Going walkabout
Posted on
April 11, 2020 by
Chris Cairns
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11 04 20 12:57
Going walkabout | speymouth
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Nice one Chris, lets just tilt the machine and end the game.
Clever!
Needs ‘older couples who don’t go single file to pass you on fenced path’. I have encountered several while going food shopping. On Thursday I had to turn and face the fence after realising they were not going to single file. The woman made some comment about it being terrible. Yes, love, it is and you are not FUCKING HELPING.
I SHOULD not still be infectious. On reaching the supermarket I donned my twin cartridge respirator and gloves just in case I still am. Because I don’t want infecting someone else on my conscience.
Yesterday on my run on a pavement with cars parked on it to avoid a man with a dog I had to sprint outside two cars with a vehicle coming behind me. I survived, just. I don’t want to infect anyone else.
By the time I need to go out again I can be 99.999% sure I’m not infectious and since I ‘should’ be immune I will be fine. So the very uncomfortable PPE can be ditched.
/rant
The game can’t end – what will they do with all these fancy new ‘quarantine centres’?
It must be Saturday. Good one Chris!
Let’s use a relatively simple analogy to try and work out the options.
Arguably, New Zealand’s approach is analogous to a family, in a city somewhere in the UK, where a family comprises Mum, Dad, two kids of school age and 80 year old gran that lives with them. Because of Gran, the whole family started isolation together 6 weeks ago – to protect Gran. No one has left the house. They are all well.
Mum and Dad have not been to work, the kids have not been to school. They have not been exposed to the virus.
What happens next? At what point do the kids go back to school or parents go back to work? How do they manage their re-entry into society? How long after the last reported case of the virus in the UK before is it safe for them to go out? What about international travel? Do we stop international travel? For how long? Until there are no reported cases of the virus anywhere in the world?
It seems to me that unless the virus is completely eradicated, or a successful vaccine has been developed, then no one in that family can come out without a real risk of being exposed and then the whole family being exposed. If the majority of people at school, or at work, are immune though, because they have had it (if indeed immunity comes from having had it) – then they might have a chance of re-entering society, but not being exposed.
The UK government’s strategy, for better or worse, is effectively, to allow the “controlled” spread of the virus (i.e. “controlled” by not stopping everything, everywhere and somethings continuing) at a rate that allows the NHS to cope with those that require hospitalisation and more critical care.
To those that are opposed to that strategy. Talk me through your preferred alternative and how we return to a “normal” society. Use my imaginary family that are all in isolation in a house somewhere in a city in the UK.
I am truly open to listening to alternatives.
Nice one Chris.The site owner wiil like it too I’m sure.
Could’ve sworn it was Sunday today.
You forgot the junkies (well at least where I live).
Muscle guy – I’m sure you can get a Hazmat suit on Amazon…
I’m going to be the spaceship that zooms along the top from time to time, because in a few weeks I have to drive a distance to pick up a new puppy that was all set up weeks before COV19.
I’ll be a walker, a driver, a dog walker all in one day… I have 4 or 5 weeks to hope the lock down might be lifted, which ought to be plenty, but if these twats with holiday homes and camper vans keep the plague on simmer for the summer, who knows when restrictions will be lifted?
What do I do? Does fetching the puppy count as essential travel? I don’t really see I have a choice. Fines or not, I will have to do it. I can maybe postpone for a week or two at a push, but that leaves a very small window of the 14 weeks for getting a puppy socialised with scary stuff like big machines and stuff.
I know it’s not a big drama beside the immensity of COV19, but like I say, I don’t see I have a choice. It’s the poor wee dogs long term welfare and vital primary development versus an arbitrary definition of non-essential travel. What a shitty choice. I’m currently counting that non-essential travel as essential, but I can readily see some people, particularly those in police uniform, would settle the moral dilemma a different way.
Right now I keep my fingers crossed… tick, tock….
Where’s the big ugly game-symbol of liar and coward Johnson sitting on his fat erse and being proclaimed England’s Messiah?
If you want to know the death total in England it’s best to look at foreign media.
If you want to know the death total in Scotland, Wales & NI the BBC have this covered.
If you want to know if Boris Johnson has taken a shit unaided yet, the BBC is recommended as his minute by minute media outlet.
Has there been any scientific tests on how long the virus is active on paper? I’ve seen a lot of estimates but no firm facts.
I’m only asking as I’ve just received the letter from Boris giving out the advice, but what about all the contacts the letter went through before landing on my mat as I picked it up within minutes of it arriving.
Certainly a great idea from the numpty government to get the herd immunity working!
Could each group not do seperate hours,
7am – runners,
8am – cyclists,
9am – walkers,
10am – families,
11am – oap,
12 – dinner time,
1pm – runners,
2pm – cyclists,
3pm – walkers,
4pm – families,
5pm – oap,
6pm – tea time,
7pm – walkers and families,
8pm – cyclists and runners,
9pm> – oaps and teenagers.
@John Jones
Best be same, lift with pair of tongs, take it out the back, burn intermediately, wash utensils. Return ashes to 10 Downing Street as confirmation you have received his advice and acted on it appropriately, you have destroyed potentially pox infested material.
It still looked like a hangover to me the last time I saw him on TV, coronavirus or bender, you decide.
clever cairnstoon
initially thought it was a link to one of revstu’s gaming reviews
i’m also wondering where the uk mass burials are taking place
msm are keen to show other countries misery
boris’ resurrection will headline easter sunday, nae doot
Sensible Dave
Your analysis is correct.
I’ve been espousing that for some time and, as you would imagine, been branded a nazi, murderer, you name it.
Experts are now predicting that the hit to the economy, with the resultant unemployment, poverty, depression, alcoholism, ill health, will produce far more premature deaths than corona virus.
The only way out of this is a phased return to normal life probably starting in about a weeks time, two max.
Most of the posters on here are either retired, unemploy(ed)(able) or on benefits and therefore are not much affected by this and can pontificate without seeing much change to their income.
What we do is protect all our loved ones for as long as we can giving them all the quality of life we can for all of their natural life.
We don’t become fascists or wild animals who kill for their own benefit.
Hitler wiped out over 400,000 weak and infirm Germans as they would be
Holding back his party’s quest to conquer the world.
I don’t ever want to see a world where we put money in front of our loved ones lives.
I would, just like in world war 2 take up arms and kill people like Dave who want to wipe out the civilised world and one by one kill all of my loved ones for being ill, being old or being unemployed.
People who want to control every aspect of the media to endure their lies are the one and only truth.
Dave would like us to wipe out Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, Socialism and humanity to save some money and it can make people like Bojo De Peffle, Greece Mogg, Gideon Osbourne and Ian Universal Discredit Smith even more filthy rich.
So Dave, you could work this Christian Holiday, you could go out and catch the virus and pass it on to all your loved ones, especially the old ones you could finish off quickly, send all your money to any of the above and end it all.
Save your pin up boys time and money having to come and get you.
Sounds like Dave is some psychopathic soldier desperate to kill and serve his masters without question.
A nice position in the 77th could be an on-line haven until the billets can be handed out again.
Pete,
Are you a higher rank than Davie boy?
Scot Finlayson 12:08
you forgot;
10pm – Showers
(or would that be gas I smell??)
Rocket.
Aaaggh, Chris, you should have done a version of Frogger where joggers, dog walkers and people with prams have to cross the park while dodging the police.
Breeks:
Scotgov guidelines say you can travel to look after someone else’s animal, or collect it. I looked into this as the breeder of my dog lives in Ayr, and as we have no family she would come over to the east coast to collect him if we are ill or worse. Guidelines are on the Scotgov website. My solicitor thought the journey would be OK, and as long as the distancing guidelines are observed there shouldn’t be a problem. I would think your journey would be OK, I would do it. A puppy will cheer you up :-).
@Pete & Dud
Unfortunately for you Topf & Son are no longer in business, it takes quite an effort to dispose of so many bodies.
When we get around to counting the dead – I hope all those fully supportive of the house arrest, changes in Law, lock-down, stopping life in general, killing businesses – are prepared to take account of their actions for killing people?
The virus will account for itself and is largely outwith our control. These current measures, however, are within our control and tantamount to murder. Those cheering it on are an affront to humanity and should be first in the dock.
All the dummies clapping may just get away with our pity.
I tried googling video to see if there was anything out there for social unrest in Italy – 38 pages of MSM. London Real is under siege – the man may actually be in danger.
‘and the freedom that you sought, drifting like a ghost amongst the trees……this is what will be, this is what will be’ – Bruce Springsteen
Excellent article by Fintan O’Toole on Anglo Saxon exceptionalism as embodied in Boris Johnston. Twitter sky is black today with chickens coming home to roost on the lying media, mouthpieces of the lying Tories.
http://archive.fo/oXpj8
Good cartoon!
Breeks, I feel your pain. After losing our dog in November we were not having another. We got it to February and we so missed getting out that we made the trek from Fife to Dogs Trust. We became the owners of two Chihuahuas at the end of February. The previous owners failed to keep their vaccinations up to date so forward another four weeks, just about to get them out of the house then bang the lock down.
We are keeping to one walk a day, they haven’t been socialised so no problem keeping away from other people but many are forgetting they should keep their dogs on leash.
Good luck with the puppy, you will be house bound for a few more weeks after you get it.
Fear and loneliness is breaking the hearts of our elderly. Community Deaths are through the roof. If someone in a care home sneezes, they are being put down (not in all cases) as COVID, without a test. let me say that again – without a test.
A lot of old folks get by because of their visits, social connections, love, the power of just hugging family and loved ones, the belief in their own humanity and that of others.
Every day that goes by with this ‘lockdown’ is another day of murder. I would go so far as to say it is evil – for why else would places of worship be closed, people being laid to rest without a service and on their own with Family being denied attendance at the graveside. That, for me, is the very definition of Evil.
Re. jfngw,
RTN for news mate, the bullshit that comes from British media is fkn spun to fk.
If it was asbestos flying about masks and protective clothing would be mandatory.
Asbestos disease takes fkn years to kick in, Coronavirus fkn instant, no fkn definitive advice on masks other than rsholes saying no proof of protection. If you sneeze with a fkn mask there is a great chance of not spreading.
It seems like there is a ploy to reduce pension pay outs. The powers that be have saved Billions to date.
We are not being looked after, to tell someone to isolate rather than take the contaminated out of society is mind blowing.
WE are being fed shit from the media.
I know more about the USA covid 19 than fkn local Alloa.
Fkn media bstrds.
Sensibledave @11:44
you ask how do we get back to normal.
The answer is simple, we need politicians to be more like rugby players, put their hand in the air, admit they fucked up, and declare everything open Tuesday morning and everyone back to work – EVERYTHING.
Politicians aren’t rugby players though are they? – they’re narcissistic sociopaths who have already WON.
You, me, the neighbours, old people in particular, we’re the losers. Some people just haven’t realised it yet.
and COVID? – we need to face the awful truth and take it on the chin, accept the NHS will triage admissions and show each other a wee bit more love. Death smiles at us all – all we can do, is smile back.
Bit worrying,
Reuters
`At least 91 patients thought to have recovered from the new coronavirus tested positive again in South Korea.
Officials say the virus may have been ‘reactivated’.
Pete says:
11 April, 2020 at 12:20 pm
Sensible Dave
Your analysis is correct.
I’ve been espousing that for some time and, as you would imagine, been branded a nazi, murderer, you name it.
Experts are now predicting that the hit to the economy, with the resultant unemployment, poverty, depression, alcoholism, ill health, will produce far more premature deaths than corona virus….
What utter shite.
COV19 in Scotland is currently killing 9.4% of those it infects, and yet you’d happily see it unleashed upon the whole population in addition to the ‘normal’ background death rate, and you’d do it for the sake of the ignorant economic madness which has left the NHS both in Scotland and England deprived of the money it needs to maintain core services.
The same vile, skinflint Tory instincts which would still rather save some pennies than invest in Ventilators and Virus testing equipment which are vital for containment of the virus, knowing where it proliferates, and how many people are carrying it.
But no, British Tory exceptionalism knows best, and will shun the offer of life saving equipment and cooperation with Europe, not because the UK can cope on it’s own, when it clearly cannot, but because accepting help from Johnny foreigners would require Tories to admit they are useless imbeciles who have no enthusiasm for owning up to the theft of the UK’s public resources over decades. Accepting they have wrecked the UK to the extent it needs emergency help would be an embarrassing climb down, which Tory entitled arrogance simply could not live with, yet as always, it’s not the well healed parasites who suffer. It’s the poor and the infirm who will pay the price.
Own it, you Tory shit bags, own it all. People are now dying in their thousands because your insatiable greed has left the corporeal body of the whole UK anaemic, malnourished, understrength and emaciated to the point it’s muscles have atrophied. And here you are, Pete, even now amidst a global pandemic, greetin’ about your fucking economic gravy train.
Get fucked. Consider yourself now branded a snivelling Tory prick in addition to being a murderous Nazi. If the cap fits, wear it, now take that half empty glass of Tory piss you drink somewhere else.
May the cure for COV19 when it comes, also cure and immunise us all from the lust of Tory greed which put a bigger, bell-end psycho-clown than Pennywise in charge of a UK already broken by Brexit and decades of Tory austerity.
Wow! Well said Breeks.
I see someone called Jack Foster, a reporter for Global radio, is livid that we named a hospital after a Scottish nurse. Anyone who has listened to Global radio news will not be shocked, it is the epitome of BritNat xenophobia, their reports just drip of anti Scottish/SNP propaganda. It’s a sort of verbal Scotsman/Herald.
Breeks
You have written some tripe on here over the years but your last one takes the biscuit.
I note that you have absolutely no plan you wish to forward, you just want to rubbish and insult everyone else.
Btw, I’m just a normal bloke that is no more responsible for covid 19 than you are. The U.K. government is not responsible for covid 19. They are responsible for a plan to deal with it, and you are totally in disagreement.
However, you have demonstrated that you are completely incapable of suggesting an alternative plan.
You’ve got nothing other than bluff and bluster. No thought. No plan. Just … everybody else is wrong.
You are a fool of the first order sir
https://crooksandliars.com/2020/04/venture-capitalist-says-feds-should-let
Breeks,
I think it’s important that you do not overreact and lose sight of facts.
Covid 19 does not kill 9.4% of those infected, we actually don’t know how many people are infected.
The vast majority of the population who are infected will have either mild symptoms or no symptoms.
Your figures are for known infected which is a completely different thing.
Breeks
This is simple problem solving and the current solution will do more harm than good, in my opinion. Your Political rant is entirely justified, people should be angry about austerity, but its so small in the rear view mirror, people can hardly see it.
The ‘cure’ if ever there is one btw, is 12 to 18 months away – this current situation cannot be extended that long – or are you suggesting that it should?
I have always been pretty good with numbers, the UK Governments 80% position re wages cannot be sustained for anymore than a month (and I am being generous here) before its burst – and I am not talking 2008 burst, I am talking burst burst.
Ask yourself why there has not been an economic impact analysis on how much damage is being done to the economy, week by week.
All that is being proposed at the moment – wait for it – is that Facebook does it………Facebook.
The Tory Party are taking the current measures to protect the NHS
Anyone, who can say that with a straight face, has a serious case of cognitive dissonance.
Nice one Chris , I always look forward to seen your cartoon nas currently it’s the only way ai know it’s a Saturday! Thanks Chris.
It doesn’t make my spelling any better though! Should really wear my specs!
A realistic piece from Kevin McKenna, on how nothing will really change after Covid-19 is defeated. Though the ruling class will say it has, and for the better.
http://archive.fo/7jsxD
This certainly wouldn’t surprise me, we really need to be independent.
“Leaked recordings of a Home Office conference call on Tuesday, exclusively obtained by Byline Times, reveal that the Government has all but given up in its fight against the Coronavirus and is intent on simply finding “a method of managing it within the population”.
http://archive.fo/aQlfZ
– missed the comment … duh …
newsreader learns how capitalism works, film at 11 …
and by synchronicity, jesus is just throwing the moneylenders out of the temple in tv film
– was jesus bailing out the usurers?
we need a new beatitudes for the times
blessed are the creditors, for they shall be bailed out
blessed are the zero hours gigs, for they shall receive reward in THE NEXT WORLD
blessed are the anti-social misanthropes, for they shall maintain social distance
blessed are the lewd and lascivious, for they shall have pornhub, may their arms grow strong
I see that Police Gestapo Scotland are out harassing walkers and dog walkers around my way again today. Yet according to Disreporting Scotland on the car radio there are far worse crimes taking place and it is all SNP BAAHHHHD!!! I will give the SNP a break today especially if they sack the head heel clicker C.C.Livingstone.
Oh and the walkers and dog walkers are attempting to walk safely in some plantation forestry where they can keep more than 2m easily from other people.
It’s going to be hard for the Tories to deny the existence of the magic money tree now. They’ll also find it difficult to justify a five week wait before receiving Universal Credit in the future.
I want to see how the furlough payments pan out. If they’re not paid when they said they would be paid, there may well be trouble. I won’t be surprised if the promises are reneged upon.
That’ll certainly bring people onto the streets.
I can count at least four ‘revolutionary’ moments which have bypassed Scotland within the last ten years. This Corona thing is yet another where Scotland has failed to take the initiative.
P.S
Oh and Gove’s idea that we shouldn’t go out walking for more than an hour is a non starter in fact that deformed little anti Scottish bigot and anybody who agrees with him can fuck right off.
Did you ever see Michael Gove when he was pissed in the Houses Of Parliament? If not, you can see it here at the YouTube link below:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=taqxVxSoOB8&fbclid=IwAR1AY0jKzkyn7LU-rgDMtRveXb3XTJGWQnghezeqJPDh-W3u3-uIx23gziw
George Osbourne was a bit of a lad in his day too. Here he is about an hour after taking Cocaine/Ecstasy/Insert your drug of choice here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrsPbtPjGfI
@SensibleDave
New Zealand has complete control of its borders. Which is part of their success. Post the lockdown situation they can test, test, test. All arrivals at their border who are forewarned that anyone carrying the virus will be quarantined. They can even insist all travellers get tested and cleared prior to arrival or no boarding.
They can step up marine patrols which are already very good at noting yachts arriving from the Pacific Islands, Australia and ensure they comply with requirements.
These measures need not go on forever, only until the vaccine is avaiable then deployed. NZ is good at ensuring vaccinations for the population. Then those who are immune compromised etc need to stay away from tourists until this thing burns itself out and immunisation is enough worldwide.
This will ensure tested safe tourists for the tourist industry and enable the export industries to restart with the ships and planes travelling again.
The UK could try the same thing but it won’t and isn’t. People continue to arrive from overseas without testing, without anything being done to isolate or restrict their movements.
Breeks
… you are full of it … until you challenged … then you have nothing, zip, nada.
Empty vessels and all that ….
The Scotland; N Ireland; Wales figures clearly visible on the BBC web sites for each country.
No BBC UK web site or BBC England web site show any England only figure.
Only a UK total figure. 🙁 Surprised not.
Anyhoo!
Scotland ….Today…47….Total…542… BBC
Wales……..Today…36….Total…351… BBC
N. Ireland…Today…15….Total…107… BBC
England……Today…832*..Total…8397* *Sun Newspaper.
—————————————-
UK ……….Today…917″..Total…9875″ “BBC values.
It doesn’t add up but that’s the best I can find. 🙁
Hancock’s mad half hour:
1. “Staff mustn’t over-use the PPE equipment”.
2. “It is not certain that NHS staff have caught the corona virus
while at work”.
Pretty bold statements. That will go down well.
England is now the global Red Zone for Covid19.
How could that happen?
Was it just bad luck, the way the wind was blowing?
Or is it some acts or omissions on the part of Her Mejesty’s government?
Must’ve been the wind,obviously.
Not possible HMG could ever get anything wrong.Is it bbc or Sky?
So, foreigners are inferior?
Oh, no. You are misconstruing what I’m saying… The British are superior.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6a_weyzkY4
Very, very clever – not easy to find something to laugh about in all this.
Dakk
You continue to add nothing of any substance to the debate … other than the normal hatred of Britain and everything that Britain does.
Like Breeks, you wring your hands and shout how disgraceful and appalling the government’s response has been. But like Breeks, apart from the hatred, you have nothing else. No solutions, no alternative plan. Nothing.
The numbers today suggest the U.K. government’s plan is slowly working. It’s the same plan in Scotland too.
What’s your plan Dakk? You don’t have one do you … other than to throw stones at everyone else?
Please share your wisdom Dakk. We can’t wait.
Police Scotland has handout out 537 fines during this crisis compared to 1087 in England and Wales (in today’s briefing). What are Police Scotland up to, by population this should only less than 90 in Scotland.
Either Scots are particularly not law abiding or Police Scotland seem to be over zealous. As the spread and deaths are better in Scotland it would seem the latter. I hope someone in power is asking Police Scotland why they are fining so many people.
jfngw says:
11 April, 2020 at 12:04 pm
If you want to know the death total in England it’s best to look at foreign media.
Don’t like Campbell (no, not the Rev) but spot on here:
https://www.thearticle.com/media-questions-at-no10-briefings-are-woeful-here-are-20-they-should-ask
Sorry, last comment should say ‘should be less than 90’.
Back to normal, what the hell is normal in the uk. A parasitic establishment, posing as the so called wealth creators, cashing in on a pandemic. A government that prioritizes nuclear weapons instead of the health service, so called National projects that appear to have the sole function of of creating jobs for consultants to the tune of hundreds of millions of pounds before they even get started, Privatized industries that are subsidized to the hilt to the benefit of shareholders, food banks, private debt going through the roof, tens of thousands dead caused by needless cuts to services, 4 million children in poverty, the lowest pensions in Europe, a benefits system that makes the sick and disabled jump through hoops.
Just why the fuck does anybody want it to get back to normal.
Yesterday, apparently, the NHS England Chief Nurse refused to answer a question on how many NHS staff have died of coronavirus. She’s called Ruth May and is married to Nigel Beverley who has links with various companies involved in health. Pure coincidence, of course.
https://twitter.com/JeanHatchet/status/1248847386883088384?s=20
The follow the money link:
https://twitter.com/TjayJT/status/1248874863206555648?s=20
@ Golfnut – it’s a poor parasite that kills off its host.
breeks, Dakk
… what’s up chaps… surely, after all your bluster, you actually have an alternative, well thought out plan that you can share?
I’m calling you out. Put up or shut up.
callmedave
From yesterdays New York Times:
“Over the 31 days ending April 4, more than twice the typical number of New Yorkers died.”
That is the information that we need to know, in order to gauge the severity off, and how well/badly different regions and countries are coping with the current health crisis.
We do not need to know how many people’s deaths may have been influenced by covid19 … we need to know how many people have died because of covid19.
Only then should we panic or heave a sigh of relief.
Has tory cabinet minister robert jenrick resigned yet?. Thought not, usual double standards for the unionist scum.
I see the Westminster Cabinet are lining up to commit political hari-kiri. Hancock’s (black) comedy half-hour has been replaced by Patel’s “I’m Sorry, I Haven’t a Clue?”.
“I’m sorry if people feel there have been failings” – clearly the idea that there is something wrong with the government’s response is out and out ludicrous. The sooner NHS staff realise that this is all their fault and work harder to correct their mistakes the sooner she’ll be able to hang on to her job.
See, it’s all a matter of perception.
So its only snp baaad people that have to resign or be maligned. Not people like tory mp robert jenrick or paedo apologists like willie rennie. You know what you unionist trolls, you can take your double standard union and shove it right up your lying a***holes.
