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The logic gap

Posted on February 16, 2013 by

As the son of a multi-millionaire, hereditary Labour MP Anas Sarwar has probably never had to think very much about money in his life. We’re not sure that’s an excuse for the mind-numbing arithmetical stupidity of what he says in the Daily Record today.

sarwarmisc

Proposing to “turn up the heat on the SNP by tearing apart some of their main policies”, and more specifically by continuing Labour’s enormously unpopular assault on universal services, Sarwar is reported by the paper as saying:

“there is no point funding free care for the elderly when half the people in the poorest parts of Scotland do not live long enough to take advantage.”

Bizarrely – and not for the first time it pains us to be obliged to spell out something so blindingly obvious – it seems to have escaped Mr Sarwar’s attention that dead people don’t require care. Therefore, the policy only requires to be funded for the people who DO live long enough to obtain its benefits, which means that the only financial savings to be made would be those made at the expense of old, sick, but still alive people.

(Who, it ought to also go without saying, have spent their whole lives paying tax and National Insurance in the legitimate expectation that the state would uphold its end of the bargain when they came to need its help. The subtext of Mr Sarwar’s comments seems to be that as fewer people in Glasgow survive Labour rule for long enough to benefit from free personal care, the policy is worthless and the old folk of Edinburgh, Dundee, Inverness, Perth and Aberdeen should be left in pain and misery.)

Astonishingly, then, Mr Sarwar appears to be suggesting that Labour will abandon all the elderly people in Scotland who DO need care, on the grounds that some other people die young (a statistic likely to rise if Labour’s plan to also end free prescriptions comes into effect), in order that he might put the SNP under political pressure.

We’ve re-read his comments several times to check, because it defies belief that anyone could either be that galactically stupid or assume the electorate was, but we can find no other interpretation. We suspect not even Willie Rennie holds the intellect of voters in such total contempt that he’d demand the cancellation of a widely-supported policy in order to save money that it doesn’t actually cost.

But Labour surrendered all grip on reason in their tribal hatred of the SNP many years ago. Only if the Scottish people do the same will catastrophically witless and venal trough-grubbers like Anas Sarwar still have a career in politics after 2014.

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79 to “The logic gap”

  1. muttley79 says:

    Anas Sarwar…. 😀 😀

  2. BM says:

    Wasn’t free personal care a Labour policy anyway?  I think Jack brought it in.

  3. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    As one who remembers the unexplained pecularities of the voting register that saw him elected, Anas’s father could be described in other ways.

  4. iain says:

    Love the posed photo in the Record piece, ‘I’m a thinker, me’.
     
    Anas’s sudden discovery of concern for his impoverished constituents apparently coincides with a vicious attack of amnesia. His constituency (or its predecessor) has had a Labour MP since 1950, his party has has been in charge for almost half that period at Westminster and for more than half of the existence of the Holyrood parliament. It’s also a Labour council that runs the schools that provide such disappointing outcomes for their pupils.
    Still, once we stop concentrating on this silly referendum it’s back to normal politics, as Ian Smart would say.

  5. Matt says:

    Looks to me like that quintessential Tory tactic of turning people against each other – “hey, you! Yes, you. You’re probably going to die before you get to benefit from free personal care, so why should you be paying for it?”, while at the same time saying to the perfectly healthy person who is definitely going to benefit from free care, “hey, you shouldn’t have to pay for others to get free prescriptions, you never get sick!”

    When the Nazis came for the communists,
    I remained silent;
    I was not a communist.

    When they locked up the social democrats,
    I remained silent;
    I was not a social democrat.

    When they came for the trade unionists,
    I did not speak out;
    I was not a trade unionist.

    When they came for the Jews,
    I remained silent;
    I wasn’t a Jew.

    When they came for me,
    there was no one left to speak out.”

    Martin Niemoller

  6. cath says:

    Why the hell do these eejits never apply that same “logic” to pensions and welfare payments?

    There is a huge problem with health inequalities in this country, where the poorest areas have statistical death rates way below the age people can collect pensions. Yet politicians always use “living longer” stats to push back retirement ages and force people to work (or suffere under ATOS/DWP)longer. This in turn makes health issues worse for those who are aleady ill young, work in jobs that create health problems etc, and who have paid into the system all their lives, often from age 16 rather than the 24 or so a graduate would have but will never get any state pension.

