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The yawning chasm

Posted on July 07, 2015 by

There’s a very strange feature in today’s Daily Record, and it’s not even one of their regular pieces of pioneering and hard-hitting investigative journalism about who’s the hottest guest ever to appear on the Jeremy Kyle show.

recordsurvation

The headline screams unequivocally that according to a new Survation poll, fear of the SNP influencing a Labour government was the reason that English voters swung back to the Conservatives, defying polls that said the Tories would be the largest party but be short of an overall majority.

(Weirdly it says that their goal in doing so was to “keep Salmond out of power”, even though (a) Alex Salmond is a humble backbench MP who doesn’t even lead the SNP group at Westminster, let alone the party, and (b) he won his seat anyway.)

The article then produces a flurry of graphs and figures showing that various numbers of supporters of the four UK parties switched their votes to various other parties after being polled (as always happens).

But then there’s something quite important missing.

The Record goes on to quote the chief executive of pollsters Survation:

“Survation chief executive Damian Lyons Lowe said he had uncovered ‘compelling evidence’ that the threat of the Nationalists drove many English voters to back the Conservatives in the final days of the campaign.

He told the Record: “We know that people were concerned about the SNP. Liberal Democrat and UKIP voters were particularly strong in their view that an SNP-supported Labour government would be ‘illegitimate’.

‘We believe a significant section of the public were convinced by the polls predicting a hung parliament and so worried about such an outcome that they changed their voting preference to stop it from happening.'”

Now, “we believe” is unusual language for a polling company to use. The very nature of a poll is that it seeks to establish facts, not suspicions or beliefs or funny little feelings. Survation – as far as we can tell from the data that’s been released – didn’t actually ASK anyone WHY they changed their vote, just WHETHER they did, and then appear to have arrived at a baseless conclusion about it on a whim.

Number Cruncher Politics, a UK statistical analysis website that predicted the Tory victory in advance and as far as we know has no dog in the Scottish political fight, unequivocally rubbished Survation and the Record’s claims within minutes of the piece being published last night:

numbrcrunchr1

numbrcrunchr2

numbrcrunchr3

It noted that the net effect of people switching from the Lib Dems and UKIP to the two main parties had a net combined effect of less than 1% of the vote – not enough to have made any significant difference to the outcome of the election, which the Tories won by 6.5% and almost 100 seats.

But that’s just the numbers. The Survation poll data makes no findings whatsoever about WHY any of those people might have changed their vote, because it didn’t ask them. It discounts seemingly-obvious possible explanations, like UKIP supporters voting Tory to ensure David Cameron remained Prime Minister so they’d get their EU referendum – something this site had been predicting for a year and a half:

ukipmay

As it happened, UKIP’s final vote share (12.6%) was indeed almost exactly half the peak (25%) that it achieved in the period between that Wings article and the vote, in a poll by – funnily enough – Survation in October 2014.

(It scored 20% or more on numerous other occasions with the same pollster – 21% in May, 22% in June, 24% in November, 23% in December and 23% in January 2015.)

The staggeringly, blindingly obvious fact is that there are any number of potential explanations for every individual vote change. 5% of Labour voters switched to the Tories, but 9% either switched to “Other” – which could of course include the SNP, since Survation’s poll was UK-wide – or stayed at home.

We could be here all day listing possible reasons why Labour supporters might have done that. (We’d also been predicting, accurately, for years that Labour would lose in 2015, for reasons which were nothing to do with the SNP and were backed by acres of soild historical data.)

It seems an incredibly large oversight for Survation not to break down the “Other” vote if it was going to come to conclusions about the SNP – especially when it DID include the Nats as an option when polling people who had previously been undecided, and of whom more broke for Labour than the Tories:

survdk

It’s also curious when seen in the context of the SNP’s leader Nicola Sturgeon being the most popular politician in the entire UK in the weeks leading up to the election:

“In every part of Britain the First Minister is also top of the polling, from +30 in north-east England to +38 in Wales and the West Country and +33 in Greater London.”

In short, then, it’s simply ridiculous given the available data to arrive at the conclusion that fear of the SNP won David Cameron the election, for a whole hatful of reasons:

1. People weren’t asked their reasons for switching.
2. The SNP weren’t included as a switching option.
3. The net numbers of Lib Dem and  UKIP switchers were far too low to matter.
4. There are far more plausible reasons for UKIP voters switching.
5. More undecideds went Labour than Tory after the Salmond posters came out.
6. Polling almost always underestimates the Tory vote.
7. Nicola Sturgeon was in fact very popular outside Scotland as well as inside.

…and too many more to list. It’s unquestionably true that the idea of the SNP holding influence over Labour generated a lot of hot air, but there’s precisely zero evidence that it actually affected anyone’s vote (let alone negatively), and elections are decided on votes, not column inches and airtime. People saying “I’m concerned about X” is a very long way from “X actually made me change who I voted for.”

(Everyone talked about the Liberal Democrats hysterically for weeks in 2010, but then they all went out and voted for Labour and the Tories as usual. The party’s vote share barely budged an inch and they LOST seats. The obsessions of the novelty-seeking commentariat are increasingly disconnected from the priorities of the electorate.)

We recommend reading Survation’s own conclusions about the poll results in full, in which the SNP are barely mentioned. The Daily Record’s assertions are complete and utter nonsense. “The SNP let the Tories in!” was tedious, mendacious drivel in 1979, and it’s tedious, mendacious drivel now.

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    1. 07 07 15 12:42

      The yawning chasm | Politics Scotland | Scoop.it

    225 to “The yawning chasm”

    1. Luigi says:

      So the Red Tories and their DR mouthpiece once again take the easy option: Blame the SNP rather than face up to the crucial part they themselves played in their downfall. Head in the sand stuff.

    2. “The Daily Record’s assertions are complete and utter nonsense”.

      You could post that line pretty much every day.

    3. heraldnomore says:

      Given your own experience of publishing poll results Stu, is it the case that the DR would need to get the approval of Survation to every interpretation that they publish?

    4. Turnip_ghost says:

      Create the lie and let people remember it. The truth doesn’t matter here, not to labour anyway.

    5. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Given your own experience of publishing poll results Stu, is it the case that the DR would need to get the approval of Survation to every interpretation that they publish?”

      Yes. Which makes it even weirder. Survation’s own analysis says IF we believe there may have been a late swing and differential turnout in England & Wales as a result of concerns about the SNP’s influence in a hung parliament”. (My caps.)

      It really is a remarkable leap. Labour want to blame someone else for being shit, the pollsters want to blame someone else for getting all their predictions wrong, and it suits everyone to pretend that a few posters of Alex Salmond explain everything.

    6. Holebender says:

      Who needs evidence when “SNPbad” trumps all?

    7. Socrates MacSporran says:

      Rev. – You are forgetting the Daily REcord’s creed: Don’t let the facts get in the way of SNP-bashing.

    8. Alan says:

      It’s part of a continuing, and to my mind quite bizarre, campaign by Labour and their pro Union backers that by repeatedly telling the Scots voting SNP encourages English voters to back the Tories will somehow persuade Scots to vote for anyone but the SNP.

      I have no hope that Labour in E&W will ever see the damage they’re doing to themselves down south for no gain in Scotland.

    9. Ben says:

      The Daily Record are doing a great job of ensuring their irrelevance. Narrow minded , poisonous nonsense posing as journalism. Won’t be that long until it closes its doors

    10. Robert Roddick says:

      How do we know that people are being honest after having cast their votes. I suspect that these selected answers were what this particular pollster wanted to hear.

    11. Graeme Doig says:

      Rev

      With all this practise you’re getting it won’t be too long before you get the hang of dismantling this DR, SNP totally, completely, utterly bad, nonsense.

      Stick with it, you’ll get there in the end 😉

    12. Training Day says:

      “It really is a remarkable leap. Labour want to blame someone else for being shit, the pollsters want to blame someone else for getting all their predictions wrong, and it suits everyone to pretend that a few posters of Alex Salmond explain everything.”

      In a nutshell.

      Perhaps the remaining hapless few who give any credence to the Record whatsoever also enjoy Orange Torch..

    13. Donald MacKenzie says:

      ‘fraid you’ve just got to see that there’s a picture of George ‘rent-a-mouth’ Foukles attached to the article to know that whatever is written is going to be utter drivel.

    14. Luigi says:

      No mistake, folks. What we are witnessing is the birth of a myth, soon to be part of Labour folklore. It’s like 1979 all over again. There is a big difference this time, however, that the red tories would be wise to consider: In 1979, it was the action of the SNP they blamed for letting the tories in. In 2015, it was the action of the electorate (by either voting SNP at the election, for declaring support in opinion polls). By blaming the “SNP surge”, they are blaming the voters! A good way to win them back? Have they really thought this one out properly?

    15. ahundredthidiot says:

      No picture of Nicola……wonder why that is

      no question mark….rhetorical…..DR dying on its feet

    16. steveasaneilean says:

      “It really is a remarkable leap. Labour want to blame someone else for being shit”

      And that’s it in a nutshell Stu. As long as they fail to address their own internal issues that caused their failure and instead blame it on everyone else (“SNP bad”, “people didn’t understand our message” etc.)then they have no hope of a recovery.

    17. Luigi says:

      Labour’s message to their ex-supporters:

      “The SNP were really bad to dupe you stupid voters and let the tories back in”

      They will soon be rushing back to the fold!

    18. Dr Jim says:

      Maybe the Daily Record are clairvoyant and they just know these things (because they do)

      Ooooh!!!

    19. Luigi says:

      Labour’s message to their ex-supporters:

      “The SNP were really bad to dupe you stupid voters and let the tories back in”

      Actually – there is also a lesson in there for us YES voters:

      Careful how you treat the soft NOes. Don’t offend them!:)

    20. Dan Huil says:

      Excellent analysis from numbrcrunchr and yourself, Rev. However, Cameron did play the anti-Scottish card during the election and that attitude will not go easily away amongst many voters in England, hence Cameron’s desperation to speedily introduce EVEL.

      Labour will of course continue to blame the SNP for everything [it’s all Labour does] but Cameron has been, and is, undermining, unwittingly or not, the union between Scotland and England. Let him get on with it, I say.

    21. Joemcg says:

      Seems a very strange story when Nicola went down a storm in the UK wide televised debates and topped both snap polls. No mention of that though eh DR?

    22. Jack Laidlaw says:

      Great article, When I read the story in Daily Record I stupidly presumed they had asked people why they voted Tory. The misinformation out there is astonishing. I really worry about people who don’t use the internet they must believe have the crap on TV or newspapers. I always knew SNP would get treated badly by the press but it is getting a bit too much like North Korean propoganda for me.

    23. K1 says:

      This must be part of the Daily Record’s cunning plan to assist Labour in keeping their ‘core vote’ in Scotland, by maintaining the ancient and debunked perennial ‘SNP let the Tories in’ narrative that so thoroughly ‘worked’ for years in Scotland.

      My own mother came out with this crap during the ref campaign, they really do ‘believe’ this, and the DR feeds it to them in great big juicy dollops like this…this is low information churnalism…undigestible bile from the people’s champions. Lots of wee pie charts wi colours and numbers and a wee nyaff typing it up to manageable bite sized porkies for the punters.

      It’s not that people are stupid, it’s that by the very ‘reading’ of the rags people are made ‘stupid’. You are what you read, or more succinctly you become what you indulge in…jeez…whit would be the point of ‘education’ if that wisnae the case? The DR is the top dumbing down rag in Scotland, it’s bad fur yer mental health.

      The DR and the rest of them are a shower of cynical shysters shitting all over Scotland and getting awarded for the privilege…sooner they’re consigned to the dustbin of obscurity…the better. Don’t even get me started on pollsters…and their propaganda ‘influence’…another shower of spivs by the looks of it, on the make for their own gain. Wankers. Sigh.

