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Wings Over Scotland

British news in British numbers

Posted on August 18, 2017 by

Number of references to “UK”, “Britain” or “British” in this story about salmon: 17

Number of references to “Scotland” or “Scottish”: 1 (in a quote)

Percentage of “UK” salmon industry that’s actually in Scotland: 96.3%

(Of the UK’s top 10 food and drink exports listed in the article, around 45% of the total value comes from whisky and salmon alone. Scottish-produced gin adds another 3%. The mystery of why the UK government doesn’t want to let Scotland go deepens.)


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    1. Chick McGregor says:

      Ignoring the trolls, whether mole, closet or overt, is OK for us old hands, but less frequent or new visitors could well leave this site with the wrong impression entirely.

      That is what concerns me.

    2. heedtracker says:

      Colin Alexander says:
      20 August, 2017 at 12:13 am
      @Scot Finlayson

      Your thesis is simply stop voting SNP and everything will be groovy, in Colin A world.

      Fact is though, its not really clear how Scots will vote in ref2 but it probably is because its being blocked by our chums in the south.

      Why would the tories in particular block Scottish democracy like this, if they thought they’d win again?

      Brexit showed us how people will vote, not how they are told too, or even how idiots like you try to fool them but what they think is best.

      Brexit is the next oncoming tory unionist catastrofuck, and almost no Scot has forgotten how the Vow turned out to be absolutely fuck all.

      Ok, Colin. Hope that helps.

    3. Hamish100 says:

      Indy troll

      Your so boriiiiiiiiing.
      Colin Alexander – what has snp done over the past 3 years?
      Won the Scottish election
      Returned more MP’s than Tories, labour and lib dem together
      Helped get 60% of Scotland to say remain within the EU

      Now what have you done?

    4. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      I find Trek 100 (97% DEET) worked on West African Mosquitos & the West Highland Midge @Shinty says at 10:26 pm and @Tinto Chiel says at 9:14 pm think EU Regs mean you can only get 50% now unless you’ve got…

      Don’t know if it’ll work on indy (is he the dude that posted BTL in the paper re WoS Paid Trolls List but using another name?)

      or The Man at C&A (echo chamber of 1) though.

    5. yesindyref2 says:

      @Jockanese Wind Talker
      Posted there as “Matthew Brown”.

    6. Dr Jim says:

      Jeremy Hunt and the Tories haven’t just picked a fight with Prof Stephen Hawking by calling him a liar they’ve picked a losing fight with the whole scientific community who’ll immediately support one of the greatest living scientists in the world and by doing so have exposed the amateurish and arrogant nature of this current crop of extreme far right (bad people)

      That’s the nicest way I could put that

      Prof Hawking has just informed the UK of the Tories plans to privatise the NHS and it’s only fools or Tories who’d be this stupid to keep digging the biggest lying hole they’ve ever dug themselves into

      This could be the the biggest game changer for the Independence movement in Scotland yet and if the folk on our side get their skates on quick enough this story has the legs of Ussain Bolt and should get every support it can be given

      Front page stuff? or burial? which way will the papers jump
      let’s see who’s got the guts to print Prof Hawkings truth or join the Tories and call him a liar

    7. yesindyref2 says:

      @Dr Jim
      I believe the 2012 Health Act allows up to 49% of the (England and maybe Wales) NHS to be privatised (corresponding drop in block grant). And the moment Fox got appointed to his position I knew we were all in deep doodoo. One alleged reason it seems for extra spending on the English NHS has been to structure it and get it ready.

    8. Croompenstein says:

      Fox is the most aptly named BritScot of living memory. We can all slag off Crash, Flipper, Dr Reid, Gove etc but Fox is a cunning, conniving Brit who will, inadvertently, hasten the end of the union…

    9. yesindyref2 says:

      Aye well I can’t help thinking that the Brexited UK is in for asset-stripping that would have made even Maggie gasp with envy.

    10. Robert Peffers says:

      @Liz g says: 19 August, 2017 at 8:10 pm:

      ” … I have always known that any child can have a place in any state school…. although we both know that it doesn’t really work that way in practice….”

      Well Liz g – it worked for me 70 odd years ago in East Calder, in what was then Midlothian and then in Edinburgh after my family moved to the Capital.

      My sister attended a Non-dom primary but got accepted at Holy Cross Academy as Secondary education. I first attended an RC Junior Secondary for a technical course as I wanted to go into Eletro-Mechanical Engineering and it was not only a top notch school but closer to home.

