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Wings Over Scotland

Is it even worth bothering?

Posted on May 20, 2013 by

With the latest Westminster fearbomb, we mean. We’ve covered the pensions thing in considerable detail already, so the Treasury’s attack was outdated before it was even launched. It’s becoming increasingly plain with every passing day than an independent Scotland would be better off financially than the rest of the UK (unless we get “more powers” after a No vote, that is), so why would it have more difficulty paying pensions?


After all, the UK government didn’t put the effort in to construct an even minimally coherent case, so frankly we don’t see why we should. We’re going for a pie.

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106 to “Is it even worth bothering?”

  1. I do wonder if the No lot have just decided the only way they can win is to make sure enough people are thoroughly scunnered about the whole thing by the time of the actual vote.

    The relentless negativity is starting to get me down, I know that! 🙁

  2. seoc says:

    Where are their figures in support of this silly suggestion?

  3. Another London Dividend says:

    Sir George Mathewson trashed the Treasury scaremongering  report on GMS radio this morning.
    An independent Scotland would only be responsible for BoS and Royal Bank customers deposits held at Branches of the bank IN SCOTLAND not for the whole of the UK as the Treasury report claims.  
    But UK government would be responsible for Nat West, LLoyds , customers etc  
    PLus EU guarantee scheme would also come into play.

  4. Macart says:

    Whuh?………………… Nah, I can’t be bothered either.
    Wake me up when they have something meaningful to contribute.

  5. Brian says:

    What kind of pie?

  6. Currywurst says:

    How about some coverage of Jim Sillars’ latest contribution to the debate?

  7. bunter says:

    The report must be rubbish as there isnt the same wall to wall on EBC like last time. Just a wee half hearted bit on the EBC in Scotland this afternoon. Soon to be forgotten methinks.

  8. jr ewen says:

    RBS is 80% owned by uk taxpayer. if scotland gets 8.4% of assets and liabilities that would mean the scottish taxpayer would have a small percentage of ownership. 7% of that 80%. The rUK would still own 73% of RBS.
    where does the liability lie?
    have i got this right.

  9. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “How about some coverage of Jim Sillars’ latest contribution to the debate?”

    I’m unaware of him making one, but I could probably write it myself anyway. Once again – kindly provide sources to things you’re talking about if you want anyone to respond.

  10. Doug Daniel says:

    I wonder if we’re starting to reach the point where even the media thinks “look, can you give us something new, please? You gave us this crap a few months ago and we got ridiculed for going with it then.”
    Incidentally, if anyone’s not seen it yet, Mandy Rhodes’ latest offering in Holyrood Magazine is well worth a read – she’s one of the best journalists we’ve got, and this is a great example why.
    Together with the Denis Healy interview, the latest issue of Holyrood Magazine looks like it’s a bit of a cracker…

  11. HandandShrimp says:

    Hmmm pie
    If financial Armageddon strikes then the UK is screwed, so it is totally academic to the argument. The Treasury are painting by numbers for George and Danny.

  12. SCED300 says:

    I wonder if any of the media in Scotland have asked Johann Lamont questions on any of these issues. It’s as if she has disappeared from the face of the earth, only to be wheeled out at FM Questions.

  13. HighlandMartin says:

    I came out of the pie shop at lunchtime only to find the world was now flat.  Buses are still going though.

    If we’re scunnered now, what will it be like when we get to report 13. I’d go long in rope.

  14. Another London Dividend says:

    Doug Daniel at 1.48
    Oil falsehoods carried on STV web site
    But not a word on BBC Scotland web site … quelle surprise.
    Haven’t seen any TV today but won’t hold my breathe for coverage of this or of Sir George Mathewson’s put down of the Treasury report.

  15. John Lyons says:

    Okay then, how about this for a new way to make Unionist press releases interesting. We’ve had Dictator bingo for which Dictator Salmond will be compared to next. How about some Fearbomb Roulette? Pick a scare or Smear story from the Wheel of misFortune and if the unionists are pedaling it tomorrow you win.
    I pick “All your family that live in England will be foreaign”. (I particularly like this reason to vote no as none of My family live in England. Even the English ones all left for either Scotland or France!)

