But seriously
We suppose we should offer a few thoughts on this, then.
And we don’t mean Kezia Dugdale’s freakishly gigantic hands.
(1) Murphy lost the trade-union members vote to Neil Findlay (51% to 40%), but convincingly won both Parliamentarians (67% to 20%) and ordinary members (60% to 44%). We’re wary of reading too much into that – it suggests that Scottish Labour’s surviving grassroots members are predominantly those on the right wing of the party, but to be honest we suspect it’s more likely to be that Murphy was the only one of the contenders they’d heard of.
Polls regularly found that around 40% of the Scottish electorate didn’t even know who Johann Lamont was, and she was the “leader”. Neil Findlay isn’t even a prominent figure among those of us who follow Holyrood closely. A lot of members probably just voted for the only candidate they knew.
(2) We can understand why Labour would think that a relative big name like Murphy might stem the loss of its support. What we have more trouble in working out is who it thinks he could win back.
“Hold onto what you’ve got” is a fair enough tactic if you’re choosing Iain Gray because you expect to win an election and you don’t want to rock the boat. When you’re 20-25 points behind five months out from one, not so much.
If we assume (based largely on geographical and demographic factors like the Yes vote in Glasgow and the unions’ backing for Findlay) that the voters deserting Labour have mostly been doing so because it’s insufficiently left-wing, Murphy’s not going to solve that problem – he’s arguably the most right-wing MP in the party with the possible exception of Tom Harris.
Neil Findlay would have been a terrible choice of leader for other reasons, but he’d have represented Labour’s best hope of recapturing its disgruntled left-wing core vote. We can’t for the life of us see who’s going to come back to Labour because Jim Murphy’s in charge.
(He might attract some Tory tactical votes who wouldn’t be prepared to back Findlay, but there aren’t enough of those to make a big difference to anything, certainly not in the areas where Labour will be fighting the SNP.)
(3) In choosing Murphy, Labour is setting itself up for all kinds of procedural slapstick. Firstly he’s got to win his Westminster seat again in 2015. He has a big majority, but it’s not too big a stretch to think that the East Renfrewshire electorate could react badly to the disrespect that’s inherent in Murphy telling them “elect me and you’ll have to have another election in a year at the most, because I’m standing down to run for Holyrood” (which is what he’s said he’ll do).
Labour rules stipulate that the Scottish leader has to be a parliamentarian, so if Murphy lost in 2015 he’d have to either resign or force a constituency Holyrood MSP to stand down so he could be parachuted in – a prospect which neither the MSP nor the electorate would be likely to look very kindly on.
Even assuming there was a safe Labour seat that Murphy could be guaranteed to win (which is quite a big assumption) it’d be catastrophically embarrassing, and if SNP and other voters choose to mischievously vote tactically either in East Renfrewshire or whatever Holyrood seat Murphy contested, the potential pratfall is Laurel-and-Hardy-esque, and would call into question Labour’s ability to organise a convivial celebration in a brewery.
(4) We remain mystified by the regard in which Kezia Dugdale is held by the Scottish media, and we’re not sure that five months (at least) of acting as Murphy’s glove puppet at FMQs will do her any favours. For all her talk of common ground, Nicola Sturgeon surely won’t be able to resist numerous digs at Dugdale’s “organ-grinder’s monkey” status, and the Lothian list MSP doesn’t seem to us to have the character or confidence to deal with them.
(Whatever we might say about Jackie Baillie, she has an air of total self-belief when deputising at FMQs, however groundless it is. That’s what an expensive private education buys you. Dugdale comes across as chippy and fragile, and will do nothing to paint Labour as a Scottish Government in waiting.)
Of course, the SNP were briefly in a similar situation when Alex Salmond led the party from Westminster while John Swinney was in charge at Holyrood. But Salmond has been the Nats’ number-one guy for decades, was still Westminster leader, and had been overall leader before. Swinney’s one-term reign was seen by many as effectively just a sabbatical for the big cheese.
Were it to be Gordon Brown riding back from London to save Scottish Labour the narrative might have been different, but Dugdale will be a stand-in for an also-ran.
But it’s done now. Time to fetch some popcorn and watch what happens. We’re not sure, however, that Labour are going to be stopping the SNP’s pigeon any time soon.
Check out rancid old Guardian vote Labour or else puffery for this pair. Project Fear 2, coming to a BBC/STV channel near you.
“Labour has been out of power in Scotland since 2007 and recent polls have suggested it is trailing the SNP in voting intentions for both Holyrood and Westminster. With the general election less than five months away Murphy will have little time to reverse Labour’s declining support north of the border.”
“Recent polls” suggest a lot more than trailing Libby Carrell of rancid Graun.
link to independent.co.uk
“The survey, by Ipsos Mori, found Labour is currently polling at just 23 per cent in Scotland which, if replicated in May, would see the party lose all but four of the 41 MPs it currently has north of the border.”
Dugdale’s “organ-grinder’s monkey” status
Since the hierarchy of the Labour party is as follows, Party Leader Ed Miliband, (lots of other people), Scottish Regional Manager, Scottish Regional Manager’s deputy then she’s actually the organ-grinder’s monkey’s monkey.
Has the SNP reached 100,000 members yet?
Would be great if it came as the result of the Murphy factor. 😀
It will be interesting to see the makeup of Smurphy’s shadow Scottish cabinet – not that they have a lot to shuffle around, and a good number of them will be pretty desperate to be seen to be keeping a safe distance from him, and the upcoming humiliation.
Time for boots on the ground in East Renfrewshire methinks !
Dugdale at FMQ’s attacking Nicola by reading a script edited by Murphy.
Life can be so cruel.
I will have to watch through my fingers as I hate public humiliations……it will be carnage (((shiver))))
Am I right in saying that the actual number of votes cast was not released, just percentages?
Christmas come early for the Yessers ….. the undigestable Labour message being pursued by the unelectable Jim Murphy … with Kezia as a wee yapping dug hiding in Lamont’s bunker …
If you’re bored this afternoon, this vote Labour in Scotland or else UKOK CiFer has stuff what Eggs Murphy would certainly “chime” with. Its not future Lord Murphy himself obviously. Usual in your face hard core Westminster style CiF but from a month ago on SNP Scots.gov, or BBC/Labour in Scotland door to door campaign in action
link to id.theguardian.com
“Wrong, as always.
Without the Scottish vote in 2010 the Tories would have had a majority.
The people of Scotland realise that voting SNP in 2015 would help the Tories win, so most sensible Scots will vote for Labour.
You SNP followers however, well you don’t care about Scotland or its people, so you’d quite happily put your party and ‘revenge’ against Labour ahead of what’s best for Scotland, even though you realise that doing so would probably inflict a Tory majority on us that would cause Scotland considerable pain and suffering.
But then that would probably help towards your goal of another referendum, so in your opinion the lives that would be ruined are no doubt ‘worthwhile collateral’
“We’re not sure, however, that Labour are going to be stopping the SNP’s pigeon any time soon.”
Hopefully, said pigeon is going to s##t all over them, round about May 2015.
Listen for the snip,snip of party cards being jig-sawed.
If you want a good example of Creepy Jim’s ‘principles’ then this is a good place to start.
This from the UK right wing think tank the Henry Jackson society – Jim Murphy is the Vice President:
‘The gravest immediate threat to the West’s long-term security does not emanate from Vladimir Putin or from the militants of the Islamic State. Rather, surprisingly, it comes from peace-loving Scots.”
link to henryjacksonsociety.org
Not quite a match for his comments today!
“I and the Scottish Labour Party share so much more in common with you and your values of those many hundreds of thousands who voted ‘Yes’ in the referendum than we do with many of the political leaders who campaigned for ‘No’ on the 18th of September.
“We share so much commitment to a fairer Scotland. We share a commitment to social justice. We share a sense of values.
“Yes, we disagreed on one vote on one day, but we should allow that to divide our nation.”
Interesting to note as well the type of company that Creepy Jim is happy to keep when he’s not dodging eggs.
link to henryjacksonsociety.org
Scottish Greens stepping up to the mark today and will no doubt attract a few more disaffected Scottish Labour members after today’s result.
link to scottishgreens.org.uk
Just listened to Derek Bateman’s interview with Craig Murray. Excellent comment from Craig, not only on the shameful record of “New Labour” in the torture of prisoners but also Jim Murphy’s support for those policies. Brings Scotland into disrepute in my opinion.
Here’s the link in case you missed it.
link to batemanbroadcasting.com
Just the team to put the final nail in Labour’s Scottish branch. Couldn’t ask for more. Anyone in Scotland still believe that Labour is still a socialist party, please don’t tell me that these two are the best you’ve got.
What could suit these two ,as a film title; Dumb and dumber ( titles are interchangeable)
Turner and Hooch( Murphy turns as we know. Kezia is Hooch)
The man who would be king (Well we know that ending)
Every which way but lose ( or loose)
For whom the Bells Toll (that would be both)
Any other ideas?
Was hoping to get Scottish(sic) Labour membership stats out of this but only percentages given at press conf, anyone know actual votes cast?
I don’t suppose anyone will understand this but I feel kind of sad. I’m glad for Murphy himself, he did work hard for it, and deserves it. He’s possible the best hope for Labour in Scotland for its long-term future as he does have a strength about him. But he’d have to do a complete chameleon to reverse Labour’s fortunes and I’m not convinced that his intentions will suit the job.
For the GE he’s probably the worst choice for Labour, in view of Lamont’s “branch office” resignation. Murphy, right now, just confirms that Lamont was telling the truth.
His appointment is also likely to fracture Scottish Labour even more. However, he may be the best choice to revive Labour’s fortunes in time for Holyrood elections ’16.
Meanwhile, with this and the opinion poll with SNP at 47%, Labour at 20%, Con at 16% and Lib 3% – 3%! – that gives 0 Tory MPs and 0 LibDem MPs according to Electoral Calculus, and that negates Labour’s warcry “vote SNP get Tory”. Something for us to make very plain to the GP.
Onwards and upwards with Angus Robertson in charge of the 7/5/15 campaign!
I see the picture and I’ve read the article but I just can’t get “Fan – Dabi – Dozi” out of my head.
I’ve even tried thinking about my happy place, rocking back and forth in the corner of the living room..but no..
The picture above and “Fan – Dabi – Dozi” just comes right back.. ARGH…
HELP..
Does it really matter WHO was elected – they all have the National Executive hand up their erse, dictating the policy?
However, Murphy was the only candidate sitting in the Labour party cabinet when the “intelligence” from CIA sponsored torture was received by M16 and the cabinet, and then sacked Craig Murray for disclosing it to HM government. Will he now disclose his and his fellow cabinet members’ complicity in the use of torture, and the use of Scottish airports in rendition, to the members of his party who just voted for him?
No, didn’t really think so.
O/T Alex Salmond’s tie just sold for £1600.
Never mind, the Daily Record loves him:
link to dailyrecord.co.uk
@jimnarlene
Feed the birds, tuppence a bag
Tuppence, tuppence, tuppence a bag…
My own idea of Hell would be the bad luck to be cast adrift in the open ocean, with James Kelly M.S.P., and Jim Murphy, M.P. CAN YOU IMAGINE THE CONVERSATION !!!! It would not matter on what topic, or how novel the subject.I think after 30 mins I would be joining the sharks voluntarily.
i dont believe he will leave westminster, between now and the scot elections in 2016 he will come up with a reason for staying at westminster, cant see any way he will want to lose his expenses account.
The role of Murphy, other prominent SLABS and the Labour Party in general in supporting torture MUST be high profile in the months ahead. Those who oppose us genuinely think they are better than your average Yesser. It needs to be made very clear to them they need to publicly distance themselves from anyone guilty of supporting torture or they are guilty by association. Murphy’s right wing views on state sponsored poverty, university tuition fees etc must also be homed in on. This man is poison and we have to shout that loud and clear. The ‘vote SNP get the Tories’ mantra needs to be drowned out as another set of lies from a party that is known to peddle lies and deceit.
Bob Mack
‘Freebie and the Bean’
‘Love’s Labour’s Lost’
Re the hands.
1. that backdrop is concave which means she is in front of Murphy especially on her right side.
2. The rest is lens distortion, it’s probably a telephoto.
/photographic nerd mode
I can see few positives for Labour from this. My No/Labour voting wife said ‘good’ when I told her, so we are both happy but she is not going to be persuaded to vote SNP anytime soon, sadly and is not very left leaning in reality. So not the sort of person he needs to win over, more a rump core voter.
3) I agree that Murphy/SLAB have on this issue again shown a complete inability to think things through. I mean, all he had to do was to say ‘I’ll do it like Alec’, i.e. stand for Westminster in 2015, then for Holyrood in 2016 (on list would be safer), and stay an MP until until 2019/20. Nobody could have argued with that, since Salmond did the same.
4) You’ve got your leader/stadholder and timing wrong. The equivalent situation was 2004-2007, when Salmond was leader and in Westminster and Sturgeon was deputy and leader in Holyrood. Which means that Dugdale is now in the same situation as Sturgeon was, who therefor is in no position to make ‘organ grinder’ comments. Not that I would ever expect her to stoop that low anyway.
@swami backveranda
I can’t remember where or in what I read it, bit I’m sure I read that this number has in fact been passed.
@ yesindyref2
I kind of know what you mean, but I am honest enough to know that the Party and all it stood for in decades past has been supplanted by this thing I do not recognise. It has to die. If a truly independent Scottish Labour Party was established tomorrow, then I know people would back them. That however does not appear to be on the cards. The simple truth is that Ed Milliband leads the Labour Party, and until that changes, the Party I personally voted for during most of my formative years, remains isolated to me. It has become, sadly evident, that for Labour, Scotland is no more than a cog in their machine. Simply a part needed to generate the power they crave. No longer. This can be evidenced by the number of Labour voters who said yes against Party wishes.Change has to come sooner or later.
Inclined to agree with you Findlay , he wont give up WM for HR ever , his profile is up and he will be looking for an English seat to continue his career through. His main job now is not to get the blame for the coming Labour disaster.
Also my wife pretty much ignores Scottish politics and votes reflexively in elections.
Skeletor and Deputy Dug – what a combo.
He’s there due to extreme desperation on Labours part – Londons gofer.
