Us, now, or never
We have fifteen hours.
The next fifteen hours mark the only ones in the entire history of time in which the fate of Scotland has rested democratically in the hands of its people. In 1707 the country was sold from under its people’s feet by a tiny handful of “nobles”. Before that it was won or lost in blood and sorrow. Today, the will of the people – every man and woman with one equal vote, regardless of wealth or property – shall decide.
Voting Yes won’t magically solve our problems overnight. But they’ll be ours to own and solve for ourselves. We need not do things in the way they’ve “always been done”. We can take Scotland – a nation at once both proudly ancient and reborn afresh – and shape it in whatever form we choose.
It will be a land not inherited from our predecessors – for they never owned it to give – but lent to us by our children, to build into a place they can prosper and flourish, not be forced to leave in search of opportunity. For those already driven away, a home worth returning to. And for those who’ve never been, a welcoming beacon of hope.
All those Scotlands, shared by all of us. Something old. Something new. Something borrowed. You know the rest.
Our enemies are not the good people of England. They, like us and much of the rest of the world, suffer the injustices and indignities imposed by a ruling class which has no nation but power and no language but money.
A new feudalism grips the planet, a reversal of much of the progress of the 20th century. Workers have seen their rights diminished, and ever-greater toil yields an ever-smaller share of the rewards, which are greedily hoarded by the wealthy on a scale not seen since medieval times. Our children are placed under a yoke of enormous debt before their working lives even begin, our elderly pushed ever closer to the grave before they can rest.
Independence alone is not the solution. But it is the vital first step that makes the solution possible. Many of those in the rest of the UK, and elsewhere across the world, look enviously on the chance we hold in our hands today, and urge us to use it, to show that another way is possible.
If we vote Yes we will remain allies, comrades-in-arms and friends with our brothers and sisters to the south, and this time it will be a friendship forged from respect, not subservience or subsidy. But if we hand back power meekly to the Bullingdon elite like a cowed serf whose courage deserted him at the last moment we will have earned only their contempt, and it will be richly deserved and pitilessly exercised.
Those who rule over us had forgotten fear, except as a tool. They buy governments. They laugh in the face of the law. They own the press. The real, unelected holders and wielders of power are immune to transient politicians reliant on patronage.
But they’re afraid now.
You know it’s true. Have you ever in your life seen such blind, hysterical panic on the normally-serene faces of the insatiable rich? Have you ever before this day witnessed the privileged and powerful – the captains of industry, the commanders of armies, the self-proclaimed “masters of the universe” – in such abject, frenzied terror, cajoling and pleading and warning and bullying, saying anything they can think of to stop us?
Why do you think that is? Is it because they’re scared FOR us – they who’ve never previously cared about anything except our votes and our money, they who despise the frail and torment the vulnerable? Or is it because they’re scared OF us?
They have not been this weak in three centuries, and they will never be this weak again in our lifetimes. For let there be no mistake: they will not allow this unexpected, unforeseen peril, this democracy no longer de-fanged but suddenly red in tooth and claw, to threaten them twice.
We have no need of guns or bombs. This revolution will have no martyrs, no widows, no orphans. For fifteen precious hours our land can be won for a cross in a box. For one fleeting moment, our foes’ flank is exposed, all their mighty weapons useless.
On them, readers. On them. They fail.
It’s that bad it might be good
Tory’s won’t agree to more powers Westminster
then labour is fooked
The state have been at great lengths to damage us. The TV are the states best toys. Try and remember your watching a state tool ????
They were always gonna call NO votes first it the MSM waken up.
just wait folks a couple of YES results and you’ll be singing yer heeds off.
Have faith in the people of Scotland.
Were at war folks and Wingers know this.
The state have been at great lengths to damage us. The TV are the states best toys. Try and remember your watching a state tool ????
They were always gonna call NO votes first it the MSM waken up.
just wait folks a couple of YES results and you’ll be singing yer heeds off.
Have faith in the people of Scotland.
Were at war folks and Wingers know this. 30 to go out of 32 yes
Westminster have sent people to die in illegal wars for oil – am not surprised they would fix a vote for oil also – mi5 and whoever else could pull this off could easily mess with postal votes and ballot boxes – it’s either that or the majority of people you know and liars – you decide.
There do appear to be a number of questions arising out of this referendum James.
There is something going on with the electorate BJ that does not sit easy with me. Why on earth would people who have not been on the electoral roll for decades, or never voted, suddenly go to be registered to vote and then NOT vote? This does not sit well with me at all.
No claiming W. Dunbartonshire could be YES with 53%, if that figure bang on that is strange. How can they call it so specifically. Keep an eye out for that one.
Tweet from 2hrs ago…
Scriptonite @Scriptonite · 2h
Anyone else weirded out by confidence of no campaign despite zero exit poll or results?
@ Big Jock
I feel your disappointment and I hope to God that we reach a point where we can celebrate, but I beg you don’t stop voting. Our vote is literally ALL we have in terms of a way to change the status quo. If you silence your voice how will we ever drown out our dissenters. Always vote. Always express your opinion. On as many subjects as possible. Only by our silence is the other side 100% guaranteed to win.
No, that seems to be exactly what has happened – the middle class no voters saw the poll results a fortnight ago and were motivated to get out and vote; but the same poll results had the *reverse* effect on the working-class areas.
But why was the Edinburgh vote so strongly no? I saw very little no campaign publicity, far more for yes.
Over the next week when westminster announces were going to war/were getting no new powers/there’s lots of oil/ I hope no voters get the soul crushing shame they deserve.
Disgusted
Shetland vote NO
It’s all going Pete Tong!
Everywhere seems to be favouring No on anticipated outcome! Gutted
I still think Jim Sillars’ contribution (“a day of reckoning for the banks”) did more harm than good.
If I’m at an airport,I’m denying I’m Scottish
I hope we arent seeing a trend here 2 declared no’s already not loosing hope yet tho my spirits have been dampened and wtf happened in glasgow pretty low turnout from a yes stronghold i though man im getting a wee bit depressed
Kevin Evans,
The me, me, me voters will feel no shame.
I just hope they feel the pain.
Do try to remember we have been conditioned to ‘not quite make it’ for so long that at the slightest whiff of not making it we automatically protect ourselves by diving right into pre disappointment, before the game is over. This ultimately lessens the ‘blow’ we have now decided is coming our way. Maybe it’s a good strategy as it does keep our feet on the ground.
Let’s remember the journey to alter a quite significant proportion of us into even considering this has been monumental from the original starting point. This is not over friends. Even if it is a No today, we are still here tomorrow…Let’s not deal in bitterness when we have accomplished the switching on of a younger generation who have known nothing but this current paradigm. And let’s remember they are our future, long after we have gone. And seriously cut the crap with the ‘revenge’ patter, we’ll have no ‘hunting’ or other such suggestions on this site, let’s not at this hour be talking the language of hate.
As others have said, it’s not over yet, get a grip.
link to perthgazette.co.uk
Apologies if I’m the umpteenth person to have posted this.
Shetland no surprise there,
I feel sick here, on the verge of tears, just cannot believe these people call themselves Scots, to not believe in their country….. To want to prop up the millionaires in WM, so disgusted
Not sure about Jim Sillars but Tommy Sheridan on TV on Sunday calling everyone brothers and sisters and talking of revolution and solidarity wouldn’t have won many votes from undecided voters. I’m guessing may also have alienated many outwith the central belt area.
If anyone from any of the corrupt three unionist parties says to my face ANY time in the future but we guaranteed you more powers I swear I’ll lay they out cold, disabled or not! We all know that with the Tory backbench revolt that is simmering away under the surface at Westminster ALL that shite that Brown kept spewing out to his magnificent few will NEVER materialise!
Shetland result
5669 YES 36.29%
9951 NO 63.71%
Total YES 26902
Total NO 38991
Vote differential 12089
Total votes 65893
i heard a rumour that fife was telling voters that they werent around to vote very worrying and the fire alarm in dundee seems fishy would be the perfect time to fix the vote.
It must be a wake outside scottish parliament
West lothian not as bad as we thought
This is a battle, the war is yet to be WON ! Scotland has the worlds attention !
Aye please No revenge nonsense we are better than that…still 30 to declare not even half way there yet.
Fuck all Scottish Unionists and all that voted NO. I personally will not speak to anyone that I know for a fact voted NO. Fuck them. If it’s NO, I hope that a Tory/UKIP Coalition win at Westminster, and vote down all promised powers for Edinburgh, along with the abolition of the Barnett Formula, plus Massive Benefit Cuts. I hope a Labour/Liberal/Tory Coalition wins in Holyrood and has to implement all the Tory/UKIP cuts.
SCOTLAND: BBBBBBBBAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.
Stephen.
There are two Scotlands. Establishment and us. We are the minority unfortunately. Let’s be honest if we lose forget it Westminster will make sure we never get this chance again like the Catalans!
Next step: How easy is it to get Irish citizenship?
Lesley-Anne
I was right about crick
he was talking shate
( : > )
Re 75% turnout in Glasgow.
Unfortunately, I think the Celtic European game affected turnout at night – along with the dreich weather.
The game was on in loads of living rooms all over the place.
By the time it was over at 8pm, it was dark.
When you are aiming for a large traditional labour / working class vote, unfortunately that was one of the co-incidences that conspired against us – especially with it being a Celtic game and not Rangers.
You wouldn’t think a football match would come secondary to the future of your country, but there you go..
James Kelly has thrown in the towel. I am trying not to greet.
Bugs the nos will get what’s coming to them but unfortunately so will we because of them.That’s where the anger comes from.But I suppose we are bigger than them. Watch Scotland disappear and the UK fall out with Europe and the right wingers take over. I actually feel sorry for Billy Bragg he had faith in us!
I won’t vote again either if it’s a No result.
Scotland,wtf have you done? You have voted to lose your teeth,you have voted to give away your great resources and to pay more taxes. You have enabled the Tories,they are laughing at you right now. Laughing. At you.
Meanwhile,Labour Lords will continue to fight for socialist values on your behalf from the House of Lords. It’s not over yet,but Lord Forsyth,your old dictator,smirks on telly. Couldn’t make it up.
Only feart Scots to blame here if it doesn’t happen. You seem to have voted for uncertainty,how many will be applauding when Mr Brown gets congratulated by Mr Cameron for delivering Scotland to his mercies?
Eat Renfrewshire result is coming up. That is a solidly NO constituency so don’t get upset at the result.
How can you,with the world watching,cower away from your nations independence?
It’s shameful.
Night people,20 years i have prayed for this.
You are all true patriots of Scotland,you have been an inspiration and i can at least take comfort from the fact that at least some of us had the courage to stand up to the threats that we have endured.
To all that voted against your country’s independence,i disown you.
Rev Stu says
TV just switched itself off. I’m taking the hint. We gave it a shot, folks. Our countrymen and women bottled it and failed us all.
The good news is, you have changed the world !
@ Nana Smith.
They didn’t attend the sealing of boxes and the final tallies, nor indeed the last 2 hours of voting at a Station I was at. I am suspicious.
Thoughtso can anyone apply for Irish citizenship? My great grandparents were Irish!
Rev Stu just gave up, as he says we gave it our best shot but the British establishment was just too powerful. I commend everyone who gave up their valuable time to fight this cause, you are all Scottish heroes.
I am getting through my last message didnt show
Not undestanding now. All supposedly big YES areas with very low turn out. BBC camp out at official (I’m worth loads Mr Snow) post vote party. First talk track is what new NO powers mean. We faught the Imperial Masters, the MSM, the zombie nation SLAB and look to have come up short. I wish for an epiphany and turnaround but seems feeling good after a doorstep chat doesn’t quite cut it compared to polling orgs. Oh, and sanctimonious shite about healing and coming together won’t wash with me. I am now bitter together.
This is a fix, right from the start, before a single vote was counted the narrative was for a no victory. Rigged, disgusting. Vile Unionists lying troughers. No cooperation. They are unforgivable. They are to be shunned utterly.
STV are saying No is likely to have won in Angus. What on earth is going on?
Discovered a new game. Flick the channels quickly and see how many millionaires you can count, then how many Lords .
Yes Robyn there is a time to fight. But there must be something worth fighting for. Time to just be a normal person and forget Scotland and politics. We have really blown it big time!
BTW Stu, without you we wouldn’t even have got this close, you are an extraordinary person and I thank you for all you have done.
link to cic.gc.ca
Western Isles votes no
Western Isles
19758 votes cast
86.2%
9195 YES 46.58%
10944 NO 53.42%
Lost Western Isles. I am going to bed. Goodnight.
Margo MacDonald said this was the day of reckoning. Well we have collectively voted to be the Tory’s bitch again. Expect Carswell to get elected for UKIP next month, and the Tories to benefit for saving the Union. Labour will now be on the receiving end of another Project Fear from now to the general election, and Miliband will lead them to disaster next year. The MSM/No campaign will now press for Salmond to stand down. Expect a massive amount of triumphalism from them.
Another one votes no this is not looking good at all
@K1
Do try to remember we have been conditioned to ‘not quite make it’ for so long that at the slightest whiff of not making it we automatically protect ourselves by diving right into pre disappointment, before the game is over.
K1 – There is a parallel to that – in that Scots have been treated as a second class culture for so long, we can’t actually bring ourselves to win. Honourable failure is good enough for lots of us.
There is also a widespread spirit of apathy, that serves as a protection mechanism – If we don’t really care, then we can’t get hurt too much..
C’mon, give us a win somewhere…
How could we lose the Western Isles?
I keep trying to sleep but can’t. Then I check the tablet again and wish I could.
If we don’t hit 45% I’m not voting again
Folks, like many others I’m trying to remain optimistic. However, James Kelly, Scot Goes Pop has posted : “I’m struggling to see a credible path for an outright Yes victory.” I’m beginning to feel the same.
