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More vile cybernats

Posted on May 02, 2015 by

Do you remember the Labour and media outrage a while back when SNP candidate Mhairi Black said she felt like “putting the nut” on some gloating Unionists at the indyref count, readers? Remember the pious scandal at such dreadful thuggery? (If you’d forgotten, don’t worry, because it’s in the Telegraph again today.)

Remember how the Daily Record and Scotsman have now been hammering away for a full week at another SNP candidate, Neil Hay, for tweeting a link to a satirical website and arguably being slightly rude about a small subset of pensioners, while glossing over a lengthy catalogue of abusive tweets calling the SNP “fascists” and “Nazis” (and more) from a prominent Labour activist and BBC pundit?


There’s your actual former First Minister and peer of the UK realm, Baron McConnell of Glenscorrodale, setting the example Labour would have everyone follow today by celebrating a threat to “f*****g boot” any Tories in Wishaw (we’re not told whether the young ladies in question were Labour activists he was with or just Labour voters).

But there’s more.

Here’s the vice-chair of the Cunninghame North Constituency Labour Party, firearm and martial arts enthusiast Gordon Wilson, apparently threatening to kill me because he doesn’t like people referring to a second-tier football club as “Sevco”:


We’re sure our phone will be ringing off the hook with journalists looking for quotes so they can run multiple stories about these shameful incidents any minute now.

Hmm. All quiet. We’ll just check that it’s plugged in.


EDIT 4.25pm: We have a response from Lord McConnell.


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108 to “More vile cybernats”

  1. Kevin Evans says:

    Right – enough is enough – I’ve been holding onto this for a while now but gloves are now off – see that twat maconnall. Lord he haw. Well he was my maths teacher at school. And I know for a fact 100% as I watched it regularly. When he was a teacher he was chatting up and leaching all over his 6th form female students. [EDIT BY REV.STU: defamatory allegation removed.]

  2. Shuggy says:

    Wrong tack there Stu. Try “Voter in England is victim of vile cybernat abuse by rabid Scots”.

    That ought to get a glance from the Mail.

  3. Cadogan Enright says:

    Was in Clarkston this morning and Labour had a tiny stall and Murphy appeared. He was assailed by elderly complainants with a grudge.

    The dozens of SNP folk at the giant SNP stall enjoyed lots of hoots of the horn from passing motorists, handing out balloons and whirlygigs BUT stayed well away from Murphy – leaving the invective to the elderly constituents.

    Interestingly, the Tories chose to canvass at Labours tiny stall, bosom buddies all. It was difficult to tell who was who. Can you tell who was wearing the red rosette and who the blue? (clue – one has white hair).



    Anyway! Off canvassing again in Eaglesham . . .

    PS someone said Kate Middleton was no longer in Labour. . . good to know the Royal Family is showing solidarity with Scotland

  4. Capella says:

    Well that certainly lowers the tone of this happy and glorious day. A right pair of charmers these are, canavassing the gutter obviously. Long may they fail to prosper if that isn’t too vile a sentiment!

  5. Grizzle McPuss says:

    There should be warning signs around the carpets of the MSM offices as they seem to have swept so much under them.

    For sure the tripping up will one day be a time of reckoning as seen in their future sales.

    …and I (still) include The National in that remark given their appalling misrepresentation of the Neil Hay debacle.

  6. James123 says:

    As Laura Bicker said on the BBC the other day “Nicola Sturgeon may struggle to control extremists in her party”. I’m sure a BBC reporter is tracking down Dugdale as we speak to ask what she’s doing about Ian Smart, oh look a flying pig.

  7. Grouse Beater says:


    I should publish the abuse meted out by so called Unionist ‘friends.’ No intention of engaging in debate or discussion, just brutal ridicule.

  8. wullie says:

    McConnell better watch himself in Wishaw then.

  9. heedtracker says:

    Make a formal Police complaint concerning these threats from Wilson and same complaint to his constituency and SLabour HQ. His position as Vice Labour Chair merits good civil conduct and he’s failed.

  10. yesindyref2 says:

    It would seem to be a good idea to print off McConnell’s tweet and plaster it all over the lampposts of East Renfrewshire, to show “tactical voting” Tories there what they might be voting for – a good kicking!

  11. jim watson says:

    wullie, that is exactly what I was going to tweet back to him but stopped short in case I was accused of being a nasty cybernat…

  12. Iain Henderson says:

    My friend in Wishaw alleges he overheard Jack scaring pensioners on their pensions and called him on it.

    As I didn’t hear this personally I will keep it anonymous but should Jack supply the lawyers I will happily name my sources. Who have already published on FB

  13. Marker Post says:

    I hear that the world’s most famous pollster, Nate Silver, is predicting 48 seats for the SNP.

  14. Bob Mack says:

    He is quoting from the intention of young ladies.Still it is stupid and encouraging others to follow suit.Very Daft.
    The second one is a good bit more serious and very threatening in tone,given that he has listed his “credentials” on the page as well.Sad to say Rev you are going to becthe focus of bampots like Wilson,who probably has loyalist/lodge sympathies .F*^k him.The guy is a knob

  15. Wuffing Dug says:

    I remember flying back into Glasgow airport while Scotland was under McConnell’s ‘stewardship’.

    All over the walls was ‘Scotland – the best (wee) country in the world. What fucking arsehole would have come up with that? Speaks bloody volumes about slab.

    Fuck them all. Sorry about the swearing but am on my laptop today and the resentment is just flowing through me.

  16. Lesley-Anne says:


    As I may have hinted at previously, that I was thinking about getting a cybernat tattoo, with these tweets from those lovely Britnats I’m now having second thoughts. Right second thoughts over, no fear, tattoo idea is still on at some point in the future. 😀

    I was out this morning at our Annan S.N.P. branch stall and it was fantastic. The numbers of people stopping, chatting, badging up, stickering up, cars blowing their horns and folks waving was amazing. Our stall was only manned by voulanteers. Meanwhile down the road a wee bit was the *ahem* Labour stall manned by THREE councillors! 🙂

    I may be slightly off tack here but I do believe our S.N.P. group was full of fun and humour meanwhile over at the Labour stall all we saw were the odd individual being rather forceful with the councillors.

