The Really Useful Show
Our attention was drawn this weekend to a survey conducted by the Scottish Chambers of Commerce, which polled 759 Scottish businesses of various sizes about a number of issues relating to independence.
It doesn’t seem to have had a great deal of coverage, perhaps because most of the answers were in the “bleeding obvious” category – business frets about change, and the more change there might be the less they like it.
One set of figures did catch our eye, though.
Business was dissatisfied with the quality of the debate so far in general – 56% of the respondents rated it “Poor” or “Dismal”, against just 20% saying “Good” or “Very Good” – but it was intriguing to see where they placed the blame for that assessment. Asked how useful they found each of four protagonists’ contributions, the net ratings were:
Yes Scotland: -4
The Scottish Government: -9
Better Together: -38
The UK Government: -52
Given the endless flow of doom-laden “Scotland Analysis” papers churned out by Westminster, and the even more numerous “factsheets” provided by the official No campaign, those are some stinging judgements. While nobody got a pass mark, the two Yes bodies scored an only mildly disapproving -13 combined, against a staggering combined -90 for the No representatives.
(NB These figures are what you get if you apply equal value to each response, ie “Not very useful” and “Useless” are both counted as one point. If you weight the results so that the more extreme responses – both positive and negative – count twice as strongly, things get much worse for the No camp: the combined Yes total actually improves slightly to just -10, but the No figure plummets to a horrific -132.)
This week Professor John Curtice noted a growing problem for the No camp, namely its inability to convince even its own supporters that it was telling the truth:
It seems fair to say that purely on the basis of being inherently change-averse, businesses could be expected to lean towards No by default. But by a huge margin, they seem a lot more favourably inclined to what they’re being told by the Yes side. Over the next five months, with the polls increasingly on a knife-edge, that could become a significant factor.
There are only so many times you can be caught lying before people stop listening.
The Sunday Herald agrees with you. They’re saying Yes.
If they stopped lying there would be nothing but a deathly silence and empty newspaper columns galore.
An earlier announcement from the SCC – perhaps part of the same quoted above, or more likely an element lifted out of context by the antipathetic press – stated of its “9000 members” about a third were against independence, or worried by it. But what Wings shows is they are not quite “against” independence.
Were we treated to more concocted exaggerations by our concerned Fourth Estate?
Sunday Herald is first paper to back Scottish independence
Yeeeeha!
Boils down to change and people don’t like change, basically we need to reach the fearties and convince them that this change is good. And major kudos to Sunday Herald hopefully the rest will have their eyes opened when the paper can’t keep up with demand.
Many moons ago I had a boss who was the chair of the local Chamber of Commerce. He was universally acknowledged to be a dipstick. I’d bet good money they’re all the same.
Better Together have one HUGE problem. They have been found out telling lies for so long, ever since the referendum debate started in fact. Any credibility that they might have had at the very beginning has been well and truly shot full of holes.
If the unthinkable were to happen and Better Together were to start actually telling the TRUTH no one would actually believe them. As far as Better Together are concerned people only expect two things to come from them.
1) Scare stories that are very quickly shot down in flames by the YES side.
2) outright lies that don’t even constitute scare stories that are also shot down in flames by the YES side.
We have now reached the point in the referendum where one side or the other is going to have to start thinking about changing its spots, so to speak. Well we all know that the YES side do NOT need to do any changing of their spots which just leaves Better Together. Unfortunately Better Together have no idea about how to go about changing their spots!
Ref the Herald, great news that is really going to sting the Unionists. Just wonder if they might have had a whisper about the Sun’s intentions and went out to beat them to being the first?
Well, I hope that was the reason!
Great News, onwards and upwards!
O/T so soon but ‘One Great Thing’ An anthem we can all get behind.
‘I only hope what pleases me will also pleasure you’
People/businesses don’t think the campaigns are providing useful information, but how many of them have made an attempt to look for the information available, attend a meeting, listen to a speech, gone online, contacted Business for Scotland?. This is a survey of businesses — so presumably of people used to accessing information.
September’s vote is of enormous importance so I would hope these businesses attempt to track down the information they require. Or is this just another side of the not-sufficient-information response that people who can’t be bothered trot out?
The Yes side comes out slightly better, but hardly well. Perhaps the Scottish Government needs a mass issue of spoons to spoon feed relevant information to the doubters and waverers.
Lesley-Anne says:
Hi
Well, I WOULD believe them, if they said WE WILL have a currency union, I would believe them if they say WE WILL get into the EU, a doddle!, I would believe them if they say WE WILL get into Nato, no problem, etc etc etc !
But hey what is the chances of them telling the truth, ok we can dream!
How I would love to be the paper boy delivering the Sunday Herald to Flipper’s Hoose in the morning
Oh Flipper here’s your paper what was that you were saying about the pound.. 
We have been buying the Sunday Herald for a couple of months now.
Hopefully not to early to go O/T but do you think the failure of NOB to last more than one day’s scrutiny was enough to send the Sunday Herald to commit?
To be honest Les even IF Better together actually started telling the TRUTH I still would NOT believe them.
I’m rather alarmed by how excited I am at the news that the Sunday Herald is now supporting independence. At last!
Claire,
Not ashamed to say I cried tears when I saw that headline. One great thing, and it’s going to happen in my life.
@Bit of a stushie – same here but it’s thanks to the likes of WoS that we have got this far.
Lesley-Anne says:
Hi,
Me neither, as I said anyway “what chance of that!”
Unfortunately, they will not even discuss the issues, as they cant really defend the record of the Union as far as Scotland is concerned. Says it all really!
Been buying it for the last month also.
It’s important to support a paper taking such a stance.
I hope they have a good print run planned for tomorrow.
We will have to get the REV to approve the articles in the Herald!! Before print of course! Ha !
I’m also looking forward to the BBC coverage of the grass roots journalistic support for our cause, after all, they’ve had enough notice to be able to do a 5 minutes feature on media supporting indy, and as a bonus, I don’t think the Sunday Herald has a s***e in-house band.
If a few chambers of commerce would actually go out and invite Business for Scotland to make a presentation, then they WOULD be better informed.
Went to one on Thursday and have to say it was brilliant.
Re the Sunday Herald. Ill be out am to buy my first paper in over three years.
I meant to say above that should the Sunday Herald put on circulation as a result of ‘coming out’, it might just encourage others to do likewise.
OT.I see that the ‘Scotland Yet’film fundraiser has had a wee boost, so keep up the good work.
link to indiegogo.com
SKY news press review saying the editor of the Sunday Herald “risks alienating some of it’s readers”. On the contrary, I would expect a sharp rise in sales tomorrow. Would be interestingpto see the circulation figures.
Eric The Cheeseman says:
SKY news press review saying the editor of the Sunday Herald “risks alienating some of it’s readers”. On the contrary, I would expect a sharp rise in sales tomorrow. Would be interestingpto see the circulation figures.
I heard that Eric, the guy was from the Sun on Sunday. What an eejit he is. I think that was he pitiful attempt to show his support for the union.
What this guy totally failed to grasp was that whilst some outright unionists will indeed stop buying the Sunday Herald what will more than make up for this is the massive increase in the sales due to the rush from YES supporters.
