The world's most-read Scottish politics website

Wings Over Scotland


The National Embarrassment

Posted on October 16, 2023 by

We thought this was overdue an update. It’s got about 16 new front pages on it, one whole new row and a handful of newly-rediscovered replacements. It really is worth taking a few minutes to peruse it properly (click on the pic to enlarge it) to get the full effect of eight wasted years of deja vu disappointment.

It’s not even The National’s fault. They’re a business, they’re simply trying to sell a few papers to a diminishing audience of endlessly gullible eejits. The real fault lies with the halfwitted SNP members who just keep on doggedly failing to learn a single lesson, and repeatedly vote to carry on doing what they know doesn’t work and never will.

Ach weel, as they used to say.

Print Friendly, PDF & Email

1 Trackbacks/Pingbacks

  1. 16 10 23 23:56

    Wings Over Scotland’s collage speaks for itself – Dug wi' a Bone
    Ignored

0 to “The National Embarrassment”

  1. Antoine Roquentin
    Ignored
    says:

    “The fault lies with the halfwitted SNP members who just keep on doggedly failing to learn a single lesson and repeatedly vote to carry on doing what they know doesn’t work.”

    Exactly like their delegates did last weekend at the Aberdeen conference.

  2. Doreen A Milne
    Ignored
    says:

    Utter b*st*rds. SNP will never be forgiven for selling us out in order to line their own pockets. I get a sick feeling every time I see their lying faces and hear their empty rhetoric.

  3. jimnarlene
    Ignored
    says:

    Beyond depressing.

  4. Kcor
    Ignored
    says:

    “They’re a business, they’re simply trying to sell a few papers to a diminishing audience of endlessly gullible eejits.”

    Thats what some of us have been saying right from the day The National was launched.

    “The real fault lies with the halfwitted SNP members”

    More than SNP members, gullible independence supporters who voted SNP at the last election.

  5. jimnarlene
    Ignored
    says:

    Depressing would be an understatement.

  6. Ál Ba
    Ignored
    says:

    But hasn’t big Pete WeeShart got all the answers, and is definitely going to get Scotland ??????? it’s independence…?
    ps- I’ve lost track of who is still in the party.

  7. Peter Glasgow
    Ignored
    says:

    No ifs no buts. No referendum? No SNP!

  8. duncanio
    Ignored
    says:

    Only 3 sleeps till No Ifs, No Buts Day!

  9. A Scot Abroad
    Ignored
    says:

    It seems likely that half of the SNP voters (the more intelligent ones) will disappear off to other parties (Alba, ISP, some to Labour or Lib Dem, very few to the Tories), and the other half (the less intelligent ones) will stick with the SNP for various reasons.

    That’s an electoral triumph for unionism, whether at Westminster or at Holyrood. Split parties often discover that.

  10. John Thomson
    Ignored
    says:

    Can’t help but think they have got the real indy supporters stashed away somewhere drunk as skunks. How can anyone not see that our problem is this SNP leadership and government failure after failure.

  11. Robert Hughes
    Ignored
    says:

    Christ ! When you enlarge that image it’s like an Andy Warhol redux ( minus the artistic sensibility ) for the terminally gullible .

    I try to avoid seeing or reading anything by or to do with Sturgeon , seeing her coupon replicated like that is an unwelcome jolt to the system – unlike her , who was/is a jolt FROM the System . Think maybe her utility has expired .

    Dolly back ….

    Fade to grey ….

    Done .

    We all were : now it’s the SNP’s turn to lose .

    Never trust anyone whose hair never moves 🙂

  12. Tommo
    Ignored
    says:

    Devolution was always going to be a case of top-slicing the money coming in for the regional politicians and their hangers-on and pet projects and then passing on the residue (if any) to the sweating populace. However this lot seem to have elevated it to an art form. Just seen the Record’s footage of Wee Jeannie descending from on high to (quite) thunderous applause. I think the expression is ‘boak’- I am open to correction. Were it not for the Editor of this site I suspect the majority of those on here would still be trotting off loyally to vote for them, too.

  13. Where's Murphy
    Ignored
    says:

    I rarely comment anywhere about independence anymore, because what’s the point? But the fact there are people who still exist who are stupid enough to believe the SNP has the will or the ability to ever deliver an independent Scotland, coupled with the willfully ignorant who won’t even sacrifice a small dent to their own pride and the feeble minded who think political parties are like football teams the support of which can never be withdrawn means we will never see Scotland free. Tragic, depressing, and bewildering in equal measure. I’ve elected to make peace with it and get on with my life. The only hope left for me in this whole sorry affair is that these treacherous cowardly bastards receive the kicking of all kickings come next election. I despise the SNP more than the Tories. Absolute scum. Still, I do still enjoy reading wings. Hope everyone is well.

  14. paul
    Ignored
    says:

    I do not think it is the half witted members fault at all.

    Their goodwill has been unmercifully mined

    The blame lies with the fully witted leadership and their mendicants that mislead them.

  15. Spear O' Annandale
    Ignored
    says:

    Anyone who has read Doun-Hauden by Alf Baird will not be surprised by the demise of the SNP as the major political party for independence.

    This happened in almost every English as British colony around the world, where the leading party supporting independence comes to “an accommodation” with the coloniser and succumbs to the perks and downright bribes provided. However, it is usually at least a 2-pronged attack where the coloniser uses infiltrators to undermine the effectiveness of any attempts towards an independent future.

    The longer that the coloniser can keep the colony and its people under their control, the longer their time to plunder the assets and resources of that colony. Does any of that sound familiar?

    It is only when the leading party for independence crumbles that the people take over the fight to remove the burden of the coloniser. History confirms that independence is achieved by People’s Movements and not by political parties.

    I gave up on believing that any political party would be able to provide what Scotland so badly needs many years ago. That’s not being smart after the event because it has always been obvious that England cannot simply afford an independent Scotland and they will do everything in their power to ensure the cash from Scotland keeps flowing south.

  16. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    Wow! Just shows you how many times you can flog a dead horse. I don’t think all the remaining SNP supporters are stupid though. Some have been loyally supporting the party for most of their lives and things looked so hopeful in 2015. Now they are only starting to come to terms with what’s happened since that awful woman took control of the party. Many are still working their way through the various stages of grief.

    For Alba, ISP, Salvo etc, I would just say be patient, keep working hard, chipping away and hang on in there. It may take longer than expected, but it’s still coming for a that!

  17. Tinto Chiel
    Ignored
    says:

    We’ll walk it on Thursday: my friend Harvey the rabbit tells me so. Save the day! Double malts all round!

    [Irony-free zone hereafter]

    The BBC tonight shows Mrs Murrell endorsing Hamsa’s simple majority BS, despite her doing nothing with 56 seats and any other majority she has had since.

    The National has absolutely no credibility either for perpetuating this mind-numbing crapola.

    *1,000 yard stare*

    Ahoo, werewolves of London!

    Quo vadis?

  18. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    The indy-supporting stay-at-homes are still working through the various stages of grief. It’s been a painful experience. They have been very badly let down and are not interested in voting for anyone at the moment. They will be one day. Give them a bit more time.

  19. David Hannah
    Ignored
    says:

    Humza doesn’t realise that Nicola Sturgeon has used him yet. If he had any shred of self respect he’d resign tomorrow. And suspend Nicola Sturgeon. She turned up today aparently to play the role of elder Statesman.

    I head someone from the Islands quoting Alf Baird and the ferries. But the leadership won’t listen to any input from sensible people.

  20. David Hannah
    Ignored
    says:

    Some guy with a islander accent was talking about catemeran ferries and Alf Baird suggesting his ideas. They’re finally listening to the sensible e people at last it seems.

  21. Red
    Ignored
    says:

    Nicola Sturgeon, Humza, Pies Blackford, Stephen “Ghoul” Flynn, that mental Canadian wumman I’m not 100% was born a wumman, Nish Kumar…

    Is The National a newspaper, or a gynecologist handbook? Turbofannies, the lot of them.

  22. 100%Yes
    Ignored
    says:

    Its time for people to pick aside and stop buying this piss Unionist newspaper and the likes of voices.scot need to stop posting those so called Indy supporters who aren’t bothered about Independence, but are only interested in independence for the money and backing up the SNP on ever they say and do.

    How can you possibly say its not the National’s fault? When the fact is the paper is supposed to support the Scottish Independence cause, and surely one of the main reason for any descent paper is to print the truth and the facts, but instead the National has been taken the SNP bull on Independence and passing it around as if its the word of god, all because the SNP was funding the paper.

