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Wings Over Scotland

All your ducks in a row

Posted on March 05, 2014 by

We’ve been known to remark from time to time that “Better Together” often has a little trouble getting its scare stories straight. “You won’t be allowed into the EU!” somehow manages to co-exist with “You’ll have to join the Euro!”, while “You wouldn’t be able to bail out the banks!” runs right alongside “All the banks will leave!”

So we take our hats well and truly off to all concerned for helpfully jamming them all together into one big mad super-scare today.


Magnificent work. Yes, according to the BBC’s Robert Peston today, EU law (which Scotland would seemingly be subject to even though it wasn’t in the EU) might compel RBS and Lloyds to move to England (even though, as Peston goes on to note, both Lloyds Bank and Lloyds Banking Group are, um, already headquartered in London).

Presumably, even though all were based in London, Scotland would still somehow be required (and unable) to bail them out if they crashed again (even though that’s not how bank bailouts work), even if we offered to do it in Euros (which we’d have to have, even though we’re not allowed to even if we wanted to, which we don’t), and, um, apparently that’s why we can’t have a currency union.

Imagine for a moment, readers, that Scotland had a media even a tiny bit interested in pulling this comical farrago of contradictory lies apart and exposing it for the lunatic drivel it is. What a fine and crazy world that’d be to live and die in, eh?

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160 to “All your ducks in a row”

  1. Lee says:

    I tweeted earlier I was completely confused today. Apparently record investment but everyone will leave if yes.

  2. TheGreatBaldo says:

    The thing in that Peston report, that jumped out and smacked me in the face was this sentence

    “…which is seen by many to have dealt the greatest blow to Mr Salmond’s separatist ambitions.”

    Not ‘The Scottish Governments independence ambitions’ which would have been balanced, accurate and in keeping with BBC Editorial standards (and traditions) regarding impartiality.

    But a phrase used exclusively by the NO campaign to describe their opponents.

    Funny that eh?

  3. JohnB says:

    What a hoot! Such an amateur attempt at scaring!

    I thought the UK BBC 6pm News presenter was trying with difficulty to keep a straight face.

  4. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

    Huge difference between tonight’s Better Together campaigning report on BBC Scotland TV news, and the good piece last night on the YES grass-roots campaign.
    It looked like all Better Together have on the streets are to Councillor duffers (1 x Lib Dem + 1 x “Scottish” Labour).

    Back at the Death Star Darth McDougall speaks darkly, spookily and slightly threateningly along the lines of “we know where you are” (like they have borrowed the TV Detector-VAN database).

    If you are a DON’T KNOW, then know this … you are going to get a letter from Darth.

    Feel the farce …

  5. the Penman says:

    @TheGreatBaldo – ah, but that’s not biased, that’s just what everyone says. Everyone that Peston hangs around with, anyway. So obviously no bias there.

  6. Jimmy The Pict says:

    New BT catch phrase

    “May the Farce Be With You”

  7. rab_the_doubter says:


    Just wondering about the data protection issues that might be raised by BT’s Patriot Software. I know that I haven’t given them permission to hold any of my information.

  8. G H Graham says:

    And this guy, Peston has the nerve to draw a salary from the BBC because he claims to be a ‘Business Editor’.

    But why should he care or indeed the BBC when their objective has been met; obscure rational, logical reality with obfuscation, myths, contradiction & blatant lies.

    It matters not, that barely a sentence in this pieces makes any sense because it, without any hint of irony is in an argument with itself.

    Readers constrained by time or commitment conflicts will simply be expected to recall the alarming words & phrases, designed to promote fear & doubt. This is how propaganda works & this is an excellent example of it.

    And when the British State via the BBC has almost unlimited access right into our homes via the telly & radio it should come as no surprise that there is a large portion of the electorate who believe what they are being told.

    Dictators & despots around the world must marvel at the ease with which the British State maintains a subservient audience without having to fire a single shot.

  9. john king says:

    I even saw Douglas Fraser go into meltdown trying to spin that one,
    I took malicious pleasure watching his head explode!
    his poor wife 🙁

  10. heedtracker says:

    Peston- noun (propaganda, BBC) extremely irritating noise emanating from tv and radio. Use in sentence- why the hell should I pay for this annoying peston, dear tv licence man?

  11. Marian says:

    All you need to know is that Robert Peston has built his career as a BBC reporter upon being the willing mouthpiece of whoever is in charge at Westminster.

  12. john king says:

    “Just wondering about the data protection issues that might be raised by BT’s Patriot Software. I know that I haven’t given them permission to hold any of my information.”

    Ooh, class action law suit,
    I wonder who could fund such a thing?
    any ideas rev? 🙂

  13. Matt Macpherson says:

    I recently donated the occasional donated £10.00 to “wings” . As a pensioner it’s about all i can do now and then. Thanks for all your work on behalf of Scotland. Matt

  14. Bill Walters says:

    “EU law (which Scotland would seemingly be subject to even though it wasn’t in the EU)”

    I think there’s a bit of a misunderstanding here – the way an EU directive works is that it sets a date by which member states need to introduce national legislation to cover the items listed in the directive. In this case the deadline was 18 July 1996. So EU law is also our law in this case – as it is with any EU directive. We don’t suddenly strike this legislation off the books if we leave the EU, it’s part of our own legal system.

  15. call me dave says:

    The ‘NO’ have reached the stage where they have got too many plates spinning on these canes. It had to happen, it will all come crashing down shortly.

    Good summary above.

  16. MD says:


    If I were undecided the threat of a letter rom Bitter Together might be enough to push me to Yes.

  17. starlaw says:

    Better together sending out 800,000 begging letters cos they know who you are . Be afraid , be very very afraid

  18. G H Graham says:

    Bill Walters,

    If we are not in the EU as the Unionist camp keeps warning us after independence, we can legislate whatever we want.

    Got anything positive that might come about as a result of clinging on to a near bankrupt Britain?