The survey goes along with a couple of small businesses i know whose owners are definite NOs but don’t like the scaremongering from either side and don’t believe a word they read. It also goes along with my NO voting daughter who won’t read a BT leaflet because they’re biased. Her NO voting fiance on the other hand wants to read the BT leaflet, but also was savage at missing the YES leaflet dropper as he had questions to ask.
Sunday Herald – a bit of a surprise they actually came out and generally I would disapprove, but at least there’s the one on our side.
Sunday Herald now has a guaranteed buyer. Almost tears in my eyes now that we have a newspaper on board.
Next for Cockers at the Torygraph!
What the papers say!
link to bbc.co.uk
Stu,
Not sure your figures are quite right. I make Yes at -5 and UK govt at -52
But I also think you should weight it. “Very useful/useless” is a value judgment and should score more than “useful/not very useful”. If we assume useless is twice as valueless as not very useful and very useful is twice as valuable as useful, so taking your +/- numbers, the figures look like this:
Yes: -2 (+2)
Scot Govt: -9 (NC)
Better Together: -53 (-21)
UK Govt: -79 (-23)
Which means that while none of the groups are “trusted” the unionist organisations’ contributions are considered to be more useless than those of the pro-independence organisations.
“Not sure your figures are quite right. I make Yes at -5 and UK govt at -52”
You’re half right. I got the UK government one wrong (fixed now), but Yes is 40+ (13 plus 27) and 44- (34 plus 10) so I was right on that one.
Valid point about the weighting. Pondering whether to change it, because it’s hard to put a definitive value on the weight – who’s to say it’s really 2x, rather than (say) 1.5x?
Dads, you’re starting to come across as strangely ambivalent about independence.
And you’ve been missing from this forum for months and suddenly resurfaced.
Your post last night about your No voting daughter might have been construed as trolling by some.
Convince me otherwise.
O/T, but in a week of hypocrisy & pisspoor churnalism by the MSM, including Salmond (not) calling us a ‘nation of drunks’, I see the Guardian reporting UK Labour as planning a “crackdown on alcohol”.
@Training Day
What you think is up to you, I post as PP in the Herald, and posted as dadsarmy in the Guardian before I gave up on getting SC to be factual. Chances are I’ve supported Indy longer than you have.
You seem quite defensive, Dads,
I’m a trusting chap so I’ll believe that your absence from WoS for months on end is purely a matter of chance.
The same chance that you’ve supported independence longer than I have.
@call me dave
Thanks for the link.
I think that was a an excellent and fair analysis of the Sunday Herald and overall situation.
@Training Day
I’m afraid you get the wooden spoon for deductive reasoning, and use of Intelligence with a capital I. Try re-reading the posting I politely gave you.
@call me dave.
I second Truth’s comment and thankyou to yourself.
What a birthday present… after we get Yes, I will remember the 3rd May for this huge step forward.
Ps. Dads Army & Training Day… this isn’t a competition. Now both kiss and make up.
@dads
I’ve reread it. None the wiser. I’ll take a wild guess that I’m closer to what’s happening than you.
I was going to ask what your point is?
Training & Dads… chill guys. This is not a competition. Relax and enjoy the Herald announcement. Peace.
Training Day/dadsarmy, c’mon guys, we’ve got a hard enough job fighting the forces of darkness, without fighting amongst ourselves
@Training Day
I’ve been busy elsewhere. To give you a hint, in 17 months 11,622 comments, 106791 votes.
Not counting the deletions, some but not all justified, by a long chalk
@Dadsarmy
Just leave Training Day with that thought, I see your work elsewhere on a daily basis. Excellent hatting figures.
As others have said lets not fall out. My Australian Merlot, mentioned earlier has gone, I’m off to bed too.
Hic!! batting
Thanks call me dave.
Suspicion is healthy all the same. There could well be surprises over the next few months, both good and bad, so it’s as well to be on the lookout. Night night, sleep tight!
I better turn in too.
I’ve got to get up early and get some Heralds!
Have been aware as a reader online that The Herald was a closet yes. Great that they are out in the open. I will be getting paper copies of both papers for a few months, at least, as a thanks for fair play. If the rest hope for my order, tough it’s first past the post for this household.
C’mon Stu, own up! you bought the Herald with the funds didn’t you?
From my experience, the Don’t Knows seem very soft. As I just speak to strangers, I’m coming across the politically disconnected, a lot. I think I’m getting through by asking if they would allow their neightbour to control their household budget, their friends an enemies, their media, their potential, their wars, etc. Trident and its replacement is a good one to top off with.
Scots Asians really don’t like to think that their taxes might be maiming and killing relative and friends back ‘home’. I should have a couple of Scots Asians shop-keepers moves to Yes within a week or two, and have been invited for a coffee by another. These guys will be dealing with a lot of people , on a daily basis.
I’m not one for counting chickens, but I don’t think the Union has a particularly long future to look forwards to,. judging by how easy it appears to be o break down barriers based on unfounded fears. Keep smiling.
I’m going to buy a Sunday Herald take it to work and pull it out of my briefcase and say,
I’ll just leave this here,
placing it quietly on the desk.
Its happening guys,
the Genies out of the bottle,
AND HE AINT GOIN BACK IN.
Lies, nothiing but lies from Naw
youtube.com/watch?v=v6cn0mLJVZY
I know its only 6:28am on 3rd May 2014, but I’m off to buy 5 copies of today’s Sunday Herald. I will buy them at different newsagents so as to leave some for others. When I buy a couple of them at Asda I intend to leave one on prominent display at the entrance for all to see. 2014 is a monumental year for Scotland. Today is a significant day for Yes. Hope every Yesser manages to get a copy of this great edition.
Walk into the light:
link to heraldscotland.com
That’s great to see business’s having so much more faith in Yes than No.
What a fantastic cover on the Sunday Herald! It’s stunning, contrast that with the shameful Saltire/Swastika image the Scotsman used months back and It’s clear which side cares about and has vision for Scotland. And which side is going win!
I love the wee bagpipe playing lions round the edges too, does anyone know if Alasdair Gray’s just come up with them or is that an old symbol I don’t recognise?
With the Sunday Herald now openly Yes, might they be interested in printing the odd piece by Stu and other contributors? Would be a nice way to get some of this great material out to folk who aren’t using the internet to get informed
Further up the column it was mentioned that people do not like change, I find this a bit misleading as everything changes all the time, yes, in times previous when everyone kept the job they started when they left school till the day they retired, everything was pretty stable. Modern life is so much different from then. Today you need to be more, and quickly adaptable to changing circumstances. So those people who want to think nothing will change, need to realise life is an evolutionary process. Only a yes vote will stop us from being the extinct dinosaurs held in political stasis of a past it’s sell by date political union which only advantages those pulling the strings and keeps everyone else in poverty.
Up and about already after 3hrs sleep, feeling fine and ‘walking’ down to the newsagents (merlot after effects)to get my hands on two Sunday heralds.
Toast and weak tea first though
Rev, this report was covered in a midweek Reporting Scotland.
It was billed as all the campaign’s are failing – the quite sizeable difference between Yes and No was not reported and indeed- the spokeswoman for the Scottish Chambers of Commerce was on the whole negative when interviewed. Questions are not being answered, EU and currency once again.