    For me I don’t want a Unionist newspaper claiming to support Independence when it doesn’t or not in the true sense of the word.

    You only have to open one eye to see the damage to Scotland the SNP leadership is doing not just to the SNP but to the very heart of our nation movement. If we allow this to continue its going to take 10-20 years to recover, so for me I hope and pray to god this paper dies a rotten death and we never hear or see it being sold or published ever again.

    Don’t be conned people, if the SNP had stuck to its core policy and worked with the Yes movement rather than try to destroy it we would be far beyond the 60% the likes of Wishart is calling for. The SNP had a army of devoted and loyalist supporters to the cause of Independence the National and the leadership have destroyed that along these other who make a good living out of saying Independence.

    Every single Scot needs to know public enemy number 1 is the SNP and there goal isn’t to win Independence its to destroy Scotland as a nation and there winning every single day we take no action and The Rag knows this.

    The day I pay homage to this unionist paper is the day I’ll end my life.

  23. Willie
    Ignored
    says:

    Are you trying to tell us something Rev.

    Surely Indy is just around the corner. All we nerd to do is elect 29 SNP’s. Or is it 29 Independence MPs. C’Mon now folks one wee push, Indy is round the corner. Vote Humza and the team.

    FFS that Rev Campbell. What’s he missing?

  24. Red
    Ignored
    says:

    By ra way, because misery loves company.

    Think how Tory voters must feel. 13 years of this dangling cat toy pish. Total deliberate waste of time.

    Think how Labour voters must feel. Their party is run by privately educated millionaires whose best ideas involve banning things.

    Nobody we know is getting what they want out of this democracy thingy, but the rich keep getting richer.

    It’s weird isn’t it.

  25. Willie
    Ignored
    says:

    Mind you there is a problem with the SNP IT. No doubt the reason the Rutherglen and Hamilton by election bombed.

    Nothing of course that a wee independence fundraiser couldn’t sort. £600k would do nicely.

    Well how’s about it then?

    Roll up, roll up, roll up. Don’t be shy. SNP’s a winner. Give us a penny mister.

  26. PacMan
    Ignored
    says:

    I’ve got a feeling that the date October 19th, 2023 is going to an albatross around the SNP’s neck.

    Anybody who spouts the garbage of the SNP will be shut down totally with 3 simple words October 19th, 2023. It will be priceless to see their coupons hitting the floor like a lead balloon after that is said to them.

  27. Robert Hughes
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Tinto C

    ” I saw a werewolf drinkin’ a piña colada at Trader Vic’s
    His hair was perfect ”

    See ! Even The Zev knew the tell-tale sign of wrong ‘uns – * immaculate * coiffeur .

    It’s akin to Einstein , when someone – noting the former’s untidy workplace – stated ” a cluttered desk reflects a cluttered mind ” asking in response ” what kind of mind does an empty desk reflect then ? ”

    Tidy desk – empty mind

    Perfect hair – vicious character

  28. Mike
    Ignored
    says:

    You know what the Indy campaign really needs right now: Hardeep Singh Kohli.

    He will be the guiding light.

  29. President Xiden
    Ignored
    says:

    It is being reported that Craig Murray has been arrested under the prevention of terrorism act on arriving at Heathrow. Is this true?

  30. Alf Baird
    Ignored
    says:

    David Hannah @ 8:04 pm

    “I head someone from the Islands quoting Alf Baird and the ferries. But the leadership won’t listen to any input from sensible people.”

    Yes, that was Robert Leslie from Orkney who reminded delegates of the massive cost and operational advantages of proven catamaran ferry designs operating in Orkney and elsewhere, i.e. less than half the cost of Scottish Government procured ‘traditional’ ferries, as presented here:

    https://oisf.org/fest-event/a-new-day-for-the-ferryman/

  31. Shug
    Ignored
    says:

    See they are only expected to get 7 seats at the election.

    It would be nice if nicola was back in charge to take the fall out.

    Whats the chances humza resigns for personal reasons and nicky comes back with a clean bill if health from the police.

    Ha ha they are so clearly goosed

  32. Merganser
    Ignored
    says:

    Shug @ 9.12 says “What’s the chances….”

    Very likely I’d say.

  33. Tinto Chiel
    Ignored
    says:

    @Robert Hughes 8.35: “immaculate coiffeur, empty mind, vicious character”.

    Yes…

    Is it Mrs Murrell or Justin Trudeau?

    Or Ursula von der Leyen?

    Or Keir Stumer (Scottish version)?

    Spooky, innit?

    To think that the latter was a Human Rights lawyer and DPP, yet he is apparently supporting the collective punishment of the Palestinian people, a war crime since 1945.

    The Collective West is sick if these politicians are representative of it.

    And not a word in protest from any MP or MSP, as far as I’m aware of.

    Those Chinese and their bloody “interesting times”, eh?

  34. sarah
    Ignored
    says:

    Craig Murray arrest is reported by Mark Hirst – been questioned about his attendance at the pro-Palestine demo at the Icelandic Parliament. His phone and electronics taken by police.

    Unbelievable.

  35. Robert Hughes
    Ignored
    says:

    Tinto

    ” Is it Mrs Murrell or Justin Trudeau?

    Or Ursula von der Leyen?

    Or Keir Stumer (Scottish version)? ”

    Perfect examples of the syndrome .

    Tune in the morra for more insights into the Psychopathology of Barnets .

    ” Stumer ” – Lol , no heard that word in a while . He’s got a middle name too ..ie Keir Glaikit Stumer . He wears it well .

  36. David Hannah
    Ignored
    says:

    A pretend ISIS shooting in Brussells.

    Fluorescent orange jacket to blind you from the weapon. And obviously the camera man knew to film before the shots fired. Then you see the officers walking around with their hands in their pockets.

    We know the EU is hell bent on drinking Palestinian blood. I’m so glad we’ve left.

  37. stonefree
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Shug at 9:12 pm
    That might be a possible,

    Something like Humza being inappropriate with money plus missus trouble, gets a governorship in the east and Sturgeon discovers £690k

    Still nearing the panto season

  38. David Hannah
    Ignored
    says:

    The West is going to destroy itself over it’s backing of Israel. Normal people can’t stomach violence.

    Joe Biden not right in the head. Urseloa Von Der Lynn. She’s the pretty face of the deep state. Married to CEO of Pfizer. And the EU cancelling the humantianian funding to Gaza £728 million – how dare they? And now they want Iron dome missiles. Coming to an EU country near you. And you’re paying for it Ireland.

    This is clearly a pretend attack to distract us from the Israeli massacre and the 100,000 soliders.

    Glasgow has a Muslim population not a Jewish population. My heart is with the Palestinians. Stop the war.

  39. David Hannah
    Ignored
    says:

    Craig Murray arrest what a disgrace. Hero of a man. I voted for him for Alba Ordinary Member. He’s more than ordinary he’s extraordinary.

  40. Tinto Chiel
    Ignored
    says:

    @Robert H. @10.28: glad you appreciated “stumer”, a fine Scots expression beloved of My Dear Old Dad (and sometimes deployed against me): surely no connection with Der Stürmer?

    In these days it’s increasingly hard to tell, innit?

    Och well, up the wooden hill to Bedfordshire, as they used to say ablaw the dyke.

    Pax vobiscum.

  41. Bernard de Linton
    Ignored
    says:

    David Hannah + Billy Carlin, separated at birth,Davina Mc Coll and Nicky Campbell,will call tomorrow.

  42. holymacmoses
    Ignored
    says:

    I think the fault lies with Nicola Sturgeon

  43. A Scot Abroad
    Ignored
    says:

    If Craig Murray has been arrested over attending a pro-Palestine demo in Iceland, it will have been at the request of Iceland, and under suspicion of breaking Icelandic laws. I can’t see that’s in any way unreasonable.

  44. Joe
    Ignored
    says:

    Is The National owned by Unionists. It reads like it’s taking the pish.

    I wish people would stop referring to Scotland as a colony. I’m proud of our history. I like the simplistic legends of Wallace and Bruce, and the notion that we fought and won our independence.

    The Acts of Union paved the way for us to become colonisers. Look at the street names in Glasgow. I hear that people want the names changed or plaques erected to explain our history as colonisers, in the biggest empire the world has ever seen.

  45. Red
    Ignored
    says:

    stonefree says:
    16 October, 2023 at 10:46 pm
    @ Shug at 9:12 pm
    That might be a possible,

    Something like Humza being inappropriate with money plus missus trouble, gets a governorship in the east and Sturgeon discovers £690k

    Still nearing the panto season

    Humza wants us to think he’s a cool wee guy like Aladdin, but he’s Jafar’s thicko cousin.

