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Bluffs and calls

Posted on December 19, 2018 by

This was the Daily Record’s front page on Tuesday:

It wasn’t true. Corbyn DIDN’T, in fact, table a vote of no confidence in either the Prime Minister personally (a meaningless and non-binding gesture even if she’d lost it) or the government. But tomorrow he may actively prevent one.

May had dared Corbyn not to table the meaningless personal rebuke, and instead move a real proper vote of no confidence, which if it succeeded would bring down the government and cause a general election – the thing Labour insists it wants.

She promised that if he did that she would grant it Parliamentary time, but that she wouldn’t do so for the meaningless stunt vote.

In the end, Corbyn actually did neither (at least so far as we can make out – the news completely blanked the story, focusing instead mainly on Jose Mourinho’s sacking as Manchester United manager).

So tonight the SNP, the second-biggest opposition party, backed by the Lib Dems, Greens and Plaid Cymru, did it for him.

By the arcane rules of the Commons, the motion will go straight to a debate and vote EITHER if the government chooses to allow it of its own free will, or if Corbyn backs it, in which case it HAS to. Labour has as yet made no indication of its position, but its Scottish MP Paul Sweeney said this tonight:

If such a move “reduces the prospect of defeating the government”, then as the official opposition Labour are duty-bound to oppose it. Which would leave British politics in the farcical position of the opposition, who say they have no confidence in the government and want to bring it down and have a general election, actually BLOCKING the only mechanism by which that can happen.

There’s no penalty for a failed vote of no confidence. It’s not like the Tory leadership challenge, where you’re only allowed to have one every 12 months. And given that just a week ago 117 Tory MPs publicly declared they had no confidence in the Prime Minister, there has to be at least a chance that four or five of them (which is all it would take) might seize the chance to get rid of her.

Some people claim, not unreasonably, that Tories wouldn’t vote to put themselves out of a job or their party out of office – it’d be like turkeys voting for something that we can’t quite put our finger on. But many of them are in extremely safe seats personally, and judging by polls it’s pretty likely the Tories would still come out of any election as the biggest party, so they might well consider it a gamble worth taking, in the certainty of deposing May and the hope of getting a new Brexiter PM and running down the clock further towards a no-deal Brexit.

The only way to find out is to force a vote and see. The only chance of Labour taking charge of the Brexit negotiations – which the party also claims to want – is to kick the Tories out NOW. Waiting until at least February to trigger an election (which is what will happen if the confidence vote doesn’t take place this week) is plainly far too late when Brexit day is scheduled for 29 March.

Labour’s bluff has been well and truly called. If they fail to back the motion tomorrow (or fail to vote for it if and when it happens), everything they’ve been saying for months about wanting a general election and a Labour team negotiating Brexit will be exposed as an absolutely hollow lie. If they DO back it, only Paul Sweeney will be a liar.

We’ll be watching the news intently to find out which turns out to be the case.

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    97 to “Bluffs and calls”

    1. Thepnr says:

      I doubt they’ll back it and then the Tories will just ignore it.

      Corbyn is totally useless and almost May’s equal in the uselessness department. Labour will just hope it all goes away, but it won’t. Their card will have been marked, particularly here in Scotland.

    2. Dr Jim says:

      I reckon if there is a GE the Tories will win it again by the skin of their teeth again but that’ll depend on whether Labour abstains on it’s own threat or takes a stand, if Labour doesn’t back its own mouth it will be seen as definitely enabling the Tories so a GE if or when came about would almost certainly see Corbyn losing because of his own indecision (people don’t like that)

      He looks like a loser talks like a loser and acts like a loser and he just wants the PMs job to fall into his hands after she’s fouled up the whole of the UK so he can’t be blamed and that’s already been seen through

      They should bring back the bacon sandwich guy he looks positively efficient next to Corbyn

    3. How can it be that at the point in history when we have the worst Tory government , the first government to be accused of holding parliament in contempt, we also have the worst opposition?

      History will not look kindly on this.

      Corbyn does not want the election yet – ‘now is not the time’ and no other Tory wants to be holding the baby when the bath water runs out.

      Corbyn’s actions tomorrow will be really interesting.

      Apparently T May is having a summit with the First ministers of Scotland and Wales on weds. afternoon and she is going to urge them to get behind her deal.

      How wide of the mark can she be?

      I bet Nicola will let her have no doubt what she thinks of Treeza’s Deal.

    4. cynicalHighlander says:

      THE END OF THE WORLD IS NIGH

    5. Capella says:

      Is that the Paul Sweeney who argued and voted for the Westminster power grab on the grounds that the SNP were playing party political games?

      Labour and their 12 dimensional chess make the SNP look positively mainstream.

      What a busy Xmas we are having. No wonder the High Street is dying. We are all glued to Parliament TV.

    6. Ade says:

      Aye, shit or get aff the pot, Corbyn…..

      I’d recommend this site : http://obiterj.blogspot.com/ for clear reporting of the legal side of things & it explains the context of Ian Blackford’s successful obtaining of an Emergency Debate at 7pm on Monday 17th December & how it forces Corbyn’s hand.

      Not that he’ll do anything…..

      Yes, very interesting times….

    7. robertknight says:

      Labour, Tories and MSM will ignore it.

      Nothing to see here folks, move along now please…

      Just another day in paradise.

    8. Robert Peffers says:

      @Meg merrilees says: 19 December, 2018 at 1:12 am:

      ” … How can it be that at the point in history when we have the worst Tory government , the first government to be accused of holding parliament in contempt, we also have the worst opposition?”