      Then I transferred to a non-dom Academy to continue for an extra two years to get a couple of higher qualifications.

      For Primary I started in the East Calder RC school, then to a Non-dom Edinburgh Primary, then a C of E
      English primary in Hants. Returning to East Calder Primary but at the Non-Dom/Protestant primary that time. Then to an RC primary in Edinburgh before beginning my Secondary Education.

      I believe that qualifies me to claim to have experienced both lots of discrimination. I was a Proddy to the Kafflics and a Kafflic to the Proddies. Is it any wonder I grew up well able to defend myself?

      A bit like the Johnny Cash, “Boy named Sue”, in fact.

    11. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      I’m on ‘The List’! Hahaha.

      At last, I BELONG.

    12. Shinty says:

      Thanks to all on your ‘midge’ deterrents – will give ’em a go.
      (G&T sounds fun, cheers!)

    13. indy says:

      How much is the Rev paying these borin’ Trolls???

      Heed tracker
      Robert Peffers
      Colin Alexander
      Liz g
      Ken 500
      Proud Cybernat
      Robert J. Sutherland
      Robert Louis
      Sensible Dave
      Meg Merrilees
      Alex Clark
      Reluctant Nationalist

      And how many of the above list are one person using multiple names???

      Wings is utter crap now and sooooooooooo fuckin borin’.

    14. Another Union Dividend says:

      The Big Westminster Oil Lie on front page of Sunday Herald.

      Worth cutting and pasting for when the Big Gers lie is repeated on Wednesday.

      Look forward to BBC news coverage of Sunday Herald story.

    15. Dorothy Devine says:

      Another Union Dividend, sadly the folk below the line continue to respond to those trolling , denigrating Scotland .

      It really is time to abandon thses forums and leave them to the ‘spite and shite ‘ brigade so that they can eat each other.

      Speaking of S&S , has anyone had the misfortune to read the drivel by Mr McKenna in the Guardian?

      Imitating his pal Mr Torrance – another absolutely rank article but comments have closed quickly, so few can be tempted into responding to the even worse commentary below the line.

    16. sassenach says:

      indy – you poor lonely soul!

      If all Wingers are just multiple names, how would you explain the hard cash that Stu is given at every fundraiser (the fastest fundraisers in the West?), or is the Rev giving himself all this money??

      We all know who is being paid by the BritNats – do you really enjoy collecting each week? Get a life.

      ps Can I be added to your esteemed list?

    17. Tinto Chiel says:

      Pravdasound4 doing the usual with A Point of View. Roger “The Man with Two Brains” Scruton explores The Meaning of Conservative.

      The Tories aren’t nasty, really. Some marvellous re-writing of history, including Thatcher’s “There is no such thing as society” comment, which doesn’t mean what we all think, apparently.

      Parp, parp, parp, poop, poop, poop…

      And so it goes on, day after day after decade.

    18. cearc says:

      Just noticed this from yesterday morning:

      Fiona Grahame? @FionaGrahame 24h24 hours ago

      I actually heard @BBCRadioScot saying people will be turned away #NC500 and #Skye again this morning ?its a total joke of a broadcaster now

      It seems to be a deliberate attempt to damage our tourist industry. NC500 has been a great success boosting tourism. I’m not quite sure how people could be ‘turned away’ from 500mls of public roads other than by the british state broadcaster deliberately telling them not to go.

      This is getting beyond a joke.

    19. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Hi Colin Alexander at 12:05 am.

      You typed,
      “The indyref will not be yes or no, it will offer multiple choices of exercising Scottish sovereignty with voting done by Single Transferable Vote, as in Council elections.

      The choices will range between Westminster rule to full independence and various options inbetween, such as a Sovereign Scotland with the offer to rUK of a confederal Scotland/r UK written constitution.”

      For an expression of Scots sovereignty to be recognised by the wider international community, the result of the independence referendum would have to be 50% + 1 in favour of independence.

      Your multi-option suggestion could merely dilute the YES vote across a number of options, most likely resulting in the 50% + 1 threshold not being achieved, thus the Status Quo continues – no independence.

      Either you haven’t thought through your strategy to achieve independence, or you have thought through your strategy to achieve the Status Quo.

      Therefore, you are either naive, or blatantly transparent in your motive here.