    Just to prove that we held no grudge against the Labour councillors some of our number went down to the Labour stall, all badged up 😉 , and suggested that they were undecided and asked the Labour councillors to convince them to vote Labour. All I can say is that our “visitors” to Labour returned, eventually, and gleefully announced they were all voting UKIP! 😛

    Apparently our local Labour candidate is STILL claiming that DCT is STILL only a TWO horse race between himself and Fluffy. I’m guessing he does not pay much attention to the opinion polls then. 😀

  17. dramfineday says:

    Another failure of leadership by labour in their refusal to tackle this type of behavior head on. They’ve had plenty of time to get on with it. On reflection, it’ll probably be a good thing if they get wiped out at the GE. It’ll give the next generation time to clean out the stable.

    Meantime I hope the polis pay a visit and make sure Mr Wilson and his guns are in order. He sounds a tad bad tempered to me.

    Finally it would be nice if the”Scottish” press looked at this in a balanced way instead of the one way lens that they employ. I suspect if I held my breath waiting on that happening, I’d probably have passed away lang syne.

  18. fred blogger says:

    yeah, i remember, not long after the indyref defeat, you know the one we lost, course you do!?
    when a passionate young women let off some steam, and i thought good on ya, better out than in.
    hallelujah, lets have some real human beings talking/doing real politics of the people, what a pleasant change it will be from the anally retentive politics we now experience from WM.
    the world looked on in awe at the peaceful yes movement, wondering how we did it under the severest of pressures.
    we managed it, coz we know we’re right, we’ll never forget that.
    freedom come all ye.

  19. Joemcg says:

    Feels like me and half the country are living in some oppressed dictatorial country where all dissent is suppressed by the countries media and leaders. It’s like a vice clamped around your head and we are screaming in to an abyss. What a nightmare this is.

  20. KennyG says:

    Death threats are a bit much, although you are bitter Rev!

    Perhaps you should educate yourself on the entity that is the mighty Glasgow Rangers.

    You and me both know that if Scotland was independent, and happened to go bust then start again, that you and me would still refer to the entity that is Scotland as Scotland, and nobody could ever take that away.

    Only our detractors would refer to us as New Scotland or Scotland 2 or some similar derivative. But we would know, in our hearts that it would still be Scotland, and Rangers are still Rangers for this reason.

    I know you’re bitter, but this Sevco pish just makes you look childish and as having a lack of basic understanding of the concept of entity.

  21. VikkingsDottir says:

    I hope you reported that deluded phoney socialist to the Polis. That sounds like a fairly serious threat to me.

    I wonder who he thinks is going to do all that to you? Him? Don’t make me laugh, and a few spelling and grammar lessons wouldn’t do a few of these folk any harm, if they’ve got time to spare from polishing up the weapon collection I mean. Oh sorry, did I imply him? I was only meaning you could think that of him, if you were bad minded enough I mean.

    Incidentally, I was at a traffic lights behind a white van the other day and it had the entire Declaration of Arbroath on the back and a call to get back Scotland’s freedom. You couldn’t ignore it.

  22. Juteman says:

    After seeing the edit, fuck off Joke McConnell.
    I would love to give you a good kicking.
    Only joking, LOL!

  23. Andy-B says:

    By the looks of Gordon Wilson profile photo,he’s been worn out for years,just like Labour.

    Incidently its Labour’s days that are numbered.

  24. Aceldo Atthis says:

    Sky News is an atrocity right now with so many reporters hanging around outside hospitals pretending they are excited about another Royal mouth to feed. I have absolutely nothing positive or even neutral to say about the Royal family and their babies so I’ll move on.

    Not sure what this Gordon Wilson character is so bitter about; Rangers died so what does he care if we call the Phoenix Sevco?

    Anyway, I have a proposal;

    Nicola announces tomorrow that the SNP are now in a position to rule out another referendum on indpendence in 2016 — absolutely and unequivocally. This will no doubt be a welcome development to the Scottish Labour Party who were very concerned about that…

    Additionally, she announces the SNP’s intention to propose to hold a referendum on full political and economic autonomy within the UK (DEVO max, or whatever you want to call it) in the 2016 manifesto, with only matters of foreign policy and defence shared at a UK level.

    It would no doubt take the Labour party and the Tories a week or so to get their heads around this and I expect it would rattle them, but the upshot is this proposal would put an end to the Barnett formula, put an end to the West Lothia question, allow certain sentimentalists to keep their passports and the pound, and most importantly allow us to take responsibility for raising and spending money in Scotland. It would also shut up those misguided English voters who think they subsidise us.

    And immediatelty it would put an end to the childish debate about referendums being secretly planned and I expect lead to a further surge in the SNP vote share at the expense of the labour party.

    Most on here will be aware the Devo-Max was the favoured option of the majority of Scots with around 85% supporting it. For more die-hard independence supporters, I think it would be a very welcome and large step in the right direction and ultimately we could just sit and wait for the UK to get involved in another illegal war before we ditch them completely — that shouldn’t take long.

    So, there you have it, a short-term, medium-term, and long term plan for us all to get behind with tangible immediate benefits that opposing forces would struggle to resist — even the likes of Gordon Wilson and other Sevco fans would probably support it.


  25. Meindevon says:

    Well, My Lord, thank you. I have been a Labour voter all my life ( with the odd tactical Lib Dem vote). I have been contemplating voting Labour down here in Devon as a) it’s going to be a close run thing with the Tories and b) the local Labour councillors have been the only ones who have taken an interest and who contact me re local issues.

