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Wings Over Scotland

A genuine mystery

Posted on April 16, 2014 by

We honestly don’t understand how anyone with electricity in their house or a newsagent anywhere within a 30-mile radius can possibly come to say things like this:

“[Independence] is a view not shared by IT teacher Elaine Coates, originally from Glasgow but now in Tettenhall. The mother of three has lived in England for 30 years but has no strong views on independence.

‘I just don’t see how it will work, I think Scotland would be crazy to do this,’ she says. ‘It doesn’t have any oil so how is it going to get its income? Whisky and tourism, probably, but that’s it.'”

Firstly, Elaine, we’d have to say that “it would be crazy” DOES actually sound like quite a strong view on independence to us. But in all seriousness, leaving all snark and sarcasm aside, how on Earth does a human being living in the UK in 2014, seemingly not inside any sort of secure institution, come to believe something like that?

Ms Coates isn’t some lone madwoman. Other people, also not resident in mental hospitals, say the same thing. And we get that lots of people aren’t into politics. But when it comes to ignorance about your own nation, being unaware that Scotland has oil is somewhere on a par with not knowing that Great Britain is an island. How in the world do you go through decades of adult life without ever picking up on that fact?

It’s not a rhetorical question. Can someone actually explain it to us?

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  1. 16 04 14 11:37

    A genuine mystery | FreeScotland

158 to “A genuine mystery”

  1. Ally says:

    Does it matter? She doesn’t have a vote & probably considers herself as much English as Scottish!

  2. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    That doesn’t seem to be an explanation, Ally.

  3. Wow!!!
    The is indeed world class ignorance.

    Just remember, people like that north of the border will have a vote.
    Let’s make sure we keep up the intensity in helping to dispel these untruths… 🙂

  4. Gary says:

    Cognitive dissonance?

    Instead of changing their view point to reflect the clear evidence out there, they simply choose to ignore the evidence, allowing them to continue with their existing beliefs.

    This causes them a lot less discomfort than having to admit that they were wrong in the first place.

    Realising that you can be wrong and being able to re-evaluate your beliefs is vital in life if you’re ever to stop making the same mistakes over and over again.

  5. Gary says:

    That degree in armchair psychology was worth every penny.

  6. Jordan says:

    Apparently she’s an IT Teacher too! God knows what she’s teaching her children.

  7. Bugger (the Panda) says:

    She probably thinks it belongs to Britain, that is to say EWNI, after we leave the UK.

  8. HandandShrimp says:

    I fear she isn’t doing much to dispel the IT Crowd image of geeks in a bubble.

    I mean what the fark does she think the rigs all around Scotland are drilling for if not oil? Treacle?

    Her Brig of Doon knowledge regarding the rest of Scottish business and industry is let down by the failure to mention the shortbread mines.

  9. Training Day says:

    But she’s right, isn’t she?

    Scotland doesn’t have any oil – at least not until 19 September 😉

  10. why did she even mention oil – if she thought we didn’t have any, did she mean we didn’t have any at all, or she believes there is oil somewhere but it belongs to the UK?

  11. patronsaintofcats says:

    What’s scary is she’s an ‘IT teacher’? Does she not understand how yon inter webs work. Information Superhighway anyone?

    No, there’s stupid and there’s wilfully ignorant. I’m going with the latter. With any luck she won’t be able to find her way our of her closet on Sept. 18th because it will all be just TOO CONFUSING!

  12. mato21 says:

    A man interviewed on tv the other night said “we may have oil for 50 or even 100years before it runs out, but what will we do then?”

    The only saving grace was that he is aware we have oil

  13. My initial reaction when I saw your tweet yesterday that this was just a re-hash of the Sharleen Spiteri story. But no, there are others! Blimey.

  14. gerry parker says:

    @ bugger.
    You’re probably not far wrong there. I’ve a nephew living in Europe who told me that all the oil was in the British sector, so Scotland wouldn’t get any of it…

  15. Scott Minto (Aka Sneekyboy) says:

    Its ‘British Oil’ syndrome…

    We get no assets, all the debt, and oil is actually British!

    At least thats what seems to go on between the ears of some Better Together types.

  16. Sneddon says:

    To be fair she probably lives in her own wee bubble and gets her news from the local TV (which as an ex resident of that county I can tell you is worse than BBC Scotland in the intellectual level of programming). It sounds like she’s been out of Scotland since she was a child. The only other explanation for her ignorance is that she’s never read a book, newspaper or journal in her life. For a teacher she’s just proved how ignorant she is.

  17. kendomacaroonbar says:

    People generally have to have an interest in the subject matter and make an effort to ‘tune in’ to the debate to ensure a basic understanding of the argument ?

    Many don’t… it’s just not important enough to them to have it on their daily radar. How many people actually know that the Scottish NHS is independent ? IMHO, not as many as you’d imagine. Just because *we* know the script doesn’t actually mean that everybody else does. We just have to keep plugging away with a reasoned positive argument.

  18. Is she under the belief that the UK will keep the oil? 30 years of being down south and never hearing it being called Scotland’s Oil? Only the UK’s Oil and Gas sector?

    No idea.

  19. Tamson says:

    People like Ms Coates make a persuasive case for informed suffrage i.e. you can’t vote unless you’ve actually read up on the parties or the referendum topic. The frightening thing in the UK is that for many, political ignorance is something they are proud of!

  20. Jiggsbro says:

    Scotland doesn’t have any oil: the UK does. Obviously, when Scotland leaves the UK, it can’t take the oil with it. That would be crazy. So it will have to survive on tourism and whisky, which the UK doesn’t want.

  21. heedtracker says:

    Without even clicking it, she’s just one more I’m alright jack so vote no. There are a lot in teamGB which is why the Con/Dems thrive in London, royals are worshipped etc

  22. Papadox says:

    None are so blind as those who don’t want to see! Through ignorance, stupidity or malice. Take your pick!

  23. steviecosmic says:

    A rhetorical question surely?

    In my not inconsiderable experience, the vast majority of people I meet connect with the world at large via mass media. The perspective they have on ‘their’ world, is informed almost in it’s entirety by exposure to tabloid media. They haven’t felt the need to delve any deeper presumably because they believe the world that media portrays to be an accurate one.

    I come across otherwise entirely sane people every day of my life who, in a brief episode of non-critical thought, will happily get angry about, say, a Daily Mail story on benefit cheats. It seems that many people have simply lost the ability to think for themselves.

  24. Mary Bruce says:

    Maybe she’s a daily mail reader? That’s the sort of ill-informed guff they come out with. Nah, she’d be more vindictive and spiteful surely?

    Or maybe she gets her information from BBC shows like the ones that Richard Madeley and Katie Hopkins appear on? They like to put these sort of ideas into people’s heads.

  25. I take it IT doesn’t stand for Information Technology because if it does, goodness help her pupils. She’s obviously never heard of the Internet.

