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Wings Over Scotland


The bully pulpit

Posted on January 25, 2014 by

It’s mainly hilarious, if we’re being honest. Today’s hysterical “unmasking” of “cybernats” (in fact a collection of perfectly normal and varied people, using the internet under their real names and mainly with photographs of themselves) by the Scottish Daily Mail as part of its ongoing “Cybernat Watch” smear campaign is like a one-stop beginner’s guide to the paper’s lurid sub-tabloid modus operandi.

cybernatsunmasked

But much as we chuckle, there are deeply sinister undercurrents to the article.

We’ve attached the entire text of the piece in its full deranged glory below as an appendix. But it’s worth pulling out a few highlights.

“HUNCHED in front of the flickering computer screen, Brendan Hynes is hard at work, despite the late hour. The divorced father of three has a look of intense concentration as his fingers race across the keyboard.”

A lovely piece of pure fantasy to start us off. (Incidentally, computer monitors don’t “flicker” when you’re typing. It’d be very distracting and give you a headache.)

“But Hynes – and many like him – are turning Twitter and other online forums into ‘no-go zones’ for those who want to engage in a rational debate on the country’s future.”

This is a weird angle. If you don’t want to read any tweets from Brendan Hynes, don’t follow his Twitter account and you won’t see any. If you want to engage in a rational debate, neither he nor anyone else on Twitter has any conceivable way of stopping you. Any Twitter user can “block” another person’s account so that messages from it will be screened and stopped from reaching the first user.

“Some Nationalists have rightly pointed out that there are offensive tweeters, or online activists, on both sides; and there will always be those who pour out abuse unthinkingly, solely to cause offence.”

The Mail, however, isn’t interested in “watching” any of those. In two weeks of solid, relentless coverage of the “cybernat” issue it hasn’t printed a single abusive comment from a Unionist. Which is a little odd – if you’re concerned about a debate being “poisoned”, wouldn’t you want to eliminate all the sources of poison, rather than just a subset of them? Or is there a good kind of poison that makes debates better?

“But what marks out the cybernats is their modus operandi: from their disparate locations around the country, on smartphones, laptops and desktop computers in lonely bedrooms, they operate almost as one homogenous body.

There are central figures who spur on or co-ordinate this activity, binding them together and providing inspiration and moral support.”

Intriguing phrasing there. The “or” in the second sentence is a classic weasel word. It’s a bit like saying “All supporters of Partick Thistle enjoy football or abusing children” – it creates a negative impression while not actually being defamatory, because the “or” means no individual is actually being accused of paedophilia.

The Mail knows that there’s nobody “co-ordinating” pro-independence Twitter users (quite aside from anything else, such an activity would be akin to herding cats), so it uses a cowardly disclaimer that allows it to imply it without actually saying so.

“Some don’t live here and can’t vote in September’s crucial referendum, or aren’t even Scottish”

IMMIGRANTS!

“And some, like Jason Dolan, rail against the UK Government, while openly admitting they depend on its benefits system.”

Apparently if you’re on benefits you lose the right to object to the government.

“Other cybernats don’t fit this profile of the bitter, lonely blogger, spewing bile in the small hours.”

Hang on – didn’t you just tell us they were “one homogenous body”?

“Melissa Murray is a director of a management consultancy – Darkstar Resources – living in the affluent Bruntsfield area of Edinburgh. More surprisingly, the 45-year-old mother of one is from the United States.”

We’re not sure why this is surprising. We’re sure the Mail must have already been aware that some people in Scotland were born in other nations. And didn’t the USA fight its own war of independence from the UK? Why would it be a shock that one of its citizens backed self-determination in other countries?

“Among her tweets, read by more than 1,200 followers, is this observation: ‘sorry but anyone who professes Scotland is #bettertogether truly must hate Scotland’.”

Well, okay, we can’t be going around suggesting that other people hate their own countries. Fair criticism. Such language would clearly be disgusting and unacceptable behaviour, and anyone using it should be made to issue a public apology immediately.

hatebritain1

hatebritain2

Oops.

“One of those she corresponded with this week on Twitter – the favoured medium of the cybernat – was a blogger called Wings Over Scotland.”

Hello!

“Wings is in fact ‘Reverend’ Stuart Campbell, 46, a former video games journalist from Denny, Stirlingshire, who has built up a following of around 7,000 subscribers on the micro-blogging site after nearly 50,000 tweets.”

As far as I’m aware, I’ve never been to Denny in my life.

“‘Followers’ is an apposite term, as Wings has grown into something of a cult – so much so that many of them willingly donate cash to the blog to fund ventures such as opinion polls – and some of Campbell’s ‘wages’.”

You may have thought you were normal people reading a website, a fairly common modern-day pursuit enjoyed by many respectable members of society. In fact you’re cultists. Everyone’s got their tickets for the debauched orgy followed by the mass suicide, right? Tuesday night at Bellahouston Park, indoors if wet.

“But nothing is quite as it seems with the ‘Reverend’ (a claim no one has yet verified; last night, the Church of Scotland told the Mail it had no record of Campbell as a Kirk minister).”

Now this is a nasty little line. Why only ask the Church of Scotland? Why not the Catholic Church or the Wee Frees or any other of Scotland’s many denominations? The implication seems to be that it only matters that someone isn’t a Protestant. Or, put another way, that they might be a Catholic. (Or Jewish.)

“Campbell lives in Bath, Somerset (with his pet rats), which means he cannot even vote in the independence referendum.”

It means no such thing, of course. It means that I couldn’t vote in the referendum if it was tomorrow, which it isn’t. The deadline for someone to be resident in Scotland and entitled to vote is September 3rd, still more than seven months away. (I’d pointed this fact out to the Mail when they asked, but for some reason they declined to include that answer in their piece.)

We don’t think ownership of rats affects the voting franchise.

“Perhaps it’s no wonder, as Campbell is prone to the kind of intemperate rants that have helped to turn Twitter into such a toxic environment.

This week, he tweeted pro-Union campaigner Andrew Skinner on Twitter: ‘I’d just like you to f*** off to Ireland’ (and then shamelessly revelled in the fact his tweet had been highlighted as an example of cybernat trolling).”

Sadly the Mail doesn’t see fit to include the rest of the joke to which that was the punchline. But its choice of poor innocent victim is intriguing.

askinner

According to his Twitter bio, self-confessed troll Mr Skinner is an (or perhaps the only) administrator of one of the more popular Unionist pages on Facebook. “Vote No 2014” is a hotbed of high-class reasoned political debate like this:

shitepaper

votenoindoctrinate

votenostickyour

votenoharvie

votenonat

votenojenkins

Populated by a ragtag of angry right-wing immigrant-haters, Ulster loyalists, army fetishists and Labour activists, the page is mainly concerned with attacking the SNP (in the person of “Wee fat Eck and Fishface Sturgeon”, as one recent commenter put it, while another noted that the First Minister was apparently “a power crazy racist who hates the English”), and fretting about the price of lager.

Poor, delicate, bullied Mr Skinner. But anyway.

“Last night, a Yes Scotland spokesman said: ‘Stuart Campbell is not part of Yes Scotland and we do not have any direct contact with him.’ But he conceded that ‘as the country becomes more engaged with the independence debate, it is likely that speaking events and debates will be proposed by a variety of groups and individuals’.”

We’re not quite sure in what way that constitues a “concession”.

“In Campbell’s orbit are lesser – but no less vociferous – cybernats.”

We’re also uncertain quite what being “in orbit” entails here.

“One of them is Tommy Ball, 29, who recently called a Unionist commentator ‘Uncle Tam’ and has branded the British Army ‘scum’. Yet Ball hardly conforms, at first glance, to the stereotype of the cybernat – he’s a lab technician who lives alone in Govan.”

These damn slippery cybernats, refusing to be “homogenous” again.

“Andrew Ellis, 52, on the other hand, is proud to be called a ‘cybernat’. He is helping to promote Scottish independence – from the unlikely location of his home in Chichester, West Sussex.”

Because Scottish people aren’t allowed to live anywhere outside Scotland, or if they do they must immediately cease having opinions about it. Like all the London-based MPs with “second homes” in their Scottish constituencies who never offer a view on the subject, presumably. Or English resident John Barrowman.

“Mr Ellis, a commercial manager for computing firm Hewlett Packard since November, moved from Yorkshire to his present home in 1992 with his English wife, 51-year-old Debbie. The Edinburgh- born former politics student appears to be one of the more temperate cybernats”

What’s he doing in this article, then?

“though at times he is a near-fanatical supporter of Wings, in many of his near-17,000 tweets to about 800 followers.

He told the Mail: ‘I am not a member of the SNP or a supporter, even though I find some of what they say and do quite attractive.”

The vicious near-fanatical cyber-bullying BASTARD! Lock him up!

Clearly running short of “endless bile and vitriol” by this point, the Mail wraps things up. But the piece (which is also accompanied by a front-page story, an editorial leader column and another “Cybernat Watch”) marks only the latest salvo in a two-week onslaught of one-sided vilification of independence supporters.

And when a newspaper issues such a stream of relentless propaganda directed only at one half of a debate, even while admitting that both sides are culpable, it’s transparently only trying to achieve one thing – ironically enough, the intimidation and silencing of its opponents.

The people the Daily Mail doorstepped aren’t used to being castigated in the national press and having their faces published like a rogue’s gallery of wanted criminals. (It’s water off a duck’s back to us.) The purpose of articles like this is to bully them and to scare others who don’t want to get the same treatment in future.

The average “cybernat” reaches only a few dozen or few hundred people, mostly like minds who’ve chosen to follow them. The Daily Mail sells almost 100,000 copies a day in Scotland, meaning a likely readership of around a quarter of a million. It doesn’t actually directly incite violence against the people in the feature, but paints a picture of them as despicable sub-human menaces to society and provides enough information (location, occupation, picture and even in some instances a description of their house) that some lunatic could track them down and assault them.

In nearly 50,000 tweets, we’ve used the occasional bit of industrial language, like most humans do. We’ve told a few trolls and Tories to f*** off, and we’re not ashamed of it. But when it comes to bullying, we’re just not in the Daily Mail’s league.

.

—————————————————————————————————-

CYBERNATS UNMASKED

A retired oil executive, a jobless man of 41 who lives with his mum and a Bath-based video games writer. Meet just some of the agitators whose online poison is shaming the Nationalists

‘Spilling endless bile and vitriol onto Twitter’

HUNCHED in front of the flickering computer screen, Brendan Hynes is hard at work, despite the late hour. The divorced father of three has a look of intense concentration as his fingers race across the keyboard. Like a lot of retirees, the internet has provided him with a hobby, a useful way of keeping in touch with relatives. But the former oil industry executive isn’t tapping out friendly messages: from his flat in a housing complex in a sleepy Aberdeenshire village, he is spilling endless bile and vitriol onto Twitter, the ‘micro-blogging’ website.

Hynes has quickly established himself as a ‘cybernat’ – the army of online supporters of Scottish independence notorious for their provocative and often abusive comments and now at the centre of a growing political row.

Last week, Hynes, 64, tweeted prominent Unionist commentator John McTernan: ‘You are an outright collaborator, conspiring to put Scotland in subjection.’

Defending his comment later, Hynes tweeted: ‘So what would you call a person who seeks to give his country to another country to be lorded over – friend of the people?’

He has even posted altered pictures of David Cameron in a Nazi uniform alongside quotes from Auschwitz’s Angel of Death, the Nazi medic Josef Mengele.

When the Scottish Daily Mail tracked him down to his home in Peterculter, Hynes, responsible for nearly 11,000 tweets, many of them hate-filled, was unrepentant.

‘I send as many tweets as I want,’ he said. ‘I can put out as many as I like – that’s what it’s for. I’m retired, that’s what I do.’

It would be easy to dismiss these outpourings as irrelevant to the national debate on the independence referendum.

But Hynes – and many like him – are turning Twitter and other online forums into ‘no-go zones’ for those who want to engage in a rational debate on the country’s future.

Many commentators, including some of the Mail’s own writers, have found themselves facing a tidal wave of abuse from cybernats who seek to poison political debate in this country.

Unlike Hynes, many cybernats are more cowardly and hide behind aliases.

Some Nationalists have rightly pointed out that there are offensive tweeters, or online activists, on both sides; and there will always be those who pour out abuse unthinkingly, solely to cause offence.

But what marks out the cybernats is their modus operandi: from their disparate locations around the country, on smartphones, laptops and desktop computers in lonely bedrooms, they operate almost as one homogenous body.

There are central figures who spur on or co- ordinate this activity, binding them together and providing inspiration and moral support.

In a show of defiance, they have even produced their own ‘cybernat’ logo for online use.

The Scottish Daily Mail set out to unmask some of them, with surprising results.

Some don’t live here and can’t vote in September’s crucial referendum, or aren’t even Scottish; some are outwardly respectable, professional people, reserving their bile for the internet.

And some, like Jason Dolan, rail against the UK Government, while openly admitting they depend on its benefits system.

When the Mail visited his small terraced house in Cumbernauld, Dunbartonshire, he had been asleep for most of the day, only waking at around 6pm.

Dolan, 41, lives on state handouts (he has bad circulation and claims he cannot work) with his 73-year-old mother.

