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Wings Over Scotland

Return Of The Fear

Posted on July 24, 2023 by

Wings readers are of course the last people in the country who need any reminding of what a ditch-slithering creature Scottish Labour activist Duncan Hothersall is. And in truth by his standards these tweets are only about averagely despicable.

But it’s what they don’t say that’s notable.

The casual dismissal of Salmond being completely acquitted by a jury on every single charge after one of the most intensive and wide-ranging investigations in Scottish legal history is of course still alarming in its snide undermining of due judicial process. The characterisation of the events as a “rape trial” – Salmond was not accused of rape – is no more dishonest than Hothersall’s usual modus operandi, but no less contemptible.

The attempt to criminalise by innuendo someone being a tactile person – we all know people who’ll bearhug you as soon as look at you, but also others for whom a formal handshake is still uncomfortably familiar – is merely typical of Hothersall’s fondness for smears over coherent arguments. Neither being tactile nor indeed having “sexual contact” are in any way unlawful or even improper. We’re all here on Earth, after all, as a result of sexual contact.

And the basic factual inaccuracy – as far as we can recall Salmond only acknowledged a single instance of fully-consensual, fully-clothed but vaguely intimate contact with one of the complainants, not two – is absolutely par for the Hothersall course.

The revealing thing, of course, is the extent to which the mere sight or thought of Alex Salmond still convulses Unionists with absolute terror.

It’s certainly true that it’s increasingly difficult to watch any TV news or look at political social media without seeing the Alba leader’s happy face. With recent appearances on Question Time (BBC1), Debate Night (BBC Scotland), Any Questions (Radio 4) and Sky News, uncountable sightings on the smaller news channels, his own excellent new online show and what will doubtless be a sold-out Edinburgh Fringe run, Salmond is almost as much a fixture on people’s screens as he was during the indyref, and is in ebullient, incisive form.

(The quality of celebrity hauners Salmond has been able to call on for his Fringe show, incidentally, is striking, and all the more so if compared to the ranks of, to be generous, D-listers like Janey Godley, Alan Cumming, Val McDermid and, um, Susie McCabe that his successor scuttles around with.)

The ex-FM is also somehow finding the time to take the Wee Alba Book roadshow to every town and village in Scotland, directly reaching tens of thousands of voters while the SNP hides in stage-managed members-only events and demands £40 from its “conference” attendees to listen to speeches with no right to speak or vote.

Alba, in fact, is now the de facto lead party of independence campaigning in Scotland, partly because it’s diligently putting in the hard work on policy but also simply because nobody else is actually doing any. The SNP/Green administration is focused entirely on making every possible aspect of the lives of put-upon working people miserable and unaffordable with its incessant nanny-state meddling, and has openly abandoned any genuine ambitions for achieving independence.

So it’s not surprising that Unionists – like the career devolutionists now in charge of the SNP – are horrified by the prospect of Salmond returning, Rasputin-like, from what they were sure this time was his grisly end.

Because they know that while Alba is still a minor fringe party in the polls, what actually matters in reality is politicians who are capable of making the political weather, not just reacting to it. (This might be a timely point to remember that Brexit, the biggest political change in Britain in the last 50 years, was brought about chiefly by a man who’s never been elected to anything in his life.)

On that scale Alex Salmond is a Category 5 hurricane, and with the indy leadership stage essentially vacant, it’s no wonder that the enemies of independence are once more scurrying for their dank, rancid basements in growing panic.

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0 to “Return Of The Fear”

  1. AnneDon

    Hacks of all parties are puir ragin at Alex Salmond for not disappearing.

    They cannot imagine a political principle worth fighting for, far less that someone could dedicate their life to it when they aren’t being paid to do so.

  2. Argentocoxos

    Alex, Alf Baird, Salvo in aboot them!

  3. Dot Jessiman

    Remind me to avoid this Hothersall who clearly is unable to to distinguish between touch and grope!

  4. BaronessSamedi

    I’ve seen Alex Salmond twice in Arbroath, within a year.. As good value as ever.

  5. Graf Midgehunter

    “Alex Salmond is a Category 5 hurricane”

    He’s OUR hurricane and I very much hope with ALBA, ISP, Salvo and Liberation that the Indy Movement gets into overdrive and gets the INDEPENDENCE that we all want.

  6. Geri

    He’s Obi Wan to anyone seeking independence. He is our only hope.
    Eejits within the YES movement who say otherwise are not independence supporters.

    Of course they fear him. The whole reason he had to be falsely accused.

    Duncan also named someone. Shall we expect the full arm of the law to cart him away sometime soon? He could share with Sophie.

  7. Cuilean

    Doubtless, the horrible Labour stooge, Hothersall, will smear ‘Wings’ as ‘pro-Putin/Russia’ because of your reference to ‘Boney M’s Rasputin’ song! That is Hothersall’s lunatic, gutter level of ‘journalism’. Same as the other labour jigsaw stooges, Garivelli and Kirsty Wark

  8. ScottieDog

    Thing is, the more they shout about the ‘rape trial’ the more they will undoubtedly end up with egg on their puss, if that is, more comes to light.

    As for labour, starmer will happily be seen masquerading with a war criminal but won’t be seen dead with a progressive left figure. Says it all really.

  9. Sandra

    It’s no wonder empty vessels like “house-husband” Hotdogstall fear a genuine thinker and strategist like Salmond. His very existence is like kryptonite to them, showing them up for the waste of oxygen they are.

  10. Dave Llewellyn

    @Dot Jessiman
    That’s because the only sexual experience Hothersall ever managed was after he rohypnoled his sister. Allegedly .
    Actually I just made that up but it’s not hard to imagine .

  11. Mike d

    Surely a case for libel against that piece of vermin.

  12. Cuphook

    Another example of the fear from Gillian Bowditch.

    Braveheart… bonkers… White…

  13. A Scot Abroad

    A majority of people don’t follow political ins and outs on a frequent basis. Some don’t even think about politics between elections.

    Salmond may have a good strategy for Alba and an iScotland, or the route to an IndyRef, but unless his tactics include reaching out to those people who voted SNP without much thinking about it, they will carry on voting SNP and all that will do is to split the Yes vote between Alba, SNP, and ISP. Resulting in nothing much being achieved, because that’s always the result of a split vote.

  14. BettyBoop

    The atmosphere in the room lifts when Alex Salmond speaks.

    I was driving when I heard him start his delivery of his opening statement at the inquiry into the Scottish Government’s handling of his case and tears started rolling down my cheeks (not great when driving by the way). This was what was missing from Scottish politics, an intelligent statesman who speaks without waffle and can hold your attention whilst elucidating his points.

    There is a warmth to his character missing from the cold fish who succeeded him. He seems to genuinely like contact with the public and it is clear that, unlike some who claim to do so, he wants statehood returned to Scotland for the benefit of its people.

    It is clear from recent tv debate programmes that audiences can be unsure or somewhat hostile towards him, but, noticeable that after a few questions answered, most generally relax and appreciate the gravitas of his contributions. His Wee Blue Book shows are enlightening as is his new, informative “Scotland Speaks” programmes. At last, someone broadcasting about Scotland without demeaning the country.

    I am looking forward to the “Ayes have it, the Ayes have it” again proving the this is a person who can respect and work with people across the political spectrum.

    Who’s Hothersall anyway?

  15. Astonished

    We can all smell their fear. And this yoon fear is well-founded.

    Alex has survived a yoon stitch-up aided and abetted by many in the top echelons of the nuSNP. They are being found out.

    The idea of ‘Scotland United’ candidates is gaining ground.

    The only people who will oppose ‘Scotland United’ are yoons.

    There are still those who haven’t yet seen through the nuSNP leadership, or hope that things will change. They are avoiding the horrible truth – That Sturgeon and her cabal betrayed us all.

    If you want independence join Alba or ISP. The bigger these parties get the more likely ‘Scotland United’ becomes.

    P.S. It is also noteworthy that the nuSNP transcult are still trying to brand Alba as a fringe party. How very old, useless labour party.

    P.P.S. I also note that I haven’t heard a single nuSNP politician slagging Alba lately. They know which way the tide is turning, and it’s not pro-Humza.

  16. Rob

    Facebook just threw this at me…

    “An SNP activist is seeking to challenge Humza Yousaf for leadership of the party.
    Chris Hanlon, secretary of the West Fife and Coastal Villages SNP branch is pledging to give ordinary members more power to decide policy.”

    Anything in it?

  17. desimond

    All for Alex but give me Alan Cumming over Tasmin ‘What Party this Week?’ Ahmed-Sheikh any day

  18. dandydons1903

    Feel the fear of the nasty britnats.

  19. fiona

    What a nasty snidey wee nyaff DH really is. I think ditch-slithering creature will be my new go to insult. It’s catchy and conjures up the perfect image of belly crawling beasties…

    I’d love to see a come back from a legal voice on that particular “rape trial” mention…. it’s completly wrong and just follows DH’s usual ‘throw mud and hope it sticks on something/someone’ approach to “journalism”

    Quite frankly DH is not fit to lick Alex’s boots IMHO.

  20. Captain Yossarian

    This article is well written and apposite.

    When confronting an adversary like Salmond, you have to dispatch him; don’t leave him on the ground to recover.

  21. Cath

    “ ing is, the more they shout about the ‘rape trial’ the more they will undoubtedly end up with egg on their puss, if that is, more comes to light”

    This exactly. There are well kent names who, when more comes to light, will end up forever known as women who falsely accused a man of rape. Very few of us will be kind enough to bother explaining “she technically didn’t, she only falsely accused him of touching her back/knee etc, but at a very public event so easily disproved”. We’ll just shrug and go, “yes, she is”.

  22. Beauvais

    Another benefit to add to the endless benefits of liberation is that in independent Scotland no one would want to talk about Duncan Hothersall any more.

  23. Stephen O'Brien

    Talking about split votes, there’s remedy for that.. Scotland United or Dissolution of the Scottish National Party!

    It’s a simple choice for the NEC.

  24. Margaret Wilson

    I read about the ridiculous discontinuation of boilers and making heat pumps mandatory and I have to say it made me more convinced that our politicians haven’t a brain amongst the lot of them. There are old houses, tenements and loads of other unsuitable buildings in Scotland where heat pumps would be nigh on impossible to fit. This sounds like yet another scheme that will fall by the wayside. What about the imposition to fit home heat alarms, the failed census, the Hate Crimes Law, the GRA? I could go on and on but I’m just sickened by the wee gnaffs who sit in Edinburgh scheming on how they can continue to annoy me. At least when Alex Salmond ran the government we saw a few decisions which improved our lives.

  25. Eric

    Might be credible to say unionists are scared of Alex Salmond if the Alba MPs were brave enough to stand and win on that ticket.

  26. Mia

    Mr Hothersall, you are old enough to know it is not what somebody is accused of what counts. What matters is what you can prove has happened, what you are charged with, and of course the credibility of the acuser.

    If the accuser has been proven to have been lying, because, for example, let’s say, there might be witnesses proving the accuser was not even present at the location at the time the accuser claims the crime took place, then there is no crime, there is no valid accussation and there is no valid accuser.

    What you are left with in such circumstances is scope to pursue a potential case of perjury and potential case of malicious prosecution against the accused, who has now become the victim, by somebody making a false accusation.

    What you appear to be doing is building a very heavy castle over crumbling foundations of hot air. It is dishonest. You might be thick enough to believe dishonesty and taking voters for fools is a good political strategy, but you are insulting the intelligence of the average voter who can see right through tacky attempts at misinformation. That will not do much good to your credibility.

  27. Dave Llewellyn

    @harry mcaye
    He didn’t actually name her . She was named by someone outside the jurisdiction of the High Court and he confirmed it by saying that he was going to report the tweet from inside the courts jurisdiction which under the definition given by Lady Dirrisn in the Craig Murray trial was definitely jigsaw identification . He also in a prior conversation helpfully stated that he was “not a journalist” so there’s not even the Dorrian get out of free card of NUM membership . ?

  28. Den

    Just my opinion but I’m afraid that with most Scottish voters being A political, they tend not to look much beyond the main headlines. Tragically I fear what the SNP did to AS reputation (outed him as a bit of a sex pest at best) will see him unelectable in the eyes of many. I think he needs to be a right hand man to a more pallatable No1. (A navigator and not a driver)

  29. Gregory Beekman

    Best. Video. Ever.

    Love how the man acts dropping dead at the end.

    (Yes, I’m talking Boney M!!!)

  30. sog

    Might there be a market for a maker of garden gnomes to produce a lookalike of a certain politician? I’d order one.

  31. ScotsRenewables

    Eric says:
    24 July, 2023 at 1:33 pm
    Might be credible to say unionists are scared of Alex Salmond if the Alba MPs were brave enough to stand and win on that ticket.

    The idea that electoral success is a necessary prerequisite for being a major political influence is given the lie by the case of Nigel Farage. Farage was the single biggest force behind the stupidity that was Brexit, yet he was never elected to the HoC.

    (Farage stood for election to the House of Commons seven times, in five general elections and two by-elections, but did not win any of those elections.)

    The constant refrain re. ALBA’s electoral record is the last refuge of the charlatan.

  32. robertkknight

    Duncan Horsefeathers should simply GTF.

    I hope Salmond has his legal team all over the tosser.

  33. John Thomson

    Thank you for that you do and can I also say that I agree with everything you write, hoping Alex has you on his new show

  34. dearieme

    I used to dismiss the absurd claims of the old Labour Party to care terribly about the poor and downtrodden. But even I am astonished at the consistency with which the modern Left tries to make “every possible aspect of the lives of put-upon working people miserable and unaffordable”.

    It’s a disgrace. But it’s also a mystery. What on earth is going on?

  35. sarah

    @ Rob at 12.35: “Chris Hanlon standing as SNP leader pledged to give ordinary members more power to decide policy…. Anything in it?”

    Well it’s in The National so it must be true. 🙂

    Chris was one of the Good Guys in the conference when we tried to restore good people to the NEC.

  36. James Che

    If Alba had more members in the running in all areas for elections, who needs the to join up with the nuSNP unionist that are full of old Labour and the Greens run funded from outside Scotland,

    A Alba in every seat possible would do it,
    We do not need the unionist parties like the above in Scottish institutions to derail Scotland into globalist ideology.

  37. Sven

    What seems certain is that Mr Salmond is the only UK government or devolved administration leader who can point to a decent level of competence when in office, my view.
    He came to power as FM in 2007 when few seriously gave the concept of Scottish independence a fighting chance.
    Just 7 years later he had brought support to heading towards 50%, achieved a referendum and was leading a nation which was demonstrating a level of consistently getting better in all areas of everyday life which affected ordinary working folk.
    All without regarding the other areas of Britain as enemies with whom to pick fights or theorising about post colonial theory. He just plain demonstrated how well Scotland could govern itself when offered the opportunity.
    And then came the Murrells …

  38. Casper1066

    Alex’s legal team really needs to slap these people down personally, then the rag they write for.

    If not they will keep at this.

    Alex needs to bite them.

  39. Rob

    Sarah @ 2:13, thanks. Pinch of salt taken.

  40. deep green

    Mgt Wilson @1.24

    Thanks for your post.I agree with you regarding air source heat pumps.It is quite distressing that there are politicians who don’t bother to acquaint themselves with the technical issues (I suspect that many are too cognitively challenged to do so) before trying to pursue some hare-brained policy or other. In this case one suspects that the model has been borrowed from some Swedish/Scandinavian system where Heat pumps have been adopted with some success, but within the context of much more favourable social and economic conditions.

    The initial stage of the process of improving energy efficiency is the improvement of the quality of the housing, which has an huge impact on the health of the occupants.

    Making the current housing stock compatible with using heat pumps is an enormous technical mountain to climb. As you say- much of Scottish housing is extremely difficult to adapt. A serious politician would break this down into achievable increments and develop policies that are likely to achieve success, communicate these to the population and provide the means by which to achieve them.(finance/training)
    IOW there would be a coherent plan but, as we all know. the current government are great at flying kites but not so good at bringing them down to ground level without a crash.

    This morning on R4 a podcast made the point that the NHS is often forced into a cycle of health repair of acute health conditions in hospitalised individuals who return to inadequate housing/poverty where the conditions dictate that the recovered individuals will quickly decline again. Prevention is not within the gift of the medical people while there is such a deficit in social conditions and services.

    It all sounds a bit ‘green/Patrick Harvie’ but I am not sure of the source.

  41. Mia

    “what the SNP did to AS reputation”

    The SNP? Looking at all the actors involved, there were elements from the SNP, elements from the Sgov, elements from the UK civil service, elements from the press and broadcasters, elements from the police and elements from the crown office.

    It was published it was the crown office who instigated on the police the investigation on Alex Salmond. In other words, the crown office authorised the misuse of public funds to mount an investigation of industrial scale trying to ping down something (anything?) on Mr Salmond.

    The SNP was just one cogg in a much bigger machine. The useful idiots, if you like.

    For quite a while now I have been wondering what the real reason behind the apparent abuse of power by the COPFS to supress those infamous whatsapp messages from public view was.

    I have had the suspicion for quite sometime that it was never to protect the aphabetes at all, but rather to keep a lid on the identity of whoever was coordinating them and the whole operation.

    And if there is any scintilla of truth in the hypothesis that the alphabetes were coordinated (and coached?) by something/someone, then the immediate question that arises is if bringing the criminal case forward as an application of the moorove doctrine in such scenario was not in fact an obvious case of malicious prosecution abusing power for political reasons.

    Who was really the “brains” engineering the case and who was the authority placing the order for such case to be built?

    Personally I do not think such authority would give a rat’s arse about the alphabetes. Once the strategy went sour, I think it has been all hands on deck to protect this authority’s own credibility (pretence of political neutrality or non-intervention?) in the eyes of the Scottish people.

  42. Ruby Tuesday

    If there is a greater risk of the ‘Alphabetties’ being named & shamed maybe even charged it will be even more important for the ‘ditch-slitherers’ to continue promoting the idea that Alex Salmond is a rapist.

    Alex Salmond is great. I’ve really missed his show on RT glad to see he has a new show.

  43. David Hannah

    I could not be more prouder to rally around Alex Salmond. I admire him. I think he’s a great man. I’ve got his book. The dream shall never die.

    Love him.

  44. Geri

    There isn’t going to be a split vote.
    There’ll be those who want independence & those who don’t.

    Their move.

    Salmond has said if they refuse a united offer then he’ll be standing against them.

    What the NuSNP fail to realise is that their core support will never forgive them if they don’t so it’s a lifeline or political suicide & they can go sit with Labour pondering where their wheels went..

  45. Lorna Campbell

    The thing is: Alec Salmond is our Braveheart. They hate him for it, the pretendy independistas of the SNP/Greens, as well as the Unionists. They thought he had been well and truly screwed after the introduction of the illegal code of conduct, then they thought he had been well and truly screwed before the trial, then they thought he could never make a come-back. Well, they thought wrong on both count. As long as I live, I will never see anything to match the looks on the faces of the four Labour and Unionist bar-stewards after the verdict, sitting in that cafe and boo-hooing into their coffee cups. Priceless!

    Not only is Alec Salmond a come-back merchant, he is a come-back merchant on a mission. Independence without him is, realistically, impossible until the next Alec or Alexa Salmond steps up to the plate. Perhaps he will not ever lead another political party in the actual polls – but I wouldn’t write him off there either – and some people might not vote for him, but he will be our Elder Statesman one day and there is nothing that they can do about it. If any of them even as much as tries to move against him again, in any way whatsoever, the Union will be over the same day. That is a dead cert. None of us is perfect, but a large measure of integrity goes a long way, and we know that the reason they wanted him gone is because he would not shut up about independence and let them get on with allowing men in frocks and lippy to subvert every aspect of our country, to use us as the springboard to greater and greater outrages against decency and liberality.

    The charlatans are going to have to eat humble pie eventually. Better sooner than later. Scotland United. Repudiate the Treaty. Scots Law was protected in the Treaty. If our lords and masters are going to remove our Scots Law (not the pretendy, twisted stuff that passes for law, Stonewall-style, and has been excreted from the nether regions of Holyrood, recently), the Scots Law that our ancestors, even though they allied us to our neighbour against even their better judgement, tried desperately to conserve and preserve for future generations, then we have nothing to lose, folks. Their intention, with the aid of the devolutionists – and that’s a joke in itself as Scottish devolution is in Westminster’s and the Lords’ sights, courtesy of our treacherous, mainly Labour lordlings – is to control us to the nth degree like any psychopathic spouse with an inferiority complex.

    When you have hit the wall and your back is to it, and you can only go forward or live according to the diktats of another, that is what you have to do, whatever it takes. We are reaching that tipping point day-by-day, and we are luckier than we know to have Alec Salmond at the helm, with good people to follow him who may not yet be ready, but will be when the time comes.

  46. JGedd

    Horsestall is the right name for someone who produces piles of ordure adding to what is regularly excreted in the Augean stables of the Scottish media.

    They and SNP supporters keep trotting out that knackered old story in the hope that it can still be a winner for them while more and more people realise it hasn’t got legs.

    It is cognitive dissonance surely that the Nicola fan club (who believe religiously that their diva has done no wrong) are so studiously outraged about what they wanted to pin on Salmond yet are so strangely insouciant about men who profess they are women, being given free rein to be in women’s spaces – on the basis that none of them would pose any kind of threat to women. Shona Robison (that intellect void) stood up and articulated this as an article of faith.

    By now it should be dawning on ordinary SNP supporters, not to mention Greens and Labour voters, that sniping at Salmond does not really look like concern for women when their representatives can so nonchalantly vote away safeguarding for women and girls.

    Anyway, the initial civil service investigation into harassment and inappropriate behaviour at Holyrood turned up significant numbers of complaints by women working there against male members of staff including, it seems, MSPs, which were somehow side lined because evidently, the real target was Alex Salmond. I don’t think any of those other complaints were taken up.

  47. Wobbly

    AS, hero to Alba.

  48. Owen Mullions

    I see some are tweeting about Woman H on Twitter with her full name and marital status. Hopefully the dam will break for her fellow conspirators soon

  49. Geri

    Well said Lorna..

  50. Alf Baird

    Sven @ 2:21 pm

    “All without regarding the other areas of Britain as enemies with whom to pick fights or theorising about post colonial theory.”

