Crossing the floor
Until relatively recently I was very firmly of the mind that Scotland shouldn’t be independent. Born in England to English parents but growing up in Scotland since I was a baby, I was English to the Scottish and Scottish to the English. I’ve always considered myself British and still do. Not in a nationalistic way, just a matter of fact.
In 2008 while in my second year at university I started an anti-independence Facebook group as a misguided joke, calling it ‘I Hate Alex Salmond’. I actually didn’t hate Alex Salmond, I’ve actually always thought he was a good politician, I just didn’t agree with some of what he stood for (and of course, one thing in particular).
So following a bit of negative press and some pressure from the university, I decided to change the name of the group to ‘No to Scottish Independence’. And then, gradually, some other things started to change too.
Over the years, membership very slowly grew, until 2014 when the debate picked up and membership grew rapidly to the point where we now have 7000 members. As admin I had no bias on membership and allowed anyone to join regardless of political stance. As long as they were respectful, they were welcome. This basic rule became very difficult to manage, with members from both sides being guilty of transgressions.
Gradually the membership tilted to a fairly strong Yes bias and I decided it might be less misleading and more representative if the name was changed to ‘Debate on Independence’ or similar. Sadly, Facebook rules prevent a name change with a group of its size, leading to many entertaining conspiracy theories about the group’s intentions, because over the same period of time my own views had changed to Yes.
Most conspiracists went along the lines that I created the page to deliberately ‘trick’ No voters into debate or something. There are even the conspiracists that suggest I’m still a No voter and somehow conspiring to attract ‘Yes’ voters to be ‘tricked’ into saying something stupid.
As to why I changed my mind, which I suspect is what people want to hear; it has more to do with the “Better Together” campaign than the Yes campaign. I’d always thought the idea of independence was ridiculous. Scotland is small and couldn’t possibly afford to go it alone, right? The whole thing was just a silly romantic notion held by those who hadn’t thought it through.
But when I decided to check the facts, it turns out Scotland is perfectly healthy economically. Even without the oil Scotland would do just fine. And once this keystone myth fell apart, I began to question it all, to think about what could be gained and what could be lost (like Trident). The more scare stories I saw and the more desperate ‘Better Together’ became, the more resolute I became in voting Yes.
I still consider myself British, and I’m not saying that’s for everyone. I’m also proud to be Scottish, but it’s a personal identity and doesn’t factor in how I’ll vote. I’ve since handed control of the group over to some friends who I trust and who are doing a great job. The endless evenings trying to moderate the page became very tiring. Every night was spent sifting through hateful comments and abuse, and deleting fake accounts, and questionable characters (including those from the National Front). I’d much rather try to convince people more directly.
We’re approaching one of the most important political decisions in Scotland’s history and whatever way people vote; I want them to have taken the opportunity to look at the facts. Over those six years I learned that those who are ‘No’ or undecided are often simply unengaged in the debate. They’re not our enemies and I hope I stand as an example that many of them can still be convinced.
I’m David Barratt. I’m British, and I’m voting Yes.
Fantastic! Thanks for that David.
Fantastic David, glad to have you on our side of the debate.
Better Together’s negativity scunners No voter to the Yes cause, love it!
We’ve got ‘English Scots for YES’. Seems there might be a need for a ‘British Scots for YES’ too.
Always enjoyed the debate on FB there, many thanks to the admins and contributers … keep up the good work !
#Gamechanger
You dont need eyes to see you need vision.
Bravo that man!
Very very cool, I hope we have more articles from you.
Ohh.. you’ve come over to the “Dark Side”
As a microcosm of the entire debate, the shifting of your Facebook group’s intentions may be quite prescient!
Welcome aboard David.
I’m British too – half English and honourary Scouser due to spending so much time there.
For a long time I struggled with admitting to being pro-independence (I probably always was but if devo-max had been on the ballot paper I doubt I’d be saying that). And that’s largely due to “Britishness” and close links down south. I’d class myself Scottish and British. If pushed I’d say “a bit more…”
The No campaign has done a very good job in pushing me not only to yes but into being an active yes campaigner, and into a far more radical form of Yes supporter than I really want to be (ie no currency union etc). I find that sad, but it’s the way it is.
As a regular observer and sometimes contributor to the Facebook page in question it has always surprised me how many people simply do not read the pinned post at the top explaining the situation. I think it is actually one of the most vibrant and interesting bits of Facebook though because it attracts naysayers and then forces them to think about stuff in a way that is clearly unusual and often difficult for them.
I am British, and I am also voting YES.
Oh, the last bit of that sentence didn’t post, probably because it was in html tags.
If pushed I’d say “a bit more…[insert whatever the person pushing didn’t want me to say]”
Hi David, I can’t thank you enough for this. I’ll be sharing you article on Facebook which is where I do the majority of my debating via my personal page. So nice to have it in black and white that people can go from one extreme to the other and all it takes is opening your mind. I respect everyone’s right to vote the way they choose. I just want that to be an informed choice. This article will inspire people to get informed. Thanks again H 🙂
That page certainly used to contain some of the biggest unionist wingnuts I’ve ever seen; some of them are still there, screaming inane comments into the uncaring wind. You can spot them, even the intelligent ones manage to be able to ignore presented facts because they know better.
True, the overwhelming impression I get from the page now when anyone I know comments on it (I don’t bother with it myself, my newsfeed is already clogged up like you wouldn’t believe) is that in spite of the name the membership is mostly Yes, and I wondered if that was some sort of covert takeover as has happened to pages on both sides of the debate. Very, very interesting to hear that no, it never actively blocked Yes activists, unlike official No pages who hit block for no good reason, and the balance has simply asserted itself over time.
Also interesting to hear of your personal journey from No to Yes; I firmly believe, as in your case, that examination of unbiased facts and data about Scottish potential and economic projections will inevitably lead anyone with an open mind to vote Yes.
O/T… work colleague of mine is going to be at Bannockburn tomorrow with a stall selling her own Jubbly Jock creations including items for Yes and No. Just look for the wee, pretty, very pregnant looking lass who answers to Lorna. Her stuff is pretty good and it will be worth a look.
Now that was an interesting article!
On the British theme I’ll quote Churchill:
To look is one thing.
To see is another.
To act upon what you see is all that matters.
Great article, Ive always said that a No voter is someone who either hasn’t read the facts or doesn’t want to, I still have a few friends in the latter category but I’m confident they will see the light in the next few months.
Part of the problem is the total censorship from the No side of UKIP or anybody against EU membership by the BBC
Does not say much for British democracy, but, bearing in mind how enthusiastic the separatists are for the BBC continuing to censor, even less for the democratic instincts of the Scottish ruling class.
Seems there might be a need for a ‘British Scots for YES’
Yes, there are a lot of us out there who haven’t really given identity much thought and are just naturally both Scottish and British without bothering about it – more British when in Liverpool dancing to 60s Mod music; more Scottish when playing fiddle in a Scottish session.
