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Wings Over Scotland


More repeats

Posted on February 21, 2016 by

The slow news year in Scottish politics continues. These are all from today:

ae1

ae2

ae3

Sound familiar?

It should do, because here was the news three months ago:

ae4

ae5

ae6

Nothing new has happened. No extra information has become available. Like the Daily Mail repeating a September 2015 puff piece on four front pages in January 2016 about “SNP second jobs”, it’s just the same story run again, when Labour/the press thinks enough time has passed that people will have forgotten.

Either that or the Scotsman, Times and Express hacks are just desperately scouring their rivals’ archives for stuff they might have missed first time round. Either way, it’s stale chips in really old wrapping. We’d quite like something to happen now, please.

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    1. thomaspotter2014 says:

      Errr……

      Doing some real journalism?????

    2. Greg Drysdale says:

      I suppose they need something in their lives to give it purpose :-/

    3. Camz says:

      The ‘Olds’ then.

    4. Proud Cybernat says:

      Just keeping up the same old failed SNPBAD meme. They just can’t help themselves. It’s really all they have.

      And talking of which…

      SNPBAD – The Movie: http://tinyurl.com/jpjqlcr

      Spread far and wide, folks.

    5. galamcennalath says:

      Simple solution.

      All they to do is employ some journalists who will actually do their jobs rather than plagiarising and spending their days in spanner banter.

    6. The Man in the Jar says:

      Its like having your TV constantly on the “Dave” channel. Watching endlessly repeated episodes of Top Gear, QI and Mock the Weak (not a typo).

      At least “Dave” doesn’t have the effrontery to pretend that its content is new.

    7. Ian says:

      Hut and run tactics as usual. No substance. I haven’t read the Beano or even Oor Wullie for years but I suspect that they’ll be doing stuff like this to try to get to the younger future voters since the MSM seem to have got what they wanted with the oldest generation.

    8. heedtracker says:

      Anything other than actual info on how their The Vow historic fraud’s going.

      How would you explain to anyone not from teamGB, why England’s BBC led toryboy media widdles all over Corbyn’s Labour in England but boosts Dugdale’s SLabour in Scotland to high red tory heaven?

      What a difference on non existent border makes to UKOK hackdom, or is it hackdumb, or said hacks just assume we are that dumb.

    9. Ken500 says:

      Do they ever give up on this rubbish. Attacking the NHS and Education is so counter productive.
      Westminster cut the NHS/Education budget.

    10. bugsbunny says:

      If TV is chewing gum for the eyes, is the Scottish Papers cleaning rags for the erse?

      Stephen.

    11. John J. says:

      You’re not seriously suggesting that journalism’s finest would get on the phone to co-ordinate an attack on the Scottish Government?

      That would imply a conspiracy against our elected representatives.

      Heaven forfend.

      Shame on you Stu.

    12. Bob Mack says:

      I went to A+E,with a broken finger. I had to sign an Official secrets Act,and sign a confidentiality clause before treatment. They kept me in a darkened room and played a tape over and over which said ” you have only just arrived,you have only just arrived”

      Imagine my outrage when I discovered they left my broken finger to help a 10 year old girl who had been in a serious road traffic accident,and a young man who had a serious heart attack.

      In any event I was fixed up within two hours. Sadly the young guy did not make it.

      Health services have distinct prioriies. I wasn’t one . The two others rightly were.

    13. tris says:

      The clue is in the name: NEWs.

      You’d think that NEWspapers might have grasped that.

    14. Macart says:

      Rinse and repeat.

      Give it a few weeks.

    15. Jamie Arriere says:

      How can you have ‘waiting lists’ for A&E?

      ‘Ah, you’ve got a broken leg – well, just fill in this form, and we’ll call you back in to treat it when we have an appointment for you.’

      Utter bollocks. I’m sure they must mean waiting times, but they’ve just cut & pasted some article or quote from some SNPBad source without thinking about it.

    16. heedtracker says:

      Red tory and blue bashing away, BBC blue, SLab activist red tory, bettertogether, as per and about nothing to do with The Vow

      Scott Arthur Retweeted
      Laura Kuenssberg ?@bbclaurak 4 hrs4 hours ago
      Sturgeon careful to say Brexit would trigger ‘demands’ for indyref 2, not the same as committing to having another vote
      53 retweets 48 likes
      Reply Retweet 53
      Like 48

      What’s my Slovene girlfriend saying about it all today?

      Adam Tomkins ?@ProfTomkins 5 hrs5 hours ago
      Everything, absolutely everything, the SNP say or do is calculated with independence, and only independence, in mind. #EURef #Marr

      He’s not a professor for nothing. Oh to be a state the obvious toryboy, when you don;t actually need votes to get a seat in Holyrood.

      “I mentioned The Vow once but I think I got away with it.” Vote tory, red or blue, we beg you suckas. etc

    17. Dr Jim says:

      Have they got any engineers to tell us where the SNP built the secret holding areas and are they safe from collapse at any time or will we need new vanity project holding areas that aren’t needed

      How many people do the secret holding areas hold
      All these “Facts” must be investigated,

      Willie Rennie says “People in holding areas must be exposed”

    18. Ken500 says:

      They expect to sell newspapers by attacking the SNP? Support for the SNP Gov/Independence is increasing. Newspaper sales are falling. They are like lemming falling over a cliff. Incredible.

    19. JLT says:

      It’s a strange situation that we have with the Scottish media, and the perception of ‘slow news’. If anything, the world of politics has been seriously shaken in this last week, if not even the last day, and to which, in the long run, does affect Scotland greatly if certain events and results come to pass.

      If the Scottish media is struggling to find things to report on, then surely the events of the last week in Brussels should have alarm bells ringing as well as having keyboards being frantically and furiously pounded.

      With not only the Scottish elections in May, we now have the EU Referendum in June, and if the result from that should creates the political imbalance of England wanting to leave, but Scotland wishing to remain within the EU, then following on from the First Minister’s statement, we then have the reality of a second Referendum.

      When you look at it, we could be facing 3 different campaigns this year (1) the Scottish Elections (2) The EU Referendum and (3) a 2nd Scottish Referendum …so how the hell is the Scottish media seeing the current political outlook as ‘slow news’.

      For the Scottish media to keep harping on about waiting times at hospitals shows complete contempt for the Scottish electorate considering that apart from the possibility of being hauled out of the EU against the wishes of the Scottish electorate, we also have the possibility of the dissolution of the United Kingdom for a second time within two years; only this time, it will probably be a much greater possibility since any ‘Better Together’ campaign will seriously struggle to promote the reasons as to why the Union should continue. After all, dangling the carrot of ‘only the UK can keep Scotland in the EU is now a horribly shattered myth, and that’s not including just about every other lie that they told us, now having been exposed.

      My only conclusion is that the Scottish media know, that to begin discussing what has just happened in Europe, and what lies in Scotland’s path over this coming Spring and Summer, would raise real difficult questions which the Scottish electorate would want answers too. To begin even discussing it will have the radars of the Scottish electorate pricking up. To answer them, would only fuel the arguments for a real clamour for independence.

      But to most of us here and that of half of the Scottish electorate, for a media to be struggling to write on the Scottish political scene is churlish, paltry and deplorable. For me personally, the greater world of politics that affects the British, European and even the Scottish arenas so much, and in so many ways, has at this very moment, thrown up such rich veins of information and news stories, which we have not seen since the Referendum of 2014 should be a journalists dream. To only come up with waiting times and ‘what Labour says’ is both laughable and contemptible.

      Scottish journalism …hold your head in shame.

    20. I was surprised to see the headline in the Sunday Express as I was in Lidl earlier and thought I saw the Sunday Express headline as something about a ”SNP MP”

    21. Papadox says:

      Yes the very stupid Jocks just won’t accept the lies our wonderful state security services use to try and protect us from our ignorance and stupidity to protect their own corrupt system. They use the world renowned Brittish press core and English Broacasting Corporation to spread is lies and deceit amongst the populace to their own vile selfish ends.

      This totally corrupt and dysfunctional system is rotten to the core and neads the state propaganda units to try and hide the facts from the people by spreading fear and alarm in its own citizens. Democracy, you have got to be joking. The system is getting more putrid by each act of deceit and misinformation daily, the body politic is putrifying and well beyond repair. Time to give it a decent burial and start again without the dead hand of empire hanging on to us.

      Decolonialisation. FREEDOM FOR SCOTLAND AND ITS PEOPLE.

    22. Clootie says:

      …Oh for the days when they managed public opinion. They could spend all day in the pub and simply post the Whitehall brief.

      I only hope none of my family ever consider a career in journalism…the shame would be dreadful!

    23. Ken500 says:

      Thousands of operations are being cancelled in England. Junior Doctors are going on stike and having contracts forced on them. Many are leaving the NHS after all their training.

      The SNP has increased NHS spending in Scotland. Built one of the best hospitals in Europe in Glasgow and sorted out the lack of funding in Grampian. Combined social and health care. Thank goodness for our NHS.

    24. Helena Brown says:

      Waiting lists in A&E, rubbish, you might wait a bit as I did many years ago on a busy Saturday night and that in the Royal Infirmary Edinburgh other wise you will not and that was only because I had a little cut on my finger. Anything serious would be seen immediately.
      Dislocated my shoulder in September last year and the Ambulance was there within ten minutes of my Husband phoning, I was seen immediately and home by 6pm and that was a busy day.
      Media fail.

    25. Auld Rock says:

      Yip and Politics Scotland had 10 mins cut from its time this morning. Wonder if any rest of you suffered this problem yesterday. Radio 4’s Any Answers was changed to give over 45 mins to taking listeners views on Cameron’s so called deal. I tried to phone-in for the full 45 mins and only got constant engaged tone ans it seemed that all calls were from England with the one exception of a call from Bangor, Nth. Ireland. Anybody else experience this problem as it would seem calls from Scotland don’t count? That’s RESPECT for you.

      Auld Rock

    26. Bob Mack says:

      You would imagine that Scotland being top of the tree in dealing with A @E would be something every Scottish politician would be delighted and rightly proud about. Little us showing the way to the rest of the UK.

      In this area however,Labour et Al, prefer to spout absolute nonsense. No wonder NHS staff can feel unappreciated.
      They are the subject of lies,insinuation,and downright deception by Labour.

    27. Craig Murray says:

      It is an unending source of wonder to me that so many “journalists” get paid good money for simply cutting and pasting or voicing Labour press releases.

    28. call me dave says:

      @JLT
      further up says.
      ———————————————————-
      The greater world of politics that affects the British, European and even the Scottish arenas so much, and in so many ways, has at this very moment, thrown up such rich veins of information and news stories, which we have not seen since the Referendum of 2014 should be a journalists dream. To only come up with waiting times and ‘what Labour says’ is both laughable and contemptible.

      Scottish journalism …hold your head in shame.
      ————————————————————-
      I think that about sums it up!

    29. Jack Murphy says:

      Proud Cybernat said at 1:44 pm:-
      “And talking of which…

      SNPBAD – The Movie: http://tinyurl.com/jpjqlcr

      Spread far and wide, folks.”

      Will do,and it’s a great 12 minute film.

      It’s concluding Screenshot:-“Our very democracy is at stake. We must not allow the UK Corporate Media to subvert our democracy in this way”.

      My friends have stopped buying any newspapers,and not one is suffering withdrawl symptoms. 🙂

    30. Ken500 says:

      Brewer gumming on about Boris. SNP Stephen Gethin, ‘the Tories (in Scotland?) just got their worse results since 1864’. Brewer campaigning for 111WW. It’s laughable. FFS.

      EU arguments tying them in knots. Hypocrites.

    31. Sweep says:

      Of the six stories, only two might warrant a second glance.

      The other four identify the source in the headline.

      Instant bypass.

    32. ScottishPsyche says:

      Dr Simpson there, politics gain was no loss to psychiatry.

    33. Ken500 says:

      The UK is 14th on a Heathcare list. Netherlands is top. @ Telegraph. ‘Patient’s who are not dying are being told to go home by A & E Depts in England’.

    34. Liz White says:

      Why do they insist on banging the SNP bad drum when they know fine well it a big turn off and no one wants to listen anymore.

    35. Bob Mack says:

      Any mention of Bournemouth and Christchurch Hospitals intending to use eviction notices for elderly bed blockers? No? It is a true story.and is gathering approval from other hospital bosses down South.

      What do Labour think of that in comparison.?

    36. G H Graham says:

      Last Wednesday, I attended an outpatient appointment at PRI (Perth Royal Infirmary) by presenting myself to the reception desk at 9:30am, precisely as requested.

      By 9:32 I had made my way to the patient waiting area. At 9:33am the consultant dermatologist opened his door to invite me in for an examination. Yet I wasn’t even offered a Union friendly, Tunnock’s Tea Cake to help compensate for the wait.

      It’s this sort of chaos & indifference that will be the end of the NHS in Scotland.

      I now regret voting SNP & wish that I had instead, voted for Johann “Stairheid Rammy” Lamont’s party instead; the same party that has made fantastic progress in Wales, if you ignore the disproportionately long waiting times, with patients for example, waiting on average around 170 days for a hip or knee replacement compared to around 70 days in England and Scotland.

      Oh, and that Wales was the only nation in the UK with an annual reduction in rates of growth in cash terms between 2010 and 2013.

      Source: http://tinyurl.com/jn8w6fe

      Well apart from that, the NHS under Labour is probably great. Certainly not as bad as it might be under the Tories who seem to be determined to privatise much of the NHS in England.

      http://tinyurl.com/nau57m8

    37. Petra says:

      Strange that they’ve never found the time to publish this. Inform the Scots:

      ‘Scotland’s A&E the best in world – Sturgeon hits back on health record – January 29th, 2016 .’

      ‘NICOLA Sturgeon yesterday cited comments from a leading medical college saying the UK “has the best performing accident and emergency services in the world” and that Scotland “has the best performing A&E services in the United Kingdom” as she brushed off an attack from Kezia Dugdale on the state of the NHS north of the Border.’

      http://www.thenational.scot/news/scotlands-ae-the-best-in-world—sturgeon-hits-back-on-health-record.13026

    38. Hamish100 says:

      Certainly the term waiting lists rather than waiting times is used by the media. What a coincidence! Six times over.

      Could the authors of their pieces Scott MacNab, Mark Macaskill, Paula Murray, Press Association, stv, BBC Scotland Politics confirm the source of their articles that they appear to state as fact?

    39. Alan Crerar says:

      Can’t remember how many employees the NHS has in Scotland, but it will be quite a few.
      Quite a few potential customers the MSM are pissing off really really badly, because the Scottish Govt just providing some cash doesn’t make A&E better. It’s the people who work in A&E that make it better.
      And that’s quite a few voters who might be pissed off enough with this monstering by the Establishment to decide Independence is the only answer.

    40. heedtracker says:

      UKOK hacks at Pacific Quay and whatever quay the Record clown show performs at, have got to keep telling us Scotland and its people are shite at running Scotland, that it must be all left to our chums in the south, or at the very least hard core red and blue tory unionists.

      Ultimately it does make for better and better public services but it must really piss off everyone actually working in them. Maybe it doesnt. UK propaganda in Scotland’s getting more and more visceral so maybe news rooms like Pacific Quay are stuffed with red and blue tories all hugging each other, like the Alamo.

      SLab and Tory worked hand in hand BetterTogether Project Fearing the life out of Scotland 2014, so why are they fragmenting apart now? Surely its not for their bosses in London looking for fresh talent in Westminster and the Lords.

      http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2016/02/16/interview-ruth-davidson

      Its a UKOK carpet baggers dream.

    41. Petra says:

      The SCUM not reporting on this either? Mortality rate has dropped since we got rid of SLab. What’s Jackie Baillie saying about this?

      ‘Mortality rates for heart attacks and strokes are down.’

      ‘It’s official – the SNP Government is good for your health, or at least for those who might be prone to heart attacks and strokes.

      According to new independent health statistics published yesterday, death rates from heart disease and strokes have both fallen by a third since 2007 when the SNP first took the reigns of government.

      Since then, mortality rates for coronary heart disease have dropped by 36 per cent and death rates from strokes have fallen 33 per cent over the same period.

      Incidence rates for coronary heart disease have also fallen by 25 per cent since 2006-07 while incidence of cerebrovascular disease (CVD), of which stroke is one of the most common types, has fallen by 13 per cent over the same period.’

      http://www.thenational.scot/news/mortality-rates-for-heart-attacks-and-strokes-are-down.12926

    42. Thepnr says:

      All 6 articles highlighted above are not about A&E at all but the inference is that the Scottish Government are massaging the “true” A&E waiting times by having “secret” areas totally separate from A&E.

      These secret areas are where people referred directly to hospital by their GP attend for assessment.

      The point though is that why is this deemed such an important news today that 3 National newspapers headline it as a story when the exact same story was headlined 3 months ago in 3 different publications?.