    With respect, had Mr. Salmond and others in the national party hierarchy better understood Scotland’s ‘colonial condition’ and what independence actually means (i.e. decolonization) they might at least have been better able to anticipate some of the devious moves of our adversary, and those inside the party.

    The national party leaders ‘rudimentary understanding’ leads to the ‘rupture’ in the movement and the subsequent delay to independence. These are all connected. Meantime the people still lack sufficient knowledge of what independence means and why it is necessary.

    Postcolonial theory tells us this based on what has actually occurred in other former colonies during their efforts to secure independence from imperial powers. Its a valuable lesson to learn, but it also still needs to be dealt with:

  51. Viscount Ennui

    Agree with all of this but with one caveat.
    Never again must Scotland become seduced into embracing governance by personality cult.
    AS needs to ensure that he assembles a team of senior officials and affords them the opportunity to develop their own public profiles.
    Yes, he is the big hitter, but…

  52. Lorna Campbell

    dearieme: the Labour party has betrayed its founders to such an extent that I doubt they would even recognize it now. When the middle-class, managerial tailor’s dummies moved in, they destroyed its working-class roots, working-class people were deliberately alienated from their previous alliances and allegiances, with heavy, then light, industry being decimated by the mid 80s. It was not that the industry went or was deliberately abandoned, but that nothing was put in place to take up the working-class again.

    They, too, were just abandoned while wide boys made piles from the financial sector and service sector being sold off, and eventually brought the UK to its knees. The Scottish working-class was conservative, with a small ‘c’, loyal to its own and the unions and it believed in ‘socialism’ insofar as ‘socialism’ (actually just decency, humanity and common sense) even when large chunks of it were not Labour party followers.

    The SNP was once a broad church party, but it also had its left-wing. When it believed in independence, all pulled together as one. Now, the hard left (‘wokerati’/’trans/Greens’) has infiltrated it, parasitized it and sucked the marrow from its bones, and opened it up to right-wing predation and middle-class managerialism. I can guarantee absolutely that if Labour wins the GE and takes the reins in the UK, Stonewall will infiltrate it even more than it has already and destroy it from within as it did with the SNP.

    The Lib Dems, if in coalition, would suffer a similar fate from the parasitism of the brattish middle-class whose virtue is all for show and not even skin deep, the useful idiots of the hard left/right. Even the Tories, if they do not oppose this bilge water, will be overcome eventually. The loss of Scotland to independence will be as nothing compared to the nihilism and chaos the hard left/right can impose on them. Our politicians simply have not a clue as to what this movement actually is. They are duped by the ‘just be kind’ sheen on the surface of this rotten-to-the-core edifice of global corporate mania.

  53. Stoker

    Salmond should be bouncing Drunken Horseshit of the walls of a Scottish courtroom.

    Take note, folks, that’s the sort of scumbag folk like “RON CLARK” on here support when they post their direct links to the Unionist media outlets these Unionist churnalists work for. So-called indy supporters helping to pay the wages of churnalists like that.

    “RON CLARK” and other Unionist inbreds think they’re getting at me, and others who preach about the importance of archiving links, but that’s how thick they are. You don’t get at me you halfwits, you help to keep the Unionist propaganda machine ticking over by your actions.

    Drunken Horseshit, in my view, is also having a pop at our host, Stuart Campbell, when he mentions “high-profile independence supporters rehabilitating Alex Salmond as a leader..” etc. And we have tubes such as “RON CLARK” promoting the rags these turds work for. If that’s an indy supporter is it any wonder we’re f@cked?

    Drunken Horseshit always fed off Campbell’s success, it was the only way he could appear relevant. Without WOS Drunken Horseshit would be a nobody penning dire articles for an ever-dwindling dead tree scroll audience. The existence of WOS made sure his name was known to a far greater audience than it ever would have been otherwise.

  54. Cath

    “The SNP was just one cog in a much bigger machine. The useful idiots, if you like.”

    This, entirely. Scotland is not an independent state. The idea the UK would allow all its arms of state – the civil service, Crown Office & judiciary, media etc – to be taken over by a devolved SNP leader is ridiculous. No, this was made in Scotland to a large extent, by the same types in our own midst we’ve been plagued with since the union. But it was a UK operation, with a lot of help from people within the SNP.

    How many were infiltrators, and how many useful idiots, we’ll probably never know. But we know those most involved were acting against indy – and many of them were very involved in the Yes campaign in 2014 too, which explains a lot. And a whole lot of blind loyalists were total useful idiots, attacking the wrong victim while defending those acting against our interests.

  55. Lulu Bells

    I’m with Lorna!

  56. James Che


    I second that, well said.

  57. Sven

    Alf Baird @ 15.06

    Whilst I know the areas where we disagree, just wanted to say I do appreciate your unfailing politeness in your responses, Professor Baird … and I truly do wish that your goodself and others with a proven track record in maritime areas and shipbuilding (catamaran construction) had been involved in the planning of an integrated maritime plan (and two Ferries).

  58. sarah

    @ Rob at 2.29: Peter A Bell is sticking up for Chris [as am I] in the comments on the National article.

    There’s an awful lot of National readers who still think all is well with the SNP and their “progress” towards independence. Apparently if only Chris didn’t have the temerity to follow party procedures in standing for the leadership, all would be well. But his application is going to make the unionist media write nasty things about there being something wrong in the party… Sigh.

  59. David Hannah

    Alex Salmond is the leader Scotland. We need him to lead this country to Independence. I’ll take my orders from big Eck.

  60. Stoker


    ScotsRenewables says on 24 July 2023 at 1:50 pm:

    “The idea that electoral success is a necessary prerequisite for being a major political influence is given the lie by the case of Nigel Farage. Farage was the single biggest force behind the stupidity that was Brexit, yet he was never elected to the HoC.”

    “(Farage stood for election to the House of Commons seven times, in five general elections and two by-elections, but did not win any of those elections.)”

    “The constant refrain re. ALBA’s electoral record is the last refuge of the charlatan.”

    It may also be worth asking those charlatan’s how many elections etc did the SNP (in all its guises) participate in before managing to make an impact? You will never get an answer from them. LOL! 😉

  61. Stoker

    Re my 3:13 pm post. That should read: Salmond should be bouncing Drunken Horseshit off the walls of a Scottish courtroom.

  62. Republicofscotland

    He’s a nasty piece work that Hothersall, I recall after Alex Salmond was acquitted by a jury of his peers made up mostly of women that the Salmond (ergo indy) hating brigade, starred in a documentary, come character assassination programme, hosted on the Britnat BBC propaganda channel.

    They fear Salmond and the Alba party because they might just manage to get us out of this blood sucking union, and that frightens them and their Westminster masters.

    The current SNP is not a party for Scottish independence, its a self serving careerist gravy train for those who comply with its agenda. As for the Greens, that bonkers lot who’ve wasted millions on a useless bottle return scheme are now going after poor folk heating systems, which you can read about here.

    The Greens also are not in the slightest bit interested in Scottish independence, like the current SNP the Greens only mention ditching this vile union when it suits them to.

    Alba will come under attack as will Alex Salmond, I can’t wait for there to be an Alba MSP or enough to get a question at FMQs and they let rip against those self serving b*stards in the SNP and the Greens.

    No doubt that mutt Hothersall will have something to say about that when the times comes, and it is coming.

    Vote Alba, Join Alba do it for Scotland.

  63. James Che

    The Snp became a cult when NS and hubby took over, before the that it was a simple political party governing Scotland well as AS as leader of that party,

    The only qualms I personally have is that there are and were many roots to independence some more serious than others,
    A independent party for Scotland cannotbut often does go around blind folded without giving a voice to the Sovereignty of the Scots,
    Or delving deeper into the treaty of union, the Scottish constitution, the territories of Scotland not to be relinquished, Salvo and SSRG,

    Otherwise Alba will evolve in its own bubble the same as the nuSNP.
    When parties listen to themselves on matters such as the EU or Gender and climate ideology because they have a vested interest,
    It stops being a party for all Scotland,
    The Swedish Model on asking the population in a vote system on major issues for democracy is to be admired by everyone, except unionists.

  64. A Scot Abroad

    Alf Baird,

    you appear to be in complete denial that Scotland was the greatest colonising nation in human history. Even more than the Romans. You may have some thoughts about the influence of England over Scotland over the last 316 years, but there’s no effort whatsoever by you to think what Scots have done and achieved by (at times) leading the colonisation of 63 other countries in the world, some for good, some for bad. All that you write is just lazy, non-academic polemics without even a hint of trying to draw a balance.

  65. Rev. Stuart Campbell

    “give me Alan Cumming over Tasmin ‘What Party this Week?’ Ahmed-Sheikh any day”

    Each to their own, but AFAIK Tas has changed parties exactly once in the last decade, and are we blaming anyone for quitting the SNP nowadays?

  66. James Che


    It goes without saying that the labour party and Torie can be added to those that do not want Scotland to be independent,

    It would have been easier to say the all unionist parties are in opposition to Scotland going independent because of the resources they would loose while England could not support its own Population 😉

  67. James Che

    I have always wondered why politicians encourage immigration to Scotland instead of creating incentives for Scots to stay and rebuild their Country in businesses and family initiatives,
    Or why our politicians could not advertise to encourage the return of families that had left for economic reasons when under the UK governance,
    Surely it is better wisdom to not dilute the culture and language of Scotland with what appears to be a Colonial globalist version of what Scotland and its nation should become for the benefit of hidden ideology,

    Changing the people of Scotland is as bad and awful idea as changing animals in Scotland like some bloody big Social experiment.

  68. Merganser

    Lorna Campbell and Capt Yossarian:

    ” If you go for the King, make sure you kill him”

    A sentiment going as far back as Machiavellian times.

    Well, Alex is the King, and they (whoever they are) came for him, but didn’t finish him off, and must now pay the penalty. Arguably the greatest politician Scotland has ever had, a stratagist beyond compare, and someone who knows when the time is right to reveal all. Or let others do it for obvious reasons.

    I don’t do twitter so I don’t know what has been said about his accusers. I will rejoice when all the facts and identities are legally disclosed. Only then can the greatest travesty in Scottish legal history be put right.

    If it is not, it will remain as a huge stain on Scotland’s reputation for fainess, openness, and accountability.

    Hothersall must be wetting himself at the prospect of a triumphant return of the King to indulge in this type of smearing. Just when Labour though it was in the bag for them, they now see where all the former SNP votes could go. And it’s not their way.

    So desperation has got a hold of him. Expect more along these lines from Labour inthe days and weeks to come, showing how rattled they are.

    This King is not dead.God save the King. And a plague upon all his false accusers.

  69. James Che

    The MSM advertise Scotland in its papers down south,

    We should advertise and encourage Scots to return home,

  70. Shug

    So let me get this right in my head
    an English unelected conservative peer, baroness Scott, and Michael Gove have proposed using a ‘pre union of the parliament’s rule’ that will allow the Westminster parliament to over rule any current act of the Scottish parliament in relation to all matters including those reserved to Holyrood!!

    The SNP is protesting. Well that will keep Westminster up at night I am sure. They would be better burning the place down and returning home.

    Westminster is getting ready to remove any Holyrood procedure that the SNP propose to use to provide any sort of referendum.They are setting the rules in place now.

    If Yousaf and Flynn don’t waken up and get their act together they will be over ruled at every turn.

    As Winnie Ewing said Westminster doesn’t rule the waves, they wave the rules.

    SNP MPs will be entirely responsible for their own inaction and right now I see them as unelectable.

    Thanks goodness for Salmond and Alba keeping the indy movement alive

  71. Alf Baird

    A Scot Abroad @ 4:05 pm

    “All that you write is just lazy, non-academic polemics”

    How about this published academic refereed journal paper, then:

  72. Geri

    Tasmina was probably disillusioned that the Unionist parties weren’t the grea bastions of democracy as they claimed.

    How many here, 10 or so yrs ago, ever thought the Labour party would prove to be such rancid democracy deniers & haters of all things Scottish?

    We kept them in a job while they stole blind from us. The majority of Scotland ditched them so no shame there. Their tea is oot. There were more Pandas in Scotland & they’re on their way back now to China. Let’s hope Murray joins them.

  73. Dan

    @ Alf Baird

    Hey, you have to grudgingly acknowledge the effort A Scot Abroad’s great great grandad did out in Burma during Britain’s colonial endeavors. With him pioneering the importing rice he paved the way for all us modern Scots to enjoy a good curry, or risotto, or even a rice pudding if you have a sweet tooth.

  74. Doug

    If the Rutherglen and Hamilton West by-election happens and Yousaf and his timid SNP crashes because pro-indy voters stay away in disgust at the SNP’s lack of fight…?

  75. George Ferguson

    @Dan 4:51pm
    When I heard this news I thought of you. You cannot sell your house with a gas boiler until you have replaced it with a heat pump. Source MSM but a claimed Scot Gov policy. We are on a cart to hell if this is right.

  76. Sven

    George Ferguson @ 17.15

    You were not alone in thinking of Dan.
    And, perhaps, what is this occult power which Messrs Harvie & Slater appear to exert over the SNP which is leading them, lemming like, over the cliff.
    Generate the power elsewhere, deliver it to the dwellings, what’s “non green” about that.

  77. Dan

    @ George Ferguson

    Aye, I had an expletive laden post on the arse end of the last thread about it. 😉
    Sad to see the laws of physics, and conservation of energy principles going the same way as biological reality it seems…
    Wonder how long it will be till my Molesworth’s Pocket Book of Engineering Formula published arounf 1900 will be banned literature due to these monumentally thick cretins.

    How about we start an Engineers’ Party to knock umpteen shades of shit out of these political pygmies that don’t seem to have a scooby doo?

  78. Craig

    I was at one of Alex’s roadshows in Glasgow and the passion and willingness to discuss with us the points of the movement and he took some criticism from me in good grace and acknowledged them shows the manner of the man.

    He did raise a wee laugh when he said to me “Mind if someone else gets to ask a question…” I didn’t feel put out or upset but thankful he was graceful enough to engage with me for 20 minutes.

    I’d probably fall asleep as soon Duncan starts speaking.

  79. George Ferguson

    Further to my post of 5:15pm
    Remember the changes to a property exchange putting the emphasis on the seller to provide a home report on a regular basis. Distressed sales available. Same for the heat pump scam. SNP officials were implicated on sharp practice on transactions of property. Michelle Thompson and others rumoured. More money for the cult to lay their hands on and now we have the Greens getting in on the act.

  80. George Ferguson

    @Dan 5:40pm
    Count me in on an engineers party. We have integrity and honesty. It’s a worry to me that the Scottish Parliament is producing leglisation that provides them with market advantage over genuine entrepreneurs. They have the Capital to make money out of ordinary people. The SNP/Greens the New Tories what’s new?. More Police Scotland investigations to come. After the home report law changes. How many SNP MSPs have accrued multiple properties?.

  81. Ian

    One of the many reasons why Alex Salmond is a popular politician is because he is genuinely engaged with the real issues which concern voters, and understands the history and politics of those issues. That, you might think, is what politicians do, but it is only when you hear Alex that you realise how the current SNP generation have none of those qualities and only concern themselves with ideological battles fought on social media and preserving their ridiculously large salaries and benefits.
    A very good example is the Herald article today about Alex’s support for the council estate tenants fighting a property developers demolition plans – brought up on a council estate himself, he gets how social housing works, and its very interesting history in Scotland. I cannot think of any other Scottish politician who understands, let alone would lend support, to these kind of issues.
    That is why he is leagues ahead of them. They are only interested in their careers, Alex is a staunch believer in Scottish history and culture, and the people who make it. It is beyond politics for him, politics is the means, but he would make the case and care about it whatever his status.

  82. Captain Yossarian

    Dan – I hate to say this, but it was I that sent you Molesworth’s Pocket Book of Engineering Formula back in the day. Other than that minor detail, I’m all in for an engineers’ party.

  83. sam

    @ASA 4.00pm

    This what Tom Devine says about Scotland’s involvement with slavery.

    “If people want to talk about Scottish involvement in slavery they need to be aware of the full picture. In the 18th and early-19th centuries the Scottish nation as a whole was ‘complicit’ in slavery. The markets and financial returns from ‘the nefarious business’ helped to lay the foundation for modern Scotland and shaped the economy from which we now benefit.”…

    ..“The new research showed that merely concentrating on prominent mercantile figures fails to take account of the fact that Scottish society as a whole benefited from chattel slavery: weavers of ‘slave cloth’ for the West Indies; fishermen who exported dried fish to feed the slaves; workers in the mills who processed the raw cotton harvested by slave labour; the crews of the vessels who sailed across the Atlantic; and the officials, lawyers and clergymen who administered the slave colonies and the spiritual needs of their owners.

    “Only by acknowledging the full extent of this nation’s role in slavery can we begin to construct a meaningful programme of response today to that dark period of history.

    ‘’I am convinced that the evidence we now have suggests Scottish modernisation was even more dependent on the slavery factor than England. This was not because of involvement in the slave trade itself. Ships from Scottish ports rarely took part in that horrible commerce in human beings after 1730. Rather it was based on the overwhelming place of tobacco, sugar and then cotton in Scottish external trade. The remarkable boom in these commodities depended entirely on armies of black slave labourers.”

    You’re not only wrong, you’re wrong at the top of your voice.

  84. Lorna Campbell

    Ian: I second that. It is precisely what makes him different from the average lot. That, and a feel for politics second to none. For those who pooh-pooh him, they are in for an almighty shock. If anyone can galvanize Scottish politics, it is Alex Salmond, and there is the added bonus that the MSM cannot resist him either because he makes such good copy. He is a born leader, and if he can cement all the disparate parts of the independence movement together, the constitutional groups, the political groups and the legal groups, we will do it. Even he has come a long way from his past stances on various aspects of independence, and I feel, personally, that he has still a little way to go, but he is close. I may be wrong, but I think he knows that something extraordinary is going to have to happen for independence to kick off this time. A politician who learns lessons and is willing to act on them, who understands that the same-old, same-old will not work this time, is as rare as hen’s teeth.

  85. Robert Louis

    If unionists and England worshippers like Hothersall actually had meaningful things to say, they would not be smearing Mr Salmond with fake innuendo. Duncan knew quite exactly that what his comments above are utterly misleading and deceptive – designed to fool the public. He knows they are not true.

    Unionists just do not have a single reasoned argument for Scotland being run by another country, England. That is their real difficulty. Time and again, including in the years leading up to indyref1, I and others here, challenged unionists to tell us just WHY Scotland benefits by being run by another country. Not one single reasoned answer. And that is because their isn’t one.

    To young Scots especially, harping on about ‘we defeated the Nazis together’, just doesn’t cut it. In truth, it never did.

    This undemocratic, unwanted, one-sided, so-called ‘union’ with England only ever benefited one country, England. That is why they wish to keep Scotland under their increasingly racist and right-wing jackboots forever. They steal our oil, our wealth and all of Scotland’s assets then tell us Scots we are beggars.

    The likes of slimey deceptive Hothersall, above, are simply feart. They are terrified of Alex Salmond.

    Once we are free of English colonial rule in Scotland, one can only hope that slimey, smeary no-hoper ‘unionists’ like Hothersall, will simply slither away down to England, a country which they seem to love so very, very much.

  86. John Main

    @sam says:24 July, 2023 at 6:49 pm

    In the 18th and early-19th centuries …

    … after 1730 …

    They’re aw deid, Sam. Slaves and slavers baith.

    Put it ahent ye, forget aboot it, move on, get a life.

    Find something we care about in 2023. Find something we can actually do something about in 2023.

    God knows, there’s enough problems to go around.

  87. Bob Mack

    @A Scot Abroad.

    Scottish law very clearly stated that slavery was not compatible with the laws of Scotland. This was in 1777 and pertained to the case of Joseph Knight at Perth Court.

    What you are saying is that citizens from Scotland were involved just like modern day drug dealers of people traffickers. Very different from the State as a whole..

  88. John Main

    @Lorna Campbell says:24 July, 2023 at 6:56 pm

    A politician who learns lessons and is willing to act on them, who understands that the same-old, same-old will not work this time

    Thanks for that, Lorna.

    Maybes there could be hope after all.

  89. sarah

    Robert Louis:

    Samuel Adams said it perfectly.

    “Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”

  90. John Main

    @Robert Louis says:24 July, 2023 at 7:00 pm

    their increasingly racist and right-wing jackboots

    Hey, Bob, how have you not noticed that all over Europe, the right-of-centre is making democratic advances at the ballot box? Forming governments, entering governing coalitions, setting the agendas, pushing back against demographic change, open borders, “green” crap, all of the unsustainable and unpopular and suicidal “progressive” shibboleths that reached their sell-by date in Feb 2022.

    Do you really and truly believe Scotland is going to be an outlier that bucks this trend, the next time we Sovereign Scots get our sticky fingers on the pencils in the polling booths?

    I hae ma doots.

  91. Dan

    @ Captain Yossarian

    You sent me fuck all ya bullshitter! I grant you we have previously mentioned the Molesworth book in our interactions, but I’ve got my late father’s copy here.
    The book was mentioned in this post (yet another expletive ridden one I might add! 😉 ) from 2019.

  92. Robert Hughes

    Aw FFS enough with the utter bollocks about Scotland’s people benefiting en masse from the Slave Trade .

    My da often went to school in his ” baries ” – bare feet . Like my mother , he was brought-up in a ” single end ” in the Gorbals in circumstances today’s wannabe Social Justice Warriors couldn’t even imagine , let alone endure .

    My mother and two of her sisters spent time in the Poor House when my grandparents simply lacked the resources to feed them .

    This deprivation was not down to workshy parents , often there was no work available , and little then by way of Social Provision from the State .

    Any ” White Man’s Burden ” should be placed on those who really profited from that inhuman commerce .

    Their descendants are the same swine that continue to live extravagantly whilst retaining the power and influence to ensure the majority of people are too occupied/distracted by day-to-day pressures to notice that they’re being shafted – and have been for centuries .

  93. Ruairidh

    Love it – he’s oor hurricane!

  94. Captain Yossarian

    Dan – Well done, Sir. I am vanquished and I raise my hat to you. You are a true engineer.

  95. A Scot Abroad

    Alf Baird,

    that’s only an academic paper because you published it, as an “academic”. Intellectually and logically, it’s pretty much nothing more than dribble. Entirely one-sided, without balance, and factually wrong in statements or analysis on literally every page through to its dire and unevidenced conclusion.