It is here that he crafts some of his sickening tweets, such as: ‘ Be prepared for the Scottish Revolution if you #UK loving c**** try to stop the real Scots from getting independence. #SNP’

In another broadside, he says: ‘@antitoryparty Great tweets! And so true about # Tory scumbags! #IndyRef they are like the #NAZI party. Cameron won’t get in on 2015.’

Dolan is rather more reasoned in person, saying he would be ‘disappointed if people didn’t vote Yes, but I wouldn’t go all Braveheart about it’. His advice for victims of online trolling is simply to ‘move on’.

Other cybernats don’t fit this profile of the bitter, lonely blogger, spewing bile in the small hours.

Melissa Murray is a director of a management consultancy – Darkstar Resources – living in the affluent Bruntsfield area of Edinburgh. More surprisingly, the 45-year-old mother of one is from the United States.

In her Twitter biography – which also contains a picture of Edinburgh Castle – she describes herself as a ‘Yank living in Edinburgh [who] supports Scottish independence’.

Among her tweets, read by more than 1,200 followers, is this observation: ‘sorry but anyone who professes Scotland is #bettertogether truly must hate Scotland’.

In another tweet, she claims to be ‘undecided’ about her political beliefs, saying: ‘I didn’t realise so many Better Together folk hated Mandela. As an undecided, I’m shocked by this fact.’

‘Let’s hear it for the cybernats!’ she tweeted this week amid a growing political row over the way the phenomenon is poisoning political debate.

When the Mail visited her home the day before, she was rather less keen to back the cause, saying only: ‘I’m not an SNP person, so I don’t know what a cybernat is.’

Rather gleefully, she also referred to herself, after our visit, as a ‘famous cybernat’.

One of those she corresponded with this week on Twitter – the favoured medium of the cybernat – was a blogger called Wings Over Scotland.

Wings is in fact ‘Reverend’ Stuart Campbell, 46, a former video games journalist from Denny, Stirlingshire, who has built up a following of around 7,000 subscribers on the micro-blogging site after nearly 50,000 tweets.

‘Followers’ is an apposite term, as Wings has grown into something of a cult – so much so that many of them willingly donate cash to the blog to fund ventures such as opinion polls – and some of Campbell’s ‘wages’.

But nothing is quite as it seems with the ‘Reverend’ (a claim no one has yet verified; last night, the Church of Scotland told the Mail it had no record of Campbell as a Kirk minister).

Campbell lives in Bath, Somerset (with his pet rats), which means he cannot even vote in the independence referendum.

‘Wings’ sees himself as a rallying point for the independence cause, urging his readers to try to convert as many ‘undecideds’ as possible.

On his website, he tells his acolytes: ‘they’ll [undecided voters] be hungry for more truth, and then you can send them our way.’

The self-aggrandising ‘our’, of course, is slightly misleading, as Wings is more or less a one-man outfit, though he does sometimes commission and publish proindependence submissions.

A self-publicist of the first order, Wings often boasts about his growing profile and Community Safety Minister Roseanna Cunningham is one of his Twitter correspondents. Yes Scotland chief executive Blair Jenkins has previously replied to Campbell on Twitter and accepted an invitation from him to take part in a public debate, though the Yes camp has since distanced itself from him.

Perhaps it’s no wonder, as Campbell is prone to the kind of intemperate rants that have helped to turn Twitter into such a toxic environment.

Straying from the topic of independence, he once sparred with the sister of Hillsborough victim Thomas Fox, telling her: ‘If people stop when they get to a wall of human beings instead of ramming it, nobody dies.’ He accused those he holds responsible for the crushing of being ‘c***s’.

This week, he tweeted pro-Union campaigner Andrew Skinner on Twitter: ‘I’d just like you to f*** off to Ireland’ (and then shamelessly revelled in the fact his tweet had been highlighted as an example of cybernat trolling).

In December, Campbell asked an SNP councillor: ‘Is there anyone you don’t like? Fred West? Harold Shipman? Anas Sarwar [Scottish Labour deputy leader]?’

Yet Campbell brazenly told the Mail: ‘The term “cybernat” is an attempted smear intended to denigrate anyone who supports independence and can operate a computer.’

He added: ‘The notion of a Great Cyber Control HQ where thousands of internet users are marshalled, co-ordinated and deployed in the service of dastardly separatist overlords is a paranoid fantasy worthy of Joe McCarthy.’

Campbell set out to raise £1,500 from his backers for one poll but took in £6,025 and claimed in an interview this week that he had to ask people to stop sending money.

For the second poll, he asked for £2,500 but received £5,797, hitting his target in 70 minutes.

Campbell also raised just over £33,000 to pay himself a wage and plans to run a second major funding appeal to secure that salary and to pay for further projects.

Last night, a Yes Scotland spokesman said: ‘Stuart Campbell is not part of Yes Scotland and we do not have any direct contact with him.’ But he conceded that ‘as the country becomes more engaged with the independence debate, it is likely that speaking events and debates will be proposed by a variety of groups and individuals’.

He added: ‘We will continue to assess those offers on an individual basis.’

In Campbell’s orbit are lesser – but no less vociferous – cybernats.

One of them is Tommy Ball, 29, who recently called a Unionist commentator ‘Uncle Tam’ and has branded the British Army ‘scum’.

Rejecting accusations from other angry Twitter users that British soldiers had died ‘fighting for the likes of you’ in 2012, he wrote: ‘There’s no British soldier fighting for anything I believe in. Bunch of child killers.’

Ball claimed to have been an SNP organiser in Nicola Sturgeon’s former Glasgow Govan seat – but after a row over his Twitter comments, he quit the party.

Yet Ball hardly conforms, at first glance, to the stereotype of the cybernat – he’s a lab technician who lives alone in Govan.

Speaking at the door of his redbrick top-floor flat, he said he, too, has had had threats ‘levelled against me; people making threats on the internet’.

But Ball then undermined his point by claiming, implausibly, that ‘if someone is threatening on a social network, they’re not likely to pose a threat in real life’.

Andy Inglis, 53, is also an unlikely cybernat.
A tweet from his account this week to a journalist said: ‘U have won “scaring & confusing my mother wi lies & propaganda” award.

‘Uras*** of the lowest order & a disgrace 2 journalism.’

Despite his foul-mouthed remarks, Inglis, the Edinburgh- based divorced father of a teenage daughter, describes himself online as a ‘former UN & UK government official’ who has worked in more than 50 independent countries.

He seemed uncharacteristically unwilling to air his views this week, however; Inglis tweeted that he knew the Mail wanted to contact him but he failed to get in touch.

Andrew Ellis, 52, on the other hand, is proud to be called a ‘cybernat’. He is helping to promote Scottish independence – from the unlikely location of his home in Chichester, West Sussex.

Mr Ellis, a commercial manager for computing firm Hewlett Packard since November, moved from Yorkshire to his present home in 1992 with his English wife, 51-year-old Debbie. The Edinburgh- born former politics student appears to be one of the more temperate cybernats, though at times he is a near-fanatical supporter of Wings, in many of his near-17,000 tweets to about 800 followers.

He told the Mail: ‘I am not a member of the SNP or a supporter, even though I find some of what they say and do quite attractive.

‘I am not a slave to the SNP – there are 800,000 Scots living in England and I’m sure plenty of them would also want independence.’

But he conceded: ‘I appreciate some of the people on Twitter can be quite extreme and unpleasant in what they say – but that is the same from both sides.

‘There is a lot of negativity from the No camp too, which could easily be reined in as well.’

Meanwhile, back in Cumbernauld, cybernat Dolan is in reflective mood. ‘Maybe I shouldn’t have written it,’ he admits, talking about one of his more abusive tweets. ‘But you can’t go back and change it.’

It can only be hoped that other cybernats take note of that self-awareness and contrition – however belated.

But many of those who have fallen victim to their vicious broadsides are unlikely to be holding their breath.”

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    245 to “The bully pulpit”

    1. G. Campbell says:

      “As far as I’m aware, I’ve never been to Denny in my life.”

      Sue them.

    2. Juteman says:

      We are at war. The enemy needs to be de-humanised.
      We are the ‘gooks’.

    3. gordoz says:

      What can we say – when you control press coverage you can write what you like, paint it whatever way you want.

      Was going to say shocking, but its actually sad, very, very sad a significant number of Scots will read this take it in and believe.

      Desopite the fact its message derives from beyond Scotland and the smoking gun is stashed deep inside Westminster control of power, lobbying, media etc etc etc.

      Will Scots wake up and shake off this zombie media malaise ?? Christ I hope so

    4. Pedro says:

      An awful rag.

    5. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Sue them.”

      I’m not sure saying someone’s from Denny is technically defamatory 😀

    6. Peter A Bell says:

      I can’t believe The Mail ignored me! I’ve got a bloody award! – https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10347839/cybernat_of_the_year.jpg

    7. Andy Ellis says:

      As one of those outed as issuing “vicious broadsides” (really?… I couldn’t say it was my usual MO, tho’ granted I’ve certainly been known to dish it out when I felt it was justified!) I can only echo the sentiments expressed by many fellow pro-independence supporters online. I won’t be intimidated by the forces of darkness directing the gutter press and their cowed fellow travellers in the No camp. My thoughts on it are expressed in my first blog, which no doubt anyone interested in the rantings of a vicious “cabernat” will be able to find!

    8. david says:

      ahem, ive not recieved my ticket for the orgy yet.

    9. November13 says:

      Surely this is defamation of character.It’s dangerous as the crazy ultra unionists out there.Will now have their bigotry and anti Scottishness legitimized by the msm.Think it’s one for the press complaints commission to look at.You now wonder how many of the journalists out there are hard line unionists in disguise.It’s easy to present yourself as a respectable moderate person in your job.I know people in my field who are hard line unionists when not at work.

    10. Kenny Ritchie says:

      Will the Kool-aid be on you Rev?

    11. Think of it as free advertising Stu.

      Watch your on-line presence soar to even greater heights. 😉

    12. Sandy says:

      Are we entering the “then they come to fight you” phase of your Ghandi quote ?

      Next stop, victory !

    13. TheGreatBaldo says:

      Typo’s too….

      Wings has grown into something of a cult –

      Pretty certain that’s spelt with an ‘n’ 😉

      Yer just Denny’s answer to David Koresh really

    14. Swello says:

      (Although it’s not funny for the people that are being named), that reads more like the Daily Mash than the Daily Mail – I laughed out loud at some of the over the top language. Do even people that read the Mail really take this stuff seriously?

    15. orkers says:

      No doubt ” your’e not a very nice person” would be construed by the Daily Mail as an incitement to violence?

      Touchy souls in “Better Together” after all.

    16. Jimsie says:

      Am I excused the Daily Hate Mails vitriol as I do not use Facebook or Twitter?. Seems to me that this right wing rag is spreading more poison than anyone on the internet.

    17. Desimond says:

      Stu Campbell…He’s an utter Cult but hes our Cult!

      Have we now officially moved into the “and then they fight you” phase?

    18. jingly jangly says:

      I would like to make it clear that my Computer is in my living room, the comment that we are all hidden in our lonely bedrooms is clearly an attempt to suggest that we are all sad individuals with no mates who spent most of our time on porn sites and are all probably paedophiles!!!!

      However I forgive them, As Oscar Wilde said
      “Always forgive your enemies, nothing annoys them so much”

    19. The Penman says:

      This was one of my favourite bits:

      “And some, like Jason Dolan, rail against the UK Government, while openly admitting they depend on its benefits system.”

      That’s the benefits system controlled by the government in Westminster instead of Holyrood? Which, I don’t know, might be the crux of the issue that Jason supports?

    20. Ericmac says:

      “A retired oil executive, a jobless man of 41 who lives with his mum and a Bath-based video games writer.”

      Stu, you have a busy household. 🙂 It’s a weird set-up.

    21. John says:

      Very disappointed I never made the list, after all, I’ve been blocked by suck worthies as Jim #bedroomtaxvote Murphy and Michael Kelly. And I’m sure that Anas Sarwar tried to get me kicked off twitter.

    22. creigs1707repeal says:

      Just think Stu, that’s 100,000 Wings Over Scotland adverts. Bring it on.

    23. Desimond says:

      Ghandi quote cap doffed to Sandy…couldnt see Cimments on phone here

    24. david says:

      and whats wrong with sad individuals with no mates like? we can vote too you know.

    25. November13 says:

      Most of the racists in my work if not all of them.Are also Unionists.You know the anti immigrant types we all have to put up with.I just leave the room when they spew their venom.I am a third generation Scot from Eire.Scottish and proud and they will never understand people like me.They want us all to tow the line for Queen and country.

    26. Les Wilson says:

      The Mail feels it is the almighty and obviously quite proud of being an extremely BIAS, Maybe the Mail will be banned for sale in Scotland after we are INDEPENDENT!
      Who needs their low standards of, well, everything.

    27. david says:

      would love to know how many people who read this article and check out wings will convert to yes.

    28. joe kane says:

      Publishing a person’s mugshot, along with enough personal details so that they can be tracked down without too much effort, is a traditional tactic used by far-right groups. It’s not an example of liberal democracy in action but an attack on it. It’s also like putting a target on someone’s back. It’s disgraceful.

      Now peaceful, law-abiding supporters of Scottish independence know what peaceful, law-abiding Romanians must have felt like in 1939 when the owner of the Daily Mail urged Hitler to go after them as well –

      When Rothermere urged Hitler to invade Romania
      http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1484647/When-Rothermere-urged-Hitler-to-invade-Romania.html

    29. Ericmac says:

      The mail ‘name and shame’ strategy is not the one off idea of the journalist, who genuinely thought he had a scoop.