      Truth is, as we know their is so little actual factual evidence of SG failings that the same old crap has to be repeated over and over.

      It’s known as brainwashing, it’s hard to avoid completely especially if you read Wings though I guess most reading here are immune.

      Under no circumstances though should you pay to read this guff in an actual newspaper. Unlikely you’d be brainwashed but you’d certainly be poorer.

    43. handclapping says:

      Ah but you don’t understand. All this other stuff is after the Holyrood elections and is about the constitution which we’ve been saying for ages the SNP should shut up about so its a bit awkward for us if we now have to start going on about the constitution. So we’ll keep our heads down and concentrate on Holyrood. Number 1 on everybody’s concerns is the NHS so we’ll bash the SNP on the NHS and hope.

      Also we haven’t had the line to take on the other stuff from dahn sarf yet. 🙁 Maybe tomorrow.

    44. JLT says:

      Seems today’s key story is actually Boris …and what way he is going to jump. This is actually rather interesting, not only because Boris himself is a bit of a conundrum, but also of his views. At times, there are perceptions of him when he contradicts with himself at times.

      Possibly today …is going to be one of those days.

      The BBC news seem to be hinting that Boris is going to jump in the ‘Out’ camp for the EU Referendum. Pro-EU supporters will have a field day if that is the case. Boris for the last decade has helped in the productions of The Dream of Rome and After Rome – Holy War and Conquest, along with a book called ‘The Dream of Rome’ in which time and again, he bangs the drum for having Turkey join the EU.

      If the BBC is right, then it explains why Boris has been so quiet; caught in a trap of his own making. His stance of advocating and denouncing Europe over not admitting Turkey to the EU will be seen as hypocrisy, especially if he now clamours for Britain leaving the EU at the same time.

      If Boris joins the ‘Out’ camp, then David Cameron will not only have one helluva fight on his hands trying to keep the UK in Europe, but the Tories will descend into literal civil war. Any of those Tory MP’s who were Eurosceptics will now stand and make themselves heard since they will have a man whom many of the Conservative party see a future PM and literally a demi-god to the establishment.

      For Scotland, Boris’s defection from Cameron and into the arms of Farage and Ian Duncan Smith will look like some perverse unholy Trinity. I suspect that many Scots who were maybe unsure about remaining in the EU, will now be forced to think twice when they see who champions the ‘Out’ camp. For those of us advocating Scottish Independence, this unholy trinity could be an asset to our cause. Slowly we are seeing a crystallization of the various groups and who supports them, and for most Scots, it will represent what they truly detest. If Boris, a possible future PM stands shoulder to shoulder with Nigel Farage, then it has all the connotations of Scottish Labour standing with the Tories in the Scottish Referendum. Would Scots really want to be tied to an England that has a future PM who ripped them right out of the heart of Europe …let alone having that same person once united with Farage and all the underlying elements of racism and bigotry that surround UKIP?

      Today could be a very interesting day …should Boris defects from his friend, the Prime Minister and joins a group perceived as anti-European, anti-Scottish and heartless to the core (when you include IDS).

    45. Legerwood says:

      When Labour were in power in Holyrood A&E statistics were gathered annually over a 4-7 day period, usually in April, from a core number of hospitals. It was not until June 2006 that the Labour-led SE started to gather A&E statistics on a more regular basis and from a larger number of hospitals. These stats were published quarterly. Perhaps Labour should be reminded of that – frequently.

      ScottishPsyche @ 2.42pm
      I believe Dr Simpson was a GP. He may have had a special interest in psychiatry just as he, together with some other GPs did some research on benign prostatic hyperplasia – old men peeing too much. He also came out in favour of minimum unit pricing of alcohol the back-tracked almost immediately.

    46. Ayeman says:

      In January 2016 The Royal College for Emergency Medicine published “Essential facts regarding A&E Services”.
      Fact no. 18 states “The UK has the best A&E performance in the world (measured by process indicators). Scotland has the best performance among the UK nations.”

      It’s got me right dumfoonert! Who to believe, the MSM or the RCEM experts in the field of A&E?

    47. Bob Mack says:

      @Alan Crerer,

      Over 153,000.

    48. HandandShrimp says:

      Once again the poverty of intellect, substance and integrity of the Scottish opposition and journalists manifests itself.

      I heard David Clegg on the radio talking about some story or other regarding Prestwick airport and Trump International. This gist seemed to be that there is no evidence of anything but wouldn’t it be great if there was. Just bizarre desperation if you ask me.

      However, just over 10 weeks to the election and we need to avoid any complacency and fight for every vote. The best riposte to this barrage of smear, accusation and fabrication is to win handsomely.

    49. Capella says:

      Dr John Robertson’s Media Watch over on Newsnet keeps a running comment on the “Scottish” broadcast media.

      ‘We know that some people (mental health sufferers) wait a long time in Scotland.’

      Go on guess who said that? I know it was easy – Eleanor Bradford, Health Correspondent, BBC Scotland. Was it true? Yes it probably was as far as it vaguely goes – ‘some people’, ‘a long time’ – but she then went on to state evidence-free that things were either better or usefully, unknown, about the rest of the UK .”
      http://newsnet.scot/?p=116464

      Of course, it isn’t Scottish at all but with few exceptions all media are London. or Yorkshire (Johnston Press?), or USA based. Only the Courier could be described as “Scottish”.

    50. Craig Murray says:

      JLT

      “Seems today’s key story is actually Boris …and what way he is going to jump.”

      Gazing out of my window at Salisbury Crags, that seems an attractive thought.

    51. Ken500 says:

      Boris’s grandfather was killed by Turkish nationalists. He did not support an independent Turkish State. Boris is a descendant of a European King – German State. He was born in the US and lived in Europe. His father was a EU diplomat? It will be strange if he campaigns for out. An opportunist?

      Fararge gets £Millions for the EU but campaigns to come out. He can’t get elected in the UK. Total hypocrite.

    52. JLT says:

      Craig Murray

      RE: Boris

      LOL. I suppose it does in that context.

    53. onelessday says:

      If it is possible to get RT’s Sputnik from yesterday it is worth watching A Dr will enlighten you as to how Blair and Brown set up NHS England to fail so that it could be privatised he goes through the whole shebang

    54. Ken500 says:

      Courier, P&J, EE are owned by D. C. Thompson – Unionist. Campaigned for NO.

    55. Legerwood says:

      Here is a reference for the A&E figures for April 2006 when figures were collected annually over a 3-7 day period. There are links within the page to PDF files showing the trends from 2004-06.

      http://www.isdscotland.org/Health-Topics/Emergency-Care/Emergency-Department-Activity/Statistics/Survey-2006.asp

    56. Effijy says:

      A & E- Antithesis & Esoteric.

      The UK Media are opposed to everything and anything connected to our duly elected SNP Government and they use these scare story headlines to fuel the rage within those who don’t have the knowledge to question their fanciful claims.

      I repeat again that Scotland has the most challenging circumstances to overcome in providing a national health service.

      We have the poorest diet, a history of alcohol alcohol abuse, and of course more remote and rural regions to be supported.

      Now that we can clearly see that NHS Scotland is the best performing UK Health service, and meeting all of their targets, the Westminster allies of misinformation must now accuse us of cheating and provide works of fiction to endorse their claims.

      After all how could these smelly socks possibly out perform
      the part privatised Tory and Labour controlled Health Services of England and Wales? It just wouldn’t be cricket!

    57. Bob Mack says:

      @Capella,

      Most patients with depressive illness and other conditions are originally treated by their GP. Only if the GP thinks there is a further possible issue,or a condition that requires other than purely medication will they onward refer to a Psychiatrist or Mental Health Unit.

      Where I worked patients about whom the GP expressed real concern would be seen within 24 hours.

      Routine GP referrals were seen within two weeks.

      This was the norm in most areas of Glasgow.

    58. I Clafrk says:

      Variation on old joke

      Guy meets a woman at a party. They get on well. She tells him she’s a journalist at a well known Scottish paper. Next day he meets her in street with an older man. Guy says “Hi”, but woman blanks him. He’s hurt. Next day he meets the woman again. Woman straight away says “I’m really sorry about blanking you yesterday. That was my dad. He doesn’t know I’m a journalist. He thinks I work in brothel”.

    59. heraldnomore says:

      and Boris comes out…

    60. Effijy says:

      Jack Murphy says:
      21 February, 2016 at 2:34 pm
      Proud Cybernat said at 1:44 pm:-
      “And talking of which…

      SNPBAD – The Movie: http://tinyurl.com/jpjqlcr

      Well Done to all connected with this video!
      It is the essence of our depraved and undemocratic Media.

    61. heedtracker says:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjFboRwGiqc

      Future PM Bojo in action. ‘A pound spent in Croydon is far more of value to the country than a pound spent in Strathclyde’

      “Indeed you will generate jobs in Strathclyde far more effectively if invest in Hackney and Croydon”

      Bit different from Crash Gordon’s red tory Pool and Share with Hackney and Croydon so vote NO 2014 but not that much.

      On balance, its going to be PM Osborne, if England votes Brexit and how bad could it get for UKOK toryboys in their Scotland region anyway.

      Blue tory sock puppets like Ruthie babes never get asked about this kind of toryboy UKOK pool and share, pumping hundreds of billions of Scotland’s money into the south east of teamGB, shock. And they get to dump their nukes next to Glasgow too.

    62. Petra says:

      O/T

      Thanks for the link Boris. Really interesting.

      Not only have we been paying more income tax per capita to the Treasury, over the last 34 years, than any other part of the UK we’re also subsidising rUK pensioners. To make matters worse subsidising them due to increased levels of deprivation in Scotland.

      ‘The UK has the worst state pensions in Europe: A study shows the state pays pensioners an income equivalent to just 17% of average earnings. The, “inadequacy” of the UK’s state pension system is, “beyond question”.

      This is the lowest level in Europe and well below the average for all European Union countries of 57%. Even the Netherlands, which has the second-lowest level, provides a state pension nearly double the UK figure, the study shows.’

      …………….

      ‘Mortality Rates and Pensions’

      ‘Up to the early 1950’s, Scottish mortality rates were broadly comparable with the rest of the UK. But from that time, (attributed to increased levels of deprivation) life expectancy in Scotland has hardly increased over a period of 60+ years.

      In England, (over the same period) rates steadily increased year on year and there is now a very significant gap in life expectancy between England & Scotland.

      Male pensioners (approximately 1 million) of affluent areas of London and the South East of England enjoy a life expectancy of approximately 80 years. Female life expectancy (similar in total) is approximately 84 years.

      In Scotland male life expectancy is approximately 72 years. Female life expectancy is approximately 78 years.

      Allow individual pension contribution payments, (through taxation) approximately £60,000, (assume 40 years @ £1500 per annum) are the same for all taxpayers.

      Maximum pension payments to male Scots. £6k x 7 years = £42K

      Maximum pension payments to male English. £6K x 15 years = £90K

      Maximum pension payments to female Scots. £4k x 13 years = £52K

      Maximum pension payments to male English. £6K x 19 years = £76K

      Summary: Scottish pensioners are heavily subsidizing pension payments of English pensioners.’

      …………….

      ‘Worrying Statistics’

      The Office of National Statistics provides, age expectancy for 2010-2012, ……….. the years most favourable to England;

      London and SE England: Males 80 years, Females 84 years.

      Glasgow and West of Scotland; Males 73 years Females 78 years.

      Babies born in Glasgow and West of Scotland that reach age 65 years; Males 73% Females 79%, (attrition rates much higher than those enjoyed by males and females in London and S/East England)

      Note-worthy is the fact that 27% of males and 22% of females in Glasgow and West of Scotland will contribute to a pension all of their working lives and get NOTHING in return by way of pension (Nice saving Mr Brown).

      Scotland is much worse off in the UK. Our people are dying much earlier than those in England and life expectancy for 25%+ of our children indicates they may not survive beyond age 65 years. A damming indictment of the so called fair and equal distribution of resources in the UK. Time we were out of it.’

      (Too bad the author didn’t outline the percentage of English pensioners who don’t live long enough to collect their pensions.)

      http://caltonjock.com/2016/02/21/scottish-state-pensions-rip-off-scots-nearing-retirement-who-voted-to-stay-with-the-union-read-this-and-weep/

    63. bugsbunny says:

      And people say we should be proud of our FREE press?

      A shower of hypocrites, liars, sycophants, propagandists, fantasists, tr@iters, backstabbing scum you will never find anywhere else. And the politicians who espouse the Union are worse.

      Stephen.

    64. Jack Murphy says:

      Back On Topic.
      The Daily Record on-line today:-
      “Nicola Sturgeon: Brexit vote ‘would trigger fresh Independence Referendum’ “.
      That’s another lie from Scotland’s Champion. 🙁

      The First Minister this morning did NOT say that!

      Capella at 3:25pm–Dr John Robertson’s Media Watch—-you beat me to it. Shucks. 🙁

      http://newsnet.scot/?p=116464

    65. Capella says:

      @ Bob Mack – I agree. What Dr Robertson was critcising was the vague language used to imply anything the BBC want. How many are “some people” and how long is “a long time” ? BBC are anything but journalists.

      @ Ken500 – I thought Johnston Press had been bought over the P&J and that JP head office was in Yorkshire. But Wikipedia has them based in London, or Edinburgh. WoS article in Feb 2014 mentions this confusion.
      http://wingsoverscotland.com/the-governors-of-opinion/

      EDIT: Several readers have suggested that Johnston Press is in fact a Scottish company. Wikipedia says its HQ is in London, but Companies House seems to indicate Edinburgh. If we attribute it to Scotland, that increases the “nationals” figure from 0% to a still-dismal 4%, and the total from 16% to 22%.”

    66. Thepnr says:

      Is it possible that today, The Sunday Times, Sunday Express and Scotland on Sunday all decided to regurgitate this 3 months old story independently of each other?

      So why are they running with this old news? More importantly who gives them the nod to get it published?

      There is it appears, a massive coordinated effort going on behind the scenes in the Corporate Media aiming to discredit the SNP.

      I doubt if this is being solely led by Labour but much more likely is in fact all three Unionist parties still working together in order that we remain Better Together.

    67. Petra says:

      O/T

      Sky reporting that 100 companies are signing a letter backing Cameron / staying in the EU ….. including BAE.

      Where have we heard that one before?

    68. sinky says:

      Attended minor injuries clinic this week. No appointment andll seen within 10 minutes.
      Very satisfied customer

    69. frogesque says:

      Boris joins OUT, that is, if dear old Aunty EBC can be believed.

    70. David Mills says:

      That’s not the tory way, clearly these “news”papers are overstuffed if they can’t find new story to wright or are short on column inches could there be a drop-off in advertising needed to be filled.
      Options
      clear out the hacks for real journalists
      Down size what postage stamp perhaps?

    71. Effijy says:

      Bozzo Boris must join the EU Exit brigade as he wants to be the next UK Prime Minister in 2020.

      Gideon will back up Cameron’s attempt to stay in as he will then be Cameron’s preferred successor to become PM in 2020.

      God help Scotland and the working classes of England >2020 !

    72. Petra says:

      O/T

      ‘The Ecks Files’

      ‘Showing the baseless attacks by the UK Corporate Media on the new 56 SNP MPs elected to Westminster in 2015. If you think you live in a democracy, think again. What you know is only what you are told. And what you are told is only what the Establishment want you to know. You believe what they want you to believe. Published on 20 Feb 2016.’

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-P4e3zLv1CU&feature=youtu.be&app=desktop

    73. Dr Jim says:

      O/T Couldn’t stop myself pointing out that today the whole of Scotland is subsidising English football on BBC 1 Scotland

      Not being a massive football fan myself
      but maybe some of the NO brigade might wonder where their TV licence money goes when they can’t get to watch their own Scottish teams for lack of BBC investment

      Better Together? only if you support English football

    74. Onwards says:

      @JLT says:

      “Today could be a very interesting day …should Boris defects from his friend, the Prime Minister and joins a group perceived as anti-European, anti-Scottish and heartless to the core (when you include IDS).”
      ——–

      Boris is thinking first about his chances of becoming PM, leapfrogging George Osborne. This is an all or nothing move.

      There seems to be an arrogant attitude that enough Scots still wouldn’t vote for independence after a Brexit. Not so sure about that. The thought of being dragged out of Europe and lorded over by Boris ‘Pound in Croydon’ and a bunch of braying little Englanders for years to come is a grim prospect.

      IndyRef 2 would be as much about dignity and self-respect as the economy. Getting dragged out of Europe could be the last straw for many.. alongside a poor Scotland bill that gradually penalises the Scottish budget.
      If oil prices stay low, we may be slightly worse off for the first few years of independence, even allowing for all the savings we will make, but we have far better long term potential than as a regional feeder zone for London.