  46. Elmac
    Ignored
    says:

    This post does not add to the discourse. I confess it is born of disappointment and disgust at what has happened since 2014. Nicola Surgeon and her acolytes are an enemy of the would be Scottish State. That much bec

  47. Oneliner
    Ignored
    says:

    Back in the day when we thought that there might be some hope for The National, they published the McCrone report verbatim.

    Despicable they may be, but in that respect, they are better than the Conningservatives and Lying Labour

  48. Johnlm
    Ignored
    says:

    Kit Klarenberg, Vanessa Beeley, Freddie Ponton.
    Now Craig Murray.
    The English don’t like the uncensored media.

  49. Elmac
    Ignored
    says:

    Apologies for my earlier aborted effort. Must get a new tablet.
    This post is off topic and born of utter frustration. The National in the early days was a beacon of hope for an under represented national leaning public. It gradually morphed into an SNP mouthpiece at the same time as the SNP were divesting themselves of any drive towards independence. SNP funding of the press was obviously a major factor, something that should not be allowed in any decent democratic society. In short they were subverted along with the SNP and now are not worth the regurgitated trees they are written on. Perhaps the Green Party could take issue with that.
    We have no current alternative but the National must die. It is an affront to what we all aspired to in the early fays of its creation. Don’t buy it! The wrong people benefit from every penny that you pay.

  50. A Scot Abroad
    Ignored
    says:

    David Hannah,

    two Swedes were killed, gunned down, in Brussels last evening, with a third seriously wounded. The gunman has not yet been found.

    And somehow, you think that you’ve worked it all out and it’s a MSM/western plot?

    I think you might need to give your head a wobble. You’ve disappeared far too far down the looney rabbit hole.

  51. Cynicus
    Ignored
    says:

    A Scot Abroad says:
    16 October, 2023 at 11:35 pm
    If Craig Murray has been arrested over attending a pro-Palestine demo in Iceland, it will have been at the request of Iceland, and under suspicion of breaking Icelandic laws. I can’t see that’s in any way unreasonable.
    ==========
    That is mindless speculation.

    I suggest you check out Mark Hirst’s tweets on X.

  52. Mark Beggan
    Ignored
    says:

    In the land of the blind, the one-eyed woman is still king.

  53. twathater
    Ignored
    says:

    How can people possibly excuse the membership in this catalogue of lies and liars , FFS Stuart Campbell has produced unremitting proof time after time in his journalism YET the membership STILL refused to accept the evidence of sturgeon’s betrayal and continued to vote for her and her deviants
    The snp membership granted that trai tor and her vichy government with a messiah adulation allowing her and her cabal of freaks and nonentities to capture their party and disembowel the very sane constitution of the party with not even a whimper
    If anyone DARED to question the messiah or her secret plan the sycophants instituted a pile on , even to this day, and for her to turn up at the assembly and be given a standing ovation after the destruction she has caused in Scotland with her GROSS INCOMPETENCE is an insult to REAL independence supporters

  54. robertkknight
    Ignored
    says:

    Twathater…

    Anyone serious about Indy has left the SNP, and those who remain are not so.

  55. Debatable Lands
    Ignored
    says:

    All this SNP blaming.

    The SNP is just a product of an emotional but not very well thought through independence movement and Scottish political culture in general. The nuSNP or something like it is inevitable. Independence will not sweep Scottish politics clean and deliver a wise government of all the talents.

    Devolution and the Scottish government holds a mirror up to the country and people just don’t like everything they see reflected in it. The ‘Smaller, smarter, more enlightened’ hope hasn’t survived the grubby reality of petty minded wannabes who are rich in bias over some hobby horse issue, but short of brains .

    So get used to it. What you see in Holyrood now won’t change with independence. Except there will be more money in it for the grifters and commercial concerns that jump on another small state whose politicians are easily steered.

  56. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Debatable Lands says:
    17 October, 2023 at 8:12 am

    All this SNP blaming.

    Hiya!

    Another wee post that made me smile. 🙂

    Hey did you see

    India’s supreme court declines to legally recognise same-sex marriage

    https://archive.ph/7Kzdb

  57. stuart mctavish
    Ignored
    says:

    Asa @11.35 pm

    If so, a better test of reasonableness will be the why how amd when behind the change from “ha, ha, swivel, lol” in 2008 to an arbitrary “3 bags full enough?” now.

  58. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Cynicus says:
    17 October, 2023 at 1:42 am

    A Scot Abroad says:
    16 October, 2023 at 11:35 pm
    If Craig Murray has been arrested over attending a pro-Palestine demo in Iceland, it will have been at the request of Iceland, and under suspicion of breaking Icelandic laws. I can’t see that’s in any way unreasonable.
    ==========
    That is mindless speculation.

    I suggest you check out Mark Hirst’s tweets on X.

    Mornin’ Cynicus
    What did you expect from ‘Lord Naw Naw’ the flame-baiting trouble maker from Norfolk Broads?

    He just makes shit up to wind people up!

    You have been hooked but still you are good with the euphemisms & posh words.

    Mindless speculation sounds great but I still prefer makes shit up.

  59. Johnlm
    Ignored
    says:

    NuSNP is a by-product of social experiments run throughout western societies.

    The plan is initially to destroy the credibility of progressive politics and create an acceptance of a totalitarian future.

    Hopefully we will look back on this one day and laugh.

  60. Debatable Lands
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruby says @ 8.32 am

    ‘Another wee post that made me smile. ?’

    I’m happy to start someone’s day with smile.

    In fairness I should add that I’m not singling out Scots politics, just noting that it is exactly the same depressing sh*t show that exists in NI, England and Wales.

  61. Debatable Lands
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruby says @ 8.32 am

    ‘Another wee post that made me smile. ?’

    I’m happy to start someone’s day with smile.

    In fairness I should add that I’m not singling out Scots politics, just noting that it is exactly the same depressing sh*t show that exists in NI, England and Wales.

  62. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    The collage that Stu has created for this article is a work of art it merits a grant from The Scottish Arts Council or whatever it’s called these days.

    Only kiddin’ there’s not a chance of that but I do think it would look good framed and taking up an entire wall of thon big gallery in Royal Exchange Square.

    It is one very powerful political statement.

  63. Shug
    Ignored
    says:

    Is it true craig murray has been arrested for going to the Iceland gaza protest

  64. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    I was wondering about the history of Royal Exchange Square but it turned out to be quite involved so I’ll just post the link in case anyone might be interested.

    https://www.theglasgowstory.com/image/?inum=TGSA01116

    Royal Exchange Square where the Gallery of Modern Art (GoMA) is situated and where Stu’s photo collage/joiner should be hung.

    How about a wee contest to see who could come up with the best title for Stu’s work of Art?

  65. Red
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruby says:
    17 October, 2023 at 9:06 am
    The collage that Stu has created for this article is a work of art it merits a grant from The Scottish Arts Council or whatever it’s called these days.

    Not sure Stuart qualifies for Scottish Government funding, Ruby.

    For one thing, he’s Scottish. Not something the Scottish Government wants to encourage.

    For another thing, everybody in the current Scottish Government reads Smash Hits instead of Amiga Power. They don’t even have the 512 Kilobyte memory expansion you need to play Cannon Fodder 2.

  66. Hobbit
    Ignored
    says:

    There’s a series on the Beeb atm about the Union, where the presenter (David Olusoga) makes the point that the support for the Union in Scotland has always been strongest amongst the elites. So, in 1707, they supported it because it saved their collective financial bacon in the aftermath of Darien. In the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries they supported it because they did well out of it as the British empire did well, and this would have continued well into the 20th century.

    To bring this up to the present day: the Tories support the Union for obvious reasons – and note that the vote for the Union amongst the middle class(es) in 2016 was a lot higher than in Scotland’s poorer areas. But this principle can also be seen in recent SNP activity?

    How well Scotland would do if it were independent is still a good question, but we may reasonably suppose that various of the elites, and not only the Tory one, would not do (as) well if it were independent?

  67. Hobbit
    Ignored
    says:

    There’s a series on the Beeb atm about the Union, where the presenter (David Olusoga) makes the point that the support for the Union in Scotland has always been strongest amongst the elites. So, in 1707, they supported it because it saved their collective financial bacon in the aftermath of Darien. In the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries they supported it because they did well out of it as the British empire did well, and this would have continued well into the 20th century.