      This is a deliberate attempt to ‘devalue’ the information on the web. There is a lot of ‘behind the scenes’ activity that we may never come to know about.

      If anyone thinks this is purely coincidental and unconnected to the YES and Truth zeitgeist on the net, think again.

    30. creigs1707repeal says:

      When historians look back fifty years from now and reflect upon this referendum campaign, they will write how a rag-tag army of citizen journalists and passionate Scots utilising the internet as their means of communicating and organising brought down the might of the British state.

      The state may have power over the printed and broadcast media, but it cannot control the internet. That loss of control (mind control by the thought police) is what they are most afraid of. It is where they are losing the battle and they really don’t like it.

    31. Alex Taylor says:

      @ Peter Bell

      And richly deserved it was too, Peter.

      Love your work and keep it up>

      Alex

    32. beachthistle says:

      Hey ho. It was only a matter of time before we became the ‘enemy within’, the ‘other’. This just shows how rattled the UK state/establishment, via its bully-boy megaphone the Daily Mail, is.

      I don’t feel intimidated by me being ‘outed’/’othered’ – more amused at the amateurish nature of it – and the fact that the tweets they quoted are, very appropriately, me calling the editor of the “Scottish’ Daily Mail “a shit of the lowest order and a disgrace to journalism”!

      Because of it happening I also feel more convinced that YES are on the road to winning – NO wouldn’t have done this if their private polling numbers looked good or if they felt that social media wasn’t having a positive effect re getting facts and information out, and playing a big role in the ‘normalising’ of being pro-YES, their biggest fear…

    33. Dave McEwan Hill says:

      TheGreatBaldo at 11.21
      “nult” What the hell’s that?

    34. Famous15 says:

      The Daily Mail has overdone this story. Most people are aware that the internet is anonymous and therefore the true beliefs of a Tweeter are unknown. This allows for mischief but that is quite unlike the sinister language used in the press. There is something more worrying about the Mail’s cyberwatch. Where do they go from here? They demonise many mainstream supporters of independence. Is democracy itself their next target?

    35. It’s all grist to the mill. My hit rate has gone mental since I put it up, lots more people now know where to find the truth online.

      The friends and acquaintances of those named in this hilariously OTT tripe will know them for what they are – ordinary Scots from all walks of life who happen to support independence and can work a computer. Not some malevolent, bullying mob or cult, and yet more Unionist & MSM credibility is washed down the toilet.

    36. Ericmac says:

      @creigs1707repeal

      You are right. We are up against the establishment, a homogenous body who want to keep control at all costs.

      I still think the idea for everyone to adopt a wings style logo is a good one.

    37. Ewan MacKenzie says:

      Les Wilson says:

      Maybe the Mail will be banned for sale in Scotland after we are INDEPENDENT!

      Oh, don’t be silly. There will be no banning.

      Who needs their low standards of, well, everything.

      Well, nobody does. But we’ll still live in a free country, and people will still be free to waste their money on vacuous pap like the Mail if that’s what they want to do.

    38. Sutherland says:

      Surely Rev all the Mail’s “journalist” had to do was Wiki you for better research than they seem to have done 🙂

    39. Randomscot says:

      Iä Iä fhtagn! Ph’nglui mglw’nafh Campbell Bath wgah’nagl fhtagn!

      They are preaching to the choir. No one who does not already think this way will read it.

    40. Robin Ross says:

      Denny was one of the places of refuge for those seeking justice in the Middle Ages, but the irony of linking Rev Stu to the place will be lost on the Daily Mail reader.

      Unpleasant as it is, and it may be a real threat to the well being of those named in the article, this Mail campaign is yet another distraction from the core issues and principles at the heart of the independence/self-determination debate. Issues of currency, defence etc. can only logically follow an agreement on the right (or otherwise) of a country to run its own affairs.

      The recent Newsnight by-election programme, Question Time and the Radio Scotland morning forays into the debate seems to be fixated on the practicalities or the periphery rather than principles. And the way these issues are presented is in the form of statement, assertion or non-sequitor to previous points. As long as people are kept away from the notion that real countries govern themselves there will be no serious debate.

      In that case we may all be heading for Denny.

    41. tiderium says:

      My mind has went blank, what was that big , nay huge thing all the papers went through for months? surely this breaches some form of press regulations somewhere. The press are guilty as sin and act as a law unto themselves. I say the people pictured should all take a class action law suit out against the paper/hack who wrote that. especially naming Mr Ellis’ wife Debbie and his place of work, sorry everyone’s place of work. They are dangerous I openly challenge them to print the ones you’ve found from better together.

    42. gillie says:

      So counter productive, because this type of reporting will just escalate the bitterness.

      Scotland riven by this sort of journalism will not be as one after the referendum.

      As we have seen this week the Scottish media are only reporting and broadcasting one side of the debate, they fear the impact of social media.

      So we have to support the people being wrongly accused by the Daily Mail. There accusers should be outed. Who are these these journalists?

    43. Dal Riata says:

      (Takes deep breath. Counts to ten. Tries to calm down. Fails)

      I try not to swear too often in comments and posts online. But sometimes, just sometimes, things are printed and said that drive you over the edge.

      The Daily Mail and its fake ‘journalists’ – a far right-wing poisonous, hate-filled, steaming pile of toxic shite that employs and pays a bunch of pathetic, useless cunts to lie, smear and poison society… Fuckers the lot of them!

      May I be around to witness the day that the Daily Mail dies a horrible painful death as it collapses and dies and those who accept payment from it are dumped on the scrapheap for life. Amen to that.

    44. Simon "CyberfNat" King says:

      One might enquire if Graham Grant is resident in Scotland or if the process of “dialogue” that the Mail is proposing requires a Scottish Labour or Tory membership card to comment. The Scottish Dail Mail is making this very nasty, quickly and is using words strongly reminiscent of dear, old Joe McCarthy at his finest. How can we respond?

    45. Bill McLean says:

      Has anyone informed that rag of the paper delivered in the HOuse of Commons by Dr Shephard?

    46. Murray McCallum says:

      I hope The Mail’s smears against individuals daring to get to the truth about Scottish independence continue to be a good source of who to ‘follow’ on twitter.

      I wonder if New OneNation Scottish Labour folks are starting to wonder how Ed’s dad and cybernats appear to be getting the same treatment from this right wing rag.

    47. scottish_skier says:

      A retired oil executive, a jobless man of 41 who lives with his mum and a Bath-based video games writer.

      Quite a ragtag army then.

      I’d advise cybernats to cross the street if they see an old lady with a blue rinse emerging from the newsagent armed with a copy of the latest Mail. A brolly can be a deadly weapon in the wrong hands.

    48. liz says:

      I’m glad you have the courage to find it amusing but in fact it’s a complete disgrace.

      How dare they name ordinary members of the public who are posting perfectly reasonable comments.

      Whatever happened to the Hutton report – this surely must be a shoe-in for a PCC complaint.

      They are trying to shut-up the opposition.

      Can this country sink any lower?

      What I assume they are doing is to try to get folk angry – to provoke a response which might be criminal

    49. gillie says:

      Graham Grant should be ashamed for producing such gutter journalism.

    50. Cath says:

      There are central figures who spur on or co-ordinate this activity, binding them together and providing inspiration and moral support.”

      My God, they have the internet and network theory is coming into play! The bastards.

    51. JLT says:

      Stuart, ignore it mate. Shake your head, and just concentrate on your excellent website. We back you mate …all the way.

      This is nothing more than your good self and a few others being tried, judged and condemned in a media kangaroo court.
      Even if you managed to get an apology out of them, it will appear as a wee box on page 33 on the paper.

      From every article I have ever read on the Wings site for the last two years, I have read nothing except the god’s honest truth. If this is ‘Democracy’, then god help us if we should lose it!
      I wonder about how the UK will be in the next two to three years under a UKIP-Tory setup. How many more freedoms could go once we exit the EU? What EU laws that protected workers rights and our freedoms will be ended at a stroke of a pen? Sillars warned the other night that those who vote ‘No’ will ‘bitterly regret it’. I agree with him in more ways than one.

      Returning to this site. Just thinking of all the usual suspects who come here; some whom I have met, some whom I have never met but happily corresponded with. I have never found any of them to be other than honest, free-thinking, enlightened, full of integrity and have shown no signs of racism or bigotry to anyone. I wonder if the Mail can say the same about it’s own opinion page, or the comments that follow some articles. The Mail should hang its head in shame.

      Stuart …you have my sympathies. It’s a disgrace that this has happened to you. To print your name and picture, when you have done absolutely nothing wrong reveals the very nature of what has become of the UK nation.

      However, cheer up, mate. You are today’s news. Tomorrow, no one will remember. By next week …Stuart who?

      But we will remember. We have now been shown to what level the ‘No’ mob and the Unionist setup will go to. I hope our Nation votes ‘Yes’ on the 18th of September, and then finally …finally …we are free of this toxic poison that has encapsulated the United Kingdom these last 30 years.

    52. Dal Riata says:

      As I said on another thread: The Leveson Inquiry… mind ae that?… What was the point of it again?

    53. tiderium says:

      thanks liz the hutton report.

    54. Billy Ross says:

      Hmm, if Scots are ‘racist’ Brits because they want separation from THIS union, are the English ‘racist’ Europeans because they want separation from THAT union?

    55. JLT says:

      Jingly Jangly says:

      I would like to make it clear that my Computer is in my living room…

      Well, mines is in my study. Seriously …what’s next? Dawn raids and the removal of our IT Kit just so we can’t correspond!

      Yep …democracy in the UK 2014.

    56. Janine says:

      Long time reader, first time commenter 🙂

      I just realised how effective this campaign is – I seriously considered NOT sharing something on Facebook lest they turn up on my doorstep.

      Well played, Unionists, but it won’t work.

    57. Iain says:

      Isn’t this just the sort of despicable, amoral journalism which brought about the Leveson Enquiry?

    58. Futureproof says:

      Cumbernauld’s not in Dunbartonshire, East or West. Unless you’re talking about the Lieutenancy of Dunbartonshire. But they aren’t, they just aren’t professional enough to bother checking simple facts. What was that about people not living in Scotland commenting on the referendum?

    59. Ann says:

      If as the Mail says that what we are doing is bullying and I myself personally have been affected by this and simply for having a different opinion about my local football team, you have to say “Why have the police not visited my door and arrested me for breaking the law”.

      As I see it the people breaking the law are the Owners of this paper who send journalists un-announced to ordinary citizens doors who have a different opinion to them, then print their photographs and then print disparaging remarks

      Our media have no souls or morals. They should be down right ashamed of themselves.

    60. G. Campbell says:

      “Last night, a Yes Scotland spokesman said”

      Idiots.

    61. rabb says:

      I think what the Daily Mail and other rags forget to take into account is that very very few people in Scotland actually care what they write. It is still right & proper that they are filleted as they clearly have been above.

      They are intimidating no one other than those politicos who choose to be upset by it.

      My cynicism radar is working overtime though. I suspect there is more to this article than simply outing “Cybernats”!

    62. Helena Brown says:

      As an Auld Cybernat I am quite angry that they missed me out.Here I am a sensible wee woman who has written a lot of comments from my laptop in the living room. I do try and not abuse anyone, some people are quite sensitive and take the wrong opinion, but I have noticed that those who have a different view of the world from me are seldom careful of my feelings.

    63. HandandShrimp says:

      It is particularly ironic as the Mail is one of the most poisonous and creepy papers in the country.

      However we can determine from the article that Yes supporters are a homogeneous group of retired, working, unemployed, middle class, working class, rich, poor, single, married, divorced, parents, childless, young, middle aged, old, male, female, native Scots, new Scots.

      Well I am glad that has been nailed down.

    64. CameronB says:

      Down with this sort of thing!

    65. Croompenstein says:

      @Rev As posted in another article, when it comes to the mass suicide remember and not use paracetamol but barbiturates – see you tuesday at Bellahouston oh great leader

    66. Franariod says:

      Wow, didnt realise I was a cult follower. The poor deluded brain washed, ignorant individual that I am . Hmmm sounds like iv just described BT

    67. Betsy says:

      It does make you wonder if all the pro-Yes online activity is having more of an effect than any of us realise.

    68. gerry parker says:

      My wife bought the rag by mistake this morning. As I was reading the article, I couldn’t help seeing a picture of a man at a podium, bashing his fist up and down, ejecting specks of spittle from his mouth as he ranted away to a delighted audience…

    69. Les Wilson says:

      One idea that could solve this is to ask visitors to add to a roll of people who have read the Mail stuff and have decided to join YES. Wait for a bit until you are satisfied with numbers. Then send the numbers to the MAIL and thank them for promoting INDY.

      I am guessing that if the numbers were high enough, they would no longer promote INDY in this way, for fear of adding evermore to YES!

    70. Croompenstein says:

      @JLT says @11.51 – very well said JLT I agree wholeheartedly hopefully normal people will see through this

    71. Cindie aka CR says:

      Intimidation, bullying and bile. No wonder Scots tell the polsters that they don’t know how they’ll be voting rather than admit to yes. Rev Stu, Melissa, Brendan, Andrew, Jason, Andy and Tommy, you have my sympathy and support.