    However, you have just made all their good work pointless as I am fed up being called a nazi, fascist, Marxist, extremist, insurgent, anti English,separatist, etc., etc.. I am fed up being demonised in the MSM and told that the Scots have no right to vote democratically for a party that will give Scotland a stronger voice. You have just accused me of being part of a hate filled mob.

    I will now vote for the Greens. I will also contact Ben Bradshaw regarding your comments.

  26. Chitterinlicht says:

    Well well

    I watched a video of said hate filled mob playing the muppet theme tune.

    Couple of idiots but honestly these people need to grow a pair.

    Big Blair was straight on twitter bleating. Reminded me of Murphy and the ‘egg.’

    When Alex Salmon was involved in an attempt on his life he kept quiet and the man is now in jail.

    That and the egg incident showed me what real leadership is.

    Labour would fan ANY flame of aggression to win a vote. Mr salmond keep quiet and let justice take care of it.

    Was anyone arrested let Night? Plenty police kicking about

  27. Joemcg says:

    Stand sized banner at Ibrox urging their supporters to vote no. 90% of their fans brandish the union flag. Thousands of Gers are connected to the orange order and loyalist groups. I honestly cannot believe ONE Rangers supporter wants us to be independent. It’s like a member of the KKK campaigning for black rights!

  28. John Young says:

    Very impressed with the way this comprehensive election prediction map can be interacted with.

  29. stewart fae stoney says:

    a stroll through Stonehaven town centre this morning and a Tory stall deserted, whilst the SNP stall about 20 yards away was mobbed and was even busier when Nicola appeared and paid Greggs a visit and I spoke to her for a few minutes and posed for pics, very friendly and listened to what people were saying which is more than Murphy does, well done nicola

  30. icyspark says:

    @Aceldo Atthis

    I have been saying this for a while regarding an FFA referendum, although I disagree that Nicola should come out with it prior to the election.

    The election needs to be played out first. There is a chance that the SNP might be pushed out of even a vote by vote basis by Ed, or that the Tories get back in via LibDems. There are so many ways this Westminster government could be formed.

    If the SNP are locked out of talks even though they could form a government with Labour, or if the Smith commission proposals come to naught, or if the Tories get back in, then a new independence referendum might be back on the cards.

    If Labour do the decent thing and form a government with SNP support, then a proposed referendum on FFA might be on the cards next year.

    It all boils down to the public mood in Scotland, once the post election has finally settled down.

  31. HandandShrimp says:

    As ever, when Labour do it it is “just a joke” but if we do it then it is evil incarnate.

    I must admit I expected better from McConnell…not sure why now. :/

  32. crazycat says:

    @ HandandShrimp

    I blame Alexander McCall Smith – he gave Jack a cameo role in one of his novels, saving someone from being run over.

    That nearly made me forget what he’s like; today provides a timely reminder.

  33. Wuffing Dug says:

    In my dad’s so telly is on.

    News now.





  34. Nodrog says:

    Well Jack what’s got up your kilt? Sorry I do not accept hierarchical , authoritarian structures as set up by the Normans so in my opinion you are not a Lord by any manner of means and I will not refer to you as such. You accepted the title so as a true Socialist it appears that you obviously do believe in that outdated concept. It is obvious that you consult Wings otherwise you would not know we are, in your words ” hate filled violent mobs “. Never mind the previous comment about the young “ladies” from Wishaw for a man who held such high office in Scotland, in my opinion, you disgrace yourself.

  35. X_Sticks says:

    Cadogan Enright says:

    “PS someone said Kate Middleton was no longer in Labour. . . good to know the Royal Family is showing solidarity with Scotland”

    Hahaha PMSL at that one Cadogan

  36. Dr Jim says:

    There is no requirement for a referendum on FFA it’s a Scottish government decision to be passed by Parliamentary Procedure

    Different process to Independence

  37. Stonefree says:

    Wilson and his comments,
    If he has a Martial Arts license he should not be threatening anyone, that used to be an offence(I’ve not had one for years and assume that is still the case)
    Also he profess to be a marksman,so he should hold a firearms certificate,.I think bundle that lot into Police Scotland with a complaint , be nice to see him in Killie court, maybe Katy Clark can represent him if she’s between engagements (hopefully)

  38. Thepnr says:

    Know what? You reap what you sow.

    All the hatred and false allegations against those who believe in a better way of governance than what he have now is counter productive for those that promote it.

    The haters will become the hated, leave them to keep on digging!

  39. KennyG says:

    @joemcg 5.01pm

    “I honestly cannot believe ONE Rangers supporter wants us to be independent”

    I can categorically prove this belief to be false, firstly, because I am one, and I do, and secondly, I know many who do also.

    “It’s like a member of the KKK campaigning for black rights”

    Not if, like me, you don’t mix politics with football.

    I know some people find it hard to get their head around this so I’ll put it simply, supporting any football team does not automatically mean that you then have to indoctrinate said football teams percieved religious or political beliefs into your own life.

    It is entirely possible to support any team on earth without it having a direct affect on your world view.

    I am one of those people!

  40. Effijy says:

    Please don’t wind anyone for being a supporter of a Scottish Football team, or who supports the Royals.

    Free choice and more important items on our the agenda right through to Friday 8th May.

    We are the positive progressive lot who stand for a fair and just society after all.

    We will embrace everyone and improve the lives of all we touch!

  41. Joemcg says:

    Kenny-I see what you mean however the whole image with the supporters and queen and country outlook of the club just screams union jockery. I cannot get my head around a yes supporter following them and I bet most people could not understand it! I’m not a club team supporter on any level I just follow our national team so don’t think I hate the club I could not care less!

  42. Aceldo Atthis says:

    @ icyspark

    “If Labour do the decent thing and form a government with SNP support, then a proposed referendum on FFA might be on the cards next year.”