She’s there coz she’s thick, obedient and dispensable – cannon fodder.
We need to rid Scotland of these Red Tory ("Tractor" - Ed)s – vote them out.
Butterkist, has to be Butterkist. The implosion continues as Labour put a right wing Blairite in as branch manager and a well known scrapper with a penchant for not playing well with others.
So much for the olive branch, healing society and reconciliation. They didn’t really mean it did they?
Thought not.
Given the time of year I can’t help hearing this wee tune in my head – “It’s beginning to look a lot like Christmas!” Festive greetings to all my fellow “yessers” – Santa may just have brought us the perfect gift. So much rope to hang this lot with (metaphorically speaking of course!)
I just glanced ( forgive me) at the BBC Scotland piece on the Murphy Mistake, and, unusually, comments are open across the UK. Makes you remember why we need independence. Horrible. Stupid, arrogant, condescending, small minded and horrible.
Are these two auditioning for the cheap version of Hitchhikers Guide – from which I present a relevant quote “For a moment nothing happened. Then, after a second or so, nothing continued to happen”.
Margaret Curran excitedly stated that Jim Murphy is “the right choice” – how true.
What is it with this man, that every time I see his physog my teeth involuntarily start to grind? He represents, for me at least, the less attractive side of a party I used to admire. At best, he is disingenuous, but I suspect he is far more sinister than simply that; he is probably a pathological careerist who will stop at nothing to promote himself over almost anybody, or any cause. I don’t like him.
The possible connection of Murphy with the CIA torture files makes it even more important to have Craig Murray put forward as an SNP candidate.
He must have a lot of inside information of what went on during those years.
I live in East Ren and have already got in touch with SNP head office to say we need a big campaign here for the GE.
We have currently not yet chosen a candidate but it will have to be someone strong and well liked.
I hate that Jim Smurffy. Why? Just because.
I do not like the tone of some of the comments here. Fan dabby dozi might stick in the mind of some but the tune I hear is “things can only get better,better,BETTER”. It worries me a lot because I have heard it before and that was just before a disaster.
Now when was that?
Look at her hands, is Deputy Dug really a female?
I see she’s still wearing Crash Broons jacket.
Interesting times are indeed ahead of us.
The question has to be asked – how can anyone, especially Findlay and the unions who backed him, show any form of support for this pair and the anti socialist stances Murphy has previously exhibited?
I send out a heart-felt plea to those unions to dissociate yourselves from Labour and put your support and backing behind the SNP – a truly reflective party of, for and by the people of Scotland.
If former/current Slabber members are totally hacked-off by these London inspired developments but cannot bring yourselves to join or vote for the SNP then i would strongly urge you to put all your support into and behind the SSP or Scottish Green Party.
Jump on-board and become a part of the movement for real positive change in Scotland and stop helping London to plunder our wealth for the chosen few.
Call yourselves “socialists” – prove it – come and join us!
The current Electoral Calculus page (which is a bit behind the times, not taking in December opinion polls) has the SNP slightly ahead of the Tories in terms of who is the challenger in Renfrewshire East.
It’s very difficult to know which way to jump if you were thinking of a tactical anti-Murphy vote in that seat. I think you’d need a specific opinion poll of the constituency itself before you’d really have much idea.
Deputy Dug is going to get absolutely flattened at FMQ.
Unite threatened to quit the Lumpen Pairty if the Smurph got elected. Bring it on them? As for their choice of Findlay being s left winger: it would have made no difference if it was Donald or Janette Findlay. A Brit is a Brit is a Brit.
To add to Labour’s troubles the Daily Suppress is now backing UKIP.
Big mistake! Well done Labour. 🙂
This is all just a holding pattern.
Murphy is interim. Marking time, get their slide bottomed out, then a comeback attack in 2016 Holyrood elections.
Except it’ll be the big clunking fist, not Murphy, IF they think they’re on an upswing again.
Neither of them has had a job.
I’d have thought it likely that Murphy’s objective will be to keep fighting the referendum. The press will make divisiveness and sectarianism a big deal if he stokes it up a bit, and as we found out, there are a lot of secret Tories out there who will be happy to have a man matching their instincts to vote for if that puts the boot in to the SNP (and he will, obviously). Labour or UKIP will be the choice.
That approach will also secure him the gullible and easily scared crowd who lost us the referendum. To them, the taxation and social justice mantra will all be convenient excuses to continue voting for the status quo.
I know this is a silly question, but did SLAB release raw figures of how many members voted in this leadership election? All I saw on the BBC were percentages from the three sections of the electorate.
No, they didn’t. Quite a bit of amusement about that on Twitter.
@ STOKER,
Well said my friend. This is for me at least, no longer about only politics, but more so the future direction of travel of my country.
see that picture on the BBCs news site, the one with the three leadership contenders, what do you suppose Mr Findlay is thinking?
Judging by the look on his face I mean!
@ liz.
I seen, just a couple of days ago, that Rolls Royce in “Renfrewshire” are to move operations to England. Is that in your neck of the woods?
I see that people are still referring to Labour as SLAB.
I thought the plan after September was to refer to them as BLAB?
I remember becoming aware of Jim Murphy as a Labour politician many years ago, and I can recall thinking at the time that he looked like he was not up to the job, and I could not understand how someone who looked like they had no talent whatsoever could be a member of Parliament.
How some things never change.
Many older Glaswegians like myself will know that the thumbs up sign both these idiots are making was done when you had decided to surrender or had been beaten. We called it ” Keys”.
Good article, as usual. However a wee slip up – item 3, start of second paragraph, “Labour rules stipulate that the Scottish leader has to be a parliamentarian”.
“Rules, you don’t like them? I have others”. We are discussing the Labour party.
And parliamentarian, of Westminster or Holyrood,? Assuming that unlike Bucks House, Labour regard Holyrood as a parliament.
Wasn’t Dugdale apprenticed to old Foulkes whilst he spluttered his way through a term or so at Holyrood as a MSP?
I always thought “keys” was more for a time-out or a truce, than a surrender.
@liz
Yes the SNP really need a high profile, well liked candidate of the political centre in East Ren. Otherwise, if they have no chance of winning and I’ll need to consider tactically voting Tory to unseat Murphy – I doubt I’d notice any policy differences. If he loses then he is no longer leader of the branch office. Does that mean Kezia takes over as leader?
Skeletor and the Dugs Tail.
@Stoker – no RR is closer to Glasgow airport.
East Ren is further south – there are no large industrial plants in ER, so we couldn’t fight him on that.
Deception, Lies, Spin, Smoke n Mirrors, Complicit MSM, all weapons in Creepy Jim’s armory. He will stop at nothing to divide Scotland, it’s his only option, as his parties Tory policies, and his voting history offers Scotland and her people nothing in the way of progress or hope. Very important we get the message out and dispel the myth that is vote SNP get Tory. Vote SNP give Scotland a voice at WM.
@panda paws – we already discussed tactical voting at the local WFI branch but a lot of folk couldn’t bring themselves to do that.
Think we will have to convince all Yes party folk to ‘lend’ their vote to the SNP even though there is no formal alliance – I think that can be done as the WFI group are mixed Yes party supporters.
I think Barrhead and Cambuslang are traditionally Lab areas but there was a very large Yes vote in those districts and we have contacts there also so I think we can get a large push from trad Lab to SNP.
I don’t think they’ve even contemplated the possibility of Murphy losing his seat in May. And to be fair, it always looks like one of the few “Labour hold” ones remaining even in the face of the SNP tsunami predicted by the recent opinion polls.
I think the fact that he’s standing again for Westminster in May speaks to a degree of cowardice, or at least lack of confidence. No matter how disadvantageous to the departing individual a Holyrood seat resignation would be, there’s always some way to induce people to co-operate. The good of the party, plus a stonking bribe, usually does it. So he could have said, OK I’ll stand down for Westminster in May, and stand for Holyrood at a by-election.
The problem is, it’s far more likely he’d lose such a by-election than lose his Westminster seat. So he’s not going to go for it. I think that fact itself says quite a lot.
He can be confident of getting into Holyrood in 2016, because even if he’s beaten in whichever constituency he stands for, they’ll put him top of the Glasgow list. If Labour are doing rather badly in Glasgow, they’ll definitely take one or more list seats there. So he’s safe. (If they’re not doing badly, he’ll win the constitueny seat.)
I would laugh like a drain if he had to crawl into Holyrood as a list MSP. I don’t like the way list MSPs, esecially those who have lost constituency elections, are treated as second-class citizens. Their presence is a vital part of the proportinality of the parliament. But on the other hand, in this case I’ll make an exception.
I’ve read suggestions that Murphy has been appointed by the UK parties in London head of a merged Scottish group. While they publicly continue on under different labels thay are a single party. Accepting that the result in Scotland is immaterial to who ends up winning at Westminster they have formed a political cartel. Run as Labour one place Tory another and occasionally LibDem. As has has been pointed out here Tory activists join Labour, so an effectively Tory like Murphy would do well as local agent for this merged group. All the now “English” parties will be content to ignore Scotland particularly if Cameron can put in place a means by whch all policies are only voted on by English MP’s. But as the Rev highlighted recently that is what happens 99% of the time with Scots MP’s just a mildly distracting background whine.
So here we’ll remain Scots divided into two groups. A wealthy or at least comfortable half unwilling or feeling no need to change, while somehow thinking everthing they have is because of England. All against the unemployed and the struggling poorer Scots who desparately want change but for some reason, despair and hardly turn up to vote.
Murphy overseeing a secretly merged UKOK party could permanently penn Scotland in subservience. Scots politics ending up a playground squabble amongst children, supported by an ever loyal media propaganda machine.
@DougtheDug says at 2:45 pm
‘Since the hierarchy of the Labour party is as follows, Party Leader Ed Miliband, (lots of other people), Scottish Regional Manager, Scottish Regional Manager’s deputy then she’s actually the organ-grinder’s monkey’s monkey.
No Doug, correct me if I’m wrong, but I think you’re way off there.
Surely that would make wee Dugdale the organ-grinder’s monkey’s, monkey’s, monkey?
Another lovely boost there for Murphy on BBC R4 news. He’s a truly wonderful man, spanked Tory Newlands, raised personal stature massively out on UKOK 100 days triumph, will stand up to and protect all Scots from Labour HQ in London and we Scots love Murphy but not Milliband and dozens of other really lovely things all about Jim Murphy that I cant mind right now
One BBC ligger sez, Jim’s main teamGB priority is making sure something called SNP don’t get a “clutch” of Westminster seats in May. As per, staggeringly corrupt BBC had absolutely noone on from SNP or anyone at all in opposition to Eggs, even just for that BBC world famous BBC neutrality and BBC non bias HAHA. Dark days for teamGB democracy or completely fine in red and blue Tory world.
hope “deputy dug sticks”, brilliant
Alex Salmond sold his tie for £1600. Jim Murphy sold his sole years ago.
They’ve finally done it. Elected a tory as Labour’s Scottish Branch Manager. Assisted by Keiza. A baffoon of a lassie.
His soul even.
The leaders of the Tories and LibDems are list MSP’s. Ruth came 4th. in the seat she contested.
Thomas Valentine
so true, i wish holyrood well in the coming months.
the snp are going to need full use of all of their skills, to prevent labour from turning it into a fiasco, which imv they will aim to do.
labour will see holyrood as a key WM election battle ground.
ronald alexander mcdonald says:
13 December, 2014 at 5:47 pm
…even soul 🙂
uscleguy says:
13 December, 2014 at 3:43 pm
Re the hands
I thought a telephoto would flatten perspective and reduce the effect of distance from the lens. That’s why 35mm used a 135mm lens for portraits. Anything shorter and the end of the nose would look big/forehead would look small. Short focal length exaggerates perspective and eventually goes all fisheye.
Something about Murphy terrifies me; he just seems so fake and self-aggrandising. I saw him out in Glasgow city centre in November. He was speaking to a guy and I’ve never seen anyone look so fake as Murphy did while he was smiling at the guy talking to him.
I guess London’s chosen him and I don’t think it really mattered what the trade unions or even the Scottish party wanted. I know Nicola will wipe the floor with him, intellectually, but I worry about how divisive Murphy will be in terms of Scottish society. He strikes me as someone who only cares about the means to an end and to hell with the damage that’s caused getting there.
I hate the idea of tactical voting. It smacks of inadequacy. I like the idea of a strong Nationalist candidate in East Ren. Vote for me. Wait… I’m not a politician – ignore that.
@Kirsty – I agree about his divisiveness.
Coincidently!! there was an OO walk today in Glasgow city centre.
In the middle of Christmas shopping, food markets, ice-rink.
You couldn’t make it up – there has never to my knowledge been an OO march in December.
Is this the Mathieson deal??
Anyone else think Murphys head looks turtle shaped ( could make a good cartoon). And the size of dugdales hand , new name Fisty Dugdale.
Just a thought.
Gary
Interesting reading in regards to the way Labour MPs and MSPs voted in the election for their leadership. A number voted for Murphy as only either their 3rd choice, or did not vote for him at all.
They include Malcolm Chisholm MSP (good guy), Elaine Murray MSP, Ian Davidson MP, Michael Connarty MP, Katy Clark MP (no surprise), Johann Lamont MSP (ditto!), Patricia Ferguson MSP, Rhoda Grant MSP, Hugh Henry MSP, Cathy Jamieson MP, Mark Lazarawick MP, Cara Hilton MP, Jim Sheridan MP, Alex Rowley MSP, and quite a few other MPs and MSPs. Some only voted for one candidate in each vote though.
link to scottishlabour.org.uk
All joking aside, Labour HQ are not stupid, devious as hell? yes stupid? no. Surf and Turf are bought and paid for, amazing they have a forelock left to tug. Labour got what they planned for Sooty and Sweep.
Jim Murphy says he is going to make scotland the most socially just country on the planet. So that is good…..
many will have seen the patriotic duty implied/spoke of as in ‘the cheviot stag and the black black oil.’
patriotic duty means loyalty to the state and battle against any threat to it.
ask yourself who hates holyrood the most now, and from what i have seen, has always done so.
from the 1st reluctance to set it up, till the present day.
they will go after credibility 1st!
link to electricscotland.com
Well I made a reasonable comment on the Herald online about the fact we will be getting a Media love in for Jim Murphy for the next 4 months. Comment was deleted as have been any comments mentioning Wings.