    20. stu mac says:

      @Dorothy Devine says:
      20 August, 2017 at 9:27 am
      Another Union Dividend, sadly the folk below the line continue to respond to those trolling , denigrating Scotland

      True. A while back, though I no longer trusted the paper as a whole, I did often check out their comments on political topics. That was back when, for a period, the Herald actually moderated their comments sections quite well and some good discussion ensued. Unfortunately in the last couple of years for whatever reason they’ve become a free for all (sort of – the ones free to say what they like appear only to be on one side of the argument) making the comments sections almost as worthless as those of the Scotsman at its worst. They lost my subscription by letting that happen. Don’t know why – cuts in moderation or new moderators with a certain bias?? They lose money by letting this happen, so why?

    21. Ken500 says:

      Oil tax 40% since Jan 2016. Oil companies cut production in 2010 when Osbourne increased Oil tax 11% (£2Billion) in 2010. When the Oil price dropped 75% Osbourne was still taxing the Oil sector at 62%. Losing thousands of jobs in Scotland. Losing £4Billion+ a year. (£28Billion).

      Scotland raises £54Billion in tax revenues.The UK raises £533Billion. The rest of the UK raises £479Billion. Divide by 11(pop 11/12) = £43.5Billion. £10Billion less is raised in the rest of the UK pro rata. The rest of the UK borrows and spends £100Billion more. Scotland has to pay loan repayments £4Billion on money no borrowed or spent in Scotland. £1Billion on Trident, £1Billion could be saved on minimum pricing. £3Billion? in tax evasion. Whisky companies etc pay no taxes on vast profits. £13Billion. Scotland loses out on EU renewables Grants etc because of Westminster indecision. £Billions.= £15Billion. Scotland can’t borrow. £6Billion? to invest. Grow the economy = £20Billion.

      Scotland gets back. £28Billion. Block Grant. Capital payment £Billion? £15Billion (UK) pensions/benefits, £3Billion Defence (under spend in Scotland) = £50Billion. Pays repayments on debt not borrowed or spent in Scotland.

      Scotland has higher employment. pro rata. Could have had full employment. Without the lose of Oil sector jobs, Westminster total mismanagement. Losing Scotland £Billions.

      Westminster illegal wars, financial fraud, tax evasion. Causing the worse migration crisis in Europe since 11WW. Costing £Trns. Other countries have to pick up the cost. Now Brexit costing £Billions.

      Independence can’t come soon enough. In the next few years.

    22. The Isolator says:


      Oh how we laughed and laughed then laughed some more.

    23. Ken500 says:

      Where’s the Rev to sort out the trolls? CA and Indy aka Malcolm Brown.

    24. indy says:

      Ken500: 9.53am

      Because you were exposed you want Big Daddy Rev to help you out.

      Free speech is crushed on Wings.

      The truth seems to hurt certain people on here.


    25. Dorothy Devine says:

      Stu Mac, maybe the paper(s) is just hanging by a thread now and Newsquest doesn’t give a damn .

      Perhaps their shareholders are wondering why their shares are being dragged down by some piffling ,little paper(s) in Scotland.

    26. ronnie anderson says:

      @ sessenach

      Its always worth reminding Wingers who want to be on a list , watch The Mikado mibees Indy should watch it to fur a wee bitty Cuulture you unerstawn.

      Congratulations to all those Wingers who made another list , it jist goes tae shows yea yer getting up the noses of the rite people keep it up , or is it the wrang people am confuddled lol .

    27. Ken500 says:

      In the NE 6,000 did not go out and vote. It was raining? They let the unionists in. Remorse. They will still vote for Independence. Vote Labour. Some folk never learn.

      The unionist council is now having to cut £125Million. After spending £200Million on the grotesque monstrosity the majority did not want ruining the City Centre. Against the majority wishes and the public interest. It could have been open space. The UTG project would have been far cheaper and pedestrianised the City Centre. Supported by the majority.

      Twa millionaire farmers getting £thousands in subsidies now represent the NE, The Unionists plan to cut Education and jobs in the City. Some people never learn.

    28. Grouse Beater says:

      Some troll-free weekend reading:

      Masters of their domain:
      The Heatherwick Man:

    29. ronnie anderson says:

      Ah wee sunday morning read fur yous, app if Nana or Smallaxe hiv posted it before , ive no read all the postings as yet .

    30. ronnie anderson says:

      @ Grouse Beater Both links were a good read I post & share all your writings on & other Yes pages , keep it up that manny , big Tammy doft tae U.