    72. Tattie-bogle says:

      They would be as well printing the biggest threat to the Union is the “jew” (stroke through thingy) “Evil cybernats” They really are pushing for trouble these bastards I don’t think they will be happy until some blood is spilled on either side.

    73. CameronB says:

      “I wonder about how the UK will be in the next two to three years under a UKIP-Tory setup. How many more freedoms could go once we exit the EU? What EU laws that protected workers rights and our freedoms will be ended at a stroke of a pen?”

      At last, a law to stop almost anyone from doing almost anything
      http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/06/law-to-stop-eveyone-everything

    74. Heather McLean says:

      Thanks Daily Mail! Ive just added all these evil cybernats to my follow list on Twitter! 😉

    75. Heather McLean says:

      Who said there’s no such thing as bad publicity?

    76. Bill C says:

      I have just tweeted two of the people named to offer my support and solidarity to all those who have been smeared. I also offer my unqualified support to you Stu, the work you do is immensely important in our struggle to achieve self determination for our country. The Daily Mail is now down there with Der Stummer in the sewer of journalism. This attack on Scots who have done nothing more than express their opinions that Scotland should be an independent country is utterly vile. It is also an indication of the fear at the heart of the British Establishment and the depths they are willing to plumb. Unfortunately this is only the start of the dirty tricks/black ops. We should be prepared for much worse to come.

    77. jingly jangly says:

      What about
      these mugs, maybe time for us all to get one!!!

      http://caledoniamugs.com/cybernat_invasion.html

    78. velofello says:

      A nasty piece of work by Mr Graham Grant. The piece on fund raising did cause me to smile. I willingly contribute to Wings in order to access news and information not available from MSM and the BBC. And of course I now enjoy a worthwhile saving through no longer being a BBC customer nor buying Unionist newspapers.I wonder if Mr Grant thought that one through? Payments in the past to the MSM now being directed to on-line blogs.

      i listened to the BBC Scotland GMS interview with Prof. Robertson of West of Scotland Uni this morning. Odd that Prof Robertson felt the need to declare that he wasn’t a nationalist.

    79. Atypical_Scot says:

      Come on cybernats, don’t hide behind avatars, stand up and be bullied off the web like a brave Scot?

      We are one big happy family with no exceptions – apart from ****** ***.

      Gutter press saturation levels high.

      Go.sub60.

    80. Murray McCallum says:

      With regard the ‘Reverend’ Stuart Campbell, have the Mail enlisted the support of Mariano Rajoy in this apparent inquisition?

    81. Grumpomcchief says:

      Me Thinks you protest too much. Not because I disagree with your views but I think its usually better to ignore idiotic statements which are not worth arguing about. I gave up reading halfway through the piece. Too long too verbose.

    82. Training Day says:

      This simply shows we are winning, and they are losing. And they know it. Received yet more anecdotal evidence last night (I was actually out and not hunched over a computer in my bedroom) that more and more people are going to vote Yes.

      Streicher’s ‘Der Sturmer’ lives on in 2014. The Daily Mail of course has always aspired to out and out Fascism, as its support for Mosely and Hitler demonstrated. Jim Murphy, much beloved of the Daily Mail, must be proud.

      How long before the UnBritish Activities Committee convenes, with Murphy or Ian Davidson in the chair? Roland Freisler, eat your heart out.

    83. HandandShrimp says:

      Pity the Daily Fail is too cowardly to put this article on line.

    84. John grant says:

      The daily Heil , what a disgraceful article . Fuck them rev keep doing what your doing , without sites like yours I think I would drown in the sea of bullshit masquerading as journalism in this stinking rotten corrupt union , let’s get the fuck out before it’s to late , apologies to mail readers for the industrial language , aye right .

    85. Tattie-bogle says:

      They will be round in trucks picking up the cybernats to take them to re-unionfication camps there you will be forced to listen to fran and anna and made to watch supergran until they squeeze the jock right oot ye.

      To gain your release will depend on a test which will involve you watching Brigadoon and writing an historical thesis on how Scotland really is and none of that fake tosh from the internet.

    86. Graham Paterson says:

      The issue with the Mail has finally made me want to put my head above the parapet. Have been long time viewer and have sent the odd tweet but have never posted here before.

      I believe in a free press but there needs to be culpability against gutter journalism.

    87. ScottishLeaf says:

      I’m sure Wings has a bigger circulation than the Daily Mail anyway!
      I hope Police Scotland and the NHS invoice the Mail should any of these people come to harm.
      Oh! They should also at note Cumbernauld is in Lanarkshire.

    88. Dick Gaughan says:

      I wouldn’t lose much sleep over this crud.

      In the course of my lifetime, the Mail has run similar witchhunts against Peace campaigners (“proto-communists and long-haired weirdos”), Gay people, Transexual people (“weird deviants”), Communists, Folksingers (“anarchist and communist subversives funded by Moscow Gold”), Arthur Scargill (“megalomaniac funded by Gaddafi”), the NUM (“the enemy within”), any group of workers taking industrial action, feminists, Irish people (“all terrorists who simply hate Britain”) and also include in that category (Irish people) anyone opposing British domination anywhere on the planet. In fact, anyone to the Left of Attila the Hun on any issue the Mail disapproves of.

      In its favour, it has to be pointed out that the DM has fearlessly supported such champions of Free Speech and Democracy as Adolph Hitler, Franco, Salazar, Pinochet, Marcos, The Shah of Iran and a long list of similar that the Colonel Blimps (Rtd) of Basingstoke and Maidstone agree with.

      The DM is a foul reactionary abcess on the arse of humanity. Lampoon and/or ignore as you see fit.

    89. Desimond says:

      “A retired oil executive, a jobless man of 41 who lives with his mum and a Bath-based video games writer.”

      Worst sit-com ever or the next movie from Simon Pegg and Nick Frost.

    90. HandandShrimp says:

      Jingly Jangly

      LOL

      A company that makes a range of mugs has included CyberNat ones. If that doesn’t tell the Mail we are mainstream I don’t know what does. The CyberNat joke is on Foulkes and the Mail. It isn’t a term of disapprobation it is a term to wear with pride.

    91. a supporter says:

      Just be thankful that this is happening now. A few years ago The Hate Mail would have been hacking your telephones to try and find some ‘dirt’.

    92. liz says:

      Sorry – getting my reports mixed up.

    93. annie says:

      I wouldn’t know for sure as I don’t read the Daily Mail but I bet they were spouting their outrage when Managers at the oil refinery were being door stepped by the Union activists a few weeks ago.

    94. Wayne says:

      If I was one of the people castigated in this article I’d be off to see my lawyer pronto. This is taking demonisation of the pro-independence cause to new depths, who as far as the Mail is concerned are on a par with dirty immigrants and sexual perverts. I don’t know how they will cope if Scotland votes YES. Has counselling been booked for them in advance?

    95. HandandShrimp says:

      To be fair if this site was not working they would not have mentioned us. The fact that you have Unionists like McColm yelling “No fucking way!” on Twitter (somehow accidentally missed by the Mail) upon hearing our poll was going to be discussed on TV tells us that the toe of our boot hits part of the crotch that other boots fail to reach,

    96. Murray McCallum says:

      “Worst sit-com ever or the next movie from Simon Pegg and Nick Frost.”

      Excellent.

    97. HandandShrimp says:

      Wayne

      If we vote Yes the fair and reasonable Mail will be demanding martial law and all nationalists rounded up and put in concentration camps.

    98. joe kane says:

      Craig Murray’s witty send-up of how the media tries to prove the existence of hidden networks of organised evil in society (such as Al Quaeda terrorists or Cybernat extremists) using the BBC’s ludicrous security correspondent Frank Gardner as an example –

      …Gardner was at it again tonight with a graphic to explain the latest ludicrous claims. How do they know there are 2,000 terrorists, he asked? Well, they can’t tell us because it’s intelligence, he explained. But the helpful graphic fills the screen, with hundreds of sinister black silhouettes of unknown terrorists, interconnected by numerous black lines indicating networks, nodes and axes of evil. And to explain it all, every so often, there was a not blacked out figure, a suicide bomber or, glowering at us, Osama Bin Laden. Of course!! That’s the evidence!! There really are thousands of them.
      I was going to retaliate by producing a graphic of thousands of sinister silhouettes linked by criss-crossing lines, and dotted among them Goebbels, Hitler, Attila the Hun, Stalin, Mao and Frank Gardner. But I can’t be bothered…

      http://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2007/11/frank_goebbels/

    99. teechur says:

      I’m thinking it’s time to have some t-shirts made!

      http://i40.tinypic.com/yfmnc.png

      Just a thought!

    100. Wayne says:

      I have to add however that some of your Twitter rants Stuart don’t really do yourself any favours. Arguing with the sorts of people you do it is totally understandable that sometimes you need to let loose, it is entirely human as you say, but it does provide ammunition for those who would wish to discredit you and this site, which is a shame as it might to some extent take the shine off all the brilliant stuff that appears here.

    101. Steve Bowers says:

      Ooooh, should I bring a friend to the orgy or just WING it, help me o great one, advise a simple soul like myself, and do we have to bring our own “tablets” of death as well cos they can be damned expensive you know !
      I hope those “outed” people don’t suffer any sort of backlash from passing numpties

    102. mogabee says:

      I can see now where I have been going wrong…

      I’m obviously just not “humfy backit” enough to be included in the DM “lists”!

      Oh well. Never mind. Too bad.

    103. creigs1707repeal says:

      @Teechur

      Shouldn’t that be: ‘The needs of Scotland outweight the neds of the Daily Mail – Proud Cybernat’?

    104. HandandShrimp says:

      Joe

      Isn’t that what that Fox News loon used to do. With lots of loaded sentences ending with pregnant pauses and “Go Figures”. The BBC has become Fox News…LOL 🙂

      Chris Morris and The Day Today was not comedy it was a premonition.

    105. John-P says:

      This has probably been posted on here before , if so apologies in advance! A nice song about the odious rag. Remember, trees died so that bile could be printed!!

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eBT6OSr1TI

    106. Papadocx says:

      They are trying to stir up anti Scottish venom down south, and in the good old colonist right wingers at home, even the red ones. Hope they don’t wind up and back up the good old BNP, EDL etc. Just keep attacking Scotland and it’s people for wanting to run their own we country. What vile sick individuals. Why should I want to get involved with people like that.

      Just listened to Brian’s big debate on iplyer for yesterday.

      David Mundell — waste of space score zero
      Drew Smith ——- enough said. Score zero
      Patrick Harvie —- excellent. Score 98%
      Paul Wheelhouse- VG. Score 90%

      Audience very good. Except for a couple of SLAB sea lions

      We win this yin hawns doon. Toodaloothenoo.

    107. Early Ball says:

      @mogabee

      See what happens when you have excellent posture!

    108. Kendomacaroonbar says:

      This is the unacceptable face of democracy.

      I will not be cowed and I will not be bullied.

    109. Alba4Eva says:

      We need to take and own the term Cybernat.
      Just like black Americans took and own the word ‘nigger’…

      So fellow Cybernats… Cybernat T Shirts, badges etc. Take the power back.

    110. Dal Riata says:

      The front page of today’s (Poisonous) Scottish Daily Mail has on its front page:

      As Mail unmasks cybernat trolls and Sturgeon condemns internet abuse, prosecutors warn:

      FIVE YEARS IN JAIL FOR THE ONLINE BULLIES

      Exclusive by Graham Grant Home Affairs Editor

      I can’t make out what is said from then on (it’s on someone’s Twitter account), but it’s basically an intro to pages two and three which are those shown at the top of this article.

      Headline writers, eh, where would the MSM be without them!:

      “unmasks cybernat trolls” – Trolls don’t normally use their real names. Numpties! How can you “unmask” someone who uses their own name? It’s just an excuse to put people’s faces in print so that they can be vilified… Oh, right. Bastards!

      “Sturgeon condemns internet abuse” – Well, yes, and quite rightly. She was, though, alluding to the amount of abuse that comes from Britnatnutters online, rather than that from Cybernats. Your association with Sturgeon condemning Cybernat abuse is a misleading and false one. Misrepresentation and misinformation!

      “prosecutors warn” – Who are these prosecutors? Sorry, can’t hear you!

      “FIVE YEARS IN JAIL FOR THE ONLINE BULLIES” – Really? Okay. Let’s start with the Daily Mail’s own commenters BTL and then see what the Britnatnutters are saying on the likes of Twitter, shall we? Hypocrites!

      Graham Grant “Home Affairs Editor”… [Sigh!]

    111. Norrie says:

      You need one yellow duster, 3 safety pins and a pair of scissors. Cut out a large capital ‘C’ with scissors use safety pins to attach to jacket, coat etc and wear when ever out in public.

    112. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “I can’t make out what is said from then on (it’s on someone’s Twitter account), but it’s basically an intro to pages two and three which are those shown at the top of this article.”

      Logic’s Rock has published the whole article. It’s linked in this piece.

    113. creigs1707repeal says:

      One man’s terrorist is another man’s cybernat.

    114. Albalha says:

      FYI

      Point 40 on Context and Approach interesting.

      http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/a_to_c/communications_sent_via_social_media/

    115. Cath says:

      Just thinking, Melissa tweeted this morning she might take legal action. I’d be up for chucking a bit into a crowd-funder to help pay. Seems like something that, although it’s only one or two people picked out here, it’s really aimed against all supporters of independence. I know nothing about the law or whether there’d be a case, out it seems to me like intimidation, harassment and libel.

