The honesty patrol
Earlier this week we had a little fun at the expense of the anaemic “grassroots” No campaign, revealing that almost all of its planned activity between now and the referendum was a single day’s leafleting of some railway stations. Yesterday we found out the reason – they’ve got a new leaflet, all about yesterday’s unspectacular comments on currency by Mark Carney, the Governor of the Bank Of England.
We have to assume that the leaflet was printed before the speech, and that any assertions it might make about Mr Carney’s view might not necessarily be entirely true. So let’s see if we can make sure everything stays on the straight and narrow.
Because we know from before that “Better Together” is often simply flat-out lying about the campaigning activities it undertakes. Supposed “events” simply don’t happen at all. Others are hit-and-run affairs staged solely for the benefit of conveniently-located TV cameras. And of course, the leaflets themselves are frequently tissues of lies.
It seems sensible, then, to put tomorrow’s proceedings under some scrutiny, to ensure that the people of Scotland are being told the truth both on the streets and on the internet. And to do that, we need your help.
Below is a list taken from the BT website of times and places that No campaigners will supposedly be handing out the new leaflet. We need people to go there and (a) confirm the event actually took place, ideally with pics; (b) get hold of the leaflet so we can see if it bears even a passing resemblance to the truth; and (c) find out exactly what the public is being told (campaigners will all have been fed a line from BT HQ).
(You may also wish to observe whether anyone is campaigning actually on ScotRail property, because the company has stipulated that any such activity is forbidden.)
Now let’s be absolutely crystal-clear about this, as if it needed saying: we DON’T want anyone harassed. Any photographs sent in will have the faces of the leafleters blurred out. We don’t want anyone insulted or harangued (though of course, if you’re told any lies while picking up the leaflet, feel free to discuss the matter politely). But this is Scotland’s future that’s at stake, and we can’t allow falsehoods to go unchallenged.
(It would obviously have been an ideal job for Labour’s “2014 Truth Team”, but for some reason they seem to have gone rather quiet, so we’ll have to do it ourselves.)
If you can help us with just a few minutes of your time and you live near any of the following stations, post a comment below saying which “event” you’re planning to cover and we’ll mark it on the chart. (If it’s already crossed out, feel free to go along anyway as back-up, or just to meet up with a fellow Wings reader.) Let’s see how many boots the No campaign can really put on the ground, and let’s keep them honest.
ALL LOCATIONS TRAIN STATIONS. TIMES ARE ON FRIDAY 31 JANUARY.
PLEASE STATE MORNING OR AFTERNOON WHERE RELEVANT
7AM – 8AM
Anniesland
Cambuslang
Cupar
Inverness
Linlithgow
Lockerbie
Milngavie
Mosspark
Musselburgh
Paisley Gilmour Street
Patterton (Eastwood)
7AM – 9AM
Aberdeen
Airdrie
Ayr
Bridge Of Allan (Stirling)
Brunstane (Edinburgh)
Burnside (Rutherglen)
Carluke
Clarkston (Glasgow)
Drem (East Lothian)
Dumbarton Central
Dunblane
Dundee
Edinburgh Haymarket
Edinburgh Waverley
Fort Matilda Station (Renfrewshire)
Glasgow Central Station
Glasgow Duke Street
Glasgow Queen Street
Glengarnock (North Ayrshire)
Gourock
Hamilton Central
Helensburgh Central
Hillfoot Station (East Dunbartonshire)
Johnstone
Kirkcaldy
Kirkhill (Rutherglen)
Lanark
Larbert
Larkhall
Lenzie (East Dunbartonshire)
Longniddry
Montrose
Newton (Lanark)
Partick
Pitlochry
Prestwick
Rutherglen
8AM-9AM
AviemoreCumbernauld
Burntisland
Falkirk Grahamston
Lockerbie
Perth
Thornliebank
8AM-10AM
BishopbriggsNorth Berwick
Stirling
4PM – 5PM
Cupar
Drem
Glasgow Alexandra Parade
Hairmyres
Insch (Aberdeenshire)
Inverness
Longniddry
4PM – 6PM
Arbroath
Aviemore
Bathgate
Dingwall
Edinburgh Haymarket
Edinburgh Waverley
Fort Matilda
Glasgow Central
Glasgow Queen Street
Hamilton West
Inverkeithing
Johnstone
Kelvindale
Kirkcaldy
Largs
Leuchars
Linlithgow
Montrose
North Berwick
Oban
Prestwick
5PM – 6PM
Ayr
Barrhead
Dalry (North Ayrshire)
Dunbar
Mosspark
Musselburgh
Patterton
Pitlochry
Prestonpans
5PM – 7PM
Bishopbriggs
Perth
Speaking of McDougall, I’ve noticed he’s condemned today’s wee gathering:
“Organised photography filming & confrontation of ordinary volunteers is intimidating & creepy. Any YES people willing to condemn?”