  19. Loved BBC news at 6 telling us our banks would move to London “within hours of a yes vote” why the rush?

  20. Doug Daniel says:

    Listening to Derek Bateman speaking about the Wings fundraiser on the latest For A’ That podcast, he made it so clear what a truly bizarre situation Scotland is in. The fundraiser just proves that we’re so starved of any media organ that actually speaks for us and puts across the other side of the argument.

  21. GrahamB says:

    No real surprise from Peston, his father is a Labour peer.

  22. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “I recently donated the occasional donated £10.00 to “wings” . As a pensioner it’s about all i can do now and then.”

    Every penny cherished, Matt. Cheers!

  23. Paula Rose says:

    Ooh please I want a BT activist begging on their knees in front of me!

  24. Training Day says:

    Peston reminds one more and more of Josef Goebbels, both physically and in his disregard for the truth.

    Alas, none of our media will point out the absurdity of this. Indeed, BBC Radio Scotland has just delivered the story on the news without a hint of shame, supplemented with comment from HelpmeRhona Carmichael.

    BT is the MSM, the MSM is BT.

  25. Schiehallion! Schiehallion! says:

    Peston you may fancy yourself a serious-looking dude with your stern face and shirt undone. But you’re just a poor wee slavey like the rest of the nasty BBC.

  26. Mike Ramsay says:

    Of course the headline suggest the banks will ‘become English’…certainly based in London if his doom-laden portent is accurate…but wouldn’t they simply remain British (as they currently are)…unless Scottish independence results in total rumpUK meltdown, of course?

  27. Jim T says:


    have a look here:

    don’t get over excited until you’ve also looked at the Yes Scotland entry and done a compare and contrast.

  28. heedtracker says:

    More from Robert

    “A banker said: “Salmond will never say this publicly, but he is bound to regard the depoliticisation of where we base ourselves as a good thing. He would no longer have the risk of picking up a big bill for us, if everything went belly up again”

    Non BBCpropagandist/journalist questions might be,

    what do you mean “if” Mr Bankster?

    and, teamGB is now approaching £2 trillion in national debt let alone deficit, if/when banks go “belly” up again, how is teamGB going to bail you out like last time?

    also, Mr bankster you got very rich last time banks went “belly” up with clear evidence of massive City bank fraud, how come no bankster has ever been taken to court let alone prosecuted?

  29. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

    @MD says:
    If I were undecided the threat of a letter rom Bitter Together might be enough to push me to Yes.

    That’s what I was thinking, watching their scary “we know who you are” approach.

  30. GrahamB says:

    Latest insult from the BBC, the Poland v Scotland online commentary is not on BBC Scotland Sport but on the main site lumped in with the other ‘home’ nations reports. No doubt we’ll get 8.4% of the text allocation.

  31. Claire McNab says:

    I try not to be a pedant, but I can no longer restrain myself. The mis-spelling of the name of the anti-Union campaign is just too grating.


    The second letter is “I” or (“i” if you are in a lowercase mood). 9th letter of the alphabet, between h and j. On your key board, it’s between “u” and “o”.

    Some people are typing “e” as the second letter.

  32. Helpmaboab says:

    I honestly admire the unionists’ ability to believe so many contradictory ideas at once.

    Doublethink is now obsolete. We are witnessing the birth of polythink.

  33. Gordon Anderson says:

    If I get a letter (which I doubt) I will be asking where and how they got this information about my voting preferences. As someone mentioned before surely this is a data protection issue!

  34. Jim T says:

    If you want to get BT to provide you with the data they hold on you they are legally entitled to charge £10 a pop. Another money spinner. Grrrrr

  35. Jack Sloan says:

    Wings asks us to imagine that Scotland had a media interested in pulling this and other farragoes of lies apart. Thankfully it has at least got the internet with sites like Wings, Newsnet, Bateman and Bella!
    (Can we crowdfund an internet TV channel?)

  36. john king says:

    “Peston- noun (propaganda, BBC) extremely irritating noise emanating from tv and radio. Use in sentence- why the hell should I pay for this annoying peston, dear tv licence man?”

    Damn that non existent like button 🙁
    cover your ears Morag. 🙂

  37. Jim T says:

    here’s the page on the ico website indicating charges for requesting information:

  38. mogabee says:

    Even for £50 I couldn’t tell you!

  39. Claire McNab says:

    @Gordon Anderson

    If you do get a begging letter from Bitter Together, rejoice. In a small way.

    They have just wasted some of their funds sending you a free firelighter. That means less cash in their pockets for mischief-making.

  40. john king says:

    “We don’t suddenly strike this legislation off the books if we leave the EU, it’s part of our own legal system.”

    Because when your being shown the door (not) you are going to adhere to EU laws (not)

  41. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Oops, spot the community idiot! 🙂

    I posted this on the wrong article…DOH! 🙂

    I think that this excerpt I do not think that Standard and Poors would consider the idea of Lloyd’s and RBS relocating to London to be a major problem, in fact if I understand this extract correctly they would see it as a bonus to Scottish independence.

    The composition of Scotland’s external balance sheet is as yet hypothetical, but our initial observation is that the Scottish financial sector is unusually large, with total assets estimated at 12.5x GDP. We would therefore likely view the financial sector as a significant contingent risk to the state. At the same time, a large part of this activity could be re-domiciled to the U.K.

  42. Jim T says:

    If you do get an unwanted begging letter, feel free to send it back to them in an UNSTAMPED envelope.

  43. Lorna Binnie says:

    I am astonished! – what can I say – what about banks like HSBC – they are global – where is their headquarters?

  44. Tartan Tory says:

    Hold on guys…. This is great news!

    Robert Peston/BBC wrote:

    And, on balance, it may be that the automatic nature of relocation to England would be worse for the pro-union campaign – because it means the financial risks of a monetary union with Scotland would be reduced.