My support for independence was primarily to do with seeing up close how desperately we need welfare, and that it really needs to be linked with health – having health and welfare split between two governments is daft.
But once you’ve come to it, the idea that Scotland is a country, so should run itself is just so blindingly obvious it’s staggering we haven’t been doing so for 300+ years.
That said, though some of us are having our eyes opened massively, it’s hard not to retain that element of your identity, even if you didn’t think much about it. So although I’m a definite Yes, I find phrases like Butcher’s Apron quite offensive, because to me the Union Jack just means the Who and Mod music. There will be others, especially older people who have a far greater British identity than me, and for whom it represents Queen and country, and WWI memories etc. That should be respected as well.
Welcome David, as someone else said to the Dark (right) side.
As ive said before, im scottish, but im british too, geographically, it is now and will remain The British Isles, as i believe the costs of digging a trench are prohibitive 🙂
Do any of you know if Rev is likely to make another Sensible Soccer? I can’t get an answer out of him. I’ve given up asking!!
I would add, that out of all the reasons I’ve heard for voting Yes, the majority have come containing the words ‘Better Together.’
Yes Scotland volunteers and activists try to go out with verifiable facts and figures, a smile and a laugh. This is a good approach.
Better Together use indefinites, half truth and outright lies. I can’t comment on the smile and laugh as I’ve never seen a BT activist in the flesh. But most people seem to know when they are being lied to, and this sends undecided folk (and, apparently, No voters) to seek out other information. And that’s when the process to Yes really starts.
So while we all get irritated by Better Together, their tactics of uncertainty questions and attempts to shut down debate on social media on their pages, just remember; we would be less effective without them.
Every story needs an enemy to fight; the more deranged the better. Better Together frequently seem to howl at the moon, other times they seem to be wired to it, so they’ll do just fine.
I vote Yes not because of where I was born but because I want my country to be as democratic and progressive as Norway and Finland and Iceland and Sweden and France and Ireland and Germany and The Netherlands and every other country in the world that somehow manages to run it’s own affairs without being plagued by a spendthrift freakshow called The House of Commons and the House of Lords teamGB.
Then, proud Scot might actually mean something.
Och Neil, you are writing rubbish, the BBC are your guardian and your benefactor.
Ukip can do no wrong, we just don’t want to hear the record, pop over somewhere else please.
Hi folks,
I’m not trying to hijack this thread so apologies in advance if anyone is offended. But – any chance some of you kind people could repost this link on your Facebook or Twitter accounts to try and raise a wee bit of cash for the Yes Stirling campaign office?
http://igg.me/at/Yes-Stirling-Office/x
We’re still a wee bit short and your extraordinary generosity will make a difference as it has in the past for so many other similar worthy causes on this site.
Welcome to Yes.
I know, I know, ignore the troll….
“Part of the problem is the total censorship from the No side of UKIP or anybody against EU membership by the BBC.”
But this is just too funny to ignore.
The BBC puts Nigel Farage on Question Time more often that ANY other party leader in the UK. They were all over the news for weeks running up to the English council elections and EU Parliamentary elections.
If that’s what you think of as being ignored I would just love for BBC Scotland to ignore the independence debate to the same degree.
Good article. I think that must be the journey a lot of voters are taking. Because the MSM has never reported events in Scotland like it should (Gandhi’s ‘ignore’), a lot of people just haven’t opened their eyes. It does highlight that the long campaign has been a good tactic.
“… those who are ‘No’ or undecided are often simply unengaged in the debate” …. very true, I’m certain.
Thanks for the article David and welcome.
Its a hard road for many who have changed their minds throughout this campaign and it takes courage. They have to challenge themselves as well as the accepted narrative they grew up with. As you say though, once you discover that first falsehood, you are led on to see how many others you might find.
Very well said.
Enlightenment is a wonderful thing – better called, thinking for oneself.
Many thanks, David, for your openness.
Dick, never mind sensible soccer, you’d best go and fix your damp patch before passers-by start to point and snigger…
@R whittington
Oh bless you, that made me physically laugh out loud
Its the mental picture of Stu ranting at his screen when reading another wee Sensible Soccer post that gets me every time!
Welcome to the ‘Bright side of life’ David
O/T
http://www.yesscotland.net/news/major-boost-unison-representatives-sign-declaration-support-independence
Did you ever play it Alan Mackintosh?
Welcome David
I think after independence the concept of the British Isles will remain. Ireland still plays in the British Lions and in some ways I think our island neighbourliness will strengthen as a bigger family of countries, not weaken.
@Neil Craig
I am a reasonably well educated man. I have post graduate qualifications and a Masters. I have worked in a number of blue-chip organisations, right up to executive level.
As far as I know all my mental faculties are in good order…. and my reading comprehension and IQ are adequate.
But for the life of me I don’t have a scooby doo about what the f*&^ you’re talking about in your post?
Did I mention I was a psychologist and change consultant?
Interesting wee article there David. It’s always nice to read, I think, what drives people to change from NO to YES or even from YES to NO, not that I’ve heard of anyone going that way. 😛
Looking forward to your input in future David.
MajorBloodnok says:
We’ve got ‘English Scots for YES’. Seems there might be a need for a ‘British Scots for YES’ too.
Funnily enough Major when I saw the brief, extremely brief, piece on (dis)Reporting Scotland last night about English Scots for YES I also heard mention of another wee group starting up soon called French Scots for YES. Apparently they are launching outside Holyrood on July 14th. I can’t for the life of me think of any reason why they would want to launch on July 14th mind you. 😉 😛
If we had a British Scots for YES press launch Major perhaps they could share July 14th? 🙂
Well, that is a bit of a journey David. More a quest!
I personally have more respect for the people who come out and say they are British and are voting no. Plain and simple.
My issue is more with the “proud Scots” who immerse themselves in the semantics of never ending political and financial analysis. They treat the concept of an independent Scotland as something quite outlandish despite its wealth, capabilities and history.
These people fall into groups of (1) The ill-informed who are open to debate (2) the informed who know exactly what they are doing, and (3) time wasters who will ask questions add infinitum – they want 100% risk free assurances that never exist in the real world.
Scottish first and always
British as long as we remain part of the British Isles
And European until the tectonic plates shift this particular geography.
And even if there is a NO vote and Westminster takes us out the EU…. there is no political mechanism to take my EU citizenship and passport away.
The desire to live in a fairer, more equal country is stronger than a sense of national identity, most of the time.
To me nationality is irrelevant in the debate. On independence day we will all become Scottish citizens together for the first time ever, wherever you’re from, Scots born people included. Background won’t matter, if you live here on Day One you’re in.
“or anybody against EU membership by the BBC”
Dearie me, what planet are you on?
“The BBC has received 1,190 complaints accusing it of either having given too much coverage to Ukip, or being biased in favour of Nigel Farage’s party.
It is thought to be the most complaints the BBC has ever received about its coverage of a party during an election.”