  16. Jiggsbro says:

    But not a word on BBC Scotland web site

  17. Adrian B says:

    Also from the BBC,
    How do you scrap an aircraft carrier? Obvious really – tow it to a foreign country!

  18. mealer says:

    Of course,without London supervision,Scotch Pies will taste quite revolting because Scottish bakers are totally useless.Bridies will be banned by those power-crazed bureaucrats in Brussels without London to look after our interests.Nobody will want our Scotch because its….well….Scotch.And the NHS in Scotland will crumble without the London Tories to protect it.I’m fair fillin’ my breeks. 

  19. Craig M says:

    John Lyons;
    The sun will never shine again on Scotland once we are independent and we can no longer rely on the Met Office.

  20. muttley79 says:

    Pandas- Offsky if we vote for indy.
    Oil is too volatile- but we will continue sending revenues to Westminster because they have proved how well they used it in the past…
    Trident job losses- MOD says around 500 job losses, Jackie Bailie says 17,000-18,000…
    Currency- No plan B, banknotes will be useless.
    Shetland will break away from Scotland and we will have no oil.
    Protecting England from the Tories @ Gordon Brown et al.  Oh hang on…
    Repeat all over again.
    Repeat all over again.

  21. mealer says:

    Craig M,
    No change there,then.

  22. mato21 says:

    Bridies will be allowed on wedding days

  23. O/T sorry, Rev.  Does anyone personally know a contact in Yes Scotland, the higher up the better?  This is concerning a forthcoming debate at Edinburgh University where BT have lined someone up from their side but Yes are not responding.  If you know someone please email me at the site linked on my name above – just use admin@.

  24. Desimond says:

    John Lyons “Fear Bingo”

    All the Wildcats will suddenly re-appear and destroy Scottish farming

  25. Dal Riata says:

    That noun ‘fearbomb’ is such a great word to describe the Unionist’s tactics. Michelle Obama used it (though in the two-word form, ‘fear bomb’) to describe what the Republicans attempted against her husband Barack Obama in the USA’s 2004 Senate race and again in his bid for the presidency.
    “Michelle Obama often refers to what she calls the “fear bomb” that was used against her husband in his Senate race, as rivals questioned whether someone with his name could be elected.
    Today she acknowledged that it is happening again in his presidential race, and said it’s an example of why America can’t wait for a leader like him to be elected.
    “They threw in the obvious, ultimate fear bomb,” Obama said of her husband’s 2004 Senate race. “We’re even hearing [that] now. … ‘When all else fails, be afraid of his name, and what that could stand for, because it’s different.'” She said rivals use innuendo to play on fears. “Just as they’re saying it now,” she said.
    But, she told about 200 supporters this morning at a restored theater in Canton, Obama won despite that “climate of negativity and doubt” in 2004, and even after standing up against the Iraq war. “We learned, number one, that when power is threatened by real change they will say anything to stop it,” she said. “But we also learned that the American people can handle the truth.”
    What America needs, she added, is a “fundamentally different kind of leadership,” one that challenges people to be different, and better to one another. And that, she said to critics who say it is not his time, cannot wait. “Barack Obama will be the kind of leader we need right now, not in four years or eight years or 12 years,” she said. “We can’t wait to get this right. We need it to happen today.””
    (all bolds are mine)
    Swap the names Obama with Salmond, and America with Scotland and what was said above could apply to what is happening in Scotland – and UK-wide – right now in 2013, and will only get more extreme as we reach 18 September, 2014.

  26. Davy says:

    What a bugger, it now appears our banking/financil sector is too big for the size of our country, and when you combine that with having far to much volitile oil which now also appears to be going to last for a long long time, its a recipe for a disaster.
    With all these resources (renewable energy), whisky, food & drink, etc etc etc and that bloody oil its no wonder we can’t afford pensions.
    I am going to vote YES anyway, just to show the world what will happen to a country with all these advantages, they’ll be sorry.
    Vote YES – and you will never have to hear another load of shite from Westminster/treasury again.
    Alba GU snooker loopy!

  27. Luigi says:

    It is always worth bothering, Rev, no matter how ridiculous the claim. Remember the legions of low information voters out there.