  26. Gary says:

    The really funny thing about the Sharleen Spiteri one is that you see it reprinted in the papers occassionaly without any hint of derision or irony. You really could make a cracking TV comedy out of some of this.

  27. Gordon Hay says:

    Reading BTL comments in the London-based press, and talking to my brother who lives in Essex, it seems there are quite a number of people in rUK who believe that, like the pound, the oil under the continental shelf around the whole of Britain belongs to UK/England and that an independent Scotland would have no rights to a share of it.

  28. Mosstrooper says:

    I think Elaine is an IT teacher in much the same way that Lamont is a great debater.

  29. Robert Whyte says:

    With all the pro union talk it seems that Scotland will float off to become a separate island. I think the next survey should ask that to see how many idiots are voting.

  30. pmcrek says:

    I produced a comprehensive analysis that fully explains how it is possible for someone to be so ignorant of their own surroundings however, I appear to have lost it somewhere in my flat.

  31. Nick Durie says:

    Stu, it’s a cringe thing. She knows there is oil, but she has already ruled out Scotland ever being ‘allowed’ access to it. The assumptive is defeat and failure.

  32. aitchbee says:

    Can I just say on behalf of professional geeks like myself, that this woman isn’t one. Still, could be worse. She could be teaching in Scotland…

  33. scottish_skier says:

    This would suggest Michael Gove may actually be correct.

  34. SquareHaggis says:

    Ah’ll get ma coates…

  35. Stewart Baillie says:

    She’s been Englasised. Once spoke to a chap who couldn’t understand where Dundee was. Is that in Edinburgh. No. Oh its in Glasgow then. No. Ah so its in Balmoral.

    That was his knowledge of Scotland , Edinburgh, Glasgow and the rest of it was Balmoral. Their ignorance is unbelievable, which explains some of the comments we suffer from English commentators.

  36. frankieboy says:

    Will somebody tell her to switch it off then switch it back on again?…that might help.

  37. Indy_Scot says:

    All joking aside, but has anyone let her know yet that the world is not flat.

  38. The Rough Bounds says:

    I recall reading a book written some years ago by an Irish bloke wandering round Ireland and speaking to people about their views on Ireland and its politicians. He wasn’t too impressed by some of the people he met.

    In one house there was a picture on the wall of some Irish political leader (whose name unfortunately I forget) and of whom the family thought very highly. They told the author that they voted for him and his Party.

    The irony is that the politician they still lauded and praised had been dead for more than twenty years…and not one of them knew.

    The ignorance of people regarding politics isn’t confined by any means to Scots; it’s worldwide. I’m not sure frankly how some people manage to function on a day to day basis so I can’t supply you with any reasons for that IT teacher’s appalling stupidity, unless it’s simply that some folks have brains that don’t work very well.

    I guess this is where democracy falls down; the ignorant and stupid have votes the same as the intelligent and bright.

  39. Mosstrooper says:

    Sorry Elaine, Computer says


  40. Rod Robertson says:

    I would suggest Ms Coates is an imaginary figure in some corrupt journalist’s corrupt mind.
    Someone check the electors roll for said Tettenhall and see if there is any such person.
    I would suggest not ,and if there is indeed a lady of that name she is neither Scottish ,nor are the words hers.

  41. Red Squirrel says:

    I’m not too surprised by this – without wishing to be insulting, some folk have an amazing capacity to live within their own little bubble, taking no notice of events around them if it doesn’t affect them directly. Sleepwalking through life if you will.

    But Scotland is waking up, engaging and questioning, no longer prepared to accept what’s being said as truth without some proof. That’s why we will win.

  42. CyberNiall says:

    @ Rev. Stuart Campbell

    Is there any chance you could make the blue book big enough to whack these people over the head with?

  43. heedtracker says:

    Clicked the link and bloody hell they ain’t half bizarrely ignorant and prejudiced down sarf.

    Proud Scot But Angus MacHaggis moved to England 30 years ago from the Scotch misty glens and loves it and he says “I am as patriotic as any Scot,” he says. “It will always be ‘home’. But the simple fact is that Alex Salmond does not have the popularity required to push enough ‘yes’ votes through.”

    Wife Mrs Angus MacHaggis went on to say “I just don’t see how it will work, I think Scotland would be crazy to do this,” she says. “It doesn’t have any oil so how is it going to get its income? Whisky and tourism, probably, but that’s it.”

    Angus’s pet Scots terrier Angus added, “Together we’re a beacon of democracy and freedom, with a vibrant culture, and we are respected around the world. It’s a lot to walk away from. Then there are the economic downsides – the concerns over currency, investment and what would happen to Scotland’s place in the European Union”

    Woof woof Alex Salmond grrr”

  44. goldenayr says:

    The answer is a mixture of sport,entertainment tv and[as Gary says]Cognitive dissonance.
    Everybody must know the wee guy down the pub who can tell you who played in the nineteen canteen cup final,who were in the teams and who scored the winning goal,the crowd attendance and then go on to tell you that he wasn,t bright enough to do well at school.
    As long as there is deliberately manipulated disconnect from politics to “exciting” topics like sport or the latest goings on in Corrie.Then people will stick their head in the sand and cry ignorance.We need our own radio or tv station to produce drama,comedy and info progs to entertaingly display the political consequences and engage the populace.
    I see the beeb comedy unit are looking for jokes about the ref to turn into a prog.My worry here is that it will be used to dumb down the argument in much the same way as every other beeb production.

  45. andrew>reid says:

    Sorry to be a classroom bore, but a serious issue is involved here – I huge number of people in Scotland, who will be voters in the referendum, have the same disengagement and lack of knowledge is the person reported on. At the risk of bringing mass hostility down on top of me, I continue to be concerned about the views of women voters, and the huge proportion of young women in the 16 to 34 age bracket, who say they will be voting No. Now, they may have reached a reasoned conclusion, and that is fair enough – but, my guess, on the basis of minimal actual knowledge, is that a very large number of them are completely disengage from politics and the almost all of the news media, have maybe caught up with a few of the unionist scare stories, don’t trust any politicians, Or that any change will make any difference. So, how does the yes campaign get through to the Elaine Coates equivalents in Scotland, because there are many thousands of them around, and John Curtice was quoted at the weekend indicating that getting them to change their minds was a lost cause, and the yes campaign would have to rely on getting an increased majority of votes from men. What needs to be done to prove him wrong?

  46. Nobby Power says:

    I had a guy tell me once in a debate, that we wouldn’t have any oil, because it wasn’t onshore! The level of ignorance can be quite staggering at times.

  47. HandandShrimp says:

    It is interesting that people can’t seem to hold two thoughts in their head. The UK includes Scotland and if Scotland leaves the UK then the bit that is Scotland and all that entails is no longer in the UK. Therefore what is the UK’s today will not necessarily be the UK’s on the 19th Sept 2014 (well 24th March 2016 to be absolutely exact). Just as fracked gas in Surrey will belong to rUK after the 19th and all UK before the 19th.