    Napier Tech was never anything more than a fourth grade Poly, despite now trying to pretend it’s a proper university. It’s the sort of nonsense you’d expect from that place.

  96. Alf Baird

    Robert Louis @ 7:00 pm

    “Once we are free of English colonial rule in Scotland, one can only hope that slimey, smeary no-hoper ‘unionists’ like Hothersall, will simply slither away down to England, a country which they seem to love so very, very much.”

    Yes, one of the most interesting aspects of postcolonial theory is that it tells us this is precisely what happens after decolonization: i.e. finding their ‘privileged position no longer exists’, and that ‘independence is a matter only for the colonized’, the colonizer returns ‘home to the mother country’. Native collaborators/elites unable to reconcile with their real national identity and culture will tend to follow them.

  97. A Scot Abroad

    Sam, at 6:49pm,

    I haven’t said anything about slavery, so your comment is a bit of a mystery to me.

    I’m sure that Scots who emigrated to the Americas had slaves, bought and sold them. But they were not alone in that, so did Englishmen, the Welsh and Irish. I wasn’t making any point about slavery, but merely that the Scots were by proportion a leading group of colonisers, and that was sustained to the point where Scots were the greatest colonisers in history. It’s well documented.

  98. Margaret Eleftheriou

    And just how many peer-reviewed papers have you published?
    I have rarely seen a better example of sour grapes. And for you to talk such drivel about Napier shows exactly the kind of person you are. And no, I am neither a graduate nor a staff member, tecnical, admin or academic, of Napier University.
    Prof. Baord, you cannot take this person seriously. He is not worth even the effort I am making tonight.

  99. sam

    @John Main

    “They’re aw deid, Sam. Slaves and slavers baith.

    Put it ahent ye, forget aboot it, move on, get a life.

    Find something we care about in 2023. Find something we can actually do something about in 2023.”

    Say that to Tom Devine? You’d get yer arse in a sling. Just tell it to ASA. When he takes over from you tell him he’s wrong.

    You find something to care about yourself. Oh, money, you care about money. Like the slavers. Just money? Care about your lost soul. Mrs Main? The dug? Canary? King Charlie?

    You see, I care about you.

  100. Big Jock

    Robert indeed. This collective guilt we are supposed to have about the slave trade is utter invention.

    Most Scots were living in poverty. They saw not a bean from the slave trade. Indeed most Scots were exploited since 1707. They were sent to Canada, sent down the pits, sent to the front line for the empire. The wealthy kept all the wealth and used poor Scots to enslave those who should have been their bretherin.

    I have no ancestors who were wealthy or who were slave masters. Indeed on one side my ancestors were kicked out of Ireland to work in the Blantyre pits. My others were farmers and labourers in Lanarkshire. The classic technique of the English empire was to exploit Scots, then implicate them in their horror show.

    The establishment are running countless propaganda programmes about this exploitation. They constantly say:” We Scots, our history”. Its nothing of the kind. It’s not Scotland’s history. It’s the 5% who ran the slave trades history. I am sorry that this happened. But I feel no more guilt than I would about anything else that happened in world history. Because its not my history. I had nothing to do with it.

  101. sarah

    @ Margaret Eleftheriou: definitely not worth your effort. The Rev has a much higher tolerance level than mine. I would have dispensed with the “contributions” from several btl characters – it is very disheartening to see their comments, I find.

  102. John Main

    @Alf Baird says:24 July, 2023 at 8:03 pm

    Native collaborators/elites unable to reconcile with their real national identity and culture will tend to follow them

    That’s sure an innarestin idea. Let’s play with it and see where it leads …

    Assuming the 50% +1 threshold frequently mandated by some on here (including myself, from time to time), can we expect 50% -1 to head south post-Indy?

    To be sure, that would delight some of the more, how you say, rabid, posters on here, but still, I see problems.

    Luckily, Professor Baird, I think we can write off the wilder excesses of your colonialist theory.

    As the immortal what-his-name says, you’ve taken that one too far.

  103. Northcode

    Margaret Eleftheriou @8:15pm

    Well said, Margaret.

  104. Ron Clark


    No one wants Scottish independence more than me,,I can assure you.

    I post Yoon links as a kind of protest against the pricks on here like Dan and others,,who engage in conversations with site wankers like Main and A Scot Abroad.

    The sooner they totally ignore the site wankers,,,the sooner I’ll stop posting links to Yoon rags.


  105. John Main

    @sam says:24 July, 2023 at 8:20 pm

    Thanks for the pointer to Tom Devine. Just looked him up on Wiki. If I can find the time, I will make a real effort to get some of his books.

    He seems to have taken a nuanced view to much of Scotland’s history, which is refreshing when compared to the stark black-and-white picture usually portrayed on here.

    Still, the past is gone, and it can’t be reshaped or put to rights, once everybody has passed on.

    Sincere apologies for my abrasive writing style and any upset I have caused you.

  106. John Main

    @Northcode says:24 July, 2023 at 8:37 pm

    I would have taken the trouble to spell Professor Baird’s name correctly.

    Simple, old-fashioned courtesy and that.

    But also exactly the kind of attention to detail that used to be valued at Scotland’s more illustrious academic establishments.

    If it’s not a cheeky question, which one did you attend?

  107. Geri

    Ian 6:17

    **very good example is the Herald article today about Alex’s support for the council estate tenants fighting a property developers demolition plans –**

    There is a recent meeting Alex attended in Maryhill on Indylive that may interest you if you haven’t watched it. It’s on the independence live channel on YouTube.
    He understands it’s communities & community involvement.

    Tasmina also made a commitment to broadcast an entire show to raise awareness of the issue within the coming weeks.

  108. Republicofscotland

    “can we expect 50% -1 to head south post-Indy?”

    What an inane remark to make, I sometime wonder why Alf entertain clowns like you Chas and that other useful idiot ASA, you three stooges couldn’t lace Alf’s boots, he runs circles around the three of you and that’s why the trio of tossers, (you lot) must find a way to discredit his informative, and trueful comments on where Scots stand within this rancid union.

  109. John Main

    @Ron Clark says:24 July, 2023 at 8:47 pm

    Now, now Ron, you promised all of my posts were going to be ignored by you.

    Back in the day, a Highlander’s word was sacrosanct.

    If you’re that keen and determined on saving our nation, culture and heritage, how’s about you start adopting some of the traits that made us great once and could make us great again?

  110. Geri

    Ron Clark

    At 5 in the morning? I don’t think so ffs.

    It’s disruptive & spamming the site after everyone has long been in bed. If you don’t like the convo maybe feck off to another forum where you do?

    Just a thought. It’s amazing all the complaints BTL – is yer knicker elastic stuck on the door? Has wings glued yer hands to the keyboard?

    It’s a message board. People chat. Calm yourself.

  111. John Main

    @Republicofscotland says:24 July, 2023 at 9:01 pm

    trio of tossers

    Oh dear, RoS, only yesterday I thought you might be developing some smarts.

    What with your Damascene conversion to the view that the route to Indy might just lie in showing us Sovereign Scots how Indy would make us better off.

    But no, you’re happier back in your comfort zone.

    Through Insults To Indy

    Yup, passes the T-shirt test, if nothing else.

    Shame you haven’t taken the time to read and thoroughly comprehend Professor Baird’s ideas though.

  112. James Jones

    I think Hothersall’s disdain may have more to do with his self-confessed “gay, trans-ally, progressive” status and Alba’s comparative disinterest in such matters. Unionism has little to do with it.

  113. A Scot Abroad

    Margaret Eleftheriou, at 8:15,

    I’ve had two careers, firstly in the Army, then in the defence industry, and spotted the need for data analytics in security matters and set up my own business. A bit niche, but it pays the bills very well. I’m cited for my work in about a dozen papers (mostly on data analytics, one on visual analytics), and was the runner up in a global inter-university and inter-business visual analytics competition ten years ago. But I don’t write papers myself, because, unlike people like Baird, I don’t pretend to be an academic, nor do I want a sham Professorship, nor am I interested in working in academia, even a fourth rate Poly like Napier Tech.

  114. Geri

    James Jones

    **I think Hothersall’s disdain may have more to do with his self-confessed “gay, trans-ally, progressive” status**

    No. He’s always been a wanker long before Trans became a thing. He was the first eejit I had the misfortune to read on twitter during indyref. He was rabid even then.

    There is a hint of truth tho as the most rabid anti Salmond crew I’ve came across lately on SM is from that community in the Greens. Probably because they know when Alba win their gig would be up in Holyrood until a proper consultation is carried out on Trans rights.

  115. Geri


    You seem to be over compensating for something.

    You seem to deliberately single Alf out for yer scathing remarks on his qualifications. Would he maybe know you by your correct name? Seems he has attracted a bit of a stalker. Did he give you a fail? Lol!!

  116. Alf Baird

    John Main @ 8:54 pm

    “He seems to have taken a nuanced view to much of Scotland’s history, which is refreshing when compared to the stark black-and-white picture usually portrayed on here.”

    One doesn’t generally receive an imperial knighthood or institutional plaudits for writing anti-colonial literature.

    In regard to ‘Native collaborators/elites etc’, the UK population has clearly been significantly influenced by the British exit from its 50+ exploited colonies and 170+ conflicts around the world over the last half century and more. Much the same population change effect has occurred in France after its numerous colonial withdrawals, and we now see some of the consequences of that. Colonialism therefore appears to have a kind of boomerang effect on the mother country.

  117. Margaret Eleftheriou

    He doesn’t write papers himself! Which makes him, in his opinion, eminently qualified to criticise the efforts of those who do. Really?

  118. dearieme

    Thank you for the explanation, Lorna Campbell.

    Looking at a couple of hundred years of history it’s clear that some kinds of progress have been introduced by radical tories. But there’s hardly a tory to be found, never mind a radical one. There’s not a classical liberal to be found either.

    The idea that these problems can be solved by “Independence”, especially a fake independence in the EU and NATO, seems impossibly far-fetched. We are in the soup.

  119. Garrion

    Looking forward to the day Duncan Horsesarse is subject to a below the blanket level of scrutiny in the public interest. That man has more than a few steamers in his bed.

    Tick tock, I hope.

  120. A Scot Abroad

    Margaret Eleftheriou,

    you’ve got it all wrong.

    Only about 1% of all academic papers ever published are of any value whatsoever to humanity. I’m entirely critical of the 99% of academics who are just basically wasting public money by their existence. I’d rather be doing and achieving something useful than sucking off the taxpayer’s tit for my working life, and achieving the practical output of fuck all while calling myself a “Professor” from a fourth rate Poly.

  121. Phil French

    I’m a ‘yoon’ and am not remotely ‘feart’ about Salmond’s renaissance. In a way good luck to him, as he was treated disgracefully, criminally probably, by his protege and could easily have died a horrible death in a cell in Saughton if she’d had her way. But, while he’s undoubtedly a substantial figure and towers over the current crop of SNP pygmies, he’s still a very divisive figure, unlikely to attract many ‘yoons’ to switch sides or bring the promised land of secession (not independence, we’re not a colony) any closer. He’s vain and self-satisfied and just turns a lot of people off. Many suspect his fundamental interest in the cause is minimal, it was just a vehicle for his own advancement – he loved the HofC for instance and hobnobbing with the great and good in TV studios. And he did create Sturgeon, let’s not forget. If he was such a shrewd operator, how the hell did he not see her for what she is and stop her from wrecking the party and nearly wrecking Scotland in the process? So welcome back Alex. Oh, and if the Brexit bit is a dig at Farage, he was, of course elected to the EU parliament. Let’s get our facts straight. BTW, I find this site’s boilerplate anti-Brexit obsession weird and disappointing. I’d expect a more intelligent take on a movement for greater self-determination, even if you don’t like some of the principals.

  122. Graf Midgehunter

    I’m not really one for petitions or happy-clappy walks but I think Grousebeater has something here which deserves support.

    Loch Tay needs help.

  123. Derek

    “Cuilean says:
    24 July, 2023 at 11:50 am

    Doubtless, the horrible Labour stooge, Hothersall, will smear ‘Wings’ as ‘pro-Putin/Russia’ because of your reference to ‘Boney M’s Rasputin’ song!”

    They’ll need to go for radio 4 too then, as it featured on “I’m Sorry, I Haven’t A Clue” earlier on.

  124. North Chiel

    Seems the English government/London treasury are now “ strategically planning “ for the loss of massive taxation revenue from exports of Scotch whisky ,( following independence), by now actively encouraging Sales/Exports of Welsh whisky . No doubt English embassies abroad will be stocking up with the Welsh tipple . However, unless our finest statesman Alex Salmond can “ rescue” and thereafter again spearhead our drive for Independence , perhaps Wales could achieve Independece before Scotland ? Could we soon see a “ fledgling” English whisky industry or is the water “ darn souff” going to evaporate with climate change ? I suppose the solution is obvious ? . A pipeline ( of course to supplement the new national water grid) from Loch Ness to the Trafalger square fountains ). Of course ( in between) there will be extensive irrigation to maintain “ England’s green and pleasant land).

  125. Rev. Stuart Campbell

    “BTW, I find this site’s boilerplate anti-Brexit obsession weird and disappointing. I’d expect a more intelligent take on a movement for greater self-determination, even if you don’t like some of the principals.”

    We talk very little about Brexit on Wings, mainly because it’s so self-evidently a fucking disaster. None of the issues driving Scottish independence are remotely analogous to it. The UK doesn’t have Tory governments it didn’t vote for foisted on it by Germany and France. The UK did not have to beg the EU for permission to vote on leaving.

  126. PhilM

    For those who don’t know, someone with so few citations in their chosen field is a tenth-rate nobody. That someone in the defence industry should criticise public-sector jobs is worth fifty thousand citations in the next three hundred years of the Journal of Unconscious Irony.
    What a joke.
    As you were Alf…

  127. James

    A Scot Abroad;

    “….ock aye the nue, ahm Scotch, do ye ken? We’re shite…..”

    etc etc etc ad infinitum….

  128. Ron Clark

  129. A Scot Abroad


    I don’t need qualifications, and certainly not a sham Professorship from a fourth rate Poly.

    I go by practical outputs. Did it work? Does it do what it claimed to do? Does it make sense in the real world? Does it make money?

    In my case, I make my living by having to have practical outputs in the real world. And I make a fairly good living out of that. And, I pay my taxes and contribute a lot more to government revenues than I cost the Exchequer.

    Not so sure that any sham Professor from a fourth grade Poly can claim that.

  130. PhilM

    Here’s an interesting article relating to corruption in the UK defence industry (rather odd that its date of publication is Christmas day…)
    I doubt much has changed in the years since it was published as the defence industry is notorious for corruption, kickbacks, bloated expenditure, sub-standard work generally, infiltration by organised crime, wilful blindness to human rights violations, lack of any oversight or accountability…you get the picture…

  131. James Jones

    Rev. Stuart Campbell at 12:09 am
    “We talk very little about Brexit on Wings, mainly because it’s so self-evidently a fucking disaster.”

    How so? The sky didn’t fall.
    The Westminster government had been infantilised by its dependence on EU leadership and unfortunately hasn’t ‘stepped-up’ despite the opportunity Brexit offered. We can only hope for some decent candidates to emerge, in contrast to the career politicians we have now.

  132. fruitella the hun

    Here is a talk about ecological thinking on agriculture. Plenty greens are on-board with this approach, worldwide. It’s thirteen minutes about independence, perhaps a deeper kind than generally contended here.

  133. Breeks

    A Scot Abroad says:
    25 July, 2023 at 12:49 am

    I don’t need qualifications….

    Hate to burst your bubble, but it’s painfully obvious to most that you really, really do.

    Start small. Don’t overtax yourself. Go to night school and get an SVQ or something. (Maybe avoid history. That might sting a bit for an obnoxious swell head with your ego).

    Actually, come to think of it, maybe learning something about Scottish History is exactly where you should start. Then you might not sound so embarrassingly blinkered and ignorant when you’re spraying phlegm over everybody.

  134. twathater

    @ breeks 2.02 am, I have this visual image of ASA sitting in his maws hoose in his wee room under the stairs wi the tap half o his uniform oan resplendent wi sumbuddy else’s medals that he bought aff ebay pinned tae his jaiket, and his skid lid oan his heed wi a photae a cammy stuck tae it, sittin there in his stained y fronts dreaming up a fantasy o big lugs chuck sending for him tae pin a medal oan his chist for his total destruction of the independence movement

  135. Ruby it's Tuesday

    Mornin Stu!

    It’s Tuesday!
    I was wondering how long my ‘pre-mod’ sentence is. Will I be on ‘pre-mod’ for life or will after I have served my time be allowed back into ‘decent society’ and by allowed to post without supervision? 🙂

    Quite a lot of personal abuse going on BTL this morning.

  136. Ruby Tuesday

    Ron Clark says:
    24 July, 2023 at 8:47 pm


    No one wants Scottish independence more than me,,I can assure you.

    I post Yoon links as a kind of protest against the pricks on here like Dan and others,,who engage in conversations with site wankers like Main and A Scot Abroad.

    The sooner they totally ignore the site wankers,,,the sooner I’ll stop posting links to Yoon rags.


    Would you be better off if you tried to convince Stu to put these ‘site wankers’ aka ‘flame baiters’ on pre-moderation?

    Could it be Dan, Geri and everyone else who responds to these ‘flame-baiters’ actually enjoy their ‘conversations’ with those you call ‘site wankers’

    Is it not a big ask to request others give up something they enjoy?

    Personally I find it all a huge wind-up and I’m not interested in reading the same thing being regurgitated over and over and over again.

    Maybe we should both take Geri’s advice and find another site.

    I don’t expect you will be reading this post Ron as it’s being ‘pre-moderated’ and most people don’t scroll back to read post.

    That is if it even passes moderation.

  137. Stephen O'Brien

    Trust has been damaged!
    Voters now require SNP to demonstrate commitment to deliver independence; an ALLIANCE for YES!

    Self-determination is not simply franchised to any single party. Scotland United; guarantor of that commitment.

    SNP must get with the programme or not at all!

  138. Ruby Tuesday

    The ECHR is the European Convention on Human Rights. It was drafted in the aftermath of the Second World War and the Holocaust in an attempt to protect the people from the State, make sure the atrocities committed would never be repeated, and safeguard fundamental rights.

    If we are going to talk about Brexit a conversation about ECHR/Human rights would be of interest. The part about protecting people from the State is of particular interest.

    I think we might be heading towards a totalitarian state and there is absolutely nothing we can do about it.

    Would we have been less at risk if we had still been in the EU. What are the implications for our human rights of ‘the State’ taking back control?

  139. SteepBrae

    Breeks 2.02am:

    Maybe ASA (11.13pm) could find a course to help build confidence in reading an academic paper without feeling threatened. He could perhaps nip on a bus to the London School of Economics and have a bash at their BSc in Philosophy, Logic and Scientific Method.

    “Studying philosophy is an excellent opportunity to think deeply whilst developing valuable skills in written and oral argument, imagination, and the critical engagement with difficult ideas. Philosophy addresses challenging foundational questions in many fields, including ethics, politics and scientific methodology. It also involves training in rigorous argumentation, including formal logic and BTL writing”.

    Maybe save him exposing such embarrassing flaws in logical deduction as “1% of academic papers = 1% of academics”.

  140. John Main

    @Alf Baird says:24 July, 2023 at 10:08 pm

    Colonialism therefore appears to have a kind of boomerang effect on the mother country

    Indeed, no argument from me on that one. You only need to watch an hour’s telly, listen to the news, or read the papers to see how the mother country (the UK) has been colonised and continues to be colonised at an ever increasing rate. Only a generation to go before it is majority colonised.

    One fascinating side effect of this (never acknowledged on here) is how Scotland has been insulated from the true boomeranging payback for her enthusiastic history of colonisation by being part of this unequal union. The majority of the payback lands on England. If Scotland got her pro-rata share, our civic life, our towns and cities, and our wee, pretendy parliament would look a lot different.

    Simple fairness should guide reasonable people to the conclusion that just as in Scotland, the ordinary people of England do not deserve the “benefits” of this mass reverse colonisation of their native land. Yet it is frequently listed on here as a cause for celebration.

    The ordinary people of all of the UK are descended from those Brits who DID NOT go abroad and colonise. By and large, the descendents of the colonisers are still in the lands their ancestors colonised, reaping the benefits of their historic pillage.

    Oh well, who said life was fair?

  141. Phil French

    ‘ We talk very little about Brexit on Wings, mainly because it’s so self-evidently a fucking disaster. None of the issues driving Scottish independence are remotely analogous to it. The UK doesn’t have Tory governments it didn’t vote for foisted on it by Germany and France. The UK did not have to beg the EU for permission to vote on leaving.’

    This reply perfectly illustrates what I mean. To call Brexit ‘self-evidently a disaster’ is uncharacteristically simplistic and prejudiced for this site. Any sort of meaningful Brexit was pretty effectively, and disgracefully, blocked in the UK parliament by Bercow and Benn et al, and simultaneously expertly bungled by remainer PM Theresa May who neither wanted it nor understood it. What minor freedoms have been reclaimed in the pathetic deal that emerged have barely been exploited by a Westminster establishment that loathes the idea of restored sovereignty and restored responsibility. So, effectively, there is no Brexit. It never happened. It wasn’t allowed to happen.

    So how can something that never really happened be a ‘disaster’? And by the way, where is all this evidence? The UK economy is in pretty bad shape, but the EU is faring even worse. It’s not clear that the tiny changes allowed to be brought about by this minimalist Brexit have have made much difference. Oh, except that we are sovereign now. We could go our own way, do positive things, if we wanted to. I would have thought that might have struck a chord with ‘indie’ supporters.

    As to barely mentioning it on this site, well perhaps you should mention it a bit more. Because if your dream ever comes true you are going have to face the question of Scotland’s relationship with the EU. Historically the SNP were anti-EC/EEC until they decided that tactically it was better to pretend to be pro to reassure those afraid of leaving one union, that a safe home would be found within another. The consensus now seems to be pro-EU with fast-tracked membership somehow to be achieved as soon as the shackles of the union are cast off.

    What would that mean? Scotland would need to beg to get in and once in would be powerless, told exactly what it could or couldn’t do and pay handsomely for the privilege. You could call that independence if you wanted to, but if you are happy for Scotland to be an EU colony, assuming that membership could somehow be granted, then that would just confirm the suspicions of many ‘yoons’ that ‘indie’ was just a nativist, anti-English movement all along. And nothing more than that.