  28. Cath says:

    Mutley you forgot how we’re over-dependent on far too many economic sectors to survive 😉

  29. David McCann says:

    Is it not about time someone  came out and asked the question- Can Scotland afford Britain’s £1.4 TRILLION debt- rising by the day?

  30. Linda's Back says:

    Scotland what a basket case .
    Far too dependent on Oil and Gas and Whisky and financial services.
    Scotland accounts for an estimated 64% of EU oil production and approximately 36% of EU total hydrocarbon production, as outlined below Scotland produces more than half of the Gas in the UK and is the second largest producer in the EU. Wood McKenzie estimate that approximately 85% of remaining UK hydrocarbon reserves lie in Scottish waters
    And Scotland has 25% of the EU’s total offshore renewable capacity.
    25% of UKs total food and drink exports,
    And only the 8th richest country in the world, so how could we possibly survive without the UK Treasury and UK banking regulators.

  31. Robert Bryce says:

    Of course it’s worth bothering Rev we each need to convince one other person.
    Sharlene Spiteri (or whatever her name is) may read this and be yours 🙂

  32. Robert Bryce says:

    Don’t forget about the 26% of all laptop computers sold in Europe being manufactured in Scotland either.

  33. Seanair says:

    If there was a single Westminster Dept you wouldn’t trust to get it right on financial matters it would be the Treasury–IMF bailouts, ERM, over-borrowing etc.
    Why should anyone believe them  now?

  34. cynicalHighlander says:

    We’ll be told our boots are to big next.

  35. sneddon says:

    But seriously….what aboot the pies? 

  36. Jiggsbro says:

    But seriously….what aboot the pies?
    This is an excellent point. So far, we’ve been over-reliant on Brian Taylor to eat them. What happens if he moves south with the rest of the BBC Scotland crew after independence? Piemageddon, that’s what.

  37. handclapping says:

    If an independent Scotland manages to get into the EU then we’ll be able to apply for geographic protection for the Scotch pie and also bridies made within the bounds of the ancient English county of Forfarshire as long as they comply with the General Directive on Appropriate Curvature of Comestibles and we will be able to sell them EU wide and so save ourselves from Piemageddon caused by BT emigration to foreign countries.

  38. Jiggsbro says:

    Where is the legal advice proving that bridies will comply with EU curvature requirements? These claims are all pie in the sky.

  39. Barontorc says:

    Linda, let’s not forget the other side of the ‘book’; we are entitled to 9.2 % of all UK’s assets. We have paid for these over the past 300 years and we’re not talking about the old albums collection.
    We also have a Treaty (contract), between us and the rest of the UK, and as John King put it yesterday (19 May – 4.26), we have a case against several Westminster governments, since the early 70’s for denying information to the Scottish people, by with-holding the McCrone Report.
    That this information would undoubtedly have caused a seismic political shift in attitudes regarding the distribution and use of these oil benefits taken from Scotland and straight into UK coffers, is a no brainer; the very scale of this fraud is monumental. 
    As John King puts it; definition and relevant rules of law concerning this situation are as follows.
    When a contract creates a duty that does not exist at common law, there are three things the parties can do wrong:-
    Nonfeasance is to ignore and take no indicated action – neglect.
    Misfeasance is to take inappropriate action or give intentionally incorrect advice.
    Malfeasance is hostile, aggressive action taken to injure the client’s interests.

    We Scots have been ripped-off to the tune of multi-billions of pounds by successive Westminster governments and it’s coming time to account for that. Is it any wonder Denis Healy tells the truth of it, when he says the present UK gov is terrified of the tiger, or should that be the rampant lion, that’s been unleashed?

  40. Bugger (the Panda) says:

    Seanair says:
    20 May, 2013 at 5:21 pm

    If there was a single Westminster Dept you wouldn’t trust to get it right on financial matters it would be the Treasury–IMF bailouts, ERM, over-borrowing etc.
    Why should anyone believe them  now?
    When I did some economics at Uni, I was appraised that, at the same time Healy was talking about, the Treasury did not do double book entry accountancy (cf how the fuck they hadn’t a clue about where the money came from anbd where it went  GERS no ! to start from) and has no economists (real ones) on their books.
    A close relation by marriage was “invited” to join HM Treasury” and couldn’t tell his debit from his credit.
    and you wonder why the Germans and French look at our economic strategy as a day by day tactical manoeuvre?