    24. Bob Mack says:

      Regardless of what assertions the Daily Unionist makes,the simple fact is that 50% of the Scottish electorate voted SNP.
      It is also evident that the Scottish electorate and the English electorate who supported the Tories for whatever reason are diametrically opposed as to the direction of government travel..i.e. we are chalk and cheese..
      The more than gap widens,the less likely the Union is to survive.
      Mr Osborne is about to put another nail in that particular coffin very soon.

    25. heedtracker says:

      If you have a relatively good job in the UK and your partner does too, life is good. Mortgages are cheap, food’s nae bad, hols are great value, new car sales highest ever, sweatshop Far East cheap kids clothes, and tax is still bearable. BUT Labour only threatened all of that over and over and over.

      Even so it didn’t stop vote Tory campers or sneaks and creeps like Linton Crosby going after Britnat/English nat keep Scotland British/down either.

      Thus their Salmond’s a thieving pickpocket, Sturgeon most dangerous Scottish woman in teamGB and poor old Milliband’s their puppet.

      Here in middle England, it looks like most dont care about what Scotland does, until it actually looked like Scotland might vote YES. If there’s one thing middle England is sensitive to, its borrowing costs, especially in the public sector middle classes.

      And who does most of the teamGB voting?

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynton_Crosby

      Tactics

      Crosby is described as favouring what is called a wedge strategy, whereby the party he advises introduces a divisive or controversial social issue into a campaign, aligning its own stance with the dissenting faction of its opponent party, with the goal of causing vitriolic debate inside the opposing party, defection of its supporters, and the legitimising of sentiment which had previously been considered inappropriate.

    26. Dcanmore says:

      It’s all about the heading and getting people to back Labour again. In other words vote SNP get Tories.

      Good ‘ol DR trying to keep SLAB relevant for SE2016 by shaming Labour voters who went to the SNP.

    27. No no no...Yes says:

      Wonderful analysis and it’s no wonder the Daily Record has no credibility. They are incapable of facing the fact that they backed a failed party, the Labour Party, in the GE.

      The Record seems to have a death wish in continuing this garbage, people haven’t believed them for years, and won’t be fooled again.

    28. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Seems a very strange story when Nicola went down a storm in the UK wide televised debates and topped both snap polls.”

      Very good point, edited in.

    29. galamcennalath says:

      And again … Cock up or conspiracy?

      Survation’s inclusion of the ‘if’ make their assertion pretty weak.

      It looks like the usual poor standards of DR investigative journalism and analysis of facts, combined with an agenda to say “SNP bad, Labour still ok”, resulted in this garbage.

      The problem, as always, is that those who fail to actively seek out the truth will believe the garbage!

    30. Petra says:

      This helps to detract from the major part that they played in the now defunct Vow.

      More than anything they are lining up to ‘mind – control’ connect the SNP to the forthcoming cuts to be announced in the Tory / Osborne budget tomorrow …. people voted for the Tories because of the SNP and now we’re getting all of these cuts. The SNP are to blame … Bad, Bad SNP (don’t vote for them next year).

      The Daily Record must have some of the most manipulative journalists in the country working for them such as Mr Chrichton. I wonder if their ‘man who walks the corridors of Westminster’ has attended the courses in the US.

      http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-06-19/imf-trained-greek-journalists-washington-spin-stories-favor-troika

    31. call me dave says:

      Daily Record heading towards the fate of the NME being given away free soon as ‘no-one is buying it’ (in both senses of that phrase)

    32. Mealer says:

      Survation should be asked to explain what makes them “believe a significant section…etc”.

    33. James Barr Gardner says:

      The daily wrecker headlines are crap as all wingers and yessers know, but we need to get it across to the public in general to oust their catalogue of lies, smears and deception.

      How can we do this daily and long term also sort the ebc at the same time?

    34. Mealer says:

      Ian “bayonet the wounded” Davidson could have written this piece for the Dirty Redcoat.

    35. Clootie says:

      …it’s a Daily Record story!

      that means it has little basis in fact and any grain of truth within will be spun to make white into black.

      This is the newspaper that brought you the “VOW”

      Apart from puppy training and bird cage floor lining I see little use for this rag.

    36. ‘Naucrates Ductor’, that’s the name for those pilot fish that swim with sharks, feeding on scraps.

      When sharks die they sink. The Pilot Fish follow the dead shark down to the bottom and swim around the corpse for a few days, until they get the message that their host is dead. When the awful truth dawns on them they swim off. Some find other sharks to follow, some don’t and die.

      If Murray Foote was a Naucrates Ductor he’d be at the bottom of the ocean wondering why the shark ain’t moving.

      Time to just swim away, Murray.

    37. scotspine says:

      FFS, I am utterly sick and tired of the complete pish that this lie peddling, anti-SNP, Unionist/OO supporting, BritNat propaganda rag peddles and hawkes.

      I do actually feel physical revulsion when I see it in the shops.

      Do the people behind it actually believe that their stance will win anyone back?

    38. Les Wilson says:

      Excellent debunk as per usual, have to say Stu, you are very, very, good at this stuff.
      Viva le Wings!

    39. K1 says:

      Aye Heed, any means are utilised by which the ends are justified. There is nothing decent or sacred that cannot be sacrificed on the alter of ‘profitability’ (whether money or power). The papers are the church choir singing to the sinners…the gospel according to the ‘spin doctors’.

      We are unrepentant. GIRUTFLOT. Say Aye!

    40. Les Wilson says:

      Just a thought, maybe the DR should ask you to approve their “articles!! Lol.

    41. ronnie anderson says:

      It was STVs turn last night to host the Labour Show, Mathison /Rowley /Baker Turnip Heids.

    42. Macart says:

      Yes, but SNP Bad and the Daily Record, or is that broken record?

      Labour failed because of Labour and very little else. They were out manoeuvred by the Conservatives, had a piss poor excuse for a leader, arse for elbow policies on just about everything and the capper was in terms of austerity measures, you could barely put a fag paper between them and the other Tories.

      Scotland’s ‘champion’, rewriting history, so you don’t have to.

    43. woosie says:

      So all the austerity, poverty, corruption, foodbanks, etc is now the fault of benefit scroungers, immigrants AND SNP! Well, that’s cleared that up! If it says so in the dirty redcoat, must be true ( though I’d like to see it on official dr parchment before changing my vote for good ).

      Desperate, tasteless tripe from a paper whose readership is dropping daily, as those who have an alternative source of news keep the donation in their pockets. Have Survation confirmed all the text quoted?

      Any paper which doesn’t see the overwhelming trend whereby negative politics hits a party in the face in Scotland, and keeps on self-harming, whether on it’s owners’ orders or not, deserves what is inevitable – closure.

    44. ClanDonald says:

      If the sums had actually worked out to show Labour winning if everyone had gone with their original choice then the Daily Record would have printed them with great fanfare. The fact they didn’t means they didn’t want you to know… Says it all really.

    45. Graham MacLure says:

      Doesn’t Alex Salmond do a great job for the SNP as a lightning conductor. All the shit is aimed at Alec allowing the rest get on with the jobs.

    46. golf nut says:

      wish there was an alternative tabloid that could be handed to the uninformed. this propoganda is working at my workplace. but no private company would invest in newspapers, the market is dying off, literally!

    47. Haggis Hunter says:

      Daily Record is the media wing of the Labour party.
      Both lacking in talent and assume that everyone is kind of stupid.

    48. Grant says:

      A classic logical fallacy in science – ‘correlation does not imply causation’.

    49. orri says:

      This only serves to highlight why EVEL is a time wasting piece of posturing on the part of the Conservatives which is going to result in a vote to exit the EU assuming the referendum is ever called.
      As things stand all the government has to do is ensure that at all times where needed they have enough MPs present to ensure votes go their way. EVEL isn’t about laws either as the examples given all seem to be budgetary. On the other hand it also serves to potentially undermine the potential for back-benchers in the conservative party itself by inflating it’s majority in some issues thus making it harder for a local MP to actually achieve the stated aim of making their voice heard where decisions affect their electorate.

      Any future Labour government dependent on Scottish MPs could simply repeal it. Although that does lead to negative campaigning against not just the SNP but any representation from Scotland.

      I’m not actually opposed to a properly defined version of devolution for England and Wales. It’s just that the current proposal is simply a way of denying a single party the right to have a say in areas that may very well have an impact on Scotland at the whim of a single individual who has already, let us not forget, been targeted by the current government and who should they get their way will in all probability be replaced by someone who is more controllable.

      Personally if this does go ahead and I were an SNP MP I’d make damn sure I booked a seat at any session of Westminster. Let them forcibly bar me or eject me.

    50. Dan Huil says:

      @scotspine 12.47. I feel the same whenever I see the Butcher’s Apron.

    51. The record and Labour need some excuse to explain their electoral defeat, and what better way to do so by blaming the threat of an SNP surge for scaring voters in England into supporting Cameron.

      Of course it had nothing to do with the fact that Miliband wasn’t seen as prime ministerial material or that his policies weren’t seen by tory voters in marginal seats as a credible alternative to those of Cameron’s.

      I suspect we are going to have more of this rubbish from the record and Labour from now until the 2016 Holyrood elections, because they have nothing else of any substance to say.

    52. Mealer says:

      Haggis Hunter 1.05
      Yep.Though actually it might be argued that the Labour Party is the political wing of the Dirty Redcoat.

    53. Grouse Beater says:

      Dear Readers,
      Today we publish some wacky, insubstantial statistics illustrated in homely apple pie-chart form for you to ponder upon, plus a reckless conclusion.

      We do so knowing you will believe anything presented in statistics you cannot prove as truth, but won’t read it because the gobbledygook figures scattered all over it make your wee brains dizzy and give you a headache.

      To save pain and suffering you need only read the headline and then the conclusion and turn to my thoughtful back-up editorial page 21, entitled ‘SNP Very, Very Bad!’

      Yours intestate
      Editor

    54. Soda says:

      Is it entirely possible that labour didnt suffer a humiliating defeat thru incompetance or stupidity rather they orchestrated their own downfall in complete collusion with the tories and the rest of the UK establishment, that they took one for the team as it were?

      Their behaviour, what with voting along side a tory gov so extremely rightwing it would have made Thatcher herself wince, on a number of issues would certainly seem to suggest so.

    55. gordoz says:

      The story is written by David Clegg; published in the Daily Record…’nough said.

      Sort of has the same impact as Alan Cochrane writing for the ‘National Enquirer’ or Jenny Hjul writing for ‘the Herald’ 🙂

    56. Jack Murphy says:

      OT.BBC—–“James Naughtie to leave Radio 4 Today Programme”.
      “Will take on a role as a special correspondent from early next year”.
      “He is also being appointed BBC News Books Editor”.

      https://archive.is/Np8Kk

    57. De Valera says:

      Memo to Baron Foulkes : Even if Scotland had returned 59 Labour MPs there would still be a Tory Government. Do try and keep up old boy.

    58. Iain Gray's Subway Lament says:

      Excellent analysis Stu.

      The remarkable thing about the westminster bubble stupidity – in wrongly trying to claim that the tories banging on about the SNP helped the tories hugely – is that it ensures they will never learn why the result was what it was or how any of the westminster parties can improve upon it for the next election.

      Let’s remember the tories only got a tiny majority which will cause chaos when they split over Europe. So instead of looking at why they couldn’t persuade more kippers back over to their side they chose to shower praise on the race-baiter Crosby who basically ensured the kippers kept that 12% instead of hammering it down even further.

      It also ensures Labour come away with the wrong conclusion if they too mistakenly think it was Crosby banging on about the SNP that killed them. Instead of the glaringly obvious conclusion that it was their own weak leader and inability to appeal to their own voters which cause them to tank spectacularly. If voters think there is little to no difference between Red Tories and the real ones then why wouldn’t they just plump for the actual tories in middle england like so many did.