What was obvious was the use of this group as presenting small and medium business in Scotland to nullify the disaster of the recent CBI debacle which has left a gaping hole in the unionist ranks and a group which can now be called upon to rival the Business for Scotland guys.
I hope Stu is organising a full page Wings advert in a coming print of the paper.
Big news about the Sunday Herald and I will be buying my first Sunday paper in years. All we need now is an opposition MSP to declare for YES.
Who will it be?
I think in years to come, when the period of the referendum is studied and analysed, I believe that the real mistake by the ‘No’ campaign wasn’t in the lie telling or half truths. It will be that they never put the third option of ‘Devo-Max’ on the ballot paper.
When you think about it. If they had, then, speculatively speaking, we can only guess that the DK’s would have been behind the ‘No’s and the option of Devo Max would have won the referendum.
Now, at that point, great for the union, but for Cameron and co, all they needed to do was chuck Scotland the odd wee bit of new power. They could have dragged out the greater powers for years; never handing them over, voting against giving them in Westminster, and using the vote itself to say that ‘most’ people endorsed the Union (in that last bit, they can tell huge porkies, because after all, who can prove it otherwise. If folk voted for more powers, it didn’t mean that they didn’t back the Union).
For me, that was where the Unionists lost the referendum. If they had put Devo Max on the ballot paper, they would have horsed it. Instead, greed and arrogance will lose them the Union.
I stopped buying newspapers a few years ago.
Time to start again.
Dammit, I get to work to find they dont sell newspapers in the restaurant anymore, I wont be able to get a copt of the Sunday Herald.
Hey folks, I know we’ll all want our own souvenir copy(ies) of the Sunday Herald today but better leave some on the shelves so undecideds get to see them! It’s important though that it does sell out today as a message to the owners of the rest of the press just how much profit they are chucking away by their slavish devotion to the Union.
Sainsburys just opened – there is a queue to by the Sunday Herald!
JLT
As to DevoMax, I think that Alex Salmond totally blindsided them by offering DevoMax.
Their total hatred of the man meant that they had to remove the option to try to scupper him.
Just thinking, no doubt they’ll effectively sell out today but we now need to continue to support the Sunday Herald every week.
Their owners (Newsquest?) will be watching and comparing with the sales of their other titles. Now they say it’s up to the editors of each to choose their own line on the Referendum but there’s going to be some pressure on the (daily) Herald to reconsider their hard unionist line if their sales continue to fall while the Sunday’s goes through the roof!
I stopped having the Herald delivered this week, apart from Sundays because I thought it gave YES and the SG a fair shout. I don’t mind if they give constructive criticism, but I’m looking forward to seeing NO exposed by publishing items which the other papers and the BBC won’t.
Dang!
Just found out about the Sunday Herald.It’s a 5 mile hike into the village,by the time I get they’re the only things left will be the London titles and the SundayMail.
Anybody getting one the day could do me a favour and pick up two.Let me know and I’ll pay postage,want it for posterity.
Had 5 copies of the Sunday Herald bought by 6:50. Had 4 conversations with the newsagent staff and had 2 Don’t Knows (but definitely leaning towards Yes) 1 Yes (but still some doubts) and 1 No (but after a short conversation said “you know I’m just not sure”). Everybody was startled to find out that tax raised per head in Scotland is higher than UK. They all agreed that simple messages need to be put across – information at present is way over their heads.
I intend to start a series of tweets on Twitter my account that starts: “Keep it Simple Scotland:” with simple facts supporting a Yes vote. I think I will use the hashtag #KISS
Didn’t leave a copy of Sunday Herald at Asda entrance as the more I thought about it the more good I thought I can do if I pass my spare copies to my still Don’t Knows and then getting them back to pass on again.
This is a very significant day in the campaign. I guess you can tell I’m quite excited today.
“they’re”?
Too early in the morning “there”.
Seasick Dave
Totally agree with you, mate. From what I can remember; when the idea of Devo Max was mooted, it was openly scorned by the Unionist parties, and treated in derision by large parts of the media.
Maybe one day, in an update to his biography, Salmond will tell us his thoughts during this period and of the next two years leading up to the vote itself.
Then again …maybe he’ll need a new book! All major politicians keep diaries of their thoughts, and I have a feeling that Alex won’t be any different. I think he’ll need a new book to tell us how he was rolling on the floor hee-hawing at each new calamity that fell on Better Together. Could be comedy gold!
Seasick Dave & JLT
The British Government did not want Devo Max on the ballot paper because they were absolutely confident of winning a single question referendum. This has now proved to have been a serious misjudgement,hence the dirty campaign of lies and smears by the unionists.
Goldenayr
Where is it that you live? I am assuming it is ‘Ayr’ but hell …you could be in West Lothian for all I know!
No doubt the Sunday Herald will sell out across most of Scotland today. Might I suggest that if anyone goes to the shops to buy a copy and it’s not there that they take a photo of the empty space, try and fit in the unsold copies of the NO papers too.
It would provide a stark contrast. It might also be worth speaking to the shop owners to ask if they are planning on increasing their order for the following week.
I hope at some point we can get to read the minutes of the
Edinburgh Agreement & why Devo was rejected ,might be a
good time for a leak from the SG,you know one of they one’s
that the SG dont deny,unlike the UK gov.
Jim Marshalls,
Yep! As I said …greed and arrogance will cost them the union. I bet even at this point in time with the polls at 50-50, that some Unionists are cursing that they didn’t have the third option on the ballot paper. Just think, if they had …none of us would be here right now. Why would we, knowing the polls would showing 70-30 to ‘No’, and knowing that the vote would be won by ‘No’ easily.
A lot of Unionist politicians could have been living a much easier, tranquil life right now. Oh …hindsight is a wonderful thing…
JLT
Bit further north.Are you able to help?
At the risk of doing a Victor Meldrew, we must have a lot of very duff businesses in Scotland.
Change creates opportunity.
The alternative is stagnation.
Rant over. Coffee time.
It’s OK.
Phoned them and they’re keeping a copy.He said it’s just as well I phoned,they’ve got two left.
Sitting in Pret A Manger with a copy of the Sunday Herald… like others first newspaper I have bought in years (3 copies). Had a chat to the Newsagent… he said he was also voting Yes, I gave him an ‘Aye Right’ card anyway.
Goldenayr,
No mate, I’m West Lothian. But that didn’t mean that you weren’t from Ayr and currently living in West Lothian. Glad you got the paper reserved.
Got mine! Framing that front page!
Alba4Eva
Good on you. Perhaps if the Sunday Herald sells out, the dailies may well see the commercial sense in backing Yes.
JLT
Nae probs.
BTW,the “ayr” in my name is auld Scots “song” or “tune”.Don’t worry,it wrong foots a lot of folk.
What a great day!
Up out of bed at 7 o’clock on a Sunday morning, quick plate of porridge and off to the local Tesco and bought my Herald on Sunday.
Having never bought newspaper for years, due to the continuous anti-scottish government sentiment, it was good to have the tactile newsprint and the smell of paper and ink again. I won’t get addicted, once a week will do to begin with.
The Editorial was clear, incisive, emotional, yet logical and pragmatic in tone.
With regard to the Scottish Chambers of Commerce survey, the Rev is is right when he says,
“There are only so many times you can be caught lying before people stop listening.”
