Best served cold
Posted on
March 28, 2020 by
Chris Cairns
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28 03 20 07:57
Best served cold | speymouth
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As ever excellent….not so sure about vengeance though,its a very strong word,although in the circumstances!
Revenge – a dish best served cold.
Yeah best served cold, nice one
Misconstrued Soup
Cock au Vin (Hens in Whine!)
Miss is dippy flinging mud pie
Mulled wine and pile of Mince Pies (Rhyming Slang)
It shouldn’t be left to Alex Salmond to seek revenge. What is the SNP and Scottish Government doing about it? Nobody is even suspended.
You can be deselected for a tame tweet, but conspiring to disgrace an innocent man and send him to prison is absolutely fine?
RIP SNP. You have badly lost your way.
Good tactic, make the instigators sweat a bit,and a bit more,and a bit more……..
Alex himself took the hit and it was personally horrendous. But don’t forget it was also the thirst for independence they wanted to vanquish. That includes each and every one of us who are fighting for the cause. It wasn’t like he was planning on a comeback for shallow reasons – he was returning to “get Indy done” to coin a phrase. They weren’t having that.
That the so-called party of independence would conspire to put an innocent man in jail, a man who more than anybody in recent history has furthered our cause, is despicable. A lot of these schemers owe their careers to this man.
Good to see Philippa Whitford has called for his return. She and Joanna Cherry were both at the top of their own professional careers and left them to fight for independence. It speaks volumes they want him back, while the careerists who stabbed him in the back are self serving cowards.
At the end of the day these people deserve what’s coming to them – not just for lying, but for stupidity. It was sheer folly to attack him with these trumped up charges. They really should jump before they are pushed.
Excellent.
I will happily line up with many others for a signed copy of Mr.Salmond’s next book. It will make a very interesting read. Not sure NS or her husband will enjoy it though…
Revenge, where somebody has been wholly wronged, is a dish to savour, and is indeed, best served cold.
I look forward to his rapid return to the SNP, and his re-starting the push for independence by the SNP (something which hasn’t happened since 2014). Their needs to be a clearout at the top.
The silence by some in the SNP regarding his innocence, speaks volumes. Very, very telling, indeed. People do notice. A man who has done more for Scotland’s independence, since King Robert the Bruce, was found not guilty, and yet, some in the SNP have gone very quiet indeed. Hmmm…. it makes you think, doesn’t it.
Wonderful cartoon Mr Cairns!
Breeks , agreed , tweets dug up from days of youthful exuberance used as a means to exude faux outrage and dismissal.
Mr Salmond’s experience has been horrendous and I do hope he goes for the jugular.
Go get ’em Alex.
I always knew were innocent.
I see the SNP backs the right of ‘key journalists’ to move around Scotland – I had no idea that John Pilger was in the country , a lonely job for Mr Pilger.
Can’t think of any other ‘key journalists’.
Marvellous cartoon Chris and cant wait to see the cold dish big Eck will serve them. I do fear the carnage that will follow will put a dent in our cause, but whoever and whatever was the motivation behind framing him must be made public regardless of the consequences to the SNP.
Dorothy @ 8.22
How could you forget our “their” own Queen of slanted journalism “Dame Sarah Smith” I would personally contribute to a crowd fund to move here right out the country. Phannar.
“Get Indy Done”,,(Terry 8.12am)
To all,,,
Badge makers
Wristband makers
Poster designers
Leaflet makers
Twitter members
Facebook members
The National editors
And all Indy minded punters, get printing!!!
“Get Indy Done” is the best slogan I have seen since the “Yes” slogan appeared in our vocabulary.
Once,,,,,we rid ourselves of this horrible virus, “Get Indy Done” should becone the new slogan for our new Indy Party.
Isn’t it amazing how you just stumble upon these little nuggets.
Fuckin genius Terry,,,well done my fellow Indy supporter.
AS needs to be absolutely ruthless, the last time we had a Leader do that, we won our Independence……and kept it.
Can’t wait
Message to Alex and his new team behind his new Indy Party,,,
“GET INDY DONE”
To borrow a phrase from the BBC pet nurse anaesthetist in the Southern General as was “It will be worse than Italy and Spain as they are mown down”
Could someone tell the BBC that B and Q is closed.
I will not fall into the trap of saying my mortality rate is bigger than yours because that would also be a lie.
BTW though not now a member I do not wish to see the SNP destroyed. The vast majority of members I know were gobsmacked too. I suppose that explains why the woke temporarily triumphed. Where DID they come from? Sneakin in like a thief in the night and stealing a decent party.
BBC news – New Major temporary hospital for London, Manchester and Birmingham?
This should trigger further funding for Scotland so how much and where are
The plans for our temporary hospitals?
Top news story is how is Boris keeping- Who gives a !!!!
Politicians have to be more honest with people, that’s the only way we’ll end the Union, and Holyrood has to do things differently from Westminster, change our banking system set up new banks just for Scotland, don’t go down the cashless way, why should our money and life be controlled by private banks, we have to get back to living not being told and controlled. People are not marching for nothing this Scottish Government have to start working for the people, start being different, with this virus showing how fragile life really is, people are wanting things to be different.
“Get Indy Done” ? Ugh. That reeks of Boris, Mogg and Farage. No thanks.
Famous15 says: 28 March, 2020 at 8:47 am
I got told a story about someone who had been ‘interviewed’ by a well known TV news outfit.
Before the interview, they were giving a wee talk beforehand, a mixture of charming banter and fake news. The person went on for the interview but didn’t talk shite because they knew they were being taken for a mug. The clip didn’t make any news programmes.
I don’t know if this happened with the NHS employee you mentioned but it is stressful time for everybody and maybe that employee was caught at the wrong time and needed to vent their frustration. It could be simply that the BBC went around interviewing a number of staff at the hospital and that employee did the best clip that fitted in with their ‘narrative’.
Make sure you stock up with popcorn
@ Terry 8:12 am
Well said
Before you start granting sainthood to AS you should remember that his defence was that he acted like a real sleazeball but he did nothing illegal.
Can’t see too many women warming to that.
I think a period of quiet contrition might be more appropriate.
Nonsense! His defence was that he didn’t do it. The Jury agreed and acquitted him.
Well Pete you must have read a quite different report form me.
Mogatron , I like this deporting idea of yours but do we have enough buses to take away all those that have decried this beloved country?
Heh Jackie.
It was a turn of phrase. I don’t think “get Indy done” should be a slogan cos of the farage connotations. But ultimately that’s what the goal is!
Let’s just stick with YES.
Alex Salmond is to me and many others the greatest ever living Scot.
Starting from a low poll he took us close to securing independence and shook the British establishment.
George Robertson said that devolution would kill Independence stone dead. The current Vichy government under Sturgeon is the testimony to that. Soft on independence, failed on Brexit, it is a devolved government acting on behalf of Westminster – just as George Robertson imagined.
But that may now all change. With the plot to convict, discredit and jailed collapsing, the independence movement now through Alex has opportunity to expose how rotten, corrupted and compromised the Vichy devolved government under Sturgeon is.
More importantly it will allow either a new leadership to come to the fore of the SNP and or facilitate at the creation of a new Independence Party.
So not vengeance from Mr Salmond. Rather the opportunity to expose and change the course of history. And I’m sure he will play it out well. Change is coming once we get past the hell of the badly mismanaged Virus crisis.
The Tartes le Vengeance at the heart of the Vichy government so compromised by the establishment are set to be exposed.
If you think about the character of the man, maybe you would conclude that he will remain 100% committed to achieving Independence? I don’t believe he would do anything to jeopardise that.
Being back in the political fray may be vengeance enough, perhaps.
Nicola and Alex should meet to sort thing out,
Maybe Greyfriars church Dumfries,
what could go wrong.
I hope Alex has a good rest and stays safe. Jotting down a few memoirs would be an excellent way to spend this period of self isolation.
Excellent cartoon, as ever.
BTW his January Alex Salmond show on RT interviews Ruth Wishart and George Kerevan on whither Scotland now that a S30 has been ruled out.
He also has Kenny Mcaskill in the studio and Alex Reid online on the same subject.
In total keeping with the times and will be interesting to see who gets sliced lol
Will the title of Alex’s book be called:
“Et tu Sturgeon but I mak sikkar” ?
Here’s enough to keep your brains spinning for the day.
This is not a time for vengeance, Mr Salmond, but for contrition
https://archive.is/Lv7MV
Believe it or not – the Alex Salmond trial could change us all for the better
http://archive.is/H1bEA
Sturgeon dare not stay silent as the Salmond camp attacks
https://archive.is/nvRTp
This isn’t going to go down well with some but woman are equals and they must act as equals.
Must be awkward if a colleague or boss propositions you but establish before the even in your mind
That if it happens you make it very clear it stops there and then.
If it persists you make it clear you will be taking it further up the command chain, to your partner and the police if necessary.
There are woman out there you can satisfy any frustration for a one off payment no questions asked.
if a man is desperate so head them off in that direction.
Prostitutes make the conscious decision to do x in return for y.
Sorry but if you feel you need to put
up with these kinds of advances to keep your job
You too are doing a trade of x for y.
I cannot believe that 10 or so women in high powered positions were all afraid to stand up for themselves, not makes official company’s or contact the police to end it.
You can’t but too sure of something being an injustice if it takes 5-10 years to decide.
Sure some people are weak or vulnerable but 10 out of 10 women I just cannot believe.
You nip these things in the bud or you allow them to grow and blossom.
Would you tell your kid to keep giving his pocket money to the school bully?
Ladies of the night have their rules and codes of conduct that are quite simple to follow
Pity Bute House Ladies need to claim life is too complicated for them to find the right course of action.
I make it clear that No means No and all things come to an abrupt stop at that point!
I’m fortunate in knowing the females in my family would be colouring round spherical objects
Black and Blue with a stiletto mark if this happened to them.
It’s a universal language understood by all men.
Breaks at 7:55.
Unless the perpetrators are co-conspirers so they got the dirty on you!
Of course!!
SNP done from the top down.
No wonder it’s “Boris” now!
Alec Salmond is 100% human and therefore possesses all of the imperfections that that status bestows upon each and every one of us. That the jury concurred similarly is all that should concern us – justice has been done.
The intriguers who placed him in the dock must be exposed and made to answer for their vicious calumny; their masters too, if applicable.
Robert Louis @ 08:17
“The silence by some in the SNP regarding his innocence, speaks volumes”
I am delighted at Alex’s innocence!
But the cause is greater than any one man.
Let due process be followed as indeed Alex has said himself, kangaroo courts are not the answer, neither is uninformed and vile slandering (not calling you out for this, others on here know who they are) of the FM at this point in time!
The independence movement has been successful because of its unity, there is the old saying “united we….” how many times does it need to be repeated?
Terry,,,,
“Get Indy Done” has nothing to do with Brexit.
It is a catchy slogan that will become known to the world as meaning, get Scottish Independence done.
Who cares if Farage used a similar slogan. And by the way, get Brexit done, was probably taken from some other idea. It’s how ideas evolve, you take little bits of ideas from around the world.
It’s how all good inventions have been happening since human existence.
So fuck Farage,,,he has nothing to do with Get Indy Done, and it would be a good talking point if people do relate it to Farage.
Any publicity is good publicity.
Get Indy Done…
Dorothy Devine 9.37
I read that his QC admitted that AS was not a good person (or words to that effect) but that he was innocent of criminality.
Maybe the Rev can arbitrate on this
I also agree that the correct verdict was given.
However, you cannot get away from what was said by his defence or have I read it wrong?
Effijy says:
28 March, 2020 at 9:08 am
Top news story is how is Boris keeping- Who gives a !!!!
Maybe on the British Indoctrination Channel, but from browsing around international Tweets, I get the distinct impression Johnson is a total laughing stock for catching the virus after boasting about all the hand’s he’s been shaking. What an utter clown.
Between Boris and Brexit, not forgetting the EU’s “missed email” on ventilators, the biggest current UK export is it’s own cringeworthy humiliation.
Kinda apt this cartoon is about revenge, because all those decades of terribly British stereotypes taking the piss out of ‘stupid’ Irishmen, ‘arrogant’ Germans, and ‘penny pinching’ Jocks will soon be coming home to roost…
Boris Johnson thinks he’s Winston Churchill, but the world will forever remember him as the imbecile on the zip-line who wrecked the UK economy and gave himself COV19. Eton must be so proud of him.
When the rest of the world sees light at the end of the tunnel with COV19, the light the UK will seeing is another train coming, and they’ll be another round of panic buying and empty shelves for Brexit once the transition expires.
I know COV19 is bad and must be taken seriously, but that is NOT a reason to throw Independence planning on the back burner, because there is yet another Open Goal for Indy heading our way and we CANNOT afford the luxury to keep on missing them.
The Tory Government under Johnson will come under extraordinary pressure when Johnson has to juggle a Brexit he has mishandled, a Pandemic which made him a laughing stock and killed many more people than it had to, and an angry public forced to confront the actuality of Brexit on an economy ravaged by COV19.
IF Scotland can stop faffing about under Sturgeon, we can anticipate a time in the near future whereby Scotland will have the opportunity to offer it’s people a Constitutional “Get out of Jail Free” card, and spare our Nation from the Brexit Calamity.
Just at the death, we can choose to dissolve the UK Union, and look to adopt the “Holding Pen” status which Jean Claude Juncker and Guy Verhofstad were offering Scotland within hours of the Brexit Result back in 2016. But to do that, we need to be holding those discussions and making those plans and contingencies right now.
Do you understand? NOT a referendum, but a short, sharp Constitutional dissolution of the Union in time to avoid Brexit, and adopt for Scotland the EU’s Holding Pen status, pending a ratification plebiscite and transition negotiations with the former UK Government.
But if we want this option, we need to be ready to do it, and go for the gap which will be there, but oh so briefly. I’m not sure we can wait for Alex Salmond’s book. Speed is of the essence.
Right now, we should be preparing brother and sister Constitutional submissions for both the UN and Council of Europe; one submission detailing the case for Scottish Sovereign legitimacy, and the second submission demolishing the unsound and dysfunctional arguments and principles of UK Parliamentary Sovereignty.