Herald subscription cancelled. At least I won’t have to read about the ‘plucky fighter’ and suchlike.
@liz – Coincidently!! there was an OO walk today in Glasgow city centre
FFS what were they singing? ‘at the Christmas bash my Father swore’
Murphy is a dirty politician who fights dirty campaigns.
His connections to the sinister Henry Jackson Society indicate someone supportive of neo-liberal policies and with close links to the intelligence community. Henry Jackson was a hawkish US Senator and the think-tank that bears his name is patronised by American neo-cons like Richard Perleman and James Woolsey (former director of the CIA), plus right-wing Tories like Michael Gove, Douglas Murray and David Willetts.
Murphy needs to be nailed on his position regarding the rendition flights, his reasons for supporting the Iraq War, and his involvement with this nefarious crowd. His needs grilled on his out-of-character and incoherent policy posturing like his support for income tax devolution and raising £250m from 16,000 taxpayers.
I repeat: Murphy is a dirty politician who fights dirty campaigns. Prepare.
Liz,
Aye, coincidentally, I’m sure ;-p I’ve never heard of a walk in December either; it probably is some deal that they’ve made. Christ, what an embarrassment.
Are you from Glasgow? Because I was thinking there must be something that we could do to complain to the councils about these walks – it’s not as though they can claim this isn’t a political thing anymore (it always was anyway), since the whole Naw/unionist thing. Can we write to our councillors and refuse to pay for it? I doubt they’d listen but surely since this is a unionist group (and was always offensive to most people anyway), we can ask that they at least pay for themselves. Or am I just being really naïve?
It’s time Nicola Sturgeon accepted vote for No means No – Kezia Dugdale
@ Kezia Dugdale
You appear to want NS to ‘cease and desist’, in expressing the wishes of roughly half the Scottish electorate. Have you forgotten we live in a ‘democracy’?
I appreciate how such radicalism has fallen out of fashion lately, so you might want to try google to help you reach a deeper understanding of the concept. 😉
And thou, all-shaking thunder,
Strike flat the thick rotundity o’ the world!
Crack nature’s moulds, all germens spill at once
That make ingrateful man!
Dr Gordon Brown, ex-politician, voted Murphy / Dugdale
Après moi, le déluge! 😀
All you need to know about what Scottish Labour now represent. Tweet from Iain Martin, your model Scottish Tory Boy, on Murphy’s election:-
“Good day for Labour, good day for the Union.”
Fiona
since keir hardie and today, they’ve had their chance.
now is the time of we the people, we are the change.
we lead they follow our lead.
labour don’t call us, we’ll call you.
things can only get better.
@Malky
I hate the idea of tactical voting.
So do I. Nobody on here should be talking about tactical voting in any constituency, especially when the SNP are so far ahead in the polls. The only way we will know the true support for the SNP in all constituencies is for all SNP supporters to vote for them regardless of who they think has the best chance of winning.
saporian
you say that, but i all amounts to the same thing.
we get the reps we the people want.
the grot campaign worked very well for scotland.
I’m not sayin Kezia’s hands are big, but I actually thought it was a picture of Murphy standing next to Kenny Everett’s “Brother Lee Love”, with those big giant hands he had.
link to youtube.com
It’s time Nicola Sturgeon accepted vote for No means No – Kezia Dugdale
Let’s be realistic, who gives a flying one reagrding what Kezia thinks?
HandandShrimp
i note she is asking us to accept her politics, as losers, i have always been given that this is a matter of personal choice.
it just so happens that 1.6m+ people agree with me.
including the snp.
The pair of them – a white yolk!
@muttley79
“Interesting reading in regards to the way Labour MPs and MSPs voted in the election for their leadership. A number voted for Murphy as only either their 3rd choice, or did not vote for him at all.
They include Malcolm Chisholm MSP (good guy)”
seems to be some comment on the others missing after this – could it be “w*nk ?
ronald alexander mcdonald says:
13 December, 2014 at 5:47 pm
Alex Salmond sold his tie for £1600. Jim Murphy sold his sole years ago.
They’ve finally done it. Elected a tory as Labour’s Scottish Branch Manager. Assisted by Keiza. A baffoon of a lassie.
================================
Alex Salmond gve the money he got to charity. Murphy took the money as much as he could claim and kept it for himself.
@Liz – how did the OO twats ever get permission to march? What are the police thinking. Its about time this nazi organisation was banned.
Arthur Thompson says
“Murphy’s right wing views on state sponsored poverty, university tuition fees etc ”
Em can I just ask Jim Murphy just how much his nine years at university cost him?
Someone should point out to deputy dug that we voted no to a labour government at the last Holyrood election but they haven’t yet shut up and given up.
We have 16 Labour MSP’s and MP’s who voted for a socialist/left of centre Labour leader
Jayne Baxter MSP, Katy Clark MP, Michael Connarty MP, Ian Davidson MP, Patricia Ferguson MSP, Neil Findlay MSP, Hugh Henry MSP, Cara Hilton MSP, Cathy Jamieson MP, Johann Lamont MSP, Graeme Morrice MP, Elaine Murray MSP, Alex Rowley MSP, Jim Sheridan MP, Drew Smith MSP, Elaine Smith MSP
Of the above the following 10 refused to vote for Murphy as a 2nd or 3rd choice
Katy Clark MP, Ian Davidson MP, Patricia Ferguson MSP, Neil Findlay MSP, Cara Hilton MSP, Cathy Jamieson MP, Johann Lamont MSP, Alex Rowley MSP, Jim Sheridan MP, Elaine Smith MSP
Anyone else think we could accommodate an ILP ( Independent Labour Party ) in the Keir Hardy mould in Scottish politics? Bit of a mixed bag but it would create merry hell with the Labour vote.
He’ll look awfy good in the Chamber’s pink jaiket; a bit like Portillo actually. And he’s like him in more ways than one, which why he goes down so well along in Newton Mearns. Best tory MP they’ve had…
@ John King,
Surely you mean cost us?
I saw Murphy’s promotion to Labour’s North Briton branch manager being referred to as, “….akin to being promoted captain of the Titanic after the iceberg had hit …”
you’ll love this. link to weegingerdug.wordpress.com 🙂
A few people here and elsewhere have commented on SLAB’s failure to reveal membership figures. This seems to be a golden opportunity for us.
Every time an independence supporter is asked a question mention that SLAB, a party who have a membership of less than 5000, can barely presume to speak for Scotland.
State it as a fact – if SLAB say the figure is wrong then the next question is obvious. In this way they will be kept on the back foot until they do release the figures.
Clootie, like you I abhor cruel sports but methinks I smell blood and I like it, can’t wait.
Have any of you seen the actual voting figures, not percentages, anywhere?
Auld Rock
Thanks for the votes cast by MPs & MSPs, both Murphy & Dugdale voted for their combined ‘dream ticket’ and no-one else. Forgot to check Boyack & Findlay.
Despite Jim’s leaning further to the right than the Tower of Pisa they think he’s a goer. To be fair, he’s the only one being considered by head office and by print/TV media. Everything that Labour voters stand for is pushed aside and the party moves further to the right. I remember when ‘the gang of four’ split from the Labour Party in the 80’s because it was too left wing. They formed the SDP who later joined with the Liberals, of course. The current Labour leadership is further to the right of them and out of step with voters. They do not deserve votes or loyalty from old supporters like me.
they see him as their last chance to save labour and the union.
Still giant on the hour love in for Murphy on BBC radio anyway. He knows he’s got more chance of being Prime Minister of teamGB than FM Holyrood so this what it’s all about. Scotland and Holyrood ‘s just a way back to shadow top jobs or even PM. It’s the only chance Murphy has at least?
Thanks to our ghastly media, it’s never discussed why Ed Milliband fired Eggs from Defence but it must have really hurt being demoted by a such a disappointing stuffed shirt like Ed.
One thing teamGB politics does teach us, don’t make enemies of thugs like Jim Murphy. Thus his ridiculous bombastic/cheezee bollocks on making Scotland “most equitable country in the world” having done and said anything to stop Scotland actually existing and being a member of the red Tory Labour governemt that made the UK the third most unequal country in the western world. There’s a whole lot of teamGB propaganda coming our way and all of it’s great for the career of one of our greediest Westminster troughers .
Thank god that is over.
My only concern is for BBC North britain. What are they going to fill their time with?
They are big hands. Just saying. Must watch that Seinfeld episode again.
Heedtracker
Every time Murphy / SLAB mention equitable country, poverty etc please remind all media outlets that Labour opposed the devolution of the minimum / living wage to the Scottish Parliament as they would prefer the Tories / UKIP in London to deal with this.
Margaret Curren on Jim Murphy
In 1997 the former National Union of Students leader Jim Murphy was widely seen as playing a key role in a successful Blairite ploy to expel numerous left-wingers, Home Rule supporters and feminists from the Scottish Labour executive.
After the Blairite Network group succeeded in removing Rosina McCrae and others from the executive in what was widely seen at the time as a coup for the right wing of the party, at the time, the now Shadow Scotland Minister Margaret Curran said: “My membership fees are not paid to have Jim Murphy carve up Rosina. We should be an organisation for committed activists, not hollow careerists.”
Colin McCartney 7:33pm Leadership vote breakdown
I also checked how the Parliamentarians voted and found it interesting that some of them voted only for Murphy and Dugdale. The other two candidates received no 2nd or 3rd preference votes from any the following:
MSP’s -Jackie Baillie, Clare Baker, Kezia Dugdale,Mark Griffin, Ken McIntosh, Jenny Marra, Anne McTaggart, John Pentland
MP’s- Gordon Banks, Gordon Brown, Russell Brown,Tom Harris, Michael McCann, Jim Murphy, Pamela Nash, Fiona McDonnell, Lindsay Roy, Anas Sarwar
MEP-Catherine Stihler
Duncan McNeil only voted for Murphy, he never bothered to vote for any of the Deputy leader candidates!
What does this say about these 20 named parliamentarians? Do they really not rate their colleagues ability to do the job(s), even to the extent of NOT voting for them at all? Wow.
Was this a concerted bit of group think by likeminded people to deny the opposition any traction? If so, ithat could be classed as a professional hatchet job on fellow candidates and despicable politics. But hey, this is SLAB!
In any event, the outcome will not help unity within the party. Oh dear, how sad, never mind.
@Colin McCartney
I am not really sure what your point was in your reply to my post. Could you elaborate on it?
Anyone else sick of the sight of Murphy’s big horsey face?
Here’s a picture of a Blobfish, just for a wee break:
link to dispatch.com
How beelin must Jackie Baillie be this evening?
I mean, really – Big J has been a rock of unthinking dogma for SLAB to cling to for ages now.
I reckon she must have been bought off on a promise of a plum job in quango land or an early ermine collar.
Did she vote for Eggy Murphy and Deputy Dug?
‘if labour loses scotland’ murphy says, labour does not own scotland, it is not labour’s to lose.
that’s the reality of how they think, in terms of entitlement.
the treat us as if pawns, gains, and losses.
if they saw us as being people, they would have also seen the poverty that we fight to end.
they didn’t notice us until now, when we have the power to evict them from office.
they have to earn the privilege to be selected as our servants.
they have not earned that privilege, but have lost it because they took us for granted for far too long.
Murphy stands for everything that we are trying to get away from. Why do you think he fits in so well in East Renfrewshire, one of the most prosperous areas in Scotland.
When was the last time he had to fight for a Labour value in East Renfrewshire.
We have got so much ammo we can fire at this guy. Red Tory Blairite, illegal wars, supporter of torture flights, member of Friends of Israel, supports Trident renewal. It’s endless. If we can’t beat this loser then we should give it up.
He has to be exposed. We have to get him out of the comfort zone of the BBC Scotland studio.
The ideal SNP candidate to stand against Murphy in East Renfrewshire would be Craig Murray. That would be a contest worth watching! What about it, Craig?
Who would be surprised that BBC 24, shortly after the announcement of Murphy’s election, found a suitably detached journalist to comment on the result. Who but Catherine MacLeod, political commentator from The Herald, former adviser to Alistair Darling, and consistent Labour luvvie. She effused enthusiastically about “Jim” and “his attachment to traditional Labour values” although she failed to clarify if this extended to his enthusiastic support of illegal wars and rendition.
Weegingerdug.wordpress.com/2014/12/13/running-down-shettleston-road-naked-with-a-red-rose-up-my-bum/#comments
Wee Ginger Dug snapping at “Labour”‘s heels again, magic:-)
A great article with humour at all levels:
1) Kezia’s big hands – derived nae doubt as Lard George’s bag carrier – soon to get bigger as Mr Murphy’s.
2) an exquisite line, proving that the subtle, quiet, use of words often beats the coarser approach as per “a convivial celebration in a brewery” – brilliant, roars of laughter from this area of “I’m all right Jockland” in Edinburgh.
3) The what could happen next – section 3 – what a hoot, what was that German word again – schadenfreude? Yep!
And finally, the thought occurs – if the BBC (or their ilk) do the usual politician of the year stuff, will Kezia win the bag carriers, bag carrier of the year award for 2014/15?
@Fairliered
Agreed – Craig Murray are you up for it?
But Murphy’s a brawler, as this account reports, and that could make quite a difference:
link to scotsman.com
When Murphy was appointed Secretary of State for Scotland in 2008, he asked officials to arrange a meeting with First Minister Alex Salmond and requested that he and the SNP leader have five minutes in private before they were joined by their teams. The call came back that Salmond would be happy to meet but that it would not be possible to have that private session.
Murphy agreed to Salmond’s conditions and then began the meeting by asking for five minutes in private. His team, teed up for this moment, stood and left the meeting room, leaving Salmond’s officials with little option but to do likewise.
Labour and SNP sources alike say that what followed was a tense confrontation between Murphy and Salmond. Murphy, it is said, told Salmond he considered him a “f***ing bully” and warned that he would not be trodden over. Apparently Salmond spluttered that this wasn’t terribly collegiate to which Murphy responded that it was as well they understood each other
clochoderic says:
“How beelin must Jackie Baillie be this evening?
Did she vote for Eggy Murphy and Deputy Dug?”