    Dear God this isn’t hard.

  48. John Russell says:

    She’s an IT teacher. Has she not heard of Google?

  49. bookie from hell says:

    Was it LULU?

  50. Mosstrooper says:

    @ROD 11.19

    Why wouldn’t a person named Coates be Scottish?

    have you never heard of the Coates family of Paisley fame?

    Naw, she’s in the same category as the chap who agreed that Scotland was a rich country then in the same breath asked me if I thought we could afford to be independent.

    I can assure you that he left me a YES voter with three Yes badges for his family

  51. Thomas William Dunlop says:

    I think she has just bought into the “oil is running out” scam. Obviously a paid up member of the Were Too Wee, Stupid, Poor Cringe Club.

    Recently I had facebook discussion with one, whose final rejoinder was independence/ removing ourselves from London’s reach was like cutting the heart out of the bloody! It is a wonder they must get out the house the day without worrying about everything.

  52. Col says:

    The sad fact is that this is ignorance is shared by many that think the oil belongs to the UK and it will continue to do so after independence! I work in the oil industry and the amount of people out here from both north and south of the border that think the revenues will continue to go to westminster is frightening and when you try to enlighten these people they just don’t believe it! One English guy was adamant that westminster would just claim the whole seabed off Scotland and there was nothing we would be able to do about it!

  53. Training Day says:


    ‘I see the beeb comedy unit are looking for jokes about the ref to turn into a prog. My worry here is that it will be used to dumb down the argument in much the same way as every other beeb production.’

    Sounds like the programme will be conducted on the same basis as their ‘light-hearted’ look at defence issues last Sunday, which was one of the most scabrous examples of naked pro-Union bias to date.

  54. CLIFF MCCABE says:

    maybe it would be a better idea to inform Elaine about the truth rather than trying to ridicule her, its one thing to ridicule politicians or journalists for spreading lies, but not too clever to ridicule someone not involved in politics for believing something she is repeatedly told by a compliant media and politicians.
    I Have seen you articulate before that people should inform themselves, yes good idea, but I don,t google for the facts every time I express an opinion, do you? I’m sure she didn’t either in this case.
    Describing her as a madwoman ? really ?

  55. Jaki McCarthy says:

    As your article said the other day. The mushroom effect…. So so true having witnessed it for most of my life… Scots have been kept in the dark for decades about their own true wealth and self worth… Fed on a diet of “too wee too stupid and too poor” from brazen british press…. #voteyes #indyref

  56. scopa says:

    It’s as bad as the recent PF event in Greenock where the gathered Labour mob started calling their post-referendum plans “devo-max”. They’re hoping that enough people are ignorant of the details that they’ll actually think it’s the third option which they prevented from appearing on the ballot paper.

  57. Fiona says:

    Perhaps she misspoke? Maybe she believes that the oil has run out, or is about to, which is not very far from a mainstream narrative.

    On the other hand there is very little point in guessing because the article is not wedded to accuracy, as you point out. She either does have strong views on independence, contrary to what the article says: or she doesn’t and has been quoted out of context. Wouldn’t be the first time.

  58. HandandShrimp says:


    There will be people who vote tribally and nothing will change there position even if the small print said a No vote will result in a Government official sticking pins in their eyes.

    However, I do believe that young female voters are open to change. They are naturally a more cautious voter just as they tend to be more cautious and careful about other aspects of life. The concerns they have need to be addressed. Clear, simple but polite rebuttal of arguments that worry them is the most effective in my experience. I have managed to swing a couple a No and Don’t Knows in this demographic to Yes and it was by being clear and honest in my understanding of the issues that concerned them.

  59. Gordon Hay says:

    O/T Radio 2 Vine show (aka Daily Mail radio)from 12 to discuss the whether the No campaign is too negative and if this is why “Salmond and his CREW” -Vine’s own words – are catching up in the polls.

  60. Papadox says:

    Great Britain was thought up so that anything good or profitable that came out of Scotland was deemed as Brittish, everything else is ENGLISH. You very seldom here anybody round about the Home Counties mention Brittish, their first and automatic choice is ENGLAND, with if you are lucky sorry I ment Brittish.

    IMO HMG have told EBC to push the positive case for maintaining the union, the EBC have sent that message down the chain of command till it reached the front line.

    Unfortunately there is no positive case for the union and no negative case against independence so the front line troops just make it up as they go along. Nobody is going to tell the king he has no clothes, not good for the career. Hence there is no positive message from BT and there never will be unless the fool in front of the camera makes it up as they try to understand what it is they are supposed to be doing.

    PROOF: just watch EBC, MSM.

  61. DaveyM says:

    It’s odd that a teacher could be so stupid. But if she’s teaching down south she isn’t likely to be properly qualified to be doing the job in any case, so nothing really surprises me on that front.

  62. Dcanmore says:

    A bit of deliberate misinformation in that article regarding Elaine Coates as a ‘teacher’, she is in fact a freelance IT consultant “advising Colleges and Schools on the implementation and development of mobile learning including staff development,” from her Linked In page. Looking at her work history she has never been a teacher but more of a ‘trainer’ at best.

    I believe she simply knows nothing about Scotland’s issues other than what she reads in the English newspaper editions. I say this because it reminds of my brother, also 30 years living in England. He couldn’t tell you a thing about what’s been happening Scotland over that time, he’s not political so Scotland is more out of sight out of mind.

  63. iheartscotland says:

    I live O/S and many Scots / English folk I meet think that time stands still in the country they left after they emigrate. On the other side, my Gran told me how old I looked when I saw her again in my mid twenties.(my family had to emigrate from Scotland when I was 5

  64. Macart says:

    I suspect Ms Coates knows exactly nothing about Scotland. People tend to becomes wrapped in the day to day life and mindset of where they’re living. With no interest in Scotland’s politics or economy its perfectly feasible that the lady is completely unaware of Scotland’s worth or potential.

    However knowing you have a gaping hole in your grasp of the issues, I’d have found it crazy to put forward any opinion on the matter of Scottish independence at all.

  65. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “I believe she simply knows nothing about Scotland’s issues other than what she reads in the English newspaper editions.”

    But that’s the thing – even ENGLISH newspapers don’t try to pretend that Scotland doesn’t have any oil. It’s brought up almost every time anyone discusses an independent Scotland’s economy, even down here.

  66. Jim T says:

    @gerry parker 10:58am

    That’s a few times now there have been indications on WoS topics that Euro news agencies seem to have a biased view of what’s going on here.

    Is there any benefit to there being a concerted effort to educate the Euro media about the positive side of the YES debate? How would we benefit, if at all?

    If there is some benefit, how can we, as a group, approach them with a coordinated series of, for wnat of a better term, infomercials?