The point about the results declared so far is that, although they may be smaller authorities, & although they may be areas where Yes was not expected to win, they show nevertheless a trend in voting patterns. If Yes was going to win, the reality is their share of the vote would be up on the results already declared. And it’s not helped either by cities like Glasgow & Dundee having a relatively lower turnout. I may be wrong – I sincerely hope I am – & I’ll be happy to take all the abuse tomorrow if Yes wins.
But if it’s a No win, it demonstrates conclusively that we are nation of political cowards. 18 years of Thatcherism, 13 of Blair/Brown New Labour neo-liberalism, & another 5 (possibly 10) of Cameron….. and we vote for more of the same. You could not make it up. I salute my fellow Yes voters, Wingers & everyone else in the truly inspirational coalition that comprised the Yes campaign. But for the rest of my fellow Scots who voted No – I have no sympathy for you whatsoever. You deserve everything that Westminster throws at you & comes your way. You have sowed the seed, now you can reap the whirlwind.
Smell it….rigged and reeking to high heaven.
Pahaha! Can’t even win the Western Isles! This could be the death of the indy movement …
My last post of the night, it’s 10 am here and I’ve been up for 2 days.
Surprised at the Western Isles result, as will the Yes camp up there. It was a really positive vibe and can only suspect that the older voters turned out in force.
Keep the faith folks, it’s still small numbers between the yes and no votes so still all to play for, I hope to waken up to good news in about 8 hours time. If so, have a dram for me since it’s a month till my next one.
I am afraid that it looks like people were lying to canvassers that they were going to vote Yes. Presumably too embarrassed to admit that we should not run our own affairs. We should now steal ourselves for the inevitable consequences of a No vote. The happy clappy always positive, always smiling approach was not effective. We let ourselves been harassed by No/MSM. Our representatives should have told them to stop interrupting them when on debates and the MSM. There appears to have been a lack of a cutting edge. We were too nice.
It seems all the men are giving up and going in the huff with the country they love. Ok, we may lose this one but we have made big head ways into the argument. This is only the start, people will realise that this is just the beginning. We have been the underdogs and will win more media support with this. You can see from the observers that they cannot give up on this and this has always been the way things are with us. Support will now grow from now on especially when people realise how it is going. Rev stu started this so please don’t give up on him. He will ultimately win.
I am ashamed
It appears an instruction has been sent to all national bodies Soccer Rugby etc. that, with immediate effect the national anthem of Scotland will revert to God Save the Queen.
Western Isles is 2 on the richter scale (0 – 10) of YES wins. ie. no chance. Orkney was 0. BUT Clackmannanshire was 10 so should have been a YES
Why are you being so negative?
I don’t have the link to the table which lists the constituencies and the likelihood of their vote. Will look to see if I can post it. Keep calm.
@Big Jock:
can anyone apply for Irish citizenship?
Look here. I hope you don’t need to use it.
I died, God Bless you all.
Blast, didn’t post a link —
link to citizensinformation.ie
SNP vote not holding up
@Mairileen
The Quebec vote was much closer than this will be and what has happened there in the intervening 20 years, fuck all, absolutely fuck all. This “country” ha fucking ha, is finished, welcome to North Britain.
We need a massive inquest now into what went wrong.
I can’t sleep at all. Every time I go to bed I just lie there tossing and turning, and now I read that we’re losing. I guess I have no country anymore. Unless we miraculously win this, I’ll be having a bonfire later. All my Yes stuff, my polling card, my Get The Vote Out list, the Saltire hanging up in my garage, the Ecosse sticker off the back of the 964. I can’t even see me wearing my kilt again. I am utterly ashamed of you, Scotland.
We need a massive inquest now into what went wrong.
Always remember folks. We have had the WHOLE of the printed media bar one against us. We have EVERY single Television channel against us. Yet despite this we have stood up strong. WE have held our heads up high. WE can be proud that we did what we could to spread the TRUTH!
WE can sleep easy in our beds folks cause we fought for what we believed in for the future of our kids and grandkids. We know that every single representative of the other side are bunch of LIARS. Their day of comeuppance is on its way! We the TRUE people of Scotland will NEVER forget what these COWARDS have done to our country!
Retribution is sweet best served COLD!
Yeah I know Onwards…and we let ourselves care again…
If we can’t win in places like Angus then something stinks. Something doesn’t feel right about these results.
Another fire alarm in Dundee. If Dundee is a no win, the it is a fix.
Just in. All national bodies in Scotland eg soccer rugby hockey etc have been emailed and told that with effect 0900 hours tomorrow the national anthem of Scotland is to revert to God Save the Queen
No actual figures but SKY appear to saying that Dundee is 55% to 45% in favour of YES!
Shafted
We have made great progress and even if we do not win tonight we are still further forward than we were. No has played on fears not love of Britain. Winning by terrorising pensioners is not an affirmation of the Union.
I only just discovered this site today, but I would like to take this opportunity to thank everyone here for everything they’ve done and tried to do for Scotland and the world.
Even if we fail today, I pray that the work we’ve begun here in Scotland will someday bear fruit.
Fuck this we have been robbed of our democracy by wall to wall propaganda. Not. Accepting.This. Pish.
After this is finished we have another battle to fight – against the BBC.
Looks like we’re going to be stuck with the nest of paedophiles in Westminster, among many things. HURRAH. ‘Fire alarms’ at Dundee look fishy. All I can say is that at least we have encouraged some kind of movement towards ‘Yes’ and that this will probably not be forgotten.
So everyone leaves everything unattended on the tables – again??! What – then the dodgy guys come out from where they were hiding etc? One fire alarm drill not long enough to do the deed?
Why the hell are the counts taking so long we should be up to at least ten.
I only just discovered this site yesterday, but I would like to take this opportunity to thank everyone here for everything they’ve done and tried to do for Scotland and the world.
Even if we fail today, I pray that the work we have begun here in Scotland will someday bear fruit.
I am away to bed. Sleep suddenly feels never more enticing.
boris says:
19 September, 2014 at 3:20 am
Just in. All national bodies in Scotland eg soccer rugby hockey etc have been emailed and told that with effect 0900 hours tomorrow the national anthem of Scotland is to revert to God Save the Queen
best laugh of the night
This morning I had plans to change my country for the better – now am making plans to emigrate.
It’s been fun. The youth may get us there in the future. If not it is the end of Scots and Hello Britain’s got Talent forever. Hope I wake up wrong but been here to often to expect a miracle especially with low turnouts. Let’s look after each other but when it comes to ‘Scotland’ well ….. Bye bye and thanks to all I am done with country.
Looks like the fearty factor trumps the fuckit factor…ashamed of the proudscots
After every fire alarm dundee,the yes vote pile gets smaller
why don’t they just get a match
I am ashamed to call myself Scottish. Never thought I’d say that but I am.
We are going out with a wee whimper.. pathetic.
Westminster will screw us into the ground now.. until our oil runs out.. then they will disregard us anyway. No point in independence then.
Press and the BBC have screwed us as well.. especially the bloody BBC.
What a message we are sending out to the world.. a joke!!
I still don’t believe it’s all been above board either.
I am truly sorry for the SNP, Alex and Nicola who worked themselves stupid for this country, and all the Yes movement, but I have had it with people that side with Westminster, choose to ignore the cesspit, and see their own swimming in it. A lot of will weep for Scotland tonight. I wondered why Glasgow was 75% turnout, and now I know from the comment above – fucking football – says it all.
So Yes was apparently 71% in Dundee, after two fire alarms its now 54%.
Of course it’s not been above board – we have witness in full view corruption from the BBC, treasury, banks, supermarket – so what honest part of you think messing around with postal votes, turning away voter because they’ve been told theyve already voted – the list goes on – complete fix
Yes, Lesley-Anne, you are right, we can hold our heads high. It seems the liars have won but their lies will find them out and soon.
I’m just going by the number of votes in so far – roughly 85,000 …. haven’t we got a couple of million to go with a current difference of only 13,500 and 28 council areas still to confirm?
I didn’t detect any downcast demeanour in any of the top YES campaign leaders – did the super-computer figure cruncher at Bute House get hacked this time?
Final count to be declared between 6-9 am. EH!
I am scunnered beyond comprehension but am hanging on to the pride I feel in being part of this extraordinary YES campaign. I will not be bitter and I will not allow this setback to deflect me from our goal.
We were underdogs every step of the way and it appears that our country is not yet ready for independence, but it will come.
Please ensure that nothing we say or do in reaction to tonight’s results damages our long-term aspirations.
Westminster will not change, we will see no significant new devolved powers and we will make sure that every Labour voter is reminded repeatedly that their party has betrayed them and the people they purport to represent.
Landslide SNP win at the next Holyrood election and onward to Independence from there.
Please remember that, when chapping no-voters doors, how often did we hear “I would love for Scotland to be independent but…”
The long game is the only game now, let’s not alienate any individual, let’s maintain the dignity displayed throughout this fantastic campaign and let us build a significant consensus for Independence, for my kids and yours and for their kids too.
JM.
I’m as bitterly disappointed as the rest of you. Possibly more so – I’m on long term disability and in Austerity Britain my personal outlook is deeply bleak.
But we keep fighting. When WM reneges on the Pledge – and it will – then all the NOs who voted out of fear will realise their error. If we lose this 40-60 then that is a sufficiently significant proportion to demand another referendum in the near rather than far future.
It’s only over if we give up. NEVER give up!
I’m really disappointed that some of you are taking the huff after 4 out of 30 odd results have yet to be declared.
It’s not over until over 2.4 million votes are in eithers favour and so far its only at 86K !
Bitter together
Every broken platitude, every nonsense promise, every sold out Lord, every mind dumbingly expensive vanity project, every militaristic projection of brewers droop erctile-ism, every collusion with big business to impoverish the people called out. That is what we are here. I went into this this accepting I and my family will be poorer (but not really really hand scooping beans in a foodbank poor). I have given but for what? If we lose this new media must continue – not speaking to ourselves, cojoling (falsely) but being heard. VIEWING doesn’t equal SEEING, HEARING doesn’t equal LISTENING. WISHING doesn’t equal DOING.
This is NOT democracy. What I feared has happened. Not only does London control the media, they also control the fiddling of the results. Sad, sad, so sad.
Scotland is now a broken country. There will be no healing. I will NEVER forgive those ‘scottish’ cowards who voted NO, and I shall never until the day I die ever give ANYBODY from the Labour party the time of day – they really are the filth of Scotland, worse than pigs.
Gordon Brown, Tory puppet, Scotland’s disgrace.
Enjoy your misery Scotland. Enjoy your London Tory rule, and just remember, YOU VOTED FOR IT.
Soon as I can (might take a couple of years or so) I’m out of here, to a more porgressive country – one where democracy is real, and not a charade. Ashamed to call myself a Scot. Ashamed.
Fife going NO too.
The older demographic voted NO in too many numbers and our young ones will have to try again but not many with a fire in their belly at the moment but they will learn.
I am not ashamed I only have one vote and voted for independence.
Cameron will be issuing weasel words of reconciliation later and lashings of jam.
Labour strongholds are yet to be announced in the main hope they get what they deserve.
@muttley79
“We need a massive inquest now into what went wrong”
No we don’t, the people have spoken and they have capitulated to fear or their own greed.
@ Democracy Reborn
“You have sowed the seed, now you can reap the whirlwind”
Yes, and I hope the sooner the better.
As far as “Scottish Govt” is concerned ( and I think they have done a fantastic job by the way), they should dissolve the Govt’ and call an election immediately.
How the fuck can people register to vote one week and then not turn out in the most important vote possible? I smell shite
You guys have inspired and educated me but now your pissing me off with your defeatist attitudes are you for real. What the hell has happened to you I’m hoping it’s just coz you are tired – get a grip you’re making me think your just bull shiters and this site is just a wind up. I assume you are grown ups stop acting like spoilt brats
inverclyde
thx
Inverclyde result
27243 YES 49.92%
27329 NO 50.08%
86 bloody votes in Inverclyde.
Totally ashamed to be Scottish tonight,will never go or support our national teams again.A region of cowards.
Hope lives in Inverclyde !
Postal vote FRAUD
Ps hope I am very wrong
BBC 4 at Strathclyde University where they have said several times that YES is 99% of the vote. BUT they are interviewing their 3rd NO voter ot of 4.
Inverclyde a NO. Should have been a NO 2 on the richter scale so a disappointing NO according to predictions.
In fact no I’m still up since this internet is so damn slow.
Agree with the earlier post about people lying to canvassers, and being too ashamed to admit that they were voting no. That’s whats happened I think. Scared to their core by the media. A fukn disgrace and possibly a wee bit of vote rigging thrown in for good measure.
I see the % so far is 58 to 42, exactly what was mentioned much earlier on this evening. Coincidence???
You can throw in the religious nutters for the Western Isles vote as well. Too many Wee Frees wanting to hold up the Union. But not wanting to be free.
Well said DoziR. People need to stiffen up.
Scots to the core, practised masters at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory
Even after Inverclyde gap between Yes and No virtually unchanged?
We could set up a kind of Declaration – those of us who voted yes, with our real names. As something tangible and permanent from the wonderful, inspiring campaign that seems to be being brutally extinguished.
Also would be interesting to see if it tallied numerically with the official vote.
Sorry. Should have been 2 on the Richter scale so huge NO. So narrow squeek vote is disappointing for NO.
Sorry I am just beat. Still hope for the yes. Only 13000 votes in it so far. Millions to play for.
Since the SNP came to power they have shielded us from the worst excesses of Westminster from the youngest to the eldest they have done all and more that could be expected of them
If this fails tonight by 1 vote or 1million it makes no difference it will feel that it has been thrown back in their face
The world is watching and our country, despite being constantly kicked in the balls, rolls over and takes it again.
