more developed drug treatments for malaria it’s not used much there now. It has some downsides though and won’t be prescribed willy nilly. Whether it would benefit coronavirus, who knows?
Trump better not steal all the stocks the arse! I need it daily.
Colin Alexander @8:51
The supposedly independent SNHS wouldn’t introduce the test unless the English NHS advisory panel recommended it.
That’s not quite how the system works. The reviews to test for conditions are made by the National Screening Committee. When a condition comes up for review (approx. every 3 years) first an external review is made by somebody with expertise. The it is opened to consultation by all the interested parties. Typically are the charities, the large medical institutions and anybody else who registered an interest. These are UK wide. Once all the comments are in a formal review is made and a final decision is published.
The National Screening Committee is ostensibly run out of Public Health England. This is probably for logistical reasons since it’s a branch of the government and by virtue of the fact that England being the largest country also has the greatest number of people and institutions involved. So it’s not really nation driven rather than population driven – more people equals more experts.
The health services of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland could make their own assessments and recommendations but generally they follow the decisions of the National Screening Committee because all the big players are involved and there’s no point in doing something twice and getting the same result.
Hi Colin Alexander.
It’s NHSS. Officially.
https://wingsoverscotland.com/going-walkabout/comment-page-3/#comment-2525553
On hydroxychloroquine you might be interested in the following:
No evidence of clinical efficacy of hydroxychloroquine in patients hospitalized for COVID-19 infection with oxygen requirement: results of a study using routinely collected data to emulate a target trial
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.10.20060699v1
I don’t want to appear dogmatic, but I believe there is a natural world outside my consciousness, and that world has basic natural rules. The human species is characterised by having two biological sexes, male and female. We retain these sexes our entire lives. Anyone suggesting other is spouting anti-foundational ideology, and there judgement MUST be rejected as being without scientific or legal foundations.
The SNP really need to consider if they should continue to allow membership to those who deny liberal science. It’s just as well the FM hasn’t openly stated her position, eh?
https://www.ssoar.info/ssoar/bitstream/handle/document/22522/ssoar-eurjwomstud-2006-4-assiter-book_review_sex_and_ontology.pdf?sequence=1&isAllowed=y&lnkname=ssoar-eurjwomstud-2006-4-assiter-book_review_sex_and_ontology.pdf
Pete wrote on 17 April, 2020 at 8:36 pm
“CBB I do agree with you about Nicholson. The SNP seem to have a propensity for promoting dodgy old queers. Clear them out.”
I don’t like Nicholson but not for the bigoted hate-filled Britnat bile you spout. Why don’t you take your nasty bitter fuckwit mentality to Conservative Hame or some other dead Britnat site where it belongs? You and your retarded thought processes are not welcome here.
Looking at these threads recently it’s becoming horrendous with the same half-dozen or so c@nts hardly letting anyone else get a conversation going. Why not let others have a chance and take all your trollfests over to ‘Off topic’?
Better still, would be great to see ‘The Rev’ giving the site a dose of disinfectant.
CameronB Brodie
There could be a grain of truth in there.
It would appear from the stats below that only two of the many genders succumb to the coronavirus.
Another explanation might be that there are only two genders.
https://www.statista.com/chart/21345/coronavirus-deaths-by-gender/
Brian Doonthetoon
Cheers for highlighting the official title of the Scottish NHS is:
NHS Scotland or NHSS.
I didn’t mean to give the impression I was using the official name.
Hi Colin Alexander.
8=)
@ Pete
It’s very fortunate his heart is in the right place or there would be many going hungry without the food parcels his charity distributes.
It’s difficult for childeren and adults to get a decent education when their energies are concentrated on just getting by.
You will be well aware of the rich and diverse range of resources Scotland has.
It’s been said Scotland could potentially be up near the top in the list of wealthy nations of the world.
Yet as we are still in a political union with all significant powers reserved to Westminster where we are outvoted by 10 to 1, we still cannot properly address the significant poverty with the knock on social problems that creates.
