The world's most-read Scottish politics website

Wings Over Scotland


Song For Today

Posted on June 27, 2016 by

We’ve been watching the news all morning, and there’s only one sane response.

Print Friendly, PDF & Email

1 Trackbacks/Pingbacks

  1. 27 06 16 12:57

    Song For Today | speymouth
    Ignored

703 to “Song For Today”

  1. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    May I suggest Reperata and the Dellrons .

    “This is the Captain of your ship”

  2. Papadox
    Ignored
    says:

    Lords and yoon MPs first!

  3. Capella
    Ignored
    says:

    Very apt. And the upside down flag “distress” call too.

  4. Bugger (le Panda)
    Ignored
    says:

    Bob Mack

    Remember that, I thinlk

  5. galamcennalath
    Ignored
    says:

    Yes. To the lifeboat!

    Johnson says: “It is clear now that Project Fear is over, there is not going to be an emergency budget, people’s pensions are safe, the pound is stable, the markets are stable, I think that’s all very good.”

    Not many will share his optimism and appraisal. Pound lowest for 31 years. Suspension of trading in bank shares. And, the effects are being felt globally.

    Nicola tweets in response: “Indeed, Boris. Project Farce has now begun – and you are largely responsible”.

  6. X_Sticks
    Ignored
    says:

    Spot on Rev.

    Just back from taking advantage of my European citizenship. Visited Athens. Thought it might be a bit dour given everything that has happened to their economy, but not a bit of it. In spite of everything everyone we spoke to is still largely supportive of the EU. They want change, yes, but they don’t yet want out.

    We ‘lost’ a day on Friday as we were just riveted by the fall out from the brexit bombshell. A large part of the English electorate have just put a gun their own heads and pulled the trigger. I fell very sorry from the youth of England who have just had their future decimated for the sake of a few lunatics who have brought about this situation largely for the betterment of their own careers (or so they thought).

    Scotland? I hope we might end up in a situation where independence is supported by the EU to keep us in. This could potentially lead to a UDI exit from the UK. That would prevent any dodgy dealings from the british establishment. My fear is that if we go down the referendum route the establishment will rig is one way or another. If there is to be an indyref2 then I certainly don’t want it run by the Electoral Commission. We should organise the whole thing ourselves and have international observers to ensure there is no cheating.

  7. Robert Graham
    Ignored
    says:

    dont panic dont panic we are all doomed doomed i say this farce makes an episode of Dad’s Army appear distinctly sensible .
    Pound projected to dip below 1.30
    BBC still pushing the Nicola threatens “……..” button
    Just a normal day in the land of OZ

  8. Tony Little
    Ignored
    says:

    @X-Sticks

    Agree 100% about the (non)involvement of the Electoral Commission next time. I would also want a completely different system for Postal Voting. I would favour the old system whereby people had to have a genuine reason for not voting in person.

    However, in the absence of this, there needs to be proper control of the process and absolutely NO involvement of political parties “assisting” people with their voting. Postal ballots should be counted separately and publicly announced separately.

    Fool me once……etc.

  9. Neil McKenzie
    Ignored
    says:

    You just got to look at the faces of Doris and Dodge to realise that Brexit is a kick in the nuts for the establishment and the right wing media. The left should be celebrating. Markets haven’t dropped that much, they are still above post 2008 levels, and where there is a market there’s a seller, where there’s a profit there’s an investor. This volatility is an opportunity for the money men. The markets are rigged anyway, just look at Libor and the gold markets which they have already been caught manipulating. The ones hurting out of this is the establishment who are working towards collective power and control, and collective power is only good for the ones that want to heard the sheep for farming. We have become so used to it and been sold it’s good by a right wing media that it’s a shock. What one generation tolerates the next will embrace, that’s why the youth wanted in yet were too lazy to vote.
    Fear is a big controller, but that fear of Scottish independence by No voters has just been trumped by fear of Brexit, that’s why they switched. I voted in because I’m afraid of what Wm Neoliberals would do to Scotland, and I don’t want Wm getting more into bed with the US, I’m also with Craig Murray that a federal EU would be better, but Brexit is a good thing for the left and my ideal scenario would be Scottish independence then an EU breakdown, because I don’t want to swap England for Germany and get the governments we didn’t vote for and be herded by an EU elite instead. We need to break collective power, not embrace it

  10. Genghis D'Midgies
    Ignored
    says:

    Ah well you musta missed Alex Salmond on Sky news and Tasmina Sheikh on BBC Victoria live. Scotland’s representatives making some great points.

  11. jimnarlene
    Ignored
    says:

    Or perhaps this little ditty..

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jxNEiZhpinY#

  12. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Its a mad mad mad toryboy world but I’m emigrating to Slovenia to be with gorgeous pouting

    Adam Tomkins MSP Retweeted
    Lindsay McIntosh ?@lmkmcintosh 2h2 hours ago
    Also in today’s @thetimes – @ProfTomkins explains why he believes H’rood couldn’t block Brexit:

    As toryboy world swills England down the pot of UKOK history, this chump’s interesting to watch on Scotland blocking England’s EU exit.

    In other words, if a lawyer’s speaking with fork tongue, in a toryboy rag like The Times, he doesn’t know, from England or Slovenia.

  13. galamcennalath
    Ignored
    says:

    Neil McKenzie says:

    “I don’t want to swap England for Germany”

    There is absolutely no comparison with the power England exercises over Scotland, and that which the EU would exercise over iScotland. Vastly different.

    Could the EU drag us into a war we opposed? No. England can at present.

    Could the EU force us to site WMDs here? No. England does.

  14. Jack Murphy
    Ignored
    says:

    OT slightly.Lovebomb 2014 Letter Historian Dan Snow isn’t too happy with the EU Referendum Result last Friday.

    The son-in-law of the Duke of Westminster wrote in last Friday’s Daily Mail:-

    “What Scotland and Northern Ireland do next is massively important. Britain became the most powerful country on earth, with the best economy, and built the British Empire because we unified ourselves.

    With Scotland expected to leave after its own referendum, we could go from being a major player to a little runt state.

    If we become just England and Wales again, our significance will return to how we were before the Spanish Armada in 1588, on the periphery, relying on piracy to make money with no influence over our own path.

    We will have consigned ourselves to irrelevance, to be blown by the winds of the rest of the world. When China, America and Russia make deals, we will have to go along.”

    Selectively edited by me.

    Perhaps he should be drafting another Lovebomb “We Love You” Letter to someone somewhere…………

  15. manandboy
    Ignored
    says:

    Missed the morning ferry – reposting from previous post

    In the way that Scotland is already changing to an Independent way of thinking and acting, so also we ought really to switch now to a European standpoint. We are no longer UK, looking into Europe; we are now, effectively and aspirationally, looking into the rUK from Europe.

    One of the immediate effects of this change is the realisation that the management of the consequences of EU Ref16 lies in our own hands, in partnership with the EU. The government at Westminster meanwhile continues to think that they are still in control of Scotland. It is this UK centered thinking which we continue to be brainwashed with daily by the BBC and the press.

    It’s time to think as being European just as, I suspect, Nicola herself is doing already. I look forward to a ‘European’ Wings over Scotland.

  16. Chic McGregor
    Ignored
    says:

    Or one for Nicola

    http://www.youtu.be/DohRa9lsx0Q?t=3

  17. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    If we become just England and Wales again, our significance will return to how we were before the Spanish Armada in 1588, on the periphery, relying on piracy to make money with no influence over our own path.”

    Why would toryboy world losing control of 8% of its UKOK scotland region serfdom suddenly become a failed state, is never discussed by toryboys.

    Dan’s just one more tory nutcase but on balance, I’ve always wanted to be a pirate, there be treasure my hearties, arrrrrrrrrr.

  18. Kato Raggity
    Ignored
    says:

    I am a member of the SNP down in London. How do I register to vote in Scotland so that I can vote in the next Indy ref. Anyone want to let me register at their address back in Scotland?

  19. A Welcome Home
    Ignored
    says:

    A great many people in Scotland who voted No at the last Indyref are unquestionably thinking again. As long as the chaos continues it will pull more and more voters out way.

    iIf we do indeed get Boris as PM then I cannot believe that will do anything other than give another boost to Independence.

    Many people have long said Boris just acts like a buffoon and is really quite canny. Let no-one say that again after the astonishing farce playing out just now.

    Boris truly is a complete buffoon. It’s not an act.

  20. Robert Louis
    Ignored
    says:

    Am I alone in getting angrier with each passing day? As we sit and watch the lunatics in London destroy everything, the pound is literally dropping minute by minute. This is REAL. Despite the Bank of England literally burning taxpayers money since Friday to try to stop the pound crashing, it continues to drop.

    It is all well and good to talk of planning for Scotland to stay in the EU via independence, but really I think this is now becoming urgent. We need a way out from these London clowns now.

    We have utter fools running things in London, encouraging racism and generally screwing up the futures of every man woman and child in Scotland, whilst offering inane, meaningless platitudes on TV about ‘our economy is as strong as it can be expected in the circumstances’.

    We cannot wait.

  21. Walter Scott
    Ignored
    says:

    England & partners in crime Wales could put a red light up & go on the game.

  22. Chic McGregor
    Ignored
    says:

    Sorry tried to miss out the ad intro – didn’t work.

    Hope this works.

    youtu.be/DohRa9lsx0Q

  23. DerekM
    Ignored
    says:

    Good choice Rev though i think this one is just as relevant 😉

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCkNu9OxThc

  24. DerekM
    Ignored
    says:

    Or how about this one

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mke8Zqii3z8

    Funny how a lot of these songs appeared last time we ended up with a rat bag tory monster in charge.

  25. Papadox
    Ignored
    says:

    Where is big Gordie the world neads saving, Gordie, Gordie come oot come oot wherever ye are, the world neads ye Gordie.

  26. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Robert Louis says:
    27 June, 2016 at 1:05 pm
    Am I alone in getting angrier with each passing day? As we sit and watch the lunatics in London destroy everything,

    Its out of our hands, yoons like these say so. Anyway Kevrage is going to London to fix everything with his graphs and amazing cleverness and UKOK unionist thingees.

    Scotland in Union ?@scotlandinunion Jun 26
    “We need a break from divisive arguments. Last thing we need as we face challenges of change is even more discord”

    (((Kevin Hague))) ?@kevverage 3h3 hours ago
    I’m speaking at @scotlandinunion London event on 11th July – seems no point prepping given the mayfly-like half-life of political facts

  27. Clapper57
    Ignored
    says:

    Remember in October 2015 John McDonnell stating “SNP are the real enemy?”

    He might want to rethink that.

  28. K1
    Ignored
    says:

    ‘Why would toryboy world losing control of 8% of its UKOK scotland region serfdom suddenly become a failed state, is never discussed by toryboys.’

    Indeed, I think it will now begin to ‘slip out’ into daylight what the true relationship is between Scotland and England. Their tongues are loosening…Scotland subsidises England, always has…but the propaganda koolaid has been drunk deeply.

    The establishment are quite literally crapping themselves. They know the real score as do we here on Wings…poor England has been kept in the dark for centuries…such an ignoble end to their empire built upon the back’s of those colonised by the supreme ‘race’ (copyright: sensibledave).

  29. Capella
    Ignored
    says:

    Angela Eagle on air very tearfully explaining that she, very reluctantly and sadly, can’t serve under Jeremy Corbyn any longer. He can’t communicate. She sent him an email yesterday and he didn’t reply.

    BBC stirring madly.

  30. paul gerard mccormack
    Ignored
    says:

    I see the Scottish question has been given the relative importance one would attribute to the reporting that Alloa v. Stenhousemuir would receive in the MSM compared to Man utd. v. Arsenal.

    So be it. Same as it always was.

    Can we just get on with it? Over to you, Europe. The ball is currently in your half.

  31. Nation Libre
    Ignored
    says:

    The Animals – We Gotta Get Out Of This Place

  32. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Come on JC! He’ll be there for years with these spivs after him.

    Duncan Hothersall Retweeted
    The Daily Record ?@Daily_Record 5h5 hours ago
    Record View: It’s time Jeremy Corbyn stood down for the sake of the Labour party:

  33. DerekM
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Chic

    Chic just copy from your browser page address and remove the http:// it will post as a clickable link,you used the embed link just as well you removed the http or the Rev might have hit you with his hammer lol

  34. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Dr NO also heading for the funny farm. Can someone tell ultra UKOK unionists like Dr NO the actual EU referendum result in his scotland region, perlease.

    Scott Arthur ?@DrScottThinks 6h6 hours ago
    The SNP are now funding Facebook adverts for #Indyref2.

    Did they do the same for #EHRef?

  35. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    The SS Ukania is going down, Captain Cameron has already jumped ship and First Mate Osbourne is busy preparing his personal lifeboat.

  36. Jack Murphy
    Ignored
    says:

    I guess this is what “Cataclysmic IndyRef” Labour’s Lord George Robertson meant in 2014:-
    “Summary
    Sterling falls more than 3% to new 31 year-low against dollar

    Bank shares fall sharply as FTSE 100 drops

    Former Bank Governor Mervyn King: ‘People shouldn’t panic’

    George Osborne indicates no Emergency Budget

    Foxtons and Easyjet shares dive after Brexit profit warnings”

    BBC Business Archived http://archive.is/LHp9K

  37. Robert J. Sutherland
    Ignored
    says:

    Who cares about the future of Jeremy Corbyn or the Labour Party? They seem to have turned into an amateur tribute act of “Game of Thrones”. Completely irrelevant.

    Meantime the ancien regime is AWOL and the incoming Brexit regime doesn’t have a clue about what to do. Not that the media managed to discover that there was no “Plan A” during the EUref.

    Westminster is a total omnishambles. The quicker we’re shot of them, the better.

    Scotland needs to be a sovereign nation again.

  38. Robert Graham
    Ignored
    says:

    the BBC pushing the line of Sturgeon threatens “……..” is Stoking up hatred and resentment in England , this crazy bunch need calming down not provoking just now while the Pound drops further and it finally dawns on them the consequences of thursdays result .
    They are endangering the safety and security of Nicola Sturgeon have they forgotten what happens when you provoke some right wing nut job .presently there are plenty of loons around without presenting them with a target of hate.
    Really disappointed in the BBC north and south acting like this .

  39. K1
    Ignored
    says:

    Nicola’s statement regarding seeking a mandate from the Scottish parliament to strengthen her hand going forward:

    “I am specifically asking Parliament to strengthen my hand by giving me a mandate to pursue discussions about protecting Scotland’s place in the EU with the UK Government, other devolved administrations, EU institutions and member states.

    “It is now crucial that our national Parliament speaks with as strong and united a voice as possible on this issue.

    “Today’s debate is among the most important in Holyrood’s history – and I want to see it result in broad cross-party support for our efforts.”

    http://archive.is/nbHCw

  40. MajorBloodnok
    Ignored
    says:

    I see one of the #Brexit conspirators is now actually writing down the plan for the UK’s exit strategy from the EU.

    The working title is “Fifty Articles of Grayling”.

  41. Nation Libre
    Ignored
    says:

    I think Corbyn will hang on until the Chilcot report, hopefully

  42. Dal Riata
    Ignored
    says:

    Absolutely fucking loving it seeing the utterly hypocritical let’s-pretend-to-be-left-leaning-but-we’re-as-rightwing-if-not-more-so-than-those-who-are-open-about-it Guardian go into hysterical meltdown!

    For all the lies, misinformation, FUD, scaremongering, fearmongering and shameful dishonesty that you *still* promote and disseminate about Scotland, it’s people and their right to self-determination, Guardian, this is for you – Get It Right Fucking Up Yez – sideways! And may your eventually demise, along with the rest of your Britnat MSM mates, be painful – very, very painful.

  43. Ian Brotherhood
    Ignored
    says:

    @Papadox (1.17) –

    Was just thinking the same. If ever there was a time for a Gordy intervention, this is it.

    He’ll appear on College Green wearing a toga, and lay down some quasi-Biblical shit involving the word ‘asunder’.

  44. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Rancid The Graun preys to the almighty for deliverance from Brexit

    “How to stop Brexit: get your MP to vote it down
    Geoffrey Robertson

    We don’t need another referendum. Members of parliament have every right to vote against repeal of the act that led us into Europe”

    Westminster not allowing art 50 through may actually work/save their sorry UKOK tory arses.

    Should be a interesting vote, how many toryboys would dare vote it down, how many Lab’s would abstain etc. Presumably all SNP will vote nae. Smells like UKOK EUOK fudge on the horizon.

  45. Stoker
    Ignored
    says:

    After supporting the Eurovision Song Contest for well over 50-years and Westmonsters various extravagant financial expenditures i think we’re entitled to a wee bit of support, don’t yous? Don’t worry folks, i’m on the case!

    ((( BRING BRING….BRING BRING….BRING BRING )))

    ((( HELLO EUROPE? )))

    ((( THIS IS SCOTLAND CALLING! )))

    ((( MAY WE HAVE YOUR VOTES PLEASE? )))

  46. K1
    Ignored
    says:

    Oliver Lewin has been cited as ‘in charge of Brexit cross-government preparations, No 10 says’

    Stu is having a meltdown on twitter (in the omfg you could not make this shit up category of ‘meltdown’) 🙂

  47. ephemeraldeception
    Ignored
    says:

    Remark re: Scottish exports and imports.

    If Scotland stays in EU, then depending on trade agreements with Scot:Eng and Eng:EU other, then it means that Eastern scottish ports will have a much better business case.

    This holds up even if Scotland does not leave UK but can be considered a country within the EU.

    What we need to see is what is the response from EU moversd and shakers. If it strongly positive then a referendum is more likely. However it could be that Scotland may stay in EU even after a brexit by keeping current agreements ie. excluded from Anglo:EU seperation agreements.

    This means that a Scottish referendum could occur after brexit but we would not need to negociate a full re-entry as we would never have left. Negociations would be more on adaption of the existing status quo and Scotland would also be successor sate in EU terms.

  48. Kevin Evans
    Ignored
    says:

    Not long till Wall Street opens now. Then we will see how the special relationship works out.

    Since the uk has no goverment am pretty certain Europe is talking with the USA to agree business and economic stability.

  49. K1
    Ignored
    says:

    I dare them to do it Heed, if they want to be lynched by their constituents…then go right ahead and vote down the will of yer electorate.

    Can any of us even imagine if Alex or any of our MSP’s had suggested turning the ref result around as so many of these ‘democrats’ have done over the past few days?

    Hell to pay doesn’t come close…

    It’s not going to happen. A match to a powder keg if they try imo.

  50. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    Letwin?!?!

    OFFS! They’ve gone AWOL.

    I’m surprised they’re not salting the soil and burning the fields as they retreat from office.

  51. Proud Cybernat
    Ignored
    says:

    Hey Westminster – know how oor Nicola’s planning to “block Brexit”? Well, it’s called KARMA. Remember when you all stumbled drunkenly out of the WM bars into the Division Lobbies at WM to vote down every single SNP ammendment to the Scotland Bill last year – remember that? Well GIRFUYs!!

    “They don’t like it up ’em, Captain Mainwaring!”

  52. Thepnr
    Ignored
    says:

    @Robert J. Sutherland

    Who cares about the future of Jeremy Corbyn or the Labour Party?

    I might not care much but in Scotland I’m sure there are still some who do care, something like 20% of the electorate and that is important.

    In 2007 both Labour and the SNP took around 33% of the constituency vote, fast forward to 2016 and the fall in Labour support of just over 10% pretty closely matches the increase in support for the SNP and Independence.

    This implosion we are witnessing right now, with so far 28 members of the shadow cabinet resigning in protest at Corbyns leadership. This will be playing mental havoc and depressing the remaining 22% of the Scottish electorate that still care enough to support Labour.

    We don’t need the Labour party in Scotland to support Independence but I would certainly welcome a big chunk if not half of their support to shift their votes to the Independence cause. Logically, backing Independence may be the only hope Scottish Labour have of surviving.

    After the disaster that is Brexit I’m confident that more Labour voters will shift their vote now to Yes no matter what their Scottish leaders views.

  53. Chic McGregor
    Ignored
    says:

    CNBC squwakbox predicting movement of the FDA from London to the continent and large correction in London real estate valuation (i.e drop in London property values).

  54. Mark Fletcher
    Ignored
    says:

    Being a convinced Europhile for the whole of my adult life, whilst simultaneously finding England curiously foreign, I am looking forward immensely to a free Scotland taking its place in Brussels.

    Woohoo!

    I am about to spend the rest of the summer in Italy but I am so annoyed at my own lack of foresight – it’s just not like me – because I haven’t bought Euros yet and it is now going to cost me a small fortune.

    Fuck.

  55. Iain More
    Ignored
    says:

    Project farce well it is more like Project Shittin Themselves. The pro EU BBC is in full diarrhoea mode today but still it looks for an SNP Baahd Scots evil angle.

  56. Chic McGregor
    Ignored
    says:

    @Mark

    Me too. Off to Finland next week 🙁

  57. Ian Brotherhood
    Ignored
    says:

    Tory cabinet deserves a Turner Prize for this:

    ‘We will not tolerate intolerance.’

    🙂

  58. Petra
    Ignored
    says:

    What a bl**dy nightmare. The pound is plummeting (at a 31 year low) and we have wee Nazi Englanders thinking they have been given an endorsement by the political Brexiter Cabal to further abuse foreigners in England. Diabolical.

    Meanwhile Boris et al are backtracking on all of their prior promises. Where have we heard that one before? Boris now saying ”there’s no rush to leave the EU” and Philip Hammond chuntering on about ”staying in the single market and continuing to accept free movement of people”. If they don’t get their act together, and soon, there’ll be a civil war in England.

    On top of that we’re witnessing the Labour Party fiasco. Is the Labour Party well and truly finished in the UK now? Who, what political Party in its right mind would do what Labour are doing right now? They wait for the Brexit result to come in and then use it to get rid of their leader (however more sinister reasons circulate). How timely is that, NOT. Also ensuring that the Tories have been able to take time out, lie low over the weekend, when in reality they should have been THE front page news.

    28 resignations now with many of the people concerned blaming Jeremy Corbyn for the ‘Leave’ result. God you couldn’t make it up. The pernicious attitude of many of the leave voters has been festering away for years now long before Jeremy Corbyn became leader. Their attitudes shaped by mostly Tory politicians (austerity / racism), a propagandist media, ineffective Labour MPs and the actions of Blair and Brown. Their fear of England being invaded by people fleeing war torn countries was created by Tony Blair not Jeremy Corbyn. The Tony Blair that many of those ousting Corbyn in this coup actually support.

    I’m not a great Jeremy Corbyn fan but this current scenario is positively crazy, suicidal, and more than anything tells me that this party is absolutely finished now, like their stooges north of the border, because it wont matter who they elect in future, Blairite or Hardieite, …. their membership will be depleted, decimated, due to their schizophrenic ideology. No doubt Tim Fallon, LibDem, is sitting rubbing his hands and waiting patiently to fill the void.