      And all the Brexit arguments will be flung back in their face.
      Vote YES, Take Control.

    75. Janet says:

      I suppose that the Forth Road Bridge inquiry wasn’t coming up with the goods.

    76. Thepnr says:

      @Capella

      The P&J is definitely owned by DC Thomson, bought in 2006 from the Daily Mail and General Trust.

    77. Capella says:

      @ Dr Jim
      Munguin’s Republic has a little red card that breaks down the licence fee and how it’s spent. Very different to the assertions of the “expert” on call Kaye this week.

      https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-eGpY0iBPM8Y/VsNPLlG94jI/AAAAAAAAcNM/dv1GxH8yrXQ/s1600/bbc.jpg

    78. Capella says:

      @ Thepnr
      Thnx – I’m not keeping up with mergers and acquisitions!

    79. MerkinScot says:

      What an exciting Summer is in store!
      World Cup Willie will make us all happy, to boot.

    80. thomaspotter2014 says:

      O/T sorry

      JLT@3.08

      RE= Boris.

      Did you know that Turkey are now bussing fighters of the Islamist group Ahrer Al-Sham from Kilis in Turkey to Azaz in Syrian Kurdish
      Front line zone to attack the YPG which effectively means US are now at war with themselves by proxy.

      Still as long as weapon sales are on the up huh?

    81. JLT says:

      Onwards

      Boris is thinking first about his chances of becoming PM, leapfrogging George Osborne. This is an all or nothing move.

      I can see what you are saying, Onwards, but I believe it runs deeper than that. I don’t believe its that black and white.

      Boris is one of David Cameron’s best friends. Boris was a prefect for David when they both attended Eton. They have known each other, and been in each others company since they were basically, young boys.

      Make no bones about it; Boris will feel terrible. This is his friend that he is literally betraying. God knows what conversations the two men have had with each other in the last 24 hours. Many would have loved to have been a fly on the wall.

      Boris is a genius. An extremely intelligent, highly educated, politically aware genius. David less so. Clever and aware …but way out of Boris’s league.

      What has just happened, is going to send seismic shockwaves through the Conservative Party. This is no longer two men, who are friends, standing in opposing camps over one issue. This in reality, as you say Onwards, is about the future. This is now a fight where very possibly, one of them is about to see their political career come to a very abrupt end.

      The Tories will now fall into two camps. This is no longer in one sense about ‘In’ or ‘Out’; it’s about ‘David’ or ‘Boris’. Should Cameron fail, and the UK leaves the EU, then David will have to resign, and Boris, most likely, will become Prime Minister. If it’s the other way about, Boris will probably be exiled into the political wilderness for a few years, and in that sense, may never truly return. A man and his destiny never fulfilled.

      And how does this affect Scotland. Well, in many ways. As I stated above, Scots will now see Boris link up with Nigel Farage and Ian Duncan Smith; two men that Scots dislike intensely. Boris, being an enigma to Scots, may have just painted himself black by joining the ‘Out’ campaign. Scots will also take all of this onboard in their own way. How would they view a future Britain if it is outside Europe; led by a man who betrayed his friend; a man who stood with men considered ruthless, racist and bigoted, and loves London so passionately, that he sees it as city-state with the rest of Britain only being there to be taxed so that the great city can thrive further.

      That is what Scots will have to ask themselves of Boris.

      This day, may be a day …that shaped Britain’s future.

    82. Valerie says:

      Boris is for out.

      It’s hetting up.

    83. Inverclyder says:

      Turns out nothing has changed in 30 years….

      Billy Bragg – It Says Here

      It says here that the Unions will never learn
      It says here that the economy is on the upturn
      And it says here we should be proud
      That we are free
      And our free press reflects our democracy

      Those braying voices on the right of the House
      Are echoed down the Street of Shame
      Where politics mix with bingo and tits
      In a strictly money and numbers game

      Where they offer you a feature
      On stockings and suspenders
      Next to a call for stiffer penalties for sex offenders

      It says here that this year’s prince is born
      It says here do you ever wish
      That you were better informed
      And it says here that we can only stop the rot
      With a large dose of Law and Order
      And a touch of the short sharp shock

      If this does not reflect your view you should understand
      That those who own the papers also own this land
      And they’d rather you believe
      In Coronation Street capers
      In the war of circulation, it sells newspapers
      Could it be an infringement
      Of the freedom of the press
      To print pictures of women in states of undress

      When you wake up to the fact
      That your paper is Tory
      Just remember, there are two sides to every story

    84. Valerie says:

      @JLT

      Not disagreeing with any of your analysis, but Cameron was always on his way out, he said so last year.

      Boris has been plotting since then, it’s why he went into the HoC, last year.

      The only thing that’s happened really, if Brexit happens, the Dave goes off to the pig farm a couple of years earlier. He will still walk into lots of lucrative swanning about jobs.

      Boris, on the side of Farage and Galloway, and his own, of course.

    85. Jimbo says:

      Same old singers, same old songs.

      Why do they bother employing these so-called journalists?

      Why don’t they just change the date on last year’s Labour/Tory Party press releases and republish them? Because that’s all they ever serve up anyway.

    86. Inverclyder says:

      So we could have Prime Minister Boris and President Trump!

      Don’t see anything going wrong with that!

      Stop the world I want to get off.

    87. JLT says:

      Valerie says:

      @JLT

      Not disagreeing with any of your analysis, but Cameron was always on his way out, he said so last year.

      Yes, I agree. But David was going to leave on a high. A two term Prime Minister having saved the British Union by keeping Scotland in the fold and seen the ending of both the Labour and Liberal Democrat parties. A man who rescued and secured a Conservative Party for the very foreseeable future. A man who kept the UK in the EU.

      Now …it could all be ashes.

    88. Fireproofjim says:

      Boris is for leaving the EU.
      Throwing his hat in the ring for future PM.
      I think this must be good for Independence.

    89. Thepnr says:

      @JLT

      Good post and I read earlier today about the friendship and rivalry between Johnson & Cameron all the way back to Eton.

      We do know they were Bullingdon Boys together as the infamous picture shown. We are also led to believe that they are still good friends. So what’s the script?

      I believe most commentators say the next leader of the Tories and likely PM will be either Johnson, Osborne or May. If the Out campaign won without Johnson as a supporter then who likely to take over from Cameron?

      IDS or Gove also from the Out campaign? can’t see it so maybe Johnson is in the Out camp just to cover all bases.

      If the In camp wins, Cameron stays to be later replaced by Osborne or May. The Out camp wins, then Cameron goes to be replaced by Johnson.

      Possibly Johnson has nothing to lose at all in the event of Cameron staying if the In crowd (get it) win and then before the next GE he announces he would support Johnson as his successor?

      Just having a laugh about the Ins and Outs as to be fair I don’t have a freakin clue and neither do I think has anyone else, except possibly the Tory inner circle.

      In Out In Out, shake it all about 🙂

    90. Calum McKay says:

      Have these journalists no shame?

      Or do they pick up the pay cheque and the paper’s owners print the news, their name gets placed against lies and misinformation masquerading as news and the journalists go along with it with varying degrees of reluctance?

      And,………………..Scotland gets shafted!

    91. Daisy says:

      Would really appreciate if you could give my blog post a read on Cameron’s decision to hold EU Referendum in June:
      https://daisycollinsblog.wordpress.com/2016/02/20/cameron-disrespects-scotland/

    92. Dan Huil says:

      The bottom of the britnat barrel has been scraped so much that New Zealanders are covered in wood chippings.

    93. X_Sticks says:

      Shortage of popcorn forecast for the next four months.

      This could get interesting. A complete british establishment bun fight on an epic scale.

      It could mean even more pain for Scotland in the short term but ultimately I think it brings independence a step closer.

    94. Robert Peffers says:

      YAWN!

    95. Valerie says:

      @JLT

      The only part I do slightly disagree with, is the part about the two men being friends.

      I have no doubt they are friends since boarding school, but it’s an entirely different kind of friendship to how we might view a relationship.

      Their school background breeds them for stardom, to lead, to move in the upper echelons. It’s not a place for sentimentality, when it comes to your personal goals, and taking what is rightfully yours.

      From what I’ve watched of Boris, he is a great white shark. Even today, the interview was timed, and performed to perfection. He is a huge fan of Churchill, after all.

      As I previously sad, Boris would have been studying relevant polls, will know Cameron came back with Scotch Mist, and his saying he won’t take part in debates – haha.

    96. Kenny says:

      Is not the whole EU ref campaign depressingly UKOK?

      All these male politicians — Cameron, BoJo, Farage, Galloway, IDS.

      Say what you like about Dugdale and Tank Ruth, but it feels a lot more normal to have women playing a prominent role in Scottish politics.

      By definition, how can UKOK politics be the right politics when they are dominated by men – and such odious men as well!

    97. Famous15 says:

      Boris Johnson yesterday said he would “come off the fence with deafening eclat” so his mind was obviously made up before today.

      Not so bonkers Boris is however very toxic in Scotland . He has insulted Scotland frequently but the reality is we mean nothing to him. It suited his purpose to shaft us but he cares not a jot so long as his own ambitions are served.

      Nicola Sturgeon today in contrast repeated a performance which we all should be proud. She is a world class stateswoman.

    98. Giving Goose says:

      The EU ref campaign is nothing but a long interview for the next Tory Prime Minister.

      Labour and The LibDums have walked into a massive trap. Fools.

      Remain or exit?

      Cameron or Boris as PM?

      It’s now time for Nicola to start dictating the script.

    99. Thepnr says:

      Johnson after announcing his support for the Outers has just become the bookies favourite as the next PM.

      Neoconservatives wetting themselves. What can it all mean LOL.

      https://archive.is/mpuMD

    100. Bob Mack says:

      TRUMP as President
      JOHNSON as PM.

      Anybody renting rooms in your nuclear bunker?

    101. Cuilean says:

      Throughout history, canny people in power (usually ruling families/ churches) planted a son or daughter on one side, in a power struggle, and another son or daughter on the opposing side.

      Whoever won, the continuing vested interest of the family/church was secured.

      Today the Tories ensured that whatever the EU result, their party will be strongly affiliated with or deemed ‘the winner’.

      Dave wins, the Tories win. Boris wins, the Tories win.

    102. Macart says:

      @X_Sticks

      Ran out of popcorn last night.

      Close to panic and had to resort to the emergency stash of choccy raisins. 😮

    103. Effijy says:

      You put your Right Wing In.
      Your Right Wing Out,
      In, out, in, out,
      These snakes are all about.

      You do the Hokey Cokey and you make a £Pound
      Scaremonger, Fear, and Shout!

      Woah, you should be in the Poaky
      Woah, your voices will go croaky
      Woah you’re having a Joke, Eh

      Tories Bent, Funds Stretched, Ha Ha Ha

    104. Marie Clark says:

      I well recall during the run up to the referedum a conversation I had with a few no voting farmers. I asked the questions of these nawbags, ” what happens if No wins, and we are taken out of the EU, and Boris get to be PM. They just laughed at me,”naw, naw that’ll never happen”.

      Well it looks as if they’re worst nightmare might not be too far off, eh.

      Ye gods, we might even get Trump as POTUS. God help us all then.

    105. Gary45% says:

      One things for sure ever since the “how now Brown VOW”,
      the establishment media has sunk to depths even deeper than something that’s really deep.(Gutter press every one of them)
      So odd ball has joined the out campaign, I must say I have been riddled with anxiety for weeks over his decision?!?!
      Now I know where he stands I can truly now focus on believing every word the Tory says!!!!!.
      Next it will “Celebrity Prime Minister” on the EBC, vote for your favourite TIT.(not the porno variety).
      Speaking of tits, Trump is on the I-player at the moment, sounds like an old Nuremberg rally meeting, “SCARY”.

      On a recent post, someone mentioned the collective for the Brexits, here is a suggestion Brextars taken from the Scottish soup company who I am sure will be in a bit of a panic if we come out of the EU.

      Then again they sided with the Yoonies in the Indy Ref, they made their bed .

    106. HandandShrimp says:

      Hadn’t realised that Boris and Gove could pull almost half the Tory party in their wake.

      Interesting times indeed.

    107. mike cassidy says:

      Those echoes from the Referendum campaign keep on coming..

      Here’s a tasty quote from one of the brexit sites.

      http://eureferendum.com/

      scroll down to

      EU Referendum: Papering Over The Lies (20 feb)


      Nor should we assume that the Brussels barons will treat us kindly if we vote to remain in the EU. They will brush aside future British protests, telling us that we have had our chance to do things our way and rejected it. Our prospects sitting uneasily on the margins of the emerging superstate will not be promising. Unloved, ignored and marginalised, we face an uncertain, even risky future, on the outskirts of the new European empire.

    108. Andy-B says:

      Tommy Sheppard getting the #SNPBAD treatment from the filthy unionist press.

      http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/646027/Edinburgh-East-MP-probe-parliamentary-watchdogs

    109. Thepnr says:

      @Effigy

      Hahaha, lovely ditty, very pretty, Boris Johnson is a feckin Twit.

      @Macart

      Just don’t go looking for any Bourbon Biscuits, I hear on the grapevine they are in very short supply.

    110. Valerie says:

      @Marie Clark

      I was wondering about those farmers for BT, although I know some support independence.

      Remember Cameron getting whisked in to speak to the CBI, and their issue in supporting him, was not to be taken out of EU.

      I reckon there will be a lot of No voters in the farming and business sector biting their hands tonight!

    111. Gary45% says:

      Marie Clark@6.24.
      Regarding the farmers, it will still be SNP baaad as far as the farmers go.
      I saw the cover of a News!!?? paper in Elgin yesterday which had Richard Lochhead on the cover, with a heading, more or less blaming him for the farming crisis.
      Westminster has screwed Scotland’s farmers for years regarding subsidies.
      The last time I was in London I never saw any farms, but I am sure London will get more of the Subsidy than Scotland, because after all”we’re all better together”.

    112. K1 says:

      Andy B, don’t give them the clicks: archive the unionist press:

      https://archive.is/6a4TC

    113. Nana says:

      I do worry for the future especially regards Trump. That man is not fit to lead a singsong never mind a nation.

      I have watched foreign news for the last few days and the UK is a laughing stock.
      If we are taken out of the EU the tories will run amok, anyone thinking they can’t be any worse than at present is deluded.

      Bozo the clown, IDS & Osborne what a nightmare.

      Please vote SNPx2

    114. heedtracker says:

      BBC r4 teatime propagandists really like future PM Bojo buts like time travelling UKOK style back to 2014, with ProjectFear getting repeated verbatim. Cameron’s says vote EU, safe, secure, pool, share, leap into the UK only dark would be disaster. Then IDS says, exact same UKOK stuff but only if UK dont Brexit. BBC hack simpers away, Bojo is a really great politician across the UK. I think she used influential or maybe galvanising or was it unifying and does it matter, no.

      One things for sure, the campaign is entirely English from now on, at the BBC.

    115. Thepnr says:

      @Marie Clark Valerie Gary45%

      There will be no more EU subsidies after a Brexit. Do you think Westminster will continue subsidies for Scottish farmers if this arises? LOL

      Not a hope in hell, won’t affect the tenant farmers they got nothing anyway, only the landowners who almost all were for a NO.

      They will reap what they sowed.

    116. mike cassidy says:

      Right then, constitutional scholars in our midst.

      Remember the referendum lock.

      Has the pigfancier brought back anything in his eu deal that requires a referendum independent of the in/out referendum.

      Are we heading for a state of referenda fatigue?

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_Act_2011

    117. Marie Clark says:

      Aye Valerie, you’re quite right,there will be a lot of NO voting farmers biting their hands tonight. They are now counting on us on the YES side, to save their bacon, it you’ll pardon the pun.

      We did try, and try very hard to tell these NO voters what would happen, to absolutely no avail. It seems now they hope that we yessrs will prove to be their saviour. Ican see the funny side to this, but I think my main reaction is BOAK.

      The very thought of being on the same side as David Cameron gives me the heebie jeebies. Urgh.

    118. Nana says:

      From the FT re brexit. A no voting donor of Bettertogether

      https://twitter.com/scarycath/status/701474988390490112?lang=en-gb

    119. HandandShrimp says:

      Andy-B

      A Westminster insider said: “Tommy seems like a nice enough bloke but the rules are the rules. With the Scottish elections and the EU referendum coming up, voters who go to the comedy festival deserve to know that it is run by a politician.”

      I loved this bit. There can’t be many in the comedy going circuit that don’t know who Tommy is or that he is in the SNP.

      It does seem to be a concerted effort on the part of the Unionist press. I am not sure they are aware exactly how repellent they are though. I don’t see stories like this and doubt the SNP I just despise the Unionist journalists that little bit more…..yes I am all the way up to 11 🙂

    120. bugsbunny says:

      heraldnomore@3.39,

      “and Boris comes out…”.