  142. John Main

    @Phil French says:24 July, 2023 at 11:41 pm

    Let’s get our facts straight. BTW, I find this site’s boilerplate anti-Brexit obsession weird and disappointing. I’d expect a more intelligent take on a movement for greater self-determination

    Facts are tricky concepts for some.

    Many, many years ago, some bright spark in the Indy movement invented the slogan “Independence In Europe” as a means of not scaring the horses over the lack of competence and ability among the movement’s fellow travelers. The promise was that we could be pretendy “independent” but outsource all the tricky stuff, like governing an aspirational first-world country, to Brussels.

    The slogan fitted on a T-shirt, lots of T-shirts were printed and bought by some of the regulars on here, and these T-shirts have controlled their thought processes ever since.

    The incontrovertible fact, that the EU has morphed out of all recognition in the intervening years, does not impinge.

    The idea of outsourcing the tricky stuff, like leadership, continues to be popular, as we see when we regard our pretendy, fraudulently elected FM, HY.

  143. John Main

    @James says:25 July, 2023 at 12:17 am

    Wheesht James, dinna gie him mair ammo …

  144. Effijy

    Touchy Feely you say!

    A man scrutinised over several years, who was fully acquired by 3 Judges and a mainly female Jury is made to appear tarnished with no justifiable reason.

    Let’s go to the top of the tree in Westminster politics.
    How about making Boris the Prime Minister.

    What type of person could he be cheating on wife no one while battling cancer.
    Could this person who has made 5 different women pregnant, well that we know of, be a better man than our former First Minister.

    We also know from Carrie’s neighbours that Boris was physically restraining her in her own home while she screened accusations about him trying to familiarise himself with a waitress.

    Former Tory Minister Rory Stewart reported a discussion with Boris regarding a trade visit to Turkey. Rory said he was too busy with constituency work to take the trip to which Boris replied “but There will be women supplied for us”.

    How would anyone outside of this dystopian Tory version of Orwell’s 1984 see why the focus is on Alex Salmond.

    I feel sorry for would be journalists as the job in the U.K. doesn’t really exist.
    In order to be published and receive an income you must decorate and embellish the propaganda the media moguls crave after.

  145. Ted

    Rev. You say Farage was never elected to anything in his life. In fact he was elected as an MEP. His UKIP party won 3.5 million votes (which in Scottish terms is a lot). In 2019 his brand new Brexit Party after 6 weeks in existence, won the European Parliament elections and trounced every other party.

  146. John Main

    @Effijy says:25 July, 2023 at 7:57 am

    Your obsession with BoJo is blinding you to the fact that right now, nobody is seriously trying to rehabilitate him to public office.

    Have you ever considered just how much Indy would be helped if BoJo was to make a return?

    You should be thinking strategically and calling for his re-instatement.

  147. Dorothy Devine

    Does anyone know the circulation figures for the Herald and National?

    I am curious to know when they will reach breaking point. If the SNP/Green Scottish government withheld the money they provide for these foreign owned papers how long would they survive?

    Perhaps they might find a more worthy cause for tax payers money – though what bizarre group /idea they might back is anyone’s guess.

  148. John Stone

    ‘This might be a timely point to remember that Brexit, the biggest political change in Britain in the last 50 years, was brought about chiefly by a man who’s never been elected to anything in his life.’

    You’re right about the importance of ideas, and specifically about how important Farage was to to the disaster of Brexit, but he was in fact elected several times as an MEP, and the party he led actually topped the polls in UK elections to the European parliament.

  149. Big J

    “Colonialism, therefore, seems to have a boomerang effect on the Mother country”

    This is so obviously true, and is what our late mother regarded as “The sins of the fathers being visited upon the sons, to the seventh generation.”

  150. Republicofscotland

    “THE UK Government will consider “sanctions” that could be imposed on the Scottish Government for spending money on areas such as independence, a Tory minister has said.

    Speaking in the House of Lords on Monday, Lucy Neville-Rolfe said that the UK Government’s standard rule book would have to be changed to “relate to the sort of changes in the devolution settlements”.

    The comment from the Cabinet Office minister and Tory peer came as members of the Lords discussed changes to the Cabinet Manual, where the main laws, rules and conventions affecting the conduct and operation of government are set out.”

    On the above, with the current useless SNP government in Bute House at the moment, we cannot allow this foreign country to interfere any deeper in Scottish political affairs.

    Westminster has a long history of meddling in other countries political affairs to the detriment of the targeted countries citizens, always remember that sanctions is a form of warfare by other means, Westminster uses sanctions abroad which end up hurting poor folk in Third World countries, the 16,000+ sanctions against the RF is costing EU citizens a fortune by backfiring on them via their governments poor decisions.

    Scotland needs to ditch this vile union, and ditch it soon, or face the consequences of allowing a foreign country to make important decisions which ultimately will be detrimental to Scots.

    Down with the union, vote Alba, Join Alba do it now.

  151. John Main

    @Republicofscotland says:25 July, 2023 at 9:31 am

    Westminster uses sanctions abroad which end up hurting poor folk in Third World countries, the 16,000+ sanctions against the RF is costing EU citizens a fortune

    We’re oot the EU RoS. WM sanctions can’t hurt EU citizens.

    Worth repeating, as if you don’t already know, that this Sovereign Scot supports everything WM and/or HR can throw at the vile RF.

    Whether they are deliberately destroying the food supply routes to poor, third-world countries, or deliberately destroying the delicate Arctic ecosystem, or deliberately destroying their sovereign, free neighbors, the RF needs to be reigned in.

    If we in the west can do it at no higher cost than some financial pain, it’s a price well worth paying.

  152. Alf Baird

    John Main @ 7:19 am

    “One fascinating side effect of this (never acknowledged on here) is how Scotland has been insulated from the true boomeranging payback for her enthusiastic history of colonisation by being part of this unequal union. The majority of the payback lands on England. If Scotland got her pro-rata share, our civic life, our towns and cities, and our wee, pretendy parliament would look a lot different.”

    So-called ‘white flight’ which, post-brexit, is now heavily oriented towards movement to rural England, Scotland and Wales from English cities and towns due to in-migration and cultural/ethnic change there, does suggest a rather different outcome for Scotland. But that does not mean Scotland ‘is insulated’ from the effects of significant ‘settler occupation’ with its consequent impacts on the nation including not least its national culture, societal values (and voting preferences), and national identity/emotion. In the 1990s Scots made Scotland a Tory free zone, its not now. Why do you think that is?

    In other words, Scotland may still be less ‘multicultural’ than England, but Scotland is clearly becoming more ‘English’ due to the ongoing movement of English people to Scotland which is also as a response to ‘multiculturalism’ in England.

    As Prof Danny Dorling in his research noted, white English people are looking for a place to live which is predominantly Anglophone, white and British-identifying, and to a large extent Scotland fits the bill; lower house prices, availability of higher level/paid jobs and a nice landscape etc are an added bonus.

    The ‘white flight’ phenomenon is therefore arguably an outcome of Britain’s colonialism, and for Scotland we also return to Michael Hechter’s UK model in which Scotland has been/is subject to ‘internal colonialism’ and a ‘cultural division of labour’ as movement here from England tends to be mainly the professional, managerial and middle classes (inc retirees) reflecting the culture of the colonial power. These demographics also explain why Scotland is no longer a Tory free zone and why the ‘unionist’ anti-independence vote remains higher than it would otherwise be.

  153. Stewart Dixon

    Dear Rev, who is the never elected to anything prime mover of Brexit? If it’s Nigel Farage then in the interests of accuracy please note that NF (and I’m no/not/never a fan) was elected as MEP for south east England, thus in a UK constituency vote.
    The thing I like best about Wings is its ruthless accuracy, and readiness to self-correct (e.g. Branchfoot). Salut.

  154. Margaret Eleftheriou

    Few spare minutes waiting for software download, gave me the following information (admittedly from Wikipedia but with good references)
    ASA’s fourth rate university was:
    – twice recognised by the Queen’s Anniversary Prize for Higher and Further Education (in 2009 & 2015) for its work in timber engineering, sustainable construction and wood science.
    -In the Times and The Sunday Times Good University Guide 2021, Edinburgh Napier was ranked the top modern university in Scotland
    – the 2020 National Student Survey ranked the institution number one for student satisfaction in Edinburgh
    -In The Guardian University Guide 2017, the university was ranked top in the UK for adding value to students
    Current Vice-Chancellor: Will Whitehorn (installed 2021), president of industry group UKspace ; former executive at the Virgin Group; boardroom roles at The Scottish Gallery Employee Ownership Trust, Scottish -Event Campus, Craneware, Good Energy and AAC Clyde Space AB. Previous Vice-Chancellors:Tim Waterstone (Waterstones), Viscount Younger of Leckie (still in UK Gov)
    .-Links with Judi Dench, Brian Cox, Tilda Swinton
    But to ASA, it is, was, and always will be fourth rate. One must wonder why this continual invective against this particular university.

  155. John Main

    @Margaret Eleftheriou says:25 July, 2023 at 10:51 am

    It sounds like a dedicated centre for colonialist oppression! How else could Napier have earned so many plaudits from our Anglo-centric overlords?!?

    If Professor Baird were to be consistent in his frequently posted claims about the colonisation of the Scottish academic system, he would be joining in with ASA’s dissing. After all, what use to an Independent Scotland is an establishment that reinforces the alien mindset of our colonising elites in our suggestible younger people?

    That’s the problem with these through-the-looking-glass belief systems though. They end up tying you in pretzel-like knots.

  156. Garavelli Princip

    I see that the self-appointed arbiter of grammar and English usage (as well as economics and politics) does not know the difference between ‘reigned’ and ‘reined’.

    As in this, so in everything else that he writes here. (or as he might put it ‘rights here’)!

  157. Bob Mack


    Small man . Big ego.

  158. Northcode

    Margaret Eleftheriou @10:51am

    Indeed, Margaret. Napier is an excellent university.

    Napier also hosts The Centre for Cybersecurity, IoT and Cyber-physical systems (CIC), led by Professor Bill Buchanan, a brilliant but down-to-earth Scot from Falkirk.

  159. Southernbystander

    Alf Baird / John Main (07:19am) re the ‘boomerang effect’, this was actually predicted way back on the 18th century when more enlightened souls like Samuel Johnson and his somewhat feckless friend, poet John Savage, were already condemning colonialism and slavery.

    Take a look at this extract from Savage’s poem of 1743:

    Why must I Afric’s sable children see
    Vended for slaves, tho’ form’d by nature free,
    The nameless tortures cruel minds invent,
    Those to subject, whom nature equal meant?
    If these you dare (albeit unjust success
    Empow’rs you now unpunish’d to oppress)
    Revolving empire you and yours may doom,
    (Rome all subdu’d, yet Vandals vanquish’d Rome,)
    Yes, empire may revolve, give them the day,
    And yoke may yoke, and blood may blood repay

    Much of the current debate around the legacies of colonialism and slavery and how we face that legacy can be accredited to the idea that ’empires may revolve’ though fortunately no-one is demanding yoke for yoke.

    As to whether the English people in general (or indeed Scots who were just as culpable) should now ‘suffer’ equally is the wrong question to me as it assumes that the major increase in migrants to England from those old colonies is fundamentally bad or somehow a serious threat to . . . I am not sure what.

    This comes from a certain type mindset and is also a pretty big misreading of English society as if it is on the verge of collapse from being subsumed by ‘aliens’ and that English culture is being destroyed. This isn’t the case: it is evolving but Englishness is alive and well. The trick is to accept migrants ‘as English’ or at the very least British (which give the chance, they embrace), and enjoy their new take on it, whilst at the same time, celebrating its original form. This process is hardly smooth or universally accepted but in my lifetime, it is what I have broadly seen happen.

    I can only assume this warped view of England as a dystopia overrun by ‘foreigners’ comes from the ultra-nationalist perspective that looks at the (apparent) existential threat of a ‘great English replacement’ in Scotland and makes false extrapolations.

  160. Northcode

    I’ve been reading an interesting book about lying.

    Here’s an extract:

    Lying is, almost by definition, a refusal to cooperate with others. It condenses a lack of trust and trustworthiness into a single act.

    It is both a failure of understanding and an unwillingness to be understood.

    To lie is to recoil from relationship.

    The lies of the powerful lead us to distrust governments and corporations.

    The lies of the weak make us callous toward the suffering of others.

    The lies of conspiracy theorists raise doubts about the honesty of whistleblowers, even when they are telling the truth.

    Lies are the social equivalent of toxic waste—everyone is potentially harmed by their spread.

    from “Lying” by Sam Harris.

    Harris is an interesting character. He spent some time in India and Nepal, where he studied meditation with teachers of the Buddhist and Hindu religions.

    His mother was TV writer and producer Susan Harris, who created Soap and The Golden Girls.

    He gained a doctorate in cognitive neuroscience using functional magnetic resonance imaging to conduct research into the neural basis of belief, disbelief, and uncertainty.

    It’s worth a read it’s interesting stuff.

  161. John Main

    @Garavelli Princip says:25 July, 2023 at 11:10 am

    Good spot. I look forwards to you jumping on every other spelling faux pas posted on here.

    Haha, I crack me up.

    Anyways, you have earned a fool afternoon of smug superiority on me.


  162. desimond

    @john Main
    re “Have you ever considered just how much Indy would be helped if BoJo was to make a return?”

    How much exactly did the dial move through all those years of hopeless and hapless Tory Prime Ministers such as Boris, Truss, May and Sunak

    Not a jot I would expect.

    The problem Indy has isnt external, its internal. No-one outside the core is being convinced that the alternative is the way forward.

  163. Geri

    Phil French 11.41pm

    **(not independence, we’re not a colony)**

    If we’re not a colony maybe you can explain to the group why a COUNTRY is forbidden to hold a referendum & has absolutely no control over its resources?


    Scotland needs to reconvene the real Scottish parliament & fck Holyrood & the Scotland Act. It’s just as Bissett warned. It’ll be gutted from the inside.
    How dare a foreign country tell this one what it can & cannot spend it’s OWN money on. A referendum was voted for by the electorate through the ballot box.
    They’ve never been good at democracy.

    The SNP need removed ASAP.


    Don’t be daft about immigrants Vs a colony. Immigrants don’t have control over the English treasury, England’s resources or are asset stripping to send home. Get back to us when it happens.

    Napier University

    An attack on its status is just the usual Yoon insult they seem to think will win them prizes. God knows where – I’m sure it’s had plenty of Britnat students over the yrs who will be thrilled to know their CV entry has been demoted to *just a polytechnic* lol!

  164. John Main

    @Southernbystander says:25 July, 2023 at 11:27 am

    fortunately no-one is demanding yoke for yoke


    California Governor Newsom has presided over the reparations task force that has detailed individual pay outs to be up to 1 million USD.

    The total estimate is 800 billion USD. Paying that would certainly sentence the predominantly white, Hispanic and Asian tax payers of California to an unremitting lifetime drudgery of unprofitable work.

    Hardly surprising they are fleeing the state. Getting out while the going is good.

  165. pipinghot

    So conspiracy theories are all lies?

  166. Geri

    ***“THE UK Government will consider “sanctions” that could be imposed on the Scottish Government for spending money on areas such as independence, a Tory minister has said.***

    We should return the favour over Brexshit. We didn’t vote to leave.
    & Stop funding the Royals – he’s not our King.

    How much has that cost Scotland?

    They should’ve trained Bain a lot better. It was her failure to know her actual job on the law that incurred costs on independence.

  167. Johnlm

    John Main thinks that the bombing of the Nordstream was a price worth paying.
    By their fruits shall ye know them.

  168. stuart mctavish

    SteepBrae @7:18 am

    Not sure if that course includes o grade statistics but even the ethics element might render it highly recommended/ compulsory for contemporary medical graduates in due course – ie once the more urgent remedial studies for Imperial College professors, chief medical advisors, sadistic dental hygienists and professional shop stewards etc (if any), are complete.

  169. John Main

    @Johnlm says:25 July, 2023 at 12:20 pm

    John Main thinks that the bombing of the Nordstream was a price worth paying.
    By their fruits shall ye know them

    I think it was bombed by 404.

    In the event of Scotland ever becoming a free, independent, sovereign nation, I will expect the first responsibility of our government to be the defence of our territory and our people.

    If that involves taking hard decisions in response to a murderous, invading, imperialist aggressor, then so be it. If the invading aggressor doesn’t like it, a simple solution will be for the invading aggressor to fuck off back to its own country.

    I won’t be supporting any potential iScotland government that lacks the guts to defend our country, or stand with our allies. Given the widespread beliefs about how wealthy and resource-rich we are, a policy of unilateral helplessness would be nonsense on stilts. Soz and all that, but if this is such an unpopular minority POV, you have nowt to fear.

    “Vote Indy For Cringing Helplessness”. Yup, it passes the T-shirt test if nothing else.

  170. John Main

    @Geri says:25 July, 2023 at 12:19 pm

    We didn’t vote to leave

    How do you know?

    You can’t logically claim that New Scots swung the 2014 Indy vote to No, but then ignore the possibility that New Scots swung the Brexit vote to Remain in Scotland.

    I claim that we Sovereign Scots were sufficiently knowledgeable about the true meaning of Independence to vote to kick the EU into touch. I claim that it was only the Remain votes of New Scots that stole the Leave result from us Sovereign Scots.

    Prove me wrong if you can.

  171. sarah

    O/T Back to male/female identity issues – Canada put a person called Quinn in their women’s football team against Nigeria. Supposedly non-binary i.e. a man.

    An Emma Smith wrote the report for BBC football page online, posted 15 minutes ago. The tone throughout was of uncritical approval. “No fuss.”

    I’m in despair. Again.

  172. Republicofscotland

    “John Main thinks that the bombing of the Nordstream was a price worth paying.”

    F*ck me, the evil monster Madeline Albright isn’t dead as long as this pr*ck is spouting her shite.

    Albright said the murdering of half a million Iraqi children during the illegal invasions of Iraq was a price worth paying.

  173. Geri

    **How do you know?**

    62% All 32 counties. New Scots were banned from voting in Brexshit by the English franchise.

    **I think it was bombed by 404.**

    It’s was the USA & Norway. Follow the money. They gained the most & pissed off the EU in the process who promptly had to pay over inflated prices for their gas when they had a better deal from R.
    Quick – blame some tosser in a supposed row boat who blew it up. Aye. That’ll be believable as Gas prices soar!
    You are a propagandists wet dream for sapping up BBC bullshit.

  174. Xaracen

    John Main said;

    “I claim that we Sovereign Scots were sufficiently knowledgeable about the true meaning of Independence to vote to kick the EU into touch. I claim that it was only the Remain votes of New Scots that stole the Leave result from us Sovereign Scots.

    Prove me wrong if you can.”

    Not your place to demand that. You made the claim, so you must substantiate it first, otherwise there is no case for anyone else to answer, because you didn’t actually make one.

  175. Johnlm

    John Main seems to regard himself as a global financial expert whilst simultaneously approving the collapse of the world’s economic system.

    I doubt 404 managed Nordstream using a Polish yacht rental.

  176. Republicofscotland

    “that this Sovereign Scot supports everything WM and/or HR can throw at the vile RF.”

    Maybe not as many as you think, and we might be out of the EU but we need imports from the market, which are in shorter supply, as for the Black Sea Grain Initiative, the UN and 404 did not live up to their end of the bargain, with the majority of 404’s grain going to Europe and not needy Third World countries.

    The impact of the cancellation of the deal will deeply impact on 404’s finances which of course will see Nato countries and EU members citizens fork out even more cash to support Nato’s war.

  177. Geri


    The only way this nonsense will be defeated is when countries & ppl stop competing in this farce.

    A bit like turning up at Westminster knowing you’ll achieve nothing, it’s only giving the air of legitimacy where it merits none.

    A shame for the women who have spent yrs training but the sooner they withdraw from competition the sooner this nonsense with end, imo.

  178. Republicofscotland

    As the English propaganda machine the BBC runs an article on its lunchtime news programme about maimed kids in Yemen, lets not forget that the English government of the day sold cluster weapons to Saudi Arabia to use on these children.

    Of course with no remit after the fall of the Soviet Union/USSR, Nato used it cluster bombs in Kosovo and Serbia killing hundreds.

    Thatcher even tried to get in on the act by selling cluster bombs to China, which politely refused to purchase them from the English, gone are the days when English gunboat diplomacy forced China to by opium.

  179. Republicofscotland

    “THE UK Government has backed a multi-million-pound loan to deliver a new railway line – in Turkey.

    UK Export Finance – the Government’s export credit agency – has underwritten €781 million (£680m) of financing to support the construction of a 286-kilometre high-speed electric railway in the south of the country.The loan underwritten by the UK Government has been provided by J.P. Morgan, ING Bank and BNP Paribas.”

    This is just brilliant, with the UK’s own transport (trains) infrastructure falling apart and train fares spiraling out of control, along with the white Elephant that is HS2, Scots and the rest of the UK’s citizens will now fork out more to fund Turkey’s railway system, to line the pockets of Westminster’s corporate buddies, as a big thank you to Turkey for letting Sweden join the warmonering Nato bullies.

  180. Alf Baird

    John Main @ 11:10 am

    “what use to an Independent Scotland is an establishment that reinforces the alien mindset of our colonising elites”

    Indeed. A newly independent people might also need to stop advertising all their top jobs in the former mother country’s metropolitan capital, and consider themselves capable of running their own institutions.

  181. SusanAHF

    Sarah, much as I think the whole trans/non binary thing is a crock of shit, Quinn the supposedly non binary player is in fact female.

  182. sarah

    @ Geri: it would be much better if the rest of the team refused to play, and did so at the last minute so there was no time to find 10 more compliant players.

    But what gets me is the BBC’s bland approval of what is an outrage for women. If someone said “give a World Cup to every team that plays in the competition” there would be a storm of protest and discussion by the journalists, let alone by the players. But the BBC won’t stand up for the truth. It is horrifying.

  183. sarah

    @ SusanAHF: “Quinn…is in fact female.”

    Ah that is marginally better. But how come the BBC write an article about it at all? Is it news that “female plays female football”?