    Bang goes Osborne’s rationalle for no currency union! 🙂

  45. bunter says:

    I really think its long overdue that we give the BBC our full attention, now we have resources to hand.

    Its not as if we don’t have the ammo, EU misrepresentation and the UWS report come to mind, and that’s for starters.

    I personally would contribute further funds, ring fenced, for dealing with this particular vile organisation. Really quite keen on a poster campaign highlighting the BBC and pointing folks to this site for further details.

    We could call it ”Operation Bannockburn”.

  46. Tearlach says:

    Sorry folks, but this is a good news story. The Standard and Poors report last week, highlighting Scotland’s economic strength, but noting an over reliance on the financial sector.

    “The composition of Scotland’s external balance sheet is as yet hypothetical, but our initial observation is that the Scottish financial sector is unusually large, with total assets estimated at 12.5x GDP. We would therefore likely view the financial sector as a significant contingent risk to the state. At the same time, a large part of this activity could be re-domiciled to the UK.”

    So Scotland could be better off loosing a couple of banks….

  47. Tess o says:

    Oh how I would love to walk into the bbc scotland headquarters the day after independence is gained with a huge pile of p45s and a list of all the journalists who wrote or approved crap like this……

  48. Capella says:

    I think one way to deal with this type of misinformation would be to produce a series of posters with simple, clear graphics showing, for example, the creation and distribution of wealth in the UK, the disparity in life expectancy in the UK, the contribution of Scotland to the UK Treasury and the amount spent in Scotland, Scotland’s ranking in OECD tables etc. There already are some examples of this type of clear visual presentation scattered around the blogs such as which might be useful to local campaign groups. But people without internet access are unlikely to be aware of this and rely on the MSM.

  49. Tearlach says:

    O/T (but 44 posts in I think it’s OK) First Yes Caithness meeting in the Weigh Inn, Thurso Friday the 7th March at 7:00pm

  50. CameronB says:

    OK pop pickers, I got a request in from both Better Together and the BBC. Now there’s a surprise. Anyway, taking us all the way back to one of the original pioneers of the electric guitar, here’s George Barnes with Spooky.

    Get that talk on the floor folks. 🙂

  51. MajorBloodnok says:

    Bill Walters says:“EU law (which Scotland would seemingly be subject to even though it wasn’t in the EU)”

    I think there’s a bit of a misunderstanding here – the way an EU directive works is that it sets a date by which member states need to introduce national legislation to cover the items listed in the directive. In this case the deadline was 18 July 1996. So EU law is also our law in this case – as it is with any EU directive. We don’t suddenly strike this legislation off the books if we leave the EU, it’s part of our own legal system.

    Yes Bill, you’re right. Apart from one detail. As financial regulation is not a devolved matter then it follows that this Directive has been translated into UK law, not Scots law, and it is therefore a moot point whether such legislation would continue to apply in an independent Scotland should we be forcibly evicted from the EU for daring to exercise our democratic right to self-determination.

  52. CameronB says:

    Talcum powder….doh.

  53. Andrew Morton says:

    Agree re sending their letter back in an unstamped envelope.

    I also suggest that if they do move south, we should all switch our accounts to the Airdrie Savings Bank.

  54. handclapping says:

    Dunno Rev, that’s Croc’d me?

  55. gordoz says:

    They may take our lives, but they’ll never take our…

    Haud oan; actually, aye on ye go; take control of the toxic banks & the associated debt if yer that daft. Rattle on guys.

    Aye and yer welcome tae Standard life, Weir Pumps the Krankies & Barrrowman n aw if yer that thick good riddance !

    Parcel o’ fuds

  56. HandandShrimp says:

    I have read the Peston piece and I am not sure what he is trying to say. He seems bored by the whole thing and as far as I can tell he seems to be suggesting, as Standard and Poor did, that these banks moving their name plates would be a good thing for Scotland and at the same time he seem to have a half-hearted compulsion to go “Woooooo it is all scary”

    I thought Carmichael on the radio tonight was talking the usual overblown Better Together nonsense but he is not exactly a financial heavyweight.

  57. gordoz says:

    @Jack Sloan

    Im for that and think it would get a big take up, all accross Scotland.

    50% of folks are fed up with propaganda of State Broadcaster and support services such as STV.

    I think this would raise even more funds – anybody with expertise ?

  58. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    Bunter at 7.56

    With you on that, . But I’d pick a newspaper as well (the utterly incoherent Express would do for a start, then the Mail) and run a campaign pouring scorn and ridicule on it.

  59. Jon D says:

    O/T totally, apologies, but…

    Graeme Obree, World Champion Scottish cyclist is campaigning to ensure that Ugandan politicians who backed the anti-gay bill are not invited to the 2014 Commonwealth Games.

    These are the values that a Scotland, independent or otherwise, surely espouses

    Sign his petition here

  60. Calgacus MacAndrews says:

    @CameronB says:
    Talcum powder….doh.

    Is that Ronnie’s talcum powder?

  61. Ken MacColl says:

    Now listen up you people!
    There is simply far too much levity in the ranks.
    Much more of this sort of talk and you might find that Prince Edward will not be allowed to visit Glasgow when your games thingy is on, or, we could apply the ultimate sanction and not let you shop at Harrods.
    Both of those quite frightful possibilities have been flagged up today in the HoC, by the way, just in case you might imagine that we are bluffing.

  62. CameronB says:

    Calgacus MacAndrews
    Shhh! 🙂

  63. Papadox says:

    Peston shows distinctive signs of genetic regression, the fact his pater is in the House of Lords seems to add some weight to this theory. The Anti Scottish attitude he shows and propensity to talk utter shite makes him standard EBC issue. Think he might get fast tracked through the EBC management ladder to take over from Mcquarry (PQ) when he is elevated up to sit next to pistons papa, for destroying EBC Scotlandshire and insulting all the dumb jocks.

    The proud pseudo middle class Scots thank them both for the insults and congratulations on their well earned pump up the greasy pole.