    ……………………………………………………

    Jim Sillars is still ‘at it’ to the point that I actually wonder if he wants Scotland to be Independent at all. He wanted us all to vote Leave and if we had done so we would have found ourselves at the mercy of a Fascist Tory Government unfettered by the EU. In conjunction with the (additional) misery that type of Government would have created for the Scots what possible chance would we have had to get our Independence following such action? Nought in my opinion. Add to that he actually advocates hundreds of companies, having been awarded licenses by Westminster, fracking in Scotland. Forget about being naive. Jim Sillars seems to have totally lost the plot now.

    Jim Sillars: ‘Let’s not be naive, the political and legal basis for early indyref2 is not in place.’

    http://www.thenational.scot/comment/jim-sillars-lets-not-be-naive-the-political-and-legal-basis-for-early-indyref2-is-not-in-place.19274

    …………………………………………..

    Following Brexit, and the announcement of a proposed Indyref2, I’m wondering if our SNP MPs will be treated with a great deal more respect in the Commons now?

  59. Chic McGregor
    Ignored
    says:

    Saw a CNN interviewer ask a young (French? Belgian?) woman in Edinburgh about BREXIT and what her experience had been living in Scotland. She said she and her friends talked about BREXIT a lot and were very concerned about it but that they were very happy here as the Scots are so welcoming unlike other areas of the UK.

    So pwoud.

  60. Robert Graham
    Ignored
    says:

    We ,you ,us ,have lost 6 and a half Billion Pounds since Friday this was our stake in the various UK Banks and The Tory chancellor has said we are prepared .Oh thank f/k for that reassurance eh .
    Labour in total free fall with the most scathing attack was by a close supporter Angela Eagle , she said she couldn’t even get a face to face meeting with Corbyn to tender her resignation and had to do it over the phone ,
    If this continues Corbyn won’t be able to form a official opposition he is fast running out of MPs willing to back him ?
    Angus Robertsons joke about assuming official opposition status may yet come to pass where is Kezia ? Come on hen yer needed . To bad your not an MP just like Ruthie yikes we are doomed .

  61. Free Scotland
    Ignored
    says:

    How about a fundraiser to arrange for Johnson, Gove and Farage to do an open-top-bus victory tour of Scotland? Any funds raised in excess of what is required to pay for the bus would be used to purchase boxes of rotten eggs and mouldy tomatoes to help spectators to make it a memorable event.

  62. DerekM
    Ignored
    says:

    So Downing street is saying we dont need an independence referendum great we will just take our indy then.

    Sorry Tory pondscum you dont get to decide,oh and the oil is ours.

    One wee question though just how are you going to pay off your 1.6 trillion debt soon to become 3 trillion as i would imagine your creditors will be anxious to get their money back,you could sell the Queen i hear she has lots of cash and is about the only thing you havnt flogged yet.

    Us well we dont really care because we are so out of your poxy union and we will be taking none of your debt in fact we might just send you a bill for our oil and whisky revenue you have pissed up against the wall.

  63. Ananurhing
    Ignored
    says:

    Sorry for banging on about Norway but there are so many similarities in our separate journeys.

    Norway and Sweden were heading in different directions.

    Norway was forbidden from setting up it’s own diplomatic missions. It did it anyway.

    Norway was forbidden from drafting it’s own constitution. It did it anyway.

    Norway was forbidden from holding a referendum. It was done anyway. 99.?% Jah!

    Sweden’s project fear army gathered at the border in anticipation of the result. Then went home again.

    Nicola’s right. There is no precedent. There are no rules to govern this situation. Many of us wanted to see her being more radical. I think we’re about to.

    Jim Sillars is a twat.

  64. Chic McGregor
    Ignored
    says:

    Ashcroft is claiming 36% of SNP voters voted Leave. Only 1% less than Labour voters.

    No big surprise, there has always been a significant percentage of pro indy voters who regard that that means out of the EU as well as out of the UK.

    However that won’t stop Kezia using it against the SNP.

  65. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    At least little England cannot now say we will be too poor or we will have a black hole to worry about,because the black hole heading their way just now will be enough to swallow a small planet.

    For the Scots it’s now simply a choice of which black hole they want to deal with.

  66. Ananurhing
    Ignored
    says:

    Just a thought. What if we the Scottish people petitioned the EU en masse refusing to surrender our European citizenship, on the grounds of our democratically expressed will?

    EU Charter of Fundamental Rights expressly forbids mass expulsions from the EU.

    Imagine the global coverage that would get.

  67. gus1940
    Ignored
    says:

    Given last thursday’s result surely now is the time for Holyrood to re-examine the case for restoration of the full daily vehicle and passenger ferry service from Rosyth to Zeebrugge.

    It must up to the same standard as the much missed Superfast service and if it needs a substantial subsidy so be it.

    This time it must be properly promoted.

  68. manandboy
    Ignored
    says:

    We’re in a race against time.

    The Tories are basically saying they won’t be ready to implement article 50 until October and so everyone will have to wait.

    An EU summit will meet for two days starting tomorrow. Waiting for Boris to become PM is not on their agenda.

    I wonder whose timetable will prevail.

  69. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    Petra,

    I’m beginning to wonder if old Jim hasn’t adopted the Bain Principle! Anything Alex and Nicola say, he seems to take the opposite view – consistently.

  70. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    K1 says:
    27 June, 2016 at 2:04 pm
    I dare them to do it Heed,

    Ongoing tory BBC led media Project Fear Brexit stuff across Westminster huge summer hols, conference season, opening of parliament, endless fannying around, you’re looking at early 2017 before art 50 even gets going in the House. Still catastrophic economic damage but same UKOK media freak show can smooth that out of our dim minds, as per.

    Meanwhile, FT says the Americans will save them.

    US seeks role of mediator in EU’s political crisis
    Kerry pays impromptu visit to London and Brussels

    Offering itself as a mediator in Europe’s new political crisis, the US has called on the UK and the EU to adopt a “sensible” and “thoughtful” approach to their forthcoming divorce proceedings

  71. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    Last Thursdays’ result has emboldened the racists and bigots. The treatment of immigrants and non-whites during the last few days is making the George Sq. trouble on 19the Sep 2014 look like a picnic. Things are getting out of hand – we need strong leadership at this moment, not non-existent leadership. What a real opportunity for a progressive opposition to grasp and deliver a knock-out punch to the tories. As usual, the Labour party is too busy self-harming. They will never be forgiven.

  72. schrodingers cat
    Ignored
    says:

    re corbyn

    many were afraid he would be labours saviour in scotland, i argued that while he could be, once elected he would be over thrown by the blairites, and with that, labours last chance in scotland would be over.

    other events have over taken this pantomime, i no longer think it matters to the indy campaign

    see eric joyce joined yes2 this weekend

  73. Glamaig
    Ignored
    says:

    How many years before Englandandwales calls in the IMF?
    1
    2
    3
    4
    5

    circle only 1

  74. John Thomson
    Ignored
    says:

    Rev
    can the SNP not lend Jeremy some MPs to fill the posts left by their defectors

  75. Dr Jim
    Ignored
    says:

    @Free Scotland

    No one should be advocating the quite frankly violent ultra extremist actions of the use of “The Egg” the whole idea is a vile distortion of our Great British value system and to be abhorred by all fair and decent minded citizens, and to go as far as “The Tomato” should be made a criminal offence and in particular the use of the word “Rotten” in describing these “Tomatoes” or indeed any incitement to use other vegetables that may have “Gone off” could risk the spread of infection or any airborne disease

    Anyone supporting these illegal activities should be censured at once and I implore the good people of our great nation not to descend into chaos by the use of these tactics

    I believe with my heart head and soul the best way to resolve the differences between us is

    Tomato controls and Egg restrictions in terms of nobody needs to purchase more than 6 Eggs at a time and the Farming lobby need to be taken on in this respect

    More than 6 Vegetables at one time is at the level of assault Vegetables and needs to be gotten off the streets of our Great Nation

  76. dramfineday
    Ignored
    says:

    “What passes for love” by John Mayall and the Bluesbreakers would also be appropriate today.

  77. galamcennalath
    Ignored
    says:

    Tomorrow, Nicola is to ask Holyrood on Tuesday to give her a mandate to negotiate with the EU.

    Greens, yes.

    It will be VERY interesting to see which Unionists back her.

    Looks like the LibDems probably will.

    Labour? I reckon they will. Or abstain, as is their custom

    The Ruthite Tories as the party which exists to look after the interests of Greater England and its ruling class, nae chance.

  78. Dave McEwan Hill
    Ignored
    says:

    O/T

    Middle pages in today’s National for keeping!

  79. Dave McEwan Hill
    Ignored
    says:

    Chic McGregor at 2.52

    It doesn’t matter.

  80. Tinto Chiel
    Ignored
    says:

    Ananurhing: liked your potted history of Norway and 1905.

    That figure of 99% has always amazed me.

    Another month of Boris and it might even happen here.

  81. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    EU Statement by CMD
    Inviting all and sundry to get involved in the EU discussions. Been on the phone to Sturgeon.

    Not pressing the Article 50 button until new PM in place and the EU can wait. (2 yrs minimum looks like) Then Blah Blah!
    ———————————————————-

    Rightly condemning the recent racist attacks going on throughout the UK.

    Ever witty though 🙁 suggesting the newly elected member keeps her mobile phone on as she might be in the labour shadow cabinet by the end of the day.

    🙂

    Jeremy: Replies…Duty calls so he must.

    Weak attack on the Tories. No Brexit plan.
    Tells CMD to press the Article 50 button ASAP and get on with it and no waiting..

    Condemns the racist attacks.

    “Our ‘country’ is divided” he says (which one)

    Did he wish CMD well … he did!

  82. cearc
    Ignored
    says:

    Ah, well Boris will be a trusty hand and calm the markets!

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-06-27/boris-johnson-future-pm-and-currency-analyst

    johnson, ‘”The pound remains higher than it was in 2013 and 2014,”

    Bloomberg, ‘Johnson did not clarify against which currency he was measuring,… The pound is much stronger, since 2013, against the Ukranian hryvnia, Kazahkstan’s tenge, and Mozambique’s metical—yet that may owe more to localized problems … Johnson’s assertion is also true against the dollar—but the dollars of Namibia, Jamaica, and Suriname …’

    Uhhm, well maybe he won’t but still the BBC will repeat his mantra that everything’s fine and the little islanders will hopefully not notice.

  83. ephemeraldeception
    Ignored
    says:

    @Tinto Chiel “figure of 99% has always amazed me”.

    With 3 or more languages in Norway, some may have marked the wrong box by accident — so may have been near 100% 😉

    It is also ironic that Vidkin Q. was very obviously an exception, whereas in Scotland its pretty rife in the establishment.

  84. Alan Mackintosh
    Ignored
    says:

    Major Bloodnok, from previous thread, you were looking for an article. I pulled this one out from my notes, which might be the one you were looking for by Peter Arnott

    http://nationalcollective.com/2014/09/22/peter-arnott-this-is-going-to-be-good/

    “The Scots were never big enough to break the Union. That’s always been a job for the English.”

  85. Ananurhing
    Ignored
    says:

    Tinto Chiel.

    Thanks. I’m not so sure. It’s not unthinkable we end up with someone else as PM, and an Euref2.

    We need to move quick. I’m tired of Scotland being buffeted around in the slipstream of Tory vanity trips and follies.

    Every time a WM Bullingdon Boy farts, Scotland gets shit in her face.

    Nicola needs to cover a lot of ground fast, before there’s even a mention of EUref2.

  86. Dr Jim
    Ignored
    says:

    Cameron has just threatened Scotland again

    He told Angus Robertson we should remember Scotland benefits from the UK market

    I know what “I” heard

  87. Edward
    Ignored
    says:

    On the various comments regarding those that voted for ‘leave’
    not just in Scotland, but across the UK as a whole.

    Here is a point to ponder

    One of the regular responses by the media as to why people were going to and did vote leave was that they didn’t know who their MEP was and thought that the EU was un-elected and didn’t do anything for them.

    This was something played out by the spiv Farage, in making out that the EU was an ‘un-elected Elite’

    But the facts are more stark and are damning of our media, both print and broadcast as well as the Westminster politicians.
    The media never at any stage openly questioned Farage on the ‘un-elected Elite’ garbage, considering that Farage was an elected MEP!

    The reason why many people don’t know who they elected as an MEP or knew what goes on in the EU parliament is that both Westminster and the media don’t provide adequate coverage. Its all low key.

    The only time the media covered something it would be Farage throwing a tantrum, so giving him free publicity!
    When it came to the EU elections (every 5 years) just how much coverage was given? How much encouragement was given to people to get involved and vote? Not much, council elections get more coverage.
    Then you look at who of the 73 MEP’s were elected, with some exceptions, notably those form the SNP, it would be Labour or Tory time servers, who were seen as being mostly harmless and would not be expected to do much.

    The contempt that Westminster showed for the EU parliament is almost parallel to that of the devolved parliaments. Consider a moment, from 1999, the level of Labour, Libdem and Tory MSP’s, who only saw Holyrood as a stepping stone between being a councillor and an MP at Westminster.

    Because of this attitude we end up having UKIP MEP’s elected, whose sole raison d’etre is for the UK not to be in the EU. So every UKIP MEP elected would turn up and do absolutely nothing, other than claim expenses and get paid a high salary. It wasnt just the UKIP MEP’s that did this , but the Tory Daniel Hanan, who we have seen a lot of lately, also admitted that he was always against the EU and never made any effort to represent the
    constituents that voted for him!

    As for the media, they are happy and have been happy for the last 300 years to scratch the backs of the Westminster politicians of the three unionist parties, in order to have something to report back. The politicians likewise are happy to have their favourite journalist help publicise what they have been doing (or cover up when they haven’t being doing anything).

    So where we are at now is squarely the fault of an ineffectual media that in the main ignores what happens on a day to day basis in the EU parliament and Westminster unionist politicians that are happy for to be as little coverage as possible.

  88. Cactus
    Ignored
    says:

    Nicola’s playing this game of chess excellently. When the timing’s right, I think we’re about to witness the ‘en passant’ move being played.

    Checkmate approaching.. independence nearing for Scotland, we’ll take it in the passing.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/En_passant

  89. ronnie anderson
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Dr Jim { Scotland benefits from 2 single markets & I would like to see them in both) . I hope that clarifies what he said.

  90. Stephen
    Ignored
    says:

    Why don’t they just void the last General election after all, isn’t there 27 Toty MPs under investigation for over spending.

  91. cearc
    Ignored
    says:

    PM (in parliament) says it is important to start off with goodwill in exit negotiations…

    Meanwhile some tosser from Leave says, on US tele, ‘“I think quite rightly the PM has paused on that which allows the dust to settle, allows people to go away on holiday, have some informal discussions about it, and then think about it come September/October time.”

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-negotiations-eu-referendum-live-delay-holiday-matthew-elliott-vote-leave-a7105661.html

    That should show lots goodwill. ‘Sorry about the mess we’ll come and have a chat after the hols.’

  92. Dr Jim
    Ignored
    says:

    @ronnie anderson

    Oh I know what he said Ronnie and I watched his face when he said it, and it was a clear threat, I don’t mistake stuff like that
    Still, he’ll find out he’s about to get threatened back by about Thursday, The Fm already has had expressions of support from France Germany and Poland and offers to help ease the path towards a Scottish solution

  93. AlbertaScot
    Ignored
    says:

    Ian Tyson doing that old cowboy ballad “Goodbye Old Paint – I’m a-Leavin’ Cheyenne” also hits the spot.

    I see BoJo has been at in the TeleTory today. The usual once-in-a-generation crap warmed up in the microwave.

    We’ll see about that.

  94. paulTgeist
    Ignored
    says:

    cearc says = “Meanwhile some tosser from Leave says,”

    As some tosser helps them sell their message AGAIN. Pot/kettle!

  95. Dr Jim
    Ignored
    says:

    That petition on the FM:

    I just signed up as Teddy Bear Noomero oono ranger street
    glasgow, and commented a load of tosh and it just accepted it even with a made up stupid non existant email address

  96. ronnie anderson
    Ignored
    says:

    @ cearc {some Tosser } Paula Rose will be mortificated with your exposure to that kind of language xx.

  97. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    I just remembered why I knew the name Oliver Letwin

    I watched one of these New Treaty of the Union meetings:

    http://www.parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/e63e7bc2-d1f7-4047-a788-e808442490dc

    I didn’t watch the whole thing because his slow speech and um ehs did my head in.

  98. Fred
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Petra, spot-on about Sillars, the man’s a disgrace. Pity about Margo’s Bill.

  99. Tinto Chiel
    Ignored
    says:

    “It is also ironic that Vidkin Q. was very obviously an exception, whereas in Scotland its pretty rife in the establishment.”

    Ephemeraldeception: I have the same sad thoughts every time I have the misfortune to overhear Radio Shortbread. I have this mental picture of Kaye Adams wearing a pith helmet and ridiculous oversize khaki shorts sitting in front of a giant Union Jack while “There’ll always be an England” plays gently in the background.

    Dearie, dearie me…

  100. Vambomarbeleye
    Ignored
    says:

    The French are quite rightly saying that their is no reason for English to be the official language of the EU.

  101. Robert J. Sutherland
    Ignored
    says:

    My vote for tune of the day is “Big Mess” by Lucinda Williams:

    “You left a big mess behind
    That I’m gonna have to clean up
    You think that you can change my mind
    But you’re clean outta luck”

  102. Dorothy Devine
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruby , he canny be as bad with his ums and aahs as ken Clark or Nigel Lawson and I’m sure he’s nearly the same vintage.

  103. cearc
    Ignored
    says:

    Ronnie,

    Och, it must be the bad company I invite to visit!

    Actually, I am finding it pretty hard to think of anything polite to say about this schoolboy spat that has caused so much mess.

    What an embarrassment, Bloomberg’s reports reading like comedy sketches.

    Obviously good for us, hopefully we will finally be shot of the lot of them.

  104. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    Sturgeon invited to talks with Gibraltar over the EU fiasco.

    Maybe Boris feeling the pressure between a Jock and hard place soon. It won’t do any harm. 🙂

  105. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    I added some stars to my high res Yes sticker but I don’t think they work. I did the stars in yellow and in white but it just seems too busy. Maybe I should make the stars switch on and off like Christmas tree lights. 🙂

    https://db.tt/GZUL3ysK

    https://db.tt/AF7SceyS

    Or perhaps I should just give up and not spoil a good design.

    https://db.tt/HZEu2NM8

    This graphic design stuff might be trickier than I thought!

    No No No I wont give up I am determined to make a good EU/IndyRef Yes sticker.

  106. Les Wilson
    Ignored
    says:

    I was watching the debate re the referendum in Westminster, as the PM was speaking Fluffy sitting next to him was in clear view.
    He was picking bits out of his beard and eating them!

    Ugh, our Secretary of State!! a creepy wee man more like!
    Turned my stomach.

  107. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    call me dave says:
    27 June, 2016 at 5:05 pm

    Sturgeon invited to talks with Gibraltar over the EU fiasco.

    Maybe Boris feeling the pressure between a Jock and hard place soon. It won’t do any harm. 🙂

    Ruby replies

    That’s interesting where do I find out more?

    Jock rhymes with rock! Can you think of anything witty about A Jock on the Rock? A Jock saves the Rock from being cut off from the mainland and prevents the apes from running off to live in a zoo in Torremolinos.

  108. Vestas
    Ignored
    says:

    Its all very amusing guys but there’s a limit to the chaos.

    Sooner or later one of “Call me Dave”‘s relatives in the monarchy is going to tell him to get a grip as he is damaging their country (England). Boris will get the same call & they will both do as they are told. Do remember that these guys have been brought up to recognise the crown in parliament is sovereign so what the plebs want is secondary.

    Being optimistic I’d hope there’s still another 5-10 days before that happens.

    I really hope the SG has got something fairly concrete out of the “EU” regarding Scotland’s membership before then.

    We can’t keep going through England’s dramas.

  109. Bill McDermott
    Ignored
    says:

    Just watching the House of Commons debate on the EU Referendum and reflecting on the fact that the Speaker dismisses the requests of SNP members to speak early in the debate. Instead they are left to a sort of catch all event towards the end of the debate when no speeches are allowed, they are confined to single sentence questions and most of the MPs have left the chamber.

    As usual the HoC showing its usual ‘respect’ for Scotland.

  110. Edward
    Ignored
    says:

    Cameron has just equated Scotland has having the same status as the County of Oxford during an answer to SNP MP Steven Paterson
    (at 1723)
    Clearly Cameron just ignoring the peoples will of Scotland

    In all responses about Scotland , it was clear that the UK Government have no intention what so ever of enabling Scotland to remain in the EU. All they are happy to include Northern Ireland and Scotland, during the ‘negotiations’ with the EU is to sit quietly and be there just to accept that they will be outside the EU

  111. Valerie
    Ignored
    says:

    Great analysis from a seasoned commentator.

    http://johnpilger.com/articles/why-the-british-said-no-to-europe

    Still watching HoC, only SNP left now, giving the pig fiddler a hard time. Bercow acting like a crabby old git with haemmoroids.

  112. Almannysbunnet
    Ignored
    says:

    Angus Robertson made the point that Scotland was a European nation and said oudly and very forcefully that Scotland would not be taken out of Europe against its will. He pointedly said that there was cross party support at Hollyrood for that stance.

    The standard reply from the government, usually, is that it is a UK wide decision. Not this time. I don’t know if it was the steel in his voice but there was no breying and farting from the Tories. When Cameron said Scotland derived benefits from the UK market it was met with derision from the SNP benches. They will make noises about not believing that Scotland wants a referendum. They will fight a forlorn battle but the games up and they know it.

  113. Tony Little
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruby

    Yes3 has my vote so far 😉

  114. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    @Ruby replies

    That’s interesting where do I find out more.

    Radio shortbread ‘Newsdrive’ on in the background had it with the presenter Mhairi Stuart cutting across Tasmina Ahmed-Sheikh OBE SNP MP discussing the news at every opportunity to declare basically .. (my words)

    It’s a waste of time , a stunt and it’s all about Indy2 init.

    Big Brian humphht … all avenues to be explored to no avail but Indy2 is on.

    Apologies for calling our revered FM a ‘Jock’ but it chimed in with hard place. 🙂

    Ach! Italy score…. 🙁

  115. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Les Wilson says:
    27 June, 2016 at 5:09 pm

    I was watching the debate re the referendum in Westminster, as the PM was speaking Fluffy sitting next to him was in clear view.
    He was picking bits out of his beard and eating them!

    Ugh, our Secretary of State!! a creepy wee man more like!
    Turned my stomach.

    Ruby replies
    Someone very witty on here I think it was ‘Almannysbunnet’ said he looked like an Ewok and that is all can think about now when I see him.

    This is him out for a walk with his son who also likes the Ewok look.

    http://tinyurl.com/zxvqw7j

  116. Epiphyta
    Ignored
    says:

    I thought this comment from Light Blue Touchpaper, on a discussion about the ramifications of Brexit on the University of Cambridge, might be cheering to some here:

    The key point though is not economic. It’s that the exit camp has pulled ahead only after a couple of weeks of viciously xenophobic campaigning about immigrants. If the UK leaves under such circumstances it will open up deep social divisions and many people will simply be ashamed to be British.