    You think the SNP getting into bed with those phoney slugs would be the decent thing?

    You think those phoney slugs will ever give Scotland an ounce more of autonomy?

    You think any agreement with those phoney slugs would be worth the fake parchment paper it was written on?

    I cannot express how misguided I think you are to invest any hope or faith in the prospects of a labour/snp alliance of any sort. Don’t you get it, Labour think they are our imperial masters, they think they own us, that this is their territory?

    If we rid Scotland of the Labour presence the penny might drop with them in a decade or two, but until then they think they own us and they won’t give us an inch. Come the next General Election, they will be looking to put us all back in their box, wait and see; and if we get into bed with them, they might just do it.

  43. Thepnr says:

    Football is but a game. Politics is not. Let’s not get confused.

  44. JBS says:

    A baby girl? Awwwww…

    I’m still voting SNP this coming Thursday 😀

  45. proudscot says:

    McConnell has always been a “Joke”, ’nuff said. Wilson has always been an SNP hating balloon – full of hot air, bluster and empty puerile threats.

    Elephant in the electoral room as far as I can tell, which isn’t being mentioned by too many commentators and punidits, it’s not likely to be the discredited LibDems who’ll be shoring up a Tory Party in government, it’ll be the misogynist soor-faced bigots of the DUP. The main difference between them and their UKIP counterparts is the fact that they hate Catholics and gays even more than do Farage’s lot.

    Real news instead of all this election stuff – some over privileged woman has had a baby! This astounding news will hopefully distract the Daily Heil, The Torygraph and the Saxe-Coburg-Gotha dynasty worshipping Express from their demonising of the SNP for a couple of days.

  46. Lesley-Anne says:

    Thepnr says:

    Football is but a game. Politics is not. Let’s not get confused.

    Has anyone told Jiminey Cricket this news? 😀

  47. carjamtic says:

    This is my third attempt to write something reasonably intelligent about these clowns,these little men.

    Here’s the best I can come up with.

    F###k Off Losers

    Apologies for lowering the tone of the debate.

  48. Davy says:

    Its always nice to see the red tories in their true colours, it reforces the hard work we have done to eliminate them and their political parties from our country.

    The target is 59 seats, it is achievable BUT WE MUST NOT STOP, keep talking, keep canvassing, keep going right through thursday.

    10.01 Thursday is our finish line.

  49. icyspark says:

    @Aceldo Atthis

    I’m not misguided at all. I don’t trust Labour in the slightest. I have no doubt they will try to scupper ANYTHING in the way of further powers to Scotland.

  50. KennyG says:

    @joemcg 5.41pm

    I hate all the stuff that’s attached to my football club as well. I detest the royals and the establishment.

    I’ve been a Rangers supporter for most of my life and nothing or no one will ever change that, no matter how much abuse is levelled at me for it.

    Many Rangers fans support independence simply because they can see through all that British bullshit and they don’t allow their clubs perceived views on any matter, political, religious or otherwise to have an influence on theirs.

    We see how shit things are in Scotland the same way you do. We hate the ruling elite just as much as you.

  51. dakk says:

    I know so many unionist blowhards like that guy Wilson.

    His team had a bad day and he’s lashing out trying to make himself feel big and hard.

    His profile.:)

    Martial Arts? Try tai- chi.

    Marksman? Plays with his grandsons spud gun.

    Yachtsman? Pedal boat in Kilmarnock boat pond.

    These types that bum up their machismo are usually frightened of their own shadows.

  52. Davy says:

    I should have said 10.01 ‘PM’ is our finish line.

  53. Croompenstein says:

    Ah wee union Jack the very antithesis of socialism a peer of the realm what a fucking joke.

    Tell you what’s violent Jack, you giving back over a billion pounds of Scotland’s money to get your wee shitey arse on the red leather. I would stamp on your coupon with fitba bits on ya wee sell out fucker (ha ha only joking Jack you can take a joke eh?)

  54. McDuff says:

    Shouldn`t` the SH and National be publishing these vile posts in response to the Unionist newspapers?

  55. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    You can’t have a referendum on FFA as such is in the gift of Westminster.

    I have no idea why anybody would like to leave defence (Trident) and Foreign affairs (Iraq, Afganistan, Libya, Syria) with Westminster – and noidea why anybody would want to pay for such nonsense.

    On 18th September last year we nearly voted for independence.
    I would think our position is stronger now.

    I can see absolutely no reason or justification for lowering our sights now. Any suggestion we should do so is mischief

  56. AllyPally says:

    Have no fear, Rev.

    I know Wee Gordy and he’s no longer at his fighting weight. I imagine touching his toes is a bit of a challenge for him these days.

  57. Juteman says:

    I really feel for the The Rangers fans that suffer through all the Brit stuff.
    Why do we never see pro Indy banners at Ibrox from them though?

  58. Fireproofjim says:

    Re royals.
    I complain about the non stop baby coverage and my royalist, SNP voting wife says ” but would you want a party balloon like Jim Murphy to be head of state?”
    Leaves me muttering.

  59. starlaw says:

    If you trawl face book you will find plenty Rangers fans for independence, they are not all tarred with the same orange brush.

  60. Robert Peffers says:

    @dramfineday says: 2 May, 2015 at 4:09 pm:

    “I suspect if I held my breath waiting on that happening, I’d probably have passed away lang syne.”

    I was just saying something along those lines a couple of days ago. A friend of mine was telling me she had suffered abuse at her work for wearing an SNP lapel badge. Some numptie had called her a Nazi.

    I told her to ignore the insults as it certainly looks like she will have the last laugh. I was telling her it was nothing new as I remembered being actually pushed around by a couple of guys just after Margo won her seat in 1973.

    I had just about had enough and was about to explode when a couple of polis came round the corner and warned then to make themselves scarce. It’s about the only time I’ve been tempted to hit back other than verbally.