      I’ve said it since I first commented here on Wings. Westminster has always been a total lie. It has always claimed to be something it isn’t.

      It has always been, “The Establishment”. The party system has always been a sham and history records that when Westminster comes under outside attack the very first thing to happen is for Her/His Majesty to call in Her/His Majesty’s choice to become Prime Minister and form a cross-party, “War Cabinet”.

      Westminster, including the Lords, has always been a sham.

    9. Macart says:

      Time for Mr Corbyn to walk the walk, come clean with his membership, or find new and interesting methods of deflecting the audience.

      Spinning bow tie with lights? Unicycling into chamber with spinning plates? I hope I’m wrong, but…

      Just for the sake of being helpful to Mr Corbyn and Labour. It’s not about ‘winning’ the big chair, or indeed any contest. It’s not simply about beating a parliamentary opponent. It’s about saving people regardless of your party loyalties. It’s about lives.

      Let’s see what Mr. kinder, more caring, more honest politics is really all about.

    10. Mary McCabe says:

      Public reaction will largely depend on how much publicity it gets.

      If Corbyn backs it of course it will be on the front page of all the papers and first item on the news.

      If he doesn’t back it and the Government doesn’t allow it then only anoraks like us who are interested in political social media will get to know about it.

    11. Aye, Robert. was it not the House of Lords that passed the legislation which rendered our Continuity Bill out of competency.

      Too scared to discuss it in the Commons – Push it throughout the lord where there are no SNP honourable members and the likes of ‘Lord’ Forsyth, ‘Lord’ Duncan and Baroness Moan can vent their spleen on their Mitherland.

      Tractors.

    12. geeo says:

      The extent of labours ineptitude is measured by the fact that, even without a majority, the tories have absolutely nothing to fear from the labour party on, well, anything really.

      I posted elsewhere in 2017 that we have an unofficial ‘grand coalition’ government, labour and the tories, working together against the real threat to their precious union, not brexit, but Scotland.

      Stand by that today.

    13. twathater says:

      And the worst thing about it is the deluded voters of engerland cannot see or don’t want to see the absolute incompetence and stupidity of both these parties .
      Sweeney is heading for high office in the red tory party as he has NO scruples and can lie without shame , thank fcuk he went to the big hoose to play with the rest of the ermine seeking scumbags
      It will be nice to see the engerlish voters openly thanking the SNP MP’s for exposing these corrupt and cowardly shysters ( cough ) I wonder now if the engerlish voters will call for Scotland to be ejected from the imperial UK or if they will go for independence for engerland

    14. Robert Alexander Harrison says:

      Even though the Englanders brought this on themselves and are quite xenophobic at times that they deserve everything they get this unfortunately is not anything they deserve even at there worst they dont deserve this but unfortunately they are stuck with one for those 2 we how ever are not independence is the only way to rid us of this crap.

    15. Doug says:

      Are you suggesting the front page of the Daily Record can not be considered always truthful? I am shocked, shocked I tell you cf The Vow…

    16. All these people blaming the English – listen carefully the next time you hear a Tory being interviewed on TV – there are a lot of Scottish accents there! Dr.Liam Fox, Michael Gove, Da Costa and others.

    17. There could be no ‘Them’ if there were no ‘Us’.
      It is not symbiosis, it is an internecine pact.
      May and Corbyn are twa fleas aff the same rancid Establishment dug.
      England is shut now. It’s Christmassssss!
      I observed in another place (WGD) that Corbyn and The Abstainers, a one hit wonder from the Militant ‘Sixties, have managed to do the impossible; sit on their hands and abstain, while wringing their mits with anxiety in case they end up holding the Brexit baby by default.
      I’d imagine that Paul Sweeney doesn’t pop into BAE Govan for a cup of tea with the Comrades these days, now that the Frigate work will go to ‘taking back control’ Southampton (that’ll please Liar Carmichael), Liverpool and Barrow on Furness.
      They have enough rope to hang themselves.
      Scotland has only one option; Self Determination as the continuer state in Europe to begin with, and only then can we decide on whether or not we want to stay in the EU by a vote of the Scottish people, and the Scottish people alone.
      Ironically UKIP was the crack in the Unionist dam.
      Farage destroyed his precious Union, although not by guile or intellect, of which he has demonstrated none.
      The timetable. May’s Withdrawal Agreement voted down in mid January.
      No Deal option rejected by WM early February.
      May applies for an extension to Article 50 schedule.
      A second EU Referendum is voted through at WM.
      The ‘Bittish People’ vote Remain, say, 54%-46%, Scotland and N Ireland Remain vote increases by perhaps 5% points,
      and there is an immediate call from UKIP and the 117 Blue Chip Tories for a ‘best of three’ decider.
      March comes and goes, the extension period comes and goes, and No DEal looms large by default.
      In the meantime, the Scottish Government announces Indyref 2, probably late February, early March, with Polling Day late March.
      I can’t see it panning out any other way.
      The Oriental car giants will be the first to fold their tents and move from England to the EU.
      Not long now until Scotland takes its rightful place in the world.

    18. Dr Jim says:

      @Meg

      The home grown baddies are the hardest to take, so personal

    19. Belgian Prime minister is resigning…

    20. Liz g says:

      Dr Jim @ 2.09
      It is the hardest to take,but the most we can learn!
      Aye?
      When the history of this is Written… I think Scotland’s story will be the go to political literature …
      We will even have the children’s sections
      EG
      Do ye know what they did with song lyrics…may,in the right hands be popular children’s tale…?