    I myself married a women of African-Asian origin, and have many in-laws who are Hindu or Muslim. The one member of our family who proposed to vote leave, citing economic arguments, has now decided for remain, like Saeeda [sic] Warsi and many others.

    Overseas it will be a catastrophe, as it will tell the world that Britain put xenophobia before rational economic self-interest. It will put us in the same boat as Hungary and Turkey; Hungarian and Turkish friends are ashamed of their passports. No tech firm would dream of setting up a new research lab there. It will also be a signal to other populists like le Pen and their supporters.

    There is no telling where it will end. And many Scots will no longer see independence as merely an economic calculation, or a conflict between the heart and the wallet. They will see it as a moral necessity.(emphasis mine)

  117. Thepnr
    Ignored
    says:

    Unfortunately I can’t see the EU confirming anything regarding Scotland’s status before they begin discussions with Westminster.

    Scotland’s status will be seen as a bargaining chip for the EU that they will use as a club to beat the UK negotiating team with as and when they see fit.

    I guess if Nicola is to make much progress with the EU then she too will have to play hardball with all of them.

  118. rongorongo
    Ignored
    says:

    @call me dave says:Sturgeon invited to talks with Gibraltar over the EU fiasco

    In the wee hours of Friday morning I joked, in a BTL thread about us teaming up with Gibraltar to improve Scotland’s average temperature. A mark of our bizarre times that this is actually happening.

  119. Edward
    Ignored
    says:

    That Gibraltar story concerning discussions with Scotland
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36639770

    There is also a report on Newsnight tonight from Gibraltar

    Basically looking at staying in the EU, while still part of the UK

    If the EU insist that cant happen, then perhaps an independent Scotland take on Gibraltar ?

  120. Cag-does-thinking
    Ignored
    says:

    It’s going to be fun to watch now. I find it hilarious that the Labour party should try to blame Corbyn for something entirely constructed by the Tories. I mean you’d blame the Liberals if we knew who was still in charge. The cool careerists who really ought to have become Tories are clutching defeat from the jaws of victory. They should be scoring at that open goal all day.

    I think though that the problem for the Tories is that the economics are gainst them. Markets hate uncertainty blah blah blah will mean only words will be not enough to stop the currency and shares falling calamitously and whatever happens I don’t think they have four months or so to think of their next move.

  121. Balaaargh
    Ignored
    says:

    I’ve been saving for the last three years with a share scheme at work. Two weeks ago, I was planning a new bathroom to replace the badly-installed one from the previous house owners which leaks into the kitchen.

    Now it’s a water butt on the roof with a hose for the shower.

    Thanks Bojo.

  122. Les Wilson
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruby says:
    Ha Ha Ha!

  123. bugsbunny
    Ignored
    says:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36643786

    I know it’s the BBC, but this is disgraceful.

  124. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    Former Yes chairman says of second independence referendum:
    Bring it on!

    https://archive.is/otgHa

  125. Tinto Chiel
    Ignored
    says:

    Thanks for that great link to Pilger, Valerie.

    “The most effective propagandists of the “European ideal” have not been the far right, but an insufferably patrician class for whom metropolitan London is the United Kingdom. Its leading members see themselves as liberal, enlightened, cultivated tribunes of the 21st century zeitgeist, even “cool”. What they really are is a bourgeoisie with insatiable consumerist tastes and ancient instincts of their own superiority. In their house paper, the Guardian, they have gloated, day after day, at those who would even consider the EU profoundly undemocratic, a source of social injustice and a virulent extremism known as “neoliberalism”.

    The aim of this extremism is to install a permanent, capitalist theocracy that ensures a two-thirds society, with the majority divided and indebted, managed by a corporate class, and a permanent working poor. In Britain today, 63 per cent of poor children grow up in families where one member is working. For them, the trap has closed. More than 600,000 residents of Britain’s second city, Greater Manchester, are, reports a study, “experiencing the effects of extreme poverty” and 1.6 million are slipping into penury.”

    Yup, can’t disagree with that. We need out, and quickly.

    Just a thought, Is the FM going to Gibraltar to offer them the Trident submarines?

    😀

  126. Tam Jardine
    Ignored
    says:

    Some great comments after another bizarre day. One voice I have yet to hear from is Gordon Brown. Now, if my memory serves me well his vision for a post Indyref no vote was Scotland leading the UK, not leaving it.

    I am curious to hear what Gordon thinks of this current predicament where rather than leading the UK we are being dragged, kicking and screaming into a kind of economic nuclear winter.

    Nice one Gordon. You are worse than Cameron.

    He is a stupid tory arsehole who has crashed the world economy, given xenophobia the strongest platform imaginable, destroyed diplomatic relations with our allies and has thrown the UK into a destructive tailspin of constitutional upheaval we can only pray we escape from.

    You on the other hand helped hand us over giftwrapped to the far right on a bullshit prospectus of part lies, part bombastic drivel aided and abetted by the BBC. YOU prevented us getting independence at a time of our choosing when we could have been insulated from Farage and Johnston. We could have been at a safer distance before the shit hit the fan.

  127. Robert J. Sutherland
    Ignored
    says:

    Don’t blame the messenger, bugsbunny, blame the racist low-lifes who are doing these vile things and above all the xenophobic Leave campaign that validated them.

    In fact, the more that ordinary decent people here in Scotland are aware of what is going on in LaLaLeaveLand, the more they will surely be inclined to support independence.

  128. Kevin Evans
    Ignored
    says:

    Just seen someone suggest if EU refurendum is run again it should not be called britexit this but bRegret.

  129. Richard Ian
    Ignored
    says:

    As a nation , this is too much, we have to break free

  130. Undeadshaun
    Ignored
    says:

    Scotlabs new wheeze, have a federal uk for Scotland to stay in eu.

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jun/27/scottish-labour-seeks-possibility-federal-uk-brexit-aftermath

    Naw, think I would rather the full monty with independence.

  131. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    No deal for Clyde warships ‘until value for money ensured’

    https://archive.is/yqe68

  132. jcd
    Ignored
    says:

    Call me dave 5.05pm

    “Between a Jock and a hard place” ha ha brill

  133. manandboy
    Ignored
    says:

    The big three in the EU decide to wait for a formal request from Westminster before initiating talks on article 50. And suddenly I feel a little queasy.

  134. Alan Mackintosh
    Ignored
    says:

    Anyway, we need to give our Northern neighbours a helping hand tonight. After all the are asking nicely…

    https://twitter.com/WingsScotland?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

    Allan Jarlsson

  135. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    I can see Scotland being treated very favourably in negotiations with the EU.
    What better revenge than admitting the next door neighbour of a country who has caused chaos in everybody else’s economy.

    Revenge is a powerful motive and not to be underestimated. Reports say the EU is not at all happy at Westminster and intend to be uncompromising.

  136. Proud Cybernat
    Ignored
    says:

    How exactly does an aeroplane from a Scottish airport get across a “hard border” between Scotland and England? Does it stop in mid-air like a Harrier jump-jet at Hadrian’s Wall to have our passports checked?

    Just askin’like.

  137. sensibledave
    Ignored
    says:

    Robert J. Sutherland 6:14 pm

    You wrote: “blame the racist low-lifes who are doing these vile things and above all the xenophobic Leave campaign that validated them.”

    Oh the irony! How can Mr Sutherland be so lacking in self awareness???

    He appears to accuse anyone that voted differently to him – of being a xenophobe – or a racist!!

    … you couldn’t make it up!

  138. Thepnr
    Ignored
    says:

    As I thought, the EU won’t offer Scotland anything anytime soon.

    “The first minister is pressing for a meeting with Jean-Claude Juncker, the president of the European commission, but sources in Brussels say that is only likely to happen “when the first wave of diplomacy [on Brexit] is over”. An EU diplomat said the EU is “far away from talking to Scotland about membership.”

  139. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Beast of Bolsover shakes JC by the hand in the House and gives red tory rebel the V’s. Cant beat old school politics.

    Come on Iceland!!!

    Heedtrackerson, the Viking.

  140. Proud Cybernat
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Sado Dave

    “He appears to accuse anyone that voted differently to him – of being a xenophobe – or a racist!!

    … you couldn’t make it up!”

    You just did.

  141. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    sensibledave says:
    27 June, 2016 at 6:48 pm
    Robert J. Sutherland 6:14 pm

    He appears to accuse anyone that voted differently to him – of being a xenophobe – or a racist!!

    … you couldn’t make it up!

    There is no such thing as the English race sensible, so grow up you big dope.

    Also

    COME ON ICELAND!!!

    Heedtracker, the Viking.

  142. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    Standard & Poor downgrading the UKs rating from triple A to double A.

    Ooft!

  143. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    Imagine a political campaign whose prime dual focuses were immigration and finance. ( both were lies of course), in every paper,on every tv programme and on radio. You have to ask yourself on which focus people chose to leave the EU.? Unless we have millions of accountants out there I would suggest immigration was the prime motivator in people’s choices

    To try and claim otherwise would be disingenuous I would suggest. Amazing how people use Transference to cover their own darker prejudices is it not sensible dave?

  144. sensibledave
    Ignored
    says:

    … more important issues at hand now!

    Come on England!

  145. sinky
    Ignored
    says:

    English football abusing Muslims on Channel 4 shortly

  146. Edward
    Ignored
    says:

    Proud Cybernat @ 6.44pm

    Re ‘Hard Border’ which the unionists keep harping on about
    It is of course meaning a garden shed with a candy striped pole across the road, complete with border guards, barbed wire fence etc
    If your flying its just passport control as you do when flying anywhere (no plane doesnt stop mid air 😉 )
    If were out the EU, then when arriving at an airport into an EU country, you go to the long line of others and not the EU citizens passport check.

    In reality any border set up between Scotland and England would be a soft border control, such as they have between Norway and Sweden, with only the trucks having to stop to clear customs. Cars just drive through

  147. K1
    Ignored
    says:

    ‘He appears to accuse anyone that voted differently to him – of being a xenophobe – or a racist!!

    … you couldn’t make it up!’

    You are quite literally an arsehole SD, Robert was replying to a comment that bugsbunny made regarding a Polish child who had received a hate poster through his door…

    Nothing like attacking out of context is there SD? You are so transparently a dicksocket of the first order. Now fuck off.

  148. otherdemons
    Ignored
    says:

    Leading article on BBC News’ Scotland page:
    Ewing: EU ‘sympathetic’ over Scotland:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-36643387

    I’m re-reading and trying to find the ‘SNP bad’ angle and I can’t?!

  149. Effigy
    Ignored
    says:

    Why would Scotland parting company with England be a problem for them?
    The Westminster politicians, and the UK Media are all in tune falsely claiming that they have to subsidise Scotland.

    There you go Westminster, think of all that you have saved when we go off back into a fair and just Europe. Quids in.

    Does the UK economy plummeting like a lead balloon mean that the rest of the world can see that Scotland is funding England by their back door?

    Uncharted waters for me:
    I must congratulate the Tory Party for the frequency and severity to which they pull the wool over Labour’s eyes!

    They got the Red Clowns to do all their Dirty Work in the Scottish Referendum.
    They stood shoulder to shoulder with Slab throughout, knowing that it will kill them up here, and it did.

    Cameron can’t even walk on a Scottish Street, but Big Clunker Broon dived in to get his minions yelling and shouting in another locked room just to help the boy David.

    Now with the Brexit Team seemingly done an Exit of their
    own, not having any policies in place, promises proved to be a pack of lies, and having forced the Tory Party leader to resign, Labour in their infinite “wisdom” have deflected the attention away from this Tory made disaster,
    by claiming that they lost the referendum due to “their” leader not doing enough to support Cameron, and for not standing on a platform shoulder to shoulder with him.

    The Red Clowns now go on to keep any negative attention away from the Tories, by resigning one by one from Corbyn’s Shadow Cabinet.
    A constant drip keeping the headlines on Labour don’t have a clue about what they are doing, even more than the Tories

    As Maggie Thatcher said ” New Labour is her greatest ever achievement”. She has turned the Labour Party into the Toryish Party who look for ideas from their right wing masters.

    Corbyn is a real socialist, and I believe he genuinely cares about the ordinary working classes, but he does lack charisma. This said, 60% of Labour Party members voted him in just 9 months ago. His closest rival only got 19%, and yet these self serving right wing members of the Shadow Cabinet have over ruled the members right of selection.

    How do you run a Democratic Socialist Party, with leaders who believe in neither democracy nor socialism?

    The Shadow Cabinet members are in the wrong party!
    They have taken a ridiculous gamble on their membership being willing to turn into right of centre neo liberals.

    Have they considered that if Corbyn is forced to stand again, in another Labour leadership battle, and the same members select him yet again.
    They surely must resign or be ejected from the party!

    For my own self interest, and that of my country, Scotland.
    I am content that Slab MUST now break away from the disaster that is Westminster Toryish Labour’s North Accounting Unit.

  150. Orri
    Ignored
    says:

    Fuck it. Time for the SNP to put down a vote of no confidence. Rattle the unionists around the skull and get them to wake the fuck up.

  151. Tam Jardine
    Ignored
    says:

    sensibledave

    England just perpetrated the worst piece of economic self harm the world has ever seen. England just jeopardised my children’s ability to work and live abroad in the future. They just put a big dent in my pension. They have made immigrants in my community, (or people as I call them) afraid and unwelcome. And they have threatened my citizenship of the EU which I value infinitely more than my UK ‘subject’ status.

    SO yes SD, come on Merrie England! The sound of leather on willow, warm beer, sunday roasts with bread sauce and all that.

  152. DerekM
    Ignored
    says:

    lmfao our sensible swings more than Max Mosely.

  153. Effigy
    Ignored
    says:

    On the matter of England’s Brexit:

    If there were to be a Border Check Point between them and Scotland, it would be one that they put up, and one they can foot the bill for.

    It is they who threatened to do it and it is their referendum result that looks likely to separate us.

    I can envision the English Digging Tunnels under the border, sailing around it, smuggling through it. all to buy their goods at a lower rate from an EU Country.

    Sales in Scotland will go through the roof!

    Just how do these fools think their new trading negotiations will go? Do they really think they will be allowed to the same terms with Europe when they refuse to pay the membership fee. That is just Dumb!

    Do they think former colonies like Jamaica, who where enslaved and abused by Westminster for centuries, before being cast off in favour of the EU,are going to give them bananas at a rate lower than they sell to the EU.

    Absolutely Bananas Britain!

  154. Vambomarbeleye
    Ignored
    says:

    I hope that Boris gets PM and Corbyn stays. It’s what they deserve.

  155. Scot Finlayson
    Ignored
    says:

    Thousands of Corbyn supporters in England`s parliament square, they are incensed with the Blairites trying to mount an undemocratic coup of the Labour party.

    the English Labour people/citizens want Corbyn to lead them,

    but the corrupt Blairites want power to milk the system for their own benefit.

  156. Robert Graham
    Ignored
    says:

    Watching the build up to the Iceland match on laptop with sound on mute gee wiz I am sure I can still hear whining when Ian Wright and co heads start bobbin up and down , I would prefer to have the commentary in Swahili also known as Kiswahili it would be more bearable oh well you really don’t need sound when watching the footie especially watching them .

  157. Tam Jardine
    Ignored
    says:

    I am not a twitter user so I don’t have a channel to ask journalists if they think their approach to the EU referendum coverage was a success or failure?

    They seem to have excused themselves of any responsibility for this clusterfuck. Watching C4 news and Chris Grayling being interrogated by John Snow. I can’t remember anyone from leave or remain getting the kind of grilling on detail that was the hallmark of the indyref.

    The coverage was paper thin and based around simple soundbites and personalities.

    There was no post brexit plan by leave according to Faisal Islam (who i consider one of the best journos out there). Talk about closing the stable door after the horse has bolted.

  158. Lollysmum
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruby at 5.06pm

    2nd one looks better (yellow stars)but one star runs into the Y of yes-spoils it-needs a gap between star & Y

  159. Orri
    Ignored
    says:

    We got it thoroughly drilled into us how vital the membership of the EU was during our independence referendum. Either that was pointless or a vital decider in some people’s choice. Regardless of what Davidson is peddling at least some of those who voted No did so with the idea that a future in the EU was guaranteed if they did so.

  160. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Rancid The Graun, ouch. But ITV is even more tory biased than the BBC, so it serves them right really. They certainly did their bit to destroy Scottish ref 1. Karma.

    “ITV sees almost £2.5bn wiped from stock market value after Brexit
    Broadcaster saw share price fall by more than 20% on Friday, raising speculation it will become target for takeover bid”

  161. cearc
    Ignored
    says:

    For anyone who hasn’t seen this on WOS twitterfeed.

    Binyamin Appelbaum ?@BCAppelbaum 17m17 minutes ago

    Starting shortly: A soccer game between an isolated island nation whose banking industry is in big trouble, and Iceland.

    The guy is Washington correspondent for the New York Times.

  162. People Carrier
    Ignored
    says:

    Let’s buy ITV!!!!!!

  163. K1
    Ignored
    says:

    From the New York Times:

    ‘Who Is to Blame for Brexit’s Appeal? British Newspapers’

    Fella called Martin Fletcher, who was appointed by the Times as Brussels correspondent in 1999, a few years after Boris Johnson was the correspondent for the Telegraph. He wrote this article on the 21st June before the EURef.

    Snippet:

    ‘Mr. Johnson, fired from The Times in 1988 for fabricating a quotation, made his name in Brussels not with honest reporting but with extreme euroskepticism, tirelessly attacking, mocking and denigrating the European Union.

    He wrote about European Union plans to take over Europe, ban Britain’s favorite potato chips, standardize condom sizes and blow up its own asbestos-filled headquarters. These articles were undoubtedly colorful but they bore scant relation to the truth.

    Mr. Johnson’s dispatches galvanized the rest of Britain’s highly competitive and partisan newspaper industry. They were far more fun than the usual dry, policy-driven Brussels fare. Editors at other newspapers, particularly but not exclusively the tabloids, started pressing their own correspondents to match Mr. Johnson’s imaginative reports.

    By the time I arrived in Brussels, editors wanted only reports about faceless Eurocrats dictating the shape of the cucumbers that could be sold in Britain, or plots to impose a European superstate, or British prime ministers fighting plucky rear-guard actions against a hostile Continent. Much of the British press seemed unable to view the European Union through any other prism. These narratives reflected and exploited the innate nationalism, historical sense of superiority and disdain for Johnny Foreigner of many readers.’

    Last paragraph:

    ‘The upshot is that Mr. Johnson and his fellow Brexit proponents are now campaigning against the caricature of the European Union that he himself helped create. They are asking the British people to part with a monster about as real as the one in Loch Ness. Mr. Johnson may be witty and amusing, but he is extremely dangerous. What began as a bit of a joke could inflict terrible damage on his country.’

    My bold. He just did ‘inflict’ terrible damage on his England.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/22/opinion/who-is-to-blame-for-brexits-appeal-british-newspapers.html?WT.mc_id=D-NYT-MKTG-MOD-52814-0625-HD&WT.mc_ev=click&WT.mc_c=

  164. North chiel
    Ignored
    says:

    Jackie Bird had a ” face like fizz” on ” reporting shortbread ” tonight . Perhaps
    she has finally ” got the message” as regards who exactly has ” Scottish interests at heart” .Certainly not ” specific pee”

  165. cearc
    Ignored
    says:

    R4 news reporting Labour meeting at Westminster (Corbyn bad) with no mention of the 4,000 Corbyn supporters demonstrating outside.

  166. Robert J. Sutherland
    Ignored
    says:

    Thepnr @ 14:21,

    I do accept your gentle correction re the Labour Party faithful. I wasn’t aiming my remarks at them at all, but rather at their inadequate leadership. I just don’t see the point of discussing at length in this forum the justification or otherwise of Corbyn’s leadership qualities and socialist credentials and Blairite opposition and so on blah de blah. It has virtually zero to do with indy.

    But of course you are right to remind me that we can’t dismiss ordinary SLab members and voters. On the contrary, we need their engagement and support too. We can only hope that the current situation will finally open many more of their eyes to the plain fact that their own admirable values are better served and sustained in an independent Scotland than in the corrupt moth-eaten Brittania to which they have been chained by their incompetent leadership.

    They don’t even have to abandon their party, though they might well do so given the manifest inadequacies of their leadership. They just have to lend their belief and support to the independence movement until they gain the opportunity to start afresh in a polity that gives them a fair democratic chance along with everyone else.

    Like you, I hope they have the foresight to seize this precious opportunity with both hands. We will all be the stronger for it.

  167. Robert Graham
    Ignored
    says:

    aw naw the feckers have scored boo boo boo

  168. One_scot
    Ignored
    says:

    The channel 4 undercover report on the English fans in Europe was absolutely shocking. Europe will be glad to see the back of them.

  169. Jimbo
    Ignored
    says:

    EU shoots down Boris Johnson’s claims that Britain would be able to access the single market without sending “a substantial sum of money” to Brussels. While British people “would still be able to go and work in the EU; to live; to travel; to study; to buy homes and to settle down”, he said, the UK would introduce a points-based immigration system that would restrict the number of EU citizens entering the country.

    https://www.buzzfeed.com/albertonardelli/european-officials-say-boris-johnsons-post-brexit-wishlist-i?utm_term=.erzg2Ep3R9#.kdgxG49EjX

  170. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    How are the queen’s eleven getting on?

  171. hopper69
    Ignored
    says:

    O/T 2-1 ICELAND.

  172. K1
    Ignored
    says:

    Another snippet from same article I posted further up, very salient regarding newspapers and their effects but also highlight just how easy it is to brainwash a population:

    ‘Loughborough University’s Center for Research in Communication and Culture has calculated that 82 percent of newspaper articles about the referendum favor Brexit when circulation and “strength of papers’ endorsements” are taken into account. InFacts, a pro-Remain group that campaigns for accurate journalism, has filed 19 complaints with the Independent Press Standards Organization, Britain’s print media watchdog, leading to five corrections, including one against a headline in The Sun that proclaimed, “Queen Backs Brexit.” The watchdog has yet to rule on the rest.

    It is often said that newspapers no longer matter. But they do matter when the contest is so close and shoppers see headlines like “BeLeave in Britain” emblazoned across the front pages of tabloids whenever they visit their supermarket. They matter if they have collectively and individually misled their readers for decades.’

    Yes people made such an ‘informed decision’ in the EU Ref. Not.

  173. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    2-1?

    I think I’ve just peed a little.

  174. Socrates MacSporran
    Ignored
    says:

    This is about fitba

    They get handed an absurdly soft penalty, then they go 2-1 down, and the ITV commentary team are almost in tears.

    This is great. England may be out of Europe faster than they want to be. But, a one-goal lead is never enough.

    What a joy the BBC studio coverage of the Spain v Italy game was. Three erudite continental “talking heads” – Vialli, Henry and Kompany – for once it wasn’t all about England – great. Lineker was still a twat mind you.

  175. Titler
    Ignored
    says:

    Robert Louis says:
    27 June, 2016 at 1:05 pm

    Am I alone in getting angrier with each passing day?