  64. MajorBloodnok says:

    @Ken MacColl

    Forget not being allowed into Harrods, it’s Haddows I’d be more worried about.

  65. Tam Jardine says:

    so… let me get this straight. All European banks need to be not just headquartered but also registered in the country where they carry out the majority (51% I presume) of their activities? And what about banks operating outwith the eu headquartered in the eu? Or registered in the eu? Or headquartered outwith the eu operating mostly in the eu? Some examples?

    Acht- never mind all that ‘journalism’ – scary headline achieved, job done. Never mind, as Stuart points out, the whole thing is just pure drivel, absolutely risible coming from an educated man working for our ‘impartial’ state broadcaster. Training day mentioned Goebbels- Goebbels would have been proud of the no campaign. It would have impressed him.

    Has anyone, any single soul accused the BBC of bias TOWARDS the Yes campaign as would be consistent with a balanced, impartial reporting?

    Next time we hold a referendum, or an election in the UK can we get some observers in from Zimbabwe to make sure everything is on the level?

  66. Arbroath 1320 says:

    I wonder how this wee article fits into the idea of RBS and Lloyd’s being “Scottish”. Would Darling still consider Barclay’s being British?

  67. Rick Guthrie says:

    All Lloyds Scottish account holders were moved to the TSB lasy year.

  68. Ian Brotherhood says:

    re: ‘Lights, camel, action!’

    Is it this?

  69. gordoz says:


    Think No Scotland got their money’s worth out of the latest Ipsos Mori poll ?

    Christ never heard so much shit get regurgitated so often.
    Its now the ‘in poll’ of choice as it has halted yes progress, (stone dead as per The baron Bobertson??) .. we’ll see.

    Well done STV & BBC; keep it up we have long memories and will remember guys.

    10 yrs from now – spare change for a poor journalist sir ?

    What do you think ??

  70. Angle Grinder says:

    In – Out – In – Out – Shake it all about,
    Do the UK-OK and turn around.
    That’s what’s it all about… OIL!

  71. ScotFree1320 says:

    It’s such a poor attempt at propaganda as to be laughable. These people really do think we button up the back. The most basic research shows the lie:

    Unico Banking GroupHQ in Brussels, banks throughout Europe.

    Danske BankBased in Copenhagen, operates throughout Europe.

    The BBC in Scotland should be abolished within hours of a Yes vote. And there is a great need for a rush!

  72. Steve Bowers says:

    Ok very important, if/when you get a letter from BT, simply pop in a menu from a local takeaway ( of your choice, I like to keep a selection for just such occasions ) and post said pre paid envelope back to them, if you throw it in the bucket it costs them nothing but they have to pay the postage if you send it back, not only does this keep our wonderful Posties in work ( I really mean that by the way, our one is brilliant as I frequently tell her whilst handing over a bottle of wine )but it will also tits off BT when they open said envelope anticipating delightful goodies. Win/win i’d say

  73. The Flamster says:

    Lady Alba – Gaga for Indy 🙂

  74. gordoz says:

    Check this out for a laugh
    by Lady Alba

  75. Mary Bruce says:

    O/T Today 58.9% of pupils at Dornoch Academy voted yes to Scottish independence in a mock referendum.

    Now, it appears that all the pupils in the school voted, not just the seniors, so they won’t all be eligible to vote for real in the referendum. However, this result is clear evidence that despite all the fear mongering, lies and biased reporting in the MSM, the positive message is reaching the people of Scotland.

    I genuinely believe that the scare stories just aren’t working any more. Well done young people of Dornoch.

  76. The Rough Bounds says:

    The really bad thing about all these ridiculous scare stories is what they are doing to the psyche of Scottish society.

    They are poisoning peoples minds and no matter how it goes in the referendum this country will never be the same again.

    Instead of having a square go with us they have used every underhand trick in the book and this experience shows we can never trust them again. It’s the difference between having a fist fight in school then shaking hands after it, and having a big thug pretend he’s going to have a fair fight then coming at you with a knife and hob-nailed boots and getting his thick pals to hold your arms behind your back.

    Britain and the British? Lying, cheating, deceitful bastards.

  77. cynicalHighlander says:

    Peston is a financial wonk who peddles what the City of London financial centre wants to hiding their internal corrupt practices out of sight with the hope of a lucrative directorship in the future. Stephanie Flanders was far more on the ball which is why the City gave her a lucrative job outside the media as they saw the damage that she could of done to them by broadcasting the truth.

  78. Lanarkist says:

    Funnily enough there is a FB page, Exposing anti-independence bias on the BBC, that are raising money for exactly this plan. Hiring space for billboard posters exposing the BBC lies.

    I have notified them of both WOS and YES intentions to carry out the same campaign tactics and may well increase the hoarding rental costs due to pressure on sites available.

    Maybe a co-ordinated campaign, WOS and Expose, could be the way forward.

  79. kininvie says:

    It’s all very well talking to ourselves on this one, but actually the truth or otherwise doesn’t matter.

    I was stopped in the shop tonight by someone I’ve had down as a waverer. “It’s looking very dark for your lot,” was his opening line. “Now that the EU says the banks will move out. And the currency…so much uncertainty…”

    It’s all very well for us to ridicule the contradictions and the lunacy, but many folk just take what they are given without question.

    I didn’t have a lot of time, so I just said. “Hell, where’s your sense of adventure gone?” and left it – for the time being.

  80. call me dave says:

    o/t Just in but.

    goal Scotland!

    try this daily record feed tv.

  81. ronnie anderson says:

    @calucus MacAndrews, thanks Calucus,ah see that CameronB,its the

    Unperformed stuff hes pinched,fur ah good snifter it hus tae be

    Perfumed ( lily of the valley ) lol

  82. TJenny says:

    Angle Grinder – Love it. 🙂

  83. Flooplepoop says:

    This story has been waiting in the sidelines to take heat off other events taking place it would seem.

