The world's most-read Scottish politics website

Wings Over Scotland


The phantom referendum

Posted on November 08, 2011 by

The theoretical possibility that the UK Government could usurp the Scottish Government and hold its own referendum on Scottish independence is one that's been kicking around ever since the SNP won its historic majority at Holyrood back in May. But one question that nobody seems to have asked is "So what?"

Much of conventional wisdom has it that only the UK Parliament has the ability to grant Scotland independence, and that the Scottish Parliament can't legally bring about the dissolution of the Union. This is essentially a fallacy, based on misunderstanding of the sovereign nature of the Scottish people, but is generally held to be an academic technicality anyway – should a referendum conducted by Holyrood indicate the desire of the Scottish electorate for independence, the idea of Westminster even attempting to refuse would in practice be unthinkable.

But were Westminster to conduct its own vote, would the situation be any different? It's hard to see how. It was recently claimed by the Tories' Lord Forsyth that Alex Salmond had told George Osborne the SNP would boycott any Westminter-led referendum. This would throw up a pretty interesting constitutional brouhaha by itself, but let's assume the referendum went ahead in 2012, the SNP did indeed refuse to collaborate in it, and let's say for the sake of argument that as a result it delivered a resounding "No" vote on a very low turnout. What then?

The UK would continue business as usual (assuming there hadn't been a civil war), and soon enough would arrive at 2015. At which point the SNP would table the referendum for which the Scottish electorate gave them an overwhelming mandate, and invite the UK Government to try to stop it.

It's difficult to identify any legal grounds on which Westminster would be able to block a referendum which the Prime Minister had repeatedly acknowledged was Holyrood's to hold. Short of Cameron sending in the tanks, the second referendum would go ahead regardless of the result of the first. The constitutional sovereignty of the Scottish people would remain unchanged, as would the unthinkability of any refusal by Westminster to accept the result. Once again, beyond military conflict there simply wouldn't be any way to keep the Union together.

(It's not even as if there isn't extremely recent precedent on these very islands for having two referenda on the same subject in the same country in close succession. Less than 16 months separated the people of the Republic Of Ireland's rejection of the Lisbon Treaty from a second vote in which it was accepted.)

So we're going to go ahead and say with some confidence that there will be no Westminster-conducted referendum on Scottish independence. That it would be democratically outrageous ought to be reason enough, let alone that it would likely be highly counter-productive, but more importantly it would be also completely pointless. Only Holyrood has a mandate for a referendum, and only Holyrood – on Holyrood's own terms – will conduct one.

Comment - please read this page for comment rules. HTML tags like <i> and <b> are permitted. Use paragraph breaks in long comments. DO NOT SIGN YOUR COMMENTS, either with a name or a slogan. If your comment does not appear immediately, DO NOT REPOST IT. Ignore these rules and I WILL KILL YOU WITH HAMMERS.


  • About

    Wings Over Scotland is a thing that exists.