    No, you are not. And the terrifying thing is, it’s justified anger, across all sections of the electorate, but our political classes can’t see it. Boris Johnson didn’t even bother turning up for the Brexit debate in the House Of Parliament. Meanwhile here’s the letter I just sent my Labour MP because it’s either doing something or just haul off and start punching the wall…

    “Dear Kerry McCarthy,

    I am writing to you in despair at what, in the face of the worst revelation of the disconnect between Labour’s former core vote and Westminster we have ever seen, that the Parliamentary Labour Party believes is the priority they should be focused upon now; namely unseating Jeremy Corbyn. I appeal to you as my MP to instead back him and re-focus upon the Tories and upon the issues that now face the people of this country; people who do not have the luxury of ignoring the consequences of accelerated austerity; people who voted in Corbyn with a huge, unexpected majority because they were sick of the kind of politics that had already beggared them to the point of disgust.

    Although I now live in Bristol, I was born and grew up in the former mining areas of Nottingham during the worst ravages of Thatcherism. I remember well the despair, and the resulting rage that was seeded by poverty then. And I remember the National Front graffiti that was scrawled on abandoned pit heads, the distrust of both the state and it’s organs such as the strike breaking police. I had hoped to never see the like of that again, but here we are once more. Only this time the Labour party, that once understood that power without principle was worthless, that the point of representation was not to win, but only representation itself for those who otherwise had no voice on the benches, seems now to be consumed with what from the outside looks like disgraceful careerism ahead of the very communities it pretends to champion. It is hard to under-estimate the revulsion I hear now from liberal, Labour voting friends and family at the behaviour of the PLP right when decades of progressive politics is under it’s greatest attack.

    I personally voted Remain in the Referendum, because I believed that Europe, although imperfect, offered us far more opportunities for progress than the alternatives. The current attempt to put Westminster politics before national mood threatens to allow those forces determined to under all the Labour Parties work. In 1948, Bevin famously stated;

    ‘His own experiences ensured that no amount of cajolery could eradicate from his heart a deep burning hatred of the Tory party. “So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin,” he went on. “They condemned millions of people to semi-starvation” ‘

    What then do you think the public mood will be to those who allow those lower than vermin to starve the country again, just because they didn’t like the leader elected to stop it?

    So again, I appeal to you to back Jeremy Corbyn in tomorrow’s Vote of No Confidence. If you do not have confidence in him, have confidence in the values he was elected for, and the values the Labour Party once stood for; have confidence in the voice of the public; or ignore the public’s mood yet again, and see what disaster greater than Brexit it may lead too next. Do not interrupt Boris Johnson writing his own political obituary just because the urge to write your own is so strong.”

    The only joy so far for me today is that immediately after hitting Send, Iceland scored against England. But even that is tempered by the fact that the lies of the Brexiteers, and every national humiliation we’re doomed too from here on is going to be heaped upon the shoulders of Foreigners… and Scots. But it’s not your fault. Every decent liberal I know actually rather envies you now; for rationally coming to your beliefs, for having the kind of politicians who decently and with dedication stand by those beliefs. But the tone of debate down south gets more and more poisoned every day.

    Who could blame you then for wanting to be independent of that?

  176. Valerie
    Ignored
    says:

    One Scot @8.09

    It was shameful. I was cringing, but it is really obvious the Leave vote won due to the huge superiority complex of ordinary working class boors, that haven’t a smidge of manners.

    We need to remind the English they didn’t win their country back with 52%, it’s 57%, when you remove Scotland numbers.

    I don’t think we need fear an immediate GE, right at this point, because the Tories are rallying.

    The danger for not reaching our goal is the agitation to block the decision to Brexit in the HoC. Running a second referendum is not an immediate threat either.

    The most direct route for Remain in the south is blocking implementation. However, that risks civil war too.

    I see Farage was visiting the war graves in the Somme. Aww.

    He said he didn’t care who became Tory leader, as long as they gave effect to the vote. His manner seemed lacking in conviction, that Brexit would happen.

  177. cearc
    Ignored
    says:

    I reckon the whole of europe and the entire global finance industry are cheering for Iceland!

    hænan.

  178. Thepnr
    Ignored
    says:

    @Titler

    I think you just summed up what the 4000 supporters of Corbyn at Westminster feel.

    Great post.

  179. ewen
    Ignored
    says:

    That Icelandic HOO sends shivers up your spine.

  180. Breeks
    Ignored
    says:

    I have a lot of sympathy for Juncker, and indeed the other Europeans who can’t believe their luck that they might finally be rid of the thorn in their side that has bedevilled their progress for decades, and even now at the close, creates utter chaos and instability both in the streets outside filled with CS gas,and indoors too and threatens the domino effect exits from Europe in its wake. Relax. Nobody will follow the UK.
    The neighbours from Hell are quitting their lease, and all you want is them to be gone. This is their revenge for that toe curling cringeathon, when Farage berated EU President Van Rompuy, and through him, all of you. Dear God, someone stop the fool. I sincerely cannot blame them. Out means out. You’re on your way, and you’re welcome to scream as you leave.

    Labour? What can you say? Or more to the point, why bother saying anything? How fucked up do your priorities have to be? At least when Nero fiddled while Rome burned, he played solo. Labour have themselves a choir and a marching band.

    The Tories cannot decide on leadership. “You be leader!” “No chance. You do it!” “Well somebody has got to do it!” If you bottled all the acid from Michael Heseltines comment’s on events, I’m pretty sure you’d have enough to fill a bath for both Boris Johnston and Farage.

    What must good queen Bess be thinking? How many for the gibet and how many for the axe? Look what they’ve done to my Empire.

    These are strange and dangerous times.

    I have confidence that Europe will hang together. Ironically, the UK’s exit might prompt reform, now there is blood on the wall from a Member state undone by its angry population, with all reason and argument turned on its head and counting for nothing. The EU might grow stronger from the lesson. For the UK? Who can forget this unprovoked insanity? We’ve all seen the poster; Keep calm. Carry on. Sorry Rule Britannia, but you’ve kinda bust that franchise.

    So here we are, on the brink of Scottish Independence, not just grasping at straws and building contraptions to get there, but spoiled for choice about how and when the deed will be done. What many percieved as our folly in 2014 is the “class act” and the model of professionalsm and integrity in a crisis.

    Aye. Come ahead Scotland. There’s a place for you at our table.

    “If you can keep your head when all about you,
    Are losing theirs and blaming it on you….
    ….. You will be a country my son”.

    … And there’s no “If” about it.

  181. Glamaig Glamaigsson
    Ignored
    says:

    I’m buying an Icelandic car sticker 🙂

  182. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    Auntie’s Radio 5 commentary team almost at blows in an ill tempered half time discussion.

    Disbelieve at the state of play and the score …shurley shome mistake it wasn’t supposed to be like this but… but..were playing France next ain’t we.. ain’t we? Maybe Aye maybe no!
    🙂

    Long 45 mins to go but more pop-corn please.

  183. Skip_NC
    Ignored
    says:

    Greetings from Raleigh, North Carolina. Completely O/T, but the only way I can follow the game at work is on the Rev’s Twitter feed and the BBC.

    I see Chris Waddle has just said that the second Iceland goal was a Sunday morning goal. I suppose that means that Iceland have just booted England into next week.

  184. ewen
    Ignored
    says:

    Afram Island!!!

  185. Valerie
    Ignored
    says:

    Oh good, that’s cheered me.

    BBC news interviewing Politico person in Brussels.

    EU having a meeting to propose a non binding resolution on UK to submit their A50 within a week.

    Fingers crossed, peeps for a GTF notice being served.

  186. Valerie
    Ignored
    says:

    @ewen

    I see what you mean!

  187. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    @Skip NC,

    Sunday morning,Monday morning, they all count. Iceland need to remember they are playing England and stop trying so hard,

  188. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    So who are the queens eleven playing in the next round?

  189. desimond
    Ignored
    says:

    Has Kezza gave her backing for Jezza or are she and best bud Muzza unavailable for comment

  190. Cactus
    Ignored
    says:

    Tick Tock, sson HOO!

  191. Brian McHugh
    Ignored
    says:

    We are only 20 minutes away from the most obvious joke of all time…

    “So England chose to exit Europe… Nah Iceland kicked them out.”

  192. Liz g
    Ignored
    says:

    Standard & Poor not giving a AAA rating!
    Am ah no supposed tae be feart?
    Am sure ah heard that somewhere age’s ago!

  193. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    No money for Clyde ships. They have run out of money. Despite Scotland putting in £4Billion a year on Defence spending. Scotland gets nothing. No jobs. Westminster has squandered it again on Trident and illegal bombing (causing migration).

    Scotland would be better Independent and build, frigates, ferries, supply boats or liners instead. Something worth selling.

    Boris Johnston the lying coward doesn’t turn up for the debate.

  194. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    EU sending the Balliffs in.

  195. Epiphyta
    Ignored
    says:

    Fitch has downgraded their rating as well.

  196. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    Pity it’s not rugny time the clock would be red.

  197. mr thms
    Ignored
    says:

    #Undeadshaun @ 6:28 pm
    Scotlabs new wheeze, have a federal uk for Scotland to stay in eu.

    http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jun/27/scottish-labour-seeks-possibility-federal-uk-brexit-aftermath

    Well.. well.. well

    Nail on head methinks..

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201516/ldselect/ldeucom/139/139.pdf

    “The UK, the EU and a British Bill of Rights”

  198. Bill Hume
    Ignored
    says:

    What’s the fucking score…re Iceland.

  199. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    Davy Cameroon yoooor boys toook a helluva beating! 🙂

  200. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    Mmmm, ths sons have it, the sons have it.

  201. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    @Bill

    2-1 Iceland

  202. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    No mugs in Iceland just these briliant viking horns!
    YAAAAAAS!

  203. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    I heard that the queens eleven might drop Hart for the Q/F? Its a big one too with the hosts.

  204. DerekM
    Ignored
    says:

    Haha did they freeze or go to pieces nah they are just shite.

    Well done the Vikings lmao

  205. Robert Louis
    Ignored
    says:

    Iceland, all of Europe salutes you. Viking kings of Europe.

  206. ScottieDog
    Ignored
    says:

    The feel good in Iceland…
    They have shown the way in economics and in sport.

  207. donnywho
    Ignored
    says:

    Europe Europe so good England Have left it Twice!

    Iceland 2 England 1

  208. Robert Louis
    Ignored
    says:

    I do think old Lizzie Windsor will not be purring tonight. GIRUY.

  209. HandandShrimp
    Ignored
    says:

    Judging by the stadium all of Iceland are in France

    and boy do they look happy

  210. Marco McGinty
    Ignored
    says:

    ITV presenter: I don’t think anybody can quite believe what they’ve watched.”

    Can I just take this opportunity to state that I can believe it!

    Out of Europe for the second time in four days.

  211. Marco McGinty
    Ignored
    says:

    How long before the SNP gets the blame for causing uncertainty with IndyRef2?

  212. Stoker
    Ignored
    says:

    Guess where i’m doing my shopping tomorrow? ((((( ICELAND )))))

    And i’m changing my name to Stoker MacStokersson

    MWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAhahahahahahahahahaha

  213. Papadox
    Ignored
    says:

    ENGERLAND you are pis* NAE kiddin.

  214. ScottieDog
    Ignored
    says:

    Was boris there to sign article 50 on the way home..

  215. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    What’s the difference between a 13A plug and England?

    Answer: No difference… both no good in Europe.

  216. Michael McCabe
    Ignored
    says:

    Song for Today http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=htobTBlCvUU

  217. Hamish100
    Ignored
    says:

    Surely Iceland is too wee, too poor, on the edge of Europe……..

  218. Cag-does-thinking
    Ignored
    says:

    Ohh dear, there won’t be a frozen food shop with any windaes south of Hadrians wall tomorrow.

  219. Rock
    Ignored
    says:

    cearc,

    “That should show lots goodwill. ‘Sorry about the mess we’ll come and have a chat after the hols.”

    They have got their priorities right.

    Enjoy their holidays while England burns.

  220. Stoker
    Ignored
    says:

    donnywho wrote:
    “Europe Europe so good England Have left it Twice!”

    Belter, LMFAO!

  221. ewen
    Ignored
    says:

    @epiphyta
    Forget Fitch. FIFA will be downgrading me now.

  222. Clapper57
    Ignored
    says:

    England are REALLY out of Europe now !!!!

  223. Lochside
    Ignored
    says:

    Brexit and Iceland….. Ian Wright greeting faced….England truly are out of Europe…..I’m chewing a lemon to take the grin off my face!

  224. Brian McHugh
    Ignored
    says:

    Everyone needs an escape from politics sometimes… So I’m away to listen to some Bjork albums. 🙂

  225. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    @Marco McGinty
    How long before the SNP get the blame for Iceland humping England?

  226. Marco McGinty
    Ignored
    says:

    ITV presenter: So Wales still flying the flag for the home nations, which is great for them.

    Being ITV (in other words independent tv), shouldn’t the presenter have said “great for us”?

    Oops, silly me. No other country should be given any consideration or good wishes in “impartial” UK TV.

  227. mealer
    Ignored
    says:

    Well,the plucky Brits did their best but the bold Icelanders had the better of them.But where was Jeremy Corbyn? And as for that Sturgeon..she should have got behind the team instead of prancing about chatting to Johnny Foreigner.

  228. AlbertaScot
    Ignored
    says:

    First Cammie, then Corbie, next Murray, followed by Roy-ey (does that work?) who can be next? Queenie?

    I guess there really is a Nordic Powerhouse after all. He. he.

    Geeze, this Brexit thing’s got legs.

  229. ewen
    Ignored
    says:

    Oops that should read them, not me

  230. Free Scotland
    Ignored
    says:

    England – gubbed by a small, independent country.

    The following is copied from an article which appeared about 10 hours ago in goal.com, an article which set out to explain why Iceland had no hope of beating England.

    Cocky English journalist writes:

    “The Iceland national team might be considered an army, but their overall footballing stocks remain far shy of England’s.

    FIFA declares a total of 32,408 active footballers in the Nordic nation counting both registered and unregistered players. In comparison, England has over four million!”

  231. John H.
    Ignored
    says:

    Time for a reality check England. 🙂

  232. ronnie anderson
    Ignored
    says:

    Fer Fek saky the Bbc hiv come up wie ah new british program

    the bestest of britishness football training camp sign up now.

  233. Squall Cloud
    Ignored
    says:

    I know it’s not related folks but England lose to Iceland 2-1 in euros. And the media go through their usual bullshit of downplaying opponents with such classics as “minnows” and commentaters trying to downplay Icelands brilliant performance with such classics as “England underperforming and this is embarassing”. Oh as I speak the excuses are flyin in.

    On the other hand this could be seen as a omen in England as it could tip them over the edge and they might try and scupper the vote as some daft idea to put things to normal( just joking, or am I).

  234. Rock
    Ignored
    says:

    Almannysbunnet,

    “The standard reply from the government, usually, is that it is a UK wide decision.”

    Yes, it was a UK wide decision.

    If Scotland wants to remain in the EU, it has one and only one option.

    GET OUT OF THE UK.

  235. Brian McHugh
    Ignored
    says:

    skal to our northern European neighbours. 🙂

  236. Iain More
    Ignored
    says:

    HAHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHAHHAHHAHHAHHHAHAHHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA. There goes another rib!

  237. Breeks
    Ignored
    says:

    England out of Europe again?

    Did they jump or were they pushed?

  238. dramfineday
    Ignored
    says:

    Well done Iceland, get the drinking horns out and rejoice!

  239. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    RE: Iceland result:

    I’m not sure how as yet, but somehow this will be the SNPs fault.

    Simply vile. 🙂

  240. Rock
    Ignored
    says:

    Edward,

    “If the EU insist that cant happen, then perhaps an independent Scotland take on Gibraltar?”

    Scotland should have absolutely nothing to do with the ultra British Nationists of Gibraltar.

    They are worse than the Orange Order.

    If they want to remain in the EU, let them join Spain.

  241. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    Hodgson resigns!

  242. Clootie
    Ignored
    says:

    Well done Iceland……soooo pleased 🙂

  243. Orri
    Ignored
    says:

    Serious lack of joined up thinking from the commentators. They say Iceland’s too wee. Then they mention the premier teams some of their players play for. How thick do you have to be not to see it’s quality that counts and not quantity?

  244. mealer
    Ignored
    says:

    Saves gone

    Roy’s gone

    Jeremy’s still hanging on

  245. Squall Cloud
    Ignored
    says:

    A certain someone has also resigned tonight to pass the buck of responsibility.( no not George boy) it’s Roy Hodgson, formerly of England FC.

  246. James Barr Gardner
    Ignored
    says:

    Comments tonight on England’s pish performance have nearly cracked my ribs, it’s been a wee while since I have had a right good belly laugh. Thanks to Wingers for your cracking wit.

  247. Brian McHugh
    Ignored
    says:

    Roy Hodgeson quit even quicker than David Cameron… ROFL.

  248. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    I almost felt sorry for England tonight…

    Then I remembered they have just hauled us out of Europe. 🙁

  249. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Nigel Farage for the England job.

  250. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    Gumboots 2 – Gunboats 1. Cod says an Is for an aye-aye.

    There’s a joke there somewhere.

  251. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    Last Thursday: BREXIT

    Tonight: EEXIT

  252. Richardinho
    Ignored
    says:

    I’m slightly worried how the Labour party are going to react to THIS.

  253. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    So I’m sitting here drinking a celebratory flagon of mead and I’m thinking, that’s what you can do when you believe.

  254. Dorothy Devine
    Ignored
    says:

    Well done wee Iceland and may I say I LOVE that chant – only wooses and big girls blouses find it threatening, the rest of us love it like a haka .

    Sadly we have nothing to compare unless we can bring on the pipe band.

    I am looking at the many and various attacks on Mr Corbyn in the MSM and wondering if he can withstand this foul onslaught .

  255. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    Apparently Iceland had a major overhaul of their youth football a few years back – unqualified, know-it-all dads aren’t allowed to coach juvie teams. Some merit in that perhaps?

    Pity the know-it-all blazers in the SFA aren’t capable of learning something.

  256. Meg merrilees
    Ignored
    says:

    According to Radio 5 LIVE, England ” had no plan ” on the pitch tonight – at least they are consistent, and now Hodgson has resigned. Who’s next?

    Well done…. ‘Land of the high endeavour, Iceland the Brave’!

  257. Effigy
    Ignored
    says:

    Warnings of sever flooding across England as Scotland pisses itself laughing at the Iceland Match.

    England broker first trade deal outside of the EU.
    They have swapped Boris for Bjork.

    Gary Lineker promises a better result when England take on
    Farm Foods next week.

    England promises to buy 100 tons of Icelandic Blow Fish,
    at Inflated prices, if they will call the game a draw!

  258. Les Wilson
    Ignored
    says:

    Top Marks Iceland, you did a great job!

  259. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    ITV has lost £2.5Billion. Brexit. It could now be taken over. No viewers. No programmes.

    Not enough migrants on the team.

  260. Brian Doonthetoon
    Ignored
    says:

    “But what have the Romans ever done for us?”

    “Well, they gave us fehv stanies…”

    “Yes OK. They gave us fehv stanies. But they always win. We need a game that we can be good at.”

    “I have a cunning plan. We’ll invent football and rule the world!”

  261. Stoker
    Ignored
    says:

    It’s written in the stars and i’ve cracked the coded message folks:

    Independent
    Countries
    Escape
    London
    And
    Never
    Die

  262. ewen
    Ignored
    says:

    They should get Hodgeson to lead the Brexit negotiations. He has experience of getting England out of Europe.

  263. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    England didn’t have any wingers.

    But seriously… (whaahaha!) Have we got a Shadow Sec State yet!

    Geez! UK credit rating gone South too. We have to get out ASAP.

  264. Clapper57
    Ignored
    says:

    England were frozen out tonight.

    English Commentator was a patronising arse wipe……crying all the way through feckin game and then at the end when England….. #FrostyLosty….he lost his COOL …own it fanny ye were ICE CREAMED…he should have taken a CHILL pill the tube ….
    ICE ICE BABY….ICE ICE BABY …..hope they had a (n)ICE time in Europe .

    Au Revoir Sots

  265. Iain
    Ignored
    says:

    Iceland, all I can say the best men won. England better get used to being a loser state, because that’s their future.

  266. Rock
    Ignored
    says:

    Iceland, independent Scotland’s best friend.

    The only country in the world that had openly backed Scottish independence in 2014.

    Well done!

  267. Dr Ew
    Ignored
    says:

    Breaking News: Roy Hodgson files Article 50 resolution on behalf of England…

  268. Rock
    Ignored
    says:

    Gordon Brown had used anti-terrorism legislation against Iceland to protect corrupt UK banks.

    Iceland, the country that has been judged to be the most peaceful country on earth.

  269. ewen
    Ignored
    says:

    Well, that is the second time in four days that England have been embarrassed in Europe.

  270. ronnie anderson
    Ignored
    says:

    Im Ronnie
    Anderson
    andersson
    andersenn
    anderssun

    Weil done tae they Icelandic Geezers,englanders in hot watter awe roads.

  271. One_Scot
    Ignored
    says:

    This is becoming so surreal that I’m half expecting to wake up tomorrow and find that Scotland is actually Independent.

  272. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    @call me dave
    From S&P (FEBRUARY 27, 2014): “Even excluding North Sea output and calculating per capita GDP only by looking at onshore income, Scotland would qualify for our highest economic assessment. Higher GDP per capita, in our view, gives a country a broader potential tax and funding base to draw from, which supports creditworthiness

  273. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Euro 2016 trivia. If you sing god save the queen too hard, it makes you play really badly.

  274. Stoker
    Ignored
    says:

    Effigy wrote:
    “Warnings of severe flooding across England as Scotland pisses itself laughing at the Iceland result.”

    Oh, wae a wee tweak am knockin that yin! Am aff tae spread the word!
    LLF
    🙂

  275. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    Furious Labour MPs tell Corbyn ‘call off the dogs’ over protest MPs office in Edinburgh

    http://archive.is/0E6KW

    Labour resignations a ‘disgusting, organised coup’, says Alex Salmond

    http://archive.is/emxfr

  276. ahundredthidiot
    Ignored
    says:

    Football aside and more over brexit, I can genuinely say I feel sorry for england

    Pity more like, which is worse.

    No doubt trouble in France tonight.

    England’s own worst enemy has come to town.

  277. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    sensibledave says:
    27 June, 2016 at 7:00 pm
    … more important issues at hand now!

    Come on England!

    😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀
    😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀
    😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀
    😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀

  278. One_Scot
    Ignored
    says:

    Given the average IQ of a some football fans, I think a certain frozen food outlet may see a drop in profit in the coming months.

  279. Inverclyder
    Ignored
    says:

    Did Carlsberg start sponsoring England over the past week and nobody noticed!

  280. desimond
    Ignored
    says:

    Sheer Euro scare mongering pish being talked on BBC2 now. Bravo Scotland 2016 still got it!!

  281. Sinky
    Ignored
    says:

    Democracy in action …. England voted to leave Europe

  282. Iain More
    Ignored
    says:

    Iceland goes volcanic! Okay I will get my coat!

  283. Sassenach
    Ignored
    says:

    Our Glorious Secretary of State, eating food, out of his beard, in the House of Commons today turned my stomach – but Jason Manford has put the clip on Wings twitter page….worth a look!