Later:
“Seriously will not one single SNP activist, yes campaigner or official recognise that what happened this morning is unacceptable? ”
Do you want to know what’s intimidating, Mr. McDougall? Being physically assaulted for holding a Yes card is intimidating.
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Demanding Yes campaigners leave an event for fear of violent reprisal is intimidating.
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Being photographed without your permission by PROFESSIONAL PHOTOGRAPHERS who then published your face, name and home address in one of Scotland’s biggest-selling newspapers – again, without permission – when they were not actively campaigning, and subsequently accusing them of being abusive nutters, is intimidating.
link to wingsoverscotland.com
Sorry, Blair, you and Better Together lost the moral high ground on this a LONG time ago.
Report from Kirkcaldy.
There was one solitary senior U-KOK campaigner at the station from about 6:50 to 9:10.
He never said anything other than “This is from Better Together” when handing out leaflets, but didn’t like being questioned about any of the contents of the leaflet, and seemed to draw a complete blank when asked about anything else regarding Bitter Together.
He’ll be the same person leafleting tonight, so if anyone going tonight wants few tips for signs or arguments, here’s what I managed to get out of him.
First, he’s a supporter of the Conservative party and went to great lengths to try and explain how the Conservatives have every right to govern Scotland with only one MP.
Second, he’s not a fan of immigrants, the working class or the poor. He went on a nice little rant about how the Bedroom Tax was a good thing, Cameron was doing a very good job as Prime Minister, and was glad next to nobody opposed Teresa May’s disgusting immigration bill. Grill him enough and he’ll tell this to you, but not the people he’s leafleting.
Third, when I asked him for a positive case for the Union, all he could give me was a really weak argument about how in his day when you left school with a certificate you could go straight into a job with the British civil service, and doesn’t want that option lost through independence.
Fourth, he is openly in favour of Trident. First street campaigner I have ever heard come out and say they’re in favour of renewing the nukes.
Fifth, he has not heard or read the speech his leaflets are about.
Finally, if you want a cheap laugh at Bitter Together’s expense, hide a recording device on yourself. I told him I was surprised that anyone turned up, and mentioned BT’s poor track record and lack of grassroots activism. He agreed and openly slammed the incompetence of BT. The phrase “Couldn’t organise a piss up in a brewery.” escaped his mouth several times.
I’ll get my photo up as soon as possible. Meantime, I look forward to reading how things progress.
I went through Waverley this morning as well. At about 5 to 8, the two chaps at Market Street had a big stack of leaflets; at 5 to 9 the still seemed to have around the same number, and most of the people I saw walk past refused to take one. I stopped to speak to the younger chap for a couple of minutes (nearly missed my bus!) and told him the leaflet was very misleading. He agreed that the GOODBYE was ‘a bit scaremongery’ but that he was campaigning generally for a stronger country. I explained how the leaflet was lying, and asked him what he meant by stronger. He talked about economic and international power, and I said, ‘like invading other countries illegally and having nuclear weapons?’ and he said he hated war, but thought we were better as a strong union. He admitted that things aren’t great just now, but they’re more likely to get better together. I asked him, if we’re better off together, why does Scotland have some of the most deprived areas in Western Europe, with the worst life spans and unemployment? I reminded him that Labour had 13 years in power and inequality just grew, so it didn’t seem to matter who was in power in Westminster, Scotland still was worse off. He was very flustered, couldn’t really answer, and I got the feeling he hadn’t actually heard anyone put across those points before, but at that point I had to run for my bus. He thanked me for talking to him and raising interesting points, and the exchange was completely polite. An interesting side note is that I’m pretty sure neither of us are native Scots; I’m native Brasilian and formerly American naturalised UK citizen, with an obviously not-Scottish accent, and he sounded like a very posh English lad, almost certainly Home Counties, and I would guess a university student.
