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Wings Over Scotland

Crimes and punishments

Posted on January 15, 2015 by

Having found to our dismay that both Scots and the rest of the UK want to see people prosecuted for offensive but non-threatening comments on Twitter and Facebook, it seems a good time to reveal the rest of our findings on matters of law and justice.


We picked a random clutch of serious, not-so-serious, timeless and topical subjects for our propositions. (Please note that all the propositions in our poll were worded for clarity of language, not to represent this site’s own viewpoints.)




Agree: 55%
Disagree: 33%
Net agreement: 22


Agree: 49%
Disagree: 36%
Net agreement: 13 

Scotland/rUK gap: 9 points

It seems Scots are still rather more Old Testament when there’s been a murrdur than the rest of Britain, which is perhaps a slightly counter-intuitive finding, but the UK as a whole is still clearly in favour. Yet once again the majority has nobody it can vote for.

This was almost the only finding in our entire poll – you’ll find the other one later in this post – where SNP (+37) and UKIP (+38) voters were closely aligned, with both being the most likely in their respective countries to seek the return of the rope. Only Lib Dem supporters, on both sides of the border, were opposed to a revival of capital punishment, more than 50 years after the last British criminal took the drop.




Agree: 10%
Disagree: 76%
Net agreement: -66


Agree: 11%
Disagree: 75%
Net agreement: -64

Scotland/rUK gap: 2 points

A pretty overwhelming finding against – almost 7 to 1 on both sides of the border – but the trend in all parties, under relentless lobbying from music and movie companies, is to back ever more draconian crackdowns on crimes against “intellectual property”. Only the extremely-fringe Pirate Party offers a more pragmatic view.




Agree: 29%
Disagree: 61%
Net agreement: -32


Agree: 36%
Disagree: 54%
Net agreement: -18

Scotland/rUK gap: 14 points

A pretty substantial difference here, but still UK-wide opposition to greater snooping powers for MI5 and pals. Nevertheless, surveillance mushroomed under the last Labour government and the Conservatives plan still-greater intrusion, leaving only whatever tiny handful of Lib Dems will be left after the election standing in the way. In such a manner do centuries of hard-won civil liberties crumble to dust.

SNP, Labour, Lib Dem and UKIP voters were all strongly opposed (the SNP’s most emphatically at -39), with Scottish and rUK Conservative voters very slightly opposed and very slightly in favour respectively.




Agree: 28%
Disagree: 53%
Net agreement: -25


Agree: 29%
Disagree: 51%
Net agreement: -22

Scotland/rUK gap: 3 points

Men were split almost exactly down the middle on this one (39-41 Scotland, 40-40 rUK), with women unsurprisingly much less likely to agree (18-64 and 19-61). We’re still waiting for someone to produce the official list of professions which ARE deemed suitable for convicted rapists, but for now it seems “footballer” definitely isn’t on it.

(In their other main area of agreement in our poll, UKIP and SNP voters were the least in favour of letting Evans play again, with rUK Labour voters and Tory supporters in Scotland the most rehabilitation-minded.)


The Evans case doesn’t really have a political dimension, but in the other three the public continues to find itself short of parties it can vote for in order to enact the policies it wants. Whether that’s a good or a bad thing in each individual instance is a matter of personal opinion, but it surely can’t be a healthy state for a democracy. And we’re nowhere near finished finding it in these poll results yet. Stay tuned.


*Our poll sampled 1007 respondents in Scotland and 1031 across the rest of the UK. Fieldwork 9-14 Jan 2015. Full data tables will be available on the Panelbase website.

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  1. 15 01 15 19:40

    Crimes and punishments - Speymouth

  2. 18 03 15 11:22

    The Devo Files: Katy Clark (North Ayrshire & Arran) | A Wilderness of Peace

179 to “Crimes and punishments”

  1. handclapping says:

    Suitable professions for convicted rapists:-
    Unionist journalism
    Estate agency

  2. handclapping says:

    Is Evans’ sentence served or is he out on licence?

  3. Valerie says:

    These right wing results are depressing me 🙁

  4. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    Don’t forget boxing and acting. Mike Tyson gets to appear in blockbuster Hollywood comedies these days.

  5. wingman 2020 says:

    So a new political party following all the tenets of this poll should be elected in power on a landslide victory?

    Nobody tell Murphy.

  6. wingman 2020 says:

    And anyone looking up tenets in the dictionary.. is well, a smelly bumface.

  7. Alex Clark says:

    It would seem then that we are not so civalised as we believed judging by the answers to the hanging question.

    Just this week a man hanged 74 years ago was declared innocent, the inquiry found:

    “The project team, while working alongside the Justice for Harry Gleeson group, found that prosecutors withheld evidence, statements were falsified and a witness was even beaten to secure a guilty verdict against Gleeson.”

    My own view id that LIFE in prison is likely a greater punishment than death by hanging.

    Mistakes are made and innocent people can be found guilty, I’m all for the guilty being punished but if you hang the innocent you can never rectify that mistake.

  8. crazycat says:

    @ handclapping

    He’s out on licence (which is apparently why he couldn’t take up an offer to play in Malta), he hasn’t shown any remorse (or even accepted that he was guilty), his victim has been named and has had to change her identity more than once, and footballers are supposedly “role models” – so I am one of those who think he should not be rehired until at least some of those things change.

  9. another me says:

    Always knew, if wee eck had come out and said ‘lets hang the buggers’ we would have swept the board last september.

    sad but true

  10. handclapping says:

    Thanks. IMO rape should be a sentence to be served in full unless a very good case can be made to the parole board.

  11. R-type Grunt says:

    What depressing findings these are. I must now point out that the only reason I vote SNP is to secure independence because it would seem most of my compatriots are reactionary xenophobic arseholes. It would seem most Scots are.

  12. Aidan says:

    Surprising results!

    Have always been against the death-penalty.

    For the simple incontrovertible reason that miscarriages of justice can and do occur.

    Executing an innocent person (even accidentally) is murder.

  13. Geoff Huijer says:

    Death penalty results fairly depressing.

  14. Kenlike says:

    I’m in favour of the death penalty

    BUT only for No Voters

    I’d even pull the lever myself

  15. Grouse Beater says:


    Ah, as ever, musicians get it in the neck!

    The fable of the Ants and the Grasshopper has the ants kick him out when winter arrives and he has nowhere to live, but the miserable Presbyterian bastards enjoyed him playing music for free all bloody year.

    And that exactly mirrors society’s attitude to the arts when the going gets tough.

  16. Dan Watt says:

    You remember the time that Westminster suppressed a certain pre-referendum poll because it, in all likelihood, gave results not to their favour…

  17. Devorgilla says:

    But the issue is surely HOW important are these to people? I would suggest, not very. The finding about capital punishment has been consistent for 50 years. It’s one area where I feel that lawmakers are wiser than voters.

  18. manandboy says:

    Once assisted suicide becomes law I would expect the death penalty to be a matter of seconds away.