We, the people of Scotland, now have the confidence to take responsibility for running their own affairs. Gone are the days of telling us lies, making promises and pledges that are never delivered. The SNP in government has not been perfect and never will be, but is has delivered time and time again, and has earned the trust of the people.
The Scottish people are great bullsh*t detectors and that is why the NO campaign and its hangerson will fail.
Off to have a coffee and read the sports section..
Have you ever chatted to ” Businessmen ” ?
They talk at you, rather than with you, more interested in hearing the sound of their own voices than yours so it’s no surprise they haven’t taken the time to digest the information ( and many assertions, from both sides ) so keep on complaining.
Aye Jim Marshall, that’s my Sunday reading sorted now… surely, there must be a Daily wanting my money too? Only a matter of time now I think.
@John King –
If you can’t get your hands on a SH, let me know. I got two, happy to keep one for you.
08:00hrs
Woman serving me in Asda says “Three Sunday Heralds”? “YES” I say.
“Your not the first one” she says smiling .. “I’m still swithering”.
Swither no longer!
First time I have bought a paper for about 5 years! How do you switch it on again?
Beautiful artwork by the way.
Got my copy. However, cheeky blighters! Someone …huffily …placed a copy of The Sunday Times over the Herald pile. I thought at first ‘Jeez! It’s sold out by 9 o’clock!’ …but then after a bit of digging, found a small pile of Heralds there.
Damn those Unionists …this just isn’t cricket, you know!
A bit O/T.
Why are pro Russian activists in Ukraine referred to throughout the media as separatists? Aren’t they seeking to rejoin with Russia, and would therefore be more accurately described as unionists? It seems clear that the must feel that they would be better together.
I suppose the narrative is that its always the separatists who like to blow stuff up.
emails from 6 mates in England “get me a copy of the Herald” corner shop already run out!
Well as partly guessed, Marr could not bring himself to show a copy of the front page of the Sunday Herald, but instead flashed up the Scotland on Sunday.
However Marr mentioned that they will be ‘discussing’ the Sunday Herald’s stance – should be interesting
I’ve got mine!
And I’ve also got Wee Ginger Dugs song – wee could maybe have a choir to singalong!
What a lovely morning!
[re Marr] Well that was the discussion then – looking at a fax copy of the front page of the Sunday Herald. Marr’s contribution was the fact that the lions were playing bagpipes.
Fraser Nelson, he of the strange and undermined accent, stated that if Scotland did vote yes, then Cameron would have to resign
Off to get my copy,
Not really OT, but yesterday I spotted a WoS banner next to the A82 between Fort Augustus and Inverness.
Great Stuff.
MochaChoca
Here is some Russian TV. Remember. If the British MSM is so disrespectful of Scottish democracy, why should you believe a word of their Ukrainian reports.
link to stopimperialism.org
Euan McColm on Headlines is beelin.
Hilarious!
I just hope there’s some copies of the Sunday Herald left when I get to the shops in a couple of hours.
I broke the habit of a lifetime and tried to buy a Sunday Herald in Tesco this morning.
I had a wee bit of difficulty with the self-checkout machine.
When I scanned the paper it said I had to get assistance.
Being instantly paranoid, I asked the checkout supervisor, as he assisted me, what the problem was.
He said that this week’s Sunday Herald is heavier than usual, and hence why the machine needs help.
I’m looking forward to using The Union self-checkout on 18th September.
Maybe I need to go on the Alex Salmond diet in preparation.
@Jim Marshall at 8.29am et al
My thoughts to. DC and the WM politicians thought this was in the bag hence no DevoMax in the ballot paper.
As they say, this has opened a can of worms. They should have judged us, the Scottish people better.
Aye Mr McColm on headlines, we’re train spotters now not cybergnats.
He’s a bit po-faced.
The wee Spar in Skelmorlie usually only has a couple of Sunday heralds in stock but had a couple of dozen this morning, so they must have run a large print of them? The shop now has a few copies less as of now!
Anyone seen this truly bizarre article based on a ‘what if scenario’ in the Mail on Sunday? ‘So what happens if Scotland votes yes’ written by Alan Massie
link to archive.today
Yes offer opinions about the future and those are often little more than informed guesses.
No tell blatant lies about what has already happened in the past as they try to repackage their broken Union.
There’s a big difference! Now BT have been labelled liars, everything they say should be doubted by everyone.
Going out shortly to deliver more Yes letters. Hope there is a Sunday Hearald left in the shops.
Who is the ‘Euan’ on Headlines right now? Is it McColm?
Doh! I’m in London visiting my son and his English fiancée. Won’t stop me voting Yes though! ????
So no chance of getting a Sunday Herald. ????
Any chance someone could put up a big JPEG? Then I and others could print it and frame it.
Hi.
Been out, bought a Sunday Herald, emailed them to tell them they were on the shopping list from now on. I told them I would have settled for fair and balanced but this is terrific news and perhaps will focus a few minds.
Call me Dave
Po faced? A wee bit nippy I would say. Not a happy bunny. Clearly, Bella, NIC, Wings etc are his bette noirs
???? = wee smiley thing
“Of course Cameron will have to resign if the Yes vote wins. He can’t say, “But I can still keep my job?” He will be told, “You lost the country we are supposed to control.” [My emphasis.]
Fraser Nelson, editor of The Spectator, on the Andrew Marr Show letting slip England controls Scotland, and by making that Freudian admission, why Scotland is right to demand genuine democracy.
It is McColm right enough. No wonder his attempts at humour are so feeble – mind you, it’s quite impressive that he can sound as though he’s smiling while chewing his own teeth.
Ian
Who else?
Watching Thazzaband on Marr’s show, drivelling on about the ‘cost of living crisis’ which they are desperate to get adopted as a catchphrase. Probably a nice guy but he’ll never be PM. He seems not to have noticed the debate in England has moved on and in Scotland is utterly different. He seems to be living in the 90s.
Ian Brotherhood
Am I that bad you just ignore my posts?
Posted it earlier.
O/T For the first time, I clicked on the “new readers start here” at the top of the home page. I am fairly certain I am not alone amongst regular readers in having ignored it (Sorry Stu
).
It is fabulous and I would certainly advise new readers to click their way in there; so much information laid out just by clicking on one easy link.
Can I make a suggestion that, even though, it is at the top of the page, it is made even more prominent for new readers?
the plan was to go to Asda and place The Herald over the tops of the other papers – drat , drat and double drat – beaten to it.
Its happening
The Sunday Herald will be the only paper to come out for YES.
Think a big message would be sent to the press if we all started buying it.
I know I will from now on !
Those last two paragraphs in the Herald piece brought a tear to my eye. This phenomenon is occurring increasingly of late. What’s a grown man to do?
Marr asks Milliband if Cameron should resign if Scotland votes no. Milliband prattles on dismissively. When Marr asks him about the Sunday Herald, Milliband huffily again dismisses stating he doesn’t want to talk about, that Better Together will win….pity Marr didn’t ask if he (Milliband) knew the where about’s of Darling
Geannach@9:51am
Yeah Red Ed has been programmed. It’s all about the cost of living crisis and nothing else. He cannot deviate from the message.
Marr has asked him what happens if there is a YES vote, Red Ed stutters and point blank refuses to answer, LA LA LA.