Not only did she vote for them, she ONLY voted for them. No 2nd or 3rd choices. Funny how shite attracts more shite, isn’t it?
@ Sinky check out the hootsman freak show, although to be fair they had no idea Eggs would single handedly save teamGB, on his own, resurrecting his career that had failed so catastrophically. How Tory boy UKOKists change their tune
link to scotsman.com
“Their removal has been linked by some to Unite general secretary Len McCluskey, who wrote in a newspaper last year: “Liam Byrne, Jim Murphy, Stephen Twigg and now Ed Balls: four horsemen of the austerity apocalypse.”
or
“Sources close to Mr Miliband insisted there had been no consultation with the union boss about the changes and denied they represented a clear-out of shadow cabinet Blairites”
or
One senior Labour source said: “There is a flicker of a change of policy on Trident being behind this move. I am concerned about it. If we do change policy, it will cause serious ructions. I really hope we don’t have to go through that debate again.”
In a further sign of a “purge of the Blairites” Mr Miliband appointed Wayne David – who was involved in the plot to remove Tony Blair in 2006 – as his parliamentary private secretary.”
Eggs says ban the bomb? vote Murphy and on it goes. Its probably going to be another 5 years of Tory rule, Milliband will go and who’s there to lead red Tory Labour in England? Eggs Murphy.
@No no no…Yes 8.34
The breakdown of the votes shows just how much they hate or love each other. And Smurphy is a divisive character.
I do think that there will a lot of ” thanks for the offer Jim, but I will be washing my hair for the next 5 months” !
Congratulations to Jim Murphy, I’m just sorry Anas Sarar didn’t stand. He’s a intellectual Titan. So we got second prize but lets wish Jim all the best in the elections in 2015 and 2016.
We’re rooting for you!
@HandandShrimp
This almost constant plea by unionist politicians in Scotland for the SNP and independence supporters in general to accept the No vote is curious. As far as I can tell the vast majority of voters have accepted the result of the referendum. We know we got beat, if we had won we would probably have been celebrating for days.
I can only guess from these calls to accept the result from Kezia Dugdale and co, is that they want us to go back in our box, shut up, go away, and not to support independence any longer. I have no idea what Dugdale is trying to achieve here. More to the point, do they understand basic democratic principles? Just because you got beat in one vote, it does not follow that you are required to renounce the cause that you believe in.
Artical in the National dec 10th by Andrew Mcfadyen ( ex liebor adviser) qoutes… “Jim Murphy has reinvented himself. To put it mildly the Eastwood MP is not known as a champion of home rule . But over the past few weeks he has cast off his scepticism towards the Scottish Parliament like a snake removing it’s old skin.” I would prefer to just call him a snake oil salesman,… further on in the article …”The same could be true of Jim Murphy. He will demand the right to set his own agenda, appoint his own people and adopt any policy that will help him win.
For his next trick, perhaps he could come out against Trident…we can hope i suppose. I would prefer if the good people of Renfrewshire gave him his P45…come May 2015.
Hobbit: But Murphy’s a brawler, as this account reports, could make quite a difference:
More here … 🙂
‘Jim Murphy MP’ grousebeater-wordpress
I wonder what Anas Sarwar thinks of Jim Murphy’s views on Palestine?
@muttley79
Sorry – was playing on your “good guy” comment on Malcolm Chisholm. Chewing the Fat had a good guy/wank sketch that was quite entertaining. Sorry if it missed the mark
link to youtube.com
Do not underestimate the devious unctuous Jim Murphy and his media supporters. He may be policy free and a right wing Blairite but the media won’t hold him to account.
Worth reading Derek Bateman’s analysis
link to newsnetscotland.scot
What we need is to galvanise the 70,000 new SNP members to get out on the doorsteps and write to Unionist news outlets rather than posting to pro Indy sites.
No point just talking to ourselves.
Rev, did you need to mention the size of Kezia’s hands.
No one would have noticed and we could have got on with our lives. But now we won’t be listening to a word she says, we will be to busy watching her hands.
And by coincidence, one of Kezia’s fav songs got played on the TV. Max Bygraves: “You Need Hands”
link to youtube.com
Everyone says don’t underestimate Murphy, and I’m sure that’s a wise piece of advice. The man’s a slippery character, and the media just love him. Look at that farcical tour shouting at empty street corners being transformed into a bravura, game-changing performance.
I just can’t get my head round why anyone would be tempted to vote Labour by the Skull being in the leadership position. Do I have a different set of glasses from oreinary voters, or what?
@Colin McCartney
No probs. I get you now. Malcolm Chisholm is about the only person left in SLAB that I have time for.
Re the big hands, it’s quite simple, the photo was taken close up with a wide angle lens, that’s whats caused the distortion. (I take photos for a living.)
dougiekdy,
I can think of nothing more enjoyable. I have however already been nominated in two constituencies – Falkirk, and Airdrie and Shotts, and another branch has just asked me if I will accept a nomination too. That’s nominated into the line-up of possible candidates. There are other excellent potential candidates in each place. I haven’t actually got the result of my vetting process yet either. So its all very uncertain, frankly.
Kezia goes to the shops without carrier bags, and gets the checkout assistant to put all the messages into her gigantic cupped hands. Sortit!
@Ian Brotherhood
“Anyone else sick of the sight of Murphy’s big horsey face?”
Aye. And his party. And the BBC sookin up tae him.
Portillo moment 1997? Murphy moment 2015 – cannae wait.
A reminder that I’ll be taking questions on Scotland’s Talk-in tomorrow 11am – 12 noon. Would love to hear from you. link to clyde1.com …
If Boney-M still has his bru-crates he can do a joint tour with Kez, and give her one.
‘Murphy’s Salute’ – let’s give it a wee push folks…
link to youtube.com
@Craig Murray
Nice to know your wanted.
No matter where, I hope you get in there with the head down. Not business as usual, we want all elected to old their feet to the fire. Things have changed.
@Bob Mack
As far as film titles go, Bob, you could also have Liar, Liar!
Thepnr dear – wot’s happened to your spelling?
@Paula Rose
I’m getting hold.
@Craig Murray
Whichever one you get (I’m sure you will!) you’ll do us proud – if Broon was standing in Kirkcaldy I was nominating you – shame that Broon’s a coward and you won’t get the chance:-)
Never winch a burd with big hands! 🙂
Someone on WOS, many months ago, nailed Murphy’s 100 Towns Tour as the teeing-up for his leadership bid after Lamont being hoofed – sorry, but I can’t remember who it was. A regular.
And so it came to pass…
Here’s a wee reminder of the packaging which made him appear to be such a martyr for the cause:
link to youtube.com
I would hope that Craig puts his name in for North East Fife.
BBC announce Labour have 14000 members and SNP have 92000 in their news bulletin at 10:00pm Radio 4.
I think both of these numbers are wrong.
This post, Ian?
” Dick Gaughan says:
29 August, 2014 at 1:03 pm
Rev Stu Cambell says:
“And it makes the point of the exercise a little hard to discern.”
He’s positioning himself for leadership of SLAB when he loses his job in WM with a “Jim is a man of principle” pitch –
“I did more than anyone to fight for my belief that the Union was best and braved the wrath of egg-chucking and abusive Nats all over the country. But The People have spoken and as a democrat I respect their decision so I will now fight equally as hard to … blah blah blah. So gonnae gies a joab, eh?””
‘Take a look at these hands!’
Talking Heads, ‘Born Under Punches’ (Live, 1980) –
link to youtube.com
All of these relate to 2011, so might not be relevant today.
The Labour Party should resist pressure to embrace the boycott movement and should remain a staunch supporter of Israel under Ed Miliband’s leadership, according to Labour’s defence spokesman, Jim Murphy.
He said the party’s decision to urge the government to vote for Palestinian statehood should not be seen as a betrayal of Israel, and warned that nothing would be solved by “a one-off symbolic vote at the United Nations”. – Jim Murphy
link to thejc.com
Unlike a similar “friends of Israel” group belonging to the Liberal Democrats – the junior party in the ruling coalition – the LFI does not appear to have supplied any information about the sources of its finances to the UK’s Electoral Commission. This lack of disclosure could be illegal. Legislation applying to “members’ associations” of political parties stipulates that all donations above £7,500 ($11,600) must be notified to the Commission within 30 days.
link to electronicintifada.net
Labour spokesman took £10,000 donation from technology firm
Jim Murphy, the shadow defence secretary, accepted a £10,000 donation from the technology firm Dr Liam Fox met in Dubai.
link to telegraph.co.uk
Does this compute given that zionism is anti-semitism?
link to antisemitism.org.uk
Here is a challenge for Wingers.
Rogue SNP councillor Arthur Morrison resigned his position as Kirkcaldy East Fife Council representative after moving to Austria to take up a job opportunity.
The Council By Election is on 22 January in Gordon Brown’s constituency. It will be a hard ask to win the seat under council by election voting system but it would a strong message if the SNOP could win this seat.
Time express some of my concerns.
1) Murphy is ruthless. He will lie and manipulate in the same way BT did, focusing on older voters. He will say whatever he thinks will gain votes. And, the MSM and BBC in Scotland will dutifully treat his rhetoric as truth and wisdom.
2) There will be no Yes Alliance. WM2015 will not be a rerun of the referendum. It will be party politics. In FPTP only the SNP can take seats for the Indy cause. Firstly the Greens and SSP may soak up votes and cause some Labour seats not to fall to the SNP. Secondly, I fear the SNP’s election campaign will not have the scale and diversity of the Yes campaign we have just seen.
3) For the last 10 days of the referendum campaign the full weight of the London media took an interest in Scotland because it suddenly became a threat to their cosy establishment. We might assume they will spend WM2015 focusing on their own wee corner with a Lab Con UKIP [Lib] focus. However, suppose early on they recognise that the SNP and not UKIP is likely to be the third party! Then Murphy et al suddenly have much more than the puny Scottish media behind them for months, not 10 days.
It will not be a push over for the SNP to gain the large number of seats some people suggest.
It’s going to be hard graft!
Sunday Herald front page;
link to twitter.com
Can we please promote “deputy dug” for ongoing usage – love it!
@Paula Rose –
Never mind his spelling – what’s happened to his bleedin’ name?
Christmas come early. Labour had the audacity to suggest that the snp would have a back seat driver in Mr salmond, whilst at the same time murphy was being lined up to run the northern Britain branch of labour.
anti-Semitism should read anti-Semitic.
Educate your grannies educate your children educate your neighborhood. Parasites are trying hard to feed.. Like any good parasite it’ll fight till the end
@gala
In regards to your third point I cannot see that happening. The UK MSM only really got interested in the indy referendum in the last two weeks of the campaign. They are simply not going to spend months in Scotland covering the general election here. It ain’t going to happen. What would they do up here for three months or so? They would get so bored. The MSM in the UK are essentially the establishment media in London. They have a notoriously insular mindset in regards to anywhere beyond the south east of England. At best, they might cover the GE in Scotland more extensively than usual, but I would still expect the focus to remain on where it usually is.
Ian,
The other name went on holiday?
wonder who gets more media air time. nicola sturgeon taking over leadership of snp and first minister position or rattlesnake jim becoming leader of scottish branch of labour party?
Ian honey – it’s the Thepnr we love back to his old self!
Sorry, did I call Broon a “coward”?
I do apologise, what I meant to say is he’s a charlatan, a chancer and a political opportunist of the highest order.
That’s a bit more accurate, sorry for getting it wrong first time round.
@Fairliered (10.13) –
Aha!
Well found there! I wouldn’t have known where to start looking.
And so it was oor very ain Dick Gaughan, eh?! I hope he sees this, and is pleased that his prescient interpretation was not only appreciated at the time, but was successfully traced. I also hope Dick gets the chance, some day, to show it to Boney first-hand – preferably on the same day that the latter delivers his resignation statement.
Ah Ian
Using the phone, settings still saved. Sorted it just for you 🙂
Listening to BBC Radio 2 this afternoon the news bulletin led with Murphy quoted as promising to reclaim Voters from the SNP. He promised a better Scotland etc… A recording of Curran backing this up followed saying he was gonna be brilliant or some such rhubarb. I waited for an analysis or alternative view but nope, that was it. On UK radio. I’ve got news for JM…The higher you fly the further you fall…
call me dave says:
13 December, 2014 at 10:10 pm
BBC announce Labour have 14000 members and SNP have 92000 in their news bulletin at 10:00pm Radio 4.
I think both of these numbers are wrong.
The 14000 figure seems to be way out of date, and even then it was based on some, let’s say rather creative counting (e.g. one trick is to include all members of associations affiliated to Labour (whether they like it or not). The real figure may currently be nearer 4000 than 14000.
The Red Tories saying that they still have 14000 members is about as honest and reliable as the Daily Record saying they actually sell 200000 copies of their rag every day.
muttley79 9.01pm
“This almost constant plea by unionist politicians in Scotland for the SNP and independence supporters in general to accept the No vote is curious.”
I also think they need reminding of the latest opinion poll on Scottish Independence. Yougov today:
YES 52%
NO 48%
@muttley79
“The UK MSM only really got interested in the indy referendum in the last two weeks of the campaign.”
I have to disagree slightly with this comment, muttley, as the UK media were all over the Commonwealth Games, with their non-stop promotion of England and TeamGB.
Damn – no more bad spelling, he’s got sensible again.
James Cook said on Twitter that he asked Labour and was told 14,000. He didn’t say when he asked but I would presume recently.
Do we think Labour is lying? Or at least indulging in some very creative accounting? Why yes we do. But, what way is there to find out other than asking them? The SNP membership numbers are also “taken on trust” from SNP headquarters, it’s just that we tend to believe them, first because the reports appear credible and internally consistent, and second because 12,000 people don’t book out the Hydro from nowhere.
I don’t see any way to counter this, no matter who adds up membership income and makes intelligent deductions from it. If Labour are prepared to declare they have 14,000 members, that’s going to be what’s reported.
And of course there will be no investigative journalism. The media and especially the BBC are going to build a wall to prevent voters hearing anything positive about the SNP and beam Labour propaganda at them 24/7, just as they did during the referendum.
Diego Garcia seems to be the place of choice for torturing terrorist suspects, I wonder how much Murphy and David Miliband knew about the British Island of Diego Garcia?