      Ok. But what’s his position on Europe? 😉

      Stephen.

    121. yesindyref2 says:

      Yes, I thknk the NHS is disgusting too. The doctor having said I had osteo-arthritis in my knee rather than the injury I’d thought I must have, phoned up the hospital and told me to make my way there when I could.

      Went homw, had a cup of tea dondered off to the hospital, was getting a bit late by then, asked reception where X-ray was while still walking (kind of hobbling), checked in, told to go to the X-ray waiting area.

      Didn’t even have time to sit down, absolutely disgusting, no idea what magazines they had there. So yes it was osteo-arthritis.

      At home, phoned the “back to work” helpline for small businesses, got an appointment in a couple of days. Just needed the one to tell me “Yes, rest for 24 hours, but then exercise”, and suggest exercises to strengthen.

      Because of the work I have to do as part of the business I get to stand around a lot working, so rather than the suggested exercises asked her if it was OK to dance on the spot to the radio, and after a bit of a strange look and a laugh was told yes. Luckily I do this work on my own!

      2 years ago, no problems since, though I do take 7 seas joint care active with chondrotin every day. It should be on prescription, the usual plain packet I guess.

      So instead of having to beg IDS to consider me disabled, I’ve been a functioning ant in society for 2 years and hope to stay that way! Last 2 days doing an intense stand on the spot job, not a twinge in sight. My dancing days are not over! It’s funny how you get used to dancing with the legs and doing precise work with the hands, all the same. Must look really really weird.

      The SNP are talking about moving more resources to primary care, I agree. Instant access for all to a physiotherapist at least for one single visit (was all I needed), patient originated access to dietician (not for me I hasten to add), and please, add chloriditin or whatever, to the free prescription list.

    122. Capella says:

      Re farm subsidy, Dr John Robertson referred to an article which argues that it is the big landowners who cream off hundreds of thousands of pounds which they use to buy more land. £60 – 90 per acre. Tax free.

      The more land you own, the bigger the subsidy.

      Small tenant farmers often don’t get any payments.

      http://tlio.org.uk/the-problem-with-the-common-agricultural-policy-tlio-information-briefing/

    123. JLT says:

      Just watched Boris speaking to the media. Everything that Boris said about Europe was spot on. When he talked about the governance of the EU and how it had become to bureaucratic and lost its sense of democracy. Once again …spot on.

      However, where Boris was wrong, was on the stance that he has just taken, and joined the ‘Out’ camp. If Boris wants to change the EU, then the UK needs to be in it. There are politicians such as Angela Merkel and the Danish Prime Minister, Lars Løkke Rasmussen who also have spoken of their dis-satisfaction over the way the EU is run. What Boris and Co should have done, is grouped together and fought for change from within. It is this position of standing with the ‘Out’ camp that Boris has made a mistake …and a big one at that.

      And though David Cameron has taken the right stance of arguing for the UK to remain in the EU, the arguments that he has presented are actually the wrong ones. Cameron, selfishly, sought to have rules changed that would not only give Britain in its own set of packages, but that the other nations recognised that it was a ‘special status’ that Britain has with the EU.

      Two Tories …one right on stance, but wrong on argument, the other wrong on stance, but right on argument. Both blinded and united together on the only principle that matters most; that Britain is the greatest nation in the world, and that it must not be part of Europe.

      It makes you wonder how all of this …is truly going to end.

    124. ScottishPsyche says:

      @Legerwood 3.16p.m.

      Dr Simpson was dual trained. Started off as a GP but worked as an Addictions Consultant in Psychiatry at the same time as working in Holyrood. Easier to do it that way round than specialise first and then do GP training.

      He is somewhat out of step with the current way of thinking wrt minimum pricing. Always a consummate politician.

    125. John from Fife says:

      So Boris wants Brexit. I hope the SNP are not putting all their Indy 2 Referendum eggs in ONE basket !!

    126. Capella says:

      In another article the website spells out the background to CAP. It is us, UK taxpayers who fund it, not the EU.

      “WHO PAYS – HOW MUCH- WHO GETS WHAT- WHY?
      CAP is not funded by EU but out of UK taxes and costs the British taxpayer £3.8 to £4billion in 2009. This is an increase of 23 per cent over 2008 and in 2010 will increase again, and in 2011.

      Some 80% of UK citizens live in urban settings. Some 99% of UK citizens own no bulk land and do not qualify for CAP payments.
      From their taxes, moistly income tax, these non qualifiers fund CAP, and this is largely unknown to them.”

      http://tlio.org.uk/cap-welfare-for-the-rich-landownerscorporations/

    127. Bill Hume says:

      We live in interesting times. I’m not too worried, personally, whether we remain in the EU or not. One battle at a time will do me. I’ll be voting to stay and hope Scotland votes likewise, hoping that the rest of the UK voted to leave. Then we can have indiref2 and rid ourselves of Westminster.

      One battle at a time……SNP x 2……..then onward.

    128. Legerwood says:

      “”ScottishPsyche says:
      21 February, 2016 at 7:32 pm
      @Legerwood 3.16p.m.

      Dr Simpson was dual trained. Started off as a GP but worked as an Addictions Consultant in Psychiatry at the same time as working in Holyrood. Easier to do it that way round than specialise first and then do GP training.

      He is somewhat out of step with the current way of thinking wrt minimum pricing. Always a consummate politician.””

      To say he is out of step with current thinking on minimum pricing is a bit of an understatement. That he still continues his opposition to it in light of the recent evidence about alsohol consumption is quite incredible.

      As you say ‘a consummate politician’

    129. Petra says:

      @ Valerie says at 5:35 pm ….. ”JLT …. The only part I do slightly disagree with, is the part about the two men being friends. I have no doubt they are friends since boarding school, but it’s an entirely different kind of friendship to how we might view a relationship.”

      From all accounts a massive rift has formed between Cameron and Johnston mostly due to Osborne (and May) being involved in dirty tricks; in turn influencing Cameron. Osborne has been handing out ‘favours’ to key people in an attempt to undermine Johnston’s ability to win the leadership election, when that time comes.

      So we have the Labour Party totally divided, ineffectual and in disarray and the Tories stabbing each other in the back. Next fascist Leader? Osborne, Johnston or May? Take your pick. One worse than the other.

      What a mess this country is in. Can’t wait to get out. Keeping my fingers crossed for a Brexit followed by Sexit.

      http://capx.co/immigration-brexit-and-sexit/

    130. heraldnomore says:

      Presumably Boris too has been at the porkies

    131. Thepnr says:

      Tongue in cheek 🙂

      June 24th 2016

      It’s 07:00 and I’m standing opposite the door of 10 Downing Street awaiting the emergence of the Prime Minister after last nights monumental result.

      The fact that the turnout failed to reach 50% is of no matter, the people have spoken.

      Wait a minute, yes, looks like the door is opening, here he is, stepping out into the street and up to the lectern. It’s pandemonium here and I can barely hear myself. Wait, wait the Prime Minister is calling for hush and the assembled world press has gone quiet.

      (Whispers) You could hear a pin drop here now, lets here what Mr Cameron has to say.

      “Last night the people of Britain sent a message, a clear message that today will resonate around the world”

      “You, the people of this proud country have expressed your view and I am proud of you.”

      “You had a difficult choice, but without flinching you made that choice.”

      “I will today, be resigning as leader of the Conservative Party of Great Britain and there will be an election as soon as possible for a new leader.”

      “I would like to congratulate the winners of the Out campaign on their fine victory and in particular, my friend Boris Johnson on how he achieved this great victory for him and his supporters”

      “This in fact is also a victory for the entire UK”

      “I will not be taking any questions, thank you”

      So there we have it, as expected the Prime Minister has resigned leaving the door open for Johnson, Osborne or May as new leader of the Conservatives and next Prime Minister. Back to the studio in Glasgow.

      “Alex Salmond what do make of the Prime Ministers speech?”

      “Well..what more could he have said? He lost, so very gracefully fell on his sword. It’s to be expected”

      What about his possible successor as Prime Minister, who might it be? You have heard the contenders.

      “It looks to me that in his speech there he endorsed his good friend Boris Johnson. I expect Boris to emerge victorious just as he has today. Let’s face it, not much of a choice eh (wee grin)”

      We know Scotland overwhelmingly voted to remain in the EU but now you have been dragged out. Do you believe that might make a difference if there is to be another Independence Referendum?

      “Fuck Aye!”

      “(Inaudible mumble) Oh pardon me, coughed there (big grin)”

    132. Ken500 says:

      Will more porky tales come out? Comedy Gold.

    133. Ian Brotherhood says:

      As someone else mentioned here fairly recently, the Bullingdon Boys’ supporters are closing ranks.

      Last year I posted a link to this documentary, which was on YT in three 10-mmin chunks. I distinctly remember ‘chatting’ to someone here about it. As you can see from the following link, the film is still available but the audio has been scrapped, replaced by dodgy music. It was of particular interest because it explored the relationship between Bojo and the Pig-Botherer.

      I’m not even sure how one would go about tampering with material in this way, but it’s been done.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jra3By2DCic

    134. Valerie says:

      @Thepnr

      Made me smile, but it’s what I’m hoping for!

      I have to admit to feeling guilt about the poor of England and Wales, because under PM Bojo, rUK under Cameron, will be remembered as the halcyon days.

      However being pragmatic, if this is our opportunity, we must grab it, for the sake of the poor, and the young of this country.

      I would fully expect the SNP to be quietly revisiting/updating the White Paper, and being battle ready for Brexit taking us out. They have a lot on their plate!

    135. yesindyref2 says:

      @Capella
      That’s an anti-CAP website so I’d be very wary about it. CAP is paid by the EU to member states to pay out to whoever, but like all EU funds is funded by the EU states. So indirectly yes taxpayers fund the EU, therefore CAP, therefore the recipients, but it’s indirect, as in the first instance it’s the EU decides how much each member state gets in total.

      http://farmsubsidy.openspending.org/GB/

      “€295.5 billion in payments to 23110639 recipients, including all the payments from 2013”

      Recipients include wealthy landowners and realtivevly poor farmers, poor working crofters and those who send all day in the pub. It is being reformed I think, bit by bit.

    136. Rock says:

      Many in Scotland are not too keen on the EU.

      But supporters of independence voting in Scotland should vote to remain in. Those voting in rest of UK should vote to get out.

      If a clear majority in Scotland votes to remain in but the overall vote is to get out, there will be another independence referendum sooner rather than later, which Yes will most likely win.

      My preferred outcome is for Scottish Yes votes to tip the balance in favour of remaining while England votes narrowly to exit.

      The right wing press and the likes of Farage will fall over themselves to make Scotland leave the UK, debt free, keep sterling if you want, Shetlands are yours.

      It will be the best revenge Scotland could have got in its 300 years plus as a “sovereign” colony.

    137. Valerie says:

      Can you imagine how welcome Scotland will be made in the EU, if there is a Brexit?

      We will be very popular! I’m sure the farms, fisheries, business sectors will be seeing a big advantage to that popularity.

      That link Petra posted by capx, also posits that a Brexit will be made painful by the EU, can’t see it being made easy, due to rancour, and no procedures.

    138. Clootie says:

      Rock

      Why do you need to make such idiotic remarks as. “…Shetland are yours”.
      Try thinking while typing.

    139. Dr Jim says:

      Well that’s the EU Referendum over and done with according to the media and we can just get on with the really important subject of choosing the next leader of the Tory Reich

      Will it be Cambo, Bojo, or even Osbo
      Runners and riders to be announced later so the rest of us, the people who are supposed to count can just go and take a flying Fukc our bit is totally not worth bothering about

      Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland just became an irrelevance now that the English media have got what they want, a personality shootout

      This whole fiasco has now turned into a great big TV soap opera, headlines titles and all with as many celebrity endorsements on both sides as can be found and every nonentity SPAD, and alive and dead “Journalist” debating who they like best and screw the result

      What was supposed to be the peoples vote is now, in big letters across our screens and print media

      “ENGLAND DECIDES” Epic, Churchillian, Thatcher would have,
      John Major, what’s the betting they even dig up Edward Heath not literally
      What will happen to Britain on exit? who cares

      England will take back “CONTROL”….. Cue the music…and make it deafening

    140. John from Fife says:

      I posted
      this earlier :So Boris wants Brexit. I hope the SNP are not putting all their Indy 2 Referendum eggs in ONE basket !!
      Also we are being told that the Scottish Government are keen to find a solution to the Fiscal Framework situation.
      Do we have plans for a second referendum after all.In the good old days an SNP majority which we have at Westmonster would have been enough for Independence or am I missing something ??

    141. Rock says:

      Valerie,

      “I would fully expect the SNP to be quietly revisiting/updating the White Paper”

      With hindsight, I think the SNP White paper was a big mistake.

      The SNP would not necessarily be in power in independent Scotland.

      The referendum should only be on a Yes or No vote, with full political independence within six months of a Yes vote.

      Followed the next day by a general election where the various parties can present their manifestos for running an independent Scotland.

    142. gordoz says:

      The Scotsman & Journalism ?

      Put me in mind o’ this

      Monty Python – Kamikaze Scotsmen : Apt No ?

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Es0t50H44IE

    143. Rock says:

      Clootie,

      “Rock

      Why do you need to make such idiotic remarks as. “…Shetland are yours”.
      Try thinking while typing.”

      I was only making the point that the unionists will not bang on about the Shetlands wanting independence from Scotland as they did during the referendum.

      What is idiotic about it anyway? The Shetlands are part of Scotland aren’t they?

    144. John from Fife says:

      The Rock is correct. The Gas is West of Shetland not Scottish according to the media.

    145. Capella says:

      @ Ian Brotherhood – I posted the link to the Bullingdon boys video then found last year that the audio had been obliterated. Not only that but also the subtitles. I too wondered how that was possible. The person who uploaded it could just have removed it. So how can one scramble the audio on youtube videos?

    146. Valerie says:

      Rock,

      I think that is just a nonsensical recipe for disaster. There needs to be some kind of structured continuity for governance, and the SLEW of new relationships, contracts, agreements, services to set up a new country.

      I’m all for a GE, once the country has the basic skeleton in place. I’m well aware it may not be a SNP government, but there is NO party but them suited to the job.

    147. Thepnr says:

      @John from Fife

      Guessing you’ve strayed onto the wrong site if you take what the media say as gospel.

    148. John from Fife says:

      Thepnr says:

      21 February, 2016 at 8:57 pm

      @John from Fife

      Guessing you’ve strayed onto the wrong site if you take what the media say as gospel
      Conspiracy Theories. I only read the National. But I can think independently.

    149. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @Capella –

      It might be more feasible that the original three-parter was deleted completely and replaced with these inferior quality copies with crap audio which no-one is going to watch.

      In any event, it stinks.

      Mind you, it’s worth having a swatch at some of the other ‘related’ links which pop-up on the side – in the wake of Pig-gate, the ‘lady of the night’ who knew Gideon made some revelations about the BB’s and their treatment of pigeons which I won’t even try to describe. (I’m sure you’ll know what I’m on about…)

      The idea that our lives can be dictated, even in part, by such rancid ‘human beings’ is just intolerable. Sometimes I really wish I’d been born in another time and place…

      Seriously – we can’t have a civilised square-go with opponents who are so damaged and sick. They are sociopaths, and we, as far as they are concerned, are worthless scum who deserve a sound thrashing for even daring to raise our pathetic voices.

    150. Effijy says:

      Has anyone considered the ordinary non-UK European Citizen and
      how they must perceive the Joke “Awards” they gave to Cameron?

      They must think of the UK like an annoying child who you finally conceded to by promising something, but at some undefined juncture in the future, just to get some peace.

      It satisfies them, and you know that they are not getting anything down the line, even if they can remember what they had originally wanted.

      You stick their very poor scrawl on your Fridge door to encourage then that they are wonderful and Special.

      Europeans will know that the UK political party that had shown any form of internal unity has imploded, and that the party who beat the Scots to death with “Better Together” is now promoting that we are Better Alone??

      What will they make of our next Prime Minister-Bozo the Bumbling Bullingdon Bully Boy, who knows neither how to comb his hair or what size he takes in a suit?

      The UK really are the leading nation of all things comical.

      Mr & Mrs Euro must be ready to throw them out and lock the door!

    151. Robert Peffers says:

      Our NHS is wonderful. I had a fall a week or so back. I didn’t lose consciousness or anything like that. I have occasional balance problems and I just fell down. There really is nothing the medics could do.

      However, someone phoned emergency and two paramedics were there in less than five minutes.

      Even allowing for the distance to the ambulance station that is great service in anyone’s language. We should all be proud of these heroes. I know I am.