Ah well for those that would have let half a million die in a tidal wave of death you have to grimace at Stanley Johnson saying that Boris nearly took one for the team.
What a fucking joke for any father to say. Just shows you the gene pool that the Johnsons come from.
Mind you he then went on to say it was time we took the pandemic seriously and started to play the game properly.
Presumably that means other people’s families taking one for the team.
Maybe they could start with 79 year old Johnson senior. I mean he opined who cares if the Irish shoot each other so we know his pedigree
Prof (retired) explaining on BBC news there that every ‘non hospital’ death in England and Wales will all end up in time with the Off Nat Stats. (ONS)
If on the death certificate (which has two parts) covid#19 is mentioned for any reason it will end up as a death from the virus.
He went on to say it all depends on who fills in the certificate.
Old Queenie Liz the Lush has just announced Coronavirus will not overcome us.
Maybe the good old gal will do the decent thing and take one for the team. At 93 she is well past the sell by date that her prime minister and his chums had in mind when they didn’t mind expending the lives of a few pensioners to protect the economy.
But no. Like her plague ridden son a Prince Charles of the same Ilk who fled to Scotland to then demand priority home treatment from the Aberdeenshire NHS old Queenie is holed up on a royal estate supported by the finest medical staff possible.
So that’s the Easter message folks. Take one for the team. Do your patriotic duty. Head to the gas chambers of your duty.
Dulce et decorum est. Pro patria more.
@Capella
That’s the trouble – they’re rich parasites.
Callmedave
Is has been mentioned a few times … but there are those on heat that are too blind to see and too deaf to hear. As was mentioned further up the thread, once we have total (all deaths) over day a 6 month period, then we can look at previous years figures and approximate the true impact in terms of additional deaths.
… on here (not on heat!)
Willie 5.57
And Stanley Johnson made that statement from his ‘home’ in Devon.
As opposed to his ‘home’ in London.
http://archive.is/cTqC9
And even if Scotland gets independence and stays in the EU
We’ll still be stuck with him!
http://archive.is/NnVxV
BBC and Sky still dumbing down their ‘news’ despite England being the world’s hot spot death zone.
Not that I will ever expect any different.
I’ll give up.
Stick to Al Jezeera and Euronews.
@ Conan the Librarian 🙂
The thing about the propaganda soft soaping treatment of England’s Red Zone tragedy that’s different from their usual modus operandi is this.
This time the great british media are not covering up a few thousand deaths in far off places where brown people are just collateral damage in their warmongering adventures.
It’s thousands of their own folk including decent hardworking civilians working in the NHS who the media are letting down just to protect their masters and peers.
@ Capella.
If only we had a remedy.
Some political satire for youse:
The Unionist’s Sovereignty.
The people of Scotland are sovereign?!! Don’t make me laugh. Your claim of sovereignty and Scottish constitution is based on documents and laws that come from history: Declaration of Arbroath and Claim of Right. And daftest of all: you are sovereign because you declare yourselves sovereign? What utter tosh!
When will you people in North Britain learn: UK Parliament is sovereign. And I will tell you why:
Crown in Parliament. Did you hear me? CROWN IN PARLIAMENT!
In England the monarch is sovereign but lends their sovereign power to parliament so that makes parliament sovereign.
So what makes the monarch sovereign? asks the Scot.
The monarchs said so. That goes way back into ancient times. It’s ancient law. That’s why it’s right.
But, I thought in the 1600’s Cromwell’s Parliament chopped Charles I’s head off, and declared parliament sovereign? asks the Scot.
Yes, parliament was sovereign.
But, you said the Crown was sovereign and it’s Crown in Parliament that makes parliament sovereign. So parliament wasn’t sovereign when there was no Crown and England was a republic? asks the Scot.
Yes, parliament was sovereign then also.
But you said sovereignty comes from the Crown. So, where did parliament’s sovereignty come from when there was no Crown? asks the Scot.
Parliament declared itself sovereign.
So, now there is a monarch again, doesn’t that make the monarch sovereign? asks the Scot.
Oh no, parliament is sovereign.
But how is parliament sovereign? asks the Scot.
Crown in parliament! Is that so difficult to understand?
It seems we’re going round in cirles here, says the Scot. I cannae follow that at all. So, what makes the monarch sovereign to make the parliament sovereign, even though the English parliament was sovereign without a monarch to make it sovereign?
The monarch of England is sovereign; that’s just the way it is, going back hundreds of years.
Now you see why England’s constitution of parliamentary sovereignty became Britain’s supreme constitutional principle? Our constitution makes sense; its modern, not based on history or tradition. It makes sense, doesn’t it?
Does it? asks the Scot. Seems to me youse just make it up as you go along.
The flexibility of the UK constitution is one of the great things about it but, of course that’s not just making it up as we go along. It’s based on English legal principles dating back hundreds of years. That’s why it’s superior.
@ Golfnut – they’re going to have a hard time getting everyone to go back to work and go shopping again. I guess 6 months should do it?
Some funny stats I saw reported by the BBC.
Apparently, on analysing the deaths it appears that there is a much larger proportion of Black and Asians than White people dying from this disease.
Maybe it’s because London and Birmingham are the hot spots and there is a bigger proportion of ethnic minorities in these two centres.
Anyway, very interesting.
I see newspapers are all bleating about how they might go out of business. With few exceptions, they are collectively nothing but the propaganda tools of some very rich people, so I hardly think we will miss them.
Then in a whole different class, you have the likes of SKY and BBC news, where so-called ‘journalists’ are literally falling over themselves, to be first in line to crawl up Boris Johnson’s backside. Just look at the sycophantic toadying of the so-called ‘Westminster’ journalists, failing to even try to hold the government to account.
Meanwhile, the UK now has the highest daily death toll from Corona, of ANY European country. Still, testing is inadequate, still PPE is unavailable for key sectors. Still, the entire media class, fail to tackle this inept and criminally culpable Government in London.
England, pooling and sharing its misery and stupidity with Scotland, and across the UK. It’s Boris Johnson and not the innocent whistle-blower Julian Assange that ought to be in Belmarsh prison. Boris and his government have innocent blood on their hands, but will NEVER be held to account.
Great cartoon, BTW.
Breastplate says:
11 April, 2020 at 1:51 pm
Breeks,
I think it’s important that you do not overreact and lose sight of facts.
Covid 19 does not kill 9.4% of those infected, we actually don’t know how many people are infected….
https://www.travellingtabby.com/scotland-coronavirus-tracker/
Right now, the TravellingTabby site I follow is quoting a fatality rate of 9.7% of total cases in Scotland. That the Tories are now privately discussing ‘everybody’ catching the virus, is nothing short of a scandal on top of a disgrace.
Granted, there’s a chance the figure is high because patients dying might have underlying medical conditions, but these are also patients who are lucky enough to be getting medical care. If the numbers keep growing, the system will eventually be overstretched and the current access to care and ventilators will be more difficult and have it’s own impact on fatalities.
I don’t believe that I am overreacting. 9.7% Fatality is the figure quoted and the trend is up.
The fact we don’t know how many people have the virus is precisely the point I’m making. Testing is a vital component of the lock down, otherwise you are blind to where the virus actually is, and we’ll living with unnecessary lockdowns which don’t do anything, or see stubborn new infections breaking out whenever lockdown is eased.
To
Sensibledave
Pete
Thehundredthidiot
The three stooges
Farcical nonsense day in and day out
Covid19 is killing 1000 a day in U.K. and will continue to do so for weeks to come
This weekend it killed more than were killed in 9/11
Each day more die from covid19 in U.K. than we’re killed each day in the Iraq war
And here we have the three stooges saying everyone should go back to work to school to uni back to normal life all shops pubs restaurants schools open from Monday
The original three stooges merited a laugh
These three stooges are just laughable for their idiocy
To
Sensibledave
Pete
Thehundredthidiot
You are the three stooges
Farcical nonsense day in and day out
Covid19 is killing 1000 a day in U.K. and will continue to do so for weeks to come
This weekend it killed more than were killed in 9/11
Each day more die from covid19 in U.K. than we’re killed each day in the Iraq war
And here we have the three stooges saying everyone should go back to work to school to uni back to normal life all shops pubs restaurants schools open from Monday
The original three stooges merited a laugh
These three stooges are just laughable for their idiocy
Hi dakk at 6:31 pm.
You typed,
“Stick to Al Jezeera and Euronews.”
I’ve tried with Chrome, Firefox and Safari. How do you get sub-titles on Euronews? It won’t change from ‘off’ to ‘on’ in the settings.
Earlier today on BBC News 24, I managed to watch the BBC anchor taking to a BBC correspondent based in Spain, about the countries latest figures for deaths due to Covid 19.
He was explaining why the figures should be treated with a ‘pinch of salt’.
His logic was very reasonable, and no doubt he was correct.
However, would the BBC dare to say the same about the UK’s figures for deaths due to Covid 19?
The figures for England are only in respect of those people who were hospitalised and tested positive for Covid 29 when they died.
The figure for Scotland is also in respect of deaths in hospitals, but it now also includes deaths in the community.
I have been unable to find the figure for deaths that occur in hospital. It appears the Scottish Government does not provide a breakdown of their new method of counting deaths in Scotland.
While the UK Government are happy to accept the new Scottish figures that include deaths that occurred in its communities, they are reluctant to include figures for deaths due to Covid 19 in England’s communities.
I am not sure what the ‘benefit’ is for Scotland to break ranks, but I have noticed the ‘benefit’ for the UK Government.
The mainstream media almost always invariably fail to report their headline for the UK’s deaths due to Covid 19 are people who were hospitalised.
By not providing a very important caveat to the UK total, that when deaths in the community are included, the UK total will be much higher.
It is right for the Scottish Government to count deaths in the community, but they should keep this figure, and the figure for deaths in hospital entirely separate.
Iain More says:
11 April, 2020 at 2:39 pm
I see that Police Gestapo Scotland are out harassing walkers and dog walkers around my way again today….
I don’t know whether the police are right or wrong, but I’m not surprised they’re perceived to be heavy handed.
I’m thinking back to the Foot and Mouth epidemic back in 2001. Scotland was brutal and ruthless in it’s efforts to contain the spread, but grimly successful, while England seemed to be more lax and suffered an alarming and much wider spread of the disease.
Scotland’s authorities doesn’t muck about when the threat is real. Stop it first, then worry about the hurty feelings later. When the threat is real, the normal rules don’t apply. Don’t go calling them Gestapo. It’s all as new to them as it is to you and me. Take your warning in your stride and work with them rather than against them.
In my experience, Scottish troops are exactly the same. They get chucked in at the deep end because they can be relied upon to get the job done, but it’s not always pretty. It’s the Scottish way, and you’re just better not getting on the wrong side of it.
If Scotland was a dog, it would most definitely bite when threatened. Everyone should understand this.
Hi Brian dtt
I’m watching it on VirginTV ch622,so not sure about computer version sibtitles.
I’m not tech savvy, but will try on my android phone.
@ bdtt
Had a go on phone but no joy.
Maybe a techy Winger could advise.
Richard Murphy says that Modern Monetary Theory has won the day. He has other interesting articles on the far reaching consequences of the current collapse of normal behaviour.
Radio Scotland interviewed a behavioural scientist today from Edinburgh University, a Dr. Bauld. She opined that governments should begin talking about getting back to work and school and going out shopping again like good little consumers.
But I think a long pause for reflection will do us no harm. Wildlife is reclaiming the countryside again. Deer are wandering down motorways and peering over garden fences. Beavers are splashing about in pools less than 2 miles from Stirling. All sorts of bees and birds and insects are thoroughy enjoying the respite from man’s dominion.
Sadly, Richard Murphy doesn’t think it possible to introduce Universal Basic Income atm. Pity. I don’t see why not. It would remove all the glaring anomalies of the current lopsided, piecemeal, ham-fisted method of keeping people alive. As someone on twitter pointed out, we should pay the front line workers £65,000 a year plus bonuses and pay the bankers £25,000
https://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2020/04/07/the-ft-says-its-time-for-the-bank-of-england-to-start-direct-funding-of-the-government-modern-monetary-theory-has-won-the-day/
@ bdtt
There’s an English version incase your on the Arabic or Spanish version.
@ BDTT – I don’t know what you’re watching euronews on but on my laptop it’s all in English. There’s a drop down arrow at the top left of the home page which gives you an option to choose the language.
https://www.euronews.com
BBC reporting what a disaster 2,000 a day dying in the USA is. It obviously missed their maths that the UK death rate would be over 5,000 a day (6,000 if you count the hidden deaths in England) if we had the same population as the USA.
The BBC wilfully misleading the UK population about the competence of the Boris Johnson government.
Seen a report that a UK private plane was turned back by France containing a number of older men and women in their twenties. First thought, obviously not Prince Andrew.
Pete 7.17
Any links to that ‘virus has ethnic bias’ story?
I hope folks are ignoring the two Tory clowns, who are ideologically opposed to a scientific world view. They obviously also lack practical experience of government.
The rational approach to this situation is to adopt a “precautionary” approach. Tories are ideologically opposed to this approach to government and public health.
@Pete & Dave
You’re a couple of bigoted morons and a threat to public health. Chase yourselves.
The precautionary principle:
protecting public health, the environment
and the future of our children
http://www.euro.who.int/__data/assets/pdf_file/0003/91173/E83079.pdf
my take on the numbers presented by Aunty
Deaths % of Deaths
N Ireland 107 1.08%
Scotland 542 5.49%
Wales 351 3.55%
England 8875 89.87%
Total 9875
they are going very strong on numbers in other countries and as usual no number for England
Numbers…
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/coronavirus/?utm_source=mixi&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=covid_partners
Mike Cassidy 8.45
Tried to find it but so far no luck.
I was surprised reading it on the BBC as they are usually very quiet on these things but the statistics were so detailed and from a reliable source that they probably had no choice.
Took me quite aback.
I’ll try to get back to you.
Hi peeps.
Dakk and Capella mentioned ‘language’.
I’m on the Euronews English site. But… I usually have a news channel on my second monitor, with the sound muted and sub-titles on, so I can glance at it every so often, while I’m doing the really important stuff on my main monitor.
That’s why I want sub-titles; not to translate what’s being said.
jfngw
None of the passengers were UK nationals
Tories are ideologically opposed to the precautionary principle. The precautionary principle is strongly linked with evidence based medicine. Evidence based medicine is not possible without a legal respect for biology.
The Precautionary Principle, Evidence-Based Medicine, and Decision Theory in Public Health Evaluation
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpubh.2016.00107/full
@ Pete:
“Apparently, on analysing the deaths it appears that there is a much larger proportion of Black and Asians than White people dying from this disease”
Hmmm? Could this be something to do with the way white or lighter skin gets plenty of vitimin (K or D, I can’t remember) from the sun, while dark skin doesn’t?
This would be worth doing further research on.
The most depressing thing about this fuckin ‘crisis’, for me anyway, is seeing people I respect and have known for years (some of them are right here in this place) succumbing to bog-standard hysteria.
For the best part of a decade we’ve been learning how to watch the msm, how to read it. We’ve developed antennae when it comes to nailing bullshit, ‘fake’ news, misdirection, distraction, straw-man arguments, circular reasoning, ad hominem, non sequiturs etc.
But here we are, arguing about whether or not it’s ‘responsible’ to follow whatever dictat-de-jour emerges from Westminster?
We’ve lost our fuckin minds.
Literally.
Neighbours spying on each other. People terrified to sit on park benches. Loved ones separated for weeks, months, not knowing if they’ll ever get to see each other again. And worst of all – our own parents, siblings, children, left alone in hospital wards to die without seeing us.
It is despicable what is happening. No, despicable isn’t strong enough…it’s fuckin diabolical.
We’re already under ‘voluntary’ house-arrest and curfew could well be imminent – how long before we require a passport to go out of our own front doors?
We’re being played like a penny whistle.
🙁
@ Mike Cassidy at 8.45
The excess BAME deaths are, briefly, mentioned in the video linked to here : https://twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/1248006240963190784.
It’s worth watching anyway, despite being quite long.
The extra deaths could be due to demographics (within the health service, for instance), or to some inherent greater susceptibility. Patrick Roden (at 9.38) is right that vitamin D may play a part, though at our latitude, no-one gets “plenty”, especially in winter. There are other differences, too – South Asians have a higher incidence of diabetes and a number of other conditions. Overall, though, this needs more research.
Ian Brotherhood
You are quite correct and I need say no more.
My wife and I are going for dinner tomorrow to our daughter and husband’s farm.
Need I say anything else.
According to people on here I’m a fascist and nazi.
GUARDIAN
UK government urged to investigate coronavirus deaths of BAME doctors
http://archive.is/5cYVo
BBC
Are minorities being hit hardest by coronavirus?
http://archive.is/z0Srb
CNN
Is Britain’s minority community disproportionately affected by the coronavirus? Lack of public data makes it difficult to answer
http://archive.is/gLITf
CNN
Coronavirus hitting some African American communities extremely hard
http://archive.is/O9MM2
Hi Ian B at 9:43 pm.
“We’re being played like a penny whistle.”
Those who don’t read WOS or Craig Murray or Wee Ginger Dug or Peter A Bell, no doubt.
Tories are ideologically opposed to a scientific world view and the precautionary approach to government. Tories don’t trust science, and prefer to grounded their world view in culture and tradition instead. This is not good.
The impact of Brexit on the future of UK forensic science and technology
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0379073819302853
Don’t get me wrong, I’m ragging at this enforced limitation on my liberty. This situation should have been better prepared for, and handled more rationally. Unfortunately, nailing the bastards responsible will unlikely in Brexitania, detached as it is from the justice of the natural law tradition.
Does anyone know if the Coronavirus Bill allows the establishment to monitor your phone to see if you are in or out and if out where you are going and for how long.
Scot Finlayson says:
11 April, 2020 at 10:21 pm
Does anyone know if the Coronavirus Bill allows the establishment to monitor your phone to see if you are in or out and if out where you are going and for how long.
I don’t go out much, but when I do I leave my phone at home.
The Scottish civil service have been instructed to adopt an approach to the law that is incompatible with a legal respect for biology. This is diametrically opposed to ethical policy design grounded in natural law, and undermines Scottish democracy. Get it sorted, please.
Intensive care consultant’s interview was the coronavirus message we all needed to hear
http://archive.is/WoSVH
Here’s the interview.
No comment needed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejlbCmRJMW4
Scot Finlayson – tracking is already happening, but probably couldn’t be used as evidence against you.
Ian B – France now requires permit and photo ID, caught out first time without permission or outwith the specified hour times, it’s a 125e fine – 4th time caught is jail time (6 months)
And people still think that this is about easing pressure on the NHS. They’re not crashing the World economy and handing out money in buckets for no reason.
I expect Curfew to be announced this week to stop people being out after dark – even in your own garden. If I am right about that, then people should think very carefully why that is.
Go see your loved ones while you can would be my advice.
Say what you need to say.
@ ahundredthidiot
Nope. The ‘Attestation De Deplacement Derogatoire’ doesn’t say anything about which specified hours you are permitted to leave your house.
It says you’re allowed one hour exrecise but doesn’t say when you have to take it. On you go if you fancy a walk at 3am in the morning.
BTW, I have never seen a single policeman anywhere here apart from the first day the restrictions came into force, which would have been March 16th.
@Pete
Are you hinting it could be royalty then?
Not being able to play golf 3/4 times a week has certainly reduced my vitamin D intake. 15 mins sunshine a day normally allows individuals to top their Vitamin D up. You would have to eat a hell of a lot of meat( so I’m told) to make up the loss of that 15 min walk in the Sun. Bernie Saunders wanted the U.S. gov to supply every household with a supplement and I’ve read at least 1 fb article calling on the Scot Gov to do the same.
@Pete:
I won’t throw any names your way, there’s enough aggro doing the rounds anyway.
Just thinking what For rest would have thought about meeting up down on the farm.
His simple answer was ‘Stupid is as stupid does’
For me, I don’t think you’re stupid,
I love my wins too but I’m not going to do it.
Up to you, Bud.
Give em a hug from me
I did a frozen food run to my son the other day, felt almost criminal driving there.
Silly me.
We exchanged gifts, spoke over the car for 10 mins,then I left.
Is felt weird,but then again it’s what’s needed then I’ll do it.
I take a multi vit and bio cultures every day for the immune system.
Re house arrest. If the UK had done the right thing at the start of the pandemic, i.e. test test test, quarantine contacts, and limit flights in, then we wouldn’t need strict social distancing. But they didn’t.
If the UK had funded the NHS properly and maintained spare capacity and stocks of PPE and ventilators for a possible pandemic, which was a known risk, then we would have contained the spread. But they didn’t.
The Westminster government is run by incompetent shysters.
They think they can lie and bluff their way out of any mess, no matter how catastrophic. The corrupt media fail to hold them to account. So that leaves only the internet as a source of information. But we have to be wary of mad conspiracies.
I like Greta Thunberg’s motto, “we can all unite behind the science”.
BDDT
Euronews:
Here in Frankfurt I have Unity media as my TV provider.
I’ve about 400 useable channels and Euronews has roughly about 6-7 channels of the same programme but each with its own language. Have a look through your list of channels for Euronews EN.
That way you don’t need to dabble with the settings..! 🙂
I have as standard for foreign channels
CNN
Euronews
France24
Al Jazeerra
RT
BBC Worldwide (Know thine enemy)
Breeks,
I’m not contesting the figures you give but 9.4% of people with Covid 19 do not die.
For example;
100 people contract Covid 19,
50 of these will have no symptoms, they do not seek medicine or medical help as they have no idea they have it.
A further 30 will have mild symptoms and take some cough or flu medicine and do not seek further medical help.
The final 20 get ill and seek medical attention and end up in hospital and being diagnosed with Covid19, 2 of these 20 patients die.
There’s your 9.4% of people known to have Covid 19.
In this scenario 80% had mild or no symptoms and didn’t get tested. Why go to hospital when you are not ill?
Of course this is just a simplified example for easy understanding but in countries where there is mass testing you will find that the percentage of people dying from this virus is lower because it encompasses people that have contracted Covid 19 and will not get sick.
10% of people dying from/with Covid 19 is scary but completely untrue.
Ian Brotherhood,
I do feel as a society, we are making things very difficult for ourselves.
Government needs good advice. Anti-foundational legal practice, such as Brexit and contemporary Scots legal practice regarding women, separates Scotland from the potential to gain justice grounded in science. International law is design to prevent such abuse of power.
The Unrealized Promise of Forensic Science
An Empirical Study of its Production and Use
https://www.rand.org/pubs/working_papers/WR1242.html
@ Capella.
Here’s a wee health tip you might care to try.
Apple cider vinager ( with Mother ) its non pasteurized and the mother is the mother of bio cultures. A half teaspoon( proper measure into glass of water 3 times a day, before meals. Taking the mother culture has obvious benefits as your obviously aware, but the Apple cider vinager ups the acid in your tum, and that acid is what helps your digestive system get the vitamins from your food. The three glasses of water also makes sure your hydrating. If you try it, don’t buy it at the health section, its a fiver, go to the condiments, you’ll get it there for half the price. I go for the Italian which is marked Negro, about £2:99,the bottle lasts about 3 months.
BRIEFING FOR THE HOUSE OF COMMONS SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY COMMITTEE
The Home Office’s oversight of forensic services
December 2014
https://www.nao.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/The-Home-Office%E2%80%99s-oversight-of-forensic-services.pdf
Ian Bruvverhood
“We’re being played like a penny whistle.”