No country rejects independence.. except us.. to stay in a union that owes £1.5 trillion!!
Hello world.. welcome to corrupt Britain where democracy is dead and buried!!
I’ll never vote again.
Tonight is lost, but the battle for Scottish independence is not over by a long shot. It’s a major setback, and we will take time to recover, but the onus is now on the three stooges to deliver.
People probably did genuinely think about voting YES, but bottled it at the last minute. They decided the least risky option was to give Westminster, just one last chance to come good on their promises. BT got their middle class vote out, YES did well, but turnouts in the cites were less than expected. Interesting that Labour voters seem to be more in favour of independence than SNP voters! Much of the rural SNP vote is obviously tactical.
I am more determined than ever. Gordon Brown once said “Whatever it takes”. We should say “however long it takes”. The fight goes on. When at first you don’t succeed.
I am concerned that many of the first time YES voters will be disillusioned. The missing million is in danger of disappearing again. We must not let that happen. We have to keep engaged with those people, keep them voting.
If we believe in independence, are we going to just give up? We owe it to our predecessors who fought the lonely battle to get us to this stage. We owe it to the missing million who came out to vote.
Scotland is not yet ready for independence. Scotand will be ready one day. When that happens, no powers on earth will be able to stop it.
It wasn’t our night. We live to fight another day.
Well guys i think im gonna go to be pretty depressed right now as its looking bloody terrible not worth staying up all no for a bunch of NO’s so dissapointed.
Unfortunatley it looks like they were right all along too many cowardly scots such a shame.
No reconciliation with liars, cheats and ("Tractor" - Ed)s.
Luigi,
How many fucking chances does Westminster deserve?
Scotland, enjoy your foodbanks.
Hope the Beeb are happy.. they have helped to kill Scotland.
Calgacus says:
Yes, Lesley-Anne, you are right, we can hold our heads high. It seems the liars have won but their lies will find them out and soon.
Thanks for that Calgcagus.
I am just so proud of every single one of you on here. We came and we fought. We fought like TIGERS! WE had right on our side fighting the LIARS, the CHEATS, the FRAUDSTERS, the MILLIONAIRES and we ran them DAMNED HARD!
I will NEVER forget everyone who had the guts to stand up and be counted in this fight against the machine!
Whenever the next voting chance comes along everyone of us should take the chance to give the COWARDS of WESTMINSTER and HOLYROOD the biggest kicking of their miserable litle lives!
There is still a heck of a long way to go to the winning line for both – I’m off to bed, hope to wake to find we’ve won by at least a single vote.
yep looks like the pensioners screwed the next generation hope they enjoy those pensions when the next financial crash comes and wipes em out we wont be able to help them cause we were screwed by them on this day lets be honest this country is F u c k e d UKIP ANYONE THATS WHATS COMING NEXT
I may be angry now but ill calm down tommorow and yes your right they used fear on the old but the crash thats coming i think they will wish they had not been cowed but i suppose they are more used to that than us i suppose……
I think that eloquently describes our plan B, LA
U.D.I.
scotspine says:
19 September, 2014 at 3:44 am
Luigi,
How many fucking chances does Westminster deserve?
None, but the majority of scots have decided to give them one chance, and we have to respect that. I believe it is one chance. They now have to deliver.
I am so so so angry. that’s it then. old black joe still pickin cotton for his buttons and bows and everybody knows the deal is rotten. that’s it then my life hasn’t amounted to much then. listening to these ‘scottish’ commentators I am an alien in an alien land. all fucking liars they are renaging already – they bought the vote – now they’re renaging on the ‘vow’
If this goes the way that media are predicting then I think I am finished with politics.
I am too old to ne oping for a change for the next generation.
O.n the other hand, I am still young enough to bear a grudge against some friends and acquaintances.
My politics, if any, may just be anti Labour …..my original party but then I see Murphy Curran, Lamont et al and I am pig sick.
I went to bed in 2011 expecting a Labour win. The reality proved otherwise. Let’s wait for the final result before any recriminations. This isn’t over. If, and it’s still an if, there’s a NO vote, the spotlight will shift onto the unionist cabal and their promises. If any of us were NO supporters, what would we expect? A reward for saving the union? A reality check awaits our fellow Scots following a NO vote. It’ll be painful. Let the Labour Scottish politicians crow. Scotland now expects. Let’s see them deliver, in the face of an aggressive Tory back bench revolt. But, I repeat, this isn’t over.
This isn’t an election folks, we haven’t lost a seat in Inverclyde, we’ve only lost 86 votes. Big areas still to come…..hold fast
How could so many Yes people, many of whom are seasoned campaigners, create an atmosphere and vibe which led us to believe that winning was possible? People on the ground reported on the positive reception, it looked as if the support was there and, according to opinion polls, growing, with momentum with us. Today there was a widespread chorus of tweets about No voters turning to Yes. It all seemed very positive.
All we got from BT over the years was lies and nastiness from people who weren’t fighting a referendum but refighting the last election campaign. There was nothing about addressing issues like lack of jobs and austerity, or talking of future possibilities.
Lesley Riddoch is on at present talking about her travels all over Scotland, encouraging engagement, Women for Indy, Business for Scotland. She is despondent that all the work done in those parts of the campaign over the last two years has been unable to make a Yes vote possible.
What happened in such a short space of time to turn the positive to the negative? People in Scotland have today turned their backs on the future and welcomed austerity and all the problems they seemed so desperate to leave behind. The scare stories pushed by BT and the media gained traction and people believed them. Some on the Yes side are saying that Scotland now has the best politically educated electorate in the world. That is not my view when so many are so willing to believe the scares and the offer of a few baubles, maybe, perhaps, at some time.
It’s 1979 all over again. We’ve been conned.
Lesley-Anne
thanks you said what i needed to say.
what a missed opportunity.
we got devo min vow and led into a vacuous cul de sac.
we tried our best, we hold our heads high.
that’s me off to bed now.
Luigi
They won’t.
I.m with Kendo…Time yet
oh fuck david mundell now I need to cut my throat
Well everyone in my house is pretty despondent right now to be sold out bu the pensioners and supposed yes supporters is the most galling thing about this independence died tonight i definatley smell something dodgy going on here if dundee is a no then they have fckn rigged it the fire alarm and 20 mins for the counters on the car park plenty of time to rigg the vote.
I love Dundee!!!
Hmm. Told Stu on twitter that there is a way to go and a big yes% means we start again. He called me an idiot. Good way to treat your friends. He is also off to Ireland. Arse.
There you go see what a bit of positivity does. Well done Dundee
Thank you dundee.
Difficult to think sensibly at the moment and certainly gutted at what seems to be a victory for low expectations.
I certainly hope we can keep something positive going, though struggling at the moment.
Well done Dundee, at least some respect.
Hope seems to live in Dundee too. Pae’s all round.
That’s better, but still no dram
Let’s not kid ourselves here!!
There is no point whatsoever in trying for independence again. Our people ARE too stupid and soon we will be too poor.
Throw in the fact that Westminster is so corrupt and have ‘arms’ everywhere to kill u off then we are already dead and buried.
Oh yeah and with the BBC ‘helping out’ we may as well just shut up now and go home.
Dundee 57% YES. Love Dundee! Overall 50.9% NO 49.1% YES
Good on you Dundee.
Can I bear to stay up to listen to all the Torcuil’s. Lachlan’s, Maxwell’s (Max) and evry other F**er who has a last name as a first name gloating that we are all better together and thank F** the oinks either stayed away or got in line. Seriously Nicola FM speech vs Cameron pantomime.
Big lead for YES in Dundee. Looks like the cities are the main focus as wemight have predictd!
scotspine says:
19 September, 2014 at 3:52 am
Luigi
They won’t.
You know that, I know that but the majority still want to believe it and we have to respect it. The truth will out soon enough.
Great result in Dundee – proud of ya!
Well Dundee hasn’t let us down, and Renfrewshire not as bad as expected…. All is not lost
JESUS CHRIST
What has happened to you in the last two hours..i am disapointed as well at the moment but please stop this there are still 27 regions to declare you have given up at the first hurdle? is it lack of sleep..this site has kept me going for the past two weeks PLEASE don’t give in to them and don’t give up until it is over
Dundee I love you!
someone wakeup rev
I love Dundee
Haud the boat. That dundee result puts us back in the game!
I’m off to bed, I was trying to be upbeat about it all but it looks like the polls have been fixed to show around 52% no 48% Yes.
Nothing more we can do now.
Dundee 57% is our best strongest YES city?
good on you Dundee see they did not let us down..
YES: 49.1%
NO: 50.9%
What a difference two constituencies make.
Stephen.
P.S. Win or Lose I still say fuck nawsayers.
Still here …. the gap in the votes between Yes and No has just halved with Dundee – hope springs eternal.
Wee booster:
Dundee 7/32
57,35% YES
42,65% NO
Dundee (Yes capital of Scotland)..
78% turnout..
71% vote predicted..
Then 2 fire alarms..
Then vote drops to 57%!!
Come on, WTF!!
It could be all down to Glasgow.
IndyRef votes so far: YES 172,426 vs NO 178,811 – just over 5k votes in it.
GET IN THERE!
Dundee result
93592 votes cast
78.8%
53620 YES 57.35%
39880 NO 42.65%
Overall YES votes so far 116960
Overall NO votes so Far 117144
Total votes cast 233723
NO lead by 184 votes!
jacksg – exactly!
Only 6,000 votes in it. That’s nothing. But trend looks as though that gap might widen
Our fellow Scots have had a lifetime of BBC and newspaper tripe you can’t reverse the effects of that in an instance. You can’t underestimate the effects on people of what they have endured. Didn’t you watch The Men That Made Us Shop. That should be one of your fights look at how you guys have reacted and you know what’s going on. There’s no way they will let us go without a huge fight. There are loads of things that have happened that you can use to gain ground for the next battle if need be. If we lose it’s just a battle not the war. Use your intelligence!
That’s more like it, Dundee!
Hmm – post disappeared – try again.
Wee booster:
Dundee 7/32
57,35%
YES 42,65% NO
I am an optimistic person but..
The Dundee result is pure shite. We needed a massive percentage win in places like this.
It’s bedtime folks I’m afraid!!
Hang on, look at the effect of Dundee on the overall numbers. I’m still not hugely optimistic but the effect of these larger constituencies is so much larger than most of those we’ve seen so far.
The 71% figure relates to a sample from one the boxes and not the actual Dundee result. Pleased we got the result here in Dundee but disappointed overall.
Dundee result – Yes:53,620 No:39,880
Sorry it wasn’t higher, though, but at least we’ve got the first Yes win!
Come on guys. By all means let off steam and have a rant, but did we come this far just to give up now?
Instead of venting our fury on those people too feared to vote YES, why don’t we honour those many people who were brave enough to vote YES for the first time?
Do we give up? Not me. This goes on. Maybe I wont see independence but I will continue the fight for future generations.
Yes the numbers are close, but the excitement has been drained from us, the emotions of the days are spent unless there’s a surprise package to come. Big numbers in Edinburgh and Aberdeen apparently going against us, and Glasgow vote lower than might be hoped.
We’ve been reading the runes for two years, but all of a sudden they’ve changed shape. Still hanging in, and there you are Stirling not looking good either. The writing is on the wall.
Thank you Dundee.
A small precentage win in Glasgow could cancel out 6000 votes.
Yes 49% no 51% as it stands just now.
If you have voted yes like me, then you did your best.
Lets see how it all pans out tonight/today.
West Dunbartonshire. YES YES YES
Many people took a bold step last night.
We cannot abandon them now.
Won west Dumbarton!
West Dumbartonshire, I love you.
We just won W Dumbarton
west dumbarton
yyyyyyyyyyyyyeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeessssssssssssssssss
West Dumbartonshire I love you
Thank you West Dumbartonshire.
Everybody keep the faith…it is not over yet !
Now you doomers on here, can you give us a fucking break.
C’mon Dunbartonshire
RESULT: West Dunbartonshire Yes 33k, No 28k. YES HAVE IT
West Dumbartonshire!!!
Get in!!!
Keep the faith its only 6k and W.Dunbaton just gone yes by 54%
Having to follow goings-on here and on Twitter as I can’t bear to look at these gloating bastards on the TV. Doubt if I’ll watch any telly or visit an online newspaper site for at least a month.
YES: 49.8%
NO: 50.2%
Stephen.
Well done West Dunbartonshire
hope Edinburgh holds up
Only 1400 votes in it now
West Dunbartonshire 54%
Overall YES 49.8%
Dundee and West Dunbartonshire have changed things. Love Dumbarton!
Could someone now give a running total of the votes difference overall as they are coming in, in real time for y and n?
Midlothian
cheers Clarinda i am not giving up until it is done..have even resorted to fags off for another one nerves are shredded..
RESULT: Midlothian Yes 26k, No 33k – It’s a No
YES: 49%
NO: 51%
Still looking good.
Stephen.
Come on Glasgow.
Thanks faolie…you’re on it
I’ll shut up now knowing this site is a well that is drawn on for hope. Certainly turned round many friends and relations perhaps not enough though. Perhaps should have had dedicated comments spaces for the evolving picture in the vote. I know I will recognise the “two feet good” brigade tomorrow though. Only people smiling (or pausing and looking wistfully at the horizon leaving poll) was YES only smilers on TV now seem to be NO.
Hey, all you bitter vets who went to bed – get back up!!! We’re not out of this fight yet!
232k to 241k, 9k delta
Nana Smith
30mins ago i was going to bed, this is a roller coaster.
west Dumbarton yes Midlothian NO, where the fuck did the Midlothian NO come from i live here..bastards
East Lothian, gap now -26k
How many counties left to declare?
It’s not over yet. West Dunbarton is yes. Now nearly 50:50 overall.