    116. Arbroath 1320 says:

      JKust so I’m correct this is from the Daily Mail itself, not made up.

      In a show of defiance, they have even produced their own ‘cybernat’ logo for online use.

      Well dear Daily Mail reader, should you ever screw up your internet navigation and land on this site can I just say that as per usual the Daily Mail are only telling you a HALF TRUTH.

      We have, according to the Daily Mail, our own logo, but what they conveniently FORGOT to tell you is that we have our own song as well! 🙂

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8KAUijtdHw

      How can anyone believe a newspaper that only tells half the story? 🙂

    117. HandandShrimp says:

      What is the bet that the first to get arrested will be Brit Nats and the Mail will sit huffing and puffing and sucking its cheeks (upper ones).

    118. Alba4Eva says:

      “I AM CYBERNAT!”

    119. creigs1707repeal says:

      Whatever happened to the woman who assaulted the elderly YES supporter in Edinburgh? Did she ever appear in the news or in court for that matter? Anyone know?

    120. Patrician says:

      This is just the start, it is going to get a lot worse from now onwards. The Britnats control the distribution of information apart from the Internet. The Arab Spring showed how important the Internet is for distributing information, so now they are trying to control the Internet. To all those doorstepped by the Mail don’t get disheartened, we are winning and that is why they are coming to fight.

    121. heedtracker says:

      So now, if you’re a YES vote, journalists may find out where you live, doorstep you, photograph you then attack you in their newspapers.

      I know journalists from school and uni and socially but after all this I doubt I could even be in the same room as these people. This is a very dark day for freedom of speech and Scottish democracy.

    122. Christian Wright says:

      Now where does the author and the editor of this scurrilous defamatory article live? Clearly he thinks the public has a right to know – at least the right to know the location of others.

      With whom does HE live? Does he live alone? If he does, what does that say about him? Where was HE born? Would he think it fine were strangers to knock on HIS door or otherwise invade his privacy and demand answers to personal questions?

      Make no mistake about it, this crawling thing and his employer are engaged in a witch hunt.

      What is HIS marital status? Has he ever been unemployed? Has he ever lived with his mother?. Has he ever been divorced? Has he ever been in receipt of state benefit? Will HE have a vote in the referendum. Why would not having a vote disqualify advocacy? How would such information be relevant unless you goal is to injure and defame?

      Did he or anyone else involved in the construction of this potentially dangerous polemic, violate any privacy law or governing code of ethics in the gathering any of the personal information made public?

      Particularly troubling was his inclusion of information about the age and sex of an innocent child and of a frail and vulnerable elderly person victimised in this deliberately provocative piece; a piece that is clearly designed to rouse the ire of those inadequates who share the author’s extreme views and penchant for thuggery. A piece that could easily put his victims and their innocent loved-ones in harms way.

      This isn’t journalism, nor the work of an ethical man, nor even a rat, for there are some things you just can’t get a rat to do.

    123. heedtracker says:

      From an Observer report last October and how the “voice of middle England” pays tax. Profit taking in the UK, pay your taxes in Bermuda and Jersey, attack democracy in Scotland.
      http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/oct/05/daily-mail-poor-example-says-headteacher

      Investigations by the Observer have revealed that all of the voting shares in the DMGT, the floated company that owns both the papers, have been acquired by a financial vehicle called Rothermere Continuation Limited. RCL, which operates for the benefit of Viscount Rothermere, DMGT chairman, recently bought the remaining 11% of voting shares in the trust that it did not already own. According to a declaration made to the stock exchange in August, RCL “is a holding company incorporated in Bermuda.

      Both Bermuda and Jersey are tax havens which, as the Mail explained in a recent article, are a “scourge” which “costs Britain billions”. While there is no suggestion of any impropriety, the complicated offshore ownership structure sits uncomfortably with the paper’s reputation for being the voice of Middle England

    124. Paul says:

      We should all comment on the daily mail stories with I am proud to be a cybernat I have but put cybergnat to see if they notice.

    125. alexicon says:

      The ENGLISH based newspaper…sorry gutter press, claims some cybernats don’t even stay in Scotland.
      Boy that’s rich coming from the daily heil.

      You look handsome Rev.

      Time to get some stickers made and place where people will see them?

    126. Geoff Huijer says:

      I don’t find any of the Mail’s article funny.

      It is deeply depressing.

      To see this type of demonisation of ordinary people
      is deeply, deeply disturbing; it really is the stuff
      of Nazi Germany.

      I stopped reading online newspaper sites a long time ago
      as I felt the likes of Grahamski, Fifi La Bonbon, Terry Kelly,
      and John McIntyre OBE were so myopic, arrogant and fixed in their views that ‘debate’ was never possible. I am certainly not interested in reading or ‘listening’ to anyone who is unable to see the hypocrisy in their own rantings.

      I think this Daily Mail article has crossed a line.

      Nothing, of course, will be done about it because it doesn’t fit the State agenda. Sad.

      I’m now away to add some of the article’s ‘accused’ on Twitter…

    127. creigs1707repeal says:

      People – especially those still undecided – want information in order that they can make an informed decision. Unfortunately, the mainstream media (print and broadcast) are providing these people with a lop-sided view of the debate and are ever careful to promote the unionist view over the independent view. Both BBC and STV have been found guilty of this unionist bias. And the press are no different.

      The undecided voter can accept what the MSM are telling them or, if they are smart, will recognise the bias being fed to them by the London-controlled MSM. What then can the undecided voter do, where can they go for the truth, for detailed analysis of the issues?

      The internet. It is the last refuge of true freedom of speech, the only place where the MSM have no control over what is presented. Thus, to gain some level of control, they try through their printed media to scare undecided people away from seeking information from the internet, a dark place where the scary cybernats reside.

      Don’t let them fool you or scare you, undecided voters. This attack on free speech and democracy itself is being perpetrated by the MSM in an attempt to demonise those who present factual information in this debate via the internet in order to deter people from seeking information there. Those who believe in a YES vote present our information on the internet only because there is no truly ‘free’ MSM left in Scotland to be our standard bearer. The internet is our only weapon of mass distribution, the only vehicle to ‘broadcast’ the YES message. This is a People’s Movement, a citizen army fighting for true freedom and democracy for Scotland. But the MSM will try to paint a dark picture of that citizen army. As I said above–one man’s terrorist is another man’s cybernat.

      You can listen to this citizen army and make up your own mind as to who you think is speaking the truth in this, Scotland’s Great Debate. One thing is for sure though in this debate, the citizen army of Scotland will not be silenced by the British state and its MSM minions.

    128. Hetty says:

      Silence your enemy, seems like this excuse for a ‘news’paper are trying to do just that.
      YES supporters need somewhere to share and distribute the truth and the right wing led msm do not like it one bit, because the message is getting through to everyone including the better together folk. The positive case for Independence is being put out and the Scottish people are listening, so the right wing and gutter press are feeling incredibly threatened. It is hard for them to contemplate the idea that England will need to grow up and change if it is a YES vote in Sept.

      The people at the helm are too comfortable in their present state of brainwashing people, and too dependant on the people staying ignorant, while filling their heads with crap on tv. Change is a good thing, as we all know, things never stay the same, so come on Daily mail, grow up and offer the people some intelligent, mature and positive options for how the future might look, the nasty idiotic bile from you is just very immature and boring, yawn!

    129. Les Wilson says:

      Christian Wright says:

      Could not agree more and could not have said it better, well said.

    130. david says:

      im absolutely over the moon, what a great feeling that a website i have donated to has got under the establishments skin, feel very proud.

    131. liz says:

      @cath – I agree about crowd funding possible legal action.
      The fact they have published photos and areas where people stay is disturbing.

      How about getting in touch with Aamer Anwar and asking his advice.
      I’ve got a feeling the DM have way overstepped the mark.

      A lot of folk who post on here are professional, educated people.

      The DM are used to demonising the poor, the sick and the unemployed – The Poor Have No Lawyers- those folk who can’t fight back – legally ‘fight’ of course in case I get accused of advocating violence.

    132. Papadocx says:

      Obviously we are doing very well and progressing nicely on our road to home rule, hence the venom, smear and scare stories, trying to shame or frighten us into keeping quiet and not spreading the truth to which this is the only answer they have. They have created a wedge which they are trying to drive between us and scare off the don’t knows to keep their heads down, shame us into denying our own country and prevent us from supporting each other in common purpose.

      WELL ALL THEY ARE DOING IS DRIVING US CLOSER TOGETHER. HOW CAN WE GET THE NON CYBERNATS TO FIND THE TRUTH WEBSITES FOR THE INFORMATION THESE PEOPLE ARE CRYING OUT FOR. THEN THE GAME WILL BE OVER. FREEDOM,

    133. callum says:

      This attack by the Daily Mail and the comments by Jim Murphy is an attack on the democratic nature by which Scotland is choosing its destiny.

      Surely the unionists understand that in general, the Scots are used to playing the underdog that is more than happy to slap an aggressor down. I don’t understand their tactics.

      I’m really surprised that Jim Murphy was daft enough to play along. He’s not thinking or retiring soon or something?

    134. Indy_Scot says:

      I am a great believer that when you start to attack the man rather than the ball, you have lost the argument.

    135. Derick faeYell says:

      ‘Graham Grant’

      Now that reminds me of ‘Frank Frazer’ (forget the creeping thing’s real name – it was in his obituary). ‘Frank’ of the Scotsman’s wee maps showing Shetland’s fake territorial waters extending to Aberdeen, and Berwick’s also extending to Aberdeen. An operative, was our ‘Frank’

      This has Security Services written all over it.

      The gradient gets a little steeper as the summit approaches. We’re winning!

      Happy to contribute to legal action

    136. Paul says:

      There is censorship going on in the tabloids my pro independence comments go to moderation in the Mail but then don’t get published and comments I have made on the Daily Record have just disappeared. This is getting like a Fascist state. As for Herr fuhrer Murphy what did he get his degree in again? It is bad enough that he and his Labour lot got funding to go to university and want to deny it to our young students but what is worse this clown wasted his funding by dropping out I think the public deserve to be told why.

    137. Richard says:

      Velofello

      I don’t know if you noticed that the interviewer caught himself linking independence campaign to alex salmond and changed it to Yes mid flow. The report from the prof clearly had some effect

    138. Ananurhing says:

      I don’t find this hilarious at all. Make no mistake, this is a pogrom. Doorstepping and demonising ordinary people because of their political leanings. Perfectly co-ordinated with Murphy’s efforts.

      Completely unacceptable. What next? Angry hoardes of orangemen smashing your windows? Kristallnicht?

      I think there’s worse to come as the Scunneristas increasingly lose the arguments.

      (Scunneristas. Thanks for that Ian Brotherhood. I just changed it a wee bit.)

    139. Roseanne says:

      I am also up for donating to help with any legal costs.

    140. @Geoff Huijer

      I do find it funny because I think I know Scots. This utterly overblown and lame attempt at bullying and intimidation of ordinary Scots by a barely post-pubescent, alco-pop swilling wee nyaff is like a red rag to a bull to a Scottish person.

      Since we’re all supposed to be in WW1 mode, think John MacLean, think Mrs Barbour’s Army. If Cybernats were on the cusp of being a bore there’s nothing like the “Hated by the Daily Mail” label to stir the soul and convince ordinary, decent people that we bring something worthwhile to the party.

      Like all bullies, he doesn’t like it up him. I’ve decorated my articles and twitter feed with a few less than flattering pics lifted from him and his wife’s FB and Twitter, which they’re now frantically deleting / securing. Invading other folk’s privacy is OK, but he doesn’t like it up him.

      How long will he last once the middle-aged and retired (the great majority of the Mail readership) realise they’ve been getting their politics from a Hooch-swilling wee nyaff who was still in short pants when Blair came to power?

      @Logicsrock

    141. Arbroath 1320 says:

      There is actually a group called ‘Orangemen for Indy’ Ananurhing so there won’t be quite as many orangemen as you first thought. 🙂

    142. Graham Paterson, you’re correct and welcome.

    143. Edward says:

      I found the Daily Mail article quite disgusting as its an attempt to pacify and bully anyone who supports independence exactly the same way as a few on the Better Together Facebook page do. I know as I, when I was able to comment, was subject to abuse and finally was blocked from any further comment.

      Its quite shocking that in a country that is supposedly very democratic, you will have those who want to stifle well informed debate and thoughts.

      What unionist and the London parties hate above all is the fact that we can circumvent the ‘normal’ media of newspaper, tv and radio and use the internet.

      You could probably chart the growth of free debate on independence and the rise in support with the start of the internet age and the spread of computers, laptops etc.

      Its no surprise that it was a unionist politician (George Foulkes) who coined the name ‘cybernat’ as a put down against anyone who dared support independence online.

      Its now hardly surprising that the number of websites supporting independence outstrip those who want to keep the union. The internet is the media of the 21st century that unionists cant control. So they resort to gutter level attacks as we see in the rag that is the Daily Mail.

      ‘Cybernat’ may have had its origins as a derogatory term from a has been Labour politician. But if that name means someone who is a proud supporter of the independence cause and the ending of the union and the UK, who read’s , listens and contributes online. Then I am very proud to state here and now MY NAME IS EDWARD BARBOUR AND I AM A CYBERNAT!