    21. Reluctant Nationalist says:

      “…at least so far as we can make out – the news completely blanked the story…”

      Um…

    22. Liz g says:

      Reluctant Nationalist @ 2.35
      Then it looks like Thepnr @ 1.00am is right and the MSM are going to help the government ignore it?
      Only this time they will have tae put their so called (precious and rightful ) 3rd party in the same column as the SNP.
      How the SNP convinced the Lib Dems to back them I’ll never know…
      But the Lib Dems in Westminster are now going to have to complain about being ignored!!
      Is it me or have the Scottish MPs just stired the pot?

    23. cearc says:

      Liz,
      because the LDs are the only english pro-eu/remain party but they have hardly any seats and despite the chaos and polls moving towards remain their vote predictions are barely shifting.

      Only with the 3rd. largest party and others can they have any influence or hope to raise their profile.

    24. Cactus says:

      The gaunlet is down on Labour’s Corbyn, the written cross-party motion awaits his acknowledgement and signature…

      Early exposure to and the understanding of the above facts is essential in being ahead of the Corporate Media, which helps to keep the pressure on them (the MSM) to the point where the NOW known becomes unavoidable to not print.

      Double-check.

      Hey Liz g 😉

    25. yesindyref2 says:

      The only hope for the Labour party is if it elects Larry the Cat as leader – he has squatter’s rights on number 10, and his own supply of Go Cat and licky licks.

    26. cearc says:

      There’s a strange irony in that Clegg destroyed the LDs because he wanted power. Corbyn is destroying Labour because he doesn’t and the Toraidh divisions are destroying the Conservatives.

      All within a system that discourages new parties. So who could govern England? It may be a very hard road ahead for english people.

    27. Robert Peffers says:

      O/T but relevant:

      This from Holyrood last night:-

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d02iNBx0V50

    28. Bob Mack says:

      Labour don’t want to be in power at this time. Would you take over this mess and deal with it rather than use it as a stick to beat the Tories in a future elEcton?

      The benefits to Labour are that they keep hold of their vote leave constituencies, and also garner the votes of those Moderate constituencies who voted remain, who will undoubtedly punish the Tories for this folly.

      What really matters to Labour is to be in power, at any cost to the electorate. That is the real game here.

      They are riding two horses at one time, but ultimately they have only one destination in mind above all others. To govern at Westminster, and to achieve that by being seen as being supportive by all sides and none. Why else would your policy be so bland and flexible on a daily, even hourly basis?

      It is a measure of how disastrous a Corbyn government would be.

    29. starlaw says:

      Now is the time for labour to stand up and be counted, lets see if they will or will they prove themselves totally politically useless.

    30. Craig P says:

      geeo says:

      I posted elsewhere in 2017 that we have an unofficial ‘grand coalition’ government, labour and the tories, working together against the real threat to their precious union, not brexit, but Scotland.

      It’s kind of looking that way, isn’t it?

      Labour will take no useful or decisive action today. Why break the habit of the last decade.

    31. Harry mcaye says:

      Blanked by BBC Scotland “news where you are” so far this morning. Shocking (but not shocked).

    32. Kenno says:

      Red Tory Blue Tory.

      These two English institutions have one thing I common, they don’t give a shit about Scotland.

      Time to dump England and her Establishment.

      Vote Yes in Indyref2.

    33. Ken500 says:

      They both want to lose a GE.

      The way out for the Tories is to have a GE they can lose. Labour do not want the poison chalice so they will support the Tories to try and keep them there. They both want to take it to the wire,

      If it was not so tragic it would be farcical. Westminster caused the migration in Europe. The European countries have to pick up the pieces. The Westminster unionists are sanctionig and starving people. Totally unecessarily. Wasting £Billions on HS2 and Hickley Poiht, A total waste of public money with no business case. Cutting essential services.

      Tory/Labour both want to trash the world economy. Never has there been such a bunch of complete and utter useless incompetents.

      If there is not a GE, another Indyref will be announced soon, Looks like Scotland has had enough of this nonsense.

      May is suppose to announce today a statement against migration. At the same time as supposedly trying to negotiate trade deals with the ‘foreigners’. While intending to give up the nearest, biggest market. Absolutely ridiculous. The Brexit nonsense. It will go down well like a lead ballon.

      Has there even been more foolish people than the Tory/unionists? The Westminster unionists have ‘foreign’ wives and husbands. Many come from migrant families are they going to throw them out. Unionists troughing on public money. Johnston is one of them. His privileged existent was funded by EU money. Complete hypocrites. Hunt’s wife is foreign. So is Corbyn’s. The Royals are migrants. Are they going to throw them out? Tomkins will have to go? with the ‘foreign’ family. If they stopped bombing the world to bits there would be less migration in the world. More people could stay in their own places.

      They are chucking people out of Scotland, Scotland is half empty. The population has stagnated. The Westminster liars have secretly and illegally taken Scottish resources to fund London S/E. liars always get found out.

      The unionists changed the political system in Scotland, illegally without a mandate, to try and destroy the Scottish Parliament,

      The visa and insurance costs of a trip abroad will cost more than the average pay for EU membership, with all the benefits. The EU costs Scotland nothing and brings benefits. The UK ‘union’ costs £20Billion a year.

      The illegal wars, financial fraud, tax evasion and total unionist mismanagement has cost Scotland dear. Iraq, Dunblane and Lockerbie kept secret for 100 years, Westminster unionists keep it’s criminality hidden under the Official Secrets Act.