We should also constitute a quasi-sovereign Scottish Government elect, – NOT devolved wee Holyrood, but a NEW Agency representing the Sovereign Constitution of the Nation, which has Legal Personality, and can and does liaise with the EU to brief them of Scotland’s Sovereign intentions to dissolve the UK Union, and discuss formal arrangements for the Holding Pen status envisioned in 2016. We can’t right now hold face to face negotiations of course, but these plans must be made and the discussions must happen quickly and with resolute purpose.
If not extended, (or doesn’t collapse prematurely), the Brexit Withdawal Agreement expires on 31st December. If we want an escape option, Scotland MUST have its homework done and all of these negotiations be well enough advanced that by December or earlier, we can offer the people of Scotland a choice and a way out of this darkness. There is a great deal to do in nine months, and there may not even be nine months in which to do it.
THAT is why we cannot afford to squander more opportunity under Sturgeon. We need to circumvent our devolved talking shop and move with all possible speed to engage Scotland’s SOVEREIGN Constitution, and if necessary compel both the UN and EU to recognise it.
Straight away, we need a conference call between Alex Salmond, Joanna Cherry, and Craig Murray. We probably need a detailed Wee Constitutional handbook from Rev Stu explaining how a sovereign constitution actually works, and that wee book might also feature the rudimentary arguments of the constitutional plebiscite which we would hold next year. A great WEE Book and and a great big YES – AUOB army to distribute it and more… once COV19 is over… (sounds like putting the band back together eh?) 😉
As for the SNP, Holyrood, and even the List Party? Well, the actions as I see them in my head will be happening outside the UK or devolved Scottish Parliamentary jurisdictions. We won’t be drinking blended, watered down sovereignty, but the very best Malt Sovereignty, and drinking it neat. They can come along with us or stay where they are according to their own beliefs. But they can’t stop us.
Too radical for you? Not the right time? Do you want Independence or not? There is one more open goal that is heading in our direction. We must be ready to break the the back of the net. I don’t know how many more such open goals Fate will steer in our direction.
Alex Salmond should certainly return to help in the drive for independence. His talents and experience are needed, but perhaps not as leader. The unionists will never let this trial be forgotten by the public (see Pete above), and a small fact like innocence won’t stop them.That one not proven verdict will be used again and again against him.
Also he was never popular with some women, though no women that I have known could ever explain why.. That will be exploited to the utmost.
I think we need his drive in some key position where he could still provide guidance and leadership where it is seen to be lacking.
Spot on Chris, its very hard to believe that Sturgeon and her husband Peter Murrell, didn’t know what was going on, with regards to the concerted effort to send Alex Salmond to prison for a very long time.
I think the only way to avoid a public washing of SNP laundry is, if Salmond is publicly welcomed back into the SNP and in the process the betrayers are cast out of the party.
I’d go as far as to say Sturgeon should stand down as FM, (as should Peter Murrell), when the time is right to keep her reputation intact, and Alex voted in as the next FM, amid a very public and united fanfare.
Then we can push in solidarty for independence, knowning that Salmond has already treaded where Sturgeon fears to go.
And bear in mind that women can harass men at work as well. I have never harassed anyone in my life but I was sexually assaulted by a colleague.
I had left the Xmas party in the lunchroom at the end of the lab space to tend an experiment. As I was returning this colleague came up and without a by-your-leave kissed me full on the lips. I failed to reciprocate. I was a happily married family man and she knew this.
Being repressed socially awkward nerdy types we simply pretended it hadn’t happened. I still had to share an office with her (4 desks).
I don’t want to think about how my other colleagues would have regarded me, the family man, if I had responded and we had struck up an affair. No matter how much you think you have hidden this, you haven’t.
Independently our head tech (a bitter divorcee) opined that I could have an affair and my wife wouldn’t know. I responded that I wasn’t that good an actor. They gave me the awerd for the ‘most improved actor’ in the last year of school. Think about that.
Aside from the lack of any desire on my part to betray my wife. I had no confidence whatever that I could keep something like that secret.
Get a right team together, Alex Salmond behind the scene and Joanna Cherry a great speaker and passionate for Scotland’s rights & future, she sat down in Westminster almost every day for hours during the brexit carry on a great worker for Scotland, but there’s plenty patriots willing to have a go, professional people with Scotland’s interest at heart.
At these Nicola Sturgeon virus updates, I get the feeling that all that is in her head is “what the fuck is Alex going to say about me”
She looks shit scared, she looks worried, she looks guilty, she looks like someone who doesn’t want this First Minister’s job anymore.
Ms Sturgeon should resign gracefully, putting it down to “personal problems”.
She looks tired, she looks washed up, she looks finished.
@ John H.
It’s not rocket science as to how many women and, let’s not forget, men didn’t like Salmond and its the same reason many today don’t like Nicola, its called propaganda, and as we now recognise our country and its people have been subjected to it in one form or another since 1707. The vicious, personal attacks against Nicola are little different to the vicious personal attacks against ALex. Whatever AS has in the pipeline, the state will know about it and will ramp up the attacks on both Alex and Nicola as the time draws closer to action.
I am not dealing with whether he could have been a better man he certainly could have been. Then to paraphrase but he was no criminal.
That was all the defence said negatively about the “Marmite” man.
Reminds me of my days in management when a member of staff tried to take advantage I would vow “No more Mr NiceGuy”
Jackie are you going to the old 77th dinner dance this year? Asking for an admirer.
Erm, a few weeks ago I clumsily called for a political martyr to emerge to help the pro-indy cause.
[I don’t blame you for not remembering]
But could this possibly be the right time, after competently stewarding Scotland through the worst of the virus crisis, for the current FM to gracefully [with the thanks of the nation] step away from office and let someone else take the helm? Someone who has the guts as well as the intelligence to fight Westminster and win independence for Scotland?
The longer the First Minister delays sacking the UK appointed civil servants, Leslie Evans, Chris Birt and Judith MacKinnon ,the worse it appears. No statement on these three since the trial – speaks volumes.
I know now whom I support – Mr Salmond.
I am a member of the SNP and have been for over thirty years. I cannot force the sacking of civil servants. All I can do is withdraw my membership.
I understand these are very difficult times.
Mr Salmond would have been sent to jail to die. He deserves so much better.
Liz Lloyd should be sacked immediately. And a statement issued on those who collaborated before the trial.
There is a whirlwind coming. I am retaining my membership to rid the party of those who plotted against Mr Salmond. I suggest, and hope, others do likewise.
Another cracker, Chris.
Certain sphincters will be twitching like a rabbit’s nose. Waiting for what’s coming must be an absolute James Blunt. Will they hold?
jackie says: 28 March, 2020 at 11:34 am
There are plenty of things that people can contribute to the conversation. The best thing you can provide is silence.
John H
Absolutely correct but I don’t think the ‘not proven’ counts for anything.
It was the open admission by his defence that he was NOT a good person.
None of us are, but for someone in his position and trying to fight an election it’s bad.
BOJO is probably similar but has the ability to win people over.
His ratings and the Conservatives are sky high.
‘ words to that effect”
Capella says: at 10:13 am
“I hope Alex has a good rest and stays safe. Jotting down a few memoirs would be an excellent way to spend this period of self isolation.”
Yes Capella, I think he might be well ahead on it.
Making it known the draughts were copied and kept safe, JIC, would be prudent.
“Excellent cartoon”
We’ve come to expect excellence from Holiday Boy, poor chap.
I do not recall the defence saying “he was NOT a good person”
The defence said he could have been a better person.
More than semantics here. We ALL could be better people.
AS has every right to “seek revenge” or as I see it, justice. This rot within the SNP must be excised, quickly and completely. Independence depends on it as the SNP is currently tainted with corruption and cabalism.
@ Pac Man
Best put down i,ve heard for a while.( Doffs cap)
Lots of “now is not the time” in the press regarding AS seeking to right a wrong and name/shame those at the heart of the matter.
Corona virus crisis and giving succour to the opponents of Indy in having the SNP plunge into civil war being the frequently used excuses for AS not only having to keep his powder dry, but also under lock and key.
I suspect another reason why the “now is not the time” brigade seeks to delay AS is to keep the current SNP leadership in place for long enough to set the manifesto for the 2021 Holyrood election and keep IndyRef2 off the agenda.
The current leadership are weak in the face of Westminster and therefore serve UK interests far more than any possible alternative, hence a desire by the British Establishment to maintain the status quo and use any means, fair or foul, to destroy AS.
The sooner someone scuttles off to pursue her career with the UN, courtesy of the UK Govt’s no doubt glowing reference, the better!
Just wondering:
Did the SNP and Green politicians that tweeted their congratulations to Kezia Dugdale do the same for Alex Salmond?
Talk of places being converted to “large makeshift hospitals” has echos of Pinochet”s football stadiums, bit chilling, declare a state of emergency, confine population, shut down communications.
Sound familiar?
We should develop independent forms of communication.
Ok tin foil hat back on the shelf.
“I don’t think the ‘not proven’ counts for anything.”
Not proven counts legally as exactly the same as not guilty.
It’s an alternative form of words with exactly the same meaning in law, that the prosecution case has failed to convince the jury of the guilt of the accused. Why that might be is irrelevant to the result, that the accused is acquitted.
@Famous15
Agree.
The counter to his enemies, yoons and SNP alike, is he was and is a man. He didn’t indulge in kiddie fiddling.
Months ago my friend Joe, who thinks AS is the antichrist, suggested AS had an affair with Tasmina. My other friend responded that he couldn’t blame him as she was rather tasty. I wonder if that thought was present in the jury vis a vis the redheaded accuser!
Astonished says: 28 March, 2020 at 11:49 am
There is so much hints, rumours and innuendo flying about that unless solid provable facts are presented, assertions can’t be made.
Until I am presented with facts that suggest otherwise, I am of the opinion that this case was perpetrated as a way to getting at Nicola Sturgeon and undermining her authority. If Alex Salmond was convicted as a rapist, it would totally undermine Nicola Sturgeon’s credibility as a champion of woman’s rights with being closely associated with him. In that way, AS wasn’t the target, NS was.
In sacking these UK appointed civil servants, NS would be accused of being hypocritical and protecting her close associate AS. However, in not doing so, she is alienating many rank and file SNP members like yourself. She is caught between the devil and the deep blue sea.
As I have said in many posts, I am a gradualist by instinct and while supportive of the SNP policy, I am not too happy with their execution of it which is why I am advocated alternative strategies. It isn’t my place to offer opinions. I only ask to pause, reflect and wait until the facts come out before making rash decisions.
As I said I am a gradualist by instinct. My head says that is the right thing to do. However, my heart says that Alex Salmond has done the most and suffered the most in his political career whose sole aim was for the betterment of the Scottish people. If he says things in the future that goes against what I believe in then I will accept that. Until then, we can’t let the British state play their divide and conquer tactics which they have perfected over the centuries.
From what I’ve heard, Wee Eck loves his Sci-fi and he’ll know the meaning of his article better as:
Maybe the rest of us should contemplate that rather than coming to rash decisions and running our mouths off?
Bob Mack says:28 March, 2020 at 12:10 pm
Can’t take credit for it as it was from Red Dwarf. IIRC, it was between Rimmer and the Cat.
Xaracen12.14
I meant that there was nothing negative in ‘not proven’.
Apologies – I could have worded that better.
It was the overall defence strategy to which I was referring and my conclusion that it wasn’t a good advert for someone wanting high office.
Good article about Iceland’s response to the pandemic..
https://wellbeingeconomy.org/how-iceland-is-already-using-its-wellbeing-framework-in-tackling-the-covid-19-crisis?fbclid=IwAR1l2woMRVM0k6jB7A7ZB7KyNsjuG5G_D5BKacG-eTg6hs3Yz_NJrImO26w
The overall defence strategy of pleading Not Guilty was correct. He was acquitted on all charges. Simple.
Robert Kerr says: 28 March, 2020 at 12:19 pm
Nowadays in the media we are blanketed wall to wall with diversity with more BAME people getting opportunities and listened to that never happened in the past. Even just ten years ago, it was totally different and in real life for most people of Scotland, very few people saw a non-white person apart from the local corner shop.
I remember an incident in my twenties that has stuck in my mind, a young black English lassie started work in a place where I was at. She was an absolute honey and I had got a few smiles and a few comments from her. Nothing happened but she was totally down to earth and really nice. However, the racist comments I had heard about her from female colleagues was shocking. As I mentioned, there was no real direct experience of BAME people and hearing those comments was really an eye opener coming from people whom I thought was decent and tolerant.
As I mentioned, you can’t jump to conclusions but I wonder how much of this behaviour I had mentioned is similar to AS association with TA-S?
Alistair Jack has symptoms of the corona virus ,new medical finding that a virus can be transmitted from animal to vegetable!!!
No worries, but that clarification could do with being out there more than it is, I think, it’s a common misperception of the term. The press like to trade on it, and they get away with it because no-one able to hold them to account seems willing to do so.
The mango Mussolini’s doing an incredible job in the US, he says..!
Who needs EU help Bojo when recycling plastic does the job.
https://twitter.com/mgudesblatt/status/1243521669119049729
Let’s be honest about the name of the SNP, there is a proportion of people, not huge, but enough to swing a tight referendum, who cannot abide the SNP because of the word National (which is repeatedly used as Nationalist).
I would rather not see a new Party (other than a Wings targeting list seats only) and if AS and co. do take control of the SNP, what an opportunity it would be to ‘rebrand’.
Don’t get too exited:
https://en.mehrnews.com/news/157078/Contradictory-reports-on-Queen-Elizabeth-coronavirus-test-result
PacMan
You deliberately misconstrued my comment.
You have now joined my scroll by list
@Dorothy Devine 8:22 am
Can’t think of any other ‘key journalists’
Perhaps Ed Vulliamy, though he might now be retired.
@ Morgatron.
‘ transmitted from animal to vegetable ‘
Neither of which is considered sentient by the Tory party, Lol.
The SNP needs cleaned up from the inside out and from top to bottom. To think SNP paid staff, MSPs and Scottish civil servants can conspire to neuter a major leader should ring alarm bells to even the most ardent of the party faithful.
These so called ‘criminal’ allegations were odd in the extreme.