    144. Murray McCallum says:

      “… is a director of a management consultancy … living in the affluent Bruntsfield area of Edinburgh. More surprisingly, …”

      What! A successful person living in Scotland?

      An independence supporter, successful in business, a woman, and a foreigner. This ticks just about every box for the Mosley.

    145. Misteralz says:

      First time commenting here, even though I’ve been reading the site for months. This seemed an appropriate juncture for throwing my name in.

      So here goes:

      Alan Lyall, Aberdeenshire. Vociferously pro-indy.

      Proud to be hated by the Daily Heil.

    146. david says:

      hello edward, im david morgan and im a cybernat too.

    147. I particularly love the “lonely bedrooms” bit! So just who the hell was that beside me this morning? Oh aye, my good lady. As for the rest of you, if the Rev wants to set up a crowdfunder for a “help a lonely Cybernat get laid” appeal, I’ll stick a fiver in.

    148. X_Sticks says:

      @ Janine 11:57am
      “Long time reader, first time commenter :)”

      Everyone’s a bit distracted Janine, so let me welcome you to Wings. Glad to see you’ve come out to join the party. 🙂

      callum says:
      “I’m really surprised that Jim Murphy was daft enough to play along. He’s not thinking or retiring soon or something?”

      He not going to get the choice callum, that’s what is worrying him!

      BTW Stu, when’s the Bellahouston gig? 19th September?

    149. Dorothy Bruce says:

      Don’t get mad — get even.

      A very substantial amount raised in the next Wings fundraiser would be an appropriate response to the Mail.

    150. Andrew Morton says:

      If you want to know what is (at least partially) driving the Daily Mail’s campaign, then reflect on this; Paul Dacre, editor of the Daily Mail has a 15,000 acre estate near Ullapool. The Scottish Government has recently suggested that the ownership of Scotland’s land is in too few hands and there can be little doubt that if independence is achieved, something may be done about it. Go figure.

      On another tack, a couple of months ago I posted here my rules for commenting on Twitter and newspaper BTL comments. No ad hominem attacks, use people’s correct names (e.g. Anas Sarwar rather than Anus Sarwar, etc.), don’t use sweary words, counter abuse with reasoned argument. The point is that you’re not really trying to enlighten the cyberbrit who’s foaming at you, the actual audience is the bystanders who don’t comment but read what is being said. One of them made an interesting point on Wings recently, she said that it was the calm, sensible reasoning and comments of the Yes supporters on the Herald BTL comments which turned her from an Undecided to a Yes.

      If we don’t follow those rules we merely provide ammo for the right wing press to use against us.

    151. Alan Mackintosh says:

      Roddy. Your mention of John Maclean reminded me of this. Well worth a listen(and the others of course…)

      http://tonightatnoonscotland.wordpress.com/the-music/

    152. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “The point is that you’re not really trying to enlighten the cyberbrit who’s foaming at you, the actual audience is the bystanders who don’t comment but read what is being said.”

      Very much this.

    153. Dcanmore says:

      “There are central figures who spur on or co-ordinate this activity, binding them together and providing inspiration and moral support.”

      I think the whole point of this rubbish from The Daily Mail will be …

      WHAT IS ALEX SALMOND GOING TO DO ABOUT THIS!

      … that is the real target of this shitty piece, in the vain hope that someone will be exposed as a direct connection to the First Minister. For Alex Salmond to come out and condemn comments on Twitter, through Press pressure, will be seen as an admission of some twisted complicity that The Daily Mail will conflate forever. The newspaper is trying to start an avalanche that the First Minister will be buried under and therefore kill the Independence movement. This is very dark and sinister, the act of turning people into hate figures in the public eye from what is essentially a nazi-supporting jew-hating newspaper group that would have welcomed Adolf’s acolytes into Downing Street. Today this waste of trees celebrates Iain Duncan-Smith’s policies of condemning the unemployed, poor and sick as a waste of space ‘that something should be done with them’.

    154. Thanks, Alan. Great performance of Hamish Henderson’s song (that first introduced me to MacLean) by the Livingstone Bros.

    155. Flower of Scotland says:

      I would agree to crowd funding possible legal action against the DM !

      I have always wanted Independence for my country Scotland but could not find a MSM newspaper that supported my ideals. Just before Christmas I found wings, then newsnet, Bella and lots more. It was a truly wonderful feeling to find that people thought the same as me. Now never buy a newspaper and avidly read everything posted. My family do the same now and hopefully I can persuade friends to do the same . I have learned so much and feel better armed to debate about Independence.

      The Arab Spring was started by citizen journalism. I think the No side need to take a good look at itself and beware, be very careful !!

    156. Dcanmore says:

      For those who are not familiar with Paul Dacre, this is worth a read …

      http://www.newstatesman.com/media/2013/12/man-who-hates-liberal-britain

    157. Ananurhing says:

      Arbroath 1320
      “There is actually a group called ‘Orangemen for Indy’”

      Yes I know Arbroath. There’s also ‘Labour for Indy’ but I don’t think either of the established institutions have shifted their ground.

      I still remember the threats of a paramilitary response to a Yes vote. Looking at some of the unionist Twittertwats, I don’t think much has changed.

    158. Dcanmore says:

      Please people, crowd funding action against The Daily Mail will be futile unless you have millions to chuck at the action, it’s one of the largest newspaper media groups in the world that generates over a £billion per year. They will tie you up in legislation for months and drain your cash. Dacre is a dangerous nutter and British Nationalist who will take great delight in wholly crushing any moves against his newspaper and he’ll happily do it in public too.

    159. Robert Louis says:

      This is quite atrocious behaviour by the Daily hate Mail. Did leveson mean nothing to these people?? Is it business as usual for the ‘gutter snipes’ who write trash like this? The sad fact is, however, that this is a sure sign that the English establishment is feart, and know that with each passing day, despite their near total control of the mainstream media, the NO vote just keeps on slipping.

      If the anti independence campaign had a convincing and coherent argument for the union, they would have made it by now and would be riding high in the polls, yet despite having the blatantly biased BBC and every major ‘Scottish’ (but English owned and controlled) ‘news’paper in Scotland peddling their daily lies and misinformation, the NO vote just keeps on slipping.

      Now, they are trying to stifle honest debate on the internet, unless those participating agree with the English establishment narrative, that Scotland is better off being run by a parliament in another country, England. This is why they seek to demonise supporters of independence who happen to write online, because it is the one media outlet over which they do not have control.

      There is, however, an aspect of this which is worryingly dangerous, and for which we already have a precedent. Hatred of gay people in Uganda has been stirred up in recent years, by the actions of US based evangelical christians and others, to the extent that gay people are now hounded out of jobs, their homes and their families. Chief cheerleader involved in all of this barbaric behaviour however, was a newspaper in Uganda, called ‘Rolling Stone’ (no relation to the Glossy magazine from the USA). It regularly printed pages of photos, with names and addresses of those the paper ‘suspected’ of being gay. The actions of this hateful newspaper were condemned around the world, yet the effects are still being felt to this day, with horrendous consequences for those who were named. I have placed some relevant links below.

      My message to those behind this intimidatory writing in the Daily hate Mail, is simply this, look at the links below, look at where it leads, and ask yourself, is what YOU have done today in the Daily Mail any better? It is a dangerous path for any journalist to go down.

      It is truly depraved, and the lowest of the low.

      As other above have said, I will also happily contribute to crowd-funded legal fees if required to pursue this tawdry English owned ‘news’ paper. In addition, and mainly because it irks the Daily hate Mail,, the laughingly titled ‘Scotsman’ newspaper and other unionist stooges such as the BBC, I will, when it happens, be donating even more to the Wings fund this year.

      Meanwhile, the campaign to restore democracy and self rule in Scotland, continues apace.

      http://archive.is/aq88p

      http://www.latitudenews.com/story/gay-uganda-homosexuality-bill-scott-lively-evangelical-american/

      http://www.boston.com/news/world/africa/articles/2010/10/20/uganda_newspaper_lists_homosexuals/

    160. Edward says:

      Does anyone know if the Nicola Sturgeon v Margaret Curran debate on any live stream ?

    161. Dorothy Devine says:

      I am really shocked by this. If it is actionable I too will be willing to contribute.

    162. Helpmaboab says:

      The Daily Heil is clearly horrified by the sums of cash that we ‘acolytes’ have raised in the past.

      Get your credit cards ready for the big fundraiser everyone. Let’s give them a reason to be REALLY scared.

    163. Murray McCallum says:

      Misteralz
      “Proud to be hated by the Daily Heil.”

      Yes, it’s got to be one of the best clubs to be in.

    164. Andrew Morton says:

      I will, when it happens, be donating even more to the Wings fund this year.

      And so will I. That’s the best riposte you can make to the Daily Mail. It’s like when John OBE was gloating that Newsnet hadn’t made their crowd funding target back in December, we picked up on that and within 48 hours they achieved it.

      Just think how galling it will be to them when we say,

      “We’re not frightened of you and we don’t care what you print about us, it just makes us all the more determined”.

    165. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Can we expect any of the other Scottish papers to condemn this? Will we have to wait until someone is hurt or killed before this behaviour is condemned by other journalists?(And what about the NUJ?)

      BTW – a very warm welcome to all the newbies, and those who’ve posted for the first time. Great to see the numbers heading ever upwards. As Sister Sledge said, ‘We Are Family’…

    166. Albalha says:

      FYI – From the PCC code

      *Harassment

      i) Journalists must not engage in intimidation, harassment or persistent pursuit.

      ii) They must not persist in questioning, telephoning, pursuing or photographing individuals once asked to desist; nor remain on their property when asked to leave and must not follow them. If requested, they must identify themselves and whom they represent.

      iii) Editors must ensure these principles are observed by those working for them and take care not to use non-compliant material from other sources.

      http://www.pcc.org.uk/cop/practice.html

    167. muttley79 says:

      @Cath

      ‘Seems like something that, although it’s only one or two people picked out here, it’s really aimed against all supporters of independence.’

      This is it. The MSM are an integral part of Project Fear. Fear and hatred is all that the Daily Heil has to offer. We saw it with their championing of the fascist Oswald Mosley, the denigration of Jewish refugees escaping from Nazi Germany, and more recently with the disgraceful character assassination of Ralph Miliband, a man of outstanding moral stature. His son, Ed Miliband, handed the Daily Heil’s rancid backside back to them after he completely destroyed their wretched, hate filled articles. The media usually ignore the fact that Nicola Sturgeon has had death threats and people have said that they want to murder Salmond as well. This is pure propaganda, nothing more, nothing less. The start came with the attempted silencing of National Collective by Taylor, one of BT’s main donor.

    168. Davy says:

      Finally, I am a member of a cult, that will teach the moonies and the mormons to say no to me.

      In the future folks when my grandkids ask what did I do during the fight for Scotlands independence, I will proudly say ” I was a cybernat ” and we kicked the lies of U-KOK, the Daily Mail and the rest of MSM oot of Scotland.

      Next question, err Grandad whats the daily mail ???

    169. Why haven’t they done me?
      Any Mail journos reading this, I’m at derekbateman1.wordpress.com
      Please…

    170. Ted says:

      I had just turned eighteen and was able to vote in the last referendum in 1979. We DID vote for independence then but the Establishment ignored it. Please be very aware they will do anything to thwart independence. To these people the end really does justify the means!

    171. velofello says:

      Roddy MacDonald and Alan Mackintosh: many thanks for the John MacLean reference and music. I first heard the song at least 30 years back sitting in my sister’s home. “Who’s John MacLean?” was probably me and my sister’s wake up calls to Scotland’s treatment by the Establishment.

      Reference the Daily Mail article today. I don’t think there is a means to sue for libel in Scotland nor do I consider that libellous statements have been made by the Daily Mail. Defamation perhaps but noting how the police will pursue and take action against threatening internet texts should any subsequent threats or harm befall any of the persons identified in the Mail article then it would not be a cause for civil action but for incitement by the Daily Mail?

    172. Ian Brotherhood says:

      If they come to this door they will be treated to a lengthy recitation of my favourite Dadaist poetry. Before long they’ll scarper, having suddenly remembered they left the telly on.

      ‘George Melly is reputed to have recited this poem at a group of muggers who were holding him up against a wall and demanding his wallet.

      Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo Bee bee bee bee bee bee bee bee bee Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooo Zee zee zee zee zee zee zee zee zee …….

      God, who is this nutter? His assailants fled.’

      http://www.57productions.com/article_reader.php?id=11

    173. Big Jock says:

      The fact that our glorious majesty,s armed forces.Were let off with the sectarian anti Catholic./Irish ditties and banners at Ibrox.Gives you an indication of what the UK finds acceptable in Scotland.Think about this Gandhi was seen as an ungrateful agitator of the empire.Collins was viewed as a terrorist by the Slave masters who stole Ireland.When the US stood against the Brits they were called ("Tractor" - Ed)s…The Brits have form in history and throughout the world as arrogant dictators.I am happy to be in the company of Michael Collins,Ghandi,General Grant,Mandela…the list goes on.This idea of British fair play falsely created is a dangerous myth.The Brits are not liked and that’s fact.They only presume they are liked due to their inflated idea of their own importance in the world.All the countries the Brits were kicked out of have flourished and not a one wants to come back.Proud to be British you must need your head looked at Darling.