      The lib dems are an irrelevance now, but no doubt those at lib dem HQ will still try to blame their annihilation on anything other than themselves. Their incredible incompetence is matched only by the head-in-the-sand delusional thinking that Clegg wasn’t the utterly toxic vote killere veryone else knew he was.

      So it helps us that so many of those stuck in the westminster bubble don’t understand and draw the wrong conclusions about why the voters voted the way they did.

      It just makes our job that much easier in appealing to voters ourselves. We will continue to use ground level campaigning to inform and develop our strategy and policies going into Holyrood next year since it was so staggeringly successful for us at the GE and won us 56 out of 59 MPs.

    59. Macart says:

      Perhaps instead of the Record looking for scapegoats to explain the demise of their political backers, they might consider investigating why, after following THEIR sage advice over a referendum vote, the Scottish electorate and their mandated representation are being reduced to second class citizenry in their own homes? Having democratic rights run over by a loaded parliamentary bus and their wishes utterly ignored?

      Or why Mr Cameron’s statement on ‘nothing being off the table’ in terms of devolution has proven to be somewhat less than truthful? Why major promises, guarantees no less, made by a certain Mr Brown haven’t made it past the first hurdle never mind been delivered and just WHY we should follow any advice the Record offers in the future? Hmmmm?

      You have no idea how hard it was to keep swerry wurds out of those two paras.

    60. galamcennalath says:

      Dan Huil says:
      ” I feel the same whenever I see the Butcher’s Apron.”

      …. and they are everywhere these days.

    61. Tony Little says:

      I read the Survation report (See Rev, some of us DO click on your links) and it seemed fairly balanced. They propose a number of inter-linked factors as to why the voting intention was not picked up properly, and do not actually subscribe to the idea that it was down to voters voting Tory in fear of the SNP.

      So, Daily Record lying … AGAIN!

    62. msean says:

      Mr Farage kept telling Labour that his support came from Labour voters,but they seemed to ignore that. Don’t know the figures but even with the Mr Miliband factor,could the result have been better for Labour if they had agreed to a european referendum as well,but promise to do it quicker?

      Also,can’t understand why parties don’t like referendums,seems those who agree to actually consult the voters,therefore empowering people,get returned win or lose them. The tories basically did the AV one and SNP the indyref one. Going by this,the Tories will be back again in 2020, win or lose the in/out referendum. 2025 is a long way away Labour.

    63. Big Jock says:

      So to sum up Bollocks!

    64. HandandShrimp says:

      Commentators are keen to suggest there are few differences in political attitude between Scotland and England. The Scottish voters were faced with the same issue. A strong SNP could influence Labour to be more anti-austerity. It didn’t frighten Scottish voters…the exact opposite.

      The actual movement in numbers was not at all that significant in England. Cameron did not improve on 2010 but the Liberal seat collapse in Cameron’s favour was enough to give him his slim majority. I think Labour would be really stupid to grasp at this straw. UKIP ate into votes in their northern heartlands – blaming nasty rough Scottish boys (and girls) will not solve Labour’s long term directional issues.

      However, if the Record wants to go up a blind alley who are we to stop them?

    65. Toobs says:

      There was an SNP related factor, in.my opinion, which I base on nothing, but iit seems to me that the SNP coalition question did hurt Labour and help conservatives in England. However, it was not fear of what the SNP might do. I was simply the way that Labour made themselves look direction less, indecisive and weak every time it was brought up. That might have swayed a few on the ill vote for the who looks up to the job side.

      It all comes down to Labour were hopeless in the election.

      And the thing to understand of your typical English person right now is not that they feel badly towards Scotland, but that they are board of hearing about it. Sad, but true.

    66. michael diamond says:

      Has that rag not gone bust yet? I would’nt put it under cat litter.

    67. David McDowell says:

      This Daily Record article betrays the Unionist’s nightmare: that their “fear porn” election rigging strategy no longer works.
      Evidence for this now includes the SNP landslide in the UK general election win in Scotland and the OXI landslide in Greece in the face of another disgusting mass attempt to terrorise the poor and vulnerable.
      It looks like the voting public has finally reached the stage where “fear porn” is working against the propagandists. In other words the more they do it the worse the result is for them. The “McTernan” era has had its day.
      Electorates have seen through the self-serving lie that the media are “champions of democracy” instead of what they really are – sock puppet propagandists for their political and bankster paymasters.

    68. K1 says:

      O/T Gaun yersel’ Pete Wishart…telling it like it is right now!

    69. Richardinho says:

      To me the most likely reason that Labour lost is because Labour were such an unattractive proposition. Miliband did many things that showed him as weak and un-Prime-Ministerial:
      The Ed-stone being one and another being his unconditional surrender to the Tories demands that he refuse to do a deal with the SNP.

    70. Stoker says:

      Remember the Yougov poll which had millions of English voters wanting to vote for the SNP?
      https://archive.is/oV9rP

      Looks like The Dirty Redcoat is still attempting to fool the good folk of our dear country and cover up its roll in the destruction of our referendum for their London masters.

      Perhaps someone with the writing skills should be contacting ‘Survation’ and asking them if they’re quite happy to have The DR destroy any credibility that company may have?

      It’s quite simple really, if they’re going to allow a rag to deliberately mislead members of the public whilst using ‘Survations’ name then they too will be seen to have zero credibility, just like the DR.

    71. Vestas says:

      Hard to tell how it played here (Glenfield, Leics) as we had a UKIP councillor until the election so its all much of a muchness – we had a choice between ConLibLab (Tory), UKIP (purple raving tory) & the BNP (old tories).

      I think the posters had an effect in marginals but if Liz Kendall (more right-wing than Maggie was IMHO) becomes Labour leader then its 6 of one, half dozen of the other in terms of who’s more right-wing.

      I expect the Labour campaign for GE2020 to be shadowing Gideon.

      So don’t worry yourselves about it, England is marching to a different drumbeat. Armed Forces day – FFS 30 years ago it’d have been thought mental NI stuff.

    72. michael diamond says:

      Agree with you orri, as snp members i would make these tory scum forcibly eject me from the hoc, then the world could see that democracy was dead in the “mother of parliaments” (my arse).

    73. A MacRitchie says:

      BIG ECK

      On top form the past two days.

      So far he’s put down

      Lying Carmichael

      Porki Murray

      John Redwood

      All with one sentence (each).

      U Unionist Paisley yet again advocating all UK should have say in the next Scottish Indy ref. This must be at least 3 times he has brought this up. Must be expecting that there will be one. He should however be concerned more with what happening in his own assembly as it has huge problems presently before trying to influence what happens in the future elsewhere.

      Pete Wishart doing a good job just now.

    74. Andy-B says:

      What a embarrassment the Daily Record has become, they know they have no credibility whatsoever, anymore in Scotland, and the trying to blame the SNP for the Tories victory only adds to their incompetence.

    75. Jack Murphy says:

      A MacRitchie at 2:47 pm says “Pete Wishart doing a good job just now”.
      Commons link—just click 14:23:16 in right hand column to bring it up 🙂

      http://www.parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/263c5ce6-68e6-4419-8e29-2394f5f87cba

    76. snode1965 says:

      I think we must get this into perspective, the daily record is not a NEWSpaper.
      I browse the news stand every morning, just to see what the other paper are leading with each day.
      This week has seen some massive stories from the Greek/EU finances to the Scotland bill.Not according to the Record or Sun. No they have led with various Jeremy Kylesque human interest faux outrage bull every day,and no dought crammed full of such mind manure.
      A recent poll from Stu revealed that only 4% of NO voters get their political news from the Record. Therefore we can rest assured that as a NEWSpaper, the Record is already dead.

    77. Grouse Beater says:

      Press and BBC on autopilot to rubbish reputation of Varoufakis in effort to convince us he was unreliable as a negotiator.

      https://grousebeater.wordpress.com/2015/07/06/greece-varoufakis-the-hero/

    78. call me dave says:

      A Conservative minister has accidentally claimed Scotland is an “England and Wales only” issue.

      https://archive.is/UhAG1

    79. Jim McIntosh says:

      Re EVEL debate – Pete Wishart spoke really well, as did Ed Miliband.

      Chris Grayling is a smug git, sprawled out in front of the despatch box, with a sneer on his face. When asked what bills would be affected, he stated that Scottish MPs would not be able to vote on issues that were devolved. He would not confirm (even although asked several times, from several people) whether that would include devolved matters with Barnett consequentials.

      Interestingly the Tories haven’t got all their own party onside. Really impressed with Sir Edward Leigh, he interjected several times with good points. He says that next week he’s going table an amendment that any bill that attracts Barnett consequentials should be exempt.

    80. Petra says:

      Pete Wishart seems to be the only one talking some sense and with passion. No wonder one of the Tories said he prefers having the 56 of them (SNP) there to 56 Libdems.

      A couple of days to debate and then vote on EVEL. I’m beginning to wonder if the Tories want to bring the Union with Scotland (and NI and Wales) to an end.

    81. Petra says:

      Well I got a bit of a laugh there watching Carmichael spouting away in the Commons. I’m sure at one point when referring to EVEL he said something along the lines of ”in the words of the great song by Johny Cash there are more questions than answers”.

      Anyway maybe I picked him up wrongly as the song was by Johny Nash but ‘there are more questions than answers’ definitely refers to his current situation.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqkCT-_Q1DI

    82. Mealer says:

      Martin John Docherty,West Dunbartonshire,made his maiden speech in the House of Commons this afternoon.Well worth a listen.Outstanding.

    83. Gary says:

      See? It’s them bliddy Natz again! It’s not our fault we couldn’t win the election, bliddy Natz voters. Too stupid to be allowed to vote!! (Sarcasm). To be fair, a couple of Scottish Labour MPs were saying much the same when the results were coming through. Their bitterness knows no end and yet they think being told how stupid we are will make us vote for them…

    84. Still Positive. says:

      @ Mealer 4.09

      Very proud of Martin Docherty, my MP.

      I have know him since 1992 and he is absolutely passionate about poverty, among other things.

      Well done!

    85. DickieT says:

      The continuing anti-Scottish and anti-SNP narrative from Westminster , the DR and unionists is just increasing the desire for Independence and for Indyref2. The problem Cameron, Westminster, the DR and the majority of unionists have is that they do not understand what has happened in Scotland nor do they understand the Scottish psyche. They scraped through the referendum by negativity and fear but they are being exposed step by step for what they really are and next time it will be different.

    86. Mealer says:

      Still Positive 4.13,
      Well,there’s plenty work for Mr Docherty in the fight against poverty.We need people of his calibre if progress is to be made.

    87. heedtracker says:

      Its interesting watching any old tory unionist go about their vote NO you moron day.

      World renowned Smith Commision English tory Prof Tonkinski says

      https://twitter.com/proftomkins

      Adam Tomkins ?@ProfTomkins 1 hr1 hour ago
      The “Barnett consequentials” line about #EVEL is complete guff, by the way. Decisions as to supply will continue to be for the whole House.

      World renowned Scottish tory tweetster, retweeted by red and blue tory boys says

      https://twitter.com/kevverage

      You’re really stupid and I’m really clever because I know most Scots earn far less than south of England do and UK.gov spends more on you ingrate Scots earning peanuts. Its why the union is so ace and Scottish independence is insane, arrogant, stupid. You foul mouthed slut Scots earning peanuts need English high earners to pay for your easy life of dossing, sponging and mooching off your betters in the nicerer and cleverer, richer south of teamGB.

      In precis, tory boys say, EVEL is not your problem sweaties, SO vote SLab or tory, even green, anyone but SNP, you north briton dummies.