    152. In regards the EU Referendum,

      June should see an eruption of the English Nationalism,

      there is Her Royal Majesty 90th birthday celebrations,

      and Her Majesties own English football team will be playing in the Euro Championship,probably through to last 16 with a game against Turkey(?) on 25th june,

      the English Nationalist blood will be at frothing point,

      rule England and damn all foreigners.

    153. Kenny says:

      Just been watching an episode of Sputnik with Galloway interviewing Farage (!). Farage said: “It’s not about right or left (wing). It’s about right or wrong. It’s about electing the government we want”!

      The exact same arguments they did not want to hear when it applied to the people of Scotland. I guess Galloway and Farage do not do irony.

      And why did George not pipe up about “we must show solidarity with workers in Turin and Marseille and Warsaw…”?!?

      I am beginning to think that a lot more in Scotland might vote to LEAVE. It is so tempting to try and force an early Indyref2. And the REMAIN campaign is just so oily “UKOK”. We will surely get some begging BBC broadcast on the eve of the EU ref from Porkface. How many Scots are going to go into a polling booth and do what Porkface tearfully implores us to do (and all other oily establishment unionists like Corbyn, Osborne…)?

    154. Effijy says:

      Bozo the Sycophant acted drunk
      And said that he’d join in the circus
      Off he went to meet Donald Trump with a trumpety-trump
      Trump, trump, trump

      Bozo the Decadent, Europe sunk
      he trundled back to the Cliff Top
      Off he went with Scotland in hand to jump,
      jump, jump.

      Day and night he danced to the circus band
      When Bozo was leading he looked oh so grand
      with various tricks that the Tories perform
      They kept the poor insecure and forlorn
      and Dump, Dump, Dumped!

    155. heedtracker says:

      Cometh the hour, cometh the Lord.. Its funny because now its Englandshire’s turn. Frankly.

      Lord Darling ?@A_LordDarling 10m10 minutes ago
      2 I doubt whether we will have been more popular,or in a better position to dictate terms, than if we stay. We’re better together in the EU.
      2 retweets 3 likes

      Lord Darling ?@A_LordDarling 11m11 minutes ago
      1 If we vote to stay, we will be in the heady position of the spouse who looked like walking out, but decided to give things one last go.

    156. thomaspotter2014 says:

      Popcorn Popcorn Popcorn …..and more Popcorn.

      LOL

    157. Rock says:

      Rock,

      “I think that is just a nonsensical recipe for disaster. There needs to be some kind of structured continuity for governance, and the SLEW of new relationships, contracts, agreements, services to set up a new country.

      I’m all for a GE, once the country has the basic skeleton in place.”

      Why should it take more than six months?

      Negotiations can go on after political independence.

      But we must start to govern ourselves and kick out the rotten to the core british establishment very quickly after independence.

    158. heedtracker says:

      Was it really only 18 monthsish ago, Scots plagued by Project Fear, Crash Gordon UKOK rage, sneering BBC vote NO Scotland, purring queens etc?

      Parp.

      Frankly.

      Lord Darling ?@A_LordDarling Feb 19
      The Leave EU campaign is irresponsible. Concocting scare stories such as the banks will leave or weekly shop will rise is spurious nonsense.

    159. Gary45% says:

      Flipper Darling,
      ARSE?ELBOW?

    160. Ian Brotherhood says:

      What kind of ‘democracy’ are we in where people are openly discussing whether or not Bojo has damaged his chances of becoming PM in 2019 or whatever…

      Is this all we can look forward to? An interminable procession of Eton boys playing musical chairs around the Cabinet table?

      It’s no wonder people get pished, eh?

      ‘Slainte’ indeed…

      🙁

    161. The Rough Bounds. says:

      I watched a bit of a programme on BBC Caesar! a couple of nights ago. It was about the Bun Sgoil (Gaelic Primary school) in Bowmore. In the classroom on one wall was painted a massive Union Flag. Who asked for this? Who sanctioned it? Why was it put there? Is this a fine example of sycophancy in the Gaelic speaking communities?

      You have half a second to make up your mind.

      On the way out of Perth yesterday I noticed a large billboard advertising a new phase of housing to be built shortly. The name of the private development is to be called Charlotte Gate. This wouldn’t be any kind of sickening sycophancy considering Kate Middleton (Prince Wullie’s wifie) gave birth in May to a baby girl to be known as Princess Charlotte would it?

      Surely naw.

    162. heedtracker says:

      Bliar McDougall oddly cryptic tonight on his UKOK vote SLab you morons tweetstering. Must be stacks of cash on consultancy fees going for the EUOK taking, so probably v v hectic at fat camp.
      Tasty, EUOK tasty.

      On balance though, oor Bliar did save us from ourselves with his ferocious brand of Project Fear but all those oil jobs gone, steel jobs gone, HMRC jobs gone, SLabour end of era, you have to wonder if he ever contemplates if stacks of cash were really worth keeping his Etonia imperial masters in power in Scotland. Ofcourse it UKOK was. Loadsa fackin money.

      Blair McDougall ?@blairmcdougall 5h5 hours ago
      Totally out of date understanding of sovereignty. As someone wrote: a man walking alone in desert is totally sovereign. He’s also powerless.

    163. Capella says:

      More betterness together. Wood Group cut pay rates by 9%.
      “This has been blamed on the “continuing cost and efficiency challenges affecting the UK North Sea oil and gas sector”.
      It is the third such move made by Wood Group PSN in the space of two years.”

      So glad we have those broad shoulders.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-35611858

    164. yesindyref2 says:

      A quick look at Rev’s twitter, this from Ross McAfferty:

      “I think Scotland will declare independence just out of sheer boredom at having to relive the same arguments until June”

      Amen to that.

    165. gerry parker says:

      Noticed a couple of comments praising the NHL.

      Let them know via:-https://www.patientopinion.org.uk/services/nhs-scotland

    166. heedtracker says:

      EUOK/Brexit’s really got the twitter tory Yoons of the Scotland region agitated tonight. Its interesting how any democracy at all makes the far right so angry. Fear of change maybe? Are the UKOK yoons planning another #SNPout 2015 style EUOK/Brexit wheel of tactical voting stupidity?

      Hope so:D

      In reply to Lj Trafford
      Effie Deans ?@Effiedeans 23m23 minutes ago
      .@TraffordLj There’s something deeply dishonest and dishonourable about the SNP’s position. They always only want dependence
      View conversation 4 retweets 5 likes

      Effie Deans ?@Effiedeans 34m34 minutes ago
      Boris versus Dave with poisoned dwarf Nicola looking on making threats. What fun in the months ahead.

    167. Gary45% says:

      Heedtracker,
      You forgot to mention all the rest of the thieving, lying, self centred, inbred parasites that stood shoulder to shoulder with him.
      Everyone one of those bas*ards have/had their snout in the trough.
      They sold a country (that did not belong to them) for a cosy wee future for themselves.
      What they forgot was, they don’t even register on the Westminster radar.( I think it was Pete Townsend who said “When you start to believe your own press you have problems” or words to that effect)
      The only people who will remember them, are the Scots they shafted.

      Tick Tock.
      SNPx2

    168. Onwards says:

      JLT says:
      21 February, 2016 at 4:34 pm

      Boris is a genius. An extremely intelligent, highly educated, politically aware genius. David less so. Clever and aware …but way out of Boris’s league.
      —-

      You really think he is so highly regarded?
      I always saw him as a buffoon.. laughing his way through everything.
      Fair enough he is charismatic, but so are Nigel Farage and George Galloway.

      I think the biggest boost to the Leave campaign won’t be Boris, but the eurosceptic right wing papers which will work themselves into a frenzy each day.. setting the agenda.

      I think this is going to be hard for Cameron to win given the likelihood of ‘Rule Brittania’ style street parties in the final weeks, together with the tabloids on board.
      The final days will be like the Last Night of the Proms.

      By comparison the Stay vote is generally seen as a pretty staid point of view – the main attraction being easy access to a huge single market. But few people are that enthusiastic about Europe itself or keen to wrap themselves in a Euro flag.

      Cameron took a huge risk pandering to UKIP supporters.
      This could easily pull away from him as English/British nationalism takes over the streets in the final weeks.

      And if there actually is a terrorist attack in London in the next couple of months, it is all over.

    169. heedtracker says:

      Gary45% says:
      21 February, 2016 at 10:42 pm
      Heedtracker,

      Its a very big parcel of contemporary UKOK rogues Gary. And all of it, every last awful drop of BBC style UKOK Project Fear, to keep a super rich ruling elite in England, in control of their Scotland region.

      Bliar McDougal probably hadn’t the faintest idea he was also ending Scottish Labour’s right to rein over Scotland for good.

      Imagine how hard same UKOK elite must be laughing now, as a stuffed shirt like Ruth Davidson vies for second party status with the Labour party, in Scotland!

      Wouldn’t want Bliar Mcdougal’s conscience for all the money toryboy world in London gave him. If he has one.

    170. DerekM says:

      So that was oil,tax,tartan tories and NHS are we back to oil again next or have i missed something oh yea nazis its got to be nazis next or did i miss that one yawn.

      Broken record stuff,no news about anything important here SNP bad.

      You would think there is nothing important going on like oh a failed Scotland bill or an EU referendum.

      Are we looking at a copycat AV news shutdown scam ?

    171. Mosstrooper says:

      Rough Bounds @ 10.10

      There appears to be a plethora of places called after the wife of George 111. Queen Charlotte of Mecklenburg Strelitze.
      In accord with the sycophancy toward our German royal family I fear you may be correct in that a degree of grovelling has erupted in Perth with a bend of the knee and a tugging of forelocks.

    172. Chic McGregor says:

      2nd attempt.
      I think Cameron is the cleverest and least evil here, flushing out the Nazis and hopefully saving England from becoming a fully fledged fascist state.

      That is what I would do if I were in his position between several rocks and several hard places.

      Hope that is correct and does not backfire.

    173. Tam Jardine says:

      Onwards

      I think you underestimate Boris. Take his appearance in front of the press today. You tell us that he is a buffoon- although I detest the man I thought he was statesmenlike. The whole pantomime- will he won’t he? What is he dripping into the public ear? He is a man of principle, tortuously putting the UK before his own career, before friendship.

      I think Cuilean nailed it waaaay up the thread- the tory ruling clique needed to hedge their bets and have a leader in both camps. It may even be as simple as a carve up between Dave and Boris like Blair and Brown at the Little Chef or wherever it was back in the day.

      I actually think Boris is perfect to front up the campaign although I am not sure if that is what is happening. The stronger the Leave campaign the better for Indy so I am well chuffed Boris has taken this step. He is significantly stronger than Farage/Michael Gove/George Galloway and signals that this is going to be a proper contest.

      What infuriates me is seeing him on television claiming to have agonised over this decision and only just decided. More likely this whole strategy was worked out between the tory high command after May last year. You now how a tory cabinet that can survive if the public vote to remain and we will have a tory cabinet that can survive if they vote to leave.

      Good to see Nicola on the Marr show this morning – something tells me she is going to enjoy the next few months

    174. Ian Brotherhood says:

      Scottish UKOKers just don’t get it –

      We’re about to endure four months of solid wall-to-wall 24/7 Eurobollocks featuring a Spitting Image array of faces we were already sick-of-seeing years ago. It’s like being forced to play a game of Cluedo with people you can’t stand. That would be bad enough, but it MUST last at least sixteen fucking weeks and you’re never allowed to leave the table.

      Sometime, during this torture, we’re supposed to conduct a serious debate about the governance of our own nation?

      Should we arrange to meet during toilet-breaks?

      Utterly sick of it all, and it’s barely started. Just a game for the Chipping-Norton set, Murdochs and sundry faceless Nawbaggers waving their wee plastic UJs.

      Fuck the whole lot of them.

    175. Inverclyder says:

      Think there might be a few folk thinking Cameron actually wants to win and stay in Europe.

      I don’t believe it for a minute and as has been said previously, the English right wing press will go into overdrive to get out of Europe.

      We’re about to witness the most unsavory faces of English Nationalism will be presented as patriotic.

      It’s enough to make you sick!

    176. Chic McGregor says:

      Tam

      Careful what you wish for. If the Nos win then IMO England/’UK’ will become an ultra extreme right wing state.

      Even if that does present an indyref2 opportunity, and even if we vote for it, it does not bode well for the future. At all.

      Best result is UK vote IN the preservation of democratic and EU lead human rights principles and an indyref2 on some other pretext.

    177. Big Jock says:

      Does anyone else feel sick when right wing little Englanders proclaim. We just want our country back. England has never lost its sovereignty. They are just not used to being the small cog in a big pond called Europe.

      Personally I think most ordinary Europeans will be glad to get shot of the Barmy Army.

    178. DerekM says:

      Very interesting link Nana thanks 🙂

      I totally agree with Hayes on that one.

      The vultures are circling and the hyenas are closing in on the kill but they have all forgotten about Hamish lurking in the bushes waiting to pounce,if they think leaving the EU will be a disaster wait until we leave them,and that is what scares them all the most and is what the English electorate must never know because they are special and have the Queen and nuke bombs rule Britannia,special relationship with America they can never know they are broke,everything is fine.

      Whats more scary Nana is the derivatives market ,Deutsche Bank, remember them,are up to their eyeballs in bad debt and over inflated fake oil derivatives that will make 2008 look like a blip,London after taking no advice to regulate the bankers have let them do exactly the same thing again but this time the debt hasnt been paid off and when it goes pop 1.7 trillion will turn into 8-9 trillion thats if 1.7 trillion is the real figure,there are people out there that think its actually about 3 trillion.

    179. Chic McGregor says:

      @Inverclyder

      My view of Cameron, which I do not pretend is a commonly held one, is that he finds himself in the midst of a bunch of right wing nutters.

      Right wing nutters who may well have already had at least one serious attempt at removing him.

      If true, he is ploughing a very lonely and thankless furrow.

      However, in that context, his actions make perfect sense.

    180. heedtracker says:

      Careful what you wish for. If the Nos win then IMO England/’UK’ will become an ultra extreme right wing state.

      Tories are not mad. They will continue to run their UK the way Thatcher, Blair and Brown did, a super rich elite able to live like gods tax free, an ever wealthier middle and upper class, a low wage, low skill working class, a continual stream of cheap high skill labour from the EU and beyond, a reasonable NHS and comp education, some jolly good wars far enough away to be safe and to keep British nationalism pulsing away, a giant BBC well funded pan UK pro tory propaganda producing BBC, giant transport infrastructure spends in England only,HS2, Heathrow 3, treats like London 2012 Olympics, and ofcourse, NOT forgetting an entirely neutered Holyrood, perpetually struggling with whatever shyste Westminster will eventually get away with.

      And that’s what you voted NO for proud Scot buts.

    181. Onwards says:

      Big Jock says:
      21 February, 2016 at 11:27 pm
      Does anyone else feel sick when right wing little Englanders proclaim. We just want our country back. England has never lost its sovereignty. They are just not used to being the small cog in a big pond called Europe.

      It’s ironic isn’t it ?
      England or the UK has FAR more sovereignty than Scotland has with our limited devolved parliament.

      Yet we were told we were small minded separatists. Now we have to listen to 4 months of hypocritical jingoistic crap about the UK ‘taking back control’.

    182. Chic McGregor says:

      @heedtracker
      “Tories are not mad.”

      Hopefully true, for the most part. However if the City goes under, which is not an unimaginable prospect on Brexit (or even ultimately on non Brexit) then all placating the international community bets are off and God help us.

    183. Tam Jardine says:

      Chic McGregor

      I am a European citizen Chic and will remain so. A leave vote will take time to take effect and we can surely turn a successful referendum around in time to secure continuing membership as an independent Scotland.

      I understand you prefer a vote to remain and then an indyref2 on another pretext. This is the pretext that gives us the 60% or whatever significant buy in we all want to see rather than shading it. This is the act that will bring support to independence from all sections of society- particularily from the pro-business tories and what is left of the labour vote.

      So there are positives. Negatives as well of course. You mention being ruled by an unfettered ultra extreme right wing state- and what I get from this is that even if we then gain independence an England out of Europe unfettered by the EU will be a monster.

      Aye- maybe so. But when that ultra right wing state is bearing down on the English people and north of the border Scotland is surging forward into the future it may be the jolt to the system England needs to finally wake up and shake off the post imperial mindset. To realise they need to start demanding governance FOR the benefit of the people rather than this oligarchy.

      My eyes are wide open Chic. I will vote to Remain but hope we Leave so by then Leaving we can Remain. If you see what I mean.

    184. AFewHomeTruths says:

      @Heedtracker
      I take it you realise it’s a parody account. Sometimes pretty amusing though.

      @Capella Ian Brotherhood

      Its simple to change the audio if you have the video. If you uploaded the video you can also opt to change the sound at any point without having to upload it again. You could also just make the original private after altering a copy if you wanted. Try other sites for an original.