“Ukip party members have enjoyed frequent appearances on Question Time.In total, Farage has appeared at least 16 times since 2009, which is more than the entire Green party, which has appeared 11 times over the same period.”
http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/may/30/bbc-complaints-ukip-election-coverage-bias
Just because people in Scotland do not want to be goverened by Westminster does not mean that we are not longer entiteled to be recognised as “British”. Westminster does not have exculsive rights on the British identity.
Even if they threaten to label us all as “foreigners”.
Welcome! Great article. I hope my NO friends eventually make that same journey to YES!
I converted from NO to YES for similar reasons, once you realise we’re not scroungers you can’t go back,EVER.
Very good article David though Britishness and being British wont disappear after independence. Britian is an island. We just have to change our mindset though. Think Scandinavian, Asian, South American. Unless the thought is that British is only England?
I think it’s great reading all these articles written by folks other than Stu. It’s not that I don’t like reading Stu’s stuff I do but I just think it gives him a wee bit time off to go play with his friends over on Twitter. 😉
I always wonder though…why does nothing with my name ever get put up…Oh that’s right I remember now… I haven’t written anything…DOH! 😛
O/T I need to know by close of business Sunday at the latest if anyone who might be attending the Wings night out in Edinburgh next Friday 4th July at the Newsroom in Edinburgh would like to take a bus from the Dundee and Angus area.
One was successfully organised for Glasgow earlier this month and it would be great to do the same again.
The overall cost would be around £500, it a 38 seater bus (with toilet) and I was hoping for at least 30 paying £15 return, so far only around a dozen folk. This is understandable as for most it would be easier to get the train except for those living outwith towns with a train station. Forfar, Brechin, Montrose, Kirriemuir etc.
I will arrange pick-ups in all these locations if people want a seat and post the details once I have enough bums on seats.
If there are any other takers please let me know over in Off Topic at http://wingsoverscotland.com/off-topic/
Great article, I will send to a couple of English pals.
@Lesley-Anne
Steady, we’re saving our best till last. Wait till you see the whites of their eyes. 😀
Macart says:
@Lesley-Anne
Steady, we’re saving our best till last. Wait till you see the whites of their eyes. 😀
Aha, that explains why nothing from me ever appears. I knew I was good but boy never in my wildest dreams did I ever dream to think I was that good! Thanks for that Macart. 😛
@Thepnr
Would love to go to Edinburgh, however myself, Brian and Mealer (the 3 drunks at the back of the bus)are either on holiday or have other committments.
We will be up for the next trip on the freedom bus!!
@Lesley-Anne maybe Stu is making another Sensible Soccer!!!!!
@Lesley-Anne
D&G keeping its powder dry. 😀
R whittington says:
@Lesley-Anne maybe Stu is making another Sensible Soccer!!!!!
Sorry RW that doesn’t compute. Putting the words sensible and soccer together in the same sentence just does not compute! 😛
Exhibit 1…Luis Suarez 😉
Haggis Hunter: Great article, I will send to a couple of English pals
Good idea. In fact, good enough to send to local Nos.
If a hard line English over-my-dead-body No can change to Yes it holds example for those here who are waverers.
Welcome. I’ve never campaigned (obviously) for the No side, but Yes seems to be a happier place to be. The few No voters I’ve met, just repeat what they’ve seen on the BBC, which is the same old clichés coming from the Westminster naysayers. There’s no thought or research behind it. If it’s on the BBC and in the MSM, then it must be right – no question! I welcome the STV debate with AS & AD. This can’t be censored, or interfered with in any way. I think this just might be a turning-point!
Hi David,thank you for sharing your journey. Posts like this make me realise we are way past the tipping point and on course for a landslide victory????????
The “British” issue is quite simple for me. You can be Swedish and Scandanavian.
An Estonian from the Baltics.
Peruvian and South American.
OR
New Zealand and antipodean.
Scottish and British is OK with me in that context.
A geographic region does not mean you want your neighbour to run your country.
Macart says:
@Lesley-Anne
D&G keeping its powder dry. 😀
Absolutely Macart. We don’t want to do a Better Together and run out of the explosive stuff too early you know.
There’s still a long way to go and a short time to get there. 😛
http://tinyurl.com/clhn2pj
Sorry Stu I couldn’t resist it, honest. 😉
Well at least 63% YES
By the way I am Pictish and voting YES
@Lesley-Anne
We want to give BT a fair chance, we don’t want to give them a mauling. I think we should consider ourselves reinforcements in the SW. 😀
Macart says:
@Lesley-Anne
We want to give BT a fair chance, we don’t want to give them a mauling. I think we should consider ourselves reinforcements in the SW. 😀
Well to be fair Macart, all the reports I read on a daily basis from the meetings/debates all over Scotland show YES vote in the 65%+ region so I think they have given up on winning, at least in Scotland from the Central belt North. 😉
I think Better Together are working on the totally skewered theory that if they win in the S.W. then they will have won the referendum. Boy are they in for a surprise! 😛
Good article.
On another matter the Herald is not accepting posts on the story about man who threatened Alex Salmond.
I wonder why.
I’ve been Scottish and British since the day I was born and I’ll still be Scottish and British when we’re independent.
Much like a person from Portugal who is Portuguese, Iberian and European or a Swede who is Swedish, Scandinavian and European.
Westminster cannot stop us being British.
I’ll be Scottish, British and European until the day I die the only difference is that Scotland will be independent and not ruled from Westminster.
Perhap’s the Herald is feart that the truth might come out the the man in question is a UNIONIST…shock… horror! 😛
David Barrat
Y’re a wee gem.
Now lets get digging and unearth some more.
I’m English, in fact I only moved up here last year, so I’m as far from being more Scots than the Scots as it is possible to be.
I will vote yes in September, and I would stick up a poster in my window if someone can be bothered to give me one, but other than that I am happy to watch it all on TV. I do blog about the debate from time to time, but it is not top of my blogging agenda.
My attitude is that if the Tories, the CBI and the Orange Lodges are on one side, then I will take the other. It looks to me as if England will become more Tory as the years go by, so a Scotland that can fend off their vileness is the place to be for folk like me. The best way to ensure that their vileness never troubles us again is to vote yes.
Part of the problem is the total censorship from the No side of UKIP
Totally; I’ve not seen nor heard about David Coburn since just after the EU election.
UKIP boost Yes big style (as per recent panelbase poll where +17% leaning more to Yes due to UKIP supporting the union, with this giving Yes a majority) so you can understand why the No camp are trying to keep a lid on them. It’s very undemocratic.
Good article David, I’m pleased that after checking the facts you’ve decided to change you perspective and vote yes, as you say not everyone likes Mr Salmond, but as you know now independence isn’t about Mr Salmond, more and more people are turning to yes, after finding out the facts.
News this good should be read and digested frequently particularly if your confidence in a Yes vote is shaky.