  19. Inkall says:

    The death penalty would do nothing but free up a couple of hundred prison spaces every decade. More work on preventing homicide where alcohol was involved would do much the same thing.

    To lock up an innocent person for life is a terrible tragedy, but to end an innocent persons life because of a mistake during trial, inaccurate witnesses or some other situation should never be allowed to happen.

  20. Kenlike says:

    To avoid confusion, my previous remark was a JOKE

    I am not, nor to the best of my knowledge have I ever been, a genocidal maniac.

  21. Devorgilla says:

    Manand boy makes a good point. If the public can’t be trusted on hanging, is their wisdom reliable on assisted suicide. I don’t think it is.

  22. Tam Jardine says:


    You should check out Dostoyevsky’s ‘House of the Dead’- if I recall correctly there is a fairly definitive condemnation of the death penalty from someone who was led to the firing squad in a mock exection as part of his punishment, imprisonment and exile for being a political dissident.

    He was part of the Petrashevsky Circle- described as a ‘Russian literary discussion group of progressive-minded commoner-intellectuals’. Sounds a bit like Wings.

  23. Faltdubh says:

    Quite depressing findings.

    Yet we quite literally want our cake and eat it e.g free downloading rights and if convicted of stealing an artist’s music, writer’s book or so, no conviction!

  24. Steve Bowers says:

    Hang Wingman, I’m offended

  25. a supporter says:

    handclapping at 607 pm

    Unfortunately all the jobs you mention are already filled to the brim with those sorts of people.

  26. HandandShrimp says:

    Like others I find the reactionary lean of the population a tad depressing. Civilisation is a wafer thin veneer and we need to protect it. It doesn’t take much to pitch a society back to the dark ages…some societies have never left the dark ages.

  27. Small sample size, but depressing findings.

    There is no place in a civilised society for capital punishment – although for Blair, I could be persuaded otherwise.

  28. Democracy Reborn says:

    Google ‘does the death penalty deter crime’.

    The weight of opinion from empirical research is that either it does not, or at least there is no credible evidence that it acts as a deterrent.

    Whether, of course, the respondents in the poll were answering it from a ‘retribution’ standpoint is another matter.

  29. Peter Bell says:

    On the matter of capital punishment, voters who favour turning the clock back lack a party that represents their view for the simple reason that a return to the barbarity of judicial killing is as close to being a political and legislative impossibility as makes no difference.

    And that’s before we get to the fact that there are absolutely no rational reasons to bring back the death penalty.

  30. Morag says:

    I remember when I was a child, hearing repeated radio news bulletins reporting on an imminent execution. Every day it was mentioned, and every day it got closer. In the end, the newsreader reported that the man had indeed been executed.

    Little people have big ears, as they say. The radio was simply playing in our kitchen, as it always was. Neither of my parents ever referred to the execution. I picked up on it purely from the airwaves.

    I was horrified. They were going to kill a man. On purpose, in cold blood, on a specified date, and the man knew it. I didn’t care what he had done, this was too much. As the day grew closer, my infant horror grew. I imagined the man seeing the day of his death coming closer. I imagined him being terrified. I imagined a live body becoming a dead one.

    I was immeasurably relieved when the death penalty was abolished. I think it’s barbarous. I think it brings us down to the level of the criminals. Not to mention the numerous miscarriages of justice we know about, and others we may not know about.

    Thankfully the EU doesn’t allow a member state to have the death penalty. I just hope to hell we aren’t forced out.

  31. grahamlive says:


    Who in their right mind agrees with that. I mean, I know they do it anyway but who the hell supports it? Would they agree to their house being bugged 24/7 ? The mind boggles.

    As for the death penalty one. While the results are still disappointing, I suspect that the number of people opposed to it is far greater than it would have been say, 10 or 20 years ago. So that’s at least a little encouraging.

  32. jimnarlene says:

    A family member of mine was murdered, a few years ago. If I could have got, my hands on, the bastard that did it; I would have killed him. He is in jail, thankfully, though not for long enough.

    That said however, I do not agree with capital punishment. Too many innocent people have been murdered, by the state.

  33. Gallium says:

    It always saddens me when those who cry ‘The Government can’t do anything right!’ turn around and demand that same government execute people.

  34. Kenlike says:

    Tam Jardine

    You are, of course, completely right in condemning the obscenity that is the death penalty. I would also recommend Albert Pierrepoint’s autobiography Executioner: Pierrepoint for any rope-death fantasists out there.

  35. Eppy says:

    OT but a bit of light relief. My 14 year old daughter started laughing when I was listening to The Archers tonight. “One of the characters is complaining about bias in the press” she said. “On the BBC!”
    Beyond irony.

  36. heraldnomore says:

    We’d need to be improving on the unsafe conviction stats – far too many of them.

    And Megrahi anyone?

  37. wingman 2020 says:

    @ Steve Bowers

    At least you are honest 🙂 *laughing*

  38. big jock says:

    Problem with death penalty is two fold. It requires the legal profession to act as God where another humana life is concerned. Secondly how many mistakes have been made with wrongful and set up convictions over the years. Once you kill someone its too late if new evidence appears. Its just unworkable as well as morally insane.

  39. Kenlike says:

    I should add as a curative obviously, not a tonic.

  40. Gary Cullen says:

    All radical Muslims convicted of acts of terrorism should be sentenced to death if their act of terrorism was within the Uk or Scotland or of British /Scottish citizens were targeted abroad this would send a very clear message to young radicals thinking about setting off bombs and beheading someone in the name of their religion,No mercy should be shown to terrorists who bomb unarmed civilians or kill them in the name of any religion

  41. MolliBlum says:

    Pretty shocked by the death penalty question.
    It has no place whatsoever in any civilised society.
    It not only brings us down to the level of base murderers ourselves, as is often argued, but perhaps even more disturbingly actually elevates the crime of murder to one that is acceptable – just as long as it is carried out by the state and leaves “our” hands clean (not only barbaric but also a total abdication of personal responsibility).
    Morag’s childhood anecdote was telling – sometimes kids are far more savvy than adults.

  42. Taranaich says:

    What was the age breakdown on death penalty? I’d like to think that older people who actually remember the death penalty would be more opposed and realise just how horrendous it is, but part of me’s worried they’re also the reactionary types. My suspicion is it’s mostly 30-55 year olds. It’s easy to call for the death penal when there’s no possibility of it happening: if it ever goes through draft legislation and people actually realise exactly what it means, I’d hope people would come to their senses.

    I see a lot of people being dismayed by these findings. Just remember: 55% of those who voted in the referendum voted No, too. Voting No in and of itself is not the same as voting for the death penality, but it does show that there are divides in the country that cannot be marked down to the referendum.

    And, don’t forget, opinions are not static. When we get our independence, convincing the rest of Scotland that the death penalty should not be brought back is just one of the new struggles we’ll face in forging our new country. You didn’t think it would be easy, would you?

  43. Anon says:

    As a left-winger I’ve always been of the opinion that the Scottish public is actually pretty damned right wing when it comes to social issues. None of these polling results surprise me.