    31. TheWasp says:

      The word restoration was used by Sarah yesterday to perhaps replace or go along side independence. I think this is an excellent idea.
      Restoration of self respect to the populace who are told constantly they aren’t good in any way. Restoration of seaports, transport and trade links we had four hundred years ago
      Restoration of the ability to decide our way forward.
      The word may have other connotations for some people, but if it is used in a completely positive way and the things being restored are shown for what they are now, to what they could be in a restored/independent Scotland, then why not use this word as way to say better than now.

    32. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      I’ll tell you what’s boring crap @indy says at 7:55 am

      You, continually throwing the “Brown” stuff about

    33. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      It is all to damage Scotlands GDP/Economic figures @cearc says:

      “@BBCRadioScot saying people will be turned away #NC500 and #Skye again this morning ?its a total joke of a broadcaster now”

      iScotland can’t be allowed to be seen as a viable project

      The ‘Establishment’ and it’s propaganda arm have to inflict damage especially following the unexpected good figures last time (despite highlighting we’d go back into recession for weeks prior to the results being issued).

      I await K***ns new graphs re GERS with interest.

    34. louis.b.argyll says:

      Aw, poor Colin Alexander. 11.53

      Did the FM not satisfy you personally, with her carefully robust assurances that THE BIGGEST THREAT TO OUR ECONOMY would be kept at arms length, for as long as possible?

      SNP BAD? Colin? Or are you just thick?

    35. HandandShrimp says:


      There will be a march in Glasgow in 4 weeks and I am sure a fair few people from Wings will be there. Come along and meet a few and see that there faces to the names.

      Is there ale to be quaffed after the march btw? I missed the June one as I was manning a street stall for our MP but I might be around for this one.

    36. Liz Rannoch says:

      Yeahhh Nana!

      Welcome back, missed you, hope your feeling bright eyed and bushy tailed.

      Now to get my pot of tea and read your lovely links.

    37. Robert Peffers says:

      @Ian Brotherhood says: 19 August, 2017 at 9:15 pm:

      Ian, You asked Colin the rhetorical question, “I asked you a simple question and you haven’t answered it.
      Why are you here, almost every day?

      At least I must assume it was rhetorical – for if it wasn’t you simply have not been paying attention.

    38. Nana says:

      Mornin Liz, milk with two sugars please. Gotta keep me sweet!

    39. colin alexander says:


      I want independence, but I think it’s more likely to happen via several steps:

      I want the SNP to completely ditch devolution administration in favour of a policy of a Scottish sovereign parliament.

      That would not be full independence but very close to it. It would end 300 years of Westminster domination.

      It would be a concession to win over soft NO votes who don’t yet want an end to a union with the rest of the UK but who would prefer Holyrood rule to Westminster rule.. It would be a way to get a clear majority if YES voters would go with it too.

      That is not Devo-Max, it is not Federalism.

      rUK either says it will accept that or more likely will say it is unacceptable / unworkable. This means the debate would not be indy v union.

      The SNP would frame the debate: Scottish sovereignty v Westminster sovereignty. Labour would be forced to campaign for Westminster rule over Scottish rule within a union.

      If the people choose Holyrood rule as preferable to WM rule:

      Scotland will have already decided Holyrood is the sovereign parliament. So, it will then be up to the Scottish politicians what we do next.

      If WM won’t cooperate or won’t play fair, We could try and see if we could make it work: Scotland’s sovereign parliament would be able to declare the Union is over if it becomes clear it is unworkable, without any permission from Westminster for an indyref.


      However, what we now have is an SNP that campaigns FOR Westminster rule: “Keep Scotland strong at Westminster”.

      An SNP that is willing to negotiate compromises to try and avoid the independence / sovereignty issue. Despite the clear manifesto statement that Scotlad being dragged out the EU is unacceptable and will trigger the independence issue again.

      An SNP whose number one priority is re-election to Holyrood in 2021 to make it 20 years of Westminster devolution under SNP administration.


      An SNP whose priority is retaining power for the SNP. An SNP that is shedding votes to Labour, as their policies are now very similar. An SNP who campaigns for the chance to form Labour / SNP voting pacts at WM, the so-called progressive alliance. Vote SNP cos they will be more British Labour than Scottish Labour.

      Both pro-Westminster devolution. The SNP can’t get rid of Trident under devolution, Labour don’t want to.


      Devolution was a stepping stone we need to leave behind now. The SNP appear to have accepted it as the final destination.

      I don’t want to destroy the SNP. I want the SNP to return to the core values of the SNP: A vote for the SNP is a vote for Scottish sovereignty, Scottish independence.

      A party whose reason for existence was constitutional change, now exists to administer domestic policies.

