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The British Job

Posted on May 18, 2019 by

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  1. 18 05 19 08:56

    The British Job | speymouth

204 to “The British Job”

  1. Iain 2 says:

    Brilliant, sums uk up.

  2. BuggerLePanda says:

    Best Brexit cartoon I have seen.

    Sums up the situation pergecrly

  3. Robert Louis says:

    Excellent Cartoon.

    Mind, whilst Boris the clown is popular among the rank and file members, isn’t it the case that only Tory MP’s get to vote on all the leadership candidates, whittling it down to just 2, and then the rank and file party members get to choose from just those two. So, my questions is, would enough Tory MP’s vote to ensure Boris the English clown gets through to the final round?

    Either way, their really is no solution coming in any of this soon. Even with a new leader, the Tory and Labour MP’s would still remain divided.

    This is why a strong vote for the SNP would be good in the EU elections next week to ensure the message is once again clear, that Scotland does not want England’s racist brexit.

    I guess the only upside of all this, is that if Boris the English clown does become Tory leader, and chose to hold a general election, it would be a great chance for the SNP to make the result about independence for Scotland.

    At the end of the day, however, the UK overall, is on a daily basis sliding further and further behind other nations of the world, lack of infrastructure, lack of innovation, lack of investment in education. Outside of London, the entire nation is being starved of investment and allowed to deteriorate.

    The UK is being dragged down by an inept and incompetent English political class. While other countries have political parties committed to development, investment and growth, London is obsessed with doing the exact opposite.

  4. Hamish100 says:

    Ding ding – C’moan let’s all get aff the bus!

  5. Giving Goose says:

    Will self identifying BritNats in Scotland get on the bus? Probably.
    Union Quackery is a peculiar thing.
    Proud to go over the cliff, the BritNats probably equate it to the Charge of the Light Brigade.
    A greater act of ignorance and self harming has never before been witnessed.

  6. Hamish100 says:

    Apparently High returns from postal votes again!

    Like Burke and Hare are the Tories touring the care and nursing homes kindly helping gathering the votes?

  7. donnywho says:

    The farce is that the Tories will be having focus groups to see how the new drivers will be accepted by the passengers.

    Then there will be the infighting as the lucky few who pass the first test scrabble for advantage and votes from their fellow Tory MPs. But still they will neither consult the passengers nor reflect that they are still falling.

    Then at last they will have whittled it down to two who they will present to their members. And for the sake of the analogy it will only be the pensioners on board who get a say and not all of them either… just the “right sort”.
    By the time our new and fearless leader slides into the drivers seat and loges in it will be too late.

    It sums up the whole sorry mess we are in!

  8. Clootie says:

    Remember we are tied into our seats on this bus. Many of our fellow Scots are blocking the aisle telling us to trust the driver. The clippie is Ruth Davidson!

    Worse still we have the LibDems singing “100 green bottles”

    Half way down Richard Leonard demands Nicola mitigates the fall.

    The Greens demand to know why it was not an electric bus.

    A pity the destination was covered over in 2014.

  9. Ken500 says:

    The Tories could not make a bigger mess. They are an absolute disgrace. It doesnot matter who they appoint they are going down big time. Out of Downing Street soon. Never have their been such a group of incompetent useless unionist fools in Westminster and local Gov. Appalling mess and apalling people. Wasting public money like there is no tomorrow. Ruining people’s lives. Causing mental health problems,. Killing people. Just despicable.

    Vote SNP/SNP to save the world fro these wicked, totally incompetent people. Vote for Independence to save the world. The power is in the people’s hands. Use it.

  10. Marie Clark says:

    Well done Chris, nail, firmly whacked on the head. Sums it all up perfectly.

    Some how, I don’t feel that a change of driver is the answer that’s needed.

  11. Giving Goose says:


    The Lib Dems will be singing Rule Britannia.
    I see the Lib Dems in Scotland as nasty enablers of BritNattery who have attempted to disguise their true intentions.
    BritNats to the core. They would be first in the queue for jackboot fittings.

  12. robert alexander harrison says:

    @ken500 dont ever say they cant make a bigger mess trust me the English voter is easy to dupe look how farage has them eating out of his fascist hand right now and the cons have people like him wanting the pm job now boris johnson is one such person.

  13. Breeks says:

    Clootie says:
    18 May, 2019 at 7:55 am
    Remember we are tied into our seats on this bus. Many of our fellow Scots are blocking the aisle telling us to trust the driver. The clippie is Ruth Davidson!

    Worse still we have the LibDems singing “100 green bottles”

    Half way down Richard Leonard demands Nicola mitigates the fall.

    The Greens demand to know why it was not an electric bus.

    A pity the destination was covered over in 2014.

    Yeah, but hope remains. I’m beginning to understand what Dame Vera Lynn was on about…

    Those “blue birds over the white cliffs of Dover” might be Pantone 300 blue birds escaping the red bus catastrophe because we have Wings, and capacity to fly independently.

  14. X_Sticks says:

    Pretty much sums it up. Another excellent (if depressing) toon from Mr Cairns.

    @Clootie – that summary of the passengers made me lol.

  15. Mike cassidy says:

    Where’s the Kelty Clippie when you need her?

  16. Hamish100 says:

    While we are on the Britisher type thing.

    Did you know we had a British Celtic resistance fighting Julius Ceasar. Neither did I.

    But the part played by the BBC in the war shouldn’t be overlooked in the propaganda states!!!

    Not an Anglo Saxon in sight I am assuming. If only we British Celts as opposed to Celts had proper immigration controls!

  17. Craig P says:

    If only Hamish was on the cliff edge waving cheerio, but we are still strapped inside 🙁

  18. Fergus Green says:

    Given the choice I would take a Scottish lifeboat over a London bus any day.

  19. Clootie says:

    @giving goose

    I stand corrected. Rule Brittania would be the LibDem choice. In the 2014 Independence campaign they were the most aggressive Unionists I encountered.

  20. galamcennalath says:

    Best summation of Tory Brexit in an image I’ve seen.

    Some of these idiots are still talking ‘no deal’. Let’s just just drive of the cliff, they say. They therefore think putting a loony committed to that in charge is good idea.

    The EU has made clear that any re-launch of talks after a ‘no deal’ (disasterous) exit will have prerequisites which equate to the current Withdrawal Agreement! The Tories have to accept that it’s not the 19thC and they have international obligations and responsibilities.

  21. One_Scot says:

    Oh man, zoomed in on the large image, the detail is fantastic. And the joke is also top drawer.

    Lol, helps if I post comments in the right place.

  22. Abulhaq says:

    This will be news to many in Ukania, not much media coverage.
    This is the point of the European Union, independence for countries like Scotland and independence from foreign interference whether US, Russia, China or ‘Anglosphere’ for all the nations within it. In fact the actual raison d’être of the whole project. Small wonder the Brits never got on board. Scotland, ex colonial possession, must.
    Vive l’Europe libre…..

  23. bobajock says:

    Still fighting over the wheel, still confusing stupid with statesmanlike.

    The UK …

    This encapsulates it perfectly.

  24. Muscleguy says:


    During the indyref I was told by those in the know that none of the care homes would allow either Yes Scotland or RIC inside to talk to people. However we knew BT was in there regularly.

    As a RIC activists I had lots of good, polite, nuanced conversations with elderly in the community. I once had a multihand discussion after one woman I’d talked to came out to continue while I was talking to a neighbour then others joined in. It was a hoot and we all laughed like drains while disagreeing. Kind of sums up the indyref for me and when others say it was awful I wonder where they are coming from.

  25. frogesque says:

    @ Mike Cassidy: 8.23

    Thank for that! I’ve had Sam the Scull ratting round my head for the past 2 days. Now the Kelty Clippie has joined in!

    Fab toon, everyone enjoying the ride until the final moment.

  26. Dorothy Devine says:

    Sadly excellent!

    I see farage is giving it big licks in the Guardian with
    Scotland won’t be free in the EU”

    How he thinks Scotland is free now is beyond me, I hope he is on Chris’s bus.

  27. Abulhaq says:

    Which to choose, American soft power ie Google, fb, twitter, Apple, Amazon etc or Chinese soft power Huawei, Belt&Road, etc?
    Could well be neither. Why not a European alternative?
    Europe should be nobody’s puppet….and we know all about puppetry and puppet masters!

  28. Giving Goose says:

    There is a large element of “we’re in charge, ok!” endemic in BritNattery. You see it with the BBC & QT, where the BBC are quite simply going through an exercise in rubbing our noses in it by what they see as an exercise in power.
    Same with the bus over the cliff. Mighty Brits sacrificing themselves come what May (pun intended) and taking us down with them they can.

  29. Eric McLean says:

    Same cartoon for next week please … zoomed in and Hamlisch with parachute

  30. Golfnut says:

    Great cartoon, the bus falling into what might just be a bottomless pit of despair. The thing is though that those in charge of this disaster aren’t on the bus, they’re the ones pushing it off the cliff. The consequences of this state sponsored debacle will be felt by those least able to defend themselves, that would be most of us. Maybe a mob headed by the queen and may, corbyn, hol and the establishment and media cheering as the bus falls into the black hole might focus minds on just who are responsible and who benefit most.

  31. Abulhaq says:

    Independence means the end of Scottish provincialism. We return to being proudly European, no longer a substrate of a confected, faux nationality. Farage, Boris, Unionism, Windsors et al. MAKE THEM ALL HISTORY! We know how.

  32. A C Bruce says:

    So apt.

    That’s a very well drawn ravine.

  33. chicmac says:

    We’re all going on a stumer holiday.
    No more working we’ll be on the brew.
    Pain and slaughter on our stumer holiday.
    Plenty worries for me and you
    Farage did it for you.

  34. starlaw says:

    Great again Chris.

    Last night I heard a snippet on some news or other that Hundreds of Tory Mp,s councellors etc had been caught with Islamaphobic comments on their media postings, and how this was another public humiliation for Theresa May. . . This morning . . . Nothing on any news ive heard.

  35. robertknight says:

    Voters in Scotland need to blow the bloody exit doors off!

  36. Simon Curran says:

    Re. comments on Lib Dems. I don’t get them. Once upon a time they looked quite progressive and had politicians you felt you might vote for. However they got in bed with the Tories and just seem to have been ‘useful idiots’, betrayed everyone’s hopes before Clegg sailed off into the sunset. If there are any progressive LibDems left in Scotland I just can’t see why they would vote for the party as they still have no chance of getting into power. On the other hand in an independent Scotland they might have a bit more influence…

  37. ronnie anderson says:

    All aboard for ah free ride tae the Cheddar Gorge nae return

  38. Bob Mack says:

    The comedian Norm Mcdonald states there are only two categories of cliff diver.
    1. Grand Champion.
    2. Stuff left on a rock.