What does come across as criminal is the conspiracy of the alleged victims to conjure up a ‘pattern’ of behaviour.
Not to mention what was Nicola Sturgeon’s role / knowledge in this group of women’s allegations. If she had no role or knowledge then she has been utterly blind-sighted and circumvented. Which begs the questions – what of her control over the party?
This is a scandal such as the like of various Tory scandals involving politicians over the decades. It should be investigated but not a white-wash internal investigation. Heads should roll – starting from the top.
Unsurprising that Alastair Jack catches the Coronavirus – his head’s been stuck up Boris Johnson’s arse for months!
I find it hard to believe that the british establishment is not working hard to divide and rule and I’ve not seen any hard evidence against NS as yet. So with that in mind and giving her the benefit of the doubt, I believe she is probably doing the right thing by keeping her friends close and enemies even closer.
After all, if a new senior civil servant were appointed from a small available selection, how could she know what their potential devious modus operandi was. At least with the current situation, she knows now EXACTLY where she stands with the people surrounding her.
I never used to see the point of the “Not Proven” verdict believing someone was either Guilty or Not Guilty, but as we all know life isn’t that black and white and since the Alex Salmond trial I’ve come to the conclusion it’s a good thing because it strengthens the Not Guilty or Guilty verdict
What I mean by that is if a jury only has a choice of Guilty or Not Guilty, they may choose Not Guilty because they’re unsure and don’t want to send someone to prison on that basis whereas if they choose Not Guilty when they have a Not Proven option it means according to them the accused is Not Guilty without doubt, the same applies if they choose Guilty.
So in my view the 12 Not Guilty verdicts in the AS trial was not simply Not Guilty it was Not Guilty without doubt, which taken to it’s logical conclusion means the jury were saying the accusers were effectively lying
Graeme
Totally
@Graeme
But one of the charges was returned not proven. This differentiates it from all the others which were returned not guilty.
We are told not proven and not guilty are the same in law,
So why the differentiation?
Watching RT Thursday night saw clip of Boris Johnson about 2 weeks back giving the Covid-19 briefing. “ last night I was in a ward of Coronavirus patients. I shook the hand of everyone in the ward. . . . And I’m going to continue shaking hands. “
Johnson became the first national leader in the world to contract Covid-19.
Robert Kerr says: 28 March, 2020 at 1:23 pm
You need to be more careful about what you comment but so sad, too bad, nevermind.
Too many egos on this site, think they know best. Empty vessels and all that….
Robert Kerr says:
28 March, 2020 at 2:28 pm
We are told not proven and not guilty are the same in law,
So why the differentiation?
—————————————————————–
Because we are innocent till proven guilty, the point I’m trying to make is the Not Proven option allows the jury to give a more accurate assessment of their findings
In Scot law historically the duty of the court was to establish – proven or not proven. It was amended years later to include ‘guilty or not guilty’.
What has not changed is the absolute weight of responsibility on the shoulders of the Fiscal to ‘Prove Beyond All Reasonable Doubt’.
Very specific, almost pedantically so.
I rather doubt any person standing accused in a court of law is ‘not guilty’ … of something or other, at some time – a Not Proven verdict is actually much more realistic and descriptive.
I’ve met my fair share of sleazy so and so’s at work, ‘handy’ fellows always standing too close, using every opportunity to touch. Most of them were also very good at their jobs.
I do not have any evidence or information to say they were rapists.
If we are going to start convicting guys for inappropriate comments, trying their luck (and stopping when told), or indeed using legal touches as a means to test the water to see if they’ve got a chance – then we will need to build prisons big enough for 1/2 the population – including for some women who can also behave in this way.
Not proven has the same legal standing as not guilty in the ayes of the law.
Francesca Osowska has some pretty big challenges to wrestle with, in her new job as chief executive of Scottish Natural Heritage. Should we reintroduce wolves and lynx to Scotland? Should the controversial culling of wild hares continue? Can we save the capercaillie?
But none of the critical questions about Scotland’s iconic species quite compares to her days wrestling with one of the big beasts of politics: the former First Minister Alex Salmond. The subject of Mr. Salmond crops up while Osowska and I are talking about her impressive career in government and the civil service.
https://caltonjock.com/2020/03/28/francesca-osowska-the-lowest-point-of-her-career-was-working-as-principal-private-secretary-to-alex-salmond-it-was-challenging-she-says-with-a-heavy-emphasis-on-the-word-challenging-make-of-it/
I see that a vaccine for Irony has been discovered and trialed successfully on ‘Wings’…
In other news, at least people might now know who Alister Jack is. Every cloud…
I honestly thought we had scraped the bottom of the barrel over Salmondgate, until I read today’s offering from Brian Wilson in The Hootsmon.
When it comes to erseholes, Wilson truly is the ersehole’s ersehole – what a toxic little man he is.
.
I wasn’t going to respond to the minor eejits on this forum defending Nicola Sturgeon and havering in Klingon lecturing us all to shut up.
However, would the person/s who are slagging off Alex Salmond and telling everyone on this website to stop criticizing Queen Nicola please do two things BEFORE they comment further:
1). Read this article by Rev Stuart Campbell…
https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-betrayer/
Then reflect on what this website owner has researched and published?
2). Realise that the Witches Coven High Priestess Dreghorn Dagger Merchant, Nicola Sturgeon has serious questions to answer? Even now she is riddled with guilt in her sin of omission. A decent leader would re-read Alex Salmond’s honourable departure letter when he resigned from the SNP and should have warmly welcomed Alex Salmond back into the SNP by now.
The Merchant of Dreghorn and her associates have fingerprints all over the voodoo dolls and levers of power that were utilised in the full knowledge that an innocent man and Scotland’s finest ever First Minister would have been sent to jail for a very long time to sate their coven’s selfish political advantage and monetary gain.
It amazes me how ignorant are those who pollute this website and are seemingly oblivious to all that has been thus far researched and unearthed by this website’s owner.
Stuart Campbell has written extensively on this subject and been interviewed by Alex Salmond. It seems the height of bad manners for the cranially challenged to come onto this website, appoint themselves as admin/moderators and tell the rest of us to shut up.
I for one am utterly disgusted at what the CURRENT (shoogly peg) SNP high command have done to our finest First Minister Alex Salmond.
Chris Cairns, would I be correct in interpreting your political sketch strapline reference to putting the dish on the window sill as “letting the lies be disinfected by strong natural daylight”?
Get Boris Done!
Scotland has an oven ready Turkey with blond feathers we want out of our Kitchen for good.
England isn’t working in Scotland
Brexit means Scotland’s Exit.
Brexit will be Black and Blue for Scotland
Never in the annals of history has so much been stolen from Scotland by so few.
Ask not what your country can do for you
Be told what Scotland must do for England
Lying Tory Lips sinks
Clyde Yard Ships
They may take our lives and they will always deny our Freedom.
Al-Stuart
You could be right but, I thought it’s a reference to the maxim:
“Revenge is a dish best served cold”
Al-stuart
The reference is to the saying “Revenge is a dish best served cold”.
935 deaths now in England, more than 20 times that of Scotland on 40 deaths, 38 deaths for Wales and 15 deaths for NI.
Overall the UK has 1,020 deaths, higher than what Italy had at this stage in their outbreak.
boris says:
28 March, 2020 at 3:03 pm
Francesca Osowska has some pretty big challenges….
Very cryptic. There are 4 or 5 different directions which that article might be interpreted to lead.
I don’t know if it’s fresh innuendo about Alex Salmond, or somebody playing Contempt of Court Cluedo to identify who’s who in the anonymous chapters of the Salmond case.
The Herald connection isn’t helping, given their despicable photo montage with poor wee Jamie Bulger. I know that was Neil Mackay, not Mark Smith, but forgive me, I don’t know who’s who at the Herald, just that there is form for groundless innuendo which denigrates Alex Salmond.
Sky news showing a fleet of ambulances outside the makeshift Nightingale hospital (conference centre) in London.
They must be expdcting a barrage of patients very soon.
Meanwhile across the pond, the governor of New York bemoans that the price of a ventilator has jumped from $25,000 dollars to $45,000 dollars.
US states are bidding against each other for the ventilators that’s why the price has gone sky high.
The 50 states are bidding against each other, and the Federal government raising the price of a unit.
Republicofscotland
Some US states still have the death penalty on the statute book.
Since their guilt is not in question, it would seem an appropriate punishment for the CEO’s of the vendors.
Covid-19 will leave an enduring psychological impact across the whole of society, and will remain foremost in the public consciousness for some time. I predict this ‘revenge’ will be as cold as cold can get.
Stay safe folks.
I think that most independence supporters, or at least a very substantial majority of them will recognise that Nicola Sturgeon is compromised.
Despite mandate after mandate we have moved away from the fight for independence. No referendum, no constitutional challenge, out of the EU, at odds with wider Yes – AUOB movement she has become the establishment’s Governor General in Scotland.
The expose of what happened to Salmond, how he was set up, how they wanted him to be jailed, how they wanted to stop him coming back, how they want to stop like minded SNP like Joanna Cherry, will bring about change, will bring about the removal of ("Quizmaster" - Ed)s like Sturgeon and her coterie of fifth coluninists.
“Since their guilt is not in question, it would seem an appropriate punishment for the CEO’s of the vendors.”
Col.Blimp IV.
But isn’t that the American dream? Get rich, shaft whomever you need to, to get to the top.
.
Thanks Colin, thanks Fireproojim,
I got the “cold” bit. Was just wondering if Chris Cairns was including a bit of forensic double wit in there 😉
If there is one antidote to disappointment at the lack of action on independence by the SNP it’s Brian Wilson turning up with one of his hatred of all this Scottish columns in the British Herald.
The thought of Wilson or one of his associated Labour arseholes running Scotland should be enough to give you a bit more backbone. And Labour is even more woke broke than the SNP.
Nicola Sturgeon…voted the most popular politician in the uk,
again and again and again…hmmm how do we put a stop to that?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?…?
…?…?…?
AHA…, Get Salmond…….so obvious!
Republicofscotland
Yes that’s about right, they probably just want to make sure that the poor suffer disproportionately, as always.
It wouldn’t come as much of a surprise to discover that they are distributing Covid-19 infected blankets to the homeless as we speak.
The trouble with the question of ‘Qui Bono?’ is that the list of names which come to mind is extensive and not limited to individuals within the SNP leadership.
@ Jockmcx,
Rather fanciful theory, Of course in order for your version to work ,Alex would have to be complicit . Think not.
Half of the cartoon is subtle IMO
The waiter is very French looking. Is alex book to be published in France to avoid any problems?
Anticipation is the name of the game.
Off topic…
Portuguese government has decreed that ALL asylum seekers and ALL undocumented migrants with pending applications for residence are AUTOMATICALLY granted and may access ALL STATE PROVISION including healthcare and benefits. I’m going to faint.
Just adding these ditties to a library in anticipation of the coming “Scotland wouldn’t cope alone in this crisis” yoonfest
Why cant we appoint a senior civil servant from within Scotland?. Who says we have to give the job to a Westminster appointed one. Tell them to GTF.
O/T: why are the BBC and Guardian reporting as of now yesterday’s Covid death numbers? I.e. claiming yesterday’s figure of 1019 as being the figure for right now? The UK gov site is meant to have the new figure at 5 p.m. every day but still shows that for 27th March.
Is this incompetence from BBC and Guardian? Surely not…
@ScottieDog
FYI.
“Overseas visitors to Scotland, regardless of their residency status, are exempt from NHS charges for both the diagnosis and treatment of coronavirus (COVID-19).”
From the following link to a page with other information and regional statistics.
https://www.gov.scot/coronavirus-covid-19/
Sarah maybe as someone is ill and resources are over stretched? A bit of common sense. Do you get off on a rolling death counter? Does it make a difference if this is showing 1000, 1200, or whatever the fuck?
Tyran @ 6.31
That was uncalled for…
This is a site which notices and exchanges information on the British Nationalist media and it’s treatment of people in general and the Scottish in particular….
If you think that the current situation has suddenly made them worth cutting a bit of slack…. Then your on the wrong blog, Sarah and the others are right to pick up on anything they do as questionable…..It matters….
TYRAN says:
28 March, 2020 at 6:31 pm
Because they had no problem reporting the cases/deaths for each nation of UK at the beginning,why the change? I think we know why
In the year of our lord -To date 28 of March 2020
935-ENGLAND Deaths
40-SCOTLAND Deaths
38-WALES- Deaths
15-NI-Deaths
We like details to show spread and hot spot areas.You can bet if rate was higher in Scotland or Wales or NI , you would know about it!
WE SEE YOU BBC!
Bloomberg reporting tories on 54% and BOJO on 74 % approval rating.
Shows what cv19 can do.
Expect the Tories to try to turn this social disaster to their political advantage. BoJo was claiming to be leading the fight, the other nigh. Evan that wee shite Gove was telling us to listen to the experts. Yet he was claiming Britain has had enough of experts, when selling Brexit to a gullible and traumatised society (austerity).
If there is one principle in life that will help to prolong your existance, it’s never to trust a Tory with the integrity of your biological security.
@Pete
I presume typo cv19 should be iq19 .
Notice how even at this time the Westminster guv and their media are still politicking using the Covid figures to present the UK as one country, because if Englands mortality percentages are higher than anywhere else it might reflect on Johnson not being decisive enough and if other country’s perhaps fare better their leaders might look as though they were listened to more than him
The EU doesn’t present it’s figures for their Union, each country is a country and has it’s own people and media to present its own figures
Even America presents its numbers state by state
The BBC, Sky and the rest of the unionist UK media only have one job which is to protect the Liar and fraudster Boris Johnson, and that is what they will do.
Has anyone yet seen the bbc/stv broadcasting news about the new assessment centres in Scotland. Channel 4 did a bulletin on it, anywhere else?
@ Pete
I wouldn’t get too excited about Boris and his party’s prospects.
Despite hero Churchill’s caretaker government ‘winning’ WW2, he was promptly removed in the next election in Labour’s first majority landslide win.
Not so queer as folk!