    To bring this up to the present day: the Tories support the Union for obvious reasons – and note that the vote for the Union amongst the middle class(es) in 2016 was a lot higher than in Scotland’s poorer areas. But this principle can also be seen in recent SNP activity, I suspect.

    How well Scotland would do if it were independent is still a good question, but we may reasonably suppose that various of the elites, and not only the Tory one, would not do (as) well if it were independent?

  68. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Aye Craig Murray!

    What can I say

    ‘Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned’

    I am trying to get over it but I’m not a Saint I’m not even a gem.

    But hey everyone else loves Craig so he should be fine and get tons & tons of well wishes.

  69. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Red says:
    17 October, 2023 at 9:27 am

    Not sure Stuart qualifies for Scottish Government funding, Ruby.

    For one thing, he’s Scottish. Not something the Scottish Government wants to encourage.

    You mean indigenous Scottish, First Scottish, Native Scottish?

    Still we can fund his exhibition.
    Have you got a title for it yet?

    BTY if you know how to do bold then you can do blockquotes

    All you do is replace the b with blockquote

    I do like the blockquote it’s very stylish and it helps one to know who is say what to whom.

    Gotta go now! So sad! 🙁

    I’ll be back later to see titles & ‘blockquote’ all over the place

    Cheerio!

  70. Alf Baird
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruby @ 9:06 am

    “The collage that Stu has created for this article is a work of art”

    Yes, the Rev’s collage is as much a part of our growing anti-colonial literature as poetry, drama, comedy, blog articles or for that matter, textbooks containing applied theoretical frameworks that help aid the understanding of the people:
    https://salvo-cor.s3.eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/THEORETICAL+CASE+FOR+SCOTTISH+INDEPENDENCE.pdf

    As Frantz Fanon wrote, in regard to the ‘objective of nationalist parties’ such as the SNP during the period of decolonization:

    “They mobilize the people with slogans of independence, and for the rest leave it to future events. When such parties are questioned on the economic programme of the state that they are clamouring for, or on the nature of the regime which they propose to install, they are incapable of replying, because, precisely, they are completely ignorant of the economy of their own country. This economy has always developed outside the limits of their knowledge.”

  71. Breastplate
    Ignored
    says:

    Craig Murray has been a thorn in the side of the Westminster Government for a long time now and they will look for any reason to shut him up.
    It’s a purely political exercise.

    Disgraceful but unsurprising in the current climate.

  72. Red
    Ignored
    says:

    Hiya Ruby

    Ruby says:
    17 October, 2023 at 9:53 am
    Red says:
    17 October, 2023 at 9:27 am

    Not sure Stuart qualifies for Scottish Government funding, Ruby.

    For one thing, he’s Scottish. Not something the Scottish Government wants to encourage.

    You mean indigenous Scottish, First Scottish, Native Scottish?

    All that good stuff, aye.

    Still we can fund his exhibition.
    Have you got a title for it yet?

    I was thinking it should be named in honour of the popular and successful game Rise of the Robots.

    BTY if you know how to do bold then you can do blockquotes

    That’s suspiciously like my wife’s logic. “If ye’re sober enough to do this, ye’re sober enough to do that”. But as ye can see, Ruby, I urnae.

  73. Red
    Ignored
    says:

    Allegedly, this is the tweet that got Craig Murray into trouble:

    Craig Murray –
    @CraigMurrayOrg
    ·
    Follow
    To be entirely plain.
    I have always viscerally opposed war. I have dedicated my life to conflict resolution and reconciliation.
    But in the coming Gaza genocide, every act of armed resistance by Hamas and Hezbollah will have my support.
    If that is a crime, send me back to jail.

    Remember that the new Hate Act and the Tories’ Online Harms Bill make expressing virtually any contentious political opinion a criminal offence if the authorities want it to be. We don’t have more freedom of speech than Russia does.

  74. Ian McCubbin
    Ignored
    says:

    Just proves more and more we need to get behind Alba and get folk to stand for councils and Holyrood then declare when we have a majority.
    Nu SNP now like old and new Labour devolution party with troughers and self servers only.

  75. George Ferguson
    Ignored
    says:

    @Breastplate 10:21pm
    I have agreed with Craig in the past on some issues. His imprisonment as a consequence of his comments on the Salmond trial being an example. He has been arrested under the Prevention of Terrorism Act because of his unreserved support for Hamas and Hezbollah and any of their subsequent actions. His tweets are at best ill advised.

  76. Frank Gillougley
    Ignored
    says:

    ‘Whats the ploblim?’

    Redouble all our efforts, knock on every door, leave no NO voter unturned, strain every sinew, hold, hold – give us a mandate, vote for US and WE will give YOU what you want, just one more shove, it’s just around the corner and so on and so on ad fuckingnauseum.

    Cretins all.

  77. Frank Gillougley
    Ignored
    says:

    – correction, should have made that, cretinous prefects and toilet monitors all.

  78. Sven
    Ignored
    says:

    Just two more days now to the Referendum Ms Sturgeon promised last June, and I’m gett a wee shade concerned that my polling card hasn’t yet arrived.
    I was kinda hoping that she may have mentioned it at her latest photo opportunity at the SNP Conference, however I must have missed it.
    Still, it was a Nicola promise, so I know I can put my faith in it coming to pass. Anytime I have doubts I just look at her past record of success.

  79. David Hannah
    Ignored
    says:

    100 per cent a false flag operation. A hoax attack to distract from the Israeli massacre in the name of zionism.

    Why would the alleged ISIS terrorist wear a fluorescent orange jacket to make him stand out from the crowd?

    Why would the camera man know to film him before the shots were fired?

    Why did the police officers look very relaxed in the videos of them stepping over the police tape? No panic. No guns either none of them had guns.

    Why were two Swedish fans killed when they most likely would have been in the stadium?

    At the home of the EU in Brussells. And we know the EU is feeling the heat. It desperately wants to drink the blood of Palestinians. Desperately. Ursela Von Der Lynn.

    We know she diverts peace funds 500 million euros from the EU to zelensky.

    We know there’s been international condemnation of her desire to cancel £728 million in funding to Gaza.

    We know the EU are saying they want a Iron done system now Europe. With the Israeli flag on display.

    A hoax attack. The terrorist shot dead. Body never to be seen again.

    Meanwhile millions of Muslims are being ethnically cleansed in an open air concentration camp.

  80. Republicofscotland
    Ignored
    says:

    I wouldn’t be at all surprised by if this were the case.

    “Been hearing a number of people travelling back from the low-key #snpconference have cancelled their membership. Conference is meant to lift spirits not depress members. It had to end somehow?”

    https://nitter.net/DavidDhenry/status/1714204215621394930#m

    Meanwhile more missing money.

    “SNP government has taken little if any notice of the slothful rebuild of the world famous Mackintosh School of Art since ScotGov’s commitee of inquiry failed to identify the guilty who set it on fire, twice, or how an initial £8 million insurance money vanished.”

    https://nitter.net/Grouse_Beater/status/1714061433535656118#m

  81. Breastplate
    Ignored
    says:

    George Ferguson,

    Craig Murray’s support was not unreserved, it was caveated in terms of stopping a war crime.
    Surely there’s an obligation by anyone and everyone to resist war crimes?

    What seems to be the problem is the misinterpretation, either willingly or ignorantly, of his words.

    Should war crimes be resisted no matter which side perpetrates them?
    It is a simple yes/no answer.

    I believe that’s Craig Murray’s point.

  82. Cynicus
    Ignored
    says:

    Shug says:
    17 October, 2023 at 9:22 am

    “Is it true craig murray has been arrested for going to the Iceland gaza protest”
    ===========
    Not claimed by Craig or admitted by the spooks who detained him.

    https://thegrayzone.com/2023/10/17/assange-craig-murray-detained-uk-terror/

  83. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    “Save the Date” (October 19th)

    I really liked that headline.

    Wow, I just realised we are now less than 48 hours away. It’s so exciting. Imagine, we will be free in a couple of days, you’ll see. Humza won’t let us down – Nicola’s got his back. So exciting. I canna wait.

  84. Mac
    Ignored
    says:

    Looking at Craig Murray’s tweets I cannot see anything that looks like it would get you arrested. We are living through some crazy times.

    Seeing this play out I can’t help but feel that this super heavy handed response must have been anticipated by Ham@s and planned for… and so far Isr@el is very much acting as they would have expected. I get the feeling the US & Isr@el are walking into something here, like a trap of some kind.

  85. Merganser
    Ignored
    says:

    The series of “Mummy” films were either scary or laughabe.