  67. Mosstrooper says:

    Punctuation time.

    A comma (,)is a mark used to indicate the smallest division of a sentence

    An apostrophe (‘) is a mark used to show the omission of a letter or letters in a word.

    If you can find the comma on the keyboard you can find the apostrophe. Please do.

    DON’T get me started on their, there and they’re or rein reign and rain

  68. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “maybe it would be a better idea to inform Elaine about the truth rather than trying to ridicule her”

    (a) I don’t have her email address.

    (b) I get so weary at concern-troll posts like this. Nobody ridiculed her. I pointed out that she WASN’T some delusional nutter, and that other people had the same view. I asked a genuine question about how such a bizarre situation could come about. You can’t just say “The word ‘madwoman’ is in there so you’re calling her mad”. Try actually reading the sentences.

    So, so weary.

  69. goldenayr says:

    Training Day
    That’s what I was thinking.The establishment seem to prefer comedies that make people think that politics is so stupidly complicated that it’s not worth their bother to get engaged in it.Think “The Thick of It”,”2012″ and “Yes Minister”.No matter what they say,they hated “Spitting Image” because it brought political discourse into everyday conversation,not that it required much in those days.It’s one of the reasons unionist hate “Borgen”,it normalises politics and makes you realise you can contribute.

  70. ronnie anderson says:

    O/T gerry parker, ok gerry kettles on mind the back door

    bell no worky.

  71. Snowy bottles says:

    I must says, demonising a normal non-voter is not a good way to go.

  72. heedtracker says:

    The women no voters that I know, 4 of them, married, have jobs, young children, a big mortgage, money a bit tight etc and none of them want any change at all. I thought the post indy child care proposition might make a difference but not so. Its an interesting debate with them as you can see very quickly that telling women what to do is obviously a no no but they same to think they are being told to. But the whole thing gets very funny very quickly.Maybe the whole debate is too masculine, shouty, patriarchal and competitive, winner and loser, Labour v SNP.

    But then you have a dude like BBCbullshit artist of the year Brian Wilson on tv last night telling us all that “Scotland can easily afford nurseries and college for everyone, so why doesn’t evil and cruel Salmond do it all now and vote no”

    Should add that all of the women above partners are 3 YES voters, one undecided.

  73. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “At the risk of bringing mass hostility down on top of me”

    I don’t know about the masses, but you’ll bring MY bloody hostility down on top of you if you don’t WRITE IN BLOODY PARAGRAPHS.

  74. lectron says:

    When you don’t know you don’t know then you think you do know. but when you do know you don’t know

  75. Peter Macbeastie says:

    Gary says:
    16 April, 2014 at 11:06 The really funny thing about the Sharleen Spiteri one is that you see it reprinted in the papers occassionaly without any hint of derision or irony. You really could make a cracking TV comedy out of some of this.

    And right there, in a nutshell, is exactly where the quoted woman got her information from. It’s complete and utterly wrong, but the problem is most people just don’t question what they read in the papers because they don’t care enough about what’s being said to argue with it.

    Distance from Scotland doesn’t automatically make you not care; if anything while in Portsmouth I got more Scottish (may have been a defence mechanism 😉 ) but in general people simply do not question things which do not affect them directly.

    Blissful ignorance.

    If by some random chance anyone knows Ms Coates personally, do her a favour and send her a link to WoS. She needs an education about the reality in Scotland and this page supplies a decent level of knowledge.

  76. Schiehallion! Schiehallion! says:

    I’d be surprised if she has much of a clue where England ‘gets its income’ from. Not least because a good deal of it comes from Scotland.

    Thirty years ago she would probably have considered computers a ‘crazy’ idea on which she nevertheless had no strong views. Surely if we were meant to have laptops we’d have been born with keyboards. And, to take your example, if Great Britain were an island, it would be surrounded by water, and how would we find this out? Best to assume that the water surrounds somewhere else.

    How to explain it? Some people have neither curiosity, imagination nor initiative. They weren’t born with it and they’re surrounded by incontrovertible evidence that no one else has it. They are wee islands of witlessness, waiting for their school holidays.

  77. Flower of Scotland says:

    Sorry o/t some guy called Sam on Fred Macaulay show , after being asked where he got his Referendum information , said not TV but on programmes like Fred,s!! Of course , Fred then said , yeah James Naughtie etc doing a good job! What a set up! Thanks Fred!!

  78. Kev says:

    It is truly astonishing that this natural resource which has single-handedly kept the UK economy afloat for nearly 40 years has over the same time been successfully portrayed to many as at best a risky commodity and at worst a non-existent one. You’ve got to take your hat off to the BBC/Westminster propaganada machine – its the best smear campaign ever conducted – convincing an oil rich nation that its bankrupt…

  79. Mealer says:

    I think this person has been misquoted.Anyone teaching anything anywhere in the UK is bound to know Scotland has oil.

  80. MajorBloodnok says:

    Caps lock must have been on because she’s actually an ‘it’ teacher.

    “What do you teach?”
    “What’s ‘it’?”
    “I dunno what it stands for mate, I’m just a teacher. It’s definitely not the same as ‘that’ though.”

    (Is she any relation to Johann Lamont?)

  81. CLIFF MCCABE says:

    (b) I get so weary at concern-troll posts like this.

    Just for the record reverend I donated to your fundraiser because I think your website provides a vital function, to advise the people of Scotland when the wool is being pulled over their eyes. I dont think this is served by you or the dozens of commenters btl ridiculing, yes ridiculing, people for their media fed ignorance.
    If your get out is to then label me as a troll well that’s just peachy isn’t it, anyone who disagrees with a single utterance of yours is a troll?
    I personally don’t think ridiculing people is the way to convert them to yes, if that makes me a troll so be it.

  82. annie says:

    Surly this is the perfect example of why people living outwith Scotland should not have the vote.

  83. ronnie anderson says:

    Noo purdon mwa fer ma ugneranceity whit does IT teaching

    mean,is that advancitery decree higher or lower than

    JoLo’s,there there hen ah dont git oot much either,but ave

    never been the village idiot either, watch oot when your

    lighting the Gas mantle they stopped making them about the

    same time you went south.

  84. RosiePosie says:

    My OH was born in England, way down sarf, but has spent the majority of his years in Scotland. (He also had the great good sense to marry a Scot :-)) He reckons the level of ignorance about Scotland and all things Scottish in the south of England is staggering. It’s like “North of “TheWall”” in Game of Thrones. “Winter is coming”

  85. SquareHaggis says:

    @Snowy bottles

    EH? Demonising? Whereabouts?

    Do I really have to point you to a dictionary or can’t you just look it up for yourself?

  86. jingly jangly says:

    Plenty of people in Scotland are just as ignorant, many of the people I speak to are not interested in anything outside their own little bubble.