Nowt
The reported numbers by the Tory papers of Boris Johnson’s numbers going up are just his sperm count
https://www.channel4.com/news/scotlands-nhs-using-unique-system-to-treat-coronavirus-patients
https://www.travellingtabby.com/scotland-coronavirus-tracker/
It could be a muppet prime minister…oh wait… and during this type of crisis it’s fairly typical that approval ratings go up for all head’s of state. It’s not fucking rocket science.
The trouble with kicking Boris and the Tories our at the next election is that there
Is no opposition. The Labour Party couldn’t organise a day out at the seaside.
Labour has absolutely no talent or leadership in their ranks.
They bring back Tory plant dinosaurs when they want to raise their profile.
The majority of English now believe their media that they are superior beings,
The won World War 2 and their murderous empire is about to make a come back.
The Tories just blame the last leader for any failings and put in a new Oxbridge replacement
With a series of new lies and promises the Daily Hail and Express will promote.
Scotland faces another 14 years of Tory Rip off at least.
The elite will have killed off millions of society’s weakest individuals, wiped out workers rights,
Extended Zero Hours contracts and watching us fighting each other for the pennies they leave
On the table.
Scotland must wake up and take control of our own destiny soon or we will be extinguished as a nation forever.
COVID19 is worthy of news airtime, of course it is, but so too is
a) the Epstein structure that needs investigated
b) the current oil war which has seen a 68% drop in oil prices over just 12 weeks
Look!……..a squirrel
Ahundrethidiot 9.20
I see your squirrel and raise you a shark!
Another for the old 77th dinner dance. Save the last dance for me.
Big enough,rich enough and certainly clever enough. Independence is normal
Subservience is abnormal.
As we post there will now be over 1,000 Corona Virus Deaths in England.
You are more than twice as likely to die in England as you are in Scotland.
That Bastard Boris just days ago had the nerve to say on TV that Scotland’s
NHS was under performing yet All the Stats show year on year we provide
The best NHS services across all of England’s colonies.
The difference is the SNP government put health first and try to fight the decade
Long austerity cuts to our budget from Westminster.
Labour controlled NHS Wales also continues to fall well short of Scotland’s NHS.
Vote for any Unionist Party and reduce the level of Health support for all your family and
See it privatised.
Do you fancy playing Russian roulette with your children’s healthcare future?
Sorry, I should better remember my own maxims, before recommending them to others. What I meant to say is never trust a Tory with the security of your biological integrity. Or to put that another way, never trust a Tory with your health. They do not respect Natural Law and tend towards biological determinism.
Austerity was/is ideological, and is considered by the BMA, to be the primary cause of in excess of 100,000 premature deaths, so far.
journals.sagepub.com/doi/pdf/10.1177/1468795X15572277
P.S. It will be funny watching the Tories try to continue selling off the NHS now.
From what i can make of the numbers today 1019 deaths/17089 infected
Each UK country is as follows
Infected 17089
Scotland 1254 7.3%
England 14427 84.4%
Wales 1093 6.4%
NI 324 1.9%
Deaths compared to infected in each country
Scotland 40/1254 3.2%
England 926.14427 6.4%
Wales 38/1093 3.5%
NI 15/324 4.6%
So England actual has about the correct ratio for its population but the worst outcome for survival. Scotland the best outcome.
NI & Scotland slightly lower infection than population percentage and Wales slightly higher.
Serious question for those who know the identities of some/all of the ‘conspirators’.
Have any of them broken cover since the verdict was announced?
(Not expecting you to reveal their actual names – just whether or not they’ve reacted.)
Is this Boris 72% support of Johnson for his crisis handling or having the virus.
You cannot sack the women who accused AS just because they lost their case in court.
That would not be enough reason someone under employment law.
You could sack them for other reasons but you would have to pay them a lot of money in compensation.
Do you want them to make profit from what they have done ? No didn’t think so.
They will suffer with deteriorating relations at work as time passes and that alone will put them out the door as their performance sinks lower and lower.
Nobody can work well without help and cooperation of colleagues.
They will find that out fairly quickly.
@ Liz g and others: as you spotted, the point I was making was the “unreliability” of information given in the media.
That is the most terrifying thing. Why is the media protecting/promoting the false stories – e.g. the way the BBC for 20-30 years promoted Farage; the lack of critical reporting of Johnson’s dishonesty/laziness,and the Tories’ lack of ability and honesty; not giving the truth about the benefits of being in the EU/single market etc etc etc.
Why do the owners of the papers, and the people who run the BBC, want to harm the vast majority of the population in Britain? I don’t get it.
If the media told the truth we would be living in a better society because we wouldn’t have such a poor quality of politician. We wouldn’t be killing people in far off places. Our welfare state would have been supported. Our employment laws would still be in place. We might even have a reformed and written constitution. And Scotland restored to itself.
Brexit and this virus are being used by government [including Holyrood] to deprive us of even more rights. “No elections. No independence referendum because…virus, squirrels…” At any minute they could take away the internet “for security reasons”. What is to stop them? We can’t gather to protest, after all.
I think in a crisis we need more democracy, not less. Planning, not banning, would make elections and referendums possible.
If I wasn’t frightened before, I would be now.
I know folk are looking for security and reassurance right now, so attacking the government may look unhelpful. Sorry, but I simply find it impossible to trust the crew that promoted austerity and engineered Brexit.
Cutting away at our children’s futures:
how austerity is affecting the health of children,
young people and families
https://www.bma.org.uk/-/media/files/pdfs/working%20for%20change/improving%20health/child%20health/cutting-away-at-our-childrens-futures-austerity-child-health-guuk-2016.pdf?la=en
Be careful
Here’s a wee story I copied from another blog…..
“Haven’t been following slugger the last few weeks because I most likely had covid-19. I was over in England for work and picked something up, got kicked out of Brittania Hotels because I had coronavirus symptoms. I was forced (2 days later) to take a train to Glasgow where I have a house. A total disgrace and a public health crises. I didn’t take a car so I had no other option. Fortunately the trains were empty.
They told me they didn’t have enough tests and if I got worse contact them. If I did have it, for those of you who are curious, it was like a baseball bat to the head and a rough fever, body aches, chills. I didn’t have a cough but I had a sore throat and a runny nose a week before it so may have had it longer.
One thing I did notice is that the English were, up until recently, going to pubs. I think they will be hit harder than most countries just from what I have seen, it wasn’t taken seriously 2 weeks ago.”
Sarah @ 10.51
Exactly Sarah…. The media need watching now more than ever..
The one thing that gives me a “crumb” of comfort about the new legislation is that we are not looking at it from a standing start of believing them.. or having to work out they are mostly corporate puppets and then, find other’s who saw it too!
We already know their duplicity well..
And there’s at least half of Scotland already organised,not buying what they are selling us and more than capable of pointing it out, even, and especially, during a lock down 🙂
Interesting
https://twitter.com/Scotpol1314/status/1243981948785229825
More on why this government’s concern over the ‘nation’s’ health, is rather difficult to believe. Apparently the gap in life expectancy continues to grow between rich and poor in Britain. Overall, not a particularly acceptable reality, from a moral perspective anyway. So much for ‘One Nation’, or ‘all in it together’.
Pre-ARM briefing paper 2019:
Recent trends in life expectancy
and healthy life expectancy in the UK
https://www.bma.org.uk/-/media/files/pdfs/about%20the%20bma/how%20we%20work/divisions/pre%20arm%20briefings/2%20pre%20arm%20briefing%20-%20life%20expectancy.pdf?la=en
This guy has excellent blog too
https://www.barrheadboy.com/the-danger-signs/
@ Liz g: thanks for the “crumb”!
I don’t think we have cracked the cartoon yet. Does ‘La Tarte’, which the gentleman in the restaurant wants to be put on the window sill for a while so that it can be served to him cold, refer to someone else? In other words, who is (or is meant by) ‘the Tart’? Who is this ‘Tarte’ (a feminine noun) who is so full of ‘vengeance’, the way an ‘apple tart’ is full of apples, and a strawberry one of strawberries?
And what is going to happen to her after she has been put on the window sill for a while (must be a bit chilly and uncomfortable out there)? Well, once she has been cooled down out there, she might still be alive … but it looks as if the gentleman in question, in the restaurant, is going to eat her up, doesn’t it … ?
Cooled down, and – maybe – eaten alive … Maybe.
If ‘La Vengeance’ is in her (‘La Tarte’ of that name), not him (the man at table), then who exactly is she? …
Well, we can’t answer that one, we don’t know her name. Mainly because the cartoon doesn’t tell us – she isn’t even visible yet, she is just referred to.
The gentleman in the restaurant knows who she is, and so does the waiter, but we don’t … Perhaps for legal reasons? … Anyway, in the meantime, let’s just call her … ‘Madame La Vengeance’ … That seems like the appropriate name for her.
AS I was saying, we are going to have to wait a little while before all is revealed … Madame La Vengeance is still hidden away on the shelf, or at least the window sill, for the moment. No doubt feeling the chill cold wind blow all round about her as her previously high temperature, when she was fully cooked and steaming and glorious, keeps dropping, dropping, dropping, in the night air, by the window, on the sill.
All of which must be bad enough, poor thing.
But it’s only going to get worse for her … Especially when she is really cold, and the waiter takes her off the shelf, or sill, on which she has been placed. For at that moment he will bring her inside and over to the gentleman, who has been patiently waiting in the restaurant until he is ready for her to be served up to him on a dish … Poor Madame La Vengeance …
At which point, so the cartoon seems to say, he’ll have her for breakfast … Metaphorically speaking, of course.
And that will be the end of her … Whoever, she is, this mysterious unnamed Madame La Vengeance, she’ll be finished off.
Is that going to be the title of the eventual and expected book: ‘Tarte a la Vengeance’? Referring, no doubt, to whichever ‘Madame La Vengeance’ cooked up this whole plot in the first place, since she will be the book’s central and most awful character.
To be honest, I hope not. I don’t know who this Madame is, and I don’t even want to. Ever.
I just want Scotland to become independent as quickly, and cleanly, as possible.
If the book would serve that purpose, OK … but if it doesn’t, and won’t, what do we need it for?
I am rather hoping that the gentleman in the restaurant just walks away from all this. That would be very big of him. No one likes being the victim of any Madame La Vengeance (or indeed any Monsieur La Vengeance either). So it will take a very large heart to do that (just walk away), but maybe such a heart can be mustered within the breast of the man at table in the restaurant, if only for Scotland’s sake.
It will take sacrifice to win Scotland’s independence. The cycle of vengeance has to stop somewhere, otherwise it will be never-ending. Who will stop it? Who will lay it to rest? Ongoing vengeance and feuding will not serve the cause of independence well, or be useful to it in any way.
The gentleman in the restaurant is obviously in full command of the situation, which is probably why he looks so happy. He commands the waiter, and he determines what the waiter will do with the ‘Tarte a la Vengeance’. And ‘La Tarte’ just has to go wherever she is taken, to be deposited wherever the gentleman tells the waiter to put her. She now commands and controls nothing. She can’t budge one inch from where she has been put, unless the gentleman orders her to be brought to him, at his table. For the very last time …
Yes, if she was ever there before, at his table, this will be the last time. Because in that case, when the waiter picks her up off the shelf or sill where she has been shivering, and may have gradually been frozen out altogether, it won’t be to come into the heat of the restaurant or the warmth of the company …
Oh no! At that point, it seems, her fate will already have been well and truly sealed. This will be the last time for ‘Madame La Tarte a La Vengeance’ (almost an aristocratic-sounding title, that: perhaps she once had pretensions) … She will never be at the gentleman’s table (or anyone else’s table for that matter). ‘Because – dear Madame La Tarte – I am sorry, but now it’s your turn. For the guillotine, that is! You wanted heads to roll – or, at least, one head, to roll: mine – but now, alas! (a lass!) it will be yours instead’.
‘Madame la Tarte’ will have been brought to the gentleman’s table only to be gobbled up, eaten alive and – with a smack of the lips – after some satisfying dining, quite done away with.
And, AS I already said, that will be that: – it will be the very end of her. Whoever she is. She will have met the final destiny of all the Tartes – whether they are aux Pommes (apple tarts) or aux Fraises (strawberry tarts) or simply, like her, vengeful tarts, a la Vengance’. She, like them, will have disappeared … completely and utterly disappeared … for ever. … Down someone’s gullet.
If you live by the sword, you die by the sword. If you live by ‘la vengeance’, you die by ‘la vengeance’.
But this is true whoever you are – and whatever sex or gender you are, or think you are, or would like to be, or whatever crazy or not-so crazy declarations you make about yourself. It will be just as true for a ‘Monsieur La Vengeance’ as it would be for a ‘Madame la Vengeance’.
I hope very much it does not happen.
Whoever you are, vengeance is just that – vengeance. It is not a positive thing, and it is not yours or mine to mete out. There is nothing – not one thing, either in intention or in outcome – that is ever good about it. It is delusional. If you think it will give you satisfaction, you are in very deep trouble yourself. And you are in for a huge disappointment.
There may be a very understandable desire for it, with every good reason imaginable backing it up and goading you on, but it is always to be resisted. Nothing good will ever come out of it.
So the gentleman at the table has a decision to make. Yes, he can call the waiter to bring him his ‘Tarte a la Vengeance’ any time he wants. And when Madame la Tarte – whoever she is – is served to him on a dish, he can finish her off any way he wants to. He is in full command of the situation … so that’s one way he can go.
Or, he can just leave her where she is, out there on the window sill … pay his bill, and walk out the restaurant. He can walk away from her, and from the whole vengeance thing. And just let it die.
At that point, he really will walk away a free man.
And if Madame La Tarte, whoever she is, ends up neglected and lonely, and feeling the chill from (and of) all around her, well, at least it won’t be his fault. Or, if she keeps trying to inflict damage, when he walks away from the whole thing, the only person she will damage is herself.
Not easy to walk away from this mess. Not at all. Not easy for anyone who has been abused, or set up, or betrayed, even by former friends, maybe even best of friends, not easy at all for anyone on whom vengeance has been viciously visited, just to leave it alone, stir it no longer, and walk freely away from it. It takes a big heart to do that. A very big heart.
I am not sying it would be easy. Not in the least. I am saying it would be wonderful.
It will take big hearts – very big hearts – to win Scotland’s independence. Small hearts love vengeance.