  61. Kirk Drennan says:

    I don’t get this Rangers thing at all. The club became synonymous with sectarianism and reactionism through the actions and preferred associations of the vast majority of its supporters.

    I for one would appreciate an apology for the too many years of Orange triumphalism, rather than a statement of personal exceptionalism from an individual fan.

    I don’t hate you, buddy, it’s just that I can’t piece your logic together in order to make a statement that I can understand.

  62. Aceldo Atthis says:

    @ Dave McEwan

    “You can’t have a referendum on FFA as such is in the gift of Westminster.

    I have no idea why anybody would like to leave defence (Trident) and Foreign affairs (Iraq, Afganistan, Libya, Syria) with Westminster – and noidea why anybody would want to pay for such nonsense.

    On 18th September last year we nearly voted for independence.
    I would think our position is stronger now.

    I can see absolutely no reason or justification for lowering our sights now. Any suggestion we should do so is mischief”


    It might be something you disagree with but it isn’t mischief. Maybe you calling it mischief is mischief.

    Independence is just a word and it’s a word that now has negative connotations in the context of Scottish politics. Unless you are willing to build a wall around Scotland, independence really means nothing; it’s an abstract concept, a notion.

    In today’s world no country is really independent. And given the ties Scotland has with its neighbours, England included, independence here is unrealisable in any meaningful sense. We are probably one of the worst examples of a country that might be able to be independent — we have all the trappings of modern communications and, thanks to Westminster, huge dependence on other countries for basic everyday needs.

  63. Harry McAye says:

    Good for you Kenny and other indy supporting Rangers fans. I do wonder how you can stomach being a part of a support that regularly belts out Rule Brittania, and, if it could get away with it, would also belt out hate filled songs about Catholics. I would feel very dirty at every match, even if all I wanted to do was see good football and cheer on the light blue shirts. You know what they say about judging a man by the company that he keeps. Apologies in advance Kenny!

    I attended games with my team at Ibrox in the 80s and it’s chalk and cheese compared to nowadays and not in a good way. Swirling union flags as the teams come out and patriotic Brit Nat guff over the tannoy. It’s a horrible matchday experience now and one I will never repeat, even though there is every chance my team will be there twice next season.

  64. Fiona says:

    What makes you think it has negative connotations?

  65. Big Jock says:

    So Lord McConnel has just described and insulted 45% of Scotland as a hate filled mob! How dare you say that you worm. Come up to Scotland and speak to us face to face you pathetic excuse for a man.

    Is he seriously suggesting that anyone who wants independence is part of a mob.Disgraceful and undignified. No wonder your party are hated more than the Tories in Scotland. You are worse you pretend to care while stabbing Scotland in the back.

    Not Labour ,never Labour, never been Labour because of people like you.

  66. Robert Peffers says:

    @KennyG says: 2 May, 2015 at 4:38 pm:

    ” … but this Sevco pish just makes you look childish and as having a lack of basic understanding of the concept”

    Sheesh! Up our Main Street was a wee supermarket. Nice wee company with just a handful of branches locally. It changed hands and was bought over by the co-op.

    No one calls it anything but the co-op, Kenny. The reason being it was a Business company and it changed to another company. Still a supermarket, still engaged in the same line of business but a different company. Now, KennyG, tell me this, Were the old Rangers a company or a club?

    Truth is they ceased to be a club a very long time ago. Now I’ll grant you this. Their supporters have clubs all over the World and most are also in association – but they are clubs – not companies. So whether you like it or not the present Rangers FC is a totally new business but their supporters are still Rangers supporters clubs.

    As for your Scotland analogy – It’s mince.

  67. Croompenstein says:

    @Harry –

    even though there is every chance my team will be there twice next season

    I think Morton will do quite well next season Harry 🙂

  68. Tinto Chiel says:

    Canvassing in a Lanarkshire constituency this week, I observed/canvassed three doors in two days which were opened by voters in Rangers strips (one with a Union Jack on the hut outside). Every voter in these houses was SNP.

    If I have learned anything during this and the referendum campaign, it’s that people continually surprise you and stereotypes are just that.

    And before you start, I’ve got enough problems, I’m a ‘Well fan.

    Well done The Staggies. You deserve to stay up: a great run of results.

  69. Charles Edward says:

    Nimrodwilson – rifle and pistol.

    The legislation on keeping firearms has clear outlines.

    Revocation of firearm certificates.

    (1)A firearm certificate may be revoked by the chief officer of police for the area in which the holder resides on any of the grounds mentioned in subsections (2) to (5) below.

    (2)The certificate may be revoked if the chief officer of police has reason to believe—

    (a)that the holder is of intemperate habits or unsound mind or is otherwise unfitted to be entrusted with a firearm; or

    (b)that the holder can no longer be permitted to have the firearm or ammunition to which the certificate relates in his possession without danger to the public safety or to the peace.

    Intemperate habits..?




    having or showing a lack of self-control; immoderate.

    “intemperate outbursts concerning global conspiracies”

    synonyms:immoderate, excessive, undue, inordinate, unreasonable, unjustified, unwarranted,uncalled for; More

    given to or characterized by excessive indulgence, especially in alcohol.

    I don’t know if this man actually has any weapons.
    My mate at school used to boast that he had the Rambo knife with the compass on the handle and waterproof matches inside?
    He didn’t. He wasn’t very clever.
    If Nimrodwilson keeps ammunition at home I hope it’s in date, in the correct quantity, and securely stored.
    If he has ballistic weapons on his property again these need to be secured in locked steel cabinets which are secured to the fabric of the building.

    you might want to have a think about this sort of thing.

    It is in the interests of the public and the law that this is in order. Police have a responsibility to check.
    I would like it if this was actioned ASAP.

  70. Aceldo Atthis says:

    Fiona says:
    2 May, 2015 at 7:57 pm
    What makes you think it has negative connotations?