    How lucky we are to have Fluffy overseeing us all!!!

  284. mr thms
    Ignored
    says:

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/27/cameron-decision-on-brexit-timing-will-be-for-britain-alone-to-take

    [I]”Cameron said Scotland “benefits from being in two single markets”, the EU and the rest of the UK. The prime minister added: “In my view the best outcome is to try and keep Scotland in both.””[/I]

    Interesting.

  285. Free Scotland
    Ignored
    says:

    Peter André will be well chuffed.

  286. Ananurhing
    Ignored
    says:

    icelandmonitor.mbl.is/news/politics_and_society/2016/06/25/brexit_is_good_news_says_president_of_iceland/

    Iceland’s President offers hope to post Brexit England. To help them transition out of Europe.

    That’ll go down well.

  287. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    Apparently, the English FA have banned the use of a certain cry from the terracces, on pain of eternal banishment:

    “go on my son”.

  288. Davy
    Ignored
    says:

    looks like England activated “article 50” sooner than we thought…….

  289. Stoker
    Ignored
    says:

    What a fabulous day! Started with raw laughter from the Revs bouncy castle dig at Wee Willie Stinky and ends the same with all the digs at Engerlund or shall one try and be diplomatic and say the day ended with raw laughter at the support for tiny Iceland? NAH, i’m shite at diplomacy. Thanks for the laughs folks!

    Take a bow Effigy for the post of the day.
    So good it needs repeating.

    Effigy wrote:
    “Warnings of sever flooding across England as Scotland pisses itself laughing at the Iceland Match.”

    “England broker first trade deal outside of the EU.
    They have swapped Boris for Bjork.”

    “Gary Lineker promises a better result when England take on
    Farm Foods next week.”

    “England promises to buy 100 tons of Icelandic Blow Fish,
    at Inflated prices, if they will call the game a draw!”

    I’m away to my crypt with aching jaws and very wattery eyes.

  290. stephen
    Ignored
    says:

    Imagine if Ingerlund were up against the big boys,like Asda or Tesco.

  291. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    @mr thms
    Yes, interesting indeed. Cameron is the best hope for us, which is why Sturgeon is moving so fast. By the looks of it done deals need to be, well, done, by 2nd September latest, the time for probably Johnson or May to be in charge. God help us then. I have a better opinion in some ways of Cameron than most Indy supporters 🙂

  292. dakk
    Ignored
    says:

    Effigy 10.24

    ‘Warnings of sever flooding across England as Scotland pisses itself laughing at the Iceland Match.’

    There could be a yellow tsunami warning coming for England as the whole of Europe will be pissing themselves at poor ol’ England now.

    Sensibledave,your boys are taking a helluva beating 🙂

  293. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    mr thms says:
    27 June, 2016 at 10:59 pm
    A multi-national compromise?

    Bob Peston on ITV news says the instant they do the article 50 thing, it triggers massive Brexit outflow of multi national business in to the EU, investment and people. So that’s why they’re not doing it says Bob.

    Which once again begs the question…

  294. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    Done the decent thing by the way Hodgson has, he’s taken the heat off his players.

  295. Kangaroo
    Ignored
    says:

    How about Goodbyee Goodbyee clean the tear baby dear from your eye.

    Anyone for an Ice Tea he he hee

  296. Nana
    Ignored
    says:

    Well done Iceland!
    Here’s some late night viewing now the footie is finished.

    Paul Mason on brexit.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yX8bURuFg0Q&feature=youtu.be

  297. Jas
    Ignored
    says:

    Too many foreign players makes their league look much better than it actually is, says Alan Shearer.

    Ooo, the delicious irony!

  298. Chic McGregor
    Ignored
    says:

    Re the Euro nation’s championship. I suppose ‘BREXIT’ would be an inappropriate quip since Wales are still in it, so how about just plain ‘EXIT’?

  299. Free Scotland
    Ignored
    says:

    English fan walks into a bar in Nice and orders a drink to drown his sorrows.

    Barman asks: “Would you like ice with that?”

    English fan walks out in disgust.

  300. Petra
    Ignored
    says:

    News report: ”England losing (football) overshadows everything that’s going on in the UK.” EH! No wonder England is in such a shambolic mess.

    Other news: Cameron could be gone by the middle of August and Farage is now concerned that the Leavers wont get what they voted for as he’s detecting backsliding from Boris et al. Vow broken already?!

    ………………………………………………

    @ One_Scot…. I see you watched Channel 4 News too One_Scot highlighting the horrendous behaviour of English football fans filmed by undercover reporters.

    Wasn’t it absolutely dreadful. Fans singing ”if you all hate Muslims clap your hands” and calling Isis out to fight. Stirring up even more racist feelings / behaviour; potential terrorist acts here and abroad. The Jews were getting it too with gangs throwing Nazi salutes and singing ”we know who you are, we know who you are … f*cking gas them all”.

    The guy on the hotel balcony tearing down the European flags and ripping them up to much hysterical cheering and laughter and singing ”we’re all voting out of Europe”. Singing / shouting up to French girls in hotel rooms ”get your t*ts out for the lads” and ”you’re the sh*gs” of some Square or other. Bragging about battering outnumbered groups of people black and blue. And worst of all the treatment of the Romanian children calling them ”f*cking gypos” and ”that’s the vermin that’s heading to England.” Handing them Euros and saying ”drink my p*ss” and ”s*ck me off” with one poor half-decent English guy getting dog’s abuse for telling them to cut it out. Leave it out they’re only children.

    They hate Muslims, Jews, Europeans, women and children. Really, really worrying and I notice that the BBC hasn’t reported on any of this. Surprise, surprise. The big cover up continues and in doing so they’re perpetuating this kind of mindset / behaviour.

    ……………………………………………

    @ Effigy says at 7:14 pm …. ”Why would Scotland parting company with England be a problem for them? The Westminster politicians, and the UK Media are all in tune falsely claiming that they have to subsidise Scotland. There you go Westminster, think of all that you have saved when we go off back into a fair and just Europe. Quids in.”

    Great post Effigy and your first few lines just about sum up the whole situation leaving one wondering why it’s not quite dawned on hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of pinball wizards living in England that something is not quite right, DUH? On the one hand they’ve had it rammed into their brainboxes (minus the grey matter) that we’re financial liabilities so why, oh why would Westminster want to hold onto us?

    ……………………………………………….

    @ Almannysbunnet says at 5:33 pm …. ”Angus Robertson made the point that Scotland was a European nation and said loudly and very forcefully that Scotland would not be taken out of Europe against its will. He pointedly said that there was cross party support at Hollyrood for that stance. The standard reply from the government, usually, is that it is a UK wide decision. Not this time. I don’t know if it was the steel in his voice but there was no breying and farting from the Tories. When Cameron said Scotland derived benefits from the UK market it was met with derision from the SNP benches. They will make noises about not believing that Scotland wants a referendum. They will fight a forlorn battle but the games up and they know it.”

    Yip the game’s a bogie AB …. ‘enough is enough’ …. and I can’t wait to get out of this ‘Better Together’ nightmare. I visit elderly people much poorer than those seen in this video and familes with children who are at the end of their tether and have NO hope for the future. As each day goes by I find myself detesting, HATING, the sleekit, parasitical, narcissistic Westminster cabal more and more to the point in fact that if we get our Independence and face real economic challenges in Scotland I’m going to work full time for nothing and have friends who’re going to do likewise. All I ask for now is this. Please, please Nicola just do it for us. Get us out of this ASAP.

    I’m posting this video again (apologies for repeating).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCtJ4kXUtb8

    …………………………………………

    ‘British Exit From EU Not Inevitable, Despite Referendum.’

    https://theintercept.com/2016/06/24/british-exit-eu-still-not-inevitable-despite-referendum/

  301. Peter Craig
    Ignored
    says:

    If, as pundits suggest, there is a GE before new year, and as others suggest, there should be calls for an early Indyref2.

    Who, amongst all the political parties in Scotland could afford to have four campaigns in twelve months, even the SNP with added members and Govt Short money would struggle no? Lab/Lib/Greens surely could not be able to mount any kind of meaningful campaign. Don’t misunderstand, I’m fine if SNP is only party able to get its message out, but I baulk at victory at any cost. It’s like buying a win at poker when your opponent has no ante left, yes, you win, but do you deserve to?

  302. Lochside
    Ignored
    says:

    Newsnicht Scotland had weary wullie Prof David Bell doing his usual of pouring doubt on Scotland’s chances of EU entry.Like he did during Indy REF he talked Scotland down..apparently we have huge deficits, because of oil price dropping which would preclude us getting in.

    Could some economics literate Wings reader(s) enlighten me on two points?: (1) How does Scotland’s economy’s deficit compare with the UK’s and (2) Why does the oil revenue figure in any calculation of Scotland’s economy when all revenue goes to a separate account ‘extra regio account’ which to my knowledge has never been included in Scotland’s finances, and was done deliberately by the UK government?.

    This glove puppet ‘academic’ has been wheeled out for the past several years with his tales of woe. Naturally his opinions are never challenged and the GERS figures that he bases all his biased bollocks on has been challenged, to no avail unfortunately, by the erudite Cuthberts. Now is the time to challenge the misrepresentations while we’ve got them all on the run and make sure that when Indyref2 comes the tired old lies will be laid to rest once and for all.

  303. Still Positive.
    Ignored
    says:

    My English daughter-in-law arrived late on Friday for a family birthday party and she was absolutely raging that we were out of the EU.

    I have rarely heard her swear but she was so incensed by what she called ‘Neanderthals’ voting to leave.

    She was reluctant to label anyone but she definitely blamed English racists – even her own mum got her wrath and had a hard time explaining she voted to Remain.

    On Friday morning my son, who wasn’t a great fan of an Independent Scotland in May 2014, said he thought it was time to move home and campaign for Scotland’s independence.

    And his wife said he did mean it. There may be many more ex-pats with that view.

  304. Mark Russell
    Ignored
    says:

    Knocked out of the Euros by Iceland, knocked out of Europe by people who shop at Iceland.

  305. Effigy
    Ignored
    says:

    Story about Jeremy Corbyn appointing the Icelandic Football team to his Shadow Cabinet, turns out to be a Red Herring!

  306. Peter Craig
    Ignored
    says:

    I’ve never really understood this deficit thing. Is England paying 15 billion a year to keep Scotland in this corpse of a union or is the 15 billion 10% of overall UK deficit. I really find it difficult to believe that WM bestows that amount of largesse upon a subsidy junkie nation such as ours without some major financial advantages being forthcoming.

  307. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Well that was another mad day in the UK. Wonder what our imperial masters will do tomorrow. Re-invade Calais, legalise slavery…

  308. Proud Cybernat
    Ignored
    says:

    Hogdson resigns. Cameron looking for new job.

    Both knocked England out of Europe.

    Hmm….

  309. David MacGille-Mhuire
    Ignored
    says:

    Goodness gracious me, the Tommy, stiff-upper lips, Anglo-Brits got gubbed by our Icelandic brothers as BBC World International News seem to be wetting their adult incontinence pads yet again whilst swiftly moving on to some other narcissist, faux journo.

    Journos, advisedly, seem to be evacuating in to their under kit.

    Golly gosh. What is a pro-Brit chappie or chapette to do when it is compounded with a turkey-voting-for-Xmas BREXIT result at the polls?

    England manager has followed Cameron and jacked it (but sans delay and arsing about as well as wankerish “specialist” commentators forging their names in the peddling of tripe and drivel apologizing for Cammers).

    UK/Angleterre’s economy seems to bo be striving to be only fcuked.

    The Japanese confused as is their wont.

    UK kaput de facto.

  310. Albaman
    Ignored
    says:

    To say that it’s uncharted political waters, is putting it mildly,
    ’cause I’ve just heard Siomon Pia declare that he would be a “yes” voter, should there be a referendum “2” , now that is something I thought I’d never hear, mind you I never thought I’d see Iceland beat England!,
    England = Out of the European Union,
    England =.Out of the European Cup,
    Not a good week for England Eh?!!!.

  311. Craig MachAonghais
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Mark Russell says:
    “Knocked out of the Euros by Iceland, knocked out of Europe by people who shop at Iceland”

    Fuck off Mark! I get some stuff out of Iceland and your snobby attitude does you no favours.

  312. Robert Peffers
    Ignored
    says:

    You really have to laugh at the latest news. Scotland could soon have a new colony – Gibraltar are already in talks with Scotland. Mind you that may upset Spain a wee bit.

    Anyway England can keep Northern Ireland as they are nothing but trouble and, anyway, too much Loyal OO stuff for Scotland’s good.

    It really has been an amazing day. The UK has had another dunt with another Credit Agency, (S&P), downgrading the UK’s ratings from the top AAA rate. Another agency, (Fitch), has dropped the UK from AA+ to AA.

    The comical part is, of course, that Osborne had just made his claims that the UK was ready to face the future, “From a position of strength”. Looks like the Credit Agencies don’t trust Ossie any more than Scotland does.

  313. One_Scot
    Ignored
    says:

    It’s funny, but I’m probably the most content I’ve been for nearly two years.

  314. Effigy
    Ignored
    says:

    Lochside says:

    27 June, 2016 at 11:29 pm

    Newsnicht Scotland had weary wullie Prof David Bell doing his usual of pouring doubt on Scotland’s chances of EU entry.Like he did during Indy REF he talked Scotland down..apparently we have huge deficits, because of oil price dropping which would preclude us getting in.

    Could some economics literate Wings reader(s) enlighten me on two points?: (1) How does Scotland’s economy’s deficit compare with the UK’s and (2) Why does the oil revenue figure in any calculation of Scotland’s economy when all revenue goes to a separate account ‘extra regio account’ which to my knowledge has never been included in Scotland’s finances, and was done deliberately by the UK government?.

    Hi Lochside,
    My slant on this lies with Scotland never having the power to borrow money, so all debt is run up by Westminster, and generally spent in England’s South East Corner.

    Scotland get a proportional share of their debt by ratio of its population.

    The figure gets skewed as Westminster can dip into a Special Fund when it suits them for projects in England, and Scotland does not get a proportion of these monies to spend here.

    The London Olympics Games was a classic example of England dipping the UK till. It was Funded as a benefit to London. The Commonwealth Games in Glasgow got nothing from the fund

    All Oil money goes straight to Westminster, where we supposedly get a share of it proportionately, less whatever Westminster wants to call Special funding.

    If Scotland became independent in the EU, I feel sure that they would back our right to have our stolen 6,000 miles of maritime waters returned to us, along with the oil rigs there. If Scotland got say 8% of oil revenue when in the UK, we could expect 100% of the revenue when independent.

    In summary, Scotland has no deficit ran up by ourselves, only the debt handed to us by Westminster.

    I like someone to answer why Ireland and Iceland both have greater rates of economic growth when both countries are smaller than Scotland and neither has, or will have any oil revenue.

    These snake oil experts seem to suggest that having large oil revenues in a small country, is somehow worse than having no oil revenue.

    Can you imagine how wealthy Scotland will be if we don’t have to pay £Billions for Trident Missiles, the English High Speed Railway, the new Sewer System for London, London Cross Rail network, the refurbishment of the House of Commons, etc, etc, etc.

    Don’t bother trying to work it out, Just know that they are liars and they are not worth listening to at any time.

  315. Peter Craig
    Ignored
    says:

    Is it possible, that after Scotland gains self determination, that I will be able to listen to “land of hope and Glory” “Jerusalem” or just about anything by Elgar, without being mini sick in the back of my mouth???

  316. One_Scot
    Ignored
    says:

    One positive of all this mayhem, after the utter havoc of Brexit, Scotland becoming Independent will feel like a tea party at a children’s nursery school.

  317. mike cassidy
    Ignored
    says:

    If you feel the need for a good laugh, then WOS twitter is comedy venue of the night.

  318. Scot Finlayson
    Ignored
    says:

    Best thing to happen to the Labour Party,

    getting rid of all the self serving Blairites in one swoop,

    cathartic,

    tough times ahead for them but at least it will be a fresh start,cleansed of the Blairite filth.

  319. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    @Peter Craig
    The deficit is the difference between revenues and spending. Just about all countries run a deficit, and cover this with borrowing. Payments and interest are made each year, and the idea is that the GDP should rise faster than the overall debt – that’s liquidity, that’s good.

    Scotland is attributed, via GERS, with revenue and spending. To cover the deficit of the UK (which includes Scotland’s), the UK Government borrows money from banks. So no, the UK nor England subsidise Scotland, banks lend money (basically). There are bonds and stuff, but keeping it simple, it’s banks lending money (like Deutsche Bank).

    From GERS 2014-15, Scotland had a deficit of £15 billion and the UK of £90 billion. Relative to our GDP, Scotland’s was 10%, and the UK’s 5%. But Scotland via GERS is attributed interest payments, so yet again, no, neither the UK nor England subsidise Scotland, it’s an item in the books, books which are illustrative, as Scotland can not run up a deficit – we’re part of the UK.

    This item in the books becomes relevant when we become independent, as the national debt of the UK around £1.5 trillion is divvied up. Basically there are two ways of doing this, per capita when we take equal proportionate shares, or historically, taking into account relative deficits over say 30 years. The figures for this are arguable, but before Indy Ref 1, the 30 year historical deficit figures would have meant Scotland taking around £50 billion, rather than the per capita £135 billion. This is because despite what Unionists will tell you, Scotland performed regularly better than the rest of the UK when geographical oil revenues are taken into account.

    The last couple of years, plus the next 1 or 2 years will raise Scotland’s contribution, as we’re running a higher deficit than the UK as a whole at the moment because of the drop in oil revenues, and because of the failed Conservative austerity policies which probably led to Brexit (not immigration in my opinion). But in say 3 years time, it will still be way less than a per capita share.

    Many people argue the accuracy of GERS for a lot of reasons, but GERS is at least the basepoint from which all arguments and negotiations are likely to flow.

  320. Cadogan Enright
    Ignored
    says:

    @ruby 5.06

    Good job, I like the yellow stars on the YES

    Looks great

  321. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    @Robert Peffers
    Gibraltar is an interesting one, considering its strategic importance to the UK during the second world war, guarding the entrance to the Med, and considering moves already by Spain to take it over. My mind is quietly boggling.

  322. Tam Jardine
    Ignored
    says:

    Lochside

    The Gers figures are an illustration of Scotland’s finances as part of the UK and they look no great.

    My understanding as a layman of the main flaw in using them to project how Scotland’s finances is this:

    Scotland’s expenditure is split between money spent in Scotland and money spent outwith Scotland ‘on our behalf’. Unlike any other EU member state we have an appalling deficit to gdp ratio it seems and this is Kevin Hague’s path of attack.

    Also and however we are able to gain independence and transfer all that shared spending outwith Scotland to spending in Scotland.

    We alone are able to move spending inside our country.

  323. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Craig MachAonghais says:
    27 June, 2016 at 11:52 pm

    @ Mark Russell says:
    “Knocked out of the Euros by Iceland, knocked out of Europe by people who shop at Iceland”

    Fuck off Mark! I get some stuff out of Iceland and your snobby attitude does you no favours.

    Ruby replies

    You get some great bargains in Iceland. These football tops are only 5p 🙂

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cl_OUkNWYAEYEH-.jpg

    Petra & Tony Little: Thanks for feedback.

    Here’s No5. I think it’s much better

    https://db.tt/xKo6OjQu\

    Look at this Smartypants with his EU/Yes sticker.

    https://twitter.com/sosolidshoe

  324. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    @Tam
    On the surface it doesn’t look good, which is why more in-depth analysis and projection will be needed for YES2.

    But there is a key statistic which will be determined during the negotations for Indy, and that’s the amount of debt Scotland will take as its share. Compared to the GDP, that gives a debt to GDP ratio, and in a lot of ways that’s more important than just one year or even a couple of years figures. The lowere the Debt to GDP ratio the more a country can borrow without getting into dangerous territory (approaching 100% basically, red-line if over!

    Current historical table on EU countries deficits:

    http://appsso.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/nui/show.do?dataset=gov_10dd_edpt1&lang=en

  325. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Cadogan Enright says:
    28 June, 2016 at 12:32 am

    @ruby 5.06

    Good job, I like the yellow stars on the YES

    Looks great

    Ruby replies

    Cheers! I didn’t particularly like it. I prefer this one
    https://db.tt/xKo6OjQu\

    The thing I find most interesting about Gibraltar is that the name Gibraltar is from Arabic.

    ‘The name Gibraltar derives from the Arabic Jabal-al-Tarik [mount of Tarik], dating from the capture (711) of the peninsula by the Muslim leader Tarik.

  326. Peter Craig
    Ignored
    says:

    @indyref2

    Thanks for your reply , but I am still no wiser, does Scotland annually spend 15 billion more than it raises? And if so , why does England feel the need to make up the shortfall?

  327. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Peter Craig says:
    28 June, 2016 at 12:57 am

    @indyref2

    Thanks for your reply , but I am still no wiser, does Scotland annually spend 15 billion more than it raises? And if so , why does England feel the need to make up the shortfall?

    Ruby replies

    That is the question that was asked about 15 billion times during IndyRef1 🙂

    Perhaps we’ll get the answer during IndyRef2!

  328. Peter Craig
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Ruby

    Thank you,
    I love my kids and like all kids they cost a fortune, I live for the day when they say “Dad I need to stand on my own two feet” At that point I may give them more than I do already, I cannot for any reason see why England would be throwing money our way, we are not their kids, so a financial advantage MUST be Englands motive. I could care less about the past, but please,this imperialistic stupidity has to be stopped. I would happily donate a Kidney if WM would open the books and let us ALL know whats what.
    I am sure there’s a cogent thought in there somewhere, good luck finding it. (Pretty sure posting whilst in possession of bottle Scotch = Dumb

  329. Petra
    Ignored
    says:

    Loads of fantastic most informative posts on here as usual and some a great laugh. Intelligent and funny! Whae’s like us?

    Ian’s post at 10:34pm is brilliant.

    Just catching up on my reading matter, such as the Sunday Herald which outlines that a poll (42,711 people) held on the HeraldScotland website indicates that 80% of Scots would vote yes next time round. They admit that it’s “not a scientific poll but are staggered at the number of respondents and their overwhelming support for a second independence referendum.” The Sunday Herald has also been contacted by hundreds of readers who said that although they voted No in 2014 they would now vote to leave the UK.

    Getting there folks!

  330. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    @Peter Craig
    Yes, Scotland in 2014-15 spent £15 billion more than it raised, according to GERS which is so far the most commonly used mechanism of doing Scotland’s accounts.

    No, England doesn’t make up the shortfall, the banks did. Scotland “pays” for it in interest.

    But yes, the UK in 2014-2015 spent £90 billion more than it raised, and No, England didn’t make up the shortfall, nor did Scotland – the banks did. The UK pays for it in interest.

    There were arguments in IndyRef1 where England subsidised Scotland, or Scotland subsidised England. They were fun, but neither actually subsidises the other. As a Union different parts have different needs, and different monies are spent in each. Meanwhile the debt racks up for the UK, which consists of all 4 countries.