Why are Wallace and Bruce such iconic figures in Scottish history?
Whatever criticism you may wish to make of one or (as some do, though I think they are mistaken) the other of them, they certainly are iconic. I think this is not just on account of their achievement, but because both of them had big hearts. AS they certainly did.
I am not saying they had no faults – they had plenty, as did everyone on both sides of the conflict (it was a cruel age, as is ours) – but they had bigger hearts than their opponents. And an intrinsically just and better cause to fight for. They never stooped to the low levels to which many of those who opposed them did.
Small hearts love vengeance. Small hearts are not Brave. Small hearts are despised. In the end, they win nothing. Nothing big, for sure. And our independence is not a small thing.
Scotland’s independence will be won by those with big hearts. AS the gentlemen in the restaurant undoubtedly – I hope so, at least – knows. He has decisions to make, but there is no rush. The situation has changed, he is once again a free man in a ‘commanding’ position: the restaurant is doing his bidding. He has time to think out his next move.
May he bide his time well, and decide wisely. Let whatever is best for Scotland be what’s best for him. Let that be the criterion. Can he sacrifice everything else for that end?
This is not the time for small hearts. The spirit of Vengeance has been vanquished, at least for now. ‘La Tarte’ has not triumphed. Let it stay that way. Let Lady MacVengeance make no comeback in any heart, whether male or female.
Not even in a heart that might feel justified in giving that Lady, and what she represents, space there, on account of having been so unjustly accused, so vindictively stitched up and so publicly hung out to dry.
Scotland’s cause can be furthered by flawed human beings, but not by vengeful hearts. It can be furthered by men who know they could and should have been better men, and by women who could and should have been better women – that’s why we can all play our part, for it is true in one way or another of all of us – but not by small and mean-minded hearts.
If we are flawed, we have no stones to throw. But we do have a job to do. We have to do independence – but without vengeance. The idea is to launch a better country – not a civil war.
This is the time for big hearts to show themselves. Flawed, no doubt, but big, and generous. With no stooping to the low low level of the vengeful-vindictive who dishonour themselves. Those who would ruin the just cause, out of vanity or revenge; leave them to self-destruct by themselves.
Hard though it may be to let go, after all that has happened, these things – vanity and revenge – need to be abandoned. They won’t win us anything. They will earn us only bitterness. and defeat. The best way to kill them off is to let them die of neglect. Leave Madame la Vengeance out in the cold, on the shelf (or window sill), where sooner or later she’ll self-destruct anyway, by her own downward-spiralling inner momentum. There is no need to expose her, whoever she is. There is need to walk away from the restaurant, free from all this. With the courage, leaving all this nonsense behind, to fight the good cause with the big heart and generosity that will indeed win the day.
Sarah @ 11.18
Any time my friend 🙂
That’s what I think was partly in the message from Nicola Sturgeon that the Yes movement can step up here.
We’re the one’s who can and will of course organise life lines to each other…
Heard…fucking…. HEARD immunity never entered OUR heads.
And, as we go about assisting our communities we show other Scots that we really,really, and demonstrably do only aspire to a better future…. and jettisoning “West-Heard-Minister” is the first step to take at the other end of this thing…
These differences in health opportunities and life expectancy are not the fault of this government. However, neither austerity or Brexit can be considered supportive of action aimed towards the reduction of poverty. As such, and viewed against the background of this government attitude towards justice and equality, it is had to believe this government supports a comprehensive approach health. So it is kind of hard to trust BoJo and his stooges right now.
From the Pre-ARM briefing paper.
Wings posters should self-isolate before any more innocents are infected with their pish.
(www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/mar/28/boris-johnson-coronavirus-outbreak-will-get-worse)
The above contains what BJ did say.
Below is probably nearer the truth.
BJ says: “It’s important for me to level with you – but it is difficult for me, because I’ve never levelled with anyone before, so , eh, you know, eh, well, here we go.
We know things will get worse before they get better. Because we have not been making the right preparations, and the more we all follow the rules, with the exception of the Royal Family, my Cabinet and I, and my wealthy friends, the fewer lives will be lost, not that that matters too much, and the sooner life can return to normal , well as near to whatever normal will ever be again, maybe in twenty years time… That is why, at this moment of national emergency, I urge you, please, to stay at home, protect the NHS so that I can sell the best bits off, and save lives, only not too many as we need to reduce the cost of Old Age Pensions by quite a bit. Actually a big bit.
I’m off now for a break, eh no, sorry, eh, I’m coughing twice a day so I’ll not be doing anything in the next few weeks, before returning to my desk, as well as my two colleagues, Alistair whothisname and Matt Hankook, who are also eh, faking it, eh, no no, eh, who are also ill just like me. Yeah, that’s it, just like me. Cheerio.”
Ayeright @ 11.57
Knock yersel oot…. There’s naebiddy hear stoapin ye
Famous15
On my case again,,,you are one cheeky old bastard.
Are you going to the dried up old cows night out???
PacMan And Famous 15 come across as a pair of old stuck up english bastards
Get off my case ya pair of old bastards
They take offence at my Anti english stance.
90% of posters here are infected with the anti SNP virus, all sane folk have given it a swerve and already left. I have full PPE, since I have a thick skin and couldn’t care less.
I pop in just to remind the 90% infected with anti-Nicola Sturgeon virus that there are still some that won’t fall for the UK states division crap.
The idiots that have found Nicola Sturgeon guilty of plotting to bring down, and if possible have Alex Salmond jailed for attempted r*pe without any evidence are who this is aimed at. Where is the evidence?
If you are not one of those creating the division then you are too thick to see that you are being used to spread it.
I am keeping a record of the figures published by the BBC and at the moment, as a percentage of population, you have twice the chance of dying in England as compared to Scotland
No doubt this will change in coming weeks but it explains the lack of numbers on the BBC and silence from BBC Scotland.
feel free to call Kaye and ask her
Jackie
I can only speak for myself and I only find disturbing your pretence.I am Scottish and you only pretend to be to besmirch the good name of our country.
So dinnae dae that.Twat.
Some right cheeky bastards on here.
Famous15
I have not got a fuckin clue what you are fuckin talking about.
Get off my fuckin case
You dried up old bastard
Take your shite out on some other bastard
Jackie @ 12.25
Then hang around fur a while…
Ye ain’t seen nuthing yet…
The National is getting pelters on twitter!!
After Salmond had the grace to acknowledge that his next move has to wait until the virus is dealt with, the accusers have decided to use the time for their own benefit – not good, not good at all 🙁
You are one of these english bastards who have moved to my country and you have a soft spot for that closet Unionist bastard Sturgeon
jackie
I distinctly remember you complaining that there are ‘too many’ sexual minorities represented in the SNP hierarchy. That’s not a particularly liberal position to argue from, so who are you trying to kid? You appear to simply be here to flame the discussion and cause trouble. Prove me wrong.
Lizg is a fuckin lesbian
You got off my case as well ya fuckin boot
Every cunt piling in
All the boots and wankers of Wings
If you are drunk then don’t post again until you come back sober
You all been sookin the cheap wine tonight
Shug @ 12.24
That’s very interesting Shug keep it up…
Hopefully you’ll be able to post the data soon or give it to the Rev and we will have another string to our how 🙂
No attempt at division going on here then 🙂
Get real all you honest Independence supporters and know who your real enemy is and take out your ire on them. It’s not the SNP.
LOL!! I’ve refrained from posting tonight and have just been following instead and it’s pretty funny what self isolation and a couple of shandies can do to people on a Saturday night!
It was pretty entertaining though, so it’s a big thumbs up from me!
Nite nite.
Me @ 12.35
Another string to our BOW… Obviously ( well I thought so )
Ayeright @ 12.36
As I keep sayin,even to those who have stopped posting…
To criticise is the nature of this place.
Was it not obvious after the 2014 NO vote. That the time it would take between then and the next Yes vote would be one of reflection?
It cannot both be true that we need to learn and improve on the 2014 vote and view all the actor’s in it as above criticism!
As I’ve said before….
If not here then where…. If not Stu then who??
Get Indy Done !!!
Mist001 @ 12.44
Then I’d recommend that you try it more often!
Indy is on hold while that closet Unionist bastard Sturgeon is still calling the shots.
SNP members need to tell her , her time is up.
Jackie @ 12.35
If you are Jackie,just don’t post again.!!!
Liz g ya lesbian bastard,,,I told you to get off my fuckin case
Ya drunken dyke bastard
@Liz g
Here’s how to create division among your opponents.
First, you cast doubt over the abilities, competence or honesty of their leaders. You spread messages that they are corrupt, they are in it for themselves and are only stringing you along.
You encourage others to agree with your point of view by focusing on single issues that you know are unpopular. Doesn’t matter what the issues are, just that they will create divisions among your opponents support.
The main goal is having them argue and disagree among themselves, cause a split, a CIVIL WAR even.
Job done, simple eh.
Dump the Bi Sexual Sturgeon and let’s,,,,,
Get Indy Done !!!
Sometimes you even make accusations without any evidence whatsoever.
Before we start trying to score political points out of different national mortality rates, has anyone considered population density as being a significant, if not primary, cause of these differences? I suggest this is why the Netherlands, which is more of a social democracy than Britain, has a higher mortality rate than England (I think). The Netherlands being Europe’s most densely populated nation. It is also more of a hub for international communication and international commerce. Damn continentals. 😉
Ayeright
WANKER!!!
OF THE HIGHEST ORDER.
FACT!!!
Ta, a badge of honour I’ll wear with pride 🙂
Dump the Bi Sexual Sturgeon and let’s,,,,
Get Indy Done!!!
Have no doubt Boris, Cummings and the Tory Party in Downing St
Were happy with the thought of the Corona Virus wiping out millions do
People who were drawing pensions, Dole money or who were drawing
The NHS with health issues-mainly the elderly.
As their thoughts were exposed they had to turn quickly to fake concern
but not go to lockdown when all the statistics said they should.
Money came first.
With millions of jobs gone and complete loss of income their was no alternative
Other than basically let everyone use the government credit card.
The alternative would be complete anarchy with rioting in the streets.
It you that has borrowed and it’s you who will pay it back over a very long time.
Your kids will pay it too.
It’s the War debt again that Tony Blair Paid off after 50 odd years.
Is the shortage of NHS equipment a plan to increase the death rate?
Is the rejection of the EU plan to share ventilators part of that plan?
Is the rejection of the ready to launch G Tech UK Built ventilators in favour of Tory
Financed James Dyson’s Malaysian still to be designed and built ventilators part of the plan,
Is not dropping all taxes on the alcohol produced for anti-bacterial products part of their plan?
Is not asking Scotland how it manages to half the English Death rate part of the plan?
Never doubt the Tory Plan is for those making them money to survive and kill to them off as soon as it stops.
Last thought for you, I hope you watched the video from the Madrid Doctor in tears as he has
Been instructed to take everyone 65 years and over off their ventilators as younger people need
Them in these times of sever shortage.
He knows it’s a horrible death sentence on lives that could be saved with the right resources.
If the number of victims in Spain continues to escalate, what do you think the chances are for
UK retired elderly people living there?
Given the choice would a Spanish Doctor give the last ventilator to a 60 year old Englishman
Or a 65 year old Spaniard?
I know exactly what would happen in reverse if inferior Johnny Foreigner dare to expect a ventilator in England.
Long live an independent Scotland with humanity and compassion for all.
Ayeright @ 2.00
Traditionally Aye… Yer …. Right.
But by your premise,Boris Johnson,Nigel Farage,Charlie Windsor….and the rest…too many to name … should be gone.
But that’s not what happened… Is it…
I’m done with societal norms?? that aren’t really really real.
Why insist that we ( the Yes and ) comply.
Did we learn nothing from purda appling to only us in 2014?
That cost us a fucking Country….
I don’t care if Alex Salmond was “Tom Catting” around Bute House… Or Nicola is shagging half the people she meets.
Anything that happens between consenting adults is none of my business….. Non consent of course must be tested in Court..
….Obviously!!! Women’s Protections must of course be strengthened…
What affects my life is that I have a government within slapping distance and the politicians whom I’ve charged to ensure my community is taken care of are demonstrably competent at what they do…
I’ve nae interest in salacious gossip…that’s for the Court’s
I’ll not be distracted….or brow beaten into a populist view!
I can still tell there is a world of difference between Crime & Sin and that none of it should dictate the future of a whole country….
Comments Unfounded and none constructive with large helping of
Character assassination and profanity belong on Facebook or Twitter
Where the owner just want money and care little for society.
This is Wings over Scotland were the owner works very long hours for
A pittance That isn’t guaranteed and you is targeted by all the Unionist
Parties, the Police, the BBC and every newspaper.
Have some respect for the house you are in or the open door might close for good.
People are dying needlessly and there are all too few journalist who work to
Give you the whole picture and let you have your say no matter how stupid that may be.
Respect it, Preserve it and be all you can be on it .
All I read mostly here when it comes to Nicola Sturgeon’s role in the Alex Salmond trial is as you say “salacious gossip”.
I won’t be distracted either, nor will I allow my views to be clouded without EVIDENCE first being heard and tried.
If we all fall out and the SNP split then forget all about Independence ever in my opinion, I don’t fancy that so prefer we stick together and don’t fall out.
Even if the accusations were true we shouldn’t fall out but agree totally that replacing the leader would be the right thing to do.
However, right now it is just “salacious gossip” and that is doing damage all by itself because people love to jump on the bandwagon and spread it.
Anyone taking part in such gossip, joining in and doing the UK governments job for them is pathetic and reduces the chances of Independence.
Divided we are weakened. stick together and they can’t possibly win.
Is it not a shame that wull’s beautiful post calling for maturity and big-heartedness, has been followed by such a torrent of ill-directed hostility and prejudice. I suppose if you can’t command the territory, you have to poison the well.
jackie
Please keep you sexual prejudices to yourself. It is possible to resist the woke-wave, without being a bigoted twat.
Effigy @ 2.35
Well said…
Tis a unique forum here…
There’s always going to be some who spoil… Or try to…
Such is life!
While it’s here it’s ours anyway… Because the Rev is a “one man band” and wants it this way…everything else is just noise..
