Last week you were widely quoted in the press on the subject of voters being informed in advance by both parties in the independence debate of the repercussions of their respective positions winning the vote. For example, your press release stated:
“The Commission has therefore recommended that the UK and Scottish Governments should clarify what process will follow the referendum, for either outcome, so that people have that information before they vote.”
Although your words seem clear to me, they seem not to have been understood by the No campaign. Ruth Davidson and Alistair Darling, for example, have both in recent days indicated their refusal to detail any proposed new devolution settlement, should Scotland reject independence, until AFTER the referendum.
Ms Davidson went so far as to suggest in one TV interview that she thought your comments meant people were unsure whether there would still be a UK Prime Minister after a No vote, and whether UK laws would still apply. As it appears extremely obvious that the “default” position in the event of a No vote would be that everything stayed the same as it is now, it seems unlikely that those were in fact the questions your respondents were asking.
But as we were not privy to your testing, we don’t know specifically which information voters were requesting be made available to them. I wonder, then, if it might be possible for you to issue some clarification on the matter, at least in broad terms.
A great many members of both the UK and Scottish Parliaments were extremely vociferous before the publication of your report in insisting that its recommendations be followed in full by all sides. It would perhaps therefore be valuable if you could be more specific about what sort of information your quote above referred to.
We know the No campaign is dead set against entering any discussions before the independence referendum, but we were so moved by Willie Rennie’s concern today about Scotland not having enough time to “negotiate over 14,000 international treaties“ in the 16 months between a Yes vote and the first elections to an independent Holyrood that we thought we’d help him out a bit with some advance work.
We did enquire of Mr Rennie as to where these “14,000 international treaties” could be found, but he was too busy helping poor people by fining them £80 a month to answer. Luckily, alert reader Angus McLellan was hot on the case, and swiftly directed us to a handy Foreign Office website featuring the magic number.
We’ve now had a brief skim through some of the UK’s historic agreements with other countries, and to save some time after 2014 we’ve knocked a few off the list.
Unionists often like to talk about independence in terms of a “divorce” to try to tug at our heart strings and make us feel like we’d be leaving a much-loved partner. The implication, of course, is that divorces are always bad, with losers on both sides.
They get very huffy when independence supporters suggest that it’s more like an abusive marriage, despite our relationship with England being far more like Stockholm Syndrome than they would like to admit. (Something their own “it’s a big, bad world out there, you’ll never survive without us” rhetoric suggests is the case.)
But if we take the metaphor of the United Kingdom being a marriage at face value, then what kind of marriage is it? And more to the point, is it worth saving?
Since we’re on the subject of Willie Rennie, we may as well have a look at the comments he’s made today in response to the Scottish Government’s publication of its “transition” plans in the event of a Yes vote. A clearer, more dispiriting example of the “We cannae dae it, Cap’n!” mentality would be hard to find.
“Liberal Democrat leader Willie Rennie insisted today that the SNP has “hopelessly underestimated the scale and complexity” of the task ahead.
“They would have to negotiate over 14,000 international treaties, a currency, the division of assets, membership of NATO and the host of international organisations,” he said.
“To say they will bang all this through in just 16 months is absurd. This will give most people in Scotland the shivers and fuel suspicion that the SNP are just making it up as they go along.”
Now, “making it up as they go along” is a pretty strange reaction in the first place to someone publishing a detailed planning document almost TWO YEARS ahead of the time it would be needed. But let’s humour the poor man and glance through his terrifying list of impossible tasks.
It’s one of the defining mysteries of the independence debate so far. The Scottish Government says that an independent Scotland would remain an EU member at all times before, during and after the process of dissolving the UK, with the precise terms being negotiated. The UK Government, meanwhile, insists that Scotland would be thrown out of the EU and have to reapply for membership.
The EU has said it’s happy to settle this dispute, but only on receipt of a request from the UK Government to issue a definitive position. The Scottish Government has urged the UK Government to do so, but the UK Government refuses, despite its professed confidence in its view and the huge propaganda victory that would presumably result.
We can only assume that the UK Government is too busy to write the letter, occupied as it is with destroying the British economy and society. So as a helpful time-saving gesture of goodwill and in the interests of informed debate, we’ve done it for them.
We’re even happy to put a stamp on it, pop out (we need milk anyway) and stick it in the postbox ourselves. Just say the word, Prime Minister.
This is “No” campaign director Blair McDougall, telling lies:
“There’s one thing that’s absolutely certain – if the nationalists get a Yes vote, Scotland will be leaving the UK and so we’ll be leaving the European Union.”
