stooges of the Kremlin

Wings Over Scotland


Checking the sums

Posted on November 06, 2017 by

The Scottish Daily Mail runs this shock-horror outrage piece today:

Let’s zoom in a little closer on that, shall we?

To save you getting your calculators out, we’ve added up all the alleged “waste” in the boxout. It comes to a total of £823.3m – a long way short of half of the “£2bn” claimed in the strapline, opening paragraph and hysterical editorial leader.

And to get to even that figure you have to contort and torture the word “waste” until it loses all meaning – and indeed the word “spend”. The Mail includes £16.6m spent on the 2014 independence referendum, for example – or to put that another way, on a government enacting the policies on which it was overwhelmingly elected.

It includes large sums of money which haven’t actually been spent at all yet, like £15m of foreign aid and £40m of support for Prestwick Airport over the next half-decade, regardless of how that investment might pay off.

It’s padded out with large amounts of “estimates” from unspecified sources, like the £44m supposedly lost on “drug waste”, an incredibly nebulous and subjective term. It includes “wasted” money like £38m on, um, sending sick people to hospitals.

It complains about £76m of expenditure aimed at reducing carbon output, but without a single word suggesting why that was a bad use of money or whether it succeeded.

Another “estimate” (we’re not told who’s estimated it) is the £110m is chalked down to the Curriculum For Excellence, a major educational reform programme whose effects and value will take years to be measurable before anyone can judge it.

£110m is also the figure attributed to “bed blocking”, but that’s NOT expenditure in any sense, it’s the opposite. The Mail is in fact complaining in that instance that money has NOT been spent to end the problem of delayed release, though of course it has no idea how it would be done, what the cost would be or whether the solution would be more “expensive” than the problem.

The biggest single item on the bill is a £200m cost increase on redeveloping the Royal Hospital For Sick Children in Edinburgh, from just under £50m to £250m, but there’s no attempt to explain it. Did everything just get 500% more expensive overnight? Have the original plans been extended to something bigger and better? We’re not told.

In any event, we’d wager a hefty sum that if you asked voters, building and improving hospitals for sick kids is exactly what they’d say they wanted their governments to be spending money on, so calling it “waste” is a bold move.

The piece blames the SNP for wasting £30m on the Glasgow Airport Rail Link, a project instigated by the previous Labour/Lib Dem executive which the SNP cancelled barely over a year after coming to power, the best part of a decade ago. Cancelling it saved three-quarters of the projected £120m cost, but for some reason the Mail classes it as waste rather than a saving.

And by the end the article has plumbed the desperate depths of moaning about £1,500 spent on Saltires for Scottish Government buildings and “two flags for limousines”.

Of course, an average of £200m a year over the course of a decade would be piddling loose change in terms of government expenditure anyway. Over that ten-year period the Scottish Government will have disposed of somewhere in the region of £300bn, of which £2bn would be under 0.7%. Most of us would be pretty chuffed to achieve 99.3% efficiency in our spending.

But even that figure appears to be absolute cobblers. Nowhere in the article is there the slightest explanation for where the other £1.2bn in “waste” has come from, or any suggestion as to where a full breakdown could be found. The Mail has seemingly just pulled the figures out of its backside. The term “fake news” barely begins to cover it.

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    186 to “Checking the sums”

    1. SandyW says:

      I’m all for freedom of the press, but I’d ban the Daily Heil in a second given the chance. Nothing good whatsoever comes from its continued publication.

    2. bobajock says:

      The Brownshirts are coming. The Brownshirts are coming.

      The brown pants are showing.

    3. Macart says:

      The Mail’s idea of waste and that of much of Scotland’s electorate appear to be somewhat different.

      Personally, I consider nuclear weapons a criminal waste of cash, but then I’m not a Mail reader. (shrugs)

    4. fillofficer says:

      they’re ramping it up. indie2 must be imminent. hooray

    5. Les Wilson says:

      The DM is one of the worst if not Thee worst of the rags, and needs put down never to be seen again.
      Propagandist shite that will not serve it’s purpose, hell mend them.

    6. Tam the Bam. says:

      Time for some ‘super-sleuth’ to do an Ashcroft type expose on Dacre.

    7. Proud Cybernat says:

      The Daily Heil – a waste of trees.

    8. Jim says:

      More propaganda, the same as the Mark McDonald resignation, still prominent like a pinned tweet on the BBC Scotland politics page while other stories are moved much quicker.

      The Sun continues the hatchet job on McDonald today on their front page.

      Not a helluva lot about the Westminster scandals though we have a big hooha about tax havens which I’d surmise is to take the heat of the sex predators at Westminster.

    9. Jules says:

      Notwithstanding the dodgy accounting, can anyone explain how saving thousands of people’s lives (e.g. health costs, or the overseas aid to Malawi) is ‘waste’?

      What a horrible publication. How can the journalists who write this kind of bile sleep at night?

    10. Betty Boop says:

      Apparently, the crossword is decent (so, I was told anyway), but, that’s an awful waste of trees wrapping it in such a load of bilious and vitriolic nonsense.

    11. Chas Clark says:

      Glad you’re there to document this sort of stuff as I couldn’t bring myself to buy these rags and complain about them.

    12. David Bruce says:

      The RHSC building also incorporates a head injuries unit currently sited at WGH (north Edinburgh). I recall a report from many years ago (apologies for not being specific) recommending this unit should be sited at the RIE for patient safety. The new head trauma unit is (when opened) directly linked to the current A&E.
      Money well spent.

    13. jfngw says:

      This is going to continue until the next Scottish election and the current hiatus makes you think a GE is fairly imminent. The objective is to poison the SNP record in the voters minds and ensure that they are no longer the largest party at WM and Holyrood.

      Why else is there little criticism of the Tories in Scotland on BBC Scotland, they are portrayed as squeaky clean, and it’s work for those who have no internet access. A ex colleague who I would have expected to be rational told me he was impressed by Ruth D, he has no internet to check the reality with.

      Funny tweet of the day was a journalist complaining about other peoples fake news. They are scurrilous lot these MSM journalists.

    14. Greannach says:

      At least, if it was in the Daily Mail, that means only about 8 people read it.

    15. ClanDonald says:

      How much has the Daily Mail cost the UK economy by converting normal folk into hate-filled, right-wing xenophobes who then voted for their Brexit catastrophe? Hundreds of billions? Into the trillions perhaps if their their hard Brexit dreams come true.

      The Daily Mail/Express are the worst things that ever happened to the UK. If I were a foreign power intent on destroying Britain I wouldn’t declare war, I’d just fund the Daily Hate.

    16. Scott says:

      I posted this on the other story.

      Scott says:

      6 November, 2017 at 12:00 pm

      Re Alex Salmond on the Scotsman paper,I note a letter writer in the P&J says the SNP want to control all the press I just wonder who he thinks controls the press at the moment not the SNP anyway.

      Maybe the Mail is the paper which this person wants to have all the time doing the reporting.

    17. Its typical that the DM produces such rubbish to feed their readers…..there must be a significant amount of crossword doers and a ridiculous amount of wasted trees as other contributors here have suggested

    18. mogabee says:

      The rage intensifies!

      My how simply awful of an elected government to ‘waste’ money on things that….OMG, losing the will to live reading crap from a newspaper whose owner is beyond reproach..NOT

      Thanks for this breakdown of petty story as it’s useful when I gently mock someone who still reads this rubbish.

    19. Ottomanboi says:

      The agents of the contemporary BritState inherit an expertise in gray propaganda, misinformation or fake news. An important underpinning of the imperialist mission it was purveyed on every continent with the smugness of cultural-racial superiority that Britishness exudes in streams. Its history makes the DM the perfect medium. The Spanish state locks people up, the British one drips poison in their minds.
      Which of the two is the more ‘honest’?

    20. John Moss says:

      Ah now, it’s the Daily Mail after all. Be kind. It’s nice to be loved by them 🙂

    21. Jack Murphy says:

      It’s the Daily Hail in Scotland. That explains everything. 🙁

    22. gus1940 says:

      Re The Daily Mail – something which is seldom, if ever, mentioned by those who criticise that disgusting racist and xenophobic rag is the daily deluge of reports of criminal cases involving immigrants which fill a significant part of the rag.

      They must devote a large part of their ‘news’ gathering resources to trawling court reports from all round the country and abroad for instances of lawbreaking involving anybody who is not pure bred English.