    Scotland is about to produce its own version:

    “Return of the Mammy”

    Which will be both.

  86. sam
    Ignored
    says:

    The link below goes to a report some months ago by Glasgow Centre of Population Health.

    GCPH has produced a short animation which I wish and hope you might look at and forward on to as many as possible.

    Include, please, SNP members and people of all parties. This should be seen.

    https://www.gcph.co.uk/latest/news/1037_changing_life_expectancy_new_animation_and_report_launched

  87. Johnlm
    Ignored
    says:

    Be careful what form of words you use.

    I find that starting with the phrase
    “Speaking as a child of h0l0caust survivors …..”
    allows me to get away with anything.

  88. George Ferguson
    Ignored
    says:

    @Breastplate 11:17pm
    Let’s break down his tweet. “But in the coming Gaza Genocide” (This presently is an assumption but could happen if Foreign and diplomatic efforts fails). “every act of armed resistance by Hamas and Hezbollah will have my support”. Inflammatory language and surprising from a former diplomat. I wouldn’t regard his statement as caveated. Every act? On the streets of Europe for example.? I said last week the Israelis were making a strategic mistake without allowing a humanarian corridor in Gaza. And also Scotland should have an even hand in this conflict. The First Minister has managed to do that. Craig’s stance could be prosecutable. I do not support it.

  89. Red
    Ignored
    says:

    Hamas is a proscribed terrorist group under the Terrorism Act 2000.

    Worth bearing in mind when discussing the activities of Hamas on the internet.

  90. Anton Decadent
    Ignored
    says:

    Whilst looking up which media outlets Sam Bankman Fried had made donations to, the same as George Soros and Bill Gates have injected cash into the likes of The Guardian, I found that he had also made a donation to at least one charity in the UK. On looking it up I found connections to an identikit of charities the same as some of the ones which are operating here in Scotland with a staff made up of Gods chosen people and other minority groups who are fighting “whiteness”. To see any kind of a pattern in this would be absurd.

  91. James Che
    Ignored
    says:

    The Scottish parliament extinguished itself by agreeing to the treaty of union, UK parliament 2023 site.

    It was debated on wether to give the Scots a vote to join the treaty of union by the commissioners and politicians in 1706/1707,
    It was decided not to give the Scots a vote to join the union as they would probably vote against joining. UK parliament site 2023.

    Queen Anne by Proclamation in Westminster parliament dissolved the Scottish parliament on April 1707, see national library of Scotland.

    SO WHERE IS THE 1707 SCOTTISH PARLIAMENT IN A PARLIAMENTARY UNION WITH THE PARLIAMENT OF ENGLAND.
    DISSOLVE, EXTINGUISHED.

    SO WHERE ARE THE “SCOTS” IN THE TREATY OF UNION if they WERE NOT ASKED TO JOIN IN THE TREATY OF UNION.

    Finding it it difficult to connect Scotland to England, or the Scots in a union,

    Me too.

  92. desimond
    Ignored
    says:

    @Ruby
    re : How about a wee contest to see who could come up with the best title for Stu’s work of Art?

    I suggest “Somewhere over the rainbow”

  93. Dorothy Devine
    Ignored
    says:

    How about ‘ Betrayal annihilates trust”

  94. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    @Desimond,

    “Time to let go ?”.

  95. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    After a film.

    ” Con (hot) Air”

  96. johnlm
    Ignored
    says:

    “what has a hazelnut in every bite?”

  97. Breastplate
    Ignored
    says:

    George Ferguson,
    It is quite clearly caveated on the coming genocide already in the midst of a present war crime, a war crime that has been recognised by the international community en masse.

  98. George Ferguson
    Ignored
    says:

    @Breastplate 1:21pm
    As helpfully pointed by Red. The act in question constrains what people can say about the activities of proscribed organisations. We obviously can’t agreed on the clarity of Craig’s stance so I am going to leave it there.

  99. Breastplate
    Ignored
    says:

    George Ferguson,
    I agree with you and Red on this discussion of this matter, that in itself speaks volumes.

    We can agree to disagree on the clarity of what Craig Murray says but I hope we can agree that 2 wrongs don’t make a right.

  100. Alf Baird
    Ignored
    says:

    James Che @ 12:41 pm

    “WHERE ARE THE “SCOTS” IN THE TREATY OF UNION”

    The ‘union’ is clearly a political deceit, a ‘confidence trick’ according to Peter Bell, and what postcolonial theorists might consider part of a well-established ‘colonial hoax’. I’m not sure you can ‘end’ a hoax, but you can better understand (via ‘smeddum’/common sense, knowledge) the nature of the lie and deceit involved; which is pathological, especially in relation to the colonizer/colonialist (‘mindset’), or whom we might broadly term ‘unionists’, which of course includes a complicit national party elite co-opted to manage a colonial administration:

    https://www.mentalhelp.net/blogs/dealing-with-liars/

  101. sam
    Ignored
    says:

    From GCPH. There is an animation link to more recent research upthread. Please watch it.

    “The political causes of poor health and inequalities are well understood. What’s happened in Glasgow is one particular ‘case study’ of a much wider phenomenon. Indeed, in the last decade we have witnessed political effects on health across all parts of the UK: increasing death rates among the more deprived populations of England, Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales. These have been attributed in large part to UK Government ‘austerity’ cuts that have had a calamitous impact on the poorest and most vulnerable people in our society. In a country as wealthy as the UK, this is nothing short of a scandal.

    However, these changes to mortality rates in different parts of the UK have not led to media headlines about an ‘England effect’ or a ‘Wales effect’. Nor have we seen similar headlines about Leeds, Birmingham, Manchester or Liverpool ‘effects’ – all cities with communities where life expectancy has decreased in the last decade. Yet the ‘Glasgow effect’ headline persists.”

  102. Captain Yossarian
    Ignored
    says:

    One man who understands the vagaries of easy wars which you seem guaranteed to win is Vladimir-P. He has suggested a cease-fire. Given that we are now at the pivot-point and one more day’s hostilities will take us to the point where hospitals will start shutting-down, this type of quiet diplomacy is probably the way to go?

  103. Xaracen
    Ignored
    says:

    James Che said;

    “The Scottish parliament extinguished itself by agreeing to the treaty of union, UK parliament 2023 site.

    It was decided not to give the Scots a vote to join the union as they would probably vote against joining. UK parliament site 2023.

    SO WHERE IS THE 1707 SCOTTISH PARLIAMENT IN A PARLIAMENTARY UNION WITH THE PARLIAMENT OF ENGLAND.

    SO WHERE ARE THE “SCOTS” IN THE TREATY OF UNION if they WERE NOT ASKED TO JOIN IN THE TREATY OF UNION.”

    James, you’re looking in the wrong place for the wrong things. But first, some bits you didn’t mention;

    1 The English weren’t allowed to vote to join the Union or its Treaty either, so your point is moot.

    2 The English Parliament also extinguished itself, but did so in a different manner, by renaming itself as the new Parliament of Great Britain. Doing so formally acknowledged the end of its old role, and the start of its new role as the shared parliament of the Union. As long as it behaved itself in line with the terms of the Treaty, that was just fine. So again your point is moot.

    3 Its new role meant taking in the MPs of the old Scottish Parliament, and they turned up specifically to represent the Kingdom of Scotland in the new shared parliament, to take their part along with England’s MPs in the joint governance of both realms.

    It is having the two sets of MPs contending in the same parliamentary debating chamber that is what is meant by the Parliamentary Union!

    There’s your ‘missing’ Scottish Parliament in the Union. And the Scots are in the Union because their government is in the Union, so we’ve found them, too.

    Of course, the new parliament didn’t behave itself in line with the terms of the Treaty. Its most egregious failure by far was England’s establishment refusing to accept their new Scottish colleagues as having equal authority with England’s MPs in the new Union’s parliament.

    That equality comes directly from the sovereignty of the Scottish Kingdom they represent, which ranks exactly equal to the sovereignty of the English Kingdom that England’s MPs represent. The ranks have nothing whatsoever to do with the sizes of the two populations, nor the resulting huge numeric difference in their respective MP numbers. But the English establishment always intended to dominate the Union, so they pretend that England’s huge numeric advantage in MPs is a legitimate basis for England’s authority outranking Scotland’s in the Union, via the crudest form of democracy, but that is just a bare-faced, self-serving English establishment lie.

  104. Stuart MacKay
    Ignored
    says:

    From Holyrood Magazine…

    “Pete Wishart calls on Scottish Government to publish A9 dualling timetable”

    Who are you and what have you done with Comfy Slippers?