Just to add; it was about ten past eight when I swung through Lenzie station carpark and they were definitely handing out leaflets at the point. However, numbers of travellers by that time are starting to die down, most commuters to Glasgow have already gone by that point and so far as I know it’s only trains every fifteen minutes; limited potential, in other words.
Hard to believe they’ve shifted more than a few leaflets except from their bag to the bin via a punter who wasn’t interested in their guff.
Is this honestly what you guys spend your time doing? Instead of trying to answer the legitimate questions being asked about independence you seem to be more interested in intimidating and misrepresenting the pro-union campaign. As an interested bystander in all this I have to say I really hope you lose the referendum, not least as your tactics have been bizar if not borderline psychotic.
Incidentally, I had a pre-prepared line if I’d had a chance to take a picture and they asked me what I was doing. It ran thus;
‘Cheers, you’ve just made me a tenner. I had a bet with a yes voting colleague; he said you probably wouldn’t be here, so the picture is evidence to show him.’
At no point stating that I am not a no voter, but dangling the unspoken implication that I might be….
I went along to Westerton station. I was there from 9.15 to 9.30 and there was no-one putting out leaflets and no sign of any leaflets either in bins or anywhere else
There was only a handful of people at the station which is unsurprising given there is only a train every 20 minutes or so. Also had a scout about the local streets in my car and couldn’t see any sign of any activity
It would be interesting to know if they worded the leaflet before or after Mr Carney’s input.
I suppose someone could ask ‘Treehouse Print’ how quickly they can print 500,000 A5 double sided full colour leaflets after final wording is proofed/agreed.
The price would also be interesting to know.
Just in case we wish to publish something too you understand.
I nearly forgot. The U-KOK Kirkcaldy leafleter also found the flooding in England hilarious, and said it was completely justifiable for the Tories to slash the UK flood defense budget, because “well cuts have to be made somewhere”.
I have had an exchange with JohnOBE over on the Herald who responded to my remark about the leaflet being printed before the speech by saying that “obviously” there were embargoed copies of the speech available to journalists and others. Now this may well be correct as pre-release is not unusual, but these would have to have been at least 5+ days in order to get a leaflet prepared and then printed.
Does anyone know if this is true, and if so, how long in advance such an “embargoed” versions would be sent out? Also, can anyone find out if the original pre-release versions was delivers “as is” if if Mark Carney made any changes?
Where is our “mole” in BT these days 😉
“I have had an exchange with JohnOBE over on the Herald who responded to my remark about the leaflet being printed before the speech by saying that “obviously” there were embargoed copies of the speech available to journalists and others.”
Even less excuse for totally misrepresenting it, then.
Lanark station 7:15 – two men handing out leaflets at a point between the adjacent bus station and the train platform.
My wife was given a leaflet (the Goodbye Pound one) which she read, then returned to the two men and told them that the statements on the leaflet “are not exactly true are they?”. When she explained why – the response she got did not defend the leaflet – it was an attack. The YES campaign was just a front for the SNP; they are just anti-English etc.
She successfully kept them occupied in conversation for the next 45 minutes during which time they didn’t hand out a single leaflet. Turns out they were members of the Labour party. They were rescued by a local Labour councillor who called them away to “go for a cup of tea”. I bet they were grateful.
I’ve got a cracking photo of the activities at Glasgow Duke Street from this morning at 8:15am. Where do I send that?
“I’ve got a cracking photo of the activities at Glasgow Duke Street from this morning at 8:15am. Where do I send that?”
Drop me a line at the Contact page and I’ll give you the email address.
link to wingsoverscotland.com
@crisiscuit
Use contact to request email
thanks
what sad little losers you are can i remind you @ yesterdays first ministers questions mr salmond actually said the white paper had nothing to do with yesscotland it was and i quote “the s snp’s dream of an independent scotland. unless it was an admission that yesscotland is a cover for the s snp
Reminded by staff at Johnstone that such activity is not permitted on railway property and land.