      It would be interesting to know just how many poor sad individuals ‘earn’ their crusts from having to carry out this disgusting task.

    23. Fireproofjim says:

      And yet the Daily Heil is the best selling paper in Scotland judging by the massive piles in the supermarkets.
      Those who buy it (from my limited observation )seem to be the older pensioners, – the group where the hardest No’s come from, and are most likely to vote.
      The Heil (along with the Express,) is simply the most rabid end of the continuous wave of U.K. propaganda, and this will never end until Yes prevails. It has the full backing of the Tory party and in many ways is the BBC in print.
      I hate them for their lies.

    24. FTDMail says:

      IPSO complaint filed. Won my last one against them. Anything to give that rag hassle and use up their time…

    25. cirsium says:

      This is another example showing why the current name for the main stream media is the fake stream media.

    26. Robert Peffers says:

      @Jules says: 6 November, 2017 at 12:13 pm:

      “How can the journalists who write this kind of bile sleep at night?”

      Real easy to answer that question, Jules.

      In order to have a conscience to keep you awake you require to have a sufficient intellect to think coherently. These poor unfortunate people totally lack the capacity of clear and meaningful thought.

      It really requires a sentient being to have a conscience. Does a predatory creature have a conscience?

      predation is a symbiotic relationship between two lifeforms of unlike species. One of which acts as the predator that captures and feeds upon the other lifeform which is the prey.

    27. Walter Scott says:

      It’s crucial that the fascist DM is exposed as often as possible but its readership are blind believers. I hope people with a fair mind see that everything isn’t a disaster & trust their own eyes and not what they read in the daily störmer or the lying express.

    28. John Walsh says:

      Sad thing is this hate rag gets readers and they believe this propaganda.
      The type who go into M&S and tut tut at the black cashier. The Uber Yoon easily fooled by MSM ,BBC and GSTQ types.
      We can’t win over these people to be good citizens. Let alone independence.

    29. Robert Graham says:

      F/k me and it took three of them to produce this load of pish, I wonder who or what party instigated this wee hatchet job, or is it the combined efforts of all the Unionist parties .

      I am surprised they include the Glasgow Rail link the close involvement of Scottish Labour , when the land required was bought for say a £100.00 and sold back to the original seller for Tuppence ( figures for illustration only) just to show the scale of the balls up .

      If Unionists want to toss dirt an endless supply and of proof of their mismanagement during their time in office is available .

      Parliament Building.
      Edinburgh Trams.
      PFI .

      The Total amount as yet is unquantifiable as interest rate rises make a final figure just a guess, but I bet it exceeds by a fair amount the Daily Heils Trumpeted figures

    30. orri says:

      Take it the gist is that any and all money spent in Scotland is a waste.

    31. frogesque says:

      Surprised the haven’t included the new Queensferry Crossing, perhaps they are saving that for another day.

    32. galamcennalath says:

      Fake news for the gullible. Sadly, there are quite a few of those around.

      What would be more interesting is the Scottish money Westminster wastes!

      That’s the sort of news which needs spread far and wide.

      They take our money and spend it on projects we wouldn’t want nor will benefit from. Then they allocate that spending to Scotland’s accounts and say we have a deficit!

      How many of WM’s ‘national’ infrastructure projects have been in, or even benefit, Scotland?

      And the grand daddy of them all is going to be Brexit! If the f*ck it up completely, as some of them actually want, then the costs to Scotland could be colossal. Totally changing our future and fortunes for the worse. Possibly irreparable damage. We don’t want it and yet they want to inflict it on us regardless.

    33. geeo says:

      Ultrabitch Elizabeth Oakshot on Sky News today claiming the current sex scandals at WM as “trivial and pathetic”.

      She really is a horrible scumbag, yet dadly typical of right wing rags.

    34. geeo says:

      Ultrabitch Elizabeth Oakshot on Sky News today claiming the current sex scandals at WM as “trivial and pathetic”.

      She really is a horrible scumbag, yet sadly typical of right wing rags.

    35. Ottomanboi says:

      If we cast ourselves in the mould of a colony with a recalcitrant element seeking liberation from foreign yoke the media we ‘enjoy’ and the legions of unionist card carrying apologists/propagandists makes sense.
      We need to swallow our pride, see ourselves as others see us and ready the tools to clean our country. Of course, to do that we may just have to get our hands dirty. Aye, there’s the rub!

    36. David says:

      The truth is that the followers of that rag dont care.

      For them the nonsense and numbers they spout is like pornography – it doesnt matter if its not real, they just love looking at it and dreaming.

    37. David says:

      @Geeo

      The WM scandal IS trivial and pathetic. Thats why its being covered. Unlike the child abuse investigation.

      On another note – I find it amusing that people who would consider a horny old man a ‘scandal’ also seem to be very charitable towards the slow creep of Sharia into our society and are quick to label anyone who has a problem with that institutionalised, law-enforced misogyny and oppression of women a ‘racist’.

      Oh well.

    38. Patrick Roden says:

      The ‘Scottish’ Daily Mail tells some more whoppers, but I am more disappointed in your glaring omission rev:

      That is that nowhere in your article do you offer the Daily Mail the right of reply, or the chance to explain how and why they got these figures from.

      It’s important to offer them the opportunity to show that they have not descended into being a newspaper that if they can’t find any bad news stories about the SNP/Immigrants?the disabled, or any of its other pet hates, it simply tells lies.

      We think you are lying, but we are offering you the opportunity to show that you are not…if they don’t take this opportunity, it is evidence that they are knowingly misleading their own readers.

      This article in its present form (although brilliant) can be (and will be) written off by the Daily Mail type,s as just the normal battle between wings and the media.anything else just feels like a difference of opinion.

      Give them the right to explain, and they don’t rely…

      Far more powerful.

    39. Maybe a list should be compiled of the huge sums of money Westminster has wasted.
      I bet it would be a very long list indeed.

    40. Glamaig says:

      I just googled ‘how much money has Westminster wasted’ and bizarrely 3 of the items in the first page of results were about the SNP and Holyrood allegedly wasting money.

    41. Dr Jim says:

      Guns, we need more guns, so’s we can shoot journalists then blame it on them for ruining our mental health

      It’s what they do in the land of the free and the home of the mentally unstable and the president says it’s OK and different from really shooting people on purpose

      Papers that make us mental and guns and lawyers
      It’s the way forward and I’m absolutely plannion and reeble about that

    42. Petra says:

      This guff from the Scottish Daily Mail would make you laugh if it wasn’t for the fact that some naive (brainwashed) individuals believe their every word. The Scots are being robbed blind between one thing and another from our oil revenue, in relation to our defence bill, Military financial botch-ups, interest on Westminster debt, maintaining Buckie Palace, Westminster, the House of Lords and even having to stump up our share of the Queen’s wine and spirits bill of £400,000, as she hides her assets in the Cayman Islands (and elsewhere?) to the detriment of wider society. The list is endless in fact. In other words loads of issues that their ‘investigative journalists’ could get their teeth into if they really wanted to highlight a decade (decades) of waste: Hundreds of billions that have been ‘wasted’ by the Westminster Government including the £600 billion of Scottish oil revenue used in part to finance decimating countries in the Middle East.

      We all know what’s going on here. Many undecided voters are extremely unhappy with the Westminster government between one thing and another, know that it’s rotten to the core, but state that it’s not proof that Holyrood could do any better (Heriot-Watt research). In other words that voting for Independence could be even more catastrophic than staying in the hellish Union. The MSM will be going at it hammer and tongs to prove just that by cherry-picking data, through omission or just downright lying. They’re out to net the 30% of Scots who are still undecided. Don’t let it happen folks. We need around 15% of them on OUR side.

      ……………………………………

      Another case of Westminster ‘waste’.

      http://www.thenational.scot/politics/15637640.Gordon_MacIntyre_Kemp__Gordon_Brown_has_some_cheek_to_write_about_punishing_bankers/

      ……………………………………..

      I felt really sad when I heard the news about GA Ponsonby stepping down. His contribution, over many years, to the Yes movement is absolutely incalculable. I want to thank him for his dedication, how hard he worked for our cause, and wish him all the very best for the future.

    43. Breeks says:

      I’m all for freedom of the Press, but it’s the sweeping definition of “Press” which is crying out for more stringent review.