    But no, in their desire to punish the poor and make sure only the wealthy ever benefit, that kind of logic will never be applied where it makes sense. Only where it’s patent lunacy.

  7. M4rkyboy says:

    One nation doesn’t allow for irregularities.Will England be brought into line with Scotland or Scotland brought into line with England?hmmm

  8. creag an tuirc says:

    John Swinneys’ tightening of the Labour run councils budgets to make universal benifits available has resulted a giant stockpiles of empty brown envelopes, poor councillers having to work hard (we thought this would be a cushy number), poor councillers having to live like the rest of us. Get rid of these universal benefits and let the councillers live like kings. After all, their predecessors are living comfortable lives, unaffected by austerity after syphoning and scamming as much of the scottish publics money into their own pockets as they could. It’s just not fair on Labour and I understand why they are upset. It’s Labour in Scotland that are too wee, too poor, too stupid and too lazy, but they still want to be paid good money for being so. Arseholes the lot of them.

  9. DaveO says:

    Sarwar is a gift to the YES campaign – long may he keep his foot firmly wedged in his mouth.

  10. MajorBloodnok says:

    “there is no point funding free care for the elderly when half the people in the poorest parts of Scotland do not live long enough to take advantage.”
     
    When Labour find a lost cause they certainly commit!  Perhaps he’s trying to attack the Scottish Goverment’s handling of the NHS as well – implying that we don’t live as long because the NHS is crap, in his opinion.
     
    There is another very important point about what Anas raises.  As Scots do not live as long, generally, as those south of the border (as he so helpfully points out), Scots are getting back even less of the taxes we pay to Westminster because people don’t claim pensions for as long as they do down south.  So much for the Union divdend.
     

  11. Nikostratos says:

    well first you have to get to elderly which people who
    live in poverty do not reach. So obviously funding
    free care for the elderly,.

    whilst not tackling the underlying causes only aids
    the snp/tory supporters who generally have higher incomes
    and thus do not die as young as those who live in log term poverty.
    this is just a cynical ploy leaving Scottish people who dont vote for the snp
    to die and give cash to snp/tory voters as a way to bribe elderly
    wealthy Scots to vote for Alex Salmonds snp.
     
     
    dead people don’t require care.
    should read
     
    dead Labour people don’t require care.and cant vote

  12. Jiggsbro says:

    So, many people in Scotland die relatively young. I wonder if Mr Sarwar agrees with Dave that Britain works? Or perhaps this disparity started in 2007.

  13. creag an tuirc says:

    @Nikostratos
    god, do you really believe what you have written?
    “the snp/tory supporters who generally have higher incomes” that would be the majority of Scotland then?

  14. Doug Daniel says:

    I know you shouldn’t judge someone on what their family members are like, but when your dad’s peerage is temporarily blocked by HMRC because of concerns over his financial affairs (after already being infamous for accusations of bribery and his massive parliamentary expenses claims) and your brother is put in jail for money laundering (although later cleared due to there not being “enough evidence”), it’s hard not to think “well, the apple rarely falls far from the tree…”
     
    Is dishonesty hereditary? Or did he just learn it himself?

  15. Mosstrooper says:

     
    Did someone forget to lock the door of the psychiatric ward? I see Nico has got out again

  16. Macart says:

    The sheer callous disregard boggles the mind. Stone cold!
     
    That anyone purporting to represent Labour in Scotland should make such a statement?????

  17. Amanayeman says:

    Dear Mr. Anus, having just read what you said about not funding free care for the elderly because they are only going to die anyway. Here is a wee suggestion to help your career. Round them all up and put them into a nice camp where they can be given jobs of work but just to be sure they are clean give them de-lousing showers.

  18. DaveO says:

    Doug – don’t forget the middle brother of the family who was at the centre of university exam cheating scandal.. I know this is wrong to say but am I the only one that can see a pattern here? £250 million VAT fraud, vote rigging, dodgy expenses, exam cheating…..
    I can see why he joined Labour…

  19. Cuphook says:

    @Nikostratos
     
    Are you seriously suggesting that Labour set up free care for the elderly to protect the fortunes of SNP and Tory voters? Where do Libdem voters come into this theory?
     