    At Independence and after negotiation, the bill is split, Scotland and the rUK leave the table, tip the waiter, and depart with neither having paid for each other’s meal. As a result of that negotiation, agreed by both parties, neither was a “subsidy junkie”.

    Taxi for Scotland!

  331. Robert J. Sutherland
    Ignored
    says:

    mr thms @22:51, 22:59,
    yesindyref2 @ 23:06,
    heedtracker @ 23:08

    This pish about Scotland somehow staying in the UK and also the EU reminds me of the Vow. Another sop to calm the turbulent natives that can be conveniently diluted and ignored once they have settled down again. It’s the “federalisation” thing reheated.

    This is VOW mk2. Don’t be fooled again!

    The only significance this kind of talk has is to very clearly demonstrate that Scotland currently has the opportunity of a lifetime (an open goal, if you like) to get free and the English Establishment know it and are running scared. It will be exploited ruthlessly by them to deter wavering Scots, then they will casually cast it aside when no longer needed.

    It would be foolishness of the first order to give this vile notion any kind of currency at all.

  332. Liz g
    Ignored
    says:

    Peter Craig @ 1.50am
    Think you have answered you’re own question (so the Scotch must be working somehow) Westminster is never going to open the books.
    We are unfortunately left in the position of having to match what we know and what we can work out.
    This suits Westminster as they can claim we would be taking a leap in the dark.
    As you have already worked out Scotland costing them money makes no sense once you stop to think about it.
    It seems to me that if they had any actual proof Scotland is skint they would have demonstrated it by now…. probably evey week at the start of Question Time.
    Also now that we have the net, site’s like this and the information Holyrood can gather and share,then on balance it seem pretty clear Scotland has considerable hidden wealth.
    There was a video doing the rounds during the Indy Ref that if you accept it’s genuine addresses this subject.
    Try…. John Jappy..on YouTube.

  333. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    @Robert J. Sutherland
    Yeah, we all know it’s pish, so does Sturgeon. The thing is she has to exahust all possibilities, and be seen to do so. Then that leaves Indy ref 2 as the only course of action left. Meanwhile exploring all possibiliites gathers support for Indy Ref 2 itself – whichever way people want to vote.

    It also probably gets people more in the mood for Independence. In its way, this is the summer Indy campaign, started moments after the Brexit result.

  334. Robert J. Sutherland
    Ignored
    says:

    Getting into another nit-picking argy-bargy over dubious GERS figures will only get us the same result as 2014. It gives the media a field day to pick over the entrails ad nauseam and depress everyone with their negativity. Hyenas feasting on offal.

    The BBC would just love to re-run that dismal business because it’s exactly the kind of superficial precision they can grind out relentlessly and make appear objective, with the assistance of willing yoon collaborators such as Prof. Bell. Behind the storm of numbers, people can’t see that the figures are politically-fixed distortions, and knowing no better, immediately deduce that they will be hurt financially by indy. At that point the case is lost.

    The best way I believe to counter this minefield of misery is twofold:

    + fix in peoples’ minds that the state we are in currently, whatever it may be, is a consequence of long-term UK mismanagement that disadvantages Scotland, not a realistic measure of Scotland’s capability once independent.This takes the sewer outlet of the likes of Kevin Hague and turns the thing right round back at them. Backfire!

    + Compare Scotland’s obvious potential with similar small countries that are doing fine, even despite the recession that has touched us all. Iceland, for one example! Send video reporters there and do vox pops asking ordinary people if they would like to give up their independence because they’re “too wee”. Replay all the derision and laughter! We can be just as good as them. Make it positive, but something far more concrete and grounded than the woolly “feel good” of the last time.

  335. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    Good grief. From average’s twitter feed (average “effectively” doesn’t understand deficits either by the way), Paddy Ashdown tweeted this:

    UK credit rating down. Cost of UK debt up. 0.5% on £470 bn debt = £22 Bn. 2X our EU contribution to international money men. Taking control?

    Paddy, lad, £22 billion is 5% of £470 million. 0.5% is £2.2 billion. At least some replies corrected him, and one pointed out it’s unlikely that £470 billion was just refinanced – these things go in bundles over 5 years or something like that.

    Oh yes, Scotland can’t have a deficit as part of the Union, only the UK can. That’s part of the point of the Union. They’re all talking twaddle, as OBE would have said. Even the borrowing power Scotland gets in Scotland Act 2015 has nothing to do with the deficit, only smoothing out revenue return expectatons and realisations.

  336. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    @Robert J. Sutherland
    GERS isn’t real, it’s illustrative. It’s supposed to show the theoretical position if Scotland HAD been Independent the year it covers. But it’s not real. Only Scotland’s DELs and controlled expenditure in it are actually real.

    Anyway, fag and bed. Perchance to dream of Indy Ref late 2017 – early 2018.

  337. jockmcx
    Ignored
    says:

    A week is a long time in politics.

    And this is only tuesday.

    I still like this old one.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3WIbFMpd400

  338. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    When people talk about oil prices ,surely it is actually going to be irrelevant? I cannot imagine England agreeing to return our territorial waters without a major struggle. It would not matter if the EU agreed as England would no longer be a member and not obliged to follow EU law.

    England gathers much needed revenue from these facilities and has probably signed them off as securities, and will not give them up easily ,and certainly not without a fight. It is their way.

    I think reclaiming our N Sea resources back will be an objective for the medium to long term and we should plan for such.

  339. ScottieDog
    Ignored
    says:

    My way of thinking about all of this now is that SCOTLAND IS OUT OF THE EU.
    That’s the best way to think gong forward for me rather than getting into complicated ‘what ifs’

    The main point to stress is that the decision was made for us and hence we have no sovereignty. The question is what do people want going forward.?

    In many ways the EU thing is now a huge advantage. It’s a burden lifted from our shoulders and was always going to be used against us in a future referendum. Hanging on to the coat tails of Europe will never be on our terms – it will be on the terms of Brussels and I personally wouldn’t accept that. The more favourable terms the UK enjoyed are gone.

    We have to look forward now.

    I believe we should look to a small country like Iceland with its own currency and central bank. It has firmly rejected austerity (unlike the EU) and is thriving now less than a decade after what appeared to be economic Armageddon.

    Having a central bank is like having infinitely rich parents (so long as you owe money in your own currency). People will always buy your bonds at a low rate of interest because they know you will always pay them back. Indeed the Bank Of England owns one fifth of the country’s debt.

    The Bank of England will play a big part post brexit in smoothing of the way ahead. It’s like a big shock absorber. Without it the economy shakes itself to bits at the mercy of the road.

    So for Scotland a central bank and a Scottish pound is the way forward along with an outright rejection of austerity. Project fear will decry our initial devalued currency (which will boost our exports). The ratings agencies will fire out warning flares (same ones which showered Enron with glowing ratings)

    We will move forward forging trade on our own terms. without being shackled by the Maastricht treaty or Westminster neoliberalism we will have the ability to deliver big infrastructure spending domestically, greening the economy and providing full employment. This isn’t pie-in-the-sky, it is pretty much what most govts did in the post war period before the monetarists took over and declared such spending inflationary (they completely ignored the fact that inflation was down to the open crisis)

    Yes Scotland will be outward facing and open but we will be a sovereign country and it will be on our terms.

  340. galamcennalath
    Ignored
    says:

    Robert J. Sutherland says:

    “This pish about Scotland somehow staying in the UK and also the EU reminds me of the Vow”

    Yes, it’s the latest reincarnation of DevoMax / FFA with the added twist of an EU membership divide.

    IMO it needs to be fully explored, picked to bits, and rejected. It will be rejected by WM and Team Scotland. It will probably also be rejected by the EU.

    We must remember many soft NOs are DevoMaxists. It is essential that come IndyRef2 everybody knows there is a clear choice, Indy versus DevoVeryLittle out of the EU.

    We MUST NOT go into IndyRef2 with lingering scope for any sort of Vow2.

  341. mealer
    Ignored
    says:

    This morning I’ll be sending an email to Angela Merkels CDU Party.I’ll be pleading with them not to rescind my EU citizenship.That letter will be worth more than 40,000 votes on a Sunday Herald poll,but probably less than the letter my 13 year old daughter is going to write.She’ll be sending a copy to her Grandparents.

  342. ScottieDog
    Ignored
    says:

    ‘Open crisis’ should read ‘opec crisis’

  343. Undeadshaun
    Ignored
    says:

    View from the usa.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/

    Quite a lot of articles as you would expect, though England does appear to be a laughing stock.

    And some more views in a Washington political magazine.

    http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/06/brexit-change-europe-britain-us-politics-213990

    Interestingly Scottish independence is seen as likely and uk us special relation will not last.

  344. mealer
    Ignored
    says:

    A lot of folks on here will have an EU built car.Send the manufacturer an email telling them Scotland voted to stay in the EU and you need their help to protect your EU citizenship.

    Or don’t.Its up to you.

  345. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    @Peter Craig

    Yesindyref2 at 2.54 has the right of it. Something to remember about GERS though – http://wingsoverscotland.com/the-limitations-of-gers/

    There is no actual ‘set of books’ for Scotland and the only accurate figures showing Scotland’s contribution year on year would be in the hands of the treasury. GERS was created back in the days of the first devolution referendums by the Tories as apolitical tool. It simply shows the state of affairs relating to a devolved Scotland’s finances. Whilst its structure has been improved somewhat from its earlier model, it is by no means the full set of accounts detailing all of Scotland’s revenue streams.

    As has been stated before, most countries run a deficit and keeping that deficit under control is the job of government. The real question for people is which government would you, or should you trust with this stewardship?

    Even leaving the historical deception and incompetence of the UK treasury and political system aside, the actions of government and the ensuing economic carnage of this past week should be a severe heads up for the UKs population. Parties who put career and the search for power ahead of the economy and the needs of their population. An awol government when all four nations are in the grip of a historic constitutional crisis which they themselves initiated.

    You’d think folk would want a homegrown government and treasury in place they could trust to be transparent with the figures, attentive to their needs and prudent with their revenue streams and resources? Might be that’ll be the case in the near future. 😉

  346. Dr Jimsson
    Ignored
    says:

    Correct me somebody if I’m wrong, economy stuff not being my area, but, given that Scotland has never had any borrowing powers how did Scotland manage to run up debt applied for by the UK Government to be spent by the UK Government in whatever way THEY chose and then attributing a percentage share to Scotland in order to maintain the UK

    It all sounds like England borrowed money and used Scotland’s GDP as a guarantor of payment whether we wanted it or not, and if you can get away with that, send your names and addresses to me so I can take out loans in all of your names and when I don’t pay it back it’s your problem

    So when Alex Salmond said, it’s not our debt, was he not correct?

    Or am I over simplifying a paper shuffling excersise

  347. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    Westminster cannot illegally and secretly take Scottish Oil revenues and hid it under the Official secrets Act or illegally say there is no way for separate accounts (a click on a commuter) It is illegal under International Law. These accounts are still not totally accountable because of Westminster decision. Since Devolution 2000. The year that democracy came to Scotland.

    Osbourne/Westminster is operating a totally false accounting system. In the private/public sector he would be arrested as a fraud and embezzler and put in jail. Osbourne and his accounting methods are criminal. Just shoving in ‘growth’ for a black hole in the finances. Or overspending £Billions on Hinkley Point, HS2 and Trident/illegal wars with little benefit but to him and his associates. When there are more cost effective alternatives.

    If/when Scotland becomes Independent a Westminster Chancellor (Osbourne) will not be able to destroy a major (Oil) sector in Scotland by inappropriate action. Taxing it at 60/80% when the price had fallen 75%. (For over 5 years). it is still 40%. Sneaking in and out of Aberdeen. Destroying the revenues (£4Billion+ a year) and having to import more Oil. More costly. Losing thousands of jobs and £Billions of revenues for Scotland/UK (£20Billion+ for Scotland). That is the harm an Westminster incompetent Chancellor, who doesn’t care, can do to the (Scottish) economy. Ditto for other policies which are not relevant to the Scottish economy, political and social structure.

    Every Budget Osbourne has done has been full of mistakes, accounting and otherwise. They have had to be adjusted and rectified. Osbourne is a disgrace. An incompetence, inexperience fraud without any accounting ability. Osbourne can’t count but just makes it up and roughs it out. Hiding behind the other incompetent coward Cameron. Another crook. They broke the electoral Laws to get into power and just get away with it. The only reason they are there is to embezzle vast sums (£Billion) from the public purse for themselves and their associates and tax evade. Breaking UK Law and getting away with it. Cameron doesn’t ‘love his country’. He tries to destroy it for personal gain.

    Or Scotland can’t put a tax on ‘loss leading’ drink saving £1Billion. Scotland can’t stop spending£1Billion+ a year on Trident (Cost £205Billion) on absolete weaponry. There are already rotting, contaminated hulls at Rosysth. Scotland can’t stop spending £Billions on illegal wars (against international Law) unless it is Independent. Causing migration into Europe. Innocent people are being sanctioned and starved to death. Westminster corrupt, costly, illegal government is costing (Scotland) £Billions because of their bad, incompetent decisions.

    The only ones to bring them to account are the SNP MP’s at Westminster and Holyrood who do care about Scotland. They know exactly what the Westminster crooks are doing. They know exactly how the accounts are operated. That is why it is so important to vote SNP/SNP do not deviate, ever, until Scotland is Independent.

    The latest havoc will also cost Scotland dear. Unless Scotland can become Independent (ASAP) to limit the terrible damage the Westminster clowns are inflicting on Scotland and the world economy.

    Most of them should be locked up in jail. They are a danger to the world. They commit crime with impunity and hide it under the Official Secret Act. Tax evasion is the reason the Westminster/Unionist crooks want to come out of the EU. They care nothing about Britain or the people in it or anyone else. The only ones they care about are their conceited, greedy selves and their associates. They are a danger to society. The Tories took a year to totally trash the economy.

    What they have done beggars belief. They should be put in jail. Starting with Farague a crook who has illegally been funding a political party with public funds for years. Illegal in Britain. Protected by Tory grandees. They will reap what they sow but the damage they are doing the economy is immense. A GE is going to put pay to it, but the immediate affects are absolutely tragic. More innocent people will die because of it.

  348. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruthie there on radio shortbread asked to apologise for her part in ‘better together’ promises all evaporating into the ether but waffles on long enough that the Ken McDonald the interviewer forgets what he asked.

    Anyhoo! The tories are putting forward their amendment this afternoon in the Holyrood debate but promise to do what they can to support keeping Scotland’s links with Europe. (poli-speak)

    The amendment will include a ‘no indy2 ref’ I expect.

    Meanwhile Jeremy Hunt somehow wants to hide the Article 50 trigger button and suggests a 2nd referendum but not sure how to
    bring it about.

    Modestly Osborne says “I’m not the right person to be the PM”. Another thing on his list that he’s got to be modest about.

    Corbyn…FGS! Good old labour MPs lets have a coup and let the tories get on with it as the UK goes down the pan.
    Hey you idiots Deputy Deadwood wants an answer …what’s she gonna do?

  349. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    Third ratings agency downgrades UK credit rating. Economy now under serious threat. This is literally beyond the realms of ridiculous. The UK is to all intents and purposes leaderless as both major parties indulge in a self harm frenzy. They are leaving their electorate and the economy to swing in the wind whilst they have a schoolyard pissing contest.

    They must be insane.

  350. Robert Peffers
    Ignored
    says:

    @Effigy says: 28 June, 2016 at 12:02 am:

    A Good explanation to Lochside, there Effigy may I expand on it?

    ” … (1) How does Scotland’s economy’s deficit compare with the UK’s”

    Scotland doesn’t actually have a deficit – even on paper – it is only claimed by UK accountancy methods.

    ” …(2) Why does the oil revenue figure in any calculation of Scotland’s economy when all revenue goes to a separate account ‘extra regio account’ which to my knowledge has never been included in Scotland’s finances, and was done deliberately by the UK government?.

    This one is an out and out rip-off. And that on several levels.

    First of all we have what Westminster classes as, “National assets”. These begin with Her Majesty and all the royal, “hingers oan”, right down to some you probably have never heard of. However, it continues with mainly London based, “National Assets”, that folk never even think they pay for.

    For example, “The Greenwich Observatory”. Then there is the, “London Luvvie”, delights such as, “The National Opera”, National Art Galleries, Museums, National Orchestras, Ballet, Shakespeare, Grace & Favour residences like St James Palace and so on.

    Which is why we all paid for the London Dome, London Olympics and we also pay for that London infrastructure they claim as parts of the national transport system. One such was the refurbishment of all London rail and bus terminals. The London Cross-rail system and the road & rail infrastructure associated with the Chunnel.

    We also all paid for the New London Sewerage System which also included a one off rebate payment to every London and SE area household. Then there was a one-of grant to the Transport for London organisation to aid their start-up.

    Another scam is the way they fund, (mainly), London infrastructure. It works like this – In Scotland everything is funded from within the Block grant. That includes infrastructure, education and the Scottish NHS.

    In England they are supposed to fund their infrastructure from within DEFRA funding but they frequently draw on, “Government Reserves”, to fund big projects and while DEFRA funding has, (both positive & Negative), Barnet Consequentials, the funding from Government Reserves does not, Thus everything paid for from Government Reserves is paid for by all of Scotland, Wales & N.I. and we get no Barnet Consequential compensation.

    The other fiddles are done in the way they do the figures and asses a Scotland share of them. The Oil & Gas figures are typical of this.

    They claim all the oil & gas revenues as coming from Extra-region territory and it is all UK assets. Then they asses Scotland’s share of those assets on the basis of per capita population and set it as 8.4%.

    Then, when they do the books, they credit Scotland as only contributing 8.4% of those oil & gas revenues but the truth is that between 95% and 98% of the oil & gas revenues comes out of Scotland’s territorial waters. Note though that this assessment is only a paper exercise and Scotland does NOT actually get that 8.4% as funding. The figure is only used to further cook the books and affects many other calculations – but never in Scotland’s favour.

    BTW: That is only scratching the surface. There are many other scams. For example extra charges made for each kilowatt of electric power added to the National grid that increases for each mile away from London and then they actually subsidise electricity generators in and around London.

    Then there is the Scottish Crown Estates revenue profits that are simply added onto the English Crown Estate and handled from England. Ad bloody infinite.

  351. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    Lord Forsyth on college green admits (good BBC word that) it’s a muddle and denies that the leave faction should have had a plan.

    Also says the process has been started and CMD who promised to press the trigger immediately was then right to pause and take counsel.

    Wants to know what the EU deal is before triggering article 50.

    Nicola should get back to sorting Scottish education and leave foreign matters to WM… 🙂 Eat your porridge sweaties!

  352. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    GERs are flawed they do not consider the alternatives. They are Westminster books and they should own them. They do not represent an Independent Scotland policies. For years until 2000. The years of Westminster economic policies in relationship to Scotland were hidden under the Official Secrets Act. Thatcher and McClone – Labour. They lied to conceal the damage Westminster economic poilicies were doing in effect to Scotland/UK economy. Breaking Scottish/UK/EU and International Laws. When Unionist criminal liars are in Gov it has a severe negative affect on the economy and taxpayers money. No taxation without proper representation.

  353. The Isolator
    Ignored
    says:

    All jokin aside re the footie last night but not only are we in unchartered waters but it’s gettin choppy out here.

    In my workplace there is discontent and much gnashing of teeth that the “wee nippy sweetie will drag us oot o Great Britain and force us tae use the Euro”.FFS.

    Anyway back to the footie best quote on Engerland last night.

    “England have just been beaten by a country with more volcanoes than professional footballers ” 5 Live arf arf

  354. Scott
    Ignored
    says:

    England 1-2 Iceland

    Another cod war victory for Iceland

    Just thought I had to get this one in.

  355. Sinky
    Ignored
    says:

    Is BBC Scotland covering Nicola’s speech and EU debate in Holyrood this afternoon?

  356. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    Radio shortbread FGS!

    An interesting dynamic they say, not trying to stir up trouble, Murray (Scot) versus Broady (English) at the tennis, how will he react, will the crowd be fair?

    Geez! I thought that they were both brave Brits.. What changed? Naughty old auntie 🙂

    Off to eat my porridge and read the footie pages.

  357. frogesque
    Ignored
    says:

    It’s not about GERS, or deficits, price of oil or any of that.

    Scotland is a net exporter of oil, food and drink, we have more than enough gold for our own uses, we have a well educated populous and the worlds best home grown politicians.

    Put all that to one side. There is an overriding MORALITY for holding IRef2. Let’s get on with it!

  358. call me dave
    Ignored
    says:

    @Sinky

    Debate here about 2 pm…ish!

    http://www.scottishparliament.tv/

  359. Dorothy Devine
    Ignored
    says:

    I can’t stop smiling this morning , Iceland 2 England 1.

    Iceland I salute you – your players for giving heart ,mind and soul to their game.

    Your fans for their heart ,mind , soul and HOO!

    And your courage in jailing bankers.

    Does anyone re-call an article by the Daily Mash
    ” Scotland dies Laughing” – it concerned the arrogance against Croatia some years ago. They could re-print it this morning and it would be just as relevant. HOO!

    I have to say I feel quite sorry for the English footballers as they are promoted beyond belief by their commentators – someone should remind them that in any game there are winners and losers and England just lost to a more committed team.HOO!

  360. ronnie anderson
    Ignored
    says:

    Richard Branson on GMB this morning want a re-run of the EU Ref the Brexit told lies Mwahahaha . Did,nt he back We Love You lets Stay Together mob. The Sun/Express ect ect printed Lies MwaHAHAHA. He must have went back to his private Island during our Indy Ref an slung a deef ear tae the sweaty Jocks Referendum . Karma’s ah Big Big Big BITCH.

  361. galamcennalath
    Ignored
    says:

    Macart says:

    “They must be insane.”

    Yes, and they aren’t the only ones.

    UK politicis has descended to the level of buying a ten year old car privately from some guy you don’t know in a car park. You don’t know how reliable the car is or whether the guy is telling the truth. Some punters clearly look at the fluffy dice and say, “that will do nicely”.

    Far too many voters are ‘insanely” making important choices based on trivia, single policies, prejudices, personal appearance, nostalgia, etc. plus of course lies and misinformation.

    For democracy to work, there needs to be an informed and politically aware voting public.

    Of course, for those who wish to undermine democracy, they need as many people as possible to remain ill informed!

  362. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    @the Isolater

    Seriously? After the past four years they still don’t know about ERM2?

    Ye Gods, the media have a lot to answer for. They do know Scotland doesn’t qualify or that joining is voluntary right? Time to start leaving literature roond the works canteen again. 🙂

  363. mike cassidy
    Ignored
    says:

    I’ve just watched potential leader candidate Jeremy Hunt talking about the importance of getting the best deal in the ‘withdrawal’ negotiations

    that the people should have a say in this

    that whatever “this” is should be reflected in the tory manifesto for the 2020 election

    and that would be the time to push the button on article50.

    4 years from now!

    Is this going to be their revenge for the Iceland defeat?

  364. Meindevon
    Ignored
    says:

    Scottiedog ( I think) mentioned that we need our own central bank earlier. I think it would be wise to get on and sort this out ASAP. Not sure why the SG hasn’t done this already. It could be important for a yes vote. Maybe they’re on it and I just haven’t heard.