    Guess which ?

  39. galamcennalath says:

    Simon Curran says:

    Lib Dems. I don’t get them

    Me neither. Whatever happened to the party of Home Rule? Back in the day, there was smaller government in general so home rule would have meant everything but defence and foreign affairs and the next step would have been dominion status.

    If WW1 hadn’t got in the way of the Scottish Home Rule Bill we could have been independent a long time ago.

    Now, LibDems seem to be the most BritNat, centralist, pro London rule party of them all.

    As their election literature makes clear they only want Scotland in the EU as part of the whole UK in the EU. Their Union matters more than Scotland’s wellbeing.

  40. galamcennalath says:

    starlaw says:

    Hundreds of Tory Mp,s councellors etc had been caught with Islamaphobic comments on their media postings,

  41. Athanasius says:

    Bloody brilliant. I can just hear the Tories singing “This is the self preservation society…”

  42. Clootie says:

    Can someone explain the LibDem policy if we get a people’s vote and through an English majority a leave vote is repeated. I have yet to hear or read an answer to that simple but very possible outcome.

    It is a straightforward question. Do we stay on the bus as it shoots over the edge OR do they support a Scottish solution.

  43. jfngw says:


    The LibDem’s are BritNats, you will do whatever England decides in a People’s Vote. There position is if the referendum outcome is Leave then we leave no matter how the Scots vote. If England votes Leave but Scots make the overall vote Remain expect all hell to break loose and the result be questioned.

    They will go even further and claim the SNP agreed a People’s Vote so they must abide by the result. It was a trap that for some reason the SNP walked right into, unless they always knew it was going be impossible for it to happen.

  44. Jack Murphy says:

    Tory Leadership latest.
    The Times Poll:

    “Boris Johnson crushes leadership rivals in poll of Tory members……”

  45. Merkin Scot says:

    I thought Wullie Rennie (who?) was supposed to be a bus driver?
    Surely, he can save us?
    Thought not.

  46. James Barr Gardner says:

    ronnie anderson says:
    18 May, 2019 at 10:18 am
    All aboard for ah free ride tae the Cheddar Gorge nae return

    Ye micht jist cum oot at Wookey Hole if yer lucky !

  47. starlaw says:

    Thanks galamcennalath,

    Rory the Torys hat is in the ring to become the new bus driver.

  48. Dr Jim says:

    Calls for Scotland’s First Minister to stop using the word *Scotland*

  49. jfngw says:

    The Tories are in panic mode, the majority probably know Johnson is an arsehole but they see him as the only one that can beat Farage and are going to go with who they think the winner will be.

    They fact that he is a walking disaster area will be put to the side, he may even make T.May look competent (very amusing initially misspelt competent and the spell checker offered component, even it sees May’s robotic tendencies).

  50. msdidi says:

    For the second day in a row I have received (via the postman) the same election leaflet from the “Welsh Labour” party! I’m in Perth, Scotland. Big picture of Jeremy on the front (1/2 page) and the message in English….’Vote Welsh Labour to bring people back together’ then repeated in Welsh. Have they sent the Scottish ones to Wales? Not that it would sway me from my SNP vote anyway!

  51. Dan says:

    On the one hand it’s a pity so many ill informed and gullible folk bought into the Leave campaign’s nonsense.
    The less aware were lured onto the bus and started singing “This is the Self Preservation Society” thinking that they were actually part of that society.
    Little did they know the stuff plastered on the side of that red bus was a load of crap, and leaving the EU was so the likes of Mogg, Farage and their ilk’s “society” could avoid the EU’s newly implemented rules and scrutiny on tax avoidance, money laundering and offshoring of that particular society’s ill gotten gains.

    On the other hand, one hopes this whole protracted situation with a lot of very damning information about the main protagonists now in full public view, it will have, and continue to give, a huge amount of folk a real wake up call.

  52. Calum McKay says:

    Watch the bbc and press as the change in driver comes to fruition.

    Johnson (or another of similar ilk), the media will unite behind him / her. Peoples choice, facing up to those nasty Europeans, they need us more than we need them, precious union, uk is exceptional and of course, Dunkirk spirit.

    The past will be glossed over, the brexit predicament will be down to the EU, immigrants and other undesirables, such as those wanting an independent Scotland. Those not on the bus will be termed subversive, malcontents, destructive and not one of us, etc.

    Both independence cause and SNP will be drowned out in a storm of british nationalism as an election is called. Corbyn won’t be at the races, the press have him in a box with anti-semitism and his dodgy pals. The tories will have a clear run.

    I have no doubts how low the tories / brit nats and state will sink and how solid the support will be from the state broadcaster and media will be for them.

    We have a fight on our hands, independence will not be gifted to us by the uk ship going down the pan, it’s down to us to make sure we jump ship before it’s too late. This will only be achieved by a unified movement with common disciplined purpose!

  53. call me dave says:

    Excellent cartoon Brexit bus.

    There will be another one along in a minute! 🙂

  54. Robert Louis says:

    Meanwhile in Glasgow, a tiny number of sad, pro-English colonial rule orange folks have turned up for the anti independence ‘march’.

    The propagandist, lying BBC where you are, have ‘estimated’ numbers attending at around 10 million, possibly higher.

    Honestly you would get more folk at an orange walk in Dublin, FFS. What a bunch of diddies.

  55. Ken500 says:

    Why does it always ?? rain for campaigning. Sod’s Law

  56. Ken500 says:

    Just get out and vote folks, Vote SNP/SNP. Vote for Independence. Save the world from the Westminster unionist imbeciles.

  57. Ken500 says:

    Farague is a criminal. He should have bedn put in jail years ago. For false representation, no accounts , embezzlement, fraud and lies. A total charlatan. Protected by Tory tax evading grandees.

  58. Abulhaq says:

    The Brexit affair will be as nothing compared to the fight to ‘save the Union’.
    It is evident that England needs Scotland. Without Scotland the UK does not simply cease to exit but the residual element may well lose international face and prestige with consequences impacting on the direction of domestic politics.
    Brexit has ‘harrowed’ the establishment heart of English politics. In the self-styled Brexit party we have indicators of what the future may hold.
    In Scotland, remain or leave now has a different reference.

  59. Breeks says:

    Abulhaq says:
    18 May, 2019 at 9:18 am
    This will be news to many in Ukania…

    Hmmm…. Not if they’ve read George Orwell’s 1984.

  60. HandandShrimp says:

    To be fair to the BBC (although why should we) they have ignored the Force for Good march….perhaps to spare their blushes.

  61. geeo says:

    Brilliant as ever, however, a wee Hamish standing next to the brexit sign looking down would have really topped it off for me.

  62. There is surely, something wrong with the system whereby, the next Prime Minister of this country, is decided by the members of the Conservative Party.

  63. Ghillie says:

    Brilliant as always Chris =)

    But THAT is scary!!!

    You do lots of scary stuff.

    Is it the times we live in?

    I know what would take the fear away 🙂

  64. Ghillie says:

    geeo, or at least floating above with a parachute called Independence…

    and throwing a life line to Wales and North of Ireland =)

    And I would like to think our Scottish Government, backed by the good folk of Scotland, tying a huge sling across the canyon for the good folk of England. Please do not let them perish because of bad choices engineered by a malignantly controlled media.

    Peace and Love folks.

  65. geeo says:

    When looking at the next Tory leader/PM there is one factor needs remembered.

    The new person in charge must understand the importance of Scottish revenues to ‘mother england’.

    Treeza clearly understands that ANY ukexit = Losing Scots revenues.

    The Tory Party will not elect someone who does not understand that simple reality.

    Now, the Tory problem becomes, does Boris, for example, know the importance of Scottish revenues, but is arrogant enough to think he can just steamroller a ukexit over Scotland and dare us to dissolve the Union, his confidence driven by the 2014 result ?

    Is THAT the factor that means the Tory party will rule his application out the final 2 candidate list?

    If Brexit was purely about leaving the EU, we would have been out on March 29th.

    And make no mistake, if Scotland were not sitting on an electoral and Holyrood mandate for a referendum on indy, we 100% would already be out the EU on March 29th.

    There are no other reasons for No ukexit, the “no to no deal” is the smokescreen the tories (and labour) are hiding behind.

    The threat of Scottish independence, is what is stopping their precious ukexit from the EU.

    The english people would happily sacrifice the Union with Scotland (revs polling) to complete leaving the EU, so it is notable that the WM politicians are flat refusing to do the same.

    Imagine if those millions of English voters ever realised the truth ?

    The EU elections will be a huge warning that they are doing exactly that.

    The next GE could be a defining moment in English political history, and ironically, any party who says vote for us and WE will dissolve the union with Scotland, would probably win by landslide.

    Which would be fine, until after we take back our vast resources.

    Then we get to watch the carnage as a secure wealthy nation.

  66. Breeks says:

    Calum McKay says:
    18 May, 2019 at 11:54 am

    We have a fight on our hands, independence will not be gifted to us by the uk ship going down the pan, it’s down to us to make sure we jump ship before it’s too late. This will only be achieved by a unified movement with common disciplined purpose…

    I kinda agree, but differ a little. I think there will be brief moment of opportunity when Independence actually will be a gift for the taking by virtue of our Constitutional Sovereignty, but the big question is whether we will have the clear vision, confidence, and single-mindedness to seize the opportunity, or squander it. It’s my old drum beat I’m afraid. I fear we might easily come unstuck if we squander our chance trying to hammer the round peg of democracy into the square hole of Constitutional Sovereignty.

    I believe in Democracy as a principle, but not an inviolable principle. In fact, it’s a very delicate and vulnerable principle, and I absolutely do not trust any democracy that is so clearly compromised and violated by the BritNat Propaganda and long term systemic indoctrination that we see all around us in Scotland.

    If our Indy movement is to be unified and prepared to move as one, and yes I agree it must, Nicola MUST give the people CLEAR and decisive leadership, and present all of us, with an uncomplicated and binary choice which everybody across the Indy spectrum can slot right into and get behind. DO NOT over-think it, and please, please, please, do not proffer any more unforced compromise.

    Am I anxious? Yes. Absolutely. We have stood at this crossroads before, on 24th June 2016, when our inalienable Constitutional Sovereignty was irreconcilably at odds with the will of the UK majority, but in my opinion, on that occasion we chose the wrong path and forfeited our unassailable Constitutional winning hand. We CANNOT afford to do that again. Such chances are simply too rare, fleeting and valuable to be missed.

    If Westminster would force Scotland out of Europe on a flawed and unconstitutional mandate, then Holyrood properly has no choice but to defend Scotland’s Sovereign Constitution, and stand up for our legitimate sovereign mandate to remain.