    They don’t look further forward than the next pay packet.
    It’s difficult getting them to make a connection with an iScotland and a better job/bigger pay packet…

    They just don’t trust politicians of any shape or form.

    But we just have to plough on and make little steps every day, the momentum is with us and I’m confident that on
    Sept 19th we will be suffering from a huge hangover and that’s not from drowning our sorrows.

    The good news for Don’s supporters that on May 17th we will be able to work for the cause and not waste it watching a bag of air being kicked around!!! Anyway I have been to Parkhead once already this year, don’t fancy another!!!

  87. andrew>reid says:

    Thanks for the two comments back so far about the major risk of a No vote by women and thoughts on the reasons for that. Maybe it’s also significant that most of the postings on independence websites seem to come from men, judging by the names. Does that Indicate women are turned off by the macho posturing of folks like myself, and by implication maybe from a lot of the independence debate? – and their default position as the status quo? I just don’t know – anyone know of any research or polling evidence about this?

  88. G H Graham says:

    A lady was asked by Jay Leno on one of his walkabouts in Burbank, CA what she thought Hitler’s first name might be.

    After a pause, she declared his question a trick because Hitler probably had a name like Cher had; i.e. no first name.

    I could go one with dozens of Uncle Sam examples but I’ll be accused of being anti-American.

    There are just as many people like this all across the UK; living in a bubble with no desire to learn the reality of the political, geographical & social environment they actually live in.

    It’s just easier to avoid the indirect responsibility for something when you deliberately chose not to carry the burden of knowing about it.

    The smarter politicians & bureaucrats know this & take full advantage of this laissez-faire attitude. Thus, we get the governments we deserve.

  89. Hewitt83 says:


    Correct. It’s been a far more common complaint that I would’ve imagined.

    Some bird I know who lives in Norway is always moaning on her Facebook page about not getting to vote. She’s not lived in Scotland since 2009 and has no plans to move back.

    Yet, for some reason, she can’t grasp the fact she’s being denied a vote.

    You don’t live here, you have no plans to move back so you simply should have no say in how Scotland is governed. Simple.

    She’d be a No if she did live here so her absence is welcome!

  90. John Gibson says:

    @ HandandShrimp

    ” failure to mention the shortbread mines.”


  91. Stewart says:

    Great Britain is an island?????

  92. Eric McLean says:

    On one side of the scales

    Establishment, BBC, Westminster, Unionist Parties, Whitehall, Monarchy, big London banks and business, aristocracy, advocacy and Boris Johnstone. Labour die hards, Scottish MPs who will lose out. House of Lords. Mainstream media. Comfortable, well off, maintainers of status quo.
    People who love themselves.

    On the other side

    Ordinary Scots, Residents of Scotland, SNP, YES grassroots, politically astute, people with long memories of betrayal, estates, disenfranchised, unemployed, agents of change, people who aspire, people who want equality, fairness and proper democracy. The visionaries. People who loveScotland.

    On the fence or ill considered NOs.

    Fearties, brainwashed, not interested in politics, the short sighted, the ignorant, the lazy, the insane, daily express, mail, Scotsman readers, religious bigots, royalists , loyalists and monkeys.

    There is a huge dam of NOs and Don’t Knows swelling behind a dyke. BBC and propaganda has done a fair job of sticking their finger in that dyke.

    If the dam bursts before 18th it will be a YES … If the dam bursts after the 18th it will be a case of all those that voted NO being too ashamed to admit it.

    No votes will become as scarce as rocking horses doo doo.

    All we can do is try to increase the pressure in the dam… Educate, share, don’t miss an opportunity to talk, support all YES activity, follow each other, RT good info, challenge the propaganda,

    But most importantly NOW is the time to fly big flags, signs, badges, posters, stickers,.

    It is time the online strength became visible on street. We are still a long way away from an avalanche, landslide, an unstoppable grass roots movement.

  93. ronnie anderson says:

    @Handandshrimp 10.53, noo your no a newcomer tae WOS so thars nae excuses, you know this is Caring Sharing Site

    Noo where ur they Shortbread Mines ( ya greedy Baaaaaahhhahaaahhhaaasss).

  94. James123 says:

    People believe all kinds of shit, that’s the way it is and the way it will always be.

  95. chalks says:

    Not every woman cares about childcare……they don’t like Salmond, it’s fairly simple.

    Is his poll ratings amongst women not the lowest of all demographics?

  96. Arel says:

    I go to visit my elderly aunt in a care home and what I find there is that the carers, all female and probably on average in the 25-35 age bracket know next to nowt about what’s happening. The reason I know that is that I frequently wear my YES badge and have had to explain to quite a few of them what it stands for. I kid you not!!!
    I think I have managed to convert one but that was a job in itself but overall there seems to be a total disengagement of the whole Indy process with this category of voter. From what I have established the only saving grace is that the majority are unlikely to even go out and vote.

  97. Hewitt83 says:

    @Rod Robertson

    She is very real it seems, I found her on LinkedIn

  98. Findlay Farquaharson says:

    calm down cliff, there will be many scots fed up to the back teeth of the ignorant views on their country by so called knowledgable people, she is a teacher for gods sake.
    You really believe she needs educating or do you think there is a small chance what she is saying is a lie? if so, she deserves ridiculing at least.

  99. Dcanmore says:

    Well Ms Coates doesn’t live in Scotland and won’t be getting a vote, more worryingly are those who do and have the same attitude, indifferent or not, some are in the DK camp and we need to concentrate on informing those rather than continually being exasperated by the ignorance of those south of the border regardless of how annoying that it is

  100. Minxy says:

    Sounds to me like some of you guys on here are suffering from battle fatigue .. And understandably so .. We have a way to go yet … We need to keep focused and stay strong ….All of these pro Indy sites are vitally important and I for one deeply appreciate all the hard work that goes into keeping us informed . Huge Thankyou .. Deep breaths guys .. United we stand divided we fall

  101. ian Mc says:

    This isn’t a “media fed ignorance” it isn’t even disengagement with the political process. What it is, is LAZINESS.

    It is a worldview fed by an “I’m alright Jack so why would I care about anything or anyone else” view and as such, if these people are going to express an “opinion” on it, then they open themsleves to comment and in this case ridicule. If you know nothing about it have the presence of moind and sense of dignity, to keep yer ill advised and ignorance to yourself.

    Today, too many people just open the gob and breath fart some nonesense which betrays their level of knowledge and or interest.

    Of couse some will say it is apathy but which there are those who really don’t see the value in voting there is a huge amount today who quite frankly cannot be arsed. Can’t be arsed going to vote, registering to vote, educating themselves about the world around them and who don’t give a stuff for a starving pensioner, kids getting nappies from foodbanks, people dying at 59. If that is the way they want to live their lofe fine. If they want to demonstrate a complete lack of empathy, concern, care then fine, but then surely they wont mind when they find themselves pulled up for it.