    88. Schrödinger's cat says:

      I’d did work, vote snp get Tory, they tried it in 2010, it worked, but not in 2011 or 2015, they even aired the lie that 11 snp mp’s brought down Callaghan in 79, it worked in 79, didn’t work so welle in 2015. I don’t think they have anything else. Tbh

    89. galamcennalath says:

      Re: Pete Wishart. Good stuff. certainly looking after our interests!

      What struck me was the obvious attitude of some English MPs. Basically looking bored as if they didn’t understand what he was talking about. One idiot saying Scots MPs wanted to vote on English health and education – too bloody right, have they never hear of, nor understand, Barnett consequencials?!

      Conversely, a few did seem to understand the way their country actually works!

      I could say the English elect some serious numpties, but perhaps I should labour (pun) that point because Scots elected some real crackers too until recently!

    90. Alastair says:

      Carmichael has initiated a huge embarrassment to the Tory Government today.

      What are the odds that the Frenchgate memo will now being released.

    91. Joemcg says:

      I see Beaker Alexander is bumping his gums saying the 56 have “got no clout” surely that is the argument for independence in a nutshell Danny boy?

    92. call me dave says:

      Kezia Brek Dugdale!

      “We need a big tent plan, not a core vote strategy, to win again in Scotland”
      ………………………………………………..
      Ach well as long as those in the tent are pissin out the tent it’s better… but can’t see that anytime soon.

      https://archive.is/3BG22

    93. rongorongo says:

      k1 says: Lots of wee pie charts wi colours and numbers and a wee nyaff typing it up to manageable bite sized porkies for the punters.

      The Daily Record: Breaking down giant whoppers into bite-sized porkies for the people of Scotland.

    94. heedtracker says:

      Joemcg says:
      7 July, 2015 at 4:48 pm
      I see Beaker Alexander is bumping his gums saying the 56 have “got no clout” surely that is the argument for independence in a nutshell Danny boy?

      They dont! And EVEL means even less clout, if that’s possible. Tory party are disenfranchising us as each teamGB day passes.

      That’s why the usual UKOK freak show says EVEL’s is not EVEL.

      And its all Scottish voters being disenfranchised now too. Should be interesting watching Scottish media led by BBC in Scotland, acting like nothings happening.

      That’s already underway. In Aberdeen, vote NO or else Press and Journal has never once mentioned EVEL in any report whatsoever.

      It’s always interesting watching crews of localised UKOK propagandists in action.

    95. Joemcg says:

      Wonder if they play the sash and simply the best on a loop in their offices as they knock up these pish jackanorys?

    96. MJS Dundee says:

      OT

      Hard to comment on this.

      I’m still trying to take in the idea that Michelle Mone leaving Scotland constitutes a brain drain from the earlier article.

      I don’t know what you call the opposite of brain-drain, but if she took her OO fans with her, I’m sure we’d find out and have trouble coping as our average intelligence rocketed.

    97. DerekM says:

      i smell Labour spin numpties still trying to blame everybody else for their own shortcomings,they seem to think that by passing the buck on to the SNP nobody will notice in Scotland that it was their fault,which is laughable and shows how out of touch they are.

      The Daily Record the mouth piece of the Labour party,and here we go again as the onions try to save the Labour party in Scotland with a full on Labour luv bomb,we will listen,we will change honest dont vote for those nasty SNP only we can stop the tories,your fathers and grandfathers voted for us.

      Hmmm will it work i dont think so that train left the platform months ago,do keep up Labour and to think you might end up in opposition in our parliament thats if the tories dont beat you jeez

    98. Brian Powell says:

      it’s the tedious, mendacious Daily Record. Now so corrupted and bitter it’s trying to ignore that the voters who supported the SNP are people.

      Of course all the years it claimed to be the champion of the people it might not have meant the people who live in the cities, towns and countryside of Scotland, but those other people at Labour HQ.

    99. Thepnr says:

      @call me dave

      That piece by Dugdale in the Scotsman is astonishing!

      Astonishing in its ignorance of the reality, she truely believes that moving the Labour party in Scotland further to the right Will help win her party elections in Scotland.

      Totally deluded, obviously learnt everything she knows from her mentors Foulkes & Murphy.

      I can easily see their constituency vote in 2016 drop below 15% and winning no seats.

    100. mike cassidy says:

      Do you think Stevie Smith had the Daily Record in mind?

      Nobody heard him, the dead man,

      But still he lay moaning:

      I was much further out than you thought

      And not waving but drowning.

      Poor chap, he always loved larking

      And now he’s dead

      It must have been too cold for him his heart gave way,

      They said.

      Oh, no no no, it was too cold always

      (Still the dead one lay moaning)

      I was much too far out all my life

      And not waving but drowning.

    101. Robert Peffers says:

      @Graham MacLure says: 7 July, 2015 at 12:53 pm:

      Doesn’t Alex Salmond do a great job for the SNP as a lightning conductor. All the shit is aimed at Alec allowing the rest get on with the jobs.”

      And getting on with it they are. Ian Blackford, Skye & Lochaber doing his bit now and doing it well. As did Pete Wishart earlier. The SNP faction all have spoken well in almost all the Westminster debates but never forget they are also busy in committees.

      Now I read lots of, down at the mouth, comments on this forum to the effect that it was a waste of time sending them to Westminster but that is not in fact how it works. Every time they speak they speak for Scotland, and for Scots but they also cut down the time for other parties to have free reign to spout their views.

      Then they do something else when others are speaking. They make interventions. This also does several things. It challenges the views being put forward by others they do not agree with or supplements those they do agree with and that also uses up parliamentary time.

      Then, many think the SNP members should NOT give way when others wish to intervenee but, when done well, it allows support to their views and if also done well does not let those who would disagree with their points get the chance. There is also the chance to allow those who would intervene look like fools too and it all uses up government time to push through bad policies.

      The thing is these all require a clever and skilled debater who can think on their feet and someone who can come back at their opponents. To date I don’t think I’ve seen a single SNP member who does not fill that bill.

      Watch the opposition and you will see elected members reading from notes. In other words they are not thinking on their feet but reading a pre-written script. The skilled debater notes who they are and can make them look fools. The great expert in all this is Alex Salmond who is never caught out and who needs no script.

      I’m much impressed by the very high standards of the SNP contingent. It is unusual to have so many in the one batch. They, so far, have all been brilliant especially in the case of first timers at Westminster.

    102. Clydebuilt says:

      The Dead Record will end up paying people to read it’s propaganda.
      Excellent article……..should email to all contacts ….. Want as many people to read this as possible.

    103. call me dave says:

      Did I hear correctly EVEL voted out by opposition parties says Radio Scotland? Hope I did hear right.

      PS:
      Footie for Motherwell fans in Europe in about 20 minutes.

      http://neolive.net/24622/1/Watch-Motherwell-FC-vs-Borussia-Monchengladbach-II-/

    104. Robert Peffers says:

      @Tony Little says: 7 July, 2015 at 1:38 pm:

      ” … So, Daily Record lying … AGAIN!”

      There is the old, old editors advice to his reporters and columnists and it is disputed who first said it. It goes like this, “Dog bites man”, is a good story but, “man bites dog”, is a great story”.

      So transpose that to your above comment and you get, “Daily Record lying again”, is a good story but, “Daily Record tells truth at last”, is not only a really great story but is probably either an exclusive or a probably a lie.

    105. heedtracker says:

      Another hard right unionista says EVEL is nothing at all

      https://archive.is/HOTqG

      Calm down: English Votes for English Laws is a very minor modest proposal

      If EVEL’s minor and modest why are tory MP’s abstaining on EVEL today and why is UKOK hatchet man in residence also playing it all down like its wild fire about to take hold in this farce union.

      That’s Prof Tomkins up there who thinks
      The “Barnett consequentials” line about #EVEL is complete guff, by the way. Decisions as to supply will continue to be for the whole House.

      Whats the point of EVEL then FFS. Nice display of UKOK far right tory boys waffling away today though.

    106. orri says:

      Given the government has a majority it implies that at least some on their benches chose to withhold their support. Given the slimness of the majority why would backbench MPs render themselves less important? It simply means that all parties will need to ensure their MPs turn out to vote. Which is as it should be.

    107. DerekM says:

      aye Robert they were always going to be up against it a baptism of fire,the question was always how would they perform and they are doing just splendid i always said they might beat us in the vote but lets see them beat us in the debate.

      Their professionalism to their elected position as representatives of their constituencies has shown up a few of the other parties MP`s and hasnt gone unnoticed,its a brilliant tactic simple but effective do your job,

      i like to look at westminster as a test,well Eck does have our future independent politicians down there on a training exercise on how not to run a government,i am sure they are learning very valuable information 🙂

    108. Andrew McLean says:

      We must realise that this will never end now, we have woken the sleeping Bulldog, defence of the realm, is his creed, lies, misinformation and threats are his tools, the narrative from the MSM is us and them, we have become the enemy within and all is fair when it comes to destroying our goals.
      This was brought into focus to me at the weekend when an old friend said to me he would never have thought I would become one of them!
      So onwards we go, fight the good fight and make Scotland free from these muppets!

    109. t42 says:

      “Crosby is described as favouring what is called a wedge strategy, whereby the party he advises introduces a divisive or controversial social issue into a campaign”

      what? like abortion for instance..

    110. Doug McG says:

      Quite simply , they are lining up their dogs , today , a reason why we got the Tories , the SNP surge , tomorrow the Tories summer budget and the following day Scotland needs someone to blame for the new cuts , cue large Redcoat article blaming the SNP for the Osborne cuts.

      It is pathetic but it will work , some will actually believe that England voted Tory to keep the SNP out of government.

      I have only one response , Prime Minister Milliband? It was never going to happen.

    111. caz-m says:

      Clegg, you are a lying unionist bastard. You are doing more to increase the SNP/YES vote than Nicola Sturgeon ever will.

      If you had an ounce of sense, you would see your paper and your Labour Party are going down the drain. I said IF you had an ounce of sense, but you and I know that you are nothing but a bitter senseless halfwit.

      Print that, ya dickheed.

    112. heedtracker says:

      Just waded through that Massie’s newstatesman cringathon for teamGB tory world. Bloody hell he’s the scotch cringer’s scotch cringer. At the very least Prof Tomkins is an English far right UK hatchetman. Massie’s a very strange Scottish tory, which isn’t true. They’re all like him.

      “This is indeed a brutal power play from the Tories but, unless we have all lost our minds completely (a possibility it would be rash to rule out) there’s no logical reason why this should encourage, to borrow from Myles na Gopaleen, a still more virulent eruption of Jockish nationalism. Something that’s good enough for Scotland is more than good enough for England”

      Jockish nationalism?

    113. Robert Peffers says:

      @Brian Powell says: 7 July, 2015 at 5:17 pm:

      ” … Of course all the years it claimed to be the champion of the people it might not have meant the people who live in the cities, towns and countryside of Scotland, but those other people at Labour HQ”

      Ah! But! Brian, There are a certain faction from that side of Scotland who have been claiming for years, “We arra People”, and lots of them did march through our capital city in support on NO before the referendum.

    114. Les Wilson says:

      Having watched Westminster today, I too say we have a cracking crowd down there. All, have been excellent and professional. Not like the Unionist baying late comers to a vote.

      It ended a good day down there, but they have much more chaos,to cause as time goes by they will stick a few sticks into the wheels.

      It also brings into clear light, how we are regarded in this abusive marriage, even doubters must be noticing, and that should bear fruit.

    115. davidb says:

      So LibDem and UKIP voters in particular thought a Labour/SNP arrangement would have been illigitimate?

      But the LibDems were in coalition for 5 years with the Conservatives. And UKIP’s whole argument was about influencing whomever was elected. Would those not have been illigitimate governing arrangements?