      What an absolute total shambles. Another fine mess they have got in. The totally incompetent, useless Westminster unionists. They don’t know what to do next.

      What a Christmas waiting for armageddon.

    34. Kenno says:

      Brexit was a victory for English Nationalists’.

      The English are the most racist Nation in Europe.

      The racist English have always had an issue with Furriners.

    35. Ken500 says:

      Daily Record at it again. Just a bunch of total liars.

    36. Kenno says:

      Ken500

      You surely mean the “Day Late Record”.

    37. Martin says:

      The (wo)man in the street doesn’t deserve what’s coming. Regardless of what country they’re from or how they voted in Brexit. The fact is that the politicians have lied and are playing out an internal squabble within a party as a national crisis. It’s like they’re having a game of chess but instead of taking pawns they’re shooting random bystanders in the head.

      And then there’s Her Majesty’s Official Opposition who, by my count, have opposed precisely 0 things the government has brought in. Anyone expecting Brexiteer Corbyn to sign up to this no confidence vote is a fool. He wants brexit, but doesn’t want to publicly support it. This was actually a pretty good move by SNP and pals- call Labour’s bluff and prove them inept, but having given them ample time to do the right thing in advance. My worry is about the reportage, as I can see it being “The SNP’s no confidence motion was defeated” rather than “Labour failed to sign up to no confidence motion, thereby ensuring the safety of the government.”

    38. Ken500 says:

      There are red and blue Tories in Scotland. Unfortunately people are conned into voting for them. Too many.

    39. Ken500 says:

      Change the record.

    40. Hamish100 says:

      The Record articke was posted by dear ol torquil. The Records version of Donalda of the bbc. Brit nat to the core. Crichton believes not in Corbyn. He is a blairite. The civil liberalitarian who took Scotland to war on lies. Next we will get tom harris on the beeb telling us brexit is good. Ooops done already.

    41. Macart says:

      Just been through some of the broadsheets and a quick scan of the twatterspere.

      Gesture politics yer Lab types are calling it… (oh the biblical irony). Labour apparently were and until otherwise notified are, waiting for the exact right moment to pounce all along you know.

      We’re literally a hundred and change days away from Brexit of some form or other, and Labour have waited two and a half years for ‘just the right moment’ to let folks know where they stand and what they’re all about. Uh huh!. Righto.

      They are the official party of opposition in what is essentially a binary system of politics. For all the period since June 2016, they’ve remained as riven and confused as the Tories, yet with less of a sense of purpose or identity than their chooms across the chamber. Who knew that was even possible? Their leader less than honest with or representative of, the bulk of his own membership. Those facts aren’t even up for debate. They’re a matter of very public record.

      The only real opposition to the government benches has come from the third party of parliament on down over this period and that should shame that chamber and the population it supposedly represents. A party by the by, that none of the above even want to see there, mainly because it upsets their hegemony and damages their calm. Can’t have northern oiks who don’t know their place lecturing folk on how to govern the plebs. (tsk)

      But it doesn’t. It doesn’t shame them at all. They’re a bit busy playing for the big chair.

      UK politics isn’t merely broken. It’s seismically fractured. The populations of these islands are facing constitutional crisis. Economic crisis. Societal breakdown and political chaos. All of which has been brought about mainly by Conservative and Labour’s practice of politics. The outcomes of those epically ignorant and arrogant practices almost inevitable some might say.

      And those two (HMGs government and its official opposition), are STILL fucking about with party politics as if sitting in a big chair matters.

      This will not end well for either of them.

    42. Gary45% says:

      “Corbyn in for the kill”
      Jezza sticks his head above the parapet, starts to load the rifle and drops the ammunition into his Horlicks.
      Mumbly Fumbly.

    43. Ken500 says:

      Raab ‘Give businesses tax breaks to weather Brexit’. So collect less tax and bankrupt businesses.

      The EU costs £12Billion and brings benefits.

      The Tories should try and balance the budget instead of keep on borrowing.

      They can’t count or read a balance sheet.

    44. Doug_Bryce says:

      Corbyn is just a wet-fart. Scared to call vote of no confidence in case he wins an election…

      Leader of opposition should be easiest job in UK politics right now.

    45. galamcennalath says:

      Google searches limited to the last hour are bringing up very little of this in msm headline stories.

      Looks like the msm are ignoring it. If so, Labour will let the Tories off the hook.

      It will be put down to a stunt by anti Brexit parties just to try to get an EURef2.

      For a GE or an EURef2, Brexit will need to be delayed. That requires the cooperation of EU27. Or, Brexit can be cancelled. Labour don’t want to be seen as damaging or stopping Brexit and they don’t want to be in control when things go tits up.

      Labour want Brexit to happen and they want it to damage the Tories. Party first, Establishment second, voters a poor third. We all know the Labour motto.

    46. Mike says:

      Both Corbyn and May want a no deal Brexit. Both are hard core Little Engarlander blood and soil Nationalists. Which is the kind of headline we should be reading in the media and would be if we actually had a media holding our public officials to account for who and what they are and what they do as a result.
      Both are committing high treason and yet the act of high treason has been normalised to the point where it is everyday business in UK politics.
      We should change the title of Prime Minister to Godfather.
      And Im not joking.

    47. Ken500 says:

      Corbyn stayed in a Party for nearly 40 years disagreeing with every major policy. Instead of going off and doing something useful. Now reneging on every ‘principle’.