  184. Captain Yossarian

    Alf – Holyrood is an all-Scottish institution, isn’t it? I think we were all hoping when Holyrood was established that it would stand up well against Westminster. What with the last but one previous FM attending the High Court and whilst there is still the possibility that the last FM will be attending the High Court too, it looks as though we cannot handle it. I’ll give you one thing though, if this story is anything to go by, Labour could be even worse. Folk think they are an “oven-ready” solution. I’d prefer to shoot myself rather than be governed by that bunch (and I speak as a Labour voter). I think the SNP need to sort their ideas out. They are currently in a mess.

  185. Geri

    **Quinn the supposedly non binary player is in fact female.**

    If they don’t identity as a woman then they shouldn’t be in a woman’s football team.

    They/them/it needs to go start their own category for competition. It is a nonsense. They’re mentally ill & shouldn’t be allowed out in public to control everyone else with their pronoun shit.

  186. Geri

    **Alf – Holyrood is an all-Scottish institution, isn’t it?**


    Not only is it ruled under the Scotland Act by London it is also stuffed full of English appointed civil servants.

  187. Republicofscotland

    “A SCOTLAND Office adviser has reportedly won the selection to contest Alister Jack’s seat for the Conservatives at the next election.

    John Cooper, who currently works as a special adviser to the Scottish Secretary, has been selected as the Tory candidate for Dumfries and Galloway at the next election, according to the selections-watcher Michael Crick.

    The Scottish Secretary is stepping down at the next election and Crick reported on his “Tomorrow’s MPs” Twitter account that Cooper saw off challenges from Ella Robertson McKay and Rebecca Fraser for the nomination.”

    And it only cost him £28k to win the nomination.

    Or maybe not if you believe the comment below- I don’t.

    “Politico reported that a John Cooper has donated £28,000 to Jack’s “campaign fund” since April 2018 – but that the Tory MP’s office said this was a different person with the same name.”

  188. Republicofscotland

    “Not only is it ruled under the Scotland Act by London it is also stuffed full of English appointed civil servants.”

    And Fifth Column House Jocks, whose remit is to make sure Scotland never leaves the union and to not answer to their constituents (farmers fishermen f*cked over, even though most of them voted no in 2014) but to answer to their party bosses in London.

  189. John Johnstone

    Most recent daily sales figures for the Herald and National as released by the ABC board are. Herald: 12,928 including 1,824 subscriptions. Herald on Sunday: 6,679 including 728 subscriptions. The National: 3,555 including 345 subscriptions. These are the most recent audited figures up to December 2022 and may have increased or decreased since then.

  190. Geri

    **The Permanent Secretary is the most senior civil servant in Scotland and leads more than 7000 staff within the core Scottish Government and has oversight of around 125 agencies.

    The government is structured into a number of directorates and their related public bodies. Directorates and agencies are managed by directors-general.**

    Permanent secretary: John-Paul Marks

    Born: Jersey.

    Appointed by: Westminster.

    Known for: 122,000 + DWP deaths.

  191. Geri


    **but that the Tory MP’s office said this was a different person with the same name.”**


    A bit like baroness tank commander & her *raffles* that generated millions of donations for Brexshit.

  192. Republicofscotland

    The Red Tories (Labour) shown for what they are.

    “A Labour candidate in a pivotal Westminster seat launched a food bank drive on the same day Keir Starmer rejected lifting the two child cap on benefits.

    Michael Shanks, who is trying to win Rutherglen and Hamilton West, made a plea for items even though anti-poverty campaigners say the cap drives people to use food banks.”

  193. Geri


    It’s amazing the amount of ppl who think we actually have a Scottish parliament.

    It’s a branch office & all failures of Holyrood lie ultimately with London.

    Civil servants are appointed by Westminster to make sure Scotland doesn’t achieve ideas above its station yet it continually fails to *advise* Lorna Slater & Patrick Harvie that they’re fucking eejits on a daily basis & to step away from policy. It has also appointed two Lord Advocates (Evans & Bain) who doesn’t actually know the Law at a cost to the Scottish taxpayer of £millions of £££s lol! (Salmond stitch up/judicial process stitch up/supreme court stitch up)

    Yet to britnats it’s the SNPEEE! You couldn’t make this shit up.

  194. Stuart MacKay

    John Johnstone, thanks for the interesting numbers.

    If anyone is so inclined you can find a list of newspapers at and their reported circulation for 2022. You’ll have to click each one to see the numbers but there are a few interesting tidbits in there. For example Oban Times (circulation 6120) trumps The National (circulation 3555). Even the John O’Groat Journal, (for f**ks sake) with a circulation 3004 is close behind.

    Ofcom’s news consumption survey for 2020, is also interesting.

    I’m sure there’s deep meaning in all that but Hothersal ranting on X (RIP twitter) is unlikely to be reaching that many eyeballs.

    With Salmond out and about on various outlets he’s probably getting more attention than most. However, since everything is spread out all over the place, it’s hard to gauge the impact.

  195. Alf Baird

    Captain Yossarian @ 2:29 pm

    “Holyrood is an all-Scottish institution, isn’t it?”

    Not sure what you mean by ‘all-Scottish’? ‘Scot Gov’ is clearly just a spending department of UK Gov, and thus a colonial administration; e.g. Ministers of the English ‘Imperial State’ crown, ‘gov’ run by UK civil servants, subject to Westminster legislation etc. All MSPs do is divvy up the budget and make up laws to further oppress the people and block independence. Postcolonial theory suggests that all institutions in a colony are colonial in nature/values, i.e. their main purpose is to protect the interest of the colonizer.

  196. Captain Yossarian

    Alf – Salmond ran it well enough and he was taken seriously. No-one laughed at him. People thought: “This Independence from the UK might work”. So, we had a referendum and Salmond lost, narrowly. If that had continued, my point is that another referendum would have been granted, due to popular public support it would have to be. If Salmond has stayed, then things would have been entirely different now.

  197. Gordon

    Alf, I often wondered about the logic of Joanna Cherry being consigned to the back benches after defeating Boris, then I realised the bleedin’ obvious – it was punishment for successfully challenging Westminster, and they were making sure she hadn’t the power or opportunity to try again.

    In that light, it show how deep rooted their colonisation is.

  198. A Scot Abroad

    Alf Baird,

    Under the Scotland Act 1998, Scotland has more devolved powers than almost any devolved region in any nation across the world. The only more devolved administration that I can think of that’s even more devolved is Guyane, a French territory in South America.

    You should understand a bit about colonialism before dribbling on about it. It’s not your background academic subject, and you don’t know much about it.

  199. Breastplate

    Captain Yossarian,
    The idea that we, here in Scotland need to be granted a referendum suggests either you don’t understand what a referendum is or you don’t understand how democracy works or both.

    A referendum is a measurement of the Will of the People.
    Democracy is government by the People through their representatives.

    If you consider that we should continue government democratically then it is anti-democratic to silence the Voice of the People through the rejection of a referendum.

  200. Cameron Robson

    If AS is supposedly unelectable because Scottish voters only look at the headlines, what evidence is there that these headlines lead them to ignore the fact that he was cleared of the charges?

  201. John Main

    @Republicofscotland says:25 July, 2023 at 1:08 pm

    No children were murdered when the pipeline was blown up.

    Once again, get a fucking grip.

  202. Robert Louis

    Brexit is indeed self evidently a disaster. Indeed, I’d go further, and state it is perhaps in modern history the greatest example of a nation inflicting real economic self harm upon itself.

    That it removes the rights of folk to move freely around and live in Europe (which will be even harder next year), makes brexit self evidently stupid as well.

    The real problem as far as Scots are concerned, is that in every single Scottish consituency the vote was NO to brexit. Indeed, in Edinburgh, it was 75% against brexit. As we now know, the opinions and democratic views of Scots were ignored by England (quelle surprise), and Scots were forcibly stripped of their EU rights and citizenship, with Scotland forcibly dragged out of the EU by the English. That is exactly what happened.

    And let’s face it, Brexit was nothing but tacet racism dressed up as something else.

    Imagine the stooshie, if England had voted no, and Scotland had voted yes, then Scotland unilaterally decided to drag England out of the EU against its wishes. But its ok to do that to Scotland, according to the England worshippers.

    Brexit, yet another example of English colonial abuse perpetrated by England, as part of this unwanted, undemocratic, so-called ‘union‘ with England.

    The sooner we are free of English colonial rule, and back in the EU, the better.

  203. twathater

    Yossa @ 4.49pm if you believe another referendum would have been GRANTED I have a bridge currently up for sale that you may be interested in purchasing

    If we had any politicians with any backbone we would stop playing this interminable game that we need WM permission for anything THEY would vociferously and publicly announce at every instance that HOLYROOD is NOT the parliament of Scotland it is the devolved parliament of colonial WM and as such it has NO POWERS it only acts and exists as a WM branch office
    They should also vociferously and publicly DEMAND to know where England’s devolved parliament has it’s branch office and where is it’s devolved pocket money

    Alex Salmond has said disruption should be the order of the day in WM, when is it going to start happening , Neil Hanvey and Kenny MacAskill should be asking these questions every time they stand up, to educate Scots to the GLARING anomaly that Scotland suffers and it would highlight the silence and betrayal of the snp bench warming tractors

  204. John Main

    @Xaracen says:25 July, 2023 at 1:19 pm

    You made the claim, so you must substantiate it first, otherwise there is no case for anyone else to answer, because you didn’t actually make one

    Of course. That which is stated without evidence may be dismissed without evidence.

    I was making a point. Poster after poster on here makes unsubstantiated claims. Wings BTL is not a serious forum for debating anything. Sometimes it’s fun to get down and dirty with the lunatics.

    TBQH, since the largely unresisted, yet still flawed, fraudulent and disgraceful coronation of Yousaf as FM, it has been very difficult for me to take any of this seriously. It remains the case, however, that the unashamed idiocy of some of the regulars continues to grate.

    This is after all, Scotland’s most widely read Indy blog. Newbies coming here for the first time must form a very dim opinion of Scotland, the Scots, and the Indy movement.

    A rational, well written, logical, grounded post helps recover some of the ground lost to the moonhowlers.

  205. John Main

    @Robert Louis says:25 July, 2023 at 5:40 pm

    in Edinburgh, it was 75% against brexit

    I can’t think of any Scottish locality that is more English than Edinburgh, other than maybes St. Andrews. Both places certainly have universities that are to all intents and purposes English ones.

    So the English in Edinburgh voted Remain. How did the Sovereign Scots vote?

    In fact, Bob, what’s your point?

  206. Captain Yossarian

    Breastplate – There are a great many people like me; not for independence but not anti-independence either. If there’s a risk involved, we will be anti-independence until we see the risk disappear. We are the people the independence movement need to convince and you do that by being nice to us. That’s how democracy works. Try being honest as-well because that’s always a winner. I’m not getting at you personally, but that’s the stage the nationalist movement is at just now. The next UK election will be the first test of how much ground you have lost and it will be shocking for all of you. God help us all if Labour return. I’m personally hoping for some sort of coalition of Parties at Holyrood and if I had to exclude anyone from that it would be Labour, not the SNP.

  207. Garavelli Princip

    “Sometimes it’s fun to get down and dirty with the lunatics.”

    So let’s identify them:

    This June 28, as emergency crews worked to clean up yet another toxic train derailment in the United States, this time on the Montana River, that further exposed our nation’s chronically underfunded infrastructure and its threats to our health, the Pentagon announced plans to send an additional $500 million worth of military aid to Ukraine.

    As Ukraine’s military failed to breach Russia’s primary defense line, CNN reported that by June 12, Kiev quote “lost” 16 US-made armored vehicles sent to the country.

    So what did the Pentagon do? It simply passed that bill down to average US taxpayers charging another $325 million to replace Ukraine’s squandered military stock. There was zero effort to consult the US public’s position on the matter; and the vast majority of Americans likely did not even know the exchange took place.

    The US policy just described — which sees Washington prioritize unrestrained funding for a proxy war with a nuclear power in a foreign land while our own domestic infrastructure falls apart before our eyes — exposes a disturbing dynamic at the heart of the Ukraine conflict: an international Ponzi scheme that enables Western elites to seize hard earned wealth out of the hands of average US citizens and funnel itI into the coffers of a foreign government that even the Western-sponsored Transparency International ranks as one of the most corrupt in Europe.

    The embezzlement of funds and supplies is at least as troubling as the potential consequences of the illicit transfer and sales of military-grade weapons. Last June, the head of Interpol warned that the massive transfers of arms into Ukraine means “we can expect an influx of weapons in Europe and beyond,” and that “criminals are even now, as we speak, focusing on them.”

    President Joe Biden himself said in March 2022, “The idea that we’re gonna send in offensive equipment and have planes and tanks… don’t kid yourself, no matter what you all say, that’s called World War III.”

    Yes – sometimes even the lunatics (both in the White House – and posting here – can get it right – despite themselves!

  208. A Scot Abroad

    Robert Louis,

    if iScotland were accepted into the EU, it would have far less autonomy than it does now under devolution. Qualified Majority Voting (QMV) accounts for around 85% of all decisions, and Scotland’s ~1.5% of the EU population means iScotland gets ~1.5% of the vote on any matter under QMV. Given the ongoing expansion of the EU with Balkan applicants, that say would fairly rapidly drop to 1%.

    It’s always been a mystery as to why Scotland might want to leave the U.K., only to then join the EU, and have far less control and autonomy over itself than it does at the moment. And you can see the continuing direction of travel of the EU: common foreign policy, common tax system, debt burdens shared among all nations, and the like. Those are all published “ambitions” for 2040. And as Scotland currently sends 60% of all its exports to England, there’s be a loss of trade and a customs border with England.

    It’s a loss of national self-control that can only be explained by people who think like you actually just hating the English, and nothing more.

  209. Captain Yossarian

    Twathater – I don’t come on here to wind folk up, but the established protocol is that when there is sufficient long term demand for another referendum, then Westminster will agree to it. I probably would too. The problem just now is that demand is in reverse gear going backwards like a runaway train. No-one from the National for example is even talking about another referendum, because people would laugh. The independence strategy and leadership need to get themselves re-aligned. I continue to read this because I have never been anti-independence and some on here have the right idea, but you just don’t demand anything you like and expect to get it because you are an independence supporter. It’s like “Stop Oil2 and all the rest of it; you need to carry the public with you.

  210. Alf Baird

    Gordon @ 5:05 pm

    “I often wondered about the logic of Joanna Cherry”

    Testing the sovereignty of Westminster in relation to the prorogation of that parliament was one thing; however, many independinistas might have preferred her testing the lawfulness of Scotland’s enforced EU exit against the wishes of sovereign Scots and in consideration of the articles of the Treaty of Union and its conditionality upon the Claim of Right.

  211. James

    A Scot Abroad&Co.;
    “..ock aye the nue, ahm Scotch, do ye ken? We’re shite…..”

    etc etc etc ad infinitum….

  212. John Main

    @Captain Yossarian

    On behalf of the rational readers here, I would like to thank you for your calm, considered, reality-grounded posts.

    We are the people the independence movement need to convince and you do that by being nice to us. That’s how democracy works. Try being honest as-well because that’s always a winner.

    Difficult to add much more to that, unless it’s:

    Show us the money!

    There is nothing nicer, or more persuasive, than being shown how a proposed course of action will make one better off. “Shown”, not “told”. And no exhortation to “just have faith”. There’s an enormous difference between these two approaches.

    Heck, even RoS is finally seeing this.

  213. Robert Louis

    All those 27 EU member states must find it odd, that idiots still try to make out that EU membership is worse than being run as an English colony. All 27 member states in the EU, have more power over their own affairs than Scotland. Yet still some England worshipping ‘unionistas’ try to argue that English colonial rule of Scotland is better for us. Aye, right!

    Of course Scotland will be better off when we throw off England’s yoke, and get back into the EU. Even the majority in England want back in the EU now. Even they see how much of a disaster brexit has been.

  214. Shug

    a Scot abroad,

    Scotland has the most powerful devolved government in the world

    can we have a scheme to return ginger bottles, NAW

    ha ha what a Muppet

    btw how is sensible Dave doing

  215. What Rot

    Phil French @ 11.41pm:

    “Many suspect his fundamental interest in the cause is minimal, it was just a vehicle for his own advancement”

    What a load of SHITE. Honest tae fuckin god

  216. John Main

    @Alf Baird says:25 July, 2023 at 6:31 pm

    testing the lawfulness of Scotland’s enforced EU exit

    Here we go, Alf, the EU referendum question:

    “Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?”

    Do you see any mention of Scotland, England, Wales or Northern Ireland in there? No, me neither.

    The time to test the lawfulness was before, not after, in a hissy fit.

    But before, everybody was convinced the fix for Remain was in, and so they didn’t need to bother.

    Anyhoo, the UK voted in, and the UK voted out. It’s a popular subject anywhere a Scot gathers to greet into his dram, but we’re never going back unless we negotiate everything all over again from scratch.

    Personally, after 300 years of the current rancid union, I am in no hurry to jump into another even more rancid union, but with an order of magnitude bigger disparity between Scotland and the rest, than the disparity we have now.

    It’s just about the most obvious no-brainer currently on the go.

  217. Shug

    I see Mike Russell is outraged at Westminster’s plans to over rule Scottish legislation.

    Any minute now he will be digging out his horse box, and that will have them on the back foot when they see that horse box coming down the street.

    The only risk I see is Scot abroad pulling a mussel laughing.

  218. John Main

    @A Scot Abroad says:25 July, 2023 at 6:18 pm

    It’s amazing the cognitive dissonance of posters who believe we are a wealthy country, yet fail to acknowledge that within the EU the wealthy countries chip in to subsidise the rest.

    It’s amazing the cognitive dissonance of posters who parrot that we all want to rejoin the EU, yet fail to comprehend that nobody can rationally want into the EU until such time as they know the terms and conditions under which we would join. And thus know the costs, and whether these costs would be outweighed by the benefits.

    It’s amazing the cognitive dissonance of posters who constantly hold up Norway as the exemplar for what iScotland should aspire to be, yet fail to understand that Norway is not in the EU.

    Truly, we live in amazing and interesting times.

  219. Republicofscotland

    “Any minute now he will be digging out his horse box, and that will have them on the back foot when they see that horse box coming down the street.”


    How f*ckin embarrassing is it knowing that Mike Russell was going to travel around Scotland in a horsebox, I don’t know whose intelligence was insulted the most, the indy masses or Russell’s himself, though the latter seemed satisfied with the idea, of touring Scotland in Del Trotter’s van, the Scottish version that is. It was reported in Sturgeon the Judas fanzine (The National) as some sort of breakthrough, a vote winner if you like.

    Meanwhile the self-serving lying b*stards in the SNP hierarchy had hidden away a £110k luxurious motorhome, that was probably bought with some of the missing 660k.

  220. Republicofscotland

    “testing the lawfulness of Scotland’s enforced EU exit”

    Indeed, and the ex-FM of Wales Carwyn Jones was amazed and baffled that Scotland’s FM at the time Nicola Sturgeon didn’t bat an eyelid when Westminster trampled all over Scots sovereignty, which should have led to at the very least a vote on dissolving the union.

    I also don’t recall England’s PM David Cameron groveling to Brussel’s and asking them for an S30, this is because England didn’t need Brussel’s permission to leave the EU, just as Sots don’t need Westminster’s permission to leave the union, all that is required is a vote and a 50+1% victory.

    A vote that should be held at every election (concurrent) to run alongside every election.

    Scotland’s route out of this union via the 50+1% is blocked not by the foreign government South of the border, but by our very own SNP government a government that doesn’t want independence, a government that’s quite happy with the status quo no matter how detrimental it may be to Scots, with the right people in place (that’s the point of attack we must get the right people in place) the 50+1% vote can be implemented at every election.

    Far too many Scottish MPs and MSPs are self-serving, to the expense of the Scottish people.

  221. bluegrass banjo

    earlier in the year i bet blair mcdougall (quiz lingfield) £2 labour would drop removal of zero hour contracts

    he wouldnt take it

  222. Chas

    You could log on to Wings and read the posts after Stu’s accurate and informative articles. It does not take long to stumble upon the usual shite, from the usual nutters, who post the same things umpteen times every single day.
    Wings is rapidly going downhill. Not your fault Stu, or maybe it is, as you allow the shite.
    Anybody else fed up reading ‘it’s just no fair’, Colonialism, The EU-which we have left, 300 year old pish etc.
    For the hard of thinking-an Independent Scotland will need honest, competent politicians. Will somebody please tell me where the are? Are they hiding?
    It would also maybe help if we had some cash to spend it on the things the Country and the people want and need. The needs and wants of the politicians should be secondary-currently this is not happening.
    Of course come Independence ‘it will all be fine’!

  223. Republicofscotland

    “It would also maybe help if we had some cash to spend it on the things the Country and the people want and need.”

    F*ck me Einstein speaks, where do you think most of our cash has been going since the illegal union was thrust upon ordinary Scots centuries ago, just where has the mega profits from our assets gone to?

    Oh dear its a mystery, you thick as shite spunk bubble. Jeezo Reeve’s is allowing any dense monkey to type on the keys at Denison these days.

  224. Alf Baird

    John Main @ 7:15 pm

    “The time to test the lawfulness was before”

    Yes, and also before the Northern Ireland backstop further violated the Treaty of Union UK internal trade agreement. But really, a majority of nationalist MPs (and MSPs) had more than sufficient grounds with Scotland’s enforced Brexit to end the UK union; rather than asserting sovereignty they bottled it, and still do.

  225. Breastplate

    Captain Yossarian,

    As I have said, I’m not convinced you have a grasp of democracy and how it works, being nice has absolutely nothing to do with it, nothing, not even a little bit, the majority has their way whether anybody else is feeling hurt or not for not having their own way.

    Emotional debate is not conducive to logical thinking, if it’s the emotional side of your brain that drives your decisions then logic and rational debate will leave you steadfastly in the same opinion you got from someone being nice to you, as you have so kindly pointed out.

    I don’t mean to upset you but I will continue to argue the case for independence with logic and point out to our more emotional friends any illogical thinking on their part.

    You are of course entitled to believe that it’s nice and proper having Switzerland, Azerbaijan or England running Scotland’s affairs.

  226. Shug

    There is a great deal of irony unionists seem to be missing.
    Every year in November we remember those that served and died to preserve democracy, but here we are living in a union that is preserved only by the blackmailing of Sturgeon, the corruption, threats and denial of democracy.
    6 times the people of Scotland have voted for another referendum and the great democracy denier in London says no.
    Yes unionists should ponder their precious union, held together by corruption and threats, when they are standing at their local cenotaph.