  44. Dr Jim says:

    I’m on the wrong site Ya shower of murdering bumfaced bastirts
    does this mean i’m a Torie
    I’m so ashamed
    No i’m not

  45. maxikerr says:

    How often would the corrupt Deep State use their unchallenged power to set up anyone they like for the drop.This is what is being voiced here so everyone TAKE NOTE.????

  46. Dr Jim says:

    Well they should stop subsidising Scottish opera and maybe i could afford to buy some CDs, or a DVD, or, i would kill for a curry right now. I’m just gonny nip round tae “Navid’s” i’ll get some “GINGER” while i’m at it

  47. Robert Louis says:

    People always like to say they want the death penalty, but when it comes to reality, the mood changes. Too many people have been murdered by a state or country in this way, whilst completely and demonstrably innocent.

    Of course you could always go the USA way, and end up frying a 14 year old to death in the electric chair, who was later shown to be quite, quite innocent.

  48. fred blogger says:

    the death penalty is horrendous for so many reasons.

  49. bookie from hell says:

    strange tweet from Jim Murphy

    A man on my train with I think 8 ‘Yes’ badges told me he’d just joined the Scottish Labour Party for £1.
    You can too:

  50. Paula Rose says:

    @ Alex Clark and others

    We weren’t being polled, those we need to reach were, gives a precise picture of the work we have to do.

    Some of the majority views are a result of brainwashing.

    Let us use fresh Scottish spring water.

  51. Dorothy Devine says:

    Mr Cullen , what punishment would you give to those terrorists who have killed 200,000 Iraqis? Many very innocent Afghanis?

  52. Alex Clark says:


    I thought your first post was funny. Unless you are devoid of a sense of humour.

    Separating that which is humour from reality, for some is not always possible.

  53. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Well said, Morag. Agree entirely

    The death penalty does not appear to be any kind of deterrent in the USA.

  54. Hoss Mackintosh says:

    O/T I got a response back from BBC Scotland on the recent Call Kay(e) incident and attached the letter to the original thread. Minor concession – if you are interested.

    Back on thread…
    Crime – BBC propaganda.
    Punishment – Hanging is too good for them.

  55. KennyG says:

    Its the classic, drunk woman meets footballer on night out, agrees to go back to a hotel with him (for coffee I presume), wakes up in the morning crying rape because they don’t remember giving consent story again isn’t it. When will they learn. Anyone whos ever been part of a dury knows the whole process stinks and the female dury members would have him guilty before hearing any evidence.

    The truth is he would have been playing by now if it wasn’t for corporate sponsors threatening to pull out of clubs. Absolutely nothing to do with sad womens groups trying to destroy his life or petitions etc. Simply money and nothing else.

  56. Dinnatouch says:

    @ Gary Cullen: Fundamentalist terrorists are quite willing to die for their cause, so the death penalty would be no deterrent whatsoever.

  57. John Sm. says:

    I seem to remember Unionists repeatedly tell us that Scots and rUKers weren’t all that different in in their worldly view.

    Some of your poll results seem to confirm this. That’s ok, views and opinions are sometimes shared.

    But that doesn’t mean we’re happy to be governed by another country or by a political party we didn’t vote for.

  58. Anne says:

    A reply from BBC re my complain on Kaye Adams bias re. saying Gordon Brown hadn’t promised Home Rule for Scotland.
    Dear Miss Galloway

    Reference CAS-3094324-D21TT4

    Thank you for getting in touch regarding Morning Call presented by Kaye Adams which was broadcast on Friday 9 January 2015, and posed the questions: Do you want Home Rule and does the price of oil make a difference?

    We have received a wide range of feedback on this matter so the response below strives to address the majority of those concerns raised but may not address all of the specific points you have mentioned.

    We forwarded your complaint to the Senior Producer of Morning Call, who has responded as follows:

    In no way did Kaye attempt to mislead the audience over Gordon Brown’s stance on Home Rule because either she or the BBC have a particular agenda.

    During the debate with our guests; Mark McDonald, SNP MSP for Aberdeen Donside and Lewis Macdonald MSP, Labour member for North East Scotland, Mark McDonald stated that home rule had been exactly what Gordon Brown had been promising with regards to ‘The Vow’ prior to the Referendum. Kaye at this point asks the question: “I don’t think he used the term Home Rule, did he?”

    Immediately jumping in, Lewis MacDonald says ‘No’ repeatedly, denying that this was said. Mark McDonald then says that what Mr Brown offered was a ‘new federalism’- effectively Home Rule – which again Mr MacDonald denies. The conversation then moves to the support for home rule and from there back to the listeners calling in.

    From listening back to this section it is quite clear that Kaye is probing to clarify and asking a question, which I concede could certainly have been phrased more clearly. Both politicians then give answers of yes, no and also a “version of federalism”. This is not Kaye lying about what was said, nor is it Kaye making a statement that Gordon Brown did not offer home rule. Lewis MacDonald is in fact the person throughout this section who denies it was ever said or offered by the former PM.

    Morning Call is a fast and fluid programme and on that day we received over 70 calls, 18 of which got on air. As ever, the listeners dictate where the conversation goes and as we moved on we discussed; oil price volatility, the continued fallout of the referendum and callers in favour and not of Home Rule.

    Some 40 minutes and five calls later, caller Chris took the opportunity on air to go back to what Lewis MacDonald had said and told Kaye that he was certain that Gordon Brown had used the term, to which Kaye replied that she had found it difficult to get an absolute on it, but that she accepted that was what Chris recalled.

    We fully accept that in the lead up to the referendum, Gordon Brown said of proposed additional powers: “These proposals are radical. And we are putting them forward as a Labour Party. They change not just Scotland, but they change Britain. They move us closer, or as close as possible to Federalism as you can, in a country where 85% of it is one nation; England. They are equivalent of what Keir Hardie was asking for when he called for Home Rule for Scotland. Home Rule for Scotland within the United Kingdom, where we have powers over own affairs in these areas but still we recognise the benefit of pensions, health care, economic decision making, defence and security as part of the United Kingdom.”

    However, as stated above, it is our opinion, that Kaye is not attempting to mislead listeners within this debate. Any indications of bias on the part of Kaye, the programme itself or the BBC due to a particular agenda, are also without substance. That said, we acknowledge you felt differently and your observations have been noted.

    I hope that this goes some way to explaining the situation and that you will continue listening in the future.

    Thank you, once again, for taking the time to contact us.

    Kind regards

    Jannine Matthews

    BBC Complaints

  59. Dinnatouch says:

    If my wife or daughter was assaulted or killed, I’d be more than willing to kill the bastard that did it, a desire for vengeance is only natural I believe. The law, however, should not be indulging in vengeance, especially when miscarriages of justice are still all too common.

  60. JLT says:

    The ‘Death Penalty’ result; surprising as it may be to some, doesn’t really doesn’t come as an actual surprise (well, for me anyway!)
    Part of that may come down to good old Scottish Presbyterian values which have been hammered into the Scottish psyche (thanks to John Knox) in which Knox, using Calvinist theory, demanded a return to the true values of the Bible …and hence …the forms of punishment, which in some sense, would be the kind from the old testament (ie an eye for an eye).