    If any Scottish MP’s or MSP’s harbour doubts about it, I would have them read out loud the Declaration of Arbroath…”Yet if he should give up what he has begun, and agree to make us or our kingdom subject to the King of England or the English, we should exert ourselves at once to drive him out as our enemy and a subverter of his own rights and ours, and make some other man who was well able to defend us our King…”

    If we can dethrone a King who abandons Scotland, you can be damn sure we can similarly exert ourselves to dethrone an elected Government which would sell out and abandon Scotland’s Constitutional Rights and integrity. (You listening Ruth Davidson?)

    A determination of Brexit based upon precise Constitutional protocol WILL give Scotland the gift of a Brexit prison break, but we must be ready to go for it, and be sure our courage doesn’t fail us when the time comes.

    Sadly, I do not feel like we are anything like ready, but must hope against hope that we are.

    The ONLY words of substance and consequence I have heard these last three years were Ian Blackford’s, declaring Scotland would not be removed from Europe against its sovereign will. Everything else we have heard, however flowery and engaging it might sound, is inconsequential. Sovereignty is the only show in town, and we, the people of Scotland OWN IT.

  67. Steph says:

    If this doesn’t prove we need independence ASAP, nothing will. But we all know the BritNats will fight hard to keep the chains around Scotland.

    England need our oil. They need somewhere to park their nuclear weapons. And all that tax money they’d lose from us.

    Oh, and there would be no more stamping a union jack on Scottish products. What shame that would be.

  68. manandboy says:

    The ‘Maintain the Union’ march took place today. Judging by the absence of any wide-angle photographs, the turnout was a couple of dozen.

  69. Abulhaq says:

    A perspective from 2012:
    Even more pertinent now.

  70. Ghillie says:

    manandboy, I loved the tweet: ‘All under one brolly’ 🙂

  71. Valerie says:

    Late in checking the toon, made me snort!

    The utter of embarrassment, yet again, after EU granting the extension. The must be wishing they’d refused.

  72. Dorothy Devine says:

    I say , I hope that assembly in freedom Square was given permission and adhered to the rules and regulations laid down by the police with a plethora of marshalls etc .

    Not to mention adhered to the minute of time laid down by the GCC.

  73. Abulhaq says:

    @manandboy 02:15pm
    Unionist don’t really need to march, they have the British army to do that for them.
    The loyalty of the military to the status quo, whatever that might be, is never in doubt.

  74. Terry callachan says:

    Lib Dem’s are opportunists riding on someone else’s back at all times they have been like that ever since the Gang of Four departed from labour and transformed into Lib Dem’s sometime later and beyond that partnering up with the tories.
    You cannot trust them.
    They will change their red line policies to whatever is most likely to win.
    A bit like Ruth Davidson .

    In Scotland the lib dems stronghold is Orkney Shetland with a fair gathering of them in Sutherland Fife and moray too , places where you have had a large number of English people moving in because of the HM Forces and farming and the oil and fish industries.
    It appears strange at first that nowhere else in Scotland votes Lib Dem but then you realise it’s the britnat contingency that gives them numbers in these areas as was seen clearly on question time in Elgin the other day.

    Make no mistake about it nine out of ten English people will vote for whatever party has best chance of defeating SNP in their local, every election is a Scottish independence referendum to an English person living in Scotland.
    Labour Tory and Lib Dem actually import English MP,s to contest elections in Scotland that’s why there are so many English MP,s in holyrood ,most,of them list MP,s and some don’t even live in Scotland .
    I can’t wait for the day when HM Forces are sent packing from Scotland along with their Union Jack flags
    I can wait for the end of Union Jack flags on all our Scottish produce
    I can’t wait for the deportation of BBC and the introduction of a Scottish broadcasting service
    that will show Scotland’s World Cup qualifying matches live on tv home and away

    I’m tired of BBC and STV showing England’s football matches home and away live on tv in Scotland whilst they only show the Scotland’s games live if at home with just highlights if playing away from home

    And why should we have to pay a tenth of the cost of the Olympics in London and a tenth of HS2 high speed rail

    England is a big neighbour for us ,twelve times as big, with a terrible crime record across the planet and an arrogant expectation and lack of respect for Scotland ,how did we ever get ourselves into this ? Who in their right mind would team up with them ?
    Betrayed by the same kind of people that betray Scotland now, Brown Darling Davidson and the rest
    Sure some English people in Scotland vote YES for Scottish independence but they are a small percentage ,many of them are actually married to a Scottish person or partner one or have a parent or grandparent who is Scottish and would qualify for Scottish nationality anyway but the bulk are britnats make no mistake about that.

  75. Hamish100 says:

    The Freedom Square march.

    Surely the organiser was arrested? For saying there would be thousands marching!!! lol

    According to the Herald 1300 – I think they counted the Police in!

  76. geeo says:

    Back to your rabid anti english claptrap callachan.

    Presumably you can prove all that bollocks ?

  77. Mac says:


  78. Mac says:

    Farage and Brexit Party Conference in Edinburgh is on YouTube.

    I couldn’t post the link for some reason.

    It’s cringeworthy, embarrassing, hypocritical, and Farage says some great words about how a country deserves to govern itself.

    Otherwise, it looks suspiciously like Rent-a-crowd, bused in especially for the event.
    It’s just too much like a set-up.

    I feel quite sick after watching.

  79. twathater says:

    I notice in the photies of the eghhh March the ????? stewards are dressed in their black paramilitary finery , is this supposed to make them look official or are they trying to confuse people by making them look like cops , if it is the latter there should be questions asked of the organisers

  80. Ken500 says:

    If the people in Scotland own it. The people in Scotland need to vote for it. No one else can. Get out there and play their part. Do not leave it to someone else. Join, donate, campaign. Do everything they can,

    Vote SNP/SNP. Vote for Independence.

  81. robertknight says:


    Just looking at the shot of Mary Scanlon on pg7 of today’s National. The epitome of a Blue Rinse Tory if ever there were.

    Typical BBC QT – more ‘plants’ than my local branch of Dobbies.

  82. Bobp says:

    Mac 3.47pm. It must have been what it was like with the same sort of mob in a munich beer hall pre 1939

  83. Gary45% says:

    I feel your pain. But to blame the English residing in Scotland for the sorry mess is well off the mark,imho.
    English football on the BBC etc. Do you still pay the license?

    Chris a belter of a toon. Nice One.

  84. Proud Cybernat says:

    “The loyalty of the military to the status quo, whatever that might be, is never in doubt.”

    There are plenty of former (and present) military who support Scotland terminating the Treaty of Union and, once again, being an independent nation.

  85. jfngw says:

    Heard a rumour that they were doing a remake of Thiller in George Square today, but the M.Jackson role was being done by someone in a manky jacket, is this true?

  86. Dan says:

    @jfngw says at 5:13 pm

    Nah, word on the street is there were auditions being held in Glasgow today for The Walking Dead. Apparently after 9 seasons they’ve now run out of zombies in America…


  87. Frank Gillougley says:

    Just to say, this year for obvious reasons this household will NOT be watching Eurovision. However, summoning all our powers of mind-melding we will be willing every phone voter and jury member to vote for Royaume Uni so that they are clear winners (and i dont even know what the song is or whatever).

    The point is that next year when the UK is no longer in the EU, they will have to host the Eurovision finals, spreading all their brotherly and sisterly love to all their fellow Europeans.

    It’s called Karma.

    Release your mind-melding bats now.

  88. CameronB Brodie says:

    From the Maybot to BoJo, that would be one hell of a delusional and illiberal dead-end for Scotland.

    What can we do? A philosophical analysis
    of individual self-determination


    The principle of self-determination, as commonly established, is based on a formal and individualistic view of liberty rights. This perspective, however, is inconsistent with the needs of a community and particularly with the necessity to promote integration between subjects and a relatively stable social order. I propose a different perspective, the one that not only takes into account individuals but also relationships.

    In particular, what I propose is: 1) that any community is aware of a specific social order, which consists of a set of practices, 2) that these practices express specific values, 3) that these values are the result of historical and cultural circumstances, 4) that they are subject to a permanent public debate, and finally 5) that the individual praxis can lead to recognition of rights only if it is consistent with these values. In this perspective there is no general liberty for self-determination of the subject outside specific relationships. It only could be stated that one has a practical liberty (not a right) to do and behave as one wants, but one’s rights depend on the relationships in which the person is engaged.

    Self-determination, relationships, community, values, rights, liberty, individualism.

  89. Dan says:

    @Frank Gillougley at 5:27 pm

    The UK’s next Eurovision entry will be by the band Fucks Biz! With a song titled – Not Making Our Mind Up…

  90. Abulhaq says:

    @Proud Cybernat
    Somehow, can’t visualise Scottish military personnel staging a coup d’état in support of independence. They will do as they are bidden by their seniors.
    Remember reading somewhere that the military in Scotland are unquestioningly ‘loyalist’.
    After three centuries of programing hardly surprising.

  91. Effijy says:

    Independence Square has had a significant problem for many years
    With the volume of pigeon droppings building up on the main concourse.

    In the past sonic booms, decoy Hawks and flashing beacons have been employed.

    No sign of pigeons today and credit given to a handful of irratic individuals waving flags
    That can claim the deaths of 10,000,000 innocent individuals against colonisation of their own countries.

    Myself, I’d rather have the bird shit than the British shit in my city centre!

  92. Gary45% says:

    Frank Gillougly@5.27
    If the TV boycott is what I hope it is, many thanks for the support.

  93. Socrates MacSporran says:


    To answer your question on your twitter feed Rev. that section is a corporate one. The “fans” sitting there are being permitted to enjoy the experience, they are not genuine fans.

    The occupants of these seats are still being wined and dined, deals are being done, contacts made, networking is going on – far more-important to these guys than the actual football.

    The FA has sold the game’s soul – assuming English football ever had one.

  94. Dr Jim says:

    Anna Soubry declares Scotland Independent in a speech in Glasgow today

    *Scotland had the good sense to vote remain in the referendum but the UK voted differently*

    Even when they’re pretending to be on our side they’re ignorantly stupidly not

  95. Frank Gillougley says:

    Very atmospheric cartoon Chris. It’s got a huge empty loneliness to it. As they (we’ll) find out soon enough.

    I wondered about the big patch of white in the lower right hand that the bus is heading towards, and thought hey! is that one of yon wormholes that the bus could go through and come out the other side, never to return, into an alternative zoomer universe and give us all a feckin break. Problem solved.

    Ah, wishful thinking, indeed, only to discover when i got my specs on, it’s a patch of sunlight. Drat!