    Stats: 6,989 Posts, 1,252,651 Comments

  • Recent Posts

  • Archives

  • Categories

  • Tags

  • Recent Comments

    • Lorncal on The fight about to come: “Indeed, Northcode, I agree with you on your use of anomaly as it applied to Mr Salmond, the person, not…” Oct 16, 17:22
    • sarah on The fight about to come: “Happily the SSRG Conference is on youtube so we can listen to some very sensible, intelligent, informed people speaking. The…” Oct 16, 17:18
    • J Robertson on The fight about to come: “Really ? what could possibly go wrong ?” Oct 16, 16:48
    • Captain Caveman on The fight about to come: “Meh. Well, your garden’s looking a tad shite from where I’m standing TURABDIN. Glass houses and all that. 😀” Oct 16, 16:25
    • TURABDIN on The fight about to come: “@Capt Caveman, Hatey, Northcode, On the basis of observation you do seem a cohort of embittered personages eyes reddened by…” Oct 16, 14:43
    • Confused on The fight about to come: “describing zionism as “racism” is pretty mild – I mean if you “really want to go there” tribalists, being tribal,…” Oct 16, 13:14
    • Hatey McHateface on The fight about to come: “An interesting article about the crisis tearing the English Greens apart: https://unherd.com/newsroom/greens-zionism-row-could-tear-the-party-in-two/ The author essentially claims that it’s the Corbynist…” Oct 16, 12:44
    • Hatey McHateface on Still Time To Save Her: “Easy for you to say, SBS, but then you’re forgetting just how much grift and lucre there is to be…” Oct 16, 12:24
    • Hatey McHateface on The fight about to come: ““I wouldn’t be at all surprised if the map of this island looks rather different come 2100” There’s defo gonna…” Oct 16, 12:10
    • Minceheid on The fight about to come: “Hatey McHateface says: 15 October, 2026 at 6:47 pm Dinna fash, MH, I’m in no position to draw my lines…” Oct 16, 11:42
    • Dick Wall on The fight about to come: “A stopped clock is right twice a day. The continued shambles that is the UK today could build support for…” Oct 16, 11:32
    • Southernbystander on Still Time To Save Her: “Everything from the past effects the present but people pick and choose what matters. How many on here would agree…” Oct 16, 11:22
    • Hatey McHateface on The fight about to come: “Aww, “Hatey’s Middle East friends”. I wonder who they might be. Surely not the people who have done more for…” Oct 16, 08:27
    • Hatey McHateface on The fight about to come: ““protofascist” I believe that to be a new word on Wings BTL. I’m certain it’s just another of those words…” Oct 16, 08:11
    • Luigi on The fight about to come: “Sigh. Do these so-called independence “leaders” not realise that their promises, their BS, their lack of action, lack of ambition,…” Oct 16, 08:03
    • Hatey McHateface on The fight about to come: ““Allowing rUK a reasonable time to relocate them might bring some rent to offset debt” Of course it will, sam.…” Oct 16, 08:00
    • Fearghas MacFhionnlaigh on The fight about to come: “SALVO digital newsletter: ‘Territorial Alienation’ https://indd.adobe.com/view/713e7419-f745-461a-b79e-a061397e7638” Oct 15, 23:31
    • Northcode on The fight about to come: “I’m with the Captain on this one – Turabdin’s (I don’t do all-caps words or names unless I’m shouting at…” Oct 15, 23:07
    • Northcode on The fight about to come: “anomaly (noun) something that deviates from what is standard, normal, or expected. I’d say the intelligent, well-read, erudite, honest and…” Oct 15, 22:50
    • Northcode on The fight about to come: ““…surely you’d agree the Scots electorate cannot simply throw its collective hands up in the air and take no responsibility…”…” Oct 15, 22:31
    • Captain Caveman on The fight about to come: “Pfft. These bloody kids today 😀 We were a bunch of penniless, roughneck council estate kids in Essex back in…” Oct 15, 22:28
    • TURABDIN on The fight about to come: “@Captain Caveman «Les fausses opinions ressemblent à la fausse monnaie qui est frappée d’abord par de grands coupables, et dépensée…” Oct 15, 21:46
    • sam on The fight about to come: “One good reason why England will want to bind Scotland fast is this. https://www.navylookout.com/why-relocating-trident-away-from-scotland-is-virtually-impossible/ If or when Scotland decides it…” Oct 15, 21:14
    • sam on The fight about to come: “Excellent piece on Alex Salmond’s contribution to Scottish political life. A perception of competent government from 2007 allowed him to…” Oct 15, 21:02
    • Lorncal on The fight about to come: “I don’t think that Mr Salmond was an anomaly, Northcode. He was exceptional, that is what he was. He was…” Oct 15, 20:19
    • Bilbo on The fight about to come: “I had come across a phrase that is used by Hatey’s Middle East friends which is Freier and is a…” Oct 15, 20:16
    • Northcode on The fight about to come: “The fallacy where a future is anticipated on the assumption that present circumstances will remain unchanged — even when change…” Oct 15, 19:28
    • Hatey McHateface on The fight about to come: “Dinna fash, MH, I’m in no position to draw my lines on the map and then enforce my partition edicts.…” Oct 15, 18:47
    • Captain Caveman on The fight about to come: “I completely agree with you Aidan. Let no one kid themselves that in the event of an independent Scotland tomorrow,…” Oct 15, 18:24
    • Captain Caveman on The fight about to come: “Well, you evidently don’t like him, TURABDIN, so I’d say he’s off to a flying start on a proforma basis…” Oct 15, 17:27
  • A tall tale



↑ Top