  227. Geri


    **Do you see any mention of Scotland, England, Wales or Northern Ireland in there? No, me neither.**

    It was in the House of commons.
    ALL FOUR NATIONS had to show a majority to exit.
    They promised it was *only advisory*
    & It was *non binding*
    & Each NATION would be consulted with the result.

    Just demonstrates how slippery & dishonest those feckers were when only two nations returned a vote leave but they charged ahead regardless. Giving NI Scotland’s proposal to remain in the single market & giving Scotland absolutely hee-haw in defiance. Knts!

    Also, STFU about Dumbzas election. It was dubious but no more dubious than Sunak who was chosen, unelected, by a handful of Tory mates to run the fcking country.

    Captain Yossarian

    It’s really your attitude that stinks & not those of independence supporters. You keep saying what England will or will not allow, what conditions are to be met first & if we beg nicely we *might* be allowed permission. WTF?!

    Scotland is a country. It’s ppl decided at the ballot box, six times, to vote to hold a referendum to leave that treaty. The end. No hoops to jump, no criteria to meet. No *if yer face fits* THAT isn’t democracy is it? What you are describing is anything but!

    No conditions needed. Scotland is a country that can leave the UK treaty of union anytime it chooses. Just as the UK could terminate their treaty with the EU. Davis said there was no treaty a sovereign ppl cannot leave & he is right.

    King Chucky claims to uphold those terms of union – he may want to start abiding by it because Scotland’s grievances are mounting. The whole point there was even a Union at all.

    As for waiting until conditions are *perfect* at Holyrood first. You’ll have a long wait. The whole point of the colonisers branch office is to disrupt, dismantle & derail everything an independence party tries to do. You mentioned the success of Alex Salmonds government, aye – back when indy stood at only 27% & wasn’t a threat.


    I agree. I don’t know why she didn’t give our exit from the UK far more importance than she did because Brexit was happening by then. (Any ppls 2nd vote long expired by then) She had a triple mandate to pursue it & obviously more free workload away from the front benches. It was completely pointless being there.

  228. Dorothy Devine

    It remains a puzzle to me why certain folk even bother to type on this ‘ dreadful’ site – obviously it is infra dig and should be left to rot in their opinion, so why do they insist on making comment or reading any of the “shite’.

    Very puzzling, if I felt that strongly I wouldn’t grace the site with my presence, so why do they?

  229. Big Jock

    Shug. ‘English exceptionalism’. They only celebrate democracy, when it doesn’t conflict with their own agenda or personal wealth. Indeed only once in history were they actually on the right side. All their other wars were about money, colonialism, genocide and political gain.

  230. A Scot Abroad


    so when were those six times that Scotland has voted in favour of another referendum?

    Genuine question, because I can’t come up with even one time that’s what Scotland voted for.

  231. Geri


    During indyref the various YES groups on Facebook were polluted with no voters just dropping in to tell everyone to shut it. You’d think they would just shut up themselves & use the exit but no, they had to make a grand entrance
    to tell everyone how bored they were like stroppy teenagers. I dunno who it’s supposed to impress.

    They should spend more effort trying to sell us a dead union instead.

  232. robbo

    Never goes down Mr Main eh

    Why can’t we have our own little clock for us poor we 5 million /

    Go on, tell us then?

  233. Kcor

    Chas says:
    25 July, 2023 at 8:16 pm

    “You could log on to Wings and read the posts after Stu’s accurate and informative articles. It does not take long to stumble upon the usual shite, from the usual nutters, who post the same things umpteen times every single day.”

    As I have suggested before, it would be a good idea to have two versions of the Rev. Stuart Campbell’s “accurate and informative” articles, not forgetting how they expose corruption and hypocrisy at the highest levels affecting both independence seekers and unionists.

    One without any comments and one with comments.

    The ones without comments can be widely circulated to all and sundry.

    Readers tend to read the comments and not just ignore them and many comments do negate the effect of the excellent unrivalled investigative journalism that the Rev. Stuart Campbell presents.

  234. Geri

    Tsk at that clock..

    All those austerity measures too. 16 yrs & counting. I’d have thought the cuts to disability would have cleared our debts by now. Fcks sakes!

    Just think, Norway has triple that in credit sitting in an oil fund.
    I guess all those oil companies just like Norway better than us.

  235. Kcor

    twathater says:
    25 July, 2023 at 5:45 pm

    “Neil Hanvey and Kenny MacAskill should be asking these questions every time they stand up, to educate Scots to the GLARING anomaly that Scotland suffers and it would highlight the silence and betrayal of the snp bench warming tractors”

    They should be using their parliamentary privilege to the maximum to expose the corruption and criminality currently prevailing in every single organ of State in the rotten to the core State of Scotland.

    Starting with the conspiracy to jail Alex Salmond on false charges.

  236. James

    Anyone got any millionaire’s shortbread?

    Main – what a tosser.

  237. shug

    Scot abroad

    All won by the SNP which was sadly compromised by deceit and dishonesty.

    General election

    Sottish election
    Local election 2017

  238. James

    A Scot Abroad;

    “Ock aye the nue, ahm Scotch di yea ken? We’re shite”!

  239. A Scot Abroad


    none of any of those elections had a >50% majority for an Indy referendum.

    I thought your thinking may have been a bit more impressive and compelling than that.

    Ultimately, it’s quite simple: demonstrate that over 50% of the adult Scottish population actively want independence, in which case there’s a legal way forward that the world will accept. Or if that cannot be demonstrated, keep quiet.

  240. A Scot Abroad

    James, at 10:42 pm

    a proper Scotsman views the world as it is, not what his inner child wants it to be.

    In other words, get a fucking grip on reality. Scotland is a part of the United Kingdom, with enormously complex and inter-related connections to the three other parts of the UK, dating back over 300 years, and ripping that apart for an uncertain and undefined future is going to be complex at best, and if done badly, enormously damaging to ordinary Scottish people. Is that what you want?

  241. Geri

    GE 2015 was over 50%

    56 MPs.

    So why was *now is not the time*?

    It’s simple to everyone but you. The UK government isn’t democratic. 50% +1 or even 100% would have the exact same outcome.

    That’s why we’ll be using every.single.election from now on with a declaration at the end of it.

    What they going to do? Remove elections?
    It’ll be accepted world wide because EVERY COUNTRY IN THE WORLD accepts the ballot box as a perfectly legal route.

  242. Geri

    **Is that what you want?**

    Yes. It’s what the majority of Scotland wants.
    It wants to make its own decisions.

    It’s not what YOU may want but that’s just fucking tough innit? YOU don’t live here.

  243. A Scot Abroad


    not only do you fail plain language comprehension, but you don’t speak for Scotland. Don’t be so arrogant as to think that you do. Voices such as your’s are a tiny, ignorant, and entirely ignorable minority.

  244. Derek

    “A Scot Abroad says:
    26 July, 2023 at 1:15 am

    …Voices such as your’s…”

    And I quote – from the same post; “not only do you fail plain language comprehension”.

    I broke my own rules again, but I laughed.

  245. Ruby Tuesday

    ‘Who’s Afraid of Alex Salmond?’

    That article by DS Kenny Farquharson made me laugh.

    Do you think we will ever see a head to head between Alex Salmond & the current First Minister?

    Too cruel?

    Spot the jigsaw pieces.

    DS = Ditch slitherer.

  246. Breastplate

    ASA @ 12:09am,
    You state your concern of “an uncertain and undefined future”, yet don’t seem to mind the future of the UK being much more an indebted nation, burdening each Scot with financial penalties that will affect the fabric and quality of our society. This is certain, this is happening currently, not in the future but in the here and now, and it is accelerating.

    You claim that Scotland couldn’t afford independence financially yet can’t name how much independence will cost, surely there must be a line, according to your argument, where a country can either afford or not afford self determination however magical and mystical it may be?
    Is your argument, however ethereal, able to stand up to scrutiny? If so, let’s hear it.

    Alas, I smell shite.

  247. John Main

    @Geri says:25 July, 2023 at 9:06 pm

    STFU about Dumbzas election

    Naw. My country. My pretendy FM, making a mockery of my national history. Shamefully pretending to join the line of great Scots stretching back to Bruce, Wallace and beyond.

    It was dubious but no more dubious than Sunak who was chosen, unelected, by a handful of Tory mates to run the fcking country

    Naw. Far, far more dubious. Sunak was elected without resignations, without police inquiries, without clear and widely publicised flouting of the established procedures.

    And then there’s the fucking bagpipe-blawing elephant in the room. All the disgraceful shenanigans to elect an outsider to head up what was supposed to be a national, independence movement!

    Scotland, the only country in the world to have outsourced leadership of its bid for freedom.

    Naw, it’s a disgrace and we are a laughing stock, and I won’t STFU.

    If you had any pride in our country, or our illustrious history, you would be with me on this.

  248. Ruby Tuesday

    Dorothy Devine says:
    25 July, 2023 at 9:13 pm

    It remains a puzzle to me why certain folk even bother to type on this ‘ dreadful’ site – obviously it is infra dig and should be left to rot in their opinion, so why do they insist on making comment or reading any of the “shite’.

    Very puzzling, if I felt that strongly I wouldn’t grace the site with my presence, so why do they?

    Hi Dorothy how are you?

    I think it’s a ‘power thing’ Dorothy. They get their thrills from baiting/demeaning people.

    I have no criticism of those who get hooked. I’m easily hooked my lack of restrain is so bad Stu has had put me into pre-moderation.

    I don’t expect you will read this post but you never know you might decided to scroll way way back to re-read old posts.

    Have a great day Dorothy.

  249. John Main

    @Dorothy Devine says:25 July, 2023 at 9:13 pm

    It remains a puzzle to me why certain folk even bother

    Really Dorothy?

    Are you sure you are a Scot? It’s a puzzle to me how you could have missed one of the most obvious stereotypical characteristics of us Scots males.

    if I felt that strongly

    I can’t speak for the other rationalist posters on here, but the peeps who think like you have driven Indy onto the rocks. Indy is going nowhere, and the best you have to offer is another 10 years of marching about waving your saltires.

    And to top off the entire rancid confection, you’ve gifted us HY to order us all about in his guise as pretendy FM.

    Am I coming across as feeling strongly about this? Good.

    I’d keep my mouth shut, my ears open, and see if I could learn something new that might just help to get Scotland out of the mess I helped to get her into.

    That’s if I were you.

  250. John Main

    Scotland, the only country in the world to have outsourced leadership of its bid for freedom.

    Not because he’s a great man.

    Not because he’s an inspirational leader.

    Not because he’s loved and revered by us Scots.

    Because he ticks the right box.

    He’s only the pretendy FM, of the wee pretendy parliament, of the wee shitey dump that is Scotland, inhabited by gormless, gutless losers who will take anything dropped on them from a great height.


    Naw, shout it from the rooftops. No other nation in the world would have accepted this travesty without so much as a peep of protest.

    Wake up, Scotland.

  251. Dorothy Devine

    A bigger puzzle is why anyone bothers to respond.

  252. Johnlm

    “ Now, who can argue with that?
    I think we’re all indebted to John Main for clearly stating what needed to be said.
    I’m particularly glad that these lovely children were here today to hear that speech.
    Not only was it authentic frontier gibberish, it expressed a courage little seen in this day.
    What are we made of?
    And let us heed John’s warnings on 404.
    Sheriffs murder3d, crops burned, stores looted, people stampeded and cattle rap3d..

  253. John Main

    @Dorothy Devine says:26 July, 2023 at 7:46 am

    A bigger puzzle is why anyone bothers to respond

    Wait, I have an even bigger puzzle.

    Why does anybody bother to respond to somebody who inexplicably bothered to respond?

    Anyhoo, it’s your turn, if you can be bothered.

    You opened your ears yet?

  254. Ebenezer Scroggie


    “It’s Scotland’s oil” was a hollow empty slogan in the 1970s and still is.

    The oil belongs to the oil companies who have so expensively won it out of the ground.

    The ‘option’ of nationalising it, as happened in Iran in 1952, would result in exactly the same thing. The international oil companies, just they did in 1952, would stand shoulder to shoulder and fold their arms and say “choke on your oil”.

    Anyway, taxing exports is nuts.

    Whisky? Again, taxing exports is nuts. In terms of employment, just go and visit one of the big name distilleries to see just how few people are employed there.

    Tourism? Highly seasonal in Scotland. In summertime the place is chock full. The infrastucture just isn’t there. The NC500 route is a traffic jam in summer. On Skye the laybys are full of human shit because there aren’t enough public toilets on the island. The single track passing places are too short to allow multiple tour busses to get past eachother.

    In summer 2019 the cops were turning people back from the mainland ferry terminals if they couldn’t prove booked accommodation. Even (ahem) campervans were being required to prove that they had booked a pitch.

    What else could an impoverished amputated iScotland turn to to make a bawbee? Selling souvenir postage stamps? Setting itself up as money-laundering tax haven? I don’t think so.

    Let’s face it. If the once in a lifetime Referendum had gone against us, we’d be fucked by now. A supplicant to the IMF who would demand title to all of our national assets as security on a loan.

  255. David Hannah

    Salmond’s a class act. I listened to his speech at the Wee Alba Roadshow in Troon on Independence live.

    We have to stand on Scotland United platform. I’m right behind him. In fact I’m going to try and get a ticket to his show right now.

  256. Dan

    I see John Manic Street Blog Preacher is off his Ritalin meds again…

    It’s beautiful day John, get oot on yer bike, or go fishing, or just take a wander in the park and take some time to appreciate the land we live on.
    You then might jist realise that it isn’t all about the money and psychos causing “wars” all of the time.

  257. Shug

    Scot abroad

    Did Boris win 50 percent, will Starmer win 50 percent?

    That’s a naw!

    so “naw I wullnae”!

    Do you wear a poppy remembering those that died fighting for democracy while your masters in London say you can’t have democracy you belong to them.

    Interesting level of hypocrisy

  258. Dan

    Before I head out on my bike to go fishing, here’s one for the “scotland is too wee and too poor, and it’s too late to nationalise…” gurners.

    The Kingdom of Scotland has a much better resources to population figure than the Kingdom of England.

    (Oldish stats so may not be 100% accurate but it gives the gist.)


    32% of the land area.
    61% of the sea area.
    90% of the fresh water.
    65% of the natural gas production
    96.5% of the crude oil production.
    47% of the open cast coal production
    81% of the untapped coal reserves
    62% of the timber production
    46% of the total forest area
    92% of the hydro electric production
    40% of the wind wave and solar energy production
    60% of the fish landings
    30% of the beef herd
    20% of the sheep herd
    9% of the dairy herd
    10% of the pig herd
    15% if the cereal holdings
    20% of the potato holdings
    90% of the whisky industry
    70% of gin production


    68% of the land area.
    39% of the sea area.
    10% of the fresh water.
    35% of the natural gas production
    3.5% of the crude oil production.
    53% of the open cast coal production
    19% of the untapped coal reserves
    38% of the timber production
    54% of the total forest area
    8% of the hydro electric production
    60% of the wind wave and solar energy production
    40% of the fish landings
    70% of the beef herd
    80% of the sheep herd
    91% of the dairy herd
    90% of the pig herd
    85% if the cereal holdings
    80% of the potato holdings
    10% of the whisky industry
    30% of gin production

    The revenue streams generated by the current UK government policies means the two Kingdoms’ combined resources help to serve the UK population of 67 million.
    So if Scotland returned to self-governance we could emulate current UK policies, which unionists are presumably policies they are supportive of. So therefore with The Kingdom of Scotland’s much improved resources to population figures it would mean the larger proportional revenue stream generated by those Scottish resources would only have to serve 5.4 million.

    Please feel free to reciprocate your suggestions on how an independent Kingdom of England will pay for itself.

    But back to resources, don’t try to divert onto the question of asset and resource ownership, ignoring that my proffered example makes no suggestion of altering the ownership status of these assets and resources, instead the change of Scotland returning to self-governance would mean that the revenue streams generated by licensing and taxation of these assets and resources in Scottish jurisdictional areas would be diverted to a Scottish Treasury, to be used and distributed across Scottish society made up of 5.4 million folk, rather than them flowing into the UK Treasury which serves 67 million folk.

    Scotland has about 65% of the UK gas fields, and supplies approximately 50% of UK domestic gas use. Some might attempt to come back with “but gas is bad and nobody will want it”. Aye, fossil fuel use will no doubt taper off but it is being used now in considerable quantities. Even today at this moment 42% of GB Grid power is being produced by burning gas in CCGT power stations situated in England. So someone wants / needs it…

  259. Stoker

    A few blasts from the past for the Unionist naysayers infesting btl:

    “Oil and gas is a priceless treasure to the UK, and Westminster is terrified of losing control of it.”

    “But there’s a more modern version of the “angels’ share” at play in modern Scotland, and this one’s a celestial snaffling not of whisky, but of Scotland’s money.”

    “Readers of this site may remember the story published on the BBC earlier this week, where the figures for GDP per capita miraculously switched overnight from showing Scotland as a net contributor to the UK to implying that Scotland was a net recipient.”

    “Initially, the report is pretty much what you’d expect. It highlights how Scotland’s economy is stronger than the UK’s at present, and how historically we’ve paid more in taxes and run a lower deficit than the UK.”

    Give me a shout if Yous still think we’re going to buy the shite you’re selling and i’ll happily expose your BritNat Bullshit further.

  260. John Main

    @Dan says:26 July, 2023 at 8:41 am

    Here you go, just for you:

    See them English Tory colonialist racist BoJo worshipping bastards? Bunch of cants, eh?

    Hows that then? In your comfort zone? Worth a pass mark on the Wings BTL measure of posting futility? To the nearest 10, how many soft No’s have been converted to Yes, thanks to the above.

    Soz, but it’s mostly about the money, Dan.

    Soz, but HY is a symbol, Dan. In politics, symbolism matters.

  261. fruitella the hun

    Comment in the Guardian which describes pretty much what I’m seeing here from some of the Scotkand’s oilmen and women

    johnnyflan 18 hours ago

    The problem actually is that a lot of people believe pseudoscience and conspiracies to be up in arms about this.

    Conversation with my dad this weekend went the usual way…

    Dad: …climate change… *something inaudible while he wandered out of the kitchen*
    Me: What was that? climate change?
    Dad: Yes, its all made up.
    Me: I’m a trained scientist. It isn’t.
    Dad: There never used to be ice sheets.
    Me: I know. You paid for me while I studied geology.
    Dad: Its the WEF.
    Me: It’s not. It’s scientific facts. The earth is getting warmer quicker than natural systems can cope with. Its science.
    Dad: *Tuts* Scientists, what do they know?
    Me: A lot more than you. And me. When 97% of scientists in an area are saying the same thing then it’s a problem.
    Dad: It will just make everything greener, won’t it. And why is it colder?
    Me: No. Weather isn’t climate, and this is a global problem. The UK will get more extreme weather. We may well go greener. But it’s quite clear that the Med is beginning to experience proper North African weather. It might end up as part of the Sahara in the next 15-30 years.

    Dad shuffles off.

    No doubt other people have this experience. The same pattern was there with COVID. And 15-minute cities.

    People think that what they see on the internet is true… all I know is that once you have searched for something the algorithms to show you more of the same stuff. For weeks I couldn’t get GB News off my YouTube after I watched JRM say something quite funny (I quite dislike him, but I find him strangely entertaining). There needs to be a change to these platforms to make sure people get balanced information.

  262. Republicofscotland

    This unelected English peer (born in Shropshire) is bumping his gums.

    “AN unelected peer has said Westminster should have the power to FINE Scottish ministers working to promote independence.

    Lord Foulkes on Monday called on the UK Government to introduce a regime of tough sanctions for Scottish ministers who are working to advance the case for Scottish independence.”

    Foulkes has or had close affiliations with the (ISC) Intelligence and Security Committee and Labour Friends of Israel.

  263. Stoker

    Here’s another belter for the Unionist bullshit merchants:

    “Upon independence, the oil and gas within Scottish waters as defined under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea III – the rulebook delineating maritime borders and the extent of the exclusive economic zone to which a country is eligible – will come under control of the Scottish Government.

    This was made clear in the now-infamous McCrone Report, which asked:

    “Can one be certain that the oil is without doubt a Scottish asset or, even if it is, that these substantial revenues and balance of payments advantages would indeed accrue to an independent Scotland?””

  264. Republicofscotland

    Today is the date (July 26th 1965) the Maldives declared their independence.

  265. Stoker

    “Offering tax breaks and incentives is a different approach, pragmatic rather than ideological in nature – it’s a deliberate manipulation of one or two taxes in order to increase revenues elsewhere.”

    “It’s the combined revenues from all taxes which is important when judging what sort of tax regime you’re setting up. The vital aspect is to raise as much in taxation as you intend to spend in services and infrastructure. At present, with Westminster controlling almost all taxation, Scotland doesn’t have very many options to choose from when looking to balance the books.”

  266. John Main

    @Shug says:26 July, 2023 at 9:03 am

    I am happy enough with the 50% +1 idea in principle, but everybody needs to be more specific.

    50% of what?

    1) Of seats?

    2) Of votes cast?

    3) Of the registered electorate?

    4) Of Sovereign Scots (definition urgently needed)?

    50% for what?

    1) The SNP?

    2) A coalition of pro-Indy parties?

    3) Any party that has agreed in principle to accept the vote as a plebiscite?

    Leave it vague beforehand, and you leave it doomed to eternal challenge and systemic sabotage afterwards, at the local, national and international levels, through the various legal systems.

  267. Ebenezer Scroggie

    It is simply untrue that “Scotland” “supplys 50% of gas consumed in Britain”.

    Most of the gas going through the St Fergus terminal is supplied by Norway.

    Anyway, there is no such thing as the “Scottish sector” of the UK sector of the North Sea. That’s just a figment of the fevered imaginations of the separatista fantasists.

    The ugly truth is that the market value of the proven reserves in the UK sector of the North Sea is exceeded by the cost of decommissioning the platforms and subsea completions and pipelines etc.

    The oil companies ain’t stupid. They knew how to arrange the contracts such that they can walk away any time and leave the gumment to pick up the pieces.

  268. John Main

    @Dan says:26 July, 2023 at 9:15 am

    Got to admire your brass neck.

    Within an hour, you post first that it’s not about the money, then second, a long list of the money.