  84. Papadox says:

    Bank of Ireland will have to move its headquarters to London since it does most of its business there where the hell does Liechtenstein move it’s headquarters to, Danish banks, Belgian banks. Christ it’s like musical chairs. The vessel with the pestle is the brew that is true, awe F*** It.

  85. TJenny says:

    Damn – Sorry Stu – mistyped my email address on last comment. Hope our spiffing new server will mean details are kept.

  86. HandandShrimp says:

    Goodness me Scotland won in Poland. A not too shabby result indeed.

  87. Davy says:

    Last monday night, I think it was then we had the BBC bounching on their seats about some poll saying support for the No campaign had increased, I of course just commented what a load of (f-ing)shite.

    You would have thought by the way the media was reporting it the vote had already taken place. I will of course treat the bollox about the banks with the same distain and swearing.

    Everynight we are going to be treated to some shite or another about how Scotland and everything we stand for is useless and shite. We just have to remember WHO is miscalling us this way, whether they be politcian or presenter/media it does not matter, we will remember.

    We have everything going for us, we have a ground campaign the No’s will never match, we have a YES campaign that we know we can trust, we have a Scottish government totally committed to getting the very best for Scotland both as a people and a country.

    We have the support of a broad church of the people and institutions of Scotland and most importantly we have the truth and each other.

    The No’s can keep the BBC & the rest of the lying media, I’ll stick with the truth and you lot.

  88. Alba4Eva says:

    Brilliant result Handandshrimp… didn’t stop the Daily Record commentators putting Scotland down though… between spemding the last 10 minutes constantly almost praying for a Poland equaliser and the comment on 89 minutes that it was “a poor performance” (WTF?)… Get it right round the Daily Rubbish!

  89. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Think I heard them say HandandShrimp that it was the first time Scotland had won in Poland since 1958. 🙂

  90. Robert Peffers says:

    Aw! Cum oan Folks! Keep the heid! Get a grip an aw that.
    Here’s the legal and logical bit. In the first place the Treaty of Union is a bipartite agreement between KINGDOMS. So, on independence day the United Kingdom disunites and as Westminster was elected by both partner Kingdoms as the United Kingdom’s Parliament and there is no United Kingdom there is no UK parliament. So there is no UK member state of the European Union. As I posted yesterday, what international organisation that the UK is a member of would be daft enough to expel one kingdom of the United Kingdom and thus make an enemy of the other? All these international organs are dedicated to uniting states together for common cause. They are not about to throw out a one state only when all they need do is say – you are both continued members and they keep both, together with the assets and support they brought to that organ to begin with.

  91. ronnie anderson says:

    Noo yous lot behave am gone back tae ma paper foldin

    CameronB go easy on that sniffin, that,s the Morrison,s 99p tin.

  92. call me dave says:


    Danny Kaye. (no relation to call Kaye) Personally never took a liking to Mr Kaye…

  93. tartanfever says:

    BREAKING NEWS : – Robert Peston just reports.

    under an obscure EU directive 95/hatetartan/bt001, Scotland’s victory in Poland tonight has been declared void after it was revealed that most of Scotland’s team plays in England and as such will accrue to the English national team instead.

    When we vote for independence, Hampden will be moved within hours of the declaration (and they’re bloody welcome to it !) 😉

  94. Arbroath 1320 says:


    I never saw that one coming Tartan. EXCELLENT! 🙂

  95. whatastramash says:

    Their scare stories are becoming bloody ludicrous.

  96. Vincent McDee says:

    Best of all the article is the Post Scriptum:

    “PS: If you are interested in the history of this tedious EU directive, which could have such a big impact on the referendum debate, it is commonly known as the post BCCI directive.

    The directed was enacted to make sure that no bank could ever again be run along the lines of the criminal enterprise, BCCI, which had its registered office in Luxembourg, but most of its operations in London – and the Luxembourg regulator simply didn’t have the resources to check what BCCI was up to, and the Bank of England felt it did not have the powers to do so”

  97. CameronB says:

    @ Lady Alba
    Absolutely brilliant. Thanks. 🙂

  98. Truth says:

    Lloyds may be headquartered in London, but I believe they operate under a Scottish banking license, in effect making them a “Scottish” bank. It’s something to do with the Lloyds and TSB merger a decade or so ago.

  99. Diane says:

    Just saw Peston report on 10 o’clock news – he even manages to say “Scotland” with contempt in his voice and “for those that want independence” as if we are the scum of the earth – anger rising! Still Yes will be up a few points after Scotlands win in Poland tonight because that’s how some of the Scottish population roll! Almost want England to do well in the World Cup because the further they get, the more annoying their commentators will be, the more people will vote Yes. Independence could be won by John Motson and Gary Lineker, what a most enjoyable thought, anger subsiding!

  100. Clootie says:

    A region of the UK won in Poland tonight. Not quite as good,

  101. Findlay Farquaharson says:

    awesome lady alba.

  102. HandandShrimp says:


    Shifty things banks but Lloyds is a London institution. Their licence is a port of convenience. I doubt the bankers in Lloyds London rarely if ever think about it. The Bank of Scotland still operates as a separate retail arm of Lloyds though.

  103. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Clootie says:

    A region of the UK won in Poland tonight. Not quite as good,

    Not so’s you’d notice from the BBC headlines at ten o’clock. Apparently only England was playing tonight!

  104. call me dave says:

    Cost cutting at the BBC.
    From the Herald.

    BBC3 set to be axed in latest bout of cost-cutting at BBC
    Wednesday 5 March 2014
    Digital TV channel BBC3 is set to be axed as part of the latest bout of cost-cutting at the corporation.

    The plans will be announced tomorrow but many of its shows, aimed at a younger audience than more mainstream channels, are expected to be transferred directly to the iPlayer.

    There is to be an announcement tomorrow.

  105. gillie says:

    Scotland being fear-bombed by the BBC. Nothing new there.