He will not be Prime minister.
@JLT
Found my pro-union newsagent had buried the SH as I expected. Hauled them out from under & bought a couple…”They put extra copies in our delivery this morning…can’t think why they bothered…sniff…moan
Have to comment like others, I am absolutely delighted by Sunday Herald’s declaration, first time up at 7.30am on a Sunday to buy a paper, asked the newsagent to keep a copy of SH every Sunday from here on in. Bought two copies, one for commemorative and to up the sales as a measure of gratitude for being the only paper (so far), to bring a well needed voice from Yes side to counter the onslaught. It’s a start!
When I came out the newsagent a big fire engine was pulling up on Byres Road, and I found myself signalling the driver’s attention, he looked down and I showed him the front page, he nodded acknowledgement. Feel quite emotional and heartened by the palpable sense of being in a country that considers social justice and altruism as ideals that are worth pursuing and that SH’s editorial has emphasised this as a core value in it’s decision to support Independence.
Just as it’s important to acknowledge SH declaring for Yes, it’s also important for me to acknowledge all the people on here at WOS who have provided invaluable information over the months and who really have been the voices of well reasoned intelligent discourse on our future. That’s why I will always subscribe to Wings, Stu provided a genuine democratic space that filled the immense vacuum left by the mainstream’s one sided viewpoint. So once again I’d like to thank Stu for his commitment and foresight in providing the real news way ahead of all the contemporary outlets.
@K1 10:00 am
Amen to that.
Just bought a few copies of the Sunday Herald. One or two for neighbours and one for posterity, and one for the few Unionists who didn’t buy this morning. (and one to encourage them)
Good editorial and articles in first few pages.
Everyone should physically buy a few copies and give them a massive thanks.
I will put an order in for every Sunday from now on.
Drive, in the mist, the 2 miles to the village shop to buy my first paper in 3 years All sold out drive on another mile to the wee co-op whew! 6 Sunday Heralds left, buy two. At the check out big smiles, off to campaign she says and points to my badge, only way to fly says I. Great, go for it says she. Back home with a light in my eye and a big daft smile on my face.
What a great day!
Well we’ve got our copy, hope everyone else has got theirs.
Isn’t today just a wonderful day today?
In fact I have felt that there was something in the air over the last few weeks but could not put my finger on it. I think this might have been what it was. Let’s face it folks over the last few weeks we have have just been *ahem* “celebrating” gift after gift from the NO side, the side that can’t stop giving.
I wonder how our *ahem* friends over at Better together H.Q. are feeling this morning. They were rather quiet on Twitter last night apparently. Mind you the couple of tweets I did see were rather rabid, to say the least.
Thanks for the piece Rev- will pass it on to someone in business I know who is swithering along with the business for Scotland 2 page ad at the back of the Sunday herald.
From a neutral point of view, if such a thing exists, the tripe from. Westminster and the so called pro – business conservatives have surely done harm to investment, not just for Scotland but to the rest of the UK. As for BT, who, hand on heart could call their interventions “really useful”? 3% seems absurdly high.
Ps bought my SH this morn-far more than usual stocked when I got there at 8am. Canny imagine there are many left now.
I read page 3 editorial piece to my wife and we both started welling up at the last couple of paragraphs. Great stuff, beautifully written and illustrated by my hero Mr Alasdair Gray.
Please leave some on the shelves for DKs and other Yes men and women. You can always order a back copy.
Tory Grant Shapps is on Sky News and seems to be sober. Now, that’s news.
i bought the SH today and will support them in the months ahead,we will probably be saving all the unionist papers with the boost to the SH.as in their all owned by the same people.
Kininvie,
Hello matey. How are you doing? Will try and get out with you guys again this week. I’ve been hammering the Study Books for the last two months (I’m now 6 weeks ahead of everyone else in my class – been studying 20 to 25 hours a week) …just so I can free up the summer (when we expect things to escalate). I’m off in a couple of weeks time (Wed 21st to Mon 26th) …can help out doing day deliveries if needed. Can do deliveries in the morning, and then can just continue my studies in the afternoon. I’ll tell you …it ain’t easy trying to juggle a 10 hour work day, Open Uni, the Indy debate and a wife who wonders what else I’m about to take on! Seriously …24 hours in a day is not enough.
@kininvie at 10:00
Your pro-union newsagent must be a right eejit. Business people usually make money providing the services and goods their customers want. Unless of course they are one of the few ethical capitalist unionists, willing to take a hit for the cause.
Worse still, their actions are stifling democracy by suppressing and hiding an alternative to their own personal polarised views. I’d vote with my feet, but appreciate that might not be an option for you.
@Andrew Morton
Any chance someone could put up a big JPEG? Then I and others could print it and frame it.
link to i.imgur.com
Let me know if it needs to be bigger.
Print it, laminate it, frame it, or maybe even put it on a t-shirt.
The real test comes if No wins – will the Sunday Herald revert to type or will it continue to champion democracy fulfilled?
And by the same token, when Yes wins, will the London national newspapers salute the will of the people or double their attacks on Scotland’s integrity?
@Andrew Morton if you’re on fb the Liberal Democrats for Independence have posted an image of the front page, as have several other pro-indy pages, so you could probably capture one of them for posterity, it’s what I’ve had to do.
thanks James 123
Bought two copies of the Herald so my wife could read it at the same time.
fairiefromtheearth
link to newsquest.co.uk
All the Newsquest titles.Don’t see anything jumping out at me as obnoxious journalism.
But then,what do I know?
@goldenayr –
Apologies! – I skimmed right to the end, wanted to see if I’m allowed to comment today (tried to comment approx 25 times yesterday, and not one appeared.
I have heard that Magnus Gardham of the Herald, has cancelled his weekly delivery of The Sunday Herald.
@ Angry Weegie says:
Bought two copies of the Herald so my wife could read it at the same time.
Am still laughing …
@kininvie at 10:00
I would say change newsagents but,like me,maybe you can’t.
Best to keep nibbling his conscience.Thankfully my newsagents a YES.
Ian Brotherhood
Nae bother,I was only joking.Do that myself sometimes and then have to immediately…whit dae the bairns cry it?…oh aye,facepalm myself.
Have just bought my copy of the Sunday Herald this morning. Only one left in the shop at 9.30am.
Grouse Beater says:
And by the same token, when Yes wins, will the London national newspapers salute the will of the people or double their attacks on Scotland’s integrity?
Grouse Beater, to be honest, I think we are all wondering the same things as to what happens on the 19th if it a Yes. From a Governmental perspective, you can’t have wee William Hague and Co, crying from the rafters about how it comes down to the will of the people and that they have the right to self-determination in defending their liberty, freedom, and independence, and then turning volte-face and denouncing Scots for the very thing that he backs wholeheartedly around the world. After all, he’s been the champion for Tunisia, Libya, Egypt, Syria, Crimea and Ukraine (and I can only assume Belarus and the Baltic States next!).