Yes Ian, we ARE the penny whistle, we’re playing to their tune.
Not a shred of sovereign will or backbone from the “Scottish” government.
I hate posting stuff like this because it just draws immediate hostility, but fuck it, this is why I made the intemperate comment earlier (9.43).
No need to watch it all – a few minutes at the start and end of both main segments is enough to get the gist of why some are now calling time on this hysterical shitery:
http://www.brasscheck.com/video/the-science-the-hysteria-and-the-end-game/?omhide=true
Ahhh reminds me of the the halcyon puggies of misspent youth…
Well, unless this thing mutates into a more benign variant – this is our life for a long time to come.
The containment is just to prevent a massive spike until everyone is inured to a certain level of Covid19 deaths’and we all.go back to work; in the same way we are inured to hundreds of thousands of deaths from Seasonal Flu globally every year.
Being pretty much of that ilk, Covid19 is a now a thing, it now exists and will be around alongside Seasonal Flu all the time.
Sure there may be a vaccine, eventually (holding of breath optional) but that is liable to be of the same nature as Seasonal Flu vaccines. It’s doesn’t eradicate it, or stop all the annual Flu deaths, nor does it fix you if you’ve already got it – but does help reduce the annual toll.
The difference being: in future, it won’t be: “I’ve the Flu I’ll be in to work after I’ve shaken it off in a week” (or the bastards ‘I’m indespensible to the company, I’ll still be in to give it to everyone – you’re welcome”
Due to the similarities of some symptoms; it will probably be “I’ve the Lurgy, I’ll be away down the Corona Centre to get tested and given my green/red wrisband or RFID card.
It may actually, paradoxically aid in reducing the seasonal Flu deaths in future, because now people may actually care about the vulnerable with a hacking bad cough and pneumonia – rather than just pull the curtains in the care home, they’ll be tested and treated… Well, we can all dream.
Anyway, there’s still a literal killing to be made from pharmaceuticals – just waiting on them coming out of the coma they’ve just wanked themselves into and we should be looking at paliative vaccines, together with various spurious ‘treatments’ and supermarket-shelf nostrums for years to come. Kerchiingg!
@Golfnut re. Vit D
Due to Scotland’s latitude we toil to get enough sunshine in the winter months to generate Vit D to recommended levels.
During this time the angle of the sun’s rays is acute and the problem is compounded by the cold temperatures meaning folk are well covered in clothing to keep warm and not running around tapsaff stylée.
I take a supplement of D3 during winter, but this last month has seen a rather radical change for my body as I appear to have given up shopping so no meat, milk, butter, coffee, tea, fresh orange juice, and instead I’ve developed “other strategies” to feed myself.
Currently reading up on my latest foraging find, the Bulrush plant, whilst quaffing birch sap I tapped from a tree…
Prescient by either accident or design.
Killing Joke – I Am The Virus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4wdbibV3IM
jfngw says:
11 April, 2020 at 4:52 pm
“Police Scotland has handout out 537 fines during this crisis compared to 1087 in England and Wales (in today’s briefing). What are Police Scotland up to, by population this should only less than 90 in Scotland.
Either Scots are particularly not law abiding or Police Scotland seem to be over zealous. As the spread and deaths are better in Scotland it would seem the latter. I hope someone in power is asking Police Scotland why they are fining so many people.”
Police Scotland are behaving like goosestepping Fascists. Are there not more serious crimes they should really be dealing with and are paid to deal with? Like domestic violence against women and children for one. Which I am told is on the increase with the lock down. I am sure you could think up a few more crimes they should be cracking down on right now as well.
https://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/statistics-and-data/statistics/statistics-by-theme/vital-events/general-publications/weekly-and-monthly-data-on-births-and-deaths/monthly-data-on-births-and-deaths-registered-in-scotland
From the above, the average number of deaths registered in Scotland in the month of march (2015 – 2019) = 5093
Deaths attributed to respiratory diseases since 2000 fluctuated between 428(2000)and 921(2005) last years being 546, this is probably due to the severity and timing of seasonal flu.
To try and get some covid19 perspective I cross referenced it with the current WEEKLY report.
https://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/files//statistics/covid19/covid-deaths-report-week-14.pdf
And saw … “The provisional total number of deaths registered in Scotland in week 14 of 2020
(30 March – 5 April) was 1,741. This is an increase of 662 from the number
registered in the previous week”
And thought O-M-G! … THE DEATH RATE HAS INCREASED BY 35% AND IS LIKELY TO BE CONSIDERABLY HIGHER BY THE TIME A MONTH HAS PASSED SINCE THE FIRST FATALITY.
Then I looked at it a bit closer, paying particular attention to this footnote:
[1 Registration offices were closed for a number of days during week 13 to put arrangements in place for
remote registration of deaths. This will have artificially reduced the number of registrations for week 13
and increased those for week 14 while registrars worked to clear the backlog.]
PANIC OVER…but we will still have to wait another fortnight or so for enough information to draw any accurate conclusions.
Though it does look like we could get an extra 150 deaths a week while this thing is in full swing or half of what the TV will be telling us.
A neo-liberal approach to government is at the root of this poor response.
Full text.
Sequential Disaster Forensics: A Case Study on Direct
and Socio-Economic Impacts
https://www.mdpi.com/2071-1050/11/21/5898/pdf
@ Ian Brotherhood
I’ve just watched the video you linked to – all the way through, which is why it’s now nearly 3am.
It contained some interesting observations, but the last minute or so put me right off. Yes, I take his point that mandatory vaccinations could be a cover for just about anything, but to dismiss measles and polio vaccination the way he did is, for me, a step too far.
I’m going to file it under “worth having watched”, but not much more, though of course I may come to regret that, depending on what happens!
I know folk are concerned for their liberty, but protecting their personal biology, and that of others, is our most fundamental responsibility as a human being.
https://www.ippr.org/coronavirus-response
I think they will have a hard time doing that without recourse to the natural law. It would only be “just” if British constitutional practice did the same. Unfortunately British constitutionalism is determined to establish a new state on legally unsound epistemological foundations.
Democracy in Britain is fucked, as the natural rights of Scots do not appear to warrant consideration in the academic policy environment.
Sorry….legally unsound epistemic foundations.
ologicaly
oops. 🙂
Ian More @ 2.37am
You raise a very important point about Police Scotland which is that many of the officers are just thugs.
Now I know everyone can have a bad day, being a policeman can be stressful especially with some of the folks that they encounter, but my experience of the police when earlier last year I took a picture of an overturned lorry at a section of trunk road I suspected was inadequate, was absolutely outrageous.
Having obviously irked the investigating traffic officers another officer came running across shouting what the fuck are you doing taking photographs your fucking lucky I don’t lift you for breach of the piece.
Explaining why I was taking an interest our man proceeded in the same vein. Recognising that this guy would say and do anything, and as a retired person I got back into my friend’s car and beat the retreat.
All in all an unpleasant experience but just shows how easy it was for a police officer to drop into fit someone up mode without a moments hesitation. My doctor friend who witnessed the incident said it’s a pity he didn’t have his phone to hand so that I could have made a backed up complaint – but with attitudes like this would you want to make a complaint.
For someone who some years ago received a commendation for going to the aide of an officer in distress my view of the police has changed based on this incident. Clearly there are very good police but this incident, where there were four officers on the scene, reinforces a mind set very much supported by senior management.
I’m getting a bit pissed off with folk slaughtering the police on here regards to people not practising social distancing, My wife who is an A&E nurse was yesterday along with her fellow nurses, presented by Police with ignorant young spaced out drug/drink induced clowns from a broken up house party, potentially putting them in even more danger than they already are. Totally irresponsible. As they were really busy, with suspected Covid-19 cases, they were told to take them away and lock them up, and as far as I’m concerned, good on the nurses!!
Truth, belief and justification.
The space invaders.
The American way.
Epist epast epology,dammit,what he said.
jfngw 11.01
The passengers were Russian and East European millionaires.
@Pete
Whoosh!
Relates to Michael Sheridan’s recent article in the Scotsman re. Scots Law.
https://auldacquaintance.wordpress.com/2020/04/08/when-you-are-not-looking/
@ Golfnut – thx for the tip, I do sprinkle balsamic vinegar on salad to help digest the vitamins so will switch to cider vinegar as we have plenty in house. I think we can all do our bit to stay as healthy as possible.
I watched Contagion last night. All the usual cluches about panic buying and aggression. But then look at actual news from New York. Oh dear.
Some interesting links above which I’ll follow up today.
Anyway the medical profession have at last diagnosed why it takes me so long to remember things and mistype comments. The x-ray revealed my numskulls are now using zimmer frames apparently.
@ Dan, hopefully Scottish solicitors and lawyers and the Scottish Government won’t allow this, stop it in its tracks.
Hi peeps.
Just gone back to
https://www.euronews.com/live
(the English version) and, for some reason, the sub-titles are now working!
Highseastim@8.37am
Understand your concerns about folks criticising the Police but not all of our Police are fine upstanding Officers of the law. Very many of course are.
But maybe the question you should be asking is why in mid February 2020 HM Government were. running huge adverts to say that they and the NHS were well prepared for the virus and that people could help by coughing into a tissue, disposing of tissue and washing hands.
Not quite how it has turned out only a few weeks later.
And why might you also ask wad Cheltenham Festival, the Scotland France rugby game and even a 12,000 Lewis Capaldi concert allowed to go ahead in the period immediately before the lock down.
What was that all about. Deliberately trying to spread the virus I’d say. And now all change but with economic pressure again to let it rip.
Yes, Highseastim you maybe all for the police getting stuck in to those who would dare to infringe the curfew, but have a think about those in government who wanted to deliberately spread the virus to between sixty to eighty percent of the population whilst telling us the NHS was well prepared.
Like sacrifices to the gas ovens please have a think about the games being played in the background. But yes, minimising transmission is now crucially important, and whilst not all police might be good, many are just ordinary human beings trying to do the best they can.
But yes, think about the deliberate policy of spreading infection and telling people that the government was well prepared!
Cops in England talking about policing your shopping trolley – I shit you not. (Northants Police)
This has all gone too far. People need to wake up and smell the coffee.
Wake up and smell the coffee!
Coronavirus: Police Chief U-Turn After Warning Officers Would Check Shopping Trolleys
http://archive.is/YuDIp
Best comment I have seen on Covid19 – Handcock’s comedy half hour and Priti Patel’s Sorry I haven’t a clue – spot on.
Priti Patel did not turn up to Committee meetings many times during January and February about the pandemic and now she dares to try and tell us she is sorry – not sorry enough – then this morning on Marr we have a car crash interview with the Business Sec? not answering a single question asked but just waffling away with utter nonsense and barely even in sentences.
How many who attended the Cheltenham Race meeting have contracted the virus and why was it ever allowed to go on – Answer, money and power. How many who travelled on the London Tube when they should have been told to stay home contracted the virus – answer money and power – building office blocks to lie empty for investors is more important.
Where are the journalist who will ask the important questions – no point in telling us they have delivered millions of pieces of equipment if we need twice that amount.
And of course the bbc covering up the number of English deaths which don’t even count community/nursing home figures. They do this by lumping all the figures for the UK together to make sure the WM govt is not called to account.
But never mind the horrendous daily death figures Boris is walking and watching films. Hurrah!
The National newspaper reporting that the Scottish government are thinking about taking a different exiting approach on Covid-19 than the rest of the UK.
The Scottish government shouldve taken a different approach from day one in my opinion.
@winifred mccartney
Ms Patel never in fact said she was sorry, what she said is she was sorry the public felt that way. She was in fact insulting the public and blaming them for feeling that way.
Then she started to get techy with a journalist when he wasn’t content with her evasive answer. She was a disaster before we even get into her not being able to say a number. I cannot think of one person in the current UK government that I even consider semi-competent.
This says it all, as BBC bosses order interviewers to take it easy on British government ministers with regards to questions on how they’ve handled the virus outbreak.
How many more lives could’ve been saved if the BBC had taken a tougher no nonsense stance with Westminster ministers on the virus, we’ll never know.
This is another one to add to the millions of good reasons to break this ufit for for purpose union.
http://archive.fo/Ohsgx
So the media (as expected) are still praising to high heaven Boris Johnson, as the UK death toll begins to hit top gear. This is the man who thought herd immunity was a great thing, and who left it very late to implement a lock down.
This is the man, who voted against giving doctors and nurses a pay rise, this is the man who made a fool of himself as the UKs Foreign minster. This is the man who frequently uses xenophobic language, who refused PPE and ventilators from the EU, this is the man amidsts this crisis with much more important things to do is determined to cement his loathing of foreigners by pushing through a post-Brexit trade deal instead of adding an extension to it.
Yet the media still laud him and give him front page status, what does that say about the media, and what does it say about Scotland in this union as we follow his lead as PM.
For a bit of fun, go to YouTube and type in “Space Invaders Player One”.
Pretty funky tune from back in the day.
@Rm 10:02am/Dan
I don’t see our lickspittle leadership/establishment doing anything about it.
Republicofscotland
The oddity about that article is the fact the Daily Mail is highlighting the failure of the BBC to hold a Tory Government to account.
Interesting times.
“Interesting times”
Mike.
Yes indeed, no angle their to blame the SNP or Scottish government. Editor Geogie Greig, will be a tad disappointed on that. However all newspapers will be scrambling for their very existence just now, so all bets are off, and just about everything and everyone will be fair game.
Interesting times indeed.
Mike Cassidy @ 11:30
A U turn of sorts there, they are actually trying to blame the media to deflect this idiots comments – wee billy big baws in a uniform threatening the civvies who pay his wages.
Besides, forget shopping trolley checking/roadblocks for a second, the most worrying thing he said was that our 3 week GRACE period is OVER. What do we think that means?
It certainly doesn’t sound like he made that up on the spot and oddly, the quote is being removed from MSM reports.
I remember years ago a Scottish,surgeon had a corrigated hut built on the roof of his hospital and had it de gerembhaving all the air removed and his success in heart operations went up to almost perfection well maybe I am being stupid but could not the masks and aprons etc., after being used not be put into huts like that and then be able to be used again instead of being discarded as I say maybe I am being stupid ??? But I remember the old saying only when you attempt the ridiculous will you achieve the impossible ., happy Easter to you all
From Auld Acquaintance – When You are Not Looking – linked by Dan at 9:28am.
‘It is chipping away at the Acts of Union to make Scots subservient and answerable to English Law. It is an assault on all of us, not just Scots Solicitors!’
Warning! Silence is consent.
Re more Asian and Black problems with Covid 19.
It could also be different blood groups.
It has been shown eg, group O are more liable to stomach ulcers, groups A to cancer etc
It some African populations many are Duffy negative, one of the lesser groups, which conveys some protection against malaria.
There are also more males than females affected.
I’m sure scientists will be looking into the way the virus works.
@crazycat (2.59) –
Thanks for the feedback on that film. I note your misgivings, and share them, but I hope you don’t feel it was time entirely wasted.
There’s something putrid about all this. No matter what the cause, the end-result should be setting alarms bells off all over the place i.e. from a civil liberties point of view.
The substance of what was said is up for debate, of course. But the problem is that there is no ‘debate’. We’ve been presented with a narrative and ordered to believe it. Any deviation is not entertained. Where are those voices in all the non-stop discussions? It’s become heretical even to suggest that we’re being sold a pup.
The most heretical thing running through my heid right now is the possibility that Dominic Cummings was right. His way of expressing it was grim but what if it was fundamentally accurate? Johnson’s comments (prior to lockdown) echoed the ‘herd-immunity’ line, ‘take it on the chin’ etc. And if what the guy in that video was saying is true then Cummings/Johnson were articulating the conventional ‘expert’ analysis of normal virus/flu behaviour. What changed? Why did Cummings make a show of bolting from Downing St? Why did Tory ministers start succumbing to a ‘normal’ flu bug, thereby excluding themselves from front-line duty in ‘war time’?
The whole thing reeks.
RTE news announces figures daily, as does every other broadcaster. But they do something the BBC doesn’t (so far as I’m aware) – they give the median age of the fatalities. Yesterday, the number of ‘new’ deaths was (say, 30 or 40, I can’t remember the exact figure) and that average age of the deceased was 82.
Ian Brotherhood says: 12 April, 2020 at 1:18 pm
I watched part of the video you had posted and outside the medical parts, I had been saying most of the stuff from the beginning in particular, the reason for Northern Italy being hit so badly was because of population density, pollution and and elderly population.
However, I disagree with the assertion about the lock-down. The sole reason for it being implemented here at least is to stop the NHS being overwhelmed. Of course the reason for that is under-investment and the UK government lack of planning for such an event. Regardless of the reasons, it is necessary and has to be done.
I know some people are not going to like this but the lock down needs to end but that doesn’t mean we ‘go back to normal’. Most of the service sector needs to be kept shut. Those outside the catering and entertainment can still operate using e-commerce but here lies the problem, people delivering stuff will be spreading the virus unless adequate medical procedures are adhered to and PPE equipment provided.
The problem that we face is after the lock down ends, we do go back to normal. If that happens then elderly and vulnerable folk are going to become like lepers of old who are shunned, forgotten and pushed to the edge of society. That simply can’t happen which is why I agree with a previous poster that the Scottish government needs to pursue a different lock-down exit strategy. Despite what folk on here think of the SNP’s constitutional position, at least they can trusted to have common human compassion and do the right thing.
From SUN online page <10mins ago:
GOVERNMENT 'COMES CLOSE TO LYING' OVER CORONAVIRUS DEATH TOLL
A former public health director has accused the government of “coming very close to lies” over the UK's coronavirus death figures, Sky is reporting.
Professor John Ashton, former regional director of Public Health England, said the number of people dying with the virus could be double what the public is being told.
This is because officials counts are not including deaths outside hospitals, such as those in the community or in care homes, he says.
He has now told Sky News: “At the moment, a lot of what's going on in these briefings is coming very close to lies and we must prevent this from happening at all costs.”
@PacMan –
Thanks for the response.
The main point I took from that video about ‘lockdown’ was that it is an attempt to ‘flatten the curve’ and that is just a way of prolonging the inevitable movement of the bug through the population. Takes pressure off the health services, aye, but doesn’t alter the fact that we will all be exposed to the thing eventually.
But that’s just an aside – I don’t know enough about any aspect of this to state anything with confidence.
My main beef is that those who *do* know a lot but aren’t on-board with the ‘official’ story are being excluded from discussion. That, in itself, is outrageous and there must be a reason for it.
That’s what I’m asking. What’s the reason?
jfngw absolutely right – what a poisonous little woman she is.
callmedave Reports sun online saying that govt coming very near to lying – so what’s new then.
Add into this the fact bbc reporting total deaths in Uk and not England, Scotland, NI and Wales thus showing England and especially London hit hardest – large centres of population and action not taken early enough – listening to the science, evidence but not until it was so obvious even tories could see it – but too late for populations living/working close together.
Reports in today for the countries in the Uk are as follows according to the SUN online.
No BBC figures appearing yet.
Anyhoo!
Scotland…Today…24……Total…542…SUN
Wales……Today…18……Total…351…SUN
N. Ireland..Today..11……Total…118…SUN
England…..Today.657……Total…9594..SUN
—————————————-
UK ………Today 710 ….Total…10605..SUN
?
https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2020/04/information-wars/
Wow. What a thoroughly rotten and corrupt racket the entire UK seems to be. If the whole UK was a house on fire, what would you run inside to save? British values? What a joke. British integrity? British society? British sense of fair play?
Freedom of Speech is the big stone which all of these lying, manipulative Invertebrates crawl under. How do you regulate this malevolent subversion of truth while protecting Freedom of Speech, when the perpetrators are just cynically exploiting a valuable principle? They are nothing but disreputable counterfeiters undermining the value of information currency.
Surely the point of having a “National” Security Service in a democracy is to protect that democracy for the many, not for the twisted and manipulative few. Who becomes an enemy of the state when the state is the biggest rogue on the manor?
If society in general wants to have public information that is credible and can be trusted, these people who abuse free speech and distort public information (or smear people like Alex Salmond), are sooner or later going have to face prosecution and time behind bars. It will feel like an erosion of liberty when it happens, but what choice is there when these crooks have no ethics or morals?
Does anyone on here know who funded the new virus test centre at Aberdeen airport. UK claiming credit for this, why Aberdeen unless it was specifically about keeping the oil industry working, the worthless oil industry.
Ian Brotherhood says: 12 April, 2020 at 2:02 pm
Once the lock-down is lifted and is done sensibly including some of the ways that I mentioned, herd immunity will be achieved with the minimum loss of life. As I mentioned earlier, only the Scottish government can be trusted to do this which is why they need to act independently of the UK government.
As to your earlier comments about Cummings/Johnson. If there was no lock-down, the death rate would be through the roof, not only with Coronavirus related deaths but unrelated ones caused by lack of proper medical care because the health system could have collapsed. It is a good thing that the creature Cummings has disappeared from public view.
As to your view about people being excluded from the debate, this is something that I don’t want to go into at this time. There are so many conspiracy theories, half truths and idiots acting hysterically out there that I just want to keep my head down and get through this. Once the dust settles, I’m quite happy to debate this but not now. I haven’t been on the usual websites, including this one, since this lockdown and had only come onto here and comment because it was dealing with the social side of current events.
If the only way the British state can maintain its’ existence, is by neutering Scots law, then that indicates we are close to our goal. I just wish Scotland’s legal fraternity were not so conditioned into being English law’s bitches. That’s what you get when you understand the law from and internal perspective, and do not employ one’s critical faculties. Or respect the principle equality.
@Scotland’s judges
Where’s the epistemic justice in Brexit? Where’s your respect for natural law?
I see that ” Carcrash “ Carlaw is being slated for raising the indyref question during corona virus crisis and it’s even being reported by the bbc
http://archive.vn/uaQ4I
There is still no vaccine for SARS or MERS so why does anyone think the vaccine for Covid 19 is just arround the corner,
what the frick is the mega rich Big Pharma been doing,
no cure for cancer no cure for heart disease no cure for Alzheimer’s no cure for Covid19 SARS MARS.
Ron Maclean says:
12 April, 2020 at 12:53 pm
From Auld Acquaintance – When You are Not Looking – linked by Dan at 9:28am.
‘It is chipping away at the Acts of Union to make Scots subservient and answerable to English Law. It is an assault on all of us, not just Scots Solicitors!’
Warning! Silence is consent.
I think it’s worse than that.
I actually think this all goes back to devolution. Devolution itself breaches Article 22 of the Union Treaty by creating a second Parliament, and over the past 20 years of devolved government, the UK state has been surreptitiously eroding the principles of Scottish Constitution through the “boiled frog” principle… slowly and imperceptibly raising the temperature.
The U.K. government has been emboldened that it “got away” with it’s Supreme Court, and is currently getting away with the direct subjugation of Scottish Sovereignty over Brexit. These are new and modern developments without precedent these last 300 years. Such encroachment on Scottish rights, Sovereignty and the Articles of Union has often been stoutly resisted, but now we have an SNP party, in Government, and it just rolls over when Scotland’s popular sovereignty is overruled? What the fk is going on???
People think I’m mad when I talk about Scotland’s Holyrood Government being impeached, but as you say Ron MacLean, silence is consent, and what kind of government remains silent as it’s National Constitution is surreptitiously dismantled? It’s high time the frog jumped out the water and took his 700 year old written Constitution to a Lawyer…
@PacMan –
Again, thanks for response.