  41. Jiggsbro says:

    When a contract creates a duty that does not exist at common law
    What contract exists between Scotland and Westminster that might have been breached?

  42. sneddon says:

    If BT leaves Scotland I’ll volunteer and step up to the plate and eat all the pies.  Not for me but for the children’s sake. 🙂
    “I’m going to the bakers…..I maybe gone some time”

  43. Vronsky says:

    I agree with Luigi, it must be answered – but answered as in chess. Deal with a weak threat by making a strong one.  Economically, somebody is ankle deep in shit and upside down – and it ain’t us.  Let’s point this out, as we go about our day.


  44. scottish_skier says:

    There’ll be no Greggs in an independent Scotland.

  45. Dubbieside says:


    Someone asked about Jim Sillars latest intervention into the indy debate. Here it is from The Telegraph. Warning have your sick bag close when reading.

  46. TYRAN says:

    How come every report they produce just happens to be bad news? It’s uncanny. How does that work into their narrative as shown in the picture above? With the law of averages, surely there must be at least one good report? 

  47. Hetty says:

    Greggs wont be missed, I know someone now retired used to work in their bakery North of England, so I don’t eat Greggs anymore neither does he! 
    Just discussing independence with a young student a friend of my sons, he says that the young folk he speaks to actually think Scotland will be a wait for it…3rd world country if a YES vote! 
    Blimey, still work to do for sure…they quite clearly have no idea regards the destruction of services etc, to their very own detriment and their children’s if they vote no. 

  48. mato21 says:

    Humza was invited to speak at Doha now who should he bump into? None other than Gordy (he must be finished with us), there to give a speech more money no doubt for the office expenses.When does this man represent his constituents, could we have him charged with taking money under false pretences? 
    From Humza
    Bumped into Gordon Brown in lift at Doha Forums – his contribution this morning on development needs of the world was v positive

  49. Yesitis says:

    Breaking News:
    The ever cheery Britnats at No Better Together have announced a new Independence Day type holiday for Scotland. It`s to be named “Happy Scaremongering Day”.
    It will be celebrated every day from now until September 18th, 2014.

  50. dundee bloke says:

    Here’s what George Kerevan has to say about it on facebook
    George Kerevan

    Shock! Horror! The UK Treasury has issued a report suggesting that Scots would be too rich and indolent if the country became independent, because of the size of its banking sector. The Treasury points out that in an indy Scotland the assets of domestic banks would equal 1,250% of GDP. This is exactly half the 2,500% to GDP ratio in Luxembourg. Unfortunately, with one bank per 3,803 people, Luxembourg has suffered from chronic social and economic stability since 1945. Its banks provide a third of GDP and tax revenues. As a result, Luxembourg has the largest household wealth of any Western nation. A Treasury official (who should have been trying to sort the disarray of the British economy instead of interfering in politics) said: “An independent Scotland risks becoming as rich and stable as Luxembourg. Surely this will make them think twice about voting Yes.”

  51. Adrian B says:

    Just heard on Channel 4 news.
    New poll out tomorrow has David Cameron only 2 points ahead of UKIP.

  52. scottish_skier says:

    @Adrian B

    Aye, UKIP+Tory now on 46% running average.

    Labour have lost 5% in just a couple of months and now on 35% – i.e. end of and hopes of a majority territory.

    UKIP-Tory coalition here we come. Already many grassroots Tories calling for it.

    Ed’s fecked.

    What to call UKIP though post 2014? Bummer to have to change the name so close to a GE.

  53. HandandShrimp says:

    I will give Brown this, I think he does care about development. I just wish he would extend it to his own country too.

  54. cynicalHighlander says:

    ‘What to call UKIP though post 2014?’

  55. Jiggsbro says:

    What to call UKIP though post 2014?
    UKIP, because rUK will insist on remaining as ‘UK’.