Gordon Brewer will probably ask him on the Sunday Politics programme tomorrow.
call me dave says:
“BBC announce Labour have 14000 members and SNP have 92000 in their news bulletin at 10:00pm Radio 4.
I think both of these numbers are wrong.”
And you are correct – they are wrong.
Couldn’t say what the SNP numbers are but i’ll bet they’re higher.
As for Slabber figures – the one quoted is utter bull.
The BBC have been deliberately loosely throwing about a range of figures in the past month – from 13,000 to 17,000.
If you challenge them on it and ask for the source of their info or make a Freedom Of Information request, they either deny you the information by hiding behind some obscure exception to the FOI Act or if you are exceptionally lucky they will tell you that they go by the most recent figures they have and then they proceed to refer you to this link from several years ago.
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7320255.stm
Slabbers membership figures are widely believed to be well under 10K.
As Morag points out above, Murphy is pretty dangerous. You can read whatever you want into him, and that is exactly what a Unionst-leaning press loves. Murphy will get a lot of air time.
There’s a pretty good analysis over at NewsNetScotland:
link to newsnetscotland.scot
Labour has made a good choice, and the SNP has no room for complacency between now and May. Nicola has her work cut out
Well, as I said, James Cook of the BBC says he asked, and Labour told him 14,000. I presume that’s true, but what’s anyone supposed to do if Labour simply lie to journalists?
@clootie
Skeletor and Deputy Dug, does it for me.
Mind you, for a minute there I was leaning toward The Joker and Harley Quinn…
Sorry folks, removed the http:// part from the link above and it didn’t work. This is the article the BBC occasionally refers you to when you question their Slabber membership figures.
link to archive.today
___________________________
btw, Thanks for that front page Marcia.
I like the bottom line: “52% would vote for Independence today.”
Still not the magical 60+ but its creeping up.
🙂
I don’t think any of these two have the work ethic or employment record. Professional spongers and expense junkies would cover their CV.
Let’s not forget Jimba left South Africa so he didn’t have to serve in the Nasty appardhied army. Let’s also not forget Jim volunteered to support Isreal’s anti Palestinian government and army with the the task of stealing as much Palestinian land and “thinning” them out now and again.
Towards the end of apartheid Isreal’s was one of the few countries in the world that had not distanced itself from SA.
JIMBA IS A MAN OF PRINCIPALS, AND KEZIA IS AS HONEST AND TRUTHFUL AS JABA.
The EBC & MSM will back them up till their nose bleeds. Rule BRITANIA! in yer dreams.
Agree with Morag on this. Murphy is Milliband’s man in Scotland
He will get his reward from the establishment when he “delivers” Labour
MP ‘s for Westminster ( This is his brief from Milliband.)
It matters not how he achieves this, and no doubt he will try to
Set a phoney left wing agenda inScotland to ” con” the electorate
Which will be “eagerly promoted” on the “Jackie Burd” show etc
From mow until May 2015
Thereafter if he is still struggling in the polls with 2 weeks to go, no
Doubt Nick Robinson and the gang from BBC London will invade
Us to lend him “a hand” to get him “over the line”
Kezia is the ideal choice as Jim’s deputy. With those hands there’s no chance any egg will get past her.
Been a whe since I last posted, good to see some positivity and good humour back and les trashing of ‘No’ voters.
Ian B – any news or word on an Ayrshire ‘Yes’ meeting at all, seems to have gone very quiet?
On topic – I remember the GE in 97, there were 9 or11 Tory held seats and they lost them all- the biggest majority and least likely was Eastwood, which in a post-age doc about the rise of New Lab had Gordon Brown exclaiming, ‘We’ve taken Eastwood?’ As it was such a siesmic result.
What’s your point?
Labour have held this seat, now JMs East Ren, with ease at every GE on the back of th comfortable class who kid on that they at Social Democrats and are basically ‘always voted Tory but don’t mind Blair’ types.
A significant number of voters are of this ilk, it opens up tactical voting opportunities and with the docile, compliant media JM has a pretty good platform with which to subjugate Scotland.
We have our work cut out, I hope the level of Yes leaning activism can match the rise I party memberships as I am still haunted by my experience on Ref polling day when the Yes team basically managed to man all the polling places only for this to be matched by BT and the Labour ground machine kicking in with over 20+ bodies out knocking on doors and getting vote out.
Onwards!
Probably best to establish a watching brief on “Spud” Murphy before offering opinions about the Labour Party in Scotland and his leadership of it. Past events indicate he will divide and rule with an iron fist. So expect a number of resignations and defectors. His weak link is his relationship with the Unions and Labour Party voters. He is well briefed on the attitude of the US in regard to Trident and it would be of no surprise if he committed the Party to giving it up whilst retaining all of the submarine fleet in Scotland. Ed Miliband would need to respond in kind otherwise Murphy would not assure the Labour party in England of Scottish Labour support assuming Labour would be the largest party in Westminster, but without an overall majority. Mch to play for, including theft of some of the SNP policies.
@Can-m 11:14
Re diago Garcia let’s not forget how the natives of this GB colony were evicted to a concentration camp by their colonial masters to allow the US government to use the islands for bombing Middle East countries for a bit of target practice and flying their lethal model airplanes from. Plus I believe the R&R facilities are second to none. God bless HMQ and her Government. Proud to be British!
Aye in yer dreams.
Maybe the 14k members for Labour explains Skeletors election. Imagine they print 14000 ballot papers. 5 or 6 thousand for actual voters and the rest to cover for spoiled or mislaid papers. Who could say what the result of any poll could be nowadays.
Don’t give me the credit for getting the measure of Murphy. I can’t understand what anyone sees in the two-faced shouty creep. But I see how the press treat him, and that spells danger to me.
We lost the referendum because of the “one conversation at a time” strategy. Not everyone is susceptible to constant harping from a friend, not everyone has a friend prepared to do it. But even those who were prepared to talk and listen, and take it on board, then turned on their TVs and opened their papers, and a series of positive conversations were rendered useless in quarter of an hour.
People trust what they see in print and hear on TV and radio far more than they do their own friends and relatives. The media have authority and we’re conditioned to give them credence. Stu said the media built a wall between the Yes campaign and the voters and that’s it in a nutshell.
Well they’re going to go right on doing it. We may have Murphy’s number, but he’s going to be portrayed as some sort of cross between Sir Galahad, Gandhi and Good King Wenceslas for the next five months. This isn’t going to do us any good at all.
To those that decry the treatment of list MSPs as second class, there are reasons for that, you know.
List MSPs are often failed candidates for a constituency seat. Its hard to be taken seriously when you are only there because you sucked so hard during the campaign for a constituency seat.
A way to reform this may be to bar anyone standing for a constituency seat from being eligable for a place on the list. This way you dont have a list system dominated by a shower of losers, and you open up the field for other candidates too.
The list system takes its legitimacy from the abilities of the MSPs elected using it. Its not easy to find talent among losers(Sturgeon was a rare exception to this rule, but she went on to win a seat outright later. Plus she was trying to take a seat in a labour heartland)
Many list MSPs are losers, especially unionist ones, and pathetic ones at that. They are mocked and derided because they have *no* ability. Case in point. Dugdale. Rennie. Ruthie. If these parties stopped flooding their lists with losers, then this class of MSP may actually begin to get the respect they should recieve.
@Kirsty – sorry about getting back late but was out.
I don’t live in Glasgow constituency but there has to be a complaint made about why this was allowed during the Christmas season.
They should be allowed to have one march in July and that is it, Mathieson et al are stirring up some serious trouble if they allowed these marches to happen whenever thee OO want.
Don’t know who will take it on though.
@Kirsty – sorry about getting back late but was out.
I don’t live in Glasgow constituency but there has to be a complaint made about why this was allowed during the Christmas season.
They should be allowed to have one march in July and that is it, Mathieson et al are stirring up some serious trouble if they allowed these marches to happen whenever thee OO want.
Don’t know who will take it on though.
Hi Wings
I asked a question of Murphy’s Twitter cheerleaders Q: what did Murphy do against apartheid while in SA. It provoked a very extreme reaction calling me nasty names. I am thinking there might be more to the story. Might be worth investigating
Great front page on the Sunday Herald. The dinosaur is becoming the trademark of Slab.
Good piece by Derek Bateman too over on Newsnet. I think it is all very sage advice about Murphy, and don’t think anyone will really be complacent about him.
One thing that does give me slight concern is that SNP is going to have to take the gloves off with him, and in the run up to the GE. Sometimes you do have to fight fire with fire, with a few well aimed punches, cos Murphy does at least have skellys knocking about.
Patrick Harvie of the Greens showed his teeth today –
“Congrats to Jim Murphy and Kezia Dugdale, commiserations to the Scottish Labour Party”
That’s what I’m talking about!
Bit radical but we need to drop ’45’ badges and associated ‘yes’ badging and try and educate reluctant no voters with sensible positive arguments to pro independence.
We need more people.
We will not get them by building walls and exclusive clubs.
Independence will come sooner with more people on indy side.
Thoughtsofascot, it’s a bit late to start this argument, but while I understand where you’re coming from, I think it’s a dangerous road to go down. In 1999 and 2003, SNP candidates were coming good seconds all over Scotland. They tried hard for the constituencies but couldn’t break past the Labour strangle-hold. We’d have lost a lot if they hadn’t been eligible for the list. Then, in the end, the breakthrough happened in 2011. Sturgeon is only one example.
Morag “We lost the referendum because of the “one conversation at a time” strategy” is not right. “We” were asked the wrong question. We should have been have been asked, Do you agree Scotland should have devo max? This is what polls show Scotland wanted and still wants. Its that simple.
Its why EVEL Tory boy planning is ongoing, to keep actual Scots away from power and its why Murphy and the BBC will ultimately fail. Its why Labour in Scotland are on their way out and its why we were denied it. Its what the next referendum should be. 10 or 12 years of devo max and Scotland becomes a self governing nation state. We are an English colony but out of the hundred or so countries they thought they owned, we are unique just for being on their border.
@Col the Viking –
Hoots there mister.
Best I know is this – what ‘was’ the Three Towns Yes group recently became (part of?) the ‘Ayrshire Independence Movement’, and has been meeting in Ardeer Neighbourhood Centre fortnightly.
If you’ve had any contact with previous 3Towns Yes group, you’ll know some names already. Gary O’Rourke, Tam Brotherston were the folk I recognised at the meeting I attended (and was made very welcome at, as an SSP member). Sorry I don’t have any contact for ‘A.I.M.’ as such, but I guess Gary O’Rourke would be the most direct route. Mind you, that would be for North Ayrshire – what’s happening more generally? Not sure.
There was talk of ‘Ayrshire Independence Movement’ having a Facebook page. I don’t do FB, but it might be worth a search.
Actually, to continue this, the Labour list MSPs are so pathetic precisely because they were on the list not standing in constituencies. Labour didn’t allow both. THey expected to win their usual constituencies and then pick up a few from the top of the list. They put the dross on the lists.
Then their big beasts were kicked out, and kicked out good. Their strategy was good for the SNP, but not for them and actually not for Holyrood. It led to the opposition being absolutely dire.
Ruthie is just useless wherever you put her. The Tories have virtually no talent these days (q.v. Mundell), but people still vote for them to some extent so anything will get elected.
Heedtracker, I was being simplistic of course. But what you describe is an entirely different referendum which I don’t believe we could have had. We (the SNP) would have had to have defined devo-max, but only Westminster could have granted it. If we’d had a consultative referendum for a huge change to the UK constitution like that, We’d simply have been told we couldn’t have it. Go directly to the Smith commission after winning, do not pass Go, do not collect responsibility for anything at all really.
We could debate that all night of course. But if you consider the referendum we had, I believe excessive reliance on “one conversation at a time” plus the relentless avoidance of anything deemed “negative” are where the seeds of defeat were sown.
Will Kezia now be the “leader aff” for the labour seat warmers in the wee parlie at FMQ’s?
@Ian/Col
I don’t do FB either, but Yes East Ayrshire has a page, plus a regular street stall in Kilmarnock on Saturdays, and is working on other activities. Yes Cumnock also still active (and on FB). I think there is something going on in the south, but have no details.
Inverclyde Region was artificially created by the Tory party by stripping it away from Strathclyde in the late ninety’s. It was calculated the newly created area would be marginal and might well be persuaded to support the Tories or Lib/Dems, They were not lucky and a labour controlled minority council was returned, (supported by LIB/Dems and now one Tory?).
The period 2000-2014 has proved to be disastrous for the poor residents of Inverclyde but it is difficult to find a deal of sympathy for an electorate that again and again votes for the Red Rose of labour regardless of past events, broken promises, financial mismanagement, inefficiency and levels of incompetence easily matching those of the Glasgow District Council.
2003; the council was branded one of the worst in Scotland and was ordered to seek outside help to solve its problems. The Accounts Commission said, ” Inverclyde Council requires urgent remedial action to address weaknesses in its leadership and direction.
2003; Inverclyde residents, (male and female) have the lowest life expectancy in the UK. This after introduction of a Labour devolved government and six Labour full years in power in Westminster and four years in the Scottish Parliament, Labour has completely failed to tackle the underlying problems of poverty and deprivation which lead to low life expectancy.
2008; Inverclyde Council forgot to apply for Government funding allocated to local authorities for tackling health inequalities. Fortunately a local SNP MSP was informed of the pending disaster and warned the Council. Although out of submission time by a number of weeks the MSP was able to persuade the Scottish government to include the bid. It is said no mention of the matter was ever recorded by the Council
2009, Inverclyde introduce the, Future Operating Model designed to save £6.4m over three years. Creating many thousands of jobs. Consultancy Fee £650K. The project was abandoned costing the Council nearly £1m. The saga rolled on and on 191 jobs were created at a cost of £317 each new post.
There are many other examples of breathtaking incompetence requiring writes off of many millions, much of it under-reported.
The people of Inverclyde need to waken up and smell the coffee. Get rid of the Labour Party regime that has been treating residents with the utmost contempt for over 60 years. Vote for the future and your children not for your parents and the past. Have courage.
See the full article. It’ll make you weep.
link to caltonjock.com
Kezia is going to be chewed up and spat out by Nicola. I think she’s even better than Alex. Kezia is toast, in so many ways.