RESULT: East Lothian
YES – 27,467
NO – 44,283
Stirling gap now -38k
Stay strong folks.Don’t even think of burning flags, kilts etc. DUNDEE just closed the gap. Even if we get beat…keep the faith…stand together we must carry on the fight. These charlatans cannot fulfil their lies.Election in 2016 is the next battle in the war.Well done West Dunbartonshire! Proud to have worked alongside you all!
Just as I was getting my hopes up.
Lanarkshire, don’t let me down
RESULT: Stirling
YES: 25,010
NO: 37,153
It’s a No
Stirling and East Lothian crushing defeats. Need more West Dunbartonshires
East Lothian is full of middle class professionals dont get dishearted the big votes are still to come.
Hold on.
NO 207,587
YES 206, 146
After 8 of 32 counts.
Hold … Hold … Hold …
indyref vote tally widens.
YES: 284,993
NO: 322,995
Falkirk gap now -46k. Thanks
19 still to go
RESULT: Falkirk
YES: 50489
NO: 58030
Falkirk votes NO
sorry 18
No real.damage done with Falkirk. Margins stay the same
1% in Glasgow could be 40K
sorry guys i have had no sleep still 20 to declare.
This is too tense! Rumours that Angus is no – how can that be?!
I still think it will be a lot closer than it looks just now. It may even come down to the Glasgow vote.
All I know is that I am not alone in wanting Independence for Scotland.
Labour voters and their values are good but the Labour and Unionist party have got to go.
No more living off the back of the poor.
many SNP still support the union
Thats it im done for tongiht after the fire alarm incident in dundee the vote changed dramatically how the hell is that possible i knew they were going to rig this these people have no limits there no level that they wont stoop to this is democracy? where whoever can lie and scare and yes cheat vote rigging c u n t s this is disgusting
fALKIRK RESULT
180626 VOTES
88.7%
50489 yes 47%
58030 no 53%
I’m sorry folks I’m disheartened
In the 2015 GE we have to nail Labour for their role in the independence campaign – in bed with the tories to crush the dream of independence.
Angus: gap now -48k
stuffed now
Crushing defeat in Aberdeen. Back to bed I think
Think Aberdeen just stuffed us
Angus gone to NO as has Aberdeen
I don’t think I want to live in a world where fear tramples hope
Well obviously the people of Scotland couldn’t bring themselves to “break” David Camerons heart,
I hope you people who voted no are proud of yourselves, youve just ensured the collective suicide of an entire country!
I planned to keep my voter registration card,as a keepsake its already ripped up.
I am deeply ashamed of my country!
Gap now after D&G 90K. 2% in Glasgow = 80K
I smell shite!
Glasgow for YES would embarrass labour
Morning John, welcome to the wake
I saw it with my own eyes yesterday people leaving polling station with shame and guilt written all over their faces. Project Fear is winning over Hope. I will never forget and never forgive what they did to our older generation with all that scaremongering. Shame on you BBC. Shame on you Gordon Brown. Never ever buying newspaper apart from Sunday Herald. This must be our Culloden I suppose.
Gutted. I don’t understand the majority of the people that live in my country if it’s true
Actually quite pleased with d&g. Thought it would be worse.
East Renfrewshire was always going to be the same. Not bad considering what your up against.
Luigi,
In the 2015 General Election, who gives a fuck! It doesn’t really matter.
Scotland has no teeth, it has no guts, it has no future as a meaningful country.
Reap the whirlwind Scotland.
Them, then and always.
I live in North Britain. I have no name, no identity, no culture, no history.
I am only required to produce, consume then die.
Anyone any idea why SNP strongholds have voted NO? Seems very strange.
Even if YES go on to win overall (eternal optimist) I am already ashamed that so many have voted for continued Westminster rule.
I am thoroughly disgusted my country is on the verge of being just a ‘region’.
PS We don’t deserve any ‘national’ teams if that’s how we feel about our country.
I was trying to remain upbeat and positive but it looks like we have been sold out again and humiliated as the first country in the history of the world not to grab independence when it was offered.
I am ashamed of the Scottish people right now and I can’t watch this train wreck anymore.
I am hoping I wake up to a miracle, but I won’t hold my breath.
I agree Luigi – maybe some kind of electoral pact with SNP and other pro-indy parties so vote is not fragmented. Really go for it at next GE. My Mum’s nearly 80 – she’s saying don’t get disheartened, she has seen the home rule movement take 2 steps forward then one back, so many times, progress slow but relentless.
Any idea why so far SNP strongholds have voted NO?
a lot vote snp to keep labour tory out but keep the union
Think we need big in Glasgow and to win both Lanarkshires
Edinburgh could be a problem
Not even going to guess on the rest
Not genetically programmed to run our own affairs
20 years ago I left Scotland to escape the poverty, deprivation and lack of opportunity, and boy am I patting myself on the back now for that wise decision. Good luck with your country guys or should I say region. I say ‘your’ coz at this moment I want fuck all to do with it. Bye y’all.
Jola’s astonished again
I’m sick
NO has won need YES to get to 48%
Am I saddened by the results so far? Yes
Am I despondent? No
So far do we not have 100% of the Scottish people demanding more powers? We need the Yes supporting parties to unite for the general election campaign to demand the powers we want. My initial ‘broad brush’ suggestion – ALL taxes in Scotland (including oil revenues) collected in Scotland. The setting up of a National investment bank funded by the insignificant oil revenues. We pay the UK Govt what we decide is our share of funding armed forces etc. Then we have a chance of being less Bitter Together. If Scotland votes for that and there’s no delivery, start working on 2016 Scottish elections…
Labour have taken their revenge on the SNP for their last two Holyrood defeats.
“Scots” celebrating voting their country out of existence. Incredible. Gutless, spineless – that’s Scotland. “Bow to your imperial masters” indeed.
Wingers
I am so ashamed that we are losing .
the world will see a region now.
what a betrayal.
Good night Wingers. if i stay up i will only feel worse.
sorry friends.
I am gutted. My 9yr old son made a wish in the fountain on Wed. I know he wished for a Yes vote. We then went to George Square and the atmosphere was amazing! I really thought we were on the verge of something exciting and positive.
My 11yr old daughter has been so caught up in this. They both came with me to vote, decked out with all their badges, balloons etc. However, on the way to the polls today, no-one smiled at them, no one tooted horns as they drove past. I had a sinking feeling then that it was not to be. They will be so upset when they get up in the morning.
Told u we were f*cked!!
I don’t take any pride in that whatsoever, but our flow Scots have wimped out on us.
All these No folk cheering and dancing about.. they obviously don’t know what’s coming.. but they soon will.. and they will have caused it!
Well done to one and all of you.. you will soon reap what you deserve!!
Parts of Scotland showing their true colours – yellow.
Then again, it might just be red, white and blue.
I stayed up to hear the future of the country; and I know you’re hurting here at Wings right now, but don’t underestimate what you’ve achieved so far. Against the entire Establishment and the Media you’re going to pull a high 40% vote for Independence. Nearly, even if not quite half the Scottish Electorate. An un-ignorable message sent. The path of Scotland, even if not the current state, is on the progressive path.
Why were your hopes inaccurate? I’ve commented on this before and you don’t need to hear it right now; but believe me even for those of us not convinced easily by your case, there’s no doubt your cause and passion was honest and decent. What ever you feel, don’t tear yourselves apart now. Stu wrote powerfully of unity with the good people of England. When you can, pick yourself up and we’ll still be here to work with you, to lever what you have proven today into a better UK for us all. Even the hated BBC is saying you have a mandate now.
And the trend will always continue to be towards a certain Yes. You’ve sewn the seeds, even if some of you may not see them flower. But be assured they will.
But for now, you have my honest sympathies.
Well guys and gals (is that pc post saville ?), it’s nearly Glasgow..
@James123
My sentiments exactly. “Fuck all to do with it” in future.
If people want to wallow in foodbanks, diminishing industry, oil and resources being sucked away, then fuck them.
Back to being complete and utter suckers and laughing stocks of the world.
I really do hope that all the COWARDS who became the GUTLESS wonders of the TORY party are extremely proud of themselves tonight. Personally I do not to have ANYTHING to do with them.
North Lanarkshire falls to YES who win by around 5,000.
Thank you North Lanarkshire.
BBC licence will be cancelled today and so should every yes voter, the BBC have won this for no tonight
Proud of my North Lanarkshire
Disappointed in the south
Glasgow doing Scotland proud
This is so hard watching all those noers cheering.
We need a miracle in Glasgow
I can’t believe no voters are cheering – it’s bigger than a one party election.
I see SKY news pulled out a tweet from Stu, along the lines of “unionists enjoy the gloating whirlwind to come!” Hmm them’s foiting words methinks!
Knighthoods for McQuarrie & Boothman at BBC Scotland a certainty.
cmoan my home town..aye well if anyone moans about the Westminster govt again i will go to jail for assault..
Well it’s decisive that’s for sure. There’s no mere half a per cent between them, which is what no one wanted. Our bed has been made, by our fellow Scots. Spineless they may be but we are bound to respect the decision and to find a path forward from here. That path is going to be littered with whatever is thrown at us, on top of the promised austerity and bugger the extra powers.
Darkened room please.
I’m in North Lanarkshire, but sad we didn’t win by more. Although, I can’t say the Yes posters in the windows have been that visible round here.
The thing is, all those voting No are not the ones who have to endure the cuts, bedroom tax, food banks etc; as long as they are not paying more for their mortgage next yr, what do they care!
It pains me to see that ‘the Cringe’ has won.
Sorry everybody. No is now :200,000 ahead. No way that can be caught.
Bitterly disappointed .
The threats and bullying from big business and the banks have worked, and we are greatly diminished now.
Will the gullible people who voted no continue to sing “Flower of Scotland”?
As others have posted, it is almost shameful to watch fellow Scots clap, cheer and hug the fact that they have voted to give away our sovereignty.
Lets see how they all feel in two or three years time
Rev Stu,
I am sorry that after all the hard work you have put in, the “people” of this territory referred to as Scotland have let you down as well as themselves.
I expect that this site will be pulled down as quick as after this utter capitulation.
Glasgow result
194779 YES
169347 NO
Thank you Glasgow.
Glasgow YES + 30K. Well done Glasgow. But not enough.
Glasgow no where near enough
Glasgow gives us hope
need a YES rally
I take back every bad thing I ever said about the Weegies. Indee they are ra peepel
OK, here is my post-mortem thoughts.
1.The media bias is the biggest thing we have against us.
Even if you no-one bought them, shoppers have a wall of propaganda facing them every day. “24 hours to save Britain etc”
The BBC website used UK-wide comment sections on every independence article, so Scottish voices were drowned out.
2. The currency lie was always going to hurt. Plus all the bank threats. Timing was bad here, with RBS in UK government hands.
3. Aiming exclusively for the working class vote, could have turned off middle class voters. Snobbery aspect played a part.
Plus turnout is lower, and more apathetic. A quarter of Glasgow stayed at home – partly because of a Celtic game.
4. SNP didn’t offer enough on energy. Setting up an national energy company was an obvious opportunity to provide a major talking point, and Norway comparisons. Scotland’s one big advantage. Oil + Green energy.. Subsidised electricity for homes and businesses. Instead the main talking point remained the currency.
5. The promise of ‘more powers’ will have swayed many voters.
Media played along without any serious challenge – Even misreported as Devo-Max !!
Nothing will change, and many will realize they were played for fools. The one area of hope for the future.
Glasgow good but don’t think it’s enough
Flower of Scotland is consigned to the past. Dead and buried like the corpses of those the song refers to.
So, is there a definitive list of all those bullying banks & businesses? Whatever meagre savings I have, I do not want to spend or save with them
Borders wipes out Glasgow
53% in Glasgow guarantees the cybernats get the result they deserve.
Outstanding result for democracy
Anyone who voted NO, who in the future complain about what has to come like the NHS, their pensions, or anything else, I will say to them fuck you.
Well done Glasgow, cant believe a 100 thou didnt vote.
You guys are going to be crying your eyes out when Edinburgh’s announced
I think the Borders result (33%) is quite good for a rural Tory area. I was expecting 25%.
That’ll be the Currency Union fixed then.
Unless . . . Glasgow & the Lanarkshires buck the trend
divided Scotland
rich/poor
I did not want to say this with my post earlier about NO twats.
But all who voted YES, the people I am very proud of and proud to be associated with, those I worked with in the North-East Fife YES campaign, I consider friends and am glad to have met you.
Come on you know what people have had to put up with media etc fear is a powerful thing and they know it and used it. You should be more determined now to free us if what you have been saying is true. Disappointment is hard but it’s not the end of the world. I would have thought you would be more determined you’ve been shafted well and truly and now you are saying your going to let them get away with it. Once things don’t get better together people may think again. I’m beginning to be just as disappointing in you as them I’ve always considered we might lose but I never believed you would desert me to. We need you don’t abandon us please. There are lessons to learn from it learn them and win the war.
I cant beleive this region of england turned its back on a future.
All YES voters can hold their head high, be proud of yourselves.
I cant take it anymore. Off to get some sleep.
so long my fellow wingers,
it has been great knowing you..i will go to work in a couple of hours holding my head up high knowing i did the right thing by voting yes..even although my fellow workers will be cheering i will not give in to it, they bought into the Labour myth of being middle class and caring about money above all else..i am WORKING CLASS and always will be i will look after other people and not give in to greed and manipulation like so may others Thatcher would be happy i hope retribution comes to them in the next life if there is one. My heart is broken
As an expat Scot in Switzerland (here because the kind of job’s the UK offers in my sector are all down in the South East), this is a hugely disappointing result. Switzerland would not be what Switzerland is if she had to send her representatives to Paris for decisions. Unfortunately, the people of Scotland appear to be content to reside with this state of affairs.