    I watch BBC Scotland as it visited a uni to talk to students about voting. The shock at the lack of giving a stuff really got to me. “What there’s a vote” and “yeah I’m voting….what I have to register?…when is it?…oh I’ll be busy”

    Apathy, disengagement? Naw, laziness and not giving a toss.

    I see a rugby fan in his Scotland shirt and his comedy jock routine for the day saying we should not be independent but try for devloution, you know like Wales, then sorry, he opened his gob and deserves all the ridicule he deserves.

    We have a generation who would shame their grandparents. Brought up on towie the speak without thinking. We have a generation who have zero interest in anything or anyone and live their lofe in zombieland of home. Fine, but if they the espouse pish then they should be pulled up on it. Apologists only exascerbate this laziness of thought and justify ignorant can’t be arsedness.

    If these people can’t be arsed to equip themselves with knowledge and show that they care about themselves then why does it matter what anyone here says?

  102. Dcanmore says:

    Well done to Women for Independence in reaching their Indiegogo fundraiser goal of £20,000 … now here’s the other one folks, pretty cool and needs help.–11#home

  103. Jammers says:

    It is indeed ridiculous. But I think your throwaway comment about ‘people in mental hospitals’ is a rare example of poor judgment on this site. Don’t label all people with mental health problems as somehow incapable of separating fact from reality.

  104. Retro_Rabbit says:

    I can’t help with your question… well… maybe I can shed a bit of light on her thinking… I noticed a long winded and rather long comment from a muppet (not Kermit) on a The Independent article, where someone seemed to think the entirety of Scotland would be treated as an enclave with a 12 mile radius of sea around it and everything would belong to England (sic), because as ee all know… there is only England in tge rest of the UK… maybe that misguided opinion is spreading… maybe it’s me that’s wrong because if course all the water around the American continent belons to Colombia… 😉
    I furnished the muppet with a link to the UNCLOS and directed his attention to article 3… idiots… idiots everywhere…

  105. MajorBloodnok says:

    There seem to be a hell of a lot of crabbit, intolerant and judgmental commenters in today. Must be sunny outside… that or the BT cheques finally cleared.

  106. Bugger (the Panda) says:

    If Elaine Coates is a teacher, she must be Johan Lamont’s sister.

  107. msean says:

    A qualified teacher,so must be educated to a higher level as you would then be passing over imformation that must be correct. A new plugin may be required.

  108. Bill Fraser says:


  109. TheItalainJob says:

    Unbelievable! Never heard of this online newspaper but caught it and read it on a news website linked to articles on Independence.

    Although she has lived in England for 30 years she has no concept of the oil still left in the Scottish contenential shelf. She has probably just picked up the usual negative No campaign soundbites that there is little oil left vs the true figure of 35-50 years as being predicted by the oil industry.

    In addition she has no idea of the Scottish economy and what industries other than oil & gas, tourism, whisky etc Scotland has. A bit of simple research on the internet etc would have provided this info.

    Surprised that this person’s ignorance of this subject was even allowed to be published on this site.

    Then maybe not as we all know ref negative MSM articles, on Independence, being published on a daily basis.

  110. Sneddon says:

    iheartscotland-I totally agree with your point about expats thinking Scotland hadn’t changed since they left. Me and my brothers all left in the early 1980’s to find work down south. I returned for holidays etc but my brothers didn’t. I noticed the huge changes since 1999 they havn’t. I moved back 2 years ago. They are still down south with no idea what’s happening up here(the meetings, the engagement at grassroots etc). Sadly they get all their information from MSM. But that’s ok because big brother (me) keeps letting them know what’s going on 🙂
    But I’ve met plenty expats who left in the 80’s who still think Scotland is an industrial wasteland.

  111. MochaChoca says:

    It’s quite simple really, a few months ago Mr Darling clearly and unequivocally said only 2 billion remain, in those few months we have still been extracting it so it’s perfectly plausible that as of this morning it’s all gone.

  112. Jamie Arriere says:

    If she is an IT teacher, she’ll know all about dumb terminals :

    A display monitor that has no processing capabilities. A dumb terminal is simply an output device that accepts data from the CPU. In contrast, a smart terminal is a monitor that has its own processor for special features, such as bold and blinking characters. Dumb terminals are not as fast as smart terminals, and they do not support as many display features, but they are adequate for most applications.

  113. Hammett96 says:

    I try to keep the oil out of any conversations personally, and go along the lines of ‘we are on a par with UK even without oil’, but I agree that there is still a good bit of ignorance within a great many Socttish people which of course should be addressed by MSM in Scotland. I chuckled a little yesterday when some bright spark on one of the BBC HYS boards commented that the oil could not be Scotland’s, his/her argument being that the oil is not within Scottish borders as it ‘under the ground’

  114. HandandShrimp says:

    How did the Jeremy Vine thing go on the radio?

    Mail radio is an apt description of that phone in show 🙂 although to be fair to Jeremy Vine isn’t some Mailesque right wing hack…but any phone in show does tend to attract those who get miffed about issues.

  115. CameronB says:

    Cognitive Dissonance. Simples.

    The brain is in two hemispheres. The right brain collects information from the outside world and the left brain determiners what information is useful. The selection process is neither random nor impartial. The brain will actually trigger a reseal of endorphins, when the left brain rejects information that challenges per-existing core values or strong beliefs. I think the medical name for this neurological response, is the normalcy bias.

    Humans are not isolated automatons, we are social animals. Our evolution has trained us that it is safer to keep our heads down and keep quiet. Remember the Holocaust?

    Oh yeh. Probably lacking in self-awareness, as well.

    Apologies if already covered.

  116. Ravelin says:

    My wife is well educated, did her degree as a mature student, then her PGDE in Edinburgh, and now works as a secondary teacher (in IT funnily enough). She’s not particularly interested in politics (she generally does vote though) and/or engaged in the independence debate. What she does hear about it will come largely from TV & Radio as it doesn’t seem to be something she’s comfortable talking about with me or the kids (both of whom will be eligible to vote).

    Living in Aberdeenshire she’s well aware that there’s oil out in the North Sea. However, only a few days ago I uttered ‘bollocks’, or something similar, in response to some report I was watching on TV. She wasn’t really watching it but asked about my utterance. Until I explained to her about UNCLOS I don’t think she realised that there was absolutely no doubt about which country would end up with the vast bulk of the oil fields if Scotland voted YES.

    It may be hugely annoying to most of us on here but the reality is that there’s a vast pool of voters out there that frankly are not educated in the truth about a lot of very important issues. You may be able to argue how long the oil will last, or how much tax income it will bring, but there should be no doubt about who it would belong to!

  117. Harry says:

    jinglyjangly – back on punctuation but you are a Dons supporter not Don’s.