      Strikes me these newspapers and BBC Newsrooms must be a very bleak and unhappy places to work. Strikes me too that it surely resonates with an equally bleak and unhappy readership. I mean it. What self respecting “progressive” would read such utter drivel and find it remotely enlightening?

      The UK media is just delivering food parcels of UKOK propaganda to sustain its increasingly beleaguered BritNat outposts.

    44. Dan Huil says:

      The incestuous relationship between British nationalist bum-wipes like the Daily Mail and the biased bbc continues. Boycott both.

      If Alex Salmond and others do get the Scotsman they’d better print articles like this one from the Rev.

    45. Jimbo says:

      Unsurprisingly there’s no mention of the £400 million the SNP “wasted” on mitigating the Westminster’s attack on the poor, sick and disabled.

    46. geeo says:

      @david 1.39pm

      Away and take your bigoted racist views and shove them up your fucking ring-piece.

      You talk about misogyny, yet STATE that unwanted sexual assaults up to and including rape, IS trivial.

      Prick.

    47. Andy-B says:

      A poorly fabricated SNPBAD story, by a ultra unionist rag that loathes Scotland, is it any wonder that more and more folk are beginning to see independence as a more attractive route.

    48. Tam the Bam. says:

      geeo @ 1-27p

      Elizabeth Oakeshott along with Michael Ashcroft jointly penned ‘Call me Dave’….(pigs head n’ that).

    49. geeo says:

      @tam the ban…all you need know about the odious oakshott

    50. Arbroath1320 says:

      I can hardly wait for tomorrow’s edition of this “excellent” 😀 newspaper and its detailed uncovering 😉 of where the “missing” £490 Billion went as recently reported by some of its fellow “journalists”.

    51. HandandShrimp says:

      Usual drivel from the usual suspects and the usual fake newspaper.

      Is there an election in the offing? This sort of pish plays to the rancid prejudices of the Fail’s geriatric readership but without the backdrop of an election it is pretty much the square root of zero politically.

    52. heedtracker says:

      English neo fascism in action. Scotland’s neo fascist UK’s whipping boy now, as UK tax dodgers hit the headlines. But look, in the Monday Graun Scotland section, an actual squirrel. Coincidentally, the Heil’s ed and one of teamGB’s greatest perverts, is also the owner of huge north west of Scottish region shooting estate.

      Red squirrels successfully reintroduced to north-west Scottish Highlands
      New population naturally expanded since reintroduction to north-west Scotland in 2016
      A red squirrel collects a nut from a tree in Pitlochry
      Red squirrels had previously disappeared due in part to forests being dramatically reduced in size Photograph: Russell Cheyne/Reuters
      View more sharing options
      Shares
      2,626
      Mattha Busby

      Monday 6 November 2017 00.01 GMT

    53. Scottish Steve says:

      I bet if that £1,500 was spent on union jack flags there would be no outrage. Typical unionist cringe. Spending our hard earned tax money on frivolous things like hospitals for sick children, education and the environment. The SNP, eh? What are they like. So Bad. They should be spending cash on worthy causes like renovating Westminster and the royal palaces instead.

      Oh, wait. We already are spending that. Don’t hear unionists complaining about that waste though.

      I hate this country’s media with a passion.

    54. Dr Jim says:

      Of course all accompanied by a shot of the FM which screams !!*GUILTY*!! as she hides in the dark looking as though she’s avoiding being photographed due to her shady doings

      She’ll be getting followed by Ross Kemp uncovering the secret dossiers and and threats of violence to political dissidents right down to secret executions out the back with bodies buried under floors in mass graves

      Aye, that’s us SNP for you, real crimey types

    55. Legerwood says:

      I see they have also included legal fees incurred when the drinks industry mounted its challenge to the Minimum Pricing Legislation passed by the Scottish Parliament. Also the fees incurred when the Christian Institute and others challenged the Named Person Section of the Children and Young People Act which was also passed by the Scottish Parliament.

      In other words – Daily Mail words as opposed to English words as we know them – the Scottish Government is supposed to roll over when ever any un-elected body or group challenge legislation passed by the elected representatives of the people of Scotland in the Scottish Parliament. Aye right!

    56. Dorothy Devine says:

      I caught the Daily Record headline while passing the stand in ASDA – it had huge coverage of the SNP MSP who has had to resign. Perhaps they are so myopic they haven’t noticed any others.

      The Daily Mail apparently pays RSMcColls to pile huge amounts of this Wikipedia mistrusted rag at eye level – my local one buries the national below Fishing / Yachting / Cooking magazines on the bottom shelf – I no longer enter the premises.

      I would dearly love the SNP to take them to task very openly.

    57. Garve Scott-Lodge says:

      £370,000 on legal fees over minimum pricing for alcohol.

      A cost which wouldn’t have happened at all if the drinks industry hadn’t gone to court in the first place.

    58. GORDON FORREST says:

      How dare our government waste this money! we could have paid for three miles of crossrail through London for that huge sum or A channel tunnel, a millenium dome ,A couple of miles of HS2 or perhaps it should have been put away in an oversees fund for a couple of years and with the interest it would then have paid for the refurbishment of the pal;ace of Wasteminster

    59. heedtracker says:

      I would dearly love the SNP to take them to task very openly.

      Extreme attack propaganda like this from the Heil, speaks volumes about just how dangerous Scottish democracy really is to the teamGB establishment. Its a revolution here, just slow, and peaceful. If the high toryboy’s of England do lose control of Scotland and Brexit really is as bad its looks, planet toryboy is in very deep shit.

    60. galamcennalath says:

      Is the £53 billion (€60bn) EU payment not true? Or, is the story being suppressed?

      Not a lot about it the msm. I would have thought it was big news!

    61. Ken500 says:

      The Unionist waste of money is costing Scotland £20Billion a year. £3Billion on interest payments on money not borrowed or spent in Scotland. £3Billion on tax evasion. Whisky companies etc make vast profits and pay no tax. The Queen HMRC evades tax. HMRC not fit for purpose. Along with all the Westminster unionists and their cronies. £1Billion on Trident,.

      £1Billion a year lost without minimum pricing. (Unable to tax loss leading cheap alcohol) Passed in the Scottish Parliament 2012 – five years ago. Except by Labour. Nothing to do with the EU. They have no objections if it concerns supporting health. They encourage that as happens in other EU counties. It is up to the legal system of the country to approve it. The whisky industry some of whom pay no tax on vast profits have stalled it. Decision in four months?

      £4Billion++ lost in illegal, unfair tax on the Oil & Gas sector by Westminster Treasury. 40% since Jan 2016. It was 62% when the Oil price had fallen 75%. A total mismanagement by Westminster. Losing 120,000 jobs and £Billion in Scotland. Scotland can’t borrow 10%? to invest in the Scottish economy for growth. £6Billion. Total £20Billion.

      Now Brexit. Losing £8Billion and 80,000 jobs in Scotland.

      Westminster wastes money on illegal wars, banking fraud and tax evasion. They do not enforce the tax Laws. Multinationals, companies and individuals make vast profits and pay no tax. Hinkley Point, HS2, Trident and Heathrow. a total waste of public money. There are cheaper, more viable alternatives. Including up grading rail travel in the North of England and Scotland where journey take twice as long because of total lack of investment for years. Total neglect. All the investment given to London S/E. Now totally congested ruining the economy.

      The Tories have irrationally cut the Scottish budget 10% a year since 2010. Now cut £3Billion a year. Despite Scottish tax revenues increasing year on year. Now £54Billion a year. It would be even more without the UK Treasury interference and control. Scotland does not receive EU renewable grants etc because of Westminster indecision,

      Total taxes raised in the UK was £533Billion. Pro rata (pop) the rest of the UK raised £43Billion. Not enough to fund essential services, which have been cut by the Tories. Labour (UK) was raising £600Billion in tax revenues and borrowing £100Billion. £720Billion.

      Westminster have caused the worst migration crisis in Europe since 11WW costing £Billions.

      UK Westminster £Trns in debt. A catastrophe. Absolutely appalling. Warmongerers, liars, tax evaders and perverts. Starving and killing vulnerable people.

      The Press are lying sychopants of their tax evading non Dom owners. Tories. In cohoots with the Westminster Press Office. Unscrupulous liars.

    62. ronnie anderson says:

      O/T . Murdo Fraser will be sorely disappointed that Queenie has only £10 million in the Offshore account an no 11 .