    Still trying to flog the coal, I see. Maybes stop always posting the same tired, old list, and put in the effort needed to make it current and relevant.

    Who knows, we might be richer than you think.

  269. John Main

    @fruitella the hun says:26 July, 2023 at 9:27 am

    When 97% of scientists in an area are saying the same thing

    Maybes you are unaware of something called the pyramid of evidence. Right at the base of the pyramid, and therefore least persuasive and reliable, is the argument from consensus. Evidence trumps consensus every time, which is why science history is full of examples of overturned consensus.

    The same pattern was there with COVID

    Maybes you are unaware of the analysis of death rates during the Covid years, which are being published all over the world. The majority of deaths attributed to Covid were due to other causes. The likely best figure is that no more than 15% of “Covid” deaths were actually Covid deaths.

    Here’s a wee thought experiment for you. See those third-world countries (the BRICS) that are all supposedly going to be trashed because of Climate Change? Have you noticed how they are mostly all hell-bent on pursuing policies that actively or supposedly promote Climate Change?

    Have you stopped to consider why that might be?

    The new, vigorous, economic superpowers of tomorrow don’t give a shit.

    I wonder why not.

  270. Ebenezer Scroggie


    There are no “two kingdoms”.

    There is The United Kingdom, singular. That’s all.

    The Kingdom was united, in two separate stages a little over a hundred year apart, by Scotsmen for the benefit of Scotsmen.

  271. Republicofscotland

    AS the MSM goes mental over new film releases such as Barbie and Oppenheimer, the later when he found out that Truman had bombed Hiroshima and Nagasaki felt he had blood on his hands, eventually Oppenheimer was forced out of the programme due to his legitimate concerns.

    Anyway this got me thinking about the increase of nuclear waste that the English MoD is now dumping in the Firth of Clyde waste from their nuclear subs. The MoD has increased its Cobalt-60 and tritium dumping in Scottish waters to degree that are now unsafe for humans.

    The MoD is so secret, that god only knows how much mor and what else they’ve dumped in Scottish waters.

  272. Republicofscotland

    So the millionaire knight of the realm and Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer was a member of the Trilateral Commission, and attended it alongside two ex-heads of the CIA, one of whom said, CIA director in 2019 “we will do our level best” to stop Corbyn getting elected.

    “Keir Starmer joined an international grouping closely linked to US and UK intelligence while he was serving in Jeremy Corbyn’s shadow cabinet

    Starmer was a member of the Trilateral Commission alongside two former heads of the CIA, and spoke at one of its London events alongside the former heads of MI5 and GCHQ.

    James Schneider, who was Corbyn’s spokesman while he was leader, told Declassified: “Starmer didn’t inform us that he was joining the Trilateral Commission while serving in the shadow cabinet. If he had, we would have put a stop to it, like we did when he tried to take an inappropriate outside job with city law firm Mischon de Reya while shadow Brexit secretary.”

    Schneider added: “Membership of the Trilateral Commission, a body dedicated to promoting corporate power, was plainly incompatible with Labour’s then-stated policies of redistributing wealth and power from the few to the many.”

    When asked if he was surprised to discover that Starmer had joined the group without informing Corbyn’s team, Schneider replied: “No. Dishonesty is Keir Starmer’s hallmark.””

  273. John Main

    @Republicofscotland says:26 July, 2023 at 10:01 am

    It’s worse than that RoS, you’ve been imbibing the filthy stuff.

    That belief works for me as an explanation for much of what you post.

  274. Dorothy Devine

    RoS, so what is SEPA doing about it?

    If I remember correctly a few years ago they stated if Faslane was privately owned they would have closed it down immediately , as it was their hands were firmly tied because it was MoD property.

    I also remember shortly after the referendum that David Cameron gave the MoD further permission to dump effluent in the Firth of Clyde.

    So we have radio active waste and ex military crap polluting our waters.

    There is a very alarming report to find in the Irish Times and New Scientist about Beauforts Dyke and another about the Holy Loch and the American navy dumping all sorts of evils prior to leaving.

    SEPA where are you??

  275. Ian Smith

    Anyone who uses the 97% of scientists line has automatically lost the argument. It is the work of charlatans.

    Of all the papers inspected 70% made no comment on anthropogenic warming, so they were removed. Of the remaining 30%, most were merely an acknowledgement that there would be some contribution from human activity.

    Only around 10% thought it was significant or concerning.

    Meanwhile dozens of predictions have been falsified by actual long term outcomes – polar bear populations, coral reef die offs, cities/regions under water, ice free arctic passages.

    10 years to save the planet has been called out for at least 30 years of passing deadline, but we never move on to acclimatisation rather than Kink Cnut strategies. It is always the case to raise more taxes and suffer more authoritarian meddling to cure the weather. While adjusting the older datasets ever further downwards.

    Ever wondered why Sturgeon was so keen to lead with it?

  276. Republicofscotland

    Of course its not just in the UK that democracy is being rolled back, in the US where they’ve been doing it for a while, that odious man Trump appears to be the target of the Biden administration, as Biden’s son Hunter prepares to plead guilty to Federal Tax crimes (the tip of the iceberg if you ask me).

    “Jack Smith, the special counsel overseeing criminal investigations into former President Donald J. Trump, employs 40 to 60 career prosecutors, paralegals and support staff, augmented by a rotating cast of F.B.I. agents and technical specialists, according to people familiar with the situation.
    In his first four months on the job, starting in November, Mr. Smith’s investigation incurred expenses of $9.2 million. That included $1.9 million to pay the U.S. Marshals Service to protect Mr. Smith, his family and other investigators who have faced threats after the former president and his allies singled them out on social media.”

  277. Breastplate

    Fruitella the hun,
    “The same pattern was there with COVID”
    Was it?
    Could you tell me a bit more about Covid 19 as I would love to hear your view on it along with your thoughts on the vaccine and the pros and cons of The Lockdown, as a trained scientist, of course?

  278. stuart mctavish

    re “a bigger puzzle is why anyone bothers to respond”

    As a twitter newbie (x newbie now) my journey from (hell) yes to FFSS! can be largely summarized by the 2 blocks I’ve earned so far (across all accounts).

    One was for a retweet (FFS!) and another for being brutally honest (albeit the attempt at humour I added to lighten the blow may ultimately have been the source of the offence taken).

    Both blockers were (not) interacting with my account on basis of their first impression, both blockers appeared to have invited debate with an element of trolling/ hate-mongering in the original publication, and both blockers were members of the SNP (or their employee) needlessly (imbo) dismissing an account/ tweet viewed by 5 other people in the whole wide world!

    Water off a whale’s back to those not yet in the same category of snowflake as Nigel Farage (behaving like his bank refused to bake a cake for his husband when it didnt even reach Barclay’s gold standard of using Brexit as the excuse to confiscate what was left of his life his savings, FFS!) but still, I think, an anomaly worthy of urgent reflection if making friends and positive influence is to remain the bread and butter of good politics in future.

  279. Republicofscotland

    “Its worse than that ROS”

    For once you are right Main, its much worse.

    “The British-American Project (BAP), set up in the 1980s with US embassy funding amid CIA concern about ‘anti-American’ drift in the Labour Party, recently added senior Labour politicians to its secret membership rolls.”

    Alan Clark’s diaries have been very informative.

  280. Republicofscotland

    “RoS, so what is SEPA doing about it?”


    As far as I’m aware the MoD supercedes SEPA on such matters

  281. Shug

    @john main

    I doubt if 50 percent of the current SNP would vote for independence.

    and do you wear a poppy remembering those that fought to preserve democracy which is now denied to us

  282. Oneliner

    Some will remember that SEPA’s computer system was hacked. Imagine that – those pesky Eastern Europeans landing on a Scottish backwater.

  283. Alf Baird

    Ebenezer @ 9:58 am

    “There are no “two kingdoms”.There is The United Kingdom, singular.”

    Yet there is twa crouns, ane fer England (Imperial State Crown) an ane for Scotlan. Thon King anely haes ane croun on his heid – that is England’s Imperial State Crown.

    The one kingdom you refer to is that which Scotland was annexed by, with Scottish sovereignty disregarded. Hence Foulkes’ ‘unequal’ union, i.e. a fraud, as is the United Kingdom, a ‘cultural illusion’. Do Scots like you still ‘buy’ into this deceit?

  284. Robert Hughes

    @ Nutella The Bun

    ” The Guardian ” aka The Wee Willie Gates Gazette . L.O.L

    Is that the same * news*paper adamant in the ANTI-SCIENTIFIC psychobabble that humans can change sex merely by declaration ?

    That ” 97% ” of all-known Scientists blah blah is a totally spurious assertion , arrived at by statistical sleight-of-hand .

    Here’s the thing though ….. no one is saying the climate is not going through changes , or even that human activity is contributing to that change ; the uncertainty lies in degree of the latter and the absolute certainty that the climate has ALWAYS been subject to change of the former.

    A paradox here is that a lot of the * recommendations * re C.C mitigation are worthwhile in their own right eg mindless consumption of * things * in the delusion that such consumption will make us happier ; as referred to previously ….the destruction of crucially important rain forests and the ancient tribal cultures that inhabit them ; the manic pursuit of * Growth * to facilitate the continuance of that consumption : to name just some of the things the planet and ourselves would benefit from much , much less of .

    But what is ACTUALLY happening or being proposed ?

    Top-down imposition of more and more draconian * measures * ( aye , exactly like Covid ) that will impact most severely on those least able to afford them ; the curtailment of individual freedoms ; the ramping-up of ludicrous alarmist narratives ( aye , again , exactly like Covid ) forced down the throat of the public from every political/MSM quarter and often by people you wouldn’t ( shouldn’t ) trust to tell you the correct time of day

    And – it appears – you want to hand over all * authority * in terms of defining our current reality and what we * must * do to the same political/*scientific * nexus that only recently made such a total fuck-up during the Great Covid Hysteria ? On ye go

    Don’t expect me to come with you . And FWIW I’m pretty confident my ” carbon footprint ” is at least as low if not lower than yours . Lest you think I’m not playing my part and don’t care less about the state of our planet

  285. Geri

    Ebenezer Scroggie

    **The oil belongs to the oil companies who have so expensively won it out of the ground.**

    Do you actually believe that shite? Lol!

    Give yer head a wobble ffs!!
    It’s just more Yoon bullshit along with that other corker that it’s running out.

    Licences are awarded by the UK government.

    Those licences will be returned to their rightful owners when we’re independent & along with it will be renegotiations of contracts.

    What’s that? They won’t want to drill cause we’re independent? Fine, pack up & fck off! Bye!


  286. Pat Blake

    Dan, the UK only supplies about 50% of gas used in the UK. Presumably Scotland uses some of it. Coal is almost dead but cheaper from elsewhere. Scottish solar is about 411 MW max. 0 nuclear. Wind is very variable and very expensive whether we can use it or not. We’d be better investing in stable nuclear supplies.

    Scotland doesn’t export any of its water to England.

    The rest of the list are available from other suppliers, often cheaper, if not necessarily as good quality. Several are hardly essential goods. You don’t include things that England supplies Scotland with.

    So your list means what exactly?

  287. sam

    @Pat Blake

    “0 nuclear.” ?????

  288. Geri

    **You don’t include things that England supplies Scotland with.**

    Which is what exactly?

    **Scotland doesn’t export any of its water to England.**

    Does that include bottled?

    **The rest of the list are available from other suppliers, often cheaper, if **

    Great! When will they be fully devolving it back to Scotland to take care of?

  289. John Main

    @Shug says:26 July, 2023 at 11:16 am

    do you wear a poppy remembering those that fought to preserve democracy which is now denied to us

    I don’t. I stopped around the turn of the century, when it became clear that we, as a society and a nation, intended to trash everything the fighters of two world wars fought for.

    To spend 364 days a year trashing their legacy, then to wear a poppy for one day, was a hypocrisy too far for me.

    BTW, I don’t believe many fought to preserve democracy. They fought for “their wee bit hill and glen”. And beyond that, for a hopefully better life for their children, grandchildren and beyond.

    I don’t believe many were fighting for Scotland’s Indy.

    I do believe that if Indy can make a good case for a hopefully better life for us Scots, then it just needs to be made. And supporting it will be continuing in the spirit of those who fought.

    Show us the money. Show us the good governance. Show us the non-negotiable freedoms. Show us the sunlit uplands of Indy.

  290. fruitella the hun

    Breastplate asked me: “Could you tell me a bit more about Covid 19 as I would love to hear your view on it along with your thoughts on the vaccine and the pros and cons of The Lockdown, as a trained scientist, of course?”

    Well, that piece I posted was a cut-and-paste from a commenter on CIF. All but the first two lines. I know nothing about Covid. It’s like the war, everybody lies. I choose not to think about it. I choose not to pay much attention to folk who claim to have special knowledge from a guy down the cyberhole. I’m not a trained scientist but used to work with many and know the lengths they go to before. making claims – which was infuriating I’ll admit. I know a bit about the effects of industrial agriculture on ecosystems. I oppose the oil economy because it fuels unsustainable agriculture and trade systems.

  291. A Scot Abroad

    John Main,

    that’s a principled argument that you make their, and I like people of principle, even if they are against the tide.

    I wear a poppy every year to remember 3 soldiers in my Regiment killed in Iraq in 1991, one of them a fellow officer killed less than 100 metres from me. And my great uncle, killed at Passchendaele, and another great uncle, but younger, drowned when his “swimming” tank couldn’t get ashore in Normandy in 1944. And, in honour of the millions of our countrymen who served our great nation of the UK.

    But your argument is logical. I wish we were governed more in our national interest.

  292. John Main

    Manuel, he say:

    “I know nutheeng”.

    Captain Mainwaring says:

    “Don’t tell them, Pike”.

    This place just gets better and better.

  293. James Che

    When all is said and done Charles and consort were not crowned king and queen of Scots, neither was queen Elizabeth1.
    And that title is important,
    Play acting the role but not actually being crowned are two different things concerning the Scottish regalia,

    We all can pretend to be king or queen of whatever country we like.

    Thre are questions to be asked.

    If Charles is declared king of Britain inEngland why does he have a seperate ceremony from the rest of Britain, in Scotland,
    No were else.

    My take on this, is the English Crown cannot cover Scotland due to historical facts,
    In England the Sovereignty is the Crown, where as in Scotland it is the people.
    Hence Charles is not king of Scotland and its territories.

    This leaves the MOD land in Scotland Under the English Crown in a position of theft and Colonialism in Scotland, simple

  294. Shug

    @john main

    can you make a case for the union and how they changed a 50 year oil bonanza into a 3 trillion dollar debt and not a penny spent on Scotland’s infrastructure

    go on make a case for the union

  295. fruitella the hun

    Robert Hughes, Ian Smith, John Main

    Perhaps one of you can explain why, if fossil fuel’s contribution to CO2 in the atmosphere is not a significant threat to us, you don’t advocate continued dependence on it?

    Or do you? Do you believe hydro, off-shore turbines, solar, nuclear fission, on-shore turbines, heat-pumps (all real) and carbon capture, green hydrogen fusion and insulating leaky homes (not so real) are a waste of time and resources?

    Or maybe you believe that there are other compelling reasons for reducing dependence on oil, like I do.

  296. sam

    I used to see a former sojer in the city when I went a certain way. He was begging and homeless.

    It wasn’t that he could not access support. His sister offered that. So did the informal support system of former army people.

    It did not meet his needs He had PTSD.

    He told me all this. One day he was very cheerful and told me that he was optimistic about finding a place.

    Then, some weeks later, he had died. I guess he was undermined by his life.

    For some ex sojers not much has changed since Wellington’s day.

    Why don’t we treat the weak and vulnerable better?

  297. A Scot Abroad

    James Che,

    all Westminster departments, including the MOD, are departments of the United Kingdom, of which you might have noted that Scotland is a part. Therefore all MOD land in the Scottish part of the UK is perfectly legal.

  298. James Che

    The Crown in Scotland, wether in the Scottish justice system or in the M O D or in the treasury regarding Scotland is one of instances moments you realise how Scotland has been taking for idiots,

    For the separate ceremony in Scotland is required and the claim of Right is required to be stated,
    And under both of those occasion Charles did not get crowed king of Scotland , nor king of Scots in Scotland 2023, nor did his mother before him.

    Anything and I mean anything in relation to the Crown is not upheld in Scotland,
    If the royals down south had been crowned as king or queen of Scots in Scotland that is a different matter,
    But they were not,

    It was a nothing more than sham token immitation, but obviously a second appearence of the suggestion of being Crowned in Scotland under the Scots claim of right as Sovereign people at the same time not actually being crowned in Scotland.

    This pretence of being king of Scots in Scotland in 2023 in a separate ceremony from the rest of Britain is interesting.

    GB and Westminster must view The king of England and Wales with its other dominions as not being King of Scotland,

  299. sam

    Climate science is still in its infancy.

    Measuring the temperature is problematic.

    Measuring the sea surface temperature was done by ships until the satellite era.

    The area covered was limited – the trade routes.

    Different methods were used. initially buckets over the side, then hull inlets.

    there was no attempt at standardisation. Buckets were of metal, wood and leather, all with different heat conductivities.

    There was no standardisation of the type of thermometer used or when the temperature was taken after the water was drawn.

    The Met Office made a try at putting the thumb on the scale by claiming that the practice of temp measurement using buckets ceased in the 1950s and the hull inlet method was used thereafter.

    In fact buckets were used up until the 70s.

    Water drawn in through the hull is colder than that at the surface so an upward adjustment of temp has to be made. Guessed at or made up?

    Land temperature measurement is no better. a big issue there is the change in land use from rural to urban (and defining those terms). There will be an upward temp trend as rural land becomes urban as populations increase. No means of knowing much about how this has taken place or what adjustments, if any, can usefully be made.

    The Urban Heat Island effect also requires temp adjustments to compensate over time for changes in the urban environment.

    Intuitively, I don’t think there is a reliable temp record until satellite measurement. Climate scientists disagree.

  300. John Main

    @Shug says:26 July, 2023 at 1:42 pm

    I’m not here to make a case for the union.

    The status quo is a known quantity. Indy is the unknown, so it is up to the Indy supporters to make the case for Indy.

    I don’t see it as an article of faith. I am pragmatic. Governments of all persuasions, whether in WM, HR or more local, take my money and give back very little. The SNP at HR have been even worse in that regard. So show me the money if you want my vote.

    If I am in a small minority, then my views don’t matter. If I am in the majority, then most Sovereign Scots think like me and we do matter.

    We have wages or benefits, mortgages or rents, sickness or health, kids or pensions. Only those at the very bottom can afford to take a chance because they have nothing to lose.

    The rest of us have something to lose. Show us the money. Show us the competence. Show us the good government. Show us our guaranteed rights, once we are an Independent nation. Show us the non-woke democracy. Show us the grown-up real-world policies around defence, economics, etc.

  301. Pat Blake

    You’re right Sam, I thought that Scotland had carried through its plans to get rid of nuclear already. Scotland still has some nuclear. 3 defense sites that the SNP want rid of, 1 civil site currently defuelling and one to be decommissioned in 2028. So, going regardless of whether Scotland stays part of the UK.

    Geri, no, I don’t count bottled water as it is a luxury item not an essential staple (like tap water or electricity). Other brands are available.

  302. James Che

    Did any of the sovereign Scots see Charlie being ccrown king of Scots,
    The actual required separate crowning ceremony in Scotland was not filmed or witnessed by the Sovereign people of Scotland, we did not see him with the crown on his head, wearing the Scottish regalia or sitting on Scotlands stone of Destiny that is used for crowning monarchs of Scots,
    It was a sham.

    And yet The Government of Great Britain and the king of England held two separate ceremonies in Great Britain
    One for the kingdom of England.
    One for the kingdom of Scotland,

    So Scotland is still a separate kingdom requiring a separate second ceremony to Crown a monarch, not of Scotland.
    But of the Scots.

    Charles is not king of Great Britain,
    It seems he is king a of two different kingdoms.

    And consent to be king of Sovereign Scots was not given by the Scots in 2023.
    No wonder very little was filmed of the ceremony of crowning him king of Scots under the Claim of Right,
    It was only the British governments hearsay that this happened at all in 2023.

    No present Crown in The kingdom, territory and realm of Scotland.

  303. Ebenezer Scroggie


    If an amputated Scotland were to dispossess the oil companies of their expensively won oilfields, as happened in 1952 in Iran, the oil infrastructure would atrophe within a year and the oil industry would collapse because no oil company in the world would buy any oil from such a ‘country’.

    Look what happened in 1953. The CIA and SIS, in a 50:50 joint venture overthrew the democratically elected government of Prime Minister Mossadeq and imposed their own puppet Peacock Shah and gave him copious assistance for his murderous regime.

    Don’t doubt for one moment that the US would not hesitate to overthrow such a government in exactly the same way that Victoria Nuland overthrew the government of Ukraine and imposed her puppet Zelensky in 2014.

  304. James Che


    Your forgetting yourself in historical records,

    United kingdomS.

    Are you blind and deaf,

    There was a ceremony and filmed Crowning of king Charles of England and Wales,

    But he had to come to Scotland to encompass the second kingdom of the Treaty of union,
    Only the Scots did not witness any of that, neither did the rest of the Countries around the world.

    For what went on behind closed doors in Scotland in 2023 was not in evidence, as a Crowning of king of Scots,

    King Charles of England and Wales verbally and on TV recognise the Scots Claim of right, as did Westminster government in 2018.

    But Charles was not Crowned with the Scots Crown in The kingdom of Scotland in 2023,

    So he is king of one kingdom, England.

  305. shug

    @John Main
    the status quo is not known or static
    it is a downward trajectory
    Norway is still on an up and there is time for Scotland to get on the up escalator but it needs to move away from the dead weight of the union

    make a case for staying in a union where our resources are exploited with no or minimal return

  306. Alf Baird

    John Main @ 2:24 pm

    “The status quo is a known quantity. Indy is the unknown”

    A nation subject to colonialism is always in the process of perishing. That has been a slow, gradual and obscure process for Scotland, until recently. Whenever colonialism is imperiled (as it has been especially since 2014) the fangs of the oppressor are shown. Now the aim of our oppressor becomes more and more evident, through the likes of Foulks, ACH, Gove, various PMs, England’s supreme court et al; it is to dissolve Scotland, to eradicate it, to end its national claim and hence its potential international existence, to obliterate its culture, and to unlawfully procure its sovereignty and territory totally.