    Before you start to worry that reality is invading the SNP, we have Exhibit A, Emma Roddick…

    Scottish Government minister and Highlands MSP Emma Roddick said there was “real pain” being caused because of a “perception” the government was breaking a promise.

    So all’s well in the world and the natural order of things is unchanged.

    Now if we’ll all perceive the A9 to be upgraded then the problem will be solved.

  105. John
    Ignored
    says:

    50 crates taught us democracy is an old confidence trick . It’s why Thatcher admired the Greco- Roman methods of control ( she was played excellently in the Jimmy Saville drama imo)
    Their control is dependent on matters they are losing in charge of. Information.
    They are unable to adapt. That’s why the Abrahamics corruption of religious leaders were paraded today United in deception.
    This despite the recent consensus confirmation that the FUCKING MAJORITY of the uk population do not associate themselves with these deceitful corruptions of what were perhaps once something positive.

    Looking at the figures.
    In Scotland the parcel of rogues would fit in Feegie dome in Paisley with their porters fitting into Ibrox up the road.
    The multiple more in England would need Wembley to accommodate with their loyal needing all the London Premier League stadia to house them

  106. Stravaiger
    Ignored
    says:

    @johnlm 1:21pm

    “Squirrel shit!”

  107. Ebenezer Scroggie
    Ignored
    says:

    They slap the label of “terrorist” on Hamas to stop people from thinking.

    Most people in the West see Hamas as a bunch of gun-toting thugs. Actually most of Hamas is involved in providing social security and health and water and sanitation and everything that a County Council or Local Authority does in the UK plus a whole lot more.

    To brand such an organisation as “terrorist” is daft.

  108. Cynicus
    Ignored
    says:

    There is some discussion above on alleged support for proscribed bodies in a Craig Murray tweet.

    Because Craig’s endorsements are contingent on a (continuing?) genocide, a prosecution under the 2000 Act is unlikely to succeed.

  109. Dorothy Devine
    Ignored
    says:

    Ebenezer Scroggie , you are so right – the west and its media always point the finger away from themselves. Now we have suggestions of ‘others’ behind them and we have heard the beginnings of the’othering’of Iran and Syria.

    It amazes me how we blithely ignore our past crimes against humanity from one end of the globe to the other.

  110. Red
    Ignored
    says:

    Ebenezer Scroggie says:
    17 October, 2023 at 3:37 pm
    They slap the label of “terrorist” on Hamas to stop people from thinking.

    Most people in the West see Hamas as a bunch of gun-toting thugs. Actually most of Hamas is involved in providing social security and health and water and sanitation and everything that a County Council or Local Authority does in the UK plus a whole lot more.

    “Hamas are paragliding social workers”

    Hot take.

  111. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    Stuart MacKay says:
    17 October, 2023 at 3:11 pm

    Now if we’ll all perceive the A9 to be upgraded then the problem will be solved.

    I’m convinced that the A9 would have been fully dualled by now had Team Salmond still been in charged. Heck, even the A96 would have been half-done by now.

    Having a competent Scottish government makes a big difference. With the clueless, seat-warming dopes in charge today? Not a chance. Even the A9 will never be fully dualled.

  112. Luigi
    Ignored
    says:

    Stuart MacKay says:
    17 October, 2023 at 3:11 pm

    Now if we’ll all perceive the A9 to be upgraded then the problem will be solved.

    I’m convinced that the A9 would have been fully dualled by now, had Team Salmond still been in charge. Heck, even the A96 would have been half-done by now.

    Having a competent Scottish government makes a big difference. With the clueless, seat-warming dopes in charge today? Not a chance. Even the A9 will never be fully dualled.

  113. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    A world of difference supporting the Palestinians and supporting Hamas.

  114. A Scot Abroad
    Ignored
    says:

    Ebenezer Scroggie at 3:37pm,

    It’s pretty fatuous to compare Hamas with a county council. Yes, they have a political and a charitable wing of the organisation (which if you delve into it, largely rules for their associates and uses international aid money and food to reward or punish sections of Gaza’s society), but they haven’t had an election since 2007, forced their coalition partners out at gunpoint, and regularly fire off salvos of missiles at their neighbours. Your comparison fails because Aberdeenshire Council don’t attack the rest of the country, nor did they send 2,000 people into Angus 10 days ago to kill 1,300 (often bestially), nor shoot up a music festival, capture 150 people and take them back over the boundary to hold them as hostages.

  115. Bob Mack
    Ignored
    says:

    If you are in any doubt, please read the Hamas Charter. It is very clear and exact.It is their sworn aims. No negotiation, no differential between men or women or babies if Israeli.

    They enacted it just last week.

    Check it.

  116. Gordon
    Ignored
    says:

    johnlm @ 1.21pm

    to the tune of the topic advert:

    what has a hazelnut in every bite?…squirrel shite!

  117. Oneliner
    Ignored
    says:

    Re the SNP Conference.

    Normally they put the trash out after it has finished – they don’t let it in while it is still in progress.

  118. Derek
    Ignored
    says:

    SNP spokesman on the PM programme just now; if you’d been playing SNP catchphrase bingo you’d’ve scored well.

  119. George Ferguson
    Ignored
    says:

    Humzas first SNP Conference as leader. Started really well with his International perspective. I am not going to be churlish by commenting on his domestic policies. He picked up the poisoned chalice when others were happy to leave it. Let him enjoy his day in the sun.

  120. Stuart MacKay
    Ignored
    says:

    I thoroughly recommend Holyrood Magazine. It beats The National as the gift that keeps on giving. Take this gem of writing:

    Humza Yousaf tells SNP conference Scotland ready to rehome refugees from Gaza

    First Minister Humza Yousaf has called for a UK-wide refugee resettlement scheme for those affected by the conflict in Gaza.

    At least the Israelis just want ethnically cleanse, oops, I means “rehome” them to Sinai, not thousands of miles away from everything they now where the chance of return is zero.

  121. Dan
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Derek

    Ach, words have lost all meaning these days so word bingo is a compromised game anyway. You’re well aware politicians and legal types tie themselves in knots and struggle to use the dictionary definition of woman.
    And with the hate crime bill coming into play I ponder if hearing impaired vegan lentil munchers will soon target famous Scot, namely Calvin Harris for his lyrics:

    You used the whole meat…
    You used the whole meat…
    You used the whole meat…
    Beef beef dinner

    You used the whole meat…
    You used the whole meat…
    You used the whole meat…
    Beef beef dinner

    The fact he was driving a muckle Peterbuilt monster truck in the vid for the song no doubt a perceived escalating hate multiplier in the minds of the “planet saving”* green loonies…

    * Not necessarily truly planet saving as fucktards that tend to use the term often appear to not have a clue about the laws of physics and conservation of energy principle.

  122. Livionian
    Ignored
    says:

    The ability of the free Palestine lot to hijack threads that have absolutely nothing to do with a small corner of the middle east never ceases to amaze.

    This is a site about Scottish politics in case that isn’t clear.

  123. ronald anderson@gmail.com
    Ignored
    says:

    We have more national embarrassments every time Humsa Useless opens his gub ( Scotland will be the 1st place to offer to give the people of Gaza a home ) . Bastard cant build enough homes for the people already here.

    Roll on the next election so we can rid ourselves of these clowns .

  124. Red
    Ignored
    says:

    So guys, are you excited about Humza offering up Scotland to be the new home of Palestinian refugees?

    Going to be great isn’t it.

  125. Neil Singleton
    Ignored
    says:

    Enenezer Scroggie – So Hamas is equivalent to a benign local authority, and to regard them as terrorists “is daft”. It’s you who is daft for not knowing the the formal constitution of Hamas calls for “EVERY JEW ON THE PLANET TO BE KILLED.” Your naïveté knows know bounds.

  126. Dan
    Ignored
    says:

    Aah, but all these refugees will no doubt be classed as low income and therefore stuck in properties owned by wealthy landlords so the properties will become eligible for taxpayer funded air sourced heatpumps and solar installations. Kerching! And Scottish “government” virtue signalers will claim more Geta T orgasm points.

    Talking of greenwashing pish… Classic today watching neighbour’s roof with the recently installed north facing solar PV array. Even on a bright day the panels remained in shade through all the daylight hours.
    You could just about power a micro hydropower scheme if you collected all the yellow liquid from me pissing myself laughing.
    Currently cooking the last of the autumn raspberry jam on the woodburner, fueled with the old untreated larch from my the neighbour’s fence which they replaced with some crap softwood which will last a few years before it rots out.