However, let’s keep heart. There’s nothing as powerful as an idea who time has come. Maybe the idea of independence still needs to take hold in people’s hearts. Remember Quebec lost its first independence bid in 1980 by a margin of 40 – 60 %. By 1995 it was practically 50 – 50. Scotland has surpassed Quebec’s first vote. The way to a second one will be long and treacherous, given the Establishment’s wrath. However, there might be light yet at the end of the tunnel. Nevertheless, this is a historical opportunity which has been missed.
Sorry Heraldnomore I was looking (in horror) at the returns.
Morning
Scotland meet Armageddon ,
Armageddon meet Scotland
The new movie of the week
THE RETURN OF THE CRINGE!
So, anyone crowdfunding “Don’t blame me, I voted Yes!” T-shirts yet?!
pauls7777 says:
“Outstanding result for democracy”
Given the total media control by Project Fear, Yes !
A lot of establishment backs were scratched.
What result were you expecting when the rev Campbell regularly indulges in censorship, and the quiet ‘No’s consistently complain of intimidation.
This forum has consistently demonstrated it’s Nationalist sympathies and its Socialist values……
Slow clap for all the Mp’s who succeeded in keeping their 7k pay rise. Bastards.
Christian Wright ?@ChristainWright · 5m
First time a country has committed national suicide in front of a live worldwide audience. #indyref
Am sick of listening to the yes politicians going on about voter turn out and so on – show some balls and say it as it is – we were lied to and pensioners were scared to death by no campaigners – that’s no reason to celebrate – pure scum
James Caithness says:
Anyone who voted NO, who in the future complain about what has to come like the NHS, their pensions, or anything else, I will say to them fuck you.
My thoughts exactly James. I do not want to here ANYONE complain about what Cameron and his thugs do from now on! WE had the chance to get shot of him and his corrupt, fraudulent, lying corp of thieving bastards. (apologies folks for swearing, no other way to put my feelings down)
All the poor areas have voted Yes as a cry for help.. and the No folk are cheering that they aren’t going to get it.
What a shame our people don’t care about the poor in our society.. makes me feel sick.
humiliating.
Guys, it’s been good! Loved the chat, loved the campaign. I’ll keep looking in but as we all know by now Scotland shat it!
If anybody’s looking for a despondent rock band visit @jojocoke
We may bring in some Smiths or Morrisey songs to expunge the pain!
@takeourblueback
That’ll be the Currency Union fixed then.
CharlieMurphy
Please show some respect.
gutted, but lets remember many people will have voted because they believe there are more powers coming. We need to keep the movement going to keep the Brits under watch. Proud that my city Glasgow voted Yes, though should have been higher. Clear from being at polling stations that Labour mobilised and ran it – there was no NO campaign.
Ok Wings, I’m Irish so not too emotively caught up in this. You beautiful visionaries, your idealistic movement has been an inspiration to progressives everywhere that the Establishment stranglehold can be challenged. They’ll now attempt to crush your aspiration. Namely, not another ref for decades. Your demoralised but you must stay unified and this morning that requires an emotional but defiant Alex flanked by the coalition for change – Riddoch, Sheridan, Cat Boyd, Hervie, Canavan, Michael Greenwell, David. Hayman etc pledging their refusal to be deterred and proclaiming to Scotland that it will treat every Holywood election as a mandate for escape from Westminster. This will at least force some delivery of the ‘Vow’ which Westminster really wants to park now. Please continue to believe!
The BBC are Evil.
Damn you!
bbc declare Scotland NO
hour late
walofs
Gutted that Project fear seems to have lied their way to a hollow triumph, but so proud of the 46% (1,200,000 + of us) who voted for change, optimism and fairness…we mustn’t lose that fantastic energy. Scotland needs us more than ever now.
Manandboy says
“Knighthoods for McQuarrie & Boothman at BBC Scotland a certainty.”
I think if those people at PQ think they have won let them think again, the 5 thousand outside PQ last week should pale into insignficance to the 30.000 crowds we need to put outside that edifice, and not leave until they have been ridden out of town on a rail!
Over to the Catalonians. Scotland could have led the way, but maybe they will instead, and prove to us that so many of the threats, particularly on the EU, were actually postering.
Maybe they can show the way forward for a country which appears to be happy to consign itself the status of a region of a region of Europe.
You need to get money behind you to have a chance to win money talks all those well off folk that supported yes have money use your heads coz our hearts are broken.
I’veNeverSeenBraveheart says:
So, anyone crowdfunding “Don’t blame me, I voted Yes!” T-shirts yet?!
I’d wear one of those T-shirts 24/7 7 days a week! Just to remind every unionist I ever saw NOT to blame me cause THEY voted for EVERYTHING that is coming down the tracks!
and now the final ignominy of Michael moore.
shotgun to my head time now.
‘We’re in the hands of the people of Scotland and there’s no safer place to be than in the hands of the Scottish people’
Alex Salmond, yesterday. What will he say today?
Fuck it still going to head to George square anyway, hope others join us
I feel that the SNP should step down and let the Labour Party preside over the cuts and austerity that is coming our way. As for the BBC.. I don’t know what we can do about them, but they need to become more accountable to those who fund them
Once it all goes tits up within two years, I suggest that the pro Independence parties grasp the nettle and say at the 2016 Holyrood elections, that if you vote for us and we win, we are going to declare Independence the next day.
I am sick of people voting for the SNP to get the “free” things. No more.
If you don’t want Independence then vote for Unionist parties and see how they love you.
I’m off to bed
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Just now ·
.
Yes has lost the ?#?IndyRef?.
But against a campaign of fear – with all institutions and major media and political parties against them –
they rallied to make it a fight.
This morning, Britain’s 3rd largest city has voted to leave.
Well over a million people have issued a vote of no confidence to Westminster.
We can’t let that slide…This is just the beginning.
Let’s lick our wounds, hug our loved ones and find a way to win independence for us all.
I’d like a badge with the don’t blame me slogan on it.
john king – a candlelit vigil outside PQ in the evening – they killed our beautiful, hopeful campaign, our wish to make a better life for all the Scots in poverty, our vision to do things differently and creatively – I would stage a ‘silence’ outside PQ because we are indeed mourning a terrible loss.
Can we do nothing against so much bias – we’ll be lucky to get devo-mini, scraps from the table.
Now we will hear of the new oil bonanza. The Scots will continue to be allowed to produce it but all the revenues will continue to flow to Westminster and not a penny will be saved for future generations, who will rightly curse the shortsighted and selfish dupes who voted No.
Stu, we shall not forget. The Common Weal vision remains. The ideals of Blossom will be hear tomorrow. It’s just that in my lifetime they will not be implemented. My children will be up in an hour or two and I will have to tell them we did not succeed. It’s their future.
The highs and the lows will live with me. The marches to the gardens in Princes St – Margo and Dougie MacLean, Ruth Wishart too – and to Calton Hill last year, and onwards.
I’d rather have made that journey than never have had the chance. But I dread whatever is to be thrpwn at us now
Jon Snow tweets…
The size of the YES vote ensures that they have Prime Minister Cameron and the Westminster Government in an armlock on genuine devolution
David_Cameron and Gordon Brown have made massive timetabled promises: failure to deliver would risk the well-being of the entire UK
But I hope we will regroup and keep going!
Just woke up after snatching around 3 hours sleep to a living nightmare. A real live horror show. After all everyones leafletting,canvassing and the engagement with the public then to this? Where was the no side, their stalls were deserted, had hardly any local grassroots. Where were they all when it was the jubilee and the olympics, hardly saw a union flag in the streets. I guess the msm and the corrupt state did it all for them and they can be controlled easily enough and see what they want to see. As long as the im all right jacks private finances are ok, thats what matters it seems.
Sickening. Ive been holding off booking a holiday but was planning to book this weekend for a week in late october in sunnier climes but we dont want to now as cant stand the shame and embarrassment. Yet, i cant really bear to be around here too. And thats only the short term!
The yes movement can be proud for the tireless work they done. Gutted. Thank God im on hol from work today. Looks like its an under the covers day. Just want to say its a pleasure to share a place on planet earth with my fellow yes supporters. We really are cut from the same cloth. Pity im at a loss of where to start on the rest of our fellow citizens.
Unionists offered a cheq book of new powers
MSM,against us
well done all
I know folk are angry and showing it – if anything this campaign has convinced me to volunteer at a food bank – they’ll be plenty to volunteer at coming up.
Think I’m gonna be sick, someone pass the sick bucket please. Mundell the Blundell is on SKY. Thankfully I can’t hear the snake in the grass, sound is off!
Oh fuck, we’ve still got nukes. There’s no oil off the Ayrshire coast. We’ll probably invade someone again.
heraldnomore: I think that’s what I’m most gutted about – having to tell my kids in the morning. I did this for them.
I probably shouldn’t have let them get so involved, but I truly believed they were witnessing history, not a bitter disappointment
They are torturing Nicola now. She should just stop waffling.
Just a thought, but if there’s a NO, which is looking a bit likely, will AS announce an immediate election in Scotland – not fight it too much, indeed not even stand in the NO areas, and allow the unionist parties to form a coalition to implement the WM cuts? And an indy ref, demanded by the people, in @ 2-3 yrs?
Remember, this is the first kick of the ball EVER – the plot thickens and the future game’s definitely afoot: D
Still a bit of a kick in the teeth for Slab in Glesga – just a pity a footie match appears to have stopped some folk for voting for their country:-(
It is over.
Fear has won and Scotland has bottled it.
It looks like the old have hung onto the past destroying the aspirations of many of the younger generation who will now continue to pursue there future elsewhere in large numbers.
All the Scots are now British. Scotland has clearly voted to be a semi autonomous region. The parliament is now a regional one and essentially an assembly. I will not suffer any No voter who maintain they are Scottish. They are not. They are British 1st and foremost.
Everything that comes now is on them.
My heart tells me that the SNP should resign, but my head tells me they absolutely should not. They agreed to respect the vote and they have a duty to lead the Scottish (now regional) department as they have been elected to do.
The discussion will now be for creeping but largely meaningless additional autonmy
Far too many of us voted YES for this to just go away.
The country remains divided so something has to give. People have had enough.
Our next goal should be to send only independence supporting MPs to Westminster. All these MPs who lied to us should be deprived of their plushy jobs and bloated expense accounts.
I left Scotland in 2001. I worked as a nurse in the NHS and it was run ragged then. I felt like I was stuck in a rut and there was no future for me in Scotland. So I went. When the first rumblings of an independence vote came up I thought of the historical advantages that had been gained, of the indisputable wealth the Empire had brought to Scotland, and I wondered if breaking such an historically useful partnership was worthwhile. Then I found Logic’s Rock and my eyes were opened. I remembered 1979. I had forgotten how we had been promised Ravenscraig and the collieries, how they would be protected in the Union. Promises shredded in under a decade. I cannot understand how anyone alive then, including our current OAPs who are being accused here of voting for their pensions, would fall for the same species of lie twice. I cannot believe that anyone exposed to the obviousness of the same tactics being used so crudely again would fall for it again. I do not believe it.
But I do not live in Scotland anymore. I have not been subjected to the media barrage from the NO side. From my distance their disinformation has seemed laughable. But for those who never looked beyond the papers and the TV it has been all too real. Foolish or no, it is all the world they know, and it has been shaped for them by others who do not wish them well.
Do not give up.
Do NOT give up.
I believe there will be Wings over Scotland. I do not believe they depend upon oil money. I believe they will fly on the basic belief in sovereignty. In self-determination.
People believed in a free Scotland long before the North Sea.
Scotland can be a free and great country even after the oil is gone.
I believe that.
But who am I? Just some sod who left.
Second attempt at posting.
Just a thought, but if there’s a NO, which is looking a bit likely, will AS announce an immediate election in Scotland – not fight it too much, indeed not even stand in the NO areas, and allow the unionist parties to form a coalition to implement the WM cuts? And an indy ref, demanded by the people, in @ 2-3 yrs?
Remember, this is the first kick of the ball EVER – the plot thickens and the future game’s definitely afoot: D
Still a bit of a kick in the teeth for Slab in Glesga – just a pity a footie match appears to have stopped some folk for voting for their country:-(
Some good points being made by Hardeep.
People who have voted No to a binary question haven’t said No to independence, full stop. Many have meant, ‘No, not now’. Not, ‘No, not ever’.
Well done to all those who had the guts and vision to vote yes. It’s painful but not finished. We have to target the mass media bias starting with the BBC. There has to be a mass action of non licence payment and protest. I firmly believe a fair media could have made the difference.
Bed time.
Tried to sleep but can’t. Never been so ashamed. To my fellow yeses, I feel your pain and hurt
To those who voted No because they are British and love the Union, congratulations you won.
To those who voted No because they were feart, didn’t think we could do what 200 other countries can do or believed we’d get meaningful new powers, when you are paying for your prescriptions, lose your bus passes, find you can’t pay your ever increasing council tax bill and watch as Scottish Water is privatised – don’t even think of complaining. Hell mend you.
Stevie boy
My thoughts exactly. The Labour strongholds who took the leap of faith , looking for something better, voted Yes. ‘ Lord ‘ Reid trying to justify it .
Get vote out of EU take it from there.
Eek – can’t post – tried 3 times and noe being told it’s a duplicate but no seeing it.
Alex Salmond ?@AlexSalmond · 37s
Well done to Glasgow, our commonwealth city, and to the people of Scotland for such a incredible support
heraldnomore says:
Oh fuck, we’ve still got nukes. There’s no oil off the Ayrshire coast. We’ll probably invade someone again.
I hear Iraq is a good bet Herald, after all we’ve been there a couple of times before so why not make it three! Sod it yeah let’s do Iraq again what’s another few hundred dead BRAVE soldiers. Just make sure it’s the Scots they send in first. The bastards!