    63. Jockanese Wind Talker says:

      £823.3 Million =

      2.65 of one of UKOKs shiny new Aircraft Carriers or,

      5.5 F35 aircraft that will be based on them

      http://archive.is/AXq3l

      Or

      0.026% of renewing Trident

      https://fullfact.org/economy/trident-nuclear-cost/

      Which govt is it that is wasting cash?

    64. cuilean says:

      Don’t miss ‘Britain’s Offshore Secrets Revealed’ Panorama, Part 2, tonight, BBC1 at 9pm. The First Part (broadcast last night), said it would reveal ‘the tv stars on the tax fiddle’. One of these ‘tv stars’ was filmed walking into the BBCScotland building, Glasgow, but you could not make out from last night’s show, if it was a man or woman.I wonder who it is?

    65. orri says:

      A simple answer might be that they’ve simply multiplied the “bed blocking” and “drug waste” figures by 10, for about £1.3bn extra.

      Drugs not being used is in part because they didn’t have the intended effect. Or they did but users didn’t finish the course. Without a recycling program with stringent checks and balances there’s no way to avoid that waste. Simply checking the packaging on foil strips might not be enough if storage temperature is a factor.

      Bed blocking was, and may still be, a strategy employed by social services to reduce their spending by taking their time putting packages in place.

    66. twathater says:

      Even my cockatiel widnae hae that shite rag put at the bottom of it’s cage ,

      Could we not arrange somehow to have a mass complaint form available to everyone to complain about the likes of this and the beeeeb , like a central register of different types of forms available to be downloaded or sent via email to the respective ( ahem ) organisations , if forms were immediately available they could be altered as required or amended from universality to allow personal views .

      When Stuart adds an expose’ like this , any poster could add a link to the register and we could then collectively flood the miscreants or their regulators with complaints , I know that it would probably have little impact but it may be worth a try as like many on here I am heartily sick of these arsewipes getting away with spouting such denigrating pish without challenge, not only that but most folks will complete a pro forma rather than compose a new letter from scratch

      Only saying like????

    67. mr thms says:

      It was a spur line from Paisley Gauze Street to Glasgow Airport that was cancelled.

      The rail link from Paisley Gauze Street to Glasgow Central rail corridor upgrade went ahead and the improvements will make it possible for the line to deal with new frequent and longer trains carrying more passengers.

      http://www.railway-technology.com/projects/paisley-corridor/

      This was one of the most complex projects u undertaken, and took years to complete.

      There are plans to complete the missing link were announced last year.

      https://www.glasgowairport.com/corporate/media-centre/posts/2016/november/24/new-post/

    68. geeo says:

      EU to discuss tax havens blacklist after ‘Paradise Papers’ leaks.

      http://archive.is/Rqe1w

      Or…massive blow to WM tory government plans to make uk tax haven post brexit ?

    69. Chick McGregor says:

      These characters must sleep very soundly because of the worthwhile and honorable service they perform for truth, democracy and decency.

    70. Ken500 says:

      €60Billion is four years EU contribution. €15Billion a year. It increases when the £ falls against the €. More £’s needed. Germany (larger 80 million) contributes €25Billion.. France (65Milllion) Italy contributes €20Billion. Spain? The smaller countries net gain. Redistribution.

      There could also be contributions for access to the markets etc. Contributions for any shared defence costs. Trident will be going. Cost of continuing CAP payments? Or cuts to farmers and higher prices, affecting the poorer for basic foodstuffs. Tariffs for travel documents etc. It will work out dearer for less rights and no decision making inclusion. Costing Scotland £8Billion+ and thousands of jobs. Depopulated? again.

    71. PictAtRandom says:

      Re airports: The Indie has this about the useless one on St Helena:
      “The £285m scheme is one of the UK government’s most expensive investments in terms of cost per capita: over £70,000 for each of the island’s 4,000 inhabitants.”

      Well done, chaps.

      But the SNP spending £110m on doing the dayjob in education is shocking. Get Ruthie on to it!

    72. geeo says:

      In other “missing” news…

      Oil at highest since mid-2015 on Saudi purge, tighter markets

      $62.46/barrel no less..!

      http://archive.is/cIF7n

    73. Iain says:

      O/t
      Will Brighthouse be displaying the royal warrant?

    74. Ken500 says:

      Minimum pricing will save £1Billion+ a year. Less crime/sickness early death etc. More people in work. Any legal expense is minimal by comparison. It hardly affect the Whisky industry. Some whisky companies make vast profits and pay no tax but interfere in Government and health matters. .

    75. Ken500 says:

      That is why the Tories and their associates want out of the EU to continue to tax evade. Embezzle and waste public money. Banks and consultancies. Hedge funds funding the Tory Party. They starve and kill vulnerable people. Causing illegal wars. Ruining the world economy.

    76. Street Andrew says:

      The propagandists seem to be getting a wee bit desperate.

    77. woosie says:

      In the Daily Fail’s eyes – and those of anyone who actually reads it – all money spent in Scotland is a waste. Why don’t we just do the right thing, and give it to Auld Liz to buy some horses?

    78. auld highlander says:

      Ian at 4.37

      They are going to change the name of her abode to Brighthouse

    79. Capella says:

      Thanks Stu for reading that tosh so that we don’t have to.

      Here’s some relief from the stream of drivel that pours from the MSM.
      The National has great articles today, as well as Greg Moodie’s strip cartoon.
      But this appreciation of Hamish Henderson reminds us of how impoverished we are that we have no broadcasting media to reflect the many great writers and thinkers which Scotland has produced.

      Henderson (who died in 2002) was a gentle giant of a man, a master of many ceremonies, formal and informal, and a latter-day embodiment of what the philosopher George Elder Davie defined as “the democratic intellect” of Scotland.
      In recognising Henderson for who (and what) he was we might begin to recognise our better selves and who (and what) we might become.

      http://archive.is/yy2pK

    80. Ian Foulds says:

      Mr THMS at 4.28 Minor adjustment.

      It is Paisley Gilmour Street station.

      Admittedly in the vicinity of Gauze Street.

      Kind regards,
      Ian

    81. The mail and all the other media should remember the old saying a liar will not be believed even when they tell the truth

    82. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      Greannach at 12.26

      No.The Daily Mail is the third best selling newspaper in Scotland and a very large proportion of its sales goes to retired incomers.

      A high profile anti Daily Mail campaign describing it as “lying” and “anti Scottish” would probably have a measurable effect.

      100,000 eight page “Not The Daily Mail”s could be printed for around £6000

    83. Hamish100 says:

      Proves 1 point.

      3 unionists brains < 1 independent minded person.

    84. galamcennalath says:

      Hamish100 says:

      unionists brains

      … a bit like hens’ teeth 🙂

    85. geeo says:

      Bumbling Boris helps get an Uk/iranian woman jail time by claiming she was “teaching iranians journalism” when in fact she was visiting family with her new child.

      What an utter moron.

      http://archive.is/RNUXj

    86. Simon Curran says:

      Dave McEwan Hill
      “Not the Daily Mail”, anyone fancy crowdfunding?

    87. Dan Huil says:

      It’s almost as if Westminster britnats think a return to the Troubles in Northern Ireland is a price worth paying for brexit.

    88. Gary45% says:

      As the old Edwin Starr song goes,
      “Mail- huh, what is it good for?, absolutely FK all”

    89. Auld Rock says:

      The biggest waste of all is spending £0.00 (don’t know how much it costs)on a copy of this Neo Nazi filth sheet.

      Auld Rock

    90. Ian Foulds says:

      Capella at 5.19pm

      Having read the article in the National, I realise what literal and metaphorical Giants this Country has produced and continue to do so.

      For a Country that does not stand tall with other Nations defies belief.

      We seriously, seriously need to extract the digit and pdq!

      We certainly need to get our own media and I mean all facets of media communication moving to awaken the people who do not yet realise our potential as an Independent Country.

    91. Tam the Bam. says:

      O/T

      For those interested: Brent Crude has just gone past $64 per barrel and rising.

    92. Alex Clark says:

      The part of the article that caught my attention was this:

      The biggest single item on the bill is a £200m cost increase on redeveloping the Royal Hospital For Sick Children in Edinburgh, from just under £50m to £250m, but there’s no attempt to explain it. Did everything just get 500% more expensive overnight? Have the original plans been extended to something bigger and better? We’re not told.