      Either they asked idiots, or xenophobes, or – which I suspect – they just made it up.

    116. Iain More says:

      Millibland was never going to happen. He just wasn’t PM material and that is the end of the matter. He demonstrated he wasn’t PM material by caving in to the Brit Nat Press and Media and to Tory attacks like he did. He lost because he was a craven curr!

    117. Iain More says:

      @Petra

      Torquemada Crichton is the metaphorical love child of Brian Wilson.

    118. Iain More says:

      Has Baron Fookes been at the cop bashing juice again?

    119. David Agnew says:

      what fresh hell is this?

      Am I seriously being asked to consider that labour and the daily record have learned absolutely sod all between May 7th and today?
      Is this pish all they have between now and 2016. The same pish that saw them get their arse kicked?

      Is there a name for this condition? Have monographs been published? A book perhaps?

      I have long since stopped reading the likes of the daily record. My sanity is the better for it as is my wallet. Frankly the daily record and the majority of the UK MSM is slowly changing into a version of the Onion or the daily mash up. The difference between those spoof news sites and the UK MSM, is that the spoof sights know they’re printing fiction.

    120. Thepnr says:

      At #Greece summit now, European leaders are eating: vichyssoise soup, cod fillet w anchovy butter, chocolate mousse on a biscuit base, moka

      Says it all really.

    121. Mealer says:

      Thepnr 7.21
      I got stew the nicht.It was fekin braw.

    122. Grouse Beater says:

      Kezia Dugdale:
      “We need a big tent plan, not a core vote strategy, to win again in Scotland”

      Nothing wrong with that.
      Got to have somewhere to park Jackie Baillie if it rains.

    123. Alastair says:

      Perfect timing for Kezia if she wins. Balcks of Greenock’s end of season sale.

      Now is the winter of our discount tents.

    124. Petra says:

      @ Iain More says at 7:11 pm ”Petra Torquemada Crichton is the metaphorical love child of Brian Wilson.”

      At first I thought you meant Brian Wilson of the Beach Boys Iain! Ah right Brian Wilson of the West Highland Free Press and …… Jackie Baillie.

    125. Tam Jardine says:

      Thepnr

      Vichy soup? Well as an SNP member and therefore a Nazi I’m obviously intrigued.

      I know we are just a small colony Alex but I would like to see what the Scottish people, led by our government could do to offer assistance and solidarity to the Greek people.

      I was awestruck last night at their resilience in the face of the might of international financial institutions. They suffered their own project fear and withstood it I in greater numbers than Scotland managed.

      But then the middle classes have suffered along with the poor to some extent where as most folk up here with a bit of dough behind them bumble along on while the poor fall by the wayside.

      The fate of Greece makes me angry- this organisation (the EU) which most folk in the Yes camp in our ain referendum were desperate to remain in was intransigent, unenthusiastic and cold towards us. And to the Greek people it has acted disgracefully.

      I love being a European; I want to stay in the EU as an independent country but they make it very difficult.

      As for Kezia and her big tent – if it’s a circus she wants there is an obvious opening for the dear departed Jim. Her swing to the right is strange – have I been out on the sun too long to today?

    126. Petra says:

      She (Dugdale) said today that ”Labour has been seen as too concerned with the vulnerable – and must now reach out to the vast majority of Scots who want to “better themselves.”

      That’ll go down like a lead balloon with the last few Labour supporters. And then again they haven’t given a toss for the vulnerable for decades now. I’m confused!

      “If the history of our Party tells us anything it’s that we win elections by reaching out beyond our natural supporters.”

      EH! It’s clear that her knowledge of history is pretty limited and maybe she should start off by taking baby steps and try to win back their ‘natural supporters’ first ……. Keir Hardie types.

      “We need a big tent plan, not a core vote strategy, to win again in Scotland.”

      And does anyone actually know what she’s talking about? ‘Core vote strategy’ and a ‘big tent plan’? She’s like a lethal mix of Jim Fundimundily Murphy and Joanne Not Genetically Programmed Lamont.

    127. Rock says:

      Who created the “fear” about the SNP in the first place?

      Which English rag had the headline “Most dangerous woman in Britain”?

      They tried to make a monster out of a decent and democratic political party to prevent it from winning.

      Now they blame the same party for the result of their scaremongering.

      They have absolutely no integrity or shame.

    128. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      Appropriate for this page, here are two of the new badges we did in time for “Hands Off Holyrood” on Saturday.

      https://sites.google.com/site/webgaffer/home/badge-designs/Labour-Record-Pish-combo.jpg

    129. heedtracker says:

      What Scot in Scotland names their son Torquil anyway? Its right in there with Crispin, Rupert, Julian and Benedict Cumberbatch. You’d have lasted about 10 seconds at my old bog standard comp in Aberdeen. Thanks again for that Alastair Campbell and why him and all of his New Labour cabal are not on trial for war crimes in the Hague, is another teamGB/EU/USA mystery.

    130. Thepnr says:

      @Alastair

      Perfect timing for Kezia if she wins. Balcks of Greenock’s end of season sale.

      Now is the winter of our discount tents.

      Hahaha, that’s an absolute stotter Alaistair. Best in a long time. 🙂

      @Tam Jardine

      Yeah, I hear you. having big time doubts about the EU myself. I never realised that the corruption ran so deep. Here’s me in all my innocence thinking that it was mainly confined to the UK.

      As I said, I have my doubts now. Bastards.

    131. Rock says:

      Jack Laidlaw,

      “Great article, When I read the story in Daily Record I stupidly presumed they had asked people why they voted Tory.”

      You still read the the Daily Record?

      At least you are not buying it?

      Labour in Scotland has been defeated.

      But we can only become independent after the Daily Record and Pravda GB have been completely destroyed.

    132. Capella says:

      O/T Giles Fraser the “loose canon” has some insight into the reason for the Greek debt:
      “…corrupt German companies bribed corrupt Greek politicians to buy German weapons. And then a German chancellor presses for austerity on the Greek people to pay back the loans they took out (with Germans banks) at massive interest, for the weapons they bought off them in the first place. Is this an unfair characterisation? A bit. It wasn’t just Germany.”

      https://archive.is/Z8zRr

    133. Cadogan Enright says:

      Surely this useless paper will collapse soon.

      Meanwhile RT’s Keiser report tonight a real blast of economic common sense – and entertaining – and Scotland got a mench

    134. heedtracker says:

      Thanks again for that Alastair Campbell and why him and all of his New Labour cabal are not on trial for war crimes in the Hague, is another teamGB/EU/USA mystery.

      Point there is that there are whole host of reasons SLabour got wiped out in Scotland. Invading Iraq with neo fascist Bush and co, revenge on the middle east for 9/11 basically, is one of the greatest horrors in SLabour history, no matter how hard their shill BBC etc try to pretend it either never happened or that SLabour had nothing to do with it.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War

      How these characters have to the nerve to Project Fear Scotland just beggars belief. But maybe they really are merely power crazed sociopaths where anything goes because we’re teamGB and we reign over you for ever and ever…

    135. orri says:

      Evel is deliberately misnamed given the examples used to justify it are all budgetary rather than law creation. However all the back patting in the world about how somehow this abuse of procedure to in effect suspend the voting rights of some MPs for some votes can avoid aproval by the House of Lords is going to face a potential problem when it comes to actual laws which need to pass through them.

      Especially if the SNP adopt a policy of faithfully passing through the division loby despite their vote not being counted. It’d either demonstrate that it’d not have mattered anyways. Or it’d supply the HoL with the ammunition needed to question the legitimacy of a bill that only passed by ignoring Scottish MPs.

    136. North Chiel says:

      The propaganda war continues unabated with the anti SNP / Scottish gov. rhetoric
      Still to the fore , the usual suspects will continue the attack right the way through to SE 2026.
      ( BBC, Daily Record / London controlled media).
      The “end game” for them is quite simply to “prevent” an SNP Holyrood majority gov.
      Hence the current “rehabilitation” of all the “Unionist losers” and the ” no change” 3 unionists
      Against 1 SNP on the ” chat shows” (Rhona tonight/ Sarah Smith etc).IF THERE IS ANY WAY of preventing Nicola obtaining an overall majority , it will be ” JOB DONE ” and thus NO INDY 2 .Make no mistake , this is the “NEW UNIONIST AGENDA “and most certainly Holyrood 2016 is not
      In my opinion ” in the bag ” as long as London controls the traditional “media”.
      We all need to “roll up our sleeves, “there is still an election to be won before ANY POSSIBILITY of Indyref 2.

    137. Thepnr says:

      @Brian Doonthetoon

      hahaha that’s them telt 🙂

    138. Paula Rose says:

      To be fair to Kezia – I think her piece makes sense in the context that the Labour core support now resides in Morningside.

    139. Thepnr says:

      Hey Mealer

      Next time I’m up Montrose wie mind save me a bowl oh that stew 🙂

    140. The burger says:

      In one of my irregular forays onto Twitter last night I saw you arguing with Owen Jones about this. Disappointed at his seeming intransigence to accept reality on this issue and just trumpet the same baseless drivel as the record.

      Superb analysis, and a real case in point as to why your presence is very much appreciated (and a bargain).

    141. HandandShrimp says:

      Only just noted that there is a march in Glasgow on the 1st August. Kelvingrove to Glasgow Green.

    142. cearc says:

      Paula Rose,

      Morningside Red = the new Mauve?

    143. Brian Doonthetoon says:

      And HandandShrimp, there are rumours in the wild that something will be goin’ on in George Square the same day.

      I’d rather be in George Square than walk a’ that distance.

      Ronnie Anderson may have more info…

    144. A MacRitchie says:

      Giddie’s Budget

      Tomorrow will see a further implementation of American R wing politics into this country. American individualism takes another step to becoming the norm in British Society. US attitudes to welfare inspire policy changes in the guise of Austerity cuts.

      The demonisation of those unlucky enough to request help from society are targeted again. If it isn’t bad enough that American terminology is being used to describe people

      Strivers not skivers

      Scroungers

      Life style choice etc.

      Help to stigmatise all sorts of people.

      Americanisation of this country has been steadily taking place since Thatcher. It is always promoted by the political elite of this country that we owe a huge debt to that generation who participated fought for democracy in ww2 and as a reward got the welfare state? I just wonder if todays society is truly the kind of society those people actually suffered for. I don’t think this is the kind of country where my grandfather who took to the streets of Aberdeen to confront the fascists before the war broke out. And then went on to contribute to the war effort would have believed that this UK government would have been worth fighting for. American individualism and personal responsibility replacing societies responsibility as a whole for taking responsibility for its people/citizens.

      So while the cuts to those in need take place tomorrow. Just contemplate what the Americans are contributing to our country.

      Food banks

      Low wages

      Ill health

      Poverty

      Reduction in workers rights etc.

      With Channel 5 and 4 helping to promote this stigmatisation.

      So when Osborne stands tomorrow stating he has found the 12billion worth of cuts in welfare to make people more individually responsible. Just think there goes another knife in the back of the welfare state we are witnessing its death and the return to 19 century attitudes to the poor and those in need of help in this country all thanks to the Americans. It hasn’t taken very long for those who opposed the welfare state in the first place (and I think I am right in saying Churchill) to dismantle it. With the help of Tony Blair as well.

      It could all have been oh so very different last year.

    145. Paula Rose says:

      cearc honey! Yes – well spotted!

    146. Petra says:

      @ Rock says at 8:54 pm ”But we can only become independent after the Daily Record and Pravda GB have been completely destroyed.”

      Rock up until last year the shelves used to be cleared of the Daily Record, now they can’t give them away (in my area anyway). I wonder what their true sales are?

      Whatever the case they’re on their way out now just like the party they’ve backed and lied for, for decades now.