      The winter of discontent.Three day weeks, candles, rubbish piled in the street, the dead not getting buried. Illegal wars, financial fraud and tax evasion. Thatcher 15% unemployment, inflation up to 25%, interest rates 15%+. The only place where unemployment was under 10% was London S/E. Deregulated banking, leverage from 25% to 13% collateral, causing the banking crash. Riots and violence in the streets. The Poll tax. EU matters brought Thatcher down. Illegal wars, financial fraud and tax evasion.

      A Tory migrant cutting migration. A bunch of total hypocrites.

      May is an absolute hypocrite. What a liar. Rees Mogg references Thatcher. The EU fights in the Tory Party brought her down. Rats in a sack.

    48. Socrates MacSporran says:

      It seems to me the msm is treating the joint tabling of a vote of no confidence in the UK Government as a dry run for Indyref2.

      They have decided to ignore it, not mention it, it simply is not happening.

      I reckon, when Nicola calls Indyref2, and the Maybot says: “Now is not the time and you are not getting a Section 30 order,” the red, yellow and blue Tories will boycott it – the Unionist media will ignore it and even if the SNP succeeds in getting say a 60% voter turn-out and an overwhelming mandate for Independence – they will try to ignore this.

      Remember, when the Establishment were pushed into having referenda about English regional assemblies or a change to some form of pr voting, the media did the Establishment’s dirty work and failed to mention them, to the extent they failed.

      It has worked before – they will try it again.

    49. Breeks says:

      The English do not deserve Brexit. The English are simply victims of the same cradle to grave indoctrination that we Scots suffer too.

      The indoctrination serves to belittle Scotland, and instill in us a sense of inferiority which keeps our population fractured and devoid of common purpose or identity. We call it the “cringe” as if it is something homegrown within us. It is much more insidious than that.

      The same indoctrination serves to promote English exceptionalism, that the English are masters of all they survey, and instill in some of them, a lot of them, the notion Scotland really aught to be grateful the English lowered the drawbridge and allowed us in to be
      “British”. The are profoundly resentful that our gratitude is so lukewarm.

      I won’t go into detail between the psychology of British Exceptionalism and the similar psychology of the Nazi’s fervent belief they were the Master Race. There is still hope for England, and their fate isn’t sealed, but I would hope the parallels are there for all to see. It was not however the German people who were responsible for the proliferation of Nazism, it was their indoctrination, and a cradle to grave diet of German exceptionalism served up by Goebbels and his propaganda. It is often said, the first country the Nazis invaded was Germany. We need only look over our Border to see how that could happen.

      Scotland, thankfully, has not been poisoned by the toxic delusion of Scottish exceptionalism. Lucky for us indoctrination that says you’re shite doesn’t take hold quite so well as indoctrination that says you’re Lords of the Earth, but it is the same indoctrination creating the false perspectives.

      Our enemy isn’t the English. They are just victims of an indoctrination that is more comfortable for them to wear than our is, but it is infinitely more cruel and damaging, and in the long run it will extract a far heavier price from them. We have a get out clause, a Constitutional step ladder to help us out the pit.

      There is an enemy, but I promise you it isn’t the English. It is the pure evil of the faceless British Establishment that relies upon and steers the direction of British Nationist Indoctrination.

      Before you abandon England to the mercy of flag waving extremists, remember that Scotland’s indoctrination still clouds the mind of roughly half our population and it is resilient. We should take a minute to ask ourselves whether the 15 million English folks who voted Remain are those resistant to or waking up from their indoctrination, just as some of us Scots are waking up from ours.

      The British Indoctrination Monster already has these Remainers, or Remoaners as it labels them, in its sights, smearing their views as treach-erous and subversive, and is trying to push a second Brexit Referendum beyond their reach on the grounds such a democratic health check would be terminal for democracy. Does “No to a second referendum” sound familiar? – Think Donald Sutherland in the last scene of the Body Snatchers.

      If Scotland’s BritNats are so secure in their righteous majority, If British Brexiteers are so secure in their righteous majority, just ask yourself why they exercise such fear and cowardice in seeing their position tested.

      They defend their respective slim majorities like a thieves who stole it. – For the very simple reason that is exactly what they did.

    50. ronnie anderson says:

      Just another day of Anti Climatical decisions from Westminster .

    51. Shug says:

      Somone call kaye she will know why thebbc doea not report the no confidence vote stoey
      I am sure there is a good reason

    52. Early Ball says:

      If Labour indicate they will not back the motion then why would any rebel Tories stick their head above the parapet.

    53. Proud Cybernat says:

      Have to say that I am hardly surprised that the DR published something on its front page that turned out to be a load of bollox.

    54. Marcia says:

      It is the time of year for ‘pass the parcel’ game. Labour don’t want to be holding the Brexit parcel when the music stops. They would be blamed for the mess this Brexit things has become.

      People know what is going on. A friend in his 80’s and a loyal Tory as you can get is shocked at the mess we are in and won’t vote Tory or Labour next time and doesn’t trust the LD but now admires Nicola Sturgeon, SNP et all for the way they have handled the looming crisis.

    55. North chiel says:

      “ Galamcennalth @ 0858” , 2nd top story on STV news website behind “ fishing deal”.

    56. Ken500 says:

      Scottish IndyRef with EU support. The Westminster unionists can’t ignore it. Or if they do it will not have any influence. Look at Ireland. The DUP do not represent NI. A minority.

      May has ‘negotiated’ a worse EU deal with less rights that costs more. Illogical. Then wants people to sign up for it.

      Soon it will be make or break time. Another IndyRef? The tone has changed.

    57. Tinto Chiel says:

      @Macart, galamcennalath, Socrates and Breeks: your latest comments are particularly accurate and sum up the situation at the moment very well.