Morag, i can understand that point of view. I am sure there is a compromise somewhere between both extremes. Maybe allowing the 2nd placed candidate to take a list seat, but 3rd and 4th placed ones are barred? Parties should decide where they want to concentrate their talent, rather than forcing upon the electorate candidates that were vhemently rejected, like say…Ruthie.
The list system also ought to be used as a way to inject fresh blood into the system, rather than recycle crap student activists and useless prats that sit there silently doing nothing. There has to be some way to reform it to make it better for the Scottish people.
I don’t know the constitutional issues on a devo max referendum Morag. Its certainly a legitimate option if only because they denied it on the referendum ballot paper.
Personally I found that Scots voting no were either very wealthy slave wage paying Tory boys, rich thanks to daddy etc or, and this was the majority, hard working Scots with jobs and young children and a mortgage and totally freaked out by Crash Gordon, BBC daily monstering AlicSamin, Project Fear, Flipper and co lying about no currency, Scots oil is just too too much for Scots to handle and so on. We all know this. Project Fear worked and they’ll do the same again, but it doesn’t mean Scots don’t want their country back for good.
I noticed that too. Alex was always too nice and left open routes for the opposition to back down and save face during FMQ(though they were always too damn dim to notice and pressed on into the rhetorical gattling gun anyway).From what I have seen Nicola really does take no prisoners in her methods. She presses home like a lawyer(to be expected!). Shes great.
Yes, Nicola’s lawyer experience showed at FMQs. This is going to be a lot of fun.
@Morag
“What are journalists supposed to do if Labour just lie?”
They’re supposed to apply what they learned about journalism: “Research, enquire, ask awkward questions and question the answers then ask again and don’t stop until you unearth the truth.” – Bob Woodward
Managing d’Hondt is a difficult issue. What about small parties, should they simply give up on the constituencies because they’re likely to come so low down their candidates couldn’t then get list places? Also, ranking is a very blunt instrument.
I think at some stage you just have to leave it to the parties to put up who they want and then to the electorate to punish them for bad choices. It’s not working out so badly for now.
I would like to explore open lists though. A lot of people object to the closed list allowing parties to get anyone they want elected. It’s not so different from a safe seat really, but it’s perceived differently. I’m told open lists would improve that.
Dr Ew, they’d probably say they’re taking the SNP at their word so why would they not do the same for Labour. The Labour system is so arcane it would be difficult to prove they’re lying, too.
Heedtracker, I agree, Project Fear worked, but it worked partly because it was unopposed. Nobody was allowed to say anything to show that there were reasons to fear a No vote.
From Wikipedia…
“Journalism is gathering, processing, and dissemination of news and information related to the news to an audience. The word applies to both the method of inquiring for news and the literary style which is used to disseminate it.
In some nations, the news media is still controlled by government intervention, and is not fully an independent body”.
With regards to smaller parties, the list system could be used to raise the profile of their own candidates, before attempting to take a constituency later. Though admittedly, for this to be applicable we first have to kill labour and win our independence…which is no easy task. As long as there remains some people tribally attached to the labour party, small parties will find it hard to take constituency seats.
Reform of the d’hondt system through open lists would help improve the legitimacy of the system. I think its fair to say that the closed system does no favours for it in that regard because as you said, it creates defacto safe seats, which is an undemocratic aberration of a feature on what is supposed to be a fairer system.
Morag’s everywhere!
I think there is a can of worms to be opened re Murphy’s getting 60% of the membership vote.
saporian,
“Nobody on here should be talking about tactical voting in any constituency, especially when the SNP are so far ahead in the polls. The only way we will know the true support for the SNP in all constituencies is for all SNP supporters to vote for them regardless of who they think has the best chance of winning.”
I support that in principle.
But I want Scottish Labour not just to be decimated, but to be eliminated.
I therefore want firebrand socialists like Tommy Sheridan to stand against the likes of Ian Davidson and Willy Bain and SNP voters to vote tactically for them.
I support any pro independence ‘loose cannon’ who has the best chance of unseating Labour MPs in their socialist heartlands.
heedtracker
Does this help?
link to blogs.lse.ac.uk
@Rock –
Hear hear.
Speaking personally – SSP hat discarded momentarily – what you say makes perfect sense. The problem, given that the SNP don’t need any overt ‘lefties’ onboard, is that we’d end up being accused of splitting the vote in marginal seats.
And who’s to say where those ‘marginal’ seats are now?
Best option I’ve heard so far came from someone here (maybe you?!) and it was very simple – everyone who was on the Yes platform in the referendum campaign votes for the SNP candidate in May 2014.
Right?
Then, in 2016, for the Holyrood elections, the same folk return the favour by voting for SSP, Greens (albeit, perhaps, as 2nd/3rd choices) assuring both parties of some list members.
For me, that seems a fair deal, and I’d happily support it.
That photo is awful
Ian Brotherhood,
“Best option I’ve heard so far came from someone here (maybe you?!) and it was very simple – everyone who was on the Yes platform in the referendum campaign votes for the SNP candidate in May 2014.
Then, in 2016, for the Holyrood elections, the same folk return the favour by voting for SSP, Greens (albeit, perhaps, as 2nd/3rd choices) assuring both parties of some list members.”
It wasn’t me who made the suggestion, but it makes sense.
I have heard that the Greens and SSP are going to put up candidates in all constituencies in 2015.
In my opinion, that would be extremely unwise and exactly what the unionists want.
The Greens and Socialists wouldn’t win a single seat on their own and SNP voters would not vote tactically for them. Labour would get in through a split vote and Scotland would lose whatever bargaining power it might hope to have. We would be doomed for a generation.
Unlike 2015, 2016 will be a democratic election and if the Greens and Socialists give a free run to the SNP in 2015, it will definitely be reciprocated in 2016.
For 2015, the SNP are best suited to challenge and defeat the unionists in most seats but in certain working class strongholds, prominent socialists would stand a better chance of unseating Labour.
Tommy Sheridan has publicly backed a vote for the SNP in 2015. Why can’t Patrick Harvey and Colin Fox do the same?
Scottish Labour can be laughed at but no one should underestimate their fighting battalions – Pravda GB and the unionist media.
We will be crushed again in 2015 as we were in 2010 if we are not extremely careful.
And even more than Yes voters, it is the 60% Labour No voters we need to convince that Labour are wolves in sheep’s clothing and have been for a very long time.
Otherwise, child poverty in Scotland would have been eliminated a long time ago, long before Saturday’s coronation.
Graudian this morning, not skilled in archiving yet, so good old copy paste for me. Don’t plan for breakfast for a wee while after reading right enough;
“Scottish Labour’s new leader: we won’t lose a single seat to the SNP”
“Jim Murphy has been elected the new leader of the Scottish Labour party, pledging to make Scotland “the fairest nation on the planet” and insisting that he will not lose a single seat to the SNP in May’s general election”
“I know there’s a huge amount of work to do in a really short period of time,” Murphy said. “I am confident that we will hold all [the Westminster seats] that we have. Any seat that the SNP tries to win from Labour increases the chance of David Cameron having an overall majority and I’m determined that won’t happen. We’ve had one referendum and we’re going to have another referendum in May, and it’s on whether Scotland genuinely wants rid of David Cameron.”
Ironic that such excrement comes from a rag you wouldn’t sully your erse with. Had a wee “sick in my mouth” moment at his “pledge” to make Scotland the fairest nation on the planet. In the real world, it’s a bit counterintuitive with him wanting to keep all SLAB seats. Then again, 9 years at Uni…..should we expect any more?
JIM MURPHY
ME, MYSELF AND I
WHAT LIES BENEATH
THE 39 STEPS (GLASGOW CONCERT HALL)
JIM CANT FIX IT……….., COS THE LABOUR PARTY IS WELL AND TRULY BROKEN ….HOW MUCH FOR HIS TIE ?…,1P ..
macduff
I’d pay a lot more for his tie if I was allowed to adjust it around his collar 🙂
dougiekdy and
@Fairliered
Agreed – Craig Murray are you up for it?
So Craig Murray goes up to someone in Newton Mearns lets say and tells them how we were complicit in the torture of terrorists (bear me out) WE know some of those people were innocent and no matter how reprehensible their crimes no one should be subject to torture.
amid the background of Kenny McCaskill carrying the can for the release of Meghrahi,
go figure what the response might be?
rearrange these words into a well known phrase.
I would be absolutely delighted to be proven wrong btw.
balloon lead?
Perhaps Kezia borrowed the hands from the estate of Kenny Everett?
I don’t think it is a case of Scottish Labour members not having heard of Neil Findlay or Sarah Boyack. If they are at all active at branch or constituency level, they will be familiar with at least the more prominent of Labour’s MSPs. I think it is the case that Scottish Labour’s surviving grassroots core is predominantly of the Stalinist right.
The Pantomine season.
The relief of getting rid of all of these ‘candidates’. Hopefully never to hear of them again.
7/5/15 Revenge will be sweet. Can’t wait.
Can we please not refer to this party as Scottish Labour, it is insult to many.
Labour Branch Office or Labour North or Unionist Labour or Red Tories all acceptable.
OT
I see that Craig Murray has an article in the DailyFail… archived of course.
.
Did Jim Murphy have knowledge of illegal torturing and rendition?
Perhaps a more succinct argument against our involvement in torture could be devised.
Ordinary Scots soldiers have been jailed for offences in Iraq. Meanwhile the politicians who sent them there were knowingly allowing and possibly encouraging torture of suspects – some innocent. There is the usual double standard. Ordinary folks get jailed, those at the top get to lecture and make millions.
I suspect myself that there is little sympathy from most people for “foreigners”,so the side of the angels argument is not likely to win friends on doorsteps.
Now before hackles are raised. I believe that the only way high moral ground can be held is if you accept the rule of law. The Geneva conventions and the conventions against torture matter. They apply to people who carry out such despicable acts on our people as well as protecting anyone we are fighting against. We cannot justify trying anyone from an enemy regime if we do not uphold the rules. I have no time for those who attempt to hurt us, but our own rights and high moral ground require that we obey those rules too.
O/T, While we’retalking about Kezia’s hands, has anyone noticed how short Neil Findlay’s fingers are.
Did he catch them in the till?
Murphy is dangerous if he is allowed to attack unchallenged from a BBC Labour studio full time.
We are now I think in a war for our survival. We have to start going on the offensive. Surely the best way to tackle Murphy is to put up a great candidate that will attract wide cross-party support in Renfrew East.
If Murphy faces a serious challenge to his seat he will have less time to work to get his fellow SLAbbers elected. Murphy would then face a nightmare where he could have saved lots of his mates but lost his own seat. His political career would then be over in five months. He would be a laughing stock if he tried to ‘lead’ what is left of SLAB from his front room – even if Millipede scraped over the line.
In short:
1. We HAVE to unseat Murphy.
2. Craig Murray is the man (probably the only one) who could beat him and would be Murphy’s worst nightmare. Murphy’s reptilian self-preservation instincts would kick in and to hell with his SLABBer associates.
Another BBC R4 daily blast of vote Murphy, Labour and Scotland’s saviour. BBC vote Murphy heat’s actually getting worse, he was pelted with eggs by raging mobs of nats etc. BBC teamGB national broadcaster hard core propaganda way beyond anything ever seen, since yesterday:D
Much more to come in an hour, Murphy and BBC heading for Easterhouse. Lucky them.
@ Jim Murphy
I hear you are a ‘liberal interventionist’, or imperialist in ‘old-speak’. I know that this would be consistent with your membership of the Fabian Society, but is that your position today? Is that the ‘change’ you have for Scotland?
link to blogs.spectator.co.uk
What is going on here? A Zionist who is a member of an organisation standing against anti-Semitism, swapping ideas with an Islamophobe.
link to labourlist.org
(as the first link in the article is dead)
link to zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk
Have a change of heart, did you? Was it a mater of expediency over principle?
link to telegraph.co.uk
I’ve got your number.
‘Sir’ Malcolm Rifkind heading a committee looking into the possible complicity of British Services in torture and rendition…Good grief.
Yeah, you can see the American govt. shaking in its boots now.
First you gather the audience standing on Irn Bru crates or in a Friendly BBC studio and you shout at the top of your voice:
SNAKE OIL, SNAKE OIL… GET YOUR SNAKE OIL HERE.
Any difficult or uncomfortable questions,just shout louder!
Salutations Ian B, Crazycat!
I registered with South Aurshire Yes movement post-ref but as said pretty quiet, thought there might be some better insight from the Wingers!
I concur whole-hearted lay about SNP for GE 15 with some reciprocal list voting for green, SSP come May 2016!
Onwards!
I stopped believing that there was a Santa Claus when big brother told me it was Mum and Dad who gave us the presents when I was five. With Jim Smurphy being elected as leader of the labour party in Scotland.I now realise that my brother was wrong.There must be a Santa Claus because both my parents are dead!
I see that SLAB are beginning, as predicted, to ramp up the “only we can kick out the tories” and “a vote for the SNP is a vote for the tories” messages for the electorate. This has to be countered at every opportunity. Remind people that they are just as bad, in fact even worse than the blue tories.
They are trying it on again – this time it needs to be countered. Start calling them the Red Tories at every opportunity, chatting with family, friends, colleagues. Make it a habit. Believe me, it will stick. Many of the old diehard Labour supporters feel very embarrassed at the state of their party. We need to keep the pressure on, in all Labour seats, but particularly in Dundee and Glasgow.
Red Tories – it’s a powerful message that will resonate with many dissafected voters.
I know my posts seem to go un-noticed here these days but I’ll give this another go.
Unless we do something about media balance in Scotland we’re going to lose every election we fight. It’s that simple.
Mealer
I think that is very pertinent. I am glad that MPs in Westminster now seem to be engaged in trying to uncover who knew what about torture and rendition. I suspect UK laws were broken as well as international ones.
And I suspect they were totally implicit and will lie and forge the records as usual.
I see that Judith Ralston, the BBC weather girl, was offering her congratulations to Jim over on Twitter.
Strange how you can go off people.
” I am a proud trade unionist ” says Murphy.
That sounds familiar.
round about the garden looking fur teddy,s bear one step two step, looky look naebuddy there.