I’ll not hand it over to them…and I think you’ll find there are many,very many, who are just waiting and watching for the time to speak again.
That’s when the disrupters find out that they might have thought they had it their own way….But they only thought it. 🙂
Can’t believe the papers are printing such pish, including The National. I stopped buying it when it started printing woke supportive shite and my mistrust seems to be validated.
Ayeright @ 2.41
Are you seriously suggesting we don’t look at this?
What I’m sayin is that we don’t fall into the habit of ignoring all scandal in the interest of the greater good.
The double standards aren’t right,but they do exist.
So!!
It never stops the Eternal Sea of Politics anywhere else!
Why should it stop Scotland’s?
I don’t see why any of this changed Scotland’s need for self governance
I’m not in this to produce a moral and righteous Holyrood!
The Historical mistakes of that, are there for those who care to look
I’m here to rebuild a Country… Not to buy what the media are selling and promoting….That’s what brought us to the lack of ventilators and the abundance of munitions!
@Liz g
Look at whatever topic or subject you like, nothing need be ignored but taking part in “salacious gossip” about Nicola Sturgeon does no one any good.
Let’s face it, Nicola Sturgeon did not feature in the Alex Salmond trial in any way as far as I know from the reporting. All I’ve heard is on here and that is just “salacious gossip”.
Do you have any evidence that Nicola Sturgeon wanted Alex Salmond JAILED for attempted r*pe? Do you even believe such a thing could be possible?
I’m asking because it sounds absolutely ridiculous to me.
I can just imagine Nicola Sturgeon after Alex Salmond resigned and handed over leadership of the SNP to her plotting with others to bring him down. Eh? he already gave her the leadership.
Then sometime around 2018, she started plotting with senior civil servants to bring forward accusations of sexual assault committed by him against young women during his time as First Minister and colluded with them in order to do so?
Eh? Really? Why?
Get real.
@ wull 11.35pm normally I like and agree with most of your posts But on this occasion I disagree strongly on AS walking away from this corruption
IMO it wouldn’t give him closure and sustenance it would only prey on his mind that people had deliberately and willfully without a care for his or his wifes mental health or physical health sought to destroy his name ,character , integrity , honesty and person without even a backward glance .
This is without even taking into consideration that had he been found guilty on these charges he would probably have been given a prison sentence which may have resulted in him spending the rest of his life in prison , that is what these accusers were quite willing to do
I have stated openly on here in the past that I don’t trust ANY politician , I do not have any adoration or worship any politician as they are only doing a job they chose to do , but equally I abhor and despise anyone or any organisation who willingly concocts and collaborates with others to destroy and imprison an innocent man for political expediency
Alex Salmond and his wife Moira have undergone at least 2 years of mental trauma , their home lives have been the focus of intense media scrutiny ,their privacy has been destroyed , their trust in each other has been corrupted by the exposures brought out in this trial , yet AS is supposed to be the better person and walk away from this concocted life destroying collaboration without EXPOSING the perpetrators behind it , I would think that’s too much to ask
Well said, Liz g. Scandal must be dealt with and not brushed under the carpet because “it might cause problems”.
Isn’t it far more likely that this was a Britsh State attempt to destroy the reputation of Alex Salmond and at the very same time implicate Nicola Sturgeon as being the one responsible?
For Wingers, it seems many of you are as gullible as f*ck.
Ayeright @ 3.28
I don’t believe I took part in any gossip salacious or otherwise about “The First Minister” but am willing to stand corrected!
And I’m not at all clear if you think I did… But do not get the impression that ye did…Anyhoo..
What I think that you and I are debating is that …
There is no evidence produced so far that Nicola has anything to do with the recent proceedings around Alex Salmond.
You are correct.
I will defer.
There is no such evidence in the public domain..
Very serious charges were laid however and…
How such a thing could happen on the other hand,is what I would argue is now that the Court’s have tested them up for debate..
We (as a collective ) I would argue, don’t want a mini me Westminster… So…If our politicians are in doubt…I don’t want,, And Scotland don’t need,, a Westminster playbook..
Let’s be big enough to plough the road to Indy
@Liz g
All I’m saying is, don’t fall the posters who write the sh*te aimed at Nicola Sturgeon and making us all fall out.
Accusations without proof remain as accusations.
Surely we’re better than that and that’s why Alex Salmond remained innocent until proven guilty!
Well, he was found to be innocent and the same courtesy should be extended to Nicola Sturgeon by those accusing her of being entwined in the court case against Alex. An actual PLOT to have him convicted?
For a crime to have been committed you need a motive. What was the motive that would lead her to support a plot to potentially Jail an innocent man for 5 to to 10 yeras?
It’s unbeliveable, so I don’t believe it, unless I see evidence that proves me wrong in my belief.
.
Hater of The Twatters,
Very well said.
I agree with your words in respect to Alex Salmond 100%
Indeed, following statements made elsewhere, I believe that arrests are imminent for those to whom a conspiracy to pervert the course of justice and are about to taste just desserts. I genuinely empathise with the torment of SNP troops on the ground. On 1st May 1997 A wonderful, feeling of relief came over many of us who cared about socilal justice when the despised Tories got booted out.
New Prime Minister Tony Blair promised so much. He is gone now, with a toxic legacy having been found out as a duplicitous liar.
When Nicola Sturgeon’s acolytes are interviewed under police caution, SNP grass roots will need to keep the heid.
New information is being ingathered all the time…
https://tinyurl.com/WoS-Innocents-and-Miscreants
twathater
I’ve got to agree with that. Due process must be followed and any misconduct punished appropriately. Justice rather than vengeance is the way that I look at things. How best to serve justice though? Certainly not by standing under British constitutional law, which lacks coherence with international law.
Some more homework for some of Scotland’s judiciary. Without a legally defensible legal personality, it is not possible to make effective claims to human rights. Brexit denies Scots have a legally defensible personality, while the proposed GRA reform denies biological women the same. We do live in ‘interesting’ times.
Full text.
Criminal Defence and the International Legal Personality of the Individual
https://www.persee.fr/doc/rqdi_0828-9999_2010_hos_1_1_1410
Ayeright @ 4.10
Then we are in agreement my friend!
Nobody should fall for any of the accusations.
My only objection is that we shouldn’t discuss them !
As I’ve already said.
If not here then where?
Ok we’ll get our idiots… We always have!!
We know that!!
Let’s look at this thing and see what we all think!!
There is no way ( I think ) it will change anybody’s mind in the Yes movement…. Agree with Nicola or with Alex..AND?
Independence is still the Goal.
The only actual split is in the fantasies of the strange disciples of the Union Acolytes
Here’s a better one to explain what a legal personality is, and where it fits within the framework of jurisprudence.
THE NATURAL PERSON, LEGAL ENTITY OR JURIDICAL PERSON AND JURIDICAL PERSONALITY
https://elibrary.law.psu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1117&context=jlia
@ ayeright it appears that it is not just us on WOS who are ” as gullible as f+ck ”
https://www.barrheadboy.com/the-danger-signs/
.
I can understand the discomfort of hard working SNP grass root members at the fallout headed towards the CURRENT First Minister and her CEO and the high taxpayer maintenance frien Leslie Loadsamoney.
When certain contributors here call others “GULLIBLE AS FLUCK” those words reflect right back on the author.
Ayeright, do you not read the work put in by Stuart Campbell?
https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-betrayer/
Cut Bono.
As a former officer of the law, I have heard, studied and seen more than enough from the court reporters and counsel, especially Gordon Jackson QC as well as other witnesses.
Ayeright yer Noright.
There is now ample evidence to require a police investigation for the allegations.
Ayeright, perhaps you might consider another approach than name calling.
Though, in spite of your efforts to rid the SNP of its crucial post-18/9/2014 membership that boosted Indyref1 to 45% and forthcoming IndyRef2 to exceed 50% YES, I for one will REJOIN THE SNP AS A PAYING MEMBER IF ALEX SALMOND IS THE LEADER.
Cut Bono and Nicola Sturgeon Ayright.
@Liz g
Discussion is good, argument is good. Fake shit is bad.
Ayeright @ 4.43
Weeelll..
that’s a bit of an enigma wrapped up in a riddle!!as they say!!
With out discussion!
Or!
Argument!!
We cannot define Fake…
So..Ayeright… We must surely keep talkin 🙂
Always!!!?
Sorry if I’m straying off topic, but it isn’t possible to achieve justice, if you reject practical reason (see anti-foundational epistemology).
Kant’s ‘Critique of Practical Reason’
A Critical Guide
https://www.cambridge.org/core/books/kants-critique-of-practical-reason/9C7EEF5574399E559FBF2310B7310CA1
Fair play to Dr Philippa Whiteford MP for challenging the Westminster Government on their dreadful decision not to participate in EU cooperation in procurement of ventilators.
Lying through their teeth Johnson’s Governmenty initially claimed that they weren’t invited when they were, that they thought they were out of the EU when in fact the U.K. is still in transition arrangements, and then finally that there was a communication mix up with emails that got missed.
And now, as is Dr Whitford’s dire concern, the U.K. is left gravely short of ventilators whilst BoJo’s team award contracts to Tory and Brexiteer supporting vacuum company to design and produce ventilators.
And already in London and here protocols are now being in place to restrict treatment to palliative care for the over sixties in the onslaught to come.
If that does not send a shiver of fear down the spine of a quarter of our population I don’t know what will.Get the virus over sixty and become seriously ill in the onslaught phase now approaching and you’re up for a death sentence.
Let’s hope the vacuum cleaner man can rustle up a few medical devices to stop folks chocking to death. And let’s hope Prime Minister Johnson’s Government lets some of these devices, if they turn up, come to Scotland.
And yes, as an SNP MP who has broken the cosy line on health between Nicola Sturgeon and Boris Johnson, I certainly don’t here Whiteford paying tribute, like Sturgeon has done to Prime Minister Johnson and his Government.
Once we are out of the holocaust of this epidemic I think we will see changes. The days of a compromised compliant First Minister are coming to an end.
Alex Salmond has been duly tried by a jury of his peers and found wholly innocent. And did so, despite several weeks of outrageous smearing and lies by the so-called ‘journalists’ of Scotland. They threw every smear and innuendo they could at him. He was found innocent of all charges. Yet. it seems, their are some who will not accept that cold hard fact. They want to smear, smear, smear by innuendo and suggestion. WTF????
We can all see what is being done. It won’t work. You are fooling nobody.
I sincerely hope Alex Salmond takes them each and every one to the f***ing cleaners, and has criminal charges laid where appropriate.
As for that silly piece in the Times or whatever, just consider, how odd it is, that a ‘member of the public’ managed to get such a clear recording in a noisy train carriage of a random person on a train, who just so happened to be Salmond’s defence lawyer. Just by coincidence, they happened to be recording that day, at that exact time, and happened to be in a seat nearby, all just by chance. Then managed to realise who the recording was of, contacted the Times and then the Times used it to create a wholly false and misleading narrative. The Lawyer involved, was quite right to believe his discussions were private (it is clear he is speaking very quietly), and indeed, if I am not incorrect, recording a private conversation in this way, is illegal. But I am sure the dean of the faculty of advocates, as an actual lawyer will deal with them appropriately.
It is abundantly clear ,their is and has been for some time, a concerted and orchestrated effort to destroy Alex Salmond. It didn’t work. Yet still they try to smear him. Those people who indulge this nonsense, do women who are victims of actual REAL sexual assault or rape no favours whatsoever for getting involved. The mainly female jury at the high court in Edinburgh, actually heard ALL the evidence, and not just the salacious, misleading, highly selective smears run by the so-called ‘news’ papers. They found him innocent of ALL 13 charges.
With each passing day, the position of NS and Peter Murrell become more and more untenable. This is their party that is attacking an innocent man and former leader. The buck stops on their desks. Perhaps Nicola has watched just a tad too many episodes of Borgen?
Time for Mr Salmond to take the gloves off. He said he would wait, because Corona was too important, but it is now clear that those who wish to undermine and smear him, have no such scruples. In many ways they have fallen right into a trap. They have played their smearing, grubby hand too soon.
Those who may have conspired to put an innocent man in jail, and failed, are hitting back, because they are feart. Like a bunch of cornered, rabid dogs, they lash out. I look forward to seeing those who conspire against ANY innocent man OR woman in this way, being jailed themselves.
I will happily crowd fund ANY AND ALL action Mr. Salmond takes against ANY and all of those behind this garbage. I am sure I am not alone.
A not guilty verdict is not the same as innocent; it merely means that the case was not proven by the standards required for a criminal conviction. It seems that Mr Salmond was extremely tactile in his relationships with many women, who misconstrued his intentions. That is no longer acceptable in public life. There is no smoke without fire. The women whose allegations were not proven are reported today as being distraught at the verdict; there doesn’t seem to be much sympathy for them.
After reflection, and in the interests of the cause that he has espoused for many years, Mr Salmond would be best advised to retire from the public view and let sleeping dogs lie. At least he has recognised that seeking retribution at present is inappropriate.
If he does not continue to bite his tongue, it will be many years before any real prospect of Scottish independence returns. It was nearly 30 years after the Parnell scandal before Irish independence was back on the agenda.
Regardless of any plotting or non plotting, Nicola Sturgeon pissed away a golden opportunity for independence, pissed on notions of Scottish sovereignty and has reduced the FM’s office to an extension of England’s doomed herd immunity experiment. A woke Arlene Foster, or a human incarnation of a kilted up newspaper, like the “Scottish” Sun or “Scottish” Sunday Times. She will not lead
Scotland to Independence and has to go.
daodao says:
29 March, 2020 at 8:36 am
A not guilty verdict is not the same as innocent;
What a load of nonsense! I take it a guilty verdict is not the same as culpable?
@ Admiral
No. In a criminal court, guilty means guilty, i.e. beyond reasonable doubt. Not guilty merely means that the verdict was not proven beyond reasonable doubt, it doesn’t necessarily mean innocent.
Daodao. And charles stewart parnell was also fitted up.
Not guilty means exactly that, not guilty.
And guilty does’nt always mean guilty. Just ask the birmingham 6.