As to the newspapers …well, I suspect the London media won’t give a stuff, and what I mean by that, is their attitude towards us. They will have a better idea than the ordinary Joe on the streets (rUK streets that is) as to what is actually going to happen in these negotiations. Therefore, I suspect that they will be growling at the rUK negotiating team to get stuck into the Scots and play hardball. However, we all know that what the papers want, and what the real reality is, that the papers might be left a tad disappointed, annoyed and angry. It will be very interesting in that case, as to who the London media throw their weight behind if the rUK ‘disappoints’. I can see Farage using it as an opportunity to once again, point out how the mainstream parties, have once again let the people of Britain. Could be interesting…
Cruachan
Don’t tell me..the shop only opens at 9am?
I can see Farage using it as an opportunity to once again, point out how the mainstream parties, have once again let the people of Britain down. Could be interesting…
(damn! wee need that editor back!)
JLT
I can see them using the Westminster ruling that subsumed Scotland into England argument.
Even though it doesn’t hold water.
Culmination of a terrible week for ‘Salmon’.
Here is a larger image of the front page with the magazine ad removed from the top.
link to i.imgur.com
link to archive.today
It’s a DM article which seems to want rid of Cameron.
Seems to be a response to the Sunday Herald saying YES.
link to heraldscotland.com
A bit OT, but I have the feeling that lots of the grassroots supporters of Nob Orders will want to show their Britishness by signing up to Tory Rory’s big day out on Hadrian’s Wall at http://www.handsacrosstheborder.co.uk
I think they might sign up under ridiculous names and might use info@acanchi.com as their email address.
Just a feeling.
Just up, and just heard about the Sunday herald. The snowball is gathering speed…
Thanks for putting up the jpeg James, now all I need is to go get some ink and we’ll have a laminated poster on the understated YES supporting Jeep.
scottish_skier
Who’s saying that?
JLT
As to the newspapers…
In an otherwise splendid editorial reasoning why it supports independence, the Sunday Herald adds a caveat:
“The Sunday Herald’s advocacy of independence does not mean it will support unquestionably the Scottish National Party or its allies.”
That flatly undermines the later proclamation:”
We will continue to publish arguments from the No campaign because we believe in balance.”
One side’s arguments get dissected, the other published without analysis? Those two statements need balance!
Then there’s the curiosity: “We state our opinion not in an attempt to persuade readers.”
Really? Kinda, laid back, cool dudes, us.
Slightly O/T , but really useful reminder about BT’s view on the outcome of the vote:
link to en.wikipedia.org
Alistair Darling stated in May 2013 that his side needs to “win well” in order to prevent another independence referendum within just a few years, to head off calls for another poll, the so-called “neverendum”. He contrasted his campaign’s position with that of Yes Scotland, saying they had to win only “by one vote” to achieve their ultimate aim. Although Darling did not say what percentage of the vote “win well” would entail, his colleagues had earlier said that the Yes vote would need to be pushed under 40% in order to answer the independence question for “a generation”.
No wonder you are in a flap flipper.
scottish_skier
Who’s saying that?
Ha ha – just a passing observation after this week’s relentless smear attacks on the FM.
Alex Massie. What a gigantic, arrogant, totally delusional, self-centred cock.
Shouldn’t have strayed outside of the Sunday Herald editorial this morning, my blood pressure is back up.
Great timing, I cancelled my Sunday Herald at the newsagents on Wednesday last week, just hope they have some left , our papers don’t arrive until about 11:30am
The position adopted by Sundayherald might be another thing which hastens the day when a Labour MSP breaks out of the Unionist straight jacket.Or more likely sidles over and gets on the fence.Theres a lot of them already adopting a “head down,mouth shut strategy”.We have to question them on where they stand.They mustn’t be allowed to duck the issue.
Anyone know anything about a independence debate at Aberdeen University?
Reading a post by a unionist (greetin about the Sunday Herald) that the No’s won itY ES – 35.9% NO – 64.1% Out of 1098
Wasn’t aware there was a debate in Aberdeen Uni
RogueCoder
I think Massie was doing a pisstake.
As the commentator on Headlines said this morning..
“I hope the YES side don’t take this seriously and I hope the no side don’t take this seriously.”
“The Sunday Herald’s advocacy of independence does not mean it will support unquestionably the Scottish National Party or its allies.”
That flatly undermines the later proclamation:”
We will continue to publish arguments from the No campaign because we believe in balance.”
One side’s arguments get dissected, the other published without analysis? Those two statements need balance!
Grouse Beater. Just pondered on your view. For myself, I can see what the paper is saying at the ‘does not mean it will support unquestionably the Scottish National Party or its allies.’. Now to me, that says that it backs the notion of Independence, but won’t back any political party. Now, there is a difference there. This first is an ideal; that Scotland deserves to be a better place and might only get there through independence. That is what the paper has said. The second is that it won’t back a party. I can accept that also. I might say, be an SNP supporter, but don’t agree with the views of the Scottish Socialists …but, at the end of the day, we are fighting for the same outcome; a better Scotland. That is what the Sunday Herald is saying to me. We back independence, but won’t align with any party.
The Sunday Herald will be judged by the Nationalists in the next few weeks! If it was to continually attack the ‘Yes’ camp by saying ‘prove this; why that? How?’ and yet, pats Darling on the head, then there will be a vicious backlash from all corners of the ‘Yes’ campaign. I can’t see the Sunday Herald making that mistake.
I think they’ve hedged their bets here. I think they’ve taken their Sunday paper, and back independence. They will see what the publication sales are like over the next month or so. If they go off the Richter scale, then I can see the daily paper, The Herald, announcing its backing of ‘Yes’ too. I think there is a bit of faith in the yes, but at the same time, could see an opportunity in making a little more money if they’ve guessed it right.
Re. BBC News review of the Sunday Herald. I think the bloke was a bit of a metropolitan twit. The will to self-determination is apparently emotional and irrational, rather than fundamental to free will and human rights. He was trying to imply the unionist have all the economic and practical issues worked out. Perhaps he could give British Labour a hand to tidy up “Powers for a Purpose”. Oh. the numpties.
Aberdeen Uni debate was clear no win with about 150 students in the hall. Love the Herald front page but this is the stark reality behind bettertogetherBBC propaganda
link to craigmurray.org.uk
Sunday Post poll on Nuclear weapons.
‘Possibly the worst, most loaded polling information questions ever’ – (Does not state polling company); but will no doubt be ratified by Prof John Curtice in a jiffy !
According to Sunday Post – Scots polled said
37 % want rid of all Nuclear weapons
26% want a less powerful replacement (?????? whit ?)
22% want a like for like replacement
15% dont know
Jesus you’ve got to read this piece. Reads like poll was organised by Better Together School children wing.
Very reminiscent of the recent BBC ‘mini educational video’ of ‘YES campaign defence proposals.
Rev; was trident a question in your up coming poll ?
I’m genuinely delighted that a title has declared today, it’s support for Scottish Independence. And it’s touching that so many people have made the effort to go out & buy a copy of The Sunday Herald.
Just don’t forget that it’s a small part of a family comprising The Herald & The Evening Times which are themselves owned by Newsquest.
The Sunday Herald has a circulation of around 20,000 per week so it’s impact is regrettably tiny. And any income earned from its sales, props up the heavily biased & pro-union Herald & Evening Times.
So bear in mind, that while supporting the pro-independence, Sunday Herald you are also propping up two other pro-unionist titles with a combined circulation that is four times larger.