    Like too many Labour supporters you’re so fixated on the SNP it’s driving you mad.

  20. balgayboy says:

    Anas Sarwar MP (born 14 March 1983)[2] is a British Labour Party politician and has been the Member of Parliament (MP) for Glasgow Central since 6 May 2010, succeeding his father Mohammad Sarwar,
    No Scottish party political association so he his views are of no relevance in the Independence debate. With his viewpoint he needs to consider standing for middle england or maybe the ukip or bnp….Ironic!

  21. pmcrek says:

    NO! I demand Free Care for the DEAD! Zombies are people too.
    http://shirtoid.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/zombie-rights.jpg

  22. CameronB says:

    @ Nikostratos
     
    You should team up with Anus, as you seam to be two of a kind. Of course that is in terms of your logical capabilities. 😉

  23. James Morton says:

    Anas is locked in, as are Scottish Labour to a tactic of trying to appeal to the disgruntled tory voter in Scotland. The only way to do that of course is to act and sound like a tory. They are trying to be clever about it, by asserting that the elderly are getting something they are not entitled to. The same sort of tactic the torys used when attacking child care benefits for the middle classes or council tentants living in mansions. The problem here is that conservatism is dying out in Soctland, and for the proud 88% of scots would never vote for that party, it’s going to be hard to take seriously a party talking about the mean selfish agenda that has kept the tories irrelevant for so long.

    Nikos swivel eyed logic is so bizarre I am amazed he can even find his way to actually post anything. His inference is that only SNP people are rich enough to be pensioners, and only the poor labour voter dies young, so it is all a twisted SNP plot to kill off labours grannies. It is just tragic and demented. before long he will start posting lyrics from songs when faced with something he can’t defend. Pretty much in the same manner that D Hothersall will resort to bad puns and jokes.
    When you look at Darling, Anas, Hothersall and Niko – you know that party is well and truly fucked.

  24. pmcrek says:

    How long before, “SNP accused of supporting free personal care as a dastardly plot to kill Labour voters…no seriously..”, shows up on the Herald?

  25. Caroline says:

    To be fair, the ‘should read’ comment is exactly what Anas is getting at, dead Labour voters can’t vote (under ordinary circumstances, except maybe postally?). If only he had just come out and said that, we’d all be much happier (in line with horsemeat now being labelled as such and no longer as beef). He is of course safe in the knowledge that Labour voters will agree with him on this, apparently. Labour voters are being asked to agree that society (which includes them) wants something for nothing. But more importantly they are being asked to forget that their ancestors who fought in two world wars, who worked in poor conditions for shit wages, who were poisoned by their employers, who protested until things changed, who paid stamp, did so because they wanted a better life for their children (today’s society that wants that something for their apparent nothing). Now those who don’t have children might be persuaded, they might agree it’s all those benefit scroungers who are making the system of taxes to benefit unequal, but surely that’s a minority? (the ones who think their taxes should be spent bailing out banks instead?) Surely the rest don’t feel that university fees will be good for them? That paying £7 for medicine will be good for them? That if they’re lucky enough to survive, paying for the privilege to stay alive will be good for them? It only highlights that Labour politicians think about the Labour Party first and their voters not at all.

  26. balgayboy says:

     
    Nikostratos says:
    Please explain by which process if a person dies they give their money to SNP/Tory voters? struggling to understanding your comment..FFS
     

  27. Clarinda says:

    But hasn’t Mr Sarwar got to look after the dead people – when so many of them ‘vote’ for his party in Scottish elections.
    Has that register ever turned up that went ‘missing’ in Kirkcaldy or does Mr Roy use it as his booster cushion at Westminster?

  28. Barontorc says:

    Is Niko actually Grahamski or do the work alternate shifts? God only knows who would fancy being the employer.

  29. Malcolm says:

    Nobody has mentioned that ‘free’ care for the elderly in Scotland only applies to those without the assets at their disposal to fund residential care. In essence the same as England & Wales – if you own a house you’re required to sell it to fund your care on entering residential care.
     