Almost all politicians are career politicians if they weren’t the world would be a better place and Scotland would have broke away from an unfair Union long ago, all the unionist politicians are bought and sold their not interested in Scotland, they want the big salary and hopefully end up in the house of lords down in a foreign country, what a bunch of snakes and rats, once this virus is gone Real Scots are going to demand a breakup of the Union between four countries that’s never been fair and we’ll make Scotland a modern 21st century country, and we won’t have to go cap in hand every year for a handout, time to get rid of all the snakes and rats especially the ones that are hiding within the Scottish Government.
daodao says:
29 March, 2020 at 8:36 am
A not guilty verdict is not the same as innocent…
Well yes it is actually.
The women whose allegations were not proven are reported today as being distraught at the verdict; there doesn’t seem to be much sympathy for them.
There was one not proven verdict, the others returned not guilty verdicts, pronouncing Alex Salmond an innocent man.
Having seen Salmond’s anonymous accusers using the vehicle of a Rape Crisis Centre to keep their attack on Alex Salmond going beyond the court case which found him innocent, I think there is an ugly parallel between these accusers doing for genuine rape victims in Scotland, what the SNP’s Wokest contingent have done for LGB(T) rights in Scotland; that is fanatically pursue their own toxic and narrow agenda but not caring a hoot if the cause who’s name they abuse gets thrown under a bus in the process.
These people exploit the principle of acting collectively, like a pack of wolves surrounding their victim, they exploit the principle of anonymity by attacking a victim who has reduced capacity to defend himself, they exploit covert communications to hide their conspiracy and orchestrate a narrative, they exploit their position and office to add gravitas to their conspiracy, they exploit the law to fabricate charges against an innocent man. The exploit the media which they know will promote their histrionics and fiction over the prosaic truth established in court before a predominantly female jury and judge.
The women are serial “exploiters” who would throw an innocent man under a bus, and just as readily throw the good name of the SNP, the Scottish Courts, Scottish rape victims, just to further their own vicious hobby horse conspiracy.
If you want to defend them daodao, I hope you’re a Barrister, because the tireless and inexhaustible conspiracy of these women will bring their world crashing down around their ears, and I strongly suspect public sympathy will not be kind. Be warned too, they would likely attempt to exploit you too.
I don’t believe for a single moment these women are distraught at all. But in due course I fear they will be, once they appreciate there will be weighty consequences of their actions.
Sorry Rev Stu… comment in moderation. I used the r word.
Today’s Telegraph runs a piece this morning where it gives details of
Operation Cygnus was conducted by the Tory government 4 years ago.
The purpose was to establish how the NHS would cope if a pandemic was
To break out.
The report showed that the NHS would be overwhelmed.
Shortages of Doctors, Nurses, Hospital Beds, ICU Beds, Ventilators
And equipment in general.
As the Tories had been in the middle of their long term austerity plan
The decision was to do nothing about it.
Money was put before lives.
Can we just confirm that again, the Tory Party puts money for their rich masters and themselves before the health of the majority of citizens.
Vote Tory if this fundamental policy is what you want for you and your family!
Vote for any Unionist Party and you can rely on the English giving Scotland an imposed Tory Government. Tory governments that Scotland has been rejection for 70 years consecutively!
Outrageous attack on Alex Salmond in the media today. Seems “not guilty” doesn’t mean you’re not guilty. The British State must be absolutely detrmined to prevent him returning to politics. He, and his QC, may have to take court action sooner than expected.
Alex Salmond to head up the “Wings Over Scotland” party for 1st choice vote.
Someone else to lead the “Get Indy Done” party for list votes.
Or some other combination of names and personalities.
Sturgeon is not resigning and is useless to independence so there is absolutely nothing to lose from throwing a whole sackful of spanners into the system, destroy it and start again. The “Start Again” par ty?
The Sunday National doing a Sunday Herald.
BBC Scotland certainly making hay with that statement.
The first item under Coronavirus In Scotland – Live
What’s making the front pages of Scotland’s Sunday papers
Definitely not the coronavirus stories on the pages in the picture.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-scotland-52009857
Telegraph Cygnus article here.
http://archive.is/nue7q
How very Tory to do nothing about the infrastructure and logistics problems revealed in order to protect life
But to draft emergency legislation you can have to hand when such a pandemic strikes
All the cheap wine drinkers are still in bed hung over.
No doubt they will hit the keyboards later , once they top up with the cheap stuff and no doubt they will continue their mass attack on posters who dare to suggest that Sturgeon is a spent force and should go immediately.
There is no reason for her to stay in office at this moment in time.
She either goes now,,,or,,,,wait for the shit to hit the fan once Mr Salmond puts his own case forward.
And remember your clocks Sprung forward one hour this morning.
Things Sprung in Spring
Get Indy Done…
Shortbread radio mentions a poll. Jings!
OH! Boris is popular. 🙁
Here’s another:
Sensational Panelbase poll shows SNP have further increased their enormous lead over the Tories
http://scotgoespop.blogspot.com/
PS:
Rexy our Glenrothes green 8ft dinosaur (stands on a mini roundabout) is now wearing a big face mask.
Well done to the person who thought of that. 🙂
Jackie The Jakey back on already.
Its gonna be a long day
Even with an hour cut out.
Now we know were your loyalties lie now Nicola, when media outlets like BBC Scotland have your back.
Just fuck off Nicola,,,just fuckin fuck off NOW,.
I used to call you a closet Unionist,,,now I just see you as a Unionist.
Mike Cassidy
I don’t need cheap wine to see me through the day
Have you a drink problem yourself Mike???
Wings seems to be splitting into two camps now.
You are either with Sturgeon or you have sussed her out and see her as a self-serving wee Unionist who has no desire to see Scotland become an independent nation.
It’s dead easy to spot the fully paid up members of the Nicky fanclub.
The people of the NHS (by and large) are pretty good folks, but the NHS as an institution is now about to operate a bit like the British Army – full of good people who give a shit, but armed with shitty weapons and not enough ammo to do the job, being given stupid instructions by weak leaders.
I have no faith in what any politician has to say about COVID. I have even less faith in the MSM to hold them to account.
An open letter by the accusers in the Salmond case released by rape crisis.
Seems not guilty is not “not guilty” meanwhile completely ignoring the fact that a bunch of woke feminists tried to put an innocent man in jail. Typical woke/feminist MO, creep creep whisper whisper fear mongering trying to trigger every woman’s fear of rape.
Is this the same as the “rape crisis” that is storming the universities of the USA and Australia which when the data is analysed turns out to be no crisis at all? Where there are rape help lines that never ring and empty “rape survivors” “safe spaces”, millions of government funds wasted on career feminists with no benefit to anyone other than the creation of a political movement which actually harms woman’s interests.
Is this the independent Scotland we want?
Taxi!!
I take it the National just as its sister paper the Herald no longer requires to make sales?
The journalists involved have no mortgages or debt?
Did Ms Hyslop describe any of them as ‘key journalist’?
OT but it looks like it was the ‘footman’ what done it!
Couldn’t possibly be one’s son ???
Could he have infected the footman , the understairs maid , the royal egg top remover, or the royal bum wiper?
Not to mention Grampian region.
There is no conspiracy against Alex Salmond , Its just coincidental that the accusers continue to orchestrate the negative stories to the media from a position of anonymity ,all for publication this Sunday by several outlets.
Amazingly they individually went to rape crisis who issued a statement ON THEIR INDIVIDUAL BEHALF?
No conspiracy? My ass.
I observe an increasing conviction amongst commenters that Alex Salmond should be crowned the new leader of the independence movement.
You really need to think that through. Whilst he has been found not guilty of illegal acts, I think most people in Scotland probably now think he is a slimey sleaze bag when it comes to his relationships with females.
Rightly or wrongly, having someone with that persona as a figurehead for a movement is not sustainable.
I think most people in Scotland probably now think he is a slimey sleaze bag when it comes to his relationships with females.
I think the Sun newspaper is slimey and sleazy and anyone who quotes uncritically from its pages likewise.
Innocent till proven guilty and still innocent after proven not guilty. The people of Scotland have more sense than believe anything found in the yellow press.
Re the newspaper coverage , the Guardian states that the women involved have faced an onslaught of abuse online and have police watching over them – how could the unnamed face an onslaught of abuse on line? Unless , of course , some careless journalist(s) let slip the names like they ‘let slip’ the QC’s ‘overheard on a train but edited to meet their agenda ” words.
The only one might be Leslie Evans who , if all we have read about Ayrshire and the moneys spent on the earlier legal challenge is true, should face an onslaught of abuse for incompetence not to mention the sack by her immediate superior.
I wish the media world was full of John Pilgers , then I might trust again.
Sensibledave
haha, nice try, and a little presumptuous to be speaking for most people in Scotland. If you know how most people in Scotland think, maybe you should run?
Think you’ve been self isolating for a little to long…..go get some fresh air.
“Your comment is awaiting moderation”
Smiley face!
I finally made the cut!
Snapshot printed and holds a place of honour on the wall.
Thank you, thank you oh thank you.
Made my day.
Most people in Scotland support the SNP according to a Panelbase poll for the Sunday times.
Scottish Parliament constituency voting intentions:
SNP 51% (+1)
Conservatives 26% (n/c)
Labour 14% (n/c)
Liberal Democrats 6% (-1)
Greens 3% (n/c)
Scottish Parliament regional list voting intentions:
SNP 48% (+1)
Conservatives 26% (+1)
Labour 13% (-1)
http://scotgoespop.blogspot.com/2020/03/panelbase-poll-shows-snp-have-further.html
So the conspirators get to win by having people like sensible? continue with the red top slimey sleaze bag description. People should remember David Cameron and a dead pig and his penis,Prince Charles and used sanitary towels,Prince Andrew and endless stories,the Queen with her mother giving nazi salutes,David Steel condoning child abuse,groping Tory MP etc etc.
It was so refreshing to hear Jason Leitch on TV give such clear and concise information and even made Brewer look almost wise Amazing that he was appointed as an adviser to the Scottish Government in 2007. Makes you think eh?
Just watched Brewer on the “Scottish” politics show, in which he in the second half of the show along with someone from the FAI, tried to show that Scotland will become an economic wasteland at the end of this pandemic.
As usual it was a backhanded attack on independence by the unionist programme.
Capella
I think the media are just printing the articles they had already paid for. they’ve had them on the press ready to print since the beginning of the trial.
Unfortunately they just show their true colours to even more people in the same way that Boris Johnson has suddenly found righteous indignation as his way out of the huawei deal…. Boris fury over china lies!!!!
Seems he’ll cancel the Huawei deal because China has terrible animal rights and tells lies but everyone will think the Tories are such fine principled people and the dastardly ‘Chinese’ ( sorry can’t bring myself to use the word that describes a crack in the wall) are to blame for all of this complete situation.
Trump and Johnson – what a pair. Oh, and we’ve to get used to the idea that fewer than 20,000 deaths will be a lucky escape.
What a terrible admission from a failing government, lying to it’s back teeth to cover their inadequacies, sending our NHS workers out in a thin blue line.
When asked how they would staff their new 4,000 mega bed hospital they said they would draft in staff from other parts of the country – so we’ve all to make sacrifices to save London from the Tories….
Stay safe everyone.
@Sensibledave
Some people may see AS as rather sleazy, but don’t forget, that that has been normalised in politics these days by the likes Bojo and the Donald, whose sleaziness Trumps anything Alex exhibits.
People are immune to these suggestions, and clearly happy to live with it especially if it is the means of getting Indy done.
” I think most people in Scotland probably now think he is a slimey sleaze bag when it comes to his relationships with females.”
Sensibledave.
Evidence please, otherwise it’s just innuendo dressed up as speculation.
It’s a bit like me saying Johnson is a womaniser with kids all over the place, and that the police were called over a domestic fracas in the home with one of his many girlfriends. Oops that’s all true.
Republicofscotland
You make my point for me … exactly.
The slight difference is however, that Boris has not been pursued through the courts in a very sleazy trial – and yet you have decided that he is guilty as charged. QED.
You are not very bright are you.
Sky news giving the mass murderer Tony Blair airtime on what we should do now with regards to the Coronavirus. Does anyone really give a toss what Blair thinks on anything let alone the virus, No? Me neither.
What next Sky giving Old Nick himself, Henry Kissinger airtime.
sp. ‘slimy’ no ‘E’ unless USA google which is a poor speller.
‘nosy” has no “E” either.
And the Daily Record, the Sun , the Herald et al should be given the Liverpool treatment.
I do wonder how the sales figures of newspapers are faring these days
Anybordy had a read of the Sunday Times Scotland this morning?
Do the teachers at journalism or spad school have a course on ethics,decency,honesty and morality,
and do they see having these qualities will be an obstacle to getting work in the scribbling trade,
are journalists and spads all sociopaths,without a trace of empathy and enjoyment in bringing pain and suffering to others,
if lawyers inhabit the gutter of humanity beneath them are the sewers inhabited by journalists and spads.
I think a good name for a new party would be the restoration party or scottis h restoration party whose sole manifesto would be to restore Scotland and return it to being an independent nation again as it previously had been. Nothing about money or in out of EU just puting to the voters,so you trust Scotland to run its own affairs or prefer a hostile foreign country do do it.
“The slight difference is however, that Boris has not been pursued through the courts in a very sleazy trial – and yet you have decided that he is guilty as charged. QED.”
There’s one slight difference one is your opinion the other reported in the media, and confirmed by the police via a neighbour, as he and his then or now girlfriend whichever, attempted to show unity by producing a older photo of them all lovey dovey in the park and passing it off as a photo from the day of the incident, which wil have a police reference number available in the the PNC.
As I rightly stated on another thread you are a Johnson apologist. Have you apologised for his watermelon smiles comments and his letterbox comments, or is that made up lies as well?
I’d quickly drop the “Sensible” handle and just go with Dave if I were you.
If you have information that you keep, with the intention of using it make someone do something or act in some way that they would otherwise not do, aren’t you guilty of blackmail?
People involved at the very top of the SNP, said they wanted to ‘hold on’ to accusations against AS, so that they could be used against him if he attempted to return to front line Scottish politics!
Why isn’t this a ‘conspiracy to blackmail’?
Brewer, Wilson,smith, cook, Fraser etc, etc, etc, etc,………………………………..etc, etc Real Scots and real unbiased journalists ha ha ha ha ha, that will be right, once the union ends send them packing every one.