My fear is that this will never be ‘over’.
If you haven’t already seen it, please have a look at this. Not a long read.
https://www.technologyreview.com/2020/03/17/905264/coronavirus-pandemic-social-distancing-18-months/
I appreciate that you would rather not discuss certain elements of this right now, and that’s cool. Most of us would rather not discuss it at all but the paucity of critical thinking in mainstream discourse right now is shocking and deeply worrying – if we don’t raise questions, and keep doing it, who will?
Freeman announcing all care workers that those on a wage rate of £9:80 (?) to receive an immediate wage rise to that level.
This to include those who do ‘sleep overs’.
All to be put on sick pay as part of their contract.
of less than £9:80. Sorry. 🙁
@ Ian Brotherhood – half way through the video so far. There are a number of points I don’t agree about. China and S Korea implemented strict lockdown as soon as they realised they had another SARS type virus on the loose. Because of their previous experience of SARS they are well prepared.
COVID-19 is much more infective than SARS. It is an upper as well as lower respiratory infection and we sneeze, cough or breathe it out all over the place. The death rate appears to be approx 3%. More than flu less than SARS and very much less than MERS. But more people get infected. If NHS resources are overwhelmed then older people will not get the ventilators. Italy and Spain have had to triage who gets treatment and who is left to die.
British exceptionalism prevented the UK govt from taking the same action. they scoffed at “authoritarian” China and its biddable population. Brits take things “on the chin” and won’t be bossed about. LOL
The herd immunity strategy is basically eugenics. The vulnerable will die and the strong will survive. For strong read wealthy and well fed. Sweden, which had its own history of eugenics, started off on the herd immunity tactic but I believe has now rapidly switched to lockdown.
The lockdown strategy is aimed at killing off the virus. If it can’t find another human to infect it dies. Once dead, the only route for reinfection is travellers at ports. These can be checked.
Once there is a vaccine then the danger is very much lessened.
I get my info from the Covid Insights blog here:
https://covid19-insights.squarespace.com/blog/covid19-insights-4
#
Now to watch the rest of the video 🙂
“Let’s remember, (Winston) Churchill won the war ”
MaggieC.
The usual unionist toss from the failed car salesman and branch manager of the Tory office in Scotland.
Churchill didn’t win any war, the allies prevalied together, indeed Russia took most of Berlin, after chasing the Nazis all the way back from the gates of Moscow.
Carlaw like most unionists actually believe that Britain (a metaphor for England) won the WWII single handedly.
Ian Brotherhood
I watched the vid you linked to last night and it prompted me to remain on my arse and do a bit of research – which led to my post @2.53am
There is a real increase in deaths which go beyond what could be explained away in terms of normal year on year variation, though not nearly as bad as the government Deathwatch lists would have us believe.
The NHS England data reveals that 92 per cent killed by Covid-19 were over 60 – 40 per cent aged 60-79 and 52 per cent over 80. Most of whom had pre-existing health issues which come with age.
Just five under 20s (0.07per cent) have died from the infection. People aged 20-39 made up 0.7 per cent of the deaths and 40-59 7 per cent.
Which would make … isolate the vulnerable – ramp up – temperature screening and testing – and return to “normal life”, seem like common sense to me.
It is after all the advice of the Prof who warned the Squareheads that the disease was on its way back in January.
The herd immunity strategy is basically eugenics.
The herd immunity strategy is basically eugenics.
The herd immunity strategy is basically eugenics.
The herd immunity strategy is basically eugenics.
I just wish my recollection of the law wasn’t quite so rusty, or else I’d go full bio-neurological in my interpretation.
Sorry to ask but is Chequers not Boris Johnstone’s second home?
Chart illustrating speed of China lockdown in clearing the virus.
https://twitter.com/yaneerbaryam/status/1239673678813683721?s=20
And a thread on herd immunity and why it is the wrong approach:
https://twitter.com/curexcomplex/status/1238755955430567936
Capella says:
“The herd immunity strategy is basically eugenics.”
I would disagree with that assessment and opine that:
Herd Immunity is The Law of Nature, Evolution, Gods Plan, which ever way one chooses to describe – “The way things are”.
Eugenics and Immunization are just two different ways mankind have of demonstrating which “Evolutionary Path” they are on … or their eagerness to defy “The Will of God”.
Col.Blimp IV
Pish.
The Era of Eugenics: When Pseudoscience Became Law
https://www.bbvaopenmind.com/en/science/bioscience/the-era-of-eugenics-when-pseudoscience-became-law/
Brexitania is divorced from the justice of the natural law tradition. This is the beginning of a new eugenics era and government through force.
Full text.
Ethical, Legal, Social, and Policy Implications of Behavioral Genetics
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4371728/
CameronB Brodie says:
“Pish.”
Non sequiturs, CB … You know they make sense – LOL.
Cammy
You are such a prat.
Would you call a bad flu year where, say 17000 people died, eugenics?
I think you need some re-education fast as all that drivel you come out with is pure garbage.
Pete
My understanding of the world incorporates a bio-neurological appreciation of the law. Does yours?
It’s pretty easy to tell when Boris Johnson will return from his 4th break in recent months, when the curve starts to become negative. If this does not happen, expect a relapse.
A wee animation to illustrate how herd immunity works if vaccinated:
https://twitter.com/RARohde/status/1179323361274580992?s=20
There is Mr Hancock on air stating if the death rate doesn’t come down it is the peoples fault.I think we can see what any inquiry will conclude, the government have behaved impeccably, but the public.
CB
What is Vaccination if it is not an artificial aid to achieving “Herd Immunity”?
Vaccination is the deliberate infection of as many as possible (some would make it compulsory) with a “watered down” strain of the disease, with the intention of making everyone (THE HERD) impervious to the disease in question.
The very word vaccine is derived from the Latin, Variolae Vaccinae … smallpox of the cow.
Winifred @ 3.38
Yes I believe it is his second home. In fact he doesn’t even own it. It’s state owned maybe? He lives at No 10. He went into hospital from there, he should return there. His fiancée is at another home, maybe her own. It will be interesting to see if she moves in with him after the isolation time is up. She shouldn’t of course and I think he should absolutely not be moving to the Shires to recuperate.
Just like Prince Charles, one rule for some…
Makes my blood boil.
For those of you who haven’t heard it yet. A very worthy cause and a beautiful tune taboot. Skerryvore & Friends – Everyday Heroes (NHS Charity Single) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjrAfy2v63c
Pete@4.20 + every other one of your posts.
Hats off to you for having the amazing ability to still be able to work a keyboard with your head shoved so far up your own arse.
Amazing!!
Those unsure about the lockdown.
A debate in The Sun.
Granted its between a nonentity and a Professor Of International Public Health.
http://archive.is/zZisR
And after you’ve read it.
Watch this Channel 4 interview from 3 April with an ICU guy at the frontline.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejlbCmRJMW4
I’m going with him.
Col.Blimp IV
I wasn’t meaning to be harsh, I just wanted to get us on solid groundings pronto.
It’s simply not ethical to ask nature to inoculate the population against a deadly pathogen. It indicates a lack of attention to a legal duty of care, and the legal duty to do no harm.
Well the virus means only one Yorkshireman left.
RIP Tim Brooke Taylor
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKHFZBUTA4k
Regarding Churchill (and I’m no fan), he refused to negotiate with Hitler, who wanted peace with England. There were a fair number of MPs who wanted peace (excluding Chamberlain). Had Hitler got his way it is possible Russia would have been defeated. However, it was both the US and Russia who won the war through sheer logistics. Churchill provided the leadership needed at that time.
Does anyone know if Rees moggs firm was going big on selling short after the government realised the virus was coming but before it went public
Labour MP Liz Kendall there very concerned that the death rates in care homes and in the community are not being published in the UK and chooses to use Eire as an example of where this is done.
Shurely there muchst be a closer example of good honest practise within the 4 countries of the UK…..maybe… Oh wait! Labour.
Meanwhile a South Lanarkshire MP Liz Cameron SNP joins the debate
and goes on the mental health issue and works with WM some figures given by the interviewer and talks about ‘the country’ never mentioning the Scottish dimension or initiatives therein!
So it goes. 🙁 Hmm! (Too political maybe)
Herd immunity created by safe vaccine does not wipe out the elderly population.
Herd immunity created by allowing Cheltenham festival to go ahead for example could be construed as murder or genocide:pick your own description.
I am fed up of saying I see you to the usual suspects.
Suspected of what? Working for the BritNat Government.
Beaker
You are right. Many MPs wanted to negotiate with Hitler after Dunkirk, including Lord Halifax who was the favourite to be PM but excluded himself as a member of the Lords. He had a strong following, and could been PM, but Churchill and the anti-appeasement Tories (Macmillan, Eden and a few others) plus the whole Labour front bench carried the day and refused to negotiate.
Britain never “stood alone” as the media love to say. Australia, New Zealand, Canada, India, and many Europeans were in the fight from day one. However as you say, it took the manpower of the USSR and the industrial might of the USA to crush Germany, but still Churchill was probably the only man with the bloody mindedness to face down the Nazis for almost two years before the Allies joined in.
FGS!
Boris’ thanks to the NHS on for the fifth time this afternoon…
Noticed too a couple of doctors interviewed on BBC today both offering to the interviewer after prompt from Auntie that they have plenty of PPE no problem where he works.
Also the sister of a NHS worker who died suggesting that she may have been contagious before she put on her PPE when attending a patient who had the virus.
Methinks that’s strange and manipulative. 🙁
Breeks:
Articles of Union 1707 as passed by the Parliament of Scotland on 16 January 1707:
http://www.parliament.uk/documents/heritage/articlesofunion.pdf
Article III says this:
“III. ‘That the United Kingdom of Great-Britain be represented by one and the same Parliament, to be stiled the Parliament of Great-Britain”.
It does not say there cannot be a Parliament of Scotland representing SCOTLAND in Scotland.
The last session of the Parliament of Scotland (PoS) took place on 25/03/1707. At that final session the (PoS)was scheduled to reconvene on 22/04/1707 and then adjourned.
“Act of adjournment
The queen’s majesty declares this parliament current and adjourns the same to 22 April next to come,…”. http://www.rps.ac.uk
Whereas, the Royal Proclamation of 28/04/1707 says ( approx ninth line from bottom of main paragraph): “there can be no other parliament in the united kingdom after the said date, first of May said, other than the parliament of Great Britain”
This Royal Proclamation also declared the Parliament of Scotland dissolved.
http://digital.nls.uk/1715-rising/gallery/index.html
Taking into consideration the recent Cherry v Lord Advocate case, regarding Queen Betty proroguing UK Parliament, was the Queen Anne Royal Proclamation unlawful when it declared only one parliament in all the united kingdom and the dissolution of the Parliament of Scotland, as it was the Crown usurping the role of parliament?
Ruth Davidson on Twitter commits sacrilege and blasphemes that “He is risen” in reference to the Tory PM being released from care.
Jesus wept.
Scot Finlayson says: at 3:03 pm
“What the frick is the mega rich Big Pharma been doing,
no cure for cancer no cure for heart disease no cure for Alzheimer’s no cure for Covid19 SARS MARS.”
Viagra! The issue is by focusing on developing that rather than Alzheimer treatments they’ve ensured we now have a society full of folk with stauners that can no longer remember what to do with them.
CB
A safe proven vaccine is at best a year down the line.
The more we slow down the spread of covid – The longer it will persist in the community.
The longer we spend in Lockdown – The the greater the damage to the economy.
Those most at risk from covid are the over 60’s and the chronically sick.
The supported isolation of only the vulnerable would have minimal economic impact.
The risk of serious harm (from covid) to those outwith the vulnerable categories is not significantly greater than those normally associated with being alive.
I am sure the first five statements are true and I think the last one is at least more or less true.
…add what ever other relevant statements of fact you can think off or find on the net – and come to your own conclusion on when and how we should come out of the lockdown.
As soon as a suitable program for the supported isolation of the vulnerable is in place and once the authorities are sure the health service will not be swamped.
Would be my recommendation and is probably not a million miles away from what always was the governments plan.
The Lockdown measures were because they knew the health service would crumble and the populace would panic – if we took the full force of a tsunami of people struggling to breathe and also that we would need softened up before we would accept the long term quarantine of 20% of the population.
Two rumours from France today:
1: Macron is expected to announce tomorrow that the lockdown will continue until at least May 10th.
2: Amazon France is closing down. 40% of it’s workforce are off sick and they’re struggling to make the business work.
I know this is France but given that the UK is about two weeks behind here, this just gives you an idea of what you might expect to happen.
How’s the Amazon depot in Dunfermline?
Serious Q: Are there any countries which have not imposed some form of lockdown?
If so, do we know how they are faring?
War-monger Churchill desperately wanted britain to go to war in August 1914.
“The Darkest Days: The Truth Behind Britain’s Rush to War, 1914”
by Douglas Newton
Superb book.
‘Taking into consideration the recent Cherry v Lord Advocate case’
No such case that I recall. Cherry recently was in court facing the Advocate General though.
And always worth recalling, dissolution is not the same thing as abolition.
Rees-Mogg celebrating Easter on twitter, very religious. Just trying to find the killing of the 10,000 and blessed are the hedge fund mangers in the bible, maybe he his using a different one.
There’s something of an azreal about him.
jfngw
I’m told Godis not to keen on hedge fund managers but he is pretty partial to the slaying of unbelievers.
http://www.bricktestament.com/the_teachings_of_jesus/on_wealth/mt06_19plk12_15.html
http://www.bricktestament.com/judges/10000_moabites_killed/jg03_12.html
Ian Brotherhood 6.29
Sweden challenges Trump — and scientific mainstream — by refusing to lock down
http://archive.is/jLKMt
Belarus is still playing football!
WHO urges stricter measures as Belarus virus cases surge
http://archive.is/SguAZ
Ian Brotherhood and Mike Cassidy
Tajikistan doesn’t seem to be in lockdown. At least no more so than usual.
Still got top flight football matches on.
Col.Blimp IV
The men in white coats think we need to do all we can to protect our personal biology. And that of others. I value their judgement and wouldn’t presume to know better. Unless you can substantiate your position, I suggest you be less prescriptive.
Data here is useful to compare countries.
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/total-covid-deaths-per-million
Despite all the publicity, at this time USA is below UK (and Ireland) in deaths/million.
Table (some countries data might be dubious)
Spain
Italy
France
UK
Sweden (strange they are much worse than Norway & Finland)
Ireland
USA
Am I alone in detecting a nasty smell about this whole Johnson/Hospital episode beautifully synchronised with Holy Week right down to his ‘resurrection’ on Easter Sunday.
The broadcasters and metropolitan media have been in coordinated overdrive singing his bravery plus all the nonsense about the messages from his mistress.
It all seems designed to near deify Johnson while distracting us from the shambles that the government is making of this Coronavirus thing.
Watching this afternoon’s broadcast does he look like a man who allegedly was at death’s door only a couple of days ago?
Gus 1940
In answer to your question, no, you are not alone.
There are lots of other loony conspiracy theorists here to.
Just read that journalists and bbc media interviewers were told not to put ministers under pressure over covid 19.
Wouldn’t it be great if our SNP mps all 48 of them, ( 3rd largest party at westminster) decided to pressurise the media and journalists to a actually do their job!!!
But then I remember black Ford and his devolutionist puppets wanted to give the BBC more money!!!
What a fucking farce!!
Never before has a political party had such power and opportunity to achieve its goal and fucked it up so badly.
When I wrote, some countries data may be unreliable, of course I meant the UK as I suspect the death toll here is closer to 15,000, rather than 10,000. This would change the UK to 220/million, above France.
@gus1940
Of course it is. I’m sure Ruth Davidson denied him three times too.
He’s been dried out, they hope he doesn’t relapse.
“Keir Starmer says ‘now is not the time’ to ask if government was too slow to act.”
When is the time to ask, when 100,000 are dead, 200,000 or 300,000. He’s not even in the job a month and his inner Blairite is shining through.
http://archive.fo/ETyDW
“Serious Q: Are there any countries which have not imposed some form of lockdown?”
Ian.
You might find this interesting.
“Two weeks ago, while people all over the world were locking down and staying at home to avoid transmitting the virus, the Nicaraguan government decided to organise a big parade, catchily titled “Love in the Time of Covid-19”. In scarcely believable scenes, thousands of government workers and regime supporters carried placards saying “welcome coronavirus to a free Nicaragua” and “victory over the coronavirus”. There were even floats. “The coronavirus has not reached Nicaragua thanks to our Commander Daniel,” they boasted.”
https://capx.co/a-state-of-denial-is-this-the-worlds-worst-coronavirus-response/
Ian Brotherhood
Here’s the latest on Sweeden
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8210677/Sweden-records-17-deaths-coronavirus-lowest-daily-rise-fortnight.html
This is a good read
https://threader.app/thread/1249127908876128259
Jock McDonnell
Thank you for the correction:
Cherry and others (Respondents) v Advocate General for Scotland (Appellant) (Scotland)[2019] UKSC 41.
@Col.Blimp IV
I would be wary using weekend numbers, Sweden’s number reduced last weekend also.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_pandemic_in_Sweden
gus1940 says:
12 April, 2020 at 7:22 pm
I agree with you Gus. The whole of the last week on MSM news has been the Bojo Show, nothing else. Nothing about what’s happening in Syria, nothing about the folk down in England and Wales how just before this virus kicked off, whole villages were floored and folk had to leave there homes, where are they self-isolating? what’s happening to their homes?
Absolutely nothing else except Bojo, and trust me, when this is all over he will come out of this absolutely stinking of roses, positively reeking of roses, and he will be crowned the new Churchill. Once this is over, there are so many questions that needs to be asked about the whole event, but with a totally spineless media, no one will dare ask any awkward questions.
So he is free to turn and mould this into a victory. His whole hospitalisation was the biggest snake oil con artistry I have seen in a while, back by her maj Betty. Unfortunately he is just untouchable, especially when folk vote him in.
Sorry, villages flooded, not floored.
Republicofscotland
I’m not sure it is wise to trust the organ of a right-wing think-tank to give an unbiased account of goings on in Commieland.
Here are the numbers for today and again some observations on the BBC:
No mention of English numbers
Lots of coverage of other countries and in particular USA.
Deaths % of Deaths
N Ireland 118 1.11%
Scotland 566 5.33%
Wales 369 3.48%
England 9559 90.08%
Total 10612
Above I posted a link to an article about deaths in Southern Ireland. An interesting aspect of the article, is that it points out that England has around 2.5 times more deaths than Southern Ireland despite starting of at the same point it the spread of the virus.
Cant wait to hear Call Kaye take questions about that.
Ian brotherhood
@ 6.29
I live in Holland Ian,where they,re following the “herd immunity”.They closed down the cafes/restraunts 2 weeks before Scotland,but have only tightened up since last week,
It seemed to me that Rutte (P.M.) and De Jong (HS)were waiting to see what bj did,they fill me with as much confidence as the clowns in wm.
Stats; positive tested 21,762
Hospital admit 7,972
reported death 2,396
population 17.28m
@Breeks 3:04pm
We are seeing the consequences of silence and subservience.
The attack on the Scottish legal system and the Treaty of Union described by Auld Acquaintance should be an opportunity for a legal challenge. Recent history suggests that won’t happen.
The border should have been closed weeks ago – it wasn’t. Perhaps because we didn’t ask or, more likely, because we didn’t get permission.
The protection of the EU is needed more than ever – we’ve been taken out and there seems nothing is to be done about it.
Independence provides an answer – the FM wants a s30 and the PM says no. Craig Murray’s alternative route will not be considered. The continuing deadlock will be profitable for some.
I don’t think the FM can be impeached. It would help if she was removed as leader of the SNP.
A new leader, with a bold action plan and a good lawyer, should get us back on track.
@ Ian Brotherhood at various times
I didn’t think watching the video was a waste of time; I do think it would be dangerous to accept its assertions uncritically (I know you’re not doing that, but some people might).
This thread : https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1249305825694437377.html reports a study which suggests it could take up to 12 iterations of the virus to achieve “herd immunity”, a far cry from the (glib, in my view) suggestion of 2 weeks in the video.
There appears to be some evidence of re-infection, implying that immunization from having had the virus is not universal. Before concluding that, however, I would like to know about the incidence of false negatives; the number of apparently re-infected people is small and could potentially be explained by inaccurate testing at some stages. Or maybe not.
Thanks to all for the data. Much food for thought.
😉
The BBC has uttered so many mis-truths & half-truths over the years such that any major, or for that matter, political announcements henceforth presented must ALWAYS be regarded with extreme scepticism.
TRUST NOT.
@crazycat –
We overlapped!
There’s such a long way to go, so much to find out and process. It’ll surely take years to get the full picture.
One thing I would very much like to see is a leaked video of Johnson in the ICU, sitting up, a glass of wine to hand, playing his Game Boy or suchlike. It’s mibbe the only thing that will stop his deification in its tracks.
🙂
? https://dorseteye.com/was-boris-johnsons-covid-19-condition-contrived/ ?
Ron Maclean says:
12 April, 2020 at 8:32 pm
@Breeks 3:04pm
We are seeing the consequences of silence and subservience.
….I don’t think the FM can be impeached. It would help if she was removed as leader of the SNP.
A new leader, with a bold action plan and a good lawyer, should get us back on track.
You would hope even a credible threat of impeachment would rattle the right cages, but given the SNP under Sturgeon is content to circle the wagons and stand firm with the Salmond Conspirators after their disgraceful conspiracy was so emphatically undone, I truly do wonder who’s side they are on.
The membership clutches at straws that the polls are rising, but 50%+ in the polls after all the humiliations and colonial subjugation of Brexit, to “merely” be crossing into a majority now is hardly a cause for celebrations and ticker tape.
I just get so bloody angry thinking about the opportunities squandered. Confidence is sub-zero.
Scotland desperately needs a Constitutional champion who doesn’t treat the Declaration of Arbroath as an ancient relic or curiosity, but is prepared to stand up for what it means; not just ‘describe’ popular sovereignty, but have it actually defended in a Constitutional Courtroom.
R Scotland this morning were speculating that the lockdown would end to coincide with VE day around 8th May. Imagine Boris Johnston delivering his victory speech to the HoC in Churchillian tones.
Their next item was an interview with a veteran of Dunkirk which started off with Vera Lynn singing We’ll Meet Again.
I switched off at that point feeling decidedly queasy. What on earth is happening to England? Could it be anything to do with Lynton Crosby doing PR for the Tories in these unprecedented times?
Capella
That’s the BBC pumping out nostalgia, to support social cohesion. Nostalgia also feeds cultural narcissism, and played an important role in bring us Brexit.
@CBB – agreed – see Guy Verhofstadt’s tweet on the tabloids blaming Europe for Boris Johnston getting ill:
DID BARNIER INFECT BOJO?
https://twitter.com/guyverhofstadt/status/1244199443097882624?s=20
Cultural narcissism is a failing that is not simply a failing of the English, we have many who think Scotland is better. We are, but we shouldn’t let that go to our heads. 🙂
Unfortunately, it appears English culture has succumbed to the legacy of the cultural influence of 19th English Christian Zionism, which encouraged a culturally penetrating belief that the English are specially blessed by God. I think this is a significant driver of Brexit.
This helped xenophobia appeare attractive once the population had been sufficiently traumatised by austerity.
It’s not just the economy, stupid!