Weegingerdug helps to light the path through the storm link to wp.me
David Cameron ?@David_Cameron · 1m
I’ve spoken to Alistair Darling – and congratulated him on an well-fought campaign.
As of now I put not one penny in a charity box. Its not only pensioners but a lot of the poor who are struggling who voted no, to them I will not give a shit. If Cameron does declare war on Syria, as was the rumour the other day, NO voting mothers and fathers, I will remind them when they complain, that they voted No.
I don’t know if you are hearing the unionist politicians speaking now about the ”new” powers, the tone is somewhat different.
BTW I received an email from my mate in NZ last night before the polls closed asking what is happening here as they news, there, was saying 54/46 NO.
Isn’t that spooky.
Craig MacInnes says
“Gutted that Project fear seems to have lied their way to a hollow triumph,”
Nailed it Craig
Never in the history of Scotland has a victory been so pyrric,
these people have voted for there own destruction, as Panda Paws says
HELL MEND THEM
Scotland,
You had the chance of a new future and let it go.
You have acceded to the excesses of big business, rich bankers, the privilaged titled landowners and the main stream media.
You have acceded to more foodbanks, another Tory government in Westminster likely supported by UKIP at the next General Election, extraction from the EU against your will, entry in to another middle eastern war, loss of Scottish Revenue (sudden miraculous discovery of new oil fields) , the privatisation of the NHS, re-instatement of University Fees, more austerity measures, the renewal of Trident and contributing to the cost of HS2 and the London sewer system without benefit here.
From having the potential of being the 14th richest country in the world, you have been subsumed in to the UK as the territory of North Briton, part of the 20th richest country in the world and one of the most unequal.
You have taken last minute “promises” from David Cameron, Nick Clegg, Ed Milliband and Gordon Brown (he who sold off the UK gold reserve, sold out pensions and with Alistair Darling brought down the economy) at face value and these “promises” have already been cast aside by Westminster MP’s as invalid and unpalatable by voters in England and Wales.
You are no longer a Country and as such deserve no national anthem, no national sporting team.
Who now dares stand up and sing “Flower O’ Scotland” without abject shame.
The only “Country” in the world to have the chance of Independence without having to resort to violence and then cowered away.
Reap the whirlwind.
Scotland has massive strength and courage, but not yet quite enough.
This is only a beginning. Take a rest, heal the wounds, and organise to finish the job. 45% of Scots are ready to leave the UK, and that is an extraordinary base to build on.
Mariaskid says:
Our next goal should be to send only independence supporting MPs to Westminster. All these MPs who lied to us should be deprived of their plushy jobs and bloated expense accounts.
I agree Maria. WE should all work to kicking every Tory, LieDem and especially LABOUR MP out of Westminster. Not one of those COWARDS deserves our support for ANYTHING! I suspect though, like tonight too many COWARDS will vote to keep those lying bastards in the WM trough!
Devorgilla says:
Some good points being made by Hardeep.
People who have voted No to a binary question haven’t said No to independence, full stop. Many have meant, ‘No, not now’. Not, ‘No, not ever’.
I think I understand what he is saying Devorgilla but really if NOW was not the time WHENis? I mean 5 years, 10 years, 20 years or AFTER all the oil is gone, WHEN?
Six words that broke my heart and made me cry:
“Scotland has voted NO to independence.”
Next thought: I’m glad I’m a Finn, not a Scot. I have an independent country.
My heart breaks for all the people of Scotland who had the same dream.
But as dawn breaks, it’s not all misery. The YES campaign has given hope to people, made them more politically aware and more self-confident and positive about themselves.
Thanks to the referendum campaign, the Scottish electorate is the best educated in the UK, and the genie will not go back into the bottle.
Interesting times ahead re the UK GE in 2015 and the Holyrood election in 2016. What now for Labour in Scotland? What about the SNP?
This is not the end, just the beginning of the next fight.
Stand tall, Scots. Nearly half of you voted for an independent Scotland. That sentiment will not go away.
(And people of Dundee, West Dunbartonshire, North Lanarkshire and Glasgow – I love you!)
Every single Winger on here feels as gutted as I do tonight. Feel so bad for all of us, and especially Stu.
This is so heartbreaking and eats at my very soul.
But my mission is this:
We will not let the Establishment and the mainstream media win this game.
Wings and the Winged Community will just have to gain even more strength, conviction, and determination to even more vociferously nail these greedy sneering players, and expose the media lies as widely as possible.
I’m not giving up. But I sure am gutted tonight.
I’ve never been more ashamed of my countrymen and women than at this moment.
I used to take such PRIDE in being known as a Scot. NOT any more. I am so ashamed.
When I think of the PRIDE I had whenever I saw a Scottish regiment in the news doing what they do best knowing that these soldiers came from one of the best countries in the world. Not any more now I’ll look at them and think you poor sods. You come from a country where your fellow countrymen are too cowardly to think of anyone but themselves. Welcome to the country of the ME ME ME and FD**K you society!
Well I agree, Lesley -Ann. But it was a huge leap for most people to make. But what is significant is that we have made huge strides, in getting the fear of independence reduced and it being something people could realistically talk about. I know it was not enough of a leap, but we have still leapt. Glasgow and Dundee, two major cities, have declared for independence.
James Caithness
I typed out almost the same as yourself and then scrubbed it but my sentiments are the same as yours
Well guys thats it nice to be sold out by our own countrymen isnt it we all know these new powers wont come chances are they may even dissolve scottish parliment next i see ukip/tory abomination ahead and i hope these no voters suffer the most i really do looks like at least half of the country is made up of weak minded cowards sad to say im ashamed of my country all this effort for what!!!!!! this is the end of the uk next stop police state where immigraants are opressed the poor are trampled even more than they already are how many think these powers are real and coming i can guess at least we stayed strong but i think ill have trouble tomorrow saying im proud to be scottish i dont feel that now as i know most here will agree totally disgusted well suppose we should get ready for more austerity foddbanks and bakers bonuses.
Sorry guys im gutted and venting to be betrayed by half of your own country im almost in tears.
NOT AIMED AT THE NO VOTER !
For those who knew what they were doing, & know it was self interest that drove their actions. i.e the useful fools & the establishment.
The democratic process was undermined from day one of the campaign and long before besides, by Project Fear having complete MSM control of the message. Fellow Scots, too many to name.
You know who you are.
=======================================================
Fareweel to a’ our Scottish fame
Fareweel our ancient glory
Fareweel even to the Scottish name
Sae famed in martial story
Now Sark rins o’er the Solway sands
And Tweed rins to the ocean
To mark whare England’s province stands
Such a parcel of rogues in a nation
What force or guile could not subdue
Thro’ many warlike ages
Is wrought now by cowards few
For hireling ("Tractor" - Ed)’s wages
The English steel we could disdain
Secure in valor’s station
But English gold has been our bane
Such a parcel of rogues in a nation
O would ‘ere I had seen the day
That treason thus could sell us
My auld grey head had lain in clay
Wi’ Bruce and loyal Wallace
But pith and power thill my last hour
I’ll mak this declaration
We’re bought and sold for English gold
Such a parcel of rogues in a nation !
Fareweel, again. For now.
Folks,
I have been here since the beginning of all this, and at Newsnet, and earlier tonight I posted my ‘angry’ thoughts here at wings, because I am so sad at the result. However, I want to change that.
The people of Scotland have voted the way they have, not principally through their own fault, but because they have been fed 24/7 blatant propaganda by the media. Chief protagonist has been the state run and controlled BBC. It is the pravda of Scotland, the lowest of the low, the scum of planet earth.
So, going forward, let’s NOT blame the ordinary folks who do not follow politics like some of us do, they have quite literally been deceived and lied to. It is NOT their fault, that the BBC and the so-called’ ‘scottish’ Journalists’ are merely paid liars of the very worst kind.
So, let’s not fight amongst our fellow Scots, it is the media, THE MEDIA, and the craven lying Labour party which we should seek to destroy. During the campaign, Steven Paton in his weekly review videos, ended with the tag line, ‘don’t blame the media, become the media’.
So, folks going forward, our aim should be to direct our skills, talent, innovation and so on, to winning independence in a few years (or less) from now. In order to do that, in my opinion, we need to do 2 things;
1. Destroy (not in a physically violent way!!) the Scottish mainstream media and especially the BBC. Do not buy them, do not read them, burn your TV license and make sites like this, and Bella Caledonia and National Collective, the NEW media. Let us not lose this NEW media we have created. Together we can build a media for ALL Scotland, that does not scurry to London for editorial policy.
2. Destroy (as above) the Labour party in Scotland. I mean it. Let us make them never again electable here in Scotland. They have shown themselves to be amongst the lowest of the low, the most self serving craven liars to walk planet earth. They have wilfully and repeatedly lied to the people of Scotland. In addition, the voters of Scotland will very quickly find out, that Labour can deliver NO new powers of any kind to Scotland, that their promises were false, and Westminster will go back to business as usual. We always knew Labour were lying, but for many in Scotland, who trust the media, they will be broken when they too discover that what Labour promised them was a pack of lies. We should use our undoubted skill and savvy, to then obliterate Labour in Scotland.
3. We set the goal of returning a pro independence majority to the Scottish Parliament in 2016. Of course this will consist of the SNP, but we also need the Greens and SSP, and possibly new comers to JOIN together in a pact, whereby they work together.
We have come this far and achieved so much, we should not let that go, ever. Labour and their media chums in the BBC want us all to just go away. Let’s not hand them this on a plate. Not for one freaking second.
Nobody ever said this would be easy. Now we have come so far, we need to FIGHT, and FIGHT hard, to secure our democracy and independence.
So, REVSTU (who incidentally is a hero), Newsnet Scotland, Bella Caledonia, National Collective, Scot goes pop, Derek Batemen, and all the many other groups, let me say this, unionists want us to just curl up and go away, but I say let’s not give them what they want. This is NOT the end, this is just the beginning
Let the fight begin.
Stuart, regroup the troops.
so Glasgow is now the Capital of Scotland now
Rev, pull the plug on this please, it’s pitiful.
I agree it was a huge leap Devorgilla but that was what this whole independence referendum thingy was all about, having the BELIEF in yourself and your fellow man/woman that we could stand on our own two feet.
I agree that we have made huge strides but to be honest I have lost faith in around 50% of the population of Scotland. The way I feel at the moment I wouldn’t trust them as far as I could throw them! The level of disgust I am feeling right now is incredible. I have NEVER felt like this in my life before.
Scotlandshire has spoken and it has voted for austerity, mediocrity, inequality, nuclear weapons, and cynical foreign wars. There is, however, a significant minority of enlightened folk who wanted and worked for a better future for their country. I accept, with no small amount of embarrassment, the result of the vote. We had a chance to hold our head high internationally. We will now be seen again (rightly) as little more than a picturesque region of North Britain. I hope that the energy and efforts of the Yes activists will count for something but I fear that we will receive precious little. I am not a proud Scot today.
@Bean an Tighe, 5:23am
I think the candlelit vigil at PQ is spot on.
I could weep at the bravado of Scotland; that’s not the same as brave. It was so difficult being at the count seeing and hearing the cheers of those who did not have to fight any sort of campaign because the media corporations and the British state with their scaremongering and miserable offers after voting started did it for them; Those who did not know what to say to people when asked why we were “better together”.
We’re not to wee, we’re not too poor, but, for the rest.
Such a lack of aspiration. Sad.
Clare Mcnab says
“This is only a beginning. Take a rest, heal the wounds, and organise to finish the job. 45% of Scots are ready to leave the UK, and that is an extraordinary base to build on.”
Trouble is Clare, I dont think I can, and worse, I dont think I want to,
If what is so screamingly obvious to all here is blindly ignored by the turkeys who voted for Christmas, Then I cant bring myself to look at those people with anything other than utter contempt, and you cant persuade a person you have zero respect for!
watching rugby crowd sing this will be embarrassing
O flower of Scotland
When will we see your like again
That fought and died for
Your wee bit hill and glen
And stood against him(no)
Proud Edward’s army
And sent him homeward(no)
Tae think again(no)
The hills are bare now
And autumn leaves lie thick and still
O’er land that is lost now
Which those so dearly held
And stood against him
Proud Edward’s army
And sent him homeward(no)
Tae think again(no)
Those days are passed now(no)
And in the past they must remain
But we can still rise now(never)
And be the nation again(no)
That stood against him(no)
Proud Edward’s army
And sent him homeward(no)
Tae think again(no)
Anything but Scotland the Brave from now on , Northern England for evermore.
The shame of being the only former country in the world vote to NOT be one.
The thought of independence in the future doesn’t comfort me a bit… My age makes it unlikely that it will ever happen in my lifetime. Like so many people I have waited a long long time for independence and just when it seemed within our grasp it is dashed away. Try as I might I am looking at my friends who are no voters differently.. Perhaps that will fade. Wealth, privilege and power have won over democracy, and the media are totally complicit. How can we make them accountable. There must be a way to make having BBC an option and not by watching programmes on iplayer.
I am sickened listened to smarmy politicians preaching forgiveness and togetherness – sorry for going on, blame the lateness of the hour.
I just don’t see how WM is going to be able to fullfil the promises of the last weeks, the degree of disappointment can only get bigger when folks realise that their expectencies are not coming. Cameron and the disgusting Brown can preach all they want but their hounds in Parliament won’t have it.
It looks as if we won’t learn until the pain really starts to bite.
Bookie, that can be binned immediately
Did some research on Ireland, for those in positions similar to myself:
“British” citizens can live there. You can become naturalised after 5 years and as long as one parent is “British” and children born in Ireland automatically become Irish citizens on birth.
defo,
Very well said. The parcel of rogues are not our fellow Scots who have voted NO because they have been deceived by the lying scum that is the Labour party, and the craven low life lying propoagandists at the BBC, and in our English controlled ‘scottish’ press.