  56. dundee bloke says:

    Scottish Skier,
    What to call UKIP though post 2014? Bummer to have to change the name so close to a GE.
    HaHa, good one

  57. Dal Riata says:

    Yes, that UKIP-post-Scottish-referendum-Yes-result-conundrum is a cracker, isn’t it! What will they do? Keep their name? That would be hilarious if they did…
    UKIP emergency session, 19 September, 2014:
    “Ehhh, hi guys, um, there isn’t a United Kingdom anymore, so, um, don’t you think that calling ourselves the United Kingdom Independence Party is a bit, um, odd? And, we’ve got a bloody general election coming up soon. So what the hell is it going to be; EIP, the English Independence Party, AEGPP, the Anti-Everything Good and Proper Party? Come on now guys, ideas, ideas!”

  58. The Rough Bounds says:

    Regarding Jim Sillars’ suggestion that the Yes campaign ought to produce an information ‘Bible’ with a question and answer theme on the weighty questions being asked about Scotland and the independence referendum I can only say that I agree.
    Back in the sixties we had that very thing; it was titled ‘100 Home Rule questions answered. It was that little booklet that made it much, much easier for those of us battling away against the lying press at the time.
    If I remember correctly the book was written and compiled by Archie MacIntosh or MacKenzie.
    It was a brilliant piece of work.
    I know that this is the era of the internet but not everyone has a computer and there is nothing to beat a reference book that you can consult at any time.
    But, apart from that, Jim Sillars is a right old Jeremiah with his Lamentations is he not?

  59. ScotFree1320 says:



    @The Rough Bounds

    Do you think this would be a starter for ten?

  60. Linda's back says:

    Good idea Rough Bounds and there is stuff out there.
    The Spring 2013 fact sheet is very concise and I use it when canvassing and pass on to anyone who is remotely  interested whether yes or no or undecided.
    There is the Newsnet Scotland Independence fact sheet
    For a more in depth study buy Stephen Maxwell’s book Arguing for Independence available at good book shops or Amazon

  61. cynicalHighlander says:

    Sillars is someone that I have always felt uncomfortable about for some unexplainable reason and his ‘rants’ appear more of personal envy than anything else, if only is his mindset.

  62. Linda's back says:

    Two giants of the Scottish financial sector Sir George Mathewson and Ian Spowart have rubbished the Treasury report but no coverage on TV or MSM.
    Many neutrals would put more store on these people rather than politicians and perhaps their comments have been met with a wall of silence as it doesn’t suit the pro UK agenda but when other non politicians attack independence they are given banner headlines plus TV and radio coverage. 

  63. fordie says:

    Couple of thoughts.
    1. I flip between BBC Scotland and BBC4 radio on my commute. Heard the ‘interview’ ~ 07:45 with MM and thought Dear God, here we go again. These negativity/scare stories are wearing me down through sheer boredom. Is that the plan? Not just to bore  and/or ‘frighten’ to death the majority of normal punters – but to drive even the committed to despair. It’s so obvious that these stories are farcical but trying saying that again and again to the non-political.
    2. After hearing ~ MM ‘interviewed’ the listeners were then informed that George Mathewson would be interviewed ‘after eight’. 50 miles and 50 minutes later, I was still waiting. Heard a lot about football, the traffic, the weather in the interim. Another bias. Unionist story given prime spot whilst the response is provided so late that either a) most listeners won’t hear it cause they’ve arrived at work or b) will have given up waiting.

  64. Mosstrooper says:

    New name for tories and UKIP, How about FUKUP
    (former Uk unionist Party

  65. Mosstrooper says:

    And of course if we wanted to close them down we could shout
    Shut the FUKUP

  66. Mosstrooper says:

    Hi Rev. Some problem with the Edit function?

  67. Bill C says:

    Re – Jim Sillars, I was a founder member of the Scottish Labour Party way back in 1976. I was looking for a more radical, socialist party than the SNP was at that time. Jim was a great orator and he took a big gamble with his career in launching the party. He had been tipped as a future Secretary of State if he had remained in the Labour Party.  He also published a very good book on Independence in Europe.  I think the problem with Jim was that he was a bit of a one man band and he did not get along with Alex Salmond, seemed to me that he was not prepared to play second fiddle to Alex.
    I think he is a lost to our cause as I am convinced of his intellect, however, I do not think he is a team player. His constant sniping from the sidelines is no more than a slight irritation, bit like a midge. A real pity though, as I am sure he could have made a positive contribution to the cause. 