You have aired your concerns about the economy being damaged with this lurgy, well that was the very same economy that was run in a way that facilitated this ongoing austerity and inequality.
How would you suggest we tweak things to turn things around and ensure there is adequate finance invested in our education establishments?
You dismiss Mark’s suggestion of a windfall tax. So what about concepts like Annual Ground Rent (AGR) for Scotland floated by Graeme McCormack as a revenue raising tool to finance Public Services?
Land can’t be hidden away in tax havens so such a concept reduces the ability for folk to avoid paying tax, which is after all just our own personal subscription to living in a civilised society.
Graeme evolved his initial figures to incoporate a universal basic income for all citizens which was higher than current unemployment or State pension amounts.
The slick thing about such a system is it can be tweaked annually to adjust for demographic imbalances of past years, where for example issues such as birth rate drops mean less young workers paying taxes to cover lots of older retired folk’s pensions and healthcare costs.
Col.Blimp IV
I just wish publications weren’t so prudish, though you do need to take account of cultural sensibilities. Not all folk can cope with reading about “sex”, so sex is often refereed to as “gender” in journals and such. This is the sort of linguist ambiguity the trans-activists are trying to exploit.
I’m sure the run-of-the-mill trans-activist hold views they feel to be progressive. Unfortunately, transgenderism cements sexist cultural stereotypes, and reinforces patriarchal misogyny.
I’m pretty sure anyone with a critical training in science and law will confirm this. Apparently there are none in the SNP, or none who can get their voices heard. This suggest ideological capture of the party. An ideology that is highly compatible with contemporary British constitutionalism, both being anti-foundational in nature.
@ Cameron B Brodie
Sorry, I was diverted and so am late answering you.
Sexuality is about sexual attraction and can be same sex, opposite sex, both, or neither.
Trans is about wanting to be (or to be perceived as), or believing oneself to actually be, the opposite sex to what one really is (biological sex is immutable). Trans persons can be sexually attracted to people of their own biological sex, to the opposite biological sex, to both, or even neither. It isn’t their trans status that determines that, though it could determine how they described themselves (“trans lesbian”, for instance).
Knowing someone is trans tells you nothing at all about that person’s sexuality. That requires additional knowledge.
Therefore, trans is not a sexuality.
@ CBB
ps – lumping the T in with the LGB, as Stonewall et al. have done, is a major factor in all the trouble this has caused. That’s why the LGB Alliance, which includes some of the original founders of Stonewall, have set up separately.
Right now I can’t find a reference to cite, but they (LGB Alliance) agree with me, not you.
crazycat
We’re on the same team and I’m not sure this is the right place to split hairs.
The Contradictions of Love
Towards a feminist-realist ontology of sociosexuality
https://www.routledge.com/The-Contradictions-of-Love-Towards-a-feminist-realist-ontology-of-sociosexuality/Gunnarsson/p/book/9780415824118
Dan
Look, I’m at the age where all my preconceptions are up in the air.
I’m open to any new ideas which make the country a fairer place.
This AGR, I have heard of it but haven’t really looked into it so maybe I will.
I certainly disagree with so much wealth being in the hands of a tiny few but, on the other hand, where would we be without the Bill Gates and Jeff Bezos of this world. In a socialist environment they would never have been able to take off and I am always worried that we stifle enterprise.
I’m delighted that we have billionaires as long as they pay reasonable amounts of tax which cascade downwards for the general good.
Perversely, during this pandemic, Bezos is becoming even wealthier as everyone is buying stuff from Amazon.
On the other hand I’ve been to the ultimate communist state, Cuba, and it’s not a pretty sight despite there being a few worthy aspects.
So, it’s very difficult and I think I’ll go back to watching Elvis on BBC4.