  365. mike cassidy
    Ignored
    says:

    re football

    Chris Waddle – “We’re not as good as we think we are”

    Now if only your politicians could grasp that reality.

  366. Al Dossary
    Ignored
    says:

    Re Oil fields – the general public have got no conception of just how much has been pulled from the existing fields in the North Sea.

    Piper Alpha was running at 250,000 bpd prior to the disaster

    Forties was producing at 500,000 bpd at its peak

    The Brent Field had produced 1 Billion barrels as far back as 1987 and peaked at 500,000 bpd. Shell claim themselves that Brent alone has contributed £20 Billion in tax.

    Nexen peaked at 250,000 bpd on Buzzard probably pumping aboout 150,000 bpd now.

    Brittania (condensate field) had 2 major stakeholders – Conoco and Chevron. When I was on it was contributing 5% of the worldwide profits of one of them, and 20% to the other.

    There is one common, unpublicised factor with all of the early fields. Namely that with no one in the UK government willing to “hold their feet to the fire”, the oil companies operated a scorched earth policy. Pump as much as they can, as quickly as they can and then get rid of the Asset.

    This is a situation which was not allowed to happen in Norway, whose parliament way back in the early days passed a law that stated that the oil belonged to the Norwegian people, and may only be used for the greater good of these same people.

    As to the service companies like Wood Group, Salamis, Kvaerner et al – every one of them operates as the subsiduary of a brass plated office in the Channel Islands. Thus they deny the exchequer a huge chunk of NI employers contributions on a weekly basis.

  367. ahundredthidiot
    Ignored
    says:

    Jeremy Hunt on BBC ‘…not been a revolution here for 4 hundred years….’

    The arrogance.

  368. Breeks
    Ignored
    says:

    Look at and thoroughly digest the McCrone Report, and what John Jappy had to say about Scotland’s economy. Then imagine such uncloaked revelations are potentially the mere tip of an iceberg; the only part to break the surface and see the light of day.

    Then look at GERS, who set it up, when, and why. Then work through all the right wing think tanks and ostenibly impartial “expert” opinions who line up to tell us how poor and crippled we are, and again ask who these people are? Why was this “institution” set up? Who pays to support them? What qualifications and expertise back their assertions? Where is their evidence?

    Then take a step back, and ask yourself how on earth can such partisan fiction and wilful disinformation survive in the public domain without appropriate scrutiny nor any requirement to substantiate what it claims or confront such frequent discordance with the acknowledged truth.

    Then ask yourself why the BBC is everywhere and so richly funded, all powerful, and yet peppered with politicos who shouldn’t be allowed in any newsroom where their political views cannot be set aside and interfere with news being objectively disseminated.

    Don’t take my word for it, I’m a self confessed independentist. You make up your own mind. You take your own journey. All I’m seeking to do is mark some key features on your tour guide.

    Finally, ask yourself the most important question of all.

    You YES yet?

  369. Capella
    Ignored
    says:

    A percentage of Scottish exports, nobody outside the Treasury knows the true figure, is chanelled through English ports. This inflates England’s foreign exports and decreases Scotland’s.
    It also increases Scotland’s trade figures with England and decreases our trade figures with EU countries.

    So when Ruth argues that Scotland should stay in the UK because it is our largest single market she should be challenged on the source of that assertion.

    How can we get accurate figures? GERS is obviously a fiction concocted to diminish the size of the Scottish economy, as Ian Lang, Secretary of State during the Thatcher administration, admitted.

    If Scotland leaves the UK surely we simply negotiate access to the English market just like everyone else.

  370. Alan Mackintosh
    Ignored
    says:

    Bob Mack, re the north sea, its not the EU which will be involved. UK is a signatory to UNCLOS, United Nations Convention on Law of the Sea, which is how the decision will be decided. Craig Murray had an article on his site which described it and he himself when he was a diplomat was involved in a/several cases. Have a look on there for it.

  371. frogesque
    Ignored
    says:

    Footie: Piers Morgan wih a wasp up his nose this morning. Engerland shite etc etc.

    Never mind, it’s Wimbers and that well known North Briton may save the day while the in crowd swig champers and scoff North British strawberries in the rain. Who cares if little England goes down the chunky as long as they can sing Rule Britania?

    Fuck them, they made their bed, we’ll take the linen sheets thanks very much.

  372. Dr Jim
    Ignored
    says:

    My simplified look at Scottish deficit

    Give me all your names and addresses I’ll take out loans which I’ll decide what I’m spending that money on but you’ll then owe me money when it’s time to pay it back

    Is that close? me not being a financial wizard and all

    It doesn’t seem fair somebody else can buy a car in my name then drive it around claiming it’s on my behalf then one day ask me to pay for it all over again when I never got a shot in it

    Like I said what do I know

  373. Tinto Chiel
    Ignored
    says:

    “It’s not about GERS, or deficits, price of oil or any of that.

    Scotland is a net exporter of oil, food and drink, we have more than enough gold for our own uses, we have a well educated populous and the worlds best home grown politicians.

    Put all that to one side. There is an overriding MORALITY for holding IRef2. Let’s get on with it!”

    I have to agree with Frogesque. The opposition just love obfuscating and spreading fear with their loaded statistics, of which GERS is an example. People in Scotland need to look at the society in meltdown over the border and ask themselves, “Surely we can do better than that?”

    And I think an increasing number are coming to the right conclusion.

    But thank goodness BLiS——d have their fingers on the pulse: their new Big Idea is federalism, but they might support IndyRef2 too.

    Surely far too early in the day for such fudge?

    Final thought on Iceland’s great victory: I think much of it stemmed for their confidence as an independent nation. Don’t laugh but our team will never be successful until WE are independent, in my opinion.

  374. Almannysbunnet
    Ignored
    says:

    Beware of polls! It wouldn’t be the first time that polls have been “used”. How often have we heard after the event “how could the polls have got it so wrong.”

    The 3 latest polls showing a huge shift to yes should not be taken at face value given who they were for. The company that carried out the Sunday Post poll is not even a member of the British Polling Council and as such are under no obligation to explain how they arrived at their figures (59/32 for yes). You have to ask yourself why would the Sunday post use this company. The Sunday Times poll (52/48 for yes) only polled 600 people so cannot be taken as accurate. The Daily Record (54/46 for yes) polled the standard 1000 people but the majority of those polled voted yest the last time.

    Anything familiar about the organizations who these polls were carried out for?

  375. Rob
    Ignored
    says:

    This may only demonstrate my patchy following of comments here, but, if we’re to get any sort of differential EU arrangements across the UK, won’t there need to be new Non-EU compatible England & Wales passports while Scotland hangs on to the current EU-UK passports or gets a new Scottish version?

  376. Kevin Evans
    Ignored
    says:

    AAA credit rating gone, pound losing value against majority a major currency’s, banks at tipping points and the U.K. Confirmed as heading into recession.

    Let’s see how these broad shoulders of the U.K. Take the weight of this shit storm coming that Scotland did not want or vote to start the ball rolling on.

    Time to support your country and fellow citizens.

    Are you YES yet?

  377. starlaw
    Ignored
    says:

    Law of the sea is usually decided by latitude and longtitude. Scotland and Englands border on the east coast would revert back to where it was.

  378. Dr Jim
    Ignored
    says:

    To be fair to the English footballers they’re not bad players, they just had no pattern of play, no approach, no style of attitude but most importantly

    No Effing plan, just like their political leaders….

    And that’s the fault of…. The Management

    See how I got politics and football together there

  379. cearc
    Ignored
    says:

    Talk about head-in-the-sand. Prats talking about doing a deal before triggering art.50 when the EU has absolutely ruled out any negotiations or pre-negotiations before art.50 is triggered.

    Meanwhile back in the real world,

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-06-27/markets-in-revolt-demand-action-from-johnson-s-brexiteer-crew

    ‘To calm markets, politicians need to “take a united stand and reiterate that regardless of the changes in party leadership, secession from Europe will be carried out in an orderly manner,”

    The longer they faff about ignoring the reality the more the economy will tank.

  380. Sassenach
    Ignored
    says:

    Almannysbunnet says:
    Beware of polls!

    Never a truer word spoken – believe them at our peril. I’m convinced people are now so au fait with pollsters that it is unlikely all of them will give truthful answers, anyway.

    Hopefully the FM will know when to act!!

  381. Tinto Chiel
    Ignored
    says:

    Me @8.54.

    Should have been “stemmed from”.

    Well said Breeks @ 8.47. Capella’s point about Scottish exports channelled through English port is another excellent one. I think it was our own RP who first alerted me to this.

    Bottom line is: we have to take control 😛

  382. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    If the rest of the UK doesn’t accept Scottish goods, fuel and services Goods, fuel and services will have a higher cost in the rest of the UK. Or there will be higher prices and/or shortages in the rest of the UK. Further damaging the English economy.

    Davidson is incorrect in her assertions. It is the rest of the UK who want to put barriers, tarriffs and borders and obstruction to free trade and movement. Not the majority in Scotland. The majority of people in Scotland have to accept their decision despite not agreeing with it. It is Westminster/Unionists, her Party, who are trashing the UK economy.

    Davidson is using false figures. No doubt that will be pointed out to her. Who would join a Unionist Party, if they cared about Scotland. Very few, especially after what Thatcher secretly and illegally did to Scotland. Broke every Ministerial Code in the book. Their pool is very limited. The Tories can be contained in Scotland but unfortunately not in the rest of the UK. They will not wash in Scotland. What Mundell was doing with his beard is disgusting. The Tories make folk sick and attack the vulnerable.

    Some tax evading Labour MP’s can be contained in England by the people.

  383. Another Union Dividend
    Ignored
    says:

    Very good article in The herald by Iain MacWhirter explaining how Scotland could opt out of Brexit

    https://archive.is/nDYbU

  384. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    The Pollster are (deliberately) mis- analysing the figures, to influence political decisions. Gerrymandering elections and getting away with it. This is illegal. They should either be fined and sanctioned. Or the Pollsters should be sacked, especially if they are being funded by (Scottish) public taxpayers money. Incompetent Academics.

  385. Free Scotland
    Ignored
    says:

    @Almannysbunnet at 8:55

    I agree. These opinion polls were put out there to coincide with the Express’s and the Mail’s concerted moan of “Here we go again.” Either that or the polls were intended to create an atmosphere of expectation among the electorate which could translate into pressure on the First Minister.

    Either way, the people of Scotland have had their awakening, and they’re not dimwits by any means, although the media attempt to treat them as such.

  386. galamcennalath
    Ignored
    says:

    I sense a very dangerous positive feed back loop has been set up in England.

    1. The ruling elite have ignored the fears and concerns of ordinary people

    2. Ordinary people are frustrated and angry at being ignored

    3. The ruling elite call a referendum and a right wing faction promises solutions to those fears and concerns

    4. Many ordinary people take the promises at face value and support the proposals

    5. The ruling elite now prepare to renege on promised solutions

    6. Ordinary people’s anger and frustration at having their wishes and concerns ignored will be reinforced.

    This will not end well for England.

    The idea that Boris Johnson could be PM after what he has just done should be preposterous.

  387. Andrew McLean
    Ignored
    says:

    Forsyth the so called “peer” or even funnier “lord” on the English state propaganda radio Scottish branch office this morning,

    “Don’t you dare, you sweaty jocks talk to me, an Englishman about things you are genetically unable to understand. For I am a English Lord and so are superior, and empowered by the God of the Englishman and By her Britannic Majesty God Bless Her Mam, to instruct you to get back in your box least you disturb the kicking we English are giving to Johnny foreigner. For was it not said that to be Born an Englishman was to win life’s lottery, and me a shining example of that class of superior man.”

  388. Famous15
    Ignored
    says:

    Call Kaye caller blaming it all on Nicola Sturgeon for not being down in London and sorting it all out.

    Tory Government ,where are you ? Call Kaye caller thinks SNP should kick you into action! I thought that was what they were trying to do!

  389. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    Lord Forsyth was Thatcher henchman. He knew what Thatcher was doing and illegally kept the secrets to line his own pockets, Forsyth was party to the fraud which killed and impoverished people. He is Party to the present destruction of the UK/world economy. A complete liar.

  390. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    Mr Osborne moved to calm the markets this morning. He has indicated tax hikes and more public spending cuts. If anybody thinks that we will do well by leaving the EU, the truth is just around the corner ,and heading our way

    These events will add to the movement to leave the UK. The party of low taxation is about to reverse that guiding principal big time.Watch support for the union sink as it takes effect.

  391. Scot Finlayson
    Ignored
    says:

    EU Referendum Debate from Brussels on BBC Parliament,

    Juncker on,

    http://tinyurl.com/m4my8z7

  392. Tam Jardine
    Ignored
    says:

    Famous15

    Did you hear the wine importer on call Kaye- lifelong conservative voter disgusted by the result.

    Certain we need to stay in the EU… only person talking sense is Nicola Sturgeon…

    Amazing stuff. Lightbulbs pinging on all over the shop at the moment.

  393. galamcennalath
    Ignored
    says:

    I note from comments she has made that Davidson is trying to deflect Team Scotland onto being part of the UK/EU negotiations and that it is all about access to EU markets.

    It’s about Scotland staying fully in the EU by whatever means. Is Davidson trying to undermine the referendum result in Scotland? Probably!

    The debate at 2pm will be interesting.

  394. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    @galamcennalath

    Boris was always ridiculous, though his personal popularity made him a possibility. The real danger was always Osborne or May. Both of them idealists, dangerous, elitist and connected. Hunt ‘I think’, though appealing to some as a halfway house, doesn’t command the same level of support as the others.

    Now Osborne has ruled himself out…

    Eyes on May as Bojo’s real competition.

  395. Hamish100
    Ignored
    says:

    BBC RUK STATE Broadcaster– 5 Live this morning. BBC English journalist SPEAKING TO English (EX LOSSIEMOUTH?)councillor & Leave campaigner in Moray. Described as the “..most leavish place in Scotland..”. Due to the military bases, ex fishermen etc. Leading questions over Scotland eagerly set the complainant on the rant that Scotland shouldn’t be allowed an independence vote as we are British and SNP are bad and Nicola Sturgeon is bad.

    Any comeback from the BBC –no, Pass to English lady in 5 Live studios in London. Any alternative view, No.

    Why do I feel we are in an occupied country.

  396. Nana
    Ignored
    says:

    Tories amendment to today’s debate

    https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/747712787925835776

  397. Juteman
    Ignored
    says:

    Someone just mentioned Scotland on the live broadcast from the Euro Parliament.

  398. Dr Jim
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruth Davidson or any of the Tories shouldn’t be allowed any opinion on anything it was their party squabbling with itself that got us into this mess so I certainly hope the FM and every other party MSP gives them what they’ve given Scotland

    A Rubber Ear

  399. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    OOFT! Telt!

    Juncker pulling no punches on Farage and UK.

    Well? What did they expect?

  400. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Peter Craig says:
    28 June, 2016 at 1:50 am

    I am sure there’s a cogent thought in there somewhere, good luck finding it. (Pretty sure posting whilst in possession of bottle Scotch = Dumb

    Ruby replies

    Your post made perfect sense!

    I understand how you feel about not being informed.

    Most of the time my head is spinning trying to get to the truth.

    It’s just too easy for the MSM/politicians to manipulate an uninformed public.

    Please keep posting even if you only do it when you are in possession of a bottle of Scotch.

    I can hardly string a sentence together when I’m stone cold sober but I don’t let that bother me.

    Whether it’s the English taxpayer who subsidise Scotland or it’s the bank the conclusion is that being part of the so called ‘Most successful Union in the history of the world the universe & everything’ has resulted in Scotland being skint.

    On saying that I really don’t know if Scotland is skint or not.

  401. Kevin Evans
    Ignored
    says:

    I’ve read and heard a few times now and with greater intention lately that 60% voted remain and 40% voted leave.

    We need to nip this in the bud right now before its branded around as fact.

    Remain 62% – leave 38%

  402. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    @Nana

    Chunky Mark didnae miss an hit the wa’.

    The fella nailed it.

  403. Ian Brotherhood
    Ignored
    says:

    @Ken500 (9.17) –

    ‘What Mundell was doing with his beard is disgusting.’

    That’s a keeper.

  404. Free Scotland
    Ignored
    says:

    @Dr Jim at 10:01

    A rubber ear – and maybe a wee rotten egg, or a fusty tomato thrown in for good measure?

  405. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    Juncker imposes presidential ban on meetings with UK officials until Article 50 triggered.

    OOFT!

    Again.

  406. ahundredthidiot
    Ignored
    says:

    O/T

    Why isn’t someone from visitscotland running a TV ad abroad inviting potential tourists to take a trip ‘north of the wall’ off the back of a popular tv show.

    And if we’re accused of being divisive…..so what.

  407. Capella
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Kevin Evans – good point. Add to that the fact that 16 – 18 year olds and EU citizens were denied the vote – otherwise it would have been much higher than 62% Remain.

  408. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    If Labour MP’s want to resign their position. Resign their position and have by-elections. If they do not support their democratically elected leader. Most of the Labour MP’s are a disgrace. Absolutely appalling.

    John Woodcock is the one who wants to continue to spend £205Billion on Trident. Obsolete weaponry. Impoverishing his constituents.

  409. Anagach
    Ignored
    says:


    Ian Brotherhood says:
    @Ken500 (9.17) –

    ‘What Mundell was doing with his beard is disgusting.’

    Apes, aren’t we all.

    At least it was self grooming and not the person in front of him.

  410. Nana
    Ignored
    says:

    @Macart Check out his other video on Bawbag, had me in stitches.

    @Ian Brotherhood these elder ‘satesmen’ get peckish in the commons. Here’s Broon having a snack

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgL-gwm9snY

  411. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    FAO STOOGIE WOOGIE

    I just had a great idea on how I could get my newly created YES sticker to stick to my car window but unfortunately I chucked out my tax disc holder. I just knew when I was clearing out my clutter there would be something I would need in future.

    https://db.tt/DNYgJ5Kh
    YES with stars

    https://db.tt/ohhqpyy5
    just YES

    I think these are the right size for the tax disc holder but I’m not sure.

    I was wondering if my wee pal ‘Stoogie Woogie’ could do my a favour.

    Pretty please Stoogie: Can you download one of these stickers cut it out carefully and see if it fits in your tax disc holder. I just know that you’ll have kept yours being that you are ‘sensible’

    Thanks so much you’re a poppet.
    Perhaps you could also laminate it before putting it in the tax disc holder to make it look nice & shiny.

  412. ahundredthidiot
    Ignored
    says:

    Farage on euronews, disgrace.

    What this man has achieved is simply stunning.

    He will go down in British history alright. Big time.

  413. sandycraig
    Ignored
    says:

    Not normally a fan o Piers Morgan but he did put that woos Branson on the spot this morning.

    So if you don’t like the result of the referendum let’s have another one, fine, so that means Iceland have to play England again?

    Let’s have the best of three then or five.

    I know Virgin is a huge company and employs thousands of people but he is an egotistical arsehole.

    Al Dossary good post for us that know little about facts and figures of the oil outputs.

    sandvig craigusson

  414. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    @Nana

    Eeeeewww!

  415. Almannysbunnet
    Ignored
    says:

    I fear we might be blocked from staying in Europe by Europeans looking at David Coburn and thinking Non! and whatever the French is for “nae if he’s coming with you”.

  416. Ian Brotherhood
    Ignored
    says:

    @Nana –

    I suspect I know which Gordy clip you’re referring to so I’m not even clicking it, just in case – even the thought of it has fair put me off my croissant.

    Does the activity recorded happen to have it’s own song which starts something like this? –

    *’Everybody’s doing it, doing it, doing it…’*

  417. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    Farage currently destroying any hope of concessions from the EU,ably assisted by Marie let Pen. Would not want to be on EU negotiating team

  418. Les Wilson
    Ignored
    says:

    The leave camp are back peddling as fast as they can, ” we need to consider everything very carefully before issuing the section 50 clause.”

    They are kicking leave into the long grass as they realise just what they have done. Promises unraveling as fast as they can.
    It is all a bloody mess and really shows up our ruling class.

    They have brought serious brexit consequences to the doors of everyone across these islands, having given no prior thought as to what would actually come about, in the event of them actually winning. These people are total self centered devious deceivers who have no morals.

    The SNP are doing the right thing, by pursuing International exposure and building support between European countries and Scotland.
    We do not need to suffer this stuff anymore, we, can do something about it, we must do it and put our own country onto a level footing. No fudges, no compromise.

    The usual culprits are starting to up the propaganda on to Scotland yet again, let us work hard in exposing them to the public at large.
    The emperor has no clothes, and it ain’t pretty. It will not stop them robbing us, only we, can do that.

  419. Meindevon
    Ignored
    says:

    Heavens! Farage just totally insulted the EU Parliamnet and then said but if you treat us right we’ll be your best friends.

    Cheered on by Marine le Pen and her rabble. Says it all!

  420. DerekM
    Ignored
    says:

    Wht is Farage sitting in the EU parliament today why is UKIP even allowed in the building.

    Come on EU show them the door get security to escort them from the building and tell them to get article 50 under way or you will.

  421. mealer
    Ignored
    says:

    Ian Brotherhood 10.11

    More than can be said for Joe Hart.

  422. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    Farague is telling total lies in the EU Parliament. A total liar. An alcoholic who makes bad decisions.
    An absolute farce. A danger in to society. 17 years to trash the British economy. It is a wonder the EU Parliament doesn’t throw him out.

    The EU costs the UK £12Billion which comes back. It cost nothing but brings benefits. Farague is an absolute disgrace. What a total lying idiot.

    Farague or Le Pen do not speak for France or the UK they can’t even get elected there. They represent a tiny minority in both places.

    The population in France has fallen (even with migration). Along with most of the countries in Europe.

    If the Farague and Le Pen do not agree with the EU what are they doing there. Milking the public purse for £Millions.

  423. Nana
    Ignored
    says:

    @Macart

    Everything about Broon makes me go EEEEWWWW YUK

    Ian, not this video but I think the content is the same as the one you allude to. His mammy obviously never told him to stop his bad habits.

  424. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    What Bob Mack said.

    Farage has just fucked up big time for the UK.

    Dear God, how did this cretin ever achieve office? All he had to do was keep his face shut. In one speech he’s managed to piss off pretty much everyone, but came pretty close to simply and nakedly threatening Germany.

    That future negotiating team is not going to have a good day at work.

  425. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    I’m a bit confused re reference to Mundell’s beard.

    Are you referring to the hair on his face or the the lady who communicates with sign language? V

    Everytime I see or hear about Mundell’s hairy face I think Ewok.

    Once I’ve finished with the YES stickers I’m planning a Ewok/Mundell photo collage!

  426. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Les Wilson says:
    28 June, 2016 at 10:34 am

    The leave camp are back peddling as fast as they can, ” we need to consider everything very carefully before issuing the section 50 clause.”

    Ruby replies

    Surely they should have considered everything very carefully before having a referendum.

    I am just so glad I didn’t spend a single minute of my time on the EU Ref.

  427. Macart
    Ignored
    says:

    Alyn Smith receiving a standing ovation from the chamber.