  68. Morag says:

    I remember him as a great rabble-rouser during the 1992 general election.  However, when the much-touted but actually completely cloud-cuckoo SNP landslide failed to materialise he simply blamed the voters (always a bad idea) and flounced off in the huff to cultivate his bank account in Saudi Arabia.

    Salmond, in contrast, simply took a deep breath, straightened his tie, and got stuck in again.  That was when I joined the SNP by the way.

  69. Bill C says:

    @Morag – Your memory serves you well, that just about sums it up. The ‘ninety minute patriot’ call was not one of Jim’s finest moments.

  70. Patrick Roden says:

    It’s being reported down here in England, that a number of Conservitive Party Activists have joined Ukip!
    They are unhappy at getting called ‘swivell eyed loons’ by one of the Parties Leaders (I wonder where the Tories got that term from?)
    Nigel Farage has been quick to spot an opportunity to strike at the Tories soft underbelly, so he has put a full page advertisement in some national newspapers with a letter inviting Conservative voters/activists to join Ukip, pointing out that these Tory posh boys are out of touch etc etc bla bla bla.
    The letter ends with an interesting ‘PS’  when Nigel mentions that many Labour and Liberal voters have also been joining Ukip…
    Oh, just a thought, but has Alistair Darling surfaced yet?

  71. Morag says:

    My former business partner, who was on the committee of the local Conservative party branch when I first joined the firm, was latterly and still is a UKIP activist.  I must give him a ring and see how he’s feeling. It may be that my old stamping ground now has a UKIP councillor.

    Yes, I have a racist, homophobic, antisemitic, UKIP-activist friend.  I like to think it broadens my mind.  It may be that I also broaden his mind.

  72. AmadeusMinkowski says:

    Westminster continues taking its toll:
    First Bedroom Tax Eviction in North Lanarkshire!

  73. ianbrotherhood says:

    @Patrick Roden-
    Re Alistair Darling – he’s meant to be on GMS later this morning, and so is Nicola Sturgeon.

  74. john king says:

    Breaking news on bbc scotland this morning
    Catriona Renton 
    “the reason penguins can fly is because of their wings”
    no f***ing s**t?
    who said BBC  were dumbing down? 
    the quality of reporting from the BBC remains steadfastly high 

  75. john king says:

    Brian says:
    20 May, 2013 at 1:26 pm

    What kind of pie?

      an ingin ain

  76. john king says:

    “What contract exists between Scotland and Westminster that might have been breached?”
    the law of treason

  77. john king says:

    “I came out of the pie shop at lunchtime only to find the world was now flat.  Buses are still going though.

    If we’re scunnered now, what will it be like when we get to report 13. I’d go long in rope.

      didn’t you know?
    the better no brigade set their phasers to scunner!

  78. Mosstrooper says:

    Only heard the very end of Darling’s radio 4 contribution to Indyref at about 7.25am.  Apparently the Indy vote is falling (whit?) and boy did he sound pissed off at something.  

  79. annie says:

    Mosstrooper – He always sounds pissed-off it’s like the indy ref was set up just to get back at him personally. 

  80. Desimond says:

    Mosstrooper –
    More chance Captain Darling is still raging at Gordon Melchett Brown stomping all over his battlefield last week and making a frightful mess of things!

  81. ianbrotherhood says:

    Darling on GMS right now, sounding even more unhinged than usual – the peculiar facial ticks he suffers from are now infecting his speech. He sounds as if he’s on bad speed and is about to start hyperventilating.

  82. Iain says:

    Darling’s interviews always follow the same pattern nowadays; starts off reasonable but building to a crescendo of swivel eyed looniness. Did GMS give him any kind of a hard time (cos Jim Naughtie sure didn’t)?