Brexit and the Cultural Sector
https://www.gbz.hu-berlin.de/downloads/pdf/brexit-and-the-cultural-sector_pdf.pdf
It’s hard to believe anything you hear or see, you can’t believe the radio or the newspapers or the politicians or the police or the internet or even your own Scottish government, everything seems to be fake and there doesn’t seem to be anything anybody can do about it, if people like Breeks, Cameron Brodie, Colin Alexander, Dr Jim, Robert Knight etc, etc, ect, could set up a people’s party that might get back to a genuine way of living and voting for real people, Scotland has to do its own thing it’s getting clearer every day.
From 1989 well into the early part of the millennium, the SNP had no more than 6 MPs at Westminster. For much of the time Scotland had 72 rather than 59 Mps that could be elected to that hive of scum and villainy.
However, with such few MPs, members, and a smaller party generally than now… in opposition, we attacked the establishment far more ferociously than we do now, even though we now have huge levels of support and success that we could only have dreamed of back then .
Imagine if we ( I’m speaking as an SNP member) attacked the British establishment now with the same ferocity with the power we now have, what we could achieve?
Independence would have been ours long ago!
Insead, we have allowed Independence to be deflected, put on the back burner, the great un mentionable word.
Always brexit or a virus or gra to deflect attention.
Why?? The strings of the party is being pulled by the brit secret service .
Sturgeon and her cleek must go!
We need leadership! True leadership.
Breeks says:
“….I don’t think the FM can be impeached. It would help if she was removed as leader of the SNP.”
What if she sort off can, a la Henry McLeish.
And the Unionists go for her head, re misleading Parliament regarding fibbing about her foreknowledge of The Salmondgate Plot?
It would be a bit of a disaster for the Independence Movement if she was replaced by a Devolutionary Wokester – just ahead of what should be the Independence Election..
Perhaps it is time to join/re-join to try and prevent that from happening.
@Ian Brotherhood, 8.45
Singapore did not go into lockdown because it would impact hard on the local economy. It had quarantine for infected people.
If you are looking for food for thought,
Dr Sucharit Bhakdi calls the lockdown action grotesque, absurd and dangerous. He thinks it will lower the life expectancy of millions. He is an infectious diseases specialist. The interview is in German with English subtitles http://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=26&v=JBB9bA-gXL4&feature=emb_logo
2. SARS-Cov2: fear versus data. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924857920300972
3. Professor Knutt Wittkowski, an epidemiologist, thinks that social distancing is artificially prolonging the epidemic. The interview is at https://off-guardian.org/2020/04/08/watch-perspectives-on-the-pandemic-2/
Professor Wittkowski ended the interview with the advice that if the people don’t stand up for their rights, these rights will be forgotten.
For more on the views of epidemiologists and infectious diseases specialists, see off guardian.
BBC covering for Boris again. On the news they stated he had ‘returned’ to his home – he did not. He went to a second home Chequers. He left from Downing Street and he should have returned there – heaven knows it’s big enough. But do remember ‘we are all in this together’.
Ian Brotherhood you fucken know it man.
@cirsium –
Thanks for that.
The Wittkowski interview you linked to seems to be the same one I posted last night, but hosted on a different site, so it’s good to see that multiple sources are trying to get out the same material.
Website hosts giving space to ‘alternative’ theories on the whole thing are being summarily barred from major social media platforms. (See Brian Rose, LondonReal)
Unconventional sites being bagged from The Twitter? Where have we heard of any such thing before?!?
Jings! Crivvens!
If Knutt Wittowski is getting referenced on this thread
Probably helps if we read this.
Its only partial – but its enough to make the point.
Knut Wittkowski: The Coronavirus Truthers’ Newest “Expert”
http://archive.is/4o07U
Ron Maclean @ 0832 pm “ the border should have been closed weeks ago – it wasn’t. “
Eventually , the “ lockdown” will have to be lifted ( in stages I presume) . Will the lockdown be lifted uniformly across the “U.K. “ or will Scotland and our government wish to differ ?
Either way , after people are released from “ curfew” then they will want to move around again . However “ normal” times look to be a very long way off. Overseas holidays to France, Spain , Italy etc are going to be “ difficult” with increased beurocracy, ( medical & vaccine requirements , checks/ certs, visas post Brexit, differing “ entry requirements” for individual destinations further complicated with Coronavirus ( who has had? Who has tested negative/ positive etc etc. ) . This will result in increased travel costs etc . In the short term 6- 12 months ( or possibly longer) people will be looking more to “ staycations” and that will result in significantly more visitors to “ traditional holiday areas “ such as Scotland , Wales etc. With higher infection rates in the South of England than for example the Highlands of Scotland then the “ Cross border traffic risk is obvious .
Consequently, should our Holyrood Government be planning as of now to introduce “ Health checks” at all points of entry ( ports , airports, major cross border trunk roads etc? As Health is “devolved “ , should this be mandated as soon as the lockdown is lifted ( in England first , or the UK as a whole if this is agreed by both governments ?) .
Apparently Denmark with a similar population to Scotland is considering a phased lifting of restrictions. However, they were able to close their border with a huge population ( Germany) to the South . Regrettably, without Independence , Scotland cannot close its border , and has no immigration powers .
It will be interesting to see how our FM proceeds ( or intends to proceed) post lockdown . Health is a devolved power ( in the meantime?). Should this devolved power be used to prevent further transmission?
Essential reading.
A mini case study in how virus bullshit spreads.
The Viral ‘Study’ About Runners Spreading Coronavirus Is Not Actually a Study
http://archive.is/zhKxQ
The reports I see ,mostly on here, of over officious policing and now locals setting up their own Schultz Staffelen are a worrying development. The threat to our long term Liberty and security from capricious government we must consider now we have so much time on our hands . Sweden ,Japan ,Singapore and South Korea opted for another approach to dealing with virus .To all Sturgeonites Alec Salmond King of Scotland.
@ Mike Cassidy – I agree about the sense of “truther” about the interview with Knut Wittowski. If 80% of the UK population are infected with COVID-19 and the death rate is 3% (as the evidence from China suggests) then we will have 1.5 m deaths in the UK.
Those deaths will be among the poor, disabled, and sick. Most may be elderly but evidence from the Gwent consultant interviewed is that this virus in fact does attack younger populations.
Personally, I wouldn’t want to take gamble.
@ mike cassidy at 11.23
Thank you.
Watching Wittkowski in the middle of the night, I “hae’d ma doots”. His body language disturbed me enough; his expressionless eyes even more.
I haven’t signed up to read the rest of the piece you linked, but even that first bit was a helpful confirmation of my thoughts.
Note : That doesn’t mean that everything he said is wrong, misleading , or deranged!
@ crazycat – yes I thought he was spot on about Bill Gates – a predatory capitalist indeed!
@ Capella
Weren’t the comments about Gates (with which I certainly agree!) made by the Brasscheck guy at the end?
I’m not going to watch it again to find out.
What he said about polio and measles had steam coming out of my ears.
Lothianlad says:
“From 1989…”
Then along came Alex Salmond. – Who said the Party had to change from being a “one trick pony”, with only independence to offer the electorate, into a modern European Social Democratic Party, positively bristling with policies.
Jim Sillars warned – That he would emasculate party democracy and surround himself with “Nodding Dugs”.
Dr McIntyre warned – That adopting a slogan of “Independence in Europe”, may prove to be useful as a device to combat Unionist scaremongering about Scotland being “All Alone” in a big scary world … But WE must always remember that our objective is Independence and our relationship with the EU or our adherence to any particular policy, must depend solely on what is and what is not advantageous to Scotland.
Jim Fairlie warned – “That Europe Isn’t our friend”, The EU Isn’t going to help us gain independence, that if he heard another party spokesperson say “INDPENDENCEINEUROPE” like a Dalek, he would spontaneously combust, and that he didn’t trust Alex any further than he could throw the Eiffel Tower.
Turns out all four of them were right.
The two Jims might find it amusing that the monster Alex created has gone out of control and bitten him on the arse, Robert McIntyre can’t do much more than spin in his grave.
We all know what the objective is, we don’t need anyone to lead us there, We do need front men and women who have no personal agenda, other that to play their part in liberating our country. from a bondage that is little more than “smoke and mirrors”.
According to the latest figures Scotland currently has almost exactly half the rate per million of Coronavirus deaths as England.
I don’t say this with any sense of superiority as we may catch up, but the English figures seem to be given in rather a confusing way as deaths outside hospitals are not included. I wonder what the point of that is unless it is to cover up just how bad the preparations were.
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/businessreview/2020/04/09/adjusting-covid-19-expectations-to-the-age-profile-of-deaths
“One of the most important factors affecting death rates is the age profile of different populations. Where we have age structure data and the size of the underlying population group, around 80% of deaths to date have been in the 70+ age group, and 92% have been in the 60+ age group. There is no obvious reason to expect that distribution to change as countries suffer more losses.”
I understand that there is loads of conflicting information out there but surely the stats show that Covid 19 is particularly dangerous to the elderly and the immuno-compromised among us and not very dangerous to the younger generation.
Why can’t we have the workforce getting back to business and schools opening again?
People most at risk can continue to self isolate as they are doing now. There would be no extra burden on the hospitals from people who won’t get sick from Covid 19. We would still be flattening the curve.
Can some of the lockdown fans explain to me and others here why they think the lockdown is necessary?
A plurality of knowledge is vital to democracy, open society, and sustainability. That does not mean all knowledge is equally valid, as all keen observers of the UK press and media will confirm.
So how do we establish which knowledge is legally valid? The UKs’ parliamentarians and sundry law makers (see Brexit), appear to have forgotten the significance of this foundational legal practice.
The British constitution
iswas an element of science. Law that is not supported by science can not support democracy.The Epistemic Integrity of Scientific Research
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/232231310_The_Epistemic_Integrity_of_Scientific_Research
Fireproofjim says:
“… unless it is to cover up just how bad the preparations were.”
I am quite partial to conspiracy theories myself and Sir Guy of Gisbourne and The Sheriff of Nottingham are who I consider to be typical of English bureaucrats and politicians.
But the reason is;
People who are tested positive for covid19 and subsequently die in hospital are = apples.
People who may or may not have been tested for covid19 and who die outwith hospital but who the doctor signing their death certificate thinks covid19 may have contributed to their death, with no standard guidelines in place for making that call or quantifying it. = oranges.
No useful purpose vis extrapolating anything, can be served by adding them together.
Danger Will Robinson Danger … England right-Scotland wrong – The sky must be falling – The Earth is probably Flat and maybe Buzz Lightyear did walk on the Moon.
British constitutional practice insists Scottish cultural knowledge is legally invalid within the British constitution.
Pragmatism can only remain ethical if it is guided by the natural law.
Pluralism and Democratic Participation:
What Kind of Citizen are Citizens Invited to be?
https://brill.com/view/journals/copr/14/4/article-p416_416.xml
I’d suggest the SNP had to become a “modern European Social Democratic Party, positively bristling with policies”, in order to get us where we are. Strategy needs to be flexible and responsive to change though. There is only the constitutional argument now, IMHO, though Brexitania is a stranger to natural law justice.
Some points to ponder.
Stand under British constitutional legal dogma, or stand under international law.
Support English Torydum, or support human rights.
Defend the interests of political ideology, or defend the natural law.
Breastplate
As far as I know the only thing we do not have a mountain of stats on is
How many patients OUTWITH the over 60/Immuno-compromised/pre-existing cardio-pulmonary condition group. (Who should be Isolated).
Are likely to show up at a hospital needing oxygen or an iron lung.
We know very few of them are going to die and that of those who do, most will have an undiagnosed condition and will probably catch covid before a vaccine (which will in itself be a risk) becomes available.
Unless that figure is high enough to exceed the hospitals ability to treat them.
Continuing Lockdown is Insane…but it’s removal should be accompanied by introduction of temperature screening and an increase in the amount of testing.
and there is no reason for anyone to stop wearing a mask/gloves, sanitizing their hands regularly and observing social distancing should they so desire, once lockdown is over.
In fact it would be advisable that they did if they wanted any contact with anyone who was isolated for their own safety.
It’s about time someone complained about the former Chief Medical Officer Dr Catherine Calderwood:
This selfish idiot broke her own rules on self isolation to visit her second home twice.
First of all she is a is a consultant obstetrician and gynaecologist: a fanny mechanic.
A general practitioner or even a one-eyed village chemist would give better advice on what to do during an extremely
contagious virus outbreak rather than her – and they’d stick to it. Secondly: she has the resources to have a second home.
This woman is symptomatic of why Scotland cannot run its own affairs.
The overly confident SNP have a child-like belief that all that is moderately good
is the best we can get.
CameronB Brodie says:
‘…modern European Social Democratic Party, positively bristling with policies”, in order to get us where we are.’
Indeed and the “Independence in Europe”/ “Babysteps to Freedom” idea, a masterstroke.
Shame that it morphed into a quasi-religious tenet and shame on those who put their new religion of one-world global wokeism ahead of what was is and should always be the belief of people who support an organisation called;
The Scottish National Party.
Col.Blimp IV
There was a senior intensive care surgeon interviewed by ch4, who was clear that the young and outwardly healthy are definitely at risk. Please stop pushing for a let-up, this is a public health CRISIS.
Col.Blimp IV
Sorry if I’m being bossy but I do have some knowledge of this stuff.
I used to be able to prove wokism and British nationalism are essentially the same ideological position.
It is possible for individuals to access international law, through the ECJ, if they feel their constitutional rights have been abused. Either individually or collectively. I posted academic proof of this a while back.
We can always bypass our government and judiciary in order to access constitutional justice consistent with international human rights law.
Our judiciary appear to be supportive of English Torydum. Is the Church of Scotland? Do they support British nationalism or the natural law?
If the support British nationalism, they will be supporting social engineering and eugenics.
Ian Brotherhood says: 12 April, 2020 at 3:08 pm
Firstly Ian, the reason why I just don’t want to discuss certain things at the moment is that during this period I am working as part of ‘skeleton crew’ as there are a lot of tasks in my job that can’t be done at home. It is a different culture where you have to be more positive and upbeat than usual both to help my colleagues but also to other people in the building. Outside work, I have to have to keep up the spirits by phone of an elderly relative who is self-isolating. I’m a quiet thoughtful chap and not one of these happy clappy types but surprisingly I do feel I am stepping up to the plate. To do that, it does mean suspending my intellectual pursuits which includes politics and trying to focus on things that allows me to keep up that positivity that is required.
I’m off work due public holidays and thought I’d resume normal I had read your article and wanted to comment on some of it.
As I have previously mentioned, things aren’t going back to normal once the lock-down is lifted. The article does mention a lot of valid issues about this with more social control and curtailing of previously enjoyed activities.
Staying first with these lost activities. This is something that I don’t really want to go into. Everybody enjoys different things and can only afford a certain level of material lifestyle. However, I do think a lot of people are going to realise that they aren’t going to miss a lot of these lifestyle pursuits that they can’t do now. I’m not sure that is something that people are going to be worried about.
Going onto the part about social control, I do accept that is a lot worrying. However, as I mentioned earlier we simply can’t go back to normal that requires parts of our society are ostracised. It isn’t morally right but with the advent of social media and the ability to easily connect groups despite large geographical distances, it isn’t possible. These groups will organise and push politically for their voices to be heard.
The biggest issue is how freedom do we give up? I share your concerns that this is being exploited by individuals who have no interest in the vulnerable in society and just want more control and power. Before the lockdown, I had tried to rationally explain the events to calm down some of, shall we say, the more hysterical colleagues in at work. Quite frankly I gave up because their heads were wasted with social media fake news. The bottom line is people are so frightened that they will do anything to get a bit of security.
I’m not really sure how you can deal with that. The only thing that I feel can be done is putting trust in our politicians to do the right thing. In that way, as I have repeated earlier, I trust the Scottish government, despite their flaws, over the UK government any day.
CameronB Brodie says: 13 April, 2020 at 2:21 am
A link to that youtube clip was supplied by a poster in here.
I had watched it. There was a few comments BTL that said the individual being interviewed was an actor and it was fake. The surgeon looked too ill and too visibly distressed for it to be faked or staged.
While I agree with the sincerity and honesty of the individual being interviewed as well as the interviewer, we have to be careful of the interview itself.
For obvious reasons, cuts were made in the name of editing to put it into a format suitable for a news programme as well as time constraints. Therefore we don’t know everything that the surgeon said.
There was also the impression given that most of his patients were young and outwardly healthy. What proportion was there between known vulnerable groups and those that are not. It also has to be kept in mind that just people don’t have outwardly health problems doesn’t mean they don’t have them. These only manifest with age or serious illness or injury.
The point I’m trying to make is that there is a danger that the surgeons comments are taken out of context to fit an agenda and we should cast a more critical eye towards them and others who speak similar sentiments. With my previous comments, I am in favour of more social controls for health reasons and social cohesion but we have to beware that we are not giving up our freedoms for the wrong reasons.
PacMan
I can’t argue with that. 😉
Wouldn’t want to. 🙂
Can some of the lockdown fans explain to me and others here why they think the lockdown is necessary?
@Breastplate 12.47 am
Triage. It was reported that in Italy, and possibly Spain, that ventilators were denied to people over 65. There weren’t enough to go round. So it’s possible that younger people were very ill but recovered through access to ventilators. Older people therefore became the majority of casualties.
That’s one possible explanation.
Social control of the type being considered now is inherently wrong.
Every social control ever introduced is abused. Go to the doctor and your details are run through the Home Office – Immigration Office – Border Agency computers. And with linked bank accounts, driving licences, national insurance numbers, HMRC details, social security details you have Windrush and the opportunity to effect the Hostile Environment on those deemed deserving of total and utter denial of al opportunity to live and work.
The striped pyjamas and gold star are very real.
The Alex Salmond Stitch -Up also tells you that as much as the abuse of the Windrush group does. Give the state the power and it will be abused – but only for those deserving of it. The blacks, the Muslims, the Jews, the Catholics, the pinkos, the dissidents, the difficult, or whoever. ( insert whatever group suits the bias and or discrimination )
The USA has a reason for allowing the right to bear arms in its constitution. A right bornevout of its recognition of colonial oppression that could recur. With something like 40,000 deaths annually at the hands of guns, the right to bear arms has killed more than the COVID 19 virus.
Maybe folks should bear that in mind when the argue that the state should be given totalitarian powers.
@ crazycat 12.21 – (I’m working my way back up the thread!).
Yes, you’re right. I think it was the presenter who said that about Bill Gates. Oh well, I got the impression they are anti vaccers.
I got the flu jab this year for the first time, also pneumonia and shingles. Two reasons: a friend’s daughter has EDS and is worried about passing on viruses to her. Also, I met an older woman whose facial muscles had collapsed because of shingles. So I decided to do my social duty and get all the vaccines that were going.
Then along comes COVID -19!
BBC Scotland still refuse to compare and contrast the Covid rates, deaths and relative preparedness / ability to cope of the NHS in Scotland and England.
Arch Unionist Robert Kilgour on Radio just now giving numerous plugs to his care home business and attacking the Scottish Government again. Initially fails to point out that Scottish government figures does include Covid deaths in care homes.
Not sure if this has already been shared on Wings – open air treatment during 1918 Spanish flu. Seems fresh air and sunlight had good results for recovery.
Some of you will remember the Sanatoriums for TB – we had one at Meanrskirk not far from where I grew up. Again it was all about fresh air and sunlight.
So tell that to the over-zealous cops the next time you’re moved on from a walk in the park!
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4504358/
When people like Robert Kilgour make attacks on Scottish government on BBC listeners have a right to know that he is the founder and prime mover of an anti independence organisation.
Also again BBC GMS fail to point out differences between levels of Covid cases and deaths per 100,000 in Scotland and England.
Scotland’s NHS is better prepared with more beds, doctors and nurses per head than in England and was behind the UK curve in the rise of cases.
Having read most the comments this morning up thread, let me just say this. If testing was being was being carried out, we would know exactly who should be isolating and what the infection rate is. We could therefore focus where limited resources should be used.
We would be able to track this virus and gather valuable data not only to help us now but also for future occurrences. That we have airports open without any apparent control is unbelievable but sadly par for the course.
Our freedom is not something we should be giving up, ever. We said that 700 yrs ago and its as relevant now as it was then. However the WHO regard this virus, the UK gov have their own agenda.
PacMan 5.00
Come on!
The few who thought the David Hepburn interview was staged were just the usual youtube crazies.
Over 1.2 million views now.
(Probably more than watched the original programme.)
So many positive comments I gave up trying to find the crazies!
Here’s the link for those who may not have watched it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejlbCmRJMW4
This twitter message condenses it all.
https://twitter.com/apnoeaboy/status/1248713903003107330
GMS is an absolute disgrace to every right minded person in Scotland. Last week Rbt Kilgour care home OWNER, failed tory mp, leader of anti-independence group, moaning about PPE – today we have PPE now but I don’t know about next week.
This is a man whose Care homes have very few qualified nurses (too expensive) who depend on training from NHS, use zero hour contracts and pay minimum pay to care staff. Very few, if any staff know about barrier nursing and surely in any setting like that ppe equipment and barrier nursing should be used as the norm.
But not content with complaining and misusing NHS walks away with the profits from his business, care does not come into it only profit.
The bbc however love him – he fits right in with their agenda of snp bad, very very bad but in the meantime no one in BBC England is prepared to ask even the obvious questions regarding the lack of preparedness of the English Health Service and the lies being spouted daily at their briefings.
Just more of Handcock’s comedy half hour and Priti Patel’s sorry I haven’t a clue.
Michael Gove got his daughter tested for the virus because she had shown symptoms.
She got the all clear a day later, meaning Gove was ok to continue working at Westminster.
But should she have been tested ahead of nurses and doctors who work on the front line and are still waiting to be tested?
If this had been any Scottish Minister it would have been an outrageous scandal and would probably be headline news across the UK for many days.
We will see if the English media run with it
https://mobile.twitter.com/GMB/status/1249600082225303557?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet
Mind you.
It’s not necessary to go to youtube to find the crazies.
Somebody has bravely collected lots of Telegraph headlines from the crisis.
And, yes, the Luftwaffe get a mention!
https://twitter.com/leonardocarella/status/1249406462339801088
@Scozzie 8.05: thanks for that excellent link on Spanish ‘flu and the fresh air and sunlight therapies.
Like Mearnskirk, Hairmyres hospital in East Kilbride became a TB hospital where patients could be wheeled out onto “verandas” under sloping glass roofs, even in winter, which could be pretty hard in EK. George Orwell was treated there, where he wrote part of 1984.
What makes Spanish ‘flu so frightening is that so many young people were affected. Perhaps the physical and mental effects of WW1 affected even their immune systems.
Capella,
There is no doubt that a lack of ventilators would have increased deaths particularly in the high risk group,
I’m not disagreeing with you on that but I don’t think you addressed my question.
Also on fb last night.
When doris was admitted to hospital, staff were required to sign the official secrets act, 2 Doctors refused and were sent home. Doctor said Doris was flippant and had a pathetic contrived cough, he should have been sent home with a flea in his ear. Sort of ties in with the idea this was no more than a propaganda stunt, getting Doris out of the line of fire and keeping him out of the line of fire.
Capella says:
13 April, 2020 at 6:51 am
Can some of the lockdown fans explain to me and others here why they think the lockdown is necessary?
@Breastplate 12.47 am
Triage.
It stops people moving about in theory for the duration of the incubation period. People carrying the virus, but completely unaware they have it, do not move freely through crowds of people. If nobody moved at all for that period, neither would the virus, but during the pause, all the hidden, incubating infections would reveal themselves as known actual cases, or pass beyond the stage of being contagious, and the spread of disease would be halted…. in theory.