I forgot the to sign off. 😉
Stuart McKay
Ta for the feedback. For anyone’s interest:
Newborn blood spot screening in Scotland:
“The programme screens for the following conditions:
phenylketonuria (PKU)
congenital hypothyroidism (CHT)
cystic fibrosis (CF)
medium chain acyl-CoA dehydrogenase deficiency (MCADD)
sickle cell disorder (SCD)
maple syrup urine disease (MSUD)
isovaleric acidaemia (IVA)
glutaric aciduria type 1 (GA1)
homocystinuria (HCU)”
That’s nine conditions, if I counted right.
———————————
Similarly: “Babies born in Ireland with several rare diseases are losing out on early diagnosis because only eight conditions are tested for in the “heel-prick test”.
Rare Diseases Ireland said the health service is lagging behind other European countries where the average number of diseases screened for at birth is 20, while in the United States it is as many as 50″.
—————————————-
Which raises the question: why isn’t Scotland (and Ireland) meeting the European average or USA lead, rather than waiting for the decision to be made under the UK body?
I guess, because health services here are underfunded so penny-pinch wherever they can, despite it being a false economy in the longer term.
@ Stuart Mackay.
There is more to it than that. The assessment is separate to the decision on whether the drug or treatment is used. The assessment also gives advice on the value of the treatment, i.e. is it cost effective, each health service makes the decision whether or not their respective boards or Trusts can make use of the drug or Treatment. Which is why some drugs / treatments are available in Scotland but not in England and vice versa of course.
Pete, at least Cuba is hanging in there. I was in Romania after Nicolae Ceau?escu was removed. A failed State is really something to behold.
We were delivering aid to the struggling hospitals and orphanages. I still wonder what became of all the hundreds of abandoned boys. Some were fit and healthy, others so damaged they just sat rocking in their own piss due to the psychological trauma they had endured.
Right, am aff, but nae BBC for me, Ozark awaits.
WO/2020/060606
patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/detail.jsf?docId=WO2020060606
That would be the patent number for Microsoft’s cryptocurrency system of the beast. You are assigned a task, you do the work, you get the credits.
Welcome to the New World Order 2020 courtesy of the beast 666.
@ CBB
Oh, aye, we’re definitely on the same team.
Hope it won’t be long before we can discuss it face to face.
(You’re still wrong, though.)
🙂 🙂
Dan, I think Cuba sent medics to Spain and Italy to help fight Covid 19.
crazycat
We’ll need to determine that properly. 😉
crazycat
I couldn’t help myself, I’ve not felt this radical since I was in my twenties. 🙂
This is the sort of knowledge trans-activists are trying to expunge from academia. Trans-ideology is attractive to both the hard-left and hard-right perspectives, as it is amenable to totalitarianism. Most who support it don’t understand it, and are victims to the effects of “pluralistic ignorance.
The SNP must urgently do all they can to eradicate anti-foundational tendencies from within the party. It is only bolstering ineffective legal strategy.
https://sas-space.sas.ac.uk/5805/1/Rosemary_Auchmuty_Feminist_approaches_to_sexuality_and_law_scholars_LIM.pdf
dakk, yes if Sky is dripping that story into the mediastream it is playing into the narrative of Chy-na bad. This virus appears to be modifed, both from the Czech lad which ran the genome and from others who suggested it had elements of HIV inserted into it. The question is who. Intriguing stories coming out regarding strange pneumonias affecting care homes in Virginia last July, and strange vaping deaths last autumn in US.
https://www.mcknights.com/news/mystery-grows-as-3rd-resident-dies-from-still-unidentified-respiratory-illness/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmL7okhbVzU&feature=youtu.be
Stuart Mackay, Yes I read that link. Is that a study? Or did they just take data and do some number crunching. What stands out is that zinc was not included in the trial. My understanding is that the chlorquine acts to open the pathway for zinc to enter the virus and disrupt the replication, so the need for both elements to be present. It begs the question if there was no efficacy, then where has all the chloroquine gone…?