  96. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Breeks @ 13:42,

    Here’s the framework of 2016:

    + Constitutionally speaking, the Claim of Right together with the Treaty of Union means that normally our soverereignty rests with our MPs in WM.

    + However in a referendum, WM explicitly transfers sovereignty directly to the people, at least in the case of an non-advisory referendum. Although the way the UKGov has been behaving, even in the case of a supposedly “advisory” referendum as well.

    + The consequence of that transfer is different in England and in Scotland. In the case of Scotland, because sovereignty is vested in the people, there can be no “advisory” referendum. For us, sovereignty is indivisible.

    + Having explicitly ceded sovereignty from our representatives in WM to the people in a referendum – any referendum – in the particular case of the EU referendum, the result of a 62% win for Remain is binding. The Unionist argument that “it was an all-UK affair only” is untenable, precisely because of the abovementioned constitutional difference.

    + Taking Scotland out of the EU against that vote therefore creates a constitutional crisis. (And that is actually the case irrespective of the existing SG mandate.) Tory posturing about shutting-up and meekly “respecting referendum results” is thus an egregious inversion of the truth, at least in their reaction to the 2016 EURef.

    So your basic take on the 2016 referendum is quite justified. And it rather disappoints me, as it also apparently does yourself, that the SG hasn’t (as yet anyway) made any legal move in that regard.

    However, there are two cautionary aspects to this:

    + We are not out of the EU yet. So maybe the SG are necessarily “keeping their powder dry” for that event. And presumably are frustrated that the event keeps getting delayed by the chaos in London.

    + In the end, this is British-style politics. There isn’t a tradition here of heavy-duty advance litigation over political issues, nor a proper Supreme Court with a constitution behind it. Instead we have a court with little apparent learning in, or understanding of, the unique constitutional position of Scotland within the UK. And above all, little understanding among the general population of the constitutional niceties as they affect them, fundamental to their interests as they may be.

    This is the main difficulty that the SG must labour under. Some of us may think that by bringing it into play, it might raise public awareness and act as a rallying-point, but it might instead be seen as a theoretical nit-picking exercise in futility and thus flop. Hence the irritating apparent lack of action on that front. It’s not an easy call to make.

    But maybe it’s still on the cards, awaiting its due time.

  97. Capella says:

    @ Mac – to post a Youtube link you have to remove everything before the www. The missing https:// will be added by the site. This is to prevent videos auto playing in the comments thread.

    You won’t get any message about it, your comment just won’t appear. But you can always click the back arrow and remove the prefix then post again.

  98. stu mac says:

    @Hamish100 says:
    18 May, 2019 at 3:32 pm

    The Freedom Square march.
    Surely the organiser was arrested? For saying there would be thousands marching!!! lol According to the Herald 1300

    You can laugh – and why not? But there’s serious side. Why were they allowed to march past the church where a priest was spat on and OAPs terrorised last year?

    This was challenged by Call it Out but the Glasgow council refused to stop them marching there. The SNP really needs to get a grip – either their Councillors are going along with this or they’re too feart to challenge the council officials who allowed this. Yes, everyone has a right to march but this was a situation where the council is seen to be accommodating intimidation of catholics.

  99. CameronB Brodie says:

    British nationalism is an expression of expansionist English nationalism. Or to put it another way, it is an expression of Tory cultural chauvinism. Or to look at it another way, it is an articulation of authoritarian, racist, misogyny.

    Reconstructing Self-Determination: The Role
    of Critical Theory in the Positivist International Law Paradigm


    Welcome to the third annual LatCrit conference’s panel on Race, Nation, and Identity: Indigenous Peoples and LatCrit Theory. As moderator of this panel, I will undertake two tasks. First, I will introduce the panelists and provide a few words concerning a common theme that this illustrious group will address. This theme revolves around the role that critical race theory may have on, what I will, call self-determination movements.

    In addition to making these introductory remarks, I will follow the theoretical framework of this conference by undertaking an innovative critical analysis of another common thread that weaves through all of these discussions, namely, the acceptance of the liberal international law doctrine of self-determination. In particular, I will critique the purportedly universal norm of self-determination in order to expose and explain its inherent subjectivity and the incoherence that results from its arbitrary nature.

    I will undertake this task by assessing the positive legal paradigm that exists for addressing international law. In addition to pointing out the flaws of the paradigm, I will engage in a deconstruction of the right of self-determination. I will conclude with a brief reconstruction of this right.


    Whether discussing the movements of indigenous people, the neocolonial plight of the people of South Asia, or a comparative analysis of Eastern Europeans, this panel is addressing what traditional parlance describes as a people’s quest for greater autonomy and for a separate state.3 In other words, we are describing various forms of selfdetermination.4

    Self determination is recognized as “the right of a people or a nation to determine freely by themselves without outside pressure to pursue their political and legal status as a separate entity.”5 The principie of self-determination is dichotomous. It is boldly radical and progressive, yet it is also deeply subversive.6 The principle as such has egalitarian underpinnings and is theoretically universal in its intended applicability and scope.7 “perhaps no contemporary norm of international law has been so vigorously promoted or widely accepted as the right of all peoples to self-determination.”8

    Self determination is grounded on human rights precepts that recognize that all peoples are “equally entitled to be in control of their own destinies”. Self-determination is based on principles of human freedom and equality. As such, it
    is at odds with colonial rule or similar forms of foreign domination.9

  100. Dan says:

    @Breeks at 6.42pm

    LOL, that’s a belter! That Yaxley-Lennon character certainly appears somewhat lactose intolerant!
    Although I see it was reactionary tweet by BK as Rev retweetewd this.

    You and myself being keen Euro fans, we should join forces with this hound in showing our frustration at losing our rights to live, work and love around Europe.

    I’ve currently got the hair, so if you self ID as a dog we could form a band and sing about our strife.


  101. Dan says:

    Arghh, apologies, dodgy mouse button failed to collect second link.

  102. CameronB Brodie says:

    If the full-English Brexit isn’t sufficient evidence that British nationalism is incompatible with the principle of universal human rights, I don’t know what will be necessary to move Scotland to seek justice and liberation from illiberal subjugation by Westminster.

    The Normative Status of Self-Determination in International Law:
    A Formula for Uncertainty in the Scope and Content of the Right?


    In this article I seek to identify and explore some of the legal consequences that flow from the various normative levels that have been ascribed to the right of self-determination in international legal doctrine.

    Four normative levels are considered: human right, association with sovereignty, erga omnes and jus cogens. A particular focus of the article is on how the doctrinal debate surrounding each normative level might impact on the willingness of states to help improve the determinacy of the scope and content of the right. I argue that there is a haziness surrounding the normative status of the right to selfdetermination and that this can help to explain the reluctance of states to publicise their views on the scope and content of the norm in international law. The article concludes with suggestions as to how a clearer
    understanding of the normative status of the right to self-determination might be achieved.

    Keywords: international law, self-determination, jus cogens, erga omnes, sovereignty

  103. CameronB Brodie says:

    British nationalism illiberal? British nationalism denies Scots the potential for “internal self-determination” (see the full-English Brexit).

    @Scottland In Union

    Internal self-determination

    It is generally agreed that peoples have a right to self-determination. The principle is present in UN and other legal documents as a moral1 or as a legal right (see also Chapter 17). But we must immediately distinguish between the right to internal self-determination and the right to external self-determination.

    The right to external self-determination is the right to own a sovereign state. It can apply to a population that already owns a sovereign state, but also to peoples that do not yet have one. In the latter case, it involves the violation of the territorial integrity of the encompassing state. It can take the form of secession when the people creates its own state, or association if the people associates itself with a neighboring state.

    Internal self-determination is in general defined as the right for a people to develop itself socially, economically and culturally within an encompassing state and to determine its political status within that state. This is how the notion is defined in the UN Charter (UN, 1945) and in the Declaration on friendly relations among states (UN, 1970). This is also how it is defined in the Declaration on the rights of Aboriginal Peoples. (UN 2007)

    In this paper, I focus essentially on the right to internal self-determination and its connection with secession. It is relevant to issues of external self-determination, because one of the main reasons for allowing unilateral secession to take place is the violation of the right to internal self-determination. If the encompassing state is not willing to grant internal self-determination to its component nations, this for the UN can count as an injustice and seems to justify a unilateral remedial right to secede.

    So in general, UN documents assert that peoples have a primary right to internal self-determination and have a remedial right to secession or external self-determination. And unilateral secession can be justified in the case of colonies, oppressed peoples and when the state does not secure internal self-determination for its internal minorities.2

  104. Mac says:

    @ Capella 6:39


    This is the cringeworthy Brexit Party Conference in Edinburgh. Are people really so stupid as to believe this populist rhetoric claptrap? They MUST be a rent-a-mob. No other explanation for the artificial hype.

  105. CameronB Brodie says:

    “It not easy being a Brexit supporter” – Louis Stedman-Bryce

    Being a racist bigot is part of the human condition, so supporting the full-English Brexit comes naturally to the “old-fashioned personality”. You are selling authoritarian, xenophobic, English nationalism to Scots you tit.

  106. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Mac @ 20:53:

    Are people really so stupid…(?)

    In a word, yes. Like it not, we can reckon that 25%-35% of voters in Scotland are by social or political inclination susceptible to a populist “Britain-first” message. Even one from an avowed English nationalist. There’s no point in wistfully pretending that we’re communally smarter than we really are.

    A lethal combination of Brexit chaos and potential Scottish independence has got the reactionaries-in-our-midst really upset, and the only question is how motivated are they to turn out and vote Faragiste instead of their usual LabConLibNobody custom?

    Which is why it’s absolutely crucial for all Remainers to get behind the SNP on the 23rd, whatever their individual reservations may or may not be.

  107. Robert Louis says:

    Breeks at 1342

    Excellent post. I totally agree, in particular about no more unforced compromises, and CLEAR leadership, with no more overthinking things. I do hope the Scottish Government has this all in hand.

    As regards eurovision, I can’t watch it, as a country actively involved in mass, barbaric genocide and illegal land seizures from poor people over a number of decades is hosting it. It is ok to say politics shouldn’t be mixed with things like singing contests, but does their not come a point, where the degree of inhumane barbarity indulged in by a country really means it is not fit to be hosting such an event?

    Let us hope that it is a civilised country which wins and hosts next year.

  108. Welsh Sion says:

    Latest poll for Euro Election – 9 000 respondents.

    SNP on course for 3 seats (out of 6) @ 38% of the vote. 1st place.
    PC on course for 1 seat (out of 4) @ 19% of the vote. 2nd place.