  83. bunter says:

    Still laughing at Darlings interview on GMS this morning. The mans a hysterical swivel eyed loon as they say. Some nice pointed questions seemed to make him sound even more unhinged lol. I used to get stressed out at some of these BT interviews, now I just laugh. Must be the effectiveness of the scares wearing off.

  84. Shinty says:

    Seems there’s now an apology, but is says South Lanarkshire? (Maybe a different case)

  85. Lianachan says:

    I was surprised by Darling’s interview on GMS this morning.  His ridiculous statements were actually queried, and he wasn’t given too easy a ride of it.  He was almost, in fact, treated like one of those filthy separatists!

  86. Silverytay says:

    Poor Darling is getting himself into a right state , his mind seems to be letting him down as it is the no Scotland campaign whose vote is falling from a high of 51% and is now down to 44% and is likely to go lower yet .  It looks as though his p45 is awaiting him .

  87. ianbrotherhood says:

    I know Rev has completed some pretty arduous transcriptions in the past, but I suspect Darling’s performance this morning would be a bridge too far, even for him – at one point AD was speaking so quickly that he was answering questions before asking them of himself. Off the top of me heid I can’t think of any other public figure who talks so fast.

  88. john king says:

    AmadeusMinkowski says:
    21 May, 2013 at 3:33 am

    Westminster continues taking its toll:First Bedroom Tax Eviction in North Lanarkshire!
    disgusting but shouldnt be surprised by a labour run council ,no doubt they’ll spin the ass off it to make the SNP’s fault they did it, 
    o/t though saw a beezer on there, 
    Q; whats 7 inches long and hang in front of an arsehole? 
    A; David Camerons tie. har har   

  89. Vronsky says:

    I’ve mentioned in previous posts that the anti-independence campaign would have the resources of the UK Treasury behind it.  We’re now seeing this happen much more overtly than I expected.  I expect that the costs of preparing and disseminating reports like this will not be considered part of the No campaign budget, in effect giving them a bottomless purse.  Isn’t there something about using public funds for political purposes?

    Lianachan says:
    21 May, 2013 at 8:57 am

    I was surprised by Darling’s interview on GMS this morning.  His ridiculous statements were actually queried, and he wasn’t given too easy a ride of it.  He was almost, in fact, treated like one of those filthy separatists!

    Do we think this is because he’s still (nominally, at least) part of BT, rather than Labour United, or whatever they are called?

    Patrick Roden says:
    20 May, 2013 at 11:36 pm
    It’s being reported down here in England, that a number of Conservitive Party Activists have joined Ukip!
    They are unhappy at getting called ‘swivell eyed loons’ by one of the Parties Leaders (I wonder where the Tories got that term from?)
    Nigel Farage has been quick to spot an opportunity to strike at the Tories soft underbelly, so he has put a full page advertisement in some national newspapers with a letter inviting Conservative voters/activists to join Ukip, pointing out that these Tory posh boys are out of touch etc etc bla bla bla.
    So basically, he’s saying ‘If you are a swivel eyed loon, come and join UKIP’ then?

  92. Luigi says:

    I think AD is becoming more and more tangled in his own web of deceit. This may explain the contorted performance on GMS this morning.

  93. Tattie-boggle says:

    Not long now until AD is carted of to Bedlam or something mad like that .

  94. Juteman says:

    Twa plen pehs an an ingin ain ana.:-)

  95. Lianachan says:

    Horacesaysyes says:


    Do we think this is because he’s still (nominally, at least) part of BT, rather than Labour United, or whatever they are called?

    I wouldn’t be in the least bit surprised if that was the reason for it.



  96. NorthBrit says:

    @Horacesaysyes and in the spirit of Mosstrooper
    Isn’t it Scottish Labour United Together?

  97. TYRAN says:

    Rev, these circles look much bigger to scale than the first.
    If not for page constraints, they would have made the last circle the size of a 12″ record.