  127. Red
    Ignored
    says:

    Stuart MacKay says:
    17 October, 2023 at 6:27 pm
    I thoroughly recommend Holyrood Magazine. It beats The National as the gift that keeps on giving. Take this gem of writing:

    Humza Yousaf tells SNP conference Scotland ready to rehome refugees from Gaza

    Nice of Humza to write his own Balfour Declaration on behalf of my country. His generosity with Scottish people’s money, land and physical safety never fails to impress.

    Ur we independent yet?

  128. Michael Laing
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Livionian at 6:45 pm:

    “The ability of the free Palestine lot to hijack threads that have absolutely nothing to do with a small corner of the middle east never ceases to amaze.

    This is a site about Scottish politics in case that isn’t clear.”

    Ja wohl, mein Fuhrer!

    And who are you to dictate what people can and can’t discuss on here? Are Scots not allowed to have an opinion on world events?

  129. John
    Ignored
    says:

    So many telling us that so many wish to kill every Jewish person. They are hearing things I neither hear or experienced until last weekend.
    The Hamas attack and murder of over a thousand civilians last was eye opening shocking.
    I have become accustomed to the daily murder of Palestinian civilians with no concerns of western governments, media and such.
    Obviously since the massacre, murder , slaughter of the Jewish victims a greater number of Palestinian Children have died. Not murdered, slaughterhouse dispatched. It’s what they do .
    *civilians is pushing it as every adult Israeli is a reservist of the IDF except their master Uber orthodox ones. Conveniently it’s actual human that decides the current wishes of the sky fairy

  130. Captain Yossarian
    Ignored
    says:

    Dan – Half a dozen houses down my way are built from cedar tiles. The same tiles are on the walls that are on the roof. These houses were built in 1965 and one or two of the roofs are just being replaced now. Walls are still OK.

  131. Effijy
    Ignored
    says:

    Doesn’t Humza not have script writers or spin doctors?

    Why did he say Scotland wants to be the first part of the U.K. to do anything?
    Wouldn’t Scotland like to be the first country to temporarily house those bombed out of their
    homes.

    He should also have emphasised the temporary situation and the fact that Westminster will not permit the Scottish Government act on their own right to offer support.

    If Palestinians did stay for good it leaves the land for Israel as they intend taking it.

  132. Mac
    Ignored
    says:

    Testing

  133. Michael Laing
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Neil Singleton at 7:17 pm:

    “It’s you who is daft for not knowing the the formal constitution of Hamas calls for ‘EVERY JEW ON THE PLANET TO BE KILLED.’ Your naïveté knows know bounds.”

    Unless you can back that statement up with actual proof, I’m going to treat it with great scepticism. And by continually referring to Hamas when it is Palestinian civilians who are being indiscriminately bombed and slaughtered by Israel, you are using the language of dehumanisation. But, just supposing Hamas actually does intend to kill every Jew on the planet, how does that measure up against the actual reality of Israel evicting the Palestinian people from almost the entirety of their land, walling them into what amounts to a concentration camp and slaughtering innocent men, women and children who have nowhere to run? This is the very epitome of evil.

  134. Johnlm
    Ignored
    says:

    Is there no start to Yusles’s talents.

    We’re to assist Israel with its pogrom, and, get to share in the collective punishment.

    Genius.

  135. George Ferguson
    Ignored
    says:

    @Effigy 8:04pm
    The Scottish Government spent £2 million or 18 full time SG advisors last year. The highest in devolution history. Established by Nicola Sturgeon and kept on by Humza Yousaf. No shortage of spin doctors but a dearth of sensible policies.

  136. Mac
    Ignored
    says:

    Fuck it, time to take a holiday from here. Trying to work out which word is banned and which is not… load of fucking wank.

  137. Dan
    Ignored
    says:

    I’m quite digging using a musical reference in posts.
    Channeling Kellis.
    My milkshake brings all the boys to the yard raspberry jam making exploits brings the last of the season’s angry wasps to my crib; So I dug out the old 70s Slazenger tennis racquet and quickly dispatched a true yellow and black terrorist threat with a deft right armed backhand. I mean, everyone be gangsta till a wasp shows up in their personal space.
    But don’t get me wrong, I like wasps in the correct place, where they can munch on aphids that might damage my veg and fruit plants, but sod having one in my house where it might end up stinging me. Got to think safety and the economy first. No point me going into anaphylactic shock and burdening oor NHS Scotland when they need to look after all the chain smoking eastern European migrant’s lung and bronchial problems.

    @ Cpt Yossa

    1965 is new build in my book. My property is 250 years old and built with locally sourced stone, slate, and wood. Just been re-pointing it with lime mortar to give the stonework a refresh after some idiots re-pointed it in cement probably around the 1950s.
    Unlike Brimmond Primary School there’s no sinking in the foundations, damp, or flood risks as the oldtimers sited the village in a sensible location. It has proper green credentials and like to see any Persimmimon home last half as long as my place has.

  138. willie
    Ignored
    says:

    And so, Craig Murray is picked up and arrested.

    But he’s not the only one who has been arrested, has been jailed by the regime police.

    Makes you realize how people were arrested, fitted up and jailed in 1930s Germany. Make no mistake the UK is going exactly the same way.

    And like so many of the Jews in 1930’s Germany they never thought they would come for them, but they did, and up the chimney or into the lime pit they went.

  139. Viscount Ennui
    Ignored
    says:

    RISK OF PILE-ON

    I have lived in Scotland for 40 years.

    Alf might call me an incomer and he would be correct but I came very close to voting Yes in 2014 because I believed then that the SNP was competent and that there was a clear cultural, economic, and political disconnect between E&W and Scotland.

    I want you to understand why I voted No and I will try to keep this brief to avoid bombarding you with detail:

    1. John Swinney

    Errr… that’s it.

    I saw through him and knew that he had no economic plan to mitigate against the risks of separation. I thought that he was lazy, thick, and lacked credibility.

    If indyref2 transpires tomorrow, I will vote No.

    The concerns I had in 2014 are now magnified ten-fold by the incompetence of the current administration and their perversion of the democratic structures that are designed to avert any lurch towards tyranny.

    The SNP in government is incomepetent but it is also corrupt and to a degree that most readers of this site will not fully comprehend. Capt Yossarian has had the same experiences as myself and until you feel that pain you will never understand.

    The death of the SNP cannot come too soon enough and a genuine independence movement will be the stronger for that.

    A bonfire of the vanities is in order and I look forward very much to that.

    I will vote Yes in my lifetime.

    But not, for God’s sake, anytime soon.

  140. Captain Yossarian
    Ignored
    says:

    Dan – “Storm Babet” (or whatever it is called) is due on Thursday. 4″ – 6″ of rainfall predicted. It was always going to happen.

  141. Dan
    Ignored
    says:

    Mac says: at 8:24 pm

    Fuck it, time to take a holiday from here. Trying to work out which word is banned and which is not… load of fucking wank.

    Just try to look on the positives and treat posting btl as a game of Numberwang but with words triggering scoring points.
    I sin-binned myself for a couple of weeks after maxxing out on word moderation frustration.
    It is as frustrating as fuck that the number 1 Scottish Indy site appears to be running Windows 95 on a ZX Spectrum using a noisy BT line dial up internet connection that keeps shitting itself. But hey, it’s marginally more betterer than us using smoke signals or pigeons to communicate.
    I mean, we’re only trying to liberate oorselves from the interests of the globalist and corporate power elite who hold all the cards. Hopefully my random utterings will act as a distracting cover for proper sensible salient communications to slip by unnoticed…

    3 weeks ago Scotland exported 500 million KWhs of leccy power to England, 2 weeks ago when I was on self imposed sabbatical it rose to 565 million KWhs, and last week it was 410 million KWhs.

    https://nitter.net/UK_Imports/status/1713862448686498292

  142. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Viscount Ennui says:
    17 October, 2023 at 8:40 pm

    I want you to understand why I voted No and I will try to keep this brief to avoid bombarding you with detail:

    1. John Swinney

    Errr… that’s it.

    I voted YES because

    1. Ed Milliband

    Errr… that’s it.

    Was that a bit mental do you think?

    PS Do you not like the term incomer?
    What about new Scot?

    I am what you would call an Indigenous Scot or maybe a Native Scot.

    Although these terms are widely used for Native Americans and Aborigines you hardly hear them used for Scots.

    Weird that!

  143. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Mac says:
    17 October, 2023 at 8:24 pm

    Fuck it, time to take a holiday from here. Trying to work out which word is banned and which is not… load of fucking wank.