  109. CameronB Brodie says:

    Denying Scotland the right to self-determination, is in accordance with the “rational paternalism” of racist, colonial patriarchy. As such, British nationalism is well past its’ use-by date. Remember, the English school of International Relations tends to articulate a gender-blind and positivist interpretation of international law. Just one of the many reasons why the international community is wary of the British.

    A New Handbook of Political Science
    International Relations: Post?Positivist and Feminist Perspectives

    Questions the optimism for international relations cited in the 1975 Handbook of Political Science. Unprecedented global change has divided international relations, and optimism for consensus has eroded. Through a diversity of viewpoints, feminism provides optimism for the broadening of theory and of empirical base. Using a post?positivist methodology, feminism challenges ethnocentrism and state?centrism, and rejects universalism and claims of objectivity. Feminism’s appreciation of difference provides realistic optimism for the future of international relations.

    Keywords: difference, ethnocentrism, feminism, global change, international relations, objectivity, post?positivism, state?centrism, universalism

  110. Dr Jim says:

    The Nigel Farage party are flooding the internet with messages stating that all 27 EU counties are not Independent
    by asserting Scotland on joining would also not be Independent, it makes you wonder why Germany doesn’t revoke his non Independent German passport if they’re not a country

  111. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Dr Jim @ 22:02,

    Another example of Brexist paranoid anti-logic. We would be in the thrall of the other 27 countries, but each of them somehow magically escapes being in the thrall of the others… oh, including us!

    It’s hard to be level-headed in the midst of this latest outbreak of mass psychosis. History will look back on this episode and assign it – and its main protagonists – to the same category as the Salem witch trials.

  112. Ken500 says:

    They are not allowed to march pass where the priest was spat on. They cancelled the March because they were told to re route

  113. Capella says:

    @ Mac – I watched a few minutes of the intro with the sound off. Looks creepy. Will have a proper look tomorrow when I feel more up to it.

    I think the problem is that people lack the information they need to form a proper opinion on “populist” rhetoric. The media completely fail to present the facts. The BBC promote BREXIT and does anyone have a clue what “populist” actually means?

    How can any referendum work in the UK when a few oligarchs have such a stranglehold on information.

  114. geeo says:

    @Dr Jim

    So, Farage is saying the uk has also not been independent for over 40 years either, nor his beloved England since 1707, due to that other union.

    So ‘brexit’ is actually about seeking independence and Farage is a top proposer of independence.

    Except for Scotland coz thats different and …stuff !!

    They have not thought this stuff through properly huh ?

  115. Col.Blimp IV says:

    Robert J. Sutherland – “Which is why it’s absolutely crucial for all Remainers to get behind the SNP on the 23rd, whatever their individual reservations may or may not be.”

    We can all make guesstimates of what factors induce “the electorate” to choose one party over the others. I wonder how many normally SNP inclined voters feel that the Party is becoming more like a Trojan Horse packed full of European Federalists and blind adherents to whatever doctrine of he day is in vogue with the Middle Class Left.

    For my part I find it impossible to convince myself that the future well-being of the Scottish masses is more at threat from British/English Imperialism, than it is from Globalism and wonder how long I can continue to vote SNP while holding my nose.

  116. CameronB Brodie says:

    The BBC are enablers of right-wing populism, of course they’re going to shy away from explaining the trajectory Britain is taking. That doesn’t mean their awareness is lacking though, it’s simply an expression of institutional character and disposition. The BBC is charter bound to work against the principle of universal human rights, by promoting British nationalism.


    In view of everything that is engulfing Europe and perhaps the whole world, our present work is of course destined to be passed on through the night that is approaching: a kind of message in a bottle.
    — Horkheimer, 1940

  117. CameronB Brodie says:

    More on populist politics.

    Populism as an Expression of Political Communication Content and Style: A New Perspective


    In this article, the introduction to a special International Journal of Press/Politics (IJPP) issue on populism, we articulate and define populism as a communication phenomenon. We provide an overview of populist political communication research and its current foci. We offer a framework for ongoing research and set the boundary conditions for a new generation of research on populist political communication, with an aim to push the research agendas and design toward a more interactive, systematic, and in particular, comparative approach to the study of populist political communication.

    Keywords democracy, editors, comparative research, journalism

  118. Capella says:

    @ Col Blimp IV – nice try.

    @ CBB – Switzerland recently declared a referendum null and void because the information given to the electorate was false or inaccurate. That degree of electoral integrity is a mark of a mature democracy as opposed to a banana monarchy.

  119. CameronB Brodie says:

    Britain is an “ambiguous democracy” (see Scotland’s democratic deficit), fast on track to becoming a “failed-state” (see the full-English Brexit).

  120. Bobp says:

    Re the eurovision. Whats all this ‘us’ with norton. Irelands equivalent of the house slave.

  121. Bobp says:

    Well well england last.sorry britain.

  122. Col.Blimp IV says:


    Their may well be as many who vote SNP despite their unconditional Europhilla than there are those who do because of it.

    I voted remain, not because I think the EU pro’s exceed the Cons – I don’t. But because I hoped it would underline the differences between Scotland and that other place.

    Then the blasted SNP come along and try to sabotage the whole thing by conspiring with the Yoons to scupper Brexit.

    Thanks again for posting that Dick Gaughan Link…it brought back memories o fa time when everything was in back and white.

  123. CameronB Brodie says:

    I’m off on one again, more on populism. Remember, though the indy movement could be described as “populist”, it is progressive in nature and supportive of multicultural tolerance. Contemporary British nationalism is characterised by racism, xenophobia, and a disregard for the rule-of-law. ;(

    Regrounding Populism: Moving Beyond Questions of Definition and Content


    While conventional studies of electoral populism acknowledge that such mobilizations are linked to significant economic crises, their preoccupation with defining what exactly populism is often leads them to downplay the unified structural roots of different sorts of populistmobilizations.

    This essay presents the beginnings of an alternative framework for the study of electoral populism that draws on the neo-Gramscian theory of political articulation that links studies of global economic crises with conventional theories of populism. While crises are an endemic feature of global capitalism, their political manifestation is shaped by the varied institutional structures and legacies in which they are translated.

    Political articulation; Gramsci; Strategic depoliticization; Economic crisis

  124. Col.Blimp IV says:


    Terry Wogan did that as well, Idon’t think Eamon Andrews did but Alan Hansen let slip with one as well, so it’s not just the Irish…I think folk like that like to think that they have been accepted as Honourary Englishmen

  125. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    RE: the discourse on Dick Gaughan.

    I have this album on vinyl. I like how he used a unionist tune to promote Scottish independence. Satire, ur whut?

    The lyrics are below the video if you scroll down.

  126. HandandShrimp says:

    Who knew Farage was ultra Vegan and all dairy products have to banned within a two mile radius of his vicinity.

    I see Europe still loves the UK. Wish Scotland had its own entry. We might not win but I doubt it would be nul point.

  127. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Col.Blimp IV at 10.57

    Another false friend appears. Getting very boring.

    Street stall today in Dunoon. Met some real dafties. The usual – I want independence but I wont vote SNP because I want out of the EU. So you’d rather be governed by Boris Johnson than be independent? Puzzled silence.
    Answer. An independent Scotland will be able to make the choice about EU membership.
    Or, what was a very persuasive point. The EU will support Scotland’s right to independence. Look at the support they are giving Ireland.

  128. CameronB Brodie says:

    Watch out for yoons spinning the line that our movement is “populist” and so dangerous. They’re talking mince, our movement aims to re-unite Scotland’s democracy with Scotland’s popular sovereignty, i.e. the people. The nature of contemporary (white) British nationalism is definitely a dangerous variety of populism though, and needs to be countered with all available resources.

    Varieties of Populism: Literature Review and Research Agenda

  129. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    BTW: did anyone else notice that Madonna was singing slightly flat in her Eurovision “performance”?

  130. Dr Jim says:

    If The Tories dug up Martin Bormann and Himmler to run the the UK, Scottish Unionists would still rush to the polls to vote for them

  131. HandandShrimp says:


    Was chatting to one of our SNP peeps who took part in a street stall today. Said the response was encouragingly positive. It does help having a clear message on the EU without having to triangulate all over the place.

    Lib Dems can’t open their mouths without a whole load of unnecessary pish about Scottish independence and why the SNP made David Steel brush Cyril Smith under the carpet (no easy task).

  132. Col.Blimp IV says:

    Brian Doonthetoon

    Back in the day I had an Alisdair MacDonald LP that had that song on it. That was when Dick would have bitten his own tongue off rather than sing anything that might get him accused of being pro independence.

    Nice to see that things have taken a change for the better.

  133. chicmac says:


    “Who knew Farage was ultra Vegan and all dairy products have to banned within a two mile radius of his vicinity.”

    TBH I never thought he was really from this planet anyway.

    If however, he turns out to be deluged by said product, his innate blatant vitriol risks turning the ensuing coverage into cheese, a la halloumi, although the squeaking from that might cause cross communication issues with his own pronouncements.

    Perhaps he could be renamed Nigel Fromage?

  134. crazycat says:

    @ Ken500 at 10.39

    There were 2 marches proposed past the church.

    The first one was cancelled (revealing that the route was crucial).

    The second one happened yesterday; there’s film of it.

  135. Brian Doonthetoon says:

    Hi Col.Blimp IV at 12:52 am.

    You typed,
    “Back in the day I had an Alisdair MacDonald LP that had that song on it. That was when Dick would have bitten his own tongue off rather than sing anything that might get him accused of being pro independence.”

    Can I refer you to this?

  136. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Col.Blimp IV @ 22:57,

    Ah, “The Struggle against Globalism”. Well, from a Scottish viewpoint (you are a resident, I presume?), if you honestly believe that this is best conducted by the old clapped-out ConLab Cartel of Buggins Principle incompetents and a WM that in a year or two will likely contain a significant contingent of Faragist disaster capitalists, then good luck to you. You will need it for the eventual heartbreak.

    You would think it would be obvious by now that first things must come first. Without independence, you can go whistle for the rest. And which party is going to get us that, one has to wonder…?

    For all of a microsecond. Duh.

    (PS: Whatever happened to your three predecessors? Expired waiting for Nirvana to arrive, perhaps?)

  137. CameronB Brodie says:

    Some knowledge tools to counter the voodoo sold by the Fromage Prince.

    Expert discusses definition and effects of populism

  138. Col.Blimp IV says:


    I have met Alisdair McDonald, he has been a “Yesser” since the 60’s.

    The “Dick” or should I say ex-dick I was referring to was Gaughan, who in the 80’s came across as an out and out Scotland Denier, which was typical for Lefties back then.

  139. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Col.Blimp IV @ 01:28,

    Well, that was then. And your point is, exactly?