Should also help with difficulty crossing over an oil rich Yes.
http://www.hurricaneenergy.com/Communications/NewsPressReleases/2014-06-26/Flow-test-success-at-Lancaster/
Flow test success at Lancaster
26 June 2014
Hurricane is pleased to announce that it has successfully completed the testing phase of its key horizontal appraisal well in the Lancaster fractured basement oil discovery West of Shetland. The well will be suspended as a future producer.
Production tests achieved a sustainable oil flow rate using an Electrical Submersible Pump (ESP) of 9,800 stock tank barrels of oil per day (STB/d), the established oil flow rate being constrained by the capacity of the surface test equipment. The Lancaster Field, which is 100 percent owned by Hurricane, has estimated 2C Contingent Resources of 207 million barrels of oil equivalent (MMboe).
The testing programme was designed to establish whether commercial hydrocarbon flow rates could be delivered from a 1km horizontal well drilled through faulted and fractured basement rock (granite) under both natural flow and artificial lift conditions. Artificial lift was achieved through the installation of the down-hole ESP, the inclusion of which was to investigate potential flow rates that could be expected under production conditions.
The headline test results are:
Natural flow – maximum sustainable flow rate of 5,300 STB/d
Artificial lift (using an ESP) – maximum sustainable flow of 9,800 STB/d (the established oil rate being constrained by surface test equipment)
Produced water – 340 barrels of drilling brine were produced during the test of which 20 barrels were recovered during natural flow
Oil type – 38° API
The Company anticipates making a further announcement following completion of operations and the rig moving off location.
Dr Robert Trice, CEO of Hurricane, commented from the Sedco 712 drilling rig: “I am delighted to report the successful completion of our testing operations which have achieved hydrocarbon flow rates in the upper range of our pre-drill estimates. The maximum sustainable flow rate of 9,800 STB/d is particularly impressive as it was achieved despite being constrained by surface equipment. Whilst the artificial lift rates are important, the fact that the well also flowed oil at 5,300 STB/d unaided (natural flow) is a clear demonstration that Hurricane’s plans for progressing to a Lancaster field development are technically viable.
I consider this year’s operational result to be major step in further de-risking the Company’s 2C Contingent (444-470MMboe) and P50 Prospective (432-442MMboe) resources and very important as we seek to enhance shareholder value.
This successful outcome reinforces the potential importance of basement resources as a strategic resource for the UK.“
O/T.
Oil explorer, Hurricane Energy, say they’ve found over 200 million barrels of oil, in the Lancaster field between Scotland, and the Fare Isles.
What was it Better Together said about oil? ah yes “It would run out by 2017”.
Calcagus I’ll settle for +1 and a square go on Glasgow Green to settle it.
@Lesley-Anne
You’re not kidding.
Looking forward to both Alan Bisset and Jim Sillars visits to Stranraer this summer. That should set the Rhins and the Machars alight. 😀
i cant believe my mum 83 and english is an s.n.p voter who is almost rabid about scotland gaining independence after a lifetime voting labour. anyhoo, im scot not brit and so are ma dugs.
macart763m says:
@Lesley-Anne
You’re not kidding.
Looking forward to both Alan Bisset and Jim Sillars visits to Stranraer this summer. That should set the Rhins and the Machars alight. 😀
I haven’t heard Alan Bisset but we did have Jim Sillars down in Annan a wee while ago and he wooed the audience. That nice Mr Brown the Labour M.P. was in the audience and asked a question. Let’s just say that by the time Jim was finished with him his face was more RED than his bright RED sweater. 😛
I honestly think that many more Scots will have no problem also considering themselves as British after a YES vote.
As it will no longer be partly associated with the unequal political union of the UK.
It will be about friendships, culture and business..
A new improved Britain, made up of secure sovereign nations working together.
Far better than mere devolution.
Andy-B
Must admit its not independence most folk are against when you question them.It’s their dislike of Alex/SNP.
They believe the crap in the papers and tv and base their opinion on that.I’ve found the best way to open their minds is to wrongfoot them.Take the argument in a seemingly tangential direction before bringing it back with the suckerpunch.An old sales technique I know but it works.Once you’ve got them saying yes to your points it’s easy to guide them in the right direction.
Maybe we need a doubleglazing/car/insurance salespeople for YES group?
Then again…
“Take the argument in a seemingly tangential direction before bringing it back with the suckerpunch.”
thats going to have to be explained to me.
Kudos to you, David
Thanks David.
@Lesley-Anne
I’ve noticed Jim has that effect on your average politician.
And Mr Brown is an average politician. 😉
go yerself Davy boy ,i hope more no people read your great article and wake up to the facts ,this is not about just Scotland its about the whole political system of this wee island we all call home ,something must be done about it ,it would please me a whole lot if the people of England would wake up and go hold on a minute the Scots are right this union thing totally sucks and our politicians are a shower of self serving troughers ,hopefully our independence will drive this and i for one look forward in hope to the day we can all work together as sovereign nations for what is best for the people of this wee island called Britain, because its not just the people in Scotland that are being lied to by the political elite infesting westminster,and who knows maybe one day all us Scots will be proud to call ourselves British once more but we arnt going to wait about any more in the hope of change,we have done that long enough.
macart763m says:
@Lesley-Anne
I’ve noticed Jim has that effect on your average politician.
And Mr Brown is an average politician. 😉
I see you give Brown MORE kudos for being an average politician than I ever would then Macart. 😛
Ok.. So it would seem that the problem is with the DPC and the render. In which case my plan is as followed: hack off the render to a line approximately one foot above the DPC, attatch a galvanised render stop bead to approximately 1″ above the DPC. Re-render with first a coat of 5:1 building sand and cement then a top layer of 4:1 with plastering sand and plasticiser. Any helpful views and advice on this before i go and get everything from b&q would be gratefully recieved. Whilst I’m there I might get some cowls for my neighbour anyway.
OT. I was driving about just north of the border last night, looking for nice places to move to next year. Near Quintinshill, I was cheered to see a rural bungalow festooned with Yes displays and saltires. Outside stood a wee silver car with a Yes badge on the rear window. If there was anyone outside I’d have given a toot and a wave, but it made me happy to know there is at last visible support in the area, beyond my driving around flying the flag. 🙂
@Goldenayr.
It true of course for some people they can’t quite seem to separate their dislike of Alex Salmond with independence, as you rightly say, the press and media push independence as Alex Salmond and the SNP. A plus for yes though is once people learn the facts and truth of the benefits of independence, they soon forget about Alex Salmond, and focus on the positives.
Findlay Farquaharson
Take the argument of at right angles to their dislike/anger.
Usually by talking about something they like.Agree with them,say yes a lot,they will start to agree with you,say yes a lot.Bring the conversation steadily back to the footing you want to hold it on and use your best argument based on the fears you’ve uncovered during the conversation.
Might not get an immediate convert but they’ll be more receptive in future.
@Lesley-Anne
I reserve my best one liners for Paddington. 🙂
I think it still causes amazement that there’s any kind of YES movement in D&G at all. Solid Tory/Lab voting base and all. But the meetings have been steady over my end and when Elaine C dropped by the toon for a visit last week, they were queuing up for selfies with the lady.