    In this context Indy is ‘the known’, i.e. removing an imperial oppressor and colonial rule, with ‘a people’ rightfully reclaiming their sovereignty. It has been done many times before, not least in Scotland. This is not the first time Scots have had to assert sovereignty over their land against the ‘customary foe’ that aye seeks to destroy them.

  307. James

    Pat Blake;
    “…Scotland doesn’t export any of it’s water to England…”

    Scotland doesn’t export any of it’s water to England yet.
    There, fixed that for you.
    You should check out some of Dan’s links to the live visuals on the GW’s of electricity flowing south from Scotland 24/7 365. Might shut you up. But I doubt it.

    Ian Smith – don’t look up, Ian!

  308. James Che

    Two kingdoms.
    Two ceremonies are required.
    One for king of England, the Country.
    One for king of Scots, ( not of Scotland) the Country.

    Because there was not a queen or king of Scotland for many reasons when the fallacious treaty was drawn up,
    The people are the Sovereign holders of Scotland in community.
    Recognised by the Claim of Right, in Westminster government and by King Charles himself in 2018 and 2023 respectively.

  309. James Che

    The Sovereign Scots shouted and protested,

    “NOT MY KING” in 2023.

    We ( Scotland ) never witnessed him ( Charles or his consort being Crowned king or Queen of Scots ) .in 2023,

    We saw him walk in a door, we saw him walk back out,

    But Scotland did not witness the Crowning of a new monarch of Scots,
    Its just “hearsay” in Scotland.

  310. James Che


    The MOD in Scotland is not perfectly legal.

    As the united kingdoms of both kingdom and realms have a separate Crowning ceremony for any monarch,

    In fact the situation of the monarch at present date seems akin to when King James was king of England and king of Scots, requiring two separate ceremonies.

    Except in Scotland we have not witnessed King Charles of England and Wales being Crowned king of Scots,

  311. A Scot Abroad

    James Che,

    I wonder about you. Endlessly dribbling on with dozens of nearly identical comments that are not just irrelevant, a-historic, drifting towards repetitive lunacy, that nobody takes seriously, and that mean the square root of fuck all. Haven’t you got anything useful to achieve?

  312. James Che

    The Crown as a entity and as a holder of Sovereignty in Scotland is not true in reality or legality.
    If you say that King Charles and his Consort were Crowned king and Queen of Scots,

    Are you suggesting that the new king and queen of Scots holds England, just like king James long ago as a representative of our sovereignty in Scotland holds the kingdom and country of England and Wales as thhey are not sovereign?

  313. Alf Baird

    James Che @ 3:39 pm

    “Except in Scotland we have not witnessed King Charles of England and Wales being Crowned king of Scots”

    True James, tho Scottish elites assembled in St Giles seemed content that Charles made the effort to attend, merely confirming their role in the colonial ‘racket’. There being no Scottish king crowned, they must remain loyal servants of England’s Imperial State Crown. One can only hope the wages of colonialism are as good as its deception.

  314. sam

    @John Main 2.24

    “The status quo is a known quantity. Indy is the unknown, so it is up to the Indy supporters to make the case for Indy.

    I don’t see it as an article of faith. I am pragmatic. Governments of all persuasions, whether in WM, HR or more local, take my money and give back very little. The SNP at HR have been even worse in that regard. So show me the money if you want my vote.”

    Well, you fell at the first hurdle. Unless you want to try to argue there is a status quo. “Downward trajectory” is where we’re at.Going to get worse.

    “… take my money and give back very little”

    Ever been sick? Private health insurance? Got a pension, want a pension? Ever been claiming any welfare benefit?

    How has the HR government, Lab/Lib and SNP been worse than UK government?

    If you can manage an answer do bear in mind it is Thatcherism that caused so much unemployment, poverty, health inequalities. It was the subsequent UK governments that followed her neoliberalism that caused numerous banking scandals, hospital scandals, premature deaths, the targetting of the poor and vulnerable as as the ones to bear the finacial burden of such incompetence.

  315. Northcode

    I’ve read Alf Baird’s papers and book.

    I’ve read some of the writings of Fanon and Memmi, who I would probably never have come across if it were not for Alf Baird and his research on colonialism.

    I’ve read the comments of the many Scottish independence supporting posters on here. I’ve also read the comments of those who support the continuation of the union between the kingdoms of Scotland and England.

    And I’ve read many of the Rev. Campbell’s articles.

    I’ve witnessed the behaviour of those charged with upholding and defending the rights of sovereign Scots, and it is clear beyond doubt they serve another master and have abandoned their own people in favour of, and in cooperation with, a power historically foreign to the Scots.

    I’ve concluded from everything I’ve read and witnessed, and from personal experience, that Scotland is a colony, and that the Scots have been, and still are, the victims of internal-colonisation.

    Others might come to a different conclusion and it is up to the individual to form their own opinion based on the available evidence, I can only tell of what has led me to my own.

    Here are some links to information some might find useful in determining their own conclusions:

    Alf Baird’s Paper: The Socio-Political Determinants of Scottish Independence

    Alf Baird’s Paper:Summarised version

    Alf Baird’s Book – Doun-Hauden-Socio-Political-Determinants-Scottish-Independence(Kindle version) – The Plundering of Scotland

    There are, of course, various publications and voices that argue in favour of Scotland’s union with England. But I leave it to those who take such a stance to provide pointers to their evidence.

    My stance is clear; I believe Scotland has been colonised by a foreign power that doesn’t care much for the Scots, though it has a great fondness for Scotland’s natural resources.

  316. Ebenezer Scroggie

    If you want to see for yourself the reality of whether there one United Kingdom or more kingdoms involved, just take a look at the name of your country on the front cover of your passport.

    Do you see an S at the end of the word Kingdom? That would indicate multiple kingdoms. There is only one United Kingdom.

    If you don’t believe your passport, take a look at the nameplate in front of the British representative(s) at the United Nations. Do you see an S there? I don’t.

    The name of our country is recognised by every member of the United Nations. Every one of ’em, even ones who strongly disagree with us on matters of sovereignty such Argentina over the Falklands and Spain over Gibraltar.

  317. Ian Smith

    I am relatively agnostic on how energy is produced.

    Happy with nuclear as long as reasonable standards are maintained, similar for hydro, coal, oil, gas, wind, tidal.

    All have pro and cons, environmental – pollutions, destruction of habitat and wildlife, noise, disruption, land use, suitablitiy for remote sites, capacity to cause disaster, local and national employment.

    They also have economic, balance of payment, security of supply, geopolitical risks, additional infrastructure to support.

    What I don’t want is unreasonable market preferences and subsidies going into extremely unreliable renewables based on clearly dishonest science and Imperial College computer models.

    Nothing has improved the health and living standards of so many people as cheap and reliable energy. It is terrifying to see so many people hoodwinked into tearing it all down.

  318. James Che

    Alf Baird.

    Colonialism of Scotland by the government and parliament of England is all there is.

    We have no evidence that Charlie or his consort became monarchs of Scotland,

    We have no evidence that the english parliament ceased or was dissolved, rather that it continued, using Englands established laws of pre- 1707 for the fallacious treaty direct into the New named British parliament,
    The triennial law and Poynings law over ruling Ireland under the law of king henry well into the supposed treaty.

    We see the evidence of Westminster parliament acting as a english parliament in the bill reform Scots law, as they considered Scot law obsolete,
    We find the parliament of England altering Scots law of treason as early as 1708 to impose the pre union english laws of treason over riding Scots law, all of which was ment to remain the law of Scotland after the union.with Scotland.

    In The fallacious union we also witnessed the members of the old english parliament being transferred directly into the new named british parliament without elections being held.

    We evidence the Bank of England remaining the bank of England and Wales, not the Bank of the new named parliament, or the new construction Great Britain, and yet has long connections with the old parliament of England.

    We see the Scotland Act for a devolved sub government for decide that Scotland should have representation in Westminster parliament after three hundred years have none, only come about because the EU suggested it, and labour jumped on the idea to stymie and deter Scots from having control of Scotland.
    We Scotland colonial stock Act,

    We evidence The old Parliament of Scotland extinguished closed and Sine Die’d, and representatives chosen from Scotland whom were no longer chosen from the parliament of Scotland when it was open, just random men from Scotland.

    We see two kingdoms in the supposed treaty and two ceremonies of coronation for the Monarchs why is that,?
    The monarch of England is not the monarch of Scotland, but of Scots, and therefore cannot be Crowned as monarch of Great Britains in the same ceremony, or of the new parliament of great Britain.

    That officially leaves the head Crown entity and monarch of England and Wales not the monarch of Scotland,

    But if it is claimed by the likes of ASA that the present king of England came to Scotland in a separate ceremony to be Crowned king of Scots and yet still represents king of England, it must be remembered that our supposed king of Scots would be paralleling king James pre union, and England as a Country does not hold Sovereignty.

    The king of sovereign Scots would also be king of England,
    Not the other way round.

  319. Dan

    Pat Blake says: at 11:59 am

    Dan, the UK only supplies about 50% of gas used in the UK. Presumably Scotland uses some of it. Coal is almost dead but cheaper from elsewhere. Scottish solar is about 411 MW max. 0 nuclear. Wind is very variable and very expensive whether we can use it or not. We’d be better investing in stable nuclear supplies.

    Scotland doesn’t export any of its water to England.

    The rest of the list are available from other suppliers, often cheaper, if not necessarily as good quality. Several are hardly essential goods. You don’t include things that England supplies Scotland with.

    So your list means what exactly?

    I am well aware the UK imports gas because it uses more than it produces domestically. I’m fairly sure that deficit is mostly in England though.
    I’ve regularly commented on this subject and recently questioned why the Easington Langeled pipeline flow figures from Norway to England had dropped off, maybe due to fault in infrastructure or just maintenance downtime. I’ve commented that Scottish gas fields don’t just flow to St Fergus, some flow to other terminals including Bacton in England. I’ve also mentioned that the gas flowing into the several connections at St Fergus isn’t all from gas fields in Scotland’s geographic area.
    It is difficult to ascertain the actual amounts because they are deliberately obscured using methods such as Ex-Regio allocations.
    The gas live data site I link to has had an “upgrade” over the last couple of days and I notice it is more difficult to read and visually interpret the information as they have dropped off the bar chart graphs.

    Some oil doesn’t even reach the mainland through pipelines because it was loaded directly onto tankers from FPSO vessels permanently moored above wellheads like in Foinavon and Schiehallion fields. The former was the first of the west of Shetland fields to come online. I know this because I was piloting one of the ROVs that was integral to the subsea engineering process of putting the first of the infrastructure in place.
    I also helped with the first 8 wells on the Brittania field, check out how much that field flowed over its life.

    But tell you what, to clear all this up, please provide us with the exact percentage figures, both past and present of the proportional share gas fields in Scotland’s geographic area contributed to the UK’s usage over the years since they came online.
    Remember to take into account the gas fields in the sea area stolen by England when they shifted the maritime border. 😉

    The rest of my list simply shows that as Scotland has only around 9% of the UK population, we are self-sufficient and in surplus of a wide range of essential resources. England clearly isn’t in a similar situation though is it.
    “But you can get them cheaper elsewhere”… this just means you are part of the increasing problem of global trade using huge amounts of fossil fuels to ship stuff around the planet, and also giving the economic benefit of jobs manufacturing products we require to other countries.
    Cough, New Zealand lamb. FFS could you find somewhere further away on the planet to produce stuff we can farm here.
    But aye, fitting ASHP on damp, poorly insulated, and single glazed properties, and solar on the north facing roofs, and removing gas boilers will save the planet whilst we import lamb from the southern hemisphere and wind turbines from China.
    And lest we forget “the war”, busy blowing huge amounts of shit up using the massive industrial military complex powered by fossil fuels.
    Just wait for #TeslaTanksFTW coming soon, making war environmentally friendly.

  320. James

    Ebenezer Scroggie says:
    26 July, 2023 at 4:50 pm
    “If you want to see for yourself the reality of whether there one United Kingdom or more kingdoms involved, just take a look at the name of your country on the front….”

    The divot continues to drivel…

    Take a look at the two creatures either side of the coat of arms, genius. A lion and a unicorn. There’s your first clue, peabrain….

  321. Republicofscotland

    “The name of our country is recognised by every member of the United Nations”

    Its not a country, its a political union, Scotland has one of the oldest borders with England in the world (The Treaty of York).

    Ask yourself why Scotland has its own honours (which are older than England’s).

    Of course the above is a mute point, if Scotland and England were indeed one nation, there wouldn’t have been an indyref in 2014, Scotland and England both separate countries, are in a political union via a international treaty, and treaties can be dissolved.

    Its no secret that Westminster over the centuries aided and abetted by House Jocks has tried to bury this very fact, however Scottish sovereignty and English sovereignty are utterly incompatible, in Scotland the people are sovereign in England its the crown, that’s why Westminster politician have lied and schemed and connived over the centuries to try and portray their parliament and monarchy as the highest in the land, in later times the media reinforced this false position.

    The union has only held together for so long because of ignorance lies and compliant House Jocks the latter aiding and abetting Westminster in a colonial self serving manner.

  322. Chas

    The latter posts on this thread must take the biscuit for absolute pish.
    Imagine if your life was so empty that all you have is to endlessly post shite on Wings?
    Scotland the brave-you are having a laugh!

  323. James Che

    You wish.

  324. A Scot Abroad


    the UK is a single country in the world’s eyes.

  325. Geri

    Pat Blake

    **Geri, no, I don’t count bottled water as it is a luxury item not an essential staple (like tap water or electricity). Other brands are available.**

    Spoken like a true capatalist. Water is actually a basic human right. Not a commodity. But going with your theory that it’s a luxury for a minute…

    What happens when a government decides to stop wasting money on chemical treatments & dumps raw sewage & nuclear waste into the waterways in its latest hair brained scheme..

    Then presents two choices
    1. Drink the unknown cocktail & possibly light up & die?
    2. Buy our nice clean bottled water provided in the shops?

    This actually happened in America btw – but not outside the realms of Westminster who is happily following the same path & dumping as much shite as possible while also safe that it’s no longer subject to EU standards.

    Scottish water can also, under the shiny new illegal internal market bill, SELL Scottish Water to its highest bidder.

    Answers on a postcard about that bottled water being a luxury item now..

    Ebenezer Scroggie

    Give up with the passport shite. England is hardly *united* to itself now is it? It’s hardly in a *union* with itself either.

    The UK has TWO crowns.
    One of Scotland.
    One of England.

    Neither were ever erased.

    One belongs to Chucky.
    One belongs to the people of Scotland.

    International bodies KNOW the United Kingdom is TWO Kingdoms & even that little ole WALES is a COUNTRY.

    Stop spouting Tory Bojo *one nation* pish.

    It never, ever happened.

    Scotland retains her territory & her crown & no fcked ever erased it. Or the Union is instantly dissolved for breaching the (non negotiable) terms.

    If you are Scottish – stop embarrassing yourself.
    If you are English – keep it up, you’ll bring independence much quicker by constantly lowering the status of Scotland as unimportant to yer own wee solitary kingdom on its own in the world.

  326. Geri


    **the UK is a single country in the world’s eyes**

    That is bullshit.

    Not only did Scotland receive over 50 signatories from the EU declaring Scotland would *be most welcome to join the Bloc* after Brexit..

    But we’ve also had UN rapporteurs give absolutely scathing reports on the UK government over health, harsh ideological austerity measures to the sick & disabled & their failing education systems WHILE comparing it to different outcomes in SCOTLAND.

    (They’re also making plenty noises over the UK govs harsh & illegal Police bill & its refugee violations.)

    They’re not exactly winning many friends eh?

    The single country pish only resides in your own head.

    When Scotland removes it’s consent to being in the UK the UN will be forced to re-evaluate the UKs lack of status. Don’t underestimate that fact. Even Cameron shat himself over that FACT.

    I maintain my gut instinct you are no Scot. Not even a hardened Yoon would deny its own country’s status in the Union & in the world like you are intent on doing here.

  327. A Scot Abroad


    you are reliably, and enjoyably, completely mental. There isn’t a single thing that you say that is correct. You are just a crypto-wowser. A phrase from Australia in the 1950s that describes the inadequately self-satisfied self-delusionist.

  328. Geri

    Insults won’t disguise the fact that you are continually WRONG.

    Google is your friend. The age of the world wide information highway seems to have bypassed yoons.
    What I’ve posted is dead easy to verify by a simple Google search.

    I thought you were here to bust all of our nonsense?
    When are you starting?

    Because you’ve spectacularly failed so far. Bye!

  329. A Scot Abroad

    So, Geri, tell us more about the over 50 signatories from the EU, a bloc of 27 countries.

    Or are you, as so often, just making things up?

  330. Jon Metcalf

    Zero fear from this yoon that Mr Salmond is reviving his profile.

    He is among the most intellectually consistent substantial national politicians over the past 3-4 decades.

    An unimpeachably honest man commanding respect and proven adept at working with any fair mind.

    His treatment by local media and state instruments has been appalling to any reasonable person capable of assessing evidence.

    It is unconscionable that his accusers remain technically anonymous and not yet subject to complimentary ordeals and jeopardies to those they contributed to for Salmond.

    It is the non yoon forces who attempted to cause his incarceration, social banishment and political destruction for their own purposes who would have reason to quake if justice were consistent.

  331. Geri

    I said 50 signatories, not 50 countries, ya dullard.

    Google is your friend. Plenty of EU member states & MEMBERS OF the EU PARLIAMENT have openly stated Scotland would be most welcome, including SPAIN, who recognises SCOTLAND isn’t a *region* of England & IS NOT locked in a written constitution.

    That burst Dominic Rabbs bubble at the time who shit himself & started lamenting other countries would invite separatists completely missing the point about what’s a fcking COUNTRY & what is not.. again..

    Tusk also said it after Brexit. Along with 49 others. Google is your friend.

    I was looking my favs to find it & came across this epic gaff from the BBC.

    Scotlands economy is worth £200 BILLION to the UK economy..

    Show me the money indeedy!!
    That’ll please Main..

  332. Geri

    The reason Brexshit didn’t come with a white paper.

    It’d need to have include those pesky things called figures to say exactly where the money was coming from.

    They’d have found it was from everyone else in the UK excluding England who doesn’t actually produce anything other than grief, Tories & money laundering services for R oligarchs.

    What does England produce that we need? It’s a question no one seems to know the answer to.. I can’t see jellied eels being a winner.

    Leadsoms Tea & jam farce…aye, she was probably taking the piss & it was code for Scotland’s 200 billion ++ jam.

  333. A Scot Abroad

    Make your mind up, Geri.

    Countries signing that statement are quite important. Individuals aren’t.

    Anyway, it would take 27 unanimous votes to allow iScotland to join the EU. And that ain’t guaranteed.

  334. Beauvais

    A Scot Abroad

    “..It would take 27 unanimous votes…”

    Only a collective vote can be unanimous. Individual votes cannot. Didn’t they teach grammar while you were at Sandhurst? Maybe you should have gone to Napier.

  335. A Scot Abroad


    blame Merchiston, not Sandhurst, although Mr Foulkes my English tutor would pass the blame onto me, because I was always utterly shit at English grammar and not really interested in it, despite his best efforts.

    You learn the art and practice of war at Sandhurst, not grammar.

  336. Geri

    ***Anyway, it would take 27 unanimous votes to allow iScotland to join the EU. And that ain’t guaranteed.***

    The point being,

    1. You claimed no one recognised Scotland as an individual country. You were wrong. Again.

    2. It’d be for Scots to decide if they ever want to rejoin. THAT is what’s *not guaranteed*. Not whether they’d have us. A mistake all rabid Britnats fail to accept. Scots would make that decision. Shock – horror!

    3. You seem an abusive partner. One of those control freaks who thinks the whole wide world would hate an independent Scotland if it went it alone in the world. Proving you are wrong. Again.

    Luckily for us that abusive, Britnat, rancid & racist exceptionalism isn’t recognised the world over – especially amongst countries who’ve suffered first hand Britnat oppression while their country was asset stripped of billions & their ppl were starved & told they were vermin or beastly without them.

    The whole world would ask what took us so long & there’s 50 signatures & £200 BILLION in the bank as a head start… + Shared assets + what’s in the BoE + what’s in GB parly + what’s funded the NHS + military.

    Tick tock…

    It’d be England who would struggle to support itself or have influence. On the world stage as well as at home & they know it. It’s a shame eejits like you still try punt a dead donkey when the whole world says different.
    Yer propagand a shit doesn’t work since the age of the internet.

    Do one..

  337. A Scot Abroad


    you are quite wrong about everything that you state. The world is rather more grown up that your potty-mouthed brain can understand. On a specific point, there isn’t £200 billion in Scotland’s account. Scotland doesn’t have an account. An iScotland may have some resources and assets, but it needs to convert those into money, and there’s no trade deals with anyone.

  338. John Main

    @Geri says:27 July, 2023 at 2:36 pm

    It’d be for Scots to decide if they ever want to rejoin

    Nah, the decision is already made. Read your First Minister’s latest speech.

    It’s a twofer: Vote Indy and get Brussels.

    Just as I have been saying for years.

    So now the big question is:

    Are you lying about it because that is what you really want, or are you just not smart enough to understand?

    My gut feeling is it’s the lying thing, but if you want to tell us you lack the smarts, go right ahead. I’ll easily believe that one too.

  339. Geri


    **My gut feeling is it’s the lying thing, but if you want to tell us you lack the smarts, go right ahead. I’ll easily believe that one too.**

    You really are a dumb knt!

    2. They have ZERO control over EU membership because in order to (re)join the EU the EU REQUIRES an EU REFERENDUM to be held first. They don’t just accept membership from political leaders. The citizens need asked first.
    3. The SNP can have hopes & as many aspirations as they like – IT DOES NOT ALTER THE EU RULES on membership.
    4. YOU & the cat next door cannot possibly know or predict the outcome of an EU referendum that hasn’t even been held yet & neither can the SNP.
    5. The SNP WONT be in charge of an independent Scotland. No where near negotiations either. A brand new government will be voted for by the return of Scotland’s independence.

    6. This must be at least six times this has been explained to you. Fear not, Johnny foreigner isn’t coming to get yeh & no one is joining the EU in secret, ya clown.

  340. Geri

    **Scotland doesn’t have an account.**

    No shit Sherlock.

    **you are quite wrong about everything that you state. **

    Prove it.

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