It also, on the simplest level, stops the virus infecting new people, which means the straight correlation of less demand for hospital services where demand is already outstripping supply. That’s the ‘flattening the curve’ strategy we’ve had explained to us.
It is possible, although perhaps seen as unintended bonus, that lock down has had a material benefit already for the supermarkets by allowing them to recover from panic buying and restock shelves, and probably tweak their re-supply strategy to cope with a volatile public anxiety. The same is true for distribution of PPE supplies to front line workers.
I have also resisted criticism of the heavy handed tactics of the police. Not because I approve, far from it, but the police need time to adjust to the emergency just like the rest of us, and they’ll make mistakes and get things wrong, but hopefully learn from it. For every one Gestapo cop going too far, there will be 999 other cops groaning about the loss of goodwill and public cooperation making their job harder.
There is also a lockdown requirement because other countries are observing lockdown, and were the UK not to follow suit, the UK would become a pariah state which would anger the rest of the world for putting them at risk and increasing their lockdown period by allowing a reservoir of virus to flourish unchecked.
Lockdown is all about buying time, controlling proliferation, and analysing what the best strategy is to defeat COV19. But with the UK, including Scotland, doing such little testing, then I suspect we will never know enough data, and it seems very unlikely the best strategy for beating COV19 will be home grown solution.
Our domestic response might be doing it’s best, but we will wait to copy best practice prescribed by nations who do a lot more testing and analysis, and actually understand what they are dealing with.
That is why the Tory’s, having gutted NHS provision for decades, together with the pig-headed arrogance of British exceptionalism, typified by an asinine UK Prime Minister who nearly won himself a Darwinian Award, represents such a threat to us all. Britain will pride itself on doing this the hard way and a great many ordinary people will pay with their lives. Who needs ventilators from Europe eh? You could weep…
Done right, lockdown should deliver results in 3 or 4 weeks. But if Lockdown drags on for months, then something is wrong, you’re not doing it right. You’re just containing the disease, but not defeating it.
Would a blood transfusion from someone that has had and survived the virus maybe help in someone going through the virus,
just a thought.
Col Blimp IV,
I agree with all your points. It seems perfectly logical and rational to me.
Cameron BB,
Of course the young and old are at risk but there are entirely different values, percentage- wise to those risks.
Why does ch4 news interview a surgeon and not a virologist? Gun deaths in USA are not all murders .There are many suicides by firearm and accidental deaths due to inexperienced and poor firearm discipline. Beware of conflated death figures. Some gun deaths are people shot by police. Spree killing is a reflection on modern society.The isolated bullied frightened individuals. Also the problem of illegal firearms.
I suspect there is much conflation in reports of virus deaths .
Billy Ocean to release new version –
When the going gets tough, the tough get hiding.
Dedicated to Mr Faker the well known fridge hider.
Breeks,
The U.K. left the containment stage of this campaign against Covid 19 a couple of weeks ago. We are in the delay stage of this model.
Breeks.
Johnson would not have qualified for a Darwin Award.
You only get one if you die before having passed on your stupidity genes.
Alas …..
Breeks,
Sorry just to be clear, the whole idea behind this particular model is that Covid 19 spreads at a manageable rate for our emergency services.
I’m saying that can be done with the younger generation still at work and still at school.
My english media rant, listening to a BBC news bulletin yesterday and the reporter went back to the bad old days of using the “Regions” insult.
She told us of how the “Capital” (London) had higher death rates than the rest of the “Regions” across the UK.
I thought these terms were to be confined to the dark days of Empire,,,but no, they are still out there being used by our Colonial masters.
Also,,,,,
Sky News and ITV News are STILL using the tilted weather maps, where it shows Cornwall as being twice the size of the whole of Scotland.
It’s as if they don’t want to show the world that the area of england is approximately the same size as her neighbour to the North.
They have a huge inferiority complex.
golfnut @9-13am
So you fell for the Dr Shirley Knott as well? (Airplane??)
https://dorseteye.com/was-boris-johnsons-covid-19-condition-contrived/
Ruth Wishart has an excellent column in the National today, in my opinion it shows the UK government to have blood on its hands over the sheer and utter incompetence on how its handled this virus.
“Dozens of companies have reported offers to make protective clothing, and othsr essential supplies, and are still for a response. One firm reported that it was exporting (PPE) all over the world having no orders from the UK government at all.”
“Covid-19 testing stations shutting for lunch, other stations turning away NHS staff because they didn’t have appointments.”
There must be a public inquiry (judge led) into how the British governments shoddy almost lacklustre response to the outbreak.
https://www.thenational.scot/news/18375847.will-no-one-hold-uk-govt-account-virus-failings/
Scot Finlayson @ 09.13
Good thinking – this is not a new idea.
Historically, immune antibodies have been collected and concentrated to produce a product called “hyperimmune globulin” which can be used to protect non-immune individuals exposed to the infection – e.g. anti-hepatitis B immunoglobulin.
The amount of antibody present in a single unit of blood, however, would probably be inadequate to protect someone else from the COVID 19 infection.
The Transfusion Services used to collect units of plasma from many such “hyperimmune” donors (returning their red cells to them during the collection process) which were then pooled together, and fractionated (split into the component parts, including clotting actors, immunoglobulins and albumin).
The whole process depends on being able to identify “protective” antibodies (not all antibodies to an infection are protective – e.g. regarding hepatitis B, anti-HB core antibody is not protective, but anti-HB surface antibody is), and then identifying donors with high levels of such antibodies.
There may be some longterm value in such an idea for protecting the small number of high risk / vulnerable individuals who are themselves unsuitable for vaccination (i.e. people with immune deficiency / immunosuppression).
For people with normal immunity, vaccination would be preferable.
(The wife worked for SNBTS for over 30 years !!).
My english media rant, listening to a BBC news bulletin yesterday and the reporter went back to the bad old days of using the “Regions” and “Capital” insult.
She told us of how the “Capital” (London) had higher death rates than the rest of the “Regions” across the UK.
I thought these terms were to be confined to the dark days of Empire,,,but no, they are still out there being used by our Colonial masters.
Also,,,,,
Sky News and ITV News are STILL using the tilted weather maps, where it shows Cornwall as being the same size as the whole of Scotland.
It’s as if they don’t want to show the world that the area of england is approximately the same size as her neighbour to the North.
They have a huge inferiority complex.
Carole doing what she does.
https://twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/1249430550609383429
BBC Scotland is an enemy broadcaster delivering ennui in an attempt to narrow the Scots mental parameters. Their news output reinforces the idea of Scottish parochialism. BBC Scotland deliver propaganda that’s designed to make us feel shite ,an attack on our morale. While angry and upset people more likely to be rash. What BBC Scotland do to Scotland could almost be described as an act of war. I think most British journalists are regarded as a joke by journalists from other parts of the world especially journalists who risk their lives to do their job.
@ Breastplate – I was answering your question about why lockdown since most of the casualties are elderly. Breeks has given you a very full answer about the reason for a general lockdown.
Why can’t we have the workforce getting back to business and schools opening again?
If the virus runs rampant through the general public there will be a very large spike in cases and triage will have to be implemented.
NHS staff use Quality of Life Indicators to decide who to prioritise. In Italy the cut off age was 65 for ventilators. People with life threatening conditions might also be denied ventilators. If necessary, the upper age limit may have to be decreased. What would you recommend?
50? 40? Would you like to be in the position of having to decide who will live and who will die?
So Save Lives. Save the NHS. to coin a phrase.
I would rather direct my anger at the Westminster politicians who have run down the NHS for decades and failed to ban the animal welfare practices that cause these pandemics in the first place then failed to prepare for the outcome which was well understood. And their lackeys in the MSM.
With the U.K. death toll now having now been reported at 10, 651 deaths the UK now has the highest daily death rate with 980 dying in the last 24 hours.
But consider this too. In Australia there has been 66 reported Coronavirus deaths whilst in New Zealand only 6.
Question, and big questions need to be asked and no one is asking them as the BBC today headline with the UK mounting a Herculean effort to get protective medical to the frontline. And all this from a government who only seven week ago was running a public information campaign to say that it and the NHS were well prepared for the virus.
Like cattle led to the slaughter no one is calling our government to account. Dying droves as a crippled government vainly tries to belatedly abate a tidal wave of death that they deliberately caused through their arrogant and flawed decision n to protect the economy by spread the virus and lay down protection preparations, we are now fed a diet of we’ll meet again British bullshit..
A broken, utterly broken Britain dying like beggars under sacks as the Government struggles to provide even enough proper body bags with hospitals having to utilise plastic sheets.
And don’t think it’s just Johnson and his ilk. Queen Nicola’s Government kept in lockstep with the PM on the health and economic policy that has brought this holocaust to where it is.
UK vs Australia. Or Scotland vs Norway or New Zealand.
Meanwhile Johnson is heading home to spend at least two weeks to rest and recuperate. Johnson couldn’t laud and praise the NHS staff enough that saved his life.
Maybe this is Johnsons damascence moment,and he’ll decide to properly fund the NHS and give the very hard working staff within the NHS a pay rise.
Do you think that will happen? No? Me neither.
Call KayE Gold @ approx 9.45am
Dr. Donald McAskill head of Scottish Care “ we have 3 (or 4) suppliers (of PPE in England who have stopped supplying Scotland. They have been told to continue supplying facilities in England only”
KayE composed her self and hit back with something along the lines of “ have you no Scottish suppliers”
Only 61 deaths (RIP) in Australia,
how the f@ck !
China apparently seeing some new cases imported from outside its borders so some regions “now require all arrivals to quarantine for 28 days and undergo testing”.
https://web.archive.org/web/20200413085431/https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/13/china-infections-rise-as-some-spanish-companies-prepare-to-restart-work?CMP=share_btn_tw
Is the UK still allowing flights in from wherever with no significant screening or quarantine of passengers?
Where the hell is the so called Scottish Government and it’s Westminster MPs?
English manufacturers not willing to send essential medical equipment to Scotland
The Co-op TV advert pleading for funds to support the vulnerable in England and Wales
The Army sending 400 troops to work in the English Ambulance service.
All of the above are necessary in Scotland and Westminster confirm they don’t give a damn
and Scotland should just shut up when being abused and insulted.
Could you be an SNP representative and turn a blind eye to all this?
Could you claim to be Scotland’s broadcaster and not report on this?
Only 61 deaths (RIP) in Australia
It’s maybe still summer in Australia? All that disinfecting sunshine?
@ Sassanach.
Are you really convinced that Doris was at deaths door, I’m not. The media barrage aimed at convincing the UK public that Doris is fighting the good fight while his Chancellor piles debt onto an already financially weak public, that we aren’t actually being distracted from the contrived( think about why I might have used that word contrived) incompetence of the UK gov. Why Scotland’s FM is under constant attack at the same time as Doris is removed from public scrutiny. Lots more could be added to this list, if we suck this up without question, well be sucked under with no way back.
Capella says: at 9:54 am
“I would rather direct my anger at the Westminster politicians who have run down the NHS for decades and failed to ban the animal welfare practices that cause these pandemics in the first place then failed to prepare for the outcome which was well understood. And their lackeys in the MSM.”
With China being an emerging global power and rival to the West, what better way to eliminate them from the game than with huge lawsuits and damages claims for trashing various Western economies due to China’s negligence in failing to address the practices that have led to various viral outbreaks.
The West giving them enough rope and all that.
Either by accident or design one can envisage a power-play of some sort coming out of this episode because psychos in power will never miss an opportunity to advantage their interest as and when one presents itself.
Capella,
Breeks didn’t give me a very full answer, he gave me a very long lecture on nothing in particular that boiled downed to the police have a difficult job to do and we are in this particular lockdown so that supermarkets can restock
He puts forward excellent arguments for an independent Scotland but I wasn’t impressed by his “very full answer” to why this model of lockdown is necessary.
I’ve already stated that people who do not get sick from Covid 19 will not need to go to hospital,
I’m sorry if you find this confusing but I really don’t know how to spell it out any simpler.
Boris’ 2 life saving nurses are both foreigners that England wants to keep out.
They will be asked for £1,200.00 each under new policies if they
Wish to extend their UK work permit for up to 3 years.
Praise indeed and knowing the value of nothing.
Capella,
We already decide people will die every year, you included.
Like you, I have been in here for years yet not one winter flu season have I seen you or anyone else demand a lockdown.
Breastplate
Watch the David Hepburn interview.
Here’s the link.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejlbCmRJMW4
This twitter message condenses it all.
https://twitter.com/apnoeaboy/status/1248713903003107330
And to add to the last sentence of my previous post, that highlights the difference between how folk with power operate.
They seize advantage and leverage off events. You’d hope Scotland could have mustered up a stronger challenge than just stating “Scotland won’t be pulled out of the EU against its will”, when there are significant negative economic implications that leaving the EU will have on our businesses and communities.
The meek will inherit fuck all…other than a fistful of dusty old unused mandates.
Breastplate
I agree totally with your points.
Unfortunately, your colleagues on here can only view matters through the prism of hatred and loathing towards the UK.
I would have thought that this crisis transcends all the usual nonsense.
Golfnut
I was merely asking if it was that article I posted, which seemed to be the one you were talking about on fb, had not rung any bells with the doctors names? So obvious a spoof.
The guy who wrote the actual article you referenced said in the initial comments btl – “You’d be amazed how many people I caught out, today”!!
I was just asking if you have been one of them?
My actual interest in Doris is nil.
Dan
Are you still viewing the EU through your ‘Rose tinted spectacles’
Maybe you should take a look at the lack of solidarity within the bloc.
We are witnessing the return of the ‘nation state’ with borders being erected and each country doing its own thing (as it should be, imo)
The countries in the eurozone couldn’t even muster enough solidarity to issue corona bonds to assist the Southern European states.
Time you did a reassessment, I think.
British nationalism is incompatible with the principle of universal human rights. British constitutionalism only remained tolerable while the moral law obligations of the establishing Treaty were respected. As soon as BoJo went full retard and shat on the Moral Law, the British constitutional lost all moral authority and legal force.
It’s purely conditioned reflex that keeps Scotland under Westminster authority. From a legal perspective informed by a respect of natural law anyway.
A Morale Booster:
Did we British crumble when millions of poorer people died of famine in our glorious Empire? No.
Did we British crumble when millions died of malnutrition and lack of basic health care for poorer people? No.
Did we British crumble when many thousands of people died of epidemics of cholera due to lack of clean water? No.
Did we British crumble when many people died of TB, encouraged by unsanitary living conditions such as whole families crammed together in one room “single end” tenement flats? No.
Did we British crumble when over a million young British died needlessly fighting the great war for British patriotism? No.
Will we British crumble because we allowed an epidemic to spread through the population before taking action? No.
Will we British crumble because thousands of people have died needlessly because our health and social care services were not properly equipped? No.
We will do what we British always do when faced with crises made much worse by British Govt incompetence and self-interest:
Keep calm and cover up the truth.
Incompetence and inadequacy. It’s what we British do best. It makes you proud to be British.
God Save The Queen!!
@ Pete 10:51
There is some truth in what you say, but the vast majority of the bile springing forth from these pages towards the uk is from Agent Provocateurs.
If you had come here 2 years ago you would have read passionate but reasoned debate in a troll free zone about topics which highlighted the duplicity of the uk press and politicians towards Scotland and the SNP.
Sadly the owner has taken the blog in a different direction and it has now become what you and others see, or wish to see, a site that serves no purpose whatsoever other than to undermine the cause of Scottish independence!
And before anyone asks:
No, I am not (GB) Gordon Brown’s speech writer.
Doug Buchannan
I’d suggest gradualism is no longer valid, as Brexitania is not a social democracy. I value my human rights and the rights of others. Brexit denies I have a legal right to have legal rights.
Mike Cassidy,
Thank you for the links, I’ve read and watched the interview.
The NHS workers are doing a fantastic job and I am in no way saying that we should try to overwhelm the hospitals, I am also aware of viral load being a real danger to them and that they should be given the proper protective equipment.
I have already acknowledged that there is a risk to young and old. It is not the same risk though.
The Doctor in the interview did state near the end that they would take you in to ICU if they thought that you would benefit from it, pandemic or no pandemic. That may be the answer to why they have that age range there.
He does state also that this virus does not discriminate on age. That is true, we are all susceptible to it but that does not mean it will affect us all in the same way, far from it as stats show.
Scott Finlayson @10.04
Cappella @ 10.19
It could be a combination of the sunshine here in Oz (we’re mostly still in Autumn); but I think what probably really helped is we locked down the borders quite quickly (not quick enough granted, but certainly quicker than the UK).
The other factor is we’re testing way more than the UK (not just those admitted to hospital but also the general population). And all returning Australians from overseas are now going into strict quarantine in hotels.
All our state borders are also locked down so we can’t travel outside our state. So we’re definitely still in containment phase.
Schools in Victoria shut on 24th March and it was about that time we went into lockdown more broadly. Our caseload was still quite low, I’m sure if we’d delayed a couple of weeks beyond, our figures would look quite different.
I’m not a lockdown nazi, but I do think social distancing is wise. The population still go outside for fresh air and exercise and our cops are not quite acting like the Gestapo yet. But in the main people are following the restrictions. Y
It’s heartbreaking watching the situation unfold in the UK. I still have family at home and friends who work in the NHS. Our government is not great, perhaps we’ve just been lucky so far. But I do get the feeling they’re trying to get ahead of the curve. Yet I get the feeling the UK government are in a state of ‘it’s all gone tits up so so let’s just make sure the rich are looked after and the hedge funds protected’!!!!!
With us still to go into winter, combined with flu season, the situation could look a lot different in a few months time. Who knows.
Pete is talking cobblers again about the EU breaking up.
And this is just two days after the EU Central Bank announced half a trillion Euros in support for members.
The largest support package in the world.
British cover up which they are very good at.
https://bylinetimes.com/2020/04/11/a-national-scandal-a-timeline-of-the-uk-governments-woeful-response-to-the-coronavirus-crisis/
Exercise Cygnus
Type this in your browser and read all about it.
Scott Finlayson @10.04
Cappella @ 10.19
It could be a combination of the sunshine here in Oz (we’re mostly still in Autumn); but I think what probably really helped is we locked down the borders quite quickly (not quick enough granted, but certainly quicker than the UK).
The other factor is we’re testing way more than the UK (not just those admitted to hospital but also the general population). And all returning Australians from overseas are now going into strict quarantine in hotels.
All our state borders are also locked down so we can’t travel outside our state. Where clusters arise they’re doing strict quarantines, so we’re definitely still in containment phase.
Schools in Victoria shut on 24th March and it was about that time we went into lockdown more broadly. Our caseload was still quite low, I’m sure if we’d delayed a couple of weeks beyond, our figures would look quite different.
I’m not a lockdown nazi, but I do think social distancing is wise. The population still go outside for fresh air and exercise and our cops are not quite acting like the Gestapo yet. But in the main people are following the restrictions. Yes, it’s crippling our economy just like everywhere else but if we let it runaway then our health system will be swamped just like Italy, Spain and UK.
It’s heartbreaking watching the situation unfold in the UK. I still have family at home and friends who work in the NHS.
Our government is not great, perhaps we’ve just been lucky so far. But I do get the feeling they’re trying to get ahead of the curve. Yet I get the feeling the UK government are in a state of ‘it’s all gone tits up so so let’s just make sure the rich are looked after and the hedge funds protected’!!!!!
With us still to go into winter, combined with flu season, the situation could look a lot different in a few months time, who knows.
We have a public / private healthcare system and the government has now co-opted the private sector (essentially paying the private hospitals to keep open and pay its workforce but at $0 profit) which has increased its bed / ICU capacity if required for COVID patients.
Sorry for the long post just giving you a snap shot of what’s happening here seeing as you mentioned our caseload / deaths.
@ Clydebuilt 10.02
On Morning with Kay Adams at 09.40 (Monday 13 April) we heard from Donald Macaskill, CEO Scottish Care. He stunned Kaye and the listeners with this:
‘We are facing an additional problem and that is that the care home sector and the care sector had traditionally ordered PPE from various sources. The four largest companies in the UK [sic] last week said they were not sending to Scotland and their priority was going to be England NHS and then English social care providers so within two or three days we’ve had a massive dry-up of procurement into Scotland and that’s had an impact, a really serious impact on our care homes and home care.’
You could sense the alarm in Kay’s voice as she, ironically, tried to blame the Scottish sector for not being independent enough: ‘So you don’t have any unique Scottish sources? But is the stuff there to be got?
Macaskill then went on to praise the Scottish Government’s efforts in increasing supply. Adams moved on quickly.
Those that think Scotland could have taken a different route earlier than the UK are deluding themselves. The only way we could have achieved a different approach is by being independent. WM controls the borrowing/ability to print money, where would the money have come from to shut businesses and compensate them. Those that control the money control the country.
It is not the SNP or Scotgov fault we are in this mess, it is the people of Scotland’s fault, they chose it in 2014. The deaths are on all our hands.
Scotland hit by ‘England-only’ supply decision
Mornings with Kaye Adams
BBC Radio Scotland
Supplies of protective equipment to carers in Scotland have been hit by the decision of the four largest manufacturers in the UK saying they will limit supplies to England, it has been revealed.
But Dr Donald Macaskill, chief executive of Scottish Care, tells BBC Radio Scotland that, although he remains concerned about supplies, he believes they are improving.
“We are facing an additional problem and that is that the care home sector and the care at home sector had traditionally ordered PPE from various sources, but the four largest companies in the UK last week said they were not sending to Scotland and their priority was going to be England – English NHS and then English social care providers.
“So, within two or three days, we’ve had a massive dry up of procurement into Scotland and that’s had a really serious impact on our care homes and care organisations. Things have improved over the weekend. We are confident the stuff is there but just needs to be put out.”
The “Scottish” (sic) MSM are preparing massive, in depth investigative reports as I write.
NOT!!!
Our enemy’s enemy is our friend. God bless the EU.
MSM = Misrepresenting Scotland Media
@ Scozzie – thx for the update. I’m not familiar with what Australia has done to deal with the virus. With “Scott from Marketing” in charge I thought the worst. So it’s good to see that you have taken steps to protect yourselves.
Doug Buchannan @11.07
Oh I think the SNP have undermined the cause of Scottish independence all by themselves. I reckon the people on Wings still have the same drive and determination for independence, but some of us are just not sure the SNP has.
Scott
Did they not have a similar “dry run”, prior to the London Bombings?
Capella @ 12.24pm
Oh am not giving Scotty from marketing any thumbs up on this. He was basically backed into a corner from the State governments who said ‘we’ll go it alone with our decisions’ which meant he was forced to take some tough decisions. Am sure if he’d had his way, it would be business as usual as all he was concerned about was the economy !!!!
Sensible dave seems to be taking the line that the virus is going to hit everyone, and we might as well get used to it. I believe this may be correct as there is little chance of a vaccine in the near future.
He correctly presents the British position that the policy is designed to deliver manageable numbers to the hospitals. Well it is his job to present his masters views. If he is just another unionist uncle Tom.
The really interesting point is Westminster has failed in even this modest approach. England currently has over 2.5 times the rate of Southern Ireland and is headed for the worst rate of infection in Europe, even considering they are missing 70% of deaths, as reported by the Office for National Statistics.
https://threader.app/thread/1249127908876128259
Out of control the virus will overwhelm the NHS and we may be headed to New York style mass graves. The quicker the lock down is removed the greater to the risk to the NHS ability to manage the numbers presenting.