    I’ll leave people to decide whether that’s fair or not but the people who really do receive free care are precisely the people Sarwar is saying are not going to benefit. Those without the assets to fund it.
     
     

  30. Cuphook says:

     
    I believe that Labour’s next slogan will be ‘End free education as some people are too thick to learn.’
     
    The appearance of Unionists does seem to indicate that this site is proving successful. It’s just a shame that, rather than engaging in meaningful discussion, they prefer to troll, disrupt discussion or just post crazy shit.  
     

  31. Munguin says:

    Add the logic gap to the credability defecit and sometimes you just have to gather your jaw up from the floor!

  32. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “Is Niko actually Grahamski or do the work alternate shifts?”

    Grahamski’s a professional troll who knows exactly what he’s doing. Niko, I fear, is properly bonkers.

  33. Macart says:

    Basically what this piece of work is claiming is that the SNPs spending priorities are all wrong. He’s claiming effectively that the SNP aren’t tackling poverty head on and that they are responsible for the state of poverty within Scotland……………??????
     
    There is of course a huge hole in his logic on the cause of poverty in Scotland and as for what he and those other careerist leeches would consider crucial priorities? Nuclear weapons, force projection, tax breaks for those and such as those with clout and votes, expenses and wages for those overworked and under appreciated souls in Westminster, repaying the interest on all of those PFI schemes…………….. Yeah, you lot, get your priorities right.
     
    The monies saved from ditching even one of those lead weight expenditures would go a long, long way in Scotland.

  34. balgayboy says:

    “there is no point funding free care for the elderly when half the people in the poorest parts of Scotland do not live long enough to take advantage.”                  
    FFS was it not your so called labour party that had the responsibility for the well being of the people of Scotland for the past 50 years…why are they dying so young before their  entitlement age…answer that please.

  35. Yesitis says:

    I am very, very, very proud to say I have never ever once even considered voting Labour. In my opinion, Labour have always been the enemy of the people of Scotland; their true colours now revealed for all to see (and smell).
    In the words of the legendary, 19th century folk singer, Taylor Swift, “We are never, ever voting Labour”

  36. Tinyzeitgeist says:

    “Venal trough-grubbers”…… the political ideology of unionist politicians!

  37. James Morton says:

    Niko?
     
    Well clearly English is not his first langauge so a lot of hiis rants are simply lost in translation. I have seen his site and his posts at Munguins republic, and they tend to veer from outrageous attacks on the SNP to very bad poetry. I also suspect that the man does not even live in Scotland, or the UK for that matter. So that makes the mans positon even harder to fathom – but he clearly subscribes to the “my party, right or wrong” – so is at least consistent in his ravings

  38. Tatties says:

    Labour`s polices  of the past  which have resulted in Scotland  having one of the lowest life expectancy`s in the western world are by their logic to be congratulated as they have saved the tax payer a fortune in pensions and benefits.

  39. CameronB says:

    @ James Morton
     
    Are you suggesting Niko might be a member, or at least a supporter of Golden Dawn?

  40. scottish_skier says:

    Grahamski’s a professional troll who knows exactly what he’s doing. Niko, I fear, is properly bonkers.
    Quite. Niko seems to think it’s the poor and working class who predominantly vote Labour. This just isn’t the case. If we take the recent MORI poll, dividing the population in half according to levels of affluence, we have:
    SNP voters:
    Lower level of affluence = 61% Higher level of affluence = 39%
    Labour voters:
    Lower level of affluence = 53% Higher level of affluence = 47%
    Yes, Labour are increasingly a party of the middle class and better off (soft Tories in particular) but then they are an economically right wing party so that’s no surprise.
    In contrast, the SNP are a centrist-left leaning party; hence the support for universal benefits and higher levels of support among the less affluent than Labour.
    http://www.politicalcompass.org/ukparties2010

  41. MajorBloodnok says:

    Cuphook says: I believe that Labour’s next slogan will be ‘End free education as some people are too thick to learn.’
     
    Funny, I was thinking exactly that half an hour ago but reflecting that it was actually Tory policy.  But now you mention it – Labour and the Tories are increasingly interchangeable – so same difference!