    The earth-shattering revelation that aware people change their views and political preferences as circumstances reveal previously-hidden realities, or that diehards refuse to change no matter what, or what…?

    You sound like a (small-c) conservative. (Hence the moniker, I suppose…)

  140. Col.Blimp IV says:

    Robert J. Sutherland

    No, of course I don’t, I grew up listening to fools who thought all the sins of every generation of Labour sell-outs from Ramsey McDonald to the present day, would be redeemed by the next incarnation of Keir Hardy, who was primed and waiting to lead us to a new socialist utopia.

    The SNP contains a lot of chancers, who would, but for Blair’s, monumental blunder of gifting us a Parliament, (that got Hijacked by the SNP), would be where the jobs and the power and the limelight was…which would be the Labour Party in Scotland.

    The SNP is also controlled by a bunch of control freaks “The Salmondeanies” who describe themselves “civic nationalists”, who have never been able to convince me that their love of Political Correctness does not exceed their love of Scotland.

    I have never not voted SNP but that might have a lot to do with the relative lack of virtue in the alternatives.

    There were more than a dozen predecessors (thanks to the invisible ascii characters). All suffered summary execution by the moderators at Hootsmon House during the First Cyberworld War.

  141. geeo says:

    Oh look..a new ‘concern troll’

    Wonder how long this one will last ?

    Gone in the ‘blimp’ of an eye, or gone in a ‘dusty bin’ ?

    Is it coco maybe in new clothes ?

    Is it Henry, the mild mannered janitor?

    Does anyone have a Scooby ?

    Or perhaps Officer Drivel at your service ?

    Another day, another faux indy disruptor.

    The British Leyland of Britnats, not built to last long.

  142. Col.Blimp IV says:


    If you read the post in the link, you would see that I was quite chuffed that DG had mended his ways.

    See The Gospel of St Luke 15:7…not that I am a believer.

  143. Col.Blimp IV says:

    Seriouslly geeo, would a Troll make up a story like that and to what end?

  144. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    Col.Blimp IV @ 02:25,

    Sorry, I had previously skipped your link. You appear to speak from experience. And your biblical quote was indeed the one I expected. One which applies to an ever-increasing number of us, one hopes.

    Your tart asides though leave me more than a little puzzled. You seem to have an unduly sceptical view of the leadership of the SNP, even granting the suspected tendency of some to indulge in (alleged) counter-productive displacement activity. Do I detect a reinvention of Reluctant Nationalist by any chance…? =grin=

  145. Ken500 says:

    Imagine if Scotland went into Eurovision trash with the cool pipes and kilts swinging it. Scotland would win it, The Europeans and Astrasians love it, The diaspora voting for it.

    Scotland pro rata won the Olympic Games.

    Tennis. Murray having to take a Knighthood he did not want for the fans. Forced to see politicians trying to cash in after matches. Boring. Andy would rather try and beat Jamie at table tennis the next day, and visa versa. Scotland loses out tennis funding from the UK Treasury. UK Tennis gets £60million of funding. Scotland get £800K of it. It should be £5Million pro rata.

    So much for the cringing knighthood. Scotland. been cheated out again. The Murray’s bring £Millions/Billions into UK sport. The Westminster Treasury undermines Scottish funding once again Scotland loses out, Westminster unionist imbeciles and vacant coupons. Brexit fools and chancers.

    The unionist Press trying to keep the non existent feuds going. Non existent spokesperson. Fake quotes that never happen. Pathetic.

  146. gus1940 says:

    Re last thursday’s disgraceful BBC QT propaganda farce from Elgin most of the criticism has been over the fact that the audience selection process allowed so many Tory politicos/activists or anti SNP individuals to flood the audience.

    That is bad enough but what is really serious is the fact that once they were in the audience they were carefully selected to ask questions or make comments.

    We must ask how did this occur? – was Bruce briefed beforehand who to look for in the audience or was she being directed through her earpiecen who to select.

    The selection of audience members to comment was so blatantly biased towards the political plants.

  147. Capella says:

    @ gus1940 – there is obviously a fatwa against mentioning the SNP unless SNPBad.

    I’ve been listening to RScotland GMS this morning to hear what they have to say in this week before the EU elections. They have so far managed to keep the SNP out of almost all discussion. The politics review was focused solely on the “two main parties” plus the LibDems. The SNP were briefly mentioned but only because of their effect on the LD election leaflets.

    There is now a lengthy discussion on the Church of Scotland and Christian Aid. Interesting though this is, it sounds like a huge diversion to get the presenters off the hook of having to do any real politics.

    In the purdah period before an election, I wonder how the Electoral Commission justifies the clear breach of rules practised by the BBC.

    Their extended media review coming up next.

  148. Dr Jim says:

    The SNP are just as riven over the EU as the Tories and Labour says a man *journalist* on Radio Scotland

    Of course then he went on to say we all want Brexit badly

    Robin Dinwoodie lambasts the Liberal Democrats for joining the Ruth Davidson no surrender party on their leaflets by mentioning the SNP umpteen times instead of talking about policy or Brexit

  149. Hamish100 says:

    BBC GMS neatly dodges the Sunday National front page from discussion. Let’s spend 5 minutes or so on the next royal wedding and discussions over what some royal clothes are being worn by some worthy.

  150. Capella says:

    The BBC website still hasn’t posted the Scottish Newspapers’ front pages. So their radio “discussion” can ignore The National and talk about Royal fashion and giggle about it without criticism. Except here:

    A Panelbase poll has the SNP way out ahead in the EU election polls, in spite of the BBC fatwa. However, strangely, Panelbase changes the SNP colours in their bar graph. The SNP appears green. All other parties are represented correctly.

  151. naina tal says:

    Re comments on “Scottish Breakaway” :
    First published I believe by the Bo’ness Rebels Literary Society who met in the now demolished Learig bar. Author is credited as “Thurso Berwick” (see what he did there?). This was a nom de plume often used by Maurice Blythman, who apparently was one of the many “Nationalist” literary figures who attended the Learig sessions.
    As well as the book I have a compilation LP with the song sung by the late Hamish Imlach, dating back to the late 1960s. (The unmistakable voice of Matt McGinn can be clearly heard in the choruses.
    The Learig bar was owned by Charles Auld, a great Nationalist stalwart, who always flew the saltire. A bit less common back then!

  152. Keith fae Leith says:

    Hi Capella,

    I think the colours are representing the “parties” in the European Parliament, no slight or insult to the normal colours of the SNP.

    As an aside, I complained to UKIP about breaching GDPR sending me a personally addressed election communication. They claimed that they have access to the electoral role and was perfectly legal to hold my personal data. They also claimed all the other parties would do the same (that’s a lie, all others came as a mail shot without name & address)

    Do any wise wingers know if this accurate?

  153. Macart says:

    @ Capella and gus1940

    Pretty much. Mibbies me, but the narrative of Betterthigitherness looking fairly thin gruel ’bout now.

    Given that the SNP are the party of Scottish government, the third party by mandate of the Westminster parliament and the second party by membership of the (Not Very) United Onion? You’d think that they’d rate a bit more of a meeja presence.

    Who knew?

    Scotland is the elephant in the room as regards the current political landscape.

    Despite the backstabbery, the twists and turns of Ms May’s government, the contortions of the Labour party to square its own circle and the sheer brass necked hypocrisy of the Libdems which have extended this process for everyone. The UK is headed precisely toward the political and societal place (carnage) it was always headed.

    Cameron got ambushed by his own electoral successes and arrogance. The nanosecond he won that election and found himself in a majority government, he was hoisted by his own manifesto pledges on the EU. The clock was ticking on constitutional crisis from then on.

    Cameron’s gamble/Tory pissing contest. A smidge of idiocy (OK… A barrel load). And the usual helping of that institutional arrogance and ignorance mentioned earlier. The rest is a directors cut of a process with an inevitable conclusion.

  154. Dan says:

    @Keith fae Leith at 9.58am

    I can confirm that the SNP, Green, and Conservative leaflets I received were not personally addressed to me, however both the UKIP and The Brexit Party ones were personally addressed.
    Dark Money covering the extra cost of processing personally addressed stuff?
    I thought I had received leaflets from all parties but it appears I haven’t received one from the LibDems as yet.
    Re. LibDems, I’m sure I also read that one household had two different types / wording of LibDem leaflet personally addressed to the two people residing at that address.
    I wonder if parties are specifically targeting certain areas where there may be more to be gained.

  155. galamcennalath says:

    Capella says:

    A Panelbase poll has the SNP way out ahead in the EU election

    SNP 38%
    BREX 16%
    LAB 16%
    CON 11%
    LDEM 10%
    GREENS 4%
    ChUK. 2%

    That would probably give SNP 3 and Brexit, Lab, Con 1 each.

    Great outcome for SNP.

    However, that’s 3 pro Brexit winners which doesn’t reflect Scotland at all. I would prefer to see an addition anti Brexit winner – ideally Greens, but LibDem would be appropriate.

    I do hope the Tories get none, so we can shove failure in Davidson and Mundell’s smug faces.

  156. Breeks says:


    10 mins watching Football, where the “Englishman’s” game has no peers, and 10 mins of Marr, where somebody has said people back Boris because he can be trusted.

    I swear, I don’t remember falling down a rabbit hole, but I’ve woken up through the looking glass.

    The world is surreal, and the surreal seems prosaic.

  157. call me dave says:

    Jings! Tory triffid plants in the audience as usual but shurley in the book only the visually impaired were caught.
    Do the BBC think the Scottish folk are daft?

    Farage balloons in Scotland discuss Brexit amid shortages of milkshakes and now reported sightings of blimps!

    Shortbread radio …anything /anyone except the SNP don’t mention any EU polls.

  158. Terrycallachan says:

    So here we have some interesting information
    I did not know that some of Scotland’s top judges who are amongst the best paid judges in Europe actually have other jobs working for other countries for example Qatar and UAE , it seams odd to me that our judges work as judges in the courts of other countries, how many people know this and why don’t these countries have their own judges ?

  159. Lenny Hartley says:

    Woo hoo , Oban’s Johm Mcphee wins French Motorcycle moto 3 Grand Prix,
    Sadly he had to endure an Anti Scottish song on the top step of the podium.

  160. chicmac says:

    Dick at the IF rally 12 years ago.

    I was also at the Celtic Connection’s concert in Glasgow’s Royal Concert Hall some years before that when, I think for the first time, he announced he was for independence.

    I happened to be looking at Billy Connolly leaning up against the back wall of the hall when he said it. What a scowling face he made, thought he was going to burst a blood vessel.

    Dick no longer does Celtic Connections because of BBC bias.

    Even Billy has been reported to be shifting on indy.