      This made me very suspicious as it sounded like bullshit. So I did some Google sleuthing of my own, here’s what I found out.

      2006 NHS Lothian put a proposal to the Lab/Lib coalition Scottish government to close the old Royal Hospital for Sick Children (RHSC) and replace it with a new one to be built in the area known as Little France in Edinburgh.

      The coalition accept the proposal provided it will be built under a PFI scheme. They are asked to prepare an Outline Business Case (OBC).

      2008 The OBC comes before the Scottish parliament now under SNP control, they too accept the proposal and instruct Lothian SNHS to prepare a Full Business Case. However it is not to be built using PFI but instead will be fully funded by Holyrood. They also agree to provide £50m from the capital spend budget as an INITIAL sum, The word initial is also used in the DM article above.

      2010 The SG have had their budget slashed due to Westminster austerity cuts and can no longer afford to fully fund the new build, they ask Lothian SNHS to seek additional funding from the newly created NPD scheme which replaced PFI.

      2012 The new proposal is put before Holyrood, the total cost is estimated as £235m which includes an addition of a new Neurological treatment hospital as more than £45m to be built on the same site. Out of the £235m there will be £155m of NFD money.

      As you can see the Daily Mail “story” is a pile of steaming crap and they know it’s crap. They even use the word “initial” in their spiel yet imply that was supposed to be the total cost.

      You can be sure that the rest of the figures are absolute crap too.

    93. Breeks says:

      Nana says:
      6 November, 2017 at 5:59 pm
      Read the thread, very worrying

      https://twitter.com/Al_toMyFriends/status/927576110438678536”

      Very alarming Nana, if not entirely unpredictable. I am very curious who Jonathan was speaking to in Brussels, but then again, what he says is so eminently plausible that it hardly matters.

      We are all of us running out of time fast. If Scotland doesn’t want the same Brexit as the UK, then we need the UK’s Parliament Sovereignty split as soon a possible and probationary Sovereignty which empowers Scotland to act independently of Westminster. The time for talking is running out, and the time for doing is rapidly approaching.

    94. mike d says:

      Dave mcewan hill. 5.33.”retired incomers “.ah yer being pc here dave. Shurely ya mean YER’s. Yoon economic retirees. (Tongue in cheek).

    95. mr thms says:

      #Nana @ 5:59pm

      An interesting and long set of tweets.

      I came across a recent article by the same person

      http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/sep/21/mps-soft-brexit-article-127-eea

      It’s a very interesting point, well made, about the EEA.

      Can’t help thinking of my pet theory that Article 50 is a part of the process of implementing the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union in Scotland, and the transitional arrangements required to bring it about. Not sure if it is for a federal Scotland in Europe or a sovereign Scotland in Europe. Time will tell.

      ps. Ian Foulds thanks for the correction. I am always saying Gauze St instead of Gilmour Street. The line is near my late mother’s home in Craigton and it annoys me whenever the opposition claim the Scottish Government cancelled the project when the opposite is true.

    96. Ian Foulds says:

      Mr THMS,

      Nice to communicate with a fellow ‘buddy’, even if possibly once removed.

      Hope your second option of an Independent Scotland in Europe/EFTA/ETA comes true.

      It is up to us and others like us to make it so.

    97. Alex Clark says:

      The more lies these newspapers print and the more often they are debunked on Wings is a good thing. They hand us the ammunition with which to destroy them.

      It is taking time but is happening slowly, not to worry we are getting there one step at a time.

      Softly, softly, catchee monkey 🙂

    98. Breeks says:

      John Bercow, the Commons speaker, has said the government should release the Brexit impact assessments requested by the Commons in a vote last week “very promptly”. If the documents are not released by tomorrow, a minister will be summoned to the Commons to explain why not, he said….

      From the Guardian.

    99. Ian Foulds says:

      FTD at 12.44pm

      Well done that person!

    100. galamcennalath says:

      “Trump adviser Ross says UK-US trade deal will mean scrapping EU rules

      Commerce secretary’s comments suggest Britain will have to accept chlorinated chicken in post-Brexit agreement “

      Who could possibly have guessed, eh!?

      http://archive.is/hYttt

      And if the UK does allow EU rules to go, and our food production chain to be polluted by ‘unfit food’, we can forget about selling our products to existing markets.

      Absolute Armageddon awaits Scotland’s agriculture and food industries. Unless, that is, we get out of this fiasco of a Union.

    101. yesindyref2 says:

      I think frogesque has this right, the cost of the Queensferry Crossing was £1.35 billion, there’s the missing amount to get a rounded £2 billion. It was probably included in the “waste of money”, and they managed to get the one sensible editor to veto that on the base it really wasn’t going to go down well with not so stupid people.

    102. Al Dossary says:

      Lost in the annals of time, but I have a headline from the daily Heil in mind from perhaps 10 years ago. That particular headline was regarding the “cost” of running Great Britain plc.

      If my memory is correct, they listed that figure as £42,000 per head of population.

    103. Alex Clark says:

      @galamcennalath

      If we allow EU rules to go we won’t be exporting much to our biggest market then. Who would have thought that could happen?

      Only the Tories and the three Brexiteers, May, Davis and the Fox.

    104. Andy-B says:

      Meanwhile, as the Puigdemont et al affair is a judicial matter in Belgium, and not a governmental one, to sighs of relief by the Belgian PM Charles Michel.

      That maybe all about to change as the deputy PM of Belgium Jan Jambon, fires both barrels at Madrid by saying Rajoy’s “Gone too far” by imprisoning eight Catalan ministers and issuing a EAW for the president of Catalonia Carles Puigdemont.

      This reaction by Jan Jambon, will surely be a major political headache for the Belgian PM Charles Michel. However, on the upside it will be most welcome by Puigdemont and his ministers.

      Don’t be too surprised if the Belgian judiciary declares that Puigdemont and his ministers have no case to answer to.

      http://www.catalannews.com/politics/item/belgian-politicians-criticize-imprisonment-of-catalan-leaders

    105. Rock says:

      Andy-B,

      “Don’t be too surprised if the Belgian judiciary declares that Puigdemont and his ministers have no case to answer to.”

      I will be very surprised.

      Like in the UK and Scotland, the judiciary will first pretend to be fair but will then extradite the Catalonians within the 60 day limit.

    106. Alex Clark says:

      @Rock

      Spoilsport the goodies are meant to win. Raspberry in your direction.

    107. Andy-B says:

      Rock.

      Two of the main charges aimed at president Puigdemont and his minister’s (sedition and Rebellion) do not feature in the 32 agreed crimes of the EAW.

    108. Scott says:

      Priti Patel has apologised for holding a series of undisclosed meetings with senior Israeli officials during a private holiday over the summer.

      Ruth Davidson 6 week wait if no longer.

      What is it with the Tories

      Well I suppose they do have the Mail and Express behind them.

    109. stewartb says:

      There is no longer any surprise or shock at how the corporate media in the main, and specifically the Scottish Daily Mail, cover Scotland – our government, our economy, our health and education systems, even our culture.

      As someone earlier commented: “How can the journalists who write this kind of bile sleep at night?” I suspect they sleep very well, confident in a job well done.

      Someone else earlier added: “In order to have a conscience to keep you awake you require to have a sufficient intellect to think coherently. These poor unfortunate people totally lack the capacity of clear and meaningful thought.” Here I must quibble: whilst being ‘poor unfortunate’, I’m afraid these Mail writers will be applying their intellect coherently, in their terms and for their purpose. The critique of the article is spot on but it was designed/framed carefully for a selected audience.

      But it is NOT journalism – and certainly not even close in the terms set out at: https://www.americanpressinstitute.org/journalism-essentials/what-is-journalism/makes-journalism-different-forms-communication/ .

      “While journalism occupies a much smaller space than the talk, entertainment, opinion, assertion, advertising and propaganda that dominate the media universe, it is nevertheless perceived as being more valuable than most of the ‘stuff out there’.

      That value flows from its purpose, to provide people with verified information they can use to make better decisions, and its practices, the most important of which is a systematic process – a discipline of verification – that journalists use to find not just the facts, but also the ‘truth about the facts’.”

      How many so called ‘journalists’ covering Scotland’s polity live up to these characteristics and practice this discipline? All too few and certainly not the authors of the article in the Mail.

    110. mike d says:

      Is there an honest SCOTTISH journalist anywhere in Scotland prepared to put honest journalism before their 30 pieces of english silver?