    🙂

  428. Orri
    Ignored
    says:

    not seen anyone else mentioning it so I will.

    At the start of the night the markets seemed certain Remain had on. That’s why Farage was so quick to convert even before counting began.

    There’s two possibilities.

    The first is that postal votes weren’t mixed in and were being counted before those from polling stations had arrived. I seem to remember that a reference to that was made live on TV. Makes sense as why cart the votes all the way to scattered locations only to have to hump them back again.

    The second is that the market prediction was based on their own unofficial exit polls.

    Once again we might have a disparity between postal and ballots on the day. Once again there may be no way of challenging the result due to suspected mass fraud because no official records of that disparity exist.

  429. Juteman
    Ignored
    says:

    Wow! Standing ovation for Alyn Smith MEP!
    “Scotland did not let Europe down, now don’t Europe let Scotland down.”

  430. gordoz
    Ignored
    says:

    Alyn Smith just received a standing ovation in the EU parliament for his plea to not let Scotland down !

    BBC Parliament now

  431. Nana
    Ignored
    says:

    @Macart

    I rather think after what Farage said last evening about some of the leavers trying to backtrack, his intention today was to insult the EU in order to cause more trouble.

    Not going to archive this article just in case anyone here feels the need to correct his assertions.

    http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2016/06/28/another-scottish-referendum-could-kill-off-independence

  432. Silver19
    Ignored
    says:

    Mundell was eating bites of his beard see here :-
    https://twitter.com/jakeyapp/status/747450196330700801

  433. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    Scotland representative gets standing ovation.

  434. Tam Jardine
    Ignored
    says:

    Farage in the EU Parliament- what an arrogant moronic performance. In the clip (which I am not sure how to link to without supporting the Guardian) as he pontificates and insults everyone else in the chamber folk are laughing at him. One guy has his hand on his face.

    Telling the EU that they have more to lose in terms of trade than we do.

    I hope Nicola makes it clear to the EU that this clown does not speak for us.

    I am not able to follow the coverage today but I sincerely hope that our SNP MEPs can get a chance to speak as it is imperative that we put as much distance between ourselves and this Little Englander mentality.

  435. wee e
    Ignored
    says:

    Today’s (Tuesday 28th) inadvertent news from the Victoria Darbyshire show, it’s “over to Brussells to hear Nigel Farrage”: but when they did this again at 10:48, what they got was aothern MEP passionately reminding the others that Scotland voted in — to huge applause — the Beeb cut away toute-de-suite just as the members began to rise for a standing ovation.
    “Er, that was a Scottish MEP” Victoria mumbles. “Anyway, er…” (Back to the studio guest, quick!)

  436. Dr Jim
    Ignored
    says:

    Alyn Smith MEP just received massive applause and support in the EU Parliament for Scotland’s place to be kept in the EU

    I can’t do the Technical stuff but if anybody can get it you need to see this

  437. Nana
    Ignored
    says:

    If you missed Alyn Smith standing ovation

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/747729114828779521?lang=en-gb

  438. Les Wilson
    Ignored
    says:

    Alyn Smith just got a brilliant standing ovation in the Euro debate. Looks like we are really building bridges.
    ” Scotland did not let Europe down,do not let Scotland down!”

    Huge support given.

  439. Brian Doonthetoon
    Ignored
    says:

    Hi Ruby.

    75mm diameter fits a tax disc holder. Here’s the one I have on my wee two seater.

    https://sites.google.com/site/webgaffer/home/badge-designs/Unicorn3-46mm-SAMPLE.jpg

  440. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    Belgium ex PM tells Fargue that he has an offshore account and has been collecting his EU (public) salary (to fund the offshore a/c) for 17 years. For 17years Farague has been trying to trash the UK economy so he could tax evade.

    Farague has been funding a political Party with public money for 17years. That is illegal in the UK.
    Farage is a crook.

  441. Robert J. Sutherland
    Ignored
    says:

    Undeadshaun @ 7:08

    Quite a lot of articles as you would expect, though England does appear to be a laughing stock.

    We need much more of this here at home. It’s the polar opposite of the GERS diversionary crap. Get people laughing at the UK sailing off into the sunset, pith helmet on, a puffed-up little Captain Waggett at the helm while the crew go around doing funny walks, and you will likely convert more people than by any amount of earnest reasoning.

  442. galamcennalath
    Ignored
    says:

    The stay-in-the-OKUK hinge pins, Darling and Brown, have no right to remain silent on the unfolding chaos. It’s time they voiced some regrets!

  443. gordoz
    Ignored
    says:

    Alyn Smith Standing Ovation here – on SNP twitter website

    Worth a watch

    Twitter.com/theSNP?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

  444. Breeks
    Ignored
    says:

    Boris as PM would be the absolute end.

    Heseltine I think I caught called on the Brexiteers to be put in charge of the EU negotiations and sorting out the mess they created. I get the drift, but putting these gibbons in charge would be a monumental error of judgement. They have brought England to its knees, and cannot deliver what the baying mob they have awoken were promised. I cannot see it ending well.
    England faces it’s bleakest period of turmoil since WW2, and needs leadership and judgement like never before. Sadly it seems lacking in both.
    Juncker clearly isn’t going to compromise over article 50, and that is the real politique. Westminster should bite the bullet and attempt to exit with a degree of integrity and whatever positive empathy they can find. Putting a screaming ape like Boris at the negotiating table is in nobody’s best interests, not even Boris himself.
    Cut to the chase England. You are out of Europe. Get over it. Start seeing the EU as a foreign market with whom you need constructive discourse. I’ll perhaps refrain from using the word cordial; the miracle you need is big enough.

    Furthermore, think hard about your attitude towards Scotland. Scotland WILL be staying in Europe. Scotland will be exiting the UK. These are events which are now beyond your control. How you deal with them will set the tone of relations between our countries for decades. If you want our friendship, respect and sympathy, then quid pro quo, now is the time to give us yours.

  445. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    The one’s who caused the migration in Europe is Westminster/Unionist, France and US illegal wars.

  446. Petra
    Ignored
    says:

    Just got in at the tail end of someone representing Scotland standing up in the EU Parliament and passionately saying …. ending with …. ”Scotland did not let you down. Please do not let Scotland down.” Followed by loud clapping with someone standing up (did more individuals do so?) and then it was cut off.

    ……………………….

    Great to have you back Nana. Thanks for the fantastic links.

    ………………………..

    Farage at the EU Parliament. He’s an utter disgrace (you laughed at me 17 years ago but you’re not laughing now – none of you have done a days work in your life etc, etc) and has just made it extremely difficult for Westminster to get any kind of decent ‘deal’ at all. Additionally doing his utmost to decimate the EU in totality. Farage one of the many ignorant, hate-filled a**holes that we didn’t elect running the show that’s impacting so negatively on Scotland.

    ……………………..

    As I read it (from the experts) there’s no way that Scotland can remain part of the UK and be a member of the EU following the trigger of Article 50 and the 2 year negotiatory period winding up. Scotland will have to be a Nation in it’s own right to become a member of the EU hence having to get our Independence first. Nicola will know this too but has to go through the motions to ensure that everything is above board to get people like Davidson / Westminster off of her back. Meanwhile UK debt is racking up and we seemingly have to pay a share of that when we leave, Uumm …. can be disputed.

    ……………………………

    @ Bob Mack says ”I cannot imagine England agreeing to return our territorial waters without a major struggle. It would not matter if the EU agreed as England would no longer be a member and not obliged to follow EU law.”

    Bob, Craig Murray is an expert in that field. Listen to what he has to say.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfbfldSrJ-0

  447. sandycraig
    Ignored
    says:

    Alyn Smith ovation.

    WOW huge lump in my throat now. I posted yesterday that I thought we had many friends in Europe. This shows clearly what they think of brexit.

    Our time has come.

  448. John Edgar
    Ignored
    says:

    UK – KO! What a shambolic situation at Westminster. Cameron, a lame duck PM, soon to be no more, still pontificating on Scotland where he has but one MP. No Brexit plan, no invoking of Article 50 – too feart, all aces in the EU hands and still the entitled deluded English leaders still vow the EU will come round.
    Klunking fist has gone to ground!! Nota cheep!
    Labour in turmoil, Scottish Labour edging slowly towards an independent stance, yet hesitant, yet at least moving!
    Mundell and Davidson spouting the usual nonsense about the UK as our best bet. At least, Klunking fist is mot uttering pooling and sharing and broad shoulders. No vows, pledges or what?
    LabourPLP talks about electing a parliamentary leader with Corbyn as Party Leader. Is that two parties now? Where does Slab fit? Does that mean two shadow cabinets et al? One Slab MP? One could not make it up?
    If Article 50 is not activated, will the EU be forced to isolate the UK within its systems? The English and Welsh voted to leave, they should be pressing their leaders to act decisively.
    Shambolic, just like the Euro exit of the Rnglish team. A double whammy. Where is Evel noo?

  449. Orri
    Ignored
    says:

    In a moment of madness I pondered.

    What if there’s no genuine intent to leave the EU and this is all related to something people went into regarding Greece. Countries with high national debt sometimes find the last resort is to devalue. In the UK we had two forces opposed to that one being Sterling is oil backed. The other being financial institutions in charge who would lose more than the ordinary punter. Wouldn’t a clever Chancellor faced with a genuine need to save the country deliberately cause a devaluation nominally outwith his control.

    Then I remembered, it’s Gideon.

  450. Petra
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Nana says at 10:59 am …. ”If you missed Alyn Smith standing ovation.”

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/747729114828779521?lang=en-gb

    BRILLIANT NANA x Thanks for that and did you notice Farage’s torn git face!

  451. Flower of Scotland
    Ignored
    says:

    @BDTT 11.01

    That’s really lovely! Another one to print out for my window.

    Standing ovation for Alyn Smith at the EU. Also for Sinn Fein from NI.

    I’m thinking there is a wee bit of backtracking from Tories unhappy with Brexit. Murmurings about a vote to ratify the conditions of withdrawal from the EU. Wouldn’t be at all surprised if they have a plan to overrule Brexit, but slowly, slowly so English voters don’t notice.

  452. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    Corbyn who could bore for Britain is the only English MP doing anything useful. The rest are crap.

  453. Robert J. Sutherland
    Ignored
    says:

    nana,

    Thanks for that link to the photo. But what I found most instructive were all the foul anti-Scottish comments attached.

    It should be shown to Scot-buts everywhere.

    Farage being obnoxious in the EU Parliament – great! Puts any chance of a smooth deal for the UK in the bin, and gives Scotland a great boost.

    Great job, Alyn Smith. (But where are the Scottish Labour MEP’s?)

  454. Ken500
    Ignored
    says:

    The ‘psycho bastards’ have even ruined Wimvbledon

  455. Nana
    Ignored
    says:

    @Petra

    Alyn was terrific, had a lump in my throat watching him and then seeing farage looking fair glum made me lol

  456. msean
    Ignored
    says:

    Everything is on hold for three months till the Tories sort out some stuff,meanwhile,the pound stabilises,nothing to do with suddenly finding a possible £250b down the back of the couch. Where has this financial backing been? I’m guessing that someone is paying somewhere,sometime,but they won’t be Tories.

  457. Tam Jardine
    Ignored
    says:

    I just watched Alyn Smith’s plea to the EU and the response and I must have something in my eye. Just incredible- where there is a will on both sides (and it certainly appears to be so) there is a way.

    If they say we must be independent then so be it. I cannot imagine it being possible otherwise. And why would we want any other status than as a full member state?

    Slab want some kind of fudge as usual… eu-nano. Sometimes compromise is a good thing and sometimes it leaves you with an outcome worse than the two options.

    Why do we have to endure this mish-mash of governance for ever? Kind of run by London, kind of run by Holyrood with a part time membership of the EU as an associate member… Haven’t we learnt anything from devolution?

    This “process” we are on- lets just get to the end of it rather than dream up new ways of extending it and convoluting it in order to drag out this failed marriage interminably.

    I have great confidence we will win the next referendum and so I would bring it on as soon as possible.

    The EU will help make this all happen- of this I am sure but we have a power of hard work to do and we should not be afraid of that. And we are now on a clock.

    Just as there are risks in bringing this forward early there are also risks in delay.

    Fortune favours the brave and now is the time to show our quality and get out of the shadow of Westminster forever.

    As the death star descends into abject chaos we have to ask- who will be our next government? Conservatives? Some kind of pro-leave amalgamation? To hell with that. The UK government is reeling and disorientated now but this will not last forever.

    I am proud as hell of Alyn Smith, our FM and Scotland today.

    Lets do this.

  458. Socrates MacSporran
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruby@ 10.50am.

    “Surely they should have considered everything very carefully before having a referendum.”

    The thing is Ruby, that well-known European, Mrs Elizabeth Mountbatten-Windsor Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg did not remind the voters of England – as she had reminded us Scots before our referendum in 2014 to: “Think very carefully”.

    Had Mrs M-W S-H-S-G intervened, enough of us old coffin dodgers might have voted for Remain.

  459. galamcennalath
    Ignored
    says:

    Petra says:

    “Alan Smith”

    Wow! Best scene I have ever seen from any parliament!

  460. Nana
    Ignored
    says:

    Here is the video from the snp. Skytv will most likely delete it soon and besides that the comments are vile

    https://twitter.com/theSNP/status/747732526760787968

  461. donald mac
    Ignored
    says:

    O/T? A colleague who was staunchly NO in 2014 has just said she’s now going to vote YES to an independent Scotland. Never thought she’d change her mind!

    Although I don’t post much in the threads I’m here every day and I’d like to thank WoS and all who contribute for making this site the best place to get news and opinions, links etc

    Proud to be part of it. Thank you all

  462. msean
    Ignored
    says:

    Watched cnn seems to think that we canny afford to go it alone because of low oil price,no one to counter what they assert. Just wondering how that works for the UK,there are 65 milion in it,the same oil would be a bonus for a 5.3 million population. The “ye canny dae it” mantra alive and well. How did that work out in the EU ref?

  463. Petra
    Ignored
    says:

    Great article in The National, yesterday, from George Kerevan. Sorry I can’t post the link. He’s basically saying that he reckons that the Labour Party will split to form new political parties. He’s also heard of some anti-Corbyn MPs speculate about joining up with the remains of the Lib-Dems to create a new centre left party (no be long before wee Willie Winkie changes his mind about supporting Nicola, lol).

    Great stuff. Keep it up. Westminster’s shambolic state can only be helpful for our cause. Drive even more people into voting Yes next time round.

    No word from the Unions? I wonder what they’re making of the Labour fiasco.

  464. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    What a bloody mess. Nicola should be running the UK never mind Scotland.

    This is all unravelling for the Tories. If they have concoccted a plan to put Brexit into the long grass they are finished .UKIP will take over. The strength of the English Brexit vote indicates the strength of English isolationism, but only on their terms..

    They won’t tolerate being sidelined by the government who promised their vote would be respected.

    Labour are self evisceration as we write.

    The vacuum in the UK is palpable and is a breeding ground for the rise of UKIP.
    Then what? The time for action is ,or should be ,very near before this happens.

  465. Robert J. Sutherland
    Ignored
    says:

    Re Alyn Smith video – I’m not a Twitterer, so the vid doesn’t work for me, alas.

    Could someone put it onto Youtube please…?

  466. Juteman
    Ignored
    says:

    The reaction from the other MEPs to Alyns speech said it all. We are welcome. We can do this.

  467. cirsium
    Ignored
    says:

    What ScottieDog said at 6.53am

    I believe we should look to a small country like Iceland with its own currency and central bank. Sounds good to me. It is interesting to note that Iceland has withdrawn its application for membership of the EU

    Here is Iceland’s President, Ólafur Ragnar Grímsson, explaining the feelings of his countrymen:
    “We were wise enough not to follow the traditional prevailing orthodoxies of the Western financial world in the last 30 years. We introduced currency controls, we let the banks fail, we provided support for the poor, and we didn’t introduce austerity measures like you’re seeing in Europe. Why are the banks considered to be the holy churches of the modern economy? Why are private banks not like airlines and telecommunication companies and allowed to go bankrupt if they have been run in an irresponsible way? The theory that you have to bail out banks is a theory that you allow bankers enjoy their own profit, their success, and then let ordinary people bear their failure through taxes and austerity. “

    Contrast this with the the words of Jean-Claude Juncker, President of the EU (and the former finance minister then prime minister who turned Luxembourg into one of the world’s great money laundering centres):-

    Il ne peut y avoir de choix démocratique contre les traités européens

    Translation: There can be no democratic choice against the European treaties

  468. Nana
    Ignored
    says:

    @Robert J Sutherland

    I posted the video Robert at 11.47, just click the link to start it

  469. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    @Cirsium,

    It was a choice of Government to sign up to the Treaties and thus compelled to honour them. They knew the terms and conditions before signing.

    We have negotiated nothing so far and start with a blank canvas. That is a beginning.

    A far as I know Iceland trade is still welcomed in Europe despite their actions.

  470. Almannysbunnet
    Ignored
    says:

    Faradge proclaiming loudly that the London stock market was on the rise and everything was fine. You might not want to boast too early Nigel!
    Angela Merkel just announced in the German parliament that there will be no cherry picking by the UK. Out is out. Ex Italian PM Mario Monti, “UK will not be allowed access to the single market” he sees the only solution as a Norway style deal where they pay virtually the same into the EU, must allow free movement of citizens but get zero say on how the EU run.

    This is where you get with your old Etonian green fields of England arrogance!

    By the way don’t pick me up on my spelling of Faradge, I know what I’m doing.

  471. Scot Finlayson
    Ignored
    says:

    Farage who represents the people of England and Wales was laughed at by the representatives of the 27 nations of the EU,

    Alyn Smith who represents the citizens of Scotland was given a standing ovation by the representatives of the 27 nations of the EU,

    and unlike in the defunct mother of parliaments they were allowed to clap and cheer.

  472. starlaw
    Ignored
    says:

    If Westminster decides on an other GE could SNP turn this into an independence vote on the same election.

  473. mike cassidy
    Ignored
    says:

    Here’s where Jeremy Hunt set out his post-brexit plan.

    http://archive.is/UQBda

    The arrogance is staggering.

    We’re divorcing you.

    We want the most attractive settlement agreement possible.

    And if we don’t get it, we won’t sign the divorce papers.

    Oh, please let him win the Tory leadership campaign!

  474. Capella
    Ignored
    says:

    Interesting article in The National about Scotland’s long history of European connections.

    http://www.thenational.scot/culture/scotland-back-in-the-day-scots-have-always-been-good-europeans-thats-why-we-voted-to-stay.19303

  475. heedtracker
    Ignored
    says:

    Work really really funny today. Just whistle start of Vindaloo near English sports fans and…, can barely get just first peep of Vindaloo out before cracking up. Another sweatie’s come back from shops with Iceland shopping bags:D

  476. Dr Jim
    Ignored
    says:

    @Everybody

    Even if you didn’t see Alyn Smith following Nana’s link
    You won’t believe it but the BBC are showing it although they do cut some of the ovation out

    Can’t get over all this the BBC allowing something good about Scotland on the telly

  477. mealer
    Ignored
    says:

    Could we have a link,please,to Alyn Smiths speech to the EU parliament?

  478. Robert J. Sutherland
    Ignored
    says:

    nana,

    Many thanks for that, short but very sweet! (It only lacks the full standing ovation at the end.)

    circium,

    You seem to be trying to re-visit the EUref all on your own. The results north and south werei clear enough, so what’s the point?

    Right now the EUref result is one of the best levers for indy we have ever had. It has changed the minds of many for “yes”. So why try to re-visit that now, FGS?

    First things first. Independence. After that is achieved you are welcome to try your luck with another EUexit if you want.

  479. Capella
    Ignored
    says:

    Some very interesting tweets on the SNP twitter now. Nicola will meet European Parliament President and expects to meet JC Junker soon.
    https://twitter.com/STVColin/status/747750996135251968

  480. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    Just for information. The president if Iceland Grimsson has been in post for 20 years and has executive power.

    He is stepping down due to revelations in the Panama papers Re his and his wife’s tax dealings.

    “Who will guard the guards”

  481. Capella
    Ignored
    says:

    here’s another. The delightful Ruth hissing “no”.
    https://twitter.com/Zarkwan/status/747749539705131009

  482. Clapper57
    Ignored
    says:

    Apologies if mentioned by others :

    No deal to build a new generation of Royal Navy warships will be signed until it offers “value for money”, Defence Secretary Michael Fallon has said.

    MP’s heard claims the project to build eight Type 26 frigates on the Clyde had been delayed due to the Ministry of Defence’s attempts to save money.

    Manufacturing of the Type 26s was initially expected to start in 2016,
    Confirmation of when the work will begin has still to be announced.

    I say this :

    Scotland will be way way way down in the pecking order when money dished out post Europe exit….we MUST MUST MUST leave UK because if we do not we are fcuked fcuked fcuked.

    No voters please think long and hard and realise that the reality of a far right Tory government will ensure that they will seek to appease and win over the English electorate as they, the English electorate, hold the power to Tory success in General elections…..”Scotland is not our problem” said Cameron.

    Ruth Davidson was keen to promote the voice of the 55% but is not so keen to promote the voice of the 62% , neither is Mundell.

    I say to all No voters , please remember what they, the Tories and their BT friends , tried to do/have done post Indy Ref based on the infamous vow……Do you really think a far right Tory government will represent YOU and your country’s best interests as part of a BREXIT UK …I think not.

    By the same token I would not trust any of the other Unionist parties either….a parcel of rogues is not who I want to govern my country…..now is the time , if we do not take this opportunity then our country will truly be finished.

    I am so raging that we could be taken out of Europe, and once again not by OUR decision but by a country who holds the REAL power in this Disunited Kingdom . NOT IN MY NAME. I am Scottish and European ALWAYS…… NOT British.

  483. yesindyref2
    Ignored
    says:

    @Macart
    The problem in the European Parliament is that while each of the 73 UK MEPs receives on average 1.5% of the votes of people in the UK, Farage now represents 52% of the people of the UK, in some respects, because of the EU Referendum. That’s something the other 72 MEPs need to put a stop to, perhaps by putting forward some sort of motion of continuing membership until the A50, and the UK actually leaving.

    Can’t see the Alyn Smith clip, but brilliant for him, and if he received a standing ovation, incredibly unbelievably excellent news for Scotland. He’s the star of the moment.

  484. Petra
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Robert J. Sutherland says at 11:47 am ”Re Alyn Smith video – I’m not a Twitterer, so the vid doesn’t work for me, alas. Could someone put it onto Youtube please…?”

    Robert the youtube video cuts short the standing ovation. Can’t you just click on the original Twitter link? It should work for you.

  485. Jack Murphy
    Ignored
    says:

    Here’s the 2 Alyn Smith MEP Speech/Standing Ovation from the European Parliament:-

    It’s a BBC Link
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-36649450



Comment - please read this page for comment rules. HTML tags like <i> and <b> are permitted. Use paragraph breaks in long comments. DO NOT SIGN YOUR COMMENTS, either with a name or a slogan. If your comment does not appear immediately, DO NOT REPOST IT. Ignore these rules and I WILL KILL YOU WITH HAMMERS.




↑ Top