    Over a million Scots have moved to a position of supporting indy in my lifetime, very few of us have been there all our adult lives.

  161. ronnie anderson says:

    Keith fae Leith there are 2 electoral registrations , 1 private & the other public , if your on the Private register then there has been a breach of Data protection act , all councils sell information from the Public electoral register or they can your information from the Public Library .

  162. Terrycallachan says:

    This is interesting
    The European court of justice considering free speech and who sets the terms of use on platforms such as Facebook , if it is decided that the likes of Facebook have to extend their responsibilities it will mean an awful lot more work for them and put them at risk of breaking the law as opposed to the lesser risk of upholding their own terms of use

  163. DerekM says:

    I think we have to remember what happened last time since last time there was only tory and labour sharing the unionist vote this time Nigel is grabbing a big chunk of that.

    That is why Nigel is desperately trying to get us indy Scots to fall for his after brexit pish so vote for me then we can talk about indy yea right!

    He knows all he has done is hand this to the SNP and split the british nationalist vote up here ,the lower percentage each of the 3 parties will get effectively makes them fighting each other for 1 seat each lol

    Nigel tell you what you want to talk okay lets talk about English independence it is going to be happening, you want to be PM well guess what while we Scots are still in the UK that will never happen because we will dig up all your skeletons and expose them to the English people,but hey if we were indy we would be to busy having a pint and enjoying ourselves to bother and hey you might be able to come up and have a pint as well without McDonald`s having to ban milkshake.

    If by chance you are one of those Scots indy people who want out the EU as well remember we will be asking this question to the Scots people when we are indy but it would be a good idea for us to keep our allies if only for protection against westminster and the tories which Nigel happens to be as well ,he is an ultra tory a very rare breed of psychopath the tories are not tory enough for him.

  164. Sinky says:

    Strange how so called informed journos think Joanna Cherry is MP for Edinburgh South.

    Unionist Tory press distotions in run up to elections are normal including Daily Mail on Labour MP being Czech spy.

    Radio Scotland paper review this morning fail to mention Sunday National front page story and treat Scottish aspect of Euro elections as an afterthought.

  165. Dr Jim says:

    Marr to Rory Stuart on Brexit, let’s talk about migratory birds because they’re very important

    Eh? whit? did I? Eh? I thought I’d nodded off and was dreaming for a minute there

  166. Terrycallachan says:

    Where we are at with Brexit can be difficult with so many lies and half truths going around but I think this is a very good appraisal of where we are, the comment Theron is good too.

  167. yesindyref2 says:

    So the argument for the intelligent activist rather than the self-appointed SNP Stasi control freaking counter-productive nutcases goes like this basically:

    1. If you like the SNP and the EU, vote SNP
    2. If you like the SNP but don’t like the EU, vote SNP for Indy and for Margaret Ferrier – 4th on the MEP candidate list – a very hard-working Indy and SNP activist who was on the Glasgow INDEPENDENCE March
    3. If you like the SNP but don’t like the EU and don’t like Indy, vote SNP or forever see the laughing face of Nigel Farage or Ruth Davidson whose cause you helped by not voting SNP.

    4. If you don’t like the SNP but like the EU, hold your nose (HYN) and vote SNP for the EU. Who cares about the SNP, they’re just a party?
    5. If you don’t like the SNP but like Indy, HYN and vote SNP for Indy, who cares about the SNP etc?
    6. If you don’t like the SNP but can’t stand Nigel Farage or Ruth Davidson, vote SNP to keep both of them out. Surely you can’t stand them even more than you can’t stand the SNP! Seriously?

    7. If you think the SNP are thought police, well, what about the rest of them? Do you really want Farage or Davidson to be laughing at you with an MEP or even two for Farage? Did you like David Coburn? Really? How about Boris Johnson as your PM forever, with Farage his trusty mad sidekick?

    And here’s some notes:

    SNP 38%
    BREX 16%
    LAB 16%
    CON 11%
    LDEM 10%
    GREENS 4%
    ChUK. 2%

    a. Sadly for the Greens a vote for them appears to be wasted, please lend your votes to the SNP. They ARE, like the Greens, part of the Verts/ALE – Group of the Greens/European Free Alliance who currently had around 51 MEPS and represented Scotland very well – they had their conference in Glasgow last year to show support for Scotland and Remain.

    b. A vote for the LibDems is almost wasted, they’re below the borderline for getting one MEP. Why not give your vote to the SNP for the sake of the EU?

    c. If you’re against the EU but for Indy, please don’t give your vote to the Brexit party – think of Indy Ref 2 and Farage giving it a barrage! Hold your nose and vote SNP …

    d. Remember 2017? Were you responsible by not voting SNP for Tory Ross Thompson and 12 other Tories being elected to Westminster? Do you like that? Really?

    For activists refusing to help the SNP these last few days because of the stupid trio or for any other reason, get some blue food hygiene gloves, a nosegag, spray yourself with Eau de Cologne, and get stacks of those SNP leaflets, and give it a lash Jack! You know it makes sense. It’s not for the SNP, it’s for YOU and Indy Scotland.

    To summarise: vote and support SNP this time. It should be the last time before Indy Ref 2. Just one more time needed.

    Note for the self-appointed SNP Stasi thought police who totally stifle free speech in Wings and ruin the MT, you 3 in particular know who you are. If you are seriously pro-SNP which I very much doubt as you’re its worst proponents, then STFU as this posting makes way more sense and is more positive for the SNP in the European Parliament elections than your drooling drivel abject Sturgeon statue kissing does. Makes no odds to me anyway, life’s too short to put up with you AH’s, hence why I’ll only post rarely in future. BUT I AM STILL HERE WATCHING YOU BREAK THE REV’S RULES. And being exactly what the three amigos were actually talking about – cowardly sneaky cybernats – or flag trolls.

  168. Sinky says:

    On Sunday before Euros Politics Scotland ignores the SNP the largest party in Scotland.

    Imagine the outcry if leading UK politics programme had no Tory rep or apologist on the show during election campaign

  169. yesindyref2 says:

    Oh, did I forget to say?

    Vote SNP till you boak!

  170. ronnie anderson says:

    BDTT Keen ears Brian my thoughts exactly I dont think she has the vocal range she once had .

  171. Breeks says:

    Well, it’s taken long enough, but on the Marr show Corbyn’s position on Brexit is clear. He’s only going to make up his mind up about Brexit once he knows what the details of Brexit will be. It sounded wishy-washy, indecisive and lame, and strangely, I could swear I’ve heard it somewhere before….

    Then Nicola was made to look dubious and shifty, manoeuvred into protesting the SNP is more anti-Brexit than the Liberals, then walks straight into the ambush of SNP’s Soft Brexit policy of a Customs Union and Single Market access. Ah! But…. Ah! But… that was a compromise. Job done smirks Marr.

    Never mind, at least the Brexit result provided an opportunity for an opening counter argument to promote the Constitutional aspects of Scotland’s sovereign will to remain in Europe perhaps? Nope. Let’s speculate instead on the next UK referendum when the next Scottish mandate for anything will be overruled by a UK mandate.

    This is all getting so very fkn predictable.

  172. mr thms says:

    An excellent summary.

    I am in category 1.

  173. galamcennalath says:

    Reckon Marr’s questions to Nicola were supplied by Scotland in Union. Utter shite just trying cast aspersions on the SNP’s unwavering pro EU position.

  174. @Breeks,

    `Then Nicola was made to look dubious and shifty,`

    didn`t see that myself,thought Nicola was the only politician to come across as logical and consistent,

    quite supprised you saw it in such a negative light,

    knowling your previous and obvious admiration for the sainted Nicola. 😉

  175. Breeks says:

    @ Scot Finlayson… And you still don’t see why?

  176. crazycat says:

    @ Keith fae Leith at 9.58 and Dan at 10.11 (and Ronnie at 10.54)

    There are indeed two versions of the electoral register, but registered campaigners have access to the full one during elections, so there would be no breach of data protection provided they only use the information to contact you about voting.

    Candidates/parties are entitled to a single free delivery of their literature, but they still have to pay to print it. They have a choice of one per household or one per (named) voter. If they choose the latter, there are complicated rules about how they have to hand the (presumably more expensive because of the individually-printed salutation) leaflets to Royal Mail – they have to be sorted in a specified way. This also adds to the cost and risks error.

    Parties with money to burn sometimes split the deliveries for households with more than one registered voter; it still counts as one leaflet drop, but they’ve managed to convey two messages to the household.

    What I want to know, though, is who the two independent candidates are. I know their names, but nothing else. If they don’t send out literature, why would anyone vote for them, and therefore why have they just wasted the fee (which I think might be as much as £5000)? I don’t intend to vote for either of them, but I’m curious about why someone would do this.

  177. Col.Blimp IV says:

    Robert J. Sutherland at 4:15am

    No need to apologise but no, I have always posted using this Moniker, though not since Indyref1.

    In the interim I have not been anywhere near political websites nor have I had much contact with active SNPers. I came here because I found myself pondering the possibility of spoiling my ballot paper, an action which I once would have considered to be something akin to treason.

    I was considering writing in “Dr Robert McIntyre” as top of the SNP list on my paper, in homage to a speech he made at the first National Council meting after the ’79 Group took control and foisted “indpendenceineurope” on a hitherto moderatelly Euroskeptic Party.

    Basically while he accepted the merits of the device as a tactic that may embolden the fearties among the electorate. He went on to warn of the dangers of cosying up too closely to a Politico-Burocratic megalith, especially in a party that sought to mould all Scots into wanting control of their own affairs…that was long before the Euro, Mastericht, Expansion, free-movement etc…and whatever comes next – common foriegn policy, one army, federalism, who knows?

    His speech was met by warm but timid applause from the delegates and stoney faced immobility from the Platform, I rose to my feet alone and clapped as if I was being attacked by a million migdes and was slowly but comprehensively joined by the rest of the delegates, as the Bosses mimed reluctant applause(no doubt concerned that Alex may have been watching on CCTV). Kenny McAskill was first to break ranks and get to his feet, the others soon followed, even Nicola who was in the chair rose drawing a look that could have melted an ice-cap.

    Self-indulgent nonsense I’m sure…I’d probably have to shoot myself afterwards.

  178. Robert Louis says:

    It’s really simple, if you want to stay in the EU vote SNP.

    If you really, really don’t want to see Ruth Davidson and Farage with smug grins on their faces the next day, vote SNP.

    Labour is pro brexit, Tories are pro brexit, the Libdems and Greens won’t get MEPa elected in Scotland (as their vote share is too low) elected, despite being anti brexit.

    Therefore in Scotland, vote SNP, and send as strong a message as possible that Scotland is not happy, not happy at all.