    111. heedtracker says:

      mike d says:
      6 November, 2017 at 10:32 pm
      Is there an honest SCOTTISH journalist anywhere in Scotland prepared to put honest journalism before their 30 pieces of english silver?

      They’re all unionist tories. That’s why they’re hired, they’re on side, right.

    112. Jock McDonnell says:

      Just haud on there Dugdale, who appointed the corporate body ? Would it be 3 parties lead by wummin – one of which wiz you ?
      Gies a break.

    113. Liz g says:

      mike d @ 10.32
      I’ll second that mike d.
      An honest Scottish msm journalist if yer out there make yerself known!
      Ye didn’t go and study yer craft to be corrupted like this,did ye?
      You must have at some point,when deciding to be a journalist had dream’s…. Especially of leaving a legacy of journalistic integrity second to none.
      To leave an example that with out fear or favour you would tell the story.
      Nobody in the Yes movement is askin anything from ye,other than that you are honest.
      If you are that journalist and you are reading this then speak up.
      Ye must know on some level it’s the right thing to do….
      To misquote sumbiddy “let journalism be done though the heavens fall”

    114. RAY STEIN says:

      I would not wipe my butt with this rag. I’d end up with more crap than when I started!

    115. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      I produced and had delivered by post to every home in Argyll and Bute nine 8 page Saltire newspapers over a period of about five years
      This was financed mainly by adverts and cost the CA nothing.
      It is a much more effective vehicle for political messaging than leaflets (and much cheaper)- as long as it is interesting, wide ranging, has plenty of human interest of local people.

      It is the best way to approach our older generation who still buy newspapers. But the idea of a “not the Daily Mail” or “not the Daily Record” is very appealing

    116. David says:

      @Geeo

      Racist for disliking Sharia? A set of sexist religious laws?

      You have an awful lot to say for someone that doesn’t have a single clue about anything they type 🙂

      If you are a Scotsman then im embarrassed to be one.

    117. Effijy says:

      Freedom of speech is to be desired but fascist lies and propaganda aimed at keep the political representatives of the rich in power should be challenged at every opportunity,

      If published statements are unproven and dispelled there should be major fines, and even imprisonment, for a continued abuse of the truth.

      Why is there such a thing as legal tax avoidance for the rich? I don’t want the immoral and unjust practice to be considered legal.

      For decades we have heard how these loopholes will be closed, but never is there a serious attempt to do so.

      For it is easier for a Camel to pass through the eye of a needle than a rich Tory to pay his taxes.

    118. Breeks says:

      mike d says:
      6 November, 2017 at 10:32 pm
      Is there an honest SCOTTISH journalist anywhere in Scotland prepared to put honest journalism before their 30 pieces of english silver?

      Is it only journalism Mike?

      Which other Scottish interests and industries have been infiltrated and hollowed out by those who are hostile to Scotland’s best interests? Scotland has been very complacent about this creeping Anglicisation for a very long time, but perhaps in time we will be thanking the UK “Press” for waking us all up to the full extent of hostile infiltration, and the culturally stifling soporific effect of Scottish Cringe combining with BritNat perfidy.

      It isn’t only Scottish journalism that is blighted with, how shall I put it, “divided loyalties”.

    119. Jock McDonnell says:

      And tax avoidance ! Mrs Brown ? Some aeroplane that some Irish citizen owns ?
      My my, is it no just terrible?

      Don’t blame the individuals or other jurisdictions, if you want your citizens to pay tax, elect a government which will create the legal framework to ensure it happens.
      If its a moral issue, why have a tax system at all – just let people pay what they think is right, eh ?

    120. @mike d

      There`s nobody in Scotland that would employ an honest journalist,

      unless someone knows different,

      there are more Pandas in Scotland than honest employed Scottish journalists.

    121. heedtracker says:

      Why is there such a thing as legal tax avoidance for the rich? I don’t want the immoral and unjust practice to be considered legal.”

      Partly because its impossible to stop the rich moving their money out of this wonderful yew kay and then investing it, from a tax haven, like Bermuda, anywhere they want to.

      One of the beeb gimp network all day PR for the queen’s things, is that what the rich do do is,

      Your money is your money, dearest lovely queen and you can ofcourse take all your lovely money anywhere you like, invest it and then pay UK taxes, when the profit slides in to the HMRC jurisdiction. Which is great but same beeb gimps leave out reality like say, when does the queen investment actually start paying tax, in a tax haven, if you’re calling yourself a trust, and trusts do not pay taxes?

      Its all up to the tax dodger, royals or not. Its like us working stiffs telling HMRC, we will pay our taxes but only when we’ve made enough money, and when it suits us.

      Anyone can be a beeb gimp:D

    122. mike d says:

      Liz 10.56pm.exactly liz. We are not asking for fabrications or lies.just put forward an honest debate between yesses and no’s. Let the people judge.Or is that asking the impossible. Have’Scottish journos really sold their soul?.

    123. Hugh Grosvenor the duke of Westminster inherited £9,000,000,000,that`s nine thousand million or nine billion UK pounds,

      but instead of paying 40% inheritance tax he paid `brussel sprout`

      the cash was in a trust,

      anyone know how does one put ones cash in a trust?

    124. Bob p says:

      Re the tax news about lizzie ‘s money in the caymans. I WONDER If the tax dodging b*****d’s who own channel 4 or 5 will do a series on the “our big ROYAL benefit tax cheats “.

    125. heedtracker says:

      channel 4

      We own C4, its just bbc grot with ads. It’s not making any money though. So no profit, means ultra royals groveling by much the same beeb gimp networking.

      https://weownit.org.uk/public-ownership/channel-4

      Its probably the most Englishy channel ever invented. Its never got anything Scottish at all, except SNP bad, Scotland’s a shithole news, or pretty much the usual from planet toryboy.

      Sarah Smith’s ex C4 Washington correspondent, which is usually the next step to tory yoon media greatness back in the yew kay. So watch out for Laura Bicker and that nonentity incredible scenes Cooke, is it?

    126. Chick McGregor says:

      OT
      Brent crude at over $64.

    127. Dr Jim says:

      As I understand it these tax avoidance schemes where you place your dosh in the Cayman Islands and these places
      you don’t draw money into the UK for your use, apparently you give yourself loans which attract no tax burden then never pay it back

      Sound familiar?

    128. Meindevon says:

      Scot. Re putting money in trusts. My mum did it in order to protect her house and modest savings (definitely not in the Duke’s league not enough for inheritance tax) from Council home care charges as we knew my mentally and physically disabled sibling would probably want to stay in the house and need to pay for carers long term. And that’s what’s happened. Do it early and before dementia or it looks like avoidance and councils sometimes challenge them. It didn’t cost that much. A family solicitor will advise.

      I tell everyone I can about it as they are not well advertised for us plebs with small amounts of inheritance.

    129. Cactus says:

      I Love Scotland.

      HOMEbound.

      Soon.

      X.

    130. Bob p says:

      Meindevon already done it with our mums house in Scotland. Whats good enough for these tax avoiding Tory ba*****s! Good enough for us plebs lol.

    131. Bob p says:

      Dr jim.are you talking about murdos 11. Pmfl.

    132. heedtracker says:

      I tell everyone I can about it as they are not well advertised for us plebs with small amounts of inheritance.

      Its tax evasion. If you do not want to pay tax on your estate when you do shuffle off this mortal coil, you have 7 years to do it.

      You die owning nothing which you also can’t take with you:-(

    133. CameronB Brodie says:

      I suspect “dark energy” is behind this otherwise inexplicable expansion of reality. 😉

      http://hubblesite.org/hubble_discoveries/dark_energy/de-what_is_dark_energy.php

    134. Molly says:

      Talking of money , see The Express has gone from 15p to 10p. 10p too much but are they struggling just a little – hahahaha .