  98. Jeannie says:

    I heard the interview with Darling this morning, and agree with other commenters – he really does sound as though he’s completely lost the plot.  He was challenged to some degree, but just continued spouting total nonsense.  He implied that the financial sector would not be able to cope with more than one regulatory body – what happens in the rest of the world?  It’s certainly not the case that there’s only one regulatory body for the financial sector world-wide.  I can only think that anybanking/investment/insurance finance professionals listening to him must have been falling off their seats laughing.  And what would it say about our finance professionals if they could only cope with one regulatory body on a cross-border basis? As opposed to finance professionals in the rest of the world who freely trade across all sorts of borders and different regulatory frameworks.
    By the way, as another poster mentioned, Brian Taylor of BBC Scotland is delivering a talk this evening on the 1997 referendum.  It’s the final seminar in the Vox Populi programme offered by Glasgow University and it’s open to the public to attend if they want to.  It takes place at 5.30 in room 611 of the Boyd Orr Building at Glasgow Uni.

  99. Dee says:

    Just listened to another bbc news 24 interview and thy keep spouting out this 30% want independence figure. Can no one challenge that figure and tell them of recent poll figures. At the end of the interview poeple in the rest of the UK think that 70% want to vote No. The Yes campaign must get these figures out there, that it is the No Campaign that is starting to lose it’s support.  Be a bit quicker off the mark please my fellow yes campaigners. Vote Yes.

  100. NorthBrit says:

    Inter alia what happens in the rest of the world is people list debt securities in Ireland because it is an alternative English speaking exchange to the LSE.
    Most fund managers have products that are listed on different exchanges.
    There are potentially huge opportunities for a Scottish financial sector. A Scottish stock exchange and regulator could be attractive for investors and issuers looking for a well regulated exchange focused on long term investment.  
    This would perhaps involve the City of London losing a certain amount of business.

  101. Luigi says:

    Dee, whether by laziness, or deliberate manipulation, they are not doing themselves any favours by persisting with the “only 30% yes” narritive. When the percentage starts to rise (and it will), the contrast of a failed, all but spent no campaign, and a succesful yes campaign, gathering momentum, will be impossible to hide. They are desperate to avoid the appearance of a trend toward independence, but this is inevitable. The yes campaign will slowly start to gain real traction after the white paper is launched in September. Coming soon, unionist panic attack!

  102. The same thought entered my head, Stuart and I came up with this
     Wargames, Strategy and Keich Ma Breeks.
    Grateful for any thoughts from fellow Cybernats.

  103. AnneDon says:

    @Morag – I remember 90-minute patriots. I used to kid my SNP mates that Sillars was waiting for the Scottish people to apologise to him!
    Ironically, that election ‘failure’ brought the start of Scotland United, and brought many of us to where we are now!
    BTW, I like the van idea, reaching people who may not use political websites. Like the Sunday Post, reaching people us political geeks can’t!

  104. john king says:

    Twa plen pehs an an ingin ain ana.:-)

    djae want sauce oan thum?

  105. Graham Ennis says:

    I think it is time to replace the activities of the NO vote response with some robust action. Lets be brutal. YES campaign hs made a fatal mistake. They have implicitly accepted the “Rights” of the NO people to campaign against Scotland and it’s interests. The “Right” to be Traitors, to be tools of a colonial occupation of a system where in return for cash, cushy jobs at Westminister, etc…..they get to advance themselves and their personal interests at the expense of the People of Scotland.
    This system is itself the actual problem. It has no moral legitimacy, at all.
    In any other country, these people would be hated as ("Tractor" - Ed)s.  Sickening. To accept that they can behave like all the other colonial opportunist elements, of which Gordon Brown is a prime example, is wrong. These people have no moral right to oppose the rights of the Scottish people. They are colonialist apparaatchiks. They profit from the present subservient position of Scotland.
    Disgusting, and I feel utter revulsion every time I see Lamont on TV. What an ignorant, stupid person she is. Utterly talentless. 
    OK. WE MUST DELEGITIMISE THEM. On every chance we get, we have to hammer home that these people do not speak for Scotland, they speak for their own interests, and the cash they get from the System. They hate their own nation, and it’s people, and are almost ashamed to be Scots. Dreadful. Hammer home a simple message. THESE PEOPLE ARE NOT PATRIOTIC. THEY SUPPORT ENGLAND, NOT SCOTLAND. If they love the Union so much, let them go and live there.
    Direct political action, confronting these people whenever they appear in Public is the key. It will soon upset their apple cart.

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