    147. Hoss Mackintosh says:

      O/T Rev Stu,

      This Frankie Boyle guy is pretty good…

      https://archive.is/VTmeU

      Any chance of giving him a regular slot on Wings? He is wasted on the Guardian with that tiny and falling Scottish readership.

    148. scottieDog says:

      If we want real independence we should be seeking a divorce from sterling. Greece is a timely reminder that having your own monetary poicy is vital…
      http://www.scottishmonetaryreform.org.uk/

    149. Dal Riata says:

      In the Record’s sister-paper-in-anti-SNP-lies-and-pish the Daily Mail, the fairest, most unbiased and most impartial ‘journalist’ in all journalism-land, the one and only Mr. Alan Roden, has a charming full-page article entitled, “Greek lesson for the SNP: You cannot simply talk your way out of austerity”.

      Following are some snippets of wisdom from the charmer himself:

      “… And, unlike in Greece, where the Left-wing Syrzia party soared to victory, British voters gave the thumbs-up to austerity in May’s election.”

      I didn’t know that Alan, that as a “British voter”, I “gave the thumbs-up to austerity in May’s election”. Gee! Thanks for keeping me right.

      “… Then [after Osborne’s budget], when the welfare cuts bite, the Nationalists will do what they do best and stoke grievances by driving a wedge between London and Edinburgh.”

      Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha! What a cheeky wee scamp you are Mr. Roden!

      “‘Full Fuscal Autonomy’ for Holyrood – the SNP’s outrageous demand that would see the result of last year’s referendum declared null and void – would make matters worse.”

      “declared null and void”… Eh?… What’s that Alan…?

      “… But, by then [the 2016 Holyrood election], the tiresome constitutional wrangling over the latest Scotland Bill will be over.
      Nicola Sturgeon will have to reveal how she will use the Scottish parliament’s sweeping new powers, not just demand even more.
      And if the SNP really does want to reverse austerity, it can start by creating a more generous benefits system.”

      “a more generous benefits system”…? Oh, Alan, you’re such a card!

      “If the SNP practices what it preaches, the prospect of more generous benefits may well win it some support.”

      “some support” ROFL! Aye, because that support they’ve got now is pure pish, so it is. By next year it’ll be something really shite like sixty-odd percent. Might as well just give it all up now, eh Alan!

      “But it also offers a fantastic opportunity for Scottish Conservative leader Ruth Davidson to continue her party’s revival north of the Border by standing on a platform to reduce the burden of the state – an objective shared by many working Scots.”

      “…Ruth Davidson to continue her party’s revival north of the Border” Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha! Brilliant! A comedian as well as the bestest journalist in all journalism-land. You’re some guy you are Alan Roden, so ye are!

      “Last week, one emboldened Nationalist MP asked Mr. Osborne if he was on the side of the ‘poor and working-class people in Greece’ or the ‘rich people’ moving their money out of the country?
      The Chancellor declined to enter into a spat over class politics. In a fitting response to the SNP, he replied: ‘I am not very impressed with anti-austerity crusaders who promise the earth and cannot deliver’.”

      Is that it, Alan? Is that the punchline? Osborne yells, ‘Huzzah for austerity you Jock plebs!’ Oh, and, ‘SNP BAD!’…? Tsk!

      Come, come, Alan, you’re the mostest fairest and the mostest bestest journalist, like ever, and you work for the most respected and loved newspaper in the whole of newspaper-dom, and you wrote like a zillion words just to say, ‘SNP BAD’…? Not good enough, Mr. Roden. Not good enough at all. Your people need you, Alan. You’re important. Don’t let us down. Next time, Alan, must do better. We’ll be watching.

    150. Ken500 says:

      Labour didn’t get in because they didn’t get enough votes. Cameron got in because he is a Conman

      Major called them ‘bastards’. Major was a liar. ‘Lying bastards’

      No democracy fo Scotland.

      The Daily Record is a waste of paper. Every word they utter is a lie.

    151. Ken500 says:

      Rev Stu. What a talent. Genius Thanks a Billion

    152. chris kilby says:

      Yawning is right. Change the bloomin’ Record, Murray. Yer no’ foolin’ anywan, ye know. And the voters ur huvin’ none ae it!

    153. Dal Riata says:

      Oh aye, and there’s a lady called Siobhan Synnot who has a regular column in the Scottish Daily Mail. And what a fabaroonie journalist she is! One of today’s Pulitzer prize-winning efforts:

      “It’s only right that if the Greeks get what they want, then Nicola Sturgeon can demand jet packs, designer shoes and macaroni pies for every man, woman and child in Scotland.”

      Where does the Mail get’em from, one wonders, such is the brilliance of their journalism. Obviously, should an opening come up there, only the best – the best – can apply.

    154. Lanarkist says:

      Dal Riata at 10.31, brilliant, thank you!

    155. boris says:

      1968: The Conservative Party in Scotland was traditionally a unionist party. But at the Conservative Party Conference of 1968, held in Perth in Scotland, Edward Heath announced a party policy of support for devolution. Heath then formed a constitutional committee chaired by former Prime Minister Sir Alec Douglas-Home.

      1970: The committee produced “Scotland’s Government”, a report that recommended the creation of a Scottish Assembly with 125 elected members and powers to initiate and discuss bills. However, all Bills were to require approval of the United Kingdom Parliament.

      The draft legislation was ready for implementation in 1970. It seems to me Cameron’s Tory’s have resurrected it for implementayion in 2016. An emasculated parliament.

    156. Grouse Beater says:

      I’ve penned a few words about the Land Reform Bill:

      https://grousebeater.wordpress.com/2015/07/07/land-grabbers-and-losers/

      Please add your own thoughts – I don’t take advertising revenue, or ask for donations, only interesting comments, wisdom welcome.

    157. Cadogan Enright says:

      Has anyone noticed how really excellent the National has been this week ?

    158. Grouse Beater says:

      Dal Riata: “The Nationalists will do what they do best and stoke grievances by driving a wedge between London and Edinburgh.”

      Wearing my automotive journalist hat, I surmise that must be a Lamborghini, or perhaps a Lotus, cars shaped like a wedge of cheese and often in yellow livery.

    159. Mealer says:

      Thepnr 9.09
      I’ll share a pot of stew with you any time.The Tory way.I get all the meat and you get a bit of what’s left.

    160. Ken500 says:

      The Eurozone has less debt spread over more people, than the UK. Osbourne is printing mney and putting up the debt because the rest of UK doesn’t raise enough in tax to pay for it’s expenditure. Cutting the income of the most vulnerable and giving tax cuts to the wealthier Allowing tax evasion for back handers, Trident/illegal Wars, tax evasion and banking fraud through London. A pozzi scheme that causes debt in Scotland.

    161. manandboy says:

      More great work Stu. I can barely bring myself to think where the Independence movement would be without you.

      Meanwhile the attacks on the SNP continue and will do so until Scotland is able to function as a Socially Democratic country through Independence. The Tories, the EU, the US, the IMF and the ECB, are united in their neo-liberal ambitions to create a new world order in which there is only room for the rich. An independent Scotland is strictly to be avoided for it will seriously upset neo-liberal plans in rUK & Europe.

      Scotland is on a collision course with Westminster and Europe’s wealthy elite, particularly those at the IMF and the ECB. How this plays out is of monumental importance to Scotland. If the Tories continue to rule us for much longer, then we will become just like the Greeks. We must, must, must become Independent soon if we are to avoid truly horrendous personal and national deprivation.

      This is not yet widely understood; nor will it be broadly accepted

    162. Alba woman says:

      Margaret Ferrier doing very well today highlighting the nightmare of nuclear warheads being trundled through Scotland at midnight. She was very well briefed and put forward an excellent case. It is so good to feel that we are being represented by folk who give a dam about their constituents and Scotland.

    163. Democracy Reborn says:

      Kezia: “Under my leadership we will celebrate success…. across this great nation (sic) of ours.”

      The original draft had “region”, but the sub-ed tidied it up.

      Perhaps Kez is trying to be the next ‘Heir to Blair’. Ever get the feeling there’s a schizophrenic mentality among the SLAB upper echelons? First, Johann’s ‘something for nothing’ society (Council Tax freeze, universal benefits, no tuition fees, all BAD, cos it’s the dastardly middle class who benefit the most. Next, sunny Jim : let’s sing a sectarian song, get pished at the fitba and get back to w’ur working class roots – Council Tax freeze, universal benefits and no tuition fees all GOOD. And now, ‘aspirational Kez’, w’ur no just fur the vulnerable in society. Is it a cunning plan to mop up the unionist vote by appealing to No voting Tories and Lib Dems?

    164. Cadogan Enright says:

      Interesting point above – if rancid only influences 4% of no voters – it is already irrelevant

      Rev’s poll says 30% BBC, 10% STV and maybe Scottish Sun 5%

      This is the real target

      No point considering Mail readers at 6% as they actually want to be deluded

    165. Mealer says:

      Democracy Reborn 12.04
      Maybe Kezia is going to try to make the Labour Party more palatable to Tories as part of a “unionists must unite” drive?

    166. Graeme Doig says:

      Cadogan

      Aye. I’ve been very impressed lately.

      Sense of duty made me stick with it but it now looks like they have upped (doesn’t look right. Is that really how you spell upt) their game.

      I hope their numbers are holding up.

    167. John Moss says:

      The Daily Record is crap.

      Why are you wasting time on it?

      Move on and get a life.

    168. Paula Rose says:

      I wanna be – anarchy… Its the only way to be fame is the NME – I wanna be

      All of you who understood your culture – understand – “is this the UK or just another IMF tenancy”

    169. Iain says:

      So – is the allegation of a “We believe …” statement not a case of the Record deliberately misleading the public, as the Telegraph did with the ‘memo’?

    170. ABCCBA says:

      Does this mean that the CEO of Survation is in breach of the ESOMAR Code of Ethics? As far as I can see they are not meant to make statements that they know to be misleading.

      https://www.esomar.org/uploads/public/knowledge-and-standards/codes-and-guidelines/ICCESOMAR_Code_English_.pdf

    171. Ken500 says:

      It’s not the currency that is used (name). It is the way the books are balance.

      ie the Eurozone will still balance the books even if they do not impose austerity in Greece and cut Greece a bit of slack The Eurozone has less debt than many other other countries, in the EU or the world. They are only allow to carry a regulated debt ratio/proportion. Many carry no debt at all and are wealthy and in surplus (Germany)

      The sterling zone, the UK Union shared currency is different to the Eurozone. The share currency in the UK is being (secretly) manipulated by the Treasury so Scotland that has less less debt than the rest of UK and pays higher taxes (pro rata) but Scotland has no say in how taxes are raised and spent in Scotland. Any debt in the UK is caused by Westminster policies. Scotland could have it’s own currency, join the Eurozone or keep Sterling and still be better off by running it’s own affairs.

      It’s not the currency (name) that is used it is whether the books balance. Westminster is trying to lie about the shared currency. Westminster is operating two separate tax policies in the UK between Scotland and the rest of the UK. The tax system is not equal. Industry is taxed higher in Scotland and Trident/illegal wars are imposed on Scotland against the majority wishes. Tax evasion and banking fraud through the City of London loses revenues in Scotland. Scotland loses £Billions which could be better spent, because it can’t control it’s own affairs but is dictated to and outvoted by Westminster.

      Tax revenues raised in Scotland £54Billion Scotland spends £54Billion.
      Total taxes raised in the UK £466Billion. Total taxes raised in the rest of the UK £466Billion minus £54Billion = £412Billion (pro rata) less than taxes raised in Scotland. The rest of the UK borrows £90Billion.