  106. HandandShrimp says:

    Alistair Darling in that Lady Alba video is really quite disturbing


  107. Wp says:

    Diane, said a few times in the pub “I hope England win the World Cup”, before my mates rip my head off,I explain, “The aftermath would guarantee a Yes vote”

  108. jingly jangly says:

    Guys think about some or your comments, this nonsense that even if we weren’t in the Eu we would still be under EU Law, FFS we would have our own sovereign parliament, we could introduce any freakin law we want and abolish any law we want too.

    This nonsense about banks, every company that is currently registered in England/Wales/NI and trades in Scotland will have to open up a Scottish HQ so that all taxes due in Scotland can be paid to the Scots Exchequer, the same applies for any Scottish registered company that will trade in England/Wales/NI. This does not mean a huge overhead, it costs about £15 to register a company over the web or £100 via snailmail.

    The Accounting Function can be done anywhere on the Globe.
    One Major Oil service company I know does all its Eastern Hemisphere accounting in Malaysia. (Eastern Hemisphere is used by the American’s to mean anywhere between Europe and Australia)

    This is the normal way of things, Do you think that BP doesn’t pay taxes in Belgium for example?

  109. Paul says:

    I dunno, that article seemed relatively even-handed for me. It’s a bit muddled, sure.

    “Presumably, even though all were based in London, Scotland would still somehow be required (and unable) to bail them out if they crashed again.”

    Does he say this? Or is this inferred?

  110. Vincent McDee says:

    Tne Neverending Farce strikes again:

    An international court could arbitrate in disputes between an independent Scotland and the remainder of the UK over the division of assets and liabilities, according to constitutional lawyers.

    Arbitration has been used in previous constitutional rifts including German debt and relations between Britain and post-revolution USA, Edinburgh University professor of public law Alan Boyle said.

    He was backed by Aberdeen University chair in Scottish politics Michael Keating, who agreed that the divisions could end in arbitration…


  111. Linda's back says:

    All the main HQ stuff for Lloyds in done in London already and most of RBS decision making also moved to London.
    They can easily have their HQ in London and still not move more than a handful of jobs due to the cheaper wage costs and overheads in Edinburgh.

    New Banking regulations coming into force also mean that if Lloyds and RBS do move HQ to England they will have to set up new separate subsidiary companies in order to operate in an independent Scotland.

    So we could get our own Bank of Scotland back.

  112. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “Does he say this? Or is this inferred?”

    The point is that “Better Together” are STILL saying we wouldn’t be able to bail out the banks, even though now we’re regularly being told we wouldn’t have any.

  113. CameronB says:

    jingly jangly
    How very dare you bring critical thought into a rigged fight?

  114. tartanfever says:

    Paul –

    What is certainly inferred is that the UK taxpayer bailed out our banks. This has become the biggest lie of recent years to be accepted by nearly everyone in the UK.

    The startling reality is that the UK taxpayer may have put some £70bn into a bank bailout, but the US Federal Reserve, effectively the US Government, put in nearly 9x as much, £640bn.

    This has never been reported by the media in this country, except for the New Statesman in a very short article in Dec 2010.

    This is the shameful truth that Peston, nor anyone at the BBC will ever report. If it hadn’t been for the US Govt., our banks would have been sunk, along with theirs.

  115. Arbroath 1320 says:

    To be honest VM, in my opinion, the threat of an international court getting involved, veiled threat or reality, in arbitration between an independent Scotland and rUK will, I imagine, send shivers up whatever remnants of a backbone Westminster still has.

    I believe that if an international court were to get involved then rUK would be the losers.

  116. jingly jangly says:

    London Evening Standard says FM gave Masterful Performance

  117. Grouse Beater says:

    The torrent of scare stories yesterday and today is a planned swamping of any reporting of Salmond’s New Statesman speech.

    I have no doubt, BBC’s Robert Peston – he of the halting delivery – was slipped the piece of paper while tramping the corridors of power, a whisper, a wink, and off he rushes to the studio to compose his “exclusive,” another “if,” “maybe,” “could,” “possibly,” fabrication purporting to indicate that an “obscure condition of EU membership” states any bank situated in Scotland must relocate to the Isle of Man/Jersey/Cayman Islands immediately post-independence … blah, blah, blah.

    As the taxi driver said this morning, unsolicited, on the way to the airport, “Scotland cannie get any worse off than it is now, so anything that gets us self-governance has to be better.”

  118. bookie from hell says:

    STV 1040pm

    fiscal commission saying Osborne will use currency union @t Scottish parliament committee

  119. Ian Brotherhood says:

    Powerful stuff from Bateman.

    His message here is remarkably similar to what the Ayr Town Hall heard from Colin Fox and Jim Sillars on Monday night:

  120. Grouse Beater says:

    Some of BBC’s reporters moonlight for MI5 and by MI6.

    I can’t state that is so for the commercial channels – I worked as a freelancer for them – but they attended some news meetings, and I know of two journalists who make it an open secret.

  121. Linda's back says:

    Bookie from hell

    But don’t expect BBC London to report any pro Indy news.

  122. Papadox says:

    EBC Scotlandshire propaganda report 10:30 Wednesday

    As I’ve said many times EBC Scotland at PQ is finished and the employees know what they are doing here so NO tears please when the axe is swung. Jackie Bird and Douglas Fraser tonight were pitiful and it wasn’t their worst performance by a long way.

    Whether the referendum is yes or no the EBC has blown its cover and shot itself in the head. Nobody trusts it anymore and the depths they will sink to is beyond belief, there is no way back and after the dust settles there will be no EBC in Scotland with any credibility and any tinkering to try and bluff the daft jocks will be met with derision and incredibility.

    It’s finished!

  123. CameronB says:

    Re. Flooplepoop’s link at 9:27pm. I did say I thought the Savile case looked a bit like Boys Town.