  42. BlueTiles says:

    And I had a Labour supporter the other day ( who denies being a dyed-in-the-wool Labour supporter) defend Anas Sarwar, call him a ‘total Legend’ and claim that he is good at his job and a proper socialist.
    I just…I just don’t understand these people ( this person is the same one who told me that voting for the SNP in 2011 would be the end of Free Tuition, and that Labour were the only ones who cared about Scottish students.)
     
    *Sigh*

  43. Yesitis says:

    @CameronB
    That`s a shame. My mum loves “Tie a yellow ribbon round the ole oak tree” 🙂

  44. CameronB says:

    @ Yesitis
     
    Sorry, but I am very hard of thinking some times, just ask my brother. Could I spoil you joke and ask you to explain it to me please, in simpler terms?

  45. Aplinal says:

    @Cameron
     
    I assumed it was some allusion to their political logo colour; yellow?
    I was thinking less Golden Dawn,m and more “Golden shower”  but that probably lowers the tone of the conversation 8-(
     

  46. CameronB says:

    🙂 🙂 🙂

  47. Yesitis says:

    @CameronB
    I think your smiley faces reveal all 🙂

  48. Bill C says:

    @Nikostratos – I find your post distasteful in the extreme.  I will not comment further as I would not wish to offend the many others on here who make very positive contributions to the debate on the future of our country. Suffice to say, I will not be commenting again on anything you write. 

    As far as Mr. Sarwar is concerned, I find it very worrying that an elected representative of a political party in Scotland could utter such bizarre logic.  I would urge anyone who is thinking of voting no in the referendum to consider the consequences of their actions i.e. in the event of a no vote, there is a very real possiblity that Mr. Sarwar could be in a position of power in Scotland. 

  49. frankieboy says:

    This guy is a parody of David Brent, even down to the posed photograph. Money and privilege are of no use if you are a moron.

  50. Angus McLellan says:

    @James Morton: No, Niko does live in Scotland, it’s just not the one outside your window. The sky is red in Niko’s world, the seas are orange (and fizzy), six is nine and we have always been at war with Eastasia. Everything makes sense then.
    As for Grahamski, I have a vague recollection that he once described himself as an anarcho-syndicalist. So there’s another term that can go on the long words Grahamski doesn’t understand list. Either that or the hypothetical list of his jokes that didn’t work.

  51. Paul Martin says:

    Plainly Anas must have exposed himself to too much mercury amalgam and X-rays in the all of 10 minutes that he spent being a dentist. How else to explain such brain-damaged thinking ?

  52. Geoff Huijer says:

    A lack of understanding logic and joined up thinking would sum
    up Mr Sarwar. Not surprised the Record would publish such utter
    nonsense.
     
    As far as the likes of Niko & Grahamski are concerned I never
    understand why anyone would post any questions or replies
    to them; there is never any thought out, intelligent ‘debate’
    just inane rantings which only divert from people we should
    listen to. I always try and value what a minority opines as it
    helps me understand them & their points of view more. However,
    once determined that no sensible discussion/debate can take place
    I tend to ‘listen’, nod politely, say ‘you know, you might be right’
    & move on.

  53. meljomur says:

    Just looks like ANOTHER own goal by the Scottish Labour party. Not the brightest bulbs on the tree, are they?

  54. James Morton says:

    @CameronB no I’m suggesting that Niko talks out of his arse – consistently I’ll give him that, but his arse all the same

  55. panda paws says:

    Aplinal
     
    Golden Dawn is the name of a Greek right wing/extremist poltical party lead by a guy called Niko. Probably not this Niko mind who is completely bonkers, I think Tris over at Munguins Republic has taken the role of his unpaid carer.
     
     
     

  56. CameronB says:

    @ panda paws
     
    Thanks, I was beginning to think everyone thought I was an ejit, apart from Aplinal. (embarrassedsmileything)

  57. Aplinal says:

    @panda
     
    thanks, I knew about their politics, but didn’t make the connection with their leader. 

  58. Nairn Clark says:

    I was going to post that I remember when Labour was a Social Democratic operation, but then I remembered that they never were. They used to make a better fist of pretending to be one than this, though.
    Every Labour voter who believes in Social Democracy should be voting Yes. That way they’ll actually get a party worthy of those values, and not the daily embarassment of crap like this. 