The Scottish Government, and in particular Nicola, seem to be taking every step possible to explain the numbers they are presenting. This is in complete contrast to the Westminster Government who seem to be providing little analysis and pointing to every other country.
I cannot stomach “K wi an E fae the valleys”, so thanks all for posting comments regarding her garbage broadcast.
When the dust settles and some normality resumes, the comments from Dr Macaskill should be stuck on every public building in Scotland.
Scots treated as fodder yet again for the benefit of the empire??
Better Together Yoons???
Over to the trolls to tell us the benefits of the “Onion”.
Scozzie @ 12:26
+1
@ Dan 10.20 – the “West” will have a hard time trying to blame China for ghastly animal welfare practices. America must be the global capital; agriculture is specifically exempt from animal welfare legislation. That’s why they keep harping on about bats and pangolins.
Yes, eating wild animals and bush meat is bad. This virus has bat dna but also has passed through another species so it is not clear yet which animal or bird was the source. All of this could just as easily occur wherever factory farming is practiced i.e. all of Western Europe, the Americas, and China. The 2007 swine flu epidemic started off in Missouri.
https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2007/12/new-swine-flu-virus-supports-mixing-vessel-theory
Can’t remember which journal I read about the dna id – might be this one:
https://journals.lww.com/cmj/pages/collectiondetails.aspx?TopicalCollectionId=2
Pete @ 10:51
“I would have thought that this crisis transcends all the usual nonsense.”
So, what’s your excuse?
@ Scozzie – funnily enough – that’s more or less what happened here!
You know we’re down the rabbit hole when Alistair Campbell makes sense.
https://www.thearticle.com/media-questions-at-no10-briefings-are-woeful-here-are-20-they-should-ask
Scozzie @ 11.48
Maybe you’re more correct that you think.
Northern hemisphere winter – seasonal flu.
Southern hemisphere summer – no seasonal flu.
Also Peter Hitchens has come up with these figures, he wasn’t clear whether they were E&W or UK but they are like for like.
ONI Statistics –
First Quarter Deaths from Respiratory Diseases as follows
2020 22,877
as compared with
2019 23,336
2018 29,898
2017 25,800
2015 28,969
2013 25,495
Are we being had?
The UKaye Adams supply story is on BBC Scotland’s ‘live’ feed at 11.17
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-scotland-52203327
Tinto Chief @9.07am
I’m not sure if it’s a compliment or not that the world’s most dystopian book was written in EK (ps am from EK so don’t get huffy on me haha).
Now you can see why PPE is being used as a weapon against the SG, English firms refusing to supply Scotland, let’s blame the SG.
The grim collateral damage of pandemic panic.
https://www.ft.com/content/10d8f5e8-74eb-11ea-95fe-fcd274e920ca
https://www.globalresearch.ca/covid-19-smartphone-surveillance-state/5709457
The BBC was first formed then developed by Whitehall spooks who perceived the medium of radio and subsequently television to be well suited to control and manipulate the thoughts and actions of the population of the country and wider afield through the subversive misuse of information.
Over a century of operations the corporation and their controllers have basked in the glory of the dubious praise of excellence in the use of mistruth and loaded language from “spooks” and their handlers worldwide.
But taxpayers should not be saddled with meeting the huge cost of maintaining a monolith which has no place in modern society and the use of the BBC as a weapon of propaganda against Scots who fervently wish to be free of the invidious control of Westminster is an affront to the expression of human rights contained in the United Nations Charter.
https://caltonjock.com/2020/04/13/the-blatant-use-of-the-bbc-by-westminster-as-a-weapon-of-propaganda-against-scots-is-an-affront-to-the-expression-of-human-rights-contained-in-the-united-nations-charter/
“Tinto Chief @9.07am
I’m not sure if it’s a compliment or not that the world’s most dystopian book was written in EK (ps am from EK so don’t get huffy on me haha).”
@Scozzie: no danger of that, I’m from the high tundra of EK myself. At least as children we had the perk of being able to chuck snowballs at the Orange Walk…….
*Gets his Puff Daddy coat*
“Dr. Donald McAskill head of Scottish Care “ we have 3 (or 4) suppliers (of PPE in England who have stopped supplying Scotland. They have been told to continue supplying facilities in England only”
Clydebuilt.
This must surely be another nail in the coffin of the bollocks that the union is good for Scotland.
The WHO and guys with big bucks aka global ‘influencers’.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/can-we-trust-who/5708576
Republicofscotland says:
can you provide links to what he said
Rev Campbell,
Good day to you,I hope your well.Yesterday i tried to post some info for Mr Brotherhood,as it was my first public post anywhere ever,and being a technophobe,im not quite sure why it wasn’t put up.
i realise i used his first name, without previously conversing,my apologies.
As i think it was Dr Jim that said if you live abroad, then you only have an opinion, fair enough,couldnt agree more,Thats why ive been lurking the last 2 yrs,but if i can give Wingers any info , i will.
I thought i knew about politics back before the referendum,i knew nothing until i found this site,You and all the Yes movement make me very proud to be a Scot,thank you, stay safe, folks
“The “Scottish” (sic) MSM are preparing massive, in depth investigative reports as I write.”
Indeed Admiral, nothing will come of this scandal, because a you rightly point out there is no Scottish media, its an illusion.
I don’t expect Sturgeon to grow a pair and do anything about either, if she can stab Salmond in the back, then its not that big of stretch to stab Scotland in the back.
“can you provide links to what he said”
Shug.
Mike has the link up @1.02pm
I would’ve though the eruption of Krakatoa would be worthy of MSM coverage.
Look!…..a squirrel
Can anyone confirm or refute the following:
The Tory ministers at Westminster decreed that pensioners who had covid19 but did not need the aid of a ventilator should not be kept in hospital, but should instead be ‘farmed out’ to their local olf folks home to convalesce there.
These pensioners were still able to spread the virus and many of the most elderly and infirm OAPs in these homes began to catch the virus from these ‘new members’
The UK government also decreed that the managers/medical staff connected to the designated homes, should not take these OAPs with the virus to hospital but should treat them at the home.
Many of the OAPs infected by these new members have died, but the UK government has not been reporting the deaths at these homes.
Question 1. can these facts all be shown to be true?
Question 2. Is the SNP government doing anything different?
Tinto chief @1.19pm
Haha High tundra…we could show Sir Edmund Hilary a few techniques trudging through the snow tae school in our duffle coats.
Scottish health service used to procure it’s own meds and equipments until T.May arrogated that devolved power back to London. There was not a peep in Jock media nor indeed much coming from First Minister .She rolled over. Now Unionist media in Scotland will beat the SNP over the year head with another media pile on.
just to be clear, I’m always careful to avoid getting caught up in the ‘truths’ (that end up being crap) of the conspiracy theorists that always pop up when something big happens,
BUT,
If you wanted to design a system that got rid of a large number of ‘our costly and burdensome’ pensioners but didn’t want too many people knowing that this was happening.
Surely not?
Little Krakatoa (Anak) – still news worthy though!
J.Galt damn good question.
From Sky news.
“Prince William has said the coronavirus outbreak has again shown that Britain is “at its best when we’re in a crisis”
Yeah like, stop supplying other hime nartiins with essential equipment during epidemics. Or producing deaths of other home nation frequently but not your own, nor your carehome figures. Or tell the EU to F-Off we don’t need your PPE, but we do need to be rid of you via our post-Brexit deal which will still go on.
Or tell foreigners to go home, leaving the NHS short of staff. Britain’s days are numbered than goodness.
Something bothered me about the daily reporting of people infected with Covid19 and those who had died from it. That was people who die from it don’t just drop dead the second they are registered with Covid19 by the authorities. They take time to die, and this time varies wildly from just a few days to several weeks, depending on what source you use:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019%E2%80%9320 coronavirus pandemic
https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2020/02/study-72000-covid-19-patients-finds-23-death-rate
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanres/article/PIIS2213-2600(20)30079-5/fulltext
I calculated percentages of deaths using the accumulated infections and deaths to date, rather than new infections and deaths that day because it gives a better picture of the trend. Percentages were also calculated for each day, and the two figures were compared. The least average discrepancy between the two methods occurs when a gap of 6 days is used between Covid19 being reported, and the poor soul dying. It wasn’t always 6 days, but has stabalised to this (from 0 days) over the past 17 days.
So I’ve used the cumulated deaths from two days ago (11th April), and compared it as a percentage with the cumulated infections for 6 days previously (5th April).
Figures for 11th April sourced from:
https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/situation-reports
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-track-coronavirus-cases
https://www.gov.scot/coronavirus-covid-19
It can be argued that people being reported with Codid19 are just a small percentage of those that actually have it. This is not the point. The point is to show how the united kingdom (disunited shitdom) stacks up against all the other proper countries in the world. It does not look good.
For 6 days from reporting to death, the figures are horrific:
% of Latest Deaths to Reported Infections 6 days previous – Comparing Countries of Interest:
22.4 England
21.4 The United Kingdom
19.5 France
15.1 Italy
14.6 Scotland
13.5 Sweden
12.7 Spain
11.0 Wales
9.8 Northern Ireland
7.1 India
6.2 Ireland
6.1 United States of America
4.0 China
2.8 Germany
1.7 Norway
% of Latest Deaths to Reported Infections 6 days previous – Top Worst countries in the world:
50.0* Liberia
39.1* Sint Maarten
38.6* Bangladesh
33.3* Bahamas
33.3* Malawi
33.3* Zimbabwe
28.6* Antigua and Barbuda
26.1* Guyana
25.0* Belize
25.0* Botswana
25.0* Gambia
25.0* Northern Mariana Islands (Commonwealth of the)
22.4 England
21.4 The United Kingdom
* These countries have less than 424 infected people. Of these, all but one have 50 or less infected people. Only three countries have data that is 3 weeks old and the rest have data two weeks to just days old. Countries with impossible percentages of over 100% death rate indicates inaccurate or mistimed reporting, or a shorter Infection to Death time than the 6 days calculated (none as of 11th).
I hope I’m wrong and that I’ve made a mistake and the figures aren’t as bad as this.
If I’m right then the UK is arguably the worst performing block in the world for dealing with this outbreak. Also I’ve heard that westminster has taken over procurement of medical supplies, taking away autonomy from the devolved nations, and forcing them on a rigid and deadly path. This is yet another reason why Scotland must have independence. If this event doesn’t do it then what the feck will it take to convince no-voters that the united kingdom is an oxymoron, whose existence doesn’t make sense.
English/British nationalists wheel out some parasitical numpty royal to give us the usual Dunkirk-spirit, bringing-the-nation-together bullshit.
Truly sickening.
This is brilliant, but to think this guy is in charge in America is scary to say the least.
He knows more about…well watch it and see for yourself.
https://mobile.twitter.com/malmberg_victor/status/1249424744010649602
I fear the conspiracy is to strip us permanently of civil liberties.Why ?I There are no doubt several reasons for it. Perhaps the most pressing reason is the state of an economy that supposedly is dying on its arse.Media seems curiously at one on both sides of Atlantic and I wonder if it’s part of the anti Trump narrative. Don’t be fooled into believing Donald Trumps daft.When he tweets the world goes on a wild Turkey hunt. With the distraction in place theRepublicans and theDemocrats vote for the same policies. They’re American equivalent of Red Tory Blue Tory. Let’s face Democracy is a hustle. Any decent pool players out there?
Heard Kaye getting told this morning about 4 suppliers in England being ‘directed’ to restrict their PPE products to Health Care England and all darn Sarf.
Strangely no journalist asked about this at the SGov briefing!
I would have loved to find out who directed.
Maybe asked at a 4-nations Cobra meeting…. 🙁
PS:
Numbers today:
Scotland …Today 9 ….Total….575 BBC
Wales…….Today 18 …Total….369 BBC
N Ireland…Today 11 ….Total….118 BBC
England….Today 737 ….Total..10612 BBC
——————————————–
UK ………Today 775….Total..11674 My Coonting 🙁
RepublicofScotland @1.59pm
What an arse (Prince William that is), coz we all just love a good crisis to be at our best…as he says from the comfort of his castle, with his private doctor and a jet to get him out if it all goes Pete Tong!!!!!
This MSM Monitor really shows how nefarious, the English media in Scotland is, and how Machiavellian their puppets in Scotland are.
Why would anyone without their snout firmly pushed into the unionist trough, want to stay in this preposterous excuse for a union one minute longer.
https://mobile.twitter.com/msm_monitor
@ Sassanach.
Should have said ‘ resonates ‘ rather than ‘ties into the idea’ would have perhaps been a bit more obvious, but hey ho, interest in doris/Boris is nil. That would put in a minority on this site.
Patrick Roden @ 1.56pm
I don’t think it’s a conspiracy. I don’t think the world, would on purpose, tank their own economies. However, I can see that some governments (looking at you UK), would see tens of thousands of deaths of the elderly and vulnerable as collateral damage. Every cloud so to speak…(not my words just my thinking of Cummings / Johnson mindset).
For anyone who missed it this morning – this information was mentioned on the Call Kaye programme on Radio Scotland this morning but seems to have been conveniently ignored by any other Scottish media outlet
” Scotland hit by ‘England-only’ supply decision
Mornings with Kaye Adams
BBC Radio Scotland
Supplies of protective equipment to carers in Scotland have been hit by the decision of the four largest manufacturers in the UK saying they will limit supplies to England, it has been revealed.
But Dr Donald Macaskill, chief executive of Scottish Care, tells BBC Radio Scotland that, although he remains concerned about supplies, he believes they are improving.
“We are facing an additional problem and that is that the care home sector and the care at home sector had traditionally ordered PPE from various sources, but the four largest companies in the UK last week said they were not sending to Scotland and their priority was going to be England – English NHS and then English social care providers.
“So, within two or three days, we’ve had a massive dry up of procurement into Scotland and that’s had a really serious impact on our care homes and care organisations. Things have improved over the weekend. We are confident the stuff is there but just needs to be put out.”
Aye, we’re definitely BETTER TOGETHER eh Gordon, Willie Rennie, (T)Ruthless, Jackson and all the other numpties ? Try explaining that to yir Granny!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-scotland-52203327/page/2 ( may have been moved further down the ‘live’ page but it is reported at 11.19)
@ Callmedave.
Still no march 2020 update on the Scotland Birth/death Register totals. I wonder if they will specify coronavirus or lump them in with Respitory totals.
‘re the PPE, they obviously expected the news that Scotland was excluded from any allocation to break surface at some point, easy now to understand why they have turned this into an SNP baad story.
Games good by the way, though I’m still in training.
Questions for Johnson…
https://truepublica.org.uk/united-kingdom/something-fishy-about-boris-johnsons-intensive-care-stay/?fbclid=IwAR00PRRlUuMtnDany4HzQW4mzJTFRONlKQ_rrwWhb62LQk05LmDAgVtawI8
Dog biscuit @ 1.59
Nobody’s interested pal, we’re in a minority!
this is interesting – a question no one is asking
https://www.unz.com/article/the-hunt-for-patient-zero/
– the speculation is that is happened in the USA, to start with
now never let a good crisis go to waste
https://www.unz.com/mwhitney/weimar-america-here-we-come-virus-hysteria-adds-10-trillion-to-the-national-debt/
now take a good idea, and invert it to your advantage
https://www.unz.com/mhudson/the-use-and-abuse-of-mmt/
every aspect of american public life seems to be exclusively populated by assholes, or psychopaths, if you want to get clinical
Reports of English companies only willing to supply PPE equipment to England. Do you imagine it woud be any different if it came to a food shortage, Scotland would be stripped of its food to supply England. We would be treated no differently to Ireland in the 19th century.
@Golfnut
I heard FM say that all figures for ‘not in hospital deaths’ related to the virus are being collate and restated in a different form with age ranges , locations, etc. The whole register of reporting has been stopped tp allow thi all to happen.
This week (Wednesday) usual day it happens.
This means that the figures which were small today (9) for (Easter weekend) delay reasons on ‘hospital’ deaths + these ‘non hospital’ deaths soon to be announced will probably show a surge in a couple of days.
PS:
I see that my figures earlier have been superseded now.
Wales and NI values have changed.
But 717 today UK and 11339 total UK 🙁
Getting repeated ‘site can’t be reached’ from that truepublica link that Ian posted, anyone else having trouble, all other tabs are working and loading fine, tried copy and paste into google too, same message coming back again and again.
J Galt @ 2.47pm
It’s not that no-ones interested but there’s a whole bunch of things that fall under respiratory diseases – COPD, Asthma, Emphysema, Chronic Bronchitis, Cystic Fybrosis, etc etc even lung cancer is classified as a respiratory disease.
If the figures were just for flu then that’s different. But my understanding is that flu does not kill 10,000 per year.
We’re almost self sufficient for food in Scotland so we don’t have to depend on the english, dissolving the Union the best thing that could happen to all four countries, every country will look after their own, with virus or without virus, or during peace or war but preferably peace, open up our ports and trade with any country who’ll trade with us. If Scotland and the world doesn’t change after this virus it’s nae gan to be much o a future.
From the Herald:
“Angus Brendan MacNeil said the current situation highlighted that “dealing with your own problems unfettered and cooperating on your own terms is better”.
It came just a day after the SNP said “the last thing any Scottish politician” should be doing was using the “appalling crisis… as an argument for or against independence”. ”
Bridge on the River Kwai is on Channel 5:
Colonel Nicholson: “I suggest you don’t try to escape”.
Nicola Sturgeon: “Nicola Sturgeon has ordered all SNP members to stop campaigning”.
There were more deaths from flu in 3 weeks in January (E&W) 2015, than there appears to have been in other years since.
2015 is a year that can’t be explained in terms of ‘usual’ flu deaths. They guessed it may be to do with the weather that year, but actually no one can explain that roughly 46,000 deaths in England and Wales in a 3 week period in Jan 2015.
‘What were the figures?
The ONS has published weekly figures on deaths registered in England and Wales from December 5 2014.
This shows that in the week beginning January 9 2015, there was a total of 16,237 deaths, followed by a total of 14,866 deaths in the week beginning January 16 2015, and 13,934 deaths in the week beginning January 23 2015.’
https://www.nhs.uk/news/medical-practice/flu-and-freezing-weather-may-be-driving-up-winter-death-rates/
Curious.
Golfnut @2.41
I noticed on the overall total deaths in march column, ln year2019 – 887 fewer deaths were recorded than in 2005
4637 against 5524 I wonder how many extra deaths per month constitute a crisis.
K1,
I’ve read somewhere about that year and if my memory serves me properly the reason for the higher death rate was that people were vaccinated against the wrong strain of flu.
I’m not 100% on that but worth a check.
All the sensible posters
Flu deaths can vary greatly from one year to another.
Typically, anything from 5k up to 18k has been seen over the last 20years.
This year is likely to be around 20k so not very much unusual.
What is different here is the speed of transmission which, if unchecked, can overwhelm the heath service.
Once we get the NHS properly organised then the lockdown should be withdrawn in an orderly manner with herd immunity being the policy till a vaccine comes on stream.
Older folks and vulnerable people will probably need to be kept indoors a little longer.
But it is imperative that we get the economy going again as otherwise deaths will rocket from poverty, depression, alcoholism, obesity – you name it.
It is pleasing to note that not everyone on here is a raving loony or a conspiracy theorist.
@ Callmedave.
Thanks, I wasn’t aware of the changes being made. Really not looking forward to seeing these figures rising.
Col.Blimp IV.
Well I guess we are about to find out.
I haven’t looked back that far, but Feb of this year 4715 deaths, was 6.7% lower than the average for the previous 5yrs, I’m kind of using that as a bench mark for the total figures in march. I’m not sure how that would be viewed academically.
@K1 (3.13) –
Any joy yet?
I had bother getting it too, probably just very busy.
It’s not a long piece but definitely worth a look.
Some raving loonies think they are invisible. The threat to civil liberties is real .The police act more like farmers than police as if we are being herded.Vaccination blackmail anyone? Do you all remember the halcyon days when everyone on here questioned the news media instead of stampeding before them. Full Spectrum Domination. I watched the covid video linked earlier and it chimes with my suspicions. The end of the film meets my farmer analogy. Please stop buying the government line. Hook line and sinker. Something more precious than safety is at stake.Democratic rights and freedoms anybody? You may be able to tell I’m not best pleased.
@Pete 4:04pm
Even raving loonies and conspiracy theorists are likely to think twice before they take medical advice from anonymous twats.
Private Pete,
Deaths have already rocket with depression, poverty, drugs and alcohol.
I take it you means the last 10 Tory Unionist years will continue this trend
No matter what Bojo’s Lying Circus does next.
Patrick Roden @ 1:53
I heard this theory from an auld mate (re pensions) – no legs in once you crunch the numbers.
People are at home with their families being paid by the Government. Sunshine is a bonus. Make the most of it.
Cool beans all round.
Yip definitely sounds dodgy about Johnsons stay in hospital, cant access Trurepublica UK.
Can access Truerepublica twitter though, comments saying they also can’t acfess site or they’ve been kicked off site.
https://mobile.twitter.com/TruePublica/status/1249634166846734338?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet
Pete @ 4.04pm
The average annual flu figures are closer to your 5k mark, the 18k are more outliers (1999-2000 as an example).
There are a couple of comparisons to make.
The flu season stretches from October – March (27 weeks with spikes in deep winter months).
COVID19 has produced 10,000 deaths since the first death on 6th March (6 weeks).
The flu has not been known to cause death of key health workers treating patients.
19 healthcare workers in direct care of COVID19 patients have died so far.
These figures are with lockdown measures in place, how rampant would it be under no containment measures?
I’m not saying it’s the apocalpyse, but it’s not just a bad flu either.
I agree there are social and economic consequences of a lockdown. But if the NHS is not adequately resourced, (which it’s not)how else do you prevent it from becoming swamped with massive spikes in death rates?
National Records Scotland website has a public facing document that goes back two decades or so, it gives month by month death rates and by NHS Trust.
Dog biscuit
I’m sure they will use this “crisis” to hasten the demise of paper money, that and the introduction of 5G will sound the death knell on PAYG “dumb” phones, enabling them to track us all 24/7.
Reading earlier posts I’d say we must drive forward for Independence
As we can see how the incompetence of Westminster is killing some
Scots needlessly.
The Herald printing we must die as otherwise it might upset the corrupt lying
Fascists in Westminster that continues to use and abuse our sovereign nation.
Continuing to follow the ideas of those from another country who have no ideas
About minimising the Corona death rates is not an option..
Scozzie
Do you REALLY think the Tory Party is doing this to keep the pressure off the NHS?
The Tory Party…..
I’d say the solicitor has already stabbed Scotland in the back, by submitting to the demands of Brexit. That and the SNP’s approach to self-ID, suggests the SNP really don’t have a fucking clue about the law.
jfngw says:
13 April, 2020 at 3:05 pm
Reports of English companies only willing to supply PPE equipment to England. Do you imagine it woud be any different if it came to a food shortage, Scotland would be stripped of its food to supply England. We would be treated no differently to Ireland in the 19th century.
I just heard the clip. Fkg unbelievable.
Scotland not coming second best, but English Hospitals AND Carers given priority over Scottish Hospitals. What an absolute disgrace.
Anybody heard any reaction from Sturgeon? Are we sending more ventilators south too? Or are we sending our doctors and nurses South too to help England cope with COV19 and Brexit too?
One of the problems for me is you cannot trust a UK politician,
the Stats they produce or the specialist advisors they use as they
Can be bought.