  124. Dave McEwan Hill says:

    RBS was formed to counteract the Bank Of Scotland which had Jacobite sympathies.

    It was hugely involved with many of the parcel of rogues who took English money to vote for the union so I suppose it would be somehow historically circular if it left Scotland when the union was cancelled.

    Good riddance

    We need a new Scottish national bank that behaves itself

  125. gillie says:

    Organise a licence fee boycott in Scotland.

  126. Bob W says:


    Lloyds Banking Group plc, is registered in Edinburgh a ‘Scottish’ company. This includes Halifax, BOS, TSB and Lloyds Bank the latter being registered in London an ‘English’ Bank and numerous other subsidiaries.

    I don’t think there is a such a thing as a’Scottish banking licence‘. Banks are authorised by the Prudential Regulation Authority (PRA), which is a UK wide regulator, therefore all banks operating in Scotland are in effect UK banks.

  127. Training Day says:

    O/T I wonder how many countries around Europe which have foolishly decided to be independent couldn’t see their national team in action tonight?

    I know of one non-independent country which couldn’t..

  128. Marcia says:

    Gerry Hassan having a go at our electronic media;

  129. G. P. Walrus says:

    The Peston with the poison’s spreading Malice from the Palace (of Westminster)

  130. Macandroid says:

    Re returning the BT letter – remember to fold some paper in it to make it too fat to fit through the wee slot thereby costing BT more 🙂

  131. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Dave McEwan Hill says:

    RBS was formed to counteract the Bank Of Scotland which had Jacobite sympathies.

    It was hugely involved with many of the parcel of rogues who took English money to vote for the union so I suppose it would be somehow historically circular if it left Scotland when the union was cancelled.

    Good riddance

    We need a new Scottish national bank that behaves itself

    Perhaps the new Scoban might be what you’re looking for Dave. There is a piece on the back page of today’s, yep it’s still today :), Herald about it.

    Basically Scoban is a private Scottish bank which has been set up by someone called Ray Entwistle who is a former chairman of Adam & Co. The bank was apparently set up three years ago and has become the first new bank to secure a banking licence under the regulations set up since the crash of 2008. The bank’s trading name is to be unveiled later this month it is reported in the Herald which also reports that as the bank has been permitted by the regulators to initiate a “mobilisation process” then the bank will be opening its doors within months.

    This new bank has already raised £4 Million from intial backers but it is now looking for an additional £36 Million. Any ideas here Stu? 😉 🙂

  132. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Oopzs forgot to add the link to the article, here it is.

  133. I smell a big stinky rat – clearly this was supposed to be part of last weekend’s Damn Buster Raid which was shot down by Standard and Poors on take off.

    Peston is peddling the line his UK Treasury political contacts are telling him to.

  134. Weedeochandorris says:

    It’s all about the money, money, money (feel an Abba song coming on:-) )Scotland is nothing but a cash cow for Westminster and they will do anything to hold on to the oil and gas revenues. We mean nothing else to them. Meanwhile in the background, while we’re all mesmerised by Robert Peston’s, (Er, um… Peston, by his own admission) announcements, Osbourne is beavering away grabbing any financial power he can. The Chancellor said:

    “I am determined to secure the UK’s position as a world class business and financial centre. That’s why it’s great news that our bid to bring the International Forum of Sovereign Wealth Funds to London has been a success.

    “This is yet another vote of confidence in our long term economic plan.”

    On the BBC, nothing much has changed at the BBC since 1957 nor will it change. They have the power to, and continue to manipulate viewers now, except this time it’s deadly serious with huge, untold consequences for everybody in Scotland. Wake up time folks, you’re actually in a nightmare, just open your eyes.

    “One of the most hilarious media hoaxes of all time was the BBC’s famous “spaghetti harvest” spoof of 1957. In a television “documentary” broadcast on April 1 of that year, a deadpan Richard Dimbleby, then the BBC’s most prominent presenter, reported that spaghetti grew on special “spaghetti trees” and that farmers in an Italian-speaking canton of Switzerland were enjoying a record “harvest.” The BBC props department did the rest. Many viewers were so impressed that they phoned in to ask how to grow spaghetti trees of their own. They were reportedly told to plant a sprig of spaghetti in a can of tomato sauce “and hope for the best”

  135. Grouse Beater says:

    @ Arbroath 1320

    I can verify all you state. I’m with Adam Bank, was before the predatory RBS bought shares in it which I hope they will return when they realise they are too much in debt.

    “Scoban” – the initial set-up label – is one of two new banks established with an old fashioned policy of serving the customer, personal and investment. (I have the letter Entwistle sent me.) An independent Scotland is in a good position to legislate strictures on how our new banks must operate …

  136. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Perhaps when Osborne sticks to his ” ye cannae shae oor pound” line after independence we can talk to the Bank of England and ask for our £4 Billion, think it’s £4 Billion anyway, back. I believe this is held in trust to allow us to use the Scottish pound. Before the BoE utters a sound we can tell them to transfer the funds to Scoban, or whatever Mr. Entwistle determines is the name of this new bank. This would surely shoot down in flames once and for all the ridiculous claim from the pathetic unionists that we can not use the pound!

  137. Stevie says:

    Morning Star conference : Lots of Labour people crushing the BritNat expectations of unionist fervour into the dust

  138. Morag says:

    Hmmm. Who are these guys? I have some savings I’d like to move out of the Bank of Scotland, but at the moment they all seem as bad as each other.

  139. Alba4Eva says:

    It has always been said that Art both reflects and shapes… indeed, represents what is going on in society.

    In the last week, we have had Paolo Nutinis’ Iron Sky and above, the Lady Alba video.

    I was thinking what ‘T in the Park’ is going to be like. Paolo Nutini, Biffy Clyro etc.

    I feel the wind of change.

  140. Weedeochandorris says:

    Sorry folks about that link splattered over the whole page, I don’t know how I did that 🙁

  141. Craiging_619 says:

    But how are they going to get all the banks past the border posts without getting sucked into a pensions black hole? BLOW FOR SALMOND!