They, are the parcel of rogues.
Lesley-Anne says:
19 September, 2014 at 5:52 am
I used to take such PRIDE in being known as a Scot. NOT any more. I am so ashamed.
When I think of the PRIDE I had whenever I saw a Scottish regiment in the news doing what they do best knowing that these soldiers came from one of the best countries in the world. Not any more now I’ll look at them and think you poor sods. You come from a country where your fellow countrymen are too cowardly to think of anyone but themselves. Welcome to the country of the ME ME ME and FD**K you society!
======================================
Lesley-Anne – To those regiments, they and their mums and dads voted No, so I care not a jot when they go to war and come home broken. Mothers and Fathers don’t let me hear you complain when your children are paying tuition fees, don’t let me hear you complain when your elderly care is cut back, don’t let me hear you complain when you are charged for a GP appointment or you are paying your prescription charges, don’t complain when your bus passes go. You voted No.
So is there no chance at all now? ;(
Sad that so many went out their way to register then vote no. I can hear the whole world laugh at us at this moment. Most of Scotland thinks foodbanks and child poverty is fine.
Bathgate no more
Linwood no more
Methil no more
Lochaber no more
Scotland no more
Robert Louis , time to grow up and take responsibility, Scots voted to be a region of England. NEVER again can we blame the English or Westminster or anyone else. It is all down to the cringing cowards in Scotland. They will get what they deserve , time for blaming other people is gone the turkeys have voted for Christmas.
I’m glad you are still around Robert, cause I’m just so pent up with anger at my fellow Scot and tearful.
I used to be one the wingers on here who would try and be strong for everyone else but I’m afraid I’ve lost it tonight, tears rolling down my face.
To everyone on Wings tonight I want to apologise for not being as strong as I have been in the last few hours. I think when reality hits me it hits pretty damned hard and I’m not so good as I appear to everyone in terms of dealing with bad news!
Apologies apart I agree that we should all now look towards achieving 100% success in the 3 main points in Robert’s post.
Retribution is best served cold, and what better way to serve up retribution than drive the print newspapers in Scotland out of business and drive BBCV out of Scotland. Most importantly though above everything else we MUST kill off the Labour party in Scotland. Every single one of these two faced hypocritical LIARS must be driven from their cushy troughs and we can start next MAY!
Wee ginger dug has an excellent post up you really should read.
link to weegingerdug.wordpress.com
Let’s not just curl up and walk away, that will be far too easy for London. Labour and London think it’s all over, but they are wrong.
This is NOT the end, this is just the freaking beginning.
Do not give up Yes campaigners.
Newspapers and TV all fought you.
The three UK-wide parties all fought you.
With Social media and passion you fought them to a standstill and made them feel fear.
They wheeled out a General to say stupid things and insult our dead.
Masters of The Universe were moved to talk about an independence movement within a stable Northern European democracy and say it would unleash chaos in the Middle East.
A Scottish vote might even cause a new great depression! Who knew??
You fought the Law.
I am not sure the law has really won.
Keep fighting past this day.
Cry over heart broken head engaged. Keep your friends close and your enemies closer. You need to get into MSM and you need friends in high places with deep pockets. 1 million people voted for YES don’t let them down. I’m new to all this so might be way of the mark so correct me if I’m wrong are you guys are called activists? AS used to be one and has spent his whole life fighting look where he is now he’s used his brain. People are scared really scared and they shouldn’t be. It’s not the right time that doesn’t mean it won’t come you feel bad imagine how alex & co feel. Hit them where it hurts their wallets we should have a protest and get the 1 million people to have a no shop day don’t spend a penny. Shop in the food banks they deserve the money not the big bastard supermarkets. They like having food banks lets support them for our shopping. don’t give any money to charities it’s a con use your money wisely. Just a few thoughts probs mostly rantings ive had little sleep since Monday don’t let it be for nothing get stronger. Vigil idea great don’t let them see you cry tee shirt and badges sound good too. Love and hugs to you all Xx get evidence for rigging.
It was the BBC and the MSM that won it. Let’s dust ourselves down and make sure Scotland gets the best deal it can.
I guess we all get to look forward to reminding the no voters of what they chose when people start suffering and dying from increasing poverty, shrinking budgets and privatised NHS, austerity, foreign wars, etc. The suffering will be endless and the powers non-existent or a poisoned chalice.
Unless there was a fiddle – and I’ve heard some very suspicious things going on – Scotland chose to curl up and die. No one in the world will have sympathy for a people who chose to be trampled. Good luck for those who have visas lined up or places in EU to go to, at least you have the option of a bright future in another country.
RAGE AGAINST THE WM MACHINE
Eh, perhaps not. let’s not make a fus .
Eat out cereal, back of the bus and shut up. Really? Really?
Not shame on us SHAME on them. Imperial Masters, Go watch Riot Club for a sense of irony. WE fucked up. My children who thought this was YES-Mass going to wake up soon to go to school as I did in 79. WTF to say…
I hope the Scottish squaddies are stocking up on high-factor sunscreen. They’ll need it in Syria
Thanks Betty Boop. I’ll put the idea on the ‘exposing anti-independence bias on the bbc’ facebook page.
1 1/5 Million thats still a result
No First Minister, this is not democracy, this is facism, fuck off with your respect for the result. FUCK this
Robert Louis Hear, hear, with you on that and the first thing we should all do tomorrow, is cancel our TV licences, well those that still have them.
As for those journos and the SH who left it al to the last minute – don’t buy them. Wonder how Ian McWhirter and derek Bateman feel now and those on TV who never asked the questions pf the unionist MSPs and MPs until the last minute.
@ panda paws
i came on to say most of what u have already said so well said and i totally agree
im ashamed and totally gutted..i cant imagine how stu and all the people on here who put so much work into it must feel..no amount of prozac is going to make the feeling go away..it doesnt matter what way anybody spins it..we are a nation of shite bags and we will be a laughing stock all around the world.
All this talk of regrouping and moving the fight on is embarrassing.
I shall be encouraging my children to take their degrees and get as far away from this fuckin shitebag filled region as possible.
There is nothing here for them to stay for, Scotland is now OFFICIALLY the worse place in the world, half full of stupid gullible and selfish Bastards.
Twice in my lifetime…FFS !
I would now like the SNP to resign en masse on Monday and force an election they refuse to sit in.
Let the ("Tractor" - Ed)s take the blame when the devastation comes and they find themselves powerless to stop their fuckin tory whoremeisters.
Am away tae bed, when ah wake up i renounce any notion of this place being a “country”.
2nd try.
Robert Louis Hear, hear, with you on that and the first thing we should all do tomorrow, is cancel our TV licences, well those that still have them.
As for those journos and the SH who left it al to the last minute – don’t buy them. Wonder how Ian McWhirter and derek Bateman feel now and those on TV who never asked the questions pf the unionist MSPs and MPs until the last minute.
@ Lesley-Anne
You don’t have to be strong ….. you’ve always been here for us all, so let us be here for you for a change. It’s hard for me to offer any words of comfort which will make u feel better. I can’t even come and give you a hug because I live 11,000 miles away on the other side of the world. Remember this, however. It’s not how we fall down, but how we pick ourselves up again. As for me, this just makes me more determined than ever. We may be battered and bruised for now. But we’ll never ever be broken. Keep the faith.
@ Robert Louis, 5.55 am
You are 100 % right on the nail.
Thanks for that wee bit of solace.
We fight on, folks. With renewed vigour, intelligence, savvy and determination.
Tonight we need rest. Over the weekend we’ll (mebbes aye, mebbes naw) peep our heads above the parapet and examine the analysis.
Next week, we start up a crowd-fund a luxury holiday for Stuart Campbell.
The week after that – we start again.
Just trying to keep myself sane, folks.
Totally heartbroken.
Never mind Lesley-Anne they aren’t worth it. You can hold your head high. You fought the good fight.
Alex still looks like the carb that got the cream.
Second reading in March. Ball in their court. Watch them juggle it.
Many thanks SS for your kind words
I know in time I’ll be back to my old self it’s just so hard at the moment. Maybe like so many others on here I need to have some time away, I don’t know I’ll maybe see later on.
The one thing Darling, Murphy and the media don’t want to hear is that the fight goes on. They want us to curl up and die. Too much work went into this and too many people voted Yes for this to end.
I went to bed because I have work in the morning.
I’ve woken up to find my fellow North Britains have decided they want the remaining 60% of austerity measures. They want to lose another 9 MPs from Westminster next year giving us an even smaller voice. They want budget cuts across the board. They want privatisation of our public services. They want our farmers to receive the lowest subsidies in the land. They want fracking. They want higher taxes and they want the same lower public spending levels that Majority Britain have. They want Christoper Chope MP and his team of backbenchers to say “No, you’re getting no new powers. You’re in it with us now.” They want our young men sent off to die in other peoples wars. Hell, they even want to be mocked mercilessly every year at Murrayfield, Twickenham, Hampden whenever the band strike up that dirge of a so-called national anthem.
I’ve always told my Son, “‘I want’ doesn’t get.”
Well, they’re gonna get it all.
They will regret it but not today. Let the jeers wash over you. Let them cheer the demise of their ancient country. I will weep no tears for them or me today or ever.
But when it dawns on them what they have done. When the penny drops and they see their mistake, their folly, their tragedy. they realise just what they have done, you and I will be there.
Stay safe, people. Hug your friends and family and take a rest. You’ve all earned it.
Hail Alba.
Carb!!!?
CAT that got the cream
geeo
hopefully the SNP will resign and refuse to stand for election.
Brilliant speech from Alex. Watch out Cameron, he is after you
Thanks to Wings, Newsnetscotland, Bella, Business for Scotland and many more for supporting us. The result is indicative of the relentless No onslaught from the MSM and we have effectively given the green light for Westminster to shaft us even more – condoning the modern day version of rape and pillage. We are now officially a region of the UK – Scotland no more
There will be NO DEAL after this. There will be no powers, no increased budget. All they will offer is poisoned chalice of making Scotland raise more of its own funding and increasing its taxes.
Have never posted, but just wanted to say thanks Stu for everything. We owe you a debt of gratitude for your contribution and I hope you’ll continue, as we still have a lot of work to do.
I feel strangely not bothered, maybe it’s the adrenalin of a fast cycle thru the deserted city or the strange experience of finding I had wandered into the midst of the slab big boys and girls, thinking looking smug was supposed to be a bad thing
ok so come Monday we need to start sorting the country out despite them, how I don’t know but we are still a movement for change, from the ground up.
It’s popcorn time on the Jam before an election and the pressure is all on them now for the next few months.
Chin up folks
I’ve heard Slovenia is nice
I wish people would stop referring to Scotland as a country. We are a region
Don’t cringe now, or they will have WON. Dig in your heels, resist, join the resistance. Oppose them every way you can. Simply refuse to play their game. You have the framework for a movement, and there are going to be a lot of angry, disappointed people. Harness that, be positive before it turns ugly. Organise, resist. Join together or else they will break you one by one. Anyone can look brave when they’re winning, but true courage is holding on when all seems lost.
Look, I’ve seen so much hope, so much enthusiasm, so much creativity, and above all that precious empowering feeling that change is really possible. That things can be better, very much better. If you let go of that the tragedy will be unbearable. Fear will have triumphed and everything will have been in vain. Please don’t let that happen, it needn’t happen, it’s up to you.
Danny Alexander says “hopefully”, “I intend to”, blah, blah, blah.
Just listened to AS and I felt so sad.
We don’t have what we wanted but we can still rally round AS and like he said, hold Cameron and Brown to account on their promises and the timetable.
If he’s willing to fight then so should we be.
I stilled liked what Robert Louis said.
Quinie frae Angus
Yip. I was angry at first, but then I thought why should we just hand everything to these lying unionist barstewards. They want us to just walk away. Oh no, I intend fighting. This was only the FIRST referendum.
Many, many people greater than me, spent their whole lives working for Scottish independence, and never even got a referendum. So, to me walking away is not an option.
People in Scotlan will very quickly realise that the Labour promises were just lies.
Nobody ever said this would be easy. We do not stop, we move the fight onwards.
Please, folks, watch out for some false flag posters who are trying to spread dissent and fractionation. Be wise to what they will try to do. They will try to turn one group against another. DO not let them.
The next independence referendum will be in 2 years. Let’s make it happen. We carry on until we win.
@geeo,completely agree with you, fuck them all from andy murray and his last minute conversion when it was no use whatever to bateman and his bbc aren’t biased and the snp wishy washy nicey nicey pish.
Salmond’s speech just showed hes one of them another career trougher. This referendum is null and void due to interference from Westminster. Salmond should show some baws and fucking fight for Scotland instead of positioning his party for another cosy love in with the scum occupying our country.
On BBC.
“The Prime Minister of UK intends to give a speech showing direction of process. Including more powers for England”.
Just what this was all about, eh?
Danny Alexander and Jim Murphy should be the first on any hit list before the bbc
To those who vote YES, thank you for proving humanity still exists. To those who voted NO…spineless faaaaaaaaaaanies!
thank you all – we are down but not out – we have witnessed a lot over recent weeks – and the rottenness at the heart of Westminster and the media has been exposed…
Robert is right we have to keep talking and sharing the truth and become the media – the vote shows that everyone wants change …..we have to be that change…..