Rev that was my remark to OBE as well. I just wondered how true it might have been.
By the way can I express my admiration for all the YES-citizen journalists seeking out the truth. An inspiration, even for me currently 200 miles away.
OK, here’s my report.
My mother called me up today to say she was going to the station to check out train times, so I decided to come along for support, and to see if anyone did turn up (which we didn’t expect). Lo and behold at 7:10, at the very Gateway to the Highlands, stood a gentleman, well-dressed for the weather, a little longer-in-the-tooth than we expected. He had at least 300 leaflets organised into three small plastic bags. Well, so impressed I was to see him out early on such a bitterly cold, dark morning, I thought it would be good to say hello.
Mum got a leaflet and engaged in conversation with him, generally about the referendum. He seemed to be of the general opinion that the UK was his country, and that England and Scotland should not be separate (no mention of Wales or Northern Ireland). He did look somewhat saddened to hear that he might be giving up free travel and free prescriptions with his No campaign. Overall, our conversation was genial, good-natured, and we all agreed that what was important was that everybody got involved, and everybody votes, no matter which side we were on. We all want the People of Scotland to decide for themselves.
However, we’re (Mum & me) sad that the people are not being given the truth, or even the facts, by the opposing campaign, while the Yes campaign use statistics, consultations, and have the clout of the overwhelmingly elected government here in Scotland. We also worry about people who are not going to live to see the fantastic changes independence will bring. This man was clearly elderly, and mum even feels (at just over middle-age) that the youth of today are the ones who will benefit from all our campaigning.
After mum got the information she needed from the station, we left for rolls & scones. Just before 9, Mum drove by the station to see how he was getting on: just as we thought, he was still there, but getting into his car at approximately 8:52. Regardless of how I feel about the No campaign, I did appreciate this man’s dedication to stay out in the dark, cold morning all alone for almost two hours. I just wish the campaign he followed was straight with him and others like him about the facts: he seemed to really believe that the UK = OK.
But I am heartened by the thought that when Scotland votes yes, then ALL the people of Scotland will benefit, just as we are with the devolved government, and our outstanding MSPs. Nobody will be punished with bedroom taxes, or have money taken from schools to fund nuclear weapons, or forced into workfare. It may be hard, but it will be just. The most important thing in an independent Scotland: instead of campaigning for independence, or to remove Trident, or for a fairer society, ALL these people will be united just simply using their creativity, ingenuity, and enthusiastic values towards making Scotland the best wee country in the world.
Was thinking this was just like a round of Mornington Crescent (Northern Line extension, Rushton’s Excuse-me variant), but without any rules. Edgy.
Report back from family member who passed Whitesands this morning between 8am and 9am: no one passing out leaflets and Whitesands even more deserted than usual. Has to be said though that relative was passing in a hurry to get to work. However, to those who don’t know the area, Whitesands Bus Station is not an enclosed building but is really an open area with bus stances so could be scanned easily in passing as it is situated beside the road known as the Whitesands.
Has to be said though that this viewing in passing was about 8.30 and doesn’t mean that someone from BT wasn’t present at all between 8am and 9am. Sorry, not very conclusive.
No-one from the Yes camp at Stirling Station this morning (6.45 to 8.35).
There were five of us handing-out the ‘Goodbye’ leaflets. All but five of the ones I handed-out were well received.
I’d wonder about the claims that each of the crossed-out stations were covered. There wasn’t any Yes presence in Dunblane or Bridge of Allan either.
Check your facts, maybe?
“I’d wonder about the claims that each of the crossed-out stations were covered. There wasn’t any Yes presence in Dunblane or Bridge of Allan either.”
It wasn’t Yes Scotland’s big campaign day, dear. Just a few folk going out on their own initiative.
PS 8.35? Weren’t you meant to be there until at least 9am?
Rev Campbell
Happy St John Bosco’s Day to you
Since we haven’t met, I’m not your dear.
And as I observed, three of the Stations claimed by “a few folk going out on their own initiative” weren’t covered.
How many other claims by “a few folk going out on their own initiative” were untrue?