      This site is still the best, despite the increasingly desperate attentions of the Underbridgers.

    58. Clootie says:

      I think Corbyn will definitely consider discussing a firm proposal to abstain but only after his next astrological consultation takes place.

      i do believe Corbyn now when he says he would not press the button in a nuclear war. Unfortunately it is not because of any strong moral stance….it is simply the inability to make a decision on anything.

    59. Ken500 says:

      All the devolved administration are suddenly getting involved in talks. After being totally ignored. The Tory opportunist. Desperation.

      May can’t bribe Nicola.

    60. Macart says:

      So far only the Independent carrying the story. FFS!

    61. geeo says:

      Sky News reporter in Brussels: “If there is no deal, there is no transition period, so on the 1st April next year, if you are a ‘brit’ and live in an EU country, overnight you become an illegal immigrant”.

      Adam Boulton: “i hope you don’t get deported, ha-ha”
      ……..

      Typical glib attitude to a very serious issue for lots of people, millions, in fact !

    62. Essexexile says:

      I heartily agree with Breeks comments above re English superiority complex. The number of times I’ve heard ‘Europe needs us more than we need them’ in my part of the world is way too many to dismiss as a few dumb idiots.
      Of course, it’s not everybody. I detect a decreasing ‘reverse cringe’ in many of my English friends who openly say they are becoming ashamed to be British or English.

    63. Truth says:

      I realised a long long time ago that Labour only act in the interest of themselves.

      That is a good guide, and virtually 100% accurate in deducing what course of action they will take.

    64. mike cassidy says:

      We live in a world where China can decide that it is a near-arctic state

      http://archive.is/NAHCM

      And still Corbyn can’t make a decision on a VONC.

    65. Robert Peffers says:

      @Bob Mack says: 19 December, 2018 at 7:35 am:

      ” … Labour don’t want to be in power at this time. Would you take over this mess and deal with it rather than use it as a stick to beat the Tories in a future elEcton?”

      I think you may be missing a little bit in that assessment Bob Mack.

      First of all the three Westminster parties are all unionist parties and they are, all three, The Establishment political wing and when what they all see as the Parliament of England is under threat the all stand together, shoulder to shoulder.

      The second bit is that, with the exception of the ministers and shadow ministers the main body of the MPs all draw the same in salary, perks and expenses. They all get the same income whether in power or not in power. Furthermore you couldn’t shove a Rizla fag paper between the two main union parties if you tried.

      Labour are unionists and are thus just as much pro-Brexit as the Tories are. Then there is that little fact the Trade Unions have been emasculated, mainly by the Tories, but also they have very much discredited themselves in the eyes of the general public.

      Labour, since NuLabour are very much more a Middle England party than a party for the workers. As so often stated here on Wings, both main parties, “Ir jist twa cheeks o the same earse”.

    66. jfngw says:

      This no confidence vote is only going to be reported if Labour supports it, then it will be heralded as a Labour initiative, the truth given a one line somewhere way down the story.

      We know how it works in Scotland, we have watched Reporting Scotland for years, it is only a story once after it has become a press release from one of the unionist parties. They often claim they have covered it because someone tweeted something at some point.

      Counter to what someone else said, they will cover a referendum but very negatively, the line will be there is no point voting because it will be boycotted and not valid. They want a low turnout to negate it.

    67. geeo says:

      Socrates MacSporran.

      You said this..
      ……….

      “I reckon, when Nicola calls Indyref2, and the Maybot says: “Now is not the time and you are not getting a Section 30 order,” the red, yellow and blue Tories will boycott it – the Unionist media will ignore it”
      ……….

      That would be great news for us, as a plebiscite of Scots is the ultimate expression of that Sovereign Will.

      Anyone refusing to vote, for whatever reason simply gets treated as those Sovereign Scots choosing to accept the sovereign will of those who choose to vote in said plebiscite.

      Result would stand, boycott or not.

    68. Luigi says:

      The BritNat Establishment MSM has a bit of a problem with recent events. They have to protect May at WM, but they have to protect Corbyn in Scotland (hence the Daily Record rides to the rescue, whilst the English papers will simultaneously slaughter Corbyn). The problem is, news tends to cross the Scottish-English border quite quickly these days. People have wised up – they are on to them.

      Corbyn’s bluff has been well and truly called – by the blue tories and the other parties (in different ways). Nowhere now to hide. The cunning plan has hit the Brexit rocks – smashed to smithereens. He has shown the world, once and for all, that he is no leader. My heart bleeds. 🙂

    69. jfngw says:

      Another interesting aspect is the journalists that were willing to question why the SNP had not tabled a no confidence motion and broadcast this as a negative SNP story. Now that they have, they don’t report it.

      It would seem the media are only interested in a story if it has a negative SNP spin. No doubt this will be turned into a negative SNP story ‘futile gesture’, I think the Labour line, rather than Labour cowardice. Remember ‘cowardice’ is a reserved matter for SNP stories by the Scottish media when they make up lies to print.

    70. call me dave says:

      Something fishy not going on in the news…wonder what?

      I have no confidence in either of my BBC Aunties darn Sarf or North of the wall.

      Not in the news where anybody is in this ‘country’ ‘Nation’ ‘realm’ ‘Sceptered Isle’ ‘Britain’ ‘union’ or ‘UK’

      FGS 🙁

    71. geeo says:

      Jeezo…Sky know which dog whistle zoomers to interview.