      In 2010 when the Tories can to power £600Billion was raised in taxes in the UK. The Tories have cut taxes. £466Billion a year is raised now £134Billion less. The Tories have cut/lost £Billions of tax revenues, thus increasing the UK debt. They are printing money to cover up the lost revenues. They are cutting benefits/taxes affecting the most vulnerable. They are sanctioning the vulnerable and starving people, allowing the wealthy to tax evade (for back handers) and increasing the debt by printing money to cover up for their incompetence.

    172. Ken500 says:

      The Daily Record prints lies everyday, doing Scotland and the representative Scottish Gov down It prints lying VOWs illegally, and tries to manipulating the political system in Scotland. Rev Stu Is right to point that out. The Daily Record deserves everything it gets, nought.

    173. heedtracker says:

      https://archive.is/v9RdD This has got to hurt after all the work they do monstering Scottish democracy for our imperial masters alone.

      Dont fire me…

      “Appearing on Radio 4’s Today, Hall pointed to George Osborne’s vow to allow the licence fee to increase in line with inflation, the “modernisation” of the £145.50 fee structure to incorporate online viewing and an end to top-slicing of money to fund rural broadband.”

      Spot the toryboy THE VOW in there, dear old beeb?

    174. Ken500 says:

      Historically Germany and Italy caused all the debt in Europe. Now pay up. Russia lost out as well, the most saving the West.

    175. scottieDog says:

      Having full fiscal power without monetary control is a serious disadvantsge IMHO.
      Having a central bank filled with failed commercial bankers and allowing banks to create money means periodic financial catastrophes.

      We need a Scottish central bank and Scottish currency.
      UK monetary policy has destroyed the uk economy.

    176. Ken500 says:

      The BBC is over extended. It could lose Channel 3 and 4 and show their programmes on 1 and 2, instead of repeats. Or increase the licence fee and be more impartial (stop kowtowing to Westminster) so more viewers would watch it.

    177. Bob Mack says:

      Interesting to see the “Hootsman “running with the same story with analysis of the “facts” from the CEO of Survation.
      Do these people now hold inter press strategy meetings?

    178. Grouse Beater says:

      How feudalism and neo-liberalism removes land from the people:

      https://grousebeater.wordpress.com/2015/07/07/land-grabbers-and-losers/

    179. Nana Smith says:

      From the most incompetent chancellor it’s budget day.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b060zw8b listen at around 47mins

      Meanwhile

      George Osborne’s family reportedly ‘struck a £6m property deal’ with firm based in tax haven

      https://archive.is/HeHP7

    180. Scotspine says:

      OT

      The BBC have done themeselves proud today.

      In a report aimed at striking a blow against the SNP and Scots Govt, they repoerted how an animal rights group have forced the Govt to reveal the numbers of seals being shot around fish farms. The group state “so consumers can make a choice”.

      Im sure the Norwegians dont cuddle their seals.

      Well done BBC. UUnfortunately some must die so we can eat. Im sure fish farmers in the remote areas where employment is scarce will be happy.

    181. Ken500 says:

      Historically the US made the equivalent of £Billion/trillions out of 11WW and caused the debt in the UK. The US Administration are corrupt fraudsters who cause poverty and deprivation the world over.

      Osbourne/Cameron and their associates are illegally making (taking) £Million/Billions out of the public purse. The only reason they are in Government. A couple of crooked conmen. They should be in jail.

    182. heedtracker says:

      Increasing licence fee won’t wash anymore. The world’s changing and beeb cant hold it back no matter how much they think they can. Mind that awful full BBC day of voteNoborders via Gavin Estler and endless every 15 minute BBC 24 news splurge on voteNoborders, stuff like their fannies of Scotland song etc.

      Once you’re in that game level of propaganda attack on democracy for a super rich elite BBC, you’ve had it.

      http://www.votenoborders.co.uk/

      Walking out on Britain is v v bad, says Gavin Esler of the BBC, so dont do it.

    183. Ken500 says:

      Over population of seals causes damage to other wildlife.

    184. Macart says:

      So it appears that the Scotland bill has gone through debates without touching the sides.

      Who knew?

      Then comes the mega genius that is Danny Beaker making noises on how powerless are the 56 in Westminster and how with his position he wielded so much influence…. Oh jeez.

      The fella just made the perfect case for independence by highlighting the fact that the entirety of Scotland’s representation, the mandate of the Scottish electorate was completely overruled by an establishment coalition led by the Tories. Effectively the numerically MPs representing English constituencies. Our partner in the most successful family of nations in history ever.

      Well done Danny boy. You keep thinking like that and some day you may reach a logical conclusion.

      Not one amendment, not a single one carried or considered. Simply batted aside by numbers, because they could. Well they can’t say that the 56 SNP MPs didn’t try to participate or try to extend the life of the union by carrying the most popular devolution proposals requested by their electorate forward to Westminster.

      It should maybe have struck some of those geniuses that fighting for devolved powers and extending the union really isn’t what we as supporters of independence are interested in. It should maybe have occurred to the tories of all colours that they had an opportunity to validate a no vote here by making a concession or two toward those who loyally voted no last September. To make sure that majority they had, remains a majority, but no, those rocket scientists decided to teach the Jocks a lesson in power. Put the Scots back in their box. Oh and have a good cheer and jeer while they were at it.

      What they didn’t reckon on was the excellent debates, arguments, interventions, attendance and work ethic of those 56 MPs. Unlike our friends in the establishment parties, they made a promise to their electorate and then kept it. That promise on the back of the referendum result was to stand on a devolution ticket, to carry their electorates wishes for change to the current settlement forward to the house of Commons and place those wishes before a Westminster system of government. To hold the establishments feet to the fire for delivery of their referendum pledges, or simply hold them to account for same. Well? They’ve done both.

      They worked hard to make headway with those amendments up to and including FFA (the most popular choice of Scotland’s electorate). They worked hard to make significant change in terms of devolution their top priority and by any yard stick their efforts to make progress were utterly and conclusively rebuffed out of hand by the HoC. No ifs buts or maybes, Scotland’s representation v the rest of the house and the rest of the house took great pleasure in telling Scotland’s representation what to do with their amendments.

      So for any new readers out there, are we clear yet on what is known as a democratic deficit? Do you now see why independence is the only way your voice, your opinion will EVER be heard? There is no successful family of nations here, no partnership of equals, no pooling and sharing. There is only sit down, shut up and eat your cereal.

      You’ve still got the power to change this situation and all you need do is ask.

    185. Ken500 says:

      Animal rights groups are a menace do more damage to the local economy, than have support. Save the world, they couldn’t even save themselves.

    186. Ken500 says:

      Danny Alexander is a liar who cost Scotland £Billions. His influence lost Scotland £Billions and caused poverty and deprivation. He should be in jail.

    187. heedtracker says:

      http://www.votenoborders.co.uk/the_tomkins_ten_points

      All Tory boys such as Prof Tomkins still gets all the BBC air time he wants now too. But still BBC want more money. Give us more money to monster Scotland, vile separatists, foul mouthed sluts, YOU…

      Like all toryboys, Prof T’s still bashing away Scottish moochers, just like he was for voteNoBorders last year.

      “5. Fiscal position

      Domestic tax revenues per person are lower for Scotland than for the rest of the UK whilst, at the same time, public spending in Scotland is higher per head than it is the rest of the UK.”

      “Domestic tax revenues per person are lower for Scotland” in real world, toryboy speak for your Scottish pay is a lot lower in Scotland than south east of England, but take your hand outs, be grateful to be Brits and shut up.

      And enough did fall for the nutty professors frighteners, daily rammed down our throats by the beeb, who are now short of £650 million.

    188. Chic McGregor says:

      OT Oil has hit a Greecey slope and is plummeting.

    189. Ken500 says:

      BBC staff were crying when Naughtie left. Lord Hall, a Tory who gets his orders (and his remuneration, expenses and benefits) from Cameron every week was appointed Head of the BBC. The Head of the BBC was/is a corrupt banker who broke the Law. Cameron/Osbourne and their associates are trying to privatise the BBC for back handers, to embezzle public money.

    190. Les wilson says:

      Gideon’s austerity budget is out today, the war on the worst off will continue, while there will be help for the better off at their expense. Tory mantra extreme.

      This morning I was reading a communication from America and thought it would be good to put here. Austerity uneqal society, and it’s eventual consequences.

      “Three interrelated factors cause “Third World-itis”: lopsided distribution of income; a government hijacked by the economic elite; and a political focus on stasis rather than change. Together those features form a self-reinforcing engine that moves in one direction only: toward conflict, tyranny and eventual collapse.”

      Writing on the wall?

    191. Ken500 says:

      Tomkins is breaking the terms of his contract of employment and is never at his post. Skiving. Taking time off tell lies about Scotland. Paid by Scottish taxpayers. Tomkins is so biased he is falling over leading to his demise. No impartiality for accuracy. Flawed research.

    192. steveasaneilean says:

      Talking of the BBC – here is their “damning with faint praise” regarding Mr Carmichael’s contribution to the EVEL debate yesterday:

      “The debate, so skilfully secured by Lib Dem ex Scottish secretary Alistair Carmichael, produced a slightly pointless vote in which the Conservatives mostly abstained, but it brought all kinds of nasty tensions to the surface”

    193. Training Day says:

      Y’know, I can’t help agreeing with avuncular Al Carmichael on Scotland Tonight last night. EVEL should have been presented to Parliament as a Bill, allowing it to be subject to full House of Commons scrutiny and debate. In that way, the likelihood is that all sorts of amendments can be proposed to the Bill, and happily accepted by the Government once the latter inevitably sees the logic of them. Just as happened with the Scotland Bill.

      With logic like that, let’s hope avuncular Al isn’t representing himself on Thursday.

    194. Chitterinlicht says:

      Daily Record is just rubbish.

      Very good article Stu

    195. OT:

      Orkney against AC. 3mins introduction before hearing.

      http://livestream.com/IndependenceLive/events/4169874

    196. call me dave says:

      Do you have to have children to be a good politician?

      I ‘kid’ you not!

      “It’s an argument that can’t lightly be dismissed” says Kaye

      A new low …or am I being paranoid?

    197. Bob Mack says:

      @call me dave,
      No ,you are right enough.It is a new low.

    198. starlaw says:

      call me dave, I agree, this is a veiled attack at Nicola. Not successful either. Kaye’s Propaganda program in full swing

    199. Fireproofjim says:

      This morning is Ken500 day.
      Usually I agree but the rant against animal rights is completely wrong. It was only animal rights campaigners who stopped dog fighting, badger baiting, hare coursing, and a host of other violent and cruel “sports” for blood- thirsty medieval morons. Some such as fox hunting still continue. Is that what you want?

    200. Phronesis says:

      A budget is about to be announced that should have the 99.9% worried. It won’t be a budget for the majority it will be for the high net worth individuals (HNWI)- those with a spare million dollars outwith their residences and the class that they aspire to the ultra high net worth individuals (UHNWI). The ‘ultras’ have at least £30 million in disposable assets-most live in London (4224 of them in 2014). The top ‘ultras’ (85 people) are worth $1.7 trillion (the same wealth as the poorest 3.6 billion people on the planet who live on less than $1.25 dollars a day).

      The tax breaks and economic system that has ensured that the globalisation of inequality progresses unabated- aided and abetted by destruction of the environment, the excessive importance of the financial sector, deindustrialisation-the list goes on.

      The more that is known about the rationality and authority of the neoliberal state the more we should all be alarmed about how unwell the body economic is. It has been sustained by successive governments choosing political policies that have affected the life and death, resilience and risk for entire populations. These ’causes of the causes’ of the ill health that are so prevalent in this country are not what UKOK wants to really tackle. Austerity is not only measured numerically in economic stats but in the number of lives lost and avoidable deaths.

      But if you belong to the HNWI and the ‘ultras’ what does it matter if the 99% are thrown over a fiscal cliff? If people die 30 years earlier than you who cares there will be plenty more to replace them (an added bonus is that they never qualify for a pension- another reason to shrink the state).

