The world's most-read Scottish politics website

Wings Over Scotland


What IS Labour’s policy on Trident?

Posted on August 30, 2012 by

Nationalists like to taunt Scottish Labour “leader” Johann Lamont for her reluctance to reveal her position on nuclear weapons. But in fairness to the little-seen notional chief, she’s hardly alone in her ambiguity. Despite the UK’s nuclear force being a huge issue, costing taxpayers tens of billions of pounds and being central to Britain’s permanent seat on the UN Security Council, one of the country’s two biggest political parties simply doesn’t seem to know – and hasn’t known for years, despite being in government on both sides of the border – whether it’s in favour of it or not.

As we noted earlier today, a Labour government resolved as recently as 2010 to replace the ageing weapon system with an upgraded version. But the overwhelming majority of over 230 with which that resolution passed was achieved thanks to the uniform support of Conservative MPs. Close to a third of Labour MPs – 94 out of a total of around 350 – opposed the motion along with all 55 Lib Dems and all six SNP members, and a narrow majority (31) of all Scottish MPs were against.

In the Scottish Parliament, meanwhile, renewal was overwhelmingly rejected despite (or perhaps because of) Labour refusing to take any position at all. A June 2007 vote conducted just after the SNP’s historic victory saw the Trident replacement scheme voted against by a comprehensive majority of 71-16, with all but four of Labour’s MSPs abstaining while the SNP, Lib Dems and Greens (along with the four Labour rebels) all voted No, and only the Tories backing the policy that the UK Labour government had chosen and voted to impose on Scotland.

It’s extraordinary that Labour has managed to maintain such a startlingly contradictory position for so long. Just two months ago the party’s shadow defence spokesman, Scottish MP Jim Murphy, blogged a statement from his fellow shadow defence minister Alison Seabeck reiterating that Labour’s official policy was to back Trident renewal. Yet in the country where the weapon system is sited, 37% of its Westminster MPs (15 from 41) voted against the proposal and not a single one of its Holyrood MSPs was prepared to vote in favour.

It’s difficult to overstate what a bizarre situation that is. That 37% is the very same percentage of Lib Dem MPs (21 from 56) who voted against the tuition-fees increase in England, having signed a conspicuous public pledge months earlier promising to do so. Yet the Scottish Labour MPs had made no such pledge.

An official Labour Party policy which chiefly affects Scotland, then, is backed by barely 60% of its Westminster Scottish MPs, and by 0% of its Holyrood MSPs. Of the six people who stood for the Scottish leadership in 2011 just 33% support renewal, while the successful candidate refuses to tell us what her oft-changed personal view is.

(Or indeed the Scottish party’s position, given its supposed policy independence from London. The 2011 Scottish Labour election manifesto makes no mention of Trident, or nuclear weapons in general, anywhere in its 98 pages.)

It’s incredible, in the literal sense of the word, that Labour feels able to make dramatic and strident pronouncements on the subject while cynically looking both ways at once. Poor old Ian Davidson is apparently so confused he rages against disarmament as a dire consequence of independence, despite not just opposing renewal but wanting the existing system scrapped.

Johann Lamont constantly angrily demands that the SNP detail every last possible consequence of a Yes vote in the referendum. Perhaps it’s time she set an example and started telling us what a No vote will mean. If, that is, she has any idea.

7 to “What IS Labour’s policy on Trident?”

  1. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Aha the nuclear Trident question.
     
    I have it on good authority 😆 that Scottish Labour policy is that if they, Labour, don’t mention Trident then it can’t possibly exist! 😆
     
    The only things that exist in the alternate universe inhabited by Labour are things that Labour want to speak about. Nothing else exists! :LOL:

    Reply
  2. Cuphook says:

    I thought a thought but the thought I thought wasn’t the thought I thought I thought.

    Mind you – this could be applied to any of their policies.   

    Reply
  3. Arbroath 1320 says:

    WHIT?
     
    Labour have POLICIES!
     
    Will wonders NEVER cease?
     
    Does the Lamentable one know that Labour have policies I wonder.
     
    Naw, she disnae know about any Labour policy, if she did she’d be the first to be seen shouting from the roof tops. Wouldn’t she?

    Reply
  4. Doug Daniel says:

    Perhaps someone in the mainstream media would like to take them to task about this, and find out their position once and for all? After all, if someone is trying to tell us that Scottish independence leading to nuclear disarmament for the UK is a bad thing, the very first question that would pop into my head would be “so you’re against nuclear disarmament, then?”

    Meanwhile, the SNP tries to debate a nuanced change on their position on NATO, and it’s talked about as if they’re just blithely changing their anti-nuke stance. The level of hypocrisy is stunning, absolutely stunning.

    Reply
  5. James McLaren says:

    Their policy is to have as many policies as is necessary by the circumstance and time of the need.
     
    In Scotland, they have a compliant MSM who never ask questions of them and their cognitive dissonances.
     
    The word, any word today, is the message, if it can been repeated authoritively ad nauseum.