That’s a lie, isn’t it, Blair? It couldn’t possibly be any more clearly a lie. Nobody actually believes that Scotland will “leave” the European Union as a result of a Yes vote. No matter how much they deliberately spin, misrepresent and mislead about the EC President’s comments, nobody honestly believes that there will be so much as a single solitary day on which Scottish people are not EU citizens. (Unless, of course, they choose to stay in the UK and the Tories then take the whole UK out.)
Even the feeble semantic-hairsplitting defence that an independent Scotland might for a split second technically “leave” the EU while negotiations over the precise terms of membership were concluded and amended is anything but “absolutely certain”. Such a scenario is, in fact, a hugely unlikely, but strictly speaking astronomically-small theoretical possibility, so irrational that a lunatic might clutch desperately at it. Either way, we would in every meaningful sense remain in the EU.
The only absolute certainty here is that Blair McDougall is a liar.
We hadn’t previously bothered commenting on the Guardian cartoon by Steve Bell that had a lot of independence supporters hot under the collar this week. We’d assumed, as seemed the most likely explanation, that it had actually been a comment on what David Cameron was alleged to have mouthed to Angus Robertson at Prime Minister’s Questions, and that Cameron was therefore the main intended target.
We worried that the nationalists who beseiged the paper with angry comments were perhaps being a little oversensitive and looking for offence where none had been meant. Ironically, the cartoon happened only days after we’d highlighted our own habitual inability to understand what Bell’s cartoons were supposed to be about, and that comment turned out to be prophetic, because we had indeed called it wrong.
Alex Salmond’s appearance on Scotland Tonight this week raised an issue we’ve been meaning to address for a while, so let’s do it now before we forget again.
Of the numerous polls of the last few months, the most encouraging for supporters of independence was the one conducted by Panelbase for the Sunday Times in late October. It showed a pretty tight race at 37% Yes to 45% No, but the most interesting aspect was how the numbers changed when voters were asked for their opinion in the hypothetical scenario that they expected the Conservatives be returned as either a majority or coalition government at the 2015 Westminster general election.
In that scenario, independence leapt ahead with a massive 10% swing, to lead by 52% to 40%. But much less reported by the media was another finding of the poll.
There’s very little room for ambiguity in the Electoral Commission’s request that both sides in the independence debate provide voters with information in advance of the referendum about the likely consequences of either a Yes or No vote. Here’s how the Scotsman reported their comments, for example:
In the case of (what we’re finally now able to officially call) the No campaign, that only means – indeed, only can mean – one thing. After all, their platform is the status quo. In every immediate respect, the consequences of a No vote will be that nothing changes, so nothing needs explaining. There is but a single exception.
I was in Glasgow Concert Hall on Saturday for your interview, and the preview of the film about your life. And what a life! You are inspirational to many, as the crowd made clear. It’s easy to see why. You talk passionately of hope, of belief in a better future, of anger at injustice. Of engagement and democracy.
You recognise, too, that New Labour became right-wing, almost a second Tory party. You must understand how this played in Scotland.
It’s for these reasons I was depressed and perplexed by your answer to the question on Scottish independence. The question was a good one: would an independent Scotland be more socialist? It’s a question many in the independence movement grapple with. Can we cast off Westminster’s neoliberalism, corruption and corporate greed? There is no answer; no one knows.
There’s a small but quite vocal subset of opinion among followers of Scottish politics that David Cameron and the Tories are doing their damnedest to “throw” the independence referendum. A string of implausibly clumsy interventions starting with the Prime Minister’s attempt to lay down the law of a year ago have led to growing speculation that the Conservatives would in fact be somewhere beyond delighted to see Scotland go its own way, but simply can’t be seen to be saying so.
It’s an argument that has a lot of rational weight. Scotland hasn’t returned more than one Conservative MP since 1992, and seems unlikely to change that statistic any time soon, effectively giving the Tories a handicap of 50+ seats in every general election. There’s now little remaining dispute that the balance of Scottish revenue/expenditure at the Treasury is basically neutral, so there’s no great financial blow to be endured if the Scots make off with the remainder of North Sea oil.
(And even senior Scottish Tories think that the sort of complete break with the toxic Conservative brand which would accompany independence is the only hope of ever reviving their fortunes north of the border.)
Are we really meant to believe, then, that Cameron’s party is unbreakably committed to keeping a pathologically ungrateful Scotland in the Union for purely sentimental reasons? Pull the other one, readers – it’s got bells on.