    The word “independence” in the eyes of about 55% of Scottish people, not to mention countless millions of English people, is now associated with strife, division, and economic failure. You can thanks the British establishment for that, they spent literally millions in order to trash it and re-define it.

    Language is like that, it’s malleable and capable of being corrupted.

    Thus, if you accept language is a tool like any other, one which we use to achieve certain ends through communication, there is simply no sense in having any loyalty to words. In this day and age, words are more corruptible than they ever were. We should be loyal to ideas and goals, not words.

    So we rule out a referendum on “Independence” which is what they are specifically asking for, and we rule in a referendum on economic and political autonomy within the UK. If they trash that concept and those words, we introduce new ones.

    I think they would struggle to adjust to a change in emphasis like that though. If successful, we would be extremely close to the ultimate goal of what you understand to be independence. And I think the polls suggested that a majority of Scottish people wanted something like devo max too, so it would be easier to sell on the doorsteps.

    As I said, for diehards like myself who want to be as independent of England as possible in economic and political terms, we would only have to wait a few years before they invaded or bombed someone illegally and then we ditch them completely — if they behaved in terms of foreign and defence policy, we would not be sacrificing too much by continuing to be attached in those areas for a time.

    The above completely neutralises the sort of attacks the SNP and independence movement are currently experiencing. It also allows those who are worried about a new currency and losing passports to be supportive, neutralising their concerns in those areas. The currency is a big obstacle and it was an issue that cost us dearly in th referendum.

    When you think about it, the Vow was really a con that tricked people into thinking they were getting devo max or something very similar at worst. That played a huge part in the result in terms of changing peoples’s minds. The only reason it was so effective as a deception though was down to the fact that devo max has huge appeal. Ergo, the SNP should now push for that and rule out another referendum on independence in 2016, whilst ruling a referendum on this in.

    If this was first line in the SNP manifesto next year, they would win by a landslide.

  71. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Aceldo Atthis at 7.55

    What nonsense.

    Independence has a very specific meaning. It is not “just a word” nor does it have negative connotations. It is entirely positive in meaning and your whole post sounds like an attempt at the sort of transparent verbal deceit we have got used to by posters here who think they are a just a bit smarter than all us simple minded independence supporters.

    FFA or whatever it is called is a misnomer as you do not have FFA if you leave responsibility for defence and foreign affairs with somebody else – unless of course you have the option of not paying your share for providing those services.

    The only way you have such a charge free option is through independence.

    The only way in fact you have FFA is through independence.

    If you have independence and wish to share responsibility for such as defence with neighbours that is a different matter.
    That can be achieved in a confederal arrangement (like the Nordic Union)in which INDEPENDENT entities agree to cooperate in areas of mutual interest.
    I would have no interest in any arrangement which implicates us in a nuclear “defence” .

    Any suggestion that you have some privileged insight into the intentions of the SNP Government or its leadership is of course complete bollocks

  72. Chungster says:

    Our SNP convoy was met today by some hate filled mobs of the red, white and blue variety in Springburn and Possilpark today. They proceeded to chant F**K the SNP and one guy decided to go one further by physically removing some car window flags during his 50 yard dash.

    At the time I had 3 young budding journalists from bournemouth sitting in my car. They were pretty bemused by it all and said to me later that they had never seen such feelings on the streets down south during elections. I suspect the whole experience was quite exciting and a little unnerving for them. Having said that, they probably think we are nuts up here!

  73. Robert Peffers says:

    @Fiona says: 2 May, 2015 at 7:57 pm:

    “What makes you think it has negative connotations?”

    Thank you Fiona for that reply. It’s going to take days to get the teeth marks from my tongue.

    Indeed no country is independent as they are often interdependent. Thing is they have the independent right to choose who to be interdependent with and without.

    However, our Scottish situation is even worse for every leader of an Establishment party makes it plain every timer they open their mouths that they regard that Westminster considers the Scotland, Wales and N.I or indeed the entire British Isles are all just inferior bits of Greater England.

    They speak of British this and British that when the correct words are United Kingdom and the use the term My country in reference to the UK which is not a country.

    The Establishment even commissioned a paper by two so called experts that claims the Kingdom of Scotland was extinguished. That, for me drove any ideas of other than full independence from my brain.
    How dare they

  74. Salt Ire says:

    What is about the SNP that makes politicians so unpolitical?

  75. Aceldo Atthis says:

    Dave McEwan Hill says:
    2 May, 2015 at 8:42 pm

    “Independence has a very specific meaning.”

    Yes, and if you took the time to imbibe the literal definition of the word independence, even you would hopefully appreciate that it is a meaningless notion in a world that is increasingly and inextricably interdependent.

    Moreover, the social and cultural ties that Scotland shares not only with England but the rest of the UK, and indeed the rest of the world, can’t be simply overlooked.

    But I’m not suggesting we abandon the idea of being politically and economically independent of England. I’m suggesting we abandon the word which, like it or not, has been trashed.

    Look at the way Unionist policians use the word “independence” to bludgeon Sturgeon in debates. It has become a weapon for them and what I am proposing would take it out of their hands.

    If you have a room full of 100 kids who are starving to death, what does it matter if you call it “feeding” or “sharing food” with them? Ultimately all that matters is that they don’t die of starvation.

    You have loyalalty to a word. That’s just stupid and irrational. An artist doesn’t paint because he loves paintbrushes. Words are just tools like paintbrushes.


    “Any suggestion that you have some privileged insight into the intentions of the SNP Government or its leadership is of course complete bollocks…”

    is a complete non sequitur.

  76. Simon Curran says:

    I’m a Rangers fan and have been for too many years to mention. Truth be told ‘Sevco”s irritating and comes across as a bit pathetic but in no way does that justify the crass and hateful abuse from Gordon Wilson. The fact that this guy is vice-chair of a Constituency Labour Party makes it even worse. I’m sure Dugdale will be demanding an apology from him even now. Yet another reason why Labour have lost my vote.