    As to the overall subject of punishing those who comment on Facebook and Twitter. I think, yes, there have been times where the state has gone into overkill, but there are also been times when someone has commented on something, and got it horribly wrong (Lord McAlpine and Sally Bercow, the wife of John Bercow as an example).

    People can be naïve, and yes, at times downright stupid when commenting. But at the end of the day, that does not mean that we should prosecute or put the fear into people over what they write, and it most certainly does not mean, we should give the Security Services permission to peek into our most private emails whenever they feel like it.

    Slowly, but surely, it seems so unbelievable that George Orwell’s vision of 1984 gets closer each day.

  61. Paula Rose says:

    A dignitas clinic on every street corner, easy access to the future whatever your belief. Let’s make death the new religion that we all choose to embrace – I’m serious.

  62. Martin McDonald says:

    In my opinion, you have to be either thick or evil to support the notion of capital punishment.

    I don’t care if someone supports independence or is in Labour, UKIP or the English Democrats, if you support capital punishment that’s what I think of them.

  63. scottish_skier says:

    People in Scotland are not that different from people in other countries shocker.

    Next, we can poll, say, France and find that, oh, Scots are a bit like the French in many respect.

    Then we can poll Paraguay and once again, shock, they are quite like us too.

    There is one huge difference though between Scotland and other countries – Scotland is inhabited by Scots. That difference in the end is the one that is the primary reason for the existence of countries. The people in an area collectively agree they are one people.

    As for the death penalty… Sadly, all too many that support it genuinely seem to think it a deterrent. That and they don’t have to carry it out personally themselves as per e.g. jury duty.

  64. heedtracker says:

    UK jails kill far more than the death penalty ever did. I don’t think people are willfully blind to the horrors that pass for civilisation day after day and Ched Evans deserves everything he gets.

  65. Peter Barlow says:

    The death penalty.
    Killing is so wrong: it is the ultimate crime. So it deserves the ultimate punishment.
    So let’s commit the same ultimate crime, and make the State as bad as the murderer.

    No. Killing is wrong. No matter whom, no matter why. (Except for reasonable force necessary to protect oneself).

    Ched Evans has apparently become a verb amongst his male fans. As in (of an attractive young woman who otherwise won’t have sex with you): I’d like to “Ched Evans” *her*!…

  66. Be careful what you wish for. I’m sure there are some that see ‘Yesser’s as enemies of the state and they want to be able to listen to your every utterance.

  67. Dr Jim says:

    So no torture then,
    My attempts at humour, but seriously,it’s not the fault of those who get it, that those who don’t,don’t, if it’s intention is not meant harmfully what follows is almost always false indignation, professional outrage, and unfortunately the world is littered with serial offendees who troll the world looking for something to be offended by
    How very dare they…..

  68. Roger Ewen says:

    Twenty six percent of scots cannot read and write! Government statistics. Before you can condemn anyone, you need to give them the chance being taught to know the difference right and wrong.

  69. Morag says:

    We’d need to be improving on the unsafe conviction stats – far too many of them.

    And Megrahi anyone?

    I’m working on it, OK?

  70. Patrick Roden says:

    Yes I have to agree with Morag, we have saw so many miscarriages of justice, in which a later investigation discovers that the police withheld information that showed the accused was innocent.

    I am reminded of the Birmingham 4 who’s arrest, trial, and long prison sentence should put paid to any idea that the UK has any genuine justice.

  71. Alex Clark says:


    Sure “they” are listening and noting all utterances. I for one don’t give a fuck.

    They aught to fear democracy and I’m sure they do, hence the watching.

  72. Schrödinger's cat says:

    It appears Russia has cut off europes gas supply, the petro dollar is starting to crash

    Watch the unionist back pedal on the anti Indy oil forecast propaganda

  73. Croompenstein says:

    The executioner’s face is always well hidden..

  74. big jock says:

    Bookie. The yes man joining the Labour party will be another Murphy stunt. He is trying to associate the Labour party with yes voters. Its car crash marketing for 12 year olds. The guy really must think he is dealing with chimps. Basically just become the SNP and the voters will come back to you. I just find it hilarious.

    Murphy if you are reading this. I presume the degree you failed after nine years wasn’t in media studies was it!

  75. Brian says:

    death penalty is against my principles , but in saying that how are murderers punished nowadays , they get sent to jail , kept in relative luxury , let out after doing half or less of their sentence in most cases and all that at public expense . Now if sentence was like for like ie life for a life , then the convicted should die in jail , just not kept in luxury . No TV , no Vidio games , make them work at least 10 hours per day and kept in their cell the rest of the time , no visitors after all their victims can’t get visitors . Only basic needs of food water and clothing met . I’d even allow basic healthcare but no life preserving treatments .
    Then that would be a more appropriate punishment than what they get now .

  76. Marcia says:


    No, for us with long memories the executioners such as Henry Allen and Albert Pierrepoint were rather well known.

  77. Paula Rose says:

    So am I allowed to die at my choosing?

  78. Schrödinger's cat says:

    I for one look forward to welcoming our new Russian and Saudi overlords

    Salam alaikum tovarich

  79. Natasha says:

    I grew up in Nigeria, and I remember seeing a photograph in a magazine of the sagging bullet-ridden corpses of three men who had been executed by firing squad. I was appalled and fascinated at the same time, and although it sickened me I couldn’t help repeatedly looking back at it.

    I was six.

    I have never been in favour of the death penalty, and I have never been able to understand anyone who is.

    By the way, KennyG, 8.29pm, the word is ‘jury’, and if I were even half as stupid as you, I’d try and keep quiet about it, not advertise it on the internet.

  80. Croompenstein says:

    Has Skeletor been on the f*ckin Hogwart’s Express or just the drugs!!

  81. Marcia says:

    A criminal waste of our resources – The National front page for Friday;

  82. crazycat says:

    @ Natasha

    Thanks – I drafted a few responses to KennyG and discarded them as ineffectual – you put it very well and I’m glad I left it to you.

  83. Nana Smith says:

    @bookie from hell

    Not alone in thinking dim Jim is lying…again

  84. War on terror ad infinitum on news, emergency snooping on the way.

  85. Ian Brotherhood says:

    re ‘Morph Goes On The Train’…

    Which train was it? Going from where to where? Who witnessed this encounter between His Morphness and the Yes-Man? When did it happen?

    How many people do you know who sport approximately eight Yes badges? Did you meet anyone, even at the height of the campaign, who had that many? Where were these badges? On his hat? His jacket? His face?

    Does anyone believe that this encounter happened?

  86. Martin says:

    Rev, the main difference between Tyson and Evans (who I personally believe should be allowed to be gainfully employed by anyone who will employ him -outside of the protected roles working with adults/children- as long as he doesn’t withold his conviction) is that Mike Tyson is a millionaire in a land where money matters more than justice, and Ched Evans…isn’t

  87. Schrödinger's cat says:

    Um, Ian brotherhood…..