“And as I observed, three of the Stations claimed by “a few folk going out on their own initiative” weren’t covered.”
Our readers weren’t leafleting. They were merely observing YOURS. A few decided to leaflet as well, but it wasn’t the purpose of the operation.
Just a point about Langs outburst
“these men died for a time and a place that is past, they did not die for that which we seem to have inherited, today was undreamt of when they were alive”
Sunset song, Lewis grassic gibbon,
FOR I WILL GIVE YOU THE MORNING STAR
In the sunset of an age and an epoch we may write that for epitaph of the men who were of it. They went quiet and brave from the lands they loved, though seldom of that love might they speak, it was not in them to tell in words of the earth that moved and lived and abided, their life and enduring love. And who knows at the last what memories of it were with them, the springs and the winters of this land and all the sounds and scents of it that had once been theirs, deep, and a passion of their blood and spirit, those four who died in France? With them we may say there died a thing older than themselves, these were the Last of the Peasants, the last of the Old Scots folk. A new generation comes up that will know them not, except as a memory in a song, they passed with the things that seemed good to them with loves and desires that grow dim and alien in the days to be. It was the old Scotland that perished then, and we may believe that never again will the old speech and the old songs, the old curses and the old benedictions, rise but with alien effort to our lips.
The last of the peasants, those four that you knew, took that with them to the darkness and the quietness of the places where they sleep. And the land changes, their parks and their steadings are a desolation where the sheep are pastured, we are told that great machines come soon to till the land, and the great herds come to feed on it, the crofter has gone, the man with the house and the steading of his own and the land closer to his heart than the flesh of his body. Nothing, it has been said, is true but change, nothing abides, and here in Kinraddie where we watch the building of those little prides and those little fortunes on the ruins of the little farms we must give heed that these also do not abide, that a new spirit shall come to the land with the greater herd and the great machines. For greed of place and possession and great estate those four had little head, the kindness of friends and the warmth of toil and the peace of rest–they asked no more from God or man, and no less would they endure.
So, lest we shame them, let us believe that the new oppressions and foolish greeds are no more than mists that pass. They died for a world that is past, these men, but they did not die for this that we seem to inherit. Beyond it and us there shines a greater hope and a newer world, undreamt when these four died. But need we doubt which side the battle they would range themselves did they live to-day, need we doubt the answer they cry to us even now, the four of them, from the places of the sunset?
LGG, sunset song
Isn’t it great that we’re now getting reports in from the NO leafleteers too ! Perhaps this captive market might benefit from some WoS home truths if they stick around…
Was at Edinburgh Haymarket soon after 4pm. Two BTs leafletting.
Took leaflet, asked if it was about ‘that banking story on tv last night’. He said it was, that we couldn’t have any control of the pound if vote yes. I said that I thought the banking guy basically said that they would implement whatever the two governments agreed and the euro is shared so what was the problem? Problem is, he said, the British govt have said they will refuse so nothing can be agreed.
“Wait a minute” I said, “so you are saying that if Scotland democratically votes yes then the British govt will simply tell us to f*co off, we ain’t gettingvto keep the pound?”.
“Yes that’s right” he said, a big smile on his face.
“Doesn’t sound very democratic or respectful”, I said, “don’t think I want a govt like that in charge of Scotland. Thanks, you just convinced me to vote YES”
Cheap shot at the end but I was hoping to demoralise him and maybe make him less strident to later people.vwhere will I email photo of encounter?
Walked through Linlithgow Station at 4.30pm, in the top entrance, down the stairs and through the tunnel to exit at the High Street side. Pleased to report that there’s nothing to report. Didn’t see any activity on either platform, and no leaflets scattered on the ground.
As you’d expect at a station there were a couple of folk standing around waiting, but none of them were handing anything out.
Was at Queen Street at the back of 4. Came across a few ukok leafletters at the George Square entrance (well off the station property.) Tried to engage one in discussion but all she could do was mouth slogans and assertions – including the ridiculous line that if people want rid of Trident they can vote Labour in 2015. No ability shown to engage in a discussion of ideas. On the plus side, I have to say she was polite – more than I can say for some die-hard unionist Labour members I’ve come across. still, our side has nothing to fear when there’s a frank discussion based on ideas and facts.