The biggest YES vote may not come from the SW, but that we bring in as many as we can from this difficult region may make all the difference.
Hmmm..that’s the second time I’ve missed out the second “f” in “off”.
Cue “oo’er missus” comments.
David is pleased: I was cheered to see a rural bungalow festooned with Yes displays and saltires. Outside stood a wee silver car with a Yes badge on the rear window
Always makes me smile when I see them.
In the past the strongest adherents to self-government pitched a Saltire atop a flag pole! You still see them.
The proliferation of Yes badges are cheery. I did say some while back they’d multiply the closer we get to SG Day.
Was about to hit the horn at a sleeping driver missing the change of traffic lights this morning when I noticed his Yes sticker. I gave him a wave instead.
Nice article.
O/T
Paxman believes in indy?
“The closer you can take decision-making to the people affected by those decisions, the better,” he said.”
http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/jun/27/jeremy-paxman-newsnight-made-by-13-year-olds-one-nation-tory?CMP=fb_gu
great article. cheers David.
David Smith says:
OT. I was driving about just north of the border last night, looking for nice places to move to next year. Near Quintinshill, I was cheered to see a rural bungalow festooned with Yes displays and saltires. Outside stood a wee silver car with a Yes badge on the rear window. If there was anyone outside I’d have given a toot and a wave, but it made me happy to know there is at last visible support in the area, beyond my driving around flying the flag. 🙂
Don’t worry David there ARE supporters of YES in the area. I’m in Eastriggs, just a wee bit West of Gretna and we have a vehicle that is ever so slightly *ahem* festooned with YES stuff on it. 😛
I too am of mixed British blood, but lived in Scotland for the best part of 60 years, I just want the best that can be for Scotland, Vote Yes to be free of Westminster.
Well done David, a great article.
O/T
Chic from Kirriemuir Yes had a great idea to get some T-shirts printed with “Ask me why I am voting Yes” printed on them.
Badges would be very handy too. Could Stu arrange this as part of the campaign materials?
Gordon says: Yes had a great idea to get some T-shirts
I have a T shirt on which is the legend, “The Complete Works of Grouse Beater.” Maybe I should wear it when I first meet friends to celebrate Scotland’s new-found democracy.
First post, love Wings & the commentators, but I though there are some parallels to the theme of independence and the hope that when we do spend £200M+ on setup costs there is a chance the passport service is improved 😉
A painful story of despair dealing with the UK Passport office:
http://passporthell.wordpress.com/2014/06/27/when-is-a-government-service-beyond-hope/
macart763m says:
@Lesley-Anne
I reserve my best one liners for Paddington. 🙂
I think it still causes amazement that there’s any kind of YES movement in D&G at all. Solid Tory/Lab voting base and all. But the meetings have been steady over my end and when Elaine C dropped by the toon for a visit last week, they were queuing up for selfies with the lady.
The biggest YES vote may not come from the SW, but that we bring in as many as we can from this difficult region may make all the difference.
Oh don’t talk to me about that wummin Macart. I can not abide her. She was in Gretna on Monday for a *ahem* hustings meeting. This *cough* meeting was never advertised so it was just by chance that out local YES group, YES South Annandale, found out about the meeting. I wasn’t able to attend unfortunately, just as well cause when you read this you’ll understand when I say I’d have lost it, particularly with that nasty evil piece of work the foul mouthed abusive Labour councillor Archie Dryburgh!
http://tinyurl.com/m8wzr9u
@manandboy
I was reading about that Hurricane oil test yesterday.
What is important is not just this single find, but the implications for opening up a whole new type of oil reservoir, previously untested around Scotland –
Basement Rock that has been naturally fractured under huge pressure.
This one company alone has high end potential of 3 billion barrels, on their licenses to the west of Shetland.
The Atlantic Margin, all the way down the west coast of Scotland, also has big potential for these types of fields.
New and Under-Explored Plays in the UKCS
I’m surprised this didn’t make the BBC news..
@Lesley-Anne
See what you mean. An ambush right enough, but the Elaine I was referring to was:
https://www.facebook.com/yeswigtownshire
Mary doll. 🙂
B&Q don’t sell chimney cowls!
Oops! Trust me to get my knickers in a twist. just a sec while I go untwist them…AGAIN! 😛
I have to admit when I read your post about folks queueing up for “selfies” with Elaine I did wonder why on earth anyone would want to have a “selfie” with the wicked witch of the South. 😉
Thank goodness you cleared that up for me otherwise I’d be going to bed tonight with nightmares about folks queueing up for “selfies” with Elaine Murray! 🙂
Helena Brown
You say that the BBC is supporting UKIP and denigrating the SNP.
The have just had their “Big “Debate”” with an SNP guest and, as always UKIP wholly censored. Granted, with us getting 10.4% and SNP 29% you lot should be on about 3 times as often as us. Indeed if the BBC were not corrupt Fascist propagandists we would be.
The only alternative is that you are saying that your SNP MEPs are so completely useless that the BBC putting them on air is a way of showing the idiots up.
Perhaps so. Who am I to disagree?
Certainly if that is not the consensus view of Wings, by definition, you are about to be denounced by a mass of wingers.
This is sooooo good..
http://weegingerdug.wordpress.com/
Very good article David.
I have always got respect for someone who challenges his/her own behaviour or beliefs. It takes a bigger person to be able to admit that they have changed their mind about something although I see not why when it is done by checking facts or done with an open mind.
Some people will change their mind because everyone else is saying something contrary (to be one of the crowd) or they want to be ‘on the side that wins’ (I’m sure the Sun will come out for Yes soon when it sees the writing on the wall). You, however, have done it for the right reasons.
Respect.
Am gone to see Mary doll tonite Shotts Bon Accord 7.30
Alex Neil/Tommy Brennan & of course Elain C Smith & a wee
quiet, word in her ear over recent events, Wingers ur US.
O/T I just thought i mention this as i’m exhilerated.
I have just successfully convinced one of my colleagues to be undecided,but in actual fact he was so open minded and poorly read on the topic, that i believe he is now a definite YES.
Now given that he had an SA80 in his hand, and was guarding a British Forces camp at the time, and broached the topic with “I can’t believe how stupid these YES voters are, and there’s so few of them”, I am pretty chuffed. Converting a Germany based squaddie is not an easy thing.
Keep going guys, I’m envious of your ability and zest for door chapping and your involvement as a whole. Sadly not possible for me. I’ve only got 3 votes plus mine in the bag. But holy shit what an unexpected triumph and buzz i got.
Love it.
hey Neil Craig
Are you trying to get on a UKIP ticket for some future elction?
Service at the mast, or\
jeez
Your not David Coburn?
ketrraist!
Anyone needing a lift to Shotts meeting tonite from Airdrie dist post up 4 spaces available 1st come 1st booked for a seat, Will pick up in around Airdrie
Neil Craid sato to helena: Helena Brown, You say that the BBC is supporting UKIP and denigrating the SNP.