    Bought the Record for my Dad today and had my usual trepidatious look at the letters and texts page. There was one excellent text rubbishing Torquil’s article where apparently he said a Yes vote was a vote for the SNP. But below it was one from a numpty in my neck of the woods, Hamilton, here it is in all it’s glory:

    May I remind Scots expats living abroad they live there as citizens of the UK and EU. If the vote is Yes, they will no longer be citizens of the above and therefore will be deported. So welcome back to a sunny Scotland and an uncertain future.
    J.McG, Hamilton

    If anyone fancies replying, you text DRVIEW followed by your comments to 85858.

  118. TheItalianJob says:

    Unbelievable! Never heard of this online newspaper but caught it and read it on a news website linked to articles on Independence.

    Although she has lived in England for 30 years she has no concept of the oil still left in the Scottish contenential shelf. She has probably just picked up the usual negative No campaign soundbites that there is little oil left vs the true figure of 35-50 years as being predicted by the oil industry.

    In addition she has no idea of the Scottish economy and what industries other than oil & gas, tourism, whisky etc Scotland has. A bit of simple research on the internet etc would have provided this info.

    Surprised that this person’s ignorance of this subject was even allowed to be published on this site.

    Then maybe not as we all know ref negative MSM articles, on Independence, being published on a daily basis.

  119. Rev. Stuart Campbell says:

    “May I remind Scots expats living abroad they live there as citizens of the UK and EU. If the vote is Yes, they will no longer be citizens of the above and therefore will be deported. So welcome back to a sunny Scotland and an uncertain future.
    J.McG, Hamilton”

    We could REALLY use a photograph of that.

  120. a supporter says:

    Rev. Stuart Campbell

    “I get so weary at concern-troll posts like this. Nobody ridiculed her. I pointed out that she WASN’T some delusional nutter, and that other people had the same view.”

    Hear! Hear! The Wet Nat/concern troll brigade are out in full strength today. The people who think we’ll win a YES vote by being nice to every idiot who writes or spouts anti-Indy rubbish. We are under a fear, smear, sneer onslought and being ‘nice’ won’t cut it.

    Criticise and make them look like fools. That way they might go and read WHY they are fools.

  121. CLIFF MCCABE says:

    @ Findlay Farqhaurson
    Thanks for your concern Findlay but I’m perfectly calm, I too am exasperated by the ignorance of so many of my fellow Scots, just this morning I was talking to a semi retired female colleague who stated she would never vote no because Scotland could end up like Ireland when I told her that Ireland is way above Scotland in most league tables of wealth or satisfaction etc, she said that was rubbish because the last time she was in Ireland her cigarettes were much more expensive than they are here, and when I explained that the minimum and average wages in Ireland are higher than they are here, she paused to think, she didn’t change her position but at least she paused to think.
    Now my point was, do you think I would have been better to ridicule her erroneous assertions about Ireland ?

  122. McHaggis says:

    The ignorance is only matched by the wilful denial of more intelligent #bettertogether bods I have engaged in discussion.

    You provide them fact-based evidenc to support a position and they just go into denial mode. Normally rational people go into a child-like state of opposition for oppositions sake.

    Really, really sad.

  123. Duncan King says:

    George Carlin — ‘Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.’

  124. Clootie says:

    Are we sure she was talking about Hydrocarbon oil?
    I’m just glad she left as the gene pool is much stronger.

  125. MajorBloodnok says:

    @Cliff McCabe

    No, but there has to be room for some ridicule in this debate otherwise we’d all go mad. Plus, there is nothing the po-faced Unionists hate more than being laughed at.

  126. SquareHaggis says:

    Any ladies out there unsure about which way to vote, just look up Dame Anne Begg, or worse still, try having a 2 minute conversation with her. That was the clincher for my nearest and dearest 3 weeks ago at the Big Debate in Aberdeen.

  127. Onwards says:

    It just backs up the fact that a huge number of people just have no interest in news or politics.
    They pick up snippets of what is going on in the background, with lots of misinformation like Chinese whispers.

    It shows the importance of getting a message across outside politics sites, and having a mainstream presence. This us why newspaper covers and billboard campaigns are still important.
    Online, it would be Facebook only that reaches such voters.

  128. Harry says:

    Rev- how do I send it to you. Scuse my ignorance, least techy savvy person around.

  129. McDuff says:

    The reality is that no one in England is remotely interested in Scotland or the referendum and that reflects the level of ignorance. I am in England every other month and can testify to that.

  130. Robert Peffers says:

    @The Rev Stu: “It’s not a rhetorical question. Can someone actually explain it to us”?

    Ah! Yes!
    I’ve been video editing all morning attempting to highlight just that very matter. It’s called,“Brainwashing”.

    It’s why the likes of Mags Curran has claimed that if we Scots vote to become independent we will cease to remain, ” British”.

    The utter confusion some find with the English Language where distinctly very different terms such as Britain, The British Isles, The United Kingdom and even England and, “The Country”, have been merged, through ignorant usage, to become, in many minds, misleading and wrong synonymous terms. I hope to have that video clip up and running on youtube today.

  131. hetty says:

    Yes the worry is that there are too many like her who do actually have the chance to change things for the better but their ignorance, or whatever it is, enables them to be completely disengaged.
    I met someone the other day who, when asked, by a wonderful yes and politically astute friend of mine in his late 70s, how he would be voting, his answer? ‘my heart says yes but my head says no’. That came from someone who also claims to be a CND supporter, the exchange we had when we tried to question him further became a bit animated! The wizard of oz came to mind for some reason.

    I had the misfortune to hear my right wing neighbours discuss how their properties would go down in price with a Independent yes vote, one said she is too old to move away now, I say it is never too late pet!

  132. Craig P says:

    I always thought Sharleen Spiteri was taking the piss when she said Scotland had no oil.

    goldenayr says:
    I see the beeb comedy unit are looking for jokes about the ref to turn into a prog.

    Just film the making of BBC Reporting Scotland, job done.

  133. Craig P says:

    Hewitt83 says:
    Some bird I know who lives in Norway is always moaning on her Facebook page about not getting to vote. She’d be a No if she did live here

    Slightly surprised at that. After living there myself, I’ve always maintained that a fortnight’s exposure to Scandanavia was a sure cure for unionism!

  134. Muscleguy says:

    What you describe as cognitive dissonance is in fact confirmation bias. CD is holding incompatible concepts in your head at once. Like being a scientist and a religious believer. That requires you never apply the principles of scientific evidence to your belief.

    Her problem is confirmation bias, as you defined it.

  135. CameronB says:

    Robert Peffers
    I hate being a pedant, but brainwashing is a violent and intrusive process that removes the individual’s personality (see CIA Project MKUltra). This then provides a clean slate, which can then be programmed in various ways (e.g. The Manchurian Candidate).

    Social conditioning is what the BBC/MSM do all day every day. They fill the public full of untruths and misconceptions which encourage them to cooperate unquestioningly. Just as Bertrand Russell recommended in his 1952 publication “The Impact of Science on Society”.