Cupar – didn’t expect to see anyone after the morning report of a no-show but was there from 4 to 4.30… nada
Rev Campbell
They ‘were merely observing YOURS’ were they? That’s reassuring.
Can’t wait for the debrief about their Bridge of Allan observations.
An interesting fact was that those arriving in Stirling later in our session already had leaflets and showed them to us.
They had obviously been leafleted at other Stations where, presumably, they would have been observed by your Secret Information Club who would be able to report that they receieved leaflets and put them in their pockets, so as to be able to show us later.
No Union Jocks/Brit Nats distributing anything that I could see at Bathgate Train Station between 4pm to approx 4.40pm.
I did however chat with a nice chap with a big blue ‘Yes’ umbrella who was going to be staying on the lookout until 6pm.
@Jim Roche
I don’t think you’ve quite grasped what this was about.
big_al
I’m sure that you’re correct. I hadn’t grasped what your chums were doing.
I thought that your group was claiming to have observers at each Station who would put today’s “proceedings under some scrutiny, to ensure that the people of Scotland are being told the truth both on the streets and on the internet”.
As I noted above, there was no visible Yes person at Stirling.
Unless you had some Brave member of your Secret Information Club skulking around and afraid to speak to any of the five of us.
And at the other two Stations where we saw nobody from your Secret Information Club.
As I wrote
“Can’t wait for the debrief about their Bridge of Allan observations.”
Jim Roche says
Secret Information Club
Yawn. That’s 3 times you’ve used that and it wasn’t all that amusing the first time. Find a new scriptwriter, your current one’s bowf.
There is no SIC. I should know, I’m the Secretary. And so’s my wife.
You are the Secretary of the Club!
Well done on your election, Mr Gaughan.
I am gratified that someone from Management has become involved. Would you care to address the earlier question about untruths?
-How many other claims by “a few folk going out on their own initiative” were untrue?
OR
“Can’t wait for the debrief about their Bridge of Allan observations.”
Which isn’t a question. Rather a challenge.
Even if you are not amused, I see great comedy in the facty that you all see yourselves as a group who go about ‘observing’ and ‘scrutinising’ other people.
All a bit Enid Blyton or Richmal Crompton, don’t you think? Kind of like A Secret Information Club.
big_al said
@Jim Roche
I don’t think you’ve quite grasped what this was about.
Jim Roche said
big_al
I’m sure that you’re correct……
I was right first time around.
Jim Roche says:
Would you care to address the earlier question about untruths?
I could tell you, but only if you roll up your trouserlegs and slaughter a goat on Portbello Beach below the high water mark when the tide’s out while keeping your left foot in a bucket of cold water and walking counterclockwise whistling “God Save the Queen” and post a video on YaChoob.
Kind of like A Secret Information Club.
You really must do something about that scriptwriter.
So, that’s a NO then.
As an aside, may I congratulate you on your version of “51st Highland Division’s Farwell to Sicily”. You make your guitar sound like the bagpipes Hamish Henderson heard in Lingualossa. Well done.
Jim Roche says:
You make your guitar sound like the bagpipes Hamish Henderson heard in Lingualossa. Well done.
Thank you, Jim. If you’d prefer, you can substitute “Bandiera Rossa” for GSTQ per my last post 🙂
I have sung each with great Gusto!
Not sure about the bucket of cold water though…
And both hymns have words and lines that I’m not too sure about, when you start to think too deeply about them.
Still…Avanti popolo!
@schrodinger’s cat –
Cheers for that. A wonderful piece of writing.
It’s hard to imagine that a highly educated man like Ian Lang isn’t familiar with LGG’s greatest work.
And that makes his remarks all the more repulsive.
Schrodinger’s Cat, thanks for the Sunset Song quotes, one of my favourite Scottish novels.
Jim, for what it’s worth, my mother and I wear our Yes badges all the time, and when we met the BT campaigner, we announced our voting intentions immediately. After all, we have nothing to hide and nothing to gain by pretending to be undecideds or Nos, and since there’s a frequent refrain about the “lack of honest debate,” we thought our BT man would welcome such a discussion.