      Julia Hartley-Brewer: “Adam, i hate to tell you, but i think you are knowledgeable enough to know that what people voted for in 1975 is not remotely what we ended up with in 2016”

      Open fecking goal to hit back with, “what people voted for in 2016 is feck all like what we are going to get in 2019”.

      Nah, before you ask, Boulton said nothing about that. These rabid brexiters are never challenged on their drivel.

    72. Luigi says:

      What – the BritNats would boycott a referendum?

      Oh Pleeeeease – go ahead, make it happen. 🙂

    73. Luigi says:

      Can the SNP, LibDems and Greens, perchance table a no-confidence motion on the official leader of the opposition?

      He’s certainly no up to the job, after all. If the tories voted for or against, JC would be fecked. They could abstain, I suppose.

      Just askin. 🙂

    74. Ken500 says:

      Sky BBC just get people arguing with each other and call it ‘news’. Cheap nonsense. Bolton – Sky having built it up. Now regretting it. Liars.

      There will be no transaction period with ‘no deal’. It’s more lies.

      Trump US has prohibited pump action bullets. A move towards gun control?

    75. Robert Peffers says:

      @Kenno says: 19 December, 2018 at 8:07 am:

      ” … These two English institutions have one thing I common, they don’t give a shit about Scotland.
      Time to dump England and her Establishment.”

      That’s because they are all the one Establishment’s political wing but The Establishment is much larger than their political wing.

    76. Auld Rock says:

      Corbyn doesn’t want the Tories out before 29th March 2019 because if he does he knows he’ll be faced with exactly the same deal. He wants to be able to blame the Tories for the mess, me I blame both of them.

    77. Who would ever have thought that we have a situation where have the worst Westminster government in living memory, and at the same time have an equally inept, incompetent and useless official opposition.

      Jeremy Corbyn is no leader, never has been, he’s sat on the back benches at Westminster dreaming the dreams of a socialist utopia that has not and never will exist.

      And when he’s faced with the reality of having to make any decisions he waffles and does nothing and abstains.

      It seems the voters in England are beginning to see how useless he really is and in any general election they may decide to stick with the devil they know.

      Which if we in Scotland don’t get independence soon will be bad news for us and our country

    78. Colin Alexander says:

      Nice to see the SNP agreed with my suggestion about the SNP should table a Motion of No Confidence in UK Govt.

      Maybe the SNP and I aren’t so far apart after all.

      Nice move SNP. Well done.

    79. Clapper57 says:

      I remember when Paul Sweeney berated Alison Thewliss when being interviewed on Scotland Tonight by Bernard Ponsonby re her not committing to SNP backing a Labour vote of no confidence in the “government”….then when it did NOT happen he started to back pedal via twitter. She actually did not refuse to do this but said will need to see details.

      Think we all know who is playing politics in Brexit shenanigans ……Labour once again…talk the talk but never walk the walk.

      Both the Tories and Labour will be culpable for this mess…and no amount of spin will be able to deflect their joint dereliction of duty in this fiasco.

    80. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      If you paste,

      “England No More” proclaimers “Letter From America”
      into Google, you’ll get two hits. The first seems to be a Russian version of YouTube, which features,
      “The 2 little Colins from Edinburgh perform The Proclaimers Letter from America”.
      WARNING! The site carries porn ads!

      The second hit is a link to a post of yesterday on the “Coming through the field” WOS page.

    81. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      So the only knowledge of the phrase “England No More” on the entire World Wide Web, is in the mind of ONE commenter on WOS.

    82. pussy nancy says:

      Wonder if the military will be deployed in the Cabinet room this afternoon? You know, one in each corner holding a machine gun in order to protect the Brexit vote.
      It could resemble the Valentine’s Day Massacre in there and the BBC/Media still wouldn’t report it!

    83. geeo says:

      @luigi.

      Angus McNeil raised that very question during a Point of Order yesterday.

      (From Hansard)
      ……….

      Brendan MacNeil

      “Further to the point of order from the hon. Member for Nottingham East (Mr Leslie), Mr Speaker.

      Is it possible for a Back-Bench MP to table a motion of no confidence in Her Majesty’s Opposition, given the mess they have made of tabling a motion of no confidence?

      They have confused even their own Back Benchers over the difference between a motion of no confidence in the Prime Minister and a motion of no confidence in the Government.

      They have made an utter shambles of the entire process. So can we have two motions of no confidence: one in the Government and one in that lot over there?
      ……..

      Brilliant stuff !!

    84. North chiel says:

      Classic Britnat “ set up” on Sky news at present with the Britnat establishment duo sitting side by side ( Rory the Tory and Labourite) across the table Kirsty Blackman being treated abysmally by Fiasal continually being sidelined to adverts & HOC . All no doubt preplanned.

    85. Jack Murphy says:

      NO DEAL BREXIT. The Mail On-line

      “Britain told to prepare for no deal DOOMSDAY:…..”

      “……Millions of businesses have also been told to prepare.
      HM Revenue & Customs will email 80,000 firms directly while a 100-page ‘Partnership Pack’ will be published to help all companies get themselves ready for turmoil.
      ….”
      Mrs May’s spokesman refused to comment on whether families will be warned about food stock piling or reports Northern Ireland could be left dependent on generators……” 🙁 🙁

      This May/Mundell/Davidson Brexit is a dangerous Whitehall Farce.

      Let the Kingdom of England have it’s Brexit and good luck to our neighbours. 🙂

      The Kingdom of Scotland will NOT follow!

      http://archive.is/VMOOZ

    86. Ghillie says:

      Kenno.

      No more.

      Seriously.