    Let me think about it for a sec….

    Nope, don’t believe a word of it

  88. Martin says:

    The word “vulnerable2 is missing from the roles working with adults/children above, sorry. It doesn’t make sense without it.

  89. Tam Jardine says:


    Just remember, the North Sea is fine – its looked after by the broad shoulders of the UK!

    David Cameron promised that all would be OK and revenues would grow by £200bn if we just voted no.

    It’s a strange way of looking at an industry that has been propping up the UK for decades. “For many years the UK has supported the North Sea oil and gas industry”

  90. Schrödinger's cat says:

    Paula Rose says:
    15 January, 2015 at 9:46 pm
    So am I allowed to die at my choosing?

    Only “la petite mort” Paula 🙂

  91. Ian Brotherhood says:

    This one’s got it all –

    Mighty Morphin’ Power Rangers Morph:

  92. desimond says:

    To quote REM
    “judge not lest ye be judged..what a beautiful refrain”

    Seems Scots think okay to prosecute abuse but dont go reading email which might contain said abuse. Arseholes

  93. tartanarse says:


    Avoiding BBC obviously, but watching ITN lie about the oil and then explain that the wee jocks shouldn’t worry about it as big UK is looking after us is making me want to kick my telly.

    Finished with a wee note about fracking.

    I like to fire high pressured liquid into those unionist frackers.

    No, not like that. Behave yersels.

  94. big jock says:

    Its probably best if people don’t speculate on how the jury found the footballer guilty,(you know who you are). The fact is he was found guilty. I think its dangerous to claim that women claim rape and females in the jury find them guilty just because they want to. Each case is different and the facts come out in court. The facts found him guilty and he was convicted end of.

  95. tartanarse says:

    Jim the Chin met a Yesser with EIGHT badges on the train.

    Where was this Yesser, on the floor unable to move with the weight of them?

    This Yesser moe than likely gave Jim the crim a pound just to fuck off, but Dimbo had to spin it as he’s not genetically programmed to tell the truth.

    You can’t trust these left right unionist seperatist vegetarian meat eating teetotalling wine drinkers you know.

  96. Marcia says:

    The Guildford 4, the Birmingham 6 et all would have been put to death in revenge if the death penalty was in force in the early 1970’s but you cannot revive a corpse with a pardon to sorry you were innocent.

  97. Alex Clark says:


    I thought KennyG would have been slaughtered for his views on rape. He wasn’t until you came along.

    Put back in his box in the best I can come up with.


    Implying blame on the victim in any crime is dangerous ground to tread. Look before you leap.

  98. Natasha says:

    @Martin, 10.09pm

    The word “vulnerable2 is missing from the roles working with adults/children above, sorry. It doesn’t make sense without it.

    Yes it does.


  99. Marcia says:


    Teetotallers don’t drink wine. An oxymoron if ever there was one.

  100. Natasha says:

    @Alex Clark 10.32pm
    Maybe people just took pity on his deep stupidity. Either that or they, like Crazycat, were lost for words.

  101. Schrödinger's cat says:

    Maybe people just took pity on his deep stupidity. Either that or they, like Crazycat, were lost for words.

    The idea that crazy cat or anyone else on wos would be lost for words were they siting opposite Murphy on a train strikes me as unlikely

    If you are traveling on a train, make sure you charge up your iphone and empty the sim before you board, you never know yer luck folks 🙂

  102. Schrödinger's cat says:

    desimond says:
    15 January, 2015 at 10:14 pm
    To quote REM
    “judge not lest ye be judged..what a beautiful refrain”

    Isn’t that from the life of Brian?

  103. Morag says:

    The last execution in Scotland happened when I was nine years old. I think that will be the one I remember from the radio news bulletins.

  104. Morag says:

    By the way, there’s something on Twitter about a Yes supporter seeing Murphy on a train and winding him up. Sounds plausible.

  105. big jock says:

    I think you will find that the Yesman was a figmant of Murphy’s vivid imagination. The line between reality and fantasy is very faintvin his world. The scary thing is that lying comes so easy with SLAB people. I suppose it just becomes normal to them after a few years. He is now a serial fantasist.

  106. cearc says:

    Paula Rose,


  107. Paula Rose says:

    If I want to die why should I be stopped from doing so?

  108. cearc says:

    I’ll go with CH’s 1008.

  109. cearc says:

    ‘Cos we all want Paula Rose to live forever.

  110. X_Sticks says:

    Paula Rose says:

    “A dignitas clinic on every street corner”

    Kinda drop in, drop out?

  111. crazycat says:

    @ fellow feline –

    My loss for words referred to by Natasha was in relation to a comment on here a few hours ago, not the bould Murphy. Woe betide him should he ever find himself opposite me on a train!

  112. Schrödinger's cat says:

    Paula Rose says:

    “A dignitas clinic on every street corner”

    Kinda drop in, drop out?

    Um, more a drop off!!

  113. Barontorc says:

    Seems big gas probs starting from Russia – get you finger oot big shoulders UK and keep us dependent wee Scots warm.

  114. @Paula Rose says:

    If I want to die why should I be stopped from doing so?

    You shouldn’t nor should anyone else if one believes in a free society.

  115. tartanarse says:

    Today, some folks have been talking about capital punishment.

    It is agreed that the justice system does not always get it right, even with a jury.

    We know that people who are guilty as sin get off. We know that folks who are innocent go down.

    In the Evans case we don’t know what the evidence was so we can’t comment on it other than acknowledge the verdict.

    No one can deny Kenny his right to say what he thinks, as he may be right, but perhaps we’ll never know.

  116. Dr Jim says:

    Police reports tonight of a man wearing several SNP and Saltire badges robbed of his bus fare home, the attacker was described as “A big skinny beaky guy wae a shiny soot” A police spokesman said the victim was violently assaulted with what appeared to be a soft drinks crate, investigations are ongoing. MP Jim Murphy happened to be passing at the time and offered to render assistance
    What a guy!!!

  117. Schrödinger's cat says:

    Us cats should stick the gither
    I wonder if there are any train spotter wingers who could give us a heads up on which trains murph uses?
    A couple of tee shirts, ” I’m Murphy’s fav naw bag etc” you sit opposite and ill film the encounter

    Career ending stuff I’m sure, snigger

    Dear Paula rose, I can’t live without you…..

  118. liz says:

    BTW Twitter has crashed!! Not surprising since the establishment hate it.
    Re the response from the BBC re Kay(e) – you are right it was mince.

    She was quite arrogant and said to with the SNP guy – so you’re basing this ‘home rule’ remark on some polls? Sneer.

    The response is as expected covering their backs as per usual.

    Also completely disagree with the death penalty it solves nothing – just look at the USA to see that.

    The Yes guy ‘joining labour’ was on Twitter admitting that he wound up Murphy because he saw him on the train and thought – not him again

  119. Schrödinger's cat says:

    Paula Rose says:
    15 January, 2015 at 10:55 pm
    If I want to die why should I be stopped from doing so?