As for “Secret Information Club,” well, I think if that was what Rev was planning, posting it on a publicly-accessible website is a bit of a fumble in regards to such espionage…
@Jim Roche:
Re: joking comments about “Avanti Popolo” and “God Save the Queen”.
“The peoples on the march
The road we’re treading
It leads to Freedom”
and
“And like a torrent rush
Rebellious Scots to crush”
I never could figure out exactly why I should be praying to a Deity I don’t believe in to give strength to a Monarch I don’t recognise to beat the crap out of my own people.
I’m glad that although we’re on opposite sides of the barricades, we can at least agree that “Avanti Popolo” should be sung with gusto!
Dick Gaughan
Bandiera Rosa
Don’t know that verse of “Bandiera Rossa” Is it a new song?
My problem is the promotion of Communism, which has killed both freedom and millions:
Red flag will be triumphant
Red flag will be triumphant
Red flag will be triumphant
Long live communism and freedom!
God Save the Queen
Your thoughts on beating the crap out of my own people are misguided. ‘The Scots’ in the rushed-up 1745 verse are the Highland Jacobites rather than the Irish Gaughans.
The Lowland Scots in 1745 were hostile to the Papist Highlanders – so the verse doesn’t mean them either.
The anti-Jacobite Scots fought with great enthusiasm against the Jacobites.
I have never heard that vers sung, have you?
I’d guess that it went out of use 200 years ago.
I am a Christian so have no problem with the Deity aspect of our National Anthem.
Rather I regret the absence of the verse asking God to save us all:
O Lord our God arise
Scatter her enemies
And make them fall
Confound their politics
Frustrate their knavish tricks
On Thee our hopes we fix
God save us all
And I don’t think that she has defended our laws/constitution very well.
ps You may be amused that I played your version of the 51st Farewell in the main square at Lingualossa last year (in my earphones) and later in the car with the windows down, but not too loud, and not for very long….
Jim Roche says:
Your thoughts on beating the crap out of my own people are misguided. ‘The Scots’ in the rushed-up 1745 verse are the Highland Jacobites rather than the Irish Gaughans.
Revealing. By “my own people” I was refering to the Lochaber MacDonald half of my family. As Scottish as haggis’n’neeps.
Good point. And well made about your Lochaber roots.
But remember that Neeps came to Scotland via the Royal Gardens in England.
An early benefit of Union ;o)
I don’t really like popcorn, but…
Ah Popcorn!
An import from the Americas via our Southern neighbours.
Much like the potatoes for our Champit Tatties.
@Jim Roche –
Aye. Okay. What-evs.
I’m only hanging about until Dick Gaughan gets back to you.
Anyway, if you’re still there – what are ‘Champit Tatties’?
I could ‘google’ it, of course, but you seem to assume that ‘we’ know what it means. As a matter of fact, I don’t, so – if you’re so-inclined, could you explain, in your own terms, what a ‘Champit Tattie’ is?
A Tattie is a potato.
A Champer is the hand-held kitchen tool used for mashing.
When one uses a Champer on boiled potatoes, thay become Mashed Potatoes. Or Mashed Tatties. Or Champit Tatties.
This is the description of Mashed Potatoes I have seen on Burns Supper menus and elsewhere.
Turnips are similarly described as Champit Neeps.
What do you call a Champer in your house?
Hello?
@Jim Roche –
I call the tool you described a ‘tattie-masher’. I have never, in my fifty years on this planet (48 of them spent here, in Scotland) heard that implement described as a ‘champer’.
Mind you, I’m a ‘Weegie’, so perhaps I was sheltered in some way. I bow to your superior awareness of Burns – like most ‘ordinary’ Scots, I have never attended a Burns Supper, and wouldn’t know how a typical modern menu describes ‘mashed-tatties’ or any of the other foodstuff involved.
Thanks for taking the time to respond to my interjection, (and educating me into the bargain!) and I do apologise if my response wasn’t as timely as you’d have preferred.
Hopefully, you won’t feel the need to address my ignorance again, and I look forward to seeing how your correspondence with Mr Gaughan unfolds.
Didn’t the Romans bring turnips here?
link to resourcesforhistory.com