      So article after article on Wings is about: Does the SNP make the Dutch make the trains run on time? Do Scotland’s Health Boards ru the NHS better under an SNP administration better than under a Tory or Labour one?

      Devolution administration for WM does nothing for independence or Scottish sovereignty.

      If that’s what matters to you or Stu, fair enough.

      I want independent Scotland.

    40. Sarah says:

      @TheWasp 10.37

      You’ve explained it much better than I did! Self-respect, dignity, confidence – a reminder that we had all those things and they are still in us.

    41. heedtracker says:

      indy says:
      20 August, 2017 at 7:55 am
      How much is the Rev paying these borin’ Trolls???

      Heed tracker


      Woohoo! I never win anything.

      Indy, Scots get endless mountains of vote tory and SLab propaganda thrown at us, tsunamis of Scotland’s a shitty wee UK region propaganda, Scots are useless drunk slackers and ofcourse the ever more hysterical SNP bad raged at us, all the time, all of it led and coordinated by the massed ranks of beeb gimps out there, from BBCr4 creeps to BBC Scotland gimp network, in the known UKOK universe of tory creepiness, in our country.

      But indy says, like it or not, Scotland really is still our country and not the BBC zone of tory control, although you can be forgiven for believing it is.

      And then, when we go abroad, we then have to listen to exact same beeb creeps tell the world how wonderfully balanced, neutral and unbiased BBC corp really really is.

      Can we not be allowed to grinch about hard core beeb gimpery at all, among a whole range of just how mad it really is, when another country thinks it owns and runs yours?

      Maybe we really will be, one day, run by tory reprobates in Westminster and FM Colonel Ruth in Holyrood.

      That is the whole tory media plan.

      I mean come on indy, vote tory BBC r4 creeps even say Orange Hitler’s a good guy.

    42. HandandShrimp says:


      As a 3/4 way house I would have no issue with a full sovereign parliament at all but I am pretty sure it would scare the bejaysus out of the likes of Mad Col Ruth MacMad and Prof Tomkins may fall over apoplexy.

      What would the steps be to get us to such a place? I doubt it could be UDI or UDS in this case.

    43. Robert Peffers says:

      @HandandShrimp says: 19 August, 2017 at 9:47 pm:

      You asked C.A. this question, HandandShrimp:-

      What do you mean, when was that? The Calton Hill march was a major event with about 30,000 taking part and fair number of high profile speakers from across the Yes spectrum including Colin Fox, Partick Harvie, Margo McDonald, Elaine C Smith, Dennis Canavan etc, … “

      There is a simple explanation. Colin is a paid for agent of the Westminster Establishment’s propaganda wing. He thus only believes something to be truth if it features on the Westminster Establishment’s propaganda Main Stream Media.

      In effect Colin doesn’t know what day of the week it is unless Westminster tells him first. In this he is 100% in tune with the Britnat, a.k.a. English, Nationalist movement.

    44. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      Restoration is a great term @TheWasp says @10.37am and you give very good examples.

      Also the Restoration of the concept of a society which puts “People before Profit”.

    45. Liz Rannoch says:

      Nae probs, whatever you want Nana!

      Before I get in about the lovely links, can I just let folks know (again) that there’s a march & rally in Dunfermline (aye, I know, Dunfermline!)

      this is happening on the same day as Jeremy C is supposed to be in Kirkcaldy, so it would be great if there was a good turnout.

    46. heedtracker says:

      HandandShrimp says:
      20 August, 2017 at 11:08 am

      Devo-max is virtual Scottish independence. That’s why they promised it and then reneged on all of it, 2014.

      Sovereignty we have, devo-max we don’t and never will. Which is why Colin A is bashing away at getting sovereignty.

      Or, sovereignty is a great and good thing, but devo-max?

      Devo-max Scotland wouldn’t just an extraordinary economic driver, showing Scots what nation statehood really means, it means England losing vast and endless sources of income and resources.

      Looking at it from the other side, this farce union has meant Scotland losing vast and endless sources of income and resources.

      But sovereignty’s great too.

    47. heedtracker says:

      Liam Fox demands power to bypass Scotland and Wales on trade deals
      Posted On: 19th August 2017

      Liam Fox wants the power to bypass the Scottish and Welsh government when agreeing free trade deals after Brexit, according to a report.

      Funny how this tory creep didn’t write letters like this, 19th August 2014?

    48. heedtracker says:

      A party whose reason for existence was constitutional change, now exists to administer domestic policies.”