    Technically and practically, you can’t be, long walk short pier etc.

  120. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Natasha at 9.48

    Whereabouts in Nigeria? I was there for 15 years

  121. snode1965 says:

    Opinion polls are all very well…but. Just watched FMQ from earlier today. By far the biggest story of this year has not only been glossed over by all branches of the State but also this site! The Tory/Labour austerity bill will have a bigger effect on all of our lives than any of Smurphy pish. Smurphy is merely a poor mans Derren Brown telling us all to watch the shiney ball. No it was left to Nicola Sturgeon to nail Labour UK to the appropriate cross for their Red Tory duplicity. You can watch for yourself political suicide unfold on screen, somewhat sad but mostly pathetic. Come on Rev and The National, time to nail these Judas bastards.

  122. Schrödinger's cat says:

    time to nail these Judas bastards.

    Love it
    Your tee shirt is in the post

  123. crazycat says:

    @ tartanarse

    No, Kenny is not right – he said female jurors convict men accused of rape regardless of the evidence, which is sexist nonsense.

  124. big jock says:

    Damn and I thought it was Murphy at home with his Hornby narrow gauge , a bottle of Irn Bru and a copy of Grimms fairy tales!

  125. big jock says:

    Paula I think death is overated!Lol! Unless you plan to haunt Murphy. Mind you, can you haunt doctor death.

  126. Schrödinger's cat says:

    Independence live rep was the 8 yes badge man who admits on this podcast that he Did join the Labour Party………


  127. Tam Jardine says:

    Lovely – Douglas Alexander on question time responding to Lib Dem claim that they would find an extra £8billion for the nhs: “That’s a completely uncosted promise on your part”

    Hmm – if only the Lib Dems had simply promised to spend a couple of billion more than labour pledge to spend that would have been ok

  128. big jock says:

    Schrödinger. Sounds like a good case for legalising Dignitas in Scotland. Joining SLAB is surely a form of assisted suicide. Thanks Jim.

  129. ronnie anderson says:

    Badges !badges i,ll raise they 8 badges by 992+1 & donate ma pound tae the restoration fund of the Fairy Bridge.

  130. tartanarse says:


    Calm down and read my post again. I never said he was right. I said he has a right to say what he wants.

    I point out that no one, even you, knows what the truth is except the two persons involved.

  131. Schrödinger's cat says:

    At val
    This pollock should have told everyone he was doing this before he made every yes supporter on twitter look like an idiot
    He can now explain his rationale all he wants
    Indy live can go fuck themselves, I won’t be crowd funding a Labour Party stooge
    End of
    Indy live = smart cunt?…

  132. Alex Clark says:


    You told us about the update recently and how things would be faster.

    Well for me at least it is a lot slower and I don’t see my own post or those of others until at least 20 minutes later.

    It is far worse not better from at least one readers point of view.

  133. No no no...Yes says:

    Regarding Murphy and an alleged YES supporter on a train:

    1.Murphy would likely be in First class and the YES supporter would ignore him in such a refined environment.

    2.If the Yes supporter had just joined Labour would he still be wearing Yes badges?

    Just another episode from attention seeking Jackanory Jim. All designed to distract from Labour’s abysmal FMQ’s.He wants us to waste time trying to ID the person, just like he did with the egg culprit. Ignore!!

  134. liz says:

    @Schrodingers cat – I have to agree with you watched bits of that ‘explanation’ and have to say the guy sounds pissed, repeated himself and looked a bit shocked as if he hadn’t expected this info to get around as quickly as it did.

    I will not fund this guy again, seem to think it was funny but has now added Murphy a good sound bite.

    This will be spun and spun – Murphy reaching out to Yes is working etc etc.

    The guy I posted seemed to have a different experience so maybe both happened but the other one wasn’t serious.

  135. Ian Brotherhood says:

    I was there, outside Grand Central Hotel, when Jim Murphy said ‘Hiya’ en passant to Deek, just feet away from us – he recognised him, knew he was from Livestream, and made the acknowledgement loud and clear.

  136. liz says:

    Sorry just realised it’s the same guy but his explanation on twitter sounded like a wind up then it looks as though he is trying to spin it as a joke.

    Will be ignoring him from now on.

  137. Schrödinger's cat says:

    Very disappointed with Indy live Liz

  138. X_Sticks says:

    Chill, Schrödinger’s cat. Del is on our side. If you had seen the confrontations he has with Murphy on a couple of occasions (all video’d) you’d understand where he’s coming from.

    Meeting Murphy was a spontaneous thing not planned. Del just took advantage of that to challenge Smurphy. He will be a fifth column in the labour party and I look forward to hearing how long he’ll last at a meeting before they chuck him out.

  139. Schrödinger's cat says:

    This will be spun and spun – Murphy reaching out to Yes is working etc etc.

    He will be on the front page of the retard, labours new convert
    I don’t mind him being an idiot but he is damaging the yes campaign

  140. Schrödinger's cat says:

    Fair doos x sticks, but he should have given social media the heads up before he did this, all he has achieved is a pr coup for slab

    They will rescind his membership in a couple of days and that won’t be reported in the DR. All he has achieved is making the Indy media look stupid

  141. Flower of Scotland says:

    @Alex Clark@11.57pm

    Me too!

  142. Alex Clark says:

    Just watched Valeries link. Hahaha

    Derek you cunt. You better get every penny’s worth of that pound you paid or you will not be able to walk any street in Scotland again!

    PS thistle can you reign him in lol.

  143. liz says:

    @X_sticks – I disagree, he cant be a fifth columnist since his face is all over social media.

    If he thinks he can play Murphy he’s fooling himself.

    His explanation looked rushed and nervous, if he didn’t realise Murphy would be delighted by this, he is very naïve.

    I agree with Schrodinger’s cat – Murphy will spin this for days.

  144. boris says:

    In some places it was estimated in the two months run up to the 2010 referendum that approximately 80% of the Scottish electorate had tuned into national television (BBC, ITV Channels, 4 and 5) for their election coverage. Post election research identified complaints from viewers primarily centred around a lack of adequate coverage of important Scottish issues, the bulk of prime time reporting and or discussion being aimed at UK matters. Biased programme presentation and interviewer, in favour of the Labour party also attracted many voters and political party candidates and leaders concerns.


  145. liz says:

    @Alex Clarke – I think this happened before.

    If I use google chrome it takes forever for stuff to post but if I use internet explorer, everything comes up instantly including other folk’s posts and I can see them saying where is my post etc.

    Don’t know the reason but it appears to be something to do with service provider

  146. Barontorc says:

    Chill people! If it wasn’t this scenario it would just have been something else. The Murphy Circus is just a pathological purpose built screwball machine.

    Nicola stuffed SLAB today at least four times for joining the Tories hallelujah chorus for more punishment of the poorest – yet nary a mention from Toodloo the Noo as he desperately tried to say anything that would divert SLAB shame – yep, the oil ‘crisis’ just about fitted his bill.