@Breastplate
So that’ll be Cuba Gooding! Boom tish
Here’s hoping those folk in the white jaikets can do more good than those in the white helmets…
@StuartMackay, 9.57
Professor Didier Raoult has completed a further study of the efficacy of HCQ_AZ in treating COVID-19. The cohort size was 1061. https://www.mediterranee-infection.com/early-treatment-of-1061-covid-19-patients-with-hydroxychloroquine-and-azithromycin-marseille-france/
The conclusion was
“The HCQ-AZ combination, when started immediately after diagnosis, is a safe and efficient treatment for COVID-19, with a mortality rate of 0.5%, in elderly patients. It avoids worsening and clears virus persistence and contagiosity in most cases.”
Professor Raoult has always emphasised that intervention has to be early in the disease process for HCQ-AZ to have maximum effect , as does Dr Zelenko http://archive.is/iBZFZ .
We all happy with this?
off-guardian.org/2020/04/17/coronavirus-lockdown-and-what-you-are-not-being-told-part-1/
Re: Deaths in old folks homes,
I had commented some time ago about the deaths of olf folk in English care homes and wondered if the Scottish government was doing things differently.
It is now being reported that there may have been ‘more than 7500 deaths’ in England (although that figure might be for the whole of the UK)
It is comforting that when asked about care homes Nicola Sturgeon mentioned the following measures have been implemented in Scotland:
1. if people show any symptoms, they are tested before they are admitted into a home.
2. Even if they do not show symptoms, all residents are isolated at this time and are eating alone/not gathering together in the ‘common room’ etc.
3. No OAP’s are being transfered from a hospital directly into a care home.
Why doesn’t Westminster have measures like this in place?
Two things have now become glaringly obvious in recent weeks regarding government ministers in the English Tory government.
Firstly, despite all their pretence, it is clear, that in reality, they are still following the nonsensical ‘herd immunity’ and ‘let them die’ policy they originally stated.
Secondly, it has become very clear, just how inept the entire English Tory cabinet is. For decades, possibly longer, Government ministers in Westminster have been used to focussing on soundbites for ‘journalists’, without really doing anything. Matters generally are run by the civil service in London. That is why so many bad decisions have been made from London, that is why they have squandered (and continue to squander) so much taxpayers money.
Tory minister have literally been riding one big long jolly for decades. No hard work involved, the minions do it for them. They do not have their eye on their cabinet brief.
Now, suddenly, in time of crisis, they are shown up for their incompetence and lack of ability. This is why we have PPE equipment suppliers literally begging for somebody to take their equipment and NOBODY in Westminster even remotely aware of it. This is why good policy after good policy is being ignored, despite experts from the NHS literally screaming at them to do something. They are inept. Really, really inept, and now being forced to actually do REAL work, sorting things out, they are found wanting. Actually doing a full days work is alien to them.
This runs to the core of everything that is wrong in Westminster. The people of Scotland deserve better, and YES, the people of England deserve better.
I firmly believe the likes of Hancock, Gove and De Pfeffle Johnson are all equally liable for many unnecessary deaths in this crisis. Good people, nurses, doctors and carers, killed by this gross wanton negligence by these Tory English cabinet minsters.
The tame media however, will give them an easy ride, it will all be brushed under the carpet. ‘No scandal to see here’. No goverment minister will be held to account. Dominic ‘let them die’ Cummings certainly won’t be.
Yet no matter how this will be dressed up, the simple fact remains, these useless, incompetent cabinet ministers are completely and wholly culpable.
End_Imminent
you seem keen, now that most people will have moved over to giant forehead, why not take a very close look at Chris picture – seek and ye shall find.
Thoroughly sensible words Crazycat, and I wish the SNP would heed them. 2 sexes only.
@ Susan at 9.32
Thanks.
@ Robert Louis at 7.57
Not for the first time, I agree with you absolutely.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/pandora/baron-zebedee-should-have-a-spring-in-his-step-433201.html