    174. Elizabeth Sutherland says:

      My name is Elizabeth Sutherland a 65 year old pensioner who lives in Inverness and I am a Cybernat. So Daily Mail (Scottish) Come up and see me sometime.

    175. Davy says:

      May I give a belated hello to all our new contributers, “a thousand welcomes and here’s my hand”.

      Cheers fa Davy Sutton a Wings over Scotland supporter.

    176. Edward says:

      Just listened to Brian Taylors ‘Big Debate’
      at the end of the programme , he asks for a show of hands on who will vote No and then a show of hand for Yes
      He exclaimed ‘oh my goodness’ but didn’t actually say what the count was.
      Take it was a majority for Yes?

    177. ronnie anderson says:

      cUT AFF THE HEID OF THE HYDRA.

      A CULTIST,am ah, ave never been tae WACO (am Whacko pit that doon tae ma brain abnormality)ah hiv never been tae JONES TOWN,(an ah hiv never MOONED in that cult either).

      @REV,WOS, Ah hiv tae cut back on ma subscription,this month,ah hiv tae invest in a thick pair of rubber glove,s/safety glasses, to protect myself from the vitiol of the Cybernatterers,not to forget the Cybernautical,s squad.

      Please remember on sending me any E Mail,s to include a self destruct( on reading )that way ah wuld hope tae avoid any viruses.

      REV,on the other hand ( & the saner part,s of my brain)
      at the least a complaint to the Press Complaint,s Board,

      you have my name address/e mail addy, & you have full permission to use them in any way you deem nessesary,in the persute of retraction / redress, to yourself,& the named Winger,s.

      PETITION PETITION PETITION.

    178. muttley79 says:

      @Derek Bateman

      ‘Why haven’t they done me?
      Any Mail journos reading this, I’m at derekbateman1.wordpress.com
      Please’…

      They would not mess with you Derek! They prefer to try and intimidate ordinary members of the public who support independence for Scotland. Senator Joe McCarthy would be very, very proud of the Daily Heil.

    179. creigs1707repeal says:

      O/T Apologies.

      At the Scottish Women’s Conference today as Margaret Curran was getting up to speak in the debate with Nicola Sturgeon, she says:

      Maigrit: “Bear with me.”

      To which a reply came from the audience shouted back. “Naw–you’re all right!”

    180. Coolheads Prevail says:

      The best way to deal with the Daily Mail is to ignore their bile and concentrate our efforts on our undecided fellow citizens.

    181. Helpmaboab says:

      Now that we’re officially all cultists we need to decide on some laughable, irrational and barely-credible things to believe in.

      I’m off to the Better Together website for some inspiration.

    182. ronnie anderson says:

      jingly jangly,ah used tae be cawed Ronnie nae pal,s then I fund WING,S,( fuck aff RED BULL two swaly,s its done )am awe ower SCOTLAND & HORIZON,S BEYOND.

      Jimsie, Ah furgoat tae mention you in ma last post,but Cybernautical,s ur, WE ARE SAILING , WE ARE SAILING, OVER CALM SEAS TO BE FREE.

    183. Richard says:

      I don’t think we should go to his address. There is no need to join him in the gutter. What he and his paper has done can only be expected. He supports labour and better together. He was always going to do a hatchet job. All he wants to do is to get traffic to his paper.

      I was in waitrose Helensburgh today. If you spend £5 you get a choice of grauniad, Torygraph or mail. I passed. I wouldn’t want to boost their circulation by accepting even a free one. If you ignore him he will go away. He is hoping to incite further action to make his case. He doesn’t even need to try.

    184. ronnie anderson says:

      iN THE REV,S HOOSE THER,S MANY MANSION,S, REV ah want the room wie the four poster bed,ur lesser Cybernater,s allow,d four poster,s,or are we only allowed wan post a day.

    185. John D says:

      Try as I might I cannot find the article on-line, I did see it on the front page on the news-stand at Morrison’s in Fort William.

    186. ronnie anderson says:

      @Peter A Bell, if the medal,s made of chocolate, keep it oot o the heat of the debate.

      am miffed tae Peter,ah need tae up ma post,s,tae get recocnition lol.

    187. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Looking forward to hearing how many new unique visitors hit WoS today.

    188. Thomas William Dunlop says:

      Definitely an attempt to stop people surfing the internet and finding out about the other side of the argument (the one we know when people are exposed to it, are more likely to change their minds from No to YES).

      The most worrying thing about the article is that names & faces have been published, so I am afraid its not going to be too long before one of them will get hurt. Typical tabloid shame and blame tactics- could launch vigilante style attacks here

      Elsewhere it was nice to see a couple of twitter trolls get their cumuppance in England. It would be nice to show if some of the wild elements in both sides were investigated.

      Also we had Angela Heggarty- Limond case in Scotland recently. I wonder if it is OK to abuse people in Britain because they are Scottish but not Irish.

    189. Desimond says:

      Cybernat, Cybernat,
      Found were Unionist lies are at
      Slash their web, any size,
      Catches Unionist lies like flies
      Look Out!
      Here comes the Cybernat.

      Is he claiming benefits?
      Listen bud,
      He’s got everyone in his club.
      Can he trash, a Vote-No thread
      All the facts are in his head
      Hey, there
      There goes the Cybernat.

      In the day or night
      With such words sublime
      Like a streak of light
      Gets Yes vote everytime.

      Cybernat, Cybernat
      Friendly internet Cybernat
      Wealth and fame
      He’s ingnored
      Independence is his reward.

      To him, life is a great big Argument
      Whenever Unionist mind needs bent
      You’ll find the Cybernat.

    190. Ken500 says:

      DM the most unpopular publication in Britain. Even more unpopular. The gutter right wing tax evading Press.

      Wings more publicity. More Yes votes.

      More power to yer elbow, more ink to yer pen.

      Absolutely Brilliant!

    191. Bugger (the Panda) says:

      As iI live in France, I would like to see them unveil me.

      I could have them charged with violation of my privacy.

    192. kininvie says:

      Taking legal action against the DM is a waste of cash. They have loads of money and a big legal team. If there’s a controversial story, they’ll asses the likelihood of being sued and reckon the payout will be worth it in increased sales, even if the plaintiff’s money doesn’t run out before judgment. This is not the Sun & Elton John. It’s an altogether slicker operation, and it doesn’t make legal mistakes when it comes to stuff like this.

      The way to counter the tabloids is to laugh at them. This is already happening on Twitter with this story. Their weapon is intimidation, so – just don’t be intimidated and laugh in their face. They really hate that.

      On a separate note – those who have been wondering why Yes is not more supportive of the blogging movement now have their answer. The DM will have been desparate to tie in the ‘vile cybernats’ to the Yes campaign or to the SNP. But they haven’t managed it, despite their questions to Stu about Roseanna.

    193. Creag an Tuirc says:

      Auch well, after a tiresome, frustrating factual debate with these Cyberbrits. You’ll need to sign off with ‘Toddle Pip’ instead of ‘Fuck Off’ from now on 🙂

    194. Michael says:

      Great fund raising effort for Wings carried out by the Daily Mail. Honestly, I was thinking of making all my directions direct to Yes from now on but happy to give again to Wings if this is the sort of reaction you are provoking. Keep up the good work.

    195. Faltdubh says:

      They are SHITIN’ it! No two doubts about it. SHITIN’ it!

      I know Yes seem to be carefully treading around the pride route and emphasizing a lot on attracting disgruntled ‘Devolutionists’ to the cause and various others who don’t care much for flag waving, but for us to be better governed. They are all welcome.

      I dislike how the right wing UK press are trying to dismantle us, and yet somehow it’s OK to support UKIP, yet not Scottish nationalism, eh?? We have to pretend that by voting Yes – we are not somehow proud of our country, and we are voting yes to rid ourselves of Tories, bedroom taxes, nukes, Westminister, House of Lords (they are all fantastic reasons too, I do concur)

      ; but my main reason is that

      Scotland is a country. It’s my country. I want my passport to be a Scottish one. I see myself as a Scot.

      I’ve felt that way since about 8 when I began to realize that we are not actually a state.

      It’s disgusting the way the press have not written a jot about the other side, and the “Britnats”. They tend to be very ugly with their abuse e.g lots of jibes at Salmond, us all being Xenophobes.

      They are feart! Absolutely. They know that people are becoming informed and the soft Nos/undecided and beginning to engage in this. Even with the criticism from some about the 3 debates on Tv and Radio this week that we didn’t drill home enough points well, the crowd sounded positively for Yes in all 3 from claps and noise.

      Who actually reads the Mail in Scotland? The printed version? I know two women at work often read it online and their only reason is to see what Kim Kardshian has eaten in Paris, how much weight Chantele Houghton has lost, and will Leo finally win an Oscar.

      We should be laughing at this though and I do feel sorry for the folks who’ve been stalked by the press, but remember, they are absolutely CACKING their breeks about this. That’s why we should laugh, they are desperate and stuck.

      To use a football scenario, they were 2-0 up in the first leg. We had many players out, and didn’t play our greatest game.
      This is the return leg. We are 2-0 up at halftime. They’ve had a man sent off, and now their coach has been sent to the stands! And we have our new £10 million striker on the bench ready to come on in the 2nd half! We are at home, they brought few away fans with them. We are making a heck of a racket.

      Of course it can go either way, but we are certainly in the driving seat!

    196. Ken500 says:

      Paul Roden has started a lot of fun. FO.

    197. kininvie says:

      The best bit was the reference to Stu’s rats…

      Honestly, Stu, couldn’t you found some pets that were less open to innuendo?

    198. Ken500 says:

      An estate buy oot in Ullapool might be applicable. Get the low life oot.

    199. Richard says:

      Eyes on the prize folks

    200. Ken500 says:

      RiderOOO – Paul of Ullapool

    201. Macart says:

      You know I’m not the sort of person who hates anything, (other than jelly ‘shudder’), but if I ever started it would be with the Mail.

      These cretins are out to paint targets on independence supporters. They are literally encouraging hate crime.

      Dear God are they completely insane?

    202. Arbroath 1320 says:

      Is it me or could the Daily Mail’s feeble attempts at trying to ‘out’ us cybernats/cabernats has, how can I put this, sort of backfired a touch? 🙂 (P.S. I use the term cabernat on the understanding that recognition of this term’s introduction is acknowledged as a trade mark owned by Ruth Davidson 🙂 )

      As others have said today welcome to all new Wings readers. You can feel proud that you have now joined the legions of cybernats currently fighting the war of independence in the ether that is the internet.

    203. David says:

      Fame at last for the author: the Daily Mail article was written by “Mrs.” Graham Grant, according to this info site!

      http://www.zoominfo.com/p/Graham-Grant/208670234

    204. ronnie anderson says:

      TO ALL NEW CYBERNATTERER,S THAT HIV STUCK THEIR HEID,S OWER THE PARAPIT,N KEEKED ROON THE DOOR OF THIS WINGS OF SCOTLAND SITE, A BIG HEARTED WELCOME,AH KEN ITS PAST
      HOGMANY,BUT I HOPE YOU,S CAN FIND A LUMP OF COAL,WE WANT
      TAE KEEP HELL,S FIRE,S BURNING.WELCOME WELCOME WELCOME.

    205. Mary Bruce says:

      Calling all cybernats: this story is now on the DM webpage, it appears to be open for comments. You know what to do…

      http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2545901/Cybernats-unmasked-Meet-footsoldiers-pro-Scottish-independence-army-online-poison-shames-Nationalists.html

    206. Boorach says:

      @ David

      Given the amount of homophobic venom he spouts on that link one is bound to wonder if Graham Grant could be confused about his sexuality is possibly even in denial.

      For your info Mr Grant; I’m Bill Urquhart a cybernat volunteer and can be found in Tain.

    207. fairiefromtheearth says:

      yea ha invited to an orgy God bless you rev 😉

    208. liz says:

      I think the best thing to do is not respond at all to the Mail or if you do be very polite- I wouldn’t put it passed them to have folk who are not yes posing as such and writing ‘vile abuse’ just so they can say ‘told you so’.

      Also I would not give them any traffic.

      I will be supporting the folk named and if need be adding to a crowd fund.

    209. Clydebuilt says:

      Calm Down Folks. How many victims (readers) of the Daily Mail will be voting YES, very few.

      In the face of this campaign against Cybernattry we should continue to publicise Wings Over Scotland, Newsnetscotland, Bellacaledonia and YES Scotland. The quality of journalism and commentary are of a high standard. Where else are Scots going to get informed commentary that is in my opinion unbiased. I’m proud to call myself a Cybernat.

      Unmoderated social network sites are weakness in the pro-
      Indy online world. TO neutralise this threat we need to self police.

    210. Tamson says:

      Did you know that on Google, when you type in “hated”, the first autocomplete entry adds “by the Daily Mail”?

    211. Clydebuilt says:

      Faltdubh says:
      25 January, 2014 at 6:12 pm

      They are SHITIN’ it! No two doubts about it. SHITIN’ it!

      Aye!

      First
      They Larf at you, then
      They Fight you, then
      You win!

    212. “They fight you and then you win!”

      9 months to go and they are already reduced to this ridiculous hype, attacking the social media debate they can not control or influence.