    Reply
  6. Arbroath 1320 says:

    I know I’m O/T here, but I’ve just watched this video of Ryan, no NOT the guy with sausage rolls and wee dugs but the Republican V.P. candidate. Having listened to it I reached a point where I was uncertain about who he was ACTUALLY talking about. Was he REALLY talking about Obama and the Democrats? I felt for sure he was talking about the Tories, RED, BLUE and YELLOW, as well as the Bitter Together campaign. 😆
     
    link to order-order.com

    Reply
  7. Arbroath 1320 says:

    Sorry folks, I’ve just read this over on NNS.
    link to newsnetscotland.com
    Are we worried folks?
    Well I don’t think WE are worried but Westminster sure as hell are! 😆

    Reply


Comment - please read this page for comment rules. HTML tags like <i> and <b> are permitted. Use paragraph breaks in long comments. DO NOT SIGN YOUR COMMENTS, either with a name or a slogan. If your comment does not appear immediately, DO NOT REPOST IT. Ignore these rules and I WILL KILL YOU WITH HAMMERS.


  • About

    Wings Over Scotland is a thing that exists.

    Stats: 6,902 Posts, 1,240,942 Comments

  • Recent Posts

  • Archives

  • Categories

  • Tags

  • Recent Comments

    • James on The value bet: “What are the chances of you voting Tory? (100%).May 6, 23:09
    • Confused on The value bet: “One thing people should realise is that the polls can also be bent; he who pays the piper – one…May 6, 23:05
    • Mark Beggan on The value bet: “So you will be able to collect your winnings in 2326.May 6, 23:04
    • James Che on The value bet: “Did you know that Statues of the realm of England do not contain any Scottish or Irish Statues. Even after…May 6, 22:45
    • James Che on The value bet: “I foresee Scotlands independent country voting for a further three hundred years of Colonial rule and missing the open goal.…May 6, 22:26
    • Geri on The value bet: “Let me see… Is it cause two of them actually attempt to serve Scots & they’re not genocidal peado apologists?…May 6, 22:25
    • James Che on The value bet: “We hve been an independent Country in Scotlant since 1707, Whats wrong? You want to pretend that your in a…May 6, 22:18
    • Rev. Stuart Campbell on The value bet: “Same either way: fuck-all.May 6, 21:17
    • sarah on The value bet: “Cheer yourselves up, folks, by listening to Eva Comrie and others on today’s Barrhead Boy podcast. Then tomorrow go and…May 6, 21:07
    • Campbell Clansman on The value bet: “Better question: How on earth could Scottish voters consider voting for the parties that have misgoverned them this century? SNP,…May 6, 20:50
    • Campbell Clansman on The value bet: “What are the odds of the Alliance winning a “bucketload of seats?” Zero. Better question: What are the odds of…May 6, 20:46
    • Captain Caveman on Seven Days Too Long: “Bravo.May 6, 18:49
    • Dan on Seven Days Too Long: “No, Lorna. TH is right, as many didn’t speak out with any worth. Plenty supposedly pro returning Scotland to self-governance…May 6, 18:38
    • Lorncal on Seven Days Too Long: “Geri: the police could be heard quite clearly saying: drop the knife, drop the knife. He wouldn’t drop it and…May 6, 18:32
    • Mark Beggan on The value bet: “How on earth could Scottish voters consider voting for the SNP? 10 years of lies, mismanagement, theft, sexual deviation, bullying,…May 6, 18:09
    • Lorncal on Seven Days Too Long: “They did and were silenced by various methods. As far as I am aware, all of them spoke out and…May 6, 18:05
    • Mark Beggan on The value bet: “It wasn’t connected to the grass roots!May 6, 17:54
    • Fearghas MacFhionnlaigh on Binfire Of The Vanities: “With respect, you must ponder deeper. It is not philosophy as such which we are warned to be wary of,…May 6, 17:53
    • Lorncal on Seven Days Too Long: “Wife: you make fair points. I know that ISP stands up for women, but they are not standing everywhere, and…May 6, 17:53
    • Mark Beggan on The value bet: “The tent covered all the issues?!May 6, 17:52
    • Effigy on The value bet: “How on earth could Scottish voters consider voting for Reform? 71 years of rejecting the Tories it looks like many…May 6, 17:47
    • agentx on The value bet: “Alliance to Liberate Scotland don’t register on polls and don’t register on betting odds.May 6, 17:43
    • Captain Caveman on Seven Days Too Long: “@Lorncal “We cannot rely on any of the parties to support women’s rights when push comes to shove and they…May 6, 17:24
    • Sven on The value bet: “Tent collapsed eh, well, that’s poles for you.May 6, 17:15
    • Mark Beggan on The value bet: “‘I took a poll recently and 100% of campers were very angry when their tent collapsed’!May 6, 17:09
    • Shug on The value bet: “Give us an idea of Swinneys option if A) he gets an overall majority B) he gets a minority gov…May 6, 17:07
    • Tommy on The value bet: “The Greens coming second would be the nightmare of nightmares. I mean, they even make the SNP look good. Another…May 6, 17:05
    • agentx on Anas Sarwar is a winner: ““While critics have pointed to the lack of formal, traditional trade union recognition, in May 2024, the Usdaw union stated…May 6, 17:00
    • Colin Dawson on The value bet: “Tactical voting could turn all current predictions upside down. What are the odds of Alliance to Liberate Scotland winning a…May 6, 16:56
    • KOF on Binfire Of The Vanities: “Colossian 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the…May 6, 16:47
  • A tall tale



↑ Top