    Russell saw social conditioning as being one of the most important tasks of government.

  136. Alan Mackintosh says:

    Harry, use contact tab at the top

  137. Craig P says:

    Also, regarding low information voters.

    It always helps to work out where people are on the information curve, find out what facts and assumptions they have, before getting too deep in a slanging match. Away from the internet, I have yet to meet anyone who has heard of the McCrone report. Nobody who knows how GERS works. And plenty who think that being in favour of independence means you are racist.

    On our own side, I also read plenty comments from folk who think Scotland has never in the past benefited in any way from the union. As daft in its own way as thinking an independent Scotland today would be a basket case…

  138. cirsium says:

    The following article reports on some interesting research findings regarding facts and citizens in a democracy

  139. I thought id heard it all until my Dad told me a neighbour,who works at the scottish parliment no less,told him Scotland would not get any oil after independence!

    According to the neighbour who claims ‘I know cause I work there’,Norway will get the oil as its in their waters!

    I could hardly contain my laughter but the shocking thing is my Dad almost believed it,and this man is spouting this shite to the people he meets every day(he is a tour guide).

    Sometimes I think, can it get any worse…..?

  140. TheItalianJob says:


    Yes my sentiments too.

    I worked in Norway for approx 6 years in the 80’s and I’ve always said if every Scotsman went there and saw what Scandinavia was like they would easily see that Independence was best for Scotland too.

    PS: That was the 80’s, since then I’ve seen Norway has prospered even more since I was there.

  141. TheItalianJob says:


    Very interesting research paper.

    “researchers at the University of Michigan found that when misinformed people, particularly political partisans, were exposed to corrected facts in news stories, they rarely changed their minds. In fact, they often became even more strongly set in their beliefs. Facts, they found, were not curing misinformation. Like an underpowered antibiotic, facts could actually make misinformation even stronger.”

    This is what we are up against with some of the No’s. Some don’t even bother to check the facts when presented to them e.g. McCrone report, GERS, Barnett etc etc. Some haven’t even heard of some of these reports/articles you present to them.

    I only hope the majority of these don’t vote in September.

  142. rabb says:

    Closer to home I have a colleague who is a proud and patriotic Scot who lives in the south side of Glasgow.

    On raising the indy question said colleague replied that Scotland had no natural resources to speak of to survive on.

    I pointed out oil first. The reply……………….

    “Scotland doesn’t have any oil.”

    My reply “Yes we do, we have loads in the north sea”.

    Colleague’s answer:

    “It doesn’t belong to us. The arabs bought it all off the government. It belongs to them”.

    A part of me died that evening!

  143. john king says:

    Considering she say “Scotland has no oil” suggests she knows there is oil in the north sea but believes it belongs to England and Scotland will lose any benefit from it post independence, did Charlene Spitieri not say something similar recently? maybe the government are putting about that its England’s oil and not ours?

  144. SquareHaggis says:


    Technically, most of the “known” oil has been sold off to foreign entities but Scotland woulsd stand to accrue all of the revenues currently going to London.

    Any further discoveries in Scottish waters after Independence would be Scottish oil.

  145. Viking Girl says:

    I can tell you the reason. It’s a combination of two things. One is that the lassie is a product of a very bad education system, and two is that she is so brainwashed she thinks all that rubbish she said is true.

  146. David L says:

    I had a recent, brief, Facebook conversation with a Scottish friend (who does live in Scotland) who stated that the oil was “long gone”. He never responded again after I posted a few (impartial) links about how much was left and the predicted 39,000 jobs that could be created in the next couple of years.

  147. MajorBloodnok says:

    Regarding oil ‘ownership’ it would be the licences to extract the oil within the various blocks that have been paid for by the oil companies. They don’t own the territory, they just own the right to explore and exploit in clearly defined areas.

    Of course the UK government has been selling these licences as quickly as possible to get the cash now and tie a future Scottish Government into less than favourable contractual straightjackets. However, as well as any future licences, the SG will determine the O&G tax regime and that is where the future revenues will come from (for the next 100 years or so – not to mention offshore tight-gas / shale gas opportunities).

  148. MajorBloodnok says:

    I should have added that the licences are time-limited and will expire eventually.

  149. rabb says:


    The drilling rights have been sold off. They still pay duty on each and every barrel extracted.

    The argument was that it was all sold off lock stock & barrel (pardon the pun) and that “the arabs” just take it all away.

  150. ronnie anderson says:

    @Debbiethe Bruce 2.46,I think your forgetting who set up the Holyrood parliament Debbie Lab/libdems, he might be a
    member of either,I could’nt make my last invitation to the Holyrood Parliament, where do you stay,I will make a point of tracking him down an putting him strait,there are rules in his employment & it would’nt take me long to find out if he has broken any.

  151. Oneironaut says:

    @jingly jangly
    “…not waste it watching a bag of air being kicked around!!!”

    So Blair MacDougall won’t be coming up here for a public debate then? 😉

    (Sorry, I saw that line and just couldn’t resist…)

  152. jingly jangly says:

    Re Jeremey Whine

    Unfortunately I caught about five minutes worth whilst driving. Mr Whine said no negativity, if your negative about the other side, I will sound a hooter and you are finished.

    Fine, one guy was doing a good job selling Indy, then he mentioned that BT were negative, he immediately got stopped in his tracks. Next up a lady from Carlisle , don’t go she begs, I don’t want to have to stop at the border and change my money visiting friends in Scotland. Apparently this was not negative as she was not stopped, thankfully I lost the signal and could not hear any more.

  153. jingly jangly says:


    No that would be a bag of hot air!!!

  154. Andy-B says:

    She’s a teacher in IT, information and technology, it beggars belief that she make such an asinine statement.

  155. ronnie anderson says:

    @Oneironaet,jingl jangly, thing is we canny get a kick o they bags o air ,they flyin/flyoot an the ither wans that stay here huddin public meetings we need CIA/MI5/6/7/8and GCHQ tae find oot where the hold they meetings an theres nae chance in asking a Question at a Televised debate.Ah jist keep rippin the mince oota them on hinternet.

  156. Martin says:

    I honestly don’t know if this makes our job harder or easier. Do we need to dumb our arguments down to get through to these type of people, before being able to actually discuss the referendum? Or do we simply let them know we do have oil and that is enough to change their views?

    I’m now more confused and upset than before.

  157. Andrew says:

    Maybe she means the oil is on the decline. Which we all know it is. To say we have no oil is wrong as you all say. To depend on it to finance an “independent” Scotland is just as absurd. Maybe its okay for a few decades but thats about it really.

  158. Derek McCabe says:

    To the last commentator; read Standard and Poor on Scotland being triple A economy. Re: Elaine Coates, these views are typical of people who have had 300+ years of dependent Scotland promulgated through generations of family, community, nation and of course its willing lackey the media.

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