    185. Brian McHugh says:

      It really is getting ridiculous. I have now long stopped watching the BBC. It has been an age since I bought a mainstream newspaper. And honestly, with the internet, I know I am more informed about what is actually going on in the world, than those decrepit and dying media sources could ever tell me.

      They can bluff their own agenda to their hearts content. Good luck to them… I have long stopped listening.

    186. Almannysbunnet says:

      I wonder what the Euro Vow is going to look like? Suppose we will have to wait until after June 20th to find out.

    187. Papadox says:

      The city of London is the key to the whole crock of shit. They are the fixers, the money changers and are washington’s little helpers, so they are indespensible to Americas great plan to rule the world.

      The population outside the M25 are just the chaff and there to support “the city” and all its requirements while the establishment rob us all blind and tell us it’s for our own good.

      Scotland, Wales, NI and the rest of ENGERLAND are just there to bulk up Londinium and put a better face on the punching above our weight crap.

      United Kindom, Great Britain, ENGERLAND. Are aliases for London Banks.

      A GOLD PLATED CON.

    188. Petra says:

      @ Gerry Parker at 10:45pm …… NHS

      Thanks for the link Gerry.

      I reckon that SLab and the SCUM are shooting themselves in the foot …. over and over again …. with the REPEATING of tall tales about Baad NHS … under Baad SNP.

      There’s around 160,000 staff (multiplied by relatives / friends) working in NHS hospitals in Scotland who won’t be taking kindly to the constant castigation of the work they’re doing. Constant focus on ‘hidden lists’ and the small minority of people who aren’t being seen within fours hours. No mention of the vast majority that are.

      There are approximately 300 hospitals in Scotland and the SCUM mooch around looking for the one or two that are experiencing problems at any given time. No mention of the 298 others that are not experiencing problems and are providing an excellent service.

      1.6 million people visit A&E departments every year. The Ambulance Service in Scotland is called out to deal with around 600,000 incidents every year. That’s a massive number of people most of whom I’m sure have been more than happy with the service provided. And of course I could go on and on posting numbers of people attending the dentist, optician, babies being born, support for the elderly and so on relating to millions of others. Millions of people in Scotland receiving a better service here than south of the border. Better service whilst the SNP are being hammered with cuts from Westminster (didn’t apply when SLab ruled the roost) and doing everything in their power to prevent privatisation. A&E services in Scotland said to be the BEST in the WORLD. A quick check also shows that NHS services in Scotland have improved dramatically since Scottish Labour was booted out in 2007.

      I’m sure that everyone who visits this site, everyone in Scotland in fact including scum journalists, knows of someone who has received an NHS service recently or is receiving service or treatment right now.

      With their lies and spin SLab and their SCUM cronies are actually doing us a favour as people are more likely to base their opinion on experience rather than the garbage that they are spouting / printing.

      Overkill re. Baad SNP MSPs. Overkill re. Baad NHS Scotland. In the process through their ‘disservice’ to the Scots and Scotland they’re actually killing off their own political party / profession and if anything promoting the Independence cause.

      It would seem that no one is exempt from Labours scaremongering propaganda in Scotland … not even the weak and vulnerable. Scotland’s big ‘bogie men and women’ …. members of the SLab and the SCUM should be hanging their heads in shame. They’re an absolute disgrace.

    189. Chic McGregor says:

      @Tam
      Part of me agrees with your logic. Promote EU membership but be quietly happy if England votes No but Scotland votes Yes because then we get an indyref2.

      However, my fears, which I admit are almost entirely based on character analysis of the main actors involved rather than on hard evidential analysis is that we are in danger of releasing a monster here.

      Of course, I do hope that a Brexit triggered indyref2 is successful and that an England out of the EU somehow, despite that, manages to sustain their London casino based economy and hence remains reasonably benign. However my suspicion is that that will not be the case.

      And of course, there is the moral aspect, that we would not wish that likely economic collapse creating a vacuum to be filled by totalitarianism of the right on our English friends and relatives never mind potential consequences for ourselves.

      I think we should hope, and if necessary act, to try to ensure England votes Yes also.

    190. DerekM says:

      Never underestimate Boris he is a con man and uses an act of charm,eccentricity,charisma and fake idiocy he is a second hand car salesman,a spiv,and he has the sacred dagger handed down by the grandees of the tory establishment MP without portfolio,Cameron is the lamb on the alter or should that be pig.

      The English electorate are oblivious to it and are sleep walking into right wing fascism ,lets not forget this is a country that voted for a dog as the best talent in “Britain”.

      Or prove me wrong people of England i will be glad to eat humble pie if you do and deal with your corrupt evil politicians.

    191. heedtracker says:

      Chic McGregor says:
      21 February, 2016 at 11:50 pm
      @heedtracker

      The City is a world market and its been well taken care of. Look at how the great red Tory liars of our age alone, Crash Gordon, the Flipper, all of them made the City spivs rich, tax free, safe, secure in the UK, and themselves too, naturally. What’s the point of being a socialist if you cant get rich.

    192. cearc says:

      Mosstrooper, Rough Bounds,

      You think that’s bad? How about buying your very own wee prince or princess?

      https://archive.is/7PGhZ

    193. call me dave says:

      FGS! It must be Monday there’s more NHS bad in the Herald…Lots of it!

      Struggling to get a GP appointment?

      https://archive.is/rjKXI

      NHS leader: Scotland must plan to shut some hospitals or risk firefighting

      He praised former Scottish Labour health secretaries for agreeing the controversial shake-up, saying: “You have to plan boldly well in advance if you are going to be able to deliver calmly.

      https://archive.is/7DFya
      ……………………………………………………….

      How we Scots manage to struggle on everyday is nothing short of miraculous!

      🙂

    194. Fred says:

      @ Mosstrooper, I believe Queen Charlotte was one of the better Guelphs & much put upon!

      On a slightly brighter note, a Slab councillor for Glasgow Provan has defected to the SNP & been accepted by the branch. 🙂 The McAveetie regime seems to be imploding.

    195. call me dave says:

      Geez! The Hootsman agrees with Jackson Carlaw and the Herald.

      https://archive.is/Om1xv

      I suppose that’s the campaign underway already!

      SNP x 2

    196. Petra says:

      @ Ian Brotherhood at 11:17pm …….

      Thanks for the laugh Ian. Brilliant.

      …..

      One thing for sure is that 50 million plus English people are going to get a wee taste of scaremongering, lies, smears and experience of full blown propaganda tactics this year. Around 25 million are going to be feeling extremely unhappy this summer whichever way the vote goes. Then you’ll have Tory voters (and politicians) who’ll be raging if the man they voted for, Cameron, steps down to be replaced by say Boris.

      If they vote for Brexit and we manage to get our Independence the English are going to be in for a massive shock when the fascists, untethered, are in a position to run amok. Byebye NHS, human rights, workers rights, health and safety at work protection and so on.

      The oil that they seem to be so derisory about right now will no longer be ‘theirs’. Trident will be given the heave-ho with nowhere else to go. The EU will make an example of England …. ensure that the breakaway country struggles at every turn and the US will have no time for them, especially with regard to the loss of their Nuclear base. The latter would also have implications for them re. the UN and NATO. All of this would also have implications for us of course as it would be far from ideal having a weak neighbour.

      If they exit the EU and lose Scotland they’ll be reduced to being a wee patch of land on the planet with not a great deal going for it. Maybe then the English will waken up and demand much needed change. A bit late but better late than never.

    197. Flying Scotsman says:

      @mike cassidy
      I’m no sure what Kezia’s favourite books are,but I have it on good authority that she coloured every one in and hardly went outside the lines at all.

    198. Breeks says:

      Whatever we do, I don’t think we as Scots can influence these mad right wing tories. The put us in the same category as European states; a thorn in their side with some real potential to reign in their greedy excesses.
      I genuinely doubt Cameron is in control any more than Boris would be. They are just figureheads for the real right wing power house. Little England is a faceless corporate entity. A kind description might be the proverbial “old boy network”, but the truth of it is these people see themselves living on a different plane of existence. They are groomed from birth to see themselves as a ruling elite, and trust each other by pedigree.
      The funny part is that Middle England thinks they are kindred with the right wing philosophy because it praises wealth and contives wealth for them, like property values which defy the laws of gravity. The joke is the right is as much of a parasite on their lives as it is on our lives. Middle England has its senses dulled and doesn’t know its happening.

      We must get out of the Union. Holding power in Westminster is unobtainable for us. We will not dent this old boy network, merely increase their resentment and vilification like a problem that won’t go away.
      We are only strong inside our own country. And that’s what it boils down to. Why are these arseholes permitted to exercise control over my country?
      The key to power and self government for Scotland does not lie in Westminster. The power is here inside Scotland and has been all the time. The problem is, even now it lies dormant and forgotten. Pick your own metaphor, but as the SNP agitate to wake Scotland from its slumber, the BBC pumps in more ether to suppress the waking up process.
      There is a reason this Scottish problem doesn’t go away. Our constitutional arrangement in the UK defies logic and always will. Relax their grip, and the natural state will right itself. They know it. It is our doubters who need convinced.

      This media bubble which drugs our vitality is the secret to our future. Get rid of it. Unplug ourselves and see how feebly we are bound.

    199. Effijy says:

      Hilary Benn on TV just explained that the UK could leave the EU
      and pay in just like Norway, but norway pays in as much as they would had they been members.

      Norway must also follow many directives such as Open Borders.
      Although they do all this, they do not get a seat at the negotiation table to form the future of the EU.
      Why would the UK want this?

      Isn’t this where Scotland is right now?

      We pay in for England’s Debt and Infrastructure and we have to follow Westminster’s directives.
      We get a seat at the table, unless it’s an EVEL matter, but even when we can vote we are out voted by England’s right wing parties.

      Why would any country want to be in that position?

    200. frogesque says:

      So, who’s next for the Witch Hunter General’s dooking stool?

      They should just do it alphabetically, it would be simpler.

    201. Grouse Beater says:

      We are the only nation in this wonderful Disunited Kingdom where the rest of the members are happy to have the press and media fully employed discrediting the Scottish government.

    202. Breeks says:

      Grouse Beater… We are the ones waking up. Or at least threatening to. We are a local problem and our state of heightened alertness must not spread to the flock.

      The BBC’s anaesthetic sweeps across these islands like a toxic fog, but right now Scotland needs double dose prescription.

      Keep the population dull, dimwitted and supine.

      Think about your daily TV intake. Remove our soap opera barbituates, reduce the dosage on our WW2 memorabilia, and pull out the needle with all the aspirational property brainwashing.

      What have you got left? Raw news propaganda people wouldn’t watch unless strapped to their armchairs or mentally flat lining. BBC rohypnol. This is how we are governed; kept docile, distracted and demotivated.

    203. Robert Kerr says:

      @Roughbounds last night.

      Bowmore is on Islay which is a Feudal Fiefdom. Remember three things.

      1, Our future King pranged a plane landing there.

      2. The Island spawned The Rt Hon Liar Carmichael.

      3. The Island spawned The Rt Hon Geo Robertson.

      There are good people there too.

      SNP SNP

    204. yesindyref2 says:

      OT
      With an interesting article in The National about the OBR being criticised by the Treasury Select Committee, I found this dated 7th Jan 2016 browsing around (headlined “Treasury select committee chairman Andrew Tyrie slams the government over ONS and OBR, saying UK statistics are “scarcely fit for purpose””):

      “The Treasury committee’s most-recent hit at official statistics came last month, when MPs told the government’s fiscal watchdog, the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) to come up with ways to improve its models after tweaks to its forecasts gave chancellor George Osborne and extra £11.5bn to spend over the next five years.”

      http://www.cityam.com/231899/treasury-select-committee-chairman-andrew-tyrie-slams-the-government-over-ons-and-obr-saying-uk-statistics-are-scarcely-fit-for-purpose?ITO=related-content

      That’s very strange, we’ve always been glad the Treasury, Danny Alexander, OBR and ONS are so honest with their figures, haven’t we? I’m just SO surprised.

    205. Ken500 says:

      It a giant farce. A few extemely, wealthy, nasty people play out a soap opera, totally out of reality, but which has a profound affect on other people’s lives. Who is paying Boris?

      Why did people vote NO.

    206. Macart says:

      @Yesindyref2

      RE: OBR article

      Clever use of language in that article right enough by the TSC: “strayed beyond the factual”.

      Is that posh wonkspeak for fibbed? 🙂

    207. yesindyref2 says:

      OT again
      Thinking about it, both EU sides are going to have to come up with some facts and figures, and you can bet they’ll be different. But this is the UK for heaven’s sake, there won’t be a totally compliant media, and every economics department in the UK will right now be filled with the sound of clacking keyboards as everyone and their dog comes up with their own reports, and analyses whatever is said by either side.

      So the people in Scotland might be able to see just how much lying goes on with UK statistics.

      Oh dear. What a shame.

    208. Breeks says:

      The SNP should be fighting fire with fire, but right now they are showcasing their flameproof credentials. Great. Triffic. It’s Scotland’s oil they use for the flame.

      The Tories think nothing about setting up right wing think tanks to splurdge out right leaning propaganda dressed up and adorned as accredited wisdom from a neutral source.

      What the SNP at Holyrood took it upon themselves to instigate a new governmental department speciifically to address issues where grey areas of sovereignty might be exploited. Just suppose the SNP announced a new Ministerial portfolio for Counter Propaganda and Corruption…

      Don’t you think that might not ruffle a few of the right feathers?

      What is to stop us?

    209. Grouse Beater says:

      Filmmaker Bill Forsyth tells us indirectly he’s not really Scottish, he’s an ‘internationalist’.

      “The Glaswegian revealed that although many of his films are set in Scotland and have helped to forge the character of the nation, he “wasn’t flying the flag for Scotland”.

      He adds: “There’s nothing Special about Scotland.”

      He tries hard not to say but somehow does:

      “Why don’t you English fucking film funds give me money anymore to make my films? I’m one of yous!”

    210. Bob Mack says:

      @Breeks.

      “What is to stop us”. Common sense for a start. You sound as if you want to start a Ministry of Propoganda. That will go down well with the public and maybe give some weight to those who use the old Nazi slur.

      We seem to be doing OK at present without resorting to state Propoganda machinery——–like the Tories

    211. yesindyref2 says:

      @Nana
      Indeed. I hope The National keeps right on top of that story, because I don’t remember seeing elsewhere in Scotland about the ONS and OBR statistics for some very odd reason.

      What was again that Treasury select committee chairman Andrew Tyrie said again about ONS and OBR, UK statistics? Oh yes:

      “scarcely fit for purpose”

    212. yesindyref2 says:

      @Macart
      Yes, I wonder how many fibs we’ll be seing unfold over the next 4 EU months? I’m sure the SNP would be far too polite to point them out …

    213. Macart says:

      I also note in the same issue Kevin McKenna putting two and two together to come up with five.

      Who says the FM doesn’t have a timetable in mind for a second indyref, or indeed that it is reliant solely on a Brexit ‘trigger’?

      The single core motivator for any second indyref will be public demand and the FM forcing that issue will not in any way speed the process. IMO the best case for independence the FM can put forward is to continue with stable, reliable government, promote confidence in Holyrood as Westminster degrades further into an ever right wing shambles. Come that next GE no single trigger would be required. All people need do is contrast and compare the behaviour and competence of the two parliaments.

      I reckon a good bet would be the latter part of the current parliamentary term. There is a perfect storm of circumstance and gathering evidence of Westminster failing to deliver on their pledges made during the referendum. By the time the dust has settled on Holyrood elections, EU in/out, Scotland Bill farce, council elections, ongoing austerity budgets/legislation and a dirty fight for the new leadership of the Conservative party? Well, I don’t think folks will be left in much doubt about which parliament to trust with their future.

      In short, I believe one ‘trigger’ won’t do it, it’ll be a gradual, snowball effect that will gather speed as events unfold.

      Tick tock. 🙂

    214. Robert Peffers says:

      @yesindyref2 says: 22 February, 2016 at 8:52 am:

      ” … I’m just SO surprised.
      Treasury select committee chairman Andrew Tyrie slams the government over ONS and OBR, saying UK statistics are “scarcely fit for purpose””

      I’m about as surprised by it, yesindyref2, as I was this morning as I sat drinking my morning coffee and saw the Sun come up ower Lochore Meedies.

      It is absolutely hilarious the YooKay is starting to fight for its independence from the EU and trotting out all the arguments the Scottish Nationalists have been highlighting for decades.

      For example Niall Aslan’s, “The Great Obfuscation”:-

      http://www.siol-nan-gaidheal.org/obfuscation.htm

      Niall is a forensic accountant and he was among the first to expose the lies of the GERS figures. Look at the his date the article was first published.

    215. Breeks says:

      @ Bob Mack.

      With that lack of imagination, I take it you’re close to the SNP.