    135. William Wallace says:

      @ Molly

      Propaganda over Profit 😉

    136. Dr Jim says:

      @Bob p

      Quite truthfully Bob I’d be delighted if there was a way to scrap football altogether, it’s just another rich persons scheme to get richer off the creation of investing in poverty
      then feeding that poverty by selling hope but within the terms of bitterness because that sells even more

      There are loads of decent folk who pay for football but I feel it’s outweighed by the other lot, the dregs of humanity who couldn’t care less about the game but the use of what they hope is their anonymity in numbers to pursue aggravation of one sort or another

      It also impoverishes many households due to it’s almost hypnotic effect on the more weak minded just as gambling machines in bookmakers do
      We try to help folk cut out smoking drug taking or excessive alcohol consumption for their health and welfare
      yet encourage football which does exactly the same thing and the only folk who benefit are the people who run it by using every trick in the accountants book to avoid paying back the tax on the profits they make to assist the poor of the country who pays them for it

      I like watching good football but I don’t like what the business of football is and here’s a funny thing the people who can most afford to go to football get in free or are guests of the wealthy and they sit and watch their paying customers baying for the other teams supporters blood and rub their hands in delight

      Of course they condemn all sectarianism racism bigotry and anything else you want condemned because they know it pays them lovely money to keep the bandwagon rolling

      Greed and hate is good, works a treat don’t you think, just like the Better together campaign used it, and still does

    137. William Wallace says:

      @ Dr Jim.

      I have to disagree (getting rid o futba ah the gither) although I do agree with your analysis/perspective of what football has become to a greater extent.

      Is it not a microcosm of the globalist capitalist society and it’s excesses in that regard though?

      As someone that used to ballboy and was going through an S form process at Dundee FC as a boy, I remember the large majority of players being absolutely skint eftir a weekend at the boozer and the bookies combined.

      The media turned it into the current money circus it is now but, it should not be abolished. Returned to it’s working class origins maybe but, abolished ah the gither? Naw! Nae chance.

    138. Cactus says:

      Checkin’ oot the weather ~

      Happening outside right now.

      I dedicate to Glasgow:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SbUC-UaAxE

      October 2017 has passed.

      Ten year of joy.

      Welcome to.

    139. Liz g says:

      mike d @ 11.37
      I am afraid that they have very much “sold their soul” mike d.
      We can but hope!
      There must be some that have worked out that bonnie wee Scotland will reject that “bloody treaty” and that there is a new Parliament in Town?

      Therefore a new media will be required!
      Those “journalist’s” should be in on the ground floor..but they seem to be too “yellow” tae go with it.

      ACH well I am sure that somehow we will get a media worthy of Scotland…. A media that, as the rev has shown… Needs to demonstrate we can trust!
      I am no quite sure how…but I am very sure we will manage!
      While ALWAYS BEING PEACEFUL of course…. As a wise man once said!!!

    140. William Wallace says:

      “While ALWAYS BEING PEACEFUL of course….
      As a wise man once said!!!

      We dinnae need their corrupt media pish
      we can write wir ain narrative instead 😉

    141. Liz g says:

      William Wallace @ 1.40
      I can see whit yer sayin…..
      But can ye no understand that when ye are no the least wee bit interested in football!
      Then it is so obviously a placebo?
      I don’t pretend to be objective…. Because I am Central belt,”mixed” marriage….
      And a Borge/McEnroe fan……This football shit is mair bother than it’s worth…
      22 men kickin a baw..FFS
      And people have lost their lives over it…I can’t even..wan mair life….and that’s it…banned.
      I have nae problem with that… Fecken behave or else!!

    142. Liz g says:

      Me @ 2.40
      And what I forgot to say was….
      Aboot the dugs..there are mair pubs that don’t let dogs in..than there are pubs that let football fans in!
      Fair enough but…..will labour request a FAO to find out how many patients present with dug bites and how many present with football violence….
      Ultimately who wid ye rather share a haulf wi ?

    143. William Wallace says:

      It’s no just a wee placebo Liz
      It’s a fundamental wey o life
      This is no just 22 men kicking a bah
      It’s the wey that we’re designed

      Mebbe we are ah quite daft as men
      perhaps you love us just the same
      yi have to come tae understand us then
      cause we love futba and

      It’s a beautiful game 🙂 😉

    144. William Wallace says:

      @ Liz

      Assuming yir no meh mither trolling me and eh wouldnae pit it past her (her name is Liz tae) Eh’m gonna hae to tak yi tae Denz 😉

    145. Liz g says:

      A FOI even
      William yer no the only wan that needs yer web site!!
      Lol

    146. William Wallace says:

      @ Liz

      Love ya 😉

    147. Liz g says:

      William
      I am no yer mither lol,rest assured..or ye wid HIV a well scleped arse!

      Although she his a wonderful name!
      And I’ll wager an even better disposition!
      We will need tae agree tae disagree !!!
      Twinty TWA men kikin a baw….is exactly whit it is…
      And Scotland could do without it..easily!
      Especially when human beings are losing their life over it.
      Ah canny support it William… No when it has the baggage that it does…it is only a game.. My friend!

    148. William Wallace says:

      Mebbe it iz Liz
      and may meh erse be skelped
      but fir me the futba
      is a story tae be telt

      A story directly
      sung fae the schemes
      aboot what wi are
      and ah wi could be

      and we could be something
      something great let us be
      cause we are but simple men
      and as Scots yet are we free

      We might love wir futba
      and gentle souls are we
      The poet resides in all of us
      said the poet of Dundee 😉

    149. Liz g says:

      William
      And I will respect those men, who desire to be free!
      Tis more than just a game…but not more than.. Our Dundee!

    150. Dorothy Devine says:

      Liz , I’m with you – a ‘game’ should not cost supporters lives , should not create hatred and mayhem on the street and without a doubt the media has a huge share of the blame for what football has become.

      I note you are living in the past glories of tennis – a golden age of John Newcombes legs for me!

      As far as journalism is concerned , it has left the building leaving only the ridiculous and puerile behind and more and more folk are recognising that judging by circulation figures .
      May they reap the whirlwind of their own making.

    151. Scotspine says:

      OT

      Anyone else seeing their twitter “suspended” regularly?

      I just tweeted support for Craig Murray on the start of his libel trial and instantly, account suspended.

      Usually happens when I have a go at the BBC, but has started more frequently recently.

      Last one was several days ago. Tweeted an ironic piss take at US State Depts stance on Catalonian Indy and wham….locked down.

      Hmmmmm….

    152. Balaaargh says:

      Daily Fail repeating the same lie on the front page this morning.

      If they repeat it often enough, it’ll become true…

    153. Ken500 says:

      The State Scotland would be in without the SNP standing up for Scotland. It does not bear thinking about. Thank goodness for Devolution and Independence soon. The world will be a better place if Scotland is Independent in the EU.

      The Tories and Westminster unionists are a complete disaster. A shower of useless incompetents. It is just unbelievable. Warmongering , tax evaders and perverts starving and killing vulnerable people. Appalling. Making the Law and breaking the Law with impunity. Wasting public money to line their pockets. They are worrying people to death. Making people unhappy and anxious. The Tories must be gone soon. ASAP. What a mess.

    154. Macart says:

      I think it’s time to be perfectly clear about the nature of the more extreme elements of the media. Titles such as the Mail and the Express are NOT newspapers. They do not promote journalism in any meaningful sense a responsible and reasoning human being would recognise. They clearly do not promote a sense of care, community or wider sense of unity and fellow feeling between demographics.

      They are purely propaganda sheets for a very motivated and self interested few and their world view. What they do, they do willingly and with full knowledge of the effects and consequences they inflict upon society as a whole. What they do is with the full intent of achieving those consequences. Their job is to direct emotion and opinion where it will do them the most good, which generally means their opposition (corporately, politically and societally), the most harm. The nature of the harm? They don’t really care overmuch.

      Be aware that the political class in general, do NOT have the reach, the expertise, nor the marketing skills necessary to con or twist the opinions of the entirety of the UKs populations. No, it takes willing participants and partners to do that. The message may originate from the political class, but it takes willing, invested, elements of the media to become the messenger. To sell that bill of goods.

      They’re the ones who will convince you to vote for certain individuals or parties. They’re the ones who can build careers and governments, or conversely destroy them when it suits. They’re the bods who will convince you to alienate or hate a demographic because… reasons. They encourage apathy. They don’t want people to think. They’d far rather you let them do that for you. Wind you up, point you in the right direction and do as you’re bid.

      SIT! LIE DOWN! ROLL OVER! There’s a good little voter. You get the drift.

      That is the nature of propaganda. To have a desired effect upon opinion, emotion, outcome.

      One look beneath the line on any piece from mainstream UK titles tells you all you need to know on how that works.

      One look at the world around us confirms it.

    155. heedtracker says:

      Great links for coffee time Nana! It does look like the tory press have declared this week, End of the SNP week, judging by their day after day SNP bad news stand headlines.