      As you know full well Colin, this is was the democratic choice of Scotland, 2014.

      You’re trying to get the SNP out and that’s fine Colin, you can rant away at us as hard as you like, without the SNP… where to start Colin?

      How it all really works in teamGB Colin.

      Big Observor Brexit survey thing today, nothing that interesting, but look at what is missing completely from this English only tory bleh,

      “Majority of UK public backs Brexit ‘transition period’, poll finds

      Observer/Opinium poll finds nearly half of those asked believe there should be no second referendum on departure terms”

      blah blah blah bleh,

      “In terms of support for the main political parties, Labour holds a lead of three percentage points on 43%, with the Conservatives on 40% and the Liberal Democrats on 6%.”

      Ghosts in the great tory UKOK machine Colin?

    49. Ron Maclean says:

      Jackal: Person who does preparatory drudgery etc or who assists another’s immoral behaviour. (C.O.D.)
      Hence – Union Jackal e.g. Mundell, Davidson, Dugdale. Other Union Jackals are available.

      The term ‘Union Jackal’ was coined by the Sydney ‘Bulletin’ during WW1. (From Piers Brenden’s ‘Decline and Fall of the British Empire’).

    50. Robert Peffers says:

      @indy says: 19 August, 2017 at 11:00 pm

      “How much is the Rev paying these borin’ Trolls???
      Heed tracker
      Robert Peffers
      Colin Alexander
      Liz g
      Ken 500
      Proud Cybernat
      Robert J. Sutherland
      Robert Louis
      Sensible Dave
      Meg Merrilees
      Alex Clark
      Reluctant Nationalist
      And how many of the above list are one person using multiple names???

      o.k. Indy, I admit it – they are all me and I’m also the Rev Stu, who also doesn’t actually exist.

      None of them get paid because they are all just me and I’m Ann Nonn. I’ve got to keep the readership figures up somehow for, besides just yourself, Rock, Colin and a couple of others there is no one else actually commenting or reading Wings.

      Sheesh! You couldn’t make up the load of sheer garbage these Britnat supporting idiot trolls are posting and the real Wingers are daft enough to be seriously responding to.

    51. colin alexander says:

      @Heedtracker, I politely ask you to consider this:

      Devo-max is devolution. ( Maximum devolution).

      Devolution is only Westminster rule administered in a decentralised way. But it is still Westminster rule. WM would always control what Holyrood can administer on behalf of WM.

      It is absolutely not Scottish Parliamentary sovereignty: it is WM sovereignty and Scottish servility.

      And as the Great WM Power Grab shows: WM will always decide what is devolved. Power remains with WM at all times.

      As people have said, WM had the chance to give Devo-Max and backtracked on it, so in my opinion, it’s no longer a viable option.

      The choice now is:

      Scottish sovereignty within a UK Union. Perhaps shared currency, shared MoD, etc. Whatever Scotland and rUK MUTUALLY agree is shared.


      Full independence: own Scottish currency, own Scottish defence forces etc.

    52. Flower of Scotland says:

      The trolls are doing exactly what they are paid to do. It only works when people answer them.

      If you want new readers on Wings, stop getting into boring conversations with these digital Britnat warriors.

      Ignore, and they will go away!

    53. doug mcgregor says:

      This was posted here yesterday and deserves
      a look at by anyone interested in an independent Scotland

    54. heedtracker says:

      colin alexander says:
      20 August, 2017 at 11:42 am
      @Heedtracker, I politely ask you to consider this:

      I do consider it Colin.

      Again, you are clearly determined to get the SNP out. Fair enough.

      Your sovereign Scots stuff is interesting/boring but it wont mean anything at all, with FM Kez or FM Colonel Ruth in Holyrood.

      Devo-max is the main driver for Scotland becoming self governing Colin, not sovereignty.

      Again, that’s why devo max was offered to Scotland in 2014, at the very last ref1 minute, breaking purdah, an act of historic fraud on all of us, even you Colin A.

      If the Smith Commission had actually “given” Scotland what their The Vow shyste promised, would there now be ref2 coming, even with Brexit?

      Scots seem to be comfortable being called UK citizens, even if it gets a bit weird. My new driving licence made in Wales, has a big union jack at the top and an EU flag at the bottom for example. But despite or because of all that Britnat stuff going on in Scotland as a UK region, majority of Scots do want devo max, taking back control of the vast Scottish mineral and green energy resources, a fairer, even a more transparent and rational taxation of great wealth and so on. And Scots wealth is great Colin. From Brenda down, Scotland is home to some of the richest rich on the planet. That’s not by chance either.