    216. galamcennalath says:

      I don’t know if anyone else has said this (I haven’t gone through all the comments), but i have seen the suggestion that Boris would fence sit until he was clear about which side would win. He didn’t want to be on the losing side.

      So … he has chosen. Does that mean he is confident of a Leave win?

      I have also then the suggestion that among Tory voters, many will follow his lead and back Boris’s view. A positive feedback effect – he chooses a side, and that side is more likely to win.

      Being outside the EU with Tories in charge would be disastrous for social, civil and workers rights. And, if you think TIPPs is bad, the Tories will negotiate their own arrangements with the US which will be even worse!

      If we get EngExit from EU, we NEED ScotExit from the UK.

    217. Famous15 says:

      Call Kaye just loves Alex Bell “former advisor to the SNP”

      Who is he? He talks utter nonsense. I much prefer Peter Bell!

    218. yesindyref2 says:

      OT and it comes flooding in.

      Bad news for Unionist activists, they’ll be greetin:

      “Scotland’s food and drink sector ‘confident of 20% growth in next year’

      … the £11 billion-a-year turnover sector

      http://archive.is/aY8IX

    219. Dr Jim says:

      Disgruntled ex employee of the SNP Alex Bell telling us all we’re doomed if we want independence and will be forced to use the Euro whether we like it or not

      England will employ a low tax economy and destroy Scotlands economy, folk will leave take their wives and kids and chattels south to the United State of England

      Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP don’t really want a second referendum anyway

      Now there speaks a man with no axe to grind whatsoever

      Shite after shite after shite pardon my language

      Project Apocalypse and HAVE A NICE DAY!!

    220. bookie from hell says:

      has alex bell lost his marbles–call kaye

    221. DerekM says:

      Though it is tempting to play them at their own game,the big drawback i see is we are not very good at that,now when it comes to finding the truth we kick ass.

      I do believe the SNP have their finger on the pulse of Scotland and know that the thing we despise most they can never become,they are well briefed and highly professional and most importantly they know who their boss is ,a real modern 21st century political party a credit to the people of Scotland,now if only we could get another party like that sigh.

    222. yesindyref2 says:

      @Robert Peffers
      Thanks for that, had a quick look and bookmarked for later.

      I worked on an economy model in the 70s that showed Scotland well able to stand for ourselves, and that was without oil. Since then there have been downs – followed very quickly by ups, including silicon and finance. There was a report just a week or two ago that showed Scotland at 99% of the UK’s GDP despite the huge drop in oil revenue. That oil revenue is so negligble in the period, it means the onshore GDP is just about 99% on its own. Which is the figure it was 2 or 3 years ago.

      But wait, it’s not just the offshore GDP will have dropped with oil, I would think the onshore oil sector GDP has dropped as well the last year. Which would mean sectors outside oil have risen above the UK’s increase.

      Now there’s hopes the food and drink sector will rise £2 billion for another onshore GDP rise, surely making it more than 100% of the UK GDP per capita by this time next year. And oil will recover some time, maybe the next 2 years.

      Scotland’s very adaptable, faster than the more cumbersome UK. We have to be, we always have.

      @Macart
      I have a feeling it’s heading for 2021 regardless, and meanwhile the ScotGov is doing what we said it should back in the CiF days – do their best at governing Scotland. Perhaps they’re going into overdrive now, having learnt their trade.

    223. yesindyref2 says:

      Alex Bell was sacked by Alex Salmond, I’m sorry, quit, in July 2013.

    224. Breeks says:

      Well, I apologise if my comments are too rich for some.

      Direct contact with the SNP has left me viciously underwhelmed that’s all, but for the greater good obviously I should just shut up about it.

      And all this deja vu I feel about the YES campaign floundering to cope with Unionist propaganda must all be a figment of my imagination. I’m glad the SNP has got it covered.

    225. Robert Peffers says:

      Radio Jockland in full blown overdrive this morning.

      How can the BEEB gather so many bloody idiots together on one programme? Just listened to some idiot woman claim we are not Scottish but are all members of Great Britain.

      Seems Northern Ireland has left the United Kingdom. Anyone know when that happened? I wonder if NI are in or out of the EU now?

    226. Grouse Beater says:

      Alex Bell was sacked by Alex Salmond, I’m sorry, quit, in July 2013.

      Maybe he smelled a plant.

    227. Nana says:

      Well I suppose Alex Bell might be feeling a little spiteful as his fundraiser bombed.

      https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/rattle–2#/

    228. sensibledave says:

      DerekM Wrote at 12:33 am

      “The English electorate are oblivious to it and are sleep walking into right wing fascism ,lets not forget this is a country that voted for a dog as the best talent in “Britain”.

      Or prove me wrong people of England i will be glad to eat humble pie if you do and deal with your corrupt evil politicians.”

      … so, your argument seems to be that the English electorate are all stupid – and the Scots are all super intelligent? I think the there is a word for people that hold those types of views.

    229. Macart says:

      @Yesindyref2

      I think a lot of groundwork has been going on quietly recently, especially with overseas connections. At home? All they need do is govern. 🙂

      Oh and by tomorrow? If the treasury hasn’t sorted their problems oot, the vow is pretty much binned.

    230. yesindyref2 says:

      @Macart
      Yes, the media’s gone very quiet about the fiscal framework.

      Interesting and potentially more good news from SPICe if applied, but I daresay the SNP are too thick to do anything about it apart from set up a £25 million centre of excellence and skills for manufacturing unveiled by the FM last Monday.

      “Better qualified workforce ‘could boost Scottish economy by £2 billion'”

      The SNP, tut, doing so little towards Indy, who’d have thunk it?

    231. heedtracker says:

      … so, your argument seems to be that the English electorate are all stupid – and the Scots are all super intelligent? I think the there is a word for people that hold those types of views.

      Well somebody keeps voting for the Tory creeps, in England sensible.

      Anyway its hardly surprising is it?

      This morn, BBC tv news propaganda had twa smirking sock puppets on the BBC couch first interview minister Fallon I think, who looks like an undertaker and he was warming up Project Fear 2 with safer, safety, safeness, secure bettertogther terrorising, in the EU.

      Then smirky on the couch had on Bojo’s dad! He’s just another upper class buffoon that thinks he knows best for teamGB, but Scots probably wont be fooled by these old tory goons again. Bojo senior thought it was very important that BBC news viewers understood that despite Bojo being an outer, the Bojo family were all great friends.

      Rejoice.

      Strong BBC propaganda though, even with the campaign hardly started.

      Wouldn’t it be a UKOK hoot sensibledave. if Scots hold England in the EU. BBC vote SLab Scotland have their work cut out now.

    232. Returnofthemac says:

      NHS NHS NHS

      My wife has been for her CT scan this morning 8.50 and returned before 10.00. Shocking! I didn’t expect her back until Wednesday. Eleanor Bradford must be disappointed.

      SNP x 2

    233. Robert Louis says:

      So, a mere 24 hours for the Westminster liars to agree a non damaging deal on the ‘Vow’, yet not a word in our ‘Scottish’ media (with the honourable exception of The National – link below) about it.

      It truly beggars belief the shoddy way in which Westminster has behaved, and worse the conniving way in which so-called ‘journalists’ in Scotland have chosen to ignore what is happening.

      The Scottish Government MUST reject any deal which damages Scotland, or they will instantly make themselves wholly unelectable for a very, very long time.

      Meanwhile, apparently everything is just fine, and the daddy of some guy called Boris is on all our news channels telling us all just what a great guy his son, Boris is. Poor Boris, needs his daddy to tell the world’s media that he is actually important. All the while the ‘UK’ media enter a frenzied period of what can only be described as journalistic masturbation over this bloke called Boris and his daddy. Pathetic.

      http://www.thenational.scot/politics/bruce-crawford-msp-heres-why-the-fiscal-framework-must-be-agreed-tomorrow.14050

    234. Dr Jim says:

      You know when they’re in trouble when the Yoon troll start flooding the airwaves with their bilious crud

      Confusion to everybody is usually the end game, the result is immaterial

      What are Scotlands choices, well, none really because it’s not about us or what we think “England Decides” and once again Scotland has to wait to react to a situation we never asked for or wanted

      The political and personality shootout that the Tories are now engaged in will lead to what they want it to lead to
      The EU is neither here or there for them, if they leave it’s Dickensian Tory rule for the lot of us, if they stay they’ve done their duty to the Great Yoonited Kingdom of England and ensured they keep power for the next twnty years anyway

      It’s all win win for the Tories and best multi millionaire pals at the end of it
      I don’t believe for one Nano second the divisions in the Tory party are anything less than a construct to deceive the electorate and the media will do their complicit job in feeding us the Oohs and Aahs of the whole sordid mess

      But hey it keeps the Tories top of the agenda which is exactly where they want to be

      The folk who are divided in Scotland by political persuasion will stay divided unless the Yoon side of the argument see sense in that they can’t win in Scotland ever and they have no power in London so where lies their future unless they join with us now and become the country we should be first then argue about who you like to run things second

      Use your noodle Yoons, Scotland will not now, or ever be

      Yoonland again

    235. DerekM says:

      Hi Dave long time no see and yep pretty much so but hey i dont blame them they are lied to just as much as we are if not maybe more and brainwashed by that damn TV thing into apathy,its a classic keep them in the dark so they either cant be arsed voting or dont have a clue what they are voting for.

      Now Dave you have to understand i may have generalized but i think i was justified in doing so since voting trends are on a downward spiral,we were the same,less and less people were caring bored out their minds what does it matter they are both crap who cares and then your democracy is lost.

      And even you cant deny there is a very nasty pong coming from the ultra right wing ,its all a bit xenophobic bordering on fascist.

      Hey i hope it gives your countries people an awakening and you all come to your senses.

      But then you probably wont.

    236. Chic McGregor says:

      @Nana
      “Well I suppose Alex Bell might be feeling a little spiteful as his fundraiser bombed.

      https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/rattle–2#/

      I would donate 1p to the title. i.e. it should be ‘Prattle’.

    237. Nana says:

      O/T

      While people are forced to use foodbanks and folk are asked to clean for queenie….

      queens-corgis-are-fed-steak-on-silver-platters-by-a-butler-royal-animal-psychologist-reveals-a6888551.html

      http://archive.is/G7hMM

    238. Nana says:

      @Chic

      Prattle would be more honest as he seems to do a lot of prattling for the beeb.

      I’m not sure how much indegogo take in fees and if he had to return the donations as he is nowhere close to target then deary me he might need to look after his pennies from now on.

    239. yesindyref2 says:

      @Nana
      I hope the corgis don’t get an anus horibilis.

    240. sensibledave says:

      Dr Jim 10.15

      … just in case you are unaware, I think I can safely predict, that when it comes to the EU referendum, The one thing the average English voter wont be considering – is whether their vote might lead to an Independent Scotland – and therefore affect their voting intentions.

      Reading many of the comments above and on previous threads, many assume that everything is to do with Scottish Independence. I understand that for many here that it may well be so – but not for the rest of us. As I write today, no one can confidently predict the outcome of the referendum. That is because there are those that have always held an in or an out position – if I was to guess, then maybe 25% at either end, whilst the majority of people I know are in the middle, and undecided.

      Most often, they are “undecided” because they don’t have sufficient information to make a decision about the subject at hand. So far, the information we are getting is partisan – from either side.

      So, unlike Scots pro-indy supporters that decided, en masse, long ago that it is in the best interest of their Independence cause to take the “Remain” stance, most English voters are wrestling with the decision based upon what they believe is the best way forward on a far broader range of issues.

      I observe that the two major parties in England have many MPs and supporters that are split on the decision. However, I haven’t heard a single SNP MP or MSP (I may be wrong) that has not toed the SNP policy line on the referendum. Why is that?

    241. Clydebuilt says:

      Rev there’s something brewing……. The MSM are turning the EU referendum into “problem for Tthe Nats”
      If there’s an OUT vote and Scotland votes IN ….. = Indy Ref 2
      1. EU won’t let us join.
      2. We won’t be able to use the Pound, will have to join Euro. (According to Kaye’s favourite Nat Alex Bell)

      If it’s a STAY vote
      1 Scotland won’t get a Indy. Referendum,

    242. louis.b.argyll says:

      Saw the corgi’s link above..
      Kind of wish I hadn’t, except for..

      ..Dorgi – a corgi bred with a dachshund.

      Like some kind of royal experiment to recreate one of Lizzies old German uncles, in dog form.

    243. G H Graham says:

      If England decides to leave the EU, does that mean we won’t be able to watch gratuitous repeats of “Das Boot” or “Chocolat”?

    244. Fred says:

      @ Macart, Kevin McKenna is just trying to come up with a new take on the crisis & failing. His photo in the National shows him smuggling a chicken past the Tesco checkout!

    245. sensibledave says:

      derekM 11.12

      You wrote “And even you cant deny there is a very nasty pong coming from the ultra right wing ,its all a bit xenophobic bordering on fascist.”

      … of course, t’was ever thus – In the same way as I have observed various calls, from time to time on here, for the result of the Scottish Independence referendum to be ignored and UDI to be implemented. There are loonies all around us. However, it would be just plain silly to somehow suggest that the loonies represent the majority Derek. If you are interested in politics, debate the politics.

    246. Capella says:

      Call Kaye – only if your blood pressure is too low. Great disappointment to find the Bell expert was Alex and not Peter. But was I surprised?

      Strikingly, the bitter and twisted voices were all anti-Scottish independence but pro – British independence. How strange.

      They also fail to see that Scotland might want to stay in the EU by choice. The UK was a forced marriage. EU is freely entered into if we are independent. Forced or free? You choose.

    247. heedtracker says:

      Nana says:
      22 February, 2016 at 11:15 am
      O/T

      While people are forced to use foodbanks and folk are asked to clean for queenie…

      Let them eat doggy treats.

      “He said: “At feeding times, each dog had an individually designed menu, including an array of homeopathic and herbal remedies.

      “Their food was served by a butler in an eclectic collection of battered silver and porcelain dishes.

      “As I watched, the Queen got the corgis to sit in a semi-circle around her, and then fed them one by one, in order of seniority. The others just sat and patiently waited their turn.”

      At least she’s keeping busy. Maybe she really didn’t purr Sept 19 2014, barked more like.

    248. Ian Brotherhood says:

      @sensibledave –

      Whether ‘your’ politics is any more or less riven with nutters than ‘ours’, the hairy-arsed fact remains that ‘you’ve’ ended-up with George Galloway.

      Good luck.

    249. Dan Huil says:

      The vast majority of britnats in England will vote for England. They will, as always, ignore Scotland. Their ignorance and arrogance towards Scotland, about to be magnified many times by the EU referendum, can only inflate the differences between Scotland and England, and therefore boost the independence movement in Scotland.

    250. Capella says:

      Another remarkable coincidence in the anti-EU campaign, the Brit Nats are on the opposite side:

      “British fascists are as dangerous as ISIS, says Derbyshire Police sergeant”

      http://on.rt.com/74y7

    251. Nana says:

      @Heedtracker

      For all we know she may treat ministers the same way. Get them to sit round in a circle and perform wee tricks. We already know she happily bestowed wee badges on the likes of Saville and Rolf Harris.

      Keeping secrets for wee treats like titles and shiny medals. Well at least the dogs can’t talk.

    252. Chic McGregor says:

      Ian B

      Hope someone organises an In Out meeting with GG and Farage on the panel and where one of the questions is on how many Syrian refugees we should take in.

    253. Chic McGregor says:

      Heedtracker

      If the Queen is corgi qualified can she gie me a quote on a new boiler?

    254. dakk says:

      Sensibledave

      ‘most English voters are wrestling with the decision based upon what they believe is the best way forward on a far broader range of issues.’

      Assuming that were true,it may be because they feel they are already in charge of their own country with England using the UK Parliament as the de facto English Parliament.

      Scotland however elects only 5% of the UK legislature which governs it as a state.

      Whilst Scotland does not have the rudiments of democracy which all nations take for granted, I’m sure you’ll forgive us for being slightly less engaged about yet one more thing which England will decide for us.

    255. Bill McLean says:

      sensible – I don’t doubt for one moment that if you had been used and abused for 300 years like Scotland has you too would do everything legal to get out from under the heel of the oppressor!

    256. Breastplate says:

      @Clydebuilt,
      it seems to be the old refrain of Scotland will be isolated with nobody to talk to and nobody to play with.
      Same old pish

    257. I see Wings are dutifully falling into line with the “Look over there ->” brigade.

      In the meantime, let’s get some perspective on what’s really going on…

      jockscot.wordpress.com/2016/02/20/how-very-convenient

    258. Bob Mack says:

      I really have to say,that ever since the days of Margaret Thatcher, the word WE has been surplanted by ME. I have lived long enough to watch the changes,when growing up in a tenement building,all the neighbours looked out for each other in times of need.