    The banned word malarky is totally bonkers!

    Here’s what I discovered by accident. Your post that included the banned word could be manually moderated and could appear tomorrow or maybe the next day depending how busy Stu is.

    It’s all bonkers but the most bonkers thing is if you know the banned words you can use them by just adding an *

    An*us,An*usol Ura*us Rect*um Rennies Sett*lers Pu*tin
    disPu*ting, comPu*ting etc etc

    I think it’s all nouns. Solution add an * to all nouns! 🙂

    Hot tip: Break your post down into small sections and you will discover where the naughty words is.

  144. George Ferguson
    Ignored
    says:

    @Dan 9:14pm
    There is mainstream political acceptance of the return to public control of energy assets and resources. Alba, Labour and the SNP. Given the projected curve of Brent Crude Oil and Gas futures. I hope the Conservatives hold good on their promise to disconnect renewable energy prices to gas prices by the end of the year. Imagine the situation where the wind is blowing and we are paying for electricity based on a dysfunctional gas market reacting to International events? Profiteering by everyone except the consumer. I am confident it will change. The public is not daft. Good to see you back.

  145. Alf Baird
    Ignored
    says:

    Ruby @ 9:30 pm

    “I am what you would call an Indigenous Scot or maybe a Native Scot.”

    You are right Ruby, a people should not be embarrassed about who they are. Neither should they be force fed cultural illusions about who they are not, like many indigenous native peoples under colonial rule.

    Don’t know why the word ‘Sett*lers’ is banned, its the third dimension of colonialism, after economic plunder and external political control.

  146. Michael Laing
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Ruby at 9.47pm:

    Doing a LOLOLOL at your comment! ???

  147. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    An*us is banned and if you don’t know why it’s banned you’ll find it strange that you can post arse, erse & bumhole.

    The tricky thing to keep up with is that it’s not just the word an*us that is banned but every word that contains the letters a n * u s

    https://wordfind.com/contains/anus/

    Who would ever guess that man*uscript would be a banned word.
    Don’t forget the planet.

    That applies to every banned word.

  148. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    Shit I got caught.. It was the link what done it. I’ll tiny it and try again

    Easy to miss a banned word in a link.

    An*us is banned and if you don’t know why it’s banned you’ll find it strange that you can post arse, erse & bumhole.

    The tricky thing to keep up with is that it’s not just the word an*us that is banned but every word that contains the letters a n * u s

    https://tinyurl.com/3jfkvtbr

    Who would ever guess that man*uscript would be a banned word.
    Don’t forget the planet.

    That applies to every banned word.

  149. Mac
    Ignored
    says:

    Dan, It is allegedly free speech BTL but then an impenetrable minefield of banned words on certain topics.

    How the fuck is that ‘free speech’?

  150. Ruby
    Ignored
    says:

    I think it’s all nouns. Solution add an * to all nouns!

    That’s rubbish it’s not all nouns. Better just add an * to every word.

    input*ining, dispu*ting etc aren’t nouns at least I don’t think they are. It’s been a long time since I did any grammar. I had to brush up a little lately to find out what a a pronoun was. I’m still confused.

    BTW. ski*er is banned
    Hence risk*ier etc
    Quite a lot of words on that list
    https://tinyurl.com/2rpdjf35

    ski*er is banned because of some total insane banned poster.

  151. Breastplate
    Ignored
    says:

    Viscount Ennui,

    I posed this question to chatgpt earlier..

    What is the purpose of a colony in political terms

    ChatGPT

    1 / 1

    (In political terms, a colony refers to a territory or community that is under the political control of another country, often located far away from the controlling nation. Colonies were a common feature of the global landscape during the Age of Exploration and the subsequent centuries. The purposes of establishing colonies varied, but they generally served several key political, economic, and strategic objectives for the colonizing powers:
    * Economic Exploitation: Colonies were often rich in natural resources such as minerals, spices, agricultural products, and later, industrial resources. The colonizing nations exploited these resources for economic gain, exporting them back to the homeland for processing and sale. This economic exploitation played a crucial role in the growth of colonial powers’ economies.
    * Trade and Commerce: Colonies provided new markets for the products of the colonizing nation. They served as hubs for trade, allowing the colonizers to establish a monopoly over certain goods and trade routes, thereby enhancing their economic power and influence.
    * Strategic Military Bases: Colonies, especially naval bases, were strategically important for controlling sea routes and projecting military power in different parts of the world. Military control of colonies allowed nations to safeguard their interests and assert dominance over rival powers.
    * Cultural and Religious Influence: Colonizing powers often sought to spread their culture, language, religion, and way of life to the colonies. This cultural and religious influence aimed to assimilate local populations into the colonizers’ way of life, leading to cultural diffusion and, sometimes, cultural assimilation.
    * National Prestige and Competition: The possession of colonies was seen as a symbol of national prestige and power. European powers, in particular, engaged in intense competition to acquire colonies, leading to conflicts and wars among these nations.
    * Population Expansion: Some colonies were used as places to relocate surplus populations from the colonizing nation. This was especially true for countries facing overpopulation and social unrest, providing an outlet for excess population while simultaneously strengthening the colonial presence.
    * Missionary Activities: In some cases, colonies were established to facilitate missionary activities and spread religious beliefs. Missionaries often accompanied colonial expeditions, aiming to convert local populations to the faith of the colonizers.
    It’s important to note that the colonial era was marked by exploitation, oppression, and significant negative impacts on indigenous populations. While colonialism had economic and strategic motivations, it also led to social, cultural, and political disruptions in colonized regions, many of which continue to affect societies today.)

    Whether you believe Scotland is a colony or not, it is certainly treated like one.
    So the idea that somehow Scotland can get its shit together under Westminster is a forlorn hope.
    Yes, Alex Salmond did impress many people from all parties and has shown how to do a good job with both hands tied behind his back but that is highly unlikely to happen again because it won’t be allowed to happen again.

    If you couldn’t bring yourself to vote for Scotland to make its own decisions in 2014, I can quite safely say you won’t ever vote for Scotland to make its own decisions.

    People, in general, believe what is convenient for them to believe and it’s convenient for you to justify the continued subjugation of Scotland is actually the forced benevolence of England upon us.

    Reasoning that Scotland shouldn’t govern itself forever because you don’t feel that the right people are in charge for a negligible amount of time initially is quite simply unreasonable.

    But I suppose we all have to justify our pitiful world view in some way.

  152. Ian Smith
    Ignored
    says:

    Scotland faces several disadvantages due to its geographical isolation at the edge of the continent. But it should at least isolate us from the flashpoints of world.

    The thought that we would throw that away, willingly, to disproportionately bring people in from an alien and worryingly backward culture of supremacist aggressiveness, resentfulness, sexism, fatalism is just bizarre.

    Its not as if we do not have enough problems with housing, debt, access to health, education, cost of living, demographics, corruption and incompetence in government yet we have larger crowds on the street more interested in intractable religious wars in the middle east than we get for the collapse of standard of living and general standards of society around us.

  153. twathater
    Ignored
    says:

    Viscount Ennui, I am one of the outspoken people that is vehemently outraged that politicians and especially Alex Salmond agreed to the 2014 franchise with Cameron that ANYONE from ANYWHERE could vote on MY FREEDOM in MY COUNTRY
    I sometimes enjoy your posts and I thought you were an intelligent individual but to admit on an independence supporting site that you voted NO to MY countries independence because of John Swindler or any other individual has to be the epitome of ignorance or you are ripping the pish

    I cannot understand how people can even have the audacity or the inability to be self aware of the stupidity of denigrating independence whilst the alternative is remaining in a morally and financially corrupt union of countries governed by grossly incompetent people who don’t give a flying fuck about anybody bar themselves
    I would see their point if the union had any benefits for Scotland and Scots but to insist that we are better together is a fallacy to divert from England stealing Scotland’s wealth

  154. twathater
    Ignored
    says:

    @ Ian Smith 11.11am unfortunately the die has been cast due to the inability of people to RATIONALLY be able to discuss immigration , religion , race , culture , sex , all taboos that trigger THE WORDS, the worst offenders are politicians and the libertarians , to object to anything above is an automatic branding of racist , anti semite ,or any ism that can be used to SILENCE opposition



Comment - please read this page for comment rules. HTML tags like <i> and <b> are permitted. Use paragraph breaks in long comments. DO NOT SIGN YOUR COMMENTS, either with a name or a slogan. If your comment does not appear immediately, DO NOT REPOST IT. Ignore these rules and I WILL KILL YOU WITH HAMMERS.




↑ Top