      But again you know that Colin A and that’s why you rant on and on about sovereignty and how bad the SNP really are, at sovereignty.

      Its ok Colin, we already know how bad they are, massed ranks of beeb gimps say they are.

    55. colin alexander says:

      Robert Peffers, you and I sing from the same hymn sheet about Scotland being sovereign.

      I don’t need to tell you about the Claim of Right. Rule by the will of the people.

      So, the majority of people voted Remain in the EU. We agreed on that?

      The people voted SNP on a manifesto pledge of indyref is Scotland is forcibly being taken from the EU.

      So, the SNP have no mandate to negotiate terms of EU exit for Scotland.

      Their mandate is absolutely clear. A mandate from the electorate and Scottish Parliament: to offer the choice of indy v UK forced removal of Scotland from the EU.

      What have the SNP done? Postponed any indyref decision announcement until Autumn 2018

      and they are currently offering the UK Govt terms that Indyref will be cancelled completely if Scotland is allowed some concessions such as access to the European Single Market.

      My position is that I agree the electorate should be given the choice to reject the UK Govt overruling the Scottish democratic decision to Remain.

      But repeating a: YES / NO indyref campaign would not be the best way to do it.

      I’m not going to get into a slagging match with you Robert, as I try to give you respect as a someone who claims to be a lifelong independence supporter and a 80 year old senior citizen.

      As someone who is also a lifelong supporter of Scottish independence I ask you to show me the same respect back and not insult me by falsely accusing me of being some sort of infiltrator or fifth columnist.

    56. louis.b.argyll says:

      Well said Robert P.

      That it is English Nationalism, that oppresses Scottish confidence.

    57. Artyhetty says:

      Just looking at Nana’s links, thanks Nana, so much to catch up on.

      The one about UK geology, a must read thanks, especially for us geology nerds…

      Years ago, UKokGov considered building a massive underground storage for nuke waste underneath Cumbria. In fact as with the nuke power station, the local people were not too resistant.Jobs. But, it could not be done, due to the fragile geology of the region.

      They thought they could do what Norway(?) had done, building a huge concrete storage pit, or cave or whatever. It was almost in the bag in Cumbria, until they consulted experts who said, er not a good idea re earthquake risk!

      Would not be surprised at all if UKOK frack Scotland, once Brexshit kicks in good n proper.

    58. colin alexander says:

      Re the Calton Hill march, “When was that?” was a rhetorical question. Even a Martian would not need to ask that question. They could google the answer.

      The Calton Hill march was FOUR YEARS AGO.

      My issue is that since 2014 the SNP barely mention independence.

      They present it as fact that cos people voted NO to independence, then indy is a no-goer. So, they are now “Keep Scotland strong at WM” / devolutionists.

      I say, it’s cos the SNP failed to put a credible currency/ economic policy in place in 2014, instead of the preferred Monetary Union with the rUK, and that’s why too many people voted No.

      That since then, instead of coming out fighting for indy 100%, the SNP won’t even mention it till Autumn 2018, and who knows what the FM will say then?

      We do know the SNP is offering the UK govt cancellation of indyref 2 altogether if Scotland could remain in the Single Market – not the EU, as their manifesto says, just the Single Market.

      So who are the servants of the UK Govt? It isn’t me.

    59. Liz g says:

      Artyhettey @ 12.24
      RE. fracking..

      Ye know Artyhettey,the first thing I thought when I heard Fox
      wants the Holyrood forbidden from hampering ANY trade deal was, what if it’s a Fracking trade deal?

      If Westminster makes a Fracking deal and name’s it a UK deal,that they don’t let Scotland’s moratorium get in the way of, then,as far as I can see Holyrood could do nothing about it.
      In fact we might have a situation where, because it would be Police Scotland that would have to ensure that fracking went ahead, who controls Police Scotland could be put into question.

    60. yesindyref2 says:

      Whenever we see a Scott Skinner claiming “ I see no mention of the production costs of a barrel of oil or total outputs; I wonder why?” here’s the answer from Oil & Gas UK – the industry body:

      the price of extraction per barrel in 2016 fell from $29.70 to $15.30 in US Dollars – half. And still falling. And the current price of Brent crude is $52.70 per barrel.