      We were a community no matter how tough things got. I ran messages for elderly neighbours,my mother would supply food to a family fallen on hard times. I knew everyone and everyone knew me.

      I think that is missing today.A sign of how we have become in today’s society.

      Dave The Tories swept to victory in England on a right wing agenda in case you had not noticed. That means enough of England agreed with them to put them in power.

      That is beyond argument.

      The politics of the two countries are not reconciled,nor will they ever be for some time,but by then the Tories will have destroyed much of the things we now take for granted like the NHS. It is happening before your very eyes.

      We either endure this or say enough.Time for change.Real change. That requires independence.

    259. sensibledave says:

      Dan Huil at 11:54 am

      You wrote “The vast majority of britnats in England will vote for England.”

      Dan, I don’t know any ENglish “Britnats”. I think you are confused. The indy ref was held in Scotland. We English didnt have a vote. The majority of your country folk disagreed with you – not the English!

      Then you wrote “They will, as always, ignore Scotland. Their ignorance and arrogance towards Scotland, about to be magnified many times by the EU referendum, can only inflate the differences between Scotland and England, and therefore boost the independence movement in Scotland.”

      Again Dan, you are “confused”. The EU referendum will give millions of people in the UK to give their view on the EU in/out debate. To state the obvious, the average voter in say, Manchester, wont be considering the wishes of a voter in Glasgow – any more or less than they will be considering the wishes of a voter in Cardiff or Belfast or London, or Southampton, or Bristol or Birmingham or Rhyl or Great Yarmouth!

      When you cast your vote in the Referendum, will you be considering what I want?

    260. Paul says:

      @Chic

      She’d need to get her qualifications up to date first!
      Corgi registration was replaced by Gas Safe registration some years ago… 🙂

    261. Macart says:

      @Fred

      Heh, Kevin is just doin’ his job as he sees it (probably with chicken). I suspect he just wishes Labour were leading the charge on the changes occurring in Scottish politics is all. Probably his biggest disappointment of recent years was coming to the realisation, that they simply weren’t capable, or willing.

      That won’t stop him from stirring the pot every now and again though. Wouldn’t be Kevin if the SNP weren’t going through some crisis. 😀

    262. DerekM says:

      Nah Dave im not interested in politics just freedom for my country isnt it funny that some of you English now feel that leaving a union is a good thing ,strange i am sure we got told its a bad thing anybody remember who said that,better together,pooling and sharing broad shoulders,would be out the EU,disasters and space monsters ,oil bad running out anyway and on and on and on …..

      If that your politics you can keep it but have fun and please in the aftermath of your referendum dont burn down your gaff we will have to pay for that again.

    263. Luigi says:

      If Boris is a clown, he is a very clever one – do not for one minute be tempted to underestimate him. He has left a trail of broken rivals and enemies who made that mistake. It will be fascinating to see how this plays out. I think the UK will not vote to leave but it is now going to be dangerously close. The opinion polls will narrow, even in Scotland. Quite a few YES voters seem undecided or for leaving the EU. I don’t know the knock-on effect on IndyRef 2 in Scotland – no one can predict it at this stage. However, I do know that the entire UK is going to be a different place after the dust settles, whatever the result. Boris will be portrayed as a champion of England and the UK by the tory press, and unlike some commentators, I do not think he will come out of this badly even if the leave campaign loses. Cameron has to win now, but Boris just has to get a good result (45% :)) and he then commands the future tory party.

      Perhaps the cunning blond blond clown observed the Scottish IndyRef 1 aftermath and decided that, like the SNP, a defeat in the European election could actually enhance his reputation. 🙂

    264. heedtracker says:

      There are loonies all around us. However, it would be just plain silly to somehow suggest that the loonies represent the majority Derek. If you are interested in politics, debate the politics.

      Sensible you do talk a lot of nonsense. The fact that UK is probably the most unequal country in the west is loonie enough but look at how rich London and the south east is compared to, well the further north you go up teamGB, the poorer it gets.

      UK run by lunatics sensibledave? Rancid The Graun did a very proud UKOK thing last week about how Snatcher Thatcher’s old house in London is now on sale at £30 million plus. Very sane pack, our imperial masters. Fair enough the blue tories are wildly mad to get London even richer but red tory loonies like Crash Gordon Brown from Fife were even worse. South east of England gets richer and richer, saps up north take their debt. Rule Britannia.

      Its UKOK socio economic greed gone mad sensible and it is ending this farce union a lot faster than even toryboy world lunatics can cope with, red or blue.

      So thanks for that UKOk:D

    265. Luigi says:

      So many commentators think this is a big risk for Boris. I’m surprised they have gone for the obvious knee-jerk. If only those professionals thought to look deeper, they would see that Boris has just captured the UKIP and Tory sceptic vote. When that combines (and it will), he becomes unbeatable, as long as his side achieves 45% or more in June.

      A big risk? It seems the blond clown is being watched by fools. He will make idiots of them all by the time this is over.

      Boris will be PM, sooner or later, depending on how the June ref goes.

    266. ArtyHetty says:

      Why is nonsense dave back? What with all the EU show happening down in england, surely there must be a calling for his sort down south. Lots of lying, stifling debate, and scaremongering will be the sort of skills they’ll be looking for right now up until their referendum.

      Scotland caught between the devil and the deep blue sea, again. Whatever the english decide for us, we need out if this dysfunctional, backward, corrupt so called union.

    267. Dan Huil says:

      The forthcoming EU refererendum will expose the nastiness of british nationalism in all its glorious [!] filth. Great fun. It can only boost the independence movement in Scotland.

      Aye, it’s britnats who are doing the most damage to their so-called united kingdom. Delicious.

    268. sensibledave says:

      DerekM at 12:07 pm

      Lets just look at that bit by bit.

      You wrote “isnt it funny that some of you English now feel that leaving a union is a good thing”.

      “some of you English”???? … yes Derek, some “English” just like some of “Scots”, some “Welsh” and some “Northern Irish” – that is why we are having a referendum. Just so I understand, is there any particular reason why particular people shouldn’t be trusted to be allowed to have a vote in a referendum?

      Then you wrote “strange i am sure we got told its a bad thing anybody remember who said that,better together,pooling and sharing broad shoulders,would be out the EU,disasters and space monsters ,oil bad running out anyway and on and on and on …..”

      Who told you that Derek? It wasn’t me, and it wasn’t the average voter in England, Wales or NI. You really need to be a little less “sweeping” in your use of language Derek. People might think you are just using cheap stereotypes (note: I have avoided using the “R” word) as targets for “dog-whistle” politics.

    269. heedtracker says:

      Who told you that Derek? It wasn’t me, and it wasn’t the average voter in England

      That’s UKOK tory rubbish too sensible. England was desperate not to lose control of Scotland, by a massive majority. It was clearly understood by everyone in England just how much England had to lose by Scotland becoming an independent nation state.

      Fair enough.

      The other side of UKOK nationalists power and glory, was the last UK GE, with vast numbers of English voters absolutely determined that Scotland, via the SNP, would have no actual power in Westminster.

      At the very least, that’s what the 2015 tory campaign focused a lot of BBC time and Salmond’s a pickpokcet thief, so for UKOK sake and our control of our Scotland region, dont let the Scots anywhere near power, vote tory, attack ads.

      Lovely time to be a Scottish voter in UKOK land.

    270. marydoll says:

      Just like the name of the topic – more repeats from sensible dave

    271. Les Wilson says:

      The UK treasury are the biggest enemy we have in Westminster.
      It continues through all UK governments and forms all their financial planning.It is they, that the UK government (any) looks to for all these things. They have proven time and time again, they are no friend to Scotland.

      SG really really needs to be on it’s toes when looking at this deal/ Scotland bill, every word treble checked for double meaning. Nothing can be taken as it is, with a myriad of tests and expert opinion required, to find traps therein for Scotland. Even then…..

    272. sensibledave says:

      ArtyHetty at 12:18 pm

      “Why is sensibledave back?”

      … because the subject matter under discussion, and the outcome of the referendum will affect me.

      “there must be a calling for his sort down south. Lots of lying, stifling debate, and scaremongering will be the sort of skills they’ll be looking for right now up until their referendum.”

      My sort? Lying? and most incredibly “Stifling debate”?

      … your lack of self awareness is just stunning! Read it again Arty, you started with “why is sensibledave back” and finished with “stifling debate” – I guess irony is not a word you are familiar with!

    273. Graham MacLure says:

      Looks as if S.Dave is on a zero hours contract and they only call on him when they need him. Shows the shallowness of the talent pool. Hang in there pal and you might get a call for the fast approaching Indy Ref as well.

    274. Valerie says:

      Luigi

      Totally agree with your analysis of BoGo, totally clinical operator, all in the service of his own advancement.

      @sensible

      The timing of your appearance is indeed curious. Why if no one down there cares what we think on this subject?

      However, I will take this opportunity, just in case you decide to take time to engage with your own countrymen, on this important subject, to thank you.

      I believe I speak for a sizeable portion of the Scottish populace, and want to thank you and your countrymen, for keeping Gorgeous George busy down there.

      Please keep him as a free gift.

    275. Petra says:

      @ Nana says at 11:15 am …. ”While people are forced to use foodbanks and folk are asked to clean for queenie….”

      queens-corgis-are-fed-steak-on-silver-platters-by-a-butler-royal-animal-psychologist-reveals-a6888551.html

      http://archive.is/G7hMM

      That just about sums up the kind of country we’re living in now Nana and isn’t it just beyond belief that the people of England (and the Queen) turn a blind eye to the horrendous level of inequality that permeates this country. MILLIONS of poor kids in the UK living in abject poverty, many starving, whilst dogs eat steak off of silver platters. It’s enough to make you think that you’re going doolally.

      When the Queen goes, sooner than later, the Monarchy is going to take a big hit. Charles is not popular and Prince William is basically a layabout (unlike his aunty Anne, father and granny). He and his wife (the boss) are just a couple of gravy train riders. I was reading that he didn’t do a hands turn for the first 47 days of this year and then came out to discuss Brexit. We’re forking out billions for this …. so yes no thinking about it … we ARE doolally.

      ……………………….

      From dogs to horses:

      I was just watching the Daily Politics show with the highly obnoxious Jo Coburn interviewing George Galloway. Too long to go into but she basically duped him into appearing on the programme to highlight how unpopular he is by showing a video of people leaving a conference he was speaking at. He went RIGHT through her, over and over again, and at one point said ”you’re determined to discuss me not my views on Brexit. I wonder why you didn’t ask your last guest why he claimed £40,000 of tax-payers money to heat a stable for his horses.” I missed the ‘guests’ name – may have been Tory Nadhim Zahawi who claimed £200,000 in one year for his energy bills.

    276. heedtracker says:

      My sort? Lying? and most incredibly “Stifling debate”?

      You are an awful teller of UKOK whoppers sensibledave.

      Personally, I prefer the hard core yoon culture online, currently going UKOK apeshit over Brexit, except its not Brexit that’s got them jumping mad as a box of frogs, British frogs, its Scottish democracy.

      Just keep posting what your fellow tory delights of Britishness do up here in your Scotland region, “you lost, shadap!” and “why cant you voters do as we tell you!” sort of UKOK red and blue tory straight shooting.

      All of the above is BBC vote SLab Scotland’s daily out pouring/shrieking sensible.

      eg sensible, red tory unionism at its creepiest, and all because Scotland wont vote for them any more

      https://twitter.com/drscottthinks

    277. Dr Jim says:

      @sensibledave

      Dave son, I don’t give a flying Fukc what English voters do or don’t do, or think or don’t think
      I don’t Fukcing live there so as I explained it’s got sod all to do with us except for the fact that once again Scotland is dragged into the Tory party’s shenanigans and we have to react not pro-act and I don’t like that

      It demonstrates once again that Scotland Wales and Northern Ireland might just as well not exist as far as any self determination goes

      Except for the one thing Scotland has the others don’t and I’ve said it before Location x3 and ultimately that is Scotlands upper hand and that’s what the London political establishment fear apart from the fact that England can’t feed itself and has to import,

      We might decide that Vladimir Putin is a nice guy in an Independent Scotland or maybe not, or We might just let his boats come fishing here or maybe not, but it will be our decision and not Englands

      Therein lies the Tory fear, loss of control
      You want to play games, we can play games, but don’t even bother talking finance,that will never be a worry, as far as joining the EU am I bovvered, I’ll vote IN but that’s part of the game innit

      Yes, I agree with the good old Great British United Kingdom of England “Let’s take back control” their phrase not mine

      BTW William Hague seems to agree with me too,
      changed his tune eh

    278. sensibledave says:

      Valerie at 1:24 pm

      You wrote “The timing of your appearance is indeed curious. Why if no one down there cares what we think on this subject?”

      I do care. I care what everyone thinks (well apart from the loonies). I engage with people of all political persuasions. I can see, once again, you are gong down the “paid hack” line – which I will take as a compliment.

      The EU referendum debate, as evidenced by the most visible protagonists in the news, is not going to be fought within the traditional party lines – so, in that respect, it is apolitical.

      As stated previously, I do not yet have enough data to decide my position on the referendum. However, I do know that I will make up my mind based upon the arguments rather than which high profile individuals may also have decided one way or another. Its called independent thought.

      If I decide I want to leave, then, indeed, on that one specific vote, I would find myself voting the same way as George Galloway and Boris Johnson. On the other hand if vote to “Stay” then doubtless I will be voting with the likes of Alex Salmond, Jeremy Corbyn and the official Labour Party line, The Greens and the Libdems.

      Strange times indeed.

      I believe I speak for a sizeable portion of the Scottish populace, and want to thank you and your countrymen, for keeping Gorgeous George busy down there.

      Please keep him as a free gift.

    279. Jack Murphy says:

      Petra at 1:24pm:-
      “From dogs to horses:
      I was just watching the Daily Politics show with the highly obnoxious Jo Coburn interviewing George Galloway.” [on the BBC]

      Someone’s put it up on YouTube:-

      http://tinyurl.com/jmpjsqa

    280. ArtyHetty says:

      Bit of a contradiction there from not so sensible dave. So ‘no one in england cares’ about Scotland
      in this EU in-out referendum, and yet why the incessant comments and defensive remarks on WoS.

      If it affects you, then given the fact that Scotland is apparently of no consequence to those South of the border, it might be better for you, to take your arguments to your england centric friends and foes.

    281. K1 says:

      sensible rave, the big ‘I’ am. Same old same old rave spluttering arrogance and patronising pish…the song remains the same.

    282. yesindyref2 says:

      @sensibledave
      “So, unlike Scots pro-indy supporters that decided, en masse, long ago that it is in the best interest of their Independence cause to take the “Remain” stance”

      So you think that around 66% of people in Scotland are in favour of Independence?

      Will this affect the votes of the English voters on the EU?

    283. Fred says:

      Petra, very well said. Don’t engage with trolls folks, the guy is a fanny, no receiver just a transmitter.

    284. K1 says:

      Thanks for the link Jack, I appreciate yer capacity to find the relevant links to some of the btl o/t’s on the threads of late, good on ye 🙂

    285. Nana says:

      @Petra

      It is not the first time the queen has shown total disregard for the wellbeing of the people who keep her in good style. I remember some time ago she tried to get money from the state poverty funds. Monarchy are leeches.

      As for Charlie boy, well he does choose some weird pals.

      http://archive.is/jGBnf

    286. Gary45% says:

      Mr Sensible??,
      Think back to last years election, I hate to say this but the English shat themselves, and believed the establishment propaganda machine, with regards to “Scotland ruling England with an SNP/labour coalition.
      During the referendum in 2014 we were fed the equal family of nations and all that bollocks.
      You have to be pretty dim if you cannot see the imbalance, if Scotland, Wales and NI vote to stay, but England votes to leave.
      If this is the outcome, then Independence for Scotland is the only vision for the future.
      Keep trolling, it gives us a laugh, as you are as interesting as wood chip wall paper swatches.

    287. Petra says:

      @ Nana says at 4:47 pm …. ”Petra …. It is not the first time the queen has shown total disregard for the wellbeing of the people who keep her in good style. I remember some time ago she tried to get money from the state poverty funds. Monarchy are leeches. As for Charlie boy, well he does choose some weird pals.

      http://archive.is/jGBnf

      Yeah it’s just disgusting Nana that we live in a Country headed by a family who are the biggest benefit scroungers by far in the UK …… with a close eye needing to be kept on Willie (future King Billy) and Kate.

      Then we are being controlled by a bunch of narcissists in the Commons: worst still paying to be dictated to by over 800 unelected parasites in the House of Lords.

      As to Charlie and his pals. Takes after daddy and brother Andrew. I’m sure you’ll have read about them all.

      The whole scenario is like something out of a Grimms fairy (scary) tale.

    288. Does Hattie Jacques Baillie never listen to English National Meejah greetin’ aboot the state o’ the English National Health service?



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