      The Poor Law Commission in 1905-09 was the first major inquiry to the Poor Laws Act of 1834 that eventually triggered the abolition of the work house and child labour and helped to establish the welfare system- but here we are in 21st century UKOK- re-inventing the Poor Law for a modern context- food banks, widening inequality, zero hour contracts- essentially writing poverty into the DNA of the 99%.

    201. Yup, the Daily Record is rubbish, but once again it’s headline rubbish, and despite their falling circulation, a lot of people will still see it, fail to read any further, not that that would help, and believe their lies. Face it folks, this will continue ad-infinitum, and it’s a fact of life we just have to live with, so onwards and upwards with this and other websites, and soon back on the streets spreading the good word.

    202. Grouse Beater says:

      All Tory boys, such as Prof Tomkins, still get all the BBC air time they want.

      Tomkins: “I was not born in Scotland. I moved here for work eleven years ago.”

      And we are annoyed by those who term such arrogance and ego as issuing from ‘incomers’? The man does not recognise Scotland as a separate country.

    203. Joemcg says:

      “Do ugly masculine faced shill like gonks make good radio presenters?”

    204. heedtracker says:

      Ken500 says:
      8 July, 2015 at 9:09 am
      Tomkins is breaking the terms of his contract of employment and is never at his post.

      Prof T has an absolute right to his opinions and if his Glasgow uni employer is satisfied with his work, then that’s their decision.

      The whole giant UKOK propaganda issue is that virtually no one in Scotland has any right of reply to these hard core right wing hachet men like Prof T. This one unionist alone sits in BBC tv studios smirking away at the brilliance of UKOK toryboy world and then after all that, same BBC creep comes bleating to sucka Scots over their cash problems.

      Only in teamGB, or Greece probably but on the upside, Wings over Scotland goes from strength to strength.

      Toryboys like Prof Smirky there should be praising WoS on high. All the stuff that UKOK toryboy wetfarts worship are in WoS, self started, independence, freedom from evil and burdensome state interference, economic success and growth, free enterprise…

      Prof T, raging tory far right reactionary, detests Scotland’s democratic change, feeding off Scots state education tax funding, pouring out said reactionary Project Fear lies smears, mostly if not directly from BBC tax funded state broadcaster. as they all desperately monster progressive liberal PR democracy in Scotland, at tax payers costs.

      Or just one more toryboy throbber of UKOK ironies:D

    205. Ken500 says:

      The EVEL carry on in the Commons is an attempt by Conman Cameron to facilitate the lies he told to win the election. He knows he can’t get an EVEL vote through the Commons. Some Unionists do not want to break the Law. Scottish/UK/EU Law. Unlike Cameron. So he corruptly tries to manipulate to cover up his lies, in another way. The Scottish Gov should sue Cameron and get rid of him. Holyrood will not go. Cameron will. Evil EVEL doesn’t make any difference anyway. Scottish reps has no influence in Westminster. Outvoted 10 to 1. Numerical it is impossible. Scottish votes have only influenced Westminster 0.6% not even 10%, as representational. There was never a West Lothian question. It’s a myth. The SNP reps are doing brilliantly.

    206. Les Wilson says:

      Carmichael’s trial set for 7th September, in Edinburgh.

    207. Petra says:

      @ cynicalHighlander says at 9:22 am ”Orkney against AC. 3mins introduction before hearing.”

      http://livestream.com/IndependenceLive/events/4169874

      Thanks for the link cynicalHighlander. So have I picked up on that correctly? The Carmichael case will be heard at the Court of Sessions on the 7 / 8th September?

    208. My late parents were Labour voters up until the mid 1970s.

      They by that time had had enough of Labour’s lies and empty promises and switched to voting SNP until they day they died, always described in our household the daily record as the daily liar.

    209. Calgacus says:

      @Ken500, at least the Animal rights people give a damn about suffering creatures unlike the SNP who are up to their oxters in blood and in bed with the blood sports lobby

    210. Iain More says:

      Totally of topic!

      Animal Rights – meh. I don’t like sea gulls as they are for me the Tory bird – disease spreading rats with wings! Oh and always greetin!

      As for seals, the clapping hands circus acts, that is your average Brit Nat Party conference gathering. Definitely not cuddly!

    211. Ken500 says:

      @ Newsnetscotland

      An article on Carmichael ‘Frenchgate’

      Advert which might benefit

      1 Tip of a fat belly – ‘Cut down a bit of your fat belly everyday by simply using this weird old tip’ –

    212. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      The correct response to Tompkins is dismissive. There is no point in arguing about his selective facts and figures. Just gives him and them publicity oxygen.

      “So, let me get this straight. You are telling us that the 300 year union has reduced Scotland to beggar nation?”

    213. Tom Platt says:

      My first preference of newspapers is now the National and Sunday Herald. Yesterday there were no Nationals left in the Tesco in which I found myself. 3 years ago I would, unhesitatingly, have taken either The Herald or the Daily Record in lieu of the unavailable first preference. My second choice nowadays is The Scottish Sun for its recent support of the SNP, although The herald still features from time to time.

    214. Balaaargh says:

      This crappy paper was being given away at Edinburgh airport when I left on Monday. it’ll probably still be sat there when I get back later today.

      I wouldn’t use it as toilet paper – your backside gets messier with every wipe!

    215. Petra says:

      So many interesting posts to catch up with this morning and additionally another of Grouse Beaters enlightening articles ‘feudalism and neo-liberalism’.

      I see that Ken 500 has posted a number of comments about the economy and would like to put a question directly to him. Ken I’m not very knowledgeable at all when it comes to issues relating to the economy. I understand that Scotland has many diverse resources, we’ve been robbed of our oil revenue over the last 40 years or so and that we’ve paid more tax per head in Scotland than rUK over the last 34 years and so on.

      I understand that Westminster has blocked all amendments to the Scotland Bill so far. If this continues and ultimately stands how will this affect Scotland? Are they setting the SNP up to fail in that they will have to put taxes up to balance the books or is it possible for Holyrood to continue to ‘manage’ this situation without becoming unpopular? Could you explain this to me? What is Westminster getting up to?

      @ heedtracker says at 10:13 am ”The whole giant UKOK propaganda issue is that virtually no one in Scotland has any right of reply to these hard core right wing hatchet men like Prof T. This one unionist alone sits in BBC tv studios smirking away at the brilliance of UKOK toryboy world and then after all that, same BBC creep comes bleating to sucka Scots over their cash problems ….”

      Heedtracker this ”no right of reply” is one of the MOST frustrating aspects of our fight in acquiring our Independence. There was a time when one persons opinion would be tested against anothers, now we have individuals being afforded a great deal of time to spout their ‘influential’ guff unopposed. The BBC (and STV to some extent) are using well known Labour supporting presenters to unashamedly select (or their boss does) any anti-SNP so-called expert to state their case on most programmes now. There must be hundreds of people (experts) to choose from … hundreds of people who must feel even more frustrated by this than we do. I just wish that someone such as Professor John Robertson would gather evidence to this effect, confront the BBC with it and then find a way to disseminate the information.

    216. Petra says:

      Thanks for the links Nana.

      I see that the ”BBC chiefs are braced for condemnation from an inquiry into the broadcaster’s failure to discover that one of its stars was a prolific paedophile. Dame Janet Smith, who is conducting a review into Jimmy Savile’s activities, is concerned about why the corporation failed to realise what he was doing despite hints of his paedophilia in one of its own programmes 15 years ago.”

      I think that when they delve into it they’ll find that he was a known paedophile since at least 1972 …. and far from being the only one employed by the BBC.

      I see that you’ve posted a John Pilger article. He’s absolutely brilliant and one of the few reporters telling the truth now. I’ll post a few of my favourites on here. Lengthy but well worth reading especially in light of Westminsters forthcoming plans for dealing with Daesh in Syria.

      Why the rise of fascism is again the issue

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/why-the-rise-of-fascism-is-again-the-issue

      The world war on democracy

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/the-world-war-on-democracy

      War by media and the triumph of propaganda

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/war-by-media-and-the-triumph-of-propaganda

      Is media just another word for control?

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/is-media-just-another-word-for-control

      From Pol Pot to ISIS: “Anything that flies on everything that moves”

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/from-pol-pot-to-isis-anything-that-flies-on-everything-that-moves

      From Hiroshima to Syria, the enemy whose name we dare not speak

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/from-hiroshima-to-syria-the-enemy-whose-name-we-dare-not-speak

      Break the silence: a world war is beckoning

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/break-the-silence-a-world-war-is-beckoning

      Discovering the power of people’s history – and why it is feared today

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/discovering-the-power-of-peoples-history-and-why-it-is-feared-today

      Dance on Thatcher’s grave, but remember there has been a coup in Britain

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/dance-on-thatcher-s-grave-but-remember-there-has-been-a-coup-in-britain

      The party game is over. Stand and fight

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/the-party-game-is-over-stand-and-fight

      David Cameron’s gift of war and racism, to them and us

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/david-cameron-s-gift-of-war-and-racism-to-them-and-us

      Welcome to the violent world of Mr. Hopey Changey

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/welcome-to-the-violent-world-of-mr-hopey-changey

      The liberal way to run the world – “improve” or we’ll kill you

      http://johnpilger.com/articles/the-liberal-way-to-run-the-world-improve-or-we-ll-kill-you

    217. heedtracker says:

      Petra, its a fascinating thing UK media control and ownership. BBC is so big and so powerful, its hard to imagine a Scottish timeline that doesn’t have the current angry reactionary BBC, dictating a conservative unionist centre right UK.

      Take a walk round their Pacific Quay citadel. Its meant to be a media business park but there’s nothing there, just that giant £500 million PFI glass box. It looks like Scots licence fee is funneled to England and invested there and that suits their management here in Scotland so they won’t be complaining much.

      In the 60’s the UK elite allowed working class people in to uni’s and the BBC but they will never make that mistake again.

      So in an ideal Scotland, bring in foreign nationals to run the Scottish Broadcasting Corp and always have a far right Prof Tomkins tory boy on, because they do own this union lock, stock and limp barrel and always that equal counterbalance, is what I would do if king for a day.

      Incidentally, almost all western countries have tv licence fees and state broadcasters. Germany has double the fee we have but they have two state broadcasters. Can’t think why.

    218. Fred says:

      @ Grouse Beater, good article, not enough of us follow the land issue, Andy Wightman’s book “The Poor Had No Lawyers” should be more widely read. Donnie Munro’s unfortunately tarred with the Slab brush I’m afraid.

      A small point, your pic’ illustrating the Mull clearances is a large sheep fank and more likely to be linked to a post-clearance sheep farm.

    219. Petra says:

      @ heedtracker at 12:06 pm

      Do you think broadcasting will ever be devolved to Scotland (until such time we get our Independence)? Taking into account they say that Scotland will have the most devolved Parliament in the World.

    220. Rock says:

      Fireproofjim,

      ” Usually I agree but the rant against animal rights is completely wrong. It was only animal rights campaigners who stopped dog fighting, badger baiting, hare coursing, and a host of other violent and cruel “sports” for blood- thirsty medieval morons. Some such as fox hunting still continue. Is that what you want?”

      Ken, are animal rights activists also funded by landowners like the Greens are (as you often say)?

      We may not like their tactics sometimes, but they believe in something and do what they can about it.

      Don’t forget we are like animal rights activists to our unionist enemies.

    221. Rock says:

      Les Wilson,

      “Carmichael’s trial set for 7th September, in Edinburgh.”

      I would say Carmichael’s acquital process set for 7th September.

      After the £60,000 collected by independence supporters has gone down the legal sewer, a Scottish judge, one of the lowest of the low in society, will acquit Carmichael.

      I’ll be happy to be proved wrong.



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