    61. yesindyref2 says:

      Incidentally, SS’s posting in the Herald is a classic case of that technique discovered by Capella and others in “The Gentleperson’s Guide To Forum Spies”

      ‘FORUM SLIDING’ – which curiously doesn’t emphasise the importance of being the first posting in when the forum is in earliest posting order. To counter that the first reply needs to be a solid one with facts, rather than an argumentative one or name-calling one, which just allows the offending posting to be unanswered in the first screen, and therefore stand for the casual reader.

      I looked for that article on the main page, didn’t find it. Perhaps for an important article it needs an alert Winger to quickly archive it and post the link in Wings for the likes of me and others to pick up and handle.

      Note by the way, that when this topic was being discussed, that’s when the “Forum Spies” made their appearance, with the purpose of quite a few of the points on that forum spy list.

    62. Jock McDonnell says:


      Yes, I see the Sunday Times has an irony by-pass today when saying Scotland’s economy is set to trail that of the UK – so thats not a criticism of the current policies & economic reality of union, no its a blow to a non existent Independent Scotland – apparently.

    63. Lenny Hartley says:

      Heady, Tom Pride on the author of the EBC bonanza after Brexit, appears the EBC missed out the Manufacturing has to go and the NHS needs privatised.

    64. yesindyref2 says:

      @Lenny Hartley
      That report “£5,000 per household”, is the most damning thing the Brexiteers could produce against themselves. Maybe they’ve been infiltrated!

    65. Rock says:

      Ian Brotherhood,

      “And that’s the point isn’t it? You and the likes of Rock chip away at WOS readership by scunnering folk into not commenting and/or not reading because they just can’t be arsed wading through your interminable shite.

      Some feel you are tolerable because, as Heedtracker pointed out some days ago, your approach is slightly different to that of Rock. FWIW, I’m probably not the only one who finds your presence as dispiriting as it is provocative. You’re maybe just doing ‘a job’, aye, understood, but what you are doing happens to be despicable.”

      Ian Brotherhood,
      11 February, 2017 at 12:59 am

      “Rock and his supporters are – successfully – choking the life out of creative, informative discourse on this site.

      No more appealing to Rev, or anyone else – I’m out.”

      You have no credibility.

    66. K1 says:

      And you do? There is not one single person I know personally, who are non commenters on Wings, but read the site nonetheless, who don’t ask me, ‘what is wrong wi that guy Rock’?

      You don’t get to do you? You’re a miserable stalker who takes revenge on others for being unable to join in on normal every day discourse regarding our country’s constitutional arrangements. All you do is an outpouring negative and nasty and unkind insinuations against those on your list Rock, that you’ve deemed ‘less than’ worthy, copying and pasting their comments and regurgitating them out of context?

      Do you seriously think you are marked as some fucking seer by those who follow Wings?

      You are marked for what you yourself indulge in: a random nutter wi time on his hands stalking and ctirticising those who contribute btl on Wings through the medium of copying, salivating at the opportunity to deploy the insulting of those you’ve listed as targets for your own ire,

      Tell me Rock, what the fuck that has to do with Scotland’s independence? What great contribution do you think you are making on here? You’re nothing less than a stalker, with nothing less than a revengeful and ‘told ye so’ outlook.

      I dread tae think what satisfaction someone of your mentality derives from such conduct, But ah tell ye what Rock, it’s a sick pastime ye’ve got going on there…and it ‘is’ nasty Rock, really nasty and creepy…and everyone sees that for the Truth of it. Always.

    67. David says:

      You cannot hope to bribe or twist,
      Thank God! the Britnat unionist.
      But, seeing what the man will do
      Unbribed, there’s no occasion to.

    68. Dorothy Devine says:

      David , I had thought that was by Hilaire Belloc but discovered it was by one Humbert Wolfe.

      May I add a favourite Belloc,

      Here richly with ridiculous display
      The politicians corpse was laid away
      While all of his acquaintance wept and slanged
      I wept for I had longed to see him hanged.

      Bright chap that Belloc !

      And I have discovered there are T shirts with those immortal words printed!

    69. David says:

      I see theres a wee argument going on about fkwits on the comment board?

      Well, thats true. Any of you should try to make a legitimate comment based from the more right side of the economic spectrum and watch what happens.

      Showing some economic acumen and knowledge on this site starts a shitshow of hysterical lefty squawking that is a wonder to behold.

    70. There probably needs to be an “official” campaign, cat, but apart from that, no idea. If there is one it definitely should have no policies at all, apart from Independence.

      Yeah, you’re right though, going on about YES Scotland is not the thing to do – unless Indy Ref 2 is going to be the same old same old, which didn’t quite work last time, though it was close.

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