By the conditions of a charter drawn up still at a time of British colonial rule, its aims and objectives conceived to satisfy Westminster expectations; by its first Director General Lord Reith’s (a Scot on the make) hope for high office; by the severity of its top down authority; but above all, by its ingrained cultural bias linguistically, historically, and attitudes prevailing then and now, BBC Scotland, (of all BBC regions) cannot be anything else but partisan in support of London rule.
Rory… brilliant mate. Enjoy the moment, but keep going, there is more to do. 😉
Neil where Ukip is concerned I have never denigrated those in England who make that choice. They have very little in the way of choice. Here there is so many choices, spoilt for choice here. What I do dislike is your continual highjacking what is obviously a distasteful site to you.
Can I refresh your memory which, as I have no idea of your age seems to be faulty, the SNP are in Government and are popular with the people of Scotland, if they were not and doing a bad job would they still have a lead in the polls and not only at Holyrood but increasingly so in the Westminster poll and that Alex Salmond, his Deputy are also the most popular politician in Scotland.
Now I think I am done with you, I really do not need to feed you as you seem voracious and are forever trying to get fed and it is always wrong to feed a troll, they tend to haunt you. Now me and Niko on Munguins are almost having an affair so I cannot accommodate you.
Well said Mr B. A real Damascus moment. This will be getting shared on my f.b presently. Hopefully,this will make my pro union friends look at things from a different perspective. On a personal note, the closer Scotland comes to retaking her proper place in the world, the more Iam comfortable with using British as an identity. I know its weird.I feel That Britishness has been forced on me. Its a form of fascism. As for Mr Craig; your mob would do away with Scotlands parly. Whats that word again?….oh aye..fascism!..thats wit you are pal.
Helena Brown says:
Now me and Niko on Munguins are almost having an affair so I cannot accommodate you.
Just a wee quickie here Helena. Does Tris know about this affair and what does Munguin think about the situation? 😛
Lesley-ASnne
Merde
Merde
It is Friday, and I do not Twitter, thank Fek.
Shhh, we are keeping it quiet. I have offered to pack up his stuff and put him on the plane to Cyprus, anything to get rid of the wee g*t.
Looks like I will be offering a similar service if I thought thon Neil Craig would toodle off as well.
UKIP currently have 0.07% of democratically elected representatives in Scotland.
Recent polling has them on ~3.6% (Survation and MORI) down ~7 points in just a matter of a few weeks.
Looks like their vote has utterly collapsed in Scotland.
I’m guessing David Couburn’s anti-English immigrant rant was probably a factor.
Ed Miliband says Labour will erect Border Posts if Scotland votes Yes in September due to our more open immigration policies.
Does he not realise that (a) There are no border posts over in Ireland and (b) if a Labour Government was elected in Scotland in 2016 they could easily fall in line with London Labour?
Aye! And I’m British too. Born in Scotland, with two Scots parents and two out of four Scots grandparents, (the other two were Irish).
Of course I’m Scottish too and of course I’ll still be British after I stop being a UKasian.
Bugger (the Panda) says:
Merde
It is Friday, and I do not Twitter, thank Fek.
Does this mean silly season has started then? 😛
Helena Brown says:
Shhh, we are keeping it quiet. I have offered to pack up his stuff and put him on the plane to Cyprus, anything to get rid of the wee g*t.
Looks like I will be offering a similar service if I thought thon Neil Craig would toodle off as well.
Don’t worry Helena mum’s the word. 😉
Scottish Skier
Without the daily publicity from the BBC they are invisible in Scottish political life.
Angus Roxburgh in New Statesman is well worth a read on the subject:
Angus Roxburgh, the broadcaster’s former Moscow correspondent, said Salmond was “spot on” to complain that UKIP’s unexpected European election success in Scotland was partly due to the extent to which Nigel Farage had been “beamed” into the country.
“Standards of broadcasting are at the heart of democracy. As Scots search for facts shorn of opinion and bias, the BBC needs to sharpen up.”
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2014/06/lack-scottish-six-o-clock-news-major-democratic-flaw
O/T
To “Nana Smith” . Re Ferguslie Park Paisley – eventually got a reply from YES Scotland. They say they are dealing with requests from local activists for speakers.
Watched a brilliant performance from Tommy Sheridan on Scotland 2014 last night. He is the man to go there and get the YES vote. If he reads this I hope he heads on down there.
O/T
Pudgy Cameron says while speaking about getting gubbed by the EU.
Blah! Blah! … Britain’s relationship with Europe… blah! Blah!
He, as usual, lies as he doesn’t mean Britain he means the United Kingdom and he doesn’t mean Europe he means the EU. Just as he published a map of the UK that included the I.O.M.
Does this numptie ever get anything right?
UKIP currently have 0.07% of democratically elected representatives in Scotland.
Recent polling has them on ~3.6% (Survation and MORI) down ~7 points in just a matter of a few weeks.
Looks like their vote has utterly collapsed in Scotland.
I’m guessing David Couburn’s anti-English immigrant rant was probably a factor.
It could also be that, having prevented a Labour first place (UK wide) and a thrid MSP for the SNP in the european elections, UKIP are now no longer required and are being ignored deliberately to ensure that they do not become too much of a problem for the establishment (victims of their own success?).
UKIP were useful. Job done. Now the BBC-MSM have cut off the oxygen supply.
Spot on Luigi which is why Alex Salmond’s comments to Dimbelby have been shown to be correct.
U OK
David
I want to thank you for having an open mind and seeking for yourself the facts of Independence. I took the same road and that is why I’m here now.
The interesting thing is like you, you don’t just convert to Yes you become an active campaigner for Yes once your eyes have been opened and the lies. lies, lies exposed.
We do not want a lying government representing us. We want a democratically elected government looking after the interests of Scotland and her people. the only way to attain that is by voting Yes.
Here is the very last paragraph of the infamous McCrone report from 1974 that was held secret for 30 years.
If, in five years’ time North Sea oil is contributing massively to the UK budget, while the economic and social condition of West Central Scotland continues in the poor state that it is today, it would be hard to imagine conditions more favourable to the growth of support for the nationalist movement.
Very determined steps to urgently transform economic conditions in Scotland will therefore be necessary and the Scottish people will have to be persuaded that their problems really have received the attention and expenditure they deserve if this outcome is to be avoided.
Instead, we got the Thatcher government and the decimation of all Scottish Industry.
Independence will allow us to rebuild that which we lost in the wilderness years. You have to fight though by spreading the message. Sticking a post on here is not enough.
Talk talk talk and talk again. get in there with the head down.
Well, fancy meeting you here, David! 🙂
I’m the guy who put pressure on Dundee University and the Officer Training Corps to shut down the ‘I Hate Alex Salmond’ group.
Excellent David. Welcome to the light.
I’ve got a saltire running through me from head to toe but i’m all for a Scotland that welcomes and supports all those who choose to live here.