    Nicola’s whole demeanour today as she slowly rose to her feet in what looked like disgust for SLAB said it all. There’s just nothing left of SLAB to like and even their own died in the wool supporters must be absolutely beelin! A horrendous bunch of cretins.

  147. HandandShrimp says:

    If Yes people starting joining the very small Labour Party groups it would be only a matter of time before accusations of entryism were raised and the new members suspended like the Union members at Falkirk or the issue with Militant back in the 80s.

    Murphy was less than honest though, clearly he has encountered Del before.

  148. crazycat says:

    @ tartanarse

    Indeed you didn’t say he was right, but you said he might be right, and I took that to refer to everything he said, not just one bit of it, since it followed an assertion that he could say what he wants (with which I agree). If you were only referring to whether the conviction was correct, then of course I don’t know, but Kenny was still far too close to victim-blaming for my liking.

    He can say what he wants, and I can call him out on it, but enough time has probably been devoted to this, by third parties like you and me, without any real gain, so I’ll shut up.

  149. Schrödinger's cat says:

    I use a number of different pcs to post here, iMac, iPad,windows7 and 8 Linux Ubuntu 14.04
    They all have different issues and problems with timing etc.
    The problem maybe related to dos attacks as reported, but many are to do with the os and browser you use, and as such are not within the revs power to solve

  150. Regarding this badgewearing bloke. People in his line of work have always got one eye on the next move. Badge or no badge.

  151. Valerie says:

    C’mon guys, be fair to Derek, he works bloody hard to bring us vids from loads of events.

    My understanding of his Indy background is he came to the party late, realised the lack of reporting of events, supported Indy, and really wanted to do something, so got off his butt.

    He got the idea of joining from here, he wants to go along to The Gravedigger’s branch etc, and why not.

    On that link above, he says he is gob smacked at the bare faced cheek of Murphy etc. to lie to his face about his voting.

    Derek is legit, I’m sure of it.

  152. Alex Clark says:

    I;m very happy with Indy Live. They bring something that nobody else does. He, Derek that is ststes clearly why he paid his pound to the Labour party.

    He is moving to live in Jim Murphy’s constituency and wanted inside info. That’s worth a quid, guess he’s fucked now though eh!

  153. Schrödinger's cat says:

    I don’t doubt his commitment just his methods
    His actions made him look clever but everyone else look stupid
    Indy live was for reporting the news the MSM didn’t, not become the news nor part of the slab propaganda campaign

  154. Alex Clark says:

    Derek is one of the good guys.

    How many of you would get off your fat arses and go and stick a camera in an ugly face like Jim Murphy’s?

    Well he has done and more, covering events in George Square etc. Not just so we could watch them LIVE but now anyone can watch them forever.

    It’s easy to sit on the settee and type on your keyboard.

    Not so easy to get out there and try to make a difference is it? The guys at Indy Live who earn basically fuck all have my respect.

    Gie Derek a break.

  155. K1 says:

    I think delboy has taken Stu’s article too much to heart and who knows maybe others did too? The fact that within a few days of this article the fates aligned and Del couldn’t resist the temptation to tell Murphy that he’d joined is I think his genuine naivety in this instance.

    He’s completely not ‘thought’ (even though his previous encounters with Murphy more than inform him of his character), that Murphy would of course advertise this loudly. Del, you are actually very well known in the indy movement, you gave Murphy a coup.

    I think Del as you describe in your reasoning that you are ‘having fun’ with this but also you’ve underestimated the impact. Because Murphy was always going to use any opportunity to say that ‘inroads’ are being made and he’s used you in this capacity.

    I don’t think Del should be maligned for this, I’m inclined to give someone who committed so much of his time and energies throughout the campaign for independence, the benefit of the doubt in this instance.

  156. Chic McGregor says:

    I am he as you are he as you are me
    And we are all together
    See how they run like pigs from a gun see how they fly
    I’m crying

    Sitting on a cornflake waiting for the van to come
    Corporation teeshirt, stupid bloody Tuesday
    Man you been a naughty boy. You let your face grow long
    I am the eggman, they are the yesmen
    I am the wally, goo goo goo tube

  157. hetty says:

    No to the death penalty, it is not the answer to fighting crime and reducing offenders, but it does appeal to those wanting revenge. Far too many were executed who were innocent, it is akways a risk, and a large proportion of those in prison have some kind of learning disability, too many.

    Actually my sons friend was just saying this week that his dad gets so shouty and angry at the news, and says things like, ‘bring back hanging’! I did ask why he watches the news, then it occured to me, how manipulative the msm is in encouraging hatred, let’s just hope we are not voted out of the EU, brrrrrrrr

  158. Schrödinger's cat says:

    Plenty folk here got of their fat arses and are still doing so, I know they earn fuck all which is why I crowd fund them and am willing to give them a break. I just hope the MSM will also give them a break……..

    He would have been better not to post the latest video admitting he was the yes labour man. Indy live risks getting slaughtered by both sides. That serves no one

  159. manandboy says:

    With 4 months to go in Indy Ref, we had no idea what McTernan’s strategy was. Except it came from Quebec.

    With 4 months to go in GE15, we have no idea what McTernan’s strategy is. Except it comes from Moscow.

    Here’s hoping we can prise our attention away from his many entertaining distractions long enough to work out what his plan is.

    Otherwise, he might go 2-0 up.

    Are you listening, Scotland?

  160. Alex Clark says:


    You are right. Nothing is more important than the GE in 4 months time.

    @Schrödinger’s cat

    I beg to differ, he posted the video that clearly supports his view. He did meet Jim Murphy for the third time, be it accidentally and described their previous meetings.

    He also explained why he paid a pound to join the Labour party.

    FFS He read it on WINGS suggesting he do exactly that. Whats your problem?

  161. CameronB Brodie says:

    The reintroduction of the death penalty would certainly constitute a wedge issue, IMO, in more ways than one. Not only does it not allow much room for political compromise, it would also significantly change the power relationship between state and individual. That might be all fine and dandy now, but what about the future? I don’t think it particularly farsighted to welcome such absolute state power, as we enter a future promising deepening economic and environmental pressures.

    It would be a regressive set at precisely the wrong time, as far as I’m concerned. World’s Top Five nations, by number of executions – China, Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia and the USA.

  162. The Man in the Jar says:

    I have a jacket with 1008 Yes badges on it!

  163. CRAIGthePICT says:

    Glad to see most people supporting Derek at indie live and not getting carried away. I am frequent visitor to their streams and the service they provide is still ridiculously undervalued and under-subscribed.

    These guys step up to the mark and do their bit to show events that otherwise go completely ignored. Instead they can be viewed by this who are interested and they are stored for posterity. I can assure you I have gained many a valuable insight thanks to their work.

    He joined SLAB for the right reasons, he has an honesty policy and merely wanted to expose more truth, whatever that may be, although now he will be lucky to get in the door without a disguise. Btw, how many of you follow the DR, Labour, the Scotsman on twitter, how many of you visit the BBC website, how many still pay the licence, how many of you still shop in the co-op, buy Tunnocks tea cakes?