    87. Bobp says:

      Breeks 9.19am good post.

    88. Robert Peffers says:

      @Kenno says: 19 December, 2018 at 8:27 am:

      ” … You surely mean the “Day Late Record”.

      the Establishment are running scared right now. Yesterday in the House the parliamentary leader of the SNP stated categorically that if Westminster attempted to drag the Kingdom of Scotland out of the European Union the Scottish Government would pursue the Scottish Claim of Right, (That the UK Supreme Court recently ratified), in the ECJ.

      Now the UK has adopted in full the United Nations Charter of Human rights, and while still an EU member state signed up to the ECJ human rights legislation so there is little chance that the UK could win a challenge for Scottish self determination and thus the Kingdom of Scotland and the Kingdom of England will part company by ending the bipartite United Kingdom. Mind you they may be stupid enough to believe their own propaganda that Scotland, the country, is leaving a four country united country union incongruously titled the United Kingdom that resulted from a two kingdom Treaty of Union but I doubt and responsible law court would believe the United Kingdom is a union of countries.

      Scotland will not be leaving the union Scotland will be ending it.

      This is bigger by far than Brexit or anything else since 1707 when UK history began. Yet where are the screaming headlines in the MSM, SMSM, and the excited newscasts on UK radio & TV?

      They most certainly are not so stupid that they don’t get the implications of Ian Blackford’s statement in parliament so the only explanation of the media silence is they are frightened to let the less aware Scottish voters know that the United Kingdom is about to end. Alternatively Westminster knows all this Brexit bullshit is a bluff on the part of Theresa May and Westminster will vote to stay in the EU after all.

      The question is will Scots decide to stay in union with the English Kingdom?

    89. Colin Alexander says:

      @ Robert Peffers

      Robert, the SC ruling makes no mention of the Claim of Right.

      Here is the ruling:

      http://www.bailii.org/uk/cases/UKSC/2018/64.html

      The Claim of Right was never in dispute, as far as I’m aware.

    90. yesindyref2 says:

      @Robert Peffers
      You’re encouraging a flag troll whose purpose is to try to tar Wings as anti-English.

      If you read this post:

      https://wingsoverscotland.com/coming-through-the-field/#comment-2418290

      you’ll find that 6 others afterwards have been asked to be added to the list if any racism is reported to Rev Stu. And there’d probably be more, but there was already a new thread – this one.

    91. ronnie anderson says:

      Goalmouth camera’s needed in Westminster , bigger stooshie than the non existent motion of no confidence & that stupid woman .

    92. Gary says:

      Well, I’d never have know about this if it weren’t for Wings and I will never find out the result unless Wings tells me either.

      The BBC. ITV etc have failed to run this story on their TV news despite it being f national importance.

      We CANNOT trust our TV news, they report ONLY what we are ALLOWED to know.

      We used to laugh at the Russians in the 80s, they had censored news and knew nothing of what happened, even in their own country, well, we’re not laughing now, are we??

    93. Terençe callachan says:

      Labour and the Conservatives and Lib Dems all abide by instructions from USA which are that should the UK remain part of the EU the increasing trade war that the USA is having with the EU and with Russia and with China, will affect the UK.
      The Anglo Saxon cosy relationship only applies if the UK sides with the USA which it usually does and is doing once again by leaving the EU.
      Corbyn is only a brexiter because he knows that if Labour are ever in government again the way they are treated by USA will be determined by their position on leaving the EU.
      If you understand this, then Corbyns decision to keep Theresa May in power when she is leading the worst most diabolical government in a hundred years in understandable.
      Corbyn doesn’t want a general election for fear of this.
      If labour took control of government they would still inflict Brexit on the UK and would be unable to explain to their voters why.
      The fear of USA in Westminsters government runs deep.
      Come on Scotland
      Leave this corrupt untrustworthy UK

    94. Bill Purves says:

      The claim of right was upheld by Westminster Parliament in July this year, not to do so would have broken the Treaty of Union.

    95. Angry Weegie says:

      Are we not all misinterpreting the Record sub-head. Are they not saying that Corbyn plans to call a no confidence vote some afternoon in May of next year? Surely much more likely.

    96. manandboy says:

      With the English electorate now divided along pro and anti EU lines, having abandoned, more or less, the historic Tory/Labour model, and, matching similar divisions within the 2 main parties, Westminster is now engaged in a three-dimensional political chess game, in which no-one has any previous experience and the rules of which have not been written.
      Add in the Tory/Labour refusal to ever be honest with the voters, and we have a confused crawl to the Brexit No Deal cliff. Confusion and an impatient, simmering anger is the mood of the moment – but for how much longer?

      Brexit has turned into a suicide vest for the Tories which they can’t get out of, while Labour are torn between preventing terrible damage to England – and to the Tory Party – on the one hand, and on the other, destroying Labour’s General Election prospects in the process.

      Brexit – the illogical contradiction seemingly destined to bring England down and to break the United Kingdom completely apart.

      And as an avalanche needs no helping hand, so the Brexit ‘avalanche’ appears to have all the momentum and gravity it needs to get right down to the bottom of the constitutional hill, levelling everything along the way.

      Watch – and wait.

    97. Les Wilson says:

      Labour are never going to endanger the Tories at this time.
      We can see how May behaves, and Corbyn is just as bad.
      Like limbo dancers trying to show who can go the lowest.

      If Brexit landed into labour’s hand by any means, it would then show them up for what they are, also utterly incompetent.
      So the muppet show goes on, and labour will avoid it regardless of the damage that will occur.



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