Cynicus on Shield Of The Phantom: ““..the new evidence aqq A” ====== Sorry for this gibberish in my long post above. The phrase should read, “the…” Jan 29, 19:37
Northcode on Shield Of The Phantom: ““Scotland already possesses key competitive advantages in marine energy, including abundant natural resources and dedicated enterprise agencies. The country’s marine…” Jan 29, 18:50
sam on Shield Of The Phantom: “Gaels and Picts combined to face the threat of the Vikings. Over time their cultures merged.” Jan 29, 18:42
Cynicus on Shield Of The Phantom: “Lorna Campbell says: 29 January, 2026 at 2:12 pm “AI spews out according to that which you put in, Cynicus.…” Jan 29, 18:39
sam on Shield Of The Phantom: “It is not 25% of the Scottish population, It is a turnout of at least 50% of those registered to…” Jan 29, 18:36
Hatey McHateface on Shield Of The Phantom: “So you don’t even grant them the basic courtesy of calling our ancestors by their own names? Preferring to use…” Jan 29, 18:35
Northcode on Shield Of The Phantom: ““In summary, Scotland’s marine energy resources have the potential to significantly contribute to its energy output, aligning closely with the…” Jan 29, 18:34
Northcode on Shield Of The Phantom: ““Indeed so, these are immense energy surpluses that would be earning Scots around £100 billion a year…” Yes, Alf. The…” Jan 29, 18:27
Hatey McHateface on Shield Of The Phantom: “Some good points made by David Davis and yourself, factchecker. My view is that if people can’t be arsed to…” Jan 29, 18:26
Northcode on Shield Of The Phantom: “Long before the arrival of The Christ the sixteen tribes held sway across the northern lands. So effective were their…” Jan 29, 18:16
agentx on Shield Of The Phantom: “@ Saffron Robe – interesting – thanks.” Jan 29, 18:15
factchecker on Shield Of The Phantom: ““Our view is that a reasonable level for the threshold that determines a settled will is that at least half…” Jan 29, 18:00
Hatey McHateface on Shield Of The Phantom: “Oh, give it a rest, Alf. If Scotland has a renewable leccy surplus on one of those days when the…” Jan 29, 17:15
sam on Shield Of The Phantom: “5 Regional Assemblies During the second reading of the Regional Assemblies (Preparations) Bill 2002-03 the Conservative spokesman, David Davis, expressed…” Jan 29, 16:06
factchecker on Shield Of The Phantom: “The 2015 election was the one when Nicola Sturgeon specifically stated that a vote for the SNP was not a…” Jan 29, 15:16
Aidan on Shield Of The Phantom: “@Alf – so in a future independent Scotland electricity bills would amount to around 33% of GDP? Sounds like a…” Jan 29, 14:19
Aidan on Shield Of The Phantom: “Okay so yet more lying, I honestly don’t know what you seek to gain out of saying things that are…” Jan 29, 14:16
Lorna Campbell on Shield Of The Phantom: “That may be true, but, if you know anything about AI, it will try to find the answers to that…” Jan 29, 14:12
Hatey McHateface on Shield Of The Phantom: “@Lorna Globalisation has worked on the most stupendously successful scale for the Chinese. Just as it is currently working unbelievably…” Jan 29, 14:02
Alf Baird on Shield Of The Phantom: ““Are they acting in the interests of Scotland” If the SNP leadership were acting in the interest of Scots we…” Jan 29, 14:02
Alf Baird on Shield Of The Phantom: ““Wind power is so abundant in Scotland” Indeed so, these are immense energy surpluses that would be earning Scots around…” Jan 29, 13:58
Hatey McHateface on Shield Of The Phantom: “Gonna level with you, Confused, these days I really miss your antisemitism. What I’d love to know is why you’ve…” Jan 29, 13:54
Peter McAvoy on Shield Of The Phantom: “If John Swinney said we can have among the cheapest power in Europe why doesn’t he do it and say…” Jan 29, 13:48
Lorna Campbell on Shield Of The Phantom: “Confused: good comment. No public utility should be outwith state control for precisely the reasons you have listed. Also, the…” Jan 29, 13:46
Hatey McHateface on Shield Of The Phantom: “Sure, Willie. Wind power is so abundant in Scotland they’re building all the turbines dozens of miles out to sea.…” Jan 29, 13:35
Hatey McHateface on Shield Of The Phantom: “Bit of an obsession there, Confused. I’m guessing they wouldn’t “let you in”.” Jan 29, 13:26
Xaracen on Shield Of The Phantom: “@Aidan, 1. You said Keen was acting for a ‘private party’. He wasn’t; he was representing the UK Government. There…” Jan 29, 13:13
James Cheyne on Shield Of The Phantom: “John Swinney SNP sits in a English parliament sent to Scotland, that is the meaning of the word ( devolved…” Jan 29, 12:33
Willie on Shield Of The Phantom: “Power, is abundant in Scotland. Wind is abundant and wind can now produce more than Scotland needs. And if course…” Jan 29, 11:58
James Cheyne on Shield Of The Phantom: “Confused, The Green agenda ideology is going out of fashion, as is the Rules based order, according to Davos, its…” Jan 29, 11:46