Malcolm Rifkin (chairman ) of the Security comiceekal committee is on the Rendition case,now with a fine legal brain Rifkins 1st course of action is to plant the seeds of grass(should be quite tall come the summer)lots of things get lost in tall grass, any reply,s from CIA will be printed on blackpaper its called (Redaction).one step two step am oota here.
Just listened to the Unison guy and Curran (right now) on Sky’s Murnaghan programme discussing Jim Murphy’s ‘promotion’.
Listening to the two of them it shows how far to the right the Labour Party has moved when they both consider socialist ideals and policies to be radical.
Kezia’s critical weakness isn’t that she’s dim, it’s that she’s dim but is convinced she’s clever. Dunning-Kruger syndrome.
@ Luigi
I see that SLAB are beginning, as predicted, to ramp up the “only we can kick out the tories” and “a vote for the SNP is a vote for the tories” messages for the electorate.
Aye, Luigi. And according to Curran, Nicola Sturgeon agrees with that.
@Macnakamura
A Proudtradeunionistbut surely?
Macart 10.01am.
“Sir’ Malcolm Rifkind heading a committee looking into the possible complicity of British Services in torture and rendition…Good grief.”
I heard Malcolm Rifkind give an interview on Sky TV and for some reason,(can’t quite put my finger on it), I didn’t believe a word he said. He reminded me of Jim Murphy, they will say anything to sweet talk the gullible idiots but underneath they are committed Unionists and will do everything in their power to safeguard the UK Establishment.
Jim will fix it (fingers crossed maybe) says the BBC’s John Pienaar as he introduces him as ‘the man himself’ this morning.
Jim I want..I want to see…I want.
Jim! as the advert says You don’t always get what you want!
BBC says we (UK) might be inadvertently involved in the rendition flights… 🙂
Magrit Current on Murnahan revealing the NEW LABOUR WINNING MESSAGE. VOTE LABOUR OR YOU’ll get the TORIES.
She was backed up by some guy Gordon McKay (unison) who kinda made similar noises, except he was pushing Findly & Clark Jimba is an experienced politician. Vote labour or it’s the TORIES for us.
Is this the limits to labours abilities. They are following the dodos plan.
R-type Grunt
I agree. There has to be something Holyrood can do to reign in the BBC, at least. I would have thought the EU might be the solution, as they have quite specific regulations re. public service broadcasters. I’m not sure though, if Holyrood would be able to approach them directly. Something has to be done though, or we face exactly the same fiasco.
.
And the Sunday Politics show just happened to have a clip of patriotic Jim jogging by the Clyde wearing a Scotland football top.
So predictable.
To be fair to Kezia at least she finished her Masters; albeit I have no idea what Policy Studies is or why my alma mater would offer such a thing…sounds like a feeder trough for the political blight that is “think tanks” 😉
As a former Unison Shop Steward I am not surprised at the likes of this Gordon Mackay, the union was chock a block with them. Amazing how many were looking to get on in the Labour Party. I stuck out like a sore thumb with them as an SNP person.
Ironically, with experience as Defence Secretary and Foreign Secretary Rifkind would know who gets to know what and when, but who has any confidence in his impartiality. Not me.
Everything will be hushed up ‘for the greater good’ and ‘national security’. The files will be locked up under the 100 year rule.
Waste of time.
How can Jim Murphy carry out ANY policy in Scotland without the approval of London Labour and Ed Miliband. Murphy is a leader with NO power.
Labour put forward the LEAST devolution proposals to the Smith Commission, so what radical ideas is Jim going to come up with that will make Scotland the best Country in the world to live in.
Murphy is an egotistical fruitcake and any normal thinking Scot will see right through him and his ideas.
Remember, Scotland “voted Labour” in the last GE and we STILL got the Tories.
R-type Grunt, well I noticed your post and I do agree but what? Seems we are hind bound by just about everything. How do we overcome the BBC, who pumps out so much propaganda.
We were talking about the size of the lie we face in our house this morning and my Husband said the problem is that when you know what you are looking for it is extremely difficult sometimes to even find the edge.
How do get people to watch the British Government, because when we get down to it, they are the enemy. They seem to control everything. We cannot go to Europe, they will not speak to a Region. Seems that the UN are not interested either?
Jim McIntosh, I would imagine that the present Prime Minister would have been made aware of these flights and all this talk about it all being Labour is exactly what.
From what I can see both Labour and Tory are so far up the US government that it is difficult to see the difference.
If Malky wants to know anything all he has to do is speak to Craig Murray. I am sure he will enlighten him, I do doubt he needs to anyway.
R-type Grunt says:
“Unless we do something about media balance in Scotland we’re going to lose every election we fight. It’s that simple.”
Go on then, what do you propose?
What do you think we could/should do to rectify the current situation?
Miliband the name you wont hear or read about on Labour interviews or leaflets in Scotland.
Murphy a man who wants to lead Scotland but doesn’t want powers over minimum / living wage or significant economic powers or broadcasting regulation or energy regulation or oil revenues etc
First casualties of Jims reign will be Mags and Anas. No more vox pops for those guys. Jim may even get the Shadow Sec for Scotland job soon to help bring him up to speed.
Fare ye well Mags as you head into oblivion…or The Lords
@art1001
Keep Murphy bogged down in his own constituency desperately defending his back yard … I agree that is a good plan! The SNP need to chose a top notch well know candidate and need to flood the constituency with activists clapping on every door several times.
And, the alternative media needs hound Murphy showing him to be what he is – a shallow ruthless liar.
@ Caz
Appointed by Cameron as Chair of intelligence and security committee (cough).
Says it all. 🙂
Long grass for the whole issue for as long as they like really.
Helena Brown
All the broadcasters are the same, IMO (says the guy with no TV). 🙂
Dumb & dumber?
Or just Despicable Me & Despicable Me Too…?
@ Cameron & Helena
We’ll then, we need to take direct action. Shut down the BBC. Since giving up my job to hit the streets for the referendum campaign I’ve been unable to find a job. I actually feel it all unravelling around me. I’ve got nothing to lose now & I’m quite prepared to go to jail for my beliefs. I’ve always believed that the problem in Scotland is that things aren’t bad enough. They never will be for the majority because Westminster isn’t stupid. Back an animal into a corner & it’s likely to bite. However I’m not alone. There’s a growing band of us poor people out here who have simply had enough. All the rhetoric on here is just that, rhetoric. There’s nothing effectual happening in Scotland which will take the fight to these bastards. The State broadcaster has it sewn up.
Murphy holds the East Renfrewshire seat and next door to him is Douglas Alexander, who holds the West Renfrewshire seat.
We need two “Names” to go head to head with these two right-wing Red Tories.
No need to panic.
The MSM has elevated every leader of Labour’s Scottish branch – remember Wendy Alexander, the ‘intellectual powerhouse of Labour, Scotland’?
Journalists are apt to accept the first press releases at face value and publish and parrot as directed. Then the rot sets in when its discovered their leaders are of poor quality, Murphy nothing more than a miserable bastard.
The Reverend I. M. Jolly.
Worse, Labour takes the Scottish people for granted, but committed suicide siding with the Conservatives against all aspects of self-governance.
Moreover, the did nothing to protect Scotland when the Tories ripped out our industries, and did nothing again when they were in power. Brown turned his back on Scotland.
Murphy is enjoying his ‘honeymoon’ period with the press, a period where he can say and promise what he likes, soon to disintegrate as his ‘radical’ ideas are reduced to dish water by head office in London.
Labour are caught between the neo-liberal concensus that welcomed Blair and Brown, doctrines encapsulated in the coalition, and the racism that is Ukip – a grizzly one side and a scavenging hyena on the other, enough to keep them busy for a decade.
The only reason to hold on to Scotland is to replenish their stock of politicians committed to the Union.
Faux radicalism at Westminster always sounds more plausible spoken in a posh Scottish accent.
It’s will simply work like this.
Every FMQ Dugdale will get hammered and look ridiculous. Every post FMQ interview will have Murphy saying “SNP BAD, STURGEON BAD, SNP BADDER THAN BAD!” with nobody to rebut him. He will get more airtime and say what he wants but never be taken to task by the FM over it.
Kinda works to their advantage when you think about it.
Why doesn’t the SG commit to impel us to pay the amount of money to the BBC to cover production costs on Scottish productions only?
This then would set the licence fee due by us jock-plebs to the propaganda machine – but only towards BBC Scotland produced propaganda.
There must be a way to skin this cat.
If i remember correctly, was Deputy Dug not one of the 2 brainless wonders who were seen using Google for answers during a pre referendum hustings?
And that, my dear friends, just about sums up the calibre of the Red Tory leadership.
Nicola will make utter mincemeat out of her and her Skeletor inspired scripts.
Scotland must rid herself of these Red Tory ("Tractor" - Ed)s.
if snp do as well as polls suggest i may start believing there is a god. fingers tightly crossed
R-type Grunt
I’m about as low in the pile as you can get, so I appreciate exactly where your coming from. Unfortunately I can’t see the BBC responding to direct action, such as the camp that was outside Saint Andrew’s house. They’re too big and we are just Scotlandshire. I think Holyrood and human-rights lawyers are the only route with any chance of success.
Come on SNP, get your finger out! I’m being oppressed and I don’t like it one bit. ;(
@ R-type Grunt
“There’s nothing effectual happening in Scotland which will take the fight to these bastards. The State broadcaster has it sewn up.”
Are you kidding?
What about taking AS’ advice and join something – the SNP, the Greens, the SSP or any other progressive party you like. There’s plenty canvassing to be done and probably a good many other voluntary tasks.
Making a martyr of yourself won’t get a mention on the biased MSM so would be a waste of energy. Democracy is still our best weapon and it is something worth working for.
Yippee !,
What have I been thinking.Jim just announces on T.V. that he has more in common with yes voters than no.Let me see, where did I put my Missiles? OOPS!,must remember to send my neighbour to Morocco for torture this week. While i,m at it I might pop in an tell my elderly neighbour i am going to stop her travelling,whilst I cut off her heating supply. Let me see what else is on the Xmas list.Yep the very thing.I will tour around the working class areas of Glasgow on a sleigh annoouncing that they can forget higher education,unless they find a Santa who can afford it fot them. Seasons Greetings to all.. Never knew it felt so good to be a Murphy right wing bastard
Helena Brown says:
14 December, 2014 at 11:14 am
As a former Unison Shop Steward I am not surprised at the likes of this Gordon Mackay, the union was chock a block with them. Amazing how many were looking to get on in the Labour Party. I stuck out like a sore thumb with them as an SNP person.
==========================================
Helena, I agree with you, I was a PCS union rep and every union election I was dismayed to see the amount of the right-wing New Labour (so-called) trade unionists in the ballot.
In their capacity as union reps they caused a lot of ppl to suffer at the hands of the employer.
Stoker
link to wingsoverscotland.com
😉
Even BBC R6 news giving Murphy massive boost, but irony is not a thing there, as this lot say “Murphy will ensure Scottish Labour will be independent from London HQ.” Its probably up to each channel news eds how they fart out their propaganda but the R6 one is an unusually clownish one, or original and innovative if you’re a red and blue Tory.
Murphy has had wall to wall tv/radio about his election bid and yet Labour poll badly. The latest poll details in full can be found here;
link to d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net
r-type
i salute your commitment and efforts, but agree with capella.
the only way we’ll get anywhere is through persuasion, protests, and the ballot box.
the system operates on a principle of managed decline and divide and conquer.
the polls say scotland is united in wanting massive meaningful change, and the passion now for indyscot is soaring.
i do wish you well, and hope that you find paid employment soon.
won’t be long now till indyscot.
Aaargh. Craig Murray is not the ideal candidate for Skeletor’s constituency. Anyone who lives in or know’s Glasgow also know’s that a friend of Israel is a better candidate there than a friend of Palestine.
I feel very uncomfortable remarking about such things. Religion is a private matter. I wonder to what extent we are being played. This site is mostly commented on by people committed to Indy. They have a mixture of views, but there still seems to be a sort of naivety. We are mostly well meaning amateurs.
The BBC is a great enemy. We need to counter them. They are so biased now as to not even pretend anything else. I stopped watching the little TV I did after 18/9. I have stopped paying the Propaganda tax. Everyone who hasn’t should look carefully at their use of TV. Arrange your affairs to comply exactly with the law, and starve the beast. The radio is appalling. I try to catch odd things then hear the “news” and always enraged return to Classic FM or Heart. I don’t know what to do about that other than rage. I think I’ll be adding audio books to my christmas list.
We are in an existentialist fight with these barstewards now. Its them or us.
@ Marcia, the poll is amazing but its from last Thursday. So after this extraordinary weekend of vote Murphy or else BBC propaganda campaigning alone, the next poll’s going to be a neat demonstration of the power of their BBC propaganda machine. Eggs Murphy is everywhere here in England too.
Firstly I understand the national is owned by a unionist supporting publisher. But still it is our one and only mainstream voice. Buy the hard copy and leave it at work. If your pub/hairdresser/place of work buys papers get them to dump one unionist paper for the national. I tend to leave mine on the bus or leave it in the greasy spoon I buy my bacon roll. Promote all yes leaning media, be inventive, its all good and if we all do one drip it becomes a torrent.
Mr Murphy is ideally placed to lead a unionist alliance in the Scottish elections in 2016.Rule Britania! etc
davidb
I guarantee 100%, that Zionism has absolutely nothing to with the Judaism. In fact, it is an anti-Semitic ideology and the Palistinians are technically Semites.
Professor Yakov Rabkin: Zionism is a revolt against Judaism.
link to youtube.com
link to en.wikipedia.org
Who’s afraid of the Big Bad Murph?
Come on folks. It’s not the end.
The Palestinians are of Semitic decent would be a more accurate description.
@ Cameron (12.36pm).
Aye, cheers, thought so.
Unbelievable that there are people who vote for that.
Is it any wonder we are in the mess we’re in.
_________
BBC reporter James Cook yesterday stated that Slabber have 14,000 members – he knows this because an unnamed Slabber source told him so.
Surely James Cook must also be aware of the concept that to relay a lie also makes the individual a liar.
James Cook, BBC reporter, you are a liar working for corrupt organisations with absolutely zero credibility.