  179. O.T. I am sure that I heard on the radio that many MPs have been acused of abusing their expenses and had their cards taken from them including Corbyn an Tom Watson does any one eise know if this is true ??? Because if it is they must have put a D notice on it as I have heard nothing since they will be classed as political frauds so no police action will be taken against them fraud is only a crime if it me or you who carry it out not MPs

  180. Col.Blimp IV says:


    As a Newbie it would be helpful to know who these dastards are…or will I find out for myself soon enough, should I elect to stay?

  181. cassandra says:

    @Col Blimp IV

    You will soon find out. No dissent is allowed, no criticism of the SNP is allowed because that means you are one of ‘them’. There are words you cannot use, terms that ‘out’ you apparently – it will all become clear.

    Basically, if you highlight arguments that can be used against the SNP, you are giving the opposition ammunition and demoralising the troops. It does not occur to the one-note SNP mob here that they do as much damage as they assume the opposition does. If you cannot argue your case here on a Independence site, it makes you wonder how much damage they are doing elsewhere.

    They are completely intolerant of any criticism of the SNP and some of the more ludicrous die-hards suggest that if you don’t like what the SNP are doing, you should join the Party. Really.

    You can protest all you like that you support Indy and that you vote SNP and are even a member but they won’t believe you if you say anything critical, especially about the FM.

    No warnings about the direction the SNP are heeded, not only must you vote without caveat or condition, you must support everything the SNP do.

    Hence, my username, Cassandra, warning what will happen if we do not take on board criticism. Some of us can see what is happening to the SNP and try to point it out to no avail. It is a blessing and a curse…!

    The vitriol in return is unbelievable. If the worst of them could hunt you down and come to your door and scream in your face they would. And the paranoia, always with the paranoia. You are a Britnat, you post under other names, you are trying to undermine them. They cannot see the one note authoritarian propaganda they use to convert voters, does the opposite.

    It is occasionally fun to turn it back on them but they are SO serious and angry all the time. You’ll see.

  182. geeo says:

    ‘cassandra’ the british nationalist in full pish dribbling flow.

    You will only get pulled up on here for talking utter pish and promoting anti indy propaganda.

    Like your pathetic trope above demonstrates perfectly.

    When did you last (ever) post an SNP/SG POSITIVE comment, ‘cassandra’ the blatent british nationalist windbag ?

  183. Undeadshuan says:

    77th are busy on here today, suppose it will get busier the nearer we are to achieving our goal.

    Not too long now, in the words of Sun Zhu

    “Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent’s fate.”

    “Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”

  184. Col.Blimp IV says:

    cassandra…… “They are completely intolerant of any criticism of the SNP and some of the more ludicrous die-hards suggest that if you don’t like what the SNP are doing, you should join the Party. Really.”

    The SNP has always in my memory, been utterly convinced that it holds all the Deeds, Patents and Mineral Rights pertaining to Independence and the current Bosses are either blind or indifferent to the fact that as they inexorably push the Party into being more of a party of the “Orwellian Trendy Left”, They risk alienating many independence supporters.

    I did think about re-joining but feared that I might discover I had morphed into a latter day version of the auld fossils, who 30 odd yrs ago tried to stymie just about anything new or constructive with never ending negativity, tales of how it was done in the old days and spurious points of order.

  185. Col.Blimp IV says:

    One down…two to go?

    eh…yesindyref2 !

  186. geeo says:


    Hilarious last wee sanctimonious spew there, you just cant help it huh ?

    You claim you are “watching us break the rev’s rules”

    Which rules would that be then ?

    Is it the one where people shouldn’t “play the man” perhaps ?

    When you then attack “3 posters” with the following drivel.

    “the self-appointed SNP Stasi thought police”

    “If you are seriously pro-SNP which I very much doubt”

    “your drooling drivel abject Sturgeon statue kissing”

    “life’s too short to put up with you AH’s”

    “being exactly what the three amigos were actually talking about – cowardly sneaky cybernats – or flag trolls”

    So much drivel, it seems rude not to highlight the inconsistences in it, but lets stick to just one.

    How can “the 3 amigo’s/AH’s you reference, be/do both the following.

    1. “your drooling drivel abject Sturgeon statue kissing”

    2. “If you are seriously pro-SNP WHICH I VERY MUCH DOUBT” (my Caps)

    If the “3 amigos” you reference are NOT PRO-SNP then why on earth would they want to ass kiss Nicola Sturgeon and erect a statue for her ?

    “Life is too short to put up with you” yet here you are with a completely unsolicited attack on 3 posters.

    You are all over the place, and making a complete fool of yourself.

    Your pals at the Herald, Uncle Tom Gordon and Leask, would be proud of you.

  187. yesindyref2 says:

    And not even once in that claptrap did “geeo” say:

    “Yes indeed, vote SNP on Thursday”.

  188. CameronB Brodie says:

    Thanks to Capella, I see that Panelbase appear to have outed themselves as being politically biased. Changing the colour used to represent the SNP, from yellow to green, definitely appears to be deliberate misrepresentation of political identity. It would appear Panelbase are supporting the drive to split the vote for the SNP, in the upcoming EU elections. What total clowns.

  189. Ghillie says:

    And as Thursday approaches the unionist panic rises =)

  190. Capella says:

    @ CBB – but see Keith’s comment above where he explains that Panelbase are using the colours of the EU group the SNP belongs to. Just “unfortunate” that the SNP is the only party which loses its traditional branding.

  191. CameronB Brodie says:

    Ah, thanks for the correction and thanks to Keith fae Leith.

  192. Robert J. Sutherland says:

    geeo @ 15:12,

    Has it never dawned on you yet that your abrasive intolerance is the very fuel for the likes of cassandra? You deliberately set out to aggravate people then stack up their resulting responses and use it against them. But you – YOU – are invariably the instigator of the gratuitous unpleasantness in the first place, not them.

    The net result is that you poison every thread in which you deploy these nasty tactics. I don’t know whether you have an anger management problem or are deliberately setting out to spread harm, but whatever it is, you are certainly succeeding in damaging the reputation of the SNP, the party you claim to support.

  193. yesindyref2 says:

    The link I have doesn’t work, maybe because of the election, but from wayback you can see a pie diagram of the MEPs and their groups:

    the Verts / ALE are the green slice of the pie. I like pie. Here’s an interesting page too:

    Smith and Hudghton were in the EFA, and presumably all 3 / 4 SNP MEPs would be too.

  194. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    Everyone in this thread: fucking behave yourselves. Don’t make me tell you twice.

  195. CameronB Brodie says:

    Thanks for confirming what I’d learnt thanks to Capella and Keith fae Leith. 😉

  196. yesindyref2 says:

    For anyone who wants to find out a bit about the EU, here’s my quick guide:

    It’ll need a bit of updating after the EP elections. Its purpose is to show that, despite Brexiteer claims to the contrary, the EU is democratic.

  197. CameronB Brodie says:

    @UK Prime-minister
    You’re illiberal stance towards Scotland and the EU, is indicative of right-wing, authoritarian, nationalism, and is tangentially divergent from a universal respect of human rights and liberty.

    Freedom beyond the threshold:
    self-determination, sovereignty, and global justice


    In current debates about global justice, statist and nationalist theories appeal to the right to self-determination in argument against egalitarianism beyond borders, and in general as a reason for caution about substantive international duties of justice, lest the exercise of self-determination would be too tightly constrained. Has self-determination – an important heritage of decolonization – *no longer a role to play in the argument against international inequality and disempowerment?

    In this article, I examine a dominant interpretation of self-determination in the global justice debate, as defended prominently by John Rawls and David Miller and find it wanting. Specifically, two challenges are raised: at the conceptual level this interpretation leaves unclarified the distinction and relationship between sovereignty and self-determination; at the normative level, this interpretation adopts a sufficiency view of international distributive justice that neglects that problem of relative extents and measures of self-determination, beyond the threshold.

    While the article’s argument is mainly of a critical scope, it is suggested that a more robust theoretical account is required of the content of the right of self-determination, and in particular of the freedoms that the right confers to
    the right-holders in the socioeconomic domains and their extents.

    Keywords: sovereignty; self-determination; global justice; John Rawls; David Miller; international investment law

  198. CameronB Brodie says:

    Some legal context to the full-English Brexit, which takes a big smelly poo on the Scottish right to “internal sovereignty”. Contemporary British nationalism is illiberal in nature and will harm Scotland’s public health and political economy. Scotland faces a crises made in England and must do all that is possible to protect itself from maladministration of bad law.

    Self-Determination as a Human Right
    The Emergency Exit of Remedial Secession


    The phrase ‘self-determination’ has a strong appeal. In a nutshell, it gives peoples a free choice which allows them to determine their own destiny.7 Traditionally, a distinction has been made between external and internal self-determination. However, for reasons of international peace and security the right of self-determination needs to be balanced with the territorial integrity of States. That is why outside the colonial context, the emphasis must be on the internal aspect of self-determination.

    This thesis examines self-determination as a human right, focusing on the central question whether international law allows for a right of external self-determination in the form of unilateral secession when the internal right of self-determination is breached. It is argued that there is a right of unilateral secession based on customary international law, despite the fact that State practice is limited.

    According to the theory of modern custom, ‘a substantive manifestation of’ opinio iuris ‘may compensate for a relative lack of practice’.8 The author argues that there is strong opinio iuris within the international community in support of a right of unilateral secession, albeit that this right is subject to very strict conditions and may only be invoked as a last resort.

    Peoples are entitled to resort to unilateral secession only when they are persistently excluded from political participation, suffer from gross violations of fundamental human rights and have exhausted every local remedy available to find a peaceful solution to the conflict. In other words, remedial secession may be used as an ‘emergency exit’ only.9

  199. Hamish100 says:

    Col clipe
    “.. to vote SNP while holding my nose.”

    Is it some sort of initiation ceremony you get involved in ? Is your trouser leg rolled up while you hop to the SIU office?

  200. Heard earlier today that the Brexit Party isn’t actually a party – it is a private? business.

    There are no ‘members’ only ‘registered supporters’.

    Can anyone verify if this is the case or not?

    If so, I’m not sure what the significance is of the difference but perhaps it could be a way round having to accredit ( large) donations – not that Mr. Farage would ever consider such an act…

  201. Foonurt says:

    Jist fine.

    Yurr guid ett, cawinit richt.

  202. Cactus says:

    Hey, the wheels are already coming off of their bus and they’ve not even landed yet. The “BREXIT” sign pointing to their right, leads to the depths of doom… but if ye pan to the left, you will see the “INDYREF2” sign, pointing to our left, which builds new bridges with our excellent international European neighbours 🙂

    Quality cc

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