  77. Bill Hume says:

    So Mr Wilson is vice-chair of the Cunninghame North Constituency Labour Party.

    Perhaps he’s not doing a very good job there as he seems unable to even supervise the catering very well……

    “Cunninghame North CLP Social Club, North Ayrshire is categorised as ‘Pub/bar/nightclub’ and is located in North Ayrshire. It currently has a food hygiene rating of ‘Improvement Required’ from North Ayrshire Food Safety.”

  78. Fiona says:

    Changing words is not the easy fix you seem to imagine. Just look at the history of words for people with learning problems and you will see that if the mindset does not change any negative attitude just moves with the linguistic shift.

    We have already seen the reaction to a shift from FFA to FFR: hardly major yet a cause of negative inference within the media, nonetheless.

    In any case I do not accept your premise. I do not think the word is toxic. though many do not want independence. That is not the same thing. What is your evidence that the word has been “trashed”?

    Incidentally, once again you are talking down to people. I do not think it furthers your case to call people stupid and irrational. Doing so is stupid and irrational in itself. I know it is your style, from past encounters; don’t have to like it, and I don’t

  79. Robert Peffers says:

    @Aceldo Atthis says: 2 May, 2015 at 8:38 pm:

    “The word “independence” in the eyes of about 55% of Scottish people, not to mention countless millions of English people, is now associated with strife, division, and economic failure. “

    How true, Aceldo Atthis, The way those British and United Kingdom Nationalists go on has indeed made all those bits of the globe that used to be coloured pink feel that way.

    Not to mention the Irish Republic, Bailiwicks of Jersey & Guernsey, and the Isle of Man. Many Welsh and many Scots also feel their Unionist British Nationalism is a corrosive and destructive form of pretendy nationalism.

    Much akin to that of the fascists nations that caused two World Wars by their bullying and expansionist nature. It was neither Nationalistic nor Socialist but often claims it is.

    British Nationalism, even by its very name gives their game away. They want to control Britain’s other Kingdoms, countries and nations. True Nationalism is inclusive and seeks only to look to their own country, nation or kingdom and to be free to interact, and deal freely with, other countries of their choice.

    Perhaps, though, you think British Nationalist are cuddly benign and loving of their neighbours. Try telling that to the People of Ireland or the natives of such lands as The USA, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, India, Pakistan and much of Africa.

  80. Robert Peffers says:

    @Salt Ire says: 2 May, 2015 at 8:55 pm:

    “What is about the SNP that makes politicians so unpolitical?”

    The main one is sheer unmitigated abject fear and the other is sheer unmitigated greed and avarice. Put the two together and you get the sheer terror of the snout being forcibly removed from the gravy trough.

  81. Paula Rose says:

    I want the people I live amongst to democratically organise their polity – any problems?

  82. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Aceldo Atthis at 9.17

    The word “independence” is hugely attractive to most of the people I know and becoming more attractive by the day if the SNP’s recruitment figures (now above 115,000 I believe) are to be assessed.
    It is only unionist who say “independence” is a bad word. The have a complete glossary of bad words. “Salmond”; “separatists”; “SNP”;
    and so on. In fact “Independence” is so attractive a word they had to invite “separatism” to combat it.

    Must try harder

    Nice post Robert BTW

  83. Aceldo Atthis says:

    Robert Peffers, if you drop the sarcasm, I’ll engage in more serious discussion with you.

    Suffice to say, though;

    1) I didn’t mention “all those bits of the globe that used to be coloured pink”

    2) I am not criticising the idea of political and economic independence per se. If you dropped your childish loyalty to words, which as I have explained are mere tools of the trade, you would understand me better.

    An interesting thing happened earlier and it’s instructive. Someone came on and took exception to Rev Stu’s use of the word Sevco. Now, then, looking at that, you don’t need to be up to speed on the demise of Rangers to understand my point that we live in a world where people have loyalties to the silliest things.

    So, Rangers in effect died, but try telling the fans that. Try asking them what they are loyal to. Try asking any football fan what he is loyal to — answers will include, the team, the club, the stadium, the badge, and various other ridiculous notions.

    The team of course changes every few weeks with players coming and going. It wasn’t that long ago that even Celtic talked about moving to a new stadium, Rangers too more recently, then there’s the badge or the shirt; turns out Mike Ashley / Sports Direct own the Rangers emblem etc.

    So what is it a football fan is loyal to? What is it he supports? Nothing. An abstract concept.

    Apply that same logic to the language of Scottish independence and you arrive at the same conclusion; it’s all bull. What matters is the outcome, the lives of people, their well-being, our ability to shape and respond to events, control over our lives and resources, etc. Call it what you want.

  84. tartanarse says:


    When stadium sized banners cover the entire crowd at a Rangers match, is it just one guy at each end who are the bigots whilst the remaining thousands look on disgusted?

    If my teams fans behaved the same I wouldn’t go to the games. I couldn’t stand around with fuckwits such as these. The stats show that a great any Rangers fans did indeed vote Yes. They don’t all fit into Ibrox.

    This suggests that the folks who do attend Ibrox are the hardcore assholes. As a result most Scottish folks dislike their begaviour and won’t condone it. I think you fit into the latter category.

  85. Aceldo Atthis says:

    Dave McEwan Hill says:
    2 May, 2015 at 9:56 pm

    “The word “independence” is hugely attractive to most of the people I know and becoming more attractive by the day if the SNP’s recruitment figures (now above 115,000 I believe) are to be assessed.
    It is only unionist who say “independence” is a bad word. The have a complete glossary of bad words. “Salmond”; “separatists”; “SNP”;
    and so on. In fact “Independence” is so attractive a word they had to invite “separatism” to combat it. ”

    I more or less agree but the point I am making is it’s stupid to have loyalty to a word or as you put it to find it “hugely attractive”.