  59. velofello says:

    The Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn, active in the 19th century in the UK.
    You certainly threw me off the scent Cameron referencing Niko to it!
    And your suggestion that Niko teams up with Anas….” as you seam to…”. i suppose a typo and you intended seem ( I’m A grade at typos). Seam however does seem appropriate as in mining, as in the pits.
    Another astonishing week of politics. To quote Baron Foulkes of the Hermetic Order of Troughers “they are doing it deliberately”. Are they really, or are they are a chaotic blend of dim and arrogant?
    Scotland extinguished declares some boffish fatheads. I agree chimes our precious soul(?) remaining Tory trougher Mr Mundel.
    Not to be overshadowed by his allies Anas identifies a means to save on welfare expenditure. The next logical step in his thinking is unthinkable. Lets just wait and let him say it. 

  60. ianbrotherhood says:

    Just make all the old dears into lasagne and have done with it – spare the horses.

  61. CameronB says:

    blushingfacething

  62. Ken Mac says:

    I remember writing on the day Sarwar was appointed as head of Labours no campaign that it was a gift from the gods. Looks like I was right again.

  63. muttley79 says:

    I still can’t believe Scottish Labour thought it was a good idea to get rid of the likes of Dennis Cannavan and John McAllion, and replace them with the careerists, such as  Margaret Curran (‘the gerbil on speed’), Jim Murphy and Anas Sarwar. 

  64. Dcanmore says:

    All we need now is Councillor Terry Kelly to show up then we’d have the Holy Trinity of Labour loonies with Niko and Grahamski. As for Sarwar, he couldn’t care less apart from self preservation. Going by what he said that could be a speech straight from Iain Duncan Smith, in fact it probably is the same script writers. If Sarwar had a SE English constituency he’d be a Tory MP banging on about Labour’s policies.
     
    Sarwar is all about power, not representation, and it’s obvious that these Labour sheep like Niko have absolutely no regard for the health of the country, only to see their blessed gain power.

  65. Sunshine on Crieff says:

    “there is no point funding free care for the elderly when half the people in the poorest parts of Scotland do not live long enough to take advantage.”

    For once I’m actually lost for words, such is the total stupidity of that statement.

    One thing that I will say, though, and it is a very working class emotion so Sarwar will not have experienced anything like it, is that I was brought up with the folk memory of means-tested handouts. They were detested by the people who had to prove their poverty to receive them, and that attitude was passed down the generations. Some Labour politicians used to appreciate that.

  66. Simon says:

    Perhaps there is a role in Scottish public discourse, for a discussion of what the word “socialism” means. Also what the word “labour” really means.

    It fascinates me that we have a Labour party which represents the interests of rentiers and career beurocrats against the interests of the working classes; and we have a Liberal Democrat party which seems to be opposed to popular democracy and opposed to personal freedom and choice.

    At least the SNP are a Scottish party working for Scottish self-determination. Perhaps that’s why the voters seem unsure about them – what are they hiding?

  67. BeamMeUpScotty says:

    This particular Scaremonger’s apprentice still has much to learn.His party has a long and proud history in the West of Scotland making sure that people were kept in penury so that he and his ilk can continue to enjoy their Westminster priviliges.The SNP have exposed him and many of his fellow Scaremongers as putting self interest before that of their constituents and at last some are beginning to realise that fact.That is why they hate the SNP so much.
     

  68. Morag says:

    Mmmmm.  Remember my tale of my schooldays, and the English teacher who taught us all about the real Macbeth, and then went on to explain why Shakespeare had to turn the story on its head to curry favour with the new “King of England” before we actually read a word of the play?  And Flight of the Heron as a school reader, and the big project on Burns and so on?

    Uh-huh….

    My daddy never thought about asking for a refund though.

  69. Rod Mac says:

    Nikostratas said
    dead people don’t require care.
    should read
     
    dead Labour people don’t require care.and cant vote
     
    But for Labour they do vote ,especially in places like Glenrothes!!
     