Sounds like you may have to convince some folk in the country of your birth though … ach if they want to build border posts i might give them a hand if it’ll keep ukipers and bnp out. Those Brit nats (and we have enough of our own) are a real laugh.
Cheers for that David, I have debates in work, amongst highly educated engineers who are spouting ‘NO’ camp rhetoric but when I try to get them to engage and read the Wings website I just meet Mr Stubborn! “Wouldn’t read that propaganda, – full of pish and lies”! And the no campaign aint? They need a reality check.
Welcome to Wings David and a cracking read too.
I served with our “British armed forces ” and considered myself British only to see it hijacked by the English. Welsh and Irish thought the same. But saying that i always considered myself a Scot first. Even abroad when asked who we were if British was said in return almost all thought English. Once we said Scots or Irish or Welsh , different attitude altogether. It’s still like that now. I don’t blame the English in any way , it’s just how things are. National Anthems too, we all have one but the English use the British one God save the queen. It’s how we feel about the countries we live in and i feel the English struggle with their own identity and the British one is closest for them.
The referendum is giving Scots a chance to go it alone and i think the knock on effect will change how our English cousins see themselves . They are good people and maybe an iScotland will help bring their out own distinct culture out more. I hope so. I watched a Billy Bragg video and he said something along those lines.
But it’s nice to know that being English and voting for independence for Scotland doesn’t make you less English. And your honesty at realizing that we can go forward from the referendum with hope and optimism only reinforces the friendship and closeness of the folk of these isles.
Delighted to have you here on Wings friend.
any sensible chap would know when to stop digging. Not so our own political party leaders.
Junker elected hahaha. Stuff your game Cameron.
Cameron humiliated as European leaders make Jean-Claude Junker president, as PM warns defeat ‘makes it harder’ for Britain to stay in EU
https://archive.today/HsgjR
Britain backed only by Hungary, everyone else for Junker.
What Cameron is worried about is that Junker is for expanding the EU and will welcome Scotland with open arms. Let’s hope Junker says this before 18th September.
Cameron humiliated says the BBC hahaha.
…………………./´¯/)
………………..,/¯../
………………./…./
…………./´¯/’…’/´¯¯`·¸
………./’/…/…./……./¨¯\
……..(‘(…´…´…. ¯~/’…’)
………\……………..’…../
……….”…\………. _.·´
…………\…………..(
…………..\………….\…
OT but last night there was a brilliant concert with a the premiere performance of the Bruce 700 by well known piper Allan MacDonald at Stirling. You can catch clips here and in particular the Scots Wha Hae is great and the performances from the shool kids was awesome. Why this wasn’t on TV or similar I don’t know as it was a special occasion. Hopefully they’ll release a DVD.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vWWwWG-9Z4 Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/edit?video_id=Hr9D86Ig4sg Part2 – Scots Wha Hae
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UljaZyvo1C4&feature=youtube_gdata
Can’t wait until we finally get our independence then get ruled from Brussels! 😉
Anything preferable to wm 😉
What Cameron is worried about is that Junker is for expanding the EU and will welcome Scotland with open arms. Let’s hope Junker says this before 18th September.
I am, as all here know, a bit lukewarm about the whole EU thing. However, I can see that Cameron has hardly endeared himself to the new EU President so I doubt Juncker will be as friendly as Barroso was. I am even more inclined to think they will have inside and signed on the dotted line before you can say independence and before we have read the small print. Hey Ho, I am not a swivel eyed Europhobe I can live with the EU but I just think if we took our time we might have had a more balanced view on the pros and cons.
O/T I managed to convert an English Woman undecided slightly YES leaning to Yes today. Quite chuffed, Earlier I was at a Funeral and at the Wake, sitting at a table of six with people I had known all my or their lives, but not knowing their political leanings, ages from 30’s to 75, Somebody else brought up the referendum , I was sitting at a table with 5 strong YES, to be honest I was gobsmacked, some of them I thought would be definite No’s.
Then I went to visit my Brother nearby, standing in his garden under a huge Saltire fluttering in the wind, this woman walking by stopped and asked if we were YES. She said her husband was but she was undecided, she left about 20 minutes later with her leanings towards yes confirmed. She was worried about the economy, probably the easiest thing to sort out.
@Ken says: 27 June, 2014 at 2:46 pm
“I’m English, in fact I only moved up here last year, so I’m as far from being more Scots than the Scots as it is possible to be”.
Ah! Yes, Ken. But this matter is not one for Scots born and bred.
It is one for, “The People of Scotland”.
Allow me to define for you what constitutes, “The People of Scotland”.
“Anyone, of any colour, creed or country of origin who is mainly resident in Scotland and who is registered to vote in Scottish Elections”.
You seem well qualified to be one of the people of Scotland and I trust you feel welcome to be so.
There are no tests of knowledge of Scotland’s history, languages or culture to be passed by applicant. Just a simple proof that you have a Scottish home address and have registered yourself as a Scottish voter.
A couple of years ago I met a proud person of Scotland in our capital city. It was during the Edinburgh Festival and on the Royal Mile.
He was dressed in full Sikh dress. Sikhs who have undergone the Sikh initiation ceremony, can be recognized by the Five Ks: uncut hair (Kesh); an iron/steel bracelet (kara); a Kirpan, a sword tucked in a gatra strap; Kachehra, a cotton undergarment; and a Kanga, a small wooden comb. Baptized male Sikhs must cover their hair with a turban. He it was that gave me that information.
This one, though, also wore a tartan turban and a tartan sash. I was astonished and spoke with him. I learned he had been brought to Scotland as a baby by his parents from the Punjab and really had never known any other country as his own except Scotland.
Now he is a very proud Person of Scotland and very much a YESSER.
@Liquid Lenny
One convent is good. We all have it in us to do that much.
Watch the polls changing as we each do our bit.
Honey bunches – you’ve all been so busy commenting, do I presume that you all had your conversations with people you don’t know, before you lunched?
@Paula Rose
I confess, haven’t had mine today so must do two tomorrow. thank you for keeping me on my toes. I nearly had one but that doesn’t count I suppose.
Thepnr
I think that is a job for the lassies, I think the nuns might chase me.
Pleased everyone likes the article.
@Albamac, I was not a fan of you! snooping my background and contacting potential employers etc was just creepy. As it happens I was no longer in the OTC. Using the word ‘hate’ was a bit strong but freedom of speech should always be maintained. Anyway, that’s all behind us now.
@ HandandShrimp – I think you missed ’tis’ in your penultimate word.
@ Andy-B 3:25pm
“…they soon forget about Alex Salmond, and focus on the positives”
I am sure that you did not mean this the way it comes across, Andy, but let’s remember that AS is the catalyst, the political leader who has made all this discussion, debate and dreaming possible. When we win, we owe him big time.
Paula
I thought people were getting excited enough as it was earlier on…I didn’t want to get people over-wrought.