I rest secure in the knowledge that is a Tory, The BBC, or
A UK newspaper said it then the truth will be something
Completely different.
It works well and has never left me disappointed.
Truerepublica article now back up. I think the Economist editor is on to something there.
https://truepublica.org.uk/united-kingdom/something-fishy-about-boris-johnsons-intensive-care-stay/
For those who can’t access the TruePublica piece, here’s the text –
Tories now fantasising about Coronavirus patients in Care homes saying that anyone who dies is assessed bv a Doctor to establish what is wrong with them …. but we know this isn’t happening in care homes.
Funny how, just as the journalist from Channel 4 asked the question, the link went all crackly and silent. She tried to ask it a second time and it went all crackly again…. hmm!
Government straining every sinew to deliver the necessary amount of PPE and again the link is faulty as the discussion with another journalist about the lack of PPE in some areas..
Bit of a pattern here or amI just cynical….
I’ve been away from this stuff for roughly three decades. I was never a proper scholar, but even I can rip the legal pish out of their approach to the law.
when his union canniving took its toll and boris hadnae dun his hamework, he would stand in front of his oxford tutor with a blank piece of paper, making it up, off the top of his head, as if reading his essay
– and think himself very clever for doing it; he has form
maybe he should start calling himself “boris the white”
an easter rising, of a kind
Generally speaking people come here to try to get a handle on the truth, or a realistic version of it and from my experience most contributors seem to be pretty level headed.
If you forget, just for a second, everything that has happened over the last 8 weeks (I know, that’s really hard) and then ask yourself this one question;
In what possible scenario would the Governments of the World tell their citizens to go home, spend time with their families and loved ones and be paid by their government?
Think about what Plan that solution would sit under and how it would be deployed.
If your answer is a Pandemic – fine, forget I asked.
Ian Brotherhood
Oh dear – the fantasists are out again!
Chris Lockwood of the Economist has apologised unreservedly for this load of bollocks.
You guys are real suckers.
Effijy at 16.57
Do you have a link to the data for these other rises in deaths that you say are happening?
Pete
As you’re a Tory, it is unlikely you respect the natural law. Would I be correct? Are you ideologically opposed to the principle of equality?
“Oh dear – the fantasists are out again!
Chris Lockwood of the Economist has apologised unreservedly for this load of bollocks.
You guys are real suckers.”
Well it didn’t take long for them to get to him, retract or lose your job I’d imagine.
Capella says: at 12:52 pm
“@ Dan 10.20 – the “West” will have a hard time trying to blame China for ghastly animal welfare practices.”
Aye, but with the 1995 H5N1 Avian Flu, the 20002-4 SARS, and now Covid19 they could always try the old Moorov Doctorine line…
close brushes with death often have a life changing effect; a radical restructuring of one’s views and purpose – you may even become a “better man”
– boris could always turn it around; at this time of year, the lost sheep, the prodigal son, the sinner repenteth, saul on the road to damascus …
but if boris turned into some mary poppins of a leader, practically perfect in every way, his attendant hyenas of the tory party, would tear him apart
– in war, generals, after a brief visit to the vicinity of the front line, would sometimes award themeselves “combat citations”; maybe something similar is going on
the economist is the house journal of the economic right; its writers occasionally get to be more candid about matters than is normal, since the rubes don’t read this stuff – but this looks like speaking out of turn
ahundrethidiot @ 5.14pm
I don’t think they’re trying to take the pressure off the NHS in a good governance way, I simply don’t think they have a choice. The world has gone for the flattening the curve approach, the UK was coming in for real criticism across the globe when talk started on a herd immunity strategy.
Italy, 2nd best healthcare system in the world – totally overwhelmed. The NHS couldn’t cope with a fraction of that if they’d gone full tonto.
So what’s their options: go into lockdown and have tens of thousands of deaths, or let rip and who knows how many deaths.
I saw the twitter videos of people collapsing in the streets of China and Iran (I’m sure UK government officials did too). That would not be a good look for ‘UK PLC we’re open for business after Brexit’. And certainly not a good look for Boris ‘I’ve spent years backstabbing my way into no.10 am not getting booted out over a bloody virus’ Johnson.
I don’t doubt for a minute at the end of all this, they’ll find a way to say the NHS is not fit for 21st century pandemics and so let’s all go on the private health insurance merry-go-round. So win-win for them – they still get to dismantle the NHS but not look like murderers in the process.
Once we have gotten over our fright I think pennies will start to drop .Question : why do governments in London and Edinburgh feel the need to equip themselves with comprehensive police powers in order to deal with a medical emergency? In 2016 a government excercise was carried out to assess the NHS ability to cope with a virus pandemic in which it was learned the health service could not cope with such a problem. No lessons learned on the health front but both governments gave themselves lots of time to draw up extensive police powers .That amount of legislation would have taken months to draw up I suspect and all ready to go in no time . Sadly the Lawer does know the Law that’s why she seeks to undermine it . This once proud Nation.
ahundredthidiot says:@5.34
“If your answer is a Pandemic…”
You don’t mean…surely not?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terran_Federation_(Blake%27s_7)
Confused
The Economist is a very left of centre publication.
No way can you brand it as ‘right wing’
It was founded by James Wilson, a Scottish liberal.
My summary for today
Deaths % of Deaths
N Ireland 124 1.09%
Scotland 575 5.08%
Wales 384 3.39%
England 10246 90.44%
Total 11329
BBC web site slightly light on hospital numbers but given Easter weekend understandable
I nearly fell off my chair when the BBC reported English providers were deprioritising Scottish Order!!! It will be one to watch and see if the BBC investigate!!
BBC not giving coverage to care home deaths not being included – again interesting but I heard it on Wings first – will they pursue??
Looking at the death rate:
The Wiki population for the UK is: 63.2 million
Percentage across the UK
Ireland 2.85%
Scotland 8.39%
Wales 3.39%
England 83.86%
It is reasonable the death rate should be representative, but it is not. In addition, Scotland now includes non-hospital cases.
In Scotland it is reasonable to think you will be half as likely to die as in England!!
The bbc continues to be an enemy of Scotland.
@ Pete at 6.06
So?
The Guardian was founded by CP Snow, who thought that “facts are sacred”.
If you can’t load the truepublica page, type
something-fishy-about-boris-johnson-intensive
into google, this appeared as the first item in my search. You can then select the cached version.
@pete
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWdd6_ZxX8c
There are three basic models of human judgement, psychology, logic, and phenomenology. Scottish political reason appears to be bound up in the psychology of British constitutional practice. I see little evidence of logic and zero respect for a phenomenological perspective.
Interesting wee piece on BBC Shortbread news tonight. Fred Olsen’s cruise line ships are currently laid-up in the Firth of Forth, and it reported although no passengers were on-board, there were several cases of Covid-19 among the on-board crew.
Fred Olsen Cruise Lines is Norwegian-owned, but the head office is in Ipswich. The ships are (from memory of being on an Olsen cruise) registered in Nassau, Bahamas.
So, why is a Norwegian-owned, English headquartered company laying-up Bahamian-registered ships in the Firth of Forth.
Not maybe as dangerous as having a Trident Fleet in the Clyde, but, still, toxic ships, located a long way from the owners English hq.
Useful stooges those Jocks.
Shug
Maybe you should take account of the fact that England has a much larger proportion of Black and Asian people and, as was reported, they make up a much larger %age of the deaths, then, as a consequence, England will have a greater percentage.
Your sums are way too simplistic.
They need a lot of refining.
The ultra unionist STV news playing politics against the Scottish government focusing in on care home deaths in Scotland, and letting some chap possibly a care home worker, without facts I might add, say that care home staff are tested more in England.
It was a brazen act of propaganda by the ultra unionist news programme.
Like I keep saying, the UK is about two weeks behind Europe with this Corona thing but I can tell you that less than 5 minutes ago, Macron announced live on TV that schools will resume on May 11th so like I said a couple of nights ago, you’re looking at June for the schools going back.
All this nonsense that people post on this blog about how governments can just print money or add a couple of zeroes on a keyboard are talking through holes in their hats.
The economies are simply fucked and countries can’t afford to extend the lockdown, so we, the people, are being led to the slaughter in an attempt to save ailing economies.
Wait ’til September though when people start dropping like flies. Then you’ll know all about it.
Scotland’s deserves better protection from the law, than the Scottish government are providing.
Scotland’s deserves better protection from the law, than the British state is prepared to allow.
Institutions, Principles and Judgement: The Relevance of the Natural Law Tradition for Articulating Business in a Global Context
https://proyectoscio.ucv.es/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/03-Ana_Marta_Gonzalez.pdf
@ahundrethidiot
you said: ” I heard this theory from an auld mate (re pensions) – no legs in once you crunch the numbers. “
Can you show me where you got the ‘number’ and how you or someone else ‘crunched’ them, please?
It would be good to know for certain.
Pete says
“Your sums are way too simplistic”
Same could be said of your logic.
Or are less than half of the population of England White and the disease three times more likely to kill a Black or Asian patient?
RE: Fred Olsen.
I fancy a cruise before I pop my clogs – but I will not entertain FO, after his treatment of the Timex workers in Dundee, in the 90s.
He shafted us. Period.
Anyone know of an ethical cruise operator?
Private Pete the Ultra Unionist-
The 2011 Census data shows that: the total population of England and Wales was 56.1 million. 48.2 million people (86.0%) were from White British stock.
Scotland had doubled the number of ethnic minority citizens in recent years as we were willing, like Great Germany to take in refugees who can thank Westminster for bombing their families, homes,
Work places, hospitals and schools.
The fake English hospital only Corona Death figures do not tell the true story but you can depend
In Scotland’s NHS performing better than England’s and produce more honest statistics.
@BDtt
How about a cruise on a sailing ship of some sort seeing as the big cruise ships burn shitonnes of fuel.
You dinnae want Greta Thunderberg oan yer case.
Bet she’s well chuffed in environmental terms with the serious reduction in fuels being burnt due to current situation. Come tae think of it, maybe it was her, in her bedroom, with a chemistry set, mixing potions…
Macron said that by May 11, France would be able to test anyone presenting COVID-19 symptoms. Schools and creches would progressively re-open, he said.
http://archive.is/38ja3
Dan
She does look like a crazy wee witch.
Ian Brotherhood
Confused
Take a look at the Guido Fawkes website where you will read all about Lockwood and that other great fantasist, Carole Codswallop.
Here’s the PR reason why those cruise ships are in the Forth.
http://archive.is/n5mbR
They forced their way in by pushing money in to my hand
If I may borrow an old Goons joke.
After Prince William says the coronavirus outbreak has again shown that Britain is “at its best when we’re in a crisis”…
The royals now double down on assholery with Princess Beatrice now planning a bigger wedding to “lift the nation’s spirits”.
Help, we’re drowning in a nauseating sludge of systemic and mediatic sentimentality.
Sentimentality, the favoured trope of people repression, of rational lockdown.
Hitler, Stalin, lovers of chocolate box schmaltz might well relate to this cloying, patronizing state propaganda.
Lasciate ogni speranza voi che entrate?
I know the news is concentrating on Coronavirus but….
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-52274242
How about this story for upping the ante?
Seems there is an out of control forest fire preaching Chernobyl – 3km away. It has been suggested that radiation levels have spiked but apparently that tweet was deleted.
Let’s keep our fingers crossed that they get some rain to put the fire out.!!!
Patrick Roden
The UK has around 12,700,000 pensioners with a state pension of around £7K
that would be approx £90 Billions per year. The UK Government announced a £350B relief package (last time I checked).
So, if COVID killed every last person of pensionable age (and of course, that’s ridiculous) it would still take 4 years to balance that particular book – and that is not accounting for new pensioners/interest.
COVID isnt going to kill every last pensioner – But as a measure, let’s say that business as usual death rates DOUBLE (The UK figure sits at around 600,000 deaths per year).
If it did (and that is by no means certain, of course) we can go with an additional 600,000 deaths (and we assume they are ALL pensioners, which they’re not) each with a ‘saving’ of 7k p/a. That equates to around £4.2 Billion.
£4.2B in the great scheme of things, is nothing. Not compared to this bail out.
Clearly, other monies can be linked in with any ‘savings’ due to deaths, but it just wouldn’t add up, so for me, old people should not worry about this theory.
@Col.Blimp IV
I reckon Greta is just needing an outlet for her energy.
I can envisage that if her parents had taken her go-karting at a young age she could have experienced the adrenaline and euphoria of motorsport which could have put her on a different life track.
Who knows what effect that might have had on her, she could even have been presenting TopGear by now! lol
Ran out of my winter stores of homemade jam this afternoon, just in time for the first rhubarb cut and making a batch of jam with it this evening. Looks like we have reached an appropriate setting point so off to jar it up…
Effigy
About 14% of the UK population is non-White, yet they represent 34% of the Coronavirus critically ill.
Very revealing stats.
Those living in Scotland need to decide if they are prepared to be denied access to constitutional justice.
Explain how Natural Law theory can be used to decide the right moral action
https://www.mytutor.co.uk/answers/20336/A-Level/Philosophy-and-Ethics/Explain-how-Natural-Law-theory-can-be-used-to-decide-the-right-moral-action/
Is that Pete being a racist?
the guardian says the virus is racist
– someone looked at it under an electoral telescope and saw a bunch of white power tattoos
Real data to ponder.
https://www.who.int/gard/publications/The_Global_Impact_of_Respiratory_Disease.pdf
I’m not hostile to the SNP or want to hurt the movement. It’s just I understand the most fundamental responsibility we have as humans. Protecting our health and the health of others. You can’t do that without fighting prejudice and discrimination. And you can do that without a bio-neurological appreciation of the law.
Acknowledgement, rather than appreciation.
That doesn’t make sense either. I’m not suggesting you can fight injustice if you’re not legally proficient. Proficiency in the law does help though.
Awareness of the bio-neurolical should guide policy design, as a principle. Ethical government is grounded in an acknowledgement of ethically legal principles. Brexitania, not so much.
Sorry….I’m not suggesting you can’t fight….
@ ahundredthidiot.
The UK spent nearly a thousand billion bailing out the banks( no you won’t find that in any newspaper), they haven’t recouped a penny of it. Just added to the bill handed to the taxpayer. Only it wasn’t. Because that’s not how these scams work. Most of the £300 billion will never reach small or medium size businesses, the banks will make sure of that, but the gov will still claim they made it available. Of course they will still have to sell of some assets and cut some services to pay for money that was never spent.
It looks like all our talk of bringing about the end of the British Empire has reached the ears of our fiends in the south.
They have made up a bucket – list, comprising all 22 of the nations that they have yet to invade.
Mongolia looks the most promising place to start, it is the biggest, the birthplace of Genghis Khan the renouned conqueror and home to the Black Death a distant ancestor of our current tormentor.
https://www.indy100.com/article/uk-country-invasion-map-empire-9462766
Perhaps the ‘success’ of this virus in being so swiftly transmitted, is due to anecdotal evidence from some quarters that a large proportion of those who test positive for Covid 19 appear to be asymptomatic.
If this is the case then it would seem unwise to lift lockdown measures too soon without mass testing. When anyone tests positive for Covid 19 then they should be quarantined whether or not they show symptoms. Otherwise testing becomes pointless.
To release people into the community just because they seem well will simply cause spread. It might already have been responsible for such rapid spread to have simply relied on those who felt ill to self-isolate, while allowing those who seemed well to go about as normal, carrying the virus into the community.
The small commune of Vo Eugenio in the Veneto discovered this some time ago, carried out mass testing of their community and isolated all of those testing positive whether or not they displayed symptoms of the illness.
However, it would have required preparation and organization to initiate mass testing of that kind. Now, it appears, we have those who are willing to fall back on the idea of ‘herd immunity’ again. Brutal social darwinism again. This looks like another abdication of responsibility. It looks also as if too many people are willing to let the government off the hook yet again.
I really liked Space Invaders.
Asteroids – not so much.
Pong to Galaxians was the extent of my interest in computer games.
john jones this question was answered some time ago on RTL station: on dry paper the virus can live intact for about 3 hours.After that it deteriorates.It deteriorates even more quickly in sunlight and the doc advised to put the mail on the windowsill for the day.
It takes a certain quantity of virus to be infectious. (viral load theory).No panic.You can always wash your hands…of boris letters.
BBC reporting at 10pm News 1000 care homes in England have reported a corona virus outbreak.
and
ITV
Paul Brand
@PaulBrandITV 4hrs ago.
There are over 11,000 care homes in the UK.
This means ‘around’ 1,500 have had an outbreak.
Occasionally played Chuckie Egg on a Commodore64 but was generally too busy kickin’ a baw aboot, fishing, or BMXing. Proper real world shiz, never got my heid round why so many folk spend so much time on computer games.
Scott Finlayson
According to the AIMSIB this virus has already got 3 variants on top of the original one.3 genomes.
For those who wonder AIMSIB is a collective of doctors and researchers from France.
They are independant of labs and politicians.
Private Pete the Ultra Unionist.
Scotland has ethic groups too but add in all the non hospital Corona deaths
Your Tory masters are hiding and their figures are horrific.
Great Germany has taken in over 1 million ethnic minorities that
Westminster helped to make refugees.
Why then are you 3-4 tines more likely to die with this virus in England?
It’s not a question it’s because of the lies that have destroyed democracy in the UK.
It’s because of greed, of fascism, it’s because of Westminster incompetence.
Hope they are paying you double time fir the crap you pitch on a Bank Holiday
Pete
Minorities usually poorer and getting crammed on tubes and buses.
Overcrowded accommodation and workplaces (staff rooms)
More likely to live in cties in polluted areas,pollution a big factor re ability to fight the virus according to Pf De L’orgeril.
golnut vit D is in milk and butter and cod liver oil not meat.
You are maybe confusing with vit B12 and iron?
Vit D supplementation drive not fully justified,not enough known about vitD which also act as a hormone.
Health now tainted by big business everywhere,in any case vitD better taken in through sunshine.
The current British constitution can not be considered anything other than a piece of pseudo-science. As such, contemporary British constitutionalism supports eugenics, or government through FORCE.
https://www.philosophyforlife.org/blog/brexit-and-the-global-genetic-arms-race
Ian Brotherhood: Michel de l’Orgeril has published a series of booklets on various vaccines.He is a cardiologist/epidemiologist and started out with no views on vaccination in general except he noticed a lot of dubious studies and claims connected to some vaccines.
On his blog he cites a Chinese study linking the flu vaccine and corona deaths:for obscure reasons still unexplained, people who had the flu jab are more likely to die of sars (in China)
He also pointed out once that a pharma company producing a vaccine can get away with less strict testing and precautions before getting an approval from the authorities .And everybody must be vaccinated…
mike cassidy Prof De L’Orgeril recommends the outdoors too: not as a cure, as prevention measure.Fresh air means healthy lungs.Obv not too cold air.
meg merrilee i was about to mention it too!Gigantic fires completely blacked out in UK!
For more unbiased info go to the site of the CRIIRAD
She explains:
Virus mutation occurs primarily in the regions that “… encode (the) structural proteins… that form the body of the virus… (and) attack the cell“. They found nothing unusual through the bulk of the genome, BUT “… what sets it apart is the regulatory region… the ‘control room’ of the virus… which is the region where replication of the virus is triggered“. “In this virus it looks like someone entered the control room… as if someone entered, opened the closets and threw everything out of them, flipped chairs – and if it were a natural variant one could hardly imagine that such extensive mutations, insertions, deletions, various single-nucleotide mutations could happen accidentally and that the virus wouldn’t die during this process, because the virus doesn’t let anything touch this control room.” She goes on to say that while mutating structural proteins are quite acceptable as they have no impact on the virus’ survival, the genome’s regulatory region, the control room, must remain free of mutation. As any mutation could kill it, they happen rarely, incrementally and only to the virus’ advantage. With a scientist’s typical understatement, she concludes that what happened in the SAR-2’s control room is “atypical”. When the interviewer asks in closing whether even more dangerous viruses are being created in secret labs, she replies “I don’t even want to imagine that, but it’s certainly possible.“.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmL7okhbVzU&feature=youtu.be
Bojo says the two nurses looking after him were real heroes. They could have been even bigger heroes if one of them had just grabbed a pillow and….well…you know. 😉
Don’t fall foul of social distancing laws in Bahrain. Apparently the fines are in the region of 30 grand according to a friend who knows someone living there.
You probably think I’m mad, but I’m not making this stuff up. The ethos of social Darwinism is strong in English Torydum. We need to look to international human rights law if we hope to find an escape route.
Post Darwin: social Darwinism, degeneration, eugenics
https://www.bl.uk/romantics-and-victorians/articles/post-darwin-social-darwinism-degeneration-eugenics
Or just vote for indy at the next election. 😉
Go on. Or do you want Scotland’s potential to be Scotland, to be defined by English Torydum, which lacks a regard for your ‘psychological personal property’.
That’s eugenics, that is.
The psychology of stuff and things
Christian Jarrett on our lifelong relationship with objects
https://thepsychologist.bps.org.uk/volume-26/edition-8/psychology-stuff-and-things
Interesting that the BBC are reporting that around 1,000 care homes have had outbreaks of the virus.
Now as we all know the UK Government does not report virus deaths other than those in hospital. So why is the BBC now running this piece.
Well one reason is that the UK is going to have to change its position to admit that the COVID 19 deaths are at least double the 11,500 currently reported and that the numbers are going up exponetionally.
Consider therefore three care homes in and around Glas where over recent weeks each has lost between five and eleven resident. At a median of 8 deaths per home applied to 11,000 care homes across the U.K. you get a horrendous number. But not all care home will have had outbreaks so that figure at the moment is too high.
But what if ten percent of care homes had an out break, that around 1,100 homes and what if they each had 8 deaths. That’s 9,000 on the current U.K. figures and it doesn’t include people who’ve died at home.
And yes, I think the true death figure is much much higher and rising than has been reported and that is why the BBC may now be preparing the country for the grim reality.
The cost of the decisions made by Boris Johnson and his right wing elite backers to let the virus spread to protect the economy is being exposed as the biggest disaster this country has ever made. ( – and I include Scotland in that!)
The UK will be absolutely economically broken by this mismanaged crisis. Austerity and economic destruction post the financial crisis of 2008 was a walk in the park compared to this. Britannia with no friends, is finally sinking below the waves and taking us with it.
@ a hundredthidiot
“If it did (and that is by no means certain, of course) we can go with an additional 600,000 deaths (and we assume they are ALL pensioners, which they’re not) each with a ‘saving’ of 7k p/a. That equates to around £4.2 Billion.”
£4.2 Billion per year! and that’s growing!
It is a well-established fact that the ‘pension burden’ is a growing problem in every western country, so as I have mentioned in a previous thread, I wouldn’t suggest that the UK government wanted this virus.
However, they haven’t half created the perfect kill zones for pensioners if it is true that they are sending covid19 positive patients, to old folks homes to convalesce.
Patrick Roden @5:53
No one is sending COVID positive patients to care homes to convalesce, please stop this, it scares people.
A more sensible approach from GPs (and even pretendy doctors working for Scottish Ambulance) is needed because they need to STOP just assuming a death in the Community/Care Homes MAY BE down to COVID without any sort of test, just because nurse wendy sneezed last week when putting pepper on her lunch.
There is a rumour going the rounds that a lot of flashers are catching covid .Hmm. Very revealing.
Darwin?Read sound criticism of Darwin in Earth in Upheaval,E.Velikovskiy.