Aye resign en masse, show some fucking spirit you SNP troughers
mr thms says:
19 September, 2014 at 6:32 am
I wish people would stop referring to Scotland as a country. We are a region
so true
You are being very selfish with some of your posts but hey ho if that’s how you really feel then off you go and prove the bastards right. Close your site coz it’s only your playground nothing real about it. You should react to their shite the way they react to our poverty and pain with blatant indifference and a smile. You disappoint me more than the results with the result there is still hope for a future with your attitudes there is non and you fooled me into thinking there was so shame on you you are no better than them thinking only of your selves and your pride but that’s ok isn’t it I don’t matter. Thanks a lot. You are doing what most of the country has done lying down shame on you don’t slag people off for doing the same as you when you should know better, they don’t know any better, so you’re worse than them. It was maybe just a wee game for you but this is something that me and thousands of other people have waited a lifetime for. Cheers for the pretense if nothing else I’ve learned a lesson. Love and hugs Xx
One of the worst days of my 61 years. I have to fly back into Glasgow tonight and walk under that fucking sign saying uk border.
stay positive everyone. Think a lot of people haven’t slept enough. I think uniting behind the pro independence parties, especially greens and SNP, and ensuring real worthwhile powers as promised are forthcoming, is vital now. Let’s remember that people weren’t necessarily rejecting Scotland as their nation, they are just victims of an onslaught of media propaganda.
We want more for our country and we’ll get it.
I think AS phoned Murdoch to put up a dodgy poll,so Westminster would panic
fools they think they won, they have no idea what they have lost, in their selfish self-centered blind panic.
what have they done!
well done everyone @ wings, a valiant effort, against incredible odds and ignorance et al.
we even nearly pulled it off, a crying shame.
@ pension age, i’m ok.
I am skrry but I am disgusted with the no voters, an absolutel disgrace, to give away your own country to a dispicable neighbour, wirds cannot discribe, the media and westminster won, they can have their bloodbath now. Worst of all our retired well off neighboursall voted no, my kids have disabilities their futures look bkeak unkess we leave Scotland.
Incrdeibly scared if what they will do to Scotland now, and the Northern parts of the uk, very worrying.
sorry the typos, cant see thru the tears, what a sad sad day.
Ah well.
Thing to remember is, we won, really: No only won the vote via the timid, the rich, and the bulk of the coffin-dodgers. Those demographics will continue to weaken, one way or another.
Well done Glasgow – proud of my city. Told you you were wrong about us, Rev!
And thank you so much Rev Stu, an amazing job you have done.
Heads high, walk proud ALL 1,500,000 + of us who voted for change, optimism, hope and a fairer Society. You’ve been a credit to your nation! Scotland needs us more than ever in the dark days ahead! Finally, thank you to all fellow wingers who inspired, comforted and educated me on this (ongoing) journey!
Im at the point that i feel like cancelling my trip to Scotland in feb eith the gf. I wanted to show her the wonders of the country, but lets be honest, Scotland has shown its true face. It may sound spiteful, but I am a great believer in democracy. The people wanted the hellfires of westminster brought down upon them. I say let them rip. They brought this upon themselves
I feel so sorry for Alex Salmond, Nicola Sturgeon, and all of the SNP mp’s and msp’s who fought so hard for the Scottish people.Can you imagine how they must feel?
Our mp’s will now have to return to Westminster and endure as much humiliation as the unionists can heap on them.When Westminster takes it’s revenge on Scotland, as it surely will, the people will waken up.Let’s hope that we can work out a way to fight back soon.
For now though, rest.I am proud of every one of you, even though I have never met you.You are my brothers and sisters.
A disgraced, shamed region of England.
How could anyone vote against their own nations independence?
When they tore up the treaty the No’s couldn’t muster the patriotism to say anything,when they lined up and threatened us all the no’s couldn’t muster the courage to stand up to them,when the prophets of doom descended on us they couldnt gather the optimism to question them.
In fact,the No’s jumped on every pronouncement with glee and would grasp and claw at the cracks in Scotland to justify there own cowardly disposition.
And now we have been defined by them as a people and reduced from a proud Nation to a lapdog.
My hatred burns,i am so angry with my fellow Scots.
You have shamed us before the world.
This is unforgivable.
Too Wee, Too poor and definitely TOO FEART!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
please dont get too downhearted people.
Lets go away , calm and compose ourselves regroup and carry on.
keep supporting grassroots organisations for independance as well as excellent sites like this.
We only have to win once. westminster must get it right everytime!!!
It does now seem that Scotland is divided into BritScots and the rest of us who refuse to accept the Unionist mindset and all its trappings. That’s just the way it is. The Yes side felt as if something was about to happen, but there were too many forces ranged against it.
For me, Scotland being in control of its own affairs makes perfect sense. I will continue to think that. Britscots are now the obvious majority (well-played chaps!) and they think Westminster delivers the best deal for Scotland. Watching how things are conducted in the UK parliament you just know Scotland comes way down in its list of priorities.
But Britscots feel a sense of security in leaving all the grown up stuff to those guys with plummy accents and eccentric rituals, and all the pomp and ceremony of the House of Lords and the Royals, which seem to elevate their status in the eyes of the world. But it’s really just an elaborate construct to give the impression of power and legitimacy, when actually they’re just a bunch of dafties with no real commonsense. What they do have is inherited wealth which keeps them in power. And not just the Tories. The House of Lords is packed with Labour grandees with seats on many a lucrative board. Labour now look and sound like Tories in more ways than one.
The political drift in England is to the right, with UKIP propelling that shift. What they desire is an American-style economy, which means an ever-diminishing welfare state.
Perhaps the Britscots are comfortable with this future? As a radically-minded person I will oppose that shift.
I am not really comfortable engaging in politics as I find it all a bit too corrosive sometimes. And if I am to be called a narrow-minded ScotNat by the trolls who have come to gloat, then I might appear to be a curio seeing that I dislike bagpipes, kilts, Irn-Bru, tartanalia but love English rock music and literature, Italian and German football, American Jazz and Rock music, European Cinema, and many more things which hardly fit the narrow ‘nat’ stereotype. Most people who are for Independence tend to be open-minded and curious about other cultures. We just want to be accepted by the world as ourselves, standing on our own two feet.
As Kurt Vonnegut once said: So it goes.
That is a despicable thing to say, though4scotland, we yes voters are upset enough, we know whats coming but please do not wish it on us. There will be many angry people today.
To all of you who voted no, you have killed my country. You are ("Tractor" - Ed)s
Operator, could you please trace this call and tell me where I am. Cos’ I’m fucked if I know.
Gutted, what a wasted opportunity
Can Look forward to a privatised NHS and UKIP!
Oh well lets send 60 nationalist MP’s to westminster the war aint lost
Bleuuurgh!
Alistair Darling’s hypocritical, smarmy speech gives me the dry boak!
Contrast that with Alex Salmond’s statesmanlike speech a while earlier.
Well, ermine for our Darling, then…
doziR says
“t was maybe just a wee game for you but this is something that me and thousands of other people have waited a lifetime for. ”
I have been an SNP supporter for nigh on 40 years, and Im sorry but if the people of Scotland want to ignore that train barrelling down the tracks straight at them and simply put their fingers in their ears to drown out the frantic whistles, then fuck them I cant stand anymore ridicule from people who simply DO NOT want to beleive the UK government does not have thier best interest at heart,
In spite of being the very people who went through the eighties and watched their country being dismantled, AND STILL WE’RE BETTER TOGETHER?
then I’ve had it with them.
I cant expend any more of my remaining years trying to persuade Scots not to put that gun to their heads and pull the trigger,
GO RIGHT AHEAD SCOTLAND BE MY GUEST!
Calgacus says:
Never mind Lesley-Anne they aren’t worth it. You can hold your head high. You fought the good fight.
Many thanks Calcagus for your kind words. I know that I along with everyone else here did what we had to do. It will take time for our collective pain to disappear but it will eventually. I am certain of one though. When we return, as we surely will, we will be better, bigger and stronger than before and we will kick earse!
If the lying toerags of Bitter Together thought they got away Scot free they can think again because when we return, as we surely will, we will be on the hunt for heads to roll, not one or two but the whole damned lot!
I agree with others on here though. The Bitter whatsits thought that by winning tonight they had put the idea of Scottish independence to bed. If only they could. All they have managed to do is to rile up 1.6 MILLION Scots who will NEVER give up. We fought and were bloodied but we were NOT beaten.
We shall rise up again and we shall fight them again and we shall give them a damned good kicking AGAIN! If that doesn’t work then we will RISE UP again and give them another kicking. This is NOT the end. This is only the BEGINNING!
Scots have always had the history of being tenacious fighters well folks WE the supporters of YES have taken over the mantle of the tenacious Scottish fighter!
One final point here. Should this guy be using a pen at the Edinburgh count?
link to tinyurl.com
Calgacus at 6:20 am says:
‘No First Minister, this is not democracy, this is facism (sic), fuck off with your respect for the result. FUCK this.’
If fear is a factor, these words and others like them caused the reaction that spooked those who overwhelmingly voted No. Canny folk who played the pollsters for suckers, telling them what they wanted to hear, but swearing not to be ordered about by SNP activists when in the privacy of the ballot box. Scots don’t like having their Scottishness questioned or redefined and being told who is or isn’t Scots, but that’s what they get from the SNP. It’s an arrogance that 55% of Scots have just rejected.
After 307 years of being British why change just because a bunch of middle-class intellectuals think they know so much better?
The challenge now is to heal the divisions between all the British people that Alex Salmond has caused. Hopefully he will now resign, and with luck the SNP will prove to lack the depth of talent needed to prosper without him.
As for the United Kingdom, this is a great day – what does not destroy us makes us stronger.
Well the nation has spoken and I really can’t believe their answer to the question. I have been here before in 1979 so live in hope there will be a next time. Perhaps the 90 minute patriots will be in the minority at that point, I certainly hope so. In the meantime I look forward to reaping westminster’s “magnanimity” in their victory with project fear… till next time.
Scotland is not my nation. It doesn’t exist. I have devoted half my life to this. I accept I am a prisoner in a strange country. I don’t have an identity anymore other than as an individual.
Thanks to the spineless, foodbanks will remain a permanent fixture here. Truly selfish bastards.
Map and graph here, really brings it home when you see the wee bit of blue
link to cityam.com
We can all be as positive as we like, but westmonster will destroy Scotland, and the Scottish parliament may well be absolved, ffs! Ukip, tory, liblabcondem, the lot of them, taking our revenues, wasting it on wmds, meanwhile keeping people in poverty…ffs!
There are no Brits here bluedog.Only Scots.
Fuck the No’s,i disown the shitebags.
Absolutely heartbroken. Heartfelt thanks to Stu & all the Wingers for everthing you’ve done. This is only the end of the beginning though
Hetty don’t say that it’s not true change doesn’t come like we imagined it you need to crawl before you can walk I wish people would stop being so nasty about people they said they were trying to help and care about. one and half million people nearly half the country want change. Now you are just falling for the fear thing it’s that that will get us it’s that that has gotten our people please don’t fall for it. Think about it properly if you give up now it’s all been for nothing. You folk must have led very sheltered lives and been so sheltered from pain and disappointment. You should be getting strength from this why are you letting smug monsters win so easily. Disappointment does not come close to the way you are making me feel your destroying my country with these comments get a grip. Have you ever lost a child how does this compare to that. You must all be space cadets fraudsters if you let them win. Stick a picture of Gordon Brown on your fridge look at it every day. Have you never watched the “The Men That Made us Shop” shows have a look at them and you might understand what’s happened. All your fighting talk means nothing without backbone to follow it threw. The results haven’t broken me, I’m just a middle aged woman without any experience of this stuff, your comments will though.
It is now a decisive win for No.
The SNP will be nothing more than a spectator at the next UK GE.
I admire and support all efforts to continue to push and attack the media and the establishment ("Quizmaster" - Ed)s.
However the SNP leadership is, understandably, talking about working with the smoke and mirros agenda for some additional responsibilities and respecting the whole once in a generation thing.
We need to face facts. It does look like disaffected voters have somehow decided to get out and vote No. I just cannot get my head round this, regardless of the Media lies. As I said earlier Scotland is now a Region.
People who voted no out of fear and would have liked to be independent will gradually come to regret their decision but will not be able to do a thing about it. I pity them.
I am gutted for my parents who probably wont be around to see another referendum.
I am gutted for the Catalans who will now have a very difficult time securing their own vote and getting it recognised by Spain. Clearly the international community will turn their heads and see it as an internal issue.
Finally I am gutted for those who know in every fibre of their body that we needed a Yes and went out and tried to persuade others. I am lucky I now live in France and the sight of my british passport sickens me. I may have to become French, not because I feel am French but the UK is largely anti Europe and xenophobic. I don’t have to suffer that too.
The relatively low vote in Glasgow certainly needs looking into. How many ballot boxes ended up at the bottom of the Clyde? How many postal votes somehow went to the wrong address?
Well done Scotchland, let’s go for the mystery box of “more powers”.
I was happy to take a temporary hit for Scotland but to go back in the gimp box for the UK, NO THANKS well F* O**. As said many posts ago, look EU brothers in the eye or look at your feet. I will have to get used to my laces, it seems. BBC, MSM , Print, UKGOV psy-ops – FU. 1979 all over again. There is no glory in this “defeat”. In any other “foreign” campaign the MSM would have been with. I have replied to my colleagues 2 weeks ago on the ref “if you have check into Al Jazeera about what is happening in your own country there is a problem”. Disenfranchised by BT /Lib/Tory/UKIP/BBC/MSM/UKIP/WM machine. Don’t worry Jim yoor exps are safe now. Well done Brown, Darling, Alexander Bros your ermine will warm your neck. Unfortuneately SoS Carmicheal is stuck doing insurance ads in the near future. Nighty, night folks off to my GIMP box to eat my cereal. It’s at the back of the bus, best keep quiet…
This was never about Scotland England – not for one minute – but I bet you the English would never have voted away their sovereignty.
To the 45 – I salute you. To the rest? I really don’t know what to say, apart from the fact you’re an embarrassment.