      Sainsbury’s have the Heil and the Express at the top of their news stands, here in Glasgow, blaring out SNP bad. Its going to be fascinating to see if they really can get the SNP out.

      Meanwhile, is the beeb prepping us for the end of Teresa?

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41894534

      A bad day at the office for Theresa May
      Laura Kuenssberg
      Political editor
      6 November 2017
      From the section UK Politics

    156. heedtracker says:

      And in progressive liberal Graun, its still “look! a squirrel, S____d region.”

      “Red squirrels, a species previously lost from their native woodlands, have been successfully returned to the north-west Highlands, early results of a reintroduction project show.”

      Severin Carrell’s definitely got the biggest doss in teamGB tory hackdom these days.

      One the one UKOK hackdom hand, SNP bad, on t’other, S____d does not exist, in the middle, beeb Scotland gimps tell us how shite we are, as Scots in shit hole Scotland.

      Anyone can be a UKOK hack:D

    157. heedtracker says:

      Will not archive, Reuters thing shows how the EU can get involved with member states when they want to, or why would top EU liggers try to mix it up with our English imperial masters, in probably one of the most volatile regions in Europe too? They really don’t give a flying fcuk really in Brussels.

      “Allowing Northern Ireland to retain some access has been floated by the European Parliament’s Brexit pointman, Guy Verhofstadt.

      “We will leave the European Union in 2019 as one United Kingdom,” the British minister for Northern Ireland, James Brokenshire, said on Monday. “We need to ensure that nothing is done that undermines the integrity of the UK single market.”

    158. Scott says:

      So Cabinet Minister Priti Patel on her Israeli “holiday” squeezed in 12 secretive engagements including PM Benjamin Netanyahu…

      How can this person keep her job

    159. heedtracker says:

      No doubt the great Guy whathisface will intervene for Brexit 70% Grimsby, like how he wants to give NI all kinds of nice EU things, after they voted Leave. Belgians are famous for being f wits though. Scotland is shackled to England and its going to ruin an awful lot of Scots.

      http://www.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk/news/grimsby-news/brexit-exemption-sought-grimsby-seafood-736984

      https://www.channel4.com/news/grimsby-where-70-voted-brexit

    160. jfngw says:

      @heedtracker

      The Scots need to do this themselves, we can’t expect any help from outside or the non Scottish owned owned media. It would seem that there is still a substantial number of Scottish residents that would rather be lead by a badly programmed robot and represented abroad by a complete buffoon than take control of their own affairs. It’s hard to fathom, but that’s where we currently are.

    161. Robert Peffers says:

      @Liz g says: 7 November, 2017 at 3:30 am:

      ” … Especially when human beings are losing their life over it.”

      The essential truth, Liz g, is that people are not losing their lives over football. They are losing their lives over Christian Sectarianism and that sectarianism is based upon two very basic human trends.

      The first trend being the totally unsupported belief in imaginary superior beings that has affected every human grouping of people since man evolved from the other primates.

      The second is the so called reformation of Christianity that came about because ruling elites wanted a piece of the action of the Holy Roman Se. The prime example being the English Monarchy resisting Papal teachings in order to execute, divorce or swap wives and otherwise do exactly what they personally wanted to do. It dominates the direction taken by our entire British History

      Thus setting the monarchy of England up as the head of the Church of England and beginning an, “Established Christian Church”, that became part of the Government of the Kingdom of England.

      Did I mention Islam?

      The three things are irrevocably intertwined, UK government, UK Sectarianism and UK Football. BTW: It is by no means confined to Scotland but is aggravated in Scotland as the Treaty of Union sets out that the English Monarchy are not head of Scottish churches. Look at the history of, for Example Liverpool FC and Everton FC or Manchester United and Manchester City.

      That is what, “people have lost their lives for”, Sectarianism.

      Furthermore, if we abolished both football and religion these knuckle dragging imbecilic numpties would find something else to hate and kill people over, for it is their mindless hatred that fuels the senseless murders and the equally senseless killings of those being hated and killed over what, in both cases, is essentially The Christian Faith.

      You can draw the same parallels in every city in the UK as they have all suffered Gang Warfare these mindless people need something, (anything), to hate and kill for and if you eradicate the claimed source of their hate they will invent something else to replace it.

    162. Capella says:

      In case you missed it – Miss Donna Babington’s 6th Birthday card for WoS
      https://twitter.com/MissBabington/status/927800842983493633

    163. Fred says:

      @Nana thanks for the linx, interesting to see Age Scotland has Labour’s Baker & Lord Ffoulkes on the board & up to no good!

      Last week somebody intimated that Winnie Ewing ploughing a lonely SNP furrow at Westminster was blighted by being stalked by a Labour MP who is now in the Lords, wonder who that might be?

      Kezia Dugdale claims to have been pestered in her previous employment, she worked for a Labour big-wig! wonder who that might be?

    164. Nana says:

      @Fred

      Spotted that about Winnie Ewing at Westminster on twitter

      https://twitter.com/ArthurStramash/status/927443876272594944

    165. Ian Campbell says:

      There is a highly edited video on Youtube from BBC Scotland’s “The Scheme” titled “Scottish White Trash” a bit worrying. It paints a very bad impression of Scotland, its the only video on this Youtube channel. I think as many folk as possible should complain to YouTube. Thanks

    166. Ken500 says:

      The best way to deal with the Press MSM is to take it over for influence, as is happening with the National and the Scotsman. Most of the rest are in collosal debts but still being run to make profits for tax evaders. How long can that go on? The best way to bring change is not to engage.

      Apple have a monopoly – patents/copywrite. They can charge what they like, with no competition. Unfair trading. They make vast profits and pay no tax etc. A scandal. The EU wants it to stop. That is why the Tories want out of the EU. So they and their associates can continue to waste public money and tax evade.

      The US is the most protectionist market in the world. Any trade deals without clout (EU) are likely to be in their favour. One of the most militarised State in the world. They cause War rather than pay their dues. Even killing their own citizens. Terrorised into believing propaganda. They spend half their tax revenues on the military. Instead of paying their way which would be cheaper. In colossal debts. The highest in the world? Divided society.

      Too high Oil prices do not benefit the economy. The tax should be related to price. Not to stop exploration and production until a feasible alternative can be provided.

    167. ronnie anderson says:

      O/T . Westminster Parliament tv agenda states HoCs starts at 12pm today but the session started at 11.33 , you would think they don’t want people to watch lol.

    168. ronnie anderson says:

      Dont beat about the bushes Winnie Ewings tormentor was Lord Soak Foulkes The Most Dishonorable Gentleman .

    169. ronnie anderson says:

      Mr Steve Baker MP just announced that the Impact assessment studies into Brexit exit will take 3 weeks to collate & draft up , as I said in another post last night they will get extension after extension . No intervention from John Bercow (speaker ) , he’ll dae whit he’s telt .

    170. sassenach says:

      ” Impact assessment studies into Brexit exit will take 3 weeks to collate & draft up”

      Surely you meant “……take 3 weeks to work out the porkies we’ll be telt”, ronnie??

    171. ronnie anderson says:

      @ sassenach We’ve already been telt porkies by the Secretary of State AGAINST SCOTLAND DAVID MUNDELL . Steve Baker MP had stated that he had read the impact studies by they weren’t drafted as yet . So the question is how come Mundell stated that the Scottish Gov were in possession of the studies that would affect Scotland .

      If the Scottish Gov have done their own impact assessment studies they should Now Release them & fek Westminster .

      Westminster Parliamentary Motions are enacted daily in Westminsters TOILETS , they should bring them onto the floor of the HoCs , it couldn’t stink any more than it already does .

    172. a supporter says:

      FFS the “hysterical editorial leader.” quotes Murdo Fraser. No more need be said

    173. crazycat says:

      Winnie Ewing was an MP between 1967 and 1970.

      George Foulkes was an MP between 1979 and 2005.

      If WE’s stalker was an MP at the time, he cannot have been GF.

    174. Alex Clark says:

      @crazycat

      Yes well said, no need to be spreading rumours in the search for truth.

    175. Fred says:

      The Winnie Ewing predator was forced to issue a written apology so who it was must be out there. The story apparently appeared in the Scotsman, Sat 15 May 2004, he was a member of a committee along with Mrs Ewing so an MP, she had to report the business to the Tory committee chairman who sorted the creep out.



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