@ Dorothy Devine – thx for the spelling bee 🙂
I don’t think these “newspapers” have to sell copy nowadays. The BBC gives them millions to promote “local democracy”, £8m IIRC.
Anyone hearing much local news these days? I hear the BBC has removed the BBC Scotland news from their bulletins and fails to inform us of important Covid19 initiatives in Scotland such as the 50 new treatment hubs. Gross negligence in a public service broadcaster in a deadly pandemic.
The BBC top item today on their website was the Alex Salmond accusers “devastated” by the court verdict. Determined to stir the umpteenth SNP Civil War when they should be helping to save lives.
The media also seem to have a full court press limiting the fallout from Boris Johnston’s government failure to act on the Covid19 pandemic. More lives lost.
RoS @10.52am
Brewer and FAI rep also brought Scotland’s oil and gas into the mix suggesting that it would not survive once we’re over the pandemic. Why would a company making a product for $12 per unit and selling it world wide for $26 per unit not survive?
Capella 51% of Scots still oppose independence in the same poll
I’m not a psephologist, but AFAIK 51/49 is within margin of error, whereas 51/26 is way out in front.
Famous15
“Sensible conservatism” is another name right-wing populism. Dave is a populist and his views a threat to open society.
Dave
You still a bigoted twat?
Right-wing populism empowers right-wing authoritarianism and social dominance orientation. Both disposition tending towards hostility towards ethnic and sexual minorities. This is the cultural psychology Dave appear to support, and everyone else content to remain standing under the authority of contemporary British constitutional law.
@James F. McIntosh
I like the name of that party very much but hopefully we can rescue the SNP.
The new poll putting the SNP further in front is good news only if they were actually to drive us forward to independence.
What good is a strong SNP if they are “soft on independence”.
As I’ve said before, I don’t care who is the leader of the SNP as long as we gain independence for our country. It’s not Alex Salmond’s party and it’s not Nicola Sturgeon’s party, it’s our party.
However, there are people in the Yes Movement that believe the current hierarchy haven’t done enough, anything or arguably made matters worse for independence.
There are also people in the Yes Movement that believe we are nearer to independence than we have ever been. There are factions forming.
That’s not unity and the decisions and actions of the SNP have created these schisms.
My own personal opinion is, that surely this cannot be classed as good leadership at all?
I’d like very much like the SNP to be cleared out of ALL those “soft on independence”.
Wouldn’t you?
Sorry James, the last question was directed at everyone. I should have made that clear.
Capella , sorry it was meant for the commentator you challenged but my general excuse is that I have no wish to be American , I have no wish for my country to be part of their education system.
Like My Fair Lady , I do wish the Americans would teach their children how to spell.
breastplate. I just wonder how many would switch over from the snp to a new party mps i am talking about and if they did, could they work together in future election to ensure we get a chance of another independence ref. vote. Of course the new party would not have the cash of the snp to help them. Just a thought in case we cannot get rid of the stallers.
@ James F McIntosh: I’ve been pushing the use of the word “restoration” for a few years as “independence” implies that we aren’t an existing, and historic, country. Also “independence” sounds a bit scary to some whereas “restoration” is just putting things back in place.
For a new party, perhaps for the regional list, what about “All for Scotland” party?
No idea James but I would take a guess at precious few.
daodao is ‘H’, and I claim a prize.
?
Many thanks to CameronB. Brodie @ 4.15 a.m. who, I think, has clarified in one succinct sentence the essence of what I was trying to say, (at inordinate length}: ‘Justice rather than vengeance’ says Cameron, is the way that I look at things.’
I was suggesting that this could and should, if possible, be the way AS will look at things too, and act accordingly. I even expect that that is indeed what will happen. Not for AS any petty and pointless vindictiveness; his to rise above all thoughts of vengeance, and be inspired only by justice.
His good judgement was already plain to see immediately after the court case. He wisely insisted that the present health emergency has to be the top priority at the moment. Any fall-out from court proceedings will therefore have to wait a little longer. That was a just measure of priorities, in a scale of political values which he generally maintains.
If he does opt for ‘justice, not vengeance’ as his way of seeing things, he will do the overriding cause to which he has dedicated his life one of its greatest favours. That cause is Scotland. An independent Scotland, yes … and also a better Scotland. Justice is the key to that, not vengeance, which never achieves a single positive thing.
Besides Cameron Brodie, I also want to mention my appreciation of Twathater, who very politely and respectfully disagreed with me, @ 4.15 a.m. Honest and well-articulated, sincere and well-argued disagreement is always to be welcomed. This too is a sound political value, on which the Yes movement ought to be thriving.
In fact, Twathater, we might not be quite as far apart as you were thinking. I actually find myself largely in agreement with the sentiments you expressed, and with the points you made. maybe you are putting a finger on an aspect that I did not sufficiently highlight.
The caption which Chris gave to his cartoon, the subtlety of which I was striving to understand better, was ‘Best served cold’. Insofar as that referred to ‘vengeance’, my point was that it would be far better if that particular thing – revenge – were never served at all. If the trial which just finished demonstrated anything, it was surely what a vile and venomous and utterly destructive thing all vengeance is. We don’t need more of it.
And the cartoon suggested to me that there is still a strong possibility that the aftermath of the trial can indeed avoid it. If the ‘Tarte a la Vengeance’ is being left out on the window sill to get cold, this provides the man at the dining table with a ‘cooling off’ period as well. Time to take some distance from the horrendous recent events, and even from his triumph in the midst of them (as perhaps indicated by his confident and happy demeanour). So as to make the wisest and most prudent decision possible about his next move … Whether to get his teeth at last into ‘la Tarte’ on the window sill, or just leave her there … ignore her … and walk away from her, and from her vicious plotting and conniving.
That would mean walking away from Vengeance, which I admitted would not be at all be easy, given the circumstances. After all that she or they have done to him, temptations to vengeance must be strong, and are indeed only natural.
But, however difficult for him, I also said, walking away remains the wisest counsel for him to follow, and the best option for him to take. Best for his – and our – cause, but also, I said, for himself personally as well.
Because Vengeance eats a person up, and destroys whoever welcomes her. You may find it sweet for a tiny moment, but it will leave you Bitter Ever After. And it can do the same to a cause.
Walking out the door and away from La Vengeance, refusing to consume ‘La Tarte’ which seems to be consumed with that very thing, I suggested, would truly set the man at the table free. Free from any desire for any thoughts of vengeance that he might still harbour. But also from the stinking stench of all the lies which underpinned this case, and emanated from it, as alluded to by Gordon Jackson.
But Twathater is fully justified in reproaching me if I failed to make it sufficiently clear that walking away from Vengeance would not prevent Justice from being done, and taking its course. What I did try to indicate – no doubt, inadequately – was that justice would be done in any case, without any need for vengeance.
The cartoon might even have been suggesting that this was already happening. Whoever had tried to take revenge on the restaurant diner (perhaps because of his refusal to advance their political careers in the way they had hoped) were already being left out in the cold (on the window sill), and were perhaps wondering what the next move of the diner, who was clearly in full command of the situation, would be.
The cartoon thus portrays that the tables have already been turned, the situation has already changed – in terms of who is in charge of it – simply on account of the verdict. It is the accusers (symbolised by the ‘Tarte a la Vengeance) who are now rendered powerless. They are now the ones being put wherever the diner wants them put (on the window sill); and they are the ones who are stuck there, unable to budge. As would have been the case of the diner if they had gained the day, and he had landed up in jail.
While the diner himself (the former accused, who had looked so powerless, and whose power the ‘Tarte a la Vengeance’ had expected to strip him of) is now in full command of the situation. The waiter does what he tells him, ‘La Tarte’ is placed where he wants it placed, and made to wait there for as long as he wants it to. Is this not meant to be an indication that justice IS now being done already, anyway – even without the diner ‘taking’ (at least as yet) any part of ‘La Tarte a la Vengeance’, not even the slightest, at all?
Other posts above mentions that Madame La Vengeance – whoever she is – and her fellow conspirators, if such they be, may now be the subject of a police investigation themselves. This is something I did not know. With a possible court case following, in which they could be accused of conspiracy to pervert the course of justice.
If such a thing were indeed to transpire, it would surely make it even easier for the man at the table ordering his desert to walk away from it all, and even more urgent that he prudently do so. If the police – the forces of law and order – are now the pursuant, the justice required will be done anyway, without him having to lift so much as a finger to make it happen. They will do the job anyway, not him.
Is that not a win / win situation for him, and for his and ours – i.e. Scotland’s – cause? If he were or were seen to be the pursuant, even if his motives were indeed purely for justice’s sake, what would happen? He would surely be unremittingly and incessantly portrayed by every mainstream media outlet in the land as a bitter and corrupt, a wicked and disgraceful, a hate-filled and a vengeful man.
And what gain would there be in all of that for his and our – for Scotland’s – cause? Or, indeed, for himself personally? None, I would say. Only increased pain …
But if the officers of the law are themselves the pursuant … It truly will not be him being, or seeming to be (since perception is so important in politics) the one inflicting any form of vengeance.
Justice WILL in fact be done, but without any whiff of him avenging himself. He will have risen above all that. Or, at the very least, he will be in a position where he CAN rise above all that. He will have walked away from ‘La Tarte a la Vengeance’ and left her well alone, poisonous as she and all revenge is.
He won’t be, or be seen to be, an Avenger.
Instead, it will be a case of ‘Vengeance is mine’, says the Law.
And, given AS’s frequently stated confidence in the Scottish legal system (not always shared by all of us, it must be said), justice – he may suppose – will indeed be done. And his supposition may well be yet again proved right. AS it has been for him twice over, in recent months.
Finally, allow me to say that I agree totally with what Twathater says about the need for everyone to respect absolutely the privacy of AS and his wife Moira. Their family life is no one’s business but their own, and any form of unwanted intrusion in that regard is simply despicable, and ought to be condemned.
This is an important point, and I share fully Twathater’s concern.
Wull @ 1.05am Thank you Wull for your thoughts and explanation of those thoughts .
Unfortunately as you have probably realised through Stuarts new post Mr Salmonds accusers are now even more determined to cause further trauma and mental anguish on an innocent man and his wife by colluding with the scurrilous msm and certain publicly funded institutions to question the veracity , integrity and honesty of the judge , jury and Scottish legal system
IMO Mr Salmond now has no other option but to highlight and expose to the justiciary this constant refusal by the accusers to accept the legal decision and to furnish proof that a conspiracy has taken place in an effort to destroy his person , and if Mr Salmond has that proof justice should INSIST that the conspirators should face the full force of the law
Many thanks, Twathater (for your post at 2.30 a.m. on Monday March 30th). Once again much appreciated.
Yes, indeed, I did take note of what happened on Sunday. In the light of which, once again, I entirely agree with you.
AS does indeed have the right to defend himself, and must do so by every legitimate means. There should be no place such unjust attacks on his person (or indeed on any person) and – in terms of their potential and actual consequences – on his family.
Moreover, he would and can do so motivated by the demand for natural justice. This is right and proper. Those who are attacking him in this way seem not only to be demonstrating how vicious and vindictive they are in their attitude towards him, but also showing their utter disdain and total disrespect for the law of the land.
This is very serious in itself, but doubly so in this case. For some, if not all of those concerned seem to be people in public office. The kind of public office, moreover, which requires of them complete respect for the law. They ought to be exemplary in that regard, and they seem to be the opposite.
This kind of hounding of an individual should not be tolerated in a civilised society. Unfortunately, the MSM, as it currently operates, not only encourages this sort of deeply personal targeting and abuse, but feeds off it and lives by it. And some politicians use this kind of thing as a weapon, even a near-deadly one. We ban certain kinds of knives to reduce knife-crime … well certain kinds of speech acts, written or verbal can be just as much intended to maim and kill.
With regard to politics, proper and even passionate political debate is a necessary and excellent thing. However, it has to be conducted rationally and fairly, within the bounds of decency and according to standards of acceptable behaviour. Ad hominem attacks on political opponents of the kind that we are seeing make the proper debate of issues impossible. Only those who wish to impose themselves by force behave in this way. On no account should AS or any of us concede to them insofar as what they are doing impedes and undermines the democratic process, and can poison its wells for a long time to come, if not for ever.
So, I entirely agree with you, Twathater. I was astonished by what transpired on Sunday, in and through the Sunday newspapers and other media. I remain confident that AS will handle this with dignity, and that his motivation will not be revenge. But justice and right, and the good of Scotland and of Scottish society as a whole.
This includes the good of Scottish politics, immediately now, but also in the long-term future. We cannot let certain kinds of behaviour, now so much in evidence, poison our political culture. The idea of the Scottish parliament, including the way it was architecturally designed, was to give rise to a different and better kind of politics. Far removed to the kind of stuff on display on Sunday, and for many a long moon – far too many.
As I said the previous time, I am against vengeance in all forms, in public life as in private. We only have to look at what came out so alarmingly in Sunday to see how awful and destructive a force it is. In no way does that mean I am opposed to justice, or to self-defence. Everyone has a right to defend his family, and his reputation.
No one, surely, has a right to set about deliberately destroying another person’s reputation, or their loved ones, or their family life. Some say all’s fair in love and war – and in politics – but it emphatically is NOT. Whether you take ‘fair’ to mean just, or to mean ‘beautiful’, you can’t just do or say anything you like in any of these activities, or indeed in every activity you can imagine. There are always controls.
That is another right which needs to be much more emphasised: a person’s right to their reputation.
Society ultimately depends on this. If it has been proved that someone did something wrong or unlawful, ok, we don’t have to deny it: we can say so. But not in order to destroy them, or simply to avenge oneself, and certainly NOT WITH MALICIOUS INTENT.
This is the problem here. There seems to be real malice involved in these incessant attacks on AS. When he defends himself, as indeed he must, I am confident that he will do it with the right attitude, and in the best way possible. And that, despite the tremendous aggravation that he has been subjected to. I mentioned ‘rising above’ it; that means not sinking to the level of these unrelenting aggressors.
Thank you again, Twathater. I do appreciate your remarks. Keep well. (And that ‘keep well’ is for you and yours.)
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