  142. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Weedeochandorris says:

    Sorry folks about that link splattered over the whole page, I don’t know how I did that 🙁

    Don’t worry about it Weedeochandorris, if you have a long link try using Tiny url, it’ll create a short link replacement for you.

    Hope this helps. 😉

  143. Alba4Eva says:

    Stevie… i honestly had to stop listening to that. Im obviously happy at the enthusiasm for Scottish independence… but some of the tired old “mah da wiz labour n mah ma wiz labour” bull, was just too much to take. These people just dont get that the SNP are the old Labour party,
    … just in modern times.

    Basically, the ‘party faithful’ collectivist crap was honestly frightening… and the ‘Communist’ stuff? …simply bizarre!

    I’m an SNP supporter, but only as long as the SNP stand for equality and stay absolutely away from both the ideas of left and right… Knowing that the Left-Right paradigm is a complete lie and is just ‘collectivism’, I could never give my support to any party that started to stray that way.

    A party to get my support, needs to be flexible… it needs to be able to analyse each issue on its’ merits and it needs to be able to act on changing circumstances.

    The idea that principles are static is foolish. Principles only have merit in the context that ghey are applied.

  144. Weedeochandorris says:

    @Arbroath 1320 Thanks for the help 🙂

  145. CameronB says:

    A healthy society needs some level of collectivism in order to function and aspire to social inclusion, IMO. For example, the Scottish NHS is an example of collectivism in operation. The trick is to achieve the correct balance.

    A thornier question is whether you want your collectivist society to be oligarchical and if so to what level, as well as what basis will the hierarchy be defined (aristocratically or hereditary)?

    For example, collectivism could eradicate poverty, with the creation of a ‘living wage’. The means are available, only the political will is lacking.

  146. CameronB says:

    aristocratically? Meritocratic-ally, obviously. ;(

  147. bjsalba says:

    to kininvie says:5 March, 2014 at 9:21 pm

    I was stopped in the shop tonight by someone I’ve had down as a waverer. “It’s looking very dark for your lot,” was his opening line.

    Needs a different kind of answer- (said brightly)

    Dark for our lot? No indeed! It proves that they weren’t Scottish banks at all! If it is from London business then the debt is owed by London. We’ll be able attract real banks that know how to support local businesses and create jobs instead of playing at Casino Banking!

  148. bjsalba says:

    If the Casino/Rip-the-customer-off-PPI-banks relocate to London that improves our Credit rating. What effect does it have on the London/Westminster Credit rating. Aren’t they alreadyover reliant on finance?

  149. Mark - Aberdeen says:

    Apologies if this has been asked already but is the story not a creation of the BBC.

    As I understand it Robert Peston, himself has researched this little known, never implemented and legally unchallenged piece of legislation. The interpretation of its *possible* impact is entirely his and his alone.

    Have the BBC not gone beyond what is legally permitted in terms of balance and fairness. I know we’ve seen biased reporting and assertions from the BT campaign going unchallenged. But they now appear to be doing the bidding for the BT lot and actually researching and publishing their owns journalists opinion as fact.

  150. G H Graham says:

    Alex Salmond’s speech in London.

    Tuesday, 4th March 2014

    Full transcript –

  151. Fairliered says:

    Remind me again about independence being a threat to our pensions. Doesn’t look as if the will be safe in Westminster’s hands.

  152. bjsalba says:

    bookie from hell says:
    5 March, 2014 at 10:45 pm

    fiscal commission saying Osborne will use currency union @t Scottish parliament committee

    But how dare he? Surely this committee should stick to its primary function as jobsearch for Scottish soon to be ex-mps?

  153. MS says:

    I’m not an expert on this so please correct me if I’m wrong.

    My reading of this was that:
    1. There is an EU directive that all member states must have legislation that requires each bank to have both their head office and registered office in the same member state as the bulk of their operations.
    2. If an independent Scotland was not an EU member they could repeal the legislation (or not carry it over) and RBS and Lloyds could remain. All good.

    However …
    3. rUK would be an EU member and would have to stop RBS and Lloyds operating in rUK unless they moved south.
    4. RBS and Lloyds would have to decide if their Scottish base or rUK operations were more important to them.

    So it’s not so much a Scottish issue as an rUK issue.

    Of course a little bit of negotiation and pragmatism on the part of the EU, Scotland and rUK could see a cross border regulatory

  154. bjsalba says:

    If we are changing the odd letter here or there I recommend Pisston for Peston.

  155. an_observer says:

    It doesn’t matter whether Scotland would be subject to these EU directives or not; the UK would continue to be and so would the banks that operate within the EU.

  156. Muscleguy says:

    @Ian Brotherhood
    Thanks a million for the Peter O’Toole clip. I was impressed that he was both lithe and sober enough to dismount by himself. Then I just cracked up laughing. Well found.

  157. tiderium says:

    Slightly off topic but personally I blame Peston for the recession and if not the whole thing then certainly for how bad it was over here as he appeared on the 6pm news every night spouting doom and gloom. The way out of a recession is for people to spend money in shops and on services and businesses to act like businesses. But Peston looked positively gleeful on the T.V telling People to be careful & don’t spend money which in my opinion caused the rot to start and spiral way out of control, which then allowed George Osbourne and the like to bring in their austerity measures which made the whole scenario run way longer than it had to.

  158. Cwiffer says:

    Couldn’t believe it last night on the 6pm news when Peston announced that “within hours of a Yes vote” RBS and Lloyds would be forced to relocate to London. Fairly sure that hours after a Yes vote we will actually still be in the UK – independence is not actually set to happen until eighteen months later, in 2016! Just another example of woolly reporting from the British Biased Corporation’s finest…

  159. handclapping says:

    So who got the 50p?

  160. me says:

    B B C’S Finest Mr pest.

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