Just watched Jim Murphy being interviewed by Gordon Brewer! what a love in. It was facinating to hear what Jim had to say and between the lines it would appear Jim will be standing down as an M.P. in the not to distant future because he does not want to stand as an M.P. then have to give up the seat shortly after to stand for the Scottish Parliament as FIRST MINISTER in 2016. But this will have to be thought through with his “advisors”. I wonder how Ken MacIntosh the M.S.P. for East Renfrewshire fits in with this. Will Jim and Ken do a reverse shuffle!! If Jim stands down we will have a different G.E campaign within East Renfrewshire.
I think it’s time that Wings had a presence at press conferences held by Labour, primed with some interesting questions.
Saw an excellent film about “Lawrence of Arabia” and the Arab revolt, both being well and truly deceived by the British Establishment (ring any bells?). Shows how struggles for independence are not well received by colonial powers, specially when you live in a land cursed with oil.
Made for Anglia TV in 1992 starring Ralph Fiennes. A great watch for those not using the MSM any more.
link to youtube.com
If there are Scots who vote Labour at the next election, it’s a lot more likely they’re doing it because it’s a vote against the Tories rather than because Jim Murphy is a big scary man who can smash the SNP with his dinosaur superpowers or because of the BBC’s weak propaganda efforts. Does anybody watch the BBC anymore? I thought everybody was on apps now or tuned into Sky. If Scots were that susceptible to propaganda, they’d have been Tory voters for the last 30 years and we know that hasn’t happened.
Independence is going to be a process for Scotland. The key achievement of Salmond and the SNP has been to remind Scotland that we do not necessarily have to be tied to England. Britishness is now an option, not an imperative. For some people that’s taking longer to sink in than for others, but the change is happening, and it’s not something that Jim Murphy or the BBC or any other desperate unionist is going to be able to stop.
@ CameronB
Thanks my friend, I know we’re not alone.
@ Capella
Are you trying to be funny? I hear a teacher tone there and teachers have never done anything for me. I joined the SNP two years ago and have been an active member ever since. I’m actually on the committee of my local branch. I’m also an active campaigner for RIC and attend policy meetings regularly.
Although I’m unemployed I haven’t actually ever signed on. I won’t give the bastards the satisfaction. Now though, the credit cards have hit the buffers and there’s nothing left. It could be seen as amusing but it’s really just sickening that you still believe this “democracy” is our best hope.
We all used to make a big point before the referendum that we’d show the world that a revolution could be civil, peaceful & democratic. We know how that worked out. To the best of my knowledge no country has ever gained self-government through entirely peaceful means. If there is such an example then I’ll wager it was only achieved because the Mother state considered them a liability. How ironic that we are in this position because the only people who truly understand our worth are those who actively campaigned against us.
My answer might not be THE answer but it’s the only one that hasn’t been tried. We’re tired of being nice, the time for diplomacy is long since passed. As CameronB says, the SNP have to do something. Now!
@Mealer
I doubt if there will be a formal Indy or Unionist alliance. Party politics run deep. However, there will be tactical voting.
Don’t get me wrong, I would love WM2015 to be a straight two horse race in every constituency between an Indy and a Unionist candidate because we would win this time! The Unionist know this. They know they only turned things around with promises, which have not been fulfilled. They can read the polls, two major ones with Yes ahead. There are a lot of things the Unionists will do to twart independence, none more so that avoiding another out in the open head to head fight.
The coronation of King Vladimir Murphy just highlights the fall in power of the Unions ,where they used to be the Kingmakers in the Labour party they are now an irrelevance only there to supply a bit of cash to the London Labour coffers.
Members of all Unions should reavaluate what/who they are paying their money into,start asking questions,basically `stop being taken for a mug`.
davidb
Semitic Jews are a dwindling minority in Israel.
link to en.wikipedia.org
R-Type.
You are one of many my friend. The referendum loss has hurt and i think, because we are much more aware now politically and use other means to get information, we see the damage being done to our country and that magnifies the hurt because we saw this coming.
The only way we can win for the moment is through the ballot box. We’re up against the State . They control all the MSM.
We have the foot soldiers. May i suggest you join a party, SNP SSP Greens anything to help the cause. We need to get the message out and can only do this on blogs and the like. Talking to folk around you does work. Word of mouth marched a YES campaign the likes of which we had never witnessed before. Grass roots is built on talking and passing info. We were so close.
We need troops on the ground in the spring. I did this last year and loved it. This country has some fantastic characters and so many good people . But of course you know this.
Xmas in a few days and foul weather restricts us to what action we can take so give yourself a wee break and re-charge the batteries. Join a party and come spring help us win an election.
You don’t give me the impression you give up easily. Your in good company here bud.
Jobless over Xmas is the cruelest of positions. I wish i could help buddy. Are there any Wingers out there with work for our supporters in need ? We do every thing else here so a jobs watch would help many too.
Just a thought.
Some people here seem quite down, given the scale of the battle against MSM propaganda to come. Don’t be. With the full might of the empire propaganda machine against us, we still got 45% of people willing to leave the UK.
And now polls are showing that yes would win today. The next battle we have is to take as many powers for Scotland out of the hands of these greedy, self serving #@%$ in Westminster.
Road signs? I know where I’d like to stuff those road signs.
The polls are showing that a huge majority of people in Scotland want more powers for Scotland. Couple this with 100,000 SNP members, 1 in 50 of the adult population, ready to get out there, knock on doors, and talk to people.
Remember, Labour took us into an illegal war for profit. Creepy Jim voted *for* that. They’re also pro Trident, pro austerity, right of centre, against free education, and lead by Red Ed – a man with less charisma than a bucket of mud.
Barontorc says:
“There must be a way to skin this cat.”
davidb says:
“I have stopped paying the Propaganda tax. Arrange your affairs to comply exactly with the law, and starve the beast.”
That and more demonstrations into the new year.
We have one voice in the street and on the news-stands. The National. We need to continue to support it, at least up until the election and as long as it does speak with our voice.
Support Live Independence and other fledgling alternative media. There are some great things happening out there but they all need our support. The more we spread the word of these alternative sources of information the more we undermine the whole establishment machine.
R-Type.
Just saw your reply earlier , course your a party member. Sorry . just trying to a wee bit sympathetic. i feel exactly like you do.
Hazel.
I believe what you say. just pissed off with the constant drivel from the MSM.
keep the faith folks.
Re ‘Friends of Israel’ Murphy – heard he used to support Free Palestine.
Would be good if we could find a source for that to use against him in ER.
I agree, with him, the gloves have to come off.
Capella
looks like a great film.
🙂
Well I just heard Murphy reported as saying he will not be consulting Ed Milliband on policy. What are we to make of this?
It seems to me that he is saying he will lie to the Scottish electorate. Since power remains at Westminster on most things, if he announces a different policy he cannot possibly deliver.
He cannot reverse austerity while dependent on Westminster for the block grant
He cannot take a keyesian economic stance while Westminster is committed to reducing the debt and deficit through robbing the poor.
He cannot make a more equitable society while Westminster is intent on making the rich richer.
He pretends that a higher top rate of income tax is essential, but that is also Westminster Labour’s policy and it will do nothing substantial to change things while tax avoidance is so prevalent and while VAT and corporation tax and oil taxation is not under Scottish control
So what is he going to do? Answer is he will do exactly what Westminster decides. He has no credible alternative
I have heard a lot of warm words about him making sure decisions are taken in Scotland and making Scotland a fairer place. I am not hearing ANY distinctive policy position which shows how he intends to do that. Odd, since in a sane world the candidates would have laid out detailed positions so that the voters could make an informed choice about what they were voting for in the leadership election. But we don’t do that anymore, apparently: just a beauty contest driven and determined by a very powerful media. And they all dutifully vote for pigs in pokes, no matter who they support. This seems to be accepted as normal, now.
But it is odder even than that. If Mr Murphy does not support his party’s positions why is he in that party?
@ fred blogger
I really found the film a great insight into the duplicity of the British Establishment. There is a also PBS documentary in two parts about Lawrence of Arabia also showing what a PR fiction that really was, “The Battle for the Arab World”.
@ R-type Grunt
Not guilty – sorry – I’ve never been a teacher. I wouldn’t have the patience. I’ve also been unemployed, a single parent, and am now a pensioner so no stranger to living on a tight budget.
@ Fiona
I agree. Scottish Labour is a pure fiction, a PR stunt to delude the Scottish Labour voters into thinking that somehow Ed Miliband only leads Westminster Labour. Jim Murphy will promote this fiction through the BBC and MSM for as long a it takes.
Labour is an Orwellian proto-fascist party, some would be horrified to think so but they are so lacking in critical thought they cannot see what they have become. Inward facing, gathered round a core belief in only themselves and their leader, a hatred of opposing views, a siege mentality and straw men threats everywhere. Yup, proto-fascist. A membership of careerists & tribalist fuckwits. The party of my parents is long gone.
as i see it, we must look after number 1, in a way that looks after all number 1’s.
no 1 rich, no 1 poor.
enough for all.
all of us 1st.
@ Fiona
“Well I just heard Murphy reported as saying he will not be consulting Ed Milliband on policy. What are we to make of this?”
He will not consult Ed because Ed will let him know what he has do.
It is often not what politicians say but they do not.
@ Fiona
“Well I just heard Murphy reported as saying he will not be consulting Ed Milliband on policy. What are we to make of this?”
Perhaps some enterprising journalist will ask JoLa why Jim Murphy can apparently make decisions without WM permission, but she couldn’t.
Do you think she’s (wo)man enough to tell the triuth, i.e. that Murphy’s lying.
Having control of income tax will make no difference. Having control of tax and spending will make a difference. Getting rid of Trident, a tax on ‘loss leading’ drink will make a difference. £3Billion. Paying loan repayments on money Scotland doesn’t borrow or spend. £4Billion. Losing £4Billion+ a year in Oil tax revenues, since 2011 Budget Oil taxes were increased 11% (£2Billion) a year. Taxes paid on Scottish commercial activities through UK HQ’s and taxes lost through evasion in the City of London.
Scotland raises £53Billion+ in tax. Enough to cover everything. £35Billion – £15Billion pensions/welfare £3Billion Defence. Plus lost revenues £10Billion+. Oil on the West coast? Scotland could get Renewable Grants from the EU £Billions. Scotland would be in Deficit.
Scotland would not be in deficit. Scotland would be in credit.
R-type Grunt,
“There’s nothing effectual happening in Scotland which will take the fight to these bastards. The State broadcaster has it sewn up.”
A neat and precise summary of the situation.
‘Vote Labour to keep the Tories out’ will be the mantra for the next five months.
If we then end up with 40 Labour MPs, it will be proved beyond doubt that a majority of us are the most stupid people on earth.
Do not get yourself into any trouble but boycott everything blatantly unionist as much as you can and try to convince people about how we have been conned for 300+ years.
My, my! Kezia. .
What big hair you’ve got. .
And what big hands you’ve got..
And here, Jim. .gonna sort out those gnashers!
– probably have to go private mate. NHS dentists only get 15 mins for each human.
That grin on the front of the paper might fit the bill of a true leftie from the ’70S but it’s the 21st century now. Chalk it down as an insult to Scottish orthodontics.
Americans sometimes describe it as a ‘British smile’ – quite fitting really. The moral decay at the roots of Labour and all that..
But seriously,
If this is the best the Slab stud farm can offer perhaps as an indy pusher I shouldn’t look a gift horse in the mouth.
His ego will destroy himself.
@call me dave 13 December, 2014 at 10:10 pm
BBC announce Labour have 14000 members and SNP have 92000 in their news bulletin at 10:00pm Radio 4.
I made a formal complaint and asked for a reply on this
It is debateable whether what remains of the core Labour faithful actually realise, that in Murphy, they are backing a very strong right wing contender as their heavyweight, “Great Red Hope.”
No other Scottish elected member comes anywhere close to being so right wing inclined. Only Scottish Labour would be daft enough to actually install an extreme right winger to head a political party in a country whose electorate are showing every sign of moving leftwards in their tens of thousands.
Unless, of course, Labour have already done a deal with the Tory/LibDem coalition to engage in tactical voting in the coming elections. They are all three, after all, the proven unionist fighting force. The Union Alliance is an already well proven fact.
Juteman says:
14 December, 2014 at 11:10 am
And the Sunday Politics show just happened to have a clip of patriotic Jim jogging by the Clyde wearing a Scotland football top.
So predictable.
Saw that, absolutely sickening how that mob can broadcast an advertisment for Murphy. We know we are in for a battle, but we are winning. Let all of the crap make you more determined.
O/T if anyone wants a late night read: link to scottishstatesman.com
Ms Dugdale in the National starting as she means to carry on I see.
Child poverty went down under Labour, it has only ever gone up under the SNP”.
Six out of ten kids who live in poor households in Scotland right now come from working families… that should shame us all. I had to sit in that parliament and watch the SNP vote down the opportunity to put the living wage in the statute books… I think that’s a scandal”.
So no mention of the carnage inflicted by Labour on the economy as being somewhat of a catalyst in Scotland’s poverty or the endemic council corruption. The PFI and ALEO scandals, gross mismanagement, impoverishing communities and leaving them debt ridden for the foreseeable future. No accounting for the ever decreasing national budget and the monies having to be found to offset the likes of the bedroom tax and no control over major economic levers.
Labour, I think you’ll find, are as pure as the driven snow and utterly blameless when it comes to the increasing poverty gap. Somebody else did it, a big boy perhaps who then ran away? When it comes to Labour, its always someone else’s fault, they’ve only ever done good in office.
FFS, when are they ever going to learn that THIS attitude is what makes them ever more unelectable? THIS is what makes them unfit to govern, the whole washing your hands of responsibility bollox. No apologies, no contrition, just somebody else did it, or the other team are always worse than we are. Huge arrogance and condescension coupled with a sense of completely undeserved entitlement.
Oh, and SNP bad.
Jim Murphy on Piennar’s politics on 14/12/14
noting the “powers” from the Smith Commission.
“We have full tax powers here in Scotland”
Oh Aye, must have missed that bit of report. Income tax is only one of several taxes we need to have “full tax powers”. Indeed, we are to be given the worst tax in relation to encouraging growth, employment and the chance to break away form the stench of “Osbourne”.