    Murphy gains nowt over this and actually is already the one looking a bit daft (again) having tried to make capital out out of half a story. He has brought attention to this because he was so excited he found one person in Scotland to sign up to SLAB for £1, but it turns out this one person wanted to find out what makes these liars tick and expose them. It’s hilarious, you could not make it up. I might stick it on The Scottish Statesman tomorrow.

    Keep up the good work independence live. It’s important.

  164. CameronB Brodie says:

    Cornflake, cornflake, cornflake, cornflake, cornflake, cornflake, CONFLICTED! 😉

  165. yesindyref2 says:

    I was in a shop in the north-west last summer, a fine sunny day too, saw a face I recognised and said “hi, how’s it going?” as one does. He said Hi back. Pleasant guy. Then I realised it was that arch-enemy of Indy, Danny Alexander. That’s me off the YES Christmas card list then.

    So some guy gives Murphy some dodgy ammo as a joke, which Murphy’s been foolish enough to use, so what?

  166. thoughtsofascot says:

    I figure that you would probably get very similar responses over here in South Korea too. These responses are just humans being humans. Irresponsible, reactionary douchebag is a very human trait, after all.

  167. Owen says:

    I dont think the death penalty should be brought back because there are to many fuck ups with evidence.You hear of all these people that have been sent to prison and let out because they got evidence mixed up. But it’s to late you’ve just ruined some guy or woman’s life.

  168. X_Sticks says:

    Ah, yes, the death penalty.

    Firmly opposed to it due to miscarriages of justice. It can’t be undone.

    I could possibly be persuaded to introduce it for international war criminals such as Bush, Blair and co.

    Then again I’d rather put them in a cage and allow people to poke them with sharp sticks.

  169. steveasaneilean says:

    Disppointed but not surprised by the lack of “progressiveness” even in Scotland. Really we ought to be better than this if we want to lead by example in the world.

    With capital punishment, the real issue there is that it is anti-justice and all about retribution. The mark of any good society and any good legal system is that any punishment can be reveresed or pardoned if the conviction is subsequently found to be unsafe or simply wrong.

    Capital punishment by definition precludes such reversal and is therefore wrong.

  170. gerry parker says:

    Well done Derek. You can always resign in disgust in May 2015.


  171. john king says:

    Ken like says
    “I am not, nor to the best of my knowledge have I ever been, a genocidal maniac.”

    PHEW I was getting worried. 🙂

    Devorgilla says
    “Manand boy makes a good point. If the public can’t be trusted on hanging, is their wisdom reliable on assisted suicide. I don’t think it is.”

    I think we all are subject (some more than others to be fair) to our baser instincts taking over from our intellectual understanding of society, and we are inclined to the herd instinct of retribution, that should result should not surprise anyone, and your right devorgilla we need cooler more analytical heads to make this decision at least they HAVE got that right.

    We just have to look at the case of Derek Bentley to see just how febrile public opinion at at a time of anger and grief can be the boy(19) was granted a full pardon in 1998,
    not a lot of good to him though since they hanged him in 1953

    But by the same token we need to be assured that police “rules of engagement” are robust or we simply allow the armed cop to be judge and jury for us and that in turn salves our conscience since we accept what we are told and the suspect gave them no choice but to open fire,

    The police we should remember were found guilty of nothing more than a breach of the “health and safety act”
    Croompenstien says
    “Has Skeletor been on the f*ckin Hogwart’s Express or just the drugs!!

    did you see this response to him croompy?
    “I’d rather live the rest of my life breathing the farts of people who ate a million Brussels Sprouts.”

    Ian Brotherhood says
    “Did you meet anyone, even at the height of the campaign, who had that many? ”

    Eh, Xsticks
    Ah’ll get ma Saltire. 🙁

    Schrodingers cay says
    “Only “la petite mort” Paula ”

    Ma porridge fir goads sake. 🙁

    Tartan eh bottom
    “This Yesser more than likely gave Jim the crim a pound just to fuck off,”

    Whoohahahahahaha 🙂

    Turns out you were spot on with your paying Jim a pound to fuck of tartanarse,
    Del is one of us guys,
    good or bad decision who cares,
    so Smugurphy uses it to make the yes camp look like we can be bought off,

    Well let him think that more fool him,
    you go to the meetings Del and make that bastards life a misery.
    Chic Mcgregor @12.55

    I think you’ve got something there I would get that down on vinyl if I were you. 🙂
    Schrodingers cat says
    “He would have been better not to post the latest video admitting he was the yes labour man. Indy live risks getting slaughtered by both sides. That serves no one”

    I would imagine he came out because some people on here were in danger of making total twats of themselves,
    jus sayin s’all.

    Alex says
    “Derek you cunt. You better get every penny’s worth of that pound you paid or you will not be able to walk any street in Scotland again!

    PS thistle can you reign him in lol.”

    Aaannnnd cut
    get that in the can,
    Alex has covered it in a paragraph,
    and of course he’s right, you ARE a cunt 🙂
    noo aboot that stonin,
    chuckies or hauf bricks
    state your preference Deek
    Now, moving on!
    Liz says
    “If he thinks he can play Murphy he’s fooling himself.”

    Of course your right Liz,
    I tried to take him down in Kirkcaldy (when he got his 20 second 3 egg omelette)
    and he saw right through my (innocent sans yes badges question) and ate me up like a tofu salad. 🙁

    CRAIGthePICT says
    ” although now he will be lucky to get in the door without a disguise.

    like this you mean?

    yesindieref2 says
    “I was in a shop in the north-west last summer, a fine sunny day too, saw a face I recognised and said “hi, how’s it going?” as one does. He said Hi back. Pleasant guy. Then I realised it was that arch-enemy of Indy, Danny Alexander. That’s me off the YES Christmas card list then.”

    I remember walking down the Strand (as you do) in London many years ago and I passed these two people who stared at me all the way past me then looked over their shoulders at me as they walked on, I remember thinking “who the hell do you think your looking at” it seemed from their reaction the thought they knew me, I on the other hand hadn’t a scoobie who they were, and after a while passing the Adelphi theater I saw a poster advertising the current farce and had a eureka moment when I realized it was John Alderton and Pauline Collins.
    nosey bastards!

    ps at the time the Yorkshire Ripper had just been apprehended and I had a full beard which the wife hated and said it made me look like — well you get the picture.
    true story.

  172. Fred says:

    A big vote for the hingin. Who would be up for doing the business though? could you?

  173. Gary says:

    This poll has been a revealing insight into polling as much as the opinions gathered. What it can’t tell us is the DEPTH of feeling on such matters in such questions where it is simply a yes/no answer, ie would it change which party they voted for. I also believe wording to be crucial, eg using ‘reintroduce’ instead of ‘introduce’ as capital punishment has been gone for nigh on half a century.

  174. Conan the Destroyer says:

    Evans is allow to play football. He just needs to find.a club that thinks employing him makes commercial sense. Don’t fancy his chances.

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