      The real debate is why is Labour for Independence now attracting old Scottish Labour big beasts. The STUC are happily providing LfI with support in the provision of rooms and other services, as are other Scottish Union Branches – some like the CWU more openly than others.

      Why is there no media coverage of the SNP canvassing on behalf of ‘Yes’ in Cowdenbeath and Inverkeithing which turned up a 40% to 30% amongst confirmed voters in favour of ‘Yes’? After all the constituency is one of the safest Labour seats at Holyrood.

      Clearly the Teflon coated skid mark protection on Unionist Y-front gusset is wearing thin as they run out of tear off strips.

    213. Diane Sutherland says:

      As the first thing I read every night now are the Wings posts for the day and I share most of them, does this make me both a Cybernat and a cult follower? Man, my life just got exciting! If they land on my doorstep they’ll get a quote they won’t forget in a hurry! Keep up the good work Stuart and get yourself up here before September so you can vote!

    214. beachthistle says:

      As one of the Daily Mail’s ‘Cybernat7’ I’d like to thank everybody on here for all the great messages of support, encouragement, solidarity, etc.

      Most reaction I’ve had from non-Wings friends and ‘strangers’ has been positive: all of of DKs said it made them more Yes right away, and even the taunts from members of the NO brigade have mostly been on the light, almost humorous side.

      As I said first off this morning, I am more amused/bemused – and more determined! – than anything else. But as well as fielding all the twitter traffic (and lots of new followers!) I decided to look through my old tweets to see how ‘bad’ they were, and lo and behold, I couldn’t find any remotely near the scale of personal attack and profanity I’ve seen on from the No side. I think the nearest I came to them was calling Alan Roden ‘a shit of the lowest order” (for filling my mother’s head with lies and propaganda) and I’d maintain, especially after today, that that is more in the domain of ‘fair comment’ than toxic abuse!

      I also looked to see if I had engaged in what I understand to be trolling – again a blank. So that has got me thinking about taking legal action. I will get in touch fellow Cybernat7ers that are considering the same and then see what our options are.

      I know there is case for laughing/ignoring and walking away – but as there is no evidence nor justification for some of the activities and words they have associated me with/effectively accused me of doing and/or saying, I am thinking of the option of both laughing AND calling their legal bluff.

      In the event that I do, I’ll want as much evidence re what people have been saying online – both on social media and in the press today – and both about the whole Cybernat7 posse and about me individually – and I’d really appreciate any potentially useful screen-grabs etc. etc. from fellow Wings-ers…

      So, an interesting day – one I have a feeling we will look back on as one of the turning points…and, I’m convinced, one of the first clear signs that the UK establishment/NO brigade are really rattled…

    215. ayemachrihanish says:

      gillie says-  “Graham Grant should be ashamed for producing such gutter journalism”.

      I understand the sentiment but – respectfully would disagree on two points.

      1. Journalism. Simple!  This is not journalism – not even close – this is pure media prostitution. Meaning, you pay me the money I’ll write anything. Follow the money! Grant’s just the patsy – tell me what to write and I’ll tell you what its going to cost you. Follow the money – who’s instructing the narrative and who’s paying him? And then ask who’s paying the payer?  Journalism got fcuk all to do with it.

      2. Ashamed – respectfully ha! That emotion is beyond the low cunning of Graham Grant.

      But on the up side – no one on there death bed ever said -” I wish i’d spent more time in the office prostituting myself for the daily mail”.

    216. ayemachrihanish says:

      That would be their death bed…

    217. Doug says:

      I bet what’s REALLY worrying them is that, for every person of a pro-independence disposition who regularly tweets/posts/comments on blogs etc, there are probably at least another thousand who actively read, digest and agree without feeling the need to add anything of their own. I’d place myself firmly in this camp and I’m certain that I’m far from alone.

      This must be annoying the crap out of the uninoists as they have no accurate way of assessing the “threat level”. That said, nether do we, but we’re just quietly and positively praying to whatever we pray to that people are listening and becoming better informed, as opposed to reacting with extreme knee-jerk paranoia such as the DM and its like.

      Keep up the great work Stu, the donation is on it’s way 🙂

    218. castle hills chavie says:

      The Cybernat7…Pure class

    219. dmw42 says:

      Just catching up on earlier posts as I’ve been out all day trying to source black candles as that’s what we ‘cultists’ do, right?

      I don’t do twitter/Facebook myself but, for those who do, keep spreading the word that democracy is alive and well outwith msm/bbc (deliberate non capitals). The more people learn, the more they’re inclined to a Yes vote so, direct all your ‘followers’ to WoS as you can rest assured Rev Stu will inform everyone what isn’t being reported, and deconstruct and correct what is.

      Keep up the good work folks (and does anyone have a match?)

    220. Morag says:

      I’ve been out all day too – skyving. I was at a workshop on Bach’s Weinachtsoratorium in a church in the New Town. So there I am, hoping the Gardner Professor of Music doesn’t notice one of his sopranos is reading Wings on her mobile phone during the chorales.

      At the break though, I was co-ordinating the delivery of Yes newspapers with one of the altos, and chiding her for not wearing a Yes badge. Facilitators and all that.

      It is simply unreal the wide variety of people who intend to vote Yes and are debating the issues online. Funny they didn’t doorstep Gordon McIntyre-Kemp and Ivan McKee come to think of it…. And Derek Bateman is feeling all lonely and left out.

    221. Morag says:

      That would be Weihnachts-Oratorium. Peasant.

    222. Albert Herring says:

      @Morag

      Ok it’s Beethoven rather than Bach, but
      Alle Menschen werden Brüder,
      Wo dein sanfter Flügel weilt.

      Nice reference to “Wings” there btw.

      I wonder if Burns knew Schiller’s work?

    223. MarkWot says:

      This stuff makes me more proud to be flying my WingsOverScotland car stickers that ‘Ken'(Thamks)supplied for the price of 2 stamps, keep tacking the Moral high ground Stu

    224. Bill McLaren says:

      Somehow I think this is appropriate…

      http://www.8ball.co.uk/not-a-daily-mail-reader-t-shirt

    225. Aidan says:

      It dawned on me a while back that a ‘Cybernat’ is someone who at some point takes some part in an online debate about Scottish Independence and gives reasons for voting Yes in September.

      The term has, until now, been employed pejoratively by people whose minds are set firmly against the idea but who have had to watch all their arguments being comprehensively destroyed through exposure to truthful analysis and indisputable facts. Having run out of anything better to say, they say something like: ‘I see the Cybernats are out in force tonight.’

      I’m with those who don’t find this turn taken by the Daily Mail funny at all. It casts a shadow over the landscape of the debate. Before, the term suggested pro-Independence people were like the Cybermen from Dr Who: just a bunch of lumbering robots with programmed minds marching into any argument and ‘winning’ by numbers. This new direction gives it a whole different meaning. They are trying to pour much darker content into the term.

      So I suppose we have to take the term on and give it our own content; make ourselves and our arguments for YES the meaning of it. The ‘cyber’ part is okay but we’re not all Nats. Some of us are Indy-ists: Cyber Self-Determinationists. It wouldn’t matter in which country in the world we found ourselves, precisely the same principles would hold. But, if it’s a term we’ve decided to self-apply because we must:

      I am a Cybernat.

    226. Marker Post says:

      Rev, I can come to the orgy on Tuesday, but I’ll have to skip the mass suicide otherwise I might miss the last bus home, is that ok?

    227. Horacesaysyes says:

      Jeez-o, I take a day off-line to go and see the pandas, and I miss out on this!

      Well, as others have already said plenty of times, it’s fairly certain that if the Daily Mail hates you, you must be doing something right!

      So, chins up all that are mentioned in the article, we are clearly heading in the right direction.

    228. schrodingerscat says:

      Alba4Eva says:
      25 January, 2014 at 12:59 pm“I AM CYBERNAT!”

      I’m spartacus………

      the cat says…
      I’m brian and so’s my wife 🙂

    229. Morag says:

      That’s why I like my automatically-generated avatar. It’ a cyberman.

      I’m a cybernat and proud of it.

    230. David says:
      25 January, 2014 at 7:01 pm
      Fame at last for the author: the Daily Mail article was written by “Mrs.” Graham Grant, according to this info site!

      http://www.zoominfo.com/p/Graham-Grant/208670234

      Interesting. The lady doth protest rather a lot. It looks as if we could have another John MacLeod (Wee Free, homophobic, Daily Hate Journo outed as a closet queen in the late 90s) on our hands.

    231. Morag says:

      Albert Herring. Burns was well-read, but whether or not he knew Schiller I don’t know. They were almost exact contemporaries of course.

      I see your Beethoven/Schiller and raise you Mahler/Klopstock.

      Mit Flügeln, die ich mir errungen, werde ich entschweben!

      “With Wings that I have won for myself, I will soar upwards!”

      Though actually, googling that just now, I see a note that Klopstock only wrote the first verse and the rest of it was by Mahler himself. That bit is right at the end of course. Just about where you turn the last page and the organ music comes straight through the soles of your feet.

    232. Albert Herring says:

      @ Morag
      The Schiller Ode predates “A Man’s a man” by 10 years, but it could be a zeitgeist thing I suppose.

      It’s interesting though – Burns, Scott, etc impact on 18th C european culture, e.g. all those wonderful Schubert settings, as well as the Haydn & Beethoven folk song settings.

      Absolutely agree the Mahler’s spine-tingling stuff.

    233. Albert Herring says:

      edit: 18th/19thC

    234. craigy1314 says:

      Who cares? The Dail Mail is only read by only read by Tories anyway.

    235. Jenny says:

      Good afternoon Cybernats.

      As discussed – the whole article is pretty awful.

      @beachthistle Congrats on becoming a cybernat7 – you’ll probably get a mention on Wikipedia now, politics students might even discuss the Cybernat7 media fiasco as being one of the turning points of the campaign. Who knows.

      Like everyone, I am concerned about the violation of privacy here but – after taking a look at the online article – I am especially concerned by the side note detailing prosections.

      “Internet trolls who spread hate online face being locked up for five years, prosecutors warned last night.

      The intervention by the Crown Office comes amid growing concern over online activists allying themselves with the pro-independence movement.

      Last night, as calls escalated for the SNP to intervene to curb the wave of online abuse, it emerged that the Crown Office is planning a shake-up of prosecution guidelines to ‘get tough’ on the trolls.

      The Crown said anyone found guilty after being prosecuted before a sheriff and jury for offensive or abusive tweets or online comments faces being imprisoned for up to five years.

      A Crown Office source said: ‘We are currently working on plans to publish further prosecution guidance relating to offensive comments made on social media and are in the process of consulting with stakeholders.

      ‘We have been considering it [the shake-up] for a while as social media and the evidence obtained from it plays an increasingly important part in the prosecution of cases.’”

      Etc…

      Feels like the attempts of the state to censor free speech online are really starting to gather steam now – what with Cameron’s Great Wall (includes banning of “esoteric interests” webpages???).

      Shite banter if you ask me.

    236. Jim says:

      Seeing an average Scot reading the Daily Mail is as rare a sight as a hen’s tooth! The paper is only read by prejudiced half-wits with an axe to grind against everybody else.

      I have though noticed that it is quite popular in the Borders where many English folk live and work and run businesses and were coach after coach of tourists come for short stays throughout the year.

      However, the DM has done itself damage with this diatribe unless it highlights similar among Unionists! Contributors to these pages have supplied enough information about the DM and its scrounging editor to publish hundreds of pages on the net.

    237. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

      “Seeing an average Scot reading the Daily Mail is as rare a sight as a hen’s tooth! The paper is only read by prejudiced half-wits with an axe to grind against everybody else.”

      It’s the third-biggest-selling daily in Scotland after the Sun and Record.

    238. Morag says:

      It’s interesting though – Burns, Scott, etc impact on 18th C european culture, e.g. all those wonderful Schubert settings, as well as the Haydn & Beethoven folk song settings.

      I think it was a different thread, but I mentioned singing at the Burns Supper in Carlops when the Sky News crew showed up trying to take the temperature of the debate. I (and my alto duet partner) were singing O wert thou in the cauld blast. Music, Felix Mendelssohn.

      I was slightly surprised to see that the music didn’t have the “Scotch snap” on the word “cauld”, which it’s so automatic to sing. Surprised, because Mendelssohn was an expert on Scottish musical idom and it wasn’t like him to miss a trick. I pencilled it in for our accompanist.

      Only later did I discover that the snap was missing because what Mendelssohn set wasn’t the Burns text but a German translation by Ferdinand Freiligrath, “O säh ich auf der Heide dort”. Obviously, there’s no snap on “Heide” because it doesn’t fit.

      Freiligrath did such a perfect translation that a musical setting of his words was able to have the original Scots set to the same music and the only way you’d know the music wasn’t written for the Scots words is that little irregularity in the rhythm. Which you might not pick up on unless you were actually Scots.

      And Mendelssohn’s setting of the words is so perfect that it has been adopted as the “right” tune for the song, even though it post-dates Burns’s poem by at least 40 years. Folk singers have picked it up and probably don’t even know they’re singing Mendelssohn.

    239. Graeme R says:

      “First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they come to fight you, and then you win.” (M.K. Gandhi)

    240. Morag says:

      Well, yeah, Stu has that on every page right under his Wings logo.

    241. Roddy says:

      Can I just check that we’re still on for the orgy on Tuesday?



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