    I would argue that those people really want control over their lives in democratic terms, control over resources, a better distribution of wealth, the power to tackle problems like poverty and unemployment, etc., etc. If we called all that chopped chicken they would possibly join the Chopped Chicken Party.

    Just words.

    You should look into the meaning of the word praxis which i believe is a German term that is used in certain Marxist/Anarchist frameworks. I’d also recommend Foucalt.

    Words are great useful things, more so than anything else they distinguish us from animals, but they can also imprison minds. Like any technology, words can be good or ungood as a means to an end. It makes no sense to have loyalty to words and if your love of the word “independence” prevents you getting what you want (economic and political control of your country), my advice is you drop it.

  86. thomaspotter2014 says:

    Independence coming closer daily.

  87. Paula Rose says:

    I always thought the AA would have a problem if it carried on the way it was heading.

  88. Aceldo Atthis says:

    thomaspotter2014 says:

    “Independence coming closer daily”

    Yeah? How?

    I’m taking bets that Sturgeon and the SNP take the approach I am advocating and outline plans for a referendum on Devo max in their 2016 manifesto. The reason I say that and am so sure is that I am equally sure that Sturgeon and her team are smart.

    Any takers?

    Another referendum on independence would be met with hysterics along the lines of “you just had one” and “no, not again” and blah blah blah.

    That’s a huge political price to pay for using a word.

    With my approach they couldn’t attack on that basis; it wouldn’t be another independence referendum. Polls suggest a huge majority want it too. In 5 or 10 years you dump UK foreign policy and defence too when the opportunity arises.

  89. Paula Rose says:

    Another thread with silly paragraph breaks.

  90. Gary says:

    So Baron McConnell has taken to Twitter to incite violence?

  91. Thepnr says:

    @Aceldo Atthis

    An old saying “Action speaks louder than words”. What does that mean?

    There is no need to question what Independence means. Just a word? I think not, it is a belief.

  92. carjamtic says:

    Wrong link doh !

    Another vile cybernat #2

  93. Stoker says:

    Maybe i shouldn’t do this but, fuck it, i can’t resist.

    Wilson, yer a dirty Orange kiddy fiddler, aye, that’s right, i know Ardrossan very well and if you’re going to make veiled threats make sure you know what you’re dealing with ya fuckin tube.

    btw, wee clue, bawbag, i used to live on Glasgow Street, ya hun.

  94. arranc says:

    8 men members of my immediate family Ranger fans are also s.n.p none go to matches

  95. CRAIGthePICT says:

    Some people are quicker on the uptake than others when it comes to political matters, such is life.

    However, the realisation that we, the Scottish people are daily victims of racism, lies, abuse and a repetitive distortion of truth on in industrial scale has eventually seeped through to us.

    They pushed us too far, they used us too much, the lies were too exaggerated, the messaging was to insulting.

    They will pay the ultimate penalty a few years down the line, but it’s not actually about THEM, It’s about US. It’s about our vision for a better, fairer country. It started in September, round 2 is Thursday, round 3 is 2016 and then we step up and do the right thing for all of us.

    It’s time to be all we can be, we owe it to ourselves and to our kids.

  96. Aceldo Atthis says:

    @ Thepnr

    “There is no need to question what Independence means. Just a word? I think not, it is a belief.”

    Another person with loyalty to a word. Brilliant.

    If the highest possible levels of political and economic control over our affairs was offered to us on the condition that we called it chopped chicken rather than independence, would you reject the offer because you have loyalty to the word “independence”?

    What if they enslaved us and made us sing God save the queen at gunpoint every morning and told us that was independence, would you be happy with that independence?

    You might think the above is quirky nonsense but it isn’t; it actually proves I am right and anyone who disagrees with me is wrong…

  97. Barbara McKenzie says:

    Found this on Wilson’s twitter page.

    ‘Gordon Wilson ?@NimrodWilson 11h11 hours ago

    @Historywoman @lyndecrab
    Hi Jill,I’ve just blocked 41 today,was referred to as a ‘hun’ 6 times.
    All I did was have a go @ their beloved rev
    2 retweets 3 favorites’

    I could have become the 42nd, but I thought I would watch for a bit longer. Don’t know how it all squares with:


    @NimrodWilson @Historywoman @lyndecrab Well even on his own side, fok like Ross Greer did not think much of the ‘Rev’, the Goebbels of Bath.’

    I mean, is Stu too popular? not popular enough? In any case, he seems to loom very large in Wilson’s consciousness.

  98. Wulls says:

    Check out the abuse I got from this fella for daring to disagree with him.

  99. Fred says:

    If Rangers fans had all voted no in the referendum Glasgow would not have turned in a YES vote!

  100. Paula Rose says:

    What’s football? sounds a bit pervy.

  101. Vambomarbeleye says:

    It used to be sage advise not to discusse politics and/or religion. Especially with strangers. Seems that for some football encapsulates both.

  102. Will Podmore says:

    Please don’t think that the vile Daily Mail and the vile Sun (in England) represent anything more than the prejudices of their millionaire owners.
    Accusations flying about fascism and Nazism are abominable.
    Reading these papers, you would think the Enlightenment had never happened.
    Yesterday I carefully read the Daily Mail for the first time this year, and couldn’t find a single unpolluted fact in it. It managed to blame the global financial crisis on Labour’s spending money on health care! Even the top civil servant at the Treasury now acknowledges that the crisis arose in the finance sector.

  103. Will Podmore says:

    Robert Peffers rightly denounces imperialism and the vicious record of the British Empire in particular. But Scottish capitalists were just as keen on the Empire as any financier from Threadneedle Street. The ruling class is our enemy. not our fellow-workers. Scotland and Wales are not exploited, underdeveloped colonies. By contrast, Ireland was.

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