A powerful article David that can be shown to the soft no and undecided. Wonder when we will get a similar article from someone who was Yes now coming out for No.. 😀
O/T Andrew, made a donation to Yes Stirling to get even with the Unionists for their trick of bringing Armed Force’s Day to Stirling on the Bannockburn weekend.
O/T any Tweeters out there? The Rev’s put out a call on Twitter for a video editor – if you don’t tweet, you could email him via contact form at top of WOS pages. Ta. 🙂
I was on of the one’s that was suspicious of David’s intent. There’s a lot of nasty tricks happening.
I was wrong, I admit that. Welcome to the family David.
Feel the love, I’m broadcasting.
Kindest regards,
David Milligan Lvss
Good news seems to be coming in from all directions today. Just read about an Asian Radio in Glasgow doing a poll with an overwhelming Number of YES respondents and John Thompson produced some encouraging canvass returns from yet another RIC mass canvass.
I’ve just watched the end of a rousing Tommy Sheridan speech at a packed hall in Dunfermline this week who gave him a rousing reception numbers I estimated as 350+
R wittington
You will always be ruled by some other furriner government.
Sodjer on.
I didn’t need to persuaded to be a Yes. With hindsight, I believe I was a YES from the evening Winnie Ewing won at Hamilton, and I started doodling the SNP logo on my school jotters.
In the past year or so, I have learned WHY we should vote YES.
And it’s not just the economic facts – it’s the fact that the UK establishment are, apparently, $h!† scared of Scotland striking out on our own – because that will represent a loss of power to the Westminster establishment and to them, (imperialistic) power is all that matters; power and control.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmOvEwtDycs
There have been mentions of our relationship with the European political system in the comments here; I can only offer a personal perspective.
I, and three workmates, were threatened with being transferred to another employer, under ‘the TUPE Regulations’. (TUPE stands for “Transfer of Undertakings Protection of Employment”.)
Unfortunately, our prospective new employer, whilst professing experience in ‘TUPE transfers’, didn’t actually have a clue about their responsibilities and restrictions concerning a TUPE-governed transfer. Neither did I, until I started a-Googling. To cut things short, the transfer was blown out of the water because neither our prospective employer, nor our own employer, actually understood the rights that we, as employees, actually had, under the EU-instigated regulations.
So, from my own personal experience, I support pan-Europe regulations – and I’m not bothered whether the bananas are straight or bent.
David, I’m gonna link to this page for a Facebook friend who, I was surprised to see, “liked” one of the “Better Together/No Thanks” Facebook pages, but then flipped the other way, then, recently, became ‘undecided’, because, as he admitted, he doesn’t really understand all the ins and outs of the referendum debate.
I haven’t had the journey that you, and others, have had and will make, between now and 18th September. But…
Through reading the stuff at Prof Curtice’s site (‘What Scotland thinks’) and James Kelly’s blog, ‘Scot Goes Pop!’, I have begun to believe that the polling companies are not representing what is actually going on in the minds of we Scots.
They seem to be very limited in the range of people whom they survey so, apart from one rogue poll last year, the YES side has never been in the lead.
From following the stuff on WOS and Newsnet, I’m getting the feeling that we are already past ‘the tipping point’ and the polling companies MAY catch up with this in the next couple of months – or maybe they won’t, like 2011.
Eh feel, in meh wahtter, that we are heading for a YES majority in September and the world will never be the same again. We will retrieve control over our own Scottish destiny.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoZZVkDVZ0c
T J
One of Santa’s little helpers.
Bisous
Laurie says
“AS is the catalyst, the political leader who has made all this discussion, debate and dreaming possible”….could’nt agree more! Remember reading No gods and precious few heroes 20 years back……When we win this Big Alex deserves to be honoured as the finest leader this country has ever had….. And I am NOT a member of the SNP.
Hector
But your Mum is?
BtP – you’re thinking of my pixie boots again, aintcha. 😉
This article really cheered me up this morning. Well done for being so open minded and a large thanks for helping the cause of self determination.
Anyone who hasn’t crossed the floor yet and is still thinking of voting “No” should listen to this informal interview with Alex Salmond:-
“Salmond Unplugged”
batemanbroadcasting.com/episode-4-audience-alex-salmond/
Tom
(2nd Draft)
Anyone who is thinking of voting “No” should listen to this informal interview with Alex Salmond
“Salmond Unplugged”
http://batemanbroadcasting.com/episode-4-audience-alex-salmond/
Tom
What next – The Queen saying YES!
Hi peeps,
I’m not trying to hijack this thread so apologies in advance if anyone is offended. But – any chance some of you kind people could repost this link on your Facebook or Twitter accounts to try and raise a wee bit of cash for the Yes Stirling campaign office?
http://igg.me/at/Yes-Stirling-Office/x
We’re still a wee bit short and your extraordinary generosity will make a difference as it has in the past for so many other similar worthy causes on this site.
Im pretty sure I was banned from No To Scottish Independence, and miraculously allowed back on appeal, only to be banned again. Not for anything nasty, not for trolling, but just for being pro Yes. At the same time the No’s were allowed a slightly more free hand.
I’m glad to see that the positive debate has paid off, and that someone as commitedly pro No is now Yes.
@David Barrat
“[i]@Albamac, I was not a fan of you! snooping my background and contacting potential employers etc was just creepy[/i]”
David,
Thought this topic was exhausted but I’ve just noticed your latest.
I wasn’t expecting to recruit any fans amongst participants in what was little more than a hysterical hate-fest. I make no apologies for anything I did to bring it to an end.
I did not ‘snoop’ into your background. You claimed membership of the Officer Training Corps as part of your public profile. The fact that you’d already left that organisation just slipped your mind. I did not contact any potential employer nor did I set out to damage your future prospects.
You and others chose hate-speech over reasoned argument and, in so doing, you brought the reputation of your university and, by claimed association, the army into disrepute. You were young and, perhaps, foolish but you and your fellows were, I’m guessing, intelligent, reasonably well-educated and, therefore, culpable.
There’s nothing ‘creepy’ about me and I don’t appreciate the intended smear. How do I square that with “Anyway, that’s all behind us now”. Well, that looks pretty much like you’ve just cleaned your own slate whilst attempting to shit on mine.
I’d have thought that the ‘big grin’ smiley, in my earlier post, would have signalled the absence of ill-feeling. You’ve blown that by attempting to attack my character.
I’m not Alex Salmond. Don’t make the mistake of thinking I’m any kind of ‘cunt’. That would be a more costly error than the first.
@Albama, Sorry. I shouldn’t have brought it up. I don’t think you are a ‘cunt’ nor did I ever suggest Salmond was. My error was in the title of the page. I don’t think I ever posted the ‘vile comments’ associated with page and wasn’t aware of them until I was contacted by the uni. I had generally ignored the page for a while and forgotten it was there. Anyway, it’s hard to portray tone in a comment but I didn’t mean to attack you, so sorry again.
@David Barrat
No worries, David. No harm done. 🙂