  70. Rod Mac says:

    We can all be appalled at Sawar’s outbursts ,we can cringe at The Falkirk Major and feel our toes curl every time Maggie Curran speaks .however until there is a dramatic change in Scotland ,some game changer these disgusting vile creatures will keep getting elected and still have influence.
    It is time for the STUC to remember that it is the workers and the vulnerable that the Trade Unions need to support not a shower of trough dwelling right wing Westminster lovers posing as “Social Democrats”
    It is time for the labour movement to back Scotland and ditch Labour Party once and for all.

  71. the rough bounds says:

    Seems to me that this Anas Sarwar bloke is eaten up with jealousy and that this accounts for his mad ravings.
    He most likely went into the Labour Party because a). His old man had been an MP. so several doors had already been opened for him, and b). he saw the Labour Party as being the best way to climbing the ladder. He saw himself in the corridors of REAL power. What a downer it must have been for him to see that he had backed the losing side. Bumped out of England then heaved out of Scotland.
    Imagine the bitterness that is coursing through his veins. He typifies the average Labour politician. Power hungry to the point of insanity.
    We can’t allow him and those like him back into power. There is too much at stake….our people’s welfare for a start.
     

  72. douglas clark says:

    Y’know how we’re supposed to be going to get a constitution?
    I think it would be right to insist that immediate relatives of MPs cannot be considered for the same, immediately adjacent or revised constituency on the retiral or death of the MP. It would help to avoid the possibility of dynastic politics.
     
    On a similar note, I hope that we retain the Holyrood electoral system.
     

  73. Dave Myers says:

    I’ve always thought of him as pretty stupid, but that really goes quite far beyond utterly idiotic.

  74. chicmac says:

     
    Quite unbelievable , first that the solution to the delta in life-expectancy between Labour-Scotland and the rest, is to remove life-extending measures generally, second in believing that people are mean-spirited enough to vote on a ‘it’ll hurt you more than it’ll hurt me’, basis.
    This paucity of vision is typical of Scottish Labour, rather than seek a positive solution by trying to raise life expectancy in those worst effected areas.

     No wonder things never get better in Scottish Labour dominated areas.
     
    http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f390/chicmac/ArcofAusterityWhy.jpg
     

  75. douglas clark says:

     
    @chicmac, sort of:

    “Dinna you worry you puir wee heid about all this politics malarky. Just vote Labour, ’cause we’re the party of the working man. We’ll see you right.

    Och, yer man just died at 54. Whit a shame.”

    I think they assume too much, but they still pile up votes. Her man should have been alive to see his grandchildren, and that shouldn’t be an aspiration not an exception. It is inhuman to argue otherwise

    Breaking that stranglehold on peoples free will, for it is dead set against self determination, is obviously the hill we have to climb.

    Keeping people ‘stupid’ is, perhaps, the only NHS prescription that Labour would continue to hand out free.

    I think Labour only survives on telling lies to children. That it is a socialist party, that it cares one iota for you and me, that it is even vaguely left wing.

    There is a lot more evidence for Father Christmas than there is for Labour giving a fuck about any of us.
     
     
     
     

  76. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    As douglas clerk notes it is tribal support Labour relies on , not political support.
    The political support is walking away from it and their activist base is almost non existent. That is why at recent Scottish by elections Labour has been in importing activists from England.
    In central Scotland the people who would have been in the Labour Party in the sixties are now mostly in the SNP. Right up to then Labour Party activists were neutral or supportive of an independent Scotland. They have only become a severely unionist party in response to the SNP coming to take their power from them but I suspect most of their activists were not committed unionists.
    Labour in Scotland has reacted with the wrong answer to its SNP problem. Labour for Independence is the right answer

  77. Morag says:

    Remember the “Lorraine Mann question”?  What’s your second choice?  Salmond straightforwardly indicated that it was devolution.  Robertson, or whoever the Labour speaker was at the time, got shifty and refused to answer.
     
    Back then, they didn’t dare admit they were unionists.  What changed?

  78. ianbrotherhood says:

    @Morag –
    George Robertson could claim – with as straight a face as he’s capable of – to be a fervent Scottish patriot whilst plucking ermine hairs from between his teeth.

  79. Douglas says:

    Is it not Anus Sarwar anyway which proves exactly what he is?



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