I wonder if this might have something to do with swaying the Sunday Herald?
link to tinyurl.com
@CameronB Brodie
I saw that and thought exactly the same.
@CameronB Brodie
Apparently us Scots are too simple minded to understand those complicated economic and political issues, its all about emotions for us.
When the No Campaign was well in the lead it was “those canny Scots, they know what side their bread is buttered on”, but now that Yes has the momentum it’s now “those Scots, they just don’t understand the issues”.
G H Graham –
Will remember that point.
Confident ‘The Herald’ will announce soon support for NO.
Its a stick on with Gardham on board.
Just tried to buy a Sunday Herald and none to be had in Tarbert, Loch Fyne! Newsagent said that he could have sold a hundred but NONE were delivered. He has been told it was a management decision and we, as customers, should complain. I will do it right now. I have had to ask my niece in Glasgow to get me a couple.
I’ll buy the Sunday Herald when the Herald daily at least goes neutral otherwise I am not paying their daily paper bettertogther wages. Check out what right click google brings up on UKOK BBC bias alone
link to facebook.com
Their bizarre Gavin Esler blast off for noborders.com then their huge pack of project fear over N. Ireland and Lord Trimble and that’s only 2 out of 24/7 vote No BBC pressure in a couple of days.
Listened to the BBC paper review and big change to hear an intelligent view re the Herald and independence in general. Not often you hear a balanced view like that.
JLT
Yes, I understand your points. Accepted.
But there are some Freudian slips in their editorial, the most glaring of which is the acceptance Westminster rules and if it continues to do so the Sunday Herald will fall in line.
Privately, I wonder what Karl Marx would say were he alive getting brutally attacked in the manner of Scotland now but for his declaration of human egalitarianism:
“I’m a free thinker, not a member of the Communist Party!”
(Note – that was a joke with added irony.)
Anyhow, I have a framed Scotsman’s front page announcing the re-opening of our Parliament and you see how well they did for civil and constitutional rights ever since, so I’ll not frame the Sunday Herald … just yet.
@Edward
Im pretty sure Aberdeen is largely NO territory. Their ruling council is a complete joke run by Labour numpties.
Seems they still believe all the Labour ‘Together we can’ pish; forgetting the (‘get ourselves nice little directorship number’ / ‘ermine robes’ and piss off to London leaving all you minions behind).
Sad but it follows a pattern.
James 123 thanks for the jpg, now print and stuck with bluetack to the windaes of ma YES Van…
@Jlt, some one had put a cycling magazine over them in ASDA. Also had an enquiry from women behind the counter, was I a yes or a no, said I have always been a YES, she and her colleague are both No’s. I said why, we are apparently too poor and to wee to survive, so I said, you are prepared to hand away the money we would get for oil and whisky and agriculture, I shook my head and said well I will not argue with you, what is the point, as my Husband said when I told him, that is where you are with poverty of thought. By the way there were another three people before me who were voting YES and never a thought that THEY behind the counter might be wrong.
Ian Bortherhood @ 09.03
thanks for that Ian, I’ll get it off you on Friday, i’l give you the money back for it, or a pint which ever comes first
It would be no exaggeration to say that I have not bought a newspaper in decades. Having decided to buy one this morning I freaked out a bit when I realised there was none left in the shop.
Drove to another shop and got the last one on the shelf. How happy am I.
I’m happy with CameronB, btw, if it makes things easier for folk.
Been out and about to a few villages in Fife to get a Herald ! NOT ONE left! Jeez there’s some hope for Fife yet that so many people bought the Herald!
On Ken MacDonald show They were trying to make Mike Small of Bella feel very small! Had I it in for National Collective too! Sneering and laughing! Hope they are laughing on the other side of their faces after Independence!
Blimey!!! Long walk around ALL the wee newsagents but finally got my copy ……. got home, made a pot of coffee to find my eldest has “borrowed” my copy and disappeared upstairs with it!!!
Have put a regular order in as well – will be a pleasure to read a Sunday Newspaper again for sure.
I’m thinking the cover would make a fab stained glass window too!
I should say though I have bought this edition I will await developments, there is a thought in my house anyway that this is the old Jacobite idea of having one son in each army. I would also say when you sup with the Devil you have to use a long spoon and they have not yet proved themselves to be wholly clean, “Pussy Riot Husband adds to criticism over Salmond Remarks”. I admit I have yet to read the piece.
Memaw
What do you mean a ‘management decision’?
Do you mean that they deliberately decided not to stock it because of the front cover?
Typical first two ferries cancelled due to incident beleived to be a small fire so no papers
Called newsagent and reinstated my order to much amusement to them
Gordoz says
Confident ‘The Herald’ will announce soon support for NO.
That is a real possibility, but they may have to beware. A lot of folk think the Herald and the Sunday Herald are one and the same publication. Could end up sending out confusing messages …on a Saturday ‘No’ …on a Sunday ‘Yes’ …on a Monday ‘No’.
Gardham may have to watch what he does here. If ‘Yes’ does overtake ‘No’ in the polls, then by having nailed his colours to the mast, then he puts his own position at the paper in an awkward situation. What happens if the rest of his staff don’t agree with him as the weeks go by? How can a room full of ‘Yes’ people write things that they totally disagree with? What happens if he is the only person in the room who says ‘No’? Sure there are the opinions of his London owners, but if public opinion in Scotland does go the way of ‘Yes’, are those same owners going to watch money dwindle as folk stop buying the paper? It’s a tough call to make. The Sunday Herald comes out once a week. The Herald is 6 days a week. Get it wrong, and you could be hosing money down the drain.
If I were the Herald, I would leave stating a position until they finally saw what way it really could swing. If Yes takes a lead of 55 to 60%, would they really still back ‘No’?
English are angry not because Scotland is going the way of self-governance, because in terms of a political vision they have nothing, bugger all, left on their own, with only the rag-bag of UKIP prejudices to choose.
That’s always been their malaise: England has only ever been interested in England.
I mean, imagine signing up to billions on a fast train to get commuters from A to B in England while their roads degrade into a copy of the moon’s surface.
Been in a few supermarkets this morning and had some fun covering up the Unionist rags with copies of The Herald. Nice YES and Scottish symbols everywhere now LOL.
Flower of Scotland
Ken MacDonald was also quite scathing on the CBIs stance and the beebs membership,in a satirical “I better watch my job” way.
Helena,
I agree with you. Will see how the Sunday Herald performs over the next few weeks. For me, I want an attack now on the No camp and their line of thinking. I want to know what the new powers are. Not when we will get them; but what they actually are! I want Darling, Lamont, Davidson seriously questioned, and if they refuse to do an interview, I want the paper to say that it is disappointed with such attitudes. I want the screw turned on these people. They have got away with it for two years! It’s time to answer to the people.
And as to the papers …well, seems quite a few folk are quite huffy about it. I’m not blaming the staff. It’ll be disgruntled ‘No’ers’. So far, myself, Kininvie and yourself have spotted this. I think there will be many more.
But hey, today is a good day. One paper (albeit it, that it only comes out once a week), but it’s a start. Let’s just wait and see what happens if ‘Yes’ take the lead in the polls. You never know, others may then jump ship. As they say …one step at a time, that’s all we can do.
Just watched a refreshingly balanced interview on Politics Sunday Scotland with Professor Michael Keating of Aberdeen University. Worth watching again.
Strangely no interruption’s and the professor was able to make his observations very clear. (In fact it was quite a ‘clipped, clear & precise’ discussion, that would not look out of place on Germany’s ARD channel – German watchers will understand what I mean, I hope).
Basically Scotland will not have any problems in remaining within the EU (well we know that anyway). Very refreshing
Tears in my house this morning – Brechin sold out of Sunday Heralds (extra copies sent) by mid-morning!
@ memaw/ Wilma Watts
No Sunday Heralds here on Seil this morning. Apparently none were delivered to Oban, which could explain the Tarbert hiatus as well.
Someone said someone said it was a ‘printing error’. I am wondering if it was a deliberate decision by the distributors.
Anyway, have despatched no.2 son to Morrisons in Aberdeen to buy two copies if any are left there.
@ Flower of Scotland – I walked the streets and none to be had. Took a bus to a large Sainsburys and only 4 left. Bought 2 so I have one spare if you really really want it.
As far as I am concerned, the real test for the Sunday Herald is if their front pages scorn character assassination attempts on pro-independence politicians, in particular, Alex Salmond, the weapon of choice of brutal unionists.
It is NOT balance to print such attacks without due judgement. It’s tantamount to being guilty aiding and abetting.
Walked in the rain to buy the Sunday Herald.
Been paperless for the last 2 years because I don’t believe in supporting my country’s enemies.
@Liquid Lenny
Thanks, printed mine out and put it in a plastic cover, it’s now sitting proudly on my desk.
@ G H Graham
So bear in mind, that while supporting the pro-independence, Sunday Herald you are also propping up two other pro-unionist titles with a combined circulation that is four times larger.
It’s a really good point you make but as you also said it is still something positive. It will be interesting to see their circulation figures over the next few weeks. If they increase by 50% or even double other publications will take notice, they after all businesses and for most of them profit is the bottom line.
@Jlt, I agree with you. We said this morning we did not want anything other than fairness, so them actually coming out for YES is a bonus, if they hold to it. I watched McWhirter and Bell blow hot and cold over the years so we shall see. Let us see them produce the goods, let them ask the questions so badly in need of clarification. We also have David Cameron taking an interest, we live in interesting times.
Seasick Dave
I see Scottish Renewables got the same story I did and he lives nearer Oban. It seems to be that the Herald did not print enough copies,that was”the management decision” my newsagant mentioned, he also said Menzies who are the distributors,were complaining that it had caused a big “stooshie”, his word. I wonder if anyone in Argyll and Bute managed to get a copy?
I managed to get what appeared to be the second last copy in town at the fourth newsagent I tried (I did have one more to try if that one had failed) A chap was picking up up the last copy as I left. No shortage of other papers though
I think the Herald may have underguesstimated the popularity of this issue.
Sitting in the cafe this morning with Sunday Herald face up on the table, I was x-wording the mag. Two older couples arrive next table. Older guy with stick clocks the Herald and has an ogle at front page.
“where’s the newsagent from here?” he asks me. I tell him “WH Smiths down the centre a bit, but might not open till noon, I got mine in ASDA earlier”
He says “Right thanks” Turns to his table companions “see that” pointing at the Herald. “I’m having that”.
Hope he did, this was 11:20hrs only a wee while to wait for him.
Just in catching up in here again been for proper shopping at ASDA, your right, Herald stand sold out.
No. 2 son lives in Aberdeen and bought me the last two copies in the King Street Morrisons.
I wonder if Newsquest will make back issues available ?
@Scots Renewables
Whot! no Heralds in Oban…Jeez.
That’s put a damper on my day for two reasons
1. My better half’s parents live there and are Sunday Post types through & through. I had had good thoughts of them seeing the Herald at Tesco in Oban.
I get a phone call every Sunday from them, so I’ll slip it casually into the general conversation.
2. It’s the only time I have been accosted from a ‘better together’ team with a flyer outside afore mentioned Tesco.
We had words and I gave them it back.
We must all support the SUNDAY HERALD today.
This could be YES break through!
I’ll walk 500miles to look for todays Sunday Herald.
(ok maybe 1mile)
I’m looking at subscribing to Sunday Herald online too.
We must all visit Sunday Herald website daily/weekly to increase its viewer count.
ps. I’m not politico but I rate Macwhirter, as only newpaper man for YES!
I’ve also admired afar Herald’s foreign correspondent David Pratt.
pps. If can’t get Sunday Herald today, hopefully they’ll use same front page again next week.
@jim arnott
“Everybody was startled to find out that tax raised per head in Scotland is higher than UK.”
Good one Jim, and probably the best one-liner to drop into any conversation. That possibly says it all in a oner.
@goldenayr
I got mine at 6.15 straight from the bundle, still pristine in its bag. I asked and it was just their normal allocation. But (haven’t read that far to see if you got one) try phoning around newsagents, supermarkets even, and ask them to keep you one.
Unsurprisingly, by the time I got to the Lauder Newsagent at ~11:00, Sunday Herald was sold out. Guy behind the counter – with a big smile – told me were all gone by mid morning.
Along to the petrol station and the same story.
Luckily my folks got out early doors and bought a couple of copies in Edinburgh so I have a copy for posterity.
SH should milk this next week by including an ad-free poster of today’s cover, with the editorial printed on the back – they’ve done nice art prints etc in the past, on decent quality paper – all those who missed today’s edition will snap them up.
One helluva week ‘at sea’; Unionist battleship CBI crippled and dead in the water after multiple hits, Battleship BBCs main battery out of action, leaving it to lob ineffective, short rounds from its secondaries and the previously neutral Sunday Herald running up the Scottish ensign and steaming to our aid.
Good moment yesterday too as I drove down the back road from Gretna to Rockliffe, saltire flying from car. Black tranny van coming the other way with a saltire up and big YES logo on bonnet. Cue, mutual thumbs up and big daft grins!????
A possible argument to put to undecided businesses is that, according to the survey, up to one-sixth of their competitors will be heading south after a YES vote.
Bye now, thanks for your share of the market.
RE Sunday Herald. To those who say ‘wait and see’I would say that when we voted with our feet, not to buy pro union blats, the reverse is also true.
Any paper who supports Yes, deserves our support, so buy it!
Ha ha. I like your thinking dadsarmy!
do you think prof curtice will have a look at this ?
Why would a group owning the Sunday Herald and supporters of the BT vote allow them to support the yes vote? I trust nothing that comes out of the UK, The Sunday Herald is still owned by a group outside of Scotland, how much can it be trusted not to do what the group that owns it say? it does seem at odds with its own group of papers and while not wanting to refuse a gift horse beware of Greeks bearing gifts comes to mind.
I hope my doubts are proved wrong and that their support is genuine but nothing BT do would surprise me.
Re my last post I hope I am well and truly proved wrong and someone puts an end to my nagging doubts about the Sunday Herald and its ownership.
Vote yes is the only way
Unfortunately I couldn’t find a copy despite trying three news agents,it was early afternoon before I got there because I was leafleting and campaigning all morning. So if there is a good reason for missing out on a copy I suppose it’s mine, sniff.
Fortbill love – those who leaflet deserve respect, those who buy newspapers have bought some rather expensive drawer liners.